RV9-Archive.digest.vol-ac
September 07, 2001 - December 14, 2001
> Good Luck,
> Todd Houg
> N194TH
> Tanks . . .
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Mark Schrimmer [mailto:mschrimmer(at)pacbell.net]
> Sent: Monday, April 30, 2001 11:27 AM
> To: rv9-list(at)matronics.com
> Subject: RV9-List: Backriveting 9A elevator skins
>
>
>
> I'm about to rivet my right elevator skin to the spar and I'm thinking
it
> might be better to back rivet instead of using a bucking bar since you
won't
> be able to see the bucking bar while you're riveting.
>
> Has anybody else used back riveting here? Did you have any problems
using
> this technique? I'm a little worried that I might damage the skins
opening
> them wide enough to back rivet.
>
> Thanks,
>
> Mark Schrimmer
> Irvine, CA
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Mark Schrimmer <mschrimmer(at)pacbell.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Backriveting 9A elevator skins |
on 9/7/01 12:58 PM, tchoug at tchoug(at)micron.com wrote:
>
> The disadvantage is that you need to keep track of the two different hole and
dimple sizes
Actually you could use 1/8" flush head rivets and then you would only need
to drill and dimple one size hole. I considered doing this, but then I
decided the pop rivets would be fine because they are on the bottom.
Mark Schrimmer
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Mark Schrimmer <mschrimmer(at)pacbell.net> |
Does anybody see any disadvantage to doing the RV-9A tanks before the rest
of the wing?
Mark Schrimmer
RV-9A
Irvine, CA
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Mark Schrimmer <mschrimmer(at)pacbell.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Backriveting 9A elevator skins |
on 9/7/01 1:14 PM, Frank Lanier at flanier(at)microsoft.com wrote:
> The only problem I had, once again, is oil canning. This seems to be my
> personal demon in building this plane. The oil canning is not horrible,
> but annoying as heck. Anyone have advise as to how to minimize it?
>
Frank,
I piled on lots of weight -- 150 to 200 lbs of sandbags and worked on a
reasonably flat surface. I also put a cleco in every hole along the trailing
edge. I then slipped my back rivet plate under 4 holes at a time, put in the
rivets and moved to the next 4 holes. About the only problem I had was that
the metal puckered a little bit along the trailing edge between rivet holes,
but I think I can fix it by putting in some SuperFil before painting.
Mark Schrimmer
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | tchoug <tchoug(at)micron.com> |
Mark,
Are you a glutton for punishment? ;o) I've only got my tanks half done and
it seems I'm always coming up with excuses to work on other parts of the
plane!
You'll probably want the spars countersunk and the tank mounting platenuts
in place so that you can fit the tanks to the spar. It might be nice to be
able to hang the top, bottom and leading edge skins on the spar while
fitting the tank to make sure the skins butt correctly, but it's not likely
you'll have problems. The only other area of concern might be the the tank
to leading edge joining strip between the leading edge skin and the tank
skin. However, you should be able to leave the holes in the tanks skins
untouched until you are fitting the leading edge and strip, then drill and
dimple these after the tanks are assembled.
Good luck,
Todd Houg
-----Original Message-----
From: Mark Schrimmer [mailto:mschrimmer(at)pacbell.net]
Sent: Friday, September 07, 2001 5:11 PM
Subject: RV9-List: Tanks first
Does anybody see any disadvantage to doing the RV-9A tanks before the rest
of the wing?
Mark Schrimmer
RV-9A
Irvine, CA
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Mark Schrimmer <mschrimmer(at)pacbell.net> |
on 9/7/01 3:24 PM, tchoug at tchoug(at)micron.com wrote:
>
> Mark,
>
> Are you a glutton for punishment? ;o) I've only got my tanks half done and
> it seems I'm always coming up with excuses to work on other parts of the
> plane!
Hi Todd,
I do have my spars countersunk and my platenuts riveted in place. I just
thought it might be nice to get the messiest part of the kit completed so I
can enjoy the rest of the project!
>
> The only other area of concern might be the tank to leading edge joining strip
between the leading edge skin and the tank skin.
You know how the joining strip fits betwqeen the leading edge rib and skin?
Does the joining strip also overlap the tank skin or does it just butt up
against the tank with no overlap?
Mark Schrimmer
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Dave Nicholson" <dnick2(at)home.com> |
Mark,
I found it best to have a place to "align" the tank while the sealer cures.
There was "just a little bit" of twist (maybe 1/16", end to end) on the
Tank after I finished riveting.
By mounting the "raw sealed tank" on the Main Spar:
1) Everything was held "exactly right" during the cure time.
2) The Main Spar makes a real good place to "store" the Tank while it cures.
3) The bead of sealant on the Rear Baffle can "flow down" to the back edge
of the tank.
4) It looks like you have more of the wing done with the tank in place.
Dave Nicholson
Danville, IL
90347
Wings
----- Original Message -----
From: "Mark Schrimmer" <mschrimmer(at)pacbell.net>
Sent: Friday, September 07, 2001 5:11 PM
Subject: RV9-List: Tanks first
>
> Does anybody see any disadvantage to doing the RV-9A tanks before the rest
> of the wing?
>
> Mark Schrimmer
> RV-9A
> Irvine, CA
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Clifford Begnaud" <shoeless(at)barefootpilot.com> |
>
> You know how the joining strip fits betwqeen the leading edge rib and
skin?
> Does the joining strip also overlap the tank skin or does it just butt up
> against the tank with no overlap?
>
Yes, the joining strip "underlaps" the tank and the leading edge. I think
you should at least do the leading edge before the tank. This allows you to
make certain they align, you get the joining strip properly placed, but most
important you get some practice fitting the ribs into the skin. The tank is
more difficult to fit ribs to than the outboard leading edge.
JMHO,
Cliff
www.barefootpilot.com
kit # 133 wings
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | barry pote <barrypote(at)home.com> |
Don't forget, I don't think it mentions it in the plans, the joint strip
butts to the spar, it does not carry over the spar, as the leading edge
and tank does. Don't ask how I know.
Barry Pote RV9a Fuselage (FINISH KIT ARRIVED TODAY!!!)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Haywire" <haywire(at)telus.net> |
| Subject: | An interesting tidbit |
I've also been told by Van's staff, that if they're going somewhere, unless
they have a specific need to take a certain aircraft, they will walk right
by all of 'em & take the "9".
S. Todd Bartrim
13B RV-9
C-FSTB (reserved)
Fuselage
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-rv9-list-server(at)matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-rv9-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of
> federigo(at)pacbell.net
> Sent: September 7, 2001 1:16 PM
> To: rv9-list(at)matronics.com
> Subject: RV9-List: An interesting tidbit
>
>
> I just heard that Van uses the RV-9 demonstrator as his commute plane. I
> suppose that its incredibly short takeoff and landing distances give an
> extra safety margin on the short strip at his home.
>
> Leland
> 90334
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Haywire" <haywire(at)telus.net> |
> > The only problem I had, once again, is oil canning. This seems to be my
> > personal demon in building this plane. The oil canning is not horrible,
> > but annoying as heck. Anyone have advise as to how to minimize it?
I assume that "oil canning" refers to slack metal between the
ribs/stiffeners that can "pop" in & out?? I hear so much about it on this
list, that it seems to be a big problem, but I haven't had any of this at
all, so I'm beginning to think that maybe it refers to something else?
Can somebody clarify this?
S. Todd Bartrim
13B RV-9
C-FSTB (reserved)
Fuselage
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Mark Schrimmer <mschrimmer(at)pacbell.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Oil Canning ?? |
> I assume that "oil canning" refers to slack metal between the
> ribs/stiffeners that can "pop" in & out?? I hear so much about it on this
> list, that it seems to be a big problem, but I haven't had any of this at
> all, so I'm beginning to think that maybe it refers to something else?
> Can somebody clarify this?
> S. Todd Bartrim
> 13B RV-9
> C-FSTB (reserved)
> Fuselage
>
>
Todd,
As far as I know, your definition of oil canning is correct. I don't think
I've had any oil canning problems either, but after following this thread,
I'm wondering if I should go back and look at all my control surfaces more
carefully.
Mark Schrimmer
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Todd Houg <thoug(at)attglobal.net> |
Mark,
I think Cliff already answered your question. The joint strip goes
between the leading edge skin and inboard rib (tight fit there) and then
extends inboard of the leading edge skin under the tank skin. You then
drill matched holes in it to the tank skin and add some countersunk
platenuts to secure the tank. It would be advantageous to have this
fitted and secure when doing the tank as it takes a little pressure on
the tank to bring the leading edges of the skin into alignment.
Todd
www.toddhoug.com - sorely out of date web site!
-----Original Message-----
From: Mark Schrimmer [SMTP:mschrimmer(at)pacbell.net]
Sent: Friday, September 07, 2001 6:05 PM
Subject: Re: RV9-List: Tanks first
on 9/7/01 3:24 PM, tchoug at tchoug(at)micron.com wrote:
>
> Mark,
>
> Are you a glutton for punishment? ;o) I've only got my tanks half done
and
> it seems I'm always coming up with excuses to work on other parts of
the
> plane!
Hi Todd,
I do have my spars countersunk and my platenuts riveted in place. I just
thought it might be nice to get the messiest part of the kit completed
so I
can enjoy the rest of the project!
>
> The only other area of concern might be the tank to leading edge
joining strip
between the leading edge skin and the tank skin.
You know how the joining strip fits betwqeen the leading edge rib and
skin?
Does the joining strip also overlap the tank skin or does it just butt
up
against the tank with no overlap?
Mark Schrimmer
=
=
=
=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________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Ernest Kells" <ernest.kells(at)sympatico.ca> |
| Subject: | Re: Oil Canning ?? |
Todd, Mark and others:
> As far as I know, your definition of oil canning is correct. I don't think
> I've had any oil canning problems either, but after following this thread,
> I'm wondering if I should go back and look at all my control surfaces more
> carefully.
I have not had any problems with oil canning either (finishing the fuse).
However, one thing that I do on all trailing surfaces was control the
compression. My son-in-law built my backrivet plate to be exactly the same
thickness as MDF board (medium density fibre?). When I "do" a surface I use
spring clamps to tightly secure the entire surface. For the elevator this
means using a 2"x4" board as a weight with several dead weights (his workout
stuff) over the entire length. The clamps hold everything in line for the
whole length. I drill - or rivet only a few rivets before setting up again
for the next few. Although time consuming and perhaps overkill, it seems to
work very well with pleasing results. You get what you pay for. My labour
is cheap.
Ernest Kells RV-9A - Fuselage 50%, O-235 Wood Prop
Sault Ste. Marie, Ontario
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: "Oil Canning" in Vertical Stab |
> I am still hoping it will reduce when I rivet the dreaded trailing edge.
Trailing edges are easy. . .
For trailing edges and stiffners, it is best to build a bucking bar into
your work table. I used a 3x2 inch steel angle which I attached to the edge
of the table flush at table top height. It is long enough to do a complete
flap. The results are perfectly straight trailing edges with little effort.
I wish I had done this with the elevators!
Dale
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bryan Wood <brywd(at)pacbell.net> |
| Subject: | F705 Bulkhead assembly |
Hi all,
I have a question regarding the F705 Bulkhead. Does the F705J go under
or on top of the F705K. This is on the fuse drawing number 20.
According to the drawing it looks like it goes on top of the F705K, but
it fits better if it goes under. What have those of you past this point
done on yours?
Thanks,
Bryan Wood
RV-9a fuse
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Haywire" <haywire(at)telus.net> |
| Subject: | F705 Bulkhead assembly |
Hi Bryan;
F-705J goes on top of F-705K. It can be seen in detail B in the upper right
corner of drawing 20. If you look at drawing 30, side view you will see how
it will work with the seat backs.
S. Todd Bartrim
13B RV-9
C-FSTB (reserved)
Fuselage
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-rv9-list-server(at)matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-rv9-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of Bryan Wood
> Sent: September 9, 2001 1:57 PM
> To: rv9-list(at)matronics.com
> Subject: RV9-List: F705 Bulkhead assembly
>
>
> Hi all,
> I have a question regarding the F705 Bulkhead. Does the F705J go under
> or on top of the F705K. This is on the fuse drawing number 20.
> According to the drawing it looks like it goes on top of the F705K, but
> it fits better if it goes under. What have those of you past this point
> done on yours?
> Thanks,
> Bryan Wood
> RV-9a fuse
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Gene" <gene(at)nvaircraft.com> |
| Subject: | Re: F705 Bulkhead assembly |
Bryan the F705J (angle) goes on top, this is what will hold the upper part
of the seat back which will be F- 638. You can get a better view of what is
going on by looking at drwg. 30
Gene 90296 Forward Fuse.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Bryan Wood" <brywd(at)pacbell.net>
Sent: Sunday, September 09, 2001 1:57 PM
Subject: RV9-List: F705 Bulkhead assembly
>
> Hi all,
> I have a question regarding the F705 Bulkhead. Does the F705J go under
> or on top of the F705K. This is on the fuse drawing number 20.
> According to the drawing it looks like it goes on top of the F705K, but
> it fits better if it goes under. What have those of you past this point
> done on yours?
> Thanks,
> Bryan Wood
> RV-9a fuse
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Albert Gardner" <albert.gardner(at)worldnet.att.net> |
| Subject: | Re: F705 Bulkhead assembly |
The preview plans set has section 4 which is an index of part numbers and
the plans page(s) numbers that a given part appears on. Very helpful if
you're ever wondering what else hooks to a part.
Albert Gardner
Yuma, AZ
RV-9A: N872RV (Reserved)
Attaching tail feathers.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Haywire" <haywire(at)telus.net> |
| Subject: | F705 Bulkhead assembly |
Hey Albert;
I started my kit before the preview plans was available, so I don't have
'em. I've considered buying them as I have done a few modifications and
would like the ability to look forward and see if anything else is affected.
I've done alright so far, and kinda think it will be a waste of money since
I'm about to order the finish kit and will get the rest of the plans with
it.
However, this index you mention sounds like it would be quite handy. Not
to
mention that it would be nice to have the preview plans too take to work
with me. What's your or anybody's opinion? are they worth $55?
S. Todd Bartrim
13B RV-9
C-FSTB (reserved)
Fuselage
#90113
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-rv9-list-server(at)matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-rv9-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of Albert Gardner
> Sent: September 9, 2001 7:19 PM
> To: rv9-list(at)matronics.com
> Subject: Re: RV9-List: F705 Bulkhead assembly
>
>
>
>
> The preview plans set has section 4 which is an index of part numbers and
> the plans page(s) numbers that a given part appears on. Very helpful if
> you're ever wondering what else hooks to a part.
> Albert Gardner
> Yuma, AZ
> RV-9A: N872RV (Reserved)
> Attaching tail feathers.
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Albert Gardner" <albert.gardner(at)worldnet.att.net> |
| Subject: | Preview Plans Set |
If you are about done, I'm not sure they are worth the money. At this point
you could just ask a list member to look up a part no. on their copy. The
preview plans set is reduced size so they are much easier to haul around but
the smaller size also makes it harder to see details.
Albert Gardner
Yuma, AZ
RV-9A: N872RV (Reserved)
Working on finish
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Guy Votuc" <guy(at)votuc.com> |
I'm curious what most of you guys plan ( or already did ) concerning the
subject of painting rivet lines. To fill or not to fill.. I see many paint
jobs with 2-3 coats partially filling ( covering ) the rivet heads. Why not
go all the way and use a light weight filler to fill the rivet heads along
with the misc dings received during construction. On that subject .....
what to use ??
Guy
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | PERRYMAN Larry <Larry.PERRYMAN(at)atofina.com> |
Personally, I plan to use a rivet shave to bring any high rivets down to the
skin level and DO NOT plan to fill around rivets. In the unlikely event that
I had to go back into a part of the plane, I want to be able to find the
rivets.
For dents, I have some aircraft grade filler similar to bondo to fill any
OOPS points I have.
Regards
Larry Perryman
N194DL reserved Fuse
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Paul Besing" <azpilot(at)extremezone.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Painting Rivets |
FWIW, this is a metal airplane. Rivets are to be seen. Be greatful that
our airplanes use flush rivets. Imagine building a Zenith where it uses pop
rivets that stick out of the skin all the time. Finish your airplane and
fly it. You will forget about filling around those rivets. Many awards have
been given to airplanes with flush rivets, that were NOT filled.
Just my $.02.
Paul Besing
RV-6A N197AB Arizona
http://www.lacodeworks.com/besing
Flying
Kitlog Pro Builder's Log Software
http://www.kitlog.com
----- Original Message -----
From: "Guy Votuc" <guy(at)votuc.com>
Sent: Monday, September 10, 2001 11:23 AM
Subject: RV9-List: Painting Rivets
>
> I'm curious what most of you guys plan ( or already did ) concerning the
> subject of painting rivet lines. To fill or not to fill.. I see many paint
> jobs with 2-3 coats partially filling ( covering ) the rivet heads. Why
not
> go all the way and use a light weight filler to fill the rivet heads along
> with the misc dings received during construction. On that subject .....
> what to use ??
>
>
> Guy
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Albert Gardner" <albert.gardner(at)worldnet.att.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Running Fuel Lines |
I have finished running the fuel line in and around the gear brackets and
after several false starts I find Kevin Shannons solution (which was to run
the fuel lines through the lower set of holes instead of putting the brake
lines there and move the brake lines up to the fuel line holes) is the best.
It put the fuel line high enough that the bend just inside the skin where
the fuel line exits the fuse in smooth and gradual.. Thanks Kevin,
Albert
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | federigo(at)pacbell.net |
| Subject: | Elevator Mac Trim Servo |
I had to mount the elevator Mac trimtab servo further forward than the
plans "show" and also to lengthen the slot in the elevator by 3/4" to
keep the servo jack screw from rubbing on the elevator skin when the
screw was at full extension. Has anybody else experienced this?
Leland in Pleasanton
#90334
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: RV9-List Digest: 1 Msgs - 09/13/01 |
No- but I did have to trim the MAC servo mount severely in order to get the
thing in and out of the hole.
Ed Winne
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Gary Newsted" <fcs(at)jlc.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Elevator Mac Trim Servo |
Leland, I think you must have misinterpreted the plans or dimensions when you
attached your servo. If you mount the servo "just-right", it does fit into the
factory position. You have to wiggle and twist it in a certain way, but it
does fit without the need for lengthening the slot.
As long as you're modifications are sound, you are OK moving it, but from my own
experience with this kit, if something doesn't fit right, take a closer look or
call for help. The kit is very near perfect in my humble opinion. I've
posted some photos of the servo mount you can look at. I have also heard one
case of a wrong servo motor, so see if you're looks like mine.
www.fcs(at)jlc.net\servo.htm
Gary Newsted - Center fuse
----- Original Message -----
From: <federigo(at)pacbell.net>
Sent: Thursday, September 13, 2001 6:36 PM
Subject: RV9-List: Elevator Mac Trim Servo
>
> I had to mount the elevator Mac trimtab servo further forward than the
> plans "show" and also to lengthen the slot in the elevator by 3/4" to
> keep the servo jack screw from rubbing on the elevator skin when the
> screw was at full extension. Has anybody else experienced this?
> Leland in Pleasanton
> #90334
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Gary Newsted" <fcs(at)jlc.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Elevator Mac Trim Servo |
Sorry, that URL with the servo photos should have been:
www.jlc.net/~fcs/servo.htm
----- Original Message -----
From: <federigo(at)pacbell.net>
Sent: Thursday, September 13, 2001 6:36 PM
Subject: RV9-List: Elevator Mac Trim Servo
>
> I had to mount the elevator Mac trimtab servo further forward than the
> plans "show" and also to lengthen the slot in the elevator by 3/4" to
> keep the servo jack screw from rubbing on the elevator skin when the
> screw was at full extension. Has anybody else experienced this?
> Leland in Pleasanton
> #90334
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Ward, David E" <david.e.ward(at)Boeing.com> |
| Subject: | Elevator Mac Trim Servo |
Gary,
I am also having some problem with the servo unit. Looking at your pictures, I
do not have the attach brackets from the servo unit to the cover plate, do those
come with the servo unit or did you fabricate them?
Dave Ward
-----Original Message-----
From: Gary Newsted [mailto:fcs(at)jlc.net]
Sent: Friday, September 14, 2001 9:15 PM
Subject: Re: RV9-List: Elevator Mac Trim Servo
Sorry, that URL with the servo photos should have been:
www.jlc.net/~fcs/servo.htm
----- Original Message -----
From: <federigo(at)pacbell.net>
Sent: Thursday, September 13, 2001 6:36 PM
Subject: RV9-List: Elevator Mac Trim Servo
>
> I had to mount the elevator Mac trimtab servo further forward than the
> plans "show" and also to lengthen the slot in the elevator by 3/4" to
> keep the servo jack screw from rubbing on the elevator skin when the
> screw was at full extension. Has anybody else experienced this?
> Leland in Pleasanton
> #90334
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Elevator Mac Trim Servo |
Gary - I was interested in your comment about the kit being 'near perfect'.
I agree but with a few odd lapses.
I am still on the empenage but one area that was a minor disapointement was
the elevator counter weight ribs. They were distinctly rough compared with
what has gone before. Is this unique to my kit or common to all.
The other thought I have on the emp is clearly much of the instructions are
'inherited' (or modified) from an earlier model, perhaps the -6, but the
build order is reversed. This shows up for instance in the fact that you
work through the drawings broadly in a descending sequence. If I was
advising someone who was just starting I would push them frequently look for
info on the drawing beyond the one they are on. Section A-A on drawing 4
answered a question I spent 2 hrs trying to confirm on drawing 5 and wasted
2hrs over.
Are the instructions good beyond the emp.?
Steve
#90360
N Yorks, UK
Working on the right elevator and rudder.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Gary Newsted" <fcs(at)jlc.net>
Sent: Saturday, September 15, 2001 4:54 AM
Subject: Re: RV9-List: Elevator Mac Trim Servo
>
> Leland, I think you must have misinterpreted the plans or dimensions when
you
> attached your servo. If you mount the servo "just-right", it does fit
into the
> factory position. You have to wiggle and twist it in a certain way, but
it
> does fit without the need for lengthening the slot.
> As long as you're modifications are sound, you are OK moving it, but from
my own
> experience with this kit, if something doesn't fit right, take a closer
look or
> call for help. The kit is very near perfect in my humble opinion.
I've
> posted some photos of the servo mount you can look at. I have also heard
one
> case of a wrong servo motor, so see if you're looks like mine.
> www.fcs(at)jlc.net\servo.htm
>
> Gary Newsted - Center fuse
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: <federigo(at)pacbell.net>
> To:
> Sent: Thursday, September 13, 2001 6:36 PM
> Subject: RV9-List: Elevator Mac Trim Servo
>
>
> >
> > I had to mount the elevator Mac trimtab servo further forward than the
> > plans "show" and also to lengthen the slot in the elevator by 3/4" to
> > keep the servo jack screw from rubbing on the elevator skin when the
> > screw was at full extension. Has anybody else experienced this?
> > Leland in Pleasanton
> > #90334
> >
> >
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
Steve: The instructions after the wing become less and less "do this,
then this, then this,..." but by then you don't need a lot of step by
step detail. On the other hand, sometimes you do. For instance,I now
discover that in order to run the rudder cable through the snap
bushings, you have to remove the bushing, deform it with your fingers
into an oval, and push the rudder cable through it-then reinstall the
snap bushing. I wish I had installed the rudder cables down the sides
as I was putting the fuse together so I didn't have to crawl back in
there now. course, now I find out after I've riveted the Aft Baggage
Side Covers (F750) on, the way I installed the snap bushing on the 2
bulkheads fore and aft of this cover means I will have to cut the snap
bushings apart in order to remove them, and put new ones in with the
rudder cable through the center. Oh well, while I'm in there, I think
I'll run a cord through all the snap bushing that carry electric wires
so that I can pull them in rather than make another trip into the black
hole of the tail cone.
Albert Gardner
Yuma, AZ
RV-9A: N872RV (Reserved)
Working on forward cabin
----- Original Message -----
> Gary - I was interested in your comment about the kit being 'near
perfect'.
> I agree but with a few odd lapses.
> I am still on the empenage but one area that was a minor
disapointement
was
> the elevator counter weight ribs. They were distinctly rough compared
with
> what has gone before. Is this unique to my kit or common to all.
> The other thought I have on the emp is clearly much of the
instructions
are
> 'inherited' (or modified) from an earlier model, perhaps the -6, but
the
> build order is reversed. This shows up for instance in the fact that
you
> work through the drawings broadly in a descending sequence. If I was
> advising someone who was just starting I would push them frequently
look
for
> info on the drawing beyond the one they are on. Section A-A on drawing
4
> answered a question I spent 2 hrs trying to confirm on drawing 5 and
wasted
> 2hrs over.
> Are the instructions good beyond the emp.?
> Steve
> #90360
> N Yorks, UK
> Working on the right elevator and rudder.
Albert Gardner
God Bless America
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | barry.pote(at)matronics.com |
| Subject: | Re: Rudder cables |
Albert, be of good cheer, I have learned by your solving the problem.
And I appreciate it! hehehehehe!
Barry Pote RV9a
PS Good post. We, the list, needs posts like that. I realize that the
manual is pretty damn good. I realize that the drawings are pretty damn
good. I realize that is was really hard when you had a pile of aluminum
and poor drawings. As a matter of fact if one of Van's employees reminds
me of that in person, I will dwell on it for a minute or 2. I will think
about where the softest spot may be on their head, and smack it with a
rolled up newspaper. BUT... I think when you have a manual, and it says
step 1 then step 2 etc, it should be correct. And if it is not correct
and you tell someone in authority about it, they should fix it and
....AND let people know about it.
I guess the PS turned into BS! Sorry about that.
"Albert Gardner"@matronics.com wrote:
>
>
> Steve: The instructions after the wing become less and less "do this,
>
________________________________________________________________________________
More on rudder cables:
Well, I had to make another darn trip into the tail cone. Short
version-feed the cable into the tail from the outside and thence forward.
The fitting on the aft end of the cable won't go through the slot in the
skin near the rudder.
Now, the question. Although Dwg 37 show Rudder Cable Link (F-6119) which is
whatever length necessary to connect the cable to the rudder bar, how do you
get it tight? I'm thinking a turnbuckle would be necessary both to tighten
the cable and to center the rudder. Kevin Shannon, what did you do? Also,
what's a good way to secure the plastic tubing where the cable exits the
skin at the back? (Kevin is a great source of info, so his reply to the
list might be benificial)
Albert Gardner
RV-9A 9-0132
God Bless America
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Gene" <gene(at)nvaircraft.com> |
| Subject: | Screwed up holes |
What is the trick for drilling thru thin skin (.032) into thicker
material such as longerons? I have messed up several holes and don't
know if I can save the side skins. Apparently the drill bit wandered
off ! #$%@&
%
I do use sharp bits and change them often.
Gene 90296 forward fuse
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Mike Nellis" <mnellis(at)peoplepc.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Screwed up holes |
Are you using a center punch? Always use a center punch. Place the drill
in position and give the chuck a couple of turns by hand and you shouldn't
have any problems.
Mike Nellis - http://bmnellis.com
Plainfield, IL
RV6 N699BM (res) Aileron Trim
Stinson 108-2 N9666K
----- Original Message -----
From: "Gene" <gene(at)nvaircraft.com>
Sent: Saturday, September 15, 2001 9:03 PM
Subject: RV9-List: Screwed up holes
>
> What is the trick for drilling thru thin skin (.032) into thicker
> material such as longerons? I have messed up several holes and don't
> know if I can save the side skins. Apparently the drill bit wandered
> off ! #$%@&
%
I do use sharp bits and change them often.
>
> Gene 90296 forward fuse
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Screwed up holes |
What's a center punch?
Just kidding...I've used center punches before, but only on hard material
(steel) and such. As Mike said, put the drill bit on your mark, and twist
the chuck a couple of times. It also helps if you have a drill that has a
variable trigger that you can start slow.
Paul Besing
RV-6A N197AB Arizona
http://www.lacodeworks.com/besing
Flying
Kitlog Pro Builder's Log Software
http://www.kitlog.com
----- Original Message -----
From: "Mike Nellis" <mnellis(at)peoplepc.com>
Sent: Saturday, September 15, 2001 7:21 PM
Subject: Re: RV9-List: Screwed up holes
Are you using a center punch? Always use a center punch. Place the drill
in position and give the chuck a couple of turns by hand and you shouldn't
have any problems.
Mike Nellis - http://bmnellis.com
Plainfield, IL
RV6 N699BM (res) Aileron Trim
Stinson 108-2 N9666K
----- Original Message -----
From: "Gene" <gene(at)nvaircraft.com>
Sent: Saturday, September 15, 2001 9:03 PM
Subject: RV9-List: Screwed up holes
>
> What is the trick for drilling thru thin skin (.032) into thicker
> material such as longerons? I have messed up several holes and don't
> know if I can save the side skins. Apparently the drill bit wandered
> off ! #$%@&
%
I do use sharp bits and change them often.
>
> Gene 90296 forward fuse
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | RV-9A Sliding Canopy Plans Error |
Dwg 42, area D9, detail A: (Ref. Construction Manual pg. 9-9 "Installing the
Roll Bar, 1st step.)
The dimension given for locating the 2 holes for attaching the Roll Bar
(WD-641) to the Aft Canopy Deck (F-721-B) appear to be just double what they
should be. Detail A is full scale so you can measure right on the drawing
to double check. 1-1/32" should be 33/64" and 7-9/32" should be 3-41/64".
Since a plans error is somewhat important I think someone else should
doublecheck me and either confirm or dispute this. If Vans was open on
weekends I would have called them but...
Albert Gardner
Yuma, AZ
RV-9A: N872RV (Reserved)
Working on canopy
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Im7shannon(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: RV-9A Sliding Canopy Plans Error |
Hi Al, I remember this, the full size drawing was right, the dimensions shown
were wrong. I just put the roll bar where the drawing showed it and
disregarded the numbers.
Also, on the rudder cables, it is your feet that hold them tight, just set
your rudder in trail, put the pedal where you want the neutral position to
be, then fab the link to fit, and make both sides the same length. I used
some wire for temporary links and played around with the pedals until I
figured out what a good length would be, which was full rudder kept the
pedals from hitting the hoses, etc behind them. Make sense? Its late and I
have been sniffing paint again.
Kevin
>Dwg 42, area D9, detail A: (Ref. Construction Manual pg. 9-9 "Installing
>the
>Roll Bar, 1st step.)
>The dimension given for locating the 2 holes for attaching the Roll Bar
>(WD-641) to the Aft Canopy Deck (F-721-B) appear to be just double what
>they
>should be. Detail A is full scale so you can measure right on the drawing
>to double check. 1-1/32" should be 33/64" and 7-9/32" should be 3-41/64".
>Since a plans error is somewhat important I think someone else should
>doublecheck me and either confirm or dispute this. If Vans was open on
>weekends I would have called them but...
>Albert Gardner
>Yuma, AZ
>RV-9A: N872RV (Reserved)
>Working on canopy
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Im7shannon(at)aol.com |
Al,
I just went and unrolled my plans, the critical dimension is shown in view
C-C on sheet 42 at the bottom center of the sheet where it says 2 5/8 from
the aft row of rivets on the center section bulkhead to the aft end of the
roll bar base plate. Put it there and then just put the bolts where the
drawing shows. The base plate should protrude past the aft face of the roll
bar about 1/8" . Make sure both sides are the same.
Kevin
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | ivo.welch(at)matronics.com |
| Subject: | RV9 Pilot Wanted |
[attempted post earlier, but believe it was unsuccessful; try again]
I have purchased someone's RV-9. It was inspected by someone who works
at Van's factory, and it looks very well put together. The plane is in
Washington State (about an hour away from Van's) and has about 100 hours
on it.
In October, I would like to get this plane from the West Coast to the
East Coast. Unfortunately, I am a student pilot and I have never flown
an RV. Is there anyone who would like to take an all-expenses paid
flight from Wcoast to Ecoast? It should be a great opportunity for
someone wondering whether they want to build an RV-9 for themselves.
However, I would highly prefer a somewhat experienced pilot, and I am
more concerned about this person than I am about the plane.
[PS: The plane does have GPS and autopilot, although they are not linked.]
/ivo welch
--
Ivo Welch, Professor of Finance/Economics, Yale/SOM + NBER
http://welch.som.yale.edu/
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Cy Galley" <cgalley(at)qcbc.org> |
| Subject: | Re: RV9 Pilot Wanted |
You need to get some transition training regardless of how or when you get
your RV-9 back home. Before you jump into your new plane, contact Mike
Seagar for that training. Sure it will probably cost you a plane ticket out
to Oregon unless he is in your neighborhood. Since you indicate that you are
a student pilot, you need to finish up your training and get your license.
You might be able to do this in your new plane.
You also will need a qualified in an RV-9 CFI. It might be that you should
get your CFI to fly out, take the training, fly it back, so he can train
you. The best if you have the time, is to take your CFI out with you so you
both can get some training. Then together fly the plane back. It will be an
experience of a life time.
It probably would be a good idea to if the CFI or you have some mechanical
experience in maintaining a plane. A lot can happen on a long trip with a
fairly new plane.
You might contact some one like Lyle Hefel who has built several RVs plus is
a CFI. Lyle's Phone number is 563-583-4657.
The EAA now has a list of airplanes available for transitional training.
Contact EAA Safety Programs at 888-322-4636, extension 6864, or e-mail
safetyprograms(at)eaa.org. Did I mention that the program is free, part of your
EAA membership. Good Luck!
Cy Galley
Editor, EAA Safety Programs
cgalley(at)qcbc.org or experimenter(at)eaa.org
----- Original Message -----
From:
Sent: Sunday, September 16, 2001 10:59 AM
Subject: RV9-List: RV9 Pilot Wanted
[attempted post earlier, but believe it was unsuccessful; try again]
I have purchased someone's RV-9. It was inspected by someone who works
at Van's factory, and it looks very well put together. The plane is in
Washington State (about an hour away from Van's) and has about 100 hours
on it.
In October, I would like to get this plane from the West Coast to the
East Coast. Unfortunately, I am a student pilot and I have never flown
an RV. Is there anyone who would like to take an all-expenses paid
flight from Wcoast to Ecoast? It should be a great opportunity for
someone wondering whether they want to build an RV-9 for themselves.
However, I would highly prefer a somewhat experienced pilot, and I am
more concerned about this person than I am about the plane.
[PS: The plane does have GPS and autopilot, although they are not linked.]
/ivo welch
--
Ivo Welch, Professor of Finance/Economics, Yale/SOM + NBER
http://welch.som.yale.edu/
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Engelmechanical(at)cs.com |
| Subject: | Re: RV9 Pilot Wanted |
I live on a private airstrip just North of Van's and own an RV-6A. I have
flown it from the east coast to the west coast and two round trips to Alaska.
I fly it regularly to Arizona in the winter where I am building another home
on an airstrip. I would be interested in flying your Airplane to the east
coast as my daughter lives in North Carolina and has been after me to come
and see their new house. I was curious if the RV-9 is the one from
Silverdale, Wa. (Apex airport). Am building an RV-9A at this time and also
curious as to why the seller has decided to sell so soon.
Jerry Engel
Private/instrument, 36 years of flying 500 hrs + in RV's
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Rudder cables |
Albert - thanks for the thoughts. I guess I dont mind having to work it out
for myself, its when the instructionss suggest the 'wrong' order....as you
just found. Dave Nicholson saved me big time by suggesting the Elevator
Horns (WD-605) should be attached to the spar BEFORE getting involved with
the skin. This worked like a dream for me and I think the other route would
have been a nightmare.
12 hrs of building and 1.3 of flying this weekend. Thats what its all about!
Steve
#90360
N Yorks, UK
Working on the right elevator
----- Original Message -----
From: <"Albert Gardner"@matronics.com>
Sent: Saturday, September 15, 2001 9:35 PM
Subject: RV9-List: Rudder cables
>
>
> Steve: The instructions after the wing become less and less "do this,
> then this, then this,..." but by then you don't need a lot of step by
> step detail. On the other hand, sometimes you do. For instance,I now
> discover that in order to run the rudder cable through the snap
> bushings, you have to remove the bushing, deform it with your fingers
> into an oval, and push the rudder cable through it-then reinstall the
> snap bushing. I wish I had installed the rudder cables down the sides
> as I was putting the fuse together so I didn't have to crawl back in
> there now. course, now I find out after I've riveted the Aft Baggage
> Side Covers (F750) on, the way I installed the snap bushing on the 2
> bulkheads fore and aft of this cover means I will have to cut the snap
> bushings apart in order to remove them, and put new ones in with the
> rudder cable through the center. Oh well, while I'm in there, I think
> I'll run a cord through all the snap bushing that carry electric wires
> so that I can pull them in rather than make another trip into the black
> hole of the tail cone.
> Albert Gardner
> Yuma, AZ
> RV-9A: N872RV (Reserved)
> Working on forward cabin
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> > Gary - I was interested in your comment about the kit being 'near
> perfect'.
> > I agree but with a few odd lapses.
> > I am still on the empenage but one area that was a minor
> disapointement
> was
> > the elevator counter weight ribs. They were distinctly rough compared
> with
> > what has gone before. Is this unique to my kit or common to all.
> > The other thought I have on the emp is clearly much of the
> instructions
> are
> > 'inherited' (or modified) from an earlier model, perhaps the -6, but
> the
> > build order is reversed. This shows up for instance in the fact that
> you
> > work through the drawings broadly in a descending sequence. If I was
> > advising someone who was just starting I would push them frequently
> look
> for
> > info on the drawing beyond the one they are on. Section A-A on drawing
> 4
> > answered a question I spent 2 hrs trying to confirm on drawing 5 and
> wasted
> > 2hrs over.
> > Are the instructions good beyond the emp.?
> > Steve
> > #90360
> > N Yorks, UK
> > Working on the right elevator and rudder.
>
>
> Albert Gardner
> God Bless America
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Gary Newsted" <fcs(at)jlc.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Elevator Mac Trim Servo |
I think you'll find the servo brackets in one of the paper bags, or else in
the box the servo comes in. I will snap a couple of photos of the servo
in the fully extended and retracted positions. I'll post these shortly. Did
you drill the large hole for the servo jack-screw (and wires) to pass through?
Gary
----- Original Message -----
From: Ward, David E <david.e.ward(at)Boeing.com>
Sent: Saturday, September 15, 2001 2:47 AM
Subject: RE: RV9-List: Elevator Mac Trim Servo
>
> Gary,
> I am also having some problem with the servo unit. Looking at your pictures,
I
do not have the attach brackets from the servo unit to the cover plate, do those
come with the servo unit or did you fabricate them?
> Dave Ward
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Gary Newsted [mailto:fcs(at)jlc.net]
> Sent: Friday, September 14, 2001 9:15 PM
> To: rv9-list(at)matronics.com
> Subject: Re: RV9-List: Elevator Mac Trim Servo
>
>
> Sorry, that URL with the servo photos should have been:
> www.jlc.net/~fcs/servo.htm
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: <federigo(at)pacbell.net>
> To:
> Sent: Thursday, September 13, 2001 6:36 PM
> Subject: RV9-List: Elevator Mac Trim Servo
>
>
> >
> > I had to mount the elevator Mac trimtab servo further forward than the
> > plans "show" and also to lengthen the slot in the elevator by 3/4" to
> > keep the servo jack screw from rubbing on the elevator skin when the
> > screw was at full extension. Has anybody else experienced this?
> > Leland in Pleasanton
> > #90334
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Gary Newsted" <fcs(at)jlc.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Elevator Mac Trim Servo |
I have posted several more photos of the elev. trim servo at the following URL:
www.jlc.net/~fcs/servo.htm
Gary
----- Original Message -----
From: Ward, David E <david.e.ward(at)Boeing.com>
Sent: Saturday, September 15, 2001 2:47 AM
Subject: RE: RV9-List: Elevator Mac Trim Servo
>
> Gary,
> I am also having some problem with the servo unit. Looking at your pictures,
I
do not have the attach brackets from the servo unit to the cover plate, do those
come with the servo unit or did you fabricate them?
> Dave Ward
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Gary Newsted [mailto:fcs(at)jlc.net]
> Sent: Friday, September 14, 2001 9:15 PM
> To: rv9-list(at)matronics.com
> Subject: Re: RV9-List: Elevator Mac Trim Servo
>
>
> Sorry, that URL with the servo photos should have been:
> www.jlc.net/~fcs/servo.htm
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: <federigo(at)pacbell.net>
> To:
> Sent: Thursday, September 13, 2001 6:36 PM
> Subject: RV9-List: Elevator Mac Trim Servo
>
>
> >
> > I had to mount the elevator Mac trimtab servo further forward than the
> > plans "show" and also to lengthen the slot in the elevator by 3/4" to
> > keep the servo jack screw from rubbing on the elevator skin when the
> > screw was at full extension. Has anybody else experienced this?
> > Leland in Pleasanton
> > #90334
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Gary Newsted" <fcs(at)jlc.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Elevator Mac Trim Servo |
Steve, yeah the written instructions leave a lot to the creative forces, but the
drawings tend to make up for it. I still refer to the written instructions,
usually reading well ahead of the current task. I also spend a HUGE amount of
time pondering the drawing set. Yes you do have to look around a lot. I'm
sorry to tell you that the written plans become even more terse as the kit
phases move on. The fuselage assumes a lot. I guess they figure you had
better know the ropes by then. I do think some more effort could (and probably
will) go into the written plans, but then again, the way they are now, you
really get to know this bird.
I was mostly referring to the quality of the kit itself. I have had literally
zero problems with the kit. On rare occasions that something looks or fits
wrong, it has always turned out to be my own misinterpretation.
Happy riveting! Gary
----- Original Message -----
From: <"Steve Sampson"@matronics.com>
Sent: Saturday, September 15, 2001 5:14 AM
Subject: Re: RV9-List: Elevator Mac Trim Servo
>
> Gary - I was interested in your comment about the kit being 'near perfect'.
> I agree but with a few odd lapses.
>
> I am still on the empenage but one area that was a minor disapointement was
> the elevator counter weight ribs. They were distinctly rough compared with
> what has gone before. Is this unique to my kit or common to all.
> The other thought I have on the emp is clearly much of the instructions are
> 'inherited' (or modified) from an earlier model, perhaps the -6, but the
> build order is reversed. This shows up for instance in the fact that you
> work through the drawings broadly in a descending sequence. If I was
> advising someone who was just starting I would push them frequently look for
> info on the drawing beyond the one they are on. Section A-A on drawing 4
> answered a question I spent 2 hrs trying to confirm on drawing 5 and wasted
> 2hrs over.
> Are the instructions good beyond the emp.?
>
> Steve
> #90360
> N Yorks, UK
> Working on the right elevator and rudder.
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Gary Newsted" <fcs(at)jlc.net>
> To:
> Sent: Saturday, September 15, 2001 4:54 AM
> Subject: Re: RV9-List: Elevator Mac Trim Servo
>
>
> >
> > Leland, I think you must have misinterpreted the plans or dimensions when
> you
> > attached your servo. If you mount the servo "just-right", it does fit
> into the
> > factory position. You have to wiggle and twist it in a certain way, but
> it
> > does fit without the need for lengthening the slot.
> > As long as you're modifications are sound, you are OK moving it, but from
> my own
> > experience with this kit, if something doesn't fit right, take a closer
> look or
> > call for help. The kit is very near perfect in my humble opinion.
> I've
> > posted some photos of the servo mount you can look at. I have also heard
> one
> > case of a wrong servo motor, so see if you're looks like mine.
> > www.fcs(at)jlc.net\servo.htm
> >
> > Gary Newsted - Center fuse
> >
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: <federigo(at)pacbell.net>
> > To:
> > Sent: Thursday, September 13, 2001 6:36 PM
> > Subject: RV9-List: Elevator Mac Trim Servo
> >
> >
> > >
> > > I had to mount the elevator Mac trimtab servo further forward than the
> > > plans "show" and also to lengthen the slot in the elevator by 3/4" to
> > > keep the servo jack screw from rubbing on the elevator skin when the
> > > screw was at full extension. Has anybody else experienced this?
> > > Leland in Pleasanton
> > > #90334
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | DThomas773(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Elevator Mac Trim Servo |
About plans. If you buy a current set of plans, are they updated to reflect
all the revisions or do you need to research all the published plan
revisions and updates?
Dennis Thomas
#90164 Emp
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Gary Newsted" <fcs(at)jlc.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Elevator Mac Trim Servo |
Vans does not send out updated plans. The occasional change is conveyed
through the RVator magazine subscription. I have often
suggested that builders avoid getting frenzied into buying phases of the kit
well ahead of their personal construction speed. If it takes you a few years to
build the emp and wings and your fuse and finish kits are sitting in your
garage, you may miss out on any modifications which Vans would have given you
had you held off ordering ahead. I was kit 59, and have seen two desirable
modifications, an extruded tie-down part, and the hexagonal flap linkage
extrusions. It was too late to get the tie-downs, but I did order the flap
linkages (I didn't like the original ones myself).
Keeping in tune with newsgroups and builders web pages will assure that you
don't miss anything important.
Gary
----- Original Message -----
From: <DThomas773(at)aol.com>
Sent: Sunday, September 16, 2001 10:43 PM
Subject: Re: RV9-List: Elevator Mac Trim Servo
>
> About plans. If you buy a current set of plans, are they updated to reflect
> all the revisions or do you need to research all the published plan
> revisions and updates?
> Dennis Thomas
> #90164 Emp
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | DThomas773(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Fwd: [Fwd: Fwd: A Response to the Disaster--Miami Herald] |
dhiggins(at)genesco.com, DThomas773(at)aol.comgmeadows55@hotmail.com,
Jeanne.Khoury(at)hcahealthcare.com, klieb(at)att.net, KSCORADIO(at)aol.com,
Stephen.G.LADD-WILSON(at)state.or.us, mjulene(at)hotmail.com,
psanders134(at)cruzio.com, Ann.THOMAS(at)state.or.us,
Ann.THOMAS(at)state.or.usAnn.THOMAS@state.or.us, Kim.Thomas(at)ti.com,
kim.thomas(at)notes.ssi1.com, Cindylwest(at)aol.com, reziegler(at)earthlink.net
From: Chldpsy2(at)aol.com
Full-name: Chldpsy2
Date: Mon, 17 Sep 2001 22:49:14 EDT
Subject: Fwd: [Fwd: Fwd: A Response to the Disaster--Miami Herald]
From: ZANNAJR(at)aol.com
Full-name: ZANNAJR
Date: Mon, 17 Sep 2001 22:04:56 EDT
Subject: Fwd: [Fwd: Fwd: A Response to the Disaster--Miami Herald]
Date: Mon, 17 Sep 2001 08:41:09 -0700
From: Tom Millman <tmillman(at)pcm3.com>
Subject: [Fwd: Fwd: A Response to the Disaster--Miami Herald]
I thought this was pretty good.
Me
From: "david watson" <davidc_watson(at)hotmail.com>
Subject: Fwd: A Response to the Disaster--Miami Herald
Date: Mon, 17 Sep 2001 08:18:18 -0700
>From: Wayne Watson <mtnviews(at)earthlink.net>
>Subject: A Response to the Disaster--Miami Herald
>Date: Fri, 14 Sep 2001 13:31:33 -0700
>
>Leonard Pitts, Jr. - Miami Herald
>
>Published Wednesday, September 12, 2001
>
>We'll go forward from this moment.
>
>It's my job to have something to say. They pay me to provide words
>that
>help make sense of that which troubles the American soul. But in this
>moment of airless shock when hot tears sting disbelieving eyes, the
>only thing I can find to say, the only words that seem to fit, must be
>
>addressed to the unknown author of this suffering.
>
>You monster. You beast. You unspeakable bastard. What lesson did you
>hope to teach us by your coward's attack on our World Trade Center,
>our
>Pentagon, us? What was it you hoped we would learn? Whatever it was,
>please know that you failed.
>
>Did you want us to respect your cause? You just damned your cause.
>
>Did you want to make us fear? You just steeled our resolve.
>
>Did you want to tear us apart? You just brought us together.
>
>Let me tell you about my people. We are a vast and quarrelsome family,
>
>a family rent by racial, social, political and class division, but a
>family nonetheless. We're frivolous, yes, capable of expending
>tremendous emotional energy on pop cultural minutiae -- a singer's
>revealing dress, a ball team's misfortune, a cartoon mouse. We're
>wealthy, too, spoiled by the ready availability of trinkets and
>material
>goods, and maybe because of that, we walk through life with a certain
>sense of blithe entitlement.
>
>We are fundamentally decent, though -- peace-loving and compassionate.
>
>We struggle to know the right thing and to do it. And we are, the
>overwhelming majority of us, people of faith, believers in a just and
>loving God.
>
>Some people -- you, perhaps -- think that any or all of this makes us
>weak. You're mistaken. We are not weak. Indeed, we are strong in ways
>that cannot be measured by arsenals.
>
>IN PAIN
>
>Yes, we're in pain now. We are in mourning and we are in shock. We're
>still grappling with the unreality of the awful thing you did, still
>working to make ourselves understand that this isn't a special effect
>from some Hollywood blockbuster, isn't the plot development from a Tom
>
>Clancy novel. Both in terms of the awful scope of their ambition and
>the
>probable final death toll, your attacks are likely to go down as the
>worst acts of terrorism in the history of the United States and,
>probably, the history of the world. You've bloodied us as we have
>never
>been bloodied before.
>
>But there's a gulf of difference between making us bloody and making
>us
>fall. This is the lesson Japan was taught to its bitter sorrow the
>last
>time anyone hit us this hard, the last time anyone brought us such
>abrupt and monumental pain. When roused, we are righteous in our
>outrage, terrible in our force. When provoked by this level of
>barbarism, we will bear any suffering, pay any cost, go to any length,
>
>in the pursuit of justice.
>
>I tell you this without fear of contradiction. I know my people, as
>you, I think, do not. What I know reassures me. It also causes me to
>tremble with dread of the future.
>
>In the days to come, there will be recrimination and accusation,
>fingers pointing to determine whose failure allowed this to happen and
>
>what can be done to prevent it from happening again. There will be
>heightened security, misguided talk of revoking basic freedoms.
>
>We'll go forward from this moment sobered, chastened, sad. But
>determined, too. Unimaginably determined.
>
>THE STEEL IN US
>
>You see, the steel in us is not always readily apparent. That aspect
>of
>our character is seldom understood by people who don't know us well.
>On
>this day, the family's bickering is put on hold.
>
>As Americans we will weep, as Americans we will mourn, and as
>Americans, we will rise in defense of all that we cherish.
>
>So I ask again: What was it you hoped to teach us?
>
>It occurs to me that maybe you just wanted us to know the depths of
>your
>hatred. If that's the case, consider the message received.
>
>And take this message in exchange: You don't know my people. You don't
>
>know what we're capable of.
>
>You don't know what you just started.
>
>But you're about to learn.
>
>--
> Wayne T. Watson (121.015 Deg. W, 39.262 Deg. N, 2,701
>feet)
>
> "I couldn't wait for success, so I went on ahead without
>it."
> -- Jonathan Winters (Comedian)
>
> Web Page: http://home.earthlink.net/~mtnviews
> Imaginarium Museum:
>http://home.earthlink.net/~mtnviews/imaginarium.html
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Gary & Sandi" <flying(at)3rivers.net> |
| Subject: | Re: RV9-List Digest: 1 Msgs - 09/17/01 |
Hi, Dennis. I think what you meant was, are the plans updated at the
time you buy them. Yes, plans revisions show on a new set, though there
may be a revision which came out shortly before your set was sent which
may not be on there. As Gary said, they don't send out revisions to
plans holders as they occur.
There is a web site which tries to list all RV plans revisions. Look at
http://www.metronet.com/~dreeves/plan_revisions/index.htm
Gary in Montana #90263, flaps
----- Original Message -----
From: <DThomas773(at)aol.com>
Sent: Sunday, September 16, 2001 10:43 PM
Subject: Re: RV9-List: Elevator Mac Trim Servo
>
> About plans. If you buy a current set of plans, are they updated to
reflect
> all the revisions or do you need to research all the published plan
> revisions and updates?
> Dennis Thomas
> #90164 Emp
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Steve Sampson" <SSampson.SLN21(at)london.edu> |
| Subject: | Help please - rivetting trailing edges |
I have to start rivetting the rudder and elevator trailing edges
together shortly. I have been putting it off because the directions
imply its a good place to go wrong! As I understand it, it is easy to
build in a curve to the traiing edge at this point if you dont do it
just right.
My question is this. When you hit the shop head of the rivet with the
gun does it tend to develop a concave or convex curve? Concave seems
obvious but is this correct? Any other tips with this step? I presume it
is also good to have the pressure turned down on the gun?
Steve
#90360
Rudder & elevator
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | tchoug <tchoug(at)micron.com> |
| Subject: | Help please - rivetting trailing edges |
Hello Steve,
When I first started riveting the trailing edge rivets, I wasn't pleased
with the results I was getting (although many people have good results). I
decided to see if I could squeeze these rivets instead of driving them. I
modified one of my rivet sets to match the angle of the AEX trailing edge
wedge. I clamped the trailing edge to my long straight angle iron along the
bench and pre-squeezed the rivets as far as I could with the standard flush
sets (I did this to prevent the angled set from folding the rivet over). I
then used the modified angle set to finish squeezing the rivets into the
dimples. While this isn't a direct answer to your question, it may be
something for you to consider.
You can see pictures and more info on this proces on my website at
www.toddhoug.com
Good Luck,
Todd Houg
Back to working on the wings
-----Original Message-----
From: Steve Sampson [mailto:SSampson.SLN21(at)london.edu]
Sent: Tuesday, September 18, 2001 2:12 PM
Subject: RV9-List: Help please - rivetting trailing edges
I have to start rivetting the rudder and elevator trailing edges
together shortly. I have been putting it off because the directions
imply its a good place to go wrong! As I understand it, it is easy to
build in a curve to the traiing edge at this point if you dont do it
just right.
My question is this. When you hit the shop head of the rivet with the
gun does it tend to develop a concave or convex curve? Concave seems
obvious but is this correct? Any other tips with this step? I presume it
is also good to have the pressure turned down on the gun?
Steve
#90360
Rudder & elevator
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Albert Gardner" <albert.gardner(at)worldnet.att.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Help please - rivetting trailing edges |
Steve-the RVator (3rd issue) has a short article on this. In case you don't
have it, essentially the technique described there was to bond the trailing
edge together with pro-seal and then set the rivets after the pro-seal has
cured. There's more to it so if you don't have the article, I'll copy it
and a-mail it to you. I used a flanging tool to put a slight bend in the
skin before riveting but still wasn't completely satisfied. The edge was
straight but with a little gap between the AEX wedge and the skin between
rivets. I don't think air pressure needs to be much reduced from what you
normally set AD3's at but-per the instructions-set them only halfway and
then turn the piece over to finish setting. Make sure you keep the mushroom
set flat against the skin.
Albert Gardner
Working on cabin
----- Original Message -----
From: "Steve Sampson" <SSampson.SLN21(at)london.edu>
> I have to start rivetting the rudder and elevator trailing edges
> together shortly. I have been putting it off because the directions
> imply its a good place to go wrong! As I understand it, it is easy to
> build in a curve to the traiing edge at this point if you dont do it
> just right.
> My question is this. When you hit the shop head of the rivet with the
> gun does it tend to develop a concave or convex curve? Concave seems
> obvious but is this correct? Any other tips with this step? I presume it
> is also good to have the pressure turned down on the gun?
> Steve
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Albert Gardner" <albert.gardner(at)worldnet.att.net> |
| Subject: | Re: RV9-List Digest: 1 Msgs - 09/17/01 |
----- Original Message -----
From: "Gary & Sandi" <flying(at)3rivers.net>
> Hi, Dennis. I think what you meant was, are the plans updated at the
> time you buy them.
I think the revisions lag the know errors by a considerable amount of time.
The web pages show the revisions from the RVator but several lusters have
indicated know errors that have not been corrected for some months. I would
say the emp and wing kit seem pretty free from unreported/uncorrected errors
but the fuse and finish kits are not that well double-checked by builders
yet.
Albert Gardner
working on cabin
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Gary Newsted" <fcs(at)jlc.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Help please - rivetting trailing edges |
I took great care in riveting my elevator trailing edges. I used a
1/2" thick sheet of steel as the back-riveting anvil, I weighted the
upper surface and clamped it solid and straight. The trailing edges
came out beautiful,,,, but not "true". When I hung the hinges on
the horizontal stabilizer, my beautifully straight elevators were
trailing off in opposite directions by about a quarter inch each!
No amount of wishing would cure the problem, so I ended up
drilling out the entire trailing edge and re-riveting it WHILE HINGED
TO THE HS! I stood the HS on its nose in the jigs, aligned the
trailing edges using the long angles that come in the wing kit and
a zillion clamps, and riveted again in the air rather than on a table.
I'm happy to say they're now perfect. I have adopted the technique
of closing trailing edges while attached to the surfaces. This has
worked well on both flaps and ailerons.
There is merit to the RVator article about bonding the seams before
riveting, particularly on the rudder with its thin skin. My rudder came
out OK (purely by accident I assure you), but I chose to cover the
entire trailing edge with a thin (.020) U-channel I had custom made. Not
only is it straight and strong, but it looks a whole lot better. I was
going to do the same on all the control surfaces, but only the rudder
seemed to warant it.
Gary
----- Original Message -----
From: Steve Sampson <SSampson.SLN21(at)london.edu>
Sent: Tuesday, September 18, 2001 3:12 PM
Subject: RV9-List: Help please - rivetting trailing edges
>
> I have to start rivetting the rudder and elevator trailing edges
> together shortly. I have been putting it off because the directions
> imply its a good place to go wrong! As I understand it, it is easy to
> build in a curve to the traiing edge at this point if you dont do it
> just right.
>
> My question is this. When you hit the shop head of the rivet with the
> gun does it tend to develop a concave or convex curve? Concave seems
> obvious but is this correct? Any other tips with this step? I presume it
> is also good to have the pressure turned down on the gun?
>
> Steve
> #90360
> Rudder & elevator
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jones" <esnj(at)granbury.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Help please - rivetting trailing edges |
Steve: I alternated the direction of the rivets on my rudder. One with the
shop head to the right, the next with the shop head to the left, and so on.
There was no warping at all.
Richard Jones 90062
----- Original Message -----
From: "Steve Sampson" <SSampson.SLN21(at)london.edu>
Sent: Tuesday, September 18, 2001 2:12 PM
Subject: RV9-List: Help please - rivetting trailing edges
>
> I have to start rivetting the rudder and elevator trailing edges
> together shortly. I have been putting it off because the directions
> imply its a good place to go wrong! As I understand it, it is easy to
> build in a curve to the traiing edge at this point if you dont do it
> just right.
>
> My question is this. When you hit the shop head of the rivet with the
> gun does it tend to develop a concave or convex curve? Concave seems
> obvious but is this correct? Any other tips with this step? I presume it
> is also good to have the pressure turned down on the gun?
>
> Steve
> #90360
> Rudder & elevator
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jeff" <jskitte1(at)midsouth.rr.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Help please - rivetting trailing edges |
I also alternated rivets along the trailing edge of the 9 rudder
using modified dies in my squeazer (ground to the correct angle). Came
out perfectly straight.
Jeff
9A empennage
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | DThomas773(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Help please - rivetting trailing edges |
I just finished my rudder last week. I had not read any posts about the
problems everyone has been having. I just followed the directions and I got
lucky. Straight as an arrow.
Dennis Thomas
9-A emp # 90164
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Mark Schrimmer <mschrimmer(at)pacbell.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Hexagonal flap linkage |
on 9/17/01 6:02 PM, Gary Newsted at fcs(at)jlc.net wrote:
>I was kit 59, and have seen two desirable modifications, an extruded tie-down
part, and the hexagonal flap linkage extrusions.
Gary,
What's the hexagonal flap linlkage and what parts does it replace in the
early kits? Is this part of the wing kit or the fuse kit?
Mark Schrimmer
Irvine, CA
Very slowly building kit #90002
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Steve Sampson" <SSampson.SLN21(at)london.edu> |
| Subject: | Re: Help please - rivetting trailing edges |
Albert - if you could send me the article I would be very grateful. I take
it you have a scanner? I have ordered a subscription to RVATOR but have
nothing yet. Also can you descrbe what Proseal is. (It probably sells so
well in Yorkshire no one buys it! If your not Albert dont expect to
understand that one.) Is it a black rubbery adhesive like the original
Bostick?
Thanks so much, Steve.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Albert Gardner" <albert.gardner(at)worldnet.att.net>
Sent: Wednesday, September 19, 2001 12:13 AM
Subject: Re: RV9-List: Help please - rivetting trailing edges
>
> Steve-the RVator (3rd issue) has a short article on this. In case you
don't
> have it, essentially the technique described there was to bond the
trailing
> edge together with pro-seal and then set the rivets after the pro-seal has
> cured. There's more to it so if you don't have the article, I'll copy it
> and a-mail it to you. I used a flanging tool to put a slight bend in the
> skin before riveting but still wasn't completely satisfied. The edge was
> straight but with a little gap between the AEX wedge and the skin between
> rivets. I don't think air pressure needs to be much reduced from what you
> normally set AD3's at but-per the instructions-set them only halfway and
> then turn the piece over to finish setting. Make sure you keep the
mushroom
> set flat against the skin.
> Albert Gardner
> Working on cabin
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Steve Sampson" <SSampson.SLN21(at)london.edu>
> > I have to start rivetting the rudder and elevator trailing edges
> > together shortly. I have been putting it off because the directions
> > imply its a good place to go wrong! As I understand it, it is easy to
> > build in a curve to the traiing edge at this point if you dont do it
> > just right.
> > My question is this. When you hit the shop head of the rivet with the
> > gun does it tend to develop a concave or convex curve? Concave seems
> > obvious but is this correct? Any other tips with this step? I presume it
> > is also good to have the pressure turned down on the gun?
> > Steve
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Steve Sampson" <SSampson.SLN21(at)london.edu> |
| Subject: | Re: Help please - rivetting trailing edges |
Guys, this email group is great. Everyone is so helpful. Thanks. The best is
that I put my questions on in the evening in England, and while I am
sleeping you are all typing in really helpful input for me waiting in the
morning!
My conclusion is that there is no one way to do it. Thoughtfully and slowly
is key though. No one indicated they had a problem with the manufactured
head tilting over and settling into its dimple. The key is to ensure the
trailing edge does not bend as you do it. Presumably it develops a concave
bend which can be rectified by a tap from the other side.
On the elevator why rivet the trailing edge BEFORE the skin lower spar
junction. Any reason for this?
As soon as my new squeezer head arrives so I can complete the tip rib rivets
I will get on with the trailing edges. Unfourtunatly some nasty Arabs have
delayed it.
Steve
#90360
N Yorks, UK
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | PERRYMAN Larry <Larry.PERRYMAN(at)atofina.com> |
| Subject: | Help please - rivetting trailing edges |
Steve,
ProSeal is a tank sealer used for the gas tanks. It can be purchased from
Wicks Aircraft(www.wicksaircraft.com). Part Number PS890B2-PT on page 092 of
the online catalog. They will ship with a credit card purchase, either
online or on the phone. They have been good on shipments for me.
Regards
Larry Perryman
90288 N194DL Reserved
Conroe, Tx
Fuselage
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Albert Gardner" <albert.gardner(at)worldnet.att.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Help please - rivetting trailing edges |
Steve:
The article went directly to you. Proseal is a brand name of fuel tank
sealant (the black, sticky, stinky stuff we all complain about that you will
use to seal your leading edge tanks.) Happy building.
Albert
----- Original Message -----
From: "Steve Sampson"
Also can you descrbe what Proseal is
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Gary Newsted" <fcs(at)jlc.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Hexagonal flap linkage |
Last months RVator has the article about the flap linkages. There has been
some question about the integrity of the one in the kit. It is made out of a
fairly thin-walled aluminum tubing that you had to end-drill and tap. I didn't
like the looks of it. Turns out, neither does Vans. They offer an upgrade
(part number VA-256) for $24 that replaces them with extruded and threaded
hex stock. A must!
Gary
----- Original Message -----
From: Mark Schrimmer <mschrimmer(at)pacbell.net>
Sent: Wednesday, September 19, 2001 12:48 PM
Subject: Re: RV9-List: Hexagonal flap linkage
>
> on 9/17/01 6:02 PM, Gary Newsted at fcs(at)jlc.net wrote:
>
> >I was kit 59, and have seen two desirable modifications, an extruded tie-down
> part, and the hexagonal flap linkage extrusions.
>
>
> Gary,
>
> What's the hexagonal flap linlkage and what parts does it replace in the
> early kits? Is this part of the wing kit or the fuse kit?
>
> Mark Schrimmer
> Irvine, CA
> Very slowly building kit #90002
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Gene" <gene(at)nvaircraft.com> |
The plans give no specific instructions for locating the rudder pedals
other than no closer than 3".
Question? How far aft can I go to allow for any future adjustment? I am
5"8" tall
Gene 90296 Fuse... the canoe rolled over !
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | barry pote <barrypote(at)home.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Rudder Pedals |
Gene, I don't know if what I did is going to work out, as I have not set
in it yet. I am 51 10" or there abouts, about like you. I figured if all
the way forward (min 3") is meant for 6'5" people, I would start at the
other end and leave extra holes for 'getting taller'.
Note, it is hard to use the same holes (front hole becomes a rear hole,
when adjusting forward) as the end blocks center to center of the holes
is different length than the center blocks. I think I spaced my holes
about 3/4" apart. Do it on paper before doing it to metal.
Barry RV9a fuselage (going back together for the final time!)
> Question? How far aft can I go to allow for any future adjustment? I am
> 5"8" tall
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Gene" <gene(at)nvaircraft.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Rudder Pedals |
Barry, Do you remember about how far back you went??
Gene
----- Original Message -----
From: "barry pote" <barrypote(at)home.com>
Sent: Saturday, September 22, 2001 11:24 AM
Subject: Re: RV9-List: Rudder Pedals
>
> Gene, I don't know if what I did is going to work out, as I have not set
> in it yet. I am 51 10" or there abouts, about like you. I figured if all
> the way forward (min 3") is meant for 6'5" people, I would start at the
> other end and leave extra holes for 'getting taller'.
>
> Note, it is hard to use the same holes (front hole becomes a rear hole,
> when adjusting forward) as the end blocks center to center of the holes
> is different length than the center blocks. I think I spaced my holes
> about 3/4" apart. Do it on paper before doing it to metal.
>
> Barry RV9a fuselage (going back together for the final time!)
>
>
> > Question? How far aft can I go to allow for any future adjustment? I am
> > 5"8" tall
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | barry pote <barrypote(at)home.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Rudder Pedals |
The center support bracket determined how far I could go. I started at
the extreme, but I repeat, I made a guess that I was on the extreme end
of then curve (short and kinda stumpy). I do not know if I made the
correct choice.
Barry
Gene wrote:
>
>
> Barry, Do you remember about how far back you went??
> Gene
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "barry pote" <barrypote(at)home.com>
> To:
> Sent: Saturday, September 22, 2001 11:24 AM
> Subject: Re: RV9-List: Rudder Pedals
>
> >
> > Gene, I don't know if what I did is going to work out, as I have not set
> > in it yet. I am 51 10" or there abouts, about like you. I figured if all
> > the way forward (min 3") is meant for 6'5" people, I would start at the
> > other end and leave extra holes for 'getting taller'.
> >
> > Note, it is hard to use the same holes (front hole becomes a rear hole,
> > when adjusting forward) as the end blocks center to center of the holes
> > is different length than the center blocks. I think I spaced my holes
> > about 3/4" apart. Do it on paper before doing it to metal.
> >
> > Barry RV9a fuselage (going back together for the final time!)
> >
> >
> > > Question? How far aft can I go to allow for any future adjustment? I am
> > > 5"8" tall
> >
> >
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Albert Gardner" <albert.gardner(at)worldnet.att.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Rudder Pedals |
I have just gone through this stage of construction (or is it destruction)
to my plane. You can only put the rudder bars as far aft as the hanger
which attaches to the firewall will allow. Like Barry, I wanted to use a few
holes as possible . Since the hole centers on the outside blocks are
3-1/4", I made 7 holes 1-1/12" apart which gives me a maximum of 3-1/4" of
adjustment. Even though the hole centers on the center bracket are slightly
different it was ok. The good part now is that in addition to where you put
the tops of the rudder bars the link you use to connect the rudder bars to
the rudder cables will also control how far forward or aft your pedals are.
I made those links an inch longer than I needed with holes every 1/2" so I
think there will be plenty of adjustment. I was trying to get the toe brake
at a "just right" angle. BTW, I am 5' 11".
I used a 2" thick piece of Styrofoam as a seat and back cushion but when I
sat in the cockpit with the seat as far back as it would go I felt that the
stick was uncomfortably far back in my crotch. This probably won't be a
factor for most of you but in my case...
There is no connection between left and right pedals except through the
rudder, in other word both cables could be slack on the ground allowing the
rudder to dance in the breeze. I have thought about putting return springs
from the pedal to the firewall.
Albert Gardner
God Bless America
----- Original Message -----
From: "barry pote" <barrypote(at)home.com>
Sent: Saturday, September 22, 2001 11:24 AM
Subject: Re: RV9-List: Rudder Pedals
>
> Gene, I don't know if what I did is going to work out, as I have not set
> in it yet. I am 51 10" or there abouts, about like you. I figured if all
> the way forward (min 3") is meant for 6'5" people, I would start at the
> other end and leave extra holes for 'getting taller'.
>
> Note, it is hard to use the same holes (front hole becomes a rear hole,
> when adjusting forward) as the end blocks center to center of the holes
> is different length than the center blocks. I think I spaced my holes
> about 3/4" apart. Do it on paper before doing it to metal.
>
> Barry RV9a fuselage (going back together for the final time!)
>
>
> > Question? How far aft can I go to allow for any future adjustment? I am
> > 5"8" tall
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Im7shannon(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Rudder Pedals |
In a message dated 9/22/01 3:27:19 PM, albert.gardner(at)worldnet.att.net writes:
>
>There is no connection between left and right pedals except through the
>rudder, in other word both cables could be slack on the ground allowing
>the
>rudder to dance in the breeze. I have thought about putting return springs
>from the pedal to the firewall.
>
>Albert Gardner
>God Bless America
Al, right after I landed from my maiden voyage, an idiot in a murphy blasted
me with his propwash when he taxied away and slammed my rudder into the
elevator so hard it deflected enough to make a little dent in the rudder.
Normally, the stops keep it from hitting the elevators by an inch or so. Some
cessna type springs would be a good idea I think. A good fix might be to weld
a piece of flatbar on the horizontal rudder pedal tube which would extend
upwards, and running the springs forward to the sub panel. This would allow
for a longer spring and would be out of sight.
Kevin in WA
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Dave Nicholson" <dnick2(at)home.com> |
| Subject: | Sealant for Wing Tank Drain Valve |
What is the recommend sealer for the Wing Tank Drain Valves? (Pipe Dope,
Teflon Tape, ProSeal ???)
Dave Nicholson
Danville, IL
Wings
90347
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Paul Besing" <azpilot(at)extremezone.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Sealant for Wing Tank Drain Valve |
Fuel lube. It's a snot like substance that you are supposed to use on all
fuel fittings, including hose. Do not use Teflon tape. If you use proseal
I can't imagine what would happen if you had to replace the valve.
Paul Besing
RV-6A N197AB Arizona
http://www.lacodeworks.com/besing
Flying
Kitlog Pro Builder's Log Software
http://www.kitlog.com
----- Original Message -----
From: "Dave Nicholson" <dnick2(at)home.com>
Sent: Saturday, September 22, 2001 9:26 PM
Subject: RV9-List: Sealant for Wing Tank Drain Valve
What is the recommend sealer for the Wing Tank Drain Valves? (Pipe Dope,
Teflon Tape, ProSeal ???)
Dave Nicholson
Danville, IL
Wings
90347
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Cy Galley" <cgalley(at)qcbc.org> |
| Subject: | Re: Sealant for Wing Tank Drain Valve |
Never Teflon tape on any aircraft fitting!
Cy Galley, TC - Chair, Emergency Aircraft Repair, Oshkosh
Editor, EAA Safety Programs
cgalley(at)qcbc.org or experimenter(at)eaa.org
http://www.eaa.org for latest flying rules
----- Original Message -----
From: "Dave Nicholson" <dnick2(at)home.com>
Sent: Saturday, September 22, 2001 11:26 PM
Subject: RV9-List: Sealant for Wing Tank Drain Valve
What is the recommend sealer for the Wing Tank Drain Valves? (Pipe Dope,
Teflon Tape, ProSeal ???)
Dave Nicholson
Danville, IL
Wings
90347
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | ET - #PU <psi(at)hillweb.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Sealant for Wing Tank Drain Valve |
Never say Never !
Could you explain details on using Teflon tape?
If not use Teflon tape, what need to be used?
Thanks
Vlad
>
>Never Teflon tape on any aircraft fitting!
>
>Cy Galley, TC - Chair, Emergency Aircraft Repair, Oshkosh
>Editor, EAA Safety Programs
>cgalley(at)qcbc.org or experimenter(at)eaa.org
>http://www.eaa.org for latest flying rules
>
>----- Original Message -----
>From: "Dave Nicholson" <dnick2(at)home.com>
>To:
>Sent: Saturday, September 22, 2001 11:26 PM
>Subject: RV9-List: Sealant for Wing Tank Drain Valve
>
>
>What is the recommend sealer for the Wing Tank Drain Valves? (Pipe Dope,
>Teflon Tape, ProSeal ???)
>
>Dave Nicholson
>Danville, IL
>Wings
>90347
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Paul Besing" <azpilot(at)extremezone.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Sealant for Wing Tank Drain Valve |
Teflon tape is used for sealing water and air fittings. Aircraft fuel,
brake fluid, and oil will deteriorate the Teflon and could ruin your day.
When sealing any fitting, you should use fuel lube, bakerseal, or something
similar. Fuel Lube is the preferred product. It's cheap, lasts forever,
lubes well for installation, and is used on the certified birds.
Paul Besing
RV-6A N197AB Arizona
http://www.lacodeworks.com/besing
Flying
Kitlog Pro Builder's Log Software
http://www.kitlog.com
----- Original Message -----
From: "ET - #PU" <psi(at)hillweb.com>
Sent: Sunday, September 23, 2001 5:15 AM
Subject: Re: RV9-List: Sealant for Wing Tank Drain Valve
Never say Never !
Could you explain details on using Teflon tape?
If not use Teflon tape, what need to be used?
Thanks
Vlad
>
>Never Teflon tape on any aircraft fitting!
>
>Cy Galley, TC - Chair, Emergency Aircraft Repair, Oshkosh
>Editor, EAA Safety Programs
>cgalley(at)qcbc.org or experimenter(at)eaa.org
>http://www.eaa.org for latest flying rules
>
>----- Original Message -----
>From: "Dave Nicholson" <dnick2(at)home.com>
>To:
>Sent: Saturday, September 22, 2001 11:26 PM
>Subject: RV9-List: Sealant for Wing Tank Drain Valve
>
>
>What is the recommend sealer for the Wing Tank Drain Valves? (Pipe Dope,
>Teflon Tape, ProSeal ???)
>
>Dave Nicholson
>Danville, IL
>Wings
>90347
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Cy Galley" <cgalley(at)qcbc.org> |
| Subject: | Sealant for Wing Tank Drain Valve |
----- Original Message -----
From: "Cy Galley" <cgalley(at)qcbc.org>
Sent: Sunday, September 23, 2001 10:51 AM
Subject: Re: RV9-List: Sealant for Wing Tank Drain Valve
Never say Never!
Always say NEVER for aircraft use. There are many better sealants which
will not cause the problems associated with Teflon tape. Even ordinary pipe
dope is better. One can get pipe dope with Teflon, but since it has finely
ground particles, this Teflon does not pose the hazards of Teflon tape.
Why, when Teflon tape easily seals very well? Serious Problems from poor
installation and even worse; re-installation; even if done correctly.
The problem is Teflon tape is insoluble and either sheds large pieces when
installed incorrectly or when a fitting is removed and re-installed. When
re-installed, the old tape pieces are shoved into the system as the fitting
is threaded back in. Remember, these pieces are insoluble in oil or fuel.
These pieces have a well known history of going down stream in a fuel, oil,
or vacuum system and causing damage.
or Bakerseal. Even then, don't over apply and keep the sealer off the first
thread of the male fitting when applying.
BUT NEVER use Teflon Tape on aircraft fittings.
Cy Galley, TC - Chair, Emergency Aircraft Repair, Oshkosh
Editor, EAA Safety Programs
cgalley(at)qcbc.org or experimenter(at)eaa.org
http://www.eaa.org for latest flying rules
----- Original Message -----
From: "ET - #PU" <psi(at)hillweb.com>
Sent: Sunday, September 23, 2001 7:15 AM
Subject: Re: RV9-List: Sealant for Wing Tank Drain Valve
Never say Never !
Could you explain details on using Teflon tape?
If not use Teflon tape, what need to be used?
Thanks
Vlad
>
>Never Teflon tape on any aircraft fitting!
>
>Cy Galley, TC - Chair, Emergency Aircraft Repair, Oshkosh
>Editor, EAA Safety Programs
>cgalley(at)qcbc.org or experimenter(at)eaa.org
>http://www.eaa.org for latest flying rules
>
>----- Original Message -----
>From: "Dave Nicholson" <dnick2(at)home.com>
>To:
>Sent: Saturday, September 22, 2001 11:26 PM
>Subject: RV9-List: Sealant for Wing Tank Drain Valve
>
>
>What is the recommend sealer for the Wing Tank Drain Valves? (Pipe Dope,
>Teflon Tape, ProSeal ???)
>
>Dave Nicholson
>Danville, IL
>Wings
>90347
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | owner-rv9-list-server(at)matronics.com |
| Subject: | !!new RV messageboard!! |
To the best of my knowledge the RV community has not untill now had a
"real" messageboard.
So I started one!
you can access it here
http://www.flugfelagid.com/ffmessageb/ubbcgi/ultimatebb.cgi
or go through our web www.flugfelagid.com (on the menu click
messageboard and it opens in a separate window)
I hope in time it will be frequented and thus become highly useful and
entertaining for everyone.
To post you will need to register.
Thor Hardarson
Iceland
Building a RV-9 empennage
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Albert Gardner" <albert.gardner(at)worldnet.att.net> |
| Subject: | Roll Bar Location |
I am installing the roll bar and find that the welded flanges on the bottom
of the roll bar are not the same on each side. On the left side, the roll
bar is very close to the aft end of the flange but on the right side, the
roll bar is about 1/8" farther forward. All of the dimensions on the plans
refer to the flanges themselves to locate attaching bolts. Is the roll bar
being just a little off going to be a problem?
Albert Gardner
God Bless America
________________________________________________________________________________
Message-ID: <001f01c1456d$658ee560$dda12b04@vz.dsl.genuity.net>
ene"
Date: Mon, 24 Sep 2001 19:54:28 -0700
What are your thoughts on insulating the belly and firewall of the rv's.
I will defiantly insulate the firewall but I am unsure on the benefits
of doing the area under the seats and the baggage area.
Any comments?
ene 90296
________________________________________________________________________________
From what I've read on the list, lots of folks have put insulation under the
footwell in order to reduce noise. I don't think it's common to put
insulation under the seats, tho.
Ed Winne
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jones" <esnj(at)granbury.com> |
----- Original Message -----
From: <Ewinne(at)aol.com>
Subject: RV9-List: insulation
>
>
>
> >From what I've read on the list, lots of folks have put insulation under
the
> footwell in order to reduce noise. I don't think it's common to put
> insulation under the seats, tho.
>
> Ed Winne
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jones" <esnj(at)granbury.com> |
I've heard that noise from exhaust and prop pulsations is a problem. I have
cut 4 pieces of 3/8" plywood that I will glue in place. Richard Jones
90062
----- Original Message -----
From: <Ewinne(at)aol.com>
Subject: RV9-List: insulation
>
>
>
> >From what I've read on the list, lots of folks have put insulation under
the
> footwell in order to reduce noise. I don't think it's common to put
> insulation under the seats, tho.
>
> Ed Winne
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Mark Schrimmer <mschrimmer(at)pacbell.net> |
on 9/25/01 10:36 AM, Jones at esnj(at)granbury.com wrote:
>
> I've heard that noise from exhaust and prop pulsations is a problem. I have
> cut 4 pieces of 3/8" plywood that I will glue in place. Richard Jones
> 90062
>
>
Plywood for sound insulation? Why not use one of the traditional aircraft
sound-insulating materials?
Mark Schrimmer
RV-9A #90002
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jones" <esnj(at)granbury.com> |
Your feet rest on this area and I was afraid that maybe my feet or the
scared passenger's feet might tear up sound insulating materials. I painted
the plywood to match the interior and will probably use the same adhesive to
attach it that I got from AS for attaching the thermal insulation on the
back of the firewall. Richard Jones 90062
----- Original Message -----
From: "Mark Schrimmer" <mschrimmer(at)pacbell.net>
Subject: Re: RV9-List: insulation
>
> on 9/25/01 10:36 AM, Jones at esnj(at)granbury.com wrote:
>
> >
> > I've heard that noise from exhaust and prop pulsations is a problem. I
have
> > cut 4 pieces of 3/8" plywood that I will glue in place. Richard Jones
> > 90062
> >
> >
> Plywood for sound insulation? Why not use one of the traditional aircraft
> sound-insulating materials?
>
> Mark Schrimmer
> RV-9A #90002
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "J R Saunders" <jr182pilot(at)home.com> |
Hi List,
I used MC ENSOLITE in my 182. Works very well on sound. I put it in where
ever the old glass was with 777 adhesive. You can get this stuff at a Rubber
supply. I bought 56"X180"X .38 was under $125.00
Good stuff.
J R....South...of.....SEATAC...in....the......FOG.
From: "Jones" <esnj(at)granbury.com>
Subject: Re: RV9-List: insulation
>
> Your feet rest on this area and I was afraid that maybe my feet or the
> scared passenger's feet might tear up sound insulating materials.
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Rudder Pedals |
Gene,
Wait to install the rudder pedals until you get the seats made. Then using
some pillows to simulate the seat upholstry, sit in it and adjust to your
liking. You can adjust a little later with the length of the rudder cables.
You may want to drill another set of holes too as Van's suggests.
--Dale
----- Original Message -----
From: "Gene" <gene(at)nvaircraft.com>
Subject: RV9-List: Rudder Pedals
>
> The plans give no specific instructions for locating the rudder pedals
> other than no closer than 3".
> Question? How far aft can I go to allow for any future adjustment? I am
> 5"8" tall
>
> Gene 90296 Fuse... the canoe rolled over !
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | DThomas773(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Fuel Tank Sealant |
Has someone come up with a simple, easy way to measure and mix this stuff? I
just mixed up a very small amount to seal the trailing edge of my elevator.
I tried measuring it with a measuring spoon and wound trying to count the
globs.
Dennis Thomas
9-A #90164
Emp
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Albert Gardner" <albert.gardner(at)worldnet.att.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Fuel Tank Sealant |
When I mixed up a large quantity of the stuff for my fuel tanks, I made a
simple balance beam that was 2" on one side of the pivot and 20" on the
other side (for a 10:1 ratio) but now when I mix up small amounts I use a
Popsicle stick and put 10 small blobs of 1 and 1 equally sized blob of the
other which has worked very well for me.
Albert Gardner
----- Original Message -----
From: <DThomas773(at)aol.com>
Subject: RV9-List: Fuel Tank Sealant
>
> Has someone come up with a simple, easy way to measure and mix this stuff?
I
> just mixed up a very small amount to seal the trailing edge of my
elevator.
> I tried measuring it with a measuring spoon and wound trying to count the
> globs.
> Dennis Thomas
> 9-A #90164
> Emp
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "John Oliveira" <oliveira(at)frontiernet.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Fuel Tank Sealant |
I use an electronic scale that is small and sensitive to the gram.
Weighs in grams or ounces. 1.Put a piece of cardboard or mixing cup on the
scale. 2. zero the scale 3. put a small amount of the black goop and read
the weight.
You can get very small quantities measured pretty accurately. 4. Multiply
the weight by 10, add that to the ammount on the scale and put the grey
stuff on until you reach the target wieght.
I have fond something better that is not as messy for bonding jobs that do
not involve fuel. 3m marine sealent, 5200. Comes in a tube, and bonds very
well. Comes in white or black and is permenent once cured. Cures much
faster than tank sealant. I used it on my trim tab foam ribs and it was
excellent. I also used to seal the ends of the trailing edges, but have not
felt the need to pre glue the whole thing. I have had very good results as
per the isntructions.
Just have the flaps left to do.
John Oliveira
90054
----- Original Message -----
From: "Albert Gardner" <albert.gardner(at)worldnet.att.net>
Subject: Re: RV9-List: Fuel Tank Sealant
>
> When I mixed up a large quantity of the stuff for my fuel tanks, I made a
> simple balance beam that was 2" on one side of the pivot and 20" on the
> other side (for a 10:1 ratio) but now when I mix up small amounts I use a
> Popsicle stick and put 10 small blobs of 1 and 1 equally sized blob of the
> other which has worked very well for me.
> Albert Gardner
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: <DThomas773(at)aol.com>
> To:
> Subject: RV9-List: Fuel Tank Sealant
>
>
> >
> > Has someone come up with a simple, easy way to measure and mix this
stuff?
> I
> > just mixed up a very small amount to seal the trailing edge of my
> elevator.
> > I tried measuring it with a measuring spoon and wound trying to count
the
> > globs.
> > Dennis Thomas
> > 9-A #90164
> > Emp
> >
> >
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Dave Nicholson" <dnick2(at)home.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Fuel Tank Sealant |
I bought a "cheap" Jeweler's Scale from Harbor Freight ($20).
http://www.harborfreight.com/cpi/ctaf/Displayitem.taf?itemnumber=42613
Dave Nicholson
Danville, IL
Finishing Wings
90347
----- Original Message -----
From: <DThomas773(at)aol.com>
Subject: RV9-List: Fuel Tank Sealant
>
> Has someone come up with a simple, easy way to measure and mix this stuff?
I
> just mixed up a very small amount to seal the trailing edge of my
elevator.
> I tried measuring it with a measuring spoon and wound trying to count the
> globs.
> Dennis Thomas
> 9-A #90164
> Emp
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Steve Sampson" <SSampson.SLN21(at)london.edu> |
| Subject: | Strobes & Wing levelers |
Gang! I'm planning ahead - pretty unusual around here!
I want to put a strobe at the top of the VS. Looking in the VANS
catalogue they seem to lean to the A650 though the A625 (from the
pictures) makes more sense. Has anyone been here already. Please advise.
I also want to install a wing leveller and presume the only way to go is
the Navaid Devices unit.
1. Is there a popular alternative?
2. Assuming Navaid Devices is there a 'standard' way to install
this?
a) So 'standard' Navaid do an install kit, or
b) Just an obvious way of making up brackets so it fits?
Comments please
Steve
RV9 #90360
Mostly on the elevator
North Yorks., UK.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Mike Nellis" <mnellis(at)peoplepc.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Strobes & Wing levelers |
Steve, I think the 625 is intended more for a rudder bottom installation
but there is certainly no reason why it couldn't be used on the VS. Take
a look here to see a nice job a VS Strobe installation.
http://bmnellis.com/BuilderIdeas/paul_golias_ideas.htm
Mike Nellis - http://bmnellis.com
Plainfield, IL
RV6 N699BM Reserved
Mounting Control Surfaces
Stinson 108-2 N9666K
----- Original Message -----
From: "Steve Sampson" <SSampson.SLN21(at)london.edu>
Subject: RV9-List: Strobes & Wing levelers
>
> Gang! I'm planning ahead - pretty unusual around here!
>
> I want to put a strobe at the top of the VS. Looking in the VANS
> catalogue they seem to lean to the A650 though the A625 (from the
> pictures) makes more sense. Has anyone been here already. Please advise.
>
> I also want to install a wing leveller and presume the only way to go is
> the Navaid Devices unit.
> 1. Is there a popular alternative?
> 2. Assuming Navaid Devices is there a 'standard' way to install
> this?
> a) So 'standard' Navaid do an install kit, or
> b) Just an obvious way of making up brackets so it fits?
> Comments please
>
> Steve
>
> RV9 #90360
> Mostly on the elevator
> North Yorks., UK.
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | PERRYMAN Larry <Larry.PERRYMAN(at)atofina.com> |
| Subject: | Strobes & Wing levelers |
Steve,
You may want to put a shield on the strobe so it does not flash down into
the cabin at night. I currently fly a Sundowner with a rotating light on the
VS. At night I can sometime see the light shining ahead of me. The high
intensity strobe "might" cause flicker vertigo if it were to shine into the
cabin. I put my white light on the rudder bottom. I do not have the strobe
but there are strobes that will go there. My strobes are in the wing tips
with just a white light behind. I mounted the power supplies in the first
inspection bay of the wing.
Navaids does not appear to have any competition at anywhere near the price.
I plan to install mine (when I get it) in the center section of the
fuselage. I talked to one builder that has installed the servo in the wing
and attached to the bell crank. Looks like there are a multitude of options.
I have a general question about this also.
Has anyone installed one and also installed the electric aileron trim?
Looks like things could get tight with both in the center section.
Regards
Larry Perryman
90288 N194DL reserved
Conroe, TX
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Dave Stewart" <davestewart(at)globalserve.net> |
| Subject: | heated pitot location |
What attachment rib are people selecting for a heated pitot on the 9A?
a)immediately inboard of the tiedown/access plate bay? (puts pitot about
6" inboard of tiedown)
b)next bay outboard? (putting it 10" or 19" out from tiedown, depending
on the rib you choose)
Thanks for any insight.
Dave, 90252
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Dave Nicholson" <dnick2(at)home.com> |
| Subject: | Re: heated pitot location |
Dave,
I put my Heated Pitot on the Outboard side of Rib #12 (Inboard most rib is
#1, Outboard most rib is #15).
This kept it close to the Outboard Inspection Plate, but away from the
Bellcrank mechanism. It is very easy to reach through the large forward
lightening hole for access to the fittings and electrical plug.
Dave Nicholson
Danville, IL
90347
Finishing Wings
----- Original Message -----
From: "Dave Stewart" <davestewart(at)globalserve.net>
Subject: RV9-List: heated pitot location
>
> What attachment rib are people selecting for a heated pitot on the 9A?
> a)immediately inboard of the tiedown/access plate bay? (puts pitot about
> 6" inboard of tiedown)
> b)next bay outboard? (putting it 10" or 19" out from tiedown, depending
> on the rib you choose)
> Thanks for any insight.
> Dave, 90252
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Mark Schrimmer <mschrimmer(at)pacbell.net> |
| Subject: | Re: heated pitot location |
on 9/28/01 4:05 PM, Dave Nicholson at dnick2(at)home.com wrote:
>
> Dave,
>
> I put my Heated Pitot on the Outboard side of Rib #12 (Inboard most rib is
> #1, Outboard most rib is #15).
>
Dave,
What type of heated pitot tube are you using?
Mark Schrimmer
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Dave Nicholson" <dnick2(at)home.com> |
| Subject: | Re: heated pitot location |
Mark,
I'm using an AN5814 Pitot/Static Tube with a Gretz Aero Mount. (I will put
an alternate Static Source in the fuselage also.)
Here is Warren Gretz's Web Page:
http://www.harborfreight.com/cpi/ctaf/Displayitem.taf?itemnumber=42613
Dave
----- Original Message -----
From: "Mark Schrimmer" <mschrimmer(at)pacbell.net>
Subject: Re: RV9-List: heated pitot location
>
> on 9/28/01 4:05 PM, Dave Nicholson at dnick2(at)home.com wrote:
>
> >
> > Dave,
> >
> > I put my Heated Pitot on the Outboard side of Rib #12 (Inboard most rib
is
> > #1, Outboard most rib is #15).
> >
> Dave,
>
> What type of heated pitot tube are you using?
>
> Mark Schrimmer
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Fabian Lefler" <fablef(at)bellsouth.net> |
| Subject: | Fuel Tank Sealer |
Dennis:
If you want to accurately mix the proseal, don't waste your time trying
to build inaccurate scales and alike. Instead, go to Target and buy a
digital kitchen scale. I just bought one for $29.99 which measures in
increments 0.1 ounces. It works like a charm and takes up almost no
room in the shop.
Fabian
RV-9A
90292
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Todd Houg <thoug(at)attglobal.net> |
| Subject: | heated pitot location |
Dave,
I mounted my pitot tube using the Gretz chrome mount on the inboard side
of the 10th rib. There's an access panel between the 8th and 9th
allowing relatively easy access. I ruled out the 11th rib because of
proximity to the tie down as you mention. My other choice was the 12th
rib like the other Dave mentioned, but I decided to keep it further
inboard. However, I wouldn't want to go any further inboard for fear of
getting into the prop wash.
When using the Gretz mount with the PH502-12cr(?) (heated pitot tube
without the static port), the connections are contained within the mount
and will not interfere with the aileron push rod.
Happy building,
Todd Houg
N194TH - reserved
-----Original Message-----
From: Dave Stewart [SMTP:davestewart(at)globalserve.net]
Subject: RV9-List: heated pitot location
What attachment rib are people selecting for a heated pitot on the 9A?
a)immediately inboard of the tiedown/access plate bay? (puts pitot about
6" inboard of tiedown)
b)next bay outboard? (putting it 10" or 19" out from tiedown, depending
on the rib you choose)
Thanks for any insight.
Dave, 90252
=
=
=
=
=
=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________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Dave Stewart" <davestewart(at)globalserve.net> |
| Subject: | Re: heated pitot location |
Mark
I'm using the pitot only (short) version from Gretz.
Dave Stewart
----- Original Message -----
From: "Mark Schrimmer" <mschrimmer(at)pacbell.net>
Subject: Re: RV9-List: heated pitot location
>
> on 9/28/01 4:05 PM, Dave Nicholson at dnick2(at)home.com wrote:
>
> >
> > Dave,
> >
> > I put my Heated Pitot on the Outboard side of Rib #12 (Inboard most rib
is
> > #1, Outboard most rib is #15).
> >
> Dave,
>
> What type of heated pitot tube are you using?
>
> Mark Schrimmer
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Haywire" <haywire(at)telus.net> |
| Subject: | Fuel Tank Sealant |
Hi Dennis;
The mixture amount is not crucial. Just mix in enough of the black stuff
to
make the white stuff dark grey (it doesn't take much) If you mix at a
perfect 10:1 ratio, you while use up all the curing agent (black) before you
are out of proseal.
The only difference you will find with the amount of curing agent is the
cure time (darker = faster, lighter = slower). Temperature will also affect
this. In fact proseal will eventually harden all by itself, with no curing
agent (not recommended), this is why it has a shelf life. As with any 2 part
mixture, too much catalyst with too fast of a cure will actually produce a
weaker product.
If you search the archives of the main RV list I'm sure you will find a
ton
of info there, as I recall it being discussed there. As a matter of fact I
remember one incident where a fellow got distracted by a phone call while he
was mixing and somehow didn't put in enough catalyst. He wrote into the list
crying about his very light grey proseal on his tank. It was recommended
that he just leave it and see what happened. About a week and a half later
he wrote back saying that it had hardened just like the darker stuff.
I recommend just mixing with the color method and you will find that
proseal is not as bad as many people say it is, as the mixing is possibly
the messiest part of using it. I have an extra can of it and use it many
other uses.
S. Todd Bartrim
13B RV-9
C-FSTB (reserved)
Finished Fuselage
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-rv9-list-server(at)matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-rv9-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of
> DThomas773(at)aol.com
> Sent: September 27, 2001 8:59 PM
> To: rv9-list(at)matronics.com
> Subject: RV9-List: Fuel Tank Sealant
>
>
> Has someone come up with a simple, easy way to measure and mix
> this stuff? I
> just mixed up a very small amount to seal the trailing edge of my
> elevator.
> I tried measuring it with a measuring spoon and wound trying to count the
> globs.
> Dennis Thomas
> 9-A #90164
> Emp
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Gene" <gene(at)nvaircraft.com> |
I am ready to rivet the aft deck (714) to the longerons. Should the
spacers F-711E @ F710C be also riveted at this time. Neither is
mentioned at this time in the manual.
Gene Park 90296 fuse making all the small parts
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Albert Gardner" <albert.gardner(at)worldnet.att.net> |
Gene, You have some HS and VS attach bolts which have to go thru some of the
holes so check your drawings carefully but, otherwise, you could put some
rivets in. I didn't-in fact my HS and VS are still attached with cleckos.
Albert Gardner
Yuma, AZ
Working on canopy
----- Original Message -----
From: "Gene" <gene(at)nvaircraft.com>
Subject: RV9-List: Help!!
>
> I am ready to rivet the aft deck (714) to the longerons. Should the
> spacers F-711E @ F710C be also riveted at this time. Neither is
> mentioned at this time in the manual.
>
> Gene Park 90296 fuse making all the small parts
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Gary Newsted" <fcs(at)jlc.net> |
The way I read it, the spacers definitely go in now. As Albert points out, keep
an eye on where the bolts belong. You have to drill through the spacer for the
HS attach angles and shims, see Detail B Sheet 27. The rear spacer is simply
riveted. It's great to see so many fuselage builders now! I've been slowed
down by this nasty habit called "work" lately, but it assures that the parts
boxes continue to arrive!
Gary
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Steve Sampson" <SSampson.SLN21(at)london.edu> |
| Subject: | Navaid in the wing? |
I am beginning to think beyond the emp kit since I only have one
elevator to go. (The trailing edges were easier than expected!)
I ordered a Navaid Devices wing leveller yesterday and am beginning to
think about where to put it. My thoughts are:
1) In the fuselage is out since it will have some small effect on the
elevator the way the rods lie.
2) The 'Sam Buchanan' wing tip installation looks really practical
except I dont like the long push rod and would feel the need to make it
quite beefy ( weight).
3) Inside the inspection hatch beside the bell crank looks perfect if it
all fits in. Which leads me to my QUESTION. Has anyone seen pictures of
such an RV9 installation, or other RV, if the crank / hatch layourt is
the same, on the web?
Also, I would welcome comments. Perhaps there is a fourth alternative?
Steve Sampson
RV9 #90360
One elevator complete, one to go.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Steve Sampson" <SSampson.SLN21(at)london.edu> |
| Subject: | VS / rudder fairings |
And another question.
I was looking at the fairings today (you can tell I am running out of
ally to rivet) and it looks as though without LOTS of work the tops of
the two fairings will not 'flow'. There seems to be a significant 'dip'
between the two. I have not installed the rudder on the VS yet but cant
see that this is going to change my perception. Has anyone been here
yet? It makes no sense since I see no reason why VANS would make other
than at least an approximately correct fairing.
Thanks, Steve.
Steve Sampson
RV9 #90360
One elevator complete, one to go.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Ted Brown" <tedbrown(at)osprey.net> |
Somewhere on the web I've seen a VOR antenna on the top of the vertical
stabilizer. Does anyone know of the website.
Ted
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Gene" <gene(at)nvaircraft.com> |
I am to the point of riveting on the side rails and see a potential
trap. Is there any reason that I could not rivet the 970 forward side
skin to the longeron at this time? (only in the area of the side rail !
) I would leave open the forward holes that would be used for the
forward top skin. These could be riveted later but it seems like it
would be easier to get the majority of them now.
Thanks Gene 90296
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Albert Gardner" <albert.gardner(at)worldnet.att.net> |
| Subject: | Re: 721B Side Rails |
That's what I did Gene. I finally got tired of having them stick in my gut
every time I leaned over the side. I'm not sure why this step is left out
of the construction manual. One other thing I just did was to modify the 2
floor ribs just outboard of the center ribs. They have you make a removable
piece so the control sick and linkage can go in from the top. After having
to disassemble all this 2 or 3 times and stand on my head to slip spacers
in, I modified the next rib outboard the same way. Now I can assemble the
whole thing on the bench and then just set it in place. Attach the push rod
and I'm done.
Albert
----- Original Message -----
From: "Gene" <gene(at)nvaircraft.com>
Subject: RV9-List: 721B Side Rails
>
> I am to the point of riveting on the side rails and see a potential
> trap. Is there any reason that I could not rivet the 970 forward side
> skin to the longeron at this time? (only in the area of the side rail !
> ) I would leave open the forward holes that would be used for the
> forward top skin. These could be riveted later but it seems like it
> would be easier to get the majority of them now.
>
> Thanks Gene 90296
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Gary & Sandi" <flying(at)3rivers.net> |
| Subject: | Re: RV9-List Digest: 5 Msgs - 10/03/01 |
Steve......I had to modify the fit of the vertical stab tip considerably
to get it to fair into the rudder tip. Mount your rudder to the stab,
and fit both tips at the same time. Try to adjust how far and at what
angle they go into the stab and counterbalance, to achieve a good line.
As I recall, I pretty much used the mold lines on the counterbalance,
and lowered the front of the stab tip maybe as much as a half inch. The
line is not perfect, but not bad.
If you want, I can send you a picture of how mine turned out. Let me
know.
Gary in Montana
90263 doing the last flap
From: "Steve Sampson" <SSampson.SLN21(at)london.edu>
Subject: RV9-List: VS / rudder fairings
And another question.
I was looking at the fairings today (you can tell I am running out of
ally to rivet) and it looks as though without LOTS of work the tops of
the two fairings will not 'flow'. There seems to be a significant
'dip'
between the two. I have not installed the rudder on the VS yet but
cant
see that this is going to change my perception. Has anyone been here
yet? It makes no sense since I see no reason why VANS would make other
than at least an approximately correct fairing.
Thanks, Steve.
Steve Sampson
RV9 #90360
One elevator complete, one to go.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Steve Sampson" <SSampson.SLN21(at)london.edu> |
| Subject: | Re: RV9-List Digest: 5 Msgs - 10/03/01 or VS / Rudder fairings |
Gary , Thanks for the reply. Yes you seem to have had the problem I have,
though Andy does not seem to have it. What you describe is about what I
expect to have to do. If you can send a picture I would be very pleased.
Like you, I find the counterbalance fairing makes sense, its the rudder
fairing which seems 'odd'.
Thanks again Steve.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Gary & Sandi" <flying(at)3rivers.net>
Subject: RV9-List: Re: RV9-List Digest: 5 Msgs - 10/03/01
>
> Steve......I had to modify the fit of the vertical stab tip considerably
> to get it to fair into the rudder tip. Mount your rudder to the stab,
> and fit both tips at the same time. Try to adjust how far and at what
> angle they go into the stab and counterbalance, to achieve a good line.
> As I recall, I pretty much used the mold lines on the counterbalance,
> and lowered the front of the stab tip maybe as much as a half inch. The
> line is not perfect, but not bad.
>
> If you want, I can send you a picture of how mine turned out. Let me
> know.
>
> Gary in Montana
> 90263 doing the last flap
> From: "Steve Sampson" <SSampson.SLN21(at)london.edu>
> Subject: RV9-List: VS / rudder fairings
>
>
>
> And another question.
>
> I was looking at the fairings today (you can tell I am running out of
> ally to rivet) and it looks as though without LOTS of work the tops of
> the two fairings will not 'flow'. There seems to be a significant
> 'dip'
> between the two. I have not installed the rudder on the VS yet but
> cant
> see that this is going to change my perception. Has anyone been here
> yet? It makes no sense since I see no reason why VANS would make other
> than at least an approximately correct fairing.
>
> Thanks, Steve.
>
> Steve Sampson
> RV9 #90360
> One elevator complete, one to go.
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | John Oliveira <oliveira(at)frontiernet.net> |
| Subject: | Re: VS / rudder fairings |
My fairings worked out great. Note: there is plenty of extra material
to be trimmed that if they are dry fitted before trimming, you they are
not even.
Mine fit so well I did not fiberglass, accept closing the rear of the
vertical and horizontal stab tips.
No bondo or fairing to the aluminum at all. the tranisiton is less
noticible than most skin transitions
John Oliveira
90054 - Wings almost done
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Gene" <gene(at)nvaircraft.com> |
| Subject: | Re: VS / rudder fairings |
By fairings I presume you guys are talking about the fiberglass tips etc. in
the empenage kit. My rudder top was about 1/4' too short, I added a peice
of 1/4' balsa then covered it with epoxy and microballons. Rudder bottom
very good . The elevator tips fit reasonabbly well no filler needed. The
forward tips on the elevator were another story. They have a compound shape
to them, look carefully at the prints. I used two pieces of the same balsa
to close in the trailing end and carefully sanded it to shape. A lot of work
but thet finally came out ok!
Gene Park 90296 finishing up the fuse
----- Original Message -----
From: "John Oliveira" <oliveira(at)frontiernet.net>
Subject: Re: RV9-List: VS / rudder fairings
>
> My fairings worked out great. Note: there is plenty of extra material
> to be trimmed that if they are dry fitted before trimming, you they are
> not even.
>
> Mine fit so well I did not fiberglass, accept closing the rear of the
> vertical and horizontal stab tips.
>
> No bondo or fairing to the aluminum at all. the tranisiton is less
> noticible than most skin transitions
>
> John Oliveira
> 90054 - Wings almost done
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | DThomas773(at)aol.com |
Hi Folks,
I have not seen a post on this site for week or longer. Evberything OK ?
Dennis Thomas
9A Emp
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Clifford Begnaud" <shoeless(at)barefootpilot.com> |
| Subject: | Re: test message |
Seems to be working just fine
cliff
>
> Hi Folks,
> I have not seen a post on this site for week or longer. Evberything OK ?
> Dennis Thomas
> 9A Emp
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | federigo(at)pacbell.net |
| Subject: | Re: test message |
Barbara from Vans called Friday to say that a QuickBuild kit was ready for
me. They originally said that it would arrive about December 1st.
Unfortunately my garage is still a mess and I am in the middle of replacing
dry-rotted siding on the house. So I will probably pass on this kit and wait
for the next delivery. Leland
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Steve Sampson" <SSampson.SLN21(at)london.edu> |
| Subject: | Electric Trim - snap bushing |
I have been so impressed with the completeness of the kit that I have
just spent nearly two hours looking for the SB-625-7 snap bushing that
the electric trim drive rod passes through. Out of interest did anyone
have this in their kit? Which bag? Presumably the electric trim hardware
bag - but not mine! I am 99.99% sure that it was short shipped if it was
meant to be included. Not a financial problem just interested to know!
Steve
#90360
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Ted Brown" <tedbrown(at)osprey.net> |
Just a note to let the Quick Build fans know that the kits are arriving.
I received mine Friday, Oct. 12th. The workmanship is great.
The inventory is another story. Slow but sure. So far I noticed that the
wing tips are missing... they were checked off on the packing slip. I'll
follow-up on any other missing pieces. Anyone receiving a QB RV9A please
let me know if you find any other parts missing.
Ted Brown
Emporia, Kansas.
tedbrown(at)osprey.net
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | gene(at)nvaircraft.com |
| Subject: | Electric Trim - snap bushing |
Steve, I just went thru the hardware bag for the elevator trim and I didn't find
any snap bushings. I have not installed the servo yet so everything was in
the box as it came from Vans. I do see on the plans were one is used for the shaft
and wires. I just bought some the other day I think about .10 ea. If you
are going to order some from Vans' you may want to order 18 of the SB625-8 and
use them when you are doing your fuselage instead of the -7 called for in the
plans.......much easier to get the rudder cables thru.
Gene 90296 Fuselage
Download NeoPlanet at http://www.neoplanet.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | DThomas773(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Electric Trim - snap bushing |
Interesting question. I recently spent a bunch of time looking for this snap
bushing and assuming that the kit being so complete and in my possesion for
more than a year that Imust have lost it. Ordered another from Van's. Cost
$.08 cents. Handling $2.50 plus postage. Week later I recive an envelope,
torn open and empty. Second try it got here. Had I known what it looked
like I probably would have picked up something at the hardware store or
fabricated something.
Dennis Thomas
90164
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Dave Nicholson" <dnick2(at)home.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Electric Trim - snap bushing |
Hi Steve,
I didn't get the Snap Bushing with my kit either. I wonder it is packed
with the Manual Trim Cable rather than with the Servo Kit, which would come
with the Fuselage if ordered with manual trim, although it is clearly called
out for both options?
According to DWG. 4, the end of the Servo Shaft, along with the wire bundle
goes through the hole. I'm thinking about providing a separate hole for the
wire bundle so there is no chance of pinching the wires with the threaded
shaft. A SB-625-4 should do the job and keep everything clear. I'll see
what Van's says about drilling another hole in the Spar.
Dave
#90347
----- Original Message -----
From: "Steve Sampson" <SSampson.SLN21(at)london.edu>
Subject: RV9-List: Electric Trim - snap bushing
>
> I have been so impressed with the completeness of the kit that I have
> just spent nearly two hours looking for the SB-625-7 snap bushing that
> the electric trim drive rod passes through. Out of interest did anyone
> have this in their kit? Which bag? Presumably the electric trim hardware
> bag - but not mine! I am 99.99% sure that it was short shipped if it was
> meant to be included. Not a financial problem just interested to know!
>
> Steve
> #90360
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jerry Vanatta" <jnv(at)home.com> |
| Subject: | Electric Trim - snap bushing |
I have had some of the same problems, and paid for some parts twice. I was
told they didn't make many mistakes. Wing kit due in this week.
Happy Building;
Jerry
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv9-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv9-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of Dave Nicholson
Subject: Re: RV9-List: Electric Trim - snap bushing
Hi Steve,
I didn't get the Snap Bushing with my kit either. I wonder it is packed
with the Manual Trim Cable rather than with the Servo Kit, which would come
with the Fuselage if ordered with manual trim, although it is clearly called
out for both options?
According to DWG. 4, the end of the Servo Shaft, along with the wire bundle
goes through the hole. I'm thinking about providing a separate hole for the
wire bundle so there is no chance of pinching the wires with the threaded
shaft. A SB-625-4 should do the job and keep everything clear. I'll see
what Van's says about drilling another hole in the Spar.
Dave
#90347
----- Original Message -----
From: "Steve Sampson" <SSampson.SLN21(at)london.edu>
Subject: RV9-List: Electric Trim - snap bushing
>
> I have been so impressed with the completeness of the kit that I have
> just spent nearly two hours looking for the SB-625-7 snap bushing that
> the electric trim drive rod passes through. Out of interest did anyone
> have this in their kit? Which bag? Presumably the electric trim hardware
> bag - but not mine! I am 99.99% sure that it was short shipped if it was
> meant to be included. Not a financial problem just interested to know!
>
> Steve
> #90360
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Tom" <treed(at)cinci.rr.com> |
| Subject: | Snap Bushing Info |
Folks,
I called about the same thing. Van's says the bushing comes with the
fuse kit since it is part of the push/connecting rods for control
surfaces. I wondered whether it could be installed after the elevator
was complete and apparently it can snap in from either side of the spar,
so there appears to be no problem.
Tom Reed
Cincinnati
N91TR
Emp almost complete
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Tom" <treed(at)cinci.rr.com> |
| Subject: | Elevator "warps" |
Hey Group!
Just complete the right elevator trailing edge. I can't remember who
suggested a 1/4" x 2" x 48" steel bar flat on the table but this was the
best advice I have gotten yet. The trailing edge is perfectly straight -
beautiful. I used the edge tool to add the slight bend on both top and
bottom edges before dimpling the holes and both edges closed together
beautifully. That's the good news. Thanks to whomever recommended the
bar.
Both top and bottom skins are flat and have no oil canning to speak of.
But, at the outboard edge where rib, trailing edge, and skin all come
together, the skins warp. It only happens about 3" from the outboard
edge and about 2" from the trailing edge. But it's enough to make the
skins buckle in the area between the trailing edge and the outboard rib.
I had a similar (but solved) problem inboard because the rib web was too
wide and caused the skins to bow out and then down to the trailing edge
instead of following the shape of the rib and airfoil. I "adjusted" this
by using a long flat piece of wood and persuading the rib to close more,
thereby letting the skins flow straight from the end of the rib to the
trailing edge. (The rib was already riveted to the skins)
Any ideas on how to eliminate the warp?
Thanks,
Tom Reed
N91TR
Cincinnati
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Steve Sampson" <SSampson.SLN21(at)london.edu> |
| Subject: | Re: Electric Trim - snap bushing |
Interesting how many responded to that! Thanks all.
Dave - I might also drill a hole if VANS says OK. Please let me know.
Also what sort of connector do people typically use to connect all those
little wires?
Thanks again, Steve.
#90360
L elevator
----- Original Message -----
From: "Dave Nicholson" <dnick2(at)home.com>
Subject: Re: RV9-List: Electric Trim - snap bushing
>
> Hi Steve,
>
> I didn't get the Snap Bushing with my kit either. I wonder it is packed
> with the Manual Trim Cable rather than with the Servo Kit, which would
come
> with the Fuselage if ordered with manual trim, although it is clearly
called
> out for both options?
>
> According to DWG. 4, the end of the Servo Shaft, along with the wire
bundle
> goes through the hole. I'm thinking about providing a separate hole for
the
> wire bundle so there is no chance of pinching the wires with the threaded
> shaft. A SB-625-4 should do the job and keep everything clear. I'll see
> what Van's says about drilling another hole in the Spar.
>
> Dave
> #90347
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Steve Sampson" <SSampson.SLN21(at)london.edu>
> To:
> Subject: RV9-List: Electric Trim - snap bushing
>
>
>
> >
> > I have been so impressed with the completeness of the kit that I have
> > just spent nearly two hours looking for the SB-625-7 snap bushing that
> > the electric trim drive rod passes through. Out of interest did anyone
> > have this in their kit? Which bag? Presumably the electric trim hardware
> > bag - but not mine! I am 99.99% sure that it was short shipped if it was
> > meant to be included. Not a financial problem just interested to know!
> >
> > Steve
> > #90360
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | PERRYMAN Larry <Larry.PERRYMAN(at)atofina.com> |
| Subject: | Electric Trim - snap bushing |
Steve,
I have been using a "Molex" connector .062 for plug connectors. You can get
them at a reasonable price from Mouser Electronics (www.mouser.com). They
are on page 185 of the catalog. About 1/4th the price from Vans or other
aviation suppliers. I ordered quantity 100 of the male and female pins to
use with the connectors ($7.00 per 100). I used the 2 and 3 pin types for
position and strobe lights in the wingtip. Makes a nice quick disconnect
when you take off the wingtip. I plan to use the "panel" type for the
connectors between the wing and fuselage since they will snap into a square
cutout. The only other option I have found is a "cannon" plug connector that
screws together and is water tight.
I also got the 9 pin type for the stick control buttons.
Butt splices can be had there also. The mouser part # for 26-22 gage(servo
wire)is 571-323994 and for 22-16 gage 571-34070
Regarding the electric trim, I drilled an additional 3/8 hole and put a
small bushing in that one for the wires for the servo. Did not think highly
of the wiring and a threaded rod in the same hole since the rod moves back
and forth. That looked like a bit of trouble waiting to happen.
You might want to check Mouser for snap bushings. I got some that fit a 3/8
hole that will allow at least 5 ea. 16 gauge wires through it or 1/4 inch
tubing.
Larry Perryman
90288 N194DL Reserved
Fuselage top skins
-----Original Message-----
From: Steve Sampson [mailto:SSampson.SLN21(at)london.edu]
Subject: Re: RV9-List: Electric Trim - snap bushing
Interesting how many responded to that! Thanks all.
Dave - I might also drill a hole if VANS says OK. Please let me know.
Also what sort of connector do people typically use to connect all those
little wires?
Thanks again, Steve.
#90360
L elevator
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Haywire" <haywire(at)telus.net> |
Hi Guys;
I'm about to do my brake lines and I've realized that I don't have
VA-118-1 brake hoses. The plans don't say "not supplied", however they
aren't mentioned on my inventory list either. I have even searched "The
List" on Van's site and they're not there either. Did anyone else get them
with their fuse kit?
I've ordered the Matco parking brake valve, so I was considering using
Chris Heitman's advice and using the smaller hoses, however I'd still like
to know if I was supposed to get hoses or not.
S. Todd Bartrim
13B RV-9
C-FSTB (reserved)
Fuselage
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jones" <esnj(at)granbury.com> |
They come with the Finish Kit. Richard Jones 90062
----- Original Message -----
From: "Haywire" <haywire(at)telus.net>
Subject: RV9-List: Brake Hose
>
> Hi Guys;
> I'm about to do my brake lines and I've realized that I don't have
> VA-118-1 brake hoses. The plans don't say "not supplied", however they
> aren't mentioned on my inventory list either. I have even searched "The
> List" on Van's site and they're not there either. Did anyone else get them
> with their fuse kit?
> I've ordered the Matco parking brake valve, so I was considering using
> Chris Heitman's advice and using the smaller hoses, however I'd still like
> to know if I was supposed to get hoses or not.
> S. Todd Bartrim
> 13B RV-9
> C-FSTB (reserved)
> Fuselage
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Mark Schrimmer <mschrimmer(at)pacbell.net> |
| Subject: | RV-9A Tank skins |
Is it necessary to slightly bend the aft edges of the RV-9A tank skins to
get them to lie flush with the upper and lower main wing skins, or will the
screws hold the tank skins flush without bending the edges?
Thanks,
Mark Schrimmer
RV-9A wings
Irvine, CA
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Dave Nicholson" <dnick2(at)home.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Electric Trim - snap bushing |
Here is the answer I got from Van's on The Electric Trim Snap Bushing &
Wiring Routing:
On 15 Oct 01, at 7:40, Dave Nicholson wrote:
> HI Gus,
>
> I don' t seem to have the SB-625-7 Snap Bushing that goes in the Left
> Elevator Spar for routing the Electric Servo Trim Wires & Servo Shaft.
> (Ref DWG 9, Electric Trim Assy)
The bushing actually comes in the fuse kit (it's with the manual
trim cable, but you get the bag even with the electric trim.
>
> What do you think of the idea of drilling a 1/4" hole through the
> E-902 Spar about a 1/2" above the existing hole for an SB-625-4 to
> route the wire bundle through separately so there will be no chance of
> snagging the wires with the threaded portion of the Servo Shaft?
There wouldn't be a problem with that.
Gus
-------------------------------------------------
Dave Nicholson
90347
Fuselage
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | John Oliveira <oliveira(at)frontiernet.net> |
| Subject: | Re: RV-9A Tank skins |
My Tank skins did not need any bending.
John Oliveira
90054 N909RV
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Gary Newsted" <fcs(at)jlc.net> |
| Subject: | Re: RV-9A Tank skins |
No need to bend them, the screws do the trick. I filed a very slight taper
just to knock the sharp edge off. Be sure you countersink properly so the
screws can pull it into position.
Gary
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | PERRYMAN Larry <Larry.PERRYMAN(at)atofina.com> |
| Subject: | Electric Trim - snap bushing |
Steve,
Last night I used some of the butt splice connectors for the 22-26 gage
wire(571-323994) on the elevator trim servo and they worked great. The small
wire from the servo was not a problem to crimp. I put some 18 gage wire
extensions on the servo.
Regards
Larry Perryman
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | gene(at)nvaircraft.com |
| Subject: | Washer under left landing gear mount |
I just discovered that a washer is to be placed between the gear mount and the
F-904 center section as a shim. I have both gear mounts in and it doesn't appear
one is used on the right side. What is the purpose of this shim?
Thanks,
Gene 90296
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | gene(at)nvaircraft.com |
| Subject: | Washer under left landing gear mount |
I just discovered that a washer is to be placed between the gear mount and the
F-904 center section as a shim. I have both gear mounts in and it doesn't appear
one is used on the right side. What is the purpose of this shim?
Thanks,
Gene 90296
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Steve Sampson" <SSampson.SLN21(at)london.edu> |
Has anyone taken delivery of an RV9 quickbuild yet?
I am interested to know what has / has not been done. Wings? Flaps?
Elevators? Fuselage?
Last time I asked VANS they really were not sure but time has passed.
Thanks, Steve.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Ted Brown" <tedbrown(at)osprey.net> |
Steve, I received mine about 2 weeks ago. The wings are complete, except
for one bottom skin on each. The flaps and ailerons are complete. The
fuselage is pretty well completed as far as skins. The top skin aft of
canopy is off, as well as the front top skin.
The workmanship is really pretty good.
Ted Brown
Emporia, KS
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Steve Sampson" <SSampson.SLN21(at)london.edu> |
| Subject: | Re: Ref: RV9A QB |
Wow - that sounds like lots is done! What I was hoping for was no more
trailing edges! Sounds like I am in luck.
Did they update the build instructions. I was missing lots of stuff from the
pack I recieved in April.
So what is your first job after the wing skins? The dreaded canopy?
Thanks Ted.
Best wishes, Steve.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Ted Brown" <tedbrown(at)osprey.net>
Subject: RV9-List: Ref: RV9A QB
>
> Steve, I received mine about 2 weeks ago. The wings are complete, except
> for one bottom skin on each. The flaps and ailerons are complete. The
> fuselage is pretty well completed as far as skins. The top skin aft of
> canopy is off, as well as the front top skin.
> The workmanship is really pretty good.
> Ted Brown
> Emporia, KS
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Gary Newsted" <fcs(at)jlc.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Ref: RV9A QB |
Quick Builds? Troublesome Trailing Edges? Dreaded Canopies?
Hey guys! Where's that homebuilder spirit gone? How depressing to
think of some lucky guy down in Puerto Rico having all the fun for you
and even getting paid for it!!! Not much I'm sure, but still.... Personally,
I can't understand why they charge MORE for a Quick Build. They've
robbed you of so much joy! Sheeeesh...
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Gary Newsted" <fcs(at)jlc.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Washer under left landing gear mount |
Gene, The way I read it, the single washer at the bottom inner-most bolt
of EACH gear mount, is to make up for the difference in height between
the 904C/904D upright members and the center section spar. If you
didn't put a washer in between the mount and the spar, there would be
a gap that would distort the gear mount when you tighten the bolt. This
is true on both right and left gear mounts. Note also that the drawings
state that you may need to file this washer to fit correctly in the curvature
of the spar flange. Did you figure this out or are you still uncertain?
If you don't see the gap I am talking about, you should carefully review
the orientation of these parts. Let me know if a photo would help.
Gary Newsted
>
> I just discovered that a washer is to be placed between the gear mount and the
F-904 center section as a shim. I have both gear mounts in and it doesn't
appear one is used on the right side. What is the purpose of this shim?
>
> Thanks,
>
> Gene 90296
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Haywire" <haywire(at)telus.net> |
Hi Gary;
I agree, but get this; A local builder who is currently building his 3rd
RV-6a Quickbuild, recently made a comment about my kit being all pre-punched
makes construction so simple that I can hardly take credit for building
it....... this from a quick builder........ go figure.
S. Todd Bartrim
13B RV-9
C-FSTB (reserved)
Finished Fuselage
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-rv9-list-server(at)matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-rv9-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of Gary Newsted
> Sent: October 24, 2001 7:46 PM
> To: rv9-list(at)matronics.com
> Subject: Re: RV9-List: Ref: RV9A QB
>
>
> Quick Builds? Troublesome Trailing Edges? Dreaded Canopies?
> Hey guys! Where's that homebuilder spirit gone? How depressing to
> think of some lucky guy down in Puerto Rico having all the fun for you
> and even getting paid for it!!! Not much I'm sure, but still....
> Personally,
> I can't understand why they charge MORE for a Quick Build. They've
> robbed you of so much joy! Sheeeesh...
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Matt Dralle <dralle(at)matronics.com> |
| Subject: | NEW Matronics Email List Feature! Browse Current List |
Messages!
Dear Listers,
I have just finished building an all new Email List Web Browsing feature
for the Matronics Email Lists. The new system allows you to use your web
browser to view all of the current Email List messages. The system's
indexes display all of the current List messages sorted by Subject, Author,
Date, or Thread. Clicking on the URL links on these index pages will open
another "Viewing Window" where the messages will be displayed.
The format of the index pages and message viewing window are consistent
with the existing Matronics Archive Search Engine and should be familiar to
everyone. The messages available on this new List Browsing Feature span
the previous 7 days of email for the given List. Each day the oldest day's
messages are replaced with the current day's messages. The web pages are
updated every 30 minutes with any new messages that are posted to the List
during that time frame.
Please have a look at the new Utility and let me know what you think! For
ease of use, I've added a link to the new system on each of the List
trailers that are appended to each List email message.
I hope you will find the new system useful and also find it to be a handy
companion to the Archive Search Engine.
The new Email Browsing Utility can be found at the following URL:
http://www.matronics.com/listbrowse
From here, you can select any of the available Email Lists.
Best regards,
Matt Dralle
Matronics Email List Admin.
Matt G Dralle | Matronics | PO Box 347 | Livermore | CA | 94551
925-606-1001 V | 925-606-6281 F | dralle(at)matronics.com Email
http://www.matronics.com/ WWW | Featuring Products For Aircraft
They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little
temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety.
Benjamin Franklin
Historical Review of Pennsylvania, 1759
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | gene(at)nvaircraft.com |
| Subject: | Washer under left landing gear mount |
Thanks Gary, Yes I did figure it out after pulling the left mount it was obvious.
Also I noticed it states on the plans "mirrored on the right" I pays to
read everything several times!!
Thanks again
Gene 90296 cabin systems
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "C J Heitman" <cjh(at)execpc.com> |
| Subject: | Washer under left landing gear mount |
My copy of dwg 34 does not mention this washer. Was there a revision to this
drawing? If so, I would be curious as to when the revision was made. My copy
of the manual also does not mention this.
I received one of the first fuselage kits.
Chris Heitman
Dousman WI
RV-9A N94ME (reserved)
http://www.execpc.com/~cjh/rv9a.html
-----Original Message-----
Thanks Gary, Yes I did figure it out after pulling the left mount it was
obvious. Also I noticed it states on the plans "mirrored on the right" I
pays to read everything several times!!
Thanks again
Gene 90296 cabin systems
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Gary Newsted" <fcs(at)jlc.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Washer under left landing gear mount |
My sheet 34 is dated 8/28/00. The note is at position B-4.
Gary
> My copy of dwg 34 does not mention this washer. Was there a revision to this
> drawing? If so, I would be curious as to when the revision was made. My copy
> of the manual also does not mention this.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Ray and Trish" <rtlack(at)chesapeake.net> |
| Subject: | Re: RV9-List Digest: 2 Msgs - 10/25/01 Website mod |
Hello Matt,
I like the browse features you've installed on the website. I'm sure I don't
use all the features to their fullest capabilities but so far I think it's
very convenient. I like the convenience of viewing by subject, author, or
date. The link you added for easy of use is a good feature also. Real nice
job Matt.
Thanks very much.
Regards,
Ray Lackwitz
----- Original Message -----
From: "RV9-List Digest Server" <rv9-list-digest(at)matronics.com>
Subject: RV9-List Digest: 2 Msgs - 10/25/01
> *
> RV9-List Digest Archive
> ---
> Total Messages Posted Thu 10/25/01: 2
>
>
____
> From: Matt Dralle <dralle(at)matronics.com>
> Subject: RV9-List: NEW Matronics Email List Feature! Browse Current List
> Messages!
>
>
> Dear Listers,
>
> I have just finished building an all new Email List Web Browsing feature
> for the Matronics Email Lists. The new system allows you to use your web
> browser to view all of the current Email List messages. The system's
> indexes display all of the current List messages sorted by Subject,
Author,
> Date, or Thread. Clicking on the URL links on these index pages will open
> another "Viewing Window" where the messages will be displayed.
>
> The format of the index pages and message viewing window are consistent
> with the existing Matronics Archive Search Engine and should be familiar
to
> everyone. The messages available on this new List Browsing Feature span
> the previous 7 days of email for the given List. Each day the oldest
day's
> messages are replaced with the current day's messages. The web pages are
> updated every 30 minutes with any new messages that are posted to the List
> during that time frame.
>
> Please have a look at the new Utility and let me know what you think! For
> ease of use, I've added a link to the new system on each of the List
> trailers that are appended to each List email message.
>
> I hope you will find the new system useful and also find it to be a handy
> companion to the Archive Search Engine.
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Matt Dralle <dralle(at)matronics.com> |
| Subject: | List Web Server Upgraded! Blazingly Fast Archive Searches!! |
Dear Listers,
As of this weekend, the Matronics Email List Web Server is now running on a
brand new hardware platform and the latest version of RedHat Linux! The
new hardware includes Dual 1.7GHz Xeon Processors, a 400MHz FSB
motherboard, 1GB of 800MHz RAM, a Dual-Channel 160 MB/Sec Ultra-160 SCSI
Controller, and an Ultra 160 36GB 15,000 RPM Seagate Cheetah hard
drive. The performance of the new system is, in a word, breathtaking!
In a variety of benchmark tests against the previous server, the new system
is at *least* six times faster! This means that your Archive Search Engine
queries will now come back in what seems like an instant! Single word
searches of the 113MB RV-List Archive now return in 2-3 seconds, and
searches of all other List Archives return in 1 second or
less!! Performance enhancements in the download and viewing of all other
web-based tools should also be noticeably improved as well.
Please enjoy the new system performance and don't forget, the Annual Email
List Fund Raiser is just around the corner!! :-)
Best regards,
Matt Dralle
Email List Administrator
Matt G Dralle | Matronics | PO Box 347 | Livermore | CA | 94551
925-606-1001 V | 925-606-6281 F | dralle(at)matronics.com Email
http://www.matronics.com/ WWW | Featuring Products For Aircraft
They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little
temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety.
Benjamin Franklin
Historical Review of Pennsylvania, 1759
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | dralle(at)matronics.com (Matt Dralle) |
| Subject: | Cool Graph on Archive Search Times... |
Hi Listers,
Below is a link to an interesting graph of the current Archive Search
Engine ( http://www.matronics.com/search ) search times done on the 113Mb
RV-List Archive file. The graph shows searches back through about
Thursday. Based on the search times (shown in the Y axis), see if you
can pick out the point at which the new Web Server hardware was
installed... Impressive? :-)
http://www.matronics.com/rv-list/RV-ListArchiveSearchTimes.jpg
Best regards,
Matt Dralle
EMail List Admin.
--
Matt G. Dralle | Matronics | P.O. Box 347 | Livermore | CA | 94551
925-606-1001 Voice | 925-606-6281 FAX | dralle(at)matronics.com Email
http://www.matronics.com/ W.W.W. | Featuring Products For Aircraft
They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little
temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety.
Benjamin Franklin
Historical Review of Pennsylvania, 1759
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Matt Dralle <dralle(at)matronics.com> |
| Subject: | 2001 List Fund Raiser - Please Support Your Lists... |
Dear Listers,
During November of each year, I have a voluntary Email List Fund Raiser to
support the continued operation, development, maintenance and upgrade of
the Forums sponsored here. Your contributions go directly into
improvements in the systems that support the Lists and to pay for the
Internet connectivity primarily dedicated to supporting the Lists.
This year, I've made some substantial improvements to the Lists and the
supporting systems. These upgrades are focused on making your experience
here faster, more enjoyable, and most importantly, informative. Here is a
partial list of improvements that I've made on the systems this year:
o Upgraded Web Server
- Minimum 6X increase in performance *
- Tons more high performance disk space and memory!
- Increased availability and reliability - UPS Backup
- Improved support for > 130,000 Archive Searches each year!
* See http://www.matronics.com/rv-list/RV-SearchTime.jpg
o Email System Disk Subsystem Upgrade
- More storage and faster access times
- Faster redistribution of List Messages
- Processed over 45,000 List messages in 2001; 50,000 in 2000!
o All new List Browse Feature *
- Browse the last seven day's worth of List Messages
- Quick access to current threads
- Sort messages by Thread, Date, Subject, or Author
* See http://www.matronics.com/listbrowse
o All new Photo Share Feature * &
- Simply email your photos and files to share
- Scanned for viruses
- Automatic Web Page Generation
- Includes descriptions and poster information
* See http://www.matronics.com/photoshare
& Officially to be announced soon
o Transition To High Performance Internet Service Provider
- Improved reliability
- Better access from most sites on the Internet
- Improved throughput
These are just some of the more visible improvements I've implemented this
year. I'm always working to improve the behind the scenes operation of the
Lists. I've built an elaborate system of message text and source address
filtering mechanisms to assure that you only receive text data in the
message, spam is nearly non-existent, computer viruses are never propagated
through the Lists, and that message post redistribution is smooth and
trouble free.
This year has seen a lot of improvements in the Email List experience. If
you enjoy the Forums here and make use of the many features, won't you take
a moment and make a Contribution to support the continued operation and
maintenance? Please note there is no advertising funding on the
Lists. You don't see annoying banner ads in the Email messages or on any
of the web pages. This just seems more friendly to me and makes the List
experience just that much more personal.
The operation of these Lists is supported *completely* through the
donations of List Members just like you!
Please take a moment to support your Lists by making a Secure Credit Card
Contribution at the following web site:
http://www.matronics.com/contribution
Or you may send a personal check to:
Matronics Email Lists
c/o Matt Dralle
PO Box 347
Livermore CA 94551-0347
I would like to thank everyone in advance for their Contribution and for
their continued support over the past year!
Best regards,
Matt Dralle
Email List Administrator
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | New Email List Photo Share Available |
RV7-List(at)matronics.com, RV8-List(at)matronics.com, RV9-List(at)matronics.com
| From: | Matronics Email List Photo Share <pictures(at)matronics.com> |
A new Email List Photo Share is now available at the following URL:
http://www.matronics.com/photoshare/fasching@amigo.net/index.html
---------------------------------
EMAIL LIST PHOTO SHARE
Share your files and photos with other List members simply by
emailing the files to:
pictures(at)matronics.com
Please view the typical Share above and include the Description Text
Fields as shown along with your submission of files and photos.
---------------------------------
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | gene(at)nvaircraft.com |
I am selling my RV-9A kit see my ad at: www.barnstormers.com
Gene 90296
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Matt Dralle <dralle(at)matronics.com> |
| Subject: | List Fund Raiser Off to a Slow Start... |
Hi Listers,
First I want to take everyone that has taken a minute already to make a
Contribution to support the Email Lists in 2001! I also really appreciate
all the kind words I've been receiving regarding the Lists and how much
they mean to everyone. The testimonial means a lot to me and makes the
many hours working on the system worth it!! Later in the month, I'll share
a few of the kind words with the Lists.
I've added a nifty new Bar Graph Thermometer to the message trailer that
gives an up-to-the-minute percentage status of how many members have made a
Contribution during 2001! It was a fun piece of code to write and
hopefully will be a fun way to watch the Fund Raiser's Progress this year!
As I've said in the past, the Lists are supported *completely* through your
generous Contributions during the Fund Raiser and throughout the
year. This includes all of the system and connectivity upgrades we seen,
as well as makes the many hours I spend each month keeping the systems
running even more enjoyable ;-).
Won't you take a moment and make a Contribution right now to support your
Lists? Its fast and easy with the On-line, SSL secure Credit Card system,
or by direct US-Mailing a check. For complete information, please see the
following URL:
http://www.matronics.com/contribution
Thank you in advance for your Generous Contribution!!
Best regards,
Matt Dralle
Email List Administrator
PS - Don't forget to monitor the Fund Raiser Bar Graph below!
Matt G Dralle | Matronics | PO Box 347 | Livermore | CA | 94551
925-606-1001 V | 925-606-6281 F | dralle(at)matronics.com Email
http://www.matronics.com/ WWW | Featuring Products For Aircraft
They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little
temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety.
Benjamin Franklin
Historical Review of Pennsylvania, 1759
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | New Email List Photo Share Available! |
RV6-List(at)matronics.com, RV7-List(at)matronics.com
| From: | Email List Photo Shares <pictures(at)matronics.com> |
A new Email List Photo Share is available:
http://www.matronics.com/photoshare/kdbrv8r@charter.net/index.html
---------------------------------
EMAIL LIST PHOTO SHARE
Share your files and photos with other List members simply by
emailing the files to:
pictures(at)matronics.com
Please view the typical Share above and include the Description Text
Fields as shown along with your submission of files and photos.
---------------------------------
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Matt Dralle <dralle(at)matronics.com> |
| Subject: | What Listers Are Saying - Fund Raiser Continues... |
Dear Listers,
The 2001 List Fund Raiser is going well and I want to thank everyone that
has already so generously made a Contribution to support the Lists! Below
are some of the great comments and feedback members have been including
along with their Contributions.
Won't you make a Contribution today to support the continued operation and
upgrade of your Lists? Its fast and easy using the SSL Secure Web Site or
by simply sending a personal check. Complete information can be found at
Contribution web site:
http://www.matronics.com/contribution
A give a special Thank You to all of those that have already contributed so
far this year!!
Matt Dralle
Email List Administrator
================== What Listers Are Saying ====================
Great information site.
- Edward S.
This is the first thing I look at every day.
- Ralph M.
The new List option is WONDERFUL!
- Kenyon B.
...new Search Software is absolutely fantastic!!
- Bruce K.
...essential to my enjoyment of RV building and flying.
- Douglas W.
Great List!
- Randall H.
...an invaluable service!
- Carlos S.
...incredible service to the industry!
- Alex M.
Building wouldn't be the same without the "Great List".
- Tom E.
...has helped the building process immensely.
- Hap S.
Matt G Dralle | Matronics | PO Box 347 | Livermore | CA | 94551
925-606-1001 V | 925-606-6281 F | dralle(at)matronics.com Email
http://www.matronics.com/ WWW | Featuring Products For Aircraft
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Leland and Anne <federigo(at)pacbell.net> |
| Subject: | Kit pickpup at Van's |
I picked up my RV9AQB kit at Van's on Monday. The workmanship looks very
good. I rented a truck in Portland. Van's shipping guys loaded it in
about an hour, while I enjoyed a demo flight in the RV9. A suggestion
for quickbuilders, make your wing cradle (shown on page 15 of the plans)
before your kit arrives so you will have a safe place to put the wings.
I was told that Penske has the most reliable trucks and I have seen
U-Haul's broken down on the highway. Penske quoted $540 for the one-way
trip to San Francisco, but quickly reduced the quote to $313 when I told
them that was what U-Haul had quoted. They even reduced the blanket
rental from $15 to $10 per dozen. The trucks in the Penske lot looked
pretty sharp. My truck was two years old, clean, ran well and averaged 8
mpg. The only drawback was that they only had 15' and 25' beds
available. The 15' is a few inches short for the QB fuselage and the 25'
is much too large. If somebody quotes you on a 20' truck, be sure that
4' of the 20' is not part of a cab-over.
If you fly commercial into Portland, the commuter train leaves every 15
minutes for Portland. It is a short cab ride from downtown Portland to
the main Penske yard.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Steve Sampson" <SSampson.SLN21(at)london.edu> |
| Subject: | Cutting Lead & Drill guides |
Well today I squeezed and bucked the last rivets on the left elevator so
its all the odd bits and pieces until my QB Christmas present arrives!
Two questions:
1) Mass balance weights. Is there any easier way to cut lead than with a
hacksaw? I am progressing - slowly!
2) I spent a while looking around my barn for somthing to use as a drill
guide to drill the elevator horns. Is there somthing obvious (cheap)
that one can use. I cant seem to find anything suitable.
Thanks for the help.
Steve
#90360 Finishing up on the emp kit.
N Yorks., UK
PS And thanks guys for all the help in getting me this far! The trailing
edges are straight AND aligned with each other!
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Albert Gardner" <albert.gardner(at)worldnet.att.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Cutting Lead & Drill guides |
Steve:
I went to the local ironmonger and got a 1/4" brass bushing with the
smallest inside diameter that I had a drill bit for. Worked very well.
Also, I was able to cut the lead on my bandsaw and smooth it with the vixen
file. I suggest you leave the inboard (still accessible after tip is
installed over the outboard weight) weight just a little heavy. You can
drill a hole in it after painting to finish the balance. Warning: if you
put the MAC servo in the left elevator, be very careful about removing lead
from the weight before you try it out. I needed to remove very little
from mine in order to balance the elevator.
Albert (cutting canopy-very carefully) Gardner
----- Original Message -----
From: "Steve Sampson" <SSampson.SLN21(at)london.edu>
>
> 1) Mass balance weights. Is there any easier way to cut lead than with a
> hacksaw? I am progressing - slowly!
>
> 2) I spent a while looking around my barn for something to use as a drill
> guide to drill the elevator horns. Is there something obvious (cheap)
> that one can use. I cant seem to find anything suitable.
>
> Thanks for the help.
>
> Steve
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Gary & Sandi" <flying(at)3rivers.net> |
| Subject: | Re: RV9-List Digest: 1 Msgs - 11/10/01 |
Steve.....I cut mine with a coarse tooth blade on the bandsaw, on slow
speed. Does fine, but gums up the saw a bit. I found a piece of steel
tubing to use as a drill guide that was thick-walled, so I could use an
undersize drill to locate the holes in the elevator horn. Then I drilled
the holes to final size in small increments.
Glad the trailing edges came out well. Most things are hard, till you learn
how.
Gary
1) Mass balance weights. Is there any easier way to cut lead than with a
hacksaw? I am progressing - slowly!
2) I spent a while looking around my barn for somthing to use as a drill
guide to drill the elevator horns. Is there somthing obvious (cheap)
that one can use. I cant seem to find anything suitable.
Thanks for the help.
Steve
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Matt Dralle <dralle(at)matronics.com> |
| Subject: | Have You Tried the New List Browse Feature?? |
Hi Listers,
I've been getting a LOT of very positive feedback on the new Email List
Browsing feature I added to the suite of List services a couple of weeks
ago. A number of List members have written to say that they love the new
List Browser because they can keep tabs on the latest List messages
throughout the day without having to constantly check their email or wait
for the Digest issue to come out.
The List Browse Function allows you to use your web browser to view the
current 7 day's worth of List messages for the give List. The indexes are
updated every 30 minutes with any new messages that have been posted. You
can sort all of the message indexes by Thread, Subject, Author, or Date and
easily track and find current threads.
You can check out the New List Browse Feature by going to the following URL
and clicking on the List of your choice:
http://www.matronics.com/listbrowse
Please remember that November is List Fund Raiser month!! The continued
operation and upgrade of the Email Lists are _entirely_ supported by YOUR
Contributions and support. You'll never see annoying, flashing banner ads,
or other forms of commercialism on these Lists. Just people sharing
information, data, and stories about your favorite topic, plain (plane?)
and simple.
If you enjoy the Lists and all of the services here, won't you take moment
and make a quick Contribution? It fast and easy using the SSL Secure Web
site with your Visa or MasterCard. Or, you can also send a personal check
to the address listed below.
SSL Secure Web Site: http://www.matronics.com/contribution
USMail: Matt Dralle
c/o Matronics
PO Box 347
Livermore, CA 94551-0347
Don't forget that the "List of Contributors" will be coming out in just a
few short weeks! Don't you want to make sure you're name is on it?
I would like to wish a special "Thank You" to everyone that has made a
Contribution so far this year!!
Matt Dralle
Email List Administrator
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Matt Dralle <dralle(at)matronics.com> |
| Subject: | Free Copy of Van's New "THE RV STORY" Video! |
Hey Listers!
In support of the 2001 Email List Fund Raiser, Andy Gold of The Builder's
Bookstore ( http://www.buildersbooks.com/ ) is donating a FREE COPY of the
new edition of Van's "The RV Story" video (VHS) to any Email List Member
making a Contribution of $50 or more!
To take advantage of this wonderful Offer, please include the following
information along with your Contribution, either in the Message Box if you
Contribute on-line, or on a slip of paper if your Contribution is by check
via the USMail:
Van's RV Story Video Offer
$50 or Greater Contributor
[your name]
[your shipping address]
[your City, State and Zip Code]
If you've already made a Contribution in 2001 of $50 or more and would like
to receive the video, please drop me an email ( dralle(at)matronics.com ) and
include the information shown above with the words "Video Offer" in the
Subject line.
Please note that this new edition of "The RV Story" will first be available
in about 8 weeks.
I want to thank Andy Gold and the Builder's Book Store for this *very
generous* Contribution! If you haven't taken a moment to check out The
Builder's Book Store web site yet, you owe it to yourself to have a look (
http://www.buildersbooks.com/ ). Andy has a fabulous selection of
interesting, informative, and exceptionally useful books and videos on his
site. Please have a look!
Again, I would like to thank everyone that has so generously made a
Contribution so far in this year's List Fund Raiser! Your Contributions
make all of the Lists and Services found here possible - period.
Thank you!
Matt Dralle
Email List Administrator
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Updated Email List Photo Share Available! |
RV6-List(at)matronics.com, RV7-List(at)matronics.com
| From: | Email List Photo Shares <pictures(at)matronics.com> |
An Update to the Email List Photo Share below is available:
Subject: Fuselage Roller
http://www.matronics.com/photoshare/kdbrv8r@charter.net/index.html
---------------------------------
EMAIL LIST PHOTO SHARE
Share your files and photos with other List members simply by
emailing the files to:
pictures(at)matronics.com
Please view the typical Share above and include the Description Text
Fields as shown along with your submission of files and photos.
---------------------------------
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Matt Dralle <dralle(at)matronics.com> |
| Subject: | What They're Saying... |
Hi Listers,
The 2001 List Fund Raiser is currently underway and lot's of people have
been making their Contribution and saying a lot of very nice things about
the Lists and what they're daily-dose of Forum means to them! I've
included a few more of the Lister comments below.
Won't you take a moment to support your Lists this month? Its fast and
easy by making a Secure Credit Card Contribution at the following web site:
http://www.matronics.com/contribution
Or by sending a personal check Contribution to:
Matronics Email Lists
c/o Matt Dralle
PO Box 347
Livermore CA 94551-0347
For Complete information on the upgrades and improvements the Lists and
servers have undergone this year, have a look at this URL:
http://www.matronics.com/searching/getmsg_script.cgi?INDEX=113171908?KEYS=asdfasdf?LISTNAME=RV?HITNUMBER=4?SERIAL=1942094803?SHOWBUTTONS=NO
Here's few more of the comments I've been receiving about what the Lists
mean to its members:
======================
Not only a great way to help each other out, it's been
a wonderful way to meet new friends. - Fred H.
The List is invaluable to me...
- Russell W.
I absolutely love your Lists...
- Scott C.
...you are tying all the builders together.
- David A.
The Lists continue to be an invaluable source of
information. - Jeff O.
I look forward to reading my Email every day...
- Harvey S.
They are invaluable resources to builders of all
skill levels. - Kevin H.
...another year of excellent service.
- Terry W.
Way cool setup.
- Chuck R.
...source of information, inspiration, support,
and camaraderie. - Carlos S.
I'd be lost without them...
- Jeff O.
======================
Matt G Dralle | Matronics | PO Box 347 | Livermore | CA | 94551
925-606-1001 V | 925-606-6281 F | dralle(at)matronics.com Email
http://www.matronics.com/ WWW | Featuring Products For Aircraft
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Matt Dralle <dralle(at)matronics.com> |
Hi Listers,
The List of Contributors (LOC) is just around the corner! On December 1st
I post a list of everyone that so generously made a Contribution to support
the Lists. Its sort of my way of publicly thanking everyone that took a
minute to show their appreciation for the Lists.
Won't you take a moment and assure that your name is on that List of
Contributors? As a number of people have pointed out, the List seems at
least, if not a whole lot more, valuable as a building/flying/recreating
tool as a typical your magazine subscription. We won't even talk about a
newsstand price... :-)
Won't you take minute and assure that your name is on the upcoming
LOC? Tell others that you appreciate the Lists. Making a Contribution to
support the Lists is fast and easy using your Visa or M/C on the SSL Secure
Web Site:
http://www.matronics.com/contribution
or by popping a personal check in the mail to:
Matronics Email Lists
c/o Matt Dralle
PO Box 347
Livermore CA 94551-0347
!! Don't forget !!
Andy Gold of the Builder's Book Store ( http://www.buildersbooks.com/ ) has
generously donated a FREE copy of Van's new "The RV Story" video to anyone
making a Contribution of $50 or more to support the Lists. For complete
information on the _awesome_ offer, please see this URL:
http://www.matronics.com/searching/getmsg_script.cgi?INDEX=113629625?KEYS=asdf?LISTNAME=RV?HITNUMBER=1?SERIAL=23392130806?SHOWBUTTONS=NO
To make sure you get your video, be sure to follow the instructions at the
URL above carefully!
I would like to thank everyone that has so generously made a Contribution
thus far in this year's List Fund Raiser! Remember that its YOUR support
that keeps these Lists going and improving! Don't forget to include a
little comment about how the Lists have helped you! I love to feel the
love... :-)
Best regards,
Matt Dralle
Email List Administrator
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Steve Sampson" <SSampson.SLN21(at)london.edu> |
I have just started fitting the empenage tips, in particular the
elevators. A couple of questions.
1) The trailing edge of my tips is considerably blunter than the 'sharp'
trailing edge of the elevator. (In profile its much more like a bent
trailing edge than a double back rivetted one.) Have others shaped it so
it matches the ally of the elevator. Was there structurally enough left?
I worry it will be too thin.
2) The instructions indicate to pop rivet the tip to the metal without a
backing piece. I am very tempted to put a backing strip in place since I
worry the glass once it is countersunk is too fragile. Thoughts?
Thanks Steve.
Working on empenage tips.
#90360
N Yorks., UK.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Leland and Anne <federigo(at)pacbell.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Empenage tips |
I just carefully countersunk the fiberglass on all the empenage tips except for
the VS tip, to which I glued an aluminum strip and installed nutplates. I used
the pure aluminum rivets included in Cleveland's wing tip installation kit.
However, Van's RV-9/RV-9A Plans Set (construction manual) has the following
quote on page 7-16 for the wing tips: "If you decide to use the rivets the tip
must be reinforced with a strip of aluminum to keep the rivets from cracking
the fiberglass. Drill (#40) Reinforcement Strips to the W-915 Tip using the
existing holes". Leland in Pleasanton, California
Steve Sampson wrote:
> 2) The instructions indicate to pop rivet the tip to the metal without a
> backing piece. I am very tempted to put a backing strip in place since I
> worry the glass once it is countersunk is too fragile. Thoughts?
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Gary Newsted" <fcs(at)jlc.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Empenage tips |
I wouldn't advise grinding down the tips to match. This would almost certainly
lead to cracks once it sees the sun, cold, vibration and time. If you really
want to do this, you should probably reinforce the inside of the tip's trailing
edge with some extra cloth and resin so you can safely thin down the exterior.
I had to do this anyway since my tip-seams were both cracked when I received
them.
A backing strip is always a good idea, but you would have to find a way to
secure it (Proseal or keeper rivets maybe) since you won't have access to it
during riveting. I didn't bother with a backing strip and didn't have any
visible problems, but I wondered the same thing. Fiberglass sucks any way you
look at it.
Gary
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Guy Votuc" <guy(at)votuc.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Empenage tips |
I agree with your observations Steve. I did "sharpen" the Elevator tip
trailing edges a little but really didn't get too finiky. I suppose you
could cut a slot out and re-glass the inside to make it match better. I
ended up drilling and counter sinking my tips then applied a little resin
with a brush on both sides of the rivet lines and holes to stiffen it up a
little. I agree the countersunk hole in the fiberglass is weak but since the
tip is on the inside of the flanges ( pressure fit ) and the rivets are
fairly long, I don't worry about them ever coming out.
Guy
----- Original Message -----
From: "Steve Sampson" <SSampson.SLN21(at)london.edu>
Subject: RV9-List: Empenage tips
>
> I have just started fitting the empenage tips, in particular the
> elevators. A couple of questions.
>
> 1) The trailing edge of my tips is considerably blunter than the 'sharp'
> trailing edge of the elevator. (In profile its much more like a bent
> trailing edge than a double back rivetted one.) Have others shaped it so
> it matches the ally of the elevator. Was there structurally enough left?
> I worry it will be too thin.
>
> 2) The instructions indicate to pop rivet the tip to the metal without a
> backing piece. I am very tempted to put a backing strip in place since I
> worry the glass once it is countersunk is too fragile. Thoughts?
>
> Thanks Steve.
>
> Working on empenage tips.
> #90360
> N Yorks., UK.
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Steve Sampson" <SSampson.SLN21(at)london.edu> |
| Subject: | Re: Empenage tips |
Thanks all! We all seem to have the same concerns!
I have now put small ally backing strips on the elevator tips, probably will
not bother on the HS tips or the rudder tip. The VS tip I want removable but
have rivetted nut plates to the glass and assume the nut plate itself will
spread the load.
The trailing edge of the elevator tips I am going to rework. Fortunately I
have a friend who is a sailplane repair specialist. The glass can be
infinitly better than the trailing edge of these tips!
Thanks again, Steve.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Steve Sampson" <SSampson.SLN21(at)london.edu>
Subject: RV9-List: Empenage tips
>
> I have just started fitting the empenage tips, in particular the
> elevators. A couple of questions.
>
> 1) The trailing edge of my tips is considerably blunter than the 'sharp'
> trailing edge of the elevator. (In profile its much more like a bent
> trailing edge than a double back rivetted one.) Have others shaped it so
> it matches the ally of the elevator. Was there structurally enough left?
> I worry it will be too thin.
>
> 2) The instructions indicate to pop rivet the tip to the metal without a
> backing piece. I am very tempted to put a backing strip in place since I
> worry the glass once it is countersunk is too fragile. Thoughts?
>
> Thanks Steve.
>
> Working on empenage tips.
> #90360
> N Yorks., UK.
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Cy Galley" <cgalley(at)qcbc.org> |
| Subject: | new e-mail address |
My new e-mail address is cgalley(at)qcbc.org as the other ISP decided to drop
service. If your address book has the old "accessus" URL that I used for
over 7 years, please update your records.
Cy Galley - Bellanca Champion Club
Newsletter Editor & EAA TC
www.bellanca-championclub.com
Cy Galley - www.qcbc.org Webmaster
Cy Galley
Editor, EAA Safety Programs
cgalley(at)qcbc.org or experimenter(at)eaa.org
Cy Galley - Treasurer, Mississippi Valley Region of the AACA
www.aaca.org/mvr - Webmaster
Cy Galley - webmaster EAA Chapter 75
http://members.tripod.com/~EAA_Chapter_75
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Albert Gardner" <albert.gardner(at)worldnet.att.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Empenage tips |
I think it's wise to put a backing strip so that the rivet expansion doesn't
have the potential to crack the glass. Proseal works very well in this
application but I'll bet it's not the only way to attach the strip.
Albert
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Matt Dralle <dralle(at)matronics.com> |
| Subject: | Michael Brown... |
Hi Listers,
In support of the 2001 Email List Fund Raiser, Michael Brown of Brown
Aviation Tool Supply Co. ( http://www.browntool.com ) has generously
offered to provide Gift Certificates to all Listers making Contributions of
$30 or more this year!
Making your Contribution to support these Email Lists and to qualify for
the Brown Tool Gift Certificate is fast and easy by using the SSL Secure
Credit Card Contribution Web Site at:
http://www.matronics.com/contribution
Or by sending a personal check Contribution to:
Matronics Email Lists
c/o Matt Dralle
PO Box 347
Livermore CA 94551-0347
According to Michael, "The Gift Certificates have absolutely no strings
attached and are as good as cash for anything from the Brown Tool Web Site
or Catalog."
The amount of your Gift Certificate is based on the size of your List
Contribution and is according to the following:
$100 or greater Contribution receives a $25 Gift Certificate!
or
$30-$99 Contribution receives a $10 Gift Certificate!
==================== How To Receive Your Certificate ====================
To receive your Brown Tool Gift Certificate, send an email message to:
browntooloffer(at)matronics.com
and include the following information:
1) Subject Line: Tool Offer
2) Which Gift Certificate you qualify for ($10 or $25)
3) [Your Name]
4) [Your Mailing Address]
5) [Your City, State Zip]
** Please only use the email address shown above (
browntooloffer(at)matronics.com ) to request your Gift Certificate!
*** Anyone making a List Contribution of $30 or more in 2001 qualifies for
the Gift Certificate!
==================== How To Receive Your Certificate ====================
You should receive your Gift Certificate from Brown Tool in about 2-4 weeks.
I want to thank Michael Brown of Brown Aviation Tool Supply Co. for this
wonderful offer in support of the Email Lists! If you haven't yet had a
look at the Brown Tool Web Site ( http://www.browntool.com ), then you own
it to yourself to take a peek! He has some great deals and good quality tools.
And finally, I would like to thank everyone that has already made a
Contribution in this year's Fund Raiser! Its YOUR support that keeps these
Lists running and NOT ADVERTISING and FLASHING BANNER ADS...
Thank you!!
Matt Dralle
Email List Administrator
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Steve Sampson" <SSampson.SLN21(at)london.edu> |
| Subject: | Re: Empenage tips |
Albert - I have only fixed the backing strip in 3 places with a 3/32 rivet
which is only gently squeezed. After all you only need the rivet to hold
until you get the clecoes in, which you then replace one by one with pops.
It seems to work. I have decided with my sailplane repair man that I am
going to then put a thin skim of glass over all the non- removable tips to
make them look more 'one'.
I was impressed by how well 3/32 rivets held nutplates in place on the VS
tip which I want removable. Again I gave them a 'light' squeeze and they
seem to sit there just fine.
Regards, Steve.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Albert Gardner" <albert.gardner(at)worldnet.att.net>
Subject: Re: RV9-List: Empenage tips
>
> I think it's wise to put a backing strip so that the rivet expansion
doesn't
> have the potential to crack the glass. Proseal works very well in this
> application but I'll bet it's not the only way to attach the strip.
> Albert
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Steve Sampson" <SSampson.SLN21(at)london.edu> |
For a poor Brit understanding Yankee nuts and screws (bolts in English)
is tough. The good news is there is no great variety since it mostly
boils down to AN3 and AN4. But how do you know if you have course or
fine? Should one assume VANS would only use 'fine' things. Having
studied p5-5 in the builders manual and my Fletcher Aircraft 'Standard
Aircraft Workers Manual' I remain confused. But then unlike most
aircraft workers I have the confusion of an engineering degree - there
is the problem!
So question:
1) For an AN3-5A screw and an AN365-1032 as used in the central elevator
hinge should I read off the line in the fine thread series #10-32 which
indicates the min max torque is 20/25 in/lbs?
2) Can one torque the counterweight fixing bolts or does the lead
collapse?
3) What does #10--32 add to AN3? (Confusion????)
4) Am I corrct in thinking 1/4-28 corresponds to AN4.
5) Who is more confused, me or the person who dreamed up this system?
I have to say our European friends - the active members of the
coallition - did give us a neat and tidy set of metric nuts & bolts
(sorry screws). Now you could come back at me and say the english stuff
is a nightmare - true - but when we invented all ours, they were at the
cutting edge of technology!
Thanks for the help, Steve.
PS Somthing I know a little more about than building..... Flying. If any
one is lacksadasical about carb heat dont be. I am pretty good about it,
though have often wondered if it is for real since I had never met it.
After 400 hours, twice in the last 7 days I have had a severe dose in an
0-320 Supercub and an o-540 Pawnee. It does stop the prop!!! We are
having a VERY cool and humid autumn.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Gary Newsted" <fcs(at)jlc.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Torque settings |
> But how do you know if you have course or fine?
Aircraft hardware is fine thread, except in very rare cases (not on this plane).
> Can one torque the counterweight fixing bolts or does the lead
> collapse?
You can torque them if you want. The washers will take up any crush. It is
not necessary to torque these however. Just tighten them "a tad".
(Brit unit of measure).
> Who is more confused, me or the person who dreamed up this system?
;
)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Matt Dralle <dralle(at)matronics.com> |
| Subject: | What Can You Say...? |
Dear Listers,
I've been getting a ton great comments on what the Lists mean to its
members and I've included a few of them below. I'm sure _most_ of you can
echo one or more of these sentiments to the tune of a nice List
Contribution... :-)
Just one more week until I post the 2001 List of Contributors! Won't you
support the continued operation of these Lists by making a Contribution
today and assure your place on the upcoming Contributor List? I'm sure
your friends will be checking for your name on the LOC... ;-)
SSL Secure Web Visa and MasterCard Contributions:
http://www.matronics.com/contributions
Personal Check via the US Mail:
Matronics Email Lists
c/o Matt Dralle
PO Box 347
Livermore, CA 94551-0347
I want to thank everyone that has already made a Contribution this
year! YOU make these Lists possible!
Matt Dralle
Email List Administrator
===========================================================================
Can't live without my List everyday!
- John B.
Information you can't get anywhere else.
- George D.
...one of the finest List sites on the Internet.
- Dennis S.
This List has saved my bacon more than once!
- Larry H.
Really invaluable service for a novice builder.
- John B.
...got some useful help from the List.
- Rocky S.
A valuable resource.
- Dennis N.
This List is a Super resource...
- Dwight F.
...couldn't have gotten this far without the
resources on the List.
- Jerry C.
Great service to us builders...
- Ronald M.
...someday we'll all meet in RV Heaven. Hey,
how come there isn't an "RV-Heaven" List?
- Louis W.
The info I've gleaned from the List has saved
me several thousand dollars...
- Kevin H.
...the only International, Interesting, Up-to-date,
List with the best search engine ever!
- Hans L.
...check it ever day so I don't miss anything.
- Jim B.
Great List!
- Douglas G.
This List has saved me a few times already...
- Thomas R.
...part of my morning wake up reading.
- Dwight F.
...helped my make my plane better, safer, better
looking, and built it quicker.
- Kevin H.
Have bought many items from the info the List gives.
- Jim B.
You meet the nicest people here.
- George D.
Informative, Amusing, Entertaining...
- John B.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Matt Dralle <dralle(at)matronics.com> |
| Subject: | Don't Miss The Video... |
Hey Listers!
Just a reminder that in support of the 2001 Email List Fund Raiser, Andy
Gold of The Builder's Bookstore ( http://www.buildersbooks.com/ ) is
donating a FREE COPY of the new edition of Van's "The RV Story" video (VHS)
to any List Member making a Contribution of $50 or more!
To take advantage of this wonderful Offer, please include the following
information along with your Contribution, either in the Message Box if you
Contribute on-line, or on a slip of paper if your Contribution is by check
via the USMail:
Van's RV Story Video Offer
$50 or Greater Contributor
[your name]
[your shipping address]
[your City, State and Zip Code]
If you've already made a Contribution of $50 or more during the 2001 Fund
Raiser and would still like to receive the video, please drop me an email (
dralle(at)matronics.com ) and include the information shown above with the
following Subject Line:
Subject: Video Offer
Please note that this new edition of "The RV Story" will first be available
in about 8 weeks.
I want to thank Andy Gold and the Builder's Book Store for this *very
generous* Contribution! If you haven't taken a moment to check out The
Builder's Book Store web site yet, you owe it to yourself to have a look (
http://www.buildersbooks.com/ ). Andy has a fabulous selection of
interesting, informative, and exceptionally useful books and videos on his
site. Please have a look!
I would like to thank everyone that has so generously made a Contribution
so far in this year's List Fund Raiser! Just a few more days until I send
out the List of Contributors for 2001. Make your Contribution today to
make sure your name is on the LOC!!
Thank you!
Matt Dralle
Email List Administrator
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Leland and Anne <federigo(at)pacbell.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Torque settings |
Steve, actually, #10-32 is not exactly equal to an AN3 in average thread
diameter. A #10 thread has a diameter of 0.06+(10)*.013, which is equal to
0.190", and of course the AN3 is 3/16" which is a slightly smaller 0.1875".
I am finding that Reithmaier's Standard Aircraft Handbook (sold by Van's) is
pretty useful in identifying kit parts.
If you are having trouble with the "English" system, imagine how it is for us
who never know if an item ostensibly manufactured in US uses English or metric
bolts.
Leland in Pleasanton, California
RV-9AQB, wings
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | DLOMHEIM(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Fuel Tank Question |
Can someone give me some direction of hooking up the capacitive sender to the
tanks...I just received the quantity gauge from Vans today and expected to
see a connector that would fit the Vans supplied BNC connector supplied with
the original kit. The wire from EI has a ring connector...is it soldered
like on the "wet side" of the BNC?
I am installing fire suppressant foam (same as contained in the F-15) between
each rib so hopefully that will have the desired effect (fire prevention)
should a wing ever break open...this has been used in racing cars for a
number of years with pretty good results...anyway that's why it's an
experimental...
Thanks for any answers to the BNC connector question.
Doug
OK City, OK
Wing Tanks
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "C J Heitman" <cjh(at)execpc.com> |
| Subject: | Fuel Tank Question |
Hi Doug,
I ordered MIL spec connectors from Mouser Electronics. Here is a copy of a
previous post on this subject:
My capacitive sender kit came with the bulkhead mounted receptacle but not
the plug end for the cable (which also is not included with the interface
module from Electronics International. The supplied BNC receptacle had a
rather cheap looking formed center contact and the housing looked like a
cheap, low quality die casting. I decided to replace them with quality Mil
Spec Amphenol receptacles with machined pin since I had to order the plugs
anyway. The receptacles are designed for use in a pressure bulkhead but I
sealed them with ProSeal on the inside of the tank anyway. I called EI and
they told me it didn't matter if I used 50 or 75 ohm connectors. I ordered
the Amphenol connectors from Mouser at www.mouser.com
Here are the part numbers that I used:
BNC Bulkhead Receptacle: Mouser #523-31-102 (Amphenol #31-102) $5.08 each
(5/30/00 price)
BNC Plug: Mouser #523-31-320 (Amphenol #31-320) $5.67 each (5/30/00 price)
Chris Heitman
Dousman WI
RV-9A N94ME (reserved)
http://www.execpc.com/~cjh/rv9a.html
-----Original Message-----
Can someone give me some direction of hooking up the capacitive sender to
the tanks...I just received the quantity gauge from Vans today and expected
to see a connector that would fit the Vans supplied BNC connector supplied
with the original kit. The wire from EI has a ring connector...is it
soldered like on the "wet side" of the BNC?
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Matt Dralle <dralle(at)matronics.com> |
| Subject: | Brown Tool Gift Certificate Reminder... |
Hi Listers,
Just a reminder that in support of the 2001 Email List Fund Raiser, Michael
Brown of Brown Aviation Tool Supply Co. ( http://www.browntool.com ) has
generously offered to provide Gift Certificates to all Listers making
Contributions of $30 or more this year!
Making your Contribution to support these Email Lists and to qualify for
the Brown Tool Gift Certificate is fast and easy by using the SSL Secure
Credit Card Contribution Web Site at:
http://www.matronics.com/contribution
Or by sending a personal check Contribution to:
Matronics Email Lists
c/o Matt Dralle
PO Box 347
Livermore CA 94551-0347
According to Michael, "The Gift Certificates have absolutely no strings
attached and are as good as cash for anything from the Brown Tool Web Site
or Catalog."
The amount of your Gift Certificate is based on the size of your List
Contribution and is according to the following:
$100 or greater Contribution receives a $25 Gift Certificate!
or
$30-$99 Contribution receives a $10 Gift Certificate!
==================== How To Receive Your Certificate ====================
To receive your Brown Tool Gift Certificate, send an email message to:
browntooloffer(at)matronics.com
and include the following information:
1) Subject Line: Tool Offer
2) Which Gift Certificate you qualify for ($10 or $25)
3) [Your Name]
4) [Your Mailing Address]
5) [Your City, State Zip]
** Please only use the email address shown above (
browntooloffer(at)matronics.com ) to request your Gift Certificate!
*** Anyone making a List Contribution of $30 or more in 2001 qualifies for
the Gift Certificate! But, you have to follow the instructions above to
receive it!
==================== How To Receive Your Certificate ====================
You should receive your Gift Certificate from Brown Tool in about 2-4 weeks.
I want to thank Michael Brown of Brown Aviation Tool Supply Co. for this
wonderful offer in support of the Email Lists! If you haven't yet had a
look at the Brown Tool Web Site ( http://www.browntool.com ), then you own
it to yourself to take a peek! He has some great deals and good quality tools.
I would like to thank everyone that has already made a Contribution in this
year's Fund Raiser!
Thank you!!
Matt Dralle
Email List Administrator
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Gary Newsted" <fcs(at)jlc.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Fuel Tank Question |
Correct me if I'm wrong, but don't you also need to order the transducer modules
for the Electronics International Fuel Gauges? My understanding is that the
BNC connection goes to the transducer which is attached to a screw on the end
cap, then conventional wire between the transducer and gauge.
If anyone can snap a photo of this it would help. I am not planning on using
the EI gauges, but I believe I will still need the transducers regardless of
what gauges I use.
Also Doug, your fire resistant foam makes me wonder if it will interfere with
operation of the capacitive senders? I don't know whether the capacitance is
measures between each plate and the skins, or between the two plates. If its
between the plates, then the foam may present a bogus reading. Hope not...
Gary
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Leland and Anne <federigo(at)pacbell.net> |
| Subject: | Pitot tubing length |
Can someone tell me whether to use the 14' or the 19' length of 1/4"
tubing for the run from the wing-mounted pitot tube to the control
panel?
Leland
RV9AQB
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | gene(at)nvaircraft.com |
| Subject: | Pitot tubing length |
I believe I used the 14'
Gene
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Matt Dralle <dralle(at)matronics.com> |
| Subject: | Contributors Down By 25%... |
Dear Listers,
First I want to thank everyone that has already so generously made a
Contribution toward this year 2001 List Fund Raiser. It is your support
that makes these Lists possible.
Since there are only a couple more days until the official end of this
year's drive, I want to share some statistics regarding this and previous
Fund Raiser percentages. In years past, the percentage of members making a
Contribution to support the Lists has typically been right around 23% of
the total List population. This year, however, you'll note from the
Contribution Meter that we're only at a little over 16% for some
reason. This is down by roughly 7%, and translates into about a *30%
decrease* in participation this year!
I'm hoping that everyone is just waiting until the very last minute to make
their Contribution this year, and that the needle on the Contribution Meter
will still creep up to the normal 23% in the next few days! Saturday or
Sunday I will be posting the 2001 List of Contributors, so you'll want to
heat up that Contribution Web Site right away to make sure your name is on
the 2001 LOC!!
The SSL Secure Web Site:
http://www.matronics.com/contribution
The US Mail Address:
Matronics Email Lists
c/o Matt Dralle
PO Box 347
Livermore, CA 94550-7227
Thank you for your support!
Matt Dralle
Email List Administrator
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Kevin Behrent <kbehrent(at)cascadiasoftware.com> |
| Subject: | Horz Stab Center Rib Problem |
I am a very frustrated builder having problems with my Hz stab skins. I
am getting a good 1/8+ dip when the skin is clecoed to the center nose
ribs. I have ordered and tried several sets of ribs and they did not
help the problem. I finally gave up one my first set of skins and
recently ordered the second set along with another set of ribs. When the
complete HZ stab is clecoed together, I continue to get a good 1/8th dip
at the center nose ribs. I've tried shimming, but find it difficult to
shim a 1/8" gap on both the top and bottom.
I've been working on this for over a year. I gave up on it a while back
and decided to finish my tail. Now that the tail is done, I must
painfully complete the Hz stab. I've talked to Van's about this problem
and their only response is that they have heard about this problem, but
they feel it is only cosmetic, so live with it. I simply can't accept
such a glaring dent.
Has anyone else experienced this problem and what did you do to fix it?
Thanks
--
Kevin Behrent
kbehrent(at)cascadiasoftware.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Guy Votuc" <guy(at)votuc.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Horz Stab Center Rib Problem |
Kevin,
This is an old story I've seen in these threads many times. I too have
this "dip" in the center nose ribs and I agree it's frustrating but mostly
cosmetic. I first I just figured I did something wrong like not flutting
properly but later decided it was not my fault. It's impossible to do much
adjusting from original when the parts are pre-punched. In the end I used a
little Z-Grip filler to blend the dip. No one will ever know except you
other RV-9 builders.......
Guy
----- Original Message -----
From: "Kevin Behrent" <kbehrent(at)cascadiasoftware.com>
Subject: RV9-List: Horz Stab Center Rib Problem
>
> I am a very frustrated builder having problems with my Hz stab skins. I
>
> am getting a good 1/8+ dip when the skin is clecoed to the center nose
> ribs. I have ordered and tried several sets of ribs and they did not
> help the problem. I finally gave up one my first set of skins and
> recently ordered the second set along with another set of ribs. When the
>
> complete HZ stab is clecoed together, I continue to get a good 1/8th dip
>
> at the center nose ribs. I've tried shimming, but find it difficult to
> shim a 1/8" gap on both the top and bottom.
>
> I've been working on this for over a year. I gave up on it a while back
> and decided to finish my tail. Now that the tail is done, I must
> painfully complete the Hz stab. I've talked to Van's about this problem
> and their only response is that they have heard about this problem, but
> they feel it is only cosmetic, so live with it. I simply can't accept
> such a glaring dent.
>
> Has anyone else experienced this problem and what did you do to fix it?
>
> Thanks
>
> --
> Kevin Behrent
> kbehrent(at)cascadiasoftware.com
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Nightingale Michael" <NightingaleMichael(at)JohnDeere.com> |
| Subject: | Horz Stab Center Rib Problem |
Kevin:
Our HS is done and it has the dips you describe. After all this is a metal
air plane and we are NOT building watches (quote from a fellow builder), so
get over it and move on.
Michael V. Nightingale
Deere & Co. Computer Center
400 19th ST.
Moline, IL. 61265
pager 563-327-7891
nightingalemichael(at)johndeere.com
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Kevin Behrent [SMTP:kbehrent(at)cascadiasoftware.com]
> Sent: Thursday, November 29, 2001 12:14 PM
> To: rv9-List
> Subject: RV9-List: Horz Stab Center Rib Problem
>
>
>
> I am a very frustrated builder having problems with my Hz stab skins. I
>
> am getting a good 1/8+ dip when the skin is clecoed to the center nose
> ribs. I have ordered and tried several sets of ribs and they did not
> help the problem. I finally gave up one my first set of skins and
> recently ordered the second set along with another set of ribs. When the
>
> complete HZ stab is clecoed together, I continue to get a good 1/8th dip
>
> at the center nose ribs. I've tried shimming, but find it difficult to
> shim a 1/8" gap on both the top and bottom.
>
> I've been working on this for over a year. I gave up on it a while back
> and decided to finish my tail. Now that the tail is done, I must
> painfully complete the Hz stab. I've talked to Van's about this problem
> and their only response is that they have heard about this problem, but
> they feel it is only cosmetic, so live with it. I simply can't accept
> such a glaring dent.
>
> Has anyone else experienced this problem and what did you do to fix it?
>
> Thanks
>
> --
> Kevin Behrent
> kbehrent(at)cascadiasoftware.com
>
>
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Andy Karmy <andy.karmy(at)gettyimages.com> |
| Subject: | Horz Stab Center Rib Problem |
Hey Kevin,
After going through it myself (like everyone else) Yes mine are dipped in... I
know we have talked about it at the EAA meetings before, but try this one on?
I came up with an idea while doing the Vertical Fin. As you remeber it's not pre-punched
and in some ways it was kind of neat building a few parts that way.
So, how about it you take one of the nose ribs, hammer it flat on your backrivet
plate, then cut out a wood block that fits the nose skin better. Use a rib
as a template and just give it more of a curve in that nose section. Then form
a new rib on the block out of some new material. Then you can just put it in
there as a non prepunched rib and drill it into place.
In looking at the ribs it seems the key problem is that the rib has too straight
of a section on the flange over the first 2 inches or so of it's length. If
you could loft it by that 1/8 of an inch you would be all set.
Then just think how many ribs you could sell to everyone else once you have the
block perfected.
Andy Karmy (fellow RV9 builder)
andy.karmy(at)gettyimages.com
-----Original Message-----
From: Kevin Behrent [mailto:kbehrent(at)cascadiasoftware.com]
I am a very frustrated builder having problems with my Hz stab skins. I
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Mark Schrimmer <mschrimmer(at)pacbell.net> |
| Subject: | Flap and aileron brackets |
I'd like to rivet the flap brackets to the ribs and the aileron brackets to
the rear spar before I rivet the entire skeleton and top skin.
Does anybody see a problem with this? I think it will be easier to rivet the
brackets and angles before the top skin is put on instead of after.
Mark Schrimmer
RV-9A wings
Irvine, CA
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Im7shannon(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Flap and aileron brackets |
Hi Mark
I did just that, I riveted the brackets into the structure during assembly of
the skeleton, it looked like a real pain to do later on as the manual
described. Mine all came out fine.
Kevin Shannon
> I'd like to rivet the flap brackets to the ribs and the aileron brackets to
> the rear spar before I rivet the entire skeleton and top skin.
>
> Does anybody see a problem with this? I think it will be easier to rivet the
> brackets and angles before the top skin is put on instead of after.
>
> Mark Schrimmer
> RV-9A wings
> Irvine, CA
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Cliff Begnaud" <shoeless(at)barefootpilot.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Horz Stab Center Rib Problem |
Kevin,
I reshaped the rib, somewhat. Use your fluting pliers and hand seamer to do
it, requires some trial and error, and perhaps a few replacement ribs. But
ribs are cheaper than skins.
I did not completely eliminate the problem, but improved it.
Cliff
>
> I am a very frustrated builder having problems with my Hz stab skins. I
>
> am getting a good 1/8+ dip when the skin is clecoed to the center nose
> ribs. I have ordered and tried several sets of ribs and they did not
> help the problem. I finally gave up one my first set of skins and
> recently ordered the second set along with another set of ribs. When the
>
> complete HZ stab is clecoed together, I continue to get a good 1/8th dip
>
> at the center nose ribs. I've tried shimming, but find it difficult to
> shim a 1/8" gap on both the top and bottom.
>
> I've been working on this for over a year. I gave up on it a while back
> and decided to finish my tail. Now that the tail is done, I must
> painfully complete the Hz stab. I've talked to Van's about this problem
> and their only response is that they have heard about this problem, but
> they feel it is only cosmetic, so live with it. I simply can't accept
> such a glaring dent.
>
> Has anyone else experienced this problem and what did you do to fix it?
>
> Thanks
>
> --
> Kevin Behrent
> kbehrent(at)cascadiasoftware.com
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | John Oliveira <oliveira(at)frontiernet.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Flap and aileron brackets |
If you do it before the top skins, make sure they are clecoed on (top
skins as that is what gives the wing the rigidity you need. Especially
for aligning the center flap bracket.
Best advice on this would probably come from Vans. I did not find
riveting the brackets on with the skins on to be difficult.
John Oliveira
90054
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | gene(at)nvaircraft.com |
| Subject: | Horz Stab Center Rib Problem |
Yes I had the same problem and didn't get much help from Vans other then to be
told your too picky. I also went thru extra ribs and finally a second set of skins.
This is how I got around the problem. Starting with fresh skins and two
new ribs. I took the ribs and cut out the center section of both ribs and basically
turned them into a stiffner. I then back riveted the "stiffners" to
the top of the skin and bucked the rivets on the bottom. The results were no
dents. I will do the same thing again and save some money I think the skins
were about 75 bucks and the ribs about 6.
Gene formerly 90296
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Matt Dralle <dralle(at)matronics.com> |
| Subject: | [PLEASE READ] - Why Have A Fund Raiser Each Year? |
Listers,
A couple List Members have asked if the Lists are "in trouble financially"
and wanted to know if this is why I was having a Fund Raiser. It got to
thinking that perhaps I should explain why I have a Fund Raiser and also
take the opportunity to express why I think the List Services here provide
a far better experience than the commercial equivalents.
I use the List Fund Raiser each year to offset the costs involved with
running a high performance email list site such as this one. With the
annual support from the List members through the PBS-like Fund Raiser, I
have found I can run the entire site without having to inflect any of the
members with those annoying banner ads flashing up all the time trying to
sell Toner Cartridge Refills or other garbage nobody wants or needs. From
the comments I've received over the years regarding the Lists, the great
majority of the members really appreciate the non-commercialism of my List
systems and don't mind my 'go-team-go' banter once a year to encourage
members to support the Lists.
I believe that the Lists services that I provide here offer a great many
benefits over the commercial equivalents in a number of ways. The first
feature I believe to be particularly significant is that you *cannot*
receive a computer v*rus from any of my Lists directly. I've been on a few
other List servers and have been unfortunate enough to download infected
files people have innocently or not-so-innocently included with their
posts. This just can't happen with my Lists; each incoming message is
filtered and attachments stripped off prior to posting. I provide a Photo
and File Share feature that allows members to share files and bitmaps with
other members and everyone can be assured that these files will be
prescanned for any sort of v*rus before they are posted. Safe and
simple. Also, with this photo and file sharing technique, the Archives
don't get loaded up with a great amount of bitmap "data" that slows the
Archive Search times.
Another feature of this system is the extensive List Archives that are
available for download, browsing, and searching. The Archives go all the
way back to the very beginning of each List and with the super fast Search
Engine, the huge size of the Archives is a non-issue in quickly finding the
data you're looking for. Another feature of the Archives, in my opinion,
is that they have been primarily stripped of all the useless email header
data and all the other header garbage that seems to build up in a typical
email thread.
I have received an extremely positive response from Listers regarding the
new List Browse feature and the consensus is that the format and ease of
use is outstanding. Members report that having the previous 7 days worth
of messages online for easy browsing and sorting is hugely beneficial. And
again, as with the real time distribution of List email, the messages are
stripped of all the unnecessary email headers and potentially dangerous
v*ruses.
I've been running email Lists and services under the matronics.com domain
since about 1989 starting with RV-List and 30 guys I knew who where
building RVs. It has grown into nearly 40 different aviation-related Email
Lists and an associated web site that receives over 500,000 hits each
month!! With all the dot.bombs these days, I think there's a lot of value
in supporting a service that has gone the long haul and is still providing
and improving a high quality service at a price that's nearly free.
I have to admit running these Lists is a labor of love and I hope it shows
in the quality of the experience that you receive when you get a List Email
Message, Search the Archives, or use the List Browser. The Lists will be
here for a long time to come. If you just want to lurk a while for free,
that's great and I encourage you to do so. If you use, appreciate, and
receive value from these Lists, then please support them during the Annual
List Fund Raiser!
Thank you,
Matt Dralle
Email List Administrator
------------------------------------------
The SSL Secure Web Site:
http://www.matronics.com/contribution
The US Mail Address:
Matronics Email Lists
c/o Matt Dralle
PO Box 347
Livermore, CA 94550-7227
------------------------------------------
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Kevin Behrent <kbehrent(at)cascadiasoftware.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Horz Stab Center Rib Problem |
Andy,
Thanks for the suggestion. I believe I will try that and use "filler" as the last
resort. I've heard from others that have used filler on metal planes that after
a couple of years, it begins to crack and chip.
Andy Karmy wrote:
>
> Hey Kevin,
>
> After going through it myself (like everyone else) Yes mine are dipped in...
I know we have talked about it at the EAA meetings before, but try this one on?
>
> I came up with an idea while doing the Vertical Fin. As you remeber it's not
pre-punched and in some ways it was kind of neat building a few parts that way.
So, how about it you take one of the nose ribs, hammer it flat on your backrivet
plate, then cut out a wood block that fits the nose skin better. Use a rib
as a template and just give it more of a curve in that nose section. Then form
a new rib on the block out of some new material. Then you can just put it in
there as a non prepunched rib and drill it into place.
>
> In looking at the ribs it seems the key problem is that the rib has too straight
of a section on the flange over the first 2 inches or so of it's length. If
you could loft it by that 1/8 of an inch you would be all set.
>
> Then just think how many ribs you could sell to everyone else once you have the
block perfected.
>
> Andy Karmy (fellow RV9 builder)
> andy.karmy(at)gettyimages.com
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Kevin Behrent [mailto:kbehrent(at)cascadiasoftware.com]
>
> I am a very frustrated builder having problems with my Hz stab skins. I
>
--
Kevin Behrent
Cascadia Software, Inc.
3600 Port of Tacoma Road
Suite 210
Tacoma, WA 99424
(253) 896-4000 x104
kbehrent(at)cascadiasoftware.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Kevin Behrent <kbehrent(at)cascadiasoftware.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Horz Stab Center Rib Problem |
Great idea!
I already purchased new skins and ribs and wanted to get some suggestions before
attempting the second set.
gene(at)nvaircraft.com wrote:
>
> Yes I had the same problem and didn't get much help from Vans other then to be
told your too picky. I also went thru extra ribs and finally a second set of
skins. This is how I got around the problem. Starting with fresh skins and
two new ribs. I took the ribs and cut out the center section of both ribs and
basically turned them into a stiffner. I then back riveted the "stiffners" to
the top of the skin and bucked the rivets on the bottom. The results were no
dents. I will do the same thing again and save some money I think the skins
were about 75 bucks and the ribs about 6.
>
> Gene formerly 90296
>
--
Kevin Behrent
Cascadia Software, Inc.
3600 Port of Tacoma Road
Suite 210
Tacoma, WA 99424
(253) 896-4000 x104
kbehrent(at)cascadiasoftware.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | MARK BOYKIN <tarpon22(at)excite.com> |
| Subject: | RV9 QB WING Correction |
RE: RV9 QuickBuild WING-BOTTOM SKIN
My neighbor(RV7QB) and I(RV9QB) have discovered that the rib underneath the
bottom inboard wing skin where the double row of rivets joins the outboard
skin has not been dimpled or machined countersunk. The dimpled skin is
sitting on an unprepared rib. We are going to have to either remove some
rivets from the inboard skin to get a sqeezer in there or some other
ingenious method.
Also, the F 6118 Center Brake Support Angle is supposed to be riveted to the
vertical support angle on the firewall, but the stainless recess is in the
way. More fun. The factory should have mounted the Center Brake Suport
Angle before installing the stainless recess or should have left the recess
off.
Mark Boykin
Leeward Air Ranch, Ocala, FL
Send a friend your Buddy Card and stay in contact always with Excite Messenger
http://messenger.excite.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Horz Stab Center Rib Problem |
I had lots of problems with the center rib as well, but it was mostly just
in getting a bucking bar in there without dinging up the skin. That, and
they are some of the first rivets you do on the plane :)
Anyway, I was noticing that I was having trouble getting the skin tight
enough against the rib while riveting, so I made a couple of extra U blocks
out of particle board, using the ones that came with the kit as a guide. I
put one of these on both sides of the rib as close as I could get them
without interfering with the gun. I also clecoed the main rib in above the
nose rib, which helps the skin maintain the proper shape.
I don't seem to have any pucker here, but maybe I'm not picky enough. It
seems to me that the pucker some folks are seeing could be cause by the skin
only being clamped to the skeleton on the very ends of the structure. The
skin in the middle is wanting to bow out, and then if you rivet it in this
condition, you are pulling the skin into the rib only, causing the pucker.
Brian
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | DThomas773(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Horz Stab Center Rib Problem |
I also, as it seems most everyone has, have the same problem with horizontal
Stab. I thought it was just my lack of skill as a first time builder and
decided to accept it and move on. I think if I were doing another I would
attempt to add a couple more vee blocks. It too bad that the first rivets
you have to buck are the most difficult ones on the whole assembly!
Dennis Thomas
RV-9A #90164
Emp
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Matt Dralle <dralle(at)matronics.com> |
| Subject: | Free Stuff Reminder... |
Dear Listers,
Don't forget that you can receive a free copy of Van's new Video, "The RV
Story" with a $50 or greater contribution this year, or a $10 Gift
Certificate from Brown Tool for a $30 or greater contribution or a $25 Gift
Certificate for a $100 contribution. Below are two URLs for complete
information on the two Offers. Please follow the respective instructions
*carefully*.
Van's Video Offer Information:
http://www.matronics.com/searching/getmsg_script.cgi?INDEX=5781141?KEYS=asdf?LISTNAME=Yak?HITNUMBER=2?SERIAL=09092616692?SHOWBUTTONS=NO
Brown Aviation Tool Gift Certificate Information:
http://www.matronics.com/searching/getmsg_script.cgi?INDEX=5838463?KEYS=asdf?LISTNAME=Yak?HITNUMBER=2?SERIAL=09080216166?SHOWBUTTONS=NO
I want to thank Andy Gold of the Builder's Bookstore and Michael Brown of
Brown Aviation Tool Supply Co. for their generous offers in support the
Lists this year!! Thank you, guys!
I'd like to thank everyone that has already made a generous Contribution in
support of the Lists!
Thank you!
Matt Dralle
Email List Administrator
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Steve Sampson" <SSampson.SLN21(at)london.edu> |
| Subject: | Re: Horz Stab Center Rib Problem |
Dennis - you said it word for word for me too! I also thought it was me. I
was planning to use a little filler. What sort to use. Bondo? Does it stick
to bare or primed metal best??????
Thanks, Steve.
#90360
N Yorks. UK
----- Original Message -----
From: <DThomas773(at)aol.com>
Subject: Re: RV9-List: Horz Stab Center Rib Problem
>
> I also, as it seems most everyone has, have the same problem with
horizontal
> Stab. I thought it was just my lack of skill as a first time builder and
> decided to accept it and move on. I think if I were doing another I would
> attempt to add a couple more vee blocks. It too bad that the first rivets
> you have to buck are the most difficult ones on the whole assembly!
> Dennis Thomas
> RV-9A #90164
> Emp
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Andy Karmy" <andy(at)karmy.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Horz Stab Center Rib Problem |
Here's a message from an RV4 builder in our local EAA group. I've seen his test
sample, and it's on bare aluminum for good...
Before you dismiss using bondo, go to Canyon Auto Paints and get "Ultra Lite PLASTIC
FILLER with space age microspheres." Not expensive. An extra tube of hardener
is free for the asking, but it takes very tiny amounts of hardener to mix
correctly. Pot life is very short...just a couple minutes. It is polyester based
so it can't be used on top of epoxy, but a lot of Van's fiberglass is still
poly. Tom at Pailca's suggested it to me. I mixed a batch on a piece of aluminum
and I couldn't remove it with a chisel.
This product is made by "bondo" in terms of a company name.
- Andy Karmy
RV9 - Wings
andy(at)karmy.com
---------- Original Message ----------------------------------
From: "Steve Sampson" <SSampson.SLN21(at)london.edu>
Date: Fri, 30 Nov 2001 19:10:48 -0000
>
>Dennis - you said it word for word for me too! I also thought it was me. I
>was planning to use a little filler. What sort to use. Bondo? Does it stick
>to bare or primed metal best??????
>
>Thanks, Steve.
>
>#90360
>N Yorks. UK
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Mark Schrimmer <mschrimmer(at)pacbell.net> |
| Subject: | Bondo (Was Horz Stab Center Rib Problem) |
on 11/30/01 11:43 AM, Andy Karmy at andy(at)karmy.com wrote:
>
> Here's a message from an RV4 builder in our local EAA group. I've seen his
> test sample, and it's on bare aluminum for good...
>
> Before you dismiss using bondo, go to Canyon Auto Paints and get "Ultra Lite
> PLASTIC FILLER with space age microspheres."
Aircraft Spruce sells a product made by Bondo called Plastic Metal. Does
anybody have any experience using it?
Mark Schrimmer
RV-9A Wings
Irvine, CA
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Im7shannon(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Bondo (Was Horz Stab Center Rib Problem) |
Guys, later on in the project you will be laminating your windscreen to the
forward fuselage skin with epoxy resin such as West systems epoxy, I used
this same product to fix those little dings in the HS during this stage. And
also to fix the dings from the first time I could not resist sitting in the
fuselage while it was on sawhorses, my german sheppard tried to jump in
with me, and the forward sawhorse collapsed. It was a Kodak moment.
Kevin Shannon
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | DThomas773(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Horz Stab Center Rib Problem |
Hi Steve,
I think I'm just going leave mine the way the are. Otherwise they might fall
into the category of " the more I fixed, the worse it got". I read somewhere
that Bondo applied more than 1/16 inch thick was trouble. Poly Fibre makes a
product called "Feather Fill". It is 2 part, very light and very strong.
The problem is that it is so tough that is hard to work down smooth without
damaging the surrounding surface. Any filler I used would get a little
practice time on non-essential parts before putting it on my airplane.
Dennis Thomas
RV-9A Emp
#90164
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Marcel Bourgon" <mbourgon(at)elp.rr.com> |
| Subject: | Re: RV9 QB WING Correction |
We had the same problem with the quick build wing also.
We just counter sunk the skin and no problems.
Marcel 9A & 7A
----- Original Message -----
From: "MARK BOYKIN" <tarpon22(at)excite.com>
Subject: RV9-List: RV9 QB WING Correction
>
> RE: RV9 QuickBuild WING-BOTTOM SKIN
>
> My neighbor(RV7QB) and I(RV9QB) have discovered that the rib underneath
the
> bottom inboard wing skin where the double row of rivets joins the outboard
> skin has not been dimpled or machined countersunk. The dimpled skin is
> sitting on an unprepared rib. We are going to have to either remove
some
> rivets from the inboard skin to get a sqeezer in there or some other
> ingenious method.
>
> Also, the F 6118 Center Brake Support Angle is supposed to be riveted to
the
> vertical support angle on the firewall, but the stainless recess is in the
> way. More fun. The factory should have mounted the Center Brake Suport
> Angle before installing the stainless recess or should have left the
recess
> off.
>
> Mark Boykin
> Leeward Air Ranch, Ocala, FL
>
>
> Send a friend your Buddy Card and stay in contact always with Excite
Messenger
> http://messenger.excite.com
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | gene(at)nvaircraft.com |
| Subject: | Horz Stab Center Rib Problem |
No I did not consider that and actually I sort of wonder about the need for a rib
at that location, maybe overkill ! After it was done I tried to compress
the leading edge and had I not known I couldn't tell the rib was missing.
I sold my kit is the reason for the "formally 90296". I was done up to the point
of the point of needing the finish kit and have ordered that in my name for
the new owner. That way I can take advantage of Vans' second kit discount!!
I do intend to start again in the future and yes another 9
Gene
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Gary Newsted" <fcs(at)jlc.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Horz Stab Center Rib Problem |
In general, nose ribs must be dry-fitted and messed with to get a good fit
before you attempt to rivet them. They are problematic because the curvature of
the flanges will either leave sections which are flat, or ribs which do not lay
flat. Do not attempt to pull them into place with rivets or dents will result.
First make sure the ribs lay flat on a piece of glass. If not, flute them till
they do. Once that is OK, look them over and run your finger along the flanges.
If they clearly don't match the curvature of the skins, or there are high-spots
at the corners of the flange cuts, or long straight sections of flange, then run
the suckers along an upright belt sander to get the smooth curve you need. It
is OK to shape them with a wood block or small rubber mallet if need be. Don't
worry about shaving a little metal off the flanges as long as you don't go nuts
and make them paper thin. These ribs do not carry significant loads. It is
better to have them fit well, if nothing more than for cosmetics. Once you
have them as good as you can get, cleco them into place using every hole if
necessary, STARTING FROM THE NOSE and working rearward. Then rivet them
STARTING FROM THE NOSE and working rearward. This will assure that the skins
pull tight to the curve of the rib. If you work the other way it will push the
metal forward and result in a dent.
If worse comes to worse, it is OK to add a small strip of aluminum to shim up
the fit where needed, although this should not be necessary. In the fuel tank
nose ribs you will be using Proseal to seal the ribs. A dab of this goop
(cured) would also help prevent dents if you are really picky.
I have used the belt sander on all of my ribs and they fit great. Just be sure
to primer them before riveting since you will have removed some of the alclad
plating. The elevator nose ribs are tough because of the tight quarters and
because you are new to the game. It gets easier.
Gary
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Gary Newsted" <fcs(at)jlc.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Horz Stab Center Rib Problem |
OK, I stand corrected, HS nose ribs, not Elevator nose ribs. You get the
idea....
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Mark Schrimmer <mschrimmer(at)pacbell.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Horz Stab Center Rib Problem |
on 11/30/01 6:21 PM, Gary Newsted at fcs(at)jlc.net wrote:
> These ribs do not carry significant loads. It is
> better to have them fit well, if nothing more than for cosmetics. Once you
> have them as good as you can get, cleco them into place using every hole if
> necessary, STARTING FROM THE NOSE and working rearward. Then rivet them
> STARTING FROM THE NOSE and working rearward. This will assure that the skins
> pull tight to the curve of the rib. If you work the other way it will push
> the metal forward and result in a dent.
>
Gary,
I did my riveting starting on the nose on my horizontal stab and it came out
fine. But have you done your leading edge D sections on the wings yet? Van's
instructions say to start at the aft edge and work toward the leading edge!
I've been wondering if I should start at the nose and work aft for the exact
reason you mention.
Mark Schrimmer
Working on 9A Wings
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bruce Cruikshank <cruikshank(at)home.com> |
Kevin,
I had the same problem. You'll notice the Vert. Stab.
skin is prebent more at the leading edge. The skin lays
over more. I bent the hor. stab. quite a bit more
(around a 3/4" pipe fastened to a piece of angle iron
for stability.). I bent the skin so that laying on the
bench the top of the skin was about 14 to 15 inches
above the table at the rear edge. The skins ended up
smooth. You have to bend it around something to keep
from reducing the radius at the leading edge.
Bruce
RV-9A wings
Castro Valley, CA
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Leland and Anne <federigo(at)pacbell.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Horz Stab Center Rib Problem |
Kevin, my HS nose skins don't look great but those on a fellow-chapter member's
project look good. He had some technique for putting more bend in the leading
edges without putting a crease in them. I think he bent the skins over a pipe
while squeezing with a pair of 2x4's hinged together. Leland
Kevin Behrent wrote:
am getting a good 1/8+ dip when the skin is clecoed to the center nose
> ribs. I have ordered and tried several sets of ribs and they did not
> help the problem. I finally gave up one my first set of skins and
> recently ordered the second set along with another set of ribs. When the
> complete HZ stab is clecoed together, I continue to get a good 1/8th dip
> at the center nose ribs.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Leland and Anne <federigo(at)pacbell.net> |
| Subject: | A-914 Control Stop |
The Exploded Iso View for the W-913 (on DWG 13) shows one orientation
for the A-914 control stop and the plan view in the upper right hand
corner of DWG 13 seems to show the part orientation rotated 90 degrees,
or am I looking at it wrong. Also, the ISO does not show any holes in
W-914B-R for the A-914 (nor is W-914B-R prepunched for them). Am I
supposed to backdrill those two holes?
Finally finished the inventory and found several parts shortages
(washers, bolts, pop-rivets, fuel tank drain valves & short tubing
lengths). I am glad that I took the time to do the inventory, but it was
painful. It helped having a $30 digital scale from Target for weighing
instead of counting.
Leland
RV9AQB
N666LC (Reserved)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Matt Dralle <dralle(at)matronics.com> |
Listers,
Below are some of the comments I've received just this week alone from
members along with their Contributions to support the Lists! What can I
say? Wow. I really appreciate the kind words and extremely positive
feedback and I would encourage you to read over a few of comments below. I
think they really say a mouthful...
The last couple of days have seen a huge increase in support!! Thank you
to all that have Contributed and to those that have rallied support for the
Lists! Since the response has been so wonderful recently, I plan to delay
the posting of the 2001 List of Contributors a few days to assure that
everyone will be included!
Won't you make your Contribution today to support the Lists?
------------------------------------------
The SSL Secure Web Site:
http://www.matronics.com/contribution
The US Mail Address:
Matronics Email Lists
c/o Matt Dralle
PO Box 347
Livermore, CA 94550-7227
------------------------------------------
Thank you to everyone for the kind words and support!
Matt Dralle
Email List Admin.
======== Some Great Comments on What The Lists Mean to its Members ==========
...great source of information, education,
relaxation, frustration, and socialization.
- John H.
Can't imagine what it would be like building
with out the Lists...
- Steven E.
Look forward to the list every day.
- Parker T.
I really enjoy reading the banter...
- Wesley H.
...enjoy the patter on construction tips and
possible problem areas.
- Richard N.
Couldn't have built my RV-4 without the List
and archives!!
- Warren M.
I have found the list to be a great help,
especially for a first time builder.
- Peter D.
I thoroughly enjoy the List.
- Larry B.
The List is a great resource.
- Dennis K.
The list is great entertainment.
- Gary Z.
Can't say enough about the good information
that I have received from reading the List.
- Robert C.
...it's the best!
- Steve F.
I'm addicted to the List!
- Rodney B.
The list has been a wonderful resource of
knowledge.
- Doug B.
As a first time builder, the lists have
been my most important source of information.
- James V.
It [read the List] is the first thing I do
every day is see what's new.
- Billie F.
The information available through the List
has made my flying safer...
- Dave R.
I get much more information about my plane
from this List than from all of my aviation
magazines combined.
- Roger H.
I love the list!!!!
- Ken L.
Much better value than a magazine subscription.
- Ted M.
...found it very useful.
- Allan J.
...this list has been a great service to me.
- Peter F.
I cannot express just how USEFUL the Lists are.
- Geoff T.
...a tremendous help to my RV-8 project and
a way to meet some of the best people going.
- Steve G.
The List is invaluable, and the best I've
ever seen.
- Ed C.
Like another family for many of us.
- John H.
The lists have saved a bunch of calls to
Van's for guidance.
- James V.
I think I'm addicted...
- Terry C.
Love it!
- David W.
The information really helps...
- Jim P.
...I find [it] very informative.
- Real D.
...List keeps me motivated... - Cliff M.
The exchange of information is really helpful...
- M.N.
Lots of great info on the List.
- Larry D.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Burl Nelson" <AIRPILOT(at)worldnet.att.net> |
Filling a small dent on the Hz will be good practice for the up coming
major task of bonding the Plexiglas to the aluminum.I use epoxy with a
long pot life and microballoons.
Burl
N9XV
90218
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Leland and Anne <federigo(at)pacbell.net> |
| Subject: | Re: RV9 QB WING Correction |
A fellow chapter member with an RV7QB kit has the same dimpling and countersinking
problem that you mention. Those on my RV9QB kit were done correctly. Leland
MARK BOYKIN wrote:
>
> My neighbor(RV7QB) and I(RV9QB) have discovered that the rib underneath the
> bottom inboard wing skin where the double row of rivets joins the outboard
> skin has not been dimpled or machined countersunk. The dimpled skin is
> sitting on an unprepared rib. We are going to have to either remove some
> rivets from the inboard skin to get a sqeezer in there or some other
> ingenious method.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Steve Sampson" <SSampson.SLN21(at)london.edu> |
Burl - How thick did you make the mix? How didi it sand? Did you have any
concerns when you were sanding that the epoxy was harder than the ally?
Steve.
#90360
----- Original Message -----
From: "Burl Nelson" <AIRPILOT(at)worldnet.att.net>
Subject: RV9-List: Small dents
>
> Filling a small dent on the Hz will be good practice for the up coming
> major task of bonding the Plexiglas to the aluminum.I use epoxy with a
> long pot life and microballoons.
> Burl
> N9XV
> 90218
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Leland and Anne <federigo(at)pacbell.net> |
Could anybody finding discrepancies on their Bag List or Packing List
please post them here or e-mail the shortages to me. Van's is glad to
send out the missing parts but it would be helpful if we could sort out
the shortages before needing the parts.
I am just barely into the wings of my QuickBuild project and find that
the QuickBuild Bag List does not have enough AN3-4A bolts (only 4 in Bag
1969) to even attach the A-906 and A-907 (10 needed for both wings). The
kit lacks AN316-5R jam nuts (only 2 in Bag 1971) and 4 are needed for
the W-917 aileron control tubes. The 2001-2002 catalogue says that the
Fuel Tank Quick Drains (CAV-110) are supplied with the wing kit, but
there are none listed on my Bag List.
Leland in Pleasanton, California
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | New Email List Photo Share Available! |
RV7-List(at)matronics.com, RV8-List(at)matronics.com, RV9-List(at)matronics.com
| From: | Email List Photo Shares <pictures(at)matronics.com> |
A new Email List Photo Share is available:
Subject: Buick Aluminum Block
http://www.matronics.com/photoshare/tbird@ptsi.net/index.html
---------------------------------
EMAIL LIST PHOTO SHARE
Share your files and photos with other List members simply by
emailing the files to:
pictures(at)matronics.com
Please view the typical Share above and include the Description Text
Fields as shown along with your submission of files and photos.
---------------------------------
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | New Email List Photo Share Available! |
RV9-List(at)matronics.com
| From: | Email List Photo Shares <pictures(at)matronics.com> |
A new Email List Photo Share is available:
Subject: Metal Engine Plenum Baffle
http://www.matronics.com/photoshare/doneaves@midsouth.rr.com/index.html
---------------------------------
EMAIL LIST PHOTO SHARE
Share your files and photos with other List members simply by
emailing the files to:
pictures(at)matronics.com
Please view the typical Share above and include the Description Text
Fields as shown along with your submission of files and photos.
---------------------------------
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | New Email List Photo Share Available! |
RV9-List(at)matronics.com
| From: | Email List Photo Shares <pictures(at)matronics.com> |
A new Email List Photo Share is available:
Subject: Cabin Air Exhaust Photos
http://www.matronics.com/photoshare/grobdriver@yahoo.com/index.html
---------------------------------
EMAIL LIST PHOTO SHARE
Share your files and photos with other List members simply by
emailing the files to:
pictures(at)matronics.com
Please view the typical Share above and include the Description Text
Fields as shown along with your submission of files and photos.
---------------------------------
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Paulbaird(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Parts Shortages |
We were missing a lot of stuff from the bags. We were missing k1000-08
platenuts, an3-6a bolts, a couple hundred rivets, some nuts, and an426ad3-3
rivets weren't even on the hardware packing list, but we need them for the
trailing edge wing top skins.
I talked to Tom Green about it and he said they are still figuring out
the hardware for the RV9 QB. They are happy to send the stuff out but it
sure holds us up on construction!
Paul
90355
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Burl Nelson" <AIRPILOT(at)worldnet.att.net> |
Steve, I mix as much microballoons as possible with the epoxy to get a
creamy wet material. You must have a clean sanded surface to get adhesion, I
have made samples on aluminum & pleglass to check for adhesion I suggest you
do the same. After a very careful application using not to much filler,
less is better than to much(you can put on a second coat).I put electrical
tape on the bare aluminum for protection and to allow me to sand the filler
level with the tape. I then remove the tape, prime the filled area and a
couple of inches outside the filled area, then when you sand the filler to a
feather edge you can see the aluminum coming through the primer STOP.
Burl
----- Original Message -----
From: "Steve Sampson" <SSampson.SLN21(at)london.edu>
Subject: Re: RV9-List: Small dents
>
> Burl - How thick did you make the mix? How didi it sand? Did you have any
> concerns when you were sanding that the epoxy was harder than the ally?
>
> Steve.
> #90360
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Burl Nelson" <AIRPILOT(at)worldnet.att.net>
> To:
> Subject: RV9-List: Small dents
>
>
> >
> > Filling a small dent on the Hz will be good practice for the up coming
> > major task of bonding the Plexiglas to the aluminum.I use epoxy with a
> > long pot life and microballoons.
> > Burl
> > N9XV
> > 90218
> >
> >
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Albert Gardner" <albert.gardner(at)worldnet.att.net> |
Hey Kevin, what do you think of the ControlVision set up now that you've put
some hours on it? As I recall your initial impression was that the screen
was a little small and mounting the thing in the panel might prove to be too
far away.
Albert Gardner
Yuma, AZ
(Cussing the canopy)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Kevin Behrent <kbehrent(at)cascadiasoftware.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Hor Stab Skin |
Sounds like a good idea. I do notice that when I picked up my second set of
skins, they were only wrapped around the ends which causes the middle section
to push out. I believe this also contributes to the poor fit.
Did you use the 3/4" pipe on inside of the leading edge in order to bend the
skin over? What did you use to press down on the skin?
Bruce Cruikshank wrote:
>
> Kevin,
>
> I had the same problem. You'll notice the Vert. Stab.
> skin is prebent more at the leading edge. The skin lays
> over more. I bent the hor. stab. quite a bit more
> (around a 3/4" pipe fastened to a piece of angle iron
> for stability.). I bent the skin so that laying on the
> bench the top of the skin was about 14 to 15 inches
> above the table at the rear edge. The skins ended up
> smooth. You have to bend it around something to keep
> from reducing the radius at the leading edge.
>
> Bruce
> RV-9A wings
> Castro Valley, CA
>
--
Kevin Behrent
Cascadia Software, Inc.
3600 Port of Tacoma Road
Suite 210
Tacoma, WA 99424
(253) 896-4000 x104
kbehrent(at)cascadiasoftware.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Dave Nicholson" <dnick2(at)home.com> |
| Subject: | Installing Optional Steps |
I have gotten to the point of trimming the scallops on the flanges of the
F-623 Corner Ribs and can not find any reference for the distance from the
F-976 Center Bottom Skin to the lower surface to the Plastic Blocks (attach
to the F-726 Baggage Ribs) that receive the Inboard ends of the Step Tubes.
This dimension will determine the slope of the Step Tubes, and hence how
deep to cut the scallops in the F-623 Ribs.
Dave Nicholson
Fuselage - 90347
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Leland and Anne <federigo(at)pacbell.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Parts Shortages |
I talked to Gus a Van's this morning and it seems that his list contains eight
more bags than my Packing List. My List does not have a date but I picked up
the kit on 11/6/01. Hopefully this will cover most of my shortages. Gus said
they are still improving the list.
Leland
RV9QB Wings
>
> We were missing a lot of stuff from the bags.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | barry pote <barrypote(at)home.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Installing Optional Steps |
When I did this, I believe there was a pre-punched hole in the skin that
was where you put the entry hole, and I believe I put the block on the
bottom skin, and trimmed the corner rib till everything cleared.
The thing I didn't like was the specified drill pattern on the flange of
the step didn't match (even remotely) the skin upright ribs.
Barry Pote RV9a fuselage
snip
>
> I have gotten to the point of trimming the scallops on the flanges of the
> F-623 Corner Ribs and can not find any reference for the distance from the
> F-976 Center Bottom Skin to the lower surface to the Plastic Blocks (attach
> to the F-726 Baggage Ribs) that receive the Inboard ends of the Step Tubes.
>
> This dimension will determine the slope of the Step Tubes, and hence how
> deep to cut the scallops in the F-623 Ribs.
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Paulbaird(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Parts Shortages |
I got the new hardware bags yesterday and they didn't cover all of the
shortages that I have. I'm still missing a lot of stuff.
Paul
90355
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | DThomas773(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Parts Shortages |
Kit shortages. I am surprised that you folks are finding so many shortages.
In my empennage kit I was shorted absolutey nothing. I picked up my wing kit
in February and got side tracked, didn't inventory it until last week.
Everything was there except 2 minor parts which Van's took my word for and
shipped cost free.
Dennis Thomas
wings
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | barry pote <barrypote(at)home.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Parts Shortages |
do not archivie
Likewise, but waws missing all of a bindle , I believe it was #13, when
I got the fuselage kit. They made up for it in the 1st 2 kits. I had
extra parts. I notified them and they said to use them for practice.
Barry Pote fuselage
DThomas773(at)aol.com wrote:
>
>
> Kit shortages. I am surprised that you folks are finding so many shortages.
> In my empennage kit I was shorted absolutey nothing. I picked up my wing kit
> in February and got side tracked, didn't inventory it until last week.
> Everything was there except 2 minor parts which Van's took my word for and
> shipped cost free.
> Dennis Thomas
> wings
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Tom" <treed(at)cinci.rr.com> |
| Subject: | Skin Dimpling and Cracks |
Folks,
Just finished the RV9 emp and have begun work on the wings.
As I am preparing the spars for the fuel tank attach nutplates, I am
advised to create a test piece of .032 skin stock, dimple it for #8
screw, and then machine countersink the spar until the dimple fits. When
I drill the original hole in the test piece and begin to dimple it, I
work progressively from a #6 to a #8 die, in hopes of keeping the actual
hole size as small (and tight fitting around the screw) as possible.
This also seems to minimize distortion. However, by the time I dimple
for the #8, the backside of the dimple has stretched the skin material
so far it shows signs of cracking.
Can anyone tell me how to keep the hole size reasonably small so the
screw isn't sloppy, but still minimize the distortion associated with
dimpling so the skin doesn't crack?
Thanks in advance,
Tom Reed
N91TR
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | PERRYMAN Larry <Larry.PERRYMAN(at)atofina.com> |
| Subject: | Skin Dimpling and Cracks |
Short of annealing the skin (NOT a good idea) there is not a way. Any time
you force a material to stretch (dimple) there will be small cracks unless
the material is so soft that it will flow with the die. That is why the
recommendation to burnish the back side of all dimples with scotchbrite pad
to smooth out the cracks.
The majority of the holding force will be with the shoulders of the screw,
not the hole size.
At least that is my opinion. I am sure others will jump in with more advice.
Happy building.
Larry Perryman
90288 (Finish kit gets here tomorrow)
Conroe TX.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | gene(at)nvaircraft.com |
| Subject: | Skin Dimpling and Cracks |
One method would be to get yourself some aluminum flat bar and drill a pilot hole
the diameter of the pilot on your machine counter sink. Put his under the flange
of your spar and line up the holes. Then clamp this guide in place. You
can then machine countersink the hole without the c' sink wandering around.
Sorry I can't take any credit for this idea, I remember another lister posting
this a while back!
The method that I used after screwing up a hole or two with the c"sink was to squeeze
them. I know the manual says to not do this as it could cause distortion.
I got a scrap piece of autumn the same thickness as the spar. I bent it with
the same bend radius and drilled about ten holes the same size and spacing
as the spar. I basically built a copy of a short spar section. I then used my
pneumatic queer. There was no distortion at all. I tried some holes on the real
thing and got the same results. All I can say is it worked for me.
Gene
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Guy Votuc" <guy(at)votuc.com> |
| Subject: | Elevator Counterweight |
Ok, I just finished my left elevator and found the counterweight ( after
carefull trimming to plans ) to be too light to keep the thing balanced .
This is with epoxy primer on the surface but no paint yet. I figure adding
paint will only make it worse as most of the weight will be aft. I have to
lay most of what I cut off the lead weight on the fiberglass tip above the
counterweight location to "balance" it. I thought maybe I riveted my cat in
the thing but saw it running around outside later ( no such luck ). Also
noticed a even but very small gap between the counterbalance skin and
elevator edge, maybe 3/16 with the weight within paper thickness of rubbing.
Anyone else have to deal with this ?
Guy
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Gary Newsted" <fcs(at)jlc.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Skin Dimpling and Cracks |
Don't second guess the tool designers. Just make it a #8 from the
start. The "sloppiness" you report is by design. Screws into nutplates
do not always align as one might like, so the little extra room is by
design. Trust me, once all those suckers are screwed down, it
aint going nowhere!
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Gary Newsted" <fcs(at)jlc.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Elevator Counterweight |
The counterweight is not intended to cause a perfect balance. It is
more for anti-flutter than anything. If you cut it per plan, it is certain
to be close enough. The true weight of the control surfaces would
have to consider the control-rod, attach bolts, trim linkage, etc.
I wouldn't be concerned over how it appears now.
The close-fit between the weight and skin is a legitimate concern.
Mine also had an uncomfortably close fit. When you can envision
a failure mode, it is worth thinking about some more.
First make sure you check it with the fiberglass tip in place. To a small
degree, you can adjust the gap through hinge-rod-end adjustment and
shim washers. Make sure you've got the rod-ends adjusted to the
right heights. I also noticed that the head of the bolt holding the
lead weight stuck up higher than the weight itself, so I flat-drilled the
countersink in the lead to lower it. Even with this, I was still not
happy with the clearance, so I did a bit of touch-up filing with a flat
file along the counterbalance skins and it is a problem no more!
You really only have to remove a tiny amount to gain piece of mind.
The gap is now equal on both sides and all the way down the chord.
Gary
----- Original Message -----
From: Guy Votuc <guy(at)votuc.com>
Subject: RV9-List: Elevator Counterweight
>
> Ok, I just finished my left elevator and found the counterweight ( after
> carefull trimming to plans ) to be too light to keep the thing balanced .
> This is with epoxy primer on the surface but no paint yet. I figure adding
> paint will only make it worse as most of the weight will be aft. I have to
> lay most of what I cut off the lead weight on the fiberglass tip above the
> counterweight location to "balance" it. I thought maybe I riveted my cat in
> the thing but saw it running around outside later ( no such luck ). Also
> noticed a even but very small gap between the counterbalance skin and
> elevator edge, maybe 3/16 with the weight within paper thickness of rubbing.
> Anyone else have to deal with this ?
>
> Guy
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Guy Votuc" <guy(at)votuc.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Elevator Counterweight |
Yea , I was about to grab the flat file myself a do a little trimming. I can
just imagine a little ice in that gap with me bending the stick between my
legs trying to break it free.... I agree about the flutter thing but am
going by Vans instructions that indicate the Elevators should remain "in
trail" after painting when balanced properly. I'll check everything again
after tying the two together but I think I'll leave the right side weights
on the heavy side. Thanks
Guy
----- Original Message -----
From: "Gary Newsted" <fcs(at)jlc.net>
Subject: Re: RV9-List: Elevator Counterweight
>
> The counterweight is not intended to cause a perfect balance. It is
> more for anti-flutter than anything. If you cut it per plan, it is
certain
> to be close enough. The true weight of the control surfaces would
> have to consider the control-rod, attach bolts, trim linkage, etc.
> I wouldn't be concerned over how it appears now.
>
> The close-fit between the weight and skin is a legitimate concern.
> Mine also had an uncomfortably close fit. When you can envision
> a failure mode, it is worth thinking about some more.
>
> First make sure you check it with the fiberglass tip in place. To a small
> degree, you can adjust the gap through hinge-rod-end adjustment and
> shim washers. Make sure you've got the rod-ends adjusted to the
> right heights. I also noticed that the head of the bolt holding the
> lead weight stuck up higher than the weight itself, so I flat-drilled the
> countersink in the lead to lower it. Even with this, I was still not
> happy with the clearance, so I did a bit of touch-up filing with a flat
> file along the counterbalance skins and it is a problem no more!
> You really only have to remove a tiny amount to gain piece of mind.
> The gap is now equal on both sides and all the way down the chord.
>
> Gary
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: Guy Votuc <guy(at)votuc.com>
> To:
> Subject: RV9-List: Elevator Counterweight
>
>
> >
> > Ok, I just finished my left elevator and found the counterweight ( after
> > carefull trimming to plans ) to be too light to keep the thing balanced
.
> > This is with epoxy primer on the surface but no paint yet. I figure
adding
> > paint will only make it worse as most of the weight will be aft. I have
to
> > lay most of what I cut off the lead weight on the fiberglass tip above
the
> > counterweight location to "balance" it. I thought maybe I riveted my cat
in
> > the thing but saw it running around outside later ( no such luck ). Also
> > noticed a even but very small gap between the counterbalance skin and
> > elevator edge, maybe 3/16 with the weight within paper thickness of
rubbing.
> > Anyone else have to deal with this ?
> >
> > Guy
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Larry Perryman" <larry-perryman(at)txucom.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Elevator Counterweight |
On mine, the right is light and the left is heavy with the electric trim.
Together they are about right.
Not wanting to change the weight, I took a hammer and peened the exposed
weight and was able to gain additional clearance without removing lead. You
can always drill out some if the weight is still to heavy after painting but
it is hard to add any.
Regards
Larry Perryman
The finish kit arrives tomorrow about noon. Ignore all shouts of joy from
Texas.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Dave Nicholson" <dnick2(at)home.com> |
| Subject: | Riveting Preperation on F-904A & B Lower Flange |
Should I countersink or dimple the Lower Flange of F-904A & B (other than
the 4 holes specified in Note 1 on Dwg 28)?
Dave Nicholson
Fuselage
90347
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Gary Newsted" <fcs(at)jlc.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Riveting Preperation on F-904A & B Lower Flange |
Countersink. Don't try to dimple a spar flange.
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | [ Ken Brooks ] : New Email List Photo Share Available! |
RV6-List(at)matronics.com, RV7-List(at)matronics.com, RV8-List(at)matronics.com,
RV9-List(at)matronics.com, Homebuilt-List(at)matronics.com,
Zenith-List(at)matronics.com, Tailwind-List(at)matronics.com,
Kolb-List(at)matronics.com
| From: | Email List Photo Shares <pictures(at)matronics.com> |
A new Email List Photo Share is available:
Subject: Portable Bench Power Tool Cart
http://www.matronics.com/photoshare/kdbrv8r@charter.net.12.06.2001/index.html
---------------------------------
EMAIL LIST PHOTO SHARE
Share your files and photos with other List members simply by
emailing the files to:
pictures(at)matronics.com
Please view the typical Share above and include the Description Text
Fields as shown along with your submission of files and photos.
---------------------------------
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Mark Schrimmer <mschrimmer(at)pacbell.net> |
| Subject: | Aileron brackets |
My aileron brackets have always had a slight gap between the two halves. I
guess the recessed area for the bearing wasn't machined deep enough. I
thought the two halves might pull together when riveted. Instead, the gap
has opened even wider after riveting. I can easily fit a scrap piece of .020
aluminum between the two halves.
Is this a problem structurally? Has this happened to anybody else's
brackets? I notice a fellow 9A builder's brackets are perfectly flush after
the bearing is inserted.
Mark Schrimmer
Working on wings
Irvine, CA
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Paulbaird(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Aileron brackets |
Mark,
All I know is ours came together nice and flush. I don't know what to
tell you but check with Van's and good luck.
Paul
90355
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Cliff Begnaud" <shoeless(at)barefootpilot.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Aileron brackets |
Mark,
Mine are flush. There is a recess that the bearing sits in, on each half.
Make sure the recesses face each other!
Cliff
> My aileron brackets have always had a slight gap between the two halves. I
> guess the recessed area for the bearing wasn't machined deep enough. I
> thought the two halves might pull together when riveted. Instead, the gap
> has opened even wider after riveting. I can easily fit a scrap piece of
.020
> aluminum between the two halves.
>
> Is this a problem structurally? Has this happened to anybody else's
> brackets? I notice a fellow 9A builder's brackets are perfectly flush
after
> the bearing is inserted.
>
> Mark Schrimmer
> Working on wings
> Irvine, CA
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Elevator control horn riveting |
So, I faithfully followed the directions in the construction manual
for the right elevator, which state to rivet the top side of the 901
skin to the elevator skeleton before fitting the wd-605 control horn.
If I'd thought ahead I would have realized it would be impossible to
rivet the control horn to the spar later, but now I'm stuck. The
angle of the root rib and the presence of the leading edge in front
of the spar make it impossible to get to about three of the rivets
(the ones closest to the skin that is riveted on). The squeezer body
won't fit, and the gun won't fit either.
I already called Van's about this, and they suggested either drilling
out the skeleton rivets (ACK!) or cutting the leading edge to get the
gun in there, then riveting it back together with a backing strip.
So, now I ask the resourceful members of this list. Am I the only
one that has done this? Any suggestions on where to find a right
angle rivet gun? :-)
Brian
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Stein Bruch" <stein(at)steinair.com> |
| Subject: | Elevator control horn riveting |
Brian,
Cherry Rivets are your best friends in these predicaments! Only if you
can't pull some solid rivets would I resort to "Un-building". Each time to
dissasemble things, they get a tad bit looser, and if possible try not to.
Cheers,
Stein Bruch
RV6, MSP, Wiring/Cowling/Oil Lines.
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv9-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv9-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of Brian Woodruff
Subject: RV9-List: Elevator control horn riveting
So, I faithfully followed the directions in the construction manual
for the right elevator, which state to rivet the top side of the 901
skin to the elevator skeleton before fitting the wd-605 control horn.
If I'd thought ahead I would have realized it would be impossible to
rivet the control horn to the spar later, but now I'm stuck. The
angle of the root rib and the presence of the leading edge in front
of the spar make it impossible to get to about three of the rivets
(the ones closest to the skin that is riveted on). The squeezer body
won't fit, and the gun won't fit either.
I already called Van's about this, and they suggested either drilling
out the skeleton rivets (ACK!) or cutting the leading edge to get the
gun in there, then riveting it back together with a backing strip.
So, now I ask the resourceful members of this list. Am I the only
one that has done this? Any suggestions on where to find a right
angle rivet gun? :-)
Brian
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Elevator control horn riveting |
Yeah, I was hoping to use Cherry rivets here, but Van's said that
definitely no pop rivets can be used on the control horn.
Brian
>
>Brian,
>
>Cherry Rivets are your best friends in these predicaments! Only if
>you
>can't pull some solid rivets would I resort to "Un-building". Each
>time to
>dissasemble things, they get a tad bit looser, and if possible try
>not to.
>
>Cheers,
>Stein Bruch
>RV6, MSP, Wiring/Cowling/Oil Lines.
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Cliff Begnaud" <shoeless(at)barefootpilot.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Elevator control horn riveting |
Brian,
I figured out early on that even though this is a very high quality kit, the
instructions often leave much to be desired. The order of riveting is often
given in the wrong order. So beware as you progress thru the kit.
Unfortunately, I have no suggestions on how to get out of your predicament.
Good Luck,
Cliff
>
> So, I faithfully followed the directions in the construction manual
> for the right elevator, which state to rivet the top side of the 901
> skin to the elevator skeleton before fitting the wd-605 control horn.
>
> If I'd thought ahead I would have realized it would be impossible to
> rivet the control horn to the spar later, but now I'm stuck. The
> angle of the root rib and the presence of the leading edge in front
> of the spar make it impossible to get to about three of the rivets
> (the ones closest to the skin that is riveted on). The squeezer body
> won't fit, and the gun won't fit either.
>
> I already called Van's about this, and they suggested either drilling
> out the skeleton rivets (ACK!) or cutting the leading edge to get the
> gun in there, then riveting it back together with a backing strip.
>
> So, now I ask the resourceful members of this list. Am I the only
> one that has done this? Any suggestions on where to find a right
> angle rivet gun? :-)
>
> Brian
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Marcel Bourgon" <mbourgon(at)elp.rr.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Elevator control horn riveting |
Greetings from El Paso
I have to agree with your assessment of the order van's sometimes tells you
proceed. Before we rivet any thing together now I look at it and see if it
makes sence. You also have to see how you back yourself out of the item you
are rivetting. Good common sence goes a long way
Marcel in El Paso
getting ready for fuselage
----- Original Message -----
From: "Cliff Begnaud" <shoeless(at)barefootpilot.com>
Subject: Re: RV9-List: Elevator control horn riveting
>
>
> Brian,
> I figured out early on that even though this is a very high quality kit,
the
> instructions often leave much to be desired. The order of riveting is
often
> given in the wrong order. So beware as you progress thru the kit.
> Unfortunately, I have no suggestions on how to get out of your
predicament.
> Good Luck,
> Cliff
>
> >
> > So, I faithfully followed the directions in the construction manual
> > for the right elevator, which state to rivet the top side of the 901
> > skin to the elevator skeleton before fitting the wd-605 control horn.
> >
> > If I'd thought ahead I would have realized it would be impossible to
> > rivet the control horn to the spar later, but now I'm stuck. The
> > angle of the root rib and the presence of the leading edge in front
> > of the spar make it impossible to get to about three of the rivets
> > (the ones closest to the skin that is riveted on). The squeezer body
> > won't fit, and the gun won't fit either.
> >
> > I already called Van's about this, and they suggested either drilling
> > out the skeleton rivets (ACK!) or cutting the leading edge to get the
> > gun in there, then riveting it back together with a backing strip.
> >
> > So, now I ask the resourceful members of this list. Am I the only
> > one that has done this? Any suggestions on where to find a right
> > angle rivet gun? :-)
> >
> > Brian
> >
> >
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Gary Newsted" <fcs(at)jlc.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Elevator control horn riveting |
Brian, if you only riveted the "top" skin to the elevator spar, then I take it
the "bottom" skin is still free? If so, you should still be able to get a rivet
gun on the control horn rivets by clamping the skeleton to a table and prying
the free bottom skin back. It's been a while since I did my elevator, but I
recall following the instructions too. Riveting was a real PITA, but doable.
It is best to use a long piece of wood to help pull the skin back evenly. I
clamped the section, tied back the skin with bungees, and knelt on the spar to
keep it from scooting around. Be creative! The bottom skins are attached
with blind-rivets per plan, but a number of hard-core-rivetheads have created
long bucking bars to snake inside the leading edge to use solid rivets! If you
have already blind-riveted the lower skin, I would suggest you drill out these
since they are easier to remove and less likely to damage the holes. Rest
assured, it gets easier,,, well maybe after you finish the tanks...
Gary
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Gary Newsted" <fcs(at)jlc.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Elevator control horn riveting |
Brian, another idea that comes to mind is that you might be able to fabricate
a
dimpled-bucking-bar. Start with a bar that will fit inside the leading edge
(yeah I know that's a tall order, but it can be done), next you need a dimple to
fit the rivet head. This can be done in one of two ways, if you have the means
to drill the appropriate rivet-head shape into the bar, do it. Otherwise,
drill a straight hole into the bar so that you can slip the right dimple-die
into the hole. Now that you have a bar with a dimple, back-rivet the rivets
from the back side of the spar using a flat (possibly offset) rivet set. If
you can envision it, it can work! Some who have built leading-edge bucking
bars say they work best if clamped in a table vise.
Gary
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Gary Newsted" <fcs(at)jlc.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Elevator control horn riveting |
Sorry bout all the replies; I guess this bothers me somehow. But on the subject
of Cherry rivets, I would never lump these into the "pop" rivet category!
First "Pop" is a trademark of relatively crappy rivets unsuitable for aircraft
structures (even a Zenith heh heh). "Blind" rivets can be found in every
aluminum aircraft from homebuilt to the Concorde. They come in a huge variety.
"Cherry" (div of Textron) is the best known blind rivet for aircraft. They
differ from most in that the anvil (the part that breaks away) remains firmly
embedded in the mushroomed head after breaking away. This creates a rivet that
rivals a solid in every measurable way. Lesser blind rivets, like Vans uses in
many places, have an anvil that falls out or kinda hangs on after breaking away
from the stem. I totally agree with Vans that these lesser rivets should never
be used where strength is an issue, particularly a control horn! However, I
would certainly trust the proper use of Cherry rivets as long as they were
properly sized and set. In fact, I ditched the lesser blind rivets Vans called
for in the control rod ends in favor of Cherry rivets. I was appalled to see
the recommendation, whereas the Cherries are, well,, Cherry! The proper size
is typically larger than the solid they replace for that added margin of safety.
So,,, after this lengthy promo, if you find yourself in a "real last resort
blind alley" don't feel bad about the proper application of blind rivets. I
once had the pleasure of closing up a spar bay on a DC10 after some X-Ray work.
We drew straws to see who got to do the job because it was fun. We got to use
explosive-blind-rivets! These babies work when you've gotta have a good fit!
You detonate them with a big soldering gun!
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Dave Nicholson" <dnick2(at)home.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Elevator control horn riveting |
Brian,
When I did my Elevators, I also "followed the instructions" and got into the
same bind you are in. I solved it by drilling out only about a dozen of the
"upper surface skin rivets", just to the point where I could "squeeze in "
enough tools to get at the last three rivets. I then closed up things in
the normal fashion.
When I did the left elevator, I was careful to get those "three nasty
rivets" just before I put in the last upper surface skin rivets. With a
full application of clecos, everything came out fine.
Dave Nicholson
Fuselage
90347
----- Original Message -----
From: "Brian Woodruff" <woodruff@dsl-only.net>
Subject: RV9-List: Elevator control horn riveting
>
> So, I faithfully followed the directions in the construction manual
> for the right elevator, which state to rivet the top side of the 901
> skin to the elevator skeleton before fitting the wd-605 control horn.
>
> If I'd thought ahead I would have realized it would be impossible to
> rivet the control horn to the spar later, but now I'm stuck. The
> angle of the root rib and the presence of the leading edge in front
> of the spar make it impossible to get to about three of the rivets
> (the ones closest to the skin that is riveted on). The squeezer body
> won't fit, and the gun won't fit either.
>
> I already called Van's about this, and they suggested either drilling
> out the skeleton rivets (ACK!) or cutting the leading edge to get the
> gun in there, then riveting it back together with a backing strip.
>
> So, now I ask the resourceful members of this list. Am I the only
> one that has done this? Any suggestions on where to find a right
> angle rivet gun? :-)
>
> Brian
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Elevator control horn riveting - Followup |
I love this list. I put out a cry for help, and y'all came up with many
ways I didn't think of to solve the problem.
I ended up doing as Gary suggested and just opened it up the skin as far as
possible. It opens up more than I thought it would! My wife held it open,
and I was able to get the offset rivet set in there and get those rivets
fairly easily.
Whew! Glad I didn't have to take it all apart. Moral of the story I guess
is to not take the instructions too literally!
Brian
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "C J Heitman" <cjh(at)execpc.com> |
| Subject: | Aileron brackets |
Mark,
I had the same problem. I didn't get any help from Van's so I used a piloted
countersink to make the recesses deeper.
Chris Heitman
Dousman WI
RV-9A N94ME (reserved)
hangar almost finished
http://www.execpc.com/~cjh/rv9a.html
-----Original Message-----
My aileron brackets have always had a slight gap between the two halves. I
guess the recessed area for the bearing wasn't machined deep enough. I
thought the two halves might pull together when riveted. Instead, the gap
has opened even wider after riveting. I can easily fit a scrap piece of .020
aluminum between the two halves.
Is this a problem structurally? Has this happened to anybody else's
brackets? I notice a fellow 9A builder's brackets are perfectly flush after
the bearing is inserted.
Mark Schrimmer
Working on wings
Irvine, CA
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Matt Dralle <dralle(at)matronics.com> |
| Subject: | New Photo Share Main Index Page - The Detail You Asked For... |
Hi Listers!
I've been noticing a lot of people having fun with the new Email List Photo
and File Share feature and I've seen a great many hits on the various
member pages.
A number of you wrote to say that some additional topic data on the Main
Photo Share Index page would certainly be helpful and I would have to agree.
It took a little programming, and it was a job retrofitting to all of the
older Shares, but I think you'll be pleased with the outcome! I've added
Poster Name, Photo Share Subject, and Target Email List data to the Main
Index. Clicking on a Subject text opens a new window with the Photo Share
and the thumbnails.
Have a look and feel free to submit your photos for sharing! The
instructions are at the top of the Main Photo Share Index Page.
The URL is:
http://www.matronics.com/photoshare
Enjoy!!
Matt Dralle
Email List Admin.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | John Oliveira <oliveira(at)frontiernet.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Elevator control horn riveting |
Have they changed the instructions along the way? I had no such problem
with mine. Riveted on the horns before the skins.
John Oliveira
90054
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Phil" <Phil(at)camsnet.com> |
| Subject: | Elevator control horn riveting - Followup |
Hello Group,
What is the correct way to rivet on the Elevator control horns? My plan is
to rivet the horns on to the
spar and ribs before the skin. Or does this cause a clearance problem?
Best regards,
Phil Johnston
JPL ENTERPRISES, INC.
1414 Boxwood Drive
Columbus, Ohio 43229
614-847-0506 home/fax
614-975-4192 cell
Phil(at)camsnet.com
RV-9A Kit Builder 90329 www.vansaircraft.com
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv9-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv9-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of Brian & Amanda
Woodruff
Subject: RV9-List: Elevator control horn riveting - Followup
<woodruff@dsl-only.net>
I love this list. I put out a cry for help, and y'all came up with many
ways I didn't think of to solve the problem.
I ended up doing as Gary suggested and just opened it up the skin as far as
possible. It opens up more than I thought it would! My wife held it open,
and I was able to get the offset rivet set in there and get those rivets
fairly easily.
Whew! Glad I didn't have to take it all apart. Moral of the story I guess
is to not take the instructions too literally!
Brian
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Elevator control horn riveting |
John,
When did you get your instructions? I got mine in early July, but Van's
said that their version says to rivet them in the correct order. Maybe they
have fixed it in subsequent versions. My instructions clearly say to rivet
the upper skin to the skeleton in the paragraph before they describe fitting
the control horn.
Brian
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv9-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv9-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of John Oliveira
Subject: Re: RV9-List: Elevator control horn riveting
Have they changed the instructions along the way? I had no such problem
with mine. Riveted on the horns before the skins.
John Oliveira
90054
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | tchoug <tchoug(at)micron.com> |
| Subject: | Elevator control horn riveting - Followup |
Phil,
That is exactly what I did and it worked out well. I think it took just a
little pressure on the rib to align it with the skin. When drilling for the
control horns, I measured and positioned each one carefully on each spar,
and found that I still had some misalignment when the elevators were
mounted. I don't think they ever come out exact no matter how careful you
are. However, if they're misaligned too much, you may not have enough
clearance around the control horn weld when you drill for the center
bearing. Mine came out very close, but should be OK. Another lister
mentioned a technique that I wish I had used. If you layout the spars,
inboard ribs and control horns end to end (as it will be assembled), and
then clamp the horns together and align the spars on a long flat surface,
you should be able to drill them and get very good alignment.
Good Luck,
Todd Houg
#90196 (still on the wings after a slow building summer!)
-----Original Message-----
From: Phil [mailto:Phil(at)camsnet.com]
Subject: RE: RV9-List: Elevator control horn riveting - Followup
Hello Group,
What is the correct way to rivet on the Elevator control horns? My plan is
to rivet the horns on to the
spar and ribs before the skin. Or does this cause a clearance problem?
Best regards,
Phil Johnston
JPL ENTERPRISES, INC.
1414 Boxwood Drive
Columbus, Ohio 43229
614-847-0506 home/fax
614-975-4192 cell
Phil(at)camsnet.com
RV-9A Kit Builder 90329 www.vansaircraft.com
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv9-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv9-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of Brian & Amanda
Woodruff
Subject: RV9-List: Elevator control horn riveting - Followup
<woodruff@dsl-only.net>
I love this list. I put out a cry for help, and y'all came up with many
ways I didn't think of to solve the problem.
I ended up doing as Gary suggested and just opened it up the skin as far as
possible. It opens up more than I thought it would! My wife held it open,
and I was able to get the offset rivet set in there and get those rivets
fairly easily.
Whew! Glad I didn't have to take it all apart. Moral of the story I guess
is to not take the instructions too literally!
Brian
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Phil" <Phil(at)camsnet.com> |
| Subject: | Dimpling the Rudder ribs |
Hello Group,
What is the best way to dimple the rudder ribs near the trialing edge? Less
than an inch clearance.
Best regards,
Phil Johnston
JPL ENTERPRISES, INC.
1414 Boxwood Drive
Columbus, Ohio 43229
614-847-0506 home/fax
614-975-4192 cell
Phil(at)camsnet.com
RV-9A Kit Builder www.vansaircraft.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Elevator control horn riveting - Followup |
Phil,
I think the way you describe is the correct way to do it. I'm going to
rivet them in that order on my left elevator.
I think I've found another order problem in the instructions. After you get
through the control horn mess, they tell you to cleco the bottom skin onto
the skeleton, then match drill the trailing edge wedge from the top and
cleco it into a flat table BEFORE you rivet the bottom skin to the skeleton.
Obviously, you can't lay the elevator down flat on the bottom side until the
clecos are gone, so I guess you're supposed to rivet the bottom side first.
Brian
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv9-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv9-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of Phil
Subject: RE: RV9-List: Elevator control horn riveting - Followup
Hello Group,
What is the correct way to rivet on the Elevator control horns? My plan is
to rivet the horns on to the
spar and ribs before the skin. Or does this cause a clearance problem?
Best regards,
Phil Johnston
JPL ENTERPRISES, INC.
1414 Boxwood Drive
Columbus, Ohio 43229
614-847-0506 home/fax
614-975-4192 cell
Phil(at)camsnet.com
RV-9A Kit Builder 90329 www.vansaircraft.com
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv9-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv9-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of Brian & Amanda
Woodruff
Subject: RV9-List: Elevator control horn riveting - Followup
<woodruff@dsl-only.net>
I love this list. I put out a cry for help, and y'all came up with many
ways I didn't think of to solve the problem.
I ended up doing as Gary suggested and just opened it up the skin as far as
possible. It opens up more than I thought it would! My wife held it open,
and I was able to get the offset rivet set in there and get those rivets
fairly easily.
Whew! Glad I didn't have to take it all apart. Moral of the story I guess
is to not take the instructions too literally!
Brian
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | tchoug <tchoug(at)micron.com> |
| Subject: | Dimpling the Rudder ribs |
I used a vise grips dimpler available from Cleaveland tools I believe. They
work great for those tight places, then it's just the riveting that becomes
the next challenge!
Todd Houg
N194TH reserved
-----Original Message-----
From: Phil [mailto:Phil(at)camsnet.com]
Subject: RV9-List: Dimpling the Rudder ribs
Hello Group,
What is the best way to dimple the rudder ribs near the trialing edge? Less
than an inch clearance.
Best regards,
Phil Johnston
JPL ENTERPRISES, INC.
1414 Boxwood Drive
Columbus, Ohio 43229
614-847-0506 home/fax
614-975-4192 cell
Phil(at)camsnet.com
RV-9A Kit Builder www.vansaircraft.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Dimpling the Rudder ribs |
The vice grip dimplers work well, but I ended up machine
countersinking the very last hole in one rudder rib because I
couldn't even use the vice grip dimplers on that one. I've since
ground one jaw of the vice grip dimplers down a little bit so they'll
get to a few more holes, so you might try that.
Brian
RV-9A elevators
>-----Original Message-----
>From: Phil [mailto:Phil(at)camsnet.com]
>To: rv9-list(at)matronics.com
>Subject: RV9-List: Dimpling the Rudder ribs
>
>
>Hello Group,
>
>What is the best way to dimple the rudder ribs near the trialing
>edge? Less
>than an inch clearance.
>
>Best regards,
>
>
>Phil Johnston
>
>JPL ENTERPRISES, INC.
>
>1414 Boxwood Drive
>
>Columbus, Ohio 43229
>
>614-847-0506 home/fax
>
>614-975-4192 cell
>
>
>Phil(at)camsnet.com
>
>RV-9A Kit Builder www.vansaircraft.com
>
>
>====
>====
>====
>====
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Gary Newsted" <fcs(at)jlc.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Elevator control horn riveting - Followup |
I'm happy to see the elevator rivets worked out. Todd is right in suggesting
that you carefully align and fit the control horns then clamp both elevators in
alignment before riveting the trailing edges and end ribs. While more skilled
craftsmen than I have managed to deliver a straight-and-true trailing edge, I
learned the hard way that "straight" is not necessarily "true". That is, each
elevator can look great, but when hung together they deviate from true course.
I was not happy with the control horns being a bit out of alignment and a
less-than-true trailing edge alignments, so I ended up drilling out one entire
trailing edge. I then clamped both elevator trailing edges together between the
two longeron angles that came in the wing kit and re-riveted the trailing edge.
The result was well worth the effort. I stand by this technique for flaps and
aileron riveting too. I built these hinged to the wing, standing upright, and
clamped along the trailing edge. The plans say use a table with holes drilled
for the clecos to stick through and lead shot bags! Boooooogus! My
opinion...
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Gary Newsted" <fcs(at)jlc.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Dimpling the Rudder ribs |
Phil, You can take a thin bucking bar end, drill and countersink a hole in it,
and use your male dimple die with a small mallet to set the dimples. Be
creative and don't hesitate to modify bars and tools. This little gizmo has
helped in many tight spots. I also built a pair of plier-dimplers as suggested.
Both tools are great to have around.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Leland and Anne <federigo(at)pacbell.net> |
| Subject: | Aileron Steel Control Tubes |
Can somebody tell me how to set the AN470AD4-12 rivets in the W-917
steel aileron rods without bending them over. My air squeezer does not
have enough poop for the job. I tried shortening the rivets a bit (since
a -12 is too long), holding the rod in a vice and squeezing with a Tatco
hand squeezer. Five out of five rivets had to be drilled out and need to
be replaced.
Note to QuickBuilders, check your kit for the presence of the MS24694
screws, AD970-3 washers and MS21083-N3 nuts that are required for
mounting the A-907 aileron brackets (on DWG13). They don't seem to be on
my inventory list. I let Gus know yesterday.
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Elevator control horn riveting - Followup |
Gary can you elaborate on your setup for riveting the trailing edges? It
sounds like you left the angle clamped in place somewhere above the trailing
edge while you riveted.
I used the method described in the RVator from a couple of months ago and my
rudder turned out dead straight. This involves drilling a piece of angle to
the hole spacing of the trailing edge, then spreading proseal along the edge
and clecoing through the angle and trailing edge. Once you let it set
overnight the proseal really does help keep it straight while you rivet.
I think I'm going to try to combine your suggestion with the proseal method.
If I get that thing glued together straight and have them both matched I
think it will turn out well.
Brian
RV-9a Elevators
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv9-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv9-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of Gary Newsted
Subject: Re: RV9-List: Elevator control horn riveting - Followup
I'm happy to see the elevator rivets worked out. Todd is right in
suggesting
that you carefully align and fit the control horns then clamp both elevators
in
alignment before riveting the trailing edges and end ribs. While more
skilled
craftsmen than I have managed to deliver a straight-and-true trailing edge,
I
learned the hard way that "straight" is not necessarily "true". That is,
each
elevator can look great, but when hung together they deviate from true
course.
I was not happy with the control horns being a bit out of alignment and a
less-than-true trailing edge alignments, so I ended up drilling out one
entire
trailing edge. I then clamped both elevator trailing edges together between
the
two longeron angles that came in the wing kit and re-riveted the trailing
edge.
The result was well worth the effort. I stand by this technique for flaps
and
aileron riveting too. I built these hinged to the wing, standing upright,
and
clamped along the trailing edge. The plans say use a table with holes
drilled
for the clecos to stick through and lead shot bags! Boooooogus! My
opinion...
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | [ Fabian Lefler ] : New Email List Photo Share Available! |
RV7-List(at)matronics.com, RV8-List(at)matronics.com, RV9-List(at)matronics.com
| From: | Email List Photo Shares <pictures(at)matronics.com> |
A new Email List Photo Share is available:
Subject: Wing Jig
http://www.matronics.com/photoshare/fablef@bellsouth.net.12.11.2001/index.html
--------------------------------------------
o EMAIL LIST PHOTO SHARE
Share your files and photos with other List members simply by
emailing the files to:
pictures(at)matronics.com
Please view the typical Share above and include the Description Text
Fields as shown along with your submission of files and photos.
o Main Photo Share Index:
http://www.matronics.com/photoshare
--------------------------------------------
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | [ Rob Ray ] : New Email List Photo Share Available! |
RV7-List(at)matronics.com, RV8-List(at)matronics.com, RV9-List(at)matronics.com
| From: | Email List Photo Shares <pictures(at)matronics.com> |
A new Email List Photo Share is available:
Subject: 160th F-16/RV Pilots
http://www.matronics.com/photoshare/smokyray@yahoo.com.12.11.2001/index.html
--------------------------------------------
o EMAIL LIST PHOTO SHARE
Share your files and photos with other List members simply by
emailing the files to:
pictures(at)matronics.com
Please view the typical Share above and include the Description Text
Fields as shown along with your submission of files and photos.
o Main Photo Share Index:
http://www.matronics.com/photoshare
--------------------------------------------
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Mark Schrimmer <mschrimmer(at)pacbell.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Aileron Steel Control Tubes |
on 12/11/01 9:43 PM, Leland and Anne at federigo(at)pacbell.net wrote:
>
> Can somebody tell me how to set the AN470AD4-12 rivets in the W-917
> steel aileron rods without bending them over. My air squeezer does not
> have enough poop for the job. I tried shortening the rivets a bit (since
> a -12 is too long), holding the rod in a vice and squeezing with a Tatco
> hand squeezer. Five out of five rivets had to be drilled out and need to
> be replaced.
>
Leland,
Did you consider using a large C-Frame tool with the shaft that fits a rivet
gun?
Mark Schrimmer
RV-9A wings
Irvine, CA
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Gary Newsted" <fcs(at)jlc.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Elevator control horn riveting - Followup |
I think you've got the general idea. Adding a dab of proseal would further help
set things straight and help prevent any pillowing of the trailing edge sheets
between rivets. I did this on the rudder since it is such thin metal. As
for clamping with long angles, that's about all there is to it. By clamping an
angle on top and bottom of the surface, and including both elevators, they can't
help but to come out straight and true. Be sure to leave the end rib rivets
open too so you can remove any twist before riveting.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Gary Newsted" <fcs(at)jlc.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Aileron Steel Control Tubes |
Try lots of little bitty taps on low pressure without appying a lot of arm
pressure. You could even resort to a ball-peen hammer instead of the gun.
They bend if you are leaning on them with heavy pressure. It also helps if you
take extra care to make the holes as tight as possible. Drop one drill bit size
so the rivets press firmly in (may be too late for this trick if you've already
drilled). I clamped a dimple-die in a vise, layed the control rod across it,
and riveted downward. Bent the first one, before I realized I was appying
excess gorrilla. Gotta go-rrilla-easy
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Albert Gardner" <albert.gardner(at)worldnet.att.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Dimpling the Rudder ribs |
You can dimple these ribs by bending the flanges and opening up a little
room for the dimpler and then bending the flange back to its original
position.
Albert Gardner
RV-9A: N872RV (Reserved)
Working on canopy
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Marcel Bourgon" <mbourgon(at)elp.rr.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Dimpling the Rudder ribs |
Greetings From El paso
We had the same problem. We just counter sunk them instead of dimpling
these ribs worked just fine.
Marcel
----- Original Message -----
From: "Albert Gardner" <albert.gardner(at)worldnet.att.net>
Subject: Re: RV9-List: Dimpling the Rudder ribs
>
>
> You can dimple these ribs by bending the flanges and opening up a little
> room for the dimpler and then bending the flange back to its original
> position.
> Albert Gardner
> RV-9A: N872RV (Reserved)
> Working on canopy
>
>
September 07, 2001 - December 14, 2001
RV9-Archive.digest.vol-ac