RV-Archive.digest.vol-oy
February 25, 2004 - March 02, 2004
> http://www.rv.oldsack.com
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Vanremog(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Heated air inlet location |
In a message dated 2/24/2004 10:23:51 AM Pacific Standard Time,
noel(at)blueskyaviation.net writes:
I had a guy in the shop yesterday that got recruited to help in the fist
engine start up of my -8A. Looking it over with a fine eye he questioned me
why I didn't take the cabin heat air off the oil cooler exit air?
Well, because you won't have any when things get really cold and you want to
keep the heat in the oil. I wouldn't want to freeze to death on one of those
cold winter days (and I'm only talking about California, forget any other
locale) in an attempt to keep the oil temp above 170 deg F by closing the oil
cooler door.
Believe me the waste heat from the exhaust pipe is the best way to go.
GV (RV-6A N1GV flying 682 hrs)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Bill VonDane" <bill(at)vondane.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Condition Inspection Checklist |
Hey Gabe...
Here's the one I use... You can modify it as you see fit...
-Bill
----- Original Message -----
From: "Gabe A Ferrer" <ferrergm(at)bellsouth.net>
Subject: RV-List: Condition Inspection Checklist
Please I'm looking for a Condition Inspection Checklist for my first annual.
I've checked in the archives. The email addresses for the RVr's offering the
checklist were no longer valid. And I couldn't find the checklist in Kevin
Horton's website.
I would appreciate it if someone could point me to a Checklist source.
Thanks
Gabe A Ferrer
RV6 N2GX 105 hours
South Florida
Email: ferrergm(at)bellsouth.net
Cell: 561 758 8894
Night Phone: 561 622 0960
Fax: 561 622 0960
________________________________________________________________________________
I did the same thing to one hole on my HS skin and decided it's not worth
worrying about. Smoothed out the edges and continued on. A slight loss of
strength around one rivet hole from the missing material is completely
insignificant. No worse than having one poorly driven rivet get past you.
I couldn't see crack propagation from that missplaced hole being an issue
either since there's thousands of holes in these planes already and Van's
solution to stopping cracks in rudder & elevator skins is to drill another
hole . . .
Brett Morawski
Toledo, OH
RV-8a, wings
I start dimpling the Horizontal Stab left side skin tonight. The first
few dimples went fine, but then the male part of the die must of slipped
out of the skin between blows with the mallet.
You can see the result here:
http://www.rv.oldsack.com/weblog.php?id=C0_1_1
I'm really sick about this and I'm not quite sure what to do. I guess I
need to order a new skin from Vans. This is not the first screw up I've
had and I'm sure it is not the last.
Any advice here would be greatly appreciated!
Thanks,
Fred
Frederick W. Oldenburg Jr.
RV-7A Standard Kit - Empennage
http://www.rv.oldsack.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "David Kirby" <davewendi(at)earthlink.net> |
I read somewhere that the new Renesis rotary
has 247 HP but only 164 LB/FT of torque. What does this mean for us? Would this
cause the engine to be sluggish? May not be good in a go around situation?
Anybody have any
thoughts? Never looked to see what kind of torque a Lycoming
has. Anyone know?
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Condition Inspection Checklist |
| From: | "Stewart, Michael (ISS Atlanta)" <mstewart(at)iss.net> |
On my downloads page.
http://www.mstewart.net/michael/rv/index.htm
Mike
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Gabe A Ferrer
Subject: RV-List: Condition Inspection Checklist
Please I'm looking for a Condition Inspection Checklist for my first
annual.
I've checked in the archives. The email addresses for the RVr's offering
the checklist were no longer valid. And I couldn't find the checklist in
Kevin Horton's website.
I would appreciate it if someone could point me to a Checklist source.
Thanks
Gabe A Ferrer
RV6 N2GX 105 hours
South Florida
Email: ferrergm(at)bellsouth.net
Cell: 561 758 8894
Night Phone: 561 622 0960
Fax: 561 622 0960
=
=
=
=
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Charles Rowbotham" <crowbotham(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | a titanium Ti-down note |
Hi Randy,
Glad to hear your still providing the best tie-downs.
Any word on when you will be offering Ti tie down RINGS - Sure would like
to ditch the heavy ones for (3) Ti rings.
Best wishes,
Chuck Rowbotham
RV-8A
>From: Randy Simpson <airtime(at)proaxis.com>
>Reply-To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
>To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
>Subject: RV-List: a titanium Ti-down note
>Date: Wed, 25 Feb 2004 02:36:39 +0100
>
>
>Hi again RV builders and flyers,
>
>It's been a couple of years since I've posted a note here about my titanium
>Ti-downs, so I hope I'm not over-doing it, spamwise. If you're not
>interested in titanium Ti-downs or what I've been up to lately, delete this
>now.
>
>I've gotten some emails recently asking if I'm still making and selling the
>Ti-downs, so I'd like to let everyone here know I'm still doing it. RV
>builders and flyers have been my main customers, by far.
>
>I've been selling the Ti-downs since 1998, and have learned during that
>time that my business is VERY seasonal, and for the previous two winters
>(since I quit my day job at the titanium plant), I've had to go to work for
>a flying buddy's business, installing computer and phone systems in Fred
>Meyer stores, to make ends meet, moneywise.
>
>
Stay informed on Election 2004 and the race to Super Tuesday.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "LarryRobertHelming" <lhelming(at)sigecom.net> |
Interesting. I bought some about 18 months ago. How would anyone who
bought these before the change know if they got screws with the bad design
that the heads twist off of or the new improved ones. Is there a torque
range for testing their strength? I understand these screws are not
structural. And the threads are not rolled but cut in. Someone with
knowledge please correct any of this that is wrong.
I am sending this info to Microfasteners also
Indiana Larry, RV7 Tip-up TMX-O-360 ACS2002 Dynon CNS430 Digitrak
Firewall Forward
----- Original Message -----
From: "Ron Calhoun" <roncal(at)earthlink.net>
Subject: RE: RV-List: Screws
>
> Mickey, these were made especially for the rv list. The first batch
> heads twisted off, but they replaced all orders with new ones with
> smaller torx. And will probably use then everywhere else
> when I paint.
> You can go direct to them at
> http://www.microfasteners.com/catalog/products/SSCFCMXS.cfm
>
> They are listed as 6 lobe drive screws, but are Torx. I suspect it has
> something to do with avoiding royalty payments for using the trademarked
> name "Torx".
>
> Ron Calhoun
> RV-4
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Mickey Coggins
> To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
> Subject: RV-List: Screws
>
>
> Hi,
>
> While installing the phillips screws into the various nutplates, I got
> to asking myself if there are aviation quality Torx screws that could be
> used instead. Does anyone know of a supplier for Torx or at a minimum
> some other type of hex head screw that won't slip off?
>
> I even used Torx on my workbenches - they are great.
>
> Thanks,
> Mickey
>
> PS: In case you don't know what the heck I'm talking
> about, here is a photo:
>
> http://rv8.ch/gallery/view_photo.php?set_albumName=workshop&id=DSCN7925
>
> or in case that wraps on your screen:
>
> http://www.rv8.ch/albums/workshop/DSCN7925.jpg
>
>
> --
> Mickey Coggins
> http://www.rv8.ch/
> #82007 QB Wings/Fuselage
>
>
> =
> direct advertising on the Matronics Forums.
> =
> =
> =
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Ed Anderson" <eanderson(at)carolina.rr.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Rotaries Again |
----- Original Message -----
From: "David Kirby" <davewendi(at)earthlink.net>
Subject: RV-List: Rotaries Again
>
> I read somewhere that the new Renesis rotary
> has 247 HP but only 164 LB/FT of torque. What does this mean for us?
Would this cause the engine to be sluggish? May not be good in a go around
situation? Anybody have any
> thoughts? Never looked to see what kind of torque a Lycoming
> has. Anyone know?
>
David, I don't have the Renesis figures in front of me, but that sounds
reasonable as the Renesis makes that HP/Torque above 8000 rpm. For that
reason, you clearly need to reduce the engine speed for propeller
efficiency. The most common gear ratio used to do this on the older rotary
engines (with less rpm) was 2.17:1. The Renesis's higher rpm makes the use
of a 2.85:1 ratio more useful Since reducing rpm (Gearing Down or
Reducing) increases torque by the gear ratio used, you have in the first
case (2.17:1) and assuming the same engine rpm and torque in cases 2.17 *164
lb-ft = 355.8 lb-ft of torque for the prop. Using the 2.85 ratio gives
2.85*164 = 467 lb-ft of torque. So for RV application, torque will not be
an issue.
Ed Anderson
RV-6A N494BW Rotary Powered
Matthews, NC 28104
eanderson(at)carolina.rr.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Alex Peterson" <alexpeterson(at)earthlink.net> |
> I read somewhere that the new Renesis rotary
> has 247 HP but only 164 LB/FT of torque. What does this mean
> for us? Would this cause the engine to be sluggish? May not
> be good in a go around situation? Anybody have any thoughts?
> Never looked to see what kind of torque a Lycoming has. Anyone know?
Presumably, these numbers are for the engine's driveshaft output. The
engine rpm for the numbers you have above would have to be about 8000.
There would also be some loss in the reduction unit, but the torque at
the prop would be 8000 divided by the reduction ratio. If the prop was
run at 2700, for example, the torque at the prop would be something like
400 - 450 ft-lbs.
Lycomings are in the 300 to 350 ft-lb torque range, but they are direct
drive.
Alex Peterson
Maple Grove, MN
RV6-A N66AP 442 hours
http://www.home.earthlink.net/~alexpeterson/
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Matthew Brandes" <matthew(at)n523rv.com> |
| Subject: | RE: Condition Inspection Checklist |
Sometimes we forget that the EAA has a great set of resources in the members
only area.
Gabe, check out
http://members.eaa.org/home/homebuilders/operating/inspection.html for a
condition inspection checklist.
Matthew Brandes,
Van's RV-9A (Wings/Fuselage)
EAA Chapter 868/91
www.n523rv.com
> From: "Gabe A Ferrer" <ferrergm(at)bellsouth.net>
> Subject: RV-List: Condition Inspection Checklist
>
>
> Please I'm looking for a Condition Inspection Checklist for my first
annual.
>
> I've checked in the archives. The email addresses for the RVr's offering
the checklist were no longer valid. And I > > > > couldn't find the
checklist in Kevin Horton's website.
>
> I would appreciate it if someone could point me to a Checklist source.
>
> Thanks
>
> Gabe A Ferrer
> RV6 N2GX 105 hours
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Hopperdhh(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Ruined HS Skin |
Hi Fred,
Its quite a shock when you first discover that you are not going to have a
perfect airplane. There are a few of those on mine too. Take everyone's
advice, deburr the hole, and move on. I have one hole out in the middle of the
skin! I just put a rivet in the hole so it looks like its supposed to be there.
That must be why Vans sent all those AD426AD3-3 rivets.
I'll probably get beat to death here, but I have found that ONE hammer blow
of the correct magnitude does a better job. I use a regular ball-peen hammer
and grind down the shaft when it peens out. There will be less distortion of
the skin that way. You still have to have the male die in the hole though!
But, there's less chance of it jumping out.
Dan RV-7A (almost finished)
In a message dated 2/24/04 11:29:47 PM US Eastern Standard Time,
foldenburg(at)earthlink.net writes:
>
>
> I start dimpling the Horizontal Stab left side skin tonight. The first
> few dimples went fine, but then the male part of the die must of slipped
> out of the skin between blows with the mallet.
>
> You can see the result here:
> http://www.rv.oldsack.com/weblog.php?id=C0_1_1
>
> I'm really sick about this and I'm not quite sure what to do. I guess I
> need to order a new skin from Vans. This is not the first screw up I've
> had and I'm sure it is not the last.
>
> Any advice here would be greatly appreciated!
>
> Thanks,
>
> Fred
>
> Frederick W. Oldenburg Jr.
> RV-7A Standard Kit - Empennage
> http://www.rv.oldsack.com
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Tailgummer(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: RV-8 Canopy Latches |
Great idea!. How do I order one? BTW the e-mail address listed on Sam
Buchanan's site kicked back.
Thanks!! John
D'Onofrio (Tailgummer(at)aol.com)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Cy Galley" <cgalley(at)QCBC.ORG> |
Most bolts and screws are rolled not cut even in the hardware store. It is
just cheaper to do it that way. I haven't seen these screws but the odds are
the threads are rolled.
----- Original Message -----
From: "LarryRobertHelming" <lhelming(at)sigecom.net>
Subject: Re: RV-List: Screws
>
> Interesting. I bought some about 18 months ago. How would anyone who
> bought these before the change know if they got screws with the bad design
> that the heads twist off of or the new improved ones. Is there a torque
> range for testing their strength? I understand these screws are not
> structural. And the threads are not rolled but cut in. Someone with
> knowledge please correct any of this that is wrong.
>
> I am sending this info to Microfasteners also
>
> Indiana Larry, RV7 Tip-up TMX-O-360 ACS2002 Dynon CNS430 Digitrak
> Firewall Forward
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Ron Calhoun" <roncal(at)earthlink.net>
> To:
> Subject: RE: RV-List: Screws
>
>
> >
> > Mickey, these were made especially for the rv list. The first batch
> > heads twisted off, but they replaced all orders with new ones with
> > smaller torx. And will probably use then everywhere else
> > when I paint.
> > You can go direct to them at
> > http://www.microfasteners.com/catalog/products/SSCFCMXS.cfm
> >
> > They are listed as 6 lobe drive screws, but are Torx. I suspect it has
> > something to do with avoiding royalty payments for using the trademarked
> > name "Torx".
> >
> > Ron Calhoun
> > RV-4
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
> > [mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Mickey Coggins
> > To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
> > Subject: RV-List: Screws
> >
> >
> >
> > Hi,
> >
> > While installing the phillips screws into the various nutplates, I got
> > to asking myself if there are aviation quality Torx screws that could be
> > used instead. Does anyone know of a supplier for Torx or at a minimum
> > some other type of hex head screw that won't slip off?
> >
> > I even used Torx on my workbenches - they are great.
> >
> > Thanks,
> > Mickey
> >
> > PS: In case you don't know what the heck I'm talking
> > about, here is a photo:
> >
> > http://rv8.ch/gallery/view_photo.php?set_albumName=workshop&id=DSCN7925
> >
> > or in case that wraps on your screen:
> >
> > http://www.rv8.ch/albums/workshop/DSCN7925.jpg
> >
> >
> > --
> > Mickey Coggins
> > http://www.rv8.ch/
> > #82007 QB Wings/Fuselage
> >
> >
> > =
> > direct advertising on the Matronics Forums.
> > =
> > =
> > =
> >
> >
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Sam Buchanan <sbuc(at)hiwaay.net> |
| Subject: | Re: RV-8 Canopy Latches |
Tailgummer(at)aol.com wrote:
>
> Great idea!. How do I order one? BTW the e-mail address listed on Sam
> Buchanan's site kicked back.
> Thanks!! John
> D'Onofrio (Tailgummer(at)aol.com)
Bill's email link in the article has now been updated:
http://home.hiwaay.net/~sbuc/journal/rv8-latch.html
Thanks for the note,
Sam Buchanan
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Jason Sneed <n242ds(at)cox.net> |
I think it is time to change my tires on my RV-6 (i am not the builder)
I have RV-4 wheel pants so I am assuming I have to stay with the same
size tire I have. (the pants are tight). I would rather spend more
money and get tires that will last longer. So I have 2 questions.
1. What is the best tire to get? I define best as last the longest.
2. How the heck do you jack this think up to change the tire? Where are
the jack points?
Thanks a lot,
N242DS RV-6
Jason Sneed
Commercial Lending Officer
First National Bank and Trust
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Lockamy, Jack L" <jack.lockamy(at)navy.mil> |
Mickey (and others),
After powder coating my instrument panel, I had some concerns about the phillips head screws in the panel and "slipping" screwdrivers. I found McMaster-Carr (www.mcmaster.com) sells Hex head torque screw in all sizes. They even had the lowered-head, black ones which is what I used for the panel.
Just go to the McMaster website and search for HEX HEAD or BUTTON HEAD SCREWS.
You will see multiple pages. You usually have to buy them in lots of 100 pcs,
but the prices are very reasonable in my opinion. Also having some spare screws
is always a good thing.....
Hope this helps,
Jack Lockamy
Camarillo, CA
RV-7A wiring
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bill VonDane <bill(at)vondane.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Condition Inspection Checklist |
vansairforce
Sorry... I should know better...
Anyway, I posted it to my web site:
http://www.vondane.com/rv8a/downloads/index.htm
-Bill VonDane
EAA Tech Counselor
RV-8A ~ N8WV ~ Colorado Springs
www.vondane.com
www.creativair.com
www.epanelbuilder.com
----- Original Message -----
From: Paul Brown
Subject: Re: Condition Inspection Checklist
Bill, your checklist did not make it through Matt's filter. Can you send me a copy?
Thanks Bill!
Paul Brown
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Aircraft Technical Book Company" <winterland(at)rkymtnhi.com> |
| Subject: | broken and missing 0-ring |
On my last flight, immediately on takeoff, fuel began spewing out of my
right side gas cap. (You won't believe how much is sucked out until you
actually see it for yourself) The flow slowed down on leveling off and
stopped completely once I began a descent. The tank was about 3/4 full on
takeoff, and in the time it took to get around the pattern I estimate losing
1-1.5 gallons throught the cap.
On landing, I first checked that the cap was on tight. It was. I then
checked the large O-ring that seals the cap in the flange. It appears fine.
But maybe appearances are deceiving. Maybe the O-ring has hardened in such
a way that it no longer seals well. Call Van's and buy a new set. Well,
since my cap is 12 years old, and new caps are somewhat different, I was
told to call Usher Enterprises direct to get a new set of old style rings.
Call Usher. Which O-ring do you need - each cap has 2, a big one and a small
one. Two 0-rings in each cap? OK, they're cheap enough - send 2 of each.
If one cap went bad, the other will surely be quick to follow.
It turns out that there is also a small O-ring which seals the stem inside
the cap. In my left tank, I found the small ring split in half, but yet to
spring a leak, although I doubt it would have been long until it did. In
the right cap, the ring was completely gone. Either lying somewhere in the
snow or floating somewhere in the tank. Nothing lasts forever, and nothing
can be taken forgranted. I'm still amazed how quickly fuel is sucked out of
such a small opening.
It's now replaced and all is fine. Maybe one more thing to carry in your
flight bag. Either that, or always make sure you've got enough fuel
available in either tank to make it to the next gas station.
Andy
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Doug Weiler" <dougweil(at)pressenter.com> |
>
> I think it is time to change my tires on my RV-6 (i am not the builder)
> I have RV-4 wheel pants so I am assuming I have to stay with the same
> size tire I have. (the pants are tight). I would rather spend more
> money and get tires that will last longer. So I have 2 questions.
>
> 1. What is the best tire to get? I define best as last the longest.
> 2. How the heck do you jack this think up to change the tire? Where are
> the jack points?
>
> Thanks a lot,
> N242DS RV-6
>
I swear by Michelin tires and tubes. They are not cheap, but last a long,
long time. Replace the tubes also (again, they are not cheap, but don't
leak air). I have used them on both of my RV-4s.
Do you have tiedown points? (screw-in steel eyelets) If so, I have rigged
up a simple auto jack extension that will bolt through your tiedown rings.
I can take a photo of this and send you one. Works great.
Doug Weiler
RV-4, N722DW, 105 hours TT
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Aircraft Technical Book Company" <winterland(at)rkymtnhi.com> |
There are several jacking options shown in past issues of the RV-ator.
I use a regular scissors type car jack. I put it on a couple cinder blocks
to raise it to near the height of the wing, and then put a 2x4 and a piece
of old carpet between it and the wing spar about halfway down the span.
I've seen others attach a threaded rod to the jack and then into the opening
in the wing where the tie down ring goes.
As far as tires, I've heard it said that re-treads last longer than new
tires, but don't make the same mistake I did. Retreads are slightly bigger
and won't fit well in the wheel pants. One landing (even a nice one) and
your wheel pants will be ripped apart requiring re-building and re-painting.
Andy
Builder's Bookstore
www.buildersbooks.com
----- Original Message -----
From: Jason Sneed <n242ds(at)cox.net>
Subject: RV-List: New tires
>
> I think it is time to change my tires on my RV-6 (i am not the builder)
> I have RV-4 wheel pants so I am assuming I have to stay with the same
> size tire I have. (the pants are tight). I would rather spend more
> money and get tires that will last longer. So I have 2 questions.
>
> 1. What is the best tire to get? I define best as last the longest.
> 2. How the heck do you jack this think up to change the tire? Where are
> the jack points?
>
> Thanks a lot,
> N242DS RV-6
>
>
> Jason Sneed
> Commercial Lending Officer
> First National Bank and Trust
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "BRUCE GRAY" <brucerv84us(at)hotmail.com> |
Fred, If I were to take a picture of mine, I think we would have twins. My
first reaction to my mistake was, out of breath, stomached turned, and call
Van's for a new skin. After taking with factory they told me to flatten out
the unwanted dimple and dimple the correct hole to maintain
symmetry. Once the rivet is set in the correct hole you fill it with micro
or feather fill, prime, paint, and WALLA. Hole Fixed! DO NOT LOSE SLEEP OVER
IT! If you were to replace everything that may go wrong during constrution
we would all still be in the shop and broke. That's worth losing sleep over.
Good-luck with your project and drive-on.
>From: "Fred Oldenburg" <foldenburg(at)earthlink.net>
>Reply-To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
>To:
>Subject: RV-List: Ruined HS Skin Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2004 21:27:28 -0700
>
>
>I start dimpling the Horizontal Stab left side skin tonight. The first
>few dimples went fine, but then the male part of the die must of slipped
>out of the skin between blows with the mallet.
>
>You can see the result here:
>http://www.rv.oldsack.com/weblog.php?id=C0_1_1
>
>I'm really sick about this and I'm not quite sure what to do. I guess I
>need to order a new skin from Vans. This is not the first screw up I've
>had and I'm sure it is not the last.
>
>Any advice here would be greatly appreciated!
>
>Thanks,
>
>Fred
>
>Frederick W. Oldenburg Jr.
>RV-7A Standard Kit - Empennage
>http://www.rv.oldsack.com
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | broke a dimple die |
| From: | Adam Boggs <boggs(at)aircrafter.org> |
Hi Folks,
The other day I was dimpling along on my wing skins and suddenly
realized that the pin on my male die had sheared off! After talking to
some other builders, it sounds like it's not uncommon to go through a
few sets of 3/32 dimple dies for a plane. I called Avery about it and
they were really great. Bob Avery replaced my male dimple die at his
cost, even though it was beyond the warrantee. (I then ordered a new
female die too and a bunch of other stuff.) He said to make sure that
I've completely cleared away all of the deburring shards or it could put
a lot of stress on the dimple dies. He also offered to clean out my
rivet gun which has been "luffing". I don't think it gets said enough
when companies do good business, so I just wanted to say that I'm really
impressed with Avery Tools and their commitment to their customers.
Now, on to my real question about dimpling technique... Normally when i
dimple I hit the plunger on my c-frame tool with my 2lb dead blow hammer
and let the plunger travel the inch or so down to where the skin is
sitting on the male dimple die. I talked to a friend about his
technique and he said he pushes the plunger down so it is mated with the
skin and male die, and then hits it with a hammer. Which is the proper
technique?
I experimented with holding the plunger down and found that it is much
more stable and significantly decreases the chances of the skin popping
off the die and putting an extra hole in the skin, but it doesn't seem
to produce as crisp a dimple. (ie. it seems to deform the skin around
the dimple a little more.)
Thoughts? Opinions? Is either way "bad"?
Thanks,
-Adam
rv7a wings
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Hopperdhh(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: broke a dimple die |
Adam,
I too broke a die by not holding the shaft down into the work. I had the
best results by having some help on the larger pieces and holding them square to
the surface as evidenced by the reflection of the shaft, and using my left
hand to hold the shaft down and hammering with my right hand. I used 2x4s, etc.,
to shim the table up to level with the male die. I then used a regular
ball-peen hammer with one blow (after slowly learning how hard to hit it). That
seemed to get the best results for me. I was into building the fuselage by the
time I caught onto this, and you can see the improvement.
Dan RV-7A (almost finished)
In a message dated 2/25/04 11:48:39 AM US Eastern Standard Time,
boggs(at)aircrafter.org writes:
> Now, on to my real question about dimpling technique... Normally when i
> dimple I hit the plunger on my c-frame tool with my 2lb dead blow hammer
> and let the plunger travel the inch or so down to where the skin is
> sitting on the male dimple die. I talked to a friend about his
> technique and he said he pushes the plunger down so it is mated with the
> skin and male die, and then hits it with a hammer. Which is the proper
> technique?
>
> I experimented with holding the plunger down and found that it is much
> more stable and significantly decreases the chances of the skin popping
> off the die and putting an extra hole in the skin, but it doesn't seem
> to produce as crisp a dimple. (ie. it seems to deform the skin around
> the dimple a little more.)
>
> Thoughts? Opinions? Is either way "bad"?
>
> Thanks,
> -Adam
> rv7a wings
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jeff Orear" <jorear(at)new.rr.com> |
| Subject: | Re: broke a dimple die |
Adam:
I think you answered you own question. It is far better, IMHO, to hold the
die down to the surface to be dimpled. No chance for slight movement that
can elongate your hole, and as you said, greatly decreases the chance of
making an "inspection hole" by mistake.
My technique was to hold the dies together by grasping the die holder rod
(for want of a better term) at the top of the c-frame----where the return
spring is. Then I would hit it lightly one stroke, then another slightly
firmer stroke. Done deal. You do not have to whack the thing into
submission. This will reduce your chances of deforming the material around
the dimple.
When you go to rivet your skin you are dimpling, use the trick of running
your deburring tool around a couple of times in the dimple to remove any
curvature inside the dimple. Your rivets will then sit down really nice.
Hope all this helps.
Regards,
Jeff Orear
RV6A
panel
Peshtigo, WI
----- Original Message -----
From: "Adam Boggs" <boggs(at)aircrafter.org>
Subject: RV-List: broke a dimple die
>
>
> Hi Folks,
>
> The other day I was dimpling along on my wing skins and suddenly
> realized that the pin on my male die had sheared off! After talking to
> some other builders, it sounds like it's not uncommon to go through a
> few sets of 3/32 dimple dies for a plane. I called Avery about it and
> they were really great. Bob Avery replaced my male dimple die at his
> cost, even though it was beyond the warrantee. (I then ordered a new
> female die too and a bunch of other stuff.) He said to make sure that
> I've completely cleared away all of the deburring shards or it could put
> a lot of stress on the dimple dies. He also offered to clean out my
> rivet gun which has been "luffing". I don't think it gets said enough
> when companies do good business, so I just wanted to say that I'm really
> impressed with Avery Tools and their commitment to their customers.
>
> Now, on to my real question about dimpling technique... Normally when i
> dimple I hit the plunger on my c-frame tool with my 2lb dead blow hammer
> and let the plunger travel the inch or so down to where the skin is
> sitting on the male dimple die. I talked to a friend about his
> technique and he said he pushes the plunger down so it is mated with the
> skin and male die, and then hits it with a hammer. Which is the proper
> technique?
>
> I experimented with holding the plunger down and found that it is much
> more stable and significantly decreases the chances of the skin popping
> off the die and putting an extra hole in the skin, but it doesn't seem
> to produce as crisp a dimple. (ie. it seems to deform the skin around
> the dimple a little more.)
>
> Thoughts? Opinions? Is either way "bad"?
>
> Thanks,
> -Adam
> rv7a wings
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Albert Gardner" <spudnut(at)worldnet.att.net> |
My understanding is that the change involved going to a smaller size recess,
ie, the new screws use a T-15 driver whereas the older style used a T-20.
Albert Gardner
>
> Interesting. I bought some about 18 months ago. How would anyone who
> bought these before the change know if they got screws with the bad design
> that the heads twist off of or the new improved ones. Is there a torque
> range for testing their strength? I understand these screws are not
> structural. And the threads are not rolled but cut in. Someone with
> knowledge please correct any of this that is wrong.
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | broke a dimple die |
| From: | "Condrey, Bob (US SSA)" <bob.condrey(at)baesystems.com> |
I have an add-on to the question below about technique. I've also been
using the male die in the bottom of the c-frame with the female on the
plunger. I saw that some folks use the male die in the plunger instead.
I can see where that might be an advantage for keep scratches to a
minimum but is there a preferred method by those that have done more
than the tail kit?
Bob RV-10 #105
-----Original Message-----
From: Adam Boggs [mailto:boggs(at)aircrafter.org]
Subject: RV-List: broke a dimple die
Hi Folks,
The other day I was dimpling along on my wing skins and suddenly
realized that the pin on my male die had sheared off! After talking to
some other builders, it sounds like it's not uncommon to go through a
few sets of 3/32 dimple dies for a plane. I called Avery about it and
they were really great. Bob Avery replaced my male dimple die at his
cost, even though it was beyond the warrantee. (I then ordered a new
female die too and a bunch of other stuff.) He said to make sure that
I've completely cleared away all of the deburring shards or it could put
a lot of stress on the dimple dies. He also offered to clean out my
rivet gun which has been "luffing". I don't think it gets said enough
when companies do good business, so I just wanted to say that I'm really
impressed with Avery Tools and their commitment to their customers.
Now, on to my real question about dimpling technique... Normally when i
dimple I hit the plunger on my c-frame tool with my 2lb dead blow hammer
and let the plunger travel the inch or so down to where the skin is
sitting on the male dimple die. I talked to a friend about his
technique and he said he pushes the plunger down so it is mated with the
skin and male die, and then hits it with a hammer. Which is the proper
technique?
I experimented with holding the plunger down and found that it is much
more stable and significantly decreases the chances of the skin popping
off the die and putting an extra hole in the skin, but it doesn't seem
to produce as crisp a dimple. (ie. it seems to deform the skin around
the dimple a little more.)
Thoughts? Opinions? Is either way "bad"?
Thanks,
-Adam
rv7a wings
=
direct advertising on the Matronics Forums.
=
=
=
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: a titanium Ti-down note |
In a message dated 2/25/04 4:52:06 AM Pacific Standard Time,
crowbotham(at)hotmail.com writes:
<< Any word on when you will be offering Ti tie down RINGS - Sure would like
to ditch the heavy ones for (3) Ti rings. >>
I'll take two Ti tie down rings when you're ready to offer them Randy.
Harry Crosby
Pleasanton, California
RV-6, final assembly
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: broke a dimple die |
In a message dated 2/25/04 8:48:39 AM Pacific Standard Time,
boggs(at)aircrafter.org writes:
<< I experimented with holding the plunger down and found that it is much
more stable and significantly decreases the chances of the skin popping
off the die and putting an extra hole in the skin >>
I learned the hard way to do it just as you describe for the same reason.
Harry Crosby
Pleasanton, California
RV-6, final assembly
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jeff Orear" <jorear(at)new.rr.com> |
| Subject: | Re: broke a dimple die |
Bob:
I preferred to have the male die in the base of the c-frame, and I made sure
that it the face of the die was just a hair above the plane of the support
tables I made with carpet on them so that there was just a bit of upward
pressure on the skin at the die.
As to scratches, I will probably get flamed here but I left the vinyl
covering on the skin whilst dimpling. As I stated in an earlier post, I
turned my deburring tool in each dimple a couple of revs prior to riveting
and I am very happy with how my rivets came out. Others will say that the
thickness of the protective covering will hamper the creation of a proper
dimple, but I had no difficulties.
Just my opinion, mind you. I suggest you try dimpling some scrap with the
covering on and off and make your own judgment. If you do remove the
covering, extra care is need to not scratch your skin....a consideration if
you do not plan to paint your RV. The scratches you make with a male dimple
die will not be a factor if you do paint. Again, just my every humble
opinion.
Regards,
Jeff Orear
RV6A
panel
Peshtigo, WI
----- Original Message -----
From: "Condrey, Bob (US SSA)" <bob.condrey(at)baesystems.com>
Subject: RE: RV-List: broke a dimple die
>
> I have an add-on to the question below about technique. I've also been
> using the male die in the bottom of the c-frame with the female on the
> plunger. I saw that some folks use the male die in the plunger instead.
> I can see where that might be an advantage for keep scratches to a
> minimum but is there a preferred method by those that have done more
> than the tail kit?
>
> Bob RV-10 #105
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Adam Boggs [mailto:boggs(at)aircrafter.org]
> To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
> Subject: RV-List: broke a dimple die
>
>
> Hi Folks,
>
> The other day I was dimpling along on my wing skins and suddenly
> realized that the pin on my male die had sheared off! After talking to
> some other builders, it sounds like it's not uncommon to go through a
> few sets of 3/32 dimple dies for a plane. I called Avery about it and
> they were really great. Bob Avery replaced my male dimple die at his
> cost, even though it was beyond the warrantee. (I then ordered a new
> female die too and a bunch of other stuff.) He said to make sure that
> I've completely cleared away all of the deburring shards or it could put
> a lot of stress on the dimple dies. He also offered to clean out my
> rivet gun which has been "luffing". I don't think it gets said enough
> when companies do good business, so I just wanted to say that I'm really
> impressed with Avery Tools and their commitment to their customers.
>
> Now, on to my real question about dimpling technique... Normally when i
> dimple I hit the plunger on my c-frame tool with my 2lb dead blow hammer
> and let the plunger travel the inch or so down to where the skin is
> sitting on the male dimple die. I talked to a friend about his
> technique and he said he pushes the plunger down so it is mated with the
> skin and male die, and then hits it with a hammer. Which is the proper
> technique?
>
> I experimented with holding the plunger down and found that it is much
> more stable and significantly decreases the chances of the skin popping
> off the die and putting an extra hole in the skin, but it doesn't seem
> to produce as crisp a dimple. (ie. it seems to deform the skin around
> the dimple a little more.)
>
> Thoughts? Opinions? Is either way "bad"?
>
> Thanks,
> -Adam
> rv7a wings
>
>
> =
> direct advertising on the Matronics Forums.
> =
> =
> =
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: broke a dimple die |
In a message dated 2/25/04 9:48:57 AM Pacific Standard Time,
bob.condrey(at)baesystems.com writes:
<< I have an add-on to the question below about technique. I've also been
using the male die in the bottom of the c-frame with the female on the
plunger. I saw that some folks use the male die in the plunger instead.
I can see where that might be an advantage for keep scratches to a
minimum but is there a preferred method by those that have done more
than the tail kit?
>>
Just my experience but I found that using the male die in the bottom allows
you to "index" the dies before striking the plunger. Many thousand dimples
later it still seems to work better that way for me.
Harry Crosby
Pleasanton, California
RV-6, final assembly
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Finn Lassen <finn.lassen(at)verizon.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Rotaries Again |
You'll probably be using a 1:3.85 PSRU (reduction gear box).
So you should be seeing 467 LB/FT torque at the prop. Right?
Finn
David Kirby wrote:
>
>I read somewhere that the new Renesis rotary
>has 247 HP but only 164 LB/FT of torque. What does this mean for us? Would this
cause the engine to be sluggish? May not be good in a go around situation?
Anybody have any
>thoughts? Never looked to see what kind of torque a Lycoming
>has. Anyone know?
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Skylor Piper <skylor4(at)yahoo.com> |
| Subject: | Re: broke a dimple die |
Several things that I've learned about dimpling from
building by HS stabilizer:
1. I started out using a dead-blow mallet. I
discovered on my second HS skin, that the dimples
weren't as perfect as I would have liked. There was
some skin distortion around the dimple (actually the
skin seemes to roll into the dimple, instead of the
dimple being formed nice and sharply around the rivet
head) and the rivets didn't seem to sit quite all the
way into the dimple, though this is very slight. I
found that by switching from the dead blow hammer to a
2lb brass head hammer, AND striking the dimpler more
firmly, I get very clean, crisp dimples, and the
rivets sit very well. Somewhere along the line before
I started my kit, I was given the advice not to strike
the dimpler too firmly. I think this was wrong,
because my best dimples I get are formed from quite
firm strikes.
2. I push and hold the "C" frame shaft all the way
down and mate the dies, then I form the dimple with
ONE solid blow. A light "alignment tap" first seems
to increase skin distortion around the dimple.
3. I try to make sure that the C frame dimpler is
located over a leg of my work bench, so that there is
no table flex and the dimple blow is sharp.
4. After making one boo-boo dimple on my HS
stabilizer skin, I am very careful about making sure
the male die is in the hole before I strike. Being
deliberate about this might make the dimpling process
take slightly longer, but it's worth it!
5. I've yet to break a die, but I'm not too far along
on my kit.
Skylor
RV-8 QB, Under Construction!
--- HCRV6(at)aol.com wrote:
>
> In a message dated 2/25/04 9:48:57 AM Pacific
> Standard Time,
> bob.condrey(at)baesystems.com writes:
>
> << I have an add-on to the question below about
> technique. I've also been
> using the male die in the bottom of the c-frame
> with the female on the
> plunger. I saw that some folks use the male die in
> the plunger instead.
> I can see where that might be an advantage for keep
> scratches to a
> minimum but is there a preferred method by those
> that have done more
> than the tail kit?
> >>
>
> Just my experience but I found that using the male
> die in the bottom allows
> you to "index" the dies before striking the plunger.
> Many thousand dimples
> later it still seems to work better that way for me.
>
> Harry Crosby
> Pleasanton, California
> RV-6, final assembly
>
>
>
> Contributions
> any other
> Forums.
>
> http://www.matronics.com/chat
>
> http://www.matronics.com/subscription
> http://www.matronics.com/FAQ/RV-List.htm
> http://www.matronics.com/archives
> http://www.matronics.com/photoshare
> http://www.matronics.com/emaillists
>
>
>
>
>
__________________________________
http://antispam.yahoo.com/tools
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Alex Peterson" <alexpeterson(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | Tenth Annual Twin Cities RV Fly In |
Fellow listers,
Get out those calendars and mark down May 22nd and 23rd for taking the
RV to the Twin Cities of Minneapolis and St. Paul, Minnesota. We have
changed the format somewhat for this year to emphasize the Fly In
portion of the event. We will still have, as usual, door prizes and
forums discussing all aspects of building and flying RV's.
Additionally, we are holding the Fly In in conjunction with Discover
Aviation Days, a major aviation event, at Anoka County Airport, in the
northern Twin Cities area. There are pancake breakfasts both days, a
pig roast Saturday evening with a hangar dance afterwards.
See our still infant website:
http://www.home.earthlink.net/~rvflyin/
And the Discover Aviation Days site:
http://www.discoveraviationdays.org/
Hope to see you all there!!
Alex Peterson
Chairman, Twin Cities RV Forum
alexpeterson(at)earthlink.net
http://www.home.earthlink.net/~rvflyin
17650 82nd Way North
Maple Grove, Minnesota, 55311
612-418-9710
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: broke a dimple die |
| From: | "Frank van der Hulst (Staff WG)" <F.vanderHulst(at)ucol.ac.nz> |
Generally speaking, I agree with the dimpling techniques outlined in
this thread. A couple of additional comments:
1. I use an ordinary 16oz carpenter's hammer, with a tap-TAP technique.
If I had a dead-blow hammer, or a brass-headed hammer, I'd probably use
it.
2. It's my view that some people on this list are perfectionists, which
is both good and bad. Good in that they build the best possible plane,
but bad in that they sometimes spend an excessive amount of time on
irrelevant details. Any comments on this list (including this one!)
should be taken with a grain of salt.
3. An example of this perfectionism is the concern with *perfect*
dimples... let's not forget that the next step is going to be to crush a
metal rivet into the dimple by bashing it several times with a pneumatic
rivet gun. Any "imperfections" in the original dimple will disappear at
that point.
4. And dimple "crispness". Is this a good thing? It'll mean that there
will be a perfect smooth line across the skin and rivet head. Nice
looking! And aerodynamically clean! BUT! We spend a lot of effort in
avoiding sharp corners in airplane construction because they weaken the
structure. I wonder how much the skin is weakened at every rivet by the
sharp corners that a crisp dimple implies? Probably insignificantly (see
point 2 above). OTOH, the aerodynamic improvements are probably also
insignificant. And so are the improvement in looks.
5. Similarly, generally speaking, ordinary tools are adequate. Not
perfect, but good enough. If you bought all the tools that people
suggest here, you would be broke. And only an Oshkosh Grand Champion
judge would be able to tell the difference.
6. Hold the C-frame shaft down to mate the dies. If it's not held down,
then the metal may move off the bottom die between taps. This *will*
cause an *real* imperfection!
7. Put the male die on the bottom. That helps locate work correctly, and
also helps stop it from moving.
8. Generally, I dimple on a concrete floor. Not because it makes better
dimples, but because its easier. Use some 4x2s or whatever to support
the skin horizontally. Use a foam pad for your knees.
9. I haven't broken any dimple dies (now working on the finish kit of a
(very) slow-build RV-6). I have broken a couple of 3/32" countersink
cutter pilots though. However, I did lend my dies to a fellow builder,
who broke one. But that was being used in a hand-squeezer, I think.
10. I think it's a good idea to remove the plastic before dimpling. If
you remove the plastic after dimpling, little doughnuts of plastic
sometimes get left behind in the dimples. It would then be possible to
accidentally rivet a plastic doughnut in place. I remove strips of
plastic about 1" wide along the rivet lines -- run a soldering iron down
the line where you want the plastic to cut.
Frank
Learn real skills for the real world - Apply online
at http://www.ucol.ac.nz or call 0800 GO UCOL
(0800 46 8265) or txt free 3388 for more information
and make a good move to UCOL Universal College of
Learning.
Enrol with a public institute and be certain of your
future
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Brian Kraut <engalt(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | Re: RV7 Finish Kit |
I have been using 3M Sandblaster paper. It also works great. I will have to try
the Norton also.
-----Original Message-----
From: Dan Checkoway <dan(at)rvproject.com>
Subject: Re: RV-List: RV7 Finish Kit
sandpaper, Sandpaper, SANDPAPER! 8-)
I just recently tried a new flavor of paper from Norton called "3X High
Performance." I bought it from Home Depot and paid at least twice as much
as el cheapo paper.
But I gotta say that it works wonders. It really works as advertised and
doesn't load or clog up. Clap it and it's clear. It's almost too good
'cause it's hard to tell when it's appropriate to toss it. From now on I'm
going to overpay for the easier time. Too bad I learned this at the end of
the project...
You might also think about having Van's ship you an extra cutting disc that
they sell for cutting the canopy and stuff. They were cheap if I recall.
If you don't already have epoxy, fiberglass, and filler stuff (i.e.
microbaloons, flox, etc.)...grab some West System 105/205 epoxy -- Spruce
sells kits, which include resin & hardener. For like 10 bucks you can buy
the ratio pumps. The canard guys will laugh at you for using West System,
but screw 'em, it's so easy and works great.
Have fun,
)_( Dan
RV-7 N714D
http://www.rvproject.com
----- Original Message -----
From: <benandginny(at)insightbb.com>
Subject: RV-List: RV7 Finish Kit
>
> I just spoke with Vans today and my RV7 finish kit is ready to ship.
10 weeks from the time I ordered. (Not the 16 weeks as advertised). I would
like some info on what tools, products, and just nice things to have, that I
can order now to be ready to go when this kit arrives. Specifically items
for the canopy, fiberglass work etc.
>
> Ben Cunningham
> RV7
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Ken Beene" <kbeene(at)citilink.com> |
| Subject: | Heated air inlet location |
> fine eye he questioned me why I didn't take the cabin heat
> air off the oil cooler exit air? We'll Makes sense to me.
> Maybe next time?
>
In addition to the potential oil cooling issues in the summer (outlet being
significantly smaller than cooler inlet), I would be concerned about routing
the outlet air from the oil cooler to the heat muff and then to the cockpit.
Even a very small leak in the cooler could cause a lot of smoke in the
cabin. The control valve would have to work very good not to leak fumes.
Ken
RV-6A N94KB building RV-4
http://www.mninter.net/~kbeene/
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Allen Fulmer" <afulmer(at)charter.net> |
| Subject: | broke a dimple die |
Something I have come to like is to remove the spring on the C-Frame, place
the skin with half hanging over the side of the bench, put the male die on
top, them move the skin with my left hand while placing the male die in the
hole. Gravity then holds the dies together while picking up the hammer for
a strike. Haven't made any extra holes since adopting this technique.
Allen Fulmer
Empenage
N808AF reserved
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | BrooksRV6(at)webtv.net (Chris Brooks) |
| Subject: | Re: Quick Oil Drain |
I think the Ebay description referencing a $120 dollar valve in the ACS
catalog is a little optimistic. A google search for Curtis CCB-37000
turned up several for less than $18. Sacramento Sky Ranch has them on
Ebay for $25 buy it now.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Tracy Crook" <lors01(at)msn.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Rotaries Again |
I'm going to use a 2.85 : 1 gear drive (RWS RD-1C) with my Renesis. Prop should
be ready for it next week (74 x 88). The torque at prop is engine torque (164)
x gear ratio (2.85) 467.4 lb/ft. This ignores gear losses which are minimal.
Go-around response is a non-issue in my experience with the rotary.
Tracy Crook
----- Original Message -----
From: David Kirby
Subject: RV-List: Rotaries Again
I read somewhere that the new Renesis rotary
has 247 HP but only 164 LB/FT of torque. What does this mean for us? Would this
cause the engine to be sluggish? May not be good in a go around situation?
Anybody have any
thoughts? Never looked to see what kind of torque a Lycoming
has. Anyone know?
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jeff Orear" <jorear(at)new.rr.com> |
| Subject: | Re: broke a dimple die |
Frank:
I couldn't agree with you more regarding numbers 2,3,4 and 5. Well put.
The old saying that we are building airplanes, not watches rings true here.
Those that choose to sweat every detail and build award-winning airplanes
certainly have my admiration, but some of the nit-picking can scare the
daylights out of the average builder at times.
As to concerns over plastic doughnuts if the protective plastic is not
removed prior to dimpling...( I KNEW I should have covered this!!) Yes,
that can happen. I have been very careful to check for them, this being
made more difficult as my skins were covered in clear plastic, not the blue
that is currently provided. A quick spin with an exacto blade and anything
that was left behind was removed.
Thanks for pointing that out for the new builders out there.
Regards,
Jeff Orear
RV6A
panel
Peshtigo, WI
----- Original Message -----
From: "Frank van der Hulst (Staff WG)" <F.vanderHulst(at)ucol.ac.nz>
Subject: RV-List: Re: broke a dimple die
>
> Generally speaking, I agree with the dimpling techniques outlined in
> this thread. A couple of additional comments:
>
> 1. I use an ordinary 16oz carpenter's hammer, with a tap-TAP technique.
> If I had a dead-blow hammer, or a brass-headed hammer, I'd probably use
> it.
>
> 2. It's my view that some people on this list are perfectionists, which
> is both good and bad. Good in that they build the best possible plane,
> but bad in that they sometimes spend an excessive amount of time on
> irrelevant details. Any comments on this list (including this one!)
> should be taken with a grain of salt.
>
> 3. An example of this perfectionism is the concern with *perfect*
> dimples... let's not forget that the next step is going to be to crush a
> metal rivet into the dimple by bashing it several times with a pneumatic
> rivet gun. Any "imperfections" in the original dimple will disappear at
> that point.
>
> 4. And dimple "crispness". Is this a good thing? It'll mean that there
> will be a perfect smooth line across the skin and rivet head. Nice
> looking! And aerodynamically clean! BUT! We spend a lot of effort in
> avoiding sharp corners in airplane construction because they weaken the
> structure. I wonder how much the skin is weakened at every rivet by the
> sharp corners that a crisp dimple implies? Probably insignificantly (see
> point 2 above). OTOH, the aerodynamic improvements are probably also
> insignificant. And so are the improvement in looks.
>
> 5. Similarly, generally speaking, ordinary tools are adequate. Not
> perfect, but good enough. If you bought all the tools that people
> suggest here, you would be broke. And only an Oshkosh Grand Champion
> judge would be able to tell the difference.
>
> 6. Hold the C-frame shaft down to mate the dies. If it's not held down,
> then the metal may move off the bottom die between taps. This *will*
> cause an *real* imperfection!
>
> 7. Put the male die on the bottom. That helps locate work correctly, and
> also helps stop it from moving.
>
> 8. Generally, I dimple on a concrete floor. Not because it makes better
> dimples, but because its easier. Use some 4x2s or whatever to support
> the skin horizontally. Use a foam pad for your knees.
>
> 9. I haven't broken any dimple dies (now working on the finish kit of a
> (very) slow-build RV-6). I have broken a couple of 3/32" countersink
> cutter pilots though. However, I did lend my dies to a fellow builder,
> who broke one. But that was being used in a hand-squeezer, I think.
>
> 10. I think it's a good idea to remove the plastic before dimpling. If
> you remove the plastic after dimpling, little doughnuts of plastic
> sometimes get left behind in the dimples. It would then be possible to
> accidentally rivet a plastic doughnut in place. I remove strips of
> plastic about 1" wide along the rivet lines -- run a soldering iron down
> the line where you want the plastic to cut.
>
> Frank
> Learn real skills for the real world - Apply online
> at http://www.ucol.ac.nz or call 0800 GO UCOL
> (0800 46 8265) or txt free 3388 for more information
> and make a good move to UCOL Universal College of
> Learning.
>
> Enrol with a public institute and be certain of your
> future
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: FrozenControls |
| From: | czechsix(at)juno.com |
Dave,
Has your friend tried heating it back up again to see if it "unfreezes"? Sometimes
moisture can get down inside the sleeve of a cable and when it's cold and
it refreezes, it can jam the controls completely just like you describe. Heating
with a torpedo heater could exacerbate this problem because there's a lot
of water vapor as a product of the combustion of kerosene, so when you blow this
into a cold cowl, the moisture can condense on (and maybe inside?) the cold
cable, then after the heat's removed if the air temp's still below freezing,
it refreezes...
I read about an ultralight incident a few years back, can't remember what kind
it was but it used sheathed cables to connect the stick to the flight controls.
It was parked in a warm hangar on one nice winter day when the owner decided
to take it around the patch. Don't know if he did a good control check before
takeoff or not, but anyway, once airborne he discovered that the controls froze
solid (fortunately in a more-or-less neutral position!). Amazingly he was
able to land it by using power to control pitch/altitude and rudder to turn
it. Couldn't figure out what was jamming the controls, until after back in the
warm hangar they started working just fine again....
Thought I'd share this just in case....let us know what the final prognosis is
for your friend's -8.
--Mark Navratil
Cedar Rapids, Iowa
RV-8A N2D fwf cables and stuff...
From: "DAVID REEL" <dreel(at)cox.net>
Subject: RV-List: FrozenControls
A friend just experienced a failure I haven't seen on the list. After preheating
his RV8 with a torpedo heater directed through the cowl exit ramp, his mixture
control froze solid. It turns out that the control cables Vans supplies for
throttle, mixture, and prop contain something inside that melts then jams the
cable when it cools. I don't know the critical temperature, but it occurred
to me to wonder if others had experienced this who might have a better handle
on how hot those cables can get before they start melting. I'm also wondering
if the aftermath of an in flight fire that you blow/starve out might leave
you in the air with jammed controls. Any thoughts?
Dave Reel - RV8A
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Mike Comeaux" <mcomeaux(at)bendnet.com> |
| Subject: | Reno Box Seating |
To whom may be interested in box seating in Reno this year.
I've had a couple more people contact me regarding Reno.
I filled the one box already. I've got (4) confirmed seats sold
and need to fill 6 more to complete another box. If interested
contact me off list at mcomeaux(at)bendnet.com.
Regards Mike Comeaux
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jim and Bev Cone" <jimnbev(at)olypen.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Opinions on new Ray Allen stick grips |
I have one of the new Ray Allen stick grips and really like it. I was one of the
first to order it when they advertised it. The delivery date kept slipping
and it took about two months to finally get it. They reduced the price by 50%
"for my patience". I also added a switch for autopilot disconnect and a flap
switch. It looks great and feels great with either hand. It is very high quality.
Jim Cone
3-peat offender
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jim and Bev Cone" <jimnbev(at)olypen.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Ruined HS Skin |
Drill out to #30. Carefully redimple the correct hole position. Use a Dremel
and a polishing wheel and polish the edge of the bad hole so it won't crack.
Use an "Oops rivet" and set the rivet normally. Fill the space at the side with
Bondo or JB Weld. After painting you will not be able to see the problem.
Jim Cone
3-peat Offender
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Larry Bowen" <Larry(at)bowenaero.com> |
| Subject: | turn and bank power consumption |
My TC shows 1.04 amps at power-on and stablizes at .26 amps after it
spins up.
-
Larry Bowen
Larry(at)BowenAero.com
http://BowenAero.com
> -----Original Message-----
> From: thomas a. sargent [mailto:sarg314(at)earthlink.net]
> Sent: Sunday, February 22, 2004 2:41 PM
> To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
> Subject: RV-List: turn and bank power consumption
>
>
> -->
>
> I've been having difficulty finding a typical power
> consumption figure
> for an electric turn and bank indicator. If any one has the
> specs for
> an R.C. Allen or a Sigmatek, that would be fine.
>
> Thanks,
> --
> Tom Sargent, RV-6A
>
>
> ===========
> Matronics Forums.
> ===========
> ===========
> ===========
>
>
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Sam Buchanan <sbuc(at)hiwaay.net> |
| Subject: | Re: This Saturday's Flyin is ON. |
Was doing a little poking through the flight planner in advance of going
to Dana's fly-in; please be advised there is a TFR just to the NE of
Madison airport, 0-5000' AGL. Please check notams so none of us get a
special escort to the airport! :-)
Sam Buchanan
======================
Dana Overall wrote:
>
> The Saturday Flyin is ON. Ill be at the hangar by 8AM. Ill have the
> Hooters wings and the local EAA chapter has asked if they can serve burger,
> chips and drinks. My cell number is listed below.
>
> It appears the entire east coast will be sitting under a large high-pressure
> area from western MO east. Furthermore it appears this high will extend to
> the Great Lakes and Florida. Mother nature seems to have lent a helping
> hand. Weather for Saturday is expected to be 64 degrees, 0% chance of
> precip, winds out of the south at 9. No weather two days either side of
> Saturday.
>
> As I mentioned in a prior post, all activities will occur at the airport,
> i39, Madison Co. Airport, Richmond, KY. As a reference, it is about 20
> miles south of Lexington, KY.
>
> Vendors of which I have either received giveaways from or have received
> strong assurances from are as follows:
>
> I would certainly encourage all to remember this gang.
>
> Control Vision: free total AnyWhere Map software package
> Trioavionics: $200 discount coupon on the purchase of an EZ Autopilot
> Avery: A box of various tools and such
> Kitlog Pro: Paul has donated a Kitlog software package.
> Vans: Two starter kits, shirt, hat.
> Grand Rapids: 10% off coupon on the purchase of an EIS engine system.
> Riteangle AOA: $50 off coupon on the purchase of a new angle of attack unit
> Aircraftextras.com
> Brian Krauts post light system.
>
> I would also encourage anyone having anything to sell, to bring it along.
> Stick your name on it and lay it on the table. This will be the total
> honesty system. Everyone chip in and make sure nothing leaves via someones
> pocket, I sure would like to see all my tools, dies, Dynon, etc. be left
> behind as I need them just as much as the next guy:-). I only mention this
> as someone once pocketed a handheld out of a cockpit at a national
> gathering. I hate to even mention it but there it is.
>
> TeamRV is planning on performing their Oshkosh routine along with some just
> fun formation flying. A formation flight from the Ohio Valley RVators has
> issued a challenge on TeamRVs website about a competition. A nice little
> back and forth is going on right now:-). I have received an email from a
> member of The Falcon RV Squadron and am awaiting a confirmation. I have
> also heard from several pilots who are offering free RV rides to potential
> builders and builders.
>
> Direction via car:
>
> Off I-75, take exit 77 (KY route 595) and turn west. Go about 200 yards and
> make a right between the BP Station and the Shell Station. Go exactly 2.0
> miles and make a right onto Madison County Airport Road. The airport road
> will take you directly to my hangar.
>
> Via air:
>
> Anyone flying in, be sure and check the NOTAMs as there is restricted
> airspace on the east side of I-75 for the army depot.
>
> For you newbies; I have turned the Vans starter kits into pre-punched
> condition. If you want to work with some aluminum, please feel free to do
> so. There will many experienced builders here to show you some pointers.
> You will be able to deburr, dimple with squeezer and C-frame, back rivet,
> buck, pneumatic squeeze, hand squeeze, roll a rudder front, and install
> nutplates. There will also be composite pilots here and I will bring along
> some West System and glass. My first airplane was plastic so give a shout.
>
>
> Dana Overall
> Richmond, KY i39 cell 859 625-2844
> RV-7 slider, Imron black, "Black Magic"
> Finish kit
> 13B Rotary. Hangar flying my Dynon.
> http://rvflying.tripod.com/aero1.jpg
> http://rvflying.tripod.com/aero3.jpg
> http://rvflying.tripod.com/blackrudder.jpg
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "William Davis" <rvpilot(at)access4less.net> |
| Subject: | Re: RV-8 Canopy Latches |
Hi John,
Thanks for your interest in my canopy latch
That was an old E mail address, I think that Sam has corrected it now.
The preferred method of payment is by personal check.
Please send $25 + $2 for S&H to:
William Davis
119 Ridgeview Dr.
Eustis, FL 32726
Thanks, Bill
----- Original Message -----
From: <Tailgummer(at)aol.com>
Subject: Re: RV-List: RV-8 Canopy Latches
>
> Great idea!. How do I order one? BTW the e-mail address listed on Sam
> Buchanan's site kicked back.
> Thanks!!
John
> D'Onofrio (Tailgummer(at)aol.com)
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Don Mack" <don(at)dmack.net> |
| Subject: | Splatter paint for the interior |
I am thinking of using splatter paint on my interior. I have seen a few RV's
this way and the owners seem to like the results. If anyone has an
experiences with it or has a web page, photos etc. I would appreciate the
info. I looked in the archives, could not find anything.
Don Mack
www.dmack.net
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Jerry2DT(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | GRT EFIS & Engine Monitor |
Listers...
Would anyone out there who has purchased the GRT EfIS Horizon or the
Graphical Engine Monitor please check in with a user report? Checked archives but
not
much out there. This looks like a good unit but I'd like to hear some
opinions from actual users if possible. Thanks.
Jerry Cochran
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "David Schaefer" <dschaefer1(at)kc.rr.com> |
| Subject: | GRT EFIS & Engine Monitor |
They're a little too new right now for much of a review. I just got mine a
week or so ago and they are serial numbers 23,24,25! Working on getting
them installed. Installed the AHARS. I think they are great units, well
made and GRT has a good reputation.
You can see some of the pictures at http://home.kc.rr.com/N142DS which is in
the VERY early stages of being developed (so please no comments about the
web-site).
David Schaefer
RV6-A Finishing
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Jerry2DT(at)aol.com
Subject: RV-List: GRT EFIS & Engine Monitor
Listers...
Would anyone out there who has purchased the GRT EfIS Horizon or the
Graphical Engine Monitor please check in with a user report? Checked
archives but not
much out there. This looks like a good unit but I'd like to hear some
opinions from actual users if possible. Thanks.
Jerry Cochran
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: broke a dimple die |
In a message dated 2/25/04 10:54:02 AM Pacific Standard Time,
jorear(at)new.rr.com writes:
<< As to scratches, I will probably get flamed here but I left the vinyl
covering on the skin whilst dimpling. >>
Just my own experience again but when I tried this I found that after eight
or ten dimples the female die would get clogged with little discs of vinyl so
that the dimples would no longer form properly. These were a real pain to dig
out of the female die so I returned to peeling the vinyl off in strips over
the rivet holes.
I used a medium size plastic mallet and a single moderate hit on each dimple,
except on 0.040 which requires two or three whacks, and got very satisfactory
dimples with very little or no marring of the surface. Just my $0.05.
Harry Crosby
Pleasanton, California
RV-6, final assembly
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | GRT EFIS & Engine Monitor |
Very impressive panel. At least now I don't feel like I've gone overboard by
planning for 2 GRT displays plus an MX-20. When you get the chance, how
about some larger size images of the panel and AHRS installation? BTW your
URL is case sensitive so it should be http://home.kc.rr.com/n142ds.
Regards,
Greg Young - Houston (DWH)
RV-6 N6GY - project Phoenix
Navion N5221K - just an XXL RV-6A
>
> They're a little too new right now for much of a review. I
> just got mine a week or so ago and they are serial numbers
> 23,24,25! Working on getting them installed. Installed the
> AHARS. I think they are great units, well made and GRT has a
> good reputation.
>
> You can see some of the pictures at
> http://home.kc.rr.com/N142DS which is in the VERY early
> stages of being developed (so please no comments about the web-site).
>
> David Schaefer
> RV6-A Finishing
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Tom & Cathy Ervin" <tcervin(at)valkyrie.net> |
| Subject: | Stainless Wheel Pants Brackets |
List, Seems like someone was selling Stainless Wheel Pants Brackets but I
can't locate the Website? Has anyone used these and/or point me in the right
direction? RV6-A getting closer!
Tom in Ohio
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jim Jewell" <jjewell(at)telus.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Stainless Wheel Pants Brackets |
Hi Tom,
Try contacting Avery tools or email robbie(at)attawayair.com
His web site is http://www.attawayair.com/rv6_products.htm
Jim in Kelowna
----- Original Message -----
From: "Tom & Cathy Ervin" <tcervin(at)valkyrie.net>
Subject: RV-List: Stainless Wheel Pants Brackets
>
> List, Seems like someone was selling Stainless Wheel Pants Brackets
but I can't locate the Website? Has anyone used these and/or point me in
the right direction? RV6-A getting closer!
>
Tom in Ohio
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jerry Calvert" <rv6(at)cox.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Stainless Wheel Pants Brackets |
The last time I checked, Avery doesn't carry them any longer.
Jerry Calvert
Edmond Ok
N296JC RV6
----- Original Message -----
From: "Jim Jewell" <jjewell(at)telus.net>
Subject: Re: RV-List: Stainless Wheel Pants Brackets
>
> Hi Tom,
>
> Try contacting Avery tools or email robbie(at)attawayair.com
>
> His web site is http://www.attawayair.com/rv6_products.htm
>
> Jim in Kelowna
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Tom & Cathy Ervin" <tcervin(at)valkyrie.net>
> To:
> Subject: RV-List: Stainless Wheel Pants Brackets
>
>
> >
> > List, Seems like someone was selling Stainless Wheel Pants Brackets
> but I can't locate the Website? Has anyone used these and/or point me in
> the right direction? RV6-A getting closer!
> >
> Tom in Ohio
> >
> >
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Matt Jurotich <mjurotich(at)hst.nasa.gov> |
Doug
I'd like a copy of that tie down jack photo. Sounds like a great idea.
Thanks
Matthew M. Jurotich
NASA/Goddard Space Flight Center
Swales contractor to the
JWST ISIM Systems Engineer
m/c : 443
e-mail mail to:
phone : 301-286-5919
fax : 301-286-7021
JWST URL: <http://ngst1.gsfc.nasa.gov
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bill Dube <bdube(at)al.noaa.gov> |
| Subject: | Re: Splatter paint for the interior |
>
>I am thinking of using splatter paint on my interior. I have seen a few RV's
>this way and the owners seem to like the results. If anyone has an
>experiences with it or has a web page, photos etc. I would appreciate the
>info. I looked in the archives, could not find anything.
I've used splatter paint on cars quite a bit.
You can buy it in spray cans as "trunk" paint. There are two major
types. One has blobs of two or three different color (gray, white, black)
paint. The other has chunks of different color (gray, white, black) flock.
The blob style is better than the flock style.
I found that the surface was not at all durable. You MUST cover
the trunk paint with clearcoat if you plan to touch it at all. The bare
trunk paint is like primer. It rubs off pretty easily and gets dirty very
easily. With a clearcoat, it is very durable and stays clean.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Evan and Megan Johnson" <evmeg(at)snowcrest.net> |
OK....who has a list of the RV10 websites out there? I have found the 4 links on
Vans' site, (alll very nice) but I know there has to be more out there in the
ether. I am curious who has the most completed on the wing kit.....would like
to see assembly pictures.
Thanks....Evan
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Oil on the Windscreen - Part 2 |
Listers,
Regarding my oil leak last Saturday:
I took my spinner, prop, and flywheel off last night. The
"crankcase oil seal" (official Lycoming name) was pushed out
of the crankcase and riding on the crankshaft. The seal itself
looks fine. I checked my breather tube and it was free and
clear as well. I have an oil-air separator with a collection
tank. I've drained it periodically and gotten very little
fluid (mostly water) out of it. I highly doubt that it froze
over in flight on Saturday.
The question now is what do I do to prevent the seal from
coming back out of the engine. While I really like Wheeler's
idea of drilling and tapping holes in the bosses provided
and then using plates to hold the seal in place, that means
tearing the whole engine apart to get access to drill and
tap behind the crankshaft flange! I really don't want to
do that! Lycoming has a Service Instruction SI-1324A
that talks about the seal. Unfortunately, it isn't one of
the SIs on line on the Lycoming website. If anyone has it,
I'd appreciate finding out what it says.
Barring any other ideas, I'm probably going to use the contact
cement used by one of the repair places at Arlington and glue
it back in. I sure can't see how just pushing it back in will
work better than the original installation.
Any ideas out there?
Doug Medema
RV-6A N276DM in the (airplane) hospital
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Ernest Kells" <ernest.kells(at)sympatico.ca> |
| Subject: | Re: Quick Oil Drain |
David and others:
Vans offers a quick drain plug for $50.00. See Part# F P5000 on page 12.
Ernest Kells - RV-9A O235-N2C, Wood Prop
90% Complete - Electrical, Pre-paint
>
> Sounds overpriced to me. I looked it up though and there is a drain valve
at
> Spruce for 120.95.
>
> Part number AE80664H Lycoming Engines 1/2NPT $120.950
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: broke a dimple die |
In a message dated 2/25/04 11:12:40 PM Pacific Standard Time, HCRV6(at)aol.com
writes:
<< Just my own experience again but when I tried this I found that after
eight
or ten dimples the female die would get clogged with little discs of vinyl
so
that the dimples would no longer form properly. >>
Sorry guys, right after I sent this I realized, again, that I should never
reply to the list after midnight. What I was thinking about was the time I
tried putting removable Scotch tape over the drilled holes to eliminate marking
of
the surface. The result of that experiment was what I described above and
had nothing to do with the vinyl. My bad!
Harry Crosby
Pleasanton, California
RV-6, final assembly
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Wheeler North <wnorth(at)sdccd.cc.ca.us> |
Paul Harvey included on his national morning radio report that last year saw
a 25% reduction in experiemntal accidents, with a 30% reduction in
fatalities, mostly due to safety efforts by such organizations as the EAA.
Thank you Paul
http://www.paulharvey.com/email_form.shtml
if you would like to thank him yourself
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | linn walters <lwalters2(at)cfl.rr.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Oil on the Windscreen - Part 2 |
dmedema(at)att.net wrote:
>
>Listers,
>
>Regarding my oil leak last Saturday:
>
>I took my spinner, prop, and flywheel off last night. The
>"crankcase oil seal" (official Lycoming name) was pushed out
>of the crankcase and riding on the crankshaft. The seal itself
>looks fine. I checked my breather tube and it was free and
>clear as well. I have an oil-air separator with a collection
>tank. I've drained it periodically and gotten very little
>fluid (mostly water) out of it. I highly doubt that it froze
>over in flight on Saturday.
>
>The question now is what do I do to prevent the seal from
>coming back out of the engine. While I really like Wheeler's
>idea of drilling and tapping holes in the bosses provided
>and then using plates to hold the seal in place, that means
>tearing the whole engine apart to get access to drill and
>tap behind the crankshaft flange! I really don't want to
>do that! Lycoming has a Service Instruction SI-1324A
>that talks about the seal. Unfortunately, it isn't one of
>the SIs on line on the Lycoming website. If anyone has it,
>I'd appreciate finding out what it says.
>
>Barring any other ideas, I'm probably going to use the contact
>cement used by one of the repair places at Arlington and glue
>it back in. I sure can't see how just pushing it back in will
>work better than the original installation.
>
>Any ideas out there?
>
>Doug Medema
>RV-6A N276DM in the (airplane) hospital
>
Clean the area where the seal goes very, very good. You can use carb
cleaner and q-tips to clean the groove, and alcohol as a final cleaning
step. Let dry thoroughly and do the contact cement thing. Be liberal
with the contact cement without being sloppy and insert the seal wet.
Use a small piece of wood (thickness of seal) and a screwdriver to make
sure the seal is seated all the way in. Use the wood against the seal
and use the flange as a fulcrum point for the screwdriver, working
around the seal evenly.
Linn ..... Not an airplane MD, nor do I play one on TV!!!
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Ed Anderson" <eanderson(at)carolina.rr.com> |
Great news, too bad the insurance companies will ignore it.
Ed
Ed Anderson
RV-6A N494BW Rotary Powered
Matthews, NC
----- Original Message -----
From: "Wheeler North" <wnorth(at)sdccd.cc.ca.us>
Subject: RV-List: news flash
>
> Paul Harvey included on his national morning radio report that last year
saw
> a 25% reduction in experiemntal accidents, with a 30% reduction in
> fatalities, mostly due to safety efforts by such organizations as the EAA.
>
> Thank you Paul
>
> http://www.paulharvey.com/email_form.shtml
>
> if you would like to thank him yourself
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Doug Rozendaal" <dougr(at)petroblend.com> |
I wonder if the huge number of RVs tilt the odds. If you took the RVs out
of the mix, I wonder if the industry would have shown similar
improvement??????
These are great airplanes. Not all homebuilts are.....
Tailwinds,
Doug Rozendaal
>
> Paul Harvey included on his national morning radio report that last year
saw
> a 25% reduction in experiemntal accidents, with a 30% reduction in
> fatalities, mostly due to safety efforts by such organizations as the EAA.
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "John Helms" <jhelms(at)i1.net> |
I don't think, Ed, that you realize just how supportive some of these
insurance companies have been over the years.
The company that underwrites our VanGuard Program is just now getting below
100% on their loss ratio for the life of the program. That means that
without taking their expenses into account, they are just now after 4.5
years getting to the point where they've taken in as much money as they've
paid out in claims over that time period. It'll still be a long while with
a low level of claims before they'll make money.
The losses had been running at 130%. So, if they've been ignoring anything,
it's been the fact that they've been losing money on homebuilts. I think
they deserve to be applauded for not pulling out of the homebuilt market
after performance like that. They easily could have.
In any event, if the risk pool (experimentals in general, and RV's
specifically) has a good loss record for long enough, competition will drive
the rates down.
JT
----- Original Message -----
From: "Ed Anderson" <eanderson(at)carolina.rr.com>
Subject: Re: RV-List: news flash
Great news, too bad the insurance companies will ignore it.
Ed
Ed Anderson
RV-6A N494BW Rotary Powered
Matthews, NC
----- Original Message -----
From: "Wheeler North" <wnorth(at)sdccd.cc.ca.us>
Subject: RV-List: news flash
>
> Paul Harvey included on his national morning radio report that last year
saw
> a 25% reduction in experiemntal accidents, with a 30% reduction in
> fatalities, mostly due to safety efforts by such organizations as the EAA.
>
> Thank you Paul
>
> http://www.paulharvey.com/email_form.shtml
>
> if you would like to thank him yourself
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Will & Lynda Allen" <linenwool(at)comcast.net> |
| Subject: | Sort of RV related |
I'm working on an RV project web site and am wondering if anyone out there
is using Infinology.com as their web hosting site? They have good prices
and space but I want to make sure they are a reliable or "real" company
before paying them.
Thanks,
-Will Allen
North Bend, Wa
RV8 wings
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jim and Bev Cone" <jimnbev(at)olypen.com> |
I think that the Michelin tires are the best.
I jack my plane up by using a pipe plug with a bolt glued into the cup screwed
into the tie down point. I use a long ram jack, but you could use a small bottle
jack on a stable base.
Jim Cone
3-peat Offender
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Cy Galley" <cgalley(at)QCBC.ORG> |
Great As RVs are, they are still airplanes with which PILOTS make mistakes. If
you check the January 2004 Experimenter I talked about these statistics a couple
of months ago.
Amateur Flying Safety Improves
While personal flying and instruction accidents went down 2.9% and 7.4%, the number
of amateur accidents decreased by a whopping 24.8%. Note that the number
of fatalities in the amateur ranks decreased which was opposite the trend in personal
flying and flight instruction.
Here is a comparison of the numbers from FY '02 to FY '03 for each category:
Personal Flight 2001 2002 Percent Change
Total Accidents 1089 1057 2.9% Decrease
Fatal Accidents 20 28 40% Increase
Fatalities 40 50 25% Increase
Instructional Flight
Total Accidents 241 223 7.4% Decrease
Fatal Accidents 20 28 40% Increase
Fatalities 40 50 25% Increase
Amateur Built
Total Accidents 218 164 24.8% Decrease
Fatal Accidents 66 42 36.4% Decrease
Fatalities 81 57 29.6% Decrease
I would like to think that the improvement is due to more builders taking advantage
of our three great programs. The Technical Counselor program making sure
our amateur built planes are as good or better structurally than certified. The
Flight Advisor program that gets the new pilot builder off to a safe start.
The EAA Transition Training waiver that makes it possible for the new builder-pilot
to experience flying a plane very similar to the one he built and is going
to test fly. We have made great strides in reducing accidents in the first
few test hours.
Before we get too smug and complacent, we still need to look at the numbers another
way. More of our amateur builders died than in either personal flight or
during instruction. Yes, we have made a good reduction but our ratio of 1 fatality
in 3 accidents is still way too high and needs further improvement.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Doug Rozendaal" <dougr(at)petroblend.com>
Subject: Re: RV-List: news flash
>
> I wonder if the huge number of RVs tilt the odds. If you took the RVs out
> of the mix, I wonder if the industry would have shown similar
> improvement??????
>
> These are great airplanes. Not all homebuilts are.....
>
> Tailwinds,
> Doug Rozendaal
>
>
> >
> > Paul Harvey included on his national morning radio report that last year
> saw
> > a 25% reduction in experiemntal accidents, with a 30% reduction in
> > fatalities, mostly due to safety efforts by such organizations as the EAA.
> >
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Cy Galley" <cgalley(at)QCBC.ORG> |
Part II form the second page..
Let's not rest until this ratio is as low as personal flight which is only 1 fatality
in 21 accidents.
Much work needs to be done by our designers to improve the crash-worthiness of
both certified and non-certified aircraft. It is not enough to design a plane
that flies well, it needs to protect the occupants at the time of an accident.
But even that isn't enough as many accidents are pilot error. You and I as Technical
Counselors and Flight Advisors need to continue our task of pilot education,
of accident prevention.
Cy Galley
Editor, EAA Safety Programs
cgalley(at)qcbc.org or sportpilot(at)eaa.org
----- Original Message -----
From: "Doug Rozendaal" <dougr(at)petroblend.com>
Subject: Re: RV-List: news flash
>
> I wonder if the huge number of RVs tilt the odds. If you took the RVs out
> of the mix, I wonder if the industry would have shown similar
> improvement??????
>
> These are great airplanes. Not all homebuilts are.....
>
> Tailwinds,
> Doug Rozendaal
>
>
> >
> > Paul Harvey included on his national morning radio report that last year
> saw
> > a 25% reduction in experiemntal accidents, with a 30% reduction in
> > fatalities, mostly due to safety efforts by such organizations as the EAA.
> >
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Kevin Horton <khorton01(at)rogers.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Rotaries Again |
>
>I read somewhere that the new Renesis rotary
>has 247 HP but only 164 LB/FT of torque. What does this mean for
>us? Would this cause the engine to be sluggish? May not be good in
>a go around situation? Anybody have any
>thoughts? Never looked to see what kind of torque a Lycoming
>has. Anyone know?
>
You can turn 247 hp into as much torque as you want, depending on
what reduction ratio you use in the Prop Speed Reduction Unit.
See: http://www.revsearch.com/dynamometer/torque_vs_horsepower.html
hp = torque * RPM / 5252 (with torque measured in ft-lb)
or, torque = hp *5252/RPM
So, if we design the PSRU to spin the prop at 2500 rpm when the
engine is at its peak power, we'll have a torque of 247 * 5252/2500
= 519 ft-lb at the prop (ignoring the losses in the PSRU).
It would be interesting to see the graph of power vs rpm (which is
mathematically equivalent to the curve of torque vs rpm). If you use
a fixed pitch prop, you would like the torque to be as high as
possible over the rpm range of interest. If you use a constant speed
prop this is less important, as the engine should come up to full rpm
very quickly when you advance the power.
Whether or not the engine is "good" in a go-around will depend on
what prop you use (i.e. how efficient is the prop, is it fixed pitch
or constant speed), how well the fuel control responds to quick
throttle movements, etc.
--
Kevin Horton RV-8 (finishing kit)
Ottawa, Canada
http://go.phpwebhosting.com/~khorton/rv8/
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Bob U." <rv3(at)comcast.net> |
Cy Galley wrote:
>
>Great As RVs are, they are still airplanes with which PILOTS make mistakes. If
you check the January 2004 Experimenter I talked about these statistics a couple
of months ago.
>Amateur Flying Safety Improves
>
>While personal flying and instruction accidents went down 2.9% and 7.4%, the number
of amateur accidents decreased by a whopping 24.8%. Note that the number
of fatalities in the amateur ranks decreased which was opposite the trend in
personal flying and flight instruction.
>
>
>Here is a comparison of the numbers from FY '02 to FY '03 for each category:
>
>
>Personal Flight 2001 2002 Percent Change
>
>Total Accidents 1089 1057 2.9% Decrease
>
>Fatal Accidents 20 28 40% Increase
>
>Fatalities 40 50 25% Increase
>
>Instructional Flight
>
>Total Accidents 241 223 7.4% Decrease
>
>Fatal Accidents 20 28 40% Increase
>
>Fatalities 40 50 25% Increase
>
>Amateur Built
>
>Total Accidents 218 164 24.8% Decrease
>
>Fatal Accidents 66 42 36.4% Decrease
>
>Fatalities 81 57 29.6% Decrease
>
>I would like to think that the improvement is due to more builders taking advantage
of our three great programs. The Technical Counselor program making sure
our amateur built planes are as good or better structurally than certified. The
Flight Advisor program that gets the new pilot builder off to a safe start.
The EAA Transition Training waiver that makes it possible for the new builder-pilot
to experience flying a plane very similar to the one he built and is going
to test fly. We have made great strides in reducing accidents in the first
few test hours.
>
>Before we get too smug and complacent, we still need to look at the numbers another
way. More of our amateur builders died than in either personal flight or
during instruction. Yes, we have made a good reduction but our ratio of 1 fatality
in 3 accidents is still way too high and needs further improvement.
>
======================================
I suspect the fleet is GROWING each year.
Without knowing more details and size of the fleet each year....
the picture is hardly a complete one and impossible to tell where
we need to improve.
Bob
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Tracy Crook" <lors01(at)msn.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Rotaries Again |
>
>I read somewhere that the new Renesis rotary
>has 247 HP but only 164 LB/FT of torque. What does this mean for
>us? Would this cause the engine to be sluggish? May not be good in
>a go around situation? Anybody have any
>thoughts? Never looked to see what kind of torque a Lycoming
>has. Anyone know?
>
You can turn 247 hp into as much torque as you want, depending on
what reduction ratio you use in the Prop Speed Reduction Unit.
See: http://www.revsearch.com/dynamometer/torque_vs_horsepower.html
hp torque * RPM / 5252 (with torque measured in ft-lb)
or, torque hp *5252/RPM
So, if we design the PSRU to spin the prop at 2500 rpm when the
engine is at its peak power, we'll have a torque of 247 * 5252/2500
519 ft-lb at the prop (ignoring the losses in the PSRU).
It would be interesting to see the graph of power vs rpm (which is
mathematically equivalent to the curve of torque vs rpm). If you use
a fixed pitch prop, you would like the torque to be as high as
possible over the rpm range of interest. If you use a constant speed
prop this is less important, as the engine should come up to full rpm
very quickly when you advance the power.
Whether or not the engine is "good" in a go-around will depend on
what prop you use (i.e. how efficient is the prop, is it fixed pitch
or constant speed), how well the fuel control responds to quick
throttle movements, etc.
--
Kevin Horton RV-8 (finishing kit)
Ottawa, Canada
http://go.phpwebhosting.com/~khorton/rv8/
All Good points except that If a prop does not respond in this situation it means
it was not even close to being properly matched to the engine at full throttle.
Power required to turn a fixed pitch prop varies as the CUBE of RPM. I know of
no engine which has a power curve this steep. If an engine bogs or does not
respond at low rpm, look for the problem elsewhere.
Tracy Crook
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | AndrewTR30(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: RV10 websites |
Doug Peterson is really charging ahead. I haven't had time to go see his
project yet.
http://members.cox.net/jgalban/index.html
Andrew
Phoenix
Rudder
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Blanton Fortson <blanton(at)alaska.net> |
| Subject: | Re: New StabCam! |
Looks like fun. I've got a 500 line "broadcast quality" Elmo "lipstick
cam" for which I wired the tip of the vertical stab as well as the L
wingtip of my 206. Sold the 206 but kept the cam for the next plane!
B.
http://homepage.mac.com/blanton
On Feb 17, 2004, at 7:15 AM, Bill VonDane wrote:
>
> I've been working on installing a bullet cam in my vertical
> stabilizer....
>
> http://www.vondane.com/rv8a/stabcam/index.htm
>
>
> -Bill VonDane
> EAA Tech Counselor
> RV-8A ~ N8WV ~ Colorado Springs
> www.vondane.com
> www.creativair.com
> www.epanelbuilder.com
>
>
> _-
> =======================================================================
> _-
> =======================================================================
> _-
> =======================================================================
> _-
> =======================================================================
> >
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Blanton Fortson <blanton(at)alaska.net> |
| Subject: | Re: New StabCam! |
Elmo makes a wide angle lens for their lipstick cam.
B.
http://homepage.mac.com/blanton
On Feb 17, 2004, at 7:44 AM, lucky macy wrote:
>
> cool. I saw Larry's example too and am darn glad you pointed out the
> lense
> coverage 'cause I agree a wider field of view would be nice to have.
> If you
> can solve that one please update to the list.
>
> lucky
>
>
>> From: Bill VonDane <bill(at)vondane.com>
>> Reply-To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
>> To: rv-list(at)matronics.com, rv8list(at)yahoogroups.com, vansairforce
>>
>> Subject: RV-List: New StabCam!
>> Date: Tue, 17 Feb 2004 09:15:22 -0700
>>
>>
>> I've been working on installing a bullet cam in my vertical
>> stabilizer....
>>
>> http://www.vondane.com/rv8a/stabcam/index.htm
>>
>>
>> -Bill VonDane
>> EAA Tech Counselor
>> RV-8A ~ N8WV ~ Colorado Springs
>> www.vondane.com
>> www.creativair.com
>> www.epanelbuilder.com
>>
>>
>
>
> _-
> =======================================================================
> _-
> =======================================================================
> _-
> =======================================================================
> _-
> =======================================================================
> >
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Blanton Fortson <blanton(at)alaska.net> |
| Subject: | Re: New StabCam! |
Here are some Elmo links:
http://www.bhphotovideo.com/bnh/controller/home;jsessionid=A2z6WykNxM!
1845882163?
ci=1&sb=ps&pn=1&sq=desc&InitialSearch=yes&O=SearchBar&A=search&Q=*&shs=e
lmo+lipstick+cam&image.x=7&image.y=7
lenses: http://www.elmousa.com/cctv/
http://www.elmousa.com/cctv/
B.
http://homepage.mac.com/blanton
On Feb 17, 2004, at 8:58 AM, Larry Bowen wrote:
>
> The camera I'm using looks to have the same field of view as Bill's.
> I'm
> not too concerned about it yet though. It looks too tight in the
> hanger,
> but I'm hoping it will be just right in the air. I've seem wider FOV
> lenses, and they can have the illusion of wearing coke-bottle glasses
> inside a fishbowl - something I'd rather avoid.
>
> I used shielded 20 AWG from the bullet cam to the camcorder (nice and
> skinny), using Electric Bob's technique for putting the BNC end on. I
> have some interference while transmitting too, but it's very dependant
> upon where all the **test equipment and hook-ups** are laid out inside
> the
> **metal building**. Again, I'm optimistic this problem will go away
> once
> everything is hooked up "for real".
>
> -
> Larry Bowen, RV-8 FWF
> Larry(at)BowenAero.com
> http://BowenAero.com
>
> lucky macy said:
>>
>> cool. I saw Larry's example too and am darn glad you pointed out the
>> lense
>> coverage 'cause I agree a wider field of view would be nice to have.
>> If
>> you
>> can solve that one please update to the list.
>>
>> lucky
>>
>>
>>> From: Bill VonDane <bill(at)vondane.com>
>>> Reply-To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
>>> To: rv-list(at)matronics.com, rv8list(at)yahoogroups.com, vansairforce
>>>
>>> Subject: RV-List: New StabCam!
>>> Date: Tue, 17 Feb 2004 09:15:22 -0700
>>>
>>>
>>> I've been working on installing a bullet cam in my vertical
>>> stabilizer....
>>>
>>> http://www.vondane.com/rv8a/stabcam/index.htm
>>>
>>>
>>> -Bill VonDane
>
>
> _-
> =======================================================================
> _-
> =======================================================================
> _-
> =======================================================================
> _-
> =======================================================================
> >
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Ed Anderson" <eanderson(at)carolina.rr.com> |
From: "John Helms" <jhelms(at)i1.net>
Subject: Re: RV-List: news flash
>
> I don't think, Ed, that you realize just how supportive some of these
> insurance companies have been over the years.
>
> The company that underwrites our VanGuard Program is just now getting
below
> 100% on their loss ratio for the life of the program. That means that
> without taking their expenses into account, they are just now after 4.5
> years getting to the point where they've taken in as much money as they've
> paid out in claims over that time period. It'll still be a long while
with
> a low level of claims before they'll make money.
>
> The losses had been running at 130%. So, if they've been ignoring
anything,
> it's been the fact that they've been losing money on homebuilts. I think
> they deserve to be applauded for not pulling out of the homebuilt market
> after performance like that. They easily could have.
>
> In any event, if the risk pool (experimentals in general, and RV's
> specifically) has a good loss record for long enough, competition will
drive
> the rates down.
>
> JT
Ok, John, I stand corrected. Always good to have someone step in who
actually knows what's going on. I guess it always seems that insurance
companies appear to take any bad news (9/11 for example) as a reason to
raise rates across the board regardless of the actual experience in that
area. For instance, I have never seen a reductions in rates regardless of
how good the GA accident rates might have improve. But, then that is my
limited experience and I guess from what you relate, the way the insurance
companies see it - that is the time when they recovery losses and perhaps
make a profit. I too have read that the companies investment returns sort
of subsidized insurance companies loss areas in the past - something they
are apparently no longer willing to do. Can't really blame them for that.
Business is business and without a profit they do cease to exist.
Now, if I could just find that those companies that would ensure Rotary (or
other alternative) engine powered conversions, all would be well. I am
still insured, but am seriously considering dropping my hull insurance due
to the high cost of premiums. I know the general refusal for most companies
to provide hull insurance for self rolled auto conversions, but are any out
there providing Liability coverage?
My apologies to you and the other agents who do an excellent job of keeping
us guys insured - despite our grousing {:>)
Ed Anderson
RV-6A N494BW Rotary Powered
Matthews, NC
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | news flash (long) |
| From: | "Frank van der Hulst (Staff WG)" <F.vanderHulst(at)ucol.ac.nz> |
Whilst any reduction in accidents and fatalities is good news, I'm
wondering what the figures really mean.
* The 25% reduction... I assume because it was on a national report, it
applies to nationwide.
* How was the weather last year? Was it really *bad*, so that people
were flying less? Or was it really *good*, so that there were less
accidents? How about the year before?
* How about all the TFRs and other restrictions? How much did they
affect things?
* Did the price of avgas go up so that people fly less?
* Did the price of kits go down, so that many people were building
instead of flying?
* Did the accident stats include the V-22 Osprey and Challenger, for
example?
* Have people been shifting from the Experimental category to the
Microlight category?
My guess -- a real 25% reduction in accidents would require a radical
change in behaviour. Which implies a radical change in attitude of
pretty much all experimental category pilots. And no corresponding
change in pilots of factory-built aircraft. Maybe I'm a cynic, but this
sounded too fishy to be true.
So I spent a couple of hours Googling for homebuilt, experimental,
accident, statistics. Here's what I found.
1. At the EAA site, I found
http://www.eaa.org/communications/eaanews/pr/040216_homebuilt.html
which basically says the same as what was quoted, except
* it claims a 36% reduction in fatal accidents,
* it states that the stats are for the year ended 30 Sept 03,
* it says that the stats were based on figures released by the FAA
* it says the GA accident rate increased slightly during that year
* it uses the words homebuilt or amateurbuilt rather than experimental
There's no reference here to what the figures actually are, nor where at
the FAA they might be found.
This same press release was quoted here and there at other Web sites.
2. However, the NTSB stats don't seem to cover 2002/2003... eg
http://www.ntsb.gov/publictn/2003/ARG0302.pdf gives details for 1999.
Some quotes (taken somewhat out of context for brevity's sake) from this
document:
"Even with the additional operating limitations placed on amateurbuilt
aircraft, the percentage of fatal accidents for amateur-built
aircraft was almost twice as high as for similar manufactured
aircraft in 1999 (27.5% versus 15.1%, respectively). The
percentage of accidents in which the aircraft was destroyed is
also noticeably higher for amateur-built than for manufactured
aircraft (27.1% versus 17.4%, respectively)."
"A comparison of the accident rate per 100,000 hours flown
indicates that the rate is considerably higher for amateur-built
than for manufactured aircraft. The amateur-built accident rate
ranged from 41.2 to 25.1 accidents per 100,000 hours between
1995 and 1999, and was equal to 25.5 accidents per 100,000
hours in 1999. The accident rate for manufactured, single-engine
piston airplanes and rotorcraft remained between 12.3 and 9.9
per 100,000 hours during the same period. The fatal accident
rate for amateur-built aircraft decreased from a high of 11.6 fatal
accidents per 100,000 flight hours in 1995, to 6.8 fatal accidents
per 100,000 flight hours in 1999. The fatal accident rate for
similar manufactured aircraft was only one-fourth that of amateurbuilt
aircraft during the same period, ranging between 2.3
accidents per 100,000 hours in 1995 and 1.5 fatal accidents
per 100,000 hours in 1999."
"Of the 218 amateur-built and 869 manufactured aircraft accidents
during 1999 with findings available, ..."
So, (unless there were equally major reductions in the years 2000-2002),
reductions of 25% and 36% would mean that the amateur-built accident and
fatality rates are still significantly higher than for manufactured
aircraft.
I'm keeping an open mind, and happy to be persuaded otherwise, but my
opinion, based on the limited facts, is:
1. Mostl likely, this is a statistical blip -- notice that amateur-built
accident rates varied between 41.2 to 25.1 between 1995 and 1999.
2. Alternatively, EAA's stats are in error.
3. Least likely, there's been an actual, statistically significant,
change in accident rates for homebuilts.
Frank
> > Paul Harvey included on his national morning radio report that last
> > year saw
> > a 25% reduction in experiemntal accidents, with a 30% reduction in
> > fatalities, mostly due to safety efforts by such organizations as
> > the EAA.
Learn real skills for the real world - Apply online
at http://www.ucol.ac.nz or call 0800 GO UCOL
(0800 46 8265) or txt free 3388 for more information
and make a good move to UCOL Universal College of
Learning.
Enrol with a public institute and be certain of your
future
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Doug Weiler" <dougweil(at)pressenter.com> |
Fellow Listers:
Several people were interested in the RV jack I mentioned. I posted the
photos on the MN Wing website here:
http://www.pressenter.com/~dougweil/mnwing/id59.htm
Doug Weiler
RV-4
pres, MN Wing
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Bob n' Lu Olds" <oldsfolks(at)aol.com> |
| Subject: | Re: >Re:Oil on the Windscreen part 2 |
Your crankshaft flange has a hole in it,doesn't it ? You can work through the hole
to drill & tap a hole( #6) for screws to hold the seal retainer ring. DON'T
drill completely through the case !! It only takes screws about 5/16" long.
I used Loctite on the screws.
My opinion only.
Bob Olds RV-4 , Lyc. O-320 B3A
Charleston,Arkansas
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Tedd McHenry <tedd(at)vansairforce.org> |
| Subject: | news flash (long) |
In 1999 I did an informal survey of RV pilots in an attempt to quantify the
fleet hours for the year, so that I could calculate accident rates to compare
to the general aviation rates quoted by the NTSB. You can see the full results
at
http://www.vansairforce.org/articles/pilotage/pil_rv_safety.shtml
Briefly, the results indicated an accident rate of between 5.8 and 10.8 per
100,000 flying hours (depending on assumptions), as compared to the GA rate of
7.12 for the same period. The fatal accident rate for RVs was between 0.8 and
1.5 per 100,000 flying hours (again, depending on assumptions), as compared to
the GA rate of 1.35.
My results have to be viewed with some skepticism because the sampling method
wasn't very random. (I relied on voluntary replies to an RV List posting to
determine fleet flying hours.) However, I think they provide a reasonable
indication that RV accident rates are more-or-less in line with general
aviation.
Tedd McHenry
Surrey, BC
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | kempthornes <kempthornes(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Oil on the Windscreen - Part 2 |
At 09:10 AM 2/26/2004, you wrote:
How about using epoxy glue to hold the plates in place? Or, use 3M Ultra
tape - amazing stuff.
hal
>The question now is what do I do to prevent the seal from
>coming back out of the engine. While I really like Wheeler's
>idea of drilling and tapping holes in the bosses provided
>and then using plates to hold the seal in place, that means
>tearing the whole engine apart to get access to drill and
>tap behind the crankshaft flange!
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "lucky macy" <luckymacy(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | What are some engine |
I'm learning that the shops I know of don't inspect/repair the cases - they
send out. I figure why not just send a suspect cracked case to them instead
but I can't give them to give me the names of those overhaul shops with FAA
certified welders.
Anyone know? I heard someone say there may be one in TX and one in OK that
actually does their own welding to certified standards.
While I'm at it, if one was motivated to take apart ones own engine, is the
Lycoming overhaul manual good enough to follow or do you really need an A&P
or similar person holding your hand the whole way if you've never done it
before?
Thanks,
lucky
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Fabian Lefler" <fablef(at)bellsouth.net> |
,
| Subject: | Instruments For Sale |
I have a few items for sale. Here is a list:
ICOM A-200
GARMIN GTX327
AMERIKING AK-350
GPS 196
Altimeter
United VSI
MONROY ADT-200
DYNON
All items are brand new. See a detailed list here: http://www.affordablepanels.com/forsale2.htm
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Charlie Kuss <chaskuss(at)bellsouth.net> |
| Subject: | Re: What are some engine |
Lucky,
Send your cases to Divco in Tulsa. Great people, good prices and excellent workmanship.
http://www.divcoinc.com/
Charlie Kuss
PS I tried to send you photos of my ELT installation, but your Hotmail account
bounced them back to me. I think you need to check your mail more often. :-)
>
>I'm learning that the shops I know of don't inspect/repair the cases - they
>send out. I figure why not just send a suspect cracked case to them instead
>but I can't give them to give me the names of those overhaul shops with FAA
>certified welders.
>
>Anyone know? I heard someone say there may be one in TX and one in OK that
>actually does their own welding to certified standards.
>
>While I'm at it, if one was motivated to take apart ones own engine, is the
>Lycoming overhaul manual good enough to follow or do you really need an A&P
>or similar person holding your hand the whole way if you've never done it
>before?
>
>Thanks,
>lucky
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Randy Simpson <airtime(at)proaxis.com> |
| Subject: | re: a titanium Ti-down ring note |
Hi again Chuck,
There's been alot of people asking about those ti tie-down rings I plan to
make.
I have it figured out how to make them now, just have to get a thread
roller and the right dia. of ti material, and the time to do it.
My good friend Kelly Lunsford (owner of Lunsford Racing) will roll the
threads and turn down the dia of the rest of the ring to 5/16" for me on
one of his Tornos Swiss CNC machines before I bend the ring into the loop
on a special jig, while redhot.
I'll have to make some and test them before deciding if I'll need to weld
he loop closed. Welding titanium requires it be done in a weld tank,
backfilled with inert gas, for best results.
I'll definately let you and the RV-list know when I have them
available...I'm sure ALL my RV flying Ti-down customers will want a pair or
three of them.
Sincerely,
Randy Simpson
Airtime Mfg.
http://www.airtimemfg.com
---------
>
>Hi Randy,
>
>Glad to hear your still providing the best tie-downs.
>
>Any word on when you will be offering Ti tie down RINGS - Sure would like
>to ditch the heavy ones for (3) Ti rings.
>
>Best wishes,
>
>Chuck Rowbotham
>RV-8A
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | linn walters <lwalters2(at)cfl.rr.com> |
| Subject: | Re: What are some engine |
lucky macy wrote:
>
>I'm learning that the shops I know of don't inspect/repair the cases - they
>send out. I figure why not just send a suspect cracked case to them instead
>but I can't give them to give me the names of those overhaul shops with FAA
>certified welders.
>
Go to Divco for the case overhaul. http://www.divcoinc.com/
>Anyone know? I heard someone say there may be one in TX and one in OK that
>actually does their own welding to certified standards.
>
Divco is in TX.
>While I'm at it, if one was motivated to take apart ones own engine, is the
>Lycoming overhaul manual good enough to follow or do you really need an A&P
>or similar person holding your hand the whole way if you've never done it
>before?
>
Absolutely! Well, almost. Get the Lycoming overhaul and parts
manuals. The overhaul manual is pretty generic ...... but the parts
manual is engine model specific, and covers a range of models. In
otherwords, don't expect to find ALL the O-360s in one parts manual.
Well, I don't know what your abilities are, but if you can read and
follow directions well ..... and are handy with tools ..... you'll be
able to do it solo. If you have an A&P that'll coach you ..... pass him
some bucks .... that's the best way. These engines are rock-simple.
You will have to have a torque wrench ..... get a good quality clicker
..... a caliper .... feeler gauges .... a few sockets ...... and a
couple of combo wrenches. It doesn't get much simpler than that.
Linn
>
>Thanks,
>lucky
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jim Jewell" <jjewell(at)telus.net> |
| Subject: | Re: What are some engine |
Hi Lucky,
There was a time when I thought that anyone could tear down any engine. By
his actions a friend convinced me that it was not so. As far as putting
engines together un-assisted with a manual or not is concerned, all bets are
off as far as the non mechanical types are concerned.
If you have disassembled and assembled engines before but have not played
with Lycomings before, getting one safely apart following the Lycoming
overhaul manual should not be too difficult.
However, with the analytical capabilities of a very well experienced person
looking over your shoulder you will gain the ability of making better
judgments during the tear down as to the degree of repair and or of overhaul
that might be required. The reduced chances of unnecessarily damaging parts
in the process will be a bonus.
It can be done and has been done using only the manual for guidance. However
training, expertise and experience do reduce failure points and make for
better chances of reaching TBO with a clean record.
Happy building
Jim in kelowna
----- Original Message -----
From: "lucky macy" <luckymacy(at)hotmail.com>
Subject: RV-List: What are some engine
>
> I'm learning that the shops I know of don't inspect/repair the cases -
they
> send out. I figure why not just send a suspect cracked case to them
instead
> but I can't give them to give me the names of those overhaul shops with
FAA
> certified welders.
>
> Anyone know? I heard someone say there may be one in TX and one in OK
that
> actually does their own welding to certified standards.
>
> While I'm at it, if one was motivated to take apart ones own engine, is
the
> Lycoming overhaul manual good enough to follow or do you really need an
A&P
> or similar person holding your hand the whole way if you've never done it
> before?
>
> Thanks,
> lucky
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | linn walters <lwalters2(at)cfl.rr.com> |
| Subject: | Re: What are some engine |
linn walters wrote:
>
>lucky macy wrote:
>
>
>
>>
>>I'm learning that the shops I know of don't inspect/repair the cases - they
>>send out. I figure why not just send a suspect cracked case to them instead
>>but I can't give them to give me the names of those overhaul shops with FAA
>>certified welders.
>>
>>
>>
>Go to Divco for the case overhaul. http://www.divcoinc.com/
>
>
>
>>Anyone know? I heard someone say there may be one in TX and one in OK that
>>actually does their own welding to certified standards.
>>
>>
>>
>Divco is in TX.
>
Sorry guys and gals! Divco is in Tulsa OK!!!! Maybe I should proofread
my emails!!!
Linn
>>While I'm at it, if one was motivated to take apart ones own engine, is the
>>Lycoming overhaul manual good enough to follow or do you really need an A&P
>>or similar person holding your hand the whole way if you've never done it
>>before?
>>
>>
>>
>Absolutely! Well, almost. Get the Lycoming overhaul and parts
>manuals. The overhaul manual is pretty generic ...... but the parts
>manual is engine model specific, and covers a range of models. In
>otherwords, don't expect to find ALL the O-360s in one parts manual.
>
>Well, I don't know what your abilities are, but if you can read and
>follow directions well ..... and are handy with tools ..... you'll be
>able to do it solo. If you have an A&P that'll coach you ..... pass him
>some bucks .... that's the best way. These engines are rock-simple.
>You will have to have a torque wrench ..... get a good quality clicker
>..... a caliper .... feeler gauges .... a few sockets ...... and a
>couple of combo wrenches. It doesn't get much simpler than that.
>Linn
>
>
>
>>Thanks,
>>lucky
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Mike Comeaux" <mcomeaux(at)bendnet.com> |
Sorry to bother you all with this again.
How do you determine where #13 & #14 go with respect to the lower floor & what
height do you actually set the lower floor? Any good pictures someone can post
to me?
Regards Mike Comeaux
mcomeaux(at)bendnet.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "JOHN STARN" <jhstarn(at)verizon.net> |
| Subject: | Re: What are some engine |
Me thinks he complains to loudly. 8*)
I'll second the Parts Manual and raise you a 21(or so) years of RVator. Two
GREAT sources of information during building, testing, repair, conditional
inspections, modifications, custom upgrades and reading material for future
projects while on the "throne". Without a doubt it's money well spent and
both are directly related to your airplane. KABONG (GBA)
----- Original Message -----
From: "Tom Gummo" <T.gummo(at)verizon.net>
Subject: Re: RV-List: What are some engine
>
> Don't forget the Parts Manual. The repair manual is generic but the parts
> (My only tool before starting the plane was a hammer.) :-) (Some say
it
> still is.) :-(
>
> Tom Gummo
> Apple Valley, CA
> Harmon Rocket-II
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Bruce Gray" <Bruce(at)glasair.org> |
| Subject: | Splatter paint for the interior |
Try http://www.zolatoneaim.com/, a clear coat is recommended.
Bruce
www.glasair.org
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Bill Dube
Subject: Re: RV-List: Splatter paint for the interior
>
>I am thinking of using splatter paint on my interior. I have seen a few
RV's
>this way and the owners seem to like the results. If anyone has an
>experiences with it or has a web page, photos etc. I would appreciate
the
>info. I looked in the archives, could not find anything.
I've used splatter paint on cars quite a bit.
You can buy it in spray cans as "trunk" paint. There are two
major
types. One has blobs of two or three different color (gray, white,
black)
paint. The other has chunks of different color (gray, white, black)
flock.
The blob style is better than the flock style.
I found that the surface was not at all durable. You MUST cover
the trunk paint with clearcoat if you plan to touch it at all. The bare
trunk paint is like primer. It rubs off pretty easily and gets dirty
very
easily. With a clearcoat, it is very durable and stays clean.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Richard Sipp" <rsipp(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | Re: broke a dimple die |
Cammie:
If you ever want to run away from home call me first. ;)
6-8 hours a day on an RV10.
do not archieve
Dick Sipp
rv4 250DS
rv10 110DV
----- Original Message -----
From: "Cammie Patch" <cammie(at)sunvalley.net>
Subject: RE: RV-List: Re: broke a dimple die
>
> I got married about a year ago, and my husband has really been getting
> excited about the RV. At first, I just had him scotchbrite-debur-move
> clecoes, but he is to the point now that I point him in the right
direction
> and he can make parts as well as anyone. We can really knock out a lot of
> work on a Sunday afternoon. It's much more enjoyable to work together, and
> there are times when four hands are quite useful. Now I have a hard time
> getting to the RVator before him.
> I taught him how to fly too. ;-)
>
> Cammie
> fuse
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Rob W M Shipley" <rob(at)robsglass.com> |
Has anyone checked out the Southco fasteners, (Aircraft Spruce, P 102), for securing
the cowl to the firewall? If satisfactory even using more of these these
would be substantially cheaper than the other brands.
Rob
Rob W M Shipley
N919RV (res) Fuselage .....still!
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Richard Sipp" <rsipp(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | Re: news flash (long) |
Tedd:
This is great stuff, let's do another survey. Maybe Van, EAA, and or J. T.
Helms would help with a mailing to all completed and flying airplanes.
The data might prove to be a benefit to all of us.
Dick Sipp
RV4
RV10
----- Original Message -----
From: "Tedd McHenry" <tedd(at)vansairforce.org>
Subject: RE: RV-List: news flash (long)
>
> In 1999 I did an informal survey of RV pilots in an attempt to quantify
the
> fleet hours for the year, so that I could calculate accident rates to
compare
> to the general aviation rates quoted by the NTSB. You can see the full
results
> at
>
> http://www.vansairforce.org/articles/pilotage/pil_rv_safety.shtml
>
> Briefly, the results indicated an accident rate of between 5.8 and 10.8
per
> 100,000 flying hours (depending on assumptions), as compared to the GA
rate of
> 7.12 for the same period. The fatal accident rate for RVs was between 0.8
and
> 1.5 per 100,000 flying hours (again, depending on assumptions), as
compared to
> the GA rate of 1.35.
>
> My results have to be viewed with some skepticism because the sampling
method
> wasn't very random. (I relied on voluntary replies to an RV List posting
to
> determine fleet flying hours.) However, I think they provide a reasonable
> indication that RV accident rates are more-or-less in line with general
> aviation.
>
> Tedd McHenry
> Surrey, BC
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Charlie Kuss <chaskuss(at)bellsouth.net> |
| Subject: | Re: What are some engine |
Linn's advice on using the parts book is good advice. However, Divco is in TULSA,
OK See
http://www.divcoinc.com/map.asp
>snipped
>>
>Go to Divco for the case overhaul. http://www.divcoinc.com/
>
>>Anyone know? I heard someone say there may be one in TX and one in OK that
>>actually does their own welding to certified standards.
>>
>Divco is in TX.
>
>>While I'm at it, if one was motivated to take apart ones own engine, is the
>>Lycoming overhaul manual good enough to follow or do you really need an A&P
>>or similar person holding your hand the whole way if you've never done it
>>before?
>>
>Absolutely! Well, almost. Get the Lycoming overhaul and parts
>manuals. The overhaul manual is pretty generic ...... but the parts
>manual is engine model specific, and covers a range of models. In
>otherwords, don't expect to find ALL the O-360s in one parts manual.
>
>Well, I don't know what your abilities are, but if you can read and
>follow directions well ..... and are handy with tools ..... you'll be
>able to do it solo. If you have an A&P that'll coach you ..... pass him
>some bucks .... that's the best way. These engines are rock-simple.
>You will have to have a torque wrench ..... get a good quality clicker
>..... a caliper .... feeler gauges .... a few sockets ...... and a
>couple of combo wrenches. It doesn't get much simpler than that.
>Linn
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Mickey Coggins <mick-matronics(at)rv8.ch> |
| Subject: | Re: news flash (long) |
Today, with widely available internet access, it would
be pretty easy to collect this data. I have a feeling,
perhaps wrong, that the "alphabets" don't want to,
since they fear the feds will then mandate it.
I agree with you that it would be good information, and
would help validate the EAA's laudable efforts to help
us become a safer group.
Seems like entering a tail number and a number of hours
flown at each annual would not be too onerous, but it's the
side effects that you have to watch out for.
Mickey
>This is great stuff, let's do another survey. Maybe Van, EAA, and or J. T.
>Helms would help with a mailing to all completed and flying airplanes.
>
>The data might prove to be a benefit to all of us.
>
>Dick Sipp
>RV4
>RV10
--
Mickey Coggins
http://www.rv8.ch/
#82007 QB Wings/Fuselage
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Bob U." <rv3(at)comcast.net> |
| Subject: | Re: news flash (long) |
Mickey Coggins wrote:
>
>Today, with widely available internet access, it would
>be pretty easy to collect this data. I have a feeling,
>perhaps wrong, that the "alphabets" don't want to,
>since they fear the feds will then mandate it.
>
>I agree with you that it would be good information, and
>would help validate the EAA's laudable efforts to help
>us become a safer group.
>
>Seems like entering a tail number and a number of hours
>flown at each annual would not be too onerous, but it's the
>side effects that you have to watch out for.
>
>Mickey
>
=================================================
Every year this stat AND MORE is collected by my insurance company. It
does NOT operate in the dark.
Bob
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Pat Hatch" <pat_hatch(at)msn.com> |
Mike,
The lower cowl should be fitted and in place when you set this floor angle.
The floor should just rest below the cowl lip (see page 4 - part 2, Van's
baffle instructions). This is so that when you later rivet the airseal
fabric to the front lip of the cowl, it can be supported by the baffle
floor, part #2. I'll post some pictures on my web site and let you know
when they are up. Also, be aware that part 13 is drawn incorrectly, the
bolt hole should be oriented forward, not to the rear as shown.
Pat Hatch
RV-4
RV-6
RV-7 QB (Building)
Vero Beach, FL
----- Original Message -----
From: "Mike Comeaux" <mcomeaux(at)bendnet.com>
Subject: RV-List: Baffles
>
> Sorry to bother you all with this again.
> How do you determine where #13 & #14 go with respect to the lower floor &
what height do you actually set the lower floor? Any good pictures someone
can post to me?
>
> Regards Mike Comeaux
> mcomeaux(at)bendnet.com
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Tailgummer(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: RV-8 Canopy Latches |
William, thanks for the response. I'll send my check to you today ($27).
Looks like you developed a nice addition to my 8. Thanks!! John D'Onofrio
(Tailgummer(at)aol.com)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | BrooksRV6(at)webtv.net (Chris Brooks) |
| Subject: | Re: >Re:Oil on the Windscreen part 2 |
My crankshaft flange did not have holes in it. I pressed out one of the
prop bushings to drill the holes in the crankcase bosses. This was done
to install a Lightspeed electronic ignition. The Lightspeed instructions
said if the engine had a seal retainer plate to just replace it with the
Lightspeed pick-up mounting plate (mine did not). By installing the
Lightspeed I got a seal retainer as a bonus. If you just wanted to
install a seal retainer, you could use the Lightspeed instructions, and
I think they're available on their website.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Oldsfolks(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: > Re: Cowl Fasteners |
Nope,haven't tried any other fasteners - I like the piano hinge fasteners
Van's shows in the plans.
Bob Olds RV-4 , N1191X
A&P , EAA Tech. Counselor
Charleston,Arkansas
Real Aviators Fly Taildraggers
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Stucklen, Frederic IFC" <Fred.Stucklen(at)UTCFuelCells.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Stainless Wheel Pants Brackets |
Listers,
I just got off the phone with Robbie concerning his Stainless
Wheel Pant Brackets. His original manufacturer has gone out of
business, and he is actively looking for another vendor. He
does expect the price to go up with the new vendor (probably
in the $90.00 range). He does expect to have inventory in a
couple of weeks......
You can get in touch with him at email robbie(at)attawayair.com.
His web site is http://www.attawayair.com/rv6_products.htm .
Fred Stucklen
RV-6A N926RV 150 Hrs
Hi Tom,
Try contacting Avery tools or email robbie(at)attawayair.com
His web site is http://www.attawayair.com/rv6_products.htm
Jim in Kelowna
----- Original Message -----
From: "Tom & Cathy Ervin" <tcervin(at)valkyrie.net>
Subject: RV-List: Stainless Wheel Pants Brackets
>
> List, Seems like someone was selling Stainless Wheel Pants
Brackets
but I can't locate the Website? Has anyone used these and/or point me
in
the right direction? RV6-A getting closer!
>
Tom in Ohio
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "John" <n1cxo320(at)salidaco.com> |
| Subject: | Engine Tear-Down/Reassembly |
IF I were going to tear down my Lycoming, I would seriously consider taking
that 5-day engine course that Lycoming offers...it costs a few hundred
dollars but might be a good investment.
John
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jim Donaghue" <jimdonaghue(at)mindspring.com> |
| Subject: | Re: engines, engines, engines - wonderful to have choicesfor |
once?
----- Original Message -----
From: "Dana Overall" <bo124rs(at)hotmail.com>
Subject: Re: RV-List: engines, engines, engines - wonderful to have
choicesfor once?
. The following company makes
> the engine mounts to fit the Van's cowl.
> http://www.conversionconcepts.com/rv-6-7.htm . I'll be buying the mount
and
> intake system and "spark" system. What else concerns you?
I have been following the rotary engine discussion with interest. The only
issue I have found with the conversion is the requirement for a new intake
system... I'm probably looking in the wrong place, but I can't find the
intake system you reference on the above web site. (or another that doesn't
require a great deal of hand finishing.)
Thanks for the info in advance.
Jim
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Stainless Wheel Pants Brackets |
Just curious, why would anyone want to use stainless steel as a wheelpant
mount.
In a message dated 2/27/2004 8:20:32 AM Pacific Standard Time,
Fred.Stucklen(at)UTCFuelCells.com writes:
Listers,
I just got off the phone with Robbie concerning his Stainless
Wheel Pant Brackets. His original manufacturer has gone out of
business, and he is actively looking for another vendor. He
does expect the price to go up with the new vendor (probably
in the $90.00 range). He does expect to have inventory in a
couple of weeks......
You can get in touch with him at email robbie(at)attawayair.com.
His web site is http://www.attawayair.com/rv6_products.htm .
Fred Stucklen
RV-6A N926RV 150 Hrs
Hi Tom,
Try contacting Avery tools or email robbie(at)attawayair.com
His web site is http://www.attawayair.com/rv6_products.htm
Jim in Kelowna
----- Original Message -----
From: "Tom & Cathy Ervin" <tcervin(at)valkyrie.net>
Subject: RV-List: Stainless Wheel Pants Brackets
>
> List, Seems like someone was selling Stainless Wheel Pants
Brackets
but I can't locate the Website? Has anyone used these and/or point me
in
the right direction? RV6-A getting closer!
>
Tom in Ohio
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "John" <n1cxo320(at)salidaco.com> |
| Subject: | Recommended Welder |
Now and then listers mention a particularly good service/product they
experienced in building/using their RV, so I wanted to mention an excellent
aluminum welder...low price, excellent workmanship, fussy about details, and
likes aircraft work.
His name is Dean Huss, phone (719) 942-4774. ...he lives in a small town
named Howard, Colorado, 81233.
Local builders (RV's, Peitenpols, Pulsars, etc) have used him and all seem
very pleased.
John at Salida, CO
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Ken Simmons" <ken(at)truckstop.com> |
| Subject: | Magnetic compass |
Sorry for what may be a stupid question, but I figured I would go
ahead and get it out of the way.
I know FAR 91.205 requires a magnetic compass, but how is this
usually interpreted? Does this mean it has to be a mechanical
vertical card compass or a whiskey compass?
The reason I'm asking is I plan on using a microEncoder with an
external compass sensor. I'm also considering the Dynon, which also
has a heading indicator. It's my understanding that both of these
give a magnetic heading. They are just electronic sensors and
therefore require power to function.
My panel is strictly VFR so no DG is required. The microEncoder would
be a backup to the Dynon and would also provide alerts that the Dynon
doesn't have (yet).
With a properly designed electrical system I don't see any reason to
have any mechanical backups (i.e. compass,airspeed,altimeter).
Thanks in advance for any feedback.
Ken.
RV8
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bill Dube <bdube(at)al.noaa.gov> |
| Subject: | Electric horizons) |
I have designed an inexpensive, lightweight, 400 Hz, 208/120 volt
inverter just so I could use these instruments. I think I can put together
a kit for something like $120 each. If anyone is interested, please let me
know and perhaps I will offer a kit. If there is enough interest, perhaps I
could make assembled units.
Read on below....
>Any RV builder considering the all electric option will need an economical
>electric horizon and other goodies. I have just bought a very fine system
>consisting of a Ferranti Mk 14 horizon which has push-button fast erection
>and crucially an 8 degree panel tilt setting, plus an inverter to provide
>the 400Hz/115V electron fodder for the horizon with high quality harness
>also included.
> The inverter is extremely high quality, designed and built by the
> supplier Chris Quayle in Oxford, U.K. It is light wth fan cooling and has
> auxilliary 24V dc output that will drive an electric turn & slip which is
> also available. The horizon orginally cost the M.O.D. about $20K and is
> in very good condition, 8 degrees tilt as released by M.O.D.,
> hermetically sealed, and bench tested for two days before delivery.
There are three similar set-ups like this on Ebay at the moment:
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=2989952953
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=246337448
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=2463374476
400 Hz instruments tend to go pretty cheap on Ebay. This is
especially true for 3 phase, 208/120 volt, 400 Hz instruments. For example,
I bought a J-8 artificial horizon for $9.99 plus $6 S&H. You can get 400 Hz
instruments very cheaply on Ebay:
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=2227603926
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=2463418261
I have seen ultra nice HSI's and artificial horizon's go for less
than $200 on Ebay. You have to be careful not to get vintage boat anchors,
of course. :
) Even so, you can buy 3 bargain instruments on Ebay and still
come out ahead if only one of them is a winner.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Ross Schlotthauer" <rv7maker(at)hotmail.com> |
Listers:
How do the vans fuel gages work. They have calibrated marks for 2.5
gallons, 5 gal., 10 gal, and 15 gal. It looks like if the need went clear
around and hit the post again it would be at 20 gallons. Is this really how
it works? Seems a little dangerous to have either full on no fuel in the
same location.
Thanks,
Ross
Ross Schlotthauer
www.experimentalair.com
RV-7 finishing
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Steve & Denise" <sjhdcl(at)kingston.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Vans Fuel gages |
No there is a stop. When full the needle sits 1/2" or so beyond the 15 Gal
mark.
They work great. The accuracy depends on how you have bent the float. It
easy to make sure its accurate. Just hook up the power to the sender and
fuel gauge and make sure it reads correctly. If not adjust the bend. The
suggested drawing that shows the bent float is a good start.
Steve Hurlbut
RV7A
42 hours
----- Original Message -----
From: "Ross Schlotthauer" <rv7maker(at)hotmail.com>
Subject: RV-List: Vans Fuel gages
>
> Listers:
>
> How do the vans fuel gages work. They have calibrated marks for 2.5
> gallons, 5 gal., 10 gal, and 15 gal. It looks like if the need went clear
> around and hit the post again it would be at 20 gallons. Is this really
how
> it works? Seems a little dangerous to have either full on no fuel in the
> same location.
>
> Thanks,
>
> Ross
>
> Ross Schlotthauer
> www.experimentalair.com
> RV-7 finishing
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Richard Dudley <rhdudley(at)att.net> |
Listers,
I have several RV VHS videos that I no longer need and would like to
sell. They are:
- RV Fuselage, Parts 1, 2 and 3 by George and Becki Orndorf - $30
- RV Finishing Kit, Parts 1, 2, and 3 by George and Becki Orndorf - $30
- RV Aircraft Systems, Parts 1 and 2 by George and Becki Orndorf - $25
- Fiberglass 101 by Sam James - $15
You can have the lot for $90. I'll cover postage.
Please contact me off list at rhdudley(at)att.net
Richard Dudley
-6A final details & paint prep
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "GMC" <gmcnutt(at)uniserve.com> |
Vans fuel gauges work very well and are warranted by Vans for 5 years from
date of purchase, don't know of any other company that has that long a
warranty.
Anyway the gauge just goes to 15 when the tank is full. All Vans gauges work
the same, 8 o'clock to 4 o'clock for low to high readings.
Due to wing dihedral the gauges (on my 6A) reads full until there is almost
an hour burn out of the tank and tank is down to about 12 gal. So at high
fuel levels the gauges are not accurate and must not to be used to establish
that tanks are full. At lower readings (7 gal. & below) my gauges are dead
on.
Gauges should be calibrated the first time tanks are filled by adding a bit
of fuel then stopping and making note of gauge readings.
George in Langley
-------------------------------
Listers:
How do the vans fuel gages work. They have calibrated marks for 2.5
gallons, 5 gal., 10 gal, and 15 gal. It looks like if the need went clear
around and hit the post again it would be at 20 gallons. Is this really how
it works? Seems a little dangerous to have either full on no fuel in the
same location.
Thanks,
Ross
Ross Schlotthauer
www.experimentalair.com
RV-7 finishing
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Oldsfolks(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: >Re:Van's Fuel Gauges |
I leveled my RV-4 and put in 5 gal. of fuel. I then marked the gauge rim
with a dot of paint. I then did the same with 10 and 15 gal. marks. That shows
me where my fuel supply is in level flight.
My opinion only.
Bob Olds RV-4 , N1191X
A&P , EAA Tech. Counselor
Charleston,Arkansas
Real Aviators Fly Taildraggers
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Oldsfolks(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: .Re:Engine Teardown/Reassembly |
You are right - it would be a good investment to take the Lycoming course.
There are special tools/fixtures you will have to have . I was able to build my
plate to press the case halves apart and back together but you HAVE to have
this fixture. I once saw an old A&P / IA ?? drive a chisle between the case
halves to seperate them. Sure ruined a n O-540 set of cases !!
Bob Olds RV-4 , N1191X
A&P , EAA Tech. Counselor
Charleston,Arkansas
Real Aviators Fly Taildraggers
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Jerry Springer <jsflyrv(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Stainless Wheel Pants Brackets |
My question is, what are the problems that people are having with the
stock brackets Van sells?
I have not had any problems with them nor have I heard of any problems
here locally.
Jerry
Stucklen, Frederic IFC wrote:
>
>Listers,
>
> I just got off the phone with Robbie concerning his Stainless
>Wheel Pant Brackets. His original manufacturer has gone out of
>business, and he is actively looking for another vendor. He
>does expect the price to go up with the new vendor (probably
>in the $90.00 range). He does expect to have inventory in a
>couple of weeks......
> You can get in touch with him at email robbie(at)attawayair.com.
>His web site is http://www.attawayair.com/rv6_products.htm .
>
>Fred Stucklen
>RV-6A N926RV 150 Hrs
>
>
>Hi Tom,
>
> Try contacting Avery tools or email robbie(at)attawayair.com
>
> His web site is http://www.attawayair.com/rv6_products.htm
>
> Jim in Kelowna
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Tom & Cathy Ervin" <tcervin(at)valkyrie.net>
> Subject: RV-List: Stainless Wheel Pants Brackets
>
>
>
> >
> > List, Seems like someone was selling Stainless Wheel Pants
>Brackets
> but I can't locate the Website? Has anyone used these and/or point me
>in
> the right direction? RV6-A getting closer!
> >
> Tom in Ohio
> >
> >
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Gordon and Marge" <gcomfo(at)tc3net.com> |
| Subject: | This Saturday's Flyin is ON. |
Subject: Re: RV-List: This Saturday's Flyin is ON.
Dana: If the good Lord's willing and the creek don't rise, N363GC will
be with you till mid afternoon. Will need fuel.
Gordon Comfort
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "RV6 Flyer" <rv6_flyer(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Stainless Wheel Pants Brackets |
Why would would you want to purchase Stainless Steel Wheel pant Brackets for
$90 when the Aluminum ones that Van's supplies with the Two Piece Wheel
pants do not have any problems? Do they weight less? They sure do not
need to be any stronger than the one's Van supplied me as mine have held up
very well.
Gary A. Sobek
"My Sanity" RV-6 N157GS O-320 Hartzell,
1,438 + Flying Hours So. CA, USA
http://SoCAL_WVAF.rvproject.com
----Original Message Follows----
From: "Stucklen, Frederic IFC" <Fred.Stucklen(at)UTCFuelCells.com>
Subject: RV-List: Re: Stainless Wheel Pants Brackets
Date: Fri, 27 Feb 2004 11:16:09 -0500
Listers,
I just got off the phone with Robbie concerning his Stainless
Wheel Pant Brackets. His original manufacturer has gone out of
business, and he is actively looking for another vendor. He
does expect the price to go up with the new vendor (probably
in the $90.00 range). He does expect to have inventory in a
couple of weeks......
You can get in touch with him at email robbie(at)attawayair.com.
His web site is http://www.attawayair.com/rv6_products.htm .
Fred Stucklen
RV-6A N926RV 150 Hrs
Hi Tom,
Try contacting Avery tools or email robbie(at)attawayair.com
His web site is http://www.attawayair.com/rv6_products.htm
Jim in Kelowna
----- Original Message -----
From: "Tom & Cathy Ervin" <tcervin(at)valkyrie.net>
Subject: RV-List: Stainless Wheel Pants Brackets
>
> List, Seems like someone was selling Stainless Wheel Pants
Brackets
but I can't locate the Website? Has anyone used these and/or point
me
in
the right direction? RV6-A getting closer!
>
Tom in Ohio
>
>
Get fast, reliable access with MSN 9 Dial-up. Click here for Special Offer!
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Charlie & Tupper England <cengland(at)netdoor.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Stainless Wheel Pants Brackets |
Jerry Springer wrote:
>
>My question is, what are the problems that people are having with the
>stock brackets Van sells?
>I have not had any problems with them nor have I heard of any problems
>here locally.
>
>Jerry
>
I can't speak about the newer kits, but I had to replace a broken
bracket on my ('92 completion date) -4 at around 400 hours.
Charlie
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Lengths of propellers |
| From: | "Dennis Parker" <dennis(at)k2workflow.com> |
Aside from the obvious issue of ground clearance - does anyone have any
comments on lengths of propellers? I am thinking of ordering the blended
airfoil Hartzell CS for my RV7. This can be ordered in a 72" or 74"
configuration? Are there performance benefits / penalties to take into
account around length?
Thanks
Dennis Parker
71041
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | jakent(at)unison.ie |
| Subject: | Electric Horizons (again) |
I started on the electric route by buying a Bendix J-8 on e-Bay - ran very well
- cleaned up nice. Bought one of Andy Wright's inverters to drive it. Result
- a good horizon system under $200= Also bought a second ($10=) J-8 for spares
- this WAS a boat anchor !!
For a RV ... DO NOT GO THIS ROUTE ... the J-8 cannot be adjusted for 8 degrees
tilt - my friends in a gyro shop have tried - it doesn't work!
The Ferranti I ended up with is a VERY different beast - is good quality and
looks it as well !
I did not want to go the PDA / loose objects in the cockpit route as I feel that
the occasional urge to look DOWN through the RV-4 canopy may be too tempting
!!
Bottom line - if anyone wants a horizon and inverter for something other than a
RV I will sell for about $200= or the inverter only for a bit less - it is light
and will drive any of the 3-phase 400/115 gyros.
John Kent RV-4 Ireland.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "George Murphy" <garthe1(at)atlantic.net> |
Am looking for RV6A fuselage, wing kit, and finishing in any stage of completion
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Lengths of propellers |
> Aside from the obvious issue of ground clearance - does anyone have any
> comments on lengths of propellers? I am thinking of ordering the blended
> airfoil Hartzell CS for my RV7. This can be ordered in a 72" or 74"
> configuration? Are there performance benefits / penalties to take into
> account around length?
> Dennis Parker
Dennis, you're delving into the black art of propeller aerodynamics fasten
your seatbelt. There are a few fundamentals to consider: a longer prop will
make slightly more noise and have slightly more drag since it has more area.
Balancing that is that it will product more thrust and that thrust will be
further away from the fuselage where it does more good. Having done some
prop testing I can tell you that whatever difference might manifest itself
between the same prop in the 72" and 74" lengths would be small. Even the
true experts would debate the question you're asking without a likely
concensus. Still, if I were buying a Hartzell, I'd go with the 74" if
performance were most important. If quiet were most important I'd go with
the 72".
Just curious though, have you looked at the Whirl Wind 200RV? I guess that's
hard to do since it isn't up on their web site yet, but as far as I'm
concerned it's the ultimate prop solution for an RV, albeit $2k more than
the Hartzell. My experience with it can be found at...
http://www.rv-8.com/Prop.htm
Randy Lervold
RV-8, 368 hrs
EAA Technical Counselor
www.rv-8.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Kevin Horton <khorton01(at)rogers.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Electric horizons) |
>
>
> I have designed an inexpensive, lightweight, 400 Hz, 208/120 volt
>inverter just so I could use these instruments. I think I can put together
>a kit for something like $120 each. If anyone is interested, please let me
>know and perhaps I will offer a kit. If there is enough interest, perhaps I
>could make assembled units.
I'm certainly interested in learning more. I worry about
electromagnetic interference though. Have you done any testing to
see if your inverter produces conducted or radiated noise?
I would love to have an HSI though, and new 14v ones are out of my
price range, so I am interested in other options.
--
Kevin Horton RV-8 (finishing kit)
Ottawa, Canada
http://go.phpwebhosting.com/~khorton/rv8/
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | kempthornes <kempthornes(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Electric Horizons (again) |
It may take a year or two but I'll bet that spinning gyro instruments will
come down in price like ADFs.
AHRS gyros (Dynon, Blue Mtn etc) are said to be ten times more reliable
than the old stuff. They will get much cheaper with time. There will be
big piles of spinning gyros available, mostly ready to be overhauled since
that is likely when the decision will be made to upgrade.
K. H. (Hal) Kempthorne
RV6-a N7HK - Three trips to OSH now.
PRB (El Paso de Robles, CA)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Jerry Springer <jsflyrv(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Stainless Wheel Pants Brackets |
Charlie & Tupper England wrote:
>
>Jerry Springer wrote:
>
>
>
>>
>>My question is, what are the problems that people are having with the
>>stock brackets Van sells?
>>I have not had any problems with them nor have I heard of any problems
>>here locally.
>>
>>Jerry
>>
>>
>>
>
>I can't speak about the newer kits, but I had to replace a broken
>bracket on my ('92 completion date) -4 at around 400 hours.
>
>Charlie
>
>
>
>
I had over 1000 hours on my old style ('89 completeion date) RV-6
brackets with no problems.
I don't have enough time on the new style yet to know if they well break
or not, time well tell.
Jerry
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Will & Lynda Allen" <linenwool(at)comcast.net> |
| Subject: | FW: Proposed FAA rule |
I'm just sending this out in case there is anyone who wants to have their
say on this before the FAA makes this change. I don't know if this would
effect the young eagles program but it will certainly put a stop to a lot of
good EAA programs for rides in antique aircraft and may even put an end to
the budgets that allow these aircraft to be restored.
-Will Allen
North Bend, Wa
RV8 wings
-----Original Message-----
From: Tony Caruso [mailto:t-caruso(at)msn.com]
Subject: Proposed FAA rule
FYI
From: Aviation Foundation of America, Courtesy of Fly-ins.com
A few weeks ago we sent you an e-mail about a proposed FAA rule. This new
rule will effectively eliminate the opportunity for Americans to purchase an
airplane ride like those offered during the National Air Tour. This proposed
rule is referred to as "NPRM-4521."
While many aviation organizations have requested open public meetings on
this subject, the FAA rejected this request, instead conducting an
experimental "On Line Public Meeting" over the Internet. This "meeting" is
going on now right now and will end Friday, March 5th. We are asking that
you participate in this meeting by going to the "public meeting" web site
(details below). This is a somewhat cumbersome process, but it is the only
way the FAA is allowing you to participate in this "public meeting."
The new proposed regulations will basically place operators offering
airplane rides in the same category as commercial air carriers (Part 135).
This is being done under the theory that people selling rides in
open-cockpit bi-planes or Ford Tri-motors are really an airline!
Preposterous as this sounds, this is exactly the FAA's position. As an
example what follows this is a direct quote from one FAA response in the
"FAA Response Section" on the "public meeting" web site:
This is a direct quote from the FAA:
FAA: "WHY DO WE WANT TO REGULATE YOU. Because you look like an airline. A
passenger decides to go on an airplane (why doesn't matter). The airplane
operator wants money (donations are money). The passenger is happy if
part/all of that money goes to a good cause but wants to go on an airplane
anyway. Airplane operator gives the passenger what the passenger paid for.
What's different about you?.."
Picture in your mind an open cockpit bi-plane giving a young child a ride.
This is what the FAA says looks like an airline!
Despite the fact that there are already regulations for Part 91 operators
including commercial pilot qualifications, frequent aircraft inspections,
pilot registration, etc., scenes like this could disappear from across
America in a few short months. The folks from Waldo Wright's Flying service,
who made so many people smile on the tour have written some of the
commentary found in this link about the FAA's Notice of Proposed Rule Making
found here: FAA
<http://dms.dot.gov/search/searchResultsSimple.cfm?numberValue4521&searchTy
pedocket> NPRM 4521 Comments.
Presently people offering rides (called Part 91 operators) are able to take
you for a ride, in their bi-plane or Ford tri-motor as an example, within 25
miles of your airport and bring you back. Do you think that is an airline?
Apparently the FAA does, and they want to treat those rides as commercial
air carriers.
The FAA says Part 91 operators will be safer if they are made to comply with
the onerous Part 135 Air Carrier regulations. This ignores the fact that
their own statistics demonstrate Part 91 operators are already significantly
SAFER than Part 135 operators. The problem is that the FAA refuses to
distinguish between local rides in fixed wing airplanes and more dangerous
operations such as helicopters flying over the ocean and mountains in
Hawaii.
There are two ways to post your thoughts and questions on this matter. If
you have not already done so, one way is to post a comment on the NRPM-4521
site by clicking here: FAA
<http://dms.dot.gov/search/searchResultsSimple.cfm?numberValue4521&searchTy
pedocket> NPRM 4521 Comments. There are more that 1,500 comments so far.
We also urge you to take part in the "On line Public Meeting" which is
taking place now. Please click here or go to this site address:
http://66.89.54.45/ , and click on "ENTER PUBLIC
MEETING" at the bottom after reading the instructions. You will be able to
post you thoughts, and more importantly, your questions about this proposed
rule.
We urge you to post comments and questions on the "Public Meeting" web site
as soon as possible. Again, by simply clicking here: http://66.89.54.45/
On both of the sites mentioned above you can read the positions taken by
thousands of citizens who are opposed to this proposed "one size fits all"
FAA regulation. Unfortunately, despite flawed statistics and questionable
logic, all the FAA has to do to make NPRM 4521 into law is to publish it in
the Federal Register. There are not votes in congress and no public
proceeding other than this "On Line Public Meeting."
We urge you to read the comments posted so far and to participate in this
"On Line Public Meeting," which, unfortunately is all the more democratic
this process is going to get.
Here at the Aviation Foundation of America, we have nothing at stake other
than to try to preserve an important grassroots aviation experience. People
offering airplane rides, whether in a Ford tri-motor, a bi-plane, or a
Cessna at your local airport have introduced millions of Americans to the
joys of flight. They deserve our help.
Please get on line, ask your questions and make your statements.
Thank you for your helping to save the airplane ride!
Greg Herrick, President
Aviation Foundation of America
PS: Please forward this message to any of your friends who could help by
sending a message to the FAA.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Chris W <1qazxsw23edcvfr45tgbnhy67ujm(at)cox.net> |
| Subject: | Re: a titanium Ti-down note |
HCRV6(at)aol.com wrote:
>
>In a message dated 2/25/04 4:52:06 AM Pacific Standard Time,
>crowbotham(at)hotmail.com writes:
>
><< Any word on when you will be offering Ti tie down RINGS - Sure would like
> to ditch the heavy ones for (3) Ti rings. >>
>
>I'll take two Ti tie down rings when you're ready to offer them Randy.
>
>
I'm sure randy will have a great deal on the Titanium Eye Bolts when he
makes them, but if you are in a hurry for some, mcmaster.com has them
for $30.22 each. Item number 3103T31
Chris Woodhouse
Oklahoma City, OK
"They that can give up essential liberty
to obtain a little temporary safety
deserve neither liberty nor safety."
-- Benjamin Franklin, 1759 Historical Review of Pennsylvania
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Mickey Coggins <mick-matronics(at)rv8.ch> |
| Subject: | Flop tubes in QB wings |
Does anyone see a way to get a flop tube to work
in a QB wing?
At first I just thought it was a quick retrofit, but
there seem to be some protective brackets needed inside
to keep the flop tubes from getting hung up in there.
Has anyone been able to make this work?
Thanks,
Mickey
--
Mickey Coggins
http://www.rv8.ch/
#82007 QB Wings/Fuselage
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Tommy Walker" <twsurveyor(at)msn.com> |
| Subject: | Cowl Inlet Ramps |
While installing the baffle seal on my 6A, I realized that the upper cowl inlet
ramps present somewhat of a problem!? I don't know if I need to trim the baffle
metal to match the ramp contour or the cowl contour.
If I trim metal to the ramp contour and let the rubber seal follow the ramp it
creates a huge air leak between the ramp and the cowl, which could be stopped
by fiber glassing the inboard ends of the ramp to the cowl. If I elect to trim
the metal to the cowl contour there will be a conflict between the rubber seal
and the edge of the ramp.
Those of you that have been down this road will know what I'm talking about. Question
is how did you solve this problem on your baffle?? Any suggestions welcome!
Tommy Walker
6A Ridgetop, TN
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Steve Struyk" <rv8striker(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Flop tubes in QB wings |
Mickey,
I put a flop tube in my left quick build tank. It's been awhile, but here's
what I remember doing.
You need to remove the tank from the wing, then move the fuel sender to the
aft wall of the tank into the second bay, one rib outboard from where it is
now. That involves cutting a new hole to mount it. Van's sells blank covers
and mounting rings. The old mounting plate, with the sender, can be cleaned
up (MEK works well) and put in the aft wall with a new mounting ring. (cut
the ring in one place to sort of "screw" it into the inside of the tank. The
new blank one will cover your access hole to the flop tube,"trap door", and
bracket to keep the tube from hanging up on anything inside the tank. Every
thing needs to be Pro-sealed when you close it up of course. A whole string
can be found in the archives about using the cork seal or not. I chose not
to and my tanks both tested good after the Pro-seal cured.
I only have one picture of my tank and it's looking in the access hole at
the trap door and bracket. I can E-mail it to you directly if that would be
of help.
Hope this helps.
Steve Struyk
RV-8, N842S (Res.)
Wiring and Panel
St. Charles, MO
rv8striker(at)hotmail.com
---- Original Message -----
From: "Mickey Coggins" <mick-matronics(at)rv8.ch>
Subject: RV-List: Flop tubes in QB wings
>
> Does anyone see a way to get a flop tube to work
> in a QB wing?
>
> At first I just thought it was a quick retrofit, but
> there seem to be some protective brackets needed inside
> to keep the flop tubes from getting hung up in there.
>
> Has anyone been able to make this work?
>
> Thanks,
> Mickey
>
> --
> Mickey Coggins
> http://www.rv8.ch/
> #82007 QB Wings/Fuselage
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Garrett, Randy L (C4S)" <Randy.L.Garrett(at)GDC4S.Com> |
| Subject: | New "No Fly Zones" and airport vulnerability assessments |
Just saw on the EAA's web site proposed additional restrictions on General
Aviation. You can easily email your Congressman by going to www.house.gov
The text of the proposed law is on www.eaa.org and no doubt other places.
Here are my comments. I'm the RV community has better and more eloquent
opinions. Just be sure to send them to your Congressman, don't just post
them here.
RV-6A
250 hours
===========================================================================
=====
This email is to express my interest in Rep. Markey's proposed amendment to
the Homeland Security Act of 2002 (HR 3798) titled "Secure Existing
Aviation Loopholes". Specifically, I am concerned about the imposition of
"No Fly Zones" and mandatory vulnerability assessments at General Aviation
airports.
On "No Fly Zones" ... First, there are already regulations about loitering
over areas, such as power plants, stadiums, etc. Second, how could these
be monitored and enforced. Radar coverage frequently does not extend that
low, and a number of additional government personnel would be required to
continually monitor the areas. Third, restricting the ability to fly
through some of these areas (as opposed to loitering), would create a
safety hazard to aviation, since this airspace may now be used for air
navigation or approaches to an airport.
Finally, my daughter pointed out that establishing "No Fly Zones" over
sensitive areas would really advertise their location to terrorists.
Obviously terrorists would not be concerned with violating a law or
regulation, but the identification of all the sensitive US facilities on
maps or other publications is an advertisement to those who wish to do us
harm.
On vulnerability assessments for small general aviation airport ... first,
the vast majority of these airports do not exist on a "shoe string" ...
they do not even have that much money. General aviation in this country
has been suffering through a tremendous depression for two decades. In
addition, practically all airports already have almost an onerous amount of
security already. So, we should consider the cost/benefit analysis. I
believe there are many other vulnerabilities in our country's security,
such as at shopping malls, trucking, and shipping containers, that should
be addressed before we expend additional funds on a comparatively much
lower risk threat.
Thank you for taking time to consider my opinion ...
Sincerely,
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Ed Anderson" <eanderson(at)carolina.rr.com> |
| Subject: | Re: New "No Fly Zones" and airport vulnerability assessments |
I've written my Representative about this bill. Interesting to note who the
sponsors of this bill are:
Co-sponsors of the bill include Rep. Ed Case, (D-HI); Rep. John Conyers,
Jr., (D-MI) Rep. Norman Dicks, D-WA; Rep. Carolyn McCarthy, D-NY; Rep.
Jerrold Nadler, D-NY; Rep. Major Owens, D-NY; and Rep. Louise McIntosh
Slaughter, D-NY.
note any common denominator among these congressional representatives?
Ed Anderson
RV-6A N494BW Rotary Powered
Matthews, NC
----- Original Message -----
From: "Garrett, Randy L (C4S)" <Randy.L.Garrett(at)GDC4S.Com>
Subject: RV-List: New "No Fly Zones" and airport vulnerability assessments
>
> Just saw on the EAA's web site proposed additional restrictions on General
> Aviation. You can easily email your Congressman by going to www.house.gov
> The text of the proposed law is on www.eaa.org and no doubt other places.
> Here are my comments. I'm the RV community has better and more eloquent
> opinions. Just be sure to send them to your Congressman, don't just post
> them here.
>
> RV-6A
> 250 hours
>
>
===========================================================================
> =====
> This email is to express my interest in Rep. Markey's proposed amendment
to
> the Homeland Security Act of 2002 (HR 3798) titled "Secure Existing
> Aviation Loopholes". Specifically, I am concerned about the imposition
of
> "No Fly Zones" and mandatory vulnerability assessments at General
Aviation
> airports.
>
> On "No Fly Zones" ... First, there are already regulations about
loitering
> over areas, such as power plants, stadiums, etc. Second, how could these
> be monitored and enforced. Radar coverage frequently does not extend
that
> low, and a number of additional government personnel would be required to
> continually monitor the areas. Third, restricting the ability to fly
> through some of these areas (as opposed to loitering), would create a
> safety hazard to aviation, since this airspace may now be used for air
> navigation or approaches to an airport.
>
> Finally, my daughter pointed out that establishing "No Fly Zones" over
> sensitive areas would really advertise their location to terrorists.
> Obviously terrorists would not be concerned with violating a law or
> regulation, but the identification of all the sensitive US facilities on
> maps or other publications is an advertisement to those who wish to do us
> harm.
>
> On vulnerability assessments for small general aviation airport ... first,
> the vast majority of these airports do not exist on a "shoe string" ...
> they do not even have that much money. General aviation in this country
> has been suffering through a tremendous depression for two decades. In
> addition, practically all airports already have almost an onerous amount
of
> security already. So, we should consider the cost/benefit analysis. I
> believe there are many other vulnerabilities in our country's security,
> such as at shopping malls, trucking, and shipping containers, that should
> be addressed before we expend additional funds on a comparatively much
> lower risk threat.
>
> Thank you for taking time to consider my opinion ...
>
> Sincerely,
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Richard Dudley <rhdudley(at)att.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Cowl Inlet Ramps |
Tommy,
I think you are referring to the fiberglas ramps ("elephant ears" )that
you "glue" to the top cowl. I found a gap between the rubber seal and
the ramps. I solved it by laying fiberglas between the ramps and the
inside of the top cowl.
If this is what you are referring to, I'll be glad to send you photos of
the ramps and top cowl.
Regards,
Richard Dudley
Tommy Walker wrote:
>
>
> While installing the baffle seal on my 6A, I realized that the upper cowl inlet
ramps present somewhat of a problem!? I don't know if I need to trim the baffle
metal to match the ramp contour or the cowl contour.
>
> If I trim metal to the ramp contour and let the rubber seal follow the ramp it
creates a huge air leak between the ramp and the cowl, which could be stopped
by fiber glassing the inboard ends of the ramp to the cowl. If I elect to trim
the metal to the cowl contour there will be a conflict between the rubber seal
and the edge of the ramp.
>
> Those of you that have been down this road will know what I'm talking about.
Question is how did you solve this problem on your baffle?? Any suggestions welcome!
>
> Tommy Walker
> 6A Ridgetop, TN
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Sam Buchanan <sbuc(at)hiwaay.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Dana Overall's - I39 Fly-in Pictures |
Dana Overall wrote:
>
> Just getting home from the airport. What a day, a big thanks to all those
> who attended. As of noon today we had 86 RVs at the airport and 107 total
> airplanes. I did not count after noon but there were not many more who came
> in after that time.
>
> Thanks again gang for the support!!
>
>
> Dana Overall
> Richmond, KY i39
> RV-7 slider, Imron black, "Black Magic"
> Finish kit
> 13B Rotary. Hangar flying my Dynon.
> http://rvflying.tripod.com/aero1.jpg
> http://rvflying.tripod.com/aero3.jpg
> http://rvflying.tripod.com/blackrudder.jpg
It was indeed a splendid event blessed by spectacular February weather!
Many thanks go to Dana for putting the fly-in together.
Of course, Dana, we expect even better weather next year; we would
*really* like to be able to wear tee shirts. :-)
The TVRVBG had twelve aircraft present and we all enjoyed the event
greatly. Put this one on your calendar for next year!
Sam Buchanan
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | DOUGPFLYRV(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Dana Overall's - I39 Fly-in Pictures |
Our thanks to u Dana for putting this event together. Greatly enjoyed it.
Look forward to next year.
Regards
Doug Preston
RV8 N127EK
BHM
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Dave Ford" <dford(at)michweb.net> |
| Subject: | wheel pant clearance |
Am fitting wheel pants and wondering what clearance is necessary all around the
lower tire? I'm wondering if 3/8 to 1/2 inch is enough all the way around?
Dave Ford
RV6
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Mike Mckenna" <mmckenna(at)bellsouth.net> |
| Subject: | Dana Overall's - I39 Fly-in Pictures |
Dana,
We all owe you the thanks for bringing us together.
Thanks,
Mike Mckenna
N61RM RV-6A
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of Dana Overall
Subject: RE: RV-List: Dana Overall's - I39 Fly-in Pictures
Just getting home from the airport. What a day, a big thanks to all those
who attended. As of noon today we had 86 RVs at the airport and 107 total
airplanes. I did not count after noon but there were not many more who came
in after that time.
Thanks again gang for the support!!
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Cy Galley" <cgalley(at)QCBC.ORG> |
| Subject: | Re: New "No Fly Zones" and airport vulnerability assessments |
When a party is out of power they introduce all sorts of feel good bills to
use in their campaign.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Ed Anderson" <eanderson(at)carolina.rr.com>
Subject: Re: RV-List: New "No Fly Zones" and airport vulnerability
assessments
>
> I've written my Representative about this bill. Interesting to note who
the
> sponsors of this bill are:
>
> Co-sponsors of the bill include Rep. Ed Case, (D-HI); Rep. John Conyers,
> Jr., (D-MI) Rep. Norman Dicks, D-WA; Rep. Carolyn McCarthy, D-NY; Rep.
> Jerrold Nadler, D-NY; Rep. Major Owens, D-NY; and Rep. Louise McIntosh
> Slaughter, D-NY.
>
> note any common denominator among these congressional representatives?
>
> Ed Anderson
> RV-6A N494BW Rotary Powered
> Matthews, NC
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Garrett, Randy L (C4S)" <Randy.L.Garrett(at)GDC4S.Com>
> To:
> Subject: RV-List: New "No Fly Zones" and airport vulnerability assessments
>
>
>
> >
> > Just saw on the EAA's web site proposed additional restrictions on
General
> > Aviation. You can easily email your Congressman by going to
www.house.gov
> > The text of the proposed law is on www.eaa.org and no doubt other
places.
> > Here are my comments. I'm the RV community has better and more eloquent
> > opinions. Just be sure to send them to your Congressman, don't just
post
> > them here.
> >
> > RV-6A
> > 250 hours
> >
> >
>
===========================================================================
> > =====
> > This email is to express my interest in Rep. Markey's proposed amendment
> to
> > the Homeland Security Act of 2002 (HR 3798) titled "Secure Existing
> > Aviation Loopholes". Specifically, I am concerned about the imposition
> of
> > "No Fly Zones" and mandatory vulnerability assessments at General
> Aviation
> > airports.
> >
> > On "No Fly Zones" ... First, there are already regulations about
> loitering
> > over areas, such as power plants, stadiums, etc. Second, how could
these
> > be monitored and enforced. Radar coverage frequently does not extend
> that
> > low, and a number of additional government personnel would be required
to
> > continually monitor the areas. Third, restricting the ability to fly
> > through some of these areas (as opposed to loitering), would create a
> > safety hazard to aviation, since this airspace may now be used for air
> > navigation or approaches to an airport.
> >
> > Finally, my daughter pointed out that establishing "No Fly Zones" over
> > sensitive areas would really advertise their location to terrorists.
> > Obviously terrorists would not be concerned with violating a law or
> > regulation, but the identification of all the sensitive US facilities
on
> > maps or other publications is an advertisement to those who wish to do
us
> > harm.
> >
> > On vulnerability assessments for small general aviation airport ...
first,
> > the vast majority of these airports do not exist on a "shoe string" ...
> > they do not even have that much money. General aviation in this
country
> > has been suffering through a tremendous depression for two decades. In
> > addition, practically all airports already have almost an onerous
amount
> of
> > security already. So, we should consider the cost/benefit analysis. I
> > believe there are many other vulnerabilities in our country's security,
> > such as at shopping malls, trucking, and shipping containers, that
should
> > be addressed before we expend additional funds on a comparatively much
> > lower risk threat.
> >
> > Thank you for taking time to consider my opinion ...
> >
> > Sincerely,
> >
> >
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "LarryRobertHelming" <lhelming(at)sigecom.net> |
| Subject: | Re: wheel pant clearance |
The answer I got from Van's was 1/2" all around.
Indiana Larry, RV7 Tip-up TMX-O-360 ACS2002 Dynon CNS430 Digitrak
Firewall Forward
----- Original Message -----
From: "Dave Ford" <dford(at)michweb.net>
Subject: RV-List: wheel pant clearance
>
> Am fitting wheel pants and wondering what clearance is necessary all
around the lower tire? I'm wondering if 3/8 to 1/2 inch is enough all the
way around?
>
> Dave Ford
> RV6
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Oldsfolks(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: > Re: New "No Fly Zones" and airport vulnerabil |
Quite a similarity - They're ALL Socialist Democrats !!
No VOTES from my family !!
Bob Olds RV-4 , N1191X
A&P , EAA Tech. Counselor
Charleston,Arkansas
Real Aviators Fly Taildraggers
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Alex Peterson" <alexpeterson(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | wheel pant clearance |
> The answer I got from Van's was 1/2" all around.
>
> Indiana Larry, RV7 Tip-up TMX-O-360 ACS2002 Dynon CNS430
> Digitrak Firewall Forward
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Dave Ford" <dford(at)michweb.net>
> To:
> Subject: RV-List: wheel pant clearance
>
>
> >
> > Am fitting wheel pants and wondering what clearance is
> necessary all
> around the lower tire? I'm wondering if 3/8 to 1/2 inch is
> enough all the way around?
> >
1/2" is marginal. Let the air out of the tire and see how the pants
fit. If you have a flat tire, the floppy tire will chew the pant away
if it is too close.
Alex Peterson
Maple Grove, MN
RV6-A N66AP 443 hours
http://www.home.earthlink.net/~alexpeterson/
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | SportAV8R(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: wheel pant clearance |
Am fitting wheel pants and wondering what clearance is necessary all around the
lower tire? I'm wondering if 3/8 to 1/2 inch is enough all the way around?
Dave Ford
RV6
Dave: Am repairing wheelpants after a hard plop-down landing (yes, I still misjudge
my energy and/or altitude in the flare every now and then). Post-crash investigation
shows clearly that the down force must have momentarily flattened
the tire enough to make it grab the edges of the wheel cutout in the bottom of
the pants, resulting in forcible delamination of the glass plies around the
opening and a crack along the bottom of the pant for about 6 inches that will
one day need repainting. Also bent the aluminum mounting flange (timely post,
huh?) which required a trip to the anvil for a pounding session with the hammer.
Secondary damage resulted to the grear leg fairing where it got torqued by
the intersection fairing as the pant bent downward in front. I had been using
about a 1/4 inch clearance all the way around. Now I have dremel-sanded the
gap to more like 3/8 inches to be safe. Too nice a day to be repairing fiberglass,
so decided to go fly now and repair /reinforce damaged areas later when
I don;t feel like flying (when will that be?!)
-Bill B
6A
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Robin Wessel" <Robin.Wessel(at)verizon.net> |
| Subject: | Heated Pitot tube $964!!!! |
Does anyone know why the price of new heated 12V pitot tubes has more
than quadrupled in the past 3 years?!?
Spruce is now $480 and Chief sells one for $964!!!
Anyone have a suggestion for where I can find a cheaper one? I have not
checked with the salvage yards yet since my preference would be for a
new one. Last time I bought one for -6A from Wentworth they sent me one
that obviously scraped the ground but the price was right (<$100).
thanks,
Robin Wessel
RV-10 wings
Tigard, OR
---
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Leesafur(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Heated Pitot tube $964!!!! |
Dynon is gearing up to sell them for $200
http://www.dynonavionics.com/docs/pitotfeatures.html
Lee
Anoka, MN
RV-3 Wing
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Richard E. Tasker" <retasker(at)optonline.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Heated Pitot tube $964!!!! |
The problem is that the only company that makes these tubes was
purchased two or three years ago and the new owners are selling them for
what the market will bear (and raising the price each year trying to
find the ceiling price of what the market will bear). It is what
happens when you have a monopoly.
Try ebay or salvage yards. A used one is fine as long as it hasn't been
damaged. There really isn't much that can go wrong with them.
I was able to find a heated pitot/static tube on ebay for a reasonable
price a few months ago.
Dick Tasker, RV9A #90573
Robin Wessel wrote:
>
>Does anyone know why the price of new heated 12V pitot tubes has more
>than quadrupled in the past 3 years?!?
>
>Spruce is now $480 and Chief sells one for $964!!!
>
>Anyone have a suggestion for where I can find a cheaper one? I have not
>checked with the salvage yards yet since my preference would be for a
>new one. Last time I bought one for -6A from Wentworth they sent me one
>that obviously scraped the ground but the price was right (<$100).
>
>thanks,
>
>Robin Wessel
>RV-10 wings
>Tigard, OR
>
>
>---
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Instrument Panel |
A few months ago I posted the fact that I wasn't happy with the way my panel was coming out and that I had actually ruined my first one. I also didn't want to purchase or learn how to use a CAD program just for one panel. I requested help from the list and promptly got a response from Ross Schlotthauer! Ross offered to lay it out in CAD and work with me to get the panel cut to the exact dimensions I wanted and the finish product turned out excellent, better than I could have hoped for. If your skills aren't up to your own standards as mine weren't, consider checking out Ross's web site at www.experimentalair.com .
Man this web site is great! Thanks Matt
Wayne Couture
RV-8A wiring
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Vanremog(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Heated Pitot tube $964!!!! |
In a message dated 2/28/2004 8:40:16 PM Pacific Standard Time,
Robin.Wessel(at)verizon.net writes:
Does anyone know why the price of new heated 12V pitot tubes has more
than quadrupled in the past 3 years?!?
Spruce is now $480 and Chief sells one for $964!!!
Duh... same as fuel prices and hangar fees here in California, because they
can.
GV (RV-6A N1GV flying 675 hrs)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Skylor Piper" <skylor(at)delta.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Heated Pitot tube $964!!!! |
Weird. I just bought my pitot tube(PH502-12) from chief last week for $415.
I guess their price increased drastically when they had to restock it!
Also, it looks like the price for Whellen strobe/position lights are going
up too. I bought mine from Vans a couple of weeks ago and their price was
the same as last year ($780 for Kit 6) but Spruce and Chief show the kit for
$150 more or so than they had it for last year.
The problem is that the only company that makes these tubes was
purchased two or three years ago and the new owners are selling them for
what the market will bear (and raising the price each year trying to
find the ceiling price of what the market will bear). It is what
happens when you have a monopoly.
Try ebay or salvage yards. A used one is fine as long as it hasn't been
damaged. There really isn't much that can go wrong with them.
I was able to find a heated pitot/static tube on ebay for a reasonable
price a few months ago.
Dick Tasker, RV9A #90573
Robin Wessel wrote:
>
>Does anyone know why the price of new heated 12V pitot tubes has more
>than quadrupled in the past 3 years?!?
>
>Spruce is now $480 and Chief sells one for $964!!!
>
>Anyone have a suggestion for where I can find a cheaper one? I have not
>checked with the salvage yards yet since my preference would be for a
>new one. Last time I bought one for -6A from Wentworth they sent me one
>that obviously scraped the ground but the price was right (<$100).
>
>thanks,
>
>Robin Wessel
>RV-10 wings
>Tigard, OR
>
>
>---
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Matthew Brandes" <matthew(at)n523rv.com> |
| Subject: | Dimple or countersink 904/976/922 |
I'm about ready to disassemble the center section assembly but before I do, I need
some input. The F-972 floor skin overlaps the F-976 center section skin which
in turn sits on the flange of the 904 E&F. The plans note four places you
should countersink the 976/904 because this is where the floor angles attach
on the inside. This implies that you should dimple the rest. The flange on
the 904 is pretty thick, and dimpling this plus the two skins could leave a not
so hot mating surfaces between them all.
I'm thinking I'll countersink the entire row of 976 skin/904 flange and dimple
the 972 skin to sit inside the countersink. Is this what others did?? Am I missing
something??
Matthew Brandes
Van's RV-9A (Wings)
EAA Chapter 91 & 868
www.n523rv.com
matthew(at)n523rv.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Ed Holyoke" <bicyclop(at)pacbell.net> |
| Subject: | Strobe power supply repair |
Hey guys,
My Whelan wingtip power supply quit working. It's got voltage to it and
the flash tube works when I try it on the other wing so it's gotta be
the power supply. It's a A490, T-DF-14/28 and it seems to be about $225
to replace it. Has anybody had one repaired?
The case is pop riveted on so they seem to be serious about their no
field repair policy.
Thanks,
Ed Holyoke
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Dimple or countersink 904/976/922 |
| From: | "Frank van der Hulst (Staff WG)" <F.vanderHulst(at)ucol.ac.nz> |
Matthew,
Exactly how thick is each part?
Generally speaking, you can't dimple anything over about .032", and
can't countersink anything under .032". If it is .032" thick, you can
choose which to do.
Frank
-----Original Message-----
I'm about ready to disassemble the center section assembly but before I
do, I need some input. The F-972 floor skin overlaps the F-976 center
section skin which in turn sits on the flange of the 904 E&F. The plans
note four places you should countersink the 976/904 because this is
where the floor angles attach on the inside. This implies that you
should dimple the rest. The flange on the 904 is pretty thick, and
dimpling this plus the two skins could leave a not so hot mating
surfaces between them all.
I'm thinking I'll countersink the entire row of 976 skin/904 flange and
dimple the 972 skin to sit inside the countersink. Is this what others
did?? Am I missing something??
Learn real skills for the real world - Apply online
at http://www.ucol.ac.nz or call 0800 GO UCOL
(0800 46 8265) or txt free 3388 for more information
and make a good move to UCOL Universal College of
Learning.
Enrol with a public institute and be certain of your
future
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | BPattonsoa(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Strobe power supply repair |
Before you send it in, be sure you have Power to the wingtip. Just having
voltage means nothing if a connection has gone bad and it can't pass the amps.
I had a similar problem with a cabin strobe power supply that was
intermittent. I appeared to have voltage at the box, but a crimp was not tight
on the
switch (the only one of about a million, I hope), and I found it when I burned
my
finger touching the connection in flight.
Whelen was nice, and it only cost me shipping back and forth and the
frustration. These things are educational even when fllying.
Bruce Patton
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Fred Stucklen" <wstucklen1(at)cox.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Stainless Wheel Pants Brackets |
I've got 152 Hrs on my RV-6A (with the new style wheel pants) and
have already replaced one wheel pant bracket. I figure the other one
will have the same problem soon, and I'll probably find it cracked when
I rotate the tires in a couple of weeks. I really don't want to have to
replace one or both of them on every tire change/rotation.
So, in my opinion, I have the choice of doubling up on the thickness
of the current material, or replacing them with the stainless material.
For the extra money, I'd rather have the durability of the
stainless.....
Fred Stucklen
RV-6A N926RV 150+ Hrs
Charlie & Tupper England wrote:
>
>Jerry Springer wrote:
>
>
>
>>
>>My question is, what are the problems that people are having
with the
>>stock brackets Van sells?
>>I have not had any problems with them nor have I heard of any
problems
>>here locally.
>>
>>Jerry
>>
>>
>>
>
>I can't speak about the newer kits, but I had to replace a broken
>bracket on my ('92 completion date) -4 at around 400 hours.
>
>Charlie
>
>
>
>
I had over 1000 hours on my old style ('89 completeion date) RV-6
brackets with no problems.
I don't have enough time on the new style yet to know if they well
break
or not, time well tell.
Jerry
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | PILOT8127(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Flyin Leftovers, need a little help. |
Hey Dana,
Here is the info on the "Indy-RVers" you requested. See Below:
Hey Rvers,
What a turnout!! Easily the biggest and best'est RV/style extravaganza
(for this early in the spring) in years!! Really! Dana did a wonderful job
of putting this together,,, considering we pretty much overwelmed the Madison
County/Richmond airport today! The best Lebanon, TN. (M54) RV/style event
only turned out about 44 RVs in years past. We nearly DOUBLED that today!!
WoW!!
The "Hooter-wings" were an absolute smash. ((oh my GAWD, finger lickin
good, they were!!)) I saw many empty "Hooters-tubs" over by the trash. The
burgers and dogs had a waiting line about a half hour long too! Coffee and
donuts greeted the RVers early this morning, and they were very much appriciated.
The INDY guys found them right away of course! (yum,yum,yum,yum,) burp!
OK.......here you go. The list of attendees today!
The INDY RVers :
1. Jon Nace RV4
2. Mike Worth RV4
3. Dave Sloan/Dan ????? RV6A
4. Dave Cobbs RV4
5. Jim Nolan RV4
6. Jim/Terri Truitt RV8A
7. Jim Sears RV6A
8. Denny Hackbarth HR/Rv
9. Sherman/Latha Dedman RV6A
10. John Crabtree/Vince F. RV6
11. Larry Boggs (Dragon/RV) RVsuper8
12. Rich Sacher RV6
13. Jeff Roberts (SKULLY) RVsuper8
14. Steve Woods (SMOKER) RV4
15. Gary Rodgers (SMOKER) RV3A
16. Karl Schiling RV8
17. Todd Riefers RV8
18. Jim Winings/Paul McCord RV4
19. Bobby Japundza RV6
20. Mark Hall (FLAG) RV4
Mark was the last of our group to arrive. We had the MOST RVers (as a CLUB)
by far!! Waita GO guys!! We got our magic number! 20 INDY RVS!
BUT wait!! There's MORE!
These are the single RVs that came filing in and eventually filled up the
parking area. ALL of it!!
21. RV6 412BN
22. RV8 86X
23. 6A 77YW (Columbus, OH.)
24. 6 7AK
25. 6 1067S
26. 8A 314TS
27. 8 49KS
28. 4 363GC (Michigan)
29. 8A 910LL
30. 8 815RV
31. 8 (3-blade shimitar) 880RV
32. 8 (Gray military sheme) ?????
33. 4 250DS
34. 6 722DK
35. 6 54VC
36. 8 (Lets ROLL!) (pretty!) 626JL
37. 8 (another Schimitar prop) 808PS
38. 4 427WB
39. 6 (polished) 101EM
40. 8 42CS
41. 6 4610D
42. 6A 602EP
43. 6 247AR
44. 6 (polished/red ) 21GJ
45. 6 (polished/white) 198DG (Akron,OH)
46. 8 (Stars/Bars) 165JM
47. 6 (Parkersburg, W. VA.) 915RV
48. 6 856RG
49. 8 46BF
50. 4 348KE
51. 4 774RV
52. 6A 767MA
53. 4 223RV
54. 4 2532T
55. 6 629K
56. 6A 124JJ
57. 6 996PJ
58. 8 563JH
59. 4 43CD
60. 6A 38JC
61. 6A 456WM
62. 6 586DB
63. 6 399SB
64. 6A 413BB
65. 6A 97KB
66. 6A 834JH
67. 6A 612GP
68. 4 81638
69. 6 280DS
70. 8 303TD
71. 8 127EK
72. 6A 915JD
Whew!! That's lot of RVs!!
Not to mention there were in excess of twenty SPAMS parked out there too!
Holy COW!!
The FOOD was great, thanks DANA!! The weather was perfect, thanks
again DANA!! The fuel was a bit pricey.........at $3 bucks a gallon. But,
hey....you can't have everything,,,right??! Two outa three ain't bad!!
OK........there you have it. EVERYONE was there! It really don't get
any better than this! Especially for February!! Hope you were one of the
lucky ones who got to attend this great "RV-cookout and get together" at
Madison, KY. today! The southern hospitality of our Kentucky RVer friends was
so
very much appriciated!!
We were treated to the usual RV-formation FLY-Bys this morning. Saw
some neat new ideas. Visited with our long lost pals. Even made some new
friends too! Paul McCord took about a thousand pictures for us.
We are already looking forward to NEXT year! MORE food. MORE RVS!!
MORE RV/FUN!
Thanks AGAIN Dana!! We had a BLAST!
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Rich Crosley" <dirtrider(at)qnet.com> |
| Subject: | Hiding the hindge pin |
How are you cleaver guys hiding the hindge pin holding the top and bottom of
the cowl together? I know you can pull the pin from the cockpit side, but
is there a clever way to pull it forward and still hide it?
Thanks..............
Rich Crosley
RV8 Finishing up
Palmdale, CA
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Stainless Wheel Pants Brackets |
Where are they cracking? And which one, the outer our the inner? Like any
other aluminum part, the holes need to be deburred and the edges dressed. When
doing my wheel pant installation, I found it took a lot of adjusting to get
the brackets to lay flat to the wheel pant. If the wheel pant is installed
causing tension on the brackets it can induce a stress crack.
Cash Copeland
RV6 Hayward, Ca
In a message dated 2/29/2004 1:35:54 PM Pacific Standard Time,
wstucklen1(at)cox.net writes:
I've got 152 Hrs on my RV-6A (with the new style wheel pants) and
have already replaced one wheel pant bracket. I figure the other one
will have the same problem soon, and I'll probably find it cracked when
I rotate the tires in a couple of weeks. I really don't want to have to
replace one or both of them on every tire change/rotation.
So, in my opinion, I have the choice of doubling up on the thickness
of the current material, or replacing them with the stainless material.
For the extra money, I'd rather have the durability of the
stainless.....
Fred Stucklen
RV-6A N926RV 150+ Hrs
Charlie & Tupper England wrote:
>
>Jerry Springer wrote:
>
>
>
>>
>>My question is, what are the problems that people are having
with the
>>stock brackets Van sells?
>>I have not had any problems with them nor have I heard of any
problems
>>here locally.
>>
>>Jerry
>>
>>
>>
>
>I can't speak about the newer kits, but I had to replace a broken
>bracket on my ('92 completion date) -4 at around 400 hours.
>
>Charlie
>
>
>
>
I had over 1000 hours on my old style ('89 completeion date) RV-6
brackets with no problems.
I don't have enough time on the new style yet to know if they well
break
or not, time well tell.
Jerry
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Ron Walker" <ron(at)walker.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Hiding the hindge pin |
Check out Dan Checkaway's latest additions to his web site for his solution
... elegant.
http://www.rvproject.com/20040222.html
Ron
----- Original Message -----
From: "Rich Crosley" <dirtrider(at)qnet.com>
Subject: RV-List: Hiding the hindge pin
>
> How are you cleaver guys hiding the hindge pin holding the top and bottom
of
> the cowl together? I know you can pull the pin from the cockpit side, but
> is there a clever way to pull it forward and still hide it?
> Thanks..............
>
> Rich Crosley
> RV8 Finishing up
> Palmdale, CA
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
aeroelectric-list(at)matronics.com
| From: | Kevin Horton <khorton01(at)rogers.com> |
| Subject: | Dynon Remote Compass mounting? |
I'm pondering the details of how to mount the remote compass sensor
for my Dynon EFIS. I'm leaning towards hanging it from the top of
the F-809 bulkhead on my RV-8, somewhat similar to:
http://home.comcast.net/~jwdanie/Compass/compass.html
But, I'm worried about potential interference from the high voltage
strobe light line that goes from the power supply back to the tail
strobe. I could reroute that guy lower, but it will be a real PITA.
So, I'm wondering how close anyone has run a strobe light cable (the
big grey one that goes from the power supply to the light) to the
EDC-10 remote compass mount. If you've got such a strobe line in the
area of your remote compass sensor, tell me how far away it is, and
whether you can see any effect on heading from it.
My strobe cable would probably be about 8 inches from the compass
sensor if I don't move it. I don't want to move it if I can get away
with it.
Thanks,
--
Kevin Horton RV-8 (finishing kit)
Ottawa, Canada
http://go.phpwebhosting.com/~khorton/rv8/
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Charlie Kuss <chaskuss(at)bellsouth.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Dynon Remote Compass mounting? |
Kevin,
I've been considering that location for the compass module of my uEncoder. I have
two concerns. Most stationary ferrous metal objects can be compensated for.
The problem is near by moving ferrous (steel and iron) parts. The rudder cables
are directly below all areas of the tail cone. You also have the elevator
horns in the rear and the rear torque tube to bellcrank hardware in the front
of the tail cone. If you are installing the battery in the rear (I am) there
is also the issue of the magnetic field generated by the master contactor mounted
on the battery tray.
I'm wondering if a location in the wing might not be better???
Charlie Kuss
>
>I'm pondering the details of how to mount the remote compass sensor
>for my Dynon EFIS. I'm leaning towards hanging it from the top of
>the F-809 bulkhead on my RV-8, somewhat similar to:
>
>http://home.comcast.net/~jwdanie/Compass/compass.html
>
>But, I'm worried about potential interference from the high voltage
>strobe light line that goes from the power supply back to the tail
>strobe. I could reroute that guy lower, but it will be a real PITA.
>So, I'm wondering how close anyone has run a strobe light cable (the
>big grey one that goes from the power supply to the light) to the
>EDC-10 remote compass mount. If you've got such a strobe line in the
>area of your remote compass sensor, tell me how far away it is, and
>whether you can see any effect on heading from it.
>
>My strobe cable would probably be about 8 inches from the compass
>sensor if I don't move it. I don't want to move it if I can get away
>with it.
>
>Thanks,
>--
>Kevin Horton RV-8 (finishing kit)
>Ottawa, Canada
>http://go.phpwebhosting.com/~khorton/rv8/
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Larry Bowen" <Larry(at)bowenaero.com> |
| Subject: | Dynon Remote Compass mounting? |
My current plan is to put the Dynon compass module inside the inboard
inspection cover in the right wing. I'll make an adjustable tripod-type
device out of AL and nylon screws that will allow me to tweak it's
level, etc. When the wings go on for the last time I'll start working
on it..... All theory so far.
-
Larry Bowen
Larry(at)BowenAero.com
http://BowenAero.com
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Charlie Kuss [mailto:chaskuss(at)bellsouth.net]
> Sent: Sunday, February 29, 2004 7:05 PM
> To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
> Subject: Re: RV-List: Dynon Remote Compass mounting?
>
>
>
> Kevin,
> I've been considering that location for the compass module
> of my uEncoder. I have two concerns. Most stationary ferrous
> metal objects can be compensated for. The problem is near by
> moving ferrous (steel and iron) parts. The rudder cables are
> directly below all areas of the tail cone. You also have the
> elevator horns in the rear and the rear torque tube to
> bellcrank hardware in the front of the tail cone. If you are
> installing the battery in the rear (I am) there is also the
> issue of the magnetic field generated by the master contactor
> mounted on the battery tray. I'm wondering if a location in
> the wing might not be better??? Charlie Kuss
>
>
> >
> >I'm pondering the details of how to mount the remote compass sensor
> >for my Dynon EFIS. I'm leaning towards hanging it from the top of
> >the F-809 bulkhead on my RV-8, somewhat similar to:
> >
> >http://home.comcast.net/~jwdanie/Compass/compass.html
> >
> >But, I'm worried about potential interference from the high voltage
> >strobe light line that goes from the power supply back to the tail
> >strobe. I could reroute that guy lower, but it will be a real PITA.
> >So, I'm wondering how close anyone has run a strobe light cable (the
> >big grey one that goes from the power supply to the light) to the
> >EDC-10 remote compass mount. If you've got such a strobe
> line in the
> >area of your remote compass sensor, tell me how far away it is, and
> >whether you can see any effect on heading from it.
> >
> >My strobe cable would probably be about 8 inches from the compass
> >sensor if I don't move it. I don't want to move it if I can
> get away
> >with it.
> >
> >Thanks,
> >--
> >Kevin Horton RV-8 (finishing kit)
> >Ottawa, Canada
> >http://go.phpwebhosting.com/~khorton/rv8/
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "bryan hooks" <hook3607(at)bellsouth.net> |
| Subject: | Hiding the hindge pin |
Here's one of the best jobs I've seen. Don't know who's it is. Go to
the following link. It's the last picture before the section labeled
"Some other nice planes". I think Ross took these pics at Arlington.
By the way, if any of you guys are the guilty party for this
design...please email me off line. I wanna do it the same way.
Bryan Hooks
RV-7A, slow
Knoxville, TN
Hook3607(at)bellsouth.net
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Rich Crosley
Subject: RV-List: Hiding the hindge pin
How are you cleaver guys hiding the hindge pin holding the top and
bottom of
the cowl together? I know you can pull the pin from the cockpit side,
but
is there a clever way to pull it forward and still hide it?
Thanks..............
Rich Crosley
RV8 Finishing up
Palmdale, CA
=
=
=
=
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Kevin Horton <khorton01(at)rogers.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Dynon Remote Compass mounting? |
The wing is quite possibly better, and I certainly gave it serious
consideration. But a fuselage location allows me to finish this task
in the garage, rather than add it to the list of stuff to do after
the move to a hangar.
Quite a few people seem to have mounted Dynon remote compass sensors
in the aft fuselage, and most seem to be happy with the compass
performance. At least this is my perception from watching various
e-mail lists. Magnetic fields from a point source (like a battery
contactor) will vary inversely with the cube of the distance, so the
field strength decreases very quickly as the separation increases.
I'm satisfied that a location at the top of the F-809 should be more
than far enough from the battery contactor, elevator horns, etc. The
rudder cables are steel, but they are a fair ways below my proposed
location, and I've read reports of success with these things mounted
on the aft deck under the VS on a tail dragger, which puts it closer
to the rudder cables, tail wheel, elevator bellcrank, etc.
My only concern was the high voltage strobe line, as many folks don't
have tail mounted strobes, and I haven't read any mention of
separation between strobe lines and compass sensors. But Bob
Nuckolls on the Aeroelectric List said:
There should be NO magnetic field radiated from your
strobe lines. Don't worry about them affecting your
compass sensor.
I trust Bob, so I'll press on with my plan.
Kevin Horton
>
>Kevin,
> I've been considering that location for the compass module of my
>uEncoder. I have two concerns. Most stationary ferrous metal objects
>can be compensated for. The problem is near by moving ferrous (steel
>and iron) parts. The rudder cables are directly below all areas of
>the tail cone. You also have the elevator horns in the rear and the
>rear torque tube to bellcrank hardware in the front of the tail
>cone. If you are installing the battery in the rear (I am) there is
>also the issue of the magnetic field generated by the master
>contactor mounted on the battery tray.
> I'm wondering if a location in the wing might not be better???
>Charlie Kuss
>
>
>>
>>I'm pondering the details of how to mount the remote compass sensor
>>for my Dynon EFIS. I'm leaning towards hanging it from the top of
>>the F-809 bulkhead on my RV-8, somewhat similar to:
>>
>>http://home.comcast.net/~jwdanie/Compass/compass.html
>>
>>But, I'm worried about potential interference from the high voltage
>>strobe light line that goes from the power supply back to the tail
>>strobe. I could reroute that guy lower, but it will be a real PITA.
>>So, I'm wondering how close anyone has run a strobe light cable (the
>>big grey one that goes from the power supply to the light) to the
>>EDC-10 remote compass mount. If you've got such a strobe line in the
>>area of your remote compass sensor, tell me how far away it is, and
>>whether you can see any effect on heading from it.
>>
>>My strobe cable would probably be about 8 inches from the compass
>>sensor if I don't move it. I don't want to move it if I can get away
>>with it.
>>
>>Thanks,
>>--
>>Kevin Horton RV-8 (finishing kit)
>>Ottawa, Canada
>>http://go.phpwebhosting.com/~khorton/rv8/
> >
>>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "bryan hooks" <hook3607(at)bellsouth.net> |
| Subject: | Hiding the hindge pin |
OK, about 30 seconds after sending this, I found it on Dan Checkoways
website...instructions and all.
-bryan
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of bryan hooks
Subject: RE: RV-List: Hiding the hindge pin
Here's one of the best jobs I've seen. Don't know who's it is. Go to
the following link. It's the last picture before the section labeled
"Some other nice planes". I think Ross took these pics at Arlington.
By the way, if any of you guys are the guilty party for this
design...please email me off line. I wanna do it the same way.
Bryan Hooks
RV-7A, slow
Knoxville, TN
Hook3607(at)bellsouth.net
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Rich Crosley
Subject: RV-List: Hiding the hindge pin
How are you cleaver guys hiding the hindge pin holding the top and
bottom of
the cowl together? I know you can pull the pin from the cockpit side,
but
is there a clever way to pull it forward and still hide it?
Thanks..............
Rich Crosley
RV8 Finishing up
Palmdale, CA
=
=
=
=
=
=
=
=
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Richard E. Tasker" <retasker(at)optonline.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Hiding the hindge pin |
Uuuh...It would have been nice if you had actually included the link :-) .
Dick Tasker
bryan hooks wrote:
>
>Here's one of the best jobs I've seen. Don't know who's it is. Go to
>the following link. It's the last picture before the section labeled
>"Some other nice planes". I think Ross took these pics at Arlington.
>By the way, if any of you guys are the guilty party for this
>design...please email me off line. I wanna do it the same way.
>
>Bryan Hooks
>RV-7A, slow
>Knoxville, TN
>Hook3607(at)bellsouth.net
>
>-----Original Message-----
>From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
>[mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Rich Crosley
>To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
>Subject: RV-List: Hiding the hindge pin
>
>
>How are you cleaver guys hiding the hindge pin holding the top and
>bottom of
>the cowl together? I know you can pull the pin from the cockpit side,
>but
>is there a clever way to pull it forward and still hide it?
>Thanks..............
>
>Rich Crosley
>RV8 Finishing up
>Palmdale, CA
>
>
>=
>=
>=
>=
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Sam Buchanan <sbuc(at)hiwaay.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Hiding the hindge pin |
Ron Walker wrote:
>
> Check out Dan Checkaway's latest additions to his web site for his solution
> ... elegant.
>
> http://www.rvproject.com/20040222.html
>
> Ron
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Rich Crosley" <dirtrider(at)qnet.com>
> To:
> Subject: RV-List: Hiding the hindge pin
>
>
>
>>
>>How are you cleaver guys hiding the hindge pin holding the top and bottom
>
> of
>
>>the cowl together? I know you can pull the pin from the cockpit side, but
>>is there a clever way to pull it forward and still hide it?
>>Thanks..............
>>
>>Rich Crosley
>>RV8 Finishing up
>>Palmdale, CA
>>
If you don't want to make the covers with composite materials, you can
make them with scrap aluminum you have on hand. There is a photo near
the bottom of this page of the hinge pin keepers I have been using for
550 hrs:
http://home.hiwaay.net/~sbuc/journal/finish5.html
Advantages of this type of keeper:
1) secures the pin
2) hides the gap between the cowl halves
3) ties the cowl halves together with screws which prevents wear and
chafing in a very visible spot.
I kept a pattern from when I made up the covers; I had one fatigue crack
around the screws and made a new one in just a few minutes from the pattern.
Sam Buchanan
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Sam Buchanan <sbuc(at)hiwaay.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Dynon Remote Compass mounting? |
Charlie Kuss wrote:
>
> Kevin,
> I've been considering that location for the compass module of my uEncoder. I
have two concerns. Most stationary ferrous metal objects can be compensated for.
The problem is near by moving ferrous (steel and iron) parts. The rudder cables
are directly below all areas of the tail cone. You also have the elevator
horns in the rear and the rear torque tube to bellcrank hardware in the front
of the tail cone. If you are installing the battery in the rear (I am) there
is also the issue of the magnetic field generated by the master contactor mounted
on the battery tray.
> I'm wondering if a location in the wing might not be better???
> Charlie Kuss
One way to check for the suitability of a location for the remote mag is
to use a handheld compass (a cheap one is fine). Move the compass around
the area you considering and if you don't see the needle deflect due to
flux it should be a good location.
My mag is located on the shelf below the vertical stab near rudder
cables, elevator horns, and the tailwheel spring. Heading accuracy is
within two degrees.
Sam Buchanan
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "David Burton" <dburton(at)nwlink.com> |
| Subject: | Hiding the cowl hinge pin |
Can we change the subject line to make searching the archives a little
easier :-) ?
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Douglas A. Fischer" <dfischer(at)iserv.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Heated Pitot tube $964!!!! |
Unfortunately, the Dynon website says the pitot will only work with their
EFIS-D10. It sounds like if you want their pitot for anything else you're
out of luck. Anybody know for certain?
Doug Fischer
RV-9A 90706 Wings
----- Original Message -----
From: <Leesafur(at)aol.com>
Subject: Re: RV-List: Heated Pitot tube $964!!!!
>
> Dynon is gearing up to sell them for $200
>
> http://www.dynonavionics.com/docs/pitotfeatures.html
>
>
> Lee
> Anoka, MN
> RV-3 Wing
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Vanremog(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Stainless Wheel Pants Brackets |
In a message dated 2/29/2004 1:35:57 PM Pacific Standard Time,
wstucklen1(at)cox.net writes:
I've got 152 Hrs on my RV-6A (with the new style wheel pants) and
have already replaced one wheel pant bracket.
Odd. I've got 682 hrs on mine and not even a hint of a problem. I just
inspected them during their fifth condition inspection last week. Did Van's
change the design? I can imagine how they could break as robust as they are.
GV (RV-6A N1GV flying 682 hrs)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Vanremog(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Strobe power supply repair |
In a message dated 2/29/2004 11:39:01 AM Pacific Standard Time,
bicyclop(at)pacbell.net writes:
My Whelen wingtip power supply quit working. It's got voltage to it and
the flash tube works when I try it on the other wing so it's gotta be
the power supply. It's a A490, T-DF-14/28 and it seems to be about $225
to replace it. Has anybody had one repaired?
I believe that their policy is that they will repair them forever to original
owner for $40.
GV (RV-6A N1GV flying 682 hrs)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Richard E. Tasker" <retasker(at)optonline.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Heated Pitot tube $964!!!! |
Their pitot is a combination pitot/AOA. I can't see why the pitot part
wouldn't work for anyone. You would need the D10 to use the AOA part.
But I won't know for certain until mine arrives (this spring???).
Dick Tasker
Douglas A. Fischer wrote:
>
>Unfortunately, the Dynon website says the pitot will only work with their
>EFIS-D10. It sounds like if you want their pitot for anything else you're
>out of luck. Anybody know for certain?
>
>Doug Fischer
>RV-9A 90706 Wings
>
>----- Original Message -----
>From: <Leesafur(at)aol.com>
>To:
>Subject: Re: RV-List: Heated Pitot tube $964!!!!
>
>
>
>
>>
>>Dynon is gearing up to sell them for $200
>>
>>http://www.dynonavionics.com/docs/pitotfeatures.html
>>
>>
>>Lee
>>Anoka, MN
>>RV-3 Wing
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Dave Ghost" <daveghost(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | Rudder trailing edge - T-88 vs Tank sealant |
Im considering using T-88 structural epoxy on the rudder trailing edge
instead of tank sealant, but first I thought Id check with those more
experienced than I in the use of these materials. I havent used either yet.
Are there any compelling reasons to use tank sealant rather than this epoxy
or is the epoxy a better way to go? I have the epoxy on hand, but would
gladly order the small container of tank sealant if it will perform better
on the trailing edge. Any feedback is greatly appreciated.
Thank you,
Dave, RV-7 Empennage
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Brian Duncan" <brian2207(at)comcast.net> |
Does anyone have experience with HVLP setups? Any brands to look for or
avoid? I'm looking at 3 or 4 stage turbine for priming and maybe finish. I'm
also need to do some re-finishing around the house. Any experiences would be
appreciated. Thanks.
Brian
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Esten Spears" <ewspears(at)comcast.net> |
| Subject: | VM 1000 & Single Drive Dual Mag (DLN 3000) |
Has anyone installed a VM 1000 Engine Monitor with a Single Drive Dual Mag?
If So; What Tach Sensor did you use and where and how did you mount it??????
The instructions call for it to be placed in the gear inspection port where
it picks up the passing gear teeth. The single drive dual mag has such ports
but it uses nylon gears so I don't think the sensor would see anything.
Any help would be appreciated!
Esten Spears, RV8A, 80922, N922ES (reserved), Leeward Air Ranch, Ocala, FL
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Van's vs Electric Bob's approach |
OK, I've bought Bob's most recent workbook but don't have quality time to go through
it all in a time frame to keep the info coherent.
Can someone give me the reader's digest version of the differences between just
going with Van's electrical design and drawing's and wiring kit and switches
vs whatever alternatives Bob's discussing (if anything).
Thanks,
lucky
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Esten Spears" <ewspears(at)comcast.net> |
| Subject: | VM 1000 Fuel Flowmeter & Purge Valve Installation |
Has anyone done an IO 360 200HP with a VM 1000 Fuel Flowmeter & Purge Valve
Installation???
If so; where and how did you place the purge valve and flowmeter????? I am using
standard Bendix Servo and Spider.
Any help would be appreciated!!
Esten Spears, RV8A, 80922, N922ES (reserved), Leeward Air Ranch, Ocala, FL
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | RV9 <rv9(at)charter.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Rudder trailing edge - T-88 vs Tank sealant |
I've used T-88 on all my trailing edges and have been very pleased
with the results. I drill the trailing edges to a scrap piece of
aluminum angle and then let the T-88 set while clecoed to the angle.
It's important to rotate and clean the clecoes periodically during the
curing if you ever want to get them out :). That's probably the only
disadvantage compared to tank sealant which never really hardens
completely. When fully cured you don't really even need the rivets.
Before somebody takes me seriously, I'm just kidding. Be sure to
set the rivets.
You can use white vinegar to clean up the excess T-88 before it
hardens or on the tips of the clecoes. You need much more powerful
solvents (Acetone, MEK) to deal with the tank sealant.
Luckily after the flaps and ailerons, I've got no more of those
trailing edges to do.
Steve Mottin
RV-9A (Fuselage - bulkheads)
N609RV (Reserved)
Granbury, Texas
Sunday, February 29, 2004, 11:13:12 PM, you wrote:
DG> Im considering using T-88 structural epoxy on the rudder trailing edge
DG> instead of tank sealant, but first I thought Id check with those more
DG> experienced than I in the use of these materials. I havent used either yet.
DG> Are there any compelling reasons to use tank sealant rather than this epoxy
DG> or is the epoxy a better way to go? I have the epoxy on hand, but would
DG> gladly order the small container of tank sealant if it will perform better
DG> on the trailing edge. Any feedback is greatly appreciated.
DG> Thank you,
DG> Dave, RV-7 Empennage
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | <EricHe(at)FlexSolPackaging.com> |
I'm getting ready to order my Dynon, I specifically asked them this last week.
Their reply was, a pitot is a pitot. They also said it was built to fit the standard
(Gretz) mount. Can't answer anything about AOA, LRI, functions. Don't know,
Don't care.
>Unfortunately, the Dynon website says the pitot will only work with their
>EFIS-D10. It sounds like if you want their pitot for anything else you're
>out of luck. Anybody know for certain?
>
>Doug Fischer
>RV-9A 90706 Wings
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | linn walters <lwalters2(at)cfl.rr.com> |
| Subject: | Re: HVLP systems |
Brian Duncan wrote:
>
>
>Does anyone have experience with HVLP setups? Any brands to look for or
>avoid? I'm looking at 3 or 4 stage turbine for priming and maybe finish. I'm
>also need to do some re-finishing around the house. Any experiences would be
>appreciated. Thanks.
>
>Brian
>
I borrow a 2-stage HVLP gun and I love the way it sprays. Much more
paint on the item and less on the floor. At the price of good paint,
that's a great plus!!! The only drawback, and sone I dom't know how to
solve is the hose. It's fat and fairly heavy and with a gun full of
paint my arm gets tired of holding it up. And that's really the only
drawback. Another good 'plus' is that the turbine gets hot and the air
is used to cool it ...... giving you warmer air to paint with instead of
colder air from a standard spray gun. I'm not a professional painter so
I can't comment on the quality of the paint job!!!
Linn
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bill VonDane <bill(at)vondane.com> |
| Subject: | Re: [rv8list] VM 1000 Fuel Flowmeter & Purge Valve Installation |
vansairforce
Esten....
I don't know about the purge valve, but I installed the flow meter on my -8A
this weekend:
http://www.vondane.com/rv8a/finish/finish13.htm
-Bill
----- Original Message -----
From: "Esten Spears" <ewspears(at)comcast.net>
Subject: [rv8list] VM 1000 Fuel Flowmeter & Purge Valve Installation
Has anyone done an IO 360 200HP with a VM 1000 Fuel Flowmeter & Purge
Valve Installation???
If so; where and how did you place the purge valve and flowmeter????? I am
using standard Bendix Servo and Spider.
Any help would be appreciated!!
Esten Spears, RV8A, 80922, N922ES (reserved), Leeward Air Ranch, Ocala, FL
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
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________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "RV_8 Pilot" <rv_8pilot(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | Re: New "No Fly Zones" and airport vulnerability assessments |
How about we, as a generally very affluent and intelligent group of people
quit arguing over who's more moderate or independent or cerebral and what
group is or isn't hurting GA and think of ways to fight these idiots.
They will take away every freedom we have to secure their own personal
power/financial agenda. They're soulless and not above cheating the
system/breaking the law to win more power. And if they think writing
ANOTHER stupid law to control us fossil fuel burning, "rich" pilots appeals
to their pathetic disfunctional base, they'll do it.
How about we brainstorm ways to fight these socialist, power mongers and
keep the freedom that is rightfully ours and NOT theirs to take?!
Idea 1 - Join AOPA.
Idea 2 - Write your reps using brief and concise statements. Ref the bills
being proposed.
Idea 3 - Call your reps with above info.
Idea 4 - Don't even waste the time calling these few reps unless you're a
constituent. Then let them have it.
Idea 5 - Reall do the things you say you will! And maybe twice!
Bryan Jones -8
www.LoneStarSquadron.com
Houston, Texas
>When a party is out of power they introduce all sorts of feel good bills to
>use in their campaign.
>Or they spend a year and a half tying up the government trying to find out
>whose spunk was on the dress.
>
>I agree with Charlie. It doesn't matter which party we're talking about
>here, they all have their issues, and you should follow the money always.
>If I
>could keep the new Republicans out of the bedroom, out of my beliefs and
>out of
>my wallet, I could be persuaded that there was a difference between them
>and
>the Dems.
Take off on a romantic weekend or a family adventure to these great U.S.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jim Anglin" <jlanglin44(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | Re:Dimple or c'sink |
I have dimpled skins up to .040 with good results on 2 RV's (sorta - RV6 and
HR II). Otherwise .032 is the breaking point for c'sinking. v dimpling.
Dimple the top pc. and c'sink the pile below. C'sink just enough to get a
rivet to lay flush - otherwise you stand a chance of pulling the skin into a
crater.
Jim
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "LarryRobertHelming" <lhelming(at)sigecom.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Van's vs Electric Bob's approach |
I am in the thick of wiring now so I have a somewhat experienced opinion on
this subject. I studied Bob's book and drawings and felt I understood about
55-65% of it before I received the Vans wiring kit. I was amazed how
different the two approaches are in their use of materials. Particularly in
the use of circuit breakers compared to fuses. And Vans rolls his own power
buss using copper strips and Bob advocates using the Buss power buses. I am
using a lot of the material that Vans supplies but have worked in the LR3
voltage regulator from Bob / B&C. After spending some time to understand
Bob and his drawings, I found it impossible for me to go with the Vans
approach. I reference the Vans wiring approach to get suggested wiring
routing and I try to use the wire his kit supplies. But I think Bob's
slip-on terminal ends are easier to work with than the screw on terminals
from Van's.
I am sure there will be mixed opinions and if I had studied Vans approach
first, I probably would feel uncomfortable with Bob's. Best wishes.
Indiana Larry, RV7 Tip-up TMX-O-360 ACS2002 Dynon CNS430 Digitrak Jeff Rose
Firewall Forward
----- Original Message -----
From: <RV8ter(at)aol.com>
Subject: RV-List: Van's vs Electric Bob's approach
>
> OK, I've bought Bob's most recent workbook but don't have quality time to
go through it all in a time frame to keep the info coherent.
>
> Can someone give me the reader's digest version of the differences between
just going with Van's electrical design and drawing's and wiring kit and
switches vs whatever alternatives Bob's discussing (if anything).
>
> Thanks,
> lucky
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Fiveonepw(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Van's vs Electric Bob's approach |
In a message dated 3/1/04 7:16:35 AM Central Standard Time, RV8ter(at)aol.com
writes:
> Can someone give me the reader's digest version of the differences between
> just going with Van's electrical design and drawing's and wiring kit and
> switches vs whatever alternatives Bob's discussing (if anything).
>
Lucky- I didn't try Vans approach and aren't even familiar with it. After
absorbing about 2 months worth of Bob Nuckolls wit, wisdom and how-tos, I didn't
even bother with an alternative and converted to Aeroelectricism. Subscribe
to the Aeroelectric list, study the book, do like it says, ask questions if
you don't understand anything, do your design and installation, and you will not
have to worry about your electrics. If I can do it, anybody can!
From The PossumWorks in TN
Mark - all electric RV-6A, 42 hours and my cheeks are KILLING me! 8-)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bill VonDane <bill(at)vondane.com> |
| Subject: | N8WV Upgrades... |
"rv8list(at)yahoogroups.com"
<104001c3ff9b$16c13380$51e25f0a@vondane>
I decided to do some upgrades to my -8A, and have a new page on my site that
I will be posting the details to if anyone is interested...
http://www.vondane.com/rv8a/finish/finish13.htm
-Bill VonDane
EAA Tech Counselor
RV-8A ~ N8WV ~ Colorado Springs
www.vondane.com
www.creativair.com
www.epanelbuilder.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Sam Buchanan <sbuc(at)hiwaay.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Van's vs Electric Bob's approach |
RV8ter(at)aol.com wrote:
>
> OK, I've bought Bob's most recent workbook but don't have quality
> time to go through it all in a time frame to keep the info coherent.
>
> Can someone give me the reader's digest version of the differences
> between just going with Van's electrical design and drawing's and
> wiring kit and switches vs whatever alternatives Bob's discussing (if
> anything).
>
> Thanks, lucky
Lucky,
This is an interesting and valid question and the answer is one that you
probably will not like. I think it is safe to say that for most of us
with minimal or normal amounts of electrical background, a serious
amount of study will be required to understand the why's and how's of
'Lectric Bob's dual bus architecture. I read portions of the book two
and three times before I finally got a good understanding of exactly why
he designed his system the way he did. If you try to implement the dual
bus system without understanding the reasons for it, it will make
absolutely no sense and you will have no idea how to properly use it or
troubleshoot.
In other words, there is no way to avoid serious study time. However,
once the system is understood, the traditional (Vans) method will appear
to be very dated and obsolete, and more than likely you will be a dual
bus convert!
Here are some of the basic tenets of Bob's system:
1) Elimination of single point failure scenarios. This is the biggie.
The horror stories we all have heard about "electrical failure" in
aircraft can be designed out of the system, and Bob has done so. His
system assures that regardless of what happens to the electrical system,
there is a work-around (usually just flipping one switch) that will
allow the flight to have a happy conclusion.
2) Elimination of expensive (and unnecessary) breakers. Bob's system is
based on readily available and reliable automotive blade fuses. The
rationale is that there is very little troubleshooting that can be done
in-flight with breakers, and with the proper design, an electrical
system can't be shot down with one or two circuit failures. Land and do
the trouble shooting on the ground.
3) Very reasonable cost due to the above use of automotive technology
and elimination of "aircraft" stuff. :-)
4) Absolute protection from over-voltage scenarios.
The traditional system of aircraft wiring does not provide for any of
the above advantages. I find it interesting that the new
state-of-the-art aircraft (Cirrus and the glass cockpit Cessnas) have
dual bus systems similar to Bob's design.
As I mentioned before, if a builder refuses to take the time to study
the dual bus architecture, they might as well go with the Vans cookbook
(and its inherent flaws) because Bob's system will be Greek to them. We
are fortunate to have choices so we can use whichever system we are most
comfortable with.
Sam Buchanan (RV-6, 5502 hrs, 'Lectric Bob's system throughout, no blown
fuses or scary electrical moments)
http://thervjournal.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jim Anglin" <jlanglin44(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | Cool oil temps cure |
My -4 won't get the oil temps above 150 even with a plate blocking off the
inlet. Someone told me there was an oil control valve that could be
installed to manually regulate the flow of oil to the cooler. I know this
could be potentially dangerous but notwithstanding that does anyone know if
this info is bogus and if not who would sell these valves?
Jim
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "lucky macy" <luckymacy(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Van's vs Electric Bob's approach |
Thanks a bunch Sam,
I keep hearing a common theme - avoids expensive breaker switches and
somehow get the impression it's a cheaper but not necessarily quicker or
lighter solution.
Is one systems totoal cost actually significantly different than the other,
lighter than the other and easier to maintain once built?
It's tough to ignore any system Van's does as overall if they decide to do
something it's usually hard to top and usually makes good customer sense.
I'm just doing day/night vfr so worries about being down at IFR mins with an
all electric panel that suddenly goes black doesn't resonate with me. I
guess that is to say, I've never had a CB switch complaint yet but agree
their pricey. But if the big price difference between the two designs is
just with the cost between the 2 switch/fuse/breaker types used, I could
justify the higher expense of Van's design with lower building time on my
part to understand, find the parts to order, etc.
Again, though, thanks for the info.
lucky
----Original Message Follows----
From: Sam Buchanan <sbuc(at)hiwaay.net>
Subject: Re: RV-List: Van's vs Electric Bob's approach
Date: Mon, 01 Mar 2004 10:12:01 -0600
RV8ter(at)aol.com wrote:
>
> OK, I've bought Bob's most recent workbook but don't have quality
> time to go through it all in a time frame to keep the info coherent.
>
> Can someone give me the reader's digest version of the differences
> between just going with Van's electrical design and drawing's and
> wiring kit and switches vs whatever alternatives Bob's discussing (if
> anything).
>
> Thanks, lucky
Lucky,
This is an interesting and valid question and the answer is one that you
probably will not like. I think it is safe to say that for most of us
with minimal or normal amounts of electrical background, a serious
amount of study will be required to understand the why's and how's of
'Lectric Bob's dual bus architecture. I read portions of the book two
and three times before I finally got a good understanding of exactly why
he designed his system the way he did. If you try to implement the dual
bus system without understanding the reasons for it, it will make
absolutely no sense and you will have no idea how to properly use it or
troubleshoot.
In other words, there is no way to avoid serious study time. However,
once the system is understood, the traditional (Vans) method will appear
to be very dated and obsolete, and more than likely you will be a dual
bus convert!
Here are some of the basic tenets of Bob's system:
1) Elimination of single point failure scenarios. This is the biggie.
The horror stories we all have heard about "electrical failure" in
aircraft can be designed out of the system, and Bob has done so. His
system assures that regardless of what happens to the electrical system,
there is a work-around (usually just flipping one switch) that will
allow the flight to have a happy conclusion.
2) Elimination of expensive (and unnecessary) breakers. Bob's system is
based on readily available and reliable automotive blade fuses. The
rationale is that there is very little troubleshooting that can be done
in-flight with breakers, and with the proper design, an electrical
system can't be shot down with one or two circuit failures. Land and do
the trouble shooting on the ground.
3) Very reasonable cost due to the above use of automotive technology
and elimination of "aircraft" stuff. :-)
4) Absolute protection from over-voltage scenarios.
The traditional system of aircraft wiring does not provide for any of
the above advantages. I find it interesting that the new
state-of-the-art aircraft (Cirrus and the glass cockpit Cessnas) have
dual bus systems similar to Bob's design.
As I mentioned before, if a builder refuses to take the time to study
the dual bus architecture, they might as well go with the Vans cookbook
(and its inherent flaws) because Bob's system will be Greek to them. We
are fortunate to have choices so we can use whichever system we are most
comfortable with.
Sam Buchanan (RV-6, 5502 hrs, 'Lectric Bob's system throughout, no blown
fuses or scary electrical moments)
http://thervjournal.com
Watch high-quality video with fast playback at MSN Video. Free!
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Evan and Megan Johnson" <evmeg(at)snowcrest.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Flop tubes in QB wings |
Hi Mickey....I have done it several times. It takes alot of patience but it
can be done. You have to use pop rivets for everything and you will scrape
up your wrists trying to pop them inside the first bay. You also have to
move the sending unit mounting hole to the back baffle in the second
bay...kind of a trick to get the nutplates in place through that little hole
but again, with patience it can be done. You will also have to be very
careful about aluminum chips, you WILL have lots of them in the tank when
you are done.....rinse, rinse, rinse. Just use a gallon of avgas and pour it
throgh a coffee filter a few times untill you dont see any sparkles. Feel
free to contact me if you wish....I am happy to help if I can.
Evan
(530)247-0375
(530)351-1776 cell
----- Original Message -----
From: "Mickey Coggins" <mick-matronics(at)rv8.ch>
Subject: RV-List: Flop tubes in QB wings
>
> Does anyone see a way to get a flop tube to work
> in a QB wing?
>
> At first I just thought it was a quick retrofit, but
> there seem to be some protective brackets needed inside
> to keep the flop tubes from getting hung up in there.
>
> Has anyone been able to make this work?
>
> Thanks,
> Mickey
>
> --
> Mickey Coggins
> http://www.rv8.ch/
> #82007 QB Wings/Fuselage
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Jason Sneed <n242ds(at)cox.net> |
Can someone tell me if it is possible to run 2 gps units off one
antenna? If so where would I find some type of Y adapter?
Thanks,
Jason Sneed
Commercial Lending Officer
First National Bank and Trust
N242DS
Great flyin this weekend at I39!
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bill VonDane <bill(at)vondane.com> |
| Subject: | Need an GPS antenna... |
vansairforce
If any one of you fine folks out there have one of those little black Garmin
hockey puck GPS antennas that you're not going to be using, I sure could use
one...
Here's a photo of what I an looking for:
http://www.vondane.com/rv8a/gpsa.jpg
Thanks!
-Bill VonDane
EAA Tech Counselor
RV-8A ~ N8WV ~ Colorado Springs
www.vondane.com
www.creativair.com
www.epanelbuilder.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Sam Buchanan <sbuc(at)hiwaay.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Van's vs Electric Bob's approach |
lucky macy wrote:
>
> Thanks a bunch Sam,
> I keep hearing a common theme - avoids expensive breaker switches and
> somehow get the impression it's a cheaper but not necessarily quicker or
> lighter solution.
I think it would be both less expensive and lighter, but since I can't
compare both systems side-by-side, I don't have hard numbers. The
Fast-On terminals used in Bob's system are *definitely* easier and
quicker to install than fumbling with tiny washers and screws! Get the
proper crimper, and a Fast-On can be installed and in place in a matter
of seconds. The fuse panels weigh nearly nothing; the weight comparison
between good quality switches and switchable breakers is probably a
wash. If you have separate breakers and switches, Bob's system would
certainly be lighter and simpler.
>
> Is one systems totoal cost actually significantly different than the other,
> lighter than the other and easier to maintain once built?
A good electrical system has no maintainance! :-)
>
> It's tough to ignore any system Van's does as overall if they decide to do
> something it's usually hard to top and usually makes good customer sense.
I think it is a matter of inertia; Vans offers what is traditional
(kinda like their aircraft....) and what the folks at Vans are familiar
with.
>
> I'm just doing day/night vfr so worries about being down at IFR mins with an
> all electric panel that suddenly goes black doesn't resonate with me.
But suddenly being in the dark on a VFR night can be exciting! And,
Bob's system means you don't have to worry about a runaway alternator or
a failed master contactor.
And....its sorta cool knowing your electrical system is more advanced
than most certificated light planes. :-)
Sam
=================
I
> guess that is to say, I've never had a CB switch complaint yet but agree
> their pricey. But if the big price difference between the two designs is
> just with the cost between the 2 switch/fuse/breaker types used, I could
> justify the higher expense of Van's design with lower building time on my
> part to understand, find the parts to order, etc.
>
> Again, though, thanks for the info.
>
> lucky
>
>
> ----Original Message Follows----
> From: Sam Buchanan <sbuc(at)hiwaay.net>
> To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
> Subject: Re: RV-List: Van's vs Electric Bob's approach
> Date: Mon, 01 Mar 2004 10:12:01 -0600
>
>
> RV8ter(at)aol.com wrote:
> >
> > OK, I've bought Bob's most recent workbook but don't have quality
> > time to go through it all in a time frame to keep the info coherent.
> >
> > Can someone give me the reader's digest version of the differences
> > between just going with Van's electrical design and drawing's and
> > wiring kit and switches vs whatever alternatives Bob's discussing (if
> > anything).
> >
> > Thanks, lucky
>
> Lucky,
>
> This is an interesting and valid question and the answer is one that you
> probably will not like. I think it is safe to say that for most of us
> with minimal or normal amounts of electrical background, a serious
> amount of study will be required to understand the why's and how's of
> 'Lectric Bob's dual bus architecture. I read portions of the book two
> and three times before I finally got a good understanding of exactly why
> he designed his system the way he did. If you try to implement the dual
> bus system without understanding the reasons for it, it will make
> absolutely no sense and you will have no idea how to properly use it or
> troubleshoot.
>
> In other words, there is no way to avoid serious study time. However,
> once the system is understood, the traditional (Vans) method will appear
> to be very dated and obsolete, and more than likely you will be a dual
> bus convert!
>
> Here are some of the basic tenets of Bob's system:
>
> 1) Elimination of single point failure scenarios. This is the biggie.
> The horror stories we all have heard about "electrical failure" in
> aircraft can be designed out of the system, and Bob has done so. His
> system assures that regardless of what happens to the electrical system,
> there is a work-around (usually just flipping one switch) that will
> allow the flight to have a happy conclusion.
>
> 2) Elimination of expensive (and unnecessary) breakers. Bob's system is
> based on readily available and reliable automotive blade fuses. The
> rationale is that there is very little troubleshooting that can be done
> in-flight with breakers, and with the proper design, an electrical
> system can't be shot down with one or two circuit failures. Land and do
> the trouble shooting on the ground.
>
> 3) Very reasonable cost due to the above use of automotive technology
> and elimination of "aircraft" stuff. :-)
>
> 4) Absolute protection from over-voltage scenarios.
>
> The traditional system of aircraft wiring does not provide for any of
> the above advantages. I find it interesting that the new
> state-of-the-art aircraft (Cirrus and the glass cockpit Cessnas) have
> dual bus systems similar to Bob's design.
>
> As I mentioned before, if a builder refuses to take the time to study
> the dual bus architecture, they might as well go with the Vans cookbook
> (and its inherent flaws) because Bob's system will be Greek to them. We
> are fortunate to have choices so we can use whichever system we are most
> comfortable with.
>
> Sam Buchanan (RV-6, 5502 hrs, 'Lectric Bob's system throughout, no blown
> fuses or scary electrical moments)
> http://thervjournal.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Van's vs Electric Bob's approach |
Ah, something concrete.
This can't be prevented with Van's setup - maybe with slight modification?
In a message dated 3/1/2004 12:16:04 PM Eastern Standard Time,
sbuc(at)hiwaay.net writes:
But suddenly being in the dark on a VFR night can be exciting! And,
Bob's system means you don't have to worry about a runaway alternator or
a failed master contactor.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Matthew Brandes" <matthew(at)n523rv.com> |
| Subject: | RE: Dimple or countersink 904/976/922 |
Frank,
The 904 flange is .040. The center section skin is .025 or .032, can't
remember. The 972 skin is also .040.
I called Van's and they said to dimple all three parts or I could
countersink the 976/904 and dimple the 972 skin to fit in the countersink.
That's the route I'm going to take.
Matthew Brandes,
Van's RV-9A (Wings/Fuselage)
EAA Chapter 868/91
www.n523rv.com <http://www.n523rv.com/>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | P M Condon <pcondon(at)mitre.org> |
| Subject: | RV-List New VANS AD/Service Bulletin Notice posted on website |
A new inspect fuel tank SB is issued from Vans. One(so far) QB fuel tank was assembled
with the clear plastic coating still adhered to the
metal. Vans now uses a blue plastic skin........One time visual inspection to comply
with SB.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Oldsfolks(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: >Re:Cool oil temps cure |
Do you have a vernatherm valve on your engine ? This goes in place of the
old oil screen and is the temp. control valve for oil flow through the oil
cooler. It doesn't let oil flow through the cooler until the temp. is high enough
to open the valve,then regulates the flow to keep the oil temp. where it
belongs.
Bob Olds RV-4 , N1191X
A&P , EAA Tech. Counselor
Charleston,Arkansas
Real Aviators Fly Taildraggers
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | linn walters <lwalters2(at)cfl.rr.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Van's vs Electric Bob's approach |
lucky macy wrote:
>
>Thanks a bunch Sam,
>I keep hearing a common theme - avoids expensive breaker switches and
>somehow get the impression it's a cheaper but not necessarily quicker or
>lighter solution.
>
>Is one systems totoal cost actually significantly different than the other,
>lighter than the other and easier to maintain once built?
>
Since we're not popping out 'standard' panels and each system is really
custom, I'd say that any Van's wiring kit will come up short. Having
said that, maybe someone will chime in and tell those of us that haven't
got that far just exactly what the Van's wiring kit entails. Cost
difference is so widely subjective that there can't really be any
comparison. It depends on what quality you buy Vs what's in Van's kit.
Do you buy Mil-spec wire or go to the auto parts place? Good
aviation-quality crimp-on connectors or Home Depot? You can save some
bucks in this area, but I don't recommend it. That'll show up in the
maintenance category.
>It's tough to ignore any system Van's does as overall if they decide to do
>something it's usually hard to top and usually makes good customer sense.
>
But, how does he do the 'one size fits all' package? Is the wiring for
an autopilot in his kit? How about wiring for strobes, nav lights and
landing lights? The 'essential bus' was mentioned. I guess there's no
dual battery sysetm in Vans's kit. there's just too many variables.
>I'm just doing day/night vfr so worries about being down at IFR mins with an
>all electric panel that suddenly goes black doesn't resonate with me. I
>guess that is to say, I've never had a CB switch complaint yet but agree
>their pricey. But if the big price difference between the two designs is
>just with the cost between the 2 switch/fuse/breaker types used, I could
>justify the higher expense of Van's design with lower building time on my
>part to understand, find the parts to order, etc.
>
Finding the parts and ordering may not be so hard. Aeroelectric will
sell you all the stuff you need. Can you buy them cheaper elsewhere?
Maybe. It's the same dilemma as when you were looking for air tools.
There is also Newark Electronics http://www.newark.com/ for electrical
stuff ...... get their catalog as their web site is tough to navigate in.
>Again, though, thanks for the info.
>
Wiring is a tough enough job as it is without being constrained by a
'one size fits all' kit. One problem is solved though, and that's
choosing the wire sizes and the ckt breakers/fuses. The idea of using
blade fuses is intriguing to me .... the breakers are large, expensive,
and heavier, and if you get the 'pullable' breakers, they cost even
more. You have to remember that breakers aren't there to protect the
units that they feed, they are there to protect the wiring. Sizing
wiring is a tedious and time consuming task in itself but will pay off
in the long run. Most builders use too much wire, and the 'if this wire
is good, a larger wire is better' mindset. This only adds weight and cost.
Linn ..... soon to be in the same boat!!! Oops .... forget the boat!!!
>lucky
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jim Jewell" <jjewell(at)telus.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Cool oil temps cure |
Hi Jim,
"The desired oil temperature range for Lycoming engines is from 165 degrees
to 220 degrees F. If the aircraft has a winterization kit, it should be
installed when operating in outside temperatures (OAT) that are below the 40
to 45 degree F range. If no winterization kit is supplied and the engine is
`not' equipped with a thermostatic bypass valve, it may be necessary to
improvise a means to of blocking off a portion of the air flow to the oil
cooler."
The above quotes are taken from page 49 of the 2002 Lycoming Flyer, Key
reprints. this publication is given out free at the Lycoming display booths
at air shows etc. chances are that it can be obtained by directly contacting
Lycoming.
I am assuming that the "thermostatic bypass valve" above and references to
vernatherm and varatherm (Spelling?) oil temperature control devices on this
list in the past are one and the same . I would think that one of these
units in good condition would be well worth installing if one is not
currently installed.
I would be very cautious about installing a non Lycoming manual valve that
could offer the chance to reduce oil flow manually. The risk of accidental
excessive oil flow reduction and or shut off ! is to be avoided.
Also try taping off both sides of the oil cooler as a test.
Jim in Kelowna
----- Original Message -----
From: "Jim Anglin" <jlanglin44(at)earthlink.net>
Subject: RV-List: Cool oil temps cure
>
> My -4 won't get the oil temps above 150 even with a plate blocking off the
> inlet. Someone told me there was an oil control valve that could be
> installed to manually regulate the flow of oil to the cooler. I know this
> could be potentially dangerous but notwithstanding that does anyone know
if
> this info is bogus and if not who would sell these valves?
>
> Jim
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Stein Bruch" <stein(at)steinair.com> |
| Subject: | Cool oil temps cure |
Hi Jim,
One thing I suspect is that your engine may not have a Vernitherm, or if it
does it may not be working.
On my -360 powered RV6, I don't have a vernitherm and I have the same
problem. The fix is to install either an oil screen housing that accepts a
vernitherm, or one of the filter mounts that accepts a vernitherm, this
keeps the oils from flowing to the cooler until it's warm enough....king of
like a thermostat in your car radiator.
Just one word of caution if you install an oil screen housing with a
Vernitherm to an engine that didn't previously have one. Make sure you
don't have the "viscosity valve" installed in the accessory case. If so,
the plunger end will interefere with the tip of the vernitherm valve.
Lycomings should have one or the other, but never both.
Anyway, just my 2 cents!
Cheers,
Stein Bruch
RV6's, Minneapolis
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of Jim Anglin
Subject: RV-List: Cool oil temps cure
My -4 won't get the oil temps above 150 even with a plate blocking off the
inlet. Someone told me there was an oil control valve that could be
installed to manually regulate the flow of oil to the cooler. I know this
could be potentially dangerous but notwithstanding that does anyone know if
this info is bogus and if not who would sell these valves?
Jim
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Sam Buchanan <sbuc(at)hiwaay.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Van's vs Electric Bob's approach |
RV8ter(at)aol.com wrote:
>
> Ah, something concrete.
>
> This can't be prevented with Van's setup - maybe with slight modification?
The "slight modification" involves the installation of a second bus and
over-voltage protection which means that you then have.........Bob's
system. :-)
Sam Buchanan
>
> In a message dated 3/1/2004 12:16:04 PM Eastern Standard Time,
> sbuc(at)hiwaay.net writes:
> But suddenly being in the dark on a VFR night can be exciting! And,
> Bob's system means you don't have to worry about a runaway alternator or
> a failed master contactor.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "John D. Heath" <altoq(at)direcway.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Cool oil temps cure |
Try this link
http://www.chiefaircraft.com/cgi-bin/frame/frame-aircraft.cgi?URL=/Aircraft/OilSystem/VernithermValve.html
John D
----- Original Message -----
From: "Stein Bruch" <stein(at)steinair.com>
Subject: RE: RV-List: Cool oil temps cure
>
> Hi Jim,
>
> One thing I suspect is that your engine may not have a Vernitherm, or if
it
> does it may not be working.
>
> On my -360 powered RV6, I don't have a vernitherm and I have the same
> problem. The fix is to install either an oil screen housing that accepts
a
> vernitherm, or one of the filter mounts that accepts a vernitherm, this
> keeps the oils from flowing to the cooler until it's warm enough....king
of
> like a thermostat in your car radiator.
>
> Just one word of caution if you install an oil screen housing with a
> Vernitherm to an engine that didn't previously have one. Make sure you
> don't have the "viscosity valve" installed in the accessory case. If so,
> the plunger end will interefere with the tip of the vernitherm valve.
> Lycomings should have one or the other, but never both.
>
> Anyway, just my 2 cents!
>
> Cheers,
> Stein Bruch
> RV6's, Minneapolis
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of Jim Anglin
> To: RV List
> Subject: RV-List: Cool oil temps cure
>
>
> My -4 won't get the oil temps above 150 even with a plate blocking off the
> inlet. Someone told me there was an oil control valve that could be
> installed to manually regulate the flow of oil to the cooler. I know this
> could be potentially dangerous but notwithstanding that does anyone know
if
> this info is bogus and if not who would sell these valves?
>
> Jim
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: HVLP systems |
Try Lexaire. Excellent gun and they back up their products. Call Bill or
Liz at 978-663-7202. Tell them L.D. sent you. RV-8QB
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "David Carter" <dcarter(at)datarecall.net> |
| Subject: | Re: HVLP systems |
I don't understand why anyone uses the "vane/turbine" HVLP systems. They
are very expensive and totally unnecessary.
I have a DeVilbiss (spelling?) gun I bought 7 years ago that uses regular
shop air compressor. I run turn the regulator down to about 10psi (have a
gage on the heel of the spray gun) and fire away. I've been using it all
this time for internal corrosion control priming and will use it for my
external priming and finish coats.
David Carter
----- Original Message -----
From: "Brian Duncan" <brian2207(at)comcast.net>
Subject: RV-List: HVLP systems
>
>
> Does anyone have experience with HVLP setups? Any brands to look for or
> avoid? I'm looking at 3 or 4 stage turbine for priming and maybe finish.
I'm
> also need to do some re-finishing around the house. Any experiences would
be
> appreciated. Thanks.
>
> Brian
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Van's vs Electric Bob's approach |
How do I get my hands on Electric Bob's book I keep reading about in the RV
list? L. D. RV-8QB 1087
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Wheeler North <wnorth(at)sdccd.cc.ca.us> |
The dynon pitot is a standard pitot, with a flat spot and a hole down below
the pitot entrance for the AOA pressure.
It provides the same values for the pitot that Van's pitot does.
It is not a static source like some pitot tubes are, so you will need to use
Vans simple system or ???
RE compass module.
Mine in in outer rt wing, fwd of spar. I used two peices of wood .75" x
1.75" x 4" long sliced on the bottom at angles one for each axis. This
allowed me to shim on each axis separately until it was inside of .2 deg in
aligment with the D10. Then I bonded it all together and final shimed it
with tape. The hold down screws were ss #6 flush head that were screwed up
through the top peice of wood, then I used the plastic stand off nuts used
on circuit boards to hold the module down.
This was the only place on my plane that allows 12" of separation from all
iron and wires.
W
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Doug Weiler" <dougweil(at)pressenter.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Flyin Leftovers, need a little help. |
Hey Fellow Listers:
Congrats Dana. Sounds like you put together a great gathering.
Since I see everyone is already getting antsy for the fly-in season to
start, allow me to continue to plug this spring's Twin Cities RV Fly-In.
May 22 and 23 is the date and it had better be on your calendars (this is
the hard sell technique!). This is going to be a BIG DEAL for RV pilots!!.
Breakfast, door prizes, "wife rides", mini-seminars and it's all part of
Discover Aviation Days at Anoka County Airport, just north of Minneapolis.
The snow will be gone and IT WILL BE SPRINGTIME!
Stay tuned on the Fly-In website: http://www.home.earthlink.net/~rvflyin/
Doug Weiler,
pres MN Wing
Alex Peterson
RV Fly-in Chairman
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | linn walters <lwalters2(at)cfl.rr.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Van's vs Electric Bob's approach |
Fly2eat(at)aol.com wrote:
>
>How do I get my hands on Electric Bob's book I keep reading about in the RV
>list? L. D. RV-8QB 1087
>
Go to http://www.aeroelectric.com/
Linn
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bill VonDane <bill(at)vondane.com> |
| Subject: | More in FlowScan installation... |
vansairforce
More on this subject... You got my interest peaked Jeff.....so I went
looking for installation manuals for different engine monitors that use the
FlowScan 201B... All of them said the following in one way or another:
- The flow transducer should be installed in the fuel line and mounted to a
horizontal surface as described below.
- A screen or filter should be installed upstream of the flow transducer to
screen out debris which could affect rotor movement or settle in V-bearings.
- As turbulence upstream of the transducer affects its performance, there
should be a reasonable length of straight line between the transducer inlet
and the first valve, elbow, or other turbulence producing device.
- Install flow transducer with wire leads pointed UP to vent bubbles and
insure that the rotor is totally immersed in liquid.
- For maximum accuracy at low flow rates the transducer should be mounted on
a horizontal surface.
I only found one that said anything about the actual location, and it said:
...has seen good results with the following mounting:
1. The transducer in a stationary location in line between the electric
boost pump and the engine driven pump.
2. The transducer in a stationary location in line between the fuel
injection servo and the distribution block.
3. The transducer in a stationary location in line between the Engine driven
pump and the Carburetor
I have a call into FlowScan for more info, but from what I have ready today,
I see no problem with installing where I did... When I hear back from
FlowScan I will update this post...
-Bill VonDane
EAA Tech Counselor
RV-8A ~ N8WV ~ Colorado Springs
www.vondane.com
www.creativair.com
www.epanelbuilder.com
----- Original Message -----
From: "pittsakro" <jfarrar1(at)cox.net>
Subject: [rv8list] Re: N8WV Upgrades...
Bill, I would advise against the location that you chose for the
flowscan. The flow meter is a point of restriction in the line.
When there is a restriction on the suction side of a pump, there
can/will be cavitation.....bubbles. It depends on the temp of the
fluid and the suction head of the pump. I believe that there is a
risk in your installation. I've got mine on the discharge side of
the engine pump w/ flex lines in and out, reasonably straight and the
error is less than 1%.
Jeff Farrar
N4ZJ 385hrs
EAA Tech Counselor
EAA Flight Adviser
--- In rv8list(at)yahoogroups.com, Bill VonDane wrote:
> I decided to do some upgrades to my -8A, and have a new page on my
site that
> I will be posting the details to if anyone is interested...
>
> http://www.vondane.com/rv8a/finish/finish13.htm
>
>
> -Bill VonDane
> EAA Tech Counselor
> RV-8A ~ N8WV ~ Colorado Springs
> www.vondane.com
> www.creativair.com
> www.epanelbuilder.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "BRUCE GRAY" <brucerv84us(at)hotmail.com> |
I'm dropping this quick message to the list about more detailed information
about are fly-in. This is the Carson City, NV. Fly-in we're talking about.
Two sights you can visit which are vansairforce.net. Once there look in the
left hand column and you will see Activities Calendar, click on there and
scroll to the bottom and our information is posted. The other sight is
vansaircraft.com which will have some information and then forward to the
first sight for the same information. If you are looking for further
information drop me an e-mail and I will try to answer all of your
questions. We still have minor details to work out but the event is on so
plan forit. Hope to see you all there. Bruce Gray in Nevada.
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: HVLP systems |
| From: | Michael D Hilger <rvsixer(at)juno.com> |
writes:
>
>
> I don't understand why anyone uses the "vane/turbine" HVLP systems.
> They
> are very expensive and totally unnecessary.
>
> I have a DeVilbiss (spelling?) gun I bought 7 years ago that uses
> regular
> shop air compressor. I run turn the regulator down to about 10psi
> (have a
> gage on the heel of the spray gun) and fire away. I've been using
> it all
> this time for internal corrosion control priming and will use it for
> my
> external priming and finish coats.
>
> David Carter
The HVLP guns that use shop air are called "conversion guns". A
friend of mine
used one to paint my -6 and it was amazing how little overspray there
was. Nice
finish, too. I have used the turbine type, too. They also worked great
except they heat
the supply air. The conversion gun we used is made by whoever bought out
Croix Air.
Mike Hilger
RV-6 N207AM 550 hours
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Jason Sneed <n242ds(at)cox.net> |
| Subject: | Re: More in FlowScan installation... |
Just for general information... I did not follow the directions at
all.. I have turns in the line before and after the floscan, I also did
not mount it to a horizontal surface. But, it works great and is highly
accurate. I would say it is within an 1/8 to a 1/10 of a gallon. My
fuel gages do not work for some reason so I use this as my fuel gage. I
was thinking about ordering the princeton fuel gages from grad rapids,
but I do not know how hard it would be to pull out the old non working
gages and replace them with new ones, if anyone has any info on this
please send me an email.
thanks,
Jason Sneed
n242ds(at)cox.net
On Mar 1, 2004, at 4:20 PM, Bill VonDane wrote:
>
> More on this subject... You got my interest peaked Jeff.....so I went
> looking for installation manuals for different engine monitors that
> use the
> FlowScan 201B... All of them said the following in one way or another:
>
> - The flow transducer should be installed in the fuel line and mounted
> to a
> horizontal surface as described below.
> - A screen or filter should be installed upstream of the flow
> transducer to
> screen out debris which could affect rotor movement or settle in
> V-bearings.
> - As turbulence upstream of the transducer affects its performance,
> there
> should be a reasonable length of straight line between the transducer
> inlet
> and the first valve, elbow, or other turbulence producing device.
> - Install flow transducer with wire leads pointed UP to vent bubbles
> and
> insure that the rotor is totally immersed in liquid.
> - For maximum accuracy at low flow rates the transducer should be
> mounted on
> a horizontal surface.
>
> I only found one that said anything about the actual location, and it
> said:
>
> ...has seen good results with the following mounting:
> 1. The transducer in a stationary location in line between the electric
> boost pump and the engine driven pump.
> 2. The transducer in a stationary location in line between the fuel
> injection servo and the distribution block.
> 3. The transducer in a stationary location in line between the Engine
> driven
> pump and the Carburetor
>
> I have a call into FlowScan for more info, but from what I have ready
> today,
> I see no problem with installing where I did... When I hear back from
> FlowScan I will update this post...
>
> -Bill VonDane
> EAA Tech Counselor
> RV-8A ~ N8WV ~ Colorado Springs
> www.vondane.com
> www.creativair.com
> www.epanelbuilder.com
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "pittsakro" <jfarrar1(at)cox.net>
> To:
> Subject: [rv8list] Re: N8WV Upgrades...
>
>
> Bill, I would advise against the location that you chose for the
> flowscan. The flow meter is a point of restriction in the line.
> When there is a restriction on the suction side of a pump, there
> can/will be cavitation.....bubbles. It depends on the temp of the
> fluid and the suction head of the pump. I believe that there is a
> risk in your installation. I've got mine on the discharge side of
> the engine pump w/ flex lines in and out, reasonably straight and the
> error is less than 1%.
>
> Jeff Farrar
> N4ZJ 385hrs
> EAA Tech Counselor
> EAA Flight Adviser
>
> --- In rv8list(at)yahoogroups.com, Bill VonDane wrote:
>> I decided to do some upgrades to my -8A, and have a new page on my
> site that
>> I will be posting the details to if anyone is interested...
>>
>> http://www.vondane.com/rv8a/finish/finish13.htm
>>
>>
>> -Bill VonDane
>> EAA Tech Counselor
>> RV-8A ~ N8WV ~ Colorado Springs
>> www.vondane.com
>> www.creativair.com
>> www.epanelbuilder.com
>
>
> _-
> =======================================================================
> _-
> =======================================================================
> _-
> =======================================================================
> _-
> =======================================================================
> >
>
>
Jason Sneed
Commercial Lending Officer
First National Bank and Trust
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Bob Hodgson" <bob(at)hodgson252.freeserve.co.uk> |
Thanks to all who replied to my recent questions. Got another one!
How big is the tach gen (IE VTACHGEN 2) for Van's tachometer (IE VTACH3500)
?
- Specifically the width / diameter.
I have an inverted oil pickup on the vac pump pad, and need to know whether
the tacho gen will interfere with it. (The pickup is just a 3/16" plate with
a hose boss in the centre).
Want to avoid using the one with the extension if possible, as it would
need to be bent rather severely to fit in the limited space between engine
and firewall on the -3
Thanks again
Bob (UK)
3B details
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Ed Holyoke" <bicyclop(at)pacbell.net> |
| Subject: | Van's vs Electric Bob's approach |
Add to the basic tenets of 'lectric Bob's system:
A) Fuel on board should be the limiting factor of duration of
flight not battery capacity.
B) Active notification of alternator failure / low voltage
condition so you can shed load and save battery for comfortable
conclusion of flight.
Ed Holyoke
Here are some of the basic tenets of Bob's system:
1) Elimination of single point failure scenarios. This is the biggie.
The horror stories we all have heard about "electrical failure" in
aircraft can be designed out of the system, and Bob has done so. His
system assures that regardless of what happens to the electrical system,
there is a work-around (usually just flipping one switch) that will
allow the flight to have a happy conclusion.
2) Elimination of expensive (and unnecessary) breakers. Bob's system is
based on readily available and reliable automotive blade fuses. The
rationale is that there is very little troubleshooting that can be done
in-flight with breakers, and with the proper design, an electrical
system can't be shot down with one or two circuit failures. Land and do
the trouble shooting on the ground.
3) Very reasonable cost due to the above use of automotive technology
and elimination of "aircraft" stuff. :-)
4) Absolute protection from over-voltage scenarios.
The traditional system of aircraft wiring does not provide for any of
the above advantages. I find it interesting that the new
state-of-the-art aircraft (Cirrus and the glass cockpit Cessnas) have
dual bus systems similar to Bob's design.
As I mentioned before, if a builder refuses to take the time to study
the dual bus architecture, they might as well go with the Vans cookbook
(and its inherent flaws) because Bob's system will be Greek to them. We
are fortunate to have choices so we can use whichever system we are most
comfortable with.
Sam Buchanan (RV-6, 5502 hrs, 'Lectric Bob's system throughout, no blown
fuses or scary electrical moments)
http://thervjournal.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Alex Peterson" <alexpeterson(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | More in FlowScan installation... |
> - The flow transducer should be installed in the fuel line
> and mounted to a horizontal surface as described below.
> - A screen or filter should be installed upstream of the flow
> transducer to screen out debris which could affect rotor
> movement or settle in V-bearings.
> - As turbulence upstream of the transducer affects its
> performance, there should be a reasonable length of straight
> line between the transducer inlet and the first valve, elbow,
> or other turbulence producing device.
> - Install flow transducer with wire leads pointed UP to vent
> bubbles and insure that the rotor is totally immersed in liquid.
> - For maximum accuracy at low flow rates the transducer
> should be mounted on a horizontal surface.
There is a plane around here which had the Floscan mounted with the flow
direction incorrect. At around 8 hours total time, the engine stopped
running at about 200 agl on takeoff. The plane sustained some damage,
and was repaired. The Floscan people apparently said that this could
happen. I don't understand it and remain skeptical, because I can't
think of why it worked for 8 hours and then stopped.
Be careful of flow direction.
Alex Peterson
Maple Grove, MN
RV6-A N66AP 443 hours
http://www.home.earthlink.net/~alexpeterson/
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "lucky macy" <luckymacy(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | which oil cooler for the angle valve 200hp engine? |
Are folks going with the stewart warner style oil cooler for this engine
even though it doesn't specify the 200hp engine?
only the positech 4215 says it's for the io-360 but it weighs twice as much
and appears to be smaller. Plus the *old* design had too dense a pattern and
didn't cool as well as the SW version. What's the scoop?
Learn how to help protect your privacy and prevent fraud online at Tech
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Dave Bristol <bj034(at)lafn.org> |
| Subject: | Re: Van's vs Electric Bob's approach |
Sam Buchanan wrote:
>...If you try to implement the dual bus system without understanding the reasons
for it, it will make absolutely no sense and you will have no idea how to properly
use it or
>troubleshoot.
>
>
Guys,
Just be sure that you REALLY understand this system because when you land in the
middle of North Dakota with an electrical problem YOU are going to be the expert
- the mechanic on duty at the FBO isn't going to know squat about it. And
of course there's the poor shmuck that you sell it to later on....
Dave RV6 So Cal
EAA Technical Counselor
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Fiveonepw(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Van's vs Electric Bob's approach |
In a message dated 03/01/2004 2:13:48 PM Central Standard Time,
luckymacy(at)hotmail.com writes:
back to reality.
There is no reality like being at 3000' agl at night and the airplane goes
dark... not a scare tactic, just one scenario we should all give a good "what
if?" to...
Van's *way* seems to be
tailorable/modifiable to some degree hence my question in the first place.
If I can offer one insight- I am an industrial electrician with 25 years in
the biz- not an aviation specialist, but someone who endeavors to understand
electricity. When I took a look at Bob's crowbar circuit for overvoltage
protection and understood the elegant simplicity and usefulness of it, it was one
of
those epiphanal moments that told me "you might want to pay attention to this
dude- he is way ahead of the curve"- kinda like some guy named VanGrunsven is
way ahead of other folk making airplanes- Sam Buchanan gave the most logical
argument I've seen yet- mine is a little more esorteric, FWIW... The system
offered by Vans may work fine for many builders, but by following the Nuckolls
approach, I'm confident that I not only understand everything going on in my
system ('cept for them "little black boxes" that only the padded-cell folk
grok) but I can competently deal with any "emergencies" I may encounter and be
able to effectively troubleshoot anything that might go badly, but always once
safely on terra firma.
And now I'll really stir it up: Why go with a taildragger when you could
have had the little wheel up front?
(Duck and cover- here it comes!) 8-) I'm KIDDING! TO EACH THEIR OWN!!
From The PossumWorks in TN
Mark Phillips
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Doug Weiler" <dougweil(at)pressenter.com> |
| Subject: | Re: More in FlowScan installation... |
----- > >
> > - The flow transducer should be installed in the fuel line and mounted
> > to a
> > horizontal surface as described below.
> > - A screen or filter should be installed upstream of the flow
> > transducer to
> > screen out debris which could affect rotor movement or settle in
> > V-bearings.
Just curious... how many of you have a filter upstream of your fuel flow
transducer?? I do not since the instructions for installation from EI
(maker of my fuel computer) did not call for one. Is this really needed??
Doug Weiler
RV-5 105 hours
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Larry Bowen" <Larry(at)bowenaero.com> |
| Subject: | More in FlowScan installation... |
My gascolator is upstream.
-
Larry Bowen
Larry(at)BowenAero.com
http://BowenAero.com
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Doug Weiler [mailto:dougweil(at)pressenter.com]
> Sent: Monday, March 01, 2004 8:45 PM
> To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
> Subject: Re: RV-List: More in FlowScan installation...
>
>
>
>
> ----- > >
> > > - The flow transducer should be installed in the fuel line and
> > > mounted to a horizontal surface as described below.
> > > - A screen or filter should be installed upstream of the flow
> > > transducer to
> > > screen out debris which could affect rotor movement or settle in
> > > V-bearings.
>
>
> Just curious... how many of you have a filter upstream of
> your fuel flow transducer?? I do not since the instructions
> for installation from EI (maker of my fuel computer) did not
> call for one. Is this really needed??
>
> Doug Weiler
> RV-5 105 hours
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Dean Pichon" <deanpichon(at)msn.com> |
| Subject: | Cool oil temps cure |
Hi Jim,
I have the same problem with my -4. On cold days, I cannot get the oil
temperature above 150F -even with the downstream side of the cooler blocked.
I plan to block the upstream side as I have been told this is much more
effective though much less easily done. I don't believe the Vernatherm
valve is your problem - assuming you have one. Vernatherm valves are
normally open, and close upon a rise in temperature. They contain a wax
pill much like car thermostats. As the heat of the oil melts the wax, it
expands thereby extending a piston. This piston extension blocks a hole
that otherwise returns oil to the engine. The alternate path (Vernatherm
extended) shunts the oil through the cooler. Even when the Vernatherm valve
is cold, it leaks (by design) oil through the cooler.
Regarding the manual valve, I've never heard of such a system, but it would
probably help - assuming you were comfortable with any safety issues. I
suggest you try blocking the upstream side of the cooler and let me know how
it works!
Good luck,
Dean
RV-4
Worcester, MA
180 Hrs
>From: "Jim Anglin" <jlanglin44(at)earthlink.net>
>Reply-To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
>To: "RV List"
>Subject: RV-List: Cool oil temps cure
>Date: Mon, 1 Mar 2004 08:14:30 -0800
>
>
>My -4 won't get the oil temps above 150 even with a plate blocking off the
>inlet. Someone told me there was an oil control valve that could be
>installed to manually regulate the flow of oil to the cooler. I know this
>could be potentially dangerous but notwithstanding that does anyone know if
>this info is bogus and if not who would sell these valves?
>
>Jim
>
>
Learn how to help protect your privacy and prevent fraud online at Tech
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Travis Hamblen" <TravisHamblen(at)cox.net> |
| Subject: | Breather tube tank... |
I have read that many people have designed a homemade breather tube tank
that they empty as needed as opposed to having the output slime up the belly
of the plane. I am considering doing the same and have a couple solid ideas
on how to do it the safest possible way (i.e.=85 whistle slot in breather tube
& vented tank). I would like to learn from anyone else=92s experiences prior
to making my own tank, so please respond here or directly to my e-mail
address with any input you may have!!! I would really appreciate any photos
or diagrams of your installation. Like I said, any help would be GREATLY
appreciated!
Thanks in advance=85.
Travis Hamblen
RV-6A @ VGT (North Las Vegas, NV)
--
Checked by AVG Anti-Virus (http://www.grisoft.com).
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | kempthornes <kempthornes(at)earthlink.net> |
At 12:59 PM 3/1/2004, you wrote:
>
>The dynon pitot is a standard pitot, with a flat spot and a hole down below
>the pitot entrance for the AOA pressure.
But, it is unheated and so not good for IFR, correct?
K. H. (Hal) Kempthorne
RV6-a N7HK - Three trips to OSH now.
PRB (El Paso de Robles, CA)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Leesafur(at)aol.com |
In a message dated 3/1/2004 8:35:10 PM Central Standard Time,
kempthornes(at)earthlink.net writes:
But, it is unheated and so not good for IFR, correct?
They have both heated and unheated.
http://www.dynonavionics.com/docs/pitotfeatures.html
Lee
Anoka, MN
RV-3 Wing
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Phil Sisson, Litchfield Aerobatic Club" <sisson(at)consolidated.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Van's vs Electric Bob's approach |
Fiveonepw(at)aol.com wrote:
>
> In a message dated 03/01/2004 2:13:48 PM Central Standard Time,
> luckymacy(at)hotmail.com writes:
>
> back to reality.
>
> There is no reality like being at 3000' agl at night and the airplane goes
> dark... not a scare tactic, just one scenario we should all give a good "what
> if?" to...
> Van's *way* seems to be
> tailorable/modifiable to some degree hence my question in the first place.
> If I can offer one insight- I am an industrial electrician with 25 years in
> the biz- not an aviation specialist, but someone who endeavors to understand
> electricity. When I took a look at Bob's crowbar circuit for overvoltage
> protection and understood the elegant simplicity and usefulness of it, it was
one of
> those epiphanal moments that told me "you might want to pay attention to this
> dude- he is way ahead of the curve"- kinda like some guy named VanGrunsven is
> way ahead of other folk making airplanes- Sam Buchanan gave the most logical
> argument I've seen yet- mine is a little more esorteric, FWIW... The system
> offered by Vans may work fine for many builders, but by following the Nuckolls
> approach, I'm confident that I not only understand everything going on in my
> system ('cept for them "little black boxes" that only the padded-cell folk
> grok) but I can competently deal with any "emergencies" I may encounter and be
> able to effectively troubleshoot anything that might go badly, but always once
> safely on terra firma.
>
> And now I'll really stir it up: Why go with a taildragger when you could
> have had the little wheel up front?
>
> (Duck and cover- here it comes!) 8-) I'm KIDDING! TO EACH THEIR OWN!!
>
> >From The PossumWorks in TN
> Mark Phillips
To save a little weight.... just like the fuses vs them old heavy circuit breakers.
tee-hee..
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Will & Lynda Allen" <linenwool(at)comcast.net> |
| Subject: | wing hole size for Van's conduit |
I'm going to go with the conduit from van's in my wings and am wondering
what size the holes need to be drilled. Also, is it a big deal if I use a
regular drill bit instead of a unibit since I'm using a drill press.. and..
well. don't want to wait until I can get to the store to get a bigger
unibit. Will I need this conduit anywhere else or should I just order the
'25 feet?
Thanks,
-Will Allen
North Bend, Wa
RV8 wings
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Eustace Bowhay" <ebowhay(at)jetstream.net> |
| Subject: | Re: which oil cooler for the angle valve 200hp engine? |
Hi Lucky:
I would recommend the Stewart Warner 9 row cooler, contact Pacific Oil
Cooler Service, Inc 1-800-866-7335 believe they have a clone of this cooler
at a good price. Also they have been in business for 45 years and can answer
all your questions. I am running two of them.
Eustace Bowhay, Blind Bay. B.C. RV 10 # 30. Emp-Tail Cone competed working
on wings.
----- Original Message -----
From: "lucky macy" <luckymacy(at)hotmail.com>
Subject: RV-List: which oil cooler for the angle valve 200hp engine?
>
> Are folks going with the stewart warner style oil cooler for this engine
> even though it doesn't specify the 200hp engine?
>
> only the positech 4215 says it's for the io-360 but it weighs twice as
much
> and appears to be smaller. Plus the *old* design had too dense a pattern
and
> didn't cool as well as the SW version. What's the scoop?
>
> Learn how to help protect your privacy and prevent fraud online at Tech
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Terri Watson" <windsaloft(at)rmisp.com> |
| Subject: | Orndorff RV-8 Wing Videos for sale |
Have the two for building the RV-8 Wing.
I think they are $41 + shipping new.
Will pass these on to the first person who will commit to and send a check
for $30, shipping via priority mail (USPS) included.
Contact info below
"Whatever you can do or dream you can, begin it.
Boldness has genius, power and magic in it."
- Goethe's Faust
Terri Watson
Winds Aloft Aviation, Inc.
windsaloft(at)rmisp.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Douglas A. Fischer" <dfischer(at)iserv.net> |
Glad to hear it. I'm just starting my wings and I'm beginning to think
about acquiring the additional stuff like heated pitot, autopilot servo,
landing lights, etc. Good to see an alternative to the other $430 rip-off
pitot.
Doug Fischer
-9A #90706 Wings
----- Original Message -----
From: <EricHe(at)FlexSolPackaging.com>
Subject: RV-List: Dynon Pitot
>
>
> I'm getting ready to order my Dynon, I specifically asked them this last
week. Their reply was, a pitot is a pitot. They also said it was built to
fit the standard (Gretz) mount. Can't answer anything about AOA, LRI,
functions. Don't know, Don't care.
>
>
> >Unfortunately, the Dynon website says the pitot will only work with their
> >EFIS-D10. It sounds like if you want their pitot for anything else
you're
> >out of luck. Anybody know for certain?
> >
> >Doug Fischer
> >RV-9A 90706 Wings
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Sam Buchanan <sbuc(at)hiwaay.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Van's vs Electric Bob's approach |
Dave Bristol wrote:
>
>
> Sam Buchanan wrote:
>
>
>> ...If you try to implement the dual bus system without
>> understanding the reasons for it, it will make absolutely no sense
>> and you will have no idea how to properly use it or troubleshoot.
>>
>>
>
> Guys,
>
> Just be sure that you REALLY understand this system because when you
> land in the middle of North Dakota with an electrical problem YOU are
> going to be the expert - the mechanic on duty at the FBO isn't going
> to know squat about it. And of course there's the poor shmuck that
> you sell it to later on....
>
> Dave RV6 So Cal EAA Technical Counselor
Well, we seem to have dropped back into old school thought mode again.
There is no reason for the local mechanic (or the pilot) to panic when
you land with "an electrical problem". If an electrical glitch occurs,
it will be associated with a component in the avionics or the charging
system, not the dual bus wiring architecture itself. For the mechanic,
troubleshooting is no different than a spam can; find where the wire
shorted against the airframe, fix it and put in a new fuse.
The only components unique to "Lectric Bob's system is a diode between
the buses and his over voltage module. The more elaborate systems will
have an extra battery and couple of extra contactors. But the system
itself is bulletproof, otherwise there would be no rationale for
adopting it. Most of the system is the usual stuff, just wired together
in a different scheme than "normal". But a blown fuse is a blown fuse
regardless of what kind of wiring system the plane has and is diagnosed
in the same old manner.
And all of us carry a wiring schematic in our plane......don't we?
Sam Buchanan
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Joe Proctor" <pjoe2(at)qwest.net> |
| Subject: | Builders Manual + 21 years of the RV-ator |
Hay List
I have the Builders Manual for the RV 9/9A + 21 years of the RV-ator for SALE -
Best Offer + Shipping.
Joe Proctor pjoe2(at)qwest.net
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | linn walters <lwalters2(at)cfl.rr.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Van's vs Electric Bob's approach |
Sam Buchanan wrote:
>Well, we seem to have dropped back into old school thought mode again.
>There is no reason for the local mechanic (or the pilot) to panic when
>you land with "an electrical problem". If an electrical glitch occurs,
>it will be associated with a component in the avionics or the charging
>system, not the dual bus wiring architecture itself. For the mechanic,
>troubleshooting is no different than a spam can; find where the wire
>shorted against the airframe, fix it and put in a new fuse.
>
>The only components unique to "Lectric Bob's system is a diode between
>the buses and his over voltage module. The more elaborate systems will
>have an extra battery and couple of extra contactors. But the system
>itself is bulletproof, otherwise there would be no rationale for
>adopting it. Most of the system is the usual stuff, just wired together
>in a different scheme than "normal". But a blown fuse is a blown fuse
>regardless of what kind of wiring system the plane has and is diagnosed
>in the same old manner.
>
>And all of us carry a wiring schematic in our plane......don't we?
>
>Sam Buchanan
>
I agree with Sam ..... to a point. I find most of the A&Ps lacking in
electrical knowledge. They're in the same boat as car mechanics that
don't understand computer controlled stuff. I can't count the number of
A&Ps that I've helped troubleshoot a charging system failure. But then
electricity and electronics is MY strong point. Faced with a radically
different electrical system (What's that other battery do?) most A&Ps
will probably shy away from working on it ..... or will spend your money
as they try to figure it out. Almost all their electrical knowledge
above the basics is gained from OJT, and the systems in the Certificated
aircraft are almost identical, and that makes troubleshooting a lot
easier for them. Bottom line is that the builder (if possible) will
probably do most of the troubleshooting.
I'm not denigrating the A&Ps out there .... they work their butt off for
a paycheck that's far from making them rich. My hat's off to them for
the work they do.
The comment was made about the poor sucker that buys your dual buss
electrical system ..... be nice to them (and yourself while you
troubleshoot your own problems ..... and at least make a wire list.
Drawing really good schematics is an art-form in itself and very time
consuming .... and a wire list is the second best thing you can have.
Numbering wiring is really time consuming too, but a couple of swipes
with a few different color magic markers can really help. Make up your
own code or use the resister code. All kinds of options!!
Linn
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Jason Sneed <n242ds(at)cox.net> |
Here are my pics from the i39 fly in if anyone is interested. Hope this
works, first time I have used this program. I think the link is this:
http://www.highland-parks.com/i39%20flyin/
if not then try:
http://www.highland-parks.com/i39 flyin/
Jason Sneed
Commercial Lending Officer
First National Bank and Trust
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | David Aronson <aronsond(at)pacbell.net> |
| Subject: | Weight/balance program |
hey listers:
I have looked in the archives but can't find weight and balance program. Anyone
with a program I would appreciate it.
Dave Aronson
RV4 N504RV
FINALLY FINISHED<) inspection Saturday
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | David Aronson <aronsond(at)pacbell.net> |
| Subject: | Re: VM 1000 & Single Drive Dual Mag (DLN 3000) |
Call VM and they will send you a diagram. The sensor is glued to the outside of
the case at a specific position. i followed their directions and it works perfectly.
Dave Aronson
RV4 N504RV
Esten Spears wrote:
Has anyone installed a VM 1000 Engine Monitor with a Single Drive Dual Mag? If
So; What Tach Sensor did you use and where and how did you mount it??????
The instructions call for it to be placed in the gear inspection port where it
picks up the passing gear teeth. The single drive dual mag has such ports but
it uses nylon gears so I don't think the sensor would see anything.
Any help would be appreciated!
Esten Spears, RV8A, 80922, N922ES (reserved), Leeward Air Ranch, Ocala, FL
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Jeff Point <jpoint(at)mindspring.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Weight/balance program |
Bill Vondane's site:
http://www.vondane.com/rv8a/downloads/index.htm
You will have to modify the stations for the 4, but no big deal.
Congrats on your inspection. Mine's on saturday also.
Jeff Point
RV-6 getting reeeaaallllyyy close
Milwaukee WI
David Aronson wrote:
>
>hey listers:
>I have looked in the archives but can't find weight and balance program. Anyone
with a program I would appreciate it.
>Dave Aronson
>RV4 N504RV
>FINALLY FINISHED<) inspection Saturday
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Rob McAnally" <mcarob(at)tpg.com.au> |
| Subject: | Alternator Warning Light Circuit |
Hi,
Does anyone have a circuit to suit the following request.
I want to install an alternator warning light similar to auto installations. i.e.
light illuminates when the master switch is on and the engine is not running,
but goes out as soon as the alternator provides greater than the battery voltage
back to the system.
I have stock Vans equipment, a 35amp Nippondenso alternator and an adjustable regulator
(case to ground, voltage in, centre stud voltage to the alternator).
I have a couple of circuits that are a little confusing and wonder if anyone has
ideas for this equipment.
Regards
Rob
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Jim Sears <sears(at)searnet.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Van's vs Electric Bob's approach |
> There is no reality like being at 3000' agl at night and the airplane goes
> dark... not a scare tactic, just one scenario we should all give a good
"what
> if?" to...
Uh, I believe that's why we're supposed to carry a good flashlight, or two.
:-)
I have some of Bob's ideas in Scooter.
I have blade fuses when others were telling me I really needed those neat
curcuit breakers. After having flown for a few years, I'd realized that
electrical failures were rare and could be handled on the ground more
easily; so, I went the the fuses. I've only had one fuse location to fail
since I started flying mine in '99. For some reason, the starter contactor
fuse popped a couple of times. I figured it was a little spike I hadn't
accounted for. Each time, I increased the amperage a little because I was
using fast blow fuses from the local auto parts store. Now, I have no fuses
failing. Going with fuses saved me a lot of money; and, I don't have to
worry about fuses going bad over time. I can't help but believe that
breakers can do that.
I used his OV protection on mine because I had one on the Cheetah. Nice
device that can save you money. It's even better when it's one that doesn't
destroy itself in the process of protecting the system. The Cheetah's had
to be replaced when it did its job when I had a bad voltage regulator.
I used Bob's ground point and grounded almost everything at that point to
prevent ground loops. I think the only thing I did not ground there were
the lights. I must admit I used a tad more wiring to do that; but, I don't
have those funny noises I read that others have had.
I do not have the essential buss system and extra battery because I don't
fly IFR. I can cut everything off to get home. So far, I'm satisfied that
my system is not overly complicated and works just fine.
Jim Sears in KY
RV-6A N198JS (Scooter)
EAA Tech Counseor
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Donald Mei" <don_mei(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | Electric Bob Weekend Class This Week in Groton, CT |
Sorry for the blatant ad copy, but our EAA chapter is hosting Electric Bob
this weekend in Groton, CT and I thought now might be a good time for
another pitch.
You can sign up for the 2 day class at his web site:
www.aeroelectric.com
Cost is I THINK $150 and that includes his book.
If you'd like to attend but are worried about a place to stay, give me a
call. (860-625-7853) We'll find something cheap, or free (my house, pending
my wife's approval) for you.
Best regards,
Don Mei
Vice President EAA 334
RV-4
3B9 - Chester, CT
"All of us need to be reminded that the federal government did not create
the states; the states created the federal government!"---Ronald Reagan
Find things fast with the new MSN Toolbar includes FREE pop-up blocking!
http://clk.atdmt.com/AVE/go/onm00200414ave/direct/01/
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Fiveonepw(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Alternator Warning Light Circuit |
Hi Rob-
Take a look at these: http://www.aeroelectric.com/Catalog/AEC/9005/9005.html
You can get 'em from: http://www.aeroelectric.com/Catalog/AECcatalog.html
The -201 model is for single battery/14 volt systems. A very talented little
piece of circuitry...
Mark
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Larry Bowen" <Larry(at)bowenaero.com> |
| Subject: | Baffle/cooler problem |
I have an oil cooler dilemma. The cutout I made on the rear baffle is
1/4" too low, allowing the middle mounting bolt on the inboard side to
interfere with the cylinder head cooling fins. This is on an O-360 with
a Aero-Classics cooler.
See here:
http://bowenaero.com/pix/lowcooler.jpg
Possible fixes:
1. Replace/reconstruct all baffling for that corner, next time raising
the cooler 1/4". (sigh)
2. Use only one bolt (the upper one) on the inboard side.
3. Use short bolt with head fwd in middle hole. Might clear
cylinder....
4. Relieve cylinder head cooling fins as needed to clear bolt/nutplate.
(cringe)
5. Other
Ideas? Thoughts?
Thanks,
-
Larry Bowen
Larry(at)BowenAero.com
http://BowenAero.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Vincent Welch" <welchvincent(at)hotmail.com> |
The majority of the toggle switches that I purchased came without
anti-rotation washers. I have looked in several catalogs (Newark, etc.) and
can not find them listed separately. Can one of you guys tell me where I
can buy anti-rotation washers separately?
Vince Welch
Find things fast with the new MSN Toolbar includes FREE pop-up blocking!
http://clk.atdmt.com/AVE/go/onm00200414ave/direct/01/
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Bruce Gray" <Bruce(at)glasair.org> |
Gosh, don't sweat it. Mount the switch and just put a dab of RTV on the
side.
Bruce
www.glasair.org
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Vincent Welch
Subject: RV-List: Toggle Switches
The majority of the toggle switches that I purchased came without
anti-rotation washers. I have looked in several catalogs (Newark, etc.)
and
can not find them listed separately. Can one of you guys tell me where
I
can buy anti-rotation washers separately?
Vince Welch
Find things fast with the new MSN Toolbar includes FREE pop-up
blocking!
http://clk.atdmt.com/AVE/go/onm00200414ave/direct/01/
=
=
=
=
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Pat Hatch" <pat_hatch(at)msn.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Baffle/cooler problem |
Larry,
Why can't you just drill new holes in the oil cooler flanges, 1/4" or so
higher than the middle hole is now? That's what I did, for different
reasons, see:
http://home.bellsouth.net/p/s/community.dll?ep=87&subpageid=133566&ck
Pat Hatch
RV-4
RV-6
RV-7 QB (Building)
Vero Beach, FL
----- Original Message -----
From: "Larry Bowen" <Larry(at)bowenaero.com>
Subject: RV-List: Baffle/cooler problem
>
> I have an oil cooler dilemma. The cutout I made on the rear baffle is
> 1/4" too low, allowing the middle mounting bolt on the inboard side to
> interfere with the cylinder head cooling fins. This is on an O-360 with
> a Aero-Classics cooler.
>
> See here:
> http://bowenaero.com/pix/lowcooler.jpg
>
> Possible fixes:
>
> 1. Replace/reconstruct all baffling for that corner, next time raising
> the cooler 1/4". (sigh)
>
> 2. Use only one bolt (the upper one) on the inboard side.
>
> 3. Use short bolt with head fwd in middle hole. Might clear
> cylinder....
>
> 4. Relieve cylinder head cooling fins as needed to clear bolt/nutplate.
> (cringe)
>
> 5. Other
>
> Ideas? Thoughts?
>
> Thanks,
>
> -
> Larry Bowen
> Larry(at)BowenAero.com
> http://BowenAero.com
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Dan Checkoway" <dan(at)rvproject.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Toggle Switches |
B&C sells 'em internal-tooth toggle switch lock washers as S700LW. You may
have to call the order in, since I don't think they're on the online
catalog.
http://www.bandc.biz
)_( Dan
RV-7 N714D
http://www.rvproject.com
----- Original Message -----
From: "Vincent Welch" <welchvincent(at)hotmail.com>
Subject: RV-List: Toggle Switches
>
> The majority of the toggle switches that I purchased came without
> anti-rotation washers. I have looked in several catalogs (Newark, etc.)
and
> can not find them listed separately. Can one of you guys tell me where I
> can buy anti-rotation washers separately?
>
> Vince Welch
>
> Find things fast with the new MSN Toolbar includes FREE pop-up blocking!
> http://clk.atdmt.com/AVE/go/onm00200414ave/direct/01/
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Dan Checkoway" <dan(at)rvproject.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Cowl Inlet Ramps |
Tommy,
Nobody's responded to this yet, so I'll take a stab...what I ended up doing
is this:
http://rvproject.com/images/2004/20040113_glassed_cowl_duct_sides.jpg
http://rvproject.com/images/2004/20040118_top_cowl_inlets.jpg
I glassed in the outboard gaps, and on the inboard edges of the ramps I
glassed it so it kind of tapers up and forward. It's not perfect, but it's
slightly better than it would have been without these mods.
)_( Dan
RV-7 N714D
http://www.rvproject.com
----- Original Message -----
From: "Tommy Walker" <twsurveyor(at)msn.com>
Subject: RV-List: Cowl Inlet Ramps
>
> While installing the baffle seal on my 6A, I realized that the upper cowl
inlet ramps present somewhat of a problem!? I don't know if I need to trim
the baffle metal to match the ramp contour or the cowl contour.
>
> If I trim metal to the ramp contour and let the rubber seal follow the
ramp it creates a huge air leak between the ramp and the cowl, which could
be stopped by fiber glassing the inboard ends of the ramp to the cowl. If I
elect to trim the metal to the cowl contour there will be a conflict between
the rubber seal and the edge of the ramp.
>
> Those of you that have been down this road will know what I'm talking
about. Question is how did you solve this problem on your baffle?? Any
suggestions welcome!
>
> Tommy Walker
> 6A Ridgetop, TN
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Cy Galley" <cgalley(at)QCBC.ORG> |
| Subject: | Re: Baffle/cooler problem |
One thought would be to rivet a re-enforcement around the hole and then
install a nutplate upside down thru the hole. When the bolt threads on your
tightened bolt show thru on the cylinder side, you are good to go!
Cy Galley, TC - Chair, Emergency Aircraft Repair, Oshkosh
Editor, EAA Safety Programs
cgalley(at)qcbc.org or sportpilot(at)eaa.org
Always looking for articles for Sport Pilot
----- Original Message -----
February 25, 2004 - March 02, 2004
RV-Archive.digest.vol-oy