RV-Archive.digest.vol-vr
May 10, 2013 - August 31, 2013
--> RV-List message posted by: Matt Dralle
Well, its unbelievable, but I was cleaning the shop this morning and
accidentally pushed the bandsaw (on a rollaround) into the back of the fuselage
and put a scratch and dent into the Aft Top Skin. It wasn't yet riveted,
but I was all finished and dimpled. I guess at least it wasn't the side of
the fuselage where replacement would be nearly impossible. But still.
Waa.
Anyway, I went to order a replacement today and put in the part number
"F-825" (F-825-1) is on the plans. I got two hits back:
TOP SKIN, AFT
F-825-1
$126.40
TOP SKIN, AFT -8
F-825PP
$124.00
What's the difference? The PP suffix probably means "pre-punched", but I
think the F-825-1 is probably pre-punched as well.
My fuselage is late model, order last year in QB form.
Thanks,
Matt
-
Matt Dralle
RV-8 #82880 N998RV "Ruby Vixen"
http://www.mattsrv8.com - Matt's Complete RV-8 Construction Log
http://www.mattsrv8.com/Mishap - Landing Mishap Rebuild Log
http://www.youtube.com/MattsRV8 - Matt's RV-8 HDTV YouTube Channel
Status: 172+ Hours TTSN - Rebuilding Fuselage After Landing Mishap...
RV-6 #20916 N360EM "The Flyer"
http://www.mattsrv6.com - Matt's RV-6 Revitalization Log
Status: 150+ Hours Since Purchase - Upgrades Complete; Now In Full Flyer
Mode
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Which Prop Governor |
| From: | MLE <rv6awingman(at)gmail.com> |
When I completed my plane, I used a used Woodward Governor purchased from
someone on this list. It's not doing the job for me anymore, acts sluggish
and won't hold RPM like I believe it should. After researching overhaul
opportunities I've decided to purchase a new governor from Van's I don't
want start any discussion like "primer wars", but what are folks choosing
for Prop Governors if running a CS prop? Vans sells the MT and Hartzell
governors for almost the same money and I'm wondering how to choose between
them. I'm wondering if a Hartzell might be easier to service later if in
the USA but that shouldn't be the only criteria for choosing.
Marty RV-6A 240 hours and climbing.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Panama Red" <panamared505(at)brier.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Which Prop Governor |
I went with the MT 3 Blade prop with the MT aerobatic governor. This
governor works opposite of normal governors.
If using an MT prop, I would buy the MT governor. I have had good
service out of mine, rock solid rpm in aerobatic conditions. I can not
comment on Hartzell.
MT has a service center in Florida, I know they do prop rebuilds etc,
they should be able to rebuild the governor. But......you might check
out the MT website.
Bob
----- Original Message -----
From: MLE
To: Rv-List
Sent: Friday, May 10, 2013 3:14 PM
Subject: RV-List: Which Prop Governor
When I completed my plane, I used a used Woodward Governor purchased
from someone on this list. It's not doing the job for me anymore, acts
sluggish and won't hold RPM like I believe it should. After researching
overhaul opportunities I've decided to purchase a new governor from
Van's I don't want start any discussion like "primer wars", but what
are folks choosing for Prop Governors if running a CS prop? Vans sells
the MT and Hartzell governors for almost the same money and I'm
wondering how to choose between them. I'm wondering if a Hartzell might
be easier to service later if in the USA but that shouldn't be the only
criteria for choosing.
Marty RV-6A 240 hours and climbing.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Carl Froehlich" <carl.froehlich(at)verizon.net> |
| Subject: | Which Prop Governor |
I have a PCU5000 on the 8A and the 10. Both have performed flawlessly. I
was able to get both on separate group buys on VAF at a much reduced price.
Carl
From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of MLE
Sent: Friday, May 10, 2013 3:15 PM
Subject: RV-List: Which Prop Governor
When I completed my plane, I used a used Woodward Governor purchased from
someone on this list. It's not doing the job for me anymore, acts sluggish
and won't hold RPM like I believe it should. After researching overhaul
opportunities I've decided to purchase a new governor from Van's I don't
want start any discussion like "primer wars", but what are folks choosing
for Prop Governors if running a CS prop? Vans sells the MT and Hartzell
governors for almost the same money and I'm wondering how to choose between
them. I'm wondering if a Hartzell might be easier to service later if in
the USA but that shouldn't be the only criteria for choosing.
Marty RV-6A 240 hours and climbing.
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Which Prop Governor |
| From: | "dmaib(at)me.com" <dmaib(at)me.com> |
I got the PCU5000X during a group buy at VAF. Nearly 5 years and 650 hours later
it has been flawless controlling my MT 3 blade propeller.
--------
David Maib
RV-10 #40559
Transition Trainer
New Smyrna Beach, FL
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=400298#400298
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Which Prop Governor |
| From: | RV6 Flyer <rv6_flyer(at)hotmail.com> |
If you can get at PCU5000, I would recommend that governor.
Gary
Sent from my iPhone
On May 10, 2013, at 12:24 PM, "MLE" wrote:
> When I completed my plane, I used a used Woodward Governor purchased from s
omeone on this list. It's not doing the job for me anymore, acts sluggish a
nd won't hold RPM like I believe it should. After researching overhaul oppo
rtunities I've decided to purchase a new governor from Van's I don't want
start any discussion like "primer wars", but what are folks choosing for Pr
op Governors if running a CS prop? Vans sells the MT and Hartzell governor
s for almost the same money and I'm wondering how to choose between them. I
'm wondering if a Hartzell might be easier to service later if in the USA bu
t that shouldn't be the only criteria for choosing.
>
> Marty RV-6A 240 hours and climbing.
>
>
==========================
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>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Robin Marks <robin(at)PaintTheWeb.com> |
| Subject: | The Joys of Experimental Aircraft Ownership |
The reason I spend top dollar on a comfortable interior!
[https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-8jZ0_d4wPDQ/UZpgXJKtieI/AAAAAAAAFmA/7cq
sEpHmOuY/w656-h875-no/IMG_20130520_104123.jpg]
Robin
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Custom Wheel Chock Group Buy Opportunity |
| From: | Aircraft Specialty <aircraftspecialty(at)gmail.com> |
Hello Everyone.
We just wanted to thank everyone for the continued opportunity to earn your
business. We count many customers and friends among this group, and we
wanted to offer our first group buy opportunity.
We have been really busy over the last 6 months innovating and adding to
our product lineup. We thought it would be fun to offer a group buy on a
product that we all use on a daily basis when we fly. Our newest product
offering is custom wheel chocks. What makes ours stand out is that they are
made of aluminum, engraved all the way through for a permanent lasting
finish, and then powder coated for a very durable finish.
Our normal pricing is $99.95 for 2 sets of chocks (one set for each main
wheel)
We are offering the following group buy:
Qty 10 or more- $99.95 with free shipping (savings of $8.95)
Qty 20 or more- $94.95 with free shipping (savings of $13.95)
Qty 30 or more- $89.95 with free shipping (savings of $18.95)
Qty 40 or more- $84.95 with free shipping (savings of $23.95)
We are going to keep the opportunity open as long as possible in order to
get everyone the cheapest price possible. However, we definitely will have
these chocks done before Oshkosh, as it would be great to see a large
number of them up there with your airplanes.
If you are interested in this group buy, please put a +1 to this thread and
email us at steve(at)aircraftspecialty.com so I can put your name on our list
and get you set up.
Also, please check out our Instrument panel CNC cutting, Powdercoating and
engraving which is keeping us busy. Please contact us for more information.
We currently have a few projects under R and D, and plan on releasing more
information this fall. One of the items that we are bringing to market will
be really unique and we hope that it will be of great interest to the RV
community.
Safe flying, and thank you again.
Steve
www.aircraftspecialty.com
http://www.aircraftspecialty.com/wpimages/57e3ba3e5ee8.jpg
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Matt Dralle <dralle(at)matronics.com> |
| Subject: | Tail Wheel Upgrade Video... |
Dear Listers,
I upgraded the tail wheel assembly on The Flyer last weekend and installed a new
spring, fork, wheel, control arm, and upgraded to a single spring push rod,
replacing the original dual springs and chains. The original tail wheel appeared
to have been mis-drilled at a slight angle which caused the tire to wear at
an angle which could have also been caused by the single arm/axle arrangement
I suppose. In any case, steering The Flyer was somewhat of a suggestion rather
than a positive decision so I decided to upgrade the whole thing. Once I
got in and started looking at what I had to do, it became obvious that I was going
to have to remove the horizontal and vertical stabilizers to be able to have
the access I needed to drill the hole for the replacement tail spring. Nothing
is easy, it seems. Anyway, the installation came out great, and I can't
believe how much BETTER the plane steers with the semi-ridge control rod! Wow!
Amazing. I also like the looks of the traditional Van's fork and the tail
rides a little bit lower now giving the plane a bit more rake which I like too.
Here is a video I made of the installation. I used a mix of time-lapse stills
from the hangar security cams along with some high resolution stills from my Nikon
D300. The video was really more of an exercise in honing my Adobe Premier
Pro video editing skills, but it came out pretty cool! Check it out!
Be sure to select a high-resolution such as 720p or 1080p and click the full-screen
view to be able to see the detail in the time-lapse photos.
http://youtu.be/H-wHdtxNX_U
-
Matt Dralle
RV-8 #82880 N998RV "Ruby Vixen"
http://www.mattsrv8.com - Matt's Complete RV-8 Construction Log
http://www.mattsrv8.com/Mishap - Landing Mishap Rebuild Log
http://www.youtube.com/MattsRV8 - Matt's RV-8 HDTV YouTube Channel
Status: 172+ Hours TTSN - Rebuilding Fuselage After Landing Mishap...
RV-6 #20916 N360EM "The Flyer"
http://www.mattsrv6.com - Matt's RV-6 Revitalization Log
Status: 150+ Hours Since Purchase - Upgrades Complete; Now In Full Flyer Mode
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Tail Wheel Upgrade Video... |
| From: | "Scot" <1975jsa(at)gmail.com> |
Nice video. I think I spent more time checking out your hanger. My t-hanger does
not have the upgrades you have done to yours.
Scott
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=401468#401468
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Tail Wheel Upgrade Video... |
| From: | "Matt Dralle" <dralle(at)matronics.com> |
Yeah, it's my little home away from home! :-) The only thing I wish it had was
a heater and an air conditioner.
Matt
Scot wrote:
> Nice video. I think I spent more time checking out your hanger. My t-hanger
does not have the upgrades you have done to yours.
>
> Scott
--------
Matt Dralle
Matronics Email List Administrator
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=401486#401486
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Tail Wheel Upgrade Video... |
I'll second the air conditioner. Gets a little warm at LVK on summer
afternoons. I bought an evaporative cooler that helps considerably. Nice
video.
Regards,
Michael Wynn
In a message dated 5/28/2013 11:53:33 A.M. Pacific Daylight Time,
dralle(at)matronics.com writes:
--> RV-List message posted by: "Matt Dralle"
Yeah, it's my little home away from home! :-) The only thing I wish it
had was a heater and an air conditioner.
Matt
Scot wrote:
> Nice video. I think I spent more time checking out your hanger. My
t-hanger does not have the upgrades you have done to yours.
>
> Scott
--------
Matt Dralle
Matronics Email List Administrator
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=401486#401486
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Matt Dralle <dralle(at)matronics.com> |
>At 12:01 PM 5/28/2013 Tuesday, you wrote:
>I'll second the air conditioner. Gets a little warm at LVK on summer afternoons.
I bought an evaporative cooler that helps considerably. Nice video.
>
>Regards,
>
>Michael Wynn
Hey Michael,
How'd your canopy turn out? I'm on my second try now on the rebuild. I think
this one might be the one. I drilled the mounting holes #36 then tapped for #6
screws. I like to be able to remove the skirts well into the process and using
screws instead of rivets seems to work out a lot better. On Ruby 1.0 I used
those Rivnuts which worked well. But, they are very large and its hard to
properly fit the plexiglass because they protrude by 1/16" and you can't put them
in until after the fitting is done - a Catch 22 of sorts. I'm hoping that
tapping the frame will work. The frame metal is fairly thick and really hard
so it would seem that tapping might work really well. You don't want to over
tighten the screws because of the plexi anyway, so you don't need much to hold
the screw. Today I enlarge the holes in the plexi from #40 to about 3/16" then
try out my tapping/screw idea. Wish me luck!
-
Matt Dralle
RV-8 #82880 N998RV "Ruby Vixen"
http://www.mattsrv8.com - Matt's Complete RV-8 Construction Log
http://www.mattsrv8.com/Mishap - Landing Mishap Rebuild Log
http://www.youtube.com/MattsRV8 - Matt's RV-8 HDTV YouTube Channel
Status: 172+ Hours TTSN - Rebuilding Fuselage After Landing Mishap...
RV-6 #20916 N360EM "The Flyer"
http://www.mattsrv6.com - Matt's RV-6 Revitalization Log
Status: 150+ Hours Since Purchase - Upgrades Complete; Now In Full Flyer Mode
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Christopher Cee Stone <rv8iator(at)gmail.com> |
Matt et al...
I see from your log photos that you cut the forward top skin back to flush
with the support brackets that attach to the windshield frame. I was
considering doing the same since the canopy frame does not really fit under
the skin. Further the fibre glass fabricated faring will cover this gap
between canopy fairing and forward top skin. Am I missing something here?
WRT your tapping the canopy frame for 6-32 screws... are clecos not
sufficient to hold things together during fitting?
You builders log has been a great reference... Even though this is my
second RV-8 with a couple of years in between builds the minds eye flickers
and doesn't always present a clear mental picture as to the "best way".
Thanks!
Chris Stone
Newberg, OR
On Wed, May 29, 2013 at 10:06 AM, Matt Dralle wrote:
>
>
> >At 12:01 PM 5/28/2013 Tuesday, you wrote:
> >I'll second the air conditioner. Gets a little warm at LVK on summer
> afternoons. I bought an evaporative cooler that helps considerably. Nice
> video.
> >
> >Regards,
> >
> >Michael Wynn
>
>
> Hey Michael,
>
> How'd your canopy turn out? I'm on my second try now on the rebuild. I
> think this one might be the one. I drilled the mounting holes #36 then
> tapped for #6 screws. I like to be able to remove the skirts well into the
> process and using screws instead of rivets seems to work out a lot better.
> On Ruby 1.0 I used those Rivnuts which worked well. But, they are very
> large and its hard to properly fit the plexiglass because they protrude by
> 1/16" and you can't put them in until after the fitting is done - a Catch
> 22 of sorts. I'm hoping that tapping the frame will work. The frame metal
> is fairly thick and really hard so it would seem that tapping might work
> really well. You don't want to over tighten the screws because of the
> plexi anyway, so you don't need much to hold the screw. Today I enlarge
> the holes in the plexi from #40 to about 3/16" then try out my
> tapping/screw idea. Wish me luck!
>
>
> -
> Matt Dralle
>
> RV-8 #82880 N998RV "Ruby Vixen"
> http://www.mattsrv8.com - Matt's Complete RV-8 Construction Log
> http://www.mattsrv8.com/Mishap - Landing Mishap Rebuild Log
> http://www.youtube.com/MattsRV8 - Matt's RV-8 HDTV YouTube Channel
> Status: 172+ Hours TTSN - Rebuilding Fuselage After Landing Mishap...
>
> RV-6 #20916 N360EM "The Flyer"
> http://www.mattsrv6.com - Matt's RV-6 Revitalization Log
> Status: 150+ Hours Since Purchase - Upgrades Complete; Now In Full Flyer
> Mode
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Linn <flying-nut(at)cfl.rr.com> |
Once you get everything drilled and tapped use your step drill to
enlarge the holes in the plexi to give it ample room to flex. I'd use
pan-head screws with the nylon washers underneath.
Linn
PS .... Good Luck!!! :-)
On 5/29/2013 1:06 PM, Matt Dralle wrote:
>
>
>> At 12:01 PM 5/28/2013 Tuesday, you wrote:
>> I'll second the air conditioner. Gets a little warm at LVK on summer afternoons.
I bought an evaporative cooler that helps considerably. Nice video.
>>
>> Regards,
>>
>> Michael Wynn
>
> Hey Michael,
>
> How'd your canopy turn out? I'm on my second try now on the rebuild. I think
this one might be the one. I drilled the mounting holes #36 then tapped for
#6 screws. I like to be able to remove the skirts well into the process and
using screws instead of rivets seems to work out a lot better. On Ruby 1.0 I
used those Rivnuts which worked well. But, they are very large and its hard to
properly fit the plexiglass because they protrude by 1/16" and you can't put
them in until after the fitting is done - a Catch 22 of sorts. I'm hoping that
tapping the frame will work. The frame metal is fairly thick and really hard
so it would seem that tapping might work really well. You don't want to over
tighten the screws because of the plexi anyway, so you don't need much to hold
the screw. Today I enlarge the holes in the plexi from #40 to about 3/16"
then try out my tapping/screw idea. Wish me luck!
>
>
> -
> Matt Dralle
>
> RV-8 #82880 N998RV "Ruby Vixen"
> http://www.mattsrv8.com - Matt's Complete RV-8 Construction Log
> http://www.mattsrv8.com/Mishap - Landing Mishap Rebuild Log
> http://www.youtube.com/MattsRV8 - Matt's RV-8 HDTV YouTube Channel
> Status: 172+ Hours TTSN - Rebuilding Fuselage After Landing Mishap...
>
> RV-6 #20916 N360EM "The Flyer"
> http://www.mattsrv6.com - Matt's RV-6 Revitalization Log
> Status: 150+ Hours Since Purchase - Upgrades Complete; Now In Full Flyer Mode
>
>
> -----
> No virus found in this message.
> Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Michael Kraus <n223rv(at)wolflakeairport.net> |
And remember to not use loc-tite on the screws!! It'll eat your canopy!!
-Mike Kraus
RV-4 sold :-(
RV-10 flying :-)
KitFox SS7 Radial building :-)
On May 29, 2013, at 3:32 PM, Linn wrote:
>
> Once you get everything drilled and tapped use your step drill to enlarge the
holes in the plexi to give it ample room to flex. I'd use pan-head screws with
the nylon washers underneath.
> Linn
> PS .... Good Luck!!! :-)
>
> On 5/29/2013 1:06 PM, Matt Dralle wrote:
>>
>>
>>> At 12:01 PM 5/28/2013 Tuesday, you wrote:
>>> I'll second the air conditioner. Gets a little warm at LVK on summer afternoons.
I bought an evaporative cooler that helps considerably. Nice video.
>>>
>>> Regards,
>>>
>>> Michael Wynn
>>
>> Hey Michael,
>>
>> How'd your canopy turn out? I'm on my second try now on the rebuild. I think
this one might be the one. I drilled the mounting holes #36 then tapped for
#6 screws. I like to be able to remove the skirts well into the process and
using screws instead of rivets seems to work out a lot better. On Ruby 1.0 I
used those Rivnuts which worked well. But, they are very large and its hard
to properly fit the plexiglass because they protrude by 1/16" and you can't put
them in until after the fitting is done - a Catch 22 of sorts. I'm hoping that
tapping the frame will work. The frame metal is fairly thick and really hard
so it would seem that tapping might work really well. You don't want to over
tighten the screws because of the plexi anyway, so you don't need much to
hold the screw. Today I enlarge the holes in the plexi from #40 to about 3/16"
then try out my tapping/screw idea. Wish me luck!
>>
>>
>> -
>> Matt Dralle
>>
>> RV-8 #82880 N998RV "Ruby Vixen"
>> http://www.mattsrv8.com - Matt's Complete RV-8 Construction Log
>> http://www.mattsrv8.com/Mishap - Landing Mishap Rebuild Log
>> http://www.youtube.com/MattsRV8 - Matt's RV-8 HDTV YouTube Channel
>> Status: 172+ Hours TTSN - Rebuilding Fuselage After Landing Mishap...
>>
>> RV-6 #20916 N360EM "The Flyer"
>> http://www.mattsrv6.com - Matt's RV-6 Revitalization Log
>> Status: 150+ Hours Since Purchase - Upgrades Complete; Now In Full Flyer Mode
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> -----
>> No virus found in this message.
>> Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "bigdog(at)bentwing.com" <bigdog(at)bentwing.com> |
I used the screws on my RV-6 canopy and was really happy with the way they worked
out. I don't recall how big the holes were but they were big enough to use
Tinnerman washers across the front bow. I dimpled the skirts and let that serve
as the "washer" so I had countersunk screws all around. The canopy survived
a crash and a round trip on a trailer to the salvage yard. I'd say it's pretty
robust. It's going on the new RV with just a new skirt on one side.
Regards,
Greg Young
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Matt Dralle
Sent: Wednesday, May 29, 2013 12:06 PM
Subject: RV-List: Re: RV-8 Canopy
>At 12:01 PM 5/28/2013 Tuesday, you wrote:
>I'll second the air conditioner. Gets a little warm at LVK on summer afternoons.
I bought an evaporative cooler that helps considerably. Nice video.
>
>Regards,
>
>Michael Wynn
Hey Michael,
How'd your canopy turn out? I'm on my second try now on the rebuild. I think
this one might be the one. I drilled the mounting holes #36 then tapped for #6
screws. I like to be able to remove the skirts well into the process and using
screws instead of rivets seems to work out a lot better. On Ruby 1.0 I used
those Rivnuts which worked well. But, they are very large and its hard to
properly fit the plexiglass because they protrude by 1/16" and you can't put them
in until after the fitting is done - a Catch 22 of sorts. I'm hoping that
tapping the frame will work. The frame metal is fairly thick and really hard
so it would seem that tapping might work really well. You don't want to over
tighten the screws because of the plexi anyway, so you don't need much to hold
the screw. Today I enlarge the holes in the plexi from #40 to about 3/16" then
try out my tapping/screw idea. Wish me luck!
-
Matt Dralle
RV-8 #82880 N998RV "Ruby Vixen"
http://www.mattsrv8.com - Matt's Complete RV-8 Construction Log http://www.mattsrv8.com/Mishap - Landing Mishap Rebuild Log
http://www.youtube.com/MattsRV8 - Matt's RV-8 HDTV YouTube Channel
Status: 172+ Hours TTSN - Rebuilding Fuselage After Landing Mishap...
RV-6 #20916 N360EM "The Flyer"
http://www.mattsrv6.com - Matt's RV-6 Revitalization Log
Status: 150+ Hours Since Purchase - Upgrades Complete; Now In Full Flyer Mode
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Matt Dralle <dralle(at)matronics.com> |
At 10:06 AM 5/29/2013 Wednesday, you wrote:
>
>How'd your canopy turn out? I'm on my second try now on the rebuild. I think
this one might be the one. I drilled the mounting holes #36 then tapped for
#6 screws. I like to be able to remove the skirts well into the process and using
screws instead of rivets seems to work out a lot better. On Ruby 1.0 I used
those Rivnuts which worked well. But, they are very large and its hard to
properly fit the plexiglass because they protrude by 1/16" and you can't put
them in until after the fitting is done - a Catch 22 of sorts. I'm hoping that
tapping the frame will work. The frame metal is fairly thick and really hard
so it would seem that tapping might work really well. You don't want to over
tighten the screws because of the plexi anyway, so you don't need much to hold
the screw. Today I enlarge the holes in the plexi from #40 to about 3/16"
then try out my tapping/screw idea. Wish me luck!
>
>-
>Matt Dralle
Yahoo! I'm elated to report that the Canopy 2.0 on Ruby 2.0 came out nearly perfect!
I'm happy to report that the #6 tapping and screws works GREAT! Van's
should recommend this as the standard installation. The best part is that you
can "retap" the holes slightly to make sure that the flush-head of the screw
perfectly aligns with the varying contours of the Plexiglass as you work around
from the front to the back. Amazing! The screws seem to have plenty of bite
into the steel frame and considering you don't want to ever over tighten them
anyway for fear of cracking the Plexiglass, there shouldn't be any problem
with the threads holding up. Attached are a few pictures.
-
Matt Dralle
RV-8 #82880 N998RV "Ruby Vixen"
http://www.mattsrv8.com - Matt's Complete RV-8 Construction Log
http://www.mattsrv8.com/Mishap - Landing Mishap Rebuild Log
http://www.youtube.com/MattsRV8 - Matt's RV-8 HDTV YouTube Channel
Status: 172+ Hours TTSN - Rebuilding Fuselage After Landing Mishap...
RV-6 #20916 N360EM "The Flyer"
http://www.mattsrv6.com - Matt's RV-6 Revitalization Log
Status: 150+ Hours Since Purchase - Upgrades Complete; Now In Full Flyer Mode
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Charlie England <ceengland7(at)gmail.com> |
Hi Matt,
I haven't followed this thread closely, so ignore this if it's been
covered. There is always the Sikaflex option. No holes at all, & no risk
of plexi cracks. There's a fairly long history now of RV-s flying with
Sika'd canopies, with very good results.
Charlie
On 05/29/2013 04:13 PM, bigdog(at)bentwing.com wrote:
>
> I used the screws on my RV-6 canopy and was really happy with the way they worked
out. I don't recall how big the holes were but they were big enough to use
Tinnerman washers across the front bow. I dimpled the skirts and let that serve
as the "washer" so I had countersunk screws all around. The canopy survived
a crash and a round trip on a trailer to the salvage yard. I'd say it's pretty
robust. It's going on the new RV with just a new skirt on one side.
>
> Regards,
> Greg Young
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Matt Dralle
> Sent: Wednesday, May 29, 2013 12:06 PM
> To: rv-list(at)matronics.com; rv8-list(at)matronics.com
> Subject: RV-List: Re: RV-8 Canopy
>
>
>> At 12:01 PM 5/28/2013 Tuesday, you wrote:
>> I'll second the air conditioner. Gets a little warm at LVK on summer afternoons.
I bought an evaporative cooler that helps considerably. Nice video.
>>
>> Regards,
>>
>> Michael Wynn
>
> Hey Michael,
>
> How'd your canopy turn out? I'm on my second try now on the rebuild. I think
this one might be the one. I drilled the mounting holes #36 then tapped for
#6 screws. I like to be able to remove the skirts well into the process and
using screws instead of rivets seems to work out a lot better. On Ruby 1.0 I
used those Rivnuts which worked well. But, they are very large and its hard to
properly fit the plexiglass because they protrude by 1/16" and you can't put
them in until after the fitting is done - a Catch 22 of sorts. I'm hoping that
tapping the frame will work. The frame metal is fairly thick and really hard
so it would seem that tapping might work really well. You don't want to over
tighten the screws because of the plexi anyway, so you don't need much to hold
the screw. Today I enlarge the holes in the plexi from #40 to about 3/16"
then try out my tapping/screw idea. Wish me luck!
>
>
> -
> Matt Dralle
>
> RV-8 #82880 N998RV "Ruby Vixen"
> http://www.mattsrv8.com - Matt's Complete RV-8 Construction Log http://www.mattsrv8.com/Mishap - Landing Mishap Rebuild Log
> http://www.youtube.com/MattsRV8 - Matt's RV-8 HDTV YouTube Channel
> Status: 172+ Hours TTSN - Rebuilding Fuselage After Landing Mishap...
>
> RV-6 #20916 N360EM "The Flyer"
> http://www.mattsrv6.com - Matt's RV-6 Revitalization Log
> Status: 150+ Hours Since Purchase - Upgrades Complete; Now In Full Flyer Mode
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Vincent Himsl <vshimsl(at)live.com> |
I used special pointed tipped plexiglass drill bits from Avery Tools. Didn't
see that mentioned. I suppose you could grind the ends of conventional drill
bits to a sharp point.
<http://www.averytools.com/prodinfo.asp?number=11080> PLAS-DRILL KIT FOR
DRILLING
Vince Himsl
RV8432 150 hours. SB traditional paint scheme (primer and metal), Idaho back
country ready...ehr no wheel pants.
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Matt Dralle
Sent: Wednesday, May 29, 2013 10:06 AM
Subject: RV-List: Re: RV-8 Canopy
dralle(at)matronics.com>
>At 12:01 PM 5/28/2013 Tuesday, you wrote:
>I'll second the air conditioner. Gets a little warm at LVK on summer
afternoons. I bought an evaporative cooler that helps considerably. Nice
video.
>
>Regards,
>
>Michael Wynn
Hey Michael,
How'd your canopy turn out? I'm on my second try now on the rebuild. I
think this one might be the one. I drilled the mounting holes #36 then
tapped for #6 screws. I like to be able to remove the skirts well into the
process and using screws instead of rivets seems to work out a lot better.
On Ruby 1.0 I used those Rivnuts which worked well. But, they are very
large and its hard to properly fit the plexiglass because they protrude by
1/16" and you can't put them in until after the fitting is done - a Catch 22
of sorts. I'm hoping that tapping the frame will work. The frame metal is
fairly thick and really hard so it would seem that tapping might work really
well. You don't want to over tighten the screws because of the plexi
anyway, so you don't need much to hold the screw. Today I enlarge the holes
in the plexi from #40 to about 3/16" then try out my tapping/screw idea.
Wish me luck!
-
Matt Dralle
RV-8 #82880 N998RV "Ruby Vixen"
<http://www.mattsrv8.com> http://www.mattsrv8.com - Matt's Complete RV-8
Construction Log <http://www.mattsrv8.com/Mishap>
http://www.mattsrv8.com/Mishap - Landing Mishap Rebuild Log
<http://www.youtube.com/MattsRV8> http://www.youtube.com/MattsRV8 - Matt's
RV-8 HDTV YouTube Channel
Status: 172+ Hours TTSN - Rebuilding Fuselage After Landing Mishap...
RV-6 #20916 N360EM "The Flyer"
<http://www.mattsrv6.com> http://www.mattsrv6.com - Matt's RV-6
Revitalization Log
Status: 150+ Hours Since Purchase - Upgrades Complete; Now In Full Flyer
Mode
http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV-List
http://www.matronics.com/contribution
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Linn <flying-nut(at)cfl.rr.com> |
Charlie, which Sikaflex is recommended???
Linn
On 5/29/2013 6:49 PM, Charlie England wrote:
>
> Hi Matt,
>
> I haven't followed this thread closely, so ignore this if it's been
> covered. There is always the Sikaflex option. No holes at all, & no
> risk of plexi cracks. There's a fairly long history now of RV-s flying
> with Sika'd canopies, with very good results.
>
> Charlie
>
>
> On 05/29/2013 04:13 PM, bigdog(at)bentwing.com wrote:
>>
>>
>> I used the screws on my RV-6 canopy and was really happy with the way
>> they worked out. I don't recall how big the holes were but they were
>> big enough to use Tinnerman washers across the front bow. I dimpled
>> the skirts and let that serve as the "washer" so I had countersunk
>> screws all around. The canopy survived a crash and a round trip on a
>> trailer to the salvage yard. I'd say it's pretty robust. It's going
>> on the new RV with just a new skirt on one side.
>>
>> Regards,
>> Greg Young
>>
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
>> [mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Matt Dralle
>> Sent: Wednesday, May 29, 2013 12:06 PM
>> To: rv-list(at)matronics.com; rv8-list(at)matronics.com
>> Subject: RV-List: Re: RV-8 Canopy
>>
>>
>>
>>> At 12:01 PM 5/28/2013 Tuesday, you wrote:
>>> I'll second the air conditioner. Gets a little warm at LVK on
>>> summer afternoons. I bought an evaporative cooler that helps
>>> considerably. Nice video.
>>>
>>> Regards,
>>>
>>> Michael Wynn
>>
>> Hey Michael,
>>
>> How'd your canopy turn out? I'm on my second try now on the
>> rebuild. I think this one might be the one. I drilled the mounting
>> holes #36 then tapped for #6 screws. I like to be able to remove the
>> skirts well into the process and using screws instead of rivets seems
>> to work out a lot better. On Ruby 1.0 I used those Rivnuts which
>> worked well. But, they are very large and its hard to properly fit
>> the plexiglass because they protrude by 1/16" and you can't put them
>> in until after the fitting is done - a Catch 22 of sorts. I'm hoping
>> that tapping the frame will work. The frame metal is fairly thick
>> and really hard so it would seem that tapping might work really
>> well. You don't want to over tighten the screws because of the plexi
>> anyway, so you don't need much to hold the screw. Today I enlarge
>> the holes in the plexi from #40 to about 3/16" then try out my
>> tapping/screw idea. Wish me luck!
>>
>>
>> -
>> Matt Dralle
>>
>> RV-8 #82880 N998RV "Ruby Vixen"
>> http://www.mattsrv8.com - Matt's Complete RV-8 Construction Log
>> http://www.mattsrv8.com/Mishap - Landing Mishap Rebuild Log
>> http://www.youtube.com/MattsRV8 - Matt's RV-8 HDTV YouTube Channel
>> Status: 172+ Hours TTSN - Rebuilding Fuselage After Landing Mishap...
>>
>> RV-6 #20916 N360EM "The Flyer"
>> http://www.mattsrv6.com - Matt's RV-6 Revitalization Log
>> Status: 150+ Hours Since Purchase - Upgrades Complete; Now In Full
>> Flyer Mode
>>
>
>
> -----
> No virus found in this message.
> Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Matt Dralle <dralle(at)matronics.com> |
Yes, I did in fact use these very drill bits from Avery to enlarge the holes in
the Plexiglass from #40 up to 3/16" for the #6 screw. They work great! Also,
I strongly recommend putting a piece of wood behind the Plexiglass with a ClecoClamp
before drilling. Didn't have a single problem with any of the holes;
and I've got a couple that are a little close to the edge. By the way, the 3/16"
hole for a #6 may seem like a lot, but the swimming room greatly reduces
the stress on the Plexiglass by any given screw. Consider also that most all
of the screw holes are sandwiched between the tube and the fiberglass skirt, so
all you really need is the clamping action (and just a little shear action).
Matt Dralle
RV-8 #82880 N998RV "Ruby Vixen"
http://www.mattsrv8.com - Matt's Complete RV-8 Construction Log
http://www.mattsrv8.com/Mishap - Landing Mishap Rebuild Log
http://www.youtube.com/MattsRV8 - Matt's RV-8 HDTV YouTube Channel
Status: 172+ Hours TTSN - Rebuilding Fuselage After Landing Mishap...
RV-6 #20916 N360EM "The Flyer"
http://www.mattsrv6.com - Matt's RV-6 Revitalization Log
Status: 150+ Hours Since Purchase - Upgrades Complete; Now In Full Flyer Mode
At 04:18 PM 5/29/2013 Wednesday, Vincent Himsl wrote:
>I used special pointed tipped plexiglass drill bits from Avery Tools. Didn't see
that mentioned. I suppose you could grind the ends of conventional drill bits
to a sharp point.
><http://www.averytools.com/prodinfo.asp?number=11080>
>PLAS-DRILL KIT FOR DRILLING
>
>
>Vince Himsl
>RV8432 150 hours. SB traditional paint scheme (primer and metal), Idaho back country
ready...ehr no wheel pants.
>
>-----Original Message-----
>From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Matt Dralle
>Sent: Wednesday, May 29, 2013 10:06 AM
>To: rv-list(at)matronics.com; rv8-list(at)matronics.com
>Subject: RV-List: Re: RV-8 Canopy
>
>
>
>>At 12:01 PM 5/28/2013 Tuesday, you wrote:
>>I'll second the air conditioner. Gets a little warm at LVK on summer afternoons.
I bought an evaporative cooler that helps considerably. Nice video.
>>
>>Regards,
>>
>>Michael Wynn
>
>
>Hey Michael,
>
>How'd your canopy turn out? I'm on my second try now on the rebuild. I think
this one might be the one. I drilled the mounting holes #36 then tapped for
#6 screws. I like to be able to remove the skirts well into the process and using
screws instead of rivets seems to work out a lot better. On Ruby 1.0 I used
those Rivnuts which worked well. But, they are very large and its hard to
properly fit the plexiglass because they protrude by 1/16" and you can't put
them in until after the fitting is done - a Catch 22 of sorts. I'm hoping that
tapping the frame will work. The frame metal is fairly thick and really hard
so it would seem that tapping might work really well. You don't want to over
tighten the screws because of the plexi anyway, so you don't need much to hold
the screw. Today I enlarge the holes in the plexi from #40 to about 3/16"
then try out my tapping/screw idea. Wish me luck!
>
>Matt Dralle
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Matt Dralle <dralle(at)matronics.com> |
Yes, I did in fact use these very drill bits from Avery to enlarge the holes in
the Plexiglass from #40 up to 3/16" for the #6 screw. They work great! Also,
I strongly recommend putting a piece of wood behind the Plexiglass with a ClecoClamp
before drilling. Didn't have a single problem with any of the holes;
and I've got a couple that are a little close to the edge. By the way, the 3/16"
hole for a #6 may seem like a lot, but the swimming room greatly reduces
the stress on the Plexiglass by any given screw. Consider also that most all
of the screw holes are sandwiched between the tube and the fiberglass skirt, so
all you really need is the clamping action (and just a little shear action).
Matt Dralle
RV-8 #82880 N998RV "Ruby Vixen"
http://www.mattsrv8.com - Matt's Complete RV-8 Construction Log
http://www.mattsrv8.com/Mishap - Landing Mishap Rebuild Log
http://www.youtube.com/MattsRV8 - Matt's RV-8 HDTV YouTube Channel
Status: 172+ Hours TTSN - Rebuilding Fuselage After Landing Mishap...
RV-6 #20916 N360EM "The Flyer"
http://www.mattsrv6.com - Matt's RV-6 Revitalization Log
Status: 150+ Hours Since Purchase - Upgrades Complete; Now In Full Flyer Mode
At 04:18 PM 5/29/2013 Wednesday, Vincent Himsl wrote:
>I used special pointed tipped plexiglass drill bits from Avery Tools. Didn't see
that mentioned. I suppose you could grind the ends of conventional drill bits
to a sharp point.
><http://www.averytools.com/prodinfo.asp?number=11080>
>PLAS-DRILL KIT FOR DRILLING
>
>
>Vince Himsl
>RV8432 150 hours. SB traditional paint scheme (primer and metal), Idaho back country
ready...ehr no wheel pants.
>
>-----Original Message-----
>From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Matt Dralle
>Sent: Wednesday, May 29, 2013 10:06 AM
>To: rv-list(at)matronics.com; rv8-list(at)matronics.com
>Subject: RV-List: Re: RV-8 Canopy
>
>
>
>>At 12:01 PM 5/28/2013 Tuesday, you wrote:
>>I'll second the air conditioner. Gets a little warm at LVK on summer afternoons.
I bought an evaporative cooler that helps considerably. Nice video.
>>
>>Regards,
>>
>>Michael Wynn
>
>
>Hey Michael,
>
>How'd your canopy turn out? I'm on my second try now on the rebuild. I think
this one might be the one. I drilled the mounting holes #36 then tapped for
#6 screws. I like to be able to remove the skirts well into the process and using
screws instead of rivets seems to work out a lot better. On Ruby 1.0 I used
those Rivnuts which worked well. But, they are very large and its hard to
properly fit the plexiglass because they protrude by 1/16" and you can't put
them in until after the fitting is done - a Catch 22 of sorts. I'm hoping that
tapping the frame will work. The frame metal is fairly thick and really hard
so it would seem that tapping might work really well. You don't want to over
tighten the screws because of the plexi anyway, so you don't need much to hold
the screw. Today I enlarge the holes in the plexi from #40 to about 3/16"
then try out my tapping/screw idea. Wish me luck!
>
>Matt Dralle
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Linn <flying-nut(at)cfl.rr.com> |
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Matt Dralle <dralle(at)matronics.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Re: RV-8 Canopy |
I definitely did consider the very elegant solution of bonding the canopy to the
frame. It would certainly reduce the stress factor. For me, however, it presents
a couple of problems. One, I like to be able to remove the skirts well
after the initial flight for adding dampening and antiskuff material in just
the right places. I had the skirts off at least three times after my first flight.
The other issue with bonding for me is the painting process. I like to
powder coat the frame, then match spray the insides of the skirts, then add labeling.
For maximum flexibility, having everything simply screwed together really
allows for a high-quality assembly and painting process. Attached are a
few pictures from Ruby 1.0's canopy installation to give an idea what I'm talking
about.
-
Matt Dralle
RV-8 #82880 N998RV "Ruby Vixen"
http://www.mattsrv8.com - Matt's Complete RV-8 Construction Log
http://www.mattsrv8.com/Mishap - Landing Mishap Rebuild Log
http://www.youtube.com/MattsRV8 - Matt's RV-8 HDTV YouTube Channel
Status: 172+ Hours TTSN - Rebuilding Fuselage After Landing Mishap...
RV-6 #20916 N360EM "The Flyer"
http://www.mattsrv6.com - Matt's RV-6 Revitalization Log
Status: 150+ Hours Since Purchase - Upgrades Complete; Now In Full Flyer Mode
At 03:49 PM 5/29/2013 Wednesday, you wrote:
>
>Hi Matt,
>
>I haven't followed this thread closely, so ignore this if it's been covered. There
is always the Sikaflex option. No holes at all, & no risk of plexi cracks.
There's a fairly long history now of RV-s flying with Sika'd canopies, with
very good results.
>
>Charlie
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Robin Marks <robin(at)PaintTheWeb.com> |
The short answer is Yes. After having a -4 Canopy crack while in the hands
of a ferry pilot (whoops) and seeing what it takes to replace a canopy on a
flying RV my next canopy was going to avoid drilling holes at all cost. He
re is my bonded 8A canopy. I got much help on this as I didn't want to it g
oof up.
Sorry I don't have a lot of detail on the process.
Robin
[cid:142292c5-02a5-447b-b8f6-bc6f9924c215]
[cid:a03f64c8-529c-4207-8897-71a66303caae]
One day it will look like this:
[cid:ba9b3118-777b-4112-a1e4-c3ff14200a11]
________________________________________
From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com [owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.co
m] on behalf of Charlie England [ceengland7(at)gmail.com]
Sent: Wednesday, May 29, 2013 3:49 PM
Subject: Re: RV-List: Re: RV-8 Canopy
Hi Matt,
I haven't followed this thread closely, so ignore this if it's been
covered. There is always the Sikaflex option. No holes at all, & no risk
of plexi cracks. There's a fairly long history now of RV-s flying with
Sika'd canopies, with very good results.
Charlie
On 05/29/2013 04:13 PM, bigdog(at)bentwing.com wrote:
>
>
> I used the screws on my RV-6 canopy and was really happy with the way the
y worked out. I don't recall how big the holes were but they were big enoug
h to use Tinnerman washers across the front bow. I dimpled the skirts and l
et that serve as the "washer" so I had countersunk screws all around. The c
anopy survived a crash and a round trip on a trailer to the salvage yard. I
'd say it's pretty robust. It's going on the new RV with just a new skirt o
n one side.
>
> Regards,
> Greg Young
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv-list-server@mat
ronics.com] On Behalf Of Matt Dralle
> Sent: Wednesday, May 29, 2013 12:06 PM
> To: rv-list(at)matronics.com; rv8-list(at)matronics.com
> Subject: RV-List: Re: RV-8 Canopy
>
>
>> At 12:01 PM 5/28/2013 Tuesday, you wrote:
>> I'll second the air conditioner. Gets a little warm at LVK on summer aft
ernoons. I bought an evaporative cooler that helps considerably. Nice video
.
>>
>> Regards,
>>
>> Michael Wynn
>
> Hey Michael,
>
> How'd your canopy turn out? I'm on my second try now on the rebuild. I th
ink this one might be the one. I drilled the mounting holes #36 then tapped
for #6 screws. I like to be able to remove the skirts well into the proces
s and using screws instead of rivets seems to work out a lot better. On Rub
y 1.0 I used those Rivnuts which worked well. But, they are very large and
its hard to properly fit the plexiglass because they protrude by 1/16" and
you can't put them in until after the fitting is done - a Catch 22 of sorts
. I'm hoping that tapping the frame will work. The frame metal is fairly th
ick and really hard so it would seem that tapping might work really well. Y
ou don't want to over tighten the screws because of the plexi anyway, so yo
u don't need much to hold the screw. Today I enlarge the holes in the plexi
from #40 to about 3/16" then try out my tapping/screw idea. Wish me luck!
>
>
> -
> Matt Dralle
>
> RV-8 #82880 N998RV "Ruby Vixen"
> http://www.mattsrv8.com - Matt's Complete RV-8 Construction Log http://ww
w.mattsrv8.com/Mishap - Landing Mishap Rebuild Log
> http://www.youtube.com/MattsRV8 - Matt's RV-8 HDTV YouTube Channel
> Status: 172+ Hours TTSN - Rebuilding Fuselage After Landing Mishap...
>
> RV-6 #20916 N360EM "The Flyer"
> http://www.mattsrv6.com - Matt's RV-6 Revitalization Log
> Status: 150+ Hours Since Purchase - Upgrades Complete; Now In Full Flyer
Mode
>
-----
No virus found in this message.
Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Charlie England <ceengland7(at)gmail.com> |
Tomorrow, I'll head down to the hangar to look at the products I used &
let you know. There are some very detailed 'how-to' sites out there, as
well; I'll try to send a couple of links to those.
Charlie
On 05/29/2013 06:19 PM, Linn wrote:
>
> Charlie, which Sikaflex is recommended???
> Linn
>
> On 5/29/2013 6:49 PM, Charlie England wrote:
>>
>> Hi Matt,
>>
>> I haven't followed this thread closely, so ignore this if it's been
>> covered. There is always the Sikaflex option. No holes at all, & no
>> risk of plexi cracks. There's a fairly long history now of RV-s
>> flying with Sika'd canopies, with very good results.
>>
>> Charlie
>>
>>
>> On 05/29/2013 04:13 PM, bigdog(at)bentwing.com wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>> I used the screws on my RV-6 canopy and was really happy with the
>>> way they worked out. I don't recall how big the holes were but they
>>> were big enough to use Tinnerman washers across the front bow. I
>>> dimpled the skirts and let that serve as the "washer" so I had
>>> countersunk screws all around. The canopy survived a crash and a
>>> round trip on a trailer to the salvage yard. I'd say it's pretty
>>> robust. It's going on the new RV with just a new skirt on one side.
>>>
>>> Regards,
>>> Greg Young
>>>
>>>
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
>>> [mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Matt Dralle
>>> Sent: Wednesday, May 29, 2013 12:06 PM
>>> To: rv-list(at)matronics.com; rv8-list(at)matronics.com
>>> Subject: RV-List: Re: RV-8 Canopy
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>> At 12:01 PM 5/28/2013 Tuesday, you wrote:
>>>> I'll second the air conditioner. Gets a little warm at LVK on
>>>> summer afternoons. I bought an evaporative cooler that helps
>>>> considerably. Nice video.
>>>>
>>>> Regards,
>>>>
>>>> Michael Wynn
>>>
>>> Hey Michael,
>>>
>>> How'd your canopy turn out? I'm on my second try now on the
>>> rebuild. I think this one might be the one. I drilled the mounting
>>> holes #36 then tapped for #6 screws. I like to be able to remove
>>> the skirts well into the process and using screws instead of rivets
>>> seems to work out a lot better. On Ruby 1.0 I used those Rivnuts
>>> which worked well. But, they are very large and its hard to
>>> properly fit the plexiglass because they protrude by 1/16" and you
>>> can't put them in until after the fitting is done - a Catch 22 of
>>> sorts. I'm hoping that tapping the frame will work. The frame
>>> metal is fairly thick and really hard so it would seem that tapping
>>> might work really well. You don't want to over tighten the screws
>>> because of the plexi anyway, so you don't need much to hold the
>>> screw. Today I enlarge the holes in the plexi from #40 to about
>>> 3/16" then try out my tapping/screw idea. Wish me luck!
>>>
>>>
>>> -
>>> Matt Dralle
>>>
>>> RV-8 #82880 N998RV "Ruby Vixen"
>>> http://www.mattsrv8.com - Matt's Complete RV-8 Construction Log
>>> http://www.mattsrv8.com/Mishap - Landing Mishap Rebuild Log
>>> http://www.youtube.com/MattsRV8 - Matt's RV-8 HDTV YouTube Channel
>>> Status: 172+ Hours TTSN - Rebuilding Fuselage After Landing Mishap...
>>>
>>> RV-6 #20916 N360EM "The Flyer"
>>> http://www.mattsrv6.com - Matt's RV-6 Revitalization Log
>>> Status: 150+ Hours Since Purchase - Upgrades Complete; Now In Full
>>> Flyer Mode
>>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> -----
>> No virus found in this message.
>> Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
>>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | RV-8 Canopy, SikaFlex |
| From: | GLEN MATEJCEK <fly4grins(at)gmail.com> |
Hi Charlie et al-
I'm not sure of what became of the RV Wiki, but I'd posted fairly
comprehensive info on the canopy gluing process. If that's unavailable for
ant reason, I might be able to find the original info for anyone who might
be interested-
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: RV-8 Canopy, SikaFlex |
| From: | Michael Kraus <n223rv(at)wolflakeairport.net> |
I used Sikaflex 295UV plus activator plus primer. Purchased from Jamestown D
istributers. Great stuff, but be sure to follow the process. There are vid
eos on Jamestown's web site.
-Mike Kraus
RV-4 sold :-(
RV-10 flying :-)
KitFox SS7 Radial building :-)
On May 30, 2013, at 10:01 AM, GLEN MATEJCEK wrote:
> Hi Charlie et al-
>
> I'm not sure of what became of the RV Wiki, but I'd posted fairly comprehe
nsive info on the canopy gluing process. If that's unavailable for ant reas
on, I might be able to find the original info for anyone who might be intere
sted-
>
>
==========================
=========
==========================
=========
==========================
=========
==========================
=========
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | canopy fitting RV-8 |
| From: | Christopher Cee Stone <rv8iator(at)gmail.com> |
I see from Matt's log photos that you cut the forward top skin back to
flush with the support brackets that attach to the windshield frame. I was
considering doing the same since the canopy frame does not really fit under
the skin. Further the fibre glass fabricated faring will cover this gap
between canopy fairing and forward top skin. Am I missing something here?
Has anyone else done this?
chris stone
RV-8
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Matt Dralle <dralle(at)matronics.com> |
| Subject: | Re: canopy fitting RV-8 |
At 08:11 AM 5/30/2013 Thursday, Christopher Cee Stone wrote:
>I see from Matt's log photos that you cut the forward top skin back to
flush with the support brackets that attach to the windshield frame. =C2 I
was considering doing the same since the canopy frame does not really fit
under the skin. =C2 Further the fibre glass fabricated faring will cover
this gap between canopy fairing and forward top skin. =C2 Am I missing
something here? =C2 Has anyone else done this?
>
>chris stone
>RV-8
Chris,
Yeah, no need to leave those flanges. They just interfere with the skirts.
The bezel over the top of the windscreen/rollbar cover the union between
the front and the back. Here are some pictures of how I made my rear
windscreen bezel and they also detail the area you're talking about.
-
Matt Dralle
RV-8 #82880 N998RV "Ruby Vixen"
http://www.mattsrv8.com - Matt's Complete RV-8 Construction Log
http://www.mattsrv8.com/Mishap - Landing Mishap Rebuild Log
http://www.youtube.com/MattsRV8 - Matt's RV-8 HDTV YouTube Channel
Status: 172+ Hours TTSN - Rebuilding Fuselage After Landing Mishap...
RV-6 #20916 N360EM "The Flyer"
http://www.mattsrv6.com - Matt's RV-6 Revitalization Log
Status: 150+ Hours Since Purchase - Upgrades Complete; Now In Full Flyer
Mode
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "RV7ASask" <rv7alamb(at)sasktel.net> |
Fellow RVers,
My wife and I are planning a 4000nm trip in the RV7A leaving mid June. We live
in Saskatchewan and will be heading east across Canada then south to NYC and Washington,
DC. The tentative route will take us to Winnipeg, Thunder Bay, Timmins,
Quebec City, Charlottetown, Bangor, Brunswick, Danbury, Gettysburg, Leesburg,
Dayton, Dubuque, Bemidji, Winnipeg and home.
My wife is looking forward to the LL Bean flagship store in Freeport, Maine and
the Jinny Beyer Quilt Studio in Virginia. Im looking forward to the VFR corridor
down the Hudson River past Manhattan then to Gettysburg. We are both looking
forward to PEI, Gettysburg history and Washington.
My questions: What is the best airport to stop at in the Gettysburg area? Are there
any secrets to flying the VFR corridor by NYC that are not on the NYC Terminal
chart?
Any secrets in and around Leesburg other than what is in the on-line DC Special
Flight Rules Area course?
What is the best place to stop in the Dayton area? How about smaller airport in
the Midwest: Dubuque, Madison, Rockford, Davenport areas?
Any other suggestions about taking a long trip or along the route are welcome.
Thanks
David Lamb
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=401641#401641
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Jack Hilditch <wmjack1(at)t3cs.net> |
David,
You might want to check in with Henry Hartman for some local knowledge. Henr
y is president of EAA Chapter 1041 in Gettysburg, PA. Their home page is:
http://www.1041.eaachapter.org
He can be reached at:
keystonesnowmobiler_at_comcast_dot_net
Regards,
Jack Hilditch
EAA Chapter 1310
Skylark Airpark (7B6)
Sent from an iPhone which features 'autocorrect' software that randomly conv
erts my messages into 'baffle-yak'.....
On May 30, 2013, at 23:44, "RV7ASask" wrote:
>
> Fellow RVers,
>
> My wife and I are planning a 4000nm trip in the RV7A leaving mid June. We l
ive in Saskatchewan and will be heading east across Canada then south to NYC
and Washington, DC. The tentative route will take us to Winnipeg, Thunder B
ay, Timmins, Quebec City, Charlottetown, Bangor, Brunswick, Danbury, Gettysb
urg, Leesburg, Dayton, Dubuque, Bemidji, Winnipeg and home.
>
> My wife is looking forward to the LL Bean flagship store in Freeport, Main
e and the Jinny Beyer Quilt Studio in Virginia. I=99m looking forward t
o the VFR corridor down the Hudson River past Manhattan then to Gettysburg. W
e are both looking forward to PEI, Gettysburg history and Washington.
>
> My questions: What is the best airport to stop at in the Gettysburg area? A
re there any secrets to flying the VFR corridor by NYC that are not on the N
YC Terminal chart?
>
> Any secrets in and around Leesburg other than what is in the on-line DC Sp
ecial Flight Rules Area course?
>
> What is the best place to stop in the Dayton area? How about smaller airpo
rt in the Midwest: Dubuque, Madison, Rockford, Davenport areas?
>
> Any other suggestions about taking a long trip or along the route are welc
ome.
>
> Thanks
> David Lamb
>
>
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=401641#401641
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
==========================
=========
==========================
=========
==========================
=========
==========================
=========
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Dale Ensing <densing(at)carolina.rr.com> |
Recommend a visit to the Udvar-Hazy museum while you are in Leesburg.
Dale Ensing
On May 30, 2013, at 11:44 PM, "RV7ASask" wrote:
>
> Fellow RVers,
>
> My wife and I are planning a 4000nm trip in the RV7A leaving mid June. We live
in Saskatchewan and will be heading east across Canada then south to NYC and
Washington, DC. The tentative route will take us to Winnipeg, Thunder Bay, Timmins,
Quebec City, Charlottetown, Bangor, Brunswick, Danbury, Gettysburg, Leesburg,
Dayton, Dubuque, Bemidji, Winnipeg and home.
>
> My wife is looking forward to the LL Bean flagship store in Freeport, Maine and
the Jinny Beyer Quilt Studio in Virginia. Im looking forward to the VFR corridor
down the Hudson River past Manhattan then to Gettysburg. We are both looking
forward to PEI, Gettysburg history and Washington.
>
> My questions: What is the best airport to stop at in the Gettysburg area? Are
there any secrets to flying the VFR corridor by NYC that are not on the NYC Terminal
chart?
>
> Any secrets in and around Leesburg other than what is in the on-line DC Special
Flight Rules Area course?
>
> What is the best place to stop in the Dayton area? How about smaller airport
in the Midwest: Dubuque, Madison, Rockford, Davenport areas?
>
> Any other suggestions about taking a long trip or along the route are welcome.
>
> Thanks
> David Lamb
>
>
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=401641#401641
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Carl Froehlich" <carl.froehlich(at)verizon.net> |
For the DC SFRA you need to do the on line course: http://www.aopa.org/Advocacy/Air-Traffic-Services-,-a-,-Technology/Air-Traffic-Services-Brief-FAA-Special-Awareness-Training-for-the-Washington-D-C-Metropolitan-Area
https://www.faasafety.gov/gslac/ALC/course_content.aspx?cID=55&sID=315&searchresults=true&preview=true
Carl
Dogwood Airpark (VA42)
Fredericksburg, VA
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Dale Ensing
Sent: Friday, May 31, 2013 7:07 AM
Subject: Re: RV-List: 4000nm Trip
Recommend a visit to the Udvar-Hazy museum while you are in Leesburg.
Dale Ensing
On May 30, 2013, at 11:44 PM, "RV7ASask" wrote:
>
> Fellow RVers,
>
> My wife and I are planning a 4000nm trip in the RV7A leaving mid June. We live
in Saskatchewan and will be heading east across Canada then south to NYC and
Washington, DC. The tentative route will take us to Winnipeg, Thunder Bay, Timmins,
Quebec City, Charlottetown, Bangor, Brunswick, Danbury, Gettysburg, Leesburg,
Dayton, Dubuque, Bemidji, Winnipeg and home.
>
> My wife is looking forward to the LL Bean flagship store in Freeport, Maine and
the Jinny Beyer Quilt Studio in Virginia. Im looking forward to the VFR corridor
down the Hudson River past Manhattan then to Gettysburg. We are both looking
forward to PEI, Gettysburg history and Washington.
>
> My questions: What is the best airport to stop at in the Gettysburg area? Are
there any secrets to flying the VFR corridor by NYC that are not on the NYC Terminal
chart?
>
> Any secrets in and around Leesburg other than what is in the on-line DC Special
Flight Rules Area course?
>
> What is the best place to stop in the Dayton area? How about smaller airport
in the Midwest: Dubuque, Madison, Rockford, Davenport areas?
>
> Any other suggestions about taking a long trip or along the route are welcome.
>
> Thanks
> David Lamb
>
>
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=401641#401641
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jack" <wmjack1(at)t3cs.net> |
David,
The Hudson River corridor flight is something you will never forget. It is a terrific
way to see the city. Coming from the Hartford area, I intercepted the river
around Ossining because the Croton Point Park peninsula, just north of Ossining
village, is easy to identify from the air. As an alternative, you could
also head south from Newburg, a little north of Ossining, where I-84 crosses
the river. That would take you past West Point expanding your scenic route.
There have been some changes in procedures over the past couple of years however
so you should go through the available online training. Googling "Hudson River
Corridor Training" for resources produces the following links:
http://www.google.com/#sclient=psy-ab&q=hudson+corridor+training&oq=Hudson+Corridor&gs_l=hp.1.1.0l2j0i22i30l2.2000.10828.0.17078.17.12.0.5.5.1.1829.4766.0j1j1j1j1j3j8-1.8.0...0.0...1c.1.15.psy-ab.MbYAkAo20gk&pbx=1&bav=on.2,or.r_qf.&bvm=bv.47244034,d.eWU&fp=6c2b3414c48f215b&biw=1080&bih=592
Regards,
Jack
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of RV7ASask
Sent: Thursday, May 30, 2013 11:45 PM
Subject: RV-List: 4000nm Trip
Fellow RVers,
My wife and I are planning a 4000nm trip in the RV7A leaving mid June. We live
in Saskatchewan and will be heading east across Canada then south to NYC and Washington,
DC. The tentative route will take us to Winnipeg, Thunder Bay, Timmins,
Quebec City, Charlottetown, Bangor, Brunswick, Danbury, Gettysburg, Leesburg,
Dayton, Dubuque, Bemidji, Winnipeg and home.
My wife is looking forward to the LL Bean flagship store in Freeport, Maine and
the Jinny Beyer Quilt Studio in Virginia. Im looking forward to the VFR corridor
down the Hudson River past Manhattan then to Gettysburg. We are both looking
forward to PEI, Gettysburg history and Washington.
My questions: What is the best airport to stop at in the Gettysburg area? Are there
any secrets to flying the VFR corridor by NYC that are not on the NYC Terminal
chart?
Any secrets in and around Leesburg other than what is in the on-line DC Special
Flight Rules Area course?
What is the best place to stop in the Dayton area? How about smaller airport in
the Midwest: Dubuque, Madison, Rockford, Davenport areas?
Any other suggestions about taking a long trip or along the route are welcome.
Thanks
David Lamb
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=401641#401641
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: alternate air |
| From: | mr.gsun(at)gmail.com |
I don't have an alternate air valve in my snorkle in my IO-360 with
horizontal induction. Yet. Was thinking of mounting a cable operated
valve on the rear baffle near the oil cooler where there is lots of room.
Then I would snake a piece of scat tubing under the engine to the snorkle
under the air filter. This might give me a bit of ram air in cruise also.
Thoughts? Advice?
Greg
On May 31, 2013 4:11 AM, "Dale Ensing" wrote:
>
> Recommend a visit to the Udvar-Hazy museum while you are in Leesburg.
>
> Dale Ensing
>
> On May 30, 2013, at 11:44 PM, "RV7ASask" wrote:
>
> >
> > Fellow RVers,
> >
> > My wife and I are planning a 4000nm trip in the RV7A leaving mid June.
> We live in Saskatchewan and will be heading east across Canada then south
> to NYC and Washington, DC. The tentative route will take us to Winnipeg,
> Thunder Bay, Timmins, Quebec City, Charlottetown, Bangor, Brunswick,
> Danbury, Gettysburg, Leesburg, Dayton, Dubuque, Bemidji, Winnipeg and hom
e.
> >
> > My wife is looking forward to the LL Bean flagship store in Freeport,
> Maine and the Jinny Beyer Quilt Studio in Virginia. I=99m looking f
orward
> to the VFR corridor down the Hudson River past Manhattan then to
> Gettysburg. We are both looking forward to PEI, Gettysburg history and
> Washington.
> >
> > My questions: What is the best airport to stop at in the Gettysburg
> area? Are there any secrets to flying the VFR corridor by NYC that are no
t
> on the NYC Terminal chart?
> >
> > Any secrets in and around Leesburg other than what is in the on-line DC
> Special Flight Rules Area course?
> >
> > What is the best place to stop in the Dayton area? How about smaller
> airport in the Midwest: Dubuque, Madison, Rockford, Davenport areas?
> >
> > Any other suggestions about taking a long trip or along the route are
> welcome.
> >
> > Thanks
> > David Lamb
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Read this topic online here:
> >
> > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=401641#401641
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>
===========
===========
===========
===========
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: alternate air |
| From: | "jfogarty tds.net" <jfogarty(at)tds.net> |
I think the alternate air is just this, if the ram air box becomes plugged
with snow, ice or a bird you will need air from somewhere for the engine to
run, I think the cowling air would be the best air and I hope I will never
need it. Once it is opened. you will need to remove the cowling to make
sure it is closed properly, per plans. Hope this helps.
Jim
On Fri, May 31, 2013 at 8:55 AM, wrote:
> I don't have an alternate air valve in my snorkle in my IO-360 with
> horizontal induction. Yet. Was thinking of mounting a cable operated
> valve on the rear baffle near the oil cooler where there is lots of room.
> Then I would snake a piece of scat tubing under the engine to the snorkle
> under the air filter. This might give me a bit of ram air in cruise also
.
> Thoughts? Advice?
>
> Greg
> On May 31, 2013 4:11 AM, "Dale Ensing" wrote:
>
>>
>> Recommend a visit to the Udvar-Hazy museum while you are in Leesburg.
>>
>> Dale Ensing
>>
>> On May 30, 2013, at 11:44 PM, "RV7ASask" wrote:
>>
>> >
>> > Fellow RVers,
>> >
>> > My wife and I are planning a 4000nm trip in the RV7A leaving mid June.
>> We live in Saskatchewan and will be heading east across Canada then sout
h
>> to NYC and Washington, DC. The tentative route will take us to Winnipeg
,
>> Thunder Bay, Timmins, Quebec City, Charlottetown, Bangor, Brunswick,
>> Danbury, Gettysburg, Leesburg, Dayton, Dubuque, Bemidji, Winnipeg and ho
me.
>> >
>> > My wife is looking forward to the LL Bean flagship store in Freeport,
>> Maine and the Jinny Beyer Quilt Studio in Virginia. I=99m looking
forward
>> to the VFR corridor down the Hudson River past Manhattan then to
>> Gettysburg. We are both looking forward to PEI, Gettysburg history and
>> Washington.
>> >
>> > My questions: What is the best airport to stop at in the Gettysburg
>> area? Are there any secrets to flying the VFR corridor by NYC that are n
ot
>> on the NYC Terminal chart?
>> >
>> > Any secrets in and around Leesburg other than what is in the on-line D
C
>> Special Flight Rules Area course?
>> >
>> > What is the best place to stop in the Dayton area? How about smaller
>> airport in the Midwest: Dubuque, Madison, Rockford, Davenport areas?
>> >
>> > Any other suggestions about taking a long trip or along the route are
>> welcome.
>> >
>> > Thanks
>> > David Lamb
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > Read this topic online here:
>> >
>> > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=401641#401641
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>>
>>
>> ==========
>> get="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV-List
>> ==========
>> http://forums.matronics.com
>> ==========
>> le, List Admin.
>> ="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution
>> ==========
>>
>>
>>
>> *
>
===========
===========
===========
===========
> *
>
>
--
Jim Fogarty
Lakes and Leisure Realty, Inc.
8636 Bluebird Lane
Breezy Point, MN 56472
218-380-3784
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Matt Dralle <dralle(at)matronics.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Re: alternate air |
At 09:36 AM 5/31/2013 Friday, you wrote:
>I think the alternate air is just this, if the ram air box becomes plugged with
snow, ice or a bird you will need air from somewhere for the engine to run,
I think the cowling air would be the best air and I hope I will never need it.
Once it is opened. you will need to remove the cowling to make sure it is closed
properly, per plans. Hope this helps.
>
>Jim
If you design the cable installation correctly, there's no need to remove the cowling.
It will work like a normal control. Here are a few pictures of my installation.
-
Matt Dralle
RV-8 #82880 N998RV "Ruby Vixen"
http://www.mattsrv8.com - Matt's Complete RV-8 Construction Log
http://www.mattsrv8.com/Mishap - Landing Mishap Rebuild Log
http://www.youtube.com/MattsRV8 - Matt's RV-8 HDTV YouTube Channel
Status: 172+ Hours TTSN - Rebuilding Fuselage After Landing Mishap...
RV-6 #20916 N360EM "The Flyer"
http://www.mattsrv6.com - Matt's RV-6 Revitalization Log
Status: 150+ Hours Since Purchase - Upgrades Complete; Now In Full Flyer Mode
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Tim Farrell <tim(at)AirCraftersLLC.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Re: alternate air |
We generally seal up the Alternate Air Door with a little bit (read thin
layer) of rtv sealant. You should test your installation to make sure
it will break away. We usually "test" it about 3 or four times before
first flight just by pulling on it and saying "hey, what's this for
again . . . oh yeah . . . woops". So label it early.
Tim
--
Tim Farrell -
Aircrafters -
Owner/Manager -
(831) 722-9141 -
www.aircraftersLLC.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: alternate air |
| From: | Dan Bergeron <dan.pat.b(at)gmail.com> |
David
My wife and I did a trip to Wisconsin from Northampton, MA (7B2) last
August in our RV-7A. We spent several days in DeForest, WI, just north of
Madison, visiting with our grandchildren. We used Middleton - Morey (C29)
airport in Middleton, WI, about 10 NM west of downtown Madison, under the
outer ring of the class C airspace . Middleton is clean, well maintained,
has a 4000' east/west runway, Avis rent-a-car on the field (call ahead to
be sure you have one waiting for you), decent nearby hotels and
restaurants, and friendly / helpful staff.
I've flown the Hudson corridor four times, twice in each direction - a
pleasant experience - only advice I can offer is be familiar with what's
on the NYC Terminal Area chart, take your time, stay on altitude, announce
your position at the required locations, keep your heads on a swivel and be
aware that from 1100' an engine failure will have you in the river in less
than two minutes - there are no other options.
I've been to the Udvar - Hazy National Air and Space Museum at Dulles
Airport (KIAD) - (a must see, bucket list item for any aviation enthusiast)
- you could easily spend two full days there) but have never flown into
Leesburg Exec (KJYO) which seems to be the preferred airport to use. I'm
told by folks who've done it that you should thoroughly review the material
in the on-line Special Flight Rules Area course and be careful to comply
with requirements.
My wife and have flown up to LL Bean several times. We use the former
Brunswick Naval Air Station (KBXM) - there is an FBO there with friendly
and helpful staff and great facilities. Hertz has an on-field franchise
but be sure to call ahead - they don't have many vehicles - Enterprise is
downtown but can have a car there within 20 minutes of your arrival - once
you get on the road it's about 20 minutes to Freeport and LL Bean - please
spend lots of $$ - the U.S. economy can use the help
Hope this is helpful. Have a great trip - bonne chance et bon voyage.
Dan Bergeron
RV-7A - N307TB
404 hours since first
flight on Aug 4, 2009
On Fri, May 31, 2013 at 12:36 PM, jfogarty tds.net wrote
:
> I think the alternate air is just this, if the ram air box becomes plugge
d
> with snow, ice or a bird you will need air from somewhere for the engine
to
> run, I think the cowling air would be the best air and I hope I will neve
r
> need it. Once it is opened. you will need to remove the cowling to make
> sure it is closed properly, per plans. Hope this helps.
>
> Jim
>
>
> On Fri, May 31, 2013 at 8:55 AM, wrote:
>
>> I don't have an alternate air valve in my snorkle in my IO-360 with
>> horizontal induction. Yet. Was thinking of mounting a cable operated
>> valve on the rear baffle near the oil cooler where there is lots of room
.
>> Then I would snake a piece of scat tubing under the engine to the snorkl
e
>> under the air filter. This might give me a bit of ram air in cruise als
o.
>> Thoughts? Advice?
>>
>> Greg
>> On May 31, 2013 4:11 AM, "Dale Ensing" wrote:
>>
>>>
>>> Recommend a visit to the Udvar-Hazy museum while you are in Leesburg.
>>>
>>> Dale Ensing
>>>
>>> On May 30, 2013, at 11:44 PM, "RV7ASask" wrote:
>>>
>>> >
>>> > Fellow RVers,
>>> >
>>> > My wife and I are planning a 4000nm trip in the RV7A leaving mid June
.
>>> We live in Saskatchewan and will be heading east across Canada then sou
th
>>> to NYC and Washington, DC. The tentative route will take us to Winnipe
g,
>>> Thunder Bay, Timmins, Quebec City, Charlottetown, Bangor, Brunswick,
>>> Danbury, Gettysburg, Leesburg, Dayton, Dubuque, Bemidji, Winnipeg and h
ome.
>>> >
>>> > My wife is looking forward to the LL Bean flagship store in Freeport,
>>> Maine and the Jinny Beyer Quilt Studio in Virginia. I=99m looking
forward
>>> to the VFR corridor down the Hudson River past Manhattan then to
>>> Gettysburg. We are both looking forward to PEI, Gettysburg history and
>>> Washington.
>>> >
>>> > My questions: What is the best airport to stop at in the Gettysburg
>>> area? Are there any secrets to flying the VFR corridor by NYC that are
not
>>> on the NYC Terminal chart?
>>> >
>>> > Any secrets in and around Leesburg other than what is in the on-line
>>> DC Special Flight Rules Area course?
>>> >
>>> > What is the best place to stop in the Dayton area? How about smaller
>>> airport in the Midwest: Dubuque, Madison, Rockford, Davenport areas?
>>> >
>>> > Any other suggestions about taking a long trip or along the route are
>>> welcome.
>>> >
>>> > Thanks
>>> > David Lamb
>>> >
>>> >
>>> >
>>> >
>>> > Read this topic online here:
>>> >
>>> > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=401641#401641
>>> >
>>> >
>>> >
>>> >
>>> >
>>> >
>>> >
>>> >
>>> >
>>> >
>>>
>>>
>>> ==========
>>> get="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV-List
>>> ==========
>>> http://forums.matronics.com
>>> ==========
>>> le, List Admin.
>>> ="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution
>>> ==========
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> *
>>
>> t="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV-List
>> tp://forums.matronics.com
>> _blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution
>> *
>>
>>
>
>
> --
> Jim Fogarty
> Lakes and Leisure Realty, Inc.
> 8636 Bluebird Lane
> Breezy Point, MN 56472
> 218-380-3784
>
> *
>
===========
===========
===========
===========
> *
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "max" <maxfly55(at)gmail.com> |
If you have the time, Ck out "Cole Palen's Old Rhinebeck" Aerodrome.
Just up the river from New York City and well worth the visit.
http://www.oldrhinebeck.org/
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=401757#401757
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Robin Marks <robin(at)PaintTheWeb.com> |
My daughter filmed a movie in Gettysburg PA for 6 weeks last fall. We had a GREAT
time there as we were put up at the Gettysburg hotel smack dab in the town
square. Note the town square is circular, go figure.
Traffic can be miserable during the peak of the tourist season (old narrow roads
with restrictions due to preserving historical grounds) and I think this is
the 150th anniversary of the Battle of Gettysburg which will make it extra busy
from our understanding.
Also of note Gettysburg college just steps away from the town center was voted
top 10 most beautiful college (looks like Hogwarts) and top 10 for best college
food service. :-). They provided food service during all the filming on campus
and it was fantastic!
Robin
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of max
Sent: Saturday, June 01, 2013 9:39 AM
Subject: RV-List: Re: 4000nm Trip
If you have the time, Ck out "Cole Palen's Old Rhinebeck" Aerodrome.
Just up the river from New York City and well worth the visit.
http://www.oldrhinebeck.org/
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=401757#401757
-----
No virus found in this message.
Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Fisher Paul A." <FisherPaulA(at)johndeere.com> |
David,
I'm based at Davenport (KDVN), but as a fuel stop, I would recommend Clinton Iowa
(KCWI). They typically have the cheapest self-serve fuel in the local area
- I often fly the 18 NM to fuel up there (makes for a good excuse to fly!).
The airport manager is the vice president of our local EAA chapter, so definitely
"homebuilt friendly"!
If you've got time, I highly recommend the US Air Force museum in Dayton Ohio (http://www.nationalmuseum.af.mil/). Free parking and free admission, and one of the best museums I've ever seen. I actually preferred it over the Udvar-Hazy in Washington - but as an airplane geek, you really should see both!
Have a great trip!
Paul A. Fisher
RV-7A N18PF
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of RV7ASask
Sent: Thursday, May 30, 2013 10:45 PM
Subject: RV-List: 4000nm Trip
Fellow RVers,
My wife and I are planning a 4000nm trip in the RV7A leaving mid June. We live
in Saskatchewan and will be heading east across Canada then south to NYC and Washington,
DC. The tentative route will take us to Winnipeg, Thunder Bay, Timmins,
Quebec City, Charlottetown, Bangor, Brunswick, Danbury, Gettysburg, Leesburg,
Dayton, Dubuque, Bemidji, Winnipeg and home.
My wife is looking forward to the LL Bean flagship store in Freeport, Maine and
the Jinny Beyer Quilt Studio in Virginia. Im looking forward to the VFR corridor
down the Hudson River past Manhattan then to Gettysburg. We are both looking
forward to PEI, Gettysburg history and Washington.
My questions: What is the best airport to stop at in the Gettysburg area? Are there
any secrets to flying the VFR corridor by NYC that are not on the NYC Terminal
chart?
Any secrets in and around Leesburg other than what is in the on-line DC Special
Flight Rules Area course?
What is the best place to stop in the Dayton area? How about smaller airport in
the Midwest: Dubuque, Madison, Rockford, Davenport areas?
Any other suggestions about taking a long trip or along the route are welcome.
Thanks
David Lamb
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=401641#401641
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "ianxbrown" <ixb(at)videotron.ca> |
David,
You and your wife would be welcome to overnight at our place on your journey.
We live in Bromont, QC, and the nicely paved runway is 5,000' long. Bromont is
about 70kms due East of Montreal. I'm rebuilding my flipped-over RV-9A presently.
It sounds like a dream trip.
Ian Brown
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=402062#402062
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Landing Gear Shimmy on RV8a |
| From: | "ianxbrown" <ixb(at)videotron.ca> |
I'm interested whether you fixed your shimmy or not. I'd suggested tight wheel
bearings. All other suggestions are really excluded by your case history. Got
worse without changing gear legs, tire pressures or without having flat spots,
etc.
The conical bearings have a capability of tightening up, or not turning freely.
Did this start after a re-lube of the bearings? The wheels really have to turn
freely. One other thought on the mains, brake pads binding?
I'm a believer in AntiSplat Aero's wheel bearing mod, and perhaps their balancing.
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=402069#402069
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Landing Gear Shimmy on RV8a |
| From: | thomas sargent <sarg314(at)gmail.com> |
On my 6A, reducing the nose wheel tire pressure helped a lot.
--
Tom Sargent
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Hopperdhh(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Landing Gear Shimmy on RV8a |
Something definitely needs to be done to improve the nose wheel axle
arrangement on the RVs.
I made a spacer so that I could tighten the axle bolt without causing the
bearings to feel the added pressure. It takes a few tries to get it just
right, but when you do the wheel should turn as free as with ball bearings.
The spacer makes the system much more stable.
I made my spacer out of steel about 3/4 inch diameter. With the wheel off
the plane you can measure between the outsides of the aluminum adapter hubs
and then subtract their combined thickness for a first try at the spacer
length. Start a few thousandths of an inch too long and the wheel bearings
will be too loose. Face off a couple of thousandths and try again until
its just right -- just a little or no play.
There is nothing wrong with the AntiSplat ball bearing mod if you want to
spend the money. I'm poor!
Dan Hopper
RV-7A 766DH Flying since 2004 -- only nosed it over once!
That (and seeing the result of a couple of other accidents) made me a
believer in the anti-splat gear leg brace. Great invention! Be sure to watch
the videos on their web site.
In a message dated 6/5/2013 10:21:04 A.M. Eastern Daylight Time,
ixb(at)videotron.ca writes:
--> RV-List message posted by: "ianxbrown"
I'm interested whether you fixed your shimmy or not. I'd suggested tight
wheel bearings. All other suggestions are really excluded by your case
history. Got worse without changing gear legs, tire pressures or without
having flat spots, etc.
The conical bearings have a capability of tightening up, or not turning
freely. Did this start after a re-lube of the bearings? The wheels really
have to turn freely. One other thought on the mains, brake pads binding?
I'm a believer in AntiSplat Aero's wheel bearing mod, and perhaps their
balancing.
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=402069#402069
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "RV7ASask" <rv7alamb(at)sasktel.net> |
To everyone who replied on and off line, thank you very much.
We have gleaned a great deal of of good info that we will apply.
It seems every trip requires a good excuse to get it started and ours is the Air
Cadet League of Canada are having their AGM in Prince Edward Island the end
of June. What a great excuse to see one of the most beautiful areas of Canada.
I will update the list as to how the trip unfolds.
Thanks again to all.
Warmest regards
David Lamb
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=402075#402075
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | thomas sargent <sarg314(at)gmail.com> |
It's time to do the annual on my 6A (IO-360). The PC680 Odyssey battery is
3 years old. Seems to work fine (only about 110 hours on it). Should I
replace this now on general principles, or can it go another year?
It's been heavily discharged once by a very small load over about 10 days,
so nothing real violent has ever happened to it.
--
Tom Sargent
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: pc680 life time |
| From: | Jeff Orear <jorear(at)new.rr.com> |
Fly on, Tom. I got 5 years out of my first odyssey.
Jeff Orear
RV6A N782P
Peshtigo, WI
On Jun 6, 2013, at 10:23 PM, thomas sargent wrote:
> It's time to do the annual on my 6A (IO-360). The PC680 Odyssey battery i
s 3 years old. Seems to work fine (only about 110 hours on it). Should I re
place this now on general principles, or can it go another year?
>
> It's been heavily discharged once by a very small load over about 10 days,
so nothing real violent has ever happened to it.
>
> --
> Tom Sargent
>
>
==========================
=========
==========================
=========
==========================
=========
==========================
=========
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: pc680 life time |
| From: | vanremog(at)aol.com |
The Resnikoff Conundrum points out that long term testing of an item that m
ay lead to dire consequences upon its failure may be ill advised. Dependin
g on what your battery runs, you may want to run the bath tub curve experim
ent, or not. Only you can decide whether you can survive the consequences.
In my plane always hangared in CA, trickle-charge maintained during the win
ter and with magneto ignition, I would replace that battery after 48 mos.
YMMV.
-GV
-----Original Message-----
From: thomas sargent <sarg314(at)gmail.com>
Sent: Thu, Jun 6, 2013 8:25 pm
Subject: RV-List: pc680 life time
It's time to do the annual on my 6A (IO-360). The PC680 Odyssey battery is
3 years old. Seems to work fine (only about 110 hours on it). Should I re
place this now on general principles, or can it go another year?
It's been heavily discharged once by a very small load over about 10 days,
so nothing real violent has ever happened to it.
--
Tom Sargent
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Ed Holyoke <bicyclop(at)pacbell.net> |
| Subject: | Re: pc680 life time |
The best way to know if your battery has outlived its usefulness is to
test it at every annual. You can use something like this:
http://www.westmountainradio.com/product_info.php?products_id=cba4
and a laptop to discharge the battery and plot an accurate ampere hour
curve. Use a discharge rate appropriate to what you would draw with the
alternator inop and minimal loads and stop the test at 10.5 volts. Then
you put it back on the charger and you know what it's worth. If you
don't have enough usable electrons to run out your fuel, that would be
good to know in advance. If you don't have enough capacity to run for at
least an hour or two..... maybe it's time for a new battery. An
electrically dependent engine would indicate even more caution as
concerns battery capacity. A test like this won't tell you much about
cranking capacity, but you should already know if it's getting weak at
high discharge rates by how it's turning your engine over.
One deep discharge cycle may or may not do much damage. A lot depends on
how deep and how long it remained discharged before getting it charged
back up. Testing it overnight to 10.5v and putting back on the charger
in the morning shouldn't harm it. If you test your battery yearly,
you'll have a baseline and you can see how quickly it is going down hill
and make an intelligent decision on when to chuck it.
Incidentally, we once had a dead short ahead of the battery contactor,
discharging it to 5v by the time I got there. Charged it up and it
started just fine. At a 4 amp rate, it tested to more than 90% of it's
rated capacity. We replaced it a couple of months later when it didn't
want to crank the airplane, but it is still a useful bench battery.
Ed Holyoke
On 6/6/2013 9:14 PM, vanremog(at)aol.com wrote:
> The Resnikoff Conundrum points out that long term testing of an item
> that may lead to dire consequences upon its failure may be ill
> advised. Depending on what your battery runs, you may want to run the
> bath tub curve experiment, or not. Only you can decide whether you
> can survive the consequences.
> In my plane always hangared in CA, trickle-charge maintained during
> the winter and with magneto ignition, I would replace that battery
> after 48 mos. YMMV.
> -GV
> -----Original Message-----
> From: thomas sargent <sarg314(at)gmail.com>
> To: rv-list
> Sent: Thu, Jun 6, 2013 8:25 pm
> Subject: RV-List: pc680 life time
>
> It's time to do the annual on my 6A (IO-360). The PC680 Odyssey
> battery is 3 years old. Seems to work fine (only about 110 hours on
> it). Should I replace this now on general principles, or can it go
> another year?
>
> It's been heavily discharged once by a very small load over about 10
> days, so nothing real violent has ever happened to it.
>
> --
> Tom Sargent
> *
>
> t="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV-List
> tp://forums.matronics.com
> _blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution
>
> *
> *
>
>
> *
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: pc680 life time |
| From: | Bobby Hester <bobbyhester(at)twc.com> |
Mine is 6 yes old and I'm passing 650 hrs. Still works great!
Sent from my Verizon iPhone
On Jun 6, 2013, at 10:23 PM, thomas sargent wrote:
> It's time to do the annual on my 6A (IO-360). The PC680 Odyssey battery i
s 3 years old. Seems to work fine (only about 110 hours on it). Should I re
place this now on general principles, or can it go another year?
>
> It's been heavily discharged once by a very small load over about 10 days,
so nothing real violent has ever happened to it.
>
> --
> Tom Sargent
>
>
==========================
=========
==========================
=========
==========================
=========
==========================
=========
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Carl Froehlich" <carl.froehlich(at)verizon.net> |
Back when I was running dual Lightspeed ignitions I designed the power
distribution to have independent left/right batteries (both PC-625s) so
a single component failure would not result in ignition power being lost
to both sides at the same time. The change out interval was to replace
one battery every two years such that one was always less than two years
old and the other less than four. I have long since remove the
Lightspeed ignitions (many reasons) and now fly with pMags - so the
ignition power requirement is gone. I still change out a battery every
2 years - the RV-10 is set up this way as well. The reason is to gain
confidence that if the alternator dies the batteries have enough
capacity to continue full panel IFR flight for at least two hours. At
$90 or so each this is a cheap maintenance routine.
One note - if you beat a battery into the ground by leaving a master on
or such, replace it. In most cases the damage is not reversible. If
you can breathe some life back into it, use it on the bench or in a
tractor.
A data point: I put a pulled PC-625 in one tractor that is now 10 years
old. While not nearly the current drain of the airplane, the tractor
still cranks it up every time.
Carl
From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of thomas sargent
Sent: Thursday, June 06, 2013 11:24 PM
Subject: RV-List: pc680 life time
It's time to do the annual on my 6A (IO-360). The PC680 Odyssey battery
is 3 years old. Seems to work fine (only about 110 hours on it). Should
I replace this now on general principles, or can it go another year?
It's been heavily discharged once by a very small load over about 10
days, so nothing real violent has ever happened to it.
--
Tom Sargent
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Richard Dudley <rhdudley1(at)bellsouth.net> |
| Subject: | Re: pc680 life time |
There is another very simple test. The cost is a couple of hours of your
time.
While you are puttering around the hanger, run the avionics and other
equipment in your airplane that you consider necessary for safe flight.
Monitor the battery voltage and the time. When the voltage falls below
what you consider minimum acceptable, note the time. That is the
endurance of your battery.
Regards,
Rich Dudley
On 6/7/2013 1:09 AM, Ed Holyoke wrote:
> The best way to know if your battery has outlived its usefulness is to
> test it at every annual. You can use something like this:
> http://www.westmountainradio.com/product_info.php?products_id=cba4
> and a laptop to discharge the battery and plot an accurate ampere hour
> curve. Use a discharge rate appropriate to what you would draw with
> the alternator inop and minimal loads and stop the test at 10.5 volts.
> Then you put it back on the charger and you know what it's worth. If
> you don't have enough usable electrons to run out your fuel, that
> would be good to know in advance. If you don't have enough capacity to
> run for at least an hour or two..... maybe it's time for a new
> battery. An electrically dependent engine would indicate even more
> caution as concerns battery capacity. A test like this won't tell you
> much about cranking capacity, but you should already know if it's
> getting weak at high discharge rates by how it's turning your engine over.
>
> One deep discharge cycle may or may not do much damage. A lot depends
> on how deep and how long it remained discharged before getting it
> charged back up. Testing it overnight to 10.5v and putting back on the
> charger in the morning shouldn't harm it. If you test your battery
> yearly, you'll have a baseline and you can see how quickly it is going
> down hill and make an intelligent decision on when to chuck it.
>
> Incidentally, we once had a dead short ahead of the battery contactor,
> discharging it to 5v by the time I got there. Charged it up and it
> started just fine. At a 4 amp rate, it tested to more than 90% of it's
> rated capacity. We replaced it a couple of months later when it didn't
> want to crank the airplane, but it is still a useful bench battery.
>
> Ed Holyoke
>
> On 6/6/2013 9:14 PM, vanremog(at)aol.com wrote:
>> The Resnikoff Conundrum points out that long term testing of an item
>> that may lead to dire consequences upon its failure may be ill
>> advised. Depending on what your battery runs, you may want to run
>> the bath tub curve experiment, or not. Only you can decide whether
>> you can survive the consequences.
>> In my plane always hangared in CA, trickle-charge maintained during
>> the winter and with magneto ignition, I would replace that battery
>> after 48 mos. YMMV.
>> -GV
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: thomas sargent <sarg314(at)gmail.com>
>> To: rv-list
>> Sent: Thu, Jun 6, 2013 8:25 pm
>> Subject: RV-List: pc680 life time
>>
>> It's time to do the annual on my 6A (IO-360). The PC680 Odyssey
>> battery is 3 years old. Seems to work fine (only about 110 hours on
>> it). Should I replace this now on general principles, or can it go
>> another year?
>>
>> It's been heavily discharged once by a very small load over about 10
>> days, so nothing real violent has ever happened to it.
>>
>> --
>> Tom Sargent
>> *
>>
>> t="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV-List
>> tp://forums.matronics.com
>> _blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution
>>
>> *
>> *
>>
>>
>> *
> *
>
>
> *
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Carl Froehlich" <carl.froehlich(at)verizon.net> |
| Subject: | Time to sell the RV-8A |
All,
Now that the RV-10 is pretty well tweaked in, and considering my son Steve
is at sea on the Nimitz and 10 years from a stable shore job, I decided to
sell the RV-8A. I would appreciate you all letting anyone know who may be
looking.
Here are some details:
Airplane: 2002 Van's RV-8A. I am the original owner and builder. 660
total hours. Always in a hangar. Day/night VFR/IFR.
Price: $80,000
Engine: Lycoming IO-360 (180hp), 660 hours since new
Prop: Hartzell constant speed blended airfoil, 320 hours since new
Dual pMag electronic ignitions
Dual batteries feeding independent power busses
GX-60 GPS comm/nav
SL-30 comm/nav
SL-70 XPDR
Dynon D10A EFIS
Garmin 396
PS Engineering audio panel
JPI fuel flow computer
Grand Rapids Engine Information System
Wing leveler autopilot
Location: Dogwood Airpark (VA42), Fredericksburg Virginia
Thanks,
Carl
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Louis Willig <larywil(at)comcast.net> |
| Subject: | Re: pc680 life time |
Tom,
Your battery should be good for another 2-3 years. These batteries are
actually designed for deep discharge, so you probably did no damage.
Good luck.
Louis Willig
On 6/6/2013 11:23 PM, thomas sargent wrote:
> It's time to do the annual on my 6A (IO-360). The PC680 Odyssey
> battery is 3 years old. Seems to work fine (only about 110 hours on
> it). Should I replace this now on general principles, or can it go
> another year?
>
> It's been heavily discharged once by a very small load over about 10
> days, so nothing real violent has ever happened to it.
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: pc680 life time |
| From: | Dale Ensing <densing(at)carolina.rr.com> |
Have had a PC680 in my 6A for nine years. Still starts the O-360, with high compression
pistons, with no hesitation. I do keep a Battery Minder on it when not
flying.
Dale Ensing
On Jun 7, 2013, at 11:16 AM, Louis Willig wrote:
>
> Tom,
> Your battery should be good for another 2-3 years. These batteries are actually
designed for deep discharge, so you probably did no damage. Good luck.
>
> Louis Willig
>
>
> On 6/6/2013 11:23 PM, thomas sargent wrote:
>> It's time to do the annual on my 6A (IO-360). The PC680 Odyssey battery is
3 years old. Seems to work fine (only about 110 hours on it). Should I replace
this now on general principles, or can it go another year?
>>
>> It's been heavily discharged once by a very small load over about 10 days, so
nothing real violent has ever happened to it.
>>
>
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Scott" <1975jsa(at)gmail.com> |
| Subject: | O-360 and Catto FP prop |
Hi folks,
I am seeking information from those who have installed an O-360 with a
Catto three bladed prop on their RV-7. I am getting ready to order my
finishing kit and have one final decision to make before the order. My
concern lies in a potential aft CG issue when installing an O-360 and a
Catto FP prop. As I understand it my options are one of two
installations.
Option 1 is to install a weight of X lbs behind the prop to shift the CG
forward. Of course, this reduces useful payload by X lbs may be the
least expensive.
Option 2 is to use a engine mount for a O-320 shifting the engine
forward with the ensuing CG shift. This option requires an extended
cowling (the Vans version might work, I believe I can order an extended
Sam James cowl. Not sure about the Sam James cowl working.) This is the
more expensive solution.
If you have an RV-7 configured with an O-360 and a FB prop; would you
mind sharing your CG issues if any? I appreciate any information you can
give.
As a final note, I have considered CS and have read extensively on the
performance issues. I have decided on FP.
Thanks for your time.
Scott
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Matt Dralle <dralle(at)matronics.com> |
| Subject: | Re: O-360 and Catto FP prop |
At 06:33 PM 6/13/2013 Thursday, you wrote:
>
>Hi folks,
>
>As a final note, I have considered CS and have read extensively on the performance
issues. I have decided on FP.
>
>Thanks for your time.
>
>Scott
Hi Scott,
Reconsider the CS prop. My RV-6 with an O-360 and a Hartzell prop is the perfect
combination of climb and cruse performance. I love being able dial the prop
back to 2350 for cruse. In the RV-8 with the same prop and the IO-390, I don't
have the RPM restriction and routinely dial it back to 2150 with lots of MP
for a REALLY quiet, high-speed cruse. Oh, and the climb is outrageous.
I wouldn't own an RV without a CS prop!
-
Matt Dralle
RV-8 #82880 N998RV "Ruby Vixen"
http://www.mattsrv8.com - Matt's Complete RV-8 Construction Log
http://www.mattsrv8.com/Mishap - Landing Mishap Rebuild Log
http://www.youtube.com/MattsRV8 - Matt's RV-8 HDTV YouTube Channel
Status: 172+ Hours TTSN - Rebuilding Fuselage After Landing Mishap...
RV-6 #20916 N360EM "The Flyer"
http://www.mattsrv6.com - Matt's RV-6 Revitalization Log
Status: 150+ Hours Since Purchase - Upgrades Complete; Now In Full Flyer Mode
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Carl Froehlich" <carl.froehlich(at)verizon.net> |
| Subject: | O-360 and Catto FP prop |
I fully agree with Matt. I started with a Sensenich FP on the RV-8A to save
a few dollars. After 350 hours of I upgraded to a Hartzell blended airfoil
CS prop (the one Van's sells). The performance gain is across the board -
not just climb.
Bottom line, any extra money should go to this prop before another box in
the panel, the graphic paint job or that fancy leather interior.
Carl
RV-8A (sold last week)
RV-10 (95 hrs)
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Matt Dralle
Sent: Thursday, June 13, 2013 10:00 PM
Subject: Re: RV-List: O-360 and Catto FP prop
At 06:33 PM 6/13/2013 Thursday, you wrote:
>
>Hi folks,
>
>As a final note, I have considered CS and have read extensively on the
performance issues. I have decided on FP.
>
>Thanks for your time.
>
>Scott
Hi Scott,
Reconsider the CS prop. My RV-6 with an O-360 and a Hartzell prop is the
perfect combination of climb and cruse performance. I love being able dial
the prop back to 2350 for cruse. In the RV-8 with the same prop and the
IO-390, I don't have the RPM restriction and routinely dial it back to 2150
with lots of MP for a REALLY quiet, high-speed cruse. Oh, and the climb is
outrageous.
I wouldn't own an RV without a CS prop!
-
Matt Dralle
RV-8 #82880 N998RV "Ruby Vixen"
http://www.mattsrv8.com - Matt's Complete RV-8 Construction Log
http://www.mattsrv8.com/Mishap - Landing Mishap Rebuild Log
http://www.youtube.com/MattsRV8 - Matt's RV-8 HDTV YouTube Channel
Status: 172+ Hours TTSN - Rebuilding Fuselage After Landing Mishap...
RV-6 #20916 N360EM "The Flyer"
http://www.mattsrv6.com - Matt's RV-6 Revitalization Log
Status: 150+ Hours Since Purchase - Upgrades Complete; Now In Full Flyer
Mode
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Ralph Finch <ralphmariafinch(at)gmail.com> |
| Subject: | Re: O-360 and Catto FP prop |
I see the same enthusiasm on VAF for those comparing a Catto prop to
standard Fixed Pitch props. Catto props apparently are in their own class.
Back to the OP's question, I'd suggest asking on VAF or calling Vans.
Ralph Finch
RV-9A, firewall forward
On Fri, Jun 14, 2013 at 4:50 AM, Carl Froehlich
wrote:
> I fully agree with Matt. I started with a Sensenich FP on the RV-8A to
> save
> a few dollars. After 350 hours of I upgraded to a Hartzell blended airfoil
> CS prop (the one Van's sells). The performance gain is across the board -
> not just climb.
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: O-360 and Catto FP prop |
| From: | Vince Himsl <vshimsl(at)live.com> |
No aft cg issues with Catto 3 blade on rv8. Understand there are with CS.
Do not assume prop bolts from Van's will work. Also, I ordered a special hub
extension from Saber. Check archives.
Limited funds, the KISS principal, and my personal preferences favored the f
ixed. I have not missed the CS prop.
Vince H
RV8 flying
On Jun 13, 2013, at 6:33 PM, "Scott" <1975jsa(at)gmail.com> wrote:
>
> Hi folks,
>
> I am seeking information from those who have installed an O-360 with a Cat
to three bladed prop on their RV-7. I am getting ready to order my finishing
kit and have one final decision to make before the order. My concern lies i
n a potential aft CG issue when installing an O-360 and a Catto FP prop. As I
understand it my options are one of two installations.
>
> Option 1 is to install a weight of X lbs behind the prop to shift the CG f
orward. Of course, this reduces useful payload by X lbs may be the least exp
ensive.
>
> Option 2 is to use a engine mount for a O-320 shifting the engine forward w
ith the ensuing CG shift. This option requires an extended cowling (the Vans
version might work, I believe I can order an extended Sam James cowl. Not s
ure about the Sam James cowl working.) This is the more expensive solution.
>
> If you have an RV-7 configured with an O-360 and a FB prop; would you mind
sharing your CG issues if any? I appreciate any information you can give.
>
> As a final note, I have considered CS and have read extensively on the per
formance issues. I have decided on FP.
>
> Thanks for your time.
>
> Scott
>
>
==========================
=========
==========================
=========
==========================
=========
==========================
=========
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Warren Brecheisen <n146wb(at)cfu.net> |
| Subject: | Re: O-360 and Catto FP prop |
My RV-6 performs quite nicely with an O-320 and a Sensenich FP prop. It han
dles loops, rolls, barrel rolls, and hammerheads quite nicely. I chose FP f
or cost and maintenance reasons. Getting the max performance was not a conc
ern for me.
Warren
On Jun 14, 2013, at 9:49 AM, Vince Himsl wrote:
> No aft cg issues with Catto 3 blade on rv8. Understand there are with CS.
>
> Do not assume prop bolts from Van's will work. Also, I ordered a special h
ub extension from Saber. Check archives.
>
> Limited funds, the KISS principal, and my personal preferences favored the
fixed. I have not missed the CS prop.
>
> Vince H
> RV8 flying
>
>
> On Jun 13, 2013, at 6:33 PM, "Scott" <1975jsa(at)gmail.com> wrote:
>
>>
>> Hi folks,
>>
>> I am seeking information from those who have installed an O-360 with a Ca
tto three bladed prop on their RV-7. I am getting ready to order my finishin
g kit and have one final decision to make before the order. My concern lies i
n a potential aft CG issue when installing an O-360 and a Catto FP prop. As I
understand it my options are one of two installations.
>>
>> Option 1 is to install a weight of X lbs behind the prop to shift the CG f
orward. Of course, this reduces useful payload by X lbs may be the least exp
ensive.
>>
>> Option 2 is to use a engine mount for a O-320 shifting the engine forward
with the ensuing CG shift. This option requires an extended cowling (the Va
ns version might work, I believe I can order an extended Sam James cowl. Not
sure about the Sam James cowl working.) This is the more expensive solution
.
>>
>> If you have an RV-7 configured with an O-360 and a FB prop; would you min
d sharing your CG issues if any? I appreciate any information you can give.
>>
>> As a final note, I have considered CS and have read extensively on the pe
rformance issues. I have decided on FP.
>>
>> Thanks for your time.
>>
>> Scott
>
>
>
3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3
D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D
3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3
D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D
3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3
D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D
3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3
D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: O-360 and Catto FP prop |
| From: | Dale Ellis <rv8builder.kd0m(at)gmail.com> |
I too have a RV-8 fitted with a IO-360 with a Catto prop. I knew up front
that I would loose T.O. and climb performance and I did it just for $$$.
CG has not been an issue with a firewall mounted PC-680 battery.
If I were to install a CS prop, I would have to move the battery aft, I
suspect to account for the heavier prop.
One thing that I have noticed is that due to the low mass of the prop, when
the engine is hot and at idle, it does run a bit rough and I do
aggressively lean after landing.
Dale
N613DJ
109 hours now.
On Thu, Jun 13, 2013 at 9:33 PM, Scott <1975jsa(at)gmail.com> wrote:
> **
>
>
> Hi folks,
>
>
> I am seeking information from those who have installed an O-360 with a
> Catto three bladed prop on their RV-7. I am getting ready to order my
> finishing kit and have one final decision to make before the order. My
> concern lies in a potential aft CG issue when installing an O-360 and a
> Catto FP prop. As I understand it my options are one of two installations.
>
>
> Option 1 is to install a weight of X lbs behind the prop to shift the CG
> forward. Of course, this reduces useful payload by X lbs may be the least
> expensive.
>
>
> Option 2 is to use a engine mount for a O-320 shifting the engine forward
> with the ensuing CG shift. This option requires an extended cowling (the
> Vans version might work, I believe I can order an extended Sam James cowl.
> Not sure about the Sam James cowl working.) This is the more expensive
> solution.
>
>
> If you have an RV-7 configured with an O-360 and a FB prop; would you mind
> sharing your CG issues if any? I appreciate any information you can give.
>
>
> As a final note, I have considered CS and have read extensively on the
> performance issues. I have decided on FP.
>
>
> Thanks for your time.
>
>
> Scott
>
> *
>
> *
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | David Burnham <daverv6a(at)gmail.com> |
| Subject: | Re: O-360 and Catto FP prop |
Check out Whirlwind, CS no CG issues.
Dave B
On Jun 14, 2013, at 3:43 PM, Dale Ellis wrote:
> I too have a RV-8 fitted with a IO-360 with a Catto prop. I knew up front
that I would loose T.O. and climb performance and I did it just for $$$.
>
> CG has not been an issue with a firewall mounted PC-680 battery.
>
> If I were to install a CS prop, I would have to move the battery aft, I su
spect to account for the heavier prop.
>
> One thing that I have noticed is that due to the low mass of the prop, whe
n the engine is hot and at idle, it does run a bit rough and I do aggressive
ly lean after landing.
>
> Dale
> N613DJ
> 109 hours now.
>
>
>
> On Thu, Jun 13, 2013 at 9:33 PM, Scott <1975jsa(at)gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>> Hi folks,
>>
>> I am seeking information from those who have installed an O-360 with a Ca
tto three bladed prop on their RV-7. I am getting ready to order my finishin
g kit and have one final decision to make before the order. My concern lies i
n a potential aft CG issue when installing an O-360 and a Catto FP prop. As
I understand it my options are one of two installations.
>>
>> Option 1 is to install a weight of X lbs behind the prop to shift the CG f
orward. Of course, this reduces useful payload by X lbs may be the least exp
ensive.
>>
>> Option 2 is to use a engine mount for a O-320 shifting the engine forward
with the ensuing CG shift. This option requires an extended cowling (the Va
ns version might work, I believe I can order an extended Sam James cowl. Not
sure about the Sam James cowl working.) This is the more expensive solution
.
>>
>> If you have an RV-7 configured with an O-360 and a FB prop; would you min
d sharing your CG issues if any? I appreciate any information you can give.
>>
>> As a final note, I have considered CS and have read extensively on the pe
rformance issues. I have decided on FP.
>>
>> Thanks for your time.
>>
>> Scott
>>
>>
>> t="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV-List
>> tp://forums.matronics.com
>> _blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution
>>
>
>
>
==========================
=========
==========================
=========
==========================
=========
==========================
=========
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: O-360 and Catto FP prop |
| From: | "jfogarty tds.net" <jfogarty(at)tds.net> |
Great information Dale, thanks. I have the three blade Catto going on an
0-320, RV9A. I also liked the price.
Jim
On Fri, Jun 14, 2013 at 3:43 PM, Dale Ellis wrote:
> I too have a RV-8 fitted with a IO-360 with a Catto prop. I knew up front
> that I would loose T.O. and climb performance and I did it just for $$$.
>
> CG has not been an issue with a firewall mounted PC-680 battery.
>
> If I were to install a CS prop, I would have to move the battery aft, I
> suspect to account for the heavier prop.
>
> One thing that I have noticed is that due to the low mass of the prop,
> when the engine is hot and at idle, it does run a bit rough and I do
> aggressively lean after landing.
>
> Dale
> N613DJ
> 109 hours now.
>
>
> On Thu, Jun 13, 2013 at 9:33 PM, Scott <1975jsa(at)gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> **
>>
>>
>> Hi folks,
>>
>>
>> I am seeking information from those who have installed an O-360 with a
>> Catto three bladed prop on their RV-7. I am getting ready to order my
>> finishing kit and have one final decision to make before the order. My
>> concern lies in a potential aft CG issue when installing an O-360 and a
>> Catto FP prop. As I understand it my options are one of two installations.
>>
>>
>> Option 1 is to install a weight of X lbs behind the prop to shift the CG
>> forward. Of course, this reduces useful payload by X lbs may be the least
>> expensive.
>>
>>
>> Option 2 is to use a engine mount for a O-320 shifting the engine forward
>> with the ensuing CG shift. This option requires an extended cowling (the
>> Vans version might work, I believe I can order an extended Sam James cowl.
>> Not sure about the Sam James cowl working.) This is the more expensive
>> solution.
>>
>>
>> If you have an RV-7 configured with an O-360 and a FB prop; would you
>> mind sharing your CG issues if any? I appreciate any information you can
>> give.
>>
>>
>> As a final note, I have considered CS and have read extensively on the
>> performance issues. I have decided on FP.
>>
>>
>> Thanks for your time.
>>
>>
>> Scott
>>
>> *
>>
>> t="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV-List
>> tp://forums.matronics.com
>> _blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution
>> *
>>
>>
> *
>
> *
>
>
--
Jim Fogarty
Lakes and Leisure Realty, Inc.
8636 Bluebird Lane
Breezy Point, MN 56472
218-380-3784
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | HCRV6(at)comcast.net |
| Subject: | Re: O-360 and Catto FP prop |
I installed a Catto two blade FP prop on my RV-6 with O-360 in 2004 and now, 1080
hours later, I have never been sorry. Yes, you may have to be cautious about
baggage compartment weight with low fuel and heavy pilot and passenger, but
the trade off is a 50 plus pound weight saving and no recurring prop inspections
(not to mention about $10 aviation units in your pocket for fuel) I fly with
RV-6s and RV-7s with constant speed props frequently and easily equal their
performance except in initial acceleration and climb. If getting pushed back in
your seat on takeoff and 2000 fpm climb rates ring your bell, then by all means
go with a CS, otherwise you will be very satisfied with a Catto prop.
Harry Crosby
RV-6 N16CX, 1080 hours
----- Original Message -----
From: "Scott" <1975jsa(at)gmail.com>
Sent: Thursday, June 13, 2013 6:33:20 PM
Subject: RV-List: O-360 and Catto FP prop
Hi folks,
I am seeking information from those who have installed an O-360 with a Catto three
bladed prop on their RV-7. I am getting ready to order my finishing kit and
have one final decision to make before the order. My concern lies in a potential
aft CG issue when installing an O-360 and a Catto FP prop. As I understand
it my options are one of two installations.
Option 1 is to install a weight of X lbs behind the prop to shift the CG forward.
Of course, this reduces useful payload by X lbs may be the least expensive.
Option 2 is to use a engine mount for a O-320 shifting the engine forward with
the ensuing CG shift. This option requires an extended cowling (the Vans version
might work, I believe I can order an extended Sam James cowl. Not sure about
the Sam James cowl working.) This is the more expensive solution.
If you have an RV-7 configured with an O-360 and a FB prop; would you mind sharing
your CG issues if any? I appreciate any information you can give.
As a final note, I have considered CS and have read extensively on the performance
issues. I have decided on FP.
Thanks for your time.
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | RV-10 from middle earth |
| From: | Christopher Cee Stone <rv8iator(at)gmail.com> |
[image: 3d sidewalk art (10)]
Very clever...
chris stone
RV-8
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: O-360 and Catto FP prop |
| From: | "Scot" <1975jsa(at)gmail.com> |
Thank you all for the info you shared. Back to building and ordering the finish
kit.
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=402779#402779
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | O-360 and Catto FP prop |
| From: | GLEN MATEJCEK <fly4grins(at)gmail.com> |
I myself am a CS kind of guy, but I've a friend with an IO-360 angle valve
in an installation that calls for FP. He has run a Sensenich, American,
Prince, and finally a Cato three blade. The performance increase with the
Cato was spectacular. Were FP my bag, that is surely how I would go.
FYI
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | retorquing bolts on catto prop. |
| From: | thomas sargent <sarg314(at)gmail.com> |
I am doing the annual on my 6A. I re-torqued the prop bolts 22hrs ago
(though that was about 10 months). Check list calls for re-torquing them,
but I don't see that it's worth disturbing the thing. Catto recommends a
much longer re-torquing interval than the average wood prop anyway, due, I
guess, to the fiberclass outer layer of the prop.
Any opinions on this ?
--
Tom Sargent
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: retorquing bolts on catto prop. |
| From: | Jeff Orear <jorear(at)new.rr.com> |
I torque mine every other year
Jeff Orear
RV6A N782P
Sent from my iPad
On Jun 17, 2013, at 1:43 AM, thomas sargent wrote:
> I am doing the annual on my 6A. I re-torqued the prop bolts 22hrs ago (tho
ugh that was about 10 months). Check list calls for re-torquing them, but I
don't see that it's worth disturbing the thing. Catto recommends a much lo
nger re-torquing interval than the average wood prop anyway, due, I guess, t
o the fiberclass outer layer of the prop.
>
> Any opinions on this ?
>
> --
> Tom Sargent
>
>
==========================
=========
==========================
=========
==========================
=========
==========================
=========
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: retorquing bolts on catto prop. |
| From: | Brian Alley <n320wt(at)yahoo.com> |
I removed my Catto prop several times each year. Actually every time I remov
ed my cowl. This was just the easiest thing to do for me on my aircraft. My p
oint is that each bolt should be loosened before it is re-torqued to avoid a
ny errors. How often to re-torque the prop depends on what climate you live i
n. Annually might be fine in the desert but monthly might be necessary in hu
mid areas prone to wide barometer changes. Your airplane, you must decide!!!
Sent from my iPhone
Brian Alley
carbonfibercomposites.net
304-395-4932
On Jun 17, 2013, at 2:43 AM, thomas sargent wrote:
> I am doing the annual on my 6A. I re-torqued the prop bolts 22hrs ago (tho
ugh that was about 10 months). Check list calls for re-torquing them, but I
don't see that it's worth disturbing the thing. Catto recommends a much lo
nger re-torquing interval than the average wood prop anyway, due, I guess, t
o the fiberclass outer layer of the prop.
>
> Any opinions on this ?
>
> --
> Tom Sargent
>
>
==========================
=========
==========================
=========
==========================
=========
==========================
=========
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | HCRV6(at)comcast.net |
| Subject: | Re: retorquing bolts on catto prop. |
Once a year at annual time.
Harry Crosby
RV-6 N16CX, O-360/Catto prop
----- Original Message -----
From: "thomas sargent" <sarg314(at)gmail.com>
Sent: Sunday, June 16, 2013 11:43:56 PM
Subject: RV-List: retorquing bolts on catto prop.
I am doing the annual on my 6A. I re-torqued the prop bolts 22hrs ago (though that
was about 10 months). Check list calls for re-torquing them, but I don't see
that it's worth disturbing the thing. Catto recommends a much longer re-torquing
interval than the average wood prop anyway, due, I guess, to the fiberclass
outer layer of the prop.
Any opinions on this ?
--
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Robin Marks <robin(at)PaintTheWeb.com> |
| Subject: | RV-10 from middle earth |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________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | thomas sargent <sarg314(at)gmail.com> |
Does any one know an acceptable leak rate for the Pitot system? Mine is
pretty bad right now. If I pressurize the pitot so that airspeed shows
about 130kts, it leaks down about 7 or 8 kts/minute.
What is an acceptable leak rate in terms of kts/minute (or should I say
minutes/kt)?
I should say this is not an IFR plane.
Thanks,
--
Tom Sargent
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Dave Saylor <dave.saylor.aircrafters(at)gmail.com> |
That's not bad at all. Our static shop always says to remember that pitot
is "an infinite column"--that is, it's always being refreshed. A good rule
of thumb would be that if you can't easily see that it's dropping then
you're doing OK. If the needle (or EFIS) movement catches your eye it's
probably too much.
If you have a mechanical indicator, remember to disconnect the airspeed
static when you do the altimeter check.
On Thursday, June 20, 2013, thomas sargent wrote:
> Does any one know an acceptable leak rate for the Pitot system? Mine is
> pretty bad right now. If I pressurize the pitot so that airspeed shows
> about 130kts, it leaks down about 7 or 8 kts/minute.
>
> What is an acceptable leak rate in terms of kts/minute (or should I say
> minutes/kt)?
>
> I should say this is not an IFR plane.
>
> Thanks,
>
> --
> Tom Sargent
>
> *
>
> *
>
>
--
Dave Saylor
831-750-0284 CL
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | David Leonard <wdleonard(at)gmail.com> |
Dave Salor has it right, but just to add to that.. The "pitot-static test"
is actually just a "static" test. There are no standards the pitot portion
must pass. They always seem to test it, but it is just optional for IFR.
For VFR, they don't even test the static system, it is just a transponder
test.
You wouldn't want it crazy out of wack, but it sounds like you are fine.
On Thu, Jun 20, 2013 at 4:37 PM, Dave Saylor <
dave.saylor.aircrafters(at)gmail.com> wrote:
> That's not bad at all. Our static shop always says to remember that pitot
> is "an infinite column"--that is, it's always being refreshed. A good rule
> of thumb would be that if you can't easily see that it's dropping then
> you're doing OK. If the needle (or EFIS) movement catches your eye it's
> probably too much.
>
> If you have a mechanical indicator, remember to disconnect the airspeed
> static when you do the altimeter check.
>
>
> On Thursday, June 20, 2013, thomas sargent wrote:
>
>> Does any one know an acceptable leak rate for the Pitot system? Mine is
>> pretty bad right now. If I pressurize the pitot so that airspeed shows
>> about 130kts, it leaks down about 7 or 8 kts/minute.
>>
>> What is an acceptable leak rate in terms of kts/minute (or should I say
>> minutes/kt)?
>>
>> I should say this is not an IFR plane.
>>
>> Thanks,
>>
>> --
>> Tom Sargent
>>
>> *
>>
>> t="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV-List
>> tp://forums.matronics.com
>> _blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution
>> *
>>
>>
>
> --
> Dave Saylor
> 831-750-0284 CL
>
> *
>
> *
>
>
--
David Leonard
Turbo Rotary RV-6 N4VY
http://N4VY.RotaryRoster.net
http://RotaryRoster.net
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Shirley Harding" <rv6vhasf(at)gmail.com> |
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of RV-List Digest
Server
Sent: Friday, 21 June 2013 3:02 PM
Subject: RV-List Digest: 3 Msgs - 06/20/13
*
=================================================
Online Versions of Today's List Digest Archive
=================================================
Today's complete RV-List Digest can also be found in either of the two Web
Links listed below. The .html file includes the Digest formatted in HTML
for viewing with a web browser and features Hyperlinked Indexes and Message
Navigation. The .txt file includes the plain ASCII version of the RV-List
Digest and can be viewed with a generic text editor such as Notepad or with
a web browser.
HTML Version:
http://www.matronics.com/digest/digestview.php?Style=82701&View=html&Chapter
13-06-20&Archive=RV
Text Version:
http://www.matronics.com/digest/digestview.php?Style=82701&View=txt&Chapter
2013-06-20&Archive=RV
See FAA AC43.13 -1B CHG1 Page 12-21 This gives acceptable data for the
leak rate: Static system, apply a vacuum equivalent to 1000'and hold for 1
min, max leak 100'. Pitot system, apply pressure to 150 kts hold for 1 min,
max 10 kts leak.
Shirley Harding
RV6 flying
RV12 under construction
________________________________ Message 1
_____________________________________
Subject: RV-List: pitot test
From: thomas sargent <sarg314(at)gmail.com>
Does any one know an acceptable leak rate for the Pitot system? Mine is
pretty bad right now. If I pressurize the pitot so that airspeed shows
about 130kts, it leaks down about 7 or 8 kts/minute.
What is an acceptable leak rate in terms of kts/minute (or should I say
minutes/kt)?
I should say this is not an IFR plane.
Thanks,
--
Tom Sargent
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: lightspeed ignition troubleshooting |
| From: | Robert Brunkenhoefer <robertbrunk(at)mac.com> |
On Jun 24, 2013, at 9:16 AM, Robert Brunkenhoefer wrote:
> I have been trying to troubleshoot a drop of 250 rpm on run up on my light speed
side. I usually get 0 drop. I also show a 250 degree rise above the other
cylinders in the 3 and 4 egt. Cht is normal for all. I have done all the troubleshooting
in the manual supplied by Klaus. We have spoken a lot about this problem.
I would like to fly my plane somewhere nearby to someone who is familiar
withs these units so I can get back to the perfect way it was for 5000 plus
hours. thanks. I am based at KCRP, corpus christi , texas. Robert Brunkenhoefer
N661G 600 hours plus
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bob Collins <bcollinsrv7a(at)comcast.net> |
| Subject: | Re: lightspeed ignition troubleshooting |
So when you take the coil-to-plug leads off and you pull the prop
through, you're getting the spark jumping across the leads on the coil,
right? And at the right time?
On 6/24/2013 9:17 AM, Robert Brunkenhoefer wrote:
>
>
> On Jun 24, 2013, at 9:16 AM, Robert Brunkenhoefer wrote:
>
>> I have been trying to troubleshoot a drop of 250 rpm on run up on my light speed
side. I usually get 0 drop. I also show a 250 degree rise above the other
cylinders in the 3 and 4 egt. Cht is normal for all. I have done all the troubleshooting
in the manual supplied by Klaus. We have spoken a lot about this problem.
I would like to fly my plane somewhere nearby to someone who is familiar
withs these units so I can get back to the perfect way it was for 5000 plus
hours. thanks. I am based at KCRP, corpus christi , texas. Robert Brunkenhoefer
N661G 600 hours plus
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: lightspeed ignition troubleshooting |
| From: | "brunk" <robertbrunk(at)mac.com> |
Yes, that is correct. spark plug leads were replaced and coil to 3 and 4 was replaced,
as well as all spark plugs. connections were checked on both ends of the
system.
--------
Robert E. Brunkenhoefer
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=403302#403302
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: lightspeed ignition troubleshooting |
| From: | Dave Saylor <dave.saylor.aircrafters(at)gmail.com> |
I've found LS to be pretty sensitive to dirty plugs. It's early on the
troubleshooting checklist but even of they looked ok you might try a new
set. I just had that work for me under similar circumstances. In my case
the plugs were only 3 hours old and just looked a little used but not bad
at all. New plugs did the trick.
On Monday, June 24, 2013, Robert Brunkenhoefer wrote:
> >
>
>
> On Jun 24, 2013, at 9:16 AM, Robert Brunkenhoefer >
> wrote:
>
> > I have been trying to troubleshoot a drop of 250 rpm on run up on my
> light speed side. I usually get 0 drop. I also show a 250 degree rise above
> the other cylinders in the 3 and 4 egt. Cht is normal for all. I have done
> all the troubleshooting in the manual supplied by Klaus. We have spoken a
> lot about this problem. I would like to fly my plane somewhere nearby to
> someone who is familiar withs these units so I can get back to the perfect
> way it was for 5000 plus hours. thanks. I am based at KCRP, corpus christi
> , texas. Robert Brunkenhoefer N661G 600 hours plus
>
>
--
Dave Saylor
831-750-0284 CL
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | scott bilinski <rv8a2001(at)yahoo.com> |
| Subject: | Re: lightspeed ignition troubleshooting |
Do you have the old RG-58 coax cable to the coils? This caused me trouble,
replaced it with RG-400 cable problem solved.=0A-=0AScott=0A=0A=0A_______
_________________________=0A From: brunk <robertbrunk(at)mac.com>=0ATo: rv-lis
t(at)matronics.com =0ASent: Monday, June 24, 2013 7:39 AM=0ASubject: RV-List:
Re: lightspeed ignition troubleshooting=0A =0A=0A--> RV-List message posted
by: "brunk" =0A=0AYes, that is correct. spark plug le
ads were replaced and coil to 3 and 4 was replaced, as well as all spark pl
ugs. connections were checked on both ends of the system.=0A=0A--------=0AR
obert E. Brunkenhoefer=0A=0A=0A=0A=0ARead this topic online here:=0A=0Ahttp
://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=403302#403302=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A
=============
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: lightspeed ignition troubleshooting |
| From: | "brunk" <robertbrunk(at)mac.com> |
Dave, I replaced the plugs with new ones and experienced no change from that.
--------
Robert E. Brunkenhoefer
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=403315#403315
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: lightspeed ignition troubleshooting |
| From: | "brunk" <robertbrunk(at)mac.com> |
This is the original coax cable . I do not know the number of it. Would it cause
the symptoms I described? Was that your problem it corrected?
--------
Robert E. Brunkenhoefer
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=403333#403333
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bob Collins <bcollinsrv7a(at)comcast.net> |
| Subject: | Re: lightspeed ignition troubleshooting |
If you're getting a spark jumping across the leads, I doubt it's the
coax. You've changed the spark plugs (and the copper washers, right?)
and if you're EGT is going up , those plugs aren't firing. The next
thing I would eliminate as a possible cause are the wires from the
coil(s) to the individual plugs. Assuming you've doublechecked to be
sure these didn't somehow get routed to the wrong plugs (ask me how
know), try swapping the wires, disconnecting them from the coils and
plugs and connecting them to another (appropriate) coil and another
(appropriate) plug and see if that same plug doesn't fire or if another
plug becomes the one that doesn't fire.
Assuming nothing changes, I think you've eliminated the Lightspeed as
the cause and we can start just diagnosing the only three things it can
be from there forward : spark, fuel, or air, and we might be able to
eliminate spark.
On 6/24/2013 1:49 PM, brunk wrote:
>
> This is the original coax cable . I do not know the number of it. Would it cause
the symptoms I described? Was that your problem it corrected?
>
> --------. dd
> Robert E. Brunkenhoefer
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=403333#403333
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: lightspeed ignition troubleshooting |
| From: | Scott Bilinski <rv8a2001(at)yahoo.com> |
The RG 58 is black.
I had a strange intermittent miss when turning off one ignition. One thing to remember
is RG 58 was designed for WWII aircraft. RG 400 is MODERN! RG 58 is NOT
designed to handle under cowl temps. Especially the center conductor insulation.
Sent from my iPhone
On Jun 24, 2013, at 11:49 AM, "brunk" wrote:
>
> This is the original coax cable . I do not know the number of it. Would it cause
the symptoms I described? Was that your problem it corrected?
>
> --------
> Robert E. Brunkenhoefer
>
>
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=403333#403333
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Vincent Himsl <vshimsl(at)live.com> |
| Subject: | RE: LightSpeed ignition troubleshooting |
Hi,
250 RPM drop compared to what read by what at what RPM setting? Run up
implies 17 to 18 hundred rpm. Are you using the digital or analog rpm signal
from the LightSpeed? CHT temps should drop, at least they do for me, when a
cylinder is not firing. But yours are 'normal'. Do you hear/feel the RPM
drop or is your only indication an instrument RPM reading drop? Your
tachometer could be missing pulses (if digital) from the LIghtSpeed, and
your tachometer is a...?
Thanks,
VinceH
RV8 Flying
On Jun 24, 2013, at 9:16 AM, Robert Brunkenhoefer
wrote:
> I have been trying to troubleshoot a drop of 250 rpm on run up on my
> light speed side. I usually get 0 drop. I also show a 250 degree rise
> above the other cylinders in the 3 and 4 egt. Cht is normal for all. I
> have done all the troubleshooting in the manual supplied by Klaus. We
> have spoken a lot about this problem. I would like to fly my plane
> somewhere nearby to someone who is familiar withs these units so I can
> get back to the perfect way it was for 5000 plus hours. thanks. I am
> based at KCRP, corpus christi , texas. Robert Brunkenhoefer N661G 600
> hours plus
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "mds4878" <mike.nova1973(at)gmail.com> |
I have a new Van's C/S-13 spinner kit for sale.
120.00 plus shipping.
Mike 612-590-8604 8)
--------
RV-10 #40447
Fuselage almost done.
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=403438#403438
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | IFR RVs in the US |
Hello to all,
I=92ve been lurking on the sidelines of this list and have contributed
at
times during the build time of my RV8 ' from France. I have finished
the 8
which has been providing me with more joy than I anticipated. What a
great
airplane.
All would be perfect except that the French and most Europeans do not
allow
home builts to fly IFR. A few of the RV owners being military and/or
professional pilots with full IFR qualifications, with planes very well
equipped avionics wise, would like to change this. I have thus taken it
upon
myself within the context of our French RV builder group
(www.vansclubdefrance.fr) to explore the possibility of having the rules
changed, at least within the context of French skies.
Since the US FAA does allow experimental built airplanes to fly IFR in
the
US, my question to the list is : what are the criteria which would allow
an
RV to be flown IFR by a duly qualified IFR pilot ? Questions which come
to
mind are :
=B7 Does the engine have to be certified as opposed to a non
certified
such as Mattituck, Superior, Barret=85 ?
=B7 What about maintenance ' by certified mechanic or by owner
under a
certain conditions ?
=B7 Minimum avionics : ex. two radios, VORs, DME, other ?
=B7 Any steam gages ?
=B7 Does the owner who does his own maintenance have to acquire
specific qualifications ?
Thanks,
Mich=E8le Delsol
RV8 ' F-PDSL
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | TR: IFR RVs in the US |
Hello to all,
I=92ve been lurking on the sidelines of this list and have contributed
at
times during the build time of my RV8 ' from France. I have finished
the 8
which has been providing me with more joy than I anticipated. What a
great
airplane.
All would be perfect except that the French and most Europeans do not
allow
home builts to fly IFR. A few of the RV owners being military and/or
professional pilots with full IFR qualifications, with planes very well
equipped avionics wise, would like to change this. I have thus taken it
upon
myself within the context of our French RV builder group to explore the
possibility of having the rules changed, at least within the context of
French skies.
Since the US FAA does allow experimental built airplanes to fly IFR in
the
US, my question to the list is : what are the criteria which would allow
an
RV to be flown IFR by a duly qualified IFR pilot ? Questions which come
to
mind are :
=B7 Does the engine have to be certified as opposed to a non
certified
such as Mattituck, Superior, Barret=85 ?
=B7 What about maintenance ' by certified mechanic or by owner
under a
certain conditions ?
=B7 Minimum avionics : ex. two radios, VORs, DME, other ?
=B7 Any steam gages ?
=B7 Does the owner who does his own maintenance have to acquire
specific qualifications ?
Thanks,
Mich=E8le Delsol
RV8 ' F-PDSL
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | HCRV6(at)comcast.net |
| Subject: | Low fuel pressure indication |
I have a puzzling problem and wondering if anyone can shed some light on it. Under
continuous high power settings, like in climb to altitude after takeoff, my
Grand Rapids EFIS fuel pressure indication drops to zero and even shows a low
negative value after a couple of minutes, but the engine continues to run at
full power. This with a carbureted O-360 and running on the engine driven pump
only. If I switch the aux pump back on the pressure indication comes back to
the normal 2 to 4 psi range. I had this problem a few years ago and installing
a new VDO pressure sender from Grand Rapids cured it, but this time a new sender
did not help. The pressure take off is at the carburetor and the sender is
mounted on the firewall, connected with a -2 hose.
The thing that has me scratching my head is that the engine keeps running fine
at high fuel flow even though the fuel pressure indicates zero or less, so I would
suspect a bum sender again, but the fact that the pressure indication comes
back to normal when I turn the aux pump back on has me baffled.
Harry Crosby
RV-6 N16CX, 1080 hours
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Mike Robertson <mrobert569(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | IFR RVs in the US |
In the US we clarify the ability to IFR in each aircraft's operating limita
tions. These operating limitations are issued to the aircraft at the time
of certification. We=2C the FAA=2C use a very generic sentence=2C i.e=2C t
he sentence reads "Unless appropriately equipped for night and/or IFR fligh
t in accordance with 14 CFR 91.205=2C this aircraft is restricted to day VF
R."
So it is up to the pilot to make sure the aircraft is equipped with all the
necessry instruments and avionics=2C and make sure that all the needed ins
pections are completed. Those inspections would include the yearly conditi
on inspeciton=2C the 24 month trnasponder/encoder inspection=2C and a curre
nt IFR pitot/static inspection. From an airplane side that is it.
We do not require anything special for the engine=2C and even the avionics
do not have to be approved (but the must pass inspection). And your panel
could be all glass if you like provided all the instruments called out in 9
1.205 are there.
The pilot must have an instrument airplane rating and be current but that i
s all. Nothing special for operation of an amateur-built airplane.
I hope this helps.
Mike Robertson
RV-6=2C RV-8=2C RV-9 builder
FAA Inspector
From: mdelsol@md-dsl.fr
Subject: RV-List: IFR RVs in the US
Date: Mon=2C 24 Jun 2013 22:04:17 +0200
Hello to all=2C
I=92ve been lurking on the sidelines of this list and have contributed at t
imes during the build time of my RV8 ' from France. I have finished the 8
which has been providing me with more joy than I anticipated. What a great
airplane.
All would be perfect except that the French and most Europeans do not allow
home builts to fly IFR. A few of the RV owners being military and/or profe
ssional pilots with full IFR qualifications=2C with planes very well equipp
ed avionics wise=2C would like to change this. I have thus taken it upon my
self within the context of our French RV builder group (www.vansclubdefranc
e.fr) to explore the possibility of having the rules changed=2C at least wi
thin the context of French skies.
Since the US FAA does allow experimental built airplanes to fly IFR in the
US=2C my question to the list is : what are the criteria which would allow
an RV to be flown IFR by a duly qualified IFR pilot ? Questions which come
to mind are :
=B7 Does the engine have to be certified as opposed to a non certifi
ed such as Mattituck=2C Superior=2C Barret=85 ?
=B7 What about maintenance ' by certified mechanic or by owner und
er a certain conditions ?
=B7 Minimum avionics : ex. two radios=2C VORs=2C DME=2C other ?
=B7 Any steam gages ?
=B7 Does the owner who does his own maintenance have to acquire spec
ific qualifications ?
Thanks=2C
Mich=E8le Delsol
RV8 ' F-PDSL
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Mike Robertson <mrobert569(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | Low fuel pressure indication |
Harry=2C
Keep in mind that when we measure pressure we are really talking pressure d
ifferential. If the throttle is full open then the fuel pressure different
ial may actually be zero. For carb equipped airplanes I would not get too
carried away with a zero reading at full throttle as long as the engine is
running good and you still see some pressure when you turn on the boost pum
p.
Mike Robertson
Date: Thu=2C 27 Jun 2013 18:07:25 +0000
From: HCRV6(at)comcast.net
Subject: RV-List: Low fuel pressure indication
I have a puzzling problem and wondering if anyone can shed some light on it
. Under continuous high power settings=2C like in climb to altitude after
takeoff=2C my Grand Rapids EFIS fuel pressure indication drops to zero and
even shows a low negative value after a couple of minutes=2C but the engin
e continues to run at full power. This with a carbureted O-360 and running
on the engine driven pump only. If I switch the aux pump back on the pres
sure indication comes back to the normal 2 to 4 psi range. I had this prob
lem a few years ago and installing a new VDO pressure sender from Grand Rap
ids cured it=2C but this time a new sender did not help. The pressure take
off is at the carburetor and the sender is mounted on the firewall=2C conn
ected with a -2 hose.
The thing that has me scratching my head is that the engine keeps running f
ine at high fuel flow even though the fuel pressure indicates zero or less
=2C so I would suspect a bum sender again=2C but the fact that the pressure
indication comes back to normal when I turn the aux pump back on has me ba
ffled.
Harry Crosby
RV-6 N16CX=2C 1080 hours
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | RV6 Flyer <rv6_flyer(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | TR: IFR RVs in the US |
All US Amateur Built Experimental aircraft are issued "Special Airworthines
s Certificates" (FAA Form 8130-7) by the FAA Inspector or by a DAR. The "O
perating Limitations" that are a part of 8130-7 come right out of FAA Order
8130.2. (Latest version is 8130.2G Change 1)
At the time of the initial Airworthiness Inspection=2C the aircraft will be
limited to DAY VFR or to DAY VFR unless equipped In Accordance With CFR 14
part 91.205 for night or IFR. 91.205 only applies to Standard Category A
irplanes but the FAA makes that part apply by the Operating Limitations.
Once the Operating Limitations are issued=2C it becomes the builder's respo
nsibility to make sure that the aircraft meets 91.205.
I am a Commercial Pilot that is Instrument rated and current. I have and d
o fly my RV IFR.
Link to FAA Order 8130.2G with Change 1. http://www.airweb.faa.gov/Regulat
ory_and_Guidance_Library/rgOrders.nsf/0/7a09d53fb0d5325586257885004d9e1b/$F
ILE/8130.2G_CHG1_Incorporated.pdf
The following is the Operating Limitation that is issued that allows IFR in
a homebuilt.
=0A
=0A
=0A
=0A
=0A
=0A
=0A
=0A
=0A
=0A
=0A
=0A
=0A
=0A
=0A
=0A
=0A
=0A
After completion of phase I flight testing=2C unless appropriately equipped
=0A
for night and/or instrument flight in accordance with =A7 91.205=2C this ai
rcraft=0A
is to be operated under VFR=2C day only. (7/8 as appropriate)=0A
=0A
=0A
=0A
Hope this helps. Yes I am a DAR with Function Code 46 that allows me to do
initial airworthiness inspections on amateur built aircraft.
Gary A. Sobek
"My Sanity" RV-6 N157GS O-320 Hartzell=2C
2=2C726+ Flying Hours So. CA=2C USA
From: mdelsol@md-dsl.fr
Subject: RV-List: TR: IFR RVs in the US
Date: Wed=2C 26 Jun 2013 15:52:17 +0200
=0A
Hello to all=2C I=92ve been lurking on the sidelines of this list and have
contributed at times during the build time of my RV8 ' from France. I hav
e finished the 8 which has been providing me with more joy than I anticipat
ed. What a great airplane. All would be perfect except that the French and
most Europeans do not allow home builts to fly IFR. A few of the RV owners
being military and/or professional pilots with full IFR qualifications=2C w
ith planes very well equipped avionics wise=2C would like to change this. I
have thus taken it upon myself within the context of our French RV builder
group to explore the possibility of having the rules changed=2C at least w
ithin the context of French skies. Since the US FAA does allow experimental
built airplanes to fly IFR in the US=2C my question to the list is : what
are the criteria which would allow an RV to be flown IFR by a duly qualifie
d IFR pilot ? Questions which come to mind are :=B7 Does the engine
have to be certified as opposed to a non certified such as Mattituck=2C Sup
erior=2C Barret=85 ?=B7 What about maintenance ' by certified mech
anic or by owner under a certain conditions ?=B7 Minimum avionics :
ex. two radios=2C VORs=2C DME=2C other ?=B7 Any steam gages ?=B7
Does the owner who does his own maintenance have to acquire specific qu
alifications ? Thanks=2CMich=E8le DelsolRV8 ' F-PDSL =0A
=0A
=0A
=0A
============0A
============0A
============0A
============0A
=0A
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Linn Walters <flying-nut(at)cfl.rr.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Low fuel pressure indication |
BTDT!!!
The sender 'wiper' sits in one place at where ever the fuel pressure
puts it. The normal engine vibration wears a hole in the carbon path
..... and the reading goes to zero. Turning on the electric pump moves
the wiper off it's 'normal' spot and onto a good spot.
Replaced the sender and my problem went away.
My sender had about 2500 hours on it but it's a crapshoot when it will fail.
A prop balance is a good investment.
Linn
On 6/27/2013 2:07 PM, HCRV6(at)comcast.net wrote:
> I have a puzzling problem and wondering if anyone can shed some light
> on it. Under continuous high power settings, like in climb to
> altitude after takeoff, my Grand Rapids EFIS fuel pressure indication
> drops to zero and even shows a low negative value after a couple of
> minutes, but the engine continues to run at full power. This with a
> carbureted O-360 and running on the engine driven pump only. If I
> switch the aux pump back on the pressure indication comes back to the
> normal 2 to 4 psi range. I had this problem a few years ago and
> installing a new VDO pressure sender from Grand Rapids cured it, but
> this time a new sender did not help. The pressure take off is at the
> carburetor and the sender is mounted on the firewall, connected with a
> -2 hose.
>
> The thing that has me scratching my head is that the engine keeps
> running fine at high fuel flow even though the fuel pressure indicates
> zero or less, so I would suspect a bum sender again, but the fact that
> the pressure indication comes back to normal when I turn the aux pump
> back on has me baffled.
>
> HarryCrosby
> RV-6 N16CX, 1080 hours
>
> *
>
>
> *
>
> No virus found in this message.
> Checked by AVG - www.avg.com <http://www.avg.com>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Vincent Himsl <vshimsl(at)live.com> |
| Subject: | Low fuel pressure indication |
Only way a working gauge pressure transducer would register negative is
if its sensing a vacuum. I am keying in on fact you have takeoff at
carburetor rather than the fuel pump outlet and that your boost pump
readings are, compared to mine, low. I would also suspect you have the
fuel pressure transducer mounted fairly high up on the firewall.
Is it possible to move the takeoff back to the fuel pump out port near
the rear of the engine? Moving the =98T=99 to the fuel pump
output decreases the height differential and also the length of hose.
I am thinking your problem will disappear, and your current transducer
and quite possibly your old transducer, will work correctly reading more
like 4 to 6 PSI with boost pump on.
I may be way off, but moving the Takeoff is something
=98relatively=99 quick and inexpensive to try.
Regards,
VinceH
RV8432 flying
From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Linn Walters
Sent: Thursday, June 27, 2013 1:34 PM
Subject: Re: RV-List: Low fuel pressure indication
BTDT!!!
The sender 'wiper' sits in one place at where ever the fuel pressure
puts it. The normal engine vibration wears a hole in the carbon path
..... and the reading goes to zero. Turning on the electric pump moves
the wiper off it's 'normal' spot and onto a good spot.
Replaced the sender and my problem went away.
My sender had about 2500 hours on it but it's a crapshoot when it will
fail.
A prop balance is a good investment.
Linn
On 6/27/2013 2:07 PM, HCRV6(at)comcast.net wrote:
I have a puzzling problem and wondering if anyone can shed some light on
it. Under continuous high power settings, like in climb to altitude
after takeoff, my Grand Rapids EFIS fuel pressure indication drops to
zero and even shows a low negative value after a couple of minutes, but
the engine continues to run at full power. This with a carbureted O-360
and running on the engine driven pump only. If I switch the aux pump
back on the pressure indication comes back to the normal 2 to 4 psi
range. I had this problem a few years ago and installing a new VDO
pressure sender from Grand Rapids cured it, but this time a new sender
did not help. The pressure take off is at the carburetor and the sender
is mounted on the firewall, connected with a -2 hose.
The thing that has me scratching my head is that the engine keeps
running fine at high fuel flow even though the fuel pressure indicates
zero or less, so I would suspect a bum sender again, but the fact that
the pressure indication comes back to normal when I turn the aux pump
back on has me baffled.
Harry Crosby
RV-6 N16CX, 1080 hours
No virus found in this message.
Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
06/26/13
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | HCRV6(at)comcast.net |
| Subject: | Re: Low fuel pressure indication |
Thanks Mike, excellent point that was escaping me.
Harry
----- Original Message -----
From: "Mike Robertson" <mrobert569(at)hotmail.com>
Sent: Thursday, June 27, 2013 11:25:15 AM
Subject: RE: RV-List: Low fuel pressure indication
Harry,
Keep in mind that when we measure pressure we are really talking pressure differential.
If the throttle is full open then the fuel pressure differential may
actually be zero. For carb equipped airplanes I would not get too carried away
with a zero reading at full throttle as long as the engine is running good and
you still see some pressure when you turn on the boost pump.
Mike Robertson
Date: Thu, 27 Jun 2013 18:07:25 +0000
From: HCRV6(at)comcast.net
Subject: RV-List: Low fuel pressure indication
I have a puzzling problem and wondering if anyone can shed some light on it. Under
continuous high power settings, like in climb to altitude after takeoff, my
Grand Rapids EFIS fuel pressure indication drops to zero and even shows a low
negative value after a couple of minutes, but the engine continues to run at
full power. This with a carbureted O-360 and running on the engine driven pump
only. If I switch the aux pump back on the pressure indication comes back to
the normal 2 to 4 psi range. I had this problem a few years ago and installing
a new VDO pressure sender from Grand Rapids cured it, but this time a new sender
did not help. The pressure take off is at the carburetor and the sender is
mounted on the firewall, connected with a -2 hose.
The thing that has me scratching my head is that the engine keeps running fine
at high fuel flow even though the fuel pressure indicates zero or less, so I would
suspect a bum sender again, but the fact that the pressure indication comes
back to normal when I turn the aux pump back on has me baffled.
Harry Crosby
RV-6 N16CX, 1080 hours
get=_blank>http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV-List
ttp://forums.matronics.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Low fuel pressure injected engine |
Hello to all,
While the subject is on fuel pressure (carbureted engine) I thought
I=92d
relate a little problem I am encountering on occasion in my fuel
injected
engine.
I=92d be putting along at cruise speed when all of a sudden, some slight
misfire, loss of poser. I look at the fuel pressure and it is down from
26
psi to the low teens. A slight touch of the boost pump and the problem
disappears. Turn the boost pump off and the pressure continues up there
at
27 psi and I can continue and hour or more ' no incident.
Set up : TMX-360 (AKA IO-360), Precision Airmotive Silver Hawk Fuel
injection, standard injectors. Pmag and Slick. I run at 24/2400 8 USG/hr
and
get 150 knts ias.
Temporary vapor lock ? Mechanical fuel pump is beginning to have
problems ?
It=92s a glitch ' it does not happen on all flights and does not seem
related
to outside air temp. Any ideas ???
This does not keep me from flying but since the boost pump has become a
life
line, I am installing Andair=92s new fuel pump in line with the boost
pump as
a back up boost pump in case things get a little nasty.
Regards,
Mich=E8le
RV8 ' TMX-360
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | IFR RVs in the US |
I knew I=92d get knowledgeable responses from the list ' you guys are
great.
Such good stuff, thanks. Gives me the ammo to approach the French
authorities ' they really treat us like children ' no trust. They
want us to
have just about everything certified : engine and everything that goes
on
one, all avionics, gages, why not switches, breakers, wiring=85 with the
appropriate form One=92s on each item. Maintenance in a certified shop
and the
paper work to go along... Result ' there are no Night or IFR home
builts in
France ' there is one exception which proves the rule.
Thanks ' i=92ll work with the material/info you sent and would get
back off
line if I need clarifications.
Mich=E8le
De : owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com] De la part de Michele Delsol
Envoy=E9 : lundi 24 juin 2013 22:04
=C0 : rv-list(at)matronics.com
Objet : RV-List: IFR RVs in the US
Hello to all,
I=92ve been lurking on the sidelines of this list and have contributed
at
times during the build time of my RV8 ' from France. I have finished
the 8
which has been providing me with more joy than I anticipated. What a
great
airplane.
All would be perfect except that the French and most Europeans do not
allow
home builts to fly IFR. A few of the RV owners being military and/or
professional pilots with full IFR qualifications, with planes very well
equipped avionics wise, would like to change this. I have thus taken it
upon
myself within the context of our French RV builder group
(www.vansclubdefrance.fr) to explore the possibility of having the rules
changed, at least within the context of French skies.
Since the US FAA does allow experimental built airplanes to fly IFR in
the
US, my question to the list is : what are the criteria which would allow
an
RV to be flown IFR by a duly qualified IFR pilot ? Questions which come
to
mind are :
=B7 Does the engine have to be certified as opposed to a non
certified
such as Mattituck, Superior, Barret=85 ?
=B7 What about maintenance ' by certified mechanic or by owner
under a
certain conditions ?
=B7 Minimum avionics : ex. two radios, VORs, DME, other ?
=B7 Any steam gages ?
=B7 Does the owner who does his own maintenance have to acquire
specific qualifications ?
Thanks,
Mich=E8le Delsol
RV8 ' F-PDSL
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Linn Walters <flying-nut(at)cfl.rr.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Low fuel pressure injected engine |
On 6/28/2013 2:56 PM, Michele Delsol wrote:
>
> Hello to all,
>
> While the subject is on fuel pressure (carbureted engine) I thought
> I'd relate a little problem I am encountering on occasion in my fuel
> injected engine.
>
> I'd be putting along at cruise speed when all of a sudden, some slight
> misfire, loss of poser. I look at the fuel pressure and it is down
> from 26 psi to the low teens. A slight touch of the boost pump and the
> problem disappears. Turn the boost pump off and the pressure continues
> up there at 27 psi and I can continue and hour or more -- no incident.
>
> Set up : TMX-360 (AKA IO-360), Precision Airmotive Silver Hawk Fuel
> injection, standard injectors. Pmag and Slick. I run at 24/2400 8
> USG/hr and get 150 knts ias.
>
> Temporary vapor lock ?
>
Unlikely in cruise.
>
> Mechanical fuel pump is beginning to have problems ?
>
That's possible. There could be something that gets caught in the pump
valve(s) that's put back in it's 'resting place' when you turn the
electric pump on. Just speculation ......
>
> It's a glitch -- it does not happen on all flights and does not seem
> related to outside air temp. Any ideas ???
>
You might try changes in throttle or mixture to see it that changes
anything before using the electric pump. Let us know what you find.
Linn
>
> This does not keep me from flying but since the boost pump has become
> a life line, I am installing Andair's new fuel pump in line with the
> boost pump as a back up boost pump in case things get a little nasty.
>
> Regards,
>
> Michle
>
> RV8 -- TMX-360
>
> *
>
>
> *
>
> No virus found in this message.
> Checked by AVG - www.avg.com <http://www.avg.com>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Low fuel pressure injected engine |
| From: | Tracy <rwstracy(at)gmail.com> |
That is a mystery. But if the problem gets even slightly worse ( with old &
new boost pumps off) the likelihood of vapor lock as the problem is pretty h
igh. Any increase in flow resistance at that point in the system will make m
atters worse.
FWIW, many aircraft fuel systems are an excuse for vapor lock to happen. It
's no wonder using auto fuel pushes them over the edge.
Tracy Crook
2000+ hours on auto fuel without vapor lock.
Sent from my iPad
On Jun 28, 2013, at 12:56, "Michele Delsol" <mdelsol@md-dsl.fr> wrote:
> Hello to all,
>
> While the subject is on fuel pressure (carbureted engine) I thought I
=99d relate a little problem I am encountering on occasion in my fuel inject
ed engine.
>
> I=99d be putting along at cruise speed when all of a sudden, some sl
ight misfire, loss of poser. I look at the fuel pressure and it is down from
26 psi to the low teens. A slight touch of the boost pump and the problem d
isappears. Turn the boost pump off and the pressure continues up there at 27
psi and I can continue and hour or more =93 no incident.
>
> Set up : TMX-360 (AKA IO-360), Precision Airmotive Silver Hawk Fuel injec
tion, standard injectors. Pmag and Slick. I run at 24/2400 8 USG/hr and get 1
50 knts ias.
>
> Temporary vapor lock ? Mechanical fuel pump is beginning to have problems ?
It=99s a glitch =93 it does not happen on all flights and does n
ot seem related to outside air temp. Any ideas ???
>
> This does not keep me from flying but since the boost pump has become a li
fe line, I am installing Andair=99s new fuel pump in line with the boo
st pump as a back up boost pump in case things get a little nasty.
>
> Regards,
> Mich=C3=A8le
> RV8 =93 TMX-360
>
>
>
==========================
=========
==========================
=========
==========================
=========
==========================
=========
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Robin Marks <robin(at)PaintTheWeb.com> |
| Subject: | Low fuel pressure injected engine |
Mich=E8le
Do you know your TAS at those settings?
Robin
From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv-list-server@matro
nics.com] On Behalf Of Michele Delsol
Sent: Friday, June 28, 2013 11:57 AM
Subject: RV-List: Low fuel pressure injected engine
Hello to all,
While the subject is on fuel pressure (carbureted engine) I thought I'd rel
ate a little problem I am encountering on occasion in my fuel injected engi
ne.
I'd be putting along at cruise speed when all of a sudden, some slight misf
ire, loss of poser. I look at the fuel pressure and it is down from 26 psi
to the low teens. A slight touch of the boost pump and the problem disappea
rs. Turn the boost pump off and the pressure continues up there at 27 psi a
nd I can continue and hour or more - no incident.
Set up : TMX-360 (AKA IO-360), Precision Airmotive Silver Hawk Fuel inject
ion, standard injectors. Pmag and Slick. I run at 24/2400 8 USG/hr and get
150 knts ias.
Temporary vapor lock ? Mechanical fuel pump is beginning to have problems ?
It's a glitch - it does not happen on all flights and does not seem relate
d to outside air temp. Any ideas ???
This does not keep me from flying but since the boost pump has become a lif
e line, I am installing Andair's new fuel pump in line with the boost pump
as a back up boost pump in case things get a little nasty.
Regards,
Mich=E8le
RV8 - TMX-360
________________________________
No virus found in this message.
Checked by AVG - www.avg.com<http://www.avg.com>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Low fuel pressure injected engine |
Not exactly ' should be around 155 at 2500=92 ' should have 160+
22/2400 at
6500=92 ' 8 US gal/hr. I have forward induction with the snorkel. A
James cowl
with direct forward air feed should get me some more MP and less air
intake
hence more power at altitude and less drag, but that is just
conjecturing.
And another thread.
On the fuel pressure issue ' two flights today ' problem did not
manifest
itself ' a mystery. Outside air temp around 60=B0F. Flew between
400=92 and
7500=92.
Mich=E8le
De : owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com] De la part de Robin Marks
Envoy=E9 : samedi 29 juin 2013 07:26
=C0 : rv-list(at)matronics.com
Objet : RE: RV-List: Low fuel pressure injected engine
Mich=E8le
Do you know your TAS at those settings?
Robin
From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Michele Delsol
Sent: Friday, June 28, 2013 11:57 AM
Subject: RV-List: Low fuel pressure injected engine
Hello to all,
While the subject is on fuel pressure (carbureted engine) I thought
I=92d
relate a little problem I am encountering on occasion in my fuel
injected
engine.
I=92d be putting along at cruise speed when all of a sudden, some slight
misfire, loss of poser. I look at the fuel pressure and it is down from
26
psi to the low teens. A slight touch of the boost pump and the problem
disappears. Turn the boost pump off and the pressure continues up there
at
27 psi and I can continue and hour or more ' no incident.
Set up : TMX-360 (AKA IO-360), Precision Airmotive Silver Hawk Fuel
injection, standard injectors. Pmag and Slick. I run at 24/2400 8 USG/hr
and
get 150 knts ias.
Temporary vapor lock ? Mechanical fuel pump is beginning to have
problems ?
It=92s a glitch ' it does not happen on all flights and does not seem
related
to outside air temp. Any ideas ???
This does not keep me from flying but since the boost pump has become a
life
line, I am installing Andair=92s new fuel pump in line with the boost
pump as
a back up boost pump in case things get a little nasty.
Regards,
Mich=E8le
RV8 ' TMX-360
===================
bsp; - The RV-List Email Forum -
o browse
scription,
, Chat, FAQ,
/span>
tronics.com/Navigator?RV-List">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV-List
===================
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eb Forums!
.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com
===================
bsp; - List Contribution Web Site -
o:p>
bsp; -Matt Dralle, List Admin.
tronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/contribution
===================
_____
No virus found in this message.
Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
:p>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Charlie England <ceengland7(at)gmail.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Low fuel pressure indication |
There have been numerous threads on various lists & forums about low
fuel pressure indications with carb'd engines. Most indicate a sensor
design flaw, rather than an actual pressure issue. Here's a pretty good
example from VAF:
<http://www.vansairforce.com/community/showthread.php?t=97911&highlight=low+fuel+pressure>http://www.vansairforce.com/community/showthread.php?t=90682&highlight=low+fuel+pressure
Mike,
I'm not following how manifold pressure would affect a fuel pressure
reading, since with a carb'd engine the fuel pressure sensor is
measuring pressure between the engine pump & the inlet to the carb bowl
& isn't typically in the intake path. What am I missing?
Charlie
On 06/28/2013 12:10 PM, HCRV6(at)comcast.net wrote:
> Thanks Mike, excellent point that was escaping me.
>
> Harry
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> *From: *"Mike Robertson" <mrobert569(at)hotmail.com>
> *To: *"rv list"
> *Sent: *Thursday, June 27, 2013 11:25:15 AM
> *Subject: *RE: RV-List: Low fuel pressure indication
>
> Harry,
>
> Keep in mind that when we measure pressure we are really talking
> pressure differential. If the throttle is full open then the fuel
> pressure differential may actually be zero. For carb equipped
> airplanes I would not get too carried away with a zero reading at full
> throttle as long as the engine is running good and you still see some
> pressure when you turn on the boost pump.
>
> Mike Robertson
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> Date: Thu, 27 Jun 2013 18:07:25 +0000
> From: HCRV6(at)comcast.net
> To: RV-list(at)matronics.com
> Subject: RV-List: Low fuel pressure indication
>
> I have a puzzling problem and wondering if anyone can shed some light
> on it. Under continuous high power settings, like in climb to
> altitude after takeoff, my Grand Rapids EFIS fuel pressure indication
> drops to zero and even shows a low negative value after a couple of
> minutes, but the engine continues to run at full power. This with a
> carbureted O-360 and running on the engine driven pump only. If I
> switch the aux pump back on the pressure indication comes back to the
> normal 2 to 4 psi range. I had this problem a few years ago and
> installing a new VDO pressure sender from Grand Rapids cured it, but
> this time a new sender did not help. The pressure take off is at the
> carburetor and the sender is mounted on the firewall, connected with a
> -2 hose.
>
> The thing that has me scratching my head is that the engine keeps
> running fine at high fuel flow even though the fuel pressure indicates
> zero or less, so I would suspect a bum sender again, but the fact that
> the pressure indication comes back to normal when I turn the aux pump
> back on has me baffled.
>
> HarryCrosby
> RV-6 N16CX, 1080 hours
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Robin Marks <robin(at)PaintTheWeb.com> |
| Subject: | Low fuel pressure injected engine |
I have the exact same thing happen to me (IO-360 200 Hp, James Cowl, Bendex
, Mag/Pmag)
I fly 21.5/2250 LOP at 6.2-6.8 GPH ~158 TAS. My cylinder & oil temps are qu
ite low because there is so little pressure & minimal internal stress vs. 2
4 or 25 Squared ROP. It sort of feels like my system is gently falling asle
ep and then the fuel pump takes a nap. Sometimes I hit the boost pump and s
ometimes I let it drop and then catch back up with rarely a stumble. I do o
ccasionally have a stumble but I thing that is more related to my most lean
cylinder (LOP) getting too lean vs. system fuel starvation.
Good luck,
Robin
From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv-list-server@matro
nics.com] On Behalf Of Michele Delsol
Sent: Saturday, June 29, 2013 1:07 PM
Subject: RE: RV-List: Low fuel pressure injected engine
Not exactly - should be around 155 at 2500' - should have 160+ 22/2400 at 6
500' - 8 US gal/hr. I have forward induction with the snorkel. A James cowl
with direct forward air feed should get me some more MP and less air intak
e hence more power at altitude and less drag, but that is just conjecturing
. And another thread.
On the fuel pressure issue - two flights today - problem did not manifest i
tself - a mystery. Outside air temp around 60=B0F. Flew between 400' and 75
00'.
Mich=E8le
De : owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com] De la part de Robin Mar
ks
Envoy=E9 : samedi 29 juin 2013 07:26
=C0 : rv-list(at)matronics.com
Objet : RE: RV-List: Low fuel pressure injected engine
Mich=E8le
Do you know your TAS at those settings?
Robin
From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com<mailto:owner-rv-list-server@matron
ics.com> [mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Michele D
elsol
Sent: Friday, June 28, 2013 11:57 AM
Subject: RV-List: Low fuel pressure injected engine
Hello to all,
While the subject is on fuel pressure (carbureted engine) I thought I'd rel
ate a little problem I am encountering on occasion in my fuel injected engi
ne.
I'd be putting along at cruise speed when all of a sudden, some slight misf
ire, loss of poser. I look at the fuel pressure and it is down from 26 psi
to the low teens. A slight touch of the boost pump and the problem disappea
rs. Turn the boost pump off and the pressure continues up there at 27 psi a
nd I can continue and hour or more - no incident.
Set up : TMX-360 (AKA IO-360), Precision Airmotive Silver Hawk Fuel inject
ion, standard injectors. Pmag and Slick. I run at 24/2400 8 USG/hr and get
150 knts ias.
Temporary vapor lock ? Mechanical fuel pump is beginning to have problems ?
It's a glitch - it does not happen on all flights and does not seem relate
d to outside air temp. Any ideas ???
This does not keep me from flying but since the boost pump has become a lif
e line, I am installing Andair's new fuel pump in line with the boost pump
as a back up boost pump in case things get a little nasty.
Regards,
Mich=E8le
RV8 - TMX-360
===================
bsp; - The RV-List Email Forum -
o browse
scription,
, Chat, FAQ,
/span>
tronics.com/Navigator?RV-List">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV-List
===================
bsp; - MATRONICS WEB FORUMS -
eb Forums!
.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com
===================
bsp; - List Contribution Web Site -
o:p>
bsp; -Matt Dralle, List Admin.
tronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/contribution
===================
________________________________
No virus found in this message.
Checked by AVG - www.avg.com<http://www.avg.com>
:p>
http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV-List
http://forums.matronics.com
http://www.matronics.com/contribution
________________________________
No virus found in this message.
Checked by AVG - www.avg.com<http://www.avg.com>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Ralph E. Capen" <recapen(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | Nose gear leg repair using taper pin |
Folks,
>From the archives, I have retrieved a number of postings on replacing the AN5-20A
bolt/assembly with a taper pin.
That process involves the pin going in from the bottom - requiring separating the
engine mount from the airframe.
Has anyone performed this repair from the top-down? This looks like it could be
done with the engine mount still attached. I don't recall the engine-mount
weldment configuration - that may dictate the direction of the taper pin.
I have a barely perceptible movement in my nose gear leg and I want to get it fixed
before it gets worse. Acknowledging I am at a less than smooth grass field
which is a contributing factor - this may only be a temporary fix.
Thanks,
Ralph Capen
RV6A N822AR @ N06 190hrs
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Matt Dralle <dralle(at)matronics.com> |
| Subject: | Tailwheel Bearing - Separating Bronze Bearing... |
Dear Listers,
Well, I disassembled the tailwheel on the RV-6 and RV-8 this weekend and took the
wad of parts including the steel spring, bearing knuckles, forks and little
hub caps to the local powdercoaters.
But they won't accept the bearing knuckle because it has a bronze or brass sleeve!
They claim it will leak oil and make a mess in the oven. They expect me
to somehow get that sleeve out of the steel part! That seems crazy? Is that
even possible? Surely it won't just come out with a gentle knocking, will it?
Help...
Thanks!
-
Matt Dralle
RV-8 #82880 N998RV "Ruby Vixen"
http://www.mattsrv8.com - Matt's Complete RV-8 Construction Log
http://www.mattsrv8.com/Mishap - Landing Mishap Rebuild Log
http://www.youtube.com/MattsRV8 - Matt's RV-8 HDTV YouTube Channel
Status: 172+ Hours TTSN - Rebuilding Fuselage After Landing Mishap...
RV-6 #20916 N360EM "The Flyer"
http://www.mattsrv6.com - Matt's RV-6 Revitalization Log
Status: 150+ Hours Since Purchase - Upgrades Complete; Now In Full Flyer Mode
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Ed <decaclops(at)gmail.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Nose gear leg repair using taper pin |
Howdy Ralph,
Yup, I did it that way. It's a real pain to work behind the engine. I
drilled the pilot with a Milwaukee angle drill and worked the taper ream
with an air ratchet. I set the air pressure very low, just high enough
to keep the ratchet from stalling and used lots of cutting oil. It took
a long time and was painful to reach, but the nose gear is rock solid
now. I think I remember beating the firewall up a bit to make room to
get the taper pin washer, nut, and cotter pin on.
If I had it to do over, I'd probably pull the engine as far as the
hookups would allow and leave it dangling from the hoist while I worked
to make better access.
Ed Holyoke
On 7/1/2013 12:59 PM, Ralph E. Capen wrote:
>
> Folks,
>
>>From the archives, I have retrieved a number of postings on replacing the AN5-20A
bolt/assembly with a taper pin.
> That process involves the pin going in from the bottom - requiring separating
the engine mount from the airframe.
>
> Has anyone performed this repair from the top-down? This looks like it could
be done with the engine mount still attached. I don't recall the engine-mount
weldment configuration - that may dictate the direction of the taper pin.
>
> I have a barely perceptible movement in my nose gear leg and I want to get it
fixed before it gets worse. Acknowledging I am at a less than smooth grass field
which is a contributing factor - this may only be a temporary fix.
>
> Thanks,
> Ralph Capen
> RV6A N822AR @ N06 190hrs
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Mike Koehn" <mskoehn(at)comcast.net> |
| Subject: | RE: RV8-List: Tailwheel Bearing - Separating Bronze Bearing... |
I was faced with the same situation on the 8 but had second thoughts about
removing the bushing. In the end I left it in and had the painters
ultrasonically strip the thing in the degreaser tank. That worked reasonably
well. In the end there was a very small amount of oil that leached out of
the bearing or surround during the bake cycle which stained the powder coat
at one small spot on the bottom (depends probably on which way you hang it
on the rack) which even with the white coating was almost unnoticeable. Am
satisfied with the paint job and it surely was better than beating the
housing senseless with a hammer...
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv8-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv8-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Matt Dralle
Sent: Monday, July 01, 2013 5:10 PM
Subject: RV8-List: Tailwheel Bearing - Separating Bronze Bearing...
--> RV8-List message posted by: Matt Dralle
Dear Listers,
Well, I disassembled the tailwheel on the RV-6 and RV-8 this weekend and
took the wad of parts including the steel spring, bearing knuckles, forks
and little hub caps to the local powdercoaters.
But they won't accept the bearing knuckle because it has a bronze or brass
sleeve! They claim it will leak oil and make a mess in the oven. They
expect me to somehow get that sleeve out of the steel part! That seems
crazy? Is that even possible? Surely it won't just come out with a gentle
knocking, will it?
Help...
Thanks!
-
Matt Dralle
RV-8 #82880 N998RV "Ruby Vixen"
http://www.mattsrv8.com - Matt's Complete RV-8 Construction Log
http://www.mattsrv8.com/Mishap - Landing Mishap Rebuild Log
http://www.youtube.com/MattsRV8 - Matt's RV-8 HDTV YouTube Channel
Status: 172+ Hours TTSN - Rebuilding Fuselage After Landing Mishap...
RV-6 #20916 N360EM "The Flyer"
http://www.mattsrv6.com - Matt's RV-6 Revitalization Log
Status: 150+ Hours Since Purchase - Upgrades Complete; Now In Full Flyer
Mode
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Ralph E. Capen" <recapen(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Nose gear leg repair using taper pin |
Ed,
Thanks for your response. I am especially glad to hear that it cured the issue
in your case.
I'm still looking to review the plans and look at the mounting tube area again
to see if there are differences between the top/forward and bottom/aft sides...that
may influence my solution method.
I am leaning towards your method as it will allow the repair with a minimal amount
of dis-assembly - my plan 'B' is the same as your 'had it to do over'.
Ralph
-----Original Message-----
>From: Ed <decaclops(at)gmail.com>
>Sent: Jul 1, 2013 11:10 PM
>To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
>Subject: Re: RV-List: Nose gear leg repair using taper pin
>
>
>Howdy Ralph,
>
>Yup, I did it that way. It's a real pain to work behind the engine. I
>drilled the pilot with a Milwaukee angle drill and worked the taper ream
>with an air ratchet. I set the air pressure very low, just high enough
>to keep the ratchet from stalling and used lots of cutting oil. It took
>a long time and was painful to reach, but the nose gear is rock solid
>now. I think I remember beating the firewall up a bit to make room to
>get the taper pin washer, nut, and cotter pin on.
>
>If I had it to do over, I'd probably pull the engine as far as the
>hookups would allow and leave it dangling from the hoist while I worked
>to make better access.
>
>Ed Holyoke
>
>On 7/1/2013 12:59 PM, Ralph E. Capen wrote:
>>
>> Folks,
>>
>>>From the archives, I have retrieved a number of postings on replacing the AN5-20A
bolt/assembly with a taper pin.
>> That process involves the pin going in from the bottom - requiring separating
the engine mount from the airframe.
>>
>> Has anyone performed this repair from the top-down? This looks like it could
be done with the engine mount still attached. I don't recall the engine-mount
weldment configuration - that may dictate the direction of the taper pin.
>>
>> I have a barely perceptible movement in my nose gear leg and I want to get it
fixed before it gets worse. Acknowledging I am at a less than smooth grass
field which is a contributing factor - this may only be a temporary fix.
>>
>> Thanks,
>> Ralph Capen
>> RV6A N822AR @ N06 190hrs
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Mark Burns <burnsm(at)suddenlink.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Nose gear leg repair using taper pin |
Guys,
Another option is to use loctite.
I used loctite 609 with a new bolt and it kept things tight for about two
years. I discovered loctite 680 which is even better for this aplication
and used it about six months ago. So the jury is still out but it's an easy
fix for sure.
Slide the gear leg out. Clean it up and slather it up with loctite and
reassemble.
I move my 7A around without a tow bar most of the time and that "click" of
a loose nose gear is very annoying to me!
And yes you can get apart later if you need to for some reason. Just some
heat from a heat gun will soften it enough for removal.
Mark Burns
7A. 870 hours
>From my Galaxy S3
On July 2, 2013 6:16:41 AM "Ralph E. Capen" wrote:
>
> Ed,
> Thanks for your response. I am especially glad to hear that it cured the
> issue in your case.
> I'm still looking to review the plans and look at the mounting tube area
> again to see if there are differences between the top/forward and
> bottom/aft sides...that may influence my solution method.
> I am leaning towards your method as it will allow the repair with a minimal
> amount of dis-assembly - my plan 'B' is the same as your 'had it to do over'.
>
> Ralph
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> >From: Ed <decaclops(at)gmail.com>
> >Sent: Jul 1, 2013 11:10 PM
> >To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
> >Subject: Re: RV-List: Nose gear leg repair using taper pin
> >
> >
> >Howdy Ralph,
> >
> >Yup, I did it that way. It's a real pain to work behind the engine. I
> drilled the pilot with a Milwaukee angle drill and worked the taper ream
> with an air ratchet. I set the air pressure very low, just high enough to
> keep the ratchet from stalling and used lots of cutting oil. It took a long
> time and was painful to reach, but the nose gear is rock solid now. I think
> I remember beating the firewall up a bit to make room to get the taper pin
> washer, nut, and cotter pin on.
> >
> >If I had it to do over, I'd probably pull the engine as far as the hookups
> would allow and leave it dangling from the hoist while I worked to make
> better access.
> >
> >Ed Holyoke
> >
> >On 7/1/2013 12:59 PM, Ralph E. Capen wrote:
> >>
> >> Folks,
> >>
> >>>From the archives, I have retrieved a number of postings on replacing
> the AN5-20A bolt/assembly with a taper pin.
> >> That process involves the pin going in from the bottom - requiring
> separating the engine mount from the airframe.
> >>
> >> Has anyone performed this repair from the top-down? This looks like it
> could be done with the engine mount still attached. I don't recall the
> engine-mount weldment configuration - that may dictate the direction of the
> taper pin.
> >>
> >> I have a barely perceptible movement in my nose gear leg and I want to
> get it fixed before it gets worse. Acknowledging I am at a less than
> smooth grass field which is a contributing factor - this may only be a
> temporary fix.
> >>
> >> Thanks,
> >> Ralph Capen
> >> RV6A N822AR @ N06 190hrs
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Ralph E. Capen" <recapen(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Nose gear leg repair using taper pin |
Interesting option - I will look in to it!
-----Original Message-----
>From: Mark Burns <burnsm(at)suddenlink.net>
>Sent: Jul 2, 2013 8:58 AM
>To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
>Subject: Re: RV-List: Nose gear leg repair using taper pin
>
>
>Guys,
>Another option is to use loctite.
>I used loctite 609 with a new bolt and it kept things tight for about two
>years. I discovered loctite 680 which is even better for this aplication
>and used it about six months ago. So the jury is still out but it's an easy
>fix for sure.
>Slide the gear leg out. Clean it up and slather it up with loctite and
>reassemble.
>I move my 7A around without a tow bar most of the time and that "click" of
>a loose nose gear is very annoying to me!
>And yes you can get apart later if you need to for some reason. Just some
>heat from a heat gun will soften it enough for removal.
>
>Mark Burns
>7A. 870 hours
>
>>From my Galaxy S3
>
>
>On July 2, 2013 6:16:41 AM "Ralph E. Capen" wrote:
>>
>> Ed,
>> Thanks for your response. I am especially glad to hear that it cured the
>> issue in your case.
>> I'm still looking to review the plans and look at the mounting tube area
>> again to see if there are differences between the top/forward and
>> bottom/aft sides...that may influence my solution method.
>> I am leaning towards your method as it will allow the repair with a minimal
>> amount of dis-assembly - my plan 'B' is the same as your 'had it to do over'.
>>
>> Ralph
>>
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> >From: Ed <decaclops(at)gmail.com>
>> >Sent: Jul 1, 2013 11:10 PM
>> >To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
>> >Subject: Re: RV-List: Nose gear leg repair using taper pin
>> >
>> >
>> >Howdy Ralph,
>> >
>> >Yup, I did it that way. It's a real pain to work behind the engine. I
>> drilled the pilot with a Milwaukee angle drill and worked the taper ream
>> with an air ratchet. I set the air pressure very low, just high enough to
>> keep the ratchet from stalling and used lots of cutting oil. It took a long
>> time and was painful to reach, but the nose gear is rock solid now. I think
>> I remember beating the firewall up a bit to make room to get the taper pin
>> washer, nut, and cotter pin on.
>> >
>> >If I had it to do over, I'd probably pull the engine as far as the hookups
>> would allow and leave it dangling from the hoist while I worked to make
>> better access.
>> >
>> >Ed Holyoke
>> >
>> >On 7/1/2013 12:59 PM, Ralph E. Capen wrote:
>> >>
>> >> Folks,
>> >>
>> >>>From the archives, I have retrieved a number of postings on replacing
>> the AN5-20A bolt/assembly with a taper pin.
>> >> That process involves the pin going in from the bottom - requiring
>> separating the engine mount from the airframe.
>> >>
>> >> Has anyone performed this repair from the top-down? This looks like it
>> could be done with the engine mount still attached. I don't recall the
>> engine-mount weldment configuration - that may dictate the direction of the
>> taper pin.
>> >>
>> >> I have a barely perceptible movement in my nose gear leg and I want to
>> get it fixed before it gets worse. Acknowledging I am at a less than
>> smooth grass field which is a contributing factor - this may only be a
>> temporary fix.
>> >>
>> >> Thanks,
>> >> Ralph Capen
>> >> RV6A N822AR @ N06 190hrs
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | tailwheel powder coating |
| From: | Vince Frazier <vincefrazier(at)gmail.com> |
From: Matt Dralle <dralle(at)matronics.com>
Subject: RV-List: Tailwheel Bearing - Separating Bronze Bearing...
Dear Listers,
Well, I disassembled the tailwheel on the RV-6 and RV-8 this weekend and
took the
wad of parts including the steel spring, bearing knuckles, forks and little
hub caps to the local powdercoaters.
But they won't accept the bearing knuckle because it has a bronze or brass
sleeve!
They claim it will leak oil and make a mess in the oven. They expect me
to somehow get that sleeve out of the steel part! That seems crazy? Is
that
even possible? Surely it won't just come out with a gentle knocking, will
it?
Help...
Thanks!
Matt Dralle SNIP
Matt,
Don't take it out unless you are prepared to install a brand new one, which
requires minor machining around the cam groove. Removal will undoubtedly
loosen it to the point that it is sloppy.
FWIW, we use engineered plastic bushings in our mounting sockets... but
those can't be baked either! They are easier to install/machine, more
durable, and don't require the locking screw to retain them. (Don't
mistake the locking screw for a grease zerk... it's useless to grease the
spindle with it. You need to disassemble the parts to properly grease
them.)
I suggest that you bead blast the parts and paint them. Sorry.
FWIW, in my experience, powder coating is not appropriate for aviation
steel parts. ( I can feel the flames already.) For example, I have an Avid
Flyer engine mount in my shop right now that is about 20 years old and the
powder coating is cracked and flaking in several spots. There is heavy
rust beneath.... which is invisible until it flakes. The plane has been
hangared all of it's life and has only 250 hours on it. To me, that powder
coating is an accident waiting to happen. It's also rather difficult to
strip off. Why anyone would use it is beyond my grasp. Sure, it looks
nice... but is it worth your life if it hides cracks and rust?
YMMV,
Vince
www.flyboyaccessories.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | RV6 Flyer <rv6_flyer(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | tailwheel powder coating |
Echoing some of what Vince said=2C I do not like Powder Coast on high stres
s steel airplane parts. The Powder coat tends to hide cracks that paint wi
ll not. Do you want a crack to develop in one of your steel parts and be h
idden from view?
Gary A. Sobek
"My Sanity" RV-6 N157GS O-320 Hartzell=2C
2=2C720+ Flying Hours So. CA=2C USA
Date: Tue=2C 2 Jul 2013 08:47:53 -0500
Subject: RV-List: tailwheel powder coating
From: vincefrazier(at)gmail.com
=0A
From: Matt Dralle <dralle(at)matronics.com>
=0A
Subject: RV-List: Tailwheel Bearing - Separating Bronze Bearing...
=0A
=0A
=0A
=0A
Dear Listers=2C
=0A
=0A
Well=2C I disassembled the tailwheel on the RV-6 and RV-8 this weekend and
took the
=0A
wad of parts including the steel spring=2C bearing knuckles=2C forks and li
ttle
=0A
hub caps to the local powdercoaters.
=0A
=0A
But they won't accept the bearing knuckle because it has a bronze or brass
sleeve!
=0A
They claim it will leak oil and make a mess in the oven. They expect me
=0A
to somehow get that sleeve out of the steel part! That seems crazy? Is th
at
=0A
even possible? Surely it won't just come out with a gentle knocking=2C wil
l it?
=0A
=0A
Help...
=0A
=0A
Thanks!
=0A
Matt Dralle SNIP
Matt=2C
Don't take it out unless you are prepared to install a brand new one=2C whi
ch requires minor machining around the cam groove. Removal will undoubtedly
loosen it to the point that it is sloppy.
=0A
FWIW=2C we use engineered plastic bushings in our mounting sockets... but t
hose can't be baked either! They are easier to install/machine=2C more dur
able=2C and don't require the locking screw to retain them. (Don't mistake
the locking screw for a grease zerk... it's useless to grease the spindle
with it. You need to disassemble the parts to properly grease them.)
=0A
I suggest that you bead blast the parts and paint them. Sorry.
FWIW=2C in my experience=2C powder coating is not appropriate for aviation
steel parts. ( I can feel the flames already.) For example=2C I have an Avi
d Flyer engine mount in my shop right now that is about 20 years old and th
e powder coating is cracked and flaking in several spots. There is heavy r
ust beneath.... which is invisible until it flakes. The plane has been han
gared all of it's life and has only 250 hours on it. To me=2C that powder
coating is an accident waiting to happen. It's also rather difficult to st
rip off. Why anyone would use it is beyond my grasp. Sure=2C it looks nic
e... but is it worth your life if it hides cracks and rust?
=0A
YMMV=2C
Vince
www.flyboyaccessories.com
=0A
=0A
=0A
=0A
============0A
============0A
============0A
============0A
=0A
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | HCRV6(at)comcast.net |
| Subject: | Re: tailwheel powder coating |
Back when I was building my RV-6 slider, I discovered that my brand new powder
coated canopy bar was rusted in many places under the powder coating. The only
way I discovered that was that I accidentally chipped the powder coating in one
place and noticed the rust underneath. It took me several weeks of grinding
and chipping to remove all the powder coat so that I could paint the bar. After
that I would be very reluctant to use powder coating on critical steel parts.
Harry Crosby
RV-6 N16CX, 1082 hours
----- Original Message -----
From: "RV6 Flyer" <rv6_flyer(at)hotmail.com>
Sent: Tuesday, July 2, 2013 9:00:25 AM
Subject: RE: RV-List: tailwheel powder coating
Echoing some of what Vince said, I do not like Powder Coast on high stress steel
airplane parts. The Powder coat tends to hide cracks that paint will not. Do
you want a crack to develop in one of your steel parts and be hidden from view?
Gary A. Sobek
"My Sanity" RV-6 N157GS O-320 Hartzell,
2,720+ Flying Hours So. CA, USA
Date: Tue, 2 Jul 2013 08:47:53 -0500
Subject: RV-List: tailwheel powder coating
From: vincefrazier(at)gmail.com
From: Matt Dralle < dralle(at)matronics.com >
Subject: RV-List: Tailwheel Bearing - Separating Bronze Bearing...
Dear Listers,
Well, I disassembled the tailwheel on the RV-6 and RV-8 this weekend and took the
wad of parts including the steel spring, bearing knuckles, forks and little
hub caps to the local powdercoaters.
But they won't accept the bearing knuckle because it has a bronze or brass sleeve!
They claim it will leak oil and make a mess in the oven. They expect me
to somehow get that sleeve out of the steel part! That seems crazy? Is that
even possible? Surely it won't just come out with a gentle knocking, will it?
Help...
Thanks!
Matt Dralle SNIP
Matt,
Don't take it out unless you are prepared to install a brand new one, which requires
minor machining around the cam groove. Removal will undoubtedly loosen it
to the point that it is sloppy.
FWIW, we use engineered plastic bushings in our mounting sockets... but those can't
be baked either! They are easier to install/machine, more durable, and don't
require the locking screw to retain them. (Don't mistake the locking screw
for a grease zerk... it's useless to grease the spindle with it. You need to
disassemble the parts to properly grease them.)
I suggest that you bead blast the parts and paint them. Sorry.
FWIW, in my experience, powder coating is not appropriate for aviation steel parts.
( I can feel the flames already.) For example, I have an Avid Flyer engine
mount in my shop right now that is about 20 years old and the powder coating
is cracked and flaking in several spots. There is heavy rust beneath.... which
is invisible until it flakes. The plane has been hangared all of it's life and
has only 250 hours on it. To me, that powder coating is an accident waiting
to happen. It's also rather difficult to strip off. Why anyone would use it is
beyond my grasp. Sure, it looks nice... but is it worth your life if it hides
cracks and rust?
YMMV,
Vince
www.flyboyaccessories.com
==========
get="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV-List
==========
http://forums.matronics.com
==========
="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: tailwheel powder coating |
| From: | mr.gsun(at)gmail.com |
What about the engine mount?
Greg
On Jul 2, 2013 10:55 AM, wrote:
> Back when I was building my RV-6 slider, I discovered that my brand new
> powder coated canopy bar was rusted in many places under the powder
> coating. The only way I discovered that was that I accidentally chipped
> the powder coating in one place and noticed the rust underneath. It took
> me several weeks of grinding and chipping to remove all the powder coat so
> that I could paint the bar. After that I would be very reluctant to use
> powder coating on critical steel parts.
>
> Harry Crosby
> RV-6 N16CX, 1082 hours
>
> ------------------------------
> *From: *"RV6 Flyer" <rv6_flyer(at)hotmail.com>
> *To: *rv-list(at)matronics.com
> *Sent: *Tuesday, July 2, 2013 9:00:25 AM
> *Subject: *RE: RV-List: tailwheel powder coating
>
>
> Echoing some of what Vince said, I do not like Powder Coast on high stress
> steel airplane parts. The Powder coat tends to hide cracks that paint will
> not. Do you want a crack to develop in one of your steel parts and be
> hidden from view?
>
>
> Gary A. Sobek
> "My Sanity" RV-6 N157GS O-320 Hartzell,
> 2,720+ Flying Hours So. CA, USA
>
> ------------------------------
> Date: Tue, 2 Jul 2013 08:47:53 -0500
> Subject: RV-List: tailwheel powder coating
> From: vincefrazier(at)gmail.com
> To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
>
> From: Matt Dralle <dralle(at)matronics.com>
> Subject: RV-List: Tailwheel Bearing - Separating Bronze Bearing...
>
>
> Dear Listers,
>
> Well, I disassembled the tailwheel on the RV-6 and RV-8 this weekend and
> took the
> wad of parts including the steel spring, bearing knuckles, forks and little
> hub caps to the local powdercoaters.
>
> But they won't accept the bearing knuckle because it has a bronze or brass
> sleeve!
> They claim it will leak oil and make a mess in the oven. They expect me
> to somehow get that sleeve out of the steel part! That seems crazy? Is
> that
> even possible? Surely it won't just come out with a gentle knocking, will
> it?
>
> Help...
>
> Thanks!
> Matt Dralle SNIP
>
> Matt,
>
> Don't take it out unless you are prepared to install a brand new one,
> which requires minor machining around the cam groove. Removal will
> undoubtedly loosen it to the point that it is sloppy.
>
> FWIW, we use engineered plastic bushings in our mounting sockets... but
> those can't be baked either! They are easier to install/machine, more
> durable, and don't require the locking screw to retain them. (Don't
> mistake the locking screw for a grease zerk... it's useless to grease the
> spindle with it. You need to disassemble the parts to properly grease
> them.)
>
> I suggest that you bead blast the parts and paint them. Sorry.
>
> FWIW, in my experience, powder coating is not appropriate for aviation
> steel parts. ( I can feel the flames already.) For example, I have an Avid
> Flyer engine mount in my shop right now that is about 20 years old and the
> powder coating is cracked and flaking in several spots. There is heavy
> rust beneath.... which is invisible until it flakes. The plane has been
> hangared all of it's life and has only 250 hours on it. To me, that powder
> coating is an accident waiting to happen. It's also rather difficult to
> strip off. Why anyone would use it is beyond my grasp. Sure, it looks
> nice... but is it worth your life if it hides cracks and rust?
>
> YMMV,
> Vince
> www.flyboyaccessories.com
>
> *
>
> ==========
> get="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV-List
> ===========http://forums.matronics.com
> ==========
> ="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution
> ==========
> *
>
> *
>
> *
>
> *
>
> *
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | HCRV6(at)comcast.net |
| Subject: | Re: tailwheel powder coating |
After the canopy frame experience, I ordered the engine mount bare and painted
it myself.
Harry Crosby
RV-6 N16CX, 1082 hours
----- Original Message -----
From: "mr gsun" <mr.gsun(at)gmail.com>
Sent: Tuesday, July 2, 2013 11:06:44 AM
Subject: Re: RV-List: tailwheel powder coating
What about the engine mount?
Greg
On Jul 2, 2013 10:55 AM, < HCRV6(at)comcast.net > wrote:
Back when I was building my RV-6 slider, I discovered that my brand new powder
coated canopy bar was rusted in many places under the powder coating. The only
way I discovered that was that I accidentally chipped the powder coating in one
place and noticed the rust underneath. It took me several weeks of grinding
and chipping to remove all the powder coat so that I could paint the bar. After
that I would be very reluctant to use powder coating on critical steel parts.
Harry Crosby
RV-6 N16CX, 1082 hours
From: "RV6 Flyer" < rv6_flyer(at)hotmail.com >
Sent: Tuesday, July 2, 2013 9:00:25 AM
Subject: RE: RV-List: tailwheel powder coating
Echoing some of what Vince said, I do not like Powder Coast on high stress steel
airplane parts. The Powder coat tends to hide cracks that paint will not. Do
you want a crack to develop in one of your steel parts and be hidden from view?
Gary A. Sobek
"My Sanity" RV-6 N157GS O-320 Hartzell,
2,720+ Flying Hours So. CA, USA
Date: Tue, 2 Jul 2013 08:47:53 -0500
Subject: RV-List: tailwheel powder coating
From: vincefrazier(at)gmail.com
From: Matt Dralle < dralle(at)matronics.com >
Subject: RV-List: Tailwheel Bearing - Separating Bronze Bearing...
Dear Listers,
Well, I disassembled the tailwheel on the RV-6 and RV-8 this weekend and took the
wad of parts including the steel spring, bearing knuckles, forks and little
hub caps to the local powdercoaters.
But they won't accept the bearing knuckle because it has a bronze or brass sleeve!
They claim it will leak oil and make a mess in the oven. They expect me
to somehow get that sleeve out of the steel part! That seems crazy? Is that
even possible? Surely it won't just come out with a gentle knocking, will it?
Help...
Thanks!
Matt Dralle SNIP
Matt,
Don't take it out unless you are prepared to install a brand new one, which requires
minor machining around the cam groove. Removal will undoubtedly loosen it
to the point that it is sloppy.
FWIW, we use engineered plastic bushings in our mounting sockets... but those can't
be baked either! They are easier to install/machine, more durable, and don't
require the locking screw to retain them. (Don't mistake the locking screw
for a grease zerk... it's useless to grease the spindle with it. You need to
disassemble the parts to properly grease them.)
I suggest that you bead blast the parts and paint them. Sorry.
FWIW, in my experience, powder coating is not appropriate for aviation steel parts.
( I can feel the flames already.) For example, I have an Avid Flyer engine
mount in my shop right now that is about 20 years old and the powder coating
is cracked and flaking in several spots. There is heavy rust beneath.... which
is invisible until it flakes. The plane has been hangared all of it's life and
has only 250 hours on it. To me, that powder coating is an accident waiting
to happen. It's also rather difficult to strip off. Why anyone would use it is
beyond my grasp. Sure, it looks nice... but is it worth your life if it hides
cracks and rust?
YMMV,
Vince
www.flyboyaccessories.com
get="_blank"> http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV-List http://forums.matronics.com ="_blank"> http://www.matronics.com/contribution t="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV-List
tp://forums.matronics.com
_blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "LARRY C. BOWLES" <SCHYBOLT(at)austin.rr.com> |
| Subject: | Re: tailwheel powder coating |
WHAT ABOUT THE LANDING GEAR???????????
From: mr.gsun(at)gmail.com
Sent: Tuesday, July 02, 2013 1:06 PM
Subject: Re: RV-List: tailwheel powder coating
What about the engine mount?
Greg
On Jul 2, 2013 10:55 AM, wrote:
Back when I was building my RV-6 slider, I discovered that my brand
new powder coated canopy bar was rusted in many places under the powder
coating. The only way I discovered that was that I accidentally chipped
the powder coating in one place and noticed the rust underneath. It
took me several weeks of grinding and chipping to remove all the powder
coat so that I could paint the bar. After that I would be very
reluctant to use powder coating on critical steel parts.
Harry Crosby
RV-6 N16CX, 1082 hours
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
-----
From: "RV6 Flyer" <rv6_flyer(at)hotmail.com>
To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
Sent: Tuesday, July 2, 2013 9:00:25 AM
Subject: RE: RV-List: tailwheel powder coating
Echoing some of what Vince said, I do not like Powder Coast on high
stress steel airplane parts. The Powder coat tends to hide cracks that
paint will not. Do you want a crack to develop in one of your steel
parts and be hidden from view?
Gary A. Sobek
"My Sanity" RV-6 N157GS O-320 Hartzell,
2,720+ Flying Hours So. CA, USA
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
-----
Date: Tue, 2 Jul 2013 08:47:53 -0500
Subject: RV-List: tailwheel powder coating
From: vincefrazier(at)gmail.com
To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
From: Matt Dralle <dralle(at)matronics.com>
Subject: RV-List: Tailwheel Bearing - Separating Bronze Bearing...
Dear Listers,
Well, I disassembled the tailwheel on the RV-6 and RV-8 this weekend
and took the
wad of parts including the steel spring, bearing knuckles, forks and
little
hub caps to the local powdercoaters.
But they won't accept the bearing knuckle because it has a bronze or
brass sleeve!
They claim it will leak oil and make a mess in the oven. They expect
me
to somehow get that sleeve out of the steel part! That seems crazy?
Is that
even possible? Surely it won't just come out with a gentle knocking,
will it?
Help...
Thanks!
Matt Dralle SNIP
Matt,
Don't take it out unless you are prepared to install a brand new one,
which requires minor machining around the cam groove. Removal will
undoubtedly loosen it to the point that it is sloppy.
FWIW, we use engineered plastic bushings in our mounting sockets...
but those can't be baked either! They are easier to install/machine,
more durable, and don't require the locking screw to retain them.
(Don't mistake the locking screw for a grease zerk... it's useless to
grease the spindle with it. You need to disassemble the parts to
properly grease them.)
I suggest that you bead blast the parts and paint them. Sorry.
FWIW, in my experience, powder coating is not appropriate for aviation
steel parts. ( I can feel the flames already.) For example, I have an
Avid Flyer engine mount in my shop right now that is about 20 years old
and the powder coating is cracked and flaking in several spots. There
is heavy rust beneath.... which is invisible until it flakes. The plane
has been hangared all of it's life and has only 250 hours on it. To me,
that powder coating is an accident waiting to happen. It's also rather
difficult to strip off. Why anyone would use it is beyond my grasp.
Sure, it looks nice... but is it worth your life if it hides cracks and
rust?
YMMV,
Vince
www.flyboyaccessories.com
get="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV-List
http://forums.matronics.com
="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution
t="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV-List
tp://forums.matronics.com
_blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Kelly McMullen <kellym(at)aviating.com> |
| Subject: | Re: tailwheel powder coating |
What about all the steel parts that Vans supplies already powder coated?
Like main gear mounts, engine mount, various bellcranks, etc.???
On 7/2/2013 7:15 PM, LARRY C. BOWLES wrote:
> WHAT ABOUT THE LANDING GEAR???????????
> *From:* mr.gsun(at)gmail.com
> *Sent:* Tuesday, July 02, 2013 1:06 PM
> *To:* rv-list(at)matronics.com
> *Subject:* Re: RV-List: tailwheel powder coating
>
> What about the engine mount?
>
> Greg
>
> On Jul 2, 2013 10:55 AM, > wrote:
>
> Back when I was building my RV-6 slider, I discovered that my
> brand new powder coated canopy bar was rusted in many places under
> the powder coating. The only way I discovered that was that I
> accidentally chipped the powder coating in one place and noticed
> the rust underneath. It took me several weeks of grinding and
> chipping to remove all the powder coat so that I could paint the
> bar. After that I would be very reluctant to use powder coating
> on critical steel parts.
>
> HarryCrosby
> RV-6 N16CX, 1082 hours
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> *From: *"RV6 Flyer" <rv6_flyer(at)hotmail.com
> >
> *To: *rv-list(at)matronics.com
> *Sent: *Tuesday, July 2, 2013 9:00:25 AM
> *Subject: *RE: RV-List: tailwheel powder coating
>
>
> Echoing some of what Vince said, I do not like Powder Coast on
> high stress steel airplane parts. The Powder coat tends to hide
> cracks that paint will not. Do you want a crack to develop in one
> of your steel parts and be hidden from view?
>
>
> Gary A. Sobek
> "My Sanity" RV-6 N157GS O-320 Hartzell,
> 2,720+ Flying Hours So. CA, USA
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> Date: Tue, 2 Jul 2013 08:47:53 -0500
> Subject: RV-List: tailwheel powder coating
> From: vincefrazier(at)gmail.com <mailto:vincefrazier(at)gmail.com>
> To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
>
> From: Matt Dralle <dralle(at)matronics.com <mailto:dralle(at)matronics.com>>
> Subject: RV-List: Tailwheel Bearing - Separating Bronze Bearing...
>
>
> Dear Listers,
>
> Well, I disassembled the tailwheel on the RV-6 and RV-8 this
> weekend and took the
> wad of parts including the steel spring, bearing knuckles, forks
> and little
> hub caps to the local powdercoaters.
>
> But they won't accept the bearing knuckle because it has a bronze
> or brass sleeve!
> They claim it will leak oil and make a mess in the oven. They
> expect me
> to somehow get that sleeve out of the steel part! That seems
> crazy? Is that
> even possible? Surely it won't just come out with a gentle
> knocking, will it?
>
> Help...
>
> Thanks!
> Matt Dralle SNIP
>
> Matt,
>
> Don't take it out unless you are prepared to install a brand new
> one, which requires minor machining around the cam groove. Removal
> will undoubtedly loosen it to the point that it is sloppy.
>
> FWIW, we use engineered plastic bushings in our mounting
> sockets... but those can't be baked either! They are easier to
> install/machine, more durable, and don't require the locking screw
> to retain them. (Don't mistake the locking screw for a grease
> zerk... it's useless to grease the spindle with it. You need to
> disassemble the parts to properly grease them.)
>
> I suggest that you bead blast the parts and paint them. Sorry.
>
> FWIW, in my experience, powder coating is not appropriate for
> aviation steel parts. ( I can feel the flames already.) For
> example, I have an Avid Flyer engine mount in my shop right now
> that is about 20 years old and the powder coating is cracked and
> flaking in several spots. There is heavy rust beneath.... which
> is invisible until it flakes. The plane has been hangared all of
> it's life and has only 250 hours on it. To me, that powder
> coating is an accident waiting to happen. It's also rather
> difficult to strip off. Why anyone would use it is beyond my
> grasp. Sure, it looks nice... but is it worth your life if it
> hides cracks and rust?
>
> YMMV,
> Vince
> www.flyboyaccessories.com <http://www.flyboyaccessories.com>
>
> *
>
> get="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV-List
> http://forums.matronics.com
> ="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution
>
> *
>
> *
>
>
> *
>
> *
>
> t="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV-List
> tp://forums.matronics.com
> _blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution
>
> *
>
> *
>
> href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV-List">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV-List
> href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com
> href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c
> *
> *
>
>
> *
-----
No virus found in this message.
Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Robin Marks <robin(at)PaintTheWeb.com> |
| Subject: | G3x Autopilot & Accessories |
Not sure everyone has seen the new Garmin G3x AP & servos but it looks like
they are kicking it into high gear with full G3x accessories. The AP is on
ly $750! Servos are also $750 ea.
Garmin is also offering a AOA Pitot & Heated AOA Pitot for $199 & $299 with
a regulated AOA Pitot coming. They also have a new back up ADAHRS.
Products
http://www.garmin.com/us/products/intheair/sport-aviation/prices
Here are some videos
http://www.garmin.com/us/products/intheair/sport-aviation/media/
[https://static.garmincdn.com/en/m/g/custom-pages/in-the-air/sport-aviation
/sf/gmc305.jpg]
[https://static.garmincdn.com/en/m/g/custom-pages/in-the-air/sport-aviation
/sf/gap26.jpg]
[https://static.garmincdn.com/en/m/g/custom-pages/in-the-air/sport-aviation
/sf/gsa28.jpg]
[https://static.garmincdn.com/en/m/g/custom-pages/in-the-air/sport-aviation
/sf/gsu25.jpg]
Robin
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Hopperdhh(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: tailwheel powder coating |
When I bent the canopy frame to make it fit I got cracks in the power
coating and scraped some off and found rust. I thought it was probably rusty
when they painted it. That could be the case with other parts as well.
Dan Hopper
RV-7A N766DH flying since 2004
In a message dated 7/2/2013 11:51:42 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time,
kellym(at)aviating.com writes:
What about all the steel parts that Vans supplies already powder coated?
Like main gear mounts, engine mount, various bellcranks, etc.???
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Carl Froehlich" <carl.froehlich(at)verizon.net> |
| Subject: | RE: RV10-List: G3x Autopilot & Accessories |
Considering they are matching Dynon on autopilot pricing, I'm thrilled that
Garmin is finally feeling some competition pressure.
Considering the grossly overpriced GTN-650 I put in my RV-10 (and horrible
Garmin after the sale service), perhaps we will soon have more value based
options for the rest of our avionics. I predict Dynon will again lead the
way.
Carl
RV-10 (105 hours)
RV-8A (sold - but it went to a good home)
From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Robin Marks
Sent: Tuesday, July 02, 2013 11:56 PM
Subject: RV10-List: G3x Autopilot & Accessories
Not sure everyone has seen the new Garmin G3x AP & servos but it looks like
they are kicking it into high gear with full G3x accessories. The AP is only
$750! Servos are also $750 ea.
Garmin is also offering a AOA Pitot & Heated AOA Pitot for $199 & $299 with
a regulated AOA Pitot coming. They also have a new back up ADAHRS.
Products
http://www.garmin.com/us/products/intheair/sport-aviation/prices
Here are some videos
http://www.garmin.com/us/products/intheair/sport-aviation/media/
https://static.garmincdn.com/en/m/g/custom-pages/in-the-air/sport-aviation/s
f/gmc305.jpg
https://static.garmincdn.com/en/m/g/custom-pages/in-the-air/sport-aviation/s
f/gap26.jpg
https://static.garmincdn.com/en/m/g/custom-pages/in-the-air/sport-aviation/s
f/gsa28.jpg
https://static.garmincdn.com/en/m/g/custom-pages/in-the-air/sport-aviation/s
f/gsu25.jpg
Robin
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | powder coating thoughts |
| From: | Vince Frazier <vincefrazier(at)gmail.com> |
SNIP
> Echoing some of what Vince said I do not like Powder Coast on high stres
> s steel airplane parts. The Powder coat tends to hide cracks that paint wi
> ll not. Do you want a crack to develop in one of your steel parts and be h
> idden from view?
>
> Gary A. Sobek
> "My Sanity" RV-6 N157GS O-320 Hartzell=2C
> 2=2C720+ Flying Hours So. CA=2C USA
>
>
> From: HCRV6(at)comcast.net
> Subject: Re: RV-List: tailwheel powder coating
>
> Back when I was building my RV-6 slider, I discovered that my brand new
> powder
> coated canopy bar was rusted in many places under the powder coating. The
> only
> way I discovered that was that I accidentally chipped the powder coating
> in one
> place and noticed the rust underneath. It took me several weeks of grinding
> and chipping to remove all the powder coat so that I could paint the bar.
> After
> that I would be very reluctant to use powder coating on critical steel
> parts.
>
>
> Harry Crosby
> RV-6 N16CX, 1082 hours
>
> ----- Original Message -----
>
> Subject: Re: RV-List: tailwheel powder coating
> From: mr.gsun(at)gmail.com
>
> What about the engine mount?
>
> Greg
>
>
> From: HCRV6(at)comcast.net
> Subject: Re: RV-List: tailwheel powder coating
>
> After the canopy frame experience, I ordered the engine mount bare and
> painted
> it myself.
>
>
> Harry Crosby
>
> From: "LARRY C. BOWLES" <SCHYBOLT(at)austin.rr.com>
> Subject: Re: RV-List: tailwheel powder coating
>
> WHAT ABOUT THE LANDING GEAR???????????
>
>
> From: Kelly McMullen <kellym(at)aviating.com>
> Subject: Re: RV-List: tailwheel powder coating
>
>
> What about all the steel parts that Vans supplies already powder coated?
> Like main gear mounts, engine mount, various bellcranks, etc.???
>
> SNIP
My comments are not meant to bash any kit company, but I think they are
doing the kitbuilders a HUGE disservice by offering powder coated parts.
Builders would be much better off to pay someone to paint the parts than to
pay for powder coating!
There is a huge misconception that powder coating will protect the parts.
Once it cracks (and it will), moisture has a highway to the steel and WILL
create LOTS of rust because it's hidden. Of course, if the guy doing the
powder coating doesn't properly blast and clean the steel before it's
powder coated, then you're already starting off badly! Since there is no
way to check the part preparation without damaging the powder coating, then
what do you think the average powder coating shop will do?
In my opinion, powder coating is for beauty, paint is for protection.
I wouldn't put powder coating on an engine mount, no way, no how. I've
been around RVs since 1987 and have yet to see an RV4,6,7 or other
taildragger engine mount that doesn't develop cracks after XXX hours of
use. Nosedragger RVs might be OK. I can't say as we don't have as many of
those around my area.
Please don't make rash decisions based solely on my comments, but in my
opinion, I'd remove any powder coating from my engine mount and any other
flight critical parts. It's tough to beat a good, light grey or white,
epoxy finish on those parts. It makes cracks and rust show up easily.
Sorry if this creates consternation for anyone, but this is a clear case
for "do it right, or do it over."
FWIW, we get asked all the time if we offer our tailwheel parts already
powder coated. The answer has been and will remain "no."
YMMV.
Thanks,
Vince
www.flyboyaccessories.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Linn Walters <flying-nut(at)cfl.rr.com> |
| Subject: | Re: powder coating thoughts |
Been watching this thread ......
Rust under the powder coat was probably there when it was coated. The
heat necessary to melt the powder coat doesn't change the steel at all,
and powder coat really seals out the moisture. You might see fatigue
cracks earlier with powder coat than paint since the powder coat is
brittle and paint still has a little flex to it. My nose gear had some
rust under the powder coat but I'll Ospho that and paint over it.
Linn ...... fitting the cowl
\On 7/3/2013 9:57 AM, Vince Frazier wrote:
>
> SNIP
>
> Echoing some of what Vince said I do not like Powder Coast on high
> stres
> s steel airplane parts. The Powder coat tends to hide cracks that
> paint wi
> ll not. Do you want a crack to develop in one of your steel parts
> and be h
> idden from view?
>
> Gary A. Sobek
> "My Sanity" RV-6 N157GS O-320 Hartzell=2C
> 2=2C720+ Flying Hours So. CA=2C USA
>
>
> From: HCRV6(at)comcast.net <mailto:HCRV6(at)comcast.net>
> Subject: Re: RV-List: tailwheel powder coating
>
> Back when I was building my RV-6 slider, I discovered that my
> brand new powder
> coated canopy bar was rusted in many places under the powder
> coating. The only
> way I discovered that was that I accidentally chipped the powder
> coating in one
> place and noticed the rust underneath. It took me several weeks of
> grinding
> and chipping to remove all the powder coat so that I could paint
> the bar. After
> that I would be very reluctant to use powder coating on critical
> steel parts.
>
>
> Harry Crosby
> RV-6 N16CX, 1082 hours
>
> ----- Original Message -----
>
> Subject: Re: RV-List: tailwheel powder coating
> From: mr.gsun(at)gmail.com <mailto:mr.gsun(at)gmail.com>
>
> What about the engine mount?
>
> Greg
>
>
> From: HCRV6(at)comcast.net <mailto:HCRV6(at)comcast.net>
> Subject: Re: RV-List: tailwheel powder coating
>
> After the canopy frame experience, I ordered the engine mount bare
> and painted
> it myself.
>
>
> Harry Crosby
>
> From: "LARRY C. BOWLES" <SCHYBOLT(at)austin.rr.com
> >
> Subject: Re: RV-List: tailwheel powder coating
>
> WHAT ABOUT THE LANDING GEAR???????????
>
>
> From: Kelly McMullen <kellym(at)aviating.com
> >
> Subject: Re: RV-List: tailwheel powder coating
>
>
> What about all the steel parts that Vans supplies already powder
> coated?
> Like main gear mounts, engine mount, various bellcranks, etc.???
>
> SNIP
>
> My comments are not meant to bash any kit company, but I think they
> are doing the kitbuilders a HUGE disservice by offering powder coated
> parts. Builders would be much better off to pay someone to paint the
> parts than to pay for powder coating!
>
> There is a huge misconception that powder coating will protect the
> parts. Once it cracks (and it will), moisture has a highway to the
> steel and WILL create LOTS of rust because it's hidden. Of course,
> if the guy doing the powder coating doesn't properly blast and clean
> the steel before it's powder coated, then you're already starting off
> badly! Since there is no way to check the part preparation without
> damaging the powder coating, then what do you think the average powder
> coating shop will do?
>
> In my opinion, powder coating is for beauty, paint is for protection.
>
> I wouldn't put powder coating on an engine mount, no way, no how. I've
> been around RVs since 1987 and have yet to see an RV4,6,7 or other
> taildragger engine mount that doesn't develop cracks after XXX hours
> of use. Nosedragger RVs might be OK. I can't say as we don't have as
> many of those around my area.
>
> Please don't make rash decisions based solely on my comments, but in
> my opinion, I'd remove any powder coating from my engine mount and any
> other flight critical parts. It's tough to beat a good, light grey or
> white, epoxy finish on those parts. It makes cracks and rust show up
> easily.
>
> Sorry if this creates consternation for anyone, but this is a clear
> case for "do it right, or do it over."
>
> FWIW, we get asked all the time if we offer our tailwheel parts
> already powder coated. The answer has been and will remain "no."
>
> YMMV.
>
> Thanks,
>
> Vince
> www.flyboyaccessories.com <http://www.flyboyaccessories.com>
>
> *
>
>
> *
>
> No virus found in this message.
> Checked by AVG - www.avg.com <http://www.avg.com>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: tailwheel powder coating |
| From: | vanremog(at)aol.com |
I agree with Harry. Powder Coating is a decorative coating only, not a pro
per aircraft quality finish with corrosion protective capabilities. Van's s
hould never have used it in these applications on steel in my opinion.
-GV
-----Original Message-----
From: HCRV6 <HCRV6(at)comcast.net>
Sent: Tue, Jul 2, 2013 3:30 pm
Subject: Re: RV-List: tailwheel powder coating
After the canopy frame experience, I ordered the engine mount bare and pain
ted it myself.
Harry Crosby
RV-6 N16CX, 1082 hours
From: "mr gsun" <mr.gsun(at)gmail.com>
Sent: Tuesday, July 2, 2013 11:06:44 AM
Subject: Re: RV-List: tailwheel powder coating
What about the engine mount?
Greg
On Jul 2, 2013 10:55 AM, wrote:
Back when I was building my RV-6 slider, I discovered that my brand new pow
der coated canopy bar was rusted in many places under the powder coating.
The only way I discovered that was that I accidentally chipped the powder c
oating in one place and noticed the rust underneath. It took me several we
eks of grinding and chipping to remove all the powder coat so that I could
paint the bar. After that I would be very reluctant to use powder coating
on critical steel parts.
Harry Crosby
RV-6 N16CX, 1082 hours
From: "RV6 Flyer" <rv6_flyer(at)hotmail.com>
Sent: Tuesday, July 2, 2013 9:00:25 AM
Subject: RE: RV-List: tailwheel powder coating
Echoing some of what Vince said, I do not like Powder Coast on high stress
steel airplane parts. The Powder coat tends to hide cracks that paint will
not. Do you want a crack to develop in one of your steel parts and be hid
den from view?
Gary A. Sobek
"My Sanity" RV-6 N157GS O-320 Hartzell,
2,720+ Flying Hours So. CA, USA
Date: Tue, 2 Jul 2013 08:47:53 -0500
Subject: RV-List: tailwheel powder coating
From: vincefrazier(at)gmail.com
From: Matt Dralle <dralle(at)matronics.com>
Subject: RV-List: Tailwheel Bearing - Separating Bronze Bearing...
Dear Listers,
Well, I disassembled the tailwheel on the RV-6 and RV-8 this weekend and to
ok the
wad of parts including the steel spring, bearing knuckles, forks and little
hub caps to the local powdercoaters.
But they won't accept the bearing knuckle because it has a bronze or brass
sleeve!
They claim it will leak oil and make a mess in the oven. They expect me
to somehow get that sleeve out of the steel part! That seems crazy? Is th
at
even possible? Surely it won't just come out with a gentle knocking, will
it?
Help...
Thanks!
Matt Dralle SNIP
Matt,
Don't take it out unless you are prepared to install a brand new one, which
requires minor machining around the cam groove. Removal will undoubtedly l
oosen it to the point that it is sloppy.
FWIW, we use engineered plastic bushings in our mounting sockets... but tho
se can't be baked either! They are easier to install/machine, more durable
, and don't require the locking screw to retain them. (Don't mistake the l
ocking screw for a grease zerk... it's useless to grease the spindle with i
t. You need to disassemble the parts to properly grease them.)
I suggest that you bead blast the parts and paint them. Sorry.
FWIW, in my experience, powder coating is not appropriate for aviation stee
l parts. ( I can feel the flames already.) For example, I have an Avid Flye
r engine mount in my shop right now that is about 20 years old and the powd
er coating is cracked and flaking in several spots. There is heavy rust be
neath.... which is invisible until it flakes. The plane has been hangared
all of it's life and has only 250 hours on it. To me, that powder coating
is an accident waiting to happen. It's also rather difficult to strip off.
Why anyone would use it is beyond my grasp. Sure, it looks nice... but i
s it worth your life if it hides cracks and rust?
YMMV,
Vince
www.flyboyaccessories.com
get="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV-List
http://forums.matronics.com
="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution
t="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV-List
tp://forums.matronics.com
_blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | HCRV6(at)comcast.net |
| Subject: | Re: tailwheel powder coating |
My taildragger gear was unfinished as received, painted it myself.
Harry Crosby
RV-6 N16CX, 1082 hours
----- Original Message -----
From: "LARRY C. BOWLES" <SCHYBOLT(at)austin.rr.com>
Sent: Tuesday, July 2, 2013 7:15:35 PM
Subject: Re: RV-List: tailwheel powder coating
WHAT ABOUT THE LANDING GEAR???????????
From: mr.gsun(at)gmail.com
Sent: Tuesday, July 02, 2013 1:06 PM
Subject: Re: RV-List: tailwheel powder coating
What about the engine mount?
Greg
On Jul 2, 2013 10:55 AM, < HCRV6(at)comcast.net > wrote:
Back when I was building my RV-6 slider, I discovered that my brand new powder
coated canopy bar was rusted in many places under the powder coating. The only
way I discovered that was that I accidentally chipped the powder coating in one
place and noticed the rust underneath. It took me several weeks of grinding
and chipping to remove all the powder coat so that I could paint the bar. After
that I would be very reluctant to use powder coating on critical steel parts.
Harry Crosby
RV-6 N16CX, 1082 hours
From: "RV6 Flyer" < rv6_flyer(at)hotmail.com >
Sent: Tuesday, July 2, 2013 9:00:25 AM
Subject: RE: RV-List: tailwheel powder coating
Echoing some of what Vince said, I do not like Powder Coast on high stress steel
airplane parts. The Powder coat tends to hide cracks that paint will not. Do
you want a crack to develop in one of your steel parts and be hidden from view?
Gary A. Sobek
"My Sanity" RV-6 N157GS O-320 Hartzell,
2,720+ Flying Hours So. CA, USA
Date: Tue, 2 Jul 2013 08:47:53 -0500
Subject: RV-List: tailwheel powder coating
From: vincefrazier(at)gmail.com
From: Matt Dralle < dralle(at)matronics.com >
Subject: RV-List: Tailwheel Bearing - Separating Bronze Bearing...
Dear Listers,
Well, I disassembled the tailwheel on the RV-6 and RV-8 this weekend and took the
wad of parts including the steel spring, bearing knuckles, forks and little
hub caps to the local powdercoaters.
But they won't accept the bearing knuckle because it has a bronze or brass sleeve!
They claim it will leak oil and make a mess in the oven. They expect me
to somehow get that sleeve out of the steel part! That seems crazy? Is that
even possible? Surely it won't just come out with a gentle knocking, will it?
Help...
Thanks!
Matt Dralle SNIP
Matt,
Don't take it out unless you are prepared to install a brand new one, which requires
minor machining around the cam groove. Removal will undoubtedly loosen it
to the point that it is sloppy.
FWIW, we use engineered plastic bushings in our mounting sockets... but those can't
be baked either! They are easier to install/machine, more durable, and don't
require the locking screw to retain them. (Don't mistake the locking screw
for a grease zerk... it's useless to grease the spindle with it. You need to
disassemble the parts to properly grease them.)
I suggest that you bead blast the parts and paint them. Sorry.
FWIW, in my experience, powder coating is not appropriate for aviation steel parts.
( I can feel the flames already.) For example, I have an Avid Flyer engine
mount in my shop right now that is about 20 years old and the powder coating
is cracked and flaking in several spots. There is heavy rust beneath.... which
is invisible until it flakes. The plane has been hangared all of it's life and
has only 250 hours on it. To me, that powder coating is an accident waiting
to happen. It's also rather difficult to strip off. Why anyone would use it is
beyond my grasp. Sure, it looks nice... but is it worth your life if it hides
cracks and rust?
YMMV,
Vince
www.flyboyaccessories.com
get="_blank"> http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV-List http://forums.matronics.com ="_blank"> http://www.matronics.com/contribution t="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV-List
tp://forums.matronics.com
_blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution
href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV-List">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV-List
href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com
________________________________________________________________________________
Q291bGQgdGhlIGFkbWluIG9mIHRoaXMgbGlzdCBzZW5kIG1lIFBNIG9uIGhvdyB0byBnZXQgaW50
byBteSBhY2NvdW50cyBpZiBJIGNhbuKAmXQgcmVtZW1iZXIgbXkgbG9naW4gbmFtZT8NCg0KDQoN
ClRoYW5rcw0K
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: IFR RVs in the US |
| From: | David Leonard <wdleonard(at)gmail.com> |
Michele,
To paraphrase the excellent responses you have already received I offer
some clarification because you may not be familiar with the rest of the
rules for our experimentals:
Our instrument and avionics requirements are the same as those for
certified aircraft except that the instruments themselves do not
necessarily have to be certified, just meet the TSO performance
requirements. In practice that usually means that the Transponder and any
GPS or VOR navigation systems are TSO certified and the other instruments
are quality panel-mount items. Significantly, that means that in order to
fly en-route with GPS guidance, the GPS needs to be IFR certified and to
fly GPS approaches the unit must be WAAS approach certified.
The bi-annual static system check and transponder test have to be done by a
certified shop, but otherwise engine and air frame work can be done by
either a certified shop or by the builder who has the repairman
certificate, but not necessarily by just the current owner. The annual
condition inspection much be current.
The engine/prop need not be certified. In fact, I fly IFR with my Wankel
engine out of a Mazda RX-7.
No IFR during the initial test phase or anytime the aircraft is temporarily
returned to 'Test Phase' because of a major modification.
Requirements for the pilot are the same as if you were flying a certified
aircraft, including medical.
Just like with VFR flight in an experimental, we cannot carry passengers or
cargo for hire even if the pilot has a commercial rating. Other forms of
commercial compensation seem to have relaxed a little (more accurately,
they have been more clearly defined in order to improve aviation safety).
For example you can be compensated to fly in an airshow, with special
permission you can provide type-specific transition training for
compensation. You can be paid for pictures taken from your aircraft, but
not be paid as a hired photographer or sky writer. You can fly to a
business event and deduct the costs from your income, even carry passengers
IFR incidental to that trip who share some of the direct costs but the
pilot has to pay an equal share. We may not rent the aircraft, but we can
lend it to someone if the owner is not paid. We cannot do banner tow or
drop skydivers even if it is unpaid.
All in all I feel it is a very fair and safe system. While experimentals
here have not yet shown themselves to be as safe as certified aircraft, I
would venture to bet that accidents under IFR are no higher than with
certified aircraft. If you can find that statistic someplace I think it
could greatly help your cause.
Good luck! I am sure that I speak for my US experimental aviation brothers
and sisters when I say that we would love to see you succeed. In fact, if
you contact the EAA they may be able to offer some advise. Our EAA has an
excellent rapport with the FAA. Do you have a similar organization in
France?
--
David Leonard
Turbo Rotary RV-6 N4VY
http://N4VY.RotaryRoster.net
http://RotaryRoster.net
On Fri, Jun 28, 2013 at 12:22 PM, Michele Delsol <mdelsol@md-dsl.fr> wrote:
> I knew I=92d get knowledgeable responses from the list ' you guys are g
reat.
> Such good stuff, thanks. Gives me the ammo to approach the French
> authorities ' they really treat us like children ' no trust. They wan
t us
> to have just about everything certified : engine and everything that goes
> on one, all avionics, gages, why not switches, breakers, wiring=85 with t
he
> appropriate form One=92s on each item. Maintenance in a certified shop an
d
> the paper work to go along... Result ' there are no Night or IFR home
> builts in France ' there is one exception which proves the rule. ****
>
> ** **
>
> Thanks ' i=92ll work with the material/info you sent and would get back
off
> line if I need clarifications.****
>
> Mich=E8le****
>
> ** **
>
> *De :* owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:
> owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com] *De la part de* Michele Delsol
> *Envoy=E9 :* lundi 24 juin 2013 22:04
> *=C0 :* rv-list(at)matronics.com
> *Objet :* RV-List: IFR RVs in the US****
>
> ** **
>
> Hello to all,****
>
> ** **
>
> I=92ve been lurking on the sidelines of this list and have contributed at
> times during the build time of my RV8 ' from France. I have finished th
e 8
> which has been providing me with more joy than I anticipated. What a grea
t
> airplane.****
>
> ** **
>
> All would be perfect except that the French and most Europeans do not
> allow home builts to fly IFR. A few of the RV owners being military and/o
r
> professional pilots with full IFR qualifications, with planes very well
> equipped avionics wise, would like to change this. I have thus taken it
> upon myself within the context of our French RV builder group (
> www.vansclubdefrance.fr) to explore the possibility of having the rules
> changed, at least within the context of French skies.****
>
> ** **
>
> Since the US FAA does allow experimental built airplanes to fly IFR in th
e
> US, my question to the list is : what are the criteria which would allow
an
> RV to be flown IFR by a duly qualified IFR pilot ? Questions which come t
o
> mind are :****
>
> **=B7 **Does the engine have to be certified as opposed to a non
> certified such as Mattituck, Superior, Barret=85 ?****
>
> **=B7 **What about maintenance ' by certified mechanic or by own
er
> under a certain conditions ?****
>
> **=B7 **Minimum avionics : ex. two radios, VORs, DME, other ?****
>
> **=B7 **Any steam gages ?****
>
> **=B7 **Does the owner who does his own maintenance have to acquir
e
> specific qualifications ? ****
>
> ** **
>
> Thanks,****
>
> Mich=E8le Delsol****
>
> RV8 ' F-PDSL****
>
> ** **
>
> ** **
>
> * *
>
> * *
>
> **
>
> **
>
> **
>
> **
>
> **
>
> **
>
> *http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV-List*
>
> **
>
> **
>
> **
>
> *http://forums.matronics.com*
>
> **
>
> **
>
> **
>
> **
>
> *http://www.matronics.com/contribution*
>
> **
>
> * *
>
> *
>
===========
===========
===========
===========
> *
>
>
--
David Leonard
Turbo Rotary RV-6 N4VY
http://N4VY.RotaryRoster.net
http://RotaryRoster.net
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: IFR RVs in the US |
| From: | David Leonard <wdleonard(at)gmail.com> |
Oh, I forgot to add this Excellent link to the EAA's comments on equiping
an experimental for IFR flight.
http://members.eaa.org/home/homebuilders/faq/Equipping%20a%20Homebuilt%20fo
r%20IFR%20operations.html
Rodoc
On Wed, Jul 3, 2013 at 12:19 PM, David Leonard wrote:
> Michele,
>
> To paraphrase the excellent responses you have already received I offer
> some clarification because you may not be familiar with the rest of the
> rules for our experimentals:
>
> Our instrument and avionics requirements are the same as those for
> certified aircraft except that the instruments themselves do not
> necessarily have to be certified, just meet the TSO performance
> requirements. In practice that usually means that the Transponder and any
> GPS or VOR navigation systems are TSO certified and the other instruments
> are quality panel-mount items. Significantly, that means that in order t
o
> fly en-route with GPS guidance, the GPS needs to be IFR certified and to
> fly GPS approaches the unit must be WAAS approach certified.
>
> The bi-annual static system check and transponder test have to be done by
> a certified shop, but otherwise engine and air frame work can be done by
> either a certified shop or by the builder who has the repairman
> certificate, but not necessarily by just the current owner. The annual
> condition inspection much be current.
>
> The engine/prop need not be certified. In fact, I fly IFR with my Wankel
> engine out of a Mazda RX-7.
>
> No IFR during the initial test phase or anytime the aircraft is
> temporarily returned to 'Test Phase' because of a major modification.
>
> Requirements for the pilot are the same as if you were flying a certified
> aircraft, including medical.
>
> Just like with VFR flight in an experimental, we cannot carry passengers
> or cargo for hire even if the pilot has a commercial rating. Other forms
> of commercial compensation seem to have relaxed a little (more accurately
,
> they have been more clearly defined in order to improve aviation safety).
> For example you can be compensated to fly in an airshow, with special
> permission you can provide type-specific transition training for
> compensation. You can be paid for pictures taken from your aircraft, but
> not be paid as a hired photographer or sky writer. You can fly to a
> business event and deduct the costs from your income, even carry passenge
rs
> IFR incidental to that trip who share some of the direct costs but the
> pilot has to pay an equal share. We may not rent the aircraft, but we ca
n
> lend it to someone if the owner is not paid. We cannot do banner tow or
> drop skydivers even if it is unpaid.
>
> All in all I feel it is a very fair and safe system. While experimentals
> here have not yet shown themselves to be as safe as certified aircraft, I
> would venture to bet that accidents under IFR are no higher than with
> certified aircraft. If you can find that statistic someplace I think it
> could greatly help your cause.
>
> Good luck! I am sure that I speak for my US experimental aviation brother
s
> and sisters when I say that we would love to see you succeed. In fact, i
f
> you contact the EAA they may be able to offer some advise. Our EAA has
an
> excellent rapport with the FAA. Do you have a similar organization in
> France?
>
> --
> David Leonard
>
> Turbo Rotary RV-6 N4VY
> http://N4VY.RotaryRoster.net
> http://RotaryRoster.net
>
>
> On Fri, Jun 28, 2013 at 12:22 PM, Michele Delsol <mdelsol@md-dsl.fr>wrote
:
>
>> I knew I=92d get knowledgeable responses from the list ' you guys are
>> great. Such good stuff, thanks. Gives me the ammo to approach the French
>> authorities ' they really treat us like children ' no trust. They wa
nt us
>> to have just about everything certified : engine and everything that goe
s
>> on one, all avionics, gages, why not switches, breakers, wiring=85 with
the
>> appropriate form One=92s on each item. Maintenance in a certified shop a
nd
>> the paper work to go along... Result ' there are no Night or IFR home
>> builts in France ' there is one exception which proves the rule. ****
>>
>> ** **
>>
>> Thanks ' i=92ll work with the material/info you sent and would get bac
k off
>> line if I need clarifications.****
>>
>> Mich=E8le****
>>
>> ** **
>>
>> *De :* owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:
>> owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com] *De la part de* Michele Delsol
>> *Envoy=E9 :* lundi 24 juin 2013 22:04
>> *=C0 :* rv-list(at)matronics.com
>> *Objet :* RV-List: IFR RVs in the US****
>>
>> ** **
>>
>> Hello to all,****
>>
>> ** **
>>
>> I=92ve been lurking on the sidelines of this list and have contributed a
t
>> times during the build time of my RV8 ' from France. I have finished t
he 8
>> which has been providing me with more joy than I anticipated. What a gre
at
>> airplane.****
>>
>> ** **
>>
>> All would be perfect except that the French and most Europeans do not
>> allow home builts to fly IFR. A few of the RV owners being military and/
or
>> professional pilots with full IFR qualifications, with planes very well
>> equipped avionics wise, would like to change this. I have thus taken it
>> upon myself within the context of our French RV builder group (
>> www.vansclubdefrance.fr) to explore the possibility of having the rules
>> changed, at least within the context of French skies.****
>>
>> ** **
>>
>> Since the US FAA does allow experimental built airplanes to fly IFR in
>> the US, my question to the list is : what are the criteria which would
>> allow an RV to be flown IFR by a duly qualified IFR pilot ? Questions wh
ich
>> come to mind are :****
>>
>> **=B7 **Does the engine have to be certified as opposed to a non
>> certified such as Mattituck, Superior, Barret=85 ?****
>>
>> **=B7 **What about maintenance ' by certified mechanic or by ow
ner
>> under a certain conditions ?****
>>
>> **=B7 **Minimum avionics : ex. two radios, VORs, DME, other ?****
>>
>> **=B7 **Any steam gages ?****
>>
>> **=B7 **Does the owner who does his own maintenance have to acqui
re
>> specific qualifications ? ****
>>
>> ** **
>>
>> Thanks,****
>>
>> Mich=E8le Delsol****
>>
>> RV8 ' F-PDSL****
>>
>> ** **
>>
>> ** **
>>
>> * *
>>
>> * *
>>
>> **
>>
>> **
>>
>> **
>>
>> **
>>
>> **
>>
>> **
>>
>> *http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV-List*
>>
>> **
>>
>> **
>>
>> **
>>
>> *http://forums.matronics.com*
>>
>> **
>>
>> **
>>
>> **
>>
>> **
>>
>> *http://www.matronics.com/contribution*
>>
>> **
>>
>> * *
>>
>> *
>>
===========
===========
===========
===========
>> *
>>
>>
>
>
> --
> David Leonard
>
> Turbo Rotary RV-6 N4VY
> http://N4VY.RotaryRoster.net
> http://RotaryRoster.net
>
--
David Leonard
Turbo Rotary RV-6 N4VY
http://N4VY.RotaryRoster.net
http://RotaryRoster.net
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | IFR RVs in the US |
Thanks David, gives me a lot to ponder on and ammo to build a strategy.
Judging by what is done in the US there is no fundamental reason except
historical events to restrain us from flying IFR with our experimental
airplanes within European skies.
Regards,
Mich=E8le
De : owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com] De la part de David Leonard
Envoy=E9 : mercredi 3 juillet 2013 21:23
=C0 : rv-list
Objet : Re: RV-List: IFR RVs in the US
Oh, I forgot to add this Excellent link to the EAA's comments on
equiping an
experimental for IFR flight.
http://members.eaa.org/home/homebuilders/faq/Equipping%20a%20Homebuilt%20
for
%20IFR%20operations.html
Rodoc
On Wed, Jul 3, 2013 at 12:19 PM, David Leonard
wrote:
Michele,
To paraphrase the excellent responses you have already received I offer
some
clarification because you may not be familiar with the rest of the rules
for
our experimentals:
Our instrument and avionics requirements are the same as those for
certified
aircraft except that the instruments themselves do not necessarily have
to
be certified, just meet the TSO performance requirements. In practice
that
usually means that the Transponder and any GPS or VOR navigation systems
are
TSO certified and the other instruments are quality panel-mount items.
Significantly, that means that in order to fly en-route with GPS
guidance,
the GPS needs to be IFR certified and to fly GPS approaches the unit
must be
WAAS approach certified.
The bi-annual static system check and transponder test have to be done
by a
certified shop, but otherwise engine and air frame work can be done by
either a certified shop or by the builder who has the repairman
certificate,
but not necessarily by just the current owner. The annual condition
inspection much be current.
The engine/prop need not be certified. In fact, I fly IFR with my
Wankel
engine out of a Mazda RX-7.
No IFR during the initial test phase or anytime the aircraft is
temporarily
returned to 'Test Phase' because of a major modification.
Requirements for the pilot are the same as if you were flying a
certified
aircraft, including medical.
Just like with VFR flight in an experimental, we cannot carry passengers
or
cargo for hire even if the pilot has a commercial rating. Other forms
of
commercial compensation seem to have relaxed a little (more accurately,
they
have been more clearly defined in order to improve aviation safety).
For
example you can be compensated to fly in an airshow, with special
permission
you can provide type-specific transition training for compensation. You
can
be paid for pictures taken from your aircraft, but not be paid as a
hired
photographer or sky writer. You can fly to a business event and deduct
the
costs from your income, even carry passengers IFR incidental to that
trip
who share some of the direct costs but the pilot has to pay an equal
share.
We may not rent the aircraft, but we can lend it to someone if the owner
is
not paid. We cannot do banner tow or drop skydivers even if it is
unpaid.
All in all I feel it is a very fair and safe system. While
experimentals
here have not yet shown themselves to be as safe as certified aircraft,
I
would venture to bet that accidents under IFR are no higher than with
certified aircraft. If you can find that statistic someplace I think it
could greatly help your cause.
Good luck! I am sure that I speak for my US experimental aviation
brothers
and sisters when I say that we would love to see you succeed. In fact,
if
you contact the EAA they may be able to offer some advise. Our EAA has
an
excellent rapport with the FAA. Do you have a similar organization in
France?
--
David Leonard
Turbo Rotary RV-6 N4VY
http://N4VY.RotaryRoster.net
http://RotaryRoster.net
On Fri, Jun 28, 2013 at 12:22 PM, Michele Delsol <mdelsol@md-dsl.fr>
wrote:
I knew I=92d get knowledgeable responses from the list ' you guys are
great.
Such good stuff, thanks. Gives me the ammo to approach the French
authorities ' they really treat us like children ' no trust. They
want us to
have just about everything certified : engine and everything that goes
on
one, all avionics, gages, why not switches, breakers, wiring=85 with the
appropriate form One=92s on each item. Maintenance in a certified shop
and the
paper work to go along... Result ' there are no Night or IFR home
builts in
France ' there is one exception which proves the rule.
Thanks ' i=92ll work with the material/info you sent and would get
back off
line if I need clarifications.
Mich=E8le
De : owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com] De la part de Michele Delsol
Envoy=E9 : lundi 24 juin 2013 22:04
=C0 : rv-list(at)matronics.com
Objet : RV-List: IFR RVs in the US
Hello to all,
I=92ve been lurking on the sidelines of this list and have contributed
at
times during the build time of my RV8 ' from France. I have finished
the 8
which has been providing me with more joy than I anticipated. What a
great
airplane.
All would be perfect except that the French and most Europeans do not
allow
home builts to fly IFR. A few of the RV owners being military and/or
professional pilots with full IFR qualifications, with planes very well
equipped avionics wise, would like to change this. I have thus taken it
upon
myself within the context of our French RV builder group
(www.vansclubdefrance.fr) to explore the possibility of having the rules
changed, at least within the context of French skies.
Since the US FAA does allow experimental built airplanes to fly IFR in
the
US, my question to the list is : what are the criteria which would allow
an
RV to be flown IFR by a duly qualified IFR pilot ? Questions which come
to
mind are :
=B7 Does the engine have to be certified as opposed to a non
certified
such as Mattituck, Superior, Barret=85 ?
=B7 What about maintenance ' by certified mechanic or by owner
under a
certain conditions ?
=B7 Minimum avionics : ex. two radios, VORs, DME, other ?
=B7 Any steam gages ?
=B7 Does the owner who does his own maintenance have to acquire
specific qualifications ?
Thanks,
Mich=E8le Delsol
RV8 ' F-PDSL
http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV-List
http://forums.matronics.com
http://www.matronics.com/contribution
t="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV-List
tp://forums.matronics.com
_blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution
--
David Leonard
Turbo Rotary RV-6 N4VY
http://N4VY.RotaryRoster.net
http://RotaryRoster.net
--
David Leonard
Turbo Rotary RV-6 N4VY
http://N4VY.RotaryRoster.net
http://RotaryRoster.net
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Matt Dralle <dralle(at)matronics.com> |
| Subject: | RV-6/7/9 Windshield Fairing... |
Hey Listers,
Has anyone tried one of these pre-made RV-6/7/9 fiberglass windshield fairing yet?
Seems like it could be a HUGE time and frustration saver if it fits pretty
well. I'm thinking about repainting the RV-6 at some point, and the glass could
use replacing as well as the bezel. This could be an option...
http://www.aircraftspruce.com/catalog/appages/rvWindshieldFairing.php
-
Matt Dralle
RV-8 #82880 N998RV "Ruby Vixen"
http://www.mattsrv8.com - Matt's Complete RV-8 Construction Log
http://www.mattsrv8.com/Mishap - Landing Mishap Rebuild Log
http://www.youtube.com/MattsRV8 - Matt's RV-8 HDTV YouTube Channel
Status: 172+ Hours TTSN - Rebuilding Fuselage After Landing Mishap...
RV-6 #20916 N360EM "The Flyer"
http://www.mattsrv6.com - Matt's RV-6 Revitalization Log
Status: 170+ Hours Since Purchase - Upgrades Complete; Now In Full Flyer Mode
Matt's Livermore Airport Live ATC Stream!
Check out the live ATC stream directly from my hangar at the Livermore
Airport. Includes both Tower and Ground transmissions. Archives too!
For entertainment purposes only. http://klvk.matronics.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: RV-6/7/9 Windshield Fairing... |
| From: | "RV7ASask" <rv7alamb(at)sasktel.net> |
Hi Matt,
Yes, I used the Aircraft Spruce Windshield Fairing on my RV7A. I was very happy
with the final result. The only thing I had to do to get it to fit well was cut
it at the top center and remove a small piece. Yes, I would use it again and
I would recommend it.
We just returned from a 4000nm trip in the 7A and everything worked well. Attached
is a picture of the fairing in place.
Regards
David Lamb
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=404681#404681
Attachments:
http://forums.matronics.com//files/2013_05_11_120442_918.jpg
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Matt Dralle <dralle(at)matronics.com> |
| Subject: | Matt's KLVK ATC Streaming... |
Dear Listers,
A couple of weeks ago I found a web site on the Internet called LiveATC.net that
has the Air Traffic Control (ATC) tower communications on line for streaming
for a number of airports around the country. Lo 'n behold, they even have a
stream for my home base, the Livermore Airport. But, much to my dismay, the quality
of their KLVK feed was just plain awful. It was obvious the airband source
didn't have a decent antenna or perhaps even a good radio. I suppose that
given that their site is a consortium of local citizens providing the feeds,
the lack of quality goes with the territory.
But, I really liked the idea of being able to monitor the LVK ATC and also the
ability to bring up the archives and listen to my personal communications with
the tower after a flight.
Since I had a computer at the hangar along with a pretty decent Internet connection
and, in the spirit of Experimental Homebuilding, I had an idea... I mounted
an air-band antenna on the top of the hangar and brought the RG-58 coax down
to near the computer and plugged it into my trusty Icom IC-A20 hand held.
I was AMAZED at the quality of signal I was getting. It was picking up guys in
airplanes 19 miles out like they were sitting next to my hangar! I set the
radio to high-speed scan between the Tower and Ground frequencies so with a single
feed I could get all communications.
So next, I made an audio connection from the handheld to the Line In input on the computer. Sure enough, now I was getting great sound from the hand held on the computer! I found some software from Australia called BroadWave from a company called NCH ( http://www.nch.com.au/streaming ). It lets you connect to the Line In port on the computer and then generate real time audio streams that can be served up via the Internet. And sure enough, it works great!
Next, I found some software from Germany called Loop Recorder ( http://looprecorder.de ) that let's you monitor an audio input on your computer and generate archive files. You can select an increment in which to rotate the files automatically, for example, every 30 minutes. I downloaded this software and installed it and sure enough, I was able to start archiving the ATC transmissions coming in, all the while streaming them live as well!
The last piece of the puzzle was to enable the Web and FTP servers on the Windows
7 system and come up with a front-end web page that would tie all of these
new resources together for easy access from the Internet. I'm happy to report,
the whole thing came together very nicely and even allows you stream directly
to your Android or iPhone as well as your desktop! Pretty darn cool!
And so, without further ado, here is my new web site for monitoring the ATC communications
at KLVK:
http://klvk.matronics.com/
Just to state the obvious, the stream is silent if there isn't any current ATC
or aircraft communications. During the day, you'll usually hear something within
five or ten minutes. Sometimes much quicker.
I contacted LiveATC.net and they were excited about adding my new stream to their web site as well. So, at some point soon, the LiveATC.net feed for Livermore Airport will be coming from my hangar! My site http://klvk.matronics.com will continue to be available as well.
For entertainment purposes only!
-
Matt Dralle
RV-8 #82880 N998RV "Ruby Vixen"
http://www.mattsrv8.com - Matt's Complete RV-8 Construction Log
http://www.mattsrv8.com/Mishap - Landing Mishap Rebuild Log
http://www.youtube.com/MattsRV8 - Matt's RV-8 HDTV YouTube Channel
Status: 172+ Hours TTSN - Rebuilding Fuselage After Landing Mishap...
RV-6 #20916 N360EM "The Flyer"
http://www.mattsrv6.com - Matt's RV-6 Revitalization Log
Status: 170+ Hours Since Purchase - Upgrades Complete; Now In Full Flyer Mode
Matt's Livermore Airport Live ATC Stream!
Check out the live ATC stream directly from my hangar at the Livermore
Airport. Includes both Tower and Ground transmissions. Archives too!
For entertainment purposes only. http://klvk.matronics.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Robin Marks <robin(at)PaintTheWeb.com> |
| Subject: | Garmin Unveils GTR 200 |
http://www.flyingmag.com/avionics-gear/instrumentaccessories/garmin-unveils
-gtr-200-comm-radio
That's pretty inexpensive for a quality Garmin Comm.
Robin
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Ken Brooks <kenbrooks(at)charter.net> |
Does anyone recall if the four bolts through the F-445 (phenolic) flap arm hold
down blocks get torqued? Couldn't find it in the manual anywhere on on the drawing.
We torqued them to 20 inch pounds and the arm would barely move with
finger pressure. That little flap motor would have to work pretty hard to move
the arm along with wind loading in flight. Thanks in advance. - Ken
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Denis Walsh <denis.walsh(at)comcast.net> |
Whatever the good book says for those size bolts, 20 sounds about right but check.
What you need to do is add washer(s) between the blocks as necessary to relieve
the pressure to a reasonable amount. Start with a "thin" washer and add as neccesary.
I found one regular size washer was just right.
Hark to the fact that I am going back 20 years in my memory, and I may be thinking
of the rudder tubes which had the same system on the RV 6.
On 27Jul, 2013, at 1:24 , Ken Brooks wrote:
>
> Does anyone recall if the four bolts through the F-445 (phenolic) flap arm hold
down blocks get torqued? Couldn't find it in the manual anywhere on on the
drawing. We torqued them to 20 inch pounds and the arm would barely move with
finger pressure. That little flap motor would have to work pretty hard to move
the arm along with wind loading in flight. Thanks in advance. - Ken
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "=?utf-8?Q?Alain_Larzilli=C3=A8re?=" <allarzil(at)aol.com> |
Bonjour,
Comment vas tu? O es tu actuellement? S'il te plat, aurais-tu du
temps consacrer une situation me concernant discrtement par mail?
Je suis en dplacement l'tranger o je vis une msaventure grave. Je
t'en dirai long plus tard. J'ai urgemment besoin de ton soutien et
apport financier. De plus je te demande de garder surtout la
confidentialit de mon courriel n'en parles personne je t'en prie car
tu es mon seul espoir. Je peux seulement communiquer par mail.
Alain
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Vincent Himsl <vshimsl(at)live.com> |
| Subject: | Crossing the Canadian Border |
Flying Adventure: Saskatchewan, Part One
<http://wordsworldandwings.blogspot.com/2013/07/flying-adventure-saskatchewa
n-part-one.html> , Part Two
<http://wordsworldandwings.blogspot.com/2013/07/flying-adventure-saskatchewa
n-part-two.html> , Part Three
<http://wordsworldandwings.blogspot.com/2013/07/flying-adventure-saskatchewa
n-part-three.html>
My friend Mike and his wife Cathy recently flew from Eastern Washington
State to Saskatchewan in their RV-7 crossing the border for the first time.
Interesting read as Cathy details some of the unexpected 'bumps in the
road'.
Vince Himsl
WA-USA
RV8432 150hrs
"I really should paint the darn thing, but it sure looks like a nice day for
flying."
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "R.C. Flyer" <smirdrv(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | Thoughts on Subaru FWF |
I am considering using an "Egg" FWF on my "6"=2C and would like to get some
real time insight as to personal experiences of those who have them now. Y
ou can write or call. Thanks.
R.C.
310-502-5331
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Bob Collins" <bcollinsrv7a(at)comcast.net> |
| Subject: | Thoughts on Subaru FWF |
I can give you a good list of people who installed it and then had emergency
landings and have pulled them out, if you'd like.
From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of R.C. Flyer
Sent: Monday, July 29, 2013 2:02 PM
Subject: RV-List: Thoughts on Subaru FWF
I am considering using an "Egg" FWF on my "6", and would like to get some
real time insight as to personal experiences of those who have them now. You
can write or call. Thanks.
R.C.
310-502-5331
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Carl Froehlich" <carl.froehlich(at)verizon.net> |
| Subject: | Thoughts on Subaru FWF |
You can talk to my neighbor who put one in a Kitfox 11 years ago. Less than
100 hours and three engine out landings the plane has been in the hangar for
the last 9 years.
For an independent opinion, call any insurance company and ask for rates for
a RV-6 with this engine.
Carl
From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Bob Collins
Sent: Monday, July 29, 2013 3:20 PM
Subject: RE: RV-List: Thoughts on Subaru FWF
I can give you a good list of people who installed it and then had emergency
landings and have pulled them out, if you'd like.
From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of R.C. Flyer
Sent: Monday, July 29, 2013 2:02 PM
Subject: RV-List: Thoughts on Subaru FWF
I am considering using an "Egg" FWF on my "6", and would like to get some
real time insight as to personal experiences of those who have them now. You
can write or call. Thanks.
R.C.
310-502-5331
http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV-List
http://forums.matronics.com
http://www.matronics.com/contribution
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Thoughts on Subaru FWF |
| From: | vanremog(at)aol.com |
The only comment I would make is "Bad Idea..." Save your green stamps and
get a real engine.
-GV
-----Original Message-----
From: R.C. Flyer <smirdrv(at)hotmail.com>
Sent: Mon, Jul 29, 2013 12:02 pm
Subject: RV-List: Thoughts on Subaru FWF
I am considering using an "Egg" FWF on my "6", and would like to get some r
eal time insight as to personal experiences of those who have them now. You
can write or call. Thanks.
R.C.
310-502-5331
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Thoughts on Subaru FWF |
| From: | Tracy <rwstracy(at)gmail.com> |
Yeah! Like a Mazda Rotary! But seriously, the Egg. has proven to be defec
tive and that is according to the manufacturer. There are too many basic fl
aws in the FWF package to be fixable even if tinkering is part of the reason
you are considering auto power.
RV-4 Mazda 13B 1850 Hrs
RV-8 Mazda 20B 210 Hrs.
Sent from my iPad
On Jul 29, 2013, at 16:26, vanremog(at)aol.com wrote:
> The only comment I would make is "Bad Idea..." Save your green stamps and
get a real engine.
>
> -GV
> -----Original Message-----
> From: R.C. Flyer <smirdrv(at)hotmail.com>
> To: rv-list
> Sent: Mon, Jul 29, 2013 12:02 pm
> Subject: RV-List: Thoughts on Subaru FWF
>
> I am considering using an "Egg" FWF on my "6", and would like to get some r
eal time insight as to personal experiences of those who have them now. You c
an write or call. Thanks.
>
> R.C.
> 310-502-5331
>
>
> t="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV-List
> tp://forums.matronics.com
> _blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution
>
>
>
==========================
=========
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>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | andrew cullum <asc23111964(at)hotmail.co.uk> |
I shall concur with other contributors.
Several Europa aircraft have had accidents because of these engines and or gear-box
failures.
Andy Cullum Tri-gear Europa G-CGDH.
Sent from my iPhone
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | scott bilinski <rv8a2001(at)yahoo.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Thoughts on Subaru FWF |
Last I checked Jan now uses Honda engines..... Anyone?=0A=0AAdd me to the l
ist, I knew a local guy who took out the Egg Subaru and replaced it with a
Lycoming after years of frustration.=0A-=0AS.=0A=0A=0A=0A________________
________________=0A From: "vanremog(at)aol.com" <vanremog(at)aol.com>=0ATo: rv-li
st(at)matronics.com =0ASent: Monday, July 29, 2013 1:26 PM=0ASubject: Re: RV-L
ist: Thoughts on Subaru FWF=0A =0A=0A=0AThe only-comment I would make is
"Bad Idea..."- Save your green stamps and get a real engine.=0A-=0A-GV
=0A-----Original Message-----=0AFrom: R.C. Flyer <smirdrv(at)hotmail.com>=0ATo
: rv-list =0ASent: Mon, Jul 29, 2013 12:02 pm=0ASubj
ect: RV-List: Thoughts on Subaru FWF=0A=0A=0AI am considering using an "Egg
" FWF on my "6", and would like to get some real time insight as to persona
l experiences of those who have them now. You can write or call. Thanks.=0A
=0AR.C.=0A310-502-5331=0A=0At="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator
?RV-List=0Atp://forums.matronics.com=0A_blank">http://www.matronics.com/con
===============
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | BOB L WATSON <bob194bn(at)verizon.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Thoughts on Subaru FWF |
That is putting a very big E in the word experimental=0A-=0Aimo =0ABob N1
94bn 700+ hours 0320 150 hp=0A=0AFrom: R.C. Flyer <smirdrv(at)hotmail.com>=0AT
o: rv-list(at)matronics.com =0ASent: Monday, July 29, 2013 12:01 PM=0ASubject:
RV-List: Thoughts on Subaru FWF=0A=0A=0A=0AI am considering using an "Egg"
FWF on my "6", and would like to get some real time insight as to personal
experiences of those who have them now. You can write or call. Thanks.=0A
=====================
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Thoughts on Subaru FWF |
Don't waste your money a half worn out Lyc. will keep you flying Ask G. Cl
ayton when he gets out of hospital from his crash and burn in Indy
-----Original Message-----
From: BOB L WATSON <bob194bn(at)verizon.net>
Sent: Mon, Jul 29, 2013 7:05 pm
Subject: Re: RV-List: Thoughts on Subaru FWF
That is putting a very big E in the word experimental
imo
Bob N194bn 700+ hours 0320 150 hp
From: R.C. Flyer <smirdrv(at)hotmail.com>
Sent: Monday, July 29, 2013 12:01 PM
Subject: RV-List: Thoughts on Subaru FWF
I am considering using an "Egg" FWF on my "6", and would like to get some r
eal time insight as to personal experiences of those who have them now. You
can write or call. Thanks.
R.C.
310-502-5331
-= - The RV-List Email Forum -
-= Use the Matronics List Features Navigator to browse
-= the many List utilities such as List Un/Subscription,
-= Archive Search & Download, 7-Day Browse, Chat, FAQ,
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________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Thoughts on Subaru FWF |
| From: | Bobby Hester <bobbyhester(at)twc.com> |
Big mistake!
Go to VAF and search the forums.
You will find lots of reasons not to.
Sent from my Verizon iPhone
On Jul 29, 2013, at 1:01 PM, "R.C. Flyer" wrote:
> I am considering using an "Egg" FWF on my "6", and would like to get some r
eal time insight as to personal experiences of those who have them now. You c
an write or call. Thanks.
>
> R.C.
> 310-502-5331
>
>
==========================
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=========
==========================
=========
==========================
=========
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "R.C. Flyer" <smirdrv(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | Re: =?utf-8?Q?Re:_RV-List:_Thoughts_on_Subaru_FWF? |
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________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | rv7a <rv7a(at)prosody.org> |
| Subject: | 2013 Abbotsford BC air show |
I've flown in from KBFI for some 10 years.
The Snowbirds are awesome.
http://www.abbotsfordairshow.com/
The Abbotsford Flying Club invites you to fly-in or
drive-in and camp August 9th through 11th for the
2013 Abbotsford International Airshow.
http://www.cleanh2o.com/633z/2013-0729-Abbotsford-airshow-FlyIn-Info-3a.pdf
Joe Edwards
CH601XLB @ BFI, 820 hours
Jabiru 3300A, Sensenich 64x51 wood prop
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bill Judge <bjudge(at)gmail.com> |
| Subject: | Fwd: History and Status of Eggenfellner Subaru Auto Conversions |
- FAASafety.gov
A few days ago a guy was asking about the Subaru conversions... and then I
just got this invite to a talk about them.
I'm guessing the content will not be kind...
but I signed up just to see for myself.
Bill
RV-8, N84WJ, 910 hrs
rv-8.blogspot.com
---------- Forwarded message ----------
From: FAASafety.gov <info_bjudge=gmail.com(at)faasafety.gov>
Date: Sat, Aug 3, 2013 at 10:21 PM
Subject: History and Status of Eggenfellner Subaru Auto Conversions -
FAASafety.gov
FAA Safety Team | Safer Skies Through Education
You have asked us to notify you when a seminar is scheduled that meets your
criteria. The following seminar may be of interest to you:
*"History and Status of Eggenfellner Subaru Auto Conversions"*
Topic: History and Status of Eggenfellner Subaru Auto Conversions
On *Saturday, August 17, 2013* at *10:00 AM*
Location:
EAA Chapter 14, Hangar 1
1409 Continental St
San Diego, CA 92154
*Select Number:*
WP0950696
*Description:*
The month's presentation is focused on automobile engines used in home
built aircraft, with a focus on the Subaru platform. Pete will review of
various Subaru auto-conversion engine types produced by Jan Eggenfellner
and a brief discussion of each engine type and the reasons for graduating
to different models
To view further details and registration information for this seminar, click
here <http://www.faasafety.gov/SPANS/event_details.aspx?eid=50696>.
The sponsor for this seminar is: *FAASTeam and EAA Chapter 14*
The FAA Safety Team (FAASTeam) is committed to providing equal access to
this meeting/event for all participants. If you need alternative formats or
services because of a disability, please communicate your request as soon
as possible with the person in the 'Contact Information' area of the
meeting/event notice. Note that two weeks is usually required to arrange
services.
The following credit(s) are available for the WINGS/AMT Programs:
Basic Knowledge 3 - 1 Credit
Advanced Knowledge 2 - 1 Credit
Master Knowledge 2 - 1 Credit
Click here to view the WINGS help
page<http://www.faasafety.gov/OnlineHelp/Default.aspx?page=/WINGS/pub/default.aspx>
Invite a fellow pilot to the next WINGS Safety Seminar in your area.
[image:
used for alignment] * FAASafety.gov <http://www.faasafety.gov/> | Email
Preferences <http://www.faasafety.gov/Users/pub/preferences.aspx> |
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Contact us<http://www.faasafety.gov/about/contact.aspx>for comments or
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________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Ralph E. Capen" <recapen(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | Fwd: History and Status of Eggenfellner Subaru Auto Conversions |
- FAASafety.gov
It would be interesting! Will they let you record it? I know of at least
one -7A under construction..he's already bought the engine..
From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Bill Judge
Sent: Sunday, August 04, 2013 2:04 AM
Subject: RV-List: Fwd: History and Status of Eggenfellner Subaru Auto
Conversions - FAASafety.gov
A few days ago a guy was asking about the Subaru conversions... and then I
just got this invite to a talk about them.
I'm guessing the content will not be kind...
but I signed up just to see for myself.
Bill
RV-8, N84WJ, 910 hrs
rv-8.blogspot.com <http://rv-8.blogspot.com/>
---------- Forwarded message ----------
From: FAASafety.gov <info_bjudge=gmail.com(at)faasafety.gov>
Date: Sat, Aug 3, 2013 at 10:21 PM
Subject: History and Status of Eggenfellner Subaru Auto Conversions -
FAASafety.gov
FAA Safety Team | Safer Skies Through Education
You have asked us to notify you when a seminar is scheduled that meets your
criteria. The following seminar may be of interest to you:
"History and Status of Eggenfellner Subaru Auto Conversions"
Topic: History and Status of Eggenfellner Subaru Auto Conversions
On Saturday, August 17, 2013 at 10:00 AM
Location:
EAA Chapter 14, Hangar 1
1409 Continental St
San Diego, CA 92154
Select Number:
WP0950696
Description:
The month's presentation is focused on automobile engines used in home built
aircraft, with a focus on the Subaru platform. Pete will review of various
Subaru auto-conversion engine types produced by Jan Eggenfellner and a brief
discussion of each engine type and the reasons for graduating to different
models
To view further details and registration information for this seminar, click
here <http://www.faasafety.gov/SPANS/event_details.aspx?eid=50696> .
The sponsor for this seminar is: FAASTeam and EAA Chapter 14
The FAA Safety Team (FAASTeam) is committed to providing equal access to
this meeting/event for all participants. If you need alternative formats or
services because of a disability, please communicate your request as soon as
possible with the person in the 'Contact Information' area of the
meeting/event notice. Note that two weeks is usually required to arrange
services.
The following credit(s) are available for the WINGS/AMT Programs:
Basic Knowledge 3 - 1 Credit
Advanced Knowledge 2 - 1 Credit
Master Knowledge 2 - 1 Credit
Click here to view the WINGS help page
<http://www.faasafety.gov/OnlineHelp/Default.aspx?page=/WINGS/pub/default.as
px>
Invite a fellow pilot to the next WINGS Safety Seminar in your area.
FAASafety.gov <http://www.faasafety.gov/> | Email Preferences
<http://www.faasafety.gov/Users/pub/preferences.aspx> | Opt Out
<http://www.FAASafety.gov/users/pub/optout.aspx?uuid=26C6F6D8-6040-453A-9466
-EAD46645F866>
Do not reply to this email as it is an unmonitored mailbox. Contact us
<http://www.faasafety.gov/about/contact.aspx> for comments or questions.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Ken Brooks <kenbrooks(at)charter.net> |
| Subject: | RV-8 Baggage Door Ribs |
Has anyone else encountered a problem with the forward (right side)
baggage door rib - F-873B- being too short to capture the last hole in
the pre-punched outside door skin? I plan to plug the hole with a
rivet, but it won't catch the rib at all. I started from the other end
of the door that meets the fuselage skin and clamped, drilled and
clecoed the skin to the two ribs, but was somewhat dismayed that the
right rib even looked short and didn't capture the last rivet hole.
Perhaps I'll see that it doesn't matter once I get everything else on
the door fitted and drilled. I'm not sure a photo will show up on the
list digest, but I'm attaching one anyway.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | bifft(at)xmission.com |
| Subject: | Re: RV-8 Baggage Door Ribs |
Quoting Ken Brooks :
> Has anyone else encountered a problem with the forward (right side)
> baggage door rib - F-873B- being too short to capture the last hole
> in the pre-punched outside door skin? I plan to plug the hole with
> a rivet, but it won't catch the rib at all. I started from the
> other end of the door that meets the fuselage skin and clamped,
> drilled and clecoed the skin to the two ribs, but was somewhat
> dismayed that the right rib even looked short and didn't capture the
> last rivet hole. Perhaps I'll see that it doesn't matter once I
> get everything else on the door fitted and drilled. I'm not sure a
> photo will show up on the list digest, but I'm attaching one anyway.
>
Where does the other end line up? I just checked mine and the top
rivet doesn't go into that rib, but instead into some angle that is
also riveted to the hinge.
Brian Huffaker, DSWL (bifft(at)xmission.com)
RV-8A Attaching cowl
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: RV-8 Baggage Door Ribs |
Hi Ken
I am quite sure there were no excess holes in the door. I built it twice,
having fouled up the first try--couldn't get it to settle in the right
position to seal properly. I would suggest a careful review of how the door
is assembled. I would bet dimes to doughnuts that you either have a piece
missing or something mis-aligned.
Regards,
Michael Wynn
RV8 Finishing
San Ramon, CA
In a message dated 8/16/2013 6:49:03 P.M. Pacific Daylight Time,
kenbrooks(at)charter.net writes:
Has anyone else encountered a problem with the forward (right side)
baggage door rib - F-873B- being too short to capture the last get it hole in
the
pre-punched outside door skin? I plan to plug the hole with a rivet, but
it won't catch the rib at all. I started from the other end of the door
that meets the fuselage skin and clamped, drilled and clecoed the skin to the
two ribs, but was somewhat dismayed that the right rib even looked short
and didn't capture the last rivet hole. Perhaps I'll see that it doesn't
matter once I get everything else on the door fitted and drilled. I'm not
sure a photo will show up on the list digest, but I'm attaching one anyway.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bill Judge <bjudge(at)gmail.com> |
| Subject: | Re: History and Status of Eggenfellner Subaru Auto Conversions |
- FAASafety.gov
The Eggenfellner Engine talk was interesting.
The gentlemen, Pete Krok, giving the talk was very unemotional about the
topic. He's assembled his group to try to get as many of the subarus flying
as possible that Egg sold by exchanging information. The information
exchanged in the group is for the group only and group is only open to Egg
buyers and Pete went to great lengths to make sure that Egg was not in the
group.
So if anyone has an orphaned Egg Pete might be helpful.
Someone recorded the talk, I've asked if it would be made available online,
if I get a link I'll pass it along.
Interesting stuff.
Bill
RV-8, N84WJ, 915 hrs
rv-8.blogspot.com
On Sat, Aug 3, 2013 at 11:03 PM, Bill Judge wrote:
> A few days ago a guy was asking about the Subaru conversions... and then I
> just got this invite to a talk about them.
>
> I'm guessing the content will not be kind...
>
> but I signed up just to see for myself.
>
> Bill
> RV-8, N84WJ, 910 hrs
> rv-8.blogspot.com
>
>
> ---------- Forwarded message ----------
> From: FAASafety.gov <info_bjudge=gmail.com(at)faasafety.gov>
> Date: Sat, Aug 3, 2013 at 10:21 PM
> Subject: History and Status of Eggenfellner Subaru Auto Conversions -
> FAASafety.gov
> To: bjudge(at)gmail.com
>
>
> FAA Safety Team | Safer Skies Through Education
>
> You have asked us to notify you when a seminar is scheduled that meets
> your criteria. The following seminar may be of interest to you:
> *"History and Status of Eggenfellner Subaru Auto Conversions"*
> Topic: History and Status of Eggenfellner Subaru Auto Conversions
> On *Saturday, August 17, 2013* at *10:00 AM*
> Location:
> EAA Chapter 14, Hangar 1
> 1409 Continental St
>
> San Diego, CA 92154
>
> *Select Number:*
> WP0950696
>
> *Description:*
> The month's presentation is focused on automobile engines used in home
> built aircraft, with a focus on the Subaru platform. Pete will review of
> various Subaru auto-conversion engine types produced by Jan Eggenfellner
> and a brief discussion of each engine type and the reasons for graduating
> to different models
>
> To view further details and registration information for this seminar, click
> here <http://www.faasafety.gov/SPANS/event_details.aspx?eid=50696>.
>
> The sponsor for this seminar is: *FAASTeam and EAA Chapter 14*
>
> The FAA Safety Team (FAASTeam) is committed to providing equal access to
> this meeting/event for all participants. If you need alternative formats or
> services because of a disability, please communicate your request as soon
> as possible with the person in the 'Contact Information' area of the
> meeting/event notice. Note that two weeks is usually required to arrange
> services.
>
> The following credit(s) are available for the WINGS/AMT Programs:
> Basic Knowledge 3 - 1 Credit
> Advanced Knowledge 2 - 1 Credit
> Master Knowledge 2 - 1 Credit
>
> Click here to view the WINGS help page<http://www.faasafety.gov/OnlineHelp/Default.aspx?page=/WINGS/pub/default.aspx> Invite a fellow pilot to the next WINGS Safety Seminar in your area. [image:
> used for alignment] * FAASafety.gov <http://www.faasafety.gov/> | Email
> Preferences <http://www.faasafety.gov/Users/pub/preferences.aspx> | Opt
> Out<http://www.FAASafety.gov/users/pub/optout.aspx?uuid=26C6F6D8-6040-453A-9466-EAD46645F866>
> * Do not reply to this email as it is an unmonitored mailbox. Contact
> us <http://www.faasafety.gov/about/contact.aspx> for comments or
> questions.
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: History and Status of Eggenfellner Subaru Auto Conversions |
- FAASafety.gov
| From: | David Leonard <wdleonard(at)gmail.com> |
I saw the topic and thought it might be interesting... but didn't want to
fly my plane there for fear of 'crashing the event' with a different (and
as a whole much more successful) auto engine.
Would love to see the video if you get a copy.
Rodoc
On Mon, Aug 19, 2013 at 2:56 PM, Bill Judge wrote:
> The Eggenfellner Engine talk was interesting.
>
> The gentlemen, Pete Krok, giving the talk was very unemotional about the
> topic. He's assembled his group to try to get as many of the subarus flying
> as possible that Egg sold by exchanging information. The information
> exchanged in the group is for the group only and group is only open to Egg
> buyers and Pete went to great lengths to make sure that Egg was not in the
> group.
>
> So if anyone has an orphaned Egg Pete might be helpful.
>
> Someone recorded the talk, I've asked if it would be made available
> online, if I get a link I'll pass it along.
>
> Interesting stuff.
>
> Bill
> RV-8, N84WJ, 915 hrs
> rv-8.blogspot.com
>
>
> On Sat, Aug 3, 2013 at 11:03 PM, Bill Judge wrote:
>
>> A few days ago a guy was asking about the Subaru conversions... and then
>> I just got this invite to a talk about them.
>>
>> I'm guessing the content will not be kind...
>>
>> but I signed up just to see for myself.
>>
>> Bill
>> RV-8, N84WJ, 910 hrs
>> rv-8.blogspot.com
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> ---------- Forwarded message ----------
>> From: FAASafety.gov <info_bjudge=gmail.com(at)faasafety.gov>
>> Date: Sat, Aug 3, 2013 at 10:21 PM
>> Subject: History and Status of Eggenfellner Subaru Auto Conversions -
>> FAASafety.gov
>> To: bjudge(at)gmail.com
>>
>>
>> FAA Safety Team | Safer Skies Through Education
>>
>> You have asked us to notify you when a seminar is scheduled that meets
>> your criteria. The following seminar may be of interest to you:
>> *"History and Status of Eggenfellner Subaru Auto Conversions"*
>> Topic: History and Status of Eggenfellner Subaru Auto Conversions
>> On *Saturday, August 17, 2013* at *10:00 AM*
>> Location:
>> EAA Chapter 14, Hangar 1
>> 1409 Continental St
>>
>> San Diego, CA 92154
>>
>> *Select Number:*
>> WP0950696
>>
>> *Description:*
>> The month's presentation is focused on automobile engines used in home
>> built aircraft, with a focus on the Subaru platform. Pete will review of
>> various Subaru auto-conversion engine types produced by Jan Eggenfellner
>> and a brief discussion of each engine type and the reasons for graduating
>> to different models
>>
>> To view further details and registration information for this seminar, click
>> here <http://www.faasafety.gov/SPANS/event_details.aspx?eid=50696>.
>>
>> The sponsor for this seminar is: *FAASTeam and EAA Chapter 14*
>>
>> The FAA Safety Team (FAASTeam) is committed to providing equal access to
>> this meeting/event for all participants. If you need alternative formats or
>> services because of a disability, please communicate your request as soon
>> as possible with the person in the 'Contact Information' area of the
>> meeting/event notice. Note that two weeks is usually required to arrange
>> services.
>>
>> The following credit(s) are available for the WINGS/AMT Programs:
>> Basic Knowledge 3 - 1 Credit
>> Advanced Knowledge 2 - 1 Credit
>> Master Knowledge 2 - 1 Credit
>>
>> Click here to view the WINGS help page<http://www.faasafety.gov/OnlineHelp/Default.aspx?page=/WINGS/pub/default.aspx> Invite a fellow pilot to the next WINGS Safety Seminar in your area. [image:
>> used for alignment] * FAASafety.gov <http://www.faasafety.gov/> | Email
>> Preferences <http://www.faasafety.gov/Users/pub/preferences.aspx> | Opt
>> Out<http://www.FAASafety.gov/users/pub/optout.aspx?uuid=26C6F6D8-6040-453A-9466-EAD46645F866>
>> * Do not reply to this email as it is an unmonitored mailbox. Contact
>> us <http://www.faasafety.gov/about/contact.aspx> for comments or
>> questions.
>>
>>
> *
>
> *
>
>
--
David Leonard
Turbo Rotary RV-6 N4VY
http://N4VY.RotaryRoster.net
http://RotaryRoster.net
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bill Judge <bjudge(at)gmail.com> |
| Subject: | Fwd: Advisory Glideslope on LP approaches ISSUE=138781 PROJ=1 |
So I noticed a while back that "advisory glide slope" disappeared from GPS
17 at KSEE, my home field.
I thought something broke... but after flying recently with an instructor
during an IPC I found out that the new LP approaches(that sometimes have
lower minima) do not support advisory glideslope, at least the Garmin 430
LP implementation doesn't support advisory glideslope.
Background: For the guys that upgraded to WAAS, it was a pleasant surprise
that all the non precision approaches suddenly had glideslope added, this
allowed you to easily set up a stabilized approach much like an ILS on any
GPS approach as long as you kept in mind that the baro altimeter and
horizontal position was the actual guidance for where you belong
vertically. You could still "chop and drop" but the 430 would connect the
dots and give you "advisory vertical guidance" allowing for the hallowed
stabilized approach.
LP came along and the FAA decided that this advisory glideslope business
just has to go away. So in 2009 when Garmin implemented the LP approaches
in the 430 they deleted the glideslope.
Then in 2011 the FAA recognized their mistake and published AC 90-107 and
now allows advisory glideslope.
So I thought I'd see what Garmin's position was on this. The answer is
below. I think basically they are saying 430 owners shouldn't hold their
breath.
I suspect that more and more LP approaches will be coming online...
Bummer.
Bill
N84WJ, RV-8 915 hrs
rv-8.blogspot.com
*Brief description of the problem:*
Good Afternoon Sir,
While we understand the FAA's position on using advisory guidance the
option to use it while flying a LP approach is limited by software. The
advisory circular you quote was published on 2/11/11, while the GNS
software that was first compatible with LP approaches dates back to 2009.
It wasn't until the last 6 months or so that LP approaches had enough
presence to disrupt LNAV+V approaches replacing the +V with lower minimums.
At this point the +V advisory guidance cannot be made available to you
until/unless new software is made available for the GPS device that is
being used. Garmin is aware of the impact that these changes have made on
flying these approaches and will accommodate you as soon as possible.
Please be aware that the process required to release new software is a long
one and this feature may be some time down the road. I am not in a position
to confirm if and or when this feature may be returned to your
product. Please stay tuned for potential future S.W. updates for your GNC
430W.
Best Regards,
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Marty Helller <marty_away(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | Fwd: Advisory Glideslope on LP approaches ISSUE=138781 PROJ=1 |
Hey Bill=2C its been a few years since working in support of the FAA's WAAS
program office so my info might be dated.... That said=2C there is a reaso
n why some RNAV / Gps approaches didn't quaily for LPV minima. Usual its c
lose in obstacles...basically the same as an ILS=2C and why people are disa
ppointed that it didn't solve their localizor only approach limitation. Se
cond could be course alignment =2C enough for staight in but still a close
in turn=2C and or other reasons. The FAA first priority was to build LPVs
whereever possible.
LP was the alternative=2C with usually better minima than a LNAV (height-wi
se) because the obstacle protection zone is smaller. But LPs also took a lo
t of extra programing for Garmin who didn't see the business case while the
re weren't many LPs out there=2C and thousands of LNAV's out there. There
is also a programming issue because the approach is really now a data file
=2C and so either it has vertical (LPV) or not (LP). Its a data block in t
he file that's either on or off. In other words an LP + VNAv would be an L
PV and the FAA would have given you an LPV if there wasn't a reason they co
uldn't.
Ref minima...
Visibility minima is partly based on the distance needed to see the runway
from the MAP. By design=2C the LNAV MAP is the runway end=2C while the LPV
=2C and LnAV/VNAV decision height is usually at the beginning of the approa
ch lights=2C based on approach angle/height and other Terps magic.
So while the LNAV visability is nearly always lower=2C the aircraft usually
is not in a position to land if its at MAP when seeing the runway. (Simi
lar to other non -precision approaches.) Unlike a Vertically guided approa
ch which will have an airplane (on course/glideslope) in position to land
if seeing the runway at decision height=2C further=2C but not as high from
the runway.
If not confused yet=2C I can keep typing....
Marty Heller=2C RV-7 120 hours=2C KSUT
From: bjudge(at)gmail.com
Date: Wed=2C 21 Aug 2013 13:35:26 -0700
Subject: RV-List: Fwd: Advisory Glideslope on LP approaches ISSUE=138781
PROJ=1
So I noticed a while back that "advisory glide slope" disappeared from GPS
17 at KSEE=2C my home field.
I thought something broke... but after flying recently with an instructor d
uring an IPC I found out that the new LP approaches(that sometimes have low
er minima) do not support advisory glideslope=2C at least the Garmin 430 LP
implementation doesn't support advisory glideslope.
Background: For the guys that upgraded to WAAS=2C it was a pleasant surpris
e that all the non precision approaches suddenly had glideslope added=2C th
is allowed you to easily set up a stabilized approach much like an ILS on a
ny GPS approach as long as you kept in mind that the baro altimeter and hor
izontal position was the actual guidance for where you belong vertically. Y
ou could still "chop and drop" but the 430 would connect the dots and give
you "advisory vertical guidance" allowing for the hallowed stabilized appro
ach.
LP came along and the FAA decided that this advisory glideslope business ju
st has to go away. So in 2009 when Garmin implemented the LP approaches in
the 430 they deleted the glideslope.
Then in 2011 the FAA recognized their mistake and published AC 90-107 and n
ow allows advisory glideslope.
So I thought I'd see what Garmin's position was on this. The answer is belo
w. I think basically they are saying 430 owners shouldn't hold their breath
.
I suspect that more and more LP approaches will be coming online...
Bummer.
BillN84WJ=2C RV-8 915 hrsrv-8.blogspot.com
Brief description of the problem:
Good Afternoon Sir=2C
While we understand the FAA's position on using advisory guidance the optio
n to use it while flying a LP approach is limited by software. The advisory
circular you quote was published on 2/11/11=2C while the GNS software that
was first compatible with LP approaches
dates back to 2009. It wasn't until the last 6 months or so that LP approa
ches had enough presence to disrupt LNAV+V approaches replacing the +V with
lower minimums.
At this point the +V advisory guidance cannot be made available to you unti
l/unless new software is made available for the GPS device that is being us
ed. Garmin is aware of the impact that these changes have made on flying th
ese approaches and will accommodate
you as soon as possible. Please be aware that the process required to rele
ase new software is a long one and this feature may be some time down the r
oad. I am not in a position to confirm if and or when this feature may be r
eturned to your product. Please
stay tuned for potential future S.W. updates for your GNC 430W.
Best Regards=2C
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "bigdog(at)bentwing.com" <bigdog(at)bentwing.com> |
| Subject: | 90 deg Oil Filter Adapter |
The engine for my RV-6 currently has a remote filter adapter but I want to
switch to a 90 degree adapter. The engine has not been mounted as yet. I've
seen several makes of adapters (Casper Labs, B&C, ECI) which all appear es
sentially the same. Is there a reason to choose one over the others, other
than price? The real question is - Is there a need for a spacer and if so,
what thickness? The engine is a parallel valve IO-360 in an RV-6 dynafocal
mount. Van's says most RV's need the 1 =BD inch spacer. Is that true here?
Thanks.
Regards,
Greg Young
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Ed <decaclops(at)gmail.com> |
| Subject: | Re: 90 deg Oil Filter Adapter |
Howdy Greg,
We've been flying a B&C adapter on our 6A with no spacer. The filter
just clears the motor mount tube. Got one on my new 6, also. There are
inches available between there and the firewall so a spacer won't hurt,
but I don't think it's necessary.
Ed Holyoke
On 8/23/2013 8:03 AM, bigdog(at)bentwing.com wrote:
> The engine for my RV-6 currently has a remote filter adapter but I want
> to switch to a 90 degree adapter. The engine has not been mounted as
> yet. Ive seen several makes of adapters (Casper Labs, B&C, ECI) which
> all appear essentially the same. Is there a reason to choose one over
> the others, other than price? The real question is Is there a need for
> a spacer and if so, what thickness? The engine is a parallel valve
> IO-360 in an RV-6 dynafocal mount. Vans says most RVs need the 1
> inch spacer. Is that true here? Thanks.
>
> Regards,
> Greg Young
>
> *
>
>
> *
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Tim Farrell <tim(at)AirCraftersLLC.com> |
| Subject: | Rv-14 and BBQ at the Watsonville Fly-In this weekend. |
Van's Aircraft is bringing the RV-14 to the Watsonville Airshow this
Labor Day Weekend, Aug. 31- Sept. 1. They will have the aircraft on
display Saturday all day and Sunday morning. A representative from Vans
will be around to answer questions.
Saturday evening, from 5:30 -- 7pm, Aircrafters will be hosting a BBQ
with hamburgers, hot dogs and veggie burgers for all the Pilots and
Passengers of Experimental Aircraft that have flown in for the show. We
will have the RV-14 at the hanger at that time as well. Also come to see
some new RV-10 and the RV-8 aircraft.
RSVP to bbq(at)aircraftersllc.com or by
phone at 831-722-9141
Thanks,
Tim
--
Tim Farrell -
Aircrafters -
Owner/Manager -
(831) 722-9141 -
www.aircraftersLLC.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | thomas sargent <sarg314(at)gmail.com> |
I'm looking to pick up a used handheld aviation GPS to use as a backup.
Maybe some one on the list has just bought the latest and greatest and
would like to sell his/her old GPS?
--
Tom Sargent
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Michael Kraus <n223rv(at)wolflakeairport.net> |
You could buy an iPhone or an iPad with 3G/4G service and it will serve mult
iple needs.... Like flight planning, moving map GPS, in-flight entertainme
nt, etc....
Sent from my iPhone
On Aug 29, 2013, at 1:56 PM, thomas sargent wrote:
> I'm looking to pick up a used handheld aviation GPS to use as a backup. Ma
ybe some one on the list has just bought the latest and greatest and would l
ike to sell his/her old GPS?
>
> --
> Tom Sargent
>
>
==========================
=========
==========================
=========
==========================
=========
==========================
=========
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | MacDonald Doug <dougsnash(at)yahoo.com> |
Tom, new Bendix/King AV8ORs were something like $199 or some such at Airven
ture from Pacific/Gulf Coast Avionics.- Why go used when you can get new
(with warranty) for a similar price.=0A=0ADoug M=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A____________
____________________=0A From: thomas sargent <sarg314(at)gmail.com>=0ATo: rv-l
ist =0ASent: Thursday, August 29, 2013 12:56:18 PM
=0ASubject: RV-List: backup GPS=0A =0A=0A=0AI'm looking to pick up a used h
andheld aviation GPS to use as a backup. Maybe some one on the list has jus
t bought the latest and greatest and would like to sell his/her old GPS?=0A
===================
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | thomas sargent <sarg314(at)gmail.com> |
Doug:
The AV8OR's features are fine, but their battery performance is really poor
(I know, I have one!). A back-up needs to be able run by itself for an
hour or 2.
On Thu, Aug 29, 2013 at 12:31 PM, MacDonald Doug wrote:
> Tom, new Bendix/King AV8ORs were something like $199 or some such at
> Airventure from Pacific/Gulf Coast Avionics. Why go used when you can get
> new (with warranty) for a similar price.
>
> Doug M
>
>
> ------------------------------
> *From:* thomas sargent
> *To:* rv-list
> *Sent:* Thursday, August 29, 2013 12:56:18 PM
> *Subject:* RV-List: backup GPS
>
> I'm looking to pick up a used handheld aviation GPS to use as a backup.
> Maybe some one on the list has just bought the latest and greatest and
> would like to sell his/her old GPS?
>
> --
> Tom Sargent
>
>
--
Tom Sargent
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | thomas sargent <sarg314(at)gmail.com> |
Actually, I just looked this up. I note that there is a 4000mah battery
available for the AV8OR for $87. Has any one tried it? Does it really give
you an hour or more of operation time?
On Thu, Aug 29, 2013 at 12:54 PM, thomas sargent wrote:
> Doug:
> The AV8OR's features are fine, but their battery performance is really
> poor (I know, I have one!). A back-up needs to be able run by itself for
> an hour or 2.
>
>
> On Thu, Aug 29, 2013 at 12:31 PM, MacDonald Doug wrote:
>
>> Tom, new Bendix/King AV8ORs were something like $199 or some such at
>> Airventure from Pacific/Gulf Coast Avionics. Why go used when you can get
>> new (with warranty) for a similar price.
>>
>> Doug M
>>
>>
>> ------------------------------
>> *From:* thomas sargent
>> *To:* rv-list
>> *Sent:* Thursday, August 29, 2013 12:56:18 PM
>> *Subject:* RV-List: backup GPS
>>
>> I'm looking to pick up a used handheld aviation GPS to use as a backup.
>> Maybe some one on the list has just bought the latest and greatest and
>> would like to sell his/her old GPS?
>>
>> --
>> Tom Sargent
>>
>>
>
> --
> Tom Sargent
>
--
Tom Sargent
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | MacDonald Doug <dougsnash(at)yahoo.com> |
That is what I have on mine and thought everyone also did since B-K was giv
ing them away for free at one time.- Three hours at full brightness is ty
pical battery life on my good ole AV8OR.=0A-=0ADoug M=0A =0A=0A__________
______________________=0A From: thomas sargent <sarg314(at)gmail.com>=0ATo: rv
-list =0ASent: Thursday, August 29, 2013 3:32:38 PM
=0ASubject: Re: RV-List: backup GPS=0A =0A=0A=0AActually, I just looked th
is up. I note that there is a 4000mah battery available for the AV8OR for $
87.- Has any one tried it? Does it really give you an hour or more of ope
ration time?=0A=0A=0A=0A=0AOn Thu, Aug 29, 2013 at 12:54 PM, thomas sargent
wrote:=0A=0ADoug: =0A>The AV8OR's features are fine, b
ut their battery performance is really poor (I know, I have one!).- A bac
k-up needs to be able run by itself for an hour or 2.=0A>=0A>=0A>=0A>=0A>On
Thu, Aug 29, 2013 at 12:31 PM, MacDonald Doug wrote:
=0A>=0A>Tom, new Bendix/King AV8ORs were something like $199 or some such a
t Airventure from Pacific/Gulf Coast Avionics.- Why go used when you can
get new (with warranty) for a similar price.=0A>>=0A>>Doug M=0A>>=0A>>=0A>>
=0A>>=0A>> =0A>>=0A>>________________________________=0A>> From: thomas sar
gent =0A>>To: rv-list =0A>>Sent:
Thursday, August 29, 2013 12:56:18 PM=0A>>Subject: RV-List: backup GPS=0A>
> =0A>>=0A>>=0A>>I'm looking to pick up a used handheld aviation GPS to us
e as a backup. Maybe some one on the list has just bought the latest and gr
eatest and would like to sell his/her old GPS?=0A>>=0A>>=0A>>-- =0A>>Tom Sa
=========
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | thomas sargent <sarg314(at)gmail.com> |
OK, you talked me into it. It's a lot cheaper than another GPS.
On Thu, Aug 29, 2013 at 1:53 PM, MacDonald Doug wrote:
> That is what I have on mine and thought everyone also did since B-K was
> giving them away for free at one time. Three hours at full brightness is
> typical battery life on my good ole AV8OR.
>
> Doug M
>
> *From:* thomas sargent
> *To:* rv-list
> *Sent:* Thursday, August 29, 2013 3:32:38 PM
> *Subject:* Re: RV-List: backup GPS
>
> Actually, I just looked this up. I note that there is a 4000mah battery
> available for the AV8OR for $87. Has any one tried it? Does it really give
> you an hour or more of operation time?
>
>
> On Thu, Aug 29, 2013 at 12:54 PM, thomas sargent wrote:
>
> Doug:
> The AV8OR's features are fine, but their battery performance is really
> poor (I know, I have one!). A back-up needs to be able run by itself for
> an hour or 2.
>
>
> On Thu, Aug 29, 2013 at 12:31 PM, MacDonald Doug wrote:
>
> Tom, new Bendix/King AV8ORs were something like $199 or some such at
> Airventure from Pacific/Gulf Coast Avionics. Why go used when you can get
> new (with warranty) for a similar price.
>
> Doug M
>
>
> *From:* thomas sargent
> *To:* rv-list
> *Sent:* Thursday, August 29, 2013 12:56:18 PM
> *Subject:* RV-List: backup GPS
>
> I'm looking to pick up a used handheld aviation GPS to use as a backup.
> Maybe some one on the list has just bought the latest and greatest and
> would like to sell his/her old GPS?
>
> --
> Tom Sargent
>
>
> --
> Tom Sargent
>
>
> --
> Tom Sargent
>
> *http://www.matronics.com/================
> *
>
>
> *
>
> *
>
>
--
Tom Sargent
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | aviation GPS app for android phones |
| From: | thomas sargent <sarg314(at)gmail.com> |
Maybe everybody already knows this, but I couldn't find a ref. to it in the
archives.
I just discovered a free Android app called Avare, which runs a pretty good
looking aviation GPS program on your Android phone (assuming it has GPS).
I am no longer searching for a backup GPS. I've had one on belt all along.
It has charts, airport info, the works. I'm still learning about it, but I
am really impressed so far.
--
Tom Sargent
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Hopperdhh(at)aol.com |
Hi Tom,
Maybe I'll get disqualified because this is not technically an aviation
GPS.
And I'll probably get laughed off the list! My Garmin Foretrex 101 cost
me $69 new at Aldi a few years ago. I wear it on my wrist and it agrees
exactly with my panel mounted (old!) Garmin 295. No data base but you can
easily put in Lat/Lon and do a goto. Two AAA batteries last 14 hours.
Now for the best part -- it has NMEA data out for your auto-pilot! Serial
data cables are on ebay, or make your own.
They sell on ebay for much less than $69! There's also the Foretrex 201
which is a little better model, and of course newer and more expensive
models of the Foretrex.
I've found this little gadget really handy for finding your car after a
NASCAR race!
Dan Hopper
RV-7A 766DH
Flying since 2004
In a message dated 8/29/2013 2:49:25 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time,
sarg314(at)gmail.com writes:
I'm looking to pick up a used handheld aviation GPS to use as a backup.
Maybe some one on the list has just bought the latest and greatest and would
like to sell his/her old GPS?
--
Tom Sargent
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: aviation GPS app for android phones |
| From: | Doug Gray <dgra1233(at)bigpond.net.au> |
It seems like a nice app but is absolutely useless outside of USA & Canada. '
ForeFlight' is no better.
Doug
On 30/08/2013, at 7:49 AM, thomas sargent wrote:
> Maybe everybody already knows this, but I couldn't find a ref. to it in th
e archives.
>
> I just discovered a free Android app called Avare, which runs a pretty goo
d looking aviation GPS program on your Android phone (assuming it has GPS).
I am no longer searching for a backup GPS. I've had one on belt all along.
>
> It has charts, airport info, the works. I'm still learning about it, but I
am really impressed so far.
>
> --
> Tom Sargent
>
>
==========================
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==========================
=========
==========================
=========
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>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: aviation GPS app for android phones |
What do you tight wads want for nothing
-----Original Message-----
From: Doug Gray <dgra1233(at)bigpond.net.au>
Sent: Thu, Aug 29, 2013 10:54 pm
Subject: Re: RV-List: aviation GPS app for android phones
It seems like a nice app but is absolutely useless outside of USA & Canada.
'ForeFlight' is no better.
Doug
On 30/08/2013, at 7:49 AM, thomas sargent wrote:
Maybe everybody already knows this, but I couldn't find a ref. to it in the
archives.
I just discovered a free Android app called Avare, which runs a pretty good
looking aviation GPS program on your Android phone (assuming it has GPS).
I am no longer searching for a backup GPS. I've had one on belt all along
.
It has charts, airport info, the works. I'm still learning about it, but I
am really impressed so far.
--
Tom Sargent
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________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | <cheathco(at)cox.net> |
Last night I had a night flight out of an airport other than my base.
(It was in rural area and I had planned to leave before dark.) No taxi
or runway lights and no moon. I had to turn off my 696 as it blinded me.
I cautiously found my way to the runway and back taxied for takeoff.
Landing lights were only extending a short distance and I was wondering
if some of you had switched to the LED type, and if so was there a
noticable improvement. only night flights since getting back into
flying have been a few out of FYV, its lit up like a two bit whore
house.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Matt Dralle <dralle(at)matronics.com> |
| Subject: | Re: 3/16 vs 1/4 Brake Lines... |
At 06:22 PM 8/31/2013 Saturday, you wrote:
>--> RV8-List message posted by: Dennis Fox
>
>My RV8a project is ready for wheels, and I keep thinking about the brake system
and lines. Seem to me like some weight could be saved by going with 3/16 brake
lines, (smaller line and less fluid). Problem with small lines is the heavy
viscosity of A/C hydraulic oil, especially when cold. Solution would be automotive
Dot 3 or Dot 4, but are there compatability issues with the Matco master
cylinders and Cleveland calipers? Maybe new o-rings could solve the problem?
Anyone know the answer?
Hi Dennis,
Hum, you should actually put the parts and fluid between a 1/4" and a 3/16" system
on a scale and weigh them. I think that you're going to find the difference
in weight is almost negligible. Oh the other hand, the difference in braking
capabilities could be deadly. Personally, I could stand to lose 50 lbs around
my belly. That is some realy weight savings that would make my RV fly a lot
better. :-)
I've done a fair amount of custom stuff on my RV, but when it comes to engineered
stuff like the size of the brake lines, and other dimensional stuff, Van's
is the man. Van's hates fat airplanes. If he felt that 3/16" brake lines would
be adequate, I know for certain that he would have used them.
Matt's $.02.
-
Matt Dralle
RV-8 #82880 N998RV "Ruby Vixen"
http://www.mattsrv8.com - Matt's Complete RV-8 Construction Log
http://www.mattsrv8.com/Mishap - Landing Mishap Rebuild Log
http://www.youtube.com/MattsRV8 - Matt's RV-8 HDTV YouTube Channel
Status: 172+ Hours TTSN - Rebuilding Fuselage After Landing Mishap...
RV-6 #20916 N360EM "The Flyer"
http://www.mattsrv6.com - Matt's RV-6 Revitalization Log
Status: 180+ Hours Since Purchase - Upgrades Complete; Now In Full Flyer Mode
May 10, 2013 - August 31, 2013
RV-Archive.digest.vol-vr