RV10-List Archive Browser

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From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Doerr, Ray R [NTK] Sent: Tuesday, September 26, 2006 7:23 AM
Subject: Ray Allen Trim Servo
I drilled mine for a small hole and inserted a snap bushing so the wires come out of the side. Just drill the hole in the center of the side metal so as not to weaken it. Thank You Ray Doerr -----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Marc Sent: Monday, September 25, 2006 8:44 PM Subject: RV10-List: Ray Allen Trim Servo Was wondering if anyone else had this problem or not? Before I mount the elevator trim servo bracket with the Ray Allen trim servo, I wanted to think about the wiring. The wires make a real sharp bend due to the closeness of the mounting bracket. See attached picture. Did anyone cut out a half circle in the bracket or just bend the wires and cover with protective material? Also, what wire did you guys use to hook up the servo? I was thinking of ordering the WC2 5 wire Teflon Installation Cable from Ray Allen at $1.10 per foot. Thanks for the input Marc Hudson #560 ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Sep 26, 2006
From: Deems Davis <deemsdavis(at)cox.net>
Subject: Re: Ray Allen Trim Servo
I've seen two approaches used. 1. is on Aeroelectic.com where Bob illustrates how to use a 9 pin d-sub with the flanges ground off and then bound with shrinkwrap. 2. Ted French has used what I believe are RJ45 connectors (I assume this requires a special crimp tool, but looked like a nice solution. Deems Davis # 406 Panel/Finishing http://deemsrv10.com/ Vern W. Smith wrote: > Hi all, > > Since we are talking about Allen trim servos, what kind of wire > connectors are people using to hook it to the wiring? Knife splice, > butt splice, AMP PIDG or what? I ask primarily because the aileron > trim servo is mounted on the left wings inboard inspection cover. And > it seems like it would be nice to be able to unplug it in the future > without cutting the wires. > > Vern Smith (#40324 wings) > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > *From:* owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com > [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] *On Behalf Of *Doerr, > Ray R [NTK] > *Sent:* Tuesday, September 26, 2006 7:23 AM > *To:* rv10-list(at)matronics.com > *Subject:* RE: RV10-List: Ray Allen Trim Servo > > I drilled mine for a small hole and inserted a snap bushing so the > wires come out of the side. Just drill the hole in the center of the > side metal so as not to weaken it. > > Thank You > *Ray Doerr* > > -----Original Message----- > *From:* owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com > [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] *On Behalf Of *Marc > *Sent:* Monday, September 25, 2006 8:44 PM > *To:* rv10-list(at)matronics.com > *Subject:* RV10-List: Ray Allen Trim Servo > > Was wondering if anyone else had this problem or not? > > Before I mount the elevator trim servo bracket with the Ray Allen trim > servo, I wanted to > > think about the wiring. The wires make a real sharp bend due to the > closeness of the mounting bracket. > > See attached picture. Did anyone cut out a half circle in the bracket > or just bend the wires and > > cover with protective material? > > Also, what wire did you guys use to hook up the servo? > > I was thinking of ordering the WC2 5 wire Teflon Installation Cable > from Ray Allen > > at $1.10 per foot. > > Thanks for the input > > Marc Hudson > > #560 > >* * > >* * > >** > >** > >** > >** > >** > >** > >** > >** > >** > >** > >* * > >* > > >* > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "John Gonzalez" <indigoonlatigo(at)msn.com>
Subject: Elevator control horn drill spacing
Date: Sep 26, 2006
Richard, Thank you for your reply. I agree with you and I am sure that many others have had the same problem and have not realized it. It is a shame Van's has not made this correction in the manual or on the jigging of the parts in this assembly. By your expanation of AC43, it seems I am under the required amount of material by 3/32" if my math is correct. I sent a previous email but it seems it got lost in cyberspace. Rather than disassembling the skins and getting new horn parts, I am going to contact Van's and find out whether welding a plate onto the offending horn would be a viable option. Of course, arc welding with no flame would be needed and I have a neighbor who is a world renown metal sculpter that can do the work perfectly. I need to still study the hardware connection to determine whether this will work with the required connection method. My apologies if the first email finally comes through. JOhn G. 409 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "ddddsp1(at)juno.com" <ddddsp1(at)juno.com>
Date: Sep 27, 2006
Subject: RV 10s in Scottsdale, AZ
I am in Scottsdale all week.was curious if anyone was building in the ar ea. Would love to see your project and help build if you are working on it. respond to my email......will have most time on thursday nite. Dean 40449 ________________________________________________________________________
I am in Scottsdale all week.was curious if anyone was building in the area. Would love to see your project and help build if you are working on it. respond to my email......will have most t ime on thursday nite.

Dean

40449

______________________ __________________________________________________
Visit http://www.juno.com/value to sign up today!

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Date: Sep 27, 2006
From: Link McGarity <wv4i(at)bellsouth.net>
Subject: Re: GRT EFIS
Part 43 does not apply to experimental aircraft. Please see FAR 43.1(b). www.EAA.org has some excellent Q&A re owner/3rd party performed maintenance, etc., who can do what, etc.. Pitot static, xpdr, mode C checks re flights under IFR or otherwise, i.e. where these systems are used as applicable. See FAR 91.411, 91.413, et al. These sections are applicable whether aircraft is experimental or not. Link Mcgarity #40622 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "David McNeill" <dlm46007(at)cox.net>
Subject: Re: GRT EFIS
Date: Sep 27, 2006
Try and sell that to the FAA. I suppose that if the experimental aircraft wants to stay out of controlled airspace (Class A,B,C.D, airways, etc.) , then you can fly IFR/VFR in uncontrolled airspace (mostly below 800 AGL and outside ABCD, etc) without a static check and transponder check. It is true that the inspections and authorizations of Part 43 do not apply to experimental but you will comparable limitations defined in your operating limitations. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Link McGarity" <wv4i(at)bellsouth.net> Sent: Wednesday, September 27, 2006 2:50 AM Subject: Re: RV10-List: GRT EFIS > > Part 43 does not apply to experimental aircraft. Please see FAR 43.1(b). > > www.EAA.org has some excellent Q&A re owner/3rd party performed > maintenance, etc., who can do what, etc.. > > Pitot static, xpdr, mode C checks re flights under IFR or otherwise, i.e. > where these systems are used as applicable. See FAR 91.411, 91.413, et al. > These sections are applicable whether aircraft is experimental or not. > > Link Mcgarity > #40622 > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Sep 27, 2006
From: "Keith Bradford" <texak1974(at)gmail.com>
Subject: Re: GRT EFIS
David, I recently decided against the RV-10 as the plane I'm going to build. I'm trying to figure out how to get off of the automatic message board. Could you help me out? BTW, I'm going with the RV-7 instead. Thanks, Keith On 9/27/06, David McNeill wrote: > > > Try and sell that to the FAA. I suppose that if the experimental aircraft > wants to stay out of controlled airspace (Class A,B,C.D, airways, etc.) , > then you can fly IFR/VFR in uncontrolled airspace (mostly below 800 AGL > and > outside ABCD, etc) without a static check and transponder check. It is > true > that the inspections and authorizations of Part 43 do not apply to > experimental but you will comparable limitations defined in your operating > limitations. > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Link McGarity" <wv4i(at)bellsouth.net> > To: > Sent: Wednesday, September 27, 2006 2:50 AM > Subject: Re: RV10-List: GRT EFIS > > > > > > Part 43 does not apply to experimental aircraft. Please see FAR 43.1(b). > > > > www.EAA.org has some excellent Q&A re owner/3rd party performed > > maintenance, etc., who can do what, etc.. > > > > Pitot static, xpdr, mode C checks re flights under IFR or otherwise, i.e > . > > where these systems are used as applicable. See FAR 91.411, 91.413, et > al. > > These sections are applicable whether aircraft is experimental or not. > > > > Link Mcgarity > > #40622 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -- Keith ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: GRT EFIS
Date: Sep 27, 2006
From: "John W. Cox" <johnwcox(at)pacificnw.com>
Although portions apply specifically to Certificated (TC) Aircraft, you are mistaken to believe that none of the FAR 43 applies to Owner Built and Maintained Aircraft. Knowledge to this error is most important in building and operating a safe aircraft. To operate otherwise gives a false perception to conscientious builders. You might do some additional research on the subject. The wildest part of the Wild West is the similar attitude with foreign built warbirds which are Certificated under Experimental Exhibition - Warbird. When completed, the RV-10 will be Certificated Experimental Amateur Built, with an appropriately applied Airworthiness Certificate which is valid only while and if you correctly maintain said aircraft. John Cox #40600 -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Link McGarity Sent: Wednesday, September 27, 2006 2:50 AM Subject: Re: RV10-List: GRT EFIS Part 43 does not apply to experimental aircraft. Please see FAR 43.1(b). www.EAA.org has some excellent Q&A re owner/3rd party performed maintenance, etc., who can do what, etc.. Pitot static, xpdr, mode C checks re flights under IFR or otherwise, i.e. where these systems are used as applicable. See FAR 91.411, 91.413, et al. These sections are applicable whether aircraft is experimental or not. Link Mcgarity #40622 ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: GRT EFIS
Date: Sep 27, 2006
From: "Lockamy, Jack L" <jack.lockamy(at)navy.mil>
Look for another avionics shop technician that brings his portable test equipment to YOU! With portable test equipment, the technician only has to connect a line to your pitot tube, a suction cup over static port(s), and a small antenna near your transponder antenna to perform the certification test. Last test cost me approx. $175 and was accomplished at MY hangar.... Jack Lockamy RV-7A N174JL 240 hrs Camarillo, CA RV-10 lurker www.jacklockamy.com ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "John Gonzalez" <indigoonlatigo(at)msn.com>
Subject: Re: elevator control horn drilling
Date: Sep 27, 2006
Hi Richard, I just got off the phone with Van's and asked them to have the powers that be review the building manual and make a comment about being careful to respect the up/down dimension of where the drill will exit out of the second hole on the second horn. Not jus tbe concerned about the most aft horn being the designated guide. I wanted to ask you the minimum edge distance as you stated, is that in steel or in alluminum? I discussed the issue of welding on a plate and and he did not think that was necessary, there also could be a weakening of the original material at the intersection of the new plate and the horn. Just for discussion, (If I could not sleep because of this) he discussed an alternate remedy, riveting another plate of similair material(4130 steel) with say 6 rivets using the same hole, just to extend the gap between the hole edge and the bottom edge of the horn. As I have stated, I have 6/32 of material on the bottom edge from hole edge to horn bottom edge, and when this is all torqued down with washers pinching this together I wonder how exposed to stresses this 6/32" of material will be. still need to review the connection, but alteast there are a couple of alternative remedies other than rework JOhn G. 409 >From: "Richard Garforth" <richard(at)hawk.flyer.co.uk> >To: "\"John Gonzalez\"" >Subject: Re: RV10-List: elevator control horn drilling >Date: Tue, 26 Sep 2006 12:40:50 +0100 > >John, > >I fell in the same hole ! I finished up replacing both horns to get the >required edge distance. Its a pain Vans don't tell you to look for the >highest/lowest as well as the rearmost horn. My bet is there is a lot of >RV10 horns out there with inadequate edge distance to the control rod hole. >BTW the replacement horns were exactly the same and if I had followed the >instructions the same thing would have happened again.The recommended >minimum edge distance for a 3/16" hole is 3/8" (hole centre to edge). see >AC43. >Ironically the fore and aft edge distance is already increased by the small >flange so its the vertical that's more important. If its any consolation >changing the horn was easily achieved it just cost time and money. > >Regards > >Richard (UK builder 40368) ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "David McNeill" <dlm46007(at)cox.net>
Subject: True Flight/ Truemap software
Date: Sep 27, 2006
Just a PIREP on their product and service. I purchased the software, the XM receiver and WAAS GPS in June 2006. At that I was told by their sales representative that the Data Base updates for a year were included in the price. I activated the XM weather in June so that I could test it on my trip to OSH. XM weather bills quarterly. The software and XM weather worked satisfactorily on the trip. Upon return home I decided to cancel XM weather and did so prior to the new billing period for me. One month later the next billing was on my credit card statement. Several phone calls required to get that removed. About a week ago I received an email that my data base update subscription was expiring and I needed to renew for $199. I emailed them that I had been assured that the first years subscription was included. Their representative replied that he had never seen a years subscription included and would only allow 7 months. I just looked at my credit card online and found a billing from them for $199. I just emailed them demanding that they remove the unauthorized charge and I also notified the credit card company. As you can see its hard to discard this TAR BABY. Buyer beware. ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: True Flight/ Truemap software
Date: Sep 27, 2006
From: "Bobby J. Hughes" <bhughes(at)qnsi.net>
David, I have been looking at their product as well. Here is what there web site says. Database Subscription The basic annual database subscription includes the following updates: $199.00 I used AnywhereMap for a couple of years and loved it. Anywheremap and True flight are suppose to interface with the Zaon Traffic box so I have been looking at both. I have not been flying since last December when I sold my Skyhawk so have not needed to renew or purchase a new system. True Flights flight level data derived from XM winds is a strong selling point for their product. Did you get a chance to test that feature? Bobby 40116 ________________________________ From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of David McNeill Sent: Wednesday, September 27, 2006 3:42 PM Subject: RV10-List: True Flight/ Truemap software Just a PIREP on their product and service. I purchased the software, the XM receiver and WAAS GPS in June 2006. At that I was told by their sales representative that the Data Base updates for a year were included in the price. I activated the XM weather in June so that I could test it on my trip to OSH. XM weather bills quarterly. The software and XM weather worked satisfactorily on the trip. Upon return home I decided to cancel XM weather and did so prior to the new billing period for me. One month later the next billing was on my credit card statement. Several phone calls required to get that removed. About a week ago I received an email that my data base update subscription was expiring and I needed to renew for $199. I emailed them that I had been assured that the first years subscription was included. Their representative replied that he had never seen a years subscription included and would only allow 7 months. I just looked at my credit card online and found a billing from them for $199. I just emailed them demanding that they remove the unauthorized charge and I also notified the credit card company. As you can see its hard to discard this TAR BABY. Buyer beware. ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Wayne Edgerton" <wayne.e(at)grandecom.net>
Subject: cowl louvers
Date: Sep 27, 2006
Flying RV10 people, I'm in the process of finishing up my cowling and baffling. In looking at the louvers that go on the bottom back of the cowl I have been debating whether the additional louvers that Alex offers would be worth installing. Have any of you flying had difficulty with engine heat problem and do you feel that Alex's additional louvers would be worth installing. In case you haven't seen the louvers I'm talking about here is the web address where you can see what they look like. http://www.rvtraining.com/html/rv10_pics.html Any help you can give me would be greatly appreciated. Wayne Edgerton #40336 ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: New Service Bulletins
From: "bcondrey" <bob.condrey(at)baesystems.com>
Date: Sep 27, 2006
Van's posted a Service Bulletin and a Service Letter on a couple of our favorite subjects within the last few days. http://www.vansaircraft.com/pdf/sb06-9-20.pdf http://www.vansaircraft.com/pdf/U-1023.pdf Bob Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=64406#64406 ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Avionics Mounting tubes/racks
Date: Sep 28, 2006
From: "McGANN, Ron" <ron.mcgann(at)baesystems.com>
G'day all, I would like to finalise cutting the panel and subpanel for my avionics stack, but want to delay the big bucks outlay for my proposed Garmin stack for a few months. Stack configuration is GMA340/GNS430/SL30/GTX327. Does anyone see any problem with finishing the panel cutting and installing the tubes/racks without having the actual avionics? More importantly, where can you buy the mounting tubes/hardware without buying the avionics? cheers, Ron #187 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Rob Kermanj <flysrv10(at)gmail.com>
Subject: Re: Avionics Mounting tubes/racks
Date: Sep 28, 2006
I did exactly what you are trying to do. I purchased the racks from Straks Avionics and used the Approach Hub to completely wire everything. I then purchased the avionics once I was within couple of months of flying. Gulf Coast Avionics will also sell you the trays. Check to see how long it will take to get your avionics. Most shops do not keep them in stock. Do not archiove Rob Kermanj On Sep 28, 2006, at 3:35 AM, McGANN, Ron wrote: > G'day all, > > I would like to finalise cutting the panel and subpanel for my > avionics stack, but want to delay the big bucks outlay for my > proposed Garmin stack for a few months. Stack configuration is > GMA340/GNS430/SL30/GTX327. > > Does anyone see any problem with finishing the panel cutting and > installing the tubes/racks without having the actual avionics? > More importantly, where can you buy the mounting tubes/hardware > without buying the avionics? > > cheers, > > Ron > > #187 > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "John Testement" <jwt(at)roadmapscoaching.com>
Subject: Avionics Mounting tubes/racks
Date: Sep 28, 2006
The mounting tubes/stack comes with each of the devices. Stark may be able to sell them separately. You can mount all of the stacks without the avionics. I got all of my stuff from Stark and they make the cables for each. This is working out real well - all of the device to device connections are made. You still have a lot of work wiring it all to the rest of the airplane. John Testement HYPERLINK "mailto:jwt(at)roadmapscoaching.com"jwt(at)roadmapscoaching.com 40321 Richmond, VA Finish kit - wheel fairings, cowl prep, panel wiring _____ From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of McGANN, Ron Sent: Thursday, September 28, 2006 3:36 AM Subject: RV10-List: Avionics Mounting tubes/racks G'day all, I would like to finalise cutting the panel and subpanel for my avionics stack, but want to delay the big bucks outlay for my proposed Garmin stack for a few months. Stack configuration is GMA340/GNS430/SL30/GTX327. Does anyone see any problem with finishing the panel cutting and installing the tubes/racks without having the actual avionics? More importantly, where can you buy the mounting tubes/hardware without buying the avionics? cheers, Ron #187 "http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List"http://www.matronics.com/Navig ator?RV10-List "http://www.matronics.com/contribution"http://www.matronics.com/contribution -- ________________________________________________________________________________
From: GRANSCOTT(at)aol.com
Date: Sep 28, 2006
Subject: Re: GRT EFIS
In a message dated 9/28/2006 6:40:49 AM Eastern Standard Time, wv4i(at)bellsouth.net writes: even though a Class C airspace lateral limit is 2 miles to the east, at which point the floor is 1200' MSL. If you are entering into the mode C area it begins at the ground and extends to the upper limits of the airspace it is not the same area as the altitude limits...that is one needs to have the transponder on in the Mode C area outer limits not just in the altitude restrictions. Mode C area is the entire controlled defined area not just the altitude area...ground to the upper limits whether in a Class C, B or A. Patrick ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Sep 28, 2006
From: Robert <retiredpilot03-serv(at)yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: Avionics Mounting tubes/racks
Hi Ron, I am using the exact same stack as yours. I am using the radio shop at JAARS to purchase and layout the panel. How are you handling the depth of the GNS430/SL30 in the panel? I want the stack to be exactly in the middle which conflicts with the brace and also the sub-panel is only 10 or so inches from the main panel. I have some thoughts but I would like to hear yours or anyone elses also. Thanks Robert "McGANN, Ron" wrote: Avionics Mounting tubes/racks G'day all, I would like to finalise cutting the panel and subpanel for my avionics stack, but want to delay the big bucks outlay for my proposed Garmin stack for a few months. Stack configuration is GMA340/GNS430/SL30/GTX327. Does anyone see any problem with finishing the panel cutting and installing the tubes/racks without having the actual avionics? More importantly, where can you buy the mounting tubes/hardware without buying the avionics? cheers, Ron #187 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Perry Casson" <pcasson(at)sasktel.net>
Subject: elt and strobe power supply mounting
Date: Sep 28, 2006
Hi All, Looking for ideas for how ELT's and strobe power supplies are being mounted in the tailcone Doublers on the belly skin? Tray's attached to J-Channel? Or what? Thanks Perry Casson Regina,Canada ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Rene Felker" <rene(at)felker.com>
Subject: elt and strobe power supply mounting
Date: Sep 28, 2006
Vans has just put out a $15 kit for the Strobe, I think I am going to try that. You can find it on their site. Rene' Felker _____ From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Perry Casson Sent: Thursday, September 28, 2006 7:03 AM Subject: RV10-List: elt and strobe power supply mounting Hi All, Looking for ideas for how ELT's and strobe power supplies are being mounted in the tailcone Doublers on the belly skin? Tray's attached to J-Channel? Or what? Thanks Perry Casson Regina,Canada ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: elt and strobe power supply mounting
Date: Sep 28, 2006
From: "RV Builder (Michael Sausen)" <rvbuilder(at)sausen.net>
I know a bunch of people have mounted the ELT on the deck at the rear of the tail where the HS/VS bolt on. It's a bit cozy but fit's very well. With all of the rigidity in the structure surrounding it, it may also have a little better chance of surviving a crash. <http://www.mykitlog.com/users/display_log.php?user=msausen&project=2 2&c ategory=626&log=14108&row=9> Michael Sausen -10 #352 Buildus Interuptus From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Perry Casson Sent: Thursday, September 28, 2006 8:03 AM Subject: RV10-List: elt and strobe power supply mounting Hi All, Looking for ideas for how ELT's and strobe power supplies are being mounted in the tailcone Doublers on the belly skin? Tray's attached to J-Channel? Or what? Thanks Perry Casson Regina,Canada ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Aileron outer hinge bearing issue
Date: Sep 28, 2006
From: "Vern W. Smith" <Vern(at)teclabsinc.com>
Hi All, While installing my ailerons I noticed drawing 4 on page 21-8 (this is the drawing that calls out the hardware used on the outboard aileron hinge) shows two normal washers and one thin washer in between the outboard aileron hinge bracket and the bearing. Looking at mine this is not enough shimming to allow the bolt to tighten the hinge bracket down onto the "bearing ball". I had to add one more washer to the stack, to get it to chinch up. Otherwise the bolt would just turn inside the bearing hole rather than the bear doing its job. Has anyone else seen this or is this just one of those things everybody knows? I didn't find anything in the archives. Vern Smith (40324) ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Sep 28, 2006
From: Deems Davis <deemsdavis(at)cox.net>
Subject: Re: elt and strobe power supply mounting
I just saw that Van's is now selling mounting plates for both of these on their web site. Deems Davis # 406 Panel/Finishing http://deemsrv10.com/ RV Builder (Michael Sausen) wrote: > I know a bunch of people have mounted the ELT on the deck at the rear > of the tail where the HS/VS bolt on. Its a bit cozy but fits very > well. With all of the rigidity in the structure surrounding it, it may > also have a little better chance of surviving a crash. > > <http://www.mykitlog.com/users/display_log.php?user=msausen&project=22&category=626&log=14108&row=9> > > Michael Sausen > > -10 #352 Buildus Interuptus > > *From:* owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com > [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] *On Behalf Of *Perry Casson > *Sent:* Thursday, September 28, 2006 8:03 AM > *To:* rv10-list(at)matronics.com > *Subject:* RV10-List: elt and strobe power supply mounting > > Hi All, > > Looking for ideas for how ELTs and strobe power supplies are being > mounted in the tailcone Doublers on the belly skin? Trays attached to > J-Channel? Or what? > > Thanks > > Perry Casson > > Regina,Canada > >* * > >* * > >** > >** > >** > >** > >** > >** > >** > >** > >** > >** > >** > >** > >** > >** > >** > >** > >** > >** > >** > >** > >** > >* * > >* > > >* > ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Sep 28, 2006
From: "Fred Williams, M.D." <drfred@cox-internet.com>
Subject: ELT mount plate
Has anybody used/mounted the plate from Van's yet? Any pictures? Where exactly does it mount? Is there any reason that one cannot use the rivet gun on top the c arm to form the skin dimples? It looks like it was made to fit and sure is easier than swinging a mallet. (is this one of those duh moments?) Dr Fred 40515 dimpling tank skins when the carma hit........ ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Sep 28, 2006
From: Rick <ricksked(at)earthlink.net>
Subject: Re: ELT mount plate
I wouldn't but you can used the rivet gun and the C-frame to rivet...makes perfect 470 rivets. I made my own moutnign plates, ELT attaches to the J stringers, Strobe power to the floor skins in the tailcone right side next to the battery. Just used angle material purcahsed way back from Vans, some 1/8" and 1/16" stuff. KISS. I would have bought the Van's stuff given the chance, looks like it is made to attach to the bottom skins or maybe the stiffeners. Both components are pretty light. Rick S. 40185 -----Original Message----- >From: "Fred Williams, M.D." <drfred@cox-internet.com> >Sent: Sep 28, 2006 9:34 AM >To: RV 10 >Subject: RV10-List: ELT mount plate > > >Has anybody used/mounted the plate from Van's yet? Any pictures? Where >exactly does it mount? > >Is there any reason that one cannot use the rivet gun on top the c arm >to form the skin dimples? It looks like it was made to fit and sure is >easier than swinging a mallet. (is this one of those duh moments?) > >Dr Fred > >40515 > >dimpling tank skins when the carma hit........ > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Sep 28, 2006
From: Tim Olson <Tim(at)MyRV10.com>
Subject: RV-10 Nose Wheel Safety Issue : Repost from RV-List
I didn't see that Russ posted this to the RV-10 list, just the RV-List, so I am reposting it here. ------------------------------------ I lost in flight one of the U-1024's (page 48-17) attached to the 1013C, bracket along with the mounting screw (Allen head) and lock washer. I am not sure what caused the loss but no damage occurred. I have since drilled the heads of the two mounting screws and drilled a safety wire hole in the two 1013C's so that I can safety wire the two mounting screws to the mounting bracket and this cannot happen again. I drilled the heads in two 90 degree locations so that when I safety wire I can run the wire from either the top or bottom of the screw head and the tow bar will not sub on the safety wire while moving the airplane. If both U-1024's had come loose and the 1013C mounting brackets had both slide back I could have suffered major damage to the nose wheel pant on landing. My assumption is that while moving the RV-10 with the two bar the two bar pressure caused the mounting screw to back off the lock washer enough that during flight the vibration caused the screw to back out far enough to drop off the U-1024 into somebody's pasture. __________________ Russ Daves Lubbock, TX N710RV - RV-10 First flight 7/28/06 ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Avionics Mounting tubes/racks
Date: Sep 29, 2006
From: "McGANN, Ron" <ron.mcgann(at)baesystems.com>
Hi Robert, My stack is located just to the right of the F1044 subassy. The sub panel will need to be cut and reinforced per plans 41-3 to accommodate the GNS430 and SL30. Proposed panel attached. If there is not enough space for the EIS in the stack, I will move it under the Copilot MFD. cheers, Ron -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of Robert Sent: Thursday, 28 September 2006 10:33 PM Subject: Re: RV10-List: Avionics Mounting tubes/racks Hi Ron, I am using the exact same stack as yours. I am using the radio shop at JAARS to purchase and layout the panel. How are you handling the depth of the GNS430/SL30 in the panel? I want the stack to be exactly in the middle which conflicts with the brace and also the sub-panel is only 10 or so inches from the main panel. I have some thoughts but I would like to hear yours or anyone elses also. Thanks Robert "McGANN, Ron" wrote: G'day all, I ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Richard Sipp" <rsipp(at)earthlink.net>
Subject: Re: elt and strobe power supply mounting
Date: Sep 28, 2006
Van's just announced the availability of a bracket to mount ELTs and strobe power supplies. See the main page of the web site. http://www.vansaircraft.com/ Dick Sipp 40065 finishing ----- Original Message ----- From: Perry Casson To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com Sent: Thursday, September 28, 2006 9:02 AM Subject: RV10-List: elt and strobe power supply mounting Hi All, Looking for ideas for how ELT's and strobe power supplies are being mounted in the tailcone Doublers on the belly skin? Tray's attached to J-Channel? Or what? Thanks Perry Casson Regina,Canada ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: New Service Bulletins
From: "johngoodman" <johngoodman(at)earthlink.net>
Date: Sep 28, 2006
I don't care what the Chief Pilot says about you guys (g). Sorry about that, just an old crewroom joke that still works. Obviously, the folks at Vans listen. John bcondrey wrote: > Van's posted a Service Bulletin and a Service Letter on a couple of our favorite subjects within the last few days. > > http://www.vansaircraft.com/pdf/sb06-9-20.pdf > http://www.vansaircraft.com/pdf/U-1023.pdf > > Bob -------- #40572 Empennage HS N711JG reserved Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=64598#64598 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Wayne Edgerton" <wayne.e(at)grandecom.net>
Subject: Re: elt and strobe power supply mounting
Date: Sep 29, 2006
I just made a doubler plate for the Wheelen unit behind the baggage compartment with nut plates on it for the ELT unit to attach to. I actually put the ELT unit in the baggage compartment just to the left close to the seat back at the first part of the baggage area so it's kind of out of the way. The reason I put it there is because in case of an accident, and I was somehow in a remote area, I would be able to unhook it and take it with me or, with the type I have, it is also a radio so I would be able to communicate. I had thought about hiding it behind the back baggage wall area but thinking the worst thought if somehow the back area was made inaccessible by the accident I wouldn't be able to get at the unit. Wayne Edgerton #40336 ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Sep 29, 2006
From: Deems Davis <deemsdavis(at)cox.net>
Subject: [Fwd: Rocket-List: Barrett IO-540]
Just saw this on the Rocket list and thought someone might benefit from it. This is one !@#$ of a deal! Deems Davis # 406 Panel/Finishing http://deemsrv10.com/ -------- Original Message -------- Subject: Rocket-List: Barrett IO-540 Date: Fri, 29 Sep 2006 09:00:37 -0700 (PDT) From: rob ray <smokyray(at)yahoo.com> Hi Guys, My neighbor is selling his brand new (still in crate) Monty Barret built experimental IO-540-X (A1A5).ser# 8686 It has all the paperwork, dyno data and all accessories except the prop governor. $30K. $28K minus the accessories. It's a great deal, if you haven't checked new IO-540 prices lately, especially a Barrett engine. I'd buy it if I could... Rob Ray 863-529-4744 * * ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Sep 29, 2006
From: James Hein <n8vim(at)arrl.net>
Subject: Finish kit for alternative engine
Hey y'all! Van's finish kit is listed for "I/O-540 Lycoming engines only". My question is: What would I need to add/drop from the "finish kit" if I want to use an Egg Subaru? Thanks! -Jim 40384 (Still on bottom wing skins) ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: [Fwd: Rocket-List: Barrett IO-540]
Date: Sep 29, 2006
From: "Rhonda Bewley" <Rhonda(at)bpaengines.com>
This is an overhauled engine that we built from a customer's core rather than "new." It is an angle head engine with a big main crank and overhauled channel chrome cylinders. Rhonda Barrett-Bewley Barrett Precision Engines, Inc. 2870-B N. Sheridan Rd. Tulsa, OK 74115 www.barrettprecisionengines.com -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Deems Davis Sent: Friday, September 29, 2006 11:37 AM Subject: RV10-List: [Fwd: Rocket-List: Barrett IO-540] Just saw this on the Rocket list and thought someone might benefit from it. This is one !@#$ of a deal! Deems Davis # 406 Panel/Finishing http://deemsrv10.com/ -------- Original Message -------- Subject: Rocket-List: Barrett IO-540 Date: Fri, 29 Sep 2006 09:00:37 -0700 (PDT) From: rob ray <smokyray(at)yahoo.com> Hi Guys, My neighbor is selling his brand new (still in crate) Monty Barret built experimental IO-540-X (A1A5).ser# 8686 It has all the paperwork, dyno data and all accessories except the prop governor. $30K. $28K minus the accessories. It's a great deal, if you haven't checked new IO-540 prices lately, especially a Barrett engine. I'd buy it if I could... Rob Ray 863-529-4744 * * ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Sep 29, 2006
From: Rick <ricksked(at)earthlink.net>
Subject: Re: Finish kit for alternative engine
James. The only thing in the finish kit I have found to be Lycoming specific is the engine mount, spinner and the cowl. Be advised the nose strut mounts to the engine mount so that's some engineering left for you to figure out. The firewall forward kit is almost ALL Lycoming specific though. Rick S. 40185 -----Original Message----- >From: James Hein <n8vim(at)arrl.net> >Sent: Sep 29, 2006 12:38 PM >To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com >Subject: RV10-List: Finish kit for alternative engine > > >Hey y'all! > > Van's finish kit is listed for "I/O-540 Lycoming engines only". > >My question is: What would I need to add/drop from the "finish kit" if I >want to use an Egg Subaru? > >Thanks! > >-Jim 40384 (Still on bottom wing skins) > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Finish kit for alternative engine
Date: Sep 29, 2006
From: "Lloyd, Daniel R." <LloydDR(at)wernerco.com>
With your Eggenfellner FWF kit, you will get the main engine mount, but will still need the nose wheel strut and attaching hardware. Depending on the cowl you choose, the standard from Vans, or the James cowl from Eggenfellner. Everything else is still the same so far. Give me a call directly and we can discuss it, as I have the list of what I left out at home. Dan Lloyd RV10E (N289DT) -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of James Hein Sent: Friday, September 29, 2006 12:38 PM Subject: RV10-List: Finish kit for alternative engine Hey y'all! Van's finish kit is listed for "I/O-540 Lycoming engines only". My question is: What would I need to add/drop from the "finish kit" if I want to use an Egg Subaru? Thanks! -Jim 40384 (Still on bottom wing skins) ________________________________________________________________________________
From: John Ackerman <johnag5b(at)cableone.net>
Subject: Re: [Fwd: Rocket-List: Barrett IO-540]
Date: Sep 29, 2006
Thanks, for this, Deems! For those of us who are not up to speed on the IO-540 designators, this one is an angle valve. Also it has channel Chrome cylinders... John Ackerman On Sep 29, 2006, at 9:36 AM, Deems Davis wrote: > > Just saw this on the Rocket list and thought someone might benefit > from it. This is one !@#$ of a deal! > > Deems Davis # 406 > Panel/Finishing > http://deemsrv10.com/ > > -------- Original Message -------- > Subject: Rocket-List: Barrett IO-540 > Date: Fri, 29 Sep 2006 09:00:37 -0700 (PDT) > From: rob ray <smokyray(at)yahoo.com> > Reply-To: rocket-list(at)matronics.com > To: rocket-list(at)matronics.com > > > Hi Guys, > My neighbor is selling his brand new (still in crate) Monty Barret > built experimental IO-540-X (A1A5).ser# 8686 It has all the paperwork, > dyno data and all accessories except the prop governor. $30K. $28K > minus the accessories. It's a great deal, if you haven't checked new > IO-540 prices lately, especially a Barrett engine. I'd buy it if I > could... > Rob Ray > 863-529-4744 > > * > > > * > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: speckter(at)comcast.net
Date: Sep 29, 2006
On all the fuel injected engines I flew behind, the fuel flow meter was connected to the spider on the top of the engine. To start the engine you turned on the fuel pump until you got a fuel flow indication then started it. With the electronic engine moniters the fuel flow is measured at the flowscan sensor in the tunnel. How do you know how much to prime when starting? Gary 40274

On all the fuel injected engines I flew behind, the fuel flow meter was connected to the spider on the top of the engine. To start the engine you turned on the fuel pump until you got a fuel flow indication then started it. With the electronic engine moniters the fuel flow is measured at the flowscan sensor in the tunnel. How do you know how much to prime when starting?

Gary

40274

________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: No Title
From: "zackrv8" <zackrv8(at)verizon.net>
Date: Sep 29, 2006
Gary, The Electronics International Fuel Flow Transducer is located just before the spider, not in the tunnel. When I called them, they told me to NOT put it in the tunnel! They do not use the Flow Scan Transducer. They make their own. Nice unit. Zack [quote="speckter(at)comcast.net"]On all the fuel injected engines I flew behind, the fuel flow meter was connected to the spider on the top of the engine. To start the engine you turned on the fuel pump until you got a fuel flow indication then started it. With the electronic engine moniters the fuel flow is measured at the flowscan sensor in the tunnel. How do you know how much to prime when starting? Gary 40274 > [b] -------- RV8 #80125 RV10 # 40512 Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=64727#64727 ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: FW: Rocket-List: Barrett IO-540
Date: Sep 29, 2006
From: "John W. Cox" <johnwcox(at)pacificnw.com>
This deal is too good not to list on our list. John Cox #40600 ________________________________ From: owner-rocket-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rocket-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of rob ray Sent: Friday, September 29, 2006 9:01 AM Subject: Rocket-List: Barrett IO-540 Hi Guys, My neighbor is selling his brand new (still in crate) Monty Barret built experimental IO-540-X (A1A5).ser# 8686 It has all the paperwork, dyno data and all accessories except the prop governor. $30K. $28K minus the accessories. It's a great deal, if you haven't checked new IO-540 prices lately, especially a Barrett engine. I'd buy it if I could... Rob Ray 863-529-4744 ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: FW: Rocket-List: Barrett IO-540
Date: Sep 29, 2006
From: "Condrey, Bob (US SSA)" <bob.condrey(at)baesystems.com>
Not so fast, it all depends... If it started out life as an O-540-A1A5 then it's a parallel valve engine (originally rated at 250HP @ 2575) and a good match for an RV-10. If it started out as an IO-540-A1A5 then it's an angle valve engine (originally rated at 290HP @ 2575 RPM) and won't physically fit on an RV-10. Note that Barrett lists 2 variants of the IO-540-X on their web site that are VERY different: the "Light Weight IO-540-X" is based on a parallel valve engine, the "Heavy Hitter IO-540-X" is based on an angle valve engine. It would be easy to identify what this is either by looking at the valve covers or calling Barrett, but based on the information posted so far, there's no way to tell. Bob _____ From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of John W. Cox Sent: Friday, September 29, 2006 4:36 PM Subject: RV10-List: FW: Rocket-List: Barrett IO-540 This deal is too good not to list on our list. John Cox #40600 _____ From: owner-rocket-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rocket-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of rob ray Sent: Friday, September 29, 2006 9:01 AM Subject: Rocket-List: Barrett IO-540 Hi Guys, My neighbor is selling his brand new (still in crate) Monty Barret built experimental IO-540-X (A1A5).ser# 8686 It has all the paperwork, dyno data and all accessories except the prop governor. $30K. $28K minus the accessories. It's a great deal, if you haven't checked new IO-540 prices lately, especially a Barrett engine. I'd buy it if I could... Rob Ray 863-529-4744 ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Rocket-List: Barrett IO-540
From: "N777TY" <microsmurfer(at)yahoo.com>
Date: Sep 29, 2006
It *is* an angle valve.. as I understand, not the best fit for a -10... -------- RV-7A N777TY (res) Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=64755#64755 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Russell Daves" <dav1111(at)cox.net>
Subject: RV-10 Nose Wheel Safety Issue Update
Date: Sep 30, 2006
I lost in flight one of the U-1024's (page 48-17) attached to the 1013C, bracket along with the mounting screw (Allen head) and lock washer. No damage occurred on landing. I had originally thought about drilling the heads of the two mounting screws and safety wire to the 1013C's but after drilling the heads I decided that the better method was to drill down through the U-1024, through the mounting screw, and then run the safety wire back to the 1013 bracket. It worked great. I didn't have my camera at the airport so I failed to get any pictures. If both U-1024's had come loose and both 1013C mounting brackets had shifted back I could have suffered major damage to the nose wheel pant and possible to the gear leg fairing on landing. My assumption is that while moving the RV-10 with the tow bar the tow bar pressure caused the mounting screw to back off the lock washer enough that during flight the vibration caused the screw to back out far enough to drop off the U-1024 into somebody's pasture. A smart move would be to check the tightness of the screw with an Allen wrench after each use of a Tow Bar to move the airplane or to safety wire as above. Russ Daves N710RV RV-10 First Flight 7/28/06 ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: FW: Rocket-List: Barrett IO-540
Date: Sep 30, 2006
From: "John W. Cox" <johnwcox(at)pacificnw.com>
Bob, the grammatically correct answer is it might not fit in the currently constricting factory offered RV-10 cowl. The mods to a Wholly Cowl or another variant might just allow such a unit. Weight is far more important than fitting a cowl which several builders have already exchanged for an improved version. Has anyone asked the James Group? Michael.. do you know the answer? Barrett has confirmed what it is as an engine. The deal merits an in-depth discussion, so builders better understand the opportunities and limitations. To my knowledge, only the factory constricted cowl is currently in use. Vic and Ed are/have installed modified stock dimensioned engines. Builders are still in the queue for the new variant cowl. John #600 ________________________________ From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Condrey, Bob (US SSA) Sent: Friday, September 29, 2006 4:58 PM Subject: RE: RV10-List: FW: Rocket-List: Barrett IO-540 Not so fast, it all depends... If it started out life as an O-540-A1A5 then it's a parallel valve engine (originally rated at 250HP @ 2575) and a good match for an RV-10. If it started out as an IO-540-A1A5 then it's an angle valve engine (originally rated at 290HP @ 2575 RPM) and won't physically fit on an RV-10. Note that Barrett lists 2 variants of the IO-540-X on their web site that are VERY different: the "Light Weight IO-540-X" is based on a parallel valve engine, the "Heavy Hitter IO-540-X" is based on an angle valve engine. It would be easy to identify what this is either by looking at the valve covers or calling Barrett, but based on the information posted so far, there's no way to tell. Bob ________________________________ From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of John W. Cox Sent: Friday, September 29, 2006 4:36 PM Subject: RV10-List: FW: Rocket-List: Barrett IO-540 This deal is too good not to list on our list. John Cox #40600 ________________________________ From: owner-rocket-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rocket-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of rob ray Sent: Friday, September 29, 2006 9:01 AM Subject: Rocket-List: Barrett IO-540 Hi Guys, My neighbor is selling his brand new (still in crate) Monty Barret built experimental IO-540-X (A1A5).ser# 8686 It has all the paperwork, dyno data and all accessories except the prop governor. $30K. $28K minus the accessories. It's a great deal, if you haven't checked new IO-540 prices lately, especially a Barrett engine. I'd buy it if I could... Rob Ray 863-529-4744 ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Sep 30, 2006
From: rob ray <smokyray(at)yahoo.com>
Subject: Barrett IO-540X for sale...
Guys, After many questions here are further details on my neighbors IO-540X for sale. The engine is an overhauled Barrett IO-540-X experimental Angle Valve engine with 8.7:1 compression & chrome cyls. It was major overhauled and dynoed in 2004. It includes a new Skytech starter, New B&C Alt, overhauled injector servo, Slick Mags, plugs and is preserved in the shipping crate. All the dyno data and logbooks are complete from Barrett. The engine dynoed 264.2 HP at 2517 RPM. $30K for everything, $28K minus accessories. (accessories are worth>2K) My neighbor bought a Glasair project which included this engine, sold the airplane and now wants to sell the engine to pay for his Howard DGA project. A win-win scenario for someone who needs a good IO-540... Rob Ray 863-529-4744 --------------------------------- All-new Yahoo! Mail - Fire up a more powerful email and get things done faster. ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Passed DAR!!!!!!!
From: "Jim & Julie Wade" <jwadejr(at)hughes.net>
Date: Sep 30, 2006
Just finished inspection, with zero discrepances!!! Should fly about Wednesday!!!!!!! Jim & Julie Wade 40383 Slow Build Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=64871#64871 Attachments: http://forums.matronics.com//files/pict0752_858.jpg ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Jack Sargeant" <k5wiv(at)amsat.org>
Subject: Passed DAR!!!!!!!
Date: Sep 30, 2006
Congratulations!!! May the fly-off be boring. Jack & Cecilia Sargeant 1127 Patricia St. Wichita, KS 67208-2642 316/683-5268 -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of Jim & Julie Wade Sent: Saturday, September 30, 2006 5:29 PM Subject: RV10-List: Passed DAR!!!!!!! Just finished inspection, with zero discrepances!!! Should fly about Wednesday!!!!!!! Jim & Julie Wade 40383 Slow Build Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=64871#64871 Attachments: http://forums.matronics.com//files/pict0752_858.jpg ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "John Gonzalez" <indigoonlatigo(at)msn.com>
Subject: Elevator control horns
Date: Sep 30, 2006
Sorry guys to bring this up again, but it seems that today I spent going backwards. I noticed this afternoon while installing my elevator pushrod that once I clamped down on my connections to the elevator horns that my elevator counterbalance arms were out of sink with one another. At their most forward edge, one side was raised by about 3/32" in referencing the top of the skins. EEEEEE!!!! Now I know the really great fighter jets use their elevators to aid in roll, but my situation perhaps might leave me in a slight constant roll to the right, not what I desire as I am planning doing more that flying circles over the airport. Maybe this was my benign spiral. In any case, I thought I drilled my elevator holes as "square as humanly posible" Perhaps not!! If not perfectly square once sinched tight, the head of the bolt and the nut will force the holes to line up and either push/pull,raise/lower or any combination there of, the second horn into alignment and thus perhaps force the elevator out "TRAIL" position. I had that earlier issue with the second hole being too near the bottom edge due to one horn being higher than the other as it is mounted on the elevator (due to jigging error) Now I am forced to do the method of welding or riveting that additional 4130 plate on to the second elevator horn and re drilling. So this got me thinking. Riverhead Aero should be making a drilling jig for this aspect of the project. Basically a block of steel drilled to 3/16" with a saw kerf cut though the bottom aspect of it so that it would slip over the bottom edge of the first drilled horn and this jig once clamped would not only keep the drill going perpendicular while the bit is between the two horns, but the block would also be on the outside of the first horn to guide the bit upon initial entry. The blocks thickness being the minimum space between the two horn+ the saw kerf+ the outside block(1/2") for the outer guide. I know there is a tooling error in all the horns, so the betweeen space id different, but he minimum thickness if metal between the two horns and then the builder could add a popsicle stick to take up the last remaining space. This assumes that both horn faces are parallel to each other from the get go. Just a thought from an anal dentist. John G. ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Rob Wright" <armywrights(at)adelphia.net>
Subject: Fuel lube
Date: Sep 30, 2006
What's a good Auto-Zone equivalent for fuel-lube to install brake/fuel lines? Rob Wright #392 fuse ________________________________________________________________________________
From: kilopapa(at)antelecom.net
Subject: Engines and temperatures
Date: Sep 30, 2006
See the link below for an article by Mike Busch on engine temps, running LOP and ROP, and proper fuel system adjustment to control CHT's. http://www.avweb.com/news/savvyaviator/193242-1.html?type=pf Kevin 40494 ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Sep 30, 2006
From: "JOHN STARN" <jhstarn(at)verizon.net>
Subject: Re: Fuel lube
Good question....have used "fuel lube" for 8-10 years...never found anything else that even comes close. (20+ years as plumbing, heating & A/C contractor, used lots of pipe dope & misc. sealants) We have had a 35mm film container that's was about 1/2 full that was given to us. Ten years and still have enough for 5-6 more "conditional inspections". Anyone out there who has lots...fill a 35mm film can & send it to him. I'll check here at APV and see if I can find him some. Do Not Archive.... KABONG HRII N561FS (GBA & GWB) ----- Original Message ----- From: Rob Wright To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com Sent: Saturday, September 30, 2006 8:41 PM Subject: RV10-List: Fuel lube What's a good Auto-Zone equivalent for fuel-lube to install brake/fuel lines? Rob Wright #392 fuse ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Engines and temperatures
Date: Sep 30, 2006
From: "John W. Cox" <johnwcox(at)pacificnw.com>
Comprehensive, In-depth detail, Accurate data and a valued article on the importance of running cooler temperatures. It only took Jim Hergert 300 hours to replace all six top ends on his Lancair IVP. So much for a $70,000 engine going TBO. At current rates that means three years before those who are missing this important step begin to report the cost of running on the high temperature side of the CHT gauges. Cowl temperatures, airflow differentials, balanced injectors, fuel flow rates, oil cooling efficiencies and CHTs are all important discussion points. Thanks Kevin. John 40600 -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of kilopapa(at)antelecom.net Sent: Saturday, September 30, 2006 9:13 PM Subject: RV10-List: Engines and temperatures See the link below for an article by Mike Busch on engine temps, running LOP and ROP, and proper fuel system adjustment to control CHT's. http://www.avweb.com/news/savvyaviator/193242-1.html?type=pf Kevin 40494 ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Air Compressors for newbies
Date: Sep 30, 2006
From: "John W. Cox" <johnwcox(at)pacificnw.com>
During my weekly walk down the Costco isle, I stumbled upon a Coleman 70 gallon, upright Black, 208VAC, air compressor. The represented airflow was 11.5cfm at 90 psi and a maximum output of 155psi. Item #700605 for $389.99. FYI. Nothing at Lowes or Home Depot Aviation Departments have come close. John 40600 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Russell Daves" <dav1111(at)cox.net>
Subject: Re: Passed DAR!!!!!!!
Date: Oct 01, 2006
Way to Go Jim & Julie!!!! You are really going to enjoy your -10. Russ Daves #40044 First Flight 7/28/06 ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jim & Julie Wade" <jwadejr(at)hughes.net> Sent: Saturday, September 30, 2006 5:28 PM Subject: RV10-List: Passed DAR!!!!!!! > > > Just finished inspection, with zero discrepances!!! > Should fly about Wednesday!!!!!!! > Jim & Julie Wade > 40383 > Slow Build > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=64871#64871 > > > Attachments: > > http://forums.matronics.com//files/pict0752_858.jpg > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "John Hasbrouck" <jhasbrouck(at)woh.rr.com>
Subject: Re: Elevator control horns
Date: Oct 01, 2006
John, All may not be lost. I encountered the same thing when I drilled mine. The right side counterweight is about 1/8 from being flush with the skin. Check your trailing edges. I'll bet they're even and that's where it counts. I've seen this same thing on Van's own -10. I don't think you will introduce any roll component. John Hasbrouck #40264 ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Oct 01, 2006
From: James Hein <n8vim(at)arrl.net>
Subject: Replacement Air Compressor
While we are on the subject, I am considering replacing my old compressor ("5HP" Coleman Black Max, 20 Gal. Tank). While it does do the job, it is quite loud and runs almost continuously while using the die grinder. I cannot talk to anyone in the shop while it is running. I am looking for a compressor which matches, or exceeds these specs: 1. Quiet !! (Yes, I know its subjective.. Use your best judgement) 2. 60-80 Gallon tank (Vertical) 3. Twin cylinder oiled compressor 4. 208/220v motor 5. Minimum 10CFM @ 90PSI 6. $800 or under Got any suggestions? -Jim 40384 ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Oct 01, 2006
From: Rick <ricksked(at)earthlink.net>
Subject: Re: Replacement Air Compressor
You can't beat that one John mentioned he saw at Costco....I think it exceeds your minimums for less than $400. Rick 40185 -----Original Message----- >From: James Hein <n8vim(at)arrl.net> >Sent: Oct 1, 2006 1:15 PM >To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com >Subject: RV10-List: Replacement Air Compressor > > >While we are on the subject, > > I am considering replacing my old compressor ("5HP" Coleman Black >Max, 20 Gal. Tank). While it does do the job, it is quite loud and runs >almost continuously while using the die grinder. I cannot talk to anyone >in the shop while it is running. > > I am looking for a compressor which matches, or exceeds these specs: > 1. Quiet !! (Yes, I know its subjective.. Use your best judgement) > 2. 60-80 Gallon tank (Vertical) > 3. Twin cylinder oiled compressor > 4. 208/220v motor > 5. Minimum 10CFM @ 90PSI > 6. $800 or under > > Got any suggestions? > >-Jim 40384 > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "John Hilger" <ninepapa(at)bendbroadband.com>
Subject: Re: Replacement Air Compressor
Date: Oct 01, 2006
Jim You might try Home Depot's VT6314. Mine is one and a half years old and runs well. Check the spec and price here http://www.homedepot.com/prel80/HDUS/EN_US/diy_main/pg_diy.jsp?CNTTYPE=PROD_META&CNTKEY=misc%2fsearchResults.jsp&BV_SessionID=@@@@1204152757.1159730986@@@@&BV_EngineID=cccladdimjmekddcgelceffdfgidgnk.0&MID=9876 John 40359 Fuselage. ----- Original Message ----- From: "James Hein" <n8vim(at)arrl.net> Sent: Sunday, October 01, 2006 10:15 AM Subject: RV10-List: Replacement Air Compressor > > While we are on the subject, > I am considering replacing my old compressor ("5HP" Coleman Black Max, 20 > Gal. Tank). While it does do the job, it is quite loud and runs almost > continuously while using the die grinder. I cannot talk to anyone in the > shop while it is running. > > I am looking for a compressor which matches, or exceeds these specs: > 1. Quiet !! (Yes, I know its subjective.. Use your best judgement) > 2. 60-80 Gallon tank (Vertical) > 3. Twin cylinder oiled compressor > 4. 208/220v motor > 5. Minimum 10CFM @ 90PSI > 6. $800 or under > > Got any suggestions? > > -Jim 40384 > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Replacement Air Compressor
Date: Oct 01, 2006
From: "John W. Cox" <johnwcox(at)pacificnw.com>
Give consideration to using the old tank with a simple vacuum compressor. You can do some fabulous composite lay-ups' with simple materials and the ole reservoir tank connected off the vacuum pump. Recovered compressors from junked refrigerators can be had for a song with simple soldering. The tanks alone at Harbor Freight are running $27.00. John 40600 -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of James Hein Sent: Sunday, October 01, 2006 10:16 AM Subject: RV10-List: Replacement Air Compressor While we are on the subject, I am considering replacing my old compressor ("5HP" Coleman Black Max, 20 Gal. Tank). While it does do the job, it is quite loud and runs almost continuously while using the die grinder. I cannot talk to anyone in the shop while it is running. I am looking for a compressor which matches, or exceeds these specs: 1. Quiet !! (Yes, I know its subjective.. Use your best judgement) 2. 60-80 Gallon tank (Vertical) 3. Twin cylinder oiled compressor 4. 208/220v motor 5. Minimum 10CFM @ 90PSI 6. $800 or under Got any suggestions? -Jim 40384 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "bob.kaufmann" <bob.kaufmann(at)cox.net>
Subject: Replacement Air Compressor
Date: Oct 01, 2006
Put the Costco special next to the neighbors laundry room, plumb in your tank in series in your garage, and if you are real sneaky, wire into your neighbors hot tub circuit. Does that make you eligible for an energy efficient unit or what? Seriously, going with the Costco unit and running your tank as a buffer extra capacity is a great idea. Do put on outside and the other anywhere, but the extra volume is well worth it. Bob K I hate fiberglass -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of John Hilger Sent: Sunday, October 01, 2006 11:37 AM Subject: Re: RV10-List: Replacement Air Compressor Jim You might try Home Depot's VT6314. Mine is one and a half years old and runs well. Check the spec and price here http://www.homedepot.com/prel80/HDUS/EN_US/diy_main/pg_diy.jsp?CNTTYPE=PROD_ META&CNTKEY=misc%2fsearchResults.jsp&BV_SessionID=@@@@1204152757.1159730986@ @@@&BV_EngineID=cccladdimjmekddcgelceffdfgidgnk.0&MID=9876 John 40359 Fuselage. ----- Original Message ----- From: "James Hein" <n8vim(at)arrl.net> Sent: Sunday, October 01, 2006 10:15 AM Subject: RV10-List: Replacement Air Compressor > > While we are on the subject, > I am considering replacing my old compressor ("5HP" Coleman Black Max, 20 > Gal. Tank). While it does do the job, it is quite loud and runs almost > continuously while using the die grinder. I cannot talk to anyone in the > shop while it is running. > > I am looking for a compressor which matches, or exceeds these specs: > 1. Quiet !! (Yes, I know its subjective.. Use your best judgement) > 2. 60-80 Gallon tank (Vertical) > 3. Twin cylinder oiled compressor > 4. 208/220v motor > 5. Minimum 10CFM @ 90PSI > 6. $800 or under > > Got any suggestions? > > -Jim 40384 > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: FLYING!!!!
From: "Jim & Julie Wade" <jwadejr(at)hughes.net>
Date: Oct 02, 2006
October 1 2006!!! The long awaited day. Julie flew it first, as that was my gift to her on her birthday Sept. 8th. Then it was my turn!!! We are both high time CFI's. I have flown maybe hundreds of planes, but none as delightful as this one. Feels a lot like a T-6 with the light controls. Have to do a little rigging, as we have to use a lot of right rudder, but just a very easy aircraft to fly!!!! I had flown the factory demo at Sun & Fun and had a good idea of how it flew, but to fly and have more time to play with it is outstanding. We have a lot of little bugs to work out in the electronics, but doesn't everyone??? The DAR gave us 50 miles due to speed and 40 hours because of the aerocomposite prop. Which is so smoooooooth. This engine (new) and prop combination is almost as smooth as a turbine!!!!!! (no lie) A little tweeking this morning and fly all day!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Keep building guys!!!!!!!! It is worth all the time and pain. Jim & Julie 40383 Slow Build Started May 1 2005 Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=65146#65146 ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: RV10-List 10/01/06 Final Rule on Lycoming 540 Crank
Date: Oct 02, 2006
From: "Condon, Philip M." <pcondon(at)mitre.org>
http://a257.g.akamaitech.net/7/257/2422/01jan20061800/edocket.access.gp o.gov/2006/E6-15958.htm [Federal Register: September 29, 2006 (Volume 71, Number 189)] [Rules and Regulations] [Page 57407-57412] >From the Federal Register Online via GPO Access [wais.access.gpo.gov] [DOCID:fr29se06-7] ----------------------------------------------------------------------- DEPARTMENT OF TRANSPORTATION Federal Aviation Administration 14 CFR Part 39 [Docket No. FAA-2006-24785; Directorate Identifier 2006-NE-20-AD; Amendment 39-14778; AD 2006-20-09] RIN 2120-AA64 Airworthiness Directives; Lycoming Engines (L)O-360, (L)IO-360, AEIO-360, O-540, IO-540, AEIO-540, (L)TIO-540, IO-580, and IO-720 Series Reciprocating Engines. AGENCY: Federal Aviation Administration (FAA), Department of Transportation (DOT). ACTION: Final rule. ----------------------------------------------------------------------- SUMMARY: The FAA is adopting a new airworthiness directive (AD) for certain Lycoming Engines (L)O-360, (L)IO-360, AEIO-360, O-540, IO-540, AEIO-540, (L)TIO-540, IO-580, and IO-720 series reciprocating engines. This AD requires replacing certain crankshafts. This AD results from reports of 23 confirmed failures of similar crankshafts in Lycoming Engines 360 and 540 series reciprocating engines. We are issuing this AD to prevent failure of the crankshaft, which will result in total engine power loss, in-flight engine failure, and possible loss of the aircraft. DATES: This AD becomes effective November 3, 2006. The Director of the Federal Register approved the incorporation by reference of certain publications listed in the regulations as of November 3, 2006. ADDRESSES: You can get the service information identified in this ad from Lycoming, 652 Oliver Street, Williamsport, PA 17701; telephone (570) 323-6181; fax (570) 327-7101, or on the internet at http://www.Lycoming.Textron.com. You may examine the AD docket on the Internet at http://dms.dot.gov or in Room PL-401 on the plaza level of the Nassif Building, 400 Seventh Street, SW., Washington, DC. FOR FURTHER INFORMATION CONTACT: Norm Perenson, Aerospace Engineer, New York Aircraft Certification Office, FAA, Engine & Propeller Directorate, 1600 Stewart Avenue, Suite 410, Westbury, NY 11590; telephone (516) 228-7337; fax (516) 794-5531. SUPPLEMENTARY INFORMATION: The FAA proposed to amend 14 CFR part 39 with a proposed airworthiness directive (AD). The proposed AD applies to certain Lycoming Engines (L)O-360, (L)IO-360, AEIO-360, O-540, IO- 540, AEIO-540, (L)TIO-540, IO-580, AEIO-580, and IO-720 series reciprocating engines. We published the proposed AD in the Federal Register on May 25, 2006 (71 FR 30078, May 19, 2006). That action proposed to require replacing certain crankshafts. Examining the AD Docket You may examine the docket that contains the AD, any comments received, and any final disposition in person at the Docket Management Facility Docket Office between 9 a.m. and 5 p.m., Monday through Friday, except Federal holidays. The Docket Office (telephone (800) 647-5227) is located on the plaza level of the Department of Transportation Nassif Building at the street address stated in ADDRESSES. Comments will be available in the AD docket shortly after the DMS receives them. Comments We provided the public the opportunity to participate in the development of this AD. We have considered the comments received. Suggest to Only Reference 360-Series Engines One private citizen suggests that since Lycoming Mandatory Service Bulletin (MSB) No. 569A, referenced in the proposed AD, only applies to 360-series engines with counterweighted crankshafts, the AD should do the same. We agree. The commenter is correct that MSB No. 569A refers only to counterweighted (L)O-360 engines. We changed paragraph (c) to limit the applicability of this AD to only those engines listed in the tables in Lycoming MSB No. 569A. The MSB lists the specific engine models and serial numbers (SNs) for engines that have a suspect crankshaft. The MSB also lists the specific crankshaft SNs installed on engines after the engine entered service. We have made this change to limit the AD's applicability to only those engines with a suspect crankshaft. Need To Correct the Table of Engine Models and Aircraft One private citizen states that we need to correct the table in paragraph (c), ``Applicability.'' The Lycoming O-540-J3C5D engine listed is actually used in the normally-aspirated Cessna R182, not the turbocharged TR182, as currently listed. The engine in the TR182 is the O-540-L3C5D. We agree, and have corrected the table. We need to note, however, that the table is provided for information only and does not control whether the AD applies to a listed engine/aircraft combination. As we have noted in paragraph (c), the affected engines may or may not be installed in the listed aircraft models. 12-Year Overhaul Limit Not in Lycoming Engines Service Instruction (SI) No. 1009AR One private citizen states that the 12-year overhaul limit referred to in the proposed rule is not in Lycoming Engines SI No. 1009AR, as we stated. We do not agree. The Lycoming Engines service instruction states that engines that do not reach the recommended overhaul hours specified in that publication should be overhauled in the twelfth year. We note that this AD does not require an engine overhaul. We have incorporated Lycoming Engines SI No. 1009AS, dated May 25, 2006, only for the purpose of providing a maximum time by which crankshaft replacement must occur, if the engine has not required earlier maintenance that involves separating the crankcase. Therefore, crankshaft removal must occur at the earliest of maintenance involving crankcase separation, the time-in-service specified in Lycoming Engines SI No. 1009AS for engine overhaul, or 12 years from the time the crankshaft first entered service. For clarification, we have added to the AD new sub-paragraphs (j)(3) and (k)(3) that now directly specify the 12-year compliance end time for crankshaft removal. Engine Model Included in Error in MSB One commenter, Lycoming Engines, states that engine model TIO-540- U2A, SN L-4641-61A, was included in MSB No. 569A in error and it is not affected by the MSB and should not be included in this AD. We agree and added new paragraph (i) in the AD that states that no action is required for this engine model. We have also added a new sub-paragraph (f)(5) to clarify that if the AD applies to an engine, but no action is required because the crankshaft on that engine is not identified as one needing [[Page 57408]] replacement, the owner or operator of the aircraft may make an entry in the AD status log required by 14 CFR 91.417(a)(2)(v) that the AD required no action. Engine Model Included in Error in Proposed AD Since we issued the proposed AD, we have identified the engine model AEIO-580 as not type certified for operation in the United States. Although this engine is listed in Table 3 of MSB No. 569A, we have removed this engine model from the AD applicability. Consider an Additional 100 Hours Operation One private citizen suggests that for aircraft that are already beyond Lycoming's time-between-overhaul (TBO) that we provide an additional 100 hours of operation from the effective date of the AD, as this would give people time to get new crankshafts or overhauls lined up. We do not agree. This final rule will not become effective until 35 days after it is published in the Federal Register. That should be ample time to prepare for compliance with the AD for those operators with engines that have operated past the Lycoming recommended TBO. If an operator needs additional time, that operator may request an alternative method of compliance (AMOC), using the procedures found in 14 CFR 39.19. We note that the AD does not require an engine overhaul, but only replacement of an identified crankshaft. Deadline for Crankshaft Replacement Needs To Be at the Next Overhaul One private citizen, states that the deadline for crankshaft replacement needs to be at the next overhaul. We do not agree. The AD requires replacement of identified crankshafts at the earliest of the next time maintenance requires splitting the crankcase, or the time specified for the next engine overhaul listed in Lycoming Engines SI No. 1009AS, or 12 years from when the crankshaft entered service. An operator may request additional time through a request for an AMOC using the procedures found in 14 CFR 39.19. Note that the AD does not require the engine to be overhauled. It only requires replacing the affected crankshaft, which can be done with other maintenance. Remove Calendar Time Compliance One commenter, Cessna Pilots Association, states that there should be no calendar time mandated, and that compliance should be determined by the appropriate Federal Aviation Regulations for the type of operations for which the aircraft is used. Another commenter, Aircraft Owners and Pilots Association, states that aircraft owners should be allowed to continue to operate their engine until reaching time-for-overhaul based on hours without any calendar end time. We do not agree. We re-evaluated the risk that this unsafe condition presents to aircraft and have determined that adequate risk mitigation can only be achieved by establishing an end limit for crankshaft removal based on years since a crankshaft enters service. The variability of the size and orientation of the metallurgical anomalies present in the identified crankshafts, results in variation in the operating times at which failures could occur. Therefore, while we stated in the proposal that the unsafe condition was unrelated to calendar time, a compliance end-time is necessary to minimize the probability of a crankshaft failure at operating times less than the specified overhaul interval. The 12-year calendar end time was selected to provide the necessary risk mitigation while minimizing the burden on owners and operators. We fully expect that few crankshafts will be replaced solely because of the 12-year calendar end time because crankshafts must be replaced earlier if maintenance requires splitting the crankcase or operations accumulate enough hours to meet the engine TBO. However, if an owner (or) operator has data to justify an extension of the hourly limit and (or) the calendar end-limit, the owner (or) operator can request an AMOC using the procedures found in 14 CFR 39.19. Determining crankshaft removal times by the type of operation would impose an overly complex record-keeping requirement on owners and operators. The identified crankshafts are installed in engines that are engaged in multiple types of operations ranging from personal use to commercial operations. We note that for some commercial operators the recommended TBO times may be mandated as a necessary component of their approved maintenance programs. For these operators, then, crankshaft replacement will be a part of the required engine overhaul unless earlier maintenance requires splitting the crankcase. Evidence for AD Is Not Convincing Enough One private citizen states that the evidence used to justify the proposed AD is not convincing enough to require parts replacement, and the lengthy compliance time (12 years) implies crankshaft replacement is not urgent, and, if it is urgent, the crankshafts should be replaced in a shorter time. We do not agree. While we determined that the risk to safety of flight was not urgent enough to warrant publishing an emergency AD that would become effective immediately upon publication, we have sufficient data on which to conclude that an unsafe condition exists and that it is likely to exist or develop on other products of the same type design. We selected the compliance times in this AD because: The same metallurgical flaw that was found in 23 confirmed crankshaft failures in different groups of Lycoming 360 and 540 engines has been found in the crankshafts in this group of engines; and Because of the presence of the flaw, this group of crankshafts has a higher potential for failure than other crankshaft groups that do not have the flaw, and it may only take longer to fail; and The overhaul may be the first opportunity that the crankshaft is removed from the engine and the first opportunity to replace the crankshaft. As previously stated in another comment, we do not have the data to support an hourly or calendar time extension beyond the hourly times contained in Lycoming Engines SI No. 1009AS, or the 12-year compliance end-time. Suggest Crankshaft Fractures Noted Are From an As-Yet Unidentified Cause Three private citizens suggest that the 23 crankshaft fractures noted are from an as-yet unidentified cause, or causes, within the engine, which results in crankshaft fracture. We do not agree. The proposal referred to 23 confirmed failures of similar crankshafts in Lycoming 360 and 540 series reciprocating engines. These are 23 crankshafts that exhibited the same, subsurface material flaw that progress to a fatigue failure. There were several other crankshaft failures that exhibited most of the same failure characteristics as the 23 confirmed failures, but the fracture surface was too badly damaged for a complete examination to confirm that they were the same. The two examples of crankshaft failures mentioned by the commenters were not examined by the Lycoming Materials Laboratory, or any of the other Materials Laboratories that participated in this investigation. One is an Australian Transport Safety Bureau report of a Lycoming O-540 crankshaft failure, that is known to the FAA, but was not included in the 23 confirmed failures. The other example is the failure of a crankshaft identified as [[Page 57409]] being from a Lycoming O-360 series engine. However, the laboratory failure report did not identify the engine model or SN. This crankshaft failed in two locations and neither of the locations are the same as the single failure location of the crankshafts in this investigation (the 23 confirmed failures and the unconfirmed failures all failed in the same location.) In addition, the report does not contain the engine type, type of engine operation, crankshaft part number, serial number, heat code, overhaul rework data, or overhaul assembly data. This makes it impossible to determine if the crankshaft was a Lycoming part or a PMA part, when the part was manufactured, or if the crankshaft was installed in an aerobatic engine and operated at a higher than certified horsepower. Based on the above, we cannot accept these examples as data to support their position that we have inadequate data on which to conclude that an unsafe condition exists and that it is likely to either exist or develop on other products of the same type design. No Reason To Change Lycoming Engines Current Compliance Conditions One commenter, Lycoming Engines, sees no reason to change its current compliance conditions, as there is no data to suggest any adjustment to the compliance terms. We do not agree. Crankshafts from the group listed in Lycoming Engines MSB No. 569A have been found to have the same material flaws as those in the groups that were addressed by previous Lycoming Engines MSBs and FAA ADs. We selected a crankshaft replacement schedule that minimizes the burden on owners and operators by requiring replacement of the crankshaft only when accessible during engine maintenance or overhaul, but contains a compliance end-time of 12 years after the crankshaft enters service to provide the necessary risk mitigation. There is no current data to support an accelerated removal of the crankshafts, so we determined that the crankshafts can continue in service until the next engine overhaul as specified in Lycoming Engines SI No. 1009AS. However, if new data becomes available at a later date, we will re-evaluate our conclusion. Lycoming Engines Should Pay Regardless of Calendar Time Six commenters, the Cessna Pilots Association, the Aircraft Owners and Pilots Association, and four private citizens state that Lycoming Engines should pay for the complete replacement cost or extend the $2,000 crankshaft kit price, regardless of when an owner replaces the crankshaft required to be removed to comply with this AD. We view this comment as beyond the scope of this rulemaking. We have no authority to regulate when or by how much a manufacturer reimburses an owner for actions required as a result of compliance with an AD. Update to Lycoming Engines SI No. 1009AR We updated the references of Lycoming Engines SI No. 1009AR, dated June 22, 2004, to Lycoming Engines SI No. 1009AS, dated May 25, 2006, in this AD. Conclusion We have carefully reviewed the available data, including the comments received, and determined that air safety and the public interest require adopting the AD with the changes described previously. We have determined that these changes will neither increase the economic burden on any operator nor increase the scope of the AD. Costs of Compliance We estimate that this AD will affect 3,774 engines installed on airplanes of U.S. registry. Because the AD compliance interval coincides with engine overhaul or other engine maintenance, we estimate no additional labor hours will be needed to comply with this AD. Parts will cost about $16,000 per engine. Based on these figures, we estimate the total cost of the AD to be $60,384,000. Lycoming said it may provide the parts for $2,000, until February 21, 2009, but will not extend the parts price beyond that date. In addition, since we issued the NPRM, Lycoming Engines has provided additional information on their Web site, explaining that engines affected by MSB No. 569 or MSB No. 569A, which get overhauled at the Lycoming factory at any time within the FAA mandated 12-year limit, will receive a replacement crankshaft during overhaul at no additional charge. Authority for This Rulemaking Title 49 of the United States Code specifies the FAA's authority to issue rules on aviation safety. Subtitle I, Section 106, describes the authority of the FAA Administrator. Subtitle VII, Aviation Programs, describes in more detail the scope of the Agency's authority. We are issuing this rulemaking under the authority described in Subtitle VII, Part A, Subpart III, Section 44701, ``General requirements.'' Under that section, Congress charges the FAA with promoting safe flight of civil aircraft in air commerce by prescribing regulations for practices, methods, and procedures the Administrator finds necessary for safety in air commerce. This regulation is within the scope of that authority because it addresses an unsafe condition that is likely to exist or develop on products identified in this rulemaking action. Regulatory Findings We have determined that this AD will not have federalism implications under Executive Order 13132. This AD will not have a substantial direct effect on the States, on the relationship between the national government and the States, or on the distribution of power and responsibilities among the various levels of government. For the reasons discussed above, I certify that this AD: (1) Is not a ``significant regulatory action'' under Executive Order 12866; (2) Is not a ``significant rule'' under DOT Regulatory Policies and Procedures (44 FR 11034, February 26, 1979); and (3) Will not have a significant economic impact, positive or negative, on a substantial number of small entities under the criteria of the Regulatory Flexibility Act. We prepared a summary of the costs to comply with this AD and placed it in the AD Docket. You may get a copy of this summary at the address listed under ADDRESSES. List of Subjects in 14 CFR Part 39 Air transportation, Aircraft, Aviation safety, Incorporation by reference, Safety. Adoption of the Amendment 0 Accordingly, under the authority delegated to me by the Administrator, the Federal Aviation Administration amends 14 CFR part 39 as follows: PART 39--AIRWORTHINESS DIRECTIVES 0 1. The authority citation for part 39 continues to read as follows: Authority: 49 U.S.C. 106(g), 40113, 44701. Sec. 39.13 [Amended] 0 2. The FAA amends Sec. 39.13 by adding the following new airworthiness directive: 2006-20-09 Lycoming Engines (formerly Textron Lycoming): Amendment 39-14778. Docket No. FAA-2006-24785; Directorate Identifier 2006-NE- 20-AD. Effective Date (a) This airworthiness directive (AD) becomes effective November 3, 2006. [[Page 57410]] Affected ADs (b) None. Applicability (c) This AD applies to those Lycoming Engines (L)O-360, (L)IO- 360, AEIO-360, O-540, IO-540, AEIO-540, (L)TIO-540, IO-580, and IO- 720 series reciprocating engines listed by engine model number and serial number in Table 1, Table 2, Table 3, or Table 4 of Lycoming Mandatory Service Bulletin (MSB) 569A, dated April 11, 2006, and those engines with crankshafts listed by crankshaft serial number in Table 5 of Lycoming MSB 569A, dated April 11, 2006. These applicable engines are manufactured new or rebuilt, overhauled, or had a crankshaft installed after March 1, 1997. These engines are installed on, but not limited to, the following aircraft: ----------------------------------------------------------------------- ----------------------------------------- Engine model Manufacturer Aircraft model ----------------------------------------------------------------------- ----------------------------------------- AEIO-360-A1B6....................... Moravan............... Z242L Zlin. Scottish Avia......... Bulldog. Valmet................ Leko 70. AEIO-360-A1E6....................... Integrated Systems.... Omega. IO-360-A1B6......................... Aircraft Manufacturing Mushshak. Factory. Beech................. C-24R Sierra or 200 Sierra. Cessna................ R-G Cardinal. Korean Air............ Chang Gong-91. Partenavia............ P-68C. Saab.................. MFI-15 Safari, MFI-17 Supporter. Scottish Avia......... Bulldog. IO-360-A1B6D........................ Cessna................ R-6 Cardinal. Siai Marchetti........ S-205. IO-360-A3B6......................... Mod Works............. Trophy 212 Conversion. IO-360-A3B6D........................ Mooney................ M20J-201. IO-360-B1G6......................... American.............. Blimp Spector 42. IO-360-C1C6......................... Piper Aircraft........ PA-28-200R Arrow IV. Ruschmeyer............ MF-85. IO-360-C1D6......................... M.B.B................. Flamingo 223. Rockwell.............. 112. IO-360-C1E6......................... Piper................. PA-34-200 Seneca I. IO-360-C1G6......................... Zeppelin.............. NT. IO-360-X178......................... Ly-Con................ STC. (L)O-360-A1G6D...................... Beech................. 76 Duchess. (L)O-360-A1H6....................... Piper................. PA-44 Seminole. O-360-A1F6.......................... Cessna................ 177 Cardinal. O-360-A1F6D......................... Cessna................ 177 Cardinal. Teal III.............. TSC 1A3. O-360-A1G6D......................... Beech................. 76 Duchess. O-360-A1H6.......................... Piper................. PA-44 Seminole. O-360-E1A6D......................... Piper................. PA-44-180 Seminole. O-360-F1A6.......................... Cessna................ C-172RG Cutlass RG. AEIO-540-D4A5....................... Christen.............. Pitts S-2S, S-2B. H.A.L................. HPT-32. Siai-Marchetti........ SF-260. Slingsby.............. T3A Firefly. AEIO-540-L1B5....................... Extra-Flugzeugbau..... Extra 300. F.F.A................. FFA-2000 Eurotrainer. AEIO-540-L1D5....................... Apex.................. Apex. IO-540-AA1A5........................ Piper................. 602P Sequoia. IO-540-AB1A5........................ Cessna................ C-182 Skylane. IO-540-AC1A5........................ Cessna................ C-206 Stationair. IO-540-AE1A5........................ Robinson.............. R44. IO-540-C4B5......................... Aerofab............... 250 Renegade. Avions Pierre Robin... HR100/250. Bellanca.............. T-250 Aries. Piper................. Aztec C PA-23 ``250'', Aztec F. Wassmer............... WA4-21. IO-540-C4D5......................... S.O.C.A.T.A........... TB-20. IO-540-C4D5D........................ S.O.C.A.T.A........... TB-20 Trinidad. IO-540-D4A5......................... Piper................. PA-24 260 Comanche. Siai-Marchetti........ SF-260. IO-540-D4B5......................... Cerva................. CF-34 Guepard. IO-540-E1A5......................... Aero Commander........ 500-E. IO-540-E1B5......................... Aero Commander........ 500-U. Poeschel.............. P-300. Shrike................ 500-S. IO-540-J4A5......................... Piper................. Aztec PA-23 ``250''. IO-540-K1A5......................... Aeronautica Agricula Quail. Mexicana. Celair................ Eagle. Embraer............... EMB-720 Minuano, EMB-721 Sertanejo. Piper................. PA-32-300 Cherokee Six. IO-540-K1A5D........................ Piper................. PA-32-300. IO-540-K1B5......................... Evangel-Air........... Evangel-Air. Pilotus Britton-Norman BN-2B Islander. [[Page 57411]] Transavara............ T-300 Skyfarmer. IO-540-K1E5......................... Bellanca.............. Bellanca. IO-540-K1F5......................... Ted Smith............. Aerostar 600. IO-540-K1G5......................... Embraer............... EMB-720 Minuano. Piper................. Saratoga PA-32-300, Brave 300. IO-540-K1G5D........................ Embraer............... EMB-721 Sertanejo. Piper................. PA-32-300R Lance, SP PA-32-300R Saratoga. IO-540-K1H5......................... Seawind............... Seawind. IO-540-K1J5......................... Piper................. 600A Aerostar. IO-540-K1J5D........................ Embraer............... EMB-201 Ipanema. IO-540-K1K5......................... Piper................. T35. IO-540-L1C5......................... Swearingen............ SX300. IO-540-M1A5......................... Piper................. PA-31-300 Navajo. IO-540-M1C5......................... King Engineering...... Angel. IO-540-S1A5......................... Piper................. 601B Aerostar, 601P Aerostar. IO-540-T4A5D........................ General Aviation...... Model 114. IO-540-T4B5......................... Commander............. 114B. IO-540-T4B5D........................ Rockwell.............. 114. IO-540-V4A5......................... Aircraft Manufacturing Aircraft Manufacturing Factory. Factory. Maule................. MT-7-260, M-7-260. IO-540-W1A5......................... Maule................. MX-7-235, MT-7-235, M7-235. IO-540-X160......................... Airship Management.... Airship Management. IO-540-X170......................... Robinson.............. Robinson. O-540-A1A5.......................... Helio................. Military H-250. O-540-A1B5.......................... Piper................. PA-32 ``250'' Aztec, PA-24 ``250'' Comanche. O-540-A1C5.......................... Piper................. PA-24 ``250'' Comanche. O-540-A1D5.......................... Piper................. PA-24 ``250'' Comanche. O-540-A4D5.......................... American Champion..... American Champion. Gomozig............... Gomozig. Avipro................ Bearhawk. O-540-B1A5.......................... Piper................. PA-23 ``235'' Apache. O-540-B2B5.......................... S.O.C.A.T.A........... 235CA Rallye. O-540-B2C5.......................... Piper................. PA-24 ``235'' Pawnee. O-540-B4B5.......................... Embraer............... EMB-710 Corioca. Maule................. MX-7-235 Star Rocket, M-6-235 Super Rocket, M-7- 235 Super Rocket. Piper................. PA-28 ``235'' Cherokee. S.O.C.A.T.A........... 235GT Rallye, 235C Rallye. O-540-E4A5.......................... Aviamilano............ F-250 Flamingo. Piper................. PA-24 ``260'' Comanche. Siai-Marchetti........ SF-260, SF-208. O-540-E4B5.......................... Britton-Norman........ BN-2. Piper................. PA-32 ``260'' Cherokee Six. O-540-E4C5.......................... Pilotus Britton-Norman BN-2A-26 Islander; BN-2A-27 Islander; BN-2B-26 Islander II; BN-2A-21 Islander; BN-2A-Mark III-2 Trislander. O-540-F1B5.......................... Robinson.............. R-44. O-540-G1A5.......................... Piper................. PA-25 ``260'' Pawnee. O-540-J1A5D......................... Maule................. MX-7-235 Star Rocket, M-6-235 Super Rocket, M-7- 235 Super Rocket. O-540-J3A5.......................... Robin................. R-3000/235. O-540-J3A5D......................... Piper................. PA-28-236 Dakota. O-540-J3C5D......................... Cessna................ R-182 Skylane. O-540-L3C5D......................... Cessna................ TR-182 Turbo Skylane. TIO-540-AA1AD....................... Aerofab Inc........... 270 Turbo Renegade. TIO-540-AB1AD....................... S.O.C.A.T.A........... TC TB-21 Trinidad. TIO-540-AE2A........................ Piper................. PA-46-350P Mirage. TIO-540-AF1B........................ Mooney................ TLS M20M. TIO-540-AG1A........................ Commander Aircraft.... 112TC. TIO-540-AH1A........................ Piper................. TC PA-32-301T TurboSaratoga. TIO-540-AK1A........................ Cessna................ T182T Turbo Skylane. TIO-540-C1A......................... Piper................. PA-23-250 Turbo Aztec. TIO-540-J2B......................... Piper................. T-1020. TIO-540-U2A......................... Piper................. 700P Aerostar. TIO-540-W2A......................... Aero Mercantil........ Gavilan. TIO-540-X136........................ Schweizer............. Schweizer. TIO-540-X155........................ Cessna................ T182 (AK1A). IO-720-D1B.......................... Embraer............... EMB-400 Ipanema, IAR-821. Nauchang.............. N5. [[Page 57412]] IO-720-D1C.......................... Piper................. PA-36-375 Brave. ----------------------------------------------------------------------- ----------------------------------------- Unsafe Condition (d) This AD results from reports of 23 confirmed failures of similar crankshafts in Lycoming Engines 360 and 540 series reciprocating engines. We are issuing this AD to prevent failure of the crankshaft, which will result in total engine power loss, in- flight engine failure, and possible loss of the aircraft. Compliance (e) You are responsible for having the actions required by this AD performed within the compliance times specified unless the actions have already been done. Engines for Which No Action Is Required (f) If your engine meets any of the following conditions, and you have not had the crankshaft replaced since meeting the condition, no further action is required: (1) Engines that are in compliance with Lycoming MSB No. 552 (AD 2002-19-03) or MSB No. 553 (AD 2002-19-03 Table 3 or Table 5); or (2) Engines that are in compliance with Lycoming MSB No. 566 AD (2005-19-11); or (3) Engines that are in compliance with Lycoming Supplement No. 1 to MSB No. 566 (AD 2006-06-16); or (4) Engines that are in compliance with the original issue of Lycoming MSB No. 569, or MSB No. 569A. (5) For engines identified in paragraphs (f), (g), (h), or (i) of this AD, owners or operators may make an entry in the AD status log required by 14 CFR 91.417(a)(2)(v) that this AD required no action for compliance. (g) If Lycoming Engines manufactured new, rebuilt, overhauled, or repaired your engine, or replaced the crankshaft in your engine before March 1, 1997, and you have not had the crankshaft replaced, no further action is required. (h) If Table 1, Table 2, Table 3, or Table 4 of Lycoming MSB No. 569A, dated April 11, 2006, lists your engine serial number (SN), and Table 5 of MSB No. 569A, dated April 11, 2006, does not list your crankshaft SN, no further action is required. (i) For engine model TIO-540-U2A, SN L-4641-61A, no action is required. Engines for Which Action Is Required (j) If Table 1, Table 2, Table 3, or Table 4 of Lycoming MSB No. 569A, dated April 11, 2006, lists your engine SN, and Table 5 of MSB No. 569A, dated April 11, 2006, lists your crankshaft SN, replace the affected crankshaft with a crankshaft that is not listed in Table 5 of MSB No. 569A at the earliest of the following: (1) The time of the next engine overhaul as specified in Lycoming Engines Service Instruction No. 1009AS, dated May 25, 2006; or (2) The next separation of the crankcase; or (3) No later than 12 years from the time the crankshaft first entered service or was last overhauled, whichever is later. (k) If Table 1, Table 2, Table 3, or Table 4 of Lycoming MSB No. 569A, dated April 11, 2006, does not list your engine SN, and Table 5 of MSB No. 569A does list your crankshaft SN (an affected crankshaft was installed as a replacement), replace the affected crankshaft with a crankshaft that is not listed in Table 5 of MSB No. 569A at the earliest of the following: (1) The time of the next engine overhaul as specified in Lycoming Engines Service Instruction No. 1009AS, dated May 25, 2006; or (2) The next separation of the crankcase; or (3) No later than 12 years from the time the crankshaft first entered service or was last overhauled, whichever is later. Prohibition Against Installing Certain Crankshafts (l) After the effective date of this AD, do not install any crankshaft that has a SN listed in Table 5 of Lycoming MSB No. 569A, dated April 11, 2006, into any engine. Alternative Methods of Compliance (m) The Manager, New York Aircraft Certification Office, has the authority to approve alternative methods of compliance for this AD if requested using the procedures found in 14 CFR 39.19. Material Incorporated by Reference (n) You must use the service information specified in Table 1 of this AD to perform the actions required by this AD. The Director of the Federal Register approved the incorporation by reference of the documents listed in Table 1 of this AD in accordance with 5 U.S.C. 552(a) and 1 CFR part 51. Contact Lycoming, 652 Oliver Street, Williamsport, PA 17701; telephone (570) 323-6181; fax (570) 327- 7101, or on the internet at http://www.Lycoming.Textron.com for a copy of this service information. You may review copies at the FAA, New England Region, Office of the Regional Counsel, 12 New England Executive Park, Burlington, MA; or at the National Archives and Records Administration (NARA). For information on the availability of this material at NARA, call 202-741-6030, or go to: http://www.archives.gov/federal-register/cfr/ibr-locations.html . Table 1.--Incorporation by Reference ----------------------------------------------------------------------- ----------------------------------------- Service information Page Revision Date ----------------------------------------------------------------------- ----------------------------------------- Lycoming Engines Service All...................... AS...................... May 25, 2006. Instruction No. 1009AS. Total Pages: 4............... Lycoming Engines Mandatory All...................... A....................... April 11, 2006. Service Bulletin No. 569A. Total Pages: 59.............. ----------------------------------------------------------------------- ----------------------------------------- Issued in Burlington, Massachusetts, on September 20, 2006. Francis A. Favara, Manager, Engine and Propeller Directorate, Aircraft Certification Service. [FR Doc. E6-15958 Filed 9-28-06; 8:45 am] BILLING CODE 4910-13-P ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Oct 02, 2006
From: Les Kearney <kearney(at)shaw.ca>
Subject: Priming in a confined space
Hi As part of my self education process I have been reading various links for priming info. I noticed that many people print outside on sunny, warm days - an option I won't have in the winter when its -20C and snowing. That being said, how does one *safely* prime in a heated garage. By safely I mean that I want to have a fuel air explosion caused by my natural gas garage heater as well as avoid growing a third arm due to toxic fumes. Inquiring minds need to know .... Les Kearney RV10 Wannabe ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Oct 02, 2006
From: linn Walters <pitts_pilot(at)bellsouth.net>
Subject: Re: Priming in a confined space
I can think of a couple of possibles ...... but they're going to cool down your workspace. First of all, you need positive air flow through the garage as a whole, or a temporary paint booth with an exhaust fan to the outside. You may even have to shut off the heater while you're painting. You need to do whatever you need to do to safely paint. Err on the 'severly cautious' side because if you come up short ....... But bottom line is that you need a good flow of fresh air ........ but then again, that third arm might just come in handy. Actually, you need to be more concerned with getting airborne paint solids into the lungs. Almost all the paints today will stay there and do nasty things. Linn Les Kearney wrote: > >Hi >As part of my self education process I have been reading various links for >priming info. > >I noticed that many people print outside on sunny, warm days - an option I >won't have in the winter when its -20C and snowing. > >That being said, how does one *safely* prime in a heated garage. By safely I >mean that I want to have a fuel air explosion caused by my natural gas >garage heater as well as avoid growing a third arm due to toxic fumes. > >Inquiring minds need to know .... > >Les Kearney >RV10 Wannabe > > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Oct 02, 2006
From: "W. Curtis" <wcurtis(at)core.com>
Subject: IO-540 Hose kit -possible group buy
Gents, Ive been out of commission for the last few weeks but I wanted to give you an update on the proposed group buy of the IO-540 hoses from aircrafthose.com. Basically the reply from aircrafthose.com was that because the 124J (Teflon hoses with integral fire) hoses were a specialty item, the price of $495 would be the best they could do even though I had 15 RV-10 builders ready to order. So to summarize $495 for the Teflon hoses with Integral Firesleeve and $432 Teflon with External Firesleeve. Ask for Ashley. Stratoflex Teflon with Integral Firesleeve Hoses for RV-10 ($495) 111-4 hose with a 300-4D fitting 21.50" Long (111001-4CR0214) (IO-540 Man Press.) 124-4J hose with a 524-4CR fitting 15.50" Long (124J001-4CR0154) (IO-540 Fuel Press.) 124-4J hose with a 524-4CR fitting 27.25" Long (124J001-4CR0272) (IO-540 Oil Press.) 124-6J hose with a 524-6CR fitting 14.00" Long (124J001-6CR0140) (IO-540 Fuel Supply) 124-6J hose with a 524-6CR fitting 25.50" Long (124J001-6CR0254) (IO-540 Fuel Line) 124-8J hose with a 524-8CR fitting 16.50" Long (124J001-8CR0164) (Oil cooler) 124-8J hose with a 524-8CR fitting 27.00" Long (124J001-8CR0270) (Oil cooler) Stratoflex Teflon with External Firesleeve Hoses for RV-10 ($432) 111-4 hose with a 300-4D fitting 21.50" Long (111001-4CR0214) (IO-540 Man Press.) 124-4 hose with a 524-4CR fitting 15.50" Long (124001-4CR0154) (IO-540 Fuel Press.) 124-4 hose with a 524-4CR fitting 27.25" Long (124001-4CR0272) (IO-540 Oil Press.) 124-6 hose with a 524-6CR fitting 14.00" Long (124001-6CR0140) (IO-540 Fuel Supply) 124-6 hose with a 524-6CR fitting 25.50" Long (124001-6CR0254) (IO-540 Fuel Line) 124-8 hose with a 524-8CR fitting 16.50" Long (124001-8CR0164) (Oil cooler) 124-8 hose with a 524-8CR fitting 27.00" Long (124001-8CR0270) (Oil cooler) William Curtis http://wcurtis.nerv10.com/ ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Brian Douglas" <bsponcil(at)belinblank.org>
Subject: Re: FLYING!!!!
Date: Oct 02, 2006
Way to go! I hope we get a chance to see it at OSH 2007. Any pireps on the bluemountain stuff? -Brian #40497 N211BD Iowa City, IA ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jim & Julie Wade" <jwadejr(at)hughes.net> Sent: Monday, October 02, 2006 4:56 AM Subject: RV10-List: FLYING!!!! > > > October 1 2006!!! The long awaited day. Julie flew it first, as that was > my gift to her on her birthday Sept. 8th. Then it was my turn!!! We are > both high time CFI's. I have flown maybe hundreds of planes, but none as > delightful as this one. Feels a lot like a T-6 with the light controls. > Have to do a little rigging, as we have to use a lot of right rudder, but > just a very easy aircraft to fly!!!! I had flown the factory demo at Sun & > Fun and had a good idea of how it flew, but to fly and have more time to > play with it is outstanding. We have a lot of little bugs to work out in > the electronics, but doesn't everyone??? The DAR gave us 50 miles due to > speed and 40 hours because of the aerocomposite prop. Which is so > smoooooooth. This engine (new) and prop combination is almost as smooth as > a turbine!!!!!! (no lie) A little tweeking this morning and fly all > day!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! > Keep building guys!!!!!!!! It is worth all the time and pain. > > Jim & Julie > 40383 > Slow Build > Started May 1 2005 > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=65146#65146 > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Oct 02, 2006
From: "Kelly McMullen" <apilot2(at)gmail.com>
Subject: Re: IO-540 Hose kit -possible group buy
That is a very good price. I paid around $615 for the same 7 hoses in 124J for my 200hp Mooney with IO360A1A in 2002. On 10/2/06, W. Curtis wrote: > Gents, > > I've been out of commission for the last few weeks but I wanted to give you > an update on the proposed group buy of the IO-540 hoses from > aircrafthose.com. Basically the reply from aircrafthose.com was that because > the 124J (Teflon hoses with integral fire) hoses were a specialty item, the > price of $495 would be the best they could do even though I had 15 RV-10 > builders ready to order. So to summarize $495 for the Teflon hoses with > Integral Firesleeve and $432 Teflon with External Firesleeve. Ask for > Ashley. ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Swivel Flush Head Rivet Set
Date: Oct 02, 2006
From: dsyvert(at)aol.com
Does anyone have any expeience with the flush rubber guard swivel rivet set? Is it a big improvement? Thanks Dave Syvertson ________________________________________________________________________ Check out the new AOL. Most comprehensive set of free safety and security tools, free access to millions of high-quality videos from across the web, free AOL Mail and more. ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Oct 02, 2006
From: James Hein <n8vim(at)arrl.net>
Subject: Re: Swivel Flush Head Rivet Set
Yup. Works great. Buy one. -Jim 40384 dsyvert(at)aol.com wrote: > Does anyone have any expeience with the flush rubber guard swivel > rivet set? Is it a big improvement? > > Thanks > Dave Syvertson > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > *Check out the new AOL* > <http://pr.atwola.com/promoclk/1615326657x4311227241x4298082137/aol?redir=http%3A%2F%2Fwww%2Eaol%2Ecom%2Fnewaol>. > Most comprehensive set of free safety and security tools, free access > to millions of high-quality videos from across the web, free AOL Mail > and more. > >* > > >* > ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Oct 02, 2006
From: Larry Rosen <LarryRosen(at)comcast.net>
Subject: Re: Priming in a confined space
A supplied air respirator makes all the difference in the world. I started with a dual carbon filter respirator and for Xmas I got a hobby air. The first time I used supplied air I didn't even know there were any fumes in the garage. I could not smell a thing. I cannot say the same for the carbon filter respirator. A local RV-9 builder uses the exhaust from a shop vac (cleaned of course) to supply breathing air, and it works well. I use Tim's method to keep the room safe from an explosion. Heat it up, turn off the heater. Paint away with an exhaust fan, and then open up the garage doors to let the fumes escape. Larry Rosen #356 Les Kearney wrote: > > Hi > As part of my self education process I have been reading various links for > priming info. > > I noticed that many people print outside on sunny, warm days - an option I > won't have in the winter when its -20C and snowing. > > That being said, how does one *safely* prime in a heated garage. By safely I > mean that I want to have a fuel air explosion caused by my natural gas > garage heater as well as avoid growing a third arm due to toxic fumes. > > Inquiring minds need to know .... > > Les Kearney > RV10 Wannabe > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Oct 02, 2006
From: Larry Rosen <LarryRosen(at)comcast.net>
Subject: Re: Swivel Flush Head Rivet Set
I 2nd. James Hein wrote: > > Yup. > Works great. Buy one. > > -Jim 40384 > > dsyvert(at)aol.com wrote: > >> Does anyone have any expeience with the flush rubber guard swivel >> rivet set? Is it a big improvement? >> >> Thanks >> Dave Syvertson >> ------------------------------------------------------------------------ >> *Check out the new AOL* >> <http://pr.atwola.com/promoclk/1615326657x4311227241x4298082137/aol?redir=http%3A%2F%2Fwww%2Eaol%2Ecom%2Fnewaol>. >> Most comprehensive set of free safety and security tools, free access >> to millions of high-quality videos from across the web, free AOL Mail >> and more. >> >> * >> >> >> * >> > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Swivel Flush Head Rivet Set
From: "John Kirkland" <jskirkland(at)webpipe.net>
Date: Oct 02, 2006
Worth every penny. Goodbye smilies. -------- RV-10 #40333 N540XP (reserved) Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=65335#65335 ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Oct 02, 2006
From: "W. Curtis" <wcurtis(at)core.com>
Subject: Re: IO-540 Hose kit -possible group buy
Oh, if it wasn't clear in my message, for these prices it does not have to be a group buy. This is the price for an individual order when you order directly from them. > > > Gents, > > Ive been out of commission for the last few weeks but I wanted to give you an update on the proposed group buy of the IO-540 hoses from aircrafthose.com. Basically the reply from aircrafthose.com was that because the 124J (Teflon hoses with integral fire) hoses were a specialty item, the price of $495 would be the best they could do even though I had 15 RV-10 builders ready to order. So to summarize $495 for the Teflon hoses with Integral Firesleeve and $432 Teflon with External Firesleeve. Ask for Ashley. > > Stratoflex Teflon with Integral Firesleeve Hoses for RV-10 ($495) > 111-4 hose with a 300-4D fitting 21.50" Long (111001-4CR0214) (IO-540 Man Press.) > 124-4J hose with a 524-4CR fitting 15.50" Long (124J001-4CR0154) (IO-540 Fuel Press.) > 124-4J hose with a 524-4CR fitting 27.25" Long (124J001-4CR0272) (IO-540 Oil Press.) > 124-6J hose with a 524-6CR fitting 14.00" Long (124J001-6CR0140) (IO-540 Fuel Supply) > 124-6J hose with a 524-6CR fitting 25.50" Long (124J001-6CR0254) (IO-540 Fuel Line) > 124-8J hose with a 524-8CR fitting 16.50" Long (124J001-8CR0164) (Oil cooler) > 124-8J hose with a 524-8CR fitting 27.00" Long (124J001-8CR0270) (Oil cooler) > > Stratoflex Teflon with External Firesleeve Hoses for RV-10 ($432) > 111-4 hose with a 300-4D fitting 21.50" Long (111001-4CR0214) (IO-540 Man Press.) > 124-4 hose with a 524-4CR fitting 15.50" Long (124001-4CR0154) (IO-540 Fuel Press.) > 124-4 hose with a 524-4CR fitting 27.25" Long (124001-4CR0272) (IO-540 Oil Press.) > 124-6 hose with a 524-6CR fitting 14.00" Long (124001-6CR0140) (IO-540 Fuel Supply) > 124-6 hose with a 524-6CR fitting 25.50" Long (124001-6CR0254) (IO-540 Fuel Line) > 124-8 hose with a 524-8CR fitting 16.50" Long (124001-8CR0164) (Oil cooler) > 124-8 hose with a 524-8CR fitting 27.00" Long (124001-8CR0270) (Oil cooler) > > William Curtis > http://wcurtis.nerv10.com/ William ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Oct 02, 2006
From: Deems Davis <deemsdavis(at)cox.net>
Subject: Re: Swivel Flush Head Rivet Set
Yes, Get one! Deems Davis # 406 Panel/Finishing http://deemsrv10.com/ dsyvert(at)aol.com wrote: > Does anyone have any expeience with the flush rubber guard swivel > rivet set? Is it a big improvement? > > Thanks > Dave Syvertson > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > *Check out the new AOL* > <http://pr.atwola.com/promoclk/1615326657x4311227241x4298082137/aol?redir=http%3A%2F%2Fwww%2Eaol%2Ecom%2Fnewaol>. > Most comprehensive set of free safety and security tools, free access > to millions of high-quality videos from across the web, free AOL Mail > and more. > >* > > >* > ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Oct 02, 2006
From: Rick <ricksked(at)earthlink.net>
Subject: Re: Priming in a confined space
Not only the heater but the WATER HEATER if it is in your garage....pilot light in there and the WHOOSH as it kicks off to reheat may be the last thing you hear. Rick S. 40185 -----Original Message----- >From: Larry Rosen <LarryRosen(at)comcast.net> >Sent: Oct 2, 2006 4:44 PM >To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com >Subject: Re: RV10-List: Priming in a confined space > > >A supplied air respirator makes all the difference in the world. I >started with a dual carbon filter respirator and for Xmas I got a hobby >air. The first time I used supplied air I didn't even know there were >any fumes in the garage. I could not smell a thing. I cannot say the >same for the carbon filter respirator. A local RV-9 builder uses the >exhaust from a shop vac (cleaned of course) to supply breathing air, and >it works well. > >I use Tim's method to keep the room safe from an explosion. Heat it up, >turn off the heater. Paint away with an exhaust fan, and then open up >the garage doors to let the fumes escape. > >Larry Rosen >#356 > >Les Kearney wrote: >> >> Hi >> As part of my self education process I have been reading various links for >> priming info. >> >> I noticed that many people print outside on sunny, warm days - an option I >> won't have in the winter when its -20C and snowing. >> >> That being said, how does one *safely* prime in a heated garage. By safely I >> mean that I want to have a fuel air explosion caused by my natural gas >> garage heater as well as avoid growing a third arm due to toxic fumes. >> >> Inquiring minds need to know .... >> >> Les Kearney >> RV10 Wannabe >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: FLYING!!!!
From: "Jim & Julie Wade" <jwade(at)msdeltawireless.com>
Date: Oct 02, 2006
Ok I will try and answer all the question in one reply Brian Having some start up problems with BMA, but they are great folks to work with and should have things sorted soon. Looks like great equipment so far. Tim, changed my email on this site, had my old one on, try the new one. Also the rudder was out a full ball. Dropped my right flap a little, helped, but went on and put a rudder trim tab on and all is well now. That is with wheel fairings. John, it is the new I0-540 Van's sell. Attaching a pic. Will have some flying soon and a few of the panel lit up!!! Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=65359#65359 Attachments: http://forums.matronics.com//files/pict0753_146.jpg ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: FLYING!!!!
From: "zackrv8" <zackrv8(at)verizon.net>
Date: Oct 02, 2006
Jim and Julie, Congrats on the first flight. I know how excited you both must be. Especially after building a slow build kit in a year and a half! Your plane looks great! Hope to hear more of your phase 1 testing when you get a chance. Did you buy the "Experimental" version of the new Lycoming? Zack Jim & Julie Wade wrote: > Ok I will try and answer all the question in one reply > Brian Having some start up problems with BMA, but they are great folks to work with and should have things sorted soon. Looks like great equipment so far. > > Tim, changed my email on this site, had my old one on, try the new one. > Also the rudder was out a full ball. Dropped my right flap a little, helped, but went on and put a rudder trim tab on and all is well now. That is with wheel fairings. > > John, it is the new I0-540 Van's sell. Attaching a pic. Will have some flying soon and a few of the panel lit up!!! -------- RV8 #80125 RV10 # 40512 Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=65364#65364 ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Oct 02, 2006
From: "Fred Williams, M.D." <drfred@cox-internet.com>
Subject: Swivel Flush set
My 2 cents. I bought one of the flush sets with the rubber gaurd. Tried it a few times, but because I had difficulty compressing the rubber, the manufactured head would not sit down flush. Took the rubber ring off and have been using it that way since. Didn't think about trimming the rubber flush with the head. I like it better overall because it has a larger radius than the smaller one that came with my tool kit. The smaller one seems to leave a small depression secondary to it's smaller radius curve. Dr Fred. 40515 having fun with proseal ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "John Jessen" <jjessen(at)rcn.com>
Subject: Priming in a confined space
Date: Oct 03, 2006
Also, brush-less exhaust fan. -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Rick Sent: Monday, October 02, 2006 5:44 PM Subject: Re: RV10-List: Priming in a confined space Not only the heater but the WATER HEATER if it is in your garage....pilot light in there and the WHOOSH as it kicks off to reheat may be the last thing you hear. Rick S. 40185 -----Original Message----- >From: Larry Rosen <LarryRosen(at)comcast.net> >Sent: Oct 2, 2006 4:44 PM >To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com >Subject: Re: RV10-List: Priming in a confined space > > >A supplied air respirator makes all the difference in the world. I >started with a dual carbon filter respirator and for Xmas I got a hobby >air. The first time I used supplied air I didn't even know there were >any fumes in the garage. I could not smell a thing. I cannot say the >same for the carbon filter respirator. A local RV-9 builder uses the >exhaust from a shop vac (cleaned of course) to supply breathing air, >and it works well. > >I use Tim's method to keep the room safe from an explosion. Heat it >up, turn off the heater. Paint away with an exhaust fan, and then open >up the garage doors to let the fumes escape. > >Larry Rosen >#356 > >Les Kearney wrote: >> >> Hi >> As part of my self education process I have been reading various >> links for priming info. >> >> I noticed that many people print outside on sunny, warm days - an >> option I won't have in the winter when its -20C and snowing. >> >> That being said, how does one *safely* prime in a heated garage. By >> safely I mean that I want to have a fuel air explosion caused by my >> natural gas garage heater as well as avoid growing a third arm due to toxic fumes. >> >> Inquiring minds need to know .... >> >> Les Kearney >> RV10 Wannabe >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: FLYING!!!!
From: "Jim & Julie Wade" <jwade(at)msdeltawireless.com>
Date: Oct 03, 2006
No Zach, the certified on Van's sell. I don't usually keep planes long, so I build with the idea I might sell one day, so I go with what I feel will be what they want. However I have a feeling I will keep this one a lot longer than most. There is nothing out there at the price that will touch it in speed manuverabilty and looks. Jim Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=65408#65408 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Fixitauto(at)aol.com
Date: Oct 03, 2006
Subject: Re: Swivel Flush Head Rivet Set
THAT BRINGS UP THE BIG ? JUST HOW MANY RIVETS ARE THERE IN THE AIR PLANE. I WAS THINKING I COUNTED 18,262 .(OR WAS DAYS IN MY LIFE) ROGER FITZ 40079 DO NOT ARCHIEVE ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "jdalton77" <jdalton77(at)comcast.net>
Subject: Re: Swivel Flush Head Rivet Set
Date: Oct 03, 2006
I always so 20,000 when people ask. Sounds impressive. ----- Original Message ----- From: Fixitauto(at)aol.com To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com Sent: Tuesday, October 03, 2006 8:51 AM Subject: Re: RV10-List: Re: Swivel Flush Head Rivet Set THAT BRINGS UP THE BIG ? JUST HOW MANY RIVETS ARE THERE IN THE AIR PLANE. I WAS THINKING I COUNTED 18,262 .(OR WAS DAYS IN MY LIFE) ROGER FITZ 40079 DO NOT ARCHIEVE ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Paul Grimstad" <bldgrv10450(at)comcast.net>
Subject: Re: Swivel Flush set
Date: Oct 03, 2006
Doc The first thing I did was grind the red rubber head down on my swivel, but try this tip. I use 2" clear standard US Postal packaging tape over the head of the rivet gun. The tape is tough and lasts a long time. In combination with a strip of the same tape on the skin, and at times I tape right over the special back rivet tape. Rivet manufactured heads set down tight and flush. The result is no marking on the skins when riveting. I remove the tape right away and use a product called SEM Solve as adhesive remover. There are different qualities of packaging tape and it's cheap but the postal standard works best and pulls right off no problem. I know that it all gets covered with paint but I wish I had used this method when riveting the VS. Let me know what you think of this method. Might there be any other little tips or tricks that the list should know about or try? Paul Grimstad RV10 40450 fuselage (refinishing shop floor) Portland, OR ----- Original Message ----- From: "Fred Williams, M.D." <drfred@cox-internet.com> Sent: Monday, October 02, 2006 7:00 PM Subject: RV10-List: Swivel Flush set > <drfred@cox-internet.com> > > My 2 cents. > > I bought one of the flush sets with the rubber gaurd. Tried it a few > times, but because I had difficulty compressing the rubber, the > manufactured head would not sit down flush. Took the rubber ring off and > have been using it that way since. Didn't think about trimming the rubber > flush with the head. I like it better overall because it has a larger > radius than the smaller one that came with my tool kit. The smaller one > seems to leave a small depression secondary to it's smaller radius curve. > Dr Fred. > > 40515 > > having fun with proseal > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Priming in a confined space
From: "johngoodman" <johngoodman(at)earthlink.net>
Date: Oct 03, 2006
Les, Have you considered getting somebody else to do it for you? Maybe you could make a deal with some paint shop. John -------- #40572 Empennage HS N711JG reserved Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=65473#65473 ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Oct 03, 2006
From: Deems Davis <deemsdavis(at)cox.net>
Subject: Filler wars - Part I
I've got the cabin cover off prior to match drilling it to the Fuse and figured this would be a good time to smooth out the "varicous veins" left from the vacum bagging and to otherwise sand and fill the depressions/hills and valleys to make for a more ascethetic interior appearance. I merrily began this process using Bondo for the deeper 'valleys' and a product called 'Icing' for the more shallow. John 'The Turbinator" Cox who monitors this grasshoppers progress to keep me from wandering too far afield from 'acceptable' practices. Noted what I was doing and in an offline e-mail diplomatically informed me that both of the 2 products I was using have histories of shrinking after 18-24 months of use, and particularly when exposed to high (120F) temps. >:o ! He sent me some pictures from some Lancair projects to dramatically demonstrate the results. So my question is: What 'aircraft grade' filler are people using? And where did you obtain it from? I'd appreciate hearing experience particularly from anybody that's already solved this problem. The application I'm using it for, is definitely Non Structural, and cosmetic only, so I don't need/want to use flox, epoxy and micro takes too long to set up to be able to sand. as I'm finding that it takes many many coats/layers of filler to get a smooth surface. Let the games begin Deems Davis # 406 Panel/Finishing http://deemsrv10.com/ ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Oct 03, 2006
From: Rick <ricksked(at)earthlink.net>
Subject: Re: Filler wars - Part I
Only at 120 degrees Deems, press on cause it is only 120 for about 10 minutes in the morning then it's way past that for the rest of the day ;) I heard the Evercoat lightweight Rage Gold filler was good. I hope cause I used it on my HS tips but alas I did use lightweight cloth prior to a very thin coat. Rick S. 40185 -----Original Message----- >From: Deems Davis <deemsdavis(at)cox.net> >Sent: Oct 3, 2006 12:53 PM >To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com >Subject: RV10-List: Filler wars - Part I > > >I've got the cabin cover off prior to match drilling it to the Fuse and >figured this would be a good time to smooth out the "varicous veins" >left from the vacum bagging and to otherwise sand and fill the >depressions/hills and valleys to make for a more ascethetic interior >appearance. I merrily began this process using Bondo for the deeper >'valleys' and a product called 'Icing' for the more shallow. John 'The >Turbinator" Cox who monitors this grasshoppers progress to keep me from >wandering too far afield from 'acceptable' practices. Noted what I was >doing and in an offline e-mail diplomatically informed me that both of >the 2 products I was using have histories of shrinking after 18-24 >months of use, and particularly when exposed to high (120F) temps. >:o >! He sent me some pictures from some Lancair projects to dramatically >demonstrate the results. > >So my question is: What 'aircraft grade' filler are people using? And >where did you obtain it from? I'd appreciate hearing experience >particularly from anybody that's already solved this problem. The >application I'm using it for, is definitely Non Structural, and cosmetic >only, so I don't need/want to use flox, epoxy and micro takes too long >to set up to be able to sand. as I'm finding that it takes many many >coats/layers of filler to get a smooth surface. > >Let the games begin > >Deems Davis # 406 >Panel/Finishing >http://deemsrv10.com/ > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "John Dunne" <acs(at)acspropeller.com.au>
Subject: Filler wars - Part I
Date: Oct 04, 2006
Deems, recommendations from the local Aero Structures group here.. Hysol EA934NA or EA960F. Check with Loctite Aerospace group www.loctite.com they should have a data chart for cross referencing applications. A question for you..... how well did your cabin cover align with your tailcone top skin F-1074? I seem to have zero gap at the very top but up to .125" at the side skin junctions (F1073) All else seems to be trimmed John 40315 -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Deems Davis Sent: Wednesday, 4 October 2006 5:54 AM Subject: RV10-List: Filler wars - Part I I've got the cabin cover off prior to match drilling it to the Fuse and figured this would be a good time to smooth out the "varicous veins" left from the vacum bagging and to otherwise sand and fill the depressions/hills and valleys to make for a more ascethetic interior appearance. I merrily began this process using Bondo for the deeper 'valleys' and a product called 'Icing' for the more shallow. John 'The Turbinator" Cox who monitors this grasshoppers progress to keep me from wandering too far afield from 'acceptable' practices. Noted what I was doing and in an offline e-mail diplomatically informed me that both of the 2 products I was using have histories of shrinking after 18-24 months of use, and particularly when exposed to high (120F) temps. >:o ! He sent me some pictures from some Lancair projects to dramatically demonstrate the results. So my question is: What 'aircraft grade' filler are people using? And where did you obtain it from? I'd appreciate hearing experience particularly from anybody that's already solved this problem. The application I'm using it for, is definitely Non Structural, and cosmetic only, so I don't need/want to use flox, epoxy and micro takes too long to set up to be able to sand. as I'm finding that it takes many many coats/layers of filler to get a smooth surface. Let the games begin Deems Davis # 406 Panel/Finishing http://deemsrv10.com/ ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Oct 03, 2006
From: "W. Curtis" <wcurtis(at)core.com>
Subject: RE: MVP-50 Fuel Flow Transducer
The EI FT-60 Fuel Flow Transducer, while a different form factor than the FloScan, is electrically compatible with the FloScan. EI went with their own design to reduce cost and because they thought they could improve it. One of the improvement was a "straight thru" flow design. In the FloScan, supposedly the fuel has to do a 90 degree turn to exit. As to them not wanted it mounted "rigid", I'm not sure what the logic is here. Both units have an internal impeller and would be equally susceptible to any vibration. In my Cardinal I've have the EI Fuel Flow instrument with the original FloScan transducer mounted rigidly to the firewall, though the lines to it are flexible. It is mounted just after the main fuel line outlet from the firewall, before the mechanical fuel pump and NOT adjacent to the spider. Since I was already an EI customer, I ordered one of their new transducers "real cheap" telling them it was a spare for the FlowScan. It was actually for the RV-10. I talked to EI at length at OSH and it WILL be mounted Not sure who you spoke to at EI but unless I hear it from Mac Speed, it's not gospel. Also not sure what to make of the "push-pull" stuff, but in the world of fluid dynamics, flow is flow. The EI FT-60 (Red Cube) Fuel Flow Transducer, while a different form factor than the FloScan, is electrically compatible with the FloScan. EI went with their own design they said, to reduce cost and because they thought they could improve it. One of the improvement was a "straight thru" flow design. In the FloScan, supposedly the fuel has to do a 90 degree turn to exit. As to them not wanted it mounted "rigid", I'm not sure what the logic is here. Both units have an internal impeller and would be equally susceptible to any vibration. In my Cardinal I've have the EI Fuel Flow instrument with the original FloScan transducer mounted rigidly to the firewall, though the lines to it are flexible. It is mounted just after the main fuel line outlet from the firewall, before the mechanical fuel pump and NOT adjacent to the spider. Not sure who you spoke to at EI but unless I hear it from Mac Speed, I have to take it with a grain of salt. Also, not sure what to make of the "push-pull" stuff, but in the world of fluid dynamics, flow is flow weather it is push or pulledyou are measuring flow not pressure. Reading the install manual for the FT-60 it only mentions that the fuel line out from the transducer NOT drop down and that the wires should NOT be pointing down. It also cautions that the transducer should NOT be installed next to the exhaust system.. Excessive heat can damage the system. Now if you are placing it before the fuel goes into the divider, even below the engine this is a high temperature environmentyou may want to check with them again and inquire why they are contradicting their documentation. Since I was already an EI customer, I ordered one of their new transducers "at a really good price" telling them it was a spare for the FlowScan. It is actually for the RV-10 to be used with the Grand Rapid EIS. I talked to EI at length at OSH and they did not mention any of the push-pull, rigid mounting or any of these issues. I modified the FloScan mount to accept the new EI transducer and Ill let you know how it works out. Nothing in the documentation contradicts locating it in the tunnel. >If anyone is going to use the MVP-50 from Electronis Intl like I am, you might >save yourself some time and NOT install the fuel-flow transducer bracket in the tunnel. > EI does NOT use the FlowScan transducer. They use their own that they designed. >They do not want it mounted "rigid." They want it mounted on a flex line >just before the fuel goes into the divider. They told me they reason for that >is that they want fuel "PUSHED" into the Transducer and not possibly "PULLED" >by the engine fuel pump. > >Zack > >-------- >RV8 #80125 >RV10 # 40512 William Curtis http://wcurtis.nerv10.com/ ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Wayne Edgerton" <wayne.e(at)grandecom.net>
Subject: Direct2 issue
Date: Oct 03, 2006
Stein, I just was looking at the Direct2 sales literature and it's absolutely amazing how much false information there is in their material as it relates to the wiring package. I know your very busy, but just skim through this and see how false their claims are. Look at the bottom where they discuss their detailed SV10 wiring manual, which I highlighted in RED. Stein, I believe they need to refund me at least $1500, which I think you said is the extra price it cost me to go with them, because 1 - they haven't delivered as promised and 2 they haven't delivered what they promised. With no wiring instructions to speak of this is an absolute joke for people like me with little or no wiring experience. Based on this literature that I excerpted from their web site they've made some fairly serious miss statements, almost boarding on fraud. Money isn't so much the issue with me, although as with everyone it's important, like the other fellow you told me about, but more that I think I've been duped. I paid them a long way in advanced for a product that they couldn't deliver on a timely basis and really on the wiring part couldn't even deliver. I like you as a person and I think you and your staff are a pretty honest group but this type of think reflects badly on you also because I relied on your expertise on what and who I should go with. I know that you've told me they duped you also, so I'll accept that explanation but I think they need to feel some of this pain also by having to rebate for what they didn't or can't deliver. I know we've discussed this on the phone but I just wanted to reiterate it in writing. I usually a fairly understanding person when it comes to delays but this is getting beyond reasonable. Wayne Service, support, and training from Direct-To Avionics completes the package. Direct-To Avionics was created to be the ultimate resource for Chelton's experimental line of synthetic vision EFIS. We took part in its development and continue developing, evaluating and exhaustively testing future Chelton Experimental and Certifi ed systems. We have an intimate working knowledge of electronic flight systems and pass this along to our customers with complete and dedicated support-from technical, to training, to warranty. When you choose Chelton you'll be completely supported by Direct-To Avionics. Our support and dedication to our customers leads the industry. Installation simplified for the RV-10. To make installation surprisingly easy, the SV-10 comes complete with an integrated wire harness engineered and fitted specifically for the RV-10. It combines over130 electrical connections! It's not just a harness for your Chelton EFIS; it includes wiring from wingtip to wingtip and firewall to rudder. This harness, built to exacting standards, is supplied by an aerospace company who also manufactures harnesses for the F-22, F-16, Airbus, Boeing, and others. Included in your harness are connections for your Chelton EFIS and the new Pinpoint Inertial GADAHRS. Wiring is also provided for interfaces such as the Trutrak Autopilot-with pitch and roll servos, Garmin SL-30 Nav/Com, datalink, and PS Engineering audio panel. We've even included wiring for aircraft systems such as electric pitch and roll trim, control stick functions, outside air temperature probe, nav and strobe lights, landing light, pitot heat and door ajar sensors. Following the detailed SV-10 manual for installing your aircraft harness system is easy-it's designed for those with basic wiring skills. In your manual you'll find photographs depicting an installation of the SV- 10 harness in an RV-10. Test your wiring, install your harness and components, and give it power. The aircraft harness is designed to eliminate the majority of complicated wiring for your RV-10, so we've included it with the Chelton SV-10 system to simplify your installation, saving you as much time as possible and getting you and your RV-10 in the air faster! The Chelton EFIS SV-10 With this special package you receive the following components: Our integrated System harness is custom fi tted ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Oct 03, 2006
Subject: [ John W. Cox ] : New Email List Photo Share Available!
From: Email List Photo Shares <pictures(at)matronics.com>
A new Email List Photo Share is available: Poster: John W. Cox Lists: RV-List,RV10-List Subject: Hartzell Composite Prop http://www.matronics.com/photoshare/johnwcox@pacificnw.com.10.03.2006/index.html ---------------------------------------------------------- o Main Photo Share Index http://www.matronics.com/photoshare o Submitting a Photo Share If you wish to submit a Photo Share of your own, please include the following information along with your email message and files: 1) Email List or Lists that they are related to: 2) Your Full Name: 3) Your Email Address: 4) One line Subject description: 5) Multi-line, multi-paragraph description of topic: 6) One-line Description of each photo or file: Email the information above and your files and photos to: pictures(at)matronics.com ---------------------------------------------------------- ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Wayne Edgerton" <wayne.e(at)grandecom.net>
Subject: Chelton SV-10 package
Date: Oct 03, 2006
I don't know if there are any of you who are considering ordering the Chelton SV10 package. If there are, based on my experience, I would recommend that you not take their wiring package. When I was at Sun-N-Fun I changed my original Chelton order over to the SV-10 package which include the WAAS receiver and a wiring package. They told me it should deliver by June or July. We are now in Oct and I still don't have everything. But my biggest complaint is with the wiring package. I've received some of it in pieces and I'm still not sure if I have everything. I'm definitely not a skilled wiring person and that is the reason that I wanted their wiring package, because of their reputation of having quality products. When I received the first bundle of wires it was for the left and right wing. There was absolutely no instructions with it. I called them and they sent me a very short sheet saying what the pins were for. Possible for a very experienced person that would be enough but not for a neophyte like me. Below is the instructions for the pilot wing. SV-10 Pilot Wing 24 Pin AMP CPC 1. Roll Servo Power 2. Roll Servo Ground 3. Roll Servo Pin 5 4. Roll Servo Pin 2 5. Roll Servo Pin 3 6. Roll Servo Pin 6 7. Roll Servo Pin 4 8. Roll Servo Shields 9. Aileron Trim 10. Aileron Trim 11. Pitot Heat Power 12. Landing Light Power 13. Landing Light Power 14. Nav Light Power 15. Strobe Light (W) 16. Strobe Light (B) 17. Strobe Light (O) 18. Strobe Light Shields 19. N/C 20. N/C 21. N/C 22. N/C 23. N/C 24. N/C For me this just isn't enough. I've received another one a little more detailed but almost like someone's notes on how it works. Their literature leads one to believe that it comes with a detailed installation manual. Not true. If I were to do it over again I would order the wiring package from Van's. It's cheaper and their instruction write up, I've seen it, is very good like the rest of the 10 manuals. I'm not out trying to burn crosses out in front of someone's building but this has been one of my bigger mistakes on this project and I hope others will not make the same mistake that I did. Wayne Edgerton #40336 ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Oct 03, 2006
Subject: [ Alf Olav Frog / Norway ] : New Email List Photo Share Available!
From: Email List Photo Shares <pictures(at)matronics.com>
A new Email List Photo Share is available: Poster: Alf Olav Frog / Norway Lists: RV-List,RV3-List,RV4-List,RV6-List,RV7-List,RV8-List,RV9-List,RV10-List Subject: Trimtab problems are history! http://www.matronics.com/photoshare/ao.frog@c2i.net.10.03.2006/index.html ---------------------------------------------------------- o Main Photo Share Index http://www.matronics.com/photoshare o Submitting a Photo Share If you wish to submit a Photo Share of your own, please include the following information along with your email message and files: 1) Email List or Lists that they are related to: 2) Your Full Name: 3) Your Email Address: 4) One line Subject description: 5) Multi-line, multi-paragraph description of topic: 6) One-line Description of each photo or file: Email the information above and your files and photos to: pictures(at)matronics.com ---------------------------------------------------------- ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Oct 03, 2006
From: Deems Davis <deemsdavis(at)cox.net>
Subject: Opinion regarding air vents
For those of you that are flying or for those of you that have spent some time in one of the transition aircraft. How would you assess the need/desirability of overhead fresh-air vents? I've read comments that the standard Van's vents provide an abundance of air, however most of it is aimed to low (gonad refrigerant). If the Naca Vents were ducted to provide fresh air to the pilot/copilot face/head/trunk from a little higher on the instrument panel,would the overhead vents still be worth having ? I've got the Cabin cover off and now would be the right time to add something if it's necessary, If it's not that's one modification I'd be happy to forgo. Deems Davis # 406 Panel/Finishing http://deemsrv10.com/ Where it's only 120 degrees for just a few minutes in the am b4 heading up to really hot. (It's OCT and stilllllllll 100!) ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Mark Ritter" <mritter509(at)msn.com>
Subject: Direct2 issue
Date: Oct 03, 2006
Wayne, WOW - I cancelled my order with Direct2 early on (received a prompt refund of my deposit) and went with a dual screen GRT and MX 20 setup. I cancelled after getting cold feet on the cost and not because of a problem with Direct2. The GRT, MX 20 with XM weather and radio coupled with a G430, TT Sorcerer A/P and SL30 makes for a pretty capable panel and great folks to deal with. Hope it all works out for you. I purchased my GRT EFIS from Stein and received excellent service. I beleive he is one of the "good" guys. Even got a $9,000 T-shirt out of the deal. Garmin avionics were ordered from John Stark and the Sorcerer from Alex DeDominicis - no T-shirts but again you won't find better people to deal with. I flew with Alex to get some RV-10 experience and had no problem with the first flight (or subsequent flights for that matter) in N410MR. One of my GRT units went black. I shipped it back to GRT and got a very quick turn around. Mark N410MR (Flying) >From: "Wayne Edgerton" <wayne.e(at)grandecom.net> >Reply-To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com >To: >Subject: RV10-List: Direct2 issue >Date: Tue, 3 Oct 2006 19:49:50 -0500 > >Stein, > >I just was looking at the Direct2 sales literature and it's absolutely >amazing how much false information there is in their material as it relates >to the wiring package. > >I know your very busy, but just skim through this and see how false their >claims are. Look at the bottom where they discuss their detailed SV10 >wiring manual, which I highlighted in RED. > >Stein, I believe they need to refund me at least $1500, which I think you >said is the extra price it cost me to go with them, because 1 - they >haven't delivered as promised and 2 they haven't delivered what they >promised. With no wiring instructions to speak of this is an absolute joke >for people like me with little or no wiring experience. Based on this >literature that I excerpted from their web site they've made some fairly >serious miss statements, almost boarding on fraud. > >Money isn't so much the issue with me, although as with everyone it's >important, like the other fellow you told me about, but more that I think >I've been duped. I paid them a long way in advanced for a product that they >couldn't deliver on a timely basis and really on the wiring part couldn't >even deliver. I like you as a person and I think you and your staff are a >pretty honest group but this type of think reflects badly on you also >because I relied on your expertise on what and who I should go with. I know >that you've told me they duped you also, so I'll accept that explanation >but I think they need to feel some of this pain also by having to rebate >for what they didn't or can't deliver. > >I know we've discussed this on the phone but I just wanted to reiterate it >in writing. I usually a fairly understanding person when it comes to delays >but this is getting beyond reasonable. > >Wayne > > >Service, support, and training from Direct-To Avionics completes the >package. > >Direct-To Avionics was created to be the ultimate resource for Chelton's >experimental line of synthetic vision EFIS. We took part in > >its development and continue developing, evaluating and exhaustively >testing future Chelton Experimental and Certifi ed systems. > >We have an intimate working knowledge of electronic flight systems and pass >this along to our customers with complete and > >dedicated support-from technical, to training, to warranty. When you choose >Chelton you'll be completely supported by > >Direct-To Avionics. Our support and dedication to our customers leads the >industry. > >Installation simplified for the RV-10. > >To make installation surprisingly easy, the SV-10 comes complete with an >integrated > >wire harness engineered and fitted specifically for the RV-10. It combines >over130 > >electrical connections! It's not just a harness for your Chelton EFIS; it >includes wiring > >from wingtip to wingtip and firewall to rudder. This harness, built to >exacting standards, > >is supplied by an aerospace company who also manufactures harnesses for the > >F-22, F-16, Airbus, Boeing, and others. Included in your harness are >connections > >for your Chelton EFIS and the new Pinpoint Inertial GADAHRS. > >Wiring is also provided for interfaces such as the Trutrak Autopilot-with >pitch and > >roll servos, Garmin SL-30 Nav/Com, datalink, and PS Engineering audio >panel. > >We've even included wiring for aircraft systems such as electric pitch and >roll trim, > >control stick functions, outside air temperature probe, nav and strobe >lights, landing light, pitot heat and > >door ajar sensors. > >Following the detailed SV-10 manual for installing your aircraft harness >system is easy-it's > >designed for those with basic wiring skills. In your manual you'll find >photographs depicting an installation of the SV- > >10 harness in an RV-10. Test your wiring, install your harness and >components, and give it power. The > >aircraft harness is designed to eliminate the majority of complicated >wiring for your RV-10, so we've > >included it with the Chelton SV-10 system to simplify your installation, >saving you as much time as possible > >and getting you and your RV-10 in the air faster! > >The Chelton EFIS SV-10 > >With this special package you receive > >the following components: > >Our integrated System harness is custom fi tted ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Oct 03, 2006
From: Deems Davis <deemsdavis(at)cox.net>
Subject: Re: Filler wars - Part I
Thanks John, it looks like I need EA960F (Fast). now if I can find a place that distributes it. I can't say as how the cabin cover aligns because I haven't put it on with the F1074 skin yet, I'll let you know what it looks like when I do. Deems Davis # 406 Panel/Finishing http://deemsrv10.com/ ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Chris , Susie Darcy" <VHMUM(at)bigpond.com>
Subject: Re: Filler wars - Part I/cabin cover
Date: Oct 04, 2006
John mine was the same! ----- Original Message ----- From: "John Dunne" <acs(at)acspropeller.com.au> Sent: Wednesday, October 04, 2006 9:13 AM Subject: RE: RV10-List: Filler wars - Part I > > Deems, recommendations from the local Aero Structures group here.. > Hysol EA934NA or EA960F. Check with Loctite Aerospace group > www.loctite.com > they should have a data chart for cross referencing applications. > A question for you..... how well did your cabin cover align with your > tailcone top skin F-1074? I seem to have zero gap at the very top but up > to > .125" at the side skin junctions (F1073) All else seems to be trimmed > John 40315 > > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com > [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Deems Davis > Sent: Wednesday, 4 October 2006 5:54 AM > To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com > Subject: RV10-List: Filler wars - Part I > > > I've got the cabin cover off prior to match drilling it to the Fuse and > figured this would be a good time to smooth out the "varicous veins" > left from the vacum bagging and to otherwise sand and fill the > depressions/hills and valleys to make for a more ascethetic interior > appearance. I merrily began this process using Bondo for the deeper > 'valleys' and a product called 'Icing' for the more shallow. John 'The > Turbinator" Cox who monitors this grasshoppers progress to keep me from > wandering too far afield from 'acceptable' practices. Noted what I was > doing and in an offline e-mail diplomatically informed me that both of > the 2 products I was using have histories of shrinking after 18-24 > months of use, and particularly when exposed to high (120F) temps. >:o > ! He sent me some pictures from some Lancair projects to dramatically > demonstrate the results. > > So my question is: What 'aircraft grade' filler are people using? And > where did you obtain it from? I'd appreciate hearing experience > particularly from anybody that's already solved this problem. The > application I'm using it for, is definitely Non Structural, and cosmetic > only, so I don't need/want to use flox, epoxy and micro takes too long > to set up to be able to sand. as I'm finding that it takes many many > coats/layers of filler to get a smooth surface. > > Let the games begin > > Deems Davis # 406 > Panel/Finishing > http://deemsrv10.com/ > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: JSMcGrew(at)aol.com
Date: Oct 04, 2006
Subject: Re: Opinion regarding air vents
In my opinion, the stock vents are quite adequate for cooling. You can point them up toward your face if you need it, or elsewhere if you don't want all that wind blowing on your microphone. For a while I had diverted the passenger vent for avionics cooling... I was able to keep the most finicky passengers happy in 100 deg weather by directing the pilot's vent cross cockpit. Personally, I would not spend the effort or panel space raising the stock vents higher or installing overhead vents. Jim 40134 - Flying Jim "Scooter" McGrew Graduate Student Humans and Automation Lab (_http://halab.mit.edu_ (https://webmail.mit.edu/horde/services/go.php?url=http://halab.mit.edu) ) Department of Aeronautics and Astronautics Massachusetts Institute of Technology In a message dated 10/3/2006 10:15:24 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time, deemsdavis(at)cox.net writes: --> RV10-List message posted by: Deems Davis For those of you that are flying or for those of you that have spent some time in one of the transition aircraft. How would you assess the need/desirability of overhead fresh-air vents? I've read comments that the standard Van's vents provide an abundance of air, however most of it is aimed to low (gonad refrigerant). If the Naca Vents were ducted to provide fresh air to the pilot/copilot face/head/trunk from a little higher on the instrument panel,would the overhead vents still be worth having ? I've got the Cabin cover off and now would be the right time to add something if it's necessary, If it's not that's one modification I'd be happy to forgo. Deems Davis # 406 Panel/Finishing http://deemsrv10.com/ ________________________________________________________________________________
From: kilopapa(at)antelecom.net
Subject: Direct2 issue
Date: Oct 03, 2006
Your system sound nice. What is displayed on the MX20? Is it a standalone moving map? Thanks, Kevin 40494 ----- Original Message Follows ----- From: "Mark Ritter" <mritter509(at)msn.com> Subject: RE: RV10-List: Direct2 issue Date: Tue, 03 Oct 2006 21:16:22 -0500 ... and went with a dual screen >GRT and MX 20 setup. I cancelled after getting cold feet >on the cost and not because of a problem with Direct2. >The GRT, MX 20 with XM weather and radio coupled with a >G430, TT Sorcerer A/P and SL30 makes for a pretty capable >panel and great folks to deal with. ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "RAS" <deruiteraircraftservices(at)btinternet.com>
Subject: Re: Hugo Rv10#40456
Date: Oct 04, 2006
Hi, there's a pilot hole in the side of the fuselage skin, roughly 4 inches forward of the flap actuator . ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Russell Daves" <dav1111(at)cox.net>
Subject: Re: Opinion regarding air vents
Date: Oct 04, 2006
I second Jim's Opinion, but like Tim Olson, I may add an overhead console and overhead vents when I install my flightline interior (less seats), due for delivery in January. My wife installed a headliner but decided after Grady O'Neal at GLO Custom Paint did such a wonderful job on the paint that she wanted me to order the Flightline interior. Russ Daves N710RV - First Flight 7/28/06 LOE 2006 Bound ----- Original Message ----- From: JSMcGrew(at)aol.com To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com Sent: Wednesday, October 04, 2006 12:15 AM Subject: Re: RV10-List: Opinion regarding air vents In my opinion, the stock vents are quite adequate for cooling. You can point them up toward your face if you need it, or elsewhere if you don't want all that wind blowing on your microphone. For a while I had diverted the passenger vent for avionics cooling... I was able to keep the most finicky passengers happy in 100 deg weather by directing the pilot's vent cross cockpit. Personally, I would not spend the effort or panel space raising the stock vents higher or installing overhead vents. Jim 40134 - Flying Jim "Scooter" McGrew Graduate Student Humans and Automation Lab (http://halab.mit.edu) Department of Aeronautics and Astronautics Massachusetts Institute of Technology In a message dated 10/3/2006 10:15:24 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time, deemsdavis(at)cox.net writes: For those of you that are flying or for those of you that have spent some time in one of the transition aircraft. How would you assess the need/desirability of overhead fresh-air vents? I've read comments that the standard Van's vents provide an abundance of air, however most of it is aimed to low (gonad refrigerant). If the Naca Vents were ducted to provide fresh air to the pilot/copilot face/head/trunk from a little higher on the instrument panel,would the overhead vents still be worth having ? I've got the Cabin cover off and now would be the right time to add something if it's necessary, If it's not that's one modification I'd be happy to forgo. Deems Davis # 406 Panel/Finishing http://deemsrv10.com/ ________________________________________________________________________________
From: GRANSCOTT(at)aol.com
Date: Oct 04, 2006
Subject: Re: RE: MVP-50 Fuel Flow Transducer
In a message dated 10/3/2006 8:01:09 PM Eastern Standard Time, wcurtis(at)core.com writes: I ordered one of their new transducers "at a really good price" telling them it was a spare for the FlowScan. It is actually for the RV-10 to be used with the Grand Rapid EIS. Not trying to be judgemental, but a "little" lie about a product's intention to get a lower price? I guess there are some things we don't need to know. P ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "gary" <speckter(at)comcast.net>
Subject: Filler wars - Part I
Date: Oct 04, 2006
For those of you new to composits there are two products that you should not be without. Superfil by Poly-Fiber and UV Smooth Prime Filler. The first is a body filler but it is light weight and sands easily. It goes on easy and comes off easy. This is a must, for get the bondo. The second is for pin holes in the composits. It to works great. Both are pricy but as they say you get what you pay for. Spruce has both of them. Gary 40274 -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Deems Davis Sent: Tuesday, October 03, 2006 3:54 PM Subject: RV10-List: Filler wars - Part I I've got the cabin cover off prior to match drilling it to the Fuse and figured this would be a good time to smooth out the "varicous veins" left from the vacum bagging and to otherwise sand and fill the depressions/hills and valleys to make for a more ascethetic interior appearance. I merrily began this process using Bondo for the deeper 'valleys' and a product called 'Icing' for the more shallow. John 'The Turbinator" Cox who monitors this grasshoppers progress to keep me from wandering too far afield from 'acceptable' practices. Noted what I was doing and in an offline e-mail diplomatically informed me that both of the 2 products I was using have histories of shrinking after 18-24 months of use, and particularly when exposed to high (120F) temps. >:o ! He sent me some pictures from some Lancair projects to dramatically demonstrate the results. So my question is: What 'aircraft grade' filler are people using? And where did you obtain it from? I'd appreciate hearing experience particularly from anybody that's already solved this problem. The application I'm using it for, is definitely Non Structural, and cosmetic only, so I don't need/want to use flox, epoxy and micro takes too long to set up to be able to sand. as I'm finding that it takes many many coats/layers of filler to get a smooth surface. Let the games begin Deems Davis # 406 Panel/Finishing http://deemsrv10.com/ ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Wayne Edgerton" <wayne.e(at)grandecom.net>
Subject: Re: Direct2 issue
Date: Oct 04, 2006
I've made a terrible mistake on this posting and I need to apologize to Stein. I hadn't meant for this to be posted on Matronics but rather sent confidential to Stein. I'm not sure what I did but I obviously wasn't paying attention well enough and selected the wrong e-mail address when I sent it. This was a very bad mistake on my part and I certainly owe Stein an apology. Wayne Edgerton #40336 ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: QB Wings and Standard Fuselage
From: "Michael Wellenzohn" <michael(at)wellenzohn.net>
Date: Oct 04, 2006
Hello everybody, I am starting soon with the tailcone so its time to order the next kit parts. Is ist possible to order the QB wings and have the standard fuselage shipped first (without the ) so that I can still keep on building without having to wait until the Wings are ready. If Wings and Fuse would be delivered at the same time I'd face some space problems. Any experience out there in the community? Cheers Michael #40511 http://www.wellenzohn.net -------- RV-10 builder #511 Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=65693#65693 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Mark Ritter" <mritter509(at)msn.com>
Subject: Direct2 issue
Date: Oct 04, 2006
Kevin, The Garmin MX-20 has its own data base (another subscription fee). It talks to the G430 and displays GPS flight plan route, etc. There are three map pages (1) VFR map page that looks like a sectional map, (2) IFR map page that has victor airways, intersections, etc., (3) Custom map page which is a sectional map page but with the ability add or delete items. It has a ton of features and options like XM weather and radio and approach chart display - too numerous to mention here. It is also very easy to learn how to use the features. Mark >From: kilopapa(at)antelecom.net >Reply-To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com >To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com >Subject: RE: RV10-List: Direct2 issue >Date: Tue, 03 Oct 2006 21:40:29 -0800 > > >Your system sound nice. What is displayed on the MX20? Is >it a standalone moving map? > >Thanks, > >Kevin >40494 > >----- Original Message Follows ----- >From: "Mark Ritter" <mritter509(at)msn.com> >To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com >Subject: RE: RV10-List: Direct2 issue >Date: Tue, 03 Oct 2006 21:16:22 -0500 > >... and went with a dual screen > >GRT and MX 20 setup. I cancelled after getting cold feet > >on the cost and not because of a problem with Direct2. > >The GRT, MX 20 with XM weather and radio coupled with a > >G430, TT Sorcerer A/P and SL30 makes for a pretty capable > >panel and great folks to deal with. > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Jae Chang" <jc-matronics_rv10(at)jline.com>
Subject: Fuel tank return fuel line
Date: Oct 04, 2006
Does anyone think adding a return fuel line to the fuel tanks, is a bad idea? I have seen -7 builder logs add this addition, but not any -10 builders, yet. If it's a worthwhile task, I notice that the fuel tank ribs have 2 small identically sized holes for snapbushings on the top side of the rib, right below the rib's top flange. The forward-most hole is designated in the plans for the vent line. However, was there any initial intention for the rear-most hole? As far as I can tell, it looks like it is ignored. Do you foresee any problems using this existing rear-most hole for putting in snapbushings to hold a fuel-return line? The only new hole I would need to drill then is in the T-1003B end rib to hold the AN hardware. Do you foresee any problems putting a hole in the end rib similar to the fuel tank ribs? Thanks for the feedback, Jae ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Jae Chang" <jc-matronics_rv10(at)jline.com>
Subject: Al fuel vent line cutting
Date: Oct 04, 2006
Another quickie question, is it kosher to use a home depot plumbing pipe cutter, for cutting the Al tubes for the fuel vent lines for instance? I guess I still need to buy something like the Parker Flaring Tool to flare the ends? http://www.aircraft-tool.com/shop/detail.aspx?PRODUCT_ID=212FB&ReturnPage=/shop/ flyer.aspx?PageNo=1 Thanks again, Jae ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Jeff Carpenter <jeff(at)westcottpress.com>
Subject: Flap Trailing Edge
Date: Oct 04, 2006
Hello Fellow Builders... I've got my flaps all clecoed up and drilled out and notice that my flap skins... both skins on both flaps come up 1/16" short of the trailing edge wedge. This was not the case with my rudder trailing edge, where the skins actually extended a fraction beyond the end of the wedge. Have others experienced this? I'm thinking that my trailing edge wedges might have been mis- punched... probably a lot more likely than all 4 skins being off. Jeff Carpenter 40304 ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Oct 04, 2006
From: Rick <ricksked(at)earthlink.net>
Subject: Re: Al fuel vent line cutting
Jae, A good tubing cutter is worth the extra dollars spent. The small Rigid cutter has good bearing rollers and fine threads for better cutter feed. The cheaper models will not make as clean of a cut and tend to bevel the edge a bit too much. I picked mine up at Homedepot for about $25. I also have a Parker Rotoflare, hard to swallow price but works perfect. Be advised that if you lend it out you will need it the next day...Speaking of which Mr. Kaufmann...I need my Rotoflare back. Make sure your using the 37 degree flaring tool for AN fittings. Rick S. 40185 -----Original Message----- >From: Jae Chang <jc-matronics_rv10(at)jline.com> >Sent: Oct 4, 2006 12:55 PM >To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com >Subject: RV10-List: Al fuel vent line cutting > > >Another quickie question, is it kosher to use a home depot plumbing pipe cutter, >for cutting the Al tubes for the fuel vent lines for instance? > >I guess I still need to buy something like the Parker Flaring Tool to flare the >ends? > >http://www.aircraft-tool.com/shop/detail.aspx?PRODUCT_ID=212FB&ReturnPage=/shop/ >flyer.aspx?PageNo=1 > >Thanks again, >Jae > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Al fuel vent line cutting
From: "egohr1" <EGOHR86(at)alumni.carnegiemellon.edu>
Date: Oct 04, 2006
Any good quality tubing cutter will work. I suggest 2, a standard for using in the open and a close quarters cutter. Both availble at Home Depot and Lowes Aviation supply. The parker tool is required for the flare, do noty use a auto parts flaring tool, as the flare angle is wrong. -------- eric gohr EGOHR86(at)alumni.carnegiemellon.edu Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=65772#65772 ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Oct 04, 2006
From: Rick <ricksked(at)earthlink.net>
Subject: Re: Flap Trailing Edge
Mine were the same way, more like a 1/32 though. My rudder was perfectly flush. Rick S. 40185 -----Original Message----- >From: Jeff Carpenter <jeff(at)westcottpress.com> >Sent: Oct 4, 2006 1:05 PM >To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com >Subject: RV10-List: Flap Trailing Edge > > >Hello Fellow Builders... > >I've got my flaps all clecoed up and drilled out and notice that my >flap skins... both skins on both flaps come up 1/16" short of the >trailing edge wedge. This was not the case with my rudder trailing >edge, where the skins actually extended a fraction beyond the end of >the wedge. Have others experienced this? > >I'm thinking that my trailing edge wedges might have been mis- >punched... probably a lot more likely than all 4 skins being off. > >Jeff Carpenter >40304 > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Oct 04, 2006
From: Deems Davis <deemsdavis(at)cox.net>
Subject: Re: Fuel tank return fuel line
Jae adding a return line could be an excellent addition. Depending upon which engine installation you decide upon. e.g. the AFP fuel injection system have a purge valve to assist hot starts/vapor lock conditions. Eggenfellner requires one for continuous return of unused fuel. It's an easy addition that you can always stub off if not needed. Adding it later will be more difficult (ask me how I know). I found and bought a 'bung' from one of the RV parts suppliers that can be riveted to the end rib and is already machined for the An fitting. Deems Davis # 406 Panel/Finishing http://deemsrv10.com/ Jae Chang wrote: > >Does anyone think adding a return fuel line to the fuel tanks, is a bad idea? I >have seen -7 builder logs add this addition, but not any -10 builders, yet. > >If it's a worthwhile task, I notice that the fuel tank ribs have 2 small >identically sized holes for snapbushings on the top side of the rib, right below >the rib's top flange. The forward-most hole is designated in the plans for the >vent line. However, was there any initial intention for the rear-most hole? As >far as I can tell, it looks like it is ignored. > >Do you foresee any problems using this existing rear-most hole for putting in >snapbushings to hold a fuel-return line? > >The only new hole I would need to drill then is in the T-1003B end rib to hold >the AN hardware. Do you foresee any problems putting a hole in the end rib >similar to the fuel tank ribs? > >Thanks for the feedback, >Jae > > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Jeff Carpenter <jeff(at)westcottpress.com>
Subject: Life Insurance
Date: Oct 04, 2006
My life insurance policy excludes coverage for death in, around or even while looking at a small plane. I'm about to ante up for a new policy without the aviation exclusion. The premium is about 50% higher than what I currently have. Before I take the plunge, does anyone know of another means of getting coverage... perhaps for flying only... that I've overlooked. Jeff Carpenter 40304 ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Life Insurance
Date: Oct 04, 2006
From: "Jeffery J. Morgan" <jmorgan(at)compnetconcepts.com>
Prudential seems to not mind and has very competitive rates. I also scuba dive and was flagged as a daredevil. :) Anyway, they are cheaper than most that I found and reasonable about activities. If you need an agent, email off list and I can send you mine. Jeff -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Jeff Carpenter Sent: Wednesday, October 04, 2006 2:02 PM Subject: RV10-List: Life Insurance My life insurance policy excludes coverage for death in, around or even while looking at a small plane. I'm about to ante up for a new policy without the aviation exclusion. The premium is about 50% higher than what I currently have. Before I take the plunge, does anyone know of another means of getting coverage... perhaps for flying only... that I've overlooked. Jeff Carpenter 40304 ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Oct 04, 2006
Subject: Re: Life Insurance
From: Dj Merrill <deej(at)deej.net>
Jeff Carpenter wrote: > > My life insurance policy excludes coverage for death in, around or > even while looking at a small plane. I'm about to ante up for a new > policy without the aviation exclusion. The premium is about 50% > higher than what I currently have. Before I take the plunge, does > anyone know of another means of getting coverage... perhaps for flying > only... that I've overlooked. > I went through Minnesota Life for my life insurance - they have an aviation policy. I think they are associated with the AOPA program if I remember correctly. -Dj ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Oct 04, 2006
From: "JOHN STARN" <jhstarn(at)verizon.net>
Subject: Re: Al fuel vent line cutting
Being an "old" plumber, A/C contractor I of course use ONLY Ridged cutters. Three points: #1 make sure the rollers turn freely, #2: Cut slowly, by that I mean go around more times with smaller additions to the tightening wheel. #3: Make sure you have the correct cutting wheel. Yes, Virginia there are different wheels for different materials. Examples: Copper, aluminum, plastic (PVC, ABS etc), stainless steel. If you buy Harbor Freight you'll get what they got, buy Ridged and you have a selection of cutter wheels to choose from. GO SLOW...it will save you time in the long run. KABONG Do Not Archive (GBA & GWB) ----- Original Message ----- From: "Tim Olson" <Tim(at)MyRV10.com> Sent: Wednesday, October 04, 2006 11:45 AM Subject: Re: RV10-List: Al fuel vent line cutting ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Life Insurance
Date: Oct 04, 2006
From: "Bobby J. Hughes" <bhughes(at)qnsi.net>
Make sure the "Aviation Policy" does not exclude Experimental Aircraft. I believe some do. Bobby 40116 -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Jeff Carpenter Sent: Wednesday, October 04, 2006 2:02 PM Subject: RV10-List: Life Insurance My life insurance policy excludes coverage for death in, around or even while looking at a small plane. I'm about to ante up for a new policy without the aviation exclusion. The premium is about 50% higher than what I currently have. Before I take the plunge, does anyone know of another means of getting coverage... perhaps for flying only... that I've overlooked. Jeff Carpenter 40304 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Jae Chang" <jc-matronics_rv10(at)jline.com>
Subject: Fuel tank return fuel line
Date: Oct 04, 2006
I asked Van's support the same question and received this response. I had not thought about the venting. I guess I will be cutting a couple new holes then. jae -----Original Message----- Subject: Re: RV-10: Return fuel lines to tank The rear hole lets air vent from one bay to another when the tank is being filled. If it is filled, the tanks will take significantly longer to fill. Better to make a new hole ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Paul Walter" <pdwalter(at)bigpond.net.au>
Subject: Life insurace
Date: Oct 05, 2006
I agree that it makes sense to have full life cover. I have chosen to link my life cover with my employer superannuation fund ( in the U.S.A i believe it is called a 401K plan or similar). Here in Australia employers pay a standard contribution of 9% of annual salary received. ( once again i am unsure of employer obligations in the U.S.) My insurance premiums are deducted from these payments as apposed to my bank account. Please do not misunderstand the point im making - I am still paying for life cover it just doesn't have an effect on my monthly cash flow, allowing me to spend premium on my plane. I then inturn monitor the investment performance of my retirement shares and managed funds (mutual funds) with in this investment in order to "claw back" premium expenses. I am fully covered for aviation incidents. ( although I must clarify experimental category as I was only a G.A pilot when policy commenced) You would have to look into this carefully as I do not profess to be an expert on the American retirement planning system. What ever avenue you chose this area needs to be addressed. Paul Walter ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Oct 04, 2006
From: Deems Davis <deemsdavis(at)cox.net>
Subject: Het Allen how's the engine?
Howdy Allen, If I recall correctly it's about time for my engine to get built, are you still on that schedule? Again, no rush just curious. and I need a few days to get you the balance. I'm leaving tomorrow and will be gone til late sun pm. Best of Luck Deems >* >* > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "bob.kaufmann" <bob.kaufmann(at)cox.net>
Subject: Fuel tank return fuel line
Date: Oct 04, 2006
I added a return line to my left tank, because I did not know what engine or injection system I was going to use and thought it would be a good idea to prepare just in case. It can always be capped off if not used. It was easy to put it, and if I need it will be a lot easier than waiting. Bob K Working with the stuff that sands to a fine itching powder. -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Jae Chang Sent: Wednesday, October 04, 2006 8:53 AM Subject: RV10-List: Fuel tank return fuel line Does anyone think adding a return fuel line to the fuel tanks, is a bad idea? I have seen -7 builder logs add this addition, but not any -10 builders, yet. If it's a worthwhile task, I notice that the fuel tank ribs have 2 small identically sized holes for snapbushings on the top side of the rib, right below the rib's top flange. The forward-most hole is designated in the plans for the vent line. However, was there any initial intention for the rear-most hole? As far as I can tell, it looks like it is ignored. Do you foresee any problems using this existing rear-most hole for putting in snapbushings to hold a fuel-return line? The only new hole I would need to drill then is in the T-1003B end rib to hold the AN hardware. Do you foresee any problems putting a hole in the end rib similar to the fuel tank ribs? Thanks for the feedback, Jae ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "John Hasbrouck" <jhasbrouck(at)woh.rr.com>
Subject: rear seat shoulder harness attach
Date: Oct 04, 2006
Not to interrupt the primer/filler discussion but I'd like to ask if everyone/anyone is using the longeron attach points for the rear seat shoulder harness or mounting to a hard point on the cabin top? BTW: Dentists have'nt mixed composite for years, Comes ready to use, sans air bubbles that were introduced by the mixing process. The curing reaction is initiated by light. Something to do with peroxide, free radicals etc. etc. Thought you might like to know. John Hasbrouck #40264 ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Oct 04, 2006
From: Deems Davis <deemsdavis(at)cox.net>
Subject: Oops
Oop's ,this was obviously supposed to go direct to Allen Barrett, I've spent too much time on the keyboard today, need to go aout and do some more sanding. :-[ Do No Archive Deems ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Filler wars - Part I
Date: Oct 05, 2006
From: "McGANN, Ron" <ron.mcgann(at)baesystems.com>
Guys, Hate to state the obvious, but any reason why we would not follow the guidelines in Plans Section 5T (particularly 'Prepping the Cowling for Paint') for all of the glass work?? Unless there is a compelling reason not to, this is what I have planned for the lid (this coming weekend). cheers, Ron -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of gary Sent: Wednesday, 4 October 2006 9:19 PM Subject: RE: RV10-List: Filler wars - Part I For those of you new to composits there are two products that you should not be without. Superfil by Poly-Fiber and UV Smooth Prime Filler. The first is a body filler but it is light weight and sands easily. It goes on easy and comes off easy. This is a must, for get the bondo. The second is for pin holes in the composits. It to works great. Both are pricy but as they say you get what you pay for. Spruce has both of them. Gary 40274 -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Deems Davis Sent: Tuesday, October 03, 2006 3:54 PM Subject: RV10-List: Filler wars - Part I I've got the cabin cover off prior to match drilling it to the Fuse and figured this would be a good time to smooth out the "varicous veins" left from the vacum bagging and to otherwise sand and fill the depressions/hills and valleys to make for a more ascethetic interior appearance. I merrily began this process using Bondo for the deeper 'valleys' and a product called 'Icing' for the more shallow. John 'The Turbinator" Cox who monitors this grasshoppers progress to keep me from wandering too far afield from 'acceptable' practices. Noted what I was doing and in an offline e-mail diplomatically informed me that both of the 2 products I was using have histories of shrinking after 18-24 months of use, and particularly when exposed to high (120F) temps. >:o ! He sent me some pictures from some Lancair projects to dramatically demonstrate the results. So my question is: What 'aircraft grade' filler are people using? And where did you obtain it from? I'd appreciate hearing experience particularly from anybody that's already solved this problem. The application I'm using it for, is definitely Non Structural, and cosmetic only, so I don't need/want to use flox, epoxy and micro takes too long to set up to be able to sand. as I'm finding that it takes many many coats/layers of filler to get a smooth surface. Let the games begin Deems Davis # 406 Panel/Finishing http://deemsrv10.com/ ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Marcus Cooper" <coop85(at)bellsouth.net>
Subject: rear seat shoulder harness attach
Date: Oct 04, 2006
Longeron attach points in my machine. Marcus 40286 _____ From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of John Hasbrouck Sent: Wednesday, October 04, 2006 9:17 PM Subject: RV10-List: rear seat shoulder harness attach Not to interrupt the primer/filler discussion but I'd like to ask if everyone/anyone is using the longeron attach points for the rear seat shoulder harness or mounting to a hard point on the cabin top? BTW: Dentists have'nt mixed composite for years, Comes ready to use, sans air bubbles that were introduced by the mixing process. The curing reaction is initiated by light. Something to do with peroxide, free radicals etc. etc. Thought you might like to know. John Hasbrouck #40264 ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Oct 04, 2006
From: Larry Rosen <LarryRosen(at)comcast.net>
Subject: Load Analysis & Electrical Schematic
I have posted on my web site the electrical schematic and load analysis that I am considering. The electrical design is a single battery, dual alternator design. Comment if you would. <http://lrosen.nerv10.com/Electic/index.html> Thanks to all who have before for a great load analysis layout for the . -- Larry Rosen RV-10 #356 http://lrosen.nerv10.com ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Oct 04, 2006
From: LES KEARNEY <Kearney(at)shaw.ca>
Subject: Change In Status
Hi After three days in Oregon, two demo flights, a project visit and a two day sheet metal course, I have decided to upgrade my "RV10 Wannabe" status to "RV10 Awaiting Empennage Kit". Being at this point in the build process is a bit daunting. To this point all I have spent is time and a few dollars setting up my garage. Now the real fun & spend begins! On Monday I spent a couple of hours at Van's factory which included a plant floor tour and a demo flight in N210RV, Van's demo '10. The 20 minute demo flight was impressive in how the '10 accelerates, climbs and flies. I was given the chance to do a few turns etc and liked the impressive visability and the easy handling of the stick. This was my first time flying in the right seat and with a stick. The only realy disappointment was the "utilitarian" look of the demo '10. It also seemed a bit noisy but this may be due to the lack of soundproofing. It would have been nice it it had a more complete interior and a "state of the possible" panel. Monday evening Randy Debauw was kind enough to give me a flight in his '10. This was a lot more fun as he let me fly and land (*albeit with gentle guidance*) at a nearby airport. This gave me a much better feel for the '10. Tuesday I spent the day at Henry Gorgas' shop and started on a sheet metal workshop. Henry is very particular about how things should be done and took great pains to explain why he did things the way he did. Under his careful instruction I have a project piece that has examples of every type of defective rivertting including an absolutely stellar mushroom rivet. Tuesday night I spent a couple of hours with Bruce Radke getting a tour of his project. I now have an appreciation how how much composite work the '10 involves. Wednesday I spent another day with Henry an completed my airfoil project. My rivetting has improved *somewhat* and I learned how to drill out rivets. Somehow, I think this will be an important skill. After finishing my sheet metal class I zipped over to Van's and asked to see the quick build kits again, took a few pictures and bought my empennage kit. This list and the wonderfully detailed websites of those who have already built a '10 will be major build resource for me. Cheers Les ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "John Jessen" <jjessen(at)rcn.com>
Subject: Change In Status
Date: Oct 04, 2006
Les, it was good meeting you. I know you'll be just as thrilled and hooked as we all appear to be. Not only is it a great plane, but the support group you now have is even better. Enjoy! John Jessen #40328 (the guy priming his tailcone parts) -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of LES KEARNEY Sent: Wednesday, October 04, 2006 7:48 PM Subject: RV10-List: Change In Status Hi After three days in Oregon, two demo flights, a project visit and a two day sheet metal course, I have decided to upgrade my "RV10 Wannabe" status to "RV10 Awaiting Empennage Kit". Being at this point in the build process is a bit daunting. To this point all I have spent is time and a few dollars setting up my garage. Now the real fun & spend begins! On Monday I spent a couple of hours at Van's factory which included a plant floor tour and a demo flight in N210RV, Van's demo '10. The 20 minute demo flight was impressive in how the '10 accelerates, climbs and flies. I was given the chance to do a few turns etc and liked the impressive visability and the easy handling of the stick. This was my first time flying in the right seat and with a stick. The only realy disappointment was the "utilitarian" look of the demo '10. It also seemed a bit noisy but this may be due to the lack of soundproofing. It would have been nice it it had a more complete interior and a "state of the possible" panel. Monday evening Randy Debauw was kind enough to give me a flight in his '10. This was a lot more fun as he let me fly and land (*albeit with gentle guidance*) at a nearby airport. This gave me a much better feel for the '10. Tuesday I spent the day at Henry Gorgas' shop and started on a sheet metal workshop. Henry is very particular about how things should be done and took great pains to explain why he did things the way he did. Under his careful instruction I have a project piece that has examples of every type of defective rivertting including an absolutely stellar mushroom rivet. Tuesday night I spent a couple of hours with Bruce Radke getting a tour of his project. I now have an appreciation how how much composite work the '10 involves. Wednesday I spent another day with Henry an completed my airfoil project. My rivetting has improved *somewhat* and I learned how to drill out rivets. Somehow, I think this will be an important skill. After finishing my sheet metal class I zipped over to Van's and asked to see the quick build kits again, took a few pictures and bought my empennage kit. This list and the wonderfully detailed websites of those who have already built a '10 will be major build resource for me. Cheers Les ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Russell Daves" <dav1111(at)cox.net>
Subject: Re: rear seat shoulder harness attach
Date: Oct 05, 2006
I used the longeron attach points in N710RV. Russ Daves First Flight 7/28/06 See you at LOE 2006 ----- Original Message ----- From: John Hasbrouck To: RV LIST Sent: Wednesday, October 04, 2006 8:17 PM Subject: RV10-List: rear seat shoulder harness attach Not to interrupt the primer/filler discussion but I'd like to ask if everyone/anyone is using the longeron attach points for the rear seat shoulder harness or mounting to a hard point on the cabin top? BTW: Dentists have'nt mixed composite for years, Comes ready to use, sans air bubbles that were introduced by the mixing process. The curing reaction is initiated by light. Something to do with peroxide, free radicals etc. etc. Thought you might like to know. John Hasbrouck #40264 ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Change In Status
From: "Michael Wellenzohn" <michael(at)wellenzohn.net>
Date: Oct 05, 2006
Hi Les, When I visited Vans last year I did nearly the same as you did. Visited Vans, and did my riveting class at Henrys workshop. It helped me alot and now I am ready to order the wings. Its a fantastic community. So have fun building! Cheers Michael http://www.wellenzohn.net -------- RV-10 builder #511 Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=65932#65932 ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Life Insurance
Date: Oct 05, 2006
From: "RV Builder (Michael Sausen)" <rvbuilder(at)sausen.net>
I went through New York Life, they didn't exclude aviation and treated it as a slightly higher risk. Barely made a change to the premium but it had to be disclosed. Michael -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Dj Merrill Sent: Wednesday, October 04, 2006 2:26 PM Subject: Re: RV10-List: Life Insurance Jeff Carpenter wrote: > --> > > My life insurance policy excludes coverage for death in, around or > even while looking at a small plane. I'm about to ante up for a new > policy without the aviation exclusion. The premium is about 50% > higher than what I currently have. Before I take the plunge, does > anyone know of another means of getting coverage... perhaps for flying > only... that I've overlooked. > I went through Minnesota Life for my life insurance - they have an aviation policy. I think they are associated with the AOPA program if I remember correctly. -Dj ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Oct 05, 2006
From: "Fred Williams, M.D." <drfred@cox-internet.com>
Subject: Fuel tanks
I'm not thinking of putting a fuel injected engine on my RV, but installing a return fitting seems like a good idea. What fitting would be the best? What is typically used? Also, the book places the chapter on the bottom skin after the completion of the fuel tanks and before installation of the aileron/flap acutation systems. Are most builders putting off attaching the bottom skin until after the flaps/ailerons/acuation system is complete? Thanks. Fred Proseal is fun........it's the MEK to clean it up that's the problem. ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Oct 05, 2006
From: Deems Davis <deemsdavis(at)cox.net>
Subject: Re: Fuel tanks
I haven't installed them yet, (wings are stored @ airport)but here's what I got to plumb a return line into one of my tanks. http://www.safeair1.com/index.htm Deems Davis # 406 Panel/Finishing http://deemsrv10.com/ Fred Williams, M.D. wrote: > <drfred@cox-internet.com> > > I'm not thinking of putting a fuel injected engine on my RV, but > installing a return fitting seems like a good idea. What fitting > would be the best? What is typically used? > Also, the book places the chapter on the bottom skin after the > completion of the fuel tanks and before installation of the > aileron/flap acutation systems. Are most builders putting off > attaching the bottom skin until after the flaps/ailerons/acuation > system is complete? > Thanks. > > Fred > > Proseal is fun........it's the MEK to clean it up that's the problem. > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Oct 05, 2006
From: Rick <ricksked(at)earthlink.net>
Subject: Re: Fuel tanks
It is a bear to rivet the bottom skins on with the aileron hardware installed, if not impossible in some spots. I did my skins with the tanks on but would have been easier with them off, just make sure no warps, the tanks help keep everything straight while the bottoms go on. An an 6 fitting bulkhead fitting should be adequate to allow you to attach a return line to, a 4 might work but you will need to know the return flow volumn and rate to make sure. Rick S. 40185 -----Original Message----- >From: "Fred Williams, M.D." <drfred@cox-internet.com> >Sent: Oct 5, 2006 6:38 AM >To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com >Subject: RV10-List: Fuel tanks > > >I'm not thinking of putting a fuel injected engine on my RV, but >installing a return fitting seems like a good idea. What fitting would >be the best? What is typically used? > >Also, the book places the chapter on the bottom skin after the >completion of the fuel tanks and before installation of the aileron/flap >acutation systems. Are most builders putting off attaching the bottom >skin until after the flaps/ailerons/acuation system is complete? > >Thanks. > >Fred > >Proseal is fun........it's the MEK to clean it up that's the problem. > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Rene Felker" <rene(at)felker.com>
Subject: Fuel tanks
Date: Oct 05, 2006
I skipped around and did the fuel tanks, leading edge (outboard), flaps, and ailerons before I started the main part of the wing. I did not put the bottom skin on until the very end........riveting the bottom skin was a pain in the ..... arm, back, etc. Rene' Felker -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Fred Williams, M.D. Sent: Thursday, October 05, 2006 7:38 AM Subject: RV10-List: Fuel tanks <drfred@cox-internet.com> I'm not thinking of putting a fuel injected engine on my RV, but installing a return fitting seems like a good idea. What fitting would be the best? What is typically used? Also, the book places the chapter on the bottom skin after the completion of the fuel tanks and before installation of the aileron/flap acutation systems. Are most builders putting off attaching the bottom skin until after the flaps/ailerons/acuation system is complete? Thanks. Fred Proseal is fun........it's the MEK to clean it up that's the problem. ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Change In Status
Date: Oct 05, 2006
From: "Phillips, Jack" <Jack.Phillips(at)cardinal.com>
Good for you, Les I'm doing things somewhat backwards. I got my empennage kit at the end of July, and have finished the vertical stabilizer and rudder and am about halfway through the horizontal stabilizer. This weekend I'm flying to Oregon with my wife. She's a Professor at NC State University and is speaking at a conference in Bend. While she's talking on Monday (I've heard her speak before), I'll drive to Aurora and go through the Van's factory. I'll try to wheedle a ride in the -10 there, but since I own and fly an RV-4 I doubt I'll qualify for their rules for a demo flight. You'll love the kit. I continue to be amazed at how well things fit together. Jack Phillips #40610 Raleigh, NC -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of LES KEARNEY Sent: Wednesday, October 04, 2006 10:48 PM Subject: RV10-List: Change In Status Hi After three days in Oregon, two demo flights, a project visit and a two day sheet metal course, I have decided to upgrade my "RV10 Wannabe" status to "RV10 Awaiting Empennage Kit". Being at this point in the build process is a bit daunting. To this point all I have spent is time and a few dollars setting up my garage. Now the real fun & spend begins! On Monday I spent a couple of hours at Van's factory which included a plant floor tour and a demo flight in N210RV, Van's demo '10. The 20 minute demo flight was impressive in how the '10 accelerates, climbs and flies. I was given the chance to do a few turns etc and liked the impressive visability and the easy handling of the stick. This was my first time flying in the right seat and with a stick. The only realy disappointment was the "utilitarian" look of the demo '10. It also seemed a bit noisy but this may be due to the lack of soundproofing. It would have been nice it it had a more complete interior and a "state of the possible" panel. Monday evening Randy Debauw was kind enough to give me a flight in his '10. This was a lot more fun as he let me fly and land (*albeit with gentle guidance*) at a nearby airport. This gave me a much better feel for the '10. Tuesday I spent the day at Henry Gorgas' shop and started on a sheet metal workshop. Henry is very particular about how things should be done and took great pains to explain why he did things the way he did. Under his careful instruction I have a project piece that has examples of every type of defective rivertting including an absolutely stellar mushroom rivet. Tuesday night I spent a couple of hours with Bruce Radke getting a tour of his project. I now have an appreciation how how much composite work the '10 involves. Wednesday I spent another day with Henry an completed my airfoil project. My rivetting has improved *somewhat* and I learned how to drill out rivets. Somehow, I think this will be an important skill. After finishing my sheet metal class I zipped over to Van's and asked to see the quick build kits again, took a few pictures and bought my empennage kit. This list and the wonderfully detailed websites of those who have already built a '10 will be major build resource for me. Cheers Les _________________________________________________ ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Fuel tanks
Date: Oct 05, 2006
From: "RV Builder (Michael Sausen)" <rvbuilder(at)sausen.net>
If you haven't put the tanks together yet you can install the return line in the top of the tank just like the feed line. It is also best that your return line extends at least 1 or 2 bays so you give the hot fuel a chance to mix with cooler fuel and eliminate any air bubbles before it is picked back up. Best case is to send it to the far bay but 2 should be fine. Looking at my AFP FM-300 manual it is looking for anything in AN2-AN4 range for the purge line. I think the Egg engine is looking for AN5 though so if you can't decide I would just go with that. Then just get a couple AN837 and associated fittings and you should be good to go. Michael Sausen -10 #352 Fuselage -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Fred Williams, M.D. Sent: Thursday, October 05, 2006 8:38 AM Subject: RV10-List: Fuel tanks --> <drfred@cox-internet.com> I'm not thinking of putting a fuel injected engine on my RV, but installing a return fitting seems like a good idea. What fitting would be the best? What is typically used? Also, the book places the chapter on the bottom skin after the completion of the fuel tanks and before installation of the aileron/flap acutation systems. Are most builders putting off attaching the bottom skin until after the flaps/ailerons/acuation system is complete? Thanks. Fred Proseal is fun........it's the MEK to clean it up that's the problem. ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "John Gonzalez" <indigoonlatigo(at)msn.com>
Subject: rear seat shoulder harness attach,
Date: Oct 05, 2006
John, You are correct, dentist don't mix their own composite except for bonding porcelain to tooth structure, but then again most of the time the assistant does the mix. We do however use flowables in tight spots and corners(low filled resin) and higher density stuff in the other areas. Having worked on both the micro scale(Dental) and the macro scale, molds and planes, I did have to learn composite basics and in both fields and the techniques are interchangable. If one is a dentist and argues this point, I would have to say they are not a very good dentist or they just don't do composite dentistry. Hopefully being a good dentist will keep my airplane from breaking apart and make it fly straight with as little power as posible. For resume' see http://johngonzalezdds.com/sculpting/sculpting.html look at full molded fiberglass models, big models! Yah the're models, but I am pretty proud of them. Knowing what I know I witnessed the most rediculous demonstration of builder assist at Lancair on their intro video they send out. At the assist center they are laminating in the main wing spar to the wing skin, basically closing up the wing and they show a man walking over the top of the wing to push the skin down onto the spar thus pushing down on the epoxy between the two structures. Now knowing what I know, both from dentistry and building models, once the weight is removed(the man walking away) the epoxy mix under the weight would have squezzed out from the gap and will not get sucked back under the skin to fill back in the gap between skin and spar, there is flex in the skin under that tremendoud weight where the man was standing. Correct application would be to put the load on the entire length of the wing skin at nearly the same time and leave it there throughout cure. It may seem anal, but this is about as important as it gets in my mind. JOhn G. >From: "John Hasbrouck" <jhasbrouck(at)woh.rr.com> >Reply-To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com >To: "RV LIST" >Subject: RV10-List: rear seat shoulder harness attach >Date: Wed, 4 Oct 2006 21:17:04 -0400 > >Not to interrupt the primer/filler discussion but I'd like to ask if >everyone/anyone is using the longeron attach points for the rear seat >shoulder harness or mounting to a hard point on the cabin top? BTW: >Dentists have'nt mixed composite for years, Comes ready to use, sans air >bubbles that were introduced by the mixing process. The curing reaction is >initiated by light. Something to do with peroxide, free radicals etc. etc. > Thought you might like to know. > >John Hasbrouck >#40264 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "jdalton77" <jdalton77(at)comcast.net>
Subject: ES 24115 Master Relay
Date: Oct 05, 2006
Good afternoon, I am just wrapping up my -10 tailcone and came to the part in the plans that instructs me to install the ES 24115 Master Relay. Does this come with the kit? I don't seem to find one in my parts bin. Did eveyone else have one? Anyone have trouble finding it? Jeff ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Oct 05, 2006
From: David Maib <dmaib(at)mac.com>
Subject: Re: Fuel tanks
Deems, Did you buy the extended range bungs to install for a return line? I have been thinking I might use one of those for a return line. David Maib 40559 tailcone On Thursday, October 05, 2006, at 07:29AM, Deems Davis wrote: > >I haven't installed them yet, (wings are stored @ airport)but here's >what I got to plumb a return line into one of my tanks. > >http://www.safeair1.com/index.htm > >Deems Davis # 406 >Panel/Finishing >http://deemsrv10.com/ > >Fred Williams, M.D. wrote: > >> <drfred@cox-internet.com> >> >> I'm not thinking of putting a fuel injected engine on my RV, but >> installing a return fitting seems like a good idea. What fitting >> would be the best? What is typically used? >> Also, the book places the chapter on the bottom skin after the >> completion of the fuel tanks and before installation of the >> aileron/flap acutation systems. Are most builders putting off >> attaching the bottom skin until after the flaps/ailerons/acuation >> system is complete? >> Thanks. >> >> Fred >> >> Proseal is fun........it's the MEK to clean it up that's the problem. >> >> >> >> >> > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: ES 24115 Master Relay
Date: Oct 05, 2006
From: "Condrey, Bob (US SSA)" <bob.condrey(at)baesystems.com>
It's an optional item. You can order direct from Van's but having it now is of no advantage. Bob _____ From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of jdalton77 Sent: Thursday, October 05, 2006 2:45 PM Subject: RV10-List: ES 24115 Master Relay Good afternoon, I am just wrapping up my -10 tailcone and came to the part in the plans that instructs me to install the ES 24115 Master Relay. Does this come with the kit? I don't seem to find one in my parts bin. Did eveyone else have one? Anyone have trouble finding it? Jeff ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Oct 05, 2006
From: "W. Curtis" <wcurtis(at)core.com>
Subject: Re: Fuel tanks
No need to buy them from Safeair for $23.95 a pair when Van's sell the VA-112 pre drilled "bung" (same 1/8 NPT "bung" used on fuel tank drain) for about $7.80 each. See Page 18-2 of the plans, or find it on "The List" Or you can do what I did here, just in case I want to add an extended range tank: http://wcurtis.nerv10.com/07Wings/wings58a.html >I haven't installed them yet, (wings are stored @ airport)but here's >what I got to plumb a return line into one of my tanks. > >http://www.safeair1.com/index.htm > >Deems Davis # 406 >Panel/Finishing >http://deemsrv10.com/ > William Curtis http://wcurtis.nerv10.com/ ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Oct 05, 2006
From: "W. Curtis" <wcurtis(at)core.com>
Subject: Re: Fuel tanks
Follow the plans Fred. The bottom skins go on LAST. Yes, you will get lots of scrapes and scars on your arms--of all the riveting I've done on the RV-10, this was by far the hardest. Also, an extra person does not help with these, they just get in the way. You can remove the torque tube temporarily AFTER you have constructed it and made adjustments to rivet the bottom skins. > >I'm not thinking of putting a fuel injected engine on my RV, but >installing a return fitting seems like a good idea. What >fitting would >be the best? What is typically used? > >Also, the book places the chapter on the bottom skin after the >completion of the fuel tanks and before installation of the aileron/flap >acutation systems. Are most builders putting off attaching the bottom >skin until after the flaps/ailerons/acuation system is complete? > >Thanks. > >Fred > William Curtis http://wcurtis.nerv10.com/ ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Direct2 issue
Date: Oct 05, 2006
From: "Kirk Hammersmith" <kirk(at)d2av.com>
I read Wayne Edgerton's posting concerning his problems with our RV-10 wiring harness, and the lack of support he feels that he has received from us at Direct To Avionics. We take this very seriously. We also take full responsibility for the issues detailed by Wayne, and want to publicly apologize to him and any others who have been impacted by this problem. We are committed to making immediate corrections. From the outset, I wanted to create a business model that is as solid as the product out in front of it. We have had challenges with supplying a harness that is as easy for our customers to install as we promote it to be. While we anticipated that the SV-10 harness and documentation would be completed months ago, the company with which we originally contracted could not deliver. To correct this, we've contracted with another firm to manufacture the harness. As a result, I am relieved to report now that we are beyond the issues of delivery, and expect production harnesses to ship within the next 3 weeks. Further, we've hired additional resources to complete the documentation that will accompany the SV-10 harness, including a graphic artist to illustrate how a builder should strip wires, crimp and terminate EACH connector. We set out to develop a wiring harness for RV-10 builder which is as close to plug & play as possible and feel that, with this documentation, we have achieved that goal. If you would like a copy of this RV-10 wiring guide sent to you, please drop me an email (kirk(at)d2av.com). We have built the reputation of Direct To Avionics around the principal of standing behind our products. Sometimes that means standing up and accepting responsibility when those products are less than our customers rightly expect. Thank you for your continued patience and patronage. Most sincerely, Kirk Hammersmith, President Direct To Avionics kirk(at)d2av.com ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Russell Daves" <dav1111(at)cox.net>
Subject: Re: Fuel tanks
Date: Oct 05, 2006
I disagree. A person to either help you buck or rivet will make the bottom skins a lot easier. If you have the wing on an upright rack even a third person to stand behind the wing to steady it while the bottom skin is being riveted is also helpful. There will be a bunch of rivets that you will probably want to set with pop rivets as well simply because even with another person bucking they won't be able to reach far enough through the access panel holes to buck every rivet. Russ Daves N710RV Flying See you at LOE 10/13/06 ----- Original Message ----- From: W. Curtis To: RV10-List(at)matronics.com Sent: Thursday, October 05, 2006 4:09 PM Subject: RV10-List: Re: Fuel tanks Follow the plans Fred. The bottom skins go on LAST. Yes, you will get lots of scrapes and scars on your arms--of all the riveting I've done on the RV-10, this was by far the hardest. Also, an extra person does not help with these, they just get in the way. You can remove the torque tube temporarily AFTER you have constructed it and made adjustments to rivet the bottom skins. > >I'm not thinking of putting a fuel injected engine on my RV, but >installing a return fitting seems like a good idea. What >fitting would >be the best? What is typically used? > >Also, the book places the chapter on the bottom skin after the >completion of the fuel tanks and before installation of the aileron/flap >acutation systems. Are most builders putting off attaching the bottom >skin until after the flaps/ailerons/acuation system is complete? > >Thanks. > >Fred > William Curtis http://wcurtis.nerv10.com/ ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Oct 05, 2006
From: "Fred Williams, M.D." <drfred@cox-internet.com>
Subject: Fuel tanks
Michael/Deems/Rene thanks for the iniput. Ive got a couple ways to go. I'll probably manufacture all the rods and connections , make sure they work, then pull them out and then put the skins on. I'll look for those fittings later tonight. It just looked easier to make sure nothing was rubbing and make sure the acuator arms all worked like they were supposed to before closing up the wing. Fred. ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Rene Felker" <rene(at)felker.com>
Subject: Re: Fuel tanks
Date: Oct 05, 2006
I agree with Russ...or do I say I agree to disagree. Just finished my bottom skins about a month and a half ago. Two people is a must. A third can help some, but they will get board. I did some riveting on a vertical stand, but changed to table. The table was much easier. First wing I used two pop rivets the second wing I used 0. Follow the order very closely and you can get them all even with short arms like me. Just make sure you start towards the middle of the large sheet and work the center section on both the rear and main spar or you will have to use some pop rivets on the main spar. Good luck. Rene' Felker _____ From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Russell Daves Sent: Thursday, October 05, 2006 3:45 PM Subject: Re: RV10-List: Re: Fuel tanks I disagree. A person to either help you buck or rivet will make the bottom skins a lot easier. If you have the wing on an upright rack even a third person to stand behind the wing to steady it while the bottom skin is being riveted is also helpful. There will be a bunch of rivets that you will probably want to set with pop rivets as well simply because even with another person bucking they won't be able to reach far enough through the access panel holes to buck every rivet. Russ Daves N710RV Flying See you at LOE 10/13/06 ----- Original Message ----- From: W. Curtis <mailto:wcurtis(at)core.com> Sent: Thursday, October 05, 2006 4:09 PM Subject: RV10-List: Re: Fuel tanks Follow the plans Fred. The bottom skins go on LAST. Yes, you will get lots of scrapes and scars on your arms--of all the riveting I've done on the RV-10, this was by far the hardest. Also, an extra person does not help with these, they just get in the way. You can remove the torque tube temporarily AFTER you have constructed it and made adjustments to rivet the bottom skins. > >I'm not thinking of putting a fuel injected engine on my RV, but >installing a return fitting seems like a good idea. What >fitting would >be the best? What is typically used? > >Also, the book places the chapter on the bottom skin after the >completion of the fuel tanks and before installation of the aileron/flap >acutation systems. Are most builders putting off attaching the bottom >skin until after the flaps/ailerons/acuation system is complete? > >Thanks. > >Fred > William Curtis http://wcurtis.nerv10.com/ href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List">http://www.matronics.com /Navigator?RV10-List href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com href="http://wiki.matronics.com">http://wiki.matronics.com href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Rob Wright" <armywrights(at)adelphia.net>
Subject: QB Floor Pans
Date: Oct 05, 2006
Tim Olson and others, I remember way back when you recommended removing your floor pans form the QB, not just for stray clecos but also to personally check quality of the Philippines. I've got all the rear ones out but can't figure an easy way to remove the most forward ones since the gear leg brackets are bolting them in. Tips? Rob Wright #392 Wanting to prime and soundproof.. ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "John Hasbrouck" <jhasbrouck(at)woh.rr.com>
Subject: Re: rear seat shoulder harness attach,
Date: Oct 05, 2006
John, Thanks for your reply regarding composites. Truly beautiful work displayed on your website. Now to the original question. Are you going to use the longeron attach or the cabin cover for rear seat shoulder harness? John Hasbrouck DDS #40264 ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: rear seat shoulder harness attach,
Date: Oct 05, 2006
From: "RV Builder (Michael Sausen)" <rvbuilder(at)sausen.net>
John, beautiful work! And seriously, is that your place and view! Man I should have been a dentist..... or single. ;-) Michael -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of John Gonzalez Sent: Thursday, October 05, 2006 12:14 PM Subject: RE: RV10-List: rear seat shoulder harness attach, --> John, You are correct, dentist don't mix their own composite except for bonding porcelain to tooth structure, but then again most of the time the assistant does the mix. We do however use flowables in tight spots and corners(low filled resin) and higher density stuff in the other areas. Having worked on both the micro scale(Dental) and the macro scale, molds and planes, I did have to learn composite basics and in both fields and the techniques are interchangable. If one is a dentist and argues this point, I would have to say they are not a very good dentist or they just don't do composite dentistry. Hopefully being a good dentist will keep my airplane from breaking apart and make it fly straight with as little power as posible. For resume' see http://johngonzalezdds.com/sculpting/sculpting.html look at full molded fiberglass models, big models! Yah the're models, but I am pretty proud of them. Knowing what I know I witnessed the most rediculous demonstration of builder assist at Lancair on their intro video they send out. At the assist center they are laminating in the main wing spar to the wing skin, basically closing up the wing and they show a man walking over the top of the wing to push the skin down onto the spar thus pushing down on the epoxy between the two structures. Now knowing what I know, both from dentistry and building models, once the weight is removed(the man walking away) the epoxy mix under the weight would have squezzed out from the gap and will not get sucked back under the skin to fill back in the gap between skin and spar, there is flex in the skin under that tremendoud weight where the man was standing. Correct application would be to put the load on the entire length of the wing skin at nearly the same time and leave it there throughout cure. It may seem anal, but this is about as important as it gets in my mind. JOhn G. ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Oct 05, 2006
From: Larry Rosen <LarryRosen(at)comcast.net>
Subject: Re: QB Floor Pans
Rob, Are the floor forward floor boards riveted in place. The early quickbuild fuselage did not have the forward floor pan installed at all. They were shipped separately as a part. The gear legs were bolted in place but they needed to be removed then the floor pan installed, match drilled, etc. I have heard that the newer QBs have the pans fully installed. It would be quite a chore to drill out all those pop rivets to check the quality of the build. That being said, there have been many reports of stuff being left inside the temporarily installed seat and floor panels. I found a cleco and some loose rivets. Larry Rosen #356 Rob Wright wrote: > > Tim Olson and others, > > I remember way back when you recommended removing your floor pans form > the QB, not just for stray clecos but also to personally check quality > of the Philippines. Ive got all the rear ones out but cant figure an > easy way to remove the most forward ones since the gear leg brackets > are bolting them in. Tips? > > Rob Wright > > #392 > > Wanting to prime and soundproof. > > * > > > * ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: QB Wings and Standard Fuselage
From: "johngoodman" <johngoodman(at)earthlink.net>
Date: Oct 05, 2006
Michael, I ordered my QB wings last week; they said they are in stock and that the fuselage does not have to be ordered with the wings. I'm still on the HS, so if you are on the tail cone, get going :) -------- #40572 Empennage HS N711JG reserved Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=66075#66075 ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Oct 05, 2006
From: Les Kearney <kearney(at)shaw.ca>
Subject: QB Floor Pans
Hi I know this may come across as asking if some wants to sell their first born, but I am in the market for tools. Basically, I need just about everything but am primarily interested in air tools including a pneumatic squeeze and a DTRT-2 dimplier. Anybody too busy flying to need tools? Cheers Les -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Rob Wright Sent: Thursday, October 05, 2006 4:46 PM Subject: RV10-List: QB Floor Pans Tim Olson and others, I remember way back when you recommended removing your floor pans form the QB, not just for stray clecos but also to personally check quality of the Philippines. I've got all the rear ones out but can't figure an easy way to remove the most forward ones since the gear leg brackets are bolting them in. Tips? Rob Wright #392 Wanting to prime and soundproof.. ________________________________________________________________________________
From: <gommone7(at)bellsouth.net>
Subject: : Hugo Rv10#40456
Date: Oct 05, 2006
Hi,reading about the floor panels,10 minutes ago just finished the final riveting,I also have a QB ,I remove the gear bracket,in order to remove the pans,are only few rivets,I epoxy primer everithing and install sound proffing underneat the pans,not in the bottom,now this is what I found, even if was riveted and primer the line of rivets along the tunnel at the fire wall and aft,where not match #30,I found this after many rivets set at the floor,some body in the phillipines wake up for my thinking, any way before install the copilot side I correct this ,and come smooth,refer to Van's (scott risan) will refer to the Phillys crew ,may be I help some one in the QB # 650 or so. By the way if somebody remove the landing gear bracket I suggest order a new set of bolts,they are install with stress,I will not reinstall the same ones,probably 15 0 20 doll worth in bolts. Hugo ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Chris" <toaster73(at)earthlink.net>
Subject: Re: Flap Trailing Edge
Date: Oct 05, 2006
I asked Ken K. about this and he said there was two different philosophies at work. ONe designer preffered the wedge poking out a little the other wanted the skin to overlay exactly on the TE of the wedge. -Chris Lucas #40072 ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jeff Carpenter" <jeff(at)westcottpress.com> Sent: Wednesday, October 04, 2006 1:05 PM Subject: RV10-List: Flap Trailing Edge > > Hello Fellow Builders... > > I've got my flaps all clecoed up and drilled out and notice that my flap > skins... both skins on both flaps come up 1/16" short of the trailing > edge wedge. This was not the case with my rudder trailing edge, where > the skins actually extended a fraction beyond the end of the wedge. Have > others experienced this? > > I'm thinking that my trailing edge wedges might have been mis- punched... > probably a lot more likely than all 4 skins being off. > > Jeff Carpenter > 40304 > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Rob Wright" <armywrights(at)adelphia.net>
Subject: Re: Fuel tanks
Date: Oct 05, 2006
I agree with Russ, but then I riveted and bucked every one of them myself on my bottom skins, no pop rivets. The reason I agree with Russ is #1 the experience I now have :], and #2 the amount of bondo I'll have to use during paint prep to cover the dings and dents that I put in the skins. Rob Wright #392 _____ From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Russell Daves Sent: Thursday, October 05, 2006 4:45 PM Subject: Re: RV10-List: Re: Fuel tanks I disagree. A person to either help you buck or rivet will make the bottom skins a lot easier. If you have the wing on an upright rack even a third person to stand behind the wing to steady it while the bottom skin is being riveted is also helpful. There will be a bunch of rivets that you will probably want to set with pop rivets as well simply because even with another person bucking they won't be able to reach far enough through the access panel holes to buck every rivet. Russ Daves N710RV Flying See you at LOE 10/13/06 ----- Original Message ----- From: W. Curtis <mailto:wcurtis(at)core.com> Sent: Thursday, October 05, 2006 4:09 PM Subject: RV10-List: Re: Fuel tanks Follow the plans Fred. The bottom skins go on LAST. Yes, you will get lots of scrapes and scars on your arms--of all the riveting I've done on the RV-10, this was by far the hardest. Also, an extra person does not help with these, they just get in the way. You can remove the torque tube temporarily AFTER you have constructed it and made adjustments to rivet the bottom skins. > >I'm not thinking of putting a fuel injected engine on my RV, but >installing a return fitting seems like a good idea. What >fitting would >be the best? What is typically used? > >Also, the book places the chapter on the bottom skin after the >completion of the fuel tanks and before installation of the aileron/flap >acutation systems. Are most builders putting off attaching the bottom >skin until after the flaps/ailerons/acuation system is complete? > >Thanks. > >Fred > William Curtis http://wcurtis.nerv10.com/ href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List">http://www.matronics.com /Navigator?RV10-List href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com href="http://wiki.matronics.com">http://wiki.matronics.com href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Rob Wright" <armywrights(at)adelphia.net>
Subject: QB Floor Pans
Date: Oct 05, 2006
Like Hugo said, there are only a few rivets tacking the pans into place. I guess I'll try Van's tomorrow and verify the bolts installed with stress before I plunge. Thanks all for the info. Rob Wright #392 Fuse -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Larry Rosen Sent: Thursday, October 05, 2006 6:25 PM Subject: Re: RV10-List: QB Floor Pans Rob, Are the floor forward floor boards riveted in place. The early quickbuild fuselage did not have the forward floor pan installed at all. They were shipped separately as a part. The gear legs were bolted in place but they needed to be removed then the floor pan installed, match drilled, etc. I have heard that the newer QBs have the pans fully installed. It would be quite a chore to drill out all those pop rivets to check the quality of the build. That being said, there have been many reports of stuff being left inside the temporarily installed seat and floor panels. I found a cleco and some loose rivets. Larry Rosen #356 Rob Wright wrote: > > Tim Olson and others, > > I remember way back when you recommended removing your floor pans form > the QB, not just for stray clecos but also to personally check quality > of the Philippines. I've got all the rear ones out but can't figure an > easy way to remove the most forward ones since the gear leg brackets > are bolting them in. Tips? > > Rob Wright > > #392 > > Wanting to prime and soundproof.. > > * > > > * ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "John Hasbrouck" <jhasbrouck(at)woh.rr.com>
Subject: Shoulder harness redo
Date: Oct 05, 2006
Thanks for the replies. Using the longeron attach for the rear harness is the only game in town for the other RVs but with the -10 the cabin top looks like the best bet to me. I've seen the inertial belts web site and the product looks good. Less stuff cluttering up the tailcone and baggage area ( no cables ) with the hard points mounted in the cabin top. For those who are going this route, ( inertial belts ) do you think the attach point is solid enough to function properly when needed? Gotta be right the first time, no do overs. Satisified with the engineering of this product? Just asking 'cause I'm about to this point and would like to use the inertial belts. John #40264 Sitting in the back seats making engine noises ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "bob.kaufmann" <bob.kaufmann(at)cox.net>
Subject: Re: Fuel tanks
Date: Oct 05, 2006
I followed the directions in the plans with the bottom rivets, my wife on the rivet gun and me bucking and we were able to do all the rivets without using pop rivets. I think it only cost a pint of blood on the left arm and 2/3 of a pint on the right. Got better with time. It was a pain in the backsides and the torque tubes absolutely have to be out of the wing, and your arm has to be a long one. The finished product looks better than the rudder. Bob K Except for the blood stains. :<)) Waiting to see the TEXAS TECH Special. _____ From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Rob Wright Sent: Thursday, October 05, 2006 7:13 PM Subject: RE: RV10-List: Re: Fuel tanks I agree with Russ, but then I riveted and bucked every one of them myself on my bottom skins, no pop rivets. The reason I agree with Russ is #1 the experience I now have :], and #2 the amount of bondo I'll have to use during paint prep to cover the dings and dents that I put in the skins. Rob Wright #392 _____ From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Russell Daves Sent: Thursday, October 05, 2006 4:45 PM Subject: Re: RV10-List: Re: Fuel tanks I disagree. A person to either help you buck or rivet will make the bottom skins a lot easier. If you have the wing on an upright rack even a third person to stand behind the wing to steady it while the bottom skin is being riveted is also helpful. There will be a bunch of rivets that you will probably want to set with pop rivets as well simply because even with another person bucking they won't be able to reach far enough through the access panel holes to buck every rivet. Russ Daves N710RV Flying See you at LOE 10/13/06 ----- Original Message ----- From: W. Curtis <mailto:wcurtis(at)core.com> Sent: Thursday, October 05, 2006 4:09 PM Subject: RV10-List: Re: Fuel tanks Follow the plans Fred. The bottom skins go on LAST. Yes, you will get lots of scrapes and scars on your arms--of all the riveting I've done on the RV-10, this was by far the hardest. Also, an extra person does not help with these, they just get in the way. You can remove the torque tube temporarily AFTER you have constructed it and made adjustments to rivet the bottom skins. > >I'm not thinking of putting a fuel injected engine on my RV, but >installing a return fitting seems like a good idea. What >fitting would >be the best? What is typically used? > >Also, the book places the chapter on the bottom skin after the >completion of the fuel tanks and before installation of the aileron/flap >acutation systems. Are most builders putting off attaching the bottom >skin until after the flaps/ailerons/acuation system is complete? > >Thanks. > >Fred > William Curtis http://wcurtis.nerv10.com/ href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List">http://www.matronics.com /Navigator?RV10-List href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com href="http://wiki.matronics.com">http://wiki.matronics.com href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c http://www.matronics.com/contribution ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "David McNeill" <dlm46007(at)cox.net>
Subject: Fw: Emailing: PA050075.JPG backup instrumentation
Date: Oct 06, 2006
Just installed a GRT Sport in the Glastar. picture included. The 10 is a dual battery, dual buss, single alternator. Instrumentation is dual Cheltons (gadahrs), Digiflite autopilot (internal gyros) and TT 2,25" ADI (if they build it). Three ways to fly the aircraft in IMC. ----- Original Message ----- From: David McNeill Sent: Friday, October 06, 2006 8:53 AM Subject: Emailing: PA050075.JPG The message is ready to be sent with the following file or link attachments: PA050075.JPG ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Not the best publicity...
From: "orchidman" <gary(at)wingscc.com>
Date: Oct 06, 2006
True, however he is probably the best supporter we have in Congress and attends Oshkosh evey year. I think this was the RV he flew to Oshkosh this year. Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=66212#66212 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: GRANSCOTT(at)aol.com
Date: Oct 06, 2006
Subject: Re: Avidyne vs. Garmin
Tim having a few more hours than Mr Greenspun in the G 1000 system, one of his comments he lists as a negative on the G 1000 system concerns winds/direction while on an ILS...saying that this information is only on the MFD...while that's true one can do a thrumbnail insert in the PDF which apparently with his only 3.4 hours of time he did not read this or set this feature up. The MFD thumbnail sits to the left of the EHSI and while probably not as convenient as having an overlay "white" line it does give you information in front of you. The G 1000 system I fly has a King Auto pilot which I'm sure is not as convenient as an integrated auto pilot such as the STec 55 system...FYI. Patrick ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Not the best publicity...
Date: Oct 06, 2006
From: "Lloyd, Daniel R." <LloydDR(at)wernerco.com>
Right, and he had it professionally built for him... -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of orchidman Sent: Friday, October 06, 2006 1:39 PM Subject: RV10-List: Re: Not the best publicity... True, however he is probably the best supporter we have in Congress and attends Oshkosh evey year. I think this was the RV he flew to Oshkosh this year. Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=66212#66212 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "John Gonzalez" <indigoonlatigo(at)msn.com>
Subject: Re: rear seat shoulder harness attach,
Date: Oct 06, 2006
I've placed the anchors on the longerons simply because that is what they told us to do. Also, I think this is a better location because in a forward inpact crash, the body will be thrown forward and the belts will be the in the truest opposite direction coming from the longerons. Thanks for the comments on the web site. I am no where near working on the cabin top so unless someone knows it chemical makeup, I will ask Van's later. John G. 409 >From: "John Hasbrouck" <jhasbrouck(at)woh.rr.com> >Reply-To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com >To: >Subject: Re: RV10-List: rear seat shoulder harness attach, >Date: Thu, 5 Oct 2006 18:53:19 -0400 > > >John, > Thanks for your reply regarding composites. Truly beautiful work >displayed on your website. Now to the original question. Are you going to >use the longeron attach or the cabin cover for rear seat shoulder harness? > >John Hasbrouck DDS >#40264 > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "John Gonzalez" <indigoonlatigo(at)msn.com>
Subject: Running the elevator trim servo
Date: Oct 06, 2006
The plans call for running the elevator trim servo through it full range of motion so that the cables can be adjusted correctly. How does one run the servo? Thanks ahead of time. John G. 409 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "John Dunne" <acs(at)acspropeller.com.au>
Date: Oct 07, 2006
Subject: Re: Running the elevator trim servo
John I just touched the wires to the battery pack terminals on my cordless and swap the wires around to run the other way. Watch for the clearance as the attaching bolt on the arm passes through the trim bracket. I decided to enlarge the slot on mine as it was way too close. John 40315 ----- Original Message ----- From: "John Gonzalez" <indigoonlatigo(at)msn.com> Sent: Saturday, October 07, 2006 3:43 PM Subject: [Norton AntiSpam] RV10-List: Running the elevator trim servo > > The plans call for running the elevator trim servo through it full range > of motion so that the cables can be adjusted correctly. > > How does one run the servo? > > Thanks ahead of time. > > John G. 409 > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Oct 07, 2006
From: Tim Olson <Tim(at)MyRV10.com>
Subject: Re: Not the best publicity...
I'm REALLY hoping not to launch another "built it myself" vs. "paid to have it built" discussion, but I did just want to get say one small thing.... This is one of my concerns regarding the purchase of "professionally built" kitplanes. One has to wonder if people like Sen. Inhofe who buys a kitplane can ever possibly maintain it to the degree that the actual builder would. Is it possible that there was some issue developing with his tailwheel that he might have noticed if he was the actual builder? I mean, I built my RV-10, and that doesn't make me an expert at all....but I do know every nut, bolt, wire, and part that went into that airframe. I've already run into that nosewheel spacer problem, but there's something to be said with having such an intimate knowledge of an airplane. I'm sure it's not that big of a deal, considering that still the majority of people buy planes from factories, but I would think that a builder has GOT to have more depth of understanding than just about anyone including an A&P about his or her personal airplane. And a diligent builder should have a pretty safe plane after he works out all the initial squaks. The other piece of the puzzle is participation in the community like most everyone that reads this.....I just HAVE to believe that in the end, this is a huge benefit to everyone's safety. There's so much info here that would help a builder find and fix problems before they occur. So personally I can't see it getting much safer than this scenario: A) Using a fantastic quality kit (like we are) B) Building it to high standards C) Built by the flying owner D) Who participates regularly in a forum related to their aircraft E) Who doesn't skimp on the ongoing maintenance cost F) and uses good judgement in their flying I would think this COULD be related to why we just saw that article showing 21% reduction in homebuilt fatal accidents. http://www.eaa.org/communications/eaanews/061002_accident.html We have lots of great participation in all RV groups. Just wanted to make note of that. Tim Olson - RV-10 N104CD - Flying Lloyd, Daniel R. wrote: > > Right, and he had it professionally built for him... > > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com > [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of orchidman > Sent: Friday, October 06, 2006 1:39 PM > To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com > Subject: RV10-List: Re: Not the best publicity... > > > True, however he is probably the best supporter we have in Congress and > attends Oshkosh evey year. I think this was the RV he flew to Oshkosh > this year. > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=66212#66212 > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "David McNeill" <dlm46007(at)cox.net>
Subject: backup instrumentation
Date: Oct 07, 2006
Took my second flight in the Glastar with the GRT Sport today. Found myself glancing at the "backup" airspeed indicator on final. Also somewhat distracted by all the new info that was available. Another few hours and I will be familiar with it. Perhaps the transition to the Cheltons in the 10 will be easier. ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Nick Nafsinger" <nick(at)creteaviation.com>
Subject: backup instrumentation
Date: Oct 07, 2006
When I first started flying the company's Baron (dual Cert Cheltons) I was constantly flying by the backup ASI and ALT. I found the Chelton had just 'too much information' on it for me to handle (coupled with learning the whole two motor thing). Somewhere in the next 15 hours it all changed, I can't tell you exactly when but I attribute it to getting comfortable with the airplane and learning what button does what on the Chelton. Everything cleared right up and now I wouldn't have it any other way, EFIS even going through teething is IMO the only way to go. Give yourself some backups to keep you honest and life will be grand. Even thought we have a long ways to go, the build partner and I have (for now) decided on Dual OP's for the Primary Flight and MFD displays. Backups are still on the negotiation table. Whether it is Dynon, GRT, OP, or Chelton (buy what fits YOUR needs and budget) I just can't see anyone regretting going the EFIS route. Nick Nafsinger 40569 emp, awaiting QB _____ From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of David McNeill Sent: Saturday, October 07, 2006 12:53 PM Subject: RV10-List: backup instrumentation Took my second flight in the Glastar with the GRT Sport today. Found myself glancing at the "backup" airspeed indicator on final. Also somewhat distracted by all the new info that was available. Another few hours and I will be familiar with it. Perhaps the transition to the Cheltons in the 10 will be easier. ________________________________________________________________________________
From: ajhauter(at)yahoo.com
Subject: Re: Avidyne vs. Garmin
Date: Oct 07, 2006
Great article Tim, Can you expand with your experience on the paragraph about Chelton's "The Avidyne and the Garmin show you an artificial horizon and some data that will let you use your 50 hours of instrument training to figure out how to follow an FAA instrument approach procedure. As long as there are big computer screens in front of the pilot, why not just show the terrain and a "highway in the sky" series of successive boxes through which you ought to fly to get to the runway? Microsoft Flight Simulator can do this for less than $50, so why not have it in your $250,000 airplane? NASA had the same idea and their contractor, Chelton Flight Systems, makes a primary flight display that does these things and is certified for certified airplanes. People retrofit the Chelton to Beechcraft Barons and similar high-end aircraft and it comes from the factory on a lot of turbine-powered helicopters. An inexpensive similar system for experimental airplanes is available from www.bluemountainavionics.com. The Garmin G1000 might some day be upgraded to work like the Chelton, but don't hold your breath. People who have flown the Chelton say that is probably the best system out there, but unfortunately it is substantially more expensive than the Garmin and Avidyne products, supposedly mostly due to the fact that a more expensive technology is used to determine aircraft attitude." aj ________________________________________________________________________________
From: RVFOURME(at)aol.com
Date: Oct 07, 2006
Subject: Re: Change In StatusChange In Status
Anyone interested in a fair deal in Life Insurance (term), which includes the knowledge of 'flying' and Experimental RV-4, research Travers Insurance Group. Francis Medler can help you out and my premium quote was actually reduced after Colony Life was informed that I also flew around in a lowly Cessna 150 as well. _http://www.traversaviation.com/_ (http://www.traversaviation.com/) Craig P. RV-4 (dreaming of an RV-10) ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Oct 08, 2006
From: Link McGarity <wv4i(at)bellsouth.net>
Subject: Re: Compressor Info
I must have final drilled several hundred holes on the HS assy skin yesterday, and my compressor ran constantly, using a Husky air drill. It's a Harbor Freight special, 21 gal, rated 5cfm @ 90psi supposedly. It also takes a dedicated 120vac 15A line to run (share garage door opener 120vac svc), and/but I wanted to avoid 240vac requirement. It's loud, and I wear ear protection (eye too of course). This is my second HF compressor as the first one literally blew a head gasket. They use cheap head bolts that apparently stretch (could see the lock washer split on 1st one). No recommendations here, just food for thought. You will use your compressor a LOT during the build process. If I had extra 240vac svc avail without calling an electrician, or dryer outlet was a little closer, ideally I would have a well built 240vac compressor capable of 9cfm@90psi (see tool air requirements) and not (have) wasted time and hearing on a lower end compressor. May still upgrade. Link McGarity #40622 HS assy ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Oct 08, 2006
From: Link McGarity <wv4i(at)bellsouth.net>
Subject: Re: backup instrumentation/lost in EFIS
I have thousands of hours of EFIS time, and hundreds of hours of HUD (heads up display) time, so feel qualified to comment on this subject. EFIS-B737/757/767/777, if it matters. HUD-AH-64A and B737-800, ditto. Since 1987, ditto. Commonalities, trends, frequent observations...It is easy to get "lost" in the display and it's symbology, whether HUD or EFIS. Solution, among others, learn what each symbol, tape, vector, everything means, how/why it might change mode or appearance, etc., before you really need it in day VFR, not to mention night VFR, or especially true IMC IFR flight. This education process starts with the manual, calls to manufacturer or other users, perhaps formalized unit specific training, etc. Do NOT try to just "muscle" your way into using an EFIS, or any electronic display for that matter, without a thorough understanding of what it's trying to/should be/is telling you. If it takes a trip to Flight Safety, etc., to get some EFIS time in a simulator, so be it. Money well spent. Remember, we do not have a BRS (parachute) like the Cirrus, if the display or our brain blanks. When transitioning to a new EFIS/HUD, I have found it helpful to initially focus attention on the display center, i.e. pitch/roll attitude, and the basic flight info i.e. airspeed/altitude. Then, as comfort level and proficiency level increase, if they do, work outward to include other less critical flight/other info. I have seen it demonstrated, repeatedly, that some pilots, regardless of age/experience, young and old, just never become comfortable, proficient, with electronic flight information displays, and just should stick with round gauges. It even follows that some pilots should stick with day VFR, out the window flying, in slower, more forgiving airplane designs, than RV's. JFK Jr. a C172 in day VFR?? Others? I hope the analogy is clear. Find your own niche. Training with EFIS and HUD displays, at least in military and airline settings, nowadays, ALWAYS begins in the simulator, where the force of the hydraulic motion servos is nothing compared to what the ground feels like when you hit it hard. Hope this is food for everyone's thought. Back to obscurity, and being just another poster/reader of this valuable list/forum. Thanks to the moderator. And, sorry, but the comment re airplane with an EFIS, but primarily flying by round airspeed/altitude gauges, really got my attention. Humble apologies. Link McGarity #40622 (just a number, hi) ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "ddddsp1(at)juno.com" <ddddsp1(at)juno.com>
Date: Oct 08, 2006
Subject: Re: backup instrumentation/lost in EFIS
I agree with the previous comments..............at Oshkosh I was able to see and Play with several of the EFIS brands. One thing that was very helpful was the DECLUTTER feature some of the brands have on them. It i s very similar to that found of several GPS units................you can remove overlays of information from the screen to just show the BASICS if you want. For example, if the EFIS is showing 10 instruments on the screen..........declutter/remove all of them except ASI/ALT/COMPASS/ATTI TUDE. Now you have only 4 things to observe and process in your brain. As one gets used to seeing these you can slowly add in a few more at a time. I know when I look at some of the screens people are flying beh ind I ask myself,"What are all those numbers/arrows trying to tell me. Keep it simple to begin with........especially in VFR we really don't n eed to overwork the panel guages. Enjoy the view and FLY THE PLANE. just my .02 worth. Dean 40449 completing baffle Seals ________________________________________________________________________
I agree with the previous comments..............at Oshkosh I was able to see and Play with several of the EFIS brands. One t hing that was very helpful was the DECLUTTER feature some of the brands have on them. It is very similar to that found of several GPS unit s................you can remove overlays of information from the screen to just show the BASICS if you want. For example, if the EFIS is s howing 10 instruments on the screen..........declutter/remove all of the m except ASI/ALT/COMPASS/ATTITUDE. Now you have only 4 things to o bserve and process in your brain. As one gets used to seeing these you can slowly add in a few more at a time. I know wh en I look at some of the screens people are flying behind I ask myself," What are all those numbers/arrows trying to tell me. Keep it simple to begin with........especially in VFR we really don't need to o verwork the panel guages. Enjoy the view and FLY THE PLANE.

just my .02 worth.

Dean

40449

completing baffle Seals

______________________ __________________________________________________
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________________________________________________________________________________
From: Dsyvert(at)aol.com
Date: Oct 08, 2006
Subject: Clecoing nose of VS
Group, Does anyone have any tricks on clecoing the nose of the VS? It seems a little tight to me. I've been able to do one entire side, plus the rear ribs and both spars of the other side but the nose ribs of the one side are tight. My thoughts are to take every thing apart and just do the other sides ribs. However, that is just putting off the tightness to dimpling. I am thinking about putting a 2x4 across the nose and the back side and then using a "come-along" to take up the slack. I'm afraid this will just dent the sheet. Any ideas or tricks? Dave Syvertson ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Oct 08, 2006
From: Deems Davis <deemsdavis(at)cox.net>
Subject: Re: Fuel tanks
Yup, that's my plan. Deems Davis # 406 Panel/Finishing http://deemsrv10.com/ David Maib wrote: > >Deems, >Did you buy the extended range bungs to install for a return line? I have been thinking I might use one of those for a return line. > >David Maib >40559 >tailcone > >On Thursday, October 05, 2006, at 07:29AM, Deems Davis wrote: > > > >> >>I haven't installed them yet, (wings are stored @ airport)but here's >>what I got to plumb a return line into one of my tanks. >> >>http://www.safeair1.com/index.htm >> >>Deems Davis # 406 >>Panel/Finishing >>http://deemsrv10.com/ >> >>Fred Williams, M.D. wrote: >> >> >> >>><drfred@cox-internet.com> >>> >>>I'm not thinking of putting a fuel injected engine on my RV, but >>>installing a return fitting seems like a good idea. What fitting >>>would be the best? What is typically used? >>>Also, the book places the chapter on the bottom skin after the >>>completion of the fuel tanks and before installation of the >>>aileron/flap acutation systems. Are most builders putting off >>>attaching the bottom skin until after the flaps/ailerons/acuation >>>system is complete? >>>Thanks. >>> >>>Fred >>> >>>Proseal is fun........it's the MEK to clean it up that's the problem. >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> > > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Rene" <rene(at)felker.com>
Subject: Clecoing nose of VS
Date: Oct 08, 2006
Here is a tip from Tim's site. http://www.myrv10.com/tips/vstabtips.html I did not have this info when I started and I have a dented VS to prove it. Rene' 801-721-6080 -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Dsyvert(at)aol.com Sent: Sunday, October 08, 2006 4:26 PM Subject: RV10-List: Clecoing nose of VS Group, Does anyone have any tricks on clecoing the nose of the VS? It seems a little tight to me. I've been able to do one entire side, plus the rear ribs and both spars of the other side but the nose ribs of the one side are tight. My thoughts are to take every thing apart and just do the other sides ribs. However, that is just putting off the tightness to dimpling. I am thinking about putting a 2x4 across the nose and the back side and then using a "come-along" to take up the slack. I'm afraid this will just dent the sheet. Any ideas or tricks? Dave Syvertson ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: For Sale: RV-10 QB Wings and Fuselage
Date: Oct 08, 2006
From: N4547K <n4547k(at)gmail.com>
With sadness I place my Van's RV-10 Quickbuild Wings and Fuselage kit up for sale. QB wings arrived in 10/2004 and the QB fuse in 02/2005. Both were inventoried and stored in our hangar and have remained otherwise untouched. A new baby has stalled the building process and we need to sell. Items are in the original crating but packing material was disposed of. Located in Wichita Falls, TX. Save a little money and up to 4 months of waiting compared to ordering from Van's! $30,000, buyer pays shipping. Kevin Echols N4547K at gmail.com ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Dsyvert(at)aol.com
Date: Oct 08, 2006
Subject: Re: Clecoing nose of VS
Thanks ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "KiloPapa" <kilopapa(at)antelecom.net>
Subject: Re: Clecoing nose of VS
Date: Oct 08, 2006
I think you will find that you need to do a little bending of the forward flange edge on the leading edge ribs at the forward point otherwise you will dent the skin trying to force it around the points. See Tim Olson's tips at http://www.myrv10.com/tips/gotchas.html for a better explanation. Kevin 40494 tail/empennage ----- Original Message ----- From: Dsyvert(at)aol.com To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com Sent: Sunday, October 08, 2006 3:26 PM Subject: RV10-List: Clecoing nose of VS Group, Does anyone have any tricks on clecoing the nose of the VS? It seems a little tight to me. I've been able to do one entire side, plus the rear ribs and both spars of the other side but the nose ribs of the one side are tight. My thoughts are to take every thing apart and just do the other sides ribs. However, that is just putting off the tightness to dimpling. I am thinking about putting a 2x4 across the nose and the back side and then using a "come-along" to take up the slack. I'm afraid this will just dent the sheet. Any ideas or tricks? Dave Syvertson ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Samuel M. Williams" <swilliams5688(at)wideopenwest.com>
Subject: RE: Clecoing nose of VS
Date: Oct 09, 2006
>> Does anyone have any tricks on clecoing the nose of the VS? It seems a >> little tight to me. I've been able to do one entire side, plus the rear ribs >> and both spars of the other side but the nose ribs of the one side are tight. Grind those nose ribs back to the minimum edge distance, and then round the corners. Here's my write-up and photos after the modification was complete... http://www.mykitlog.com/users/display_log.php?user=Roadster&project=210&cate gory=1857&log 339&row=29 Sam Williams #40619 Rudder Assembly ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Samuel M. Williams" <swilliams5688(at)wideopenwest.com>
Subject: Re: Clecoing nose of VS
Date: Oct 09, 2006
Sorry about the garbled link. Here's an alternative route to the information... Click the "Empennage" link on my KitLogPro website.... http://www.mykitlog.com/Roadster And then go to the entry on 09-19-2006 entitled "Modify Ribs to Minimize Skin Buckling" for my write-up and photos. Sam Williams #40619 Rudder Assembly ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Glueing the foam ribs into the trims tabs of the elevator
From: "Michael Wellenzohn" <michael(at)wellenzohn.net>
Date: Oct 09, 2006
Hello, so far I used tank sealant to glue the foam ribs into the elevator. Since I always need to order the small portion from Van's (no known vendor available in Switzerland) I wonder I anyone used a product which is also available in Europe. Would Scotch-Weld work to and if yes which product number of Scotch-Weld? Thansk for your help. Michael empennage / elevator trims http://www.wellenzohn.net -------- RV-10 builder #511 Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=66682#66682 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Brian Douglas" <bsponcil(at)belinblank.org>
Subject: Re: Clecoing nose of VS
Date: Oct 09, 2006
Tight nose ribs seems to be a common affliction in the Vans kits. My VS (along with many others) has a skin dent from my not knowing. I have since been a little more aggressive with the deburring wheel when it comes to the nose ribs and it's worked out better. -Brian #40497 N211BD Iowa City, IA ----- Original Message ----- From: Dsyvert(at)aol.com To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com Sent: Sunday, October 08, 2006 5:26 PM Subject: RV10-List: Clecoing nose of VS Group, Does anyone have any tricks on clecoing the nose of the VS? It seems a little tight to me. I've been able to do one entire side, plus the rear ribs and both spars of the other side but the nose ribs of the one side are tight. My thoughts are to take every thing apart and just do the other sides ribs. However, that is just putting off the tightness to dimpling. I am thinking about putting a 2x4 across the nose and the back side and then using a "come-along" to take up the slack. I'm afraid this will just dent the sheet. Any ideas or tricks? Dave Syvertson ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Oct 09, 2006
From: Larry Rosen <LarryRosen(at)comcast.net>
Subject: Re: Glueing the foam ribs into the trims tabs of the elevator
I used RTV silicone to glue the foam ribs in place. Larry Rosen #356 Michael Wellenzohn wrote: > > Hello, > > so far I used tank sealant to glue the foam ribs into the elevator. Since I always need to order the small portion from Van's (no known vendor available in Switzerland) I wonder I anyone used a product which is also available in Europe. Would Scotch-Weld work to and if yes which product number of Scotch-Weld? > > Thansk for your help. > > Michael > empennage / elevator trims > > http://www.wellenzohn.net > > -------- > RV-10 builder > #511 > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=66682#66682 > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "jdalton77" <jdalton77(at)comcast.net>
Subject: Re: Glueing the foam ribs into the trims tabs of the elevator
Date: Oct 09, 2006
I used a commercially available epoxy from the airplane department at Home Depot. It was formulated for metal and plastic bonding. Worked great and bonded in 5 minutes. Jeff ----- Original Message ----- From: "Michael Wellenzohn" <michael(at)wellenzohn.net> Sent: Monday, October 09, 2006 4:54 AM Subject: RV10-List: Glueing the foam ribs into the trims tabs of the elevator > > > Hello, > > so far I used tank sealant to glue the foam ribs into the elevator. Since > I always need to order the small portion from Van's (no known vendor > available in Switzerland) I wonder I anyone used a product which is also > available in Europe. Would Scotch-Weld work to and if yes which product > number of Scotch-Weld? > > Thansk for your help. > > Michael > empennage / elevator trims > > http://www.wellenzohn.net > > -------- > RV-10 builder > #511 > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=66682#66682 > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Oct 09, 2006
From: Deems Davis <deemsdavis(at)cox.net>
Subject: Re: backup instrumentation
David Maib wrote: > > I am not familiar with OP. Where can I get some information? > > Regards, > David Maib > 40559 > tailcone Try : http://www.optechnologies.com/index2.html Deems ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Glueing the foam ribs into the trim tabs of the elevator
From: "zackrv8" <zackrv8(at)verizon.net>
Date: Oct 09, 2006
Michael, This is exactly what I used on my foam blocks. 2216 is the part number. Great stuff! Zack quote="Michael Wellenzohn"]Hello, so far I used tank sealant to glue the foam ribs into the elevator. Since I always need to order the small portion from Van's (no known vendor available in Switzerland) I wonder I anyone used a product which is also available in Europe. Would Scotch-Weld work to and if yes which product number of Scotch-Weld? Thansk for your help. Michael empennage / elevator trims http://www.wellenzohn.net[/quote] -------- RV8 #80125 RV10 # 40512 Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=66812#66812 Attachments: http://forums.matronics.com//files/t_dsc05931_117_346.jpg ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Clecoing nose of VS
From: "johngoodman" <johngoodman(at)earthlink.net>
Date: Oct 09, 2006
Amen! You guys have to promise me you'll never notice by VS "bumps". John [quote="bsponcil(at)belinblank.or"]Tight nose ribs seems to be a common affliction in the Vans kits. My VS (along with many others) has a skin dent from my not knowing. I have since been a little more aggressive with the deburring wheel when it comes to the nose ribs and it's worked out better. -Brian #40497 N211BD Iowa City, IA > --- -------- #40572 Empennage HS N711JG reserved Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=66819#66819 ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Another Fuse Gotcha - step 29
Date: Oct 09, 2006
From: "Chris Johnston" <CJohnston(at)popsound.com>
Whoops. Sorry, I sent this on august 27th and it just showed up for me. Lost electrons. cj -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Chris Johnston Sent: Sunday, August 27, 2006 2:20 PM Subject: RV10-List: Another Fuse Gotcha - step 29 hey all - i'm merrily riveting along towards the end of step 29, and as i'm riveting F-1040 (upper fuse channel), i notice that there are nutplate holes on the upper flange that have no nutplates. furthermore, after you rivet it to the bulkhead, you won't be able to get at one of the noles needed for one of the nutplates. I noticed many steps later that there's an access cover that screws into these nonexistant nutplates. i found a little reference to this in the archives and i'll be drilling out a couple rivets to install these nutplates now. NOTE - IT WOULD BE MUCH MORE DIFFICULT AFTER THE FORWARD FUSE SIDE SKIN IS RIVETED ON. this is yet another shortcoming in the (now becoming infamous around here) step 29. fyi cj #40410 fuse ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: pilot vs. final holes and cogsdill
From: "tomhanaway" <tomhanaway(at)adelphia.net>
Date: Oct 10, 2006
Empennage ordered but not here yet so don't have instructions. Are most drilled holes two-part. I.e., 1/8" pilot(0.125) then #30(0.1285)final and 3/32pilot(0.0938) then #40(0.0980)final. The reason I ask is deciding which burraway drill bits to get. Will the #30 and 40 size do? Or is most of the deburring done off the smaller pilot hole, if both pilot and final are necessary? I'd obviously prefer to buy only two bits if possible rather than four. Separately, I do follow the ebay sales but other than the .093, most of the sizes are larger than needed for the Van's kit. Empennage should arrive early next week. Thanks in advance, Tom Hanaway Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=66903#66903 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "John Jessen" <jjessen(at)rcn.com>
Subject: pilot vs. final holes and cogsdill
Date: Oct 10, 2006
#30 and #40 Cogsdill are all you need. Make sure you have the standard deburring tools from an Avery or Cleveland. Many places you'll want those over the Cogsdill. John Jessen #328 (riveting tailcone) -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of tomhanaway Sent: Tuesday, October 10, 2006 5:39 AM Subject: RV10-List: pilot vs. final holes and cogsdill Empennage ordered but not here yet so don't have instructions. Are most drilled holes two-part. I.e., 1/8" pilot(0.125) then #30(0.1285)final and 3/32pilot(0.0938) then #40(0.0980)final. The reason I ask is deciding which burraway drill bits to get. Will the #30 and 40 size do? Or is most of the deburring done off the smaller pilot hole, if both pilot and final are necessary? I'd obviously prefer to buy only two bits if possible rather than four. Separately, I do follow the ebay sales but other than the .093, most of the sizes are larger than needed for the Van's kit. Empennage should arrive early next week. Thanks in advance, Tom Hanaway Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=66903#66903 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Russell Daves" <dav1111(at)cox.net>
Subject: Re: pilot vs. final holes and cogsdill
Date: Oct 10, 2006
In addition to drill bits (buy at least 5 of each) you should also get #30 and #40 reamers. The reamers are my first choice in doing the initial/final drilling of pre-punched holes. I have never used the burraway drill bits but didn't find a real problem with deburring after using a reamer. In addition, instead of "match drilling" pre-punched holes I would advise first hitting all of the pre-punched holes with either the #30 or #40 reamer and debur before putting them together the first time. I found on the VS that it was real difficult to cleco the parts together but after using the reamers and deburring first all my parts cleco'd together much easier. By the time I reached the HS I had stopped match drilling anything that was pre-punched and didn't do it again all the way to the end of my build. Not only does it save loads of time but I found the holes lined up much better and I had fewer drilling errors than I was having with match drilling the pre-punched holes, many of which the tabs would push down with the drill bit and I couldn't tell that they had been mis-drilled until after I took them apart for deburr. I did find on occasion when I was riveting that I had to go back and run the reamer through the cleco'd holes sometimes to get the rivet to set like I wanted it to set. Using the reamer at the point in drilling I didn't feel any significant areas around the holes that caused me any deburring concerns since the holes had already been reamed, de-burred, countersunk and the slight trim caused by another run of the reamer didn't seem to be a problem. Good luck with your project, I had a wonderful time doing my 33 month build (even had three major surgeries during such 33 months and lost about 8 months of build time). Russ Daves N710RV - Flying RV-10 See everyone at LOE 2006 this weekend ----- Original Message ----- From: "tomhanaway" <tomhanaway(at)adelphia.net> Sent: Tuesday, October 10, 2006 7:38 AM Subject: RV10-List: pilot vs. final holes and cogsdill > > Empennage ordered but not here yet so don't have instructions. Are most > drilled holes two-part. I.e., 1/8" pilot(0.125) then #30(0.1285)final and > 3/32pilot(0.0938) then #40(0.0980)final. > > The reason I ask is deciding which burraway drill bits to get. Will the > #30 and 40 size do? Or is most of the deburring done off the smaller > pilot hole, if both pilot and final are necessary? > > I'd obviously prefer to buy only two bits if possible rather than four. > Separately, I do follow the ebay sales but other than the .093, most of > the sizes are larger than needed for the Van's kit. > > Empennage should arrive early next week. > Thanks in advance, > Tom Hanaway > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=66903#66903 > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Oct 10, 2006
From: Maule Driver <MauleDriver(at)nc.rr.com>
Subject: Electric Aileron Trim
I'm getting ready to order my Fuse and Wing kit. Are any of you installing Van's electric trim? What are your thoughts on it? Given Van's bias towards 'less', I'm guessing there is a good reason for making the trim option available. ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Oct 10, 2006
From: Rick <ricksked(at)earthlink.net>
Subject: Re: Electric Aileron Trim
I'm installing it. I think most builders are as well if for anything it helps with fuel imbalance trim. Plus it gives the left and right funtions of the hat switch something to work on ;) It's pretty simple and you can wait for awhile to install it. Mounts on the inner most access plate on the bottom of the wing. Ray Allen trim wire comes with the kit. It's the #24/5 wire that Spruce and Ray Allen both sell. Servo has an arm the connects to the aileron pushrod via two springs. Rick S. 40185 -----Original Message----- >From: Maule Driver <MauleDriver(at)nc.rr.com> >Sent: Oct 10, 2006 8:13 AM >To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com >Subject: RV10-List: Electric Aileron Trim > > >I'm getting ready to order my Fuse and Wing kit. Are any of you >installing Van's electric trim? What are your thoughts on it? > >Given Van's bias towards 'less', I'm guessing there is a good reason for >making the trim option available. > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "John Gonzalez" <indigoonlatigo(at)msn.com>
Subject: Re: pilot vs. final holes and cogsdill
Date: Oct 10, 2006
Russel, Having almost finished the entire tail assembly, as I am now doing fiberglass work, with the new experience I have gained, I have no idea of what you are advocating. I am not trying to be disrespectful, just would like to understand what it is you are saying. "In addition, instead of "match drilling" pre-punched holes I would advise first hitting all of the pre-punched holes with either the #30 or #40 reamer and debur before putting them together the first time. I found on the VS that it was real difficult to cleco the parts together but after using the reamers and deburring first all my parts cleco'd together much easier. By the time I reached the HS I had stopped match drilling anything that was pre-punched and didn't do it again all the way to the end of my build." "Not only does it save loads of time but I found the holes lined up much better and I had fewer drilling errors than I was having with match drilling the pre-punched holes, many of which the tabs would push down with the drill bit and I couldn't tell that they had been mis-drilled until after I took them apart for deburr. In addition, instead of "match drilling" pre-punched holes I would advise first hitting all of the pre-punched holes with either the #30 or #40 reamer and debur before putting them together the first time. I found on the VS that it was real difficult to cleco the parts together but after using the reamers and deburring first all my parts cleco'd together much easier. By the time I reached the HS I had stopped match drilling anything that was pre-punched and didn't do it again all the way to the end of my build." My thoughts.....The only place I had difficulty getting prepunched holes to line up was during the assembly of the rudder, as the control horn of the rudder had a slightly larger bend raduis than it should have. This pushed the rudder spar away from the skin holes. It all worked out, especially when you use an ice pick to line up holes before cecoing them. The ice pick is one of those "Must Have Tools" Use a lot of clecoes during the drilling, the more the merrier. JOhn G. 409 >From: "Russell Daves" <dav1111(at)cox.net> >Reply-To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com >To: >Subject: Re: RV10-List: pilot vs. final holes and cogsdill >Date: Tue, 10 Oct 2006 09:43:28 -0500 > > >In addition to drill bits (buy at least 5 of each) you should also get #30 >and #40 reamers. The reamers are my first choice in doing the >initial/final drilling of pre-punched holes. I have never used the >burraway drill bits but didn't find a real problem with deburring after >using a reamer. > >In addition, instead of "match drilling" pre-punched holes I would advise >first hitting all of the pre-punched holes with either the #30 or #40 >reamer and debur before putting them together the first time. I found on >the VS that it was real difficult to cleco the parts together but after >using the reamers and deburring first all my parts cleco'd together much >easier. By the time I reached the HS I had stopped match drilling >anything that was pre-punched and didn't do it again all the way to the end >of my build. > >Not only does it save loads of time but I found the holes lined up much >better and I had fewer drilling errors than I was having with match >drilling the pre-punched holes, many of which the tabs would push down with >the drill bit and I couldn't tell that they had been mis-drilled until >after I took them apart for deburr. > >I did find on occasion when I was riveting that I had to go back and run >the reamer through the cleco'd holes sometimes to get the rivet to set like >I wanted it to set. Using the reamer at the point in drilling I didn't >feel any significant areas around the holes that caused me any deburring >concerns since the holes had already been reamed, de-burred, countersunk >and the slight trim caused by another run of the reamer didn't seem to be a >problem. > >Good luck with your project, I had a wonderful time doing my 33 month build >(even had three major surgeries during such 33 months and lost about 8 >months of build time). > >Russ Daves >N710RV - Flying RV-10 >See everyone at LOE 2006 this weekend >----- Original Message ----- From: "tomhanaway" <tomhanaway(at)adelphia.net> >To: >Sent: Tuesday, October 10, 2006 7:38 AM >Subject: RV10-List: pilot vs. final holes and cogsdill > > >> >>Empennage ordered but not here yet so don't have instructions. Are most >>drilled holes two-part. I.e., 1/8" pilot(0.125) then #30(0.1285)final and >>3/32pilot(0.0938) then #40(0.0980)final. >> >>The reason I ask is deciding which burraway drill bits to get. Will the >>#30 and 40 size do? Or is most of the deburring done off the smaller >>pilot hole, if both pilot and final are necessary? >> >>I'd obviously prefer to buy only two bits if possible rather than four. >>Separately, I do follow the ebay sales but other than the .093, most of >>the sizes are larger than needed for the Van's kit. >> >>Empennage should arrive early next week. >>Thanks in advance, >>Tom Hanaway >> >> >> >> >>Read this topic online here: >> >>http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=66903#66903 >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Electric Aileron Trim
Date: Oct 10, 2006
From: "Vern W. Smith" <Vern(at)teclabsinc.com>
Hi Maule, I am installing the aileron trim and this came after conversations with both Trutrak and Van's. The reason for it is as fuel is burned off of one tank the wing gets lighter. If you are using an autopilot this will compensate for this condition until you turn the auto pilot off and then the heavier wing will tend to drop. How much of a problem this is I don't know. The Mooney I used to fly had an auto wing leveler that was basically always on. In addition to this we switched tank every 1/2 hour so the weight difference between the wings was only 30 lbs. max. It would be interesting to get feedback from those flying, as to what they have notice in trim from fuel burn. Vern (40324) -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Maule Driver Sent: Tuesday, October 10, 2006 8:14 AM Subject: RV10-List: Electric Aileron Trim I'm getting ready to order my Fuse and Wing kit. Are any of you installing Van's electric trim? What are your thoughts on it? Given Van's bias towards 'less', I'm guessing there is a good reason for making the trim option available. ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Bottom wing skins
Date: Oct 10, 2006
From: "Vern W. Smith" <Vern(at)teclabsinc.com>
Just read the discussion on the fuel tanks/bottom wing skins. The local EAA tech consoler suggested wearing a long sleeve shirt during the riveting of the bottom skins. I must say, this does help. Also, I supported the wings vertically with the trailing edge pointed down. This allowed me to reach down inside to buck the rivet as opposed to reaching up under the skins if the leading edge was down. The ergonomics seem a little better and I was able to reach all of the rivets by myself. Vern Smith (#324) ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: pilot vs. final holes and cogsdill
From: "tomhanaway" <tomhanaway(at)adelphia.net>
Date: Oct 10, 2006
Just to clarify. I do have a complete tool kit coming from Cleveland with some optionals coming from Avery, Brown and Planetool. As to the #30 and #40 debur, Cogsdill doesn't make them. They do have the 1/8 and 3/32" bits E-z burr has a #40 debur size. I guess my question should have been clearer. Do the 1/8 and 3/32 deburr sizes work effectively with the slightly larger #30 and #40 holes. Thanks, Tom Hanaway Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=66963#66963 ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Oct 10, 2006
From: Rick <ricksked(at)earthlink.net>
Subject: Re: pilot vs. final holes and cogsdill
John, In a nutshell this came up about a year ago. What some builders were doing including my friend & fellow builder here in Las Vegas was to predrill (ream), deburr and dimple then final assemble before ever clecoing together an assembly. In theory it sounds good and it seemed to work well for Russ & Bob. I found it much easier to understand the correct way things went together by clecoing, drilling then disassemble deburr...the conventional way most build. It has drawbacks.....the fuselage has several areas that need holes drilled in assembly and if you miss them after you have it partially riveted then you may find yourself drilling out some rivets or trying to complete what was a simple step now almost impossible to do because it is assembled. I always considered the cleco then drill the equivalent of "measuring twice and cutting once" I didn't really find it all that much faster and I know all my holes have been properly deburred and I didn't have any problems by having to go backwards and disassemble anything. Rick S. 40185 -----Original Message----- >From: John Gonzalez <indigoonlatigo(at)msn.com> >Sent: Oct 10, 2006 8:47 AM >To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com >Subject: Re: RV10-List: pilot vs. final holes and cogsdill > > >Russel, > >Having almost finished the entire tail assembly, as I am now doing >fiberglass work, with the new experience I have gained, I have no idea of >what you are advocating. I am not trying to be disrespectful, just would >like to understand what it is you are saying. > >"In addition, instead of "match drilling" pre-punched holes I would advise >first hitting all of the pre-punched holes with either the #30 or #40 reamer >and debur before putting them together the first time. I found on the VS >that it was real difficult to cleco the parts together but after using the >reamers and deburring first all my parts cleco'd together much easier. By >the time I reached the HS I had stopped match drilling anything that was >pre-punched and didn't do it again all the way to the end of my build." > >"Not only does it save loads of time but I found the holes lined up much >better and I had fewer drilling errors than I was having with match drilling >the pre-punched holes, many of which the tabs would push down with the drill >bit and I couldn't tell that they had been mis-drilled until after I took >them apart for deburr. In addition, instead of "match drilling" pre-punched >holes I would advise first hitting all of the pre-punched holes with either >the #30 or #40 reamer and debur before putting them together the first time. > I found on the VS that it was real difficult to cleco the parts together >but after using the reamers and deburring first all my parts cleco'd >together much easier. By the time I reached the HS I had stopped match >drilling anything that was pre-punched and didn't do it again all the way to >the end of my build." > >My thoughts.....The only place I had difficulty getting prepunched holes to >line up was during the assembly of the rudder, as the control horn of the >rudder had a slightly larger bend raduis than it should have. This pushed >the rudder spar away from the skin holes. It all worked out, especially when >you use an ice pick to line up holes before cecoing them. The ice pick is >one of those "Must Have Tools" Use a lot of clecoes during the drilling, the >more the merrier. > >JOhn G. 409 > > >>From: "Russell Daves" <dav1111(at)cox.net> >>Reply-To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com >>To: >>Subject: Re: RV10-List: pilot vs. final holes and cogsdill >>Date: Tue, 10 Oct 2006 09:43:28 -0500 >> >> >>In addition to drill bits (buy at least 5 of each) you should also get #30 >>and #40 reamers. The reamers are my first choice in doing the >>initial/final drilling of pre-punched holes. I have never used the >>burraway drill bits but didn't find a real problem with deburring after >>using a reamer. >> >>In addition, instead of "match drilling" pre-punched holes I would advise >>first hitting all of the pre-punched holes with either the #30 or #40 >>reamer and debur before putting them together the first time. I found on >>the VS that it was real difficult to cleco the parts together but after >>using the reamers and deburring first all my parts cleco'd together much >>easier. By the time I reached the HS I had stopped match drilling >>anything that was pre-punched and didn't do it again all the way to the end >>of my build. >> >>Not only does it save loads of time but I found the holes lined up much >>better and I had fewer drilling errors than I was having with match >>drilling the pre-punched holes, many of which the tabs would push down with >>the drill bit and I couldn't tell that they had been mis-drilled until >>after I took them apart for deburr. >> >>I did find on occasion when I was riveting that I had to go back and run >>the reamer through the cleco'd holes sometimes to get the rivet to set like >>I wanted it to set. Using the reamer at the point in drilling I didn't >>feel any significant areas around the holes that caused me any deburring >>concerns since the holes had already been reamed, de-burred, countersunk >>and the slight trim caused by another run of the reamer didn't seem to be a >>problem. >> >>Good luck with your project, I had a wonderful time doing my 33 month build >>(even had three major surgeries during such 33 months and lost about 8 >>months of build time). >> >>Russ Daves >>N710RV - Flying RV-10 >>See everyone at LOE 2006 this weekend >>----- Original Message ----- From: "tomhanaway" <tomhanaway(at)adelphia.net> >>To: >>Sent: Tuesday, October 10, 2006 7:38 AM >>Subject: RV10-List: pilot vs. final holes and cogsdill >> >> >>> >>>Empennage ordered but not here yet so don't have instructions. Are most >>>drilled holes two-part. I.e., 1/8" pilot(0.125) then #30(0.1285)final and >>>3/32pilot(0.0938) then #40(0.0980)final. >>> >>>The reason I ask is deciding which burraway drill bits to get. Will the >>>#30 and 40 size do? Or is most of the deburring done off the smaller >>>pilot hole, if both pilot and final are necessary? >>> >>>I'd obviously prefer to buy only two bits if possible rather than four. >>>Separately, I do follow the ebay sales but other than the .093, most of >>>the sizes are larger than needed for the Van's kit. >>> >>>Empennage should arrive early next week. >>>Thanks in advance, >>>Tom Hanaway >>> >>> >>> >>> >>>Read this topic online here: >>> >>>http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=66903#66903 >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >> >> >> >> >> >> > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: FW: [LML] Lancair driver make the AVWEB news
Date: Oct 10, 2006
From: "John W. Cox" <johnwcox(at)pacificnw.com>
As the weather makes its annual pilgrimage South this time of year. Visions of a trip to OSH '07 begin to dance in my head. This story reminds me of the unnecessary loss of life the last few years and how a few bad apples get most of the press. I am still patiently waiting for Scott to post the last thirty days of construction progress. John Cox N49CX RV-10 in process ________________________________ From: Lancair Mailing List [mailto:lml(at)lancaironline.net] On Behalf Of N320GG Sent: Tuesday, October 10, 2006 9:00 AM Subject: [LML] Lancair driver make the AVWEB news "A Lancair pilot flew the published warbird arrival rather than the general aviation arrival. He was followed to parking and interviewed. His arrogance astonished the volunteer who spoke with him; it seems that the pilot was of the opinion that because he flew a fast airplane he could use the warbird arrival and the EAA volunteer who had the temerity to express a dissenting opinion could go to where it is reputed to be extremely warm for eternity. " For all of the story: http://www.avweb.com/news/pilotlounge/193321-1.html For a link to the audio mentioned: http://www.oshawapilot.ca/?p=342 Gary Melton N320GG LNC2 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Rob Kermanj <flysrv10(at)gmail.com>
Subject: Re: Electric Aileron Trim
Date: Oct 10, 2006
I have the aileron trim and I find it necessary for fuel and passanger imbalance. I do not seem to need any adjustment if Trutrak is engaged. Rob Kermanj On Oct 10, 2006, at 12:05 PM, Vern W. Smith wrote: > > Hi Maule, > > I am installing the aileron trim and this came after conversations > with > both Trutrak and Van's. The reason for it is as fuel is burned off of > one tank the wing gets lighter. If you are using an autopilot this > will > compensate for this condition until you turn the auto pilot off and > then > the heavier wing will tend to drop. > > How much of a problem this is I don't know. The Mooney I used to > fly had > an auto wing leveler that was basically always on. In addition to this > we switched tank every 1/2 hour so the weight difference between the > wings was only 30 lbs. max. It would be interesting to get feedback > from > those flying, as to what they have notice in trim from fuel burn. > > Vern (40324) > > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com > [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Maule > Driver > Sent: Tuesday, October 10, 2006 8:14 AM > To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com > Subject: RV10-List: Electric Aileron Trim > > > I'm getting ready to order my Fuse and Wing kit. Are any of you > installing Van's electric trim? What are your thoughts on it? > > Given Van's bias towards 'less', I'm guessing there is a good > reason for > > making the trim option available. > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Oct 10, 2006
From: Deems Davis <deemsdavis(at)cox.net>
Subject: Re: FW: [LML] Lancair driver make the AVWEB news
On VAF Scott posted a msg indicating that he had completed his DAR inspection and was awaiting someone to do a pitot/static check before flying. Deems Davis # 406 Panel/Finishing http://deemsrv10.com/ John W. Cox wrote: > As the weather makes its annual pilgrimage South this time of year. > Visions of a trip to OSH 07 begin to dance in my head. This story > reminds me of the unnecessary loss of life the last few years and how > a few bad apples get most of the press. I am still patiently waiting > for Scott to post the last thirty days of construction progress. > > John Cox > > N49CX RV-10 in process > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > *From:* Lancair Mailing List [mailto:lml(at)lancaironline.net] *On Behalf > Of *N320GG > *Sent:* Tuesday, October 10, 2006 9:00 AM > *To:* Lancair Mailing List > *Subject:* [LML] Lancair driver make the AVWEB news > > "A Lancair pilot flew the published warbird arrival rather than the > general aviation arrival. He was followed to parking and interviewed. > His arrogance astonished the volunteer who spoke with him; it seems > that the pilot was of the opinion that because he flew a fast airplane > he could use the warbird arrival and the EAA volunteer who had the > temerity to express a dissenting opinion could go to where it is > reputed to be extremely warm for eternity. " > > For all of the story: > > http://www.avweb.com/news/pilotlounge/193321-1.html > > For a link to the audio mentioned: > > http://www.oshawapilot.ca/?p=342 > > Gary Melton > > N320GG LNC2 > >* > > >* > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Chris Hukill" <cjhukill(at)cox.net>
Subject: front seat shoulder harness attach
Date: Oct 11, 2006
I'm trying to get everything done to the canopy cover before I install it, and can't find any instructions on how to mount the front seat shoulder harness to the canopy. I have all the kits, but haven't bought seat belts yet. I can't find any instructions on how to mount the harness, nor can I find anything in the archives. Does anyone have any clues for me? Thanks Chris Hukill hating the wheelpants ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: front seat shoulder harness attach
Date: Oct 11, 2006
From: "Lloyd, Daniel R." <LloydDR(at)wernerco.com>
Section 49 page 3, it shows the hard point mounts and hardware call out for the seatbelts Dan 40269 RV10E _____ From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Chris Hukill Sent: Wednesday, October 11, 2006 12:15 PM Subject: RV10-List: front seat shoulder harness attach I'm trying to get everything done to the canopy cover before I install it, and can't find any instructions on how to mount the front seat shoulder harness to the canopy. I have all the kits, but haven't bought seat belts yet. I can't find any instructions on how to mount the harness, nor can I find anything in the archives. Does anyone have any clues for me? Thanks Chris Hukill hating the wheelpants ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Wingtip installation with hinges
Date: Oct 11, 2006
From: "Chris Johnston" <CJohnston(at)popsound.com>
hey all - i'm trying to find my RVator that has the writeup about using hinges to install wingtips, and i can't seem to find it. looked in both bathrooms and the nightstand :) anyone remember which issue it was in? thanks! cj #40410 fuse www.perfectlygoodairplane.net ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "John Hasbrouck" <jhasbrouck(at)woh.rr.com>
Subject: Re: Wingtip installation with hinges
Date: Oct 11, 2006
Chris, Info is in the second issue of 2005. Great article! Thought I might do the same but don't think it will work well with the Archer nav antennas in the tips. If you have a different opinion let me know. John Hasbrouck #40264 ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Wingtip installation with hinges
From: "zackrv8" <zackrv8(at)verizon.net>
Date: Oct 11, 2006
CJ, Here is a link. I am doing the same on my 10. Beats using screws! Zack http://www.rvwiki.org/index.php?title=Attach_Wingtips_with_Hinges CJohnston(at)popsound.com wrote: > hey all - > > i'm trying to find my RVator that has the writeup about using hinges to install wingtips, and i can't seem to find it. looked in both bathrooms and the nightstand :) anyone remember which issue it was in? > > thanks! > > cj > #40410 > fuse > www.perfectlygoodairplane.net -------- RV8 #80125 RV10 # 40512 Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=67226#67226 ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Oct 11, 2006
From: Kelly McMullen <kellym(at)aviating.com>
Subject: Re: pilot vs. final holes and cogsdill
Do you have a good source for #30 &40 reamers? Russell Daves wrote: > > In addition to drill bits (buy at least 5 of each) you should also get > #30 and #40 reamers. The reamers are my first choice in doing the > initial/final drilling of pre-punched holes. I have never used the > burraway drill bits but didn't find a real problem with deburring > after using a reamer. > > In addition, instead of "match drilling" pre-punched holes I would > advise first hitting all of the pre-punched holes with either the #30 > or #40 reamer and debur before putting them together the first time. > I found on the VS that it was real difficult to cleco the parts > together but after using the reamers and deburring first all my parts > cleco'd together much easier. By the time I reached the HS I had > stopped match drilling anything that was pre-punched and didn't do it > again all the way to the end of my build. > ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Wingtip installation with hinges
Date: Oct 11, 2006
From: "Chris Johnston" <CJohnston(at)popsound.com>
super sweet. that's the article i was lookin fer. even better, since it's in color, has clickable pics, more of them, and i can stop lookin for my RVator that grew legs and ran away. Thanks Zack! for John - i'm doing the hinge wingtips for a couple reasons. it looks way cleaner and doesn't chip paint installing and removing screws (as long as i don't accidentally bash the tips into the wings putting them on and off). in my wingtips, i'm installing the usual suspects. a Bob Archer nav antenna in one, possibly a com antenna in the other, and i've got strobes and nav lights to go in there. also, it's a good way to tinker with the duckworks HIDs that are in the last bay in both wings, and also i have an AOA in there. sounds like a lot of poop in there, and it is. i can't imagine that it'll all just work the first time out, and forever thereafter! Like to have easy(ier) access. cj #40410 www.perfectlygoodairplane.net fuse -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com on behalf of zackrv8 Sent: Wed 10/11/2006 3:41 PM Subject: RV10-List: Re: Wingtip installation with hinges CJ, Here is a link. I am doing the same on my 10. Beats using screws! Zack http://www.rvwiki.org/index.php?title=Attach_Wingtips_with_Hinges CJohnston(at)popsound.com wrote: > hey all - > > i'm trying to find my RVator that has the writeup about using hinges to install wingtips, and i can't seem to find it. looked in both bathrooms and the nightstand :) anyone remember which issue it was in? > > thanks! > > cj > #40410 > fuse > www.perfectlygoodairplane.net -------- RV8 #80125 RV10 # 40512 Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=67226#67226 ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Vans Alternator
Date: Oct 12, 2006
From: "McGANN, Ron" <ron.mcgann(at)baesystems.com>
All, Just unpacked my FWF kit. Was planning on the B&C alternator and external reg. Forgot to exclude the Vans ES 60 amp alt from the FWF kit. Backup will be the B&C 20 amp with ext reg. Any negative comments/experiences with the Vans unit?? cheers, Ron 187 - trimming windows. ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Wingtip installation with hinges
From: "zackrv8" <zackrv8(at)verizon.net>
Date: Oct 11, 2006
No sweat CJ! Zack CJohnston(at)popsound.com wrote: > super sweet. that's the article i was lookin fer. even better, since it's in color, has clickable pics, more of them, and i can stop lookin for my RVator that grew legs and ran away. Thanks Zack! > > for John - > i'm doing the hinge wingtips for a couple reasons. it looks way cleaner and doesn't chip paint installing and removing screws (as long as i don't accidentally bash the tips into the wings putting them on and off). in my wingtips, i'm installing the usual suspects. a Bob Archer nav antenna in one, possibly a com antenna in the other, and i've got strobes and nav lights to go in there. also, it's a good way to tinker with the duckworks HIDs that are in the last bay in both wings, and also i have an AOA in there. sounds like a lot of poop in there, and it is. i can't imagine that it'll all just work the first time out, and forever thereafter! Like to have easy(ier) access. > > > > > cj > #40410 > www.perfectlygoodairplane.net > fuse > > > -- -------- RV8 #80125 RV10 # 40512 Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=67263#67263 ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Oct 12, 2006
From: Sam Marlow <sam.marlow(at)adelphia.net>
Subject: Re: Vans Alternator
I know of at least 2 that didn't make it to the first 100 hrs! McGANN, Ron wrote: >All, > >Just unpacked my FWF kit. Was planning on the B&C alternator and external reg. Forgot to exclude the Vans ES 60 amp alt from the FWF kit. Backup will be the B&C 20 amp with ext reg. Any negative comments/experiences with the Vans unit?? > >cheers, >Ron >187 - trimming windows. > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Albert Gardner" <ibspud(at)adelphia.net>
Subject: pilot vs. final holes and cogsdill
Date: Oct 11, 2006
Avery for one, probably all the tool outfits have them. I like the reamers better than the drills because the little to no deburring after using one on a pilot hole. You will also have some use for the 12" #40 and #30 drill bits. I bought a 3/16" and 1/4" reamer and use them to finish up those holes rather than the number bits called for to eliminate as much slop as possible when fitting parts. Albert Gardner Yuma, AZ 40-422 Finish kit -----Original Message----- Subject: Re: RV10-List: pilot vs. final holes and cogsdill Do you have a good source for #30 &40 reamers? ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Vans Alternator
Date: Oct 12, 2006
From: "RV Builder (Michael Sausen)" <rvbuilder(at)sausen.net>
If anyone is ordering the FWF kit from Van's, I recommend you replace the standard 60amp alt with the deluxe model. The stock one is just an auto alternator where the deluxe one is a Plane Power alternator at a very attractive reduced price. From Van's it is $375 Plane Power's list price is $569. Michael Sausen -10 #352 Fuselage From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Sam Marlow Sent: Thursday, October 12, 2006 10:59 PM Subject: Re: RV10-List: Vans Alternator I know of at least 2 that didn't make it to the first 100 hrs! McGANN, Ron wrote: All, Just unpacked my FWF kit. Was planning on the B&C alternator and external reg. Forgot to exclude the Vans ES 60 amp alt from the FWF kit. Backup will be the B&C 20 amp with ext reg. Any negative comments/experiences with the Vans unit?? cheers, Ron 187 - trimming windows. ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Oct 12, 2006
From: Perry Casson <pcasson(at)sasktel.net>
Subject: Vans Alternator
Anyone know what's actually failing on these alternators? From my various vehicles and several million miles of driving I've never had an auto alternator failure. Perhaps it's an installation issue (i.e. heat or vibration). Perry Casson ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Rob Kermanj <flysrv10(at)gmail.com>
Subject: Re: Vans Alternator
Date: Oct 12, 2006
i am not sure why mine failed. i could not feel the brushes by spinning it. It is back to Van for warranty refund. (I hope). do not crchive Rob Kermanj On Oct 12, 2006, at 10:10 AM, Perry Casson wrote: > Anyone know what=92s actually failing on these alternators? =46rom my > various vehicles and several million miles of driving I=92ve never > had an auto alternator failure. Perhaps it=92s an installation issue > (i.e. heat or vibration). > > > Perry Casson > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: LessDragProd(at)aol.com
Date: Oct 12, 2006
Subject: Re: Vans Alternator
I've had car alternators fail twice as each car approached 125,000 miles. Maybe you're not driving your cars long enough. :-) Jim Ayers In a message dated 10/12/2006 7:13:32 AM Pacific Daylight Time, pcasson(at)sasktel.net writes: Anyone know what=99s actually failing on these alternators? From my various vehicles and several million miles of driving I=99ve never had an aut o alternator failure. Perhaps it=99s an installation issue (i.e. heat or vibration). Perry Casson ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Oct 12, 2006
From: Link McGarity <wv4i(at)bellsouth.net>
Subject: HS-905 Rib Install
Do NOT try this without help, at least the 2 inside ribs ones in each half of HS. It will not go well. Your arms are not long enough to buck and rivet properly at same time. Wish I'd looked at John J's site, this step, about a day sooner!!!! Link McGarity #40622 ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Vans Alternator
Date: Oct 13, 2006
From: "McGANN, Ron" <ron.mcgann(at)baesystems.com>
The really disappointing thing about this is that I could not find the contents of the IO-540 FWF kit listed anywhere on Van's website. The Master relay, starter relay and Battery as listed on their web site as included, ARE NOT provided in the 540 kit nor could I find any options to change the alternator. Returning the alternator for a refund/replacement from Oz is a pain in the agates. Ron -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of RV Builder (Michael Sausen) Sent: Thursday, 12 October 2006 10:49 PM Subject: RE: RV10-List: Vans Alternator If anyone is ordering the FWF kit from Van's, I recommend you replace the standard 60amp alt with the deluxe model. The stock one is just an auto alternator where the deluxe one is a Plane Power alternator at a very attractive reduced price. From Van's it is $375 Plane Power's list price is $569. Michael Sausen -10 #352 Fuselage From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Sam Marlow Sent: Thursday, October 12, 2006 10:59 PM Subject: Re: RV10-List: Vans Alternator I know of at least 2 that didn't make it to the first 100 hrs! McGANN, Ron wrote: All, Just unpacked my FWF kit. Was planning on the B&C alternator and external reg. Forgot to exclude the Vans ES 60 amp alt from the FWF kit. Backup will be the B&C 20 amp with ext reg. Any negative comments/experiences with the Vans unit?? cheers, Ron 187 - trimming windows. http://www.matron ic - NEW MATRONICS also available via the Web ================== ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Wingtip installation with hinges
From: "Bob Collins" <bcollinsrv7a(at)comcast.net>
Date: Oct 12, 2006
Afterthought on not remember which issue an RVator article was in. I put a spreadsheet together of RVAtor articles from 2001 on (although I haven't updated it with the one this week). Eventually, I'm going to move it to a public page, at the moment, it's in the RV yahoogroups file section. Here (http://groups.yahoo.com/group/RV7A/files/Newsletters%20and%20publications/) -------- Bob Collins St. Paul, Minn. RV Builder's Hotline (free!) http://home.comcast.net/~rvnewsletter/ Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=67446#67446 ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Oct 13, 2006
From: Link McGarity <wv4i(at)bellsouth.net>
Subject: Re: Vans Alternator
I run a Van's 35A alternator (not the 60A) in my RV6 with over 500TTAF. It is the original alternator. 2-3 yrs ago, started to see system voltage go to battery voltage intermittently in flight. Thinking this was a temp related problem, replaced plug on back of alternator, checked belt tightness, etc.. No help. Next replaced Van's supplied voltage regulator (located in cockpit behind instrument panel) with another Van's VR, same part no, but slightly different style, wiring, etc. Problem fixed. Link McGarity #40622 ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Kit Contents: was Vans Alternator
Date: Oct 13, 2006
From: "Condrey, Bob (US SSA)" <bob.condrey(at)baesystems.com>
Ron, Tim Olson has contents for all of the kits posted on his web site at http://www.myrv10.com/tips/kits/index.html Bob #40105 _____ From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of McGANN, Ron (AUS BAeA) Sent: Thursday, October 12, 2006 5:46 PM Subject: RE: RV10-List: Vans Alternator The really disappointing thing about this is that I could not find the contents of the IO-540 FWF kit listed anywhere on Van's website. The Master relay, starter relay and Battery as listed on their web site as included, ARE NOT provided in the 540 kit nor could I find any options to change the alternator. Returning the alternator for a refund/replacement from Oz is a pain in the agates. Ron -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of RV Builder (Michael Sausen) Sent: Thursday, 12 October 2006 10:49 PM To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com Subject: RE: RV10-List: Vans Alternator If anyone is ordering the FWF kit from Van's, I recommend you replace the standard 60amp alt with the deluxe model. The stock one is just an auto alternator where the deluxe one is a Plane Power alternator at a very attractive reduced price. From Van's it is $375 Plane Power's list price is $569. Michael Sausen -10 #352 Fuselage From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Sam Marlow Sent: Thursday, October 12, 2006 10:59 PM To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com Subject: Re: RV10-List: Vans Alternator I know of at least 2 that didn't make it to the first 100 hrs! McGANN, Ron wrote: All, Just unpacked my FWF kit. Was planning on the B&C alternator and external reg. Forgot to exclude the Vans ES 60 amp alt from the FWF kit. Backup will be the B&C 20 amp with ext reg. Any negative comments/experiences with the Vans unit?? cheers, Ron 187 - trimming windows. http://www.matronic - NEW MATRONICS also available via the Web ===================http://www.matronic s .com/Navigator?RV10-List ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Noel & Yoshie Simmons" <noel(at)blueskyaviation.net>
Subject: 296
Date: Oct 13, 2006
I am rebuilding a panel for an old friend, I am using his Garmin 295 SL-40, GTX-327. Well the airgizmo panel mount I bought and have the panel cut for fits the 296 so what can I do about traiding someone across the board? Or should I go jump in a lake and just get him a 296 Noel ________________________________________________________________________________
From: <ricksked(at)earthlink.net>
Subject: Re: 296
Date: Oct 13, 2006
Jump in the lake...he is a customer, I mean old friend. ;) ----- Original Message ----- From: Noel & Yoshie Simmons To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com Sent: Friday, October 13, 2006 5:32 PM Subject: RV10-List: 296 I am rebuilding a panel for an old friend, I am using his Garmin 295 SL-40, GTX-327. Well the airgizmo panel mount I bought and have the panel cut for fits the 296 so what can I do about traiding someone across the board? Or should I go jump in a lake and just get him a 296 Noel ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Carl Froehlich" <carl.froehlich(at)cox.net>
Subject: 296
Date: Oct 13, 2006
Get a 396 for the XM weather. Carl -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of Noel & Yoshie Simmons Sent: Friday, October 13, 2006 8:32 PM To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com Subject: RV10-List: 296 I am rebuilding a panel for an old friend, I am using his Garmin 295 SL-40, GTX-327. Well the airgizmo panel mount I bought and have the panel cut for fits the 296 so what can I do about traiding someone across the board? Or should I go jump in a lake and just get him a 296 Noel ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: engines
Date: Oct 13, 2006
From: billykay1(at)AOL.COM
Hello, Has anybody (besides me) considered putting a 4 cylinder lyc (or derivative) in the 10? Billy Kehmeier tail kit 574 ________________________________________________________________________ Check out the new AOL. Most comprehensive set of free safety and security tools, free access to millions of high-quality videos from across the web, free AOL Mail and more. ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Nick Nafsinger" <nick(at)creteaviation.com>
Subject: 296
Date: Oct 13, 2006
WEATHER! 396 or 496, can't go wrong with either one. Nick _____ From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Carl Froehlich Sent: Friday, October 13, 2006 8:20 PM Subject: RE: RV10-List: 296 Get a 396 for the XM weather. Carl -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of Noel & Yoshie Simmons Sent: Friday, October 13, 2006 8:32 PM Subject: RV10-List: 296 I am rebuilding a panel for an old friend, I am using his Garmin 295 SL-40, GTX-327. Well the airgizmo panel mount I bought and have the panel cut for fits the 296 so what can I do about traiding someone across the board? Or should I go jump in a lake and just get him a 296 Noel href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List">http://www.matronics.com /Navigator?RV10-List ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Rob Wright" <armywrights(at)adelphia.net>
Subject: QB Steps
Date: Oct 13, 2006
The section on installing the steps is my favorite section that I've come across for some time now. On the QB Fuse some things seem harder than the slow build, just because you've got to figure out what's been done down to the last rivet driven or intentionally left open (I had to drill out a few that were in the wrong spots). Seems like the folks across the pond and Van's are trying to keep the playing field level by doing 98% of the pre-install work on this section. Shoving the steps in and torqueing the bolts took all of .5 tonight, and that included deburring some high spots on the #12 holes.. Rob Wright #392 Loving the QB Fuse build.today at least! ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "RAS" <deruiteraircraftservices(at)btinternet.com>
Subject: Re: engines
Date: Oct 14, 2006
Billy, The problem is not the power of the engine, but the weight. Hanging a four cylinder up front will leave the tail relatively heavy. This means little or no luggage, maybe one or none on the rear seat. Stick with the original design as intended, build and fly it. If you don't like at that stage sell it and start with a clean sheet ofpaper and design your own. ----- Original Message ----- From: billykay1(at)aol.com To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com Sent: Saturday, October 14, 2006 2:40 AM Subject: RV10-List: engines Hello, Has anybody (besides me) considered putting a 4 cylinder lyc (or derivative) in the 10? Billy Kehmeier tail kit 574 ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ----- Check out the new AOL. Most comprehensive set of free safety and security tools, free access to millions of high-quality videos from across the web, free AOL Mail and more. ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Wayne Edgerton" <wayne.e(at)grandecom.net>
Subject: Re: engines
Date: Oct 14, 2006
That sounds like blaspheme to me :>} Wayne Edgerton #40336 ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Oct 14, 2006
From: Link McGarity <wv4i(at)bellsouth.net>
Subject: Re: engines
4 cyl eng in RV-10? Me. Van's. But flying off grass in FL in the summer, probably need the bigger motor. Have some Cirrus SR-20 owners/neighbors that can speak to this subject, although I think the wing loading on the

RV10-Archive.digest.vol-bn

RV10-Archive.digest.vol-bn