RV10-Archive.digest.vol-dh
April 15, 2008 - May 03, 2008
I'm looking at that for my panel. I spent a lot of time looking
at it at Sun-N-Fun. Tell me why you think it's a good or bad
purchase!!!
Linn
http://www.matronic -
MATRONICS available via the Web
href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com===
======
=========http://www.matronics.com/c
href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List">http://www.matronic
s
.com/Navigator?RV10-List
href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com
href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | AFS Systems .... and others |
| From: | "John Cox" <johnwcox(at)pacificnw.com> |
This is a great resource to share with the other builders. Knowing how
many wires to run in anticipation of future adaption of emerging
technology. Maybe Stein could make a future edition of Kitplanes
Magazine on aircraft wiring tips, techniques and wiring run planning.
Tim has done a lot with his loads and diagrams. Thanks for the wake up
call.
John
Aurora, OR
From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Albert
Gardner
Sent: Tuesday, April 15, 2008 7:05 AM
Subject: RE: RV10-List: AFS Systems .... and others
When we build our panels and select the instruments/vendors that are
available we are hoping that these products/companies well survive.
None-the-less we are well aware that there will be many changes in the
market in just a short time. In my RV-9A I installed a Navaid autopilot,
changed to a Trio, was in the planning stage of removing the electric
gyros and other round gages looking at EFIS/EMS displays. Now in the
RV-10 I have Dynon EFIS/EMS and TruTrak but I'm looking at the Dynon
autopilot and I know Trio has a new one to present at Oshkosh. My point
is because we can make major panel changes some of us will-and maybe
more than once. My advice is to make it as easy as possible to remove
and alter the panel, add more wires, etc. I added rudder trim after
completion but had already run a 5 wire cable into the tail cone and put
the indicator on the panel 'just in case' so it was pretty easy to do.
But what if it had required 6 wires instead of 5 I had run? Make it as
easy as possible to incorporate change.
Albert Gardner
Yuma, AZ
href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List">http://www.matronic
s
.com/Navigator?RV10-List
href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com
href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Automatic temp controller for air conditioning |
| From: | "marcausman" <marc(at)verticalpower.com> |
We recently announced at Sun n Fun a set and forget temperature controller for
air conditioning systems. In a nutshell, you set the desired temp and it controls
the fans and compressor to regulate the cabin temperature. It automatically
turns on after engine start, and turns off during takeoff and after engine shutdown.
If there is a fault with the air conditioning system, it tells you exactly
where the fault is and what kind of fault occurred.
You can find more information here: http://www.verticalpower.com/climate_control.html
The system is just beginning beta testing now and expected to begin shipping in
Q3 08.
Marc
--------
Marc Ausman
http://www.verticalpower.com
RV-7 IO-390 Flying
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=177002#177002
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | jason Parker <litesellme(at)yahoo.com> |
Curtis,
Curtis,
Extreme version 2 turbo on bottom 16500
Redundancy 2200
Engine mount (if it works on Buds) 1000
New zero time Block 3000 USD
Intercooler 1500
Modification to your mount 500
Total above 24700
Plus extras
Muffler, muffler support, muffler wrap 650
Wiring harness heat wrap, water line heat wrap, roll of exaust wrap 120
New total: 25470-5000 deposit 20470.
I do not take person checks or money orders. The best thing is cash. You will
also need to sign a hold harmless agreement prior to release of the engine. One
more thing, i do not rip into engines any longer due to liability, so you have
stock new pistons.
Jason
William Curtis wrote:
Not sure how they can call themselves a GA planning site when you can't overlay your route on an actual aviation map (sectional, TAC, etc). Did I miss how to do this? The only options for the route maps are Street Map, Satellite, Hybrid and Terrain. I much prefer http://skyvector.com/ It will overlay your planned route on the actual current Sectional, TAC or IFR charts.
William
http://wcurtis.nerv10.com/
"Be who you are and say what you feel because those who mind don't matter and those
who matter don't mind."
-- Dr. Suess
-------- Original Message --------
>
> A great flight planning web site that I think you will appreciate.
>
> http://www.navmonster.com/
>
>
> Rob Kermanj
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bruce Lane <bruce_a_lane(at)hotmail.com> |
Bruce:
Can't agree more. They make very nice products and have the worlds crappie
st service. I purchased two fuel caps for my RV-8 at Sun N Fun last year.
They promised to ship them within 4 days. I never got them. Lots of emai
ls, calls etc. Finally, I threatened to report them to my credit card comp
any and they promised to send the caps right away and give me a 10% discoun
t for my trouble. Still never got my gas caps. Only good news is to the b
est of my knowledge them never charged my credit card either.
They are embarrassingly bad at customer service.
bruce
From: snyderbd888(at)sbcglobal.netTo: rv10-list(at)matronics.comSubject: RV10-Lis
t: Andair problemsDate: Mon, 14 Apr 2008 22:35:54 -0400
I=92ve had an ongoing problem with Andair and I thought that I=92d give eve
ryone that was thinking about buying one of their products some insight int
o their lack of responsiveness and customer service. I purchased a fuel va
lve for my RV-10 before the valve extensions were available. At Oshkosh 20
07 I personally handed them the fuel valve I purchased to be exchanged for
one with a six inch extension. The receipt noted the serial number of the
fuel valve that I gave them along with a quote for the price of a valve wit
h the extension. I=92ve been emailing every 2-3 weeks and I=92ve called th
em a couple of times but here I am almost 9 months later with no fuel valve
despite several promised shipping dates. I thought I was dealing with a r
eputable company but my experience so far has been otherwise.
Bruce Snyder
40353
_________________________________________________________________
Going green? See the top 12 foods to eat organic.
http://green.msn.com/galleries/photos/photos.aspx?gid=164&ocid=T003MSN5
1N1653A
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Sheldon Olesen <saolesen(at)sirentel.net> |
| Subject: | wing rotisserie & paint booth |
Does anyone have pictures or plans for making a wing rotisserie? I
want to be able to rotate the wings while they are being painted.
Also, any suggestions for the size and plans for a homemade paint
booth would be appreciated.
Sheldon Olesen
#40080 8 pieces ready to paint--all small
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Andair problems |
| From: | "Michael Wellenzohn" <rv-10(at)wellenzohn.net> |
Sorry to hear that. I personally had good experience with exchanging the fuel valve
with the extension version.
Hope they improve their service.
Michael
www.wellenzohn.net (FWF)
--------
RV-10 builder (engine, prop, finishing)
#511
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=177030#177030
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | wing rotisserie & paint booth |
| From: | "Bobby J. Hughes" <bhughes(at)qnsi.net> |
Sheldon,
Sent you information off line.
Bobby
4116
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Sheldon
Olesen
Sent: Tuesday, April 15, 2008 2:07 PM
Subject: RV10-List: wing rotisserie & paint booth
Does anyone have pictures or plans for making a wing rotisserie? I
want to be able to rotate the wings while they are being painted.
Also, any suggestions for the size and plans for a homemade paint booth
would be appreciated.
Sheldon Olesen
#40080 8 pieces ready to paint--all small
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Bud Williams" <rambud(at)windstream.net> |
| Subject: | wing rotisserie & paint booth |
Bobby,
Could you send the information to me to at rambud(at)windstream.net
Thanks
Bud
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Bobby J. Hughes
Sent: Tuesday, April 15, 2008 5:47 PM
Subject: RE: RV10-List: wing rotisserie & paint booth
Sheldon,
Sent you information off line.
Bobby
4116
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Sheldon
Olesen
Sent: Tuesday, April 15, 2008 2:07 PM
Subject: RV10-List: wing rotisserie & paint booth
Does anyone have pictures or plans for making a wing rotisserie? I
want to be able to rotate the wings while they are being painted.
Also, any suggestions for the size and plans for a homemade paint booth
would be appreciated.
Sheldon Olesen
#40080 8 pieces ready to paint--all small
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | MauleDriver <MauleDriver(at)nc.rr.com> |
| Subject: | Re: wing rotisserie & paint booth |
I would appreciate the information too. I'm trying to decide whether to
commit to paint or not. And it's time to paint some interior stuff.
Thanks
Bill "Living with Fiberglass" Watson
40605
Durham NC
Bobby J. Hughes wrote:
>
> Sheldon,
>
> Sent you information off line.
>
> Bobby
> 4116
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Sheldon
> Olesen
> Sent: Tuesday, April 15, 2008 2:07 PM
> To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com
> Subject: RV10-List: wing rotisserie & paint booth
>
>
> Does anyone have pictures or plans for making a wing rotisserie? I
> want to be able to rotate the wings while they are being painted.
> Also, any suggestions for the size and plans for a homemade paint booth
> would be appreciated.
>
>
> Sheldon Olesen
> #40080 8 pieces ready to paint--all small
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "David McNeill" <dlm46007(at)cox.net> |
For those who are not using the metal blocks in place of the delrin blockin
the door frame: There appears to be enough variability in door construction
that the standard c-1012 and c-1011 are not always long enough to penetrate
the complete door frame (i.e. delrin, glass and aluminum). For my money I
like to see .25" of complete tube in the door jamb. Because of the length of
the tube or the bevel, the supplied pins are short by .25-.375. I am making
the suggestion to Vans to lengthen these by that amount and allow the
builder to shorten to fit as opposed to my personal solution to buy material
and machine as required.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Thane States" <thane2(at)comporium.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Recommendations for front air vents |
Stein sells tem for just under $100. They are very nice and I found a great
way to install them with no hardware or Proseal.
Thane
----- Original Message -----
From: "Fred Williams, M.D." <drfred(at)suddenlinkmail.com>
Sent: Monday, April 14, 2008 5:06 PM
Subject: RV10-List: Recommendations for front air vents
>
>
> Any recommendations for the front air vents?
> Vans wants $145 for the aluminum ones
>
> Aircraft Spruce has several varieties in the $175 price range.
> Is this is the part of the building where you say to the dealer?
>
> ........ hit me . :-)
>
>
> Lew: good job on the wheel pants. Thanks for the reference, but I just
> added the pics. Our late friend, Mark Ritter showed me how to do it when
> I looked at his plane a couple of months ago. And I will be "displeased"
> if you get flying before I do.
>
>
> Fred Williams
> 40515.
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Rene Felker" <rene(at)felker.com> |
| Subject: | Recommendations for front air vents |
OK, so tell us the secret..........
Rene' Felker
RV-10 N423CF Flying
801-721-6080
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Thane States
Sent: Tuesday, April 15, 2008 4:51 PM
Subject: Re: RV10-List: Recommendations for front air vents
Stein sells tem for just under $100. They are very nice and I found a great
way to install them with no hardware or Proseal.
Thane
----- Original Message -----
From: "Fred Williams, M.D." <drfred(at)suddenlinkmail.com>
Sent: Monday, April 14, 2008 5:06 PM
Subject: RV10-List: Recommendations for front air vents
>
>
> Any recommendations for the front air vents?
> Vans wants $145 for the aluminum ones
>
> Aircraft Spruce has several varieties in the $175 price range.
> Is this is the part of the building where you say to the dealer?
>
> ........ hit me . :-)
>
>
> Lew: good job on the wheel pants. Thanks for the reference, but I just
> added the pics. Our late friend, Mark Ritter showed me how to do it when
> I looked at his plane a couple of months ago. And I will be "displeased"
> if you get flying before I do.
>
>
> Fred Williams
> 40515.
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Recommendations for front air vents |
| From: | "McGANN, Ron" <ron.mcgann(at)baesystems.com> |
Thane - don't be coy. I am about to instal Steins vents and was
thinking of E6000 to attach them to the NACA ducts. What was your
method? Contact me off list if this is a secret .
Cheers,
Ron
187, almost there.
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Thane States
Sent: Wednesday, 16 April 2008 8:21 AM
Subject: Re: RV10-List: Recommendations for front air vents
Stein sells tem for just under $100. They are very nice and I found a
great way to install them with no hardware or Proseal.
Thane
----- Original Message -----
From: "Fred Williams, M.D." <drfred(at)suddenlinkmail.com>
Sent: Monday, April 14, 2008 5:06 PM
Subject: RV10-List: Recommendations for front air vents
>
>
> Any recommendations for the front air vents?
> Vans wants $145 for the aluminum ones
>
> Aircraft Spruce has several varieties in the $175 price range.
> Is this is the part of the building where you say to the dealer?
>
> ........ hit me . :-)
>
>
> Lew: good job on the wheel pants. Thanks for the reference, but I
> just added the pics. Our late friend, Mark Ritter showed me how to do
> it when I looked at his plane a couple of months ago. And I will be
"displeased"
> if you get flying before I do.
>
>
> Fred Williams
> 40515.
>
>
>
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your computer."
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | John Gonzalez <indigoonlatigo(at)msn.com> |
I'm within one to two hours from seeing how all this comes together and I a
m surprised that the pins do not penetrate all three structures. Still have
n't gotten to the part about how far the threaded bolts stick out of the pi
ns, and why did I have to make a run to the hardware store for these bolts?
??
From: dlm46007(at)cox.netTo: rv10-list(at)matronics.comSubject: RV10-List: doors
againDate: Tue, 15 Apr 2008 15:32:38 -0700
For those who are not using the metal blocks in place of the delrin blockin
the door frame: There appears to be enough variability in door constructio
n that the standard c-1012 and c-1011 are not always long enough to penetra
te the complete door frame (i.e. delrin, glass and aluminum). For my money
I like to see .25" of complete tube in the door jamb. Because of the length
of the tube or the bevel, the supplied pins are short by .25-.375. I am ma
king the suggestion to Vans to lengthen these by that amount and allow the
builder to shorten to fit as opposed to my personal solution to buy materia
l and machine as required.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "David McNeill" <dlm46007(at)cox.net> |
The pins may not penetrate all three materials. My left rear pin engaged by
the .25" minimum but the other three did not; the bevel in the right rear
ran right to the edge of the aluminum; not sufficient for me. The only thing
I can figure is that location of the handle can effect these lengths. The
instructions requiring centering the handle in the box but of course the box
location is determined by where the inner shell is glued to the outer shell.
The appropriate holes on the shell halves were faint and flat so there is
some variability there. By Friday the doors shoudl be ready to go back on.
_____
From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of John Gonzalez
Sent: Tuesday, April 15, 2008 4:17 PM
Subject: RE: RV10-List: doors again
I'm within one to two hours from seeing how all this comes together and I am
surprised that the pins do not penetrate all three structures. Still haven't
gotten to the part about how far the threaded bolts stick out of the pins,
and why did I have to make a run to the hardware store for these bolts???
_____
From: dlm46007(at)cox.net
Subject: RV10-List: doors again
Date: Tue, 15 Apr 2008 15:32:38 -0700
For those who are not using the metal blocks in place of the delrin blockin
the door frame: There appears to be enough variability in door construction
that the standard c-1012 and c-1011 are not always long enough to penetrate
the complete door frame (i.e. delrin, glass and aluminum). For my money I
like to see .25" of complete tube in the door jamb. Because of the length of
the tube or the bevel, the supplied pins are short by .25-.375. I am making
the suggestion to Vans to lengthen these by that amount and allow the
builder to shorten to fit as opposed to my personal solution to buy material
and machine as required.
get=_blank>http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List
p://forums.matronics.com
blank>http://www.matronics.com/contribution
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Lew Gallagher" <lewgall(at)charter.net> |
Again, I did not thread the rods, just stuck a pencil in the hole with a bit of
masking tape to make it firm and centered, and marked away -- it came out perfect.
Using someone else's idea, I carved out the BACKSIDE of where the toothed bar retracts,
and also a bit of the teflon (where the retaining pin on the toothed
bar and the split end of the rod bumps in full open position) so that the pins
can retract to the maximum -- which allows you to set the rod at maximum penetration
in closed position (make sure they're set on the absolute last possible
tooth). In open position, the inside handle is at about 130 degrees instead
of 90.
I get full penetration through all three structures. No threads. The taper pulls
the door in snug with no help at all, no movement at all once it's shut.
This weekend we'll temporarily install the provided weather strip with double
sided carpet tape to see if we can accomplish the same fit. I can probably post
pictures later if there's interest.
This is not the right thread, but I gotta tell ya, I very much appreciate the info
on the crashes, and it's VERY sobering if not downright discouraging.
Later, - Lew
--------
non-pilot
crazy about building
NOW OFICIALLY BUILDER #40549
doors almost finished, pants on, WHEW!
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=177090#177090
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bill Hicks <bilhicks(at)swbell.net> |
| Subject: | 64TX is a real airplane |
64TX broke the bounds of earth on Saturday morning April 12 in celebration of my
65th bday. Flew well a little heavier on the controls than my 6A but still
easy to fly. Now comes the fun. It was kit number 40378 and still needs interior
and paint.
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | 64TX is a real airplane |
| From: | "Perry, Phil" <Phil.Perry(at)netapp.com> |
Congrats, Bill!
I envy you!
________________________________
From: Bill Hicks [mailto:bilhicks(at)swbell.net]
Sent: Tuesday, April 15, 2008 7:29 PM
Subject: RV10-List: 64TX is a real airplane
64TX broke the bounds of earth on Saturday morning April 12 in
celebration of my 65th bday. Flew well a little heavier on the controls
than my 6A but still easy to fly. Now comes the fun. It was kit number
40378 and still needs interior and paint.
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: wing rotisserie & paint booth |
| From: | "tomhanaway" <tomhanaway(at)comcast.net> |
Bobby,
I'm giving some thought to painting also. Could you email me the info also.
Thanks,
Tom Hanaway
tomhanaway(at)comcast.net
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=177114#177114
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Chris Hukill" <cjhukill(at)cox.net> |
| Subject: | dimple or countersink around baggage door |
The plans call for you to countersink the aft six holes in the fuselage
skin, where it mates to the forward six holes in the tailcone skin,
F-1023 baggage floor angle, and F10100-A shim (page 32-4 figure 3). The
QB fuselage has the forward holes dimpled in those pieces. The floor
angle and shim was just temporarily attached with pop rivets. Why would
I not dimple those remaining holes also? The .032 skin is the minimum
for countersink, and I don't see an access issue. Is this a mistake in
the plans, or is there a reason to countersink, not dimple. The same for
the rivets above the baggage door, and on the right side, that go thru
the skin into the longerons. All the holes that were filled with rivets
have been dimpled, but the plans call for the remaining ones to be
countersunk. Vans says to just build it. Anyone with an input?
Chris Hukill
dazed and confused
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Dave Leikam" <daveleikam(at)wi.rr.com> |
| Subject: | Re: dimple or countersink around baggage door |
I just went out and looked at my fuse as I just did that step a few
weeks ago. I countersunk the 6 holes as the plans said. There is
plenty of material behind the skin with the shim and angle, no worries.
I agree with Vans on this one, just build it.
Dave Leikam
40496
----- Original Message -----
From: Chris Hukill
To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com
Sent: Tuesday, April 15, 2008 10:30 PM
Subject: RV10-List: dimple or countersink around baggage door
The plans call for you to countersink the aft six holes in the
fuselage skin, where it mates to the forward six holes in the tailcone
skin, F-1023 baggage floor angle, and F10100-A shim (page 32-4 figure
3). The QB fuselage has the forward holes dimpled in those pieces. The
floor angle and shim was just temporarily attached with pop rivets. Why
would I not dimple those remaining holes also? The .032 skin is the
minimum for countersink, and I don't see an access issue. Is this a
mistake in the plans, or is there a reason to countersink, not dimple.
The same for the rivets above the baggage door, and on the right side,
that go thru the skin into the longerons. All the holes that were
filled with rivets have been dimpled, but the plans call for the
remaining ones to be countersunk. Vans says to just build it. Anyone
with an input?
Chris Hukill
dazed and confused
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | John Gonzalez <indigoonlatigo(at)msn.com> |
NO one ever answerred my question to this email below I sent a week or so a
go.
Thanks!
This could be the source of the problem right here, as long as the pins are
long enough to just be emerging from the door while the handle is in the 1
30 degree position:
Important question not adressed in the building instructions. When placing
the latch mechanism inside the latch pocket, is it necessary to cut access
holes for the geared arms that interface with the rod pin and the gear so
that not only is there a cut in the pocket for the pin, but also the back h
alf of the gear arm. Basically, when the door is open does the handle go up
to the 90 degree position or does it go all the way to the 180 degree posi
tion. If the pin was just emerging from the door side while the handle was
in the 180 degree position(Facing aft), just think how far the pin will tr
avel when the handle is placed in the closed position. The manual does not
state the number of cuts in the latch pockets??????I haven't fitted the en
tire mechanism yet, but real close so I am not certain of how it is suposse
d to be.. JG
> Subject: RV10-List: Re: doors again> From: lewgall(at)charter.net> Date: Tue
message posted by: "Lew Gallagher" > > Again, I did no
t thread the rods, just stuck a pencil in the hole with a bit of masking ta
pe to make it firm and centered, and marked away -- it came out perfect.> >
Using someone else's idea, I carved out the BACKSIDE of where the toothed
bar retracts, and also a bit of the teflon (where the retaining pin on the
toothed bar and the split end of the rod bumps in full open position) so th
at the pins can retract to the maximum -- which allows you to set the rod a
t maximum penetration in closed position (make sure they're set on the abso
lute last possible tooth). In open position, the inside handle is at about
130 degrees instead of 90.> > I get full penetration through all three stru
ctures. No threads. The taper pulls the door in snug with no help at all, n
o movement at all once it's shut. This weekend we'll temporarily install th
e provided weather strip with double sided carpet tape to see if we can acc
omplish the same fit. I can probably post pictures later if there's interes
t.> > This is not the right thread, but I gotta tell ya, I very much apprec
iate the info on the crashes, and it's VERY sobering if not downright disco
uraging.> > Later, - Lew> > --------> non-pilot> crazy about building> NOW
OFICIALLY BUILDER #40549> doors almost finished, pants on, WHEW!> > > > > R
ead this topic online here:> > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p
=========> > >
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "McGANN, Ron" <ron.mcgann(at)baesystems.com> |
Hey John,
The plans are silent on this, but attached is a photo of 410RV. If you
do not cut the hole in the back of the pocket, there is no way to
achieve required full pin travel.
cheers,
Ron - almost there
________________________________
From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of John Gonzalez
Sent: Wednesday, 16 April 2008 2:31 PM
To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com
Subject: RE: RV10-List: Re: doors again
NO one ever answerred my question to this email below I sent a
week or so ago.
Thanks!
This could be the source of the problem right here, as long as
the pins are long enough to just be emerging from the door while the
handle is in the 130 degree position:
Important question not adressed in the building instructions.
When placing the latch mechanism inside the latch pocket, is it
necessary to cut access holes for the geared arms that interface with
the rod pin and the gear so that not only is there a cut in the pocket
for the pin, but also the back half of the gear arm. Basically, when the
door is open does the handle go up to the 90 degree position or does it
go all the way to the 180 degree position.
If the pin was just emerging from the door side while the handle
was in the 180 degree position(Facing aft), just think how far the pin
will travel when the handle is placed in the closed position. The
manual does not state the number of cuts in the latch pockets??????I
haven't fitted the entire mechanism yet, but real close so I am not
certain of how it is supossed to be..
JG
> Subject: RV10-List: Re: doors again
> From: lewgall(at)charter.net
> Date: Tue, 15 Apr 2008 17:03:13 -0700
> To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com
>
>
> Again, I did not thread the rods, just stuck a pencil in the
hole with a bit of masking tape to make it firm and centered, and marked
away -- it came out perfect.
>
> Using someone else's idea, I carved out the BACKSIDE of where
the toothed bar retracts, and also a bit of the teflon (where the
retaining pin on the toothed bar and the split end of the rod bumps in
full open position) so that the pins can retract to the maximum -- which
allows you to set the rod at maximum penetration in closed position
(make sure they're set on the absolute last possible tooth). In open
position, the inside handle is at about 130 degrees instead of 90.
>
> I get full penetration through all three structures. No
threads. The taper pulls the door in snug with no help at all, no
movement at all once it's shut. This weekend we'll temporarily install
the provided weather strip with double sided carpet tape to see if we
can accomplish the same fit. I can probably post pictures later if
there's interest.
>
> This is not the right thread, but I gotta tell ya, I very much
appreciate the info on the crashes, and it's VERY sobering if not
downright discouraging.
>
> Later, - Lew
>
> --------
> non-pilot
> crazy about building
> NOW OFICIALLY BUILDER #40549
> doors almost finished, pants on, WHEW!
>
>
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=177090#177090
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
&g===============
>
>
>
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confidential to BAE Systems Australia. If you are not the intended
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________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Tim Lewis <timrvator(at)comcast.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Recommendations for front air vents |
The $18 plastic ones from Vans (approximate price) work fine if you add
a little RTV to seal the leak in the "closed" position. I believe the
process is discussed in 21 Years of the RVator. It's also discussed in
the RV-list archives. I used it in my -6A, works well. I'm doing the
same thing for my RV-10.
Tim
--
Tim Lewis -- HEF (Manassas, VA)
RV-6A N47TD -- 1000 hrs
RV-10 #40059 under construction
Fred Williams, M.D. wrote:
>
>
> Any recommendations for the front air vents?
> Vans wants $145 for the aluminum ones
>
> Aircraft Spruce has several varieties in the $175 price range.
> Is this is the part of the building where you say to the dealer?
>
> ........ hit me . :-)
>
>
> Lew: good job on the wheel pants. Thanks for the reference, but I
> just added the pics. Our late friend, Mark Ritter showed me how to do
> it when I looked at his plane a couple of months ago. And I will be
> "displeased" if you get flying before I do.
>
>
> Fred Williams
> 40515.
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Lew Gallagher" <lewgall(at)charter.net> |
Hey John (JG),
That's the one! It was YOUR post that gave me the idea to play with the holes
on the backside -- I just now got there, and it works. Try it, you'll like it!
Thanks, - Lew
--------
non-pilot
crazy about building
NOW OFICIALLY BUILDER #40549
doors almost finished, pants on, WHEW!
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=177164#177164
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: AFS Systems .... and others |
| From: | "johngoodman" <johngoodman(at)earthlink.net> |
John,
In response to your question. The Odyssey looks very good. MGL has earlier products
so they are not exactly new to the game. I agree that some manufacturers
will drop out in time and who knows which ones. The one thing I like about them
is willingness to incorporate 3rd party devices. They are fine with Trio or
TruTrak, and probably can work with any other manufacturer that uses ARINC 429.
They can make the Dynon Pitot/AOA work, the AFS holes, and can even accomodate
home-made AoA systems. I'll keep an eye on them.
Just like Oshkosh, I found Sun 'n fun overwhelming in the avionics areas. Too many
things to absorb. The one thing I have gotten out of it however, is the high
prices and arrogance of the Garmin folks.
John
--------
#40572 QB Fuselage, wings finished
N711JG reserved
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=177184#177184
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | GRANSCOTT(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: AFS Systems .... and others |
In a message dated 4/16/2008 9:18:34 AM Central Daylight Time,
johngoodman(at)earthlink.net writes:
is the high prices and arrogance of the Garmin folks
Anyone else get the feeling that now since garmin has gone from aviation
background to the general public in car devices...they really don't need
aviation anymore or certainly have an attitude like this? We're sort of their
test
market and highest profit margin per product area, but lowest market unit
area...
P
**************It's Tax Time! Get tips, forms and advice on AOL Money &
Finance. (http://money.aol.com/tax?NCID=aolcmp00300000002850)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | John Gonzalez <indigoonlatigo(at)msn.com> |
Thanks Ron,
I cut the holes anyway, but was skiing last weekend so I haven't finished t
he pin install. If I don't get enough length with the Van's pins and bolt a
ssembly, I'll make up my own from new tube stock.
JOhn
Subject: RE: RV10-List: Re: doors againDate: Wed, 16 Apr 2008 14:50:25 +093
0From: ron.mcgann(at)baesystems.comTo: rv10-list(at)matronics.com
Hey John,
The plans are silent on this, but attached is a photo of 410RV. If you do
not cut the hole in the back of the pocket, there is no way to achieve requ
ired full pin travel.
cheers,
Ron - almost there
From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@m
atronics.com] On Behalf Of John GonzalezSent: Wednesday, 16 April 2008 2:31
PMTo: rv10-list(at)matronics.comSubject: RE: RV10-List: Re: doors again
NO one ever answerred my question to this email below I sent a week or so a
go. Thanks! This could be the source of the problem right here, as long a
s the pins are long enough to just be emerging from the door while the hand
le is in the 130 degree position: Important question not adressed in the bu
ilding instructions. When placing the latch mechanism inside the latch poc
ket, is it necessary to cut access holes for the geared arms that interface
with the rod pin and the gear so that not only is there a cut in the pocke
t for the pin, but also the back half of the gear arm. Basically, when the
door is open does the handle go up to the 90 degree position or does it go
all the way to the 180 degree position. If the pin was just emerging from
the door side while the handle was in the 180 degree position(Facing aft),
just think how far the pin will travel when the handle is placed in the clo
sed position. The manual does not state the number of cuts in the latch po
ckets??????I haven't fitted the entire mechanism yet, but real close so I a
m not certain of how it is supossed to be.. JG > Subject: RV10-List: Re: do
ors again> From: lewgall(at)charter.net> Date: Tue, 15 Apr 2008 17:03:13 -0700
agher" > > Again, I did not thread the rods, just stuc
k a pencil in the hole with a bit of masking tape to make it firm and cente
red, and marked away -- it came out perfect.> > Using someone else's idea,
I carved out the BACKSIDE of where the toothed bar retracts, and also a bit
of the teflon (where the retaining pin on the toothed bar and the split en
d of the rod bumps in full open position) so that the pins can retract to t
he maximum -- which allows you to set the rod at maximum penetration in clo
sed position (make sure they're set on the absolute last possible tooth). I
n open position, the inside handle is at about 130 degrees instead of 90.>
> I get full penetration through all three structures. No threads. The tape
r pulls the door in snug with no help at all, no movement at all once it's
shut. This weekend we'll temporarily install the provided weather strip wit
h double sided carpet tape to see if we can accomplish the same fit. I can
probably post pictures later if there's interest.> > This is not the right
thread, but I gotta tell ya, I very much appreciate the info on the crashes
, and it's VERY sobering if not downright discouraging.> > Later, - Lew> >
--------> non-pilot> crazy about building> NOW OFICIALLY BUILDER #40549> do
ors almost finished, pants on, WHEW!> > > > > Read this topic online here:>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=177090#177090> > > > > > >
&g================> > >
p://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List
ics.com
.matronics.com/contribution
"Warning:
The information contained in this email and any attached files is
confidential to BAE Systems Australia. If you are not the intended
recipient, any use, disclosure or copying of this email or any
attachments is expressly prohibited. If you have received this email
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however, any loss or damage incurred in using this email is not the
sender's responsibility. It is your responsibility to ensure virus
checks are completed before installing any data sent in this email to
your computer."
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Pascal" <rv10builder(at)verizon.net> |
| Subject: | Re: AFS Systems .... and others |
with the G1000 and G900 I think the Garmin folks are more "we're better
than thou" than thinking we are their test bed. Some company reps get
that way, figure they don't need anyone when they are selling products
based on the name alone.
Arrogance is from thinking they dont need us as much as they think we
need them.. Sadly I need a 430w to go with my AFS system.. until there
is a good replacement I really dont have much of a choice.. happens when
a company buys their competition (Apollo/UPS)
Pascal
----- Original Message -----
From: GRANSCOTT(at)aol.com
To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com
Sent: Wednesday, April 16, 2008 7:26 AM
Subject: Re: RV10-List: Re: AFS Systems .... and others
In a message dated 4/16/2008 9:18:34 AM Central Daylight Time,
johngoodman(at)earthlink.net writes:
is the high prices and arrogance of the Garmin folks
Anyone else get the feeling that now since garmin has gone from
aviation background to the general public in car devices...they really
don't need aviation anymore or certainly have an attitude like this?
We're sort of their test market and highest profit margin per product
area, but lowest market unit area...
P
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
-----
It's Tax Time! Get tips, forms and advice on AOL Money & Finance.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Ralph E. Capen" <recapen(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | Re: AFS Systems .... and others |
Pascal's hit the nail on the head!
UPSAT had a great line of products that kept Garmin on their toes and reasonable.
Garmin's taken some of the good things and discarded some of the good things.
If there were only some competition....
-----Original Message-----
>From: Pascal <rv10builder(at)verizon.net>
>Sent: Apr 16, 2008 11:13 AM
>To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com
>Subject: Re: RV10-List: Re: AFS Systems .... and others
>
>with the G1000 and G900 I think the Garmin folks are more "we're better than thou"
than thinking we are their test bed. Some company reps get that way, figure
they don't need anyone when they are selling products based on the name alone.
>Arrogance is from thinking they dont need us as much as they think we need them..
Sadly I need a 430w to go with my AFS system.. until there is a good replacement
I really dont have much of a choice.. happens when a company buys their
competition (Apollo/UPS)
>
>Pascal
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: GRANSCOTT(at)aol.com
> To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com
> Sent: Wednesday, April 16, 2008 7:26 AM
> Subject: Re: RV10-List: Re: AFS Systems .... and others
>
>
> In a message dated 4/16/2008 9:18:34 AM Central Daylight Time, johngoodman(at)earthlink.net
writes:
> is the high prices and arrogance of the Garmin folks
> Anyone else get the feeling that now since garmin has gone from aviation background
to the general public in car devices...they really don't need aviation
anymore or certainly have an attitude like this? We're sort of their test market
and highest profit margin per product area, but lowest market unit area...
>
> P
>
>
>------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> It's Tax Time! Get tips, forms and advice on AOL Money & Finance.
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: AFS Systems .... and others |
| From: | "Bobby J. Hughes" <bhughes(at)qnsi.net> |
I wonder what the price will be for this Honeywell unit. The one
sitting beside the AFS display. Garmin needs competition so I hope this
product will be competitively priced.
https://commerce.honeywell.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/CategoryDisplay
?storeId=10101&catalogId=10052&langId=-1&cursel=item1&identifier=
Apex%20
Edge%20Series
Bobby
40116
________________________________
From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Pascal
Sent: Wednesday, April 16, 2008 9:14 AM
Subject: Re: RV10-List: Re: AFS Systems .... and others
with the G1000 and G900 I think the Garmin folks are more "we're better
than thou" than thinking we are their test bed. Some company reps get
that way, figure they don't need anyone when they are selling products
based on the name alone.
Arrogance is from thinking they dont need us as much as they think we
need them.. Sadly I need a 430w to go with my AFS system.. until there
is a good replacement I really dont have much of a choice.. happens when
a company buys their competition (Apollo/UPS)
Pascal
----- Original Message -----
From: GRANSCOTT(at)aol.com
To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com
Sent: Wednesday, April 16, 2008 7:26 AM
Subject: Re: RV10-List: Re: AFS Systems .... and others
In a message dated 4/16/2008 9:18:34 AM Central Daylight Time,
johngoodman(at)earthlink.net writes:
is the high prices and arrogance of the Garmin folks
Anyone else get the feeling that now since garmin has gone from
aviation background to the general public in car devices...they really
don't need aviation anymore or certainly have an attitude like this?
We're sort of their test market and highest profit margin per product
area, but lowest market unit area...
P
________________________________
It's Tax Time! Get tips, forms and advice on AOL Money & Finance
<http://money.aol.com/tax?NCID=aolcmp00300000002850> .
href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List">http://www.matronic
s
.com/Navigator?RV10-List
href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com
href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: AFS Systems .... and others |
| From: | "Robin Marks" <robin1(at)mrmoisture.com> |
Garmin does have competition in the form of Chelton, OP and others. Plus
I absolutely consider the lower priced EFIS units competition to Garmin
as I strongly considered them before going with the G900X. I agree that
Garmin is A LOT like MS and they both seem to be full of themselves
however they both make excellent products that tend to be pretty well
sorted out when they hit the market place. A thing that is really
difficult to do in the aggressive world of software development which at
this point is exactly, they both are... software vendors. While I can
find fault with MS, I have also been able to pay for my -10 and the
balance of my family's lifestyle almost exclusively using MS software. I
can get annoyed with MS but I am also thankful that they are a stable,
consistent global company. They may screw you on some product pricing
but they don't Bear Stearns screw you. The same goes for Garmin from my
point of view. On my G900X purchase I looked at Dynon, GRT, AFS on the
low end and Chelton / OP on the high end specifically and I know I would
have been very happy with any of these fine devices but I would have
still had to get a transponder, dual radios, audio panel etc (OP
excluded) ... and when I penciled it out the difference was not that
great. In some cases there was no price difference at all. PLEASE cut me
some slack here because in this scenario I consider $15K "not that
great." Then adding the potential costs to integrate all these different
pieces of equipment from different vendors and learning the nuances of
each piece of equipment made the purchase price difference (to me)
become almost a push. The thought of a single fully integrated stable
system did have its appeal to me and was probably the overriding factor
in my choice. Add the fact that I many want to move up in aircraft class
at some point and that there is a very strong possibility that there
will be a G900/1000 driving that ship and all of a sudden Garmin made
the most sense for my purchase.
Yes we can bitch about Garmin for many reasons. I plan to be one of the
loudest complainers starting in the next few months as we give life to
this horse tail size gaggle of wires but for now I am fat, dumb & happy
as the unit is paid for, delivered and looks exactly how I sketched it
out 10 months ago .
Robin
WARNING, this aircraft is amateur built...
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: AFS Systems .... and others |
| From: | "John Cox" <johnwcox(at)pacificnw.com> |
________________________________
From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com on behalf of Robin Marks
Sent: Wed 4/16/2008 10:04 AM
Subject: RE: RV10-List: Re: AFS Systems .... and others
Garmin does have competition in the form of Chelton, OP and others. Plus
I absolutely consider the lower priced EFIS units competition to Garmin
as I strongly considered them before going with the G900X. I agree that
Garmin is A LOT like MS and they both seem to be full of themselves
however they both make excellent products that tend to be pretty well
sorted out when they hit the market place. A thing that is really
difficult to do in the aggressive world of software development which at
this point is exactly, they both are... software vendors. While I can
find fault with MS, I have also been able to pay for my -10 and the
balance of my family's lifestyle almost exclusively using MS software. I
can get annoyed with MS but I am also thankful that they are a stable,
consistent global company. They may screw you on some product pricing
but they don't Bear Stearns screw you. The same goes for Garmin from my
point of view. On my G900X purchase I looked at Dynon, GRT, AFS on the
low end and Chelton / OP on the high end specifically and I know I would
have been very happy with any of these fine devices but I would have
still had to get a transponder, dual radios, audio panel etc (OP
excluded) ... and when I penciled it out the difference was not that
great. In some cases there was no price difference at all. PLEASE cut me
some slack here because in this scenario I consider $15K "not that
great." Then adding the potential costs to integrate all these different
pieces of equipment from different vendors and learning the nuances of
each piece of equipment made the purchase price difference (to me)
become almost a push. The thought of a single fully integrated stable
system did have its appeal to me and was probably the overriding factor
in my choice. Add the fact that I many want to move up in aircraft class
at some point and that there is a very strong possibility that there
will be a G900/1000 driving that ship and all of a sudden Garmin made
the most sense for my purchase.
Yes we can bitch about Garmin for many reasons. I plan to be one of the
loudest complainers starting in the next few months as we give life to
this horse tail size gaggle of wires but for now I am fat, dumb & happy
as the unit is paid for, delivered and looks exactly how I sketched it
out 10 months ago .
Robin
WARNING, this aircraft is amateur built...
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: AFS Systems .... and others |
| From: | "John Cox" <johnwcox(at)pacificnw.com> |
Robin, your killing us here.
"Warning, this aircraft panel was built by" one of the finest avionics
shops in the country. You have what many of us can just dream about.
As configured, what did it run (in US dollars) to get to this level of
coverage.
My question is still out there (Remotely mounted avionics). Stein gave
me a price for my creation and I could by a 1970 Cessna or Piper for
that chunk. The market needs a challenger to Garmin on the ability to
remotely locate and control "current technology" avionics. Each of the
competitors you mention love to have panel mounted bricks like the ole
Motorola, first generation cellphone, that extend 11 inches towards the
firewall and then add real weight forward of the CG point.
Do you have any pictures of your remotely mounted dual GPS/Nav/Comm/ILS
units? I would love it if AFS/Chelton/Grand Rapids/Dynon/OP/L3/Avidyne
and all of Jesse's forgottens would control the remote Garmin stacks -
off the high value real estate like your picture shows. Technically
advanced certified aircraft are all the same layout and supplier -
Garmin 1000. We need some choices here. It is like the days of being a
logger in the Pacific NW circa 1850 or a pipeline worker in Alaska 1970.
Ecks, does anyone shave their legs up here - oh there are few of them.
The price Please....
John C.
________________________________
From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com on behalf of Robin Marks
Sent: Wed 4/16/2008 10:04 AM
Subject: RE: RV10-List: Re: AFS Systems .... and others
Garmin does have competition in the form of Chelton, OP and others. Plus
I absolutely consider the lower priced EFIS units competition to Garmin
as I strongly considered them before going with the G900X. I agree that
Garmin is A LOT like MS and they both seem to be full of themselves
however they both make excellent products that tend to be pretty well
sorted out when they hit the market place. A thing that is really
difficult to do in the aggressive world of software development which at
this point is exactly, they both are... software vendors. While I can
find fault with MS, I have also been able to pay for my -10 and the
balance of my family's lifestyle almost exclusively using MS software. I
can get annoyed with MS but I am also thankful that they are a stable,
consistent global company. They may screw you on some product pricing
but they don't Bear Stearns screw you. The same goes for Garmin from my
point of view. On my G900X purchase I looked at Dynon, GRT, AFS on the
low end and Chelton / OP on the high end specifically and I know I would
have been very happy with any of these fine devices but I would have
still had to get a transponder, dual radios, audio panel etc (OP
excluded) ... and when I penciled it out the difference was not that
great. In some cases there was no price difference at all. PLEASE cut me
some slack here because in this scenario I consider $15K "not that
great." Then adding the potential costs to integrate all these different
pieces of equipment from different vendors and learning the nuances of
each piece of equipment made the purchase price difference (to me)
become almost a push. The thought of a single fully integrated stable
system did have its appeal to me and was probably the overriding factor
in my choice. Add the fact that I many want to move up in aircraft class
at some point and that there is a very strong possibility that there
will be a G900/1000 driving that ship and all of a sudden Garmin made
the most sense for my purchase.
Yes we can bitch about Garmin for many reasons. I plan to be one of the
loudest complainers starting in the next few months as we give life to
this horse tail size gaggle of wires but for now I am fat, dumb & happy
as the unit is paid for, delivered and looks exactly how I sketched it
out 10 months ago .
Robin
WARNING, this aircraft is amateur built...
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "David McNeill" <dlm46007(at)cox.net> |
| Subject: | Re: AFS Systems .... and others |
I think Garmin is more reminiscent King in the 70s when Gar Min germinated.
_____
From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Pascal
Sent: Wednesday, April 16, 2008 8:14 AM
Subject: Re: RV10-List: Re: AFS Systems .... and others
with the G1000 and G900 I think the Garmin folks are more "we're better than
thou" than thinking we are their test bed. Some company reps get that way,
figure they don't need anyone when they are selling products based on the
name alone.
Arrogance is from thinking they dont need us as much as they think we need
them.. Sadly I need a 430w to go with my AFS system.. until there is a good
replacement I really dont have much of a choice.. happens when a company
buys their competition (Apollo/UPS)
Pascal
----- Original Message -----
From: GRANSCOTT(at)aol.com
Sent: Wednesday, April 16, 2008 7:26 AM
Subject: Re: RV10-List: Re: AFS Systems .... and others
In a message dated 4/16/2008 9:18:34 AM Central Daylight Time,
johngoodman(at)earthlink.net writes:
is the high prices and arrogance of the Garmin folks
Anyone else get the feeling that now since garmin has gone from aviation
background to the general public in car devices...they really don't need
aviation anymore or certainly have an attitude like this? We're sort of
their test market and highest profit margin per product area, but lowest
market unit area...
P
_____
It's Tax Time! Get tips, forms and advice on AOL
<http://money.aol.com/tax?NCID=aolcmp00300000002850> Money & Finance.
href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List">http://www.matronics.com
/Navigator?RV10-List
href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com
href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: AFS Systems .... and others |
| From: | "N777TY" <microsmurfer(at)yahoo.com> |
It'll list for around 17,000
That GPS/Nav/Com will list for about 14,000
bhughes(at)qnsi.net wrote:
> I wonder what the price will be for this Honeywell unit. The one sitting
beside the AFS display. Garmin needs competition so I hope this product will
be competitively priced.
>
> https://commerce.honeywell.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/CategoryDisplay?storeId=10101&catalogId=10052&langId=-1&cursel=item1&identifier=Apex%20Edge%20Series
(https://commerce.honeywell.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/CategoryDisplay?storeId=10101&catalogId=10052&langId=-1&cursel=item1&identifier=Apex%20Edge%20Series)
>
> Bobby
> 40116
>
--------
RV-7A
N777TY
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=177278#177278
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "David McNeill" <dlm46007(at)cox.net> |
Just a heads up. My original door seals were light gray. Because one did not
stick properly I ordered a new seal; had to purchase the 25 feet. OK. The
new seals are light brown. Surprise.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Kelly McMullen" <apilot2(at)gmail.com> |
>From Vans or ? I thought some were using seals from aircraftdoorseals.com
On Wed, Apr 16, 2008 at 6:32 PM, David McNeill wrote:
> Just a heads up. My original door seals were light gray. Because one did
> not stick properly I ordered a new seal; had to purchase the 25 feet. OK.
> The new seals are light brown. Surprise.
>
> *
>
> *
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Kelly McMullen" <apilot2(at)gmail.com> |
>From Vans or ? I thought some were using seals from aircraftdoorseals.com
On Wed, Apr 16, 2008 at 6:32 PM, David McNeill wrote:
> Just a heads up. My original door seals were light gray. Because one did
> not stick properly I ordered a new seal; had to purchase the 25 feet. OK.
> The new seals are light brown. Surprise.
>
> *
>
> *
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "David McNeill" <dlm46007(at)cox.net> |
vans
_____
From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Kelly McMullen
Sent: Wednesday, April 16, 2008 7:00 PM
Subject: RV10-List: door seals
>From Vans or ? I thought some were using seals from aircraftdoorseals.com
On Wed, Apr 16, 2008 at 6:32 PM, David McNeill wrote:
Just a heads up. My original door seals were light gray. Because one did not
stick properly I ordered a new seal; had to purchase the 25 feet. OK. The
new seals are light brown. Surprise.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Dave Lammers <davelammers(at)mchsi.com> |
David,
Other than color are there other characteristics that are different?
Dimensions, including thickness?
Stiffness? Etc?
Thanks,
Dave Lammers
Finishing--about to fasten door seals
David McNeill wrote:
> Just a heads up. My original door seals were light gray. Because one
> did not stick properly I ordered a new seal; had to purchase the 25
> feet. OK. The new seals are light brown. Surprise.
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Richard Sipp" <rsipp(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | Re: AFS Systems .... and others |
Robin:
Fantastic panel. I am wondering how you and the others using extended
depth panels are planning on handling the stick interference issue?
My panel is less than an inch deeper than stock and getting the
Infinity stick grips to clear took shortening upper portion of the stick
as much as possible and still mount the grip.
Thanks
Dick Sipp
RV10 N110DV
close
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "David McNeill" <dlm46007(at)cox.net> |
does not appear too be; be advised that this time we are using the same 3M
super silicone sealant clear that is mentioned in the plans. Used a GE
product first time, a silicon sealant rated 10 on the 10 scale bonding the
seal to glass and one worked and the other did not.
_____
From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Dave Lammers
Sent: Wednesday, April 16, 2008 7:39 PM
Subject: Re: RV10-List: door seals
David,
Other than color are there other characteristics that are different?
Dimensions, including thickness?
Stiffness? Etc?
Thanks,
Dave Lammers
Finishing--about to fasten door seals
David McNeill wrote:
Just a heads up. My original door seals were light gray. Because one did not
stick properly I ordered a new seal; had to purchase the 25 feet. OK. The
new seals are light brown. Surprise.
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: AFS Systems .... and others |
| From: | "William Curtis" <wcurtis(at)nerv10.com> |
>My question is still out there (Remotely mounted avionics)
Why the fascination with remote mounted avionics? The Garmin G-900 allows installation
with the Line Replaceable Units (LRUs) mounted remotely or directly in
front of the screens. While remote mounted avionics may be a plus, even mandatory
in large aircraft, that requirement is significantly reduced in small aircraft
such as the RV-10.
Here is a picture of a G-900 in an RV-7 by a Garmin engineer.
http://nerv10.com/wcurtis/pictures/images/G900XRV2.jpg
Here is a picture of the forward side of the panel with the LRUs installed with
the screens.
http://nerv10.com/wcurtis/pictures/images/G900XRV1.jpg
This is a picture of the G-900 with only the screens installed on the panel. The
LRUs are installed in a remote location ala new Cessna 182-206.
http://nerv10.com/wcurtis/pictures/images/G900XRV3.jpg
William
RV10-List(at)matronics.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Chris and Susie McGough" <VHMUM(at)bigpond.com> |
| Subject: | Torque wing bolts |
Could someone look up the torque for me for those nas bolts that hold the
wings on? Cant find my red book
regards Chris
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: AFS Systems .... and others |
| From: | "John Cox" <johnwcox(at)pacificnw.com> |
Thanks for the review. I captured all of these back in the Garmin tent
at OSH '06. It was a proof of concept done in Salem at their Black Ops
site where they developed the G1000 options, G600 and G900X.
Remotely mounted avionics stacks reduce panel heat, provide tremendous
flexibility in W&B issues, improves performance, enhances pilot
ergonomics and functional flow during "hard IFR" (a phrase I do not
like). Remotely mounted makes panel installation a breeze.
It only took some time inside a shiny new KingAir C90, a new Mooney, a
Cessna 182XP and the DJet prototype to see clearly where panel design
has moved since Jim introduced "ArchAngel" in a Lancair IV, N425HP
(Jesse' you tracking this hangar queen?) back in 1983.
Dynon pryed open the low end of the Experimental market, Sierra moved
the bar to SV, AFS brought us the best in engine monitoring and now the
playing field is infilling the holes. The only missed point is that
volume should begin to push down the piety of Garmin. If only
Apollo(UPS Aviation) in Salem would jump back into this game. Aspen is
even breathing life into the concept of Dynon style EFIS screens for
retrofit steam gauge guys. And let's all thank Mark and his Vertical
Power developments.
Let's not forget our own Bill DeRouchey and the great job he has done
with his panel. Jim Hergert's N6XE set the standard with his three
screen Chelton Sierras and it is so beautiful that Garmin uses his plane
in their literature to sell the G900 (He doesn't even own them). His
only Garmins are not EFIS they are the Old Panel mounted Rack Avionics
of the 1950's. Oh how I love nostalgia.
One formula has remained timeless. The percent of final cost in the
airframe, the percent in the FWF, the percent in the total Avionics,
Abby would love you to factor a percentage for a professional interior -
too. As Stein puts it so well, three things lead to higher resale
value. Avionics properly laidout, well wired and functional is a big
one. Now that RV7 with dual G900's that sets the needle to full
deflection. WOW he took that to heart. Oh yeh, if we could only pay
what he did. That is where "Supply & Demand" needs to sign in.
The one factor missing from Robin's post was the Garmin mandated factory
installation cost. Tim got it right - he did it all and shared each
step. Randy got Lancair to do his. The rest of us say our prayers each
night that pricing will get downright competitive like Dell Computers.
John C.
________________________________
From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com on behalf of William Curtis
Sent: Wed 4/16/2008 9:10 PM
Subject: RV10-List: Re: AFS Systems .... and others
>My question is still out there (Remotely mounted avionics)
Why the fascination with remote mounted avionics? The Garmin G-900
allows installation with the Line Replaceable Units (LRUs) mounted
remotely or directly in front of the screens. While remote mounted
avionics may be a plus, even mandatory in large aircraft, that
requirement is significantly reduced in small aircraft such as the
RV-10.
Here is a picture of a G-900 in an RV-7 by a Garmin engineer.
http://nerv10.com/wcurtis/pictures/images/G900XRV2.jpg
Here is a picture of the forward side of the panel with the LRUs
installed with the screens.
http://nerv10.com/wcurtis/pictures/images/G900XRV1.jpg
This is a picture of the G-900 with only the screens installed on the
panel. The LRUs are installed in a remote location ala new Cessna
182-206.
http://nerv10.com/wcurtis/pictures/images/G900XRV3.jpg
William
RV10-List(at)matronics.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | John Hurst <johnh38(at)yahoo.com> |
| Subject: | Encoder / Transponder question |
I'm in the process of connecting up some avionics HW and need some assistance.
I have the Ameri-King AK-350 encoder and the Garmin GTX-320A transponder. My question
is where do I hook up pin #18 on the Garmin ? Its listed as Altitude D4.
The AK-350 doesn't have an altitude D4 pin and I can't find a reference as to what
D4 actually is. Is my AK-350 outdated?
The AK-350 has a DB-15 pin connector and the Garmin has a DB-25 pin connector
Anyone have a schematic laying around that includes the Garmin. My AK-350 is new
in the box but about 7 years old.
A google search did not provide any worth while results
John
40102
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "David McNeill" <dlm46007(at)cox.net> |
| Subject: | Encoder / Transponder question |
I have not searched for the 320A manual I have for the Glastar but I believe
you do not need to hook up that wire. I believe that the encoding is binary
and the D4 provides an altitude that you encoder does not support; Your
encoder may be limited to 20000 but the Garmin may be able to report 30000
to ATC. Additionally Garmin can supply a pdf of their old tech manual.
_____
From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of John Hurst
Sent: Thursday, April 17, 2008 5:53 AM
Subject: RV10-List: Encoder / Transponder question
I'm in the process of connecting up some avionics HW and need some
assistance. I have the Ameri-King AK-350 encoder and the Garmin GTX-320A
transponder. My question is where do I hook up pin #18 on the Garmin ? Its
listed as Altitude D4.
The AK-350 doesn't have an altitude D4 pin and I can't find a reference as
to what D4 actually is. Is my AK-350 outdated?
The AK-350 has a DB-15 pin connector and the Garmin has a DB-25 pin
connector
Anyone have a schematic laying around that includes the Garmin. My AK-350 is
new in the box but about 7 years old.
A google search did not provide any worth while results
John
40102
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | GRANSCOTT(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: AFS Systems .... and others |
In a message dated 4/16/2008 11:05:11 PM Central Daylight Time,
wcurtis(at)nerv10.com writes:
Why the fascination with remote mounted avionics?
CG...
**************Need a new ride? Check out the largest site for U.S. used car
listings at AOL Autos.
(http://autos.aol.com/used?NCID=aolcmp00300000002851)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "David McNeill" <dlm46007(at)cox.net> |
| Subject: | Encoder / Transponder question |
IIRC the first nine pins provide 8 bit binary to indicate altitude and one
the 320A is capable. Short story you do not need to hook it anywhere..
_____
From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of John Hurst
Sent: Thursday, April 17, 2008 5:53 AM
Subject: RV10-List: Encoder / Transponder question
I'm in the process of connecting up some avionics HW and need some
assistance. I have the Ameri-King AK-350 encoder and the Garmin GTX-320A
transponder. My question is where do I hook up pin #18 on the Garmin ? Its
listed as Altitude D4.
The AK-350 doesn't have an altitude D4 pin and I can't find a reference as
to what D4 actually is. Is my AK-350 outdated?
The AK-350 has a DB-15 pin connector and the Garmin has a DB-25 pin
connector
Anyone have a schematic laying around that includes the Garmin. My AK-350 is
new in the box but about 7 years old.
A google search did not provide any worth while results
John
40102
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | SkyTec Starter Wiring Warning |
| From: | John Jessen <n212pj(at)gmail.com> |
Probably everyone knows about this but me, but since I just fried my
oil-soaked SkyTec starter on my GlaStar, I was perusing their web pages and
found this:
http://www.skytecair.com/Wiring_diag.htm
Scroll down to the RV-10 wiring warning. If the shoe fits...
John Jessen
40328 building
GlaStar flying
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | rsipp(at)earthlink.net |
Serial 40065 N110DV was successfully flown for the first time this afternoon.
No problems were noted and the airplane flew well.
Pictures and more information after the test period is complete and we've been
to the paintshop.
Dick Sipp
RV 10 flying
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Bob Leffler" <rv(at)thelefflers.com> |
Great news Dick!!!
With all the first flights, we are going to need a couple rows at OSH for parking
all the RV-10s!
Bob
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of rsipp(at)earthlink.net
Sent: Thursday, April 17, 2008 3:26 PM
Subject: RV10-List: First flight
Serial 40065 N110DV was successfully flown for the first time this afternoon.
No problems were noted and the airplane flew well.
Pictures and more information after the test period is complete and we've been
to the paintshop.
Dick Sipp
RV 10 flying
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Thane States" <thane2(at)comporium.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Recommendations for front air vents |
No secret, I just didn't know if anyone cared to hear. But glad to share.
Here goes; Go to lowes or H.D and B-line it for the plumbing department,
then look for the rubber fittings to attach PVC, in line, 1 1/2". Get a
coupling for 1 1/2" pipe, it will be about 4" long and have two hose clamps
on each end. You will need to cut the two ends off with a band saw, or your
weapon of choice. Cut just inside of the groove where the clamp sets. You
will now have two couplings for each vent.
Then you can use a dremal to cut the big flange off the NACA inlets, about
1/4 inch from the seam, or so you have 1 1/2" diameter left. Then with the
nut ring still on the eyeball vent insert it into the rubber coupling and
place the whole unit over the NACA vent, and tighten the hose clamp.
Sound complicated but take around 30 minutes.
Let me know if you have questions. I also have a pic of the end product,
looks real clean, is easy to remove, and eliminates the ugly white flange,
and requires no hardware or glue.
Thane
803-396-8865
----- Original Message -----
From: "McGANN, Ron" <ron.mcgann(at)baesystems.com>
Sent: Tuesday, April 15, 2008 7:14 PM
Subject: RE: RV10-List: Recommendations for front air vents
>
> Thane - don't be coy. I am about to instal Steins vents and was
> thinking of E6000 to attach them to the NACA ducts. What was your
> method? Contact me off list if this is a secret .
>
> Cheers,
> Ron
> 187, almost there.
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Thane States
> Sent: Wednesday, 16 April 2008 8:21 AM
> To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com
> Subject: Re: RV10-List: Recommendations for front air vents
>
>
> Stein sells tem for just under $100. They are very nice and I found a
> great way to install them with no hardware or Proseal.
> Thane
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Fred Williams, M.D." <drfred(at)suddenlinkmail.com>
> To:
> Sent: Monday, April 14, 2008 5:06 PM
> Subject: RV10-List: Recommendations for front air vents
>
>
>>
>>
>> Any recommendations for the front air vents?
>> Vans wants $145 for the aluminum ones
>>
>> Aircraft Spruce has several varieties in the $175 price range.
>> Is this is the part of the building where you say to the dealer?
>>
>> ........ hit me . :-)
>>
>>
>> Lew: good job on the wheel pants. Thanks for the reference, but I
>> just added the pics. Our late friend, Mark Ritter showed me how to do
>
>> it when I looked at his plane a couple of months ago. And I will be
> "displeased"
>> if you get flying before I do.
>>
>>
>>
>> Fred Williams
>> 40515.
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
> "Warning:
> The information contained in this email and any attached files is
> confidential to BAE Systems Australia. If you are not the intended
> recipient, any use, disclosure or copying of this email or any
> attachments is expressly prohibited. If you have received this email
> in error, please notify us immediately. VIRUS: Every care has been
> taken to ensure this email and its attachments are virus free,
> however, any loss or damage incurred in using this email is not the
> sender's responsibility. It is your responsibility to ensure virus
> checks are completed before installing any data sent in this email to
> your computer."
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Chris and Susie McGough" <VHMUM(at)bigpond.com> |
| Subject: | Re: SkyTec Starter Wiring Warning |
No I did not know this does anyone know if Vans updated there plans as mine
show to remove the jumper which will make it 24 volts!.
regards Chris
----- Original Message -----
From: "John Jessen" <n212pj(at)gmail.com>
Sent: Friday, April 18, 2008 1:47 AM
Subject: RV10-List: SkyTec Starter Wiring Warning
>
> Probably everyone knows about this but me, but since I just fried my
> oil-soaked SkyTec starter on my GlaStar, I was perusing their web pages
> and
> found this:
>
> http://www.skytecair.com/Wiring_diag.htm
>
> Scroll down to the RV-10 wiring warning. If the shoe fits...
>
> John Jessen
> 40328 building
> GlaStar flying
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | linn Walters <pitts_pilot(at)bellsouth.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Recommendations for front air vents |
Thane States wrote:
snip
> Let me know if you have questions. I also have a pic of the end
> product, looks real clean, is easy to remove, and eliminates the ugly
> white flange, and requires no hardware or glue.
So, where's the picture??? Holding out for cash offers??? :-)
Linn
>
> Thane
> 803-396-8865
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | <jim(at)CombsFive.Com> |
Speaking of Oshkosh,
I hope they allow more room for taxi this year, Last year the wingtip spacing was
a bit tight.
Jim C
40192
===========================================================
From: "Bob Leffler" <rv(at)thelefflers.com>
Date: 2008/04/17 Thu PM 03:56:40 EDT
Subject: RE: RV10-List: First flight
Great news Dick!!!
With all the first flights, we are going to need a couple rows at OSH for parking
all the RV-10s!
Bob
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of rsipp(at)earthlink.net
Sent: Thursday, April 17, 2008 3:26 PM
Subject: RV10-List: First flight
Serial 40065 N110DV was successfully flown for the first time this afternoon.
No problems were noted and the airplane flew well.
Pictures and more information after the test period is complete and we've been
to the paintshop.
Dick Sipp
RV 10 flying
===========================================================
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Thane States" <thane2(at)comporium.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Recommendations for front air vents |
Sorry the wife has camera. I will post some pics tomorrow.
Thane
----- Original Message -----
From: "linn Walters" <pitts_pilot(at)bellsouth.net>
Sent: Thursday, April 17, 2008 7:12 PM
Subject: Re: RV10-List: Recommendations for front air vents
>
> Thane States wrote:
>
>
> snip
>
>> Let me know if you have questions. I also have a pic of the end
>> product, looks real clean, is easy to remove, and eliminates the ugly
>> white flange, and requires no hardware or glue.
>
> So, where's the picture??? Holding out for cash offers??? :-)
> Linn
>
>>
>> Thane
>> 803-396-8865
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Jesse Saint <jesse(at)saintaviation.com> |
I have asked for this in the past, and may have reported on it at some
point, but wanted to share an experience with the group. Earlier
today my dad and I flew from 7FL6 to X35 and did the GPS 23 approach
into Dunnellon. This approach is a non-WAAS approach, but when
activated on the 430W it reads "LNAV+V". When close to the final
approach fix "JOLCO", we just hit "mode" to activate GPSS and then
"alt" twice to activate GPSV and the TruTrak Digiflight II VSGV did
the rest until the flare. Even while dropping the flaps it kept the
needles almost centered and quickly got them back to the center.
Other than that, it nailed the center of both needles all the way down
to the VASI's, one red one white the whole way down.
Most of this to encourage those of you who have the 430W or 530W to
utilize this feature in your TruTrak vertical steering GPS. I know a
lot of other units have been able to do this for a while, but getting
it from possibly the most common GPS in GA is a great improvement.
The technology advances even in the short time I have been directly
involved in aviation are amazing.
Jesse Saint
Saint Aviation, Inc.
jesse(at)saintaviation.com
Cell: 352-427-0285
Fax: 815-377-3694
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Deems Davis <deemsdavis(at)cox.net> |
| Subject: | Re: First flight |
Congratulations Dick !
Keep us posted on how your Phase 1 goes and if you find / encounter any
gremlins.
Deems Davis # 406
'Its all done....Its just not put together'
http://deemsrv10.com/
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | FW: 12 "cigarette" receptacle |
| From: | "Dawson-Townsend,Timothy" <tdawson-townsend(at)aurora.aero> |
Check this out. I didn't really like the bulky cigarette-type power
receptacles from Spruce or elsewhere (commonly with a flange on both
sides for screw mounting), so I went to the aviation department at West
Marine and found this one by Marinco. As you can see, it mounts with a
screw-on ring in the back, so you've only got the diameter of the
receptacle itself showing in front. There is an optional front flange
if you want to use it. It also has a nice-sealing cap, being a marine
product . . .
I think it was $17.99 at my local West Marine. You landlubbers will
have to go on their web site, if interested.
TDT
40025
Wings going on soon!
From: Dawson-Townsend [mailto:yooper(at)alum.mit.edu]
Sent: Friday, April 18, 2008 1:35 AM
Subject: P1000230.JPG
P1000230.JPG
--
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "RV Builder (Michael Sausen)" <rvbuilder(at)sausen.net> |
| Subject: | SkyTec Starter Wiring Warning |
Which starter is Van selling with the FWF now? If it's the LS then I believe
the original diagram is correct. If it's now the NL then the new diagram is
correct. As always you should review the instructions from the manufacturer in
addition to Van's. You know they will always fall back on what the manufacturer
says.
Michael
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Chris and Susie McGough
Sent: Thursday, April 17, 2008 5:22 PM
Subject: Re: RV10-List: SkyTec Starter Wiring Warning
No I did not know this does anyone know if Vans updated there plans as mine
show to remove the jumper which will make it 24 volts!.
regards Chris
----- Original Message -----
From: "John Jessen" <n212pj(at)gmail.com>
Sent: Friday, April 18, 2008 1:47 AM
Subject: RV10-List: SkyTec Starter Wiring Warning
>
> Probably everyone knows about this but me, but since I just fried my
> oil-soaked SkyTec starter on my GlaStar, I was perusing their web pages
> and
> found this:
>
> http://www.skytecair.com/Wiring_diag.htm
>
> Scroll down to the RV-10 wiring warning. If the shoe fits...
>
> John Jessen
> 40328 building
> GlaStar flying
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Doerr, Ray R [NTK]" <Ray.R.Doerr(at)sprint.com> |
| Subject: | SkyTec Starter Wiring Warning |
You don't get a Starter in the Van's FWF Kit.
Thank You
Ray Doerr
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of RV Builder (Michael Sausen)
Sent: Friday, April 18, 2008 9:21 AM
Subject: RE: RV10-List: SkyTec Starter Wiring Warning
Which starter is Van selling with the FWF now? If it's the LS then I believe
the original diagram is correct. If it's now the NL then the new diagram is
correct. As always you should review the instructions from the manufacturer in
addition to Van's. You know they will always fall back on what the manufacturer
says.
Michael
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Chris and Susie McGough
Sent: Thursday, April 17, 2008 5:22 PM
Subject: Re: RV10-List: SkyTec Starter Wiring Warning
No I did not know this does anyone know if Vans updated there plans as mine
show to remove the jumper which will make it 24 volts!.
regards Chris
----- Original Message -----
From: "John Jessen" <n212pj(at)gmail.com>
Sent: Friday, April 18, 2008 1:47 AM
Subject: RV10-List: SkyTec Starter Wiring Warning
>
> Probably everyone knows about this but me, but since I just fried my
> oil-soaked SkyTec starter on my GlaStar, I was perusing their web pages
> and
> found this:
>
> http://www.skytecair.com/Wiring_diag.htm
>
> Scroll down to the RV-10 wiring warning. If the shoe fits...
>
> John Jessen
> 40328 building
> GlaStar flying
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | FW: 12 "cigarette" receptacle |
| From: | "Robin Marks" <robin1(at)mrmoisture.com> |
I also didn't care for any aviation 12V receptacle I could source and
the best looking one I could find was on one a 2008 Honda (CRV). Most
newer Honda's used the same receptacle with a rectangular spring loaded
cover plate and a nice 12V embossed on the face plate. I think I paid
$20.00 each delivered from an online automotive supply house.
Sorry no photos as I am traveling.
Robin
From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of
Dawson-Townsend,Timothy
Sent: Friday, April 18, 2008 6:59 AM
Subject: RV10-List: FW: 12 "cigarette" receptacle
Check this out. I didn't really like the bulky cigarette-type power
receptacles from Spruce or elsewhere (commonly with a flange on both
sides for screw mounting), so I went to the aviation department at West
Marine and found this one by Marinco. As you can see, it mounts with a
screw-on ring in the back, so you've only got the diameter of the
receptacle itself showing in front. There is an optional front flange
if you want to use it. It also has a nice-sealing cap, being a marine
product . . .
I think it was $17.99 at my local West Marine. You landlubbers will
have to go on their web site, if interested.
TDT
40025
Wings going on soon!
From: Dawson-Townsend [mailto:yooper(at)alum.mit.edu]
Sent: Friday, April 18, 2008 1:35 AM
Subject: P1000230.JPG
P1000230.JPG
--
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Roger Standley" <taildragon(at)msn.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Torque wing bolts |
Hi Chris,=0A=0ADid you receive a response? I need those torques,
too.=0A=0ARoger=0A ----- Original Message ----- =0A Fro
m: Chris and Susie McGough =0A To: rv10-
list(at)matronics.com =0A Sent: Wedne
sday, April 16, 2008 9:55 PM=0A Subject: RV10-List: Torque wing bo
ie McGough" >=0A=0A
Could someone look up the torque for me for those nas bolts that hol
d the =0A wings on? Cant find my red book=0A=0A regards Ch
=======================
=======================
=======================
=======================
=======================
=======================
w.matronics.com/contribution<http://www.matronics.com/contribution>
=======================
=================0A=0A=0A
=0A
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jay Rowe" <jfrjr(at)roadrunner.com> |
Now deep into the wiring and panel placement but have several questions.
1) Trim wiring. Specifically what type of wire or bundle do I run from
the panel to the three trim motors. I have used Stein's "servo" wire to
feed the roll and pitch servos but that seems to have too many wires and
some of the wires are too big. Do I make my own bundle or is there
something available specifically for this chore? 2) The radio stack
cooling fan I have has three ports but I can only find two ports on the
radio stack. Do I use that other port to cool the Lightspeed console?
And is there a preferred position to place that fan? Thanks everyone
for the continued help. Jay Rowe 40301
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Rick Sked <ricksked(at)embarqmail.com> |
| Subject: | Re: wiring question |
Jay,
Can't help you with the fans but this works well for the trim.
http://www.aircraftspruce.com/catalog/elpages/wc2wire.php
Rick Sked
40185
----- Original Message -----
From: "Jay Rowe" <jfrjr(at)roadrunner.com>
Sent: Friday, April 18, 2008 8:11:17 AM (GMT-0800) America/Los_Angeles
Subject: RV10-List: wiring question
Now deep into the wiring and panel placement but have several questions.=C2
-1) Trim wiring. Specifically what type of wire or bundle do I run from t
he panel to the three trim motors.=C2- I have used Stein's "servo" wire t
o feed the roll and pitch servos but that seems to have too many wires and
some of the wires are too big. Do I make my own bundle or is there somethin
g available specifically for this chore?=C2-2)=C2- The radio stack cool
ing fan I have has three ports but I can only find two ports on the radio s
tack.=C2- Do I use that other=C2-port to=C2-cool the=C2-Lightspeed
console?=C2- And is there a preferred position to place that fan?=C2-
=C2-Thanks everyone for the continued help.=C2- Jay Rowe 40301
Upgrade Your Email - Click here!
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | gommone7(at)bellsouth.net |
| Subject: | Re: FW: 12 "cigarette" receptacle |
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: wiring question |
| From: | "orchidman" <gary(at)wingscc.com> |
Jay,
I am also running the same wiring as Rick. I also got mine from AS. It is one
bundle to pull and not worry which wire is which.
--------
Gary Blankenbiller
RV10 - # 40674
Fuselage SB
(N410GB reserved)
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=177660#177660
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: SkyTec Starter Wiring Warning |
| From: | "tomhanaway" <tomhanaway(at)comcast.net> |
Ok, I've got a dog in this fight since I just ordered an IO-540 from Van's as part
of their promotion.
The Van's Lycoming engine comes with the LS starter on the crated engine. Since
it's part of the OEM contract with Van's, it can't be changed. If you're ordering
from an after market builder, you can specify the NL.
I then spoke to the tech at Sky-Tech. The LS has a higher current draw than the
NL and may not turn over the engine IF you've done a shoddy wiring job. The
NL is recommended for that reason.
As to kickback, that can happen depending on settings of a magneto. In my case,
I plan to go with PMags for both. Skytech advised that they worked specifically
with the PMag system guys to ensure that a kickback won't happen.
Bottom line-Skytech changed the recommendation from LS to NL based on several engines
having slow turnover due to restrictive wiring or low battery power.
So I'll stay with the LS unless I do have a problem. If I was starting from scratch
on the engine, I'd get the NL.
Tom H.
Boynton Beach, FL[color=black][/color]
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=177671#177671
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Dave Saylor" <Dave(at)AirCraftersLLC.com> |
Jay,
Ray Allen sells wire that's perfect for their trim motors. It's very small
diameter and the colors match the servos so you don't have to convert
anything.
If I had an extra cooling port I would consider blowing cool air up into the
top of the panel area. It gets pretty hot up there. Also, put a few vent
holes in the top of the glare sheild to let the heat out. My Dynon
overtemped on a warm day last fall before I installed the cooling fan and
vent holes. We put the fan laying flat so it pulls (cooler) air from the
cockpit at about the level of the bottom of the panel. I also ran a couple
cold air tubes from the fresh air NACA ducts to displace some warm air.
Dave Saylor
AirCrafters LLC
140 Aviation Way
Watsonville, CA
831-722-9141
831-750-0284 CL
www.AirCraftersLLC.com
_____
From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Jay Rowe
Sent: Friday, April 18, 2008 8:11 AM
Subject: RV10-List: wiring question
Now deep into the wiring and panel placement but have several questions. 1)
Trim wiring. Specifically what type of wire or bundle do I run from the
panel to the three trim motors. I have used Stein's "servo" wire to feed
the roll and pitch servos but that seems to have too many wires and some of
the wires are too big. Do I make my own bundle or is there something
available specifically for this chore? 2) The radio stack cooling fan I
have has three ports but I can only find two ports on the radio stack. Do I
use that other port to cool the Lightspeed console? And is there a
preferred position to place that fan? Thanks everyone for the continued
help. Jay Rowe 40301
<http://promos.hotbar.com/promos/promodll.dll?RunPromo&El=&SG=&RAND=47419&pa
rtner=seekmo> Upgrade Your Email - Click here!
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "lbgjb10" <lbgjb(at)gnt.net> |
I'm looking at putting in a Stewart Warner dual flow oil cooler--told model is
8432R. Using Mattituck 10-540. Anyone use it--any problems or problems fitting
it?? thanks larry b
--------
Larry and Gayle N104LG
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=177676#177676
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Rick Sked <ricksked(at)embarqmail.com> |
I have Van's stock FWF cooler....I know I'm going to be changing it out...I just know it but I'm gonna try it first. This is my choice for replacment and it may another manuf. that Alex is selling but it is a much better oil cooler in many ways. Heres the link: http://www.aviationtechproducts.com/html/engine__parts.html
Rick Sked
40185
----- Original Message -----
From: "lbgjb10" <lbgjb(at)gnt.net>
Sent: Friday, April 18, 2008 10:11:47 AM (GMT-0800) America/Los_Angeles
Subject: RV10-List: oil cooler
I'm looking at putting in a Stewart Warner dual flow oil cooler--told model is
8432R. Using Mattituck 10-540. Anyone use it--any problems or problems fitting
it?? thanks larry b
--------
Larry and Gayle N104LG
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=177676#177676
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Paul Grimstad" <Bldgrv10450(at)comcast.net> |
| Subject: | Re: FW: 12 "cigarette" receptacle |
P1000230.JPGThey have a nice one at Aerocraft Parts:
http://www.aerocraftparts.com/ItemForm.aspx?item=901-0031&Category=51
ea08db-b876-4fd0-8c8b-dc2ba184c151
Paul Grimstad
RV10 40450
Portland, Or.
----- Original Message -----
From: Dawson-Townsend,Timothy
To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com
Sent: Friday, April 18, 2008 6:58 AM
Subject: RV10-List: FW: 12 "cigarette" receptacle
Check this out. I didn't really like the bulky cigarette-type power
receptacles from Spruce or elsewhere (commonly with a flange on both
sides for screw mounting), so I went to the aviation department at West
Marine and found this one by Marinco. As you can see, it mounts with a
screw-on ring in the back, so you've only got the diameter of the
receptacle itself showing in front. There is an optional front flange
if you want to use it. It also has a nice-sealing cap, being a marine
product . . .
I think it was $17.99 at my local West Marine. You landlubbers will
have to go on their web site, if interested.
TDT
40025
Wings going on soon!
From: Dawson-Townsend [mailto:yooper(at)alum.mit.edu]
Sent: Friday, April 18, 2008 1:35 AM
To: Dawson-Townsend,Timothy
Subject: P1000230.JPG
P1000230.JPG
--
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Chris and Susie McGough" <VHMUM(at)bigpond.com> |
| Subject: | Wiring NL starter help |
Guys I am now stuck. I have the NL starter and also wired the plane as per
Vans wiring kit which I now know is wrong for this starter. I contacted Vans
and they are not interested in helping as not the starter they supply.
Can somone have a look at the skytec diagram and give me an idea what wires
to change. Ofcourse if you have not used Vans diagram you will not know the
difference.
Vans starter relay has 4 terminals and Skytec diagram has 3. Also Skytec has
1 wire going to the starter not 2.
http://www.skytecair.com/images/NL%2012V%20Installation%20Wiring_1100.jpg
Luckily John Jessen pointed this out
regards Chris
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Chris and Susie McGough" <VHMUM(at)bigpond.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Torque wing bolts |
Thanks Vern You should have got he email to Roger regards Chris
----- Original Message -----
From: Roger Standley
To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com
Sent: Saturday, April 19, 2008 12:52 AM
Subject: Re: RV10-List: Torque wing bolts
Hi Chris,
Did you receive a response? I need those torques, too.
Roger
----- Original Message -----
From: Chris and Susie McGough
To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com
Sent: Wednesday, April 16, 2008 9:55 PM
Subject: RV10-List: Torque wing bolts
Could someone look up the torque for me for those nas bolts that
hold the
wings on?
C========================
======================nbsp;
- The RV10-List Email Forum
-http://www.=====================
p; - MATRONICS WEB FORUMS
href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.====
===================nbsp;
title=http://www.matronics.com/contribution
href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c
ontribut======================
==================
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Chris and Susie McGough" <VHMUM(at)bigpond.com> |
| Subject: | SkyTec Starter Wiring Warning diagrams |
Here is the diagrams. The first is Vans which is how I have wired which is
incorrect for the NL starter
http://www.skytecair.com/images/Van's%20Starter%20Wiring%20RV10%20Lg.jpg
This is the corect wiring.
http://www.skytecair.com/images/NL%2012V%20Installation%20Wiring_1100.jpg
Chris
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Chris and Susie McGough" <VHMUM(at)bigpond.com> |
| Subject: | Wiring NL starter problem solved |
Hi Chris
You can use the 4 terminal solenoid - just use the 'S' terminal to your
switch, leave the 'I' unconnected assuming you have the standard black
starter solenoid. If you are still not sure then give me a call on 0412 624
723 and I'll walk you through it. I'm off test flying an Fadec equipped R7A
(the old ICY ;-) but will be available during the day.
Regards, Jake
----- Original Message -----
From: "Chris and Susie McGough" <VHMUM(at)bigpond.com>
Sent: Saturday, April 19, 2008 6:54 AM
Subject: RV10-List: Wiring NL starter help
>
>
> Guys I am now stuck. I have the NL starter and also wired the plane as per
> Vans wiring kit which I now know is wrong for this starter. I contacted
> Vans and they are not interested in helping as not the starter they
> supply.
>
> Can somone have a look at the skytec diagram and give me an idea what
> wires to change. Ofcourse if you have not used Vans diagram you will not
> know the difference.
>
> Vans starter relay has 4 terminals and Skytec diagram has 3. Also Skytec
> has 1 wire going to the starter not 2.
> http://www.skytecair.com/images/NL%2012V%20Installation%20Wiring_1100.jpg
>
> Luckily John Jessen pointed this out
>
> regards Chris
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Larry Rosen <LarryRosen(at)comcast.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Insurance was AFS Systems .... (G900X panel cost / Stick |
Clearance)
Here is the post John was referencing. It is slightly different than the information
we got earlier where IFR GPS, and moving map and autopilot are required
for the 10% discount from AIG.
Just got my insurance bill for the renewal and SkySmith included the AIG
"Technology Advanced Aircraft" discount requirements.
The aircraft must have:
1.) IFR certified GPS, 2.) Moving map, 3.) two axis autopilot, plus any
two from column B, including:
TAWS, TCAS, Weather monitor (Stormscope, datalink, or radar), a fuel
totalizer, and RNP capability.
The pilot must have:
1.) Minimum Private/Instrument
2.) Current Instrument Proficiency Check, maintained annually
3.) Air Safety Foundation course completed, selected from 1.) single
pilot IFR, 2.) Datalink, 3.) Thunderstorms, 4.) IFR GPS, and 5.) Runway
Safety. These are available free and on-line and take about 30-40
minutes to complete.
Meet these requirements and get a 10% discount from AIG!!
John Cox wrote:
> ...
> On the Lancair site today there was a posting of new equipment
> requirements and pilot requirements that trigger a 10% savings for
> true Technically Advanced IFR Experimental equipped aircraft. Knowing
> those components, choosing wisely, building safely and maintaining
> currency of flight is going to have a positive impact and those are
> good things.
>
> John C
>
> *
> *
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Thane States" <thane2(at)comporium.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Recommendations for front air vents |
Here are a few pics of my eyeball vent install as promised. Hope these are
OK.
Thane
----- Original Message -----
From: "Thane States" <thane2(at)comporium.net>
Sent: Thursday, April 17, 2008 9:18 PM
Subject: Re: RV10-List: Recommendations for front air vents
>
> Sorry the wife has camera. I will post some pics tomorrow.
> Thane
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "linn Walters" <pitts_pilot(at)bellsouth.net>
> To:
> Sent: Thursday, April 17, 2008 7:12 PM
> Subject: Re: RV10-List: Recommendations for front air vents
>
>
>>
>> Thane States wrote:
>>
>>
>> snip
>>
>>> Let me know if you have questions. I also have a pic of the end
>>> product, looks real clean, is easy to remove, and eliminates the ugly
>>> white flange, and requires no hardware or glue.
>>
>> So, where's the picture??? Holding out for cash offers??? :-)
>> Linn
>>
>>>
>>> Thane
>>> 803-396-8865
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: 12 "cigarette" receptacle |
| From: | "johngoodman" <johngoodman(at)earthlink.net> |
Funny that a cigarette lighter defines a standard. Sort of like the 4 feet 8.5
inches of a railroad track....
--------
#40572 QB Fuselage, wings finished
N711JG reserved
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=177788#177788
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Scott Schmidt <scottmschmidt(at)yahoo.com> |
| Subject: | PIREP: Electric Rudder Trim - Do I really need it? |
Over the past month I have been heavily debating whether I should add electric
rudder trim or not.
Everyone who has it absolutely loves it and I know it would be great but I wanted
to see if I could get away with just rudder trim tabs.
I like to add stuff like electric trim but wanted to try the KISS principle first.
For the first year I had one of the tabs from Avery on and it always needed a little
more right rudder.
Last year at Oshkosh I saw one RV-10 with two tabs (can't remember who) so I tried
it out.
I purchased another tab and temporarily mounted it so I now have two full tabs
on the lower portion of my rudder.
I have flown for 10 hours now with the two tabs and it seems to be working perfect.
At 165 knots true the ball is perfectly centered. At 160 it is barely right and
at 170 it is barely left.
I am so pleased with the results that I am not going to add the electric trim for
now.
I believe the electric trim is the luxury way to go but I can now fly with both
feet flat on the floor.
Just thought I'd share my findings with you. Happy Flying!
Scott Schmidt
scottmschmidt(at)yahoo.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Kelly McMullen <kellym(at)aviating.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Wiring NL starter help |
I tend to think you have the wrong relay. The starter relay is normally
an intermittentduty model, with 3 terminals as shown in the Skytec
diagram. Master relays normally have 4 terminals. I note that the
pictures in the Spruce catalog are also reversed. :-(
Chris and Susie McGough wrote:
>
>
> Guys I am now stuck. I have the NL starter and also wired the plane as
> per Vans wiring kit which I now know is wrong for this starter. I
> contacted Vans and they are not interested in helping as not the
> starter they supply.
>
> Can somone have a look at the skytec diagram and give me an idea what
> wires to change. Ofcourse if you have not used Vans diagram you will
> not know the difference.
>
> Vans starter relay has 4 terminals and Skytec diagram has 3. Also
> Skytec has 1 wire going to the starter not 2.
> http://www.skytecair.com/images/NL%2012V%20Installation%20Wiring_1100.jpg
>
> Luckily John Jessen pointed this out
>
> regards Chris
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Wayne Edgerton" <wayne.e(at)grandecom.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Insurance was AFS Systems .... (G900X panel cost / Stick |
Clearance)
I qualified for the TAA requirements with AIG and still found that
Global was a little bit cheaper than AIG even with AIG giving me the 10%
discount.
Wayne Edgerton N602WT
From: Larry Rosen <LarryRosen(at)comcast.net>
Subject: Re: Insurance was AFS Systems .... (G900X panel cost /
Stick
Clearance)
Here is the post John was referencing. It is slightly different
than the information
we got earlier where IFR GPS, and moving map and autopilot are
required
for the 10% discount from AIG.
Just got my insurance bill for the renewal and SkySmith included
the AIG
"Technology Advanced Aircraft" discount requirements.
The aircraft must have:
1.) IFR certified GPS, 2.) Moving map, 3.) two axis autopilot,
plus any
two from column B, including:
TAWS, TCAS, Weather monitor (Stormscope, datalink, or radar), a
fuel
totalizer, and RNP capability.
The pilot must have:
1.) Minimum Private/Instrument
2.) Current Instrument Proficiency Check, maintained annually
3.) Air Safety Foundation course completed, selected from 1.)
single
pilot IFR, 2.) Datalink, 3.) Thunderstorms, 4.) IFR GPS, and 5.)
Runway
Safety. These are available free and on-line and take about 30-40
minutes to complete.
Meet these requirements and get a 10% discount from AIG!!
John Cox wrote:
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Wiring NL starter help |
| From: | "Jesse Saint" <jesse(at)saintaviation.com> |
In my experience the master has 3 contacts and the starter has 4. Ground
closes the master and power closes the starter.
Jesse Saint
Saint Aviation, Inc.
jesse(at)saintaviation.com
www.saintaviation.com
352-427-0285
Kelly McMullen wrote:
>
> I tend to think you have the wrong relay. The starter relay is normally
> an intermittentduty model, with 3 terminals as shown in the Skytec
> diagram. Master relays normally have 4 terminals. I note that the
> pictures in the Spruce catalog are also reversed. :-(
>
> Chris and Susie McGough wrote:
>>
>>
>> Guys I am now stuck. I have the NL starter and also wired the plane as
>> per Vans wiring kit which I now know is wrong for this starter. I
>> contacted Vans and they are not interested in helping as not the
>> starter they supply.
>>
>> Can somone have a look at the skytec diagram and give me an idea what
>> wires to change. Ofcourse if you have not used Vans diagram you will
>> not know the difference.
>>
>> Vans starter relay has 4 terminals and Skytec diagram has 3. Also
>> Skytec has 1 wire going to the starter not 2.
>> http://www.skytecair.com/images/NL%2012V%20Installation%20Wiring_1100.jpg
>>
>> Luckily John Jessen pointed this out
>>
>> regards Chris
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Roger Standley" <taildragon(at)msn.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Torque wing bolts |
Got it! Thanks, Guys! Roger=0A ----- Original Message ----- =0A
From: Chris and Susie McGough<mailto:VHMUM(at)bigpond.com> =0A To:
rv10-list(at)matronics.com =0A Sent:
Friday, April 18, 2008 1:56 PM=0A Subject: Re: RV10-List: Torque w
ing bolts=0A=0A=0A Thanks Vern You should have got he email
to Roger regards Chris=0A ----- Original Message ----- =0A
From: Roger Standley<mailto:taildragon(at)msn.com> =0A To: rv10-li
st(at)matronics.com =0A Sent: Satur
day, April 19, 2008 12:52 AM=0A Subject: Re: RV10-List: Torque w
ing bolts=0A=0A=0A Hi Chris,=0A=0A Did you receiv
e a response? I need those torques, too.=0A=0A Roger=0A
----- Original Message ----- =0A From: Chris and Susie McGo
ugh =0A To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com<
mailto:rv10-list(at)matronics.com> =0A Sent: Wednesday, April 16,
2008 9:55 PM=0A Subject: RV10-List: Torque wing bolts=0A
Gough" >=0A=0A
Could someone look up the torque for me for those nas bolts that hold
the =0A wings on? C=============
=======================
==========nbsp; - The RV10-List Email Forum -h
ttp://www.====================
=p; - MATRONICS WEB FORUMS href="http://forums.matronics.com
">http://forums.matronics.==============
=========nbsp; tit
le=http://www.matronics.com/contribution href="http://www.matronic
s.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/contribut=====
=======================
==============0A=0A=0A=0A=0A
=0A=0Ahref="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List">http
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tronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com=0Ahref="http://www.matro
=======================
=======================
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=======================
======================0A_
=======================
=======================
http://www.matronics.com/contribution
=======================
====================0A=0A
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | rv10builder <rv10builder(at)bellsouth.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Wiring NL starter help |
I too have the 149-NL starter (that came with my TMX-540) and it is
wired per Van's Lightweight Starter Circuit with the "I" terminal
connected to the smaller stud (jumper removed). It's working just fine...
Brian Sutherland
Nashville, TN
N104BS
13.5 hours in Phase 1
Chris and Susie McGough wrote:
>
>
> Guys I am now stuck. I have the NL starter and also wired the plane as
> per Vans wiring kit which I now know is wrong for this starter. I
> contacted Vans and they are not interested in helping as not the
> starter they supply.
>
> Can somone have a look at the skytec diagram and give me an idea what
> wires to change. Ofcourse if you have not used Vans diagram you will
> not know the difference.
>
> Vans starter relay has 4 terminals and Skytec diagram has 3. Also
> Skytec has 1 wire going to the starter not 2.
> http://www.skytecair.com/images/NL%2012V%20Installation%20Wiring_1100.jpg
>
> Luckily John Jessen pointed this out
>
> regards Chris
>
>
> .
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Chris" <toaster73(at)embarqmail.com> |
| Subject: | Matco 511.25 nose wheel ? |
For those that switched to the 511.25 nosewheel did you change to a
different tube than what was in the finish kit?
Thanks
Chris Lucas
#40072
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Chris and Susie McGough" <VHMUM(at)bigpond.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Wiring NL starter help |
Thanks Brian if it was not for this list I would had a stuffed starter.
Enjoy your flying.
regards Chris
----- Original Message -----
From: "rv10builder" <rv10builder(at)bellsouth.net>
Sent: Sunday, April 20, 2008 5:13 AM
Subject: Re: RV10-List: Wiring NL starter help
>
> I too have the 149-NL starter (that came with my TMX-540) and it is wired
> per Van's Lightweight Starter Circuit with the "I" terminal connected to
> the smaller stud (jumper removed). It's working just fine...
>
> Brian Sutherland
> Nashville, TN
> N104BS
> 13.5 hours in Phase 1
>
> Chris and Susie McGough wrote:
>>
>>
>> Guys I am now stuck. I have the NL starter and also wired the plane as
>> per Vans wiring kit which I now know is wrong for this starter. I
>> contacted Vans and they are not interested in helping as not the starter
>> they supply.
>>
>> Can somone have a look at the skytec diagram and give me an idea what
>> wires to change. Ofcourse if you have not used Vans diagram you will not
>> know the difference.
>>
>> Vans starter relay has 4 terminals and Skytec diagram has 3. Also Skytec
>> has 1 wire going to the starter not 2.
>> http://www.skytecair.com/images/NL%2012V%20Installation%20Wiring_1100.jpg
>>
>> Luckily John Jessen pointed this out
>>
>> regards Chris
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> .
>>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Wiring NL starter help |
| From: | "Michael Wellenzohn" <rv-10(at)wellenzohn.net> |
I am not sure if I can add help or more confusion here. But I wrote this question
to SkyTec since I wanted to know what to do with my 149 NL Starter which came
with my the TMX IO-540.
Quote:
Michael,
Per that page, "All Sky-Tec NL starters must be wired per diagram "B" below as
there is no active "S" terminal. The small, "S" terminal on the NL model starter
is used to switch the starter from 24V (jumper wire removed) to 12V (jumper
wire installed) operation and cannot be used to activate the starter."
So yes, assuming you are running this thing on 12V, you will need to install the
jumper.
It is confusing.
- Rich
Rich Chiappe
Sky-Tec
800-476-7896
richc(at)skytecair.com
www.skytecair.com
Quoutattion end:
I read here to keep the jumper on!
Do I miss
something?
Michael
--------
RV-10 builder (engine, prop, finishing)
#511
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=177873#177873
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Wiring NL starter help |
| From: | "William Curtis" <wcurtis(at)nerv10.com> |
The diagram he is referring to is here: http://www.skytecair.com/images/NL%
2012V%20Installation%20Wiring_1100.jpg=0A=0AAlso attached. My TMX-IO
540 also came with the NL starter and I wired it per this diagram.=0A
=0AWilliam=0Ahttp://nerv10.com/wcurtis/ =0A=0A-------- Original Me
=0A> =0A> I am not sure if I can add help or m
ore confusion here. But I wrote this question to SkyTec since I wanted to k
now what to do with my 149 NL Starter which came with my the TMX IO-540.
=0A> =0A> Quote:=0A> =0A> =0A> Michael,=0A> =0A> Per that
page, "All Sky-Tec NL starters must be wired per diagram "B" below as ther
e is no active "S" terminal. The small, "S" terminal on the NL model start
er is used to switch the starter from 24V (jumper wire removed) to 12V (jum
per wire installed) operation and cannot be used to activate the starter."
=0A> =0A> So yes, assuming you are running this thing on 12V, you wil
l need to install the jumper.=0A> =0A> It is confusing.=0A> =0A
> - Rich=0A> =0A> Rich Chiappe=0A> Sky-Tec=0A> 800-476-7896
=0A> richc(at)skytecair.com=0A> www.skytecair.com=0A> =0A> =0A> Qu
outattion end:=0A> =0A> =0A> I read here to keep the jumper on!
=0A> =0A> Do I miss=0A> something?=0A> =0A> Michael=0A>
=0A> --------=0A> RV-10 builder (engine, prop, finishing)=0A> #511
=0A> =0A> =0A> =0A> =0A> Read this topic online here:=0A>
=0A> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=177873#177873=0A>
========================
=0A
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Chris and Susie McGough" <VHMUM(at)bigpond.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Wiring NL starter help |
>From Skytec
Sky-Tec repurposed the S-Terminal functionality on NL model starters to
serve as a means of switching the starter between 12V and 24V operation.
Because of this, ALL NL STARTER INSTALLATIONS MUST BE WIRED ACCORDING TO THE
CERTIFIED AIRCRAFT WIRING DIAGRAM BELOW - NO EXCEPTIONS!
http://www.skytecair.com/images/NL%2012V%20Installation%20Wiring_1100.jpg
I noticed on the starter when I put the jumper back it says someting like
jumper for 12 volt operation. So if that jumper is used it becomes a 24 volt
starter. I must have had a coeliac moment when I first removed it.
regards Chris
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Chris and Susie McGough" <VHMUM(at)bigpond.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Wiring NL starter help |
Woops missed a critical word .....
From Skytec
Sky-Tec repurposed the S-Terminal functionality on NL model starters to
serve as a means of switching the starter between 12V and 24V operation.
Because of this, ALL NL STARTER INSTALLATIONS MUST BE WIRED ACCORDING TO
THE
CERTIFIED AIRCRAFT WIRING DIAGRAM BELOW - NO EXCEPTIONS!
http://www.skytecair.com/images/NL%2012V%20Installation%20Wiring_1100.jpg
I noticed on the starter when I put the jumper back it says someting like
jumper for 12 volt operation. So if that jumper is not used it becomes a 24
volt
starter. I must have had a coeliac moment when I first removed it.
regards Chris
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Wiring NL starter help |
| From: | "William Curtis" <wcurtis(at)nerv10.com> |
> I noticed on the starter when I put the jumper back it says someting like
> jumper for 12 volt operation. So if that jumper is used it becomes a 24 volt
> starter. I must have had a coeliac moment when I first removed it.
I think you have it backwards. When the junper is ON, it's a 12 volt starter;
when the jumper is OFF it is a 24 volt starter.
William
http://nerv10.com/wcurtis/
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Wiring NL starter help |
| From: | "William Curtis" <wcurtis(at)nerv10.com> |
>I tend to think you have the wrong relay. The starter relay is normally
>an intermittentduty model, with 3 terminals as shown in the Skytec
>diagram. Master relays normally have 4 terminals. I note that the
>pictures in the Spruce catalog are also reversed
>I too have the 149-NL starter (that came with my TMX-540) and it is
>wired per Van's Lightweight Starter Circuit with the "I" terminal
>connected to the smaller stud (jumper removed). It's working just fine
This is interesting. My starter relay has FOUR terminals and came with a tag that
said "If original has 3 terminals DO NOT use this "I" terminal."
William
http://nerv10.com/wcurtis/
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Chris and Susie McGough" <VHMUM(at)bigpond.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Wiring NL starter help |
Yep I sent another email thanks
Chris
----- Original Message -----
From: "William Curtis" <wcurtis(at)nerv10.com>
Sent: Sunday, April 20, 2008 7:54 AM
Subject: Re: RV10-List: Re: Wiring NL starter help
>
>> I noticed on the starter when I put the jumper back it says someting like
>> jumper for 12 volt operation. So if that jumper is used it becomes a 24
>> volt
>> starter. I must have had a coeliac moment when I first removed it.
>
> I think you have it backwards. When the junper is ON, it's a 12 volt
> starter; when the jumper is OFF it is a 24 volt starter.
>
> William
> http://nerv10.com/wcurtis/
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "RV Builder (Michael Sausen)" <rvbuilder(at)sausen.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Wiring NL starter help |
Think you got the wrong guy attached to the quote below William. That was Brian
Sutherland that said that, not me.
Michael
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of William Curtis
Sent: Saturday, April 19, 2008 5:04 PM
Subject: Re: RV10-List: Re: Wiring NL starter help
>I tend to think you have the wrong relay. The starter relay is normally
>an intermittentduty model, with 3 terminals as shown in the Skytec
>diagram. Master relays normally have 4 terminals. I note that the
>pictures in the Spruce catalog are also reversed
>I too have the 149-NL starter (that came with my TMX-540) and it is
>wired per Van's Lightweight Starter Circuit with the "I" terminal
>connected to the smaller stud (jumper removed). It's working just fine
This is interesting. My starter relay has FOUR terminals and came with a tag that
said "If original has 3 terminals DO NOT use this "I" terminal."
William
http://nerv10.com/wcurtis/
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "RV Builder (Michael Sausen)" <rvbuilder(at)sausen.net> |
| Subject: | Wiring NL starter help |
For now. :)
Michael
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of rv10builder
Sent: Saturday, April 19, 2008 2:14 PM
Subject: Re: RV10-List: Wiring NL starter help
I too have the 149-NL starter (that came with my TMX-540) and it is
wired per Van's Lightweight Starter Circuit with the "I" terminal
connected to the smaller stud (jumper removed). It's working just fine...
Brian Sutherland
Nashville, TN
N104BS
13.5 hours in Phase 1
Chris and Susie McGough wrote:
>
>
> Guys I am now stuck. I have the NL starter and also wired the plane as
> per Vans wiring kit which I now know is wrong for this starter. I
> contacted Vans and they are not interested in helping as not the
> starter they supply.
>
> Can somone have a look at the skytec diagram and give me an idea what
> wires to change. Ofcourse if you have not used Vans diagram you will
> not know the difference.
>
> Vans starter relay has 4 terminals and Skytec diagram has 3. Also
> Skytec has 1 wire going to the starter not 2.
> http://www.skytecair.com/images/NL%2012V%20Installation%20Wiring_1100.jpg
>
> Luckily John Jessen pointed this out
>
> regards Chris
>
>
> .
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "AirMike" <Mikeabel(at)Pacbell.net> |
Alex sells a cooler that he claims has 20% more capacity. I bought it.
I live in NV and it is pretty hot in the summer
--------
OSH '08 or Bust
Q/B Kit - Ready to exit cabin top/door purgatory
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=177907#177907
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Bruce Snyder" <snyderbd888(at)sbcglobal.net> |
| Subject: | FW: 12 "cigarette" receptacle |
Are most of the parts plastic on that power receptacle? Thanks.
Bruce
40353
_____
From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of
Dawson-Townsend,Timothy
Sent: Friday, April 18, 2008 9:59 AM
Subject: RV10-List: FW: 12 "cigarette" receptacle
Check this out. I didn't really like the bulky cigarette-type power
receptacles from Spruce or elsewhere (commonly with a flange on both sides
for screw mounting), so I went to the aviation department at West Marine and
found this one by Marinco. As you can see, it mounts with a screw-on ring
in the back, so you've only got the diameter of the receptacle itself
showing in front. There is an optional front flange if you want to use it.
It also has a nice-sealing cap, being a marine product . . .
I think it was $17.99 at my local West Marine. You landlubbers will have to
go on their web site, if interested.
TDT
40025
Wings going on soon!
From: Dawson-Townsend [mailto:yooper(at)alum.mit.edu]
Sent: Friday, April 18, 2008 1:35 AM
Subject: P1000230.JPG
P1000230.JPG
--
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Howard Crawford <crawfordh22(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | RV-10 for sale! My loss your gain! |
RV10 kit # 40017 is for sale because of circumstances beyond my control. Th
is aircraft is on gear and is in the finishing stage. Engine and prop are i
nstalled, canopy, cowl, doors & window fit is beautiful. The engine is a 12
00 hour total time IO 540 engine with a fresh overall. Prop is a new Hartze
ll blended airfoil. Purchase for the price of the kits, engine, prop and bu
ilding materials. Please contact me off line at crawfordh22(at)hotmail.com Tha
nks! Would consider the right RV trade!
_________________________________________________________________
Pack up or back up'use SkyDrive to transfer files or keep extra copies. L
earn how.
http://www.windowslive.com/skydrive/overview.html?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_Refre
sh_skydrive_packup_042008
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Les Kearney <kearney(at)shaw.ca> |
| Subject: | Fuel Line Quick Disconnects |
Hi
As I look at the tunnel in my -10, I am contemplating how I will be able to
*easily* access the fuel pumps / filters that after the panel is installed.
Keeping in mind John Cox's admonition to think about maintenance access when
building, I have wondered about the use of quick disconnects on the fuel
lines so the fuel pumps / filters can be easily removed / installed. I can't
image how I would be able to connect these things in the future.
I see that A/C Spruce sells experimental quick disconnects and that there
are several racing sites that have what appear to be even higher quality
units.
Has anyone used these in their a/c? Are there any reasons why they should
not be used?
Inquiring minds need to know
Les Kearney
#40643
C-GCWZ (reserved)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Sheldon Olesen <saolesen(at)sirentel.net> |
| Subject: | Temporary door seal install |
Does anyone know a method of temporarily installing the door seal?
I've tried carpet tape and it won't stick to the seal material. I
wanted to final fit the doors with the seal in place so there
wouldn't be any surprises after painting.
Sheldon Olesen
40080
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Wiring NL starter help |
| From: | "William Curtis" <wcurtis(at)nerv10.com> |
Sorry about that. Getting confused as to who is saying what.
William
http://nerv10.com/wcurtis/
-------- Original Message --------
> X-Rcpt-To:
>
>
> Think you got the wrong guy attached to the quote below William. That was Brian
Sutherland that said that, not me.
>
> Michael
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of William Curtis
> Sent: Saturday, April 19, 2008 5:04 PM
> To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com
> Subject: Re: RV10-List: Re: Wiring NL starter help
>
>
> >I tend to think you have the wrong relay. The starter relay is normally
> >an intermittentduty model, with 3 terminals as shown in the Skytec
> >diagram. Master relays normally have 4 terminals. I note that the
> >pictures in the Spruce catalog are also reversed
>
> >I too have the 149-NL starter (that came with my TMX-540) and it is
> >wired per Van's Lightweight Starter Circuit with the "I" terminal
> >connected to the smaller stud (jumper removed). It's working just fine
>
> This is interesting. My starter relay has FOUR terminals and came with a tag
that said "If original has 3 terminals DO NOT use this "I" terminal."
>
> William
> http://nerv10.com/wcurtis/
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Dave Saylor" <Dave(at)aircraftersllc.com> |
| Subject: | Fuel Line Quick Disconnects |
Les,
It's really not that bad a job. The hardest part is getting the tunnel
cover off. You might consider leaving a few of the screws out towards the
front. That and an electric screwdriver will have the filter serviced in a
few minutes. The stock design is simple and light.
Dave Saylor
AirCrafters LLC
140 Aviation Way
Watsonville, CA
831-722-9141
831-750-0284 CL
www.AirCraftersLLC.com
_____
From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Les Kearney
Sent: Saturday, April 19, 2008 7:20 PM
Subject: RV10-List: Fuel Line Quick Disconnects
Hi
As I look at the tunnel in my -10, I am contemplating how I will be able to
*easily* access the fuel pumps / filters that after the panel is installed.
Keeping in mind John Cox's admonition to think about maintenance access when
building, I have wondered about the use of quick disconnects on the fuel
lines so the fuel pumps / filters can be easily removed / installed. I can't
image how I would be able to connect these things in the future.
I see that A/C Spruce sells experimental quick disconnects and that there
are several racing sites that have what appear to be even higher quality
units.
Has anyone used these in their a/c? Are there any reasons why they should
not be used?
Inquiring minds need to know
Les Kearney
#40643
C-GCWZ (reserved)
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: RV-10 for sale! My loss your gain! |
| From: | "2eyedocs" <2eyedocs(at)tx.rr.com> |
Bad email! [Exclamation]
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=177933#177933
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | LES KEARNEY <Kearney(at)shaw.ca> |
| Subject: | Re: Fuel Line Quick Disconnects |
Hi Dave
My setup is a bit different. I am installing an Eggenfellner E6Ti (3.6l) engine.
My fuel pumps and filters are a different from the stock vans equipment.
Looking at the tunnel, they will be a pain to service. I am not as flexible as
I once was....
Cheers
Les
----- Original Message -----
From: Dave Saylor <Dave(at)aircraftersllc.com>
Date: Saturday, April 19, 2008 9:25 pm
Subject: RE: RV10-List: Fuel Line Quick Disconnects
> Les,
>
> It's really not that bad a job. The hardest part is
> getting the tunnel
> cover off. You might consider leaving a few of the screws
> out towards the
> front. That and an electric screwdriver will have the
> filter serviced in a
> few minutes. The stock design is simple and light.
>
> Dave Saylor
> AirCrafters LLC
> 140 Aviation Way
> Watsonville, CA
> 831-722-9141
> 831-750-0284 CL
> www.AirCraftersLLC.com
>
> _____
>
> From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Les Kearney
> Sent: Saturday, April 19, 2008 7:20 PM
> To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com
> Subject: RV10-List: Fuel Line Quick Disconnects
>
>
>
> Hi
>
>
>
> As I look at the tunnel in my -10, I am contemplating how I will
> be able to
> *easily* access the fuel pumps / filters that after the panel is
> installed.Keeping in mind John Cox's admonition to think about
> maintenance access when
> building, I have wondered about the use of quick disconnects on
> the fuel
> lines so the fuel pumps / filters can be easily removed /
> installed. I can't
> image how I would be able to connect these things in the future.
>
>
>
> I see that A/C Spruce sells experimental quick disconnects and
> that there
> are several racing sites that have what appear to be even higher
> qualityunits.
>
>
>
> Has anyone used these in their a/c? Are there any reasons why
> they should
> not be used?
>
>
>
> Inquiring minds need to know
>
>
>
> Les Kearney
>
> #40643
>
> C-GCWZ (reserved)
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Matco 511.25 nose wheel ? |
| From: | "bcondrey" <bob.condrey(at)baesystems.com> |
Original tube works fine.
Bob #40105
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=177934#177934
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | John Gonzalez <indigoonlatigo(at)msn.com> |
| Subject: | Doors and the C-1010 Cabin Pin Blocks. |
Wow, atleast 9 hours today again mounting doors, drilling out the cabin fra
me openings and the cabin pin blocks and fabricating the pins from the 5/16
-24 bolts. I noticed that my C-1010 cabin pin blocks were slightly wider o
ut of the box than they should have been by about 1/16 of an inch. Regardle
ss of the fact that I did not trim them down to the correct width, I do not
believe that the door edge bevel would fit over the block without reshapin
g the door drastically...the block is quite thick, wide and the door flange
s are thick, inner and outer door shells. The blocks just happen to be flus
h with the outside edge of the fuse, which made me realize that with the bl
ocks in this configuration, the pins cannot come in contact with the painte
d sides of the fuse. I remember that a lot of folks are complaining of chip
ping of the paint in this area. Of course if I opt to not trim the block's
width, then I need to pocket out the edge of the door to allow the pin bloc
k to fit into the door edge.
If I opt to trim the width of the cabin pin block then there will be less t
hickness between the pin hole and the out side of the block. My pin absolut
ely go thru the entire block, the fiberglass cabin top and into the aluminu
m fuselage members, fore and aft. It seems that the pin block are only supp
osed to serve as a guide and a method of pulling the door in with the pin h
ole having that 3.4 degree angle in it. Of course if the pin block is reduc
ed in it's width, the door pin will hit the fuselage paint, provided the do
or handles are not in the 135 degree maximum open position.
What have people been doing with this? This sections direction are pretty v
ague considering this is such a critical area...misshaps and all.
John G.
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Fuel Line Quick Disconnects |
| From: | "John Cox" <johnwcox(at)pacificnw.com> |
Besides the quality build and great archival photos, Scott Schmidt was
one of the first to consider removal for serving of fuel parts - using a
side access panel. His solution was simple and a quick look at Deems
site shows a similar build which values servicing ease considerations.
The eyes of a manufacturer are often from a different perspective than
the maintenance technician who follows into perpetuity after the DAR
signoff. The later often using the name of the first (frequently and
with color)for failing to take into consideration maintenance access
during the build. When it is yourself, it often follows with a whap to
the forehead and something that sounds like "I could have had a V-8".
(vegetable juice that is)
The easiest and most glaring item seen in tech inspections is the large
number of builders who do not double back safety wire and learn the
consequence on penetration of their fingers or arms to service something
- down the road. Boeing has been an example of design which values
service in the field.
John C
________________________________
From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com on behalf of LES KEARNEY
Sent: Sat 4/19/2008 9:17 PM
Subject: Re: RE: RV10-List: Fuel Line Quick Disconnects
Hi Dave
My setup is a bit different. I am installing an Eggenfellner E6Ti (3.6l)
engine. My fuel pumps and filters are a different from the stock vans
equipment.
Looking at the tunnel, they will be a pain to service. I am not as
flexible as I once was....
Cheers
Les
----- Original Message -----
From: Dave Saylor <Dave(at)aircraftersllc.com>
Date: Saturday, April 19, 2008 9:25 pm
Subject: RE: RV10-List: Fuel Line Quick Disconnects
> Les,
>
> It's really not that bad a job. The hardest part is
> getting the tunnel
> cover off. You might consider leaving a few of the screws
> out towards the
> front. That and an electric screwdriver will have the
> filter serviced in a
> few minutes. The stock design is simple and light.
>
> Dave Saylor
> AirCrafters LLC
> 140 Aviation Way
> Watsonville, CA
> 831-722-9141
> 831-750-0284 CL
> www.AirCraftersLLC.com
>
> _____
>
> From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Les Kearney
> Sent: Saturday, April 19, 2008 7:20 PM
> To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com
> Subject: RV10-List: Fuel Line Quick Disconnects
>
>
>
> Hi
>
>
>
> As I look at the tunnel in my -10, I am contemplating how I will
> be able to
> *easily* access the fuel pumps / filters that after the panel is
> installed.Keeping in mind John Cox's admonition to think about
> maintenance access when
> building, I have wondered about the use of quick disconnects on
> the fuel
> lines so the fuel pumps / filters can be easily removed /
> installed. I can't
> image how I would be able to connect these things in the future.
>
>
>
> I see that A/C Spruce sells experimental quick disconnects and
> that there
> are several racing sites that have what appear to be even higher
> qualityunits.
>
>
>
> Has anyone used these in their a/c? Are there any reasons why
> they should
> not be used?
>
>
>
> Inquiring minds need to know
>
>
>
> Les Kearney
>
> #40643
>
> C-GCWZ (reserved)
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________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: PIREP: Electric Rudder Trim - Do I really need it? |
| From: | "AirMike" <Mikeabel(at)Pacbell.net> |
Scott - very nice - I like your KISS approach. Is there any way you could post
a picture of placement. Also where did you get the tabs or how did you fabricate
and locate them?
--------
OSH '08 or Bust
Q/B Kit - Ready to exit cabin top/door purgatory
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=177943#177943
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | rv10builder <rv10builder(at)bellsouth.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Wiring NL starter help |
And I should have probably added the statement: Prior to flying Sunday
I'll be pulling the cowl and disconnecting the "I" lead and
re-installing the jumper. The reason I haven't had a problem is that
12V is still being supplied to the 12/24V stud via the "I" lead rather
than the jumper. I may be wrong but my guess is that Van's diagram for
the LS provided a safeguard against a stuck starter relay in that the
starter also must see 12V via the S/I leads coming from the starter
switch. Obviously this is problem for the NL as a stuck relay would put
the starter in 24V mode and likely result in damage.
Brian Sutherland
Nashville, TN
N104BS
13.5 hours in Phase 1
rv10builder wrote:
>
> I too have the 149-NL starter (that came with my TMX-540) and it is
> wired per Van's Lightweight Starter Circuit with the "I" terminal
> connected to the smaller stud (jumper removed). It's working just
> fine...
>
> Brian Sutherland
> Nashville, TN
> N104BS
> 13.5 hours in Phase 1
>
> Chris and Susie McGough wrote:
>>
>>
>> Guys I am now stuck. I have the NL starter and also wired the plane
>> as per Vans wiring kit which I now know is wrong for this starter. I
>> contacted Vans and they are not interested in helping as not the
>> starter they supply.
>>
>> Can somone have a look at the skytec diagram and give me an idea what
>> wires to change. Ofcourse if you have not used Vans diagram you will
>> not know the difference.
>>
>> Vans starter relay has 4 terminals and Skytec diagram has 3. Also
>> Skytec has 1 wire going to the starter not 2.
>> http://www.skytecair.com/images/NL%2012V%20Installation%20Wiring_1100.jpg
>>
>>
>> Luckily John Jessen pointed this out
>>
>> regards Chris
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> .
>>
>
>
> .
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: RV-10 for sale! My loss your gain! |
| From: | "Scott Keadle" <Scott(at)Keadle.com> |
I'm a little new around here, but I think I missed a joke or something...
2eyedocs wrote:
> Bad email! [Exclamation]
--------
Scott Keadle
14A, Lake Norman Airpark
N426AK RV-10, final assembly
N246SK, Giles 202, flying
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=177974#177974
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Bob Leffler" <rv(at)thelefflers.com> |
I've just finished match drilling the wing skins and am getting ready to
start deburring, dimpling, and priming.
I'm curious as to how others handled match drilling, deburring, and dimpling
the bottom side of the wing ribs and rear spar.
While it's easier to do now before riveting the top skin the wing ribs, I
suspect it's probably better to wait until the bottom skins are attached for
a more perfect fit. My thoughts are that I will probably have to touch up
the priming after final match drilling and dimpling.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Pascal" <rv10builder(at)verizon.net> |
| Subject: | Re: WIng Question |
I primed everything as I went, aka, all the ribs are primed than I
followed through the steps Van's has in each section except I did NOT
rivet the bottom skins on..
So I did match drill and dimple all holes and the bottom is ready to be
riveted, I moved on to the next section and will rivet the bottom later.
As far the primer being removed, after I deburred each hole using a
brush did touchup on the bottom ribs, the bottom skins were primed after
all dimpling and deburring.
Pascal
----- Original Message -----
From: Bob Leffler
To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com
Sent: Sunday, April 20, 2008 8:04 AM
Subject: RV10-List: WIng Question
I've just finished match drilling the wing skins and am getting ready
to start deburring, dimpling, and priming.
I'm curious as to how others handled match drilling, deburring, and
dimpling the bottom side of the wing ribs and rear spar.
While it's easier to do now before riveting the top skin the wing
ribs, I suspect it's probably better to wait until the bottom skins are
attached for a more perfect fit. My thoughts are that I will probably
have to touch up the priming after final match drilling and dimpling.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "John Testement" <jwt(at)roadmapscoaching.com> |
| Subject: | Temporary door seal install |
I used 3M Weatherstrip Adhesive to temporarily glue the seals then used the
Brown Aircraft Supply contact cement for the final. This worked with their
seal - I have now tried this with Vans original seal.
John Testement
jwt(at)roadmapscoaching.com
40321
Richmond, VA
Painting
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Sheldon Olesen
Sent: Saturday, April 19, 2008 10:44 PM
Subject: RV10-List: Temporary door seal install
Does anyone know a method of temporarily installing the door seal?
I've tried carpet tape and it won't stick to the seal material. I wanted to
final fit the doors with the seal in place so there wouldn't be any
surprises after painting.
Sheldon Olesen
40080
Checked by AVG.
5:24 PM
Checked by AVG.
11:31 AM
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "David McNeill" <dlm46007(at)cox.net> |
| Subject: | Pictures of the door pins after fabricating longer pins. |
To ensure a complete circumference of the pin in the door jamb we lengthened
the pins about .25-.40 inch and shortened the bevel length . That is we made
the angle steeper.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Rick Sked <ricksked(at)embarqmail.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Recommendations for front air vents |
Thane,
I am doing the same thing but what did you use to attach the vents to the inlet?
I haven't installed them permanently yet but I was going to just use a 2" pipe
clamp.
Rick Sked
40185
----- Original Message -----
From: "Thane States" <thane2(at)comporium.net>
Sent: Friday, April 18, 2008 6:38:48 PM (GMT-0800) America/Los_Angeles
Subject: Re: RV10-List: Recommendations for front air vents
Here are a few pics of my eyeball vent install as promised. Hope these are
OK.
Thane
----- Original Message -----
From: "Thane States" <thane2(at)comporium.net>
Sent: Thursday, April 17, 2008 9:18 PM
Subject: Re: RV10-List: Recommendations for front air vents
>
> Sorry the wife has camera. I will post some pics tomorrow.
> Thane
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "linn Walters" <pitts_pilot(at)bellsouth.net>
> To:
> Sent: Thursday, April 17, 2008 7:12 PM
> Subject: Re: RV10-List: Recommendations for front air vents
>
>
>>
>> Thane States wrote:
>>
>>
>> snip
>>
>>> Let me know if you have questions. I also have a pic of the end
>>> product, looks real clean, is easy to remove, and eliminates the ugly
>>> white flange, and requires no hardware or glue.
>>
>> So, where's the picture??? Holding out for cash offers??? :-)
>> Linn
>>
>>>
>>> Thane
>>> 803-396-8865
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Thane States" <thane2(at)comporium.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Recommendations for front air vents |
Rick, the coupling I used had the hose clamps already on each end, so I just
used them. It holds very tight and you can barely see the clamp once it is
installed.
Good luck, I am very pleased with the final look and function.
Thane
----- Original Message -----
From: "Rick Sked" <ricksked(at)embarqmail.com>
Sent: Sunday, April 20, 2008 5:47 PM
Subject: Re: RV10-List: Recommendations for front air vents
>
> Thane,
>
> I am doing the same thing but what did you use to attach the vents to the
> inlet? I haven't installed them permanently yet but I was going to just
> use a 2" pipe clamp.
>
> Rick Sked
> 40185
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Thane States" <thane2(at)comporium.net>
> To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com
> Sent: Friday, April 18, 2008 6:38:48 PM (GMT-0800) America/Los_Angeles
> Subject: Re: RV10-List: Recommendations for front air vents
>
> Here are a few pics of my eyeball vent install as promised. Hope these
> are
> OK.
> Thane
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Thane States" <thane2(at)comporium.net>
> To:
> Sent: Thursday, April 17, 2008 9:18 PM
> Subject: Re: RV10-List: Recommendations for front air vents
>
>
>>
>> Sorry the wife has camera. I will post some pics tomorrow.
>> Thane
>>
>>
>> ----- Original Message -----
>> From: "linn Walters" <pitts_pilot(at)bellsouth.net>
>> To:
>> Sent: Thursday, April 17, 2008 7:12 PM
>> Subject: Re: RV10-List: Recommendations for front air vents
>>
>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Thane States wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>> snip
>>>
>>>> Let me know if you have questions. I also have a pic of the end
>>>> product, looks real clean, is easy to remove, and eliminates the ugly
>>>> white flange, and requires no hardware or glue.
>>>
>>> So, where's the picture??? Holding out for cash offers??? :-)
>>> Linn
>>>
>>>>
>>>> Thane
>>>> 803-396-8865
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Scott Schmidt <scottmschmidt(at)yahoo.com> |
| Subject: | Re: PIREP: Electric Rudder Trim - Do I really need it? |
Here is a shot of the two rudder trim pieces that can be bought at Avery Tools.
The bottom one is a little harder to see because the paint matches.
I will now send out the top one to be painted.
I attach them with silicon rubber.
Scott Schmidt
scottmschmidt(at)yahoo.com
----- Original Message ----
From: AirMike <Mikeabel(at)Pacbell.net>
Sent: Sunday, April 20, 2008 12:26:43 AM
Subject: RV10-List: Re: PIREP: Electric Rudder Trim - Do I really need it?
Scott - very nice - I like your KISS approach. Is there any way you could post
a picture of placement. Also where did you get the tabs or how did you fabricate
and locate them?
--------
OSH '08 or Bust
Q/B Kit - Ready to exit cabin top/door purgatory
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=177943#177943
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Stick hits panel solution |
| From: | "Robin Marks" <robin1(at)mrmoisture.com> |
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________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Scott Schmidt <scottmschmidt(at)yahoo.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Stick hits panel solution |
I had the same stick interference with my panel from Lancair. The Infinity grips
are much taller and cause this problem.
I have posted this in the past but thought I would post again. I decided to cut
my stick near the top of the curve. I then purchased the exact same steel and
wall thickness only it was a larger diameter so it would slide over the stock
stick. I can't remember the type of steel, I just called Van's and they knew
exactly what it was.
Luckily one of the helicopter maintenance companies here at my airport has a certified
tig welder and he charged me $40 to weld up both sticks. He did an amazing
job.
I don't even notice that the stick is slightly angled but now it is clear of everything.
I don't think anyone should mess with the controls and limit them even though full
down will probably never be used.
My fix took a couple hours once I had the right steel tubing.
I then had Flighline Interiors make me some real nice leather covers for the sticks.
Scott Schmidt
scottmschmidt(at)yahoo.com
----- Original Message ----
From: Robin Marks <robin1(at)mrmoisture.com>
Sent: Monday, April 21, 2008 6:54:10 PM
Subject: RV10-List: Stick hits panel solution
Someone recently asked me how I resolved our Infinity
grip mounted stick hitting the lower panel. My answer was I will know in two
weeks. Well folks, finally something done ahead of schedule...
The grips do hit the lower panel as we
suspected. The sticks need to travel about 1/8" further than the panel
allows. Additionally we would want some extra clearance for comfort. After
spending some time accessing the situation we figured there were a couple of
options at this point in the build.
Option 1 modify the down travel on the
elevator stop. From what we measured our current down travel is 25 degrees. To
get the full set back needed we would have to take the travel down to ~19
degrees. This was less than 0.75 inches of travel on the Horizontal Stab and would
have solved all the stick clearance issues. That being said Van specific a
minimum of 20 degrees and as we are not re-engineering the aeronautical portion
of this aircraft that modification was a no go even though I hope to never need
full forward deflection.
Option 2 turns out to be a simple fix. We
pulled the stick out of the fuse and placed it in a hydraulic press to bend the
curved section of the stick. There was very little bending required to provide
the clearances needed and nothing aeronautical was modified. The change is unnoticeable
from the pilots/co-pilot seated position.
Option 3 is to plan ahead like Deems did and
modify the stick BEFORE it is powder coated, grip fitted and wires run.
Fortunately our adjustment did not put a single scratch on the stick and the
entire correction took less than 90 minutes including making the wood jig to
bend the sticks. (All times exclude head scratching)
Robin
RV-4 Sold
RV-6A 400 Hours
RV-10 Sooner or Later, Probably Later
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Rene Felker" <rene(at)felker.com> |
| Subject: | Stick hits panel solution |
Based on Scotts recommendation I did the same thing, except I used a smaller
OD, thicker wall piece of stock and put it inside the tube and welded it.
It is nice to have friends on the field that can weld....
Rene' Felker
RV-10 N423CF Flying
801-721-6080
From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Scott Schmidt
Sent: Tuesday, April 22, 2008 9:05 AM
Subject: Re: RV10-List: Stick hits panel solution
I had the same stick interference with my panel from Lancair. The Infinity
grips are much taller and cause this problem.
I have posted this in the past but thought I would post again. I decided to
cut my stick near the top of the curve. I then purchased the exact same
steel and wall thickness only it was a larger diameter so it would slide
over the stock stick. I can't remember the type of steel, I just called
Van's and they knew exactly what it was.
Luckily one of the helicopter maintenance companies here at my airport has a
certified tig welder and he charged me $40 to weld up both sticks. He did
an amazing job.
I don't even notice that the stick is slightly angled but now it is clear of
everything.
I don't think anyone should mess with the controls and limit them even
though full down will probably never be used.
My fix took a couple hours once I had the right steel tubing.
I then had Flighline Interiors make me some real nice leather covers for the
sticks.
Scott Schmidt
scottmschmidt(at)yahoo.com
----- Original Message ----
From: Robin Marks <robin1(at)mrmoisture.com>
Sent: Monday, April 21, 2008 6:54:10 PM
Subject: RV10-List: Stick hits panel solution
Someone recently asked me how I resolved our Infinity grip mounted stick
hitting the lower panel. My answer was I will know in two weeks. Well folks,
finally something done ahead of schedule...
The grips do hit the lower panel as we suspected. The sticks
need to travel about 1/8" further than the panel allows. Additionally we
would want some extra clearance for comfort. After spending some time
accessing the situation we figured there were a couple of options at this
point in the build.
Option 1 modify the down travel on the elevator stop. From what
we measured our current down travel is 25 degrees. To get the full set back
needed we would have to take the travel down to ~19 degrees. This was less
than 0.75 inches of travel on the Horizontal Stab and would have solved all
the stick clearance issues. That being said Van specific a minimum of 20
degrees and as we are not re-engineering the aeronautical portion of this
aircraft that modification was a no go even though I hope to never need full
forward deflection.
Option 2 turns out to be a simple fix. We pulled the stick out
of the fuse and placed it in a hydraulic press to bend the curved section of
the stick. There was very little bending required to provide the clearances
needed and nothing aeronautical was modified. The change is unnoticeable
from the pilots/co-pilot seated position.
Option 3 is to plan ahead like Deems did and modify the stick
BEFORE it is powder coated, grip fitted and wires run. Fortunately our
adjustment did not put a single scratch on the stick and the entire
correction took less than 90 minutes including making the wood jig to bend
the sticks. (All times exclude head scratching)
Robin
RV-4 Sold
RV-6A 400 Hours
RV-10 Sooner or Later, Probably Later
Stick Jig.jpgStick Clearance.jpg
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | John Gonzalez <indigoonlatigo(at)msn.com> |
| Subject: | Perhaps a better fitting door when latched. |
In my previous post, I described the point of my build where I was question
ing what to do with the plastic door blocks that are screwed to the fuse, t
he ones that the pins go through, as mine where flush with the fuse sides.
Even though these acted as a door pin stops which would prevent the pins fr
om chipping the paint in the event the pins were not completely retracted,
when the door is being closed, I opted to trim them back instead of pocketi
ng out the door edge. Now they act as door stops and are trimmed back from
the fuse edge, the thickness of the door material.
After the door was able to go back into its position that I had spend so m
any hours fitting, I engaged the pins to full position and noted that both
door did not fit the same way as when the pins were not engaged. After much
analysing...here is my idea as to why.
I spend so much effort and time making sure that that I marked where the pi
ns hit the canopy opening, I was very careful to make sure I dilled my hole
s for the pins correctly, straight and true. I even went as far as to drill
each hole with a small bit and incrementally step up bit sizes and I did i
t from the front as well as from the back. I used a straght edge as a guide
to remain parallel to the side and in a fore/aft dimension.
The problem is that the cabin sill, fiberglass canopy top and the metal fus
elage member are almost 1/4 inch thick and one needs to drill that pin hole
so that it is perfectly parallel, in all dimensions to the door pin, becau
se if the hole isn't true, the back half of the hole will cause the door to
ride up on that pin and cause the door to fit differently when the pins ar
e engaged.
Another way to do this or to fix it is to do the following:
Drill the holes as suggested in the manual, if the problem does occur, remo
ve the plastic guiding blocks, the ones that remain attached to the cabin s
ide, then enlarge the hole slighly with a dremel sanding drum on the offend
ing side of the hole( the side of the hole which engages too much) and re-c
heck that the pins go into the hole without any interference while the door
is jigged and clamped in its perfect position.
Fabricate out of 1" X 2.5" X 1/8" aluminum a new hole. Drill to 7/16". Have
the door closed in its' perfectly positioned place and close the pins to t
heir maximum extension and place the new plate over the pin and glue it ont
o the metal channel which makes up the fuselage side. (NOTE: I ALSO FABRICA
TED NEW FORWARD PINS TO A LITTLE LONGER, ABOUT 3/16" LONGER AND CUT THE BEV
EL LESS STEEP, SO INSTEAD OF 60 DEGREES, I DID 50 DEGREES OF BEVEL,( this s
evers to have the entire pin tube held by the hole. Because the bevel is fa
cing up and out, the unbevelled portion of the tube was just barely all the
way through the aluminum fuse member.) Note#2 there seems to be enough dis
tance between the pin while they are in their maximum open position and the
plastic guide block on the fuse side to allow the pins to be made longer.
Back to the new plate. Once glue is set, re drill the AN3 screw holes that
are used to attach the plastic guide block and place longer screws to go al
l the thru the plastic block, thru the fiberglass, through the metal fuse s
ide and through the new plate. One will most likely need to make new plasti
c guide blocks because the position of the hole is in a slightly different
positon in relation to the screw holes. The enlarged hole in the fiberglass
can be fixed by resin and cotton flox and the pin vasolined and placed in
the closed position while curing. This should be done while the new plastic
blocks are in place to minimize sanding.
If this is done, all of this should be done, first by carefully checking wh
ich pin hole is the offending one or whether it is both, by trying all comb
inations of one plastic blocks on the other off, etc.
Side Note: Remember, there should be four holes placed in the door handle g
ear pocket sides to allow the full 135 degrees of handle movement. The mech
anism needs to be centerred, and the toothed arms need to be at their maxim
um closed positon against the blind rivet when the handle is in its' closed
positon. The pins need to extend all the way into the metal fuse member. W
ith all this done, I see no way how one could not realize the door is ajar
and the pins are absolutely long enough that they cannot pull out.
John Gonzalez
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Scott Schmidt <scottmschmidt(at)yahoo.com> |
| Subject: | RV-10 Dash Cover |
I get a few e-mails every month about my dash cover.
It was custom made here in Salt Lake by a local hot rod shop and they did a great
job. I sent it out to Abby at Flightline Interiors to be copied.
Today I e-mailed her and she informed me that she is selling them but has not had
time to update her website.
I have attached a couple of photos that I have (not very good ones) of my cover.
If you are interested please contact Flightline Interiors.
http://www.flightlineinteriors.com/
If anyone has one from Abby please post a picture.
Scott Schmidt
scottmschmidt(at)yahoo.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "David McNeill" <dlm46007(at)cox.net> |
The preliminary NTSB report is availaable.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "David McNeill" <dlm46007(at)cox.net> |
If you want to see graphically the track, check www.flightware.com and zoom
in on the end of the track by resizing your browser to 200%.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "orchidman" <gary(at)wingscc.com> |
I believe the link to the track is www.flightaware.com and Tim's link is also broken. Guess we have fat fingers today [Laughing]
--------
Gary Blankenbiller
RV10 - # 40674
Fuselage SB
(N410GB reserved)
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=178718#178718
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Lew Gallagher" <lewgall(at)charter.net> |
Thanks Tim, I never would have found it ... now I'm not sure I'm glad I did. I
still love building, but my curiosity about flying is waning. Hopefully I'm
just temporarily discouraged. What a loss.
Here's Tim's unbroken link:
http://www.ntsb.gov:80/ntsb/brief.asp?ev_id 080422X00528&key=1
Here's the address of the flight (you may have to copy and paste it):
http://flightaware.com/live/flight_track_bigmap.rvt?ident=N210HM;airports=M54+KEUF;key d4df5c6845e46bcf7468a922905557f369ebd5;keytime=1208981350;height=340;width=400;departuretime=1207580400;arrivaltime=1207585140
Later, -Lew
--------
non-pilot
crazy about building
NOW OFICIALLY BUILDER #40549
doors almost finished, pants on, WHEW!
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=178741#178741
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Andy Turner" <aturner(at)clarion.edu> |
http://www.ntsb.gov/ntsb/brief.asp?ev_id 080422X00528&key=1
--------
Andy Turner
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=178739#178739
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Pascal" <rv10builder(at)verizon.net> |
Lew;
We all miss our fellow builders who have perished in the last year. I would
encourage you to read some of Tim's great articles on what he has done for
his family in the plane these last couple of years
http://www.myrv10.com/N104CD/index.html and remember people die every day;
some doing what they enjoy, some while waiting for that day they would do
something they wanted to do and some completely unexpectedly taking out the
garbage they hated doing.. I too will go one day, I know where I'm going and
I'm pretty excited about it, but in the meantime I want to do what I always
wanted (build a plane) and if I die on my maiden flight, I'll be really
bummed but I did it doing something I was excited about.. the few we have
lost this last year perished doing what they loved..
I encourage you to think of all those trips to meet many of us at fly-in's,
in Oregon for Van's open house, etc.. there is so much to get excited about
with flying..
Pascal
--------------------------------------------------
From: "Lew Gallagher" <lewgall(at)charter.net>
Sent: Wednesday, April 23, 2008 1:25 PM
Subject: RV10-List: Re: 210HM
>
> Thanks Tim, I never would have found it ... now I'm not sure I'm glad I
> did. I still love building, but my curiosity about flying is waning.
> Hopefully I'm just temporarily discouraged. What a loss.
>
> Here's Tim's unbroken link:
>
> http://www.ntsb.gov:80/ntsb/brief.asp?ev_id 080422X00528&key=1
>
> Here's the address of the flight (you may have to copy and paste it):
>
> http://flightaware.com/live/flight_track_bigmap.rvt?ident=N210HM;airports=M54+KEUF;key d4df5c6845e46bcf7468a922905557f369ebd5;keytime=1208981350;height=340;width=400;departuretime=1207580400;arrivaltime=1207585140
>
> Later, -Lew
>
> --------
> non-pilot
> crazy about building
> NOW OFICIALLY BUILDER #40549
> doors almost finished, pants on, WHEW!
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=178741#178741
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Marcus Cooper" <coop85(at)cableone.net> |
Lew,
I'd like to add to Pascal's encouragement to you. I've been blessed with
the opportunity to fly a lot of airplanes, mostly fighters, and find the
RV-10 and general aviation flying to be some of the greatest experiences of
my life. This tragedy is certainly sad and disheartening, and for me
compounded by the loss of two more brethren here at Columbus AFB today, but
I wouldn't trade flying for anything in the world. The opportunities the
RV-10 has afforded my family are irreplaceable and I wouldn't be able to
spend the time with my daughters who are off in college anywhere close to
what I can now. The joy of flight, and in particular going places that the
RV-10 provide, are absolutely amazing. The losses of friends and fellow
aviators is devastating but I pray will not be more than a bump in the road
for your progress to personal success but will be lessons learned as to how
you train and act as a pilot.
Marcus
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Lew Gallagher
Sent: Wednesday, April 23, 2008 3:25 PM
Subject: RV10-List: Re: 210HM
Thanks Tim, I never would have found it ... now I'm not sure I'm glad I did.
I still love building, but my curiosity about flying is waning. Hopefully
I'm just temporarily discouraged. What a loss.
Here's Tim's unbroken link:
http://www.ntsb.gov:80/ntsb/brief.asp?ev_id 080422X00528&key=1
Here's the address of the flight (you may have to copy and paste it):
http://flightaware.com/live/flight_track_bigmap.rvt?ident=N210HM;airports=M5
4+KEUF;key d4df5c6845e46bcf7468a922905557f369ebd5;keytime=1208981350;heigh
t=340;width=400;departuretime=1207580400;arrivaltime=1207585140
Later, -Lew
--------
non-pilot
crazy about building
NOW OFICIALLY BUILDER #40549
doors almost finished, pants on, WHEW!
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=178741#178741
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Perry, Phil" <Phil.Perry(at)netapp.com> |
I know the feeling, Lew.
Every time we lose someone close to the aviation family, I seem to pull
away from aviation too. About the only thing I've found that can get me
over it is to put the headset on and go for a flight. It recaptures my
imagination and once I've landed the plane, I realize I still know how
to fly safely.
Staying in the air has been important to my comfort level in flying. If
I go more than a couple of weeks without flying, I start getting scared.
Accidents or not.
It just amazes me that I can leave the planet in Texas, successfully
navigate across the US, and actually make that airplane touch down
within a pre-determined 50' x 50' square patch of the planet 4 states
away. Just the thought of that amazes me and scares me. To get over
it, I've just got to get in the air and prove to myself that everything
is A-OK.
Some days, I feel like I'm exposing myself to more risks that I'm
comfortable taking. There have been times that I've described aviation
to friends in the same terms as a drug addiction. (Not that I know what
that's like.)
I'm addicted to it. I've got to have it. I live for the next hit. I'm
willing to take risks for it. I'm willing to risk my life for it. It
has a tighter grip on me than I have on my own will power. Some days I
feel like I can't live with it, while I know I can't live without it.
I am a pilot. I know the risks. I'm addicted to flight (just like
those addicted to drugs) whether I like it or not. It's part of who I
am and I honestly don't think it's possible to put out the fire.
Hang in there. Deep down, I'm sure there is still a flame burning.
Don't let it go out. Just get in an airplane and go for a flight.
After you return to the planet, you'll remember why you fell in love
with flight the first time.
Phil
-----Original Message-----
From: Marcus Cooper [mailto:coop85(at)cableone.net]
Sent: Wednesday, April 23, 2008 6:42 PM
Subject: RE: RV10-List: Re: 210HM - Lew
Lew,
I'd like to add to Pascal's encouragement to you. I've been blessed
with the opportunity to fly a lot of airplanes, mostly fighters, and
find the RV-10 and general aviation flying to be some of the greatest
experiences of my life. This tragedy is certainly sad and
disheartening, and for me compounded by the loss of two more brethren
here at Columbus AFB today, but I wouldn't trade flying for anything in
the world. The opportunities the RV-10 has afforded my family are
irreplaceable and I wouldn't be able to spend the time with my daughters
who are off in college anywhere close to what I can now. The joy of
flight, and in particular going places that the RV-10 provide, are
absolutely amazing. The losses of friends and fellow aviators is
devastating but I pray will not be more than a bump in the road for your
progress to personal success but will be lessons learned as to how you
train and act as a pilot.
Marcus
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Lew Gallagher
Sent: Wednesday, April 23, 2008 3:25 PM
Subject: RV10-List: Re: 210HM
Thanks Tim, I never would have found it ... now I'm not sure I'm glad I
did.
I still love building, but my curiosity about flying is waning.
Hopefully I'm just temporarily discouraged. What a loss.
Here's Tim's unbroken link:
http://www.ntsb.gov:80/ntsb/brief.asp?ev_id 080422X00528&key=1
Here's the address of the flight (you may have to copy and paste it):
http://flightaware.com/live/flight_track_bigmap.rvt?ident=N210HM;airport
s=M5
4+KEUF;key d4df5c6845e46bcf7468a922905557f369ebd5;keytime=1208981350;h
4+eigh
t=340;width=400;departuretime=1207580400;arrivaltime=1207585140
Later, -Lew
--------
non-pilot
crazy about building
NOW OFICIALLY BUILDER #40549
doors almost finished, pants on, WHEW!
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=178741#178741
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | GRANSCOTT(at)aol.com |
In a message dated 4/23/2008 3:30:44 PM Central Daylight Time,
lewgall(at)charter.net writes:
Later, -Lew
Lew...the idea in flying is to learn from others mistakes and have your own
set of limits...not always the published figures on plates...IMHO
Patrick
**************Need a new ride? Check out the largest site for U.S. used car
listings at AOL Autos.
(http://autos.aol.com/used?NCID=aolcmp00300000002851)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Tim Olson <Tim(at)MyRV10.com> |
Lew, Pascal, and all,
Nothing I have to say is new at all, but I thought I'd share
my feelings. To me, all things involve risk, so I don't really
view the fact that it has risk as making the activity something
I'm averse to. I've never been skydiving (REAL skydiving), but
it drives me crazy to hear about people like my own brother
in law, who would LOVE to go skydiving, but simply won't because
his insurance wouldn't pay if he died. You're put on the earth
to LIVE life, and to me, it's all about what you're passionate
about...and fulfilling your dreams. There is a LOT you can
do, in ANY activity, to increase your odds, but in almost
ALL activities there is nothing you can do to guarantee your
safety. So, you simply live life to it's fullest, enjoying
the things you're passionate about....and you do what you can
to minimize your risks.
A couple days ago, I wanted to fill in the AOPA survey and
the question "What do you think is the most significant
deterrent to learning how to fly, besides cost?" I tell you,
I was totally stumped. So I asked a co-worker, who's expressed
interest, but never taken the plunge. She said "Probably
fear, that they won't be able to control the plane, and that
they'll hurt or kill themselves or someone else." I was
stunned at first. I couldn't believe it. To me, I always
had the passion, the dream, and the desire. The thought that
I would not be able to do it safely never entered my mind.
To me, if other people can fly planes, then because I WANT
to fly planes so bad, I can fly planes. After pondering
it for a while, I agreed with her and I filled in the survey.
I just didn't realize that some people let their fears
crush their passion like that, or perhaps their passion
wasn't as overwhelming to quench their fears.
So assuming that a person indeed has the passion in them
to partake in flying, my feeling is that those that
TRULY have that passion for excellence will also strive
for developing the knowledge and skill required to do
the flying they want to do. For me, one thing led to
another and I yearned for more. I love the complexity,
I love the challenge, I love flying in and out of IMC.
I love the clear sky days, and I love the low drizzly
days. But I also want to do it right, and be safe. I
have a fear in me, developed from reading all of the
negative examples that we have...."Aftermath"...."I learned
about flying from that", and so on... I put myself in
the cockpit when I read those stories, and I wonder...
what would be the way to prevent that situation? There
are many good people and good pilots who did some pretty
not-so-hot things that led to their demise. I'm no better
than them, but because they are my teacher, in some
respect, I hope to use them as a source of guidance,
and let them help me develop self-control. I don't want
to have the same fate, so when I fly, I constantly
analyze the safety of what I'm doing when I have those
critical decisions, and I remind myself what the cost
is if I fail. It's very humbling. But, the risk
does not kill my desire...because I KNOW....there is
no reason for me to meet the same fate....it's ALL IN
MY HANDS.
That leads me to re-tell a story. I had many good
opportunities for instilling respect and fear into
myself in actual IMC during my Instrument rating
training. I genuinely was NOT ready, 20 hours into
my training, to keep myself alive in IMC...and I knew
that. But, I kept flying with my pals....all CFI's,
in actual IMC and under the hood, to build confidence.
Finally the day came...well after obtaining that ticket,
for me to go fly in IMC on a perfect day. No reason,
just was the perfect 700' overcast day to go test
myself with, ... HA! ... that same risk-averse brother
in law of mine. I climbed out into the clouds, and
as soon as I was in IMC, I thought to myself "Man,
did YOU do it now....Now you're stuck...and you can't
get out of this with any help from anyone else...it's
only YOU who can bring you both down alive and safe."
I was genuinely fearful....but reminded myself that
I knew what to do...it was only executing those things
that I needed to do properly. The airplane was up to
it, if only I was too. Obviously, it went just fine,
or I'd not be here today. But, still to this day,
when I'm entering the clouds, I have similar feelings,
because I respect what I'm doing as "highly challenging"
and important to do well.
In reading the NTSB report, one cannot help to question
the pilot(s). It's our nature. "Why didn't they just
fly straight and level and get their bearings?" "Why
didn't they just hit the ONE button on their Autopilot
(assuming a TruTrak) that gives them instant heading
and altitude hold?" "Why didn't they ask for vectors
and just fly headings and vectors until they got to
some better conditions?" They're gone, so it's not
dishonoring them to ask....they're now our teachers.
What is obvious is that mistakes were made. Now, for
those who choose to fly in conditions like they were,
it's your job to find out what mistakes, and NOT make
them yourself. Remember them, and honor them by
bringing your craft and crew home safe, every time.
What can you do to help? Well, I for one, just did
an early BFR and IPC yesterday. Nothing wrong with
doing a AFR instead of a BFR right? (No, there is
no such thing as an Annual Flight Review...but hey,
it never hurts.) I want to make sure that not only
am I legal on paper, but that someone else critiques
me too. I don't WANT him to go easy on me. I did
some things and he asked if I wanted ATP standards
or normal. I chose ATP. I WANT to be tested.
As Phil mentioned, you get rusty and more fearful if
you don't fly often, so FLY OFTEN. This activity
isn't for the occasional pilot...one who goes up for
some touch and goes every 4 months. Stick with it...
get some time every month, even if it's only an hour.
Can you do that? I'm thinking that if you truly have
the passion, you'll make it happen. Flying isn't
for everyone...but anyone with the passion can make
it work for them.
The one thing that does concern me greatly is the
number of ZERO time pilots that are building RV-10's.
My CFII yesterday mentioned, when we discussed the
3 fatal RV-10 accidents, that we're very similar to
the Cirrus trends, but we're very similar planes.
He said the average Cirrus owner has something like
74 hours (unverified), and we both lamented at how
shockingly inadequate (sorry, really, I am) that can
be, for flying a plane with such performance. Sure, it
flies slow if throttle back, but it's slippery, and
it's light, and it demands respect. So, for those
out there that are very low or zero time pilots, please,
get in that plane with a CFI and put LOTS of time on
it if you insist on flying an RV-10 right away. LOTS
of time. You will never progress faster by any other
means than if you put on a LOT of time over a short
time span. If you can fly 200 hours in a year, you're
going to retain a lot more skill for many years, than
the guy who flies 20-45 hours a year. So look at it
as an investment, and just fork over for the avgas
and keep that plane in the air for a MINIMUM of 100
hours in the first year. The year I got my instrument
ticket I put in 100+ hours, and it was my biggest
year of skill growth ever...and it was the most
retained, at that. My first year in my RV-10 I put
on 200 hours. It's amazing how much comfort that brings
you.
So, if you truly have the passion, these accidents, and
NTSB reports won't stun you and set you back. They'll
make you think, and make you strive for more. And
you'll still gladly jump in the plane and go for a flight,
because you'll know that it CAN happen to you, but only
if you don't get out there and develop good skills,
and retain them. Anyone can fly a plane and bring it
back to earth with everyone alive. You just have to
NOT do the things that people do wrong....so learn from
the others who paid the price for your lesson...and
develop respect for flying and be safe.
Tim Olson - RV-10 N104CD - Flying
(sorry, I'll try for more brevity on the next few posts
to make up for this one.) ;)
Pascal wrote:
>
> Lew;
> We all miss our fellow builders who have perished in the last year. I
> would encourage you to read some of Tim's great articles on what he has
> done for his family in the plane these last couple of years
> http://www.myrv10.com/N104CD/index.html and remember people die every
> day; some doing what they enjoy, some while waiting for that day they
> would do something they wanted to do and some completely unexpectedly
> taking out the garbage they hated doing.. I too will go one day, I know
> where I'm going and I'm pretty excited about it, but in the meantime I
> want to do what I always wanted (build a plane) and if I die on my
> maiden flight, I'll be really bummed but I did it doing something I was
> excited about.. the few we have lost this last year perished doing what
> they loved..
> I encourage you to think of all those trips to meet many of us at
> fly-in's, in Oregon for Van's open house, etc.. there is so much to get
> excited about with flying..
> Pascal
>
> --------------------------------------------------
> From: "Lew Gallagher" <lewgall(at)charter.net>
> Sent: Wednesday, April 23, 2008 1:25 PM
> To:
> Subject: RV10-List: Re: 210HM
>
>>
>> Thanks Tim, I never would have found it ... now I'm not sure I'm glad
>> I did. I still love building, but my curiosity about flying is
>> waning. Hopefully I'm just temporarily discouraged. What a loss.
>>
>> Here's Tim's unbroken link:
>>
>> http://www.ntsb.gov:80/ntsb/brief.asp?ev_id 080422X00528&key=1
>>
>> Here's the address of the flight (you may have to copy and paste it):
>>
>> http://flightaware.com/live/flight_track_bigmap.rvt?ident=N210HM;airports=M54+KEUF;key d4df5c6845e46bcf7468a922905557f369ebd5;keytime=1208981350;height=340;width=400;departuretime=1207580400;arrivaltime=1207585140
>>
>>
>> Later, -Lew
>>
>> --------
>> non-pilot
>> crazy about building
>> NOW OFICIALLY BUILDER #40549
>> doors almost finished, pants on, WHEW!
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Read this topic online here:
>>
>> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=178741#178741
>>
>>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "bruce breckenridge" <bbreckenridge(at)gmail.com> |
Word for word, a very encouraging and motivating statement of passion
guarded by wisdom. Thanks Tim. I am one of those low timers working on my
IFR ticket and loving every minute of it, yet nervous of the day when I'm on
my own and every move is up to me. Good words. Keep 'em coming!
Bruce
40018
On Wed, Apr 23, 2008 at 7:10 PM, Tim Olson wrote:
>
> Lew, Pascal, and all,
>
> Nothing I have to say is new at all, but I thought I'd share
> my feelings. To me, all things involve risk, so I don't really
> view the fact that it has risk as making the activity something
> I'm averse to. I've never been skydiving (REAL skydiving), but
> it drives me crazy to hear about people like my own brother
> in law, who would LOVE to go skydiving, but simply won't because
> his insurance wouldn't pay if he died. You're put on the earth
> to LIVE life, and to me, it's all about what you're passionate
> about...and fulfilling your dreams. There is a LOT you can
> do, in ANY activity, to increase your odds, but in almost
> ALL activities there is nothing you can do to guarantee your
> safety. So, you simply live life to it's fullest, enjoying
> the things you're passionate about....and you do what you can
> to minimize your risks.
>
> A couple days ago, I wanted to fill in the AOPA survey and
> the question "What do you think is the most significant
> deterrent to learning how to fly, besides cost?" I tell you,
> I was totally stumped. So I asked a co-worker, who's expressed
> interest, but never taken the plunge. She said "Probably
> fear, that they won't be able to control the plane, and that
> they'll hurt or kill themselves or someone else." I was
> stunned at first. I couldn't believe it. To me, I always
> had the passion, the dream, and the desire. The thought that
> I would not be able to do it safely never entered my mind.
> To me, if other people can fly planes, then because I WANT
> to fly planes so bad, I can fly planes. After pondering
> it for a while, I agreed with her and I filled in the survey.
> I just didn't realize that some people let their fears
> crush their passion like that, or perhaps their passion
> wasn't as overwhelming to quench their fears.
>
> So assuming that a person indeed has the passion in them
> to partake in flying, my feeling is that those that
> TRULY have that passion for excellence will also strive
> for developing the knowledge and skill required to do
> the flying they want to do. For me, one thing led to
> another and I yearned for more. I love the complexity,
> I love the challenge, I love flying in and out of IMC.
> I love the clear sky days, and I love the low drizzly
> days. But I also want to do it right, and be safe. I
> have a fear in me, developed from reading all of the
> negative examples that we have...."Aftermath"...."I learned
> about flying from that", and so on... I put myself in
> the cockpit when I read those stories, and I wonder...
> what would be the way to prevent that situation? There
> are many good people and good pilots who did some pretty
> not-so-hot things that led to their demise. I'm no better
> than them, but because they are my teacher, in some
> respect, I hope to use them as a source of guidance,
> and let them help me develop self-control. I don't want
> to have the same fate, so when I fly, I constantly
> analyze the safety of what I'm doing when I have those
> critical decisions, and I remind myself what the cost
> is if I fail. It's very humbling. But, the risk
> does not kill my desire...because I KNOW....there is
> no reason for me to meet the same fate....it's ALL IN
> MY HANDS.
>
> That leads me to re-tell a story. I had many good
> opportunities for instilling respect and fear into
> myself in actual IMC during my Instrument rating
> training. I genuinely was NOT ready, 20 hours into
> my training, to keep myself alive in IMC...and I knew
> that. But, I kept flying with my pals....all CFI's,
> in actual IMC and under the hood, to build confidence.
> Finally the day came...well after obtaining that ticket,
> for me to go fly in IMC on a perfect day. No reason,
> just was the perfect 700' overcast day to go test
> myself with, ... HA! ... that same risk-averse brother
> in law of mine. I climbed out into the clouds, and
> as soon as I was in IMC, I thought to myself "Man,
> did YOU do it now....Now you're stuck...and you can't
> get out of this with any help from anyone else...it's
> only YOU who can bring you both down alive and safe."
> I was genuinely fearful....but reminded myself that
> I knew what to do...it was only executing those things
> that I needed to do properly. The airplane was up to
> it, if only I was too. Obviously, it went just fine,
> or I'd not be here today. But, still to this day,
> when I'm entering the clouds, I have similar feelings,
> because I respect what I'm doing as "highly challenging"
> and important to do well.
>
> In reading the NTSB report, one cannot help to question
> the pilot(s). It's our nature. "Why didn't they just
> fly straight and level and get their bearings?" "Why
> didn't they just hit the ONE button on their Autopilot
> (assuming a TruTrak) that gives them instant heading
> and altitude hold?" "Why didn't they ask for vectors
> and just fly headings and vectors until they got to
> some better conditions?" They're gone, so it's not
> dishonoring them to ask....they're now our teachers.
> What is obvious is that mistakes were made. Now, for
> those who choose to fly in conditions like they were,
> it's your job to find out what mistakes, and NOT make
> them yourself. Remember them, and honor them by
> bringing your craft and crew home safe, every time.
>
> What can you do to help? Well, I for one, just did
> an early BFR and IPC yesterday. Nothing wrong with
> doing a AFR instead of a BFR right? (No, there is
> no such thing as an Annual Flight Review...but hey,
> it never hurts.) I want to make sure that not only
> am I legal on paper, but that someone else critiques
> me too. I don't WANT him to go easy on me. I did
> some things and he asked if I wanted ATP standards
> or normal. I chose ATP. I WANT to be tested.
> As Phil mentioned, you get rusty and more fearful if
> you don't fly often, so FLY OFTEN. This activity
> isn't for the occasional pilot...one who goes up for
> some touch and goes every 4 months. Stick with it...
> get some time every month, even if it's only an hour.
> Can you do that? I'm thinking that if you truly have
> the passion, you'll make it happen. Flying isn't
> for everyone...but anyone with the passion can make
> it work for them.
>
> The one thing that does concern me greatly is the
> number of ZERO time pilots that are building RV-10's.
> My CFII yesterday mentioned, when we discussed the
> 3 fatal RV-10 accidents, that we're very similar to
> the Cirrus trends, but we're very similar planes.
> He said the average Cirrus owner has something like
> 74 hours (unverified), and we both lamented at how
> shockingly inadequate (sorry, really, I am) that can
> be, for flying a plane with such performance. Sure, it
> flies slow if throttle back, but it's slippery, and
> it's light, and it demands respect. So, for those
> out there that are very low or zero time pilots, please,
> get in that plane with a CFI and put LOTS of time on
> it if you insist on flying an RV-10 right away. LOTS
> of time. You will never progress faster by any other
> means than if you put on a LOT of time over a short
> time span. If you can fly 200 hours in a year, you're
> going to retain a lot more skill for many years, than
> the guy who flies 20-45 hours a year. So look at it
> as an investment, and just fork over for the avgas
> and keep that plane in the air for a MINIMUM of 100
> hours in the first year. The year I got my instrument
> ticket I put in 100+ hours, and it was my biggest
> year of skill growth ever...and it was the most
> retained, at that. My first year in my RV-10 I put
> on 200 hours. It's amazing how much comfort that brings
> you.
>
> So, if you truly have the passion, these accidents, and
> NTSB reports won't stun you and set you back. They'll
> make you think, and make you strive for more. And
> you'll still gladly jump in the plane and go for a flight,
> because you'll know that it CAN happen to you, but only
> if you don't get out there and develop good skills,
> and retain them. Anyone can fly a plane and bring it
> back to earth with everyone alive. You just have to
> NOT do the things that people do wrong....so learn from
> the others who paid the price for your lesson...and
> develop respect for flying and be safe.
>
> Tim Olson - RV-10 N104CD - Flying
> (sorry, I'll try for more brevity on the next few posts
> to make up for this one.) ;)
>
>
> Pascal wrote:
>
>>
>> Lew;
>> We all miss our fellow builders who have perished in the last year. I
>> would encourage you to read some of Tim's great articles on what he has done
>> for his family in the plane these last couple of years
>> http://www.myrv10.com/N104CD/index.html and remember people die every
>> day; some doing what they enjoy, some while waiting for that day they would
>> do something they wanted to do and some completely unexpectedly taking out
>> the garbage they hated doing.. I too will go one day, I know where I'm going
>> and I'm pretty excited about it, but in the meantime I want to do what I
>> always wanted (build a plane) and if I die on my maiden flight, I'll be
>> really bummed but I did it doing something I was excited about.. the few we
>> have lost this last year perished doing what they loved..
>> I encourage you to think of all those trips to meet many of us at
>> fly-in's, in Oregon for Van's open house, etc.. there is so much to get
>> excited about with flying..
>> Pascal
>>
>> --------------------------------------------------
>> From: "Lew Gallagher" <lewgall(at)charter.net>
>> Sent: Wednesday, April 23, 2008 1:25 PM
>> To:
>> Subject: RV10-List: Re: 210HM
>>
>>>
>>> Thanks Tim, I never would have found it ... now I'm not sure I'm glad I
>>> did. I still love building, but my curiosity about flying is waning.
>>> Hopefully I'm just temporarily discouraged. What a loss.
>>>
>>> Here's Tim's unbroken link:
>>>
>>> http://www.ntsb.gov:80/ntsb/brief.asp?ev_id 080422X00528&key=1
>>>
>>> Here's the address of the flight (you may have to copy and paste it):
>>>
>>>
>>> http://flightaware.com/live/flight_track_bigmap.rvt?ident=N210HM;airports=M54+KEUF;key d4df5c6845e46bcf7468a922905557f369ebd5;keytime=1208981350;height=340;width=400;departuretime=1207580400;arrivaltime=1207585140
>>>
>>> Later, -Lew
>>>
>>> --------
>>> non-pilot
>>> crazy about building
>>> NOW OFICIALLY BUILDER #40549
>>> doors almost finished, pants on, WHEW!
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Read this topic online here:
>>>
>>> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=178741#178741
>>>
>>>
>>>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Pascal" <rv10builder(at)verizon.net> |
Tim;
I should have said ">> would encourage you to read some of Tim's great
articles on what he has
done for his family and builders with feedback in the plane these last
couple of years"
As always you have not let us down with your insight!
Thanks!
Pascal
--------------------------------------------------
From: "Tim Olson" <Tim(at)MyRV10.com>
Sent: Wednesday, April 23, 2008 7:10 PM
Subject: Re: RV10-List: Re: 210HM
>
> Lew, Pascal, and all,
>
> Nothing I have to say is new at all, but I thought I'd share
> my feelings. To me, all things involve risk, so I don't really
> view the fact that it has risk as making the activity something
> I'm averse to. I've never been skydiving (REAL skydiving), but
> it drives me crazy to hear about people like my own brother
> in law, who would LOVE to go skydiving, but simply won't because
> his insurance wouldn't pay if he died. You're put on the earth
> to LIVE life, and to me, it's all about what you're passionate
> about...and fulfilling your dreams. There is a LOT you can
> do, in ANY activity, to increase your odds, but in almost
> ALL activities there is nothing you can do to guarantee your
> safety. So, you simply live life to it's fullest, enjoying
> the things you're passionate about....and you do what you can
> to minimize your risks.
>
> A couple days ago, I wanted to fill in the AOPA survey and
> the question "What do you think is the most significant
> deterrent to learning how to fly, besides cost?" I tell you,
> I was totally stumped. So I asked a co-worker, who's expressed
> interest, but never taken the plunge. She said "Probably
> fear, that they won't be able to control the plane, and that
> they'll hurt or kill themselves or someone else." I was
> stunned at first. I couldn't believe it. To me, I always
> had the passion, the dream, and the desire. The thought that
> I would not be able to do it safely never entered my mind.
> To me, if other people can fly planes, then because I WANT
> to fly planes so bad, I can fly planes. After pondering
> it for a while, I agreed with her and I filled in the survey.
> I just didn't realize that some people let their fears
> crush their passion like that, or perhaps their passion
> wasn't as overwhelming to quench their fears.
>
> So assuming that a person indeed has the passion in them
> to partake in flying, my feeling is that those that
> TRULY have that passion for excellence will also strive
> for developing the knowledge and skill required to do
> the flying they want to do. For me, one thing led to
> another and I yearned for more. I love the complexity,
> I love the challenge, I love flying in and out of IMC.
> I love the clear sky days, and I love the low drizzly
> days. But I also want to do it right, and be safe. I
> have a fear in me, developed from reading all of the
> negative examples that we have...."Aftermath"...."I learned
> about flying from that", and so on... I put myself in
> the cockpit when I read those stories, and I wonder...
> what would be the way to prevent that situation? There
> are many good people and good pilots who did some pretty
> not-so-hot things that led to their demise. I'm no better
> than them, but because they are my teacher, in some
> respect, I hope to use them as a source of guidance,
> and let them help me develop self-control. I don't want
> to have the same fate, so when I fly, I constantly
> analyze the safety of what I'm doing when I have those
> critical decisions, and I remind myself what the cost
> is if I fail. It's very humbling. But, the risk
> does not kill my desire...because I KNOW....there is
> no reason for me to meet the same fate....it's ALL IN
> MY HANDS.
>
> That leads me to re-tell a story. I had many good
> opportunities for instilling respect and fear into
> myself in actual IMC during my Instrument rating
> training. I genuinely was NOT ready, 20 hours into
> my training, to keep myself alive in IMC...and I knew
> that. But, I kept flying with my pals....all CFI's,
> in actual IMC and under the hood, to build confidence.
> Finally the day came...well after obtaining that ticket,
> for me to go fly in IMC on a perfect day. No reason,
> just was the perfect 700' overcast day to go test
> myself with, ... HA! ... that same risk-averse brother
> in law of mine. I climbed out into the clouds, and
> as soon as I was in IMC, I thought to myself "Man,
> did YOU do it now....Now you're stuck...and you can't
> get out of this with any help from anyone else...it's
> only YOU who can bring you both down alive and safe."
> I was genuinely fearful....but reminded myself that
> I knew what to do...it was only executing those things
> that I needed to do properly. The airplane was up to
> it, if only I was too. Obviously, it went just fine,
> or I'd not be here today. But, still to this day,
> when I'm entering the clouds, I have similar feelings,
> because I respect what I'm doing as "highly challenging"
> and important to do well.
>
> In reading the NTSB report, one cannot help to question
> the pilot(s). It's our nature. "Why didn't they just
> fly straight and level and get their bearings?" "Why
> didn't they just hit the ONE button on their Autopilot
> (assuming a TruTrak) that gives them instant heading
> and altitude hold?" "Why didn't they ask for vectors
> and just fly headings and vectors until they got to
> some better conditions?" They're gone, so it's not
> dishonoring them to ask....they're now our teachers.
> What is obvious is that mistakes were made. Now, for
> those who choose to fly in conditions like they were,
> it's your job to find out what mistakes, and NOT make
> them yourself. Remember them, and honor them by
> bringing your craft and crew home safe, every time.
>
> What can you do to help? Well, I for one, just did
> an early BFR and IPC yesterday. Nothing wrong with
> doing a AFR instead of a BFR right? (No, there is
> no such thing as an Annual Flight Review...but hey,
> it never hurts.) I want to make sure that not only
> am I legal on paper, but that someone else critiques
> me too. I don't WANT him to go easy on me. I did
> some things and he asked if I wanted ATP standards
> or normal. I chose ATP. I WANT to be tested.
> As Phil mentioned, you get rusty and more fearful if
> you don't fly often, so FLY OFTEN. This activity
> isn't for the occasional pilot...one who goes up for
> some touch and goes every 4 months. Stick with it...
> get some time every month, even if it's only an hour.
> Can you do that? I'm thinking that if you truly have
> the passion, you'll make it happen. Flying isn't
> for everyone...but anyone with the passion can make
> it work for them.
>
> The one thing that does concern me greatly is the
> number of ZERO time pilots that are building RV-10's.
> My CFII yesterday mentioned, when we discussed the
> 3 fatal RV-10 accidents, that we're very similar to
> the Cirrus trends, but we're very similar planes.
> He said the average Cirrus owner has something like
> 74 hours (unverified), and we both lamented at how
> shockingly inadequate (sorry, really, I am) that can
> be, for flying a plane with such performance. Sure, it
> flies slow if throttle back, but it's slippery, and
> it's light, and it demands respect. So, for those
> out there that are very low or zero time pilots, please,
> get in that plane with a CFI and put LOTS of time on
> it if you insist on flying an RV-10 right away. LOTS
> of time. You will never progress faster by any other
> means than if you put on a LOT of time over a short
> time span. If you can fly 200 hours in a year, you're
> going to retain a lot more skill for many years, than
> the guy who flies 20-45 hours a year. So look at it
> as an investment, and just fork over for the avgas
> and keep that plane in the air for a MINIMUM of 100
> hours in the first year. The year I got my instrument
> ticket I put in 100+ hours, and it was my biggest
> year of skill growth ever...and it was the most
> retained, at that. My first year in my RV-10 I put
> on 200 hours. It's amazing how much comfort that brings
> you.
>
> So, if you truly have the passion, these accidents, and
> NTSB reports won't stun you and set you back. They'll
> make you think, and make you strive for more. And
> you'll still gladly jump in the plane and go for a flight,
> because you'll know that it CAN happen to you, but only
> if you don't get out there and develop good skills,
> and retain them. Anyone can fly a plane and bring it
> back to earth with everyone alive. You just have to
> NOT do the things that people do wrong....so learn from
> the others who paid the price for your lesson...and
> develop respect for flying and be safe.
>
> Tim Olson - RV-10 N104CD - Flying
> (sorry, I'll try for more brevity on the next few posts
> to make up for this one.) ;)
>
>
> Pascal wrote:
>>
>> Lew;
>> We all miss our fellow builders who have perished in the last year. I
>> would encourage you to read some of Tim's great articles on what he has
>> done for his family in the plane these last couple of years
>> http://www.myrv10.com/N104CD/index.html and remember people die every
>> day; some doing what they enjoy, some while waiting for that day they
>> would do something they wanted to do and some completely unexpectedly
>> taking out the garbage they hated doing.. I too will go one day, I know
>> where I'm going and I'm pretty excited about it, but in the meantime I
>> want to do what I always wanted (build a plane) and if I die on my maiden
>> flight, I'll be really bummed but I did it doing something I was excited
>> about.. the few we have lost this last year perished doing what they
>> loved..
>> I encourage you to think of all those trips to meet many of us at
>> fly-in's, in Oregon for Van's open house, etc.. there is so much to get
>> excited about with flying..
>> Pascal
>>
>> --------------------------------------------------
>> From: "Lew Gallagher" <lewgall(at)charter.net>
>> Sent: Wednesday, April 23, 2008 1:25 PM
>> To:
>> Subject: RV10-List: Re: 210HM
>>
>>>
>>> Thanks Tim, I never would have found it ... now I'm not sure I'm glad I
>>> did. I still love building, but my curiosity about flying is waning.
>>> Hopefully I'm just temporarily discouraged. What a loss.
>>>
>>> Here's Tim's unbroken link:
>>>
>>> http://www.ntsb.gov:80/ntsb/brief.asp?ev_id 080422X00528&key=1
>>>
>>> Here's the address of the flight (you may have to copy and paste it):
>>>
>>> http://flightaware.com/live/flight_track_bigmap.rvt?ident=N210HM;airports=M54+KEUF;key d4df5c6845e46bcf7468a922905557f369ebd5;keytime=1208981350;height=340;width=400;departuretime=1207580400;arrivaltime=1207585140
>>>
>>> Later, -Lew
>>>
>>> --------
>>> non-pilot
>>> crazy about building
>>> NOW OFICIALLY BUILDER #40549
>>> doors almost finished, pants on, WHEW!
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Read this topic online here:
>>>
>>> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=178741#178741
>>>
>>>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "John Testement" <jwt(at)roadmapscoaching.com> |
Tim,
Thank you so much for taking the time to share the kind of wisdom all of us
RVers need to hear (over and over again). I flew a Cessna 172 for years and
did my instrument training in the 172. But moving up to a high performance
plane - C182 was a whole new experience. IFR is demanding enough at 172
speeds but things happen really fast in a high performance plane - you have
to be ready for this. Your advice to fly LOTS of hours before ending up in
actual in a high performance RV10 can't be emphasized enough.
John Testement
jwt(at)roadmapscoaching.com
40321 N311RV
Richmond, VA
Painting
Lew, Pascal, and all,
Nothing I have to say is new at all, but I thought I'd share my feelings.
To me, all things involve risk, so I don't really view the fact that it has
risk as making the activity something I'm averse to. I've never been
skydiving (REAL skydiving), but it drives me crazy to hear about people like
my own brother in law, who would LOVE to go skydiving, but simply won't
because his insurance wouldn't pay if he died. You're put on the earth to
LIVE life, and to me, it's all about what you're passionate about...and
fulfilling your dreams. There is a LOT you can do, in ANY activity, to
increase your odds, but in almost ALL activities there is nothing you can do
to guarantee your safety. So, you simply live life to it's fullest,
enjoying the things you're passionate about....and you do what you can to
minimize your risks.
A couple days ago, I wanted to fill in the AOPA survey and the question
"What do you think is the most significant deterrent to learning how to fly,
besides cost?" I tell you, I was totally stumped. So I asked a co-worker,
who's expressed interest, but never taken the plunge. She said "Probably
fear, that they won't be able to control the plane, and that they'll hurt or
kill themselves or someone else." I was
stunned at first. I couldn't believe it. To me, I always
had the passion, the dream, and the desire. The thought that I would not be
able to do it safely never entered my mind.
To me, if other people can fly planes, then because I WANT to fly planes so
bad, I can fly planes. After pondering it for a while, I agreed with her
and I filled in the survey.
I just didn't realize that some people let their fears crush their passion
like that, or perhaps their passion wasn't as overwhelming to quench their
fears.
So assuming that a person indeed has the passion in them to partake in
flying, my feeling is that those that TRULY have that passion for excellence
will also strive for developing the knowledge and skill required to do the
flying they want to do. For me, one thing led to another and I yearned for
more. I love the complexity, I love the challenge, I love flying in and out
of IMC.
I love the clear sky days, and I love the low drizzly days. But I also want
to do it right, and be safe. I have a fear in me, developed from reading
all of the negative examples that we have...."Aftermath"...."I learned about
flying from that", and so on... I put myself in the cockpit when I read
those stories, and I wonder...
what would be the way to prevent that situation? There are many good people
and good pilots who did some pretty not-so-hot things that led to their
demise. I'm no better than them, but because they are my teacher, in some
respect, I hope to use them as a source of guidance, and let them help me
develop self-control. I don't want to have the same fate, so when I fly, I
constantly analyze the safety of what I'm doing when I have those critical
decisions, and I remind myself what the cost is if I fail. It's very
humbling. But, the risk does not kill my desire...because I KNOW....there
is no reason for me to meet the same fate....it's ALL IN MY HANDS.
That leads me to re-tell a story. I had many good opportunities for
instilling respect and fear into myself in actual IMC during my Instrument
rating training. I genuinely was NOT ready, 20 hours into my training, to
keep myself alive in IMC...and I knew that. But, I kept flying with my
pals....all CFI's, in actual IMC and under the hood, to build confidence.
Finally the day came...well after obtaining that ticket, for me to go fly in
IMC on a perfect day. No reason, just was the perfect 700' overcast day to
go test myself with, ... HA! ... that same risk-averse brother in law of
mine. I climbed out into the clouds, and as soon as I was in IMC, I thought
to myself "Man, did YOU do it now....Now you're stuck...and you can't get
out of this with any help from anyone else...it's only YOU who can bring you
both down alive and safe."
I was genuinely fearful....but reminded myself that I knew what to do...it
was only executing those things that I needed to do properly. The airplane
was up to it, if only I was too. Obviously, it went just fine, or I'd not
be here today. But, still to this day, when I'm entering the clouds, I have
similar feelings, because I respect what I'm doing as "highly challenging"
and important to do well.
In reading the NTSB report, one cannot help to question the pilot(s). It's
our nature. "Why didn't they just fly straight and level and get their
bearings?" "Why didn't they just hit the ONE button on their Autopilot
(assuming a TruTrak) that gives them instant heading and altitude hold?"
"Why didn't they ask for vectors and just fly headings and vectors until
they got to some better conditions?" They're gone, so it's not dishonoring
them to ask....they're now our teachers.
What is obvious is that mistakes were made. Now, for those who choose to
fly in conditions like they were, it's your job to find out what mistakes,
and NOT make them yourself. Remember them, and honor them by bringing your
craft and crew home safe, every time.
What can you do to help? Well, I for one, just did an early BFR and IPC
yesterday. Nothing wrong with doing a AFR instead of a BFR right? (No,
there is no such thing as an Annual Flight Review...but hey, it never
hurts.) I want to make sure that not only am I legal on paper, but that
someone else critiques me too. I don't WANT him to go easy on me. I did
some things and he asked if I wanted ATP standards or normal. I chose ATP.
I WANT to be tested.
As Phil mentioned, you get rusty and more fearful if you don't fly often, so
FLY OFTEN. This activity isn't for the occasional pilot...one who goes up
for some touch and goes every 4 months. Stick with it...
get some time every month, even if it's only an hour.
Can you do that? I'm thinking that if you truly have the passion, you'll
make it happen. Flying isn't for everyone...but anyone with the passion can
make it work for them.
The one thing that does concern me greatly is the number of ZERO time pilots
that are building RV-10's.
My CFII yesterday mentioned, when we discussed the
3 fatal RV-10 accidents, that we're very similar to the Cirrus trends, but
we're very similar planes.
He said the average Cirrus owner has something like
74 hours (unverified), and we both lamented at how shockingly inadequate
(sorry, really, I am) that can be, for flying a plane with such performance.
Sure, it flies slow if throttle back, but it's slippery, and it's light, and
it demands respect. So, for those out there that are very low or zero time
pilots, please, get in that plane with a CFI and put LOTS of time on it if
you insist on flying an RV-10 right away. LOTS of time. You will never
progress faster by any other means than if you put on a LOT of time over a
short time span. If you can fly 200 hours in a year, you're going to retain
a lot more skill for many years, than the guy who flies 20-45 hours a year.
So look at it as an investment, and just fork over for the avgas and keep
that plane in the air for a MINIMUM of 100 hours in the first year. The
year I got my instrument ticket I put in 100+ hours, and it was my biggest
year of skill growth ever...and it was the most retained, at that. My first
year in my RV-10 I put on 200 hours. It's amazing how much comfort that
brings you.
So, if you truly have the passion, these accidents, and NTSB reports won't
stun you and set you back. They'll make you think, and make you strive for
more. And you'll still gladly jump in the plane and go for a flight, because
you'll know that it CAN happen to you, but only if you don't get out there
and develop good skills, and retain them. Anyone can fly a plane and bring
it back to earth with everyone alive. You just have to NOT do the things
that people do wrong....so learn from the others who paid the price for your
lesson...and develop respect for flying and be safe.
Tim Olson - RV-10 N104CD - Flying
(sorry, I'll try for more brevity on the next few posts to make up for this
one.) ;)
Checked by AVG.
7:24 AM
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | GRANSCOTT(at)aol.com |
In a message dated 4/23/2008 9:16:59 PM Central Daylight Time,
Tim(at)MyRV10.com writes:
Well, I for one, just did
an early BFR and IPC yesterday. Nothing wrong with
doing a AFR instead of a BFR right?
The new climate in the FAA has gotten away from the term BFR they are now
promoting a more professional approach to training as is done with ATP's...the
new Wings program is trying to promote the idea that our training should be
progressive learning and proficiency. Thus they are trying to instill that we
should all be training, learning new or re-inforcing the basics. Not
waiting for a check ride very 2 years. A PPL is just the begining ticket to a
ride
of learning.
I don't know if you newer/non-pilot read Bob Miller electronic newsletter or
visit AOPA Safety Foundation courses...both of these provide some great
information. There are a number of other publications for pilots of all skill
levels...whether it's IFR magazines or general aviation reading. Additionally
there are a number of schools one can attend...my friend recently attended an
aerobatics school so he's now more comfortable with stalls in all
configurations and attitudes...something he feared before this training, now his
confidence level has risen.
The FAA's folks today believe as many instructors have said forever, get
good instruction frequently and not rely on a minimal check ride every 24
months. Continue your learning with new skills either through progressive training
in the new Wings program or obtaining a new rating or learning a new skill.
A little anxiety is probably healthy. If you've been flying for a while,
you've probably done some dum pilot tricks or been involved with
situations...with good training and a bit of luck you've learned and grown to
be a better
pilot. Recently a student pilot lost and engine and landed the plane
safely..the news asked if he was going to fly again...he said as soon as he
could...now he's received some good training..hats off to his CFI and his good
attitude.
In golf, reading Jack's book, he say's that each spring he would approach
his golf teacher, Jack Grout, hand him a club and ask him if he would teach him
how to play golf. Not well or better but to teach him golf basics. As Tim
said he's taking a progressive approach to his skill set and that's pretty
good advise to all pilots, whether an ATP or a person wanting to learn...never
stop learning. If you've learned everything there is to know about
flying...QUIT...if not please venture on adding to the skills in your flight bag.
Patrick
**************Need a new ride? Check out the largest site for U.S. used car
listings at AOL Autos.
(http://autos.aol.com/used?NCID=aolcmp00300000002851)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "David McNeill" <dlm46007(at)cox.net> |
First flight was at 0600 this morning. Have one hour of recorded data from
the GRT Sport system to review, Used the Cheltons for the first time; very
easy to hand fly altitude and heading.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "John Jessen" <n212pj(at)GMAIL.COM> |
Lew, you've gotten some good advice in the last couple days. Let me add a
couple items and make a plea.
1. If you want to build the 10 because you love building and feel flying is
not your thing, then do it. Build an RV-10. A great bunch of folks are
right there with you. You might have someone who knows flying help you
decide on the final panel design, but other than that, it's pretty "simple"
and fun. You won't be earning very big bucks at the end of the day, when it
comes time to sell, but then you are doing it for the love of building,
right?
2. If you want to fly, then I'd suggest starting now. I suggest going out
to your favorite field and getting that first lesson, and I'd rather see you
do it with the attitude that you're out to have fun. It doesn't matter too
much which type of airplane, since the one's that you'll have available to
you are all trainers. That is, they are designed to be as stable as
possible, and not all that fast. I hope what you'll get from the lesson is
that it is fun, it is doable, and that you'll want the second lesson. And
the third and the forth and so on.
3. Then, assuming you love flying, I hope you'll spend more time, or at
least as much time flying than building. I hope you take the advice of many
on the list and get in that 100 or 200 hours and build those skills. But,
even if it's the 50 hours most casual flyers can afford, in terms of time
and coin, that's 50 more hours than you had before. Fifty more hours of
experience leading up to the skills needed for the RV-10.
4. Finally, and this is for all those who lack high performance training,
don't even think you can handle the RV-10 without high performance training
and plenty of high performance time. The RV-10 is a great plane. Good
handling. Good slow speed characteristics. Goes fast. But, it can get
folks in trouble because things happen very quickly. The difference between
flying a 172 and an RV-10 is not night and day. It's all the same stuff,
almost. It just happens faster, so you have to know what you need to do
before you need to do it. And that takes time and practice. Someone said
there was a lot to learn going from a 172 to a 182. Heck, there's a lot to
learn going from a 182 to an RV-10! But, you can go from a 172 to an RV-10,
just do it with a CFI for many, many hours until both you and s/he feel
you're ready. One analogy that I got from someone about moving up to the
faster airplanes was what is often said by college athletes going into the
pros, it's all the same, just that everything happens faster and the
offensive and defensive schemes are more complex. You can learn it and do
it, you just need to practice, practice, practice.
In some senses I'm trying to make a very strong case for you to get in the
air, and do it soon. You have what is good to have (besides the desire to
fly), and that is a healthy bit of anxiety about flying. The faster you get
in the air with a CFI (one that you feel comfortable with, don't forget you
can audition these folks) helping you learn, the faster that anxiety will
diminish and you'll find that this is a reasonable activity, one with so
many upsides that the risks are worth it, especially if you manage them
well. BUT, don't wait too long. Get going. It takes time, and there is a
whole bunch of learning (and a whole bunch of fun) to be had before you will
be ready for the RV-10, especially ready in a manner that you will find very
enjoyable and exhilarating.
Finally, you don't have to build an RV-10 to enjoy flying. You don't have
to go fast to enjoy flying. You don't have to haul around 4 seats to enjoy
flying. The RV-10, in fact, may not be the right first plane for you to
build and fly. That is something that you need to think carefully about.
It is, after all, a large commitment of time and coin. However, if you have
the passion and you're enjoying the heck out of it, then do it! Just go get
that license and build your time....
John Jessen
40328 (on hold while I'm enjoying flying my GlaStar, a very much slower
plane than the RV-10, but a joy to fly!)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | John Ackerman <johnag5b(at)cableone.net> |
Congratulations, David!
Is KPRC in your fly-off area?
John
On Apr 24, 2008, at 8:25 AM, David McNeill wrote:
> First flight was at 0600 this morning. Have one hour of recorded
> data from the GRT Sport system to review, Used the Cheltons for the
> first time; very easy to hand fly altitude and heading.
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "David McNeill" <dlm46007(at)cox.net> |
NO decided to go south for better emergency fields and cheaper gas.
_____
From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of John Ackerman
Sent: Thursday, April 24, 2008 9:33 AM
Subject: Re: RV10-List: n46007
Congratulations, David!
Is KPRC in your fly-off area?
John
On Apr 24, 2008, at 8:25 AM, David McNeill wrote:
First flight was at 0600 this morning. Have one hour of recorded data from
the GRT Sport system to review, Used the Cheltons for the first time; very
easy to hand fly altitude and heading.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "David McNeill" <dlm46007(at)cox.net> |
| Subject: | Emailing: P3260023 |
My daughter was happy to see me on the ground after the first flight of
N46007.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | James Hein <n8vim(at)arrl.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Emailing: P3260023 |
So THAT'S where Santa goes during his off-season!
Either that, or Kenny Loggins likes to fly.
-Jim 40384
David McNeill wrote:
>
> My daughter was happy to see me on the ground after the first flight of
> N46007.
>
>
>
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Kelly McMullen" <apilot2(at)gmail.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Emailing: P3260023 |
Big Congratulations. Will have to come see your finished product
before long, or if CHD is in your test area, feel free to drop over.
On Thu, Apr 24, 2008 at 10:25 AM, David McNeill wrote:
>
> My daughter was happy to see me on the ground after the first flight of
> N46007.
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "David McNeill" <dlm46007(at)cox.net> |
| Subject: | Emailing: P3260023 |
CHD is in the test area; will advise when I plan a stop there.
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Kelly McMullen
Sent: Thursday, April 24, 2008 12:15 PM
Subject: Re: RV10-List: Emailing: P3260023
Big Congratulations. Will have to come see your finished product before
long, or if CHD is in your test area, feel free to drop over.
On Thu, Apr 24, 2008 at 10:25 AM, David McNeill wrote:
>
> My daughter was happy to see me on the ground after the first flight
> of N46007.
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | IO-540 arrived two months early- best way to move it? |
| From: | "tomhanaway" <tomhanaway(at)comcast.net> |
Got a bit of a surprise when the trucking company called from the front gate.
I ordered one of Van's Lycoming IO-540 special deals at Sun and Fun just two weeks
ago. Received a notice from Van's that it would arrive in mid-June.
WRONG.....
It's here today, literally 2 weeks later and I certainly hadn't expected it.
Right now the box, as delivered, is sitting in the side yard covered with a tarp.
Questions:
1. Could it just be left crated (long term storage already applied) and covered
with a waterproof tarp?
Eventually it has to be uncrated and moved down the side of my house over gravel.
I planned on laying down some 4'x8' plywood to make a pathway.
What's the best plan to move it?
Buy an engine crane from Harbor Freight or similar?
Rent a pallet jack?
Take it out of the crate, put it on a dolly and roll it back?
Any thoughts, comments or experience appreciated.
Tom Hanaway
Boynton Beach, FL
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=179045#179045
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "David McNeill" <dlm46007(at)cox.net> |
| Subject: | IO-540 arrived two months early- best way to move it? |
Buy or borrow an crane from Harbor freight you will need it again to hang
the engine . Alternatively buy a Home Depot refer dolly ; holds 1000 pounds,
move over plywood strip. Or you could ask 6 big friends to put the box on
some thick plastic and slide over gravel. Just don't leave it outside as
$35000 could "walk".
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of tomhanaway
Sent: Thursday, April 24, 2008 4:02 PM
Subject: RV10-List: IO-540 arrived two months early- best way to move it?
Got a bit of a surprise when the trucking company called from the front
gate. I ordered one of Van's Lycoming IO-540 special deals at Sun and Fun
just two weeks ago. Received a notice from Van's that it would arrive in
mid-June.
WRONG.....
It's here today, literally 2 weeks later and I certainly hadn't expected it.
Right now the box, as delivered, is sitting in the side yard covered with a
tarp.
Questions:
1. Could it just be left crated (long term storage already applied) and
covered with a waterproof tarp?
Eventually it has to be uncrated and moved down the side of my house over
gravel.
I planned on laying down some 4'x8' plywood to make a pathway.
What's the best plan to move it?
Buy an engine crane from Harbor Freight or similar?
Rent a pallet jack?
Take it out of the crate, put it on a dolly and roll it back?
Any thoughts, comments or experience appreciated.
Tom Hanaway
Boynton Beach, FL
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=179045#179045
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Fred Williams, M.D." <drfred(at)suddenlinkmail.com> |
| Subject: | I0 540 Arrived too early |
Tom;
I Left mine in the box and on the pallet. Jack it up enough and put
some big casters under the pallet. What I did was attach the casters to
a scrap 2x4, then attached the 2x4 under the ends of the pallet. Now
you have the engine in it's foam case, still covered and can roll it
anywhere you want.
By the way, what was that address where you live??
Dr Fred
40515
paneling is fun.
By the way to Tim O. Great write up the other day. You have a good way
of writing down what a lot of us are not able to express. Keep flying,
keep safe and keep pounding the rivets.
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: IO-540 arrived two months early- best way to move it? |
| From: | "orchidman" <gary(at)wingscc.com> |
I would suggest getting an Auto Engine hoist from HF or somewhere else. I got
a good deal at PepBoys. Use it to left the engine/pallet up so it can be placed
on some type of dolly. Most of the engine hoists that I have seen don't have
wheels that you can role very easily on anything but flat concrete. I would
hate to have it lifted up and trying to role the hoist with metal wheels and
hit a bump and it possibly tip on you. To much $$$ there to mess up.
Once you have the palet on some type of dolly with larger wheels you can role it
over your less than ideal surfaces to your final destination. As mentioned
before, you will need the hoist later when you attach the engine to the mount.
--------
Gary Blankenbiller
RV10 - # 40674
Fuselage SB
(N410GB reserved)
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=179074#179074
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: IO-540 arrived two months early- best way to move it? |
| From: | "AirMike" <Mikeabel(at)Pacbell.net> |
I moved mine onto a furniture dolly that I bought from HF. Moves around in my garage
real well. If I were moving it outside, I would put it on 2 of the HF dollies
($15-19) in the crate. Leave it in the crate as it protects the unit from
damage and rust or perforation of the visqueen covering. Use a jack or a couple
of strong guys to lift onto the dollies.
Boy is there any place to put it inside. I sure would not leave it outside.
Heck - I would even buy a shed.
Oh yea - watch those toes moving that heavy momma around. Could ruin your day
--------
OSH '08 or Bust
Q/B Kit - Ready to exit cabin top/door purgatory
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=179133#179133
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Perhaps a better fitting door when latched. |
| From: | "AirMike" <Mikeabel(at)Pacbell.net> |
Why are you not using the Rivethead door pins? Way better
--------
OSH '08 or Bust
Q/B Kit - Ready to exit cabin top/door purgatory
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=179136#179136
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Doerr, Ray R [NTK]" <Ray.R.Doerr(at)sprint.com> |
| Subject: | Rudder Stop Sheared Off |
During the process of getting my RV-10 ready for paint (Yes, I
know it's been 2 years) I discovered that my Rudder was hitting the aft ski
n of the Vertical Stab. After looking at it further, I notice one of my Ru
dder Stops that are riveted to the top hinge half of the bottom hinge was m
issing. The heads of the three AN470-4 rivets were still in the hinge half
. A simply touch and they popped right out.
Now I was thinking I was going to have to duplicate another sto
p and rivet it on, but the hinge halves are quiet close together. Then it
dawned on me that the Rudder stop may have fallen into the rudder bottom.
Sure enough, that is where it was. The 3 rivets that hold this to the hing
e were sheared off clean. The only thing I can think of is that when I was
in Florida, my Tow Bar on the Rudder Pedals had gotten loose and allow the
rudder to get slammed to the stop. No other damage found.
So I thought about this for a while and thought this could like
ly happen again if I don't change anything. So I decided to drill out the
rivets to #28 and use #6 steel screws with stopnuts for both rudder stops.
Hopefully the steel #6 screws will be much stronger in shear then the AN47
0-4 rivets.
Thank You
Ray Doerr
N519RV (40250) Currently down for Paint
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Tim Olson <Tim(at)MyRV10.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Rudder Stop Sheared Off |
Ray,
This has happened to more than one person in the past. The last
one was Scott Schmidt. He had some pretty high winds while
he was tied down in Vegas that broke his rudder lock, and his
rudder flapped and sheared the same rivets. I know I've heard
of one or two others, as well. In fact, I think for one person
it actually broke the rudder stop aluminum, but I'm not positive
about that. So adding screws might not hurt, but you still may
have the stop tabs break off.
Either way, make sure you have a really good rudder gust
lock:
http://www.myrv10.com/tips/accessories/control_locks/index.html
It may be that plastic won't do it for you, as depending on
the design, high winds could snap the plastic tubes. I
suppose if I wanted to toughen mine up, I could have glassed
over the PVC, or done some work with strong aluminum tubing.
Tim
Doerr, Ray R [NTK] wrote:
> During the process of getting my RV-10 ready for paint (Yes,
> I know its been 2 years) I discovered that my Rudder was hitting the
> aft skin of the Vertical Stab. After looking at it further, I notice
> one of my Rudder Stops that are riveted to the top hinge half of the
> bottom hinge was missing. The heads of the three AN470-4 rivets were
> still in the hinge half. A simply touch and they popped right out.
>
> Now I was thinking I was going to have to duplicate another
> stop and rivet it on, but the hinge halves are quiet close together.
> Then it dawned on me that the Rudder stop may have fallen into the
> rudder bottom. Sure enough, that is where it was. The 3 rivets that
> hold this to the hinge were sheared off clean. The only thing I can
> think of is that when I was in Florida, my Tow Bar on the Rudder Pedals
> had gotten loose and allow the rudder to get slammed to the stop. No
> other damage found.
>
> So I thought about this for a while and thought this could
> likely happen again if I dont change anything. So I decided to drill
> out the rivets to #28 and use #6 steel screws with stopnuts for both
> rudder stops. Hopefully the steel #6 screws will be much stronger in
> shear then the AN470-4 rivets.
>
>
>
> Thank You
> *Ray Doerr*
>
> *N519RV (40250) Currently down for Paint*
>
> *
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | John Gonzalez <indigoonlatigo(at)msn.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Perhaps a better fitting door when latched. |
Same reason I am not using dual Cheltons, aftermarket, custom made cabin to
p and fifteen thousand dollar, custom painted carbon prop and six bottom in
finity grips. To each there own. After all, it is a consumer driven society
.
Van's original design is good enough, but needs modification and the plans
in this section are not written very well, nothing I can't seem to use my h
ead to figure out.
The up grades for me need to stop someplace and I have chosen where they wi
ll be used and I am comfortable with what Van's has provided, it just needs
modification and correct installation...no door pins should have ever only
gone into the plastic blocks and not into the metal fuse members. No fiber
glass door should have ever been made so flimsy that it flexs in flight and
allows a pin to pull out.
Lastly, the lack of any of the above items are not going to prevent my plan
e from doing its' mission, the one real important thing that I need to reme
mber is that this is still a small plane in a big sky with atmospheric cond
ition that sometimes are not condussive to flight. On those days it stays o
n the ground.
A leason learned in boating thirty to forty miles offshore in a twenty foot
boat off the coast of Mexico and of course my cross country soaring. Don't
underestimate mother nature.
Yes, flying is like an addiction, but unlike an addiction, we don't need to
step into our aircrafts at the beginning of our flights with glazed over e
yes like zombies drawn to the gruel. That felling need to be reserved for a
fter the plane is back on the ground. It's called afterglow and indeed, it
can last for days and can even be rememberred years later.
This is a post to cover a couple I never weighed in on.
Elitist on his soapbox and now off.
JG.
> Subject: RV10-List: Re: Perhaps a better fitting door when latched.> From
: Mikeabel(at)Pacbell.net> Date: Fri, 25 Apr 2008 07:50:57 -0700> To: rv10-lis
bell.net>> > Why are you not using the Rivethead door pins? Way better> > -
-------> OSH '08 or Bust> Q/B Kit - Ready to exit cabin top/door purgatory>
> > > > Read this topic online here:> > http://forums.matronics.com/viewto
=============> > >
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Brian Douglas" <bsponcil(at)belinblank.org> |
| Subject: | Thielert Troubles |
I realize this isn't exactly RV-10 specific but I found it interesting
nonetheless. I wonder if they'll even have a tent at OSH this year...
http://www.aopa.org/aircraft/articles/2008/080424thielert.html
-Brian
#40497
Iowa City, IA
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "mark vultaggio" <mvultaggio(at)hotmail.com> |
I posted a question to the wrong list yesterday regarding the Geared
Drive system being offered with a corvette LS 1 engine by Bud Warren.
It was on display at Sun n Fun and seems interesting. Interested in any
comments by those with any experience. Look at the product at
http://www.geareddrives.com/
Mark
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Perry, Phil" <Phil.Perry(at)netapp.com> |
Hi Mark,
I'm not a big fan of alternative engines, but the LS1 (combined with
fuel prices) has opened my eyes.
I'm still not sure if I'll put the LS1 in there or not, but I do know
I'll at least consider it.
Bud and I are members of the same EAA chapter (302). He's a great
resource.
Like I said, I'm still undecided. But there is a lot to like about the
LS1 price, packaging, and options.
Phil
________________________________
From: mark vultaggio [mailto:mvultaggio(at)hotmail.com]
Sent: Saturday, April 26, 2008 1:25 PM
Subject: RV10-List:
I posted a question to the wrong list yesterday regarding the Geared
Drive system being offered with a corvette LS 1 engine by Bud Warren.
It was on display at Sun n Fun and seems interesting. Interested in any
comments by those with any experience. Look at the product at
http://www.geareddrives.com/
Mark
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: IO-540 arrived two months early- best way to move it? |
| From: | "tomhanaway" <tomhanaway(at)comcast.net> |
Thanks to all for the suggestions and humor.
I was just taken by surprise as normally I've had a chance to plan for each step.
Harbor freight (only 4 miles from my house) had a sale on the hoist of $147 and
approx $26 for the load leveler.
The engine is now sitting on a four-wheel dolly in the livingroom. VERY understanding
wife and a straight shot back to the sliding glass doors of the workshop
when it's time to put on:^)
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=179369#179369
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Matt Dralle <dralle(at)matronics.com> |
| Subject: | Four New Email Lists At Matronics!! |
Dear Listers,
I have added four new Lists to the Matronics line up today. These include the
following categories:
Citabria-List Citabria, Decathlon, Scout, and Champ
Zenith601-List Zenair Zodiac CH 601
Zenith640-List Zenair Zodiac CH 640
Zenith701801-List Zenair STOL CH 701 and CH 801
All services are enabled and now available including Search, Browse, Digest, Archives,
Forums, Chat, etc., etc. etc...:
Citabria:
http://www.matronics.com/navigator?citabria-list
Zenith601:
http://www.matronics.com/navigator?zenith601-list
Zenith640:
http://www.matronics.com/navigator?zenith640-list
Zenith701801:
http://www.matronics.com/navigator?zenith701801-list
To subscribe, go to the Matronics Email List Subscription Form:
http://www.matronics.com/subscribe
To check the new Lists out on the Matronics Forum go here:
http://forums.matronics.com
Enjoy the new Lists!! Don't forget me during the Fund Raiser! :-)
Best regards,
Matt Dralle
Matronics Email List Administrator
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "David McNeill" <dlm46007(at)cox.net> |
Could this LS1 presentation at Sun-n-Fun be the phoenix of the link.
http://www.vansairforce.com/community/showthread.php?p=4937
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "mark vultaggio" <mvultaggio(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | geared drive LS 1 engine |
Jesse,
Thanks for the comments. I spoke with Bud at length at Sun n Fun and
have some of the same sentiments as you. He is obviously a smart man
and very experienced. I have known many people who are very confident
to the point of cockiness. For some individuals, frustration,
repetition and some level of genius often do not make for good
salesmanship.
My "problem" with the whole project is represented that there are no
weak links or problems associated with the combination. I have been
around long enough to know that all things in life come with trade offs.
I have no problem dealing with potential weaknesses but would like to
know what they are up front. When questions were asked they seemed to
be partially answered and partially dismissed . I hope it is because
the product is truly that good and the number of weak links are few.
Time will tell.
Several people asked bud about rebuilds, time intervals and costs. At
approximately 5700.00 for a new crate engine, I would be inclined to run
it for a reasonable time (whatever that proves to be) and then just sell
the old engine to some hot rodder and buy a new one and get the piece of
mind of another new unit. I wish I was technically competent with
regard to aviation engines to know if the combination of the LS 1 engine
and his drive unit and clutch eliminate the balance, harmonic,
crankshaft loading issues that are present with aircraft. Certainly the
money spent on designing and testing the LS 1 engine for automotive use
was significant and the motor has proven itself for its original
intended use. The package fits nicely in the -10 cowl (with minor mod)
and the heating and air conditioning possibilities are nice bonuses.
Limiting the power to Vans rec's would be easy enough if there was data
available for the proper settings of the throttle. I wonder how
"waterproof" the electronics are in the a/c environment and what could
be done to add the necessary redundancies to put these up in the air
safely. I should have paid more attention in school.... I am a fan of
what Bud has done and very much want him to be a success. He is
impressive with all of his racing and aviation knowledge and I wish I
lived closer to Texas to keep tabs on his program
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Scott" <scott428(at)tds.net> |
Rudy-
After visiting the hangar this a.m., decided to first pursue the larger
windshield.
-The extended layer of DBM will make a "hump" on the inside.
-It will be difficult to recreate straight and curved joggle edges.
-The mess, both fibreglass goo and bondo dust...
-I really, really, really don't want to mess with more gel coat to
repair the new edges.
At least those are the highlights. Thanks for the suggestion, but will
save that as a back-up plan.
I did go on an information-gathering field trip this noon. Stopped into
a couple open hangars to inquire about the carb heat issue. Without
exception, everyone agreed with you that I don't want or need ram air in
this situation. So, you saved me from chopping another hole in the
baffling.
Too bad Young Eagles wasn't today -- awesome weather!
Thanks again!
-Scott
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Les Kearney <kearney(at)shaw.ca> |
| Subject: | Section 40 Question - Flaps |
Hi
I thought I'd throw a building question into the mix.
I have just installed the flap tubes per the plans. My question is how
freely should they rotate? They seem a bit stiff and I can hear a bit of a
rubbing sound as they move in the nylon blocks. It may also be that the
center horn is rubbing a bit on the center tunnel walls.
Any comments form those who have gone before?
Inquiring minds need to know
Les
#40643
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Rick Sked <ricksked(at)embarqmail.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Section 40 Question - Flaps |
Les,
I had the same thing, I think it mainly has to do with the close tolerance
the tube has in the nylon block and the small amount of misalignment that o
ccurs across the sets of blocks. Try lossening the bolts and tighten slowly
while moving the flap tube alternating from block to block. It does get be
tter as you move the tube more and more.
Rick Sked
40185
----- Original Message -----
From: "Les Kearney" <kearney(at)shaw.ca>
Sent: Sunday, April 27, 2008 4:38:03 PM (GMT-0800) America/Los_Angeles
Subject: RV10-List: Section 40 Question - =C2-Flaps
Hi
I thought I=99d throw a building question into the mix.
I have just installed the flap tubes per the plans. My question is how free
ly should they rotate? They seem a bit stiff and I can hear a bit of a rubb
ing sound as they move in the nylon blocks. It may also be that the center
horn is rubbing a bit on the center tunnel walls.
Any comments form those who have gone before?
Inquiring minds need to know
Les
============
====
=======================
==
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Section 40 Question - Flaps |
| From: | "Lew Gallagher" <lewgall(at)charter.net> |
Hey Les,
It's been awhile back, but I remember this same problem on our quick build fuse.
I hadn't read anything about it, didn't like it, didn't ask anybody, and just
enlarged the aluminum so that the flap tubes only touch nylon. Smooth as
silk now.
Later, - Lew
--------
non-pilot
crazy about building
NOW OFICIALLY BUILDER #40549
doors almost finished, pants on, WHEW!
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=179704#179704
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Rene" <rene(at)felker.com> |
| Subject: | Section 40 Question - Flaps |
Mine were very tight also. Since they did move I just kept building. Once
I got the flap motor in and they worked, I figured they were ok. Working
fine after 30 hours.
Rene'
N423CF RV10 Flying
801-721-6080
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Les Kearney
Sent: Sunday, April 27, 2008 5:38 PM
Subject: RV10-List: Section 40 Question - Flaps
Hi
I thought I'd throw a building question into the mix.
I have just installed the flap tubes per the plans. My question is how
freely should they rotate? They seem a bit stiff and I can hear a bit of a
rubbing sound as they move in the nylon blocks. It may also be that the
center horn is rubbing a bit on the center tunnel walls.
Any comments form those who have gone before?
Inquiring minds need to know
Les
#40643
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: It's another girl! |
| From: | "Andy Turner" <aturner(at)clarion.edu> |
Well, as long as we are on the baby topic - My wife Sharon gave birth April 2 to
twin boys, Joshua and Caleb. We couldn't be happier. And, bringing it back to
airplanes, the deciding factor in beginning the RV-10 last winter was knowing
that in a few years we would be needing an airplane with significant load hauling
capability!
--------
Andy Turner
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=179859#179859
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: It's another girl! |
| From: | pilotdds(at)aol.com |
The support gear required for two infants will tax the load carrying capabilities
of even the rv-10.Welcome to the world of airplane carseats and tiny headsets!
728DD-27 mos
-----Original Message-----????????????????????????????????? Katherine Scarlet Rore--17
mos
From: Andy Turner <aturner(at)clarion.edu>
Sent: Mon, 28 Apr 2008 11:00 am
Subject: RV10-List: Re: It's another girl!
Well, as long as we are on the baby topic - My wife Sharon gave birth April 2 to
twin boys, Joshua and Caleb. We couldn't be happier. And, bringing it back to
airplanes, the deciding factor in beginning the RV-10 last winter was knowing
that in a few years we would be needing an airplane with significant load
hauling capability!
--------
Andy Turner
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=179859#179859
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Eric Panning <ericmpmail-rv10(at)yahoo.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Thielert Troubles |
I wonder how this will impact superior engines, since they are a subsidiary of Thielert. http://www.superiorengines.com/
Will be interesting to see what Deltahawk is up to. Perhaps opportunity again for
UAV market with Thielert problems?
ECI has been quiet about IO-540 plans. For those looking for options, there is UQM technologies and their powerphase 150 motor. http://www.uqm.com/products/specsheet.html. Downside is continuous power restrictions would get you only ~ 110 HP and current state of the art battery (LiON, including M3, etc) would keep you in the air for ~ 10-20 mins. Then it would be really quiet! :)
Eric
----- Original Message ----
From: Brian Douglas <bsponcil(at)belinblank.org>
Sent: Friday, April 25, 2008 1:04:02 PM
Subject: RV10-List: Thielert Troubles
I realize this isn't exactly RV-10 specific but I found it interesting nonetheless.
I wonder if they'll even have a tent at OSH this year...
http://www.aopa.org/aircraft/articles/2008/080424thielert.html
-Brian
#40497
Iowa City, IA
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | GRANSCOTT(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Thielert Troubles |
In a message dated 4/28/2008 2:51:23 PM Central Daylight Time,
ericmpmail-rv10(at)yahoo.com writes:
I wonder how this will impact superior engines, since they are a subsidiary
of Thielert. _http://www.superiorengines.com/_
(http://www.superiorengines.com/)
"Superior engines...Inferior financing"....
**************Need a new ride? Check out the largest site for U.S. used car
listings at AOL Autos.
(http://autos.aol.com/used?NCID=aolcmp00300000002851)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | GRANSCOTT(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Thielert Troubles |
In a message dated 4/28/2008 2:51:23 PM Central Daylight Time,
ericmpmail-rv10(at)yahoo.com writes:
Will be interesting to see what Deltahawk is up to.
Are they still tied up with the DOD on their programs?
**************Need a new ride? Check out the largest site for U.S. used car
listings at AOL Autos.
(http://autos.aol.com/used?NCID=aolcmp00300000002851)
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Spins in a -10? |
| From: | "John Kirkland" <jskirkland(at)webpipe.net> |
Vans also spin tested one of their factory birds, with a spin chute. Write up is
on their website under the RV-10 specific information. They too lived to tell
the tale.
--------
RV-10 #40333
N540XP (reserved)
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=179918#179918
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | It's another girl! |
| From: | "Patrick Pulis" <patrick.pulis(at)seagas.com.au> |
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "David McNeill" <dlm46007(at)cox.net> |
What flap extension speeds are being used? I see the full flap extension
maximum speed is 85 kts. I have flown the 10 like my old C177RG. Approach
flaps at 120 kts to begin slowing and further deployment at speeds below 90
kts indicated. Seems to work as an approach flap of 10 degrees begins the
slowing process and no excessive forces seem to be experienced. What are
others doing?
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Spins in a -10? |
| From: | "johngoodman" <johngoodman(at)earthlink.net> |
For a brief period I instructed spins in the Navy. Quite frankly, it's like practicing
to bleed. Stall recovery training and avoidance of icing is what you need
to know.
If you are morbidly curious about what would happen, have you thought about spins
in a 747?
John
--------
#40572 QB Fuselage, wings finished
N711JG reserved
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=179994#179994
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Neil & Sarah Colliver <ncol(at)xtra.co.nz> |
| Subject: | What is Vans working on now? |
With all the talk of more babies (congratulations Jesse & co), and now
that the RV12 is completed, can anyone tell us what Vans design team
is working on now?
Will the RV14 be a high speed, 2 seat jet, or will it be an extended,
6 seat IO550 RV10+2 = RV14?, or even better from my point of view, a
VTOL 6 seat jet??
Or how about underwing baby pods for the RV10???
Neil
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "jim berry" <jimberry(at)qwest.net> |
To all those flying with sun visors, is there a brand you are happy or unhappy
with? Any recommendations for mounting or a different size? Thanks.
Jim Berry
40482
Finished with fiberglass
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=180018#180018
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Riveting Question |
| From: | "Jon Reining" <jonathan.w.reining(at)wellsfargo.com> |
I was cruising through channels last night and saw something on the Discovery Channel
that showed an airplane manufacturer riveting wings.
They used a piece of masking tape over the head of their rivet gun. Why? Is it
the "feel"? Does it make it more "non-slip"? Is it standard practice for everybody
else in the world?
Jon Reining (with dad Bill)
40514 - we'll finish off the wings some day
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=180015#180015
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Riveting Question |
| From: | "jim berry" <jimberry(at)qwest.net> |
Jon
It reduces scratching. One piece of tape is good for only a few rivets before it
wears through.
Jim Berry
40482
Finished with all fiberglass last week !
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=180017#180017
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "John Lenhardt" <av8or(at)cox.net> |
| Subject: | Re: What is Vans working on now? |
I'd like to see them finish the RV-11 motorglider.
John
#40262
----- Original Message -----
From: Neil & Sarah Colliver
To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com
Sent: Monday, April 28, 2008 11:52 PM
Subject: RV10-List: What is Vans working on now?
With all the talk of more babies (congratulations Jesse & co), and now
that the RV12 is completed, can anyone tell us what Vans design team
is working on now?
Will the RV14 be a high speed, 2 seat jet, or will it be an extended,
6 seat IO550 RV10+2 = RV14?, or even better from my point of view, a
VTOL 6 seat jet??
Or how about underwing baby pods for the RV10???
Neil
--
Checked by AVG.
4/28/2008 1:29 PM
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | What is Vans working on now? |
| From: | John Jessen <n212pj(at)gmail.com> |
I think it's called retirement.
Given the decrease in the flying GA population, it may be called
retrenchment.
Of course, free market types might figure that there needs to be more
innovation at Vans, not less. How about putting more ribs in the forward
part of the HS for safety and the ability to withstand bird and the
occasional, inevitable door strike. Or, how about a door that actually
makes sense from a safety perspective. If a door is designed to be shed in
flight when accidentally not closed, then maybe it's an innovation that
enables the door to break away freely, soaring up and over the empennage.
Perhaps little wings that pop out, creating the necessary, rapid lifting
force. Or, if that's too difficult an engineering feat, maybe it's a door
that, if not secured properly, actually cannot be ripped off, as the rest of
the light airplane world has. Gee, that'd be a piece of OBVIOUS
engineering.
Sorry, but the more I think about this door thing, the more I cannot believe
it actually was allowed to go to market.
John Jessen
40328
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Neil & Sarah
Colliver
Sent: Monday, April 28, 2008 8:53 PM
Subject: RV10-List: What is Vans working on now?
With all the talk of more babies (congratulations Jesse & co), and now that
the RV12 is completed, can anyone tell us what Vans design team is working
on now?
Will the RV14 be a high speed, 2 seat jet, or will it be an extended,
6 seat IO550 RV10+2 = RV14?, or even better from my point of view, a VTOL 6
seat jet??
Or how about underwing baby pods for the RV10???
Neil
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | JSMcGrew(at)aol.com |
I asked Van's for clarification regarding the 2 degree flap setting. I was
told that it does not have a speed limitation on it. I put the flaps to that
position as I am entering the pattern or rolling out on final during an
approach.
As for the first and second real notches of flaps, I slow to below 87 kts
before extending the flaps per Van's recommendations. I'm sure that there is a
reason for that limitation.
-Jim
N312JE
In a message dated 4/28/2008 11:03:33 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time,
dlm46007(at)cox.net writes:
What flap extension speeds are being used? I see the full flap extension
maximum speed is 85 kts. I have flown the 10 like my old C177RG. Approach flaps
at 120 kts to begin slowing and further deployment at speeds below 90 kts
indicated. Seems to work as an approach flap of 10 degrees begins the slowing
process and no excessive forces seem to be experienced. What are others doing?
(http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List)
(http://www.matronics.com/contribution)
**************Need a new ride? Check out the largest site for U.S. used car
listings at AOL Autos.
(http://autos.aol.com/used?NCID=aolcmp00300000002851)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Scott Schmidt <scottmschmidt(at)yahoo.com> |
Does anyone have a .pdf that Van's supplies with the finishing kit describing the
first flight as well as flap speeds?
For me, it is 120 knots for the first, then below 90 knots for everything else.
Typically it is 85 knots for the second notch, then 80 for the third.
Scott Schmidt
scottmschmidt(at)yahoo.com
----- Original Message ----
From: "JSMcGrew(at)aol.com" <JSMcGrew(at)aol.com>
Sent: Tuesday, April 29, 2008 1:58:28 PM
Subject: Re: RV10-List: flap speeds
I asked Van's for clarification regarding the 2 degree flap setting. I was
told that it does not have a speed limitation on it. I put the flaps to
that position as I am entering the pattern or rolling out on final during
an approach.
As for the first and second real notches of flaps, I slow to below
87 kts before extending the flaps per Van's recommendations. I'm sure that
there is a reason for that limitation.
-Jim
N312JE
In a message dated 4/28/2008 11:03:33 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time,
dlm46007(at)cox.net writes:
What flap extension speeds are being used? I see the full flap extension maximum
speed is 85 kts. I have flown the 10 like my old C177RG. Approach flaps at
120 kts to begin slowing and further deployment at speeds below 90 kts indicated.
Seems to work as an approach flap of 10 degrees begins the slowing process
and no excessive forces seem to be experienced. What are others doing?
="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List
.matronics.com/">http://forums.matronics.com
://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/contribution
________________________________
Need a new ride? Check out the largest site for U.S. used car listings at AOL Autos.
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Riveting Question |
| From: | John Jessen <n212pj(at)gmail.com> |
Protects the skin a little from banging marks; might also keep it from
slipping. Works fine.
John J
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Jon Reining
Sent: Tuesday, April 29, 2008 8:36 AM
Subject: RV10-List: Riveting Question
-->
I was cruising through channels last night and saw something on the
Discovery Channel that showed an airplane manufacturer riveting wings.
They used a piece of masking tape over the head of their rivet gun. Why?
Is it the "feel"? Does it make it more "non-slip"? Is it standard practice
for everybody else in the world?
Jon Reining (with dad Bill)
40514 - we'll finish off the wings some day
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=180015#180015
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Fred Williams, M.D." <drfred(at)suddenlinkmail.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Riveting Question |
Jon;
I also used just regular scotch tape. I used it on the factory head
side to hold the rivets in instead of rivet tape. Just fold over a edge
so you can easily get it back off. Works just as good as the expensive
rivet tape. Helps keep the scratches off the aluminum. Also, I used to
polish the head of the rivet set on the scotch brite wheel. It also
helps to cut down on scratches/poc marks.
Fred Williams
40515.
90% finishing rule applies.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Carl Froehlich" <carl.froehlich(at)cox.net> |
| Subject: | Riveting Question |
It also ends "smilies" on round head rivets. I find clear packaging tape to
work best for both standard and flush rivet sets. Masking tape work for
standard rivets but needs to be changed out more often.
Carl Froehlich
RV-8A (400 hrs)
RV-10 (wings)
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of John Jessen
Sent: Tuesday, April 29, 2008 5:43 PM
Subject: RE: RV10-List: Riveting Question
Protects the skin a little from banging marks; might also keep it from
slipping. Works fine.
John J
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Jon Reining
Sent: Tuesday, April 29, 2008 8:36 AM
Subject: RV10-List: Riveting Question
-->
I was cruising through channels last night and saw something on the
Discovery Channel that showed an airplane manufacturer riveting wings.
They used a piece of masking tape over the head of their rivet gun. Why?
Is it the "feel"? Does it make it more "non-slip"? Is it standard practice
for everybody else in the world?
Jon Reining (with dad Bill)
40514 - we'll finish off the wings some day
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=180015#180015
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "David McNeill" <dlm46007(at)cox.net> |
Just a couple of tips for phase 1 testing. Select an area where there are
plentiful off airport landing sites just in case; but most important select
an area with cheaper fuel. my choices were to go north or south out of
Phoenix. I chose south for both landing sites and fuel prices. I find myself
refueling each day after 1-2 hours of flying for $100 +. Its also advisable
to buy two cases of mineral oil for break-in; I just started using the
second case. Also get your DAR to widen your fly off area if possible.
driving back and forth across the area to maintain high power during
break-in puts you at the boundary edge quickly. Fortunately to this point,
the only known discrepancy is the prop governor is set too low; although
take off MP is 28, maximum RPM is about 2520 so governor needs an
adjustment. One other tip; the angle of the cowl is very steep; therefore
what appears to be the view for level flight in the 10 seems like a very
nose low attitude. This aircraft does not fly like other aircraft where the
climb attitude view is nose slightly above the horizon; this one is
decidedly nose low. Once I looked outside and concluded that I must be
descending at a good rate but when checking the PFD, the aircraft had
descended very little. When landing, look at the opposite end of the runway
and look for things to get flat. Also be ready for the acceleration on take
off along with the left turning tendency. Its like flooring your muscle car
for the 0-60 ride. Much faster and stronger than any certified aircraft I
have flown. Just some initial observations.
9 hours and 15 landings
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "John Cox" <johnwcox(at)pacificnw.com> |
Excellent and valuable information.
Thanks Dave and gentle breezes as you land to refuel.
John C.
From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of David McNeill
Sent: Tuesday, April 29, 2008 5:07 PM
Subject: RV10-List: phase 1 testing
Just a couple of tips for phase 1 testing. Select an area where there
are plentiful off airport landing sites just in case; but most important
select an area with cheaper fuel. my choices were to go north or south
out of Phoenix. I chose south for both landing sites and fuel prices. I
find myself refueling each day after 1-2 hours of flying for $100 +. Its
also advisable to buy two cases of mineral oil for break-in; I just
started using the second case. Also get your DAR to widen your fly off
area if possible. driving back and forth across the area to maintain
high power during break-in puts you at the boundary edge quickly.
Fortunately to this point, the only known discrepancy is the prop
governor is set too low; although take off MP is 28, maximum RPM is
about 2520 so governor needs an adjustment. One other tip; the angle of
the cowl is very steep; therefore what appears to be the view for level
flight in the 10 seems like a very nose low attitude. This aircraft does
not fly like other aircraft where the climb attitude view is nose
slightly above the horizon; this one is decidedly nose low. Once I
looked outside and concluded that I must be descending at a good rate
but when checking the PFD, the aircraft had descended very little. When
landing, look at the opposite end of the runway and look for things to
get flat. Also be ready for the acceleration on take off along with the
left turning tendency. Its like flooring your muscle car for the 0-60
ride. Much faster and stronger than any certified aircraft I have flown.
Just some initial observations.
9 hours and 15 landings
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jim & Julie Wade" <jwade2163(at)bellsouth.net> |
Love my Rosen's!! Don't know how I flew without them. Had to where a hat all the
time. Or use stickon shades.
Jim
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=180222#180222
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: What is Vans working on now? |
| From: | "johngoodman" <johngoodman(at)earthlink.net> |
ncol(at)xtra.co.nz wrote:
> With all the talk of more babies (congratulations Jesse & co), and now
> that the RV12 is completed, can anyone tell us what Vans design team
> is working on now?
>
> Will the RV14 be a high speed, 2 seat jet, or will it be an extended,
> 6 seat IO550 RV10+2 = RV14?, or even better from my point of view, a
> VTOL 6 seat jet??
>
> Or how about underwing baby pods for the RV10???
>
>
> Neil
The number that comes after 12 is 13, not 14.... [Wink]
--------
#40572 QB Fuselage, wings finished
N711JG reserved
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=180256#180256
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: What is Vans working on now? |
| From: | "Jon Reining" <jonathan.w.reining(at)wellsfargo.com> |
What ever happened to the RV5?
Where the RV1 and RV2 the original pitts and van's original modification?
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=180316#180316
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: What is Vans working on now? |
| From: | "Perry, Phil" <Phil.Perry(at)netapp.com> |
Funny you should ask. I looked at RV-1 about 10 days ago.
RV-1 is located at Dunham Field, just NE of Houston and was the
prototype RV built by Dick Vangrunsven.
Oddly enough it's a fabric airplane with a little aluminum mixed in as
well. :)
She is not airworthy, but I'm sure the owner has plans to rebuild her
sometime in the future.
These photos are not mine, but they are Paul Dye's. Next time I'm out
there, I can snap a few of my own if you'd like to see more.
Phil
-----Original Message-----
From: Jon Reining [mailto:jonathan.w.reining(at)wellsfargo.com]
Sent: Wednesday, April 30, 2008 1:12 PM
Subject: RV10-List: Re: What is Vans working on now?
-->
What ever happened to the RV5?
Where the RV1 and RV2 the original pitts and van's original
modification?
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=180316#180316
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Brian Douglas" <bsponcil(at)belinblank.org> |
| Subject: | Pre-OSH Pool Party |
For those of you planning to fly at odd altitudes to OSH, you might
consider stopping by KIOW. A friend of mine owns a hotel adjacent to
the airport and he hosts a pre-OSH party every year. Free food, free
drink, etc etc. Last year there were quite a few RVs and even a couple
of -10s in attendance. Anyway, he asked that I post this to the list:
http://www.alexisparkinn.com/iowa_city_pool_party.htm
-Brian
#40497
Iowa City, IA
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: What is Vans working on now? |
| From: | "Perry, Phil" <Phil.Perry(at)netapp.com> |
Here's a few more notes I found on VAF regarding the airplane.
It was ground looped in a stiff crosswind a year or two ago. (Dunham
Field is an East/West Runway with a couple of large holes in the trees
to funnel the winds. Not a good combination in SE Texas.)
Damage was sustained to the main landing gear, cowling, and belly skin.
Mixed into that was a prop-strike.
Van apparently created an experimental prop from a Sensnich that was cut
down and severely re-pitched. Apparently they can't get a prop-shop to
touch it, so they're looking for alternatives.
So it sounds like they've got some real intentions to make her fly
again.
Phil
-----Original Message-----
From: Perry, Phil
Sent: Wednesday, April 30, 2008 2:06 PM
Subject: RE: RV10-List: Re: What is Vans working on now?
Funny you should ask. I looked at RV-1 about 10 days ago.
RV-1 is located at Dunham Field, just NE of Houston and was the
prototype RV built by Dick Vangrunsven.
Oddly enough it's a fabric airplane with a little aluminum mixed in as
well. :)
She is not airworthy, but I'm sure the owner has plans to rebuild her
sometime in the future.
These photos are not mine, but they are Paul Dye's. Next time I'm out
there, I can snap a few of my own if you'd like to see more.
Phil
-----Original Message-----
From: Jon Reining [mailto:jonathan.w.reining(at)wellsfargo.com]
Sent: Wednesday, April 30, 2008 1:12 PM
Subject: RV10-List: Re: What is Vans working on now?
-->
What ever happened to the RV5?
Where the RV1 and RV2 the original pitts and van's original
modification?
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=180316#180316
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | <rv(at)thelefflers.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Pre-OSH Pool Party |
As another Cherokee owner and member of CPA, I can state that Jay has a great aviation
themed hotel. He also hosts an event in the North Forty as well.
>
> From: "Brian Douglas" <bsponcil(at)belinblank.org>
> Date: 2008/04/30 Wed PM 02:09:56 EST
> To:
> Subject: RV10-List: Pre-OSH Pool Party
>
> For those of you planning to fly at odd altitudes to OSH, you might consider
stopping by KIOW. A friend of mine owns a hotel adjacent to the airport and he
hosts a pre-OSH party every year. Free food, free drink, etc etc. Last year
there were quite a few RVs and even a couple of -10s in attendance. Anyway,
he asked that I post this to the list:
>
> http://www.alexisparkinn.com/iowa_city_pool_party.htm
>
>
> -Brian
>
> #40497
> Iowa City, IA
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "RV Builder (Michael Sausen)" <rvbuilder(at)sausen.net> |
| Subject: | Autocad format RV-10 line drawings? |
Anyone have line drawings of the RV-10 in AutoCAD? My buddy I'm working with on
the paint scheme was wondering if he could get some in that format. I already
gave him the regular jpg versions that are out there.
Michael
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of johngoodman
Sent: Wednesday, April 30, 2008 9:57 AM
Subject: RV10-List: Re: What is Vans working on now?
ncol(at)xtra.co.nz wrote:
> With all the talk of more babies (congratulations Jesse & co), and now
> that the RV12 is completed, can anyone tell us what Vans design team
> is working on now?
>
> Will the RV14 be a high speed, 2 seat jet, or will it be an extended,
> 6 seat IO550 RV10+2 = RV14?, or even better from my point of view, a
> VTOL 6 seat jet??
>
> Or how about underwing baby pods for the RV10???
>
>
> Neil
The number that comes after 12 is 13, not 14.... [Wink]
--------
#40572 QB Fuselage, wings finished
N711JG reserved
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=180256#180256
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Compliments to customer service at Lycoming-Skytech starter |
| From: | "tomhanaway" <tomhanaway(at)comcast.net> |
Recently some discussion went on about the Skytech starter and IO-540's.
I am also aware of some history of Lycoming service issues.
I previously wrote:
"Ok, I've got a dog in this fight since I just ordered an IO-540 from Van's as
part of their promotion.
The Van's Lycoming engine comes with the LS starter on the crated engine. Since
it's part of the OEM contract with Van's, it can't be changed. If you're ordering
from an after market builder, you can specify the NL.
I then spoke to the tech at Sky-Tech. The LS has a higher current draw than the
NL and may not turn over the engine IF you've done a shoddy wiring job. The NL
is recommended for that reason.
As to kickback, that can happen depending on settings of a magneto. In my case,
I plan to go with PMags for both. Skytech advised that they worked specifically
with the PMag system guys to ensure that a kickback won't happen.
Bottom line-Skytech changed the recommendation from LS to NL based on several engines
having slow turnover due to restrictive wiring or low battery power.
So I'll stay with the LS unless I do have a problem. If I was starting from scratch
on the engine, I'd get the NL.
Subsequently, based on my phone call to Lycoming and Lycoming's follow up discussions
with Skytech, Lycoming sent me a new Skytech NL starter at no additional
charge, asking only that I return the unused LS starter to them.
Thank you.
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=180539#180539
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | linn Walters <pitts_pilot(at)bellsouth.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Compliments to customer service at Lycoming-Skytech starter |
tomhanaway wrote:
>
>Recently some discussion went on about the Skytech starter and IO-540's.
>I am also aware of some history of Lycoming service issues.
>
>
>
SNIP
>Subsequently, based on my phone call to Lycoming and Lycoming's follow up discussions
with Skytech, Lycoming sent me a new Skytech NL starter at no additional
charge, asking only that I return the unused LS starter to them.
>Thank you.
>
Would you share the contact info with Lycoming??? I know Vans has sold
a whole lot of engines during their SNF sale ..... mine too ...... and
there'll be a whole lot of folks looking to do the trade.
Linn
>
>
>Read this topic online here:
>
>http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=180539#180539
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "David McNeill" <dlm46007(at)cox.net> |
| Subject: | Compliments to customer service at Lycoming-Skytech starter |
On my Vans certified IO540 the first touch of the starter relay only moves
it about a half a blade; but the second try spins it like a top. Same
problem and same solution for the Glastar as well. I am using Odyssey 680s.
Wire 002 crimped and soldered.
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of tomhanaway
Sent: Thursday, May 01, 2008 12:20 PM
Subject: RV10-List: Compliments to customer service at Lycoming-Skytech
starter
Recently some discussion went on about the Skytech starter and IO-540's.
I am also aware of some history of Lycoming service issues.
I previously wrote:
"Ok, I've got a dog in this fight since I just ordered an IO-540 from Van's
as part of their promotion.
The Van's Lycoming engine comes with the LS starter on the crated engine.
Since it's part of the OEM contract with Van's, it can't be changed. If
you're ordering from an after market builder, you can specify the NL.
I then spoke to the tech at Sky-Tech. The LS has a higher current draw than
the NL and may not turn over the engine IF you've done a shoddy wiring job.
The NL is recommended for that reason.
As to kickback, that can happen depending on settings of a magneto. In my
case, I plan to go with PMags for both. Skytech advised that they worked
specifically with the PMag system guys to ensure that a kickback won't
happen.
Bottom line-Skytech changed the recommendation from LS to NL based on
several engines having slow turnover due to restrictive wiring or low
battery power.
So I'll stay with the LS unless I do have a problem. If I was starting from
scratch on the engine, I'd get the NL.
Subsequently, based on my phone call to Lycoming and Lycoming's follow up
discussions with Skytech, Lycoming sent me a new Skytech NL starter at no
additional charge, asking only that I return the unused LS starter to them.
Thank you.
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=180539#180539
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "David McNeill" <dlm46007(at)cox.net> |
Now at 12.4 hours and 21 landings including some gusting crosswinds. Oil
consumption is beginning to stabilize. Of the 13 quarts poured into the
engine at this point nine are still showing on the oil stick. considering
the oil filter , this is a consumption of 3-4 quarts during this past week
of flying. During the last two days of flights, consumption has been about
half a quart (over 3.5 flight hours). CHTs with full rich mixture have been
340-360 for cylinders 2,3,4,5. CHT for 6 is 360-390. and cylinder 1 has been
as high as 433 for a short period during the climb. It then settled 395-405.
Recently the temperatures have not stayed as high as long and I have been
able to lean fuel flow so that EGTs are approx 1350F. Full rich EGTs will be
approx. 1200+. Considerable right rudder required during takeoff and climb.
Some still required at cruise. After phase I , I will place a fixed tab on
the rudder to compensate during cruise. At this point , I don't' know
whether rudder trim would be worthwhile. I plan to re evaluate after
painting and rebalancing of the ailerons. (My Glastar had a distinct desire
to turn right as speed increased but after painting and a balancing of the
ailerons to the nearest gram the tendency went away). The digiflie II
autopilot works fine with Cheltons in the basic GPSS track mode with
altitude hold. It does not work with VNAV at all. I am told I need the 2.24
software versus the 2.2 that I have installed. I will get that during paint.
On the other hand instrument approaches with the VNAV and HITS are very easy
to hand fly. A series of skyway boxes take the pilot through the
intermediate fixes and to the missed approach point. If a miss is necessary
the boxes lead the way back to the missed approach hold. Next on the agenda
is some slow flight and stall to see how slow we can reasonably fly this
thing on landings. On Alex's advice I started at 80 kts on final and have
worked down to 70-75 on short final. I noticed that today the Chelton
indicated just under 60 kts about the time of touchdown. Be advised also
that the low wing provides a good ground effect and any excess speed will
use lots of runway. If your initial test runway is less than 3000 feet you
might want to consider first flight elsewhere; additionally fire rescue, if
needed, would be nice. FFZ has 5200 feet paved and onsite fire rescue;
thankfully they were not needed. One other thing, the fuel caps as supplied
by Van's QB had a little residue on one of them ; also a little nick , at
any rate after filling the tank a small venting of fuel occurs after
takeoff. It tends to go away at cruise. I have switched sides for the caps
to determine whether the problem follows the cap. More later.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "lbgjb10" <lbgjb(at)gnt.net> |
Anyone use anything different than Vans Engine mounts--ie Lord mounts??
thanks larry
--------
Larry and Gayle N104LG
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=180582#180582
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Randy DeBauw" <Randy(at)abros.com> |
Scott take a look at my airspeed indicator from vans for the 10. It
shows the speeds you are looking for. Randy 40006
http://www.myrv10.com/N610RV/20050328/DSCN4452.html
________________________________
From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Scott Schmidt
Sent: Tuesday, April 29, 2008 2:37 PM
Subject: [SPAM?] Re: RV10-List: flap speeds
Importance: Low
Does anyone have a .pdf that Van's supplies with the finishing kit
describing the first flight as well as flap speeds?
For me, it is 120 knots for the first, then below 90 knots for
everything else.
Typically it is 85 knots for the second notch, then 80 for the third.
Scott Schmidt
scottmschmidt(at)yahoo.com
----- Original Message ----
From: "JSMcGrew(at)aol.com" <JSMcGrew(at)aol.com>
Sent: Tuesday, April 29, 2008 1:58:28 PM
Subject: Re: RV10-List: flap speeds
I asked Van's for clarification regarding the 2 degree flap setting. I
was told that it does not have a speed limitation on it. I put the flaps
to that position as I am entering the pattern or rolling out on final
during an approach.
As for the first and second real notches of flaps, I slow to below 87
kts before extending the flaps per Van's recommendations. I'm sure that
there is a reason for that limitation.
-Jim
N312JE
In a message dated 4/28/2008 11:03:33 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time,
dlm46007(at)cox.net writes:
What flap extension speeds are being used? I see the full flap
extension maximum speed is 85 kts. I have flown the 10 like my old
C177RG. Approach flaps at 120 kts to begin slowing and further
deployment at speeds below 90 kts indicated. Seems to work as an
approach flap of 10 degrees begins the slowing process and no excessive
forces seem to be experienced. What are others doing?
="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List">http://www.matronics.co
m
/Navigator?RV10-List
.matronics.com/">http://forums.matronics.com
://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/contribution
________________________________
Need a new ride? Check out the largest site for U.S. used car listings
at AOL Autos <http://autos.aol.com/used?NCID=aolcmp00300000002851> .
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Larry Rosen <LarryRosen(at)comcast.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Autocad format RV-10 line drawings? |
You can get it from Van's web site.
<http://www.vansaircraft.com/public/downloads.htm>
Larry Rosen
RV Builder (Michael Sausen) wrote:
>
> Anyone have line drawings of the RV-10 in AutoCAD? My buddy I'm working with
on the paint scheme was wondering if he could get some in that format. I already
gave him the regular jpg versions that are out there.
>
> Michael
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of johngoodman
> Sent: Wednesday, April 30, 2008 9:57 AM
> To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com
> Subject: RV10-List: Re: What is Vans working on now?
>
>
> ncol(at)xtra.co.nz wrote:
>
>> With all the talk of more babies (congratulations Jesse & co), and now
>> that the RV12 is completed, can anyone tell us what Vans design team
>> is working on now?
>>
>> Will the RV14 be a high speed, 2 seat jet, or will it be an extended,
>> 6 seat IO550 RV10+2 = RV14?, or even better from my point of view, a
>> VTOL 6 seat jet??
>>
>> Or how about underwing baby pods for the RV10???
>>
>>
>> Neil
>>
>
>
> The number that comes after 12 is 13, not 14.... [Wink]
>
> --------
> #40572 QB Fuselage, wings finished
> N711JG reserved
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=180256#180256
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Phase 1 update |
| From: | "jim berry" <jimberry(at)qwest.net> |
Damon,
Ten quarts seems high for an IO540. Dose that include what went to your inverted
oil system?
Jim Berry
40482
25 years in a Pitts S1S
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=180619#180619
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Richard Sipp" <rsipp(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Phase 1 update |
10 Builders, David
We are at similar stages of test flying. I have about 8 hours now,
also with Cheltons. I am using 6.0B and a Trutrak Digiflight II with
GPS lateral and vertical steering.
I have seen nearly identical airframe numbers that you and others have
reported and really enjoy the low speed handling qualities. We've done
multiple stalls in all configs and lots of slow flight. With the cg at
about 20% of the range it is difficult to get a stall break with full
flaps. The indicated stall airspeeds are within a couple of knots of
Van's numbers. For initial test flying at what will probably be forward
cgs, 50 flap landings are more comfortable than full flap. The launch on
takeoff (1620 lbs bow, no interior or paint, 50 lbs of ballast in bag
compartment) is fun too.
I had an issue with unreliable winds and track on the Chelton
initially. Successful alighnment and swing calibration seems to have
cured that and today it nailed an automatic GPS approach. I am finding
the same thing as others have mentioned with the oil quantity. It seems
to be happy at about 9 qts; we've added one so far.
One caution, the temtation during the initial flights particularly
with advanced avionics is to spend too much time looking inside the
cockpit. I am trying hard to limit the "inside" viewing and verifing
the avionics in small easily managed steps rather than getting wrapped
up "what's it doing now" problems. I found that dividing the test
flights into half aerodynamics or perfomance tests and half avionics
tests provides a nice mix.
From a perfomance standpoint (other than no aerobatics) this airplane
is every bit as much fun to fly as the RV4 was. I am amazed that a
cross country cruiser can be this responsive and fun to fly.
For everyone slogging through the never ending finishing phase, don't
give up you are going to love this airplane.
Dick Sipp
RV10 110DV flying
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "David McNeill" <dlm46007(at)cox.net> |
inside and outside time is a problem. I plan to fly off the phase one hours
and get my flying partner in the iarplane. I can give him his dual and we
can then do some of the inflight checks I would normally do. I have
concentrated on high power settings to break in the engone and confirming
reliability of systems. My date with the painter is May 25.
_____
From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Richard Sipp
Sent: Thursday, May 01, 2008 7:48 PM
Subject: Re: RV10-List: Phase 1 update
10 Builders, David
We are at similar stages of test flying. I have about 8 hours now, also
with Cheltons. I am using 6.0B and a Trutrak Digiflight II with GPS lateral
and vertical steering.
I have seen nearly identical airframe numbers that you and others have
reported and really enjoy the low speed handling qualities. We've done
multiple stalls in all configs and lots of slow flight. With the cg at about
20% of the range it is difficult to get a stall break with full flaps. The
indicated stall airspeeds are within a couple of knots of Van's numbers.
For initial test flying at what will probably be forward cgs, 50 flap
landings are more comfortable than full flap. The launch on takeoff (1620
lbs bow, no interior or paint, 50 lbs of ballast in bag compartment) is fun
too.
I had an issue with unreliable winds and track on the Chelton initially.
Successful alighnment and swing calibration seems to have cured that and
today it nailed an automatic GPS approach. I am finding the same thing as
others have mentioned with the oil quantity. It seems to be happy at about
9 qts; we've added one so far.
One caution, the temtation during the initial flights particularly with
advanced avionics is to spend too much time looking inside the cockpit. I
am trying hard to limit the "inside" viewing and verifing the avionics in
small easily managed steps rather than getting wrapped up "what's it doing
now" problems. I found that dividing the test flights into half aerodynamics
or perfomance tests and half avionics tests provides a nice mix.
>From a perfomance standpoint (other than no aerobatics) this airplane is
every bit as much fun to fly as the RV4 was. I am amazed that a cross
country cruiser can be this responsive and fun to fly.
For everyone slogging through the never ending finishing phase, don't give
up you are going to love this airplane.
Dick Sipp
RV10 110DV flying
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Damon Wack <dwack(at)flbb.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Phase 1 update |
Hey Jim, I don't believe so, the oil seemed to settle in at the ten qt
amount, unless I was doing a lot of inverted or negative g stuff, and
then it would drop below 10 pretty quickly. Anything more than ten
would blow off very quickly. The Pitts had the same horsepower as the
RV, the Extra was a 300hp version. I don't know if there are any
other differences.
Damon
On May 1, 2008, at 10:36 PM, jim berry wrote:
>
> Damon,
>
> Ten quarts seems high for an IO540. Dose that include what went to
> your inverted oil system?
>
> Jim Berry
> 40482
> 25 years in a Pitts S1S
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=180619#180619
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "orchidman" <gary(at)wingscc.com> |
scottmschmidt(at)yahoo.co wrote:
> Does anyone have a .pdf that Van's supplies with the finishing kit describing
the first flight as well as flap speeds?
> For me, it is 120 knots for the first, then below 90 knots for everything else.
> Typically it is 85 knots for the second notch, then 80 for the third.
>
> Scott Schmidt
> scottmschmidt(at)yahoo.com
> ---
Have you checked Van's FAQ's 'Airspeed Indicator Markings' page?
http://www.vansaircraft.com/pdf/speeds.pdf
It lists all the RV's airspeed indicator markings.
--------
Gary Blankenbiller
RV10 - # 40674
Fuselage SB
(N410GB reserved)
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=180649#180649
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Fred Williams, M.D." <drfred(at)suddenlinkmail.com> |
| Subject: | Trutrak autopilots |
I need a little advice from those who are IFR rated and flying.
Unfortunately, my panel shop, Accuracy avionics just went belly up this
am. (I wouldn't advise sending them any more checks) I've been stiffed
out of an autopilot that I still haven't received yet. Now that I get
to pay double for it, I'm reconsidering how may features I need. I
planned on a Trutrak digiflight IIVSGV.
I would like to know how often one needs the vertical GPS steering
feature. Does it help eliminate setting your power and trim for a
climb/descent? I have minimal IFR training, but doesn't one set up
basically a table with power settings to see what your airplane will do
to get say a 500 ft/min descent? Looks like I could save about $400-500
by not getting that feature.
Little miffed this am......
Trying to regain composure and just fly the airplane.......
Thanks in advance for the replies.
Dr Fred
40515
Now in panel assembly hell.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "David McNeill" <dlm46007(at)cox.net> |
Do we have a pliminary count of RV10s at OSH this year? I have been talking
to EAA OSH to determine where they plan to park RVs or whether it is just
HBP out west of 18-36. My concern is my visit is always first IFR in on
Thursday AM and first IFR out on Sun AM. Getting to the active without
flagman or assistance is paramount. I believe Claude and I will tent camp in
Scholler with the rest of the 10 crowd.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Deems Davis <deemsdavis(at)cox.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Overhead Console? |
The Flightline A/C guy/s http://flightlineac.com/home have one that
they sell/include with their air conditioning system. when I spoke to
John Strain some time ago he said they would sell the Ohead separate.
It's basically a knock-off of the Accuracy.
But, beware, They are ALSO located in BEND !
Deems Davis # 406
'Its all done....Its just not put together'
http://deemsrv10.com/
Chase Snodgrass wrote:
>
> On 5/2/08, Fred Williams, M.D. wrote: "Accuracy avionics just went
> belly up this am. (I wouldn't advise sending them any more checks)"
>
> Dang! Is there any other source for the overhead console?
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Overhead Console? |
| From: | "John Cox" <johnwcox(at)pacificnw.com> |
As I was (and am) the guy who connected Ed Hayden and John Strain
together for the first A/C unit for the RV-10, you can be assured that
my cousins Vinny and Guido will visit him if he tries such a sophomoric
stunt. Fortunately he has very little time on the shop floor at Lancair
(Redmond), where those fumes might permeate.
The Oregon Department of Aviation Board is meeting in Bend on May 21st
and I will make a point of putting the issue on their agenda for
discussion - formally.
John
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Deems Davis
Sent: Friday, May 02, 2008 9:58 AM
Subject: Re: RV10-List: Overhead Console?
The Flightline A/C guy/s http://flightlineac.com/home have one that
they sell/include with their air conditioning system. when I spoke to
John Strain some time ago he said they would sell the Ohead separate.
It's basically a knock-off of the Accuracy.
But, beware, They are ALSO located in BEND !
Deems Davis # 406
'Its all done....Its just not put together'
http://deemsrv10.com/
Chase Snodgrass wrote:
>
> On 5/2/08, Fred Williams, M.D. wrote: "Accuracy avionics just went
> belly up this am. (I wouldn't advise sending them any more checks)"
>
> Dang! Is there any other source for the overhead console?
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "John Strain" <aircarepros(at)yahoo.com> |
| Subject: | Overhead Console? |
Fred, Deems, and RV10 gang,
John from Flightline AC, Inc here,
Yes we are in Bend, but so is Precise Flight, EI, Mountain High, Cessna,
Epic, Advanced Aviation, RDD, Fibercrafters, LancAir, Snowline and a whole
bunch of others who are very viable companies and who still lead the way in
experimental and certified aircraft development. Bend isn't a curse, but
there have been some businesses that for various reasons haven't made it.
Now to your solution....
We do offer our overhead (completely different than the Advanced Avionics)
separately or included in our air conditioning kit. Ours is designed to be
integral and bonded into the canopy. We have one more of our prototype
unit, and several of our latest design boxed and ready to go. The prototype
unit is the same as the one that is now offered by Saint Aviation. We will
sell our last one for $395.00. I am not sure what Jesse will be selling
theirs for, but it is from the same mold. He has one installed in Steve's
newly repainted 10 and it really looked good at SnF with the leather
interior. Our latest design is a 2 piece for easier installation and less
expensive shipping. It sells for $595.00 or can be included in an ac kit.
As far as designed for delivering air throughout the cabin, the Flightline 1
(aka by us as the one offered by Saint Aviation) and the Flightline 2
offered by us are the best in the industry. Neither have DVD or clothes
hanger racks in them, but could be added if someone spent a little time on
the design and glass work.
Thanks for the plug???? Deems, you really ought to visit here before we all
end up having to come stay with your because of the hard times that Bend has
dealt us. It really is a great place and the aviation community is very
strong and active here.
John
John N. Strain II
Flightline AC, Inc
P.O. Box 5309
Bend, Or 97708
541-815-8935 Cell
541-330-5466 Office
541-312-4257 Fax
john(at)flightlineac.com
www.flightlineac.com
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Deems Davis
Sent: Friday, May 02, 2008 9:58 AM
Subject: Re: RV10-List: Overhead Console?
The Flightline A/C guy/s http://flightlineac.com/home have one that
they sell/include with their air conditioning system. when I spoke to
John Strain some time ago he said they would sell the Ohead separate.
It's basically a knock-off of the Accuracy.
But, beware, They are ALSO located in BEND !
Deems Davis # 406
'Its all done....Its just not put together'
http://deemsrv10.com/
Chase Snodgrass wrote:
>
> On 5/2/08, Fred Williams, M.D. wrote: "Accuracy avionics just went
> belly up this am. (I wouldn't advise sending them any more checks)"
>
> Dang! Is there any other source for the overhead console?
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Condrey, Bob (US SSA)" <bob.condrey(at)baesystems.com> |
Just finished up with the DAR and #40105 is now N442PM in every respect!
No squawks found during the inspection, just have to put everything back
together... First flight will wait until weather conditions locally
improve a bit.
Bob
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Overhead Console? |
| From: | "bcondrey" <bob.condrey(at)baesystems.com> |
John,
I wouldn't copy the Accuracy OH console directly - fit is poor as it was delivered.
With some misc cutting/fitting/filling it looks great, but it somebody was
making a mold I wouldn't consider them ideal.
Bob
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=180778#180778
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Bob Leffler" <rv(at)thelefflers.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Overhead Console? |
I know that Tony just rework the console recently. I wonder if anyone has
received one of the new ones and if they fit any better.
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of bcondrey
Sent: Friday, May 02, 2008 3:56 PM
Subject: RV10-List: Re: Overhead Console?
John,
I wouldn't copy the Accuracy OH console directly - fit is poor as it was
delivered. With some misc cutting/fitting/filling it looks great, but it
somebody was making a mold I wouldn't consider them ideal.
Bob
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=180778#180778
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Bob Leffler" <rv(at)thelefflers.com> |
Great news! Looking forward to seeing you, Susan, and N442PM at OSH.
From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Condrey, Bob (US
SSA)
Sent: Friday, May 02, 2008 3:38 PM
Subject: RV10-List: It's Official!
Just finished up with the DAR and #40105 is now N442PM in every respect! No
squawks found during the inspection, just have to put everything back
together. First flight will wait until weather conditions locally improve a
bit.
Bob
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "DejaVu" <wvu(at)ameritel.net> |
| Subject: | Garmin Rapair - Customer Beware |
Short story: if Garmin replaces a light bulb in your unit, it's $800. I wa
s totally unaware but you can find the verbage in their warranty online. I
was expecting someone to call first.
Long story: Lost the transmitter on my comm radio on the 430 on the way bac
k from SNF, reception was fine. Trouble shooting showed transmitter output
was a whopping 1.5W and very noisy after the initial 3 second ouput of 37W
You can hear something like a relay within the unit kicking in right pri
or to going from 37W to 1.5W. Great, the radio is protected. Something si
mple is wrong. My 430 has 130hrs on it. 2-year warranty started on purcha
se date so that expired about 7 months after first flight.
Sent the unit to Garmin through a dealer (can't send it directly to them).
Turn around time was quick - confirmed my suspecion that it was a simple f
ix. I was impressed. The damage - $875. My eye balls almost jumped out o
f their sockets. After researching a bit I realized that I'm not the first
unhappy customer. Garmin has a flat repair rate of $800 for the 430, incl
uding shipping (thank goodness!! I wonder why my bill was $875?). They gua
rantee complete overhaul if they so deem the unit needs it. This includes
cosmetics like worn out buttons or anything they see that's not up to par.
Quote from the Service Report "Confirmed problem. Repaired the COMM board
to correct the discrepancy. Updated software." Garmin's repair records d
oes not contain any more details than this. When asked if cosmetic works we
re done to my unit, the answer.... no. I would've been surprised if there
was any on such a low time unit.
Sounds to me that Garmin has a good marketing strategy to keep all units in
service at tip top overhauled shape at the expense of the customers. By th
e way, the dealer wasn't aware of this flat rate policy.
So what's the chance of something majorly wrong with my 430 would happen to
get a good $800 deal? Considering the cost of a new unit, a quick statist
ical calculation +/- a bunch% error says that you'll never make out ahead w
ith this deal. Google what others have to say regarding Garmin's customer
support and see for yourself. I don't mind supporting a good product but t
his feels like a log going through my rear end.
Anh
N591VU-flying
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Rick Sked <ricksked(at)embarqmail.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Trutrak autopilots |
What really bothers me is I have my panel from Accuracy, one of their first. I
gave out glowing recommendations for their quality and service because that was
my experience. I have not heard from Tony or Eric and this came as a complete
surprise to me after talking to them at Sun n Fun. If anyone has suffered a
loss as a result of my recommendation for Accuracy, please understand that I had
a very good experience with them, if I hadn't, those that know me would tell
you I usually don't hold any punches when it comes to service, value and other
traits we hold close.
Rick Sked
40185
----- Original Message -----
From: "Fred Williams, M.D." <drfred(at)suddenlinkmail.com>
Sent: Friday, May 2, 2008 8:08:29 AM (GMT-0800) America/Los_Angeles
Subject: RV10-List: Trutrak autopilots
I need a little advice from those who are IFR rated and flying.
Unfortunately, my panel shop, Accuracy avionics just went belly up this
am. (I wouldn't advise sending them any more checks) I've been stiffed
out of an autopilot that I still haven't received yet. Now that I get
to pay double for it, I'm reconsidering how may features I need. I
planned on a Trutrak digiflight IIVSGV.
I would like to know how often one needs the vertical GPS steering
feature. Does it help eliminate setting your power and trim for a
climb/descent? I have minimal IFR training, but doesn't one set up
basically a table with power settings to see what your airplane will do
to get say a 500 ft/min descent? Looks like I could save about $400-500
by not getting that feature.
Little miffed this am......
Trying to regain composure and just fly the airplane.......
Thanks in advance for the replies.
Dr Fred
40515
Now in panel assembly hell.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Rick Sked <ricksked(at)embarqmail.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Trutrak autopilots |
PS- Fred, I know e have chatted about assembling your panel.....If I can help you
sort out that panel let me know...I have a pretty complete library of AA's
wiring diagrams, manuals etc. Sorry this has happened to you.
Rick Sked
----- Original Message -----
From: "Fred Williams, M.D." <drfred(at)suddenlinkmail.com>
Sent: Friday, May 2, 2008 8:08:29 AM (GMT-0800) America/Los_Angeles
Subject: RV10-List: Trutrak autopilots
I need a little advice from those who are IFR rated and flying.
Unfortunately, my panel shop, Accuracy avionics just went belly up this
am. (I wouldn't advise sending them any more checks) I've been stiffed
out of an autopilot that I still haven't received yet. Now that I get
to pay double for it, I'm reconsidering how may features I need. I
planned on a Trutrak digiflight IIVSGV.
I would like to know how often one needs the vertical GPS steering
feature. Does it help eliminate setting your power and trim for a
climb/descent? I have minimal IFR training, but doesn't one set up
basically a table with power settings to see what your airplane will do
to get say a 500 ft/min descent? Looks like I could save about $400-500
by not getting that feature.
Little miffed this am......
Trying to regain composure and just fly the airplane.......
Thanks in advance for the replies.
Dr Fred
40515
Now in panel assembly hell.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "gary" <speckter(at)comcast.net> |
Congratulations. Let me know when you fly.
I flew mine up to MN. I still have OP stuff to work out with Stein but now
I am in his back yard.
Gary
_____
From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Condrey, Bob (US
SSA)
Sent: Friday, May 02, 2008 2:38 PM
Subject: RV10-List: It's Official!
Just finished up with the DAR and #40105 is now N442PM in every respect! No
squawks found during the inspection, just have to put everything back
together. First flight will wait until weather conditions locally improve a
bit.
Bob
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Fred Williams, M.D." <drfred(at)suddenlinkmail.com> |
Guys,
Thanks for the input. I do have a 430w for the panel and will likely go
ahead and get the vertical steering. Just wanted to know how useful it
would be.
Rick, thanks for the reply, fortunately I do have the complete wiring
diagrams and 90% of the parts. I was able to talk to Eric this am and
he was just as taken back as I was. He was completely in the dark until
today. He has been gracious enough to offer to help also If I have any
problems. Tony has been just as helpful up until this last two weeks.
I knew something was up when I called to get the autopilot and adi and
Tony said he had to wait until a couple orders came in so he could
purchase it.
Fred
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Van's support to international customers |
| From: | "McGANN, Ron" <ron.mcgann(at)baesystems.com> |
Sorry guys, time for a bit of a whinge. Vans credibility has just taken a
serious nose dive for this builder.
Weldon 10 is not readily available in Australia and Vans will not deliver i
t other than sea freight (3 month delay for $12 worth of stuff!!!). The su
pplier here insists on providing adhesive that is significantly past its sh
elf life (ie more than 2yrs). I have been trying to get some useable Weldo
n for the past 3 months without success. Vans did advise that they hoped t
o have a solution by end of April. Here is their response to my query on w
hat was happening:
"Obviously we have no control over IPS or their distributors. We can become
certified for shipping Hazmat, but this requires sending staff on an
expensive 3 day course.
We are making inquiries to see if we can ship the material through a third
party rather than becoming Hazmat certified here for this one product.
However it is done, minimum cost for shipping any quantity of the adhesive
would be about $200.
The reason we don't have an alternative is because experts in the field
advised us that this is the best adhesive to use. It therefore seems
inadvisable for us to research, or to recommend that you use, the "not quite
so good" alternatives.
Several RV-10s have been finished in Australia, so this is not an
insurmountable problem, though I am not sure how they solved the issue.
As I said before, we are able to ship the adhesive in with the kits. If you
have
all your kits we can conceivably ship this in someone else's kit, so if you
know of someone near you ordering a kit let us know. As of right now, that
is
all we can do.
Gus"
The majority of RV-10s that were completed in Australia have used Weld-on s
upplied by Vans BEFORE they discovered it was Hazmat. Their reluctance to r
ecommend an alternative windows installation method, when they cannot provi
de their specified product is very disappointing. My -10 is virtually fini
shed with a planned first flight date of July. Windscreen installation and
fairing is the only job left and I have no more kits to freight in.
So, for those international builders that may have a problem with getting W
eld-On 10 - expect ZERO support from Vans.
For me, it's back to the archives to find an alternative (but not Vans appr
oved) way of installing the windscreen.
Ron
-187 (and reeeeally pi$$ed off)
"Warning:
The information contained in this email and any attached files is
confidential to BAE Systems Australia. If you are not the intended
recipient, any use, disclosure or copying of this email or any
attachments is expressly prohibited. If you have received this email
in error, please notify us immediately. VIRUS: Every care has been
taken to ensure this email and its attachments are virus free,
however, any loss or damage incurred in using this email is not the
sender's responsibility. It is your responsibility to ensure virus
checks are completed before installing any data sent in this email to
your computer."
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | MauleDriver <MauleDriver(at)nc.rr.com> |
| Subject: | Building Sequence - how long can I delay riveting the fiberglass |
top on?
I'm looking for some advice on building sequence. I finished sections
thru 40 and now the fuselage top has been fitted but it seems to be in
my best interest to delay riveting it until a number of tasks are done.
It would also seems to be best to delay the upper forward fuselage
installation until the avionics are well underway. I have the finishing
kit inhouse and the 540 is on its way. I'm thinking that I need to
focus on the avionics and other cockpit systems so that I can put the
tops on.
Those of you that have been thru this, what is a good way to proceed?
What kind of flexibility do I have? What pitfalls should I avoid?
So much to do and so many options.
Hey Bob C - Congratulations! Can't wait to hear about the first flight.
Bill "with fiberglass dust everywhere" Watson
Durham NC
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Rick Sked <ricksked(at)embarqmail.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Van's support to international customers |
Ron,
I'm going the Silpruf silicone method, ever consider an alternative to weld-on?
The Glasair crews have been using this method and it even looks like the Cirrus
uses similar methods. I have the VHS tape showing it's install and I think
it's a better way to go IMHO, Easier to get the adhesive as well. Takes 4 to 5
tubes at about $15 US each to complete.
Rick Sked
40185
----- Original Message -----
From: "Ron McGANN" <ron.mcgann(at)baesystems.com>
Sent: Friday, May 2, 2008 6:25:11 PM (GMT-0800) America/Los_Angeles
Subject: RV10-List: Van's support to international customers
Sorry guys, time for a bit of a whinge. Vans credibility has just taken a serious
nose dive for this builder.
Weldon 10 is not readily available in Australia and Vans will not deliver it other
than sea freight (3 month delay for $12 worth of stuff!!!). The supplier
here insists on providing adhesive that is significantly past its shelf life (ie
more than 2yrs). I have been trying to get some useable Weldon for the past
3 months without success. Vans did advise that they hoped to have a solution
by end of April. Here is their response to my query on what was happening:
"Obviously we have no control over IPS or their distributors. We can become
certified for shipping Hazmat, but this requires sending staff on an
expensive 3 day course.
We are making inquiries to see if we can ship the material through a third
party rather than becoming Hazmat certified here for this one product.
However it is done, minimum cost for shipping any quantity of the adhesive
would be about $200.
The reason we don't have an alternative is because experts in the field
advised us that this is the best adhesive to use. It therefore seems
inadvisable for us to research, or to recommend that you use, the "not quite
so good" alternatives.
Several RV-10s have been finished in Australia, so this is not an
insurmountable problem, though I am not sure how they solved the issue.
As I said before, we are able to ship the adhesive in with the kits. If you have
all your kits we can conceivably ship this in someone else's kit, so if you
know of someone near you ordering a kit let us know. As of right now, that is
all we can do.
Gus"
The majority of RV-10s that were completed in Australia have used Weld-on supplied
by Vans BEFORE they discovered it was Hazmat. Their reluctance to recommend
an alternative windows installation method, when they cannot provide their specified
product is very disappointing. My -10 is virtually finished with a planned
first flight date of July. Windscreen installation and fairing is the
only job left and I have no more kits to freight in.
So, for those international builders that may have a problem with getting Weld-On
10 - expect ZERO support from Vans.
For me, it's back to the archives to find an alternative (but not Vans approved)
way of installing the windscreen.
Ron
-187 (and reeeeally pi$$ed off)
"Warning:
The information contained in this email and any attached files is
confidential to BAE Systems Australia. If you are not the intended
recipient, any use, disclosure or copying of this email or any
attachments is expressly prohibited. If you have received this email
in error, please notify us immediately. VIRUS: Every care has been
taken to ensure this email and its attachments are virus free,
however, any loss or damage incurred in using this email is not the
sender's responsibility. It is your responsibility to ensure virus
checks are completed before installing any data sent in this email to
your computer."
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Rick Sked <ricksked(at)embarqmail.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Building Sequence - how long can I delay riveting the |
fiberglass top on?
Bill,
I fitted my cabin top and doors way back. Since then I have, put it on the gear,
hung the engine & prop, installed all the wiring, the panel, finished the cowl/FWF/baffeling.
Basically my -10 is complete without the top on. The top/windows
and the pants/faring are all that's left to do shy of hanging the wings
and final assembly..(yeah right) I found it so much easier to climb in and out
without the cabin top on the fuselage. I'm afraid as soon as the top is on I'll
see that bright light at the end of the tunnel and really start to think I'm
done.
Rick Sked
40185
----- Original Message -----
From: "MauleDriver" <MauleDriver(at)nc.rr.com>
Sent: Friday, May 2, 2008 6:43:24 PM (GMT-0800) America/Los_Angeles
Subject: RV10-List: Building Sequence - how long can I delay riveting the fiberglass
top on?
I'm looking for some advice on building sequence. I finished sections
thru 40 and now the fuselage top has been fitted but it seems to be in
my best interest to delay riveting it until a number of tasks are done.
It would also seems to be best to delay the upper forward fuselage
installation until the avionics are well underway. I have the finishing
kit inhouse and the 540 is on its way. I'm thinking that I need to
focus on the avionics and other cockpit systems so that I can put the
tops on.
Those of you that have been thru this, what is a good way to proceed?
What kind of flexibility do I have? What pitfalls should I avoid?
So much to do and so many options.
Hey Bob C - Congratulations! Can't wait to hear about the first flight.
Bill "with fiberglass dust everywhere" Watson
Durham NC
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Robert Wright <flywrights(at)yahoo.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Trutrak autopilots |
Even on my limited budget I've been reminded on occasion that-400-500 is
a fairly small amount if that's the only differential factor.- I understa
nd if you're trying to trim a bunch of new increased prices, but if you lik
e the original feature then it's pretty much-a wash.=0ARob=0A#392=0AMakin
g a-negative fortune in aviation!=0A=0A=0A----- Original Message ----=0AF
rom: "Fred Williams, M.D." =0ATo: RV 10 =0ASent: Friday, May 2, 2008 11:08:29 AM=0ASubject: RV10-L
s, M.D." =0A=0AI need a little advice from those
who are IFR rated and flying.- =0AUnfortunately, my panel shop, Accuracy
avionics just went belly up this =0Aam.- (I wouldn't advise sending them
any more checks)- I've been stiffed =0Aout of an autopilot that I still
haven't received yet.- Now that I get =0Ato pay double for it, I'm recons
idering how may features I need.- I =0Aplanned on a Trutrak digiflight II
VSGV.=0A=0AI would like to know how- often one needs the- vertical- G
PS steering- =0Afeature.- Does it help eliminate setting your power and
trim for a =0Aclimb/descent?- I have minimal IFR training, but doesn't o
ne set up =0Abasically a table with power settings to see what your airplan
e will do =0Ato get say a 500 ft/min descent?- Looks like I could save ab
out $400-500 =0Aby not getting that feature. =0A=0ALittle miffed this am...
...=0ATrying to regain composure and just fly the airplane.......=0A=0AThan
ks in advance for the replies. =0A=0A=0ADr Fred=0A40515=0ANow in panel asse
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - -Matt Dralle, List
========0A=0A=0A _______________________________________
_____________________________________________=0ABe a better friend, newshou
nd, and =0Aknow-it-all with Yahoo! Mobile. Try it now. http://mobile.yaho
o.com/;_ylt=Ahu06i62sR8HDtDypao8Wcj9tAcJ
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Kelly McMullen <kellym(at)aviating.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Overhead Console? |
I hope the official photographer is on standby to assist those of us
that are schedule and distance challenged.
Whatever happened to the RV-10 calendar effort? Is a 2008 version available?
John Cox wrote:
> The light is ON for the Pacific
> NW RV-10 builder shindig next Saturday. Yeh All should contact John
> Jessen if you can fly your Rv-10 into Dietz Airpark for the get
> together.
>
> John
>
>
>
Checked by AVG.
02 AM