RV-Archive.digest.vol-pz
October 29, 2004 - November 06, 2004
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Andy Karmy <andy(at)karmy.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Looking for backer board for interior panels |
The next question would be... What do you all use for glue to hold the
material to the board?
I used the plastic board product, covered with 1/8" sound foam and
vinyl, but all the glue's I have used to date let go when it gets hot
outside!
I wrapped the vinyl around the edges and overlapped about 1" on the
back to hold. Seems to need some other form of holding than just glue.
Tried Spray 77, contact cement, automotive trim & emblem glue.
- Andy Karmy
andy(at)karmy.com
On Oct 29, 2004, at 8:51 AM, Steven DiNieri wrote:
>
> Try chloroplast or corrugated plastic sheets from a graphics supplier.
> It's
> the same stuff that I received from airtex for an "approved install".
> It's
> easy to work with and water proof. My local guy sells it for 14 bucks a
> sheet (48" x 96").
> Steve
> N221RV
>
>
> Foam core works well. Not the best fire retardent product in the
> world, but
> it works well. You can get it as thin as 1/8" from craft stores like
> Michaels.
>
>> Any suggestions on a light backer board for interior panels. My bird
>> is
> already a little on the plumpy side so Im trying to keep her from
> becoming a
> static display while making her a little more eye friendly.
>>
>> Jeff Dowling
>> RV-6A, N915JD
>> 140 hours
>> Chicago/Louisville
>>
>>
>
>
> _-
> =======================================================================
> _-
> =======================================================================
> _-
> =======================================================================
> _-
> =======================================================================
> >
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Donald Mei" <don_mei(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | Seat Description |
Abby used temperfoam for my seat. I don't know how many layers, but it is
very comfortable. She also uses some kind of batting to "puff up" the seat,
so it looks nice when you're not sitting in it.
I'll post some pics to www.3b9.com/planeseats.html by the end of the day, in
case anyone wants to see mine.
Don
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Jeff Point <jpoint(at)mindspring.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Looking for backer board for interior panels |
Try 3M 90, a high-strength version of 77, should be available on the
same shelf at the hardware store. Or try Pli-o-bond contact cement.
Jeff Point
RV-6
Milwaukee WI
>
>Tried Spray 77, contact cement, automotive trim & emblem glue.
>
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | linn walters <lwalters2(at)cfl.rr.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Looking for backer board for interior panels |
Andy Karmy wrote:
>
>The next question would be... What do you all use for glue to hold the
>material to the board?
>
>I used the plastic board product, covered with 1/8" sound foam and
>vinyl, but all the glue's I have used to date let go when it gets hot
>outside!
>
>I wrapped the vinyl around the edges and overlapped about 1" on the
>back to hold. Seems to need some other form of holding than just glue.
>
>Tried Spray 77, contact cement, automotive trim & emblem glue.
>
>- Andy Karmy
> andy(at)karmy.com
>
You may have to scuff the plastic with some 80 grit sandpaper .... and
the spray 99 should work ..... follow the instructions.
Linn
>
>On Oct 29, 2004, at 8:51 AM, Steven DiNieri wrote:
>
>
>
>>
>>Try chloroplast or corrugated plastic sheets from a graphics supplier.
>>It's
>>the same stuff that I received from airtex for an "approved install".
>>It's
>>easy to work with and water proof. My local guy sells it for 14 bucks a
>>sheet (48" x 96").
>>Steve
>>N221RV
>>
>>
>>Foam core works well. Not the best fire retardent product in the
>>world, but
>>it works well. You can get it as thin as 1/8" from craft stores like
>>Michaels.
>>
>>
>>
>>>Any suggestions on a light backer board for interior panels. My bird
>>>is
>>>
>>>
>>already a little on the plumpy side so Im trying to keep her from
>>becoming a
>>static display while making her a little more eye friendly.
>>
>>
>>>Jeff Dowling
>>>RV-6A, N915JD
>>>140 hours
>>>Chicago/Louisville
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>_-
>>=======================================================================
>>_-
>>=======================================================================
>>_-
>>=======================================================================
>>_-
>>=======================================================================
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "David Burton" <dburton(at)nwlink.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Looking for backer board for interior panels |
Upholstery shops use a glue pot with hot liquid glue. They can spray it on
with a gun. They also use steam to heat and soften the material so it
stretches and wraps around the backing board without wrinkles. I'm sure
that if you took your parts to them they would be happy to stick the fabric
on for you. I've got a buddy who owns an upholstery shop. He does mostly
furniture but when he gets back from hunting I'll ask him what he
recommends. An upholstery shop that does automotive interiors is really
what you want if you take it to someone.
The best glue I've ever found is the contact adhesive used to attach plastic
laminate (Formica). Don't use the water based stuff. Use the one with the
warnings about not blowing your house up with the fumes. It's the only
thing I've ever used that would not come loose over time.
Dave Burton
RV6
(lots of custom interiors over the years)
----- Original Message -----
From: "Jeff Point" <jpoint(at)mindspring.com>
Subject: Re: RV-List: Looking for backer board for interior panels
>
> Try 3M 90, a high-strength version of 77, should be available on the
> same shelf at the hardware store. Or try Pli-o-bond contact cement.
>
> Jeff Point
> RV-6
> Milwaukee WI
>
> >
> >Tried Spray 77, contact cement, automotive trim & emblem glue.
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "steve zicree" <szicree(at)adelphia.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Looking for backer board for interior panels |
Contact cement, if used according to directions (both surfaces, wait to
flash) is bomb-proof but also sort of unforgiving to work with. You get one
chance to line things up and then you're "stuck". Also, should we be
concerned about the flammability of the dried glue? I know that wet contact
cement is super flammable.
Steve Zicree
----- Original Message -----
From: "David Burton" <dburton(at)nwlink.com>
Subject: Re: RV-List: Looking for backer board for interior panels
>
> Upholstery shops use a glue pot with hot liquid glue. They can spray it
on
> with a gun. They also use steam to heat and soften the material so it
> stretches and wraps around the backing board without wrinkles. I'm sure
> that if you took your parts to them they would be happy to stick the
fabric
> on for you. I've got a buddy who owns an upholstery shop. He does mostly
> furniture but when he gets back from hunting I'll ask him what he
> recommends. An upholstery shop that does automotive interiors is really
> what you want if you take it to someone.
>
> The best glue I've ever found is the contact adhesive used to attach
plastic
> laminate (Formica). Don't use the water based stuff. Use the one with
the
> warnings about not blowing your house up with the fumes. It's the only
> thing I've ever used that would not come loose over time.
>
> Dave Burton
> RV6
> (lots of custom interiors over the years)
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Jeff Point" <jpoint(at)mindspring.com>
> To:
> Subject: Re: RV-List: Looking for backer board for interior panels
>
>
> >
> > Try 3M 90, a high-strength version of 77, should be available on the
> > same shelf at the hardware store. Or try Pli-o-bond contact cement.
> >
> > Jeff Point
> > RV-6
> > Milwaukee WI
> >
> > >
> > >Tried Spray 77, contact cement, automotive trim & emblem glue.
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | HAL KEMPTHORNE <hal_kempthorne(at)sbcglobal.net> |
I have a Narco MK12 in my Debonair which now requires a slight side pressure on
one of the tuning knobs to get next frequency. It is only 12 years old.
hal
Jim & Bev Cone wrote:
MK12D+ is bullet proof. It is the best radio/nav I have ever used, period.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "cgalley" <cgalley(at)qcbc.org> |
| Subject: | Re: re: Re: countersunk rivets |
After I wrote about AC 43-13 I went looking and could not find it. I even
checked a Bingalis Book. I then consulted an old time metal working A&P.
He said that the thickness depends on the rivet head size. Regular #3 needs
0.032, #4 0.040 thick material. Cessna uses a special small head #4 so they
can countersink as thin as 0.032 with a #4.
Cy Galley - Chair,
AirVenture Emergency Aircraft Repair
A Service Project of Chapter 75
EAA Safety Programs Editor - TC
EAA Sport Pilot
----- Original Message -----
From: "Rick Galati" <rick6a(at)yahoo.com>
Subject: RV-List: re: Re: countersunk rivets
>
> Cy,
>
> My preliminary search through AC-43 has proved fruitless. Perhaps you can
steer me towards the relevant part of AC-43 that documents .040 as the
minimum material thickness to machine countersink for a 426-AD3 rivet.
>
> I ask this because many people refer to Section 5(E), page 5-3 of Van's
manual which would seem to indicate otherwise.
>
> Rick Galati RV-6A "finishing"
>
>
> I believe the number is 0.040 as min for countersinking. Check AC 43.13-1B
>
> Cy Galley - Chair,
> AirVenture Emergency Aircraft Repair
> A Service Project of Chapter 75
> EAA Safety Programs Editor - TC
> EAA Sport Pilot
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Vanremog(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Looking for backer board for interior panels |
In a message dated 10/29/2004 6:30:38 AM Pacific Daylight Time,
shempdowling(at)earthlink.net writes:
Any suggestions on a light backer board for interior panels. My bird is
already a little on the plumpy side so Im trying to keep her from becoming a
static display while making her a little more eye friendly.
============================================
I used the gray corrugated polypropylene signboard available from Tap
Plastics.
GV (RV-6A N1GV O-360-A1A C/S, flying 725 hrs)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Doug Gray <dgra1233(at)bigpond.net.au> |
| Subject: | Re: Looking for backer board for interior panels |
>
> Any suggestions on a light backer board for interior panels. My bird is
> already a little on the plumpy side so Im trying to keep her from becoming a
> static display while making her a little more eye friendly.
>
>
> ============================================
>
> I used the gray corrugated polypropylene signboard available from Tap
> Plastics.
>
I had in mind to use some 0.016 Al sheet. Weight for weight I was thinking this
would be more
durable. Is this overkill?
Doug Gray
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Brian Kraut" <brian.kraut(at)engalt.com> |
| Subject: | countersunk rivets |
Thanks to all that replied.
Brian Kraut
Engineering Alternatives, Inc.
www.engalt.com
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of
Hopperdhh(at)aol.com
Subject: Re: RV-List: countersunk rivets
Brian,
While you can countersink .032 for a 3/32 rivet, dimpling makes a much
stronger joint. For the wing and fuselage skins, I would dimple. I found
that a
single hammer blow made a nice dimple without distorting the skin.
Squeezing
distorted the skin more. My breakpoint would be to machine countersink no
less
than .040. On the fuselage bottom where the skins join the carry-through
spar, I would dimple including the .040 spar.
The exception to this is nutplates, where there is really no structural
load.
When installing nutplates with standard rivets its impossible to avoid a
knife edge unless you carefully deburr. You also have to countersink the
nutplate slightly so that the rivet will be flush.
There are always exceptions to rules, so this is just one opinion.
Welcome to the wonderful world of sheet metal. It won't be as smooth as
glass, but it flies just as good.
Dan Hopper
RV-7A
N766DH (flying about 62 hours)
In a message dated 10/28/04 10:39:46 PM US Eastern Standard Time,
brian.kraut(at)engalt.com writes:
>
>
> Can anyone tell a mainly plastic airplane builder what the general rule of
> thumb is for when you can countersink sheet metal instead of dimple for a
> flush rivet.
>
>
> Brian Kraut
> Engineering Alternatives, Inc.
> www.engalt.com
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Larry Bowen" <Larry(at)bowenaero.com> |
| Subject: | Trutrak Tracking |
I have a TruTrak DF200VS driven by a Garmin 196. It follows a route very
nicely, except it will not anticipate a turn. I have to go to, and through,
a waypoint before it begins to turn for the next waypoint. Is there a way
to program either box so turns begin just prior to reaching a waypoint...ie,
rounding the corner?
-
Larry Bowen
Larry(at)BowenAero.com
http://BowenAero.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | rmickey(at)ix.netcom.com |
| Subject: | Re: Trutrak Tracking |
This is called GPS Steering (GPSS). The TruTrak will do this IF the GPS it is
recieveing its signal from is putting out the signal. I do not know if the Garmin
196 has this capability. My Apollo GX60 has this GPSS output and my DFC250
anticipates turns as advertized.
Ross Mickey
TruTrak DFC250
N9PT
-----Original Message-----
From: Larry Bowen <Larry(at)bowenaero.com>
Subject: RV-List: Trutrak Tracking
I have a TruTrak DF200VS driven by a Garmin 196. It follows a route very
nicely, except it will not anticipate a turn. I have to go to, and through,
a waypoint before it begins to turn for the next waypoint. Is there a way
to program either box so turns begin just prior to reaching a waypoint...ie,
rounding the corner?
-
Larry Bowen
Larry(at)BowenAero.com
http://BowenAero.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "BRUCE GRAY" <brucerv84us(at)hotmail.com> |
I am curious to all that are unloading there RV8's? Is winter coming and
everyone is itching to build something else or what? It is funny to see
people let go of there aircraft and have nothing to fall back on for there
"rotate the world 3g get away". Like I said, just curious?
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Ron Schreck" <ronschreck(at)mail.webkorner.com> |
| Subject: | Horizontal Filtered Airbox kit |
I'm building the baffles for my IO360 in the RV-8. I have the fiberglass intake
and filter that mounts to the left baffle intake floor but I can't find any
information or parts to construct a box for the filter. Does anyone have any
references or pictures to help me out? Was there something supplied in the kit
that I have misplaced? I can't even find a drawing! Help!
Ron Schreck
Baffled
Sent via the WebMail system at mail.webkorner.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jim Cimino" <jcimino(at)echoes.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Horizontal Filtered Airbox kit |
The filter sits inside the end of the fiberglass intake. It is sandwiched
between the fiberglass intake and the left baffle floor. You make two
brackets to bolt it up to the baffle floor.
Jim
James Cimino
RV-8 SN 80039
100+ Hours
570-842-4057
http://www.geocities.com/jcimino.geo/
----- Original Message -----
From: "Ron Schreck" <ronschreck(at)mail.webkorner.com>
Subject: RV-List: Horizontal Filtered Airbox kit
>
>
> I'm building the baffles for my IO360 in the RV-8. I have the fiberglass
> intake and filter that mounts to the left baffle intake floor but I can't
> find any information or parts to construct a box for the filter. Does
> anyone have any references or pictures to help me out? Was there
> something supplied in the kit that I have misplaced? I can't even find a
> drawing! Help!
>
> Ron Schreck
> Baffled
>
>
> Sent via the WebMail system at mail.webkorner.com
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Ed Anderson" <eanderson(at)carolina.rr.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Van's LSA? (was: RV8 Sale) |
----- Original Message -----
From: "Jerry Springer" <jsflyrv(at)earthlink.net>
Subject: Re: RV-List: Van's LSA? (was: RV8 Sale)
>
> When I had breakfast with Van two weeks ago I asked him this very
> question. His answer was that they were waiting to see
> what the final qualifications were going to be and what kind of demand
> there was going to be. I am sure like all of the rest of his
> designs that if there is a need he will fill it. :-)
>
> Jerry
>
>
Its interesting to note that Van has resisted (in the early stages) several
models in his line-up. He originally was against a side-by-side as he
couldn't imagine why people would want it compared to a tandem - well, he
has sold more RV-6s than any other model. Same for the RV-10 - resisted a 4
seater for years. He reportedly was noted as stating that he didn't think
there would be much market for the LSA - because if there were that many
people who could not pass a Class III and wanted to fly they would be flying
motorized gliders, etc. Van is well noted for being conservative and its
hard to argue with his success in bring out models when the interest is
high.
I predict we will within the next year see/hear/rumors of Van's team
designing the LSA - in fact, I would bet money that some of his design staff
are already doodling on napkins (if not on the CAD) the LSA preliminary
design.
I can't wait
Ed Anderson
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Jeff Point <jpoint(at)mindspring.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Breaks question |
I'd recommend you scrap the nylon tube/ reservoir setup entirely and go
with the indivdual reservoirs which mount on the master cylinder.
Spruce sells them for about 20 bucks, and it gets rid of all the leaks.
Here's where I got the idea. His is for an -8 but the same thing can be
done to a 6.
http://www.rv-8.com/IdeasProducts.htm#PRODUCT:%20Aircraft%20Spruce%20A-600%20Brake%20Reservoirs
Jeff Point
RV-6
Milwaukee WI
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | [ Neal George ] : New Email List Photo Share Available! |
| From: | Email List Photo Shares <pictures(at)matronics.com> |
A new Email List Photo Share is available:
Poster: Neal George
Subject: Dimpling
http://www.matronics.com/photoshare/Neal.George@MAXWELL.AF.MIL.10.30.2004/index.html
o Main Photo Share Index
http://www.matronics.com/photoshare
o Submitting a Photo Share
If you wish to submit a Photo Share of your own, please include the
following information along with your email message and files:
1) Email List or Lists that they are related to:
2) Your Full Name:
3) Your Email Address:
4) One line Subject description:
5) Multi-line, multi-paragraph description of topic:
6) One-line Description of each photo or file:
Email the information above and your files and photos to:
pictures(at)matronics.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "LarryRobertHelming" <lhelming(at)sigecom.net> |
| Subject: | Sandia and Garmin |
I need help on an avionic problem. I have a Sandia SAE5-35 encoder and
Garmin 327 and 430. I have something wired wrong because the 430 is telling
me it is not receiving altitude information and the 327 is not displaying an
altitude. I have a question in to Sandia sales/support, but thought I would
take a shot at seeing if anyone has been down this road before.
The way I wired it is to feed the serial altitude data from Sandia in the
RS232 IN 1 channel of the 327. I configure that channel on the 327 as
Icarus. The RS232 IN 1 data is sent to the 430 using the 327's RS232 OUT
1 (configured as Icarus) connecting to the 430 by the GPS RS232 IN 1
channel. I configured this as Icarus. Feel free to contact me directly
if anyone has any ideas as I doubt if many have an interest in this
particular combination. Thanks.
Indiana Larry, RV7 TipUp "SunSeeker"
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "thomas a. sargent" <sarg314(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | firewall recess in a QB |
I am about to install the firewall recess in my 6A. Since this is a QB,
the firewall area is already fully assembled. Does any one have any
suggestions about how to cut the firewall sheet cleanly after it is
rivetted to the airplane?
--
Tom Sargent, RV-6A
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jim Jewell" <jjewell(at)telus.net> |
Received: contains a forged HELO
Hi Tom,
If you have or can beg, borrow or buy a Dremel tool (hobby sized hi speed
grinder) with a package of their "cut off wheel no. 409" you should get the
job done quite well.
Drill 3/32 holes at each corners from the cockpit side. Then use the holes
on the outside to tape off the cut lines. Use the Dremel to cut the hole and
finish the edges with a fine grit Dremel sanding drum or hand fie file as
needed.
Jim in Kelowna
----- Original Message -----
| From: | "thomas a. sargent" <sarg314(at)earthlink.net> |
contains a forged HELO
>
> I am about to install the firewall recess in my 6A. Since this is a QB,
> the firewall area is already fully assembled. Does any one have any
> suggestions about how to cut the firewall sheet cleanly after it is
> rivetted to the airplane?
>
>
> --
> Tom Sargent, RV-6A
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Matt Johnson" <matt(at)n559rv.com> |
| Subject: | Help with Elevator and HS clearance... |
(not processed: message from valid local sender)
At the Van's recommended elevator clearance, my elevator is 1/16 away (maybe closer
in some spots) to the HS skin. I found very little on
this in the archives and was wondering if I did something wrong? With the -7 it
seems hard to do something wrong since the skin is pre-
drilled. I am afraid once I put paint on it it will rub. I used the vixen file
to open the gap more (it was actually hitting before) and now there
is 1/16" gap. Why hasnt anyone else experienced this? what is the gap that should
be between the elevator and the HS skin when at full
deflection? By the way, I have the hinge bolts at the recommended max. of 7/8".
- Matt Johnson
www.rv7a.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Brian Denk" <akroguy(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | Help with Elevator and HS clearance... (not processed: message |
from
>
>At the Van's recommended elevator clearance, my elevator is 1/16 away
>(maybe closer in some spots) to the HS skin. I found very little on
>this in the archives and was wondering if I did something wrong? With the
>-7 it seems hard to do something wrong since the skin is pre-
>drilled. I am afraid once I put paint on it it will rub. I used the vixen
>file to open the gap more (it was actually hitting before) and now there
>is 1/16" gap. Why hasnt anyone else experienced this? what is the gap that
>should be between the elevator and the HS skin when at full
>deflection? By the way, I have the hinge bolts at the recommended max. of
>7/8".
>
>- Matt Johnson
>www.rv7a.com
Try "massaging" the curled leading edges inward towards the elevator spars.
You might have the profile of the elevator leading edges too
"pointy"...sticking forward too far. I'm having the same issue on my RV10.
Bearings are out as far as max allowed. Had to squish the radius down a lot
to get clearance.
Brian Denk
RV8 N94BD
RV10 '51
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Wing storage rack |
| From: | James H Nelson <rv9jim(at)juno.com> |
Would anyone please give me the depth of the spar on the "9". I am
getting ready to pick up my QB kit wings and I am building the rack to
hold them. Has any one found the best spacing for the wings on the rack
so you can finish them (QB). The plans call for 24" between the leading
edge and the top. Is this a good dimension?
Jim Nelson
N599RV (reserved)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | CBRxxDRV(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: narco radios |
Have you sold the narcos?
Sal Capra
Lakeland, FL
My Home Page
http://hometown.aol.com/cbrxxdrv/index.html
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | richard dudley <rhdudley(at)att.net> |
Listers,
You never can have too many clecoes.
I've reached a point where I will keep only a few.
I have 100 1/8" clecoes that I will sell for $25 and
50 3/32" for $12.50. Or the whole schmere for $35.
Please contact me off list.
Richard Dudley
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "steve zicree" <szicree(at)adelphia.net> |
Folks,
If I need to modify the wheel pants, do I need to use the same type of resin as
they are made of? If so, can anyone tell me how to determine whether mine are
epoxy or polyester? Thanks.
Steve Zicree
RV4 on its wheels!
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Kyle Boatright" <kboatright1(at)comcast.net> |
You can use epoxy to repair or modify parts that were built with epoxy or
polyester resin. You can't use polyester resin to repair epoxy parts,
although it is fine on polyester parts.
Most manufacturers use polyester because it is less expensive and cures
faster.
KB
----- Original Message -----
From: "steve zicree" <szicree(at)adelphia.net>
Subject: RV-List:
>
> Folks,
>
> If I need to modify the wheel pants, do I need to use the same type of
> resin as they are made of? If so, can anyone tell me how to determine
> whether mine are epoxy or polyester? Thanks.
>
> Steve Zicree
> RV4 on its wheels!
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Charlie Kuss <chaztuna(at)adelphia.net> |
| Subject: | Angle valve IO-360 oil sump part # needed |
Listers,
Can anyone tell me the part numbers for the "tuned" induction oil sump &
intake tubes for the various angle valve IO-360s? I know that the C series
has a horizontally mounted servo, but it exits the rear. I "think" the
IO-360-A1A is a vertical (updraft) version. Are there any models (besides
the new IO-360-M1B) which have a forward, horizontal induction point?
Charlie Kuss
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Hopperdhh(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Angle valve IO-360 oil sump part # needed |
Charlie,
I don't have the part numbers, but maybe I can help a little.
The IO-360-A1A has the front facing servo, not updraft. Van's assembly
manual chapter on engines spells this out, and it is also in the engine data sheet
posted on Dan Checkoway's website.
My engine was originally a -C1E6 which had the rear facing sump. It had
unmachined bosses on the front. I had the sump machined to install the servo on
the front, only to find that the rear hit the (RV-7A) nose gear part of the
engine mount. I was able to find a -A1A core and used the induction system from
it. The induction tubes set about 2 inches farther aft on the -C1E6 than on
the -A1A sump. I believe it will clear the engine mount on a tail dragger. If
it will work for you, and you want it, it could probably be made available to
you.
Dan Hopper
RV-7A
N766DH (Flying 62 hours)
In a message dated 10/30/04 10:17:08 PM US Eastern Standard Time,
chaztuna(at)adelphia.net writes:
>
>
> Listers,
> Can anyone tell me the part numbers for the "tuned" induction oil sump &
> intake tubes for the various angle valve IO-360s? I know that the C series
> has a horizontally mounted servo, but it exits the rear. I "think" the
> IO-360-A1A is a vertical (updraft) version. Are there any models (besides
> the new IO-360-M1B) which have a forward, horizontal induction point?
> Charlie Kuss
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Angle valve IO-360 oil sump part # needed |
Bad news. The "C" sump won't work on the taildragger either without
modifying the mount, at least on a parallel valve IO-360. It's also
magnesium and costs big $$$ to add a boss for inverted oil. I had one on my
-6 and modified the mount but won't do it again. I plan to change to the
"A1A" sump on the Phoenix. That makes it essentially an IO-360-M1B.
Regards,
Greg Young - Houston (DWH)
RV-6 N6GY - project Phoenix
Navion N5221K - just an XXL RV-6A
>
>
> Charlie,
>
> I don't have the part numbers, but maybe I can help a little.
>
> The IO-360-A1A has the front facing servo, not updraft.
> Van's assembly manual chapter on engines spells this out, and
> it is also in the engine data sheet posted on Dan Checkoway's website.
>
> My engine was originally a -C1E6 which had the rear facing
> sump. It had unmachined bosses on the front. I had the sump
> machined to install the servo on the front, only to find that
> the rear hit the (RV-7A) nose gear part of the engine mount.
> I was able to find a -A1A core and used the induction system
> from it. The induction tubes set about 2 inches farther aft
> on the -C1E6 than on the -A1A sump. I believe it will clear
> the engine mount on a tail dragger. If it will work for you,
> and you want it, it could probably be made available to you.
>
> Dan Hopper
> RV-7A
> N766DH (Flying 62 hours)
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Charlie Kuss <chaztuna(at)adelphia.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Angle valve IO-360 oil sump part # needed |
Dan,
I seem to remember that another RV-8A builder ran into the same problem
with a converted C series sump. I just checked my photo library. Sure
enough, the C series sump has the intake plenum located directly under the
accessory cover. I have 3 photos of this problem. This will clear the tail
dragger motor mounts, but not the tricycle motor mounts. Thanks for the info.
Charlie
>
>Charlie,
>
>I don't have the part numbers, but maybe I can help a little.
>
>The IO-360-A1A has the front facing servo, not updraft. Van's assembly
>manual chapter on engines spells this out, and it is also in the engine
>data sheet
>posted on Dan Checkoway's website.
>
>My engine was originally a -C1E6 which had the rear facing sump. It had
>unmachined bosses on the front. I had the sump machined to install the
>servo on
>the front, only to find that the rear hit the (RV-7A) nose gear part of the
>engine mount. I was able to find a -A1A core and used the induction
>system from
>it. The induction tubes set about 2 inches farther aft on the -C1E6 than on
>the -A1A sump. I believe it will clear the engine mount on a tail
>dragger. If
>it will work for you, and you want it, it could probably be made available to
>you.
>
>Dan Hopper
>RV-7A
>N766DH (Flying 62 hours)
>
>
>In a message dated 10/30/04 10:17:08 PM US Eastern Standard Time,
>chaztuna(at)adelphia.net writes:
>
> >
> >
> > Listers,
> > Can anyone tell me the part numbers for the "tuned" induction oil sump &
> > intake tubes for the various angle valve IO-360s? I know that the C series
> > has a horizontally mounted servo, but it exits the rear. I "think" the
> > IO-360-A1A is a vertical (updraft) version. Are there any models (besides
> > the new IO-360-M1B) which have a forward, horizontal induction point?
> > Charlie Kuss
> >
> >
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "David Fenstermacher" <dfenstermacher(at)earthlink.net> |
No luck in the archives.
Building the wing jig.
What is the best height for the angle iron used to clamp the main spar?
There isn't a dimension on the drawing.
Want to try to get it comfortable; as I will be living with it for some time.
I'm about 5'8" tall, if that matters at all.
Dave
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Patrick Kelley" <webmaster(at)flion.com> |
Main spar at shoulder level. You will have to reach up for the leading
edge, down for the trailing edge. That's about the best compromise.
Patrick Kelley - RV-6A - fuselage bottom skins ready to rivet
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of David Fenstermacher
Subject: RV-List: Wing Jig
No luck in the archives.
Building the wing jig.
What is the best height for the angle iron used to clamp the main spar?
There isn't a dimension on the drawing.
Want to try to get it comfortable; as I will be living with it for some
time.
I'm about 5'8" tall, if that matters at all.
Dave
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Arnold de Brie" <arnold(at)paperchip.com> |
Would anyone be interested in an Archangel Efis system complete with
AHRS, EFDS, ADS and remote flux gate compass.
It is sitting in my shop for quite a while here and the authorities here
won't let me install it in an experimental .
I fired the system up lately and it is still working fine.
The only things that have to be added are sensors for the temps/fuelflow
Contact me off-list
Arnold de Brie
The Netherlands
RV8
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "David Figgins" <2004nospam(at)earthlink.net> |
I think I may have run into a problem and need some advice, I have the wing
kit on order with the QB tanks (due in December), and in reading the
drawings and instruction this past couple of days I noticed a tank mod is
required for inverted flight that adds a flop tube in the standard vent line
area and moves the sender outboard one station. I am assuming the QB tanks
are in the standard configuration. Questions therefore are 1) can the tank
be modified for this mod after it is complete (i.e. can you get access and
keep inside clean) and 2) is this mod for sustained inverted flight and
regular rolls, loops etc are OK with the standard tanks.
Thanks for any input
Dave RV7A
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Charlie Kuss <chaztuna(at)adelphia.net> |
| Subject: | Angle valve IO-360 oil sump part # needed |
Greg,
Does the A1A sump have the proper tapped ports for adding the Christian
inverted oil system?
Charlie Kuss
>
>Bad news. The "C" sump won't work on the taildragger either without
>modifying the mount, at least on a parallel valve IO-360. It's also
>magnesium and costs big $$$ to add a boss for inverted oil. I had one on my
>-6 and modified the mount but won't do it again. I plan to change to the
>"A1A" sump on the Phoenix. That makes it essentially an IO-360-M1B.
>
>Regards,
>Greg Young - Houston (DWH)
>RV-6 N6GY - project Phoenix
>Navion N5221K - just an XXL RV-6A
>
>
> >
> >
> > Charlie,
> >
> > I don't have the part numbers, but maybe I can help a little.
> >
> > The IO-360-A1A has the front facing servo, not updraft.
> > Van's assembly manual chapter on engines spells this out, and
> > it is also in the engine data sheet posted on Dan Checkoway's website.
> >
> > My engine was originally a -C1E6 which had the rear facing
> > sump. It had unmachined bosses on the front. I had the sump
> > machined to install the servo on the front, only to find that
> > the rear hit the (RV-7A) nose gear part of the engine mount.
> > I was able to find a -A1A core and used the induction system
> > from it. The induction tubes set about 2 inches farther aft
> > on the -C1E6 than on the -A1A sump. I believe it will clear
> > the engine mount on a tail dragger. If it will work for you,
> > and you want it, it could probably be made available to you.
> >
> > Dan Hopper
> > RV-7A
> > N766DH (Flying 62 hours)
> >
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Pat Hatch" <pat_hatch(at)msn.com> |
| Subject: | Re: RV7 QB tanks |
David,
The standard fuel pickups are fine for most aerobatics but will not work for
sustained inverted flight. But are you really going to do this? If so, are
you going to have the required inverted oil system for your engine? If not,
I would just stay with the standard pickups. I put an inverted pickup in my
first RV and realize now that it was not necessary. You could probably put
the inverted pickups in your -7 QB but it will be a mess. The tanks will
arrive with the inboard inspection plate just screwed on (without sealant)
so you can certainly gain access to do this job, but it will still be
difficult and probably not worth it, in my opinion. On the other hand, if
inverted aerobatics is your thing, it is doable, so go for it!
Pat Hatch
RV-4
RV-6
RV-7 QB
Vero Beach, FL
----- Original Message -----
From: "David Figgins" <2004nospam(at)earthlink.net>
Subject: RV-List: RV7 QB tanks
>
> I think I may have run into a problem and need some advice, I have the
> wing
> kit on order with the QB tanks (due in December), and in reading the
> drawings and instruction this past couple of days I noticed a tank mod is
> required for inverted flight that adds a flop tube in the standard vent
> line
> area and moves the sender outboard one station. I am assuming the QB tanks
> are in the standard configuration. Questions therefore are 1) can the tank
> be modified for this mod after it is complete (i.e. can you get access and
> keep inside clean) and 2) is this mod for sustained inverted flight and
> regular rolls, loops etc are OK with the standard tanks.
>
> Thanks for any input
>
> Dave RV7A
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Oldsfolks(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: >Re:Wing Jig |
You will need to drive rivets in the rear spar from the bottom,just have
enough room to handle the gun under there.
Bob Olds RV-4 , N1191X
A&P , EAA Tech. Counselor
Charleston,Arkansas
Real Aviators Fly Taildraggers
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Jim Gray <n747jg(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | Van's Horizontal Filtered Airbox |
Listers,
I am using an IO-360 angle valve engine with Airflow Performance fuel
injection on an RV-8. It looks like the fiberglass snorkel intake that
Van sells will need to be completely redesigned due to the round
forward facing intake on the AFP system (vs. a nice flat plate at the
forward end of the throttle body on the Bendix system). Any experience
in attaching the snorkel securely to the round opening would be
appreciated.
My second question is, why does Van's fiberglass snorkel have to snake
its way from the forward part of the throttle body up to the filter
that mounts to the left baffle intake floor? Couldn't it be designed
to come straight out of the throttle body, through a filter, to an
intake designed into the cowl right in front of the throttle body
itself? I would guess that ram airflow is a good thing and a straight
duct directly to the throttle body intake might actually increase the
ram effect.
Any thoughts or experience with installation of the forward facing AFP
would be appreciated.
Thanks,
Jim Gray
n747jg(at)earthlink.net
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Allen Fulmer" <afulmer(at)charter.net> |
I put one at 49" and the other at 60" (so I could see which way I liked it!)
So far think I like the 49" for working on the tank z brackets, reaming the
tank skin/rib rivet holes, etc. But then I have not started on the 60" high
wing yet except to match ream the skins. Anywhere in between will be just
fine I suspect.
Allen Fulmer
RV7 Wings
QB Fuse 12/04
N808AF reserved
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of David Fenstermacher
Subject: RV-List: Wing Jig
No luck in the archives.
Building the wing jig.
What is the best height for the angle iron used to clamp the main spar?
There isn't a dimension on the drawing.
Want to try to get it comfortable; as I will be living with it for some
time.
I'm about 5'8" tall, if that matters at all.
Dave
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Mickey Coggins <mick-matronics(at)rv8.ch> |
| Subject: | Installing big radios and transponders |
Hi,
I've got a Narco 155 and an ICOM A200 that I plan to install
in my RV8 panel.
Does anyone have any photos of an installation of these
long devices in a panel, preferably an 8?
It seems like they will need more support than just bolting
them to the panel itself, but getting them lined up to a
frame attached to somewhere other than the panel seems kind
of tricky. Any and all advice appreciated!
Thanks,
Mickey
--
Mickey Coggins
http://www.rv8.ch/
#82007 QB Wings/Fuselage
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Mike Robertson" <mrobert569(at)hotmail.com> |
The van's wheel pants are polyester. You can use epoxy resin on polyester.
Mike Robertson
>From: "steve zicree" <szicree(at)adelphia.net>
>Reply-To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
>To:
>Subject: RV-List: Date: Sat, 30 Oct 2004 19:11:56 -0700 1.16
>
>
>Folks,
>
>If I need to modify the wheel pants, do I need to use the same type of
>resin as they are made of? If so, can anyone tell me how to determine
>whether mine are epoxy or polyester? Thanks.
>
>Steve Zicree
>RV4 on its wheels!
>
>
Get ready for school! Find articles, homework help and more in the Back to
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Ed Anderson" <eanderson(at)carolina.rr.com> |
| Subject: | Re: RV7 QB tanks |
> David,
>
> The standard fuel pickups are fine for most aerobatics but will not work
for
> sustained inverted flight. But are you really going to do this? If so,
are
> you going to have the required inverted oil system for your engine? If
not,
> I would just stay with the standard pickups. I put an inverted pickup in
my
> first RV and realize now that it was not necessary. You could probably
put
> the inverted pickups in your -7 QB but it will be a mess. The tanks will
> arrive with the inboard inspection plate just screwed on (without sealant)
> so you can certainly gain access to do this job, but it will still be
> difficult and probably not worth it, in my opinion. On the other hand, if
> inverted aerobatics is your thing, it is doable, so go for it!
>
> Pat Hatch
>
I agree with Pat's comment regarding installing a flop tube. Unless you are
going to do sustained inverted flight you don't need it and if you are -
then you are going to need a lot more done to the engine.
I installed a flop tube and the only thing it ever did for me was a major
(but not the only one) factor in a 12 mile engine out guide when the flop
tube came unscrewed from the rib bulkhead fitting after 160 hours of flight
time. Therefore the engine could not "suck" up the last 3 1/2 gallons of
fuel in that tank. Ditch the flop-tube.
Ed Anderson
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "steve zicree" <szicree(at)adelphia.net> |
| Subject: | Re: RV7 QB tanks |
I built my tanks with the standard and then, after getting into acro,
changed my mind and decided to put the flop tube in. It was really no big
thing and I was able to complete the whole job in one session. Regarding the
need for it, it's only necessary for negative g stuff. Without it, your
engine will sputter during things like slow rolls, cuban 4's, etc. Of
course, you'll also need an injected engine and inverted oil system, but
those things could be added later.
Steve Zicree
----- Original Message -----
From: "David Figgins" <2004nospam(at)earthlink.net>
Subject: RV-List: RV7 QB tanks
>
> I think I may have run into a problem and need some advice, I have the
wing
> kit on order with the QB tanks (due in December), and in reading the
> drawings and instruction this past couple of days I noticed a tank mod is
> required for inverted flight that adds a flop tube in the standard vent
line
> area and moves the sender outboard one station. I am assuming the QB tanks
> are in the standard configuration. Questions therefore are 1) can the tank
> be modified for this mod after it is complete (i.e. can you get access and
> keep inside clean) and 2) is this mod for sustained inverted flight and
> regular rolls, loops etc are OK with the standard tanks.
>
> Thanks for any input
>
> Dave RV7A
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "steve zicree" <szicree(at)adelphia.net> |
| Subject: | Re: RV7 QB tanks |
Ed,
Why did the flop tube come unscrewed?
Steve Zicree
----- Original Message -----
From: "Ed Anderson" <eanderson(at)carolina.rr.com>
Subject: Re: RV-List: RV7 QB tanks
>
>
> > David,
> >
> > The standard fuel pickups are fine for most aerobatics but will not work
> for
> > sustained inverted flight. But are you really going to do this? If so,
> are
> > you going to have the required inverted oil system for your engine? If
> not,
> > I would just stay with the standard pickups. I put an inverted pickup
in
> my
> > first RV and realize now that it was not necessary. You could probably
> put
> > the inverted pickups in your -7 QB but it will be a mess. The tanks
will
> > arrive with the inboard inspection plate just screwed on (without
sealant)
> > so you can certainly gain access to do this job, but it will still be
> > difficult and probably not worth it, in my opinion. On the other hand,
if
> > inverted aerobatics is your thing, it is doable, so go for it!
> >
> > Pat Hatch
> >
>
> I agree with Pat's comment regarding installing a flop tube. Unless you
are
> going to do sustained inverted flight you don't need it and if you are -
> then you are going to need a lot more done to the engine.
> I installed a flop tube and the only thing it ever did for me was a major
> (but not the only one) factor in a 12 mile engine out guide when the flop
> tube came unscrewed from the rib bulkhead fitting after 160 hours of
flight
> time. Therefore the engine could not "suck" up the last 3 1/2 gallons of
> fuel in that tank. Ditch the flop-tube.
>
> Ed Anderson
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | richard dudley <rhdudley(at)att.net> |
Listers,
In order to not be limited by capacity, I purchased a large compressor
about midway in building my -6A. I found that the small one that I had
originally would not keep up with my die grinder and I expected that
when I painted that it would be inadequate. I am now finished with
painting and want to sell my large compressor and replace it with a
smaller one that will fill tires and occasionally run air tools.
The compressor for sale is:
Porter-Cable Jetstream
135psi
7 hp/ 60 gal.
12.1 scfm @ 40 psi
9.7 scfm @ 90 psi
240 vAC
Valve, trap and regulator included (not part of original equipment).
It is like new and has no problem keeping up with a die grinder or spray
gun.
Because it is large and relatively heavy, it would probably be expensive
to ship and only of interest to someone near enough to Orlando, FL with
a suitable vehicle to carry it away.
I will sell it for $ 300 if you can pick it up.
If you are interested please contact me off list. I could send you a
photo if you would like.
Regards,
Richard Dudley
Preparing -6A to move to the airport
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "LML Klingmuller" <l_klingmuller(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | Dip stick oil seep help |
For some unknown reason the seat of my dip stick tube (0-360 ) always seem to
leak after a while. Initially I just tighten the tube, but the oil did always
seep through. Then I put a some permatex around the thread, but again no luck
for a permanent seal.
Any ideas what I could use to make a leak free connection between the crankcase
and the plastic dip stick tube???
Lothar, Denver area, RV-6A, 450 hrs
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "D Paul Deits" <pdeits(at)comcast.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Archangel Efis |
Can you give me more details?
----- Original Message -----
From: "Arnold de Brie" <arnold(at)paperchip.com>
Subject: RV-List: Archangel Efis
>
>
> Would anyone be interested in an Archangel Efis system complete with
> AHRS, EFDS, ADS and remote flux gate compass.
>
>
> It is sitting in my shop for quite a while here and the authorities here
> won't let me install it in an experimental .
>
>
> I fired the system up lately and it is still working fine.
>
>
> The only things that have to be added are sensors for the temps/fuelflow
>
>
> Contact me off-list
>
>
> Arnold de Brie
>
>
> The Netherlands
>
>
> RV8
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Brian Denk" <akroguy(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | Van's Horizontal Filtered Airbox |
>
> I am using an IO-360 angle valve engine with Airflow Performance
>fuel
>injection on an RV-8. It looks like the fiberglass snorkel intake that
>Van sells will need to be completely redesigned due to the round
>forward facing intake on the AFP system (vs. a nice flat plate at the
>forward end of the throttle body on the Bendix system). Any experience
>in attaching the snorkel securely to the round opening would be
>appreciated.
>
> My second question is, why does Van's fiberglass snorkel have to
>snake
>its way from the forward part of the throttle body up to the filter
>that mounts to the left baffle intake floor? Couldn't it be designed
>to come straight out of the throttle body, through a filter, to an
>intake designed into the cowl right in front of the throttle body
>itself? I would guess that ram airflow is a good thing and a straight
>duct directly to the throttle body intake might actually increase the
>ram effect.
>
> Any thoughts or experience with installation of the forward facing
>AFP
> would be appreciated.
>
> Thanks,
>
> Jim Gray
> n747jg(at)earthlink.net
Might this be of any help?
http://www.f1-rocketboy.com/products.htm
Brian Denk
RV8 N94BD
RV10 '51
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Ed Anderson" <eanderson(at)carolina.rr.com> |
| Subject: | Re: RV7 QB tanks |
Steve,
I don't know for certain, but I suspect that I failed to proper torque
the fitting before I closed up the tank. I probably took the flop tube out
to put in the "sloshing" compound and then just screwed it back on finger
tight after the slosh dried. I undoubtedly intended to go back and torque
the fitting properly - but, clearly I did not. It was interesting that it
took 160 hour of flight for it to finally work off - but it did. Which left
3.5 gallons below the level of fitting unavailable.
I at first thought the flop tube had hung up on a fitting in the bay with
the inlet above the fuel level. So after my nerves calmed down I may
several flights and tried to shake it loose by rocking the wings, pitching,
etc., but to no avail So I bit the bullet and took the tank off. When I
took the access plate off I realized I had put in all the anti-fouling
fittings to prevent it from doing just that and the flop tube was laying
where it should in the bottom of the tank. Then I reached in to move it and
it came back in my hand I realized it had come unscrewed. I have now
screwed the flop tube back on and torqued it this time and so far (40 hours)
its remained in place.
Ed Anderson
----- Original Message -----
From: "steve zicree" <szicree(at)adelphia.net>
Subject: Re: RV-List: RV7 QB tanks
>
> Ed,
>
> Why did the flop tube come unscrewed?
>
> Steve Zicree
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Ed Anderson" <eanderson(at)carolina.rr.com>
> To:
> Subject: Re: RV-List: RV7 QB tanks
>
>
> >
> >
> > > David,
> > >
> > > The standard fuel pickups are fine for most aerobatics but will not
work
> > for
> > > sustained inverted flight. But are you really going to do this? If
so,
> > are
> > > you going to have the required inverted oil system for your engine?
If
> > not,
> > > I would just stay with the standard pickups. I put an inverted pickup
> in
> > my
> > > first RV and realize now that it was not necessary. You could
probably
> > put
> > > the inverted pickups in your -7 QB but it will be a mess. The tanks
> will
> > > arrive with the inboard inspection plate just screwed on (without
> sealant)
> > > so you can certainly gain access to do this job, but it will still be
> > > difficult and probably not worth it, in my opinion. On the other
hand,
> if
> > > inverted aerobatics is your thing, it is doable, so go for it!
> > >
> > > Pat Hatch
> > >
> >
> > I agree with Pat's comment regarding installing a flop tube. Unless you
> are
> > going to do sustained inverted flight you don't need it and if you are -
> > then you are going to need a lot more done to the engine.
> > I installed a flop tube and the only thing it ever did for me was a
major
> > (but not the only one) factor in a 12 mile engine out guide when the
flop
> > tube came unscrewed from the rib bulkhead fitting after 160 hours of
> flight
> > time. Therefore the engine could not "suck" up the last 3 1/2 gallons
of
> > fuel in that tank. Ditch the flop-tube.
> >
> > Ed Anderson
> >
> >
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Brian Denk" <akroguy(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | Dip stick oil seep help |
>
>
>For some unknown reason the seat of my dip stick tube (0-360 ) always
>seem to leak after a while. Initially I just tighten the tube, but the oil
>did always seep through. Then I put a some permatex around the thread, but
>again no luck for a permanent seal.
>Any ideas what I could use to make a leak free connection between the
>crankcase and the plastic dip stick tube???
>
>Lothar, Denver area, RV-6A, 450 hrs
Proseal!
You might have a tiny crack in the tube from the repeated torquings. It's a
silly plastic thing and I know I could easily crack it if I went too far
with the wrench. Worth checking.
Brian Denk
RV8 N94BD
RV10 '51
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Jerry Springer <jsflyrv(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Dip stick oil seep help |
Brian Denk wrote:
>
>
>
>
>>
>>
>>For some unknown reason the seat of my dip stick tube (0-360 ) always
>>seem to leak after a while. Initially I just tighten the tube, but the oil
>>did always seep through. Then I put a some permatex around the thread, but
>>again no luck for a permanent seal.
>>Any ideas what I could use to make a leak free connection between the
>>crankcase and the plastic dip stick tube???
>>
>>Lothar, Denver area, RV-6A, 450 hrs
>>
>>
>
>
>Proseal!
>
>You might have a tiny crack in the tube from the repeated torquings. It's a
>silly plastic thing and I know I could easily crack it if I went too far
>with the wrench. Worth checking.
>
>Brian Denk
>RV8 N94BD
>RV10 '51
>
>
>
Mine also has a paper gasket, don't know if that is standard or not.
Jerry
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Wayne Glasser" <ku-tec(at)bigpond.net.au> |
| Subject: | Re: RV7 QB tanks |
Dave
I have just been through this exact dilemma with Vans and their answer was
that you can complete all the required mods ie flop tube, flop tube guides,
trap door and tank senders with the tanks completed.
Wayne
----- Original Message -----
From: "David Figgins" <2004nospam(at)earthlink.net>
Subject: RV-List: RV7 QB tanks
>
> I think I may have run into a problem and need some advice, I have the
> wing
> kit on order with the QB tanks (due in December), and in reading the
> drawings and instruction this past couple of days I noticed a tank mod is
> required for inverted flight that adds a flop tube in the standard vent
> line
> area and moves the sender outboard one station. I am assuming the QB tanks
> are in the standard configuration. Questions therefore are 1) can the tank
> be modified for this mod after it is complete (i.e. can you get access and
> keep inside clean) and 2) is this mod for sustained inverted flight and
> regular rolls, loops etc are OK with the standard tanks.
>
> Thanks for any input
>
> Dave RV7A
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Jim & Kathy McChesney <rvtach(at)highstream.net> |
List-
I'm looking at my wings and debating between the Duckworks HID leading
edge landing light ($450 for one light from Van's) and the CreativAir
wingtip halogen landing light ($120 for a pair- one in each wingtip).
Any discussion of the advantages of one or the other would be helpful.
Also any factors favoring right wing vs left wing installation if I
choose a single light? I'm thinking that illuminating the driver's
side of the taxiway would be a good choice but I've seen several side by
side RVs with the light in the right wing.
Thanks in advance for any info.
Jim McChesney
7A-QB wings and fuse
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Mike Holland" <hollandm(at)pacbell.net> |
| Subject: | Rear Window / Top Skin Pucker |
On my tip-up rear window I'm getting a very noticeable pucker in the rear top
skin at the 10 and 2 o'clock between the holes with greatest curvature. I've
cut the canopy so there isn't much I can do to reposition things. I removed the
skin dimples and tried forcing the rear edge tight against the skin and tried
to realign holes, thinking that might allow the parts to shift enough, then
redimpled, no-luck.
I'm using washers rather than a backing strip and wondered if this could be part
of the problem since there isn't anything adding stiffness between screw holes?
If others have encountered this problem what solutions worked for you?
About the only solution I have left is to put a faring over the transition between
the rear window and aft top skin, not a job I really want to do!
Thanks
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Dan Checkoway" <dan(at)rvproject.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Dip stick oil seep help |
Lycoming calls out a paper gasket.
http://images.rvproject.com/images/2004/20040929_oil_filler_gasket.jpg
I had the same seepage until I finally got the gasket in there. It didn't
come with my engine, and I didn't realize it was supposed to be in there
until I looked at the Lyc parts catalog.
Spruce sells it for $1.36:
08-00305 LYC OIL DIPSTICK GASK 72059
)_( Dan
RV-7 N714D
http://www.rvproject.com
----- Original Message -----
From: "LML Klingmuller" <l_klingmuller(at)earthlink.net>
Subject: RV-List: Dip stick oil seep help
>
> For some unknown reason the seat of my dip stick tube (0-360 ) always
seem to leak after a while. Initially I just tighten the tube, but the oil
did always seep through. Then I put a some permatex around the thread, but
again no luck for a permanent seal.
> Any ideas what I could use to make a leak free connection between the
crankcase and the plastic dip stick tube???
>
> Lothar, Denver area, RV-6A, 450 hrs
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Angle valve IO-360 oil sump part # needed |
Christen has standard and extended flavors of their plumbing. I believe the
normal A1A can be plumbed for the standard but the extended requires the
addition of a boss. The aluminum weld boss for the A1A is ~$40 and can be
welded by a lot of folks. The magnesium boss needed for the C sump was $200+
IIRC and needs a specialty welder - read that as more $$. Christen may have
their instructions on-line. I'd check out the Aviat (they own Christen) site
(www.aviat.com ???)
Greg Young
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Charlie Kuss
> Sent: Sunday, October 31, 2004 8:05 AM
> To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
> Subject: RE: RV-List: Angle valve IO-360 oil sump part # needed
>
>
> Greg,
> Does the A1A sump have the proper tapped ports for adding
> the Christian inverted oil system?
> Charlie Kuss
>
>
> >
> >Bad news. The "C" sump won't work on the taildragger either without
> >modifying the mount, at least on a parallel valve IO-360. It's also
> >magnesium and costs big $$$ to add a boss for inverted oil.
> I had one on my
> >-6 and modified the mount but won't do it again. I plan to
> change to the
> >"A1A" sump on the Phoenix. That makes it essentially an IO-360-M1B.
> >
> >Regards,
> >Greg Young - Houston (DWH)
> >RV-6 N6GY - project Phoenix
> >Navion N5221K - just an XXL RV-6A
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Greg@itmack" <greg(at)itmack.com> |
Hi all,
It's time for me to order the fuse kit for my 8 and I want to enlist the lists
help in making some decisions.
Should I get the ground adjustable rudders? How easy is it to get down there and
adjust them when needed?
Electric or manual aileron trim? Does either come with some type of indicator
for trim position?
Anything else I should think of now?
I'm leaning towards the Altrak and Trio AP, I suppose I should at least get the
servos now, but I'd like to hold off on the electronics as much as possible
since there is always an upgrade coming. Do these servos work with all autopilots
in case I change my mind as to which autopilot I want later?
Thanks
Greg
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Ed Anderson" <eanderson(at)carolina.rr.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Rear Window / Top Skin Pucker |
----- Original Message -----
From: "Mike Holland" <hollandm(at)pacbell.net>
Subject: RV-List: Rear Window / Top Skin Pucker
>
> On my tip-up rear window I'm getting a very noticeable pucker in the rear
top skin at the 10 and 2 o'clock between the holes with greatest curvature.
I've cut the canopy so there isn't much I can do to reposition things. I
removed the skin dimples and tried forcing the rear edge tight against the
skin and tried to realign holes, thinking that might allow the parts to
shift enough, then redimpled, no-luck.
>
> I'm using washers rather than a backing strip and wondered if this could
be part of the problem since there isn't anything adding stiffness between
screw holes?
>
> If others have encountered this problem what solutions worked for you?
>
> About the only solution I have left is to put a faring over the transition
between the rear window and aft top skin, not a job I really want to do!
>
> Thanks
Well, Mike, I had small puckers - but a worst problem (in my opinion) in
that when I cut the canopy into two pieces it was - lets just say - less
than perfect. Some places the two pieces would meet with a nice straight
gap of maybe 1/16 - 3/32" and other places looked like the grand canyon.
You really only noticed it when the canopy was shut and you could compare
the two pieces - but I really couldn't stand to look at it.
I cut a 3" wide strip of 0.032 2024 T3 (after getting the right curve with
poster paper). I smoothed the edges of the metal strip so it wouldn't
scratch or cut and I placed the 3" strip over canopy (front of course) and
pop riveted it over the plex. Approx 2" of the strip is over the front and
the other 1" or so overlaps the rear canopy. It gave me a nice line, hid
the messy mismatch of Plexiglas and has worked fine for over 7 years of
flying my RV-6A. I found out it also kept the rain out as well. It also
provides a convention place to gently lift the canopy from the center once
its unlocked.
FWIW
Ed Anderson
eanderson(at)carolina.rr.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Van's Horizontal Filtered Airbox |
Jim,
If you want the smooth cowl through use of the snorkel you can cut off the
flange and mold a new attachment directly to the AFP intake. I used the -8
snorkel on my -6 and had to rebuild the lower half but you should need to do
nearly as much. I stuffed florist foam into the AFP intake and remaining
snorkel, shaved it down to the contour I wanted, covered and smoothed it
with clay, applied mold release and laid up fiberglass over the clay and the
AFP inlet. When done I had a nice snug fit round end on the snorkel. I'll
send you a couple pics offline. The snorkel gives the smooth appearance, has
a filter and means for alternate air but probably doesn't offer the ram
effect of the Rocket-type scoop. Your choice but the mod to the snorkel is
not hard.
Regards,
Greg Young - Houston (DWH)
RV-6 N6GY ...project Phoenix
Navion N5221K - just an XXL RV-6A
>
>
> Listers,
>
> I am using an IO-360 angle valve engine with Airflow
> Performance fuel injection on an RV-8. It looks like the
> fiberglass snorkel intake that Van sells will need to be
> completely redesigned due to the round forward facing intake
> on the AFP system (vs. a nice flat plate at the forward end
> of the throttle body on the Bendix system). Any experience
> in attaching the snorkel securely to the round opening would
> be appreciated.
>
> My second question is, why does Van's fiberglass
> snorkel have to snake its way from the forward part of the
> throttle body up to the filter that mounts to the left baffle
> intake floor? Couldn't it be designed to come straight out
> of the throttle body, through a filter, to an intake designed
> into the cowl right in front of the throttle body itself? I
> would guess that ram airflow is a good thing and a straight
> duct directly to the throttle body intake might actually
> increase the ram effect.
>
> Any thoughts or experience with installation of the
> forward facing AFP
> would be appreciated.
>
> Thanks,
>
> Jim Gray
> n747jg(at)earthlink.net
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Randy Lervold" <randy(at)romeolima.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Landing lights |
> I'm looking at my wings and debating between the Duckworks HID leading
> edge landing light ($450 for one light from Van's) and the CreativAir
> wingtip halogen landing light ($120 for a pair- one in each wingtip).
> Any discussion of the advantages of one or the other would be helpful.
> Also any factors favoring right wing vs left wing installation if I
> choose a single light? I'm thinking that illuminating the driver's
> side of the taxiway would be a good choice but I've seen several side by
> side RVs with the light in the right wing.
As you're making this this decision you might want to consider whether you
want a wig-wag circuit or not. If you do than you can't use HID. Personally,
I think a wig-wag system in an RV is a GOOD idea, they are small fast
aircraft that are often difficult for other aircraft to see. A wig-wag
option on your light(s) really adds to your visibility day or night, but
really helps more during the day.
Randy Lervold
RV-3, RV-3B
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "David Figgins" <2004nospam(at)earthlink.net> |
Thanks for all the responses, seems this will not be a big deal
Dave
David Figgins
Tel: (801) 572-5092
Cell: (801) 201-0558
email: dbfigginsweb(at)earthlink.net
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Wayne Glasser
Subject: Re: RV-List: RV7 QB tanks
Dave
I have just been through this exact dilemma with Vans and their answer was
that you can complete all the required mods ie flop tube, flop tube guides,
trap door and tank senders with the tanks completed.
Wayne
----- Original Message -----
From: "David Figgins" <2004nospam(at)earthlink.net>
Subject: RV-List: RV7 QB tanks
> --> <2004nospam(at)earthlink.net>
>
> I think I may have run into a problem and need some advice, I have the
> wing kit on order with the QB tanks (due in December), and in reading
> the drawings and instruction this past couple of days I noticed a tank
> mod is required for inverted flight that adds a flop tube in the
> standard vent line area and moves the sender outboard one station. I
> am assuming the QB tanks are in the standard configuration. Questions
> therefore are 1) can the tank be modified for this mod after it is
> complete (i.e. can you get access and keep inside clean) and 2) is
> this mod for sustained inverted flight and regular rolls, loops etc
> are OK with the standard tanks.
>
> Thanks for any input
>
> Dave RV7A
>
>
>
advertising on the Matronics Forums.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | John Ammeter <jammeter(at)comcast.net> |
| Subject: | Free Starter.... Seattle area |
I'm cleaning out my garage and came across this Prestolite
12 volt starter. It's part #MZ4204 with the number 32000C83
just below the part number.
It came off a Lycoming O-320 model E2A 150 HP engine. Was
working when removed.
If you want it, you can have it.... gotta pick it up in
North Seattle or Port Hadlock area.
email me for directions. Or, find my number in the
'book'...
jammeter(at)comcast.net
Also, I have for sale... won't give it away since it cost
too damn much.. One airplane jack suitable for lifting the
RV wing so you can change the tire. It's about 20" high
with tripod bracing. Asking $75 for it. Same deal... pick
up in or near Seattle.
John Ammeter
Former owner/builder of RV-6 N16JA
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | luckymacy(at)comcast.net (lucky) |
| Subject: | Re: Van's Horizontal Filtered Airbox |
I think the design is optimized to efficiently use the vacuum situation in the
front baffle location and smoothly flow air through the snorkel into the fuel
metering system. In fact today at a fly in I asked a RV8 pilot who after flying
the normal Van's io-360 set up for a while bought a different aftermarket cowl
which placed the air intake in the center under the spinner. For all his
work he said he didn't get any noticeable gains.
lucky
>
>
> Listers,
>
> I am using an IO-360 angle valve engine with Airflow Performance fuel
> injection on an RV-8. It looks like the fiberglass snorkel intake that
> Van sells will need to be completely redesigned due to the round
> forward facing intake on the AFP system (vs. a nice flat plate at the
> forward end of the throttle body on the Bendix system). Any experience
> in attaching the snorkel securely to the round opening would be
> appreciated.
>
> My second question is, why does Van's fiberglass snorkel have to snake
> its way from the forward part of the throttle body up to the filter
> that mounts to the left baffle intake floor? Couldn't it be designed
> to come straight out of the throttle body, through a filter, to an
> intake designed into the cowl right in front of the throttle body
> itself? I would guess that ram airflow is a good thing and a straight
> duct directly to the throttle body intake might actually increase the
> ram effect.
>
> Any thoughts or experience with installation of the forward facing AFP
> would be appreciated.
>
> Thanks,
>
> Jim Gray
> n747jg(at)earthlink.net
>
>
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "JOHN STARN" <jhstarn(at)verizon.net> |
| Subject: | Re: OT (well not really)...quote pertinent to QB vs. standard |
kit
Lest we forget all those who spend all their time (& our money,) finding
ways not to work but still get paid. Welfare & Politicians... KABONG Do
not archive
>>
>>I'm disappointed. It seems to leave out those of us who spend a whole lot
>>of money wasting time. :-)
>>
> Don't forget about those of us who make money by saving other people time.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Sam Buchanan <sbuc(at)hiwaay.net> |
| Subject: | Re: fuse order time |
Greg@itmack wrote:
I'm leaning towards the Altrak and Trio
> AP, I suppose I should at least get the servos now, but I'd like to
> hold off on the electronics as much as possible since there is always
> an upgrade coming. Do these servos work with all autopilots in case
> I change my mind as to which autopilot I want later?
Navaid servo works with Navaid, EZ-Pilot, and DigiTrak.
AlTrak and native version of DigiTrak and all DigiFlight systems require
TruTrak servos.
Don't worry about servo installations now, Just make sure you install
conduit to the proposed servo locations and you can readily run wiring
and mount servos when you settle on a particular system.
Sam Buchanan (RV-6, EZ-Pilot, AlTrak)
http://thervjournal.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "thomas a. sargent" <sarg314(at)earthlink.net> |
Received": contains.a.forged.HELO(at)matronics.com
Received: contains a forged HELO
Jim:
That worked out well. That Stainless eats up the cutting disks pretty
fast, but it was controllable. I cut the firewall about 1/16" or 1/32"
away from the aluminum angle backing it up on the cabin side and then
trimmed the last bit of the edge with a chassis nibbler. I got the edge
nice and flush with the aluminum angle.
Jim Jewell wrote:
>
> Hi Tom,
>
> If you have or can beg, borrow or buy a Dremel tool (hobby sized hi speed
> grinder) with a package of their "cut off wheel no. 409" you should get the
> job done quite well.
> Drill 3/32 holes at each corners from the cockpit side. Then use the holes
> on the outside to tape off the cut lines. Use the Dremel to cut the hole and
> finish the edges with a fine grit Dremel sanding drum or hand fie file as
> needed.
>>I am about to install the firewall recess in my 6A. Since this is a QB,
>>the firewall area is already fully assembled. Does any one have any
>>suggestions about how to cut the firewall sheet cleanly after it is
>>rivetted to the airplane?
--
Tom Sargent, RV-6A
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "DEAN PSIROPOULOS" <dean.psiropoulos(at)verizon.net> |
| Subject: | RV-6A Main Gear Leg Fairings. |
Anybody have advice on how to make this process faster and less painful? The prints
and manual talk about the importance of getting the leg fairings lined up
so they are parallell to the airstream and not acting like rudders on the front
of the airplane. I looked at what Van's shows on the blueprints on how to
do this and in theory it should work but it's a tedious time consuming process
and I'm not sure that the results would actually be all that accurate. Since
I've spent the last half dozen weekends and a few weeknights doing wheel pants
and getting THEM aligned into the airflow and set at the correct height, etc.
etc. ........ I'm kinda burned out with this and am hoping some has a quicker
easier method for doing this. Just seems like a hell of a lot of effort for
something seemingly trivial. Any suggestions? Also, what is everyone's experience
in the field? Those that didn't do that great a job aligning these things
have rudder trim different with fairings on than with them off? Van's manual
spend several sentences talking about the importance of getting this accurate
but I'm having a difficult time figuring out how to do this accurately, like
the wheel pants, the gear legs and fairings are curved shapes that are hard
to make reference points on. What's the scoop from you folks with experience?
Thanks for the help.
Dean Psiropoulos
RV-6A N197DM
Wondering if it'll ever get done!
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Mickey Coggins <mick-matronics(at)rv8.ch> |
Hi Jim,
I've got a couple of articles with some pictures of the landing
lights and LED position lights on my home page: http://rv8.ch/
The Creativair landing lights are stone simple, and pretty easy
to install. If you do go with the Duckworks kit, be careful
cutting out the hole in the wing. I have a friend that made the
cut out with the wing upside down, and of course the hole was
in the wrong place.
Mickey
>I'm looking at my wings and debating between the Duckworks HID leading
>edge landing light ($450 for one light from Van's) and the CreativAir
>wingtip halogen landing light ($120 for a pair- one in each wingtip).
>Any discussion of the advantages of one or the other would be helpful.
>Also any factors favoring right wing vs left wing installation if I
>choose a single light? I'm thinking that illuminating the driver's
>side of the taxiway would be a good choice but I've seen several side by
>side RVs with the light in the right wing.
--
Mickey Coggins
http://www.rv8.ch/
#82007 QB Wings/Fuselage
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Fiveonepw(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: RV-6A Main Gear Leg Fairings. |
> Anybody have advice on how to make this process faster and less painful?
>>>>>>>>>>>>
1. Level the plane with the fairings installed
2. Using plumb lines from the center of the firewall and tail, chalk a
centerline on the floor extending several feet behind the plane
3. Highlight the trailing edge of each fairing- place the side of a Sharpie
tip on the edge of the fairing and run it down the full length of the fairing
4. Mark the fairing trailing edge at midpoint and use a plumbline to mark
this point on the floor (both sides)
5. Measure the distance from these points to the centerline and chalk two
lines rearward from them parallel to the centerline
6. Place your better eye next to the floor at the rear of these two lines and
see if the same amount of fairing is visible on both sides of the trailing
edge- adjust as necessary until it appears the trailing edge is running right
down the center of the fairing- clamp them firmly into final position
If you need to move or remove them before making or attaching intersection
fairings, you'll need a good reference point to avoid the above. Once mine were
in position, I ran the hinge pin up to the lower skin and marked where it
touched the skin in case I had to pull them off.
May be better ways, but this worked well for me
From The PossumWorks in TN
Mark - 125 hours and plane still nekkid 8-(
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Hopperdhh(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Landing lights |
In a message dated 11/1/04 3:09:17 AM US Eastern Standard Time,
mick-matronics(at)rv8.ch writes:
> I have a friend that made the
> cut out with the wing upside down, and of course the hole was
> in the wrong place.
>
> Mickey
>
And then what did he do?
Dan H
RV-7A
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Wheel Pant Question |
| From: | tacaruth(at)ralcorp.com |
11/01/2004 08:14:54 AM
HI All,
On the plans for the 7A wheelpants, it shows using Tinnerman washers for
the #6 screws that hold the front and rear halves together. It does not,
however, show using the washers for the #8's that hold the pants to the
aluminum brackets. Would this be a good idea to prevent the screws pulling
through the fiberglass?
Thanks,
Tom
RV-7A, ready to begin engine mounting and FWF.
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: RV-6A Main Gear Leg Fairings. |
| From: | tacaruth(at)ralcorp.com |
11/01/2004 08:29:52 AM
The upper gear fairing that Fairings Etc sells should align the leg
fairing. Talk with Bob at Fairings Etc about this.
Tom
"DEAN
PSIROPOULOS"
Sent by: cc
owner-rv-list-ser
ver(at)matronics.com Subject
RV-List: RV-6A Main Gear Leg
Fairings.
11/01/2004 12:18
AM
Please respond to
rv-list@matronics
.com
Anybody have advice on how to make this process faster and less painful?
The prints and manual talk about the importance of getting the leg fairings
lined up so they are parallell to the airstream and not acting like rudders
on the front of the airplane. I looked at what Van's shows on the
blueprints on how to do this and in theory it should work but it's a
tedious time consuming process and I'm not sure that the results would
actually be all that accurate. Since I've spent the last half dozen
weekends and a few weeknights doing wheel pants and getting THEM aligned
into the airflow and set at the correct height, etc. etc. ........ I'm
kinda burned out with this and am hoping some has a quicker easier method
for doing this. Just seems like a hell of a lot of effort for something
seemingly trivial. Any suggestions? Also, what is everyone's experience in
the field? Those that didn't do that great a job aligning these things
have rudder trim different with fairings on than!
with them off? Van's manual spend several sentences talking about the
importance of getting this accurate but I'm having a difficult time
figuring out how to do this accurately, like the wheel pants, the gear legs
and fairings are curved shapes that are hard to make reference points on.
What's the scoop from you folks with experience? Thanks for the help.
Dean Psiropoulos
RV-6A N197DM
Wondering if it'll ever get done!
If you are not the intended addressee indicated in this message (or
responsible for delivery of the message to such person), you may not copy
message and kindly notify the sender by reply email. Please advise
immediately if you or your employer do not consent to internet email for
messages of this kind.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Charlie Kuss <chaztuna(at)adelphia.net> |
| Subject: | Re: fuse order time |
Greg,
Changing the position of the ground adjustable rudder pedals is about as
easy as working under the dash of an MG Midget! In other words, a real
bitch! Stick with the in flight units. Even if no one else ever flies the
plane, you'll like being able to easily change your foot position while in
flight.
Trim is a personal decision. Manual is less money & work to install
(assuming you want the electric on your stick grip). The electric is
lighter weight. I went with the electric for both axis, as I wanted the GIB
to be able to fly and trim the plane. No easy way to do that with manual trim.
The electric units come with an LED indicator for each axis. No indicator
for the manual system.
Vans makes no provision for checking the tightness of 8 AN3 nut/bolt
combinations at the forward end of the fuselage. These bolts hold the lower
fuselage longerons to the firewall (which supports the engine). These are
VERY important bolts. I've modified my firewall with 2 access covers to
allow access to check and tighten these bolts after construction is
complete. I'm including 2 photos of my mod. You want to do this while the
fuselage is still in the jig.
The mod can be done later, but is easier if done while building. If you
even THINK you'll add a pitch servo for your autopilot, don't make the
F-818 brackets as shown by Vans. You can simply make them as shown on the
attached drawing. This is how TruTrak mounts their servo for pitch control.
This mod will add little or no work, IF done during the building phase.
If you want to have all your floors removable, don't rivet the floor ribs
together as suggested by the Orndorff video tapes. Mount them with only
Clecos. Fit the floor skins while the fuselage is still upside down in the
jig. This will allow you to remove the floor ribs when you take the rest of
the fuselage apart to de burr, dimple, etch, Alodine and prime. It's easier
to do this for the floor ribs, if you haven't permanently riveted them in
place. With the floor ribs removable, you will only have to de burr and
dimple on them one time.
Following Vans instructions, this will be a 3 phase process. It will also
me much easier and less work to fit all the nutplates on these ribs (for
the removable flooring) if you can do it at the work bench.
How tall are you? If you are over 6'2", I'd suggest getting the "tall
pilot" seat back weldment option. This moves the pilot's seat back about 2".
Charlie Kuss
PS For those of you reading this on the RV List, you won't see the photos
and drawing that I sent to Greg. The list strips out all attachments.
Contact me "off list" if you'd like to see these.
>
>Hi all,
>It's time for me to order the fuse kit for my 8 and I want to enlist the
>lists help in making some decisions.
>Should I get the ground adjustable rudders? How easy is it to get down
>there and adjust them when needed?
>Electric or manual aileron trim? Does either come with some type of
>indicator for trim position?
>Anything else I should think of now?
>I'm leaning towards the Altrak and Trio AP, I suppose I should at least
>get the servos now, but I'd like to hold off on the electronics as much
>as possible since there is always an upgrade coming. Do these servos work
>with all autopilots in case I change my mind as to which autopilot I want
>later?
>
>Thanks
>Greg
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Fiveonepw(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Wheel Pant Question |
In a message dated 11/1/04 8:16:15 AM Central Standard Time,
tacaruth(at)ralcorp.com writes:
> On the plans for the 7A wheelpants, it shows using Tinnerman washers for
> the #6 screws that hold the front and rear halves together. It does not,
> however, show using the washers for the #8's that hold the pants to the
> aluminum brackets. Would this be a good idea to prevent the screws pulling
> through the fiberglass?
>>>>>>>
FWIW, I used #8 screws for all the screws on the wheelpants- a neat trick is
using #6 finishing washers (NAS390, also referred to as 603) on these as they
are a much nicer fit to the #8 screws (flush with the screw head with less of
the washer showing).
http://www.wicksaircraft.com/catalog/product_search_results.php/search=bmFzMzkw
Don't recall if the plans mention this, but adding several layers of glass
inside the pant where the screws go through thickens the material for a better
countersink and stronger attach point.
Also, highly recommend torx head screws from Microfasteners:
http://www.microfasteners.com/catalog/products/SSCFCMXS.cfm
I used these all over the plane and (IMHO) they are a HUGE improvement over
Phillips!
Mark Phillips
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Dan Checkoway" <dan(at)rvproject.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Wheel Pant Question |
> however, show using the washers for the #8's that hold the pants to the
> aluminum brackets. Would this be a good idea to prevent the screws
pulling
> through the fiberglass?
In my opinion, yes. I glassed tinnermans right into the wheel pant when I
did my lower intersection fairings recently. That way the washers aren't
visible when all is said and done, but the protection is there.
)_( Dan
RV-7 N714D
http://www.rvproject.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Mickey Coggins <mick-matronics(at)rv8.ch> |
| Subject: | Re: Landing lights |
>> I have a friend that made the
>> cut out with the wing upside down, and of course the hole was
>> in the wrong place.
>
>And then what did he do?
He put a patch on the original hole, and then
installed the light correctly on the other wing.
Mickey
--
Mickey Coggins
http://www.rv8.ch/
#82007 QB Wings/Fuselage
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jim Jewell" <jjewell(at)telus.net> |
| Subject: | Re: RV-6A Main Gear Leg Fairings. |
Re- gear fairings,
I found that 'after' carefully doing the alignment as suggested in the Van's
instructions Bob's (Fairings Etc) upper fairings fit very nicely, the
reverse order of Dean's note below. This gives me cause to think they will
fly well and that Bobs claim is as good as his product, well made indeed!.
However the first flight is likely to happen in the coming year (Where have
I heard that said before) and the truth will be seen then.
Jim in Kelowna
----- Original Message -----
From: <tacaruth(at)ralcorp.com>
Subject: Re: RV-List: RV-6A Main Gear Leg Fairings.
>
>
> The upper gear fairing that Fairings Etc sells should align the leg
> fairing. Talk with Bob at Fairings Etc about this.
>
> Tom
>
>
> "DEAN
> PSIROPOULOS"
> (at)verizon.net>
> Sent by: cc
> owner-rv-list-ser
> ver(at)matronics.com Subject
> RV-List: RV-6A Main Gear Leg
> Fairings.
> 11/01/2004 12:18
> AM
>
>
> Please respond to
> rv-list@matronics
> .com
>
>
>
>
> Anybody have advice on how to make this process faster and less painful?
> The prints and manual talk about the importance of getting the leg
> fairings
> lined up so they are parallell to the airstream and not acting like
> rudders
> on the front of the airplane. I looked at what Van's shows on the
> blueprints on how to do this and in theory it should work but it's a
> tedious time consuming process and I'm not sure that the results would
> actually be all that accurate. Since I've spent the last half dozen
> weekends and a few weeknights doing wheel pants and getting THEM aligned
> into the airflow and set at the correct height, etc. etc. ........ I'm
> kinda burned out with this and am hoping some has a quicker easier method
> for doing this. Just seems like a hell of a lot of effort for something
> seemingly trivial. Any suggestions? Also, what is everyone's experience
> in
> the field? Those that didn't do that great a job aligning these things
> have rudder trim different with fairings on than!
> with them off? Van's manual spend several sentences talking about the
> importance of getting this accurate but I'm having a difficult time
> figuring out how to do this accurately, like the wheel pants, the gear
> legs
> and fairings are curved shapes that are hard to make reference points on.
> What's the scoop from you folks with experience? Thanks for the help.
>
> Dean Psiropoulos
> RV-6A N197DM
> Wondering if it'll ever get done!
>
>
> If you are not the intended addressee indicated in this message (or
> responsible for delivery of the message to such person), you may not copy
> message and kindly notify the sender by reply email. Please advise
> immediately if you or your employer do not consent to internet email for
> messages of this kind.
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jeff Dowling" <shempdowling(at)earthlink.net> |
contains a forged HELO
How about some Walmart specials for 10 bucks. Thats essentially what the
Duckworks is anyway. You can get the redneck pickup truck rollover
rectangular halogen 50watt lights from Wallyworld for 20 bucks for the pair.
You have to make up the housing with spare aluminum. It will help alot if
you can look at someone elses. You can bend some plexi on your own or just
by it from Vans. I have them on both wings and they work fine.
Jeff Dowling
RV-6A, N915JD
140 hours
Chicago/Louisville
----- Original Message -----
| From: | "Jim & Kathy McChesney" <rvtach(at)highstream.net> |
forged HELO
>
>
> List-
>
> I'm looking at my wings and debating between the Duckworks HID leading
> edge landing light ($450 for one light from Van's) and the CreativAir
> wingtip halogen landing light ($120 for a pair- one in each wingtip).
> Any discussion of the advantages of one or the other would be helpful.
> Also any factors favoring right wing vs left wing installation if I
> choose a single light? I'm thinking that illuminating the driver's
> side of the taxiway would be a good choice but I've seen several side by
> side RVs with the light in the right wing.
>
> Thanks in advance for any info.
> Jim McChesney
> 7A-QB wings and fuse
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jeff Dowling" <shempdowling(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | Re: RV-6A Main Gear Leg Fairings. |
If you buy fairings-etc intersection fairings they will line up the gear leg
frngs for you.
Jeff Dowling
RV-6A, N915JD
140 hours
Chicago/Louisville
----- Original Message -----
From: "DEAN PSIROPOULOS" <dean.psiropoulos(at)verizon.net>
Subject: RV-List: RV-6A Main Gear Leg Fairings.
>
>
> Anybody have advice on how to make this process faster and less painful?
> The prints and manual talk about the importance of getting the leg
> fairings lined up so they are parallell to the airstream and not acting
> like rudders on the front of the airplane. I looked at what Van's shows
> on the blueprints on how to do this and in theory it should work but it's
> a tedious time consuming process and I'm not sure that the results would
> actually be all that accurate. Since I've spent the last half dozen
> weekends and a few weeknights doing wheel pants and getting THEM aligned
> into the airflow and set at the correct height, etc. etc. ........ I'm
> kinda burned out with this and am hoping some has a quicker easier method
> for doing this. Just seems like a hell of a lot of effort for something
> seemingly trivial. Any suggestions? Also, what is everyone's experience
> in the field? Those that didn't do that great a job aligning these things
> have rudder trim different with fairings on than!
> with them off? Van's manual spend several sentences talking about the
> importance of getting this accurate but I'm having a difficult time
> figuring out how to do this accurately, like the wheel pants, the gear
> legs and fairings are curved shapes that are hard to make reference points
> on. What's the scoop from you folks with experience? Thanks for the
> help.
>
> Dean Psiropoulos
> RV-6A N197DM
> Wondering if it'll ever get done!
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Kevin Shannon" <kshannon(at)seanet.com> |
| Subject: | Fuel senders to float or not to float |
I need to put the baffles on my fuel tanks, but have not decided what to
put in the panel yet. Does anyone know if Vans capacitive senders are
compatible with all the electronic systems out there? I read in the
archives that the S/W float type senders will work with the Grand Rapids
unit. Is this true with any of the other "glass cockpit" systems?
Kevin Shannon
RV 8
RV 9A 994KS sold
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bruno <rv4(at)videotron.ca> |
| Subject: | Blue Mountain EFIS LITE DATABASE UPDATE. |
Hello Listers
Here's an e-mail I sent to Blue Mountain Avionics
regarding their EFIS LITE.
Good day
I'm seriously considering an Efis Lite for my A/C in a near
future but I would like first to have a few questions answered if it's not
too much trouble.
1,- Is a flush mounting bracket available (Due to space/ thickness
constrains)
Not at this time.
2.- How long is your actual shipping schedule ( A friend was told 1 month,
then 2 mouths then a third delivery date extension?)
8-10 weeks at this time.
3.- How can the unit be updated once installed in the A/C,? Does it have to
be pulled out or is a laptop essential to do the updates?
Laptop is perfect. You will need some way to download the updates from the
website and connect to your processor. The Efis/Lite uses a compact flash
card for its internal memory.
4.- Can an actual size cardboard template( Like Dynon has ) be made
available so one can check instrument panel space requirement?
No. You can download a template from website and print for planning
purposes.
Shelia
Thanks a lot for your time
Bruno Dionne
rv4(at)videotron.ca
---------------------------------------------
1.- Looks like I'm gonna have to build my own "Flush mounting bracket"
2.- 8- 10 weeks delivery. ( A friend was told when he called due to delays
getting his that they were missing parts and waiting for them ) Make you
think, doesn't it?
3.- Are there anyone on the List using an Efis Lite or Efis One using a
compact flash card, how one can update or upload a database update to a
flash card ??
Thank you for your time
Bruno
r v4(at)videotron.ca
P.S# You may respond off list if you wish.
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Fuel senders to float or not to float |
I realize this is kind of changing the subject here.....
I would use standard gages for fuel due to 100LL going away probably with
in 5 years. For its replacement check out AGE-85. Its certified and already
TC'ed for a few planes.
http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/1999/07/990720083151.htm
http://www.carbohydrateeconomy.org/news/news.cfm?News_ID=135
http://www.engineering.sdstate.edu/~ethanol/
>
>
>I need to put the baffles on my fuel tanks, but have not decided what to
>put in the panel yet. Does anyone know if Vans capacitive senders are
>compatible with all the electronic systems out there? I read in the
>archives that the S/W float type senders will work with the Grand Rapids
>unit. Is this true with any of the other "glass cockpit" systems?
>
>Kevin Shannon
>RV 8
>RV 9A 994KS sold
>
>
Scott Bilinski
Eng dept 305
Phone (858) 657-2536
Pager (858) 502-5190
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Christopher Stone <rv8iator(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Archangel Efis |
Hello...
Sorry to hear of your misfortune with the authorities.
How old is your system? It has never been installed in an aircraft? What is your
asking price?
Chris Stone
RV-8
-----Original Message-----
From: Arnold de Brie <arnold(at)paperchip.com>
Subject: RV-List: Archangel Efis
Would anyone be interested in an Archangel Efis system complete with
AHRS, EFDS, ADS and remote flux gate compass.
It is sitting in my shop for quite a while here and the authorities here
won't let me install it in an experimental .
I fired the system up lately and it is still working fine.
The only things that have to be added are sensors for the temps/fuelflow
Contact me off-list
Arnold de Brie
The Netherlands
RV8
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Terry Watson" <terry(at)tcwatson.com> |
| Subject: | Blue Mountain EFIS LITE DATABASE UPDATE. |
Bruno,
The database update for my EFIS/one uses a compact flash card. It seems
like the ideal system to me. To update, download the latest from Blue
Mountain's website, copy that onto the compact flash card (using a $5 to $20
card reader/writer if you don't have one built in to your computer); put the
compact flash card in the EFIS and turn it on. That's it.
Terry
RV-8A wiring
Blue Mountain EFIS/one
Seattle
3.- Are there anyone on the List using an Efis Lite or Efis One using a
compact flash card, how one can update or upload a database update to a
flash card ??
Thank you for your time
Bruno
r v4(at)videotron.ca
________________________________________________________________________________
Guys:
Had a fun experience yesterday that I felt I should share with the list to
offer encouragement to those of you still building.
Larry Bowen ... with 14 hours on his new 8 and I flew down to meet up with
Mike Munn (RV-8) to show a perspective builder the RVs and give the $$$$$ ride.
We departed as a flight of 3 .... buzzed a friend's grass strip ... could see
him down there waving !!!
Stopped at Martinsville, Va for a coke and changed planes for the passenger
so that he could get a different ride. On the approach back into Concord the
controller called out Aztec traffic off our right side on a long final ...
giving us the number 2 position ... we could not slow down enought for this Aztec
and finally the controller told him we were 40 kntos faster and to please turn
out and let us come on in .... IT WAS TERRIFIC !!!
The poor Aztec guy was a good sport and wanted to know what the heck we were
flying !! The controller was actually giggling over the radio ... man these
planes are fun ... and fast !!!
Oh yea ... the perspective builder ... he is taking the plunge !!!! Another
successful RV ride !! Welcome to the fold Scott !!
Len Leggette, RV-8A
Greensboro, NC N910LL
283 hrs
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Mike Robertson" <mrobert569(at)hotmail.com> |
If you are going to be the only one flying it except on a rare occassion,
then go with the ground adjustable pedals. To adjust them you remove the
forward baggage compartment floor. If you plan on someone else flying
frequently then go with the adjustable pedals.
The elctric trim adjust comes with a position indicator. The manual one
does not.
Mike Robertson
>From: "Greg@itmack" <greg(at)itmack.com>
>Reply-To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
>To:
>Subject: RV-List: fuse order time
>Received: contains a forged HELO
>
>
>Hi all,
>It's time for me to order the fuse kit for my 8 and I want to enlist the
>lists help in making some decisions.
>Should I get the ground adjustable rudders? How easy is it to get down
>there and adjust them when needed?
>Electric or manual aileron trim? Does either come with some type of
>indicator for trim position?
>Anything else I should think of now?
>I'm leaning towards the Altrak and Trio AP, I suppose I should at least get
>the servos now, but I'd like to hold off on the electronics as much as
>possible since there is always an upgrade coming. Do these servos work
>with all autopilots in case I change my mind as to which autopilot I want
>later?
>
>Thanks
>Greg
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Mickey Coggins <mick-matronics(at)rv8.ch> |
| Subject: | Re: Fuel senders to float or not to float |
>Interesting article, you could tell they were reaching to knock it though.
>Bottom line, there is no other replacement av-gas that is this far along.
>It has also proven to work. There is only one lead mine left producing TEL.
>This is not good.
I'll bet if leaded avgas disappeared tomorrow, the collective
ingenuity of the aviation community would solve the problem
very quickly.
There are solutions out there, but since avgas is still available,
there's no reason to introduce them, or get them certified. This
was discussed quite a while back here:
http://www.avweb.com/news/columns/182149-1.html
Mickey
--
Mickey Coggins
http://www.rv8.ch/
#82007 QB Wings/Fuselage
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Fuel senders to float or not to float |
I agree but as posted earlier this fuel is already certified. It did so
well in testing that the remaining tests were waived. There is no other
fuel this far along in the process. As far as other solutions out there, I
would sure like to know about them so I can read up.
>
>
> >Interesting article, you could tell they were reaching to knock it though.
> >Bottom line, there is no other replacement av-gas that is this far along.
> >It has also proven to work. There is only one lead mine left producing TEL.
> >This is not good.
>
>I'll bet if leaded avgas disappeared tomorrow, the collective
>ingenuity of the aviation community would solve the problem
>very quickly.
>
>There are solutions out there, but since avgas is still available,
>there's no reason to introduce them, or get them certified. This
>was discussed quite a while back here:
>
> http://www.avweb.com/news/columns/182149-1.html
>
>Mickey
>
>
>--
>Mickey Coggins
>http://www.rv8.ch/
>#82007 QB Wings/Fuselage
>
>
Scott Bilinski
Eng dept 305
Phone (858) 657-2536
Pager (858) 502-5190
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Bending Hinge Pin |
| From: | "" <tx_jayhawk(at)excite.com> |
All,
Anyone care to share the best method for accurately bending piano hinge pins?
Thanks,
Scott
7A Wings 99% done, Fuse on order
www.scottsrv7a.com
Join Excite! - http://www.excite.com
The most personalized portal on the Web!
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Vanremog(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Bending Hinge Pin |
In a message dated 11/1/2004 7:33:17 PM Pacific Standard Time,
tx_jayhawk(at)excite.com writes:
Anyone care to share the best method for accurately bending piano hinge
pins?
=====================================
Actually, I just mark the desired location for the bend, put it in my trusty
rivet cutter and use that tool either as a bending vice or a cutter.
GV (RV-6A N1GV O-360-A1A C/S, flying 725 hrs)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Vanremog(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Fuel senders to float or not to float |
In a message dated 11/1/2004 2:41:38 PM Pacific Standard Time,
rv_8pilot(at)hotmail.com writes:
I've always thought it was foolish to think we could seriously consider
ethanol a significant source of fuel. Wondering just many acres it takes to
produce a barrel of ethanol, I did a search... here's what I found.
http://science.howstuffworks.com/question707.htm
Interesting facts from the above link:
1. It takes 26.1 pounds of corn to make 1 gallon of ethanol
2. you need about 140 gallons (530 liters) of fossil fuel to plant, grow
and harvest an acre of corn
3. The final cost of the fuel-grade ethanol is about $2.49 per gallon
(corrected for $2/gal gasoline)
If you think that things will go this way, invest in Archer Daniels Midland,
supermarket to the world? Paul Harvey is one of their biggest fans.
GV (RV-6A N1GV O-360-A1A C/S, flying 725 hrs)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Jeff Bertsch <noms1reqd(at)yahoo.com> |
I am going to use tufts of yarn around the cowling inlet to help visualize the
flow fields in that area. I'll then go fly formation and get some nice videos
and photos at various speeds. I figured someone in this knowledgeable group
has done this before and could offer some tips based on their experience.
If so thanks...
Jeff Bertsch
RV-4
www.lonestarsquadron.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Mickey Coggins <mick-matronics(at)rv8.ch> |
| Subject: | Re: Bending Hinge Pin |
Hi Scott,
Do you mean like this:
http://bowenaero.com/mt3/archives/2004/06/cowl_pins.html
Mickey
>Anyone care to share the best method for accurately bending piano hinge pins?
--
Mickey Coggins
http://www.rv8.ch/
#82007 QB Wings/Fuselage
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Help with the RV-8 seat back |
| From: | "Stewart, Michael (ISS Atlanta)" <mstewart(at)iss.net> |
Ahh, replying to myself.
Thanks to Kevin Horton For the quick response and the pictures he
uploaded to his very cool website.
Thanks Kevin.
Photo's here.
http://go.phpwebhosting.com/~khorton/rv8/gallery/view_album.php?set_albu
mName=album13
Turns out the yoyo builder in question (me) was trying to put the
fiberglass on the forward side of the seatback instead of the back side.
Duh, no wonder it would not fit. What a dope:) A picture is an amazing
fog removal tool.
Mike
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Stewart,
Michael (ISS Atlanta)
Subject: RV-List: Help with the RV-8 seat back
I am looking for a good set of photos of the seat back, rear seat, for
an 8. plans and parts have confused me to the brink of migraine.
Please help. I cant figure out what need to be removed from the side
support rails at the top where they meet the fiberglass, how the
fiberglass attaches to the seatback at that undetermined angle, which
part of the seat other than the fiberglass flange touches the fuse. Etc.
Thanks for your help.
Michael Stewart
S8
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Phil Sisson, Litchfield Aerobatic Club" <sisson(at)consolidated.net> |
Jeff Dowling wrote:
>
>How about some Walmart specials for 10 bucks. Thats essentially what the
>Duckworks is anyway. You can get the redneck pickup truck rollover
>rectangular halogen 50watt lights from Wallyworld for 20 bucks for the pair.
>You have to make up the housing with spare aluminum. It will help alot if
>you can look at someone elses. You can bend some plexi on your own or just
>by it from Vans. I have them on both wings and they work fine.
>
>Jeff Dowling
>RV-6A, N915JD
>140 hours
>Chicago/Louisville
>
>----- Original Message -----
>From: "Jim & Kathy McChesney" <rvtach(at)highstream.net>
>To:
>forged HELO
>
>
>
>
>>
>>
>>List-
>>
>>I'm looking at my wings and debating between the Duckworks HID leading
>>edge landing light ($450 for one light from Van's) and the CreativAir
>>wingtip halogen landing light ($120 for a pair- one in each wingtip).
>>Any discussion of the advantages of one or the other would be helpful.
>>Also any factors favoring right wing vs left wing installation if I
>>choose a single light? I'm thinking that illuminating the driver's
>>side of the taxiway would be a good choice but I've seen several side by
>>side RVs with the light in the right wing.
>>
>>Thanks in advance for any info.
>>Jim McChesney
>>7A-QB wings and fuse
>>
>>
I saw the exact same thing at Auto-Zone for $18.
I ordered one from Duck and made the other one myself. Duckworth parts
are very nicely made. and well worth the cost, but if you have more time
than money, it is not hard to make, just takes some time... Van has the
lens for about $12. I ordered it with another order to save on some
shipping.
phil in Illinois
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Brian Denk" <akroguy(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | Help with the RV-8 seat back |
>
>I am looking for a good set of photos of the seat back, rear seat, for
>an 8. plans and parts have confused me to the brink of migraine.
>
>Please help. I cant figure out what need to be removed from the side
>support rails at the top where they meet the fiberglass, how the
>fiberglass attaches to the seatback at that undetermined angle, which
>part of the seat other than the fiberglass flange touches the fuse. Etc.
>
>
>Thanks for your help.
>
>
>Michael Stewart
>
Some very marginal pics here on my webpage:
http://geocities.com/CapeCanaveral/Hangar/9656/fuselage6.html
Fiberglass top contacts the bulkhead and the side channels basically don't!
Trim the tops of the channels to blend into the glass top piece and trim at
the bottom if/as needed to clear the floor when seat is swung forward for
baggage access. Trim top contour of the glass to clear the canopy handle
too. Trim opposite side in a symmetrical fashion for best appearance. Top
attaches to seat back side channels with a few rivets through channels,
using a piece of alu on the shop head side so rivets don't crush through the
glass. (This is how I did it, YMMV.)
I also highly recommend using DJ Lauritson's plans for a seat bottom pan.
It improves the angle of the seat cushion and provides a neato storage space
under it. Pics of my seat pan are on the webpage too.
Brian Denk
RV8 N94BD
RV10 '51
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | George Neal E Capt AU/PC <Neal.George(at)maxwell.af.mil> |
| Subject: | Bending Hinge Pin |
Scott -
Try this neat little tool from the RC world.
Harry Higley's Wire Benders.
http://www2.towerhobbies.com/cgi-bin/WTI0095P?FVSEARCH=wire+bender&FVPROFIL++
If the link fails, try towerhobbies.com, part number LXL787.
Neal
RV-7 N8ZG (tanks)
>
Anyone care to share the best method for accurately bending piano hinge
pins?
Thanks,
Scott
<
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Entering and exiting an RV-6 (or 7 or 9) |
I've been thinking about the seats for my RV-6A and have
struggled with the issue of getting in and out of the plane without
damaging the seats. It seems like the only way to get in and out
includes standing on the seat. I've thought about trying to make
the seat in two pieces, kind of a front and back part. The front
would be easily removable so you could step on metal while
getting in and then replace the front part after you're in the plane.
This doesn't seem real practical to me though. I was discussing
this with my wife last night and she mentioned "jump seats." Now
I have a Ford Ranger pickup extended cab and it has two small
seats that fold into the sides of the truck behind the main seat.
This got me thinking about the possibility of having some kind of
frame that would swing up for entry and exit and would fold down
as you sat on it. I think I would try to make it hinged somehow,
maybe like a theater seat, possibly with a spring to raise it when
not loaded. When down, the loads would be on the airplane floor
and not on the moving seat frame. I realize this will add some
weight, the challenge would be to minimize it. It also has some
issues with moving the seat back fore-and-aft, but I might just
give up that feature and keep the seat backs in one position.
So, how are you people, who have spent quite a bit of money on
your nice seats, keeping them nice? Do you move them out of the
way or just step on them? Any unique ideas out there for moving
the seats out of the way?
Thanks,
Doug Medema
RV-6A N276DM
I've been thinking about the seats for my RV-6A and have
struggled with the issue of getting in and out of the plane without
damaging the seats. It seems like the only way to get in and out
includes standing on the seat. I've thought about trying to make
the seat in two pieces, kind of a front and back part. The front
would be easily removable so you could step on metal while
getting in and then replace the front part after you're in the plane.
This doesn't seem real practical to me though. I was discussing
this with my wife last night and she mentioned "jump seats." Now
I have a Ford Ranger pickup extended cab and it has two small
seats that fold into the sides of the truck behind the main seat.
This got me thinking about the possibility of having some kind of
frame that wouldswing up for entry and exit and would fold down
as you sat on it. I think I would try to make it hinged somehow,
maybe like a theater seat, possibly with a spring to raise it when
not loaded. When down, the loads would be on the airplane floor
and not on the moving seat frame. I realize this will add some
weight, the challenge would be to minimize it. It also has some
issues with moving the seat back fore-and-aft, but I might just
give up that feature and keep the seat backs in one position.
So, how are you people, who have spent quite a bit of money on
your nice seats, keeping them nice? Do you move them out of the
way or just step on them? Any unique ideas out there for moving
the seats out of the way?
Thanks,
Doug Medema
RV-6A N276DM
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Entering and exiting an RV-6 (or 7 or 9) |
I have an 8, and the problem exist here to. I just covered the seats with a
dark fabric and tell everyone to go ahead an step on them. The plane is one
year old this month with about 200 hours. Seats look just fine. They are
the Oregon Aero seats upholstered by a local car upholstery shop with
standard cloth material glued to the seats to follow the seat contour.
>
>I've been thinking about the seats for my RV-6A and have
>struggled with the issue of getting in and out of the plane without
>damaging the seats. It seems like the only way to get in and out
>includes standing on the seat. I've thought about trying to make
>the seat in two pieces, kind of a front and back part. The front
>would be easily removable so you could step on metal while
>getting in and then replace the front part after you're in the plane.
>This doesn't seem real practical to me though. I was discussing
>this with my wife last night and she mentioned "jump seats." Now
>I have a Ford Ranger pickup extended cab and it has two small
>seats that fold into the sides of the truck behind the main seat.
>This got me thinking about the possibility of having some kind of
>frame that would swing up for entry and exit and would fold down
>as you sat on it. I think I would try to make it hinged somehow,
>maybe like a theater seat, possibly with a spring to raise it when
>not loaded. When down, the loads would be on the airplane floor
>and not on the moving seat frame. I realize this will add some
>weight, the challenge would be to minimize it. It also has some
>issues with moving the seat back fore-and-aft, but I might just
>give up that feature and keep the seat backs in one position.
>
>So, how are you people, who have spent quite a bit of money on
>your nice seats, keeping them nice? Do you move them out of the
>way or just step on them? Any unique ideas out there for moving
>the seats out of the way?
>
>Thanks,
>Doug Medema
>RV-6A N276DM
>
>
>
>
>
>I've been thinking about the seats for my RV-6A and have
>struggled with the issue of getting in and out of the plane without
>damaging the seats. It seems like the only way to get in and out
>includes standing on the seat. I've thought about trying to make
>the seat in two pieces, kind of a front and back part. The front
>would be easily removable so you could step on metal while
>getting in and then replace the front part after you're in the plane.
>This doesn't seem real practical to me though. I was discussing
>this with my wife last night and she mentioned "jump seats." Now
>I have a Ford Ranger pickup extended cab and it has two small
>seats that fold into the sides of the truck behind the main seat.
>This got me thinking about the possibility of having some kind of
>frame that wouldswing up for entry and exit and would fold down
>as you sat on it. I think I would try to make it hinged somehow,
>maybe like a theater seat, possibly with a spring to raise it when
>not loaded. When down, the loads would be on the airplane floor
>and not on the moving seat frame. I realize this will add some
>weight, the challenge would be to minimize it. It also has some
>issues with moving the seat back fore-and-aft, but I might just
>give up that feature and keep the seat backs in one position.
>
>So, how are you people, who have spent quite a bit of money on
>your nice seats, keeping them nice? Do you move them out of the
>way or just step on them? Any unique ideas out there for moving
>the seats out of the way?
>
>Thanks,
>Doug Medema
>RV-6A N276DM
>
>
>
>
Scott Bilinski
Eng dept 305
Phone (858) 657-2536
Pager (858) 502-5190
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Mickey Coggins <mick-matronics(at)rv8.ch> |
| Subject: | Off Topic - Presidential Poll |
In the spirit of election day in the USA, I've put a poll
on my website (http://www.rv8.ch/) asking who you would
like to become the next president of the United States.
If you participate, you can tell your friends that you
voted twice!
It will be interesting to see how the RV community sees
this election.
Best regards,
Mickey
--
Mickey Coggins
http://www.rv8.ch/
#82007 QB Wings/Fuselage
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Pat Hatch" <pat_hatch(at)msn.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Entering and exiting an RV-6 (or 7 or 9) |
Doug,
This may not be very elegant, but I keep a couple of beach towls on the
seats for getting in and out. After I'm in I will throw them in the baggage
area or if it's just a short flight, just leave them there.
Pat Hatch
RV-4
RV-6
RV-7
Vero Beach, FL
----- Original Message -----
From: <dmedema(at)att.net>
Subject: RV-List: Entering and exiting an RV-6 (or 7 or 9)
>
> I've been thinking about the seats for my RV-6A and have
> struggled with the issue of getting in and out of the plane without
> damaging the seats. It seems like the only way to get in and out
> includes standing on the seat. I've thought about trying to make
> the seat in two pieces, kind of a front and back part. The front
> would be easily removable so you could step on metal while
> getting in and then replace the front part after you're in the plane.
> This doesn't seem real practical to me though. I was discussing
> this with my wife last night and she mentioned "jump seats." Now
> I have a Ford Ranger pickup extended cab and it has two small
> seats that fold into the sides of the truck behind the main seat.
> This got me thinking about the possibility of having some kind of
> frame that would swing up for entry and exit and would fold down
> as you sat on it. I think I would try to make it hinged somehow,
> maybe like a theater seat, possibly with a spring to raise it when
> not loaded. When down, the loads would be on the airplane floor
> and not on the moving seat frame. I realize this will add some
> weight, the challenge would be to minimize it. It also has some
> issues with moving the seat back fore-and-aft, but I might just
> give up that feature and keep the seat backs in one position.
>
> So, how are you people, who have spent quite a bit of money on
> your nice seats, keeping them nice? Do you move them out of the
> way or just step on them? Any unique ideas out there for moving
> the seats out of the way?
>
> Thanks,
> Doug Medema
> RV-6A N276DM
>
>
>
>
>
> I've been thinking about the seats for my RV-6A and have
> struggled with the issue of getting in and out of the plane without
> damaging the seats. It seems like the only way to get in and out
> includes standing on the seat. I've thought about trying to make
> the seat in two pieces, kind of a front and back part. The front
> would be easily removable so you could step on metal while
> getting in and then replace the front part after you're in the plane.
> This doesn't seem real practical to me though. I was discussing
> this with my wife last night and she mentioned "jump seats." Now
> I have a Ford Ranger pickup extended cab and it has two small
> seats that fold into the sides of the truck behind the main seat.
> This got me thinking about the possibility of having some kind of
> frame that wouldswing up for entry and exit and would fold down
> as you sat on it. I think I would try to make it hinged somehow,
> maybe like a theater seat, possibly with a spring to raise it when
> not loaded. When down, the loads would be on the airplane floor
> and not on the moving seat frame. I realize this will add some
> weight, the challenge would be to minimize it. It also has some
> issues with moving the seat back fore-and-aft, but I might just
> give up that feature and keep the seat backs in one position.
>
> So, how are you people, who have spent quite a bit of money on
> your nice seats, keeping them nice? Do you move them out of the
> way or just step on them? Any unique ideas out there for moving
> the seats out of the way?
>
> Thanks,
> Doug Medema
> RV-6A N276DM
>
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Entering and exiting an RV-6 (or 7 or 9) |
| From: | "Stewart, Michael (ISS Atlanta)" <mstewart(at)iss.net> |
Doug after 1300 hours of stepping in and out of my 6A and usually with a
passenger, on expensive leather seats, there is only one solution IMHO,
just step on them.
Many folks have tried to climb in and out w/o stepping on them and it
urks me cause I tell them to stand right on the seat, but still they try
not to and it is dangerous to try and get in w/o stepping on the seat. I
have seen many an awkward scenario in my plane from trying not to step
on the seat. You can get hurt, and on the slider, it puts the fiberglass
strip across the top at tremendous risk.
Bottom line, just step on em, and don't worry about it. You can not tell
that literally hundreds of people have stepped on them.
Good luck.
Mike Stewart
6A Flying
S8 Fuse
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of dmedema(at)att.net
Subject: RV-List: Entering and exiting an RV-6 (or 7 or 9)
I've been thinking about the seats for my RV-6A and have
struggled with the issue of getting in and out of the plane without
damaging the seats. It seems like the only way to get in and out
includes standing on the seat. I've thought about trying to make
the seat in two pieces, kind of a front and back part. The front
would be easily removable so you could step on metal while
getting in and then replace the front part after you're in the plane.
This doesn't seem real practical to me though. I was discussing
this with my wife last night and she mentioned "jump seats." Now
I have a Ford Ranger pickup extended cab and it has two small
seats that fold into the sides of the truck behind the main seat.
This got me thinking about the possibility of having some kind of
frame that would swing up for entry and exit and would fold down
as you sat on it. I think I would try to make it hinged somehow,
maybe like a theater seat, possibly with a spring to raise it when
not loaded. When down, the loads would be on the airplane floor
and not on the moving seat frame. I realize this will add some
weight, the challenge would be to minimize it. It also has some
issues with moving the seat back fore-and-aft, but I might just
give up that feature and keep the seat backs in one position.
So, how are you people, who have spent quite a bit of money on
your nice seats, keeping them nice? Do you move them out of the
way or just step on them? Any unique ideas out there for moving
the seats out of the way?
Thanks,
Doug Medema
RV-6A N276DM
I've been thinking about the seats for my RV-6A and have
struggled with the issue of getting in and out of the plane without
damaging the seats. It seems like the only way to get in and out
includes standing on the seat. I've thought about trying to make
the seat in two pieces, kind of a front and back part. The front
would be easily removable so you could step on metal while
getting in and then replace the front part after you're in the plane.
This doesn't seem real practical to me though. I was discussing
this with my wife last night and she mentioned "jump seats." Now
I have a Ford Ranger pickup extended cab and it has two small
seats that fold into the sides of the truck behind the main seat.
This got me thinking about the possibility of having some kind of
frame that wouldswing up for entry and exit and would fold down
as you sat on it. I think I would try to make it hinged somehow,
maybe like a theater seat, possibly with a spring to raise it when
not loaded. When down, the loads would be on the airplane floor
and not on the moving seat frame. I realize this will add some
weight, the challenge would be to minimize it. It also has some
issues with moving the seat back fore-and-aft, but I might just
give up that feature and keep the seat backs in one position.
So, how are you people, who have spent quite a bit of money on
your nice seats, keeping them nice? Do you move them out of the
way or just step on them? Any unique ideas out there for moving
the seats out of the way?
Thanks,
Doug Medema
RV-6A N276DM
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Rob Prior" <rv7(at)b4.ca> |
| Subject: | Re: Entering and exiting an RV-6 (or 7 or 9) |
On 15:59 31/12/1969 dmedema(at)att.net wrote:
> I've been thinking about the seats for my RV-6A and have
> struggled with the issue of getting in and out of the plane without
> damaging the seats.
Here's two suggestions i've seen in use on other homebuilts, RV's included.
1. Sew or velcro a flap of fabric to the front of your seat, that is about
1.5x the depth of the seat, and just as wide. Make it from Canvas, or some
other durable material. To get in, flip the flap over the seat, stand on
it, and swing your body into place. Before dropping the last few inches to
the seat, pull the flap forward and hang it down to the floor in front of
the seat. That way you can always sit on a clean seat, and have a
protective flap for entry/exit.
2. If you aren't installing the armrest, you can have a nice gap between
your front seats. It's well supported, and about exactly the right size
for a foot to stand on the seat pan *next* to the cushion while you get
your weight over the sill. One foot goes in the seat pan between the
seats, the other goes on the floor in front of the spar. Then grab the
canopy bow, move your seat-pan foot to the floor, and lower yourself down.
Both methods, once you've been shown how to use them, work very well.
-Rob Prior
rv7 "at" b4.ca
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | BELTEDAIR(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Entering and exiting an RV-6 (or 7 or 9) |
Many years ago the Erocoupe had a bottom seat cushion with a flap attached to
the front lower edge, when getting in or out the flap covered the seat then
folded down out of the way. It worked then and it works now.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jaye Murray and Scott Jackson" <jayeandscott(at)telus.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Entering and exiting an RV-6 (or 7 or 9) |
My 6 has electric flaps, which leaves the space between the seats clear.
It's easy to put a foot right on the metal between the seat cushions, sit on
the crossmember, then pull your other leg in and put that foot on the floor,
then lower yourself down while putting the first foot forward onto the
floor.
Scott in Vancouver
----- Original Message -----
From: <dmedema(at)att.net>
Subject: RV-List: Entering and exiting an RV-6 (or 7 or 9)
>
> I've been thinking about the seats for my RV-6A and have
> struggled with the issue of getting in and out of the plane without
> damaging the seats. It seems like the only way to get in and out
> includes standing on the seat. I've thought about trying to make
> the seat in two pieces, kind of a front and back part. The front
> would be easily removable so you could step on metal while
> getting in and then replace the front part after you're in the plane.
> This doesn't seem real practical to me though. I was discussing
> this with my wife last night and she mentioned "jump seats." Now
> I have a Ford Ranger pickup extended cab and it has two small
> seats that fold into the sides of the truck behind the main seat.
> This got me thinking about the possibility of having some kind of
> frame that would swing up for entry and exit and would fold down
> as you sat on it. I think I would try to make it hinged somehow,
> maybe like a theater seat, possibly with a spring to raise it when
> not loaded. When down, the loads would be on the airplane floor
> and not on the moving seat frame. I realize this will add some
> weight, the challenge would be to minimize it. It also has some
> issues with moving the seat back fore-and-aft, but I might just
> give up that feature and keep the seat backs in one position.
>
> So, how are you people, who have spent quite a bit of money on
> your nice seats, keeping them nice? Do you move them out of the
> way or just step on them? Any unique ideas out there for moving
> the seats out of the way?
>
> Thanks,
> Doug Medema
> RV-6A N276DM
>
>
>
>
>
> I've been thinking about the seats for my RV-6A and have
> struggled with the issue of getting in and out of the plane without
> damaging the seats. It seems like the only way to get in and out
> includes standing on the seat. I've thought about trying to make
> the seat in two pieces, kind of a front and back part. The front
> would be easily removable so you could step on metal while
> getting in and then replace the front part after you're in the plane.
> This doesn't seem real practical to me though. I was discussing
> this with my wife last night and she mentioned "jump seats." Now
> I have a Ford Ranger pickup extended cab and it has two small
> seats that fold into the sides of the truck behind the main seat.
> This got me thinking about the possibility of having some kind of
> frame that wouldswing up for entry and exit and would fold down
> as you sat on it. I think I would try to make it hinged somehow,
> maybe like a theater seat, possibly with a spring to raise it when
> not loaded. When down, the loads would be on the airplane floor
> and not on the moving seat frame. I realize this will add some
> weight, the challenge would be to minimize it. It also has some
> issues with moving the seat back fore-and-aft, but I might just
> give up that feature and keep the seat backs in one position.
>
> So, how are you people, who have spent quite a bit of money on
> your nice seats, keeping them nice? Do you move them out of the
> way or just step on them? Any unique ideas out there for moving
> the seats out of the way?
>
> Thanks,
> Doug Medema
> RV-6A N276DM
>
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws;
s=beta; d=gmail.com;
b=VuKY4eoxmn0/YGyTHk82E50aCPdjUjaGAXSYnSychoRNy9XBNFcK2F4fUedHPKzwC22ZQvOlrkIJkwt3oGjk5R+0TdpCdYryIIOXhOz4o0Y2zBJStbhysOzBiuXF9eFiS5WIQEUuh+tcXutPwPqHUItSwgU8akWKo2fBxDYff/cReceived:
by 10.54.33.47 with SMTP id g47mr97026wrg;
| From: | Bob J <rocketbob(at)gmail.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Entering and exiting an RV-6 (or 7 or 9) |
Ditto. 600 hours stepping on the DJ vinyl seats and mine still look
new. I clean the seats maybe twice a year with upholstery cleaner,
only takes a few minutes. Once in a while I'll have an asphalt/tar
stain that just takes a little solvent to clean up, no big deal.
Regards,
Bob Japundza
RV-6 flying F1 under const.
> Doug after 1300 hours of stepping in and out of my 6A and usually with a
> passenger, on expensive leather seats, there is only one solution IMHO,
> just step on them.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Dean" <dvanwinkle(at)royell.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Fuel senders to float or not to float |
RV Listers
As a farmer in an early life, and a retired Aeronautical Engineer now who
helps a nephew in corn and soybean planting and harvest, I would like to
point out a gross error in the "science.howstuffworks" extract. The
quantity of fossil fuel required to plant, grow, and harvest an acre of corn
is exaggerated by at least a factor of ten. The real world number is 10 to
12 gallons per acre total. Sort of makes a person wonder about the validity
of the rest of the data.
Dean Van Winkle
RV-9A Fuselage/Finish
----- Original Message -----
From: <Vanremog(at)aol.com>
Subject: Re: RV-List: Fuel senders to float or not to float
>
>
> In a message dated 11/1/2004 2:41:38 PM Pacific Standard Time,
> rv_8pilot(at)hotmail.com writes:
>
> I've always thought it was foolish to think we could seriously consider
> ethanol a significant source of fuel. Wondering just many acres it takes
to
>
> produce a barrel of ethanol, I did a search... here's what I found.
>
> http://science.howstuffworks.com/question707.htm
>
> Interesting facts from the above link:
>
> 1. It takes 26.1 pounds of corn to make 1 gallon of ethanol
>
> 2. you need about 140 gallons (530 liters) of fossil fuel to plant, grow
> and harvest an acre of corn
>
> 3. The final cost of the fuel-grade ethanol is about $2.49 per gallon
> (corrected for $2/gal gasoline)
>
>
> If you think that things will go this way, invest in Archer Daniels
Midland,
> supermarket to the world? Paul Harvey is one of their biggest fans.
>
> GV (RV-6A N1GV O-360-A1A C/S, flying 725 hrs)
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jack Ford" <jackoford(at)theofficenet.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Off Topic - Presidential Poll |
What happened to Michael Badnarik, the Libertarion candidate? He was
outpolling the dangit out of Nader the dictator.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Mickey Coggins" <mick-matronics(at)rv8.ch>
Subject: RV-List: Off Topic - Presidential Poll
>
> In the spirit of election day in the USA, I've put a poll
> on my website (http://www.rv8.ch/) asking who you would
> like to become the next president of the United States.
>
> If you participate, you can tell your friends that you
> voted twice!
>
> It will be interesting to see how the RV community sees
> this election.
>
> Best regards,
> Mickey
>
> --
> Mickey Coggins
> http://www.rv8.ch/
> #82007 QB Wings/Fuselage
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Charlie England <ceengland(at)bellsouth.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Fuel senders to float or not to float |
After the 1st batch, you no longer need the fossil fuel at all.
And no Marines will be endangered to produce ethanol; surely that's
worth something...
Charlie
Dean wrote:
>
>RV Listers
>
>As a farmer in an early life, and a retired Aeronautical Engineer now who
>helps a nephew in corn and soybean planting and harvest, I would like to
>point out a gross error in the "science.howstuffworks" extract. The
>quantity of fossil fuel required to plant, grow, and harvest an acre of corn
>is exaggerated by at least a factor of ten. The real world number is 10 to
>12 gallons per acre total. Sort of makes a person wonder about the validity
>of the rest of the data.
>
>Dean Van Winkle
>RV-9A Fuselage/Finish
>
>----- Original Message -----
>From: <Vanremog(at)aol.com>
>To:
>Subject: Re: RV-List: Fuel senders to float or not to float
>
>
>
>
>>
>>
>>In a message dated 11/1/2004 2:41:38 PM Pacific Standard Time,
>>rv_8pilot(at)hotmail.com writes:
>>
>>I've always thought it was foolish to think we could seriously consider
>>ethanol a significant source of fuel. Wondering just many acres it takes
>>
>>
>to
>
>
>>produce a barrel of ethanol, I did a search... here's what I found.
>>
>>http://science.howstuffworks.com/question707.htm
>>
>>Interesting facts from the above link:
>>
>>1. It takes 26.1 pounds of corn to make 1 gallon of ethanol
>>
>>2. you need about 140 gallons (530 liters) of fossil fuel to plant, grow
>>and harvest an acre of corn
>>
>>3. The final cost of the fuel-grade ethanol is about $2.49 per gallon
>>(corrected for $2/gal gasoline)
>>
>>
>>If you think that things will go this way, invest in Archer Daniels
>>
>>
>Midland,
>
>
>>supermarket to the world? Paul Harvey is one of their biggest fans.
>>
>>GV (RV-6A N1GV O-360-A1A C/S, flying 725 hrs)
>>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Marty" <martorious(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | Fuel senders to float or not to float |
How much ethanol can one acre be expected to produce?
Marty
Dean wrote:
>
>RV Listers
>
>As a farmer in an early life, and a retired Aeronautical Engineer now who
>helps a nephew in corn and soybean planting and harvest, I would like to
>point out a gross error in the "science.howstuffworks" extract. The
>quantity of fossil fuel required to plant, grow, and harvest an acre of
corn
>is exaggerated by at least a factor of ten. The real world number is 10 to
>12 gallons per acre total. Sort of makes a person wonder about the validity
>of the rest of the data.
>
>Dean Van Winkle
>RV-9A Fuselage/Finish
>
>----- Original Message -----
>From: <Vanremog(at)aol.com>
>To:
>Subject: Re: RV-List: Fuel senders to float or not to float
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Randy Garrett" <rgarrett(at)objectsciences.com> |
| Subject: | Radio Amplifier? |
Would a radio amplifier that could handle AM/SSB/FM (by design) also amplify
AM? Aviation radio is VHF AM. Could a ham radio amp be used to boost my
signal? I realize that VHF is line-of-sight, so power is not normally a
limiting factor. However, I often operate in areas with lots of
interference. I can hear ATC, but they sometimes can't hear me, so I'm
thinking a little more power might be a big help. Would there be any FCC
issues with doing this? I am a licensed ham, and the power out would be
considerably below what airline radios transmit.
Thanks,
Randy
RV-6A
430 hours
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bill Dube <bdube(at)al.noaa.gov> |
I'm writing from work.
I'm the guy that makes the LED position light kits (Bill VonDane sells
one
style of my LED position lights on his http://www.CreativAir.com website.)
A couple of folks on the list wanted to know more about the LED position
lights, and Bill VonDane's landing lights.
>>>> LED Position lights <<<<
So far, I have zero complaints about the LED position lights. I have sold
a bunch of them to a lot of different people, so the total lack of
complaints is a pretty good recommendation. Also, only a couple of folks
have had any questions/problems assembling the kits. This tells me that the
instructions are pretty good. When I get customer feedback, it is generally
something like, "Wow, these things are bright!"
>>>> CreativAir Landing lights <<<
I have installed Bill VonDane's landing lights on my wings and they put
out a bunch of light. Since I haven't built the fuselage yet, I can't give
any flight reports on the landing lights. :
)
Bill VonDane also makes a strobe kit. I haven't seen it myself, but I have
heard nothing negative about it. Seems to work just fine, so I am told.
Bill Dube'
http://www.killacycle.com/Lights.htm
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Kevin Shannon" <kshannon(at)seanet.com> |
| Subject: | leaving a floater |
Looks like my question about using float type senders with the high tech
EFIS systems is answered as follows:
Works with Blue Mountain EFIS, plugs right in
Works with Grand Rapids System
Works with Vision Microsystems see below
I think I will just go with the old tried and true floaters then.
Nothing to calibrate or adapt. They will work just fine someday when we
are all flying around on corn squeezins too. Has anyone ever had a float
type sender fail in an RV?
Kevin Shannon
-----Original Message-----
From: Technical Support [mailto:support(at)visionmicrosystems.com]
Subject: RE: Fuel senders
Hello Kevin,
What system are you looking at? The VM1000C will work with floats.
Best Regards
David McCluskey
Technical Support
4151 Mitchell Way
Bellingham, WA 98226
(360) 714-8203
Fax (360) 714-8253
-----Original Message-----
From: Kevin Shannon [mailto:kshannon(at)seanet.com]
Subject: Fuel senders
Hi, will resistance float type senders work for fuel level? I already
have these in my tanks in an RV8
Thanks
Kevin Shannon
Superintendent
Severson Construction, LLC
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | RobHickman(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: leaving a floater |
Kevin,
The ACS2002 engine monitor will work with Floats or Capacitance probes. I
had a float sendor fail in my RV-4 at 200 hours. I also know of a few others
around Portland, OR. that have had the floats fail. Mine and the others that
I have seen were the old style with the metal housings so hopefully the new
plastic ones are better.
Rob Hickman
N401 RV-4
N402 RV-10 (Under Construction)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Marty" <martorious(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | Fuel senders to float or not to float |
Ok this is what I've discovered in about 20 minutes by googling.
Lets start with the tractor.
On average, new John Deere tractors that are of the same type used in
Agriculture around here (Central Indiana, we grow A LOT of corn here!) use
roughly 15 gal/hr. And I would estimate they travel at approx 5 mph while
they work the fields. So we're talking around 3 gal per mile.
Most implements used around here are close to 30 feet wide, so that makes
158,400 square feet of field tilled per linear mile traveled. An acre is
approx 209 feet on a side, or 43,560 square feet to be more precise (at
least this is the figure I found on the web.) So 158,400 divided by 43,560
yields 3.636363 acres per linear mile, for roughly .825 gallons of fuel per
acre for a single pass.
Now unless I'm WAY off in my estimates (anyone more knowledgeable feel free
to chime in) or my math skills suddenly took a vacation, I don't think we're
looking at much more than 12-13 gallons of fossil fuel per acre, including
allowances for grain trucks to haul the harvest to the grain towers and for
herbicide and insecticide spraying (if you've never seen one of those
sprayers, they look like a very large ATV with spray booms that are at least
20 feet to each side and travel through a field at close to 30 miles per
hour! Quite a site to see one racing through a recently sown corn field.
My kids get a kick out of the 'overgrown 4-wheelers'!)
Marty
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of rv6tc
Subject: Re: RV-List: Fuel senders to float or not to float
How do you figure? You still have to harvest, and turn the soil, then
re-seed. Not to mention spray for insects. Unless you are planning on
harvesting with mules......
Curious.
Keith
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Wheeler North <wnorth(at)sdccd.cc.ca.us> |
Subject: RV-List: Matronics 2004 Email List Fund Raiser [PLEASE READ]
Tuesday's Schedule
wake up
pee
vote - thank you Veterans
donate to email lists - thank you Matt
take nap
fart - or go to work, whichever seems like more fun
finish oil change and post-maintenance test fly RV
eat
fall asleep - dream about flying RV - not as much fun, but costs less
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Gabe A Ferrer" <ferrergm(at)bellsouth.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Entering and exiting an RV-6 (or 7 or 9) |
Passengers in my RV6 step on my leather cushions when getting in or out. No problem.
Just make sure that they are not wearing high heels.
I don't need to step on the cushions getting in or out.
I place my butt on the top of the back rest, swing my legs in and let my calves
rest on the forward edge of the buttom cushion. I then slide down with my right
hand initially holding on to the back rest and my left hand holding on to the
longeron.
To get out I reverse the procedure.
Gabe A Ferrer
RV6 N2GX 137 hours
South Florida
ferrergm(at)bellsouth.net
cell: 561 758 8894
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Chris W <1qazxsw23edcvfr45tgbnhy67ujm(at)cox.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Alternative Fuels (was Fuel Senders...) |
Scott Bilinski wrote:
>Yes it has lower BTU's but also puts out about 10% more power at
>the same power settings.
>
>
I'm confused. How can it have less BTU's and still put out more power?
BTU is an energy unit and Power is Energy over time. So if ethanol has
fewer BTU's per gallon, how could you possibly get 10% more power at the
same GPH flow?
This is probably a bad estimate, and probably changes a lot with scale.
In the model airplane world if you have a big bird you want to convert
from a nitro-methane engine to a gas engine, the general rule of thumb
is you only need half as much fuel by volume.
Now diesel seems the way to go, more BTU's per lbs and more lbs per
gallon... it's like getting long range tanks for free. Of course there
is the whole needing a new engine part. I just hope by the time I get
building Deltahawk or some other manufacture will have a 180+ hp diesel
with all the bugs worked out.
Chris W
Not getting the gifts you want? The Wish Zone can help.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jeff Dowling" <shempdowling(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Entering and exiting an RV-6 (or 7 or 9) |
Its easy if you install a couple of handles on the rollover bar. I got some
computer main frame aluminum pull handles from someone on the list. Easy to
install and I will never have one without them.
Jeff Dowling
RV-6A, N915JD
140 hours
Chicago/Louisville
----- Original Message -----
From: <dmedema(at)att.net>
Subject: RV-List: Entering and exiting an RV-6 (or 7 or 9)
>
> I've been thinking about the seats for my RV-6A and have
> struggled with the issue of getting in and out of the plane without
> damaging the seats. It seems like the only way to get in and out
> includes standing on the seat. I've thought about trying to make
> the seat in two pieces, kind of a front and back part. The front
> would be easily removable so you could step on metal while
> getting in and then replace the front part after you're in the plane.
> This doesn't seem real practical to me though. I was discussing
> this with my wife last night and she mentioned "jump seats." Now
> I have a Ford Ranger pickup extended cab and it has two small
> seats that fold into the sides of the truck behind the main seat.
> This got me thinking about the possibility of having some kind of
> frame that would swing up for entry and exit and would fold down
> as you sat on it. I think I would try to make it hinged somehow,
> maybe like a theater seat, possibly with a spring to raise it when
> not loaded. When down, the loads would be on the airplane floor
> and not on the moving seat frame. I realize this will add some
> weight, the challenge would be to minimize it. It also has some
> issues with moving the seat back fore-and-aft, but I might just
> give up that feature and keep the seat backs in one position.
>
> So, how are you people, who have spent quite a bit of money on
> your nice seats, keeping them nice? Do you move them out of the
> way or just step on them? Any unique ideas out there for moving
> the seats out of the way?
>
> Thanks,
> Doug Medema
> RV-6A N276DM
>
>
>
>
>
> I've been thinking about the seats for my RV-6A and have
> struggled with the issue of getting in and out of the plane without
> damaging the seats. It seems like the only way to get in and out
> includes standing on the seat. I've thought about trying to make
> the seat in two pieces, kind of a front and back part. The front
> would be easily removable so you could step on metal while
> getting in and then replace the front part after you're in the plane.
> This doesn't seem real practical to me though. I was discussing
> this with my wife last night and she mentioned "jump seats." Now
> I have a Ford Ranger pickup extended cab and it has two small
> seats that fold into the sides of the truck behind the main seat.
> This got me thinking about the possibility of having some kind of
> frame that wouldswing up for entry and exit and would fold down
> as you sat on it. I think I would try to make it hinged somehow,
> maybe like a theater seat, possibly with a spring to raise it when
> not loaded. When down, the loads would be on the airplane floor
> and not on the moving seat frame. I realize this will add some
> weight, the challenge would be to minimize it. It also has some
> issues with moving the seat back fore-and-aft, but I might just
> give up that feature and keep the seat backs in one position.
>
> So, how are you people, who have spent quite a bit of money on
> your nice seats, keeping them nice? Do you move them out of the
> way or just step on them? Any unique ideas out there for moving
> the seats out of the way?
>
> Thanks,
> Doug Medema
> RV-6A N276DM
>
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Konrad Werner" <klwerner(at)comcast.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Alternative Fuels |
Dear Chris,
>>...more BTU's per lbs and more lbs per gallon... it's like getting long range
tanks for free...<<
This does sound like a double dipping winner, when in reality it is more like a
even out kind of compensator, no?
More LBS / GAL more weight to carry per gallon of fuel.
More BTU / LBS more energy per gallon to carry said weight.
Bottom line: More energy content to carry the higher weight penalty maybe even?
But maybe I am confused and see this all wrong? Am I wrong?
Konrad
>> Now diesel seems the way to go, more BTU's per lbs and more lbs per
gallon... it's like getting long range tanks for free. Of course there
is the whole needing a new engine part. I just hope by the time I get
building Deltahawk or some other manufacture will have a 180+ hp diesel
with all the bugs worked out.
Chris W. <<
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Chris W <1qazxsw23edcvfr45tgbnhy67ujm(at)cox.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Alternative Fuels |
Konrad Werner wrote:
>This does sound like a double dipping winner, when in reality it is more like
a even out kind of compensator, no?
>More LBS / GAL more weight to carry per gallon of fuel.
>More BTU / LBS more energy per gallon to carry said weight.
>Bottom line: More energy content to carry the higher weight penalty maybe even?
>
>But maybe I am confused and see this all wrong? Am I wrong?
>
>
Unless I understand it wrong, and I don't think I do, you are reading it
wrong. Think of it this way. . .
10 lbs of diesel will take you farther than 10 lbs of LL100. Here we
have a win.
you can fit more lbs of diesel in the same size tank than you can
LL100. Win some more.
So it is a win win situation In the first case we get more range per
pound of flying weight. In the second we effectively get a larger
tank. With the numbers Deltahawk has published, an RV7 could have a
range of nearly 1,000 statute miles.
Chris W
Not getting the gifts you want? The Wish Zone can help.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "cgalley" <cgalley(at)qcbc.org> |
| Subject: | Re: Alternative Fuels (was Fuel Senders...) |
As I remember it, you have to burn more (higher fuel flow) to get the higher
power output with alcohol.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Chris W" <1qazxsw23edcvfr45tgbnhy67ujm(at)cox.net>
Subject: Re: RV-List: Alternative Fuels (was Fuel Senders...)
<1qazxsw23edcvfr45tgbnhy67ujm(at)cox.net>
>
> Scott Bilinski wrote:
>
> >Yes it has lower BTU's but also puts out about 10% more power at
> >the same power settings.
> >
> >
> I'm confused. How can it have less BTU's and still put out more power?
> BTU is an energy unit and Power is Energy over time. So if ethanol has
> fewer BTU's per gallon, how could you possibly get 10% more power at the
> same GPH flow?
>
> This is probably a bad estimate, and probably changes a lot with scale.
> In the model airplane world if you have a big bird you want to convert
> from a nitro-methane engine to a gas engine, the general rule of thumb
> is you only need half as much fuel by volume.
>
> Now diesel seems the way to go, more BTU's per lbs and more lbs per
> gallon... it's like getting long range tanks for free. Of course there
> is the whole needing a new engine part. I just hope by the time I get
> building Deltahawk or some other manufacture will have a 180+ hp diesel
> with all the bugs worked out.
>
> Chris W
> Not getting the gifts you want? The Wish Zone can help.
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | some more ethanol data |
In a message dated 11/3/2004 2:02:49 AM Central Standard Time,
rv-list-digest(at)matronics.com writes:
Scott Bilinski wrote:
>Yes it has lower BTU's but also puts out about 10% more power at
>the same power settings.
>
>
I'm confused. How can it have less BTU's and still put out more power?
BTU is an energy unit and Power is Energy over time. So if ethanol has
fewer BTU's per gallon, how could you possibly get 10% more power at the
same GPH flow?
Fellas!!
Read the statement again: Scott said power setting -- not fuel flow! As
ethanol is more viscous (sort of like oil vs gasoline), it requires a larger jet
to
get the same flow. It also has less BTU per lb, so flow has to be higher yet.
So, flow (GPH) is higher at the same power setting -- up to 15%, unless the
engine is modified to use the higher octane rating.
Since ethanol is so resistant to knock, you can run higher compression ratios
(12:1 or so) to regain most of the lost efficiency. I'm also told timing
should be pulled back to 15deg BTDC or so, as the stuff burns so fast. This keeps
peak cyl pressure at the correct rod/crank angle....
I have run up to a 40% blend of ethanol/100LL in my ship without re-jetting,
but it was warm outside, so the flow didn't have to go up that much; the std
jets and full rich mixture worked up to about that blend ratio. And, did that
thing run or what! I could se much higher IAS easily, but the flow rate was
also higher -- there ain't no free lunch.
I did notice that speed didn't change when changing from one tank (blended)
to the other (straight 100LL) inflight, if flow was kept the same. But remember
that I was only running up to a 40% blend -- not 85% as would be the case
with AGE85. CHT readings dropped dramatically at all power settings.
This stuff works, or at least it did in my application methods, and didn't
cause any problems for me in using 150 gal in various blending ratios. Unless
you mind the smell -- it's like you have a big open bottle of whisky in the
hangar somehwere..
As for infrastructure problems, 100LL is delivered by truck anyway -- doesn't
go thru pipelines due to the lead content -- there wouldn't be any changes
there, except that ethanol CAN go thru the pipelines. But, we would all have to
rejet...
And it may be that if you let your infernal combustion machine set for an
extended period, you may find the carb has some deposits in it -- the ethanol
also has some vegetable oil mixed in, which remains when the ethanol evaporates.
Ethanol is not a panacea, I'd suggest. But, if we're going to have one fuel
for both the 6.3:1 A65 continentals and the turbo'ed GTSIO520s, it's not gonna
be 92UL. Could be a blend of 92UL & ethanol, if the usual auto gas additives
are controlled -- a couple of 'em make ethanol gel, which can clog fuel filters
& jets etc. This would not be good!
Carry on!
Mark
Team Rocket LP
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | RV rear seat back |
| From: | "Frazier, Vincent A" <VFrazier(at)usi.edu> |
Subject: RV-List: Help with the RV-8 seat back
From: "Stewart, Michael (ISS Atlanta)" <mstewart(at)iss.net>
I am looking for a good set of photos of the seat back, rear seat, for
an 8. plans and parts have confused me to the brink of migraine.
Please help. I cant figure out what need to be removed from the side
support rails at the top where they meet the fiberglass, how the
fiberglass attaches to the seatback at that undetermined angle, which
part of the seat other than the fiberglass flange touches the fuse. Etc.
Thanks for your help. Michael Stewart ******************
Michael,
I can't say what you should do, but I can say what I did on the RV-4 and
the HRII seats I built.... I threw the fiberglas in the trash and made
the entire seatback from aluminum. It wasn't that hard and I was quite
pleased with it. YMMV. Should work just fine for the RV-8 also.
http://www.usi.edu/science/chemistry/vfrazier/2003-04-07/rear%20seat%20b
ack.jpg all metal rear seat
http://www.usi.edu/science/chemistry/vfrazier/2003-04-07/rear%20seat%20b
ack%20aft%20side.jpg all metal rear seat
http://www.usi.edu/science/chemistry/vfrazier/fuselage_construction.htm
scroll about halfway down to see the butt pan for the rear seat.... VERY
COMFORTABLE and well worth the effort.
Lots of other applicable pics on this page too.
Vince Frazier
F-1H Rocket, N540VF
http://www.usi.edu/science/chemistry/vfrazier/page1.html
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "JT Helms" <jhelms(at)nationair.com> |
| Subject: | Changes in NationAir's VanGuard Program |
VanGuard Insurance Program
This past Oshkosh marked the fifth anniversary of NationAir's VanGuard Insurance
Program. There are now over 1200 aircraft insured in the program, which makes
this program one of the largest and most successful single aircraft insurance
programs in our industry. NationAir is proud to receive the exclusive endorsement
of Van's Aircraft, who fully supports the VanGuard Program.
NationAir created the VanGuard Program with Van's help to aid their customers.
We are dedicated to continuing to provide the same level of service we always
have to our clients and the very best rates available in the marketplace for RV
owners.
We wanted to let all RV owners know about an upcoming change in how the program
is administered. Up to this point, with the exception of some liability only
policies, a single insurer, Phoenix Aviation Managers, has issued all of the insurance
policies written through the program. Due to changes in the marketplace,
NationAir has decided that it is in the best interests of our VanGaurd clients
to open up this program to all aviation insurers. Unlike some brokers, NationAir
has access to all the insurance companies. This change will give our clients
the broadest possible insurance options and the very best coverages and
rates. These other insurers are excited at the prospect of becoming part of the
VanGuard Program as insurance providers.
As a result of these changes, those of you already insured in the program by Phoenix
will eventually receive a notice from them indicating their intent not to
renew your policy. Prior to your renewal, NationAir will be contacting all insurers
to obtain your program renewal terms as we have in the past. This is no
different than what we have done in the past. Even though we've been the only
brokers with access to Phoenix's rates for RV owners, we have regularly gone
to all the other markets to make sure we had the very best quotes available for
our customers.
NationAir is continually trying to advance the cause for RV owners with the insurance
companies. To advance the position for the VanGuard Program, we are currently
coordinating the first visit to Van's by American International Group (AIG.)
AIG is an insurance company, which currently writes coverage for a large
number of RVs. The better the insurance companies understand and feel about the
product they're insuring, the more enthusiastic the underwriters will be about
supporting owners of those aircraft. We are constantly expanding the acceptable
types of engines RV owners are most enthusiastic about today with AIG, Global
(EAA insurance program) and other companies. As an example, we recently
got AIG's approval for the ECI engine.
If you have any questions at all, or need our assistance, please call Aaron Wedge,
who now manages the program full time, or myself at 877 475 5860.
Sincerely,
John Helms
Branch Manager
NationAir Insurance Agencies, Inc.
Light Aircraft Office
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | RE: RV-List Digest: 43 Msgs - 11/02/04 |
| From: | "Frazier, Vincent A" <VFrazier(at)usi.edu> |
>>I'm looking at my wings and debating between the Duckworks HID leading
>>edge landing light ($450 for one light from Van's) and the CreativAir
>>wingtip halogen landing light ($120 for a pair- one in each wingtip).
>>Any discussion of the advantages of one or the other would be helpful.
>>Also any factors favoring right wing vs left wing installation if I
>>choose a single light? I'm thinking that illuminating the driver's
>>side of the taxiway would be a good choice but I've seen several side
by
>>side RVs with the light in the right wing.
>>
>>Thanks in advance for any info.
>>Jim McChesney
>>7A-QB wings and fuse
Jim,
This has been discussed before but here goes again... Bill VonDane,
IIRC, makes a nice kit if you can use the wingtip lights.
I did the same thing... I think Bill and I stole the idea from Terry
Jantzi... for about $10.
Yes, $10, and it works very nicely.
http://www.usi.edu/science/chemistry/vfrazier/Construction%20Notes%20for
%20the%20tail%20and%20wings.htm Pictures and text here!
IF YOU REALLY WANT TO TRICK OUT YOUR INSTALLATION.. get one of the solid
state wig-wag units and use it to flash your landing lights during the
day. MAN! It really makes your airplane stand out!
Vince
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | SportAV8R(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: leaving a floater |
Has anyone ever had a float
type sender fail in an RV?
YES! My float developed a pinhole leak and sank ... :-(
New float cleared it right up. The new design is a closed cell foam body with
brass end cap. The old style was hollow brass halves soldered together.
-Bill Boyd
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Changes in NationAir's VanGuard Program |
John:
What is the real reason for the split with Pheonix? Loss ratios?,
commissions? Brokers generally do not sever relationships with insurers on group
programs
unless the insurer wants out or there is a sudden and substantial increase in
rates/premiums or a decrease in broker fees or commission..
What is it John?
Scott Morrow
RV-6A N548SM
Retired aviation insurance broker with over 25 years with AON, Marsh, and as
a consultant
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "923te" <923te(at)cox.net> |
| Subject: | Re: MA-4-5 Carburator needed.. New, Rebuilt or Core |
Anyone have available a carburator MA-4-5? Lycoming Part number LW-18788
Thanks,
Ned
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "JT Helms" <jhelms(at)nationair.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Changes in NationAir's VanGuard Program |
Phoenix is a fantastic company. I and everyone at NationAir thinks the
world of them. NationAir has not severed any ties with Phoenix. They had
some leadership changes recently. They are not the most automated insurance
company in the world. There are 1200+ policies in the program almost all of
which are with Phoenix. (a few with AIG, and very few with the EAA
Program.)
Phoenix's loss ratio's were high enough that they have not made any money
over the life of the program. With 1200 policies to service, it was a bit
much for them without it being a money maker for them. They elected to
raise their rates, and subsequently it was decided that they wanted to
non-renew those customers. This was Phoenix's first and only foray into the
homebuilt market. I think they took a great first stab at writing risks in
that market. If they're able to automate more, perhaps they'll be back.
There are other companies out there like AIG and Global Aerospace (the EAA
Insurance Program's insurer) that are more automated and able to easily
handle that many accounts with no problem.
JT
----- Original Message -----
From: <Smcm75(at)aol.com>
Subject: Re: RV-List: Changes in NationAir's VanGuard Program
>
> John:
>
> What is the real reason for the split with Pheonix? Loss ratios?,
> commissions? Brokers generally do not sever relationships with insurers on
group programs
> unless the insurer wants out or there is a sudden and substantial increase
in
> rates/premiums or a decrease in broker fees or commission..
>
> What is it John?
>
> Scott Morrow
> RV-6A N548SM
>
> Retired aviation insurance broker with over 25 years with AON, Marsh, and
as
> a consultant
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "923te" <923te(at)cox.net> |
| Subject: | Re: MA-4-5 Carburator needed.. New, Rebuilt or Core |
This a carb for the O540 engine. O360's amd O320's may have it as well.
----- Original Message -----
From: "923te" <923te(at)cox.net>
Subject: Re: RV-List: MA-4-5 Carburator needed.. New, Rebuilt or Core
> Anyone have available a carburator MA-4-5? Lycoming Part number LW-18788
>
> Thanks,
> Ned
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Bob 1" <rv3a(at)comcast.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Radio Amplifier? |
>
> Would a radio amplifier that could handle AM/SSB/FM (by design) also
amplify
> AM? Aviation radio is VHF AM. Could a ham radio amp be used to boost my
> signal? I realize that VHF is line-of-sight, so power is not normally a
> limiting factor. However, I often operate in areas with lots of
> interference. I can hear ATC, but they sometimes can't hear me, so I'm
> thinking a little more power might be a big help. Would there be any FCC
> issues with doing this? I am a licensed ham, and the power out would be
> considerably below what airline radios transmit.
>
> Thanks,
>
> Randy
> RV-6A
> 430 hours
============================================
If your situation is really as you describe, it is truly unique.
Most radio xmitters either match or outperform the receiver portion.
Fer instance...
I use a 1 watt xmit and have no trouble talking 75 miles or more...
unless on the ground.
Bob
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "John" <n1cxo320(at)salidaco.com> |
| Subject: | NationAir Dropping Phoenix Underwriters |
Do any of you that have insurance with AIG know if your liability policy
ALSO covers the hangar where your plane is stored? Phoenix's policy gave me
that coverage (necessary because of ground lease terms at my airport) as a
part of the overall liability coverage. I would appreciate some info. Thanks
John at Salida, CO
________________________________________________________________________________
DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws;
s=beta; d=gmail.com;
b=j0iB9QBeRd+3YRMSY9qsqd6Pe3QbPmQUtjii7d/YBxfrfKkOQUREQkWgqSK+kmeP4eu5GRxCRTEG6OlfECT93FzfYpzfqvmauy79WyalyXWE7XGpcRrQFnym77LU9g2jJPKonC2FYYDU4BRen6A1QQxgD4/mb8X8C4B3G3+Ua+0Received:
by 10.54.36.47 with SMTP id j47mr141176wrj;
| From: | Bob J <rocketbob(at)gmail.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Changes in NationAir's VanGuard Program |
I am going thru the renewal process right now and to reinsure with AIG
as the underwriter; its costing me nearly $200 more a year for the
same coverage as I've had previously. My auto rates have similarly
rose this year, and I changed carriers but got a better deal. I can
deal with a nominal increase but the future is what worries me. If it
increases $200 a year for the next five years then that's another
story. Having only one low cost underwriter writing policies for RV's
is NOT GOOD. With Phoenix out of the picture a competitive insurance
marketplace for the RV's no longer exists.
Regards,
Bob Japundza
RV-6 flying F1 under const.
>
> John:
>
> What is the real reason for the split with Pheonix? Loss ratios?,
> commissions? Brokers generally do not sever relationships with insurers on group
programs
> unless the insurer wants out or there is a sudden and substantial increase in
> rates/premiums or a decrease in broker fees or commission..
>
> What is it John?
>
> Scott Morrow
> RV-6A N548SM
>
> Retired aviation insurance broker with over 25 years with AON, Marsh, and as
> a consultant
>
>
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Matt Johnson" <matt(at)n559rv.com> |
| Subject: | Stupid Question... |
(not processed: message from valid local sender)
I was going to dimple the skin on the wings for the fuel tanks and I cannot figure
out which dimple die to use... The bolts are AN5-8R8 but
the "complete RV builders kit" that I purchased does not have an AN5 dimple. Am
I missing something? are you supposed to match the
dimple die (AN5) to the bolt size (AN5) based on the AN number? did the kit just
leave out this obvious dimple die (there are a lot of these
bolts throughout the hole plane). Thanks for your help.
- Matt Johnson
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "JT Helms" <jhelms(at)nationair.com> |
| Subject: | Re: NationAir Dropping Phoenix Underwriters |
All companies include that (except London Aviation Underwriters which isn't
really a factor for RVs). It's called premises liability coverage.
JT
----- Original Message -----
From: "John" <n1cxo320(at)salidaco.com>
Subject: RV-List: NationAir Dropping Phoenix Underwriters
>
> Do any of you that have insurance with AIG know if your liability policy
> ALSO covers the hangar where your plane is stored? Phoenix's policy gave
me
> that coverage (necessary because of ground lease terms at my airport) as a
> part of the overall liability coverage. I would appreciate some info.
Thanks
>
> John at Salida, CO
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "JT Helms" <jhelms(at)nationair.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Changes in NationAir's VanGuard Program |
We actually have seen AIG and the EAA's program competing with one another
on RVs. So, there is some competition.
The low rates Phoenix formerly offered for 5 years contributed to the loss
ratio being higher. That ratio is calculated by taking claims $'s paid out
or reserved for a loss by the amount of premium taken in (and earned...
meaning that portion of the policy premium that's been used.)
If the premiums taken in (and earned) are lower, then the ratio is higher.
Assuming the loss $'s are the same between two companies, if one is charging
higher premiums, then they're earning premium faster, and their loss ratio
would be lower.
At the heart of your post, yes, RVers are likely to experience higher
premiums than what has been available for the last 5 years. NationAir is
working very hard at keeping those two markets available and competitive as
well as adding others. Also, as I mentioned in our statement about our
program, we are apparently the only broker that is trying to advance the
cause for RV owners with the insurance companies. Broadening the scope of
engine types, getting the underwriters up to see Van are just two things
we're working on right now.
We'd really like to see even more insurance companies in the marketplace.
Competition is good for you (the customers), obviously. Encouraging
additional companies to quote homebuilts, or existing markets to lower their
rates is completely dependant on their view of the loss ratio. That is
completely dependant upon you all. The best sales job I can do on an
underwriter to convince them to write RVs isn't going to matter if the
losses are high (or would be in their mind.)
JT
----- Original Message -----
From: "Bob J" <rocketbob(at)gmail.com>
Subject: Re: RV-List: Changes in NationAir's VanGuard Program
>
> I am going thru the renewal process right now and to reinsure with AIG
> as the underwriter; its costing me nearly $200 more a year for the
> same coverage as I've had previously. My auto rates have similarly
> rose this year, and I changed carriers but got a better deal. I can
> deal with a nominal increase but the future is what worries me. If it
> increases $200 a year for the next five years then that's another
> story. Having only one low cost underwriter writing policies for RV's
> is NOT GOOD. With Phoenix out of the picture a competitive insurance
> marketplace for the RV's no longer exists.
>
> Regards,
> Bob Japundza
> RV-6 flying F1 under const.
>
> >
> > John:
> >
> > What is the real reason for the split with Pheonix? Loss ratios?,
> > commissions? Brokers generally do not sever relationships with insurers
on group programs
> > unless the insurer wants out or there is a sudden and substantial
increase in
> > rates/premiums or a decrease in broker fees or commission..
> >
> > What is it John?
> >
> > Scott Morrow
> > RV-6A N548SM
> >
> > Retired aviation insurance broker with over 25 years with AON, Marsh,
and as
> > a consultant
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "McFarland, Randy" <Randy.McFarland(at)novellus.com> |
| Subject: | Entering and exiting an RV-6 (or 7 or 9) |
I'm not very good at searching the archives. Can someone tell me who sells
the handles for the roll bar, and the best spacing for easiest use?
Thank you
Randy
7A Aft canopy skirts
-----Original Message-----
From: Jeff Dowling [mailto:shempdowling(at)earthlink.net]
Subject: Re: RV-List: Entering and exiting an RV-6 (or 7 or 9)
Its easy if you install a couple of handles on the rollover bar. I got some
computer main frame aluminum pull handles from someone on the list. Easy to
install and I will never have one without them.
Jeff Dowling
RV-6A, N915JD
140 hours
Chicago/Louisville
----- Original Message -----
From: <dmedema(at)att.net>
Subject: RV-List: Entering and exiting an RV-6 (or 7 or 9)
>
> I've been thinking about the seats for my RV-6A and have
> struggled with the issue of getting in and out of the plane without
> damaging the seats. It seems like the only way to get in and out
> includes standing on the seat. I've thought about trying to make
> the seat in two pieces, kind of a front and back part. The front
> would be easily removable so you could step on metal while
> getting in and then replace the front part after you're in the plane.
> This doesn't seem real practical to me though. I was discussing
> this with my wife last night and she mentioned "jump seats." Now
> I have a Ford Ranger pickup extended cab and it has two small
> seats that fold into the sides of the truck behind the main seat.
> This got me thinking about the possibility of having some kind of
> frame that would swing up for entry and exit and would fold down
> as you sat on it. I think I would try to make it hinged somehow,
> maybe like a theater seat, possibly with a spring to raise it when
> not loaded. When down, the loads would be on the airplane floor
> and not on the moving seat frame. I realize this will add some
> weight, the challenge would be to minimize it. It also has some
> issues with moving the seat back fore-and-aft, but I might just
> give up that feature and keep the seat backs in one position.
>
> So, how are you people, who have spent quite a bit of money on
> your nice seats, keeping them nice? Do you move them out of the
> way or just step on them? Any unique ideas out there for moving
> the seats out of the way?
>
> Thanks,
> Doug Medema
> RV-6A N276DM
>
>
>
>
>
> I've been thinking about the seats for my RV-6A and have
> struggled with the issue of getting in and out of the plane without
> damaging the seats. It seems like the only way to get in and out
> includes standing on the seat. I've thought about trying to make
> the seat in two pieces, kind of a front and back part. The front
> would be easily removable so you could step on metal while
> getting in and then replace the front part after you're in the plane.
> This doesn't seem real practical to me though. I was discussing
> this with my wife last night and she mentioned "jump seats." Now
> I have a Ford Ranger pickup extended cab and it has two small
> seats that fold into the sides of the truck behind the main seat.
> This got me thinking about the possibility of having some kind of
> frame that wouldswing up for entry and exit and would fold down
> as you sat on it. I think I would try to make it hinged somehow,
> maybe like a theater seat, possibly with a spring to raise it when
> not loaded. When down, the loads would be on the airplane floor
> and not on the moving seat frame. I realize this will add some
> weight, the challenge would be to minimize it. It also has some
> issues with moving the seat back fore-and-aft, but I might just
> give up that feature and keep the seat backs in one position.
>
> So, how are you people, who have spent quite a bit of money on
> your nice seats, keeping them nice? Do you move them out of the
> way or just step on them? Any unique ideas out there for moving
> the seats out of the way?
>
> Thanks,
> Doug Medema
> RV-6A N276DM
>
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Ross Mickey" <rmickey(at)ix.netcom.com> |
| Subject: | Hangar Insurance |
John,
Does this cover the rebuilding of my hangar if it is destroyed?
Ross Mickey
-----Original Message-----
All companies include that (except London Aviation Underwriters which
isn't
really a factor for RVs). It's called premises liability coverage.
JT
----- Original Message -----
From: "John" <n1cxo320(at)salidaco.com>
Subject: RV-List: NationAir Dropping Phoenix Underwriters
>
> Do any of you that have insurance with AIG know if your liability
policy
> ALSO covers the hangar where your plane is stored? Phoenix's policy
gave
me
> that coverage (necessary because of ground lease terms at my airport)
as a
> part of the overall liability coverage. I would appreciate some info.
Thanks
>
> John at Salida, CO
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jim Jewell" <jjewell(at)telus.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Entering and exiting an RV-6 (or 7 or 9) |
Hi Randy,
Try http://www.reidtool.com/store/home.asp or mail@reidtool.com they send
annual catalog on request.
Jim in Kelowna
----- Original Message -----
From: "McFarland, Randy" <Randy.McFarland(at)novellus.com>
Subject: RE: RV-List: Entering and exiting an RV-6 (or 7 or 9)
>
>
> I'm not very good at searching the archives. Can someone tell me who sells
> the handles for the roll bar, and the best spacing for easiest use?
> Thank you
> Randy
> 7A Aft canopy skirts
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Jeff Dowling [mailto:shempdowling(at)earthlink.net]
> To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
> Subject: Re: RV-List: Entering and exiting an RV-6 (or 7 or 9)
>
>
> Its easy if you install a couple of handles on the rollover bar. I got
> some
>
> computer main frame aluminum pull handles from someone on the list. Easy
> to
>
> install and I will never have one without them.
>
> Jeff Dowling
> RV-6A, N915JD
> 140 hours
> Chicago/Louisville
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: <dmedema(at)att.net>
> To:
> Subject: RV-List: Entering and exiting an RV-6 (or 7 or 9)
>
>
>>
>> I've been thinking about the seats for my RV-6A and have
>> struggled with the issue of getting in and out of the plane without
>> damaging the seats. It seems like the only way to get in and out
>> includes standing on the seat. I've thought about trying to make
>> the seat in two pieces, kind of a front and back part. The front
>> would be easily removable so you could step on metal while
>> getting in and then replace the front part after you're in the plane.
>> This doesn't seem real practical to me though. I was discussing
>> this with my wife last night and she mentioned "jump seats." Now
>> I have a Ford Ranger pickup extended cab and it has two small
>> seats that fold into the sides of the truck behind the main seat.
>> This got me thinking about the possibility of having some kind of
>> frame that would swing up for entry and exit and would fold down
>> as you sat on it. I think I would try to make it hinged somehow,
>> maybe like a theater seat, possibly with a spring to raise it when
>> not loaded. When down, the loads would be on the airplane floor
>> and not on the moving seat frame. I realize this will add some
>> weight, the challenge would be to minimize it. It also has some
>> issues with moving the seat back fore-and-aft, but I might just
>> give up that feature and keep the seat backs in one position.
>>
>> So, how are you people, who have spent quite a bit of money on
>> your nice seats, keeping them nice? Do you move them out of the
>> way or just step on them? Any unique ideas out there for moving
>> the seats out of the way?
>>
>> Thanks,
>> Doug Medema
>> RV-6A N276DM
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> I've been thinking about the seats for my RV-6A and have
>> struggled with the issue of getting in and out of the plane without
>> damaging the seats. It seems like the only way to get in and out
>> includes standing on the seat. I've thought about trying to make
>> the seat in two pieces, kind of a front and back part. The front
>> would be easily removable so you could step on metal while
>> getting in and then replace the front part after you're in the plane.
>> This doesn't seem real practical to me though. I was discussing
>> this with my wife last night and she mentioned "jump seats." Now
>> I have a Ford Ranger pickup extended cab and it has two small
>> seats that fold into the sides of the truck behind the main seat.
>> This got me thinking about the possibility of having some kind of
>> frame that wouldswing up for entry and exit and would fold down
>> as you sat on it. I think I would try to make it hinged somehow,
>> maybe like a theater seat, possibly with a spring to raise it when
>> not loaded. When down, the loads would be on the airplane floor
>> and not on the moving seat frame. I realize this will add some
>> weight, the challenge would be to minimize it. It also has some
>> issues with moving the seat back fore-and-aft, but I might just
>> give up that feature and keep the seat backs in one position.
>>
>> So, how are you people, who have spent quite a bit of money on
>> your nice seats, keeping them nice? Do you move them out of the
>> way or just step on them? Any unique ideas out there for moving
>> the seats out of the way?
>>
>> Thanks,
>> Doug Medema
>> RV-6A N276DM
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "JT Helms" <jhelms(at)nationair.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Hangar Insurance |
No. It is for liabilities that happen in or around the plane which the
aircraft's owner (and the owner of the hangar if that's a different person
and you've added them as additional insured on the policy) incurs.
The owner of the hangar would have to purchase a seperate policy to cover
physical damage to a hangar (i.e. wind, fire, etc).
Aircraft policies typically do have coverage for 'damage to non-owned
hangars' although some policies further exclude a hangar which you rent
(long term.... not as in overnight on a cross country.)
JT
----- Original Message -----
From: "Ross Mickey" <rmickey(at)ix.netcom.com>
Subject: RV-List: Hangar Insurance
>
> John,
>
> Does this cover the rebuilding of my hangar if it is destroyed?
>
> Ross Mickey
>
> -----Original Message-----
>
> All companies include that (except London Aviation Underwriters which
> isn't
> really a factor for RVs). It's called premises liability coverage.
>
> JT
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "John" <n1cxo320(at)salidaco.com>
> To:
> Subject: RV-List: NationAir Dropping Phoenix Underwriters
>
>
> >
> > Do any of you that have insurance with AIG know if your liability
> policy
> > ALSO covers the hangar where your plane is stored? Phoenix's policy
> gave
> me
> > that coverage (necessary because of ground lease terms at my airport)
> as a
> > part of the overall liability coverage. I would appreciate some info.
> Thanks
> >
> > John at Salida, CO
> >
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Allen Fulmer" <afulmer(at)charter.net> |
| Subject: | Stupid Question... (not processed: message from valid |
local sender)
I think mine were marked by Avery as #6 and #8. Don't really know what
"size" they are. They are noticeably larger than the 3/32" and 1/8".
HTH
Allen Fulmer
RV7 Wings
N808AF reserved
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of Matt Johnson
Subject: RV-List: Stupid Question... (not processed: message from valid
local sender)
I was going to dimple the skin on the wings for the fuel tanks and I cannot
figure out which dimple die to use... The bolts are AN5-8R8 but
the "complete RV builders kit" that I purchased does not have an AN5 dimple.
Am I missing something? are you supposed to match the
dimple die (AN5) to the bolt size (AN5) based on the AN number? did the kit
just leave out this obvious dimple die (there are a lot of these
bolts throughout the hole plane). Thanks for your help.
- Matt Johnson
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Jerry2DT(at)aol.com |
I believe it's a good idea to firesleeve for sure the stuff that's catching
the radiant heat from those red hot, 1400-1500 deg exhaust pipes. And all the
fuel lines, regardless. Other stuff like behind engine, not so sure. The SS
enshrouded oil lines for instance. If you have a fire, you're going to shut
the engine down, right?
Jerry Cochran
Van's catalogue suggests only certain fuel/oil lines should be firesleeved
in that
orange hose. But I'm pretty sure I've seen where builders have almost
firesleeved
just about everything from control cables to starter wires to small wire
bundles up there.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Charlie Kuss <chaztuna(at)adelphia.net> |
| Subject: | Stupid Question... |
Allen
Those numbers refer to the machine screw size which the dimple is for.
The dimple corresponds to the flush head of either a #6 or #8 machine screw
and the center hole corresponds to the size of the screw's shank.
Charlie Kuss
PS Do yourself a favor. While Vans specifies that a #19 drill is correct
for #8 dimpled holes, the hole will tend to crack when dimpled due to the
severe upset of the metal. On scrap, drill and dimple using the #19 drill.
Now inspect the dimpled hole carefully with a jeweler's loop or a
magnifying glass. 3 out of 4 will have tiny cracks. Repeat this process
using a #17 drill bit. No cracks. I learned this trick from A&P, IA and RV4
builder Jody Edwards.
>
>I think mine were marked by Avery as #6 and #8. Don't really know what
>"size" they are. They are noticeably larger than the 3/32" and 1/8".
>HTH
>
>Allen Fulmer
>RV7 Wings
>N808AF reserved
>
>-----Original Message-----
>From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
>[mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of Matt Johnson
>To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
>Subject: RV-List: Stupid Question... (not processed: message from valid
>local sender)
>
>
>I was going to dimple the skin on the wings for the fuel tanks and I cannot
>figure out which dimple die to use... The bolts are AN5-8R8 but
>the "complete RV builders kit" that I purchased does not have an AN5 dimple.
>Am I missing something? are you supposed to match the
>dimple die (AN5) to the bolt size (AN5) based on the AN number? did the kit
>just leave out this obvious dimple die (there are a lot of these
>bolts throughout the hole plane). Thanks for your help.
>
>- Matt Johnson
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | SportAV8R(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Radio Amplifier? |
Randy, you'll have to retune the input and output networks for the lower frequency
(assuming a 2 meter "brick") and also be certain you have a class-A or -AB
amp offering reasonable linearity (an FM/CW-only, class-C amp will not work here.)
Then there are the type-acceptance issues for use in non-amateur service where
your ham ticket doesn't mean jack to the Feds. On that note, I am surprised people
are getting away with running Icom-706's as avaition HF's for trans-Atlantic
ferry work and so on. Those radios are not type-accepted for use in the
aviation HF service, and probably lack the frequency stability for such certification
unless an add-on crystal oven is used... just an aside.
-Stormy
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bob <panamared3(at)brier.net> |
| Subject: | Re: NationAir's VanGuard Quotes |
on opie.wvnet.edu
FYI,
I just renewed my insurance as of 1 Nov with VanGuard. Previous costs, 1st
year $1550, 2nd year $1360 (rate reduction due to 300+ hours and 200+
tailwheel), this year $1668 (I did increase the hull value by $9,000 to
$60K).
This was all with Phoenix. I did receive a quote from AIG for about $30
less. However, at this time I have declined to do business with AIG while
they are under investigation by NY Attorney General for insurance fraud.
I find JT Helms to be a good person to do business with.
Bob
RV6 NightFighter
Dynon D-10 is way too cool at night! Far Out!!
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "John Furey" <john(at)fureychrysler.com> |
| Subject: | MA-4-5 Carburetor needed.. New, Rebuilt or Core |
Ned, When I Needed help with a carb Bart Lablonde came to my rescue and was
great to work with. 250-376-2955
John Furey
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Hopperdhh(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Stupid Question... (not processed: message from valid local |
send...
Matt,
Use the die that makes the right size dimple. Practice on some scrap.
Dan Hopper
RV-7A
N766DH (Flying 62 hours)
In a message dated 11/3/04 11:48:41 AM US Eastern Standard Time,
matt(at)n559rv.com writes:
>
>
> I was going to dimple the skin on the wings for the fuel tanks and I cannot
> figure out which dimple die to use... The bolts are AN5-8R8 but
> the "complete RV builders kit" that I purchased does not have an AN5 dimple.
> Am I missing something? are you supposed to match the
> dimple die (AN5) to the bolt size (AN5) based on the AN number? did the kit
> just leave out this obvious dimple die (there are a lot of these
> bolts throughout the hole plane). Thanks for your help.
>
> - Matt Johnson
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Sensenich FP Prop |
| From: | "" <tx_jayhawk(at)excite.com> |
All,
Based on the advice of Stein and others, I went ahead and ordered the 86 pitch
prop from Sensenich. Although Vans sells it only in 85 pitch (at least on the
catalog), you can apparently get it up to 88 or 89 pitch if you want.
I would be interested in hearing any performance data (climb or cruise) from people
with the 86 pitch prop and 0-360 combination. What I am told is that a combination
like this should exceed any CS performance in cruise (obviously not
climb).
Thanks,
Scott
www.scottsrv7a.com
Thanks for the advice on bending the hinge pins...it was very helpful.
Join Excite! - http://www.excite.com
The most personalized portal on the Web!
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Brian Denk" <akroguy(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | Sensenich FP Prop |
>
>All,
>
>Based on the advice of Stein and others, I went ahead and ordered the 86
>pitch prop from Sensenich. Although Vans sells it only in 85 pitch (at
>least on the catalog), you can apparently get it up to 88 or 89 pitch if
>you want.
>
>I would be interested in hearing any performance data (climb or cruise)
>from people with the 86 pitch prop and 0-360 combination. What I am told
>is that a combination like this should exceed any CS performance in cruise
>(obviously not climb).
>
>Thanks,
>Scott
>www.scottsrv7a.com
FWIW, as a point of reference, my RV8/O-360/Sensenich 83" pitch tops out in
cruise at 200mph at 8,000' MSL/ 2700rpm. Static ground runup on a cool day
at about 5,000' field elevation is 2350 rpm. My plane hooks up to the air
pretty quick on takeoff roll so accelleration and climb is excellent. At
sea level, it's airborne RIGHTNOW. But, I'm left with a bunch of throttle
available at most normal cruise altitudes. I'd say the 85 or 86 would be
the cat's meow in all but very high and hot operational altitudes. I live a
mile high already in New Mexico so I chose the finer pitch to get the
airplane off the ground reliably when the tarmac is melting during the
summer.
Brian Denk
RV8 N94BD
RV10 '51
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Vanremog(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Alternative Fuels (was Fuel Senders...) |
In a message dated 11/3/2004 5:13:29 PM Pacific Standard Time,
jjewell(at)telus.net writes:
Me?... I'm holding out for the advent of motive power source designs that
utilize antimatter based fuels before considering substantial engine mods
and currently available alternative fuels etc.{[g-}!
=========================================
I keep praying for the "faith based" fuels.
GV (RV-6A N1GV O-360-A1A C/S, flying 725 hrs)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Darwin Barrie" <ktlkrn(at)cox.net> |
I've got the Van's seats and I purchased my desired covering. Anybody know if one
of the existing companies that does seats will cover the Van's seats with my
stuff?
Darwin N. Barrie
Chandler AZ
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jeff Dowling" <shempdowling(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Entering and exiting an RV-6 (or 7 or 9) |
Do a google search for computer hardware. Im sure you can find these
handles. They even take -3 bolts.
The hardest part of the installation was drilling through the front and back
of the rollover in a straight line at the right angle so you dont drill into
the windshield yet still have enough room grab the handle. Not very
dificult, just take your time and start with a small dia bit and work your
way up. The aft holes (on the cockpit side) will then be enlarged so the
handle will slide through them into the rollover. The front holes only have
to be large enough to accept the -3.
To get in and out, you put your right heel inbetween the seats over the spar
while grabbing both handles. Then swing your left leg all the way in to the
rudder pedals. Getting out is just as easy. One motion, right heel between
seats and pull yourself up and out while swinging your left leg out onto the
wing. Typing this was a lot harder than doing it :)
My list of "must haves" so far:
1. Koger sun shade
2. Enter/exit handles
3. Altitude hold a/p
Of course I can add alot to that list but so far these are the most
significant. I purchased the tilt up aftermarket upgrade for my slider but
havent installed it yet. Im guessing it will be added to the list.
Jeff Dowling
RV-6A, N915JD
140 hours
Chicago/Louisville
----- Original Message -----
From: "McFarland, Randy" <Randy.McFarland(at)novellus.com>
Subject: RE: RV-List: Entering and exiting an RV-6 (or 7 or 9)
>
>
> I'm not very good at searching the archives. Can someone tell me who sells
> the handles for the roll bar, and the best spacing for easiest use?
> Thank you
> Randy
> 7A Aft canopy skirts
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Jeff Dowling [mailto:shempdowling(at)earthlink.net]
> To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
> Subject: Re: RV-List: Entering and exiting an RV-6 (or 7 or 9)
>
>
> Its easy if you install a couple of handles on the rollover bar. I got
> some
>
> computer main frame aluminum pull handles from someone on the list. Easy
> to
>
> install and I will never have one without them.
>
> Jeff Dowling
> RV-6A, N915JD
> 140 hours
> Chicago/Louisville
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: <dmedema(at)att.net>
> To:
> Subject: RV-List: Entering and exiting an RV-6 (or 7 or 9)
>
>
>>
>> I've been thinking about the seats for my RV-6A and have
>> struggled with the issue of getting in and out of the plane without
>> damaging the seats. It seems like the only way to get in and out
>> includes standing on the seat. I've thought about trying to make
>> the seat in two pieces, kind of a front and back part. The front
>> would be easily removable so you could step on metal while
>> getting in and then replace the front part after you're in the plane.
>> This doesn't seem real practical to me though. I was discussing
>> this with my wife last night and she mentioned "jump seats." Now
>> I have a Ford Ranger pickup extended cab and it has two small
>> seats that fold into the sides of the truck behind the main seat.
>> This got me thinking about the possibility of having some kind of
>> frame that would swing up for entry and exit and would fold down
>> as you sat on it. I think I would try to make it hinged somehow,
>> maybe like a theater seat, possibly with a spring to raise it when
>> not loaded. When down, the loads would be on the airplane floor
>> and not on the moving seat frame. I realize this will add some
>> weight, the challenge would be to minimize it. It also has some
>> issues with moving the seat back fore-and-aft, but I might just
>> give up that feature and keep the seat backs in one position.
>>
>> So, how are you people, who have spent quite a bit of money on
>> your nice seats, keeping them nice? Do you move them out of the
>> way or just step on them? Any unique ideas out there for moving
>> the seats out of the way?
>>
>> Thanks,
>> Doug Medema
>> RV-6A N276DM
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> I've been thinking about the seats for my RV-6A and have
>> struggled with the issue of getting in and out of the plane without
>> damaging the seats. It seems like the only way to get in and out
>> includes standing on the seat. I've thought about trying to make
>> the seat in two pieces, kind of a front and back part. The front
>> would be easily removable so you could step on metal while
>> getting in and then replace the front part after you're in the plane.
>> This doesn't seem real practical to me though. I was discussing
>> this with my wife last night and she mentioned "jump seats." Now
>> I have a Ford Ranger pickup extended cab and it has two small
>> seats that fold into the sides of the truck behind the main seat.
>> This got me thinking about the possibility of having some kind of
>> frame that wouldswing up for entry and exit and would fold down
>> as you sat on it. I think I would try to make it hinged somehow,
>> maybe like a theater seat, possibly with a spring to raise it when
>> not loaded. When down, the loads would be on the airplane floor
>> and not on the moving seat frame. I realize this will add some
>> weight, the challenge would be to minimize it. It also has some
>> issues with moving the seat back fore-and-aft, but I might just
>> give up that feature and keep the seat backs in one position.
>>
>> So, how are you people, who have spent quite a bit of money on
>> your nice seats, keeping them nice? Do you move them out of the
>> way or just step on them? Any unique ideas out there for moving
>> the seats out of the way?
>>
>> Thanks,
>> Doug Medema
>> RV-6A N276DM
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
Has anyone done testing and found the best speed that maximizes, altitude,
distance traveled, in the least time?
Scott Bilinski
Eng dept 305
Phone (858) 657-2536
Pager (858) 502-5190
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | luckymacy(at)comcast.net (lucky) |
| Subject: | Re: EFIS Horizon |
Vince,
I'm starting to warm up to the idea of the GRT EFIS & EIS combo. It's a lot of
eggs in one basket should something fail in flight (and at work it's not uncommon
for our flight rated MFDs to degrade/fail in the labs) and personally I have
this fear about the plane being broken into for easy to steal higher priced
avionics. This seems a tempting target. Oh well.
OK, so it's the best idea since sliced bread. But what are the current annoyances
with it?
Any false alarms generated like typical startup conditions before ideal tolerances
are obtainable?
Do you use the altitude encoder to your TX? They show no pictures of anything
but main displays. Do you have any pictures of the setup menus? For example,
a common action would be to setup barometric pressure. How many steps and what
buttons/knob combinations get you there. I hope it's not all push button for
this.
How accurate is the heading and what were the considerations they have about mounting
it near a wing tip strobe power pack? How involved in calibrating it and
the rest of the sensors?
I have float type fuel senders - any issue there? Any other installation nice
to knows along those kind of lines?
I want to use the MFD as the ammeter for the whole plane. Did you and if so what
did it take to make that happen?
The GPS page is sparce and more Software is promised in the future. What can it
do now and what's the latest on when they will updgrade it?
What are the limitations and usefullness of the G-meter readings? I haven't found
any picture of it on their display. Is it actually usable during acro and
does it keep the max high/low or just show instanteaous in small font?
I see no notice about an online user's manual other than one is going to be out
late but that was a while ago. Do you have a soft copy of one you could send?
Thanks!
Lucky Macy
>
>
> SNIP Anyone hear of anything new on the EFIS horizon? no pun intended.
>
> lucky
>
> SNIP
>
> Lucky,
>
> I've got 5 hours behind my GRT EFIS Horizon in my Rocket. All I can say
> is WOW!
>
> It will take me another 20 hours just to figure out how to use all of
> the nifty stuff it will do!
>
> I've had the usual teething problems, all related to things I've done
> wrong, nothing that a phone call hasn't been able to fix in 2 minutes.
> So far, I'm quite pleased with it. If you need more details visit my
> website or www.grtavionics.com.
>
> No, they don't pay me to say this stuff....but they should!!!
>
> Vince Frazier
> F-1H Rocket, N540VF
> http://www.usi.edu/science/chemistry/vfrazier/page1.html
>
>
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Alternative Fuels (was Fuel Senders...) |
This just in from the South Dakota Corn Association:
"For every bushel of corn that is put into an ethanol plant you get 2.7
gallons of ethanol, 17 pounds of Dried Distiller's Grain, 17 pounds of co2."
Now there is about 200 bushels per acre +- 25. So one acre should produce
540 gallons of alcohol. So I only need about 4~5 acres of corn a year to
fly on.
Scott Bilinski
Eng dept 305
Phone (858) 657-2536
Pager (858) 502-5190
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: EFIS Horizon |
Lucky,
I'm flying with the EFIS Horizion as an MFD/moving map I also have the EIS but
I don't use the graphical engine data on the EFIS. If you are worried about failures
you can have the EFIS built with airspeed and altitude built in then the
EFIS with compare the values and flag if they don't match. But then you have
to figure out which one is correct. But what I realy was writing to say is
that if you go to the GRT download page and download the latest software one
of the files you get in the .zip package is a .PDF of the users manual. It will
not answer all your question but after you read through it I would say to call
Todd at GRT and get the answer from him.
Alan Kritzman
Cedar Rapids, IA
RV-8
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Denis Walsh <denis.walsh(at)comcast.net> |
| Subject: | Re: climb speed? |
When I started flying my RV seven years ago, the experienced persons
said climb at 120 MPH when doing enroute climb. It works to
perfection, and seems to go with the airfoil, visibility and overall
economy.
We live close to the mountains. When we head west to go over the
mountains, we use 120 MPH. This gets us to breakfast in the minimum
time, which i think meets your criteria.
A scientific analysis would no doubt change this a bit but I doubt it
would be more than 5MPH off.
Denis.
On Nov 4, 2004, at 7:04 AM, Scott Bilinski wrote:
> <bilinski@kyocera-wireless.com>
>
> Has anyone done testing and found the best speed that maximizes,
> altitude,
> distance traveled, in the least time?
>
>
> Scott Bilinski
> Eng dept 305
> Phone (858) 657-2536
> Pager (858) 502-5190
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | luckymacy(at)comcast.net (lucky) |
| Subject: | Re: EFIS Horizon |
Thanks,
Why don't you use the graphical display for the engine info? I really like the
idea of using the split screens and want the engine data available to me there.
It's one of the best features.
I already have the standard round airspeed and altitude gauges so I'm not really
interested in the effect of loosing that part of the MFD.
How do you like dealing with the company? Is it basically a one person show?
How responsive have they been to any problem you may have had or suggestion you
had to make?
lucky
>
> Lucky,
> I'm flying with the EFIS Horizion as an MFD/moving map I also have the EIS but
I
> don't use the graphical engine data on the EFIS. If you are worried about
> failures you can have the EFIS built with airspeed and altitude built in then
> the EFIS with compare the values and flag if they don't match. But then you
> have to figure out which one is correct. But what I realy was writing to say
is
> that if you go to the GRT download page and download the latest software one
of
> the files you get in the .zip package is a .PDF of the users manual. It will
> not answer all your question but after you read through it I would say to call
> Todd at GRT and get the answer from him.
>
> Alan Kritzman
> Cedar Rapids, IA
> RV-8
>
>
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Matt Johnson" <matt(at)n559rv.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Stupid Question... |
(not processed: message from valid local sender)
I am not finding any kind of chart that shows suggested dimple die sizes for a
given screw size anywhere on the plans. I have found the
torque table that shows the size of the screw (I think it is 5/16). Anyway, I dont
think I have a #8 dimple die, but I am not sure because
these dumb ATS dimple dies dont have numbers on them that look meaningful... Is
there somewhere in the plans that it states the
correct drill holes and dimple die sizes for each of the given bolt holes? Or maybe
some other resource online?
- Matt
-----Original Message-----
From: "Dan Checkoway" <dan(at)rvproject.com>
Date: Wed, 3 Nov 2004 09:48:02 -0800
Subject: Re: RV-List: Stupid Question... (not processed: message from valid
local sender)
> AN5?! You must be building a B-17. 8
) More like a #8 screw.
> Probably
> AN515 or something like that. Use a #8 dimple. Check the plans before
> taking my advice, though...
>
> )_( Dan
> RV-7 N714D
> http://www.rvproject.com
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Matt Johnson" <matt(at)n559rv.com>
> To:
> Sent: Wednesday, November 03, 2004 9:00 AM
> Subject: RV-List: Stupid Question... (not processed: message from valid
> local sender)
>
>
> >
> > I was going to dimple the skin on the wings for the fuel tanks and I
> cannot figure out which dimple die to use... The bolts are AN5-8R8 but
> > the "complete RV builders kit" that I purchased does not have an AN5
> dimple. Am I missing something? are you supposed to match the
> > dimple die (AN5) to the bolt size (AN5) based on the AN number? did
> the
> kit just leave out this obvious dimple die (there are a lot of these
> > bolts throughout the hole plane). Thanks for your help.
> >
> > - Matt Johnson
> >
> >
> >
> > _-> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Ross Mickey" <rmickey(at)ix.netcom.com> |
| Subject: | Stupid Question... (not processed: message from valid |
local sender)
I can't help you with the labeling part. You can go to
http://www.averytools.com/results.cfm?keyword=dies
Or
http://www.aircraftspruce.com/catalog/topages/rivdimplesets.php
To see the different sizes.
These are 3/32, 1/8, 5/32 for rivets and #6, #8, #10 for screws. When I
bought mine, I made sure I stored them so I could tell which was which.
Ross Mickey
RV6A
N9PT
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Matt Johnson
Subject: Re: RV-List: Stupid Question... (not processed: message from
valid local sender)
I am not finding any kind of chart that shows suggested dimple die sizes
for a given screw size anywhere on the plans. I have found the
torque table that shows the size of the screw (I think it is 5/16).
Anyway, I dont think I have a #8 dimple die, but I am not sure because
these dumb ATS dimple dies dont have numbers on them that look
meaningful... Is there somewhere in the plans that it states the
correct drill holes and dimple die sizes for each of the given bolt
holes? Or maybe some other resource online?
- Matt
-----Original Message-----
From: "Dan Checkoway" <dan(at)rvproject.com>
Date: Wed, 3 Nov 2004 09:48:02 -0800
Subject: Re: RV-List: Stupid Question... (not processed: message
from valid local sender)
> AN5?! You must be building a B-17. 8
) More like a #8 screw.
> Probably
> AN515 or something like that. Use a #8 dimple. Check the plans
before
> taking my advice, though...
>
> )_( Dan
> RV-7 N714D
> http://www.rvproject.com
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Matt Johnson" <matt(at)n559rv.com>
> To:
> Sent: Wednesday, November 03, 2004 9:00 AM
> Subject: RV-List: Stupid Question... (not processed: message from
valid
> local sender)
>
>
> >
> > I was going to dimple the skin on the wings for the fuel tanks and I
> cannot figure out which dimple die to use... The bolts are AN5-8R8 but
> > the "complete RV builders kit" that I purchased does not have an AN5
> dimple. Am I missing something? are you supposed to match the
> > dimple die (AN5) to the bolt size (AN5) based on the AN number? did
> the
> kit just leave out this obvious dimple die (there are a lot of these
> > bolts throughout the hole plane). Thanks for your help.
> >
> > - Matt Johnson
> >
> >
> >
> > _-> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Eustace Bowhay" <ebowhay(at)jetstream.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Stupid Question... (not processed: message from valid |
local sender)
Hii Matt:
It sounds like you are talking about AN509 8R8 flat head screws. They
require a dimple die that has a #19 male half and matching female half.
Check the size with your drill size gauge.
Eustace
----- Original Message -----
From: "Matt Johnson" <matt(at)n559rv.com>
Subject: RV-List: Stupid Question... (not processed: message from valid
local sender)
>
> I was going to dimple the skin on the wings for the fuel tanks and I
cannot figure out which dimple die to use... The bolts are AN5-8R8 but
> the "complete RV builders kit" that I purchased does not have an AN5
dimple. Am I missing something? are you supposed to match the
> dimple die (AN5) to the bolt size (AN5) based on the AN number? did the
kit just leave out this obvious dimple die (there are a lot of these
> bolts throughout the hole plane). Thanks for your help.
>
> - Matt Johnson
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | HalBenjamin(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Stupid Question... (not processed: message from valid local |
send...
In a message dated 11/4/2004 3:50:03 PM Eastern Standard Time,
matt(at)n559rv.com writes:
> I am not finding any kind of chart that shows suggested dimple die sizes
> for a given screw size anywhere on the plans. I have found the
> torque table that shows the size of the screw (I think it is 5/16). Anyway,
> I dont think I have a #8 dimple die, but I am not sure because
> these dumb ATS dimple dies dont have numbers on them that look meaningful...
> Is there somewhere in the plans that it states the
> correct drill holes and dimple die sizes for each of the given bolt holes?
> Or maybe some other resource online?
>
Hi Matt,
If the plans say to use an AN509-8R8. You would use a #8 die. If you have
one it might have 4508 stamped on it. (Number is from ATS catalog) It helps
to get have catalogs from the various tool companies handy for this kind of
stuff. Good news is that they're usually free.
Cleveland Aircraft Tool Company's catalog has a handy chart in it that you
can hang on your wall that has hole sizes, tap sizes, etc.
Another good reference for fasteners is the toolbox reference book from
Genuine Aircraft Hardware Company.
Good Luck,
Hal Benjamin
RV4, Long Island, NY
Fuselage
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Matt Johnson" <matt(at)n559rv.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Stupid Question... |
(not processed: message from valid local sender)
Thanks everyone. I will take a look when I get home at what I have again now that
I know what I am looking for.
- Matt
-----Original Message-----
From: HalBenjamin(at)aol.com
Date: Thu, 4 Nov 2004 16:55:19 EST
Subject: Re: RV-List: Stupid Question... (not processed: message from valid local
send...
>
> In a message dated 11/4/2004 3:50:03 PM Eastern Standard Time,
> matt(at)n559rv.com writes:
>
> > I am not finding any kind of chart that shows suggested dimple die
> sizes
> > for a given screw size anywhere on the plans. I have found the
> > torque table that shows the size of the screw (I think it is 5/16).
> Anyway,
> > I dont think I have a #8 dimple die, but I am not sure because
> > these dumb ATS dimple dies dont have numbers on them that look
> meaningful...
> > Is there somewhere in the plans that it states the
> > correct drill holes and dimple die sizes for each of the given bolt
> holes?
> > Or maybe some other resource online?
> >
>
> Hi Matt,
>
> If the plans say to use an AN509-8R8. You would use a #8 die. If you
> have
> one it might have 4508 stamped on it. (Number is from ATS catalog) It
> helps
> to get have catalogs from the various tool companies handy for this
> kind of
> stuff. Good news is that they're usually free.
>
> Cleveland Aircraft Tool Company's catalog has a handy chart in it that
> you
> can hang on your wall that has hole sizes, tap sizes, etc.
> Another good reference for fasteners is the toolbox reference book from
> Genuine Aircraft Hardware Company.
>
> Good Luck,
>
> Hal Benjamin
> RV4, Long Island, NY
> Fuselage
>
>
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Randy Lervold" <randy(at)romeolima.com> |
| Subject: | Re: climb speed? |
I also heard that others who had actually tested came up with 120 mph and
used that with good results for my RV-8. Actually I found that 130 mph
yielded almost as much rate of climb, but of course provided slightly better
cooling.
Then I started testing props where we were doing very precise climbs and
data acquisition. What I found is that the actual best climb varied a bit
with each prop. I used the same speed for each prop so as to not introduce
another variable, but that may have been unfair if the best speed was
different. For example with the Whirl Wind 200C I remember discarding a run
where I was flying a bit too fast, ~125 mph, and it climbed better there.
The window for the three props I tested was probably 7 mph wide. The moral
to the story is that you'll need to do the testing to actually find out what
Vy for your plane is.
Randy Lervold
----- Original Message -----
From: "Denis Walsh" <denis.walsh(at)comcast.net>
Subject: Re: RV-List: climb speed?
>
> When I started flying my RV seven years ago, the experienced persons
> said climb at 120 MPH when doing enroute climb. It works to
> perfection, and seems to go with the airfoil, visibility and overall
> economy.
>
> We live close to the mountains. When we head west to go over the
> mountains, we use 120 MPH. This gets us to breakfast in the minimum
> time, which i think meets your criteria.
>
> A scientific analysis would no doubt change this a bit but I doubt it
> would be more than 5MPH off.
>
> Denis.
> On Nov 4, 2004, at 7:04 AM, Scott Bilinski wrote:
>
> > <bilinski@kyocera-wireless.com>
> >
> > Has anyone done testing and found the best speed that maximizes,
> > altitude,
> > distance traveled, in the least time?
> >
> >
> > Scott Bilinski
> > Eng dept 305
> > Phone (858) 657-2536
> > Pager (858) 502-5190
> >
> >
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jack Ford" <jackoford(at)theofficenet.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Alternative Fuels (was Fuel Senders...) |
Way I heard it, back in my hotrodding days, was that alcohol carries some of
its own oxygen, so it acts sort of like it was supercharged, BUT, volume
comsumption has to increase to make up for it, so you'll be running a lot
richer at full power, but you'll also be putting out a lot more steam.
Jack Ford
----- Original Message -----
From: "cgalley" <cgalley(at)qcbc.org>
Subject: Re: RV-List: Alternative Fuels (was Fuel Senders...)
>
> As I remember it, you have to burn more (higher fuel flow) to get the
higher
> power output with alcohol.
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Chris W" <1qazxsw23edcvfr45tgbnhy67ujm(at)cox.net>
> To:
> Subject: Re: RV-List: Alternative Fuels (was Fuel Senders...)
>
>
> <1qazxsw23edcvfr45tgbnhy67ujm(at)cox.net>
> >
> > Scott Bilinski wrote:
> >
> > >Yes it has lower BTU's but also puts out about 10% more power at
> > >the same power settings.
> > >
> > >
> > I'm confused. How can it have less BTU's and still put out more power?
> > BTU is an energy unit and Power is Energy over time. So if ethanol has
> > fewer BTU's per gallon, how could you possibly get 10% more power at the
> > same GPH flow?
> >
> > This is probably a bad estimate, and probably changes a lot with scale.
> > In the model airplane world if you have a big bird you want to convert
> > from a nitro-methane engine to a gas engine, the general rule of thumb
> > is you only need half as much fuel by volume.
> >
> > Now diesel seems the way to go, more BTU's per lbs and more lbs per
> > gallon... it's like getting long range tanks for free. Of course there
> > is the whole needing a new engine part. I just hope by the time I get
> > building Deltahawk or some other manufacture will have a 180+ hp diesel
> > with all the bugs worked out.
> >
> > Chris W
> > Not getting the gifts you want? The Wish Zone can help.
> >
> >
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Larygagnon(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Garmin 196 mounting... |
I cut the original 196 mount to leave just a right angle brace that was
drilled and mounted to the side rail. It allows me to take the unit in and out
with the original slip in latch and still retain the swivel and tilt of the
cradle. Contact me off line if you want a picture.
Larry Gagnon
RV6 O360 N6LG 60 hours
RV6A wings
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Stupid Question... (not processed: message from valid local |
send...
In a message dated 11/4/04 12:49:52 PM Pacific Standard Time, matt(at)n559rv.com
writes:
<< Is there somewhere in the plans that it states the correct drill holes
and dimple die sizes for each of the given bolt holes? Or maybe some other
resource online? >>
Matt: Just a suggestion but why don't you buy a number drill gauge (Avery
or Cleveland). With that you could easily select the correct dimple die even
if they are unmarked by selecting the one that has a guide pin that fits the
desired screw size hole in the gauge.
Harry Crosby
Pleasanton, California
RV-6
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Jerry2DT(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Garmin 196 mounting |
Tom,
We used Ram Mount pieces to install the GPS 196 in our -6a. Works well, and
can swivel for best view. They are in various catalogs like Chief and Wicks.
Website is _http://www.ram-mount.com/_ (http://www.ram-mount.com/)
Jerry Cochran
From: "Tom" <tomrv8(at)gvtc.com>
Subject: RV-List: Garmin 196 mounting...
I would like to mount my Garmin 196 GPS in my RV-4, and plan to mount it in
front of the upper right area of the instrument panel at the intersection of
the side rail. In that postition it won't be blocking any guages, and should
be out of the way of my knees. (no room to mount it in the panel itself)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Mickey Coggins <mick-matronics(at)rv8.ch> |
Hi,
I'm kind of tired of my crappy looking nutplate installations,
and I'm looking for any tips/tricks to make them better.
My basic problem is getting the screw hole to line up right.
Are nutplate jigs worth what people like Avery charge
for them (38 USD)? Any other tricks that you care to pass on?
Thanks,
Mickey
--
Mickey Coggins
http://www.rv8.ch/
#82007 QB Wings/Fuselage
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Richard Lundin <rlundin46(at)yahoo.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Nutplate jigs |
Absolutely!
Rick
--- Mickey Coggins wrote:
>
>
> Hi,
>
> I'm kind of tired of my crappy looking nutplate
> installations,
> and I'm looking for any tips/tricks to make them
> better.
> My basic problem is getting the screw hole to line
> up right.
>
> Are nutplate jigs worth what people like Avery
> charge
> for them (38 USD)? Any other tricks that you care
> to pass on?
>
> Thanks,
> Mickey
>
>
> --
> Mickey Coggins
> http://www.rv8.ch/
> #82007 QB Wings/Fuselage
>
>
>
> Click on the
> this
> by the
> Admin.
> _->
> Contributions
> any other
> Forums.
>
> http://www.matronics.com/subscription
> http://www.matronics.com/FAQ/RV-List.htm
> http://www.matronics.com/archives
> http://www.matronics.com/photoshare
> http://www.matronics.com/emaillists
>
>
>
>
>
>
__________________________________
www.yahoo.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Mike Nellis <mike(at)bmnellis.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Nutplate jigs |
Mickey, I don't know why your screw holes wouldn't line p correctly.
Here is the sequence I use and it works out great.
1. Drill #30 hole where screw is to be place
2. Cleco nut plate in place
3. Position nut plate so tabs are in correct position
4. Drill 1st tab and cleco
5. Drill 2nd tab
6. Before riveting nut plate in place, drill screw hold to final size
Works every time and, no, I don't think the nut plate jigs are worth the
cost.
I seem to recall a web site with some pictures so I went looking. I
found it in the old, tried and true website of Sam Buchanan. He even
shows how to correctly install the nut plates if you screw up the
sequence. :)
http://home.hiwaay.net/~sbuc/journal/tanks.html
--
Mike Nellis
Austin, TX
CMRA #32 Honda RC51
'97 YZF1000
'47 Stinson 108-2; RV6 (Fuselage)
http://bmnellis.com
Mickey Coggins wrote:
>
>Hi,
>
>I'm kind of tired of my crappy looking nutplate installations,
>and I'm looking for any tips/tricks to make them better.
>My basic problem is getting the screw hole to line up right.
>
>Are nutplate jigs worth what people like Avery charge
>for them (38 USD)? Any other tricks that you care to pass on?
>
>Thanks,
>Mickey
>
>
>--
>Mickey Coggins
>http://www.rv8.ch/
>#82007 QB Wings/Fuselage
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bill VonDane <bill(at)vondane.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Nutplate jigs |
Mickey... As long as you do your drilling and riveting with a screw in the
nutplate you wont have any trouble.....and you wont need to spend the $38!
-Bill VonDane
RV-8A (FOR SALE)
www.vondane.com/forsale/rv8a
--- Mickey Coggins wrote:
>
>
> Hi,
>
> I'm kind of tired of my crappy looking nutplate
> installations,
> and I'm looking for any tips/tricks to make them
> better.
> My basic problem is getting the screw hole to line
> up right.
>
> Are nutplate jigs worth what people like Avery
> charge
> for them (38 USD)? Any other tricks that you care
> to pass on?
>
> Thanks,
> Mickey
>
>
> --
> Mickey Coggins
> http://www.rv8.ch/
> #82007 QB Wings/Fuselage
>
>
> Click on the
> this
> by the
> Admin.
> _->
> Contributions
> any other
> Forums.
>
> http://www.matronics.com/subscription
> http://www.matronics.com/FAQ/RV-List.htm
> http://www.matronics.com/archives
> http://www.matronics.com/photoshare
> http://www.matronics.com/emaillists
>
>
__________________________________
www.yahoo.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Gary Zilik <zilik(at)excelgeo.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Nutplate jigs |
On my first RV I made my own nutplate jig instead of buying the
expensive one. On the second RV the jig finally wore out and I went back
to using the nutplate for the jig and got pretty good and fast at it.
When I started the 3rd RV I broke down and bought #8 and #6 jigs from
Brown Tool (cheaper than Avery) and would never go back to the time
before jigs. They are worth it. There are literally hundreds of
nutplates in the typical RV.
Gary Zilik
Mickey Coggins wrote:
>
> Hi,
>
> I'm kind of tired of my crappy looking nutplate installations,
> and I'm looking for any tips/tricks to make them better.
> My basic problem is getting the screw hole to line up right.
>
> Are nutplate jigs worth what people like Avery charge
> for them (38 USD)? Any other tricks that you care to pass on?
>
> Thanks,
> Mickey
>
>
> --
> Mickey Coggins
> http://www.rv8.ch/
> #82007 QB Wings/Fuselage
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Richard Tasker <retasker(at)optonline.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Nutplate jigs |
I don't know if they are worth it or not. You could make one easily if
you wanted to.
What I do is drill the screw hole first to whatever size cleco will fit
through the nutplate - same as the nutplate screw for standard
nutplates, smaller for countersunk nutplates. Then I cleco the nutplate
to the aluminum through the screw hole and drill the first rivet hole
right through the nutplate hole. The nutplate is held firmly in place
by the first cleco so it is easy to drill properly. Then I put another
cleco in the first rivet hole and drill the second through the second
nutplate hole. Finally, for the countersunk nutplates I redrill the
screw hole to the proper size.
Dick Tasker
Mickey Coggins wrote:
>
>Hi,
>
>I'm kind of tired of my crappy looking nutplate installations,
>and I'm looking for any tips/tricks to make them better.
>My basic problem is getting the screw hole to line up right.
>
>Are nutplate jigs worth what people like Avery charge
>for them (38 USD)? Any other tricks that you care to pass on?
>
>Thanks,
>Mickey
>
>
>--
>Mickey Coggins
>http://www.rv8.ch/
>#82007 QB Wings/Fuselage
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | GMC <gmcnutt(at)shaw.ca> |
Hi Mickey
I am starting on second RV without nutplate jigs and do not intend to get
any.
My method is slower but here is how I go about mounting nutplates.
(1) put screw through hole into nutplate, not tight just one turn & center
in hole, (nutplate upside down on structure or as required).
(2) using finger pressure on one tab to keep things from shifting drill
through other nutplate tab into structure, then drop a rivet into this hole
to keep nutplate from shifting.
(3) drill second rivet hole.
(4) remove screw & rivet from holes.
(5) use deburring tool to countersink structure. Note that I use only the
small headed "UH-OH" NAS 1097AD3 rivets for mounting nutplates, this will
work on material as thin as .025.
George in Langley
-----Original Message-----
Hi,
I'm kind of tired of my crappy looking nutplate installations,
and I'm looking for any tips/tricks to make them better.
My basic problem is getting the screw hole to line up right.
Are nutplate jigs worth what people like Avery charge
for them (38 USD)? Any other tricks that you care to pass on?
Thanks,
Mickey
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "steve zicree" <szicree(at)adelphia.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Nutplate jigs |
What I do is use the smallest drill size that will allow the screw to pass
through. I then use a real short screw to hold the nutplate in position
while I drill for the rivets. After deburring and countersinking, I use the
same screw to hold the nutplate in postion while I squeeze the rivets.
Steve Zicree
----- Original Message -----
From: "Mickey Coggins" <mick-matronics(at)rv8.ch>
Subject: RV-List: Nutplate jigs
>
> Hi,
>
> I'm kind of tired of my crappy looking nutplate installations,
> and I'm looking for any tips/tricks to make them better.
> My basic problem is getting the screw hole to line up right.
>
> Are nutplate jigs worth what people like Avery charge
> for them (38 USD)? Any other tricks that you care to pass on?
>
> Thanks,
> Mickey
>
>
> --
> Mickey Coggins
> http://www.rv8.ch/
> #82007 QB Wings/Fuselage
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | richard dudley <rhdudley(at)att.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Nutplate jigs |
Mickey,
Nutplate jigs are wonderful. They are very accurate and save lots of
time and aggravation. Drill the hole for the screw body, insert the pin
of the jig. Drill the first hole for a rivet. Then flip the jig over
insert the center pin and the rivet pin and drill the hole for the
second rivet. At least on the 6/A I used them for wing root fairings,
floor nutplates ( I used screws on the floor), panel, tail fairing
,wingtips and many other locations.
Regards,
Richard Dudley
-6A ready to move to the airport
Mickey Coggins wrote:
>
>Hi,
>
>I'm kind of tired of my crappy looking nutplate installations,
>and I'm looking for any tips/tricks to make them better.
>My basic problem is getting the screw hole to line up right.
>
>Are nutplate jigs worth what people like Avery charge
>for them (38 USD)? Any other tricks that you care to pass on?
>
>Thanks,
>Mickey
>
>
>--
>Mickey Coggins
>http://www.rv8.ch/
>#82007 QB Wings/Fuselage
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Rick Galati <rick6a(at)yahoo.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Nutplate jigs |
Mickey,
For installing the odd nutplate here and there, you can get by well enough without
using a nutplate jig. My preferred method is to drill out the center hole
to accept the screw or bolt and using washers as stack spacers, temporarily install
and align the nutplate to the assembly with a temporary screw or bolt tightened
down to discourage any clocking movement. Drill out one rivet hole and
cleco if possible or at least shove a #40 drill bit through it to help prevent
shifting. Drill out the second rivet hole, then disassemble for deburring.
Reassemble using 1097AD3 rivets. There is a thumbscrew available with undersize
threads that is used to hold the nutplate element in place of a temporary
screw, but I have not seen these tools available to the homebuilder. Perhaps
someone out there knows of a source.
If you are going to install nutplates in dozens of places, I consider nutplate
jigs an essential tool. This is based upon my sometimes daily and otherwise long
experience using all manner of nutplate jigs on the factory floor. Nothing
else insures consistent quality and repeatability like this specialized tool
does, and that goes double when drilling out the hole pattern for floating nutplates.
My RV-6A makes extensive use of (mostly) floating nutplates which includes
service holding all manner of accessories to the firewall, every single
one of the fiberglass tips except for the vertical stab and rudder top, fully
removable floors, upper cowl attach, etc. An assortment of nutplate jigs greatly
simplified these varied tasks. I find that most people having once familiarized
themselves with a nutplate jig, are somewhat loathe to go back to the
basic way of drilling out nutplate hole patterns.
Rick Galati RV-6A "finishing"
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Stein Bruch" <stein(at)steinair.com> |
Hi Mickey,
I used to use every old trick in the book there was to put in nutplates and
thought I had it whipped, and that "I didn't need no darned new-fangled
nutplate jigs"..... Then during my airline days I acquired some "real true
to life" nutplate jigs. They are nifty little handheld units that are worth
their weight in gold.
If you haven't used them, you'll think you're doing fine. But....after you
use one, you'll wonder why you didn't get them before.
Makes life a LOT easier, especially in these "nutplate" intensive RV's.
Just my experience.
Cheers,
Stein Bruch
RV6's, Minneapolis.
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of Mickey Coggins
Subject: RV-List: Nutplate jigs
Hi,
I'm kind of tired of my crappy looking nutplate installations,
and I'm looking for any tips/tricks to make them better.
My basic problem is getting the screw hole to line up right.
Are nutplate jigs worth what people like Avery charge
for them (38 USD)? Any other tricks that you care to pass on?
Thanks,
Mickey
--
Mickey Coggins
http://www.rv8.ch/
#82007 QB Wings/Fuselage
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Mike Robertson" <mrobert569(at)hotmail.com> |
Mickey,
They are worth every penny if you are doing more than just a couple of
nutplates.
Mike Robertson
>From: Mickey Coggins <mick-matronics(at)rv8.ch>
>Reply-To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
>To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
>Subject: RV-List: Nutplate jigs
>Date: Fri, 05 Nov 2004 21:35:32 +0100
>
>
>Hi,
>
>I'm kind of tired of my crappy looking nutplate installations,
>and I'm looking for any tips/tricks to make them better.
>My basic problem is getting the screw hole to line up right.
>
>Are nutplate jigs worth what people like Avery charge
>for them (38 USD)? Any other tricks that you care to pass on?
>
>Thanks,
>Mickey
>
>
>--
>Mickey Coggins
>http://www.rv8.ch/
>#82007 QB Wings/Fuselage
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jim Jewell" <jjewell(at)telus.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Nutplate jigs |
Hi Mickey,
Try this:
Shorten a screw of the size that matches the nutplate you wish to install.
Insert the shortened screw and tighten as required to hold the nutplate in
place.
Drill the intended screw hole to the final screw size. Put the nut plate
into place on the material side that allows best drilling access.
(If the shortened screw is the right length it will hold the nutplate in
place for the drilling of the first hole without going all the way through
the nutplate. This preserves the nutplate threads.)
Using light pressure carefully drill the first nutplate mounting hole and
cleako it in place. Drill the second mounting hole. Install the nutplate
when and as required.
Another approach: Cut the head off of the screw of a size that matches the
nutplate you wish to install.
Install the cut off threaded section snugly into the nutplate.
Dill the screw hole to the final screw size. Put the nut plate into place on
the material side that allows best drilling access. Clamp one end of the
nutplate in position. drill the first hole then cleako for drilling the
second hole
In both cases a clamp or a small pair of Vice-grip pliers can be used (when
space allows) to hold the nutplate for drilling the first nutplate mounting
hole. "Some Duct tape (the handy man's secret weapon") on the Vise-grip jaws
protects the surfaces.
I suppose that if you really need to build fast or you intend to re offend
( build more than one RV) the cash for the neat tool would be well spent.
Jim in Kelowna
----- Original Message -----
From: "Mickey Coggins" <mick-matronics(at)rv8.ch>
Subject: RV-List: Nutplate jigs
>
> Hi,
>
> I'm kind of tired of my crappy looking nutplate installations,
> and I'm looking for any tips/tricks to make them better.
> My basic problem is getting the screw hole to line up right.
>
> Are nutplate jigs worth what people like Avery charge
> for them (38 USD)? Any other tricks that you care to pass on?
>
> Thanks,
> Mickey
>
>
> --
> Mickey Coggins
> http://www.rv8.ch/
> #82007 QB Wings/Fuselage
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Chris & Kellie Hand" <ckhand(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Nutplate jigs |
You guys are raising my interest level - I'm one of those that has been
using the nutplates themselves as jigs and have been pretty satisfied doing
it that way (at the end of fuselage kit, start of finishing kit stage).
Anybody out there that has used the jigs and still thinks it's just as easy
either way?
Chris Hand
RV-6A, #23559, sloooow but steady progress.....
----- Original Message -----
From: "Stein Bruch" <stein(at)steinair.com>
Subject: RE: RV-List: Nutplate jigs
>
> Hi Mickey,
>
> I used to use every old trick in the book there was to put in nutplates
and
> thought I had it whipped, and that "I didn't need no darned new-fangled
> nutplate jigs"..... Then during my airline days I acquired some "real
true
> to life" nutplate jigs. They are nifty little handheld units that are
worth
> their weight in gold.
>
> If you haven't used them, you'll think you're doing fine. But....after
you
> use one, you'll wonder why you didn't get them before.
>
> Makes life a LOT easier, especially in these "nutplate" intensive RV's.
>
> Just my experience.
>
> Cheers,
> Stein Bruch
> RV6's, Minneapolis.
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of Mickey Coggins
> To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
> Subject: RV-List: Nutplate jigs
>
>
> Hi,
>
> I'm kind of tired of my crappy looking nutplate installations,
> and I'm looking for any tips/tricks to make them better.
> My basic problem is getting the screw hole to line up right.
>
> Are nutplate jigs worth what people like Avery charge
> for them (38 USD)? Any other tricks that you care to pass on?
>
> Thanks,
> Mickey
>
>
> --
> Mickey Coggins
> http://www.rv8.ch/
> #82007 QB Wings/Fuselage
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Hopperdhh(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Flying with flaps down |
Fellow RVers,
This friend of mine has an RV-7A just like mine. He took off from an airport
after a fuel stop, and flew about 5 miles with the flaps full down. I'm sure
he was well over the white arc, maybe 150 mph. When he got to his
destination he looked everything over, and can find no damage. Has anyone else
ever
done this? I just want to put my, err I mean his, mind at ease.
Dan Hopper
RV-7A
N766DH (Flying 64 hours)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "steve zicree" <szicree(at)adelphia.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Nutplate jigs |
Are you sure you guys don't work for the nutplate jig makers? You've
convinced stubborn ol' me to go buy one tomorrow.
Steve Zicree
----- Original Message -----
From: "Stein Bruch" <stein(at)steinair.com>
Subject: RE: RV-List: Nutplate jigs
>
> Hi Mickey,
>
> I used to use every old trick in the book there was to put in nutplates
and
> thought I had it whipped, and that "I didn't need no darned new-fangled
> nutplate jigs"..... Then during my airline days I acquired some "real
true
> to life" nutplate jigs. They are nifty little handheld units that are
worth
> their weight in gold.
>
> If you haven't used them, you'll think you're doing fine. But....after
you
> use one, you'll wonder why you didn't get them before.
>
> Makes life a LOT easier, especially in these "nutplate" intensive RV's.
>
> Just my experience.
>
> Cheers,
> Stein Bruch
> RV6's, Minneapolis.
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of Mickey Coggins
> To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
> Subject: RV-List: Nutplate jigs
>
>
> Hi,
>
> I'm kind of tired of my crappy looking nutplate installations,
> and I'm looking for any tips/tricks to make them better.
> My basic problem is getting the screw hole to line up right.
>
> Are nutplate jigs worth what people like Avery charge
> for them (38 USD)? Any other tricks that you care to pass on?
>
> Thanks,
> Mickey
>
>
> --
> Mickey Coggins
> http://www.rv8.ch/
> #82007 QB Wings/Fuselage
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Alex Peterson" <alexpeterson(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | Flying with flaps down |
> Fellow RVers,
>
> This friend of mine has an RV-7A just like mine. He took off
> from an airport
> after a fuel stop, and flew about 5 miles with the flaps full
> down. I'm sure
> he was well over the white arc, maybe 150 mph. When he got to his
> destination he looked everything over, and can find no
> damage. Has anyone else ever
> done this? I just want to put my, err I mean his, mind at ease.
>
> Dan Hopper
> RV-7A
> N766DH (Flying 64 hours)
Dan, the honest among us will admit we have taken off and begun our flight
with some amount of flap down. I take off with about half flaps, and a
couple times in 550 hours of flying have failed to retract them fully (got
distracted, answered a radio call, etc., left an inch or two of flap in) An
inch of flaps down is quite noticeable, as even an inch is equivalent to
something like 3-4 inches of manifold pressure drop. What is a little hard
to imagine is proceeding with full flaps. I think my trim would have to be
full forward with high power just to keep the plane flying generally level
with full flaps. Go arounds with full flaps and full power can really
surprise one with the forward stick force needed until the trim is rolled
in. I would guess my 180 horse plane could make maybe 120-130 knots with
full flaps down, if that.
These planes will talk to us, we just need to listen. Anything that seems
amiss probably is.
Dan, or I mean Dan's friend, learn from it and move on. My only question is
why did you, er, he, have full flaps on takeoff? Full flaps lengthen the
takeoff roll.
Alex Peterson
RV6-A 548 hours
Maple Grove, MN
http://www.home.earthlink.net/~alexpeterson/
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Stein Bruch" <stein(at)steinair.com> |
Nope, but I can't for the life of me figure out why anyone (including me)
would rather goof around with all these long protracted stories about
inserting a screw, drilling, clecoing, ad.nauseum when the neat little tool
takes literally a few seconds to do each nutplate with NO screws, clecos,
screwdrivers, shortened screws, etc..
I'm just as scared of spending wasted money on stupid gadgets as the next
guy, and much of the time I'm just stubborn enough to think those little
things aren't needed and the "old way" is best, but in this case the
opposite is true.
Just to be clear, I've done it both ways, and have the worn out nutplates to
prove it but wouldn't go back.
Cheers,
Stein.
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of steve zicree
Subject: Re: RV-List: Nutplate jigs
Are you sure you guys don't work for the nutplate jig makers? You've
convinced stubborn ol' me to go buy one tomorrow.
Steve Zicree
----- Original Message -----
From: "Stein Bruch" <stein(at)steinair.com>
Subject: RE: RV-List: Nutplate jigs
>
> Hi Mickey,
>
> I used to use every old trick in the book there was to put in nutplates
and
> thought I had it whipped, and that "I didn't need no darned new-fangled
> nutplate jigs"..... Then during my airline days I acquired some "real
true
> to life" nutplate jigs. They are nifty little handheld units that are
worth
> their weight in gold.
>
> If you haven't used them, you'll think you're doing fine. But....after
you
> use one, you'll wonder why you didn't get them before.
>
> Makes life a LOT easier, especially in these "nutplate" intensive RV's.
>
> Just my experience.
>
> Cheers,
> Stein Bruch
> RV6's, Minneapolis.
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of Mickey Coggins
> To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
> Subject: RV-List: Nutplate jigs
>
>
> Hi,
>
> I'm kind of tired of my crappy looking nutplate installations,
> and I'm looking for any tips/tricks to make them better.
> My basic problem is getting the screw hole to line up right.
>
> Are nutplate jigs worth what people like Avery charge
> for them (38 USD)? Any other tricks that you care to pass on?
>
> Thanks,
> Mickey
>
>
> --
> Mickey Coggins
> http://www.rv8.ch/
> #82007 QB Wings/Fuselage
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "LarryRobertHelming" <lhelming(at)sigecom.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Nutplate jigs |
>
> Are you sure you guys don't work for the nutplate jig makers? You've
> convinced stubborn ol' me to go buy one tomorrow.
>
Not all of us. I agree with a few that say you don't need them. I have
built an entire slow build RV7 without a nutplate jig. It can be done and
done well. The key, as some others have already stated, is to drill your
screw hole small so you can use a cleco to hold the nutplate in place. Then
drill your rivet holes using the nutplate as your drill guide. Before
riveting them on, expand the original screw hole to full size. Then rivet
the nutplate on. Works like a charm. You don't have to look for or store
that extra tool any place either. More $$ for avgas when you get done. do
not archive
Indiana Larry, RV7 TipUp "SunSeeker"
The sincerest satisfactions in life come in doing and not dodging duty;
in meeting and solving problems, in facing facts;
in flying a virgin plane never flown before.
- Richard L. Evans & Larry R Helming
----- Original Message -----
From: "steve zicree" <szicree(at)adelphia.net>
Subject: Re: RV-List: Nutplate jigs
>
> Are you sure you guys don't work for the nutplate jig makers? You've
> convinced stubborn ol' me to go buy one tomorrow.
>
> Steve Zicree
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Stein Bruch" <stein(at)steinair.com>
> To:
> Subject: RE: RV-List: Nutplate jigs
>
>
> >
> > Hi Mickey,
> >
> > I used to use every old trick in the book there was to put in nutplates
> and
> > thought I had it whipped, and that "I didn't need no darned new-fangled
> > nutplate jigs"..... Then during my airline days I acquired some "real
> true
> > to life" nutplate jigs. They are nifty little handheld units that are
> worth
> > their weight in gold.
> >
> > If you haven't used them, you'll think you're doing fine. But....after
> you
> > use one, you'll wonder why you didn't get them before.
> >
> > Makes life a LOT easier, especially in these "nutplate" intensive RV's.
> >
> > Just my experience.
> >
> > Cheers,
> > Stein Bruch
> > RV6's, Minneapolis.
> >
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
> > [mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of Mickey Coggins
> > To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
> > Subject: RV-List: Nutplate jigs
> >
> >
> >
> > Hi,
> >
> > I'm kind of tired of my crappy looking nutplate installations,
> > and I'm looking for any tips/tricks to make them better.
> > My basic problem is getting the screw hole to line up right.
> >
> > Are nutplate jigs worth what people like Avery charge
> > for them (38 USD)? Any other tricks that you care to pass on?
> >
> > Thanks,
> > Mickey
> >
> >
> > --
> > Mickey Coggins
> > http://www.rv8.ch/
> > #82007 QB Wings/Fuselage
> >
> >
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "steve zicree" <szicree(at)adelphia.net> |
Anyone know whether my gear leg fairing hinges are stainless? They're very thin
material and sure do look like stainless, but I'm not sure. Only reason I care
is I'd love to have one less thing to prime.
Steve Zicree
RV4, wearing pants!
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "steve zicree" <szicree(at)adelphia.net> |
Anyone know whether my gear leg fairing hinges are stainless? They're very thin
material and sure do look like stainless, but I'm not sure. Only reason I care
is I'd love to have one less thing to prime.
Steve Zicree
RV4, wearing pants!
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Special N-Number reservation |
Greetings
Last year I had applied for and received an N-number reservation. It expires
on December 3, 2004 unless I reserve it for another year or assign it to my
aircraft. My question is, Can I assign this number to a partially completed
aircraft or do I need to wait until it's finished.
Bill King
www.kane-king.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Ed Holyoke" <bicyclop(at)pacbell.net> |
| Subject: | Flying with flaps down |
Dan,
A friend of mine took off in a 6a with the flaps full down and took a
minute to figure out why it wouldn't accelerate and climb as well as it
usually does. Alex is right. The airplane will tell you something's
wrong. I bet you don't forget to raise them next time. I, I mean my
friend didn't forget again. Same guy forgot to latch his oil filler door
once, too.
Check your canopy at least twice before you go too. That one wasn't my
fault, though. The spring that holds the tip-up latch wasn't long enough
and allowed the latch to come loose and the canopy to open in flight.
That was about a week after we bought the plane. Made an impression on
me. I was at OSH buying springs that night. I may forget to turn on my
transponder every now and them, but I never forget to check the canopy.
Ed Holyoke
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of
Hopperdhh(at)aol.com
Subject: RV-List: Flying with flaps down
Fellow RVers,
This friend of mine has an RV-7A just like mine. He took off from an
airport
after a fuel stop, and flew about 5 miles with the flaps full down. I'm
sure
he was well over the white arc, maybe 150 mph. When he got to his
destination he looked everything over, and can find no damage. Has
anyone else ever
done this? I just want to put my, err I mean his, mind at ease.
Dan Hopper
RV-7A
N766DH (Flying 64 hours)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Vanremog(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Special N-Number reservation |
In a message dated 11/5/2004 7:51:08 PM Pacific Standard Time,
bill@kane-king.com writes:
Last year I had applied for and received an N-number reservation. It expires
on December 3, 2004 unless I reserve it for another year or assign it to my
aircraft. My question is, Can I assign this number to a partially completed
aircraft or do I need to wait until it's finished.
==========================================
Be careful, as assignment of the number (as opposed to reserved status) may
have significant tax implications effective on the date of assignment.
GV (RV-6A N1GV O-360-A1A C/S, flying 725 hrs)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Ed Holyoke" <bicyclop(at)pacbell.net> |
| Subject: | Special N-Number reservation |
Bill,
You can register the aircraft now if you want, I think, but your local
taxman will come knocking. I've renewed my reservation a couple of times
now. A very minor expense.
Pax,
Ed Holyoke
N 86ED (reserved)
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of William King
Subject: RV-List: Special N-Number reservation
Greetings
Last year I had applied for and received an N-number reservation. It
expires
on December 3, 2004 unless I reserve it for another year or assign it to
my
aircraft. My question is, Can I assign this number to a partially
completed
aircraft or do I need to wait until it's finished.
Bill King
www.kane-king.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Vanremog(at)aol.com |
In a message dated 11/5/2004 7:18:32 PM Pacific Standard Time,
szicree(at)adelphia.net writes:
Anyone know whether my gear leg fairing hinges are stainless? They're very
thin material and sure do look like stainless, but I'm not sure. Only reason I
care is I'd love to have one less thing to prime.
=========================================
I can't imagine that they would be as stainless, as they would then be
approx. three times the weight of aluminum hinge of the same size. I believe
you'll find them to be anodized aluminum.
GV (RV-6A N1GV O-360-A1A C/S, flying 725 hrs)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "steve zicree" <szicree(at)adelphia.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Flying with flaps down |
This thread has reminded me of the importance of checklists. Is anybody
using an electronic checklist and, if so, how do you like it? I know they
have some that even read the entries in your own voice and would be curious
to hear from anybody who's tried one.
Steve Zicree
----- Original Message -----
From: "Ed Holyoke" <bicyclop(at)pacbell.net>
Subject: RE: RV-List: Flying with flaps down
>
> Dan,
>
> A friend of mine took off in a 6a with the flaps full down and took a
> minute to figure out why it wouldn't accelerate and climb as well as it
> usually does. Alex is right. The airplane will tell you something's
> wrong. I bet you don't forget to raise them next time. I, I mean my
> friend didn't forget again. Same guy forgot to latch his oil filler door
> once, too.
>
> Check your canopy at least twice before you go too. That one wasn't my
> fault, though. The spring that holds the tip-up latch wasn't long enough
> and allowed the latch to come loose and the canopy to open in flight.
> That was about a week after we bought the plane. Made an impression on
> me. I was at OSH buying springs that night. I may forget to turn on my
> transponder every now and them, but I never forget to check the canopy.
>
> Ed Holyoke
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of
> Hopperdhh(at)aol.com
> To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
> Subject: RV-List: Flying with flaps down
>
>
> Fellow RVers,
>
> This friend of mine has an RV-7A just like mine. He took off from an
> airport
> after a fuel stop, and flew about 5 miles with the flaps full down. I'm
> sure
> he was well over the white arc, maybe 150 mph. When he got to his
> destination he looked everything over, and can find no damage. Has
> anyone else ever
> done this? I just want to put my, err I mean his, mind at ease.
>
> Dan Hopper
> RV-7A
> N766DH (Flying 64 hours)
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "R. Craig Chipley" <mechtech81(at)yahoo.com> |
Well, There is one more way without jigs that is
fairly simple. In the place where you want a nutplate,
find your center and drill a #30 hole. Place your
nutplate on TOP of the skin and cleco it down. Use a
medium length drill bit drill your first rivet hole
with the #40 drill. Put in a cleco and drill the other
hole. If your worried about movement put in a screw
down cleco. Not that hard works good lasts a long
time.
--- Stein Bruch wrote:
>
>
> Nope, but I can't for the life of me figure out why
> anyone (including me)
> would rather goof around with all these long
> protracted stories about
> inserting a screw, drilling, clecoing, ad.nauseum
> when the neat little tool
> takes literally a few seconds to do each nutplate
> with NO screws, clecos,
> screwdrivers, shortened screws, etc..
>
> I'm just as scared of spending wasted money on
> stupid gadgets as the next
> guy, and much of the time I'm just stubborn enough
> to think those little
> things aren't needed and the "old way" is best, but
> in this case the
> opposite is true.
>
> Just to be clear, I've done it both ways, and have
> the worn out nutplates to
> prove it but wouldn't go back.
>
> Cheers,
> Stein.
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf
> Of steve zicree
> To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
> Subject: Re: RV-List: Nutplate jigs
>
>
>
>
> Are you sure you guys don't work for the nutplate
> jig makers? You've
> convinced stubborn ol' me to go buy one tomorrow.
>
> Steve Zicree
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Stein Bruch" <stein(at)steinair.com>
> To:
> Subject: RE: RV-List: Nutplate jigs
>
>
>
> >
> > Hi Mickey,
> >
> > I used to use every old trick in the book there
> was to put in nutplates
> and
> > thought I had it whipped, and that "I didn't need
> no darned new-fangled
> > nutplate jigs"..... Then during my airline days I
> acquired some "real
> true
> > to life" nutplate jigs. They are nifty little
> handheld units that are
> worth
> > their weight in gold.
> >
> > If you haven't used them, you'll think you're
> doing fine. But....after
> you
> > use one, you'll wonder why you didn't get them
> before.
> >
> > Makes life a LOT easier, especially in these
> "nutplate" intensive RV's.
> >
> > Just my experience.
> >
> > Cheers,
> > Stein Bruch
> > RV6's, Minneapolis.
> >
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
> > [mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com]On
> Behalf Of Mickey Coggins
> > To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
> > Subject: RV-List: Nutplate jigs
> >
> >
>
> >
> > Hi,
> >
> > I'm kind of tired of my crappy looking nutplate
> installations,
> > and I'm looking for any tips/tricks to make them
> better.
> > My basic problem is getting the screw hole to line
> up right.
> >
> > Are nutplate jigs worth what people like Avery
> charge
> > for them (38 USD)? Any other tricks that you care
> to pass on?
> >
> > Thanks,
> > Mickey
> >
> >
> > --
> > Mickey Coggins
> > http://www.rv8.ch/
> > #82007 QB Wings/Fuselage
> >
> >
>
>
>
> Click on the
> this
> by the
> Admin.
> _->
> Contributions
> any other
> Forums.
>
> http://www.matronics.com/subscription
> http://www.matronics.com/FAQ/RV-List.htm
> http://www.matronics.com/archives
> http://www.matronics.com/photoshare
> http://www.matronics.com/emaillists
>
>
>
>
>
>
__________________________________
www.yahoo.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "steve zicree" <szicree(at)adelphia.net> |
They don't look anything like the anodized ones I've worked with up til now.
They're also much thinner material, so they probably aren't any heavier. Is
there some easy way to tell the difference?
Steve Zicree
----- Original Message -----
From: <Vanremog(at)aol.com>
Subject: Re: RV-List: Hinges
>
>
> In a message dated 11/5/2004 7:18:32 PM Pacific Standard Time,
> szicree(at)adelphia.net writes:
>
> Anyone know whether my gear leg fairing hinges are stainless? They're
very
> thin material and sure do look like stainless, but I'm not sure. Only
reason I
> care is I'd love to have one less thing to prime.
>
>
> =========================================
>
> I can't imagine that they would be as stainless, as they would then be
> approx. three times the weight of aluminum hinge of the same size. I
believe
> you'll find them to be anodized aluminum.
>
> GV (RV-6A N1GV O-360-A1A C/S, flying 725 hrs)
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Vanremog(at)aol.com |
In a message dated 11/5/2004 8:33:18 PM Pacific Standard Time,
szicree(at)adelphia.net writes:
They don't look anything like the anodized ones I've worked with up til now.
They're also much thinner material, so they probably aren't any heavier. Is
there some easy way to tell the difference?
How thin? Rolled aluminum hinges would need to be .040" thick to be good
for even a light structural application as they are made of 5052 (soft) alloy
in order to roll the eyelets without cracking the material. Extruded aluminum
alloy hinges would be obvious due to their cross-section. If the hinges you
have are the rolled eyelet type, are thinner than .040" and you can't tear
them apart with your bare hands, I would guess that they are stainless.
GV (RV-6A N1GV O-360-A1A C/S, flying 725 hrs)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Brian Kraut" <brian.kraut(at)engalt.com> |
| Subject: | Special N-Number reservation |
You can register the aircraft before it is complete, as a matter of fact,
since they sometimes take a while to mail back the registration you normally
register it before it is done so you have the paperwork back before the
inspection. Until you get the inspection and have an airworthiness
certificate it is a partially completed airplane anyway so they are all
registered before they are complete.
You will trigger the sales tax man in most states by the registration so
that is a consideration if you won't be done for a while.
Brian Kraut
Engineering Alternatives, Inc.
www.engalt.com
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of William King
Subject: RV-List: Special N-Number reservation
Greetings
Last year I had applied for and received an N-number reservation. It expires
on December 3, 2004 unless I reserve it for another year or assign it to my
aircraft. My question is, Can I assign this number to a partially completed
aircraft or do I need to wait until it's finished.
Bill King
www.kane-king.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Nutplate jigs |
In a message dated 11/5/04 12:39:58 PM Pacific Standard Time,
mick-matronics(at)rv8.ch writes:
<< Are nutplate jigs worth what people like Avery charge for them (38 USD)?
Any other tricks that you care to pass on? >>
I've never been sorry I purchased both #6 and #8 nutplate jigs early on.
They don't work however on the smaller MK nutplates or on the 45 degree ones.
For them I use the nutplate as a jig. Drill the screw hole first, then attach
the nutplate with a short screw and use it as a guide to drill the rivet holes.
Much slower than the jig but it gets the job done.
Harry Crosby
Pleasanton, California
RV-6, final details
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Mickey Coggins <mick-matronics(at)rv8.ch> |
| Subject: | Re: Nutplate jigs |
Many thanks to those of you that replied both on and off-list.
I've tried just about every trick mentioned, cuz I didn't
want to shell out the cash for a nutplate jig. By the time
I realized they existed, I thought I was just about finished
installing nutplates. Wrong! I'll probably be installing
a nutplate on the morning of my first flight, it seems!
Now I'm going to try the jig(s).
Thanks again,
Mickey
><< Are nutplate jigs worth what people like Avery charge for them (38 USD)?
>Any other tricks that you care to pass on? >>
>
>
>I've never been sorry I purchased both #6 and #8 nutplate jigs early on.
>They don't work however on the smaller MK nutplates or on the 45 degree ones.
>For them I use the nutplate as a jig. Drill the screw hole first, then attach
>the nutplate with a short screw and use it as a guide to drill the rivet holes.
> Much slower than the jig but it gets the job done.
--
Mickey Coggins
http://www.rv8.ch/
#82007 QB Wings/Fuselage
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Special N-Number reservation |
Thanks for the responses, I never thought of the Tax Consequenses!
Another $10 ain't such a bad deal I guess...
Bill King
www.kane-king.com
----- Original Message -----
From: "Brian Kraut" <brian.kraut(at)engalt.com>
Subject: RE: RV-List: Special N-Number reservation
>
> You can register the aircraft before it is complete, as a matter of fact,
> since they sometimes take a while to mail back the registration you
> normally
> register it before it is done so you have the paperwork back before the
> inspection. Until you get the inspection and have an airworthiness
> certificate it is a partially completed airplane anyway so they are all
> registered before they are complete.
>
> You will trigger the sales tax man in most states by the registration so
> that is a consideration if you won't be done for a while.
>
> Brian Kraut
> Engineering Alternatives, Inc.
> www.engalt.com
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of William King
> To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
> Subject: RV-List: Special N-Number reservation
>
>
> Greetings
>
> Last year I had applied for and received an N-number reservation. It
> expires
> on December 3, 2004 unless I reserve it for another year or assign it to
> my
> aircraft. My question is, Can I assign this number to a partially
> completed
> aircraft or do I need to wait until it's finished.
>
> Bill King
> www.kane-king.com
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "LarryRobertHelming" <lhelming(at)sigecom.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Flying with flaps down |
> Check your canopy at least twice before you go too.
This potential problem is solved easily in a tip up ( and probably
also in a slider ) with the ACS2002 monitor. It has a voice alert that can
be used to tell the pilot if the canopy is not fully closed down when the
RPMs are over 1500. Nice feature and I hope I only test it and hear it
once. A small well placed roller or pressure switch at Radio Shack which
cost about $2 with some wire is all that is needed to complete the job. The
ACS2002 also has other user alerts that can be used in a similar fashion
with an open/closed switch. I am not a salesman for them, just a happy
customer of theirs. I still have a couple of open options and am looking
for ideas of what I can use them for. I guess flaps up would be another
one. I usually have the rpm under 1500 when the flaps are being used. If
used, it would be an instant reminder if you just decided to do a go around
and got back on the throttle before raising the flaps. Other Ideas?
Larry Robert Helming
The sincerest satisfactions in life come in doing and not dodging duty;
in meeting and solving problems, in facing facts;
in flying a virgin plane never flown before.
- Richard L. Evans & Larry R Helming
----- Original Message -----
From: "Ed Holyoke" <bicyclop(at)pacbell.net>
Subject: RE: RV-List: Flying with flaps down
>
> Dan,
>
> A friend of mine took off in a 6a with the flaps full down and took a
> minute to figure out why it wouldn't accelerate and climb as well as it
> usually does. Alex is right. The airplane will tell you something's
> wrong. I bet you don't forget to raise them next time. I, I mean my
> friend didn't forget again. Same guy forgot to latch his oil filler door
> once, too.
>
> Check your canopy at least twice before you go too. That one wasn't my
> fault, though. The spring that holds the tip-up latch wasn't long enough
> and allowed the latch to come loose and the canopy to open in flight.
> That was about a week after we bought the plane. Made an impression on
> me. I was at OSH buying springs that night. I may forget to turn on my
> transponder every now and them, but I never forget to check the canopy.
>
> Ed Holyoke
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Hopperdhh(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Flying with flaps down |
In a message dated 11/5/04 8:15:24 PM US Eastern Standard Time,
alexpeterson(at)earthlink.net writes:
> Dan, or I mean Dan's friend, learn from it and move on. My only question
> is
> why did you, er, he, have full flaps on takeoff? Full flaps lengthen the
> takeoff roll.
>
> Alex Peterson
> RV6-A 548 hours
> Maple Grove, MN
>
> http://www.home.earthlink.net/~alexpeterson/
>
>
Alex,
I'm not really sure that this happened at all, now that you mention the
amount of stick pressure that would be required. He doesn't remember any great
amount of force required. If it did happen it was because he had full flaps for
the previous landing. He usually leaves the flaps down to make exiting and
entering the airplane easier. The takeoff would have then been made with the
flaps in that position, not on purpose. What "my friend" remembers is that when
he went to put the flaps down for the landing approach, they were already
down. Its possible he put them down without realizing it. He was being
distracted by a passenger asking a lot of questions (same goes for the takeoff),
when
he should have said, "Be quiet for a minute, while I go through my checklist!"
Dan
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Hopperdhh(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Special N-Number reservation |
Bill,
You need to have your airplane registered before it is inspected by the FAA
or DAR. I didn't, and had to wait 3 long weeks for the first flight. I think
you could go ahead and register it now. IMHO.
Dan Hopper
RV-7A
N766DH (Flying 60+ hours)
In a message dated 11/5/04 10:51:05 PM US Eastern Standard Time,
bill@kane-king.com writes:
> Greetings
>
> Last year I had applied for and received an N-number reservation. It expires
>
> on December 3, 2004 unless I reserve it for another year or assign it to my
> aircraft. My question is, Can I assign this number to a partially completed
> aircraft or do I need to wait until it's finished.
>
> Bill King
> www.kane-king.com
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Hopperdhh(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Nutplate jigs |
Fellow nutplaters,
Why doesn't Van punch these holes for us? I know he wants to make the
airplanes easier and quicker to build. This would be something he could do that
would save us all from needing a jig wouldn't it?
Dan Hopper
RV-7A
N766DH (Flying 60+ hours)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Ed Anderson" <eanderson(at)carolina.rr.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Flying with flaps down |
I agree with Dan. I once took off with full flaps and the first thing I
noticed was - I seemed to be elevating in a almost left attitude, but the
real tip off was the aircraft was slow to accelerate pass 80 knots. Also
had the tip-up canopy pop open on take off at about 300 ft . Failed to
ensure the main latch was locked and got distracted from the check list and
failed to rotate the canopy handel so that the "secondary" latch would
engage. The loud noise when the canopy pop open approx 6 -8 inches WILL
get your attention.
Just keep flying the aircraft to a safe altitude (I leveled off at 3500msl)
at a slow climb airspeed. Pull on full flaps and slow down to 5-10 kts
above your stall speed and then you can reach up and pull the canopy closed.
Have never done either one since {:>)
Ed Anderson
>
> Dan,
>
> A friend of mine took off in a 6a with the flaps full down and took a
> minute to figure out why it wouldn't accelerate and climb as well as it
> usually does. Alex is right. The airplane will tell you something's
> wrong. I bet you don't forget to raise them next time. I, I mean my
> friend didn't forget again. Same guy forgot to latch his oil filler door
> once, too.
>
> Check your canopy at least twice before you go too. That one wasn't my
> fault, though. The spring that holds the tip-up latch wasn't long enough
> and allowed the latch to come loose and the canopy to open in flight.
> That was about a week after we bought the plane. Made an impression on
> me. I was at OSH buying springs that night. I may forget to turn on my
> transponder every now and them, but I never forget to check the canopy.
>
> Ed Holyoke
>
> >
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Fiveonepw(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Flying with flaps down |
> This thread has reminded me of (snip)
>>>>>>>>>>>
Unfortunaltely it reminds me how often we never answer the original question-
which asked about flap damage experience flying above the white line--
If there is no obvious damage, skin wrinkles, hinge eyes broken, loose
hardware and the alignment of the TE looks original and they still operate as
before, I doubt you (er, he) hurt anything. If you're still concerned, I'd fess
up
to Vans techies and get their slant on it.
In your friends defense, if he had just loaded 200 lbs of fuel and was
departing a busy, possibly unfamiliar airport, watching traffic etc I could
understand, especially since 150 HP, FP RVs climb pretty darn good even with the
flaps
down (yes, I've done it too!<>!)
From The PossumWorks in TN
Mark
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Charlie England <ceengland(at)bellsouth.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Nutplate jigs |
Hopperdhh(at)aol.com wrote:
>
>Fellow nutplaters,
>
>Why doesn't Van punch these holes for us? I know he wants to make the
>airplanes easier and quicker to build. This would be something he could do that
>would save us all from needing a jig wouldn't it?
>
>Dan Hopper
>RV-7A
>N766DH (Flying 60+ hours)
>
Well Dan, you must have made your move too soon. ;-)
I thought about telling Mickey to do a kit upgrade instead of a tool
upgrade. My -7 tail & wings (bought in Apr. last year) have had all the
nutplate areas prepunched.
Charlie
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "LarryRobertHelming" <lhelming(at)sigecom.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Flying with flaps down |
>If there is no obvious damage, skin wrinkles, hinge eyes broken, loose
hardware and the alignment of the TE looks original and they still operate
as
before, I doubt you (er, he) hurt anything.
Well, maybe while in that configuration the plane did not run into
any wind gusts also. What if it had?
I agree, good question for Vans designers/engineers.
Indiana Larry
----- Original Message -----
From: <Fiveonepw(at)aol.com>
Subject: Re: RV-List: Flying with flaps down
>
>
> > This thread has reminded me of (snip)
>
> >>>>>>>>>>>
>
> Unfortunaltely it reminds me how often we never answer the original
question-
> which asked about flap damage experience flying above the white line--
>
> If there is no obvious damage, skin wrinkles, hinge eyes broken, loose
> hardware and the alignment of the TE looks original and they still operate
as
> before, I doubt you (er, he) hurt anything. If you're still concerned,
I'd fess up
> to Vans techies and get their slant on it.
>
> In your friends defense, if he had just loaded 200 lbs of fuel and was
> departing a busy, possibly unfamiliar airport, watching traffic etc I
could
> understand, especially since 150 HP, FP RVs climb pretty darn good even
with the flaps
> down (yes, I've done it too!<>!)
>
> From The PossumWorks in TN
> Mark
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Special N-Number reservation |
| From: | James H Nelson <rv9jim(at)juno.com> |
Bill,
I kept my reserved number for 5 years while I was building my
first plane. When I was close to finishing, and getting ready to do
weight and balance after painting, I sent in my request to officially
register the plane. That way I could put the numbers on the fuselage and
be ready for the DAR to sign off the plane so I could go fly it. Worked
out very nicely.
Jim Nelson
N599RV (reserved)
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Nutplate jigs |
Mickey,
I am useing the Avery nut plate jigs and I think that they are worth the
money. If you get back to Peachtree City come on by the hanger.
Paul LeDoux
RV-8
N9NM reserved
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Evan and Megan Johnson" <evmeg(at)snowcrest.net> |
If you are sure they are not aluminum then try to stick a magnet to
them....stainless wont stick to the magnet like regular mild steel.
Evan
----- Original Message -----
From: "steve zicree" <szicree(at)adelphia.net>
Subject: Re: RV-List: Hinges
>
> They don't look anything like the anodized ones I've worked with up til
now.
> They're also much thinner material, so they probably aren't any heavier.
Is
> there some easy way to tell the difference?
>
> Steve Zicree
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: <Vanremog(at)aol.com>
> To:
> Subject: Re: RV-List: Hinges
>
>
> >
> >
> > In a message dated 11/5/2004 7:18:32 PM Pacific Standard Time,
> > szicree(at)adelphia.net writes:
> >
> > Anyone know whether my gear leg fairing hinges are stainless? They're
> very
> > thin material and sure do look like stainless, but I'm not sure. Only
> reason I
> > care is I'd love to have one less thing to prime.
> >
> >
> > =========================================
> >
> > I can't imagine that they would be as stainless, as they would then be
> > approx. three times the weight of aluminum hinge of the same size. I
> believe
> > you'll find them to be anodized aluminum.
> >
> > GV (RV-6A N1GV O-360-A1A C/S, flying 725 hrs)
> >
> >
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jack Ford" <jackoford(at)theofficenet.com> |
Some stainless alloys are magnetic.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Evan and Megan Johnson" <evmeg(at)snowcrest.net>
Subject: Re: RV-List: Hinges
>
> If you are sure they are not aluminum then try to stick a magnet to
> them....stainless wont stick to the magnet like regular mild steel.
>
> Evan
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "steve zicree" <szicree(at)adelphia.net>
> To:
> Subject: Re: RV-List: Hinges
>
>
> >
> > They don't look anything like the anodized ones I've worked with up til
> now.
> > They're also much thinner material, so they probably aren't any heavier.
> Is
> > there some easy way to tell the difference?
> >
> > Steve Zicree
> >
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: <Vanremog(at)aol.com>
> > To:
> > Subject: Re: RV-List: Hinges
> >
> >
> > >
> > >
> > > In a message dated 11/5/2004 7:18:32 PM Pacific Standard Time,
> > > szicree(at)adelphia.net writes:
> > >
> > > Anyone know whether my gear leg fairing hinges are stainless? They're
> > very
> > > thin material and sure do look like stainless, but I'm not sure. Only
> > reason I
> > > care is I'd love to have one less thing to prime.
> > >
> > >
> > > =========================================
> > >
> > > I can't imagine that they would be as stainless, as they would then be
> > > approx. three times the weight of aluminum hinge of the same size. I
> > believe
> > > you'll find them to be anodized aluminum.
> > >
> > > GV (RV-6A N1GV O-360-A1A C/S, flying 725 hrs)
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Mickey Coggins <mick-matronics(at)rv8.ch> |
| Subject: | Re: Nutplate jigs |
Hi Charlie,
Is this true even on the wing roots? That's what I'm working
on right now. Also, I put nutplates in the floors, and the
baggage area, and there are a lot of them! Next will be wingtips.
Mickey
>I thought about telling Mickey to do a kit upgrade instead of a tool
>upgrade. My -7 tail & wings (bought in Apr. last year) have had all the
>nutplate areas prepunched.
--
Mickey Coggins
http://www.rv8.ch/
#82007 QB Wings/Fuselage
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "steve zicree" <szicree(at)adelphia.net> |
The material is only about .035 thick and looks like either alclad or
stainless. There's gotta be some easy way to find out which. Any
metalurgists out there?
Steve Zicree
----- Original Message -----
From: "Jack Ford" <jackoford(at)theofficenet.com>
Subject: Re: RV-List: Hinges
>
> Some stainless alloys are magnetic.
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Evan and Megan Johnson" <evmeg(at)snowcrest.net>
> To:
> Subject: Re: RV-List: Hinges
>
>
>
> >
> > If you are sure they are not aluminum then try to stick a magnet to
> > them....stainless wont stick to the magnet like regular mild steel.
> >
> > Evan
> >
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: "steve zicree" <szicree(at)adelphia.net>
> > To:
> > Subject: Re: RV-List: Hinges
> >
> >
> > >
> > > They don't look anything like the anodized ones I've worked with up
til
> > now.
> > > They're also much thinner material, so they probably aren't any
heavier.
> > Is
> > > there some easy way to tell the difference?
> > >
> > > Steve Zicree
> > >
> > > ----- Original Message -----
> > > From: <Vanremog(at)aol.com>
> > > To:
> > > Subject: Re: RV-List: Hinges
> > >
> > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > In a message dated 11/5/2004 7:18:32 PM Pacific Standard Time,
> > > > szicree(at)adelphia.net writes:
> > > >
> > > > Anyone know whether my gear leg fairing hinges are stainless?
They're
> > > very
> > > > thin material and sure do look like stainless, but I'm not sure.
Only
> > > reason I
> > > > care is I'd love to have one less thing to prime.
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > =========================================
> > > >
> > > > I can't imagine that they would be as stainless, as they would then
be
> > > > approx. three times the weight of aluminum hinge of the same size.
I
> > > believe
> > > > you'll find them to be anodized aluminum.
> > > >
> > > > GV (RV-6A N1GV O-360-A1A C/S, flying 725 hrs)
> > > >
> > > >
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
Oh, just run a small drill against it on the back side. You can tell right
away. If the drill starts to cut with light pressure, it's aluminum. If it
hardly makes a mark, it's probably stainless...
Kathleen Evans
www.rv7.us <http://www.rv7.us/>
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of steve zicree
Subject: Re: RV-List: Hinges
The material is only about .035 thick and looks like either alclad or
stainless. There's gotta be some easy way to find out which. Any
metalurgists out there?
Steve Zicree
----- Original Message -----
From: "Jack Ford" <jackoford(at)theofficenet.com>
Subject: Re: RV-List: Hinges
>
> Some stainless alloys are magnetic.
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Evan and Megan Johnson" <evmeg(at)snowcrest.net>
> To:
> Subject: Re: RV-List: Hinges
>
>
>
> >
> > If you are sure they are not aluminum then try to stick a magnet to
> > them....stainless wont stick to the magnet like regular mild steel.
> >
> > Evan
> >
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: "steve zicree" <szicree(at)adelphia.net>
> > To:
> > Subject: Re: RV-List: Hinges
> >
> >
> > >
> > > They don't look anything like the anodized ones I've worked with up
til
> > now.
> > > They're also much thinner material, so they probably aren't any
heavier.
> > Is
> > > there some easy way to tell the difference?
> > >
> > > Steve Zicree
> > >
> > > ----- Original Message -----
> > > From: <Vanremog(at)aol.com>
> > > To:
> > > Subject: Re: RV-List: Hinges
> > >
> > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > In a message dated 11/5/2004 7:18:32 PM Pacific Standard Time,
> > > > szicree(at)adelphia.net writes:
> > > >
> > > > Anyone know whether my gear leg fairing hinges are stainless?
They're
> > > very
> > > > thin material and sure do look like stainless, but I'm not sure.
Only
> > > reason I
> > > > care is I'd love to have one less thing to prime.
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > =========================================
> > > >
> > > > I can't imagine that they would be as stainless, as they would then
be
> > > > approx. three times the weight of aluminum hinge of the same size.
I
> > > believe
> > > > you'll find them to be anodized aluminum.
> > > >
> > > > GV (RV-6A N1GV O-360-A1A C/S, flying 725 hrs)
> > > >
> > > >
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
>
>
_-
_-
_-
_-
_-
_-
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Oldsfolks(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: > Re: Hinges |
A phone call or email to Van's will get a CORRECT answer !!!!!!
Bob Olds RV-4 , N1191X
A&P , EAA Tech. Counselor
Charleston,Arkansas
Real Aviators Fly Taildraggers
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Sam Buchanan <sbuc(at)hiwaay.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Special N-Number reservation |
Brian Kraut wrote:
>
> You can register the aircraft before it is complete, as a matter of fact,
> since they sometimes take a while to mail back the registration you normally
> register it before it is done so you have the paperwork back before the
> inspection. Until you get the inspection and have an airworthiness
> certificate it is a partially completed airplane anyway so they are all
> registered before they are complete.
>
> You will trigger the sales tax man in most states by the registration so
> that is a consideration if you won't be done for a while.
>
Triggering the tax man early in the project is a *good* thing! If you
wait until the plane is nearly complete before registering (and having
the FAA inform your state revenuers there is a rich aircraft owner in
their midst), and you have not paid any sales taxes on airframe, engine,
or components, you will incur penalties and interest for late payment of
taxes.
However, if you contact your state's tax offices early in the project,
you can pay sales tax as you go and avoid the penalties and interest.
This can be done whether registration has occurred or not.
Sam Buchanan
http://thervjournal.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Screwy fuel flow readings |
Listers, especially those with EIS engine monitors:
I'm almost ready for my first flight but have run into a glitch with my GRT
EIS fuel flow measurement system that has me temporarily stumped. I get a
normal zero flow indication with EIS power on (engine off) but it jumps to a
steady state of about 4.5 GPH as soon as I turn on the boost pump. There is no
fuel flowing at that point. When I start the engine the indication jumps to
upwards of 19 GPH at idle and as high as 38 GPH at 2000 RPM. This with an 0-360
BTW. For those of you who are EIS users, the correct scale factor of 200 has
been entered into the EIS.
My boost pump is separated from the flow sender by at least 30 inches of
tubing and the last 12 inches before the sender is a long smooth curve. I have
checked all connections, wiring, grounds, etc., and can find nothing wrong
there. Greg at GRT is on vacation but Sandy is sending me a loaner sending unit
to
try. In the meantime if anyone has had a similar experience or has any ideas
on this I'd sure appreciate hearing from them.
Harry Crosby
Pleasanton, California
RV-6, final details
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Jeff Point <jpoint(at)mindspring.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Screwy fuel flow readings |
Harry,
I had a bum sending unit to start with and they sent me a replacement.
Could have been a bad batch of them out there. I'd try that first.
Also, the scale factor recommended by them is a bit too high, I found.
After a lot of experimenting, I found that a setting of 170 (in other
words, 15% lower) is accurate. Also the flows will tend to read much
higher with the boost pump on. Try turning the pump off once the engine
is running and see what it does.
Jeff Point
RV-6
Milwaukee WI
>
>
October 29, 2004 - November 06, 2004
RV-Archive.digest.vol-pz