RV-Archive.digest.vol-oz
March 02, 2004 - March 07, 2004
| From: | "Larry Bowen" <Larry(at)bowenaero.com> |
| Subject: | Baffle/cooler problem |
>
> I have an oil cooler dilemma. The cutout I made on the rear baffle is
> 1/4" too low, allowing the middle mounting bolt on the inboard side to
> interfere with the cylinder head cooling fins. This is on an O-360 with
> a Aero-Classics cooler.
>
> See here:
> http://bowenaero.com/pix/lowcooler.jpg
>
> Possible fixes:
>
> 1. Replace/reconstruct all baffling for that corner, next time raising
> the cooler 1/4". (sigh)
>
> 2. Use only one bolt (the upper one) on the inboard side.
>
> 3. Use short bolt with head fwd in middle hole. Might clear
> cylinder....
>
> 4. Relieve cylinder head cooling fins as needed to clear bolt/nutplate.
> (cringe)
>
> 5. Other
>
> Ideas? Thoughts?
>
> Thanks,
>
> -
> Larry Bowen
> Larry(at)BowenAero.com
> http://BowenAero.com
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Dan Checkoway" <dan(at)rvproject.com> |
| Subject: | tip-up canopy strut brace |
A while back I remember seeing somebody had a simple, elegant way to keep
the tip-up canopy propped up (pretty sure it was on an RV-6). It was
something that slipped over the shaft of the gas strut when the canopy was
open, preventing the canopy from coming down inadvertently.
Anybody out there know whaddamean? Was it just a piece of aluminum tubing?
I forget!
)_( Dan
RV-7 N714D
http://www.rvproject.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "David Carter" <dcarter(at)datarecall.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Weight/balance program |
Here are two wt&bal websites I've collected. I use the first one. Haven't
tried the 2nd.
http://www.mrkent.com/flying/wt-bal/login.asp
http://www.florintsev.com/wb/
David Carter
----- Original Message -----
From: "David Aronson" <aronsond(at)pacbell.net>
Subject: RV-List: Weight/balance program
>
> hey listers:
> I have looked in the archives but can't find weight and balance program.
Anyone with a program I would appreciate it.
> Dave Aronson
> RV4 N504RV
> FINALLY FINISHED<) inspection Saturday
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | kempthornes <kempthornes(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Van's vs Electric Bob's approach |
At 05:32 PM 3/1/2004, you wrote:
>Just be sure that you REALLY understand this system because when you land
>in the middle of North Dakota with an electrical problem YOU are going to
>be the expert - the mechanic on duty at the FBO isn't going to know squat
>about it.
My experience with mechanics and electrical problems is limited to two
incidents, one where a very young mechanic needed a little help
understanding alternators and regulators and the other, a very senior IA
said we'd have to remove the alternator and send it in. I gave a gentle
tug to the field lead and it fell off. Reconnect and problem fixed. He
still charged me for half an hour! He may have muttered, "Darn, another
alternator sale lost!"
My Debonair is mysterious enough but it does have a wiring diagram. (What
are those battery cable going to the panel?)
Finally, if you think Bob's systems are difficult, stay well away from
modern automobiles!
K. H. (Hal) Kempthorne
RV6-a N7HK - Three trips to OSH now.
PRB (El Paso de Robles, CA)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Brian Denk" <akroguy(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | Baffle/cooler problem |
>I have an oil cooler dilemma. The cutout I made on the rear baffle is
>1/4" too low, allowing the middle mounting bolt on the inboard side to
>interfere with the cylinder head cooling fins. This is on an O-360 with
>a Aero-Classics cooler.
>
>See here:
>http://bowenaero.com/pix/lowcooler.jpg
>
>Possible fixes:
>
>1. Replace/reconstruct all baffling for that corner, next time raising
>the cooler 1/4". (sigh)
>
>2. Use only one bolt (the upper one) on the inboard side.
>
>3. Use short bolt with head fwd in middle hole. Might clear
>cylinder....
>
>4. Relieve cylinder head cooling fins as needed to clear bolt/nutplate.
>(cringe)
>
>5. Other
>
>Ideas? Thoughts?
>
>Thanks,
>
>-
>Larry Bowen
Use flush screw and dimple/countersink as needed. No more interference with
cooling fins.
Brian Denk
RV8 N94BD
RV10 '51
Frustrated with dial-up? Lightning-fast Internet access for as low as
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Sam Buchanan <sbuc(at)hiwaay.net> |
| Subject: | Re: tip-up canopy strut brace |
Dan Checkoway wrote:
>
> A while back I remember seeing somebody had a simple, elegant way to keep
> the tip-up canopy propped up (pretty sure it was on an RV-6). It was
> something that slipped over the shaft of the gas strut when the canopy was
> open, preventing the canopy from coming down inadvertently.
>
> Anybody out there know whaddamean? Was it just a piece of aluminum tubing?
> I forget!
>
> )_( Dan
> RV-7 N714D
> http://www.rvproject.com
Dan, slit a couple of lengths of rubber fuel hose and slip them over the
strut shafts. Works like a charm.
Sam Buchanan
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Darwin N. Barrie" <ktlkrn(at)cox.net> |
| Subject: | Re: tip-up canopy strut brace |
Hi Dan,
Go to your local hardware store and look at the screen door mechanisms.
(Like our struts). There is a simple locking device that can be fabricated
that will lock them in the up position. It simply slides down to the
cylinder and prevents the shaft from retracting.
Darwin
----- Original Message -----
From: "Dan Checkoway" <dan(at)rvproject.com>
Subject: RV-List: tip-up canopy strut brace
>
> A while back I remember seeing somebody had a simple, elegant way to keep
> the tip-up canopy propped up (pretty sure it was on an RV-6). It was
> something that slipped over the shaft of the gas strut when the canopy was
> open, preventing the canopy from coming down inadvertently.
>
> Anybody out there know whaddamean? Was it just a piece of aluminum
tubing?
> I forget!
>
> )_( Dan
> RV-7 N714D
> http://www.rvproject.com
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Baffle/cooler problem |
In a message dated 3/2/04 6:20:31 AM Pacific Standard Time,
Larry(at)bowenaero.com writes:
<< I have an oil cooler dilemma. The cutout I made on the rear baffle is
1/4" too low, allowing the middle mounting bolt on the inboard side to
interfere with the cylinder head cooling fins. This is on an O-360 with
a Aero-Classics cooler.
>>
I had a similar problem Larry, same engine and seven row Aeroclassics, except
in my case it was the bottom bolt that interfered with the cylinder fins. I
just put the cooler on my drill press and put a new hole bolt hole through the
mounting flanges between the bottom and middle hole. Seems like it will work
fine but I'm not flying yet. I used nut plates on the forward side of the
rear baffle for the oil cooler mounting bolts. I also had to cut away aft
inboard cooler mounting flange around the middle bolt hole to clear the engine
mount, so used a short bolt just through the forward inboard hole in that
location. Hope this helps.
Harry Crosby
Pleasanton, California
RV-6, final assembly
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Warren W Hurd <warren(at)ahyup.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Weight/balance program |
Another cool program for W&B:
http://bidasst.bizland.com/rv8wbp.htm
You can set it up for a RV4 or whatever,
Then it calculates the change in W&B over the duration of the flight!
Forgot where I found it.
Warren
http://ahyup.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Matt Jurotich <mjurotich(at)hst.nasa.gov> |
| Subject: | Re: Van's vs Electric Bob's approach |
I have survived one night VFR Alternator failure in a spam can. My RV 6A
is getting the Bob's electric experience with dual alternators and a RG
battery that will give me an hour in the air if both fail. Of course it is
also getting a very good IFR panel at the same time. I bought a 300 hour
old 6 with a basic VFR panel and I no longer want to fly at night without
an IFR capable plane.
Matthew M. Jurotich
NASA/Goddard Space Flight Center
Swales contractor to the
JWST ISIM Systems Engineer
m/c : 443
e-mail mail to:
phone : 301-286-5919
fax : 301-286-7021
JWST URL: <http://ngst1.gsfc.nasa.gov
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Matt Jurotich <mjurotich(at)hst.nasa.gov> |
| Subject: | Re: Van's vs Electric Bob's approach |
Bob's system is so simple I could understand it on one read. I read it
again to make sure I was not kidding myself.
Matthew M. Jurotich
NASA/Goddard Space Flight Center
Swales contractor to the
JWST ISIM Systems Engineer
m/c : 443
e-mail mail to:
phone : 301-286-5919
fax : 301-286-7021
JWST URL: <http://ngst1.gsfc.nasa.gov
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Dan Checkoway" <dan(at)rvproject.com> |
| Subject: | tricks for keeping clean, draining preservative oil |
I'm about to drain the inhibiting/preservative oil from the engine, and I'm
curious if there are any neat tricks for keeping everything relatively clean
as the oil pours out the bottom plug holes?
)_( Dan
RV-7 N714D
http://www.rvproject.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Tom Gummo" <T.gummo(at)verizon.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Weight/balance program |
Dave,
If you have an PC type computer, try the program I wrote several years ago.
Go to:
http://www.matronics.com/enclosures.html/
Then go to August 29, 2001 (way at the bottom of the list). There you can
download a CG program. Then just run the program and it should install
itself on your computer and then have fun.
Let me know what you think. You can change any of the parameters you want.
It defaults to the numbers in Van's manuals back then. Email me directly if
you have a question.
Tom
----- Original Message -----
From: "David Aronson" <aronsond(at)pacbell.net>
Subject: RV-List: Weight/balance program
>
> hey listers:
> I have looked in the archives but can't find weight and balance program.
Anyone with a program I would appreciate it.
> Dave Aronson
> RV4 N504RV
> FINALLY FINISHED<) inspection Saturday
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "John" <n1cxo320(at)salidaco.com> |
| Subject: | Oshkosh Camping Question |
I'm not an outdoorsman but plan on flying the RV to OSH again this year and
now trying camping with it. My question is what tent (brand & type) would
you experienced RV-campers suggest? I will be alone and the tent won't be
used except for this and perhaps a few more years for RV events. Ideas?
John
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Kevin Horton <khorton01(at)rogers.com> |
>
>Their first version is unheated, but their goal is to offer a heated one,
>not sure if it is available yet.
>
>Heated should only be required for icing, not all IFR though, or am I
>misremembering that???
>
>W
I guess it depends on what part of the world you are flying in, and
what time of the year. If you are going to fly IFR you need to be
ready to fly in cloud. If you are flying in cloud above the freezing
level, you could hit icing conditions. If your airframe starts icing
up you are probably OK if you take immediate action to exit the icing
conditions. That may be a climb or a descent or a 180, depending on
the situation. If your pitot ices up, and you can descent below the
freezing level, that will probably work out OK. But if your pitot
ices up and the situation dictates a climb then it might get pretty
interesting.
You could try to rely on the met forecasts to stay below the freezing
level. But the met guys don't always get it right, and it is real
hard to stay below the freezing level but above the minimum IFR
altitude in many parts of the world for much of the year.
We are not required to follow FAR 23, but it is smart to review what
it says, as those requirements usually have their root in lessons
learned in accidents. FAR 23.1323(d) says "If certification for
instrument flight rules or flight in icing conditions is requested,
each airspeed system must have a heated pitot tube or an equivalent
means of preventing malfunction due to icing."
So, if you plan to fly IFR I highly recommend a heated pitot.
--
Kevin Horton RV-8 (finishing kit)
Ottawa, Canada
http://go.phpwebhosting.com/~khorton/rv8/
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Hopperdhh(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Dimple or countersink 904/976/922 |
Matthew,
I too called Vans about this. I was told to dimple anything up to and
including .040". I believe the spar flange there is .040. It is better to dimple
than to countersink because countersinking weakens the .040 more than dimpling
does. Dimpling makes a very strong joint, stronger than the rivet alone,
because of the interlocking of the two materials in shear. The reason for
countersinking where they say is to avoid having to countersink the floor
reinforcement angles to clear the dimples, which would leave them very thin where
the
shop heads would set.
Hope this helps,
Dan N766DH RV-7A (working on gear fairings)
In a message dated 2/29/04 1:41:46 PM US Eastern Standard Time,
matthew(at)n523rv.com writes:
>
> I'm about ready to disassemble the center section assembly but before I do,
> I need some input. The F-972 floor skin overlaps the F-976 center section
> skin which in turn sits on the flange of the 904 E&F. The plans note four
> places you should countersink the 976/904 because this is where the floor angles
> attach on the inside. This implies that you should dimple the rest. The
> flange on the 904 is pretty thick, and dimpling this plus the two skins could
> leave a not so hot mating surfaces between them all.
>
> I'm thinking I'll countersink the entire row of 976 skin/904 flange and
> dimple the 972 skin to sit inside the countersink. Is this what others did??
Am
> I missing something??
>
>
> Matthew Brandes
> Van's RV-9A (Wings)
> EAA Chapter 91 &868
> www.n523rv.com
> matthew(at)n523rv.com
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Randy Simpson <airtime(at)proaxis.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Oshkosh Camping answer |
Hi John,
Been there.
No need to get real fancy, but a basic tent (I just upgraded to a
lightweight Coleman 7'x7' dome tent since Oshkosh) for about $40.00, and
get a coleman air bed with a battery powered airpump. Having that six
inches of air floatation while sleeping makes for a good nights sleep, WAY
BETTER than those 2" pads, I've found.
Of course, you'll need a good set of Ti-downs, to hold your RV down while
parked there at Homebuilt heaven *wink*.
That's all you need to take to Osh (besides money)...tent, airbed, sleeping
bag, Ti-downs, RV...everything else is just fluff...
Sincerely
Randy Simpson
Ultralight flying, aircamping adventurer
p.s. here's a little ditty from an aircamping adventure last summer...
http://www.airtimemfg.com/greenpetereservoir/aircamping.htm
>
>I'm not an outdoorsman but plan on flying the RV to OSH again this year and
>now trying camping with it. My question is what tent (brand & type) would
>you experienced RV-campers suggest? I will be alone and the tent won't be
>used except for this and perhaps a few more years for RV events. Ideas?
>
>John
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Hopperdhh(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Van's vs Electric Bob's approach |
I strongly agree with item no. 4 of Stein Bruch's reply.
I bought the wiring kit from Van's to speed up the wiring of my RV-7A, but
found the kit to be money wasted, about half of it was, anyway. In buying the
kit, I bought a lot of heavy gauge wire (starter and battery cable) which was
not used. They sell you every length you could possibly use with terminals
installed. You will only use 4 out of the 10 heavy (4 gauge) wires they sell
you. I would say they "give" you, but you are BUYING it.
I found Van's terminal block system unnecessary because every one of the
posts only goes to a circuit breaker. Therefore, why not just wire your lights,
radio, etc., directly to the breaker and save the weight and space? That's
what I did.
The wiring kit was the first time I felt that I got a bad deal from Van's.
I'm not a complainer (usually!) so I let it pass, and just used parts from the
kit and wrote it off to experience. Maybe someone on the RV-List will benefit
from this advice. Get the documentation, then buy what you need, either from
Van's or somewhere else. Buy or borrow a heavy crimping tool for the 4 to 10
gauge wire. Definitely use aircraft quality wire and terminals. Most of the
stuff you find today in the auto parts stores is not high quality.
I had not heard of Electric Bob at the time I was wiring my plane, or I'm
sure I'd gone his route. I may redo some of it, but its done now and I want to
fly the airplane first.
Dan RV-7A N766DH (almost done in IN)
4) Very few people actually build a panel to match the kit that Van's
> sells. Many of them end up cutting up Van's Wiring kit to use the wire, in
> which case it's almost a total waste of money (ok, not total waste--just
> overpriced). If you build a panel to their specs, it works fine.
> But....Add a Dynon, autopilot, GPS, engine monitor, etc.. and you'll need a
> lot more. That being said, if you are buying the Van's kit just for the
> wire and terminals, it's way more expensive than just buying the raw
> materials themselves.
>
> Cheers,
> Stein Bruch
> RV6's, Minneapolis
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Oldsfolks(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: tricks for keeping clean,draining preservative oil |
BE SURE to put a good funnel under the drain hole prior to removing the plug
!!! Then don't drop the plug in the drain pan.
Oil won't kill you unless ,you drink it ?/!
Good luck Dan;C'mon & get flying,
Bob Olds RV-4 , N1191X
A&P , EAA Tech. Counselor
Charleston,Arkansas
Real Aviators Fly Taildraggers
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | linn walters <lwalters2(at)cfl.rr.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Oshkosh Camping Question |
John wrote:
>
>I'm not an outdoorsman but plan on flying the RV to OSH again this year and
>now trying camping with it. My question is what tent (brand & type) would
>you experienced RV-campers suggest? I will be alone and the tent won't be
>used except for this and perhaps a few more years for RV events. Ideas?
>
>John
>
Sure. By far, the best tent I've owned is a dome tent. Get a tent with
a rain fly so the tent can breathe. In cooler weather it's rather
unpleasant to roll over, hit the side of the tent and get rained on!!!
Check the height of the tent. It's always nice to be able to bend over
and pull your long pants on!!! Try and find a tent that will fit in
it's little bag and be about 18" long. The length of the pole segments
will decide how long the package is. Also, don't just buy cheap. The
better tents are worth the extra bucks.
Linn
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Dane Sheahen" <dane(at)mutualace.com> |
| Subject: | Oshkosh Camping Question |
John
As a EAA Ambassador Volunteer that camps out there every year and drives
people around in a golf cart my I suggest you decide where you are going to
camp first
Choice ONE is camp with your plane, but now you are out next to the west end
of 9-27. This can be a hike to get anywhere. There is a shuttle bus and
golf carts . Or you may be at the way south end 18-36. Advantages you are
near your plane at night
Choice TWO is to camp in Camp Scholler just to adjacent to AIRVENTURE
Buildings. Advantages are you can park your plane and show it off with the
rest of the RV's. There is a grocery store at Camp Scholler and more
showers etc. The other big advantage is you can easily get over to Dick
Martins camp sight in the woods and drink his beer. If you don't know Dick,
he is the one on the RV Flight line with an all aluminum hopped up RV8 and a
straw hat
As for camping gear get a big tent & seam seal. If the tents says its a two
man don't believe then get a four man they are not that big
E mail me for other suggestions
Dane Sheahen
RV8a 140hrs
dane(at)mutualace.com
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of John
Subject: RV-List: Oshkosh Camping Question
I'm not an outdoorsman but plan on flying the RV to OSH again this year and
now trying camping with it. My question is what tent (brand & type) would
you experienced RV-campers suggest? I will be alone and the tent won't be
used except for this and perhaps a few more years for RV events. Ideas?
John
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Clifford Begnaud" <shoeless(at)barefootpilot.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Oshkosh Camping Question |
John,
I started camping well over 40 years ago. After all these years, I can tell
you one thing; don't buy your tent at k-mart, Wal-Mart, target or any other
mass retailer. Bite the bullet and go to a bonifide outdoor shop and buy a
"QUALITY" tent. The cheap ones will leak when it rains, and they will likely
be blown down in a strong wind. If they are not blown down they will keep
you up at night when it's windy because of the poor construction and poor
fit, look for a tight fitting rain fly. A quality tent will have a lifetime
guarantee.
Also, get some heavy duty tent stakes to use at Oshkosh. Every year I see a
tent or two go flying by on a windy afternoon. I also see numerous cheap
tents that are well staked but they just get blown over and the tent poles
are usually broken.
If the price of a quality tent is too much to bear, try to find a used one.
If there is a college in your town, there's always some rich kids selling
the nice tent that mommy bought them because they used it once in their back
yard and now they need to buy some new Nike's or baggy pants (or worse).
Here's a few quality brands to look for: North Face, Marmot, Mountain
Hardware, Sierra Designs, Kelty, REI, EMS, Black Diamond, Eureka, MSR.
There's probably a few others but these will be the most common.
Avoid getting those giant size tents that are big enough to park a car in.
They are the most likely to be damaged in strong winds. A medium to low
profile tent that allows you to upright inside is best.
Bon Marche,
Cliff
> I'm not an outdoorsman but plan on flying the RV to OSH again this year
and
> now trying camping with it. My question is what tent (brand & type) would
> you experienced RV-campers suggest? I will be alone and the tent won't be
> used except for this and perhaps a few more years for RV events. Ideas?
>
> John
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Joe Hine" <joehine(at)rogers.com> |
| Subject: | Alternator Warning Light Circuit |
Hi Rob
I might have posted this once before but not sure so I'll do it again.
I have a big red idiot light wired up in my four just as you describe. It is
in my post flight shut down scan and so far it has saved me leaving the
master on a couple of times. If you look at your alternator, you will see a
terminal in the plug that indicates that it is for a light. If it you can't
find this you need to identify which terminal is for the light. The light
is wired so it illuminates from a power source when the master is turned on.
The ground side of the light is wired to the terminal on the alternator that
you have identified as the one for an idiot light. While the alternator is
not turning this terminal provides the ground for the light and it is
illuminated. Once the alternator is turning and producing power, it sends
power to this terminal and as the light now has power coming from two sides
and no ground, it goes out. If the alternator begins to fail slowly, the
terminal becomes more and more of a ground and the light begins to
illuminate, just as it does in a car. Seems to work for me, although I
haven't had the alternator quite in flight as yet. I got this explanation
how they work from an old guy in an alternator rebuild shop.
Cheers.
Joe Hine
RV4 C-FYTQ
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of Rob McAnally
Subject: RV-List: Alternator Warning Light Circuit
Hi,
Does anyone have a circuit to suit the following request.
I want to install an alternator warning light similar to auto installations.
i.e. light illuminates when the master switch is on and the engine is not
running, but goes out as soon as the alternator provides greater than the
battery voltage back to the system.
I have stock Vans equipment, a 35amp Nippondenso alternator and an
adjustable regulator (case to ground, voltage in, centre stud voltage to the
alternator).
I have a couple of circuits that are a little confusing and wonder if anyone
has ideas for this equipment.
Regards
Rob
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "thomas a. sargent" <sarg314(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | Re: tip-up canopy strut brace |
I am just aboout to install my tip-up canopy struts. I'm puzzled that
this is even necessary. The struts seem pretty stout. How can the
canopy come down inadvertently? Are you referring to slow gas leaks in
the strut or do they just not work very well?
--
Tom Sargent
>----- Original Message -----
>From: "Dan Checkoway" <dan(at)rvproject.com>
>To:
>Subject: RV-List: tip-up canopy strut brace
>
>
>A while back I remember seeing somebody had a simple, elegant way to keep
>the tip-up canopy propped up (pretty sure it was on an RV-6). It was
>something that slipped over the shaft of the gas strut when the canopy was
>open, preventing the canopy from coming down inadvertently.
>
>Anybody out there know whaddamean? Was it just a piece of aluminum
>
>
>tubing?
>
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jim Anglin" <jlanglin44(at)earthlink.net> |
"RV List" ,
"Bruce MacInnes"
| Subject: | Re: Cool oil temps cure |
Thanks Bruce - I have the E2A in my -4 - what size ball valve and where did
you get it?
To you listers - this should be self ezplanatory.
Jim
---- Original Message -----
From: "Bruce MacInnes" <m_motorsports(at)hotmail.com>
Subject: RE: Cool oil temps cure
Jim,
The cooler baffles don't work. I have a stainless steel ball valve inline to
my cooler with a push-pull cable to the panel. It is the only thing that
will get the job done on my 0-320 E2D powered RV-4. As I understand it, a
fully closed vernatherm still flows some oil, most likely to prevent oil
from congealing in the cooler. I try to open my valve (slowly) on every
flight to prevent this problem...This system has been in place for many
years, is very convenient, and is perfect on long flights (to Florida) when
the temperature changes...Feel free to post this to the RV-list. I do not
subscribe, but I do like to chec it out...Information on this can be found
in the archives.
Bruce MacInnes
Senior Instructor
The Skip Barber Racing School
860-435-4270 W
413-229-8853 H
N 14 FT - 463 TT
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "C J Heitman" <cjh(at)execpc.com> |
Vince,
Here's one source: http://pegasusautoracing.com/pdfs/048.pdf
Part No. 4428 near upper right corner of page.
Chris Heitman
RV-9A N94ME
http://my.execpc.com/~cjh/rv9a.html
-----Original Message-----
The majority of the toggle switches that I purchased came without
anti-rotation washers. I have looked in several catalogs (Newark, etc.) and
can not find them listed separately. Can one of you guys tell me where I
can buy anti-rotation washers separately?
Vince Welch
---
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Dan Checkoway" <dan(at)rvproject.com> |
| Subject: | Re: tip-up canopy strut brace |
> I am just aboout to install my tip-up canopy struts. I'm puzzled that
> this is even necessary. The struts seem pretty stout. How can the
> canopy come down inadvertently? Are you referring to slow gas leaks in
> the strut or do they just not work very well?
Am I correct in assuming you have a nosewheeler?
My theory is that enough headwind, plus the tail-on-ground attitude, would
be enough to force the canopy down and ruin my day. I just want to take
every precaution possible to keep that sucker from coming down
inadvertently.
The gas struts do seem to weaken with age, according to the reports I've
read, but I'm paranoid even with my "new" ones (~2 years since receiving
them). They're stout, and you have to pull the canopy down a fair way
before the struts give out, but I ain't takin' any chances! 8-)
)_( Dan
RV-7 N714D
http://www.rvproject.com
----- Original Message -----
From: "thomas a. sargent" <sarg314(at)earthlink.net>
Subject: Re: RV-List: tip-up canopy strut brace
>
> --
> Tom Sargent
>
> >----- Original Message -----
> >From: "Dan Checkoway" <dan(at)rvproject.com>
> >To:
> >Subject: RV-List: tip-up canopy strut brace
> >
> >
> >A while back I remember seeing somebody had a simple, elegant way to keep
> >the tip-up canopy propped up (pretty sure it was on an RV-6). It was
> >something that slipped over the shaft of the gas strut when the canopy
was
> >open, preventing the canopy from coming down inadvertently.
> >
> >Anybody out there know whaddamean? Was it just a piece of aluminum
> >
> >
> >tubing?
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Douglas A. Fischer" <dfischer(at)iserv.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Electric Bob Weekend Class This Week in Groton, CT |
The class is $150 but the book is not included. It is discounted to $20
with the class and can be shipped to your house prior to the class. I'm
signed up for the class in Kalamazoo, MI on 20-21 March 04. I hope to learn
a bunch because I'm planning a 2-screen GRT EFIS and Engine Monitor and I'm
an electrical idiot!
Doug Fischer
-9A 90706 Wings
----- Original Message -----
From: "Donald Mei" <don_mei(at)hotmail.com>
Subject: RV-List: Electric Bob Weekend Class This Week in Groton, CT
>
>
> Sorry for the blatant ad copy, but our EAA chapter is hosting Electric Bob
> this weekend in Groton, CT and I thought now might be a good time for
> another pitch.
>
> You can sign up for the 2 day class at his web site:
> www.aeroelectric.com
> Cost is I THINK $150 and that includes his book.
>
> If you'd like to attend but are worried about a place to stay, give me a
> call. (860-625-7853) We'll find something cheap, or free (my house,
pending
> my wife's approval) for you.
>
> Best regards,
>
> Don Mei
> Vice President EAA 334
> RV-4
> 3B9 - Chester, CT
>
>
> "All of us need to be reminded that the federal government did not create
> the states; the states created the federal government!"---Ronald Reagan
>
> Find things fast with the new MSN Toolbar includes FREE pop-up blocking!
> http://clk.atdmt.com/AVE/go/onm00200414ave/direct/01/
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Sam Buchanan <sbuc(at)hiwaay.net> |
| Subject: | Van's alternator |
> I had a bad experience with Van's " rebuilt" alternator.I disassenbled the end
bells
> to cut a cooling hole in it for the diodes.after it was opened, I found one broken
> diode and all leads were poorly soldered or not soldered at all. The wires had
been
> so hot , the insulation was melted back on them. The outside had been glass beaded
> but the inside was a mess. Not "rebuilt" as I had paid for. It was the 35 amp
> nipondenso. I would recommend buyers to check out their local auto supply first.
> Unfortunately a lot of stuff gets bought way in advance and the 30 day return
policy
> has long been expired when it is time to install it. I also wrote it off to
> experience.
>
> Hopefully I can buy a set of diodes for it. Has anyone ever replaced them or
know if
> they are available?
>
> Phil in Illinois
Phil, the alternator is a NipponDenso as used on 1976-1979 Honda Civic
CVCC without air conditioning. A common number you can find in Duralast
and other reman alternators is 14184. About $49.00 at Advance Auto and
Autozone. When I replaced my Vans alternator recently, I left the fan on
the 14184.
Sam Buchanan
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Strobe power supply repair |
FWIW, I had an Aeroflash strobe power supply go bad, flat rate around $45 for
repair. Works great now!
-Mike Kraus
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Bob U." <rv3(at)comcast.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Weight/balance program |
Tom Gummo wrote:
>
>Dave,
>
>If you have an PC type computer, try the program I wrote several years ago.
>Go to:
>
>http://www.matronics.com/enclosures.html/
>
>Then go to August 29, 2001 (way at the bottom of the list). There you can
>download a CG program. Then just run the program and it should install
>itself on your computer and then have fun.
>
>Let me know what you think. You can change any of the parameters you want.
>It defaults to the numbers in Van's manuals back then. Email me directly if
>you have a question.
>
>Tom
>
==================================
I've been using your program since it appeared in 2001.
It's the best.
Kudos!!!
Many thanks.
Bob
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Cy Galley" <cgalley(at)QCBC.ORG> |
| Subject: | Re: Oshkosh Camping Question |
They have just opened up a new camp ground with new show house I believe
west of the tower for home builts. Check the EAA web site. www.eaa.org
Cy Galley, TC - Chair, Emergency Aircraft Repair, Oshkosh
Editor, EAA Safety Programs
cgalley(at)qcbc.org or sportpilot(at)eaa.org
Always looking for articles for Sport Pilot
----- Original Message -----
From: "Dane Sheahen" <dane(at)mutualace.com>
Subject: RE: RV-List: Oshkosh Camping Question
>
> John
>
> As a EAA Ambassador Volunteer that camps out there every year and drives
> people around in a golf cart my I suggest you decide where you are going
to
> camp first
>
> Choice ONE is camp with your plane, but now you are out next to the west
end
> of 9-27. This can be a hike to get anywhere. There is a shuttle bus and
> golf carts . Or you may be at the way south end 18-36. Advantages you are
> near your plane at night
>
> Choice TWO is to camp in Camp Scholler just to adjacent to AIRVENTURE
> Buildings. Advantages are you can park your plane and show it off with
the
> rest of the RV's. There is a grocery store at Camp Scholler and more
> showers etc. The other big advantage is you can easily get over to Dick
> Martins camp sight in the woods and drink his beer. If you don't know
Dick,
> he is the one on the RV Flight line with an all aluminum hopped up RV8 and
a
> straw hat
>
> As for camping gear get a big tent & seam seal. If the tents says its a
two
> man don't believe then get a four man they are not that big
>
> E mail me for other suggestions
>
> Dane Sheahen
> RV8a 140hrs
> dane(at)mutualace.com
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of John
> Sent: Tuesday, March 02, 2004 3:53 PM
> To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
> Subject: RV-List: Oshkosh Camping Question
>
>
> I'm not an outdoorsman but plan on flying the RV to OSH again this year
and
> now trying camping with it. My question is what tent (brand & type) would
> you experienced RV-campers suggest? I will be alone and the tent won't be
> used except for this and perhaps a few more years for RV events. Ideas?
> John
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "" <tx_jayhawk(at)excite.com> |
All,
Currently fitting my fuel tank to my wings. I followed Dan C's method of aligning,
and I have the tank aligned perfectly (L to R). The only problem I see is
that the leading edge on the tank protrudes *slightly* more than the leading
edge on the outboards section. I would estimate the protrusion to be about the
thickness of the skin. Anyone else experience this? I did remove the plastic
already. My only thoughts might be to sand the surface of the z-brackets
down a bit. Only concern might be that's a lot of work (x7) and I am afraid I
may mess it up worse. Am I being too picky here? I thought I saw a similar
post recently but could not dig it up in the archives.
Thanks,
Scott
7A Wings
Join Excite! - http://www.excite.com
The most personalized portal on the Web!
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Brian Denk" <akroguy(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | Van's alternator |
> > Hopefully I can buy a set of diodes for it. Has anyone ever replaced
>them or know if
> > they are available?
> >
> > Phil in Illinois
>
>
>Phil, the alternator is a NipponDenso as used on 1976-1979 Honda Civic
>CVCC without air conditioning. A common number you can find in Duralast
>and other reman alternators is 14184. About $49.00 at Advance Auto and
>Autozone. When I replaced my Vans alternator recently, I left the fan on
>the 14184.
>
>Sam Buchanan
I just received a 14184 per Sam's specs from Autozone. It's a rebuild, but
appears to be very nicely done...very clean, spins smoothly, etc. I don't
plan to split the case to check diodes unless curiosity gets the best of me!
It will be kept as a spare, and if needed, the fan will stay on.
Brian Denk
RV8 N94BD
RV10 '51
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Rob W M Shipley" <rob(at)robsglass.com> |
| Subject: | Wiring the Nuckolls way or ....... |
Dave RV6 So Cal
EAA Technical Counselor
Wrote
"Guys,
Just be sure that you REALLY understand this system because when you land in the
middle of North Dakota with an electrical problem YOU are going to be the expert
- the mechanic on duty at the FBO isn't going to know squat about it. And
of course there's the poor shmuck that you sell it to later on...."
He's absolutely right. Of course with up to date wire books and well labelled
wiring a competent electrician should be well able to follow the logic of Bob's
designs. The key is the up to date wire books and the carefully labelled wires.
Rob
Rob W M Shipley
N919RV (res) Fuselage .....still!
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Rob W M Shipley" <rob(at)robsglass.com> |
Jeff wrote:
Subject: Re: Trailing edge of new rudder
"used clear RTV on the trailing edge of my elevator"
I have heard, (you know that can be, though) that RTV may corrode aluminum. Probably
the acetic acid as it cures. Something to watch. This was noted by some
people that used it to cure the oil-canning of -4 and -6 type control surfaces.
Also, keep it away from your canopy, unless it's the type approved for electronics.
Once again, just stuff from past threads on this forum. FWIW etc.
Jeff
This is quite correct and easily dealt with. Make sure that any silicone / rtv
you use on metal is the neutral cure type.
Rob
Rob W M Shipley
N919RV (res) Fuselage .....still!
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Jeff Point <jpoint(at)mindspring.com> |
| Subject: | Re: tip-up canopy strut brace |
>
>
>The gas struts do seem to weaken with age, according to the reports I've
>read, but I'm paranoid even with my "new" ones (~2 years since receiving
>them). They're stout, and you have to pull the canopy down a fair way
>before the struts give out, but I ain't takin' any chances! 8-)
>
>
Even if only one of them goes, it could cause your canopy to come
crashing down in a most disturbing way. This happened to me shortly
after finishing the canopy, due to a defective strut. Try unhooking one
of them, and see how well the other holds the canopy up. Van's replaced
it free of charge. I'm glad I didn't have to bargain with them to
replace the canopy destroyed as a result of the failed strut!
Jeff Point
RV-6 inspection this saturday
Milwaukee WI
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Phil Sisson, Litchfield Aerobatic Club" <sisson(at)consolidated.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Van's alternator |
Sam Buchanan wrote:
>
>
> > I had a bad experience with Van's " rebuilt" alternator.I disassenbled the
end bells
> > to cut a cooling hole in it for the diodes.after it was opened, I found one
broken
> > diode and all leads were poorly soldered or not soldered at all. The wires
had been
> > so hot , the insulation was melted back on them. The outside had been glass
beaded
> > but the inside was a mess. Not "rebuilt" as I had paid for. It was the 35
amp
> > nipondenso. I would recommend buyers to check out their local auto supply first.
> > Unfortunately a lot of stuff gets bought way in advance and the 30 day return
policy
> > has long been expired when it is time to install it. I also wrote it off to
> > experience.
> >
> > Hopefully I can buy a set of diodes for it. Has anyone ever replaced them or
know if
> > they are available?
> >
> > Phil in Illinois
>
> Phil, the alternator is a NipponDenso as used on 1976-1979 Honda Civic
> CVCC without air conditioning. A common number you can find in Duralast
> and other reman alternators is 14184. About $49.00 at Advance Auto and
> Autozone. When I replaced my Vans alternator recently, I left the fan on
> the 14184.
>
> Sam Buchanan
Thanks Sam, this is real good information.
PS
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | <EricHe(at)FlexSolPackaging.com> |
Hi all, don't know if this is general knowledge, but I thought this response was
good enough to share with the list. I finally bit the bullet and ordered my
Dynon and associated toys. Tony and Monte have been really great to deal with.
Would like to throw out a big thanks to Dynon just for making a good pitot tube
for a reasonable price. Every little victory adds up.
Eric
Thanks for your order, we look forward to receiving it and we'll get it processed
as soon as it's received.
The wing tip is the preferred location for the remote compass. This gets the remote
compass as far away from the panel and ferrous materials (engine, engine
mount, landing gear, etc.) as possible. If you have a strobe power supply in the
wing tip, you'll want to install the compass as far away from the box as possible
(within the wing tip). The EFIS-D10 "samples" the remote compass 64 times/second
and averages these samples. Even with the comet flash strobes, there
is only small amount of time, relative to the sampling rate, that any significant
interference can be generated by the strobe power supply. The remote compass
will sense the strobes as they discharge but the user probably won't notice
any change on the EFIS-D10 display (due to the averaging and large number of
samples taken each second). Now that you understand how the EFIS-D10 gathers
and processes compass signals, it explains why electric gyro's (being continuous
sources of interference) are the most problematic to correct.
As a side note, if you ever think you may be installing our ER Tanks, mount the
remote compass at least 1 foot behind the main spar. Then you won't have to move
it should you install ER Tanks at a later date. (The ER Tanks slide into the
first nose rib lightening hole forward of the spar)
If there's anything else Monte or I can do for you, please don't hesitate to contact
us.
Tony Munday and Monte McDavid
SafeAir1
817-821-4957 (TM)
817-939-2695 (MM)
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Mounting Instruments |
| From: | tacaruth(at)ralcorp.com |
03/03/2004 08:10:24 AM
Hi All,
I am mounting my flight instruments in the control panel. What type of
screws are the best to use? Do I need to use brass or stainless? Are
aircraft grade screws required since this is non-structural?
Thanks in advance,
Tom
RV-7A
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Gordon and Marge" <gcomfo(at)tc3net.com> |
| Subject: | I39 fly-in queries |
First, congratulations to Dana and his EAA chapter, friends and family
for an outstanding start to our flying season. Second, who are these
folks Dana mentioned from Pontiac, MI? Did you mean us, from Tecumseh,
MI, and just get your Indian chiefs confused? If there are active RV-ers
from Pontiac, not far from here by RV, we would like to know them and
perhaps get together. Thanks.
Gordon and Marge
N363GC
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Hopperdhh(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Van's alternator |
A fan is definitely necessary. My friend had the Van's 35 amp fail and take
out most of his electronics. (Another plug for Bob's buss.) I opened up the
alternator and although it still worked, it was toast. The regulator had
failed.
The reason Van's removes the fan may be that it rotates backwards for the
airplane. Check this, but even so it may be better to have it. An alternator
is
only about 50% efficient, and really depends on lots of airflow for cooling.
Dan (retired automotive engineer)
RV-7A N766DH (almost done)
In a message dated 3/2/04 10:30:59 PM US Eastern Standard Time,
sbuc(at)hiwaay.net writes:
>
> Phil, the alternator is a NipponDenso as used on 1976-1979 Honda Civic
> CVCC without air conditioning. A common number you can find in Duralast
> and other reman alternators is 14184. About $49.00 at Advance Auto and
> Autozone. When I replaced my Vans alternator recently, I left the fan on
> the 14184.
>
> Sam Buchanan
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Sam Buchanan <sbuc(at)hiwaay.net> |
| Subject: | EZ-Pilot display update |
Just wanted to update my experiences with the Trio Avionics EZ-Pilot
autopilot. I have flown the unit with the new LCD display and am
completely pleased with it. The LCD eliminates the only problem that an
RV pilot would have with the system.
I won't rehash info that is in the archives, but the EZ-Pilot is a
plug-n-play replacement for the Navaid head and has a feature set far
more advanced than the Navaid. The EZ-Pilot is also completely
solid-state and uses those cool new sensors like the other AHRS systems.
The Trio website:
http://www.trioavionics.com
My previous comments on this autopilot:
http://home.hiwaay.net/~sbuc/journal/EZ_Pilot.htm
Sam Buchanan
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Sam Buchanan <sbuc(at)hiwaay.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Van's alternator |
lucky macy wrote:
>
>
> For a new build, any mods required to make the Autozone bought one work in
> the RV in the first place? Just buy the appropriate boss or case mount
> bracket from Vans and we're set?
>
> How about the 60 Amp internally regulated version? Is there a reason folks
> don't use it more often in the first place other than it's more expensive?
> Same question about it with respect to buying it local cheaper and mount
> without modification.
The 14184 will fit perfectly in the Vans bracket. Note that Vans part
number for their alternator is........14184. :-)
Somebody pulls the fan off the Vans unit but the alternator will work
just fine with the fan in place.
As for internally regulated alternators, you might read, *ahem*, 'Lectic
Bob's discourses on this subject. The internally regulated alternators
are a bit more difficult to set up for over-voltage protection than the
externally regulated units and that is why Bob recommends the external
regulator. He has an inexpensive OV module that can be easily wired into
an external regulator circuit.
There are many internally regulated alternators on RVs without
over-voltage protection. The argument is that the things work fine on
cars, why not on our planes? It really comes down to whether or not you
want to trust your high doll$$$$$r avionics to the regulator in the
alternator.
Sam Buchanan
================
> ----Original Message Follows----
> From: "Brian Denk" <akroguy(at)hotmail.com>
> To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
> Subject: RE: RV-List: Van's alternator
> Date: Wed, 03 Mar 2004 04:26:42 +0000
>
>
>
> > > Hopefully I can buy a set of diodes for it. Has anyone ever replaced
> >them or know if
> > > they are available?
> > >
> > > Phil in Illinois
> >
> >
> >Phil, the alternator is a NipponDenso as used on 1976-1979 Honda Civic
> >CVCC without air conditioning. A common number you can find in Duralast
> >and other reman alternators is 14184. About $49.00 at Advance Auto and
> >Autozone. When I replaced my Vans alternator recently, I left the fan on
> >the 14184.
> >
> >Sam Buchanan
>
>
> I just received a 14184 per Sam's specs from Autozone. It's a rebuild, but
> appears to be very nicely done...very clean, spins smoothly, etc. I don't
> plan to split the case to check diodes unless curiosity gets the best of me!
> It will be kept as a spare, and if needed, the fan will stay on.
>
> Brian Denk
> RV8 N94BD
> RV10 '51
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Ron Walker" <ron(at)walker.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Mounting Instruments |
Page 93 of the 03/04 spruce catalog ... brass instrument screws - MS24693 is
the part. The brass construction will not interfere with the compass
readings.
Ron
----- Original Message -----
From: <tacaruth(at)ralcorp.com>
Subject: RV-List: Mounting Instruments
>
>
> Hi All,
>
> I am mounting my flight instruments in the control panel. What type of
> screws are the best to use? Do I need to use brass or stainless? Are
> aircraft grade screws required since this is non-structural?
>
> Thanks in advance,
>
> Tom
> RV-7A
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | linn walters <lwalters2(at)cfl.rr.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Mounting Instruments |
tacaruth(at)ralcorp.com wrote:
>
>
>Hi All,
>
>I am mounting my flight instruments in the control panel. What type of
>screws are the best to use? Do I need to use brass or stainless? Are
>aircraft grade screws required since this is non-structural?
>
>Thanks in advance,
>
>Tom
>RV-7A
>
Typically the instruments are mounted with black anodized brass screws.
They weigh less than steel and are non-magnetic. Aesthetically,
however, I guess it depends on the color of your instrument panel.
There are many grades of 'stainless' screws, so test with a magnet to be
sure. I wouldn't use cad-plated (aircraft) screws because of the cost.
Generally, in deciding whether to use common hardware Vs. aircraft
bolts, you need to look at the application. Aircraft bolts/screws will
bend without fracturing (and they'll bend a lot) while stuff from the
hardware store will typically fracture. Tensile strength can be fairly
equal depending on the grade of the common hardware.
Linn
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jeff Dowling" <shempdowling(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Cool oil temps cure |
Has anyone tested one of these? My oil temp is hovering around the
published opening temp of 108 C in cold weather and seems to be staying
there.
Jeff Dowling
RV-6A, N915JD
18 hours
Chicago/Louisville
----- Original Message -----
From: "Dean Pichon" <deanpichon(at)msn.com>
Subject: RE: RV-List: Cool oil temps cure
>
> Hi Jim,
>
> I have the same problem with my -4. On cold days, I cannot get the oil
> temperature above 150F -even with the downstream side of the cooler
blocked.
> I plan to block the upstream side as I have been told this is much more
> effective though much less easily done. I don't believe the Vernatherm
> valve is your problem - assuming you have one. Vernatherm valves are
> normally open, and close upon a rise in temperature. They contain a wax
> pill much like car thermostats. As the heat of the oil melts the wax, it
> expands thereby extending a piston. This piston extension blocks a hole
> that otherwise returns oil to the engine. The alternate path (Vernatherm
> extended) shunts the oil through the cooler. Even when the Vernatherm
valve
> is cold, it leaks (by design) oil through the cooler.
>
> Regarding the manual valve, I've never heard of such a system, but it
would
> probably help - assuming you were comfortable with any safety issues. I
> suggest you try blocking the upstream side of the cooler and let me know
how
> it works!
>
> Good luck,
>
> Dean
> RV-4
> Worcester, MA
> 180 Hrs
>
> >From: "Jim Anglin" <jlanglin44(at)earthlink.net>
> >Reply-To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
> >To: "RV List"
> >Subject: RV-List: Cool oil temps cure
> >Date: Mon, 1 Mar 2004 08:14:30 -0800
> >
> >
> >My -4 won't get the oil temps above 150 even with a plate blocking off
the
> >inlet. Someone told me there was an oil control valve that could be
> >installed to manually regulate the flow of oil to the cooler. I know
this
> >could be potentially dangerous but notwithstanding that does anyone know
if
> >this info is bogus and if not who would sell these valves?
> >
> >Jim
> >
> >
>
> Learn how to help protect your privacy and prevent fraud online at Tech
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Hopperdhh(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Need name of engine shop |
Listers,
What was the name of the engine shop in Oklahoma mentioned recently on the
list? I couldn't find it in the archives.
Thanks,
Dan RV-7A (almost done)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Ernest Kells" <ernest.kells(at)sympatico.ca> |
| Subject: | Re: Mounting Instruments |
> >I am mounting my flight instruments in the control panel. What type of
> >screws are the best to use? Do I need to use brass or stainless? Are
> >aircraft grade screws required since this is non-structural?
I painted my panel in medium gray (not so reflective in sunlight). The black
brass instrument screws (Page 93 of ACS) look really neat in the panel. I
chose the pan head MS35214 screws. For the six big holes I used nut rings
(Vans Catalogue and Page 342 of ACS). They allow you to install and remove
those instruments from the front. The screws match the above pan head
screws used everywhere else. Cool.
Ernest Kells - RV-9A O235-N2C, Wood Prop
90% Complete - electrical and pre-paint
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Ted Gauthier" <TGauthier(at)comcast.net> |
RV's in Michigan,
My plan was to attend the RV event in Kentucky however I did not make
it. I am sorry that I did not attend, I heard it was a really great
time. Yes, I am from Pontiac, Mi. We have at least 6 RV's based here
and at least another dozen builders and flying RV's in the area. Great
group of guys, just give us a call, we also welcome new friends.
Ted Gauthier, RV-6 125hours
DAR
Pontiac, Mich.
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Gordon and
Marge
Subject: RV-List: I39 fly-in queries
First, congratulations to Dana and his EAA chapter, friends and family
for an outstanding start to our flying season. Second, who are these
folks Dana mentioned from Pontiac, MI? Did you mean us, from Tecumseh,
MI, and just get your Indian chiefs confused? If there are active RV-ers
from Pontiac, not far from here by RV, we would like to know them and
perhaps get together. Thanks.
Gordon and Marge
N363GC
=
=
=
=
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | <klwerner(at)comcast.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Need name of engine shop |
Are you looking for DIVCO in Tulsa (1-800-874-1351)?
----- Original Message -----
From: Hopperdhh(at)aol.com
To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
Sent: Wednesday, March 03, 2004 9:30 AM
Subject: RV-List: Need name of engine shop
Listers,
What was the name of the engine shop in Oklahoma mentioned recently on the
list? I couldn't find it in the archives.
Thanks,
Dan RV-7A (almost done)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Jerry2DT(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Airworthiness Inspection |
Group...
Had an opportunity to observe airworthiness inspection yesterday. My
advice... if you get a chance to watch one, do it. You will learn a heap of stuff.
I
took away from this that before your "final", you should tear that baby down
and do a formal "condition inspection" yourself, using the checklist and paying
a LOT of attention to tiny details, like proper safety wire, anti chafing,
nuts, bolts, washers. The inspector in this case, Mike Robertson, was beyond
thorough, and I got a new appreciation for the work these guys do.
Jerry Cochran
RV6a...flying one, building one.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Albert Gardner" <spudnut(at)worldnet.att.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Mounting Instruments |
ACS also sells an Instrument Mounting Nut (pg 86) that attach a nut on the
back of each mounting hole of an instrument. These nuts stay with the
instrument and make installation easy. The nuts come in different lengths
for use with instrument that different thicknesses. They are non-magnetic
and take 6-32 machine screws.
Albert Gardner
RV-9A 872RV
Yuma, AZ
----- Original Message -----
From: "Ernest Kells" <ernest.kells(at)sympatico.ca>
Subject: Re: RV-List: Mounting Instruments
>
> > >I am mounting my flight instruments in the control panel. What type of
> > >screws are the best to use? Do I need to use brass or stainless? Are
> > >aircraft grade screws required since this is non-structural?
>
> I painted my panel in medium gray (not so reflective in sunlight). The
black
> brass instrument screws (Page 93 of ACS) look really neat in the panel. I
> chose the pan head MS35214 screws. For the six big holes I used nut rings
> (Vans Catalogue and Page 342 of ACS). They allow you to install and
remove
> those instruments from the front. The screws match the above pan head
> screws used everywhere else. Cool.
> Ernest Kells - RV-9A O235-N2C, Wood Prop
> 90% Complete - electrical and pre-paint
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "lucky macy" <luckymacy(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Need name of engine shop |
they do case work only.
----Original Message Follows----
From: <klwerner(at)comcast.net>
Subject: Re: RV-List: Need name of engine shop
Date: Wed, 3 Mar 2004 10:36:04 -0700
Are you looking for DIVCO in Tulsa (1-800-874-1351)?
----- Original Message -----
From: Hopperdhh(at)aol.com
To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
Sent: Wednesday, March 03, 2004 9:30 AM
Subject: RV-List: Need name of engine shop
Listers,
What was the name of the engine shop in Oklahoma mentioned recently on
the
list? I couldn't find it in the archives.
Thanks,
Dan RV-7A (almost done)
Learn how to help protect your privacy and prevent fraud online at Tech
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Ross Mickey" <rmickey(at)ix.netcom.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Airworthiness Inspection |
Mike did mine and required a condition inspection be done with the
appropriate checklist prior to him doing the inspection.
Ross
N9PT
----- Original Message -----
From: <Jerry2DT(at)aol.com>
Subject: RV-List: Airworthiness Inspection
>
> Group...
>
> Had an opportunity to observe airworthiness inspection yesterday. My
> advice... if you get a chance to watch one, do it. You will learn a heap
of stuff. I
> took away from this that before your "final", you should tear that baby
down
> and do a formal "condition inspection" yourself, using the checklist and
paying
> a LOT of attention to tiny details, like proper safety wire, anti chafing,
> nuts, bolts, washers. The inspector in this case, Mike Robertson, was
beyond
> thorough, and I got a new appreciation for the work these guys do.
>
> Jerry Cochran
> RV6a...flying one, building one.
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Hopperdhh(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Need name of engine shop |
Thanks for the replies.
I was wanting to know good places to send out parts for overhaul.
Crankcase: Divco
Crankshaft, Connecting rods, Camshaft, Lifters: ???
Cylinders: ???
Where/Who are the preferred shops for someone who does their own assembly?
Thanks, Dan
RV-7A N766DH (almost done)
Working on a spare engine!
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Van's alternator - $18 at Pep boys |
For grins, I called up Pep Boys. Part number 14184, from an civic years 76 - 79
without AC is $18.00. The same alternator for the airconditioned version can
be had for 34.99.
This is a remanufactured one but the guy swears it's with new parts even at that
price :-).
The only "catch" is that the name NipponDenso was nowhere to be found but Pro Start
and Bosch were the names associated with it in the lookup.
What do you guys think? Someone already have to scoop on this?
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Stein Bruch" <stein(at)steinair.com> |
"Rv8-List" , "Rv9-List" ,
"Rv-List"
| Subject: | Quick Fit Tabs for Ground Blocks |
Hi Guys,
Just a quick update. Awhile back people were looking for the ground block
tabs separate from fuse blocks and pre-made ground blocks.
I now have several hundred in stock. They have 10 tabs, (2 double rows of
5), are the 1/4 faston, with holes for mounting to a brass bar, bulkhead,
etc..
Basically, you can "roll your own" ground blocks now, and it's much cheaper
than buying one already made. I thought about making ground blocks, but it's
easier just to sell the tabs, and let the builder make their own if they
like.
They are listed under "Accessories" on my website. Also, under switches
you'll see some new Vinyl Toggle switch boots in 6 colors. They really dress
up the switches nice!
Last thing.....I now have all the 4 conductor shielded wire in stock for the
Dynon Harnesses, and all harnesses/kits from this point forward will be
delivered with Shielded wire as standard.
Happy building and have a great day.
Cheers,
Stein Bruch
http://www.steinair.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "BRUCE GRAY" <brucerv84us(at)hotmail.com> |
Ted, I know this would be a good cross country flight for you guys up there
but myself and Chapter 403 have put together RV APPRECIATION DAY, a fly-in
that will be held Apr. 30th through May 2nd at the Carson City, NV. Airport.
We have additional information on the fly-in on VansAircaft web sight.
vansaircraft.com under Fly-in Schedule. Check it out if you guys are
interested and weather permits. Thak you, Bruce
>From: "Ted Gauthier" <TGauthier(at)comcast.net>
>Reply-To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
>To:
>Subject: RE: RV-List: Michigan RV's
>Date: Wed, 3 Mar 2004 12:15:24 -0500
>
>
>RV's in Michigan,
>
>My plan was to attend the RV event in Kentucky however I did not make
>it. I am sorry that I did not attend, I heard it was a really great
>time. Yes, I am from Pontiac, Mi. We have at least 6 RV's based here
>and at least another dozen builders and flying RV's in the area. Great
>group of guys, just give us a call, we also welcome new friends.
>
>Ted Gauthier, RV-6 125hours
>DAR
>Pontiac, Mich.
>
>
>-----Original Message-----
>From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
>[mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Gordon and
>Marge
>To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
>Subject: RV-List: I39 fly-in queries
>
>
>First, congratulations to Dana and his EAA chapter, friends and family
>for an outstanding start to our flying season. Second, who are these
>folks Dana mentioned from Pontiac, MI? Did you mean us, from Tecumseh,
>MI, and just get your Indian chiefs confused? If there are active RV-ers
>from Pontiac, not far from here by RV, we would like to know them and
>perhaps get together. Thanks.
>
>Gordon and Marge
>N363GC
>
>
>=
>=
>=
>=
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Matt Jurotich <mjurotich(at)hst.nasa.gov> |
| Subject: | Re: Van's vs Electric Bob's approach |
No vacuum pump or instruments, therefore reasonable prudence says an all
electric IFR panel should have two independent sources of power. B&C sells
two nice vacuum pump pad alternator.
Matthew M. Jurotich
NASA/Goddard Space Flight Center
Swales contractor to the
JWST ISIM Systems Engineer
m/c : 443
e-mail mail to:
phone : 301-286-5919
fax : 301-286-7021
JWST URL: <http://ngst1.gsfc.nasa.gov
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | <klwerner(at)comcast.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Need name of engine shop |
How about:
Crankcase:
DIVCO / Tulsa, OK
Crankshaft, Connecting rods, Camshaft, Lifters:
AIRCRAFT SPECIALTIES / Tulsa, OK
Cylinders:
GIBSON AIRCRAFT / El Reno, OK
(Or ECI, SUPERIOR)
----- Original Message -----
From: Hopperdhh(at)aol.com
To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
Sent: Wednesday, March 03, 2004 12:02 PM
Subject: Re: RV-List: Need name of engine shop
Thanks for the replies.
I was wanting to know good places to send out parts for overhaul.
Crankcase: Divco
Crankshaft, Connecting rods, Camshaft, Lifters: ???
Cylinders: ???
Where/Who are the preferred shops for someone who does their own assembly?
Thanks, Dan
RV-7A N766DH (almost done)
Working on a spare engine!
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | linn walters <lwalters2(at)cfl.rr.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Need name of engine shop |
Hopperdhh(at)aol.com wrote:
>
>Thanks for the replies.
>
>I was wanting to know good places to send out parts for overhaul.
>
> Crankcase: Divco
> Crankshaft, Connecting rods, Camshaft, Lifters: ???
>
D&S Camcorp (386) 426-0670
> Cylinders: ???
>
D&S engines used to do mine, but they're out of the cylinder business now.
Linn
>Where/Who are the preferred shops for someone who does their own assembly?
>
>Thanks, Dan
>RV-7A N766DH (almost done)
>Working on a spare engine!
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Sam Buchanan <sbuc(at)hiwaay.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Van's alternator - $18 at Pep boys |
RV8ter(at)aol.com wrote:
>
>
> For grins, I called up Pep Boys. Part number 14184, from an civic years 76 -
79 without AC is $18.00. The same alternator for the airconditioned version
can be had for 34.99.
>
> This is a remanufactured one but the guy swears it's with new parts even at that
price :-).
>
> The only "catch" is that the name NipponDenso was nowhere to be found but Pro
Start and Bosch were the names associated with it in the lookup.
>
> What do you guys think? Someone already have to scoop on this?
I looked on the Advance Auto Parts site and there are several
alternators listed for the 1977 Honda Civic CVCC, and not all of them
are 14184. You might want to compare the $18.00 unit to a 14184 to make
sure it is the same alternator. There are scores of alternators that can
be used on our planes (after all, they only have to charge the battery),
but the 14184 is small and externally regulated making it suitable for
our use.
The Nippon brand wasn't on the 14184 I recently purchased.
Sam Buchanan
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Van's alternator - $18 at Pep boys |
In a message dated 3/3/2004 4:47:43 PM Eastern Standard Time, sbuc(at)hiwaay.net
writes:
The Nippon brand wasn't on the 14184 I recently purchased.
Sam Buchanan
forgot to ask, was the Nippon not being on the label of your recent 14184
purchase a good thing or a bad thing? ie, will work with Van's alternator kit
just as good as the one Van's sells or not?
thx,
lucky
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | kempthornes <kempthornes(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Oshkosh Camping Question |
At 01:52 PM 3/2/2004, you wrote:
>
>I'm not an outdoorsman
I am. My newest tent, my seventh, is a Coleman Sundome 7'X7'. Adequate
and cheap. Oshkosh proven.
If you want to keep your plane really light get a one man back pack
tent. I have a Eureka and love it.
Whatever you get be sure you get a fly that covers as much tent as possible
- few cover enough IMHO. Keeping the tent from getting wet helps you stay
dry. When it rains at OSH, the wind blows too. Also take a water bottle
and a P bottle.
You can certainly get better tents and being able to get a good night's in
the outdoors is essential to your becoming an outdoorsman.
K. H. (Hal) Kempthorne
RV6-a N7HK - Three trips to OSH now.
PRB (El Paso de Robles, CA)
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Van's alternator - $18 at Pep boys |
| From: | "Stewart, Michael (ISS Atlanta)" <mstewart(at)iss.net> |
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________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Sam Buchanan <sbuc(at)hiwaay.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Van's alternator - $18 at Pep boys |
RV8ter(at)aol.com wrote:
>
> In a message dated 3/3/2004 4:47:43 PM Eastern Standard Time, sbuc(at)hiwaay.net
> writes:
> The Nippon brand wasn't on the 14184 I recently purchased.
>
> Sam Buchanan
> forgot to ask, was the Nippon not being on the label of your recent 14184
> purchase a good thing or a bad thing? ie, will work with Van's alternator kit
> just as good as the one Van's sells or not?
>
> thx,
> lucky
It will work just fine. The Nippon brand wasn't on Vans's unit either;
matter of fact it didn't have *any* marking. Keep in mind all the
alternator does is keep the battery charged; there is no black art here. :-)
Just think.....the alternator will have a lifetime warranty as long as
you own that '77 Civic. ;-)
Sam Buchanan
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Van's alternator - $18 at Pep boys |
Sure but I'm pretty sure it will be backwards as that's been written here
before. The fan is press fit however and a decent gear puller should be able to
get rid of it.
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Dynon Heated Pitot Availability |
| From: | "" <tx_jayhawk(at)excite.com> |
FYI...information I got from Dynon on the Heated Pitot
Scott
7A Wings
From: Gloria Hee [mailto:temp(at)dynondevelopment.com]
Subject: RE: Heated Pitot Availability
We hope to have the heated AOA/Pitot probe available the end of this month. It
should work in the place of any heated pitot but it will not be TSOd. There
are no options when ordering the pitot.
-----Original Message-----
From: Scott_Haskins(at)Dell.com [mailto:Scott_Haskins(at)Dell.com]
Subject: Heated Pitot Availability
Can you confirm when the new heated pitot will be available? Also, will it work
only with the Dynon, or in the place of any heated pitot application? Are there
any options when ordering the pitot?
Thanks,
Scott Haskins
Join Excite! - http://www.excite.com
The most personalized portal on the Web!
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Charlie & Tupper England <cengland(at)netdoor.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Sun N Fun camping |
Brian Kraut wrote:
>
>I am driving to SNF. Can anyone tell me if you can bring a tent and camp somwehere
there if you didn't fly in? If so, can you camp with your vehicle so you
can lock up your stuff instead of having to carry it all out to the parking
lot and back every day.
>
snipped
Hi Brian,
Yes, you can camp with your car. Expect a fairly long commute to the
flight line if you don't arrive at least 2 days early, but it's still
nowhere near as bad as OSH.
FWIW, I've never heard of anyone losing anything out of a campsite at a
major flyin. I guess it happens, but it's got to be pretty rare or we
would hear more about it. Has anyone on the list lost anything while
camping at SNF or OSH?
Charlie
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Charlie & Tupper England <cengland(at)netdoor.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Van's alternator - $18 at Pep boys |
RV8ter(at)aol.com wrote:
>
>Sure but I'm pretty sure it will be backwards as that's been written here
>before. The fan is press fit however and a decent gear puller should be able
to
>get rid of it.
>
The external fan will still work (just not quite as efficiently) even
when spun backward. I've seen it confirmed on a test bench with the
alternator spun both ways. I've not observed this with an internal fan
model, but I expect similar results. Any auto-electric shop, & probably
even AutoZone, could spin one up for you if you want to check it for
yourself.
Charlie
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Jerry Springer <jsflyrv(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Van's alternator - $18 at Pep boys |
Charlie & Tupper England wrote:
>
>RV8ter(at)aol.com wrote:
>
>
>
>>
>>Sure but I'm pretty sure it will be backwards as that's been written here
>>before. The fan is press fit however and a decent gear puller should be able
to
>>get rid of it.
>>
>>
>>
>
>The external fan will still work (just not quite as efficiently) even
>when spun backward. I've seen it confirmed on a test bench with the
>alternator spun both ways. I've not observed this with an internal fan
>model, but I expect similar results. Any auto-electric shop, & probably
>even AutoZone, could spin one up for you if you want to check it for
>yourself.
>
>
>Charlie
>
>
The fan turning backwards well work fine, it has worked great on my
internal regulated non-electric Bob
electrical system for over 1000 hours. :)
Jerry
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Dave Bristol <bj034(at)lafn.org> |
| Subject: | Re: Van's alternator - $18 at Pep boys |
Sorry Sam, but the alternator not only has to charge the battery, it also has to
supply power for everything in the airplane. The electrical equipment in the
airplane runs off the alternator not the battery. The battery is used only for
starting and backup for the alternator.
Dave
Sam Buchanan wrote:
>There are scores of alternators that can
>be used on our planes (after all, they only have to charge the battery),
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Bob U." <rv3(at)comcast.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Van's alternator - $18 at Pep boys |
Dave Bristol wrote:
>
>
>Sorry Sam, but the alternator not only has to charge the battery, it also has
to supply power for everything in the airplane. The electrical equipment in the
airplane runs off the alternator not the battery.
>
>The battery is used only for starting and backup for the alternator.
>
>
>Dave
>
==========================================
Not exacty.
AFAIK --
1.An alternator will not excite without a battery.
2. If you remove the battery as a load for the alternator, the voltage
can soar to well over 100 volts unless there is circuitry to prevent it..
Bob
========================================
>Sam Buchanan wrote:
>
>
>
>>There are scores of alternators that can
>>be used on our planes (after all, they only have to charge the battery),
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Cy Galley" <cgalley(at)QCBC.ORG> |
| Subject: | Re: Van's alternator - $18 at Pep boys |
It works regardless of rotation so there is no need to remove. Might not be
as efficient but at 6000 rpm it doesn't make any difference.
----- Original Message -----
From: <RV8ter(at)aol.com>
Subject: Re: RV-List: Van's alternator - $18 at Pep boys
>
> Sure but I'm pretty sure it will be backwards as that's been written here
> before. The fan is press fit however and a decent gear puller should be
able to
> get rid of it.
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Dj Merrill <deej(at)thayer.dartmouth.edu> |
EricHe(at)FlexSolPackaging.com wrote:
>
> Hi all, don't know if this is general knowledge, but I thought this response
was good enough to share with the list. I finally bit the bullet and ordered my
Dynon and associated toys. Tony and Monte have been really great to deal with.
Would like to throw out a big thanks to Dynon just for making a good pitot
tube for a reasonable price. Every little victory adds up.
Hi all,
Just as an fyi, I sent e-mail to Dynon, and received
a reply that they will be at Sun-n-Fun with a display booth, C-23.
They also indicated that the OAT option should be available
in a couple of weeks.
Don't know if they will have a "show special" price, but one
can hope... :-)
-Dj
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Dj Merrill <deej(at)thayer.dartmouth.edu> |
| Subject: | Re: Sun N Fun camping |
SportAV8R(at)aol.com wrote:
>
> And what's the deal with a ban on backpacks and coolers?
No backpacks? Are they nuts?
Are they banning purses? If not, I guess I
will have a very big purse that I can
conveniently carry on my back...
Or maybe it s baby carrier - yeah, that's it!
A carrier for all the things I am
buying for my "baby".. *wink*
Seriously, how do these people expect
us to carry all our junk without a backpack?
-Dj
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | linn walters <lwalters2(at)cfl.rr.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Van's alternator - $18 at Pep boys |
Bob U. wrote:
>>he battery is used only for starting and backup for the alternator.
>>
>>
>>Dave
>>
>>
>>
>==========================================
>
>Not exacty.
>
>AFAIK --
>1.An alternator will not excite without a battery.
>
True
>2. If you remove the battery as a load for the alternator, the voltage
>can soar to well over 100 volts unless there is circuitry to prevent it..
>
Well, that's what the regulator is there for. If the alternator is
excited (I love that word!) and then the battery is removed, the
regulator should keep the voltage level constant ..... provided that the
field is still getting regulated voltage from the alternator output. As
long as the regulator stays intact, the system should function normally.
Linn
>Bob
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Oldsfolks(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re:Van's Alternator |
Dave:
I think you'll find the electrical system draws power from the battery and
alternator. They are both connected to the power buss, and if the load exceeds
the output of the alternator,then power comes from the battery.
My alternator has no name on it anywhere. I was told it is Nipondenso,from a
Toyota.
Bob Olds RV-4 , N1191X
A&P , EAA Tech. Counselor
Charleston,Arkansas
Real Aviators Fly Taildraggers
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Dave Ford" <dford(at)michweb.net> |
| Subject: | flap motor failure |
I have just 30 hours on my RV6 and had a flap motor failure today, could not extend
flaps, landed & got to the flap motor, gave it a rap while holding switch
and flaps extended. I know others have had failures according to archives but
this should not be happening. Has Van's been known to be exchanging or upgrading
these kit motors of 3-4 years old? I have cleaned the contacts, but how
long will that last?
Dave Ford
RV6
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | dralle(at)matronics.com (Matt Dralle) |
DNA: not not archive
| Subject: | [PLEASE READ] Virus Laden Spam Purports To Be From Matronics... |
Dear Listers,
First let me say that I normally don't condone the sharing of warnings
about Internet viruses on the Matronics Email Lists. I don't want to
start a storm of discussion regarding computer viruses on the Lists, so
please just note the information below and refrain from commenting to
the List. The circumstances I describe below are disturbing enough
that I felt an explanation is necessary. That being said...
There is a new email-bourne virus running rampant on the Internet that
is cleverly disguising itself as legitimate email warning of such
things as:
"your email account is disabled because of unauthorized access"
"Some of our clients complained about the spam (negative e-mail
content) outgoing from your e-mail account"
"Probably, you have been infected by a proxy-relay trojan server. In
order to keep your computer safe, follow the instructions."
"Our main mailing server will be temporary unavailable for next two
days, to continue receiving mail in these days you have to
configure our free auto-forwarding service."
All of these messages include an attachment that you are instructed to
click upon to "Get more information", "clean the virus from your
system", or "check your system for infections".
These enclosures all contain a virus that will infect your system and
propagate even more copies of the original message.
The disturbing part of these messages is that they appear to be coming
from very legitimate addresses and have very legitimate, convincing
dialog. For example, I have received a number of them today that
appear to be from "support(at)matronics.com", "management(at)matronics.com",
"administration(at)matronics.com", and "staff(at)matronics.com".
The text of the messages seems believable enough, and given the forged
source address, seem even more legitimate.
Please be assured that no one at Matronics.com will be sending you
these kinds of messages. If you receive one, it is a spam/virus that
has forged headers and was sent to you from someone other than
Matronics. Delete the message and the attachment promptly. Invest in
a copy of Norton Antivirus and keep the definitions up dated on a daily
basis.
Again, I want to stress that I *DO NOT* want a big discussion of
viruses on the Matronics Email Lists. Please do not reply to this
email with any comments. You may write to me directly at
dralle(at)matronics.com if you wish, but do not include the List.
Since many of these appear to come from matronics.com, I wanted to
assure everyone that Matronics wasn't the real source of these messages.
Let's be careful out there and keep those virus definitions up to date!
Today alone, the Matronics spam filter and virus blocking appliance
has filtered out 11,550 spam messages and 375 viruses! That's just in
an 18 hour period!
Best regards,
Matt Dralle
Matronics Email List Administrator
--
Matt G. Dralle | Matronics | P.O. Box 347 | Livermore | CA | 94551
925-606-1001 Voice | 925-606-6281 FAX | dralle(at)matronics.com Email
http://www.matronics.com/ W.W.W. | Featuring Products For Aircraft
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Cy Galley" <cgalley(at)QCBC.ORG> |
| Subject: | Re: Van's alternator - $18 at Pep boys |
I am fairly sure without the "ballast" of the battery, your regulator will
quickly give up the ghost. I know the battery filters out the ripple of the
current and many electrical noises within the system.
Cy Galley, TC - Chair, Emergency Aircraft Repair, Oshkosh
Editor, EAA Safety Programs
cgalley(at)qcbc.org or sportpilot(at)eaa.org
Always looking for articles for Sport Pilot
----- Original Message -----
From: "linn walters" <lwalters2(at)cfl.rr.com>
Subject: Re: RV-List: Van's alternator - $18 at Pep boys
>
> Bob U. wrote:
>
> >>he battery is used only for starting and backup for the alternator.
> >>
> >>
> >>Dave
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >==========================================
> >
> >Not exacty.
> >
> >AFAIK --
> >1.An alternator will not excite without a battery.
> >
> True
>
> >2. If you remove the battery as a load for the alternator, the voltage
> >can soar to well over 100 volts unless there is circuitry to prevent it..
> >
> Well, that's what the regulator is there for. If the alternator is
> excited (I love that word!) and then the battery is removed, the
> regulator should keep the voltage level constant ..... provided that the
> field is still getting regulated voltage from the alternator output. As
> long as the regulator stays intact, the system should function normally.
> Linn
>
> >Bob
> >
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Vanremog(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Mounting Instruments |
In a message dated 3/3/2004 6:56:16 AM Pacific Standard Time,
lwalters2(at)cfl.rr.com writes:
Typically the instruments are mounted with black anodized brass screws.
Linn meant black oxided brass screws. Brass can't be anodized.
GV (RV-6A N1GV flying 675 hrs)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Vanremog(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Mounting Instruments |
In a message dated 3/3/2004 6:13:17 AM Pacific Standard Time,
tacaruth(at)ralcorp.com writes:
I am mounting my flight instruments in the control panel. What type of
screws are the best to use? Do I need to use brass or stainless?
I would recommend the corrosion resistant steel (stainless) just because I
think they look better longer. Most of the commonly available ANSI variety
industrial fasteners are 300 series (nonmagnetic).
GV (RV-6A N1GV flying 682 hrs)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Mickey Coggins <mick-matronics(at)rv8.ch> |
Speaking of show specials - is this pretty common?
I've got a lot of stuff to buy, and I can wait
until SNF. Do people usually require cash or
can you "buy" and then have them ship and pay
for it later?
Thanks,
Mickey
>Don't know if they will have a "show special" price, but one
>can hope... :-)
--
Mickey Coggins
http://www.rv8.ch/
#82007 QB Wings/Fuselage
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | LeastDrag93066(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | MT Propeller Group Buy for Lycoming 320 |
Hi All,
MTV-17-C/178-59 electric CS propeller for Lycoming O-320 engine.
The is a 70" diameter 2 blade propeller including spinner and electric
governor.
Delivered assembled to your door in the USA.
I need 16 orders to get an assembled in Southern California price of $7,100
as a group buy. I have 7 now.
Approximate extra cost of $150 to deliver to your door in the USA. (Across
USA.)
If I don't get 16 orders, the price would be $7,600 assembled in Southern
California.
Approximate extra cost of $150 to deliver to your door in the USA. (Across
USA.)
The hydraulic 70" diameter 2 blade MT propeller can be included in this order.
MTV-11-C/178-59 hydraulic CS propeller including spinner.
$6,700 assembled in Southern California.
Approximate extra cost of $150 to deliver to your door in the USA. (Across
USA.)
As part of a 16 person group buy, $6,250 assembled in Southern California.
Approximate extra cost of $150 to deliver to your door in the USA. (Across
USA.)
Contact me at jim(at)lessdrag.com if you are interested in this group buy.
Jim Ayers
OEM Distributor for MT Propeller
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "lucky macy" <luckymacy(at)hotmail.com> |
vansairforce(at)yahoogroups.com
| Subject: | fuel return line / Mooney engine question |
I have an IO-360-A1B6D from a Mooney. The markings on the FI servo said
Bendix RSA-SAD1
Precision Air Motor Corp FC MAB
I don't have any Lycoming/Mooney documentation with the engine. I will get
an overhaul manual but I doubt it will tell me this question. Any idea if a
fuel return line was used on the Mooney?
Even if it wasn't used on the Mooney, would it ever a *bad* concept to
implement on a RV?
Does the return need to go to a fuel tank or just Teed back to the fuel line
upstream of the fuel selector vavle? My tanks are *done* so I'm hopinig not
to go there.
thanks,
lucky
----Original Message Follows----
From: "David Rogers" <davidrgr(at)comcast.net>
Subject: RE: [rv8list] Re: FloScan transducer mounting
Date: Wed, 3 Mar 2004 21:02:17 -0500
What are the pros/cons of one system over the other ?
Does the Airflow Perf unit give you more HP ?
How does the Bendix system eliminate the need for the fuel return ?
Dave R.
RV-8 (wings)
-----Original Message-----
From: mahlon_r [mailto:mahlon_russell(at)teledyne.com]
Subject: [rv8list] Re: FloScan transducer mounting
Brian,
The Precison/Bendix fuel injection system that comes standard on a
Lycoming IO-360 does not need or use a fuel return. If on the other
hand, you are going to use a AirFlow performance fuel injection
system the fuel return is required.
Good Luck,
Mahlon
-- In rv8list(at)yahoogroups.com, "bcross2160rv8"
wrote:
> Hi Folks
>
> On this subject, I have been trying to figure out for awhile what
> type of fuel valve do I require.
>
> I plan to use an IO360 with the Andair fuel valve. What I do not
know
> is if I need to get the expensive one which returns a portion of
the
> fuel to the tank selected? I assume that in the injected models,
> some of the fuel has to be returned to tank to keep the fuel cool.
I
> am obviously over my head on this one & would really appreciate
some
> advice on this.
>
> Thanks very much.
>
> Brian #81844
>
>
> -- In rv8list(at)yahoogroups.com, "Danny King" wrote:
> > Guys,
> > I saw a flying RV-8 the other day with all of the fuel components
> hanging on the firewall or motor mount. I ask him if he was having
> any weird fuel pressure readings. He said that his fuel pressure
> readings were all over the place. He had an angle valve I0360 200
hp
> engine. I couldn't help but flash back to my first homebuilt. It
> was a Pitts S1S with a PS-5C pressure carb and Christen Inverted
> system. I mounted the Pitts electric Airborne boast pump on the
> firewall along with the gascolator. All was well after that first
> flight on December 15, 1983 but by the late spring of 1984 I got a
> real scare when the fuel pressure started to drop. The Bendix PS-
5C
> requires approx. 14 psi to work. It is kinda like a throttle body
> injection (part carburetor and part fuel injection). I found that
> the Texas heat, and having those fuel components on the firewall
side
> was incompatible! I replumbed the Pitts and moved all fuel
> components to cockpit side of the firewall. All my problems went
> away!
> >
> > When planning the Doll's fuel system, I took the lessons learned
> and followed the very simple Grumman AA1 setup. The Grumman AA-
1A
> I owned for 23 years DID NOT HAVE A GASCOLATOR. In fact it used a
> tank drains at the low point just like the RV-8. If you drain your
> tanks prior to the first flight, then there will be no water in the
> system.
> > Second, if all fuel system plumbing is behind the firewall, there
> will be no vapor lock (fuel boiling) problems. The Doll is set up
> this way. After the (through the firewall) fitting, there is a 303
> hose to the engine fuel pump, and the rest is the way Lycoming
ships
> the engine to you!
> >
> > I also had a fuel flow transducer in my Grumman AA1-A. It was
> mounted just after the fuel valve, and it work perfectly! So I put
> the transducer in the Doll right after the elbow fitting coming out
> of the bottom of the fuel valve. Nearly 400 hours later, you
guessed
> it... it works perfectly! When I refuel, the total fuel to refill
> the Doll, and the amount used on the Electronics International fuel
> computer are within 1/10 of a gal.
> >
> > I decided to aim the vent line tubes strait down, and I did not
> turn them into the slip stream. I cut them off at an angle to
cause
> some pressurization. I thought about the bug issue as well.
> >
> > I'm not an engineer, and I am not saying that I did it the best
> way. Therefore, I only offer this as a away that I have found to
be
> successful on my former Grumman AA1-A, Pitts S1S, and the Doll.
> >
> > Danny King
> > Beautiful Doll 80434
> > ==========================
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: Jross10612@a...
> > To: rv8list(at)yahoogroups.com
> > Cc: chaskuss@y...
> > Sent: Wednesday, March 03, 2004 7:32 AM
> > Subject: [rv8list] FloScan transducer mounting
> >
> >
> > Charlie:
> >
> > I have my FloScan transducer mounted between the fuel injector
> servo and the
> > distribution block. It is mounted on a small plate that I made;
> that plate
> > meets at two tubes in the engine mount and is attached by two
> Adel clamps.
> > Flexible hose (firesleeved) is used to run in and out of the
> transducer, with
> > straight fittings on the transducer itself. There is a gently
> curved fitting on the
> > flexible hose on the outlet side. I have a blast tube pointed
at
> the
> > transducer, which runs to the top rear engine baffle. Between
the
> engine mounts, Adel
> > clamp rubber and flexible fuel lines, I think I have the
> vibration problem
> > under control. The cooling should be a non issue because of the
> blast tube. (At
> > least when there is airflow when moving)
> >
> > There really is no place to put the FloScan transducer which
> meets all
> > concerns we can think of. Talk to Don Rivera at Airflow
> Performance and he will tell
> > you not to install one at all; he is just too concerned about
> bubbles and
> > cavitation.
> >
> > I have tried to pick a place to mount the transducer that meets
> all
> > requirements as best as possible. I fully agree with your
> comments about the thermal
> > concerns of a transducer that is made of several materials, but
> I've tried to
> > minimize that issue as best that I can. The blast tube in the
> photo of the
> > installation is not seen well in the photo due to the engine
lord
> mount.
> >
> >
> >
> > Anyway, roll your own and don't go too crazy trying to engineer
> every issue
> > into a solution that considers everything.
> >
> > I have a wing root mounted gascolator. I'm thinking about
> removing it because
> > it may be of dubious value. All of the plumbing and potential
for
> leaks may
> > well negate the benefit of the gascolator. But old ideas die
> hard, and the
> > gascolator is a place for filtration and for water to settle
out
> as fuel passes
> > through it. But then all of the turns in the tubing, gentle as
> they are may be a
> > place for fuel turbulence to start. I'll probably leave it in
> because of the
> > filter in the gascolator and he fact that I have not installed
> any other
> > filter. On the other hand Danny King (as well as others) have
> been operating just
> > fine without a gascolator.
> >
> > My point is that if you talk to a fuel system engineer (like
> Caesar Gonazales
> > of Cessna fame) and follow all of the engineering principles
and
> accepted
> > practices when designing a fuel system you will end up with a
> compromise
> > somewhere. One of the things about the RV airplanes is the
poorly
> designed fuel vent
> > system. It's a major no-no to use 1/4 " fuel vent lines simply
> because a single
> > drop of water may freeze in the vent line and cause fuel flow
> problems.
> > Couple this with the fuel vents facing forward into the
> slipstream on the RV-8 and
> > you have a real potential for fuel vent icing if you were to
fly
> into any
> > freezing rain. Or maybe even bugs on a hot day could obstruct
the
> fuel vent. But
> > then the RV-8 was intended to be a VFR sport plane and not to
be
> flown IFR.
> >
> > If I had it to do over I'd put 3/8" fuel vent lines in my
> airplane. Why Van
> > did not do this in the first place is puzzling. On the other
> hand, we don't
> > seem to hear about fuel vent problems on the RV airplanes
either.
> >
> > Anyway, just food for thought.
> >
> > Jon Ross
> > 80094 Wing Paint
> >
> >
> > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Information exchange for builders of Vans Aircraft RV-8 kits.
> >
> > IF YOU WISH TO UNSUBSCRIBE, PLEASE SEND AN EMAIL TO :
> >
> > rv8list-unsubscribe(at)egroups.com
> >
> >
> >
> > ADVERTISEMENT
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
--
> ----------
> >
> > a.. To visit your group on the web, go to:
> > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/rv8list/
> >
> > b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
> > rv8list-unsubscribe(at)yahoogroups.com
> >
of
> Service.
> >
> >
> >
> > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Information exchange for builders of Vans Aircraft RV-8 kits.
IF YOU WISH TO UNSUBSCRIBE, PLEASE SEND AN EMAIL TO :
rv8list-unsubscribe(at)egroups.com
_____
* To visit your group on the web, go to:
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* To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
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Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> .
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
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________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | linn walters <lwalters2(at)cfl.rr.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Van's alternator - $18 at Pep boys |
Cy Galley wrote:
>
>I am fairly sure without the "ballast" of the battery, your regulator will
>quickly give up the ghost.
>
This hasn't been my (limited) experience. It may be due to differences
in regulators or due to the fact that there was some load available,
although the battery wasn't part of it. I don't see any reason,
technically, for the system to run away with a fully functioning
regulator. Maybe someone else can help out here.
>I know the battery filters out the ripple of the
>current and many electrical noises within the system.
>
The diode array in the alternator does 99% of the ripple removing.
Under full load, the remaining ripple may become noticeable in cheap
intercoms etc. It is true that the battery will filter some of the crap
that ends up on the power bus, but it's a poor filter .... otherwise we
wouldn't be chasing strobe and flasher noise. In this case 'it all
depends' may be useful as electrical systems are, by their nature,
terribly dynamic.
Linn
>
>Cy Galley, TC - Chair, Emergency Aircraft Repair, Oshkosh
>Editor, EAA Safety Programs
>cgalley(at)qcbc.org or sportpilot(at)eaa.org
>
>Always looking for articles for Sport Pilot
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | linn walters <lwalters2(at)cfl.rr.com> |
Mickey Coggins wrote:
>
>Speaking of show specials - is this pretty common?
>
Yes. You can bargain a little better towards the end of the show if
they have the stuff in stiock. they don't want to pack it all up, haul
it 'home' and then unpack it again! You can always get a price at one
vendor, have him write it on a business card and leverage another
vendor. Walking back and forth a few times can be rewarding ..... but
also a waste of time.
>I've got a lot of stuff to buy, and I can wait
>until SNF. Do people usually require cash or
>can you "buy" and then have them ship and pay
>for it later?
>
Actually, I've done it both ways. You can buy it at the show and have
it shipped from their home base and avoid sales tax (in FL) most of the
time.
Linn
>
>Thanks,
>Mickey
>
>
>
>
>>Don't know if they will have a "show special" price, but one
>>can hope... :-)
>>
>>
>
>--
>Mickey Coggins
>http://www.rv8.ch/
>#82007 QB Wings/Fuselage
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Bob U." <rv3(at)comcast.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Van's alternator - $18 at Pep boys |
linn walters wrote:
>
>Cy Galley wrote:
>
>
>
>>
>>I am fairly sure without the "ballast" of the battery, your regulator will
>>quickly give up the ghost.
>>
>>
>>
>This hasn't been my (limited) experience. It may be due to differences
>in regulators or due to the fact that there was some load available,
>although the battery wasn't part of it. I don't see any reason,
>technically, for the system to run away with a fully functioning
>regulator. Maybe someone else can help out here.
>
I've had a regulator "give up the ghost" with diasterout results and
expensive results, so it DOES happen.
>
>
>
>>I know the battery filters out the ripple of the
>>current and many electrical noises within the system.
>>
>>
>>
>The diode array in the alternator does 99% of the ripple removing.
>Under full load, the remaining ripple may become noticeable in cheap
>intercoms etc. It is true that the battery will filter some of the crap
>that ends up on the power bus, but it's a poor filter .... otherwise we
>wouldn't be chasing strobe and flasher noise. In this case 'it all
>depends' may be useful as electrical systems are, by their nature,
>terribly dynamic.
>
>Linn
>
A battery provides "ripple free" DC.
The alternator cannot.
For my money, I prefer to think of the battery as the provider
of electrical power and the alternator to keep the battery charged.
YMMV.
Bob
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "rob" <edmist_r(at)bellsouth.net> |
"Rv8-List" , "Rv9-List" ,
"Rv-List"
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "rob" <edmist_r(at)bellsouth.net> |
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Tulsa Engine Services |
| From: | <EricHe(at)FlexSolPackaging.com> |
>>>>Listers,
What was the name of the engine shop in Oklahoma mentioned recently on the
list? I couldn't find it in the archives.
Thanks,
Dan RV-7A (almost done)
>>>>>
Sounds like you are doing your own rebuild. I just did that so I thought I'd give
you a run down on what I found. Maybe it will benefit someone.
If you want your steel parts refurbed in Tulsa you are looking for Aircraft Specialties
Inc. They did all of my internal parts, resurfaced everything and yellow
tags for everything for $1800.00 . They sold me a rebuild kit that contains
all hardware you'll need for $800.00. There's your bottom end overhaul. BTW,
most of the cost is the connecting rod bolts. Ouch! My cases were done by Divco.
For $700.00 they line bore, check for cracks, resurface everything. They are
absolutely beautiful when you get them back. Next engine, I will do the same
thing, but I might be tempted to give ole Monte Barret a call and ask him how
much he wants to assemble and test the thing. Monte builds high perf competition
aerobatic engines. He's right next door to Aircraft Specialties. He chased
down some parts for me and was great to work with and was more than reasonable.
Basically you could disassemble your engine ship it off and get back a fresh
engine. You would be skipping the markup the builders charge you to ship your
parts out. When a builder ships a crank out, from my experience, they charge
you near double the cost of the machine shops price. If you have a bendix fuel
injection, Air Flow Performance made my entire FI system brand spanking new
for $650.00, they replace everything but the body. For Mags I found a guy named
Howard Libersky in Okechobee, Fl that rebuilt each mag completely for $120.00
flat out. He's been doing mags since they were cutting edge technology. His
number is (863-467-6464). I put new ECI Titan cylinders on since it was not much
more than having my old work cylinders reworked. All told, I figure I've got
about $13,500.00 invested and I'm damn confident in my engine (big thanks to
Charlie Kuss).
Hope it helps
Eric Henson
________________________________________________________________________________
"Rv8-List" , "Rv9-List" ,
"Rv-List"
| From: | George Frost <ghfrost(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | Mag impulse assembly |
I need an impulse assembly for a slick magneto, part number M3529.
Anyone have an extra one for sale or can suggest a source? AC Spruce
is out of stock.
George
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Vans Seat Cushion Kit for Sale |
Hey guys:
I have an unused Van's seat cushion kit in the original box for sale. Paid
$195 will let go for $160 and I will pay the shipping in the US. Interested
Thanks,
Scott Morrow
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Noel & Yoshie Simmons" <noel(at)blueskyaviation.net> |
| Subject: | fuel return line / Mooney engine question |
Lucky
My Bendix RSA-???? does not need a return line the continental fuel
injection is the one that needs the return line.
Noel
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of lucky macy
vansairforce(at)yahoogroups.com
Subject: RV-List: fuel return line / Mooney engine question
I have an IO-360-A1B6D from a Mooney. The markings on the FI servo said
Bendix RSA-SAD1
Precision Air Motor Corp FC MAB
I don't have any Lycoming/Mooney documentation with the engine. I will get
an overhaul manual but I doubt it will tell me this question. Any idea if a
fuel return line was used on the Mooney?
Even if it wasn't used on the Mooney, would it ever a *bad* concept to
implement on a RV?
Does the return need to go to a fuel tank or just Teed back to the fuel line
upstream of the fuel selector vavle? My tanks are *done* so I'm hopinig not
to go there.
thanks,
lucky
----Original Message Follows----
From: "David Rogers" <davidrgr(at)comcast.net>
Subject: RE: [rv8list] Re: FloScan transducer mounting
Date: Wed, 3 Mar 2004 21:02:17 -0500
What are the pros/cons of one system over the other ?
Does the Airflow Perf unit give you more HP ?
How does the Bendix system eliminate the need for the fuel return ?
Dave R.
RV-8 (wings)
-----Original Message-----
From: mahlon_r [mailto:mahlon_russell(at)teledyne.com]
Subject: [rv8list] Re: FloScan transducer mounting
Brian,
The Precison/Bendix fuel injection system that comes standard on a
Lycoming IO-360 does not need or use a fuel return. If on the other
hand, you are going to use a AirFlow performance fuel injection
system the fuel return is required.
Good Luck,
Mahlon
-- In rv8list(at)yahoogroups.com, "bcross2160rv8"
wrote:
> Hi Folks
>
> On this subject, I have been trying to figure out for awhile what
> type of fuel valve do I require.
>
> I plan to use an IO360 with the Andair fuel valve. What I do not
know
> is if I need to get the expensive one which returns a portion of
the
> fuel to the tank selected? I assume that in the injected models,
> some of the fuel has to be returned to tank to keep the fuel cool.
I
> am obviously over my head on this one & would really appreciate
some
> advice on this.
>
> Thanks very much.
>
> Brian #81844
>
>
> -- In rv8list(at)yahoogroups.com, "Danny King" wrote:
> > Guys,
> > I saw a flying RV-8 the other day with all of the fuel components
> hanging on the firewall or motor mount. I ask him if he was having
> any weird fuel pressure readings. He said that his fuel pressure
> readings were all over the place. He had an angle valve I0360 200
hp
> engine. I couldn't help but flash back to my first homebuilt. It
> was a Pitts S1S with a PS-5C pressure carb and Christen Inverted
> system. I mounted the Pitts electric Airborne boast pump on the
> firewall along with the gascolator. All was well after that first
> flight on December 15, 1983 but by the late spring of 1984 I got a
> real scare when the fuel pressure started to drop. The Bendix PS-
5C
> requires approx. 14 psi to work. It is kinda like a throttle body
> injection (part carburetor and part fuel injection). I found that
> the Texas heat, and having those fuel components on the firewall
side
> was incompatible! I replumbed the Pitts and moved all fuel
> components to cockpit side of the firewall. All my problems went
> away!
> >
> > When planning the Doll's fuel system, I took the lessons learned
> and followed the very simple Grumman AA1 setup. The Grumman AA-
1A
> I owned for 23 years DID NOT HAVE A GASCOLATOR. In fact it used a
> tank drains at the low point just like the RV-8. If you drain your
> tanks prior to the first flight, then there will be no water in the
> system.
> > Second, if all fuel system plumbing is behind the firewall, there
> will be no vapor lock (fuel boiling) problems. The Doll is set up
> this way. After the (through the firewall) fitting, there is a 303
> hose to the engine fuel pump, and the rest is the way Lycoming
ships
> the engine to you!
> >
> > I also had a fuel flow transducer in my Grumman AA1-A. It was
> mounted just after the fuel valve, and it work perfectly! So I put
> the transducer in the Doll right after the elbow fitting coming out
> of the bottom of the fuel valve. Nearly 400 hours later, you
guessed
> it... it works perfectly! When I refuel, the total fuel to refill
> the Doll, and the amount used on the Electronics International fuel
> computer are within 1/10 of a gal.
> >
> > I decided to aim the vent line tubes strait down, and I did not
> turn them into the slip stream. I cut them off at an angle to
cause
> some pressurization. I thought about the bug issue as well.
> >
> > I'm not an engineer, and I am not saying that I did it the best
> way. Therefore, I only offer this as a away that I have found to
be
> successful on my former Grumman AA1-A, Pitts S1S, and the Doll.
> >
> > Danny King
> > Beautiful Doll 80434
> > ==========================
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: Jross10612@a...
> > To: rv8list(at)yahoogroups.com
> > Cc: chaskuss@y...
> > Sent: Wednesday, March 03, 2004 7:32 AM
> > Subject: [rv8list] FloScan transducer mounting
> >
> >
> > Charlie:
> >
> > I have my FloScan transducer mounted between the fuel injector
> servo and the
> > distribution block. It is mounted on a small plate that I made;
> that plate
> > meets at two tubes in the engine mount and is attached by two
> Adel clamps.
> > Flexible hose (firesleeved) is used to run in and out of the
> transducer, with
> > straight fittings on the transducer itself. There is a gently
> curved fitting on the
> > flexible hose on the outlet side. I have a blast tube pointed
at
> the
> > transducer, which runs to the top rear engine baffle. Between
the
> engine mounts, Adel
> > clamp rubber and flexible fuel lines, I think I have the
> vibration problem
> > under control. The cooling should be a non issue because of the
> blast tube. (At
> > least when there is airflow when moving)
> >
> > There really is no place to put the FloScan transducer which
> meets all
> > concerns we can think of. Talk to Don Rivera at Airflow
> Performance and he will tell
> > you not to install one at all; he is just too concerned about
> bubbles and
> > cavitation.
> >
> > I have tried to pick a place to mount the transducer that meets
> all
> > requirements as best as possible. I fully agree with your
> comments about the thermal
> > concerns of a transducer that is made of several materials, but
> I've tried to
> > minimize that issue as best that I can. The blast tube in the
> photo of the
> > installation is not seen well in the photo due to the engine
lord
> mount.
> >
> >
> >
> > Anyway, roll your own and don't go too crazy trying to engineer
> every issue
> > into a solution that considers everything.
> >
> > I have a wing root mounted gascolator. I'm thinking about
> removing it because
> > it may be of dubious value. All of the plumbing and potential
for
> leaks may
> > well negate the benefit of the gascolator. But old ideas die
> hard, and the
> > gascolator is a place for filtration and for water to settle
out
> as fuel passes
> > through it. But then all of the turns in the tubing, gentle as
> they are may be a
> > place for fuel turbulence to start. I'll probably leave it in
> because of the
> > filter in the gascolator and he fact that I have not installed
> any other
> > filter. On the other hand Danny King (as well as others) have
> been operating just
> > fine without a gascolator.
> >
> > My point is that if you talk to a fuel system engineer (like
> Caesar Gonazales
> > of Cessna fame) and follow all of the engineering principles
and
> accepted
> > practices when designing a fuel system you will end up with a
> compromise
> > somewhere. One of the things about the RV airplanes is the
poorly
> designed fuel vent
> > system. It's a major no-no to use 1/4 " fuel vent lines simply
> because a single
> > drop of water may freeze in the vent line and cause fuel flow
> problems.
> > Couple this with the fuel vents facing forward into the
> slipstream on the RV-8 and
> > you have a real potential for fuel vent icing if you were to
fly
> into any
> > freezing rain. Or maybe even bugs on a hot day could obstruct
the
> fuel vent. But
> > then the RV-8 was intended to be a VFR sport plane and not to
be
> flown IFR.
> >
> > If I had it to do over I'd put 3/8" fuel vent lines in my
> airplane. Why Van
> > did not do this in the first place is puzzling. On the other
> hand, we don't
> > seem to hear about fuel vent problems on the RV airplanes
either.
> >
> > Anyway, just food for thought.
> >
> > Jon Ross
> > 80094 Wing Paint
> >
> >
> > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Information exchange for builders of Vans Aircraft RV-8 kits.
> >
> > IF YOU WISH TO UNSUBSCRIBE, PLEASE SEND AN EMAIL TO :
> >
> > rv8list-unsubscribe(at)egroups.com
> >
> >
> >
> > ADVERTISEMENT
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
--
> ----------
> >
> > a.. To visit your group on the web, go to:
> > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/rv8list/
> >
> > b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
> > rv8list-unsubscribe(at)yahoogroups.com
> >
of
> Service.
> >
> >
> >
> > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Information exchange for builders of Vans Aircraft RV-8 kits.
IF YOU WISH TO UNSUBSCRIBE, PLEASE SEND AN EMAIL TO :
rv8list-unsubscribe(at)egroups.com
_____
* To visit your group on the web, go to:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/rv8list/
* To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
rv8list-unsubscribe(at)yahoogroups.com
Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> .
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Find things fast with the new MSN Toolbar includes FREE pop-up blocking!
http://clk.atdmt.com/AVE/go/onm00200414ave/direct/01/
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Ron Walker" <ron(at)walker.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Vans Seat Cushion Kit for Sale |
This is probably the 3rd or 4th time i've seen someone selling their Van's
seat cushions in the past few months. Is there something about them that is
disliked ? What are you guys going with instead ? I'm curious because I'm at
the point of needing some cushions and perhaps you guys have some insight to
share ?
Ron
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "David Carter" <dcarter(at)datarecall.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Halon fire extinguishers-size |
Bert,
I assume you are talking about the hand-held extinguishers. There should be
an FAA recommendation or requirement (for those "other" airplanes) that
would provide a reasonable value of size. The Cessna 172 that I fly has an
extinguisher on the floor between the seats - about a foot long. Probably
any aviation mechanic could tell you the size.
On the other hand, I'm planning to put in a wand system in my engine
compartment to kill any fire that starts up there. Haven't decided how big
a tank yet - want about 15 seconds total discharge time, if I remember
correctly.
David
----- Original Message -----
From: <bertrv6(at)highstream.net>
>
>
> Hi:
>
> Have a question, I see there are 3 sizes of halon extinguishers, what
> is best size use for our rv6?
>
>
> Comments appreciated
>
>
> Bert
> rv6a
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Doug Weiler" <dougweil(at)pressenter.com> |
| Subject: | Re: flap motor failure |
> I have just 30 hours on my RV6 and had a flap motor failure today, could
not extend flaps, landed & got to the flap motor, gave it a rap while
holding switch and flaps extended. I know others have had failures
according to archives but this should not be happening. Has Van's been
known to be exchanging or upgrading these kit motors of 3-4 years old? I
have cleaned the contacts, but how long will that last?
>
> Dave Ford
> RV6
I to have had this problem. On the advice of Van's I clean it and then
applied one (just ONE!!!) drop of Three-In-One oil to the top of the flap
motor shaft. No problems since (in the RV-4, the motor is mounted
vertically which makes this easy).
Doug Weiler
MN Wing
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Cy Galley" <cgalley(at)QCBC.ORG> |
| Subject: | Re: Van's alternator - $18 at Pep boys |
How can you get the battery out of the circuit? It must be there for no other reason
than to excite the field.
STATOR
Surrounding the rotor is another set of coils, three in number, called the stator.
The stator is fixed to the shell of the alternator, and does not turn. As
the rotor turns within the stator windings, the magnetic field of the rotor sweeps
through the stator windings, producing an electrical current in the windings.
Because of the rotation of the rotor, an alternating current is produced.
As, for example, the north pole of the magnetic field approaches one of the stator
windings, there is little coupling taking place, and a weak current is produced,
As the rotation continues, the magnetic field moves to the center of
the winding, where maximum coupling takes place, and the induced current is at
its peak. As the rotation continues to the point that the magnetic field is leaving
the stator winding, the induced current is small. By this time, the south
pole is approaching the winding, producing a weak current in the opposite direction.
As this continues, the current produced in each winding plotted against
the angle of rotation of the rotor has the form shown in figure 2. The three
stator windings are spaced inside the alternator 120 degrees apart, producing
three separate sets, or "phases," of output voltages, spaced 120 degrees apart,
as shown in figure 3.
OUTPUT DIODES
A/C voltage is of little use in a D/C system, such as used in an airplane, so it
has to be converted to D/C before it can be used. This conversion to D/C takes
place in the "output diodes" and in the "diode trio." Diodes have the property
of allowing current to flow in only one direction, while blocking current
flow in the other direction. The output diodes consist of six diodes, one pair
for each winding. One of the pair is for the negative half cycle, and the other
for the positive half cycle. As a result of this diode rectification, the output
of the alternator looks as shown in figure 4.
Surprisingly enough, the output of the alternator is not a pure D/C as one might
expect, but a pulsating D/C. Because there are three windings, each with a positive
and a negative half, by the time the voltage is passed through the diodes,
there are six pulsations for each rotation of the rotor. This is close enough
to D/C for most automotive components. Critical components, such as radios,
have their own internal filtering circuits to further smooth out the waveform
to a purer D/C.
This doesn't look like your quoted 99% to me.
----- Original Message -----
From: "linn walters" <lwalters2(at)cfl.rr.com>
Subject: Re: RV-List: Van's alternator - $18 at Pep boys
>
> Cy Galley wrote:
>
> >
> >I am fairly sure without the "ballast" of the battery, your regulator will
> >quickly give up the ghost.
> >
> This hasn't been my (limited) experience. It may be due to differences
> in regulators or due to the fact that there was some load available,
> although the battery wasn't part of it. I don't see any reason,
> technically, for the system to run away with a fully functioning
> regulator. Maybe someone else can help out here.
>
> >I know the battery filters out the ripple of the
> >current and many electrical noises within the system.
> >
> The diode array in the alternator does 99% of the ripple removing.
> Under full load, the remaining ripple may become noticeable in cheap
> intercoms etc. It is true that the battery will filter some of the crap
> that ends up on the power bus, but it's a poor filter .... otherwise we
> wouldn't be chasing strobe and flasher noise. In this case 'it all
> depends' may be useful as electrical systems are, by their nature,
> terribly dynamic.
>
> Linn
>
> >
> >Cy Galley, TC - Chair, Emergency Aircraft Repair, Oshkosh
> >Editor, EAA Safety Programs
> >cgalley(at)qcbc.org or sportpilot(at)eaa.org
> >
> >Always looking for articles for Sport Pilot
> >
> >
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Kyle Boatright" <kyle.boatright(at)adelphia.net> |
| Subject: | Exhaust Bracket Failure |
Looks like the exhaust hanging hardware on my airplane needs to be changed every
100 hours or so. When I pulled the cowl for my condition inspection, I found
that one of the angles in the Vetterman exhaust hanging system had failed.
That was at about 220 hours. Previously (at about 100 hours in service) I experienced
a failure in the previous version of the exhaust hanging system.
Has anyone worked out an exhaust hanging system that is reliable over the long
term? Tom at Van's indicated that lots of folks have experienced failures in
this area over the years, despite numerous revisions in the hardware and attachement
of the hangars.
Thanks in advance,
KB
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bill Dube <bdube(at)al.noaa.gov> |
| Subject: | Re: Van's alternator - $18 at Pep boys |
>
>It works regardless of rotation so there is no need to remove. Might not be
>as efficient but at 6000 rpm it doesn't make any difference.
Honda spins the engine backwards from everyone else. Why use a
Honda alternator when every other brand in the world spins in the correct
direction?
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Kosta Lewis" <mikel(at)dimensional.com> |
I have camped at OSH every year for the past, what 16? years I suppose.
I have seen tents come and go, literally (Hey, isn't that Dave's tent
rolling by over there?). The best I have found for relatively little
money for what you get are the Cabela tents, specifically the Alaskan
Guide Model. I have the 4 man for me, myself and I and my wife when she
can come. Holds everything I cram in it. At OSH it can RAIN which will
get in your tent. My Cabela's is the driest I have used or seen. It also
can BLOW there, either nature or some twin trying to blast himself out
of his tire ruts. The Cabela tents can be secured at multiple points and
stay put.
Search the archives under CAMPING AT OSH and read message 99850 April 02
babble for some more hints about camping there. Some things will be
changed as there will now be Custom Camping west of the forum tents.
YEA.
You HAVE to fly to OSH, and it is GREAT to camp there, even if you are
not that accustom to the great out doors. Early morning, smell of coffee
and someone cooking bacon, sun not up yet but orange glow over the lake,
conversation you can't quite make out over behind you to your left, two
P-51s and an F4U taking off in sequence 200 yards from your tent roar
the quiet away and are gone, quiet again except for someone somewhere
saying "cool!". Friends you only see at OSH, stumble out of their tent
and crawl over to yours, set up a chair and, smiling blurry-eyed, hold
out their cup for a bit of hot joe. Can't wait.
Michael
RV-4 N232 Suzie Q
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | cecilth(at)juno.com |
What is "(The ER Tanks slide into the first nose rib lightening hole
forward of the spar) "
Inquiring minds want to know.
Cecil
>
> Hi all, don't know if this is general knowledge, but I thought this
> response was good enough to share with the list. I finally bit the
> bullet and ordered my Dynon and associated toys. Tony and Monte have
> been really great to deal with. Would like to throw out a big thanks
> to Dynon just for making a good pitot tube for a reasonable price.
> Every little victory adds up.
>
> Eric
> Thanks for your order, we look forward to receiving it and we'll get
> it processed as soon as it's received.
> The wing tip is the preferred location for the remote compass. This
> gets the remote compass as far away from the panel and ferrous
> materials (engine, engine mount, landing gear, etc.) as possible. If
> you have a strobe power supply in the wing tip, you'll want to
> install the compass as far away from the box as possible (within the
> wing tip). The EFIS-D10 "samples" the remote compass 64 times/second
> and averages these samples. Even with the comet flash strobes, there
> is only small amount of time, relative to the sampling rate, that
> any significant interference can be generated by the strobe power
> supply. The remote compass will sense the strobes as they discharge
> but the user probably won't notice any change on the EFIS-D10
> display (due to the averaging and large number of samples taken each
> second). Now that you understand how the EFIS-D10 gathers and
> processes compass signals, it explains why electric gyro's (being
> continuous sources of interference) are the most problematic!
> to correct.
> As a side note, if you ever think you may be installing our ER
> Tanks, mount the remote compass at least 1 foot behind the main
> spar. Then you won't have to move it should you install ER Tanks at
> a later date. (The ER Tanks slide into the first nose rib lightening
> hole forward of the spar)
> If there's anything else Monte or I can do for you, please don't
> hesitate to contact us.
> Tony Munday and Monte McDavid
> SafeAir1
> 817-821-4957 (TM)
> 817-939-2695 (MM)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "pcondon" <pcondon(at)mitre.org> |
| Subject: | RV-List New EFIS instrument add & company in Kitplanes |
Has anyone contacted the Canadian company who is advertising in the back of
Kitplanes magazine which advertises single unit, replacement electrical/LCD
display flight instruments ?? I am at work and the magazine is at
home........ Noticed the add in the new (latest) mailing of Kitplane
magazine, in the back section of the mag,- last night while I should have
been doing my taxes and houseold billing......
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Oshkosh Camping Question |
| From: | cecilth(at)juno.com |
From: Laird Owens <owens(at)aerovironment.com>
"And be sure not to mix up the two.... :-)"
Owen . . . you didn't----
Oh My God
Cecil
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Ned Thomas" <315(at)cox.net> |
| Subject: | Honda alternator |
If the Honda spins backwards from every other car engine then it would be
turning the same direction that aircrat engines turn and the alternator
would be even better?? Right??
----- Original Message -----
From: "Bill Dube" <bdube(at)al.noaa.gov>
Subject: Re: RV-List: Van's alternator - $18 at Pep boys
>
> >
> >It works regardless of rotation so there is no need to remove. Might not
be
> >as efficient but at 6000 rpm it doesn't make any difference.
>
> Honda spins the engine backwards from everyone else. Why use a
> Honda alternator when every other brand in the world spins in the correct
> direction?
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Richard Tasker <retasker(at)optonline.net> |
They sell extended range tanks - fuel "cylinders" that slide into the
rib lightening holes.
Take a look at www.safeair1.com
Dick Tasker
cecilth(at)juno.com wrote:
>
>What is "(The ER Tanks slide into the first nose rib lightening hole
>forward of the spar) "
>Inquiring minds want to know.
>Cecil
>
>
>
>
>>
>>Hi all, don't know if this is general knowledge, but I thought this
>>response was good enough to share with the list. I finally bit the
>>bullet and ordered my Dynon and associated toys. Tony and Monte have
>>been really great to deal with. Would like to throw out a big thanks
>>to Dynon just for making a good pitot tube for a reasonable price.
>>Every little victory adds up.
>>
>>Eric
>>Thanks for your order, we look forward to receiving it and we'll get
>>it processed as soon as it's received.
>>The wing tip is the preferred location for the remote compass. This
>>gets the remote compass as far away from the panel and ferrous
>>materials (engine, engine mount, landing gear, etc.) as possible. If
>>you have a strobe power supply in the wing tip, you'll want to
>>install the compass as far away from the box as possible (within the
>>wing tip). The EFIS-D10 "samples" the remote compass 64 times/second
>>and averages these samples. Even with the comet flash strobes, there
>>is only small amount of time, relative to the sampling rate, that
>>any significant interference can be generated by the strobe power
>>supply. The remote compass will sense the strobes as they discharge
>>but the user probably won't notice any change on the EFIS-D10
>>display (due to the averaging and large number of samples taken each
>>second). Now that you understand how the EFIS-D10 gathers and
>>processes compass signals, it explains why electric gyro's (being
>>continuous sources of interference) are the most problematic!
>> to correct.
>>As a side note, if you ever think you may be installing our ER
>>Tanks, mount the remote compass at least 1 foot behind the main
>>spar. Then you won't have to move it should you install ER Tanks at
>>a later date. (The ER Tanks slide into the first nose rib lightening
>>hole forward of the spar)
>>If there's anything else Monte or I can do for you, please don't
>>hesitate to contact us.
>>Tony Munday and Monte McDavid
>>SafeAir1
>>817-821-4957 (TM)
>>817-939-2695 (MM)
>>
>>
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Exhaust Bracket Failure |
| From: | Larry Pardue <n5lp(at)warpdriveonline.com> |
on 3/4/04 11:03 AM, Kyle Boatright at kyle.boatright(at)adelphia.net wrote:
>
> Looks like the exhaust hanging hardware on my airplane needs to be changed
> every 100 hours or so. When I pulled the cowl for my condition inspection, I
> found that one of the angles in the Vetterman exhaust hanging system had
> failed. That was at about 220 hours. Previously (at about 100 hours in
> service) I experienced a failure in the previous version of the exhaust
> hanging system.
>
> Has anyone worked out an exhaust hanging system that is reliable over the long
> term? Tom at Van's indicated that lots of folks have experienced failures in
> this area over the years, despite numerous revisions in the hardware and
> attachement of the hangars.
>
Kyle,
I started off with lots of failures and have finally gotten it to where I
have not had any for a few hundred hours. I can't remember everything I
have done because it has been a gradual upgrading, but here are some of the
things, half stolen from other listers and half my own ideas.
I replaced the original Vetterman tubing with heavier wall tubing. I
believe this stuff is auto brake line.
The smashed ends with the holes, that Vetterman uses to make attachements
are where mine almost always broke, no matter how careful I was making the
smashes smooth. Now I use clamps on the tubing captured with silver
soldered wire around the tubing on each side of the clamp.
Rather than one clamp on the engine mount at each attach point I use two
bridged with a piece of heavy aluminum.
I eliminated the cross brace, which was a failure point and have found the
exhaust hangs just fine straight down from its mounting point. It can't
break if it isn't there.
I have still found failures of one clamp occasionally but that hasn't caused
a problem. And finally I safety wire things so a failure doesnt' let the
exhaust go anywhere, although I have found it tends to stay pretty much in
place, even with a complete failure on one side.
I haven't tried any of Larry's updated mounting solutions. All of this is
on an RV-6 with O-360.
Larry Pardue
Carlsbad, NM
RV-6 N441LP Flying
http://n5lp.net
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | <chaskuss(at)bellsouth.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Van's alternator - $18 at Pep boys |
Cy meant to say ROTOR, not stator at the beginning of his message. The electormagnetic
field is created by electricity being fed into the rotor windings. This
creates the magnetic field.
Charlie Kuss
>
> From: "Cy Galley" <cgalley(at)QCBC.ORG>
> Date: 2004/03/04 Thu PM 12:29:52 EST
> To:
> Subject: Re: RV-List: Van's alternator - $18 at Pep boys
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "BRUCE GRAY" <brucerv84us(at)hotmail.com> |
bill(at)vondane.com, banderson(at)polyvision.com, dan(at)rvproject.com,
rv7boy(at)yahoo.com, drwalker(at)powernet.net, jacki(at)jackim.com,
jhallrv4(at)comcast.net, n1cxo320(at)salidaco.com, RV-List(at)matronics.com,
mikesrv6(at)yahoo.com, rosales(at)bigfoot.com, n667sr(at)comcast.net
| Subject: | RSVP for Carson City Fly-in |
Hello Everyone, I am sending this e-mail out 8 weeks in advance to get an
idea of the crowd we may be dealing with. We have set aside a block of 40
rooms at the Pinion Plaza Resort so don't hesitate on that. I have been told
if the rooms do not reserve by a certain time they will release them for
other costumers. So far I have received raffle/door prizes from Aerox
Aviation Oxygen Systems, Avery Tools, and Aircraft Spruce. We are working on
a couple more and will post those donations as soon as I get word. Please
mark your calendars and plan for this event. I ask anyone that wishes to
participate in this event to RSVP in the next couple of weeks so we can get
an idea for food preparations and chapter members we need to recruit to make
this fly-in a success. Thanks to you all that are supporting and donating to
this fly-in. We will see you here. Bruce
One-click access to Hotmail from any Web page download MSN Toolbar now!
http://clk.atdmt.com/AVE/go/onm00200413ave/direct/01/
________________________________________________________________________________
My new AeroSport engine has arrived. I would like to find a new home for my
old engine with about 900hrs on it SMOH. It is a 180HP O-360A1D off of a
Mooney. The engine was removed from a flying airplane when the owner changed to
a
200HP IO-360 angle valve. The engine includes the starter and rebuilt Bendix
"shower of sparks" mags with the vibrator. I need the vacuum pump and the
prop governor. I bought the engine to test fly my RV-6 without having to worry
about breaking in a new engine. I have flown it about 85hrs without any
problems. The airplane is really fast, I hope I see a big difference in airspeed
after spending the money for the AeroSport. I will not be installing the new
engine right away so come hear it run and fly the airplane. I am asking $12,500
Cash Copeland
RV-6 N46FC
Hayward, Ca
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bill VonDane <bill(at)vondane.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Exhaust Bracket Failure |
I had the same problem after about 80 hours... I made some new brackets and
now, 80 hours later, they are good as new...
http://www.vondane.com/rv8a/engine/engine3.htm - bottom of page...
-Bill
----- Original Message -----
From: "Kyle Boatright" <kyle.boatright(at)adelphia.net>
Subject: RV-List: Exhaust Bracket Failure
Looks like the exhaust hanging hardware on my airplane needs to be changed
every 100 hours or so. When I pulled the cowl for my condition inspection,
I found that one of the angles in the Vetterman exhaust hanging system had
failed. That was at about 220 hours. Previously (at about 100 hours in
service) I experienced a failure in the previous version of the exhaust
hanging system.
Has anyone worked out an exhaust hanging system that is reliable over the
long term? Tom at Van's indicated that lots of folks have experienced
failures in this area over the years, despite numerous revisions in the
hardware and attachement of the hangars.
Thanks in advance,
KB
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Tulsa Engine Services |
Good info. It seems there's no overhaul manual specific to IO-360s. It looks
like there's just one generic manual for direct drive engines non turbo
charged engines. Is that right?
What documentation, Lycoming or otherwise, did you accumulate?
thanks,
lucky
In a message dated 3/4/2004 9:24:01 AM Eastern Standard Time,
EricHe(at)FlexSolPackaging.com writes:
>>>>Listers,
What was the name of the engine shop in Oklahoma mentioned recently on the
list? I couldn't find it in the archives.
Thanks,
Dan RV-7A (almost done)
>>>>>
Sounds like you are doing your own rebuild. I just did that so I thought I'd
give you a run down on what I found. Maybe it will benefit someone.
If you want your steel parts refurbed in Tulsa you are looking for Aircraft
Specialties Inc. They did all of my internal parts, resurfaced everything and
yellow tags for everything for $1800.00 . They sold me a rebuild kit that
contains all hardware you'll need for $800.00. There's your bottom end overhaul.
BTW, most of the cost is the connecting rod bolts. Ouch! My cases were done by
Divco. For $700.00 they line bore, check for cracks, resurface everything. They
are absolutely beautiful when you get them back. Next engine, I will do the
same thing, but I might be tempted to give ole Monte Barret a call and ask him
how much he wants to assemble and test the thing. Monte builds high perf
competition aerobatic engines. He's right next door to Aircraft Specialties. He
chased down some parts for me and was great to work with and was more than
reasonable. Basically you could disassemble your engine ship it off and get back
a
fresh engine. You would be skipping the markup the buil!
ders charge you to ship your parts out. When a builder ships a crank out,
from my experience, they charge you near double the cost of the machine shops
price. If you have a bendix fuel injection, Air Flow Performance made my entire
FI system brand spanking new for $650.00, they replace everything but the body.
For Mags I found a guy named Howard Libersky in Okechobee, Fl that rebuilt
each mag completely for $120.00 flat out. He's been doing mags since they were
cutting edge technology. His number is (863-467-6464). I put new ECI Titan
cylinders on since it was not much more than having my old work cylinders
reworked. All told, I figure I've got about $13,500.00 invested and I'm damn confident
in my engine (big thanks to Charlie Kuss).
Hope it helps
Eric Henson
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Exhaust Bracket Failure |
In a message dated 3/4/04 3:21:55 PM Eastern Standard Time,
n5lp(at)warpdriveonline.com writes:
> Rather than one clamp on the engine mount at each attach point I use two
> bridged with a piece of heavy aluminum.
>
>
Are you attaching the exaust pipes hangers from the engine mount rather than
from lower case bolts as indicated in the vettermans instructions?
Scott Morrow
RV-6A
90%
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Laird Owens <owens(at)aerovironment.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Exhaust Bracket Failure |
The exhaust hangers were one of the most problematic parts of my RV
for the first couple hundred hours. I don't know how many variations
I tried, but they'd always break.
I finally gave up trying to hang them off the motor mount and now
support them off the sump bolts. Been great for the last 500 hrs.
Laird RV-6/O-360 950 hrs
SoCal
>
>on 3/4/04 11:03 AM, Kyle Boatright at kyle.boatright(at)adelphia.net wrote:
>
>>
>>
>> Looks like the exhaust hanging hardware on my airplane needs to be changed
>> every 100 hours or so. When I pulled the cowl for my condition
>>inspection, I
>> found that one of the angles in the Vetterman exhaust hanging system had
>> failed. That was at about 220 hours. Previously (at about 100 hours in
>> service) I experienced a failure in the previous version of the exhaust
>> hanging system.
>>
>> Has anyone worked out an exhaust hanging system that is reliable
>>over the long
>> term? Tom at Van's indicated that lots of folks have experienced
>>failures in
>> this area over the years, despite numerous revisions in the hardware and
> > attachement of the hangars.
>>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Larry Pardue" <n5lp(at)warpdriveonline.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Exhaust Bracket Failure |
>
> In a message dated 3/4/04 3:21:55 PM Eastern Standard Time,
> n5lp(at)warpdriveonline.com writes:
>
> > Rather than one clamp on the engine mount at each attach point I use two
> > bridged with a piece of heavy aluminum.
> >
> >
>
> Are you attaching the exaust pipes hangers from the engine mount rather
than
> from lower case bolts as indicated in the vettermans instructions?
>
I am attaching to the engine mount as indicated in the Vetterman
instructions that I got. Apparently there are different versions of his
system. I think I got my exhaust about 1998 or 1999.
Larry Pardue
Carlsbad, NM
RV-6 N441LP Flying
http://n5lp.net
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Kevin Horton <khorton01(at)rogers.com> |
| Subject: | Re: MP/Ram Air Question |
A few comments:
1. The ambient pressure is directly related to the pressure altitude,
but the pressure does not vary with temperature. So, there is no
direct relationship between density altitude and ambient pressure.
So forget all about density altitude for this discussion. Just
consider pressure altitude (i.e. what the altimeter reads when you
set it to 29.92).
2. There are a whole bunch of different pressures that we can talk
about, and it is hard to have a clear discussion unless we are sure
we are talking about the same pressures.
Ambient pressure (or static pressure) - the actual pressure in the
atmosphere at the altitude in question. There is a direct
relationship between ambient pressure and pressure altitude. You can
find the equations for the relationship between pressure altitude and
ambient pressure at:
http://williams.best.vwh.net/avform.htm#Altimetry
Dynamic pressure - this is the pressure increase due to speed, in simple terms.
http://www.centennialofflight.gov/essay/Dictionary/Dynamic_Pressure/DI142.htm
Total pressure - this is the sum of ambient pressure and dynamic
pressure. It is the pressure that we get if we take the air and slow
it down to zero speed (looking at it from the perspective of the
aircraft). This is the pressure that we could get inside the
induction air scoop, if we actually could get the air to come to a
stop relative to the aircraft. In reality, the air has to keep
moving, as the engine needs to keep consuming it, so we can never get
the pressure quite this high.
Pressure before the air filter - this pressure will generally be
somewhat less than the total pressure, unless we manage to position
our intake to get some pressure increase due to the propeller.
Pressure after the air filter - air will not flow unless there is a
pressure differential, so the pressure after the filter has to be
lower than the pressure ahead of the filter. The pressure loss as
the air goes through the filter seems to be about 1" HG, at least
based on what some people have reported.
Manifold pressure - this is the pressure that we have at the intake
manifold, right next to the intake port. There are pressure losses
as the air flows through the carb (or fuel injection servo) and the
intake manifold plumbing.
So, the manifold pressure will be equal to the ambient pressure +
dynamic pressure - small error because the air never actually goes to
zero speed - pressure loss through the air filter - pressure loss
through the carb and intake manifold. So, depending on how fast we
going (which will largely determine the dynamic pressure), and what
the various pressure losses are, the manifold pressure may be more or
less than the ambient pressure.
So, you are seeing about a 1" pressure increase due to ram air.
Which pressure has increased by 1"? 1" relative to what? The
manifold pressure? What do you mean by ram air? Do you mean that
you have a way to bypass the air filter? Or do you mean that you are
looking at the pressure increase due to motion (i.e. the dynamic
pressure)?
There is no rocket science to increasing manifold pressure, but the
laws of physics will place limits on what you can do. Going faster
will increase the dynamic pressure, which will increase the total
pressure, which will mean more manifold pressure. Sort of a Catch 22
here - you want to go faster, so you want more manifold pressure.
But you'll get more manifold pressure if you can figure out how to go
faster.
Have an air inlet with the lowest amount of frictional losses. The
frictional losses are at the outside surface of the air inlet. So,
you want the shape that has the least amount of circumference for a
given area - i.e. a circle.
Turbulence causes pressure losses, so you want smooth contours, and
gentle changes in contour. No steps, or rapidly increasing areas.
You want the shortest possible inlet duct, as that minimizes the
frictional losses.
You might get some benefit from having the air inlet further away
from the prop hub, so you could get some pressure increase from the
prop. Lopresti claimed to have gotten some benefit from this effect,
but it could have been all smoke and mirrors.
You want a smooth surface to the intake ducting and the intake
manifold, to reduce the frictional losses.
You want an air filter with the lowest pressure drop.
Good luck,
Kevin Horton
>
>Dont remember where I came up with 1"???? Somewhere somebody posted the
>calculated pressure available at 8k density alt for a standard day?. Well
>we have had a few standard days here in the last month, I checked and saw
>1" more than calculated at 185 MPH. Have no idea if this is right. I have
>paid real attention to detail on sealing up everything I can on the air
>box. It pained me to even add the drain hole for the FAB.
>
>Now after all this I just remember I was told that you cannot use the
>barometric pressure as a comparison/base line to MP. Any info on this? How
>and why are they different? If barometric pressure is 30.0 would max
>manifold pressure also be the same barring any losses in the system?
>
>
>>
>>Hi Scott,
>>
>>I am still learning about these things but maybe I can help. I'm curious
>>how you deduced the 1" MP increase due to ram air? It is interesting because
>>at 170 mph you can expect about 1" of mercury pressure available at the air
>>box. This can be calculated based on the formula for the dynamic pressure of
>>a fluid where
>>
>>P = (V**2 d)/288 g
>>
>>where:
>>
>> P = lbs per sq. inch (psi)
>>V = Velocity in feet per second (1mph = 1446 fps)
>>d = density of air in pounds pwe cu. ft., standard sea level air density
>>0.0762 pounds per cubic foot.
>>g = acceleration of gravity in feet per second (32.2 feet per second)
>>
>>Based on this formulation at:
>>
>>170 mph =~1"hg
>>300 mph =~3"hg
>>
>>To increase your Ram air pressure you can eliminate pressure drops, across
>>air filters, induction systems, etc. For example a poorly designed air box
>>may have a large pressure drop. Porting of the intake manifold and intake
>>chambers on the head can help reduce pressure drop. Keep in mind that you
>>are working with rather small increases in performance here for increasingly
>>higher dollar costs. If you have the Van's FAB then you probably have a very
>>low psi drop air box already.
>>
>>Your Fellow RV Enthusiast,
>>Ned
>>
>>----- Original Message -----
>>From: "Scott Bilinski" <bilinski@kyocera-wireless.com>
>>To:
>>Subject: RV-List: MP/Ram Air Question
>>
>>
>><bilinski@kyocera-wireless.com>
>>>
>>> Is there anyone out there who understands MP, ram air induction, and what
>>> can be done to increase ram air pressure? I appear to be seeing about 1"
>>MP
>>> increase due to ram air. Can I get more? Is there a limit? Would a bigger
>>> FAB help? Larger snorkel intake? Smaller snorkel intake? Any advice
>>> appreciated.
>>>
>>>
> >> Scott Bilinski
> >>
>>>
>>
>>
>
>Scott Bilinski
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Wheeler North <wnorth(at)sdccd.cc.ca.us> |
Honda civic engines are one of the very few that spin like a aircraft
engine, so their fans should work. I'm not sure my cowl would not hit the
external fan though if one were installed.
RE reverse spinning the alt is no problem as long as you are below roughly
50% rated duty. The main problem with auto alternators is they are not rated
for continous duty as aircraft ones are. Then you reduce cooling by reverse
spinning the fan and removing the external one (if it had one) and ba da
bing melted parts.
I have tested them on the bench at load both ways and they will smoke
quicker when going backwards, but they will smoke either way if held at
rated power for too long.
That's why I built the big one out of a toyota solara.
http://www.miramarcollege.net/programs/avim/faculty/north/alternator/index.h
tm
W
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Bob U." <rv3(at)comcast.net> |
| Subject: | Re: MP/Ram Air Question |
>>Engine (valves) won't last long with no filter - grit gets
>>onto valve seats and then valves burn rapidly due to hot gas blow-by.
>>
>>David
>>
I've had rings get wiped out, but never valves operating
crop dusters on dirt roads with leaking air boxes.
For the record, there a model of Mooney that allows one to
bypass the filter for improved ram air performance.
Also for the record, I have an early Vans intake air setup in my RV-3.
No filtering unless the carb heat is actuated. Over 700 hours on the
engine with compression in the mid 70's and oil consumption is less
than a quart in 20 hours. I do pull carb heat while taxiing on the
ground to keep the engine clean of damaging abrasive particles.
Would a full time air filter be better for longevity?
Most likely at the expense of ramn air performance.
At any rate, seems Van was not too concerned
when he engineered my early version RV-3 air intake.
Bob
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jim Jewell" <jjewell(at)telus.net> |
| Subject: | Re: alternator cooling |
Listers,
Has anyone actually studied the airflow conditions surrounding the
alternators positioned as they are in the cowlings of Vans RV line?
I have seen little indication that the direction of airflow in the
alternator's confined area of the average RV cowling is clearly understood.
Keep in mind that there is no direct air flow to or from the line of flight
outside airflow.
Airflow in this comparatively cramped corner of the forward lower cowling
might well be considerably dynamically turbulent with very little actual
definable flow direction or rate of flow.
All air movement in the area of the alternator is pre-heated by engine
cooling and further by exhaust system radiant and convective sources.
Cooling therefore is an issue.
The direction of rotation of the stock cooling fan/s is likely to be a
somewhat moot point.
Having the fan/s turn in the fan designer's intended direction where
possible would be the preferred choice.
Adding an additional fan on the units that have only one, might be possible?
but may not be worth the effort.
Blast air is suggested `if not a must' and is not uncommonly applied by
aiming a blast air tube in the general direction of the alternator.
Having the blast air tube fitted to some form of duct that improves the
cooling effect might be desirable on any alternator. The same treatment
focused on the electronics housing for internally regulated regulator types
can only help in the overall.
Of course having additional blast air tubes could help but a line has to be
drawn somewhere.
These alternators survive well in deplorable conditions in the automobiles
that they were designed for. It could be said that though the conditions
under the engine of an RV are different, they are also deplorable at least
from any imaginary ideal condition point of view.
If anyone cares to add to my understanding or shed light on my lack thereof
please do so.
I live to learn,
Jim in Kelowna
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Ned Thomas" <315(at)cox.net> |
Good information and I like that you have actually tested the alternators. I
always wondered how my "Certified" aircraft was able to get the Ford
alternator certified while running it backwards. They didn't even bother to
change the fan. The fan runs backwards... Go figure.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Wheeler North" <wnorth(at)sdccd.cc.ca.us>
Subject: RV-List: alternators
>
> Honda civic engines are one of the very few that spin like a aircraft
> engine, so their fans should work. I'm not sure my cowl would not hit the
> external fan though if one were installed.
>
> RE reverse spinning the alt is no problem as long as you are below roughly
> 50% rated duty. The main problem with auto alternators is they are not
rated
> for continous duty as aircraft ones are. Then you reduce cooling by
reverse
> spinning the fan and removing the external one (if it had one) and ba da
> bing melted parts.
>
> I have tested them on the bench at load both ways and they will smoke
> quicker when going backwards, but they will smoke either way if held at
> rated power for too long.
>
> That's why I built the big one out of a toyota solara.
>
>
http://www.miramarcollege.net/programs/avim/faculty/north/alternator/index.h
> tm
>
> W
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Stein Bruch" <stein(at)steinair.com> |
| Subject: | Exhaust Bracket Failure |
Hi Larry,
Since then Larry is recommending attaching the exhaust to the engine sump
bolts. I broke mine multiple times until I hung them from the two rear
corner sump bolts. Now the exhaust moves with the engine, nearly 200 hrs
trouble free since then. It'll only take you an hour or two to make the
change, and no more exhaust hanger problems!
Cheers,
Stein Bruch
RV6's, Minneapolis
http://www.steinair.com
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of Larry Pardue
Subject: Re: RV-List: Exhaust Bracket Failure
>
> In a message dated 3/4/04 3:21:55 PM Eastern Standard Time,
> n5lp(at)warpdriveonline.com writes:
>
> > Rather than one clamp on the engine mount at each attach point I use two
> > bridged with a piece of heavy aluminum.
> >
> >
>
> Are you attaching the exaust pipes hangers from the engine mount rather
than
> from lower case bolts as indicated in the vettermans instructions?
>
I am attaching to the engine mount as indicated in the Vetterman
instructions that I got. Apparently there are different versions of his
system. I think I got my exhaust about 1998 or 1999.
Larry Pardue
Carlsbad, NM
RV-6 N441LP Flying
http://n5lp.net
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Hopperdhh(at)aol.com |
W,
Thanks for the great web site and sharing your alternator knowledge.
I was a technician for Delco Radio (now Delphi Delco Electronics) back in the
mid to late 60's working on GM's electronic voltage
regulator-in-the-alternator program which first came out on the '68 Pontiac in
limited production.
Within about 3 years it was across the board on all GM cars. At the time even
silicon transistors were not too common. When I first heard what the
temperatures were in the alternator, and what accuracy of regulation we were expected
to
achieve, I wondered if I was working for a bunch of idiots! Anyway, I had
the pleasure of getting to know some of the brightest minds in the business. My
'63 Ford was one of the first, if not the first, to have a regulator inside
the alternator. I took off the generator and made brackets and installed one
of the Delco Remy alternators which was consigned to me by the company.
My first impression of Van's 35 amp installation with no fan was that it
won't last long. Guess what, it didn't. My friend and instructor finished his
RV-9A and the first thing that failed was the charging system. I opened up the
alternator and found solder balls and soot. Has anyone had any LUCK with
these things with no fan? A blast tube alone will not get the air where its
needed, although a blast tube may bring in some cool air for the alternator fan
to
pick up, if it has one.
The problem is that if you have to crank the engine long, or otherwise run
the battery down, the alternator will overheat before you get it to the end of
the runway to take off. You could baby it by leaving the field breaker turned
off, but who wants to have to remember to do that? Not a good situation.
Right now I have Van's 60 amp kit installed on my yet to fly RV-7A, but I
really like your approach. At the first sign of a problem, I'm going that route.
Thanks again,
Dan N766DH (almost done in Indiana)
In a message dated 3/4/04 5:34:45 PM US Eastern Standard Time,
wnorth(at)sdccd.cc.ca.us writes:
>
> That's why I built the big one out of a toyota solara.
>
> http://www.miramarcollege.net/programs/avim/faculty/north/alternator/index.h
> tm
>
> W
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Hopperdhh(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Exhaust Bracket Failure |
Listers,
Rather than flatten the tubes or silver solder to them, I just put a little
flare on them with my flaring tool -- just enough to increase the diameter
about like putting a bead on the tube. A bead would be ideal. After flaring the
tubing, smooth it up on a Scotchbrite wheel so it doesn't cut the rubber
tubing.
Dan RV-7A (almost done)
In a message dated 3/4/04 6:46:33 PM US Eastern Standard Time,
stein(at)steinair.com writes:
> Since then Larry is recommending attaching the exhaust to the engine sump
> bolts. I broke mine multiple times until I hung them from the two rear
> corner sump bolts. Now the exhaust moves with the engine, nearly 200 hrs
> trouble free since then. It'll only take you an hour or two to make the
> change, and no more exhaust hanger problems!
>
> Cheers,
> Stein Bruch
> RV6's, Minneapolis
> http://www.steinair.com
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bill Dube <bdube(at)al.noaa.gov> |
| Subject: | Re: Honda alternator |
>
>If the Honda spins backwards from every other car engine then it would be
>turning the same direction that aircrat engines turn and the alternator
>would be even better?? Right??
Then why are folks complaining that the fan is backwards?
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | finishing up sequence of events? |
Engine and finishing kit on the way. So what's the preferred order of events
between now and riveting on the forward top fuse skin? I can see some things
are on an equal level.
Here's what I'm thinking. No vacuum system for me. I want to put a
Lightspeed on one set of plugs but will wait until after 25 hour fly off.
Mount the engine,
install engine accessories,
fit cowl,
exhaust,
baffles,
oil cooler,
fuel and oil hoses/lines,
throttle, mixture, governor cables from cockpit,
engine monitoring cables and sensors,
finish panel,
???,
cut canopy,
rivet on top skin,
finish front baggage door,
install windscreen,
???
What have I got out of order or am missing?
thanks,
lucky
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | finishing up sequence of events? |
You probably ought to install the Lightspeed up front. It's a good size box
that needs to be mounted on the cabin side of the firewall with penetrations
for 2 coil leads, manifold pressure and timing pick-up and direct-to-battery
power. The Hall effect sensor uses a 9-pin D-sub that needs a large opening
to pass through even if you remove its shell. You really don't want to do
all that after the skin is on. Engine side would certainly be easier but
cabin side was recommended several years ago unless Klaus has changed it
recently.
Regards,
Greg Young - Houston (DWH)
RV-6 N6GY ...project Phoenix
Navion N5221K - just an XXL RV-6A
>
>
> Engine and finishing kit on the way. So what's the preferred
> order of events
> between now and riveting on the forward top fuse skin? I can
> see some things
> are on an equal level.
>
> Here's what I'm thinking. No vacuum system for me. I want to put a
> Lightspeed on one set of plugs but will wait until after 25
> hour fly off.
>
> Mount the engine,
> install engine accessories,
> fit cowl,
> exhaust,
> baffles,
> oil cooler,
> fuel and oil hoses/lines,
> throttle, mixture, governor cables from cockpit,
> engine monitoring cables and sensors,
> finish panel,
> ???,
> cut canopy,
> rivet on top skin,
> finish front baggage door,
> install windscreen,
> ???
>
> What have I got out of order or am missing?
>
> thanks,
> lucky
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Vince Himsl" <vhimsl(at)turbonet.com> |
| Subject: | finishing up sequence of events? |
Hello,
I am there now....It is sort of a chicken and the egg stage isn't it! Well, here's
what I am doing:
Check with Van's Web Site as they have some additional notes/instructions about
mounting the wings, the cowl and I believe
the canopy. Main thing is they say to leave off all the engine doodads as they
get in the way when mounting the cowl.
I haven't mounted the top deck as I am concentrating on firewall penetrations in
the vain hope of minimizing the crawling
around inside when the top deck is on.
I have the engine mounted. Some say to wait till you have mounted the firewall
stuff, but I need the engine on to get an
idea of where everything goes.
I have been held up as I really need to have an idea of the panel before I proceed.
I have decided on NO
fuel/pressure/copper/etc. lines in the cockpit. NO Vacuum instruments. I elaborate
as you need to know this before you
start punching holes in the firewall. Everything on the firewall will be nutplated
so you can imagine trying to do it with
the top deck on. Are you using Lightspeed Electronic Ignition? Then you need to
have a Manifold Pressure line to it and the
coax cables need to seperated from the return sensor wires. This kind of circular
detail can drive one crazy!
Another reason I mention the panel is that the side sections (RV-8) of it are best
dealt with before permanent installation
of the top deck. My ignition switch will go on the right and potentially the carb/cabin
heat will go on the left. Also if
you can nail down the electrical wire routing (again firewall penetrations) you
will be ahead of the game. With apologies
to the traditionalists, I am going with Aeroelectric Bob's recommendations.
There are other things you can be doing in parallel such as the upholstery, seats,
cabin wiring, but you already know that.
So wrapping it all up:
Focus on the firewall and instrument side penetrations (and fuel lines, but you
probably have already done that).
Mount the top deck
Then pick up with the plans at the Canopy.
Of course, that is the game plan for today. Tomorrow could be another story.
Regards,
Vince Himsl
RV8 - SB Finish
"Aerosport and Lightspeed, but still procrastinating on the canopy"
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of RV8ter(at)aol.com
Subject: RV-List: finishing up sequence of events?
Engine and finishing kit on the way. So what's the preferred order of events
between now and riveting on the forward top fuse skin? I can see some things
are on an equal level.
Here's what I'm thinking. No vacuum system for me. I want to put a
Lightspeed on one set of plugs but will wait until after 25 hour fly off.
Mount the engine,
install engine accessories,
fit cowl,
exhaust,
baffles,
oil cooler,
fuel and oil hoses/lines,
throttle, mixture, governor cables from cockpit,
engine monitoring cables and sensors,
finish panel,
???,
cut canopy,
rivet on top skin,
finish front baggage door,
install windscreen,
???
What have I got out of order or am missing?
thanks,
lucky
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Tedd McHenry <tedd(at)vansairforce.org> |
| Subject: | Langley Fly-in 2004 |
The Langley Aero Club and Van's Air Force Western Canada Wing are holding the
third annual Langley Fly-in on Saturday, June 12, 2004 at Langley airport
(CYNJ), Langley, BC (~20 nm north of Bellingham, WA).
Keep an eye on the Fly-in web page for details,
http://www.vansairforce.org/CYNJ
For U.S. visitors, there's a link on the web page to Randall Henderson's
excellent border-crossing information page -- everything the first-time
border-crosser needs to know.
There will be awards for homebuilts, seminars on RV-related topics, and a
representative from Van's Aircraft.
Naturally, we're encouraging anyone who wants to fly in, regardless of what
type of airplane you have. If you plan to attend, and especially if you plan
to fly in, please take the time to sign the Guest Book on the Fly-in web page.
http://www.vansairforce.org/CYNJ/guestbook/lac_sign.html
That will help us plan facilities such as food and washrooms.
Tedd McHenry
Van's Air Force
Western Canada Wing
tedd(at)vansairforce.org
www.vansairforce.org
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "LarryRobertHelming" <lhelming(at)sigecom.net> |
| Subject: | Re: alternator cooling |
With using a blast air tube for cooling the alternator, is there any concern
about flying into rain and having rain water coming through the tube onto
the back of the alternator?
Indiana Larry, RV7 Tip-up TMX-O-360 ACS2002 Dynon CNS430 Digitrak JeffRose
Firewall Forward
----- Original Message -----
From: "Jim Jewell" <jjewell(at)telus.net>
Subject: Re: RV-List: alternator cooling
>
> Listers,
>
> Has anyone actually studied the airflow conditions surrounding the
> alternators positioned as they are in the cowlings of Vans RV line?
>
> I have seen little indication that the direction of airflow in the
> alternator's confined area of the average RV cowling is clearly
understood.
> Keep in mind that there is no direct air flow to or from the line of
flight
> outside airflow.
> Airflow in this comparatively cramped corner of the forward lower cowling
> might well be considerably dynamically turbulent with very little actual
> definable flow direction or rate of flow.
>
> All air movement in the area of the alternator is pre-heated by engine
> cooling and further by exhaust system radiant and convective sources.
> Cooling therefore is an issue.
> The direction of rotation of the stock cooling fan/s is likely to be a
> somewhat moot point.
> Having the fan/s turn in the fan designer's intended direction where
> possible would be the preferred choice.
> Adding an additional fan on the units that have only one, might be
possible?
> but may not be worth the effort.
> Blast air is suggested `if not a must' and is not uncommonly applied by
> aiming a blast air tube in the general direction of the alternator.
> Having the blast air tube fitted to some form of duct that improves the
> cooling effect might be desirable on any alternator. The same treatment
> focused on the electronics housing for internally regulated regulator
types
> can only help in the overall.
> Of course having additional blast air tubes could help but a line has to
be
> drawn somewhere.
>
> These alternators survive well in deplorable conditions in the automobiles
> that they were designed for. It could be said that though the conditions
> under the engine of an RV are different, they are also deplorable at least
> from any imaginary ideal condition point of view.
>
>
> If anyone cares to add to my understanding or shed light on my lack
thereof
> please do so.
>
> I live to learn,
>
> Jim in Kelowna
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Jason Sneed <n242ds(at)cox.net> |
| Subject: | Help me stop my engine |
For the last 2 months I have had a problem I can not figure out and
wanted to see if anyone has a direction to point me. I have a 6 with a
o-360 with the airflow performance fuel injection system. When I
shutdown, the engine is dieseling really bad. I did not know the term
dieseling but it basically means the engine will not shutdown fuel gets
ignited somehow and keeps turning the engine over. I pull the mixture
to idle cut off and then hit the electronic ignition and the mag and
the master. I do all this with about 1000 rpm. Before this started
happening I could shutdown any way I wanted with no problem. The only
way to get the prop to stop spinning and vibrating the heck out of the
airplane is to shove the mixture to full rich while everything else is
off and the engine is just dieseling. Not only is this causing damage
(exhaust breakage) it is dangerous. Tonight I cleaned (sand blasted)
all the top plugs, this made no difference. Has anyone had this
happen? What should I do next? I am suspect of the mixture control but
last time I checked the control was hitting the stop. The only thing I
did right before this happened was add avblend to the oil (I know that
should have nothing to do with the problem). The oil has been changed
since the avblend and I still have the problem.
Any ideas to help my RV not come off as a clunker on the flight line?
Jason Sneed
Commercial Lending Officer
First National Bank and Trust
http://www.highland-parks.com/n242ds/index.html
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | John Huft <aflyer(at)direcway.com> |
| Subject: | MP/Ram Air Question |
Well, thanks guys, a useful discussion.
I have spent the last couple of months developing a ram/alternate/filtered
air system. When I am finished I will offer parts for sale...see me at sun n
fun.
I have been testing the ram pressure rise by noting the manifold pressure
before I start the engine, then again at the same altitude 5 miles south of
the airport at cruise speed. I live in the mountains so that is easy, though
it happens at 7650 msl.
More to follow.
John Huft
RV8 flying
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of Kevin Horton
Subject: Re: RV-List: MP/Ram Air Question
A few comments:
1. The ambient pressure is directly related to the pressure altitude,
but the pressure does not vary with temperature. So, there is no
direct relationship between density altitude and ambient pressure.
So forget all about density altitude for this discussion. Just
consider pressure altitude (i.e. what the altimeter reads when you
set it to 29.92).
2. There are a whole bunch of different pressures that we can talk
about, and it is hard to have a clear discussion unless we are sure
we are talking about the same pressures.
Ambient pressure (or static pressure) - the actual pressure in the
atmosphere at the altitude in question. There is a direct
relationship between ambient pressure and pressure altitude. You can
find the equations for the relationship between pressure altitude and
ambient pressure at:
http://williams.best.vwh.net/avform.htm#Altimetry
Dynamic pressure - this is the pressure increase due to speed, in simple
terms.
http://www.centennialofflight.gov/essay/Dictionary/Dynamic_Pressure/DI142.ht
m
Total pressure - this is the sum of ambient pressure and dynamic
pressure. It is the pressure that we get if we take the air and slow
it down to zero speed (looking at it from the perspective of the
aircraft). This is the pressure that we could get inside the
induction air scoop, if we actually could get the air to come to a
stop relative to the aircraft. In reality, the air has to keep
moving, as the engine needs to keep consuming it, so we can never get
the pressure quite this high.
Pressure before the air filter - this pressure will generally be
somewhat less than the total pressure, unless we manage to position
our intake to get some pressure increase due to the propeller.
Pressure after the air filter - air will not flow unless there is a
pressure differential, so the pressure after the filter has to be
lower than the pressure ahead of the filter. The pressure loss as
the air goes through the filter seems to be about 1" HG, at least
based on what some people have reported.
Manifold pressure - this is the pressure that we have at the intake
manifold, right next to the intake port. There are pressure losses
as the air flows through the carb (or fuel injection servo) and the
intake manifold plumbing.
So, the manifold pressure will be equal to the ambient pressure +
dynamic pressure - small error because the air never actually goes to
zero speed - pressure loss through the air filter - pressure loss
through the carb and intake manifold. So, depending on how fast we
going (which will largely determine the dynamic pressure), and what
the various pressure losses are, the manifold pressure may be more or
less than the ambient pressure.
So, you are seeing about a 1" pressure increase due to ram air.
Which pressure has increased by 1"? 1" relative to what? The
manifold pressure? What do you mean by ram air? Do you mean that
you have a way to bypass the air filter? Or do you mean that you are
looking at the pressure increase due to motion (i.e. the dynamic
pressure)?
There is no rocket science to increasing manifold pressure, but the
laws of physics will place limits on what you can do. Going faster
will increase the dynamic pressure, which will increase the total
pressure, which will mean more manifold pressure. Sort of a Catch 22
here - you want to go faster, so you want more manifold pressure.
But you'll get more manifold pressure if you can figure out how to go
faster.
Have an air inlet with the lowest amount of frictional losses. The
frictional losses are at the outside surface of the air inlet. So,
you want the shape that has the least amount of circumference for a
given area - i.e. a circle.
Turbulence causes pressure losses, so you want smooth contours, and
gentle changes in contour. No steps, or rapidly increasing areas.
You want the shortest possible inlet duct, as that minimizes the
frictional losses.
You might get some benefit from having the air inlet further away
from the prop hub, so you could get some pressure increase from the
prop. Lopresti claimed to have gotten some benefit from this effect,
but it could have been all smoke and mirrors.
You want a smooth surface to the intake ducting and the intake
manifold, to reduce the frictional losses.
You want an air filter with the lowest pressure drop.
Good luck,
Kevin Horton
<bilinski@kyocera-wireless.com>
>
>Dont remember where I came up with 1"???? Somewhere somebody posted the
>calculated pressure available at 8k density alt for a standard day?. Well
>we have had a few standard days here in the last month, I checked and saw
>1" more than calculated at 185 MPH. Have no idea if this is right. I have
>paid real attention to detail on sealing up everything I can on the air
>box. It pained me to even add the drain hole for the FAB.
>
>Now after all this I just remember I was told that you cannot use the
>barometric pressure as a comparison/base line to MP. Any info on this? How
>and why are they different? If barometric pressure is 30.0 would max
>manifold pressure also be the same barring any losses in the system?
>
>
>>
>>Hi Scott,
>>
>>I am still learning about these things but maybe I can help. I'm curious
>>how you deduced the 1" MP increase due to ram air? It is interesting
because
>>at 170 mph you can expect about 1" of mercury pressure available at the
air
>>box. This can be calculated based on the formula for the dynamic pressure
of
>>a fluid where
>>
>>P = (V**2 d)/288 g
>>
>>where:
>>
>> P = lbs per sq. inch (psi)
>>V = Velocity in feet per second (1mph = 1446 fps)
>>d = density of air in pounds pwe cu. ft., standard sea level air density
>>0.0762 pounds per cubic foot.
>>g = acceleration of gravity in feet per second (32.2 feet per second)
>>
>>Based on this formulation at:
>>
>>170 mph =~1"hg
>>300 mph =~3"hg
>>
>>To increase your Ram air pressure you can eliminate pressure drops, across
>>air filters, induction systems, etc. For example a poorly designed air box
>>may have a large pressure drop. Porting of the intake manifold and intake
>>chambers on the head can help reduce pressure drop. Keep in mind that you
>>are working with rather small increases in performance here for
increasingly
>>higher dollar costs. If you have the Van's FAB then you probably have a
very
>>low psi drop air box already.
>>
>>Your Fellow RV Enthusiast,
>>Ned
>>
>>----- Original Message -----
>>From: "Scott Bilinski" <bilinski@kyocera-wireless.com>
>>To:
>>Subject: RV-List: MP/Ram Air Question
>>
>>
>><bilinski@kyocera-wireless.com>
>>>
>>> Is there anyone out there who understands MP, ram air induction, and
what
>>> can be done to increase ram air pressure? I appear to be seeing about
1"
>>MP
>>> increase due to ram air. Can I get more? Is there a limit? Would a
bigger
>>> FAB help? Larger snorkel intake? Smaller snorkel intake? Any advice
>>> appreciated.
>>>
>>>
> >> Scott Bilinski
> >>
>>>
>>
>>
>
>Scott Bilinski
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jim Cimino" <jcimino(at)echoes.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Help me stop my engine |
Lower your idle.
Jim
----- Original Message -----
From: "Jason Sneed" <n242ds(at)cox.net>
Subject: RV-List: Help me stop my engine
>
> For the last 2 months I have had a problem I can not figure out and
> wanted to see if anyone has a direction to point me. I have a 6 with a
> o-360 with the airflow performance fuel injection system. When I
> shutdown, the engine is dieseling really bad. I did not know the term
> dieseling but it basically means the engine will not shutdown fuel gets
> ignited somehow and keeps turning the engine over. I pull the mixture
> to idle cut off and then hit the electronic ignition and the mag and
> the master. I do all this with about 1000 rpm. Before this started
> happening I could shutdown any way I wanted with no problem. The only
> way to get the prop to stop spinning and vibrating the heck out of the
> airplane is to shove the mixture to full rich while everything else is
> off and the engine is just dieseling. Not only is this causing damage
> (exhaust breakage) it is dangerous. Tonight I cleaned (sand blasted)
> all the top plugs, this made no difference. Has anyone had this
> happen? What should I do next? I am suspect of the mixture control but
> last time I checked the control was hitting the stop. The only thing I
> did right before this happened was add avblend to the oil (I know that
> should have nothing to do with the problem). The oil has been changed
> since the avblend and I still have the problem.
>
> Any ideas to help my RV not come off as a clunker on the flight line?
>
>
> Jason Sneed
> Commercial Lending Officer
> First National Bank and Trust
> http://www.highland-parks.com/n242ds/index.html
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Terry Watson" <terry(at)tcwatson.com> |
| Subject: | Help me stop my engine |
Jason,
I have heard that this is the biggest reason for installing the purge valve
with an Airflow Performance fuel injection system. For some reason the
mixture apparently doesn't always shut the fuel off enough to stop the
engine. Pulling the purge valve diverts the fuel from the injectors to the
return line and the engine quits.
Note that this is not from my own experience. I am still at the wiring
stage, but my Superior XP-IO-360-B1B came from Bart with the purge valve
already installed. A call to Airflow Performance ought to get you an
authoritative answer.
Terry
RV-8A #80729 wiring
For the last 2 months I have had a problem I can not figure out and
wanted to see if anyone has a direction to point me. I have a 6 with a
o-360 with the airflow performance fuel injection system. When I
shutdown, the engine is dieseling really bad. I did not know the term
dieseling but it basically means the engine will not shutdown fuel gets
ignited somehow and keeps turning the engine over. I pull the mixture
to idle cut off and then hit the electronic ignition and the mag and
the master.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jim Jewell" <jjewell(at)telus.net> |
| Subject: | Re: alternator cooling |
Hi Larry,
Rain water should not be an issue.
For me the fret level is very low in regard to the amount of water that
might find it's way to the alternator via the blast tube. I am quite sure
that the cars boats etc.that these units live in subject them to more
moisture road filth and various other chemical pollution (anti freeze etc.)
than your aircraft will see before TBO comes around.
Firewall Forward huh, have baffling fun ! [:-)
Jim in Kelowna
From: "LarryRobertHelming" <lhelming(at)sigecom.net>
Subject: Re: RV-List: alternator cooling
>
> With using a blast air tube for cooling the alternator, is there any
concern
> about flying into rain and having rain water coming through the tube onto
> the back of the alternator?
>
> Indiana Larry, RV7 Tip-up TMX-O-360 ACS2002 Dynon CNS430 Digitrak JeffRose
> Firewall Forward
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Jason Sneed <n242ds(at)cox.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Help me stop my engine |
I'll give them a call tomorrow.... The weird thing is that the engine
went 275 hours without having this problem.
Thanks,
Jason
On Mar 4, 2004, at 10:21 PM, Terry Watson wrote:
>
> Jason,
>
> I have heard that this is the biggest reason for installing the purge
> valve
> with an Airflow Performance fuel injection system. For some reason the
> mixture apparently doesn't always shut the fuel off enough to stop the
> engine. Pulling the purge valve diverts the fuel from the injectors
> to the
> return line and the engine quits.
>
> Note that this is not from my own experience. I am still at the wiring
> stage, but my Superior XP-IO-360-B1B came from Bart with the purge
> valve
> already installed. A call to Airflow Performance ought to get you an
> authoritative answer.
>
> Terry
> RV-8A #80729 wiring
>
>
> For the last 2 months I have had a problem I can not figure out and
> wanted to see if anyone has a direction to point me. I have a 6 with a
> o-360 with the airflow performance fuel injection system. When I
> shutdown, the engine is dieseling really bad. I did not know the term
> dieseling but it basically means the engine will not shutdown fuel gets
> ignited somehow and keeps turning the engine over. I pull the mixture
> to idle cut off and then hit the electronic ignition and the mag and
> the master.
>
>
> _-
> =======================================================================
> _-
> =======================================================================
> _-
> =======================================================================
> _-
> =======================================================================
> >
>
>
Jason Sneed
Commercial Lending Officer
First National Bank and Trust
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Jason Sneed <n242ds(at)cox.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Help me stop my engine |
Jim... Tried that.... It is worse when I shutdown at 600 rpm.
On Mar 4, 2004, at 10:17 PM, Jim Cimino wrote:
>
> Lower your idle.
> Jim
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Jason Sneed" <n242ds(at)cox.net>
> To:
> Subject: RV-List: Help me stop my engine
>
>
>>
>> For the last 2 months I have had a problem I can not figure out and
>> wanted to see if anyone has a direction to point me. I have a 6 with a
>> o-360 with the airflow performance fuel injection system. When I
>> shutdown, the engine is dieseling really bad. I did not know the term
>> dieseling but it basically means the engine will not shutdown fuel
>> gets
>> ignited somehow and keeps turning the engine over. I pull the mixture
>> to idle cut off and then hit the electronic ignition and the mag and
>> the master. I do all this with about 1000 rpm. Before this started
>> happening I could shutdown any way I wanted with no problem. The only
>> way to get the prop to stop spinning and vibrating the heck out of the
>> airplane is to shove the mixture to full rich while everything else is
>> off and the engine is just dieseling. Not only is this causing damage
>> (exhaust breakage) it is dangerous. Tonight I cleaned (sand blasted)
>> all the top plugs, this made no difference. Has anyone had this
>> happen? What should I do next? I am suspect of the mixture control but
>> last time I checked the control was hitting the stop. The only thing I
>> did right before this happened was add avblend to the oil (I know that
>> should have nothing to do with the problem). The oil has been changed
>> since the avblend and I still have the problem.
>>
>> Any ideas to help my RV not come off as a clunker on the flight line?
>>
>>
>> Jason Sneed
>> Commercial Lending Officer
>> First National Bank and Trust
>> http://www.highland-parks.com/n242ds/index.html
>>
>>
>
>
> _-
> =======================================================================
> _-
> =======================================================================
> _-
> =======================================================================
> _-
> =======================================================================
> >
>
>
Jason Sneed
Commercial Lending Officer
First National Bank and Trust
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | linn walters <lwalters2(at)cfl.rr.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Help me stop my engine |
Jason Sneed wrote:
>
>For the last 2 months I have had a problem I can not figure out and
>wanted to see if anyone has a direction to point me. I have a 6 with a
>o-360 with the airflow performance fuel injection system. When I
>shutdown, the engine is dieseling really bad. I did not know the term
>dieseling but it basically means the engine will not shutdown fuel gets
>ignited somehow and keeps turning the engine over. I pull the mixture
>to idle cut off and then hit the electronic ignition and the mag and
>the master. I do all this with about 1000 rpm. Before this started
>happening I could shutdown any way I wanted with no problem. The only
>way to get the prop to stop spinning and vibrating the heck out of the
>airplane is to shove the mixture to full rich while everything else is
>off and the engine is just dieseling. Not only is this causing damage
>(exhaust breakage) it is dangerous. Tonight I cleaned (sand blasted)
>all the top plugs, this made no difference. Has anyone had this
>happen? What should I do next? I am suspect of the mixture control but
>last time I checked the control was hitting the stop. The only thing I
>did right before this happened was add avblend to the oil (I know that
>should have nothing to do with the problem). The oil has been changed
>since the avblend and I still have the problem.
>
>Any ideas to help my RV not come off as a clunker on the flight line?
>
>
>Jason Sneed
>Commercial Lending Officer
>First National Bank and Trust
>http://www.highland-parks.com/n242ds/index.html
>
Well, I suspect that you may have a worn idle cutoff valve, or an intake
leak, or both. The intake leak is easier to diagnose. Take a vacuum
cleaner that you can attach the hose to the output. Clean the vacuum
really good, and stuff the hose in the intake, and seal with a couple of
rags. Turn the vacuum on ans spray really soapy water all over the
intake system. Bubbles will tell you where the leaks are. 'Course this
works much better with the cowl off.
If no leaks are found, then you might try putting the throttle a little
way in and then moving the mixture to idle cut-off ..... and if it still
diesels, open up the throttle. That should create a really lean
condition and stop the dieseling.
If that doesn't work, then we have the carb. The carb is harder to
diagnose and I don't have any good way to test it. The option may be to
send it off for a rebuild.
Good luck,
Linn
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Ross Scroggs" <rv4ross(at)charter.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Help me stop my engine |
The idle speed is a good answer but here is something else. Do you have a
primer?
If so, make sure it is locked in the off position and not allowing just
enough fuel to pass
into a couple of cylinders. It could be locked but still allowing fuel to
pass. Might want
to check it.
Ross Scroggs
Locust Grove, Ga.
RV4 #3911 Wings
----- Original Message -----
From: "Jason Sneed" <n242ds(at)cox.net>
Subject: RV-List: Help me stop my engine
>
> For the last 2 months I have had a problem I can not figure out and
> wanted to see if anyone has a direction to point me. I have a 6 with a
> o-360 with the airflow performance fuel injection system. When I
> shutdown, the engine is dieseling really bad. I did not know the term
> dieseling but it basically means the engine will not shutdown fuel gets
> ignited somehow and keeps turning the engine over. I pull the mixture
> to idle cut off and then hit the electronic ignition and the mag and
> the master. I do all this with about 1000 rpm. Before this started
> happening I could shutdown any way I wanted with no problem. The only
> way to get the prop to stop spinning and vibrating the heck out of the
> airplane is to shove the mixture to full rich while everything else is
> off and the engine is just dieseling. Not only is this causing damage
> (exhaust breakage) it is dangerous. Tonight I cleaned (sand blasted)
> all the top plugs, this made no difference. Has anyone had this
> happen? What should I do next? I am suspect of the mixture control but
> last time I checked the control was hitting the stop. The only thing I
> did right before this happened was add avblend to the oil (I know that
> should have nothing to do with the problem). The oil has been changed
> since the avblend and I still have the problem.
>
> Any ideas to help my RV not come off as a clunker on the flight line?
>
>
> Jason Sneed
> Commercial Lending Officer
> First National Bank and Trust
> http://www.highland-parks.com/n242ds/index.html
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Jason Sneed <n242ds(at)cox.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Help me stop my engine |
Thanks Ross... I have a boost pump that I just turn on until I get 4
GPH on the fuel flow gauge then turn it off and hit the started button.
Thanks,
Jason
On Mar 4, 2004, at 10:59 PM, Ross Scroggs wrote:
>
> The idle speed is a good answer but here is something else. Do you
> have a
> primer?
> If so, make sure it is locked in the off position and not allowing just
> enough fuel to pass
> into a couple of cylinders. It could be locked but still allowing
> fuel to
> pass. Might want
> to check it.
>
> Ross Scroggs
> Locust Grove, Ga.
> RV4 #3911 Wings
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Jason Sneed" <n242ds(at)cox.net>
> To:
> Subject: RV-List: Help me stop my engine
>
>
>>
>> For the last 2 months I have had a problem I can not figure out and
>> wanted to see if anyone has a direction to point me. I have a 6 with a
>> o-360 with the airflow performance fuel injection system. When I
>> shutdown, the engine is dieseling really bad. I did not know the term
>> dieseling but it basically means the engine will not shutdown fuel
>> gets
>> ignited somehow and keeps turning the engine over. I pull the mixture
>> to idle cut off and then hit the electronic ignition and the mag and
>> the master. I do all this with about 1000 rpm. Before this started
>> happening I could shutdown any way I wanted with no problem. The only
>> way to get the prop to stop spinning and vibrating the heck out of the
>> airplane is to shove the mixture to full rich while everything else is
>> off and the engine is just dieseling. Not only is this causing damage
>> (exhaust breakage) it is dangerous. Tonight I cleaned (sand blasted)
>> all the top plugs, this made no difference. Has anyone had this
>> happen? What should I do next? I am suspect of the mixture control but
>> last time I checked the control was hitting the stop. The only thing I
>> did right before this happened was add avblend to the oil (I know that
>> should have nothing to do with the problem). The oil has been changed
>> since the avblend and I still have the problem.
>>
>> Any ideas to help my RV not come off as a clunker on the flight line?
>>
>>
>> Jason Sneed
>> Commercial Lending Officer
>> First National Bank and Trust
>> http://www.highland-parks.com/n242ds/index.html
>>
>>
>
>
> _-
> =======================================================================
> _-
> =======================================================================
> _-
> =======================================================================
> _-
> =======================================================================
> >
>
>
Jason Sneed
Commercial Lending Officer
First National Bank and Trust
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jim Jewell" <jjewell(at)telus.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Help me stop my engine |
Hi Jason,
Not being a fuel injection person I cannot supply precise touble shooting
information.
However, dieseling can only occur when fuel is allowed to continue to flow
into the combustion chambers even though you seemingly have shut it off.
This would indicate things such as an internal valve is not sealing as it
should, a sticking throttle staying open a bit might allow fuel to flow or
as suggested a primming circut could be involved.
Have you been watching the EGTs and CHTs for abnormal behavior.
If extra fuel is getting through the system throughout the normal engine
operation modes it might be promoting excess carbon buildup in the
cylinders. This also would be consistant with the kind of running on that
you describe.
A call to the maker of your injection system is in order.
I am inclined to suggest that you should not run this engine again until
some serious trouble shooting is done and satisfactory results are achived.
In serious cases internal engine damage due to dieseling is also quite
possible.
Let us know how it works out, good luck,
Jin in Kelowna
----- Original Message -----
From: "Jason Sneed" <n242ds(at)cox.net>
Subject: RV-List: Help me stop my engine
>
> For the last 2 months I have had a problem I can not figure out and
> wanted to see if anyone has a direction to point me. I have a 6 with a
> o-360 with the airflow performance fuel injection system. When I
> shutdown, the engine is dieseling really bad. I did not know the term
> dieseling but it basically means the engine will not shutdown fuel gets
> ignited somehow and keeps turning the engine over. I pull the mixture
> to idle cut off and then hit the electronic ignition and the mag and
> the master. I do all this with about 1000 rpm. Before this started
> happening I could shutdown any way I wanted with no problem. The only
> way to get the prop to stop spinning and vibrating the heck out of the
> airplane is to shove the mixture to full rich while everything else is
> off and the engine is just dieseling. Not only is this causing damage
> (exhaust breakage) it is dangerous. Tonight I cleaned (sand blasted)
> all the top plugs, this made no difference. Has anyone had this
> happen? What should I do next? I am suspect of the mixture control but
> last time I checked the control was hitting the stop. The only thing I
> did right before this happened was add avblend to the oil (I know that
> should have nothing to do with the problem). The oil has been changed
> since the avblend and I still have the problem.
>
> Any ideas to help my RV not come off as a clunker on the flight line?
>
>
> Jason Sneed
> Commercial Lending Officer
> First National Bank and Trust
> http://www.highland-parks.com/n242ds/index.html
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Dan Checkoway" <dan(at)rvproject.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Help me stop my engine |
Jason, I want to reiterate what Terry said. Read the AFP manual and you'll
see that they even state (I forget where, but it's in there), that pulling
the mixture will still allow X fuel flow, and that the purge valve is the
way they encourage shutdowns.
)_( Dan
RV-7 N714D
http://www.rvproject.com
----- Original Message -----
From: "Terry Watson" <terry(at)tcwatson.com>
Subject: RE: RV-List: Help me stop my engine
>
> Jason,
>
> I have heard that this is the biggest reason for installing the purge
valve
> with an Airflow Performance fuel injection system. For some reason the
> mixture apparently doesn't always shut the fuel off enough to stop the
> engine. Pulling the purge valve diverts the fuel from the injectors to
the
> return line and the engine quits.
>
> Note that this is not from my own experience. I am still at the wiring
> stage, but my Superior XP-IO-360-B1B came from Bart with the purge valve
> already installed. A call to Airflow Performance ought to get you an
> authoritative answer.
>
> Terry
> RV-8A #80729 wiring
>
>
> For the last 2 months I have had a problem I can not figure out and
> wanted to see if anyone has a direction to point me. I have a 6 with a
> o-360 with the airflow performance fuel injection system. When I
> shutdown, the engine is dieseling really bad. I did not know the term
> dieseling but it basically means the engine will not shutdown fuel gets
> ignited somehow and keeps turning the engine over. I pull the mixture
> to idle cut off and then hit the electronic ignition and the mag and
> the master.
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Stein Bruch" <stein(at)steinair.com> |
| Subject: | RSA Injection Basics, was (Help me stop my engine) . |
I'll pre-emp this by saying I'm not trying to flame anyone here, I just
can't think of the politically correct words to type, and since I'm a "tell
it like it is" kind of guy, here you go!
OK....Time for a quick lesson on injection....Obviously more than a couple
people could use some basics on injection (really, I mean this helpfully,
not sarcastically).
#1) The RSA/AFP injection systems are pretty simple, not much to go wrong.
#2) The RSA/AFP injection system does NOT use a separate primer circuit at
all...see #3)
#3) The RSA/AFP injection system is a constant flow system, meaning that
(hopefully) anytime the mixture is not in ICO, fuel is flowing into the
intake ports if either the engine is running or the mixture is not in ICO.
Priming is accomplished by moving the mixture to rich, and turning on the
boost pump for a specified amount of time (seems different on each persons
Lyc), usually 4-8 seconds. These fuel systems run around 20-30psi, instead
of 2-4psi for the carb's.
#4) The AFP purge valve is usually installed to help starting, NOT stopping
a F.I. Lyc. The problem with the RSA type system that has the bare
Stainless Steel distribution lines above the cylinder, is that usually after
shutdown, the fuel remaining in distribution lines is boiled and ends up in
the intake ports, resulting in a "pseudo" flooded engine - more like just an
abundance of fuel/vapors. Since a typical FI system has the metered fuel
line running from the servo up to the spider on top of the engine routed
between cylinders #1 & #3, all of these components contribute to quick heat
soaking if fuel is not moving through them. The spider/flow divider has a
small ball/check valve installed in them to help with this phenomenon.
#5) The thought behind the purge valve is to allow an operator to circulate
fresh cool fuel to the flow divider before starting the engine and gettin
rid of all the vapor bubbles in the line to that point. At least that's the
claim, in real life, I've seen little benefit on heat soaked engine/hot day
combinations between my -360 w/o a purge valve and the guys that have them
installed. Without electronic ignition, they all can be a bear to start
when hot/hot.
#6) Using the purge valve to shutoff the engine is not a wise thing, you're
just "bandaiding" the real problem, which obviously is with the servo / ICO
itself.
#7) The Servo uses "blast tubes" to measure the air moving through the
servo. These only start working above a normal idle, as at normal idle, the
butterfly is almost completely close. Hence the Idle circuit builit into
the servo. This is an adjustable circuit which allows the operator to adjust
a flow of fuel relative to the throttle being at idle. Like I just said,
the idle mixture adjustment is hooked to the throttle, NOT the mixture, so
you adjust the fuel flow at idle accordingly.
Here's where I would start. Check the adjustment on the idle mixture arm,
it's the little square threaded portion with the spring keeper / star shaped
wheel in the center of it. Make sure that hasn't either moved a great deal
or even come disconnected. Make sure you are still getting a small rise in
RPM right before ICO. If not, then it's a prett good indication that the
idle mixture is out of adjustment.
Either way, I would start with the idle mixture adjustment. This can be
done with the engine idling and you can adjust it with the engine running.
WARNING -DO NOT DO THIS ALONE, make sure someone is in the cockpit holding
the breaks, and WARNING - WATCH THE PROP, always keep one hand holding onto
the engine mount. The smart thing to do is basically sit on the wheel with
the L/G between your legs to keep yourself from accidentally falling into
the prop. This is for a TD, don'e know about a nosewheel airplane. If
you're not comfortable working on a running engine, DON'T do it, get someone
who is experienced to do it. Too many accidents have happened that way!
The fact that you're having problems at slower idle would also point the the
above diagnosis. You should easily be able to get these things to lope
along at 550-650RPM.
When idling, do you get any backfiring, or is the exhaust puffing white or
black colored smoke?? Also indicates something amiss with the idle mixture
or as mentioned earlier, a possible induction leak, althought an induction
lead shouldn't have any bearing on the engine continuing to get fuel after
ICO.
OK, that's it for my rant. The idle mixture can be a finiky thing when out
of adjustment, so I'd start there. If no progress, then something else is
wrong. Last thing, check the mixture arm on the servo to make sure it has't
moved a notch or something like that - I've seen it happen! The servo's
should be good for at least 1500hrs, or engine TBO if taken care of and kept
in adjustment. Usually the rubber diaphrams wear out, and the throttle arm
bushings wear, but rarely to they just plain quit working.
Best of luck, keep us informed!
Cheers,
Stein Bruch
RV6's, Minneapolis (1 injected & 1 carb'd).
http://www.steinair.com
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of Jason Sneed
Subject: RV-List: Help me stop my engine
For the last 2 months I have had a problem I can not figure out and
wanted to see if anyone has a direction to point me. I have a 6 with a
o-360 with the airflow performance fuel injection system. When I
shutdown, the engine is dieseling really bad. I did not know the term
dieseling but it basically means the engine will not shutdown fuel gets
ignited somehow and keeps turning the engine over. I pull the mixture
to idle cut off and then hit the electronic ignition and the mag and
the master. I do all this with about 1000 rpm. Before this started
happening I could shutdown any way I wanted with no problem. The only
way to get the prop to stop spinning and vibrating the heck out of the
airplane is to shove the mixture to full rich while everything else is
off and the engine is just dieseling. Not only is this causing damage
(exhaust breakage) it is dangerous. Tonight I cleaned (sand blasted)
all the top plugs, this made no difference. Has anyone had this
happen? What should I do next? I am suspect of the mixture control but
last time I checked the control was hitting the stop. The only thing I
did right before this happened was add avblend to the oil (I know that
should have nothing to do with the problem). The oil has been changed
since the avblend and I still have the problem.
Any ideas to help my RV not come off as a clunker on the flight line?
Jason Sneed
Commercial Lending Officer
First National Bank and Trust
http://www.highland-parks.com/n242ds/index.html
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | linn walters <lwalters2(at)cfl.rr.com> |
| Subject: | Re: RSA Injection Basics, was (Help me stop my engine) . |
Stein, thanks for FI 101. I know more about the system than I did
before. In my post, I read over the FI part. Sorry. As for the
induction leak .... it just makes it easier for the small amount of fuel
available to get enough air to burn.
My question is with the purge valve. Is this a manual valve? If not,
how does it distinguish between vapor and liquid???
Linn
Stein Bruch wrote:
>
>I'll pre-emp this by saying I'm not trying to flame anyone here, I just
>can't think of the politically correct words to type, and since I'm a "tell
>it like it is" kind of guy, here you go!
>
>OK....Time for a quick lesson on injection....Obviously more than a couple
>people could use some basics on injection (really, I mean this helpfully,
>not sarcastically).
>
>#1) The RSA/AFP injection systems are pretty simple, not much to go wrong.
>
>#2) The RSA/AFP injection system does NOT use a separate primer circuit at
>all...see #3)
>
>#3) The RSA/AFP injection system is a constant flow system, meaning that
>(hopefully) anytime the mixture is not in ICO, fuel is flowing into the
>intake ports if either the engine is running or the mixture is not in ICO.
>Priming is accomplished by moving the mixture to rich, and turning on the
>boost pump for a specified amount of time (seems different on each persons
>Lyc), usually 4-8 seconds. These fuel systems run around 20-30psi, instead
>of 2-4psi for the carb's.
>
>#4) The AFP purge valve is usually installed to help starting, NOT stopping
>a F.I. Lyc. The problem with the RSA type system that has the bare
>Stainless Steel distribution lines above the cylinder, is that usually after
>shutdown, the fuel remaining in distribution lines is boiled and ends up in
>the intake ports, resulting in a "pseudo" flooded engine - more like just an
>abundance of fuel/vapors. Since a typical FI system has the metered fuel
>line running from the servo up to the spider on top of the engine routed
>between cylinders #1 & #3, all of these components contribute to quick heat
>soaking if fuel is not moving through them. The spider/flow divider has a
>small ball/check valve installed in them to help with this phenomenon.
>
>#5) The thought behind the purge valve is to allow an operator to circulate
>fresh cool fuel to the flow divider before starting the engine and gettin
>rid of all the vapor bubbles in the line to that point. At least that's the
>claim, in real life, I've seen little benefit on heat soaked engine/hot day
>combinations between my -360 w/o a purge valve and the guys that have them
>installed. Without electronic ignition, they all can be a bear to start
>when hot/hot.
>
>#6) Using the purge valve to shutoff the engine is not a wise thing, you're
>just "bandaiding" the real problem, which obviously is with the servo / ICO
>itself.
>
>#7) The Servo uses "blast tubes" to measure the air moving through the
>servo. These only start working above a normal idle, as at normal idle, the
>butterfly is almost completely close. Hence the Idle circuit builit into
>the servo. This is an adjustable circuit which allows the operator to adjust
>a flow of fuel relative to the throttle being at idle. Like I just said,
>the idle mixture adjustment is hooked to the throttle, NOT the mixture, so
>you adjust the fuel flow at idle accordingly.
>
>Here's where I would start. Check the adjustment on the idle mixture arm,
>it's the little square threaded portion with the spring keeper / star shaped
>wheel in the center of it. Make sure that hasn't either moved a great deal
>or even come disconnected. Make sure you are still getting a small rise in
>RPM right before ICO. If not, then it's a prett good indication that the
>idle mixture is out of adjustment.
>
>Either way, I would start with the idle mixture adjustment. This can be
>done with the engine idling and you can adjust it with the engine running.
>WARNING -DO NOT DO THIS ALONE, make sure someone is in the cockpit holding
>the breaks, and WARNING - WATCH THE PROP, always keep one hand holding onto
>the engine mount. The smart thing to do is basically sit on the wheel with
>the L/G between your legs to keep yourself from accidentally falling into
>the prop. This is for a TD, don'e know about a nosewheel airplane. If
>you're not comfortable working on a running engine, DON'T do it, get someone
>who is experienced to do it. Too many accidents have happened that way!
>
>The fact that you're having problems at slower idle would also point the the
>above diagnosis. You should easily be able to get these things to lope
>along at 550-650RPM.
>
>When idling, do you get any backfiring, or is the exhaust puffing white or
>black colored smoke?? Also indicates something amiss with the idle mixture
>or as mentioned earlier, a possible induction leak, althought an induction
>lead shouldn't have any bearing on the engine continuing to get fuel after
>ICO.
>
>OK, that's it for my rant. The idle mixture can be a finiky thing when out
>of adjustment, so I'd start there. If no progress, then something else is
>wrong. Last thing, check the mixture arm on the servo to make sure it has't
>moved a notch or something like that - I've seen it happen! The servo's
>should be good for at least 1500hrs, or engine TBO if taken care of and kept
>in adjustment. Usually the rubber diaphrams wear out, and the throttle arm
>bushings wear, but rarely to they just plain quit working.
>
>Best of luck, keep us informed!
>
>Cheers,
>Stein Bruch
>RV6's, Minneapolis (1 injected & 1 carb'd).
>
>http://www.steinair.com
>
>
>-----Original Message-----
>From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
>[mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of Jason Sneed
>To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
>Subject: RV-List: Help me stop my engine
>
>
>For the last 2 months I have had a problem I can not figure out and
>wanted to see if anyone has a direction to point me. I have a 6 with a
>o-360 with the airflow performance fuel injection system. When I
>shutdown, the engine is dieseling really bad. I did not know the term
>dieseling but it basically means the engine will not shutdown fuel gets
>ignited somehow and keeps turning the engine over. I pull the mixture
>to idle cut off and then hit the electronic ignition and the mag and
>the master. I do all this with about 1000 rpm. Before this started
>happening I could shutdown any way I wanted with no problem. The only
>way to get the prop to stop spinning and vibrating the heck out of the
>airplane is to shove the mixture to full rich while everything else is
>off and the engine is just dieseling. Not only is this causing damage
>(exhaust breakage) it is dangerous. Tonight I cleaned (sand blasted)
>all the top plugs, this made no difference. Has anyone had this
>happen? What should I do next? I am suspect of the mixture control but
>last time I checked the control was hitting the stop. The only thing I
>did right before this happened was add avblend to the oil (I know that
>should have nothing to do with the problem). The oil has been changed
>since the avblend and I still have the problem.
>
>Any ideas to help my RV not come off as a clunker on the flight line?
>
>
>Jason Sneed
>Commercial Lending Officer
>First National Bank and Trust
>http://www.highland-parks.com/n242ds/index.html
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "WALTER KERR" <kerrjb(at)msn.com> |
| Subject: | New Grand Rapids 4000 EIS for sale |
Never installed 4000 for sale. Save over $100. I ordered this unit thinking I would
be ready to fly before Tracy Crook at RWS had his EIS ready for market for
my 9A rotary. He held to schedule but I didn't :>( His unit is disigned with
the rotary in mind so I would rather use it now.
Call for details, I will pay for shipping
Bernie Kerr
772 466 6701
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Ronnie Brown" <romott(at)adelphia.net> |
| Subject: | Navaid Autopilot Operation |
For those of you who have the Navaid autopilot, read on. The rest of you
can ignore this note.
After flying my Velocity for a year, I decided to try to improve the
operation of my Navaid autopilot. (Sorry, but I follow the RV list since
there are 10 times more RV's than Velocities - you use the same engines and
avionics as Velocities - thanks for the great answers and information!!!!)
The Navaid has been working great in wing leveler mode - but I haven't been
real happy with they way it tracked the GPS signals via the Porcine coupler.
(I had already had the Porcine chip replaced because they had problems with
the aviation data stream that comes out of panel mounted GPS's)
I finally figured it out (after reading the manual again - for the 10th
time!)
I had "jinked" the servo for the correct trim position. The Navaid's left
hand knob is used to trim the plane for level flight, the right hand knob is
used to make turns.
I repeat "left hand knob is used to trim the plane for level flight, the
right hand knob is used to make turns." If you are trying to fly straight
and level, DO NOT USE the right hand knob - use the trim knob!!! (This is a
duh-huh, but if you didn't understand this subtelty, it makes a huge
difference!)
When putting the Navaid in track mode - make sure the right hand knob is
straight up. The trim knob is in what ever position is required to maintain
straight ahead flight. Then after engaging track mode, use the trim knob to
put the plane on course if the Navaid is not tracking the course as desired.
This last sentence is critically important to getting good tracking
performance. I used to cuss the Navaid because it didn't seem to be holding
the correct track. If you use the trim knob to establish the plane on
track, it tracks PERFECTLY!!!!
A HAPPY NAVAID USER!
Ronnie Brown
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Alex Peterson" <alexpeterson(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | Help me stop my engine |
>
> For the last 2 months I have had a problem I can not figure out and
> wanted to see if anyone has a direction to point me. I have a
> 6 with a
> o-360 with the airflow performance fuel injection system. When I
> shutdown, the engine is dieseling really bad. I did not know the term
> dieseling but it basically means the engine will not shutdown
> fuel gets
> ignited somehow and keeps turning the engine over. I pull the mixture
> to idle cut off and then hit the electronic ignition and the mag and
> the master. I do all this with about 1000 rpm. Before this started
> happening I could shutdown any way I wanted with no problem. The only
> way to get the prop to stop spinning and vibrating the heck
> out of the
> airplane is to shove the mixture to full rich while
> everything else is
> off and the engine is just dieseling. Not only is this causing damage
> (exhaust breakage) it is dangerous. Tonight I cleaned (sand blasted)
> all the top plugs, this made no difference. Has anyone had this
> happen? What should I do next? I am suspect of the mixture
> control but
> last time I checked the control was hitting the stop. The
> only thing I
> did right before this happened was add avblend to the oil (I
> know that
> should have nothing to do with the problem). The oil has been changed
> since the avblend and I still have the problem.
>
> Any ideas to help my RV not come off as a clunker on the flight line?
>
Something is likely wrong with the idle mixture. The idle mixture
should be adjusted exactly per the AFP manual, it is spelled out in
great detail there. You are correct in wondering what has changed,
though. What happens if you run it at 1500 rpm, and pull the mixture
out?
Is the idle mixture linkage tight? Maybe it worked loose, and went
rich.
Alex Peterson
Maple Grove, MN
RV6-A N66AP 443 hours
http://www.home.earthlink.net/~alexpeterson/
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Bob U." <rv3(at)comcast.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Help me stop my engine |
Jason Sneed wrote:
>
>For the last 2 months I have had a problem I can not figure out and
>wanted to see if anyone has a direction to point me. I have a 6 with a
>o-360 with the airflow performance fuel injection system. When I
>shutdown, the engine is dieseling really bad. I did not know the term
>dieseling but it basically means the engine will not shutdown fuel gets
>ignited somehow and keeps turning the engine over. I pull the mixture
>to idle cut off and then hit the electronic ignition and the mag and
>the master. I do all this with about 1000 rpm. Before this started
>happening I could shutdown any way I wanted with no problem.
>
>Jason Sneed
>Commercial Lending Officer
>First National Bank and Trust
>http://www.highland-parks.com/n242ds/index.html
>
True "dieseling", as I understand it, is caused by at least by at least
one 'hotspot' in a combustion chamber. Sounds to me like something in
the combustion chamber is acting like a glowplug. Rid yourself of that
source and you may once again be a happy camper. I suggest reading the
spark plugs for abnormalities and for carbon buildup. Also, check the
the plugs for thin sharp edges while you're at it. Anybody got a
borescope?
Good luck.
Bob
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Alex Peterson" <alexpeterson(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | Help me stop my engine |
>
> AFP recommends turning off the engine by activating the fuel
> bypass valve. Pulling the mixture all the way back still
> allows enough fuel to barely keep the engine running. I tried
> killing the engine this way once, it was painful.
This should not be - with AFP the engine should stop when at idle with
the mixture pulled completely to ICO. Their instructions are very clear
about how to adjust the idle mixture. If it doesn't quit when the
mixture is pulled at idle, you are probably idling way too rich.
Alex Peterson
Maple Grove, MN
RV6-A N66AP 443 hours
http://www.home.earthlink.net/~alexpeterson/
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Jason Sneed <n242ds(at)cox.net> |
| Subject: | Re: shut-down procedure |
This is what my airflow manual says to do but it does not work for me.
When the engine is dieseling I even tried going to full throttle and
it just keeps sputtering. Oddly enough if at the very end of shutdown
and when the engine just starts to diesel I go full rich on the mixture
the engine stops which makes NO sense to me.
Thanks for all the help and suggestions!
Jason
On Mar 5, 2004, at 8:19 AM, Mlfred(at)aol.com wrote:
> Hey Jason:
>
> I found a work-around for this run-on problem:
> When you pull the mix to ICO, push the throttle about 1/2 open and the
> thing will quit cleanly. Works every time for me...credit the old
> round engine guys for this one...
>
> Stein had some other very good comments.
>
> cheers
> Mark
> Team Rocket
>
> Any ideas to help my RV not come off as a clunker on the flight line?
>
>
> Jason Sneed
> Commercial Lending Officer
> First National Bank and Trust
> http://www.highland-parks.com/n242ds/index.html
>
Jason Sneed
Commercial Lending Officer
First National Bank and Trust
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Bob U." <rv3(at)comcast.net> |
| Subject: | Re: shut-down procedure |
Jason Sneed wrote:
>
>This is what my airflow manual says to do but it does not work for me.
>When the engine is dieseling I even tried going to full throttle and
>it just keeps sputtering. Oddly enough if at the very end of shutdown
>and when the engine just starts to diesel I go full rich on the mixture
>the engine stops which makes NO sense to me.
>
>Thanks for all the help and suggestions!
>
>Jason
>
=========================================
Makes sense to me, if you have a combustion chamber hot spot.
The raw fuel snuffs the hotspot, just like pouring water on a fire.
Pull your plugs.
See if you have a ton of soot.
If so, the engine has been running far too rich in some mode.
P.S.
If I'm wrong, never mind.
Bob
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Jason Sneed <n242ds(at)cox.net> |
| Subject: | Fwd: help me stop my engine |
Begin forwarded message:
> From: Mahlon_Russell(at)teledyne.com
> Date: March 5, 2004 9:06:44 AM CST
> To: n242ds(at)cox.net
> Subject: help me stop my engine
>
>
> Jason, I tried to post this to the list but I am not a member so it
> didn't
> go through..too bad I think it could be helpful to others. I monitor
> the
> list from the web and don't subscribe because I can't get any more
> email
> the I already get..just too much to deal with. so anyway I hope this
> helps
> you out! you might forward it to the list if you think it would help
> others.
> Jason,
> From the description of your situation I think you might have two
> problems.
> For what is happening to your engine, you need to have a fuel supply
> and a
> ignition supply. It can not run-on or diesel without ignition and
> fuel. So
> it sounds to me like you have 1.) an ignition source you shouldn't
> have and
> also 2.) a fuel source you shouldn't have. Two independent systems and
> two
> different troubleshooting scenarios.
> The way I would troubleshoot the problem is as follows:
> Lets look at the fuel situation first.
> The mixture control on the AFP fuel servo is not the Idle cut off
> device,
> if you have a purge valve. The idle cut off device is the purge/idle
> cutoff
> valve. To trouble shoot if it is working correctly, Place the mixture
> control valve in full lean and the purge/Idle cutoff valve in idle
> cutoff.
> Disconnect the fuel injection lines at the fuel nozzles. Turn the boost
> pump on and observe if there is fuel coming out any of the lines where
> you
> disconnected them from the nozzles. There should be no observable flow
> at
> the lines, an occasional drip is ok, but no flow allowed. If there is
> flow,
> you need to get the flow divider and purge/idle cutoff assembly
> checked out
> and or reworked. If there isn't any flow another way you can get fuel
> into
> the engine while you are trying to shut it off, is through a fuel
> injection
> nozzle that has a blocked air bleed or has a cracked line supplying it
> fuel. The nozzles are vented and when you close the Idle cut-off valve
> you
> put a stop to fuel flow. The natural sucking action of the intake
> system is
> exposed to the outlet of the fuel nozzles in each intake port. The
> vents in
> the nozzles relive that suction, and no fuel is drawn from the lines,
> into
> the intake ports, to keep the engine running. If one of the vents is
> restricted it will allow this suction to pull fuel out of the other
> lines
> and will keep the engine running. Likewise, a cracked line will allow
> the
> fuel to be drawn in, as it acts a relieve to the Idle cut-off valve.
> It's
> like putting a straw into a glass of soda. Put your finger on the end
> of
> the straw and you can lift the straw out of the soda and the soda will
> stay
> in the straw until you lift your finger and then the soda pours out of
> the
> straw. The crack in the line is acting like lifting your finger off
> the end
> of the straw. To check the nozzles for the clogged vent condition,
> remove
> them and blow into them with your mouth, while holding a finger over
> the
> outlet hole. You will then be blowing air into the nozzle and out the
> vent.
> If the vent is restricted or plugged you will be able to tell. To
> check for
> cracked line, do a visual inspection..common place for problems is
> where
> the ball end is silver soldered onto the line. Another place the
> engine
> can get fuel from is from an internal leak inside the servo. To check
> this
> remove the line that feeds the flow divider and plug it on the fuel
> servo
> side. Now turn the boost pump on for a minute or two. With the pump on
> observe the impact tubes( small tubes pointing into the air flow) at
> the
> mouth of the servo. They should not have fuel coming out of them. If
> they
> do you need to get the servo serviced as the servo is acting like a
> carburetor and supplying the fuel to keep the engine running. Lastly
> if you
> have the overboard drain from the engine driven fuel pump teed into the
> intake manifold drain, the fuel pump could be leaking and supplying
> fuel to
> the intake system though the drain network. If you have the fuel pump
> drain
> "teed in" disconnect from the drain network temporarily, and see if the
> engine shuts down OK. If it does, you need a new fuel pump. I assume
> that
> you don't have manual primmer system, if you do, disconnect it, to make
> sure it isn't the source of the fuel. Other than these things there is
> no
> other way, that I know of, for fuel to get into the engine, so I think
> it
> must be one of these that is supplying the fuel for the engine to be
> able
> to run on.
> Fixing the fuel situation will make the engine shut off but it won't
> fix
> problem 2.) which is how that fuel getting lit off with no ignition
> source?
> First thing we need to do is make sure the ignition systems are off
> when we
> think they are. To do this with the engine running, first turn off the
> electronic ignition system and master switch then momentarily turn the
> mag
> off. When doing this you need to be quick, on the mag switch, as
> letting
> the engine run down for more that a second or so with the ignition
> turned
> off and than turning the ignition back on, can light off un-burnt fuel
> that
> has collected in the exhaust system and cause a rather loud backfire,
> as
> well as, possible exhaust system damage. The engine should quit if we
> are
> killing the ignition. If it doesn't we need to figure out which system
> is
> still on. To do this, I would disconnect the sparkplug leads for the
> electronic system, start the engine on the mag, and then shut off the
> mag,
> if the engine continues to run, you have mag or mag switch issues, if
> it
> doesn't, I would reverse the situation and start on the electronic
> system
> and then shut it off. If the engine doesn't quit, you have electronic
> ignition or wiring issues with it. Either of these situations are bad
> as we
> have a engine that can inadvertently start with prop movement, because
> one
> of the ignition systems is actually on, when we think it is off. Be
> very
> careful moving the prop on this engine, until you are sure that that
> is a
> safe practice!! If the engine does not quit, using either trouble
> shooting
> scenario, then we have a hot spot in the cylinders, that is acting
> like a
> glow plug, that was igniting the fuel, This is a bad thing that can
> have
> some potential catastrophic results for the engine, as it can cause
> pre-ignition and eventually detonation. There is no easy way to
> troubleshoot this but it is normally caused by an ignition system that
> is
> out of whack and not timed correctly or some really bad quality fuel.
> If
> you ran the engine using only one of the ignition systems, the
> offending
> one should be able to be discovered, in that the engine shouldn't
> develop
> the hot spot if the bad ignition source hasn't been turned on and used.
> Therefore after a run with only one ignition system used and if it
> shuts
> down OK it should point the finger at the other system. That or a
> complete
> ignition systems tune up is in order. If you are using av-gas fuel
> shouldn't be an issue. If you are using MoGas try some av-gas for a
> while.
> If you remove the fuel source and the ignition source you will have a
> correctly configured system and an engine that will shut down. If you
> only
> fix the fuel system or the offending ignition system you will have an
> engine that will shut down but still isn't configured the way it
> should be.
> If it's the fuel that's an issue you are lucky that the only problem
> you
> have is it won't shut off!
> Hope this helps.
> Good Luck,
> Mahlon
>
>
Jason Sneed
Commercial Lending Officer
First National Bank and Trust
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Jason Sneed <n242ds(at)cox.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Help me stop my engine |
>
> Sputters if I shutdown at 600 rpm or 1300 rpm. Top plugs were pretty
> clean, have not had time to pull the bottom yet. I have been told the
> electronic ignition plugs are usually cleaner but I do not know that
> from experience.
>
> Thanks!
On Mar 5, 2004, at 8:48 AM, Alex Peterson wrote:
>
>
>>
>> AFP recommends turning off the engine by activating the fuel
>> bypass valve. Pulling the mixture all the way back still
>> allows enough fuel to barely keep the engine running. I tried
>> killing the engine this way once, it was painful.
>
> This should not be - with AFP the engine should stop when at idle with
> the mixture pulled completely to ICO. Their instructions are very
> clear
> about how to adjust the idle mixture. If it doesn't quit when the
> mixture is pulled at idle, you are probably idling way too rich.
>
> Alex Peterson
> Maple Grove, MN
> RV6-A N66AP 443 hours
>
> http://www.home.earthlink.net/~alexpeterson/
>
>
> _-
> =======================================================================
> _-
> =======================================================================
> _-
> =======================================================================
> _-
> =======================================================================
> >
>
>
Jason Sneed
Commercial Lending Officer
First National Bank and Trust
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Ross Schlotthauer" <rv7maker(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | Help me stop my engine |
John,
Call airflow performance. They are very familiar with this problem and as I
understand it, it is the biggest weakness in the AFP system.
Ross Schlotthauer
RV-7
>From: Jason Sneed <n242ds(at)cox.net>
>Reply-To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
>To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
>Subject: RV-List: Help me stop my engine
>Date: Thu, 4 Mar 2004 21:58:34 -0600
>
>
>For the last 2 months I have had a problem I can not figure out and
>wanted to see if anyone has a direction to point me. I have a 6 with a
>o-360 with the airflow performance fuel injection system. When I
>shutdown, the engine is dieseling really bad. I did not know the term
>dieseling but it basically means the engine will not shutdown fuel gets
>ignited somehow and keeps turning the engine over. I pull the mixture
>to idle cut off and then hit the electronic ignition and the mag and
>the master. I do all this with about 1000 rpm. Before this started
>happening I could shutdown any way I wanted with no problem. The only
>way to get the prop to stop spinning and vibrating the heck out of the
>airplane is to shove the mixture to full rich while everything else is
>off and the engine is just dieseling. Not only is this causing damage
>(exhaust breakage) it is dangerous. Tonight I cleaned (sand blasted)
>all the top plugs, this made no difference. Has anyone had this
>happen? What should I do next? I am suspect of the mixture control but
>last time I checked the control was hitting the stop. The only thing I
>did right before this happened was add avblend to the oil (I know that
>should have nothing to do with the problem). The oil has been changed
>since the avblend and I still have the problem.
>
>Any ideas to help my RV not come off as a clunker on the flight line?
>
>
>Jason Sneed
>Commercial Lending Officer
>First National Bank and Trust
>http://www.highland-parks.com/n242ds/index.html
>
>
Get business advice and resources to improve your work life, from bCentral.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Dave Bristol <bj034(at)lafn.org> |
| Subject: | Re: shut-down procedure |
Jason,
Don't want beat a dead horse here but the purge valve WILL solve both
the shut down hot start problems. I put up with difficult starting and
stopping for 2 years before I installed one and I wouldn't even consider
not having one on an AFP system.
Dave
Jason Sneed wrote:
>
>This is what my airflow manual says to do but it does not work for me.
>When the engine is dieseling I even tried going to full throttle and
>it just keeps sputtering. Oddly enough if at the very end of shutdown
>and when the engine just starts to diesel I go full rich on the mixture
>the engine stops which makes NO sense to me.
>
>Thanks for all the help and suggestions!
>
>Jason
>
>
>On Mar 5, 2004, at 8:19 AM, Mlfred(at)aol.com wrote:
>
>
>
>>Hey Jason:
>>
>>I found a work-around for this run-on problem:
>>When you pull the mix to ICO, push the throttle about 1/2 open and the
>>thing will quit cleanly. Works every time for me...credit the old
>>round engine guys for this one...
>>
>>Stein had some other very good comments.
>>
>>cheers
>>Mark
>>Team Rocket
>>
>>Any ideas to help my RV not come off as a clunker on the flight line?
>>
>>
>>Jason Sneed
>>Commercial Lending Officer
>>First National Bank and Trust
>>http://www.highland-parks.com/n242ds/index.html
>>
>>
>>
>
>
>Jason Sneed
>Commercial Lending Officer
>First National Bank and Trust
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "RV_8 Pilot" <rv_8pilot(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | Alternators - Reliability, Preventive Replacement |
Now we're getting into a topic that interests me. Alternator reliability
and preventive replacement.
Knowing I can purchase an alternator for $38 to $18 is good. What I don't
know is what's the typical lifespan for these pieces of equipment when used
in an aircraft and turning faster than typical automotive applications.
As far as a failure mode, I worry about shaft bearings. They're a pretty
high rpm component, with questionable sealed lubrication and questionable
cooling (got external cooling, but who knows just how adequate it really
is).
Even though it has almost 4 yrs and 600 hrs of trouble free operation, I'm
considering replacing mine on a *preventive* basis
Spending $40 now to replace a 75% "used" alternator is much better than the
thing locking up, burning up the drive belt and possibly damaging something
nearby. Not to mention the pain in the a## of it happening away from home
and either having to fix it or fly home on battery alone.
Any thoughts on preventive replacement? Who's had Van's alternator
failures? Why did it fail? How many hours was it used? Did you have
cooling?
Lots of questions, but even a few answered will help us all (me!) make
better decisions.
Bryan Jones -8
www.LoneStarSquadron.com
Houston, Texas
>One person's experiences with an alternator is not a definitive study.
>What
>ever experience that person has is 100% for him and him alone. It may or
>may
>not be a generalized condition. It may be that one case in 1000s that
>sometimes happens. If it is a failure then every thing is o.k. but if it
>is
>the one case of success, then we have big problems. Reiterating one's
>opinion doesn't change the overall failure rate. Remember most of us are
>Amateur Builders. Of course, we have strong opinions, but they aren't
>necessarily the silent majorities nor statistically significant. They can
>be
>used for guidance.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bill Dube <bdube(at)al.noaa.gov> |
| Subject: | Re: Carbon panel |
>
>I would simply use a layer of 6 oz glass then a layer of 5.9 oz carbon fiber
>cloth. The carbon is there to give the look the glass is there to save you
>money. You could do this as a flat panel then cut it to the instrument panel
>or you could use the panel as your plate.
>
>Carbon and glass is available from www.CSTsales.com This is where I buy
>supplies for my model lay-ups. They also have vacuum bagging video.
I like these folks. They are very helpful and also have some nifty
"how-to" videos. http://www.fibreglast.com/
They are a bit pricey, however.
I would suggest that you do the lay-up with a combination of
carbon fiber and Kevlar. The carbon fiber has poor impact resistance and
cracks rather easily. Backing the carbon layer(s) with a Kevlar layer
greatly enhances the impact resistance and arrests cracks even before they
become apparent.
Where you can afford the thickness, it would be wise to add a thin
sheet of foam, balsa, or honeycomb into the lay-up. 1/4" or 1/8" of any of
these materials in the middle of the lay-up is all it will take. This will
make the panel MUCH stronger.
You could use a glass plate for a form, but I much prefer Formica.
With just a little wax, it releases very easily and leaves a very nice
surface finish. You can also drill it, cut it, glue it, and bend it into
simple curved shapes. Drilling and gluing allow you to easily secure mold
"plugs" for instrument recesses, switch recesses, vents, etc. You can also
drill a hole or two, (then carefully fill with bee's wax,) so you can blow
the part loose with compressed air when it has cured.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Kevin Warren" <kevin.m.warren(at)vanderbilt.edu> |
Has anyone read any NTSB reports of RVs doing an endo (flipping upside-down)
in rough field landing or the like? I was trying to envision an emergency
egress strategy in the event such a thing happened, especially if fuel were
leaking.
Thanks,
Kevin
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Kevin Warren" <kevin.m.warren(at)vanderbilt.edu> |
Has anyone read any NTSB reports of RVs flipping upside-down in rough field
landing or the like? I was trying to envision an emergency egress strategy
in the event such a thing happened, especially if fuel were leaking.
Thanks,
Kevin
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Darwin N. Barrie" <ktlkrn(at)cox.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Carbon panel |
I would not recommend Kevlar for this application because at some point you
are going to have to sand the edges to conform to the panel. Kevlar will
"fuzz" with no method to recover.
Good points on sandwiching things for added depth.
Darwin N. Barrie
Chandler AZ
----- Original Message -----
From: "Bill Dube" <bdube(at)al.noaa.gov>
Subject: Re: RV-List: Carbon panel
>
>
> >
> >I would simply use a layer of 6 oz glass then a layer of 5.9 oz carbon
fiber
> >cloth. The carbon is there to give the look the glass is there to save
you
> >money. You could do this as a flat panel then cut it to the instrument
panel
> >or you could use the panel as your plate.
> >
> >Carbon and glass is available from www.CSTsales.com This is where I buy
> >supplies for my model lay-ups. They also have vacuum bagging video.
>
> I like these folks. They are very helpful and also have some
nifty
> "how-to" videos. http://www.fibreglast.com/
>
> They are a bit pricey, however.
>
> I would suggest that you do the lay-up with a combination of
> carbon fiber and Kevlar. The carbon fiber has poor impact resistance and
> cracks rather easily. Backing the carbon layer(s) with a Kevlar layer
> greatly enhances the impact resistance and arrests cracks even before they
> become apparent.
>
> Where you can afford the thickness, it would be wise to add a
thin
> sheet of foam, balsa, or honeycomb into the lay-up. 1/4" or 1/8" of any of
> these materials in the middle of the lay-up is all it will take. This will
> make the panel MUCH stronger.
>
> You could use a glass plate for a form, but I much prefer
Formica.
> With just a little wax, it releases very easily and leaves a very nice
> surface finish. You can also drill it, cut it, glue it, and bend it into
> simple curved shapes. Drilling and gluing allow you to easily secure mold
> "plugs" for instrument recesses, switch recesses, vents, etc. You can also
> drill a hole or two, (then carefully fill with bee's wax,) so you can blow
> the part loose with compressed air when it has cured.
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Steve Eberhart <steve(at)newtech.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Carbon panel |
Bill Dube wrote:
> I would suggest that you do the lay-up with a combination of
> carbon fiber and Kevlar. The carbon fiber has poor impact resistance and
> cracks rather easily. Backing the carbon layer(s) with a Kevlar layer
> greatly enhances the impact resistance and arrests cracks even before they
> become apparent.
Dana and I are still in the development stage on the carbon fiber panel
so the jury is still out - but we have a pretty good idea of where we
are going to end up. We are more interrested in having the look of a
carbon fiber panel than we are in the structural and/or weight
advantages. We decided early on that Kevlar probably wasn't going to be
in the final solution. More because it is simply a pain to work with
than anything else. I just don't know how to make all of the instrument
cut outs, holes and trim the final edges. Kevlar is so tough that it
resists cutting. On an instrument panel, you would have little
"frizzies" where ever you had to cut through it. And, you can't sand
them away, they just get worse the more you try to sand them.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Kyle Boatright" <kyle.boatright(at)adelphia.net> |
| Subject: | Cylinder Blocker |
One thing I'm planning to do during this year's condition inspection is add a cylinder
blocker in front of the #1 cylinder, which (hopefully) will reduce the
40 or so degree CHT difference between #3 and the rest of the cylinders. There
is plenty in the archives on the effectiveness of this technique, but I can't
find a picture or any specifics on how tall to make the blocker in front of
the head vs in front of the barrel of the cylinder.
I'd sure appreciate some dimensions and/or a picture to use as a go-by or at least
to give me a good starting point.
Thanks in advance,
Kyle Boatright
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Steve Eberhart <steve(at)newtech.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Carbon panel |
I coundn't do that again if I tried. Just imagine a cup of coffee on
the desk, notebook computer in your lap and the phone rings. When the
incident was all through playing out, the coffee was covering the desk,
phone was in hand and the unfinished e-mail reply was sent. Oh well.
Here is how I was going to finish my last post:
Bill Dube wrote:
>
> I would suggest that you do the lay-up with a combination of
> carbon fiber and Kevlar. The carbon fiber has poor impact resistance and
> cracks rather easily. Backing the carbon layer(s) with a Kevlar layer
> greatly enhances the impact resistance and arrests cracks even before they
> become apparent.
>
> Where you can afford the thickness, it would be wise to add a thin
> sheet of foam, balsa, or honeycomb into the lay-up. 1/4" or 1/8" of any of
> these materials in the middle of the lay-up is all it will take. This will
> make the panel MUCH stronger
Dana and I are still in the development stage on the carbon fiber panel
so the jury is still out - but we have a pretty good idea of where we
are going to end up. We are more interrested in having the look of a
carbon fiber panel than we are in the structural and/or weight
advantages we might gain from the composites. We decided early on that
Kevlar probably wasn't going to be in the final solution. More because
it is simply a pain to work with than anything else. I just don't know
how to make all of the instrument cut outs, holes and trim the final
edges. Kevlar is so tough that it resists cutting. On an instrument
panel, you would have little "frizzies" where ever you had to cut
through it. And, you can't sand them away, they just get worse the more
you try to sand them.
I do like the idea of using the Rutan sandwich construction techniques
to strengthen the panel. We will probably do that around the radio
stack but not anywhere else. The main reason is, we are going to use
this panel on three RV-7's that are under construction. As is usually
the case, no two panels are alike. Making all of the panels the same,
without the internal core material, we can make instrument cutouts where
ever we want.
I have had good experiences buying carbon from
http://www.discountcomposite.com/ infact, this is where the carbon we
are using came from.
Stay tuned. As in every development project, everything is subject to
change :-)
Steve Eberhart
RV-7A - still working on wings and now the panel as well
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Kevin Warren" <kevin.m.warren(at)vanderbilt.edu> |
I've seen pictures of various tools kept in the cockpit for breaking the
plexi - The question should have been more specific and I guess it's pretty
much been answered... is there enough room to squeeze out? It appears that
for the average person at least, there is.
Thanks!
Kevin
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bluecavu(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Exhaust Bracket Failure |
Subject: RV-List: Exhaust Bracket Failure
Looks like the exhaust hanging hardware on my airplane needs to be changed
every 100 hours or so.=A0
sounds like you might have a problem with vibration. until you get it solved,
you will continually be replacing stuff like this. investing in a dynamic
balance might be easily worth it -not to mention the increased comfort.
-scott
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Rob Prior <rv7(at)b4.ca> |
| Subject: | Re: iPAQ Pilot Log... |
Bill VonDane wrote:
>
> Anyone know of a good, free, pilot logbook for the iPAQ?
By far the most flexible, is Pocket Excel, which comes with the iPaq.
Set up whatever columns you want, and track them.
I looked for ages for a better (and free) program, and never found one.
There's one that's quite good called DS Pilot Log, it was the best of
the dedicated programs that I could find, and it was reasonably
economical ($20, I think). It looks like the interface has changed
since I last used it, it's up to version 2.0 now.
But i've since switched back to Palm, the iPaq's inability to interface
with anything but a Windows PC started to become an issue (I run Linux
at home). My Tungsten T3 is smaller, lighter, faster, and syncs to all
of my computers.
-Rob
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Doug Weiler" <dougweil(at)pressenter.com> |
| Subject: | Re: alternator cooling |
>
> Jim in Kelowna
>
> From: "LarryRobertHelming" <lhelming(at)sigecom.net>
> Subject: Re: RV-List: alternator cooling
>
>
> >
> > With using a blast air tube for cooling the alternator, is there any
> concern
> > about flying into rain and having rain water coming through the tube
onto
> > the back of the alternator?
> >
> > Indiana Larry, RV7 Tip-up TMX-O-360 ACS2002 Dynon CNS430 Digitrak
JeffRose
> > Firewall Forward
>
Just a comment on alternators. I too had problems with Van's Honda
alternator in my previously RV-4. Bought another from Vans. The new owner
just reported to me that it has conked out again.
I installed a B&C 40 amp alternator in my new RV-4. B&C tells me they have
sold thousands and almost no reported failures. They are a well engineered
unit as you all know. Not cheap, but reliable.
Then the question arises, how come, after 10 years of use, the alternator in
my 1993 Saturn finally failed. 120,000 plus miles which I figured
translated to over 3000 hours of use. Now that's reliability!!
Doug Weiler
Hudson, WI
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Skylor Piper <skylor4(at)yahoo.com> |
| Subject: | Re: alternator cooling |
Sounds like the Bronco II I got rid of last year. Had
it for 14 years, 309,000 miles (no typos there). It
was still running on the original engine build AND
alternator when I donated it!!!
--- Doug Weiler wrote:
> Then the question arises, how come, after 10 years
> of use, the alternator in
> my 1993 Saturn finally failed. 120,000 plus miles
> which I figured
> translated to over 3000 hours of use. Now that's
> reliability!!
>
> Doug Weiler
> Hudson, WI
>
>
>
> Contributions
> any other
> Forums.
>
> http://www.matronics.com/chat
>
> http://www.matronics.com/subscription
> http://www.matronics.com/FAQ/RV-List.htm
> http://www.matronics.com/archives
> http://www.matronics.com/photoshare
> http://www.matronics.com/emaillists
>
>
>
>
>
__________________________________
http://search.yahoo.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Gabe A Ferrer" <ferrergm(at)bellsouth.net> |
| Subject: | Exhaust Bracket Failure |
Call Vetterman at 605 745 5932.
He has a "new" exhaust mounting kit that works. I got it from him for $10. No problems
for 105 hours.
Gabe A Ferrer
RV6 N2GX 105 hours
South Florida
Email: ferrergm(at)bellsouth.net
Cell: 561 758 8894
Night Phone: 561 622 0960
Fax: 561 622 0960
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Hopperdhh(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: alternator maintenance |
After 100 K to 150 K miles (1000 hours? given the higher RPM) its pretty
normal for alternator brushes to wear out. They can be replaced for about $5 or
$6. Its a good investment in preventative maintenance if you have gotten this
far with the alternator. Let it go too long and the slip rings will get
ruined. Alternators are very easy to work on. Mark the case so you can get it
back the same way, not 90 or 120 or 180 degrees out. Most have a hole where you
load and hold the brushes with a plastic or wooden stick -- the new brushes
sometimes come with the stick. Pull it out after you put the case halves back
together.
Dan RV-7A (almost done)
In a message dated 3/5/04 6:33:00 PM US Eastern Standard Time,
skylor4(at)yahoo.com writes:
>
>
> Sounds like the Bronco II I got rid of last year. Had
> it for 14 years, 309,000 miles (no typos there). It
> was still running on the original engine build AND
> alternator when I donated it!!!
>
>
> --- Doug Weiler wrote:
>
> >Then the question arises, how come, after 10 years
> >of use, the alternator in
> >my 1993 Saturn finally failed. 120,000 plus miles
> >which I figured
> >translated to over 3000 hours of use. Now that's
> >reliability!!
> >
> >Doug Weiler
> >Hudson, WI
> >
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Pat Hatch" <pat_hatch(at)msn.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Cylinder Blocker |
Kyle,
I also had about a 40 degree difference between cylinders 1 & 3 and fixed it
with the blocker as you describe.
Here is a picture for reference.
http://home.bellsouth.net/p/s/community.dll?ep=87&subpageid=134196&ck
You can start with speed tape or something similar until you get the right
size, but the size shown will get you pretty close.
Pat Hatch
RV-4
RV-6
RV-7 QB (Building)
Vero Beach, FL
----- Original Message -----
From: "Kyle Boatright" <kyle.boatright(at)adelphia.net>
Subject: RV-List: Cylinder Blocker
>
> One thing I'm planning to do during this year's condition inspection is
add a cylinder blocker in front of the #1 cylinder, which (hopefully) will
reduce the 40 or so degree CHT difference between #3 and the rest of the
cylinders. There is plenty in the archives on the effectiveness of this
technique, but I can't find a picture or any specifics on how tall to make
the blocker in front of the head vs in front of the barrel of the cylinder.
>
> I'd sure appreciate some dimensions and/or a picture to use as a go-by or
at least to give me a good starting point.
>
> Thanks in advance,
>
> Kyle Boatright
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Wheeler North <wnorth(at)sdccd.cc.ca.us> |
| Subject: | alternator notes |
Without the battery any changing load device will cause the VR to have a
hard time keeping the V stable since a sudden change in load will not be
compensated for by the battery at the speed of light and electrons coming
out of it. It takes time for the VR to wind up the field's magnetism which
is much slower to react. The battery also provides a large stable "sense"
reservoir for the VR to sense and adjust its output as needed.
by the by, a few technical additions to the below, a DC generator "field" is
actually AC, the commutator causes this, but the armature sees it as DC
since the phase of the armature and field are aligned for that to happen.
Although alternators are "schematically" phased 120degs they are actually
wound to have a bunch of three phase events per actual "pulley" revolution.
(this is what destroys most student's brains when trying to understand my
alternator lessons) But because diodes need a small amount of voltage to
switch they don't completely get rid of the AC on top of the DC.
Most diode rectifiers have a 4th bridge pair that I think is used to compare
V for the internal regulator so it knows when a failure is occuring in a
main diode. This is how it knows when to activate the idiot light. But I've
never proven this. But I mention it so you don't get worried if you see
eight diodes when you are looking for six in the rectifier plate.
RE Vans units. I have seen/repaired about ten of these units now, and none
of them are the same in regards to their delivered condition. The last one I
saw was not rebuilt by any stretch of the imagination, and Vans didn't
question paying the bill for it to be fixed properly. It needed a new
regulator, a rectifier and a good bath. So the variety of failures you folks
have discribed (many years to 35 hours) is no surprise.
RE cooling, the denso's cool from either end as the inlets and then out the
side outlets. If you want to blast them, blast the back where the rectifier
plate is, but blast into the end port, not into one of the side ports. They
are mostly rain proof. The only place where water could cause a problem is
on the field brushes, and these are ususally somewhat well covered. I
wouldn't try driving one underwater though, regardless of the results
produced by Mr. Denver's experiments.
Even if the brushes do get wet the field only sees an amp or so at most.
W
From: "Cy Galley" <cgalley(at)QCBC.ORG>
Subject: Re: RV-List: Van's alternator - $18 at Pep boys
How can you get the battery out of the circuit? It must be there for no
other reason
than to excite the field.
STATOR
Surrounding the rotor is another set of coils, three in number, called the
stator.
The stator is fixed to the shell of the alternator, and does not turn. As
the rotor turns within the stator windings, the magnetic field of the rotor
sweeps
through the stator windings, producing an electrical current in the
windings.
Because of the rotation of the rotor, an alternating current is produced.
As, for example, the north pole of the magnetic field approaches one of the
stator
windings, there is little coupling taking place, and a weak current is
produced,
As the rotation continues, the magnetic field moves to the center of
the winding, where maximum coupling takes place, and the induced current is
at
its peak. As the rotation continues to the point that the magnetic field is
leaving
the stator winding, the induced current is small. By this time, the south
pole is approaching the winding, producing a weak current in the opposite
direction.
As this continues, the current produced in each winding plotted against
the angle of rotation of the rotor has the form shown in figure 2. The three
stator windings are spaced inside the alternator 120 degrees apart,
producing
three separate sets, or "phases," of output voltages, spaced 120 degrees
apart,
as shown in figure 3.
OUTPUT DIODES
A/C voltage is of little use in a D/C system, such as used in an airplane,
so it
has to be converted to D/C before it can be used. This conversion to D/C
takes
place in the "output diodes" and in the "diode trio." Diodes have the
property
of allowing current to flow in only one direction, while blocking current
flow in the other direction. The output diodes consist of six diodes, one
pair
for each winding. One of the pair is for the negative half cycle, and the
other
for the positive half cycle. As a result of this diode rectification, the
output
of the alternator looks as shown in figure 4.
Surprisingly enough, the output of the alternator is not a pure D/C as one
might
expect, but a pulsating D/C. Because there are three windings, each with a
positive
and a negative half, by the time the voltage is passed through the diodes,
there are six pulsations for each rotation of the rotor. This is close
enough
to D/C for most automotive components. Critical components, such as radios,
have their own internal filtering circuits to further smooth out the
waveform
to a purer D/C.
This doesn't look like your quoted 99% to me.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bill Dube <bdube(at)al.noaa.gov> |
| Subject: | Re: Carbon panel |
>
>I would not recommend Kevlar for this application because at some point you
>are going to have to sand the edges to conform to the panel. Kevlar will
>"fuzz" with no method to recover.
Indeed, you will get fuzz at the edges. It is possible to trim any
exposed edges with rubber molding, etc.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bill Dube <bdube(at)al.noaa.gov> |
| Subject: | Re: Carbon panel |
>
>For those who have not worked with Kevlar.....my opinion of it is it is too
>hard to work with, too hard to cut and the edges are totally unacceptable in
>our applications.
Actually, it can be easy to cut if you buy cheap scissors instead
of expensive ones. Look for scissors that have a coarsely-ground cutting
edge. $5 or $6 plastic-handle office scissors.
The high-quality scissors have a very smooth, finely-ground
cutting edge. The Kevlar slides a bit, wads up, and jams in the scissors.
The cheap scissors have a rough enough cutting edge to grip the cloth so it
doesn't slip and wad up.
After a while the coarse edge starts to smooth out and the cheap
scissors don't work so well to cut Kevlar. At that point, you can either
regrind them with a course wheel, retire them to fiberglass and carbon
cutting, or simply throw them away.
> Formica, sure you can but I wanted a gloss finish and get
>much better results from plate glass. You can get different finishes with
>formica. In the picture posted, I used three layers of 5.7 set at 90,45 &
>90. On a full carbon panel, I'm thinking some carbon fiber angles made by
>laying up on a 3/4 x 3/4 piece of angle alum as reinforcement instead of
>using foam as panel space pretty well uses up available area.
An 1/8" or 1/16" sheet of balsa in the lay-up should not take up
much room and will keep the panel from flexing or "oil canning". The balsa
will bond much better to the epoxy and will not cause cracking with
temperature changes.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bill Dube <bdube(at)al.noaa.gov> |
| Subject: | Re: Carbon panel |
>
>Dana and I are still in the development stage on the carbon fiber panel
>so the jury is still out - but we have a pretty good idea of where we
>are going to end up. We are more interrested in having the look of a
>carbon fiber panel than we are in the structural and/or weight
>advantages we might gain from the composites. We decided early on that
>Kevlar probably wasn't going to be in the final solution. More because
>it is simply a pain to work with than anything else. I just don't know
>how to make all of the instrument cut outs, holes and trim the final
>edges. Kevlar is so tough that it resists cutting. On an instrument
>panel, you would have little "frizzies" where ever you had to cut
>through it. And, you can't sand them away, they just get worse the more
>you try to sand them.
This is a fact. You would have to plan the panel so that no cut
edges would show.
>I do like the idea of using the Rutan sandwich construction techniques
>to strengthen the panel. We will probably do that around the radio
>stack but not anywhere else. The main reason is, we are going to use
>this panel on three RV-7's that are under construction. As is usually
>the case, no two panels are alike. Making all of the panels the same,
>without the internal core material, we can make instrument cutouts where
>ever we want.
Mold the holes instead of cutting them.
Arrange plastic disks on the flat mold plate where you wanted the
round instruments to go. You would machine the disks to provide the exact
recess (or hole edge) that you wanted. You could also place rectangles for
square instruments. Secure the disks so they don't shift during the lay-up.
Wax and smooth the joint between the plate and the each disk so epoxy won't
get under them.
You bag the front layers (with a peel ply) over this negative
mold. Once the first lay-up has cured, pull the peel ply, add the spacer
and back lay-up, then bag again. (It might be possible to do it all in one
step, once you got the process down, but it could be difficult to get the
front layer to come out perfectly.)
When you pull the part, you have a perfect recessed hole (or plain
hole) for each instrument. Just trim off the flange flash from the back
with a cut-off wheel. The small flange around each hole will make the panel
much stronger and durable. Recessed holes and cut-outs would look super
slick and would also increase the strength of the panel.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Hopperdhh(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: alternator notes |
W.,
The extra 3 diodes in a pack are called the diode trio (at least in GM
alternators). Its function is to provide power to the field (rotor). By using
the
trio, there is isolation from the battery in a car where there is no main
relay as in an airplane. In a car the alternator diodes are hot 24/7. The team
I
was on back in about 1966 (4 of us at Delco Radio in Kokomo, IN plus some in
Anderson, IN at Delco Remy) came up with the idea of putting the idiot light
between the diode trio (field +) and the switched battery, and found that it
detected about 90% of the faults and required no additional circuitry. Some of
today's regulators are much more sophisticated at detecting faults, and many
regulate off of the trio voltage if the normal voltage sense line gets unhooked
thereby preventing a complete runaway. Hope this helps explain the 3 extra
diodes.
Dan (Retired electrical automotive engineer)
RV-7A ( almost done)
In a message dated 3/5/04 8:24:46 PM US Eastern Standard Time,
wnorth(at)sdccd.cc.ca.us writes:
>
> Most diode rectifiers have a 4th bridge pair that I think is used to compare
> V for the internal regulator so it knows when a failure is occuring in a
> main diode. This is how it knows when to activate the idiot light. But I've
> never proven this. But I mention it so you don't get worried if you see
> eight diodes when you are looking for six in the rectifier plate.
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Hopperdhh(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: alternator notes |
After rereading my earlier post, you may be referring to different diodes
that I was thinking of. Those extra diodes may be zener diodes for transient
suppression. They clamp the battery line to about 30 volts or so to protect the
electronic equipment in the car (airplane). There is a tradeoff as to what
voltage to clamp to because it takes more current to supress 20 volts than 40
volts. Of course we would like to clamp to 16 volts, but that is too hard to do
reliably and at a reasonable cost.
Dan
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Steve Hamer" <s.hamer(at)verizon.net> |
| Subject: | Vetterman Crossover for sale |
I have a Vetterman Crossover Exhaust system for parallel valve 0-320's and 0-360's
that fits the RV-6,7,8,and 9 including the "A" models that I'm not going
to use. It's currently listed at $775 through Van's. I'll let someone have it
for $675. It includes the muff and mounting stuff, everything you would get
if you ordered it from Van's. I've had it installed on the engine but the engine
has never been run so it's as good as new.
I also have Van's Gascolator (GAS-5) that I won't be using. $76 from Van's, $60
from me. New, never used.
Thanks,
Steve Hamer
-4 flying
-6 finishing
s.hamer(at)verizon.net
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Phil Sisson, Litchfield Aerobatic Club" <sisson(at)consolidated.net> |
| Subject: | Re: alternator cooling |
Doug Weiler wrote:
> Just a comment on alternators. I too had problems with Van's Honda
> alternator in my previously RV-4. Bought another from Vans. The new owner
> just reported to me that it has conked out again.
>
> I installed a B&C 40 amp alternator in my new RV-4. B&C tells me they have
> sold thousands and almost no reported failures. They are a well engineered
> unit as you all know. Not cheap, but reliable.
>
> Then the question arises, how come, after 10 years of use, the alternator in
> my 1993 Saturn finally failed. 120,000 plus miles which I figured
> translated to over 3000 hours of use. Now that's reliability!!
>
> Doug Weiler
> Hudson, WI
No fault of Van's. but I think he didn't get the rebuild quality that he thought
he was getting. Like I said in an earlier post, mine appears to have had the
outside glass bead blasted and resold as a re-build when It really wasnt even
taken apart. Some guys have had great luck and others havent had as good. The
one I got woudlnt have made it past the first run-up.
This thread has given some good input though and a lot of good ideas.
Phil
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Dj Merrill <deej(at)thayer.dartmouth.edu> |
| Subject: | wood props and IFR |
Hi all,
I'm looking for some advice from more experienced pilots than I.
I have a Ted Hendrickson wooden prop on my plane, and I'd like to start
training for my instrument rating.
I've read that wood props don't like the
rain, and get beat up pretty badly.
Basically, I'm wondering is a little rain
going to really trash the prop, or
would it take hours and hours of rain flying
to cause damage? The prop has about
1050 hours on it, but was freshly refurbished
by Sensenich about 50 hours ago, nice
fresh clear coat, looks beautiful.
Thanks,
-Dj
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Exhaust Bracket Failure |
| From: | "Stewart, Michael (ISS Atlanta)" <mstewart(at)iss.net> |
Kyle, check my website. Under flying/135hr report. I too had several
broken ones. My fix has lasted over 1000 hours since.
Mike
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Kyle Boatright
Subject: RV-List: Exhaust Bracket Failure
Looks like the exhaust hanging hardware on my airplane needs to be
changed every 100 hours or so. When I pulled the cowl for my condition
inspection, I found that one of the angles in the Vetterman exhaust
hanging system had failed. That was at about 220 hours. Previously (at
about 100 hours in service) I experienced a failure in the previous
version of the exhaust hanging system.
Has anyone worked out an exhaust hanging system that is reliable over
the long term? Tom at Van's indicated that lots of folks have
experienced failures in this area over the years, despite numerous
revisions in the hardware and attachement of the hangars.
Thanks in advance,
KB
=
=
=
=
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Help me stop my engine |
| From: | "Stewart, Michael (ISS Atlanta)" <mstewart(at)iss.net> |
The AFP preferred shutdown method is to pull the purge valve.
Mike
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Jason Sneed
Subject: RV-List: Help me stop my engine
For the last 2 months I have had a problem I can not figure out and
wanted to see if anyone has a direction to point me. I have a 6 with a
o-360 with the airflow performance fuel injection system. When I
shutdown, the engine is dieseling really bad. I did not know the term
dieseling but it basically means the engine will not shutdown fuel gets
ignited somehow and keeps turning the engine over. I pull the mixture
to idle cut off and then hit the electronic ignition and the mag and
the master. I do all this with about 1000 rpm. Before this started
happening I could shutdown any way I wanted with no problem. The only
way to get the prop to stop spinning and vibrating the heck out of the
airplane is to shove the mixture to full rich while everything else is
off and the engine is just dieseling. Not only is this causing damage
(exhaust breakage) it is dangerous. Tonight I cleaned (sand blasted)
all the top plugs, this made no difference. Has anyone had this
happen? What should I do next? I am suspect of the mixture control but
last time I checked the control was hitting the stop. The only thing I
did right before this happened was add avblend to the oil (I know that
should have nothing to do with the problem). The oil has been changed
since the avblend and I still have the problem.
Any ideas to help my RV not come off as a clunker on the flight line?
Jason Sneed
Commercial Lending Officer
First National Bank and Trust
http://www.highland-parks.com/n242ds/index.html
=
=
=
=
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Help me stop my engine.... |
| From: | "Dennis Parker" <dennis(at)k2workflow.com> |
Here is a note from Air Flow Performance that I got when thinking about
ordering the system without a purge valve. Seems like this could be your
problem.
Regards
Dennis Parker
71041
From: Airflow Performance <mailto:airflow2(at)bellsouth.net>
Subject: Re: Fw: Fuel Injection System for IO360 for RV7
See the attached excel files for the special kits with no purge valve.
Be a where that the purge valve provides cures to the hot start problems
and also provides positive ICO with no fuel bleed off into the engine.
You may experience engine run on at shut down, hot start problems,
flooding, and fuel dripping out the air intake after shut down with out
the purge valve option. This is normal and will not be covered under
any warrantee claims.
Don Rivera
Airflow Performance
111 Airflow Drive
Spartanburg, SC 29306
Phone: 864-576-4512
Fax: 864-576-0201
E-Mail: Airflow2(at)bellsouth.net
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jim Nolan" <jamespnolan(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Wood props and IFR |
Dj,
I flew IFR with a wood prop the first two years I had my ticket. To
make a long story short, I had to refinish my prop three times in two years.
The fact that I slowed the engine to less than 2000 rpm in rain probably
saved me from refinishing it more often. I finally broke down and bought a
Sensenich metal prop. I've been happy with it so far and the peace of mind
you get is priceless.
I once informed Indy ATC that I had to slow down because I had a wood
prop and I was in heavy rain. The woman responded with " Do you want to
declare an emergency"
Jim Nolan
N444JN
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | RVer273sb(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Exhaust Bracket Failure |
Listers,
My RV4 has 954 hrs on the hanging system with
no problems. It is the older set up using hose and
alum flat bar stock. It attaches to the 4 pipe tubes
(2 each side) and the outboard corner bolts of the sump.
I do have a wood prop and balance ring installed.
Perhaps the failures are prop vibration issues
Stewart RV4 Colorado
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Hopperdhh(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Van's alternator - $18 at Pep boys |
Mike,
What is the part number of your Susuki 60 amp alternator? Or can you tell
where and what to ask for?
Dan
RV-7A (almost done)
In a message dated 3/6/04 2:20:11 AM US Eastern Standard Time,
mstewart(at)iss.net writes:
>
> mstewart(at)iss.net>
>
> I got one of the bosch ones cross referenced to the 14xxx number. 22$.
> It worked for about the same 250 hours as the Vans one did. It was not
> until I got the Susuki 60 amp internally regulated, lighter, more amp
> unit, that I stopped toasting them. My Suzuki unit has lasted about 600
> hours without toasting. I believe I read somewhere in the aeroeletric
> site why the Suzuki unit was far superior. Double fan, rated for the
> high rpm's it turns and so forth. It is a $130ish unit. But the lifetime
> warrantee, and lack of headache factor, combined with the increased amps
> which I needed running an all electric plane with no mags, made this
> alternator a much better choice fo me.
>
> Mike
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Brian Kraut" <brian.kraut(at)engalt.com> |
| Subject: | non-U.S. parts suppliers |
I am trying to find some distributors for my instrument lights in other countries.
Since there are a lot of builders on the list in places other than the U.S.
could you please tell me where you buy your parts and instruments. Please
reply directly to me at brian.kraut(at)engalt.com, not to the list. Thanks.
Brian Kraut
www.engalt.com/aviation.htm
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Roger Crandell" <rwc000(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | transducer manifold |
Can anyone recommend a two port (two transducer) manifold. Van's sells a
three port unit, but I only need two. I can cut off one port on the Van's
unit, but would rather not do that.
Thanks
Roger Crandell
Find things fast with the new MSN Toolbar includes FREE pop-up blocking!
http://clk.atdmt.com/AVE/go/onm00200414ave/direct/01/
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Evan and Megan Johnson" <evmeg(at)snowcrest.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Carbon panel |
I bet I could get flat sheets laser cut....never tried carbon fiber but the
laser cuts metals, plywood and plastics with no problems. I just had an RV6
(aluminum stock one)panel cut for a friend of mine and it turned out awsome.
I got to do the whole layout on Autocad and then watch the laser cut it
perfectly....the cut is just a few thousands thick.
Evan
----- Original Message -----
From: "Bill Dube" <bdube(at)al.noaa.gov>
Subject: Re: RV-List: Carbon panel
>
>
> >
> >Dana and I are still in the development stage on the carbon fiber panel
> >so the jury is still out - but we have a pretty good idea of where we
> >are going to end up. We are more interrested in having the look of a
> >carbon fiber panel than we are in the structural and/or weight
> >advantages we might gain from the composites. We decided early on that
> >Kevlar probably wasn't going to be in the final solution. More because
> >it is simply a pain to work with than anything else. I just don't know
> >how to make all of the instrument cut outs, holes and trim the final
> >edges. Kevlar is so tough that it resists cutting. On an instrument
> >panel, you would have little "frizzies" where ever you had to cut
> >through it. And, you can't sand them away, they just get worse the more
> >you try to sand them.
>
> This is a fact. You would have to plan the panel so that no cut
> edges would show.
>
>
> >I do like the idea of using the Rutan sandwich construction techniques
> >to strengthen the panel. We will probably do that around the radio
> >stack but not anywhere else. The main reason is, we are going to use
> >this panel on three RV-7's that are under construction. As is usually
> >the case, no two panels are alike. Making all of the panels the same,
> >without the internal core material, we can make instrument cutouts where
> >ever we want.
>
> Mold the holes instead of cutting them.
>
> Arrange plastic disks on the flat mold plate where you wanted the
> round instruments to go. You would machine the disks to provide the exact
> recess (or hole edge) that you wanted. You could also place rectangles for
> square instruments. Secure the disks so they don't shift during the
lay-up.
> Wax and smooth the joint between the plate and the each disk so epoxy
won't
> get under them.
>
> You bag the front layers (with a peel ply) over this negative
> mold. Once the first lay-up has cured, pull the peel ply, add the spacer
> and back lay-up, then bag again. (It might be possible to do it all in one
> step, once you got the process down, but it could be difficult to get the
> front layer to come out perfectly.)
>
> When you pull the part, you have a perfect recessed hole (or
plain
> hole) for each instrument. Just trim off the flange flash from the back
> with a cut-off wheel. The small flange around each hole will make the
panel
> much stronger and durable. Recessed holes and cut-outs would look super
> slick and would also increase the strength of the panel.
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Michel" <rv8ter(at)rogers.com> |
| Subject: | wood props and IFR |
Rain will do a good number on the finish,wood and fiberglass leading edge
even. I've had pretty good success using the 3M wing leading edge tape on
the prop leading edge.
Michel
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Dj Merrill
Subject: RV-List: wood props and IFR
Hi all,
I'm looking for some advice from more experienced pilots than I.
I have a Ted Hendrickson wooden prop on my plane, and I'd like to start
training for my instrument rating.
I've read that wood props don't like the
rain, and get beat up pretty badly.
Basically, I'm wondering is a little rain
going to really trash the prop, or
would it take hours and hours of rain flying
to cause damage? The prop has about
1050 hours on it, but was freshly refurbished
by Sensenich about 50 hours ago, nice
fresh clear coat, looks beautiful.
Thanks,
-Dj
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Charlie England <cengland(at)netdoor.com> |
"rv7-list(at)matronics.com"
| Subject: | -7 wing leading edge 'glitch' ? |
-7/-8 builders,
Has anyone noticed a slight dip about an inch above & below (back of the
actual apex) the rolled leading edge of their tank skins & leading edge
skins?
While handling one of my cleco'd tanks, I felt the dip, & thought I had
somehow dented the leading edge. On further inspection, the 'dips' are
slight valleys running the entire length of the LE & are identical on
all 4 skins. On the top side, it's about where the 2nd rivet will be in
each rib. It seems unlikely that it's due to the ribs, because there is
no difference in the valley mid way between ribs.
I might be good at messing stuff up, but I ain't THAT good.
Thanks,
Charlie
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Hopperdhh(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: -7 wing leading edge 'glitch' ? |
Charlie,
Yeah, its there. I had never noticed it before. Do you mean like it was
rolled a little too far at the leading edge? Don't fix it or mine will look bad.
Dan RV-7A (almost done)
In a message dated 3/6/04 7:29:32 PM US Eastern Standard Time,
cengland(at)netdoor.com writes:
>
>
> -7/-8 builders,
>
> Has anyone noticed a slight dip about an inch above &below (back of the
> actual apex) the rolled leading edge of their tank skins &leading edge
> skins?
>
> While handling one of my cleco'd tanks, I felt the dip, &thought I had
> somehow dented the leading edge. On further inspection, the 'dips' are
> slight valleys running the entire length of the LE &are identical on
> all 4 skins. On the top side, it's about where the 2nd rivet will be in
> each rib. It seems unlikely that it's due to the ribs, because there is
> no difference in the valley mid way between ribs.
>
> I might be good at messing stuff up, but I ain't THAT good.
>
> Thanks,
>
> Charlie
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Oldsfolks(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: >Re:wood props and IFR |
Rain will definitely ruin a wood prop. On one of our first flights in our
RV-4 ,we were flying with another RV-4. I had the urethane leading edge and the
other had just clear tape. After 3 1/2 hours @ 1800 RPM I had only minor
chipping on the paint edges at the tip ; the other had about 1/4" of the wood chewed
off the leading edge ! One trashed prop.
Bob Olds RV-4 , N1191X
A&P , EAA Tech. Counselor
Charleston,Arkansas
Real Aviators Fly Taildraggers
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "JOHN STARN" <jhstarn(at)verizon.net> |
"rocket-list" , "Roger Graham" ,
"Paul Ray" , "Allen Mecum"
| Subject: | Re: [SoCAL-RVlist] Apple Valley Today, Chino Sunday |
The official count was 26 RV's with one HRII flown in. We at EAA 768 also had
three Young Eagle flights, made room for the Short Wing Piper club, 7 fly-in's
for them. Several other production types mixed with the Arco guys and the
"usual APV suspects". We were missing only an RV-3, HR-1, F-1 and an HRIII to
have had a complete set of ALL the RV types. We refer to 561FS as an RV-4 on steroids.
If you missed out on the feed and the talk, TOUGH TOE NAILS. We had a
great time and will hold another "informal" RV fly-in feed for all those that
missed out this time.
Friday was also a good day at APV. Got 561FS's test flights completed on the
new engine and the "quad" prop. When was the last time you saw 5 Howards and
a Ryan land at your airport during the week. Apple Valley Airport is just a
great place to spend flying or hanger time.
If anyone who attended didn't get enough to eat, that was your fault. Ron Caraway
cooked up just about everything we had but it was good to the last bite.
Thanks to all for the great examples of RV's and the hanger "flying".
Ya'll com back y'ear KABONG
----- Original Message -----
From: Paul (Rosie) Rosales
To: SoCAL-RVlist(at)yahoogroups.com
Sent: Saturday, March 06, 2004 4:44 PM
Subject: [SoCAL-RVlist] Apple Valley Today, Chino Sunday
We had a GREAT turnout of RVs today at Gummo's EAA Mexican outdoor
barbeque at Apple Valley (APV) with, I'm told, 25 RVs plus one Rocket
in attendance! Weather was awesome; nice and comfortable, with NO
WIND, a rarity out this way ;-) It was fun Tom!
The flyout for tomorrow (Sunday) to Chino is being finalized, and I
will post more a bit later tonight. Thanks to all the RVs for
joining us to Apple Valley (and a few more to Agua Dulce
afterwards)!!! Rosie
a.. To visit your group on the web, go to:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/SoCAL-RVlist/
b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
SoCAL-RVlist-unsubscribe(at)yahoogroups.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Vanremog(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Exhaust Bracket Failure |
In a message dated 3/5/2004 11:23:40 PM Pacific Standard Time,
mstewart(at)iss.net writes:
Has anyone worked out an exhaust hanging system that is reliable over
the long term?
Absolutely
GV (RV-6A N1GV flying 682 hrs)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Randy Richter <richterrbb(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Fiber post lights; was non-U.S. parts suppliers |
Brian,
I would be interested in this light, but I think the presentation on
your website and in your brochure would be much more compelling if you
had a picture that actually demonstrated the illumination created by the
light instead of illumination OF the light by a flash bulb.
How well does its light cover the instrument? How bright is the
illumination? What actually is the cost?
Randy
Brian Kraut wrote:
>
>I am trying to find some distributors for my instrument lights in other countries.
Since there are a lot of builders on the list in places other than the U.S.
could you please tell me where you buy your parts and instruments. Please
reply directly to me at brian.kraut(at)engalt.com, not to the list. Thanks.
>
>Brian Kraut
>www.engalt.com/aviation.htm
>
>
>
>
--
Randy Richter
richterrbb(at)earthlink.net
-7QB Kit in hibernation
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Youne Hippoman" <youne.hippoman(at)sympatico.ca> |
| Subject: | -7 wing leading edge 'glitch' ? |
Yes. I have dips above and below, on both leading edges and both fuel tanks
skins. This is normal and has nothing to do with the ribs. It happens
because the apex part of the skin is a permanent curve (machine formed) in
the aluminium structure whereas the aft top and bottom curves are temporary
(i.e. if you remove the clecoes, the skin opens back to a 90 degree angle).
When the skin is left open, there is absolutely no dip at all. But, when we
force the skin to fold, a bulge is formed where the permanent and the
temporary curves meet. Blame it on molecular structure memory, not Van's!!!
In theory, if we keep on forcing the skin to fold (don't do that, it may
create permanent damage to the skin), we will reach a point where the dip
will disappear. But, the plane won't fly with such a wing profile!!! I
would rather keep the bulge and fly the plane.
You will also notice the same dip in the rudder skin, but it's harder to
detect because it is less deep. You may need a couple of drinks with the
lights turned off in order to feel the dip in the rudder skin.
Youne Hippoman
Montreal, Qc, Canada
(RV-7A Center Fuselage)
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of Charlie England
Subject: RV-List: -7 wing leading edge 'glitch' ?
-7/-8 builders,
Has anyone noticed a slight dip about an inch above & below (back of the
actual apex) the rolled leading edge of their tank skins & leading edge
skins?
While handling one of my cleco'd tanks, I felt the dip, & thought I had
somehow dented the leading edge. On further inspection, the 'dips' are
slight valleys running the entire length of the LE & are identical on
all 4 skins. On the top side, it's about where the 2nd rivet will be in
each rib. It seems unlikely that it's due to the ribs, because there is
no difference in the valley mid way between ribs.
I might be good at messing stuff up, but I ain't THAT good.
Thanks,
Charlie
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | kempthornes <kempthornes(at)earthlink.net> suppliers |
| Subject: | Re: Fiber post lights; was non-U.S. parts |
suppliers
Post lights were hot stuff FORTY years ago.
hal
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | MMcs139808(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Fiber post lights; was non-U.S. parts suppliers |
Light Aero in the UK has post lights listed in their catalog, you will find
them on the web.
Eugene
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "N6JX" <n6jx(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | TruTrak Auto-pilot w/turn coordinator |
I had a chance to look at the new TruTrak unit yesterday at the Casa Grande
Arizona, Cactus Antique Aircraft fly-in. They will initially have two
units available, one with roll control like the Digitrak unit and a plain
turn coordinator without any autopilot functions. No altitude functions on
the Autopilot unit, roll control only for now.
I really liked the way the units looked and the way the display moved.
However, the small size (2 1/4 ) really made the turn coordinator not very
satisfactory for me. This would be a great instrument if it were in a 3
inch format. Same is true for the autopilot unit, the display is just too
small to use if you had to use it as a primary flight instrument. I did
like the way the airplane stayed level and the horizon pivoted around the
axis, this was a nice representation and would be really easy to fly from.
If they bring out a bigger unit, I would probably buy one in a flash.
Mel Jordan
RV-6A N6JX
Tucson
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Darwin N. Barrie" <ktlkrn(at)cox.net> |
| Subject: | Re: TruTrak Auto-pilot w/turn coordinator |
Hi Mel,
I saw the unit too and was very impressed, especially the price. He told me
the unit IS available in the standard size, so I ordered one. The 2.25" was
for display. Very, very cool and will look perfect under my Dynon.
Darwin N. Barrie
Chandler AZ
----- Original Message -----
From: "N6JX" <n6jx(at)earthlink.net>
Subject: RV-List: TruTrak Auto-pilot w/turn coordinator
>
> I had a chance to look at the new TruTrak unit yesterday at the Casa
Grande
> Arizona, Cactus Antique Aircraft fly-in. They will initially have two
> units available, one with roll control like the Digitrak unit and a plain
> turn coordinator without any autopilot functions. No altitude functions
on
> the Autopilot unit, roll control only for now.
>
> I really liked the way the units looked and the way the display moved.
> However, the small size (2 1/4 ) really made the turn coordinator not very
> satisfactory for me. This would be a great instrument if it were in a 3
> inch format. Same is true for the autopilot unit, the display is just too
> small to use if you had to use it as a primary flight instrument. I did
> like the way the airplane stayed level and the horizon pivoted around the
> axis, this was a nice representation and would be really easy to fly from.
> If they bring out a bigger unit, I would probably buy one in a flash.
>
> Mel Jordan
> RV-6A N6JX
> Tucson
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Hopperdhh(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Instrument lighting with LEDs |
RV Listers,
I just bought some cheap LED flashlights at a hamfest (a fly mart for ham
radio people) and am thinking of using them to illuminate my panel. I bought 10
of these flashlights to experiment with because they have some optics to
control the light pattern that I thought might help. I want a very low cost
approach. Bright LEDs are readily available now at Radio Shack and many mail order
houses like Digikey. I am thinking of mounting them under the glare shield
aimed at the instruments. Has anyone else done this?
LED stands for light emitting diode for any who don't already know. There
are some really bright LEDs available today. They are much more efficient than
light bulbs which radiate a lot of energy at longer wavelengths than light.
They are also more reliable. Many traffic lights and taillights on cars are
now LEDs, and I have heard that LED headlights for cars are not too far off.
Dan RV-7A (almost done)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Tom & Cathy Ervin" <tcervin(at)valkyrie.net> |
| Subject: | Air Filter 0-360-A1A |
List,
I have run into a problem with the clearance on my FAB 360 airbox being
close to rubbing the cowl air scope?
The K&N Air Filter supplied is exactly 7" x 3 1/2 " O.D. I would be fine
if the Air Filter was only 3 1/4" High?
Has anyone else ran into this? It would appear the front my Airbox
needs to angle up more to use the existing filter? Sure don't
want to cut the box to increase the upward angle and re-glass?
Tom in Ohio
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Charlie Kuss <chaskuss(at)bellsouth.net> |
| Subject: | Re: TruTrak Auto-pilot w/turn coordinator |
What page of the new Sport Aviation is this product on?
Charlie Kuss
>
>Hi Mel,
>
>I saw the unit too and was very impressed, especially the price. He told me
>the unit IS available in the standard size, so I ordered one. The 2.25" was
>for display. Very, very cool and will look perfect under my Dynon.
>
>Darwin N. Barrie
>Chandler AZ
>----- Original Message -----
>From: "N6JX" <n6jx(at)earthlink.net>
>To:
>Subject: RV-List: TruTrak Auto-pilot w/turn coordinator
>
>
>>
>> I had a chance to look at the new TruTrak unit yesterday at the Casa
>Grande
>> Arizona, Cactus Antique Aircraft fly-in. They will initially have two
>> units available, one with roll control like the Digitrak unit and a plain
>> turn coordinator without any autopilot functions. No altitude functions
>on
>> the Autopilot unit, roll control only for now.
>>
>> I really liked the way the units looked and the way the display moved.
>> However, the small size (2 1/4 ) really made the turn coordinator not very
>> satisfactory for me. This would be a great instrument if it were in a 3
>> inch format. Same is true for the autopilot unit, the display is just too
>> small to use if you had to use it as a primary flight instrument. I did
>> like the way the airplane stayed level and the horizon pivoted around the
>> axis, this was a nice representation and would be really easy to fly from.
>> If they bring out a bigger unit, I would probably buy one in a flash.
>>
>> Mel Jordan
>> RV-6A N6JX
>> Tucson
>>
>>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bobby Hester <bhester(at)hopkinsville.net> |
| Subject: | Re: TruTrak Auto-pilot w/turn coordinator |
Darwin N. Barrie wrote:
>
>Hi Mel,
>
>I saw the unit too and was very impressed, especially the price. He told me
>the unit IS available in the standard size, so I ordered one. The 2.25" was
>for display. Very, very cool and will look perfect under my Dynon.
>
>Darwin N. Barrie
>Chandler AZ
>
>
>
Did you get the standard size 3 1/8" turn coordinator without the
autopilot? I am interested in that. Was it the same price as the 2 1/4"
$395 I will be very interested in hearing your report after you receive it.
--
Surfing the Web from Hopkinsville, KY
Visit my web site at: http://www.geocities.com/hester-hoptown/RVSite/
RV7A Slowbuild wings-QB Fuse :-)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bobby Hester <bhester(at)hopkinsville.net> |
| Subject: | Re: TruTrak Auto-pilot w/turn coordinator |
Charlie Kuss wrote:
>
>What page of the new Sport Aviation is this product on?
>Charlie Kuss
>
>
>
Sport Aviation, March 2004, page 55
Not on their web site yet, seem like that would be the first place to
have it.
--
Surfing the Web from Hopkinsville, KY
Visit my web site at: http://www.geocities.com/hester-hoptown/RVSite/
RV7A Slowbuild wings-QB Fuse :-)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "LarryRobertHelming" <lhelming(at)sigecom.net> |
| Subject: | Re: TruTrak Auto-pilot w/turn coordinator |
Does anyone know if this is considered a trade up purchase (getting trade-in
value for original purchase of the digitrak) for someone already having a
digitrak and wanting to replace with the new wing leveler with TC?
Indiana Larry, RV7 Tip-up TMX-O-360 ACS2002 Dynon CNS430 Digitrak
Firewall Forward
----- Original Message -----
From: "Darwin N. Barrie" <ktlkrn(at)cox.net>
Subject: Re: RV-List: TruTrak Auto-pilot w/turn coordinator
>
> Hi Mel,
>
> I saw the unit too and was very impressed, especially the price. He told
me
> the unit IS available in the standard size, so I ordered one. The 2.25"
was
> for display. Very, very cool and will look perfect under my Dynon.
>
> Darwin N. Barrie
> Chandler AZ
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "N6JX" <n6jx(at)earthlink.net>
> To:
> Subject: RV-List: TruTrak Auto-pilot w/turn coordinator
>
>
> >
> > I had a chance to look at the new TruTrak unit yesterday at the Casa
> Grande
> > Arizona, Cactus Antique Aircraft fly-in. They will initially have two
> > units available, one with roll control like the Digitrak unit and a
plain
> > turn coordinator without any autopilot functions. No altitude functions
> on
> > the Autopilot unit, roll control only for now.
> >
> > I really liked the way the units looked and the way the display moved.
> > However, the small size (2 1/4 ) really made the turn coordinator not
very
> > satisfactory for me. This would be a great instrument if it were in a 3
> > inch format. Same is true for the autopilot unit, the display is just
too
> > small to use if you had to use it as a primary flight instrument. I
did
> > like the way the airplane stayed level and the horizon pivoted around
the
> > axis, this was a nice representation and would be really easy to fly
from.
> > If they bring out a bigger unit, I would probably buy one in a flash.
> >
> > Mel Jordan
> > RV-6A N6JX
> > Tucson
> >
> >
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Darwin N. Barrie" <ktlkrn(at)cox.net> |
| Subject: | Re: TruTrak Auto-pilot w/turn coordinator |
Yes, according to Richard Martin who was representing TruTrak the turn
coordinator alone is available in the 3 1/8" version. They only had the
2.25" for display.
It is very cool. It looks like much like a standard Artificial Horizon with
out the pitch component. Standard looking slip/skid ball. The unit is
electric and spools up immediately. The display unit had an internal battery
so people could test it out. The bank indicator is very sensitive.
Just from the 10 minutes I played with it I believe it is the perfect
addition to the Dynon or other EFIS.
Darwin N. Barrie
Chandler AZ
----- Original Message -----
From: "Bobby Hester" <bhester(at)hopkinsville.net>
Subject: Re: RV-List: TruTrak Auto-pilot w/turn coordinator
>
> Darwin N. Barrie wrote:
>
> >
> >Hi Mel,
> >
> >I saw the unit too and was very impressed, especially the price. He told
me
> >the unit IS available in the standard size, so I ordered one. The 2.25"
was
> >for display. Very, very cool and will look perfect under my Dynon.
> >
> >Darwin N. Barrie
> >Chandler AZ
> >
> >
> >
> Did you get the standard size 3 1/8" turn coordinator without the
> autopilot? I am interested in that. Was it the same price as the 2 1/4"
> $395 I will be very interested in hearing your report after you receive
it.
>
> --
> Surfing the Web from Hopkinsville, KY
> Visit my web site at: http://www.geocities.com/hester-hoptown/RVSite/
> RV7A Slowbuild wings-QB Fuse :-)
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Ken Harrill <KHarrill(at)osa.state.sc.us> |
| Subject: | The First Palmetto RV FlyIn Cookout |
The Palmetto Wing of Van's Air Force
Invites any and all RV pilots/flyers/builders/etc. to the
FIRST PALMETTO RV FLYIN COOKOUT
Saturday, March 20th
Columbia Downtown Owens Field Airport
Columbia, SC
Palmetto Burgers and Carolina Dogs
Grills will be fired up at 11:00 AM
No Program
No Vendors
No Speeches
No Organization
No Charge
(Donations Accepted)
Just good food, RV's, and friendly conversation.
www.airnav.com/airport/KCUB
Note right traffic for runway 13
Taxi toward the east end of the field (toward Rwy 31) and look for the
crowd.
If you plan to come email Ken.Harrill(at)Columbia.SC so we can buy enough food.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | <nyman(at)bellsouth.net> |
I am looking for a band saw and I found this one at Harbor Freight. After going
thru the archives, it sounds like just about any band saw will work. Anyone
have experience with Central Machinery brand? Is the following a good deal?
Thanks,
Steve
Precision three-wheeled design cuts material up to 12'' wide and makes bevel cuts
from 0 to 60 Electronic variable speed switch controls the speed of the blade
from 0 to 2645 feet per minute. Three ball bearing blade guide system eliminates
the blade from slipping. Includes miter gauge, trunion assembly, hex wrenches,
and extra set of carbon brushes. Blade sold separately.
Motor: 115V, 3.5 amps, single phase
Table: slotted cast aluminum: 13-1/2'' x 13-1/2''
Work capacity: 12'' x 4-1/8'' high
Requires 62'' blade
Overall dimensions: 24-7/8''L x 13-1/2''W x 22-3/4''H
Tool weight: 30 lbs.
ITEM 40981-5VGA
$109.99
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | <nyman(at)bellsouth.net> |
I am looking for a band saw and I found this one at Harbor Freight. After going
thru the archives, it sounds like just about any band saw will work. Anyone
have experience with Central Machinery brand? Is the following a good deal?
Thanks,
Steve
Precision three-wheeled design cuts material up to 12'' wide and makes bevel cuts
from 0 to 60 Electronic variable speed switch controls the speed of the blade
from 0 to 2645 feet per minute. Three ball bearing blade guide system eliminates
the blade from slipping. Includes miter gauge, trunion assembly, hex wrenches,
and extra set of carbon brushes. Blade sold separately.
Motor: 115V, 3.5 amps, single phase
Table: slotted cast aluminum: 13-1/2'' x 13-1/2''
Work capacity: 12'' x 4-1/8'' high
Requires 62'' blade
Overall dimensions: 24-7/8''L x 13-1/2''W x 22-3/4''H
Tool weight: 30 lbs.
ITEM 40981-5VGA
$109.99
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Brian Kraut" <brian.kraut(at)engalt.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Fiber post lights; was non-U.S. parts suppliers |
Thanks. I will check them out.
---------- Original Message ----------------------------------
From: MMcs139808(at)aol.com
Date: Sun, 7 Mar 2004 03:45:43 EST
>
>Light Aero in the UK has post lights listed in their catalog, you will find
>them on the web.
>
>Eugene
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Ned Thomas" <315(at)cox.net> |
Hi Steve,
I bought that saw when it was on sale last month for $99. I took it back for
a refund. It was an alright saw but is primariuly for cutting wood. I took
it back because the guide wheels are NOT adjustable. Harbor Freight has no
metal cuting saw blades for it. I did order a 50' 24 tPI blade and had some
welded to fit (62") but when I tried to install them they were too thick.
That is when I found that the guide wheels would not adjust.
Hope this helps,
Ned
----- Original Message -----
From: <nyman(at)bellsouth.net>
Subject: RV-List: Band Saws
>
> I am looking for a band saw and I found this one at Harbor Freight. After
going thru the archives, it sounds like just about any band saw will work.
Anyone have experience with Central Machinery brand? Is the following a good
deal?
>
> Thanks,
> Steve
>
> Precision three-wheeled design cuts material up to 12'' wide and makes
bevel cuts from 0 to 60 Electronic variable speed switch controls the speed
of the blade from 0 to 2645 feet per minute. Three ball bearing blade guide
system eliminates the blade from slipping. Includes miter gauge, trunion
assembly, hex wrenches, and extra set of carbon brushes. Blade sold
separately.
> Motor: 115V, 3.5 amps, single phase
> Table: slotted cast aluminum: 13-1/2'' x 13-1/2''
> Work capacity: 12'' x 4-1/8'' high
> Requires 62'' blade
> Overall dimensions: 24-7/8''L x 13-1/2''W x 22-3/4''H
> Tool weight: 30 lbs.
> ITEM 40981-5VGA
> $109.99
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Charlie & Tupper England <cengland(at)netdoor.com> |
nyman(at)bellsouth.net wrote:
>
>I am looking for a band saw and I found this one at Harbor Freight. After going
thru the archives, it sounds like just about any band saw will work. Anyone
have experience with Central Machinery brand? Is the following a good deal?
>
>Thanks,
>Steve
>
If you want mine (bought about 13 years ago & never made a cut without
the blade coming off), you can have it if you will come & get it.
Charlie
Slobovia Outernational Airport, Jackson MS
>
>Precision three-wheeled design cuts material up to 12'' wide and makes bevel cuts
from 0 to 60 Electronic variable speed switch controls the speed of the blade
from 0 to 2645 feet per minute. Three ball bearing blade guide system eliminates
the blade from slipping. Includes miter gauge, trunion assembly, hex wrenches,
and extra set of carbon brushes. Blade sold separately.
>Motor: 115V, 3.5 amps, single phase
>Table: slotted cast aluminum: 13-1/2'' x 13-1/2''
>Work capacity: 12'' x 4-1/8'' high
>Requires 62'' blade
>Overall dimensions: 24-7/8''L x 13-1/2''W x 22-3/4''H
>Tool weight: 30 lbs.
>ITEM 40981-5VGA
>$109.99
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Light Weight Gear Leg for RV-8 |
Any one know of a source for lighter weight gear legs for the RV-8. I have
seen them mentioned in the past, even with brake lines enclosed. L.D.
Jeffries. RV-8QB
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Paul Eastham <eastham(at)netapp.com> |
| Subject: | 2 new building resources |
Tired of riveting on parts that you later learn to be defective? Yep,
there it is, right in the archives, other people have gotten the bad
part too. Van's even knows about it, but for some reason they didn't
tell the rest of us...
Found errors in the documentation? Sure, we all have. You probably
realized the problem before you hurt your airplane, but what about the
next guy?
Reduce the amount of suffering in the RV community. Register any
parts defects and construction manual errors you find, so new builders
can go and make notes *before* they repeat history:
http://hmb.dyndns.org/~eastham/rv/defect.html (parts defects)
http://hmb.dyndns.org/~eastham/rv/manual.html (construction manual errata)
Please invest a moment to help us newbies! :)
Regards,
Paul
RV-9A wings
http://hmb.dyndns.org/~eastham/rv
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Robin Wessel" <Robin.Wessel(at)verizon.net> |
| Subject: | re: Instrument lighting with LEDs |
Check our HYPERLINK "http://www.lumileds.com"www.lumileds.com for their
line of Luxeon Star LED's that I bought from HYPERLINK
"http://www.luxeonstar.com"www.luxeonstar.com . The new Audi A8 will
feature what appears to be their 5W star's in a 5 light cluster for
headlamps.
I built some nav lights using 3 of their star LED's and a simple current
regulator using an LM317 and a 3.6 Ohm resistor for my RV-10 project.
The light output is definitely brighter than a typical incandescent
source and the current draw is about 1 amp compared to 2.5 amps for a
reg. bulb.
A link to the current regulator circuit is at: HYPERLINK
"http://linear1.org/gm/archives/00000147.php"http://linear1.org/gm/archi
ves/00000147.php
I plan on using the Star LED's for the interior as well. They are
available with different lens patterns, colors, and outputs. Although
they cost about $10 a piece, they are easy to mount and 1 Star is a lot
brighter than multiple $2 super brights. They also sell some wide
dispersion board mount styles that many of the auto vendors currently
use for IP lighting.
The concept I have is a to use one of each of the primaries clustered in
a color mixing flood configuration so that I can change the interior
lighting to any color I want.
Other ideas- the local PC stores are selling EL strip lighting kits with
12V inverters for less than $20. Although designed to light up your PC
box (don't ask me why!) I think that they would make great
under-glareshield lights for real cheap.
Robin Wessel
rv-10 wings
Tigard, OR
HYPERLINK "http://robin.getbiz.net"http://robin.getbiz.net
---
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Curt" <choffman9(at)cinci.rr.com> |
I bought that same band saw many years ago. Very difficult to find metal
blades for it. I had to have a few made up special. Then they easily snap
when cutting anything of any significance. I finally sold it for $20 bucks
with no blades. Now that I am working on the RV-9 there have only been a
couple times when I wish I had one. But not enough to actually go buy one
yet. If I do, I will buy a good one and one that I know there are blades
for.
Curt Hoffman
RV-9A Wings done, QB fuselage, tail about done
Cherokee N5320W
TR6 back to running with HS6 SUs
Harley Road King Classic
Maybe I need a sailboat
----- Original Message -----
From: <nyman(at)bellsouth.net>
Subject: RV-List: Band Saws
>
> I am looking for a band saw and I found this one at Harbor Freight. After
going thru the archives, it sounds like just about any band saw will work.
Anyone have experience with Central Machinery brand? Is the following a good
deal?
>
> Thanks,
> Steve
>
> Precision three-wheeled design cuts material up to 12'' wide and makes
bevel cuts from 0 to 60 Electronic variable speed switch controls the speed
of the blade from 0 to 2645 feet per minute. Three ball bearing blade guide
system eliminates the blade from slipping. Includes miter gauge, trunion
assembly, hex wrenches, and extra set of carbon brushes. Blade sold
separately.
> Motor: 115V, 3.5 amps, single phase
> Table: slotted cast aluminum: 13-1/2'' x 13-1/2''
> Work capacity: 12'' x 4-1/8'' high
> Requires 62'' blade
> Overall dimensions: 24-7/8''L x 13-1/2''W x 22-3/4''H
> Tool weight: 30 lbs.
> ITEM 40981-5VGA
> $109.99
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Mauri Morin" <maurv8(at)bigsky.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Light Weight Gear Leg for RV-8 |
http://www.groveaircraft.com/rv8.html
----- Original Message -----
From: <Fly2eat(at)aol.com>
Subject: RV-List: Light Weight Gear Leg for RV-8
>
> Any one know of a source for lighter weight gear legs for the RV-8. I
have
> seen them mentioned in the past, even with brake lines enclosed. L.D.
> Jeffries. RV-8QB
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | 2 new building resources |
| From: | "Frank van der Hulst (Staff WG)" <F.vanderHulst(at)ucol.ac.nz> |
Paul,
This is similar to what I had in mind when I began the "Bunny's Guide to
RV Building" site.
See http://www.matronics.com/rv-list/bunnys-guide/rv/bunny/
It doesn't really aim to correct specific 'errors' in the Manual -- more
like fill in many of the gaps. Similarly with 'parts defects' -- it's
more about how to work-around slightly mis-fitting parts than to
document whether or not they are mis-fitting.
I suspect that some RV-9 (and a lot of RV-7 stuff) will still be
more-or-less the same as the RV-6, so its probably worth your while
having a skim through.
Frank
(self-appointed keeper of the Guide)
Reduce the amount of suffering in the RV community. Register any parts
defects and construction manual errors you find, so new builders can go
and make notes *before* they repeat history:
Learn real skills for the real world - Apply online
at http://www.ucol.ac.nz or call 0800 GO UCOL
(0800 46 8265) or txt free 3388 for more information
and make a good move to UCOL Universal College of
Learning.
Enrol with a public institute and be certain of your
future
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Douglas A. Fischer" <dfischer(at)iserv.net> |
| Subject: | Re: TruTrak Auto-pilot w/turn coordinator |
From the picture in Sport Aviation, it looks as though when you upgrade to
the Autopilot combo version you lose the skid ball. That makes it an AP /
Turn-and-Bank and not an AP / Turn Coordinator. Since I'm looking for IFR
eventually, this doesn't really save anything for me, since I still want an
actual TC. Maybe the Standard size instrument varies from the photo and has
the ball. I'm considering a TruTrak AP and a combo AP/ TC (like the S-Tec)
would be nice, but from the pic it looks like the TruTrak falls short of
this. Too bad.
Doug Fischer
-9A Wings
----- Original Message -----
From: "Darwin N. Barrie" <ktlkrn(at)cox.net>
Subject: Re: RV-List: TruTrak Auto-pilot w/turn coordinator
>
> Yes, according to Richard Martin who was representing TruTrak the turn
> coordinator alone is available in the 3 1/8" version. They only had the
> 2.25" for display.
>
> It is very cool. It looks like much like a standard Artificial Horizon
with
> out the pitch component. Standard looking slip/skid ball. The unit is
> electric and spools up immediately. The display unit had an internal
battery
> so people could test it out. The bank indicator is very sensitive.
>
> Just from the 10 minutes I played with it I believe it is the perfect
> addition to the Dynon or other EFIS.
>
> Darwin N. Barrie
> Chandler AZ
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Bobby Hester" <bhester(at)hopkinsville.net>
> To:
> Subject: Re: RV-List: TruTrak Auto-pilot w/turn coordinator
>
>
> >
> > Darwin N. Barrie wrote:
> >
> > >
> > >Hi Mel,
> > >
> > >I saw the unit too and was very impressed, especially the price. He
told
> me
> > >the unit IS available in the standard size, so I ordered one. The 2.25"
> was
> > >for display. Very, very cool and will look perfect under my Dynon.
> > >
> > >Darwin N. Barrie
> > >Chandler AZ
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > Did you get the standard size 3 1/8" turn coordinator without the
> > autopilot? I am interested in that. Was it the same price as the 2 1/4"
> > $395 I will be very interested in hearing your report after you receive
> it.
> >
> > --
> > Surfing the Web from Hopkinsville, KY
> > Visit my web site at: http://www.geocities.com/hester-hoptown/RVSite/
> > RV7A Slowbuild wings-QB Fuse :-)
> >
> >
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Craig Warner" <cwarner(at)twcny.rr.com> |
I bought a Delta bench top band saw for $88 from a local building supply
store. Take the blade off and go to a machine tool supply house like Do-All.
They can recommend theeth per inch, blade width, and thickness. I bought two
blades for $16. Just watch out for metal flakes building up on the rubber
tires the blade rides on. Otherwise it works well.
Craig warner 6A still building
----- Original Message -----
From: "Curt" <choffman9(at)cinci.rr.com>
Subject: Re: RV-List: Band Saws
>
> I bought that same band saw many years ago. Very difficult to find metal
> blades for it. I had to have a few made up special. Then they easily snap
> when cutting anything of any significance. I finally sold it for $20 bucks
> with no blades. Now that I am working on the RV-9 there have only been a
> couple times when I wish I had one. But not enough to actually go buy one
> yet. If I do, I will buy a good one and one that I know there are blades
March 02, 2004 - March 07, 2004
RV-Archive.digest.vol-oz