RV10-Archive.digest.vol-ex
August 20, 2009 - August 28, 2009
Those look nice Les. If I had to order today I would buy Stein's with the black
vents and map lights. I am very interested in the carbon fiber one. I didn't
realize that I should fit the cabin top and then mount the console. That sounds
logical. I am just finishing section 29 so I will be ordering soon. I
hope the carbon fiber one will be available by the time I am ready.
--------
Cust. #40936
RV-10 SB Fuselage
N801VR reserved
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=258847#258847
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Overhead Console |
| From: | "Robin Marks" <robin1(at)mrmoisture.com> |
Sean,
I agree with everything said to date. I especially like the build your
own if you want to save $ and have something specific to your needs.
Obviously a few more hours will be needed. That being said when we were
building the AA was the only game in town so we installed that poor
fitting piece of... Fiberglass on our old style canopy. Something about
a monkey and a football. If I were doing it again today I would wait for
the carbon fiber one before deciding. If it's anything like the panels
they offer it should be sensational.
Here is a link to my OH build:
http://www.painttheweb.com/rv-10/console.htm
Robin
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Les Kearney
Sent: Thursday, August 20, 2009 9:01 AM
Subject: RE: RV10-List: Overhead Console
Sean
I have seen Stien's console on a couple of -10s at KOSH and they are
very nice.
If you are a bit more ambitious, you might want to take a page out of
John G's book and make your own.
Attached are a couple of photos of my "amateur built" console that was
built using John's technique. It took a more than a few hours but was
good f/g practise for a neophyte. I am, now more comfortable with f/g
although I still hate sanding the damn stuff.
I plan to have the canopy interior painted in a couple of weeks by a
professional shop. Painting is one thing I don't want to do because I
don't the requisite skills or equipment. and expect it to look quite
respectable.
The "long runs" were fabbed using 3/4" foam about 12" wide. The raised
vent
holders were fabbed from shaped foam.
The holes in mine are for eyeball lights and Steins eyeball vents.
Speaking of vents, don't bother with anyone else's vents. I bought some
Aveo vents from ACS and sent them back and got Stien's which really are
far superior.
Cheers
Les
#40643 - Living in a f/g world
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Strasnuts
Sent: August-19-09 9:36 PM
Subject: RV10-List: Overhead Console
I am getting ready to order an overhead console. Anyone have one they
REALLY like? or suggest?
--------
Cust. #40936
RV-10 SB Fuselage
N801VR reserved
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=258777#258777
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Bob-tcw" <rnewman(at)tcwtech.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Overhead Console |
If you are interested in a DIY overhead console here's the link to my web
album. Go to the chapter titled "fiberglass work" starting around photo
111 there's a progression of the overhead I did for my rv-10. It's being
fed air from naca scoops in the rear with the addition of two axial fans to
provide airflow while on the ground.
http://picasaweb.google.com/rcnewman64
Bob Newman
www.tcwtech.com
#40176 glass work and panel and wiring and stuff.
----- Original Message -----
From: "John Strain" <aircarepros(at)yahoo.com>
Sent: Thursday, August 20, 2009 10:07 AM
Subject: RE: RV10-List: Re: Overhead Console
>
> Check out www.flightlineac.com.
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of orchidman
> Sent: Thursday, August 20, 2009 4:31 AM
> To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com
> Subject: RV10-List: Re: Overhead Console
>
>
> Strasnuts wrote:
>> I am getting ready to order an overhead console. Anyone have one they
> REALLY like? or suggest?
>
> I have the one that Stein now sells. After you get the top fit, pull it
> off
> and fit the overhead while the top is upside down on some sawhorses.
> Use some of the rubber seal to seal the aft edge against the rear
> bulkhead.
> Install 2 of the scat tube flanges to the aft side of the bulkhead and add
> 2
> naca inlets to provide the air. You will get a bunch of air out of this
> configuration even with all 4 vents open.
>
> Some of my pictures can be seen at
> http://www.wingscc.com/N2GB/43-CabinCover/100_2897.html
>
> --------
> Gary Blankenbiller
> RV10 - # 40674
> (N2GB Flying)
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=258795#258795
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Richard Bibb" <rbibb(at)tomet.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Overhead Console |
Bob:
OT but that is one nice looking workshop with the Post and Beam
construction. I expected to see Norm Abrams show up in the picture sequence
somewhere....
Not too shabby looking fiberglass boat looking thing with all the holes in
it either.... :)
Richard Bibb
972-771-2598
972-835-5979 mobile
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Bob-tcw
Sent: Thursday, August 20, 2009 12:16 PM
Subject: Re: RV10-List: Re: Overhead Console
If you are interested in a DIY overhead console here's the link to my web
album. Go to the chapter titled "fiberglass work" starting around photo
111 there's a progression of the overhead I did for my rv-10. It's being
fed air from naca scoops in the rear with the addition of two axial fans to
provide airflow while on the ground.
http://picasaweb.google.com/rcnewman64
Bob Newman
www.tcwtech.com
#40176 glass work and panel and wiring and stuff.
----- Original Message -----
From: "John Strain" <aircarepros(at)yahoo.com>
Sent: Thursday, August 20, 2009 10:07 AM
Subject: RE: RV10-List: Re: Overhead Console
>
> Check out www.flightlineac.com.
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of orchidman
> Sent: Thursday, August 20, 2009 4:31 AM
> To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com
> Subject: RV10-List: Re: Overhead Console
>
>
> Strasnuts wrote:
>> I am getting ready to order an overhead console. Anyone have one they
> REALLY like? or suggest?
>
> I have the one that Stein now sells. After you get the top fit, pull it
> off
> and fit the overhead while the top is upside down on some sawhorses.
> Use some of the rubber seal to seal the aft edge against the rear
> bulkhead.
> Install 2 of the scat tube flanges to the aft side of the bulkhead and add
> 2
> naca inlets to provide the air. You will get a bunch of air out of this
> configuration even with all 4 vents open.
>
> Some of my pictures can be seen at
> http://www.wingscc.com/N2GB/43-CabinCover/100_2897.html
>
> --------
> Gary Blankenbiller
> RV10 - # 40674
> (N2GB Flying)
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=258795#258795
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Les Kearney" <kearney(at)shaw.ca> |
| Subject: | Re: Overhead Console |
Sean
Amy way you slice it, the canopy and doors will require a lot of work. My
"pink doors" have / had a lot of voids were it appears that the mold was not
clean when the doors were made. As well my "green canopy" was a real treat
cleaning up.
Stien's stuff is great although I used the ACS eyeball LED lights and his
vents.
Cheers
les
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Strasnuts
Sent: August-20-09 10:45 AM
Subject: RV10-List: Re: Overhead Console
Those look nice Les. If I had to order today I would buy Stein's with the
black vents and map lights. I am very interested in the carbon fiber one.
I didn't realize that I should fit the cabin top and then mount the console.
That sounds logical. I am just finishing section 29 so I will be ordering
soon. I hope the carbon fiber one will be available by the time I am ready.
--------
Cust. #40936
RV-10 SB Fuselage
N801VR reserved
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=258847#258847
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Oil Cooler Size On RV-10...? |
| From: | "AirMike" <Mikeabel(at)Pacbell.net> |
I do not know about Van's, but Alex DeDominicis (Aviation tech products)sells
one that has the identical dimensions as Van's unit for the 10 and supposedly
has 20% better cooling. Alex is a good guy and with the difference from the cost
of the Van's product - it was about $100 more. Seems to work fine.
--------
OSH '09 or Bust (busted) be there someday
Q/B Kit - end game
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=258936#258936
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Another Flying RV10 for the book |
| From: | "AirMike" <Mikeabel(at)Pacbell.net> |
RV-10 Q/B kit #40663 lifted off with Mike Seager at the controls on Thursday August
13th 2009 at Minden, Nevada. AirMike now with 2 hrs. in the beast.
http://www.vansaircraft.com/public/flights.htm
A sincere thanks to all the great folks on this list without whose help the task
would have been much more difficult. Special koddos to Tim Olson, Dave M, Dave
Saylor, Matt, Gary, Albert, Deems, William C.,Scott, Kelly M, Jesse, Stein,
Bob C., John C., Jae C., and anyone else whom I may have forgotten.
For the newbees starting their projects this forum will yield to you a better and
safer aircraft and the opportunity to meet (even electronically) a great group
of fine folks. Read Matt's rules - be positive, and do not be afraid to ask
what you might think is a foolish question. Respect and helpfulness keeps this
a great forum. Fly safe - have fun
--------
OSH '09 or Bust (busted) be there someday
Q/B Kit - end game
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=258937#258937
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Don McDonald <building_partner(at)yahoo.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Oil Cooler Size On RV-10...? |
Ditto on the unit from Alex.... with the exception of the reduction in cool
ing... certainly NOT 20%.... considering 200 degrees, we'd be talking about
a 40 degree reduction.- Plan on a reduction of between 5 and 15.
Don McDonald
--- On Thu, 8/20/09, AirMike wrote:
From: AirMike <Mikeabel(at)Pacbell.net>
Subject: RV10-List: Re: Oil Cooler Size On RV-10...?
Date: Thursday, August 20, 2009, 10:16 PM
I do not know about Van's, but Alex- DeDominicis (Aviation tech products)
sells one that has the identical dimensions as Van's unit for the 10 and su
pposedly has 20% better cooling. Alex is a good guy and with the difference
from the cost of the Van's product - it was about $100 more. Seems to work
fine.
--------
OSH '09 or Bust (busted) be there someday
Q/B Kit - end game
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=258936#258936
le, List Admin.
=0A=0A=0A
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Another Flying RV10 for the book |
| From: | "orchidman" <gary(at)wingscc.com> |
AirMike wrote:
> RV-10 Q/B kit #40663 lifted off with Mike Seager at the controls on Thursday
August 13th 2009 at Minden, Nevada. AirMike now with 2 hrs. in the beast.
>
A real big CONGRATULATIONS!!!!
Now the real question, was it better then sex? [Mr. Green]
I have 70 hours on mine and right now it is in the paint shop. I am in severe
withdrawal. Last night I even emptied the dish washer. The wife is about to
kick me out. It's like hide and seek. I hide things where I think they are supposed
to go and then she has to seek them out because they aren't where she
expects them. So some advise, when you get ready to send it off for paint, be
prepared. I wasn't.
The 10 sure is a real pleasure to fly :D
--------
Gary Blankenbiller
RV10 - # 40674
(N2GB Flying)
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=258948#258948
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Les Kearney" <kearney(at)shaw.ca> |
| Subject: | Another Flying RV10 for the book |
Congrats Mike!
As with every new -10, I turn just a it more green with envy! I trust we
will shall see the AirMike model of the -10 at KOSH in 2010.
Cheers
Les
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of AirMike
Sent: August-20-09 11:48 PM
Subject: RV10-List: Another Flying RV10 for the book
RV-10 Q/B kit #40663 lifted off with Mike Seager at the controls on Thursday
August 13th 2009 at Minden, Nevada. AirMike now with 2 hrs. in the beast.
http://www.vansaircraft.com/public/flights.htm
A sincere thanks to all the great folks on this list without whose help the
task would have been much more difficult. Special koddos to Tim Olson, Dave
M, Dave Saylor, Matt, Gary, Albert, Deems, William C.,Scott, Kelly M, Jesse,
Stein, Bob C., John C., Jae C., and anyone else whom I may have forgotten.
For the newbees starting their projects this forum will yield to you a
better and safer aircraft and the opportunity to meet (even electronically)
a great group of fine folks. Read Matt's rules - be positive, and do not be
afraid to ask what you might think is a foolish question. Respect and
helpfulness keeps this a great forum. Fly safe - have fun
--------
OSH '09 or Bust (busted) be there someday
Q/B Kit - end game
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=258937#258937
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Don McDonald <building_partner(at)yahoo.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Another Flying RV10 for the book |
Congrats Mike... now the fun doesn't just start, it continues!- At first
glance your builder # looked exactly like mine... 40636 bvs.40663.- Have
fun, and may we all meet up during this great adventure.
Don McDonald
--- On Thu, 8/20/09, AirMike wrote:
From: AirMike <Mikeabel(at)Pacbell.net>
Subject: RV10-List: Another Flying RV10 for the book
Date: Thursday, August 20, 2009, 10:47 PM
RV-10 Q/B kit #40663 lifted off with Mike Seager at the controls on Thursda
y August 13th 2009 at Minden, Nevada. AirMike now with 2 hrs. in the beast.
http://www.vansaircraft.com/public/flights.htm
A sincere thanks to all the great folks on this list without whose help the
task would have been much more difficult. Special koddos to Tim Olson, Dav
e M, Dave Saylor, Matt, Gary, Albert, Deems, William C.,Scott, Kelly M, Jes
se, Stein, Bob C., John C., Jae C., and anyone else whom I may have forgott
en.
For the newbees starting their projects this forum will yield to you a bett
er and safer aircraft and the opportunity to meet (even electronically) a g
reat group of fine folks. Read Matt's rules - be positive, and do not be af
raid to ask what you might think is a foolish question. Respect and helpful
ness keeps this a great forum. Fly safe - have fun
--------
OSH '09 or Bust (busted) be there someday
Q/B Kit - end game
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=258937#258937
le, List Admin.
=0A=0A=0A
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "David McNeill" <dlm46007(at)cox.net> |
Has anyone painted/treated the fork as supplied by Vans?
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Michael Baldwin <michaelbaldwin7475(at)sbcglobal.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Oil Cooler Size On RV-10...? |
We put the Airflow-2008X on our RV-10 since our oil temps where higher th
an we liked
And saw a-10 - 20-degree F drop as a result
We also installed-a baffle that splits the air flow in the Van's standard
box per recommendation from Airflow (these guys had a lot of good experien
ce with the RV-10 people)
You do have to modify Van's oil cooler-box to bolt the 2008X on inplace o
f the standard cooler, but it can be done.- Basically-you have to turn
the cooler 90 degrees and fold out the vertical sides of the box, drill a f
ew holes and bolt on.- Actually pretty simple change.- I felt it was wo
rth
-
High oil temps for us was only during summer hot days coupled with-slow f
light conditions 120 -- 150 mph range. if you keep the speed up to 160 or
better its usually ok
Example would be 90-degree day and slow flight around the-pattern or si
ght seeing low and slow the temp would get up to 230 F.- Now with larger
cooler it only hits 210 F.- Our 6 position CHT numbers have always been 3
50 or lower regarding engine temp, so the cowling / baffling seams tight an
d working good.
The slow flght condition appears to be more of the issue.- I would bet a
cowl flap right under the cooler would-also work, be interested to hear i
f any one has done that yet.-
-
Mike Baldwin--(see add below )
-
- Engine Parts---Oil Coolers---Airflow Systems
X-SERIES OIL COOLERS BY AIRFLOW SYSTEM
The first new aircraft oil cooler design in 50 years. Computer modeling and
flight testing have been used to develop coolers that deliver significantl
y lower oil temps with no increase in oil cooler
View more details
08-06154
2006X AIRFLOW OIL COOLER EXPMT
$432.00
08-06155
2008X AIRFLOW OIL COOLER EXPMT
$493.00
-
-
--- On Fri, 8/21/09, Don McDonald wrote:
From: Don McDonald <building_partner(at)yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: RV10-List: Re: Oil Cooler Size On RV-10...?
Date: Friday, August 21, 2009, 1:49 AM
Ditto on the unit from Alex.... with the exception of the reduction in cool
ing... certainly NOT 20%.... considering 200 degrees, we'd be talking about
a 40 degree reduction.- Plan on a reduction of between 5 and 15.
Don McDonald
--- On Thu, 8/20/09, AirMike wrote:
From: AirMike <Mikeabel(at)Pacbell.net>
Subject: RV10-List: Re: Oil Cooler Size On RV-10...?
Date: Thursday, August 20, 2009, 10:16 PM
I do not know about Van's, but Alex- DeDominicis (Aviation tech products)
sells one that has the identical dimensions as Van's unit for the 10 and su
pposedly has 20% better cooling. Alex is a good guy and with the difference
from the cost of the Van's product - it was about $100 more. Seems to work
fine.
--------
OSH '09 or Bust (busted) be there someday
Q/B Kit - end game
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=258936#258936<=- - -
- - - The RV10-List tp://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List" target
=_blank>http://www.matr - - - - - - - - - - &nbs;-->
h
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Oil Cooler Size On RV-10...? |
| From: | pilotdds(at)aol.com |
Mike do you have any photos of your mods to the oil cooler box?
-----Original Message-----
From: Michael Baldwin <michaelbaldwin7475(at)sbcglobal.net>
Sent: Fri, Aug 21, 2009 2:03 pm
Subject: Re: RV10-List: Re: Oil Cooler Size On RV-10...?
We put the Airflow?2008X on our RV-10 since our oil temps where higher than we
liked
And saw a?10 - 20?degree F drop as a result
We also installed?a baffle that splits the air flow in the Van's standard box per
recommendation from Airflow (these guys had a lot of good experience with the
RV-10 people)
You do have to modify Van's oil cooler?box to bolt the 2008X on inplace of the
standard cooler, but it can be done.? Basically?you have to turn the cooler 90
degrees and fold out the vertical sides of the box, drill a few holes and bolt
on.? Actually pretty simple change.? I felt it was worth
?
High oil temps for us was only during summer hot days coupled with?slow flight
conditions 120 -? 150 mph range. if you keep the speed up to 160 or better its
usually ok
Example would be 90?degree day and slow flight around the?pattern or sight seeing
low and slow the temp would get up to 230 F.? Now with larger cooler it only
hits 210 F.? Our 6 position CHT numbers have always been 350 or lower regarding
engine temp, so the cowling / baffling seams tight and working good.
The slow flght condition appears to be more of the issue.? I would bet a cowl flap
right under the cooler would?also work, be interested to hear if any one has
done that yet.?
?
Mike Baldwin??(see add below )
?
? Engine Parts?-?Oil Coolers?-?Airflow Systems
X-SERIES OIL COOLERS BY AIRFLOW SYSTEM
The first new aircraft oil cooler design in 50 years. Computer modeling and flight
testing have been used to develop coolers that deliver significantly lower
oil temps with no increase in oil cooler
View more details
08-06154
2006X AIRFLOW OIL COOLER EXPMT
$432.00
08-06155
2008X AIRFLOW OIL COOLER EXPMT
$493.00
?
?
--- On Fri, 8/21/09, Don McDonald wrote:
From: Don McDonald <building_partner(at)yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: RV10-List: Re: Oil Cooler Size On RV-10...?
Date: Friday, August 21, 2009, 1:49 AM
Ditto on the unit from Alex.... with the exception of the reduction in cooling...
certainly NOT 20%.... considering 200 degrees, we'd be talking about a 40 degree
reduction.? Plan on a reduction of between 5 and 15.
Don McDonald
--- On Thu, 8/20/09, AirMike wrote:
From: AirMike <Mikeabel(at)Pacbell.net>
Subject: RV10-List: Re: Oil Cooler Size On RV-10...?
Date: Thursday, August 20, 2009, 10:16 PM
I do not know about Van's, but Alex? DeDominicis (Aviation tech products)sells
one that has the identical dimensions as Van's unit for the 10 and supposedly
has 20% better cooling. Alex is a good guy and with the difference from the cost
of the Van's product - it was about $100 more. Seems to work fine.
--------
OSH '09 or Bust (busted) be there someday
Q/B Kit - end game
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=258936#258936<=? ? ? ? ? - The RV10-List tp://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List" target=_blank>http://www.matr ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? &nbs;--> h
get=_blank rel=nofollow>http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List
=nofollow>http://forums.matronics.com
blank rel=nofollow>http://www.matronics.com/contribution
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Tim Olson <Tim(at)MyRV10.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Oil Cooler Size On RV-10...? |
Does anyone have photos of this "splitter" vane thing that people
are putting in the filter box? It sounds great, and I've heard
tons about it, but never seen a photo.
Tim Olson - RV-10 N104CD
Michael Baldwin wrote:
> We put the Airflow 2008X on our RV-10 since our oil temps where higher
> than we liked
> And saw a 10 - 20 degree F drop as a result
> We also installed a baffle that splits the air flow in the Van's
> standard box per recommendation from Airflow (these guys had a lot of
> good experience with the RV-10 people)
> You do have to modify Van's oil cooler box to bolt the 2008X on inplace
> of the standard cooler, but it can be done. Basically you have to turn
> the cooler 90 degrees and fold out the vertical sides of the box, drill
> a few holes and bolt on. Actually pretty simple change. I felt it was
> worth
>
> High oil temps for us was only during summer hot days coupled with slow
> flight conditions 120 - 150 mph range. if you keep the speed up to 160
> or better its usually ok
> Example would be 90 degree day and slow flight around the pattern or
> sight seeing low and slow the temp would get up to 230 F. Now with
> larger cooler it only hits 210 F. Our 6 position CHT numbers have
> always been 350 or lower regarding engine temp, so the cowling /
> baffling seams tight and working good.
> The slow flght condition appears to be more of the issue. I would bet a
> cowl flap right under the cooler would also work, be interested to hear
> if any one has done that yet.
>
> Mike Baldwin (see add below )
>
> */ Engine Parts
> <http://www.aircraftspruce.com/menus/ep/index.html> - Oil Coolers
> <http://www.aircraftspruce.com/menus/ep/oilcoolers.html> - Airflow Systems/*
> <http://www.aircraftspruce.com/catalog/eppages/xseriesOilCooler.php>
> X-SERIES OIL COOLERS BY AIRFLOW SYSTEM
> <http://www.aircraftspruce.com/catalog/eppages/xseriesOilCooler.php>
> The first new aircraft oil cooler design in 50 years. Computer modeling
> and flight testing have been used to develop coolers that deliver
> significantly lower oil temps with no increase in oil cooler
> View more details
> <http://www.aircraftspruce.com/catalog/eppages/xseriesOilCooler.php>
> 08-06154 2006X AIRFLOW OIL COOLER EXPMT *$432.00*
> <http://www.aircraftspruce.com/neworderform.php?cmd=add&p=08-06154&q=1>
> 08-06155 2008X AIRFLOW OIL COOLER EXPMT *$493.00*
> <http://www.aircraftspruce.com/neworderform.php?cmd=add&p=08-06155&q=1>
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
>
>
>
> --- On *Fri, 8/21/09, Don McDonald //* wrote:
>
>
> From: Don McDonald <building_partner(at)yahoo.com>
> Subject: Re: RV10-List: Re: Oil Cooler Size On RV-10...?
> To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com
> Date: Friday, August 21, 2009, 1:49 AM
>
> Ditto on the unit from Alex.... with the exception of the reduction
> in cooling... certainly NOT 20%.... considering 200 degrees, we'd be
> talking about a 40 degree reduction. Plan on a reduction of between
> 5 and 15.
> Don McDonald
>
> --- On *Thu, 8/20/09, AirMike //* wrote:
>
>
> From: AirMike <Mikeabel(at)Pacbell.net>
> Subject: RV10-List: Re: Oil Cooler Size On RV-10...?
> To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com
> Date: Thursday, August 20, 2009, 10:16 PM
>
> <http://us.mc537.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=Mikeabel@Pacbell.net>>
>
> I do not know about Van's, but Alex DeDominicis (Aviation tech
> products)sells one that has the identical dimensions as Van's
> unit for the 10 and supposedly has 20% better cooling. Alex is a
> good guy and with the difference from the cost of the Van's
> product - it was about $100 more. Seems to work fine.
>
> --------
> OSH '09 or Bust (busted) be there someday
> Q/B Kit - end game
>
>
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=258936#258936<=
> - The RV10-List tp://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List"
> target=_blank>http://www.matr &nbs;--> h
>
>
>
> <http://www.matronics.com/contribution>
>
>
> *
>
> get=_blank rel=nofollow>http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List
> =nofollow>http://forums.matronics.com
> blank rel=nofollow>http://www.matronics.com/contribution
>
> *
>
> *
>
>
> *
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Deems Davis <deemsdavis(at)cox.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Oil Cooler Size On RV-10...? |
Tim,
I don't have a picture, but I'll try and describe it.
The 'splitter' itself is a piece of .032. It is the same width as the
inside dimension of the oil cooler mounting box. Its depth (from memory)
is about 3 1/2 " the bottom 3/4" of an inch of the splitter is bent with
an angle of 30-45 degs. The splitter comes with 2 .032 alum angle "L"
tabs. that are about 1/2" wide and 1/2-5/8" long. I installed mine by
pop riveting the angle flanges flush with the top of the splitter, Then
installe the splitter/diverter flange inside of the mounting and place
it midway across the circular opening. Drill (match) a # 30 hole so
that you can pop rivet the flanges to the top of the mounting . 9The
bent part of the splitter is facing forwaed. The theory is that the air
coming from the scat is split and the splitter pushes 1/2 of the air
towards the top of the oil cooler. the reports were that without it the
pressures builds up on the bottom of the wedge and more air passes
through the bottom than the top.
Deems Davis N519PJ
http://deemsrv10.com/index.html
Tim Olson wrote:
>
> Does anyone have photos of this "splitter" vane thing that people
> are putting in the filter box? It sounds great, and I've heard
> tons about it, but never seen a photo.
>
> Tim Olson - RV-10 N104CD
>
>
> Michael Baldwin wrote:
>> We put the Airflow 2008X on our RV-10 since our oil temps where
>> higher than we liked
>> And saw a 10 - 20 degree F drop as a result
>> We also installed a baffle that splits the air flow in the Van's
>> standard box per recommendation from Airflow (these guys had a lot of
>> good experience with the RV-10 people)
>> You do have to modify Van's oil cooler box to bolt the 2008X on
>> inplace of the standard cooler, but it can be done. Basically you
>> have to turn the cooler 90 degrees and fold out the vertical sides of
>> the box, drill a few holes and bolt on. Actually pretty simple
>> change. I felt it was worth
>>
>> High oil temps for us was only during summer hot days coupled with
>> slow flight conditions 120 - 150 mph range. if you keep the speed up
>> to 160 or better its usually ok
>> Example would be 90 degree day and slow flight around the pattern or
>> sight seeing low and slow the temp would get up to 230 F. Now with
>> larger cooler it only hits 210 F. Our 6 position CHT numbers have
>> always been 350 or lower regarding engine temp, so the cowling /
>> baffling seams tight and working good.
>> The slow flght condition appears to be more of the issue. I would
>> bet a cowl flap right under the cooler would also work, be interested
>> to hear if any one has done that yet.
>> Mike Baldwin (see add below )
>>
>> */ Engine Parts <http://www.aircraftspruce.com/menus/ep/index.html>
>> - Oil Coolers
>> <http://www.aircraftspruce.com/menus/ep/oilcoolers.html> - Airflow
>> Systems/*
>> <http://www.aircraftspruce.com/catalog/eppages/xseriesOilCooler.php>
>> X-SERIES OIL COOLERS BY AIRFLOW SYSTEM
>> <http://www.aircraftspruce.com/catalog/eppages/xseriesOilCooler.php>
>> The first new aircraft oil cooler design in 50 years. Computer
>> modeling and flight testing have been used to develop coolers that
>> deliver significantly lower oil temps with no increase in oil cooler
>> View more details
>> <http://www.aircraftspruce.com/catalog/eppages/xseriesOilCooler.php>
>> 08-06154 2006X AIRFLOW OIL COOLER EXPMT *$432.00*
>> <http://www.aircraftspruce.com/neworderform.php?cmd=add&p=08-06154&q=1>
>> 08-06155 2008X AIRFLOW OIL COOLER EXPMT *$493.00*
>> <http://www.aircraftspruce.com/neworderform.php?cmd=add&p=08-06155&q=1>
>>
>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> --- On *Fri, 8/21/09, Don McDonald //*
>> wrote:
>>
>>
>> From: Don McDonald <building_partner(at)yahoo.com>
>> Subject: Re: RV10-List: Re: Oil Cooler Size On RV-10...?
>> To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com
>> Date: Friday, August 21, 2009, 1:49 AM
>>
>> Ditto on the unit from Alex.... with the exception of the reduction
>> in cooling... certainly NOT 20%.... considering 200 degrees, we'd be
>> talking about a 40 degree reduction. Plan on a reduction of between
>> 5 and 15.
>> Don McDonald
>>
>> --- On *Thu, 8/20/09, AirMike //* wrote:
>>
>>
>> From: AirMike <Mikeabel(at)Pacbell.net>
>> Subject: RV10-List: Re: Oil Cooler Size On RV-10...?
>> To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com
>> Date: Thursday, August 20, 2009, 10:16 PM
>>
>>
>> <http://us.mc537.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=Mikeabel@Pacbell.net>>
>>
>> I do not know about Van's, but Alex DeDominicis (Aviation tech
>> products)sells one that has the identical dimensions as Van's
>> unit for the 10 and supposedly has 20% better cooling. Alex is a
>> good guy and with the difference from the cost of the Van's
>> product - it was about $100 more. Seems to work fine.
>>
>> --------
>> OSH '09 or Bust (busted) be there someday
>> Q/B Kit - end game
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Read this topic online here:
>>
>>
>> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=258936#258936<=
>> - The RV10-List tp://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List"
>> target=_blank>http://www.matr &nbs;--> h
>>
>>
>>
>> <http://www.matronics.com/contribution>
>>
>>
>> *
>>
>> get=_blank rel=nofollow>http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List
>> =nofollow>http://forums.matronics.com
>> blank rel=nofollow>http://www.matronics.com/contribution
>>
>> *
>>
>> *
>>
>>
>> *
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Chris and Susie" <vhicy(at)bigpond.com> |
Guys i am after a SL-30 for the 10 and wish to sell a SL-40 in perfect
working order with AD done.
Need the SL-30 to make the 10 NVFR
Also need a VOR indicator and antenna if anyone has these for sale
Please email direct and not to the list
regards chris vhmum(at)bigpond.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "David McNeill" <dlm46007(at)cox.net> |
If you already have an EFIS it is possible to display CDI info on the EFIS
screen. I am doing this with both GRT Sport and Chelton screens. It is
possible on Dynon and and AFS and possibly others.
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Chris and Susie
Sent: Saturday, August 22, 2009 3:37 AM
Subject: RV10-List: Wanted SL-30
Guys i am after a SL-30 for the 10 and wish to sell a SL-40 in perfect
working order with AD done.
Need the SL-30 to make the 10 NVFR
Also need a VOR indicator and antenna if anyone has these for sale
Please email direct and not to the list
regards chris vhmum(at)bigpond.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Chris and Susie" <vhicy(at)bigpond.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Wanted SL-30 |
Thanks David yes and we might go this way
Chris
----- Original Message -----
From: "David McNeill" <dlm46007(at)cox.net>
Sent: Saturday, August 22, 2009 10:54 PM
Subject: RE: RV10-List: Wanted SL-30
>
> If you already have an EFIS it is possible to display CDI info on the
> EFIS
> screen. I am doing this with both GRT Sport and Chelton screens. It is
> possible on Dynon and and AFS and possibly others.
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Chris and Susie
> Sent: Saturday, August 22, 2009 3:37 AM
> To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com
> Subject: RV10-List: Wanted SL-30
>
>
> Guys i am after a SL-30 for the 10 and wish to sell a SL-40 in perfect
> working order with AD done.
>
> Need the SL-30 to make the 10 NVFR
>
> Also need a VOR indicator and antenna if anyone has these for sale
>
> Please email direct and not to the list
>
> regards chris vhmum(at)bigpond.com
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | QB wing bag table of contents |
| From: | "woxofswa" <woxof(at)aol.com> |
Anyone have a link to a copy of the table of bag contents for the QB wing kit.
Please be so kind as to post a link, email, or fax.
It would be much appreciated
Myron
woxof(at)aol.com
fax 480 834 9825
--------
Myron Nelson
Mesa, AZ
Emp completed, legacy build fuse in progress
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=259115#259115
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: QB wing bag table of contents |
| From: | "woxofswa" <woxof(at)AOL.COM> |
Thanks, that is exactly what I need, unfortunately for a QB instead. The bag numbers
are different.
Appreciate the response though.
Myron
--------
Myron Nelson
Mesa, AZ
Emp completed, legacy build fuse in progress
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=259120#259120
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: QB wing bag table of contents |
| From: | "woxofswa" <woxof(at)aol.com> |
Thanks, that is exactly what I need, unfortunately for a QB instead. The bag numbers
are different.
Appreciate the response though.
Myron
--------
Myron Nelson
Mesa, AZ
Emp completed, legacy build fuse in progress
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=259121#259121
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Builders/owners in the SF Bay Area? |
| From: | Chris Colohan <rv10(at)colohan.com> |
Hi there!
I'm trying to decide whether or not I want to jump into the pool and start
building an rv-10. (Step 2: figure out if I can actually afford it.)
Before I make that leap, I thought it might be a good idea to take a look
at the finished product, and to perhaps help out with some building tasks to
make sure it is really the kind of thing I'd like to spend several years
doing. :-)
So, I'm asking:
1. Is there anyone with a finished (or nearly finished) rv-10 in the Bay
Area (or within a 100nm flight or so and near an airport) who might be
interested in showing off their work?
2. Is there anyone working on a plane who might find a second pair of
somewhat-handy hands useful? (I hear offering to hold a bucking bar is a
good thing -- but I've never set real rivets, only pop rivets, so I can't
offer loads of experience.)
3. Has anyone on this list nearly finished and have a good estimate of what
the finished product cost to build? I fear that the estimates on Van's site
might be hopelessly optimistic, and seeing some actual numbers might improve
my confidence in my building decision.
I tried heading up to Golden West to see all the planes, but the Cessna I
rented failed a mag check (and refused to clear) after waiting 30 minutes
for an IFR release. (Urk.)
Thanks!
Chris
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Rene" <rene(at)felker.com> |
| Subject: | Builders/owners in the SF Bay Area? |
Can not help you with the building part, but the Price part...
A Very conservative number for my airplane is ~160,000 before taxes. It
can
be done cheaper, I could have spent less on the engine and a little less
on
the panel. I purchased the interior and had it painted. I also have a
$6,000+ O2 System, but you need to get what you really need..want.during
the
build, it will be hard to do it later. The O2 was real important for me
because my wife gets air sick whenever we fly over 10k w/o O2. It has
worked great.
Rene'
801-721-6080
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Chris Colohan
Sent: Saturday, August 22, 2009 5:01 PM
Subject: RV10-List: Builders/owners in the SF Bay Area?
Hi there!
I'm trying to decide whether or not I want to jump into the pool and
start
building an rv-10. (Step 2: figure out if I can actually afford it.)
Before I make that leap, I thought it might be a good idea to take a
look at
the finished product, and to perhaps help out with some building tasks
to
make sure it is really the kind of thing I'd like to spend several years
doing. :-)
So, I'm asking:
1. Is there anyone with a finished (or nearly finished) rv-10 in the
Bay
Area (or within a 100nm flight or so and near an airport) who might be
interested in showing off their work?
2. Is there anyone working on a plane who might find a second pair of
somewhat-handy hands useful? (I hear offering to hold a bucking bar is
a
good thing -- but I've never set real rivets, only pop rivets, so I
can't
offer loads of experience.)
3. Has anyone on this list nearly finished and have a good estimate of
what
the finished product cost to build? I fear that the estimates on Van's
site
might be hopelessly optimistic, and seeing some actual numbers might
improve
my confidence in my building decision.
I tried heading up to Golden West to see all the planes, but the Cessna
I
rented failed a mag check (and refused to clear) after waiting 30
minutes
for an IFR release. (Urk.)
Thanks!
Chris
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Builders/owners in the SF Bay Area? |
| From: | pilotdds(at)aol.com |
I am at SCK come on by,an early example but it flys well-2094770222.Cost to complete
about 110-Do it yourself paint and a home overhaul on the engine.The RV-10
is an awesome aircraft.
-----Original Message-----
From: Chris Colohan <rv10(at)colohan.com>
Sent: Sat, Aug 22, 2009 4:01 pm
Subject: RV10-List: Builders/owners in the SF Bay Area?
Hi there!
I'm trying to decide whether or not I want to jump into the pool and start building
an rv-10. ?(Step 2: ?figure out if I can actually afford it.) ?Before I make
that leap, I thought it might be a good idea to take a look at the finished
product, and to perhaps help out with some building tasks to make sure it is
really the kind of thing I'd like to spend several years doing. ?:-)
So, I'm asking:
1. ?Is there anyone with a finished (or nearly finished) rv-10 in the Bay Area
(or within a 100nm flight or so and near an airport) who might be interested in
showing off their work?
2. ?Is there anyone working on a plane who might find a second pair of somewhat-handy
hands useful? ?(I hear offering to hold a bucking bar is a good thing --
but I've never set real rivets, only pop rivets, so I can't offer loads of experience.)
3. ?Has anyone on this list nearly finished and have a good estimate of what the
finished product cost to build? ?I fear that the estimates on Van's site might
be hopelessly optimistic, and seeing some actual numbers might improve my confidence
in my building decision.
I tried heading up to Golden West to see all the planes, but the Cessna I rented
failed a mag check (and refused to clear) after waiting 30 minutes for an IFR
release. ?(Urk.)
Thanks!
Chris
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "David McNeill" <dlm46007(at)cox.net> |
| Subject: | Builders/owners in the SF Bay Area? |
I can not help with the near by 10. A very good rule of thumb for costs is
the 3X rule. Use the airframe cost and multiply by 3 for the finished built
product. Then use the airframe cost and multiply by 9 to determine the cost
of certified equivalent. As example 50K for the 10 kit, 50k for engine and
prop and Firewall forward kit, and 50K for avionics and finishing including
a modest paint job. A 10 goes faster , carries more and is better equipped
than most new C182s. Check a new 182 price with glass panel avionics and it
is at least 400K.
_____
From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Rene
Sent: Saturday, August 22, 2009 4:44 PM
Subject: RE: RV10-List: Builders/owners in the SF Bay Area?
Can not help you with the building part, but the Price part...
A Very conservative number for my airplane is ~160,000 before taxes. It can
be done cheaper, I could have spent less on the engine and a little less on
the panel. I purchased the interior and had it painted. I also have a
$6,000+ O2 System, but you need to get what you really need..want.during the
build, it will be hard to do it later. The O2 was real important for me
because my wife gets air sick whenever we fly over 10k w/o O2. It has
worked great.
Rene'
801-721-6080
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Chris Colohan
Sent: Saturday, August 22, 2009 5:01 PM
Subject: RV10-List: Builders/owners in the SF Bay Area?
Hi there!
I'm trying to decide whether or not I want to jump into the pool and start
building an rv-10. (Step 2: figure out if I can actually afford it.)
Before I make that leap, I thought it might be a good idea to take a look at
the finished product, and to perhaps help out with some building tasks to
make sure it is really the kind of thing I'd like to spend several years
doing. :-)
So, I'm asking:
1. Is there anyone with a finished (or nearly finished) rv-10 in the Bay
Area (or within a 100nm flight or so and near an airport) who might be
interested in showing off their work?
2. Is there anyone working on a plane who might find a second pair of
somewhat-handy hands useful? (I hear offering to hold a bucking bar is a
good thing -- but I've never set real rivets, only pop rivets, so I can't
offer loads of experience.)
3. Has anyone on this list nearly finished and have a good estimate of what
the finished product cost to build? I fear that the estimates on Van's site
might be hopelessly optimistic, and seeing some actual numbers might improve
my confidence in my building decision.
I tried heading up to Golden West to see all the planes, but the Cessna I
rented failed a mag check (and refused to clear) after waiting 30 minutes
for an IFR release. (Urk.)
Thanks!
Chris
http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List
http://forums.matronics.com
http://www.matronics.com/contribution
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Builders/owners in the SF Bay Area? |
| From: | "Bob Turner" <bobturner(at)alum.rpi.edu> |
I'm in Castro Valley, #40745. I also know Dave, in Livermore, #40746 (just coincidence
on the numbers!). We're both on the finish kit stage (which definitely
does not mean it's finished - maybe 60% of the way there. We're both working
in garages (he has a 3 car garage, I have a smallish 2 car garage). If you'd like
to come by, see what it looks like stuffed into a garage like this, talk about
the work, the cost to date, expected final cost, etc., I'd be happy to host
you, and I'm sure Dave would, too. email me at if you'd like to visit.
--------
Bob Turner
RV-10 QB
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=259147#259147
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Builders/owners in the SF Bay Area? |
| From: | Dave Saylor <dave.saylor.aircrafters(at)gmail.com> |
Chris,
We're in Watsonville, near Monterey, at KWVI. I have a 10 that I finished
in '07 now with 475 hours.
I'd be happy to take you for a quick flight and show you around our shop.
Just give me a call and we can set up a time for you come over and see a
bunch of experimentals, including my 10. We do SportAir weekend workshops
with EAA and other workshops too.
Best Regards,
Dave Saylor
AirCrafters LLC
140 Aviation Way
Watsonville, CA 95076
831-722-9141 Shop
831-750-0284 Cell
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Tim Olson <Tim(at)MyRV10.com> |
| Subject: | LOP (Lean of Peak) Injector Tuning |
For those who are interested in running LOP and who want to
get better injector tuning to make their engine run smooth
when Lean of Peak, I wrote up my recent experience in tuning
the injectors. It was cheap, and very very easy.
http://www.myrv10.com/N104CD/upgrades/20090822/index.html
There will be a future update to the write-up, as I'm working
on a project on another engine, but the info here should give
you what you need to get started tweaking your own system.
It's so simple that there's no reason not to get your engine
set up for great operation.
--
Tim Olson - RV-10 N104CD
540 hours and climbing
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Tim Olson <Tim(at)MyRV10.com> |
| Subject: | LOP (Lean of Peak) Injector Tuning |
For those who are interested in running LOP and who want to
get better injector tuning to make their engine run smooth
when Lean of Peak, I wrote up my recent experience in tuning
the injectors. It was cheap, and very very easy.
http://www.myrv10.com/N104CD/upgrades/20090822/index.html
There will be a future update to the write-up, as I'm working
on a project on another engine, but the info here should give
you what you need to get started tweaking your own system.
It's so simple that there's no reason not to get your engine
set up for great operation.
--
Tim Olson - RV-10 N104CD
540 hours and climbing
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Lew Gallagher" <lewgall(at)charter.net> |
| Subject: | IO-540 online manual - Lew |
Hey Tim,
If you're back from vacation, did someone ever send you the online IO-540
manual? If so, could you send it to me? I've been looking for it also and
apparently those who used to post a link to it have been shut down -- maybe
copywright problems?
Thanks, - Lew
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "David McNeill" <dlm46007(at)cox.net> |
Attached is a picture of the GRT Sport that backs up my Chelton displays; it
has a LOP lean function where the boxes appear as each EGT peaks and then
declines. The GRT EIS is feeding both the Chelton and the GRT Sport with
serial data on engine performance. The two Chelton screens show comparable
data from about the same time. Fortunately I did not have to balance my
injectors as the spread of both EGTs and CHTs seemed adequate. My engine was
a new certified IO540 from Vans.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "richard sipp" <rsipp(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | Re: LOP (Lean of Peak) Injector Tuning |
Tim:
Great post as usual on your injector balancing experience. I had very
nearly the same experience and results with two minor variations; a complete
Airflow Performance system vs. your Silver Hawk and we started by installing
.026's in all cylinders and then balancing. I ran most of the tests at
10-11 MSL and verified at the results at 7.5. Don R. felt that at the lower
power settings of around 50-60% the flow divider begins to be the
determining factor and by going to the smaller .026s the flow divider is
taken out of the equation.
There was an interesting series of pictures and notes regarding burned
pistons (don't remember where I saw them) where the author thought the cause
was "rapid" mixture leaning used by LOP operators. He felt the rapid rise
in EGT was the cause. I disagree. GAMI recommends the "big pull" from rich
to LOP and then a finer adujustment to prevent spending more time in the
danger zone of peak to 100 rich of peak. Also with a rapid initial mixture
leaning I doubt the cylinder or piston temp will increase before it cools
from steady LOP operation. Further at <65% I do not think you can do
anything to the mixture that would harm or overstress the engine.
Regarding long range cruise I was happy to find that my engine seems equally
smooth at 2250 as at higher RPM. I see about a 1GPH reduction in fuel flow
with each 100 RPM reduction at full throttle settings and there is very
little airspeed loss as the prop is taking bigger bits (sorta like
overdrive). Charles Lindberg showed the P-38 pilots in the South Pacific how
to double their range by running "over square and lean". Finally, to
prevent the prop driving the engine during higher speed descents I keep the
RPM at least "2" oversquare below manifold pressure. This is common
practice with the big radials and it would seem equally applicable to our
engines.
Dick Sipp
N110DV 175 hours
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "gary" <speckter(at)comcast.net> |
| Subject: | LOP (Lean of Peak) Injector Tuning |
Is there a danger with running too much over square? Dick mentions 2" but I
have been running more than that (2200 and 26")LOP. I have not seen much
info on running over square.
Gary Specketer
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of richard sipp
Sent: Saturday, August 22, 2009 11:57 PM
Subject: Re: RV10-List: LOP (Lean of Peak) Injector Tuning
Tim:
Great post as usual on your injector balancing experience. I had very
nearly the same experience and results with two minor variations; a complete
Airflow Performance system vs. your Silver Hawk and we started by installing
.026's in all cylinders and then balancing. I ran most of the tests at
10-11 MSL and verified at the results at 7.5. Don R. felt that at the lower
power settings of around 50-60% the flow divider begins to be the
determining factor and by going to the smaller .026s the flow divider is
taken out of the equation.
There was an interesting series of pictures and notes regarding burned
pistons (don't remember where I saw them) where the author thought the cause
was "rapid" mixture leaning used by LOP operators. He felt the rapid rise
in EGT was the cause. I disagree. GAMI recommends the "big pull" from rich
to LOP and then a finer adujustment to prevent spending more time in the
danger zone of peak to 100 rich of peak. Also with a rapid initial mixture
leaning I doubt the cylinder or piston temp will increase before it cools
from steady LOP operation. Further at <65% I do not think you can do
anything to the mixture that would harm or overstress the engine.
Regarding long range cruise I was happy to find that my engine seems equally
smooth at 2250 as at higher RPM. I see about a 1GPH reduction in fuel flow
with each 100 RPM reduction at full throttle settings and there is very
little airspeed loss as the prop is taking bigger bits (sorta like
overdrive). Charles Lindberg showed the P-38 pilots in the South Pacific how
to double their range by running "over square and lean". Finally, to
prevent the prop driving the engine during higher speed descents I keep the
RPM at least "2" oversquare below manifold pressure. This is common
practice with the big radials and it would seem equally applicable to our
engines.
Dick Sipp
N110DV 175 hours
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: LOP (Lean of Peak) Injector Tuning |
| From: | "N777TY" <microsmurfer(at)yahoo.com> |
Dick,
I think you're referring to this document:
http://www.eci.aero/pdf/93-6-7.pdf
(though, no photos in it..)
--------
RV-7A
N777TY
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=259171#259171
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | LOP (Lean of Peak) Injector Tuning |
| From: | "John Cox" <johnwcox(at)pacificnw.com> |
The challenge is to avoid Detonation and the earlier than planned
destruction of the engine. That can be a factor of compression ratio of
the cylinder, quality and octane of the AVGAS, carbon and garbage
deposits inside the combustion chamber and the ignition event. The
lower the RPM, the higher the throttle the greater the risk.
Several pilots are running upward of 10.0:1 pistons, choose their avgas
supplier wisely, run a well timed ignition system and gently increase
the throttle. GAMI has made a business of educating pilots. Others try
marginal gas quality, ragged ignitions and throw caution to the wind.
Choose wisely. Fly Safe. Check your % of power tables for LOP
operations.
John
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of gary
Sent: Sunday, August 23, 2009 5:08 AM
Subject: RE: RV10-List: LOP (Lean of Peak) Injector Tuning
Is there a danger with running too much over square? Dick mentions 2"
but I
have been running more than that (2200 and 26")LOP. I have not seen much
info on running over square.
Gary Specketer
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of richard sipp
Sent: Saturday, August 22, 2009 11:57 PM
Subject: Re: RV10-List: LOP (Lean of Peak) Injector Tuning
Tim:
Great post as usual on your injector balancing experience. I had very
nearly the same experience and results with two minor variations; a
complete
Airflow Performance system vs. your Silver Hawk and we started by
installing
.026's in all cylinders and then balancing. I ran most of the tests at
10-11 MSL and verified at the results at 7.5. Don R. felt that at the
lower
power settings of around 50-60% the flow divider begins to be the
determining factor and by going to the smaller .026s the flow divider is
taken out of the equation.
There was an interesting series of pictures and notes regarding burned
pistons (don't remember where I saw them) where the author thought the
cause
was "rapid" mixture leaning used by LOP operators. He felt the rapid
rise
in EGT was the cause. I disagree. GAMI recommends the "big pull" from
rich
to LOP and then a finer adujustment to prevent spending more time in the
danger zone of peak to 100 rich of peak. Also with a rapid initial
mixture
leaning I doubt the cylinder or piston temp will increase before it
cools
from steady LOP operation. Further at <65% I do not think you can do
anything to the mixture that would harm or overstress the engine.
Regarding long range cruise I was happy to find that my engine seems
equally
smooth at 2250 as at higher RPM. I see about a 1GPH reduction in fuel
flow
with each 100 RPM reduction at full throttle settings and there is very
little airspeed loss as the prop is taking bigger bits (sorta like
overdrive). Charles Lindberg showed the P-38 pilots in the South Pacific
how
to double their range by running "over square and lean". Finally, to
prevent the prop driving the engine during higher speed descents I keep
the
RPM at least "2" oversquare below manifold pressure. This is common
practice with the big radials and it would seem equally applicable to
our
engines.
Dick Sipp
N110DV 175 hours
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Deems Davis <deemsdavis(at)cox.net> |
| Subject: | Re: LOP (Lean of Peak) Injector Tuning |
All of the LOP information is GREAT. Keep it coming !!!!!!! I have a
question:
When leaning the engine, the 'old traditional / prior to gages' way was
to lean it until it begins to 'stumble' and then richen it up a bit.
When I lean using the EGT gages I notice the 'stumble' when the 1st
cylinder goes lean. If you continue to lean until all of the remaining
cylinders peak (LOP), What happens to the 'stumble' ??? Does it even out
/ go way with the engine running smooth? Does it persist? Since any
changes in the engines smooth running are a concern in flight, I'd
appreciate learning what those of you that are routinely running LOP are
experiencing.
Deems Davis N519PJ
http://deemsrv10.com/index.html
gary wrote:
>
> Is there a danger with running too much over square? Dick mentions 2" but I
> have been running more than that (2200 and 26")LOP. I have not seen much
> info on running over square.
>
> Gary Specketer
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of richard sipp
> Sent: Saturday, August 22, 2009 11:57 PM
> To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com
> Subject: Re: RV10-List: LOP (Lean of Peak) Injector Tuning
>
>
> Tim:
>
> Great post as usual on your injector balancing experience. I had very
> nearly the same experience and results with two minor variations; a complete
>
> Airflow Performance system vs. your Silver Hawk and we started by installing
>
> .026's in all cylinders and then balancing. I ran most of the tests at
> 10-11 MSL and verified at the results at 7.5. Don R. felt that at the lower
>
> power settings of around 50-60% the flow divider begins to be the
> determining factor and by going to the smaller .026s the flow divider is
> taken out of the equation.
>
> There was an interesting series of pictures and notes regarding burned
> pistons (don't remember where I saw them) where the author thought the cause
>
> was "rapid" mixture leaning used by LOP operators. He felt the rapid rise
> in EGT was the cause. I disagree. GAMI recommends the "big pull" from rich
>
> to LOP and then a finer adujustment to prevent spending more time in the
> danger zone of peak to 100 rich of peak. Also with a rapid initial mixture
> leaning I doubt the cylinder or piston temp will increase before it cools
> from steady LOP operation. Further at <65% I do not think you can do
> anything to the mixture that would harm or overstress the engine.
>
> Regarding long range cruise I was happy to find that my engine seems equally
>
> smooth at 2250 as at higher RPM. I see about a 1GPH reduction in fuel flow
> with each 100 RPM reduction at full throttle settings and there is very
> little airspeed loss as the prop is taking bigger bits (sorta like
> overdrive). Charles Lindberg showed the P-38 pilots in the South Pacific how
>
> to double their range by running "over square and lean". Finally, to
> prevent the prop driving the engine during higher speed descents I keep the
> RPM at least "2" oversquare below manifold pressure. This is common
> practice with the big radials and it would seem equally applicable to our
> engines.
>
> Dick Sipp
> N110DV 175 hours
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bill DeRouchey <billderou(at)yahoo.com> |
| Subject: | Re: LOP (Lean of Peak) Injector Tuning |
I believe tuning the injector nozzles will create a smoother running engine
and that in itself has value. However, I have been mystified during these
conversations as to the value of running LOP vs fuel economy. There was nev
er enough data in the emails to get the whole picture. The-question I alw
ays had was-how much speed are you willing to loose to gain how much-fu
el efficiency?
-
Thanks to Dave's pic of his panel and my own experience I was able to put a
picture together.
-
The following numbers are in statute miles and the Density Altitude is simi
lar. If we assume that the top speed of our RV-10's is 205mph then Dave is
flying 20% (164.5smph) under max and achieving 18.6smpg while leaned to app
rox 25deg LOP. An averaged flight in my plane is 6% under max speed (193smp
h) achieving 19.1smpg while leaned to peak. My definition of peak is when 3
cylinders drop.
-
Typical panel setup for me is: WOT, 10-13K feet, 2380-2420rpm, 10.1-10.3gph
, lean to peak.
-
These are only two-datapoints. What are others achieving? And please prov
ide the whole picture - what is-the percent under max speed you are willi
ng to fly and the miles per gallon you are achieving as a benefit. I assume
the whole LOP (other than a smooth engine) is to achieve fuel efficiency.
-
What am I missing?
-
Bill DeRouchey
N939SB
-
-
-
-
--- On Sun, 8/23/09, Deems Davis wrote:
From: Deems Davis <deemsdavis(at)cox.net>
Subject: Re: RV10-List: LOP (Lean of Peak) Injector Tuning
Date: Sunday, August 23, 2009, 8:22 AM
All of the LOP information is GREAT. Keep it coming !!!!!!! I have a questi
on:
When leaning the engine, the 'old traditional / prior to gages' way was to
lean it until it begins to 'stumble' and then richen it up a bit. When I le
an using the EGT gages I notice the 'stumble' when the 1st cylinder goes le
an. If you continue to lean until all of the remaining cylinders peak (LOP)
, What happens to the 'stumble' ??? Does it even out / go way with the engi
ne running smooth? Does it persist? Since any changes in the engines smooth
running are a concern in flight, I'd appreciate learning what those of you
that are routinely running LOP are experiencing.
Deems Davis N519PJ
http://deemsrv10.com/index.html
gary wrote:
>
> Is there a danger with running too much over square?- Dick mentions 2"
but I
> have been running more than that (2200 and 26")LOP. I have not seen much
> info on running over square.
>
> Gary Specketer
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of richard sipp
> Sent: Saturday, August 22, 2009 11:57 PM
> To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com
> Subject: Re: RV10-List: LOP (Lean of Peak) Injector Tuning
>
>
> Tim:
>
> Great post as usual on your injector balancing experience.- I had very
nearly the same experience and results with two minor variations; a complet
e
>
> Airflow Performance system vs. your Silver Hawk and we started by install
ing
>
> .026's in all cylinders and then balancing.- I ran most of the tests at
10-11 MSL and verified at the results at 7.5.- Don R. felt that at the l
ower
>
> power settings of around 50-60% the flow divider begins to be the determi
ning factor and by going to the smaller .026s the flow divider is taken out
of the equation.
>
> There was an interesting series of pictures and notes regarding burned pi
stons (don't remember where I saw them) where the author thought the cause
>
> was "rapid" mixture leaning used by LOP operators.- He felt the rapid r
ise in EGT was the cause.- I disagree.- GAMI recommends the "big pull"
from rich
>
> to LOP and then a finer adujustment to prevent spending more time in the
danger zone of peak to 100 rich of peak.- Also with a rapid initial mixtu
re leaning I doubt the cylinder or piston temp will increase before it cool
s from steady LOP operation.- Further at <65% I do not think you can do a
nything to the mixture that would harm or overstress the engine.
>
> Regarding long range cruise I was happy to find that my engine seems equa
lly
>
> smooth at 2250 as at higher RPM.- I see about a 1GPH reduction in fuel
flow with each 100 RPM reduction at full throttle settings and there is ver
y little airspeed loss as the prop is taking bigger bits (sorta like overdr
ive). Charles Lindberg showed the P-38 pilots in the South Pacific how
>
> to double their range by running "over square and lean".- Finally, to p
revent the prop driving the engine during higher speed descents I keep the
RPM at least "2" oversquare below manifold pressure.- This is common prac
tice with the big radials and it would seem equally applicable to our engin
es.
>
> Dick Sipp
> N110DV 175 hours
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>---
le, List Admin.
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Garmin G900X Users Group? |
| From: | "Robin Marks" <robin1(at)mrmoisture.com> |
Does anyone know of a Garmin Users Group? Ideally a G900X or G1000 users
group? I have many (basic) questions about my avionics that don't seem
to be covered by the 500+ page manual.
Robin
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Tim Olson <Tim(at)MyRV10.com> |
| Subject: | Re: LOP (Lean of Peak) Injector Tuning |
This is just a guess, for me, to answer your question, but first
I'll pass on what my experience has been...
When I lean up to and past peak, there is never a period where
it stumbles. It keeps running smoothly and as you get further
and further LOP, you can hear the engine start to lose power...
it gets quieter. If you run that way for a couple minutes and
adapt to the sound, you will easily hear and feel the extra
power come back as you richen it up towards that -25 to -50F
LOP again...and feel even more power as you richen it back to
ROP operation. The old "lean to stumble" works well with the
carbureted planes I guess. (In my opinion though if it's
really that non-precise, carbureted engines in general are
kind of "sloppy", and not really going to be nearly as
good for LOP) Probably everyone should be using a 6 probe
monitor for their operations.
So my opinion on the answer to the question would be...since
you're running a fuel injected engine, if it's stumbling
when it gets to peak on one cylinder, I would guess (just
a guess) that it won't go away as you keep leaning further.
It would probably be the case that something is preventing
you from getting it smooth...be it timing, compression, or
something else. The hope is that you can determine what
exactly that is, and then make it work so it is smooth.
This is the big headache for me in the later part of that
writeup. My pal with the 10:1 pistons, we really have to
apply ourselves to figure that one out. He ordered the .026
injectors, so we'll see soon how that plays out. Maybe that
would be all it would take for you too. I'm hoping that we
can make it perfect and then provide more info to all others
who face the same hurdle.
I am just finally able to get to replying today, and I've
gotten a couple of great offline emails. One of them
brought up something that I should mention that is
important and I'll add this warning into the write-up soon.
I wrote there that you should use a timing light to time
both systems. This is something basically being said by
Klaus at Lightspeed. Of course, it's in his interest to
urge you to be very precise in determining timing. It would
be ideal if you knew it exactly. But, timing a system with
a timing light, being up by the prop when it's moving,
is a very dangerous thing. The writer, and A&P himself, said
that static timing of a mag can be very good. I agree.
I felt like a slacker that I've never used a timing light
on my plane, but I feel my mag was timed pretty well by
standard simple static timing. But, in this extreme case
of this 10:1 engine, I'm not sure what to do. Klaus
says use a timing light and get it exact...then tweak
the systems or maybe just the mag, and do some testing...try
advancing a little. I don't know what to say but...BE
CAREFUL if you're working near a moving prop....take it from
Stein. :)
Also, I assumed that with higher compression you would need
to slightly retard the timing. That may not be the case.
Klaus said LOP sometimes works better with advanced timing.
Anyway, he said not to use the adjustable timing knob addition
on the lightspeed..it's too dangerous to mess with. But,
the one big thing he did say that makes perfect sense is
to READ THE INSTALLATION MANUAL AND FOLLOW THE DIRECTIONS.
So, we're also going back into the Lightspeed install and
going to make sure the engine is set up properly per that
manual.
Wish it was simple answers for everyone, but there are going
to be some unique cases, with the various engine setups.
Tim Olson - RV-10 N104CD
Deems Davis wrote:
>
> All of the LOP information is GREAT. Keep it coming !!!!!!! I have a
> question:
>
> When leaning the engine, the 'old traditional / prior to gages' way was
> to lean it until it begins to 'stumble' and then richen it up a bit.
> When I lean using the EGT gages I notice the 'stumble' when the 1st
> cylinder goes lean. If you continue to lean until all of the remaining
> cylinders peak (LOP), What happens to the 'stumble' ??? Does it even out
> / go way with the engine running smooth? Does it persist? Since any
> changes in the engines smooth running are a concern in flight, I'd
> appreciate learning what those of you that are routinely running LOP are
> experiencing.
>
> Deems Davis N519PJ
> http://deemsrv10.com/index.html
>
> gary wrote:
>>
>> Is there a danger with running too much over square? Dick mentions 2"
>> but I
>> have been running more than that (2200 and 26")LOP. I have not seen much
>> info on running over square.
>>
>> Gary Specketer
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com
>> [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of richard sipp
>> Sent: Saturday, August 22, 2009 11:57 PM
>> To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com
>> Subject: Re: RV10-List: LOP (Lean of Peak) Injector Tuning
>>
>>
>> Tim:
>>
>> Great post as usual on your injector balancing experience. I had very
>> nearly the same experience and results with two minor variations; a
>> complete
>>
>> Airflow Performance system vs. your Silver Hawk and we started by
>> installing
>>
>> .026's in all cylinders and then balancing. I ran most of the tests
>> at 10-11 MSL and verified at the results at 7.5. Don R. felt that at
>> the lower
>>
>> power settings of around 50-60% the flow divider begins to be the
>> determining factor and by going to the smaller .026s the flow divider
>> is taken out of the equation.
>>
>> There was an interesting series of pictures and notes regarding burned
>> pistons (don't remember where I saw them) where the author thought the
>> cause
>>
>> was "rapid" mixture leaning used by LOP operators. He felt the rapid
>> rise in EGT was the cause. I disagree. GAMI recommends the "big
>> pull" from rich
>>
>> to LOP and then a finer adujustment to prevent spending more time in
>> the danger zone of peak to 100 rich of peak. Also with a rapid
>> initial mixture leaning I doubt the cylinder or piston temp will
>> increase before it cools from steady LOP operation. Further at <65% I
>> do not think you can do anything to the mixture that would harm or
>> overstress the engine.
>>
>> Regarding long range cruise I was happy to find that my engine seems
>> equally
>>
>> smooth at 2250 as at higher RPM. I see about a 1GPH reduction in fuel
>> flow with each 100 RPM reduction at full throttle settings and there
>> is very little airspeed loss as the prop is taking bigger bits (sorta
>> like overdrive). Charles Lindberg showed the P-38 pilots in the South
>> Pacific how
>>
>> to double their range by running "over square and lean". Finally, to
>> prevent the prop driving the engine during higher speed descents I
>> keep the RPM at least "2" oversquare below manifold pressure. This is
>> common practice with the big radials and it would seem equally
>> applicable to our engines.
>>
>> Dick Sipp
>> N110DV 175 hours
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "David McNeill" <dlm46007(at)cox.net> |
| Subject: | Glastar flyer/ RV10 builder |
IIRC there was an RV10 builder who was flying a Glastar for fun while
building. If he will identify himself off list I will send pictures of the
use of an RV10 nose fork on the Glastar to improve rough/soft field
performance. Just completed the Glastar mod this morning to 15/600-5 main
wheels and a 500-5 nose wheel.
N46007 RV10 190TT
N48007 Glastar 515TT
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "gary" <speckter(at)comcast.net> |
| Subject: | Garmin G900X Users Group? |
Robin, if you want to start one, count me in.
Gary Specketer
_____
From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Robin Marks
Sent: Sunday, August 23, 2009 11:55 AM
Subject: RV10-List: Garmin G900X Users Group?
Does anyone know of a Garmin Users Group? Ideally a G900X or G1000 users
group? I have many (basic) questions about my avionics that don't seem to be
covered by the 500+ page manual.
Robin
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Kelly McMullen <kellym(at)aviating.com> |
| Subject: | Re: LOP (Lean of Peak) Injector Tuning |
Deems, if you get a stumble when first cylinder reaches peak you may
need some injector matching. While I may sense a hint of roughness as I
get near the last cylinder to peak, there is no stumble and continue to
run fine until it wants to quit near 70 LOP.
Deems Davis wrote:
>
> All of the LOP information is GREAT. Keep it coming !!!!!!! I have a
> question:
>
> When leaning the engine, the 'old traditional / prior to gages' way was
> to lean it until it begins to 'stumble' and then richen it up a bit.
> When I lean using the EGT gages I notice the 'stumble' when the 1st
> cylinder goes lean. If you continue to lean until all of the remaining
> cylinders peak (LOP), What happens to the 'stumble' ??? Does it even out
> / go way with the engine running smooth? Does it persist? Since any
> changes in the engines smooth running are a concern in flight, I'd
> appreciate learning what those of you that are routinely running LOP are
> experiencing.
>
> Deems Davis N519PJ
> http://deemsrv10.com/index.html
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Kelly McMullen <kellym(at)aviating.com> |
| Subject: | Re: LOP (Lean of Peak) Injector Tuning |
Hi Bill,
LOP fuel economy is only one part of the picture, and is NOT the main
reason to do it. Your engine will run cleaner, use less oil and last
longer running LOP. It causes the flame to burn slower(like higher
octane) giving a flatter pressure pulse to the piston, so that the peak
pressure is less, but the average work is close to same. If you are
below 7500(approx) you can add throttle to make up for lost power. As
long as you are LOP, power =14.9 * gal/hr. So 10gph=149hp. (57%)
75% then = 13.1 gph, if, and only if, you are running LOP. So if you can
find an altitude where you can go LOP and then adjust throttle for 13.1
gph, you should see somewhere around 190mph. Of course once you are high
enough that you are at WOT and less than 13.1 your power is less and
speed will be less. I typically give up 5-7kts to fly LOP, which is
okay as long as I am not fighting a headwind.
Bill DeRouchey wrote:
> These are only two datapoints. What are others achieving? And please
> provide the whole picture - what is the percent under max speed you are
> willing to fly and the miles per gallon you are achieving as a benefit.
> I assume the whole LOP (other than a smooth engine) is to achieve fuel
> efficiency.
>
> What am I missing?
>
> Bill DeRouchey
> N939SB
>
>
>
>
>
> --- On *Sun, 8/23/09, Deems Davis //* wrote:
>
>
> From: Deems Davis <deemsdavis(at)cox.net>
> Subject: Re: RV10-List: LOP (Lean of Peak) Injector Tuning
> To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com
> Date: Sunday, August 23, 2009, 8:22 AM
>
> <http://us.mc344.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=deemsdavis@cox.net>>
>
> All of the LOP information is GREAT. Keep it coming !!!!!!! I have a
> question:
>
> When leaning the engine, the 'old traditional / prior to gages' way
> was to lean it until it begins to 'stumble' and then richen it up a
> bit. When I lean using the EGT gages I notice the 'stumble' when the
> 1st cylinder goes lean. If you continue to lean until all of the
> remaining cylinders peak (LOP), What happens to the 'stumble' ???
> Does it even out / go way with the engine running smooth? Does it
> persist? Since any changes in the engines smooth running are a
> concern in flight, I'd appreciate learning what those of you that
> are routinely running LOP are experiencing.
>
> Deems Davis N519PJ
> http://deemsrv10.com/index.html
>
> gary wrote:
> <http://us.mc344.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=speckter@comcast.net>>
> >
> > Is there a danger with running too much over square? Dick
> mentions 2" but I
> > have been running more than that (2200 and 26")LOP. I have not
> seen much
> > info on running over square.
> >
> > Gary Specketer
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com
> <http://us.mc344.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com>
> > [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com
> <http://us.mc344.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com>]
> On Behalf Of richard sipp
> > Sent: Saturday, August 22, 2009 11:57 PM
> > To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com
> <http://us.mc344.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=rv10-list@matronics.com>
> > Subject: Re: RV10-List: LOP (Lean of Peak) Injector Tuning
> >
> <http://us.mc344.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=rsipp@earthlink.net>>
> >
> > Tim:
> >
> > Great post as usual on your injector balancing experience. I had
> very nearly the same experience and results with two minor
> variations; a complete
> >
> > Airflow Performance system vs. your Silver Hawk and we started by
> installing
> >
> > .026's in all cylinders and then balancing. I ran most of the
> tests at 10-11 MSL and verified at the results at 7.5. Don R. felt
> that at the lower
> >
> > power settings of around 50-60% the flow divider begins to be the
> determining factor and by going to the smaller .026s the flow
> divider is taken out of the equation.
> >
> > There was an interesting series of pictures and notes regarding
> burned pistons (don't remember where I saw them) where the author
> thought the cause
> >
> > was "rapid" mixture leaning used by LOP operators. He felt the
> rapid rise in EGT was the cause. I disagree. GAMI recommends the
> "big pull" from rich
> >
> > to LOP and then a finer adujustment to prevent spending more time
> in the danger zone of peak to 100 rich of peak. Also with a rapid
> initial mixture leaning I doubt the cylinder or piston temp will
> increase before it cools from steady LOP operation. Further at <65%
> I do not think you can do anything to the mixture that would harm or
> overstress the engine.
> >
> > Regarding long range cruise I was happy to find that my engine
> seems equally
> >
> > smooth at 2250 as at higher RPM. I see about a 1GPH reduction in
> fuel flow with each 100 RPM reduction at full throttle settings and
> there is very little airspeed loss as the prop is taking bigger bits
> (sorta like overdrive). Charles Lindberg showed the P-38 pilots in
> the South Pacific how
> >
> > to double their range by running "over square and lean".
> Finally, to prevent the prop driving the engine during higher speed
> descents I keep the RPM at least "2" oversquare below manifold
> pressure. This is common practice with the big radials and it would
> seem equally applicable to our engines.
> >
> > Dick Sipp
> > N110DV 175 hours
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > =======================
> <http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List>http://www.mat====================
>
>
>
> <http://forums.matronics.com/>
>
> *
>
>
> *
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Garmin G900X Users Group? |
| From: | "Robin Marks" <robin1(at)mrmoisture.com> |
The blind leading the blind?
Gary are you flying behind a G900X now? If so maybe we could talk
offline to find out where each if us is confused (other than Garmin's
poor documentation). Note: I believe Garmin specifically limited it's
documentation to limit its liability.
Robin
From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of gary
Sent: Sunday, August 23, 2009 3:12 PM
Subject: RE: RV10-List: Garmin G900X Users Group?
Robin, if you want to start one, count me in.
Gary Specketer
________________________________
From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Robin Marks
Sent: Sunday, August 23, 2009 11:55 AM
Subject: RV10-List: Garmin G900X Users Group?
Does anyone know of a Garmin Users Group? Ideally a G900X or G1000 users
group? I have many (basic) questions about my avionics that don't seem
to be covered by the 500+ page manual.
Robin
http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List
http://forums.matronics.com
http://www.matronics.com/contribution
Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
08/23/09 06:18:00
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "richard sipp" <rsipp(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | Re: LOP (Lean of Peak) Injector Tuning |
There are limits to "oversquare" operation on the power charts in the
Lycoming operators manual. They vary with all the other engine parameters
but
the limits are higher than one would probably guess, several inches MP over
RPM in hundreds in most cases. These are the hard to read two page charts
and the limit is just a line and is easy to miss.
My normal cruise is 55-65% power, 10.5-11.5 GPH and 160-165 KTAS.
Dick Sipp
----- Original Message -----
From: "gary" <speckter(at)comcast.net>
Sent: Sunday, August 23, 2009 8:07 AM
Subject: RE: RV10-List: LOP (Lean of Peak) Injector Tuning
>
> Is there a danger with running too much over square? Dick mentions 2" but
> I
> have been running more than that (2200 and 26")LOP. I have not seen much
> info on running over square.
>
> Gary Specketer
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of richard sipp
> Sent: Saturday, August 22, 2009 11:57 PM
> To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com
> Subject: Re: RV10-List: LOP (Lean of Peak) Injector Tuning
>
>
> Tim:
>
> Great post as usual on your injector balancing experience. I had very
> nearly the same experience and results with two minor variations; a
> complete
>
> Airflow Performance system vs. your Silver Hawk and we started by
> installing
>
> .026's in all cylinders and then balancing. I ran most of the tests at
> 10-11 MSL and verified at the results at 7.5. Don R. felt that at the
> lower
>
> power settings of around 50-60% the flow divider begins to be the
> determining factor and by going to the smaller .026s the flow divider is
> taken out of the equation.
>
> There was an interesting series of pictures and notes regarding burned
> pistons (don't remember where I saw them) where the author thought the
> cause
>
> was "rapid" mixture leaning used by LOP operators. He felt the rapid rise
> in EGT was the cause. I disagree. GAMI recommends the "big pull" from
> rich
>
> to LOP and then a finer adujustment to prevent spending more time in the
> danger zone of peak to 100 rich of peak. Also with a rapid initial
> mixture
> leaning I doubt the cylinder or piston temp will increase before it cools
> from steady LOP operation. Further at <65% I do not think you can do
> anything to the mixture that would harm or overstress the engine.
>
> Regarding long range cruise I was happy to find that my engine seems
> equally
>
> smooth at 2250 as at higher RPM. I see about a 1GPH reduction in fuel
> flow
> with each 100 RPM reduction at full throttle settings and there is very
> little airspeed loss as the prop is taking bigger bits (sorta like
> overdrive). Charles Lindberg showed the P-38 pilots in the South Pacific
> how
>
> to double their range by running "over square and lean". Finally, to
> prevent the prop driving the engine during higher speed descents I keep
> the
> RPM at least "2" oversquare below manifold pressure. This is common
> practice with the big radials and it would seem equally applicable to our
> engines.
>
> Dick Sipp
> N110DV 175 hours
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Tim Olson <Tim(at)MyRV10.com> |
| Subject: | Re: LOP (Lean of Peak) Injector Tuning |
Bill,
Regarding the speeds, I don't know why Dave was only getting 164.5
statute mph, but my LOP cruise is typically way better than that,
which is about 143kts, right? If I am way lean of peak, and/or
very heavy loaded, I MAY get slowed down to 155-156kts TAS, but
on plenty of trips I'm seeing speeds of 164-166kts at LOP cruise.
If I fly ROP, I'd say most commonly I'll see 173-175kts, sometimes
slower. I've found that between leaning variations, turbulence,
altitudes flown, and loadings, that the speed can be all over the
map, but I don't know that I've ever really seen constant enroute
cruise figures of less than 152kts on my trips. So if I am
getting, say 189-190 statue mph on many flights, and I'm generally
burning 9.5-10.5 gph at my most commonly flown altitudes,
I'm probably pushing right up near that same 19.1 statue mpg
on many flights. There are times I'm a bit less, but loadings
and the other factors don't always duplicate themselves. I'll
tell you what though, there's no way that I'm not getting
better efficiency than someone flying ROP. As Kelly pointed
out, it's the temps, the cleanness, and all sorts of other
things that are benefits too. I'd say that you will usually
lose 6-10kts depending on many factors, such as how far you
lean past peak. I usually just go for 25 LOP on the last
cyl. to peak.
Regarding flying ROP or at peak, like you are talking about,
I tend to agree that if you're way down in power like at
65%, you're probably not going to hurt anything too bad.
But, for those who are running 50-100 ROP, you probably
want to do a bit of studying up. I don't have the numbers
committed to memory, but there is a window at higher power
settings where you really don't want to stay, and I
think in order to stay out of it you really have to
either fly WAY ROP, or go LOP. Again, don't quote me,
but if you venture over 75% power, I'd avoid that range
from maybe 125 to 0 ROP. (Can someone verify that? I've got
docs but I'm not going to dig them up right this minute)
So I'm not saying you're doing anything wrong, at the
lower power levels you can get away with anything. But,
I think you picked a pretty lowball datapoint from David
if you're going to use his 164.5smph. Scott Schmidt
and I both just flew together for 3.75 hours running
LOP and we blew that speed away by at least 10kts
for the whole trip, on something like 9.5 gph. He was
lighter loaded than me and burned about 2 gallons less
over the entire leg.
So the point is, I don't think most people will give up enough
speed to worry about it a whole lot.
Tim Olson - RV-10 N104CD
Bill DeRouchey wrote:
> I believe tuning the injector nozzles will create a smoother running
> engine and that in itself has value. However, I have been mystified
> during these conversations as to the value of running LOP vs fuel
> economy. There was never enough data in the emails to get the whole
> picture. The question I always had was how much speed are you willing to
> loose to gain how much fuel efficiency?
>
> Thanks to Dave's pic of his panel and my own experience I was able to
> put a picture together.
>
> The following numbers are in statute miles and the Density Altitude is
> similar. If we assume that the top speed of our RV-10's is 205mph then
> Dave is flying 20% (164.5smph) under max and achieving 18.6smpg while
> leaned to approx 25deg LOP. An averaged flight in my plane is 6% under
> max speed (193smph) achieving 19.1smpg while leaned to peak. My
> definition of peak is when 3 cylinders drop.
>
> Typical panel setup for me is: WOT, 10-13K feet, 2380-2420rpm,
> 10.1-10.3gph, lean to peak.
>
> These are only two datapoints. What are others achieving? And please
> provide the whole picture - what is the percent under max speed you are
> willing to fly and the miles per gallon you are achieving as a benefit.
> I assume the whole LOP (other than a smooth engine) is to achieve fuel
> efficiency.
>
> What am I missing?
>
> Bill DeRouchey
> N939SB
>
>
>
>
>
> --- On *Sun, 8/23/09, Deems Davis //* wrote:
>
>
> From: Deems Davis <deemsdavis(at)cox.net>
> Subject: Re: RV10-List: LOP (Lean of Peak) Injector Tuning
> To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com
> Date: Sunday, August 23, 2009, 8:22 AM
>
> <http://us.mc344.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=deemsdavis@cox.net>>
>
> All of the LOP information is GREAT. Keep it coming !!!!!!! I have a
> question:
>
> When leaning the engine, the 'old traditional / prior to gages' way
> was to lean it until it begins to 'stumble' and then richen it up a
> bit. When I lean using the EGT gages I notice the 'stumble' when the
> 1st cylinder goes lean. If you continue to lean until all of the
> remaining cylinders peak (LOP), What happens to the 'stumble' ???
> Does it even out / go way with the engine running smooth? Does it
> persist? Since any changes in the engines smooth running are a
> concern in flight, I'd appreciate learning what those of you that
> are routinely running LOP are experiencing.
>
> Deems Davis N519PJ
> http://deemsrv10.com/index.html
>
> gary wrote:
> <http://us.mc344.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=speckter@comcast.net>>
> >
> > Is there a danger with running too much over square? Dick
> mentions 2" but I
> > have been running more than that (2200 and 26")LOP. I have not
> seen much
> > info on running over square.
> >
> > Gary Specketer
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com
> <http://us.mc344.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com>
> > [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com
> <http://us.mc344.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=owner-rv10-list-server@matronics.com>]
> On Behalf Of richard sipp
> > Sent: Saturday, August 22, 2009 11:57 PM
> > To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com
> <http://us.mc344.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=rv10-list@matronics.com>
> > Subject: Re: RV10-List: LOP (Lean of Peak) Injector Tuning
> >
> <http://us.mc344.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=rsipp@earthlink.net>>
> >
> > Tim:
> >
> > Great post as usual on your injector balancing experience. I had
> very nearly the same experience and results with two minor
> variations; a complete
> >
> > Airflow Performance system vs. your Silver Hawk and we started by
> installing
> >
> > .026's in all cylinders and then balancing. I ran most of the
> tests at 10-11 MSL and verified at the results at 7.5. Don R. felt
> that at the lower
> >
> > power settings of around 50-60% the flow divider begins to be the
> determining factor and by going to the smaller .026s the flow
> divider is taken out of the equation.
> >
> > There was an interesting series of pictures and notes regarding
> burned pistons (don't remember where I saw them) where the author
> thought the cause
> >
> > was "rapid" mixture leaning used by LOP operators. He felt the
> rapid rise in EGT was the cause. I disagree. GAMI recommends the
> "big pull" from rich
> >
> > to LOP and then a finer adujustment to prevent spending more time
> in the danger zone of peak to 100 rich of peak. Also with a rapid
> initial mixture leaning I doubt the cylinder or piston temp will
> increase before it cools from steady LOP operation. Further at <65%
> I do not think you can do anything to the mixture that would harm or
> overstress the engine.
> >
> > Regarding long range cruise I was happy to find that my engine
> seems equally
> >
> > smooth at 2250 as at higher RPM. I see about a 1GPH reduction in
> fuel flow with each 100 RPM reduction at full throttle settings and
> there is very little airspeed loss as the prop is taking bigger bits
> (sorta like overdrive). Charles Lindberg showed the P-38 pilots in
> the South Pacific how
> >
> > to double their range by running "over square and lean".
> Finally, to prevent the prop driving the engine during higher speed
> descents I keep the RPM at least "2" oversquare below manifold
> pressure. This is common practice with the big radials and it would
> seem equally applicable to our engines.
> >
> > Dick Sipp
> > N110DV 175 hours
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > =======================
> <http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List>http://www.mat====================
>
>
>
> <http://forums.matronics.com/>
>
> *
>
>
> *
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "David McNeill" <dlm46007(at)cox.net> |
| Subject: | LOP (Lean of Peak) Injector Tuning |
I was not using WOT at 10000 MSL. DA was 14000+. I don't know the weight but
we had OSH baggage and camping gear. I typically get about 150KTAS at about
8.5-9 gph. IIRC TAS is affected about 2 mph per 100 pounds gross weight
change. My numbers were from pictures just after departing OSH which would
mean higher gross weight rather than later in the flight. 36 gals burned in
the four hour flight to Tulsa after an OSH taxi and number 6 IFR departure
off of R09. After having flown for so many years at slower ground speeds
150KTAS GS or better seems enough. Of course if headwinds are involved I may
push the power lever forward but avoiding a fuel stop also figures into the
calculation.
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Tim Olson
Sent: Sunday, August 23, 2009 6:54 PM
Subject: Re: RV10-List: LOP (Lean of Peak) Injector Tuning
Bill,
Regarding the speeds, I don't know why Dave was only getting 164.5 statute
mph, but my LOP cruise is typically way better than that, which is about
143kts, right? If I am way lean of peak, and/or very heavy loaded, I MAY
get slowed down to 155-156kts TAS, but on plenty of trips I'm seeing speeds
of 164-166kts at LOP cruise.
If I fly ROP, I'd say most commonly I'll see 173-175kts, sometimes slower.
I've found that between leaning variations, turbulence, altitudes flown, and
loadings, that the speed can be all over the map, but I don't know that I've
ever really seen constant enroute cruise figures of less than 152kts on my
trips. So if I am getting, say 189-190 statue mph on many flights, and I'm
generally burning 9.5-10.5 gph at my most commonly flown altitudes, I'm
probably pushing right up near that same 19.1 statue mpg on many flights.
There are times I'm a bit less, but loadings and the other factors don't
always duplicate themselves. I'll tell you what though, there's no way that
I'm not getting better efficiency than someone flying ROP. As Kelly pointed
out, it's the temps, the cleanness, and all sorts of other things that are
benefits too. I'd say that you will usually lose 6-10kts depending on many
factors, such as how far you lean past peak. I usually just go for 25 LOP
on the last cyl. to peak.
Regarding flying ROP or at peak, like you are talking about, I tend to agree
that if you're way down in power like at 65%, you're probably not going to
hurt anything too bad.
But, for those who are running 50-100 ROP, you probably want to do a bit of
studying up. I don't have the numbers committed to memory, but there is a
window at higher power settings where you really don't want to stay, and I
think in order to stay out of it you really have to either fly WAY ROP, or
go LOP. Again, don't quote me, but if you venture over 75% power, I'd avoid
that range from maybe 125 to 0 ROP. (Can someone verify that? I've got docs
but I'm not going to dig them up right this minute)
So I'm not saying you're doing anything wrong, at the lower power levels you
can get away with anything. But, I think you picked a pretty lowball
datapoint from David if you're going to use his 164.5smph. Scott Schmidt
and I both just flew together for 3.75 hours running LOP and we blew that
speed away by at least 10kts for the whole trip, on something like 9.5 gph.
He was lighter loaded than me and burned about 2 gallons less over the
entire leg.
So the point is, I don't think most people will give up enough speed to
worry about it a whole lot.
Tim Olson - RV-10 N104CD
Bill DeRouchey wrote:
> I believe tuning the injector nozzles will create a smoother running
> engine and that in itself has value. However, I have been mystified
> during these conversations as to the value of running LOP vs fuel
> economy. There was never enough data in the emails to get the whole
> picture. The question I always had was how much speed are you willing
> to loose to gain how much fuel efficiency?
>
> Thanks to Dave's pic of his panel and my own experience I was able to
> put a picture together.
>
> The following numbers are in statute miles and the Density Altitude is
> similar. If we assume that the top speed of our RV-10's is 205mph then
> Dave is flying 20% (164.5smph) under max and achieving 18.6smpg while
> leaned to approx 25deg LOP. An averaged flight in my plane is 6% under
> max speed (193smph) achieving 19.1smpg while leaned to peak. My
> definition of peak is when 3 cylinders drop.
>
> Typical panel setup for me is: WOT, 10-13K feet, 2380-2420rpm,
> 10.1-10.3gph, lean to peak.
>
> These are only two datapoints. What are others achieving? And please
> provide the whole picture - what is the percent under max speed you
> are willing to fly and the miles per gallon you are achieving as a
benefit.
> I assume the whole LOP (other than a smooth engine) is to achieve fuel
> efficiency.
>
> What am I missing?
>
> Bill DeRouchey
> N939SB
>
>
>
>
>
> --- On *Sun, 8/23/09, Deems Davis //* wrote:
>
>
> From: Deems Davis <deemsdavis(at)cox.net>
> Subject: Re: RV10-List: LOP (Lean of Peak) Injector Tuning
> To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com
> Date: Sunday, August 23, 2009, 8:22 AM
>
> <http://us.mc344.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=deemsdavis@cox.net>>
>
> All of the LOP information is GREAT. Keep it coming !!!!!!! I have a
> question:
>
> When leaning the engine, the 'old traditional / prior to gages' way
> was to lean it until it begins to 'stumble' and then richen it up a
> bit. When I lean using the EGT gages I notice the 'stumble' when the
> 1st cylinder goes lean. If you continue to lean until all of the
> remaining cylinders peak (LOP), What happens to the 'stumble' ???
> Does it even out / go way with the engine running smooth? Does it
> persist? Since any changes in the engines smooth running are a
> concern in flight, I'd appreciate learning what those of you that
> are routinely running LOP are experiencing.
>
> Deems Davis N519PJ
> http://deemsrv10.com/index.html
>
> gary wrote:
> <http://us.mc344.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=speckter@comcast.net>>
> >
> > Is there a danger with running too much over square? Dick
> mentions 2" but I
> > have been running more than that (2200 and 26")LOP. I have not
> seen much
> > info on running over square.
> >
> > Gary Specketer
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com
>
<http://us.mc344.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=owner-rv10-list-server@matroni
cs.com>
> > [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com
>
<http://us.mc344.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=owner-rv10-list-server@matroni
cs.com>]
> On Behalf Of richard sipp
> > Sent: Saturday, August 22, 2009 11:57 PM
> > To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com
> <http://us.mc344.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=rv10-list@matronics.com>
> > Subject: Re: RV10-List: LOP (Lean of Peak) Injector Tuning
> >
> <http://us.mc344.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=rsipp@earthlink.net>>
> >
> > Tim:
> >
> > Great post as usual on your injector balancing experience. I had
> very nearly the same experience and results with two minor
> variations; a complete
> >
> > Airflow Performance system vs. your Silver Hawk and we started by
> installing
> >
> > .026's in all cylinders and then balancing. I ran most of the
> tests at 10-11 MSL and verified at the results at 7.5. Don R. felt
> that at the lower
> >
> > power settings of around 50-60% the flow divider begins to be the
> determining factor and by going to the smaller .026s the flow
> divider is taken out of the equation.
> >
> > There was an interesting series of pictures and notes regarding
> burned pistons (don't remember where I saw them) where the author
> thought the cause
> >
> > was "rapid" mixture leaning used by LOP operators. He felt the
> rapid rise in EGT was the cause. I disagree. GAMI recommends the
> "big pull" from rich
> >
> > to LOP and then a finer adujustment to prevent spending more time
> in the danger zone of peak to 100 rich of peak. Also with a rapid
> initial mixture leaning I doubt the cylinder or piston temp will
> increase before it cools from steady LOP operation. Further at <65%
> I do not think you can do anything to the mixture that would harm or
> overstress the engine.
> >
> > Regarding long range cruise I was happy to find that my engine
> seems equally
> >
> > smooth at 2250 as at higher RPM. I see about a 1GPH reduction in
> fuel flow with each 100 RPM reduction at full throttle settings and
> there is very little airspeed loss as the prop is taking bigger bits
> (sorta like overdrive). Charles Lindberg showed the P-38 pilots in
> the South Pacific how
> >
> > to double their range by running "over square and lean".
> Finally, to prevent the prop driving the engine during higher speed
> descents I keep the RPM at least "2" oversquare below manifold
> pressure. This is common practice with the big radials and it would
> seem equally applicable to our engines.
> >
> > Dick Sipp
> > N110DV 175 hours
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > =======================
>
> <http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List>http://www.mat=========
> ==========
>
>
>
> <http://forums.matronics.com/>
>
> *
>
>
> *
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: RV-10 trio pitch servo install |
| From: | "ddnebert" <doug(at)mapcontext.com> |
Trio has a bracket, parts, and instructions for the wing leveler in the RV-10,
but no plans or parts yet for the pitch servo. After discussing with a number
of builders, the addition of a pitch servo (at such a reasonable price - $750
- controlled by the MGL Odyssey EFIS) was a good design idea. It was also something
I could do now. I'll order another servo for roll later.
I contacted Trio and an individual who had built and mounted a pitch servo in a
-10, and took pictures of it, and built a reinforced tray that is mounted on
the aft end of the battery and elevator bellcrank support platform. They suggested
I use whatever parts I could from the wing leveler kit and fashion a reinforced
tray.
So, I fashioned a 6x7 inch tray from the leftover cutout of the baggage door, cut
lengths of 3/4-in angle that I bought at the fly market, and mounted them facing
upward for clearance. Drilled, deburred and riveted the angle to the sheet.
Lined up the holes to connect the tray to the battery platform - three holes
for #8 screws. Marked and drilled six holes to suit the hardware supplied with
the servo bracket to mount the servo to the tray (bolt, washer, and lock nut).
I mounted the servo tray and it is very stiffly in-place. I attached the servo
arm to the wheel with screws to allow for motion at the top of the arc, detents
fore and aft, center straight up. Likewise, I positioned the elevator bellcrank
arm near-neutral (also vertical) then drilled a hole for a #3 bolt through
the arm to hold the servo control connection.
Looking around the shop, I found a hexagonal 6-1/2" threaded rod that accommodated
the rod ends and nuts supplied with the leveler kit (Vans VA 256) which was
the perfect length. Tightened up the rod end nuts, and used three washers between
the arms and the rod end for clearance, otherwise keeping the arm connection
design as pictured for the leveler servo. Bolted the battery platform back
to the ribs.
Log entry:
http://websites.expercraft.com/douglasn/index.php?q=log_entry&log_id=40960
and pictures:
http://websites.expercraft.com/douglasn/images/3368053714a91f7a4158b3.jpg
http://websites.expercraft.com/douglasn/images/21209592804a91f7a41c679.jpg
--------
RV-10 Builder #40546
Tail mostly done, wings complete, middle of SB fuse
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=259232#259232
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Steven DiNieri" <capsteve(at)iflyrv10.com> |
Dave,
I powdercoated mine and it came out nice. it didn't hurt the
bushings at all.
steve
From: David McNeill
Sent: Friday, August 21, 2009 1:33 PM
Subject: RV10-List: nose fork
Has anyone painted/treated the fork as supplied by Vans?
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Sheldon Olesen <saolesen(at)sirentel.net> |
| Subject: | Power point presentation on LOP |
If anyone is interested there is a power point presentation by one of
the GAMI guys on LOP operations. It details where the problem ROP
and LOP temps are (the RED Box). The List won't accept the format so
email me off list for a copy.
Sheldon Olesen
N475PV 106 hours
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Michael Baldwin <michaelbaldwin7475(at)sbcglobal.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Oil Cooler Size On RV-10...? |
No photo - but I think we had a drawing From Airflow that I can dig out and
scan
It's at the airport so may take a few days to get back to you
Later
Mike
--- On Fri, 8/21/09, pilotdds(at)aol.com wrote:
From: pilotdds(at)aol.com <pilotdds(at)aol.com>
Subject: Re: RV10-List: Re: Oil Cooler Size On RV-10...?
Date: Friday, August 21, 2009, 5:10 PM
Mike do you have any photos of your mods to the oil cooler box?
-----Original Message-----
From: Michael Baldwin <michaelbaldwin7475(at)sbcglobal.net>
Sent: Fri, Aug 21, 2009 2:03 pm
Subject: Re: RV10-List: Re: Oil Cooler Size On RV-10...?
We put the Airflow-2008X on our RV-10 since our oil temps where higher th
an we liked
And saw a-10 - 20-degree F drop as a result
We also installed-a baffle that splits the air flow in the Van's standard
box per recommendation from Airflow (these guys had a lot of good experien
ce with the RV-10 people)
You do have to modify Van's oil cooler-box to bolt the 2008X on inplace o
f the standard cooler, but it can be done.- Basically-you have to turn
the cooler 90 degrees and fold out the vertical sides of the box, drill a f
ew holes and bolt on.- Actually pretty simple change.- I felt it was wo
rth
-
High oil temps for us was only during summer hot days coupled with-slow f
light conditions 120 -- 150 mph range. if you keep the speed up to 160 or
better its usually ok
Example would be 90-degree day and slow flight around the-pattern or si
ght seeing low and slow the temp would get up to 230 F.- Now with larger
cooler it only hits 210 F.- Our 6 position CHT numbers have always been 3
50 or lower regarding engine temp, so the cowling / baffling seams tight an
d working good.
The slow flght condition appears to be more of the issue.- I would bet a
cowl flap right under the cooler would-also work, be interested to hear i
f any one has done that yet.-
-
Mike Baldwin--(see add below )
-
- Engine Parts---Oil Coolers---Airflow Systems
X-SERIES OIL COOLERS BY AIRFLOW SYSTEM
The first new aircraft oil cooler design in 50 years. Computer modeling and
flight testing have been used to develop coolers that deliver significantl
y lower oil temps with no increase in oil cooler
View more details
08-06154
2006X AIRFLOW OIL COOLER EXPMT
$432.00
08-06155
2008X AIRFLOW OIL COOLER EXPMT
$493.00
-
-
--- On Fri, 8/21/09, Don McDonald wrote:
From: Don McDonald <building_partner(at)yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: RV10-List: Re: Oil Cooler Size On RV-10...?
Date: Friday, August 21, 2009, 1:49 AM
Ditto on the unit from Alex.... with the exception of the reduction in cool
ing... certainly NOT 20%.... considering 200 degrees, we'd be talking about
a 40 degree reduction.- Plan on a reduction of between 5 and 15.
Don McDonald
--- On Thu, 8/20/09, AirMike wrote:
From: AirMike <Mikeabel(at)Pacbell.net>
Subject: RV10-List: Re: Oil Cooler Size On RV-10...?
Date: Thursday, August 20, 2009, 10:16 PM
I do not know about Van's, but Alex- DeDominicis (Aviation tech products)
sells one that has the identical dimensions as Van's unit for the 10 and su
pposedly has 20% better cooling. Alex is a good guy and with the difference
from the cost of the Van's product - it was about $100 more. Seems to work
fine.
--------
OSH '09 or Bust (busted) be there someday
Q/B Kit - end game
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=258936#258936<=- - -
- - - The RV10-List tp://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List" target
=_blank>http://www.matr - - - - - - - - - - &nbs;-->
h
get=_blank rel=nofollow>http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List
=nofollow>http://forums.matronics.com
blank rel=nofollow>http://www.matronics.com/contribution
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Linn Walters <pitts_pilot(at)bellsouth.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Power point presentation on LOP |
I'm interested. Thanks,
Linn
Sheldon Olesen wrote:
>
> If anyone is interested there is a power point presentation by one of
> the GAMI guys on LOP operations. It details where the problem ROP and
> LOP temps are (the RED Box). The List won't accept the format so
> email me off list for a copy.
>
>
> Sheldon Olesen
> N475PV 106 hours
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Power point presentation on LOP |
| From: | "John Cox" <johnwcox(at)pacificnw.com> |
The powerpoint presentation on Tim's site would be great!
Taking the chance that I might be out of line with Tim and many of you
(What's new), I would like to point out one idea for consideration. FAR
43, Appendix D has as its last entry (j) as a catch all. You each might
ask your DAR if not doing Mag Timing at a Conditional is appropriate or
to be taken only cautiously before moving ahead. I have been instructed
that to maintain the TCDS on a Lycoming engine, it is the responsibility
of the repairman, mechanic to confirm the ignition system is providing
fire at the correct number of degrees from TDC. Almost all engines have
one systems a little off note. Klaus might have a perspective on this
idea. Some might assume it is the RV-10 owner's responsibility to
confirm correct ignition event prior to LOP ops or injector balancing
;-) I do not subscribe to 10:1 compression as introducing a problem to
correctly maintained engines. Some people love 8.7:1. A TN
(turbo-normalized) GAMI engine does just fine when all the musical
instruments are playing the same sheet of music at the same timing i.e.
Cirrus G3.
On a separate note, I hope a few of you will join me in November as Don
graduates a handful of us in his Airflow Performance FI class. It is
held in beautiful Spartanburg, just after the passing of the '09
hurricane season.
Running LOP and fuel injector balancing begins with the perception that
all of the concentric circles are aligned by you the technician.
Compression, Spark, Valve movement, Atmospherics (density of air
mass/temp/humidity) and the correct Air:Fuel ratio (Peak
Stoichiometric). As Deem's asked to bring it on, Kelly responded with
some sage advice.
There is good stuff there... Saving money, less carbon footprint and
knowledge of your respective system. Sheldon you are welcome to send it
my way.
John
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Sheldon
Olesen
Sent: Monday, August 24, 2009 6:50 AM
Subject: RV10-List: Power point presentation on LOP
If anyone is interested there is a power point presentation by one of
the GAMI guys on LOP operations. It details where the problem ROP
and LOP temps are (the RED Box). The List won't accept the format so
email me off list for a copy.
Sheldon Olesen
N475PV 106 hours
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Sheldon Olesen <saolesen(at)sirentel.net> |
| Subject: | If you didn't get the power point |
I have sent the power point presentation to every one who requested
one. If you wanted one and didn't get it, I'm sorry. I used
"Reply" on some some emails and and the list rejected them again. I
deleted the messages as I sent them so I don't know who didn't get
them. Send a new email and I'll get it to you.
Sheldon Olesen
N475PV
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Question on Control Cables & FAB |
| From: | "jayb" <jaybrinkmeyer(at)yahoo.com> |
FF3-2 (rev0): What torque to set for AN316-7R nuts? These are used to hold the
various control cables to their respective mounting brackets.
FF-FAB Figure 2: "Securing the Control Cable" shows the alt air cable as "route
to panel". Where have others routed it through the firewall? Any photos?
Thanks in advance to anyone who responds...
Regards,
Jay
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=259350#259350
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Oil Cooler Size On RV-10...? |
| From: | pilotdds(at)aol.com |
thanks
-----Original Message-----
From: Michael Baldwin <michaelbaldwin7475(at)sbcglobal.net>
Sent: Mon, Aug 24, 2009 7:13 am
Subject: Re: RV10-List: Re: Oil Cooler Size On RV-10...?
No photo - but I think we had a drawing >From Airflow that I can dig out and scan
It's at the airport so may take a few days to get back to you
Later
Mike
--- On Fri, 8/21/09, pilotdds(at)aol.com wrote:
From: pilotdds(at)aol.com <pilotdds(at)aol.com>
Subject: Re: RV10-List: Re: Oil Cooler Size On RV-10...?
Date: Friday, August 21, 2009, 5:10 PM
Mike do you have any photos of your mods to the oil cooler box?
-----Original Message-----
From: Michael Baldwin <michaelbaldwin7475(at)sbcglobal.net>
Sent: Fri, Aug 21, 2009 2:03 pm
Subject: Re: RV10-List: Re: Oil Cooler Size On RV-10...?
We put the Airflow?2008X on our RV-10 since our oil temps where higher than we
liked
And saw a?10 - 20?degree F drop as a result
We also installed?a baffle that splits the air flow in the Van's standard box per
recommendation from Airflow (these guys had a lot of good experience with the
RV-10 people)
You do have to modify Van's oil cooler?box to bolt the 2008X on inplace of the
standard cooler, but it can be done.? Basically?you have to turn the cooler 90
degrees and fold out the vertical sides of the box, drill a few holes and bolt
on.? Actually pretty simple change.? I felt it was worth
?
High oil temps for us was only during summer hot days coupled with?slow flight
conditions 120 -? 150 mph range. if you keep the speed up to 160 or better its
usually ok
Example would be 90?degree day and slow flight around the?pattern or sight seeing
low and slow the temp would get up to 230 F.? Now with larger cooler it only
hits 210 F.? Our 6 position CHT numbers have always been 350 or lower regarding
engine temp, so the cowling / baffling seams tight and working good.
The slow flght condition appears to be more of the issue.? I would bet a cowl flap
right under the cooler would?also work, be interested to hear if any one has
done that yet.?
?
Mike Baldwin??(see add below )
?
? Engine Parts?-?Oil Coolers?-?Airflow Systems
X-SERIES OIL COOLERS BY AIRFLOW SYSTEM
The first new aircraft oil cooler design in 50 years. Computer modeling and flight
testing have been used to develop coolers that deliver significantly lower
oil temps with no increase in oil cooler
View more details
08-06154
2006X AIRFLOW OIL COOLER EXPMT
$432.00
08-06155
2008X AIRFLOW OIL COOLER EXPMT
$493.00
?
?
--- On Fri, 8/21/09, Don McDonald wrote:
From: Don McDonald <building_partner(at)yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: RV10-List: Re: Oil Cooler Size On RV-10...?
Date: Friday, August 21, 2009, 1:49 AM
Ditto on the unit from Alex.... with the exception of the reduction in cooling...
certainly NOT 20%.... considering 200 degrees, we'd be talking about a 40 degree
reduction.? Plan on a reduction of between 5 and 15.
Don McDonald
--- On Thu, 8/20/09, AirMike wrote:
From: AirMike <Mikeabel(at)Pacbell.net>
Subject: RV10-List: Re: Oil Cooler Size On RV-10...?
Date: Thursday, August 20, 2009, 10:16 PM
I do not know about Van's, but Alex? DeDominicis (Aviation tech products)sells
one that has the identical dimensions as Van's unit for the 10 and supposedly
has 20% better cooling. Alex is a good guy and with the difference from the cost
of the Van's product - it was about $100 more. Seems to work fine.
--------
OSH '09 or Bust (busted) be there someday
Q/B Kit - end game
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=258936#258936<=? ? ? ? ? - The RV10-List tp://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List" target=_blank>http://www.matr ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? &nbs;--> h
get=_blank rel=nofollow>http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List
=nofollow>http://forums.matronics.com
blank rel=nofollow>http://www.matronics.com/contribution
get=_blank rel=nofollow>http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List
=nofollow>http://forums.matronics.com
blank rel=nofollow>http://www.matronics.com/contribution
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Power point presentation on LOP |
| From: | Kelly McMullen <apilot2(at)gmail.com> |
Yes, checking mag timing is a required task for an A&P/IA on a
certified plane for 100 hour or annual. As I understand it, a
repairman doing condition inspection must develop a checklist equal to
or in greater depth than Part 43 Appendix D, so I believe ignition
timing should be a requirement.
That said, the TIO540 in Mooney TLS/Bravo is one of the most difficult
engines around to run LOP. Symptoms indicate it is either the
pressurized Slick mags, or the combustion chamber design. Some will
run fine LOP, including one I know of, that as soon as one of the
Slick mags was overhauled, would no longer run LOP at all. On that
engine the mags often require overhaul in less than 500 hours.
They also tend to tear up exhaust systems when run LOP. Don't
understand that either, just what owners have experienced.
The Lycoming IO-540 is a very different engine than the IO550
Continental the Cirrus operates with, and stock compression is 8.5:1.
The TCM runs fine LOP. Not all Lyc IO-540s will.
On Mon, Aug 24, 2009 at 9:20 AM, John Cox wrote:
> ;-) I do not subscribe to 10:1 compression as introducing a problem to
> correctly maintained engines. Some people love 8.7:1. A TN
> (turbo-normalized) GAMI engine does just fine when all the musical
> instruments are playing the same sheet of music at the same timing i.e.
> Cirrus G3.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Deems Davis <deemsdavis(at)cox.net> |
| Subject: | Airflow oil cooler splitter/diffuser pics (kinda) |
I found the paper that came with the Airflow oil cooler 'splitter' at
the hangar today. I've scanned it and am attaching it to this message.
It's got a couple of pictures of it installed.
Deems Davis N519PJ
http://deemsrv10.com/index.html
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Kelly McMullen <kellym(at)aviating.com> |
| Subject: | Wanted--Bent whip Com antenna |
I would like to find a used or uninstalled/not needed Comant CI-122 or
equivalent bent whip com antenna. I have both a used Comant CI-121
antenna, and a Mooney "7" style antenna(also used on some Pipers) that I
can offer in partial trade or whatever deal might be possible.
Kelly McMullen
RV-10 under construction
Mooney M20E
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "gary" <speckter(at)comcast.net> |
| Subject: | Power point presentation on LOP |
Speaking of condition inspections, does any one have a good checklist? I
have one I made up but it might be nice to cross check it.
Gary Specketer
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Kelly McMullen
Sent: Monday, August 24, 2009 4:27 PM
Subject: Re: RV10-List: Power point presentation on LOP
Yes, checking mag timing is a required task for an A&P/IA on a
certified plane for 100 hour or annual. As I understand it, a
repairman doing condition inspection must develop a checklist equal to
or in greater depth than Part 43 Appendix D, so I believe ignition
timing should be a requirement.
That said, the TIO540 in Mooney TLS/Bravo is one of the most difficult
engines around to run LOP. Symptoms indicate it is either the
pressurized Slick mags, or the combustion chamber design. Some will
run fine LOP, including one I know of, that as soon as one of the
Slick mags was overhauled, would no longer run LOP at all. On that
engine the mags often require overhaul in less than 500 hours.
They also tend to tear up exhaust systems when run LOP. Don't
understand that either, just what owners have experienced.
The Lycoming IO-540 is a very different engine than the IO550
Continental the Cirrus operates with, and stock compression is 8.5:1.
The TCM runs fine LOP. Not all Lyc IO-540s will.
On Mon, Aug 24, 2009 at 9:20 AM, John Cox wrote:
> ;-) I do not subscribe to 10:1 compression as introducing a problem to
> correctly maintained engines. Some people love 8.7:1. A TN
> (turbo-normalized) GAMI engine does just fine when all the musical
> instruments are playing the same sheet of music at the same timing i.e.
> Cirrus G3.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Kelly McMullen <kellym(at)aviating.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Leaning for Climb, LOP ppt, and more |
APS generally recommends that you note whatever your sea-level EGT is
for takeoff, if possible, and use that value for leaning in the climb.
If not possible, they suggest 1250-1300 or 200 degrees rich of your
normal 75% cruise peak EGT. Like you, I prefer to stay between
1200-1250, but don't get excited if it goes to 1275 initially on an
adjustment. You don't need to obsess about precision, just keep it
ballparked with 50 degrees or so of your target.
Tim Olson wrote:
>
> A quick note on leaning during climb.
> As many of you know, when you takeoff at altitude, especially over
> 5,000' of altitude, you will need to lean to get the proper takeoff
> power. A trick I learned a while back is that during climb, all the way
> up, you can lean to about 1225 degrees EGT, and if you maintain that
> temp your engine should be roughly leaned appropriately for climb. If
> you go full rich and try to climb to 8,000-10,000', your EGT's will be
> too low and you won't be making much power. In addition, I've worked
> with one person who had a Carbon Monoxide issue, and when I asked what
> the EGT's were, they sounded very low. By leaning out the engine a bit
> and raising the EGT's, the CO problem went away. So leaning is very
> important during cruise and climb.
>
>
> I did update my LOP Write-up at
> http://www.myrv10.com/N104CD/upgrades/20090822/index.html
> to add some additional info near the bottom, including the above.
> I also put in an "Advanced Pilot Seminar" on leaning link at the bottom,
> and a link to a .pdf version of the ppt that Sheldon had.
>
>
> One other quick note....
> I did get a trip write-up done from my latest travels to Utah,
> Oregon, and Idaho. Might be boring for you, but it was a
> really interesting trip in some respects.
> http://www.myrv10.com/N104CD/flights/20090819/index.html
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Linn Walters <pitts_pilot(at)bellsouth.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Leaning for Climb, LOP ppt, and more |
The only comment I can make is that a specific EGT number will almost
always (sometimes we get lucky) work different on different
installations. The biggest issue in climbing is to prevent cooking the
cylinders. Many 'big' engines use the rich fuel mixture as a cooling
aid, and again, installation makes a difference. I always lean ..... to
prevent lead buildup in the plugs ..... but CHT drives how much. Get
the engine up to operating temp, and then do a T&G and climb like you
want ..... and lean using CHTs and then note the EGTs to establish your
own number. The CHTs are slow to react to changes in power, so be careful.
Linn
Tim Olson wrote:
>
> A quick note on leaning during climb.
> As many of you know, when you takeoff at altitude, especially over
> 5,000' of altitude, you will need to lean to get the proper takeoff
> power. A trick I learned a while back is that during climb, all the way
> up, you can lean to about 1225 degrees EGT, and if you maintain that
> temp your engine should be roughly leaned appropriately for climb. If
> you go full rich and try to climb to 8,000-10,000', your EGT's will be
> too low and you won't be making much power. In addition, I've worked
> with one person who had a Carbon Monoxide issue, and when I asked what
> the EGT's were, they sounded very low. By leaning out the engine a bit
> and raising the EGT's, the CO problem went away. So leaning is very
> important during cruise and climb.
>
>
> I did update my LOP Write-up at
> http://www.myrv10.com/N104CD/upgrades/20090822/index.html
> to add some additional info near the bottom, including the above.
> I also put in an "Advanced Pilot Seminar" on leaning link at the bottom,
> and a link to a .pdf version of the ppt that Sheldon had.
>
>
> One other quick note....
> I did get a trip write-up done from my latest travels to Utah,
> Oregon, and Idaho. Might be boring for you, but it was a
> really interesting trip in some respects.
> http://www.myrv10.com/N104CD/flights/20090819/index.html
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Deems Davis <deemsdavis(at)cox.net> |
| Subject: | Airflow Oil Box Splitter |
For further information about the Oil box splitter, as well as improved
performance Oil coolers and other products. I encourage people to contact:
William F. Genevro
Managing Director
949-218-9701
@ Airflow Systems directly. Bill has spent a LOT of time researching Oil
temps and associated issues, speaking with many RV10 builders and has a
large knowledge base from which he's developed these solutions. He's
easy to talk to. The oil splitter kits are available directly from him
for $49. And are free to those who buy one of his oil coolers.
Deems Davis N519PJ
http://deemsrv10.com/index.html
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "RV Builder (Michael Sausen)" <rvbuilder(at)sausen.net> |
| Subject: | Airflow Oil Box Splitter |
Thanks for this info Deems. I'll have to check with Alex D and find out why
this wasn't included when I got my 2006X from him.
Michael
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Deems Davis
Sent: Tuesday, August 25, 2009 10:14 AM
Subject: RV10-List: Airflow Oil Box Splitter
For further information about the Oil box splitter, as well as improved
performance Oil coolers and other products. I encourage people to contact:
William F. Genevro
Managing Director
949-218-9701
@ Airflow Systems directly. Bill has spent a LOT of time researching Oil
temps and associated issues, speaking with many RV10 builders and has a
large knowledge base from which he's developed these solutions. He's
easy to talk to. The oil splitter kits are available directly from him
for $49. And are free to those who buy one of his oil coolers.
Deems Davis N519PJ
http://deemsrv10.com/index.html
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Richard Martin" <martin(at)gbonline.com> |
| Subject: | Re: RV8-List: Oil Cooler Size On RV-10...? |
When I built my RV8, I attempted to use the SW cooler recommended by vans,
however it was inadequate. Upon advice of Monty Barrette, and Dave Anders
(still the fastest RV) I obtained a Niagara/Harrison 10 cooler and mounted
it on the rear baffle behind cyl 4 and tilted it down approximately 35
degrees (tilt as much as possible without contacting engine mount) (it will
be necessary to remove some metal from the flange on the cooler to prevent
contact with engine mount tube). This set up has proven to be excellent
providing good cooling in all temperatures up to 95 degrees outside air
including the Air Venture races when I run at 100 percent of power at low
altitude for over 2 hours (2700 rpm, 27-29 inch manifold pressure) average
indicated airspeeds are 220-235mph depending on OAT.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Matt Dralle" <dralle(at)matronics.com>
Sent: Wednesday, August 19, 2009 10:08 PM
Subject: RV8-List: Oil Cooler Size On RV-10...?
> --> RV8-List message posted by: Matt Dralle
>
>
> Hey, what size oil cooler to the RV-10's use? Is it the same on on
> the -7's and -8's? "Oil Cooler II". Or, do they use a larger one?
>
> I've got a SW10610R for my IO-390 on the RV-8 which is a monster sized
> cooler. The stock "FF-709" mounting bracket is way too small. Does Van's
> have a larger one available? What's used on the RV-10?
>
> I guess that I could make one, but I'd rather Van's CNC punch did, if you
> know what I mean...?
>
> Thanks!
>
> Matt Dralle
> RV-8 #82880 N998RV
> http://www.mykitlog.com/dralle
> FWF
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Matt Dralle <dralle(at)matronics.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Oil Cooler Size On RV-10...? |
Thanks for the feedback Richard. Do you have some pictures of your installation
you could post to the Lists?
BTW, your computer clock is 5 days behind.
Matt Dralle
RV-8 #82880 N998RV
<http://www.mykitlog.com/dralle>http://www.mykitlog.com/dralle
FWF
At 08:33 AM 8/20/2009 Thursday, you wrote:
>--> RV-List message posted by: "Richard Martin"
>
>When I built my RV8, I attempted to use the SW cooler recommended by vans, however
it was inadequate. Upon advice of Monty Barrette, and Dave Anders (still
the fastest RV) I obtained a Niagara/Harrison 10 cooler and mounted it on the
rear baffle behind cyl 4 and tilted it down approximately 35 degrees (tilt as
much as possible without contacting engine mount) (it will be necessary to remove
some metal from the flange on the cooler to prevent contact with engine
mount tube). This set up has proven to be excellent providing good cooling in
all temperatures up to 95 degrees outside air including the Air Venture races
when I run at 100 percent of power at low altitude for over 2 hours (2700 rpm,
27-29 inch manifold pressure) average indicated airspeeds are 220-235mph depending
on OAT.
>----- Original Message ----- From: "Matt Dralle" <dralle(at)matronics.com>
>To: ; ;
>Sent: Wednesday, August 19, 2009 10:08 PM
>Subject: RV8-List: Oil Cooler Size On RV-10...?
>
>
>>--> RV8-List message posted by: Matt Dralle
>>
>>
>>Hey, what size oil cooler to the RV-10's use? Is it the same on on the -7's
and -8's? "Oil Cooler II". Or, do they use a larger one?
>>
>>I've got a SW10610R for my IO-390 on the RV-8 which is a monster sized cooler.
The stock "FF-709" mounting bracket is way too small. Does Van's have a larger
one available? What's used on the RV-10?
>>
>>I guess that I could make one, but I'd rather Van's CNC punch did, if you know
what I mean...?
>>
>>Thanks!
>>
>>Matt Dralle
>>RV-8 #82880 N998RV
>>http://www.mykitlog.com/dralle
>>FWF
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Builders/owners in the SF Bay Area? |
| From: | Chris Colohan <rv10(at)colohan.com> |
Wow, what a nice response I got!
FYI -- I swung by Bob's house on Sunday, since he was the closest to where
I live. Very impressive project.
I am now pretty convinced that I want to build one of my own. Time to start
working harder on the finances... ;-)
Chris
On Sat, Aug 22, 2009 at 4:01 PM, Chris Colohan wrote:
> Hi there!
> I'm trying to decide whether or not I want to jump into the pool and start
> building an rv-10. (Step 2: figure out if I can actually afford it.)
> Before I make that leap, I thought it might be a good idea to take a look
> at the finished product, and to perhaps help out with some building tasks to
> make sure it is really the kind of thing I'd like to spend several years
> doing. :-)
>
> So, I'm asking:
>
> 1. Is there anyone with a finished (or nearly finished) rv-10 in the Bay
> Area (or within a 100nm flight or so and near an airport) who might be
> interested in showing off their work?
>
> 2. Is there anyone working on a plane who might find a second pair of
> somewhat-handy hands useful? (I hear offering to hold a bucking bar is a
> good thing -- but I've never set real rivets, only pop rivets, so I can't
> offer loads of experience.)
>
> 3. Has anyone on this list nearly finished and have a good estimate of
> what the finished product cost to build? I fear that the estimates on Van's
> site might be hopelessly optimistic, and seeing some actual numbers might
> improve my confidence in my building decision.
>
> I tried heading up to Golden West to see all the planes, but the Cessna I
> rented failed a mag check (and refused to clear) after waiting 30 minutes
> for an IFR release. (Urk.)
>
> Thanks!
>
> Chris
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "John Cumins" <jcumins(at)jcis.net> |
| Subject: | Leaning for Climb, LOP ppt, and more |
I do this every time I fly. Especially at take off at high alt airports it
works great. You will be amazed how much more power is available with this
leaning procedure.
The Saratoga sea level egt is right at 1300 so I use 1250 to 1300 for climb
egt.
John G. Cumins
President
JC'S Interactive Systems
2499 B1 Martin Rd
Fairfield Ca 94533
707-425-7100
707-425-7576 Fax
Your Total Technology Solution Provider
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Kelly McMullen
Sent: Tuesday, August 25, 2009 6:54 AM
Subject: Re: RV10-List: Leaning for Climb, LOP ppt, and more
APS generally recommends that you note whatever your sea-level EGT is
for takeoff, if possible, and use that value for leaning in the climb.
If not possible, they suggest 1250-1300 or 200 degrees rich of your
normal 75% cruise peak EGT. Like you, I prefer to stay between
1200-1250, but don't get excited if it goes to 1275 initially on an
adjustment. You don't need to obsess about precision, just keep it
ballparked with 50 degrees or so of your target.
Tim Olson wrote:
>
> A quick note on leaning during climb.
> As many of you know, when you takeoff at altitude, especially over
> 5,000' of altitude, you will need to lean to get the proper takeoff
> power. A trick I learned a while back is that during climb, all the way
> up, you can lean to about 1225 degrees EGT, and if you maintain that
> temp your engine should be roughly leaned appropriately for climb. If
> you go full rich and try to climb to 8,000-10,000', your EGT's will be
> too low and you won't be making much power. In addition, I've worked
> with one person who had a Carbon Monoxide issue, and when I asked what
> the EGT's were, they sounded very low. By leaning out the engine a bit
> and raising the EGT's, the CO problem went away. So leaning is very
> important during cruise and climb.
>
>
> I did update my LOP Write-up at
> http://www.myrv10.com/N104CD/upgrades/20090822/index.html
> to add some additional info near the bottom, including the above.
> I also put in an "Advanced Pilot Seminar" on leaning link at the bottom,
> and a link to a .pdf version of the ppt that Sheldon had.
>
>
> One other quick note....
> I did get a trip write-up done from my latest travels to Utah,
> Oregon, and Idaho. Might be boring for you, but it was a
> really interesting trip in some respects.
> http://www.myrv10.com/N104CD/flights/20090819/index.html
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "John Cumins" <jcumins(at)jcis.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Builders/owners in the SF Bay Area? |
Chris
You will be glad you did. I am in Dixon just up I80 from you contact me and
come visit any time.
John G. Cumins
President
JC'S Interactive Systems
2499 B1 Martin Rd
Fairfield Ca 94533
707-425-7100
707-425-7576 Fax
Your Total Technology Solution Provider
From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Chris Colohan
Sent: Tuesday, August 25, 2009 10:32 AM
Subject: RV10-List: Re: Builders/owners in the SF Bay Area?
Wow, what a nice response I got!
FYI -- I swung by Bob's house on Sunday, since he was the closest to where
I live. Very impressive project.
I am now pretty convinced that I want to build one of my own. Time to start
working harder on the finances... ;-)
Chris
On Sat, Aug 22, 2009 at 4:01 PM, Chris Colohan wrote:
Hi there!
I'm trying to decide whether or not I want to jump into the pool and start
building an rv-10. (Step 2: figure out if I can actually afford it.)
Before I make that leap, I thought it might be a good idea to take a look at
the finished product, and to perhaps help out with some building tasks to
make sure it is really the kind of thing I'd like to spend several years
doing. :-)
So, I'm asking:
1. Is there anyone with a finished (or nearly finished) rv-10 in the Bay
Area (or within a 100nm flight or so and near an airport) who might be
interested in showing off their work?
2. Is there anyone working on a plane who might find a second pair of
somewhat-handy hands useful? (I hear offering to hold a bucking bar is a
good thing -- but I've never set real rivets, only pop rivets, so I can't
offer loads of experience.)
3. Has anyone on this list nearly finished and have a good estimate of what
the finished product cost to build? I fear that the estimates on Van's site
might be hopelessly optimistic, and seeing some actual numbers might improve
my confidence in my building decision.
I tried heading up to Golden West to see all the planes, but the Cessna I
rented failed a mag check (and refused to clear) after waiting 30 minutes
for an IFR release. (Urk.)
Thanks!
Chris
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Rene Felker" <rene(at)felker.com> |
| Subject: | Airflow Oil Box Splitter |
Please let me know what you find out, I did not get one either and I could
use a little more improvement. Saw oil temps in the low 220's when I left
Las Vegas last month.....
Rene' Felker
RV-10 N423CF Flying
801-721-6080
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of RV Builder
(Michael Sausen)
Sent: Tuesday, August 25, 2009 10:34 AM
Subject: RE: RV10-List: Airflow Oil Box Splitter
Thanks for this info Deems. I'll have to check with Alex D and find out
why this wasn't included when I got my 2006X from him.
Michael
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Deems Davis
Sent: Tuesday, August 25, 2009 10:14 AM
Subject: RV10-List: Airflow Oil Box Splitter
For further information about the Oil box splitter, as well as improved
performance Oil coolers and other products. I encourage people to contact:
William F. Genevro
Managing Director
949-218-9701
@ Airflow Systems directly. Bill has spent a LOT of time researching Oil
temps and associated issues, speaking with many RV10 builders and has a
large knowledge base from which he's developed these solutions. He's
easy to talk to. The oil splitter kits are available directly from him
for $49. And are free to those who buy one of his oil coolers.
Deems Davis N519PJ
http://deemsrv10.com/index.html
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bill DeRouchey <billderou(at)yahoo.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Power point presentation on LOP |
Please send a copy.
Thanks,
Bill
--- On Mon, 8/24/09, Linn Walters wrote:
From: Linn Walters <pitts_pilot(at)bellsouth.net>
Subject: Re: RV10-List: Power point presentation on LOP
Date: Monday, August 24, 2009, 7:55 AM
I'm interested.- Thanks,
Linn
Sheldon Olesen wrote:
>
> If anyone is interested there is a power point presentation by one of the
GAMI guys on LOP operations.- It details where the problem ROP and LOP t
emps are (the RED Box).- The List won't accept the format so email me off
list for a copy.
>
>
> Sheldon Olesen
> N475PV 106 hours
>
>
>
>
>
le, List Admin.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bill DeRouchey <billderou(at)yahoo.com> |
| Subject: | Re: LOP (Lean of Peak) Injector Tuning |
Hi Tim-
If I dissect the trip with you and Scott Schmidt you were flying at 14% und
er max (176.5/205smph) at 9.5gph which yields 18.5smpg. This is the same ef
ficiency as David flying 20% under with reduced power. Not much different t
han the-19.1smph that I reported. The difference could easily be explaine
d by atmospherics or loading.
-
My interest is cross country efficiency and I thought there was a significa
nt miles per gallon increase with slowing the plane down and running LOP. M
y original thought was to-collect data points from everyone and plot-ai
rspeed-percent reduction vs the miles per gallon at LOP. We know when run
ning ROP the speed increases little and the consumption lots. I made a some
what speed run recently at 8000ft/DA 10425, WOT, 2400rpm, lean 25degF ROP,
200mph TAS, 13.6gph. A 3% drop in speed yielded 14.7smpg.
-
With still just a small amount of data it would seem that-right at peak E
GT is the maximum fuel efficiency/airspeed optimum and the fuel efficiency
remains (or drops slightly)-as you lean into-LOP territory.
-
I ran into Scott on a grass strip in the middle of Idaho. He has a beautifu
l aircraft.
-
This is getting too far from the theme of injector tuning so I'll drop off
but may bring up efficiency and prop settings at a later date.
-
Bill DeRouchey
N939SB
-
--- On Sun, 8/23/09, Tim Olson wrote:
From: Tim Olson <Tim(at)myrv10.com>
Subject: Re: RV10-List: LOP (Lean of Peak) Injector Tuning
Date: Sunday, August 23, 2009, 6:53 PM
Bill,
Regarding the speeds, I don't know why Dave was only getting 164.5
statute mph, but my LOP cruise is typically way better than that,
which is about 143kts, right?- If I am way lean of peak, and/or
very heavy loaded, I MAY get slowed down to 155-156kts TAS, but
on plenty of trips I'm seeing speeds of 164-166kts at LOP cruise.
If I fly ROP, I'd say most commonly I'll see 173-175kts, sometimes
slower. I've found that between leaning variations, turbulence,
altitudes flown, and loadings, that the speed can be all over the
map, but I don't know that I've ever really seen constant enroute
cruise figures of less than 152kts on my trips.- So if I am
getting, say 189-190 statue mph on many flights, and I'm generally
burning 9.5-10.5 gph at my most commonly flown altitudes,
I'm probably pushing right up near that same 19.1 statue mpg
on many flights.- There are times I'm a bit less, but loadings
and the other factors don't always duplicate themselves.- I'll
tell you what though, there's no way that I'm not getting
better efficiency than someone flying ROP.- As Kelly pointed
out, it's the temps, the cleanness, and all sorts of other
things that are benefits too.- I'd say that you will usually
lose 6-10kts depending on many factors, such as how far you
lean past peak.- I usually just go for 25 LOP on the last
cyl. to peak.
Regarding flying ROP or at peak, like you are talking about,
I tend to agree that if you're way down in power like at
65%, you're probably not going to hurt anything too bad.
But, for those who are running 50-100 ROP, you probably
want to do a bit of studying up.- I don't have the numbers
committed to memory, but there is a window at higher power
settings where you really don't want to stay, and I
think in order to stay out of it you really have to
either fly WAY ROP, or go LOP.- Again, don't quote me,
but if you venture over 75% power, I'd avoid that range
from maybe 125 to 0 ROP. (Can someone verify that? I've got
docs but I'm not going to dig them up right this minute)
So I'm not saying you're doing anything wrong, at the
lower power levels you can get away with anything. But,
I think you picked a pretty lowball datapoint from David
if you're going to use his 164.5smph.- Scott Schmidt
and I both just flew together for 3.75 hours running
LOP and we blew that speed away by at least 10kts
for the whole trip, on something like 9.5 gph.- He was
lighter loaded than me and burned about 2 gallons less
over the entire leg.
So the point is, I don't think most people will give up enough
speed to worry about it a whole lot.
Tim Olson - RV-10 N104CD
Bill DeRouchey wrote:
> I believe tuning the injector nozzles will create a smoother running engi
ne and that in itself has value. However, I have been mystified during thes
e conversations as to the value of running LOP vs fuel economy. There was n
ever enough data in the emails to get the whole picture. The question I alw
ays had was how much speed are you willing to loose to gain how much fuel e
fficiency?
>- Thanks to Dave's pic of his panel and my own experience I was able to
put a picture together.
>- The following numbers are in statute miles and the Density Altitude is
similar. If we assume that the top speed of our RV-10's is 205mph then Dav
e is flying 20% (164.5smph) under max and achieving 18.6smpg while leaned t
o approx 25deg LOP. An averaged flight in my plane is 6% under max speed (1
93smph) achieving 19.1smpg while leaned to peak. My definition of peak is w
hen 3 cylinders drop.
>- Typical panel setup for me is: WOT, 10-13K feet, 2380-2420rpm, 10.1-10
.3gph, lean to peak.
>- These are only two datapoints. What are others achieving? And please p
rovide the whole picture - what is the percent under max speed you are will
ing to fly and the miles per gallon you are achieving as a benefit. I assum
e the whole LOP (other than a smooth engine) is to achieve fuel efficiency.
>- What am I missing?
>- Bill DeRouchey
> N939SB
>- ---
> --- On *Sun, 8/23/09, Deems Davis //* wrote:
>
>
>- ---From: Deems Davis <deemsdavis(at)cox.net>
>- ---Subject: Re: RV10-List: LOP (Lean of Peak) Injector Tuning
>- ---To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com
>- ---Date: Sunday, August 23, 2009, 8:22 AM
>
net
>- ---<http://us.mc344.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=deemsdavis@co
x.net>>
>
>- ---All of the LOP information is GREAT. Keep it coming !!!!!!! I
have a
>- ---question:
>
>- ---When leaning the engine, the 'old traditional / prior to gage
s' way
>- ---was to lean it until it begins to 'stumble' and then richen i
t up a
>- ---bit. When I lean using the EGT gages I notice the 'stumble' w
hen the
>- ---1st cylinder goes lean. If you continue to lean until all of
the
>- ---remaining cylinders peak (LOP), What happens to the 'stumble'
???
>- ---Does it even out / go way with the engine running smooth? Doe
s it
>- ---persist? Since any changes in the engines smooth running are
a
>- ---concern in flight, I'd appreciate learning what those of you
that
>- ---are routinely running LOP are experiencing.
>
>- ---Deems Davis N519PJ
>- ---http://deemsrv10.com/index.html
>
>- ---gary wrote:
t
>- ---<http://us.mc344.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=speckter@comc
ast.net>>
>- - - >
>- - - > Is there a danger with running too much over square?- Dick
>- ---mentions 2" but I
>- - - > have been running more than that (2200 and 26")LOP. I have n
ot
>- ---seen much
>- - - > info on running over square.
>- - - >
>- - - > Gary Specketer
>- - - >
>- - - > -----Original Message-----
>- - - > From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com
>- ---<http://us.mc344.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=owner-rv10-li
st-server(at)matronics.com>
>- - - > [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com
>- ---<http://us.mc344.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=owner-rv10-li
st-server(at)matronics.com>]
>- ---On Behalf Of richard sipp
>- - - > Sent: Saturday, August 22, 2009 11:57 PM
>- - - > To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com
>- ---<http://us.mc344.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=rv10-list@mat
ronics.com>
>- - - > Subject: Re: RV10-List: LOP (Lean of Peak) Injector Tuning
>- - - >
>- ---- ---<http://us.mc344.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=rsipp@earthli
nk.net>>
>- - - >
>- - - > Tim:
>- - - >
>- - - > Great post as usual on your injector balancing experience.
- I had
>- ---very nearly the same experience and results with two minor
>- ---variations; a complete
>- - - >
>- - - > Airflow Performance system vs. your Silver Hawk and we start
ed by
>- ---installing
>- - - >
>- - - > .026's in all cylinders and then balancing.- I ran most of
the
>- ---tests at 10-11 MSL and verified at the results at 7.5.- Don
R. felt
>- ---that at the lower
>- - - >
>- - - > power settings of around 50-60% the flow divider begins to b
e the
>- ---determining factor and by going to the smaller .026s the flow
>- ---divider is taken out of the equation.
>- - - >
>- - - > There was an interesting series of pictures and notes regard
ing
>- ---burned pistons (don't remember where I saw them) where the au
thor
>- ---thought the cause
>- - - >
>- - - > was "rapid" mixture leaning used by LOP operators.- He fel
t the
>- ---rapid rise in EGT was the cause.- I disagree.- GAMI recom
mends the
>- ---"big pull" from rich
>- - - >
>- - - > to LOP and then a finer adujustment to prevent spending more
time
>- ---in the danger zone of peak to 100 rich of peak.- Also with
a rapid
>- ---initial mixture leaning I doubt the cylinder or piston temp w
ill
>- ---increase before it cools from steady LOP operation.- Furthe
r at <65%
>- ---I do not think you can do anything to the mixture that would
harm or
>- ---overstress the engine.
>- - - >
>- - - > Regarding long range cruise I was happy to find that my engi
ne
>- ---seems equally
>- - - >
>- - - > smooth at 2250 as at higher RPM.- I see about a 1GPH reduc
tion in
>- ---fuel flow with each 100 RPM reduction at full throttle settin
gs and
>- ---there is very little airspeed loss as the prop is taking bigg
er bits
>- ---(sorta like overdrive). Charles Lindberg showed the P-38 pilo
ts in
>- ---the South Pacific how
>- - - >
>- - - > to double their range by running "over square and lean".-
---Finally, to prevent the prop driving the engine during higher spee
d
>- ---descents I keep the RPM at least "2" oversquare below manifol
d
>- ---pressure.- This is common practice with the big radials and
it would
>- ---seem equally applicable to our engines.
>- - - >
>- - - > Dick Sipp
>- - - > N110DV 175 hours
>- - - >
>- - - >
>- - - >
>- - - >
>- - - >
>- - - >
>- - - >
>- - - >
>- - - >
>- - - > ====================
===
>- ---<http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List>http://www.mat
====================
>
>
>
>- ---<http://forums.matronics.com/>
>
> *
>
>
> *
le, List Admin.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Michael Kraus <n223rv(at)wolflakeairport.net> |
I don't like the Vans set up on the grab handles. They appear very
hard to trim out as the back end is flush with the panel. I was
thinking about spacing the reinforcement rings further aft to give
some room behind it to add a trim ring or something.
What have others done to make this area look nice? Picts would be
great!!
-Mike
Sent from my iPhone
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | David Maib <dmaib(at)mac.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Grab Handles |
I find that we never use the grab handles. We always use the center
windshield post when adjusting seats or getting in and out of the
airplane. I do use the right hand one as a handy place to clip my
SPOT tracker.
$.02 worth.
David Maib
40559
Flying
On Aug 25, 2009, at 9:05 PM, Michael Kraus wrote:
I don't like the Vans set up on the grab handles. They appear very
hard to trim out as the back end is flush with the panel. I was
thinking about spacing the reinforcement rings further aft to give
some room behind it to add a trim ring or something.
What have others done to make this area look nice? Picts would be
great!!
-Mike
Sent from my iPhone
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Question on Control Cables & FAB |
| From: | "johngoodman" <johngoodman(at)earthlink.net> |
It's a 7/16th inch thread, so look up the torque numbers in the tables.
John
--------
#40572 QB Fuselage, wings finished. Finish Kit progressing. Engine & Panel
delivery soon.
N711JG reserved
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=259607#259607
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Linn Walters <pitts_pilot(at)bellsouth.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Grab Handles |
Whic causes me to ask the question. Would anyone miss the windshield
post if the mod fairies visited??? And yes, I'm contemplating leaving
mine out. I hate stuff in the way of the 'view'. I'm not interested in
'structural' comments, just whether it's used a lot and not a real big
'distraction', so no flames, please.
Linn
David Maib wrote:
>
> I find that we never use the grab handles. We always use the center
> windshield post when adjusting seats or getting in and out of the
> airplane. I do use the right hand one as a handy place to clip my SPOT
> tracker.
>
> $.02 worth.
>
> David Maib
> 40559
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Jesse Saint <jesse(at)saintaviation.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Grab Handles |
It doesn't seem to bother the view. It would be a pain not to have it.
Jesse Saint
Saint Aviation
jesse(at)saintaviation.com
352-427-0285
Sent from my iPhone
On Aug 25, 2009, at 9:58 PM, Linn Walters
wrote:
> >
>
> Whic causes me to ask the question. Would anyone miss the
> windshield post if the mod fairies visited??? And yes, I'm
> contemplating leaving mine out. I hate stuff in the way of the
> 'view'. I'm not interested in 'structural' comments, just whether
> it's used a lot and not a real big 'distraction', so no flames,
> please.
> Linn
>
> David Maib wrote:
>> I find that we never use the grab handles. We always use the center
>> windshield post when adjusting seats or getting in and out of the
>> airplane. I do use the right hand one as a handy place to clip my
>> SPOT tracker.
>> $.02 worth.
>> David Maib
>> 40559
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Rene" <rene(at)felker.com> |
Yes I would miss the post. Very hard to get in the plane without it.
Rene'
801-721-6080
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Linn Walters
Sent: Tuesday, August 25, 2009 7:58 PM
Subject: Re: RV10-List: Grab Handles
Whic causes me to ask the question. Would anyone miss the windshield
post if the mod fairies visited??? And yes, I'm contemplating leaving
mine out. I hate stuff in the way of the 'view'. I'm not interested in
'structural' comments, just whether it's used a lot and not a real big
'distraction', so no flames, please.
Linn
David Maib wrote:
>
> I find that we never use the grab handles. We always use the center
> windshield post when adjusting seats or getting in and out of the
> airplane. I do use the right hand one as a handy place to clip my SPOT
> tracker.
>
> $.02 worth.
>
> David Maib
> 40559
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Perry, Phil" <Phil.Perry(at)netapp.com> |
I fly an airplane with a center post and it doesn't bother me at all..
-----Original Message-----
From: Linn Walters [mailto:pitts_pilot(at)bellsouth.net]
Sent: Tuesday, August 25, 2009 8:58 PM
Subject: Re: RV10-List: Grab Handles
Whic causes me to ask the question. Would anyone miss the windshield
post if the mod fairies visited??? And yes, I'm contemplating leaving
mine out. I hate stuff in the way of the 'view'. I'm not interested in
'structural' comments, just whether it's used a lot and not a real big
'distraction', so no flames, please.
Linn
David Maib wrote:
>
> I find that we never use the grab handles. We always use the center
> windshield post when adjusting seats or getting in and out of the
> airplane. I do use the right hand one as a handy place to clip my SPOT
> tracker.
>
> $.02 worth.
>
> David Maib
> 40559
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Tim Olson <Tim(at)MyRV10.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Grab Handles |
I, like you, absolutely hated the idea of the center bar when
I first flew in the factory 10. I came from a Sundowner
that was wide open in front and had great visibility. I contemplated
getting rid of it entirely, and didn't want it there.
Funny thing is, now I wouldn't probably be without it if I had
the choice. I use it ALL the time. My hand is constantly
there, getting in, getting out, pulling myself from
under the panel, and especially when riding along in
turbulence. Sometimes I just hang my hand from there
like an ape to relax. It's great having it. I do very
highly recommend that you paint the bar a very dark color,
and the same with the glareshield...something non-reflective
for sure. You will see anything that is light in color as
a reflection in the windshield. That is the only time I'd
be annoyed, but since I painted my a darker grey, it is
usually invisible, and I'm surprised at how much my
perspective changed, once I started actually flying my -10.
Tim Olson - RV-10 N104CD
Linn Walters wrote:
>
> Whic causes me to ask the question. Would anyone miss the windshield
> post if the mod fairies visited??? And yes, I'm contemplating leaving
> mine out. I hate stuff in the way of the 'view'. I'm not interested in
> 'structural' comments, just whether it's used a lot and not a real big
> 'distraction', so no flames, please.
> Linn
>
> David Maib wrote:
>>
>> I find that we never use the grab handles. We always use the center
>> windshield post when adjusting seats or getting in and out of the
>> airplane. I do use the right hand one as a handy place to clip my SPOT
>> tracker.
>>
>> $.02 worth.
>>
>> David Maib
>> 40559
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Linn Walters <pitts_pilot(at)bellsouth.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Grab Handles |
Thanks to everyone for all the feedback on the center post! I'm not one
to ignore good advice. The post will be there when my bird flies!!!
Linn
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Don McDonald <building_partner(at)yahoo.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Grab Handles |
Tim,,,, and I thought I was the only one that kind of just hangs from the p
ost from time to time.- Definitely like it in there.
Don McDonald
--- On Tue, 8/25/09, Tim Olson wrote:
From: Tim Olson <Tim(at)MyRV10.com>
Subject: Re: RV10-List: Grab Handles
Date: Tuesday, August 25, 2009, 8:25 PM
I, like you, absolutely hated the idea of the center bar when
I first flew in the factory 10.- I came from a Sundowner
that was wide open in front and had great visibility. I contemplated
getting rid of it entirely, and didn't want it there.
Funny thing is, now I wouldn't probably be without it if I had
the choice. I use it ALL the time.- My hand is constantly
there, getting in, getting out, pulling myself from
under the panel, and especially when riding along in
turbulence.- Sometimes I just hang my hand from there
like an ape to relax.- It's great having it.- I do very
highly recommend that you paint the bar a very dark color,
and the same with the glareshield...something non-reflective
for sure.- You will see anything that is light in color as
a reflection in the windshield.- That is the only time I'd
be annoyed, but since I painted my a darker grey, it is
usually invisible, and I'm surprised at how much my
perspective changed, once I started actually flying my -10.
Tim Olson - RV-10 N104CD
Linn Walters wrote:
>
> Whic causes me to ask the question.- Would anyone miss the windshield p
ost if the mod fairies visited???- And yes, I'm contemplating leaving min
e out.- I hate stuff in the way of the 'view'.- I'm not interested in '
structural' comments, just whether it's used a lot and not a real big 'dist
raction', so no flames, please.
> Linn
>
> David Maib wrote:
>>
>> I find that we never use the grab handles. We always use the center wind
shield post when adjusting seats or getting in and out of the airplane. I d
o use the right hand one as a handy place to clip my SPOT tracker.
>>
>> $.02 worth.
>>
>> David Maib
>> 40559
le, List Admin.
=0A=0A=0A
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Deems Davis <deemsdavis(at)cox.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Olsons great getaway writeup - A Gathering ???? |
I like this idea ... RV10 gathering/s. OSH is definitely a great
gathering, but I'd love to see if there's any interest in getting
together somewhere with some other builder/flyers. I think the biggest
attraction to OSH for me is just getting to visit with other similarly
'infected' types.
I monitor the SoCal RV list, and they routinely have several posts each
week where several people connect and either meet somewhere or fly
somewhere together. I realize we're spread across the US and the
logistics are greatly expanded, but it would be nice if we developed
into the kind of group that routinely met and flew together either
regionally or otherwise.
What if people just used this list to post ideas about where, who, and
when they would like to take a trip with some others? and let people
naturally connect? If it turns out to be a benefit, who know someone
might set up part of a website as an " I want to take a trip' bulletin
board.
Deems Davis N519PJ
http://deemsrv10.com/index.html
Tim Olson wrote:
>
> I just do it to try to get you all to finish up so we can have
> some great RV-10 gatherings. :)
> Tim
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Robin Marks" <robin1(at)mrmoisture.com> |
RV-List,
In the past I have mentioned that a number of pilots
have said how bright & noticeable my Dual Wig Wag HID lights are from
the ground when I am on approach during the daylight hours. This is
exactly what I wanted from the first day I saw my neighbor's Pilatus
swoop into our home field with his flashing HID's a blazing. I think the
little boy inside of me said... "me want."
Well yesterday on a dusk flight departing the LA basin
ATC called traffic "South West 737 you have RV-10 Traffic 10 O'clock, 17
miles 8,500 feet. November 110EE traffic 2:00 O'clock descending out of
one-one-thousand feet a Boeing 737." Before I could respond the South
West 737 replied Traffic Insight. Moments later the SW pilot told me
through the controller "that is some light system he has on his RV-10,
it's really easy to pick up" COOL! Getting "at a boy's" from commercial
pilots.
I consider the Wig-Wag HID's to be an important safety feature on my
-10. Seeing is avoiding.
The set up is nothing out of the ordinary with the
exception of dual 35W HID lights placed in the leading edge. If
interested I have a page that shows the install.
http://www.painttheweb.com/rv-10/Lights_LEDHID.htm . One more thing of
note. When on that page you will also see some pretty expensive (but
nice) LED Position Lights. My next build is an RV-8A and I have found a
set of Red & Green LED bulbs for around $8.00 each including wired
sockets (eBay). These appear to be an excellent and cost effective
solution vs. the printed circuit board LED's I used on my -10. Plus some
significant time savings to install as well. I will report results once
flying.
Not exactly the LED's I purchased but this gives you an idea of the
concept: eBay Item# 380151029392
<http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/G18-67-67-Hyper-Green-15-LED-Light-Bulb-
12v-1156-61-63_W0QQcmdZViewItemQQ_trksidZp3286Q2ec0Q2em14QQhashZitem5882
c45e90QQitemZ380151029392QQptZMotorsQ5fCarQ5fTruckQ5fPartsQ5fAccessories
>
Robin
RV-4 Sold
RV-6A Sold
RV-10 75 Hours
RV-8A Flying 2010
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Russell Daves" <dav1111(at)suddenlink.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Olsons great getaway writeup - A Gathering ???? |
I agree with deems. The next RV get together for Ann and I will be at
Larry Vetterman's Black Hills fly in and Mt. Rushmore aerial tour, on
9/11-13/09.
Check out the info here:
http://www.vansairforce.com/community/calendar.php?do=getinfo&day 0
9-9-11&c=1
Russ Daves
N710RV - 280+ hours
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "RV Builder (Michael Sausen)" <rvbuilder(at)sausen.net> |
Also, as one of the users of the S-10 overhead console mod, I plan on using the
center post to run wires up for the overhead lights and anything else I stick
in there like probably the 496 GPS antenna.
Michael
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Linn Walters
Sent: Tuesday, August 25, 2009 10:53 PM
Subject: Re: RV10-List: Grab Handles
Thanks to everyone for all the feedback on the center post! I'm not one
to ignore good advice. The post will be there when my bird flies!!!
Linn
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "RV Builder (Michael Sausen)" <rvbuilder(at)sausen.net> |
This is another great place to get LED replacement bulbs.
http://www.autolumination.com/
Michael
From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@m
atronics.com] On Behalf Of Robin Marks
Sent: Wednesday, August 26, 2009 12:43 AM
Subject: RV10-List: Big Iron Envy
RV-List,
In the past I have mentioned that a number of pilots have s
aid how bright & noticeable my Dual Wig Wag HID lights are from the ground
when I am on approach during the daylight hours. This is exactly what I wan
ted from the first day I saw my neighbor's Pilatus swoop into our home fiel
d with his flashing HID's a blazing. I think the little boy inside of me sa
id... "me want."
Well yesterday on a dusk flight departing the LA basin ATC
called traffic "South West 737 you have RV-10 Traffic 10 O'clock, 17 miles
8,500 feet. November 110EE traffic 2:00 O'clock descending out of one-one-
thousand feet a Boeing 737." Before I could respond the South West 737 repl
ied Traffic Insight. Moments later the SW pilot told me through the control
ler "that is some light system he has on his RV-10, it's really easy to pic
k up" COOL! Getting "at a boy's" from commercial pilots.
I consider the Wig-Wag HID's to be an important safety feature on my -10. S
eeing is avoiding.
The set up is nothing out of the ordinary with the exceptio
n of dual 35W HID lights placed in the leading edge. If interested I have a
page that shows the install. http://www.painttheweb.com/rv-10/Lights_LED
HID.htm . One more thing of note. When on that page you will also see some
pretty expensive (but nice) LED Position Lights. My next build is an RV-8A
and I have found a set of Red & Green LED bulbs for around $8.00 each inclu
ding wired sockets (eBay). These appear to be an excellent and cost effecti
ve solution vs. the printed circuit board LED's I used on my -10. Plus some
significant time savings to install as well. I will report results once fl
ying.
Not exactly the LED's I purchased but this gives you an idea of the concept
: eBay Item# 380151029392<http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/G18-67-67-Hyper-Gr
een-15-LED-Light-Bulb-12v-1156-61-63_W0QQcmdZViewItemQQ_trksidZp3286Q2ec0Q2
em14QQhashZitem5882c45e90QQitemZ380151029392QQptZMotorsQ5fCarQ5fTruckQ5fPar
tsQ5fAccessories>
Robin
RV-4 Sold
RV-6A Sold
RV-10 75 Hours
RV-8A Flying 2010
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Deems Davis <deemsdavis(at)cox.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Olsons great getaway writeup - A Gathering ???? |
Another possibility for those same dates is:Land Of Enchantment (LOE)
:http://www.vansairforce.com/community/showthread.php?t=41042&highlight=%22LOE%22
Deems Davis N519PJ
http://deemsrv10.com/index.html
Russell Daves wrote:
> I agree with deems. The next RV get together for Ann and I will be at
> Larry Vetterman's Black Hills fly in and Mt. Rushmore aerial tour, on
> 9/11-13/09.
>
> Check out the info here:
>
> http://www.vansairforce.com/community/calendar.php?do=getinfo&day 09-9-11&c=1
> <http://www.vansairforce.com/community/calendar.php?do=getinfo&day 09-9-11&c=1>
>
> Russ Daves
> N710RV - 280+ hours
>
> *
>
>
> *
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Pascal" <rv10builder(at)verizon.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Big Iron Envy |
As far as LED's there is a nice way to do this, I think when I used all
the LED's ( 8 in total) plexi, resistor and all it was about $80 for the
two Nav lights.
from Pete on VAF-
http://www.vansairforce.com/community/showthread.php?t=37018&highlight=
led+nav+light instructions of how to do and some better pictures than I
was able to take myself of my setup. Very bright!
As far those (like me) that just want to be seen without making a hole
in the leading edge (which actually allows there to be light for the
pilot to see) Here is an inexpensive option- David McNeill's plane is on
the website to show the difference of the wing tip lights (stock Van's-
vs Planelights) http://www.planelights.com/index.php?id=661
Pascal
From: Robin Marks
Sent: Tuesday, August 25, 2009 10:43 PM
Subject: RV10-List: Big Iron Envy
RV-List,
In the past I have mentioned that a number of pilots
have said how bright & noticeable my Dual Wig Wag HID lights are from
the ground when I am on approach during the daylight hours. This is
exactly what I wanted from the first day I saw my neighbor's Pilatus
swoop into our home field with his flashing HID's a blazing. I think the
little boy inside of me said. "me want."
Well yesterday on a dusk flight departing the LA basin
ATC called traffic "South West 737 you have RV-10 Traffic 10 O'clock, 17
miles 8,500 feet. November 110EE traffic 2:00 O'clock descending out of
one-one-thousand feet a Boeing 737." Before I could respond the South
West 737 replied Traffic Insight. Moments later the SW pilot told me
through the controller "that is some light system he has on his RV-10,
it's really easy to pick up" COOL! Getting "at a boy's" from commercial
pilots.
I consider the Wig-Wag HID's to be an important safety feature on my
-10. Seeing is avoiding.
The set up is nothing out of the ordinary with the
exception of dual 35W HID lights placed in the leading edge. If
interested I have a page that shows the install.
http://www.painttheweb.com/rv-10/Lights_LEDHID.htm . One more thing of
note. When on that page you will also see some pretty expensive (but
nice) LED Position Lights. My next build is an RV-8A and I have found a
set of Red & Green LED bulbs for around $8.00 each including wired
sockets (eBay). These appear to be an excellent and cost effective
solution vs. the printed circuit board LED's I used on my -10. Plus some
significant time savings to install as well. I will report results once
flying.
Not exactly the LED's I purchased but this gives you an idea of the
concept: eBay Item# 380151029392
Robin
RV-4 Sold
RV-6A Sold
RV-10 75 Hours
RV-8A Flying 2010
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Grab Handles |
| From: | "orchidman" <gary(at)wingscc.com> |
msausen wrote:
> Also, as one of the users of the S-10 overhead console mod, I plan on using the
center post to run wires up for the overhead lights and anything else I stick
in there like probably the 496 GPS antenna.
> Michael--
I considered that but put my 496 GPS antenna on the glare shield just to the left
of where the center post goes through the glare shield. I put the WX antenna
just to the right of the post. I cut the hole in the glare shield where the
post penetrates it larger on the left side to get the connectors through it.
When flying I have not noted any interference in my view. We sit high enough that
the antennas are below the our view of the outside.
--------
Gary Blankenbiller
RV10 - # 40674
(N2GB Flying)
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=259690#259690
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Big Iron Envy |
| From: | Dave Saylor <dave.saylor.aircrafters(at)gmail.com> |
Robin,
Which Wig-Wag are you using? After I installed the Planelights HIDs in my
wingtips, I was told by Eric Jones in no uncertain terms that HIDs would
ruin the wig-wag he sells (from Perihelion Design). I had one of his WW
switches installed, and it worked fine for the halogens. But it came out
after the HIDs were installed, and I miss it!
How does your wig wag handle the warm-up period, or is there one?
I agree, the WW is a pretty significant safety improvement. Did I
understand the jet saw you at 10+ miles? Wow!
Dave Saylor
AirCrafters LLC
140 Aviation Way
Watsonville, CA 95076
831-722-9141 Shop
831-750-0284 Cell
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Tim Olson <Tim(at)MyRV10.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Grab Handles |
I forgot all about that aspect! Yes, I have 2 antenna wires up
the grab bar, and also some wires for LED lights. So without
that, you'd absolutely have to have an overhead console because
there is no other good way to get wires up there for lights.
Tim Olson - RV-10 N104CD
RV Builder (Michael Sausen) wrote:
>
> Also, as one of the users of the S-10 overhead console mod, I plan on using the
center post to run wires up for the overhead lights and anything else I stick
in there like probably the 496 GPS antenna.
>
> Michael
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Linn Walters
> Sent: Tuesday, August 25, 2009 10:53 PM
> To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com
> Subject: Re: RV10-List: Grab Handles
>
>
> Thanks to everyone for all the feedback on the center post! I'm not one
> to ignore good advice. The post will be there when my bird flies!!!
> Linn
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Olsons great getaway writeup - A Gathering ???? |
| From: | pilotdds(at)AOL.COM |
Are you going to host the first event,I understand Az is nice in the fall?
-----Original Message-----
From: Deems Davis <deemsdavis(at)cox.net>
Sent: Tue, Aug 25, 2009 10:09 pm
Subject: Re: RV10-List: Olsons great getaway writeup - A Gathering ????
?
I like this idea ... RV10 gathering/s. OSH is definitely a great gathering, but
I'd love to see if there's any interest in getting together somewhere with some
other builder/flyers. I think the biggest attraction to OSH for me is just
getting to visit with other similarly 'infected' types.?
?
I monitor the SoCal RV list, and they routinely have several posts each week where
several people connect and either meet somewhere or fly somewhere together.
I realize we're spread across the US and the logistics are greatly expanded,
but it would be nice if we developed into the kind of group that routinely met
and flew together either regionally or otherwise.?
?
What if people just used this list to post ideas about where, who, and when they
would like to take a trip with some others? and let people naturally connect?
If it turns out to be a benefit, who know someone might set up part of a website
as an " I want to take a trip' bulletin board.?
?
Deems Davis N519PJ?
http://deemsrv10.com/index.html?
?
Tim Olson wrote:?
>?
> I just do it to try to get you all to finish up so we can have?
> some great RV-10 gatherings. :)?
> Tim?
>?
?
?
?
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "David Shelton" <SBaircraft(at)yahoo.com> |
One of my friends is a leading winglet designer and here is my understanding...
If they are carefully optimized in a wind tunnel (airfoils, cant, sweep, twist,
etc), they can decrease drag by a very small amount (0.5 to 1.5% on a sailplane).
However, without expert design and testing, the winglets will almost certainly
increase drag.
Increasing the wingspan (higher aspect ratio) is a better way to reduce drag. If
you have no limitations on your wingspan (hangar space, sailplane class rules,
etc.), this is a better way to kill induced drag.
For the RV-10, I believe you would get a lot more bang-for-the-buck with these
improvements:
1) Seal your flaps. When retracted, the leading edge of the flap should nest against
a foam-rubber seal. This will prevent air from flowing through the gap and
creating interference drag.
2) Wingroot fairings. These should start with a very small radius at the leading
edge. Beginning at the thickest part of the wing, the radius should gently grow.
Some people make them backwards!
VGs can boost your maximum lift (lower stall, shorter take-off) but they generate
drag and reduce your high-speed performance. If STOL isn't your primary mission
(you probably shouldn't have an RV-10 if it is), then I wouldn't worry about
them.
In the case of the Columbia 400, I believe the VGs were used to improve the stall/spin
characteristics at high-altitude. Without them, I heard that it gives
an abrupt stall with unpredictable wing drop. The VGs took care of this problem
but with a corresponding drag penalty.
-David
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=259708#259708
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "RV Builder (Michael Sausen)" <rvbuilder(at)sausen.net> |
The key with wig-wagging HID's is that you have to give them a warm up pe
riod before they go to wig-wag mode or you will fry them. Most wig-wag set
ups for HID's will turn them on for a minute or so before switching to that
mode allowing them to fully warm up.
Michael
From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@m
atronics.com] On Behalf Of Dave Saylor
Sent: Wednesday, August 26, 2009 9:48 AM
Subject: Re: RV10-List: Big Iron Envy
Robin,
Which Wig-Wag are you using? After I installed the Planelights HIDs in my
wingtips, I was told by Eric Jones in no uncertain terms that HIDs would ru
in the wig-wag he sells (from Perihelion Design). I had one of his WW swit
ches installed, and it worked fine for the halogens. But it came out after
the HIDs were installed, and I miss it!
How does your wig wag handle the warm-up period, or is there one?
I agree, the WW is a pretty significant safety improvement. Did I understa
nd the jet saw you at 10+ miles? Wow!
Dave Saylor
AirCrafters LLC
140 Aviation Way
Watsonville, CA 95076
831-722-9141 Shop
831-750-0284 Cell
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Deems Davis <deemsdavis(at)cox.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Olsons great getaway writeup - A Gathering -Copperstate |
!!!
Absolutely ! We've got Copperstate coming up in Oct : (23-24)
http://www.copperstate.org/csj/ We had about a dozen -10 builders /
flyers here last year, Myron Nelson brought his 5th wheel trailer over
and cooked Carne Asada diiner for everyone. He even had a banner made up
w/ RV-10 HQ on it. There were 3-4 RV-10's that flew their planes in. I
personally know of at least one more that will be flying in this year
;-) . He may even be able to be talked into giving some rides.
We've got 4 flying RV10's in the area:
David McNeil
Bill DeRouchey
Al Gardner
Myself.
And several more under construction.
Maybe we would could talk you Jim and Robin Marks into coming over from
CA, and Rick Sked to come down from Las Vegas, Scott to come down from
SLC. Heck if we can get that many -10's I'm pretty sure I can arrange
for us to get a 'designated parking area' set aside for us. That time of
the year the weather is GREAT! Visibilities are unlimited. And Av Gas in
Casa Grande is some of the cheapest in AZ.
I'd be happy to work on arrangements. and possibly some group activities.
Who's interested????????
Deems Davis N519PJ
http://deemsrv10.com/index.html
pilotdds(at)aol.com wrote:
> Are you going to host the first event,I understand Az is nice in the fall?
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Deems Davis <deemsdavis(at)cox.net>
> To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com
> Sent: Tue, Aug 25, 2009 10:09 pm
> Subject: Re: RV10-List: Olsons great getaway writeup - A Gathering ????
>
> >
>
> I like this idea ... RV10 gathering/s. OSH is definitely a great
> gathering, but I'd love to see if there's any interest in getting
> together somewhere with some other builder/flyers. I think the biggest
> attraction to OSH for me is just getting to visit with other similarly
> 'infected' types.
>
> I monitor the SoCal RV list, and they routinely have several posts
> each week where several people connect and either meet somewhere or
> fly somewhere together. I realize we're spread across the US and the
> logistics are greatly expanded, but it would be nice if we developed
> into the kind of group that routinely met and flew together either
> regionally or otherwise.
>
> What if people just used this list to post ideas about where, who, and
> when they would like to take a trip with some others? and let people
> naturally connect? If it turns out to be a benefit, who know someone
> might set up part of a website as an " I want to take a trip' bulletin
> board.
>
> Deems Davis N519PJ
> http://deemsrv10.com/index.html
>
> Tim Olson wrote:
> >
> >
> > I just do it to try to get you all to finish up so we can have
> > some great RV-10 gatherings. :)
> > Tim
> >
>
>
>
> *
>
>
> *
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "David McNeill" <dlm46007(at)cox.net> |
| Subject: | Olsons great getaway writeup - A Gathering ???? |
The LOE at 5t6 I believe is Oct 9-11.
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Deems Davis
Sent: Wednesday, August 26, 2009 6:57 AM
Subject: Re: RV10-List: Olsons great getaway writeup - A Gathering ????
Another possibility for those same dates is:Land Of Enchantment (LOE)
:http://www.vansairforce.com/community/showthread.php?t=41042&highlight=%22L
OE%22
Deems Davis N519PJ
http://deemsrv10.com/index.html
Russell Daves wrote:
> I agree with deems. The next RV get together for Ann and I will be at
> Larry Vetterman's Black Hills fly in and Mt. Rushmore aerial tour, on
> 9/11-13/09.
>
> Check out the info here:
>
> http://www.vansairforce.com/community/calendar.php?do=getinfo&day 09
> -9-11&c=1
> <http://www.vansairforce.com/community/calendar.php?do=getinfo&day 0
> 9-9-11&c=1>
>
> Russ Daves
> N710RV - 280+ hours
>
> *
>
>
> *
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Dave Saylor <dave.saylor.aircrafters(at)gmail.com> |
David,
I agree about the winglets.
But in regard to the RV-10 specifically, I think a strip of foam in the
flap cove might reduce flap effectiveness by disrupting the air through the
gap when the flaps are down. The gap is referred to as a "nozzle", which
makes me think that the air going through it is being managed to at least
some degree. Wouldn't a span-wise strip disrupt that flow? Besides, I
think that the upper skin, which should contact the top of the flap, does a
pretty good job of sealing off that airflow. I don't have any hard facts on
any of this, just my .02.
Dave Saylor
AirCrafters LLC
140 Aviation Way
Watsonville, CA 95076
831-722-9141 Shop
831-750-0284 Cell
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "David McNeill" <dlm46007(at)cox.net> |
| Subject: | Olsons great getaway writeup - A Gathering -Copperstate |
!!!
I will be at Copperstate. Will probably fly in all four days.
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Deems Davis
Sent: Wednesday, August 26, 2009 8:48 AM
Subject: Re: RV10-List: Olsons great getaway writeup - A Gathering
-Copperstate !!!
Absolutely ! We've got Copperstate coming up in Oct : (23-24)
http://www.copperstate.org/csj/ We had about a dozen -10 builders / flyers
here last year, Myron Nelson brought his 5th wheel trailer over and cooked
Carne Asada diiner for everyone. He even had a banner made up w/ RV-10 HQ on
it. There were 3-4 RV-10's that flew their planes in. I personally know of
at least one more that will be flying in this year
;-) . He may even be able to be talked into giving some rides.
We've got 4 flying RV10's in the area:
David McNeil
Bill DeRouchey
Al Gardner
Myself.
And several more under construction.
Maybe we would could talk you Jim and Robin Marks into coming over from CA,
and Rick Sked to come down from Las Vegas, Scott to come down from SLC. Heck
if we can get that many -10's I'm pretty sure I can arrange for us to get a
'designated parking area' set aside for us. That time of the year the
weather is GREAT! Visibilities are unlimited. And Av Gas in Casa Grande is
some of the cheapest in AZ.
I'd be happy to work on arrangements. and possibly some group activities.
Who's interested????????
Deems Davis N519PJ
http://deemsrv10.com/index.html
pilotdds(at)aol.com wrote:
> Are you going to host the first event,I understand Az is nice in the fall?
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Deems Davis <deemsdavis(at)cox.net>
> To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com
> Sent: Tue, Aug 25, 2009 10:09 pm
> Subject: Re: RV10-List: Olsons great getaway writeup - A Gathering ????
>
> >
>
> I like this idea ... RV10 gathering/s. OSH is definitely a great
> gathering, but I'd love to see if there's any interest in getting
> together somewhere with some other builder/flyers. I think the biggest
> attraction to OSH for me is just getting to visit with other similarly
> 'infected' types.
>
> I monitor the SoCal RV list, and they routinely have several posts
> each week where several people connect and either meet somewhere or
> fly somewhere together. I realize we're spread across the US and the
> logistics are greatly expanded, but it would be nice if we developed
> into the kind of group that routinely met and flew together either
> regionally or otherwise.
>
> What if people just used this list to post ideas about where, who, and
> when they would like to take a trip with some others? and let people
> naturally connect? If it turns out to be a benefit, who know someone
> might set up part of a website as an " I want to take a trip' bulletin
> board.
>
> Deems Davis N519PJ
> http://deemsrv10.com/index.html
>
> Tim Olson wrote:
> >
> >
> > I just do it to try to get you all to finish up so we can have some
> > great RV-10 gatherings. :) Tim
> >
>
>
>
> *
>
>
> *
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Robin Marks" <robin1(at)mrmoisture.com> |
At the time there were limited choices. There was someone selling a
small module for something like $30 but I didn't want to risk the
expensive HID system on an unknown W/W module so I spent the extra $ and
purchased the XePulse module
http://www.xevision.com/hid_prices.html#pulsingprices $165 to $195. I
understand from Duckworth that the MaxPulse Flasher is also a very nice
unit (with warm up mode) for $140 http://www.duckworksav.com/WigWag.html
but the MaxPulse may violate a XePulse patent so Duckworks has been
forced to close out it's inventory.
As I did not stay at a Holiday In Express last night PLEASE do the
research to make sure any unit you purchase works with your
manufacturers HID lights.
Robin
From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Dave Saylor
Sent: Wednesday, August 26, 2009 7:48 AM
Subject: Re: RV10-List: Big Iron Envy
Robin,
Which Wig-Wag are you using? After I installed the Planelights HIDs in
my wingtips, I was told by Eric Jones in no uncertain terms that HIDs
would ruin the wig-wag he sells (from Perihelion Design). I had one of
his WW switches installed, and it worked fine for the halogens. But it
came out after the HIDs were installed, and I miss it!
How does your wig wag handle the warm-up period, or is there one?
I agree, the WW is a pretty significant safety improvement. Did I
understand the jet saw you at 10+ miles? Wow!
Dave Saylor
AirCrafters LLC
140 Aviation Way
Watsonville, CA 95076
831-722-9141 Shop
831-750-0284 Cell
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Pascal" <rv10builder(at)verizon.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Olsons great getaway writeup - A Gathering -Copperstate |
!!!
I'll be driving out to Scottsdale October 24th, (who came up with a Thursday
to Saturday flyin?) I'll talk to my wife about leaving on Friday Maybe
we'll camp Friday night and hook up with anyone who is there.
If any of you will be there Friday night, please let me know so I'll know if
it's worth coming out Friday. Hope to meet a few of you.
Pascal
--------------------------------------------------
From: "Deems Davis" <deemsdavis(at)cox.net>
Sent: Wednesday, August 26, 2009 8:48 AM
Subject: Re: RV10-List: Olsons great getaway writeup - A
Gathering -Copperstate !!!
>
> Absolutely ! We've got Copperstate coming up in Oct : (23-24)
> http://www.copperstate.org/csj/ We had about a dozen -10 builders /
> flyers here last year, Myron Nelson brought his 5th wheel trailer over and
> cooked Carne Asada diiner for everyone. He even had a banner made up w/
> RV-10 HQ on it. There were 3-4 RV-10's that flew their planes in. I
> personally know of at least one more that will be flying in this year ;-)
> . He may even be able to be talked into giving some rides.
>
> We've got 4 flying RV10's in the area:
>
> David McNeil
> Bill DeRouchey
> Al Gardner
> Myself.
>
> And several more under construction.
>
> Maybe we would could talk you Jim and Robin Marks into coming over from
> CA, and Rick Sked to come down from Las Vegas, Scott to come down from
> SLC. Heck if we can get that many -10's I'm pretty sure I can arrange for
> us to get a 'designated parking area' set aside for us. That time of the
> year the weather is GREAT! Visibilities are unlimited. And Av Gas in Casa
> Grande is some of the cheapest in AZ.
>
> I'd be happy to work on arrangements. and possibly some group activities.
>
> Who's interested????????
>
> Deems Davis N519PJ
> http://deemsrv10.com/index.html
>
>
> pilotdds(at)aol.com wrote:
>> Are you going to host the first event,I understand Az is nice in the
>> fall?
>>
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: Deems Davis <deemsdavis(at)cox.net>
>> To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com
>> Sent: Tue, Aug 25, 2009 10:09 pm
>> Subject: Re: RV10-List: Olsons great getaway writeup - A Gathering ????
>>
>> > I like this idea ... RV10 gathering/s. OSH
>> is definitely a great gathering, but I'd love to see if there's any
>> interest in getting together somewhere with some other builder/flyers. I
>> think the biggest attraction to OSH for me is just getting to visit with
>> other similarly 'infected' types. I monitor the SoCal RV list, and they
>> routinely have several posts each week where several people connect and
>> either meet somewhere or fly somewhere together. I realize we're spread
>> across the US and the logistics are greatly expanded, but it would be
>> nice if we developed into the kind of group that routinely met and flew
>> together either regionally or otherwise. What if people just used this
>> list to post ideas about where, who, and when they would like to take a
>> trip with some others? and let people naturally connect? If it turns out
>> to be a benefit, who know someone might set up part of a website as an "
>> I want to take a trip' bulletin board. Deems Davis N519PJ
>> http://deemsrv10.com/index.html Tim Olson wrote:
>> >
>> >
>> > I just do it to try to get you all to finish up so we can have some
>> > great RV-10 gatherings. :) Tim
>> *
>>
>>
>> *
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | David Maib <dmaib(at)mac.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Grab Handles |
I actually considered leaving mine out as well. After riding in a -10
and talking to others that were flying -10's, I decided to throw that
idea away. I don't think it is a "view" problem, and as mentioned, it
is very handy and sturdy for entry and exit, as well as seat
adjustment. Structural considerations were considerable, to say the
least!
David Maib
40559
flying
On Aug 25, 2009, at 9:58 PM, Linn Walters wrote:
Whic causes me to ask the question. Would anyone miss the windshield
post if the mod fairies visited??? And yes, I'm contemplating
leaving mine out. I hate stuff in the way of the 'view'. I'm not
interested in 'structural' comments, just whether it's used a lot and
not a real big 'distraction', so no flames, please.
Linn
David Maib wrote:
> I find that we never use the grab handles. We always use the center
> windshield post when adjusting seats or getting in and out of the
> airplane. I do use the right hand one as a handy place to clip my
> SPOT tracker.
> $.02 worth.
> David Maib
> 40559
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bill DeRouchey <billderou(at)yahoo.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Grab Handles |
I use the windshield post many times during a flight. Its handy to ingress,
steep turns, turbulence. The only time I use the glareshield handle-is t
o adjust-the seat forward. It should be reinforced for this purpose and c
reates a challenge when fabricating-a glareshield.-
-
Bill DeRouchey
N939SB
--- On Tue, 8/25/09, Linn Walters wrote:
From: Linn Walters <pitts_pilot(at)bellsouth.net>
Subject: Re: RV10-List: Grab Handles
Date: Tuesday, August 25, 2009, 6:58 PM
Whic causes me to ask the question.- Would anyone miss the windshield pos
t if the mod fairies visited???- And yes, I'm contemplating leaving mine
out.- I hate stuff in the way of the 'view'.- I'm not interested in 'st
ructural' comments, just whether it's used a lot and not a real big 'distra
ction', so no flames, please.
Linn
David Maib wrote:
>
> I find that we never use the grab handles. We always use the center winds
hield post when adjusting seats or getting in and out of the airplane. I do
use the right hand one as a handy place to clip my SPOT tracker.
>
> $.02 worth.
>
> David Maib
> 40559
le, List Admin.
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Question on Control Cables & FAB |
| From: | "jayb" <jaybrinkmeyer(at)yahoo.com> |
Thanks for the reply.
Here's why I asked the question:
The table in Vans RV-10 General Info Section 5 calls out AN7... 450-500 in-lbs.
The Lycoming Service Table of Limits SSP1776 doc Table I, "Bolts, Screws and
Nuts", page 1-37 calls out 7/16...600 in-lbs. 150 in-lbs difference is quite a
spread.
I may just split the difference and call it good.
Regards,
Jay
johngoodman wrote:
> It's a 7/16th inch thread, so look up the torque numbers in the tables.
> John
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=259752#259752
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "David McNeill" <dlm46007(at)cox.net> |
| Subject: | Olsons great getaway writeup - A Gathering -Copperstate |
!!!
Check http://www.copperstate.org/csj/ Thursday is setup day; main show Fri
22 and Sat 23, 24th almost everybody is gone by noon.
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Pascal
Sent: Wednesday, August 26, 2009 9:22 AM
Subject: Re: RV10-List: Olsons great getaway writeup - A Gathering
-Copperstate !!!
I'll be driving out to Scottsdale October 24th, (who came up with a Thursday
to Saturday flyin?) I'll talk to my wife about leaving on Friday Maybe
we'll camp Friday night and hook up with anyone who is there.
If any of you will be there Friday night, please let me know so I'll know if
it's worth coming out Friday. Hope to meet a few of you.
Pascal
--------------------------------------------------
From: "Deems Davis" <deemsdavis(at)cox.net>
Sent: Wednesday, August 26, 2009 8:48 AM
Subject: Re: RV10-List: Olsons great getaway writeup - A Gathering
-Copperstate !!!
>
> Absolutely ! We've got Copperstate coming up in Oct : (23-24)
> http://www.copperstate.org/csj/ We had about a dozen -10 builders /
> flyers here last year, Myron Nelson brought his 5th wheel trailer over
> and cooked Carne Asada diiner for everyone. He even had a banner made
> up w/ RV-10 HQ on it. There were 3-4 RV-10's that flew their planes
> in. I personally know of at least one more that will be flying in
> this year ;-) . He may even be able to be talked into giving some rides.
>
> We've got 4 flying RV10's in the area:
>
> David McNeil
> Bill DeRouchey
> Al Gardner
> Myself.
>
> And several more under construction.
>
> Maybe we would could talk you Jim and Robin Marks into coming over
> from CA, and Rick Sked to come down from Las Vegas, Scott to come down
> from SLC. Heck if we can get that many -10's I'm pretty sure I can
> arrange for us to get a 'designated parking area' set aside for us.
> That time of the year the weather is GREAT! Visibilities are
> unlimited. And Av Gas in Casa Grande is some of the cheapest in AZ.
>
> I'd be happy to work on arrangements. and possibly some group activities.
>
> Who's interested????????
>
> Deems Davis N519PJ
> http://deemsrv10.com/index.html
>
>
> pilotdds(at)aol.com wrote:
>> Are you going to host the first event,I understand Az is nice in the
>> fall?
>>
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: Deems Davis <deemsdavis(at)cox.net>
>> To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com
>> Sent: Tue, Aug 25, 2009 10:09 pm
>> Subject: Re: RV10-List: Olsons great getaway writeup - A Gathering ????
>>
>> > I like this idea ... RV10 gathering/s.
>> OSH is definitely a great gathering, but I'd love to see if there's
>> any interest in getting together somewhere with some other
>> builder/flyers. I think the biggest attraction to OSH for me is just
>> getting to visit with other similarly 'infected' types. I monitor the
>> SoCal RV list, and they routinely have several posts each week where
>> several people connect and either meet somewhere or fly somewhere
>> together. I realize we're spread across the US and the logistics are
>> greatly expanded, but it would be nice if we developed into the kind
>> of group that routinely met and flew together either regionally or
>> otherwise. What if people just used this list to post ideas about
>> where, who, and when they would like to take a trip with some others?
>> and let people naturally connect? If it turns out to be a benefit, who
know someone might set up part of a website as an "
>> I want to take a trip' bulletin board. Deems Davis N519PJ
>> http://deemsrv10.com/index.html Tim Olson wrote:
>> >
>> >
>> > I just do it to try to get you all to finish up so we can have some
>> > great RV-10 gatherings. :) Tim
>> *
>>
>>
>> *
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "RV Builder (Michael Sausen)" <rvbuilder(at)sausen.net> |
| Subject: | Airflow Oil Box Splitter |
Just wanted to chime in quick, just had a nice chat with Bill and he is sending
out the splitters to anyone that has bought one of their coolers for no additional
cost if you give him a ring. He only asks that you pay $15 for the shipping.
Michael
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Deems Davis
Sent: Tuesday, August 25, 2009 10:14 AM
Subject: RV10-List: Airflow Oil Box Splitter
For further information about the Oil box splitter, as well as improved
performance Oil coolers and other products. I encourage people to contact:
William F. Genevro
Managing Director
949-218-9701
@ Airflow Systems directly. Bill has spent a LOT of time researching Oil
temps and associated issues, speaking with many RV10 builders and has a
large knowledge base from which he's developed these solutions. He's
easy to talk to. The oil splitter kits are available directly from him
for $49. And are free to those who buy one of his oil coolers.
Deems Davis N519PJ
http://deemsrv10.com/index.html
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Tim Olson <Tim(at)MyRV10.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Olsons great getaway writeup - A Gathering ???? |
I think gatherings would be fun, but, there is a downside sometimes.
If you go somewhere with tons to do, then nobody does any flying,
and there is too much draw to go visit other things. On the
other hand, if you go somewhere lame, then there is only flying
to do, and the family will get bored. So personally, I really
like the idea of gathering in one spot, and flying around
to a couple others....kind of like the last couple trips I
did like meeting David Maib and Vic and heading to Key West,
or metting Scott and heading to Oregon. That makes for a great
FLYING vacation where you can camp or see things too.
This year I was considering LOE for a fly-in since it's been
a while, but, at the same time, it's not really a super destination
for the kids and family....you basically will love it if you
just want to hang out with other builders, and you can
fly all day long if you want. But, you hang out at the
airport a lot. OSH is a great GATHERING but not the most
convenient place to do lots of flying. What would make
OSH more fun is if people would meet up along the way,
and the closer you got, the more people you had.
So it's hard because everyone has a varied agenda of what
they'd like. I don't think I'll be at LOE this year,
but I know I'll be flying a couple more times on trips by
the end of the year. It's always nice to fly along and look
out the window and see another RV-10. :)
Tim Olson - RV-10 N104CD
Deems Davis wrote:
>
> I like this idea ... RV10 gathering/s. OSH is definitely a great
> gathering, but I'd love to see if there's any interest in getting
> together somewhere with some other builder/flyers. I think the biggest
> attraction to OSH for me is just getting to visit with other similarly
> 'infected' types.
>
> I monitor the SoCal RV list, and they routinely have several posts each
> week where several people connect and either meet somewhere or fly
> somewhere together. I realize we're spread across the US and the
> logistics are greatly expanded, but it would be nice if we developed
> into the kind of group that routinely met and flew together either
> regionally or otherwise.
>
> What if people just used this list to post ideas about where, who, and
> when they would like to take a trip with some others? and let people
> naturally connect? If it turns out to be a benefit, who know someone
> might set up part of a website as an " I want to take a trip' bulletin
> board.
>
> Deems Davis N519PJ
> http://deemsrv10.com/index.html
>
> Tim Olson wrote:
>>
>> I just do it to try to get you all to finish up so we can have
>> some great RV-10 gatherings. :)
>> Tim
>>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Deems Davis <deemsdavis(at)cox.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Olsons great getaway writeup - A Gathering ???? |
Tim you might want to consider Copperstate as an alternate to LOE this
year. I've heard the same about LOE, great for RV'rs but not much else
to do. Copperstate is not so large that flying in and out during the
event is the challenge it is @ OSH. Tie in a visit to Sedona, Grand
Canyon, Monument Valley, Puerto Penasco, San Diego, Las Vegas ??? We'll
make it worth your while. I'll fly part way out to meet you so you can
have a -10 to look at on your way inbound :-)
Deems drumming up Copperstate attendance Davis
Tim Olson wrote:
>
> I think gatherings would be fun, but, there is a downside sometimes.
> If you go somewhere with tons to do, then nobody does any flying,
> and there is too much draw to go visit other things. On the
> other hand, if you go somewhere lame, then there is only flying
> to do, and the family will get bored. So personally, I really
> like the idea of gathering in one spot, and flying around
> to a couple others....kind of like the last couple trips I
> did like meeting David Maib and Vic and heading to Key West,
> or metting Scott and heading to Oregon. That makes for a great
> FLYING vacation where you can camp or see things too.
>
> This year I was considering LOE for a fly-in since it's been
> a while, but, at the same time, it's not really a super destination
> for the kids and family....you basically will love it if you
> just want to hang out with other builders, and you can
> fly all day long if you want. But, you hang out at the
> airport a lot. OSH is a great GATHERING but not the most
> convenient place to do lots of flying. What would make
> OSH more fun is if people would meet up along the way,
> and the closer you got, the more people you had.
>
> So it's hard because everyone has a varied agenda of what
> they'd like. I don't think I'll be at LOE this year,
> but I know I'll be flying a couple more times on trips by
> the end of the year. It's always nice to fly along and look
> out the window and see another RV-10. :)
>
> Tim Olson - RV-10 N104CD
>
>
> Deems Davis wrote:
>>
>> I like this idea ... RV10 gathering/s. OSH is definitely a great
>> gathering, but I'd love to see if there's any interest in getting
>> together somewhere with some other builder/flyers. I think the
>> biggest attraction to OSH for me is just getting to visit with other
>> similarly 'infected' types.
>>
>> I monitor the SoCal RV list, and they routinely have several posts
>> each week where several people connect and either meet somewhere or
>> fly somewhere together. I realize we're spread across the US and the
>> logistics are greatly expanded, but it would be nice if we developed
>> into the kind of group that routinely met and flew together either
>> regionally or otherwise.
>>
>> What if people just used this list to post ideas about where, who,
>> and when they would like to take a trip with some others? and let
>> people naturally connect? If it turns out to be a benefit, who know
>> someone might set up part of a website as an " I want to take a trip'
>> bulletin board.
>>
>> Deems Davis N519PJ
>> http://deemsrv10.com/index.html
>>
>> Tim Olson wrote:
>>>
>>> I just do it to try to get you all to finish up so we can have
>>> some great RV-10 gatherings. :)
>>> Tim
>>>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Question on Control Cables & FAB |
| From: | "johngoodman" <johngoodman(at)earthlink.net> |
Jay,
Just to muddy the water a little (g), The Standard Aircraft Handbook table on page
160 Shows 450-500 inch-pounds for a 7/16-20 with an AN315 nut, while an AN316
Shear Nut is only 270-300 inch-pounds. I believe you are tightening an AN316,
right?
Also, Coarse thread 7/16-14 are even less, but I'm pretty sure yours is -20.
John
--------
#40572 QB Fuselage, wings finished. Finish Kit progressing. Engine & Panel
delivery soon.
N711JG reserved
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=259774#259774
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Question on Control Cables & FAB |
| From: | "orchidman" <gary(at)wingscc.com> |
pitts_pilot(at)bellsouth. wrote:
> Most all (if not all) the hardware on a Lycosaur is coarse thread .....
> and the AN bolts are fine thread. I'm thinking that may be the
> difference???
> Linn
Also it should specify the metal it is for. Course, fine, and metal.
--------
Gary Blankenbiller
RV10 - # 40674
(N2GB Flying)
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=259786#259786
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Leaning for Climb, LOP ppt, and more |
| From: | Kelly McMullen <apilot2(at)gmail.com> |
If that is your cruise, what is your peak? Is that at 65%, 75% or ???
Seems a little high to me.
On Wed, Aug 26, 2009 at 9:40 AM, Bill DeRouchey wrote:
> My average EGT during cruise is always 1450 to 1510. I can't believe my
> engine is running much different than other installations but I do believe
> the instrumentation is different.
>
> My CHT's during the summer were 360-380 during cruise.Summer air in
> Prescottis 50degF at 8,000ft.
>
> QuotingEGT numbers from one aircraftdoesn't necessarily transfer to
> another.
>
> Bill DeRouchey
> N939SB
>
>
> --- On Tue, 8/25/09, David McNeill wrote:
>
> From: David McNeill <dlm46007(at)cox.net>
> Subject: RE: RV10-List: Leaning for Climb, LOP ppt, and more
> To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com
> Date: Tuesday, August 25, 2009, 8:21 AM
>
>
> Ditto on leaning. When I had my turbonormalized 177RG; the guidance from the
> STC was when climbing make sure that the EGTS are abour 1250F and about
> 1400F for cruise. For the 10 I use the 1250F number for Takeoffs at 5000+
> MSL but lean of peak EGTs usually fall in the 1350F-1400F range, while CHTs
> usually range from about 275F to 320F.
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Tim Olson
> Sent: Tuesday, August 25, 2009 6:36 AM
> To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com
> Subject: RV10-List: Leaning for Climb, LOP ppt, and more
>
>
> A quick note on leaning during climb.
> As many of you know, when you takeoff at altitude, especially over 5,000' of
> altitude, you will need to lean to get the proper takeoff power. A trick I
> learned a while back is that during climb, all the way up, you can lean to
> about 1225 degrees EGT, and if you maintain that temp your engine should be
> roughly leaned appropriately for climb. If you go full rich and try to climb
> to 8,000-10,000', your EGT's will be too low and you won't be making much
> power. In addition, I've worked with one person who had a Carbon Monoxide
> issue, and when I asked what the EGT's were, they sounded very low. By
> leaning out the engine a bit and raising the EGT's, the CO problem went
> away. So leaning is very important during cruise and climb.
>
>
> I did update my LOP Write-up at
> http://www.myrv10.com/N104CD/upgrades/20090822/index.html
> to add some additional info near the bottom, including the above.
> I also put in an "Advanced Pilot Seminar" on leaning link at the bottom, and
> a link to a .pdf version of the ppt that Sheldon had.
>
>
> One other quick note....
> I did get a trip write-up done from my latest travels to Utah, Oregon, and
> Idaho. Might be boring for you, but it was a really interesting trip in
> some respects.
> http://www.myrv10.com/N104CD/flights/20090819/index.html
>
>
> --
> Tim Olson - R/www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List"
> target=_blank>http://www.matronicbsp;--> http://= - List
> Contributionsp; &bsp;-->
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Question on Control Cables & FAB |
| From: | Kelly McMullen <apilot2(at)gmail.com> |
Lycoming generally uses higher torque than standard values, especially
on the case halve bolts, and has little relevance to what torque you
would use on a control cable nut.
On Wed, Aug 26, 2009 at 11:20 AM, jayb wrote:
>
> Thanks for the reply.
>
> Here's why I asked the question:
>
> The table in Vans RV-10 General Info Section 5 calls out AN7... 450-500 in-lbs.
The Lycoming Service Table of Limits SSP1776 doc Table I, "Bolts, Screws and
Nuts", page 1-37 calls out 7/16...600 in-lbs. 150 in-lbs difference is quite
a spread.
>
> I may just split the difference and call it good.
>
> Regards,
> Jay
>
>
> johngoodman wrote:
>> It's a 7/16th inch thread, so look up the torque numbers in the tables.
>> John
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=259752#259752
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Olsons great getaway writeup - A Gathering -Copperstate |
!!!
| From: | Kelly McMullen <apilot2(at)gmail.com> |
Copperstate for some odd reason appears to be Thurs noon to Sun noon.
Probably to get more revenue.
I'll probably come for a couple days.
On Wed, Aug 26, 2009 at 9:22 AM, Pascal wrote:
>
> I'll be driving out to Scottsdale October 24th, (who came up with a Thursday
> to Saturday flyin?) I'll talk to my wife about leaving on Friday Maybe
> we'll camp Friday night and hook up with anyone who is there.
> If any of you will be there Friday night, please let me know so I'll know if
> it's worth coming out Friday. Hope to meet a few of you.
> Pascal
> --------------------------------------------------
> From: "Deems Davis" <deemsdavis(at)cox.net>
> Sent: Wednesday, August 26, 2009 8:48 AM
> To:
> Subject: Re: RV10-List: Olsons great getaway writeup - A Gathering
> -Copperstate !!!
>
>>
>> Absolutely ! We've got Copperstate coming up in Oct : (23-24)
>> http://www.copperstate.org/csj/ We had about a dozen -10 builders / flyers
>> here last year, Myron Nelson brought his 5th wheel trailer over and cooked
>> Carne Asada diiner for everyone. He even had a banner made up w/ RV-10 HQ on
>> it. There were 3-4 RV-10's that flew their planes in. I personally know of
>> at least one more that will be flying in this year ;-) . He may even be able
>> to be talked into giving some rides.
>>
>> We've got 4 flying RV10's in the area:
>>
>> David McNeil
>> Bill DeRouchey
>> Al Gardner
>> Myself.
>>
>> And several more under construction.
>>
>> Maybe we would could talk you Jim and Robin Marks into coming over from
>> CA, and Rick Sked to come down from Las Vegas, Scott to come down from SLC.
>> Heck if we can get that many -10's I'm pretty sure I can arrange for us to
>> get a 'designated parking area' set aside for us. That time of the year the
>> weather is GREAT! Visibilities are unlimited. And Av Gas in Casa Grande is
>> some of the cheapest in AZ.
>>
>> I'd be happy to work on arrangements. and possibly some group activities.
>>
>> Who's interested????????
>>
>> Deems Davis N519PJ
>> http://deemsrv10.com/index.html
>>
>>
>> pilotdds(at)aol.com wrote:
>>>
>>> Are you going to host the first event,I understand Az is nice in the
>>> fall?
>>>
>>>
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: Deems Davis <deemsdavis(at)cox.net>
>>> To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com
>>> Sent: Tue, Aug 25, 2009 10:09 pm
>>> Subject: Re: RV10-List: Olsons great getaway writeup - A Gathering ????
>>>
>>> > I like this idea ... RV10 gathering/s. OSH is
>>> definitely a great gathering, but I'd love to see if there's any interest in
>>> getting together somewhere with some other builder/flyers. I think the
>>> biggest attraction to OSH for me is just getting to visit with other
>>> similarly 'infected' types. I monitor the SoCal RV list, and they routinely
>>> have several posts each week where several people connect and either meet
>>> somewhere or fly somewhere together. I realize we're spread across the US
>>> and the logistics are greatly expanded, but it would be nice if we developed
>>> into the kind of group that routinely met and flew together either
>>> regionally or otherwise. What if people just used this list to post ideas
>>> about where, who, and when they would like to take a trip with some others?
>>> and let people naturally connect? If it turns out to be a benefit, who know
>>> someone might set up part of a website as an " I want to take a trip'
>>> bulletin board. Deems Davis N519PJ http://deemsrv10.com/index.html Tim Olson
>>> wrote:
>>> >
>>> >
>>> > I just do it to try to get you all to finish up so we can have some >
>>> > great RV-10 gatherings. :) Tim
>>> *
>>>
>>>
>>> *
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Airflow Oil Box Splitter |
| From: | "nukeflyboy" <flymoore(at)charter.net> |
I also just called Airflow and got good support. In defense of Alex, Airflow said
that the kit is a very recent development and may not have been available
at the time ours were sent.
--------
Dave Moore
RV-6 flying
RV-10 QB - cabin top/fiberglass hell
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=259804#259804
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "RV Builder (Michael Sausen)" <rvbuilder(at)sausen.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Airflow Oil Box Splitter |
Yep, I was talking to Alex to at the same time and you may have noticed I was
copying him on the emails. Alex was very interested in making sure there was
no problem with the fact the cooler was purchased through him and that Bill would
send the splitter out no matter who it was purchased from. He was glad to
see there was no problem.
Bill also said to be sure that the cooler was sealed to the box with RTV as well
as making sure all the holes in the cooler box to firewall fit was sealed
to ensure all available pressure was directed through the cooler. He also echoed
the feelings that many of us have in that there is not enough exit area to
get the cooling air out of the cowling.
Michael
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of nukeflyboy
Sent: Wednesday, August 26, 2009 4:47 PM
Subject: RV10-List: Re: Airflow Oil Box Splitter
I also just called Airflow and got good support. In defense of Alex, Airflow said
that the kit is a very recent development and may not have been available
at the time ours were sent.
--------
Dave Moore
RV-6 flying
RV-10 QB - cabin top/fiberglass hell
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=259804#259804
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Fred Williams, M.D." <drfred(at)suddenlinkmail.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Olsons great getaway writeup - A Gathering ???? |
Deems;
How far away is monument valley???
It 's on my bucket list of things to do in my RV 10
Dr Fred.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Jeff Carpenter <jeff(at)westcottpress.com> |
| Subject: | Bonded Edges of Windows |
I'm about to take the plunge and bond the windows onto the doors.
I've got a cosmetic question:
What do you see when looking through the plexi to the bonded edge?
The Weld-On 10 is white. Should I paint the exterior perimeter of the
window to hide that? Should I add some black color to that somehow
first? What have others done?
Jeff Carpenter
40304
Covered in a fine dusting of plexi glass
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | William Souza <electspec(at)sbcglobal.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Olsons great getaway writeup - A Gathering -Copperstate |
!!!
I'll be at copperstate from California, Had a great time last year at Myron Nelson's
fifth wheel HQ and awsome food. I thank Myron for a nice weekend, made new
friends and great food.
Bill Souza
Owner of Rick Grays RV-10
N279RB
--- On Wed, 8/26/09, Kelly McMullen wrote:
> From: Kelly McMullen <apilot2(at)gmail.com>
> Subject: Re: RV10-List: Olsons great getaway writeup - A Gathering -Copperstate
!!!
> To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com
> Date: Wednesday, August 26, 2009, 2:19 PM
> Kelly McMullen
>
> Copperstate for some odd reason appears to be Thurs noon to
> Sun noon.
> Probably to get more revenue.
> I'll probably come for a couple days.
>
> On Wed, Aug 26, 2009 at 9:22 AM, Pascal
> wrote:
> >
> > I'll be driving out to Scottsdale October 24th, (who
> came up with a Thursday
> > to Saturday flyin?) I'll talk to my wife about leaving
> on Friday Maybe
> > we'll camp Friday night and hook up with anyone who is
> there.
> > If any of you will be there Friday night, please let
> me know so I'll know if
> > it's worth coming out Friday. Hope to meet a few of
> you.
> > Pascal
> > --------------------------------------------------
> > From: "Deems Davis" <deemsdavis(at)cox.net>
> > Sent: Wednesday, August 26, 2009 8:48 AM
> > To:
> > Subject: Re: RV10-List: Olsons great getaway writeup -
> A Gathering
> > -Copperstate !!!
> >
>
> >>
> >> Absolutely ! We've got Copperstate coming up in
> Oct : (23-24)
> >> http://www.copperstate.org/csj/ We had
> about a dozen -10 builders / flyers
> >> here last year, Myron Nelson brought his 5th wheel
> trailer over and cooked
> >> Carne Asada diiner for everyone. He even had a
> banner made up w/ RV-10 HQ on
> >> it. There were 3-4 RV-10's that flew their planes
> in. I personally know of
> >> at least one more that will be flying in this year
> ;-) . He may even be able
> >> to be talked into giving some rides.
> >>
> >> We've got 4 flying RV10's in the area:
> >>
> >> David McNeil
> >> Bill DeRouchey
> >> Al Gardner
> >> Myself.
> >>
> >> And several more under construction.
> >>
> >> Maybe we would could talk you Jim and Robin Marks
> into coming over from
> >> CA, and Rick Sked to come down from Las Vegas,
> Scott to come down from SLC.
> >> Heck if we can get that many -10's I'm pretty sure
> I can arrange for us to
> >> get a 'designated parking area' set aside for us.
> That time of the year the
> >> weather is GREAT! Visibilities are unlimited. And
> Av Gas in Casa Grande is
> >> some of the cheapest in AZ.
> >>
> >> I'd be happy to work on arrangements. and possibly
> some group activities.
> >>
> >> Who's interested????????
> >>
> >> Deems Davis N519PJ
> >> http://deemsrv10.com/index.html
> >>
> >>
> >> pilotdds(at)aol.com
> wrote:
> >>>
> >>> Are you going to host the first event,I
> understand Az is nice in the
> >>> fall?
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> -----Original Message-----
> >>> From: Deems Davis <deemsdavis(at)cox.net>
> >>> To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com
> >>> Sent: Tue, Aug 25, 2009 10:09 pm
> >>> Subject: Re: RV10-List: Olsons great getaway
> writeup - A Gathering ????
> >>>
> Davis >>> >
> I like this idea ... RV10 gathering/s. OSH is
> >>> definitely a great gathering, but I'd love to
> see if there's any interest in
> >>> getting together somewhere with some other
> builder/flyers. I think the
> >>> biggest attraction to OSH for me is just
> getting to visit with other
> >>> similarly 'infected' types. I monitor the
> SoCal RV list, and they routinely
> >>> have several posts each week where several
> people connect and either meet
> >>> somewhere or fly somewhere together. I realize
> we're spread across the US
> >>> and the logistics are greatly expanded, but it
> would be nice if we developed
> >>> into the kind of group that routinely met and
> flew together either
> >>> regionally or otherwise. What if people just
> used this list to post ideas
> >>> about where, who, and when they would like to
> take a trip with some others?
> >>> and let people naturally connect? If it turns
> out to be a benefit, who know
> >>> someone might set up part of a website as an "
> I want to take a trip'
> >>> bulletin board. Deems Davis N519PJ http://deemsrv10.com/index.html Tim Olson
> >>> wrote:
> Olson >>> >
> >>> >
> >>> > I just do it to try to get you all to
> finish up so we can have some >
> >>> > great RV-10 gatherings. :) Tim
> >>> *
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> *
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>
> Forum -
> FAQ,
> - MATRONICS WEB FORUMS -
> List Contribution Web Site -
> -Matt
> Dralle, List Admin.
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | pilotdds(at)aol.com |
Nice RV-10 write up in the Aopa magazine-interesting comment re oil temps
-----Original Message-----
From: William Souza <electspec(at)sbcglobal.net>
Sent: Wed, Aug 26, 2009 4:18 pm
Subject: Re: RV10-List: Olsons great getaway writeup - A Gathering -Copperstate
!!!
I'll be at copperstate from California, Had a great time last year at Myron
Nelson's fifth wheel HQ and awsome food. I thank Myron for a nice weekend, made
new friends and great food.
Bill Souza
Owner of Rick Grays RV-10
N279RB
--- On Wed, 8/26/09, Kelly McMullen wrote:
> From: Kelly McMullen <apilot2(at)gmail.com>
> Subject: Re: RV10-List: Olsons great getaway writeup - A Gathering
-Copperstate !!!
> To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com
> Date: Wednesday, August 26, 2009, 2:19 PM
> Kelly McMullen
>
> Copperstate for some odd reason appears to be Thurs noon to
> Sun noon.
> Probably to get more revenue.
> I'll probably come for a couple days.
>
> On Wed, Aug 26, 2009 at 9:22 AM, Pascal
> wrote:
> >
> > I'll be driving out to Scottsdale October 24th, (who
> came up with a Thursday
> > to Saturday flyin?) I'll talk to my wife about leaving
> on Friday ?Maybe
> > we'll camp Friday night and hook up with anyone who is
> there.
> > If any of you will be there Friday night, please let
> me know so I'll know if
> > it's worth coming out Friday. Hope to meet a few of
> you.
> > Pascal
> > --------------------------------------------------
> > From: "Deems Davis" <deemsdavis(at)cox.net>
> > Sent: Wednesday, August 26, 2009 8:48 AM
> > To:
> > Subject: Re: RV10-List: Olsons great getaway writeup -
> A Gathering
> > -Copperstate ?!!!
> >
>
> >>
> >> Absolutely ! ?We've got Copperstate coming up in
> Oct : (23-24)
> >> http://www.copperstate.org/csj/ ?We had
> about a dozen -10 builders / flyers
> >> here last year, Myron Nelson brought his 5th wheel
> trailer over and cooked
> >> Carne Asada diiner for everyone. He even had a
> banner made up w/ RV-10 HQ on
> >> it. There were 3-4 RV-10's th
at flew their planes
> in. ?I personally know of
> >> at least one more that will be flying in this year
> ;-) . He may even be able
> >> to be talked into giving some rides.
> >>
> >> We've got 4 flying RV10's in the area:
> >>
> >> David McNeil
> >> Bill DeRouchey
> >> Al Gardner
> >> Myself.
> >>
> >> And several more under construction.
> >>
> >> Maybe we would could talk you Jim and Robin Marks
> into coming over from
> >> CA, and Rick Sked to come down from Las Vegas,
> Scott to come down from SLC.
> >> Heck if we can get that many -10's I'm pretty sure
> I can arrange for us to
> >> get a 'designated parking area' set aside for us.
> That time of the year the
> >> weather is GREAT! Visibilities are unlimited. And
> Av Gas in Casa Grande is
> >> some of the cheapest in AZ.
> >>
> >> I'd be happy to work on arrangements. and possibly
> some group activities.
> >>
> >> Who's interested????????
> >>
> >> Deems Davis N519PJ
> >> http://deemsrv10.com/index.html
> >>
> >>
> >> pilotdds(at)aol.com
> wrote:
> >>>
> >>> Are you going to host the first event,I
> understand Az is nice in the
> >>> fall?
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> -----Original Message-----
> >>> From: Deems Davis <deemsdavis(at)cox.net>
> >>> To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com
> >>> Sent: Tue, Aug 25, 2009 10:09 pm
> >>> Subject: Re: RV10-List: Olsons great getaway
> writeup - A Gathering ????
> >>>
> Davis >>> >
> I like this idea ... RV10 gathering/s. OSH is
> >>> definitely a great gathering, but I'd love to
> see if there's any interest in
> >>> getting together somewhere with some other
> builder/flyers. I think the
> >>> biggest attraction to OSH for me is just
> getting to visit with other
> >>> similarly 'infected' types. I monitor the
> SoCal RV list, and they routinely
> >>> have several posts each week where several
> people connect and either meet
> >>> somewhere or fly somewhere together. I realize
> we're spread across the US
> >>> and the logistics are greatly expa
nded, but it
> would be nice if we developed
> >>> into the kind of group that routinely met and
> flew together either
> >>> regionally or otherwise. What if people just
> used this list to post ideas
> >>> about where, who, and when they would like to
> take a trip with some others?
> >>> and let people naturally connect? If it turns
> out to be a benefit, who know
> >>> someone might set up part of a website as an "
> I want to take a trip'
> >>> bulletin board. Deems Davis N519PJ http://deemsrv10.com/index.html Tim
Olson
> >>> wrote:
> Olson >>> >
> >>> >
> >>> > I just do it to try to get you all to
> finish up so we can have some >
> >>> > great RV-10 gatherings. :) Tim
> >>> ?*
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> *
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>
> Forum -
> FAQ,
> ???- MATRONICS WEB FORUMS -
> List Contribution Web Site -
> ? ? ? ? ? ? ? -Matt
> Dralle, List Admin.
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "David McNeill" <dlm46007(at)cox.net> |
check
http://www.aopa.org/members/files/pilot/2009/september/honeymooners0909.html
_____
From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of pilotdds(at)aol.com
Sent: Wednesday, August 26, 2009 4:51 PM
Subject: RV10-List: AOPA magazine
Nice RV-10 write up in the Aopa magazine-interesting comment re oil temps
-----Original Message-----
From: William Souza <electspec(at)sbcglobal.net>
Sent: Wed, Aug 26, 2009 4:18 pm
Subject: Re: RV10-List: Olsons great getaway writeup - A Gathering
-Copperstate !!!
I'll be at copperstate from California, Had a great time last year at Myron
Nelson's fifth wheel HQ and awsome food. I thank Myron for a nice weekend,
made
new friends and great food.
Bill Souza
Owner of Rick Grays RV-10
N279RB
--- On Wed, 8/26/09, Kelly McMullen wrote:
> From: Kelly McMullen <apilot2(at)gmail.com>
> Subject: Re: RV10-List: Olsons great getaway writeup - A Gathering
-Copperstate !!!
> To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com
> Date: Wednesday, August 26, 2009, 2:19 PM
> Kelly McMullen
>
> Copperstate for some odd reason appears to be Thurs noon to
> Sun noon.
> Probably to get more revenue.
> I'll probably come for a couple days.
>
> On Wed, Aug 26, 2009 at 9:22 AM, Pascal
> wrote:
> >
> > I'll be driving out to Scottsdale October 24th, (who
> came up with a Thursday
> > to Saturday flyin?) I'll talk to my wife about leaving
> on Friday Maybe
> > we'll camp Friday night and hook up with anyone who is
> there.
> > If any of you will be there Friday night, please let
> me know so I'll know if
> > it's worth coming out Friday. Hope to meet a few of
> you.
> > Pascal
> > --------------------------------------------------
> > From: "Deems Davis" <deemsdavis(at)cox.net>
> > Sent: Wednesday, August 26, 2009 8:48 AM
> > To:
> > Subject: Re: RV10-List: Olsons great getaway writeup -
> A Gathering
> > -Copperstate !!!
> >
>
> >>
> >> Absolutely ! We've got Copperstate coming up in
> Oct : (23-24)
> >> http://www.copperstate.org/csj/ We had
> about a dozen -10 builders / flyers
> >> here last year, Myron Nelson brought his 5th wheel
> trailer over and cooked
> >> Carne Asada diiner for everyone. He even had a
> banner made up w/ RV-10 HQ on
> >> it. There were 3-4 RV-10's that flew their planes
> in. I personally know of
> >> at least one more that will be flying in this year
> ;-) . He may even be able
> >> to be talked into giving some rides.
> >>
> >> We've got 4 flying RV10's in the area:
> >>
> >> David McNeil
> >> Bill DeRouchey
> >> Al Gardner
> >> Myself.
> >>
> >> And several more under construction.
> >>
> >> Maybe we would could talk you Jim and Robin Marks
> into coming over from
> >> CA, and Rick Sked to come down from Las Vegas,
> Scott to come down from SLC.
> >> Heck if we can get that many -10's I'm pretty sure
> I can arrange for us to
> >> get a 'designated parking area' set aside for us.
> That time of the year the
> >> weather is GREAT! Visibilities are unlimited. And
> Av Gas in Casa Grande is
> >> some of the cheapest in AZ.
> >>
> >> I'd be happy to work on arrangements. and possibly
> some group activities.
> >>
> >> Who's interested????????
> >>
> >> Deems Davis N519PJ
> >> http://deemsrv10.com/index.html
> >>
> >>
> >> pilotdds(at)aol.com
> wrote:
> >>>
> >>> Are you going to host the first event,I
> understand Az is nice in the
> >>> fall?
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> -----Original Message-----
> >>> From: Deems Davis <deemsdavis(at)cox.net>
> >>> To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com
> >>> Sent: Tue, Aug 25, 2009 10:09 pm
> >>> Subject: Re: RV10-List: Olsons great getaway
> writeup - A Gathering ????
> >>>
> Davis >>> >>
> I like this idea ... RV10 gathering/s. OSH is
> >>> definitely a great gathering, but I'd love to
> see if there's any interest in
> >>> getting together somewhere with some other
> builder/flyers. I think the
> >>> biggest attraction to OSH for me is just
> getting to visit with other
> >>> similarly 'infected' types. I monitor the
> SoCal RV list, and they routinely
> >>> have several posts each week where several
> people connect and either meet
> >>> somewhere or fly somewhere together. I realize
> we're spread across the US
> >>> and the logistics are greatly expanded, but it
> would be nice if we developed
> >>> into the kind of group that routinely met and
> flew together either
> >>> regionally or otherwise. What if people just
> used this list to post ideas
> >>> about where, who, and when they would like to
> take a trip with some others?
> >>> and let people naturally connect? If it turns
> out to be a benefit, who know
> >>> someone might set up part of a website as an "
> I want to take a trip'
> >>> bulletin board. Deems Davis N519PJ http://deemsrv10.com/index.html Tim
Olson
> >>> wrote:
> Olson >>> >>
> >>> >
> >>> > I just do it to try to get you all to
> finish up so we can have some >
> >>> > great RV-10 gatherings. :) Tim
> >>> *
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> *
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>
> Forum -
> FAQ,
> - MATRONICS WEB FORUMS -
> List Contribution Web Site -
> -Matt
> Dralle, List Admin.
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Don McDonald <building_partner(at)yahoo.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Olsons great getaway writeup - A Gathering -Copperstate |
!!!
Isn't anyone going to Van's Homecoming this weekend?- It will be our firs
t real trip.... Then Kim looks at the weather and it's suppose to rain Frid
ay.- Sounds like fun.
Don & Kim McDonald
--- On Wed, 8/26/09, Pascal wrote:
From: Pascal <rv10builder(at)verizon.net>
Subject: Re: RV10-List: Olsons great getaway writeup - A Gathering -Coppers
tate !!!
Date: Wednesday, August 26, 2009, 9:22 AM
I'll be driving out to Scottsdale October 24th, (who came up with a Thursda
y to Saturday flyin?) I'll talk to my wife about leaving on Friday- Maybe
we'll camp Friday night and hook up with anyone who is there.
If any of you will be there Friday night, please let me know so I'll know i
f it's worth coming out Friday. Hope to meet a few of you.
Pascal
--------------------------------------------------
From: "Deems Davis" <deemsdavis(at)cox.net>
Sent: Wednesday, August 26, 2009 8:48 AM
Subject: Re: RV10-List: Olsons great getaway writeup - A Gathering -Coppers
tate- !!!
>
> Absolutely !- We've got Copperstate coming up in Oct : (23-24) http://w
ww.copperstate.org/csj/- We had about a dozen -10 builders / flyers here
last year, Myron Nelson brought his 5th wheel trailer over and cooked Carne
Asada diiner for everyone. He even had a banner made up w/ RV-10 HQ on it.
There were 3-4 RV-10's that flew their planes in.- I personally know of
at least one more that will be flying in this year ;-) . He may even be abl
e to be talked into giving some rides.
>
> We've got 4 flying RV10's in the area:
>
> David McNeil
> Bill DeRouchey
> Al Gardner
> Myself.
>
> And several more under construction.
>
> Maybe we would could talk you Jim and Robin Marks into coming over from C
A, and Rick Sked to come down from Las Vegas, Scott to come down from SLC.
Heck if we can get that many -10's I'm pretty sure I can arrange for us to
get a 'designated parking area' set aside for us. That time of the year the
weather is GREAT! Visibilities are unlimited. And Av Gas in Casa Grande is
some of the cheapest in AZ.
>
> I'd be happy to work on arrangements. and possibly some group activities.
>
> Who's interested????????
>
> Deems Davis N519PJ
> http://deemsrv10.com/index.html
>
>
> pilotdds(at)aol.com wrote:
>> Are you going to host the first event,I understand Az is nice in the fal
l?
>>
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: Deems Davis <deemsdavis(at)cox.net>
>> To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com
>> Sent: Tue, Aug 25, 2009 10:09 pm
>> Subject: Re: RV10-List: Olsons great getaway writeup - A Gathering ????
>>
:deemsdavis(at)cox.net>> I like this idea ... RV10 gathering/s. OSH is definit
ely a great gathering, but I'd love to see if there's any interest in getti
ng together somewhere with some other builder/flyers. I think the biggest a
ttraction to OSH for me is just getting to visit with other similarly 'infe
cted' types. I monitor the SoCal RV list, and they routinely have several p
osts each week where several people connect and either meet somewhere or fl
y somewhere together. I realize we're spread across the US and the logistic
s are greatly expanded, but it would be nice if we developed into the kind
of group that routinely met and flew together either regionally or otherwis
e. What if people just used this list to post ideas about where, who, and w
hen they would like to take a trip with some others? and let people natural
ly connect? If it turns out to be a benefit, who know someone might
set up part of a website as an " I want to take a trip' bulletin board. De
ems Davis N519PJ http://deemsrv10.com/index.html Tim Olson wrote:
>> >
>> >
>> > I just do it to try to get you all to finish up so we can have some >
great RV-10 gatherings. :) Tim
>>- *
>>
>>
>> *
>
>
>
>
>
le, List Admin.
=0A=0A=0A
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "David McNeill" <dlm46007(at)cox.net> |
I O540D4A5 Hartzell constant speed. Anybody done one like this?
airplane is 1666, 3 people is 600, 32 gal is 192, 40 pounds of tools. total
2500 pounds, elevation 6000, temp probably 90f. DA9500.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Miller John <gengrumpy(at)aol.com> |
Best have a VERY long runway!
On Aug 26, 2009, at 7:42 PM, David McNeill wrote:
>
>
> I O540D4A5 Hartzell constant speed. Anybody done one like this?
>
> airplane is 1666, 3 people is 600, 32 gal is 192, 40 pounds of
> tools. total 2500 pounds, elevation 6000, temp probably 90f. DA9500.
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Dave Saylor <dave.saylor.aircrafters(at)gmail.com> |
ooo, I just looked up 40G. 4200' is not a lot of extra. I was on an 8200'
runway at KEMM.
On Wed, Aug 26, 2009 at 6:04 PM, Dave Saylor <
dave.saylor.aircrafters(at)gmail.com> wrote:
> I've done a couple very similar, maybe worse. I was 100AGL after 4000 feet
> of runway. I ran up to full power, leaned before rolling, and used 1/3
> flaps.
>
>
> On Wed, Aug 26, 2009 at 5:46 PM, Miller John wrote:
>
>> Best have a VERY long runway!
>> On Aug 26, 2009, at 7:42 PM, David McNeill wrote:
>>
>>
>>
>> I O540D4A5 Hartzell constant speed. Anybody done one like this?
>>
>> airplane is 1666, 3 people is 600, 32 gal is 192, 40 pounds of tools.
>> total 2500 pounds, elevation 6000, temp probably 90f. DA9500.
>>
>> *
>> *
>>
>>
> Dave Saylor
> AirCrafters LLC
> 140 Aviation Way
> Watsonville, CA 95076
> 831-722-9141 Shop
> 831-750-0284 Cell
>
--
Dave Saylor
AirCrafters LLC
140 Aviation Way
Watsonville, CA 95076
831-722-9141 Shop
831-750-0284 Cell
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: AOPA magazine |
| From: | Dave Saylor <dave.saylor.aircrafters(at)gmail.com> |
>>Peeler, a physician, said he doesn=92t have the time or skills to build a
n
airplane like the RV'10, which requires at least 2,000 hours for a vetera
n
builder to assemble. But he says he complies with the letter and spirit of
the regulations by only using his aircraft for private, noncommercial
purposes and hiring professional mechanics to perform the required
inspections.
=93I=92m not the builder of this airplane and I don=92t pretend to be,=94 h
e said.<<
http://registry.faa.gov/aircraftinquiry/NNum_Results.aspx?NNumbertxt=430W
P
He pretended to be the builder when he applied for the AW cert, and had his
signature notarized stating he was the builder on the 8130-12. He may have
some 'splain'n to do...
On Wed, Aug 26, 2009 at 4:50 PM, wrote:
> Nice RV-10 write up in the Aopa magazine-interesting comment re oil temps
>
>
Dave Saylor
AirCrafters LLC
140 Aviation Way
Watsonville, CA 95076
831-722-9141 Shop
831-750-0284 Cell
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Dave Saylor <dave.saylor.aircrafters(at)gmail.com> |
I've done a couple very similar, maybe worse. I was 100AGL after 4000 feet
of runway. I ran up to full power, leaned before rolling, and used 1/3
flaps.
On Wed, Aug 26, 2009 at 5:46 PM, Miller John wrote:
> Best have a VERY long runway!
> On Aug 26, 2009, at 7:42 PM, David McNeill wrote:
>
>
> I O540D4A5 Hartzell constant speed. Anybody done one like this?
>
> airplane is 1666, 3 people is 600, 32 gal is 192, 40 pounds of tools.
> total 2500 pounds, elevation 6000, temp probably 90f. DA9500.
>
> *
> *
>
>
Dave Saylor
AirCrafters LLC
140 Aviation Way
Watsonville, CA 95076
831-722-9141 Shop
831-750-0284 Cell
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Robin Marks" <robin1(at)mrmoisture.com> |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________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "richard sipp" <rsipp(at)earthlink.net> |
Dave:
If what you are asking is estimated takeoff performance assuming an
otherwise normal RV-10......I would say no problem.
I made several takeoffs in this condition or more demanding on a recent
trip to Utah. While I did not pay particular attention to the distances
I doubt any were over
2500'.
Dick Sipp
----- Original Message -----
From: David McNeill
To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com
Sent: Wednesday, August 26, 2009 8:42 PM
Subject: RV10-List: 40G
I O540D4A5 Hartzell constant speed. Anybody done one like this?
airplane is 1666, 3 people is 600, 32 gal is 192, 40 pounds of tools.
total 2500 pounds, elevation 6000, temp probably 90f. DA9500.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Rene" <rene(at)felker.com> |
I fly out of KOGD, 4473 ft. Done several flights at 2700, or a little more,
with temps in the high 80's low 90's. No problem getting off in 2500 feet.
Used runway 16, 5195 feet.
Rene'
801-721-6080
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of David McNeill
Sent: Wednesday, August 26, 2009 6:43 PM
Subject: RV10-List: 40G
I O540D4A5 Hartzell constant speed. Anybody done one like this?
airplane is 1666, 3 people is 600, 32 gal is 192, 40 pounds of tools. total
2500 pounds, elevation 6000, temp probably 90f. DA9500.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "richard sipp" <rsipp(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Olsons great getaway writeup - A Gathering ???? |
Great ideas Deems,
I would like to see an RV-10 dedicated fly in at a different location each
year, someplace that would also provide interest to the rest of our family
members.
The Ohio Valley RVators, much like the SoCal group started as an email list
has grown to several hundred and flys somewhere in this area nearly every
weekend.
Dick Sipp
N110DV
----- Original Message -----
From: "Deems Davis" <deemsdavis(at)cox.net>
Sent: Wednesday, August 26, 2009 1:09 AM
Subject: Re: RV10-List: Olsons great getaway writeup - A Gathering ????
>
> I like this idea ... RV10 gathering/s. OSH is definitely a great
> gathering, but I'd love to see if there's any interest in getting together
> somewhere with some other builder/flyers. I think the biggest attraction
> to OSH for me is just getting to visit with other similarly 'infected'
> types.
>
> I monitor the SoCal RV list, and they routinely have several posts each
> week where several people connect and either meet somewhere or fly
> somewhere together. I realize we're spread across the US and the
> logistics are greatly expanded, but it would be nice if we developed into
> the kind of group that routinely met and flew together either regionally
> or otherwise.
>
> What if people just used this list to post ideas about where, who, and
> when they would like to take a trip with some others? and let people
> naturally connect? If it turns out to be a benefit, who know someone might
> set up part of a website as an " I want to take a trip' bulletin board.
>
> Deems Davis N519PJ
> http://deemsrv10.com/index.html
>
> Tim Olson wrote:
>>
>> I just do it to try to get you all to finish up so we can have
>> some great RV-10 gatherings. :)
>> Tim
>>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Pascal" <rv10builder(at)verizon.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Olsons great getaway writeup - A Gathering -Copperstate |
!!!
I will road trip out there Friday arriving sometime in the afternoon from
SoCal. We'll camp overnight than we'll probably do the show Saturday for a
few hours and move on in the afternoon.
Look forward to meeting everyone there.
Pascal
--------------------------------------------------
From: "David McNeill" <dlm46007(at)cox.net>
Sent: Wednesday, August 26, 2009 11:19 AM
Subject: RE: RV10-List: Olsons great getaway writeup - A
Gathering -Copperstate !!!
>
> Check http://www.copperstate.org/csj/ Thursday is setup day; main show Fri
> 22 and Sat 23, 24th almost everybody is gone by noon.
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Pascal
> Sent: Wednesday, August 26, 2009 9:22 AM
> To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com
> Subject: Re: RV10-List: Olsons great getaway writeup - A Gathering
> -Copperstate !!!
>
>
> I'll be driving out to Scottsdale October 24th, (who came up with a
> Thursday
> to Saturday flyin?) I'll talk to my wife about leaving on Friday Maybe
> we'll camp Friday night and hook up with anyone who is there.
> If any of you will be there Friday night, please let me know so I'll know
> if
> it's worth coming out Friday. Hope to meet a few of you.
> Pascal
> --------------------------------------------------
> From: "Deems Davis" <deemsdavis(at)cox.net>
> Sent: Wednesday, August 26, 2009 8:48 AM
> To:
> Subject: Re: RV10-List: Olsons great getaway writeup - A Gathering
> -Copperstate !!!
>
>>
>> Absolutely ! We've got Copperstate coming up in Oct : (23-24)
>> http://www.copperstate.org/csj/ We had about a dozen -10 builders /
>> flyers here last year, Myron Nelson brought his 5th wheel trailer over
>> and cooked Carne Asada diiner for everyone. He even had a banner made
>> up w/ RV-10 HQ on it. There were 3-4 RV-10's that flew their planes
>> in. I personally know of at least one more that will be flying in
>> this year ;-) . He may even be able to be talked into giving some rides.
>>
>> We've got 4 flying RV10's in the area:
>>
>> David McNeil
>> Bill DeRouchey
>> Al Gardner
>> Myself.
>>
>> And several more under construction.
>>
>> Maybe we would could talk you Jim and Robin Marks into coming over
>> from CA, and Rick Sked to come down from Las Vegas, Scott to come down
>> from SLC. Heck if we can get that many -10's I'm pretty sure I can
>> arrange for us to get a 'designated parking area' set aside for us.
>> That time of the year the weather is GREAT! Visibilities are
>> unlimited. And Av Gas in Casa Grande is some of the cheapest in AZ.
>>
>> I'd be happy to work on arrangements. and possibly some group activities.
>>
>> Who's interested????????
>>
>> Deems Davis N519PJ
>> http://deemsrv10.com/index.html
>>
>>
>> pilotdds(at)aol.com wrote:
>>> Are you going to host the first event,I understand Az is nice in the
>>> fall?
>>>
>>>
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: Deems Davis <deemsdavis(at)cox.net>
>>> To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com
>>> Sent: Tue, Aug 25, 2009 10:09 pm
>>> Subject: Re: RV10-List: Olsons great getaway writeup - A Gathering ????
>>>
>>> > I like this idea ... RV10 gathering/s.
>>> OSH is definitely a great gathering, but I'd love to see if there's
>>> any interest in getting together somewhere with some other
>>> builder/flyers. I think the biggest attraction to OSH for me is just
>>> getting to visit with other similarly 'infected' types. I monitor the
>>> SoCal RV list, and they routinely have several posts each week where
>>> several people connect and either meet somewhere or fly somewhere
>>> together. I realize we're spread across the US and the logistics are
>>> greatly expanded, but it would be nice if we developed into the kind
>>> of group that routinely met and flew together either regionally or
>>> otherwise. What if people just used this list to post ideas about
>>> where, who, and when they would like to take a trip with some others?
>>> and let people naturally connect? If it turns out to be a benefit, who
> know someone might set up part of a website as an "
>>> I want to take a trip' bulletin board. Deems Davis N519PJ
>>> http://deemsrv10.com/index.html Tim Olson wrote:
>>> >
>>> >
>>> > I just do it to try to get you all to finish up so we can have some
>>> > great RV-10 gatherings. :) Tim
>>> *
>>>
>>>
>>> *
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | pilotdds(at)aol.com |
It is a different feel and you will climb slower with a longer ground roll than
what you are used to.Remember your v-speeds and proper leaning techniques and
all else being normal it will do it.I have been to Bishop, RKS and TVL and am
very pleased with the high altitude performance.Do not take high density altitude
lightly.
-----Original Message-----
From: Dave Saylor <dave.saylor.aircrafters(at)gmail.com>
Sent: Wed, Aug 26, 2009 6:04 pm
Subject: Re: RV10-List: 40G
I've done a couple very similar, maybe worse.? I was 100AGL after 4000 feet of
runway.? I ran up to full power, leaned before rolling, and used 1/3 flaps.
On Wed, Aug 26, 2009 at 5:46 PM, Miller John wrote:
Best have a VERY long runway!
On Aug 26, 2009, at 7:42 PM, David McNeill wrote:
?
I?O540D4A5 Hartzell constant speed. Anybody done one like this??
airplane is 1666, 3 people is 600, 32 gal is 192, 40 pounds of tools. total 2500
pounds, elevation 6000, temp probably 90f. DA9500.
Dave Saylor
AirCrafters LLC
140 Aviation Way
Watsonville, CA 95076
831-722-9141 Shop
831-750-0284 Cell
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Deems Davis <deemsdavis(at)cox.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Olsons great getaway writeup - A Gathering ???? |
Fred, Monument valley airport is 255nm NE from KCGZ (Casa Grande /
Copperstate). It's near the Utah Arizona border about midway between
Page Az and 4 corners.
(I've got visions of Fred's Paris Special perched atop one of the
spiers !!!!!)
Deems
Fred Williams, M.D. wrote:
>
>
> Deems;
>
> How far away is monument valley???
> It 's on my bucket list of things to do in my RV 10
>
> Dr Fred.
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Deems Davis <deemsdavis(at)cox.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Bonded Edges of Windows |
Cover them with a very light weight strip of fiberglass cloth, to
prevent cracks in the paint developing later, then paint over them.
Deems Davis N519PJ
http://deemsrv10.com/index.html
Jeff Carpenter wrote:
>
> I'm about to take the plunge and bond the windows onto the doors.
> I've got a cosmetic question:
>
> What do you see when looking through the plexi to the bonded edge?
>
> The Weld-On 10 is white. Should I paint the exterior perimeter of the
> window to hide that? Should I add some black color to that somehow
> first? What have others done?
>
> Jeff Carpenter
> 40304
> Covered in a fine dusting of plexi glass
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Bonded Edges of Windows |
| From: | Dave Saylor <dave.saylor.aircrafters(at)gmail.com> |
Ditto to Deems. I don't know of any tested way to tint the Weld-On.
Dave
On Wed, Aug 26, 2009 at 9:52 PM, Deems Davis wrote:
>
> Cover them with a very light weight strip of fiberglass cloth, to prevent
> cracks in the paint developing later, then paint over them.
>
> Deems Davis N519PJ
> http://deemsrv10.com/index.html
>
>
> Jeff Carpenter wrote:
>
>>
>> I'm about to take the plunge and bond the windows onto the doors. I've
>> got a cosmetic question:
>>
>> What do you see when looking through the plexi to the bonded edge?
>>
>> The Weld-On 10 is white. Should I paint the exterior perimeter of the
>> window to hide that? Should I add some black color to that somehow first?
>> What have others done?
>>
>> Jeff Carpenter
>> 40304
>> Covered in a fine dusting of plexi glass
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
--
Dave Saylor
AirCrafters LLC
140 Aviation Way
Watsonville, CA 95076
831-722-9141 Shop
831-750-0284 Cell
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Condrey, Bob (US SSA)" <bob.condrey(at)baesystems.com> |
I was at 00V (Meadowlake, just north of Colorado Springs, CO) in late June
and had 2 large people (440), full fuel (360), about 35 pounds in back. Th
is was before my plane was in paint so empty wt was 1654 for a GW of 2489.
Field elevation is 6874 and DA was 11,200! Runway at 00V is 6000x60. ht
tp://www.airnav.com/airport/00V
Bob
N442PM
________________________________
From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@m
atronics.com] On Behalf Of David McNeill
Sent: Wednesday, August 26, 2009 7:43 PM
Subject: RV10-List: 40G
I O540D4A5 Hartzell constant speed. Anybody done one like this?
airplane is 1666, 3 people is 600, 32 gal is 192, 40 pounds of tools. total
2500 pounds, elevation 6000, temp probably 90f. DA9500.
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Question on Control Cables & FAB |
| From: | "jayb" <jaybrinkmeyer(at)yahoo.com> |
Thanks John. Differences between the tables make perfect sense once thread count
is taken into consideration.
The control cables all use the same AN316 nuts. Don't know if they are shear nuts
however.
Just fyi that if you ordered Vans throttle quadrant, you'll need extra -43 lock
washers as they only include enough for the FWF ends.
Regards,
Jay
johngoodman wrote:
> Jay,
> Just to muddy the water a little (g), The Standard Aircraft Handbook table on
page 160 Shows 450-500 inch-pounds for a 7/16-20 with an AN315 nut, while an
AN316 Shear Nut is only 270-300 inch-pounds. I believe you are tightening an AN316,
right?
> Also, Coarse thread 7/16-14 are even less, but I'm pretty sure yours is -20.
> John
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=259932#259932
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Robert Brunkenhoefer <rebrunk42(at)gmail.com> |
I have departed SRR. Ruidoso,nm . At that wt. Same DA 6800' el . Mt
prop 8000' runway. Off@ middle so it is doable. Lean for da and do
mountain flying prep. Robert Brunkenhoefer. N 661G long trips and
loving it. 150+ hrs
Sent from my iPhone
Robert E. Brunkenhoefer
Brunkenhoefer Law Firm, P.C.
520 Lawrence St.
Corpus Christi, Texas 78401
Phone: 361-888-8808
Facsimile: 361-888-6753
robert(at)brunklaw.com
On Aug 26, 2009, at 7:46 PM, Miller John wrote:
> Best have a VERY long runway!
>
> On Aug 26, 2009, at 7:42 PM, David McNeill wrote:
>
>>
>>
>> I O540D4A5 Hartzell constant speed. Anybody done one like this?
>>
>> airplane is 1666, 3 people is 600, 32 gal is 192, 40 pounds of
>> tools. total 2500 pounds, elevation 6000, temp probably 90f. DA9500.
>>
>>
>> ===================================
>> tp://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List
>> ===================================
>> nics.com
>> ===================================
>> w.matronics.com/contribution
>> ===================================
>>
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Robin Marks" <robin1(at)mrmoisture.com> |
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________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Robert Brunkenhoefer <rebrunk42(at)gmail.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Olsons great getaway writeup - A Gathering ???? |
i agree but has anyone thought about a gathering in texas? south
padre island, matamoris,mex. , brownsville. gulf of mexico. port
isabel airport. robert
On Aug 26, 2009, at 9:13 PM, richard sipp wrote:
>
> Great ideas Deems,
>
> I would like to see an RV-10 dedicated fly in at a different
> location each year, someplace that would also provide interest to
> the rest of our family members.
>
> The Ohio Valley RVators, much like the SoCal group started as an
> email list has grown to several hundred and flys somewhere in this
> area nearly every weekend.
>
> Dick Sipp
> N110DV
> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Deems Davis" <deemsdavis(at)cox.net>
> To:
> Sent: Wednesday, August 26, 2009 1:09 AM
> Subject: Re: RV10-List: Olsons great getaway writeup - A
> Gathering ????
>
>
>>
>> I like this idea ... RV10 gathering/s. OSH is definitely a great
>> gathering, but I'd love to see if there's any interest in getting
>> together somewhere with some other builder/flyers. I think the
>> biggest attraction to OSH for me is just getting to visit with
>> other similarly 'infected' types.
>>
>> I monitor the SoCal RV list, and they routinely have several posts
>> each week where several people connect and either meet somewhere or
>> fly somewhere together. I realize we're spread across the US and
>> the logistics are greatly expanded, but it would be nice if we
>> developed into the kind of group that routinely met and flew
>> together either regionally or otherwise.
>>
>> What if people just used this list to post ideas about where, who,
>> and when they would like to take a trip with some others? and let
>> people naturally connect? If it turns out to be a benefit, who know
>> someone might set up part of a website as an " I want to take a
>> trip' bulletin board.
>>
>> Deems Davis N519PJ
>> http://deemsrv10.com/index.html
>>
>> Tim Olson wrote:
>>>
>>> I just do it to try to get you all to finish up so we can have
>>> some great RV-10 gatherings. :)
>>> Tim
>>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Pascal" <rv10builder(at)verizon.net> |
| Subject: | Fw: The honeymooners- response from Dave |
FYI on the AOPA article
From: Hirschman, Dave
Sent: Thursday, August 27, 2009 8:14 AM
Subject: RE: The honeymooners
Dear Pascal,
Thanks for your e-mail, and your suggestion of Tim Olson. I've read his
blogs and trip reports and enjoy them very much!
The decision to feature an RV-10 owned by a non-builder was done with
AOPA demographics in mind. A large percentage of our membership would
never consider owning an Experimental airplane, let alone build one. The
article was meant to show that some Experimental designs, like the
RV-10, are thoroughly mainstream and highly useful (as well as
exceptionally fun) airplanes. Hopefully, some readers will do as you
suggest and buy someone else's completed airplane -- or build one . . .
Warm Regards,
Dave
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
-------
From: Pascal [mailto:rv10builder(at)verizon.net]
Sent: Thursday, August 27, 2009 11:06 AM
Subject: Re: The honeymooners
Dave;
I enjoy reading your articles but I must admit my excitement when I saw
the Van's RV-10 on the September cover quickly turned to disappointment
when I read the story. There are so many great stories of builders out
there that are doing what the EAA designed in the late 1940; using
building an aircraft to be for recreation and education. Your story on
the Peelers did exactly the opposite. If Dr Peeler "doesn't have the
time or skills to build an airplane". He should have considered a
certified plane or someone else's completed RV-10. Home built aircraft
are supposed to be built at Home not a professional's hangar. The EAA
has spend numerous hours with volunteers like Dick Van Grunsven to work
on the 51% rule for those who actually want to take the time to learn
the skills. Your builder example did everything in writing to hurt that
effort.
Should you ever decide to do another article on a RV-10, consider
getting a real builder who has done much for the RV-10 community. His
name is Tim Olson
Thank you!
Pascal Reid
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Olsons great getaway writeup - A Gathering ???? |
| From: | "orchidman" <gary(at)wingscc.com> |
After I get my plane back from the paint shop I want to start looking for a good
airport in the Ozarks (Eastern OK, Western AR, and MO)
That would put it within a -10 tank of gas for everyone within the circle from
TX, NM, the Dakotas, WI, OH, and GA which would be most of the central US.
I am sure others can do it for the western and eastern areas also.
Come in on a Saturday and leave by noon on Sunday.
--------
Gary Blankenbiller
RV10 - # 40674
(N2GB Flying)
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=259963#259963
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "John Cox" <johnwcox(at)pacificnw.com> |
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YWdpbmcgcGlsb3QgYmFzZSBhbmQgYSBkd2luZGxpbmcgbnVtYmVyIG9mIGN1c3RvbWVycyB0byBz
dXBwb3J0IHF1YWxpdHkgQSZQIHNlcnZpY2VzLg0KDQogDQoNClRoZXJlIGlzIG5vdGhpbmcgd3Jv
bmcgd2l0aCBhbiBPQkFNIGFpcmNyYWZ0IGluIHRoZSBoYW5kcyBvZiBhIHBhc3Npb25hdGUgYW5k
IHJlY2VwdGl2ZSBvcGVyYXRvci4NCg0KIA0KDQpKb2huDQoNCmRvIG5vdCBhcmNoaXZlDQoNCiAN
Cg0KRnJvbTogb3duZXItcnYxMC1saXN0LXNlcnZlckBtYXRyb25pY3MuY29tIFttYWlsdG86b3du
ZXItcnYxMC1saXN0LXNlcnZlckBtYXRyb25pY3MuY29tXSBPbiBCZWhhbGYgT2YgUGF0cmljayBU
aHlzc2VuDQpTZW50OiBUaHVyc2RheSwgQXVndXN0IDI3LCAyMDA5IDk6MjMgQU0NClRvOiBydjEw
LWxpc3RAbWF0cm9uaWNzLmNvbQ0KU3ViamVjdDogUmU6IFJWMTAtTGlzdDogQU9QQSBtYWdhemlu
ZQ0KDQogDQoNCg=
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Deems Davis <deemsdavis(at)cox.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Olsons great getaway writeup - A Gathering ???? |
Branson MO? We've got a couple of days @ a time share reserved there
sometime in OCT
Deems
orchidman wrote:
>
> After I get my plane back from the paint shop I want to start looking for a good
airport in the Ozarks (Eastern OK, Western AR, and MO)
> That would put it within a -10 tank of gas for everyone within the circle from
TX, NM, the Dakotas, WI, OH, and GA which would be most of the central US.
> I am sure others can do it for the western and eastern areas also.
> Come in on a Saturday and leave by noon on Sunday.
>
> --------
> Gary Blankenbiller
> RV10 - # 40674
> (N2GB Flying)
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=259963#259963
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Rick Sked <ricksked(at)embarqmail.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Fw: The honeymooners- response from Dave |
He totally skirted the issue that will caus e the most uproar. The fact tha
t the owner did not build the aircraft and obviously falsified the paperwor
k for the airworthiness certificate. Demographics my butt.....political con
nections within the AOPA and the airshow circut determined the selection, I
'm wondering if any enforcment action will come from this....I did like the
article though...makes it easier for me to sell mine when the time comes,
but regardless of who owns it, the data plate will always say Manufacturer:
Rick Sked.....Now where did I put that hold harmless agreement???
Rick Sked
N246RS
----- Original Message -----
From: "Pascal" <rv10builder(at)verizon.net>
Sent: Thursday, August 27, 2009 8:47:54 AM GMT -08:00 US/Canada Pacific
Subject: RV10-List: Fw: The honeymooners- response from Dave
FYI on the AOPA article
From: Hirschman, Dave
Sent: Thursday, August 27, 2009 8:14 AM
Subject: RE: The honeymooners
Dear Pascal,
Thanks for your e-mail, and your suggestion of Tim Olson. I've read his blo
gs and trip reports and enjoy them very much!
The decision to feature an RV-10 owned by a non-builder was done with AOPA
demographics in mind.=C2-A large percentage of our membership would never
consider owning an Experimental airplane, let alone build one. The article
was meant to show that some Experimental designs, like the RV-10, are thor
oughly mainstream and highly useful (as well as exceptionally fun) airplane
s. Hopefully, some readers will do as you suggest and buy someone else's co
mpleted airplane -- or=C2-build one . . .
Warm Regards,
Dave
From: Pascal [mailto:rv10builder(at)verizon.net]
Sent: Thursday, August 27, 2009 11:06 AM
Subject: Re: The honeymooners
Dave;
I enjoy reading your articles but I must admit my excitement when I saw the
=C2- Van's RV-10 on the September cover quickly turned to disappointment
when I read the story. There are so many great stories of builders out ther
e that are doing what the EAA designed in the late 1940; using building an
aircraft to be for recreation and education. Your story on the Peelers did
exactly the opposite. If Dr Peeler "doesn't have the time or skills to buil
d an airplane". He should have=C2-considered a certified plane or someone
else's completed RV-10. Home built aircraft are supposed to be built at Ho
me not a professional's hangar. The EAA has spend numerous hours with volun
teers like Dick Van Grunsven to work on the 51% rule for those who actually
want to take the time to learn the skills. Your builder example did everyt
hing in writing to hurt that effort.
Should you ever decide to do another article on a RV-10, consider getting a
real builder who has done much for the RV-10 community. His name is Tim Ol
son
Thank you!
Pascal Reid
==
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: RV-10 Article |
| From: | Dave Saylor <dave.saylor.aircrafters(at)gmail.com> |
Thank you, Dave. That's a reasonable and completely acceptable
explanation. FWIW, there are a lot of people who are concerned about people
intending to get around the rules, and this looked for all the world like
one of those cases. A line or two to set things straight might have been
interesting and informative to your audience. How about an article
specifically addressing "second owner" ins and outs?
Thanks again,
Dave Saylor
On Thu, Aug 27, 2009 at 9:49 AM, Hirschman, Dave wrote:
> Dear David Saylor,
>
> Thanks very much for your e-mail and sharing your concerns about this
> airplane.
> I can assure you that David Peeler doesn't have the repairman's certificate
> on this airplane. He bought it from the builder (who is now deceased).
> The point of the RV-10 story was to highlight the tremendous utility and
> capability of some Experimental category aircraft, even for non-builders
> like David and Amy Peeler. My parents built a VariEze, and I'm an RV-3
> owner, so I'm a big fan of the Experimental category . . .
> Warm Regards,
>
> Dave Hirschman
>
> ------------------------------
> *From:* Dave Saylor [mailto:dave.saylor.aircrafters(at)gmail.com]
> *Sent:* Thursday, August 27, 2009 12:41 PM
> *To:* Hirschman, Dave
> *Subject:* Fwd: RV-10 Article
>
> Dear Mr. Hirschman,
>
> I'm a 24-year AOPA member and an RV-10 builder/owner. I own and operate a
> builder assistance center for amateur built aircraft, and I served on the
> FAA's recent committee to review what is commonly known as the 51% rule.
>
> I think you did a disservice to RV-10 builders specifically and all amateur
> builders in general by printing certain quotes from David Peeler. Without
> any valid explanation of the rule, you left the impression that Dr. Peeler
> had someone build his plane. Yet, a quick check of the registration
> database clearly lists him as the manufacturer, but he claims he doesn't
> "pretend to be" the builder...something's fishy.
>
> There's nothing wrong with selling a plane that you built, as long as your
> intentions were correct. And there's nothing wrong with hiring out certain
> parts of the project. But in this case there's clearly more to the story,
> and not knowing what it is or how it was addressed leaves a black mark.
>
> I hope you can clear up the discrepancy. I'm not the only one who noticed.
>
> Sincerely,
>
> Dave Saylor
> AirCrafters LLC
> 140 Aviation Way
> Watsonville, CA 95076
> 831-722-9141 Shop
> 831-750-0284 Cell
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: RV-10 Article |
| From: | Dave Saylor <dave.saylor.aircrafters(at)gmail.com> |
Dave,
I copied my last reply to you to a bunch of RV-10 types on Matronics. You
said the builder passed away, and implied that the plane was amateur
built...now I'm hearing that it was Steve Raddatz. Yes, he is deceased, but
he was also a professional builder who it seems did not share your concern
about abuse of the AB category. So I stand by my original statement and I
think I'll shut up for a while before I make myself a bigger fool.
Dave Saylor
On Thu, Aug 27, 2009 at 10:54 AM, Hirschman, Dave
wrote:
> Dear Dave Saylor,
> I share your concerns about abuse of the Experimental category, and your
> point about explicitly spelling out the ownership trail in this case is well
> taken.
> Also, I like your idea about a "second owner" article, too. As a buyer (but
> not yet a builder) of Experimental aircraft over the years, it's a subject
> I'm personally very interested in . . .
> Best,
>
> Dave Hirschman
>
>
> ------------------------------
> *From:* Dave Saylor [mailto:dave.saylor.aircrafters(at)gmail.com]
> *Sent:* Thursday, August 27, 2009 1:50 PM
> *To:* Hirschman, Dave
> *Cc:* rv10-list(at)matronics.com
> *Subject:* Re: RV-10 Article
>
> Thank you, Dave. That's a reasonable and completely acceptable
> explanation. FWIW, there are a lot of people who are concerned about people
> intending to get around the rules, and this looked for all the world like
> one of those cases. A line or two to set things straight might have been
> interesting and informative to your audience. How about an article
> specifically addressing "second owner" ins and outs?
>
> Thanks again,
>
> Dave Saylor
>
> On Thu, Aug 27, 2009 at 9:49 AM, Hirschman, Dave wrote:
>
>> Dear David Saylor,
>>
>> Thanks very much for your e-mail and sharing your concerns about this
>> airplane.
>> I can assure you that David Peeler doesn't have the repairman's
>> certificate on this airplane. He bought it from the builder (who is now
>> deceased).
>> The point of the RV-10 story was to highlight the tremendous utility and
>> capability of some Experimental category aircraft, even for non-builders
>> like David and Amy Peeler. My parents built a VariEze, and I'm an RV-3
>> owner, so I'm a big fan of the Experimental category . . .
>> Warm Regards,
>>
>> Dave Hirschman
>>
>> ------------------------------
>> *From:* Dave Saylor [mailto:dave.saylor.aircrafters(at)gmail.com]
>> *Sent:* Thursday, August 27, 2009 12:41 PM
>> *To:* Hirschman, Dave
>> *Subject:* Fwd: RV-10 Article
>>
>> Dear Mr. Hirschman,
>>
>> I'm a 24-year AOPA member and an RV-10 builder/owner. I own and operate a
>> builder assistance center for amateur built aircraft, and I served on the
>> FAA's recent committee to review what is commonly known as the 51% rule.
>>
>> I think you did a disservice to RV-10 builders specifically and all
>> amateur builders in general by printing certain quotes from David Peeler.
>> Without any valid explanation of the rule, you left the impression that Dr.
>> Peeler had someone build his plane. Yet, a quick check of the registration
>> database clearly lists him as the manufacturer, but he claims he doesn't
>> "pretend to be" the builder...something's fishy.
>>
>> There's nothing wrong with selling a plane that you built, as long as your
>> intentions were correct. And there's nothing wrong with hiring out certain
>> parts of the project. But in this case there's clearly more to the story,
>> and not knowing what it is or how it was addressed leaves a black mark.
>>
>> I hope you can clear up the discrepancy. I'm not the only one who
>> noticed.
>>
>> Sincerely,
>>
>> Dave Saylor
>> AirCrafters LLC
>> 140 Aviation Way
>> Watsonville, CA 95076
>> 831-722-9141 Shop
>> 831-750-0284 Cell
>>
>
--
Dave Saylor
AirCrafters LLC
140 Aviation Way
Watsonville, CA 95076
831-722-9141 Shop
831-750-0284 Cell
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Robert Brunkenhoefer <rebrunk42(at)gmail.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Olsons great getaway writeup - A Gathering ???? |
i would be interested. i hear arkansas, ok and mo are beautiful.
robert corpus christi is a long way from most places. CRP
On Aug 27, 2009, at 11:33 AM, orchidman wrote:
>
> After I get my plane back from the paint shop I want to start
> looking for a good airport in the Ozarks (Eastern OK, Western AR,
> and MO)
> That would put it within a -10 tank of gas for everyone within the
> circle from TX, NM, the Dakotas, WI, OH, and GA which would be most
> of the central US.
> I am sure others can do it for the western and eastern areas also.
> Come in on a Saturday and leave by noon on Sunday.
>
> --------
> Gary Blankenbiller
> RV10 - # 40674
> (N2GB Flying)
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=259963#259963
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Kelly McMullen <kellym(at)aviating.com> |
| Subject: | Re: AOPA magazine |
Or the mechanically capable owner that is able to find an amenable A&P
to supervise properly restoring the aircraft to what it should be.
I do carry 30-40lbs of tools on most flights, more if planning to do
inspection or repair.
Kelly
A&P/IA
Patrick Thyssen wrote:
> Tim,
> Maybe it's the owner who wants their plane to look like shit and not
> pay an honest amount of money to fix it. You can always find some one to
> do work and sighn it off.
> But its the owner who has to say do it right. And Pay.
> Patrick Thyssen
> A&P
> I don't carry 100 lbs of tools in my planes and neither do my customers.
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | David Maib <dmaib(at)mac.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Olsons great getaway writeup - A Gathering ???? |
Eureka Springs AR. was just featured in the most recent issue of
Pilot Getaways magazine. Mary and I used to own a place in that area.
It is a little jewel tucked away in NW Arkansas. Carroll Co. airport
(4M1) is a nice little (VFR) airport and I suspect the manager would
be pretty helpful to a group fly-in. Side trip to Gaston's White
River Resort for a fly-in lunch or some world class brown trout
fishing would be available. People could stay on Table Rock Lake at
Holiday Island, about seven miles out of Eureka Springs. Golf, water
sports, and fishing available there. Very short flight to Branson, as
well. Lots for kids and grownups to do.
David Maib
40559
Flying
On Aug 27, 2009, at 12:54 PM, Deems Davis wrote:
Branson MO? We've got a couple of days @ a time share reserved there
sometime in OCT
Deems
orchidman wrote:
>
> After I get my plane back from the paint shop I want to start
> looking for a good airport in the Ozarks (Eastern OK, Western AR,
> and MO)
> That would put it within a -10 tank of gas for everyone within the
> circle from TX, NM, the Dakotas, WI, OH, and GA which would be most
> of the central US.
> I am sure others can do it for the western and eastern areas also.
> Come in on a Saturday and leave by noon on Sunday.
>
> --------
> Gary Blankenbiller
> RV10 - # 40674
> (N2GB Flying)
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=259963#259963
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Kelly McMullen <kellym(at)aviating.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Olsons great getaway writeup - A Gathering ???? |
Hot Springs AR, Springfield/Branson and areas in between are nice. Can't
recall any place I've been in OK that I'd want to spend more than an
overnight.
Both destinations would be in the 5-6 hour distance from AZ at -10
speeds, about an hour more in my Mooney. Unless extremely favorable
winds, that means a fuel stop.
Robert Brunkenhoefer wrote:
>
> i would be interested. i hear arkansas, ok and mo are beautiful. robert
> corpus christi is a long way from most places. CRP
> On Aug 27, 2009, at 11:33 AM, orchidman wrote:
>
>>
>> After I get my plane back from the paint shop I want to start looking
>> for a good airport in the Ozarks (Eastern OK, Western AR, and MO)
>> That would put it within a -10 tank of gas for everyone within the
>> circle from TX, NM, the Dakotas, WI, OH, and GA which would be most of
>> the central US.
>> I am sure others can do it for the western and eastern areas also.
>> Come in on a Saturday and leave by noon on Sunday.
>>
>> --------
>> Gary Blankenbiller
>> RV10 - # 40674
>> (N2GB Flying)
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Read this topic online here:
>>
>> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=259963#259963
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Olsons great getaway writeup - A Gathering ???? |
| From: | "orchidman" <gary(at)wingscc.com> |
I now have 3 locations to examine.
I assume that we need to evaluate parking, air camping, hotels, food and any gathering
area plus what else?
--------
Gary Blankenbiller
RV10 - # 40674
(N2GB Flying)
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=260051#260051
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "David McNeill" <dlm46007(at)cox.net> |
Boulders need to carry some tools and spare parts on their flights. I have
had a major FBO at Austin tell me that since they have no maintenance manual
for my Glastar that they can not work on it. They offered free use of their
hangar and tools but I must fix it.
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Kelly McMullen
Sent: Thursday, August 27, 2009 1:15 PM
Subject: Re: RV10-List: AOPA magazine
Or the mechanically capable owner that is able to find an amenable A&P to
supervise properly restoring the aircraft to what it should be.
I do carry 30-40lbs of tools on most flights, more if planning to do
inspection or repair.
Kelly
A&P/IA
Patrick Thyssen wrote:
> Tim,
> Maybe it's the owner who wants their plane to look like shit and not
> pay an honest amount of money to fix it. You can always find some one
> to do work and sighn it off.
> But its the owner who has to say do it right. And Pay.
> Patrick Thyssen
> A&P
> I don't carry 100 lbs of tools in my planes and neither do my customers.
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | <karolamy(at)roadrunner.com> |
| Subject: | Re: RV10-List Digest: Aveo landing lights |
Did anyone else see the new generation Aveo landing lights @ OSH this year?
Here is their verbage - AveoMaxxT landing/taxi/wigwag light module and the
AveoMaxxT Premiere 6-in-1 embedded wingtip light solution
(Taxi-WigWag-Landing-Nav-Posistion-Strobe). Web site is:
aveoaviationlights.com for those interested.
Has anyone purchased them? If so have you "fired them up"? How do they
compare to other brand HID's? Am looking for someone's input who has
purchased/used them if possible. They supposedly use an LED with Lazer
technology. All that sounds great but my question is how does the RUNWAY
LOOK at night in comparing them to HIDs? Better, worse, same? It is
difficult to imagine them any better than a "top of the line" 50 Watt HID,
but am looking for real world input???
Yes, they look cool, and yes their Nav/strobe combo bolts right on the side
of the landing light fixture and yes the entire fixture will fit in our wing
tip space. But, at their price (quoted $2600 at OSH for Nav/strobe/landing
light combo - both sides) I'd sure appreciate some input from fellow
flyer/builders... Thanks to all!
Rich
RV-6A 1000 hrs of awesome flying
10 - finishing kit
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Seano" <sean(at)braunandco.com> |
| Subject: | Re: RV10-List Digest: Aveo landing lights |
Hey, I am really interested too! I have been waiting for these to come out.
The Aveo dudes said these won't come out until mid September. I know the
HID's are great but they said these are even brighter! I would pay for
these just for the fact they are easy to install and hoolk right to the nav
lights. They quoted me 2700, hope they come down a little. If not I will
spend 1000 for LED position lights and strobes then buy the two HID'S. Oh
ya the LED's would be a lot easier to wig wag with no power up.
----- Original Message -----
From: <karolamy(at)roadrunner.com>
Sent: Thursday, August 27, 2009 3:16 PM
Subject: RV10-List: Re: RV10-List Digest: Aveo landing lights
>
> Did anyone else see the new generation Aveo landing lights @ OSH this
> year? Here is their verbage - AveoMaxxT landing/taxi/wigwag light module
> and the AveoMaxxT Premiere 6-in-1 embedded wingtip light solution
> (Taxi-WigWag-Landing-Nav-Posistion-Strobe). Web site is:
> aveoaviationlights.com for those interested.
>
> Has anyone purchased them? If so have you "fired them up"? How do they
> compare to other brand HID's? Am looking for someone's input who has
> purchased/used them if possible. They supposedly use an LED with Lazer
> technology. All that sounds great but my question is how does the RUNWAY
> LOOK at night in comparing them to HIDs? Better, worse, same? It is
> difficult to imagine them any better than a "top of the line" 50 Watt HID,
> but am looking for real world input???
>
> Yes, they look cool, and yes their Nav/strobe combo bolts right on the
> side of the landing light fixture and yes the entire fixture will fit in
> our wing tip space. But, at their price (quoted $2600 at OSH for
> Nav/strobe/landing light combo - both sides) I'd sure appreciate some
> input from fellow flyer/builders... Thanks to all!
>
> Rich
> RV-6A 1000 hrs of awesome flying
> 10 - finishing kit
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: RV10-List Digest: Aveo landing lights |
| From: | "woxofswa" <woxof(at)aol.com> |
Check these out at the bottom of the page. This is what I am ordering. What I
have ordered from these guys so far has been high quality.
http://www.kestrobes.com/beacon.htm#LL1
--------
Myron Nelson
Mesa, AZ
Emp completed, legacy build fuse in progress
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=260078#260078
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: RV10-List Digest: Aveo landing lights |
| From: | "Robin Marks" <robin1(at)mrmoisture.com> |
Wow, $2,700. That is a lot of $. I think if one wanted to work with some
of the Auto HID kits you could do dual HID's (~$150.00 each), Red/Green
LED Position Lights ($75.00 total including sockets) and a premium
Wig/Wag (XePulse ~$200.00). All that for under $600.00. Add two blank
Duckworks leading edge cutouts ($130.00 pair). All in you have a great
lighting system for under $750.00. If you don't want to cut your leading
edge and wish to place the landing lights in the wing tips (not ideal
for lighting based on my prior RV experience) you can get the Auto HID's
that use the same bulb size as the standard Vans wing tip lights.
I don't know of anyone saw the posting by Sam Buchannan where he used
colored mirrored plexi as the backing for his position lights adding
pizaz of his position lights and reflecting his strobes. Really cool
look and again inexpensive. ~$6.00 each plus shipping.
Turns our I am more frugal than I thought! The $2,000 savings gets you
ALMOST a full set of front & rear leather Seats from Classic Aero.
$3,000 for lights looks like a lot to me...
Robin
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Seano
Sent: Thursday, August 27, 2009 3:24 PM
Subject: Re: RV10-List: Re: RV10-List Digest: Aveo landing lights
Hey, I am really interested too! I have been waiting for these to come
out.
The Aveo dudes said these won't come out until mid September. I know
the
HID's are great but they said these are even brighter! I would pay for
these just for the fact they are easy to install and hoolk right to the
nav
lights. They quoted me 2700, hope they come down a little. If not I
will
spend 1000 for LED position lights and strobes then buy the two HID'S.
Oh
ya the LED's would be a lot easier to wig wag with no power up.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Seano" <sean(at)braunandco.com> |
| Subject: | Re: RV10-List Digest: Aveo landing lights |
That is a big difference. I should go the cheaper route. Scott Schmidt
has the HID's in the wingtip and I don't know why I should even look at
anything else. Why do I need brighter than that? Maybe I will be able
to afford my G900 now....NOT!
Really wish I had the time yesterday to see your plane Robin. I am back
in SLC now. What airport do you keep your plane at?
----- Original Message -----
From: Robin Marks
To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com
Sent: Thursday, August 27, 2009 5:24 PM
Subject: RE: RV10-List: Re: RV10-List Digest: Aveo landing lights
Wow, $2,700. That is a lot of $. I think if one wanted to work with
some of the Auto HID kits you could do dual HID's (~$150.00 each),
Red/Green LED Position Lights ($75.00 total including sockets) and a
premium Wig/Wag (XePulse ~$200.00). All that for under $600.00. Add two
blank Duckworks leading edge cutouts ($130.00 pair). All in you have a
great lighting system for under $750.00. If you don't want to cut your
leading edge and wish to place the landing lights in the wing tips (not
ideal for lighting based on my prior RV experience) you can get the Auto
HID's that use the same bulb size as the standard Vans wing tip lights.
I don't know of anyone saw the posting by Sam Buchannan where he used
colored mirrored plexi as the backing for his position lights adding
pizaz of his position lights and reflecting his strobes. Really cool
look and again inexpensive. ~$6.00 each plus shipping.
Turns our I am more frugal than I thought! The $2,000 savings gets you
ALMOST a full set of front & rear leather Seats from Classic Aero.
$3,000 for lights looks like a lot to me.
Robin
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Seano
Sent: Thursday, August 27, 2009 3:24 PM
To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com
Subject: Re: RV10-List: Re: RV10-List Digest: Aveo landing lights
Hey, I am really interested too! I have been waiting for these to
come out.
The Aveo dudes said these won't come out until mid September. I know
the
HID's are great but they said these are even brighter! I would pay
for
these just for the fact they are easy to install and hoolk right to
the nav
lights. They quoted me 2700, hope they come down a little. If not I
will
spend 1000 for LED position lights and strobes then buy the two HID'S.
Oh
ya the LED's would be a lot easier to wig wag with no power up.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "RV Builder (Michael Sausen)" <rvbuilder(at)sausen.net> |
Not sure what happened that he completely yanked his site. I'm guessing he got
slapped with a lawsuit or something that he completely dropped out of cyberspace.
If you use this link it will take you to the Internet Archive copy of
his site at various points in time. Some of the links on the site might be broken
and some of the pictures might not come up but it's mostly all there. It's
funny how I can find my first couple emails ever from back in 92 by googling
my name along with every single post I ever made to this list "do not archiv"
or not. :)
http://web.archive.org/web/*/http://www.rvproject.com
Michael
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Kelly McMullen
Sent: Thursday, August 27, 2009 3:38 PM
Subject: Re: RV10-List: AOPA magazine
Reminder how to find the old Checkoway site would be nice. I recall
several things that I would like to refresh on.
RV Builder (Michael Sausen) wrote:
>
> Ya guys, no embarrassing Tim lest he take his website offline ala Checkoway.
Of course Dan forgot about a little something called the Internet Archive. As
the kids of today are learning, once on the Internet, it's there forever. :)
>
> Michael
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Don McDonald <building_partner(at)yahoo.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Olsons great getaway writeup - A Gathering ???? |
Deems, and you other AZ 10 guys, we are flying (at least that's the plan) t
o Sedona on 9-4 for a week.- It would be nice to at least meet up.... eit
her in Sedona, or we could stop on the way there or on our return trip.-
-I'm sure we'll have a spare day or so to fly... and for that day-or so
we have-accomodations for you as well.
Don McDonald-
--- On Wed, 8/26/09, Deems Davis wrote:
From: Deems Davis <deemsdavis(at)cox.net>
Subject: Re: RV10-List: Olsons great getaway writeup - A Gathering ????
Date: Wednesday, August 26, 2009, 12:09 PM
Tim you might want to consider Copperstate as an alternate to LOE this year
. I've heard the same about LOE, great for RV'rs but not much else to do. C
opperstate is not so large that flying in and out during the event is the c
hallenge it is @ OSH. Tie in a visit to Sedona, Grand Canyon, Monument Vall
ey,- Puerto Penasco, San Diego, Las Vegas ??? We'll make it worth your wh
ile. I'll fly part way out to meet you so you can have a -10 to look at on
your way inbound :-)
Deems drumming up Copperstate attendance Davis
Tim Olson wrote:
>
> I think gatherings would be fun, but, there is a downside sometimes.
> If you go somewhere with tons to do, then nobody does any flying,
> and there is too much draw to go visit other things.- On the
> other hand, if you go somewhere lame, then there is only flying
> to do, and the family will get bored.- So personally, I really
> like the idea of gathering in one spot, and flying around
> to a couple others....kind of like the last couple trips I
> did like meeting David Maib and Vic and heading to Key West,
> or metting Scott and heading to Oregon.- That makes for a great
> FLYING vacation where you can camp or see things too.
>
> This year I was considering LOE for a fly-in since it's been
> a while, but, at the same time, it's not really a super destination
> for the kids and family....you basically will love it if you
> just want to hang out with other builders, and you can
> fly all day long if you want.- But, you hang out at the
> airport a lot.- OSH is a great GATHERING but not the most
> convenient place to do lots of flying.- What would make
> OSH more fun is if people would meet up along the way,
> and the closer you got, the more people you had.
>
> So it's hard because everyone has a varied agenda of what
> they'd like.- I don't think I'll be at LOE this year,
> but I know I'll be flying a couple more times on trips by
> the end of the year.- It's always nice to fly along and look
> out the window and see another RV-10. :)
>
> Tim Olson - RV-10 N104CD
>
>
>
> Deems Davis wrote:
>>
>> I like this idea ... RV10 gathering/s. OSH is definitely a great gatheri
ng, but I'd love to see if there's any interest in getting together somewhe
re with some other builder/flyers. I think the biggest attraction to OSH fo
r me is just getting to visit with other similarly 'infected' types.
>>
>> I monitor the SoCal RV list, and they routinely have several posts each
week where several people connect and either meet somewhere or fly somewher
e together.- I realize we're spread across the US and the logistics are g
reatly expanded, but it would be nice if we developed into the kind of grou
p that routinely met and flew together either regionally or otherwise.
>>
>> What if people just used this list to post ideas about where, who, and w
hen they would like to take a trip with some others? and let people natural
ly connect? If it turns out to be a benefit, who know someone might set up
part of a website as an " I want to take a trip' bulletin board.
>>
>> Deems Davis N519PJ
>> http://deemsrv10.com/index.html
>>
>> Tim Olson wrote:
>>>
>>> I just do it to try to get you all to finish up so we can have
>>> some great RV-10 gatherings. :)
>>> Tim
>>>
>
>
>
>
>
>
le, List Admin.
=0A=0A=0A
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Miller John <gengrumpy(at)aol.com> |
| Subject: | Re: AOPA magazine |
You can carry a simple memory stick with the entire RV 10 plans on it
for convenient use whenever needed!
I do!
grumpy
N184JM
On Aug 27, 2009, at 4:00 PM, David McNeill wrote:
>
> Boulders need to carry some tools and spare parts on their flights.
> I have
> had a major FBO at Austin tell me that since they have no
> maintenance manual
> for my Glastar that they can not work on it. They offered free use
> of their
> hangar and tools but I must fix it.
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Kelly
> McMullen
> Sent: Thursday, August 27, 2009 1:15 PM
> To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com
> Subject: Re: RV10-List: AOPA magazine
>
>
> Or the mechanically capable owner that is able to find an amenable
> A&P to
> supervise properly restoring the aircraft to what it should be.
> I do carry 30-40lbs of tools on most flights, more if planning to do
> inspection or repair.
> Kelly
> A&P/IA
>
> Patrick Thyssen wrote:
>> Tim,
>> Maybe it's the owner who wants their plane to look like shit and not
>> pay an honest amount of money to fix it. You can always find some one
>> to do work and sighn it off.
>> But its the owner who has to say do it right. And Pay.
>> Patrick Thyssen
>> A&P
>> I don't carry 100 lbs of tools in my planes and neither do my
>> customers.
>>
>>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "David McNeill" <dlm46007(at)cox.net> |
My USB memory has RV10 plans, technical manuals for the avionics, operation
guides,etc If one is prepare, I rarely find use for same.
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Miller John
Sent: Thursday, August 27, 2009 7:15 PM
Subject: Re: RV10-List: AOPA magazine
You can carry a simple memory stick with the entire RV 10 plans on it for
convenient use whenever needed!
I do!
grumpy
N184JM
On Aug 27, 2009, at 4:00 PM, David McNeill wrote:
>
> Boulders need to carry some tools and spare parts on their flights.
> I have
> had a major FBO at Austin tell me that since they have no maintenance
> manual for my Glastar that they can not work on it. They offered free
> use of their hangar and tools but I must fix it.
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Kelly
> McMullen
> Sent: Thursday, August 27, 2009 1:15 PM
> To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com
> Subject: Re: RV10-List: AOPA magazine
>
>
> Or the mechanically capable owner that is able to find an amenable A&P
> to supervise properly restoring the aircraft to what it should be.
> I do carry 30-40lbs of tools on most flights, more if planning to do
> inspection or repair.
> Kelly
> A&P/IA
>
> Patrick Thyssen wrote:
>> Tim,
>> Maybe it's the owner who wants their plane to look like shit and not
>> pay an honest amount of money to fix it. You can always find some one
>> to do work and sighn it off.
>> But its the owner who has to say do it right. And Pay.
>> Patrick Thyssen
>> A&P
>> I don't carry 100 lbs of tools in my planes and neither do my
>> customers.
>>
>>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Deems Davis <deemsdavis(at)cox.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Olsons great getaway writeup - A Gathering ???? |
Now thats what I'm talking about !!!!!!!!! ;-) Seriously, we're only a
short flight from Sedona, and would love to hook up with you while
you/re here. There's an RV-10 in Prescott as well. Sedona is an
interesting airport. It sits on the top of a 500' mesa, normally, you
land one way (uphill) and take off the other. The elevation differences
on the ends of the runway is 100'. There is some really amazing 'red
rock' formations in the area. It would make for some REALLY neat
air-to-air shots with your freshly painted plane in the foreground.
(I've got a camera that should be up to the task).
Deems
Don McDonald wrote:
> Deems, and you other AZ 10 guys, we are flying (at least that's the
> plan) to Sedona on 9-4 for a week. It would be nice to at least meet
> up.... either in Sedona, or we could stop on the way there or on our
> return trip. I'm sure we'll have a spare day or so to fly... and for
> that day or so we have accomodations for you as well.
> Don McDonald
>
> --- On *Wed, 8/26/09, Deems Davis //* wrote:
>
>
> From: Deems Davis <deemsdavis(at)cox.net>
> Subject: Re: RV10-List: Olsons great getaway writeup - A Gathering
> ????
> To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com
> Date: Wednesday, August 26, 2009, 12:09 PM
>
> <http://us.mc537.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=deemsdavis@cox.net>>
>
> Tim you might want to consider Copperstate as an alternate to LOE
> this year. I've heard the same about LOE, great for RV'rs but not
> much else to do. Copperstate is not so large that flying in and
> out during the event is the challenge it is @ OSH. Tie in a visit
> to Sedona, Grand Canyon, Monument Valley, Puerto Penasco, San
> Diego, Las Vegas ??? We'll make it worth your while. I'll fly part
> way out to meet you so you can have a -10 to look at on your way
> inbound :-)
>
>
> Deems drumming up Copperstate attendance Davis
>
> Tim Olson wrote:
> <http://us.mc537.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=Tim@myrv10.com>>
> >
> > I think gatherings would be fun, but, there is a downside sometimes.
> > If you go somewhere with tons to do, then nobody does any flying,
> > and there is too much draw to go visit other things. On the
> > other hand, if you go somewhere lame, then there is only flying
> > to do, and the family will get bored. So personally, I really
> > like the idea of gathering in one spot, and flying around
> > to a couple others....kind of like the last couple trips I
> > did like meeting David Maib and Vic and heading to Key West,
> > or metting Scott and heading to Oregon. That makes for a great
> > FLYING vacation where you can camp or see things too.
> >
> > This year I was considering LOE for a fly-in since it's been
> > a while, but, at the same time, it's not really a super destination
> > for the kids and family....you basically will love it if you
> > just want to hang out with other builders, and you can
> > fly all day long if you want. But, you hang out at the
> > airport a lot. OSH is a great GATHERING but not the most
> > convenient place to do lots of flying. What would make
> > OSH more fun is if people would meet up along the way,
> > and the closer you got, the more people you had.
> >
> > So it's hard because everyone has a varied agenda of what
> > they'd like. I don't think I'll be at LOE this year,
> > but I know I'll be flying a couple more times on trips by
> > the end of the year. It's always nice to fly along and look
> > out the window and see another RV-10. :)
> >
> > Tim Olson - RV-10 N104CD
> >
> >
> >
> > Deems Davis wrote:
> <http://us.mc537.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=deemsdavis@cox.net>>
> >>
> >> I like this idea ... RV10 gathering/s. OSH is definitely a
> great gathering, but I'd love to see if there's any interest in
> getting together somewhere with some other builder/flyers. I think
> the biggest attraction to OSH for me is just getting to visit with
> other similarly 'infected' types.
> >>
> >> I monitor the SoCal RV list, and they routinely have several
> posts each week where several people connect and either meet
> somewhere or fly somewhere together. I realize we're spread
> across the US and the logistics are greatly expanded, but it would
> be nice if we developed into the kind of group that routinely met
> and flew together either regionally or otherwise.
> >>
> >> What if people just used this list to post ideas about where,
> who, and when they would like to take a trip with some others? and
> let people naturally connect? If it turns out to be a benefit, who
> know someone might set up part of a website as an " I want to take
> a trip' bulletin board.
> >>
> >> Deems Davis N519PJ
> >> http://deemsrv10.com/index.html
> >>
> >> Tim Olson wrote:
> <http://us.mc537.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=Tim@myrv10.com>>
> >>>
> >>> I just do it to try to get you all to finish up so we can have
> >>> some great RV-10 gatherings. :)
> >>> Tim
> >>>
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV1bsp; -
> MATRONICS WEB FORUMS -nbsp;
> ="http://www.matronics.com/contribution"
> target=_blank>http://www.matro====================
>
>
> *
>
>
> *
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Olsons great getaway writeup - A Gathering -Copperstate |
!!
| From: | "woxofswa" <woxof(at)aol.com> |
Thanks for the kind words. Last year was a lot of fun and I am planning on a repeat
if there is sufficient interest.
The only difference is that if we do a dinner it will probably have to be Friday
night as my granddaughter's birthday party is scheduled for Saturday afternoon.
As we get closer I'll need a rough estimate on how many to expect for dinner.
--------
Myron Nelson
Mesa, AZ
Emp completed, legacy build fuse in progress
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=260145#260145
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Olsons great getaway writeup - A Gathering ???? |
| From: | "Robin Marks" <robin1(at)mrmoisture.com> |
On a recent trip to AZ I did a few landings at Payson (PAY) between
Deems & Sedona. It was beautiful there, more like Colorado than AZ
(5,200 MSL). Looked like a really cool diner on the airport edge
overlooking the runway. The type of place people use as a destination to
ride their Harleys to on the weekend. Check it out. As I remember it was
also the cheapest fuel in the area (but check me on that). Payson also
where I learned that landing at 80 Knots gets you to land exactly on the
1,000' markers. The far 1,000' markers. :-)
Robin
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Deems Davis
Sent: Thursday, August 27, 2009 8:23 PM
Subject: Re: RV10-List: Olsons great getaway writeup - A Gathering ????
Now thats what I'm talking about !!!!!!!!! ;-) Seriously, we're only a
short flight from Sedona, and would love to hook up with you while
you/re here. There's an RV-10 in Prescott as well. Sedona is an
interesting airport. It sits on the top of a 500' mesa, normally, you
land one way (uphill) and take off the other. The elevation differences
on the ends of the runway is 100'. There is some really amazing 'red
rock' formations in the area. It would make for some REALLY neat
air-to-air shots with your freshly painted plane in the foreground.
(I've got a camera that should be up to the task).
Deems
Don McDonald wrote:
> Deems, and you other AZ 10 guys, we are flying (at least that's the
> plan) to Sedona on 9-4 for a week. It would be nice to at least meet
> up.... either in Sedona, or we could stop on the way there or on our
> return trip. I'm sure we'll have a spare day or so to fly... and for
> that day or so we have accomodations for you as well.
> Don McDonald
>
> --- On *Wed, 8/26/09, Deems Davis //* wrote:
>
>
> From: Deems Davis <deemsdavis(at)cox.net>
> Subject: Re: RV10-List: Olsons great getaway writeup - A Gathering
> ????
> To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com
> Date: Wednesday, August 26, 2009, 12:09 PM
>
> <http://us.mc537.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=deemsdavis@cox.net>>
>
> Tim you might want to consider Copperstate as an alternate to LOE
> this year. I've heard the same about LOE, great for RV'rs but not
> much else to do. Copperstate is not so large that flying in and
> out during the event is the challenge it is @ OSH. Tie in a visit
> to Sedona, Grand Canyon, Monument Valley, Puerto Penasco, San
> Diego, Las Vegas ??? We'll make it worth your while. I'll fly part
> way out to meet you so you can have a -10 to look at on your way
> inbound :-)
>
>
> Deems drumming up Copperstate attendance Davis
>
> Tim Olson wrote:
> <http://us.mc537.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=Tim@myrv10.com>>
> >
> > I think gatherings would be fun, but, there is a downside
sometimes.
> > If you go somewhere with tons to do, then nobody does any
flying,
> > and there is too much draw to go visit other things. On the
> > other hand, if you go somewhere lame, then there is only flying
> > to do, and the family will get bored. So personally, I really
> > like the idea of gathering in one spot, and flying around
> > to a couple others....kind of like the last couple trips I
> > did like meeting David Maib and Vic and heading to Key West,
> > or metting Scott and heading to Oregon. That makes for a great
> > FLYING vacation where you can camp or see things too.
> >
> > This year I was considering LOE for a fly-in since it's been
> > a while, but, at the same time, it's not really a super
destination
> > for the kids and family....you basically will love it if you
> > just want to hang out with other builders, and you can
> > fly all day long if you want. But, you hang out at the
> > airport a lot. OSH is a great GATHERING but not the most
> > convenient place to do lots of flying. What would make
> > OSH more fun is if people would meet up along the way,
> > and the closer you got, the more people you had.
> >
> > So it's hard because everyone has a varied agenda of what
> > they'd like. I don't think I'll be at LOE this year,
> > but I know I'll be flying a couple more times on trips by
> > the end of the year. It's always nice to fly along and look
> > out the window and see another RV-10. :)
> >
> > Tim Olson - RV-10 N104CD
> >
> >
> >
> > Deems Davis wrote:
> <http://us.mc537.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=deemsdavis@cox.net>>
> >>
> >> I like this idea ... RV10 gathering/s. OSH is definitely a
> great gathering, but I'd love to see if there's any interest in
> getting together somewhere with some other builder/flyers. I think
> the biggest attraction to OSH for me is just getting to visit with
> other similarly 'infected' types.
> >>
> >> I monitor the SoCal RV list, and they routinely have several
> posts each week where several people connect and either meet
> somewhere or fly somewhere together. I realize we're spread
> across the US and the logistics are greatly expanded, but it would
> be nice if we developed into the kind of group that routinely met
> and flew together either regionally or otherwise.
> >>
> >> What if people just used this list to post ideas about where,
> who, and when they would like to take a trip with some others? and
> let people naturally connect? If it turns out to be a benefit, who
> know someone might set up part of a website as an " I want to take
> a trip' bulletin board.
> >>
> >> Deems Davis N519PJ
> >> http://deemsrv10.com/index.html
> >>
> >> Tim Olson wrote:
> <http://us.mc537.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=Tim@myrv10.com>>
> >>>
> >>> I just do it to try to get you all to finish up so we can have
> >>> some great RV-10 gatherings. :)
> >>> Tim
> >>>
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV1bsp; -
> MATRONICS WEB FORUMS -nbsp;
> ="http://www.matronics.com/contribution"
> target=_blank>http://www.matro====================
>
>
> *
>
>
> *
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: RV-10 Article |
| From: | John Cox <johnwcox(at)pacificnw.com> |
Thanks Dave for setting Mr. Hirschman straight. I know that Stein and Rob
Hickman both felt Steven Raddatz Production aircraft for immediate resale w
ere, in their words -beautiful. Others will follow in his footsteps to fil
l the "Peeler Need". I have seen far prettier and more valued features in
OBAM projects actually built by the pilots. So much so that I am going to
take my critical attitude to the EAA for consideration as a 2010 AirVenture
Judge. Many of you amatuer builders deserve some well earned accolades...
.Nicely Done! Let's shout it to those wanting RV-10s. Kit #984 is on the
floor at Van's.
The Peeler paperwork did not acknowledge Mr. Raddatz's contribution nor his
many other repeditive financial successes while so slowly learning.. Oh ya
h, it was for remedial education and continueing financial enjoyment. It d
id credit the check Dr Peeler and his commercial pilot wife wrote, leaving
a distinct siren's call for future purchasers to look to Pro Built RV-10s a
gainst the sea of stouter built C-182s and faster SR-22s certified birds at
dealers. Maybe that is what the RV-10 policyholders now want?
As Dave Hirschman stated, (as a buyer but not yet a builder) he was well f
amiliar with the issues and knew what he was writing. He knows the FAA acc
epted Dr. Peeler as the builder and he published the passage that Peeler kn
ew what his Airworthiness certification statement meant... Peeler goes on
to say he had it professionally produced for him.
Anyone have that Granite rewritten language on 51% built aircraft available
so the rest of us get to use it finding the next Peeler?
John Cox
From: Dave Saylor
Sent: Thu 8/27/2009 11:10 AM
Subject: RV10-List: Re: RV-10 Article
Dave,
I copied my last reply to you to a bunch of RV-10 types on Matronics. You
said the builder passed away, and implied that the plane was amateur built.
..now I'm hearing that it was Steve Raddatz. Yes, he is deceased, but he w
as also a professional builder who it seems did not share your concern abou
t abuse of the AB category. So I stand by my original statement and I thin
k I'll shut up for a while before I make myself a bigger fool.
Dave Saylor
On Thu, Aug 27, 2009 at 10:54 AM, Hirschman, Dave
wrote:
Dear Dave Saylor,
I share your concerns about abuse of the Experimental category, and your po
int about explicitly spelling out the ownership trail in this case is well
taken.
Also, I like your idea about a "second owner" article, too. As a buyer (but
not yet a builder) of Experimental aircraft over the years, it's a subject
I'm personally very interested in . . .
Best,
Dave Hirschman
From: Dave Saylor [mailto:dave.saylor.aircrafters(at)gmail.com]
Sent: Thursday, August 27, 2009 1:50 PM
Cc: rv10-list(at)matronics.com
Subject: Re: RV-10 Article
Thank you, Dave. That's a reasonable and completely acceptable explanation
. FWIW, there are a lot of people who are concerned about people intending
to get around the rules, and this looked for all the world like one of tho
se cases. A line or two to set things straight might have been interesting
and informative to your audience. How about an article specifically addre
ssing "second owner" ins and outs?
Thanks again,
Dave Saylor
On Thu, Aug 27, 2009 at 9:49 AM, Hirschman, Dave
wrote:
Dear David Saylor,
Thanks very much for your e-mail and sharing your concerns about this airpl
ane.
I can assure you that David Peeler doesn't have the repairman's certificate
on this airplane. He bought it from the builder (who is now deceased).
The point of the RV-10 story was to highlight the tremendous utility and ca
pability of some Experimental category aircraft, even for non-builders like
David and Amy Peeler. My parents built a VariEze, and I'm an RV-3 owner, s
o I'm a big fan of the Experimental category . . .
Warm Regards,
Dave Hirschman
From: Dave Saylor [mailto:dave.saylor.aircrafters(at)gmail.com]
Sent: Thursday, August 27, 2009 12:41 PM
Subject: Fwd: RV-10 Article
Dear Mr. Hirschman,
I'm a 24-year AOPA member and an RV-10 builder/owner. I own and operate a
builder assistance center for amateur built aircraft, and I served on the F
AA's recent committee to review what is commonly known as the 51% rule.
I think you did a disservice to RV-10 builders specifically and all amateur
builders in general by printing certain quotes from David Peeler. Without
any valid explanation of the rule, you left the impression that Dr. Peeler
had someone build his plane. Yet, a quick check of the registration datab
ase clearly lists him as the manufacturer, but he claims he doesn't "preten
d to be" the builder...something's fishy.
There's nothing wrong with selling a plane that you built, as long as your
intentions were correct. And there's nothing wrong with hiring out certain
parts of the project. But in this case there's clearly more to the story,
and not knowing what it is or how it was addressed leaves a black mark.
I hope you can clear up the discrepancy. I'm not the only one who noticed.
Sincerely,
Dave Saylor
AirCrafters LLC
140 Aviation Way
Watsonville, CA 95076
August 20, 2009 - August 28, 2009
RV10-Archive.digest.vol-ex