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Date: May 13, 2006
From: Deems Davis <deemsdavis(at)cox.net>
Subject: Re: Engine prices
Yes Will James gorejr(at)bellsouth.net wrote: > >Thanks for your reply. Still a little confused. If one wanted to purchase a modified cowl for a cold induction for the IO-540 for an RV-10 is there a source? Thanks Jim > > >>From: Deems Davis <deemsdavis(at)cox.net> >>Date: 2006/05/13 Sat AM 10:15:42 EDT >>To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com >>Subject: Re: FW: RV10-List: Engine prices >> >> >>I'm sorry I should have been more clear in my post. Will James is making >>the cowl for the eggenfellner H6 engine installation, it is specifically >>designed for that engine. The pictures shown are of an RV 6/7 I believe >>I have no idea what Will is doing for that engine on RV-10's, I suspect >>it would be an entirely different cowl and would NOT be the same as an >>IO 540. I only mentioned it as a reference to an inquiry about >>modifications to accomodate the forward facing Barrett Cold Air System. >>The eggenfellner cowl is an EXAMPLE of what the Cold Air system cowl >>will look like when complete for the RV-10. >> >>The benefits to the James cowl/plenum are: >> >>1. imporved cooling efficiency >>2. reduced drag (their web site cites a 7-10 mph avg speed increase from >>their cowl/pressure plenum installation. This appears to be >>substantiated by builder results and air race results.) >> >>The Cowl without the pressure plenum is only a partial solution. It's >>the combination of the devices that produces the above results >> >>Deems Davis # 406 >>Fuse >>http://deemsrv10.com/ >> >>The cowl without >> >>gorejr(at)bellsouth.net wrote: >> >> >> >>> >>>Where could one purchase the eggenfellner cowl? Is this the cowl made by James? Jim >>> >>> >>> >>> >>>>From: Deems Davis <deemsdavis(at)cox.net> >>>>Date: 2006/05/12 Fri PM 10:54:51 EDT >>>>To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com >>>>Subject: Re: FW: RV10-List: Engine prices >>>> >>>> >>>>Here's another pic link of the eggenfellner cowl: >>>>http://eggenfellneraircraft.com/100_1871.JPG >>>>I also just remembered something additional that plays into this >>>>discussion, that the James cowl requires a 14" prop spinner. >>>> >>>>Deems Davis # 406 >>>>Fuse >>>>http://deemsrv10.com/ >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> > > > > > > > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: May 13, 2006
Subject: [ Larry Rosen ] : New Email List Photo Share Available!
From: Email List Photo Shares <pictures(at)matronics.com>
A new Email List Photo Share is available: Poster: Larry Rosen Lists: RV10-List Subject: RV-10 control stick mod http://www.matronics.com/photoshare/LarryRosen@comcast.net.05.13.2006/index.html o Main Photo Share Index http://www.matronics.com/photoshare o Submitting a Photo Share If you wish to submit a Photo Share of your own, please include the following information along with your email message and files: 1) Email List or Lists that they are related to: 2) Your Full Name: 3) Your Email Address: 4) One line Subject description: 5) Multi-line, multi-paragraph description of topic: 6) One-line Description of each photo or file: Email the information above and your files and photos to: pictures(at)matronics.com ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Indran Chelvanayagam" <ichelva(at)netspace.net.au>
Subject: lifting
Date: May 14, 2006
I used a carton of beer ... to entice a few friends to help lift the fuse onto tables! Indran Chelvanayagam _____ From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of David McNeill Sent: Saturday, 13 May 2006 4:07 AM Subject: RV10-List: lifting What methods have been used to lift the fuselage and get it on its gear? Jacks? straps? etc? ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Marc and Kathy" <marchudson(at)comcast.net>
Subject: Elevator tip rib
Date: May 14, 2006
Looking for some help on this one. If you look at page 9-6 step 6 (empennage plans), the plans call for clecoing the tip rib assembly to the E-1022 shear clip and the e-1002 front spar and e-1001B bottom skin. If I'm reading the plans correctly, E-913 is supposed to go in between the skin E-1001B and the flange of E-1002. If this is the case, E-913 will catch only one hole of the flange of E-1002. To me, this will cause the skin to have an uneven appearance to it on the bottom side and top side. On step 8 it shows the top side where the skin E-1001A is laid on top of the flange of E-1002 and on top of the counterbalance skin E-913. It's just not flat going from the flange of E-1002 to E-913. Anyone else have this observation or remember how they handled this? I have taken several pictures of the area if I haven't asked the question clearly enough. Thanks Marc ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Quiet Sunday
Date: May 14, 2006
From: "John W. Cox" <johnwcox(at)pacificnw.com>
Randy Debauw, Rob Hickman, Paul Grimstad, myself and many other RV builders from three Oregon EAA Chapters had the pleasure of the annual tour of the VANS Factory Thursday night. I was surprised no one has posted the thrill on this list by now. QB Fuselage kit 398 was being packed for shipment. Kits 400 through 408 are on racks in inventory and ready for delivery. The factory has 90 empennage kits ready for shipment. Dick was absent and touring the Alaskan Northwest Passage on a cruise ship. (Well earned though). The big excitement was Tom Green and Ken Krueger sharing the visuals of the new RV-12 LSA. Tom Green was most gracious as the host and Ken was quite informative. Two passenger, spar behind and above the buttocks of the Pilot and Co-Pilot (it appears capable of two full frame bodies), fuel behind the spar (inside the fuselage), detachable wings, large forward hinging canopy, direct foot control of the centering nose wheel and yes - all assembled with Pull Rivets. Both the mahogany "proof of concept" mock up as well as the yet to be flown aluminum prototype were shown. Rotax 912 powerplant. Sorry you all missed it. Hope your wives and mothers are enjoying their day. John - KUAO ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Recent pictures of N519RV (40250) and Weight and Balance
Date: May 15, 2006
From: "Doerr, Ray R [NTK]" <Ray.R.Doerr(at)sprint.com>
Here are a few recent pictures of N519RV (40250). I also completed the W & B yesterday, which weighed in at 1587 lbs. Nose Wheel 369 lbs Arm 49.82 Right Main 609 lbs Arm 123.82 Left Main 609 lbs Arm 123.69 For the Weight and Balance, the gear leg fairings, wheel pants and intersect fairing were not installed. The exterior of the plane in not painted, but the interior is complete with carpet interior panels all painted except the insides of the doors. Thank You Ray Doerr 40250 (N519RV) (DAR scheduled for Mon May 22nd, First Flight scheduled for Fri May 26th) ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: For Sale - FF Kit, Engine, MT Prop
Date: May 15, 2006
From: "Conti, Rick" <rick.conti(at)boeing.com>
Cc: "Conti, Rick" , "Eric Parlow" I have a reasonable good agreement to sell my kit sans, everything firewall forward. I did not intend to "part out" the kit, but I believe selling the remaining parts will not be difficult. Prices are my cost. Please contact me if you are interested. In the event the kit sale does not happen (scheduled for mid-June), I will not sell the above parts. Fire Wall Forward Kit $ 5,675.00 Engine (New Lycoming) $39,590.00 Engine Shipping $ 156.00 Propeller (MT 3-Blade w/chrome spinner) $ 8,600.00 Propeller Handling Fee $ 202.00 TOTAL $54,223.00 Thank You Rick Conti office: 703 - 414 - 6141 blackberry: 571 - 215 - 6134 ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: I'm having trouble getting insurance on my RV-10
Date: May 15, 2006
From: "Doerr, Ray R [NTK]" <Ray.R.Doerr(at)sprint.com>
I was wondering what experience level other are at that are now flying and have insurance on there RV-10. Since I have been so busy building, I have only accumulated 110 hours total time. I am VFR pilot only and had the total loss of my RV-9A due to engine failure from fuel vapor lock. Now I am trying to get insured $150,000 on my RV-10. They all want me to be instrument rated with 200 - 250 hours total time. We are even asking if I get my instrument and still only have 160 hours total time, but with 50 of that in Make and Model, will that suffice. They only said they would see. This is making it very hard for me to know exact when and what numbers I need to satafiy there ever changing requirements. The reason I bring this up is for those out there like me with low time think that the RV-10 will be treated like the other RV's. They are not, they are being compared with Bonazana's. Thank You Ray Doerr 40250 (N519RV) ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Brinker" <brinker@cox-internet.com>
Subject: GARMIN GI-106A VS. MD200-306 CDI
Date: May 15, 2006
Can anyone tell me the difference between the GARMIN GI-106A VS. MD200-306 CDI/LOC/GS ? I have looked at the Garmin description on both and they seem to have the same features. Randy ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: I'm having trouble getting insurance on my RV-10
Date: May 15, 2006
From: "Randy DeBauw" <Randy(at)abros.com>
Ray, I had 200 hrs total. 4 hours in a 205. 3 hours in the factory 10. 3260.00 a year. Randy 40006. -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Doerr, Ray R [NTK] Sent: Monday, May 15, 2006 11:04 AM Subject: RV10-List: I'm having trouble getting insurance on my RV-10 I was wondering what experience level other are at that are now flying and have insurance on there RV-10. Since I have been so busy building, I have only accumulated 110 hours total time. I am VFR pilot only and had the total loss of my RV-9A due to engine failure from fuel vapor lock. Now I am trying to get insured $150,000 on my RV-10. They all want me to be instrument rated with 200 - 250 hours total time. We are even asking if I get my instrument and still only have 160 hours total time, but with 50 of that in Make and Model, will that suffice. They only said they would see. This is making it very hard for me to know exact when and what numbers I need to satafiy there ever changing requirements. The reason I bring this up is for those out there like me with low time think that the RV-10 will be treated like the other RV's. They are not, they are being compared with Bonazana's. Thank You Ray Doerr 40250 (N519RV) ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: I'm having trouble getting insurance on my RV-10
From: "John Kirkland" <jskirkland(at)webpipe.net>
Date: May 15, 2006
Duh. Performance-wise a Bonanza is about the only comparison there is. I was quoted $2K by Nation Air, Private ASEL, Instrument Airplane, High Performance and Complex Airplane endorsements, 450 accident and incident free hours. -------- RV-10 #40333 N540XP (reserved) Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=34759#34759 ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: May 15, 2006
From: "Mark Chamberlain" <10flyer(at)verizon.net>
Subject: Re: GARMIN GI-106A VS. MD200-306 CDI
Randy, I don't know for sure but I think it has something to do with the original mfg. The GI-106 is Garmin and the MD-200 is former UPSAT/ II MORROW. When I installed my GNS-430, they told me to wire it to a GI-106. They told me my SL-30(UPSAT) would require the MD-200. That's about all I know. I think internally they work the same, it's how they communicate with the equiptment they are wired to. Of course I could be completely wrong!! Does that help!! Mark (N104ML) ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: May 15, 2006
From: "Mark Chamberlain" <10flyer(at)verizon.net>
Subject: Re: I'm having trouble getting insurance on my RV-10
The real shame here is that the 10 is one of the easiest, most forgiving airplanes I have ever flown(10k hrs). It's a new animal and they are wary. In time they will realize it is safer than the other RV's and much safer than a lot of other airplanes out there, even for low time pilots. Get the best you can, build time, add ratings and keep bothering them to get your rates lowered as you gain experience. Mark. ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "John Hasbrouck" <jhasbrouck(at)woh.rr.com>
Subject: Re: I'm having trouble getting insurance on my RV-10
Date: May 15, 2006
I was quoted $4000.00 at Sun-n-Fun by Avemco for 150K hull and 1mil liability. No hull coverage in first 10 hours of test flight. I have 1000 hours, SEL, Inst. with high perf. and complex signoffs. Suspect that as the fleet builds time the rates will go down but you have to remember that those extra two seats make a big difference in rating. I wonder what effect transition training would have? John Hasbrouck #40264 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Marcus Cooper" <coop85(at)bellsouth.net>
Subject: Recent pictures of N519RV (40250) and Weight and Balance
Date: May 15, 2006
Ray, Nice, clean looking interior. Are the side panels painted aluminum sheet or vinyl with snaps? It's kind of hard to tell by the pictures and I'm trying to firm up what I'll be doing on the sides. Thanks, Marcus -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Doerr, Ray R [NTK] Sent: Monday, May 15, 2006 9:38 AM Subject: RV10-List: Recent pictures of N519RV (40250) and Weight and Balance Here are a few recent pictures of N519RV (40250). I also completed the W & B yesterday, which weighed in at 1587 lbs. Nose Wheel 369 lbs Arm 49.82 Right Main 609 lbs Arm 123.82 Left Main 609 lbs Arm 123.69 For the Weight and Balance, the gear leg fairings, wheel pants and intersect fairing were not installed. The exterior of the plane in not painted, but the interior is complete with carpet interior panels all painted except the insides of the doors. Thank You Ray Doerr 40250 (N519RV) (DAR scheduled for Mon May 22nd, First Flight scheduled for Fri May 26th) ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: May 15, 2006
From: Rick <ricksked(at)earthlink.net>
Subject: RV-10 hull protection
Myself and my partner are have been developing a program that is very exciting and beneficial to all RV builders. We have worked on this project for close to 2 years and we are very close to going public with it. It is not insurance but a similar product to provide hull protection with a limited liability option through regular carriers. We hope to speak with all interested parties at OSH in person. Once it is ready to go we will have information available through our web site and written brochures. Some may recall very early conversations on the old Yahoo site. We are almost ready to reveal the entire package. The only reason I even bring it up at this point is to let everyone know there is another option that will be available shortly and the discussions of late on the list proves there is a need for protection other than high insurance rates without representation or benefit. We look forward to meeting all of you in the future to discuss this. Rick Sked 40185 Fuse/Finish ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: I'm having trouble getting insurance on my RV-10
From: "steveadams" <dr_steve_adams(at)yahoo.com>
Date: May 16, 2006
I didn't build an RV-10, but had similar issues with my CH640. I opted to go without insurance until I had about 100 hrs in the plane. The quoted rates dropped almost 50%. I know that this option is not for everyone, but you may want to consider this, or getting liability only until you build some time in your plane. They usually won't cover hull damage for the first 10-15 hours anyway, but you are still paying for it. Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=34836#34836 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Barry Marz or Amy Marz" <blalmarz(at)earthlink.net>
Subject: Defrost Fans
Date: May 15, 2006
Does anyone know a good make/model computer fan to use as a defroster? Thanks ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: May 16, 2006
From: "Ralph E. Capen" <recapen(at)earthlink.net>
Subject: Re: Defrost Fans
I bought a bunch of the small fans from radio shack - that way - hopefully, I'll be able to get replacements..... You can check with digi-key, allied electronics, or mouser...... there are a gozillion choices..... -----Original Message----- >From: Barry Marz or Amy Marz <blalmarz(at)earthlink.net> >Sent: May 15, 2006 9:49 AM >To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com >Subject: RV10-List: Defrost Fans > > >Does anyone know a good make/model computer fan to use as a defroster? >Thanks > > > > > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Jerry Grimmonpre" <jerry(at)mc.net>
Subject: Re: Defrost Fans
Date: May 16, 2006
Barry ... I don't have a name for the fan but I just bought a NEW one on ebay. Paid 8$ and change including delivery. This one is 5" in diameter and uses 1/2 of an amp. Enter your search with "computer fan" and you'll get several hits. Jerry Grimmonpre' RV8A Huntley IL > > > Does anyone know a good make/model computer fan to use as a defroster? > Thanks ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: I'm having trouble getting insurance on my RV-10
Date: May 16, 2006
From: "Conti, Rick" <rick.conti(at)boeing.com>
I had a lengthy email exchange with my broker. He provided me all the info I needed including required transition training. He is very responsive and great to work with, I highly recommend him. Tony Rukavina Ajruk84(at)aol.com 866-296-9665 Thank You Rick Conti office: 703 - 414 - 6141 blackberry: 571 - 215 - 6134 -----Original Message----- From: John Hasbrouck [mailto:jhasbrouck(at)woh.rr.com] Sent: Monday, May 15, 2006 9:23 PM Subject: Re: RV10-List: I'm having trouble getting insurance on my RV-10 I was quoted $4000.00 at Sun-n-Fun by Avemco for 150K hull and 1mil liability. No hull coverage in first 10 hours of test flight. I have 1000 hours, SEL, Inst. with high perf. and complex signoffs. Suspect that as the fleet builds time the rates will go down but you have to remember that those extra two seats make a big difference in rating. I wonder what effect transition training would have? John Hasbrouck #40264 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: JSMcGrew(at)aol.com
Date: May 16, 2006
Subject: Re: Recent pictures of N519RV (40250) and Weight and Balance
Ray, Could you post the part # / where you bought your tow bar? Aircraft Spruce sells a bunch of them, but I'm not sure which one works with the RV-10 Thanks Jim 40134 Finishing kit / FW forward In a message dated 5/15/2006 7:46:15 A.M. Mountain Daylight Time, Ray.R.Doerr(at)sprint.com writes: Here are a few recent pictures of N519RV (40250). I also completed the W & B yesterday, which weighed in at 1587 lbs. Nose Wheel 369 lbs Arm 49.82 Right Main 609 lbs Arm 123.82 Left Main 609 lbs Arm 123.69 For the Weight and Balance, the gear leg fairings, wheel pants and intersect fairing were not installed. The exterior of the plane in not painted, but the interior is complete with carpet interior panels all painted except the insides of the doors. Thank You Ray Doerr 40250 (N519RV) (DAR scheduled for Mon May 22nd, First Flight scheduled for Fri May 26th) Jim "Scooter" McGrew jsmcgrew(at)aol.com ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "John Gonzalez" <indigoonlatigo(at)msn.com>
Subject: RV-10 hull protection
Date: May 16, 2006
Looking forward to hearing about it. JG. #409 >From: Rick <ricksked(at)earthlink.net> >Reply-To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com >To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com >Subject: RV10-List: RV-10 hull protection >Date: Mon, 15 May 2006 20:17:38 -0700 (GMT-07:00) > > >Myself and my partner are have been developing a program that is very >exciting and beneficial to all RV builders. We have worked on this project >for close to 2 years and we are very close to going public with it. It is >not insurance but a similar product to provide hull protection with a >limited liability option through regular carriers. We hope to speak with >all interested parties at OSH in person. Once it is ready to go we will >have information available through our web site and written brochures. Some >may recall very early conversations on the old Yahoo site. We are almost >ready to reveal the entire package. The only reason I even bring it up at >this point is to let everyone know there is another option that will be >available shortly and the discussions of late on the list proves there is a >need for protection other than high insurance rates without representation >or benefit. We look forward to meeting all of you in the future to discuss >this. > >Rick Sked >40185 >Fuse/Finish > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Neil Colliver <neilcolliver(at)maxnet.co.nz>
Subject: Your advice please
Date: May 17, 2006
Hi everyone. & especially those who have advised me off the list. Here are my plans & reasons. We currently have a Savannah microlight which went together in 250 hours complete + paint. Brilliant little 2 seat metal plane for short strips / beaches / etc. But our family is now up to 5 children under 7! (Something to do with having no TV ), so could do with something bigger, and faster. (70knots cruise is great local fun, but sloooow to get anywhere. Our grass strip is 550m (ruling out a 2nd hand 50 year old C712 with 4 people & decent fuel) An RV 10 would enable a good chunk of us to go places here in NZ. My wife & I both have our PPL's, me with 250 hrs, her with 120 hours+2 babies in the same time span! - I know who worked harder! We can't afford or justify the Cheltons & most, if not all of our flying will be VFR around middle earth, often just for an hour locally. So, our choice and reason are as follows. RV-10 QB - so we can be flying in about 1300 hours - starting to build in Jan 2007, full time, 2 people. Also the prop & govenor cable, FWF kit, ES WH-10 wiring kit & some antenas IO540 from BRE, inc P-mags (available late this year I hope), cold air (more power for a grass strip,) and the James cowl Hartzel constant speed from Vans ( 3 blade composites too expensive) LED lights from Thor LLC Panel --Aaarrgggghhhhh! Probably will get the lancair one. - any comments? Every one speaks highly of the Cheltons, but I think even they have had a recall recently. But too expensive anyway, unless they are about to bring the price down by 50%, then I would grab a pair. But I would love the highway in the sky, so it's got to be the Blue Mountain G4 set up with the 6" screen, (& probably their autopilot). Also gives GPS. (Advanced Flight Sys also came highly recommended, but have no future plans for a 3d highway in the sky.) Backing that up will be the Dynon EFIS D100 7" screen, so we have 2 completely separate EFIS's for safety. Garmin DNS430 for nav / com / GPS Garmin GTX330 for Mode S transponder - the our local radar station just upgraded to mode S, making my Microair transponder very intermittent at best. Also the 330 will display traffic on the 430. EI MVP50 EIS - a little expensive, but seems what Vans recommends PC Eng PMA 8000 - for the romance of music when flying beautiful NZ Some kind of 406 ELT, because so many planes just simply disappear in NZ, even with state of the art ELT's. I know this all adds up to a fairly ugly looking panel, but I would appreciate any helpful comments / /suggestions or dire warnings on the whole set up. Have I missed anything obvious? Thanks Neil & Sarah Colliver+++++ N Island, NZ. ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: May 16, 2006
From: Rick <ricksked(at)earthlink.net>
Subject: Re: Your advice please
Your thoughts look ideal to me, heck a Garmin 396, transponder, radio stack, ACS has a great engine monitor/EFIS that just came out and is very reasonable. You don't need the Cheltons, you can still go all electric Heck your doing what Van says his idea and RV should be. Use the standard panel that comes with the kit, no need to spend a lot of money on an aftermarket panel. Look at the Colorada -10's very conventional but great looking panels. There didn't look like there were any obstructions at your field. I say go for. Rick S. 40185 Fuse/finish ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: New Trip to Central Ca.
Date: May 16, 2006
From: "Randy DeBauw" <Randy(at)abros.com>
Well it is time to go flying again. Looking for a little wine country tour. Is anyone familiar with Angwin-Parrett airport or Sonoma County. Which is better for rental cars and hotel access. Randy 40006. ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: May 16, 2006
From: Deems Davis <deemsdavis(at)cox.net>
Subject: Re: New Trip to Central Ca.
I used to live in Santa Rosa, and am pretty familiar with the area. Angwin is a small airport located in the top of the hills on the east side of the Sonoma valley. Services are limited there, I doubt that they have rental cars available. Sonoma County (Charles Schultz)KSTS has several rental car companies to choose from. Your other alternative would be Napa airport where I'm sure they have rental cars. Depending upon where you plan to stay either Sonoma county or Napa would be fine. Deems Davis # 406 Fuse http://deemsrv10.com/ Randy DeBauw wrote: > Well it is time to go flying again. Looking for a little wine country > tour. Is anyone familiar with Angwin-Parrett airport or Sonoma > County. Which is better for rental cars and hotel access. Randy > 40006. > ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: New Trip to Central Ca.
Date: May 16, 2006
From: "Randy DeBauw" <Randy(at)abros.com>
Thanks for the input. Is Sonoma or Napa better to be centrally located in the wine country? Randy -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Deems Davis Sent: Tuesday, May 16, 2006 1:55 PM Subject: Re: RV10-List: New Trip to Central Ca. I used to live in Santa Rosa, and am pretty familiar with the area. Angwin is a small airport located in the top of the hills on the east side of the Sonoma valley. Services are limited there, I doubt that they have rental cars available. Sonoma County (Charles Schultz)KSTS has several rental car companies to choose from. Your other alternative would be Napa airport where I'm sure they have rental cars. Depending upon where you plan to stay either Sonoma county or Napa would be fine. Deems Davis # 406 Fuse http://deemsrv10.com/ Randy DeBauw wrote: > Well it is time to go flying again. Looking for a little wine country > tour. Is anyone familiar with Angwin-Parrett airport or Sonoma > County. Which is better for rental cars and hotel access. Randy > 40006. > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Neil Colliver <neilcolliver(at)maxnet.co.nz>
Subject: Rv-10 advice
Date: May 17, 2006
Hi guys Thanks for all your comments about bigger or more suitable planes & how to stop children:-) Great to hear so many of you having fun without TV;-) However,..... Is my proposed set up about right? RV-10 QB - so we can be flying in about 1300 hours - starting to build in Jan 2007, full time, 2 people. Also the prop & govenor cable, FWF kit, ES WH-10 wiring kit & some antenas IO540 from BRE, inc P-mags (available late this year I hope), cold air (more power for a grass strip,) and the James cowl Hartzel constant speed from Vans ( 3 blade composites too expensive) LED lights from Thor LLC Panel --Aaarrgggghhhhh! Probably will get the lancair one. - any comments? Every one speaks highly of the Cheltons, but I think even they have had a recall recently. But too expensive anyway, unless they are about to bring the price down by 50%, then I would grab a pair. But I would love the highway in the sky, so it's got to be the Blue Mountain G4 set up with the 6" screen, (& probably their autopilot). Also gives GPS. (Advanced Flight Sys also came highly recommended, but have no future plans for a 3d highway in the sky.) Backing that up will be the Dynon EFIS D100 7" screen, so we have 2 completely separate EFIS's for safety. Garmin DNS430 for nav / com / GPS Garmin GTX330 for Mode S transponder - the our local radar station just upgraded to mode S, making my Microair transponder very intermittent at best. Also the 330 will display traffic on the 430. EI MVP50 EIS - a little expensive, but seems what Vans recommends PC Eng PMA 8000 - for the romance of music when flying beautiful NZ Some kind of 406 ELT, because so many planes just simply disappear in NZ, even with state of the art ELT's. I know this all adds up to a fairly ugly looking panel, but I would appreciate any helpful comments / /suggestions or dire warnings on the whole set up. Have I missed anything obvious? Thanks Neil & Sarah Colliver+++++ N Island, NZ. ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: May 16, 2006
From: Deems Davis <deemsdavis(at)cox.net>
Subject: Re: New Trip to Central Ca.
That depends upon which wineries you plan to visit. Napa is located at the south end of the Napa Valley., So most of the Napa county wineries are North from there. Sonoma county is at the North end of the Sonoma Valley, but smack dab in the middle of the Alexander valley. And closer to the Mendocino county wineries. I believe that Sonoma county provides the best overall access. If you have a car it's not a big deal which airport as you can drive from Sonoma county to Napa airport in about 45 min. You can take a slight longer routt that goes from Santa Rosa over the Calistoga Hwy and then heads down the Napa Valley. (1:15) This is a beautiful time to visit, if you get there before early June the hills that surround the valleys should still be green. Deems Davis # 406 Fuse http://deemsrv10.com/ Randy DeBauw wrote: > >Thanks for the input. Is Sonoma or Napa better to be centrally located >in the wine country? Randy > >-----Original Message----- >From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com >[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Deems Davis >Sent: Tuesday, May 16, 2006 1:55 PM >To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com >Subject: Re: RV10-List: New Trip to Central Ca. > > >I used to live in Santa Rosa, and am pretty familiar with the area. >Angwin is a small airport located in the top of the hills on the east >side of the Sonoma valley. Services are limited there, I doubt that >they have rental cars available. Sonoma County (Charles Schultz)KSTS has > >several rental car companies to choose from. Your other alternative >would be Napa airport where I'm sure they have rental cars. Depending >upon where you plan to stay either Sonoma county or Napa would be fine. > >Deems Davis # 406 >Fuse >http://deemsrv10.com/ > >Randy DeBauw wrote: > > > >>Well it is time to go flying again. Looking for a little wine country >>tour. Is anyone familiar with Angwin-Parrett airport or Sonoma >>County. Which is better for rental cars and hotel access. Randy >>40006. >> >> >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: New Trip to Central Ca.
Date: May 16, 2006
From: "Randy DeBauw" <Randy(at)abros.com>
Thanks again Deems. Sonoma it is. Randy -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Deems Davis Sent: Tuesday, May 16, 2006 3:19 PM Subject: Re: RV10-List: New Trip to Central Ca. That depends upon which wineries you plan to visit. Napa is located at the south end of the Napa Valley., So most of the Napa county wineries are North from there. Sonoma county is at the North end of the Sonoma Valley, but smack dab in the middle of the Alexander valley. And closer to the Mendocino county wineries. I believe that Sonoma county provides the best overall access. If you have a car it's not a big deal which airport as you can drive from Sonoma county to Napa airport in about 45 min. You can take a slight longer routt that goes from Santa Rosa over the Calistoga Hwy and then heads down the Napa Valley. (1:15) This is a beautiful time to visit, if you get there before early June the hills that surround the valleys should still be green. Deems Davis # 406 Fuse http://deemsrv10.com/ Randy DeBauw wrote: > >Thanks for the input. Is Sonoma or Napa better to be centrally located >in the wine country? Randy > >-----Original Message----- >From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com >[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Deems Davis >Sent: Tuesday, May 16, 2006 1:55 PM >To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com >Subject: Re: RV10-List: New Trip to Central Ca. > > >I used to live in Santa Rosa, and am pretty familiar with the area. >Angwin is a small airport located in the top of the hills on the east >side of the Sonoma valley. Services are limited there, I doubt that >they have rental cars available. Sonoma County (Charles Schultz)KSTS has > >several rental car companies to choose from. Your other alternative >would be Napa airport where I'm sure they have rental cars. Depending >upon where you plan to stay either Sonoma county or Napa would be fine. > >Deems Davis # 406 >Fuse >http://deemsrv10.com/ > >Randy DeBauw wrote: > > > >>Well it is time to go flying again. Looking for a little wine country >>tour. Is anyone familiar with Angwin-Parrett airport or Sonoma >>County. Which is better for rental cars and hotel access. Randy >>40006. >> >> >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: New Trip to Central Ca.
Date: May 16, 2006
From: "Robin Marks" <robin(at)mrmoisture.com>
Don't forget the possibility of visiting the central California coast of San Luis Obispo to Paso Robles. Both are excellent airports and the wine industry is exploding in the area. We must have 100+ wineries all within 10 miles of each airport. Right now the area is magical with blue ocean waters & green mountains. As the summer progresses you will want to consider San Luis Obispo for its cooler temperatures. We also have Hearst Castle San Simeon state park and much more. SBP http://www.airnav.com/airport/KSBP PRB http://www.airnav.com/airport/Kprb Photos attached are from just south of Morro Bay near MQO VORTAC & Diablo Nuclear Power Plant (why our grapes grow so big!) Note my RV-6A in the photo Robin RV-4 Sold RV-6A 300 Hours RV-10 First flight... 12/2007? ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Evan and Megan Johnson" <evmeg(at)snowcrest.net>
Subject: Re: New Trip to Central Ca.
Date: May 16, 2006
I didn't read the whole string so forgive me if it has already been mentioned.....Napa is reputed to have a very good restaurant. I am going there this Saturday on a cross country and am looking forward to a good steak. Evan Johnson www.evansaviationproducts.com (530)247-0375 (530)351-1776 cell ----- Original Message ----- From: "Deems Davis" <deemsdavis(at)cox.net> Sent: Tuesday, May 16, 2006 3:18 PM Subject: Re: RV10-List: New Trip to Central Ca. > > That depends upon which wineries you plan to visit. Napa is located at > the south end of the Napa Valley., So most of the Napa county wineries > are North from there. Sonoma county is at the North end of the Sonoma > Valley, but smack dab in the middle of the Alexander valley. And closer > to the Mendocino county wineries. I believe that Sonoma county provides > the best overall access. If you have a car it's not a big deal which > airport as you can drive from Sonoma county to Napa airport in about 45 > min. You can take a slight longer routt that goes from Santa Rosa over > the Calistoga Hwy and then heads down the Napa Valley. (1:15) This is a > beautiful time to visit, if you get there before early June the hills > that surround the valleys should still be green. > > Deems Davis # 406 > Fuse > http://deemsrv10.com/ > > Randy DeBauw wrote: > > > > >Thanks for the input. Is Sonoma or Napa better to be centrally located > >in the wine country? Randy > > > >-----Original Message----- > >From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com > >[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Deems Davis > >Sent: Tuesday, May 16, 2006 1:55 PM > >To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com > >Subject: Re: RV10-List: New Trip to Central Ca. > > > > > >I used to live in Santa Rosa, and am pretty familiar with the area. > >Angwin is a small airport located in the top of the hills on the east > >side of the Sonoma valley. Services are limited there, I doubt that > >they have rental cars available. Sonoma County (Charles Schultz)KSTS has > > > >several rental car companies to choose from. Your other alternative > >would be Napa airport where I'm sure they have rental cars. Depending > >upon where you plan to stay either Sonoma county or Napa would be fine. > > > >Deems Davis # 406 > >Fuse > >http://deemsrv10.com/ > > > >Randy DeBauw wrote: > > > > > > > >>Well it is time to go flying again. Looking for a little wine country > >>tour. Is anyone familiar with Angwin-Parrett airport or Sonoma > >>County. Which is better for rental cars and hotel access. Randy > >>40006. > >> > >> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Brian S Douglas <bsponcil(at)belinblank.org>
Subject: Re: New Trip to Central Ca.
Date: May 16, 2006
My wife and I spent a week in/around Napa on our way to the Reno Air Races last fall and my impressions were: 1. Sonoma is quieter and the wineries there tend to be the small, family owned production you've likely never heard of. The kind of laid back place where there's a cat sleeping on the tasting bar and the tour is run by the winemaker him/herself (typically a retired couple). If you stay in Sonoma though, one of my favorite wineries is Chateau St Jean, and it's neither small nor unheard of. 2. Napa is busier and has, IMHO, more of the up-scale wineries - Opus One, Joseph Phelps, Chateau Montelena, Coppola, etc. In these places, you're as unlikely to see a cat as you are the winemaker though the quality of the wines tend to be a bit higher (or at least more consistent). 3. Napa also seemed to have more in the way of upscale restaurants. Brix and Martini House come to mind as nice, albeit expensive, places to eat. There was also some sort of chef training school around there but we never went so I don't know if it would be any good. 4. Of course with busier comes more expensive and more hassle. We stayed in a B&B on the northern end of things (Calistoga?) and got a "deal" at only $150/night. There was really only one road up and down the valley which was always busy and of course getting into a restaurant other than A&W required reservations a day or two in advance. 5. One thing we did that was kind of fun was a balloon ride over napa. Again it was expensive but neither of us had ever been a balloon and Napa valley in the morning is quite beautiful. I'm not sure I'd spring for it again - especially since you can just fly over the valley - but I'd say it was worth doing once. -Brian #40497 N211BD Iowa City, IA On May 16, 2006, at 9:15 PM, Evan and Megan Johnson wrote: > > > I didn't read the whole string so forgive me if it has already been > mentioned.....Napa is reputed to have a very good restaurant. I am > going > there this Saturday on a cross country and am looking forward to a > good > steak. > Evan Johnson > www.evansaviationproducts.com > (530)247-0375 > (530)351-1776 cell > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Deems Davis" <deemsdavis(at)cox.net> > To: > Sent: Tuesday, May 16, 2006 3:18 PM > Subject: Re: RV10-List: New Trip to Central Ca. > >>> >>> Randy DeBauw wrote: >>> >>> >>> >>>> Well it is time to go flying again. Looking for a little wine >>>> country >>>> tour. Is anyone familiar with Angwin-Parrett airport or Sonoma >>>> County. Which is better for rental cars and hotel access. Randy >>>> 40006. >>>> >>>> >>>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Recent pictures of N519RV (40250) and Weight and Balance
Date: May 17, 2006
From: "Doerr, Ray R [NTK]" <Ray.R.Doerr(at)sprint.com>
I made the panels from .020 aluminum sheets. Thank You Ray Doerr CDNI Principal Engineer Sprint PCS 16020 West 113th Street Lenexa, KS 66219 Mailstop KSLNXK0101 (913) 859-1414 (Office) (913) 226-0106 (Pcs) (913) 859-1234 (Fax) Ray.R.Doerr(at)sprint.com -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Marcus Cooper Sent: Monday, May 15, 2006 9:02 PM Subject: RE: RV10-List: Recent pictures of N519RV (40250) and Weight and Balance Ray, Nice, clean looking interior. Are the side panels painted aluminum sheet or vinyl with snaps? It's kind of hard to tell by the pictures and I'm trying to firm up what I'll be doing on the sides. Thanks, Marcus -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Doerr, Ray R [NTK] Sent: Monday, May 15, 2006 9:38 AM Subject: RV10-List: Recent pictures of N519RV (40250) and Weight and Balance Here are a few recent pictures of N519RV (40250). I also completed the W & B yesterday, which weighed in at 1587 lbs. Nose Wheel 369 lbs Arm 49.82 Right Main 609 lbs Arm 123.82 Left Main 609 lbs Arm 123.69 For the Weight and Balance, the gear leg fairings, wheel pants and intersect fairing were not installed. The exterior of the plane in not painted, but the interior is complete with carpet interior panels all painted except the insides of the doors. Thank You Ray Doerr 40250 (N519RV) (DAR scheduled for Mon May 22nd, First Flight scheduled for Fri May 26th) ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: May 17, 2006
From: "Michael Wellenzohn" <michael(at)wellenzohn.net>
Subject: Rudderedge (ProSeal on Primer or on bare metal)
Hello, when you primed your rudder skins did you tape the edge so that the ProSeal would stick to the bare metal or not. (I use DuPont 820R Primer). Best Regards Michael Michael Wellenzohn #40511 (VS) Zuerich,Switzerland michael(at)wellenzohn.net www.wellenzohn.net ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: May 17, 2006
From: "Michael Wellenzohn" <michael(at)wellenzohn.net>
Subject: Rudderedge (ProSeal on Primer or on bare metal)
Hello, when you primed your rudder skins did you tape the edge so that the ProSeal would stick to the bare metal or not. (I use DuPont 820R Primer). Best Regards Michael Michael Wellenzohn #40511 (VS) Zuerich,Switzerland michael(at)wellenzohn.net www.wellenzohn.net ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: May 17, 2006
From: "Michael Wellenzohn" <michael(at)wellenzohn.net>
Subject: Rudder Edge (ProSeal on Primer or on bare metal)
Hello, when you primed your rudder skins did you tape the edge so that the ProSeal would stick to the bare metal or just prime the edge too and apply the ProSeal on top of it?. (I use DuPont 820R Primer in case that matters). Best Regards Michael Michael Wellenzohn #40511 (VS) Zuerich,Switzerland michael(at)wellenzohn.net www.wellenzohn.net ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "John Jessen" <jjessen(at)rcn.com>
Subject: Rudder Edge (ProSeal on Primer or on bare metal)
Date: May 17, 2006
Michael, I primed the entire skin, then added the proseal. Remember that the proseal is only there to help hold things in position for the next steps. It is not even needed, and some builders do not use it at all. Take a look at some of the web sites for alternative ways of handling trailing edges. I followed the instructions and it apparently worked fine. John Jessen 328 (Tailcone) -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Michael Wellenzohn Sent: Wednesday, May 17, 2006 9:02 AM Subject: RV10-List: Rudder Edge (ProSeal on Primer or on bare metal) --> Hello, when you primed your rudder skins did you tape the edge so that the ProSeal would stick to the bare metal or just prime the edge too and apply the ProSeal on top of it?. (I use DuPont 820R Primer in case that matters). Best Regards Michael Michael Wellenzohn #40511 (VS) Zuerich,Switzerland michael(at)wellenzohn.net www.wellenzohn.net ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Jesse Saint" <jesse(at)itecusa.org>
Subject: Rudderedge (ProSeal on Primer or on bare metal)
Date: May 17, 2006
Yes, you scuff it well and then tape it so the paint doesn't get there. This is true for everywhere you are going to put proseal. Jesse Saint I-TEC, Inc. jesse(at)itecusa.org www.itecusa.org 352-465-4545 -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Michael Wellenzohn Sent: Wednesday, May 17, 2006 10:45 AM Subject: RV10-List: Rudderedge (ProSeal on Primer or on bare metal) Hello, when you primed your rudder skins did you tape the edge so that the ProSeal would stick to the bare metal or not. (I use DuPont 820R Primer). Best Regards Michael Michael Wellenzohn #40511 (VS) Zuerich,Switzerland michael(at)wellenzohn.net www.wellenzohn.net -- -- ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: New Trip to Central Ca.
Date: May 17, 2006
From: "Randy DeBauw" <Randy(at)abros.com>
Keep us posted. Randy -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Evan and Megan Johnson Sent: Tuesday, May 16, 2006 7:15 PM Subject: Re: RV10-List: New Trip to Central Ca. I didn't read the whole string so forgive me if it has already been mentioned.....Napa is reputed to have a very good restaurant. I am going there this Saturday on a cross country and am looking forward to a good steak. Evan Johnson www.evansaviationproducts.com (530)247-0375 (530)351-1776 cell ----- Original Message ----- From: "Deems Davis" <deemsdavis(at)cox.net> Sent: Tuesday, May 16, 2006 3:18 PM Subject: Re: RV10-List: New Trip to Central Ca. > > That depends upon which wineries you plan to visit. Napa is located at > the south end of the Napa Valley., So most of the Napa county wineries > are North from there. Sonoma county is at the North end of the Sonoma > Valley, but smack dab in the middle of the Alexander valley. And closer > to the Mendocino county wineries. I believe that Sonoma county provides > the best overall access. If you have a car it's not a big deal which > airport as you can drive from Sonoma county to Napa airport in about 45 > min. You can take a slight longer routt that goes from Santa Rosa over > the Calistoga Hwy and then heads down the Napa Valley. (1:15) This is a > beautiful time to visit, if you get there before early June the hills > that surround the valleys should still be green. > > Deems Davis # 406 > Fuse > http://deemsrv10.com/ > > Randy DeBauw wrote: > > > > >Thanks for the input. Is Sonoma or Napa better to be centrally located > >in the wine country? Randy > > > >-----Original Message----- > >From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com > >[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Deems Davis > >Sent: Tuesday, May 16, 2006 1:55 PM > >To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com > >Subject: Re: RV10-List: New Trip to Central Ca. > > > > > >I used to live in Santa Rosa, and am pretty familiar with the area. > >Angwin is a small airport located in the top of the hills on the east > >side of the Sonoma valley. Services are limited there, I doubt that > >they have rental cars available. Sonoma County (Charles Schultz)KSTS has > > > >several rental car companies to choose from. Your other alternative > >would be Napa airport where I'm sure they have rental cars. Depending > >upon where you plan to stay either Sonoma county or Napa would be fine. > > > >Deems Davis # 406 > >Fuse > >http://deemsrv10.com/ > > > >Randy DeBauw wrote: > > > > > > > >>Well it is time to go flying again. Looking for a little wine country > >>tour. Is anyone familiar with Angwin-Parrett airport or Sonoma > >>County. Which is better for rental cars and hotel access. Randy > >>40006. > >> > >> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: New Trip to Central Ca.
Date: May 17, 2006
From: "Randy DeBauw" <Randy(at)abros.com>
I may have to change my trip to the end of the month. It sounds like late Aug. will be out of the peek season for temps. Randy -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Robin Marks Sent: Tuesday, May 16, 2006 5:21 PM Subject: RE: RV10-List: New Trip to Central Ca. Don't forget the possibility of visiting the central California coast of San Luis Obispo to Paso Robles. Both are excellent airports and the wine industry is exploding in the area. We must have 100+ wineries all within 10 miles of each airport. Right now the area is magical with blue ocean waters & green mountains. As the summer progresses you will want to consider San Luis Obispo for its cooler temperatures. We also have Hearst Castle San Simeon state park and much more. SBP http://www.airnav.com/airport/KSBP PRB http://www.airnav.com/airport/Kprb Photos attached are from just south of Morro Bay near MQO VORTAC & Diablo Nuclear Power Plant (why our grapes grow so big!) Note my RV-6A in the photo Robin RV-4 Sold RV-6A 300 Hours RV-10 First flight... 12/2007? ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: New Trip to Central Ca.
Date: May 17, 2006
From: "Randy DeBauw" <Randy(at)abros.com>
Excellent detail. Thx. -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Brian S Douglas Sent: Tuesday, May 16, 2006 4:40 PM Subject: Re: RV10-List: New Trip to Central Ca. My wife and I spent a week in/around Napa on our way to the Reno Air Races last fall and my impressions were: 1. Sonoma is quieter and the wineries there tend to be the small, family owned production you've likely never heard of. The kind of laid back place where there's a cat sleeping on the tasting bar and the tour is run by the winemaker him/herself (typically a retired couple). If you stay in Sonoma though, one of my favorite wineries is Chateau St Jean, and it's neither small nor unheard of. 2. Napa is busier and has, IMHO, more of the up-scale wineries - Opus One, Joseph Phelps, Chateau Montelena, Coppola, etc. In these places, you're as unlikely to see a cat as you are the winemaker though the quality of the wines tend to be a bit higher (or at least more consistent). 3. Napa also seemed to have more in the way of upscale restaurants. Brix and Martini House come to mind as nice, albeit expensive, places to eat. There was also some sort of chef training school around there but we never went so I don't know if it would be any good. 4. Of course with busier comes more expensive and more hassle. We stayed in a B&B on the northern end of things (Calistoga?) and got a "deal" at only $150/night. There was really only one road up and down the valley which was always busy and of course getting into a restaurant other than A&W required reservations a day or two in advance. 5. One thing we did that was kind of fun was a balloon ride over napa. Again it was expensive but neither of us had ever been a balloon and Napa valley in the morning is quite beautiful. I'm not sure I'd spring for it again - especially since you can just fly over the valley - but I'd say it was worth doing once. -Brian #40497 N211BD Iowa City, IA On May 16, 2006, at 9:15 PM, Evan and Megan Johnson wrote: > > > I didn't read the whole string so forgive me if it has already been > mentioned.....Napa is reputed to have a very good restaurant. I am > going > there this Saturday on a cross country and am looking forward to a > good > steak. > Evan Johnson > www.evansaviationproducts.com > (530)247-0375 > (530)351-1776 cell > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Deems Davis" <deemsdavis(at)cox.net> > To: > Sent: Tuesday, May 16, 2006 3:18 PM > Subject: Re: RV10-List: New Trip to Central Ca. > >>> >>> Randy DeBauw wrote: >>> >>> >>> >>>> Well it is time to go flying again. Looking for a little wine >>>> country >>>> tour. Is anyone familiar with Angwin-Parrett airport or Sonoma >>>> County. Which is better for rental cars and hotel access. Randy >>>> 40006. >>>> >>>> >>>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Rudderedge (ProSeal on Primer or on bare metal)
Date: May 17, 2006
From: "Conti, Rick" <rick.conti(at)boeing.com>
No, and I used AKZO primer from Aircraft Spruce. No problem with adhesion. I also bought a 6' piece of steel 2" angle. I drilled holes the length space the same as the rudder. After applying the ProSeal I cleoed the rudder to the steel angle to ensure a true straight edge. Worked great. Thank You Rick Conti office: 703 - 414 - 6141 blackberry: 571 - 215 - 6134 -----Original Message----- From: Michael Wellenzohn [mailto:michael(at)wellenzohn.net] Sent: Wednesday, May 17, 2006 11:48 AM Subject: RV10-List: Rudderedge (ProSeal on Primer or on bare metal) Hello, when you primed your rudder skins did you tape the edge so that the ProSeal would stick to the bare metal or not. (I use DuPont 820R Primer). Best Regards Michael Michael Wellenzohn #40511 (VS) Zuerich,Switzerland michael(at)wellenzohn.net www.wellenzohn.net ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Brian Sponcil" <bsponcil(at)belinblank.org>
Subject: Re: Rudder Edge (ProSeal on Primer or on bare metal)
Date: May 17, 2006
I didn't ProSeal the rudder at all and I thought it came out fine - albeit not perfectly straight. I am going to try the ProSeal on the elevators this weekend and see if they come out any straighter. I'd primer the skins without regard to the edges. It's my understanding that the ProSeal is just there to temporarily hold things together and to ruin a few clecos ;-) The one thing I'd say about riveting trailing edges is that I think it's a lot easier to just grind down a flat set to match the angle and squeeze them rather than back rivet. As always, your mileage may vary. -Brian #40497 N211BD Iowa City, IA ----- Original Message ----- > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com > [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Michael > Wellenzohn > Sent: Wednesday, May 17, 2006 9:02 AM > To: RV10-List(at)matronics.com > Subject: RV10-List: Rudder Edge (ProSeal on Primer or on bare metal) > > --> > > Hello, > > when you primed your rudder skins did you tape the edge so that the > ProSeal > would stick to the bare metal or just prime the edge too and apply the > ProSeal on top of it?. (I use DuPont 820R Primer in case that matters). > > Best Regards > Michael > > > Michael Wellenzohn > #40511 (VS) > Zuerich,Switzerland > michael(at)wellenzohn.net > www.wellenzohn.net > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Chris , Susie Darcy" <VHMUM(at)bigpond.com>
Subject: Re: Rudder Edge (ProSeal on Primer or on bare metal)
Date: May 18, 2006
There is no need to proseal....all you are doing is adding weight! Chris ----- Original Message ----- From: "Brian Sponcil" <bsponcil(at)belinblank.org> Sent: Thursday, May 18, 2006 4:54 AM Subject: Re: RV10-List: Rudder Edge (ProSeal on Primer or on bare metal) > > > I didn't ProSeal the rudder at all and I thought it came out fine - albeit > not perfectly straight. I am going to try the ProSeal on the elevators > this weekend and see if they come out any straighter. I'd primer the > skins without regard to the edges. It's my understanding that the ProSeal > is just there to temporarily hold things together and to ruin a few clecos > ;-) > > The one thing I'd say about riveting trailing edges is that I think it's a > lot easier to just grind down a flat set to match the angle and squeeze > them rather than back rivet. As always, your mileage may vary. > > > -Brian > > #40497 > N211BD > Iowa City, IA > > ----- Original Message ----- > -----Original Message----- >> From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com >> [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Michael >> Wellenzohn >> Sent: Wednesday, May 17, 2006 9:02 AM >> To: RV10-List(at)matronics.com >> Subject: RV10-List: Rudder Edge (ProSeal on Primer or on bare metal) >> >> --> >> >> Hello, >> >> when you primed your rudder skins did you tape the edge so that the >> ProSeal >> would stick to the bare metal or just prime the edge too and apply the >> ProSeal on top of it?. (I use DuPont 820R Primer in case that matters). >> >> Best Regards >> Michael >> >> >> Michael Wellenzohn >> #40511 (VS) >> Zuerich,Switzerland >> michael(at)wellenzohn.net >> www.wellenzohn.net >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> > > > http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List > http://wiki.matronics.com > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Jack Sargeant" <k5wiv(at)amsat.org>
Subject: New Trip to Central Ca.
Date: May 17, 2006
One weekend several years ago doesn't make me an expert, but -- my wife and I drove to Napa on a Saturday with the intent of doing a few wineries. We dawdled too long in SF and Sausalito and arrived in Napa late afternoon, so we found a motel (not very upscale, but they didn't question our lack of luggage), went to a convenience store for toothbrushes, etc., had a fast food supper and got a good night's sleep. Sunday morning. fairly early, we drove north 'till about the time the wineries started opening. We then worked our way back south stopping at whatever winery looked interesting. We got back to Napa in the PM and stopped by an airport where they were offering glider rides. The wife wasn't interested so I made a decision that I have regretted ever since and didn't go either. We watched for a while and then drove on to our temporary home in San Jose. If that sounds like a mixed-up weekend with no coherent plan, it was. But -- it was one of the best in our 43 years together. Botton line: In my opinion if you get into the Napa Valley and just spend a day or more doing whatever you feel like at the time, you can't go wrong! y?J ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: New Trip to Central Ca.
Date: May 18, 2006
From: "McGANN, Ron" <ron.mcgann(at)baesystems.com>
What y'all need to do is get those REALLY BIG extended range tanks installed and get over here to Australia. You can't beat our beefy reds - or elegant whites if you've got limp wrists ;-) Ron ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Tree top flyer over the Rio Grande
Date: May 17, 2006
From: "John W. Cox" <johnwcox(at)pacificnw.com>
http://www.youtube.com/watch?vij1qWr99qLE Or Rogue River or Umpqua or whatever. Johnny Horizon ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: May 17, 2006
From: Rick <ricksked(at)earthlink.net>
Subject: Re: Tree top flyer over the Rio Grande
--- MIME Errors - No Plain-Text Section Found --- A message with no text/plain MIME section was received. The entire body of the message was removed. Please resend the email using Plain Text formatting. HOTMAIL is notorious for only including an HTML section in their client's default configuration. If you're using HOTMAIL, please see your email application's settings and switch to a default mail option that uses "Plain Text". --- MIME Errors No Plain-Text Section Found --- ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: May 18, 2006
From: greerdans(at)AOL.COM
Subject: Wing Back Riveting
Just finishing up working on the wing ribs. Looking ahead to the skins I wanted to ask if Back Riveting using the large handheld bucking bar had worked well for those that have tried it. Also, do you recommend using the 12 inch straight or double offset back rivet set. Thanks, George 40434 (Wings) ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: May 18, 2006
From: Rick <ricksked(at)earthlink.net>
Subject: Tree top flyer over the Rio Grande
--- MIME Errors - No Plain-Text Section Found --- A message with no text/plain MIME section was received. The entire body of the message was removed. Please resend the email using Plain Text formatting. HOTMAIL is notorious for only including an HTML section in their client's default configuration. If you're using HOTMAIL, please see your email application's settings and switch to a default mail option that uses "Plain Text". --- MIME Errors No Plain-Text Section Found --- ________________________________________________________________________________
From: <millstees(at)ameritech.net>
Subject: Re: Wing Back Riveting
Date: May 18, 2006
George; I just completed the wing skins, and I back riveted everything. It came out great. I did use the large handheld bucking bar, and it was easy. In many spots you will need the double offset back riveter. Just take your time, have a good assistant, and it will work great. Steve Mills 40486 Naperville, Illinois finishing wings ----- Original Message ----- From: greerdans(at)aol.com To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com Sent: Thursday, May 18, 2006 8:31 AM Subject: RV10-List: Wing Back Riveting Just finishing up working on the wing ribs. Looking ahead to the skins I wanted to ask if Back Riveting using the large handheld bucking bar had worked well for those that have tried it. Also, do you recommend using the 12 inch straight or double offset back rivet set. Thanks, George 40434 (Wings) ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: May 18, 2006
From: Rick <ricksked(at)earthlink.net>
Subject: Re: Wing Back Riveting
--- MIME Errors - No Plain-Text Section Found --- A message with no text/plain MIME section was received. The entire body of the message was removed. Please resend the email using Plain Text formatting. HOTMAIL is notorious for only including an HTML section in their client's default configuration. If you're using HOTMAIL, please see your email application's settings and switch to a default mail option that uses "Plain Text". --- MIME Errors No Plain-Text Section Found --- ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: May 18, 2006
From: Rick <ricksked(at)earthlink.net>
Subject: Tree top flyer over the Rio Grande
--- MIME Errors - No Plain-Text Section Found --- A message with no text/plain MIME section was received. The entire body of the message was removed. Please resend the email using Plain Text formatting. HOTMAIL is notorious for only including an HTML section in their client's default configuration. If you're using HOTMAIL, please see your email application's settings and switch to a default mail option that uses "Plain Text". --- MIME Errors No Plain-Text Section Found --- ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: May 18, 2006
From: Jay Brinkmeyer <jaybrinkmeyer(at)yahoo.com>
Subject: Thielert's New 230 hp Diesel Aircraft Engine
FYI Monday, Thielert Aircraft Engines announced at the Berlin Air Show intent to produce a new liquid-cooled turbocharged diesel-burning, FADEC-controlled single-lever-power 230 bhp engine, the Centurion 3.2. The engine is targeted for air-time in late 2007. Frank Thielert, CEO and founder of Thielert Aircraft Engines GmbH, said his goal was to offer a complete piston engine product line with, "New engines and engine integrations [that] will enable us in [the] future to cover the entire spectrum of piston aircraft engine technology." Those products -- the 150 bhp Centurion 1.7 (powering many Diamond DA42 Twin Star aircraft and burning 5.6 gph in economy cruise), the coming 230 bhp Centurion 3.2, and a 350 bhp Centurion 4.0 -- are supported by 111 service centers currently spanning 97 countries. The addition of more service centers is a company priority, as is Thielert's intent to make its 350 hp 4.0 available for multiple Cessnas. The existing Centurion 4.0 350 bhp jet fuel powered piston engine will be "integrated ... into further popular aircraft..." said Thielert. Specifically, the company seeks to acquire STC's for service in Cessna 206, 340, 414 and 421-series aircraft. See the full text of the company's release here http://info.thielert.com/centurion/main/news_start.php?newsid=343 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "RAS" <deruiteraircraftservices(at)btinternet.com>
Subject: Re: Thielert's New 230 hp Diesel Aircraft Engine
Date: May 18, 2006
hi all, If prices are similar as for the 1.7 I would say keep building, stick a Lycosaur on the front and sell it as quick as possible to finance your new thielert engine! You then have only two problems remaining : Find the finances for another RV10 kit and 2 building the thing with a big ugly squared off front area in the cowling....... I recall reading somewhere that current conversion cost are somewhere around 60,000 euro's for the full 1.7 kit for either C172 or PA 28. You'll have to fly an awful lot to get the initial price back through saving in fuel. An article in one of the magazines here recently quoted a headline flying from the UK to France for around 7 or 8 or something . MJR ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: May 19, 2006
From: Dan Masys <dmasys(at)cox.net>
Subject: CHTs with electronic ignition
Putting an electronic ignition in seems almost like a no brainer with fuel prices over $5/gal, but one of the potential downsides is higher CHTs (presumably due to more complete combustion). Could those who have flying -10s say whether they are limited in climb out by CHTs hitting high values (and whether they have electronic ignitions)? Am sort of spoiled by my -7A climbing at 2500 fpm with CHTs never higher than about 400, even on 'high, hot' kind of days. Thanks, -Dan Masys Making engine decision... ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Ralph E. Capen" <recapen(at)earthlink.net>
Subject: Re: CHTs with electronic ignition
Date: May 18, 2006
My LASAR on my O360 has a CHT sensor and drops the advance back automatically. Ralph RV6AQB ----- Original Message ----- From: "Dan Masys" <dmasys(at)cox.net> Sent: Thursday, May 18, 2006 8:32 PM Subject: RV10-List: CHTs with electronic ignition > > Putting an electronic ignition in seems almost like a no brainer with fuel > prices over $5/gal, but one of the potential downsides is higher CHTs > (presumably due to more complete combustion). Could those who have > flying -10s say whether they are limited in climb out by CHTs hitting > high values (and whether they have electronic ignitions)? Am sort of > spoiled by my -7A climbing at 2500 fpm with CHTs never higher than about > 400, even on 'high, hot' kind of days. > > Thanks, > -Dan Masys > Making engine decision... > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: May 18, 2006
From: rv10builder <rv10builder(at)bellsouth.net>
Subject: Airflow Performance Fuel Injection
I was just looking over my new Airflow Performance fuel injection system and noticed the purge valve with a return fitting. How does anyone using this system plan on connecting it up? Brian #40308 http://www.mykitlog.com/rv10builder ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: CHTs with electronic ignition
Date: May 18, 2006
From: "John W. Cox" <johnwcox(at)pacificnw.com>
Dan this is an excellent topic and should be followed with widespread interest. The advantages and the disadvantages should be posted. It is important for any poster to note whether running two mags, one mag / one electronic or complete electronic dependence. Those with the BPA package and the close test results from GAMI should provide an eye opener. It will not be a complete discussion until everyone knows the advantages and risks of LOP and ROP first. John Cox -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Dan Masys Sent: Thursday, May 18, 2006 5:32 PM Subject: RV10-List: CHTs with electronic ignition Putting an electronic ignition in seems almost like a no brainer with fuel prices over $5/gal, but one of the potential downsides is higher CHTs (presumably due to more complete combustion). Could those who have flying -10s say whether they are limited in climb out by CHTs hitting high values (and whether they have electronic ignitions)? Am sort of spoiled by my -7A climbing at 2500 fpm with CHTs never higher than about 400, even on 'high, hot' kind of days. Thanks, -Dan Masys Making engine decision... ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Dave Saylor" <Dave(at)AirCraftersLLC.com>
Subject: Airflow Performance Fuel Injection
Date: May 18, 2006
Brian, One thing to consider with the purge valve: We worked on a plane that had the valve oriented so the shaft pointed up. We had replaced the engine isolators among other work and I suspect rasied the engine a tiny bit. We ran it without the cowl for a while, and it ran fine. When we put the cowl on (I know, we should have checked), the top cowl barely contacted the purge valve shaft, pressing it down into its housing. That kept the engine from starting since the shaft displacement created an extreme over-rich condition. Cowl on, no start. Cowl off, ran great. That took a while to figure out...make sure the shaft is well clear! That installation ran the purged fuel back to a header tank (ideally...). Dave Saylor AirCrafters LLC 831-722-9141 40394 QB, wings done, baggage floors in -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of rv10builder Sent: Thursday, May 18, 2006 7:09 PM Subject: RV10-List: Airflow Performance Fuel Injection I was just looking over my new Airflow Performance fuel injection system and noticed the purge valve with a return fitting. How does anyone using this system plan on connecting it up? Brian #40308 http://www.mykitlog.com/rv10builder ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: May 18, 2006
From: Deems Davis <deemsdavis(at)cox.net>
Subject: Weight of Hartzell 2 bld?
Does anyone know the weight of the 2 blade Hartzell (Blended Airfoil)? Deems Davis # 406 Fuse http://deemsrv10.com/ ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "John Dunne" <acs(at)acspropeller.com.au>
Subject: Weight of Hartzell 2 bld
Date: May 19, 2006
Sorry Deems, the chart info didn't reproduce correctly. Short answer 50lbs approx. John 40315 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Ralph E. Capen" <recapen(at)earthlink.net>
Subject: Re: Airflow Performance Fuel Injection
Date: May 19, 2006
I have an andair duplex valve and will be returning the purge fuel back to the same tank...otherwise, you need to placard for selecting the same fuel side that your return is plumbed to or risk pumping it overboard. My purge valve is mounted 'lay-down' style insteda of between the cylinders as I am using a sam james plenum. Contact AirflowPerformance - they can swap out the purge valve if you need to avoid cowl interference issues. ----- Original Message ----- From: "rv10builder" <rv10builder(at)bellsouth.net> Sent: Thursday, May 18, 2006 10:09 PM Subject: RV10-List: Airflow Performance Fuel Injection > > I was just looking over my new Airflow Performance fuel injection system > and noticed the purge valve with a return fitting. How does anyone using > this system plan on connecting it up? > > Brian > #40308 > http://www.mykitlog.com/rv10builder > > > http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List > http://wiki.matronics.com > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: May 19, 2006
From: Dan Masys <dmasys(at)cox.net>
Subject: CHTs with electronic ignition
Cc: Tim Dawson-Townsend ---- Tim Dawson-Townsend wrote: > > Sounds like a great discussion for an "Engines" email list or Vans Air Force forum thread . . . > > TDT I'd like to get feedback from flying RV-10's as well, since it is as much a question of how good the cooling design is on the -10 as it is a general discussion of engines and ignitions. The general discussion is pretty well covered in online documents from the CAFE foundation (http://cafefoundation.org/v1/aprs/ignition1.pdf ), where in their test platform CHTs went up enough to cause them to have to modify the cowl outlets of their test plane. The AVWEB discussion of the LASAR system ( http://avweb.com/news/reviews/182489-1.html ) notes CHTs about 30 degrees higher than with stock ignition but concludes it isn't a problem if the engine is still in the green. Some airframes are pretty famous for being tightly cowled and having CHTs as the limiting parameter on hot day climbouts. Some its no biggee. Just would like some anecdotes about the early RV10 experience on this. Not trying to cause ignition of any flame wars (pun intended). -Dan Masys #40448 installing wiring ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Buhwana <buhwana(at)charter.net>
Subject: Re: RV10-List Digest: 28 Msgs - 05/18/06
Date: May 19, 2006
ein Verm=F6gen On May 19, 2006, at 1:57 AM, RV10-List Digest Server wrote: > Wieviel kostet die schoene deutsche Triebwerk ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: May 19, 2006
From: linn Walters <pitts_pilot(at)bellsouth.net>
Subject: RV-10 engine
Does anyone know if a Lycoming IO-540 A1A5 will work in the RV-10??? I get all kinds of '540' hits in the archives, but nothing model specific. Linn ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: What fuel pressure should I see for electric or engine fuel
pump on IO-540 engine.
Date: May 19, 2006
From: "Doerr, Ray R [NTK]" <Ray.R.Doerr(at)sprint.com>
What fuel pressure should I see for the electric and/or the engine fuel pump. The Lycoming operators manual talks abour 40 being the max, but when I run the electric pump I get 6 and when the engine is running at idle, it is also around 6 with the electric one off. Does this sound normal for an Injected IO-540? Thank You Ray Doerr 40250 (First engine run went great) ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: RV-10 engine
Date: May 19, 2006
From: "Condrey, Bob (US SSA)" <bob.condrey(at)baesystems.com>
Linn, That is an angle valve engine so it won't work. To conserve bandwidth I'll send you a spreadsheet I made a long time ago with the parallel valve engines listed. Bob #40105 -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of linn Walters Sent: Friday, May 19, 2006 11:14 AM Subject: RV10-List: RV-10 engine Does anyone know if a Lycoming IO-540 A1A5 will work in the RV-10??? I get all kinds of '540' hits in the archives, but nothing model specific. Linn ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Brinker" <brinker@cox-internet.com>
Subject: Re: What fuel pressure should I see for electric or engine
fuel pump on IO-540 engine.
Date: May 19, 2006
I had the same question a while back. I contacted Airflow Performance about it. Here is a copy & pasted email from them, Randy............................... We manufacture a boost pump to be used with fuel injected engines. P/N 3090050 $375.00. The pump is 12 VDC, fuel pressure is 25-30 PSI, flow capacity is 32 GPH @ 30 PSI, requires a 7-10 amp breaker. You fuel injection system (Bendix) requires 22-35 PSI to operate. If you have a diaphragm engine driven pump (P/N LW15473) this pump should produce 22-26 PSI. If you engine has a vane pump it should be set to 26-35 PSI. Don Rivera Airflow Performance 111 Airflow Drive Spartanburg, SC 29306 Phone: 864-576-4512 Fax: 864-576-0201 E-Mail: Airflow2(at)bellsouth.net ----- Original Message ----- From: "Doerr, Ray R [NTK]" <Ray.R.Doerr(at)sprint.com> Sent: Friday, May 19, 2006 11:09 AM Subject: RV10-List: What fuel pressure should I see for electric or engine fuel pump on IO-540 engine. > > > What fuel pressure should I see for the electric and/or the > engine fuel pump. The Lycoming operators manual talks abour 40 being > the max, but when I run the electric pump I get 6 and when the engine is > running at idle, it is also around 6 with the electric one off. Does > this sound normal for an Injected IO-540? > > > Thank You > Ray Doerr > 40250 (First engine run went great) > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: LessDragProd(at)aol.com
Date: May 19, 2006
Subject: Re: Weight of Hartzell 2 bld
50 pounds? That's it? Is this the best the RV-10 list can do? I am willing to say that the Hartzell 80" diameter blended airfoil propeller and spinner assembly weighs at least 65 pounds ready to bolt onto the engine. The Hartzell 72" diameter propeller and spinner assy with 7666-4 blades weighs 56 pounds. The Hartzell 80" diameter propeller and spinner assy weighs 66 pounds. I would suggest that the blended airfoil blades are not significantly lighter than the standard aluminum blades. Is someone on the RV-10 list actually willing to weigh their Hartzell blended airfoil propeller and spinner assembly to provide a REAL weight? Jim Ayers In a message dated 05/19/2006 4:25:46 AM Pacific Daylight Time, deemsdavis(at)cox.net writes: --> RV10-List message posted by: Deems Davis Thanks John do not archive John Dunne wrote: > Sorry Deems, the chart info didn't reproduce correctly. Short answer > 50lbs approx. > John 40315 ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: RV-10 engine
Date: May 19, 2006
From: "BPA" <BPA(at)bpaengines.com>
Linn, The A1A5 can be used in the RV-10 with a few changes. Allen Barrett BPE, Inc. -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of linn Walters Sent: Friday, May 19, 2006 10:14 AM Subject: RV10-List: RV-10 engine Does anyone know if a Lycoming IO-540 A1A5 will work in the RV-10??? I get all kinds of '540' hits in the archives, but nothing model specific. Linn ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: RV-10 engine
Date: May 19, 2006
From: "BPA" <BPA(at)bpaengines.com>
Let me retract, the IO-540 A1A5 cannot be used in the RV-10, but the 0-540 A1A5 can. The IO is an angle head, the 0 is a parallel head Allen Barrett -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of linn Walters Sent: Friday, May 19, 2006 10:14 AM Subject: RV10-List: RV-10 engine Does anyone know if a Lycoming IO-540 A1A5 will work in the RV-10??? I get all kinds of '540' hits in the archives, but nothing model specific. Linn ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Dave Saylor" <Dave(at)AirCraftersLLC.com>
Subject: What fuel pressure should I see for electric or engine
fuel pump on IO-540 engine.
Date: May 19, 2006
Ray, Metered fuel pressure downstream of the servo is around 5 psi with little if any change when the electric pump comes on. If you measure fuel pressure just downstream of the mechanical pump, before the servo, you should be able to see the electric pump boost the pressure to 30-40 psi. That's how you know it's working. The mechanical pump alone should keep it around 20-30 psi. 6 psi is about right for a carbureted engine. Carbureted engines use a lower pressure mechanical fuel pump compared to injected engines. Dave Saylor AirCrafters LLC 831-722-9141 -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Doerr, Ray R [NTK] Sent: Friday, May 19, 2006 9:10 AM Subject: RV10-List: What fuel pressure should I see for electric or engine fuel pump on IO-540 engine. --> What fuel pressure should I see for the electric and/or the engine fuel pump. The Lycoming operators manual talks abour 40 being the max, but when I run the electric pump I get 6 and when the engine is running at idle, it is also around 6 with the electric one off. Does this sound normal for an Injected IO-540? Thank You Ray Doerr 40250 (First engine run went great) ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Jesse Saint" <jesse(at)itecusa.org>
Subject: What fuel pressure should I see for electric or engine
fuel pump on IO-540 engine.
Date: May 19, 2006
I don't have a chart to verify this, but that does sound low for injected. Jesse Saint I-TEC, Inc. jesse(at)itecusa.org www.itecusa.org 352-465-4545 -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Doerr, Ray R [NTK] Sent: Friday, May 19, 2006 11:10 AM Subject: RV10-List: What fuel pressure should I see for electric or engine fuel pump on IO-540 engine. What fuel pressure should I see for the electric and/or the engine fuel pump. The Lycoming operators manual talks abour 40 being the max, but when I run the electric pump I get 6 and when the engine is running at idle, it is also around 6 with the electric one off. Does this sound normal for an Injected IO-540? Thank You Ray Doerr 40250 (First engine run went great) -- -- ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Jesse Saint" <jesse(at)itecusa.org>
Subject: RV-10 engine
Date: May 19, 2006
According to my research, it should not be a problem. I think only the K models are angle valve, which would not work. Everything else should be parallel valve. The only problem you may run into is the mount ears, but those can be swapped out. There is a guy on the list who has a set to sell also. According to Allen Barrett, all parallel valve engine are the same size with a few minor variations, which would mainly come into play on weight (minor) and fitting the baffles (trimming in different places and to different extents). Jesse Saint I-TEC, Inc. jesse(at)itecusa.org www.itecusa.org 352-465-4545 -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of linn Walters Sent: Friday, May 19, 2006 11:14 AM Subject: RV10-List: RV-10 engine Does anyone know if a Lycoming IO-540 A1A5 will work in the RV-10??? I get all kinds of '540' hits in the archives, but nothing model specific. Linn -- -- ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: What fuel pressure should I see for electric or engine
fuel pump on IO-540 engine.
Date: May 19, 2006
From: "Doerr, Ray R [NTK]" <Ray.R.Doerr(at)sprint.com>
Thanks for all the replies. I bought the electric boost pump directly from Van's for the fuel injected engines. My fuel system is per Van's exactly for the fuel injected engine. This is why I can't explain the 6 psi from my Dynon Engine monitor when the electric boost pump is running. I will check the engine driven fuel pump as well tonight. But I can't believe that I have the wrong electric and engine driven pump, because both of them only register 6 psi on the Dynon. Thank You Ray Doerr 40250 -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Dave Saylor Sent: Friday, May 19, 2006 12:21 PM Subject: RE: RV10-List: What fuel pressure should I see for electric or engine fuel pump on IO-540 engine. Ray, Metered fuel pressure downstream of the servo is around 5 psi with little if any change when the electric pump comes on. If you measure fuel pressure just downstream of the mechanical pump, before the servo, you should be able to see the electric pump boost the pressure to 30-40 psi. That's how you know it's working. The mechanical pump alone should keep it around 20-30 psi. 6 psi is about right for a carbureted engine. Carbureted engines use a lower pressure mechanical fuel pump compared to injected engines. Dave Saylor AirCrafters LLC 831-722-9141 -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Doerr, Ray R [NTK] Sent: Friday, May 19, 2006 9:10 AM Subject: RV10-List: What fuel pressure should I see for electric or engine fuel pump on IO-540 engine. --> What fuel pressure should I see for the electric and/or the engine fuel pump. The Lycoming operators manual talks abour 40 being the max, but when I run the electric pump I get 6 and when the engine is running at idle, it is also around 6 with the electric one off. Does this sound normal for an Injected IO-540? Thank You Ray Doerr 40250 (First engine run went great) ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Jerry Grimmonpre" <jerry(at)mc.net>
Subject: Re: What fuel pressure should I see for electric or engine
fuel pump on IO-540 engine.
Date: May 19, 2006
I've read on the RV list about two months ago ... someone experienced the same results ... about 6 PSI with a mechanical pump that should put out the higher pressure for injected engines. This pump had the wrong P/N on it. It was a low pressure pump with a high pressure P/N. Can't trust anything anymore! Jerry Grimmonpre' RV8A > > Ray, > > Metered fuel pressure downstream of the servo is around 5 psi with little > if > any change when the electric pump comes on. > > If you measure fuel pressure just downstream of the mechanical pump, > before > the servo, you should be able to see the electric pump boost the pressure > to > 30-40 psi. That's how you know it's working. The mechanical pump alone > should keep it around 20-30 psi. 6 psi is about right for a carbureted > engine. Carbureted engines use a lower pressure mechanical fuel pump ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Jesse Saint" <jesse(at)itecusa.org>
Subject: What fuel pressure should I see for electric or engine
fuel pump on IO-540 engine.
Date: May 19, 2006
With the Dynon, there are different settings for different sensors. Some sensors are for Carbureted engines while some are for injected. If you got the fuel injected probes, then you will need to tell the Dynon unit that you have the injected probe. That is most likely your issue. If all else fails, call Dynon and ask which sensor to tell the unit that you are using. Hope this helps. Jesse Saint I-TEC, Inc. jesse(at)itecusa.org www.itecusa.org 352-465-4545 -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Doerr, Ray R [NTK] Sent: Friday, May 19, 2006 1:01 PM Subject: RE: RV10-List: What fuel pressure should I see for electric or engine fuel pump on IO-540 engine. Thanks for all the replies. I bought the electric boost pump directly from Van's for the fuel injected engines. My fuel system is per Van's exactly for the fuel injected engine. This is why I can't explain the 6 psi from my Dynon Engine monitor when the electric boost pump is running. I will check the engine driven fuel pump as well tonight. But I can't believe that I have the wrong electric and engine driven pump, because both of them only register 6 psi on the Dynon. Thank You Ray Doerr 40250 -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Dave Saylor Sent: Friday, May 19, 2006 12:21 PM Subject: RE: RV10-List: What fuel pressure should I see for electric or engine fuel pump on IO-540 engine. Ray, Metered fuel pressure downstream of the servo is around 5 psi with little if any change when the electric pump comes on. If you measure fuel pressure just downstream of the mechanical pump, before the servo, you should be able to see the electric pump boost the pressure to 30-40 psi. That's how you know it's working. The mechanical pump alone should keep it around 20-30 psi. 6 psi is about right for a carbureted engine. Carbureted engines use a lower pressure mechanical fuel pump compared to injected engines. Dave Saylor AirCrafters LLC 831-722-9141 -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Doerr, Ray R [NTK] Sent: Friday, May 19, 2006 9:10 AM Subject: RV10-List: What fuel pressure should I see for electric or engine fuel pump on IO-540 engine. --> What fuel pressure should I see for the electric and/or the engine fuel pump. The Lycoming operators manual talks abour 40 being the max, but when I run the electric pump I get 6 and when the engine is running at idle, it is also around 6 with the electric one off. Does this sound normal for an Injected IO-540? Thank You Ray Doerr 40250 (First engine run went great) -- -- ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Jesse Saint" <jesse(at)itecusa.org>
Subject: What fuel pressure should I see for electric or engine
fuel pump on IO-540 engine.
Date: May 19, 2006
By the way, tachometer may be the same thing. We were only getting about 2,000 rpm I think on the reading when we tested it with a visual tachometer and found that it was right at red-line. Make sure you check the settings for all of the different probes, especially if you are seeing something odd like that. Jesse Saint I-TEC, Inc. jesse(at)itecusa.org www.itecusa.org 352-465-4545 -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Doerr, Ray R [NTK] Sent: Friday, May 19, 2006 1:01 PM Subject: RE: RV10-List: What fuel pressure should I see for electric or engine fuel pump on IO-540 engine. Thanks for all the replies. I bought the electric boost pump directly from Van's for the fuel injected engines. My fuel system is per Van's exactly for the fuel injected engine. This is why I can't explain the 6 psi from my Dynon Engine monitor when the electric boost pump is running. I will check the engine driven fuel pump as well tonight. But I can't believe that I have the wrong electric and engine driven pump, because both of them only register 6 psi on the Dynon. Thank You Ray Doerr 40250 -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Dave Saylor Sent: Friday, May 19, 2006 12:21 PM Subject: RE: RV10-List: What fuel pressure should I see for electric or engine fuel pump on IO-540 engine. Ray, Metered fuel pressure downstream of the servo is around 5 psi with little if any change when the electric pump comes on. If you measure fuel pressure just downstream of the mechanical pump, before the servo, you should be able to see the electric pump boost the pressure to 30-40 psi. That's how you know it's working. The mechanical pump alone should keep it around 20-30 psi. 6 psi is about right for a carbureted engine. Carbureted engines use a lower pressure mechanical fuel pump compared to injected engines. Dave Saylor AirCrafters LLC 831-722-9141 -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Doerr, Ray R [NTK] Sent: Friday, May 19, 2006 9:10 AM Subject: RV10-List: What fuel pressure should I see for electric or engine fuel pump on IO-540 engine. --> What fuel pressure should I see for the electric and/or the engine fuel pump. The Lycoming operators manual talks abour 40 being the max, but when I run the electric pump I get 6 and when the engine is running at idle, it is also around 6 with the electric one off. Does this sound normal for an Injected IO-540? Thank You Ray Doerr 40250 (First engine run went great) -- -- ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Rene Felker" <rene(at)felker.com>
Subject: What fuel pressure should I see for electric or engine
fuel pump on IO-540 engine.
Date: May 19, 2006
Hate to ask the obvious, but where is your sensor hooked up? Before or after the servo? Rene' Felker -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Doerr, Ray R [NTK] Sent: Friday, May 19, 2006 12:01 PM Subject: RE: RV10-List: What fuel pressure should I see for electric or engine fuel pump on IO-540 engine. Thanks for all the replies. I bought the electric boost pump directly from Van's for the fuel injected engines. My fuel system is per Van's exactly for the fuel injected engine. This is why I can't explain the 6 psi from my Dynon Engine monitor when the electric boost pump is running. I will check the engine driven fuel pump as well tonight. But I can't believe that I have the wrong electric and engine driven pump, because both of them only register 6 psi on the Dynon. Thank You Ray Doerr 40250 -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Dave Saylor Sent: Friday, May 19, 2006 12:21 PM Subject: RE: RV10-List: What fuel pressure should I see for electric or engine fuel pump on IO-540 engine. Ray, Metered fuel pressure downstream of the servo is around 5 psi with little if any change when the electric pump comes on. If you measure fuel pressure just downstream of the mechanical pump, before the servo, you should be able to see the electric pump boost the pressure to 30-40 psi. That's how you know it's working. The mechanical pump alone should keep it around 20-30 psi. 6 psi is about right for a carbureted engine. Carbureted engines use a lower pressure mechanical fuel pump compared to injected engines. Dave Saylor AirCrafters LLC 831-722-9141 -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Doerr, Ray R [NTK] Sent: Friday, May 19, 2006 9:10 AM Subject: RV10-List: What fuel pressure should I see for electric or engine fuel pump on IO-540 engine. --> What fuel pressure should I see for the electric and/or the engine fuel pump. The Lycoming operators manual talks abour 40 being the max, but when I run the electric pump I get 6 and when the engine is running at idle, it is also around 6 with the electric one off. Does this sound normal for an Injected IO-540? Thank You Ray Doerr 40250 (First engine run went great) ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: RV-10 engine
Date: May 19, 2006
From: "BPA" <BPA(at)bpaengines.com>
Even if the engine is an angle head engine as a core, it can be changed/ converted to a parallel head. Although it is pretty expensive to do, several have been changed over. Push rods, tubes, inter-cylinder baffles, sumps, etc, are the major changes. Some angle head engines are more costly than others to convert, particularly the 'up exhaust' engines because of the angle of the tappet body openings. These cases will need to be converted, required weld and re-machining. It's a matter of economics. Get the core for the right price and it may be feasible. Pay the premium for the core and it may not be worth the cost. Allen Barrett BPE, Inc. -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Jesse Saint Sent: Friday, May 19, 2006 11:58 AM Subject: RE: RV10-List: RV-10 engine According to my research, it should not be a problem. I think only the K models are angle valve, which would not work. Everything else should be parallel valve. The only problem you may run into is the mount ears, but those can be swapped out. There is a guy on the list who has a set to sell also. According to Allen Barrett, all parallel valve engine are the same size with a few minor variations, which would mainly come into play on weight (minor) and fitting the baffles (trimming in different places and to different extents). Jesse Saint I-TEC, Inc. jesse(at)itecusa.org www.itecusa.org 352-465-4545 -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of linn Walters Sent: Friday, May 19, 2006 11:14 AM Subject: RV10-List: RV-10 engine Does anyone know if a Lycoming IO-540 A1A5 will work in the RV-10??? I get all kinds of '540' hits in the archives, but nothing model specific. Linn -- -- ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: What fuel pressure should I see for electric or engine
fuel pump on IO-540 engine.
Date: May 19, 2006
From: "Doerr, Ray R [NTK]" <Ray.R.Doerr(at)sprint.com>
As per the plans, right off the output of the fuel pump. Thank You Ray Doerr -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Rene Felker Sent: Friday, May 19, 2006 1:26 PM Subject: RE: RV10-List: What fuel pressure should I see for electric or engine fuel pump on IO-540 engine. Hate to ask the obvious, but where is your sensor hooked up? Before or after the servo? Rene' Felker -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Doerr, Ray R [NTK] Sent: Friday, May 19, 2006 12:01 PM Subject: RE: RV10-List: What fuel pressure should I see for electric or engine fuel pump on IO-540 engine. Thanks for all the replies. I bought the electric boost pump directly from Van's for the fuel injected engines. My fuel system is per Van's exactly for the fuel injected engine. This is why I can't explain the 6 psi from my Dynon Engine monitor when the electric boost pump is running. I will check the engine driven fuel pump as well tonight. But I can't believe that I have the wrong electric and engine driven pump, because both of them only register 6 psi on the Dynon. Thank You Ray Doerr 40250 -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Dave Saylor Sent: Friday, May 19, 2006 12:21 PM Subject: RE: RV10-List: What fuel pressure should I see for electric or engine fuel pump on IO-540 engine. Ray, Metered fuel pressure downstream of the servo is around 5 psi with little if any change when the electric pump comes on. If you measure fuel pressure just downstream of the mechanical pump, before the servo, you should be able to see the electric pump boost the pressure to 30-40 psi. That's how you know it's working. The mechanical pump alone should keep it around 20-30 psi. 6 psi is about right for a carbureted engine. Carbureted engines use a lower pressure mechanical fuel pump compared to injected engines. Dave Saylor AirCrafters LLC 831-722-9141 -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Doerr, Ray R [NTK] Sent: Friday, May 19, 2006 9:10 AM Subject: RV10-List: What fuel pressure should I see for electric or engine fuel pump on IO-540 engine. --> What fuel pressure should I see for the electric and/or the engine fuel pump. The Lycoming operators manual talks abour 40 being the max, but when I run the electric pump I get 6 and when the engine is running at idle, it is also around 6 with the electric one off. Does this sound normal for an Injected IO-540? Thank You Ray Doerr 40250 (First engine run went great) ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: What fuel pressure should I see for electric or engine
fuel pump on IO-540 engine.
Date: May 19, 2006
From: "Doerr, Ray R [NTK]" <Ray.R.Doerr(at)sprint.com>
I just found this on Dynon's sites as well. I will have to check tonight, but I suspect I have mine set for Type 1 when it should be type 2. This makes sense because the engine runs fine and the builder (America's Aircraft Engines) ran the engine for over an hour at 75% power. Thank You Ray Doerr -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Jesse Saint Sent: Friday, May 19, 2006 1:17 PM Subject: RE: RV10-List: What fuel pressure should I see for electric or engine fuel pump on IO-540 engine. With the Dynon, there are different settings for different sensors. Some sensors are for Carbureted engines while some are for injected. If you got the fuel injected probes, then you will need to tell the Dynon unit that you have the injected probe. That is most likely your issue. If all else fails, call Dynon and ask which sensor to tell the unit that you are using. Hope this helps. Jesse Saint I-TEC, Inc. jesse(at)itecusa.org www.itecusa.org 352-465-4545 -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Doerr, Ray R [NTK] Sent: Friday, May 19, 2006 1:01 PM Subject: RE: RV10-List: What fuel pressure should I see for electric or engine fuel pump on IO-540 engine. Thanks for all the replies. I bought the electric boost pump directly from Van's for the fuel injected engines. My fuel system is per Van's exactly for the fuel injected engine. This is why I can't explain the 6 psi from my Dynon Engine monitor when the electric boost pump is running. I will check the engine driven fuel pump as well tonight. But I can't believe that I have the wrong electric and engine driven pump, because both of them only register 6 psi on the Dynon. Thank You Ray Doerr 40250 -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Dave Saylor Sent: Friday, May 19, 2006 12:21 PM Subject: RE: RV10-List: What fuel pressure should I see for electric or engine fuel pump on IO-540 engine. Ray, Metered fuel pressure downstream of the servo is around 5 psi with little if any change when the electric pump comes on. If you measure fuel pressure just downstream of the mechanical pump, before the servo, you should be able to see the electric pump boost the pressure to 30-40 psi. That's how you know it's working. The mechanical pump alone should keep it around 20-30 psi. 6 psi is about right for a carbureted engine. Carbureted engines use a lower pressure mechanical fuel pump compared to injected engines. Dave Saylor AirCrafters LLC 831-722-9141 -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Doerr, Ray R [NTK] Sent: Friday, May 19, 2006 9:10 AM Subject: RV10-List: What fuel pressure should I see for electric or engine fuel pump on IO-540 engine. --> What fuel pressure should I see for the electric and/or the engine fuel pump. The Lycoming operators manual talks abour 40 being the max, but when I run the electric pump I get 6 and when the engine is running at idle, it is also around 6 with the electric one off. Does this sound normal for an Injected IO-540? Thank You Ray Doerr 40250 (First engine run went great) -- -- ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Bob Condrey" <bcondrey(at)cox.net>
Subject: Re: Weight of Hartzell 2 bld
Date: May 19, 2006
I just weighed mine - 53.6 lbs. That is a new Hartzell 2 blade blended airfoil prop as ordered from Vans and delivered from Hartzell. Does not count any spinner/backplate related hardware - just the prop w/blades and hub as delivered. Bob #40105 Subject: Re: Weight of Hartzell 2 bld From: LessDragProd(at)aol.com Date: Fri May 19 - 10:02 AM 50 pounds? That's it? Is this the best the RV-10 list can do? I am willing to say that the Hartzell 80" diameter blended airfoil propeller and spinner assembly weighs at least 65 pounds ready to bolt onto the engine. The Hartzell 72" diameter propeller and spinner assy with 7666-4 blades weighs 56 pounds. The Hartzell 80" diameter propeller and spinner assy weighs 66 pounds. I would suggest that the blended airfoil blades are not significantly lighter than the standard aluminum blades. Is someone on the RV-10 list actually willing to weigh their Hartzell blended airfoil propeller and spinner assembly to provide a REAL weight? Jim Ayers In a message dated 05/19/2006 4:25:46 AM Pacific Daylight Time, deemsdavis(at)cox.net writes: --> RV10-List message posted by: Deems Davis Thanks John ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Carl Froehlich" <carl.froehlich(at)cox.net>
Subject: Airflow Performance Fuel Injection
Date: May 19, 2006
I run the Airflow Performance on my RV-8A. I use the purge valve for engine shut down, but it's main function is to eliminate vapor lock in the spider for hot starts (never had to do this - 250 hrs so far). I have the purge line plumbed back to one tank. Considering the very infrequent use for purging, and that purge volume is only a few ounces, they is no need for a duplex fuel valve. Carl Froehlich RV-10 (tail) RV-8A (flying) -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of Ralph E. Capen Sent: Friday, May 19, 2006 6:32 AM Subject: Re: RV10-List: Airflow Performance Fuel Injection I have an andair duplex valve and will be returning the purge fuel back to the same tank...otherwise, you need to placard for selecting the same fuel side that your return is plumbed to or risk pumping it overboard. My purge valve is mounted 'lay-down' style insteda of between the cylinders as I am using a sam james plenum. Contact AirflowPerformance - they can swap out the purge valve if you need to avoid cowl interference issues. ----- Original Message ----- From: "rv10builder" <rv10builder(at)bellsouth.net> Sent: Thursday, May 18, 2006 10:09 PM Subject: RV10-List: Airflow Performance Fuel Injection > > I was just looking over my new Airflow Performance fuel injection system > and noticed the purge valve with a return fitting. How does anyone using > this system plan on connecting it up? > > Brian > #40308 > http://www.mykitlog.com/rv10builder > > > http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List > http://wiki.matronics.com > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Byron Gillespie" <bgill1(at)charter.net>
Subject: Re: Weight of Hartzell 2 bld
Date: May 19, 2006
OK you got my curiosity up... Went down and unboxed mine (std from Vans) and it weights in at 53.5 - again out of the box - no spinner or other attachments. I used the wife's bathroom scales so use the info at our own risk :-) Byron #40253 finishing & FFW -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Bob Condrey Sent: Friday, May 19, 2006 4:46 PM Subject: RV10-List: Re: Weight of Hartzell 2 bld I just weighed mine - 53.6 lbs. That is a new Hartzell 2 blade blended airfoil prop as ordered from Vans and delivered from Hartzell. Does not count any spinner/backplate related hardware - just the prop w/blades and hub as delivered. Bob #40105 Subject: Re: Weight of Hartzell 2 bld From: LessDragProd(at)aol.com Date: Fri May 19 - 10:02 AM 50 pounds? That's it? Is this the best the RV-10 list can do? I am willing to say that the Hartzell 80" diameter blended airfoil propeller and spinner assembly weighs at least 65 pounds ready to bolt onto the engine. The Hartzell 72" diameter propeller and spinner assy with 7666-4 blades weighs 56 pounds. The Hartzell 80" diameter propeller and spinner assy weighs 66 pounds. I would suggest that the blended airfoil blades are not significantly lighter than the standard aluminum blades. Is someone on the RV-10 list actually willing to weigh their Hartzell blended airfoil propeller and spinner assembly to provide a REAL weight? Jim Ayers In a message dated 05/19/2006 4:25:46 AM Pacific Daylight Time, deemsdavis(at)cox.net writes: --> RV10-List message posted by: Deems Davis Thanks John ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: May 19, 2006
From: rv10builder <rv10builder(at)bellsouth.net>
Subject: Re: Airflow Performance Fuel Injection
Thanks for the responses; all contained good information! After a little searching on the WEB I found an attractive solution: http://www.rvproject.com/20030516.html Thanks Dan! rv10builder wrote: > I was just looking over my new Airflow Performance fuel injection > system and noticed the purge valve with a return fitting. How does > anyone using this system plan on connecting it up? > > Brian > #40308 > http://www.mykitlog.com/rv10builder > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: LessDragProd(at)aol.com
Date: May 19, 2006
Subject: Re: Weight of Hartzell 2 bld
Hartzell 80" diameter blended airfoil propeller. Around 54 pounds bare. Around 57 pounds with spinner installed. That is impressive. Jim Ayers PS this is not sarcasm. The Hartzell 2 blade 80" diameter propeller assembly used on the Harmon Rocket 2 weighs 66 pounds. ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Richard Sipp" <rsipp(at)earthlink.net>
Subject: Re: What fuel pressure should I see for electric or engine
fuel pump on IO-540 engine.
Date: May 19, 2006
The Ops Manual I have lists: inlet to fuel pump min -2 max 35 inlet to fuel injector min 14 max 45 min at idle 12 I think you should see something like 25 psi or so in normal operation. AirFlow Perfomance recommends a boost pump setting a few psi higher than the engine pump pressure to verify its operation on the fuel pressure gauge. It sounds like you may have a gauge or pressure sensor for a carbureted engine. Dick Sipp 40065 ----- Original Message ----- From: "Doerr, Ray R [NTK]" <Ray.R.Doerr(at)sprint.com> Sent: Friday, May 19, 2006 12:09 PM Subject: RV10-List: What fuel pressure should I see for electric or engine fuel pump on IO-540 engine. > > > What fuel pressure should I see for the electric and/or the > engine fuel pump. The Lycoming operators manual talks abour 40 being > the max, but when I run the electric pump I get 6 and when the engine is > running at idle, it is also around 6 with the electric one off. Does > this sound normal for an Injected IO-540? > > > Thank You > Ray Doerr > 40250 (First engine run went great) > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: PILOTDDS(at)aol.com
Date: May 20, 2006
Subject: CHT with lightspeed
I have dual lightspeed and you are right the cllinder heads run a bit hot.About 430 at 50 rich of peak at 23,24.The coldest cylinder is high 390`s. 728DD ________________________________________________________________________________
From: PILOTDDS(at)aol.com
Date: May 20, 2006
Subject: Re: Airflow Performance Fuel Injection
Instructions are very clear and it is a great system.Good people to work with. 728DD ________________________________________________________________________________
From: PILOTDDS(at)AOL.COM
Date: May 20, 2006
Subject: Re: RV-10 engine
The hartzell prop sold by vans may not work due to the absence of counterweights.This could cause vibration issues.I am told the counterweights can be retrofitted,good luck. 728DD ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Bob Condrey" <bcondrey(at)cox.net>
Subject: Re: CHT with lightspeed
Date: May 20, 2006
Do you have any pictures of the dual LSE installation? I trying to figure out a good place to put the two electronics boxes. Bob #40105 -------------------------------------------- Subject: CHT with lightspeed From: PILOTDDS(at)aol.com Date: Fri May 19 - 9:40 PM I have dual lightspeed and you are right the cllinder heads run a bit hot.About 430 at 50 rich of peak at 23,24.The coldest cylinder is high 390`s. 728DD ________________________________________________________________________________
From: PILOTDDS(at)aol.com
Date: May 20, 2006
Subject: lightspeed
No pics but I mounted them on the front of the false panel forward of the avionics panel. ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: May 20, 2006
From: "Fred Williams, M.D." <drfred@cox-internet.com>
Subject: Trim tab movement
I am installing the trim tab servo today. Cables routed, connected and set at 35 deg down deflection on both sides. Set with full " nose up:" postion of F-1095B. RT tab is connected to the forward hole and lt tab is connected to the aft hole. My question is the differential movement of the tabs. When I raise the tabs up, the movement of the left tab stops at 0 deg deflection (from the cord line of the horizontial stabilizer) and the rt tab continues up ward. Is this normal?? I dont see anything in the plans that tells me this is how it should work. Did I set this up correctly? Thanks. By the way, just got back from the Texas RV fly in and saw two completed RV 10's One was Alex De Dominicus's plane another one who's owner I did not get to meet. I had to hurry back and get something done. Sweet looking planes. I met a couple other 10 builders who are having problems with the door fit. Fred Williams 40515 tailcone Wings SB should ship 5/29. ......... ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: May 20, 2006
From: "Fred Williams, M.D." <drfred@cox-internet.com>
Subject: Trim tab movement
Tim and Jesse: Thanks. Fred Williams 40515 ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: May 21, 2006
From: Michael Wellenzohn <michael(at)wellenzohn.net>
Subject: VS completed!
I achieved to complete my first part the VS :-) However I have one little issue along the middle rib I have some rough marks on the skin now. I belief they are from the rough edge of the bucking bar (I grinded them now to have smooth edges). Here is the picture http://www.wellenzohn.net/VerticalStabilizer/_vs_16.jpg you see the marks below the rivets. Best Regards Michael Wellenzohn #511 (VS) www.wellenzohn.net ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: May 21, 2006
From: Larry Rosen <LarryRosen(at)comcast.net>
Subject: Re: VS completed!
I would think that a when you go to final finish the VS a scotch bright pad would clean up those rough marks on the skin just fine. Larry Rosen http://lrosen.nerv10.com Michael Wellenzohn wrote: > > > I achieved to complete my first part the VS :-) > However I have one little issue along the middle rib I have some rough > marks on the skin now. I belief they are from the rough edge of the > bucking bar (I grinded them now to have smooth edges). > > Here is the picture > http://www.wellenzohn.net/VerticalStabilizer/_vs_16.jpg you see the > marks below the rivets. > > Best Regards > Michael Wellenzohn > #511 (VS) > www.wellenzohn.net > > > http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List > http://wiki.matronics.com > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Marc and Kathy" <marchudson(at)comcast.net>
Subject: VS completed!
Date: May 21, 2006
Mike >From the picture that you sent, the marks are on the manufactured side of the rivet. Were you using the bucking bar on that side? If not, I'm not sure how the bucking bar could be causing this issue. One of the things that I use to protect the skins on the outside is to put rivet tape on every rivet that I shoot. I know this isn't necessary but it does help protect the skin a little. Marc -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Michael Wellenzohn Sent: Sunday, May 21, 2006 6:52 AM Subject: RV10-List: VS completed! I achieved to complete my first part the VS :-) However I have one little issue along the middle rib I have some rough marks on the skin now. I belief they are from the rough edge of the bucking bar (I grinded them now to have smooth edges). Here is the picture http://www.wellenzohn.net/VerticalStabilizer/_vs_16.jpg you see the marks below the rivets. Best Regards Michael Wellenzohn #511 (VS) www.wellenzohn.net ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "jdalton77" <jdalton77(at)comcast.net>
Subject: Re: VS completed!
Date: May 21, 2006
Congrats! I finished mine last month and it felt great. I'm now finishing off the trim tabs. If scotchbrite pad on an orbital sander won't work I sometimes (lightly) sand the skin with 180 grit sandpaper to remove any small imperfections. Then use the scotchbrite pad by hand and prime. be very careful not to remove to much though. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Michael Wellenzohn" <michael(at)wellenzohn.net> Sent: Sunday, May 21, 2006 8:51 AM Subject: RV10-List: VS completed! > > > I achieved to complete my first part the VS :-) > However I have one little issue along the middle rib I have some rough > marks on the skin now. I belief they are from the rough edge of the > bucking bar (I grinded them now to have smooth edges). > > Here is the picture > http://www.wellenzohn.net/VerticalStabilizer/_vs_16.jpg you see the marks > below the rivets. > > Best Regards > Michael Wellenzohn > #511 (VS) > www.wellenzohn.net > > > http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List > http://wiki.matronics.com > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "jdalton77" <jdalton77(at)comcast.net>
Subject: Re: VS completed!
Date: May 21, 2006
I put a line of tape over all the rivets that I shoot with a mushroom heard from the outside. It almost always comes out without scratches. Be careful not to miss the rivet due to the tape - big dents! I know this to be true . . . :) ----- Original Message ----- From: "Marc and Kathy" <marchudson(at)comcast.net> Sent: Sunday, May 21, 2006 11:22 AM Subject: RE: RV10-List: VS completed! > > Mike > >>From the picture that you sent, the marks are on the manufactured side of > the rivet. Were you using the bucking bar on that side? If not, I'm not > sure how the bucking bar could be causing this issue. One of the things > that I use to protect the skins on the outside is to put rivet tape on > every rivet that I shoot. I know this isn't necessary but it does help > protect the skin a little. > > Marc > > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com > [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Michael > Wellenzohn > Sent: Sunday, May 21, 2006 6:52 AM > To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com > Subject: RV10-List: VS completed! > > > > I achieved to complete my first part the VS :-) > However I have one little issue along the middle rib I have some rough > marks on the skin now. I belief they are from the rough edge of the > bucking bar (I grinded them now to have smooth edges). > > Here is the picture > http://www.wellenzohn.net/VerticalStabilizer/_vs_16.jpg you see the > marks below the rivets. > > Best Regards > Michael Wellenzohn > #511 (VS) > www.wellenzohn.net > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Fixitauto(at)aol.com
Date: May 21, 2006
Subject: Re: UP COMING RV FLY IN
THE BOONE IOWA ANNUAL RV FLY IN IS COMING UP NEXT MONTH. LOTS OF PLANES, GREAT PEOPLE AND JUST PLANE FUN. SATURDAY JUNE 17 2006 HERS A LINK FOR MOR INFORMATION _http://www.wcaircraft.com/boonervday.html_ (http://www.wcaircraft.com/boonervday.html) ________________________________________________________________________________
From: JSMcGrew(at)AOL.COM
Date: May 21, 2006
Subject: Big Week.
This week was something of a big transition for me. I had my last ever flight in an F-15 on Thursday (pictured below after being hosed down). And today I moved my RV-10 from my garage out to the hangar. I've been worrying about how I was going to transport it as most trailers are only 6 feet wide. You can see I used a 4x8 sheet of 5/8 inch plywood strengthened by some 2x8 and 2x4 boards underneath to extend the trailer width out to 8' - perfect for the gear. It was easy to load and unload and traveled great. My last day of work for the Air Force is at the end of this week, so I'm a full time airplane builder until I get my plane in the air - hopefully before I have to go back to school next fall! I'm extra motivated now since I don't get to fly at work anymore... Jim "Scooter" McGrew 40134 Doors and FW forward ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: May 21, 2006
From: rv10builder <rv10builder(at)bellsouth.net>
Subject: Heater boxes
O.K....I am totally pulling my hair out here; any help would be greatly appreciated. I cannot seem to find anywhere in the plans or hardware list the pieces needed to connect up cabin heat selector boxes, specifically the screws, nuts, cushion clamps and most importantly the flapper "tabs" that terminate the cables. Thanks! Brian 40308 http://www.mykitlog.com/rv10builder ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: May 21, 2006
From: Sam Marlow <sam.marlow(at)adelphia.net>
Subject: AIRSPEED INDICATOR MARKINGS
Where do we get the range markings for the airspeed indicator? Did most of you mark your own instruments? ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: May 21, 2006
Subject: Re: AIRSPEED INDICATOR MARKINGS
From: "Tim Olson" <Tim(at)MyRV10.com>
Depends on what you get for instruments. You can actually order UMA instruments like the airspeed indicator, all premarked for the RV-10. On an EFIS you'd input them yourself. Tim > > Where do we get the range markings for the airspeed indicator? Did most > of you mark your own instruments? > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "David McNeill" <dlm46007(at)cox.net>
Subject: cabin cover hints
Date: May 21, 2006
Although we modified out lid a few months ago for the shoulder harnesses, we recently began trimming it to fit the fuselage. In our first attempt we used a compressor and cutoff wheel that supplied only 6 CFM @90 PSI. This was insufficient and resulted in cutting a distance of about 72" in about 90 mins. This morning we used a larger compressor and completed the cut to trim lines for doors, windows, mid side flanges, rear flanges, windscreen flanges and under door flanges. The areas were then sanded with a sanding wheel and belt sander. This mornings work was done in two hours using a few sanding disks and three cutoff wheels. ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Richard Sipp" <rsipp(at)earthlink.net>
Subject: Re: AIRSPEED INDICATOR MARKINGS
Date: May 21, 2006
They are listed at the top of page 22 of the Final Inspection and Flight Test Chapter. In MPH: Bottom of white arc.......60 indicated stall with full flaps Top of white arc............100 max speed with full flaps Bottom of green arc......70 approx indicated stall without flaps Top of green arc...........180 max structural cruise speed Blue line.........................144 maneuvering speed Yellow arc......................180-230 caution range calm or light turbulence only Red line.........................230 maximum permissible speed under any condition There's lots of other critical stuff in this chapter. I can't recall for sure what part of the kit this section came with. Dick Sipp 40065 ----- Original Message ----- From: "Sam Marlow" <sam.marlow(at)adelphia.net> Sent: Sunday, May 21, 2006 5:06 PM Subject: RV10-List: AIRSPEED INDICATOR MARKINGS > > Where do we get the range markings for the airspeed indicator? Did most of > you mark your own instruments? > > > http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List > http://wiki.matronics.com > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: May 21, 2006
From: greerdans(at)aol.com
Subject: Fastener Concern
While working on the wings I noticed that that the Aileron Bellcrank Attach Brackets are attached using only two bolts each into platenuts, without any other locking feature. Considering the importance of the Brackets in the Aileron Linkage I'm surprised that they are not riveted or secured with some additional locking feature. Since I'm really just getting into the critical contol linkages and I'm not sure if this is a common design approach that Van's uses throughout the kit or if is it used in aircraft in general?. I wanted to find out if others have other considered this as a potental problem area and have you done anything to improve the design? (loctite, jam nut, etc.) For those with more experience building/inspecting aircraft have you ever found that bolts installed in platenuts, properly torqued, have loosened or vibrated out? Thanks, George Costigan 40434 Wings ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Steven DiNieri" <capsteve(at)adelphia.net>
Subject: cabin cover hints
Date: May 21, 2006
I threw away the friction disk after about two minutes, I found much better success with a body air saw. Very precise cutting and 24 tooth blade didnt bind. http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=4640677249 19.00 from harbor freight. The blades last about 4feet or so, so get extras. The other benefit is it doesnt toss fiberdust all over the shop. My .02 steve Although we modified out lid a few months ago for the shoulder harnesses, we recently began trimming it to fit the fuselage. In our first attempt we used a compressor and cutoff wheel that supplied only 6 CFM @90 PSI. This was insufficient and resulted in cutting a distance of about 72" in about 90 mins. This morning we used a larger compressor and completed the cut to trim lines for doors, windows, mid side flanges, rear flanges, windscreen flanges and under door flanges. The areas were then sanded with a sanding wheel and belt sander. This mornings work was done in two hours using a few sanding disks and three cutoff wheels. -- ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Fastener Concern
From: "steveadams" <dr_steve_adams(at)yahoo.com>
Date: May 22, 2006
If you are worried about it, either drill the heads or put in bolts with drilled heads and safety wire the bolts. Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=35743#35743 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "John Jessen" <jjessen(at)rcn.com>
Subject: Big Week.
Date: May 22, 2006
Congratulations! Looks great. _____ From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of JSMcGrew(at)aol.com Sent: Sunday, May 21, 2006 1:03 PM Subject: RV10-List: Big Week. This week was something of a big transition for me. I had my last ever flight in an F-15 on Thursday (pictured below after being hosed do wn). And today I moved my RV-10 from my garage out to the hangar. I've been worry ing about how I was going to transport it as most trailers are only 6 feet wide. You can see I used a 4x8 sheet of 5/8 inch plywood strengthened by some 2x8 and 2x4 boards underneath to extend the trailer width out to 8' - perfect for the ge ar. It was easy to load and unload and traveled great. My last day of work for the Air Force is at the end of this week, so I' m a full time airplane builder until I get my plane in the air - hopef ully before I have to go back to school next fall! I'm extra motivated now since I don't get to fly at work anymore... Jim "Scooter" McGrew 40134 Doors and FW forward ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Jeff Carpenter <jeff(at)westcottpress.com>
Subject: Re: Big Week.
Date: May 22, 2006
For years, the RV-6 has been called the poor mans' F-16. I imagine that for most of us (certainly for me) the RV-10 is a big step up. For you, I guess it will have to do. Congratulations on the end of one career and the beginning of another. Jeff Carpenter 40304 N410CF Fuel Tanks On May 21, 2006, at 1:02 PM, JSMcGrew(at)aol.com wrote: > This week was something of a big transition for me. I had my last > ever flight in an F-15 on Thursday (pictured below after being > hosed do wn). And today I moved my RV-10 from my garage out to the > hangar. I've been worry ing about how I was going to transport it > as most trailers are only 6 feet wide. You can see I used a 4x8 > sheet of 5/8 inch plywood strengthened by some 2x8 and 2x4 boards > underneath to extend the trailer width out to 8' - perfect for the > ge ar. It was easy to load and unload and traveled great. > > My last day of work for the Air Force is at the end of this week, > so I' m a full time airplane builder until I get my plane in the > air - hopef ully before I have to go back to school next fall! I'm > extra motivated now since I don't get to fly at work anymore... > > Jim "Scooter" McGrew > 40134 > Doors and FW forward > <133-3370_IMG.JPG> > <133-3400_IMG.JPG> > <134-3420_IMG.JPG> ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: N519RV (40250) just received it's airworthiness today.
Date: May 22, 2006
From: "Doerr, Ray R [NTK]" <Ray.R.Doerr(at)sprint.com>
N519RV (40250) just received it's airworthiness today from Chuck Morris (DAR). I have a IO-540-D4A5 that was rebuilt by America's Aircraft Engines with the Silver Hawk EX fuel injection. My engine data plate was replace with one from America's Aircraft Engine which says Experimental IV, but I still manage to get a 25 hour fly off with the Hartzell blended airfoil prop. The only thing the DAR found was that when the rudder cables are left slack, they tend to rest on the top surface of the 2nd last bulkhead ( the one in which the cables run in the center of), so he suggested that I put a split hose over the top of the bulkhead so when the cables won't rub against the bulkhead. First flight is schedule for Friday May 26th at K34 around 04:00pm. Thank You Ray Doerr ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: What fuel pressure should I see for electric or engine
fuel pump on IO-540 engine.
Date: May 22, 2006
From: "Doerr, Ray R [NTK]" <Ray.R.Doerr(at)sprint.com>
The real problem for the low fuel pressure was the Dynon Sensor Type was set to 1 (Carb Version) instead of 2 (Injected Version). Once I changed this to 2, it is now reading 17.5 PSI at idle. Thank You Ray Doerr 40250 -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Richard Sipp Sent: Friday, May 19, 2006 10:22 PM Subject: Re: RV10-List: What fuel pressure should I see for electric or engine fuel pump on IO-540 engine. The Ops Manual I have lists: inlet to fuel pump min -2 max 35 inlet to fuel injector min 14 max 45 min at idle 12 I think you should see something like 25 psi or so in normal operation. AirFlow Perfomance recommends a boost pump setting a few psi higher than the engine pump pressure to verify its operation on the fuel pressure gauge. It sounds like you may have a gauge or pressure sensor for a carbureted engine. Dick Sipp 40065 ----- Original Message ----- From: "Doerr, Ray R [NTK]" <Ray.R.Doerr(at)sprint.com> Sent: Friday, May 19, 2006 12:09 PM Subject: RV10-List: What fuel pressure should I see for electric or engine fuel pump on IO-540 engine. > > > What fuel pressure should I see for the electric and/or the > engine fuel pump. The Lycoming operators manual talks abour 40 being > the max, but when I run the electric pump I get 6 and when the engine is > running at idle, it is also around 6 with the electric one off. Does > this sound normal for an Injected IO-540? > > > Thank You > Ray Doerr > 40250 (First engine run went great) > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: May 22, 2006
From: Matt Dralle <dralle(at)matronics.com>
Subject: Matronics BBS Forums
Hello Listers, I just wanted to send out a reminder to all of the Listers regarding the new-ish BBS (Bulletin Board System) Forums that are available at Matronics for the Email Lists. The BBS Forums give you Web-based access into the same email content that is generated by the Email Lists. When an email message is posted to any of the email lists, a copy of the message is also copied to the respective List forum section on in the BBS Forums. By the same token, when a message is posted within the BBS Forum interface context, it will also be posted to the respective email list. Basically, the BBS Forums give you yet another method of accessing the Matronics Email List content. Some people prefer email, some prefer web forums; now you can have it either way or both with the Matronics Lists! You'll have to register for a login/password on the BBS Forum to _post_ from the BBS, but you can view message content without registering for an account. To Register for an account, look for the link at the top of the main BBS Forum page entitled "Register". Click on it and follow the instructions. Site Administrator approval will be required (to keep spammers out), but I will try to get these approved in less than 24 hours. If you haven't yet taken a look at the Matronics Email List content over on the BBS Forum, surf on over and take a peek. Its pretty cool. The URL is: http://forums.matronics.com I want to stress that the BBS Forums are simply an adjunct to the existing Matronics Email Lists; another way of viewing and interacting with the Matronics List content. If you like Email, great. If you like Web Forums, great. If you like both, great. Its up to you how you view and create your content. You will also find a URL link at the bottom of this email called Matronics List Features Navigator. You can click on this link at any time to find URL links to all of the other great features available on the Matronics site like the Archive Search Engine, List Browse, List Download, FAQs, Wiki, and lots more. There is a specific Navigator for each Email List and the link for this specific List is shown below. Thanks for all the great list participation and support; it is greatly appreciated! Matt Dralle Matronics Email List Administrator ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "John Gonzalez" <indigoonlatigo(at)msn.com>
Subject: Height of fuselage bottom from floor
Date: May 22, 2006
I am making a jig/fancy table to support the fuselage and tail section in my shop and would like to know the height of the main fuselage bottom to the floor with the gear legs on(No wheels). Reference where the gear leg goes into the fuselage. I know all floors are not level, but also the distance of the bottom of the tail cone, last bulkhead(end), to the floor. With that said, I hopefully will in the end jack up the fuselage and insert the gear legs. Thanks John G. ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "David McNeill" <dlm46007(at)cox.net>
Subject: Re: Height of fuselage bottom from floor
Date: May 22, 2006
I believe you will find that putting the fuselage/tailcone on a sufficiently high table will greatly complicate access to the rest of the fuselage for the build. You might consider a couple of refrigerator dollies under the main spar and padding the loading steps. lifting the fuselage to insert the gear legs should be relatively easy by using a portable crane to attach to the motor mount to lift it. Of course you put the gear on before the wings. ----- Original Message ----- From: "John Gonzalez" <indigoonlatigo(at)msn.com> Sent: Monday, May 22, 2006 3:40 PM Subject: RV10-List: Height of fuselage bottom from floor > > I am making a jig/fancy table to support the fuselage and tail section in > my shop and would like to know the height of the main fuselage bottom to > the floor with the gear legs on(No wheels). Reference where the gear leg > goes into the fuselage. > > I know all floors are not level, but also the distance of the bottom of > the tail cone, last bulkhead(end), to the floor. > > With that said, I hopefully will in the end jack up the fuselage and > insert the gear legs. > > Thanks > > John G. > > > http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List > http://wiki.matronics.com > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Mike Kraus" <n223rv(at)wolflakeairport.net>
Subject: Height of fuselage bottom from floor
Date: May 22, 2006
I had my RV-10 on (2) flat 4 wheel dolly's until it was ready to go up on the gear legs. Then we lifted the front end (by hand) and put a saw horse under the front. Then did the same for the back and slid in the gear legs. No need for a 'crane' and it was very simple. Of course, none of these reply's give you the dimensions you were looking for.... -Mike -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of David McNeill Sent: Monday, May 22, 2006 7:05 PM Subject: Re: RV10-List: Height of fuselage bottom from floor I believe you will find that putting the fuselage/tailcone on a sufficiently high table will greatly complicate access to the rest of the fuselage for the build. You might consider a couple of refrigerator dollies under the main spar and padding the loading steps. lifting the fuselage to insert the gear legs should be relatively easy by using a portable crane to attach to the motor mount to lift it. Of course you put the gear on before the wings. ----- Original Message ----- From: "John Gonzalez" <indigoonlatigo(at)msn.com> Sent: Monday, May 22, 2006 3:40 PM Subject: RV10-List: Height of fuselage bottom from floor > --> > > I am making a jig/fancy table to support the fuselage and tail section > in > my shop and would like to know the height of the main fuselage bottom to > the floor with the gear legs on(No wheels). Reference where the gear leg > goes into the fuselage. > > I know all floors are not level, but also the distance of the bottom > of > the tail cone, last bulkhead(end), to the floor. > > With that said, I hopefully will in the end jack up the fuselage and > insert the gear legs. > > Thanks > > John G. > > > http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List > http://wiki.matronics.com > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "brian bollaert" <bbollaert(at)comcast.net>
Subject: Re: N519RV (40250) just received it's airworthiness today.
Date: May 22, 2006
Hello Ray: Congrats Ray on the sign off ! I have the same IO-540-D4A5 as i think Tim does & many others (any web cams at K34?) anyway have a great time on the 26th . Brian Bollaert #20400 ----- Original Message ----- From: Doerr, Ray R [NTK] To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com Sent: Monday, May 22, 2006 11:02 AM Subject: RV10-List: N519RV (40250) just received it's airworthiness today. N519RV (40250) just received it's airworthiness today from Chuck Morris (DAR). I have a IO-540-D4A5 that was rebuilt by America's Aircraft Engines with the Silver Hawk EX fuel injection. My engine data plate was replace with one from America's Aircraft Engine which says Experimental IV, but I still manage to get a 25 hour fly off with the Hartzell blended airfoil prop. The only thing the DAR found was that when the rudder cables are left slack, they tend to rest on the top surface of the 2nd last bulkhead ( the one in which the cables run in the center of), so he suggested that I put a split hose over the top of the bulkhead so when the cables won't rub against the bulkhead. First flight is schedule for Friday May 26th at K34 around 04:00pm. Thank You Ray Doerr ----- 5/22/2006 ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: UP COMING RV FLY IN
From: "bcondrey" <bob.condrey(at)baesystems.com>
Date: May 22, 2006
I will be there again! Bob #40105 Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=35928#35928 ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: May 22, 2006
From: Deems Davis <deemsdavis(at)cox.net>
Subject: Re: Height of fuselage bottom from floor
I echo Dave's comments. you will want the Fuse fairly low to facilitate all of the work that goes on during it's build. the gear legs don't get added until the finish kit. and everything in the Fuse plans have you reaching over/under the fuse to get to things. I've got mine on some cut-off sawhorses (a la Rick sked) with wheels on them, but if I did it over I'd cut off a couple more inches from the saw-horses. (I'm what you call 'vertically challenged') here's a pic: http://deemsrv10.com/album/Sec%2029%20Fuse%20Side%20Skins/slides/DSC02554.html Deems Davis # 406 Fuse http://deemsrv10.com/ ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Chris , Susie Darcy" <VHMUM(at)bigpond.com>
Subject: Re: Fastener Concern
Date: May 23, 2006
I wouldn't bother.....the load would be minimal so why reinvent the wheel?? Kind regards Chris RV^ and now 10 ----- Original Message ----- From: greerdans(at)aol.com To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com Sent: Monday, May 22, 2006 12:54 PM Subject: RV10-List: Fastener Concern While working on the wings I noticed that that the Aileron Bellcrank Attach Brackets are attached using only two bolts each into platenuts, without any other locking feature. Considering the importance of the Brackets in the Aileron Linkage I'm surprised that they are not riveted or secured with some additional locking feature. Since I'm really just getting into the critical contol linkages and I'm not sure if this is a common design approach that Van's uses throughout the kit or if is it used in aircraft in general?. I wanted to find out if others have other considered this as a potental problem area and have you done anything to improve the design? (loctite, jam nut, etc.) For those with more experience building/inspecting aircraft have you ever found that bolts installed in platenuts, properly torqued, have loosened or vibrated out? Thanks, George Costigan 40434 Wings ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Paul Walter" <pdwalter(at)bigpond.net.au>
Subject: Retractable
Date: May 23, 2006
In read on a web site that a guy in Western Australia is trying to adapt a retratrable undercarraige from a lancair to an RV 10. Not sure how far into this mission he is but if he is sucessfull i'm sure he should be able to squeeze a few more knots out of this thing. Any thoughts ?. As for me I'll just keep working on the empenage. Paul Walter ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Indran Chelvanayagam" <ichelva(at)netspace.net.au>
Subject: Retractable
Date: May 23, 2006
Paul, do you have the website of the alleged Western Australian RV-10 RG builder? I'm only aware of 5 kits (with one flying) in this state. Indran Chelvanayagam _____ From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Paul Walter Sent: Tuesday, 23 May 2006 3:22 PM Subject: RV10-List: Retractable ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: May 23, 2006
From: Deems Davis <deemsdavis(at)cox.net>
Subject: Re: Retractable
I'm suspicious of this rumor. The Lancair IV landing gear is a huge box structure that would not fit into the RV10 fuse (unless you built on an additional drag producing box-like structure on the bottom of the fuse to house it (what's the point?) The 360/Legend gear would require being mounted into the wing structure with several ribs removed/reengineered. Then there's the mater of the nose gear, where would you stow it? Not to mention the significant change that this would produce in the locations of the wheels and the rotation moments for landing/takeoff and the almost total rework of the engine mount, exhaust, and induction. There are better solutions for an RG than the -10. Deems Davis # 406 Fuse http://deemsrv10.com/ ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: May 23, 2006
From: Chris W <3edcft6(at)cox.net>
Subject: Re: Retractable
It's my understanding that in a 200 mph airplane, if you can do retracts with out adding too much weight, the best you are going to see is 15 knots. From what I have heard, you are very lucky to get that. It seems until you have a plane that files closer to 300 mph, retracts aren't worth the trouble. -- Chris W KE5GIX ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Indran Chelvanayagam" <ichelva(at)netspace.net.au>
Subject: Retractable
Date: May 24, 2006
Paul - any chance of pointing us to the website you mentioned? As far as I'm aware, there are only 5 RV10 kits (one flying) in Western Australia. Would be good to contact another builder, especially if he's making serious mods. Might also be able to post some photos on the list! Indran Chelvanayagam Paul Walter wrote: > In read on a web site that a guy in Western Australia is trying to > adapt a retratrable undercarraige from a lancair to an RV 10. Not sure > how far into this mission he is but if he is sucessfull i'm sure he > should be able to squeeze a few more knots out of this thing. Any > thoughts ?. As for me I'll just keep working on the empenage. > > Paul Walter ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Weather capabilities and severe turblance
From: "Jon Reining" <jonathan.w.reining(at)wellsfargo.com>
Date: May 23, 2006
I flew down to Mexico from Oakland, CA this weekend with a friend in his Cherokee 180 with my brother to celebrate his bachelor party on the beach at Alfonsina's to drink beer, fish, and relax. Alfonsina's is just south of San Felipe on the Baja Peninsula, about a 2,500' dirt strip paralleling the beach, great relaxing spot. On our way home, we stopped in Calexico to clear customs and get our weather briefing. It showed some light scattered storms in the Bay Area, and we'd probably have to file on the way home depending on how it looked. About 75-80 miles out, we could see buildup over the hills, called up flight service and got a weather briefing, didn't look all too bad, but we couldn't make it in VFR so we filed IFR, received our pop-up, and were headed in at 8,000'. We were soon in IMC, no big deal, pretty easy sailing, when all of a sudden we hit a thunderstorm and encountered severe turblance and very near loss of control of the airplane. We would be up 100', down 200', 45 degrees to the right, then quickly snapped to 45 degrees to the left, our maximum bank angle was probably 60 degrees at one point. Our attitude and altitude were all over the place. This lasted for a full two minutes. ATC gave us clearance to descend to 4000' and maneuver to the north. My friend, CFI/CFII, did a great job and instinctively reduced power, gave full carb heat (it was only +2C outside and raining but no sign of icing), and did a great job getting us out of there. It was a really tough spot, one that I hope to never be in again. After we got out, ATC announced that the weather capabilities of his radar were down. In light of all this, I'm starting to give lots of thought to the capabilities of the various weather alternatives for the RV10 panel. In other words, if ATC can't tell us when we're headed for trouble, what is available to us so that we can see it ourself? Is XM weather dependant on air traffic control's weather radar? Would we still get weather in the cockpit if their's is out? Since there was no lightning that I could see or hear, would a strike finder have detected that? Short of an on-board radar, what are our options? Also, we were planning on going with the Chelton's and I can definately see how that would be nice to know, even if its synthetic vision, what the ground looks like. Can XM weather be displayed on the Chelton? Jon Reining 40514 (along with my dad) working on elevators, QB wings and fuse just showed up (and thinking of weather capabilities) Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=36025#36025 ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: May 23, 2006
From: pilotdds(at)aol.com
Subject: Brake master cylinders
Is anyone willing to comment on the master cylinders.It seems there should be some sort of external return spring around the actuating shafts.I notice some dragging when towing. ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: May 23, 2006
Subject: Re: Weather capabilities and severe turblance
From: Dj Merrill <deej(at)deej.net>
> > > In light of all this, I'm starting to give lots of thought to the > capabilities of the various weather alternatives for the RV10 panel. > In other words, if ATC can't tell us when we're headed for trouble, > what is available to us so that we can see it ourself? Is XM weather > dependant on air traffic control's weather radar? Would we still get > weather > You may consider looking into ADS-B. It does not cover all of the US yet, but it will over the next several years. Up front equipment costs, but no monthly or other subscription fees for traffic and weather information. The equipment is really expensive right now, but I hope it comes down by the time I need to buy to install. http://www.adsb.gov/ http://www.ads-b.com/ -Dj ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Albert Gardner" <ibspud(at)adelphia.net>
Subject: Weather capabilities and severe turbulence
Date: May 23, 2006
Although I learned to fly in Idaho where there was weather as well as high terrain now almost all my flying is in the Southwest except for occasional trips North. A trip from Reno to Yuma last Wed. afternoon (trying to get home before the Presidential TFR Thursday) had me dodging much weather. My Anywhere Map with XM weather worked very well. You can select various weather displays but Nexrad, TAFS, and winds aloft are very useful in flight. One very nice feature of ControlVisions's Anywhere Map is that the cost of monthly updates is much less than most others and it does a good job of driving my Navaid. The display is small but I mounted it on the side instead of on the panel. For about $2K it's more than adequate for VFR flying. Albert Gardner 40-422 Yuma, AZ ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: May 23, 2006
From: Eric Panning <ericmpmail-rv10(at)yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: Weather capabilities and severe turblance - pilot account
The pilot also had a write up on the Cherokee Chat board: "This weekend I flew my plane with a couple of friends down to Alfonsina's for a batchelor party weekend. We left OAK Thursday night, overnighted in Calexico and made it to Alfonsina's by noon on Friday. We spent that afternoon, and all day Saturday fishing, playing in the beautiful warm water, eating great food and consuming mass quantities of ice cold beer. We were in the air at 8 AM this morning and screamed back up to the border with the help of a 15-20 Kt tailwind. After breakfast and a weather brief at Calexico, we launched into uncertain conditions over Southern California, the High Desert and the Central Valley. A late season storm was approaching from the southwest, very moist and unstable, with winds aloft from the south at 25-50 Kts. Things were actually quite doable over Southern California, and I was enjoying the 30 Kt push towards home. We were able to punch through a line of showers NW of Bakersfield while maintaining VFR, but there was another band of precip that was plopped over the last 100 miles of the route. FSS advised me that there were multiple layers from 2000 to FL200, light scattered rain showers and the freezing level was around 9000 ft. Pilot reports weren't indicating anything too scary, and most of the reports were light rime icing at 12000 Ft. Since I didn't want to scud-run into OAK, I filed in the air and got direct Panoche VOR, direct OAK at 8000. Easy, straightworward, straight-in to the ILS for 27R. We went into the goo about 25-30 miles south of Panoche, and I was enjoying the challenge of hand-flying my plane in real IFR, with the temps about 2 C. Things were going along just fine until we were about 20 miles northwest of Panoche on V-301, when it was as if somebody had turned on a blender and we were in it! The instrument panel was an incomprehensible blur. It was the most severe turbulence I've ever been in, and we were in solid IMC. We must have flown into an imbedded thunderstorm, and Center didn't have it on their radar. I could barely control the plane. I immediately informed Center of the situation and they gave me a turn to the North and a descent to 6000 ft. I fought with the plane to maintain control, just to keep the wings somewhere near level and the airspeed in the green while descending towards the Central Valley and lower terrain. I kept telling myself not to give up... Just fly the plane. It took me about 2 or 3 minutes to get down to 6000, but we were still in IMC, though the turbulence had eased a bit. We were cleared to 4000, and began to descend again. At 5500 I was head down, on the gages when by friend Jon called ground in sight, and at 4900 we were completely clear of the base of a very angry-looking black cloud mass. I told Center we were clear and he immediately issued an Airmet for severe turbulence in the area, and began deviating 3 other aircraft that were in-trail around the area I encountered the turbulence. At that point I heard him mention something about their weather radar capability being INOP at the time... So I guess that made me the canary in the coal mine. Anyway, we made it into OAK with little fuss after dodging a couple of showers near Livermore. 3 hours block time CXL to OAK with a little excitement thrown in for good measure. Moral of story? No good deed goes unpunished? S#!t happens? How about "Do not give up on the airplane!"? Truly, one of the thoughts that went through my mind as I was struggling to maintain control of the the plane was "My wife is gonna kill me if I die now and ruin our Italian vacation plans!" I'm very happy to be alive, and to be able to write this down for your perusal. Stay safe." The Cherokee Board also discussed the XM weather and the 396. What wasn't clear was if weather was down locally for ATC or west coast. I use avwx.net on a blackberry for ground planning and it's Nexrad service was down on Sunday in the NW. NWS radar was still up and running (can also download to blackberry). Lot's of reasons not to rely on ATC for weather - see www.avweb.com and ATC columns. Eric 40150 Working on center section of fuselage ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Chris , Susie Darcy" <VHMUM(at)bigpond.com>
Subject: Re: Brake master cylinders
Date: May 24, 2006
Not sure what you mean dragging when towing?? There are no external springs. Check your nut are not to tight on pedal Chris ----- Original Message ----- From: pilotdds(at)aol.com To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com Sent: Wednesday, May 24, 2006 3:48 AM Subject: RV10-List: Brake master cylinders Is anyone willing to comment on the master cylinders.It seems there should be some sort of external return spring around the actuating shafts.I notice some dragging when towing. ________________________________________________________________________________
From: LIKE2LOOP(at)aol.com
Date: May 23, 2006
Subject: Re: Brake master cylinders
In a message dated 5/23/2006 1:51:35 PM Eastern Standard Time, pilotdds(at)aol.com writes: It seems there should be some sort of external return spring around the actuating shafts.I notice some dragging when towing. The brakes on my C-170 are the same, they don't spring open, and will touch ever so slightly against the disks..... but in the air, the wheels are not turning! As the pads wear, the contact often lightens up when the brakes are NOT applied. Not a major issue. Steve Stephen G. Blank,DDS RV-10 #40499 Finishing the HS Cessna 170b Flyer Port St Lucie, FL 772-475-5556 cell ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Jack Sargeant" <k5wiv(at)amsat.org>
Subject: Brake master cylinders
Date: May 23, 2006
All disc brakes depend on the minute wobble in the rotors to push the pucks back when released. I've never seen any with return springs, and I don't think that springs on the master cylinders would help either. Jack & Cecilia Sargeant 1127 Patricia St. Wichita, KS 67208-2642 316/682-5268 -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of LIKE2LOOP(at)aol.com Sent: Tuesday, May 23, 2006 4:30 PM To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com Subject: Re: RV10-List: Brake master cylinders In a message dated 5/23/2006 1:51:35 PM Eastern Standard Time, pilotdds @aol.com writes: The brakes on my C-170 are the same, they don' t spring open, and will touch ever so slightly against the disks..... but in the air, the wheels are not turning! As the pads wear, the contact of ten lightens up when the brakes are NOT applied. Not a major issue. Steve Stephen G. Blank,DDS RV-10 #40499 &n bsp; Finishing the HS Cessna 170b Flyer Port St Lucie, FL 772-475-5556 cell ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Belue, Kevin" <KBelue@drs-tem.com>
Subject: Brake master cylinders
Date: May 24, 2006
When I finished my RV-6A, I noticed a lot of times that it was harder to push it in the hangar than it should be. One day when it was fairly hard to move, I pulled back on the tops of the brake pedals and then it moved much easier. After more experimentation, I found that a lot of times the master cylinders were not returning completing, causing the brakes to drag. I took the canopy release spring that I didn't use when building the plane and cut it in half, stretched it some, and put one on the shaft outside of each master cylinder. That fixed the brake dragging and it has been easy to move since then. I've made this modification to other RVs with similar results. I'm not flying my RV-10 yet so I haven't tried it there, but the brakes are essentially the same as the RV-6A, so I would expect similar results. Kevin D. Belue RV-6A flying RV-10 canopy top _____ From: Jack Sargeant [mailto:k5wiv(at)amsat.org] Sent: Tuesday, May 23, 2006 8:20 PM Subject: RE: RV10-List: Brake master cylinders All disc brakes depend on the minute wobble in the rotors to push the pucks back when released. I've never seen any with return springs, and I don't think that springs on the master cylinders would help either. Jack & Cecilia Sargeant 1127 Patricia St. Wichita, KS 67208-2642 316/682-5268 -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of LIKE2LOOP(at)aol.com Sent: Tuesday, May 23, 2006 4:30 PM Subject: Re: RV10-List: Brake master cylinders In a message dated 5/23/2006 1:51:35 PM Eastern Standard Time, pilotdds @aol.com writes: The brakes on my C-170 are the same, they don' t spring open, and will touch ever so slightly against the disks..... but in the air, the wheels are not turning! As the pads wear, the contact of ten lightens up when the brakes are NOT applied. Not a major issue. Steve Stephen G. Blank,DDS RV-10 #40499 &n bsp; Finishing the HS Cessna 170b Flyer Port St Lucie, FL 772-475-5556 cell http://www.w3.org/TR/REC-html40">

When I finished my RV-6A, I noticed a lot of times that it was harder to push it in the hangar than it should be. One day when it was fairly hard to move, I pulled back on the tops of the brake pedals and then it moved much easier. After more experimentation, I found that a lot of times the master cylinders were not returning completing, causing the brakes to drag. I took the canopy release spring that I didn't use when building the plane and cut it in half, stretched it some, and put one on the shaft outside of each master cylinder. That fixed the brake dragging and it has been easy to move since then. I've made this modification to other RVs with similar results. I'm not flying my RV-10 yet so I haven't tried it there, but the brakes are essentially the same as the RV-6A, so I would expect similar results.

Kevin D. Belue

RV-6A flying

RV-10 canopy top

From: Jack Sargeant [mailto:k5wiv(at)amsat.org]
Sent: Tuesday, May 23, 2006 8:20 PM
To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com
Subject: RE: RV10-List: Brake master cylinders

All disc brakes depend on the minute wobble in the rotors to push the pucks back when released. I've never seen any with return springs, and I don't think that springs on the master cylinders would help either.

Jack & Cecilia Sargeant
1127 Patricia St.
Wichita, KS 67208-2642
316/682-5268

-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of LIKE2LOOP(at)aol.com
Sent: Tuesday, May 23, 2006 4:30 PM
To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com
Subject: Re: RV10-List: Brake master cylinders

In a message dated 5/23/2006 1:51:35 PM Eastern Standard Time, pilotdds @aol.com writes:

The brakes on my C-170 are the same, they don' t spring open, and will touch ever so slightly against the disks..... but in the air, the wheels are not turning! As the pads wear, the contact of ten lightens up when the brakes are NOT applied. Not a major issue.

Steve

Stephen G. Blank,DDS
RV-10 #40499 &n bsp; Finishing the HS
Cessna 170b Flyer

Port St Lucie, FL
772-475-5556 cell

________________________________________________________________________________
From: JSMcGrew(at)AOL.COM
Date: May 24, 2006
Subject: RV-10 Tow Bar
My quest for a tow bar that works with my RV-10 continues. If anyone can point me in the right direction, I would appreciate it. The only thing mentioned in the archives is one from Coss Aviation from South Africa and a couple general references to Bracket Aircraft and Aircraft Spruce. Does anyone have a specific part number of one that works? The Universal Tow bar from Aircraft Spruce (part #13-02250) does NOT work. I'm sending it back and going to try again... -Jim McGrew 40134 ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: RV-10 Tow Bar
Date: May 24, 2006
From: "Condrey, Bob (US SSA)" <bob.condrey(at)baesystems.com>
Bogert has one specifically made for the RV-10 that seems to work fine. For some reason Spruce doesn't list it though http://www.bogert-av.com/bogi-bars.php model #4-RV10; $84 Bob #40105 _____ My quest for a tow bar that works with my RV-10 continues. If anyone ca n point me in the right direction, I would appreciate it. The only thing mentioned in the archives is one from Coss Aviation from South Africa and a couple general references to Bracket Aircraft and Aircraft Spruce. Does anyo ne have a specific part number of one that works? The Universal Tow bar from Aircraft Spruce (part #13-02250) does NOT wo rk. I'm sending it back and going to try again... -Jim McGrew 40134 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Bruce Case" <pioneer(at)choiceonemail.com>
Subject: Horizontal Stabilizer Riveting
Date: May 24, 2006
When I cleco the horizontal stabilizer together with just the leading edge ribs and the plywood form blocks there is a lot of stress on the ribs to the point where the HS is somewhat distorted. Has anyone done anything additional before putting in the rivets on the leading edge ribs? I am concerned about the airfoil shape. I was thinking of pro-sealing the leading edge ribs in place with the the main spar clecoed in and then going back and riveting in the leading edge ribs after the pro-seal has dried and I can remove the main spar. Bruce Case #40446 ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: RV-10 Tow Bar
Date: May 24, 2006
From: "Doerr, Ray R [NTK]" <Ray.R.Doerr(at)sprint.com>
This is the one I use for my RV-9 and RV-10. Works great on both planes. It's from Aircraft Spruce. 4-RVA RVA Style with Nose Wheel 13-01811 $78.75 Thank You Ray Doerr CDNI Principal Engineer -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of JSMcGrew(at)aol.com Sent: Wednesday, May 24, 2006 8:24 AM Subject: RV10-List: RV-10 Tow Bar ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: RV-10 Tow Bar
Date: May 24, 2006
From: "Doerr, Ray R [NTK]" <Ray.R.Doerr(at)sprint.com>
This is the one I use for my RV-9 and RV-10. Works great on both planes. It's from Aircraft Spruce part # 13-01811 (RVA Style with Nose Wheel) Thank You Ray Doerr -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of JSMcGrew(at)aol.com Sent: Wednesday, May 24, 2006 8:24 AM Subject: RV10-List: RV-10 Tow Bar ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: May 24, 2006
From: pilotdds(at)aol.com
Subject: Re: RV-10 Tow Bar
I have been using a tow bar from a c-210.Works great -----Original Message----- From: JSMcGrew(at)aol.com Subject: RV10-List: RV-10 Tow Bar My quest for a tow bar that works with my RV-10 continues. If anyone ca n point me in the right direction, I would appreciate it. The only thing mentioned in the archives is one from Coss Aviation from South Africa and a couple general references to Bracket Aircraft and Aircraft Spruce. Does anyo ne have a specific part number of one that works? The Universal Tow bar from Aircraft Spruce (part #13-02250) does NOT wo rk. I'm sending it back and going to try again... -Jim McGrew 40134 ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: May 24, 2006
From: pilotdds(at)aol.com
Subject: Re: RV-10 Tow Bar
I will get part number this weekend. -----Original Message----- From: JSMcGrew(at)aol.com Subject: RV10-List: RV-10 Tow Bar My quest for a tow bar that works with my RV-10 continues. If anyone ca n point me in the right direction, I would appreciate it. The only thing mentioned in the archives is one from Coss Aviation from South Africa and a couple general references to Bracket Aircraft and Aircraft Spruce. Does anyo ne have a specific part number of one that works? The Universal Tow bar from Aircraft Spruce (part #13-02250) does NOT wo rk. I'm sending it back and going to try again... -Jim McGrew 40134 ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: May 24, 2006
From: Tim Olson <Tim(at)MyRV10.com>
Subject: Re: RV-10 Tow Bar
Here's some new Towbar comments: (Old) The RVA towbar from Aircraft Spruce does indeed work fine on the RV-10. I have one. When you first buy it, you can use it on the 10 nosewheel on the axle area. After you add wheel fairings, you'll cut 3/4" off the towbar pinchers and use it on some other capscrews. But, it works just fine. I see they now offer an RV-10 version, but I'm sure there's not a lot different...it's probably just pre-cut. You should ask them. (New) In search of a nice rudder gust lock, I created one that works really well. I spoke with Bogerts about it to see if they'd be interested in making it a product of theirs that would save builders having to build one. The RV-10 does definitely need a rudder gust lock. This progressed into a bit larger project, where we are trying to come up with a Towbar/Gust-Lock that will do everything you would ever want...it would be a towbar, and with a couple of attachments it would also serve as a rudder, AND aileron/elevator gust lock. I don't have a timeline for when you could see a finished product. I do have some photos of my rudder gust-lock only that I made. It works really great, but means I have to have 2 things hauled in the tail on long trips. More to come... Tim Olson - RV-10 N104CD - Flying Condrey, Bob (US SSA) wrote: > Bogert has one specifically made for the RV-10 that seems to work fine. > For some reason Spruce doesnt list it though > > http://www.bogert-av.com/ bogi-bars.php > <http://www.bogert-av.com/bogi-bars.php> > > model #4-RV10; $84 > Bob #40105 > > > My quest for a tow bar that works with my RV-10 continues. If anyone ca > n point me in the right direction, I would appreciate it. The only thing > mentioned in the archives is one from Coss Aviation from South Africa > and a couple general references to Bracket Aircraft and Aircraft Spruce. > Does anyo ne have a specific part number of one that works? > > The Universal Tow bar from Aircraft Spruce (part #13-02250) does NOT wo > rk. I'm sending it back and going to try again... > > -Jim McGrew > > 40134 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Mark Ritter" <mritter509(at)msn.com>
Subject: Re: RV-10 Tow Bar
Date: May 24, 2006
--- MIME Errors - No Plain-Text Section Found --- A message with no text/plain MIME section was received. The entire body of the message was removed. Please resend the email using Plain Text formatting. HOTMAIL is notorious for only including an HTML section in their client's default configuration. If you're using HOTMAIL, please see your email application's settings and switch to a default mail option that uses "Plain Text". --- MIME Errors No Plain-Text Section Found --- ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: May 24, 2006
From: "Rob Kermanj" <flysrv10(at)gmail.com>
Subject: Re: RV-10 Tow Bar
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From: RobHickman(at)aol.com
Date: May 24, 2006
Subject: Re: Retractable
My neighbor just insured his Cessna 210 with retracts - - $2,400 a year for $100,000 Hull He has 800 hours and VFR only Rob Hickman ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Bruce Case" <pioneer(at)choiceonemail.com>
Subject: Re: Retractable
Date: May 24, 2006
I fly both an Archer and Piper Arrow. Annual insurance on the Archer is $1200, on the Arrow it is $2000. Bruce Case #40446 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: LIKE2LOOP(at)aol.com
Date: May 24, 2006
Subject: Re: Horizontal Stabilizer Riveting
In a message dated 5/24/06 10:02:58 A.M. Eastern Daylight Time, pioneer(at)choiceonemail.com writes: Has anyone done anything additional before putting in the rivets on the leading edge ribs? i held the skins together at the trailing edge with rubber tipped spring clamps a foot or two away from where i was rivetting. This kept them from bending wide open and kept the skin in close contact to the tip ribs, be careful to not crease the metal with hard clamps. I need to rivet the aft spar to place and my HS is done! Steve Stephen Blank RV-10 Builder #40499 / C-170B flyer 766 SE River Lane Port St. Lucie, FL 34983 772-475-5556 cell ________________________________________________________________________________
From: GenGrumpy(at)aol.com
Date: May 24, 2006
Subject: avionics panel offer
For those still thinking about a panel, check this out. I bought the overhead console Tony showed down at Sun n Fun, and he is making an offer for any -10 builder. Just wanted to pass this along to the crowd. grumpy Tony Sustare Accuracy Avionics I realize you've made plans for your panel, but if you know of anyone getting close please let them know I'm ready to work a deal for anyone willing to have their panel displayed at Oshkosh. I'd rather build a panel for a customer than to build one to disassemble! I'll make it worth his while. Phone: 541-350-2168 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "John Lenhardt" <av8or(at)cox.net>
Subject: Re: Retractable
Date: May 24, 2006
This is an interesting thread, but there may be one flaw in the assumptions.....namely that you could get insurance! John #40262 ----- Original Message ----- From: Bruce Case To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com Sent: Wednesday, May 24, 2006 5:25 PM Subject: Re: RV10-List: Retractable I fly both an Archer and Piper Arrow. Annual insurance on the Archer is $1200, on the Arrow it is $2000. Bruce Case #40446 ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: May 25, 2006
From: Dan Masys <dmasys(at)cox.net>
Subject: Re: Retractable
---- David Maib wrote: > Don't get me wrong, the > Bonanza is an awesome airplane, but less complexity and similar > performance are very attractive to me now. Had a fun experience last weekend. Flew the -7A to Columbus Ohio (CMH) and landed at Lane Aviation, where there were acres of Bonanzas and Barons on the ramp, and a one day Beechcraft pilot proficiency refresher course in progress. A couple of the Beech drivers struck up a conversation with me about that 'cute little homebuilt". They were more or less in gloat mode until I told them that cute little homebuilt had a 75% cruise of 175kts and a service ceiling of 25,000 feet on 11 gph. Got very quiet, except for a quietly uttered 'cripes!'. -Dan Masys #40448 wiring & systems installation ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: May 25, 2006
From: Dan Masys <dmasys(at)cox.net>
Subject: Retractable
---- John Jessen wrote: >If someone came up to me and said he'd gladly sell > his pristine 33A to me for what I'm likely to put into the 10, it's be a > hard choice to turn him down. A beautiful airplane. A 33A I could walk away from. An A-36 for the price of an RV-10, now that would be a conversation :-). But even then, the balance tips in favor of the homebuilt in my mind due to that FAA repairman's card you're going to have in your pocket after you get this puppy airborne. It'll always be a project, and you can put as much or as little time and money into it as you like, without worrying every year about a multi-kilobucks surprise at an annual inspection. Playing with your airplane includes playing with its systems configurations, adding new gadgets, etc. In that regard it is a much better boy toy than any spam can. -Dan Masys ________________________________________________________________________________
From: GRANSCOTT(at)aol.com
Date: May 25, 2006
Subject: Re: Retractable
In a message dated 5/25/06 10:58:45 A.M. Eastern Daylight Time, jjessen(at)rcn.com writes: pristine 33A to me for what I'm likely to put into the 10, it's be a hard choice to turn him down. A beautiful airplane John until the first time you needed to buy a part or a decal from the factory...yipes...expensive stuff... Patrick do not achive ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: paint
From: "Jim & Julie Wade" <jwadejr(at)hughes.net>
Date: May 25, 2006
Just out of the paint booth!!!! Jim & Julie Wade 40383 Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=36444#36444 Attachments: http://forums.matronics.com//files/pict0563_180.jpg ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Baggage door organizer
From: "Jim & Julie Wade" <jwadejr(at)hughes.net>
Date: May 25, 2006
Sent this idea to Abby at Flightline Interiors and she made this for us. By the way, her work is outstanding. Her interior for the RV10 can't be beat. Jim & Julie 40383 Slowbuild kit Planning to make Oshkosh!!!! Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=36445#36445 Attachments: http://forums.matronics.com//files/pict0569_944.jpg ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: May 25, 2006
From: Michael Wellenzohn <michael(at)wellenzohn.net>
Subject: Picture series of building the rudder trailing edge
Hello everybody, I found several descriptions on how to glue the rudder trailing edge but never found any pictures. On my page http://www.wellenzohn.net you'll find a couple pictures of how I did it based on descriptions I found in this list (Thanks to all of you!) Michael #511 (rudder) www.wellenzohn.net Switzerland ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "John Dunne" <acs(at)acspropeller.com.au>
Subject: paint
Date: May 26, 2006
Very nice paint job and design! I also like your baggage door organizer and having purchased an interior complete from Abby, couldn't agree more about her great service and how painless it was dealing with her from the other side of the globe. John 40315 -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Jim & Julie Wade Sent: Friday, 26 May 2006 6:47 AM Subject: RV10-List: paint Just out of the paint booth!!!! Jim & Julie Wade 40383 Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=36444#36444 Attachments: http://forums.matronics.com//files/pict0563_180.jpg ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Retractable
Date: May 25, 2006
From: "Robin Marks" <robin(at)mrmoisture.com>
>Wing loading on the Bonanza makes them a much more enjoyable ride in the bump and grind. Other than that, one can have as much speed, more room, and lower costs. Don't forget the ability to put exactly what electronics you wish in your -10 to take advantage of the latest in technology which I am convinced will make us safer pilots with respect to weather, traffic, detailed GPS navigation, terrain etc. Don't take this the wrong way, I love my Bonanza but the thought of a certified panel upgrade to state of the art displays sends chills down my bankers spine. Also note a late model Bonanza is still 20 years old. Now back to the original reason for this post; I have personally taken a solemn pledge to never again purchase a retract (unless one winks at me extra sexy like). The cost of gear maintenance can come close to matching the entire balance of aircraft maintenance before considering the weight consequence or insurance. With today's modern fairings the drag penalty is relatively small even for guys like me with the extra weenie wheel. In my limited piloting experience (6 planes) I believe performance, safety, comfort and VALUE are all on the side of experimental builders (assuming one follows the plans). Robin do not achive ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: May 25, 2006
From: Deems Davis <deemsdavis(at)cox.net>
Subject: Andair Fuel Valve Install
I know there has been a lot of discussion about the install of these valves and interference with heater duct. in my mind it was a foregone conclusion to move the valve down to the bottom of the tunnel. However, I took some measurements and figured that It should be possible to mount it above similar to the plans. I just finished the install and was able to get it installed pretty much per the plans (intake nozzles are fwd rather then aft), and did not have to resort to an extension. My valve is the one Van's sells through his store, and today I picked up some #10 Scat to verify that everything is going to fit OK. Looks like this will work. Another Country heard from. Some write up on my site: http://deemsrv10.com/fuelsystemlogindex.html and more pictures also: http://deemsrv10.com/album/Sec%2037%20Fuel%20System/index.html Deems Davis # 406 Fuse http://deemsrv10.com/ ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Cal Hoffman" <cehoffman(at)bellsouth.net>
Subject: Throttle Quadrant
Date: May 25, 2006
Does anyone have the installation instructions (options) for Van's throttle/mixture/prop quadrant? Mine came without any paperwork and I haven't been able to locate them. Cal Hoffman #40119 (Canoe) ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: May 25, 2006
From: Tim Olson <Tim(at)MyRV10.com>
Subject: Re: Andair Fuel Valve Install
Deems, I've got 2 questions, and I'm not trying to be negative in any way... 1) Have you moved your controls and pushrods through full travel and do they clear the SCAT tube, or will that elevator cross tube rub the SCAT? 2) Aren't you a bit worried that you have a hot air duct running directly through your fuel lines and valve area? That was one of my larger concerns as any added temperature to those lines will only add to the vapor lock possibilities. At any rate, the valve you have is nicer than mine....that one wasn't available in the past, those 90 degree built in fittings haven't been around that long. Tim Olson - RV-10 N104CD - Flying Deems Davis wrote: > > I know there has been a lot of discussion about the install of these > valves and interference with heater duct. in my mind it was a foregone > conclusion to move the valve down to the bottom of the tunnel. However, > I took some measurements and figured that It should be possible to mount > it above similar to the plans. I just finished the install and was > able to get it installed pretty much per the plans (intake nozzles are > fwd rather then aft), and did not have to resort to an extension. My > valve is the one Van's sells through his store, and today I picked up > some #10 Scat to verify that everything is going to fit OK. Looks like > this will work. > > Another Country heard from. > > Some write up on my site: http://deemsrv10.com/fuelsystemlogindex.html > > and more pictures also: > http://deemsrv10.com/album/Sec%2037%20Fuel%20System/index.html > > Deems Davis # 406 > Fuse > http://deemsrv10.com/ > > > > > > http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List > http://wiki.matronics.com > > > > > > > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Mark Carey" <markacarey(at)msn.com>
Subject: Andair Fuel Valve Install
Date: May 25, 2006
I just bit the bullet and went along with my partners slight offset from center. >From: Deems Davis <deemsdavis(at)cox.net> >Reply-To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com >To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com >Subject: RV10-List: Andair Fuel Valve Install >Date: Thu, 25 May 2006 17:38:17 -0700 > > >I know there has been a lot of discussion about the install of these valves >and interference with heater duct. in my mind it was a foregone conclusion >to move the valve down to the bottom of the tunnel. However, I took some >measurements and figured that It should be possible to mount it above >similar to the plans. I just finished the install and was able to get it >installed pretty much per the plans (intake nozzles are fwd rather then >aft), and did not have to resort to an extension. My valve is the one Van's >sells through his store, and today I picked up some #10 Scat to verify that >everything is going to fit OK. Looks like this will work. > >Another Country heard from. > >Some write up on my site: http://deemsrv10.com/fuelsystemlogindex.html > >and more pictures also: >http://deemsrv10.com/album/Sec%2037%20Fuel%20System/index.html > >Deems Davis # 406 >Fuse >http://deemsrv10.com/ > > >http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List >http://wiki.matronics.com > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: May 25, 2006
From: Deems Davis <deemsdavis(at)cox.net>
Subject: Re: Andair Fuel Valve Install
I temp installed the elev cross tube to ensure there was no interference and it looks to be OK. Frankly, I don't expect to be running heat to the rear seats that often, but your point is well taken, I might just encase the fuel lines (all of them in the tunnel) in some firesleeve or some other split/insulating material to guard against the vapor lock concern. THANKS Deems Tim Olson wrote: > > Deems, > > I've got 2 questions, and I'm not trying to be negative in any way... > > 1) Have you moved your controls and pushrods through full travel and > do they clear the SCAT tube, or will that elevator cross tube rub > the SCAT? > > 2) Aren't you a bit worried that you have a hot air duct running > directly through your fuel lines and valve area? That was one of > my larger concerns as any added temperature to those lines will > only add to the vapor lock possibilities. > > At any rate, the valve you have is nicer than mine....that one > wasn't available in the past, those 90 degree built in fittings > haven't been around that long. > > > Tim Olson - RV-10 N104CD - Flying > > > Deems Davis wrote: > >> >> I know there has been a lot of discussion about the install of these >> valves and interference with heater duct. in my mind it was a >> foregone conclusion to move the valve down to the bottom of the >> tunnel. However, I took some measurements and figured that It should >> be possible to mount it above similar to the plans. I just finished >> the install and was able to get it installed pretty much per the >> plans (intake nozzles are fwd rather then aft), and did not have to >> resort to an extension. My valve is the one Van's sells through his >> store, and today I picked up some #10 Scat to verify that everything >> is going to fit OK. Looks like this will work. >> >> Another Country heard from. >> >> Some write up on my site: http://deemsrv10.com/fuelsystemlogindex.html >> >> and more pictures also: >> http://deemsrv10.com/album/Sec%2037%20Fuel%20System/index.html >> >> Deems Davis # 406 >> Fuse >> http://deemsrv10.com/ >> >> >> >> >> >> http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List >> http://wiki.matronics.com >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> > > > http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List > http://wiki.matronics.com > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: May 26, 2006
From: Tom Gesele <tgesele(at)optonline.net>
Subject: Fiberglass panel options
For those who went with one of the after-market fiberglass panels available, were there any modifications required in the upper fwd fuselage assembly? Also, is there a rough guesstimate of the difference in weight between the fiberglass and stock panel? Thanks, Tom Gesele #473 - Fuselage ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Fuselage Firewall Gotchas?
Date: May 26, 2006
From: "Chris Johnston" <CJohnston(at)popsound.com>
Hey all - I'm just about to get started on the firewall section of the fuse (initial assembly) and I wondered about any gotchas in this area. I don't have the engine yet, and I'm concerned about opening up holes (or not closing them) when I don't yet have the hardware that goes in there. I've never built an airplane before, and I don't have a very good mental picture of all the ins and outs of aircraft engines. I'm using the standard IO540 so there shouldn't be any nuttiness, but as I got ready to open up the holes for the control cables, I got nervous. Any info would be appreciated. Thanks cj ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: May 26, 2006
From: Rick <ricksked(at)earthlink.net>
Subject: Re: Fuselage Firewall Gotchas?
CJ, Don't open the holes in the recess if you are planning on doing the throttle quadrant. Tim Olson I think said he had to close his off and use different routing for the cable due to the quadrant. Use your C-frame to rivet all the 470-4 rivets...it will save you lots of heartache over bucking the rivets. That's all I have for you, I'm sure others will have some more. Rick S. 40185 Fuse/finish ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Mike Lauritsen - Work" <mike(at)cleavelandtool.com>
Subject: Fuselage Firewall Gotchas?
Date: May 26, 2006
For those just starting the fuse. The c-frame with the cupped set in the bottom, and the long backrivet set in the top is your best friend for all the sub-assemblies (as mentioned below). I even prefer it over the squeezer when noise is not an issue. Mike Lauritsen Cleaveland Aircraft Tool 2225 First St. Boone, Iowa 50036 515-432-6794 mike(at)cleavelandtool.com -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Rick Sent: Friday, May 26, 2006 11:42 AM Subject: Re: RV10-List: Fuselage Firewall Gotchas? CJ, Don't open the holes in the recess if you are planning on doing the throttle quadrant. Tim Olson I think said he had to close his off and use different routing for the cable due to the quadrant. Use your C-frame to rivet all the 470-4 rivets...it will save you lots of heartache over bucking the rivets. That's all I have for you, I'm sure others will have some more. Rick S. 40185 Fuse/finish ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: May 26, 2006
From: Rick <ricksked(at)earthlink.net>
Subject: Fuselage Firewall Gotchas?
You didn't imagine it CJ, It's in the plans to fill the corner holes of the recess with proseal. The plans also tell you to use proseal on the skin to firewall flanges when you rivet them, the only place you rivet early in the fuselage is the bottom flange minus a few rivets that get the short hinge material. The rest of the firewall doesn't get sealed and riveted until the cowl hinge section. You might want to consider picking up some of the high temp proseal from Van's in the tube to caulk the seam between the firewall and the bottom/side skins when you finally rivet the cowl hinge to the skins and firewall. One tube should allow for both the hinge and the interior corner. Plans say to use proseal intially on the fuselage then recommends the high temp stuff I believe or I just decided that's what I was going to use. I forget but it does call for proseal for sure. Mike makes a good point about the long back rivet set in the C-frame, I used the suicide set that came with my C-frame, but since it travels in a bronze bushing it's not a sucidal as if it were in a rivet gun. :) Rick S. 40185 ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: May 26, 2006
From: Deems Davis <deemsdavis(at)cox.net>
Subject: Re: Line drawings
Try this: ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Fiberglass panel options
Date: May 26, 2006
From: "Randy DeBauw" <Randy(at)abros.com>
The modification all depends on what you put in the panel. I had almost no changes to rib (only a slight relief on the lower flange). I moved the MX20 to the top of the stack so the center rib has no modifications at all. Randy -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Tom Gesele Sent: Friday, May 26, 2006 5:52 AM Subject: RV10-List: Fiberglass panel options For those who went with one of the after-market fiberglass panels available, were there any modifications required in the upper fwd fuselage assembly? Also, is there a rough guesstimate of the difference in weight between the fiberglass and stock panel? Thanks, Tom Gesele #473 - Fuselage ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Richard Sipp" <rsipp(at)earthlink.net>
Subject: Re: Fuselage Firewall Gotchas?
Date: May 26, 2006
I am fairly certain Van will sell you the documentation only for the electrical kit, and the firewall forward kit. They did for me. You can use these to "plan ahead" even if you are not ready to order the parts yet. Dick Sipp 40065 fuselage completion ----- Original Message ----- From: "Chris Johnston" <CJohnston(at)popsound.com> Sent: Friday, May 26, 2006 12:02 PM Subject: RV10-List: Fuselage Firewall Gotchas? > > Hey all - > > I'm just about to get started on the firewall section of the fuse > (initial assembly) and I wondered about any gotchas in this area. I > don't have the engine yet, and I'm concerned about opening up holes (or > not closing them) when I don't yet have the hardware that goes in there. > I've never built an airplane before, and I don't have a very good mental > picture of all the ins and outs of aircraft engines. I'm using the > standard IO540 so there shouldn't be any nuttiness, but as I got ready > to open up the holes for the control cables, I got nervous. Any info > would be appreciated. > > Thanks > cj > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: LIKE2LOOP(at)aol.com
Date: May 26, 2006
Subject: Re: Fuselage Firewall Gotchas?
In a message dated 5/26/06 12:45 pm, ricksked(at)earthlink.net writes: << Use your C-frame to rivet all the 470-4 rivets...it will save you lots of heartache over bucking the rivets. >> keep talking...... I never thought of using the C-frame for seating rivets. Do you hit the sliding arm with the mallet or rivet gun? What die goes in which part? (dome of rivet up or down?) What does the job best? Thanks for any tips! Steve Port St. Lucie, FL 772-475-5556 Sent from my Treo 600 ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: May 26, 2006
From: Tom Gesele <tgesele(at)optonline.net>
Subject: Fiberglass panel options
First, thanks for the responses to my question. Second, I was hoping to get information on the mounting differences between the stock aluminum panel and the various fiberglass substitutes available. Specifically, looking at the way the stock panel mounts, there is a lower sub-panel (F-1003B) that screws to the main panel and is riveted to the fuselage side skins. If you use one of the fiberglass substitutes, is this piece required, does it require modifications, or is there a piece that substitutes for it? Also, do any of the three ribs from the F/W to the panel require any modifications? Thanks in advance for any insights from those who've already gone this route. Tom Gesele #473 -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of Randy DeBauw Sent: Friday, May 26, 2006 4:04 PM Subject: RE: RV10-List: Fiberglass panel options The modification all depends on what you put in the panel. I had almost no changes to rib (only a slight relief on the lower flange). I moved the MX20 to the top of the stack so the center rib has no modifications at all. Randy ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Fuselage Firewall Gotchas?
Date: May 26, 2006
From: "Chris Johnston" <CJohnston(at)popsound.com>
I checked vans site and they only sell one type of tank sealer. Is this the high temp stuff? I noticed that they say that this is a new sealer which replaces the older Proseal. I saw on the label that it says "Flamemaster". I'm assuming that it somehow masters the flames? Hehe. But really, it is a higher temp version than the normal proseal from places like Spruce? cj #40410 fuse -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Rick Sent: Friday, May 26, 2006 12:20 PM Subject: RE: RV10-List: Fuselage Firewall Gotchas? You didn't imagine it CJ, It's in the plans to fill the corner holes of the recess with proseal. The plans also tell you to use proseal on the skin to firewall flanges when you rivet them, the only place you rivet early in the fuselage is the bottom flange minus a few rivets that get the short hinge material. The rest of the firewall doesn't get sealed and riveted until the cowl hinge section. You might want to consider picking up some of the high temp proseal from Van's in the tube to caulk the seam between the firewall and the bottom/side skins when you finally rivet the cowl hinge to the skins and firewall. One tube should allow for both the hinge and the interior corner. Plans say to use proseal intially on the fuselage then recommends the high temp stuff I believe or I just decided that's what I was going to use. I forget but it does call for proseal for sure. Mike makes a good point about the long back rivet set in the C-frame, I used the suicide set that came with my C-frame, but since it trav! els in a bronze bushing it's not a sucidal as if it were in a rivet gun. :) Rick S. 40185 ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Fuselage Firewall Gotchas?
Date: May 26, 2006
From: "RV Builder (Michael Sausen)" <rvbuilder(at)sausen.net>
Rather than getting high-temp proseal, save yourself some time and pick up some fire rated caulk from your local Lowes Depot. Makes more sense and more suitable to the task. Michael Sausen -10 #352 Fuselage -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Rick Sent: Friday, May 26, 2006 2:20 PM Subject: RE: RV10-List: Fuselage Firewall Gotchas? You didn't imagine it CJ, It's in the plans to fill the corner holes of the recess with proseal. The plans also tell you to use proseal on the skin to firewall flanges when you rivet them, the only place you rivet early in the fuselage is the bottom flange minus a few rivets that get the short hinge material. The rest of the firewall doesn't get sealed and riveted until the cowl hinge section. You might want to consider picking up some of the high temp proseal from Van's in the tube to caulk the seam between the firewall and the bottom/side skins when you finally rivet the cowl hinge to the skins and firewall. One tube should allow for both the hinge and the interior corner. Plans say to use proseal intially on the fuselage then recommends the high temp stuff I believe or I just decided that's what I was going to use. I forget but it does call for proseal for sure. Mike makes a good point about the long back rivet set in the C-frame, I used the suicide set that came with my C-frame, but since it trav! els in a bronze bushing it's not a sucidal as if it were in a rivet gun. :) Rick S. 40185 ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: May 26, 2006
From: rv10builder <rv10builder(at)bellsouth.net>
Subject: Re: Fuselage Firewall Gotchas?
Van's sells a firewall sealing compound (p/n MC-CS-1900) and gun (p/n TOOL SEALANT GUN). Brian #40308 Chris Johnston wrote: > >I checked vans site and they only sell one type of tank sealer. Is this >the high temp stuff? I noticed that they say that this is a new sealer >which replaces the older Proseal. I saw on the label that it says >"Flamemaster". I'm assuming that it somehow masters the flames? Hehe. >But really, it is a higher temp version than the normal proseal from >places like Spruce? > >cj >#40410 >fuse > >-----Original Message----- >From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com >[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Rick >Sent: Friday, May 26, 2006 12:20 PM >To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com >Subject: RE: RV10-List: Fuselage Firewall Gotchas? > > >You didn't imagine it CJ, > >It's in the plans to fill the corner holes of the recess with proseal. >The plans also tell you to use proseal on the skin to firewall flanges >when you rivet them, the only place you rivet early in the fuselage is >the bottom flange minus a few rivets that get the short hinge material. >The rest of the firewall doesn't get sealed and riveted until the cowl >hinge section. You might want to consider picking up some of the high >temp proseal from Van's in the tube to caulk the seam between the >firewall and the bottom/side skins when you finally rivet the cowl hinge >to the skins and firewall. One tube should allow for both the hinge and >the interior corner. Plans say to use proseal intially on the fuselage >then recommends the high temp stuff I believe or I just decided that's >what I was going to use. I forget but it does call for proseal for sure. >Mike makes a good point about the long back rivet set in the C-frame, I >used the suicide set that came with my C-frame, but since it trav! > els in a bronze bushing it's not a sucidal as if it were in a rivet >gun. :) > >Rick S. >40185 > > > > > > > > > > > > > >. > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "John Hasbrouck" <jhasbrouck(at)woh.rr.com>
Subject: Re: Fuselage Firewall Gotchas?
Date: May 26, 2006
Chris, Your timing is perfect, I just finished mine today! Pay attention to the nutplates, most are on the aft side of the firewall but two are on the forward side, see plans. Would be nice to decide if you're going to use a Matco parking brake. If you do you should modify the brake line bracket and make a bracket for the parking brake valve. Amen on the "C" frame and back riveting. The stainless steel is very sharp, wear gloves and no I didn't enlarge those holes in the recess yet, thanks to following those ahead of me on this board and learning from their experience. John ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: N519RV did two very short first Flights today.
Date: May 26, 2006
From: "Doerr, Ray R [NTK]" <Ray.R.Doerr(at)sprint.com>
Thank You Ray Doerr CDNI Principal Engineer Sprint PCS 16020 West 113th Street Lenexa, KS 66219 Mailstop KSLNXK0101 (913) 859-1414 (Office) (913) 226-0106 (Pcs) (913) 859-1234 (Fax) Ray.R.Doerr(at)sprint.com Today we did the first flight of N519RV (40250). Takeoff seemed normal at first except my test Pilot Joe Shetterly was only climbing out at 90 Knots and maybe 500 ft/min with only 2200 lbs. Turns out the engine was only running at 2100RPM with MP at 28". I think this is what resulted in the Oil temp running very hot at 250 degrees. Joe landed it right away and we removed the cowl to let it cool down. OAT was about 90 degrees. Once the oil temp was down to 160, Joe tried another flight, this time trying to keep the airspeed around 120 Knots, this airspeed with the low RPM did not allow for very much climb at all. Around this RPM, I figure it was only developing around 45% power, enough for a take off compare to a Cessna 150, but no where near the 2,000 ft/min I expected for a 2200 lb gross weight. The prop is able to cycle fine, but we can't get more that 2100 rpm static on the ground and that is even after I change the Prop Gov stop to the point where it hit the hard stop of the metal that hold the stop bolt. It seems that the prop gov is not allowing the prop to go to full flat pitch to allow the engine to run to it's full 2700 rpm. I have asked everyone at my local airport for any suggestion, but so far, no one has come up with anything we can try to get the RPM up to Take Off RPM. My setup is identical to most of the other RV-10's that are flying. I bought the Firewall Forward kit from Van's which included the MT Prop Gov P/N P-860-3 and the Blended Hartzell Prop HC-C2YR-1BFP/F8068D. My engine is a rebuilt IO-540-D4A5, dual mags, Precision Silver Hawk EX fuel injection, 260 HP. If anyone has any ideas on what my problem could be, I would really appreciate it. We were hoping to fly the 25 hours off this long weekend, but it's not worth attempting another flight till we try something that might make a positive change of this situation. Thanks Ray Doerr 40250 N519RV (Flying, but still having problems) ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: N519RV did two very short first Flights today.
Date: May 27, 2006
From: "Doerr, Ray R [NTK]" <Ray.R.Doerr(at)sprint.com>
Since I went to bed all I could think about is how to solve this problem of low RPM. According to the Prop Gov P/N, the 6 in the P-860-3 means Pressure to increase pitch - CW. Also ther is a paragraph in section 5.5 that states "As a general rule, engine redline RPM cannot be reached during a full power static run-up Contrary to popular belief, the governor is not controlling the propeller at this time, the propeller is against its low pitch stop. Attempting to increase propeller static run-up RPM by adjusting the governor high RPM screw will have no effect and will probably result in a propeller overspeed during the take-off roll". Once I read that and confirmed that backing off the high RPM stop screw on the Gov by 3/8" had no effect, it looks like my problem lies in the low picth stop of the Propellar hub. By the way the fuel flow on a high speed taxi test was 21 GPH. With this info in hand, I went at the Prop manual and found that the low pitch stop is the one at the center front of the hub. This bolt has 24 threads per inch and by turning it out one full turn is approximately an increase by 200 RPM. At this moment, I think I will try and turn it out one full turn and see if the RPM will come up the 200 RPM to 2300. If that works, I will need to turn it out two more full turns for the 2700 RPM required for take-off. I will then return the prop gov stops back to there original setting. If anyone has had to do this on there flying RV-10, I would like to here from you. If anyone has any other ideas, I would also like to hear them. Thanks for now. I'm off to the airport. Ray Doerr 40250 N519RV Today we did the first flight of N519RV (40250). Takeoff seemed normal at first except my test Pilot Joe Shetterly was only climbing out at 90 Knots and maybe 500 ft/min with only 2200 lbs. Turns out the engine was only running at 2100RPM with MP at 28". I think this is what resulted in the Oil temp running very hot at 250 degrees. Joe landed it right away and we removed the cowl to let it cool down. OAT was about 90 degrees. Once the oil temp was down to 160, Joe tried another flight, this time trying to keep the airspeed around 120 Knots, this airspeed with the low RPM did not allow for very much climb at all. Around this RPM, I figure it was only developing around 45% power, enough for a take off compare to a Cessna 150, but no where near the 2,000 ft/min I expected for a 2200 lb gross weight. The prop is able to cycle fine, but we can't get more that 2100 rpm static on the ground and that is even after I change the Prop Gov stop to the point where it hit the hard stop of the metal that hold the stop bolt. It seems that the prop gov is not allowing the prop to go to full flat pitch to allow the engine to run to it's full 2700 rpm. I have asked everyone at my local airport for any suggestion, but so far, no one has come up with anything we can try to get the RPM up to Take Off RPM. My setup is identical to most of the other RV-10's that are flying. I bought the Firewall Forward kit from Van's which included the MT Prop Gov P/N P-860-3 and the Blended Hartzell Prop HC-C2YR-1BFP/F8068D. My engine is a rebuilt IO-540-D4A5, dual mags, Precision Silver Hawk EX fuel injection, 260 HP. If anyone has any ideas on what my problem could be, I would really appreciate it. We were hoping to fly the 25 hours off this long weekend, but it's not worth attempting another flight till we try something that might make a positive change of this situation. Thanks Ray Doerr 40250 N519RV (Flying, but still having problems) ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Chris" <toaster73(at)earthlink.net>
Subject: Re: N519RV did two very short first Flights today.
Date: May 27, 2006
This seems to be a heads up to the rest of us on our test flight preps. I am just now starting on the fuselage so I am not up on all the engine stuff yet...But for the certified aircraft, the type certificate data sheet usually lists the engine propeller combination along with the maximum allowed and minimum allowed full throttle static rpms. Do we not have this info for a 540 with blended airfoil prop? Seems to me this first flight could have been the last flight very easily. In my Bonanza I had an electric prop and descended over NYC down the Hudson for sight seeing, when I got to the Statue of Liberty I went to climb back out only to find that my prop would not go to fine pitch, it was stuck. So I landed at the next airport and on final my partner/co-pilot suggested I make the landing. No room for a go-around! A broken wire kept my prop motor from going fine. This happened to the previous owner and on landing he had barely enough thrust to taxi since the engine was so loaded up by the pitch being stuck in nearly full coarse. Did your test pilot monitor for full static rpm before releasing brakes for takeoff? We always did that in the Bonanza. Thanks for the report another possible gotcha for Tim's website. -Chris Lucas #40072 ----- Original Message ----- From: "Doerr, Ray R [NTK]" <Ray.R.Doerr(at)sprint.com> Sent: Saturday, May 27, 2006 6:01 AM Subject: RE: RV10-List: N519RV did two very short first Flights today. > > > Since I went to bed all I could think about is how to solve this > problem of low RPM. According to the Prop Gov P/N, the 6 in the P-860-3 > means Pressure to increase pitch - CW. Also ther is a paragraph in > section 5.5 that states "As a general rule, engine redline RPM cannot be > reached during a full power static run-up Contrary to popular belief, > the governor is not controlling the propeller at this time, the > propeller is against its low pitch stop. Attempting to increase > propeller static run-up RPM by adjusting the governor high RPM screw > will have no effect and will probably result in a propeller overspeed > during the take-off roll". > Once I read that and confirmed that backing off the high RPM > stop screw on the Gov by 3/8" had no effect, it looks like my problem > lies in the low picth stop of the Propellar hub. > By the way the fuel flow on a high speed taxi test was 21 GPH. > With this info in hand, I went at the Prop manual and found that > the low pitch stop is the one at the center front of the hub. This bolt > has 24 threads per inch and by turning it out one full turn is > approximately an increase by 200 RPM. > At this moment, I think I will try and turn it out one full turn > and see if the RPM will come up the 200 RPM to 2300. If that works, I > will need to turn it out two more full turns for the 2700 RPM required > for take-off. I will then return the prop gov stops back to there > original setting. > If anyone has had to do this on there flying RV-10, I would like > to here from you. If anyone has any other ideas, I would also like to > hear them. > > > Thanks for now. I'm off to the airport. > > Ray Doerr > 40250 > N519RV > > > Today we did the first flight of N519RV (40250). Takeoff seemed > normal at first except my test Pilot Joe Shetterly was only climbing out > at 90 Knots and maybe 500 ft/min with only 2200 lbs. Turns out the > engine was only running at 2100RPM with MP at 28". I think this is what > resulted in the Oil temp running very hot at 250 degrees. Joe landed it > right away and we removed the cowl to let it cool down. OAT was about > 90 degrees. Once the oil temp was down to 160, Joe tried another > flight, this time trying to keep the airspeed around 120 Knots, this > airspeed with the low RPM did not allow for very much climb at all. > Around this RPM, I figure it was only developing around 45% power, > enough for a take off compare to a Cessna 150, but no where near the > 2,000 ft/min I expected for a 2200 lb gross weight. The prop is able to > cycle fine, but we can't get more that 2100 rpm static on the ground and > that is even after I change the Prop Gov stop to the point where it hit > the hard stop of the metal that hold the stop bolt. It seems that the > prop gov is not allowing the prop to go to full flat pitch to allow the > engine to run to it's full 2700 rpm. I have asked everyone at my local > airport for any suggestion, but so far, no one has come up with anything > we can try to get the RPM up to Take Off RPM. My setup is identical to > most of the other RV-10's that are flying. I bought the Firewall > Forward kit from Van's which included the MT Prop Gov P/N P-860-3 and > the Blended Hartzell Prop HC-C2YR-1BFP/F8068D. My engine is a rebuilt > IO-540-D4A5, dual mags, Precision Silver Hawk EX fuel injection, 260 HP. > If anyone has any ideas on what my problem could be, I would really > appreciate it. We were hoping to fly the 25 hours off this long > weekend, but it's not worth attempting another flight till we try > something that might make a positive change of this situation. > > > Thanks > Ray Doerr > 40250 > N519RV (Flying, but still having problems) > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: May 27, 2006
From: Tim Olson <Tim(at)MyRV10.com>
Subject: Re: N519RV did two very short first Flights today.
Jesse, is there anything strange about setup on the Dynon? I know Ray has a Dynon too, and if there is anything that needs to be set properly to display RPM correctly, I'm sure he'd love to hear it....as would the list. On my setup, I have the GRT EIS6000, and I just had to set the tach Pulses per revolution to I believe 3, because that's what the Lightspeed ignition put out. And the wire out of the Lightspeed feeds directly to the EIS6000. (That info is just for future reference by archive searchers) T Tim Olson - RV-10 N104CD - Flying Jesse Saint wrote: > > Are you sure you are only getting that RPM? We thought we were having a > similar problem, but when we used an external (laser-type-thingy) tach we > were actually over RPM. Your experience on power, however, would certainly > agree with you. I didn't do the adjustments on the prop governor, but I > know it can be picky. > > > Jesse Saint > I-TEC, Inc. > jesse(at)itecusa.org > www.itecusa.org > 352-465-4545 > ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: May 27, 2006
From: Tim Olson <Tim(at)MyRV10.com>
Subject: Re: N519RV did two very short first Flights today.
Your point is very well taken Chris. My DAR didn't care to see much of the engine running. He wanted me to taxi it out, and back, and turn. But then he did have just one thing that he insisted on....that he be in the plane for a full-power static RPM runup test to see what RPM it came to. I know that with a new engine, people don't want to run it on the ground at high power, but hey, your engine can handle the 15 seconds of full-power runup required to verify static RPM before you take your first flight. Just FYI to the list, I think I saw 2690 RPM or something like that when I did my runup, and I *think* the spec is 2700 for your target. I'll add some info to the tips area next time I update the site. Tim Olson - RV-10 N104CD - Flying Chris wrote: > > This seems to be a heads up to the rest of us on our test flight preps. > I am just now starting on the fuselage so I am not up on all the engine > stuff yet...But for the certified aircraft, the type certificate data > sheet usually lists the engine propeller combination along with the > maximum allowed and minimum allowed full throttle static rpms. Do we not > have this info for a 540 with blended airfoil prop? Seems to me this > first flight could have been the last flight very easily. > In my Bonanza I had an electric prop and descended over NYC down the > Hudson for sight seeing, when I got to the Statue of Liberty I went to > climb back out only to find that my prop would not go to fine pitch, it > was stuck. So I landed at the next airport and on final my > partner/co-pilot suggested I make the landing. No room for a go-around! > A broken wire kept my prop motor from going fine. This happened to the > previous owner and on landing he had barely enough thrust to taxi since > the engine was so loaded up by the pitch being stuck in nearly full coarse. > Did your test pilot monitor for full static rpm before releasing brakes > for takeoff? We always did that in the Bonanza. > Thanks for the report another possible gotcha for Tim's website. > -Chris Lucas > #40072 > > ----- Original Message ----- From: "Doerr, Ray R [NTK]" > > To: > Sent: Saturday, May 27, 2006 6:01 AM > Subject: RE: RV10-List: N519RV did two very short first Flights today. > > >> >> >> Since I went to bed all I could think about is how to solve this >> problem of low RPM. According to the Prop Gov P/N, the 6 in the P-860-3 >> means Pressure to increase pitch - CW. Also ther is a paragraph in >> section 5.5 that states "As a general rule, engine redline RPM cannot be >> reached during a full power static run-up Contrary to popular belief, >> the governor is not controlling the propeller at this time, the >> propeller is against its low pitch stop. Attempting to increase >> propeller static run-up RPM by adjusting the governor high RPM screw >> will have no effect and will probably result in a propeller overspeed >> during the take-off roll". >> Once I read that and confirmed that backing off the high RPM >> stop screw on the Gov by 3/8" had no effect, it looks like my problem >> lies in the low picth stop of the Propellar hub. >> By the way the fuel flow on a high speed taxi test was 21 GPH. >> With this info in hand, I went at the Prop manual and found that >> the low pitch stop is the one at the center front of the hub. This bolt >> has 24 threads per inch and by turning it out one full turn is >> approximately an increase by 200 RPM. >> At this moment, I think I will try and turn it out one full turn >> and see if the RPM will come up the 200 RPM to 2300. If that works, I >> will need to turn it out two more full turns for the 2700 RPM required >> for take-off. I will then return the prop gov stops back to there >> original setting. >> If anyone has had to do this on there flying RV-10, I would like >> to here from you. If anyone has any other ideas, I would also like to >> hear them. >> >> >> Thanks for now. I'm off to the airport. >> >> Ray Doerr >> 40250 >> N519RV >> >> >> >> >> >> >> Today we did the first flight of N519RV (40250). Takeoff seemed >> normal at first except my test Pilot Joe Shetterly was only climbing out >> at 90 Knots and maybe 500 ft/min with only 2200 lbs. Turns out the >> engine was only running at 2100RPM with MP at 28". I think this is what >> resulted in the Oil temp running very hot at 250 degrees. Joe landed it >> right away and we removed the cowl to let it cool down. OAT was about >> 90 degrees. Once the oil temp was down to 160, Joe tried another >> flight, this time trying to keep the airspeed around 120 Knots, this >> airspeed with the low RPM did not allow for very much climb at all. >> Around this RPM, I figure it was only developing around 45% power, >> enough for a take off compare to a Cessna 150, but no where near the >> 2,000 ft/min I expected for a 2200 lb gross weight. The prop is able to >> cycle fine, but we can't get more that 2100 rpm static on the ground and >> that is even after I change the Prop Gov stop to the point where it hit >> the hard stop of the metal that hold the stop bolt. It seems that the >> prop gov is not allowing the prop to go to full flat pitch to allow the >> engine to run to it's full 2700 rpm. I have asked everyone at my local >> airport for any suggestion, but so far, no one has come up with anything >> we can try to get the RPM up to Take Off RPM. My setup is identical to >> most of the other RV-10's that are flying. I bought the Firewall >> Forward kit from Van's which included the MT Prop Gov P/N P-860-3 and >> the Blended Hartzell Prop HC-C2YR-1BFP/F8068D. My engine is a rebuilt >> IO-540-D4A5, dual mags, Precision Silver Hawk EX fuel injection, 260 HP. >> If anyone has any ideas on what my problem could be, I would really >> appreciate it. We were hoping to fly the 25 hours off this long >> weekend, but it's not worth attempting another flight till we try >> something that might make a positive change of this situation. >> >> >> Thanks >> Ray Doerr >> 40250 >> N519RV (Flying, but still having problems) >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> > > > > > http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List > http://wiki.matronics.com > > > > > > > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: N519RV did two very short first Flights today.
Date: May 27, 2006
From: "John W. Cox" <johnwcox(at)pacificnw.com>
Ray it is exciting that you and your test pilot Joe were able to get a test flight in and that you shared with the group your initial findings. My mental questions were; #1 did you and the test pilot confirm static rpm output to the limit prescribed by the manufacturer BEFORE taxi testing? #2 Did you do high speed taxi and did the anomaly of oil temp appear? #3 Did the test pilot do a complete run up to proper rpm, check the mags and FULLY cycle the prop stop to stop 3x before takeoff? If you only get 2100, I would not call that fine. #4 Did you visually witness full blade pitch change from outside the cockpit during each of the three cycles? #5 Did you confirm full range of motion on the Prop Control cable at the governor with cable springback at the instrument panel? #6 Was the oil up to minimum temperature (which on a new engine should have been a non issue)? Sounds like a possible viscosity issue with the oil or a control cable miss setting. You may have something on the MT governor set screw. Oil passages are the rarest of causes. Did the problem then develop only after each of the previous questions confirmed proper operation? Don't tell me the test pilot took off without everything in the green first. I know a lot of pilots who do not know how or why a prop check is properly done (A great question for this forum). I agree with Tim, get the problem fixed and we hope to hear the final solution and the grin appearing on your face soon. "Take off power" when you want it is really important all the time. Go Rounds would be another. John Cox -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Doerr, Ray R [NTK] Sent: Friday, May 26, 2006 9:23 PM Subject: RV10-List: N519RV did two very short first Flights today. Today we did the first flight of N519RV (40250). Takeoff seemed normal at first except my test Pilot Joe Shetterly was only climbing out at 90 Knots and maybe 500 ft/min with only 2200 lbs. Turns out the engine was only running at 2100RPM with MP at 28". The prop is able to cycle fine, but we can't get more that 2100 rpm static on the ground and that is even after I change the Prop Gov stop to the point where it hit the hard stop of the metal that hold the stop bolt. It seems that the prop gov is not allowing the prop to go to full flat pitch to allow the engine to run to it's full 2700 rpm. If anyone has any ideas on what my problem could be, I would really appreciate it. We were hoping to fly the 25 hours off this long weekend, but it's not worth attempting another flight till we try something that might make a positive change of this situation. Thanks Ray Doerr 40250 N519RV (Flying, but still having problems) ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Jack Sparling" <jhs_61(at)yahoo.com>
Subject: Rivet behind oil cooler duct flange.
Date: May 27, 2006
I am looking at a rivet that is behind the oil cooler duct flange and was wondering how anyone is supposed to tackle that job. If anyone has been successful at bucking that rivet I would certainly like to know what technique they used. Can you reverse buck a rivet? Haven't tried it yet, just a thought. Considering a no. 6 screw. Thanks, Jack Sparling Ready to mount engine. ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Jesse Saint" <jesse(at)itecusa.org>
Subject: N519RV did two very short first Flights today.
Date: May 27, 2006
The dynon is the same way on the tack, I think. You need to set it to the number of pulses per revolution. It also depends on where you are getting the tach information. We are on the p-leads and had to set it to match. Nobody that we talked to knew what the setting should be, so we used the lasar tach and changed the Dynon until it matched and then we had it. The main thing to remember with the Dynon is that there are different probes that put out different signals for different functions, and until you have the right info in the settings, you won't be displaying correct information. Jesse Saint I-TEC, Inc. jesse(at)itecusa.org www.itecusa.org 352-465-4545 -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Tim Olson Sent: Saturday, May 27, 2006 10:33 AM Subject: Re: RV10-List: N519RV did two very short first Flights today. Jesse, is there anything strange about setup on the Dynon? I know Ray has a Dynon too, and if there is anything that needs to be set properly to display RPM correctly, I'm sure he'd love to hear it....as would the list. On my setup, I have the GRT EIS6000, and I just had to set the tach Pulses per revolution to I believe 3, because that's what the Lightspeed ignition put out. And the wire out of the Lightspeed feeds directly to the EIS6000. (That info is just for future reference by archive searchers) T Tim Olson - RV-10 N104CD - Flying Jesse Saint wrote: > > Are you sure you are only getting that RPM? We thought we were having a > similar problem, but when we used an external (laser-type-thingy) tach we > were actually over RPM. Your experience on power, however, would certainly > agree with you. I didn't do the adjustments on the prop governor, but I > know it can be picky. > > > Jesse Saint > I-TEC, Inc. > jesse(at)itecusa.org > www.itecusa.org > 352-465-4545 > -- -- ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Dave & Brenda Emond" <d_emond(at)mweb.co.za>
Subject: Re: Gascolators
Date: May 27, 2006
I was planning on fitting an Andair Gascolator. I am now having second thoughts, about this. I have fitted an IO540, and running the Vans recommended fuel pump setup. My plan was to include the Andair gascolator some where on the engine side of the firewall. I am concerned about the gascolator being after the fuel pump??? Vans does not include a gascolator in his plans on the 10, maybe theres a good reason. I would be interested to hear other points of view?? Dave Emond #40159 Engine in, busy with baffles ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Carl Froehlich" <carl.froehlich(at)cox.net>
Subject: Re: Gascolators
Date: May 27, 2006
I used the Andair Gascolator in my Airflow Performance fuel injected RV-8A. It is firewall mounted after the electric fuel pump, and feeds into the mechanical fuel pump. The filter element on the Andair Gascolator meets the filter specs for the Airflow Performance injection system. This set up works fine, but I will be removing it during a planed panel upgrade. Considering the mounting options available in the RV series airplanes, there is no practical value in the water sump function of the gascolator. Water settling out in your tanks just can't make the migration to the gascolator. Any water pumped from your tanks is entrained with the fuel, thus the mechanical gravity separating action that leads to water collecting in a low spot (like the gascolator in a high wing airplane) is not present. For RVs, water is removed from the tanks by sumping only. Recommend you skip the gascolator and stay with the fuel filter that comes with the Airflow Performance electric fuel pump. Carl Froehlich RV-8A (250 hrs) RV-10 (tail cone) -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of Dave & Brenda Emond Sent: Saturday, May 27, 2006 1:35 PM Subject: RV10-List: Re: Gascolators I was planning on fitting an Andair Gascolator. I am now having second thoughts, about this. I have fitted an IO540, and running the Vans recommended fuel pump setup. My plan was to include the Andair gascolator some where on the engine side of the firewall. I am concerned about the gascolator being after the fuel pump??? Vans does not include a gascolator in his plans on the 10, maybe theres a good reason. I would be interested to hear other points of view?? Dave Emond #40159 Engine in, busy with baffles ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: May 27, 2006
From: Dan Masys <dmasys(at)cox.net>
Subject: N519RV did two very short first Flights today.
I have heard of a similar problem occuring when the gasket for the prop governor was installed in the wrong position, and it blocked oil from getting to the governor. The prop governor is basicly an oil pump and when it's own oil supply is altered strange things happen. -Dan Masys #40448 > From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com > [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Doerr, Ray R > [NTK] > Sent: Friday, May 26, 2006 9:23 PM > To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com > Subject: RV10-List: N519RV did two very short first Flights today. > > > > Today we did the first flight of N519RV (40250). Takeoff seemed > normal at first except my test Pilot Joe Shetterly was only climbing out > at 90 Knots and maybe 500 ft/min with only 2200 lbs. Turns out the > engine was only running at 2100RPM with MP at 28". The prop is able > to > cycle fine, but we can't get more that 2100 rpm static on the ground and > that is even after I change the Prop Gov stop to the point where it hit > the hard stop of the metal that hold the stop bolt. It seems that the > prop gov is not allowing the prop to go to full flat pitch to allow the > engine to run to it's full 2700 rpm. > If anyone has any ideas on what my problem could be, I would really > appreciate it. We were hoping to fly the 25 hours off this long > weekend, but it's not worth attempting another flight till we try > something that might make a positive change of this situation. > > > Thanks > Ray Doerr > 40250 > N519RV (Flying, but still having problems) > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: May 27, 2006
From: Dan Masys <dmasys(at)cox.net>
Subject: N519RV did two very short first Flights today.
Slight modification to previous post. The blockage caused by the incorrectly positioned gasket (or maybe it was the wrong gasket -- I think the builder used the gasket that came with the plate put on the pad by Lycoming, instead of the gasket provided with the governor) and the *return* oil passage of the governor was blocked, and so it sent max pressure oil to the prop regardless of linkage position and drove the blades into cruise rather than climb (flat) pitch. Hope this helps, -Dan Masys ---- Dan Masys wrote: > > I have heard of a similar problem occuring when the gasket for the prop governor was installed in the wrong position, and it blocked oil from getting to the governor. The prop governor is basicly an oil pump and when it's own oil supply is altered strange things happen. > > -Dan Masys > #40448 > > > From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com > > [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Doerr, Ray R > > [NTK] > > Sent: Friday, May 26, 2006 9:23 PM > > To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com > > Subject: RV10-List: N519RV did two very short first Flights today. > > > > > > > > Today we did the first flight of N519RV (40250). Takeoff seemed > > normal at first except my test Pilot Joe Shetterly was only climbing out > > at 90 Knots and maybe 500 ft/min with only 2200 lbs. Turns out the > > engine was only running at 2100RPM with MP at 28". The prop is able > > to > > cycle fine, but we can't get more that 2100 rpm static on the ground and > > that is even after I change the Prop Gov stop to the point where it hit > > the hard stop of the metal that hold the stop bolt. It seems that the > > prop gov is not allowing the prop to go to full flat pitch to allow the > > engine to run to it's full 2700 rpm. > > If anyone has any ideas on what my problem could be, I would really > > appreciate it. We were hoping to fly the 25 hours off this long > > weekend, but it's not worth attempting another flight till we try > > something that might make a positive change of this situation. > > > > > > Thanks > > Ray Doerr > > 40250 > > N519RV (Flying, but still having problems) > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Chris , Susie Darcy" <VHMUM(at)bigpond.com>
Subject: Re: Rivet behind oil cooler duct flange.
Date: May 28, 2006
Back rivet. Did it last night. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jack Sparling" <jhs_61(at)yahoo.com> Sent: Sunday, May 28, 2006 2:50 AM Subject: RV10-List: Rivet behind oil cooler duct flange. > > I am looking at a rivet that is behind the oil cooler duct flange and was > wondering how anyone is supposed to tackle that job. If anyone has been > successful at bucking that rivet I would certainly like to know what > technique they used. Can you reverse buck a rivet? Haven't tried it > yet, > just a thought. Considering a no. 6 screw. > > Thanks, > > Jack Sparling > Ready to mount engine. > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: RobHickman(at)aol.com
Date: May 27, 2006
Subject: Re: Retractable
There have actually been 2 RV-4's with retracts. One was done by Dave Lewis in Hillsboro Oregon for a customer. The plane was black and gray and has had at least one gear up landing. It was a lot heavier and not that much faster, but did it look cool. The other is the blue and white one from Canada. Rob Hickman . ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: May 27, 2006
From: "James Clark" <jclarkmail(at)gmail.com>
Subject: Re: Retractable
Well maybe then there are three ... Klaus Roth built (????) two RV4's as I recall. One was regular gear and the other retract. I also think one was flown by his wife and the other by him. D-ESKR and D-ERKR See photos here ... http://www.rv8r.de/foto_e.htm See article (well almost) here ... http://www.kitplanes.com/issues/21_7/builder_spotlight/42-1.phtml James On 5/27/06, RobHickman(at)aol.com wrote: > > There have actually been 2 RV-4's with retracts. > > One was done by Dave Lewis in Hillsboro Oregon for a customer. The plane > was black and gray and has had at least one gear up landing. It was a lo= t > heavier and not that much faster, but did it look cool. > > The other is the blue and white one from Canada. > > Rob Hickman > . > -- This is an alternate email. Please continue to email me at james(at)nextupventures.com . ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: N519RV did two very short first Flights today.
Date: May 27, 2006
From: "Doerr, Ray R [NTK]" <Ray.R.Doerr(at)sprint.com>
Guys, thanks for all the ideas. This is one awesome group of people coming together to help each other out in time of great stress. I went out to the hanger this morning to try and solve my 2100 RPM max statis issue with the new info I had in had from the prop gov and prop manual. But before I was about to change anything, I wanted a second option from a separate source on Engine RPM. I borrowed a optical tach sensor ($17 item from tower hobbies, same item used on R/C Airplanes) and test the prop rpm at idle with the parking brake set. I made sure the brake was going to hold the airplane back with at least twice this RPM before I was about to jump out of the plane and stand in front of the running prop. The tach sensor read 990 RPM while the Dynon was reading 740. The Dynon manual states the setting should either be a fact or 1/2 or 1/4 of the number of cylinders. Mine was set to 2, which was incorrect for a 6 cyl engine. I set it to 3 and that went in the wrong direction, so I set it to 1.5 and that was bang on (990 RPM). Now here comes the math, with it set to 2 before and now at 1.5, that's .5 less than the 1.5 that it is now set at. So it is now 1/3 less than before. So if you take the 740 RPM I was getting before and multiply by 1.33, that is exactly 990. Bingo, this all adds up. So when we were getting 2100 RPM before for takeoff, that was actually 2100 * 1.33 = 2800 RPM. So we were running the crap out of the engine. So we were getting basically 28 squared. This would help explain some of the engine oil high temps. This also explains the lack of climb performance. With the engine running faster than 2700 RPM (recommended Take Off RPM), the Prop was having to flatten the pitch to a point where the thrust just wasn't there. This all proved out perfectly with another test flight of 2 hours. She climbed at 1600 ft/min at 2200 lbs at 100 knots. MUCH BETTER, can you see the smile on my face now? Now on to the high oil temperature reading on the dynon. Just for fun a changed the Dynon Oil Temp setting to sensor type 2 from 1 on the ground with the oil at room temp. It read 75 regardless of it being set to 1 or 2. So we fly it again and were still seeing 254 on the oil temp, but that was as high as it got. Other flight through out the day it was slowing coming down to 246. So then I decided to have the test pilot set the Oil Temp Sensor type in flight from 1 to 2 and the temp was indicating 23 degrees cooler on type 2. So I started surfing Dynon's support site and found that I did in fact have the Type 1 sensor. So much for that thought. After digging a little more I found a service bulletin about how the Type 1 Oil Temp probe is high by about 20 degrees. If you have a software version greater than 1.02, than this issue was resolved. But since I have version 1.02, I had this 20 degree error on the high side. So we left it at sensor type 2 until I get a chance tomorrow to update the software with 1.02.01. So all of this info means we were not running above the recommended oil temp of 245. At 254 before the change, it was actually only 234 degree. 11 shy of the max red line. Can you see my smile getting bigger. Now my two test pilot were simply having fun running the plane around at 70 - 75 % power with rich mixture to break in the engine. It was burning 19.5 Gal/Hr at this rate. Greg (Joe's dad, ATP and examiner for ATP's) is the other test pilot, and between the two of them they were tag teaming the fly off hours. By the end of the day, we had 9.2 hours on the hobbs and I started the first oil change in prep for tomorrows marathon. The outside air temp was 90 - 95 on the ground at 1040 MSL and at 7500 MSL it was 71 degrees. Greg's felt a slight sake and different engine sound briefly on the last flight of the day and then the cylinder temp coming down a fair amount. His thoughts so far is that the rings may be finally seating in place. Does this sound right? I also notice some light blue dust around some of the injectors. The only blue I know is the dye in the 100LL fuel. Is this anything to be concerned amount? I will keep everyone posted on my progress from tomorrow. Thanks Ray Doerr 40250 N519RV (I still can't belive it is no longer a project) ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: paint
From: "Jim & Julie Wade" <jwadejr(at)hughes.net>
Date: May 28, 2006
Actually I stole it!!!!!! Flew a Columbia 400 at Sun&Fun. That is the 06 paint scheme!! Got me a Columbia for 1/3 the price!!!!!!!! Jim Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=36928#36928 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Evan and Megan Johnson" <evmeg(at)snowcrest.net>
Subject: Re: Retractable
Date: May 28, 2006
A fellow in Germany named Klaus Roth built one just recently. It is a really beautiful job but as others have already stated it flys no faster...just looks faster. There was a good article in kitplanes about it written by our friend Ishmael Fuentes. The picture below comes from Dirk Schlichtenhorst's RV 4 web page. http://www.rv8r.de/welcome.htm.... I personally wont be trying anything like this on my 10 project but I certainly want to see the results of others efforts. I spoke with at least one builder who is converting to a taildragger....maybe the same guy? Evan Johnson www.evansaviationproducts.com (530)247-0375 (530)351-1776 cell ----- Original Message ----- From: RobHickman(at)aol.com To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com Sent: Saturday, May 27, 2006 7:40 PM Subject: Re: RV10-List: Retractable There have actually been 2 RV-4's with retracts. One was done by Dave Lewis in Hillsboro Oregon for a customer. The plane was black and gray and has had at least one gear up landing. It was a lot heavier and not that much faster, but did it look cool. The other is the blue and white one from Canada. Rob Hickman . ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Bev and Jim Sinkbeil" <bevandjim(at)clearwire.net>
Subject: fiberglass panels
Date: May 28, 2006
Hi, The panels that we manufacture for SteinAir and Avionics Systems are very comparable in weight to Van's stock panel. They are deeper and can accommodate vertically stacked Cheltons without rib modifications. The panel screws directly into the upper forward fuselage with no modification needed. An example of a completed panel can be seen on page 51 of the May issue of Sport Aviation. SteinAir will soon have a picture on their web site of the completed panel for our RV-10 N203JJ. In the near future, Van's Aircraft will be offering this panel through their web site and accessory catalogue. Regards, Jim Sinkbeil RV-7A flying RV-10 almost flying ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "John Jessen" <jjessen(at)rcn.com>
Subject: N519RV did two very short first Flights today.
Date: May 28, 2006
Ray, congratulations on getting your grin! I think one of the lessons here for me is to not take off in the first place if not seeing the correct RPM. You were either under powered or now it seems over revving. The latter less serious, I conjecture, than the former, but now that I know one can test the RPM with a $17 gadget to verify that the electronics are correct, you can bet that will be one of my first steps, no matter what the electronics are saying. Thanks so much for all the great information. Taking the time to post this amongst all the excitement is highly commendable and highly recommended for all of us to do. One favor. I'm not that good at conceptualizing a math problem and need a little help with your calculations. 0.5 is indeed 1/3 of 1.5. But, and this is the conceptual thing that I'm having trouble with, if you're original was 2 and you're down .5 from that original number, don't you then figure what percentage that is from the original number? So .5 down from 2 means you are down 1/4, not 1/3? Again, I am horrible at these things, so please forgive the dumb question. Again, congratulations! John Jessen ~328 Tailcone -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Doerr, Ray R [NTK] Sent: Saturday, May 27, 2006 9:16 PM Subject: RE: RV10-List: N519RV did two very short first Flights today. --> Guys, thanks for all the ideas. This is one awesome group of people coming together to help each other out in time of great stress. I went out to the hanger this morning to try and solve my 2100 RPM max statis issue with the new info I had in had from the prop gov and prop manual. But before I was about to change anything, I wanted a second option from a separate source on Engine RPM. I borrowed a optical tach sensor ($17 item from tower hobbies, same item used on R/C Airplanes) and test the prop rpm at idle with the parking brake set. I made sure the brake was going to hold the airplane back with at least twice this RPM before I was about to jump out of the plane and stand in front of the running prop. The tach sensor read 990 RPM while the Dynon was reading 740. The Dynon manual states the setting should either be a fact or 1/2 or 1/4 of the number of cylinders. Mine was set to 2, which was incorrect for a 6 cyl engine. I set it to 3 and that went in the wrong direction, so I set it to 1.5 and that was bang on (990 RPM). Now here comes the math, with it set to 2 before and now at 1.5, that's .5 less than the 1.5 that it is now set at. So it is now 1/3 less than before. So if you take the 740 RPM I was getting before and multiply by 1.33, that is exactly 990. Bingo, this all adds up. So when we were getting 2100 RPM before for takeoff, that was actually 2100 * 1.33 = 2800 RPM. So we were running the crap out of the engine. So we were getting basically 28 squared. This would help explain some of the engine oil high temps. This also explains the lack of climb performance. With the engine running faster than 2700 RPM (recommended Take Off RPM), the Prop was having to flatten the pitch to a point where the thrust just wasn't there. This all proved out perfectly with another test flight of 2 hours. She climbed at 1600 ft/min at 2200 lbs at 100 knots. MUCH BETTER, can you see the smile on my face now? Now on to the high oil temperature reading on the dynon. Just for fun a changed the Dynon Oil Temp setting to sensor type 2 from 1 on the ground with the oil at room temp. It read 75 regardless of it being set to 1 or 2. So we fly it again and were still seeing 254 on the oil temp, but that was as high as it got. Other flight through out the day it was slowing coming down to 246. So then I decided to have the test pilot set the Oil Temp Sensor type in flight from 1 to 2 and the temp was indicating 23 degrees cooler on type 2. So I started surfing Dynon's support site and found that I did in fact have the Type 1 sensor. So much for that thought. After digging a little more I found a service bulletin about how the Type 1 Oil Temp probe is high by about 20 degrees. If you have a software version greater than 1.02, than this issue was resolved. But since I have version 1.02, I had this 20 degree error on the high side. So we left it at sensor type 2 until I get a chance tomorrow to update the software with 1.02.01. So all of this info means we were not running above the recommended oil temp of 245. At 254 before the change, it was actually only 234 degree. 11 shy of the max red line. Can you see my smile getting bigger. Now my two test pilot were simply having fun running the plane around at 70 - 75 % power with rich mixture to break in the engine. It was burning 19.5 Gal/Hr at this rate. Greg (Joe's dad, ATP and examiner for ATP's) is the other test pilot, and between the two of them they were tag teaming the fly off hours. By the end of the day, we had 9.2 hours on the hobbs and I started the first oil change in prep for tomorrows marathon. The outside air temp was 90 - 95 on the ground at 1040 MSL and at 7500 MSL it was 71 degrees. Greg's felt a slight sake and different engine sound briefly on the last flight of the day and then the cylinder temp coming down a fair amount. His thoughts so far is that the rings may be finally seating in place. Does this sound right? I also notice some light blue dust around some of the injectors. The only blue I know is the dye in the 100LL fuel. Is this anything to be concerned amount? I will keep everyone posted on my progress from tomorrow. Thanks Ray Doerr 40250 N519RV (I still can't belive it is no longer a project) ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: May 28, 2006
Subject: Re: N519RV did two very short first Flights today.
From: Dj Merrill <deej(at)deej.net>
>--> > >from a separate source on Engine RPM. I borrowed a optical tach sensor ($17 >item from tower hobbies, same item used on R/C >Airplanes) and test the prop rpm at idle with the parking brake set. I made >sure the brake was going to hold the airplane back with at least twice this >RPM before I was about to jump out of the plane and stand in front of the >running prop. The tach sensor read 990 RPM while the Dynon was reading 740. > > A search on their website revealed the following: <http://www2.towerhobbies.com/cgi-bin/WTI0095P?FVSEARCH=tach&FVPROFIL=++&search3=Go> All of them say you must be within 12 inches of the prop. That is a little scary, but what really scares me is "I was about to jump out of the plane and stand in front of the running prop". Did you have anyone inside the plane at the controls when you did this? Your statement is phrased such that you did this alone, which makes the hairs stand up on the back of my neck... Could you have made this measurement from the back side of the prop? Very glad to hear you worked out the issue, are safe, and that the plane is going well. -Dj ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "David McNeill" <dlm46007(at)cox.net>
Subject: 10s in LAS
Date: May 28, 2006
I am bringing the family to LAS next week and will have a little time to spare while they see the playground in Circus Circus. Anyone with a 10 at my stage of completion? finish kit or firewall forward? ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: N519RV did two very short first Flights today.
Date: May 28, 2006
From: "Doerr, Ray R [NTK]" <Ray.R.Doerr(at)sprint.com>
N519RV update. We now have 16 of our 25 hours flown off. My two test pilots are extremely impressed with the performance of the 260 HP RV-10. Some of there comments are "Short field performance is better than a Cessna 182", "More cabin and leg room than a Bonanza and just as fast or faster", "Acceleration is about 3/4 of a Pitt's S2B with the same engine", "It's likely easier and more stable to fly than my RV-9". I asked Greg (ATP pilot examiner) how many hours it would take for a female student pilot (that he just did her check ride and passed) to get use to the RV-10 to the point where he would sign her off. His answer was 8 hours. That just goes to show how easy the RV-10 is to fly. I finished changing the oil today and everything ran great. I should finally be able to fly my own plane this coming weekend once the 25 hours are flown off. I will post some of the stall numbers etc once we finish up tomorrow. We are going to do weight testing up to 2900 lbs tomorrow. Today Greg also did some spin testing today with it and said it was a piece of cake to recover from. These boys are really putting this bird through its paces and are more impressed with every test they do. Thank You Ray Doerr N519RV (Flying) ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: N519RV did two very short first Flights today.
Date: May 28, 2006
From: "Doerr, Ray R [NTK]" <Ray.R.Doerr(at)sprint.com>
Another way to think of it from a math standpoint is this. 740 A --- X --- 990 2 What we are trying to find is the relationship between 740 and 990 vs something is to the value of 2. So (740 x 2)/990 is equal to 1.5. Thank You Ray Doerr N519RV (Flying) -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of John Jessen Sent: Sunday, May 28, 2006 10:46 AM Subject: RE: RV10-List: N519RV did two very short first Flights today. Ray, congratulations on getting your grin! I think one of the lessons here for me is to not take off in the first place if not seeing the correct RPM. You were either under powered or now it seems over revving. The latter less serious, I conjecture, than the former, but now that I know one can test the RPM with a $17 gadget to verify that the electronics are correct, you can bet that will be one of my first steps, no matter what the electronics are saying. Thanks so much for all the great information. Taking the time to post this amongst all the excitement is highly commendable and highly recommended for all of us to do. One favor. I'm not that good at conceptualizing a math problem and need a little help with your calculations. 0.5 is indeed 1/3 of 1.5. But, and this is the conceptual thing that I'm having trouble with, if you're original was 2 and you're down .5 from that original number, don't you then figure what percentage that is from the original number? So .5 down from 2 means you are down 1/4, not 1/3? Again, I am horrible at these things, so please forgive the dumb question. Again, congratulations! John Jessen ~328 Tailcone -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Doerr, Ray R [NTK] Sent: Saturday, May 27, 2006 9:16 PM Subject: RE: RV10-List: N519RV did two very short first Flights today. --> Guys, thanks for all the ideas. This is one awesome group of people coming together to help each other out in time of great stress. I went out to the hanger this morning to try and solve my 2100 RPM max statis issue with the new info I had in had from the prop gov and prop manual. But before I was about to change anything, I wanted a second option from a separate source on Engine RPM. I borrowed a optical tach sensor ($17 item from tower hobbies, same item used on R/C Airplanes) and test the prop rpm at idle with the parking brake set. I made sure the brake was going to hold the airplane back with at least twice this RPM before I was about to jump out of the plane and stand in front of the running prop. The tach sensor read 990 RPM while the Dynon was reading 740. The Dynon manual states the setting should either be a fact or 1/2 or 1/4 of the number of cylinders. Mine was set to 2, which was incorrect for a 6 cyl engine. I set it to 3 and that went in the wrong direction, so I set it to 1.5 and that was bang on (990 RPM). Now here comes the math, with it set to 2 before and now at 1.5, that's .5 less than the 1.5 that it is now set at. So it is now 1/3 less than before. So if you take the 740 RPM I was getting before and multiply by 1.33, that is exactly 990. Bingo, this all adds up. So when we were getting 2100 RPM before for takeoff, that was actually 2100 * 1.33 = 2800 RPM. So we were running the crap out of the engine. So we were getting basically 28 squared. This would help explain some of the engine oil high temps. This also explains the lack of climb performance. With the engine running faster than 2700 RPM (recommended Take Off RPM), the Prop was having to flatten the pitch to a point where the thrust just wasn't there. This all proved out perfectly with another test flight of 2 hours. She climbed at 1600 ft/min at 2200 lbs at 100 knots. MUCH BETTER, can you see the smile on my face now? Now on to the high oil temperature reading on the dynon. Just for fun a changed the Dynon Oil Temp setting to sensor type 2 from 1 on the ground with the oil at room temp. It read 75 regardless of it being set to 1 or 2. So we fly it again and were still seeing 254 on the oil temp, but that was as high as it got. Other flight through out the day it was slowing coming down to 246. So then I decided to have the test pilot set the Oil Temp Sensor type in flight from 1 to 2 and the temp was indicating 23 degrees cooler on type 2. So I started surfing Dynon's support site and found that I did in fact have the Type 1 sensor. So much for that thought. After digging a little more I found a service bulletin about how the Type 1 Oil Temp probe is high by about 20 degrees. If you have a software version greater than 1.02, than this issue was resolved. But since I have version 1.02, I had this 20 degree error on the high side. So we left it at sensor type 2 until I get a chance tomorrow to update the software with 1.02.01. So all of this info means we were not running above the recommended oil temp of 245. At 254 before the change, it was actually only 234 degree. 11 shy of the max red line. Can you see my smile getting bigger. Now my two test pilot were simply having fun running the plane around at 70 - 75 % power with rich mixture to break in the engine. It was burning 19.5 Gal/Hr at this rate. Greg (Joe's dad, ATP and examiner for ATP's) is the other test pilot, and between the two of them they were tag teaming the fly off hours. By the end of the day, we had 9.2 hours on the hobbs and I started the first oil change in prep for tomorrows marathon. The outside air temp was 90 - 95 on the ground at 1040 MSL and at 7500 MSL it was 71 degrees. Greg's felt a slight sake and different engine sound briefly on the last flight of the day and then the cylinder temp coming down a fair amount. His thoughts so far is that the rings may be finally seating in place. Does this sound right? I also notice some light blue dust around some of the injectors. The only blue I know is the dye in the 100LL fuel. Is this anything to be concerned amount? I will keep everyone posted on my progress from tomorrow. Thanks Ray Doerr 40250 N519RV (I still can't belive it is no longer a project) ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Hole sizes conduits and static lines
Date: May 29, 2006
From: "McGANN, Ron" <ron.mcgann(at)baesystems.com>
G'day all, About to start wiring and static plumbing. Does anyone know of limitations on the size of holes that can be drilled into the fuse bulkheads/ribs to accommodate conduit and/or bushings? I am particularly interested in any constraints on the F-1006C bulkhead (at the tailcone join), for the static pressure lines and potential GRT AHRS/magnetometer wire runs. I already have a conduit installed under the baggage and rear set floor pans via 7/8" holes in the F-1005 and F-1034A bulkheads. TIA Ron 187 Fuse/Finishing ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Roman Bukolt" <conceptmodels(at)mailbag.com>
Subject: Re: N519RV did two very short first Flights today.
Date: May 29, 2006
FYI With an optical Tach you don't have to stand in front of the prop. It reads th same if you take the reading from the back of the prop.! Roman Bukolt 40541 ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: May 29, 2006
From: Tim Lewis <Tim_Lewis(at)msm.umr.edu>
Subject: Gap between governor and upper cowl ramp (IO-540)
Listers, Attached are a couple of photos from my RV-10. One shows the governor, the other shows the cutout for the governor in the upper cowl ramp. I have gaps all around the prop governor between the governor and the ramp cutout. This will permit air to flow from the high pressure side of the cowling to the low pressure side through the gaps. Have others encountered similar geometry? What, if anything, have you done to reduce the leakage? Thanks, Tim Lewis -- Tim Lewis -- HEF (Manassas, VA) RV-6A N47TD -- 830 hrs RV-10 #40059 under construction ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: May 29, 2006
From: Matt Dralle <dralle(at)matronics.com>
Subject: Two New Email Lists at Matronics and Wiki Reminder!
Dear Listers, I have added two new email Lists to the Matronics Line up today. These include a Continental engine List and a Lightning aircraft List: =========== continental-list(at)matronics.com http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Continental-List Everything related to the Continental aircraft engine. Sky's the limit on discussions here. =========== =========== lightning-list(at)matronics.com http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Lightning-List This is an exciting new design from Arion Aircraft LLC in Shelbyville Tennessee. Pete Krotje has a very nice web site on the aircraft that can be found here: http://www.arionaircraft.com/ =========== Also, if you haven't checked out the new Matronics Aircraft Wiki, swing by and have a look. Remember, a Wiki is only as good as the content that the members put into it. Have a look over some of the sections, and if you've got some interesting or useful, please add it to the Wiki! Its all about YOU! :-) The URL for the Matronics Wiki is: http://wiki.matronics.com Best regards, Matt Dralle Matronics Email List Administrator ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Robert G. Wright" <armywrights(at)adelphia.net>
Subject: Stall Vane
Date: May 29, 2006
I'm assembling the stall vane assembly, and the instructions say not to torque so much that the vane can't rotate freely. In order for my vane to rotate freely, the screw/nut that holds it in place also rotates freely. Yes, the screw is engaged in the self-locking plastic of the nut, so I consider the nut locked. However, if I tighten the nut just enough that the screw won't rotate, the vane won't either. So, I can't even tighten the nut snugly, much less to any torque value. I figure if I leave it the way it is it'll allow the screw to spin and eventually wear something through, most likely the aluminum mount plate. Any tips? Rob Wright #392 Wings QB ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: May 29, 2006
From: James Hein <n8vim(at)arrl.net>
Subject: Re: Stall Vane
Just file the ends (the ends of the tube the vane is welded to) of the vane itself a bit so you can tighten the screw so it doesn't turn. Or just use some loctite on the screw head. -Jim 40384 (Slow build all the way) Robert G. Wright wrote: > Im assembling the stall vane assembly, and the instructions say not > to torque so much that the vane cant rotate freely. In order for my > vane to rotate freely, the screw/nut that holds it in place also > rotates freely. Yes, the screw is engaged in the self-locking plastic > of the nut, so I consider the nut locked. However, if I tighten the > nut just enough that the screw wont rotate, the vane wont either. > So, I cant even tighten the nut snugly, much less to any torque > value. I figure if I leave it the way it is itll allow the screw to > spin and eventually wear something through, most likely the aluminum > mount plate. Any tips? > > Rob Wright > > #392 Wings QB > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Indran Chelvanayagam" <ichelva(at)netspace.net.au>
Subject: Stall Vane
Date: May 30, 2006
Try grinding the VA-196 down a little, so that it rotates freely when the nut is torqued _____ From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Robert G. Wright Sent: Tuesday, 30 May 2006 6:54 AM Subject: RV10-List: Stall Vane I'm assembling the stall vane assembly, and the instructions say not to torque so much that the vane can't rotate freely. In order for my vane to rotate freely, the screw/nut that holds it in place also rotates freely. Yes, the screw is engaged in the self-locking plastic of the nut, so I consider the nut locked. However, if I tighten the nut just enough that the screw won't rotate, the vane won't either. So, I can't even tighten the nut snugly, much less to any torque value. I figure if I leave it the way it is it'll allow the screw to spin and eventually wear something through, most likely the aluminum mount plate. Any tips? Rob Wright #392 Wings QB ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "John Hasbrouck" <jhasbrouck(at)woh.rr.com>
Subject: Air tool refurb.
Date: May 29, 2006
Anyone know of someone who refurbishes air tools? I have an old Rockwell 90degree air drill for threaded drill bits that needs the head rebuilt. It's wobbling a good bit now. Any suggestions? John ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: May 29, 2006
From: Tim Lewis <Tim_Lewis(at)msm.umr.edu>
Subject: Re: Air tool refurb.
You might try www.clearairtools.com. He rebuilds and sells many pneumatic tools. I bought my squeezer from him. Good service, reasonable price. Tim -- Tim Lewis -- HEF (Manassas, VA) RV-6A N47TD -- 830 hrs RV-10 #40059 under construction John Hasbrouck wrote: > > Anyone know of someone who refurbishes air tools? I have an old > Rockwell 90degree air drill for threaded drill bits that needs the head > rebuilt. It's wobbling a good bit now. Any suggestions? > > John > > > > http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List > http://wiki.matronics.com > > > > > > > > > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: May 29, 2006
From: rv10builder <rv10builder(at)bellsouth.net>
Subject: CI-122
I have decided to take a different route with respect to COM antennas, so I have two brand new COMANT CI-122 VHF antennas still in the boxes that I will let go for $100 ea. (+ shipping). Cost me $125 new each from ACS. Contact me off board if interested... Brian #40308 http://www.mykitlog.com/rv10builder ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Jeff Carpenter <jeff(at)westcottpress.com>
Subject: Re: Air tool refurb.
Date: May 29, 2006
Try The Yard. The did a great job of refurbishing my pneumatic squeezer. On May 29, 2006, at 5:32 PM, John Hasbrouck wrote: > > > Anyone know of someone who refurbishes air tools? I have an old > Rockwell 90degree air drill for threaded drill bits that needs the > head rebuilt. It's wobbling a good bit now. Any suggestions? > > John > > > www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List > wiki.matronics.com > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Robert G. Wright" <armywrights(at)adelphia.net>
Subject: Stall Vane and now QB impressions
Date: May 29, 2006
A follow up: For those of you still teetering between QB and regular build, my 4-week old impressions of the QB Wings are: some things are done too completely, an example being that some of my holes have been riveted shut that I was supposed to use for templating; and some other things are done as they should be, but like Indran said, makes access very difficult at times. Definitely install all you can before closing the wings up. With access being the main complaint (not really), I still smile every time I think about not having to do the mundane repetition of 30-something wing ribs, gallons of proseal for the tanks, etc. But get a hold of the plans and read them, there's still plenty of wealth to go around for those tasks as well here in QB land. I'd be farther along with the wings but I had to take some days, read the plans multiple times, let the enormity sink in, and mostly, think almost abstractly because I couldn't just go step 1 - 50, Section A-Z like the emp kit. You really gotta try to understand what's left and make your own order up. The last thing I want is a small but significant pile of parts left at the end of the build! It does feel good to begin to have a flow to building again, though. Rob #392 QB Wings _____ _____ From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Robert G. Wright Sent: Tuesday, 30 May 2006 8:35 AM Subject: RE: RV10-List: Stall Vane Thanks James and Indran, Duh! There I go, pole-vaulting over mouse turds again. Rob Wright _____ From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Indran Chelvanayagam Sent: Monday, May 29, 2006 7:25 PM Subject: RE: RV10-List: Stall Vane Try grinding the VA-196 down a little, so that it rotates freely when the nut is torqued _____ From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Robert G. Wright Sent: Tuesday, 30 May 2006 6:54 AM Subject: RV10-List: Stall Vane I'm assembling the stall vane assembly, and the instructions say not to torque so much that the vane can't rotate freely. In order for my vane to rotate freely, the screw/nut that holds it in place also rotates freely. Yes, the screw is engaged in the self-locking plastic of the nut, so I consider the nut locked. However, if I tighten the nut just enough that the screw won't rotate, the vane won't either. So, I can't even tighten the nut snugly, much less to any torque value. I figure if I leave it the way it is it'll allow the screw to spin and eventually wear something through, most likely the aluminum mount plate. Any tips? Rob Wright #392 Wings QB ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Brian Sponcil" <bsponcil(at)belinblank.org>
Subject: Re: paint
Date: May 30, 2006
Current thinking in our camp is to go with a scheme similar to the Mooney Aclaim. http://www.mooney.com/aircraft/acclaim/ -Brian N211BD #40497 Iowa City, IA ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jim & Julie Wade" <jwadejr(at)hughes.net> Sent: Sunday, May 28, 2006 6:15 AM Subject: RV10-List: Re: paint > > > Actually I stole it!!!!!! Flew a Columbia 400 at Sun&Fun. That is the 06 > paint scheme!! Got me a Columbia for 1/3 the price!!!!!!!! > Jim > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=36928#36928 > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Mike Lauritsen - Work" <mike(at)cleavelandtool.com>
Subject: Fuselage Firewall Gotchas?
Date: May 30, 2006
I have a rough video showing the c-frame being used for riveting. I don't have the voice over figured out yet so half of the voice over is bad, and the other half is missing, but at least you can see it in action. There are two sizes for different internet connections: Small (1MB): http://www.cleavelandtool.com/video/rsb12_low.wmv Large (10MB): http://www.cleavelandtool.com/video/rsb12.wmv Mike Lauritsen Cleaveland Aircraft Tool 2225 First St. Boone, Iowa 50036 515-432-6794 mike(at)cleavelandtool.com -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of LIKE2LOOP(at)aol.com Sent: Friday, May 26, 2006 4:31 PM Subject: Re: RV10-List: Fuselage Firewall Gotchas? In a message dated 5/26/06 12:45 pm, ricksked(at)earthlink.net writes: << Use your C-frame to rivet all the 470-4 rivets...it will save you lots of heartache over bucking the rivets. >> keep talking...... I never thought of using the C-frame for seating rivets. Do you hit the sliding arm with the mallet or rivet gun? What die goes in which part? (dome of rivet up or down?) What does the job best? Thanks for any tips! Steve Port St. Lucie, FL 772-475-5556 Sent from my Treo 600 ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: May 30, 2006
From: "James Clark" <jclarkmail(at)gmail.com>
Subject: Re: Retractable
See the plane in flight with its "sibling" below ... Also another "retract 4". Both photos were from the "archives" :-) of a local RV4 builder, "RVRC". James (hope the attachments made it through) On 5/28/06, Evan and Megan Johnson wrote: > > A fellow in Germany named Klaus Roth built one just recently. It is a > really beautiful job but as others have already stated it flys no > faster...just looks faster. There was a good article in kitplanes about it > written by our friend Ishmael Fuentes. The picture below comes from Dirk > Schlichtenhorst's RV 4 web page. http://www.rv8r.de/welcome.htm.... I > personally wont be trying anything like this on my 10 project but I > certainly want to see the results of others efforts. I spoke with at least > one builder who is converting to a taildragger....maybe the same guy? > Evan Johnson > www.evansaviationproducts.com > (530)247-0375 > (530)351-1776 cell > > ----- Original Message ----- > *From:* RobHickman(at)aol.com > *To:* rv10-list(at)matronics.com > *Sent:* Saturday, May 27, 2006 7:40 PM > *Subject:* Re: RV10-List: Retractable > > There have actually been 2 RV-4's with retracts. > > One was done by Dave Lewis in Hillsboro Oregon for a customer. The plane > was black and gray and has had at least one gear up landing. It was a lot > heavier and not that much faster, but did it look cool. > > The other is the blue and white one from Canada. > > Rob Hickman > . > -- This is an alternate email. Please continue to email me at james(at)nextupventures.com . ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: May 30, 2006
From: "Bob Newman" <rnewman(at)lutron.com>
Subject: Re: Fuselage Firewall Gotchas?
I'm just finishing up the firewall, here's what I did. I used my rivet squeezer with a deep throat jaw for all the -4 rivets possible around the periphery of the firewall. This helped provide a lot rigidity to the sheet metal and ensure the aluminum parts were perfectly seated against the stainless. Then I back-riveted all of the interior rivets using a 3" by 20" chunk of steel laid flat on the work bench and a back rivet set in the pneumatic rivet gun. I found I can control the mating of the parts much better with back riveting and squeezing as opposed to using the c-frame and a hammer. Bob Newman 40176 plane #5, slow build everything... :) >>> ricksked(at)earthlink.net 5/26/2006 12:42:07 PM >>> CJ, Don't open the holes in the recess if you are planning on doing the throttle quadrant. Tim Olson I think said he had to close his off and use different routing for the cable due to the quadrant. Use your C-frame to rivet all the 470-4 rivets...it will save you lots of heartache over bucking the rivets. That's all I have for you, I'm sure others will have some more. Rick S. 40185 Fuse/finish ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Fiberglass panel options
Date: May 30, 2006
From: "Randy DeBauw" <Randy(at)abros.com>
On my fiberglass panel I used the ends or the cross brace only. I cut the last 1 1/2" off and riveted it to the fuse side skin. When I placed the panel in place I drilled through the panel into cross brace end pieces then pulled the panel and installed nut plates on them. Now there is one screw in each lower corner to hold it. I have the center console so there is no movement at all. Randy -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Tom Gesele Sent: Friday, May 26, 2006 2:53 PM Subject: RE: RV10-List: Fiberglass panel options First, thanks for the responses to my question. Second, I was hoping to get information on the mounting differences between the stock aluminum panel and the various fiberglass substitutes available. Specifically, looking at the way the stock panel mounts, there is a lower sub-panel (F-1003B) that screws to the main panel and is riveted to the fuselage side skins. If you use one of the fiberglass substitutes, is this piece required, does it require modifications, or is there a piece that substitutes for it? Also, do any of the three ribs from the F/W to the panel require any modifications? Thanks in advance for any insights from those who've already gone this route. Tom Gesele #473 -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of Randy DeBauw Sent: Friday, May 26, 2006 4:04 PM Subject: RE: RV10-List: Fiberglass panel options The modification all depends on what you put in the panel. I had almost no changes to rib (only a slight relief on the lower flange). I moved the MX20 to the top of the stack so the center rib has no modifications at all. Randy ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Mike Kraus" <n223rv(at)wolflakeairport.net>
Subject: RV-10 Longitudinal Level
Date: May 30, 2006
What is the longitudinal level line in the RV-10? Is it the bottom of the door opening where the main longeron's are, or is it the longerons that are in the tail cone section? Mine seem to be about 1.7 degrees different. I could not seem to find anything in the plans. Thanks -Mike ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "bob.kaufmann" <bob.kaufmann(at)cox.net>
Subject: 10s in LAS
Date: May 30, 2006
I'm in Vegas(Bob K), Rick S, and Chris Huckel. Also John, and I think two others, but they are laying low. Bob K -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of David McNeill Sent: Sunday, May 28, 2006 4:57 PM Subject: RV10-List: 10s in LAS I am bringing the family to LAS next week and will have a little time to spare while they see the playground in Circus Circus. Anyone with a 10 at my stage of completion? finish kit or firewall forward? ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "John Erickson" <john.erickson(at)cox.net>
Subject: 10s in LAS
Date: May 30, 2006
Yup, I'm here also. Just finished moving from one house to another, so just getting my shop set back up. (Hence laying low... :-) ) Of course, Bob and Rick are both way ahead of me. Haven't seen Chris's yet... John #40208 -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of bob.kaufmann Sent: Tuesday, May 30, 2006 7:35 PM Subject: RE: RV10-List: 10s in LAS I'm in Vegas(Bob K), Rick S, and Chris Huckel. Also John, and I think two others, but they are laying low. Bob K -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of David McNeill Sent: Sunday, May 28, 2006 4:57 PM Subject: RV10-List: 10s in LAS I am bringing the family to LAS next week and will have a little time to spare while they see the playground in Circus Circus. Anyone with a 10 at my stage of completion? finish kit or firewall forward? ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: May 31, 2006
From: rv10builder <rv10builder(at)bellsouth.net>
Subject: Re: CI-122
Yes they are; however I have a taker already. Thanks for all of the responses! Jesse Saint wrote: >Are these the bent whip antennas? If so (I will check the other one I have >in the morning on Wednedsay), I will take both of them. > >Thanks and GOD BLESS! > >Jesse Saint >I-TEC, Inc. >jesse(at)itecusa.org >www.itecusa.org >W: 352-465-4545 >C: 352-427-0285 > >-----Original Message----- >From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com >[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of rv10builder >Sent: Monday, May 29, 2006 10:59 PM >To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com >Subject: RV10-List: CI-122 > > >I have decided to take a different route with respect to COM antennas, >so I have two brand new COMANT CI-122 VHF antennas still in the boxes >that I will let go for $100 ea. (+ shipping). Cost me $125 new each >from ACS. Contact me off board if interested... > >Brian >#40308 >http://www.mykitlog.com/rv10builder > > > > > > > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Dave Saylor" <Dave(at)AirCraftersLLC.com>
Subject: Back Seat Folding
Date: May 31, 2006
Would it be useful to build the back seats a little narrower (about 1/2") so they fold down flat between the seat belt tabs? Seems like an easy thing to do to add some versatility to loading. Am I missing something? Dave Saylor AirCrafters LLC 831-722-9141 ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: May 31, 2006
From: Deems Davis <deemsdavis(at)cox.net>
Subject: Re: Back Seat Folding
FWIW I also thought about a different mounting of the rear seats to accomplish the same thing (ie. fold flat), then someone pointed out to me that with the current mounting hinge split into 2 'pins' removing the entire seat is a realtively simple thing to do. For the few times that I need the seat comepletely flat, I decided it's easier to stick with the current design, and put/reinsert the hinge pins, than to make a mod. Deems Davis # 406 Fuse http://deemsrv10.com/ Dave Saylor wrote: > Would it be useful to build the back seats a little narrower (about > 1/2") so they fold down flat between the seat belt tabs? Seems like > an easy thing to do to add some versatility to loading. Am I missing > something? > > Dave Saylor > AirCrafters LLC > 831-722-9141 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Steven DiNieri" <capsteve(at)adelphia.net>
Subject: prop spacer
Date: Jun 01, 2006
Does anyone know the dimensions of a hartzel hub? I'd like to make a spacer to mount the spinner backplate and fit the cowling. steve -- ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Wayne Edgerton" <weeav8ter(at)grandecom.net>
Subject: collision avoidance system
Date: Jun 01, 2006
A little while back I purchase a portable collision avoidance system Traffic Scope VRX. I have now decided to install the RYAN TCAD600 system. I have never used this unit and it's still in the box. They retail at $995 and I think you can find them discounted at $795. If anyone would be interested I am going to sell the one I have and would sell it for $650. Here are a couple of web addresses to be able to see what it is. http://www.surecheck.net/avionics/ http://www.air-land-sea-products.com/trafficscope.htm Wayne Edgerton #40336 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Jesse Saint" <jesse(at)itecusa.org>
Subject: prop spacer
Date: Jun 01, 2006
Steve, We wanted to do this as well, so we go ahold of a prop shop and they gave us an old unairworthy prop hub. That worked great. We had to make the spacers (.250") to hold the hub off the back plate, but that is a lot easier than trying to make something to replace the hub. If you give a prop shop the model number of the prop, they should be able to tell you which hubs would be the same. GOD BLESS! Jesse Saint I-TEC, Inc. jesse(at)itecusa.org www.itecusa.org W: 352-465-4545 C: 352-427-0285 -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Steven DiNieri Sent: Thursday, June 01, 2006 2:53 AM Subject: RV10-List: prop spacer Does anyone know the dimensions of a hartzel hub? I'd like to make a spacer to mount the spinner backplate and fit the cowling. steve -- -- -- ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Indran Chelvanayagam" <ichelva(at)netspace.net.au>
Subject: Brake Mount Assembly - help requested!
Date: Jun 01, 2006
Has anyone else run into problems with their Brake Mount Assembly? This has been stumping me ( and others) for almost a week I am referring to page 46-4, steps 5,6 and 7. I fabricated the spacers to 21/32" width, as in the plans (see pic). However, when the brake mount assembly is mounted onto the gear leg, the head of the uppermost forward AN4 bolt (the one which is installed in a different direction to the others) impinges onto the gear leg, and prevents the U-1003 from lining up with the 3/8" hole in the gear leg (see pics). The hole seems to be off by approx 1/8". Both sides have the same problem So I removed the offending bolt, and installed the wheel/tyre/brake disc assembly. There is approx 1/4" clearance between the brake disc and the U-1010-L/R bracket. This is barely enough, when the bracket is flexed from side to side. I see the following options: 1) shorten spacers by 1/8" - but then risk the U-1010 bracket intermittently rubbing on the brake disc 2) Shave off some of the bolt head 3) Use a countersunk AN4 screw instead of a bolt. 4) dispense with wheel fairings altogether (and lose 5kts in cruise!) I'd be grateful for the group's opinions and suggestions Indran Chelvanayagam Bunbury, Western Australia #40228 ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jun 01, 2006
From: "Ralph E. Capen" <recapen(at)earthlink.net>
Subject: Re: Brake Mount Assembly - help requested!
--- MIME Errors - No Plain-Text Section Found --- A message with no text/plain MIME section was received. The entire body of the message was removed. Please resend the email using Plain Text formatting. HOTMAIL is notorious for only including an HTML section in their client's default configuration. If you're using HOTMAIL, please see your email application's settings and switch to a default mail option that uses "Plain Text". --- MIME Errors No Plain-Text Section Found --- ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jun 01, 2006
From: Tom Gesele <tgesele(at)optonline.net>
Subject: Baggage door fit
I seem to recall that others had a problem with the fit of their baggage door so figured I'd pass this along. On the initial fit to the fuselage, discovered that the door was bowed and the fit was unacceptable. It appears that dimpling the frame resulted in a bow, causing the problem. The solution on mine was progressively fluting the frame along the outer edge which straightened everything to the point where the fit is now acceptable. I'd suggest starting with small flutes, cleco everything back to together, check the fit, and repeat as necessary. On mine, it required rather aggressive flutes to get the fit where I wanted but yours may be different. Hope this saves someone some head-scratching. Tom Gesele #40473 (N629RV Reserved) - Fuselage ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Indran Chelvanayagam" <ichelva(at)netspace.net.au>
Subject: Brake Mount Assembly - help requested!
Date: Jun 02, 2006
That's my problem - the AN4 bolt in question prevents the bolt holes lining up, and prevents the AN6-23A bolt from going through the gear leg. _____ From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Ralph E. Capen Sent: Friday, 2 June 2006 1:43 AM Subject: Re: RV10-List: Brake Mount Assembly - help requested! One of the pictures shows the bolt hole that goes through the gear leg - that bolt being in there would change the total spacing - I don't know if it would fix your error though. I know that when I was doing my 6A I had a similar issue - after I put it all together it fit better and the spacers ended up being almost perfect....... Something to check..... Ralph -----Original Message----- From: Indran Chelvanayagam Sent: Jun 1, 2006 11:00 AM Subject: RV10-List: Brake Mount Assembly - help requested! Has anyone else run into problems with their Brake Mount Assembly? This has been stumping me ( and others) for almost a week I am referring to page 46-4, steps 5,6 and 7. I fabricated the spacers to 21/32" width, as in the plans (see pic). However, when the brake mount assembly is mounted onto the gear leg, the head of the uppermost forward AN4 bolt (the one which is installed in a different direction to the others) impinges onto the gear leg, and prevents the U-1003 from lining up with the 3/8" hole in the gear leg (see pics). The hole seems to be off by approx 1/8". Both sides have the same problem So I removed the offending bolt, and installed the wheel/tyre/brake disc assembly. There is approx 1/4" clearance between the brake disc and the U-1010-L/R bracket. This is barely enough, when the bracket is flexed from side to side. I see the following options: 1) shorten spacers by 1/8" - but then risk the U-1010 bracket intermittently rubbing on the brake disc 2) Shave off some of the bolt head 3) Use a countersunk AN4 screw instead of a bolt. 4) dispense with wheel fairings altogether (and lose 5kts in cruise!) I'd be grateful for the group's opinions and suggestions Indran Chelvanayagam Bunbury, Western Australia #40228 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "John Dunne" <acs(at)acspropeller.com.au>
Subject: Brake Mount Assembly - help requested!
Date: Jun 02, 2006
Indran, I'd talk to Vans. They may have a dimension from the outside of the leg to the brake mount hole. This may be incorrectly drilled. Or the radius of the leg bend may be to far outboard, crowding the alignment hole. Just some thoughts. John 40315 From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Indran Chelvanayagam Sent: Friday, 2 June 2006 9:30 AM Subject: RE: RV10-List: Brake Mount Assembly - help requested! That's my problem - the AN4 bolt in question prevents the bolt holes lining up, and prevents the AN6-23A bolt from going through the gear leg. _____ From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Ralph E. Capen Sent: Friday, 2 June 2006 1:43 AM Subject: Re: RV10-List: Brake Mount Assembly - help requested! One of the pictures shows the bolt hole that goes through the gear leg - that bolt being in there would change the total spacing - I don't know if it would fix your error though. I know that when I was doing my 6A I had a similar issue - after I put it all together it fit better and the spacers ended up being almost perfect....... Something to check..... Ralph -----Original Message----- From: Indran Chelvanayagam Sent: Jun 1, 2006 11:00 AM Subject: RV10-List: Brake Mount Assembly - help requested! Has anyone else run into problems with their Brake Mount Assembly? This has been stumping me ( and others) for almost a week I am referring to page 46-4, steps 5,6 and 7. I fabricated the spacers to 21/32" width, as in the plans (see pic). However, when the brake mount assembly is mounted onto the gear leg, the head of the uppermost forward AN4 bolt (the one which is installed in a different direction to the others) impinges onto the gear leg, and prevents the U-1003 from lining up with the 3/8" hole in the gear leg (see pics). The hole seems to be off by approx 1/8". Both sides have the same problem So I removed the offending bolt, and installed the wheel/tyre/brake disc assembly. There is approx 1/4" clearance between the brake disc and the U-1010-L/R bracket. This is barely enough, when the bracket is flexed from side to side. I see the following options: 1) shorten spacers by 1/8" - but then risk the U-1010 bracket intermittently rubbing on the brake disc 2) Shave off some of the bolt head 3) Use a countersunk AN4 screw instead of a bolt. 4) dispense with wheel fairings altogether (and lose 5kts in cruise!) I'd be grateful for the group's opinions and suggestions Indran Chelvanayagam Bunbury, Western Australia #40228 ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Fuel tank tabs
Date: Jun 02, 2006
From: "Vern W. Smith" <Vern(at)teclabsinc.com>
Hi, Has anyone installed fuel tank tabs to allow for accurate partial filling of the fuel tanks? I believe Piper uses these on the Cherokee. If you have, how long are they, what material did you use and where did you anchor them? I guess I should also introduce myself. My name is Vern Smith and am building a standard kit # 40324. My son and I are just finishing the flaps and are going back to the fuel tanks that we skipped over. Power will be an overhauled Lycoming IO-540 C4B5. Currently I rent a C-182. Thanks, Vern Smith ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Fuel tank tabs
Date: Jun 02, 2006
From: "Stewart, Michael (ISS Atlanta)" <mstewart(at)iss.net>
I put these on my Super 8 with 60 gallon tanks. One thing I did was make the tab removable. In the place of one rivet holding the tank flange in, I put a #8 screw and have the tab holding the platenut. So I could replace the tab if I did not like the height. Tab is about 3" down and gives me 20 gal/side. Frankly I never use the darn thing. But the thought is good. Mike _____ From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Vern W. Smith Sent: Friday, June 02, 2006 11:22 AM Subject: RV10-List: Fuel tank tabs Hi, Has anyone installed fuel tank tabs to allow for accurate partial filling of the fuel tanks? I believe Piper uses these on the Cherokee. If you have, how long are they, what material did you use and where did you anchor them? I guess I should also introduce myself. My name is Vern Smith and am building a standard kit # 40324. My son and I are just finishing the flaps and are going back to the fuel tanks that we skipped over. Power will be an overhauled Lycoming IO-540 C4B5. Currently I rent a C-182. Thanks, Vern Smith ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jun 02, 2006
From: Darton Steve <sfdarton(at)yahoo.com>
Subject: PDX area builders
Any one in the Tigard Oregon area that would like to entertain a visit from a 10 builder? I have some time this evening or Saturday morning. Steve 40212 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Mike Kraus" <n223rv(at)wolflakeairport.net>
Subject: Brake Mount Assembly - help requested!
Date: Jun 02, 2006
I had the same problem on the right side, not the left.... I'd shave down the bolt. FWIW, on my RV-4 you had to shave down the entire side of a couple of the landing gear bolts to get them to fit. No worries, keep building! -Mike Kraus RV-4 Flying RV-10 Fuselage/Avionics -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Indran Chelvanayagam Sent: Thursday, June 01, 2006 11:01 AM Subject: RV10-List: Brake Mount Assembly - help requested! Has anyone else run into problems with their Brake Mount Assembly? This has been stumping me ( and others) for almost a week I am referring to page 46-4, steps 5,6 and 7. I fabricated the spacers to 21/32" width, as in the plans (see pic). However, when the brake mount assembly is mounted onto the gear leg, the head of the uppermost forward AN4 bolt (the one which is installed in a different direction to the others) impinges onto the gear leg, and prevents the U-1003 from lining up with the 3/8" hole in the gear leg (see pics). The hole seems to be off by approx 1/8". Both sides have the same problem So I removed the offending bolt, and installed the wheel/tyre/brake disc assembly. There is approx 1/4" clearance between the brake disc and the U-1010-L/R bracket. This is barely enough, when the bracket is flexed from side to side. I see the following options: 1) shorten spacers by 1/8" - but then risk the U-1010 bracket intermittently rubbing on the brake disc 2) Shave off some of the bolt head 3) Use a countersunk AN4 screw instead of a bolt. 4) dispense with wheel fairings altogether (and lose 5kts in cruise!) I'd be grateful for the group's opinions and suggestions Indran Chelvanayagam Bunbury, Western Australia #40228 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Indran Chelvanayagam" <ichelva(at)netspace.net.au>
Subject: Brake Mount Assembly - Van's reply
Date: Jun 03, 2006
Reply from Van's -----Original Message----- From: Gus Funnell [mailto:gusf(at)vansaircraft.com] Sent: Friday, 2 June 2006 10:26 PM Subject: Re: RV10 Brake Mount Assembly - builder 40228 This has happened with a few gear legs because the bend can vary a little to cause the interference. The fix is to replace the bolt with a csk screw. We will send you the parts and modified instructions. The clearance from the brake disc/bracket is OK. The parts won't move much when the wheelpants are installed. Vans On 1 Jun 06, at 23:46, Indran Chelvanayagam wrote: > Dear Van's Technical support staff, > > I am having a problem with installing the brake mount assembly of the > RV-10. > > I am referring to page 46-4, steps 5,6 and 7. > > I fabricated the spacers to 21/32" width, as in the plans (see pic). > However, when the brake mount assembly is mounted onto the gear leg, > the head of the uppermost forward AN4 bolt (the one which is installed > in a different direction to the others) impinges onto the gear leg, > and prevents the U-1003 from lining up with the 3/8" hole in the gear > leg (see pics). The hole seems to be off by approx 1/8". Both sides > have the same problem. > > So I removed the offending bolt, and installed the wheel/tyre/brake > disc assembly. There is approx 1/4" clearance between the brake disc > and the U-1010-L/R bracket. This is barely enough, when the bracket is > flexed from side to side. > > I see the following options: > > 1) shorten spacers by 1/8" - but then risk the U-1010 bracket > intermittently rubbing on the brake disc > > 2) Shave off some of the bolt head > > 3) Use a countersunk AN4 screw instead of a bolt. > > > Could it be that the gear leg itself has been mis-drilled, or bent > insufficiently? > > I'd be grateful for advice. Email is better for me, due to time > difference, but if you wish to speak, I'm happy to set up a time. I am > 16hrs ahead of USA pacific standard time. > > Regards > Indran Chelvanayagam > Western Australia > Builder 40228 > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Jeff Carpenter <jeff(at)westcottpress.com>
Subject: Pro Seal Slop
Date: Jun 02, 2006
Hindsight being what it is... I don't think I've done enough masking on my first fuel tank, and now have bits of pro seal along the non-mating edges. To what extent have those of you past this point cleaned it up... and what are the concerns about it breaking off and plugging up the fuel system? Thank you, Jeff Carpenter 40304 Awash in Pro Seal and acetone ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jun 02, 2006
From: Deems Davis <deemsdavis(at)cox.net>
Subject: Re: Yellowstone - KCOD destination
Tim, I've never flown into Cody before but have gone to West Yellowstone and Jackson Hole airports several times. Both are proximate to major park entrances. Flying along side the Grand Tetons is an experience that every aviator should relish once in their life time. Yellowstone park is one of my favorite places on earth, my wife and I honeymooned there a 'few' years ago. There are several motel/hotels in either West Yellowstone or Jackson, but you should call before leaving as they are pretty busy in the summer. Not likely that you will find anytning inside the Park available at this late date. There are rental cars at both of the above airports. It may only be 5 +/- hours in the -10 but be aware that ANY flight after about 10-11 am local can expect STRONG convective activity. Additionally, the eastern portion of Wyoming from the Neb. border westward is normally pretty windy so plan on headwinds going out, but coming home you can point her downhill and go like @#$! (I remember seeing 230 kts gs in the Baron) Deems Davis # 406 Fuse http://deemsrv10.com/ Tim Olson wrote: >

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