RV10-Archive.digest.vol-dc
February 22, 2008 - March 04, 2008
RV10-Archive.digest.vol-dc
February 22, 2008 - March 04, 2008
>> errors".
>>
>>
>> Nine employees of the Arab airline were in the aircraft, but "no
>> employees"
>> from Airbus were present.
>>
>>
>> The Arab's taxied out to the run-up area.
>>
>>
>> Then they took all four engines to takeoff power with virtually an
>> empty
>> aircraft. (They obvious didn't read the run-up manuals.)
>>
>>
>> No chocks were set, (not that it would have mattered at that power
>> setting).
>>
>>
>> "Brakes will not hold it back at full power anyway".
>>
>>
>> As it turns out the takeoff warning horn was blaring away in the
>> cockpit
>> because they had all FOUR engines at full power.
>>
>>
>> The aircraft computers thought they were trying to takeoff but it
>> had not
>> been configured properly (flaps/slats, etc, etc).
>>
>>
>> Then one of these brain surgeons decided to pull the "Ground Sense"
>> circuit breaker to quiet the alarms.
>>
>>
>> This fools the aircraft into thinking it is in the air."A big, big
>> mistake"!
>>
>>
>>
>> As soon as they did that, the computers automaticlly "released" all
>> the
>> brakes. ("this is a Safety feature so that pilots don't land with
>> the brakes
>> on".)There was No time to stop and no one smart enough thought to
>> reduce the
>> max power setting.....
>>
>> So the rest is as you see it below.
>>
>>
>>
>> No one is talking, so who knows if there were survivors.
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Rudder Trim - Spring Bias
From: jason.kreidler(at)regalbeloit.com
Date: Feb 22, 2008
I have 'developed' a spring bias rudder trim system for the RV-10. After
sharing this idea with Deems he encouraged me to do the same with the rest
of the group. So here goes, but before I get into any details let me
preface this whole conversation with a few thoughts. This is all in
theory, I have absolutely no actual flight testing to back up any of the
'claims', or assumptions. Just good old common sense and a tiny bit of
engineering. Our airplane is not in the air yet, I had hoped to get in
the air, prove out the system, then share with the world. To prevent
anyone else for possibly needlessly cutting into their rudder to add a
trim tab, I have decided to bear the scrutiny of an unproven, theoretical
system. Please be gentle...
I will attempt to verbalize the system. I used two torsion springs, one
mounted / wrapped around, each rudder bar (the bar that connects the
rudder pedals). One of the springs is fixed on both ends providing a
torsional force on the rudder bar. The other springs free end is hooked
to a servo motor that allows approximately 30 degrees deflection. The
theory is that the two springs will seek equilibrium (OK, that's not much
theory, that's more fact), here is where the testing needs to happen. If
I deflect the one springs free arm 30 degrees, will it create enough force
to put the airplane in trim. The springs apply about an 8 pound force to
the rudder cables (pre-load if you will), assuming they will want to
maintain in equilibrium a 30 degree deflection should be more than enough
to trim the airplane. The servo will act as sort of a fine tuning
mechanism, the course adjustment will be accomplished by winding more or
less tension in one spring or the other during flight testing.
I like a few things about this method.
1) It can be installed to any flying airplane with no modifications
required other than wiring.
2) There is a chance that this system could be made manual and eliminate
the RAC servo if desired.
3) This system provides tension to both rudder cables, no more 'flopping
rudder'.
4) Keeps the rudder 'clean'.
5) Doesn't add much extra rudder input force.
I sent pictures of this system to Deems, I will 'attempt' to post some
pictures to this forum if there is interest. Comments welcome, I
apologize for the extremely long post, but I have added Deems questions
below, I figured if he asked, many more will have the same questions....
1. How did you determine which spring type/size/strength to use?
OK, you busted me!! I didn't do the math, I feel extremely guilty about
this, as an engineer, I should probably go back and figure the forces
here. Here is what I did; since I grew up in the business of garage doors
(my Dad owned his own company doing this), I went to Fleet Farm (one of
our local supply houses, similar to most lumbar yards) and found a garage
door spring that had an ID that would slide over the rudder bar with room
to spare, and would fit between the two rudder bars (I will measure this
for you). I then cut lengths of the spring until I got what I 'thought'
was a reasonable amount of force with two turns of pre-load, and bent some
custom ends on them. With torsion springs you have two options to
increase the reaction force. You can add turns of pre-load, or you can
shorten the spring with the same number of turns. I just went until I
reached what I 'felt' was a happy medium. Remember that as you wind a
torsion spring more and more the inside diameter decreases, until it
eventually binds on the shaft (rudder bar). What mostly drove me not to
do the math, was I had absolutely no idea what sort of corrective rudder
pressure was required to put the ball in the middle. My plan all along
has been to get it in the air and do some experimenting, I installed the
system so that modification of the spring force should be simple. I just
need to start dating a contortionist :)
2. I assume that you can 'adjust the torsional load somewhat by moving
the collar/s, Is that true?
Correct, I started out with each spring wound an equal amount. If I find
that I need additional trim to one side or the other I will wind one of
the springs to compensate. The servo will just provide the 'fine tuning'.
3. One of the pictures shows the center support brace minus the delrin
bushings, I'm assuming that leaving those out is not a requirement of
your approach and was just the result of taking the picture before they
were installed?
Correct, in fact there isn't a single modification to the airframe, if I
remove the system no one could ever tell it was installed. I built the
mount so that it could be used in either the forward or aft rudder
mounting positions, my pedals are mounted in the aft position. But I
drilled and prepped the airframe to mount the rudder pedals in either
position.
4. What about the mount for the RAC servo, do you have a picture of it
before the servo is mounted.
See attached.... The angle was determined by something, I just don't
recall what anymore. I know it has to be at an angle to work though. I
can measure if you decide to attempt this.
5. Also it' looks like you used a small section of SS cable to connect
the servo arm to the spring coil, correct? Picture?
Correct, see attached. One end is run through the servo arm, the other
gets hooked by the spring. The spring on the pilot side is hooked over
the opposite rudder bar.
I gave some thought to your desire to have a manually operated system, I
think this system could be done manually with very little pain. You may
be able to add a knob that would come out of the sub panel, really
anywhere along its length. What would have to happen is a bracket would
need to be made that slid over the rudder bar with a nut in it. Then a
threaded shaft running from the rudder bar to the sub panel would be used
to adjust the free arm of the spring. It may be best if the spring were
pushed by the shaft instead of pulled, as this would make the mechanism a
bit simpler. I could do a drawing of what I am thinking if you are not
following.
While it was not my intention to begin producing kits, if there is enough
interest, I could be persuaded to fabricate a few.
Thanks, Jason
Jason Kreidler - 40617 Finishing
(4 Partner Build)
________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Amendment and Revision to Kit Building Rules - Where's
the Leadership?
Date: Feb 22, 2008
From: "John W. Cox" <johnwcox(at)pacificnw.com>
Deems, you have hit it on the head.
Randy Hansen is our (everyone's EAA Government Relations Rep). He wrote
this glowing passage after Oregon killed an exclusion for one grade of
gasoline to be available for aircraft operators of STCed MOGAS engines
and LSAs with Rotax (which require a restriction on 100LL).
"When we sent our first EAA member e-Alert/Notice to
Oregon members,
Dan Clem and the Department of Ag were very strongly
opposed to asking
the state legislature to amend the new ethanol mandating
bill. They
said that because this was only a special secession and
that all special
secession bills had already been identified, that any
modifications
would not be looked at or accepted. In actual practice,
the OPA and EAA
members were able to bring their concerns before their
individual
legislators and get the bill listing several exemptions,
including
aviation, introduced and acted on. Hopefully, this
afternoon the bill
will be finalized and passed. While the "exclude all
premium gasoline
from ethanol-blending" point of view has not, so far,
carried the day -
it has been an overwhelming success to get this far into
the special
Oregon legislature secession with a bill that state
advisors said should
not have happened. So, EAA must offer our congrats to
the entire team
for this huge effort and success."
The role of the Director of Aviation, Dan Clem, has now been brought
into question on Ethanol at the Pump. Nothing about HB2210 which is law
or the SB1079 Amendment A6 which was supposed to correct it during the
Emergency Session this week, can be called a success. When pilots, who
had waited hours for the Railroad Lobbyists to finish talking, our
legislators walked out of the hearing on them.
The result is that Oregon is the first state in the union to mandate
that all consumers buy adulterated fuel at the pump with a minimum of
10% ethanol. Greenies want all states to mandate Ethanol. Several
states provided fuel exemptions. Oregon is not one of them. The First
Responders who use gasoline emergency generators, the boat and auto
aficionados and of course aviators be damned. Everything was tried,
nothing persuaded our legislators. The EAA did nothing but offer
congrats to some entire team which did not represent our interests. Now
all of you flying from other states had better check fuel supply first.
Don't get me wrong, I love the EAA for what it presents, but legislative
and government relations are a travesty. The ARC is not much different.
The EAA needs to focus primarily on Experimental Certificated
Aircraft.... Period.
John Cox #600
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Deems Davis
Sent: Friday, February 22, 2008 7:22 AM
Subject: Re: RV10-List: Amendment and Revision to Kit Building Rules -
Where's the Leadership?
It's too bad the ARC couldn't agree on proposed rule changes, (for
'economic' reasons) so now we're left with the FAA drafting the
changes. Its fairly obvious that based on the varied interests of the
representative parties, that ANY changes that were considered were going
to result in a financial hit to at least one of the represented
segments. In this business world this is what happens when there is a
Leadership void. Which is what I see happening here. What I find
personally extremely disappointing is that the EAA, who at one time was
the best representative for 'us' (homebuilders) seems to have become a
victim of the 'special interests' and has followed vs. lead on this one.
My letter is on it's way.
Deems Davis # 406
'Its all done....Its just not put together'
http://deemsrv10.com/
> *
> *
________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: WRECKED A340-600 at TULOUSE FRANCE 11-07
From: "orchidman" <gary(at)wingscc.com>
Date: Feb 22, 2008
msausen wrote:
> "Would it have been as comic had the aircraft been painted with British Airway
colors?"
>
> Hell yes! --
Its Friday so I guess we have to be politically correct.
Ya-all have a good day!
--------
Gary Blankenbiller
RV10 - # 40674
Fuselage SB
(N410GB reserved)
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=165583#165583
________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Feb 22, 2008
Subject: Re: WRECKED A340-600 at TULOUSE FRANCE 11-07
From: "William Curtis" <wcurtis(at)nerv10.com>
> William I agree with you but can you tell me what Dr Suess has to do with RV's?
That's in jest --right? I can't tell?
William
http://wcurtis.nerv10.com/
"Be who you are and say what you feel because those who mind don't matter and those
who matter don't mind."
-- Dr. Suess
________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Mod1 Overhead Console
From: "jayb" <jaybrinkmeyer(at)yahoo.com>
Date: Feb 22, 2008
Yet another overhead. Pretty nice and small too.
The Mod1 Overhead Console is mounted to top of cabin or top wing skin
with four stainless steel screws into the four standoffs or posts on Console.
The lights are the same ones that come standard w/ Accuracy Overhead. I think I've
seen them on Stein's website too.
http://www.cockpitlights.com/console.html
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=165588#165588
________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Feb 22, 2008
From: "Ralph E. Capen" <recapen(at)earthlink.net>
Subject: Re: Rudder Trim - Spring Bias
When do we get to see some pictures?
-----Original Message-----
>From: jason.kreidler(at)regalbeloit.com
>Sent: Feb 22, 2008 12:55 PM
>To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com
>Subject: RV10-List: Rudder Trim - Spring Bias
>
>I have 'developed' a spring bias rudder trim system for the RV-10. After
>sharing this idea with Deems he encouraged me to do the same with the rest
>of the group. So here goes, but before I get into any details let me
>preface this whole conversation with a few thoughts. This is all in
>theory, I have absolutely no actual flight testing to back up any of the
>'claims', or assumptions. Just good old common sense and a tiny bit of
>engineering. Our airplane is not in the air yet, I had hoped to get in
>the air, prove out the system, then share with the world. To prevent
>anyone else for possibly needlessly cutting into their rudder to add a
>trim tab, I have decided to bear the scrutiny of an unproven, theoretical
>system. Please be gentle...
>
>I will attempt to verbalize the system. I used two torsion springs, one
>mounted / wrapped around, each rudder bar (the bar that connects the
>rudder pedals). One of the springs is fixed on both ends providing a
>torsional force on the rudder bar. The other springs free end is hooked
>to a servo motor that allows approximately 30 degrees deflection. The
>theory is that the two springs will seek equilibrium (OK, that's not much
>theory, that's more fact), here is where the testing needs to happen. If
>I deflect the one springs free arm 30 degrees, will it create enough force
>to put the airplane in trim. The springs apply about an 8 pound force to
>the rudder cables (pre-load if you will), assuming they will want to
>maintain in equilibrium a 30 degree deflection should be more than enough
>to trim the airplane. The servo will act as sort of a fine tuning
>mechanism, the course adjustment will be accomplished by winding more or
>less tension in one spring or the other during flight testing.
>
>I like a few things about this method.
>1) It can be installed to any flying airplane with no modifications
>required other than wiring.
>2) There is a chance that this system could be made manual and eliminate
>the RAC servo if desired.
>3) This system provides tension to both rudder cables, no more 'flopping
>rudder'.
>4) Keeps the rudder 'clean'.
>5) Doesn't add much extra rudder input force.
>
>I sent pictures of this system to Deems, I will 'attempt' to post some
>pictures to this forum if there is interest. Comments welcome, I
>apologize for the extremely long post, but I have added Deems questions
>below, I figured if he asked, many more will have the same questions....
>
>
>1. How did you determine which spring type/size/strength to use?
>OK, you busted me!! I didn't do the math, I feel extremely guilty about
>this, as an engineer, I should probably go back and figure the forces
>here. Here is what I did; since I grew up in the business of garage doors
>(my Dad owned his own company doing this), I went to Fleet Farm (one of
>our local supply houses, similar to most lumbar yards) and found a garage
>door spring that had an ID that would slide over the rudder bar with room
>to spare, and would fit between the two rudder bars (I will measure this
>for you). I then cut lengths of the spring until I got what I 'thought'
>was a reasonable amount of force with two turns of pre-load, and bent some
>custom ends on them. With torsion springs you have two options to
>increase the reaction force. You can add turns of pre-load, or you can
>shorten the spring with the same number of turns. I just went until I
>reached what I 'felt' was a happy medium. Remember that as you wind a
>torsion spring more and more the inside diameter decreases, until it
>eventually binds on the shaft (rudder bar). What mostly drove me not to
>do the math, was I had absolutely no idea what sort of corrective rudder
>pressure was required to put the ball in the middle. My plan all along
>has been to get it in the air and do some experimenting, I installed the
>system so that modification of the spring force should be simple. I just
>need to start dating a contortionist :)
>
>2. I assume that you can 'adjust the torsional load somewhat by moving
>the collar/s, Is that true?
>Correct, I started out with each spring wound an equal amount. If I find
>that I need additional trim to one side or the other I will wind one of
>the springs to compensate. The servo will just provide the 'fine tuning'.
>
>3. One of the pictures shows the center support brace minus the delrin
>bushings, I'm assuming that leaving those out is not a requirement of
>your approach and was just the result of taking the picture before they
>were installed?
>Correct, in fact there isn't a single modification to the airframe, if I
>remove the system no one could ever tell it was installed. I built the
>mount so that it could be used in either the forward or aft rudder
>mounting positions, my pedals are mounted in the aft position. But I
>drilled and prepped the airframe to mount the rudder pedals in either
>position.
>
>4. What about the mount for the RAC servo, do you have a picture of it
>before the servo is mounted.
>See attached.... The angle was determined by something, I just don't
>recall what anymore. I know it has to be at an angle to work though. I
>can measure if you decide to attempt this.
>
>5. Also it' looks like you used a small section of SS cable to connect
>the servo arm to the spring coil, correct? Picture?
>Correct, see attached. One end is run through the servo arm, the other
>gets hooked by the spring. The spring on the pilot side is hooked over
>the opposite rudder bar.
>
>I gave some thought to your desire to have a manually operated system, I
>think this system could be done manually with very little pain. You may
>be able to add a knob that would come out of the sub panel, really
>anywhere along its length. What would have to happen is a bracket would
>need to be made that slid over the rudder bar with a nut in it. Then a
>threaded shaft running from the rudder bar to the sub panel would be used
>to adjust the free arm of the spring. It may be best if the spring were
>pushed by the shaft instead of pulled, as this would make the mechanism a
>bit simpler. I could do a drawing of what I am thinking if you are not
>following.
>
>While it was not my intention to begin producing kits, if there is enough
>interest, I could be persuaded to fabricate a few.
>
>Thanks, Jason
>
>Jason Kreidler - 40617 Finishing
>(4 Partner Build)
________________________________________________________________________________
From: GRANSCOTT(at)aol.com
Date: Feb 22, 2008
Subject: Re: WRECKED A340-600 at TULOUSE FRANCE 11-07
In a message dated 2/22/2008 12:08:17 PM Central Standard Time,
wcurtis(at)nerv10.com writes:
That's in jest --right? I can't tell?
I was hoping to lighten the moment and work off of the comment...
P 8-]
**************Ideas to please picky eaters. Watch video on AOL Living.
(http://living.aol.com/video/how-to-please-your-picky-eater/rachel-campos-duffy/
2050827?NCID=aolcmp00300000002598)
________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Steven DiNieri" <capsteve(at)adelphia.net>
Subject: Rudder Trim - Spring Bias
Date: Feb 22, 2008
Jason, its sounds like a very elegant solution i can't wait to see some
pics.
[Steven DiNieri]
rom: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of
jason.kreidler(at)regalbeloit.com
Sent: Friday, February 22, 2008 12:55 PM
Subject: RV10-List: Rudder Trim - Spring Bias
I have 'developed' a spring bias rudder trim system for the RV-10. After
sharing this idea with Deems he encouraged me to do the same with the rest
of the group. So here goes, but before I get into any details let me
preface this whole conversation with a few thoughts. This is all in theory,
I have absolutely no actual flight testing to back up any of the 'claims',
or assumptions. Just good old common sense and a tiny bit of engineering.
Our airplane is not in the air yet, I had hoped to get in the air, prove out
the system, then share with the world. To prevent anyone else for possibly
needlessly cutting into their rudder to add a trim tab, I have decided to
bear the scrutiny of an unproven, theoretical system. Please be gentle...
I will attempt to verbalize the system. I used two torsion springs, one
mounted / wrapped around, each rudder bar (the bar that connects the rudder
pedals). One of the springs is fixed on both ends providing a torsional
force on the rudder bar. The other springs free end is hooked to a servo
motor that allows approximately 30 degrees deflection. The theory is that
the two springs will seek equilibrium (OK, that's not much theory, that's
more fact), here is where the testing needs to happen. If I deflect the one
springs free arm 30 degrees, will it create enough force to put the airplane
in trim. The springs apply about an 8 pound force to the rudder cables
(pre-load if you will), assuming they will want to maintain in equilibrium a
30 degree deflection should be more than enough to trim the airplane. The
servo will act as sort of a fine tuning mechanism, the course adjustment
will be accomplished by winding more or less tension in one spring or the
other during flight testing.
I like a few things about this method.
1) It can be installed to any flying airplane with no modifications required
other than wiring.
2) There is a chance that this system could be made manual and eliminate the
RAC servo if desired.
3) This system provides tension to both rudder cables, no more 'flopping
rudder'.
4) Keeps the rudder 'clean'.
5) Doesn't add much extra rudder input force.
I sent pictures of this system to Deems, I will 'attempt' to post some
pictures to this forum if there is interest. Comments welcome, I apologize
for the extremely long post, but I have added Deems questions below, I
figured if he asked, many more will have the same questions....
1. How did you determine which spring type/size/strength to use?
OK, you busted me!! I didn't do the math, I feel extremely guilty about
this, as an engineer, I should probably go back and figure the forces here.
Here is what I did; since I grew up in the business of garage doors (my Dad
owned his own company doing this), I went to Fleet Farm (one of our local
supply houses, similar to most lumbar yards) and found a garage door spring
that had an ID that would slide over the rudder bar with room to spare, and
would fit between the two rudder bars (I will measure this for you). I then
cut lengths of the spring until I got what I 'thought' was a reasonable
amount of force with two turns of pre-load, and bent some custom ends on
them. With torsion springs you have two options to increase the reaction
force. You can add turns of pre-load, or you can shorten the spring with
the same number of turns. I just went until I reached what I 'felt' was a
happy medium. Remember that as you wind a torsion spring more and more the
inside diameter decreases, until it eventually binds on the shaft (rudder
bar). What mostly drove me not to do the math, was I had absolutely no idea
what sort of corrective rudder pressure was required to put the ball in the
middle. My plan all along has been to get it in the air and do some
experimenting, I installed the system so that modification of the spring
force should be simple. I just need to start dating a contortionist :)
2. I assume that you can 'adjust the torsional load somewhat by moving
the collar/s, Is that true?
Correct, I started out with each spring wound an equal amount. If I find
that I need additional trim to one side or the other I will wind one of the
springs to compensate. The servo will just provide the 'fine tuning'.
3. One of the pictures shows the center support brace minus the delrin
bushings, I'm assuming that leaving those out is not a requirement of
your approach and was just the result of taking the picture before they
were installed?
Correct, in fact there isn't a single modification to the airframe, if I
remove the system no one could ever tell it was installed. I built the
mount so that it could be used in either the forward or aft rudder mounting
positions, my pedals are mounted in the aft position. But I drilled and
prepped the airframe to mount the rudder pedals in either position.
4. What about the mount for the RAC servo, do you have a picture of it
before the servo is mounted.
See attached.... The angle was determined by something, I just don't recall
what anymore. I know it has to be at an angle to work though. I can
measure if you decide to attempt this.
5. Also it' looks like you used a small section of SS cable to connect
the servo arm to the spring coil, correct? Picture?
Correct, see attached. One end is run through the servo arm, the other gets
hooked by the spring. The spring on the pilot side is hooked over the
opposite rudder bar.
I gave some thought to your desire to have a manually operated system, I
think this system could be done manually with very little pain. You may be
able to add a knob that would come out of the sub panel, really anywhere
along its length. What would have to happen is a bracket would need to be
made that slid over the rudder bar with a nut in it. Then a threaded shaft
running from the rudder bar to the sub panel would be used to adjust the
free arm of the spring. It may be best if the spring were pushed by the
shaft instead of pulled, as this would make the mechanism a bit simpler. I
could do a drawing of what I am thinking if you are not following.
While it was not my intention to begin producing kits, if there is enough
interest, I could be persuaded to fabricate a few.
Thanks, Jason
Jason Kreidler - 40617 Finishing
(4 Partner Build)
________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Rudder Trim - Spring Bias
From: "jkreidler" <jason.kreidler(at)regalbeloit.com>
Date: Feb 22, 2008
Enclosed are a few photographs....
Thanks, Jason
Jason Kreidler - 40617 Finishing
(4 Partner Build)
--------
RV-10 Quick Build
4 Partner Build - Finishing
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=165593#165593
Attachments:
http://forums.matronics.com//files/copilotside_947.jpg
http://forums.matronics.com//files/overview_610.jpg
http://forums.matronics.com//files/pilotside_821.jpg
http://forums.matronics.com//files/servomtg1_720.jpg
________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Feb 22, 2008
From: Carlos Hernandez <carlosh(at)structuralaz.com>
Subject: Re: Rudder Trim - Spring Bias
First I must admit I'm building a 7A. Second - you guys are an awesome
resource for ideas! Do any of you repeat offenders know if the rudder
tubes are the same size in the 10 and 7? I like this idea very much and,
with your permission Jason, I'd like to use it if it works.
Carlos in Arizona
(Watching this development with great interest.)
jkreidler wrote:
>
> Enclosed are a few photographs....
>
> Thanks, Jason
>
> Jason Kreidler - 40617 Finishing
> (4 Partner Build)
>
> --------
> RV-10 Quick Build
> 4 Partner Build - Finishing
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=165593#165593
>
>
> Attachments:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com//files/copilotside_947.jpg
> http://forums.matronics.com//files/overview_610.jpg
> http://forums.matronics.com//files/pilotside_821.jpg
> http://forums.matronics.com//files/servomtg1_720.jpg
>
>
>
--
Carlos Hernandez <carlosh@sec-engr.com>
Structural Engineers Company
2963 W. Elliot Rd. - Suite 3
Chandler, AZ 85224
Phone: 480.968.8600
Fax: 480.968.8608
www.sec-engr.com
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________________________________________________________________________________
From: "David McNeill" <dlm46007(at)cox.net>
Subject: Airbus response
Date: Feb 22, 2008
It seems that the first response on the PC crowd in this country is to play
the racism card. I assure you that the ethnicity of those on board was the
least of my concerns. The real concern was the stupidity of the airmen.
However let's address the race issue. I spent 16 years living and working in
the Middle East so I know better than most the strengths and weaknesses of
the culture. I have visited in their villages , attended their weddings and
speak, read and write limited Arabic. I assure you that there are more
incompetents in technical positions in the East than in the West; this is in
part due to their culture and religion. As an example I was hiring a data
processing analyst for my group; I was sent two Arabs by my Arab boss ( a
stand in vacation replacement) for the interview. Both had been schooled in
the USA. Both had BS degrees in computer science and one had a MS in
computer science. One had a BS in computer science from Eastern Michigan
University where his transcript showed barely passing grades. The other had
a BS and MS from Florida State University and had a GPA A-. Needless to say
I chose the good grade fellow. My stand in boss then told me to hire the low
grade fellow; It so happened that that fellow was of the same tribe as my
stand in boss and brother of the Manager of computer operations. I did as
instructed and when my real boss (another Arab, same tribe) returned I
recounted the situation. Shortly thereafter my first choice was sent to my
group and the low graded fellow was put somewhere else. In another case the
head of the Aviation department is a well qualified Arab who has qualified
as a B737 and G IV captain at Flight Safety where ratings are not handed out
by tribal decree.
________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Feb 22, 2008
From: "Pascal" <rv10builder(at)verizon.net>
Subject: Re: Rudder Trim - Spring Bias
Jason;
you mentioned "While it was not my intention to begin producing kits, if
there is enough interest, I could be persuaded to fabricate a few. "
I may be interested after hearing how well it works and you feel that
the "engineering" is complete.
Thanks!
Pascal
----- Original Message -----
From: jason.kreidler(at)regalbeloit.com
To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com
Sent: Friday, February 22, 2008 9:55 AM
Subject: RV10-List: Rudder Trim - Spring Bias
I have 'developed' a spring bias rudder trim system for the RV-10.
After sharing this idea with Deems he encouraged me to do the same with
the rest of the group. So here goes, but before I get into any details
let me preface this whole conversation with a few thoughts. This is all
in theory, I have absolutely no actual flight testing to back up any of
the 'claims', or assumptions. Just good old common sense and a tiny bit
of engineering. Our airplane is not in the air yet, I had hoped to get
in the air, prove out the system, then share with the world. To prevent
anyone else for possibly needlessly cutting into their rudder to add a
trim tab, I have decided to bear the scrutiny of an unproven,
theoretical system. Please be gentle...
I will attempt to verbalize the system. I used two torsion springs,
one mounted / wrapped around, each rudder bar (the bar that connects the
rudder pedals). One of the springs is fixed on both ends providing a
torsional force on the rudder bar. The other springs free end is hooked
to a servo motor that allows approximately 30 degrees deflection. The
theory is that the two springs will seek equilibrium (OK, that's not
much theory, that's more fact), here is where the testing needs to
happen. If I deflect the one springs free arm 30 degrees, will it
create enough force to put the airplane in trim. The springs apply
about an 8 pound force to the rudder cables (pre-load if you will),
assuming they will want to maintain in equilibrium a 30 degree
deflection should be more than enough to trim the airplane. The servo
will act as sort of a fine tuning mechanism, the course adjustment will
be accomplished by winding more or less tension in one spring or the
other during flight testing.
I like a few things about this method.
1) It can be installed to any flying airplane with no modifications
required other than wiring.
2) There is a chance that this system could be made manual and
eliminate the RAC servo if desired.
3) This system provides tension to both rudder cables, no more
'flopping rudder'.
4) Keeps the rudder 'clean'.
5) Doesn't add much extra rudder input force.
I sent pictures of this system to Deems, I will 'attempt' to post some
pictures to this forum if there is interest. Comments welcome, I
apologize for the extremely long post, but I have added Deems questions
below, I figured if he asked, many more will have the same questions....
1. How did you determine which spring type/size/strength to use?
OK, you busted me!! I didn't do the math, I feel extremely guilty
about this, as an engineer, I should probably go back and figure the
forces here. Here is what I did; since I grew up in the business of
garage doors (my Dad owned his own company doing this), I went to Fleet
Farm (one of our local supply houses, similar to most lumbar yards) and
found a garage door spring that had an ID that would slide over the
rudder bar with room to spare, and would fit between the two rudder bars
(I will measure this for you). I then cut lengths of the spring until I
got what I 'thought' was a reasonable amount of force with two turns of
pre-load, and bent some custom ends on them. With torsion springs you
have two options to increase the reaction force. You can add turns of
pre-load, or you can shorten the spring with the same number of turns.
I just went until I reached what I 'felt' was a happy medium. Remember
that as you wind a torsion spring more and more the inside diameter
decreases, until it eventually binds on the shaft (rudder bar). What
mostly drove me not to do the math, was I had absolutely no idea what
sort of corrective rudder pressure was required to put the ball in the
middle. My plan all along has been to get it in the air and do some
experimenting, I installed the system so that modification of the spring
force should be simple. I just need to start dating a contortionist :)
2. I assume that you can 'adjust the torsional load somewhat by moving
the collar/s, Is that true?
Correct, I started out with each spring wound an equal amount. If I
find that I need additional trim to one side or the other I will wind
one of the springs to compensate. The servo will just provide the 'fine
tuning'.
3. One of the pictures shows the center support brace minus the delrin
bushings, I'm assuming that leaving those out is not a requirement of
your approach and was just the result of taking the picture before
they
were installed?
Correct, in fact there isn't a single modification to the airframe, if
I remove the system no one could ever tell it was installed. I built
the mount so that it could be used in either the forward or aft rudder
mounting positions, my pedals are mounted in the aft position. But I
drilled and prepped the airframe to mount the rudder pedals in either
position.
4. What about the mount for the RAC servo, do you have a picture of it
before the servo is mounted.
See attached.... The angle was determined by something, I just don't
recall what anymore. I know it has to be at an angle to work though. I
can measure if you decide to attempt this.
5. Also it' looks like you used a small section of SS cable to connect
the servo arm to the spring coil, correct? Picture?
Correct, see attached. One end is run through the servo arm, the
other gets hooked by the spring. The spring on the pilot side is hooked
over the opposite rudder bar.
I gave some thought to your desire to have a manually operated system,
I think this system could be done manually with very little pain. You
may be able to add a knob that would come out of the sub panel, really
anywhere along its length. What would have to happen is a bracket would
need to be made that slid over the rudder bar with a nut in it. Then a
threaded shaft running from the rudder bar to the sub panel would be
used to adjust the free arm of the spring. It may be best if the spring
were pushed by the shaft instead of pulled, as this would make the
mechanism a bit simpler. I could do a drawing of what I am thinking if
you are not following.
While it was not my intention to begin producing kits, if there is
enough interest, I could be persuaded to fabricate a few.
Thanks, Jason
Jason Kreidler - 40617 Finishing
(4 Partner Build)
________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Feb 22, 2008
From: Rick Sked <ricksked(at)embarqmail.com>
Subject: Re: Rudder Trim - Spring Bias
Very Cool!!! Like the torsion springs in a garage door....good thinking. Bu
t alas...I ain't crawling under that panel one more time.
Rick S.
40185
----- Original Message -----
From: "jason kreidler" <jason.kreidler(at)regalbeloit.com>
Sent: Friday, February 22, 2008 9:55:17 AM (GMT-0800) America/Los_Angeles
Subject: RV10-List: Rudder Trim - Spring Bias
I have 'developed' a spring bias rudder trim system for the RV-10. =C2-Af
ter sharing this idea with Deems he encouraged me to do the same with the r
est of the group. =C2-So here goes, but before I get into any details let
me preface this whole conversation with a few thoughts. =C2-This is all
in theory, I have absolutely no actual flight testing to back up any of the
'claims', or assumptions. =C2-Just good old common sense and a tiny bit
of engineering. =C2-Our airplane is not in the air yet, I had hoped to ge
t in the air, prove out the system, then share with the world. =C2-To pre
vent anyone else for possibly needlessly cutting into their rudder to add a
trim tab, I have decided to bear the scrutiny of an unproven, theoretical
system. =C2-Please be gentle...
I will attempt to verbalize the system. =C2-I used two torsion springs, o
ne mounted / wrapped around, each rudder bar (the bar that connects the rud
der pedals). =C2-One of the springs is fixed on both ends providing a tor
sional force on the rudder bar. =C2-The other springs free end is hooked
to a servo motor that allows approximately 30 degrees deflection. =C2-The
theory is that the two springs will seek equilibrium (OK, that's not much
theory, that's more fact), here is where the testing needs to happen. =C2
-If I deflect the one springs free arm 30 degrees, will it create enough
force to put the airplane in trim. =C2-The springs apply about an 8 pound
force to the rudder cables (pre-load if you will), assuming they will want
to maintain in equilibrium a 30 degree deflection should be more than enou
gh to trim the airplane. =C2-The servo will act as sort of a fine tuning
mechanism, the course adjustment will be accomplished by winding more or le
ss tension in one spring or the other during flight testing.
I like a few things about this method.
1) It can be installed to any flying airplane with no modifications require
d other than wiring.
2) There is a chance that this system could be made manual and eliminate th
e RAC servo if desired.
3) This system provides tension to both rudder cables, no more 'flopping ru
dder'.
4) Keeps the rudder 'clean'.
5) Doesn't add much extra rudder input force.
I sent pictures of this system to Deems, I will 'attempt' to post some pict
ures to this forum if there is interest. =C2-Comments welcome, I apologiz
e for the extremely long post, but I have added Deems questions below, I fi
gured if he asked, many more will have the same questions....
1. How did you determine which spring type/size/strength to use?
OK, you busted me!! =C2-I didn't do the math, I feel extremely guilty abo
ut this, as an engineer, I should probably go back and figure the forces he
re. =C2-Here is what I did; since I grew up in the business of garage doo
rs (my Dad owned his own company doing this), I went to Fleet Farm (one of
our local supply houses, similar to most lumbar yards) and found a garage d
oor spring that had an ID that would slide over the rudder bar with room to
spare, and would fit between the two rudder bars (I will measure this for
you). =C2-I then cut lengths of the spring until I got what I 'thought' w
as a reasonable amount of force with two turns of pre-load, and bent some c
ustom ends on them. =C2-With torsion springs you have two options to incr
ease the reaction force. =C2-You can add turns of pre-load, or you can sh
orten the spring with the same number of turns. =C2-I just went until I r
eached what I 'felt' was a happy medium. =C2-Remember that as you wind a
torsion spring more and more the inside diameter decreases, until it eventu
ally binds on the shaft (rudder bar). =C2-What mostly drove me not to do
the math, was I had absolutely no idea what sort of corrective rudder press
ure was required to put the ball in the middle. =C2-My plan all along has
been to get it in the air and do some experimenting, I installed the syste
m so that modification of the spring force should be simple. =C2-I just n
eed to start dating a contortionist :)
2. I assume that you can 'adjust the torsional load somewhat by moving
the collar/s, Is that true?
Correct, I started out with each spring wound an equal amount. =C2-If I f
ind that I need additional trim to one side or the other I will wind one of
the springs to compensate. =C2-The servo will just provide the 'fine tun
ing'.
3. One of the pictures shows the center support brace minus the delrin
bushings, I'm assuming that leaving those out is not a requirement of
your approach and was just the result of taking the picture before they
were installed?
Correct, in fact there isn't a single modification to the airframe, if I re
move the system no one could ever tell it was installed. =C2-I built the
mount so that it could be used in either the forward or aft rudder mounting
positions, my pedals are mounted in the aft position. =C2-But I drilled
and prepped the airframe to mount the rudder pedals in either position.
4. What about the mount for the RAC servo, do you have a picture of it
before the servo is mounted.
See attached.... =C2-The angle was determined by something, I just don't
recall what anymore. =C2-I know it has to be at an angle to work though.
=C2-I can measure if you decide to attempt this.
5. Also it' looks like you used a small section of SS cable to connect
the servo arm to the spring coil, correct? Picture?
Correct, see attached. =C2-One end is run through the servo arm, the othe
r gets hooked by the spring. =C2-The spring on the pilot side is hooked o
ver the opposite rudder bar.
I gave some thought to your desire to have a manually operated system, I th
ink this system could be done manually with very little pain. =C2-You may
be able to add a knob that would come out of the sub panel, really anywher
e along its length. =C2-What would have to happen is a bracket would need
to be made that slid over the rudder bar with a nut in it. =C2-Then a th
readed shaft running from the rudder bar to the sub panel would be used to
adjust the free arm of the spring. =C2-It may be best if the spring were
pushed by the shaft instead of pulled, as this would make the mechanism a b
it simpler. =C2-I could do a drawing of what I am thinking if you are not
following.
While it was not my intention to begin producing kits, if there is enough i
nterest, I could be persuaded to fabricate a few.
Thanks, Jason
Jason Kreidler - 40617 Finishing
(4 Partner Build)
====
=======================
===
________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Dave Saylor" <Dave(at)AirCraftersLLC.com>
Subject: Amendment and Revision to Kit Building Rules - Where's
the Leadership?
Date: Feb 22, 2008
Deems,
The ARC did agree on a few things. We agreed that flagrant pro building
exists and that it should not, and we agreed on several fixes to the current
system.
Where we disagreed most significantly was in how to define the major
portion. No one thought we should count hours or dollars. No one wanted a
rivet (epoxy/thread/grain) count. I believe the rule was poorly written and
has somehow managed to serve us anyway. A lot of credit for the success of
the current situation is, I believe, that initially there was not any real
financial incentive to pro building. Back in the day you could buy a nice
plane for less effort than you or a pro could build one. When that equation
started to change, pro building became worthwhile and there wasn't anyone
enforcing the fact that it was not within the rules. It was a cottage
industry.
Now that there is real money involved (several hundred million dollars by my
accounting--very little mine >:-(), you are correct in that the parties at
the table mainly had their interests in mind. Everyone wants it to work for
himself after it all shakes out. You are also correct in that the committee
was pretty well balanced in terms of personalities so that no one party
emerged as the leader for the rest of us to rally around. I don't think
that was intentional when the committee members were selected. I think the
FAA wanted a broad and representative sample of the industry and that's what
they got. Earl Lawrence from EAA was helpful and did stand up for its
membership and the industry as well as he could, especially considering that
a workable definition of "major portion" is such a slippery critter.
I think there is an elegant solution that has not yet surfaced. I hope that
with more input from more people it will show itself. I don't really think
that amateur building is in much danger. Violaters will probaly not be
tolerated much longer, but those who've gotten away with it so far, I think,
are pretty safe. FAA lawyers made it pretty clear that pursuing what's
already happened under current conditions would be difficult to impossible.
Write those letters!
Thanks for listening,
Dave Saylor
AirCrafters LLC
140 Aviation Way
Watsonville, CA
831-722-9141
831-750-0284 CL
www.AirCraftersLLC.com
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Deems Davis
Sent: Friday, February 22, 2008 7:22 AM
Subject: Re: RV10-List: Amendment and Revision to Kit Building Rules -
Where's the Leadership?
It's too bad the ARC couldn't agree on proposed rule changes, (for
'economic' reasons) so now we're left with the FAA drafting the changes.
Its fairly obvious that based on the varied interests of the representative
parties, that ANY changes that were considered were going to result in a
financial hit to at least one of the represented segments. In this business
world this is what happens when there is a Leadership void. Which is what I
see happening here. What I find personally extremely disappointing is that
the EAA, who at one time was the best representative for 'us' (homebuilders)
seems to have become a victim of the 'special interests' and has followed
vs. lead on this one.
My letter is on it's way.
Deems Davis # 406
'Its all done....Its just not put together'
http://deemsrv10.com/
> *
> *
________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: OSH RV-10 Operatonr seminar was: Establishing gross weight
Date: Feb 22, 2008
From: "John W. Cox" <johnwcox(at)pacificnw.com>
Purging important old posts and converting some to PDFs for research.
We should contact AirVenture about a meeting tent to discuss RV-10
Operating Issues like the Lancair boys. We have plenty flying now and
could pack a tent.
What say you? We could segway right into Pilot Proficiency.
EAA asked if I wanted to be a Featured Speaker. I can at least find out
how to reserve a tent.
JC
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Deems Davis
Sent: Friday, May 18, 2007 5:42 AM
Subject: RV10-List: OSH RV-10 Operatonr seminar was: Establishing gross
weight
Let's do it!
How can we make this happen?
I'm willing to assist, with the caveat, that I am NOT qualified to
provide the content but willing to help assist in the organization,
administration and delivery.
Perhaps this could be a step towards a Pilot Proficiency program?
Deems Davis # 406
Finishing - ( A Misnomer ! )
http://deemsrv10.com/
John W. Cox wrote:
> OSH
>
> Anybody want to talk about an RV-10 Operator's Seminar at OSH like
> Lancair does? So we can hammer out these issues.
>
> John Cox
>
> *
> *
________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Rudder Trim - Spring Bias
From: "johngoodman" <johngoodman(at)earthlink.net>
Date: Feb 23, 2008
Jason,
I love it! Simple, clean, and easy to install or remove. You've sold me on it.
If you decide to make a few, sign me up.
John
jkreidler wrote:
> Enclosed are a few photographs....
>
> Thanks, Jason
>
> Jason Kreidler - 40617 Finishing
> (4 Partner Build)
--------
#40572 QB Fuselage, wings finished
N711JG reserved
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=165729#165729
________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: OSH RV-10 Operatonr seminar was: Establishing gross weight
From: "johngoodman" <johngoodman(at)earthlink.net>
Date: Feb 23, 2008
Excellent idea. Go for it.
By the way, anybody going to Sun 'n fun? I plan on arriving day one and staying
until I'm bored. I'm driving down so there will be at least one RV-10 builder
there with a car (actually a six seat Chevy 4wd pickup).
John
--------
#40572 QB Fuselage, wings finished
N711JG reserved
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=165734#165734
________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Feb 23, 2008
From: Deems Davis <deemsdavis(at)cox.net>
Subject: Re: OSH RV-10 Operatons seminar
I think this is a great idea, and the time should be right, there are
enough flying RV-10's to where there's some really valuable
information/data that could be assembled and disseminated at such an
event. In fact I could see the possibility for several sessions, each
with a different focus. I don't know what the availability of the tents
might be, but there' always the possibility of 'carry-over' sessions
occurring @ RV-10 HQ in the evening. Some thoughts about possible topics:
1st flight:
Preparation for
Sharing of Stage ! test plans/scripts
Here's what I learned during Stage 1
Maintenance issues - What to look for and to keep your eyes open to.
Performance data - Let's publish a standard/simple performance recording
procedure and ask as many -10's as possible to fly it and report.
Insuring your RV-10
How do you fly your -10?
ROP/LOP
TO/Landing
CG issues (nose heavy?)
Deems Davis # 406
'Its all done....Its just not put together'
http://deemsrv10.com/
John W. Cox wrote:
>
> Purging important old posts and converting some to PDFs for research.
>
> We should contact AirVenture about a meeting tent to discuss RV-10
> Operating Issues like the Lancair boys. We have plenty flying now and
> could pack a tent.
>
> What say you? We could segway right into Pilot Proficiency.
>
> EAA asked if I wanted to be a Featured Speaker. I can at least find out
> how to reserve a tent.
>
> JC
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Deems Davis
> Sent: Friday, May 18, 2007 5:42 AM
> To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com
> Subject: RV10-List: OSH RV-10 Operatonr seminar was: Establishing gross
> weight
>
>
> Let's do it!
>
> How can we make this happen?
>
> I'm willing to assist, with the caveat, that I am NOT qualified to
> provide the content but willing to help assist in the organization,
> administration and delivery.
>
> Perhaps this could be a step towards a Pilot Proficiency program?
>
> Deems Davis # 406
> Finishing - ( A Misnomer ! )
> http://deemsrv10.com/
>
> John W. Cox wrote:
>
>> OSH
>>
>> Anybody want to talk about an RV-10 Operator's Seminar at OSH like
>> Lancair does? So we can hammer out these issues.
>>
>> John Cox
>>
>> *
>> *
>>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
From: "bob.kaufmann" <bob.kaufmann(at)cox.net>
Subject: Re: Rudder Trim - Spring Bias
Date: Feb 23, 2008
Somehow I seem to not have the pictures, where can I see them.
Bob K
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of johngoodman
Sent: Saturday, February 23, 2008 7:36 AM
Subject: RV10-List: Re: Rudder Trim - Spring Bias
Jason,
I love it! Simple, clean, and easy to install or remove. You've sold me on
it. If you decide to make a few, sign me up.
John
jkreidler wrote:
> Enclosed are a few photographs....
>
> Thanks, Jason
>
> Jason Kreidler - 40617 Finishing
> (4 Partner Build)
--------
#40572 QB Fuselage, wings finished
N711JG reserved
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=165729#165729
________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Feb 23, 2008
From: Deems Davis <deemsdavis(at)cox.net>
Subject: Re: Amendment and Revision to Kit Building Rules - Where's
the Leadership?
Thanks for the insight Dave, and Thanks also for volunteering to spend
your time on this issue. I'm just another 'special interest' that
doesn't' want the abuses of a few to end up limiting or restricting the
abilities of the critical amateur mass. Having already written and sent
my letter, I'll calm back down and now wait for the NPRM and hope that
the right things happen.
Deems Davis # 406
'Its all done....Its just not put together'
http://deemsrv10.com/
Dave Saylor wrote:
>
> Deems,
>
> The ARC did agree on a few things. We agreed that flagrant pro building
> exists and that it should not, and we agreed on several fixes to the current
> system.
>
> Where we disagreed most significantly was in how to define the major
> portion. No one thought we should count hours or dollars. No one wanted a
> rivet (epoxy/thread/grain) count. I believe the rule was poorly written and
> has somehow managed to serve us anyway. A lot of credit for the success of
> the current situation is, I believe, that initially there was not any real
> financial incentive to pro building. Back in the day you could buy a nice
> plane for less effort than you or a pro could build one. When that equation
> started to change, pro building became worthwhile and there wasn't anyone
> enforcing the fact that it was not within the rules. It was a cottage
> industry.
>
> Now that there is real money involved (several hundred million dollars by my
> accounting--very little mine >:-(), you are correct in that the parties at
> the table mainly had their interests in mind. Everyone wants it to work for
> himself after it all shakes out. You are also correct in that the committee
> was pretty well balanced in terms of personalities so that no one party
> emerged as the leader for the rest of us to rally around. I don't think
> that was intentional when the committee members were selected. I think the
> FAA wanted a broad and representative sample of the industry and that's what
> they got. Earl Lawrence from EAA was helpful and did stand up for its
> membership and the industry as well as he could, especially considering that
> a workable definition of "major portion" is such a slippery critter.
>
> I think there is an elegant solution that has not yet surfaced. I hope that
> with more input from more people it will show itself. I don't really think
> that amateur building is in much danger. Violaters will probaly not be
> tolerated much longer, but those who've gotten away with it so far, I think,
> are pretty safe. FAA lawyers made it pretty clear that pursuing what's
> already happened under current conditions would be difficult to impossible.
>
> Write those letters!
>
> Thanks for listening,
>
> Dave Saylor
> AirCrafters LLC
> 140 Aviation Way
> Watsonville, CA
> 831-722-9141
> 831-750-0284 CL
> www.AirCraftersLLC.com
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Bob Leffler" <rv(at)thelefflers.com>
Subject: OSH RV-10 Operatons seminar
Date: Feb 23, 2008
When I inquired last year the forum pavilions were available in the evening,
but that was about 6 weeks before Airventure. We may be early enough to
find a location during the day.
While clearly not an expert yet on most RV-10 topics, I would be willing to
assist with organizing or with any other tasks that need to be done.
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Deems Davis
Sent: Saturday, February 23, 2008 10:50 AM
Subject: Re: RV10-List: OSH RV-10 Operatons seminar
I think this is a great idea, and the time should be right, there are
enough flying RV-10's to where there's some really valuable
information/data that could be assembled and disseminated at such an
event. In fact I could see the possibility for several sessions, each
with a different focus. I don't know what the availability of the tents
might be, but there' always the possibility of 'carry-over' sessions
occurring @ RV-10 HQ in the evening. Some thoughts about possible topics:
1st flight:
Preparation for
Sharing of Stage ! test plans/scripts
Here's what I learned during Stage 1
Maintenance issues - What to look for and to keep your eyes open to.
Performance data - Let's publish a standard/simple performance recording
procedure and ask as many -10's as possible to fly it and report.
Insuring your RV-10
How do you fly your -10?
ROP/LOP
TO/Landing
CG issues (nose heavy?)
Deems Davis # 406
'Its all done....Its just not put together'
http://deemsrv10.com/
John W. Cox wrote:
>
> Purging important old posts and converting some to PDFs for research.
>
> We should contact AirVenture about a meeting tent to discuss RV-10
> Operating Issues like the Lancair boys. We have plenty flying now and
> could pack a tent.
>
> What say you? We could segway right into Pilot Proficiency.
>
> EAA asked if I wanted to be a Featured Speaker. I can at least find out
> how to reserve a tent.
>
> JC
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Deems Davis
> Sent: Friday, May 18, 2007 5:42 AM
> To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com
> Subject: RV10-List: OSH RV-10 Operatonr seminar was: Establishing gross
> weight
>
>
> Let's do it!
>
> How can we make this happen?
>
> I'm willing to assist, with the caveat, that I am NOT qualified to
> provide the content but willing to help assist in the organization,
> administration and delivery.
>
> Perhaps this could be a step towards a Pilot Proficiency program?
>
> Deems Davis # 406
> Finishing - ( A Misnomer ! )
> http://deemsrv10.com/
>
> John W. Cox wrote:
>
>> OSH
>>
>> Anybody want to talk about an RV-10 Operator's Seminar at OSH like
>> Lancair does? So we can hammer out these issues.
>>
>> John Cox
>>
>> *
>> *
>>
>
>
>
__________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature
database 2897 (20080222) __________
The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus.
__________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature
database 2897 (20080222) __________
The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus.
________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: OSH RV-10 Operatons seminar
Date: Feb 23, 2008
From: "John W. Cox" <johnwcox(at)pacificnw.com>
The worst time for a reserved discussion area was after 3:00PM and when
the late Jimmy Franklin would fly his Jet Assisted WACO or a Harrier
Demo performed during the airshow. Seems like a successful time slot
just before the Airshow and later in the week (WED/THU/FRI) might hold
the greatest potential for attendance. When the airshow ends, the whole
culture and traffic considerations at Air Venture Change abruptly. In
the evening we might need to add other considerations like hunger or
Thunderstorm avoidance on the airport grounds.
Construction Mods, Calculations of amended GW, Phase One Compliance,
Transition Training, EFIS setup and testing, flight performance numbers
and first person stories might hold a crowd even during the noise. It
is best to request an area even before Sun N Fun kick into gear.
I say we forward our ideas to Deems for validation and screening. Then
we can outreach for the best panel speakers from the RV-10 family. Tim
can you contact OSH or Mike are you listening?
John
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Bob Leffler
Sent: Saturday, February 23, 2008 9:40 AM
Subject: RE: RV10-List: OSH RV-10 Operatons seminar
When I inquired last year the forum pavilions were available in the
evening,
but that was about 6 weeks before Airventure. We may be early enough
to
find a location during the day.
While clearly not an expert yet on most RV-10 topics, I would be willing
to
assist with organizing or with any other tasks that need to be done.
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Deems Davis
Sent: Saturday, February 23, 2008 10:50 AM
Subject: Re: RV10-List: OSH RV-10 Operatons seminar
I think this is a great idea, and the time should be right, there are
enough flying RV-10's to where there's some really valuable
information/data that could be assembled and disseminated at such an
event. In fact I could see the possibility for several sessions, each
with a different focus. I don't know what the availability of the tents
might be, but there' always the possibility of 'carry-over' sessions
occurring @ RV-10 HQ in the evening. Some thoughts about possible
topics:
1st flight:
Preparation for
Sharing of Stage ! test plans/scripts
Here's what I learned during Stage 1
Maintenance issues - What to look for and to keep your eyes open to.
Performance data - Let's publish a standard/simple performance recording
procedure and ask as many -10's as possible to fly it and report.
Insuring your RV-10
How do you fly your -10?
ROP/LOP
TO/Landing
CG issues (nose heavy?)
Deems Davis # 406
'Its all done....Its just not put together'
http://deemsrv10.com/
________________________________________________________________________________
From: speckter(at)comcast.net
Subject: Re: OSH RV-10 Operatons seminar
Date: Feb 23, 2008
I have not talked with Bob Condry yet, but I will be at OSH early again this year
and will help stake out a HQ up close.
Bob, do we want to do the reservations like we did last year or modify?
Gary
40274
-------------- Original message --------------
From: Deems Davis <deemsdavis(at)cox.net>
>
> I think this is a great idea, and the time should be right, there are
> enough flying RV-10's to where there's some really valuable
> information/data that could be assembled and disseminated at such an
> event. In fact I could see the possibility for several sessions, each
> with a different focus. I don't know what the availability of the tents
> might be, but there' always the possibility of 'carry-over' sessions
> occurring @ RV-10 HQ in the evening. Some thoughts about possible topics:
>
> 1st flight:
> Preparation for
> Sharing of Stage ! test plans/scripts
> Here's what I learned during Stage 1
> Maintenance issues - What to look for and to keep your eyes open to.
> Performance data - Let's publish a standard/simple performance recording
> procedure and ask as many -10's as possible to fly it and report.
> Insuring your RV-10
> How do you fly your -10?
> ROP/LOP
> TO/Landing
> CG issues (nose heavy?)
>
>
> Deems Davis # 406
> 'Its all done....Its just not put together'
> http://deemsrv10.com/
>
>
> John W. Cox wrote:
> >
> > Purging important old posts and converting some to PDFs for research.
> >
> > We should contact AirVenture about a meeting tent to discuss RV-10
> > Operating Issues like the Lancair boys. We have plenty flying now and
> > could pack a tent.
> >
> > What say you? We could segway right into Pilot Proficiency.
> >
> > EAA asked if I wanted to be a Featured Speaker. I can at least find out
> > how to reserve a tent.
> >
> > JC
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com
> > [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Deems Davis
> > Sent: Friday, May 18, 2007 5:42 AM
> > To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com
> > Subject: RV10-List: OSH RV-10 Operatonr seminar was: Establishing gross
> > weight
> >
> >
> > Let's do it!
> >
> > How can we make this happen?
> >
> > I'm willing to assist, with the caveat, that I am NOT qualified to
> > provide the content but willing to help assist in the organization,
> > administration and delivery.
> >
> > Perhaps this could be a step towards a Pilot Proficiency program?
> >
> > Deems Davis # 406
> > Finishing - ( A Misnomer ! )
> > http://deemsrv10.com/
> >
> > John W. Cox wrote:
> >
> >> OSH
> >>
> >> Anybody want to talk about an RV-10 Operator's Seminar at OSH like
> >> Lancair does? So we can hammer out these issues.
> >>
> >> John Cox
> >>
> >> *
> >> *
> >>
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>
>
>
>
I have not talked with Bob Condry yet, but I will be at OSH early again this
year and will help stake out a HQ up close.
Bob, do we want to do the reservations like we did last year or modify?
Gary
40274
> --> RV10-List message posted by: Deems
Davis
>
> I think this is a great idea,
and the time should be right, there are
> enough flying RV-10's to where
there's some really valuable
> information/data that could be assembled
and disseminated at such an
> event. In fact I could see the possibility
for several sessions, each
> with a different focus. I don't know
what the availability of the tents
> might be, but there' always the possibility
of 'carry-over' sessions
> occurring @ RV-10 HQ in the evening.
Some thoughts about possible topics:
>
> 1st flight:
>
Preparation for
> Sharing of Stage ! test plans/scripts
> Here's
what I learned during Stage 1
> Maintenance
issues
- What to look for and to keep your eyes open to.
> Performance data - Let's publish a standard/simple performance recording
> procedure and ask as many -10's as possible to fly it and report.
> Insuring your RV-10
> How do you fly your -10?
> ROP/LOP
> TO/Landing
> CG issues (nose heavy?)
>
>
> Deems Davis # 406
> 'Its all done....Its just not put together'
> http://deemsrv10.com/
>
>
> John W. Cox wrote:
> > --> RV10-List message posted by: "John W. Cox"
> >
> > Purging important old posts and converting some to PDFs for research.
> >
> > We should contact AirVenture about a meeting tent to discuss RV-10
> > Operating Issues like the Lancair boys. We have plenty flying now and
> > could pack a tent.
> >
> > What say you? We could segway right into Pilot P
rofici
ency. <BR>> > <BR>> > EAA asked if I wanted to be a Featured Speaker. I can at least find out <BR>> > how to reserve a tent. <BR>> > <BR>> > JC <BR>> > <BR>> > -----Original Message----- <BR>> > From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com <BR>> > [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Deems Davis <BR>> > Sent: Friday, May 18, 2007 5:42 AM <BR>> > To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com <BR>> > Subject: RV10-List: OSH RV-10 Operatonr seminar was: Establishing gross <BR>> > weight <BR>> > <BR>> > --> RV10-List message posted by: Deems Davis <DEEMSDAVIS(at)COX.NET><BR>> > <BR>> > Let's do it! <BR>> > <BR>> > How can we make this happen? <BR>> > <BR>> > I'm willing to assist, with the caveat, that I am NOT qualified to <BR>> > provide the content but willing to help assist in the organization, <BR>> > administration and delivery. <BR>>
; >
lities
________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: OSH RV-10 Operatons seminar
From: "bcondrey" <bob.condrey(at)baesystems.com>
Date: Feb 23, 2008
Gary,
I will also be there again early but haven't really done any planning yet. I thought
last year worked OK, but if somebody had ideas for improvements I'm all
ears.
BTW, last year folks were very generous with their contributions during our various
"food nights" and we overachieved a bit... I plan to use the excess collected
to partially offset cost for an extra site to give us more room for gathering
and socializing for the group.
We can plan more when it gets a little closer.
Bob
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=165837#165837
________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Rudder Trim - Spring Bias
From: "jkreidler" <jason.kreidler(at)regalbeloit.com>
Date: Feb 23, 2008
All, thanks for the encouraging comments both on-line and off. I really didn't
expect this sort of interest. With that being said, I would really like to find
a willing participant to test this on a flying RV-10. We are several months
away from our fist flight, I don't think everyone has that sort of time available.
If anyone would be interested in helping out with this sort of testing
please let me know.
I am really surprised at the number of people who expressed interest in installing
a kit (once the system is working). I have decided to create a kit of parts
once the concept is reality.
As far as using this kit on an RV-7, I have a friend building a 7 not far from
where I live, I will stop by his house and measure it all up and see if it will
work.
If you are still unable to view the pictures please send me an e-mail, I would
be happy to e-mail copies.
Thanks again everyone!!
Jason - 40617 Finishing
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=165844#165844
________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Request of those flying (was Rudder Trim - Spring Bias)
From: "jkreidler" <jason.kreidler(at)regalbeloit.com>
Date: Feb 23, 2008
"Also, if you need 30 degrees of pedal movement to hold the airplane in trim, I
suspect you have something else very wrong going on so that should be plenty."
Just to clarify, I am not suggesting that a thirty degree deflection of the free
leg of the spring will produce thirty degrees of pedal movement. The thirty
degree deflection is the amount of bias available to produce a much smaller movement
of the actual rudder. Because the first spring is counteracting the second
spring, the difference in the induced tension between the two is your ability
to trim.
Thanks, Jason
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=165847#165847
________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Bob Leffler" <rv(at)thelefflers.com>
Subject: N410BL Flies!
Date: Feb 23, 2008
Well, at least the empennage... :^)
With the assistance of the family, we hoisted the empennage using a couple
bicycle hoists. Now my wife can get her car back into the garage.
Unfortunately, it's a couple days too late. We've had freezing rain here
the last couple of days.
Bob
#40684
mykitlog.com/rleffler
________________________________________________________________________________
From: speckter(at)comcast.net
Subject: Re: OSH RV-10 Operatons seminar
Date: Feb 24, 2008
I looked at the calendar and we will probably arrive at OSH on the 21 on Monday
again and we can stake out the sites on Tues the 22. If you want to be the treasurer
again, I would be greatful.
Gary
-------------- Original message --------------
From: "bcondrey" <bob.condrey(at)baesystems.com>
>
> Gary,
>
> I will also be there again early but haven't really done any planning yet. I
> thought last year worked OK, but if somebody had ideas for improvements I'm all
> ears.
>
> BTW, last year folks were very generous with their contributions during our
> various "food nights" and we overachieved a bit... I plan to use the excess
> collected to partially offset cost for an extra site to give us more room for
> gathering and socializing for the group.
>
> We can plan more when it gets a little closer.
>
> Bob
>
>
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=165837#165837
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
I looked at the calendar and we will probably arrive at OSH on the 21 on Monday
again and we can stake out the sites on Tues the 22. If you want to
be the treasurer again, I would be greatful.
Gary
> --> RV10-List message posted
by: "bcondrey"
>
> Gary,
>
>
I will also be there again early but haven't really done any planning
yet. I
> thought last year worked OK, but if somebody had ideas for improvements
I'm all
> ears.
>
> BTW, last year folks were very
generous with their contributions during our
> various "food nights"
and we overachieved a bit... I plan to use the excess
> collected to
partially offset cost for an extra site to give us more room for
> gathering
and socializing for the group.
>
> We can plan more when it
gets a little closer.
>
> Bob
>
>
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
> >
-->
________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Rudder Peddle Position
From: "orchidman" <gary(at)wingscc.com>
Date: Feb 23, 2008
Ok all you flyers and near flyers, did you position your rudder peddles in the
forward or aft set of bolt holes?
Thanks to the excellent plans, it you blink you miss completely the fact that there
are 2 sets of bolt holes that can be used to set the for and aft positioning
of the rudder peddles. Section 38 page 4 shows the 6 holes in the F-1013
longeron and shows the F-1039B bracket being installed into the forward set of
holes but doesnt mention the aft set of holes and why you may or may not want
to use either. You then blindly proceed on and drill the F-1039D bracket for
the center support blocks based on the set of holes you used for the side blocks.
It is not until 38-10 where the secret is revealed when in step one you
make the Rudder Cable Links, either the Aft or Fwd based on the holes used previously.
Well I drilled the F-1039D bracket for both settings so I can go either way at
any time with out having to do any drilling in the future.
Here is my question, which location did you install your peddles, how tall are
you and do you feel that you were correct in the location you used? I know that
we have a fair amount of latitude due to the ability of move our seats forward
and aft. I can see tall pilots wanting the forward position, but at some
point smaller pilots would prefer the aft settings. The seat can only be moved
forward just so far before the stick starts getting in the way.
It would be nice if we could come up with some type of rule of thumb that would
say any one shorter then 5'8", then install in the Aft set.
--------
Gary Blankenbiller
RV10 - # 40674
Fuselage SB
(N410GB reserved)
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=165870#165870
________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Static ports
From: "tganster" <tganster(at)mwwb.net>
Date: Feb 23, 2008
Has anyone purchased the static ports offered by Vans?
Are they aluminum? Flush mount? Quality?
And by the way, my wife and I will be at SnF Wed. through Sun. and would love
to get together with other builders.
--------
Tom Ganster 40778 Tailcone
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=165871#165871
________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: RVator
From: "tganster" <tganster(at)mwwb.net>
Date: Feb 23, 2008
I have not seen the first installment of the electronic form of rvator yet. Does
anyone know when the first issue of the year usually comes out and how to access
it?
--------
Tom Ganster 40778 Tailcone
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=165873#165873
________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Feb 23, 2008
From: Rick Sked <ricksked(at)embarqmail.com>
Subject: Re: RVator
Late Feb 08,,, last Van's said..Yeah I know it's already the 23rd...gives thme
a few more days... I still like opening the mailbox and finding the RVator...makes
a long day seem better..
----- Original Message -----
From: "tganster" <tganster(at)mwwb.net>
Sent: Saturday, February 23, 2008 6:42:35 PM (GMT-0800) America/Los_Angeles
Subject: RV10-List: RVator
I have not seen the first installment of the electronic form of rvator yet. Does
anyone know when the first issue of the year usually comes out and how to access
it?
--------
Tom Ganster 40778 Tailcone
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=165873#165873
________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: OSH RV-10 Operatons seminar
Date: Feb 23, 2008
From: "Condrey, Bob (US SSA)" <bob.condrey(at)baesystems.com>
Sounds like a plan!
Bob
_____
From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of
speckter(at)comcast.net
Sent: Saturday, February 23, 2008 7:01 PM
Subject: Re: RV10-List: Re: OSH RV-10 Operatons seminar
I looked at the calendar and we will probably arrive at OSH on the 21 on
Monday again and we can stake out the sites on Tues the 22. If you want
to be the treasurer again, I would be greatful.
Gary
-------------- Original message --------------
From: "bcondrey" <bob.condrey(at)baesystems.com>
>
> Gary,
>
> I will also be there again early but haven't really done any
planning yet. I
> thought last year worked OK, but if somebody had ideas for
improvements I'm all
> ears.
>
> BTW, last year folks were very generous with their
contributions during our
> various "food nights" and we overachieved a bit... I plan to
use the excess
> collected to partially offset cost for an extra site to give
us more room for
> gathering and socializing for the group.
>
> We can plan more when it gets a little closer.
>
> Bob
>
>
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
> > -->
________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Rudder Peddle Position
From: "raddatz" <n667sr(at)comcast.net>
Date: Feb 24, 2008
Always and I don't care how tall you are, mount your rudder pedals as close to
the seats as possible for the following reasons:
1. It will allow you to sit further back, helping CG a little.
2. Gives you more stick to belly clearance at full up elevator.
3. Allows you to skip the extensions you have to make between the peddles and cables,
which makes the bottom of the peddle a few degrees closer to you helping
in not applying the brake until you want to.
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=165921#165921
________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: OSH RV-10 Operatons seminar
From: "ddnebert" <doug(at)mapcontext.com>
Date: Feb 24, 2008
I coordinated a forum on alternative fuels last year and just received forms to
propose a seminar this year. They are roughly 90 minutes long and I was able
to get the day I wanted last time. That time length is ideal for 3 speakers and
discussion -- so in addition to 'tentside chats' in the campground -- are
there three of you who'd like to put together materials/powerpoints for relevant
topics discussed earlier on the thread? If so I can get the slot in-process.
I'd need your names and topics and could proceed.
--------
RV-10 Builder #40546
Tail mostly done, wings complete, starting SB fuse
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=165937#165937
________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Lack of Install Instructions TruTrak
Date: Feb 25, 2008
From: "McGANN, Ron" <ron.mcgann(at)baesystems.com>
Here is a supplement to AirMike's invaluable post below.
"The brass screw is a shear pin - do not try and remove it!"
It shears easily - don't ask how I know ;-(. According to SteinAir, I am not the
first person to have done this! Tim O, maybe a useful inclusion in the RV
University?
The drive wheel should be carefully levered off with the brass screw in position.
Trutrak makes a great product, but their documentation is disgraceful.
Ron
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of AirMike
Sent: Monday, 26 November 2007 12:28 PM
Subject: RV10-List: Re: Lack of Install Instructions TruTrak
Pitch Servo Installation RV10
As supplied with torque enhancement rail 1. Confirm that a .20 hole has been drilled
in the proper position on the bellcrank per the plans for the RV10. Placement
and sizing of this hole is of the utmost importance.
2. If it came with your kit, remove (discard or use for another function) the pitch
servo bracket supplied by Vans Aircraft. Use only the pitch servo bracket
supplied with the autopilot servo by TruTrak.
3. Place the servo unit on a stable surface and remove the stainless steel screw
and nylon washer holding the drive wheel and torque rail to the drive shaft.
Carefully set the screw and nylon washer aside. Note the small brass screw on
the drive wheel so that you can reposition it in the same position as it is when
removed. Carefully pry or lift the drive wheel and torque rail off of the
drive shaft.
4. Take the drive wheel rail and torque rail. On the forward edge take the eyebolt
and screw the Rod end bearing #MM-3-300 into the torque rail approximately
half way, using the supplied standard nut as a locking device. Tighten the nut
against the aluminum torque rail.
5. Attach the servo bracket to the airframe per the photo supplied by TruTrak.
Please note that bracket is attached to the inside right line of bolts adjacent
to the bellcrank. Secure the (3) AN3 bolts and the (1) single AN515-8R8 screw
and torque to the proper value. Mark the torqued bolts with security paint or
colored nail polish.
6. Position the servo motor on the outside of the bracket in such a way as the
drive wheel protrudes thru the bracket and the four bolt holes on the bracket
line up with the four bolt holes on the servo motor. When you look at the servo
unit, the electric motor will be aft and the Connector plug part of the servo
will be forward with the connector plug facing outward (away from the bellcrank)
7. Attach the servo motor to the bracket using the four supplied AN3 bolts
and the rough washers. Secure the AN3 bolts and torque to the proper value.
Mark the torqued bolts with security paint or colored nail polish. Safety wire
the four bolts at your option.
8. Reposition the drive wheel in the same position as it is when removed. Reattach
the stainless steel screw and nylon washer to the drive shaft (now with the
attached eyebolt).
9. Secure the rod end to the bellcrank as follows: Insert supplied AN3 bolt through
the bellcrank from the pilot side insert aluminum spacer insert rod end
bearing insert large cadmium plated washer and secure these pieces with 10-32
lock nut. Torque to the proper value and mark the torqued bolts as before.
10. Check that , when moved, the toque rail clears the two retaining bolts on the
upper side of the servo motor.
11. This is a good time to be sure that you have made provision to install/secure
the static lines and install any needed security fittings for the wire/s that
operate the pitch servo unit.
--------
OSH '08 or Bust
Q/B Kit - Doors/windows/fiberglass stuff
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=148485#148485
"Warning:
The information contained in this email and any attached files is
confidential to BAE Systems Australia. If you are not the intended
recipient, any use, disclosure or copying of this email or any
attachments is expressly prohibited. If you have received this email
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________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Lack of Install Instructions TruTrak
Date: Feb 25, 2008
From: "McGANN, Ron" <ron.mcgann(at)baesystems.com>
Just checked Tim's site http://www.myrv10.com/N104CD/upgrades/20060816/index.html - there is a clear warning not to try and remove the screw - doh!!!
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of McGANN, Ron
Sent: Monday, 25 February 2008 8:44 AM
Subject: RV10-List: Lack of Install Instructions TruTrak
-->
Here is a supplement to AirMike's invaluable post below.
"The brass screw is a shear pin - do not try and remove it!"
It shears easily - don't ask how I know ;-(. According to SteinAir, I am not the
first person to have done this! Tim O, maybe a useful inclusion in the RV
University?
The drive wheel should be carefully levered off with the brass screw in position.
Trutrak makes a great product, but their documentation is disgraceful.
Ron
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of AirMike
Sent: Monday, 26 November 2007 12:28 PM
Subject: RV10-List: Re: Lack of Install Instructions TruTrak
Pitch Servo Installation RV10
As supplied with torque enhancement rail 1. Confirm that a .20 hole has been drilled
in the proper position on the bellcrank per the plans for the RV10. Placement
and sizing of this hole is of the utmost importance.
2. If it came with your kit, remove (discard or use for another function) the pitch
servo bracket supplied by Vans Aircraft. Use only the pitch servo bracket
supplied with the autopilot servo by TruTrak.
3. Place the servo unit on a stable surface and remove the stainless steel screw
and nylon washer holding the drive wheel and torque rail to the drive shaft.
Carefully set the screw and nylon washer aside. Note the small brass screw on
the drive wheel so that you can reposition it in the same position as it is when
removed. Carefully pry or lift the drive wheel and torque rail off of the
drive shaft.
4. Take the drive wheel rail and torque rail. On the forward edge take the eyebolt
and screw the Rod end bearing #MM-3-300 into the torque rail approximately
half way, using the supplied standard nut as a locking device. Tighten the nut
against the aluminum torque rail.
5. Attach the servo bracket to the airframe per the photo supplied by TruTrak.
Please note that bracket is attached to the inside right line of bolts adjacent
to the bellcrank. Secure the (3) AN3 bolts and the (1) single AN515-8R8 screw
and torque to the proper value. Mark the torqued bolts with security paint or
colored nail polish.
6. Position the servo motor on the outside of the bracket in such a way as the
drive wheel protrudes thru the bracket and the four bolt holes on the bracket
line up with the four bolt holes on the servo motor. When you look at the servo
unit, the electric motor will be aft and the Connector plug part of the servo
will be forward with the connector plug facing outward (away from the bellcrank)
7. Attach the servo motor to the bracket using the four supplied AN3 bolts
and the rough washers. Secure the AN3 bolts and torque to the proper value.
Mark the torqued bolts with security paint or colored nail polish. Safety wire
the four bolts at your option.
8. Reposition the drive wheel in the same position as it is when removed. Reattach
the stainless steel screw and nylon washer to the drive shaft (now with the
attached eyebolt).
9. Secure the rod end to the bellcrank as follows: Insert supplied AN3 bolt through
the bellcrank from the pilot side insert aluminum spacer insert rod end
bearing insert large cadmium plated washer and secure these pieces with 10-32
lock nut. Torque to the proper value and mark the torqued bolts as before.
10. Check that , when moved, the toque rail clears the two retaining bolts on the
upper side of the servo motor.
11. This is a good time to be sure that you have made provision to install/secure
the static lines and install any needed security fittings for the wire/s that
operate the pitch servo unit.
--------
OSH '08 or Bust
Q/B Kit - Doors/windows/fiberglass stuff
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=148485#148485
"Warning:
The information contained in this email and any attached files is confidential
to BAE Systems Australia. If you are not the intended recipient, any use, disclosure
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you have received this email in error, please notify us immediately. VIRUS:
Every care has been taken to ensure this email and its attachments are virus free,
however, any loss or damage incurred in using this email is not the sender's
responsibility. It is your responsibility to ensure virus checks are completed
before installing any data sent in this email to your computer."
"Warning:
The information contained in this email and any attached files is
confidential to BAE Systems Australia. If you are not the intended
recipient, any use, disclosure or copying of this email or any
attachments is expressly prohibited. If you have received this email
in error, please notify us immediately. VIRUS: Every care has been
taken to ensure this email and its attachments are virus free,
however, any loss or damage incurred in using this email is not the
sender's responsibility. It is your responsibility to ensure virus
checks are completed before installing any data sent in this email to
your computer."
________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Trimming wing tips
From: "johngoodman" <johngoodman(at)earthlink.net>
Date: Feb 24, 2008
Looking at the plans, it seems that a lot of material needs to be removed on the
wing tips. I think I've got it marked up right but I'd like a quick confidence
builder that I'm not overcutting.
John
--------
#40572 QB Fuselage, wings finished
N711JG reserved
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=166000#166000
________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Feb 24, 2008
From: Les Kearney <kearney(at)shaw.ca>
Subject: Things to order from Vans and others
Hi
I have been wandering through the Van's website looking for bits and bobs to
order along with a replacement for a piece of aluminium I turned into scrap
today.
I noticed that there is an aileron trim kit and was wondering how necessary
it is on the -10. Any comments? I seem to remember reading that the aileron
trim was not as necessary on the -10 as rudder trim.
I also saw *somewhere* some barrel connectors used to connect wires between
the wings & the fuse. Does anyone have a part number for these connectors?
Inquiring minds need to know
Les Kearney
#40643
C-GCWZ (reserved)
________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Trimming the cowling
From: "Lew Gallagher" <lewgall(at)charter.net>
Date: Feb 24, 2008
Hey Jim,
Just a follow up to tell you how much I appreciate your tape method. Today I used
it to mark the doors to fit the cabin. I made the first cut a hair outside
the line just in case I didn't get it quite right, but after sanding some, I
went right to the line and it's about perfect! How easy is that!
Thanks again. Later, - Lew
--------
non-pilot
crazy about building
NOW OFICIALLY BUILDER #40549
Landing gear installed, we're mobile!
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=166027#166027
________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Door pin alignment
From: "Lew Gallagher" <lewgall(at)charter.net>
Date: Feb 24, 2008
OK, we're about ready to start final fitting the doors and I'm reading ahead about
tapping the rod and making a center pin to thread into it ... just to mark
the center for where it hits the jamb?
Seems like a lot of trouble to go to just to mark a center. Has anybody stuck
a sharpie in there or anything? I didn't see anything on Tim's site about it
-- just thought I'd ask.
Later, - Lew
--------
non-pilot
crazy about building
NOW OFICIALLY BUILDER #40549
Landing gear installed, we're mobile!
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=166035#166035
________________________________________________________________________________
From: Jesse Saint <jesse(at)saintaviation.com>
Subject: Re: Things to order from Vans and others
Date: Feb 24, 2008
On the connectors, CPC Series 1 or 2 from www.mouser.com. Stein's
molex pin crimp tool is great for the series 1 and the D-sub crimper
for series 2 (the Series 2 machined closed barrel pins are the same as
the D-sub pins, but are only good up to 20 gauge wire, I think).
Jesse Saint
Saint Aviation, Inc.
jesse(at)saintaviation.com
Cell: 352-427-0285
Fax: 815-377-3694
On Feb 24, 2008, at 7:40 PM, Les Kearney wrote:
> Hi
>
> I have been wandering through the Van=92s website looking for bits and
> bobs to order along with a replacement for a piece of aluminium I
> turned into scrap today.
>
> I noticed that there is an aileron trim kit and was wondering how
> necessary it is on the -10. Any comments? I seem to remember reading
> that the aileron trim was not as necessary on the -10 as rudder trim.
>
> I also saw *somewhere* some barrel connectors used to connect wires
> between the wings & the fuse. Does anyone have a part number for
> these connectors?
>
> Inquiring minds need to know
>
> Les Kearney
> #40643
> C-GCWZ (reserved)
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
From: John Gonzalez <indigoonlatigo(at)msn.com>
Subject: Trimming wing tips
Date: Feb 24, 2008
YEPP, ALOT OF TRIMMING IS NEEDED. ALSO, ONCE YOU HAVE THE TIPS IN PLACE WIT
H THE NUTPLATES, BUT BEFORE YOU PUT IN THE TE. RIB, MARK THE AILERON TE ONT
O THE WING TIP WITH A STRAIGHT EDGE. I THINK IT WAS MY LEFT WINGTIP, IT WAS
ABOUT 1.25 INCHES TOO LONG. AMAZING QUALITY!!!> Subject: RV10-List: Trimmi
ng wing tips> From: johngoodman(at)earthlink.net> Date: Sun, 24 Feb 2008 14:48
"johngoodman" > > Looking at the plans, it seems
that a lot of material needs to be removed on the wing tips. I think I've
got it marked up right but I'd like a quick confidence builder that I'm not
overcutting.> John> > --------> #40572 QB Fuselage, wings finished> N711JG
reserved> > > > > Read this topic online here:> > http://forums.matronics.
========================> _
===============> > >
________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Feb 24, 2008
From: Les Kearney <kearney(at)shaw.ca>
Subject: Crimpers
Hi Again
I have been looking at electrical tools at the local electronics shop with a
view to acquiring the tools required to do my electrical system.
Not that I know much about these things, but the Paladin Tools seemed well
made. I was thinking of getting their Crimpall handles with dies for
insulated terminals, open barrel and D-sub pins.
Has anyone had experience with this brand of tools? Advice gratefully
appreciated.
Inquiring minds need to know
Les Kearney
#40643
C-GCWZ (reserved)
________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Windshield scratches
Date: Feb 24, 2008
From: John Jessen <n212pj(at)gmail.com>
Help! Scratches on windshield.............
Wanted to clean off the bugs and, using a nylon encased sponge, just about
put as many scratches on the windshield that I could do. Any advice
appreciated. I've looked up some products on ACS, but wondered if anyone
had had such a problem and found a solution that they could
recommend....PLEASE! Ugh.
John J
(on the GlaStar, not the unfinished -10)
________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Neal George" <n8zg(at)mchsi.com>
Subject: Crimpers
Date: Feb 24, 2008
Les -
I have a set of Paladin Crimpall handles and dies for PIDG terminals.
I'm VERY happy with it.
My D-sub crimper is also a Paladin, Model number PA1440.
Pretty satisfied with it, too.
Shop around. I think I paid about $80 total for both, new, including
shipping.
neal
RV-7 N8ZG
Baffled by Baffles
_____
From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Les Kearney
Sent: Sunday, February 24, 2008 9:30 PM
Subject: RV10-List: Crimpers
Hi Again
I have been looking at electrical tools at the local electronics shop with a
view to acquiring the tools required to do my electrical system.
Not that I know much about these things, but the Paladin Tools seemed well
made. I was thinking of getting their Crimpall handles with dies for
insulated terminals, open barrel and D-sub pins.
Has anyone had experience with this brand of tools? Advice gratefully
appreciated.
Inquiring minds need to know
Les Kearney
#40643
C-GCWZ (reserved)
href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List">http://www.matronics.com
/Navigator?RV10-List
href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com
href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c
________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Albert Gardner" <ibspud(at)roadrunner.com>
Subject: Door pin alignment
Date: Feb 24, 2008
I am not happy with the stock door/locking pin setup. They have several
problems that the aftermarket guys have solved. One of them is lack of a
door key lock. If I were doing it again I would spring for one of the better
door handles or at least the machined latching pins with the magnet built in
the pins. Check some the web sites of RV-10 builder and/or the list archives
for post concerning door handles. I wish I had spent some money and did mine
differently. Also, although my door had a really nice fit, after I put the
'P' seal on the door edge I had to do a lot of sanding to make my door close
and the fit isn't quite as nice. The location of the mechanism inside the
door is very far forward but it makes it a stretch to stand in back of the
wing and lean forward to unlatch and open the door. In spite of this I love
this plane.
Albert Gardner
N991RV
Yuma, AZ
-----Original Message-----
OK, we're about ready to start final fitting the doors and I'm reading ahead
about tapping the rod and making a center pin to thread into it ... just to
mark the center for where it hits the jamb?
Seems like a lot of trouble to go to just to mark a center. Has anybody
stuck a sharpie in there or anything? I didn't see anything on Tim's site
about it -- just thought I'd ask.
Later, - Lew
________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Feb 24, 2008
From: linn Walters <pitts_pilot(at)bellsouth.net>
Subject: Re: Windshield scratches
Get a Micro Mesh kit. Follow the instructions and use copious amounts
of water .... adding a little dish soap won't hurt either. Take your
time. You'll get some sore arm muscles in trade for a clear view.
Linn
John Jessen wrote:
> Help! Scratches on windshield.............
>
> Wanted to clean off the bugs and, using a nylon encased sponge, just
> about put as many scratches on the windshield that I could do. Any
> advice appreciated. I've looked up some products on ACS, but wondered
> if anyone had had such a problem and found a solution that they could
> recommend....PLEASE! Ugh.
>
> John J
> (on the GlaStar, not the unfinished -10)
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Albert Gardner" <ibspud(at)roadrunner.com>
Subject: Things to order from Vans and others
Date: Feb 24, 2008
Rudder trim is far more of a "nice but not really necessary" option than
aileron trim. The trim kit is very easy to install at any point or even
after the plane is finished. Put the 5 wire cable in place during
construction and plan ahead for space of the IP for a switch and
indicator
and you would be ready to add trim later. The kit is about $350 ordered
as
an option. Rudder trim at cruise can be a simple tab or wedge on the
rudder
as required but many of us would like to have adjustable rudder trim.
Albert Gardner
N991RV
Yuma, AZ
-----Original Message-----
Hi
I have been wandering through the Van's website looking for bits and
bobs to
order along with a replacement for a piece of aluminium I turned into
scrap
today.
I noticed that there is an aileron trim kit and was wondering how
necessary
it is on the -10. Any comments? I seem to remember reading that the
aileron
trim was not as necessary on the -10 as rudder trim.
I also saw *somewhere* some barrel connectors used to connect wires
between
the wings & the fuse. Does anyone have a part number for these
connectors?
Inquiring minds need to know
Les Kearney
#40643
C-GCWZ (reserved)
________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Feb 24, 2008
From: Les Kearney <kearney(at)shaw.ca>
Subject: Windshield scratches
John
Every year there is a chap at KOSH who flogs a 3M scratch repair kit similar
to:
http://www.skygeek.com/window-tools.html
I have watched while a window is scratch and the all the scratches are
polished out. I tried this on my PA218 a few years back and ended up just
replacing the window. If you try one of these products, get someone who
knows what they are doing to do it for you. My impression is that these
products can be very effective in the right hands.
Cheers
Les
_____
From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of John Jessen
Sent: February-24-08 8:47 PM
Subject: RV10-List: Windshield scratches
Help! Scratches on windshield.............
Wanted to clean off the bugs and, using a nylon encased sponge, just about
put as many scratches on the windshield that I could do. Any advice
appreciated. I've looked up some products on ACS, but wondered if anyone
had had such a problem and found a solution that they could
recommend....PLEASE! Ugh.
John J
(on the GlaStar, not the unfinished -10)
________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Windshield scratches
From: "eagerlee" <eagerlee(at)comcast.net>
Date: Feb 24, 2008
I believe you have two choices. The first one is messy - ruins the paint job: replace
the windscreen. The second one isn't as bad but probably takes just as
much time: buff out the scratches with progressively finer abrasive material.
The stuff you need comes in a kit with instructions. You start out coarse(400
grit?) and graduate up to 1800 or 2000 (crocus cloth?) with water. I've never
done it but I hear it works. Mask off anything you don't want to scratch while
you are removing scratches.
Paul Hahn
#40203
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=166062#166062
________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Feb 24, 2008
From: Tim Olson <Tim(at)MyRV10.com>
Subject: Re: Windshield scratches
I've used this kit before, on a couple different planes, and it
worked miracles.
http://www.aircraftspruce.com/catalog/cspages/scratchoff.php
It's called "Scratch Off".
I used it on all of my windows when I got done, to get rid of
any scratches I caused during construction.
Tim Olson - RV-10 N104CD - Flying
John Jessen wrote:
> Help! Scratches on windshield.............
>
> Wanted to clean off the bugs and, using a nylon encased sponge, just
> about put as many scratches on the windshield that I could do. Any
> advice appreciated. I've looked up some products on ACS, but wondered
> if anyone had had such a problem and found a solution that they could
> recommend....PLEASE! Ugh.
>
> John J
> (on the GlaStar, not the unfinished -10)
>
________________________________________________________________________________
From: "John Cleary" <john_rv10(at)yahoo.com>
Subject: Windshield scratches
Date: Feb 25, 2008
John,
This happened to an RV6 in our hangar. It was repaired by a chap who
does
motor cycle plastic repairs and after he finished you could not tell it
had
been done. The process was complex with many stages and he was clearly
masterful at it. Having seen it done, I wouldn=92t try it myself.
Good luck,
John Cleary
_____
From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of John Jessen
Sent: Monday, 25 February 2008 2:47 PM
Subject: RV10-List: Windshield scratches
Help! Scratches on windshield.............
Wanted to clean off the bugs and, using a nylon encased sponge, just
about
put as many scratches on the windshield that I could do. Any advice
appreciated. I've looked up some products on ACS, but wondered if
anyone
had had such a problem and found a solution that they could
recommend....PLEASE! Ugh.
John J
(on the GlaStar, not the unfinished -10)
"http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List"http://www.matronics.com/Na
vig
ator?RV10-List
"http://forums.matronics.com"http://forums.matronics.com
"http://www.matronics.com/contribution"http://www.matronics.com/contribut
ion
24/02/2008
12:19 PM
24/02/2008
12:19 PM
________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Crimpers
From: "marcausman" <marc(at)verticalpower.com>
Date: Feb 25, 2008
Les, I've had good luck with that brand of tools. Here's a doc with some good info about different crimp tools and how to use them: http://www.verticalpower.com/docs/Connector_Service_Manual.pdf
Marc
--------
Marc Ausman
http://www.verticalpower.com
RV-7 IO-390 Flying
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=166102#166102
________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Windshield scratches
Date: Feb 25, 2008
From: John Jessen <n212pj(at)gmail.com>
Thanks to everyone for your posts on windshield scratches. I will order the
Micromesh and have at it. I'll take pictures of the tools that made the
scratches, the actual scratches, the tools assembled to get rid of them, and
document the process. If I'm successful, I'll post everything on my site
and send it on to Tim so it can be placed in a convenient location for
future reference. Knowing Tim, there's probably something on the topic on
his site already.
If I have to replace the windshield, I'll take pictures of Hell's canyon
just before the leap.
You know, I just never thought that the windshield I'm zooming through the
air behind (well, relative zooming) would be this soft. Another lesson...
John J
40328
________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Feb 25, 2008
From: Deems Davis <deemsdavis(at)cox.net>
Subject: ARC follow-up
Following my reading of the ARC final report published by the FAA. I
sent off an e-mail to several addresses within the EAA, similar to the
one I posted on this forum. My objective was to voice my disappointment
with how I perceived I had been represented in this effort. I'm happy to
report that today, I've been in receipt of several encouraging e-mails
from Earl Lawrence the EAA's regulatory affairs officer. Earl was the
EAA rep on the committee and along with Van one of the co-chairs .
Through this dialog he has shared considerable additional information
and insight from the proceedings and most importantly has indicated a
pending EAA communications program/campaign which will address (but not
be limited to) the following 3 questions:
1. What the EAA proposed to the FAA as a co chair of the ARC ?
2. What is the EAA's position wrt Commercial Builders and the impact
they are having on our sport/hobby?
3. What the EAA recommends Amateur Builders do to continue to support
and lobby for our existing rights to continue to build, fly, and
maintain our aircraft ?
I'm encouraged that the EAA does in fact plan an active role in this
effort. And that they will involve the membership in the same.
Through this brief process, I've also learned / formed some additional
opinions that have given me cause to _increase_ my concern that the FAA
_might_ act in a way that could limit or restrict our existing
capabilities. (Yes, that means RV-10 builders) And as a result I'm
reminded that keeping silent and hoping for a favorable outcome is not
the best course. I simply care _too_ much about what I'm doing. As this
issues moves forward I would encourage each of you to find a way to
voice or record you desires. My experience in having the EAA hear my
voice was encouraging and rewarding.
Deems Davis # 406
'Its all done....Its just not put together'
http://deemsrv10.com/
________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Windshield scratches
Date: Feb 25, 2008
From: "John W. Cox" <johnwcox(at)pacificnw.com>
Your point is well taken. Care and protection of the windscreen leads
to years of trouble free enjoyment with continued clarity.
Bugs, ballpoint pens, clipboards, headsets and other sundry items leave
a lasting and less than enjoyable impression. There have been a few
novel headset hangers in some of the pictures that have drifted from
this list over the months. The Repairman's cap needs to be on while we
are wearing the Builder cap. It can substantially reduce the post
production repairs list.
John
________________________________
From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Mark Ritter
Sent: Monday, February 25, 2008 10:30 AM
Subject: RE: RV10-List: Windshield scratches
I had a scratch on my RV-10 windscreen on the inside about 4 inches long
in a curved portion of the window (slap anyone who tries to put their
headsets on the glareshield) that was really difficult to get to. Wish
I had left it to the experts. At the end of the day I got rid of the
scratch OK but ended up with a distortion I couldn't live with - not one
of my better monemts. Ended up replacing the windscreen - you can
imagine how much fun that was. Had the plane been painted I would have
really been up a creek.
Mark
RV-10/N410MR
________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Feb 25, 2008
From: Rick Sked <ricksked(at)embarqmail.com>
Subject: Fitting the cowl tips and the 1/4 turn fastner
Fitting the cowl..
some of this is cart before horse but I tried to keep it in some semblance of order
I hope to help others who have not come this far...I have spent the last three
weeks getting the cowl to fit properly...maybe I'm being to anal but this is a
very cosmetic piece so I hope to help everyone achieve the same fit, maybe you
already have. First off I am using mil spec 1/4 turn fasteners on the cowl sides,
and along the top cowl firewall side. They are spaced at 4 inches around
the firewall, 3.5" at the top to bottom cowl seam. I used hinges along the firewall
the firewall for the cowl sides, only because I had already mounted the
hinges prior to bolting on the engine mount.
TIP #1 if you are mounting ether hinges or flanges for 1/4 turn fasteners, do so
prior to mounting the engine mount...not enough readily accessible space to
buck the rivet prior to installing the mount.
OK....I can not emphasis this point. You need to get the forward part of the cowl
fitted first...the inlets, the spinner diameter all that stuff you need to
get right first. You may need to trim the top cowl to allow getting the nose ring
to fit and the bottom to slide up over the top. The bottom cowl over laps
the top cowl on the sides. Sand and make a very straight line on the bottom cowl
now....it will be the guide for marking and cutting the top cowl when that
time comes and the material seemed thin on the very edge, you will need to straight,
blunt edge. Fit your top cowl as best as you can before even bringing the
bottom cowl, left right, up down get the top as close to perfect before going
any further, including the spinner gap. Get two sanding bars/blocks. I used
a 12" and a 30" The 30 was fitted with 80 grit paper and the 12 has a coarse
Carborundum metal backed abrasive plate. The edges sand very easily...too easily
if you get aggressive. Once you mount the cowl bottom to the top on the aircraft
you will notice that the back over hangs the firewall quite a bit. Trim
the bottom to allow it to fit flush with the bottom. Beware of the flange interfering
with the flush fit. I had to cut a portion of my bottom mounting flange
back about 3/8, just make sure it does not hit the honeycomb. The masking tape
method previously posted worked well for cutting the initial line on the top,
bottom and sides. I still did not end up with a perfect flat nose ring once
the cowl was fitted. To fix that I shorted the cowl about 3/16 to allow me to
build up the nose ring with micro/epoxy. Then sand it for a perfect gap. Me engine
has been mounted for 6 months so I don't fear sag to much at this point.
OK...1/4 turn fasteners. I recommend using .063 for the flanges. Make sure they
are at least 1-5/8 wide...Once you scallop the flange, it bends fairly easily
into position. The reason I don't recommend anything lighter is the holes that
must be made to mount the receptacle. The receptacles are mounted with -4 rivets,
which just barely make edge distance from the middle receptacle hole...that
hole is 11/16. The distance for the edge of that hole is very close to the
edge of the flange, so don't go with too thin of a flange. I had all my flanges
clecoed in place for fitting the cowl. Once the cowl was fit very tightly to
the firewall I drilled all the fastener locations with a #40 and clecoed, checking
fit after each hole. Did the bottom first, using #8 screws there but drilled
and clecoed non the less. Then did the top cowl, firewall side then taped
and strapped the two halves to mark the side cuts. Marked the top cowl using
the bottom as a guide and cut near the line then sanded to the line with the
long sanding block. Made up the side flanges with 1" -3 rivet spacing, matched
drilled them to the bottom cowl, clecoed and reinstalled the cowl...side seam
was perfect but tight, that's a good thing. Now I drilled the top cowl/side flanges
while the assembly was secured to the aircraft with tape, straps and the
neighbors small kid who worked underneath :). The trick is to get that whole
shebang drilled and clecoed to the flanges. OK...tip coming! remove your flanges
(mark them) then go over to your trusty drill press because your gonna drill
a boat load of holes. Open the #40's to #30 and use the drill jig provided
by Milspec to drill the rivet holes for the receptacles. Then open the center
receptacle holes with a unibit to 11/16" that's a big hole and lot of chips. Then
countersink the rivet holes for a flush -4.
TIP!!! prime and install the receptacles now, don't wait till the strips are riveted
to the aircraft. Once the receptacles are on, run them in on a best guess
depth, use one of the fasteners to get close, all of mine were to shallow. Do
this before mounting the strip...just by attaching to the cowl while it's on
the bench. Then rivet the flanges to the aircraft, mount your cowl and see how
it all fits..you will have to adjust (read bend down) each scallop to allow
the outer edge of the cowl to fit flush...actually do it as soon as you do your
first fitting of the flanges and cowl.Then final adjust your depths. I used
the snap ring tool and the pliers from Milspec...right tool, right job...they
worked perfect. Don't skimp on the clecos...use them in every hole.
Final fitting...now that everything is installed with the fasteners, I removed
the cowls and using masking tape as a guide (OK, anal here 3/64" material showing
to be trimmed off, maybe a little more) I removed the small amount of material
from all the edges to allow for that small line that will be occupied by
paint. By waiting to do the final trimming now, you just push each part to the
firewall snug each and every time during the fitting process.
Would I use them again? Yup...Cons..they ain't cheap, took me about 60 hours to
totally fit the cowl and install the fasteners, not including the oil door, louvers
etc.. Once finished I am going to remove the metal grommets in prep for
paint.
Put your power tools up high and ignore them while doing this, the one exception
is the Dremel, I used it to cut all of my cowl exclusively with there quick
change made for plastic cut off wheels. Easy to control and very straight smooth
cut. I hope I helped all of you thinking about this method. Thanks to pics
of Vic Syaracuse, Randy's RV-3 works and a close examination of Wayne Edgerton's
for helping me through this whole thing. Now on to the wheel pants & fairings...they
are easy right?
Rick Sked
40185
________________________________________________________________________________
From: "gary" <speckter(at)comcast.net>
Subject: Elevator Stops
Date: Feb 25, 2008
I am rigging the elevator and cannot get enough movement to go from stop to
stop. It is hitting on the front ball joint shank in one direction and the
lower ball joint under the battery. I do have the minimum movement in each
direction but I don't like that the movement is limited by the control
mechanism instead of the stops.
Any one else have this problem? Better yet anyone have a solution?
Gary
40274
________________________________________________________________________________
From: Mark Ritter <mritter509(at)MSN.COM>
Subject: Fuel Tank Leak
Date: Feb 25, 2008
After 190 hours a leak developed around the fuel line fitting with the stra
iner that goes into the right tank. It appears the fuel is leaking around
the flange inside the tank and coming out around the opening for the fittin
g. They are QB wings so I can't take credit for not properly prosealing th
e flange to the fuel tank rib. With no access to the inside of the tank I'
m trying to come up with a fix short of removing the tank. First two attem
pts to come up with a fix failed. The third attempt appears to be working
knock on wood. I'm getting really good at taking the wing root fairing on
and off.
The thought of messing up my paint job removing the tank screws is not plea
sant.
TIP - Those in the process of building the tank don't spare the proseal aro
und the flange that is riveted to the rib.
Mark
RV-10/N410MR
_________________________________________________________________
Helping your favorite cause is as easy as instant messaging.-You IM, we g
ive.
________________________________________________________________________________
From: "John Testement" <jwt(at)roadmapscoaching.com>
Subject: Unusual paint ridge around windows
Date: Feb 25, 2008
I have had an unusual situation with the door windows when painting and want
to see if anyone else has seen a similar problem.
After painting the doors a small ridge developed above the
Plexiglas-fiberglass joint - it is about 1/4 wide and 1/16 high. The area
was level and smooth after priming. I used the Weld On 10 and put a thin
layer of fiberglass over the seam. I then primed with UV SmoothPrime and
primed over that with the Dupont high build primer. All looked good until we
painted the final color and clear coat (Imron). It seems like some kind of
chemical reaction.
Anyone else seen this? Any ideas? Suggestions on how to best fix and avoid
this on the other windows?
I have attached a few photos - a little hard to see the ridge.
Thanks for you input.
John Testement
HYPERLINK "mailto:jwt(at)roadmapscoaching.com"jwt(at)roadmapscoaching.com
40321
Richmond, VA
Painting in sections and LOTS of little stuff
9:35 PM
________________________________________________________________________________
From: Rob Kermanj <flysrv10(at)gmail.com>
Subject: Re: Fuel Tank Leak
Date: Feb 25, 2008
You did not say how you fixed it on the third try. I have a leak on
my QB tank and Van has sent me a new tank but the thought of replacing
and repainting the tank has stopped me short. My leak (the third
discovered on this tank) is at the outboard panel. Any suggestion
short of opening an access hole?
Rob.
On Feb 25, 2008, at 5:08 PM, Mark Ritter wrote:
>
> After 190 hours a leak developed around the fuel line fitting with
> the strainer that goes into the right tank. It appears the fuel is
> leaking around the flange inside the tank and coming out around the
> opening for the fitting. They are QB wings so I can't take credit
> for not properly prosealing the flange to the fuel tank rib. With
> no access to the inside of the tank I'm trying to come up with a fix
> short of removing the tank. First two attempts to come up with a
> fix failed. The third attempt appears to be working knock on wood.
> I'm getting really good at taking the wing root fairing on and off.
>
> The thought of messing up my paint job removing the tank screws is
> not pleasant.
>
> TIP - Those in the process of building the tank don't spare the
> proseal around the flange that is riveted to the rib.
>
> Mark
> RV-10/N410MR
>
>
>
>
>
> Helping your favorite cause is as easy as instant messaging. You IM,
> we givein' target='_new'>Learn more.
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Elevator Stops
From: "jkreidler" <jason.kreidler(at)regalbeloit.com>
Date: Feb 25, 2008
Gary, we also had a problem with the elevator rigging. It has been quite a while,
so I will attempt to recall as best as I can. Our problem was the elevator
horn would not bump against the aft stop. The bottom of the elevator horn seemed
as if it could be 'forced' past the stop and become jammed.
We ended up building up the stop with an extra bar of .125 aluminum and a piece
of 1x1 angle. When we asked Vans, they had never seen this problem before, we
double checked everything, and they gave the thumbs up to the fix. To tell
if you are having the same problem as we had, take a look at the elevator horn
when the elevator is in the full nose up deflection. If it seems as if the elevator
horn could go past the stop let me know and I will send you pictures of
our fix off line.
Thanks, Jason #40617 - Finishing
speckter(at)comcast.net wrote:
> I am rigging the elevator and cannot get enough movement to go from stop to
> stop. It is hitting on the front ball joint shank in one direction and the
> lower ball joint under the battery. I do have the minimum movement in each
> direction but I don't like that the movement is limited by the control
> mechanism instead of the stops.
>
> Any one else have this problem? Better yet anyone have a solution?
>
> Gary
> 40274
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=166197#166197
________________________________________________________________________________
From: Mark Ritter <mritter509(at)msn.com>
Subject: Fuel Tank Leak
Date: Feb 25, 2008
I'm lucky in a way in that I can see the leak by removing the wing root fai
ring. I put two flat washers over the strainer and on to the fitting. I pu
t a liberal amount of proseal around the washers which I hoped would push t
he proseal into the opening around the hole in the fuel tank rib when I tig
hten the fitting. The washers also might help in tightening up the flange
in the tank against the rib. If it starts leaking again I'm going to try t
hinning out some proseal with MEK and suck it into the hole using a suction
pump on the fuel vent.
After that I'm out of ideas and will have to remove the tank to cut an acce
ss hole so I can get to the flange. A paint cutter (The Yard Store) works
fairly well around the screws to keep the damage to the paint at a minimum.
A friend with a fuel tank leak used the cutter around the screws of his p
ainted RV-7 and it looks OK - not great but OK.
Mark
RV-10/N410MR
From: flysrv10(at)gmail.comTo: rv10-list(at)matronics.comSubject: Re: RV10-List:
Fuel Tank LeakDate: Mon, 25 Feb 2008 17:32:14 -0500You did not say how you
fixed it on the third try. I have a leak on my QB tank and Van has sent me
a new tank but the thought of replacing and repainting the tank has stoppe
d me short. My leak (the third discovered on this tank) is at the outboard
panel. Any suggestion short of opening an access hole?
Rob.
On Feb 25, 2008, at 5:08 PM, Mark Ritter wrote:
After 190 hours a leak developed around the fuel line fitting with the stra
iner that goes into the right tank. It appears the fuel is leaking around
the flange inside the tank and coming out around the opening for the fittin
g. They are QB wings so I can't take credit for not properly prosealing th
e flange to the fuel tank rib. With no access to the inside of the tank I'
m trying to come up with a fix short of removing the tank. First two attem
pts to come up with a fix failed. The third attempt appears to be working
knock on wood. I'm getting really good at taking the wing root fairing on
and off. The thought of messing up my paint job removing the tank screws is
not pleasant. TIP - Those in the process of building the tank don't spare
the proseal around the flange that is riveted to the rib. MarkRV-10/N410M
R
Helping your favorite cause is as easy as instant messaging. You IM, we giv
ein' target='_new'>Learn more.http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-Lis
t
href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com
href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/con
tribution
_________________________________________________________________
Need to know the score, the latest news, or you need your Hotmail=AE-get yo
ur "fix".
http://www.msnmobilefix.com/Default.aspx
________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Feb 25, 2008
From: "Pascal" <rv10builder(at)verizon.net>
Subject: Re: Fuel Tank Leak
they sent you a new tank?? wow, I thought they were handing out 4 inch
"access panels".
Never understood the logic of repairing a pinhole sized leak with a 4
inch access panel.
----- Original Message -----
From: Rob Kermanj
To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com
Sent: Monday, February 25, 2008 2:32 PM
Subject: Re: RV10-List: Fuel Tank Leak
You did not say how you fixed it on the third try. I have a leak on
my QB tank and Van has sent me a new tank but the thought of replacing
and repainting the tank has stopped me short. My leak (the third
discovered on this tank) is at the outboard panel. Any suggestion short
of opening an access hole?
Rob.
On Feb 25, 2008, at 5:08 PM, Mark Ritter wrote:
After 190 hours a leak developed around the fuel line fitting with
the strainer that goes into the right tank. It appears the fuel is
leaking around the flange inside the tank and coming out around the
opening for the fitting. They are QB wings so I can't take credit for
not properly prosealing the flange to the fuel tank rib. With no access
to the inside of the tank I'm trying to come up with a fix short of
removing the tank. First two attempts to come up with a fix failed.
The third attempt appears to be working knock on wood. I'm getting
really good at taking the wing root fairing on and off.
The thought of messing up my paint job removing the tank screws is
not pleasant.
TIP - Those in the process of building the tank don't spare the
proseal around the flange that is riveted to the rib.
Mark
RV-10/N410MR
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
---
Helping your favorite cause is as easy as instant messaging. You IM,
we givein' target='_new'>Learn more.
http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List
href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com
href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c
ontribution
________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Feb 25, 2008
From: "Kelly McMullen" <apilot2(at)gmail.com>
Subject: Re: BA Prop
Well you know some guys....two things to hand prop aren't enough. ;-p
On Mon, Feb 25, 2008 at 4:19 PM, John W. Cox wrote:
>
>
> Viagra, for prop envy. Last longer around sexy aircraft. I have heard it
> all.
>
>
> John C.
________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Feb 25, 2008
From: "Kelly McMullen" <apilot2(at)gmail.com>
Subject: Re: Fuel Tank Leak
Consider that likely the replacement tank was built by Van's staff
rather than in the Philippines. Might just be a bit better
construction.
On Mon, Feb 25, 2008 at 3:32 PM, Rob Kermanj wrote:
> You did not say how you fixed it on the third try. I have a leak on my QB
> tank and Van has sent me a new tank but the thought of replacing and
> repainting the tank has stopped me short. My leak (the third discovered on
> this tank) is at the outboard panel. Any suggestion short of opening an
> access hole?
>
> Rob.
>
________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Ben Westfall" <rv10(at)sinkrate.com>
Subject: safety-trim mounting locations
Date: Feb 25, 2008
Where are/have people been mounting the safety trim controller unit? What
factors influenced your decision?
THX
-Ben
________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Bob-tcw" <rnewman(at)tcwtech.com>
Subject: Re: safety-trim mounting locations
Date: Feb 25, 2008
Ben, I certainly want others to chime in, but some of our customers
have mounted the Safety-Trim controller to the wing spar under the front
seats, This certainly is a very short run of wire to the trim switch
wiring coming from the control sticks. We are mounting it in the rear
of the our RV-10 on an equipement tray behind the baggage area. We
have photo's of this on our web site. In our Glastar I mounted it up
under the instrument panel near the previously existing wiring.
Thanks,
Bob Newman
TCW Technologies
www.tcwtech.com
________________________________________________________________________________
From: Rob Kermanj <flysrv10(at)gmail.com>
Subject: Re: Fuel Tank Leak
Date: Feb 25, 2008
Thanks for the info.
Rob.
On Feb 25, 2008, at 6:54 PM, Mark Ritter wrote:
> I'm lucky in a way in that I can see the leak by removing the wing
> root fairing. I put two flat washers over the strainer and on to the
> fitting. I put a liberal amount of proseal around the washers which
> I hoped would push the proseal into the opening around the hole in
> the fuel tank rib when I tighten the fitting. The washers also
> might help in tightening up the flange in the tank against the rib.
> If it starts leaking again I'm going to try thinning out some
> proseal with MEK and suck it into the hole using a suction pump on
> the fuel vent.
>
> After that I'm out of ideas and will have to remove the tank to cut
> an access hole so I can get to the flange. A paint cutter (The Yard
> Store) works fairly well around the screws to keep the damage to the
> paint at a minimum. A friend with a fuel tank leak used the cutter
> around the screws of his painted RV-7 and it looks OK - not great
> but OK.
>
> Mark
> RV-10/N410MR
>
>
>
>
>
> From: flysrv10(at)gmail.com
> To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com
> Subject: Re: RV10-List: Fuel Tank Leak
> Date: Mon, 25 Feb 2008 17:32:14 -0500
>
> You did not say how you fixed it on the third try. I have a leak on
> my QB tank and Van has sent me a new tank but the thought of
> replacing and repainting the tank has stopped me short. My leak
> (the third discovered on this tank) is at the outboard panel. Any
> suggestion short of opening an access hole?
>
> Rob.
>
> On Feb 25, 2008, at 5:08 PM, Mark Ritter wrote:
>
>
> After 190 hours a leak developed around the fuel line fitting with
> the strainer that goes into the right tank. It appears the fuel is
> leaking around the flange inside the tank and coming out around the
> opening for the fitting. They are QB wings so I can't take credit
> for not properly prosealing the flange to the fuel tank rib. With
> no access to the inside of the tank I'm trying to come up with a fix
> short of removing the tank. First two attempts to come up with a
> fix failed. The third attempt appears to be working knock on wood.
> I'm getting really good at taking the wing root fairing on and off.
>
> The thought of messing up my paint job removing the tank screws is
> not pleasant.
>
> TIP - Those in the process of building the tank don't spare the
> proseal around the flange that is riveted to the rib.
>
> Mark
> RV-10/N410MR
>
>
>
>
>
> Helping your favorite cause is as easy as instant messaging. You IM,
> we givein' target='_new'>Learn more.
> http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List
> href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com
>
href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/co
ntribution
>
>
> get=_blank>http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List
> p://forums.matronics.com
> blank>http://www.matronics.com/contribution
>
>
> Need to know the score, the latest news, or you need your Hotmail=AE-
> get your "fix". Check it out.
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
From: Rob Kermanj <flysrv10(at)gmail.com>
Subject: Re: Fuel Tank Leak
Date: Feb 25, 2008
Yes they did. However, my first leaks began on two rivets, then at
the fuel pick up area, and then at the outboard baffle. I had no
difficulty asking for a new tank.
Rob.
On Feb 25, 2008, at 7:00 PM, Pascal wrote:
> they sent you a new tank?? wow, I thought they were handing out 4
> inch "access panels".
>
> Never understood the logic of repairing a pinhole sized leak with a
> 4 inch access panel.
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: Rob Kermanj
> To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com
> Sent: Monday, February 25, 2008 2:32 PM
> Subject: Re: RV10-List: Fuel Tank Leak
>
> You did not say how you fixed it on the third try. I have a leak on
> my QB tank and Van has sent me a new tank but the thought of
> replacing and repainting the tank has stopped me short. My leak
> (the third discovered on this tank) is at the outboard panel. Any
> suggestion short of opening an access hole?
>
> Rob.
>
> On Feb 25, 2008, at 5:08 PM, Mark Ritter wrote:
>
>>
>> After 190 hours a leak developed around the fuel line fitting with
>> the strainer that goes into the right tank. It appears the fuel is
>> leaking around the flange inside the tank and coming out around the
>> opening for the fitting. They are QB wings so I can't take credit
>> for not properly prosealing the flange to the fuel tank rib. With
>> no access to the inside of the tank I'm trying to come up with a
>> fix short of removing the tank. First two attempts to come up with
>> a fix failed. The third attempt appears to be working knock on
>> wood. I'm getting really good at taking the wing root fairing on
>> and off.
>>
>> The thought of messing up my paint job removing the tank screws is
>> not pleasant.
>>
>> TIP - Those in the process of building the tank don't spare the
>> proseal around the flange that is riveted to the rib.
>>
>> Mark
>> RV-10/N410MR
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Helping your favorite cause is as easy as instant messaging. You
>> IM, we givein' target='_new'>Learn more.
>> http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List
>> href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com
>> href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/contribution
>>
>>
>
> href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List
> href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com
> href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://
> www.matronics.com/c
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
From: Rob Kermanj <flysrv10(at)gmail.com>
Subject: Re: Fuel Tank Leak
Date: Feb 25, 2008
Scott told me that it will be built here with the knowledge that it is
going to replace a tank for an unhappy customer. I am also very
pleased that we deal with such a great company that backs up their
product without question. They certainly make up for that rare
deficiencies that come up.
Rob.
On Feb 25, 2008, at 7:14 PM, Kelly McMullen wrote:
>
> Consider that likely the replacement tank was built by Van's staff
> rather than in the Philippines. Might just be a bit better
> construction.
>
> On Mon, Feb 25, 2008 at 3:32 PM, Rob Kermanj
> wrote:
>> You did not say how you fixed it on the third try. I have a leak
>> on my QB
>> tank and Van has sent me a new tank but the thought of replacing and
>> repainting the tank has stopped me short. My leak (the third
>> discovered on
>> this tank) is at the outboard panel. Any suggestion short of
>> opening an
>> access hole?
>>
>> Rob.
>>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
From: "John Dunne" <acs(at)acspropeller.com.au>
Subject: Fitting the cowl tips and the 1/4 turn fastner
Date: Feb 26, 2008
Rick fantastic write up.
Valuable stuff indeed!
Any photos?
John 40315 (cowls)
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Rick Sked
Sent: Tuesday, 26 February 2008 7:00 AM
Subject: RV10-List: Fitting the cowl tips and the 1/4 turn fastner
Fitting the cowl........................
________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Feb 25, 2008
From: "Pascal" <rv10builder(at)verizon.net>
Subject: Re: Fuel Tank Leak
That makes sense,Always nice to hear how Van's stands by their product
when there is an obvious problem.
Thanks for explaining!
Pascal
----- Original Message -----
From: Rob Kermanj
To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com
Sent: Monday, February 25, 2008 7:04 PM
Subject: Re: RV10-List: Fuel Tank Leak
Yes they did. However, my first leaks began on two rivets, then at
the fuel pick up area, and then at the outboard baffle. I had no
difficulty asking for a new tank.
Rob.
On Feb 25, 2008, at 7:00 PM, Pascal wrote:
they sent you a new tank?? wow, I thought they were handing out 4
inch "access panels".
Never understood the logic of repairing a pinhole sized leak with a
4 inch access panel.
----- Original Message -----
From: Rob Kermanj
To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com
Sent: Monday, February 25, 2008 2:32 PM
Subject: Re: RV10-List: Fuel Tank Leak
You did not say how you fixed it on the third try. I have a leak
on my QB tank and Van has sent me a new tank but the thought of
replacing and repainting the tank has stopped me short. My leak (the
third discovered on this tank) is at the outboard panel. Any suggestion
short of opening an access hole?
Rob.
On Feb 25, 2008, at 5:08 PM, Mark Ritter wrote:
After 190 hours a leak developed around the fuel line fitting
with the strainer that goes into the right tank. It appears the fuel is
leaking around the flange inside the tank and coming out around the
opening for the fitting. They are QB wings so I can't take credit for
not properly prosealing the flange to the fuel tank rib. With no access
to the inside of the tank I'm trying to come up with a fix short of
removing the tank. First two attempts to come up with a fix failed.
The third attempt appears to be working knock on wood. I'm getting
really good at taking the wing root fairing on and off.
The thought of messing up my paint job removing the tank screws
is not pleasant.
TIP - Those in the process of building the tank don't spare the
proseal around the flange that is riveted to the rib.
Mark
RV-10/N410MR
------------------------------------------------------------------------
Helping your favorite cause is as easy as instant messaging. You
IM, we givein' target='_new'>Learn more.
http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List
href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com
href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c
ontribution
href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List">http://www.matronic
s.com/Navigator?RV10-List
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http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List
href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com
href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c
ontribution
________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Ben Westfall" <rv10(at)sinkrate.com>
Subject: safety-trim mounting locations
Date: Feb 25, 2008
I have looked at your install in the 10 on your site. The equipment tray is
a great idea and looks nice. I am concerned about the wiring for that
location. I am quickly finding out the reality that the conduit that goes
under the floors up to the front is prime real estate. There are quite a
few less wires running through the conduit to the tail if you mount it up
front. This might necessitate that I install it in the front half of the
plane.
-Ben
_____
From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Bob-tcw
Sent: Monday, February 25, 2008 6:56 PM
Subject: Re: RV10-List: safety-trim mounting locations
Ben, I certainly want others to chime in, but some of our customers have
mounted the Safety-Trim controller to the wing spar under the front seats,
This certainly is a very short run of wire to the trim switch wiring coming
from the control sticks. We are mounting it in the rear of the our RV-10
on an equipement tray behind the baggage area. We have photo's of this on
our web site. In our Glastar I mounted it up under the instrument panel
near the previously existing wiring.
Thanks,
Bob Newman
TCW Technologies
www.tcwtech.com
________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Fuel Tank Leak
Date: Feb 26, 2008
From: "Phillips, Jack" <Jack.Phillips(at)cardinalhealth.com>
Leaking QB Tanks? Y'all are making me happier and happier with my
economics-driven decision to go the slo-build route.
Jack Phillips
#610, Raleigh NC
Still waiting for my Slo-Build Wing Kit to Arrive
_____
From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Rob Kermanj
Sent: Monday, February 25, 2008 5:32 PM
Subject: Re: RV10-List: Fuel Tank Leak
You did not say how you fixed it on the third try. I have a leak on my
QB tank and Van has sent me a new tank but the thought of replacing and
repainting the tank has stopped me short. My leak (the third discovered
on this tank) is at the outboard panel. Any suggestion short of opening
an access hole?
Rob.
On Feb 25, 2008, at 5:08 PM, Mark Ritter wrote:
After 190 hours a leak developed around the fuel line fitting with the
strainer that goes into the right tank. It appears the fuel is leaking
around the flange inside the tank and coming out around the opening for
the fitting. They are QB wings so I can't take credit for not properly
prosealing the flange to the fuel tank rib. With no access to the
inside of the tank I'm trying to come up with a fix short of removing
the tank. First two attempts to come up with a fix failed. The third
attempt appears to be working knock on wood. I'm getting really good at
taking the wing root fairing on and off.
The thought of messing up my paint job removing the tank screws is not
pleasant.
TIP - Those in the process of building the tank don't spare the proseal
around the flange that is riveted to the rib.
Mark
RV-10/N410MR
_____
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________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Feb 26, 2008
From: Tim Olson <Tim(at)MyRV10.com>
Subject: Re: safety-trim mounting locations
I had my trim relays mounted under the panel lip edge....no big reason,
as they could have been under the seats I guess. So for me it
was easy splicing to just put it in under the radio stack. For some
of these lightweight plastic boxes, I've found the hard plastic
high strength velcro to be great...just slap on a slab and stick
it in place. It isn't as solid until you get it on there for a
day or two, but once the stickyback tightens up, that thing isn't
going anywhere....and it's easy to yank off again. Did the same
with my GRT Manifold pressure sensor, and my CO monitor. Just
the lightweight or plastic things....and nothing that can drop and
short out.
Tim
Ben Westfall wrote:
> I have looked at your install in the 10 on your site. The equipment
> tray is a great idea and looks nice. I am concerned about the wiring
> for that location. I am quickly finding out the reality that the
> conduit that goes under the floors up to the front is prime real estate.
> There are quite a few less wires running through the conduit to the
> tail if you mount it up front. This might necessitate that I install it
> in the front half of the plane.
>
>
>
> -Ben
>
________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Dave Saylor" <Dave(at)AirCraftersLLC.com>
Subject: Unusual paint ridge around windows
Date: Feb 26, 2008
John,
The ridge looks like it's at the edge of the fiberglass. Is that right, or
is the edge of the fiberglass further from the plex? What type of resin did
you use to overlay the seam?
Dave Saylor
AirCrafters LLC
140 Aviation Way
Watsonville, CA
831-722-9141
831-750-0284 CL
www.AirCraftersLLC.com
_____
From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of John Testement
Sent: Monday, February 25, 2008 2:36 PM
Subject: RV10-List: Unusual paint ridge around windows
I have had an unusual situation with the door windows when painting and want
to see if anyone else has seen a similar problem.
After painting the doors a small ridge developed above the
Plexiglas-fiberglass joint - it is about 1/4 wide and 1/16 high. The area
was level and smooth after priming. I used the Weld On 10 and put a thin
layer of fiberglass over the seam. I then primed with UV SmoothPrime and
primed over that with the Dupont high build primer. All looked good until we
painted the final color and clear coat (Imron). It seems like some kind of
chemical reaction.
Anyone else seen this? Any ideas? Suggestions on how to best fix and avoid
this on the other windows?
I have attached a few photos - a little hard to see the ridge.
Thanks for you input.
John Testement
jwt(at)roadmapscoaching.com
40321
Richmond, VA
Painting in sections and LOTS of little stuff
2/23/2008 9:35 PM
________________________________________________________________________________
From: "John Testement" <jwt(at)roadmapscoaching.com>
Subject: Unusual paint ridge around windows
Date: Feb 26, 2008
Dave,
The ridge is just over the Weld On seam between the plexi and fiberglass.
Its as though the Weld On expanded when painted over. I used West System
epoxy.
John
_____
From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Dave Saylor
Sent: Tuesday, February 26, 2008 1:26 PM
Subject: RE: RV10-List: Unusual paint ridge around windows
John,
The ridge looks like it's at the edge of the fiberglass. Is that right, or
is the edge of the fiberglass further from the plex? What type of resin did
you use to overlay the seam?
Dave Saylor
AirCrafters LLC
140 Aviation Way
Watsonville, CA
831-722-9141
831-750-0284 CL
www.AirCraftersLLC.com
_____
From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of John Testement
Sent: Monday, February 25, 2008 2:36 PM
Subject: RV10-List: Unusual paint ridge around windows
I have had an unusual situation with the door windows when painting and want
to see if anyone else has seen a similar problem.
After painting the doors a small ridge developed above the
Plexiglas-fiberglass joint - it is about 1/4 wide and 1/16 high. The area
was level and smooth after priming. I used the Weld On 10 and put a thin
layer of fiberglass over the seam. I then primed with UV SmoothPrime and
primed over that with the Dupont high build primer. All looked good until we
painted the final color and clear coat (Imron). It seems like some kind of
chemical reaction.
Anyone else seen this? Any ideas? Suggestions on how to best fix and avoid
this on the other windows?
I have attached a few photos - a little hard to see the ridge.
Thanks for you input.
John Testement
HYPERLINK "mailto:jwt(at)roadmapscoaching.com"jwt(at)roadmapscoaching.com
40321
Richmond, VA
Painting in sections and LOTS of little stuff
2/23/2008 9:35 PM
"http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List"http://www.matronics.com/Navig
ator?RV10-List
"http://www.matronics.com/contribution"http://www.matronics.com/contribution
9:35 PM
9:35 PM
________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Urethane pourable expanding foam in doors?
Date: Feb 26, 2008
From: "Chris Johnston" <CJohnston(at)popsound.com>
Hey all -
I know someone around here has thought about filling the doors with an
expanding foam to give them some density and make 'em be less flimsy.
Anyone care to speculate if you'd split your door in two by doing this?
I was thinking something like this:
http://jgreer.com/Foam%20Page.htm
I called and spoke with John Greer there and tried to explain myself.
"uh, so, I'm building an airplane, and I was thinking..." you know how
those conversations go. I asked if he thought I'd blow up the door by
filling it with that stuff, and he said he didn't think so. After
thinking about it a bit, I think I agree. My reasoning: on his website
(and others with similar products) there's a picture of a paper cup with
some foam that has been poured and expanded in it. the foam expands
over the top, and creates a muffin-top type situation. the paper cup
retains it's shape, and doesn't split. So, think I, as long as you have
open space for the foam to expand, it's not going to split the door.
Now, this is all my hair-brained theory. The leap to filling my
already-fitting and built doors with something that could destroy them
gives me pause. The upside to doing this is that it seems like it'll
make the doors feel much less flimsy, not add too much weight, insulate
a bit, cut down on noise, etc. Downsides? possibly having to build new
doors. hmmm. I think I'm going to get some of this foam and do some
testing. While I'm on this voyage of discovery, anyone want to give
their opinion? A search of the archives only had one entry on the
subject, and it had not much detail.
cj
#40410
finishing/FF/various science projects
www.perfectlygoodairplane.net
________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Feb 26, 2008
From: Werner Schneider <glastar(at)gmx.net>
Subject: Re: Urethane pourable expanding foam in doors?
The paper cup is a different story as it can easely expand, if you have
a small and narrow channel the story might come out different!
I would be very carefull with that approach, for a short open space ok,
for a long (>3" and narrow (1" or less)) I would leave my fingers off,
and then there is the weight of UR foam.
as usuasl just my 5cents
Werner
Chris Johnston wrote:
> Hey all -
>
> I know someone around here has thought about filling the doors with an expanding
foam to give them some density and make 'em be less flimsy. Anyone care to
speculate if you'd split your door in two by doing this? I was thinking something
like this:
>
> http://jgreer.com/Foam%20Page.htm
>
> I called and spoke with John Greer there and tried to explain myself. "uh, so,
I'm building an airplane, and I was thinking..." you know how those conversations
go. I asked if he thought I'd blow up the door by filling it with that
stuff, and he said he didn't think so. After thinking about it a bit, I think
I agree. My reasoning: on his website (and others with similar products)
there's a picture of a paper cup with some foam that has been poured and expanded
in it. the foam expands over the top, and creates a muffin-top type situation.
the paper cup retains it's shape, and doesn't split. So, think I, as long
as you have open space for the foam to expand, it's not going to split the
door.
>
> Now, this is all my hair-brained theory. The leap to filling my already-fitting
and built doors with something that could destroy them gives me pause. The
upside to doing this is that it seems like it'll make the doors feel much less
flimsy, not add too much weight, insulate a bit, cut down on noise, etc. Downsides?
possibly having to build new doors. hmmm. I think I'm going to get
some of this foam and do some testing. While I'm on this voyage of discovery,
anyone want to give their opinion? A search of the archives only had one entry
on the subject, and it had not much detail.
>
> cj
> #40410
> finishing/FF/various science projects
> www.perfectlygoodairplane.net
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Feb 26, 2008
From: Tim Olson <Tim(at)MyRV10.com>
Subject: Re: Urethane pourable expanding foam in doors?
There are people who have put fabric on their doors who already
can't get the lift cylinders to stay up well. It would
only get worse over time. Mine work good, but I would never
bother filling them with foam.
If you want me to be blunt, I could just say
"Hey cj, that's a dumb idea." But instead, I'll just
say......is it really worth the possible downsides? :)
I think you'll find that just having fabric on the inside of the
plane will deaden echo'd sounds, and make it pretty quiet.
And, warmth wise you really have no concerns. The heat
output in the -10 is incredible. I fly in 10F weather with
no jacket in the plane because you can easily warm it
comfortable with 1/2 heat. I can't even use full heat.
Anyway, you got my .02. No offense, just havin' fun.
Tim
Chris Johnston wrote:
> Hey all -
>
> I know someone around here has thought about filling the doors with
> an expanding foam to give them some density and make 'em be less
> flimsy. Anyone care to speculate if you'd split your door in two by
> doing this? I was thinking something like this:
>
> http://jgreer.com/Foam%20Page.htm
>
> I called and spoke with John Greer there and tried to explain myself.
> "uh, so, I'm building an airplane, and I was thinking..." you know
> how those conversations go. I asked if he thought I'd blow up the
> door by filling it with that stuff, and he said he didn't think so.
> After thinking about it a bit, I think I agree. My reasoning: on
> his website (and others with similar products) there's a picture of a
> paper cup with some foam that has been poured and expanded in it.
> the foam expands over the top, and creates a muffin-top type
> situation. the paper cup retains it's shape, and doesn't split. So,
> think I, as long as you have open space for the foam to expand, it's
> not going to split the door.
>
> Now, this is all my hair-brained theory. The leap to filling my
> already-fitting and built doors with something that could destroy
> them gives me pause. The upside to doing this is that it seems like
> it'll make the doors feel much less flimsy, not add too much weight,
> insulate a bit, cut down on noise, etc. Downsides? possibly having
> to build new doors. hmmm. I think I'm going to get some of this
> foam and do some testing. While I'm on this voyage of discovery,
> anyone want to give their opinion? A search of the archives only had
> one entry on the subject, and it had not much detail.
>
> cj #40410 finishing/FF/various science projects
> www.perfectlygoodairplane.net
>
________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Urethane pourable expanding foam in doors?
Date: Feb 27, 2008
From: "McGANN, Ron" <ron.mcgann(at)baesystems.com>
Hey CJ,
Have you installed the windows in the doors yet? I thought the doors
were flimsy too, until I installed the windows. Seem plenty rigid to me
now. With real issues surrounding door fit, the door latch and the
installation of a locking mechanism, rigidity of the door has not been a
concern for me. YMMV tho'
Cheers,
Ron
187 still trying to finish
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Chris
Johnston
Sent: Wednesday, 27 February 2008 7:38 AM
Subject: RV10-List: Urethane pourable expanding foam in doors?
Hey all -
I know someone around here has thought about filling the doors with an
expanding foam to give them some density and make 'em be less flimsy.
Anyone care to speculate if you'd split your door in two by doing this?
I was thinking something like this:
http://jgreer.com/Foam%20Page.htm
I called and spoke with John Greer there and tried to explain myself.
"uh, so, I'm building an airplane, and I was thinking..." you know how
those conversations go. I asked if he thought I'd blow up the door by
filling it with that stuff, and he said he didn't think so. After
thinking about it a bit, I think I agree. My reasoning: on his website
(and others with similar products) there's a picture of a paper cup with
some foam that has been poured and expanded in it. the foam expands
over the top, and creates a muffin-top type situation. the paper cup
retains it's shape, and doesn't split. So, think I, as long as you have
open space for the foam to expand, it's not going to split the door.
Now, this is all my hair-brained theory. The leap to filling my
already-fitting and built doors with something that could destroy them
gives me pause. The upside to doing this is that it seems like it'll
make the doors feel much less flimsy, not add too much weight, insulate
a bit, cut down on noise, etc. Downsides? possibly having to build new
doors. hmmm. I think I'm going to get some of this foam and do some
testing. While I'm on this voyage of discovery, anyone want to give
their opinion? A search of the archives only had one entry on the
subject, and it had not much detail.
cj
#40410
finishing/FF/various science projects
www.perfectlygoodairplane.net
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________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Feb 26, 2008
From: Scott Schmidt <scottmschmidt(at)yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: OSH RV-10 Operatons seminar
I would definitely pay for a few extra days and split your gas Tim to fly over
there and stake it out.
The spots last year were great and it really made it fun to be so close to the
front and not have to walk up and down the busy road.
Scott Schmidt
scottmschmidt(at)yahoo.com
----- Original Message ----
From: Tim Olson <Tim(at)MyRV10.com>
Sent: Sunday, February 24, 2008 6:38:12 AM
Subject: Re: RV10-List: Re: OSH RV-10 Operatons seminar
-->
RV10-List
message
posted
by:
Tim
Olson
I
think
this
year
we
were
also
contemplating
having
me
and/or
Michael
go
over
there
a
little
earlier
so
we
could
get
contiguous
spaces.
I
think
it
was
a
bit
scattered
last
year
and
a
few
of
the
people
who
were
out
there
further
thought
it
would
be
worthwhile
to
get
sites
earlier
and
pay
a
couple
extra
days,
to
get
them
closer.
I'll
touch
base
with
Scott,
but
it
may
be
that
if
others
are
unwilling
to
pick
up
a
couple
more
days
to
be
closer
to
the
group,
that
I'll
still
get
over
there
either
on,
or
before
that
weekend
before,
so
I
can
grab
a
couple
of
them
for
us.
I
definitely
think
we
need
to,
as
a
group,
like
you
mentioned....get
a
single
additional
site
just
for
hanging
out.
It
got
a
bit
tight
at
times
trying
to
cram
all
the
chairs
into
the
end
of
a
site.
It'll
be
sweet
if
we
can
have
better
group
space
this
year.
Personally,
considering
how
close
the
sites
are
to
the
show,
I
think
if
we
grab
some
all
contiguous,
we
should
skip
getting
an
EAA
tent
or
whatever,
and
just
do
it
all
at
the
campsite.
Tim
Olson
-
RV-10
N104CD
-
Flying
do
not
archive
Condrey,
Bob
(US
SSA)
wrote:
>
Sounds
like
a
plan!
>
>
>
>
Bob
>
>
>
>
------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
>
*From:*
owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com
>
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com]
*On
Behalf
Of
>
*speckter(at)comcast.net
>
*Sent:*
Saturday,
February
23,
2008
7:01
PM
>
*To:*
rv10-list(at)matronics.com
>
*Subject:*
Re:
RV10-List:
Re:
OSH
RV-10
Operatons
seminar
>
>
>
>
I
looked
at
the
calendar
and
we
will
probably
arrive
at
OSH
on
the
21
on
>
Monday
again
and
we
can
stake
out
the
sites
on
Tues
the
22.
If
you
want
>
to
be
the
treasurer
again,
I
would
be
greatful.
>
>
>
>
Gary
>
>
>
>
--------------
Original
message
--------------
>
From:
"bcondrey"
>
>
>
-->
RV10-List
message
posted
by:
"bcondrey"
>
>
>
>
Gary,
>
>
>
>
I
will
also
be
there
again
early
but
haven't
really
done
any
>
planning
yet.
I
>
>
thought
last
year
worked
OK,
but
if
somebody
had
ideas
for
>
improvements
I'm
all
>
>
ears.
>
>
>
>
BTW,
last
year
folks
were
very
generous
with
their
contributions
>
during
our
>
>
various
"food
nights"
and
we
overachieved
a
bit...
I
plan
to
use
>
the
excess
>
>
collected
to
partially
offset
cost
for
an
extra
site
to
give
us
>
more
room
for
>
>
gathering
and
socializing
for
the
group.
>
>
>
>
We
can
plan
more
when
it
gets
a
little
closer.
>
>
>
>
Bob
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
Read
this
topic
online
here:
>
>
*>
-->
*
>
>
*
*
>
>
*
*
>
>
**
>
>
**
>
>
**
>
>
**
>
>
**
>
>
**
>
>
**
>
>
*http://www.matronics.com/contribution*
>
>
*
*
>
>
*
>
>
>
*
-
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RV10-List
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-
Use
the
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List
Features
Navigator
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MATRONICS
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Thank
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-Matt
Dralle,
List
Admin.
-->
http://www.matronics.com/contribution
________________________________________________________________________________
From: John Gonzalez <indigoonlatigo(at)msn.com>
Subject: Urethane pourable expanding foam in doors?
Date: Feb 26, 2008
Absolutely do not do this!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
You will find out several things. As has been said, with so little space fo
r the foam to expand into, it can easily seal itself off, leaving no place
for the expansion to go and it will warp and bow out your doors. If you cou
ld have each part half still in their mold halves and then fill it and clos
e the mold, it would be a different story.
"Do Not Seek The Treasure!!!!" Oh Brother Where Art Thou
JOhn G.> Subject: RV10-List: Urethane pourable expanding foam in doors?> Da
-list(at)matronics.com> > Hey all - > > I know someone around here has thought
about filling the doors with an expanding foam to give them some density a
nd make 'em be less flimsy. Anyone care to speculate if you'd split your do
or in two by doing this? I was thinking something like this:> > http://jgre
er.com/Foam%20Page.htm> > I called and spoke with John Greer there and trie
d to explain myself. "uh, so, I'm building an airplane, and I was thinking.
.." you know how those conversations go. I asked if he thought I'd blow up
the door by filling it with that stuff, and he said he didn't think so. Aft
er thinking about it a bit, I think I agree. My reasoning: on his website (
and others with similar products) there's a picture of a paper cup with som
e foam that has been poured and expanded in it. the foam expands over the t
op, and creates a muffin-top type situation. the paper cup retains it's sha
pe, and doesn't split. So, think I, as long as you have open space for the
foam to expand, it's not going to split the door. > > Now, this is all my h
air-brained theory. The leap to filling my already-fitting and built doors
with something that could destroy them gives me pause. The upside to doing
this is that it seems like it'll make the doors feel much less flimsy, not
add too much weight, insulate a bit, cut down on noise, etc. Downsides? pos
sibly having to build new doors. hmmm. I think I'm going to get some of thi
s foam and do some testing. While I'm on this voyage of discovery, anyone w
ant to give their opinion? A search of the archives only had one entry on t
he subject, and it had not much detail.> > cj> #40410> finishing/FF/various
science projects> www.perfectlygoodairplane.net>
________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Feb 26, 2008
From: linn Walters <pitts_pilot(at)bellsouth.net>
Subject: Re: Urethane pourable expanding foam in doors?
Been there, done that .... but not on parts like these doors. If you
decide to go down this path .... and I think it's a good idea .... there
are a few things you can control, and a few that you can't.
You really should make some weep holes along the cavity ..... a place
for the pressure to go. Plug these with a tapered plug that's snug, not
tight. At any signs of swelling, pull the plugs.
The pressure can get fairly high per sq. in., but having a close space
makes the foam denser, and therefore stronger. If there's a seam that
didn't get sufficient epoxy, it may part.
To do a good job, you need to get the liquid foam to coat the whole
cavity before it flashes off. The cooler you keep it, the longer your
working time. once it starts to kick, it generates it's own heat and
it'll run away pretty quickly.
You need to have some way to get the liquid mix into the cavity .....
you may be able to take a baggie, cut a corner off, and tape a tube in
the hole. Fill the baggie with the mix, and squeeze it like a bakers
icing bag into the cavity. I had a machine that mixed the two parts and
I could spray it into a cavity.
Having gone all through this, if there's a boat manufacturer near you,
they have the machine to spray foam into flotation places and can give
you some pointers.
Linn
Chris Johnston wrote:
>Hey all -
>
>I know someone around here has thought about filling the doors with an expanding
foam to give them some density and make 'em be less flimsy. Anyone care to
speculate if you'd split your door in two by doing this? I was thinking something
like this:
>
>http://jgreer.com/Foam%20Page.htm
>
>I called and spoke with John Greer there and tried to explain myself. "uh, so,
I'm building an airplane, and I was thinking..." you know how those conversations
go. I asked if he thought I'd blow up the door by filling it with that
stuff, and he said he didn't think so. After thinking about it a bit, I think
I agree. My reasoning: on his website (and others with similar products) there's
a picture of a paper cup with some foam that has been poured and expanded
in it. the foam expands over the top, and creates a muffin-top type situation.
the paper cup retains it's shape, and doesn't split. So, think I, as long
as you have open space for the foam to expand, it's not going to split the
door.
>
>Now, this is all my hair-brained theory. The leap to filling my already-fitting
and built doors with something that could destroy them gives me pause. The
upside to doing this is that it seems like it'll make the doors feel much less
flimsy, not add too much weight, insulate a bit, cut down on noise, etc. Downsides?
possibly having to build new doors. hmmm. I think I'm going to get
some of this foam and do some testing. While I'm on this voyage of discovery,
anyone want to give their opinion? A search of the archives only had one entry
on the subject, and it had not much detail.
>
>cj
>#40410
>finishing/FF/various science projects
>www.perfectlygoodairplane.net
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: BA Prop Part II - Paint
Date: Feb 26, 2008
From: "Robin Marks" <robin1(at)mrmoisture.com>
Seeing that my last question about a BA prop ended in a discussion about
male performance related issues I am hesitant to ask a follow up but
here it goes...
I always lusted after the custom painted composite props and assumed
that I could not paint my BA prop till I saw an RV-10 for sale on
Barnstormers with a painted prop. I am beginning to feel my life can now
be complete.
Any comments on the practicality of painting this prop full length or
just a modified paint scheme on the tip (extended)?
Robin
________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Feb 26, 2008
From: groves(at)epix.net
Subject: Re: BA Prop Part II - Paint
You can definitely paint the BA prop!! Hartzell will do it for you.
Kirk
Quoting Robin Marks :
> Seeing that my last question about a BA prop ended in a discussion about
> male performance related issues I am hesitant to ask a follow up but
> here it goes...
>
> I always lusted after the custom painted composite props and assumed
> that I could not paint my BA prop till I saw an RV-10 for sale on
> Barnstormers with a painted prop. I am beginning to feel my life can now
> be complete.
>
> Any comments on the practicality of painting this prop full length or
> just a modified paint scheme on the tip (extended)?
>
>
> Robin
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Unusual paint ridge around windows
From: "zackrv8" <zackrv8(at)verizon.net>
Date: Feb 26, 2008
John,
After you painted the door with Imron, did you bake the paint to help it dry
or did you let it air dry?
Zack
--------
RV8 #80125
RV10 # 40512
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=166516#166516
________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Dave Saylor" <Dave(at)AirCraftersLLC.com>
Subject: Unusual paint ridge around windows
Date: Feb 26, 2008
John,
I think you're right, there must have been a reaction. Let's see, Weld-On,
base resin, plexiglass, West System, Smooth Prime, primer, and Imron...quite
a few volatile chemicals all in close proximity.
I would have thought the overlay would have taken care of that. I did
something similar around the windsheild of mine, but the overlay went on
many months after the bond was cured. Maybe that made a
difference--allowing the bond to cure fully. Also, I used Hysol instead of
WeldOn, just because we use it alot, not because of any other
characteristics.
Wish I had something better to tell you.
Dave Saylor
AirCrafters LLC
140 Aviation Way
Watsonville, CA
831-722-9141
831-750-0284 CL
www.AirCraftersLLC.com
_____
From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of John Testement
Sent: Tuesday, February 26, 2008 12:34 PM
Subject: RE: RV10-List: Unusual paint ridge around windows
Dave,
The ridge is just over the Weld On seam between the plexi and fiberglass.
Its as though the Weld On expanded when painted over. I used West System
epoxy.
John
_____
From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Dave Saylor
Sent: Tuesday, February 26, 2008 1:26 PM
Subject: RE: RV10-List: Unusual paint ridge around windows
John,
The ridge looks like it's at the edge of the fiberglass. Is that right, or
is the edge of the fiberglass further from the plex? What type of resin did
you use to overlay the seam?
Dave Saylor
AirCrafters LLC
140 Aviation Way
Watsonville, CA
831-722-9141
831-750-0284 CL
www.AirCraftersLLC.com
_____
From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of John Testement
Sent: Monday, February 25, 2008 2:36 PM
Subject: RV10-List: Unusual paint ridge around windows
I have had an unusual situation with the door windows when painting and want
to see if anyone else has seen a similar problem.
After painting the doors a small ridge developed above the
Plexiglas-fiberglass joint - it is about 1/4 wide and 1/16 high. The area
was level and smooth after priming. I used the Weld On 10 and put a thin
layer of fiberglass over the seam. I then primed with UV SmoothPrime and
primed over that with the Dupont high build primer. All looked good until we
painted the final color and clear coat (Imron). It seems like some kind of
chemical reaction.
Anyone else seen this? Any ideas? Suggestions on how to best fix and avoid
this on the other windows?
I have attached a few photos - a little hard to see the ridge.
Thanks for you input.
John Testement
jwt(at)roadmapscoaching.com
40321
Richmond, VA
Painting in sections and LOTS of little stuff
2/23/2008 9:35 PM
href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List">http://www.matronics.com
/Navigator?RV10-List
href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com
href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c
2/23/2008 9:35 PM
________________________________________________________________________________
From: "gary" <speckter(at)comcast.net>
Subject: Unusual paint ridge around windows
Date: Feb 27, 2008
I don't know what caused the ridge, but when I got a crack around one of the
windows on a plane I built 20 years ago that followed the contour of the
window like your's does, I took some pinstripe tape from an auto store and
overlaid it on the crack/ridge in your case/. It hid the crack and I didn't
have to repaint. You might try that and see what you think.
Gary
40274
_____
From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Dave Saylor
Sent: Wednesday, February 27, 2008 1:25 AM
Subject: RE: RV10-List: Unusual paint ridge around windows
John,
I think you're right, there must have been a reaction. Let's see, Weld-On,
base resin, plexiglass, West System, Smooth Prime, primer, and Imron...quite
a few volatile chemicals all in close proximity.
I would have thought the overlay would have taken care of that. I did
something similar around the windsheild of mine, but the overlay went on
many months after the bond was cured. Maybe that made a
difference--allowing the bond to cure fully. Also, I used Hysol instead of
WeldOn, just because we use it alot, not because of any other
characteristics.
Wish I had something better to tell you.
Dave Saylor
AirCrafters LLC
140 Aviation Way
Watsonville, CA
831-722-9141
831-750-0284 CL
www.AirCraftersLLC.com
_____
From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of John Testement
Sent: Tuesday, February 26, 2008 12:34 PM
Subject: RE: RV10-List: Unusual paint ridge around windows
Dave,
The ridge is just over the Weld On seam between the plexi and fiberglass.
Its as though the Weld On expanded when painted over. I used West System
epoxy.
John
_____
From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Dave Saylor
Sent: Tuesday, February 26, 2008 1:26 PM
Subject: RE: RV10-List: Unusual paint ridge around windows
John,
The ridge looks like it's at the edge of the fiberglass. Is that right, or
is the edge of the fiberglass further from the plex? What type of resin did
you use to overlay the seam?
Dave Saylor
AirCrafters LLC
140 Aviation Way
Watsonville, CA
831-722-9141
831-750-0284 CL
www.AirCraftersLLC.com
_____
From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of John Testement
Sent: Monday, February 25, 2008 2:36 PM
Subject: RV10-List: Unusual paint ridge around windows
I have had an unusual situation with the door windows when painting and want
to see if anyone else has seen a similar problem.
After painting the doors a small ridge developed above the
Plexiglas-fiberglass joint - it is about 1/4 wide and 1/16 high. The area
was level and smooth after priming. I used the Weld On 10 and put a thin
layer of fiberglass over the seam. I then primed with UV SmoothPrime and
primed over that with the Dupont high build primer. All looked good until we
painted the final color and clear coat (Imron). It seems like some kind of
chemical reaction.
Anyone else seen this? Any ideas? Suggestions on how to best fix and avoid
this on the other windows?
I have attached a few photos - a little hard to see the ridge.
Thanks for you input.
John Testement
jwt(at)roadmapscoaching.com
40321
Richmond, VA
Painting in sections and LOTS of little stuff
2/23/2008 9:35 PM
href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List">http://www.matronics.com
/Navigator?RV10-List
href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com
href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c
2/23/2008 9:35 PM
href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List">http://www.matronics.com
/Navigator?RV10-List
href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com
href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c
________________________________________________________________________________
From: GRANSCOTT(at)aol.com
Date: Feb 27, 2008
Subject: Re: Urethane pourable expanding foam in doors?
CJ,
What happens to Urethane when it burns...what types of gasing off are you
going to get as the foam expands and continues to gas-off. Some applications
of expandables can cause irritation to lungs and soft tissues both immediately
and long term migration.
P
**************Ideas to please picky eaters. Watch video on AOL Living.
(http://living.aol.com/video/how-to-please-your-picky-eater/rachel-campos-duffy/
2050827?NCID=aolcmp00300000002598)
________________________________________________________________________________
From: John Gonzalez <indigoonlatigo(at)MSN.COM>
Subject: Unusual paint ridge around windows
Date: Feb 27, 2008
When you guys say you are overlaying glass over the seam, what are you usin
g, what weight of weave, how many laminations? What I am wondering is once
you have done this, are you building up the rest of the cabin top to match
the contour which this overlay has created, or are you sanding the overlay
down so much that it really is much thinner than it was when in full form?
John G. 409
From: Dave(at)AirCraftersLLC.comTo: rv10-list(at)matronics.comSubject: RE: RV10-L
ist: Unusual paint ridge around windowsDate: Tue, 26 Feb 2008 22:24:54 -080
0
John,
I think you're right, there must have been a reaction. Let's see, Weld-On,
base resin, plexiglass, West System, Smooth Prime, primer, and Imron...qui
te a few volatile chemicals all in close proximity.
I would have thought the overlay would have taken care of that. I did some
thing similar around the windsheild of mine, but the overlay went on many m
onths after the bond was cured. Maybe that made a difference--allowing the
bond to cure fully. Also, I used Hysol instead of WeldOn, just because we
use it alot, not because of any other characteristics.
Wish I had something better to tell you.
Dave Saylor
AirCrafters LLC
140 Aviation Way
Watsonville, CA
831-722-9141
831-750-0284 CL
www.AirCraftersLLC.com
From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@m
atronics.com] On Behalf Of John TestementSent: Tuesday, February 26, 2008 1
2:34 PMTo: rv10-list(at)matronics.comSubject: RE: RV10-List: Unusual paint rid
ge around windows
Dave,
The ridge is just over the Weld On seam between the plexi and fiberglass. I
ts as though the Weld On expanded when painted over. I used West System ep
oxy.
John
From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@m
atronics.com] On Behalf Of Dave SaylorSent: Tuesday, February 26, 2008 1:26
PMTo: rv10-list(at)matronics.comSubject: RE: RV10-List: Unusual paint ridge a
round windows
John,
The ridge looks like it's at the edge of the fiberglass. Is that right, or
is the edge of the fiberglass further from the plex? What type of resin d
id you use to overlay the seam?
Dave Saylor
AirCrafters LLC
140 Aviation Way
Watsonville, CA
831-722-9141
831-750-0284 CL
www.AirCraftersLLC.com
From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@m
atronics.com] On Behalf Of John TestementSent: Monday, February 25, 2008 2:
36 PMTo: rv10-list(at)matronics.comSubject: RV10-List: Unusual paint ridge aro
und windows
I have had an unusual situation with the door windows when painting and wan
t to see if anyone else has seen a similar problem.
After painting the doors a small ridge developed above the Plexiglas-fiberg
lass joint - it is about 1/4 wide and 1/16 high. The area was level and smo
oth after priming. I used the Weld On 10 and put a thin layer of fiberglass
over the seam. I then primed with UV SmoothPrime and primed over that with
the Dupont high build primer. All looked good until we painted the final c
olor and clear coat (Imron). It seems like some kind of chemical reaction.
Anyone else seen this? Any ideas? Suggestions on how to best fix and avoid
this on the other windows?
I have attached a few photos - a little hard to see the ridge.
Thanks for you input.
John Testementjwt(at)roadmapscoaching.com40321
Richmond, VAPainting in sections and LOTS of little stuff
2/23/2008 9:35 PM
href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List">http://www.matronics.
com/Navigator?RV10-List
href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com
href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c
008 9:35 PM
href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List">http://www.matronics.
com/Navigator?RV10-List
href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com
href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c
________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Urethane pourable expanding foam in doors?
From: "Jon Reining" <jonathan.w.reining(at)wellsfargo.com>
Date: Feb 27, 2008
I just foamed the walls of my house for insulation and went through a pretty extensive
search. There's a big difference between the open and closed cell foam.
Its looks like you're looking at closed cell foam. The open cell foam tends
to weigh less, but also have a pretty huge expansion factor when its applied.
So I'd definitely stay away from that.
The closed cell foam doesn't expand as much, is denser (and weighs more) but also
adds quite a bit of structural strength.
I ended up going with closed cell foam that is made primarily from soy beans and
had an R value of like 7.5 per inch of foam. As an insulator on a house its
awesome.
So, to apply all this to airplane building... I don't think its entirely crazy,
but I'd be especially careful. Perhaps glass up a simulated door cavity and
try it out and see how you like it.
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=166588#166588
________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Rene Felker" <rene(at)felker.com>
Subject: Re: Urethane pourable expanding foam in doors?
Date: Feb 27, 2008
Just one thought on the foam. You also have to be concerned about water
absorption and UV and heat affects.
Rene' Felker
N423CF
40322
801-721-6080
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Jon Reining
Sent: Wednesday, February 27, 2008 10:26 AM
Subject: RV10-List: Re: Urethane pourable expanding foam in doors?
I just foamed the walls of my house for insulation and went through a pretty
extensive search. There's a big difference between the open and closed cell
foam. Its looks like you're looking at closed cell foam. The open cell
foam tends to weigh less, but also have a pretty huge expansion factor when
its applied. So I'd definitely stay away from that.
The closed cell foam doesn't expand as much, is denser (and weighs more) but
also adds quite a bit of structural strength.
I ended up going with closed cell foam that is made primarily from soy beans
and had an R value of like 7.5 per inch of foam. As an insulator on a house
its awesome.
So, to apply all this to airplane building... I don't think its entirely
crazy, but I'd be especially careful. Perhaps glass up a simulated door
cavity and try it out and see how you like it.
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=166588#166588
________________________________________________________________________________
From: "gary" <speckter(at)comcast.net>
Subject: Unusual paint ridge around windows
Date: Feb 27, 2008
I usually use one layer of about 8 oz and one layer of 4 oz on top of that.
I make it wide enough to cover the joint between the plex and the frame and
to extend up on the plex about 1" and back on the frame at least 2". Yes
you work to make a smooth transition between the glass and the frame with
micro and epoxy. If you want more detailed instructions e-mail me off line.
Gary
40274
_____
From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of John Gonzalez
Sent: Wednesday, February 27, 2008 10:16 AM
Subject: RE: RV10-List: Unusual paint ridge around windows
When you guys say you are overlaying glass over the seam, what are you
using, what weight of weave, how many laminations? What I am wondering is
once you have done this, are you building up the rest of the cabin top to
match the contour which this overlay has created, or are you sanding the
overlay down so much that it really is much thinner than it was when in full
form?
John G. 409
_____
From: Dave(at)AirCraftersLLC.com
Subject: RE: RV10-List: Unusual paint ridge around windows
Date: Tue, 26 Feb 2008 22:24:54 -0800
John,
I think you're right, there must have been a reaction. Let's see, Weld-On,
base resin, plexiglass, West System, Smooth Prime, primer, and Imron...quite
a few volatile chemicals all in close proximity.
I would have thought the overlay would have taken care of that. I did
something similar around the windsheild of mine, but the overlay went on
many months after the bond was cured. Maybe that made a
difference--allowing the bond to cure fully. Also, I used Hysol instead of
WeldOn, just because we use it alot, not because of any other
characteristics.
Wish I had something better to tell you.
Dave Saylor
AirCrafters LLC
140 Aviation Way
Watsonville, CA
831-722-9141
831-750-0284 CL
www.AirCraftersLLC.com
_____
From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of John Testement
Sent: Tuesday, February 26, 2008 12:34 PM
Subject: RE: RV10-List: Unusual paint ridge around windows
Dave,
The ridge is just over the Weld On seam between the plexi and fiberglass.
Its as though the Weld On expanded when painted over. I used West System
epoxy.
John
_____
From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Dave Saylor
Sent: Tuesday, February 26, 2008 1:26 PM
Subject: RE: RV10-List: Unusual paint ridge around windows
John,
The ridge looks like it's at the edge of the fiberglass. Is that right, or
is the edge of the fiberglass further from the plex? What type of resin did
you use to overlay the seam?
Dave Saylor
AirCrafters LLC
140 Aviation Way
Watsonville, CA
831-722-9141
831-750-0284 CL
www.AirCraftersLLC.com
_____
From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of John Testement
Sent: Monday, February 25, 2008 2:36 PM
Subject: RV10-List: Unusual paint ridge around windows
I have had an unusual situation with the door windows when painting and want
to see if anyone else has seen a similar problem.
After painting the doors a small ridge developed above the
Plexiglas-fiberglass joint - it is about 1/4 wide and 1/16 high. The area
was level and smooth after priming. I used the Weld On 10 and put a thin
layer of fiberglass over the seam. I then primed with UV SmoothPrime and
primed over that with the Dupont high build primer. All looked good until we
painted the final color and clear coat (Imron). It seems like some kind of
chemical reaction.
Anyone else seen this? Any ideas? Suggestions on how to best fix and avoid
this on the other windows?
I have attached a few photos - a little hard to see the ridge.
Thanks for you input.
John Testement
jwt(at)roadmapscoaching.com
40321
Richmond, VA
Painting in sections and LOTS of little stuff
2/23/2008 9:35 PM
href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List">http://www.matronics.com
/Navigator?RV10-List
href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com
href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c
ONT> size=2>Version: 7.5.516 /
2/23/2008 9:35 PM
href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List">http://www.matronics.com
/Navigator?RV10-List
href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com
href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c
get=_blank>http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List
p://forums.matronics.com
blank>http://www.matronics.com/contribution
________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Neal George" <n8zg(at)mchsi.com>
Subject: Unusual paint ridge around windows
Date: Feb 27, 2008
GRENADE !
(sorry - couldn't help it)
_____
From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of gary
Sent: Wednesday, February 27, 2008 1:56 PM
Subject: RE: RV10-List: Unusual paint ridge around windows
I usually use one layer of about 8 oz and one layer of 4 oz on top of that.
I make it wide enough to cover the joint between the plex and the frame and
to extend up on the plex about 1" and back on the frame at least 2". Yes
you work to make a smooth transition between the glass and the frame with
micro and epoxy. If you want more detailed instructions e-mail me off line.
Gary
40274
_____
From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of John Gonzalez
Sent: Wednesday, February 27, 2008 10:16 AM
Subject: RE: RV10-List: Unusual paint ridge around windows
When you guys say you are overlaying glass over the seam, what are you
using, what weight of weave, how many laminations? What I am wondering is
once you have done this, are you building up the rest of the cabin top to
match the contour which this overlay has created, or are you sanding the
overlay down so much that it really is much thinner than it was when in full
form?
John G. 409
_____
From: Dave(at)AirCraftersLLC.com
Subject: RE: RV10-List: Unusual paint ridge around windows
Date: Tue, 26 Feb 2008 22:24:54 -0800
John,
I think you're right, there must have been a reaction. Let's see, Weld-On,
base resin, plexiglass, West System, Smooth Prime, primer, and Imron...quite
a few volatile chemicals all in close proximity.
I would have thought the overlay would have taken care of that. I did
something similar around the windsheild of mine, but the overlay went on
many months after the bond was cured. Maybe that made a
difference--allowing the bond to cure fully. Also, I used Hysol instead of
WeldOn, just because we use it alot, not because of any other
characteristics.
Wish I had something better to tell you.
Dave Saylor
AirCrafters LLC
140 Aviation Way
Watsonville, CA
831-722-9141
831-750-0284 CL
www.AirCraftersLLC.com
_____
From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of John Testement
Sent: Tuesday, February 26, 2008 12:34 PM
Subject: RE: RV10-List: Unusual paint ridge around windows
Dave,
The ridge is just over the Weld On seam between the plexi and fiberglass.
Its as though the Weld On expanded when painted over. I used West System
epoxy.
John
_____
From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Dave Saylor
Sent: Tuesday, February 26, 2008 1:26 PM
Subject: RE: RV10-List: Unusual paint ridge around windows
John,
The ridge looks like it's at the edge of the fiberglass. Is that right, or
is the edge of the fiberglass further from the plex? What type of resin did
you use to overlay the seam?
Dave Saylor
AirCrafters LLC
140 Aviation Way
Watsonville, CA
831-722-9141
831-750-0284 CL
www.AirCraftersLLC.com
_____
From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of John Testement
Sent: Monday, February 25, 2008 2:36 PM
Subject: RV10-List: Unusual paint ridge around windows
I have had an unusual situation with the door windows when painting and want
to see if anyone else has seen a similar problem.
After painting the doors a small ridge developed above the
Plexiglas-fiberglass joint - it is about 1/4 wide and 1/16 high. The area
was level and smooth after priming. I used the Weld On 10 and put a thin
layer of fiberglass over the seam. I then primed with UV SmoothPrime and
primed over that with the Dupont high build primer. All looked good until we
painted the final color and clear coat (Imron). It seems like some kind of
chemical reaction.
Anyone else seen this? Any ideas? Suggestions on how to best fix and avoid
this on the other windows?
I have attached a few photos - a little hard to see the ridge.
Thanks for you input.
John Testement
jwt(at)roadmapscoaching.com
40321
Richmond, VA
Painting in sections and LOTS of little stuff
2/23/2008 9:35 PM
href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List">http://www.matronics.com
/Navigator?RV10-List
href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com
href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c
ONT> size=2>Version: 7.5.516 /
2/23/2008 9:35 PM
href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List">http://www.matronics.com
/Navigator?RV10-List
href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com
href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c
get=_blank>http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List
p://forums.matronics.com
blank>http://www.matronics.com/contribution
http://www.matronics.com/contribution
________________________________________________________________________________
From: "John Testement" <jwt(at)roadmapscoaching.com>
Subject: Unusual paint ridge around windows
Date: Feb 27, 2008
I have just been using one layer of the lightest weight glass I can find (I
think 1oz). I have to be careful not to sand through it.
John
_____
From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of John Gonzalez
Sent: Wednesday, February 27, 2008 10:16 AM
Subject: RE: RV10-List: Unusual paint ridge around windows
When you guys say you are overlaying glass over the seam, what are you
using, what weight of weave, how many laminations? What I am wondering is
once you have done this, are you building up the rest of the cabin top to
match the contour which this overlay has created, or are you sanding the
overlay down so much that it really is much thinner than it was when in full
form?
John G. 409
_____
From: Dave(at)AirCraftersLLC.com
Subject: RE: RV10-List: Unusual paint ridge around windows
Date: Tue, 26 Feb 2008 22:24:54 -0800
John,
I think you're right, there must have been a reaction. Let's see, Weld-On,
base resin, plexiglass, West System, Smooth Prime, primer, and Imron...quite
a few volatile chemicals all in close proximity.
I would have thought the overlay would have taken care of that. I did
something similar around the windsheild of mine, but the overlay went on
many months after the bond was cured. Maybe that made a
difference--allowing the bond to cure fully. Also, I used Hysol instead of
WeldOn, just because we use it alot, not because of any other
characteristics.
Wish I had something better to tell you.
Dave Saylor
AirCrafters LLC
140 Aviation Way
Watsonville, CA
831-722-9141
831-750-0284 CL
www.AirCraftersLLC.com
_____
From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of John Testement
Sent: Tuesday, February 26, 2008 12:34 PM
Subject: RE: RV10-List: Unusual paint ridge around windows
Dave,
The ridge is just over the Weld On seam between the plexi and fiberglass.
Its as though the Weld On expanded when painted over. I used West System
epoxy.
John
_____
From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Dave Saylor
Sent: Tuesday, February 26, 2008 1:26 PM
Subject: RE: RV10-List: Unusual paint ridge around windows
John,
The ridge looks like it's at the edge of the fiberglass. Is that right, or
is the edge of the fiberglass further from the plex? What type of resin did
you use to overlay the seam?
Dave Saylor
AirCrafters LLC
140 Aviation Way
Watsonville, CA
831-722-9141
831-750-0284 CL
www.AirCraftersLLC.com
_____
From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of John Testement
Sent: Monday, February 25, 2008 2:36 PM
Subject: RV10-List: Unusual paint ridge around windows
I have had an unusual situation with the door windows when painting and want
to see if anyone else has seen a similar problem.
After painting the doors a small ridge developed above the
Plexiglas-fiberglass joint - it is about 1/4 wide and 1/16 high. The area
was level and smooth after priming. I used the Weld On 10 and put a thin
layer of fiberglass over the seam. I then primed with UV SmoothPrime and
primed over that with the Dupont high build primer. All looked good until we
painted the final color and clear coat (Imron). It seems like some kind of
chemical reaction.
Anyone else seen this? Any ideas? Suggestions on how to best fix and avoid
this on the other windows?
I have attached a few photos - a little hard to see the ridge.
Thanks for you input.
John Testement
HYPERLINK "mailto:jwt(at)roadmapscoaching.com"jwt(at)roadmapscoaching.com
40321
Richmond, VA
Painting in sections and LOTS of little stuff
2/23/2008 9:35 PM
href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List">http://www.matronics.com
/Navigator?RV10-List
href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com
href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c
ONT> size=2>Version: 7.5.516 /
2/23/2008 9:35 PM
href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List">http://www.matronics.com
/Navigator?RV10-List
href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com
href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c
get=_blank>http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List
p://forums.matronics.com
blank>http://www.matronics.com/contribution
"http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List"http://www.matronics.com/Navig
ator?RV10-List
"http://www.matronics.com/contribution"http://www.matronics.com/contribution
8:35 AM
8:35 AM
________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Dave Saylor" <Dave(at)AirCraftersLLC.com>
Subject: Unusual paint ridge around windows
Date: Feb 27, 2008
That's pretty light material. Next time (??) try something like 7781 which
is about 8 oz as Gary suggested. Two layers of that should work fine and
tolerate some pretty significant body work.
_____
From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of John Testement
Sent: Wednesday, February 27, 2008 12:48 PM
Subject: RE: RV10-List: Unusual paint ridge around windows
I have just been using one layer of the lightest weight glass I can find (I
think 1oz). I have to be careful not to sand through it.
John
_____
From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of John Gonzalez
Sent: Wednesday, February 27, 2008 10:16 AM
Subject: RE: RV10-List: Unusual paint ridge around windows
When you guys say you are overlaying glass over the seam, what are you
using, what weight of weave, how many laminations? What I am wondering is
once you have done this, are you building up the rest of the cabin top to
match the contour which this overlay has created, or are you sanding the
overlay down so much that it really is much thinner than it was when in full
form?
John G. 409
_____
From: Dave(at)AirCraftersLLC.com
Subject: RE: RV10-List: Unusual paint ridge around windows
Date: Tue, 26 Feb 2008 22:24:54 -0800
John,
I think you're right, there must have been a reaction. Let's see, Weld-On,
base resin, plexiglass, West System, Smooth Prime, primer, and Imron...quite
a few volatile chemicals all in close proximity.
I would have thought the overlay would have taken care of that. I did
something similar around the windsheild of mine, but the overlay went on
many months after the bond was cured. Maybe that made a
difference--allowing the bond to cure fully. Also, I used Hysol instead of
WeldOn, just because we use it alot, not because of any other
characteristics.
Wish I had something better to tell you.
Dave Saylor
AirCrafters LLC
140 Aviation Way
Watsonville, CA
831-722-9141
831-750-0284 CL
www.AirCraftersLLC.com
_____
From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of John Testement
Sent: Tuesday, February 26, 2008 12:34 PM
Subject: RE: RV10-List: Unusual paint ridge around windows
Dave,
The ridge is just over the Weld On seam between the plexi and fiberglass.
Its as though the Weld On expanded when painted over. I used West System
epoxy.
John
_____
From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Dave Saylor
Sent: Tuesday, February 26, 2008 1:26 PM
Subject: RE: RV10-List: Unusual paint ridge around windows
John,
The ridge looks like it's at the edge of the fiberglass. Is that right, or
is the edge of the fiberglass further from the plex? What type of resin did
you use to overlay the seam?
Dave Saylor
AirCrafters LLC
140 Aviation Way
Watsonville, CA
831-722-9141
831-750-0284 CL
www.AirCraftersLLC.com
_____
From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of John Testement
Sent: Monday, February 25, 2008 2:36 PM
Subject: RV10-List: Unusual paint ridge around windows
I have had an unusual situation with the door windows when painting and want
to see if anyone else has seen a similar problem.
After painting the doors a small ridge developed above the
Plexiglas-fiberglass joint - it is about 1/4 wide and 1/16 high. The area
was level and smooth after priming. I used the Weld On 10 and put a thin
layer of fiberglass over the seam. I then primed with UV SmoothPrime and
primed over that with the Dupont high build primer. All looked good until we
painted the final color and clear coat (Imron). It seems like some kind of
chemical reaction.
Anyone else seen this? Any ideas? Suggestions on how to best fix and avoid
this on the other windows?
I have attached a few photos - a little hard to see the ridge.
Thanks for you input.
John Testement
jwt(at)roadmapscoaching.com
40321
Richmond, VA
Painting in sections and LOTS of little stuff
2/23/2008 9:35 PM
href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List">http://www.matronics.com
/Navigator?RV10-List
href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com
href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c
ONT> size=2>Version: 7.5.516 /
2/23/2008 9:35 PM
href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List">http://www.matronics.com
/Navigator?RV10-List
href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com
href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c
get=_blank>http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List
p://forums.matronics.com
blank>http://www.matronics.com/contribution
href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List">http://www.matronics.com
/Navigator?RV10-List
href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com
href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c
2/27/2008 8:35 AM
________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Urethane pourable expanding foam in doors?
Date: Feb 27, 2008
From: "Chris Johnston" <CJohnston(at)popsound.com>
Thanks for all the input everyone. Sometimes I get nutty ideas while
I'm sitting here at work, and I need people to tell me they're nutty.
Sheesh. It's not like I don't have other building tasks to work on :)
I'll just build on, and forgo the foam-core-door idea.
cj
________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: eggenfellner engine ordered-concerns about sole supplier
From: "tomhanaway" <tomhanaway(at)comcast.net>
Date: Feb 28, 2008
I posted this over on VAF forums but thought I'd put it here since the readership
is slightly different.
I've ordered a 3.6L turbo for my rv-10. The one thing I'm having trouble with is
the idea of sole supplier or possible orphan status of the engine/psru/turbo
etc.
I really like Jan's subaru concept and definitely not looking to bash in any way.
If he should suddenly go out of business or no longer be available to provide psru's,
what are the alternatives for those that have puchased this package?
I understand with a lycoming/clone that there are several alternative suppliers,
any thoughts or comments?
Thanks,
Tom Hanaway
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=166747#166747
________________________________________________________________________________
From: <rv(at)thelefflers.com>
Subject: Re: eggenfellner engine ordered-concerns about sole supplier
Date: Feb 28, 2008
I fully understand your anxiety. Not bashing Jan or his company in any way, this
is one of the reasons I decided not to pursue an Egg for my RV-10. This,
along with education I received in assisting Dan, it became very apparent that
experimenting with alternative engines required more skill and experience than
I have.
I chose to go a more conservative approach to go with an engine that I can get
assistance from the local FBO if needed.
I haven't made my final decision on vendor and probably won't until around Airventure
time. The good news is that there are plenty to choose from offering very
similiar products.
>
> From: "tomhanaway" <tomhanaway(at)comcast.net>
> Date: 2008/02/28 Thu AM 11:29:48 EST
> To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com
> Subject: RV10-List: eggenfellner engine ordered-concerns about sole supplier
>
>
> I posted this over on VAF forums but thought I'd put it here since the readership
is slightly different.
>
> I've ordered a 3.6L turbo for my rv-10. The one thing I'm having trouble with
is the idea of sole supplier or possible orphan status of the engine/psru/turbo
etc.
>
> I really like Jan's subaru concept and definitely not looking to bash in any
way.
>
> If he should suddenly go out of business or no longer be available to provide
psru's, what are the alternatives for those that have puchased this package?
>
> I understand with a lycoming/clone that there are several alternative suppliers,
any thoughts or comments?
>
> Thanks,
> Tom Hanaway
>
________________________________________________________________________________
From: GRANSCOTT(at)aol.com
Date: Feb 28, 2008
Subject: Re: eggenfellner engine ordered-concerns about sole supplier
In a message dated 2/28/2008 10:35:54 AM Central Standard Time,
tomhanaway(at)comcast.net writes:
I understand with a lycoming/clone that there are several alternative
suppliers, any thoughts or comments?
Thanks,
Tom Hanaway
you put down your money and you take your chances...after all it's
experimental...so you are the builder and can make any part for your aircraft...
P
**************Ideas to please picky eaters. Watch video on AOL Living.
(http://living.aol.com/video/how-to-please-your-picky-eater/rachel-campos-duffy/
2050827?NCID=aolcmp00300000002598)
________________________________________________________________________________
From: Damon Wack <dwack(at)flbb.net>
Subject: engine question
Date: Feb 28, 2008
Hey all, I have been lurking on the list for a month or so, I'm
interested in building a 10, and obviously have many questions. I live
in FL and plan on being at Sun N' Fun to ask most of them, but the
engine thread compels me to ask, with the threat of avgas disappearing
sometime in the future, is anybody considering a diesel engine? Do
they make a 260 hp diesel or comparable yet? I have heard a few are
out there, French manufacture I believe, but know next to nothing of
these
Thanks in advance!
Damon
ps. Hey Chris, I got the Apple TV and I am very happy! Thanks for all
your help! Enjoyed your website as well, nice job!
________________________________________________________________________________
From: GRANSCOTT(at)aol.com
Date: Feb 28, 2008
Subject: Re: eggenfellner engine ordered-concerns about sole supplier
I really think one of the only concerns one would have with an experimental
engine would be if you have an engine problem away from your base, it may be
hard for a while to find an A&P that would want to work on it and sign your
log if you were not capable of doing the work or didn't have tools, etc.
**************Ideas to please picky eaters. Watch video on AOL Living.
(http://living.aol.com/video/how-to-please-your-picky-eater/rachel-campos-duffy/
2050827?NCID=aolcmp00300000002598)
________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Feb 28, 2008
From: "Pascal" <rv10builder(at)verizon.net>
Subject: Re: engine question
Those French you mention (SMAengines) wont do anything unless Van's agrees
to be a distributor, aka they are not interested in selling to individuals.
I know there was a few others but as far as I know none really as in
production for the experimental market. I figure there are way too many
engines out there for there to be a short term issue on fuel use.
Welcome aboard! Make sure you find Jesse when you're at SnF, he'll be a
great asset if you do.
Pascal
----- Original Message -----
From: "Damon Wack" <dwack(at)flbb.net>
Sent: Thursday, February 28, 2008 12:17 PM
Subject: RV10-List: engine question
>
> Hey all, I have been lurking on the list for a month or so, I'm interested
> in building a 10, and obviously have many questions. I live in FL and
> plan on being at Sun N' Fun to ask most of them, but the engine thread
> compels me to ask, with the threat of avgas disappearing sometime in the
> future, is anybody considering a diesel engine? Do they make a 260 hp
> diesel or comparable yet? I have heard a few are out there, French
> manufacture I believe, but know next to nothing of these
>
> Thanks in advance!
>
> Damon
>
> ps. Hey Chris, I got the Apple TV and I am very happy! Thanks for all
> your help! Enjoyed your website as well, nice job!
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Feb 28, 2008
From: "Kelly McMullen" <apilot2(at)gmail.com>
Subject: Re: engine question
If you wanted to hedge your bets, you can control the compression and
either go with
235 or 250hp engine, with plenty of margin for 96 UL fuel. Heck, 260
should have no trouble with it.
Only the 300 hp versions of the engine and turbo engines really need 100 octane.
Avgas won't disappear, but it may lose lead and octane.
On Thu, Feb 28, 2008 at 1:17 PM, Damon Wack wrote:
>
> Hey all, I have been lurking on the list for a month or so, I'm
> interested in building a 10, and obviously have many questions. I live
> in FL and plan on being at Sun N' Fun to ask most of them, but the
> engine thread compels me to ask, with the threat of avgas disappearing
> sometime in the future, is anybody considering a diesel engine? Do
> they make a 260 hp diesel or comparable yet? I have heard a few are
> out there, French manufacture I believe, but know next to nothing of
> these
>
> Thanks in advance!
>
> Damon
>
> ps. Hey Chris, I got the Apple TV and I am very happy! Thanks for all
> your help! Enjoyed your website as well, nice job!
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Handy HF Stapler (off topic)
From: "Bill Reining" <wreining(at)gmail.com>
Date: Feb 28, 2008
Just thought I'd put in a plug for the pneumatic Harbor Freight "1/2 inch Crown
Stapler", number 46365. I bought one for $30 to attach Tyvek to the exterior
of the sheathing around the carport I'm converting to a garage (RV-10 workshop.)
It works like a champ. It does not have any safety, so it doesn't matter
whether the tool is against anything - if you pull the trigger it fires a staple.
So you have to be a little careful. But it has been firing 1/2 inch long
staples into 1/2 inch thick OSB and fir 2x4's with no problem. To top it off,
I discovered when I unloaded a bag of HF pneumatic couplers I purchased yesterday,
they had included a little book of retail store coupons, with one for
this tool discounted to $10 (valid 3/12 to 3/30). I'm happy to have found it
for $30, but some of you may wish to take advantage of this deal. I do not work
for HF, nor own any of their stock - just thought I'd pass on what appears
to be a bargain.
--------
Bill (and Jon) Reining
40514
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=166875#166875
________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Feb 29, 2008
From: "Pascal" <rv10builder(at)verizon.net>
Subject: Rivethead Door Guide and Pin set
I am looking for real world feedback on the door guide and pin set. Nice
video but hear it doesn't fit as well once the rubber seal is installed
around doors.
Thanks!
Pascal
________________________________________________________________________________
From: "gary" <speckter(at)comcast.net>
Subject: Final assembly
Date: Feb 29, 2008
I finally have the wings and tail on.
Gary
40274
________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Bob Leffler" <rv(at)thelefflers.com>
Subject: Final assembly
Date: Mar 01, 2008
So you and Brenda will each be bringing a RV to OSH this year?
From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of gary
Sent: Friday, February 29, 2008 8:06 PM
Subject: RV10-List: Final assembly
I finally have the wings and tail on.
Gary
40274
________________________________________________________________________________
From: "gary" <speckter(at)comcast.net>
Subject: Final assembly
Date: Mar 01, 2008
We don't know yet about that. I will definitely be bringing the Dolphin.
Not sure yet about the RV10.
Gary
_____
From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Bob Leffler
Sent: Saturday, March 01, 2008 9:15 AM
Subject: RE: RV10-List: Final assembly
So you and Brenda will each be bringing a RV to OSH this year?
From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of gary
Sent: Friday, February 29, 2008 8:06 PM
Subject: RV10-List: Final assembly
I finally have the wings and tail on.
Gary
40274
__________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature
database 2913 (20080301) __________
The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus.
________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Mar 01, 2008
From: Robert Wright <flywrights(at)yahoo.com>
Subject: Engine Iso Mounts
Tried an engine hanging today.
My boss mounts each have a roll pin in the hole that each iso mount fits over to
ensure correct orientation when installing. However, my iso mounts from Van's
do not have the corresponding hole for the pin to sit in.
Which is right, the boss mount or the iso mount? I notice that the plans (FFWD
page 4 or 5?) show the hole as empty, but we know that the pictures are not always
accurate.
Rob Wright
#392
Never miss a thing. Make Yahoo your home page.
http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs
________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Jay Rowe" <jfrjr(at)roadrunner.com>
Subject: counter sinking canopy holes
Date: Mar 01, 2008
Just now installing the seat belts and I need to countersink the canopy
for the large screws that hold the shoulder harness in place. I don't
have, nor can I find, a large enough countersink cutter to do the job.
Any suggestions? Jay Rowe
________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Mar 01, 2008
From: "Pascal" <rv10builder(at)verizon.net>
Subject: Re: Rivethead Door Guide and Pin set
certainly there must be someone who has the Rivethead aero door guide
installed..
Thoughts?
Thanks!
Pascal
----- Original Message -----
From: Pascal
To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com
Sent: Friday, February 29, 2008 12:48 PM
Subject: RV10-List: Rivethead Door Guide and Pin set
I am looking for real world feedback on the door guide and pin set.
Nice video but hear it doesn't fit as well once the rubber seal is
installed around doors.
Thanks!
Pascal
________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Rivethead Door Guide and Pin set
Date: Mar 02, 2008
From: "Robin Marks" <robin1(at)mrmoisture.com>
Pascal, ours work great but the engine was just hung and the front
windscreen has not been installed. Same with the prop, spinner, cowl.
Not really real world feedback but the best I can do.
Robin
http://www.painttheweb.com/rv-10/Doors.htm
________________________________________________________________________________
From: <jim(at)CombsFive.Com>
Subject: Re: Engine Iso Mounts
Date: Mar 02, 2008
Take a punch and drive the pin out. Not needed on the RV-10.
Jim C (N40192)
===========================================================
From: Robert Wright <flywrights(at)yahoo.com>
Date: 2008/03/01 Sat PM 07:12:24 EST
Subject: RV10-List: Engine Iso Mounts
Tried an engine hanging today.
My boss mounts each have a roll pin in the hole that each iso mount fits over to
ensure correct orientation when installing. However, my iso mounts from Van's
do not have the corresponding hole for the pin to sit in.
Which is right, the boss mount or the iso mount? I notice that the plans (FFWD
page 4 or 5?) show the hole as empty, but we know that the pictures are not always
accurate.
Rob Wright
#392
Never miss a thing. Make Yahoo your home page.
http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs
===========================================================
________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: counter sinking canopy holes
From: "Lew Gallagher" <lewgall(at)charter.net>
Date: Mar 02, 2008
Hey John,
Tool sharing?!!! What an awesome offer! Please put us on the list.
Thanks, - Lew
--------
non-pilot
crazy about building
NOW OFICIALLY BUILDER #40549
Landing gear installed, we're mobile!
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=167228#167228
________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Rivethead Door Guide and Pin set
From: "Lew Gallagher" <lewgall(at)charter.net>
Date: Mar 02, 2008
Hey Robin,
Thanks for the door pictures. We just installed the hinges yesterday. Even trying
to pay attention to the unique orientation, I still managed to get one set
on reversed fore and aft!
Here's a couple of questions:
1) It looks on one picture that you have weather stripping installed? Still fit?
I had thought of temporarily attaching the weather strip with something less
sticky than "Gorilla Snot" to get the fit right before final installing.
Weather strip goes on after painting?
2) Did you just drill and tap the canopy hinge to attach the covers? I had thought
of using the scrap fiberglass from the window cutouts instead of metal.
Later, - Lew
--------
non-pilot
crazy about building
NOW OFICIALLY BUILDER #40549
Landing gear installed, we're mobile!
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=167231#167231
________________________________________________________________________________
From: "David McNeill" <dlm46007(at)cox.net>
Subject: fuel pressure
Date: Mar 02, 2008
Just finished the testing of the fuel sensors , EIS 6000 calibration and the
test of the boost pump. The display show only 1.2 psi but the Chelton shows
12 PSI. What PSI are we supposed to see for the Van's injection boost pump?
BTW I suggest pouring some mineral spirits or Av gas through the tanks and
draining through the sump before connecting to your fuel lines and boost
pump. It took four flushes of the right QB tank and two flushes of the left
tank before there were no contaminants showing. Otherwise the proseal
fragments and other debris just collects on the screens and fuel filter. It
requires two -8D caps to seal the ends of the tanks. Also when bending the
wire for the floats be sure to get the piece that penetrates the float bent
at a right angle. If the angle is slightly acute it can bind and cause the
float to stick at empty.
________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Rivethead Door Guide and Pin set
From: "Lew Gallagher" <lewgall(at)charter.net>
Date: Mar 02, 2008
Here's a little before and after I did just now while waiting for the wife to get
more beautiful.
I'm thinking that for sorta a lock, instead of leaving the "button" sticking out
on the outside to push in to release it, I might shave it off so that it's recessed,
weld a cap on it, and then you can insert any key, etc. in it to depress
it. Not much, but somewhat of a deterrent -- and more aerodynamic, weather
tight.
Later, - Lew
--------
non-pilot
crazy about building
NOW OFICIALLY BUILDER #40549
Landing gear installed, we're mobile!
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=167247#167247
Attachments:
http://forums.matronics.com//files/handle_984.jpg
________________________________________________________________________________
From: "David McNeill" <dlm46007(at)cox.net>
Subject: trash in the tanks
Date: Mar 02, 2008
obviously an orange bucket with three gallons of AV gas and the residue at
the bottom. IIRC this was the second flush of the right QB tank.
________________________________________________________________________________
From: "David McNeill" <dlm46007(at)cox.net>
Subject: trash in the tanks correction
Date: Mar 02, 2008
-----Original Message-----
From: David McNeill [mailto:dlm46007(at)cox.net]
Sent: Sunday, March 02, 2008 10:11 AM
Subject: trash in the tanks
obviously an orange bucket with one gallon of mineral spirit and the residue
at the bottom. IIRC this was the second flush of the right QB tank. AV gas
works but the blue dye makes spotting the debris more difficult unless in
direct sunlight.
________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Mar 02, 2008
From: "Pascal" <rv10builder(at)verizon.net>
Subject: Re: Rivethead Door Guide and Pin set
Thanks Robin, not hearing any complaints it actually great feedback.
Thanks!
Pascal
To be clear I know RH Aero takes months so since I am months away I know
I should order them now if I want them by Christmas ;-)
----- Original Message -----
From: Robin Marks
To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com
Sent: Saturday, March 01, 2008 9:44 PM
Subject: RE: RV10-List: Rivethead Door Guide and Pin set
Pascal, ours work great but the engine was just hung and the front
windscreen has not been installed. Same with the prop, spinner, cowl.
Not really real world feedback but the best I can do.
Robin
http://www.painttheweb.com/rv-10/Doors.htm
________________________________________________________________________________
From: John Ackerman <johnag5b(at)cableone.net>
Subject: Re: counter sinking canopy holes
Date: Mar 02, 2008
Lew,
I suggested that it be passed on from builder to builder. I think Jay
is passing it to "Barry in FL. "
I suggest contacting either of them, because I don't know where it's
going once past Deems and Jay.
Best
John 40458
On Mar 2, 2008, at 6:59 AM, Lew Gallagher wrote:
>
> Hey John,
>
> Tool sharing?!!! What an awesome offer! Please put us on the list.
>
> Thanks, - Lew
>
> --------
> non-pilot
> crazy about building
> NOW OFICIALLY BUILDER #40549
> Landing gear installed, we're mobile!
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=167228#167228
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: counter sinking canopy holes
Date: Mar 03, 2008
From: "Patrick Pulis" <patrick.pulis(at)seagas.com.au>
________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Mar 02, 2008
From: rv10builder <rv10builder(at)bellsouth.net>
Subject: Jacking up the -10
Hey all,
I'm trying to figure out the best way to jack up my 99% completed -10 so
that I can complete the fitting of the main gear fairings.
Suggestions? I've got a harbor freight nearby...
Thanks,
Brian
40308
Main gear fairings then inspection!
________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: counter sinking canopy holes
Date: Mar 03, 2008
From: "McGANN, Ron" <ron.mcgann(at)baesystems.com>
Forwarded second attempt from Patrick:
Hi there John, could you please indicate the part number for the
countersink available from Avery as I would like to obtain one to be
sent downunder.
Regarding harnesses, I have just purchased a set colour matched to my
seats from Hookers, they are great, albiet a little pricey, but well
worth the money.
Regards
Patrick Pulis
#40299 VH-XPP
Adelaide, South Australia
"Warning:
The information contained in this email and any attached files is
confidential to BAE Systems Australia. If you are not the intended
recipient, any use, disclosure or copying of this email or any
attachments is expressly prohibited. If you have received this email
in error, please notify us immediately. VIRUS: Every care has been
taken to ensure this email and its attachments are virus free,
however, any loss or damage incurred in using this email is not the
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your computer."
________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Rick Barnes" <rickbarnes(at)highlanddental.com>
Date: Mar 03, 2008
Subject: Rivethead Door Guide and Pin set
Mike Howe and I just installed the after market Rivethead door pin guide
set. We didn't receive any info on the installation from Rivethead. We
used the plastic ones supplied by Van's to mark the holes in the frame. The
new guides didn't line up exactly with Van's. We had to do some
drilling/sanding of the guide to get the pins to fit. Once modified they
seem to hold the door very tight. We don't know how the weather stripping
will affect the fit. We're miles away from that part of the finishing. I
hope this helped some.
Rick
_____
From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Pascal
Sent: Sunday, March 02, 2008 11:22 AM
Subject: Re: RV10-List: Rivethead Door Guide and Pin set
Thanks Robin, not hearing any complaints it actually great feedback.
Thanks!
Pascal
To be clear I know RH Aero takes months so since I am months away I know I
should order them now if I want them by Christmas ;-)
----- Original Message -----
From: Robin Marks <mailto:robin1(at)mrmoisture.com>
Sent: Saturday, March 01, 2008 9:44 PM
Subject: RE: RV10-List: Rivethead Door Guide and Pin set
Pascal, ours work great but the engine was just hung and the front
windscreen has not been installed. Same with the prop, spinner, cowl. Not
really real world feedback but the best I can do.
Robin
http://www.painttheweb.com/rv-10/Doors.htm
href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List">http://www.matronics.com
/Navigator?RV10-List
href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com
href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c
________________________________________________________________________________
From: Vernon Smith <planesmith(at)hotmail.com>
Subject: Lower Cowl Mounts
Date: Mar 03, 2008
Looking through some of the old postings, I found some discussion on replac
ing the lower cowl mounts with nutplates and screws. Are these modified mou
nts still holding up well during flight? Also were #10 countersunk screws a
nd nut plates used? And finally what was the mounting plate made from?
Thanks,
Vern Smith (#324)
_________________________________________________________________
Helping your favorite cause is as easy as instant messaging.-You IM, we g
ive.
________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Rivethead Door Guide and Pin set
Date: Mar 03, 2008
From: "Robin Marks" <robin1(at)mrmoisture.com>
Lew,
The only weather stripping we have is on our inner console, we used Door
Seals for the doors and it took some significant modifications to the
door frame to properly install the door seals. The end result is
fantastic but I am sure there are better door seal choices available.
Yes we drilled & tapped the hinge for 6-32 screws. There is no reason
that fiberglass will not work but we chose aluminum because we could
bend the edges down slightly so they will lay in the recess tightly and
not flex up. Plus we plan to probably powder coat to match other items
we will be powder coating.
One of the mods you did not mention is the fiberglass inner door gap
cover that allows the door seal to make complete contact. We believe
this will make for a quieter & less drafty cockpit.
http://www.painttheweb.com/rv-10/doors.htm
Good luck,
Robin
>>>Hey Robin,
Thanks for the door pictures. We just installed the hinges yesterday.
Even trying to pay attention to the unique orientation, I still managed
to get one set on reversed fore and aft!
Here's a couple of questions:
1) It looks on one picture that you have weather stripping installed?
Still fit? I had thought of temporarily attaching the weather strip
with something less sticky than "Gorilla Snot" to get the fit right
before final installing. Weather strip goes on after painting?
2) Did you just drill and tap the canopy hinge to attach the covers? I
had thought of using the scrap fiberglass from the window cutouts
instead of metal.
Later, - Lew
--------
non-pilot
crazy about building
NOW OFICIALLY BUILDER #40549
Landing gear installed, we're mobile!
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=167231#167231
________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Mar 03, 2008
From: Tim Olson <Tim(at)MyRV10.com>
Subject: Re: Lower Cowl Mounts
Not countersunk screws....round head screws. Yes,
they're holding up great for people, and there are
some now that I know personally (I'll let them speak up
if they wish) who didn't install them until after they
had issues with the hinges. But, there really are
no problems with nutplates and screws...it's really
secure.
Tim Olson - RV-10 N104CD - Flying
Vernon Smith wrote:
> Looking through some of the old postings, I found some discussion on
> replacing the lower cowl mounts with nutplates and screws. Are these
> modified mounts still holding up well during flight? Also were #10
> countersunk screws and nut plates used? And finally what was the
> mounting plate made from?
> Thanks,
>
> Vern Smith (#324)
>
________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Mar 03, 2008
From: Rick Sked <ricksked(at)embarqmail.com>
Subject: Re: Lower Cowl Mounts
I made mine out of .063 aluminum, I think I used #8, three per side.
Rick Sked
40185
----- Original Message -----
From: "Tim Olson" <Tim(at)MyRV10.com>
Sent: Monday, March 3, 2008 8:33:55 AM (GMT-0800) America/Los_Angeles
Subject: Re: RV10-List: Lower Cowl Mounts
Not countersunk screws....round head screws. Yes,
they're holding up great for people, and there are
some now that I know personally (I'll let them speak up
if they wish) who didn't install them until after they
had issues with the hinges. But, there really are
no problems with nutplates and screws...it's really
secure.
Tim Olson - RV-10 N104CD - Flying
Vernon Smith wrote:
> Looking through some of the old postings, I found some discussion on
> replacing the lower cowl mounts with nutplates and screws. Are these
> modified mounts still holding up well during flight? Also were #10
> countersunk screws and nut plates used? And finally what was the
> mounting plate made from?
> Thanks,
>
> Vern Smith (#324)
>
________________________________________________________________________________
From: Eric Parlow <ericparlow(at)hotmail.com>
Subject: engine question (aerodiesel)
Date: Mar 03, 2008
For info on aerodiesel engines see:
www.dieselair.com
ERic--
RV-10, 40014
N104EP
> To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com> From: dwack(at)flbb.net> Subject: RV10-List: en
gine question> Date: Thu, 28 Feb 2008 15:17:55 -0500> > is anybody consider
ing a diesel engine?
________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Mar 03, 2008
From: "Fred Williams, M.D." <drfred(at)suddenlinkmail.com>
Subject: Doors
Robin;
Great pics and write up on the finer points of the doors.
What door seal material are you using?
Fred Williams
40515
________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Jacking up the -10
From: "jim berry" <jimberry(at)qwest.net>
Date: Mar 03, 2008
To all,
Has anyone developed a good method to jack and support the completed fuselage before
the wings are attached. I want to raise the fuselage off the wheels and
fit the wheel pants before mounting the wings.
Jim Berry
40482
N15JB(reserved)
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=167445#167445
________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Steven DiNieri" <capsteve(at)adelphia.net>
Subject: Rivethead Door Guide and Pin set
Date: Mar 03, 2008
One of the problems i found was the way they mounted from the backside which
made it difficult to mount and adjust. i made a similar part but made it
screw in from the front. i fabbed a backplate with platenuts and ovaled out
the holes in the doorframe to allow future adjustments.
steve dinieri
_____
From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Pascal
Sent: Sunday, March 02, 2008 1:22 PM
Subject: Re: RV10-List: Rivethead Door Guide and Pin set
Thanks Robin, not hearing any complaints it actually great feedback.
Thanks!
Pascal
To be clear I know RH Aero takes months so since I am months away I know I
should order them now if I want them by Christmas ;-)
----- Original Message -----
From: Robin <mailto:robin1(at)mrmoisture.com> Marks
Sent: Saturday, March 01, 2008 9:44 PM
Subject: RE: RV10-List: Rivethead Door Guide and Pin set
Pascal, ours work great but the engine was just hung and the front
windscreen has not been installed. Same with the prop, spinner, cowl. Not
really real world feedback but the best I can do.
Robin
http://www.painttheweb.com/rv-10/Doors.htm
href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List">http://www.matronics.com
/Navigator?RV10-List
href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com
href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c
________________________________________________________________________________
From: Jesse Saint <jesse(at)saintaviation.com>
Subject: Re: Jacking up the -10
Date: Mar 03, 2008
With or without the engine? If without, then using a jack/stand on
the engine mount and one on the tail tie down base and then something
to stable it works. With the engine, then you could possible use an
engine hoist to hold up the front and a jack/stand on the tail, also
with something to stabilize it.
Jesse Saint
Saint Aviation, Inc.
jesse(at)saintaviation.com
Cell: 352-427-0285
Fax: 815-377-3694
On Mar 3, 2008, at 3:20 PM, jim berry wrote:
>
> To all,
>
> Has anyone developed a good method to jack and support the completed
> fuselage before the wings are attached. I want to raise the fuselage
> off the wheels and fit the wheel pants before mounting the wings.
>
> Jim Berry
> 40482
> N15JB(reserved)
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=167445#167445
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Jacking up the -10
Date: Mar 03, 2008
From: "Chris Johnston" <CJohnston(at)popsound.com>
I went down to harbor freight, and they were having a sale on lift
tables. I bought one, modified it a bit, and it worked like a charm.
See here:
http://www.perfectlygoodairplane.net/Perfectlygoodairplane/Landing_Gear.
html
it was just the ticket for doing the wheelpants and gear leg fairings.
I used a heavy duty saw horse under the tail, and adjusted the height so
that the aircraft was level.
cj
www.perfectlygoodairplane.net
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of jim berry
Sent: Monday, March 03, 2008 12:20 PM
Subject: RV10-List: Re: Jacking up the -10
To all,
Has anyone developed a good method to jack and support the completed
fuselage before the wings are attached. I want to raise the fuselage off
the wheels and fit the wheel pants before mounting the wings.
Jim Berry
40482
N15JB(reserved)
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=167445#167445
________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Ben Westfall" <rv10(at)sinkrate.com>
Subject: baggage floor access plate for step
Date: Mar 03, 2008
I am pondering adding an access hole/plate on the baggage floor that would
allow one to get at the step attach hardware. Has anyone done this? What
are some thoughts on it? Pictures?
-Ben
________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Roger Standley" <taildragon(at)msn.com>
Subject: Re: Jacking up the -10
Date: Mar 03, 2008
Jim,=0A Here is how I do it...=0A=0A ----- Original Message
----- =0A From: jim berry<mailto:jimberry(at)qwest.net> =0A To: r
v10-list(at)matronics.com =0A Sent: M
onday, March 03, 2008 12:20 PM=0A Subject: RV10-List: Re: Jacking
rry" >=0A=0A To a
ll,=0A=0A Has anyone developed a good method to jack and suppor
t the completed fuselage before the wings are attached. I want to rais
e the fuselage off the wheels and fit the wheel pants before mounting
the wings.=0A=0A Jim Berry=0A 40482=0A N15JB(reserved)
=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A Read this topic online here:=0A
=0A http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=167445#167445
//forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=167445#167445>=0A=0A
=======================
=======================
vigator?RV10-List<http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List>=0A
=======================
=======================
=======================
http://www.matronics.com/contribution
=======================
====================0A=0A
=0A=0A
________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Jacking up the -10
From: "jim berry" <jimberry(at)qwest.net>
Date: Mar 03, 2008
Jesse,
The engine and prop are on. I thought about using my engine hoist to lift the fuselage,
but am reluctant to hang all the weight from the engine mount or the
engine lifting ring.
cj,
The link to your landing gear does not work, and I could not find the table you
mentioned searching manually.
Jim Berry
40482
N16JB(reserved)
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=167459#167459
________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Dave Saylor" <Dave(at)AirCraftersLLC.com>
Subject: baggage floor access plate for step
Date: Mar 03, 2008
Ben,
I'd show you a picture of the hole through the baggage floor, but it got
covered up by the side panel. Doh.
Next time I'll put a nutplate on the top of the step socket and put the bolt
in from the bottom, through the belly.
This is by no means overkill. We've replaced a few RV steps for one reason
or another.
Dave Saylor
AirCrafters LLC
140 Aviation Way
Watsonville, CA
831-722-9141
831-750-0284 CL
www.AirCraftersLLC.com
_____
From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Ben Westfall
Sent: Monday, March 03, 2008 1:23 PM
Subject: RV10-List: baggage floor access plate for step
I am pondering adding an access hole/plate on the baggage floor that would
allow one to get at the step attach hardware. Has anyone done this? What
are some thoughts on it? Pictures?
-Ben
________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Mar 03, 2008
From: Rick Sked <ricksked(at)embarqmail.com>
Subject: Re: Jacking up the -10
Thats a great but TINY picture...can you descibe what the jack is pushing o
n and how it's attached to the gear.
Rick Sked
40185
----- Original Message -----
From: "Roger Standley" <taildragon(at)msn.com>
Sent: Monday, March 3, 2008 1:36:02 PM (GMT-0800) America/Los_Angeles
Subject: Re: RV10-List: Re: Jacking up the -10
Jim,
=C2-Here is how I do it...
----- Original Message -----
From: jim berry
Sent: Monday, March 03, 2008 12:20 PM
Subject: RV10-List: Re: Jacking up the -10
To all,
Has anyone developed a good method to jack and support the completed fusela
ge before the wings are attached. I want to raise the fuselage off the whee
ls and fit the wheel pants before mounting the wings.
Jim Berry
40482
N15JB(reserved)
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p==========
============itle=http://www.matronics.com/Navigat
or?RV10-List href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List">http://w
ww.matronics.com/N===================
==<;=C2- -->
________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Roger Standley" <taildragon(at)msn.com>
Subject: Re: Jacking up the -10
Date: Mar 03, 2008
Her is how I do it...=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A ----- Original Me
ssage ----- =0A From: jim berry<mailto:jimberry(at)qwest.net> =0A
To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com =0A S
ent: Monday, March 03, 2008 12:20 PM=0A Subject: RV10-List: Re: Ja
jim berry" >=0A=0A
To all,=0A=0A Has anyone developed a good method to jack and
support the completed fuselage before the wings are attached. I want t
o raise the fuselage off the wheels and fit the wheel pants before mou
nting the wings.=0A=0A Jim Berry=0A 40482=0A N15JB(rese
rved)=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A Read this topic online here:
=0A=0A http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=167445#167445
<http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=167445#167445>=0A
=======================
=======================
com/Navigator?RV10-List<http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List>
=======================
=======================
=======================
= --> http://www.matronics.com/contribution
=======================
=======================
=0A=0A=0A=0A
________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Steven DiNieri" <capsteve(at)adelphia.net>
Subject: Re: Jacking up the -10
Date: Mar 03, 2008
when you install the wheel pants you might want to jack the fuse itself and
leave the gear legs in an "in-flight position" or relaxed position to ensure
alignment with the airflow. i had one already installed when i started to
think about it. when i jacked the plane and refit the wheel pant there was a
difference. it wasn't major, but probably enough to affect trim flight....
steve dinieri
_____
From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Roger Standley
Sent: Monday, March 03, 2008 4:55 PM
Subject: Re: RV10-List: Re: Jacking up the -10
Her is how I do it...
----- Original Message -----
From: jim <mailto:jimberry(at)qwest.net> berry
Sent: Monday, March 03, 2008 12:20 PM
Subject: RV10-List: Re: Jacking up the -10
To all,
Has anyone developed a good method to jack and support the completed
fuselage before the wings are attached. I want to raise the fuselage off the
wheels and fit the wheel pants before mounting the wings.
Jim Berry
40482
N15JB(reserved)
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewt==========================================
===nbsp; <http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=167445#167445> -
The RV10-List Email Forum
-http://www.==============================================p; -
MATRONICS WEB FORUMS
href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.================
======nbsp;
title=http://www.matronics.com/contribution
href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/contri
but========================================
________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Roger Standley" <taildragon(at)msn.com>
Subject: Re: Jacking up the -10
Date: Mar 03, 2008
Hi Rick,=0A=0AYes, I welded a bolt at about a 45 degree angle to
a cut piece of galvanized pipe, and covered it with epoxy and micro-b
alloons. Wrapped the inside of the pipe with a strip of inter-tube to
prevent scratching and to add friction. The bolt fits in a hole drille
d in the top of the scissor jack (from Kragens). Using an electric dri
ll with a "tee" makes for easy jacking.=0A=0ARoger=0A -----
Original Message ----- =0A From: Rick Sked<mailto:ricksked@embarq
mail.com> =0A To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com =0A Sent: Monday, March 03, 2008 1:49 PM=0A Subject: R
e: RV10-List: Re: Jacking up the -10=0A=0A=0A Thats a great
but TINY picture...can you descibe what the jack is pushing on and how
it's attached to the gear.=0A=0A Rick Sked=0A=0A 40185
=0A ----- Original Message -----=0A From: "Roger Standley" <ta
ildragon(at)msn.com>=0A To: rv10-list@matr
onics.com=0A Sent: Monday, March 3
, 2008 1:36:02 PM (GMT-0800) America/Los_Angeles=0A Subject: Re: R
V10-List: Re: Jacking up the -10=0A=0A=0A=0A Jim,=0A
Here is how I do it...=0A=0A ----- Original Message -----
=0A From: jim berry<mailto:jimberry(at)qwest.net> =0A To: rv1
0-list(at)matronics.com =0A Sent: M
onday, March 03, 2008 12:20 PM=0A Subject: RV10-List: Re: Jackin
m berry" >=0A=0A
To all,=0A=0A Has anyone developed a good method to jack an
d support the completed fuselage before the wings are attached. I want
to raise the fuselage off the wheels and fit the wheel pants before m
ounting the wings.=0A=0A Jim Berry=0A 40482=0A N1
5JB(reserved)=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A Read this topic online
here:=0A=0A http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p==
====================itle=htt
p://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List href="http://www.matronics
com/Navigator?RV10-List">http://www.matronics.com/N======
=======================
=================<; --> <http://for
ums.matronics.com/viewtopicphp?p=167445#167445>=0A=0A=0A
=0A <http://md01.embarq.synacor.com/zimbra/========
=======================
=======================
/www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List<http://www.matronics.com/Naviga
=======================
======================0A_
=======================
=======================
http://www.matronics.com/contribution
=======================
====================0A=0A
________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Jacking up the -10
Date: Mar 03, 2008
From: "Chris Johnston" <CJohnston(at)popsound.com>
Oops. The link wrapped to the next page. Try this
www.perfectlygoodairplane.net/Perfectlygoodairplane/Landing_Gear.html
if it wrapped to the next line again, just make sure the .html is on
there
or go to the finishing section, and select "landing gear"
cj
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of jim berry
Sent: Monday, March 03, 2008 1:39 PM
Subject: RV10-List: Re: Jacking up the -10
Jesse,
The engine and prop are on. I thought about using my engine hoist to
lift the fuselage, but am reluctant to hang all the weight from the
engine mount or the engine lifting ring.
cj,
The link to your landing gear does not work, and I could not find the
table you mentioned searching manually.
Jim Berry
40482
N16JB(reserved)
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=167459#167459
________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Roger Standley" <taildragon(at)msn.com>
Subject: Re: Jacking up the -10
Date: Mar 03, 2008
Rick, here is another pic of the "gear grabber. After cutting the pipe
, open it up to allow it to slide over the gear near the wheel but tig
hten against the gear leg as it is raised toward the fuselage.=0A
=0A=0A=0A ----- Original Message ----- =0A From: Roger S
tandley =0A To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com
=0A Sent: Monday, March 03, 2008
2:15 PM=0A Subject: Re: RV10-List: Re: Jacking up the -10=0A
=0A=0A =EF=BB =0A Hi Rick,=0A=0A Yes, I welded a bol
t at about a 45 degree angle to a cut piece of galvanized pipe, and co
vered it with epoxy and micro-balloons. Wrapped the inside of the pipe
with a strip of inter-tube to prevent scratching and to add friction.
The bolt fits in a hole drilled in the top of the scissor jack (from
Kragens). Using an electric drill with a "tee" makes for easy jacking
=0A=0A Roger=0A ----- Original Message ----- =0A F
rom: Rick Sked =0A To: rv10-list
(at)matronics.com =0A Sent: Monday,
March 03, 2008 1:49 PM=0A Subject: Re: RV10-List: Re: Jacking u
p the -10=0A=0A=0A Thats a great but TINY picture...can yo
u descibe what the jack is pushing on and how it's attached to the gea
r.=0A=0A Rick Sked=0A=0A 40185=0A ----- Origin
al Message -----=0A From: "Roger Standley" <taildragon(at)msn.com<m
ailto:taildragon(at)msn.com>>=0A To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com=0A Sent: Monday, March 3, 2008 1:36:02
PM (GMT-0800) America/Los_Angeles=0A Subject: Re: RV10-List: Re
: Jacking up the -10=0A=0A=0A=0A Jim,=0A Here is
how I do it...=0A=0A ----- Original Message ----- =0A
From: jim berry<mailto:jimberry(at)qwest.net> =0A To: rv10-li
st(at)matronics.com =0A Sent: Mon
day, March 03, 2008 12:20 PM=0A Subject: RV10-List: Re: Jackin
jim berry" >=0A=0A
To all,=0A=0A Has anyone developed a good method to j
ack and support the completed fuselage before the wings are attached.
I want to raise the fuselage off the wheels and fit the wheel pants be
fore mounting the wings.=0A=0A Jim Berry=0A 40482
=0A N15JB(reserved)=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A Read th
is topic online here:=0A=0A http://forums.matronics.com/vie
wtopic.php?p===================
===itle=http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List href="h
ttp://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List">http://www.matronics.com/
N=======================
=======================<
; --> <http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopicphp?p=167445#167445>
=0A=0A=0A=0A <http://md01.embarq.synacor.com/zimbra/==
===================p; >
=======================
======================0A_
=======================
=======================
= --> http://forums.matronics.com>
=======================
=======================
=======================
=====0A=0A
________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Traveling counter sink
Date: Mar 03, 2008
From: "Dawson-Townsend,Timothy" <tdawson-townsend(at)aurora.aero>
Y'all should include a traveling signature sheet with that traveling
shared counter sink tool for the cabin roof.
Each person can sign the sheet and stick a photo of them and/or their
fuselage in the envelope before sending it on to the next person.
By Oshkosh 2009, it might be an interesting collection of names and
places!
TDT
40025
Wheel Fairings done!
Tim Dawson-Townsend
Aurora Flight Sciences
tdt(at)aurora.aero
617-500-4812 (office)
617-905-4800 (mobile)
________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Mar 03, 2008
From: PJ Seipel <seipel(at)seznam.cz>
Subject: Re: baggage floor access plate for step
I used the parts for the stall warning horn access panel. I had to
drill the bolt hole in the steps from the side, however, to be able to
get the bolt in because of how I oriented the access panel. If you
rotate it to the right about 30 degrees or so, I believe you can still
put the bolt in per the plans.
PJ Seipel
RV-10 #40032
Ben Westfall wrote:
>
> I am pondering adding an access hole/plate on the baggage floor that
> would allow one to get at the step attach hardware. Has anyone done
> this? What are some thoughts on it? Pictures?
>
>
>
> -Ben
>
>
>
> *
>
>
> *
________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Mar 03, 2008
From: PJ Seipel <seipel(at)seznam.cz>
Subject: Re: baggage floor access plate for step
Sorry, forgot the picture.
PJ Seipel
PJ Seipel wrote:
> I used the parts for the stall warning horn access panel. I had to
> drill the bolt hole in the steps from the side, however, to be able to
> get the bolt in because of how I oriented the access panel. If you
> rotate it to the right about 30 degrees or so, I believe you can still
> put the bolt in per the plans.
>
> PJ Seipel
> RV-10 #40032
>
>
> Ben Westfall wrote:
>>
>> I am pondering adding an access hole/plate on the baggage floor that
>> would allow one to get at the step attach hardware. Has anyone done
>> this? What are some thoughts on it? Pictures?
>>
>>
>>
>> -Ben
>>
>>
>>
>> *
>>
>>
>> *
>
________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Roger Standley" <taildragon(at)msn.com>
Subject: Re: Jacking up the -10
Date: Mar 03, 2008
Hi Steve,=0A=0AYou are right. When we did the wheel pants, we le
t the gear "sag", but it didn't sag much. We braced from the spar carr
y-thru and fitted the wheel pants.=0A=0A=0A ----- Original M
essage ----- =0A From: Steven DiNieri<mailto:capsteve(at)adelphia.net
> =0A To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com
=0A Sent: Monday, March 03, 2008 2:11 PM=0A Subject: RE: RV10-
List: Re: Jacking up the -10=0A=0A=0A when you install the w
heel pants you might want to jack the fuse itself and leave the gear l
egs in an "in-flight position" or relaxed position to ensure alignment
with the airflow. i had one already installed when i started to think
about it. when i jacked the plane and refit the wheel pant there was
a difference. it wasn't major, but probably enough to affect trim flig
ht.... =0A steve dinieri=0A=0A=0A=0A------------------
----------------------------------------------------------=0A Fr
om: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-serve
r(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Roger Standley=0A Sent: Monday, Ma
rch 03, 2008 4:55 PM=0A To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com=0A Sub
ject: Re: RV10-List: Re: Jacking up the -10=0A=0A=0A Her i
s how I do it...=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A ----- Original Mes
sage ----- =0A From: jim berry<mailto:jimberry(at)qwest.net>
=0A To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com
=0A Sent: Monday, March 03, 2008 12:20 PM=0A Subject:
RV10-List: Re: Jacking up the -10=0A=0A=0A --> RV10-List
message posted by: "jim berry" >=0A=0A To all,=0A=0A Has anyone develop
ed a good method to jack and support the completed fuselage before the
wings are attached. I want to raise the fuselage off the wheels and f
it the wheel pants before mounting the wings.=0A=0A Jim Ber
ry=0A 40482=0A N15JB(reserved)=0A=0A=0A=0A
=0A Read this topic online here:=0A=0A http://forum
s.matronics.com/viewt================
=====nbsp; - The RV10-List Email Forum -http://www.=
====================p; -
MATRONICS WEB FORUMS href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://foru
ms.matronics.===================
====nbsp; title=http://www
matronics.com/contribution href="http://www.matronics.com/contribut
ion">http://www.matronics.com/contribut==========
=======================
=========0A=0A=0A=0A=0A<http://forums.m
atronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=167445#167445>
________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Mar 03, 2008
From: Tim Olson <Tim(at)MyRV10.com>
Subject: Re: Jacking up the -10
Actually, I think that's the Per-plans way...you're supposed to
let the gear hang and align the fairings while they're in the
in-flight hanging position.
Tim
Steven DiNieri wrote:
> when you install the wheel pants you might want to jack the fuse itself
> and leave the gear legs in an "in-flight position" or relaxed position
> to ensure alignment with the airflow. i had one already installed when i
> started to think about it. when i jacked the plane and refit the wheel
> pant there was a difference. it wasn't major, but probably enough to
> affect trim flight....
> steve dinieri
>
________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: baggage floor access plate for step
From: "orchidman" <gary(at)wingscc.com>
Date: Mar 03, 2008
seipel(at)seznam.cz wrote:
> I used the parts for the stall warning horn access panel.PJ Seipel
> RV-10 #40032
I did a similar thing but probably would do it differently next time (there had
better never be a next time) [Laughing] I mounted my covers close enough that
you can pull the bolt straight out or put it in. After I did all of this,
I realized that the side panels will cover half of the plates. So the side panels
will not be riveted in place until the very end. If I have to ever remove/replace
the steps, it will be about a half dozen pop rivets that will have to
be drilled out and then the places will be able to be unscrewed giving access
to the step mounting bolts.
I have some early pictures at
http://www.wingscc.com/N410GB/30-StepInstal/30-StepInstallation.html
I am so far behind at keeping my pictures up to date and I don't have any of the
later ones on the web yet.
--------
Gary Blankenbiller
RV10 - # 40674
Fuselage SB
(N410GB reserved)
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=167492#167492
________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Mar 03, 2008
From: Scott Schmidt <scottmschmidt(at)yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: Lower Cowl Mounts
Can someone point me to some photos. This is a modification I would like to make.
I've already lost 2 eyelets.
Scott Schmidt
scottmschmidt(at)yahoo.com
On Mar 3, 2008, at 12:30 PM, Rick Sked wrote:
I made mine out of .063 aluminum, I think I used #8, three per side.
Rick Sked
40185
----- Original Message -----
From: "Tim Olson" <Tim(at)MyRV10.com>
Sent: Monday, March 3, 2008 8:33:55 AM (GMT-0800) America/Los_Angeles
Subject: Re: RV10-List: Lower Cowl Mounts
Not countersunk screws....round head screws. Yes,
they're holding up great for people, and there are
some now that I know personally (I'll let them speak up
if they wish) who didn't install them until after they
had issues with the hinges. But, there really are
no problems with nutplates and screws...it's really
secure.
Tim Olson - RV-10 N104CD - Flying
Vernon Smith wrote:
Looking through some of the old postings, I found some discussion on
replacing the lower cowl mounts with nutplates and screws. Are these
modified mounts still holding up well during flight? Also were #10
countersunk screws and nut plates used? And finally what was the
mounting plate made from?
Thanks,
Vern Smith (#324)
________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Mar 03, 2008
From: Robert Wright <flywrights(at)yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: Jacking up the -10
Two or three pallets with the top one covered with a carpet scrap. Then use various
shims to ensure level across the fuselage. That ws my method and it seemed
fine, especially after dropping many plumb lines and square lines on the floor
to cross-check in-plane.
Rob Wright
#392
looking at a LOT of sanding when I do the body prep for the door-canopy prep.
Just didn't seem to cure flush even after many many clamps held it correctly.
But I DID hang then engine today!
----- Original Message ----
From: jim berry <jimberry(at)qwest.net>
Sent: Monday, March 3, 2008 3:20:21 PM
Subject: RV10-List: Re: Jacking up the -10
To all,
Has anyone developed a good method to jack and support the completed fuselage before
the wings are attached. I want to raise the fuselage off the wheels and
fit the wheel pants before mounting the wings.
Jim Berry
40482
N15JB(reserved)
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=167445#167445
Looking for last minute shopping deals?
________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Mar 03, 2008
From: Tim Olson <Tim(at)MyRV10.com>
Subject: Re: Lower Cowl Mounts
Hi Scott,
This will show you some photos. Here's a page with some photos towards
the bottom:
http://www.myrv10.com/N104CD/finishing/20050911/index.html
Here are a couple other ones for you too:
http://www.myrv10.com/N104CD/finishing/20050918/index.html
http://www.myrv10.com/N104CD/finishing/20050911/RV200509110038.html
http://www.myrv10.com/N104CD/finishing/20050918/RV200509120004.html
I used some heavier stock when I did mine, and I put a plate on the
fuselage side, and then another plate on the cowl side that is
"permanent" to give the cowl more backing.
Not sure the thickness anymore, but maybe .063 like Rick said. It
seems it was about the same as the thickness of the panel material.
Tim Olson - RV-10 N104CD - Flying
Scott Schmidt wrote:
>
> Can someone point me to some photos. This is a modification I would like to make.
I've already lost 2 eyelets.
>
> Scott Schmidt
> scottmschmidt(at)yahoo.com
>
> On Mar 3, 2008, at 12:30 PM, Rick Sked wrote:
>
>
> I made mine out of .063 aluminum, I think I used #8, three per side.
>
> Rick Sked
> 40185
________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Mar 03, 2008
From: Rick Sked <ricksked(at)embarqmail.com>
Subject: Re: Jacking up the -10
Very cool, I was looking for a way to jack mine easily from the gear, I hav
e mine on Harbor Freight dollys and I can see using them once flying to get
the most from our hangar space=C2-(Bob Kauffman and I) we have 3500 SF a
nd rent out what we don't need. The dollys allow us to move the aircraft ea
sily into the corners...we inconvience ourselves but not our tenants...look
s like an aerolift may be on the way. Hangar space at North Las Vegas is sp
arce...we are lucky to own the facility we have. Once the fly off is done a
nd the fairings are on for good I'll have to jack from the wing tie down to
put it on the dollys...small price to pay for "free" hangar space.
Rick Sked
40185
----- Original Message -----
From: "Roger Standley" <taildragon(at)msn.com>
Sent: Monday, March 3, 2008 2:15:26 PM (GMT-0800) America/Los_Angeles
Subject: Re: RV10-List: Re: Jacking up the -10
=EF=BB
Hi Rick,
Yes, I welded a bolt at about a 45 degree angle to a cut piece of galvanize
d pipe, and covered it with epoxy and micro-balloons. Wrapped the inside of
the pipe with a strip of inter-tube to prevent scratching and to add frict
ion. The bolt fits in a hole drilled in the top of the scissor jack (from K
ragens). Using an electric drill with a "tee"=C2- makes for easy jacking.
Roger
----- Original Message -----
From: Rick Sked
Sent: Monday, March 03, 2008 1:49 PM
Subject: Re: RV10-List: Re: Jacking up the -10
Thats a great but TINY picture...can you descibe what the jack is pushing o
n and how it's attached to the gear.
Rick Sked
40185
----- Original Message -----
From: "Roger Standley" < taildragon(at)msn.com >
Sent: Monday, March 3, 2008 1:36:02 PM (GMT-0800) America/Los_Angeles
Subject: Re: RV10-List: Re: Jacking up the -10
Jim,
=C2-Here is how I do it...
----- Original Message -----
From: jim berry
Sent: Monday, March 03, 2008 12:20 PM
Subject: RV10-List: Re: Jacking up the -10
To all,
Has anyone developed a good method to jack and support the completed fusela
ge before the wings are attached. I want to raise the fuselage off the whee
ls and fit the wheel pants before mounting the wings.
Jim Berry
40482
N15JB(reserved)
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p==========
============itle=http://www.matronics.com/Navigat
or?RV10-List href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List">http://w
ww.matronics.com/N===================
==<;=C2- -->
http://w======================
====================f="http://www
.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c======
========================
====
=======================
==
________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: baggage floor access plate for step
Date: Mar 03, 2008
From: "Robin Marks" <robin1(at)mrmoisture.com>
Ben,
I think it's an excellent idea especially when working
around the plane during construction. Think of it as Shin Insurance
because you will whack yourself and it can hurt. Then you will hit your
already tender shin in the exact same place and it will hurt even more.
We powder coated our steps a smoke chrome and I wanted it to be
removable in case the PC didn't hold up. Additionally mine are removal
for the Reno Air Races. Watch out Bearcat!
Robin
Photos Attached
________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Mar 03, 2008
From: Deems Davis <deemsdavis(at)cox.net>
Subject: Re: Lower Cowl Mounts
Scott here's a link to 2 photos (click next to see the 2nd)
http://deemsrv10.com/album/Sec%2047%20Spinner%20and%20Cowling/slides/DSC04175.html
I've since trimmed the inside portion of the 'flange' so that it doesn't
stick out and interfere with the air exiting the lower cowl. (A John Cox
suggestion)
Deems Davis # 406
'Its all done....Its just not put together'
http://deemsrv10.com/
Scott Schmidt wrote:
>
> Can someone point me to some photos. This is a modification I would like to make.
I've already lost 2 eyelets.
>
> Scott Schmidt
> scottmschmidt(at)yahoo.com
>
> On Mar 3, 2008, at 12:30 PM, Rick Sked wrote:
>
>
> I made mine out of .063 aluminum, I think I used #8, three per side.
>
> Rick Sked
> 40185
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Tim Olson" <Tim(at)MyRV10.com>
> To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com
> Sent: Monday, March 3, 2008 8:33:55 AM (GMT-0800) America/Los_Angeles
> Subject: Re: RV10-List: Lower Cowl Mounts
>
>
> Not countersunk screws....round head screws. Yes,
> they're holding up great for people, and there are
> some now that I know personally (I'll let them speak up
> if they wish) who didn't install them until after they
> had issues with the hinges. But, there really are
> no problems with nutplates and screws...it's really
> secure.
>
>
> Tim Olson - RV-10 N104CD - Flying
>
>
> Vernon Smith wrote:
> Looking through some of the old postings, I found some discussion on
> replacing the lower cowl mounts with nutplates and screws. Are these
> modified mounts still holding up well during flight? Also were #10
> countersunk screws and nut plates used? And finally what was the
> mounting plate made from?
> Thanks,
>
> Vern Smith (#324)
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Ben Westfall" <rv10(at)sinkrate.com>
Subject: baggage floor access plate for step
Date: Mar 03, 2008
That looks pretty good but how are you going to get the bolt out? Is there
room if you move the access panel all the way next to the wall panel to lift
the bolt up?
-Ben
_____
From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Robin Marks
Sent: Monday, March 03, 2008 4:27 PM
Subject: RE: RV10-List: baggage floor access plate for step
Ben,
I think it's an excellent idea especially when working around
the plane during construction. Think of it as Shin Insurance because you
will whack yourself and it can hurt. Then you will hit your already tender
shin in the exact same place and it will hurt even more. We powder coated
our steps a smoke chrome and I wanted it to be removable in case the PC
didn't hold up. Additionally mine are removal for the Reno Air Races. Watch
out Bearcat!
Robin
Photos Attached
________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: counter sinking canopy holes
From: "Lew Gallagher" <lewgall(at)charter.net>
Date: Mar 03, 2008
Hey John, Jay, Barry, etc.
Nick has contacted me about who's next! Let's use this thread to determine where
it's going and to get it back to John eventually.
If it's: 1) Jay, 2) Barry, 3) Lew 4) Nick use this to get contact info and send
it to the next in line.
And others can add their name and number to the list here.
Thanks, - Lew
--------
non-pilot
crazy about building
NOW OFICIALLY BUILDER #40549
Landing gear installed, we're mobile!
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=167550#167550
________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Steven DiNieri" <capsteve(at)adelphia.net>
Subject: Lower Cowl Mounts
Date: Mar 03, 2008
hi deems,
did you use a shim under the plate to space out for the thickness of the
cowl??
Steven dinieri
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Deems Davis
> Sent: Monday, March 03, 2008 7:46 PM
> To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com
> Subject: Re: RV10-List: Lower Cowl Mounts
>
>
> Scott here's a link to 2 photos (click next to see the 2nd)
> http://deemsrv10.com/album/Sec%2047%20Spinner%20and%20Cowling/
slides/DSC04175.html
> I've since trimmed the inside portion of the 'flange' so that
> it doesn't stick out and interfere with the air exiting the
> lower cowl. (A John Cox
> suggestion)
>
> Deems Davis # 406
> 'Its all done....Its just not put together'
> http://deemsrv10.com/
>
> Scott Schmidt wrote:
> > -->
> >
> > Can someone point me to some photos. This is a modification
> I would like to make. I've already lost 2 eyelets.
> >
> > Scott Schmidt
> > scottmschmidt(at)yahoo.com
> >
> > On Mar 3, 2008, at 12:30 PM, Rick Sked
> wrote:
> >
> >
> > I made mine out of .063 aluminum, I think I used #8, three per side.
> >
> > Rick Sked
> > 40185
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: "Tim Olson" <Tim(at)MyRV10.com>
> > To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com
> > Sent: Monday, March 3, 2008 8:33:55 AM (GMT-0800)
> America/Los_Angeles
> > Subject: Re: RV10-List: Lower Cowl Mounts
> >
> >
> > Not countersunk screws....round head screws. Yes, they're
> holding up
> > great for people, and there are some now that I know
> personally (I'll
> > let them speak up if they wish) who didn't install them until after
> > they had issues with the hinges. But, there really are no problems
> > with nutplates and screws...it's really secure.
> >
> >
> > Tim Olson - RV-10 N104CD - Flying
> >
> >
> >
> > Vernon Smith wrote:
> > Looking through some of the old postings, I found some
> discussion on
> > replacing the lower cowl mounts with nutplates and screws.
> Are these
> > modified mounts still holding up well during flight? Also were #10
> > countersunk screws and nut plates used? And finally what was the
> > mounting plate made from?
> > Thanks,
> >
> > Vern Smith (#324)
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>
> Photoshare, and much much more:
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Rivethead Door Guide and Pin set
From: "Lew Gallagher" <lewgall(at)charter.net>
Date: Mar 03, 2008
Hey Robin,
Thanks for the reply. By "weather strip" I meant the door seal provided by Vans
... did you final install before you're going to paint? Did you shave off door/canopy
fiberglass to make the door seal fit right?
I do like the cover plates you added so the door seal will continue uninterrupted
at the top of the doors -- doesn't that make for some creative nut installation?
I've looked more closely at the canopy hinges on ours, and it appears that the
hinges are barely flush with the canopy top (maybe even stick up a bit) -- so
that it doesn't look possible to recess and fit a plate on top of it. Maybe it's
just our canopy (pink), or did you build it up around the hinges?
Later, - Lew
--------
non-pilot
crazy about building
NOW OFICIALLY BUILDER #40549
Landing gear installed, we're mobile!
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=167556#167556
________________________________________________________________________________
From: "David McNeill" <dlm46007(at)cox.net>
Subject: baggage floor access plate for step
Date: Mar 03, 2008
Just a thought but Cessna on occasion drilled a bolt insertion hole directly
over the bolt and had an circular access panel below or adjacent to the bolt
for hand access to tighten or loosen the bolt. the bolt insertion hole was
covered with a chrome cap.
_____
From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Ben Westfall
Sent: Monday, March 03, 2008 6:28 PM
Subject: RE: RV10-List: baggage floor access plate for step
That looks pretty good but how are you going to get the bolt out? Is there
room if you move the access panel all the way next to the wall panel to lift
the bolt up?
-Ben
_____
From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Robin Marks
Sent: Monday, March 03, 2008 4:27 PM
Subject: RE: RV10-List: baggage floor access plate for step
Ben,
I think it's an excellent idea especially when working around
the plane during construction. Think of it as Shin Insurance because you
will whack yourself and it can hurt. Then you will hit your already tender
shin in the exact same place and it will hurt even more. We powder coated
our steps a smoke chrome and I wanted it to be removable in case the PC
didn't hold up. Additionally mine are removal for the Reno Air Races. Watch
out Bearcat!
Robin
Photos Attached
________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Mar 03, 2008
From: Deems Davis <deemsdavis(at)cox.net>
Subject: Re: Lower Cowl Mounts
I didn't use a shim. In my case I didn't need one. I have a Will James
cowl, I believe the construction is different from the Van's cowl and
most likely the dimensions also.
btw, I'm using countersunk screws with ss countersunk washers.
Deems Davis # 406
'Its all done....Its just not put together'
http://deemsrv10.com/
Steven DiNieri wrote:
>
> hi deems,
> did you use a shim under the plate to space out for the thickness of the
> cowl??
> Steven dinieri
>
>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com
>> [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Deems Davis
>> Sent: Monday, March 03, 2008 7:46 PM
>> To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com
>> Subject: Re: RV10-List: Lower Cowl Mounts
>>
>>
>> Scott here's a link to 2 photos (click next to see the 2nd)
>> http://deemsrv10.com/album/Sec%2047%20Spinner%20and%20Cowling/
>>
> slides/DSC04175.html
>
>> I've since trimmed the inside portion of the 'flange' so that
>> it doesn't stick out and interfere with the air exiting the
>> lower cowl. (A John Cox
>> suggestion)
>>
>> Deems Davis # 406
>> 'Its all done....Its just not put together'
>> http://deemsrv10.com/
>>
>> Scott Schmidt wrote:
>>
>>> -->
>>>
>>> Can someone point me to some photos. This is a modification
>>>
>> I would like to make. I've already lost 2 eyelets.
>>
>>> Scott Schmidt
>>> scottmschmidt(at)yahoo.com
>>>
>>> On Mar 3, 2008, at 12:30 PM, Rick Sked
>>>
>> wrote:
>>
>>>
>>> I made mine out of .063 aluminum, I think I used #8, three per side.
>>>
>>> Rick Sked
>>> 40185
>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>> From: "Tim Olson" <Tim(at)MyRV10.com>
>>> To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com
>>> Sent: Monday, March 3, 2008 8:33:55 AM (GMT-0800)
>>>
>> America/Los_Angeles
>>
>>> Subject: Re: RV10-List: Lower Cowl Mounts
>>>
>>>
>>> Not countersunk screws....round head screws. Yes, they're
>>>
>> holding up
>>
>>> great for people, and there are some now that I know
>>>
>> personally (I'll
>>
>>> let them speak up if they wish) who didn't install them until after
>>> they had issues with the hinges. But, there really are no problems
>>> with nutplates and screws...it's really secure.
>>>
>>>
>>> Tim Olson - RV-10 N104CD - Flying
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Vernon Smith wrote:
>>> Looking through some of the old postings, I found some
>>>
>> discussion on
>>
>>> replacing the lower cowl mounts with nutplates and screws.
>>>
>> Are these
>>
>>> modified mounts still holding up well during flight? Also were #10
>>> countersunk screws and nut plates used? And finally what was the
>>> mounting plate made from?
>>> Thanks,
>>>
>>> Vern Smith (#324)
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>> Photoshare, and much much more:
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: lessons learned installing plexiglas with Weld-on 10
From: "eagerlee" <eagerlee(at)comcast.net>
Date: Mar 03, 2008
We just finished building our windscreen faring so now its on to bigger and better
things like "trimming out" the final finish of the doors, windows and windscreen.
The gluing of the door windows was easy. The first one we did on the
bench per the directions except we applied freshly mixed glue to both the plexi
and the fiberglass ledge. A few days later we installed the door to the cabin
and then: AHH!! We found 3 small cracks on the edge where one of the clamps
held the plexi tight against the fiberglass ledge. We stop drilled the cracks
and changed technique for the second door/window installation. The door was
installed on the cabin complete with hinges and latches and trimmed to give
a good flush fit. We used four nylon straps around the entire fuselage and cabin
with wooden blocks to apply pressure at the window edges. This pressure was
left in place for about 22 hours and the results were great with NO cracks.
We then did both rear cabin windows together using the four strap method of holding
them in place and when we removed the straps and blocks we were saddened
by the discovery of dozens of small "feathery" cracks at the pressure points.
We thought of starting over with the rear windows but e-mailed Van's and when
Scott said that other builders reported these cracks (Van's RV-10 with 1100
hours has them) but there have been ZERO failures, we decided to stress the cracks
to see if we could get them to "run" into the center of the window. We
applied heat to get the temperature of the window bond up to where the Summer
Colorado sun might cause it to rise. Then we applied an ice pack to get the temperature
down to where the lower flight levels might cause it to fall. An amazing
result - the cracks disappeared. I don't mean that they went away - I
mean they were VERY difficult (in some cases, impossible) to see. We did the
windscreen with a combination of clamps on the sides and a strap around the cabin
to give us holding pressure across the top. We got several small cracks at
the pres!
sure poi
nts of the clamps - none at the strap. Our final conclusion is that the cracks
are caused by high clamping pressure over time and the best way to avoid them
when using Weld-on 10 is to remove your clamps (or straps) after just a few hours,
maybe three of four, and keep the pressure down to no more than is needed
to keep the plexi flush with the cabin. We heated all our weld-on 10 bonds
to stress relieve them.
Paul Hahn
#40203
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=167577#167577
________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Mar 04, 2008
From: Rick Sked <ricksked(at)embarqmail.com>
Subject: Re: Sun N Fun
Well the cuts on my hand will be healed by then...from cutting out my old t
rim system and instaling yours..BTW...it works great and is VERY easy to in
stall...from the git go...not really bad after I had my own installed...rea
lly neat product..
Rick Sked
40185
----- Original Message -----
From: "Bob-tcw" <rnewman(at)tcwtech.com>
Sent: Monday, March 3, 2008 6:24:16 PM (GMT-0800) America/Los_Angeles
Subject: Re: RV10-List: Sun N Fun
=EF=BB
I'll be at Sun-n-Fun all week.=C2-=C2- TCW Technologies has an outdoor
booth at spot N-96 this year.=C2- We'll have a Safety-Trim Tent set up wi
th demo units and with just a little bit of luck a new product announcement
!=C2-
I look forward to meeting=C2- the many builders who have become Safety-Tr
im customers.
Best regards,
Bob Newman
RV-10 40176
TCW Technologies
www.tcwtech.com
----- Original Message -----
From: Rick Sked
Sent: Monday, March 03, 2008 7:29 PM
Subject: RV10-List: Sun N Fun
What's the head count for Sun N Fun? I'll be there noon on the 8th, leaving
Early Friday the 11th. Via commercial airlines. I'm staying at the Marriot
Village in Orlando, about a 45 minute drive but nice if you have family (I
don't) that can play at the parks while you go to the show. I really liked
it last year...pretty laid back and well...fun. =C2- Rick Sked 40185 do
not archive href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List">http://ww
w.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List href="http://forums.matronics.com">ht
tp://forums.matronics.com href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">ht
==================
====
=======================
==
________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Mar 04, 2008
From: Rick Sked <ricksked(at)embarqmail.com>
Subject: Re: Lower Cowl Mounts
I didn't need a shim on the bottom, only the sides. Where you have to make up for
the curve of the fuselage sides.
Rick Sked
40185
----- Original Message -----
From: "Steven DiNieri" <capsteve(at)adelphia.net>
Sent: Monday, March 3, 2008 7:30:05 PM (GMT-0800) America/Los_Angeles
Subject: RE: RV10-List: Lower Cowl Mounts
hi deems,
did you use a shim under the plate to space out for the thickness of the
cowl??
Steven dinieri
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Deems Davis
> Sent: Monday, March 03, 2008 7:46 PM
> To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com
> Subject: Re: RV10-List: Lower Cowl Mounts
>
>
> Scott here's a link to 2 photos (click next to see the 2nd)
> http://deemsrv10.com/album/Sec%2047%20Spinner%20and%20Cowling/
slides/DSC04175.html
> I've since trimmed the inside portion of the 'flange' so that
> it doesn't stick out and interfere with the air exiting the
> lower cowl. (A John Cox
> suggestion)
>
> Deems Davis # 406
> 'Its all done....Its just not put together'
> http://deemsrv10.com/
>
> Scott Schmidt wrote:
> > -->
> >
> > Can someone point me to some photos. This is a modification
> I would like to make. I've already lost 2 eyelets.
> >
> > Scott Schmidt
> > scottmschmidt(at)yahoo.com
> >
> > On Mar 3, 2008, at 12:30 PM, Rick Sked
> wrote:
> >
> >
> > I made mine out of .063 aluminum, I think I used #8, three per side.
> >
> > Rick Sked
> > 40185
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: "Tim Olson" <Tim(at)MyRV10.com>
> > To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com
> > Sent: Monday, March 3, 2008 8:33:55 AM (GMT-0800)
> America/Los_Angeles
> > Subject: Re: RV10-List: Lower Cowl Mounts
> >
> >
> > Not countersunk screws....round head screws. Yes, they're
> holding up
> > great for people, and there are some now that I know
> personally (I'll
> > let them speak up if they wish) who didn't install them until after
> > they had issues with the hinges. But, there really are no problems
> > with nutplates and screws...it's really secure.
> >
> >
> > Tim Olson - RV-10 N104CD - Flying
> >
> >
> >
> > Vernon Smith wrote:
> > Looking through some of the old postings, I found some
> discussion on
> > replacing the lower cowl mounts with nutplates and screws.
> Are these
> > modified mounts still holding up well during flight? Also were #10
> > countersunk screws and nut plates used? And finally what was the
> > mounting plate made from?
> > Thanks,
> >
> > Vern Smith (#324)
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>
> Photoshare, and much much more:
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: baggage floor access plate for step
Date: Mar 04, 2008
From: "Robin Marks" <robin1(at)mrmoisture.com>
Bingo! Ben.
Lew, sorry I am on the road and have too many moving parts these days to
reply quickly.
There is a =BD" hole drilled directly above the bolt (no pictured). That
hole is normally plugged with a plastic panel plug and then the entire
area covered with carpet.
Regarding the door seal we used a seal sold by McMaster Carr not the
vans seal. Sorry I don't have the style number.
(Photo attached)
Regarding the nut installation for the door, it's not that difficult to
remove and I hope the doors will not have to be taken off many more
times. At least not till the first flight J
We cleaned up under the hinge a bit but ours do sit pretty flush. The
metal is bent a bit down into the recess we made for the cover. There
are a number of different ways to do this including living with a small
bump at each hinge point.
Robin
From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of David McNeill
Sent: Monday, March 03, 2008 7:50 PM
Subject: RE: RV10-List: baggage floor access plate for step
Just a thought but Cessna on occasion drilled a bolt insertion hole
directly over the bolt and had an circular access panel below or
adjacent to the bolt for hand access to tighten or loosen the bolt. the
bolt insertion hole was covered with a chrome cap.
________________________________
From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Ben Westfall
Sent: Monday, March 03, 2008 6:28 PM
Subject: RE: RV10-List: baggage floor access plate for step
That looks pretty good but how are you going to get the bolt out? Is
there room if you move the access panel all the way next to the wall
panel to lift the bolt up?
-Ben
________________________________
From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Robin Marks
Sent: Monday, March 03, 2008 4:27 PM
Subject: RE: RV10-List: baggage floor access plate for step
Ben,
I think it's an excellent idea especially when working
around the plane during construction. Think of it as Shin Insurance
because you will whack yourself and it can hurt. Then you will hit your
already tender shin in the exact same place and it will hurt even more.
We powder coated our steps a smoke chrome and I wanted it to be
removable in case the PC didn't hold up. Additionally mine are removal
for the Reno Air Races. Watch out Bearcat!
Robin
Photos Attached
href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List">http://www.matronic
s.com/Navigator?RV10-List
href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com
href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c
________________________________________________________________________________
From: Michael Kraus <n223rv(at)wolflakeairport.net>
Subject: baggage floor access plate for step
Date: Mar 04, 2008
I purchased 2 extra of the stall warning access panels rom Vans. I installed these
in the floor inboard of the step bolts for hand access. I drilled a hole
in the lower skin large enough to just clear the bolt head and stuck in a hole
plug.
It works great, but I like the idea of redrilling the hole horizontal and not
having the hole in the bottom skin...
-Mike Kraus
RV-4 Flying
RV-10 FWF and wiring
-----Original Message-----
From: "Robin Marks" <robin1(at)mrmoisture.com>
Sent: 03/04/08 2:41 AM
Subject: RE: RV10-List: baggage floor access plate for step
Bingo! Ben.
Lew, sorry I am on the road and have too many moving parts these days to reply
quickly.
There is a " hole drilled directly above the bolt (no pictured). That hole is normally
plugged with a plastic panel plug and then the entire area covered with
carpet.
Regarding the door seal we used a seal sold by McMaster Carr not the
________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: counter sinking canopy holes
From: "egohr1" <EGOHR86(at)alumni.carnegiemellon.edu>
Date: Mar 04, 2008
Please add me to the list for the counter sink.
Eric Gohr
40271 - finishing, Fiberglass wonderland.
--------
eric gohr
EGOHR86(at)alumni.carnegiemellon.edu
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=167625#167625
________________________________________________________________________________
From: John Gonzalez <indigoonlatigo(at)msn.com>
Subject: lessons learned installing plexiglas with Weld-on 10
Date: Mar 04, 2008
You mention Colorado. How warm was the shop while instailing these windows?
John G. 409> Subject: RV10-List: lessons learned installing plexiglas with
Weld-on 10> From: eagerlee(at)comcast.net> Date: Mon, 3 Mar 2008 21:08:35 -080
e" > > We just finished building our windscreen farin
g so now its on to bigger and better things like "trimming out" the final f
inish of the doors, windows and windscreen. The gluing of the door windows
was easy. The first one we did on the bench per the directions except we ap
plied freshly mixed glue to both the plexi and the fiberglass ledge. A few
days later we installed the door to the cabin and then: AHH!! We found 3 sm
all cracks on the edge where one of the clamps held the plexi tight against
the fiberglass ledge. We stop drilled the cracks and changed technique for
the second door/window installation. The door was installed on the cabin c
omplete with hinges and latches and trimmed to give a good flush fit. We us
ed four nylon straps around the entire fuselage and cabin with wooden block
s to apply pressure at the window edges. This pressure was left in place fo
r about 22 hours and the results were great with NO cracks. We then did bot
h rear cabin windows together using !> the four strap method of holding the
m in place and when we removed the straps and blocks we were saddened by th
e discovery of dozens of small "feathery" cracks at the pressure points. We
thought of starting over with the rear windows but e-mailed Van's and when
Scott said that other builders reported these cracks (Van's RV-10 with 110
0 hours has them) but there have been ZERO failures, we decided to stress t
he cracks to see if we could get them to "run" into the center of the windo
w. We applied heat to get the temperature of the window bond up to where th
e Summer Colorado sun might cause it to rise. Then we applied an ice pack t
o get the temperature down to where the lower flight levels might cause it
to fall. An amazing result - the cracks disappeared. I don't mean that they
went away - I mean they were VERY difficult (in some cases, impossible) to
see. We did the windscreen with a combination of clamps on the sides and a
strap around the cabin to give us holding pre!> ssure across the top. We g
ot several small cracks at the pres!> sure poi> > nts of the clamps - none
at the strap. Our final conclusion is that the cracks are caused by high cl
amping pressure over time and the best way to avoid them when using Weld-on
10 is to remove your clamps (or straps) after just a few hours, maybe thre
e of four, and keep the pressure down to no more than is needed to keep the
plexi flush with the cabin. We heated all our weld-on 10 bonds to stress r
elieve them.> > Paul Hahn> #40203> > > > > Read this topic online here:> >
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=167577#167577> > > > > > > >
========================> >
>
________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Mar 04, 2008
From: "Pascal" <rv10builder(at)verizon.net>
Subject: Re: counter sinking canopy holes
whoever has it. can you tell what size the countersink is?
I looked at Avery's site but couldn't find any information on it.
Thanks!
Pascal
----- Original Message -----
From: "egohr1" <EGOHR86(at)alumni.carnegiemellon.edu>
Sent: Tuesday, March 04, 2008 6:50 AM
Subject: RV10-List: Re: counter sinking canopy holes
>
>
> Please add me to the list for the counter sink.
>
> Eric Gohr
> 40271 - finishing, Fiberglass wonderland.
>
> --------
> eric gohr
> EGOHR86(at)alumni.carnegiemellon.edu
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=167625#167625
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
From: "RV Builder (Michael Sausen)" <rvbuilder(at)sausen.net>
Date: Mar 04, 2008
Subject: baggage floor access plate for step
Here is what I did.
http://www.mykitlog.com/users/display_log.php?user=msausen&project=22&c
ategory=613&log=14961&row=36
It's a push to release pin. Got it from McMaster/Carr or Grainger or someo
ne. Also using one on my passenger side stick.
Michael
From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@m
atronics.com] On Behalf Of David McNeill
Sent: Monday, March 03, 2008 9:50 PM
Subject: RE: RV10-List: baggage floor access plate for step
Just a thought but Cessna on occasion drilled a bolt insertion hole directl
y over the bolt and had an circular access panel below or adjacent to the b
olt for hand access to tighten or loosen the bolt. the bolt insertion hole
was covered with a chrome cap.
________________________________________________________________________________
From: "John Hilger" <ninepapa(at)bendbroadband.com>
Subject: Re: counter sinking canopy holes
Date: Mar 04, 2008
Pascal
I bought mine from The Yard Store.
P/N 13326 Countersink #12 x 5/8 x 100 deg
John
----- Original Message -----
From: "Pascal" <rv10builder(at)verizon.net>
Sent: Tuesday, March 04, 2008 7:42 AM
Subject: Re: RV10-List: Re: counter sinking canopy holes
>
> whoever has it. can you tell what size the countersink is?
> I looked at Avery's site but couldn't find any information on it.
> Thanks!
> Pascal
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "egohr1" <EGOHR86(at)alumni.carnegiemellon.edu>
> To:
> Sent: Tuesday, March 04, 2008 6:50 AM
> Subject: RV10-List: Re: counter sinking canopy holes
>
>
> >
> >
> > Please add me to the list for the counter sink.
> >
> > Eric Gohr
> > 40271 - finishing, Fiberglass wonderland.
> >
> > --------
> > eric gohr
> > EGOHR86(at)alumni.carnegiemellon.edu
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Read this topic online here:
> >
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________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Landing gear lift
Date: Mar 04, 2008
From: "Dawson-Townsend,Timothy" <tdawson-townsend(at)aurora.aero>
We lifted the plane with engine on (no wings), by using an auto jack and
2-foot piece of 4x4 to lift up one side, then placing a long 4x4 between
two tall sawhorses, under the wing spar stub. Then lift the other side
likewise. Pull down on the tail tiedown ring to tweak fore-aft leveling
as needed.
TDT
40025
Tim Dawson-Townsend
tdt(at)aurora.aero
617-500-4812 (office)
617-905-4800 (mobile)
________________________________________________________________________________
From: John Gonzalez <indigoonlatigo(at)msn.com>
Subject: Lower Cowl Mounts
Date: Mar 04, 2008
Deems,
I did a quick look through all you cowl photos and looks like you did a fin
e job. I will also using a James cowl, but going with the vertical inductio
n model of cowl. Was your cowl that cowl, than you had to modify that area.
In your photos the intake was originally oblong and then you did a mod to
a round intake.
Wil informed me that there is currently only one vertical induction cowl op
erating and was kind enough to inform me he wished he had more of a tract r
ecord before selling me one. He said that the one currently flying is cooli
ng fine.
John G.> Date: Mon, 3 Mar 2008 17:46:17 -0700> From: deemsdavis(at)cox.net> To
: rv10-list(at)matronics.com> Subject: Re: RV10-List: Lower Cowl Mounts> > -->
RV10-List message posted by: Deems Davis > > Scott her
e's a link to 2 photos (click next to see the 2nd)> http://deemsrv10.com/al
bum/Sec%2047%20Spinner%20and%20Cowling/slides/DSC04175.html> I've since tri
mmed the inside portion of the 'flange' so that it doesn't > stick out and
interfere with the air exiting the lower cowl. (A John Cox > suggestion)> >
Deems Davis # 406> 'Its all done....Its just not put together'> http://dee
tt Schmidt > >> > Can someone point me to some pho
tos. This is a modification I would like to make. I've already lost 2 eyele
ts. > >> > Scott Schmidt> > scottmschmidt(at)yahoo.com> >> > On Mar 3, 2008, a
t 12:30 PM, Rick Sked wrote:> >> > --> RV10-List
message posted by: Rick Sked > >> > I made mine ou
t of .063 aluminum, I think I used #8, three per side.> >> > Rick Sked> > 4
0185> > ----- Original Message -----> > From: "Tim Olson" <Tim(at)MyRV10.com>>
> To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com> > Sent: Monday, March 3, 2008 8:33:55 AM (G
MT-0800) America/Los_Angeles> > Subject: Re: RV10-List: Lower Cowl Mounts>
countersunk screws....round head screws. Yes,> > they're holding up great f
or people, and there are> > some now that I know personally (I'll let them
speak up> > if they wish) who didn't install them until after they> > had i
ssues with the hinges. But, there really are> > no problems with nutplates
and screws...it's really> > secure.> >> >> > Tim Olson - RV-10 N104CD - Fly
ing> >> >> >> > Vernon Smith wrote:> > Looking through some of the old post
ings, I found some discussion on > > replacing the lower cowl mounts with n
utplates and screws. Are these > > modified mounts still holding up well du
ring flight? Also were #10 > > countersunk screws and nut plates used? And
finally what was the > > mounting plate made from?> > Thanks,> >> > Vern Sm
======================> > >
________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Mar 04, 2008
From: Deems Davis <deemsdavis(at)cox.net>
Subject: Re: Lower Cowl Mounts
My cowl is NOT vertical induction, it was originally made for the BPE
forward facing fuel servo and Cold Air sump. The oblong induction ring
is the characteristic 'signature' for that cowl. When I was ready to
install a filtered air system, there were none available that could be
easily adapted to that Oval induction ring. I spoke with and followed
another -10 BPE cold air builder as he customized a filtered air system
using a K&N filter, Will, had offered to work with me in designing and
building a filtered air intake for the BPE set up, (that he would
subsequently offer to other builders) if I could provide him a 'model'
(made from expandable foam) of the bottom of the cowl and the servo/cold
air sump. I was ready to follow one of these approaches, when I happened
on the information regarding the Rod Bowers design. I was Very impressed
with the design and the '3 in one' capabilities of
RAM/filtered/Alternate air sources, and after speaking w/ Rod, I
concluded that while hacking up my cowl in order to replace the oval
induction ring w/ the circular ring sounded alarming, it really turned
out to be less work for me than either of the other 2 approaches, plus I
picked up the benefit of the RAM air mp increase. I'm really happy with
the results so far, although I'm obviously not flying and haven't
validated any performance.
Deems Davis # 406
'Its all done....Its just not put together'
http://deemsrv10.com/
IIRC the vertical induction cowl that is flying on an RV-10 is in
Canada, there were some initial issues with heat and cooling, Will
designed a modification wihc inclluded a larger exit area (around the
exhaust stacks) and that appears to have solved that problem. my
understanding is that he subsequently modified his mold to include the
larger exit area.
Deems Davis # 406
'Its all done....Its just not put together'
http://deemsrv10.com/
> *
> *
________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Lower Cowl Mounts
From: "Michael Wellenzohn" <rv-10(at)wellenzohn.net>
Date: Mar 04, 2008
Guys,
did anyone use camlocks for the bottom cowling mounts?
Michael
--------
RV-10 builder (engine, prop, finishing)
#511
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=167708#167708
________________________________________________________________________________
From: Mark Ritter <mritter509(at)msn.com>
Subject: Re: Lower Cowl Mounts
Date: Mar 04, 2008
I used camlocks around the fuse and piano hinge along the sides (vertical).
They work great. Some folks don't like the looks of camlocks but I'm hap
py with them.
Mark
RV-10/N410MR
> Subject: RV10-List: Re: Lower Cowl Mounts> From: rv-10(at)wellenzohn.net> Da
-List message posted by: "Michael Wellenzohn" > > Guy
s,> > did anyone use camlocks for the bottom cowling mounts?> > Michael> >
--------> RV-10 builder (engine, prop, finishing)> #511> > > > > Read this
topic online here:> > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=167708#
=====> > >
_________________________________________________________________
Connect and share in new ways with Windows Live.
http://www.windowslive.com/share.html?ocid=TXT_TAGHM_Wave2_sharelife_0120
08
________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Jay Rowe" <jfrjr(at)roadrunner.com>
Subject: Re: Lower Cowl Mounts
Date: Mar 04, 2008
Michael: I used the camlocks thru out (firewall to cowling and top to
bottom cowling). Came as a kit (pricey) and fairly straight forward to
install. Takes me about 3 minutes by myself to get the top cowling off and
on, and a little longer for the bottom since you have to do some nudging to
get the various baffles in proper place. The down side to the camlocks, in
addition to the cost, is that they are not as cosmetically pleasing as the
clean look you get with the hinges. Jay Rowe
----- Original Message -----
From: "Michael Wellenzohn" <rv-10(at)wellenzohn.net>
To:
Sent: Tuesday, March 04, 2008 3:58 PM
Subject: RV10-List: Re: Lower Cowl Mounts
>
> Guys,
>
> did anyone use camlocks for the bottom cowling mounts?
>
> Michael
>
> --------
> RV-10 builder (engine, prop, finishing)
> #511
>
>
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=167708#167708
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> --
3/4/2008 8:35 AM
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Mar 04, 2008
Subject: Re: Lower Cowl Mounts
From: "William Curtis" <wcurtis(at)nerv10.com>
> Guys,
> did anyone use camlocks for the bottom cowling mounts?
> Michael
I am. Two per side on a 0.63 base. Four of each of the below:
244-16 Floting Receptacle 2.89
4002-4 Camloc Stud 2.45
4002-O Camloc Grommet 1.53
R4G Snap Rings 0.20
I used these on the horizontal sides of my Cardinal to replace the SouthCo fasteners
and I like them a lot. Not enough however to use them in place of the hinges
on the 10 except on the cowl bottom.
The above prices are from Spruce, however if you go to OSH or Sun-N-Fun you can
get them at the Aeromart for less. If you want to pay even more you can get
the adjustable receptacle version but since the -4 stud will fit the thickness
range of our cowling, I don't see any reason to use them.
William
http://wcurtis.nerv10.com/
"Be who you are and say what you feel because those who mind don't matter and those
who matter don't mind."
-- Dr. Suess
________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Mar 04, 2008
From: Larry Rosen <LarryRosen(at)comcast.net>
Subject: Re: Lower Cowl Mounts
Vic used camlocs all the way around. You can see photos here:
<http://lrosen.nerv10.com/Construct/SunNFun_2006/Vic%20RV10/CamLocs/index.html>
Larry Rosen
William Curtis wrote:
>
>
>> Guys,
>> did anyone use camlocks for the bottom cowling mounts?
>> Michael
>>
>
> I am. Two per side on a 0.63 base. Four of each of the below:
>
> 244-16 Floting Receptacle 2.89
> 4002-4 Camloc Stud 2.45
> 4002-O Camloc Grommet 1.53
> R4G Snap Rings 0.20
>
> I used these on the horizontal sides of my Cardinal to replace the SouthCo fasteners
and I like them a lot. Not enough however to use them in place of the
hinges on the 10 except on the cowl bottom.
>
> The above prices are from Spruce, however if you go to OSH or Sun-N-Fun you can
get them at the Aeromart for less. If you want to pay even more you can get
the adjustable receptacle version but since the -4 stud will fit the thickness
range of our cowling, I don't see any reason to use them.
>
> William
> http://wcurtis.nerv10.com/
> "Be who you are and say what you feel because those who mind don't matter and
those who matter don't mind."
> -- Dr. Suess