RV9-Archive.digest.vol-ai
December 12, 2002 - February 24, 2003
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Ken Moak <ken_moak(at)yahoo.com> |
| Subject: | Rudder, How to dimple a 903 tip rib? |
How do you dimple the R903 tip rib. It gets so narrow
I can not get a nail into the last couple of holes for
a pop rivet type dimpler, and can not get a pair of
vice grips in either. I'm sure I'm just brain dead
and when someone tells me it will be one of those
BFO's (Blinding Flash of the Obvious) before I mess up
a parth thought I's see if anybody could point in the
right direction.
Thanks
Ken
=====
Ken Moak #90608
Fort Worth, TX
Empennage, wings on order
ken_moak(at)yahoo.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | John Oliveira <oliveira(at)frontiernet.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Rudder, How to dimple a 903 tip rib? |
I took a piece of sheet steel as thick as I could get to fit between the
flanges, drilled a number 40 hole and countersunk it. I used that as
the female dimple die.
John Oliveira
Ken Moak wrote:
>
>How do you dimple the R903 tip rib. It gets so narrow
>I can not get a nail into the last couple of holes for
>a pop rivet type dimpler, and can not get a pair of
>vice grips in either. I'm sure I'm just brain dead
>and when someone tells me it will be one of those
>BFO's (Blinding Flash of the Obvious) before I mess up
>a parth thought I's see if anybody could point in the
>right direction.
>
>Thanks
>
>Ken
>
>=====
>Ken Moak #90608
>Fort Worth, TX
>Empennage, wings on order
>ken_moak(at)yahoo.com
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Gunnar Doerwald <gunnar(at)doerwald.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Rudder, How to dimple a 903 tip rib? |
>How do you dimple the R903 tip rib. It gets so narrow
>I can not get a nail into the last couple of holes for
>a pop rivet type dimpler, and can not get a pair of
>vice grips in either.
Hi Ken:
I took a piece of 3/16" steel bar by about an inch wide. Drilled a 3/32"
hole in it and used a countersink to make a female dimple die.
Then I put the steel in a vice, used a piece of small pipe as a driver on a
male dimple and a hammer to dimple the rib.
I hope this helps.
Regards, Gunnar
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Gunnar Doerwald <gunnar(at)doerwald.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Rudder, How to dimple a 903 tip rib? |
>How do you dimple the R903 tip rib. It gets so narrow
>I can not get a nail into the last couple of holes for
>a pop rivet type dimpler, and can not get a pair of
>vice grips in either.
Hi Ken:
I took a piece of 3/16" steel bar by about an inch wide. Drilled a 3/32"
hole in it and used a countersink to make a female dimple die.
Then I put the steel in a vice, used a piece of small pipe as a driver on a
male dimple and a hammer to dimple the rib.
I hope this helps.
Regards, Gunnar
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bill Rounds <wrounds(at)ix.netcom.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Rudder, How to dimple a 903 tip rib? |
John
I think I just bent the flanges apart dimpled them with the squeezer
then bent them back. I think I had to use a pop rivet there also
because it was to tight to buck both sides.
Bill Rounds
Tip Up Canopy fitting
John Oliveira wrote:
>
>I took a piece of sheet steel as thick as I could get to fit between the
>flanges, drilled a number 40 hole and countersunk it. I used that as
>the female dimple die.
>
>John Oliveira
>
>Ken Moak wrote:
>
>
>
>>
>>How do you dimple the R903 tip rib. It gets so narrow
>>I can not get a nail into the last couple of holes for
>>a pop rivet type dimpler, and can not get a pair of
>>vice grips in either. I'm sure I'm just brain dead
>>and when someone tells me it will be one of those
>>BFO's (Blinding Flash of the Obvious) before I mess up
>>a parth thought I's see if anybody could point in the
>>right direction.
>>
>>Thanks
>>
>>Ken
>>
>>=====
>>Ken Moak #90608
>>Fort Worth, TX
>>Empennage, wings on order
>>ken_moak(at)yahoo.com
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Richard E. Tasker" <retasker(at)optonline.net> |
| Subject: | Wing Jig Question |
I have just built a roll-around wing jig based on the information on
drawing 15 of the RV9 plans. Due to my building constraints I couldn't
make a permanently installed one. It is sufficiently braced so it is
rigid and the casters all have brakes so I should be okay from that
aspect. It is finished except for the mounting of the cross bars which
the wing spar rests on.
The question is: If you scale Van's drawing, it indicates that this bar
is approximately 3 ft. from the ground. This seems low to me, but I
might be missing some reason to put it so low. Does anyone who has
worked on their wings have any suggestions or comments regarding this
height? What height did you use?
Thanks,
Dick Tasker 90573
Ready to stsrt the wings!
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Ted Strand" <tstrand(at)strandcentral.com> |
Here is a list I found for several others including LAX...
LAX...... http://www1.passur.com/lax.html
San Jose http://www4.passur.com/sjc.html
Boston Logan http://www4.passur.com/bos.html
Louisville http://www1.passur.com/sdf.html
Boca Raton http://www4.passur.com/bct.html
Ted Strand
Finishing Elevators
-----Original Message-----
From: Leland [mailto:RV9AQB(at)frys.com]
Subject: RV9-List: A neat site
A friend just put me onto a really neat site that shows all the radar
traffic in the San Francisco bay area. Tune into www.sjc.org, click on
the
Airport Flight Tracking System in the upper right hand side of the
screen,
then click on the SJC Airport Monitor-Internet Flight Tracking System at
the
top of the page. In addition to showing what is in the air right now,
you
can look at the archives and view your past flights.
Leland in Pleasanton, California (Wiring the Ray Allen G205 stick grip)
=
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | DThomas773(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Wing Jig Question |
Hi Dick,
I think if your 2 vertical posts are perfectly plumb and aligned with each
other you don't really need a cross bar, all though it adds some rigididy.
It is shown in the plans but does not really have a purpose in the
construction of the wing. The wing actually mounts on the the vertical
posts the only thing I used mine for was to block the spar to make the spar
straight and actually after the skins were on they held it straight anyway.
Dennis Thomas
finishing flaps
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | JohnCClarkVA(at)cs.com |
| Subject: | Re: Wing Jig Question |
Hi Dick, just a few comments. I put the wing bracket at 44". This allowed
me to put the ailerons on while in the jig and made it easier to reach all of
the rivets. and work on the bell cranks, install the wiring tubes, etc.
Riveting the bottom skins was easy in the jig and I did all the bottom rivets
by myself with little effort. Did not plan it that way but it worked great.
I used what I had, 3 4x4s and 2 2x6s that were screwed together for the 4
posts. Then I clamped them to the microlam floor joists (I am in the
basement). I just let the bottom ends rest on the concrete. Works ok, but
the bottom ends would come up a little in cold wx and I would just loosen the
clamp and reset themt. Then I found I could take another clamp at the top,
hook the top end over the post, the bottom end under the bottom of the joist,
tighten a little and the post would be pushed down firmly on the concrete at
the other end. Once I remove the wings, perhaps today, the posts will come
down in about 5 minutes. John.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Dr. Leathers" <DrLeathers(at)822heal.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Wing Jig Question |
Hi John,
I'm getting my shop ready to start on an RV9A. I noticed that you are
building in your basement. I am concerned about noise in my shop because
there is a 24 hour restaurant upstairs from my shop. I am getting an oil
bath compressor because they are
quieter than the others. I wonder about the actual riveting of the airframe.
Can your riveting be heard from upstairs? Is it disruptive for your family?
What percentage of riveting is done with the gun compared to pneumatic or
hand squeezers?
DOC
----- Original Message -----
From: <JohnCClarkVA(at)cs.com>
Subject: Re: RV9-List: Wing Jig Question
>
> Hi Dick, just a few comments. I put the wing bracket at 44". This
allowed
> me to put the ailerons on while in the jig and made it easier to reach all
of
> the rivets. and work on the bell cranks, install the wiring tubes, etc.
> Riveting the bottom skins was easy in the jig and I did all the bottom
rivets
> by myself with little effort. Did not plan it that way but it worked
great.
> I used what I had, 3 4x4s and 2 2x6s that were screwed together for the 4
> posts. Then I clamped them to the microlam floor joists (I am in the
> basement). I just let the bottom ends rest on the concrete. Works ok,
but
> the bottom ends would come up a little in cold wx and I would just loosen
the
> clamp and reset themt. Then I found I could take another clamp at the
top,
> hook the top end over the post, the bottom end under the bottom of the
joist,
> tighten a little and the post would be pushed down firmly on the concrete
at
> the other end. Once I remove the wings, perhaps today, the posts will
come
> down in about 5 minutes. John.
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jim Hosie" <jhosie4(at)attbi.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Wing Jig Question |
DOC
That's is a problem, I just retuned my inexpensive (Home Depot) $300 for the
oil bath $400 one just to cut the noise.
I went from 20 gal to 60 to also cut the times it turns on.
Riveting is noisy enough where you need to ware ear protection and the air
drills aren't all that quite ether.
I'm building in my garage and I insulated the door it to keep SOME noise for
escaping to the neighbors.
I'm also looking at other sound proofing "stuff" to keep the noise in and
out of the shop down.
I would also like to hear about noise reductions tips.
Jim
Rudder
N-9SU
----- Original Message -----
From: "Dr. Leathers" <DrLeathers(at)822heal.com>
Subject: Re: RV9-List: Wing Jig Question
>
> Hi John,
>
> I'm getting my shop ready to start on an RV9A. I noticed that you are
> building in your basement. I am concerned about noise in my shop because
> there is a 24 hour restaurant upstairs from my shop. I am getting an oil
> bath compressor because they are
> quieter than the others. I wonder about the actual riveting of the
airframe.
> Can your riveting be heard from upstairs? Is it disruptive for your
family?
> What percentage of riveting is done with the gun compared to pneumatic or
> hand squeezers?
>
> DOC
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: <JohnCClarkVA(at)cs.com>
> To:
> Subject: Re: RV9-List: Wing Jig Question
>
>
> >
> > Hi Dick, just a few comments. I put the wing bracket at 44". This
> allowed
> > me to put the ailerons on while in the jig and made it easier to reach
all
> of
> > the rivets. and work on the bell cranks, install the wiring tubes, etc.
> > Riveting the bottom skins was easy in the jig and I did all the bottom
> rivets
> > by myself with little effort. Did not plan it that way but it worked
> great.
> > I used what I had, 3 4x4s and 2 2x6s that were screwed together for the
4
> > posts. Then I clamped them to the microlam floor joists (I am in the
> > basement). I just let the bottom ends rest on the concrete. Works ok,
> but
> > the bottom ends would come up a little in cold wx and I would just
loosen
> the
> > clamp and reset themt. Then I found I could take another clamp at the
> top,
> > hook the top end over the post, the bottom end under the bottom of the
> joist,
> > tighten a little and the post would be pushed down firmly on the
concrete
> at
> > the other end. Once I remove the wings, perhaps today, the posts will
> come
> > down in about 5 minutes. John.
> >
> >
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jaimes Biard" <jbiard(at)charter.net> |
| Subject: | Wing Jig Question |
Jim
What did you use to insulate your garage doors?
Jaimes
90543
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv9-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv9-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of Jim Hosie
Subject: Re: RV9-List: Wing Jig Question
DOC
That's is a problem, I just retuned my inexpensive (Home Depot) $300 for the
oil bath $400 one just to cut the noise.
I went from 20 gal to 60 to also cut the times it turns on.
Riveting is noisy enough where you need to ware ear protection and the air
drills aren't all that quite ether.
I'm building in my garage and I insulated the door it to keep SOME noise for
escaping to the neighbors.
I'm also looking at other sound proofing "stuff" to keep the noise in and
out of the shop down.
I would also like to hear about noise reductions tips.
Jim
Rudder
N-9SU
----- Original Message -----
From: "Dr. Leathers" <DrLeathers(at)822heal.com>
Subject: Re: RV9-List: Wing Jig Question
>
> Hi John,
>
> I'm getting my shop ready to start on an RV9A. I noticed that you are
> building in your basement. I am concerned about noise in my shop because
> there is a 24 hour restaurant upstairs from my shop. I am getting an oil
> bath compressor because they are
> quieter than the others. I wonder about the actual riveting of the
airframe.
> Can your riveting be heard from upstairs? Is it disruptive for your
family?
> What percentage of riveting is done with the gun compared to pneumatic or
> hand squeezers?
>
> DOC
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: <JohnCClarkVA(at)cs.com>
> To:
> Subject: Re: RV9-List: Wing Jig Question
>
>
> >
> > Hi Dick, just a few comments. I put the wing bracket at 44". This
> allowed
> > me to put the ailerons on while in the jig and made it easier to reach
all
> of
> > the rivets. and work on the bell cranks, install the wiring tubes, etc.
> > Riveting the bottom skins was easy in the jig and I did all the bottom
> rivets
> > by myself with little effort. Did not plan it that way but it worked
> great.
> > I used what I had, 3 4x4s and 2 2x6s that were screwed together for the
4
> > posts. Then I clamped them to the microlam floor joists (I am in the
> > basement). I just let the bottom ends rest on the concrete. Works ok,
> but
> > the bottom ends would come up a little in cold wx and I would just
loosen
> the
> > clamp and reset themt. Then I found I could take another clamp at the
> top,
> > hook the top end over the post, the bottom end under the bottom of the
> joist,
> > tighten a little and the post would be pushed down firmly on the
concrete
> at
> > the other end. Once I remove the wings, perhaps today, the posts will
> come
> > down in about 5 minutes. John.
> >
> >
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | barry pote <barrypote(at)comcast.net> |
| Subject: | canopy fit questions |
If some of you guys that 'have been there and done that' could comment
on the following questions:
The front of the canopy is drilled and clecoed to the canopy frame, and
to the back bone. According to the plans, the rear of the canopy does
not get drilled till the rear skin is drilled to it. In order to get the
right and left bottom edges of the canopy plexiglass down for drilling
to the 660, some light pressure is required on the rear of the
plexiglass to bring it down to the rear canopy bow.
1. if you do this on the fuselage, someone might have to be inside the
canopy to apply clamps to the rear. Has anyone drilled the right and
left lower sides of the plexiglass to the canopy frame skirts, OFF THE
fuselage? Has anyone drilled and clecoed the rear plexiglass to the
rear canopy bow, to accomplish this?
2. On the front....the front fuselage top skin finishes at the roll bar.
The windshield kind of squashes it (that top skin) at the rollbar. Van's
told me that the manual probably still tells us that we can slit the
skin (I saw this on an RV6a..Orndorff tapes) and let the plexiglass wind
shield go behind it (the skin) near the rollbar. The manual (mine) does
not mention this. How did you all do this?
Barry Pote RV9a canopy in 2 pieces and lots of holes drilled and no
cracks....YET.
________________________________________________________________________________
I made my rack for the spar 48" off the floor. Works OK for me. I'm 6' tall
Bob Devaney
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | JohnCClarkVA(at)cs.com |
| Subject: | Re: Wing Jig Question |
My wife sees clients until 9 in the evening. I cannot rivet at that time.
The oil compressor is not a problem. The pneumatic drill is not a problem.
I use the squeezer about 30%of the time, just a wild guess. If the
restaurant is noisy, may not be a problem. You may be able to put some foam
on the ceiling and cut the noise some. Good luck.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | JohnCClarkVA(at)cs.com |
| Subject: | Re: Wing Jig Question |
I forgot to mention the family. The bedrooms are on the second floor and
noise is not a problem.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Richard E. Tasker" <retasker(at)optonline.net> |
| Subject: | Main Spar #6 and #8 countersinks |
I am starting my wing. By the way, I ended up mounting the crosspiece
on the wing jig 48" above the ground and it seems to be just about
perfect so far.
The plans say to use a scrap 0.032" piece of aluminum, dimple a hole to
fit the #8 screws (and another for the #6 screws) and use that to size
the countersink in the main spar. I have done that but the countersink
in the main spar looks very large if I actually make it large enough
that the 0.032" piece fits properly. The diameter of the top of the
countersink for the #8 screw is almost 3/8" diameter.
Is this okay and correct? It seems to be a rather large hole in the
spar (actually dozens of them) and I want to be sure before I do
something so drastic to the spar...
Thanks,
Dick Tasker, 90573
Startiing the wings!
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jim Hosie" <jhosie4(at)attbi.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Wing Jig Question |
Jim,
Home Depot has a Garage Door Kit, it comes with the panels precut.
They're made of hardboard insulation and finished with vinyl on one side.
It is a 45 minutes project putting them in.
Keeps the heat in much of the noise from the neighborhood.
Jim
----- Original Message -----
From: "Jaimes Biard" <jbiard(at)charter.net>
Subject: RE: RV9-List: Wing Jig Question
>
> Jim
>
> What did you use to insulate your garage doors?
>
> Jaimes
> 90543
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-rv9-list-server(at)matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-rv9-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of Jim Hosie
> To: rv9-list(at)matronics.com
> Subject: Re: RV9-List: Wing Jig Question
>
>
> DOC
> That's is a problem, I just retuned my inexpensive (Home Depot) $300 for
the
> oil bath $400 one just to cut the noise.
> I went from 20 gal to 60 to also cut the times it turns on.
>
> Riveting is noisy enough where you need to ware ear protection and the air
> drills aren't all that quite ether.
> I'm building in my garage and I insulated the door it to keep SOME noise
for
> escaping to the neighbors.
>
> I'm also looking at other sound proofing "stuff" to keep the noise in and
> out of the shop down.
> I would also like to hear about noise reductions tips.
>
> Jim
> Rudder
> N-9SU
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Dr. Leathers" <DrLeathers(at)822heal.com>
> To:
> Subject: Re: RV9-List: Wing Jig Question
>
>
> >
> > Hi John,
> >
> > I'm getting my shop ready to start on an RV9A. I noticed that you are
> > building in your basement. I am concerned about noise in my shop because
> > there is a 24 hour restaurant upstairs from my shop. I am getting an oil
> > bath compressor because they are
> > quieter than the others. I wonder about the actual riveting of the
> airframe.
> > Can your riveting be heard from upstairs? Is it disruptive for your
> family?
> > What percentage of riveting is done with the gun compared to pneumatic
or
> > hand squeezers?
> >
> > DOC
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: <JohnCClarkVA(at)cs.com>
> > To:
> > Subject: Re: RV9-List: Wing Jig Question
> >
> >
> > >
> > > Hi Dick, just a few comments. I put the wing bracket at 44". This
> > allowed
> > > me to put the ailerons on while in the jig and made it easier to reach
> all
> > of
> > > the rivets. and work on the bell cranks, install the wiring tubes,
etc.
> > > Riveting the bottom skins was easy in the jig and I did all the bottom
> > rivets
> > > by myself with little effort. Did not plan it that way but it worked
> > great.
> > > I used what I had, 3 4x4s and 2 2x6s that were screwed together for
the
> 4
> > > posts. Then I clamped them to the microlam floor joists (I am in the
> > > basement). I just let the bottom ends rest on the concrete. Works
ok,
> > but
> > > the bottom ends would come up a little in cold wx and I would just
> loosen
> > the
> > > clamp and reset themt. Then I found I could take another clamp at the
> > top,
> > > hook the top end over the post, the bottom end under the bottom of the
> > joist,
> > > tighten a little and the post would be pushed down firmly on the
> concrete
> > at
> > > the other end. Once I remove the wings, perhaps today, the posts will
> > come
> > > down in about 5 minutes. John.
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Dave Nicholson" <dnick2(at)insightbb.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Main Spar #6 and #8 countersinks |
Check out Chris Heitman's Web Site at:
http://my.execpc.com/~cjh/csink.html
to see how he handled this issue.
Dave
90347
Finishing Kit
----- Original Message -----
From: "Richard E. Tasker" <retasker(at)optonline.net>
Subject: RV9-List: Main Spar #6 and #8 countersinks
>
> I am starting my wing. By the way, I ended up mounting the crosspiece
> on the wing jig 48" above the ground and it seems to be just about
> perfect so far.
>
> The plans say to use a scrap 0.032" piece of aluminum, dimple a hole to
> fit the #8 screws (and another for the #6 screws) and use that to size
> the countersink in the main spar. I have done that but the countersink
> in the main spar looks very large if I actually make it large enough
> that the 0.032" piece fits properly. The diameter of the top of the
> countersink for the #8 screw is almost 3/8" diameter.
>
> Is this okay and correct? It seems to be a rather large hole in the
> spar (actually dozens of them) and I want to be sure before I do
> something so drastic to the spar...
>
> Thanks,
>
> Dick Tasker, 90573
> Startiing the wings!
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | DThomas773(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Main Spar #6 and #8 countersinks |
Hi Dick,
I was really concerned about the size of holes I was cutting into the spar
flange when I was countersinking for the #8 nutplates. I called Van's and
they said it was OK. The countersink actually is going through the spar
flange but you are adding a steel nutplate to back it up and that provides
the needed strength.
Dennis Thomas
RV9
finishing wings
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "steve dwyer" <stdwyer(at)dreamscape.com> |
Ted, Can you identify Syracuse, N.Y. FSYR?
Steve Dwyer RV9A 90219 fitting the canopy
----- Original Message -----
From: Ted Strand <tstrand(at)strandcentral.com>
Subject: RE: RV9-List: A neat site
>
> Here is a list I found for several others including LAX...
>
> LAX...... http://www1.passur.com/lax.html
> San Jose http://www4.passur.com/sjc.html
> Boston Logan http://www4.passur.com/bos.html
> Louisville http://www1.passur.com/sdf.html
> Boca Raton http://www4.passur.com/bct.html
>
> Ted Strand
> Finishing Elevators
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Leland [mailto:RV9AQB(at)frys.com]
> To: rv9-list(at)matronics.com
> Subject: RV9-List: A neat site
>
>
> A friend just put me onto a really neat site that shows all the radar
> traffic in the San Francisco bay area. Tune into www.sjc.org, click on
> the
> Airport Flight Tracking System in the upper right hand side of the
> screen,
> then click on the SJC Airport Monitor-Internet Flight Tracking System at
> the
> top of the page. In addition to showing what is in the air right now,
> you
> can look at the archives and view your past flights.
> Leland in Pleasanton, California (Wiring the Ray Allen G205 stick grip)
>
>
> >
>
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Ted Strand" <tstrand(at)strandcentral.com> |
The ones that I listed appear to be the only airports that have
purchased the system. You can find out more information at the passur
web site. http:///www.passur.com
-----Original Message-----
From: steve dwyer [mailto:stdwyer(at)dreamscape.com]
Subject: Re: RV9-List: A neat site
Ted, Can you identify Syracuse, N.Y. FSYR?
Steve Dwyer RV9A 90219 fitting the canopy
----- Original Message -----
From: Ted Strand <tstrand(at)strandcentral.com>
Subject: RE: RV9-List: A neat site
>
> Here is a list I found for several others including LAX...
>
> LAX...... http://www1.passur.com/lax.html
> San Jose http://www4.passur.com/sjc.html
> Boston Logan http://www4.passur.com/bos.html
> Louisville http://www1.passur.com/sdf.html
> Boca Raton http://www4.passur.com/bct.html
>
> Ted Strand
> Finishing Elevators
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Leland [mailto:RV9AQB(at)frys.com]
> To: rv9-list(at)matronics.com
> Subject: RV9-List: A neat site
>
>
> A friend just put me onto a really neat site that shows all the radar
> traffic in the San Francisco bay area. Tune into www.sjc.org, click on
> the
> Airport Flight Tracking System in the upper right hand side of the
> screen,
> then click on the SJC Airport Monitor-Internet Flight Tracking System
at
> the
> top of the page. In addition to showing what is in the air right now,
> you
> can look at the archives and view your past flights.
> Leland in Pleasanton, California (Wiring the Ray Allen G205 stick
grip)
>
>
> >
>
>
>
>
>
=
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Andy Karmy" <andy(at)karmy.com> |
| Subject: | Re: canopy fit questions |
Ok, Barry, see below for my stab at it...
---------- Original Message ----------------------------------
From: barry pote <barrypote(at)comcast.net>
Date: Sat, 14 Dec 2002 17:55:22 -0500
>1. if you do this on the fuselage, someone might have to be inside the
>canopy to apply clamps to the rear. Has anyone drilled the right and
>left lower sides of the plexiglass to the canopy frame skirts, OFF THE
>fuselage? Has anyone drilled and clecoed the rear plexiglass to the
>rear canopy bow, to accomplish this?
I drilled the rear plexi & bow on the fuselage and clecoed together. That's what
my vintage of instructions seemed to say... Then I had to use a blind hole finder
while fitting the rear skirts to find those holes again and drill the rear
skirts. Overall it worked fine this way. I would not do anything "off" the
fuselage as you must keep everything in alingment to have it all work out.
>2. On the front....the front fuselage top skin finishes at the roll bar.
>The windshield kind of squashes it (that top skin) at the rollbar. Van's
>told me that the manual probably still tells us that we can slit the
>skin (I saw this on an RV6a..Orndorff tapes) and let the plexiglass wind
>shield go behind it (the skin) near the rollbar. The manual (mine) does
>not mention this. How did you all do this?
I called them on this one also. The instructions don't say anything about it, all
you have is the side view on the plans which is not very descriptive.
I riveted down the front skin, wrapped it all the way around the sides and riveted
along the longaron. Then simply drilled through it with the canopy and layed
the front windscreen on top of that section that wraps onto the rollbar. That
area actually has lots of leeway as you are going to gunk it up with fiberglass
anyways. So you just fill, glass, fill, glass, etc etc etc until the whole
mess is nice and smooth and faired into the skin, windscreen, and rollbar. I
too have seen the skin cut, but I would think that would be harder on the plexi
being pressed between the skin like that.
- Andy Karmy
RV9A Seattle WA - Just built the carb-air-box
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Im7shannon(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: canopy fit questions |
Hi Barry
One good trick that worked well for me was to fit the rear skirts in place on
the fuse with the canopy slightly aft of its final closed and locked
position, which makes them fit real tight when you do close it. I left mine a
little long in case I needed to trim them later, but they came out just
right. Some duct tape helps hold everything in place while drilling
Kevin Shannon
Following the RV10 development...
> If some of you guys that 'have been there and done that' could comment
> on the following questions:
>
> The front of the canopy is drilled and clecoed to the canopy frame, and
> to the back bone. According to the plans, the rear of the canopy does
> not get drilled till the rear skin is drilled to it. In order to get the
> right and left bottom edges of the canopy plexiglass down for drilling
> to the 660, some light pressure is required on the rear of the
> plexiglass to bring it down to the rear canopy bow.
>
> 1. if you do this on the fuselage, someone might have to be inside the
> canopy to apply clamps to the rear. Has anyone drilled the right and
> left lower sides of the plexiglass to the canopy frame skirts, OFF THE
> fuselage? Has anyone drilled and clecoed the rear plexiglass to the
> rear canopy bow, to accomplish this?
>
> 2. On the front....the front fuselage top skin finishes at the roll bar.
> The windshield kind of squashes it (that top skin) at the rollbar. Van's
> told me that the manual probably still tells us that we can slit the
> skin (I saw this on an RV6a..Orndorff tapes) and let the plexiglass wind
> shield go behind it (the skin) near the rollbar. The manual (mine) does
> not mention this. How did you all do this?
>
> Barry Pote RV9a canopy in 2 pieces and lots of holes drilled and no
> cracks....YET.
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Richard Tasker <retasker(at)optonline.net> |
I have ordered Van's conduit for wiring routing in the wing.
Unfortunately, it is not here yet and I want to work on the wing ribs.
Does anyone know what size holes I should provide for this in the ribs?
Does this require additional abrasion protection in the form of
bushings, or is it good as is?
Thanks,
Dick Tasker 90573
Starting the wings...
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | barry pote <barrypote(at)comcast.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Van's conduit |
Wait till you get the material, in case they have changed. Advice I
would give is put the holes in before riveting ribs to spars. I used pro
seal to hold it in place.
Barry Pote RV9a
> I have ordered Van's conduit for wiring routing in the wing.
> Unfortunately, it is not here yet and I want to work on the wing ribs.
>
> Does anyone know what size holes I should provide for this in the ribs?
> Does this require additional abrasion protection in the form of
> bushings, or is it good as is?
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | johncclarkva(at)cs.com |
I tried another approach rather than cutting holes in the ribs. I found some small
aluminum clips at Lowes. I think they were to be used for hanging telephone
wire. They were about 3/8 X 1 with a hook that would wrap around a 1/8 drill.
I spread out the hook until it came out flat on the bottom with a slight
hump on the end. Just right for holding onto wire ties. I then pop riveted
the hook to the rib and installed the tube through the lightening holes, used
the wire tie to connect the hook and tube, then shot some aluminum safe rtv between
the tube and rib. Fast, easy, small hole, and looks pretty good. John.
Richard Tasker wrote:
>
>I have ordered Van's conduit for wiring routing in the wing.
> Unfortunately, it is not here yet and I want to work on the wing ribs.
>
>Does anyone know what size holes I should provide for this in the ribs?
> Does this require additional abrasion protection in the form of
>bushings, or is it good as is?
>
>Thanks,
>
>Dick Tasker 90573
>Starting the wings...
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Don/Marcia Piermattei" <dlpier(at)lamar.colostate.edu> |
I purchaed the Esco hingemate tool some time ago. I have lost the instructions
and in a continuing senior moment I can't remember how to use it(I can
remember thinking it was neat when I bought it). Can anyone out there refresh
me or fax a copy of the instructions to 970/568-7279?
Thanks for any help.
Don Piermattei
90411
Donald L. Piermattei DVM, PhD
5000 E County Rd 92
Carr, CO 80612
970/568-9047
Fax 970/568-7279
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Bruce Cruikshank" <cruikshank(at)attbi.com> |
I'm sure this is not new but....
While preparing AEX tie down extrusion for installing in the tail, the light came
on. Get an extra length of this extrusion and chop into pieces about 1/2"
long. After drilling out the big hole 3/8" and cleaning the edges, these things
can be riveted/popriveted to various points in the baggage compartment. The
hole may be a bit small for chord, but fine for bungee chord hooks.
Bruce 90364
Starting OB fuselage.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Gary" <rv9er(at)3rivers.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Cargo tiedowns |
You can also use a couple as places to stow the tiedown rings in flight. I made
mine so that with the rings screwed into them, they were located so they could
be used as baggage tiedowns. Less drag, and fewer items on the ceiling.
Gary
I'm sure this is not new but....
While preparing AEX tie down extrusion for installing in the tail, the light
came on. Get an extra length of this extrusion and chop into pieces about 1/2"
long. After drilling out the big hole 3/8" and cleaning the edges, these things
can be riveted/popriveted to various points in the baggage compartment.
The hole may be a bit small for chord, but fine for bungee chord hooks.
Bruce 90364
Starting OB fuselage.
---
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Andy Karmy" <andy(at)karmy.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Cargo tiedowns |
>
>they were located so they could be used as baggage tiedowns.
>
>Gary
So Gary, Where did you locate them exactly?
- Andy (also looking for tiedown & baggage features)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Gary" <rv9er(at)3rivers.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Cargo tiedowns |
Hi, Andy. I put them at the top of the F-749 baggage side covers, pretty much
where the plans show. See dwg #29, detail D.
Gary
----- Original Message -----
From: Andy Karmy
To: rv9-list(at)matronics.com
Sent: Thursday, December 19, 2002 3:23 PM
Subject: Re: RV9-List: Cargo tiedowns
>
>they were located so they could be used as baggage tiedowns.
>
>Gary
So Gary, Where did you locate them exactly?
- Andy (also looking for tiedown & baggage features)
---
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Norman" <nhunger(at)sprint.ca> |
| Subject: | Re: Cargo tiedowns |
I made these little metal plates that have a hole in each end 1 1/2" apart.
A small loop of chain link is welded to each plate making a tiedown ring. I
then installed pairs of nutplates 1 1/2" apart throughout my baggage
compartment. I even went up the sides and into my ski rack luggage
compartment. I will eventually make a cargo net, probably out of one that I
salvage from a modern car. Many new cars and SUVs these days come with nice
looking black cargo nets. The plan is that all these pieces are removable
for local sport flight but he aircraft can be set up for different
configurations of XC very quickly.
The ski rack has a hard to describe structure in the middle that serves to
hold the left seat belt shoulder harness cable above the compartments floor
(height of the longerons). This structure was made very strong out of 1 1/2"
.125 angle. It has slots cut into the upright that are designed to take
small ratcheting straps (motorcycle stlye). I want the skis to be held
extremely tight.
> You can also use a couple as places to stow the tiedown rings in flight.
> I made mine so that with the rings screwed into them, they were located so
they could be used as baggage tiedowns.
> Less drag, and fewer items on the ceiling.
Nice idea. For those that don't know, Aircraft Spruce sells nutplates in six
sizes right up to 3//8" (held in by 1/8" rivets).
Vans kits only use the two smallest sizes. Also very usefull when making
custom panels are floating nutplates.
Norman Hunger
RV6A Delta BC
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Steve Sampson" <SSampson.SLN21(at)london.edu> |
Dennis - you expressed interest so now it is fixed (finished today) I
thought I had better tell you what I learned.
The problem was the innermost bay on the outer/under skin where it overlaps
the inner skin. I had an oil can valley that came up to the inspection
hatch.
The solution was to drill out the double row of rivets at the overlapping
skins and then rivet them up again. However, when we rivited them up we only
riveted up the holes that exactly aligned and we were very careful to rivet
'outwards and forwards' all the time. Then we ran a drill through the
remaining misaligned ones, presqueezed longer rivets and closed it up. By
this time > 95% of the problem was gone. It was only noticeable because I
had become so critical of this area. Today I put the hatch on and with that
screwed down, the problem is > 99% gone. (I will always imagine I can see
something until I forget which wing and cant find it!)
The problem may have been compounded by the fact that I perhaps did not
chamfer the inner skin at the rear spar as much as I might so the outer skin
had a bit of a step down to the spar. Putting the rivet nearest to the two
skin layers into the spar may have stretched the outer skin also.
So why were the holes out of line? (We are talking perhaps 1/8th of the
diameter of the 3/32 hole. Minute! I should also say that when match drilled
my policy is a cleco in every other hole.) The misalignement was a few holes
only, and a minute amount, and they tended to be near the trailing edge.
When we first riveted it up I think we tended to rivet the rivet that goes
through the 2 skins AND the rib BEFORE we did the 2 skins rivet. This I
guess is at odd with VANS instruction to rivet 'outwards and forwards'.
(This was because the rib rivets are easier than the 'floating' skin
rivets.) Perhaps the act of riveting makes 'extra' skin which gets pushed
ahead if you always move out, but nowhere to go otherwise. The amazing thing
to me is that a tiny movement can cause such an ugly problem.
This was the second wing and the problem had not occurred on the first. I
worked with a far LESS experienced riveting partner on the first wing! (The
only oil canning I now have is in a QB Philippines fuse area and it is very
very slight.) In the future I will be VERY careful always to move outwards
on skins so 'spare' metal moves ahead.
So I hope you have no problems.
Remember - always outward!
Steve
#90360
UK
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv9-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv9-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of
DThomas773(at)aol.com
Subject: Re: RV9-List: Oil canning
Hi Steve,
Please keep us posted on your progrees. I am about a week away from bottom
wing skins so I'll be following with interest.
Dennis Thomas
wings
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Curt Hoffman" <choffman9(at)cinci.rr.com> |
| Subject: | Alodine learning |
Just learned something today. If you are an acid etcher and alodiner like myself-
If you leave the plastic covering on a bracket the acid etch and alodine are
really ineffective. Go figure.
Also- after that little piece of learning I primed the last few pieces of the wing
and ordered the empennage today ( I decided to go backwards since I had already
built a -6 tail before), Next I figure I'll do the finish kit and then order
the fuselage : ).
Curt Hoffman
RV-9A wings - tail on order
1968 Mustang 302 convertible
Piper Cherokee N5320W
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | DThomas773(at)aol.com |
Hi Steve,
Thanks for the information. I just finished fitting the ailerons and all the
aileron hardware today and will start next with nav, landing lights and
wiring. With that done it will my turn to deal with bottom skins.
Dennis
N164DV
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Don/Marcia Piermattei" <dlpier(at)lamar.colostate.edu> |
| Subject: | RV-9A brake and fuel lines |
Has anyone ever actually installed these lines in one piece a shown in the
plans? If so, I would like to know how you did it. Van's support wasn't
helpful.
Don Piermattei
90411
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Albert Gardner" <albert.gardner(at)worldnet.att.net> |
| Subject: | Re: RV-9A brake and fuel lines |
It can be done but many of us put the fuel line higher than the brake line.
That way the fuel line makes a much shallower s-curve and it's not very
difficult to do (compared to some other things later on).
Albert Gardner, Yuma, AZ
RV-9A: N872RV
Working on windscreen
----- Original Message -----
From: "Don/Marcia Piermattei" <dlpier(at)lamar.colostate.edu>
Subject: RV9-List: RV-9A brake and fuel lines
>
> Has anyone ever actually installed these lines in one piece a shown in the
> plans? If so, I would like to know how you did it. Van's support wasn't
> helpful.
>
> Don Piermattei
> 90411
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Albert Gardner" <albert.gardner(at)worldnet.att.net> |
| Subject: | EAA Centennial Dataplate and Certificate |
"EAA Offers Centennial Package for Completed Aircraft Projects
"Any EAA member who completes a homebuilt aircraft between December 17, 2002
and December 31, 2003, will receive a centennial dataplate and certificate
of accomplishment from EAA as part of the commemoration of powered flight's
100th anniversary. Both of these items signify the homebuilder's link to the
legacy of the powered flight's original homebuilders--the Wright brothers.
EAA will also display a picture of the proud homebuilder with his or her
completed aircraft on a special section of the EAA website."
If any of you RV-9 builders are contemplating completing your project in
2003 here is an additional inducement to get it in the air. I wonder which
RV-9 builder will be the first?
Albert Gardner, Yuma, AZ
RV-9A: N872RV
Working on windscreen
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Andy Karmy" <andy(at)karmy.com> |
| Subject: | Re: RV-9A brake and fuel lines |
Yes I put them all in just like the plans show! Was it easy... Not really!
The hardest part was the tubes that traversed the gear towers. I fought and struggeled
with these. I bent the z bend at the outside end, left the inside straight
and sort of pushed and hand bent the tube as I threaded it into the holes.
It took some time and coaxing but worked out in the end. When I talked with
some of the Vans guys at Oshkosh this year they said, all you have to do is unbolt
the gear towers and then put the tubes in, bend them to shape and then bolt
the towers back in place...
Hum, why didn't I think of that. In my case I was already finished.
- Andy Karmy
RV9A - Seattle WA
I'm a baffeling right now... I see light... It's almost there....
---------- Original Message ----------------------------------
From: "Don/Marcia Piermattei" <dlpier(at)lamar.colostate.edu>
Date: Sun, 22 Dec 2002 08:07:30 -0700
>
>Has anyone ever actually installed these lines in one piece a shown in the
>plans? If so, I would like to know how you did it. Van's support wasn't
>helpful.
>
>Don Piermattei
>90411
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Nightingale Michael" <NightingaleMichaelV(at)JohnDeere.com> |
"'rv-list(at)matronics.com'"
| Subject: | FW: Garmin 196 on Experimental Panel builder |
>
>
> Does anyone on the List have access to someone at The Experimental Panel
> builder site? I've Emailed them 4 times in the last two months about
> adding the Garmin 196 to GPS Group, but the 196 is still a no show.
>
>
> Thanks
> Mike Nightingale
> RV-9A 90259
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Ralph Cloud" <ercouper(at)flash.net> |
Hope Santa brought your a bunch of neat tools to help your RV... I got
some!!! Not to mention a really neat RV-9A Poster & Vans Calendar!!!
Ralph
Livermore
Wing to be delivered in Jan
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Steve Sampson" <SSampson.SLN21(at)london.edu> |
| Subject: | Odessey PC680 tray |
Anyone know how to order the Odessey battery tray from VANS for the forward
firewall on the -9a?
Steve
#90360
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | barry pote <barrypote(at)comcast.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Odessey PC680 tray |
Not sure Steve, but I believe it comes with the battery.
Barry Pote RV9a canopy
Steve Sampson wrote:
>
>
> Anyone know how to order the Odessey battery tray from VANS for the forward
> firewall on the -9a?
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Gary" <rv9er(at)3rivers.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Odessey PC680 tray |
Steve......order this:ES PC680 INSTALL KIT BATTERY MOUNT ODYSSEY $50.00
Here is how you find that sort of thing: Go to http://www.vansaircraft.com/public/parts.txt
and then use the "find on this page" option in the edit menu of your browser to
search that list for what you want. But you have to spell "Odyssey" correctly!
Happy Holidays to all y'all.
Gary
----- Original Message -----
From: Steve Sampson
To: rv9-list(at)matronics.com
Sent: Wednesday, December 25, 2002 4:16 PM
Subject: RV9-List: Odessey PC680 tray
Anyone know how to order the Odessey battery tray from VANS for the forward
firewall on the -9a?
Steve
#90360
---
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Ken Moak <ken_moak(at)yahoo.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Merry Christmas |
Merry Christmas and a Happy New Year.
Santa was real good, my wings are ready for pickup at
the freight company! Guess they were too big and
heavy to get down the chimney. ;)
--- Ralph Cloud wrote:
>
>
> Hope Santa brought your a bunch of neat tools to
> help your RV... I got
> some!!! Not to mention a really neat RV-9A Poster &
> Vans Calendar!!!
>
>
> Ralph
> Livermore
> Wing to be delivered in Jan
>
>
>
> Click on the
> this
> generous
> _->
> Contributions
> any other
> Forums.
>
> latest messages.
> List members.
>
> http://www.matronics.com/subscription
> http://www.matronics.com/FAQ/RV9-List.htm
> Digests:http://www.matronics.com/digest/rv9-list
> http://www.matronics.com/archives
> http://www.matronics.com/photoshare
> http://www.matronics.com/emaillists
>
>
>
>
>
=====
Ken Moak #90608
Fort Worth, TX
Empennage, wings on order
ken_moak(at)yahoo.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Nightingale Michael" <NightingaleMichaelV(at)JohnDeere.com> |
"'rv-list(at)matronics.com'"
| Subject: | Garmin 196 on Experimental Panel Builder |
Does anyone have access to someone at the Experimental Panel Builder Site?
Is this Site still being supported? I have Emailed them several time over
the last 3 months, to have the Garmin 196 ADDED to GPS Group, but it is
still a NO SHOW.
Mike
RV-9A 90259
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Steve Sampson" <SSampson.SLN21(at)london.edu> |
Can someone tell me if the F-999 are part of the fuse or finish kit. They
are the pieces that close the gap between wing and fuse? Do you fabricate
them or are they pre cut. Also, Do the platenuts and screws for them and the
rubber strip come with fuse or finish kit? (From this you will gather I have
none of the above.)
Thanks, Steve.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Steve Sampson" <SSampson.SLN21(at)london.edu> |
Seasons greetings to you all!
Do the drain valves screw home or are they designed so the threads lock up
so there is no leak. Mine only seem to screw in a short distance.
Thanks, Steve.
#90360
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Steve Sampson" <SSampson.SLN21(at)london.edu> |
| Subject: | Odessey PC680 tray |
Garry / Barry - thanks. I think the spelling of Odyssey was EXACTLY the
problem! Best wishes for 2003, Steve
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv9-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv9-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Gary
Subject: Re: RV9-List: Odessey PC680 tray
Steve......order this:ES PC680 INSTALL KIT BATTERY MOUNT ODYSSEY
$50.00
Here is how you find that sort of thing: Go to
http://www.vansaircraft.com/public/parts.txt
and then use the "find on this page" option in the edit menu of your browser
to search that list for what you want. But you have to spell "Odyssey"
correctly!
Happy Holidays to all y'all.
Gary
----- Original Message -----
From: Steve Sampson
To: rv9-list(at)matronics.com
Sent: Wednesday, December 25, 2002 4:16 PM
Subject: RV9-List: Odessey PC680 tray
Anyone know how to order the Odessey battery tray from VANS for the
forward
firewall on the -9a?
Steve
#90360
---
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Norman" <nhunger(at)sprint.ca> |
On my RV6A they came with the finish kit. Norman
> Can someone tell me if the F-999 are part of the fuse or finish kit. They
> are the pieces that close the gap between wing and fuse? Do you fabricate
> them or are they pre cut. Also, Do the platenuts and screws for them and
the
> rubber strip come with fuse or finish kit? (From this you will gather I
have
> none of the above.)
>
> Thanks, Steve.
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Tim <rv9a_000(at)deru.com> |
Steve Sampson wrote:
>
> Can someone tell me if the F-999 are part of the fuse or finish kit. They
> are the pieces that close the gap between wing and fuse? Do you fabricate
> them or are they pre cut. Also, Do the platenuts and screws for them and the
> rubber strip come with fuse or finish kit? (From this you will gather I have
> none of the above.)
The easiest way to find this out is to look in the
preview plans parts index. F-999 (wing root fairing)
is listed as being in the finishing kit. It is listed
as "manufactured" which means it is a pre cut part (as
opposed to "material" which would be a fabricate-it-yourself
part).
I don't have my finishing kit just yet, but I would hazard
a guess that the platenuts, screws, etc come with that kit.
I don't recall having any weather stripping in the fuse kit.
If you don't have the preview plans, I would recommend getting
them. I have found the parts index as well as the ability to
read ahead to future tasks very handy.
- Tim.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Fabian Lefler" <fablef(at)bellsouth.net> |
Ollie,
There are a lot of users of the EIS monitor. Myself included. I believe
just about all of us using an Eggenfellner Subaru are installing the EIS
monitor and, in my opinion, it is the best bang for the buck.
The only bad thing I could say is that it doesn't look as sophisticated as
some of the more expensive monitor out there, but I guess you get what you
pay for and in this case, you get a lot.
To make the EIS monitor fit in a panel layout more gracefully, I decided
to make an option for it for my Modular Panel.
www.affordablepanels.com/new_products.html . (Sorry for the plug). I am
only giving ou the link so that you can get some ideas in how to fit the
look of the EIS in your layout. As a matter of fact, quite a few builders
have e-mailed me telling me that they saw the EIS option on my website, and
they are adapting a version of their own in Van's panel.
Good luck!
Regards,
Fabian Lefler
RV-9A
90292
----- Original Message -----
From: "Ollie Washburn" <skybolt-aviator(at)msn.com>
Subject: RV-List: EIS
> --> RV-List message posted by: "Ollie Washburn"
>
> Listers---
> I have checked the archives and don't see much listed on usage of
> Grand Rapids Tech.(EIS) eng.monitor.Is anyone using the 4000 and if so
what are your comments on it.
> Ollie 6A Central Fl.
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Richard E. Tasker" <retasker(at)optonline.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Drain Valves |
They are 1/8 NPT - tapered pipe threads. They do only screw in a few
threads. The "proper" (according to Parker) way to install pipe threads
is to use a little thread sealer (teflon tape or teflon pipe dope) being
careful not to allow any loose pieces to get inside the tank, screw the
valve into the fitting by hand and then use a wrench to tighten it two
more turns.
Dick Tasker, 90573
Steve Sampson wrote:
>
>Seasons greetings to you all!
>
>Do the drain valves screw home or are they designed so the threads lock up
>so there is no leak. Mine only seem to screw in a short distance.
>
>Thanks, Steve.
>#90360
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Gary" <rv9er(at)3rivers.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Drain Valves |
Do not use Teflon Tape on oil/gasoline fittings. The paste stuff will work, usually
even if it has Teflon in it.
Teflon tape will wait an inappropriate amount of time, then begin annoying leaks
that slowly get worse. I had this happen on my fuel oil plumbing in my house.
Every joint eventually failed with the tape.
Gary
----- Original Message -----
From: Richard E. Tasker
To: rv9-list(at)matronics.com
Sent: Thursday, December 26, 2002 6:08 PM
Subject: Re: RV9-List: Drain Valves
They are 1/8 NPT - tapered pipe threads. They do only screw in a few
threads. The "proper" (according to Parker) way to install pipe threads
is to use a little thread sealer (teflon tape or teflon pipe dope) being
careful not to allow any loose pieces to get inside the tank, screw the
valve into the fitting by hand and then use a wrench to tighten it two
more turns.
Dick Tasker, 90573
Steve Sampson wrote:
>
>Seasons greetings to you all!
>
>Do the drain valves screw home or are they designed so the threads lock up
>so there is no leak. Mine only seem to screw in a short distance.
>
>Thanks, Steve.
>#90360
>
>
---
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Cy Galley" <cgalley(at)qcbc.org> |
| Subject: | Re: Drain Valves |
NEVER EVER use Teflon tape on any system that has small orifices such as
fuel, oil, hydraulic, or vacuum. The pieces that can get loose especially
on the second screw in of a fitting can cause major problems. Even engine
stoppage. It will even void the warrantee on your vacuum pump. The use of
pipe dope even with Teflon powder is a much better solution.
Cy Galley, TC - Chair, Emergency Aircraft Repair, Oshkosh
Editor, EAA Safety Programs
cgalley(at)qcbc.org or experimenter(at)eaa.org
Always looking for articles for the Experimenter
----- Original Message -----
From: "Richard E. Tasker" <retasker(at)optonline.net>
Subject: Re: RV9-List: Drain Valves
>
> They are 1/8 NPT - tapered pipe threads. They do only screw in a few
> threads. The "proper" (according to Parker) way to install pipe threads
> is to use a little thread sealer (teflon tape or teflon pipe dope) being
> careful not to allow any loose pieces to get inside the tank, screw the
> valve into the fitting by hand and then use a wrench to tighten it two
> more turns.
>
> Dick Tasker, 90573
>
> Steve Sampson wrote:
>
> >
> >Seasons greetings to you all!
> >
> >Do the drain valves screw home or are they designed so the threads lock
up
> >so there is no leak. Mine only seem to screw in a short distance.
> >
> >Thanks, Steve.
> >#90360
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | DThomas773(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Drain Valves |
Hi Steve,
When I installed my drain valves I coated the threads with Feel lube (
Aircraft Spruce,P/N 09-25300).
It is a general purpose product originally used to lubricate fuel selector
valves but is also good to seal threads, lubricate and seal gaskets etc.
I used it to seal the gaskets for the fuel gauge sender units on the fuel
tanks and when tested my tanks did not leak.
Dennis Thomas RV-9
tail dragger/tip-up
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Gary" <rv9er(at)3rivers.net> |
| Subject: | Aligning pants and fairings |
Yep, all done with that. I used a cherry-picker type engine hoist to lift the
plane. I put straps around the spar connect bolts, lifted it till the wheels
just barely touched the floor, and made sure it was level.
Drop plumb bobs from the center belly-to-firewall rivet hole and the little hole
for the purpose just ahead of the tail tiedown. Snap a chalkline on the floor.
Mark a centerline on the pants all the way around. With a nice straight
board, you can align the pants with the chalkline.
Now, here is the trick: when doing the gear fairings, clamp a straight board across
the steps. Draw a centerline on the belly. Measure from the centerline
to the front of the fairing, and the centerline to the board at the step. Put
a nail in the board at that point, and wrap a string around the fairing and
to the nail. When the trailing edge of the fairing is centered between the strings
with no weight on the gear, you are there. Using the steps instead of some
exotic fixture at the tail is much easier, and I think still plenty accurate.
Mark the gear leg and fairing well, so you don't lose your marks when you glass
the stiffener on the leg.
And DON'T cut the slots for the hose clamps at the top of the fairing! It is
a crummy way to attach them. The clamp sticks out, interferes with the brake
fitting, and makes extra messy layup work.
Instead, make a nice little wood block on each side of the stiffener at the top,
which fits against the inside of the aft part of the fairing. Then after it
is glassed to the leg, put a machine screw through the whole works, and it will
stay aligned and secure.
Gary
----- Original Message -----
From: Andy Karmy
To: Gary
Sent: Friday, December 27, 2002 8:52 AM
Subject: Re: cowl slot
Have you done your gear leg fairings or wheel pants yet? I am doing that now
and it sure is confusing trying to get then pointing in the right direction based
upon the plans description...
- Andy
------>
---
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "steve dwyer" <stdwyer(at)dreamscape.com> |
| Subject: | slider canopy questions |
I'd like to add a small 1.5" long angle bracket running lengthwise at the outside
aft end of the canopy frame bow. This is to assist in opening the canopy from
the closed position, will this cause a turbulence error reading problem with
the static port pickup located approximately 5' farther aft?
I dont see a callout for any type of weather strip where the slider canopy bow
meets the rollover bar at the windscreen. Isn't this a leak potential for rain
while parked on the ground? I cannot find any reference to this possible problem
in the instructions.
Are we using the wood window casing strips as part of the gear leg fairings or
not? My finish kit supplied the three fiberglass leg fairings and I overheard
someone at sun n fun say that van no longer installs the wood since it is no
longer necessary, comments anyone?
Steve Dwyer Chirstmas is over now back to work!!!
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Norman" <nhunger(at)sprint.ca> |
| Subject: | Re: slider canopy questions |
> I'd like to add a small 1.5" long angle bracket running lengthwise at the
outside aft end of the canopy frame bow.
> This is to assist in opening the canopy from the closed position, will
this cause a turbulence error reading problem with the static port pickup
located approximately 5' farther aft?
>
I have seen many tip up canopies with exactly that on the left side rear
lower corner for lifting the canopy open. I have installed one myself but
not flying yet.
Norman Hunger
RV6A Delta BC
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: slider canopy questions |
| From: | "Larry PERRYMAN" <larry.perryman(at)atofina.com> |
12/27/2002 11:16:36 PM,
Serialize complete at 12/27/2002 11:16:36 PM
Steve,
There are many slider and tipup canopies with just such an angle. Don't
worry about it.
I put some weatherstrip material between my front bow and the canopy frame
for a seal. Works great if you can find one that is small enough. I found
some that was already adhesive backed to it went on without a problem.
Wooden shims on the gear leg - per Van's support - try taxi tests first.
If you do not have gear leg shimmy, then do not put them on. The vans
demonstrator planes do not have them. I put them on my plane before I got
the word and have not seen the problem.
Regards,
Larry Perryman
N194DL flying 26 hours now
steve dwyer
12/27/2002 01:34 PM
Please respond to rv9-list
To: rv9-list(at)matronics.com
cc:
Subject: RV9-List: slider canopy questions
I'd like to add a small 1.5" long angle bracket running lengthwise at the
outside aft end of the canopy frame bow. This is to assist in opening the
canopy from the closed position, will this cause a turbulence error
reading problem with the static port pickup located approximately 5'
farther aft?
I dont see a callout for any type of weather strip where the slider canopy
bow meets the rollover bar at the windscreen. Isn't this a leak potential
for rain while parked on the ground? I cannot find any reference to this
possible problem in the instructions.
Are we using the wood window casing strips as part of the gear leg
fairings or not? My finish kit supplied the three fiberglass leg fairings
and I overheard someone at sun n fun say that van no longer installs the
wood since it is no longer necessary, comments anyone?
Steve Dwyer Chirstmas is over now back to work!!!
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Stein Bruch" <stein(at)steinair.com> |
| Subject: | slider canopy questions |
Hi Steve,
I have those tabs on both sides of my canopy and am really glad I did. My
canopy ended up fitting very nicely, and I needed them to get the first 2
inches open, after than the canopy slides open on it's own.
Regarding weatherstripping, I put a small strip between the front bow and
the windshield. It's just the cheap adhesive backed stuff from Lowe's but
it works great. My rear skirts are tight enough that I didn't need any, and
so were my side skirts.
About leg stiffners, I don't have them and haven't yet found a need for
them. I say fly it first, and if needed install them later. This seems to
be very individualistic between planes. I fly of a "unsmooth" grass strip,
and haven't had shimmy problems there or on pavement.
Hope this helps!
Cheers,
Stein Bruch, Minneapolis.
RV6, Flying. Just flew from MSP to MKE for lunch today. Did I mention these
are awesome planes:)
Just clicked 80 hrs!!
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv9-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv9-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of steve dwyer
Subject: RV9-List: slider canopy questions
I'd like to add a small 1.5" long angle bracket running lengthwise at the
outside aft end of the canopy frame bow. This is to assist in opening the
canopy from the closed position, will this cause a turbulence error reading
problem with the static port pickup located approximately 5' farther aft?
I dont see a callout for any type of weather strip where the slider canopy
bow meets the rollover bar at the windscreen. Isn't this a leak potential
for rain while parked on the ground? I cannot find any reference to this
possible problem in the instructions.
Are we using the wood window casing strips as part of the gear leg fairings
or not? My finish kit supplied the three fiberglass leg fairings and I
overheard someone at sun n fun say that van no longer installs the wood
since it is no longer necessary, comments anyone?
Steve Dwyer Chirstmas is over now back to work!!!
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Dave Nicholson" <dnick2(at)insightbb.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Drain Valves |
Steve,
The NPT threads should engage at least 2 turns, finger tight, before needing
a wrench for tightening. If you're only getting 1/3 Turn, something is
wrong.
NPT Threads are "tapered", unlike Metric Threads that are "straight".
The theory is the taper "bottoms out" the threads of the fittings and there
is less space for the sealant between the threads and hence less area for
pressure to act on the sealant. Metric Threads rely completely on the
thread dope for the seal.
Some Metric Pipe Fittings are even set up to use O-rings or gaskets rather
than thread dope.
You may have a defective taped hole, or perhaps a thread on the plug is
dinged.
When you're done, at least half of the male threaded section should be
engaged with the female threaded section, and often even more. If the
fittings "bottom out" where there is no male threads showing, something is
also wrong.
Dave
BTW, Parker is Parker Hannifin, a major manufacture of pipe fittings in the
USA.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Steve Sampson" <SSampson.SLN21(at)london.edu>
Subject: RE: RV9-List: Drain Valves
>
> Thanks all for the 'Drain Valve' responses. That helped my confidence. I
> have used Teflon paste not tape.
>
> Richard - I think the 'two turns' is in fact two flats ie 1/3 turn. Who is
> Parker?
>
> Best wishes for '03.
> Steve.
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Gene" <gene(at)nvaircraft.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Drain Valves |
Steve,
I had to run a tap in all of the VA-112 drain flanges so far. I used
about two turns and that made the Q/D fitting lack about 3/32" of bottoming
out on the flange. If the tap was not used then the quick drain stuck out
about 3/16" + unnecessary and sticking out in the wind. I also used teflon
paste.
Gene N557RV (res.) waiting on fuse.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Todd Houg <thoug(at)attglobal.net> |
When I first installed the drain valves in the machined aluminum I wasn't pleased
with how far they extended. They had two or three threads fully engaged, but
there was a lot of thread showing yet. I used a standard 1/8" NPT tap and tapped
out the aluminum to gain some additionaly thread depth. I was careful not
to go to deep since I didn't want to bottom the threads out. I frequently checked
the depth during tapping until I had just a couple of threads exposed.
I'm sure I'll gain at least .0001 Knots by having less drag from the exposed fittings!
;)
Todd Houg
=09
-----Original Message-----
From: Dave Nicholson
Subject: Re: RV9-List: Drain Valves
Steve,
The NPT threads should engage at least 2 turns, finger tight, before needing
a wrench for tightening. If you're only getting 1/3 Turn, something is
wrong.
NPT Threads are "tapered", unlike Metric Threads that are "straight".
The theory is the taper "bottoms out" the threads of the fittings and there
is less space for the sealant between the threads and hence less area for
pressure to act on the sealant. Metric Threads rely completely on the
thread dope for the seal.
Some Metric Pipe Fittings are even set up to use O-rings or gaskets rather
than thread dope.
You may have a defective taped hole, or perhaps a thread on the plug is
dinged.
When you're done, at least half of the male threaded section should be
engaged with the female threaded section, and often even more. If the
fittings "bottom out" where there is no male threads showing, something is
also wrong.
Dave
BTW, Parker is Parker Hannifin, a major manufacture of pipe fittings in the
USA.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Steve Sampson" <SSampson.SLN21(at)london.edu>
Subject: RE: RV9-List: Drain Valves
>
> Thanks all for the 'Drain Valve' responses. That helped my confidence. I
> have used Teflon paste not tape.
>
> Richard - I think the 'two turns' is in fact two flats ie 1/3 turn. Who is
> Parker?
>
> Best wishes for '03.
> Steve.
>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________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Drain Valves |
| From: | Thomas J Lutgring <rv9abldr(at)juno.com> |
Steve, these drain valves come up every few months it seems. Mine were
the same way, I used the NPT tap to bring them in a little deeper. I
think the key is to just turn the tap a little and keep checking the
progress with the drain valve to ensure you don't go to deep. I did look
at Vans demonstrators at Oshkosh this last summer and the drain valves on
both the RV-9 and RV-7 were installed as is, hanging out in the breeze. I
just could not see leaving them that way. If you don't have the tap
Sears sells it as an individual item, about $5.00. good luck,
Tom RV-9A, wings almost finished, fuselage inventoried, Ohio
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Gene" <gene(at)nvaircraft.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Drain Valves |
Steve et all , I have two of the 1/8-27 npt taps. I would be willing to
loan for the price of return postage. They weigh about 1 once ea. If
interested send you name and address to my e-mail: gene(at)nvairacaft.com and I
will send one right out.
Gene N57RV (res.)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Gary" <rv9er(at)3rivers.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Drain Valves |
One thing that hasn't been mentioned is that the further the drains protrude into
the tank, the more residue it will leave in there when you drain.
I agree that three threads is not enough, though.
Gary
Steve, these drain valves come up every few months it seems. Mine were
the same way, I used the NPT tap to bring them in a little deeper. I
think the key is to just turn the tap a little and keep checking the
progress with the drain valve to ensure you don't go to deep. I did look
at Vans demonstrators at Oshkosh this last summer and the drain valves on
both the RV-9 and RV-7 were installed as is, hanging out in the breeze. I
just could not see leaving them that way. If you don't have the tap
Sears sells it as an individual item, about $5.00. good luck,
Tom RV-9A, wings almost finished, fuselage inventoried, Ohio
---
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Roy Taylor" <Royandjilly(at)btinternet.com> |
Should I prime and paint the rear canopy slider bar or will it bind the slider
block or get rubbed off anyway?...just a small point, but you keep answering my
more fundamental questions just before I get there!
Roy. Somerset U.K.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Dave Nicholson" <dnick2(at)insightbb.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Slider canopy |
Roy,
I primed and painted the Slide Spacer C-763 because it is covered by the
Canopy Slide Rail C-762 which I left "bare" because the Slide Seal C-679 and
the Canopy Slider Block C-661 will wear off any coating
Dave
90347
----- Original Message -----
From: "Roy Taylor" <Royandjilly(at)btinternet.com>
Subject: RV9-List: Slider canopy
>
> Should I prime and paint the rear canopy slider bar or will it bind the
slider block or get rubbed off anyway?...just a small point, but you keep
answering my more fundamental questions just before I get there!
>
> Roy. Somerset U.K.
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Steve Sampson" <SSampson.SLN21(at)london.edu> |
Thanks again all for the info on drain valves and offers of taps. I think I
can find my way from here! Thanks, Steve
#90360
UK
PS What a nice community the RV9 group is!
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Tim <rv9a_000(at)deru.com> |
| Subject: | What's this for? |
Howdy -
Can somebody please tell me what the rectangular
cutout is for on the forward seat floor, just aft
of the stick cutout?
It is not shown on all the drawings, and I can't
find anything that shows its purpose.
Thanks,
- Tim.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Ernest Kells" <ernest.kells(at)sympatico.ca> |
| Subject: | Re: What's this for? |
Tim: You are probably referring to the cutout for the "fifth" belt - the
crotch strap. If you ordered the five point option you will have a full
drawing which shows all. I have installed this option and am very happy
with the result.
Ernest Kells - RV-9A O235-N2C, Wood Prop
Finish Kit 85% Complete
> Can somebody please tell me what the rectangular cutout is for on the
forward seat floor, just aftof the stick cutout?
> It is not shown on all the drawings, and I can't find anything that shows
its purpose.
> Thanks, Tim.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Leland" <RV9AQB(at)frys.com> |
| Subject: | Doghouse Quality |
The sheet aluminum part C-792 that I received with the slider finishing kit
was badly bent. I talked to Tom Green who sent me a new part but he said
that it would not be much better. He was right, it isn't. This part fits on
top of the fuselage, behind the slider canopy and is shown on Drawing 41. It
is called the "dog house". Has anyone had good luck at making a new one or
straightening out the old part?
Leland in Pleasanton
Working on wheel pants (The main gear fairings and wheel pants parts are
high quality and only require cutting and sanding)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Steve Sampson" <SSampson.SLN21(at)london.edu> |
| Subject: | F774skin / F732B bracket / F632A channel - tipper builders only. |
I'm sorry guys - me again. I don't want to be obtuse but I cant for the life
of me figure out the junction of the above parts. DWG 39 & 40.
Are the 3/32 skin rivets meant to go through the skin / bulkhead flange,
F732B bracket and F632A channel?
If YES - then the rivet callout is wrong, and it is not indicated this way
on the plans.
If NO - then there is nowhere for the shopheads to go. They will have to go
at least through the F732B.
Also, a related question. How far from the bulkhead is the rear edge of the
the F632A channel? It appears about 3/16th or " on view D-D Dwg40, but I
can not find it defined.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Roy Taylor" <Royandjilly(at)btinternet.com> |
| Subject: | Slider canopy paint |
Thanks Dave,
Roy
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Gary" <rv9er(at)3rivers.net> |
| Subject: | Re: F774skin / F732B bracket / F632A channel - tipper builders |
only.
Steve......this is one of the things I tried to explain in that long email about
Tip-up stuff. It is hard to describe until you start putting the stuff together.
I think the best solution is like you say.....use long rivets through the whole
works. The drawings do not acknowlege the problem, so don't try to follow them
on that point. Also, I long ago stopped paying much attention to rivet length
callouts. I use my homemade length gage instead.
My rollover brace channel F-732A just fits up against the bulkhead at the top.
I don't think it matters if you want to leave a little gap.
Gary
----- Original Message -----
From: Steve Sampson
To: rv9-list(at)matronics.com
Sent: Wednesday, January 01, 2003 11:20 AM
Subject: RV9-List: F774skin / F732B bracket / F632A channel - tipper builders
only.
I'm sorry guys - me again. I don't want to be obtuse but I cant for the life
of me figure out the junction of the above parts. DWG 39 & 40.
Are the 3/32 skin rivets meant to go through the skin / bulkhead flange,
F732B bracket and F632A channel?
If YES - then the rivet callout is wrong, and it is not indicated this way
on the plans.
If NO - then there is nowhere for the shopheads to go. They will have to go
at least through the F732B.
Also, a related question. How far from the bulkhead is the rear edge of the
the F632A channel? It appears about 3/16th or " on view D-D Dwg40, but I
can not find it defined.
---
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Ernest Kells" <ernest.kells(at)sympatico.ca> |
| Subject: | Re: Doghouse Quality |
I think that the part just looks defective. Mine looked "defective" as
well. It is stamped out of very thin stuff - but it is non-structural. It
requires a bit bending and a lot of shaping - in assembly. I even had to
trim the plastic sliding doohickey to get a good fit. This is an area where
the fabrication and fitting will be unique to each airplane's fuselage +
canopy + frame + side skirts + rail, etc. In retrospect I think that the
sucky-looking part is what Vans needs to ship. Not everything can be
pre-punched - and this thing can't be. When done it will look very good.
Ernest Kells - RV-9A O235-N2C, Wood Prop
Finish Kit 85% Complete
> Please explain further. Am I getting this straight? Van's sent you a
> defective or damaged part with your kit. You called and spoke to Tom about
> the problem. Tom told you he would send a replacement part, but forewarned
> you that the replacement part would also be damaged or defective?? What am
I
> missing here?
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Leland" <RV9AQB(at)frys.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Doghouse Quality |
Dr. Leathers: If I remeber correctly, Tom said that he did not expect the
replacement part to be any better. This looks like a part for some
entrepeneur to make and sell.
Speaking of entrepeneurs, did everyone get a look at these really need
pre-cut panels:
http://www.affordablepanels.com/pricing.html
Leland
Working on wheel pants
> Hi Leland,
> Please explain further. Am I getting this straight? Van's sent you a
> defective or damaged part with your kit. You called and spoke to Tom about
> the problem. Tom told you he would send a replacement part, but forewarned
> you that the replacement part would also be damaged or defective?? What am
I
> missing here?
>
> DOC
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Andy Karmy" <andy(at)karmy.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Doghouse Quality |
Not only have I taken a look at them, I look at it each time I get into the plane!
I love it. I just installed the plates for the last time (I hope) as I finished
up the panel install and they are looking and working great...
- Andy Karmy
RV9A Seattle WA
T-2 wks for move to airport...
---------- Original Message ----------------------------------
From: "Leland" <RV9AQB(at)frys.com>
>Speaking of entrepeneurs, did everyone get a look at these really need
>pre-cut panels:
>http://www.affordablepanels.com/pricing.html
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | [ Fred Stucklen ] : New Email List Photo Share Available! |
| From: | Email List Photo Shares <pictures(at)matronics.com> |
A new Email List Photo Share is available:
Poster: Fred Stucklen
Subject: RV-6A IFR Inst Panel & Wiring
http://www.matronics.com/photoshare/wstucklen1@cox.net.01.02.2003/index.html
--------------------------------------------
o EMAIL LIST PHOTO SHARE
Share your files and photos with other List members simply by
emailing the files to:
pictures(at)matronics.com
Please view the typical Share above and include the Description Text
Fields as shown along with your submission of files and photos.
o Main Photo Share Index:
http://www.matronics.com/photoshare
--------------------------------------------
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Steve Sampson" <SSampson.SLN21(at)london.edu> |
| Subject: | F774skin / F732B bracket / F632A channel - tipper builders |
only.
Gary - I should have dropped you a mail before I posted that and explained.
I just wanted to see what others had to say and if anyone had talked to VANS
about it. Your mail was very helpful and I fully understood it. I have
dropped the same query to VANS but I guess they are out at the moment....or
have been.
As I get more involved with it, it seems to me that it is the most
inaccurate aspect of the plans to date. I now have the bracket in place and
it fits tight into the flange of the bulkhead. It seems to me there should
be two rows of rivets. Some 1/8th in the position shown on the drawing of
the bracket, tyeing the bracket and channel together, and then behind them
some 3/32nd going right through the skin, reinforcing plate, flange and
bracket and channel. They sure don't indicate that. (There cant be many
rivets that go through 5 items! Done that way I think it would be tidy.
The other bit which I think is poor is the fact that although the channel is
18 11/16th long at the top face just where it fits on the bracket is poorly
defined. It is going into a curved corner so is very judgemental. Yet it
controls the position of the upper edge of the role bar. As you said that
need NOT be very accurate which is perhaps the good news. See my note below.
I have just about sorted the role bar out that I was having some difficulty
with and have been working on fitting it to the brackets on the cockpit
coming. It all seems to be coming together.
Thanks again Gary.
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv9-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv9-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Gary
Subject: Re: RV9-List: F774skin / F732B bracket / F632A channel - tipper
builders only.
Steve......this is one of the things I tried to explain in that long email
about Tip-up stuff. It is hard to describe until you start putting the
stuff together.
I think the best solution is like you say.....use long rivets through the
whole works. The drawings do not acknowlege the problem, so don't try to
follow them on that point. Also, I long ago stopped paying much attention
to rivet length callouts. I use my homemade length gage instead.
My rollover brace channel F-732A just fits up against the bulkhead at the
top. Surely its below the bracket so being pushed away from the bulkhead by
the bracket.) I don't think it matters if you want to leave a little gap.
Gary
----- Original Message -----
From: Steve Sampson
To: rv9-list(at)matronics.com
Sent: Wednesday, January 01, 2003 11:20 AM
Subject: RV9-List: F774skin / F732B bracket / F632A channel - tipper
builders only.
I'm sorry guys - me again. I don't want to be obtuse but I cant for the
life
of me figure out the junction of the above parts. DWG 39 & 40.
Are the 3/32 skin rivets meant to go through the skin / bulkhead flange,
F732B bracket and F632A channel?
If YES - then the rivet callout is wrong, and it is not indicated this way
on the plans.
If NO - then there is nowhere for the shopheads to go. They will have to
go
at least through the F732B.
Also, a related question. How far from the bulkhead is the rear edge of
the
the F632A channel? It appears about 3/16th or " on view D-D Dwg40, but I
can not find it defined.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "steve dwyer" <stdwyer(at)dreamscape.com> |
| Subject: | main gear farings |
It appears van wants us to fabricate the upper main gear intersect faring after
the wings are installed at least thats my take on this according to the drawing.
I really dont want to do to do this kind of work once the plane has been moved
to the hanger has anyone rigged some sort of temporary bottom wing skin surface
to lay up the glass to? If so can I have your thoughts.
Van gives us the option of placing wood dampening strips on either the front or
aft side of the main gear legs. It really looks like the front is the best choice
since the brake line gives us the best configuration wrap around to the break
cylinder if it comes down the aft. If we are trying to dampen possible vibrations
would oak casing be better than pine or is it to stiff or does it not matter?
It would appear the greater the mass of wood material would be most effective,
I know some of you are ignoring this altogether but in my case I know how my
luck runs given murphys law and all, I really dont want to have to retrofit my
gear legs after the plane is completed.
Steve Dwyer Slider Canopy and Windscreen completed 90219
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Dave Nicholson" <dnick2(at)insightbb.com> |
| Subject: | Re: main gear farings |
Steve,
Check out
http://www.fairings-etc.com/
Bob Snedaker is in the process of completing the Prototypes for the RV-9A
and indicated he expected have them available later this month.
As far as the wood dampening strips, here's what Van's said back in Aug:
--------------------
> Gus,
>
> What's the current thinking on the need for the Wood Damping Strips?
My thinking is don't do it til you fly and can determine if you need
them or not. None of Van's airplanes have them.
>
> If they're needed, is the front better than the back?
> is easier
> If the back side is best how do you deal with the brake line?
>
The brake line is on the front of the gear leg, so it doesn't
interfere.You can zip tie it to the gear leg when the stiffener is
installed.
Gus
-----------
Dave
90347
----- Original Message -----
From: "steve dwyer" <stdwyer(at)dreamscape.com>
Subject: RV9-List: main gear farings
>
> It appears van wants us to fabricate the upper main gear intersect faring
after the wings are installed at least thats my take on this according to
the drawing. I really dont want to do to do this kind of work once the plane
has been moved to the hanger has anyone rigged some sort of temporary bottom
wing skin surface to lay up the glass to? If so can I have your thoughts.
>
> Van gives us the option of placing wood dampening strips on either the
front or aft side of the main gear legs. It really looks like the front is
the best choice since the brake line gives us the best configuration wrap
around to the break cylinder if it comes down the aft. If we are trying to
dampen possible vibrations
> would oak casing be better than pine or is it to stiff or does it not
matter? It would appear the greater the mass of wood material would be most
effective, I know some of you are ignoring this altogether but in my case I
know how my luck runs given murphys law and all, I really dont want to have
to retrofit my gear legs after the plane is completed.
>
> Steve Dwyer Slider Canopy and Windscreen completed 90219
> >
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Dave Nicholson" <dnick2(at)insightbb.com> |
| Subject: | Re: main gear farings |
Steve,
Check out
http://www.fairings-etc.com/
Bob Snedaker is in the process of completing the Prototypes for the RV-9A
and indicated he expected have them available later this month.
As far as the wood dampening strips, here's what Van's said back in Aug:
On 29 Aug 02, at 7:53, Dave Nicholson wrote:
> Gus,
>
> What's the current thinking on the need for the Wood Damping Strips?
My thinking is don't do it til you fly and can determine if you need
them or not. None of Van's airplanes have them.
>
> If they're needed, is the front better than the back?
>
back is easier
> If the back side is best how do you deal with the brake line?
>
The brake line is on the front of the gear leg, so it doesn't
interfere.You can zip tie it to the gear leg when the stiffener is
installed.
Gus
Dave
90347
----- Original Message -----
From: "steve dwyer" <stdwyer(at)dreamscape.com>
Subject: RV9-List: main gear farings
>
> It appears van wants us to fabricate the upper main gear intersect faring
after the wings are installed at least thats my take on this according to
the drawing. I really dont want to do to do this kind of work once the plane
has been moved to the hanger has anyone rigged some sort of temporary bottom
wing skin surface to lay up the glass to? If so can I have your thoughts.
>
> Van gives us the option of placing wood dampening strips on either the
front or aft side of the main gear legs. It really looks like the front is
the best choice since the brake line gives us the best configuration wrap
around to the break cylinder if it comes down the aft. If we are trying to
dampen possible vibrations
> would oak casing be better than pine or is it to stiff or does it not
matter? It would appear the greater the mass of wood material would be most
effective, I know some of you are ignoring this altogether but in my case I
know how my luck runs given murphys law and all, I really dont want to have
to retrofit my gear legs after the plane is completed.
>
> Steve Dwyer Slider Canopy and Windscreen completed 90219
> >
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Glenn Brasch" <gbrasch(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | HS 908 Angle Brackets |
I am just prior to riveting the HS'er's. I have things cleco'ed together before
final dis-assembly and was putting the brackets in place to check things over.
I swore before I match drilled the brackets to the spar and doubler that they
were perfectly aligned. Now, they both seem to be off of alignment by 1/32nd
each in opposite directions, which seems to exaggerate the problem. Have I really
messed up somehow, or will it all "come together" in the end. Thanks in
advance. Glenn Brasch/Arizona.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Dave Nicholson" <dnick2(at)insightbb.com> |
| Subject: | Re: HS 908 Angle Brackets |
Glenn,
Check to see if you have them reversed, either now or when you drilled them.
If they are drilled "bad", you can get some 5/32" Universal Rivets, and
re-drill the holes.
BTW, if you wait until the HS is completely assembled before riveting these
angles in place, things will go easier. (Check the Archives for more
information on this issue.)
Dave
90347
----- Original Message -----
From: "Glenn Brasch" <gbrasch(at)earthlink.net>
Subject: RV9-List: HS 908 Angle Brackets
>
> I am just prior to riveting the HS'er's. I have things cleco'ed together
before final dis-assembly and was putting the brackets in place to check
things over. I swore before I match drilled the brackets to the spar and
doubler that they were perfectly aligned. Now, they both seem to be off of
alignment by 1/32nd each in opposite directions, which seems to exaggerate
the problem. Have I really messed up somehow, or will it all "come together"
in the end. Thanks in advance. Glenn Brasch/Arizona.
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Leland" <RV9AQB(at)frys.com> |
| Subject: | Fuel line location |
Van's plans for the 9A show the fuel line going up and to the right from the
electric pump to a firewall penetration for the gascolator. Having that fuel
line behind the passengers rudder pedals bothers me for fear the pedals or
the passenger's feet may dislodge the line. My pedals are mounted as far
forward as possible due to my long legs. I've read that RV6 pilots sometimes
put their feet under and behind the pedals on x-country flights. Does this
potential interferance bother anyone else, and have you come up with
anything better?
Leland in Pleasanton
"Trying" to align the wheel pants according to the drawings
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "dean van winkle" <dvanwinkle(at)royell.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Van's conduit |
Barry and others
The corrugated nylon conduit that I received from Van's measured 3/4 inch OD
in the bottom of the corrugations. I used a unibit to cut 3/4 inch dia holes
in each rib centered one inch below the upper rib flange and six and one
half inches aft of the rib to spar flange. After deburring the holes, I
slit the conduit lengthwise for the full length of the wing. Starting at
the tip rib, I rolled one edge of the conduit inside the other to feed it
through the ribs all the way to the root rib. Again starting at one end, I
stretched each segment in turn by a small amount to eliminate any droop or
slack in the conduit, making sure that the edges were back together in each
rib hole. It was tedious and time consuming, but it gave a nice snug
installation, open to any rib bay, and should preclude any appreciable rib
to conduit working.
Dean Van Winkle
90095
Fuselage
----- Original Message -----
From: "barry pote" <barrypote(at)comcast.net>
Subject: Re: RV9-List: Van's conduit
>
> Wait till you get the material, in case they have changed. Advice I
> would give is put the holes in before riveting ribs to spars. I used pro
> seal to hold it in place.
> Barry Pote RV9a
>
> > I have ordered Van's conduit for wiring routing in the wing.
> > Unfortunately, it is not here yet and I want to work on the wing ribs.
> >
> > Does anyone know what size holes I should provide for this in the ribs?
> > Does this require additional abrasion protection in the form of
> > bushings, or is it good as is?
> >
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Roy Taylor" <Royandjilly(at)btinternet.com> |
| Subject: | PRES-15 SW oil press. switch |
You've got 3 terminals on it. Which ones do I use for the Hobbs, and which for
an oil pressure warning light.. and is the other to ground? No markings on it
and no diagram either. I suppose at 4 psi I'll get a circuit on one terminal,
and not on another?
Roy Somerset UK
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | barry pote <barrypote(at)comcast.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Van's conduit |
Dean, the splitting of the tube is a nice touch. I put a dab of
proseal, here and there to 'keep' it firm. The only trick I would
recommend is...DO THE DRILLING OF HOLES in the ribs, before riveting to
the spars. Much easier de-burring.
Barry Pote RV 9a canopy
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Gary Newsted" <fcs(at)jlc.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Van's conduit |
Most people don't cut the conduit open, but rather, just work it through the
progression of holes, only cutting openings where wires need to exit. Be sure
to add a drop of adhesive (weatherstrip, Auto-Goop, or ProSeal, etc.) at the
point where the conduit passes through each rib. This dampens vibration and
reduces the chances of eventual chaffing all the way through the conduit.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "dean van winkle" <dvanwinkle(at)royell.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Van's conduit |
Barry
For planning purposes, I ordered the conduit right after receiving the wing
kit. All the rib conduit holes were done on the drill press before
assembling the wing skeletons. The conduit was installed, with the split
down to drain any possible condensation, after the top skins were riveted
on. The conduit upper forward location keeps it out of the way when
installing the bottom skins.
Dean Van Winkle RV-9A Fuselage
----- Original Message -----
From: "barry pote" <barrypote(at)comcast.net>
Subject: Re: RV9-List: Van's conduit
>
> Dean, the splitting of the tube is a nice touch. I put a dab of
> proseal, here and there to 'keep' it firm. The only trick I would
> recommend is...DO THE DRILLING OF HOLES in the ribs, before riveting to
> the spars. Much easier de-burring.
>
> Barry Pote RV 9a canopy
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | JohnCClarkVA(at)cs.com |
| Subject: | Re: Van's conduit |
Try attaching a small aluminum J-shaped clips to the ribs, with the hook
aligned with the edge of the lightening hole. You can then run the conduit
down through the lightening holes and use zip-ties to attach the conduit to
the J portion of the clip. Dap some proseal or aluminum-safe RTV to the
conduit and rib. You can skip some of the closely spaced inboard ribs. You
only have to drill small holes for rivets or pop-rivets to attach the J-clip
rather than the 3/4 inch holes in all of the ribs.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Gary" <rv9er(at)3rivers.net> |
| Subject: | Re: PRES-15 SW oil press. switch |
Where did you get the switch? Mine is from B&C specialties. It came with a diagram.
You can check yours with an Ohmmeter to be sure. You should put a few drops of
oil in it and blow on the switch to check it. Mine gave funny readings till
it was oiled.
If you want, I can look up the connection lettering on mine, but it might be different
from yours.
Gary
----- Original Message -----
From: Roy Taylor
To: rv9-list(at)matronics.com
Sent: Saturday, January 04, 2003 4:13 PM
Subject: RV9-List: PRES-15 SW oil press. switch
You've got 3 terminals on it. Which ones do I use for the Hobbs, and which for
an oil pressure warning light.. and is the other to ground? No markings on it
and no diagram either. I suppose at 4 psi I'll get a circuit on one terminal,
and not on another?
Roy Somerset UK
---
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: PRES-15 SW oil press. switch |
Roy,
You most likely have a SPDT switch. One terminal is common, one is normally
closed, one normally open. You will wan to connect the Hobbs to the
normally open circuit. When engine oil pressure increases, this circuit
will close allowing the Hobbs to run.
You can tell which is normally closed with the ohm meter. Which is common
is a little tricky. Usually the common is marked or is different in some
way from the other two.
Hope this helps.
> You've got 3 terminals on it. Which ones do I use for the Hobbs, and which
for an oil pressure warning light.. and is the other to ground? No markings
on it and no diagram either. I suppose at 4 psi I'll get a circuit on one
terminal, and not on another?
> Roy Somerset UK
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Harold Kovac" <kayce(at)sysmatrix.net> |
| Subject: | Is there a fly in on next Sat. at SnF? |
A few weeks back I saw a few messages about an RV gathering at SnF in
Lakeland, is it still on? I checked the SnF site and nothing shows. I just
started a partially completed kit RV9 I picked up last month.. I'm in Ocala
and would like to know its on before a 2 hr. drive.
Harold Kovac
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "steve dwyer" <stdwyer(at)dreamscape.com> |
Can anyone with past experience elaborate on the process of moving your completed
plane to a paint shop. I can't imagine dropping off this delicate bird at a
body shop and simply picking it up in a week or two. I've heard of some guys
making a device that rotates the wings so the paint can be easily applied to both
sides. And what about transporting do we simply tie down the wing storage
rack in the back of the old pickup? Is this a concern to anyone else? Attempting
to buy and fire up an HVLP spray system in the garage on my own is beginning
to sound real tempting. Over the past two years I have picked up on many of
your inputs on painting yourself (Gary Newstead and others) but for those of us
who would rather turn this task over to an experienced painter I'd like some
thoughts.
Steve Dwyer Installing wheel and leg fairings
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "fcs(at)jlc.net" <fcs(at)jlc.net> |
Hi Steve, A large flat-bed truck is the way to go as far as moving the
fuselage. This assumes you've removed the wings, main and tail, and
vertical stabilizer. You'll need an oversized load permit if you don't
remove the empennage. Anyway you go, there's a risk of scratching the
paint job. I've painted my empennage and have already banged into it in
the garage. My painting is being done in a boat-shed at my home. I just
cover the floors, walls, and ceiling with tarps stapled to the walls. Keep
in mind its an airplane, not a show car. Even perfect paint won't look so
perfect for long once you start flying and exposing it to the elements.
Some may feel differently, but I don't place the high value on airplane
painting that I do on a car. In fact, I would paint outdoors if it
weren't for the four foot snowdrifts... Some airports allow you to paint
in the hangars, but be sure you are well sealed off from other peoples
planes. There are also paint methods that don't create the airborne mess
of spraying, and some paints which are far less toxic. Shop around.
Finally, don't overlook "real" aircraft painting shops. Most reasonbly
sized airports will have at least one painter on the field. Flying the
bird there and away when done is nice. Particularly since it can be
painted while fully assembled, thus avoiding the chances of banging into
stuff.
Good luck, Gary Newsted
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Leland" <RV9AQB(at)frys.com> |
| Subject: | Re: PRES-15 SW oil press. switch |
Roy, here are two posts from the Archives regarding your question on wiring
the oil pressure switch.
Leland in Pleasanton
Question: Can one of you please give me some insight on the wiring of Van's
oil
pressure switch (the one that is to run the Hobbs, not the oil pressure).
It has three terminals... what is the proper hook-up for these three
terminals?
Response: One terminal is power the other two are normally open and normally
closed.
The normally open starts the Hobbs when it gets oil pressure and closes. I
use the normally closed terminal to illuminate a master on/low oil pressure
light on the instrument panel. Watch the Hobbs wire hook up. It is
polarity
sensitive.
________________________________________________________________________________
Have two Oregon Areo seat cores for sale. These are custom made high tech
seats for the RV9. I won't be using them as I will be doing something a
little different with the interior. Unused, still in the bag. Email me
with an offer if you're interested.
Oregon Aero part number: 30RV901 See at
http://www.oregonaero.com/p33_2001.htm
Thanks,
Dale
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: FS: RV9 Seats |
> Just out of curiosity, what are you planning to do differently?
Joshua,
Talked with my interior guy yesterday and he talked me into a fiberglass
center console and armrest. The seats I have will require some
modification. He also said he could build a custom seat to fit me with
adjustable lumbar supports. He said he could modify the Oregon Aero seats,
but he could build a custom fit seat cheaper and lighter. The Oregon areo
seats are very comfy but are a bit heavy.
He has 35 years in the business, so I'm going with his recommendations.
Dale
RV9A
Working on composite panel.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Leland" <rv9aqb(at)frys.com> |
| Subject: | Re: RV9-List Digest: 3 Msgs - 01/08/03 |
Dale, the main adavantage in the Oregon Aero cushions is that they give you
"crush resistance" in the event of a hard off-field landing. This is needed
in a ship where you sit low and esssentially over the wing spar.
Leland in Pleasanton
Making wheel pants intersection fairings
> Talked with my interior guy yesterday and he talked me into a fiberglass
> center console and armrest. The seats I have will require some
> modification. He also said he could build a custom seat to fit me with
> adjustable lumbar supports. He said he could modify the Oregon Aero
seats,
> but he could build a custom fit seat cheaper and lighter. The Oregon areo
> seats are very comfy but are a bit heavy.
>
> He has 35 years in the business, so I'm going with his recommendations.
>
> Dale
> RV9A
> Working on composite panel.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Andy Karmy" <andy(at)karmy.com> |
| Subject: | Re: RV9-List Digest: 3 Msgs - 01/08/03 |
Along with the fact that they are ssssoooooo comfortable! I just got my finished
Oregon Aero seats installed last night. It make garage flying much nicer now!
I've almost completed my test period with my eyes closed sitting in the garage!
;)
- Andy
---------- Original Message ----------------------------------
From: "Leland" <rv9aqb(at)frys.com>
Date: Thu, 9 Jan 2003 08:30:37 -0800
>
>Dale, the main adavantage in the Oregon Aero cushions is that they give you
>"crush resistance" in the event of a hard off-field landing. This is needed
>in a ship where you sit low and esssentially over the wing spar.
>Leland in Pleasanton
>Making wheel pants intersection fairings
>
>> Talked with my interior guy yesterday and he talked me into a fiberglass
>> center console and armrest. The seats I have will require some
>> modification. He also said he could build a custom seat to fit me with
>> adjustable lumbar supports. He said he could modify the Oregon Aero
>seats,
>> but he could build a custom fit seat cheaper and lighter. The Oregon areo
>> seats are very comfy but are a bit heavy.
>>
>> He has 35 years in the business, so I'm going with his recommendations.
>>
>> Dale
>> RV9A
>> Working on composite panel.
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Roy Taylor" <Royandjilly(at)btinternet.com> |
| Subject: | starter solenoid |
"S" terminal goes to starter switch, right? "I" terminal goes to starter if necessary
(probably not). Where and how should I wire in a starter warning light...from
the "I" terminal? Diode I haven't a problem with..."S" terminal to ground
on battery tray.
Comments much appreciated.
Roy, Somerset, UK.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Albert Gardner" <albert.gardner(at)worldnet.att.net> |
| Subject: | Wing Installation |
I took my RV-9A to the airport today and put the wings on. Not as big of a
job as I had anticipated. Took about 6 hours to put the bolts in which
includes a pizza break. I thought it looked nice in my garage but it looks
awesome at the airport.
Albert Gardner, Yuma, AZ
RV-9A: N872RV
Wings On
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Larry Perryman" <larry-perryman(at)txucom.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Wing Installation |
Way to go Albert.
Keep up the good work and let us know when you take flight.
Regards
Larry Perryman
N194DL
----- Original Message -----
From: "Albert Gardner" <albert.gardner(at)worldnet.att.net>
Subject: RV9-List: Wing Installation
|
| I took my RV-9A to the airport today and put the wings on. Not as big of a
| job as I had anticipated. Took about 6 hours to put the bolts in which
| includes a pizza break. I thought it looked nice in my garage but it looks
| awesome at the airport.
| Albert Gardner, Yuma, AZ
| RV-9A: N872RV
| Wings On
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Andy Karmy" <andy(at)karmy.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Wing Installation |
Congratulations Albert!
I am looking forward to this very same task... estimated at 1 week to go for Airport
move of 169AK!
- Andy (prop mounted today)
---------- Original Message ----------------------------------
From: "Albert Gardner" <albert.gardner(at)worldnet.att.net>
Date: Sat, 11 Jan 2003 20:38:09 -0700
>
>I took my RV-9A to the airport today and put the wings on. Not as big of a
>job as I had anticipated. Took about 6 hours to put the bolts in which
>includes a pizza break. I thought it looked nice in my garage but it looks
>awesome at the airport.
>Albert Gardner, Yuma, AZ
>RV-9A: N872RV
>Wings On
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Dave Nicholson" <dnick2(at)insightbb.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Wing Installation |
Hi Larry,
Did you put any lubricant on the Spar Bolts for your wings?
If so, what did you use?
Dave
90347
----- Original Message -----
From: "Larry Perryman" <larry-perryman(at)txucom.net>
Subject: Re: RV9-List: Wing Installation
>
> Steve,
>
> They are very tight. You will need someone to hold up on the end of the
wing
> while you tap them home.
>
> If you have a tri gear kit, two of the bolts have to go in from the back
to
> the front because they are behind the gear leg bracket. It is a bit tight
to
> get the nuts on them there. I used a long set of forceps that I found at a
> hardware store to hold the nut while I turned the bolt. (one place where
> this is the only way to get it done).
>
> Get a couple of hardware store bolts 3/8 x 5 or so inches long and grind
the
> threads off to form a blunt tapered punch. They work well for aligning the
> holes and holding them there while you fit the "close tolerance" bolts.
>
> This is where someone wiggling the end of the wing will help get the first
> two bolts in. After that, you will not be able to move the wing.
>
> Now get those wings mounted and finish the planes so you can join our
little
> club.
> Regards
> Larry Perryman
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Larry Perryman" <larry-perryman(at)txucom.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Wing Installation |
I think that I used WD-40 since my fuel lube had not come in then. Any good
non corrosive grease should work.
Regards
Larry
----- Original Message -----
From: "Dave Nicholson" <dnick2(at)insightbb.com>
Subject: Re: RV9-List: Wing Installation
|
| Hi Larry,
|
| Did you put any lubricant on the Spar Bolts for your wings?
|
| If so, what did you use?
|
| Dave
| 90347
|
| ----- Original Message -----
| From: "Larry Perryman" <larry-perryman(at)txucom.net>
| To:
| Subject: Re: RV9-List: Wing Installation
|
|
|
| >
| > Steve,
| >
| > They are very tight. You will need someone to hold up on the end of the
| wing
| > while you tap them home.
| >
| > If you have a tri gear kit, two of the bolts have to go in from the back
| to
| > the front because they are behind the gear leg bracket. It is a bit
tight
| to
| > get the nuts on them there. I used a long set of forceps that I found at
a
| > hardware store to hold the nut while I turned the bolt. (one place where
| > this is the only way to get it done).
| >
| > Get a couple of hardware store bolts 3/8 x 5 or so inches long and grind
| the
| > threads off to form a blunt tapered punch. They work well for aligning
the
| > holes and holding them there while you fit the "close tolerance" bolts.
| >
| > This is where someone wiggling the end of the wing will help get the
first
| > two bolts in. After that, you will not be able to move the wing.
| >
| > Now get those wings mounted and finish the planes so you can join our
| little
| > club.
| > Regards
| > Larry Perryman
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Larry Perryman" <larry-perryman(at)txucom.net> |
| Subject: | Wing Installation |
To all you folks installing wings:
Please put in the plate nuts in the holes that you skipped on the inboard
edge of the wing.
Remember every third rivet that you left out for no apparent reason?
It is very hard to put them in once the wings are installed.
Regards
Larry Perryman
N194DL
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Albert Gardner" <albert.gardner(at)worldnet.att.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Wing Installation |
Several things regarding wing installation:
A) Although Dwg shows all spar bolts with the nuts forward, it's only really
necessary on the bottom bolts although I installed all of them pointing
forward.
B) Check your wings bolts carefully, 2 of mine had a much tighter fit than
the others and were much harder to install. Fortunatly they were bolts
going in the top rather than the bottom.
C)Check the fit of all of the bolts in both the wing and the center spar
holes to make sure they will go in. Many have found that the landing gear
weldment holes need to be slightly enlarged so that the threads don't get
banged up when the bolt goes through them. If I was doing it again I would
bolt the landing gear weldment on the center spar and do a trial fit of the
bolts through the holes long before I closed up the cabin area.
D) I coated all the bolts with anti-seize and ran them through the center
spar holes as well as the wing spar holes before we set the wing in place.
In most cases bolts that were a tight fit loosened up by just placing them
in the wing or center spar hole and doing some twisting and turning.
E) Once the holes were lubed with anti=seize and the bolts would slip in, we
put the wing in place and held it with some regular bolts that had the
threads ground down so as to act as loose fitting pins. We then made sure
that the close bolt was well lubed with anti-seize then dipped it in light
oil and slipped/pushed/tapped/twisted/cussed it in place. After you get a
couple of them in the rest are fairly easy except for the bottom nuts inside
the landing gear weldment. One or two guys out on the wing to do a little
jiggling makes it work.
F) Make sure you ply the work crew with pizza and a suitable beverage in
order to keep them on the job until the end.
Keep on trucking, the end is in sight.
Albert Gardner, Yuma, AZ
RV-9A: N872RV
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Gary" <rv9er(at)3rivers.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Wing Installation |
So, how do you locate the matching holes in the fuselage belly skin/wing root fairing?
Gary
----- Original Message -----
From: Larry Perryman
To: rv9-list(at)matronics.com
Sent: Sunday, January 12, 2003 8:03 PM
Subject: RV9-List: Wing Installation
To all you folks installing wings:
Please put in the plate nuts in the holes that you skipped on the inboard
edge of the wing.
Remember every third rivet that you left out for no apparent reason?
It is very hard to put them in once the wings are installed.
Regards
Larry Perryman
N194DL
---
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Wing Installation |
| From: | "Larry PERRYMAN" <larry.perryman(at)atofina.com> |
01/13/2003 06:30:50 PM,
Serialize complete at 01/13/2003 06:30:50 PM
Gary,
You can drill down from the top through the plate nuts with a #40 x 12
drill bit or leave them out and drill a hole for a sheet metal screw. Once
again a two person job since you need someone to hold the bottom skin up
against the wing.
I did not put any platenuts there because I did not see the problem until
I had installed the wing. I am stuck with the sheet metal screw route.
Regards,
Larry Perryman
Gary
01/13/2003 10:53 AM
Please respond to rv9-list
To: rv9-list(at)matronics.com
cc:
Subject: Re: RV9-List: Wing Installation
So, how do you locate the matching holes in the fuselage belly skin/wing
root fairing?
Gary
----- Original Message -----
From: Larry Perryman
To: rv9-list(at)matronics.com
Sent: Sunday, January 12, 2003 8:03 PM
Subject: RV9-List: Wing Installation
To all you folks installing wings:
Please put in the plate nuts in the holes that you skipped on the
inboard
edge of the wing.
Remember every third rivet that you left out for no apparent reason?
It is very hard to put them in once the wings are installed.
Regards
Larry Perryman
N194DL
---
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Gary" <rv9er(at)3rivers.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Wing Installation |
Okay, Larry. I wonder if U-type tinnerman nuts would work there. But then you
couldn't use flat head screws.
Gary
----- Original Message -----
From: Larry PERRYMAN
To: rv9-list(at)matronics.com
Sent: Monday, January 13, 2003 10:30 AM
Subject: Re: RV9-List: Wing Installation
Gary,
You can drill down from the top through the plate nuts with a #40 x 12
drill bit or leave them out and drill a hole for a sheet metal screw. Once
again a two person job since you need someone to hold the bottom skin up
against the wing.
I did not put any platenuts there because I did not see the problem until
I had installed the wing. I am stuck with the sheet metal screw route.
Regards,
Larry Perryman
---
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Im7shannon(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Wing Installation |
Guys,
I had my plane inspected by Scott McDaniels when I sold it, he told me that
those belly skin to wing skin screws were important because they were
structural, and highly recommended using countersunk screws and platenuts. He
said when they did the wing loading test on the mock up in the shop they
could see these points were taking some deflection.
Im going to be down there for the air show Albert, maybe you will be flying
by then?
Kevin Shannon
> Okay, Larry. I wonder if U-type tinnerman nuts would work there. But then
> you couldn't use flat head screws.
>
> Gary
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: Larry PERRYMAN
> To: rv9-list(at)matronics.com
> Sent: Monday, January 13, 2003 10:30 AM
> Subject: Re: RV9-List: Wing Installation
>
>
> larry.perryman(at)atofina.com>
>
> Gary,
>
> You can drill down from the top through the plate nuts with a #40 x 12
> drill bit or leave them out and drill a hole for a sheet metal screw.
> Once
> again a two person job since you need someone to hold the bottom skin up
> against the wing.
>
> I did not put any platenuts there because I did not see the problem until
> I had installed the wing. I am stuck with the sheet metal screw route.
>
> Regards,
> Larry Perryman
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "David Burden" <db1yg(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | AeroSport/Performance |
Hey Folks,
Anyone on the list have any real world experience with the AeroSport 0-320 with
the high compression pistons in a 9 or 9A? I understand this engine produces
170hp and I was curious as to the cruise and climb performance compared with
a stock 320.
Cheers,
db1yg
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Richard E. Tasker" <retasker(at)optonline.net> |
I am working on my wings and am ready to put the W-919 in place on the
first wing. The drawings say nothing about the length. However, I
looked on the parts list at the front of the manual to find the length
(28.8125") and that seems to work as far as length.
Now I have a question regarding width/placement. The instructions say
to draw a line 5/16" from one edge and then insert the strip between the
skin and the nose rib until the line is visible through the skin holes.
It further states that this allows 5/8" of protrusion to support the
tank skin. The numbers don't add up... The strip is 1.5" wide. The
hole centers are 5/16" from the edge of the skin. This uses up 5/8" of
the strip width (5/16" on either side of the holes). If we subtract
this from 1.5" we get 7/8" of protrusion, not 5/8" as stated in the manual.
What is correct? The line position or the stated amount of protrusion?
Or is there a gap between the fuel tank nose rib and the leading edge
nose rib and the 5/8" stated in the manual is actually the overlap with
the fuel tank skin and the extra 1/4" is the gap between the two?
Thanks,
Dick Tasker. 90573
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Norman" <nhunger(at)sprint.ca> |
| Subject: | Re: Wing Installation |
I am facing this when I get to the airport. I plan on slipping in the wings
with just 4-5 bolts per side. I'll have the wing marked for the perfect
position of the holes with a parallel line one inch out on the wing bottom.
That way I will be able to locate the holes perfectly. Next I'll pull the
bolts and slide the wings out 6-8 inches and install the platenuts and
dimple the belly skins. Any one see a problem with this plan?
> You can drill down from the top through the plate nuts with a #40 x 12
> drill bit or leave them out and drill a hole for a sheet metal screw. Once
> again a two person job since you need someone to hold the bottom skin up
> against the wing.
>
> I did not put any platenuts there because I did not see the problem until
> I had installed the wing. I am stuck with the sheet metal screw route.
Do you mean these sheet metal screws will have heads sticking out in the
wind? How will they lock in? Wouldn't #6 machine screws with nylock nuts be
better?
Norman Hunger
RV6A Delta BC
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Albert Gardner" <albert.gardner(at)worldnet.att.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Wing Installation |
About the only problem Norman is that the wing spar only sticks in about 6
or 8 inches. The wing is very light, stick it in there with 3 or 4 regular
bolts with the threads ground down. They are about .010" undersize so they
will be very easy to insert and will locate it accurately enough. Set the
sweep and incidence and locate the rear spar hole. Match drill the lower
skin holes, pull the wing out onto sawhorses and finish up the holes and
platenuts and you're ready for final installation.
BTW, if I were to do this again, I would install the rod end bearings for
the aileron push/pull tubes on the control stick. Then when your hooking
them up later you don't have to you can just turn the threaded tube end onto
the rod end bearing. The other end will be loose anyway since you will be
setting aileron position at that time.
Albert Gardner, Yuma, AZ
RV-9A: N872RV
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Tim <rv9a_000(at)deru.com> |
Richard E. Tasker wrote:
>
> I am working on my wings and am ready to put the W-919 in place on the
...
> the strip width (5/16" on either side of the holes). If we subtract
> this from 1.5" we get 7/8" of protrusion, not 5/8" as stated in the manual.
>
> What is correct? The line position or the stated amount of protrusion?
My manual and my preview plans both say 7/8" will be exposed
to support the tank skin, and a quick measurement of my wing
in fact shows 7/8" protruding.
Try measuring the outboard edge of the tank skin to make sure
7/8" of protruding W-919 will fit without interfering with the
outboard tank nose rib.
- Tim.
90338
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Albert Gardner" <albert.gardner(at)worldnet.att.net> |
| Subject: | Sliding Canopy Lock |
I discovered a rather simple canopy lock setup that looks like it might do
the job. If you bought the keyed mag/starter switch from Vans, it came with
2 tumbler locks with a flat arm that swung 90 degrees to lock/unlock. All 3
use the same key which is really nice. I installed the tumbler locks in the
Canopy Skirt so that it protruded into one of the large holes in C-791
(Canopy Skirt Brace). You have to enlarge the hole in the Skirt Brace and be
careful that there is room to install the hex nut on the lock tumbler
without it interfering with the Canopy Frame. I cut a slot in the Canopy
Roller Track for the flat arm to swing down into and lock the canopy in the
closed position. The lock tumbler just barely clears the Skirt Brace and
looks pretty clean without sticking out into the cabin very far. Much less
elaborate than pushing a pin up into the Roller Track from below. I put this
in after the canopy was finished but I wish the idea had occurred when I
was building it as it would have been easier.
Albert Gardner, Yuma, AZ
RV-9A: N872RV
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Andy Karmy" <andy(at)karmy.com> |
| Subject: | Wing skin attachment screws |
Ok guys, here's the word from Scott McDaniels on those skin overlap screws on the
center section... I think this makes it fairly clear as to what we need to
do in this area.
- Andy
writes:
> Hi Scott,
>
> This thread has been cooking on the matronics rv9 list and I wasn't
> sure if you watched that one or not... Any comments would be
> helpfull.
>
> - Andy Karmy
> RV9A Seattle WA
>
Hi Andy
No I don't monitor that list at all (I do cruise the RV-list archives
occasionally).
When the static testing was done on the wings they were attached to a
center section portion of a fuselage with all of the specified AN509
flush screws and K1100 plate nuts installed. When the wings were
unloaded after going to ultimate load (150% of limit load) it was
apparent that the over lap skin from the fuselage had been taking some
load because most all of the dimpled screw holes had been
stretched/elongated (remember, at ultimate load, permanent damage is
acceptable; catastrophic failure of the wing is not).
Because of this evidence, any deviation from the plans in this area could
be reducing the ultimate load the wings are capable of. How much? Who
knows. We don't test to see what strength variations may occur from
modifications builders may choose to make.
I do know that a screw in a dimple in another dimple into a riveted plate
nut is a stronger joint than a truss head screw into a couple of un
countersunk holes with a riveted plate nut. A joint with a truss head
screw into a tinnerman nut or just a sheet metal screw is weaker still.
I personally would never deviate from the plans at this location.
Considering the amount of work required to build the airplane, it takes a
very small amount of time (in comparison) to do it right.
I realize it is a pain, but the assembly process of the current RV kits
was never intended for the wings to be installed on to the fuselage just
once during the construction process. If a builder plans ahead he
wouldn't have to totally remove the wings to do this work.
Just pre install them with only one top and one bottom bolt. Do all of
the required root fairing work. Then slip the wing out far enough to put
one bolt through the inboard most hole at the bottom of the spar,
through the outboard most hole in the bottom of the center section. You
can then rest the outboard end of the wing on a saw horse ( you can even
use an under sized bolt that will easily slip through the holes without
getting them perfectly aligned). This will give you a gap of about 5"
between the wing and the fuse bottom skin, which is enough to prep for
and install the plate nuts. After you are finished it is an easy task to
slip the wing back into its final position. This can be done one wing at
a time with very little trouble.
Hope this is of some help.
Feel free to post it to the RV-9 list if you like.
Scott McDaniels
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | New books for Homebuilders |
| From: | sonja.englert(at)juno.com |
Hi everyone,
I would like to introduce myself to this group. I am an aeronautical engineer,
pilot, airplane homebuilder and writer. I have written 3 new books for airplane
homebuilders, which you can check out on my web page www.caroengineering.com.
They are mainly for airplane homebuilders, but should be of interest to anyone
who wants to install engines, work with composites or flight test an airplane.
Cheers,
Sonja Englert
www.caroengineering.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | KIKIDEEMAX(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | POP-RIVETING THE ATTACH ANGLES TO THE TANK |
I'M UNABLE TO USE MY POP-RIVETER TO GET THE ATTACH ANGLES ON THE
THE TANK ASSY. I AM FITTING THE TANK TO TO SPAR TO DRILL THE SPAR/ANGLE
SCREW HOLES. CAN SOMEONE RECOMMEND ANOTHER WAY OR A RIVETER THAT CAN HANDLE
THE TIGHT SPACE ON THE ATTACH ANGLE.
THANKS, DAVID MORGAN #90079
DENVER,COLO
Q/B FUSE. ORDERED
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Mark Schrimmer <mschrimmer(at)pacbell.net> |
| Subject: | Re: POP-RIVETING THE ATTACH ANGLES TO THE TANK |
on 1/15/03 11:17 AM, KIKIDEEMAX(at)aol.com at KIKIDEEMAX(at)aol.com wrote:
>
> I'M UNABLE TO USE MY POP-RIVETER TO GET THE ATTACH ANGLES ON THE
> THE TANK ASSY. I AM FITTING THE TANK TO TO SPAR TO DRILL THE SPAR/ANGLE
> SCREW HOLES. CAN SOMEONE RECOMMEND ANOTHER WAY OR A RIVETER THAT CAN HANDLE
> THE TIGHT SPACE ON THE ATTACH ANGLE.
>
> THANKS, DAVID MORGAN #90079
>
> DENVER,COLO
>
>
> Q/B FUSE. ORDERED
>
>
David,
If I remember correctly, you may have to grind away part of your pop riveter
to get it to fit. Many pop riveters are too wide. There is a picture of a
modified pop riveter in the instructions.
Mark Schrimmer
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "John Kerr" <kerrjohna(at)mtwest.net> |
| Subject: | Re: POP-RIVETING THE ATTACH ANGLES TO THE TANK |
I could not locate a picture of a modified pop rivet tool. Do you have a
reference #?
John Kerr-wing kit scheduled for delivery 1/17/03
----- Original Message -----
From: "Mark Schrimmer" <mschrimmer(at)pacbell.net>
Subject: Re: RV9-List: POP-RIVETING THE ATTACH ANGLES TO THE TANK
>
> on 1/15/03 11:17 AM, KIKIDEEMAX(at)aol.com at KIKIDEEMAX(at)aol.com wrote:
>
> >
> > I'M UNABLE TO USE MY POP-RIVETER TO GET THE ATTACH ANGLES ON THE
> > THE TANK ASSY. I AM FITTING THE TANK TO TO SPAR TO DRILL THE SPAR/ANGLE
> > SCREW HOLES. CAN SOMEONE RECOMMEND ANOTHER WAY OR A RIVETER THAT CAN
HANDLE
> > THE TIGHT SPACE ON THE ATTACH ANGLE.
> >
> > THANKS, DAVID MORGAN #90079
> >
> > DENVER,COLO
> >
> >
> > Q/B FUSE. ORDERED
> >
> >
> David,
>
> If I remember correctly, you may have to grind away part of your pop
riveter
> to get it to fit. Many pop riveters are too wide. There is a picture of a
> modified pop riveter in the instructions.
>
> Mark Schrimmer
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: POP-RIVETING THE ATTACH ANGLES TO THE TANK |
| From: | "Larry PERRYMAN" <larry.perryman(at)atofina.com> |
01/15/2003 10:33:04 PM,
Serialize complete at 01/15/2003 10:33:04 PM
John,
The picture is in the instructions section of the manual from Vans. You
get a cheap right angle pop rivet gun and grind the side opposite the
handles down until you can get it to fit at an angle down by the attach
brackets. A belt sander works quite well on this. . you want to use a
cheap gun since it is about a throw away after the grind job.
Regards,
Larry Perryman
John Kerr
01/15/2003 02:16 PM
Please respond to rv9-list
To: rv9-list(at)matronics.com
cc:
Subject: Re: RV9-List: POP-RIVETING THE ATTACH ANGLES TO THE TANK
I could not locate a picture of a modified pop rivet tool. Do you have a
reference #?
John Kerr-wing kit scheduled for delivery 1/17/03
----- Original Message -----
From: "Mark Schrimmer" <mschrimmer(at)pacbell.net>
Subject: Re: RV9-List: POP-RIVETING THE ATTACH ANGLES TO THE TANK
>
> on 1/15/03 11:17 AM, KIKIDEEMAX(at)aol.com at KIKIDEEMAX(at)aol.com wrote:
>
> >
> > I'M UNABLE TO USE MY POP-RIVETER TO GET THE ATTACH ANGLES ON THE
> > THE TANK ASSY. I AM FITTING THE TANK TO TO SPAR TO DRILL THE
SPAR/ANGLE
> > SCREW HOLES. CAN SOMEONE RECOMMEND ANOTHER WAY OR A RIVETER THAT CAN
HANDLE
> > THE TIGHT SPACE ON THE ATTACH ANGLE.
> >
> > THANKS, DAVID MORGAN #90079
> >
> > DENVER,COLO
> >
> >
> > Q/B FUSE. ORDERED
> >
> >
> David,
>
> If I remember correctly, you may have to grind away part of your pop
riveter
> to get it to fit. Many pop riveters are too wide. There is a picture of
a
> modified pop riveter in the instructions.
>
> Mark Schrimmer
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: POP-RIVETING THE ATTACH ANGLES TO THE TANK |
01/15/2003 03:39:17 PM
David, I just finished my tank. All you need to do is buy the cheapest pop
rivet tool you can find and grind clearance on the head. The depth of the
grind will depend on the position of the through holes in the angles. The
length of the grind will be slightly longer than the height of the attach
angle. The grind will be in the axis of the rivet center line only off set
to one side to make clearance for the tool. When you finish grinding you
will be able to see all the pats inside the rivet tool head moving. It is
probably best to disassemble the tool before grinding but then you have to
debur carefully so it will fit back together. I was pretty worried that I
would destroy my $12 sears rivet tool with the amount of grinding I needed
to do but it works better than ever in it's modified form. Good luck.
Bryan Flood
I'M UNABLE TO USE MY POP-RIVETER TO GET THE ATTACH ANGLES ON
THE
THE TANK ASSY. I AM FITTING THE TANK TO TO SPAR TO DRILL THE SPAR/ANGLE
SCREW HOLES. CAN SOMEONE RECOMMEND ANOTHER WAY OR A RIVETER THAT CAN
HANDLE
THE TIGHT SPACE ON THE ATTACH ANGLE.
THANKS, DAVID MORGAN #90079
DENVER,COLO
Q/B FUSE. ORDERED
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Curt Hoffman" <choffman9(at)cinci.rr.com> |
| Subject: | Re: POP-RIVETING THE ATTACH ANGLES TO THE TANK |
One watch out- I ground mine down some years ago when I was working on my
first kit. I continued to use the modified pop rivet gun over the years and
when I went to work on the tank on my -9 it wouldn't grab a rivet. Turns out
that the inside grabber thing wore through the part I ground down enough
that it would no longer compress enough on the stem to grab it. I had to go
buy another pop riveter and grind that one too.
Curt Hoffman
RV-9A wings
1968 Mustang 302 convertible
Piper Cherokee N5320W
----- Original Message -----
From: <BFlood@sauer-danfoss.com>
Subject: Re: RV9-List: POP-RIVETING THE ATTACH ANGLES TO THE TANK
>
>
> David, I just finished my tank. All you need to do is buy the cheapest pop
> rivet tool you can find and grind clearance on the head. The depth of the
> grind will depend on the position of the through holes in the angles. The
> length of the grind will be slightly longer than the height of the attach
> angle. The grind will be in the axis of the rivet center line only off set
> to one side to make clearance for the tool. When you finish grinding you
> will be able to see all the pats inside the rivet tool head moving. It is
> probably best to disassemble the tool before grinding but then you have to
> debur carefully so it will fit back together. I was pretty worried that I
> would destroy my $12 sears rivet tool with the amount of grinding I needed
> to do but it works better than ever in it's modified form. Good luck.
>
> Bryan Flood
>
>
> I'M UNABLE TO USE MY POP-RIVETER TO GET THE ATTACH ANGLES ON
> THE
> THE TANK ASSY. I AM FITTING THE TANK TO TO SPAR TO DRILL THE SPAR/ANGLE
> SCREW HOLES. CAN SOMEONE RECOMMEND ANOTHER WAY OR A RIVETER THAT CAN
> HANDLE
> THE TIGHT SPACE ON THE ATTACH ANGLE.
>
> THANKS, DAVID MORGAN #90079
>
> DENVER,COLO
>
>
> Q/B FUSE. ORDERED
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Nightingale Michael" <NightingaleMichaelV(at)JohnDeere.com> |
| Subject: | RV-9A Silhouette |
I'm looking for side and top silhouettes to start working on a paint scheme.
Michael V. Nightingale
DEERE & Co. Computer Center
400 19th ST.
Moline, IL. 61265
pager 563-327-7891
nightingalemichael(at)johndeere.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Andy Karmy" <andy(at)karmy.com> |
| Subject: | Re: RV-9A Silhouette |
RV8 builder Bill VonDane has them all on his website...
http://www.vondane.com/paint/index.htm
- Andy
---------- Original Message ----------------------------------
From: "Nightingale Michael" <NightingaleMichaelV(at)JohnDeere.com>
Date: Thu, 16 Jan 2003 14:56:30 -0600
>
>I'm looking for side and top silhouettes to start working on a paint scheme.
>
>Michael V. Nightingale
>DEERE & Co. Computer Center
>400 19th ST.
>Moline, IL. 61265
>
>pager 563-327-7891
>
>nightingalemichael(at)johndeere.com
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "fcs(at)jlc.net" <fcs(at)jlc.net> |
| Subject: | Re: RV-9A Silhouette |
They're also included in the finish kit plans.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Gary" <rv9er(at)3rivers.net> |
| Subject: | Clamp for nose strut fairing |
Andy,
Yeah, mine is done........except for finding the specified 3/8 inch wide hose clamp.
I was just going to post a message on the list about this, to see what
solutions people had.
The problem is not the pant.....it is the clamp. The deal is, the only hose clamps
I can find in a big enough size to go around the nose strut and fairing are
all 1/2 inch wide. Vans calls out a 3/8 inch wide clamp. I called Van's
on this, after searching all the hardware stores, and the aircraft supply catalogs.
The only place I have not checked is McMaster-Carr.
Van's didn't have an answer, other than what I'd already tried. He said it shouldn't
be a problem to find narrow hose clamps. I said, fine, you guys find them,
and include them in the kit.
Bottom line is, the pant and fairing fit fine, we just need a clamp that is narrow
enough and has a small enough worm drive so it won't hit the inside of the
front of the nose pant when the gear pivots.
I'll post this to the two lists and see what we stir up.
Gary
----- Original Message -----
From: Andy Karmy
To: rv9er(at)3rivers.net
Sent: Thursday, January 16, 2003 4:05 PM
Subject: Nose wheel pant?
Hey Gary,
I'm having a hard time getting the nosewheel pant to work out. Have you fit that
part yet? I finished mounting the pant and everything was fine until I tried
to install the nose gear leg fairing. Seems the hoseclamp at the bottom is
too high (when pressed all the way down) so it apears that I got the pant mounted
too low (by about 3/16") so now I can't hide the clamp inside the pant...
Did yours work out, or have you done it yet?
- Andy
---
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Gary" <rv9er(at)3rivers.net> |
| Subject: | Clamps for nose strut fairing |
Andy......looks like McMaster Carr can help us out. They have 5/16 inch wide
stainless hose clamps all the way up past 2 inches. The 1 1/4 inch size is around
$5 for a package of ten.
Go to http://www.mcmaster.com/ and search for hose clamps, worm drive.
Gary
---
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Cy Galley" <cgalley(at)qcbc.org> |
| Subject: | Re: Clamp for nose strut fairing |
Some of the foreign cars use the narrow clamp, Try a junk yard'
Cy Galley
Editor, EAA Safety Programs
cgalley(at)qcbc.org or experimenter(at)eaa.org
----- Original Message -----
From: "Gary" <rv9er(at)3rivers.net>
Subject: RV9-List: Clamp for nose strut fairing
>
> Andy,
>
> Yeah, mine is done........except for finding the specified 3/8 inch wide
hose clamp. I was just going to post a message on the list about this, to
see what solutions people had.
>
> The problem is not the pant.....it is the clamp. The deal is, the only
hose clamps I can find in a big enough size to go around the nose strut and
fairing are all 1/2 inch wide. Vans calls out a 3/8 inch wide clamp. I
called Van's on this, after searching all the hardware stores, and the
aircraft supply catalogs. The only place I have not checked is
McMaster-Carr.
>
> Van's didn't have an answer, other than what I'd already tried. He said
it shouldn't be a problem to find narrow hose clamps. I said, fine, you
guys find them, and include them in the kit.
>
> Bottom line is, the pant and fairing fit fine, we just need a clamp that
is narrow enough and has a small enough worm drive so it won't hit the
inside of the front of the nose pant when the gear pivots.
>
> I'll post this to the two lists and see what we stir up.
>
> Gary
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: Andy Karmy
> To: rv9er(at)3rivers.net
> Sent: Thursday, January 16, 2003 4:05 PM
> Subject: Nose wheel pant?
>
>
> Hey Gary,
>
> I'm having a hard time getting the nosewheel pant to work out. Have you
fit that part yet? I finished mounting the pant and everything was fine
until I tried to install the nose gear leg fairing. Seems the hoseclamp at
the bottom is too high (when pressed all the way down) so it apears that I
got the pant mounted too low (by about 3/16") so now I can't hide the clamp
inside the pant... Did yours work out, or have you done it yet?
>
> - Andy
>
>
> ---
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | [ Fred Stucklen ] : New Email List Photo Share Available! |
| From: | Email List Photo Shares <pictures(at)matronics.com> |
A new Email List Photo Share is available:
Poster: Fred Stucklen
Subject: Instrument Panel & Radio Stack Wiring
http://www.matronics.com/photoshare/Fred.Stucklen@UTCFuelCells.com.01.19.2003/index.html
--------------------------------------------
o EMAIL LIST PHOTO SHARE
Share your files and photos with other List members simply by
emailing the files to:
pictures(at)matronics.com
Please view the typical Share above and include the Description Text
Fields as shown along with your submission of files and photos.
o Main Photo Share Index:
http://www.matronics.com/photoshare
--------------------------------------------
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Richard E. Tasker" <retasker(at)optonline.net> |
Why is the spanwise stringer cut into two pieces? It comes in a nice
long angle and is then cut into two pieces that overlap at the wing skin
joint. Yes, I know that there would be a slight gap where the skins
overlap if it was one piece. But there is an even bigger gap due to the
overlap of the stringers and there is a still a gap where the inboard
stringer goes from the wing walk doubler to the single wing skin.
Does anyone have any explanations for this situation where it seems they
are making things worse rather than better? Or am I overlooking another
reason why there are two pieces?
Dick Tasker, 90573
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Curt Hoffman" <choffman9(at)cinci.rr.com> |
| Subject: | Re: W926 stringers |
That's probably a good design question to ask Vans sometime. The good thing
for me, the way I have my two wings set up in the basement to build, I'm not
sure I could have put the stringer in if it was one piece. I may have had to
relocate my jig. I hadn't thought through the fact they would need to slide
in from the side when I located the jig so the split worked out nice.
There are a lot of interesting "why / how come" questions when building. I
was wondering why the control tubes weren't cut to exact length instead of
coming about a half a foot long. It could be I suppose just to ensure you do
the 51% or there were some standard lengths from the suppliers. I still
can't figure out why I have so much angle left over. I got two pieces about
9' in length with the wing kit and all I had to make was some small pieces
for the flap brackets. I hope I'm not forgetting to install something : ).
These aren't the long ones for the fuselage.
Curt Hoffman
RV-9A wings
1968 Mustang 302 convertible
Piper Cherokee N5320W
----- Original Message -----
From: "Richard E. Tasker" <retasker(at)optonline.net>
Subject: RV9-List: W926 stringers
>
> Why is the spanwise stringer cut into two pieces? It comes in a nice
> long angle and is then cut into two pieces that overlap at the wing skin
> joint. Yes, I know that there would be a slight gap where the skins
> overlap if it was one piece. But there is an even bigger gap due to the
> overlap of the stringers and there is a still a gap where the inboard
> stringer goes from the wing walk doubler to the single wing skin.
>
> Does anyone have any explanations for this situation where it seems they
> are making things worse rather than better? Or am I overlooking another
> reason why there are two pieces?
>
> Dick Tasker, 90573
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: W926 stringers |
| From: | "Larry PERRYMAN" <larry.perryman(at)atofina.com> |
01/20/2003 03:41:28 PM,
Serialize complete at 01/20/2003 03:41:28 PM
Curt,
Don't worry about it. You will use all of that and more when you get to
the fuselage. Vans ships all the angle for the rest of the plane with the
wing kit since the wing spar box is the only on that is long enough for
the standard lengths. The firewall and front floor stiffeners eat up a lot
of it.
Regards
Larry Perryman
Curt Hoffman
01/20/2003 08:55 AM
Please respond to rv9-list
To: rv9-list(at)matronics.com
cc:
Subject: Re: RV9-List: W926 stringers
I still can't figure out why I have so much angle left over. I got two
pieces about
9' in length with the wing kit and all I had to make was some small pieces
for the flap brackets. I hope I'm not forgetting to install something : ).
These aren't the long ones for the fuselage.
Curt Hoffman
RV-9A wings
1968 Mustang 302 convertible
Piper Cherokee N5320W
----- Original Message -----
From: "Richard E. Tasker" <retasker(at)optonline.net>
Subject: RV9-List: W926 stringers
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Mark Schrimmer <mschrimmer(at)pacbell.net> |
| Subject: | Re: W926 stringers |
on 1/19/03 9:13 PM, Richard E. Tasker at retasker(at)optonline.net wrote:
>
> Why is the spanwise stringer cut into two pieces? It comes in a nice
> long angle and is then cut into two pieces that overlap at the wing skin
> joint. Yes, I know that there would be a slight gap where the skins
> overlap if it was one piece. But there is an even bigger gap due to the
> overlap of the stringers and there is a still a gap where the inboard
> stringer goes from the wing walk doubler to the single wing skin.
>
> Does anyone have any explanations for this situation where it seems they
> are making things worse rather than better? Or am I overlooking another
> reason why there are two pieces?
>
> Dick Tasker, 90573
Richard,
If I remember correctly, you're supposed to put the outboard J stringer
closest to the top wing skin, then you put the inboard J stringer into place
so it overlaps the outboard J stringer. This fills in the gap that is caused
by the extra thickness of the wing walk doubler.
Mark Schrimmer
Wings almost finished
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Richard Tasker <retasker(at)optonline.net> |
| Subject: | Re: W926 stringers |
I just discovered via Van's that I evidently used the wrong parts for
these stringers... Oh well...
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Steve Kiekover" <stneki(at)hotmail.com> |
Can anybody help me locate a source for AKZO primer that is cheaper than
Aircraft Spruce, also does this primer provide a moister barrier or does it
need to be top coated.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Nightingale Michael" <NightingaleMichaelV(at)JohnDeere.com> |
"'rv-list(at)matronics.com'"
| Subject: | Experimental Panel Builder |
What happened to the Experimental Panel builder, it's GONE!
Mike
RV-9A 90259
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Cy Galley" <cgalley(at)qcbc.org> |
| Subject: | Re: Experimental Panel Builder |
Looks like someone hacked the site!
----- Original Message -----
From: "Nightingale Michael" <NightingaleMichaelV(at)JohnDeere.com>
Subject: RV9-List: Experimental Panel Builder
>
> What happened to the Experimental Panel builder, it's GONE!
>
> Mike
> RV-9A 90259
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Terry Hobert" <terhobey(at)hotmail.com> |
I haven't really gotten any e-mails from the 9A builders last few days. Is
there something wrong or is everyone quiet?
Terry 9A empennage
The new MSN 8: smart spam protection and 2 months FREE*
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "L. Mark Thomasson" <lmthomasson(at)adelphia.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Experimental Panel Builder |
try http://epanelbuilder.com/
Looks like someone hacked the site!
What happened to the Experimental Panel builder, it's GONE!
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Joe Wiza <planejoel(at)juno.com> |
Listers
I haven't been on the list for some time, I did build fly RV6A and
then sold it due to the following.. Last march I was diagnost with small
cell lung cancer and was given 2 months. Looks like they were wrong.
I have just ordered RV9A kit and will be looking for an engine
would like to here from other people what they have used and any other
suggestions you might have, like did you install electric flaps. Also has
anyone heard any pro's or con's about Don George Acft in orlando FL.
Thanks ahead
RV9A
Joe
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Albert Gardner" <albert.gardner(at)worldnet.att.net> |
I have spent this last week at the airport doing the final assembly on my
RV-9A. If I were building another one these are some things I might do
differently. Everything I did at the airport was more difficult than back
at the ranch. No matter how many tools I took with me I always needed
something else.
A. Fitting the ailerons: before I put the bottom outboard skin on the wing I
think I'd put the bellcrank and push/pull tube in, check for deflection and
install the aileron stop. I had to do some filing in the rear spar where the
aileron push rod comes through because of the lateral movement of the
pushrod as the bellcrank rotates.
B. Wingtips: with the aileron lined up I for sure would fit the wingtips in
the shop.
C. Wiring: I thought I had plenty of holes for wires to go back and forth
through the spar and from side to side under the seats but it got very tight
by the time I was done. The holes in the lower front area of the seat ribs
just aft of the spar are of little use since the brackets holding the
control stick assy interfere with the two inboard ones. I'd consider putting
those wiring holes further aft. You need to make a hole in the fuse side
skin forward of the spar for the fuel sender. Also life would be easier if I
had made the hole in the fuse line up with the wiring conduit in the wing.
Albert Gardner, Yuma, AZ
RV-9A: N872RV
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | [ Ollie Washburn ] : New Email List Photo Share Available! |
| From: | Email List Photo Shares <pictures(at)matronics.com> |
A new Email List Photo Share is available:
Poster: Ollie Washburn
Subject: RV Tow Bars...
http://www.matronics.com/photoshare/ollie-6a@prodigy.net.01.25.2003/index.html
--------------------------------------------
o EMAIL LIST PHOTO SHARE
Share your files and photos with other List members simply by
emailing the files to:
pictures(at)matronics.com
Please view the typical Share above and include the Description Text
Fields as shown along with your submission of files and photos.
o Main Photo Share Index:
http://www.matronics.com/photoshare
--------------------------------------------
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Richard E. Tasker" <retasker(at)optonline.net> |
| Subject: | W-932DG drill guides - CAUTION!! |
CAUTION! I drilled the tank mounting brackets today and started using
the W-932DG drill guides supplied by Van's in the kit. Fortunately,
before I got very far I discovered that three out of four of the
supplied drill guiides were drilled incorrectly. The hole was not
centered properly across the narrow part of the guide. In addition, the
drawing dimensions seem to have an error in the length vs hole
placement. The manual says that the hole must be centered in the
bracket, but the dimensions show the hole slightly displaced from the
center. If it is actually supposed to be offset, then there should be
somewhere that sho\ws the proper placement on the bracket.
I ended up using the one drill guide that had the hole centered
laterally and longitudinally and the brackets came out fine.
Check the parts BEFORE you use them to drill your mounting brackets!
Dick Tasker, 90573
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Joe Wiza <planejoel(at)juno.com> |
I have ordered my wing and am wondering if its necessary to buyil a wing
jig like I did for the RV6A. Also anybody out there buil there wing tanks
is it the same tear jerking job as in the past . Thanks ahead.
Joe/RV9A
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Gene" <gene(at)nvaircraft.com> |
I have wing stands suitable for building your wings that I would be glad to
loan, when you are done loan them to someone else. I am located in Oregon
and the stands are at my hanger in McMinnville (MMV) Can send pitcures to
your e-mail.
Gene
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Ernest Kells" <ernest.kells(at)sympatico.ca> |
Hello, Joe:
You don't need a jig for wing building. The drawings will have instructions
for building something better.
For the wings just drop two vertical 4 x 4 posts from the ceiling, after
assembling the frame (spar plus ribs) on a work table attach the thing to
the uprights, use a 1 1/2" plastic drain pipe (with a screw coupling for
adjustment) to prevent sag in the middle. Finish the wing (leading edge
pointing up, at chest height).
For the tanks build a jig out of a couple of short pieces of 2 x 4's and a
couple of pieces of 5/8" sawdust board. Use one of the tank ribs to cut out
an opening in each sawdust board. Screw each board to its 2x4. Insert the
tank skin into the two jigs sitting on the work table. Insert the ribs,
etc. into the skins. Build the tanks. Keep the wing in its jig so you can
easily fit the tank to the leading edge of the wing.
Works well - - wait for the drawings. You will understand.
Ernest Kells - RV-9A O235-N2C, Wood Prop
Finish Kit 85% Complete
> I have ordered my wing and am wondering if its necessary to buyil a wing
> jig like I did for the RV6A. Also anybody out there buil there wing tanks
> is it the same tear jerking job as in the past . Thanks ahead. Joe/RV9A
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Streiker, Stephen D (Steve), WHLSL" <streiker(at)att.com> |
I am interested in eventually building an RV9. I'd like to partner up with a New
York metro area builder and maybe assist in exchange for some experience.
If you know of a builder in the area, please let me know.
s
Stephen D. Streiker
Global Account Manager - AT&T Service Provider Markets
32 Avenue of the Americas - W616 - New York, NY 10013
Phone: 212-387-5355 Fax: 360-397-7362 Mobile: 917-865-9875
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jim Hosie" <jhosie4(at)attbi.com> |
Joe,
My wing kit ships next week, A fellow local RV club member used two engine
stands from Harbor Freight (49.95 each).
I am doing the same and found there is need for some engineering to get an
acceptable height to work from.
But it makes for a very nice wheel around unit.
Good luck
Jim Hosie
N-9SU
Wings
----- Original Message -----
From: "Joe Wiza" <planejoel(at)juno.com>
Subject: RV9-List: wING
>
> I have ordered my wing and am wondering if its necessary to buyil a wing
> jig like I did for the RV6A. Also anybody out there buil there wing tanks
> is it the same tear jerking job as in the past . Thanks ahead.
>
> Joe/RV9A
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Joe Wiza <planejoel(at)juno.com> |
Thanks Gene but I live down in FL.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Joe Wiza <planejoel(at)juno.com> |
I have 8ft sliding glass doors in my down stairs where I plan on building
my 9A. Would some one measure the wheel base and hor stab width
please. Tanks ahead.
Joe
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Joe Wiza <planejoel(at)juno.com> |
I visited Don George acft factory today in Orlando FL I was pretty
impressed. Almost convinced to by an overhauld O320 160hp with cp ready
to install. No alterenaor or oil cooler. $15000
RV9A/Joe
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Dave Nicholson" <dnick2(at)insightbb.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Wheel base with |
Out-to-Out for the Wheels is 7'-6" (No Fairings)
Out-to-Out for the HS is 11'-6" (Fiberglass Tips, add 11")
If I were you, I would plan on removing the Empennage before moving the
Fuselage. (The top of the VS is about 8' off the floor!) About a dozen
bolts hold the HS & VS in place and they're pretty easy to get at. I've had
mine on and off several times.
Dave Nicholson
90347
----- Original Message -----
From: "Joe Wiza" <planejoel(at)juno.com>
Subject: RV9-List: Wheel base with
>
> I have 8ft sliding glass doors in my down stairs where I plan on building
> my 9A. Would some one measure the wheel base and hor stab width
> please. Tanks ahead.
>
> Joe
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Wheel base with |
| From: | "Larry PERRYMAN" <larry.perryman(at)atofina.com> |
01/28/2003 03:25:02 PM,
Serialize complete at 01/28/2003 03:25:02 PM
Joe,
The wheel base is around 6 feet. The HS is 11 feet. Just leave it off
until you get to the airport.
The fuselage with canopy is about 6.5 feet tall.
Regards,
Larry Perryman
N194DL Flying RV-9A
Joe Wiza
01/28/2003 06:01 AM
Please respond to rv9-list
To: rv9-list(at)matronics.com
cc:
Subject: RV9-List: Wheel base with
I have 8ft sliding glass doors in my down stairs where I plan on building
my 9A. Would some one measure the wheel base and hor stab width
please. Tanks ahead.
Joe
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Andy Karmy" <andy(at)karmy.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Wheel base with |
I just moved my plane to the airport and the main gear is 7' center to center on
the tires. Fit nicely on my 8' trailer with just a couple of inches to spare!
- Andy Karmy
RV9A Seattle WA
Final assembly at the airport
---------- Original Message ----------------------------------
From: Joe Wiza <planejoel(at)juno.com>
Date: Tue, 28 Jan 2003 07:01:17 -0500
>
>I have 8ft sliding glass doors in my down stairs where I plan on building
>my 9A. Would some one measure the wheel base and hor stab width
> please. Tanks ahead.
>
> Joe
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Dave Stewart" <davestewart(at)globalserve.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Wheel base with |
Dave.......I think you'll find the HS is about 9'-6" O/O (without tips).
Elevators (c'weight arms) add about 2" each end.
(I'm trying to figure my chances of test-fitting everything in a 9'-11 1/2"
wide garage...YIKES!!)
Dave Stewart
90252
----- Original Message -----
From: "Dave Nicholson" <dnick2(at)insightbb.com>
Subject: Re: RV9-List: Wheel base with
>
> Out-to-Out for the Wheels is 7'-6" (No Fairings)
>
> Out-to-Out for the HS is 11'-6" (Fiberglass Tips, add 11")
>
> If I were you, I would plan on removing the Empennage before moving the
> Fuselage. (The top of the VS is about 8' off the floor!) About a dozen
> bolts hold the HS & VS in place and they're pretty easy to get at. I've
had
> mine on and off several times.
>
> Dave Nicholson
> 90347
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Joe Wiza" <planejoel(at)juno.com>
> To:
> Subject: RV9-List: Wheel base with
>
>
> >
> > I have 8ft sliding glass doors in my down stairs where I plan on
building
> > my 9A. Would some one measure the wheel base and hor stab width
> > please. Tanks ahead.
> >
> > Joe
> >
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Dave Nicholson" <dnick2(at)insightbb.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Wheel base with |
You're right, 9'-6" it is. (Next time I'll turn on the light in the
storeroom before reading the tape scale.)
Dave
----- Original Message -----
From: "Dave Stewart" <davestewart(at)globalserve.net>
Subject: Re: RV9-List: Wheel base with
>
> Dave.......I think you'll find the HS is about 9'-6" O/O (without tips).
> Elevators (c'weight arms) add about 2" each end.
> (I'm trying to figure my chances of test-fitting everything in a 9'-11
1/2"
> wide garage...YIKES!!)
> Dave Stewart
> 90252
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "steve dwyer" <stdwyer(at)dreamscape.com> |
| Subject: | RV-9A pilot operating handbook |
Does anyone have a POH specifically prepared for the rv9a? I contacted Vans and
Gus e-mailed me his written for his rv6a when he was still in Europe. I've got
to believe one of those guys out there with their 9 in the air has completed
this. Gus' is well done and follows Europe's version of the FAA requirements
identical to a POH found in a certified aircraft. I'd like to have this on board
and I dont want to take the time writing my own except for the weight and
balance and engine specifics, I guess I'm getting a little lazy after 2 years
of pounding rivets. Help anyone???
Steve Dwyer 90219
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jones" <esnj(at)granbury.com> |
| Subject: | RV-9A Air Speeds |
I am about 3 weeks from a first flight on my 9A and would be interested in knowing
what indicated air speeds seem to work best on final and at landing flair
at 1375 lbs. and 20 degrees of flaps. Any comments on what may have suprised
you on your first flight would be appreciated.
Dick Jones 90062
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Paulbaird(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: RV-9A pilot operating handbook |
Steve,
I started to convert one for a 6A to a 9A, but I haven't finished it
yet.
Paul Baird
90355
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Paulbaird(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: RV-9A Air Speeds |
Dick,
I have an 9A that I have been flying since July. My airspeed
indicator is in mph so if yours is in knots you will have to divide my
numbers by 1.15.
My stall speed when solo is from 42 to 44 mph depending on fuel load.
Using the traditional 1.3 times Vs would yield an approach speed of about 56
mph. I found that I needed a little more speed for elevator authority in the
flare. I use 65mph on final and it seems to be a very comfortable speed.
I didn't have any surprises on the test flights. It flew just as I
expected it to, only better. I did some "crow hops" before the first flight.
I got it about 2 ft off the ground and found I need a tad of aileron trim.
After that it was balanced and as stable as could be. I did about a half a
dozen crow hops and then I took off. I didn't use the flaps on the first
couple of flights. I added some speed of course on final.
Good Luck!
Paul Baird
90355
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Jim Brandvold <jbrandv(at)worldnet.att.net> |
This was posted some time ago.
Jim Brandvold
N209RV (Reserved)
Fitting the cowl.
ivo welch wrote:
>
> I know that every plane is different, but I would love to know what people are
> using as their speeds. here is what I am using:
>
> Vs0 45mph
> Vs1 52mph
> Vx 80mph
> Vy 100mph
> Va 135mph (?)
> Best Glide 70mph (???)
> 18nm glide range from 10,000' (for iPaq anywhere)
>
> naturally, the exact values won't apply, not even to my own plane, much less
to
> your's. (In case someone has it handy, I need to find the 55% power RPM setting
> table for the Lycoming 160hp).
>
> /iaw
> http://welch.som.yale.edu/n994ks/
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Larry Perryman" <larry-perryman(at)txucom.net> |
| Subject: | Re: RV-9A pilot operating handbook |
Steve,
If you will go to the RV-9 web site on Yahoo from Doug Reeves "Vans
AIrforce" web site, I have posted a couple of POH's for a 9 out there. I
copied them from ones on the Western Canada Wing web site.
You will need to edit it for your configuration. Since I am not using a
lycoming, you may need to cut and paste from the RV-6 poh out there for some
of the engine stuff. .
There is also flight test plans and other stuff out there if you want it.
Regards
Larry Perryman
N194DL 90288
----- Original Message -----
From: "steve dwyer" <stdwyer(at)dreamscape.com>
Subject: RV9-List: RV-9A pilot operating handbook
|
| Does anyone have a POH specifically prepared for the rv9a? I contacted
Vans and Gus e-mailed me his written for his rv6a when he was still in
Europe. I've got to believe one of those guys out there with their 9 in the
air has completed this. Gus' is well done and follows Europe's version of
the FAA requirements identical to a POH found in a certified aircraft. I'd
like to have this on board and I dont want to take the time writing my own
except for the weight and balance and engine specifics, I guess I'm getting
a little lazy after 2 years of pounding rivets. Help anyone???
|
| Steve Dwyer 90219
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Richard Tasker <retasker(at)optonline.net> |
| Subject: | Tank dimple Question |
I am starting on the tanks for my RV9A and would like your opinions of
tank dimple dies vs normal dimple dies.
I understand that the tank dimple dies make a deeper dimple to
compensate for the pro-seal under the rivet. If one uses the regular
dimple dies, does that leave the rivets sticking up an objectional
amoount? If that is the case, what does one do about that?
Thanks,
Dick Tasker
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Albert Gardner" <albert.gardner(at)worldnet.att.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Tank dimple Question |
Another way is to use your hand powered countersink tool. After you dimple
and as you're getting ready to rivet, use the countersink to take out a
little more material. I found most rivets would seat flush after that. On
the wing or fuse where there were lots of rivets to do, I put the
countersink tool in my drill and used it a low speed to cover lots of
ground.
Albert Gardner
RV-9A
Trying to find necessary form for final inspection.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | John Oliveira <oliveira(at)frontiernet.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Tank dimple Question |
I did much the same when needed, used the countersink tool in an
electric screwdriver. the same one I use for de-burring
John Oliveira N909RV Wings Done, waiting for Fuselage to arrive
Albert Gardner wrote:
>
>Another way is to use your hand powered countersink tool. After you dimple
>and as you're getting ready to rivet, use the countersink to take out a
>little more material. I found most rivets would seat flush after that. On
>the wing or fuse where there were lots of rivets to do, I put the
>countersink tool in my drill and used it a low speed to cover lots of
>ground.
>Albert Gardner
>RV-9A
>Trying to find necessary form for final inspection.
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Sargentclt(at)cs.com |
you might also contact www.airsportpower.com they have an o-320 for
$16600.00 that includes new cylinders, pistons etc.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | KIKIDEEMAX(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | PROSEALING THE TANKS |
AFTER REVIEWING THE ARCHIVES, SOMEONE PROSEALED , CLECOED, AND LET THE
TANK SIT FOR SOME TIME. HE LATER RIVETED AND CLAIMED NO LEAKS. I APPOLGIZE
FOR NOT ATTRIBUTING THIS PROPERLY TO THE WRITER. HAS ANYONE ELSE DONE THIS
AND WHAT WAS THEIR OUTCOME?
IS PROSEAL PART OF THE PACKAGE FROM VANS (ALREADY PREPAID)? HOW LONG
DOES IT LAST UNOPENED OR AFTER IT BEEN OPENED?
I'M PLANNING TO DO EACH TANK SEPARATLY. ANY WORDS FO WISDOM ARE
APPRECIATED.
ORDERED Q/B FUSELAGE, GAD ZOOKS IT WON'T GET HERE TIL OCT !
THANKS, DAVID MORGAN,
90079, DENVER
KIKIDEEMAX(at)AOL.COM
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | DThomas773(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: PROSEALING THE TANKS |
No. Proseal is not included in Van's kit. They do have a very good price for
it in thier catalogue.
I would not suggest letting the tanks set up with the clecos in. I think you
might have a tough time getting the clecos out and a still worse time getting
the rivets in the holes partially clogged with proseal. Believe me, Van's
instructions are well thought out and usually the best way to go.
Dennis
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Gary" <rv9er(at)3rivers.net> |
| Subject: | Re: PROSEALING THE TANKS |
Hi, David. I don't know about letting the Proseal set up before riveting. I suspect
the main thing that would happen is you'd have a hell of a time cleaning
the clecos. It is a messy job however you do it, but not really all that bad.
Van's sells the Proseal in the accessory catalog, but does not suppy it with the
kit. It is supposed to have a shelf life of I think 6 months, but keep it in
the freezer, and it will outlive you. Mine is almost 2 years old, and I still
have half a can left, and it is still fine. I am using it for sealing the
firewall, etc long after doing the tanks.
You might want to break it up into several work sessions, not just one per tank.
For example do the ribs one session, the baffle another, and seal the ends
another. Have a helper or two. One can be kept busy just cleaning clecos and
general mess. It really isn't as bad as it is made out to be. The worst part
for me was the MEK for cleaning.
Sorry to hear about your slooow Quick-build. Steve Sampson on the list had it
even worse. He waited a long time to get his in England, and it arrived badly
damaged. Long sad story.
Gary
----- Original Message -----
From: KIKIDEEMAX(at)aol.com
To: rv9-list(at)matronics.com
Sent: Thursday, January 30, 2003 10:03 PM
Subject: RV9-List: PROSEALING THE TANKS
AFTER REVIEWING THE ARCHIVES, SOMEONE PROSEALED , CLECOED, AND LET THE
TANK SIT FOR SOME TIME. HE LATER RIVETED AND CLAIMED NO LEAKS. I APPOLGIZE
FOR NOT ATTRIBUTING THIS PROPERLY TO THE WRITER. HAS ANYONE ELSE DONE THIS
AND WHAT WAS THEIR OUTCOME?
IS PROSEAL PART OF THE PACKAGE FROM VANS (ALREADY PREPAID)? HOW LONG
DOES IT LAST UNOPENED OR AFTER IT BEEN OPENED?
I'M PLANNING TO DO EACH TANK SEPARATLY. ANY WORDS FO WISDOM ARE
APPRECIATED.
ORDERED Q/B FUSELAGE, GAD ZOOKS IT WON'T GET HERE TIL OCT !
THANKS, DAVID MORGAN,
90079, DENVER
---
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: PROSEALING THE TANKS |
| From: | Joe Wiza <planejoel(at)juno.com> |
I dont think so when the proseal sets up you would need a jack hamer to
remove the clecos.
Joe RV9A awaiting emp
>
> AFTER REVIEWING THE ARCHIVES, SOMEONE PROSEALED , CLECOED,
> AND LET THE
> TANK SIT FOR SOME TIME. HE LATER RIVETED AND CLAIMED NO LEAKS. I
> APPOLGIZE
> FOR NOT ATTRIBUTING THIS PROPERLY TO THE WRITER. HAS ANYONE ELSE
> DONE THIS
> AND WHAT WAS THEIR OUTCOME?
> IS PROSEAL PART OF THE PACKAGE FROM VANS (ALREADY PREPAID)?
> HOW LONG
> DOES IT LAST UNOPENED OR AFTER IT BEEN OPENED?
> I'M PLANNING TO DO EACH TANK SEPARATLY. ANY WORDS FO WISDOM
> ARE
> APPRECIATED.
> ORDERED Q/B FUSELAGE, GAD ZOOKS IT WON'T GET HERE TIL OCT !
>
> THANKS, DAVID
> MORGAN,
> 90079, DENVER
>
> KIKIDEEMAX(at)AOL.COM
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Joe Wiza <planejoel(at)juno.com> |
Can it be bought in measurable ratios I had a time getting the right
volume ratio on my RV6A
JoeRV9A
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jerry Calvert" <rv6(at)cox.net> |
| Subject: | Re: PROSEALING THE TANKS |
I would not recommend doing it that way. During the riveting process, the
proseal oozzes under and seals the rivet. I would think also that the
riveting process may even break the seal if done after the proseal is dry.
Proseal doesn't come with the kit, but Van's carries it along with other
vendors.
On measuring it...I made a fancy aparatus to measure the weight and soon
found out that I could eyeball it once I knew what the proper proportions
looked like . Mix small amounts at a time. A good gauge for this amount has
been to mix a glob about the size of a golf ball.
As soon as the baffle is attached, put saran wrap on the spar and go ahead
and screw tank to wing and let it cure in place for a few days ...in perfect
positon!
Jerry Calvert
Edmond Ok
RV6 N296JC(res)
----- Original Message -----
From: <KIKIDEEMAX(at)aol.com>
Subject: RV9-List: PROSEALING THE TANKS
>
> AFTER REVIEWING THE ARCHIVES, SOMEONE PROSEALED , CLECOED, AND LET
THE
> TANK SIT FOR SOME TIME. HE LATER RIVETED AND CLAIMED NO LEAKS. I
APPOLGIZE
> FOR NOT ATTRIBUTING THIS PROPERLY TO THE WRITER. HAS ANYONE ELSE DONE
THIS
> AND WHAT WAS THEIR OUTCOME?
> IS PROSEAL PART OF THE PACKAGE FROM VANS (ALREADY PREPAID)? HOW
LONG
> DOES IT LAST UNOPENED OR AFTER IT BEEN OPENED?
> I'M PLANNING TO DO EACH TANK SEPARATLY. ANY WORDS FO WISDOM ARE
> APPRECIATED.
> ORDERED Q/B FUSELAGE, GAD ZOOKS IT WON'T GET HERE TIL OCT !
>
> THANKS, DAVID MORGAN,
> 90079, DENVER
>
> KIKIDEEMAX(at)AOL.COM
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: PROSEALING THE TANKS |
| From: | "Larry PERRYMAN" <larry.perryman(at)atofina.com> |
01/31/2003 03:53:04 PM,
Serialize complete at 01/31/2003 03:53:04 PM
David,
The recommended shelf life of ProSeal is 6 months. I have heard of people
keeping it longer and it working well. ProSeal is not included in the
standard package. It is available through most parts houses.
If I remember correctly, those that used clecos to let the proseal cure,
put a bit more under the rivet to guarantee a seal there also. It is not
that much of a problem either way. Just keep a jar of cleaner handy and
wipe off tools often. I did my tanks in 3-4 sessions each of about 30
minutes.
1. I riveted the ribs to the skin on the flat side of the tank.
2. Inserted the tank into the cradles
3. Rivet the curved side to the skin.
4. install and rivet the back tank baffle
Try a dry assembly of the tank with clecos first to see if you like this
procedure for putting the tanks together.
The other method of doing the tanks is to put the skin in the cradle and
then force the ribs into place. Start in the center and work outwards.
Move the cradles in or out to give you enough play to insert the ribs.
Like everything else on the plane, the second one will be easier than the
first. The job is not as bad as it is made out to be. Just wear old
clothes because it will get everywhere and does not come out. Heavy hand
lotion on all exposed skin will also help. Get rubber gloves from the
medical section at WalMart or a drug store. The gloves sold at most
hardware stores are not tough enough for a lot of the jobs on the plane.
If you think that there will be 6 months or more between the time you plan
to finish the wings and the delivery time for the quick build fuselage,
you may want to think about ordering a standard build fuselage and use the
time to build it out. Use the extra dough for instruments or interior
upgrades.
Regards,
Larry Perryman
N194DL 90288
KIKIDEEMAX(at)aol.com
01/30/2003 11:03 PM
Please respond to rv9-list
To: rv9-list(at)matronics.com
cc:
Subject: RV9-List: PROSEALING THE TANKS
AFTER REVIEWING THE ARCHIVES, SOMEONE PROSEALED , CLECOED, AND LET
THE
TANK SIT FOR SOME TIME. HE LATER RIVETED AND CLAIMED NO LEAKS. I
APPOLGIZE
FOR NOT ATTRIBUTING THIS PROPERLY TO THE WRITER. HAS ANYONE ELSE DONE
THIS
AND WHAT WAS THEIR OUTCOME?
IS PROSEAL PART OF THE PACKAGE FROM VANS (ALREADY PREPAID)? HOW
LONG
DOES IT LAST UNOPENED OR AFTER IT BEEN OPENED?
I'M PLANNING TO DO EACH TANK SEPARATLY. ANY WORDS FO WISDOM ARE
APPRECIATED.
ORDERED Q/B FUSELAGE, GAD ZOOKS IT WON'T GET HERE TIL OCT !
THANKS, DAVID MORGAN,
90079, DENVER
KIKIDEEMAX(at)AOL.COM
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Gene" <gene(at)nvaircraft.com> |
Vans also sells pro-seal in cartridges, you will need a dispenser. It is
only B-1/2 meaning it has a half hour working life.(the tube I bought was
sttill workable after two hours,) It is available in longer life
cartridges at Aircraft Spruce. I bought a postal scale for 39.00 it is very
easy to then measure out the portions. I also used a catheter syringe that I
bought at a local farm and feed store for dispenseing the stuff, if you
put a thumb or finger from your rubber glove over the plunger then you can
re-use the syringe as the tube is fairly easy to clean.
Gene
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Steve Sampson" <SSampson.SLN21(at)london.edu> |
| Subject: | Fitting the wings - Grease the face! |
Put the wings on for the first time yesterday. I had done a lot of work to
be sure the mild steel bolts were going to work, but where we were caught
out and spent all the time, was the need to grease the face of the spar
where it touches its opposite number in the fuse. Until we got that done
sliding them in was very hard.
Bolts went in easy but I don't relish getting them out! Does everyone do it
nuts forward?
Regards, Steve
#90360 N Yorks., UK
PS It nearly takes up a third of the space in my workshop!
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Steve Sampson" <SSampson.SLN21(at)london.edu> |
| Subject: | RV-9A Air Speeds |
Paul / Sam / Larry / others - you are all flying and Paul you mentioned
needing to carry some speed to get the nose up. This makes me wonder if
there is a tendancy for the aircraft to have a forward CG. I have been
working to keep 'extras' like the strobe power around the spar rather than
further aft.
I would welcome knowledge of CG position and handling characteristics. I had
thought there was a danger of banging the rear fuse on the ground rather
than not getting the nose up!
Regards, Steve.
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv9-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv9-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Paulbaird(at)aol.com
Subject: Re: RV9-List: RV-9A Air Speeds
Dick,
I have an 9A that I have been flying since July. My airspeed
indicator is in mph so if yours is in knots you will have to divide my
numbers by 1.15.
My stall speed when solo is from 42 to 44 mph depending on fuel load.
Using the traditional 1.3 times Vs would yield an approach speed of about 56
mph. I found that I needed a little more speed for elevator authority in
the
flare. I use 65mph on final and it seems to be a very comfortable speed.
I didn't have any surprises on the test flights. It flew just as I
expected it to, only better. I did some "crow hops" before the first
flight.
I got it about 2 ft off the ground and found I need a tad of aileron trim.
After that it was balanced and as stable as could be. I did about a half a
dozen crow hops and then I took off. I didn't use the flaps on the first
couple of flights. I added some speed of course on final.
Good Luck!
Paul Baird
90355
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Paulbaird(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: RV-9A Air Speeds |
Steve,
My weight and balance came out almost identical to Van's prototype.
It is impossible for me (at 165 lbs) to load it out of c.g. Unless of
course I exceeded the baggage compartment limit of 100 lbs or if I loaded the
airplane over gross weight. The only way for my airplane to be out of
forward c.g. is to have a 100 lb pilot almost out of fuel.
The reason I go above 1.3 vs on final isn't because the nose won't
come up in the flare. It just feels very mushy. It is much more comfortable
to approach at 60-65 mph. I always turn off at the first taxiway at my local
airport which is 800 ft from the approach end of the runway.
I hope that clarifies what I was saying. Good Luck!
Paul
90355
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Steve Sampson" <SSampson.SLN21(at)london.edu> |
Daft question which I ought to know the answer to!
On the rare occasion in the past when I drill a large hole I have
occasionally seen a tendancy for it to be slightly triangular. Now I have
to drill the 5/16th holes for the rear spar. Before I do I want to make sure
this is not going to hapeen. I did a test piece today and sure enough iit
was slightly out of true. What is going on please?
Thanks guys! Steve.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Steve Sampson" <SSampson.SLN21(at)london.edu> |
| Subject: | RV-9A Air Speeds |
Paul thanks for that. I am used to 'mushy' I have a 950' one way strip. Are
you CS or FP? Much braking?
On VANS runway Gus needed about 300' but it's a good surface for braking.
Steve.
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv9-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv9-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Paulbaird(at)aol.com
Subject: Re: RV9-List: RV-9A Air Speeds
Steve,
My weight and balance came out almost identical to Van's prototype.
It is impossible for me (at 165 lbs) to load it out of c.g. Unless of
course I exceeded the baggage compartment limit of 100 lbs or if I loaded
the
airplane over gross weight. The only way for my airplane to be out of
forward c.g. is to have a 100 lb pilot almost out of fuel.
The reason I go above 1.3 vs on final isn't because the nose won't
come up in the flare. It just feels very mushy. It is much more
comfortable
to approach at 60-65 mph. I always turn off at the first taxiway at my
local
airport which is 800 ft from the approach end of the runway.
I hope that clarifies what I was saying. Good Luck!
Paul
90355
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Rob W M Shipley" <Rob(at)RobsGlass.com> |
For those anticipating the joys which only Proseal can offer the following points
may provide some relief of anxiety.
1) The shelf life is more than adequate. I live in the San Diego area and we
get nice warm weather. My can of Proseal sat in the garage for nearly a year
after it had been opened before I got round to the second tank. It was fine.
2) Clecoing first. I have heard that Boeing uses this approach with tanks and
that the Clecos can be removed after the initial hardening. It then rubs off
the clecos fairly easily. I HAVE NOT USED THIS METHOD NOR DO I SEE ANY NEED
FOR IT.
3) Don't sweat the measuring process too much. Shortly before I began my tanks
I saw an email from a builder who had inadvertantly used half the usual hardener.
The advice from the list was not to worry it would set anyway. Just
take a little longer. I was a little sceptical of this so I made my own test.
For a range of double the ratio to half the ratio the only thing that changes
is the cure time. So don't worry. I eyeballed the amounts for all my mixing
and ended up running out of both at the same time!
4) Unless you are heavy handed you will get both tanks and all the other minor
bits out of the one can.
5) Use popsicle sticks to butter the Proseal onto the flanges and trowel the
exudate. Clean up with MEK.
Good luck. It's not as bad as people say. Really!
Rob
Rob W M Shipley
RV9A N919RV Fuselage.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Miller Robert <rmiller3(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | Secure bolts and screws |
New, (to me anyway), product from Nylok (www.nylok.com) - mentioned in 2/03 issue
of Sport Aviation, pg. 115.
Called Nylok True Blue.
This would seem to offer benefits in securing bolts and screws against loosening
over time due to vibration.
Looks like a good thing.
Robert Miller
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Cy Galley" <cgalley(at)qcbc.org> |
The very best way is to drill undersize and ream to final size.
Cy Galley, TC - Chair, Emergency Aircraft Repair, Oshkosh
Editor, EAA Safety Programs
cgalley(at)qcbc.org or experimenter(at)eaa.org
Always looking for articles for the Experimenter
----- Original Message -----
From: "Steve Sampson" <SSampson.SLN21(at)london.edu>
Subject: RV9-List: Drilling
>
> Daft question which I ought to know the answer to!
>
> On the rare occasion in the past when I drill a large hole I have
> occasionally seen a tendancy for it to be slightly triangular. Now I have
> to drill the 5/16th holes for the rear spar. Before I do I want to make
sure
> this is not going to hapeen. I did a test piece today and sure enough iit
> was slightly out of true. What is going on please?
>
> Thanks guys! Steve.
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Richard E. Tasker" <retasker(at)optonline.net> |
When drilling with a large bit there is a significant tendency for the
bit to make triangular holes if either the bit is not in a stationary
drill press or the part is not clamped rigidly - as you have discovered.
As Cy says, the best way is to drill undersize and ream to size.
However, if you do not have a complete set of reamers, (which I don't),
I have found that a unibit drills very clean perfectly round holes (as
long as the part you are drilling is no thicker than the unibit steps -
which seems to be the case with everything I have drilled so far). Get
the one that goes from 1/4" to 3/4" in 1/16" steps. This will do just
about anything you need to drill on an RV. As a side benefit if you
drill a tiny bit deeper so the next size step just barely starts to
drill you get a pre-chamfered hole for free!
It works best in a drill press, but also works just fine in a handheld
drill.
Dick Tasker, 90573
Working on the tanks
Steve Sampson wrote:
>
>Daft question which I ought to know the answer to!
>
>On the rare occasion in the past when I drill a large hole I have
>occasionally seen a tendancy for it to be slightly triangular. Now I have
>to drill the 5/16th holes for the rear spar. Before I do I want to make sure
>this is not going to hapeen. I did a test piece today and sure enough iit
>was slightly out of true. What is going on please?
>
>Thanks guys! Steve.
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Cy Galley" <cgalley(at)qcbc.org> |
You can buy "chucking reamers" for less about $4 each from Enco
1-800-873-3626 http://www.use-enco.com/
Their foreign made reamers work very well for limited use. You can get O/S
and U/S so check your bolts with a micrometer before ordering.
You can also get a set of 4 adjustable for less than $20
Cy Galley, TC - Chair, Emergency Aircraft Repair, Oshkosh
Editor, EAA Safety Programs
cgalley(at)qcbc.org or experimenter(at)eaa.org
Always looking for articles for the Experimenter
----- Original Message -----
From: "Richard E. Tasker" <retasker(at)optonline.net>
Subject: Re: RV9-List: Drilling
>
> When drilling with a large bit there is a significant tendency for the
> bit to make triangular holes if either the bit is not in a stationary
> drill press or the part is not clamped rigidly - as you have discovered.
> As Cy says, the best way is to drill undersize and ream to size.
>
> However, if you do not have a complete set of reamers, (which I don't),
> I have found that a unibit drills very clean perfectly round holes (as
> long as the part you are drilling is no thicker than the unibit steps -
> which seems to be the case with everything I have drilled so far). Get
> the one that goes from 1/4" to 3/4" in 1/16" steps. This will do just
> about anything you need to drill on an RV. As a side benefit if you
> drill a tiny bit deeper so the next size step just barely starts to
> drill you get a pre-chamfered hole for free!
>
> It works best in a drill press, but also works just fine in a handheld
> drill.
>
> Dick Tasker, 90573
> Working on the tanks
>
> Steve Sampson wrote:
>
> >
> >Daft question which I ought to know the answer to!
> >
> >On the rare occasion in the past when I drill a large hole I have
> >occasionally seen a tendancy for it to be slightly triangular. Now I
have
> >to drill the 5/16th holes for the rear spar. Before I do I want to make
sure
> >this is not going to hapeen. I did a test piece today and sure enough iit
> >was slightly out of true. What is going on please?
> >
> >Thanks guys! Steve.
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Larry Perryman" <larry-perryman(at)txucom.net> |
Steve,
Drill a pilot hole first and then follow up with the larger bit. Good SHARP
bits work best. If in doubt, go buy a new one of that size. For me, slow
drill speeds worked best.
On the spar bolts, only those that come behind the gear leg mount (if you
are tri gear) come from the back. The rest go front to back. If you are tail
wheel, then all go front to back..
CG - don't worry about it. If you are like most I have heard about, you
will find it very hard to get it out of CG.
Pattern speeds - about 85-90 knots on downwind,
About 78 knots on base, about 60 knots on final. You will find it flies
very similar (at least in my view) to a Cherokee.
I have been holding it down on takeoff until I saw about 65 knots. It will
fly a long time before that.
I had to take off the other day with my Quinti prop at full coarse. I was
only able to make about 3800 rpm instead of my normal 5000 rpm but the plane
flew like my old Beechcraft Sundowner 180.
Just make sure when the time comes to take the bird into the air that YOU
are ready to fly.
Good luck.
Regards
Larry Perryman
----- Original Message -----
From: "Steve Sampson" <SSampson.SLN21(at)london.edu>
Subject: RV9-List: Drilling
|
| Daft question which I ought to know the answer to!
|
| On the rare occasion in the past when I drill a large hole I have
| occasionally seen a tendancy for it to be slightly triangular. Now I have
| to drill the 5/16th holes for the rear spar. Before I do I want to make
sure
| this is not going to hapeen. I did a test piece today and sure enough iit
| was slightly out of true. What is going on please?
|
| Thanks guys! Steve.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Gary" <rv9er(at)3rivers.net> |
Steve.....if you want the holes to be round and centered where they started, start
small and use progressivelly larger drills in small increments.
Gary
On the rare occasion in the past when I drill a large hole I have
occasionally seen a tendancy for it to be slightly triangular. Now I have
to drill the 5/16th holes for the rear spar. Before I do I want to make sure
this is not going to hapeen. I did a test piece today and sure enough iit
was slightly out of true. What is going on please?
Thanks guys! Steve.
---
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Merems" <merems(at)cox.net> |
Gary,
The only way to get a truly round hole is to ream the hole when finished.
This triangular hole condition is most noticeable in thin materials. The
best way to minimize this condition is to pilot drill and enlarge.
Paul
----- Original Message -----
From: "Gary" <rv9er(at)3rivers.net>
Subject: Re: RV9-List: Drilling
>
> Steve.....if you want the holes to be round and centered where they
started, start small and use progressivelly larger drills in small
increments.
>
> Gary
>
> On the rare occasion in the past when I drill a large hole I have
> occasionally seen a tendancy for it to be slightly triangular. Now I have
> to drill the 5/16th holes for the rear spar. Before I do I want to make
sure
> this is not going to hapeen. I did a test piece today and sure enough iit
> was slightly out of true. What is going on please?
>
> Thanks guys! Steve.
>
>
> ---
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Boyd Butler" <linbb(at)worldnet.att.net> |
In something like the rear or front spar one should use a reamer for good fit
not a drill as no matter what size the hole it will not be round. Ask a machinist
and he will tell you for sure.
Boyd Butler
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Curt Hoffman" <choffman9(at)cinci.rr.com> |
| Subject: | Flap installation |
I just did something that I would like some perspective one.
On the -9 there are three flap brackets. Instructions call for you to string the
three brackets to make sure they are in alignment, which I did, but apparently
not perfect.
When I went to install the flaps, now that all the brackets are fully riveted on,
the center bracket was a smidgeon off. I could almost get the bolt through
the bushing, but would have to put a fair amount of pressure on the flap in the
center to get it in. That flap spar doesn't move easily.
I chose to slightly ream out the bushing to better align it with the bracket holes
and allow the bolt to go through easily. The holes in the center bracket on
the flap are untouched but the bushing is slightly oversize now. Both the inboard
and outboard brackets and bushings were untouched. The flap swings freely.
I'm hoping this is an ok solution given the slightly shorter flaps on the -7 only
run inboard and outboard brackets and the hole was only slightly enlarged.
The alternatives really looked difficult.
Curt Hoffman
RV-9A wings (almost) done working on tail
1968 Mustang 302 convertible
Piper Cherokee N5320W
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Gary" <rv9er(at)3rivers.net> |
Paul,
Lots of holes in thin material in an RV....... I don't know of anyone who reams
very many of them. I reamed the tip-up hinge holes, and a few others that act
as pivots or critical areas, but not in thin material. For big holes in thin
stuff, I use a Unibit, as was previously mentioned by others on the list.
Reaming is sort of impractical in many instances......Which holes did you ream?
Gary
----- Original Message -----
From: Merems
To: rv9-list(at)matronics.com
Sent: Sunday, February 02, 2003 8:50 AM
Subject: Re: RV9-List: Drilling
Gary,
The only way to get a truly round hole is to ream the hole when finished.
This triangular hole condition is most noticeable in thin materials. The
best way to minimize this condition is to pilot drill and enlarge.
Paul
---
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jim Hosie" <jhosie4(at)attbi.com> |
Steve,
Try slowing your drill speed down.
The larger the drill bit the slower the speed.
In the instruction binder there is a section on drilling and speeds.
Jim Hosie
N-9SU
Wings
----- Original Message -----
From: "Steve Sampson" <SSampson.SLN21(at)london.edu>
Subject: RV9-List: Drilling
>
> Daft question which I ought to know the answer to!
>
> On the rare occasion in the past when I drill a large hole I have
> occasionally seen a tendancy for it to be slightly triangular. Now I have
> to drill the 5/16th holes for the rear spar. Before I do I want to make
sure
> this is not going to hapeen. I did a test piece today and sure enough iit
> was slightly out of true. What is going on please?
>
> Thanks guys! Steve.
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Gary Newsted" <fcs(at)jlc.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Flap installation |
Hate to say it, but the alternatives, no matter how hard they look, would have
been better.
I take it you've already riveted your bottom skins on? Control surface
bearings are not
the place to goof up.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Steve Sampson" <SSampson.SLN21(at)london.edu> |
Jim et al - thanks for that. Slower drilling seems to help.
No section in my manual re drilling. Perhaps I have an early edition. I
started in early '01.
The hole is too deep in the rear spar attachment for the unibit. You need to
go through 4 thick layers!
Thanks, Steve.
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv9-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv9-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Jim Hosie
Subject: Re: RV9-List: Drilling
Steve,
Try slowing your drill speed down.
The larger the drill bit the slower the speed.
In the instruction binder there is a section on drilling and speeds.
Jim Hosie
N-9SU
Wings
----- Original Message -----
From: "Steve Sampson" <SSampson.SLN21(at)london.edu>
Subject: RV9-List: Drilling
>
> Daft question which I ought to know the answer to!
>
> On the rare occasion in the past when I drill a large hole I have
> occasionally seen a tendancy for it to be slightly triangular. Now I have
> to drill the 5/16th holes for the rear spar. Before I do I want to make
sure
> this is not going to hapeen. I did a test piece today and sure enough iit
> was slightly out of true. What is going on please?
>
> Thanks guys! Steve.
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Curt Hoffman" <choffman9(at)cinci.rr.com> |
| Subject: | Re: [RV-9A] Flap installation |
Well it's done. Vans recommended remounting the bracket and so that is what
I am doing. I removed the flap and the drilling of the bushing I tried
removed maybe 1/64" of the flange of the bushing. I'm a little surprised
that the bolt was so hard to get in with that little bit of misalignment but
it was.
Took about 45 minutes per side to remove all the rivets and clean everything
up for reinstallation. Less time actually then I spent stewing about it. (I
had the exact same misalignment on both flaps indicating a very repeatable
but incorrect technique used for alignment of the center bracket.
In hindsight I would recommend not installing that center bracket until you
mount the flap and then install it where it lands with the bracket held to
the flap. This is essentially what I will be doing now. A little tougher now
that my top skins are riveted on but not remarkably so. At least I didn't
have to remove the flap gap seal. I was very easily able to leave the angle
bracket mounted to the rear spar.
Now I will reinstall the bracket and put a doubler on the rib side to make
up for any enlargement of the holes in the ribs by moving the bracket. Given
the very small misalignment I suspect the holes won't get much bigger but
it's easy to do and I'm not going to remove this stuff again. Plus I was
wondering what I was going to do with some of the extra aluminum I have
laying around.
Curt Hoffman
RV-9A wings and tail
1968 Mustang 302 convertible
Piper Cherokee N5320W
----- Original Message -----
From: <johncclarkva(at)cs.com>
Subject: Re: [RV-9A] Flap installation
> Curt, just how far out of alignment is your center hinge? 1/2 hole dia or
less? A slight bit of misalignment is not a problem, expecially if it
causes the flap to bend in plane (that is bend as the wing bends) May be a
problem if is causes the center hinge to move fore or aft, but I would bet
not. Remember that the wing will flex slightly while in flight and that may
have the tendency to relieve the problem, or could be further out. I would
wait for Van's answer. Flutter is not an issue if you only oversized the
bushing. If it is very far out, the flap will flex each cycle (probably not
much of an issue). I would rather go with a slight misalignment that
remanufacturer the flap brackets, etc. Do you feel any binding when you
cycle the flaps by hand? John.
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Merems" <merems(at)cox.net> |
Gary,
Indeed reaming is impractical and unnecessary for rivet holes and most bolt
holes. Back in the good old days when RV spars were built by the builder
(Plans built RV-4) the close tolerance holes were reamed for size. In
general I do not ream my bolt holes, but it will yield the best results and
very good internal surface finish. Most of the standard AN bolts have a
loose tolerance on size so reaming isn't going to make a big difference in
terms of fit. I will ream any holes that I can in control parts
(bellcranks, control sticks, landing gear legs, brake attach. etc). Most of
the powder painted steel parts supplied with the empennage need to have the
3/16" holes opened up because of paint buildup. I "back" reamed these to
produce a perfect hole. One method I like to use a what I call "back"
reaming. Basically if you are trying to ream a clevis end on a control
stick, as an example, if you try to drill/ream the traditional way you may
elongate the first hole as you are drilling/reaming the second (happened on
my RV-4 tail wheel yoke-had to replace it). If you drill a hole that is
undersized by about .005" and insert the shank end of the reamer through the
holes and attach the drill to the shank you can then "back" ream the holes
by powering up the drill and pulling the reamer through the holes. It works
very well and is almost foul proof. So since I have the reamers in my tool
collection, it only takes a few seconds to use them when it is practical.
Having a 3/16" and 1/4" reamer ($5 each) in you tool box is a good thing.
I used to build Navy fighters for Grumman Aerospace Corp. Drilling good
holes in very expensive aircraft parts Government owned) was taken very
seriously there. Drilling holes in my RV parts is even more expensive to me
and I have extended some of what I have learned into the construction of my
RV-4 and now RV-7A. At a point in time when you are drilling your wing rear
spar attach to the fuselage, you may want to get the best hole you can. If
it gets elongated or isn't quite right, you may not be able to safely
enlarge it and then you are in for some major repairs (just an example).
I hope this helps
Paul
----- Original Message -----
From: "Gary" <rv9er(at)3rivers.net>
Subject: Re: RV9-List: Drilling
>
> Paul,
>
> Lots of holes in thin material in an RV....... I don't know of anyone who
reams very many of them. I reamed the tip-up hinge holes, and a few others
that act as pivots or critical areas, but not in thin material. For big
holes in thin stuff, I use a Unibit, as was previously mentioned by others
on the list.
>
> Reaming is sort of impractical in many instances......Which holes did you
ream?
>
> Gary
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: Merems
> To: rv9-list(at)matronics.com
> Sent: Sunday, February 02, 2003 8:50 AM
> Subject: Re: RV9-List: Drilling
>
>
> Gary,
>
> The only way to get a truly round hole is to ream the hole when
finished.
> This triangular hole condition is most noticeable in thin materials.
The
> best way to minimize this condition is to pilot drill and enlarge.
>
> Paul
>
>
> ---
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | DThomas773(at)aol.com |
I find this discussion of reaming interesting because I have none of these
tools in my box and don't know how to use them. The only reamers I've seen
for sale are in the Cleveland catologue and called straight flute reamers.
How do they work? It would seem if the hole is large enough for the tool to
be inserted it would be as large as it needs to be. What good is turning a
cutter inside a hole that is already full size? If it isn't full size, how do
you get the tool in it? I'm looking at the wing attach bolts and tried test
fitting them in the center section. They are really tight! I sprayed them
with WD-40 and they go in but really need coaxing. Just pushing them in with
my fingers tends to remove some of the cadmium plating. I would appreciate
any general information anyone would care to share with me.
Dennis Thomas 90164
9-taildragger, tip up
starting fuselage
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Merems" <merems(at)cox.net> |
I have seen posting from builders about there mega compressors and their air drills.
Everyone knows that if your really are going to be an airplane builder
you must use air drills. Just about every major aircraft company uses air drills,
so they must be the right choice.
Well here is some real food for thought if you haven't made the plunge yet. I
image most builders build there RV's in their garage. Most of these garages maybe
attached to their homes and many are in a neighborhoods. I used electric
drills on my RV-4 and I thought I would graduate up to the big leagues with an
air drill on my RV-7 project. I have been eyeing that big 60 gallon upright
220 Volt Husky compressor at Home Depot for years. My time had come, I was going
to load that baby in the back of my pickup and join the few, the proud the,
"real" builders. Then I saw it, on sale, price reduced, a CH air drill at
Home Depot. I thought to my self, I can buy it an see if it has a good "teasing"
throttle on it. This is important because without slow speed control of the
drill, it will very hard to use. So I bought it and took it home and hooked
it up to my 20 gal. 110 volt compressor I have had for 20 years. I wanted to
see how loud the drill was and how many holes I could drill until the compressor
would startup. I got about 5 holes drilled and the compressor chimed in.
I had the pressure set to 65-70 psi. Not only was the whine of the air drill
motor and the compressor cranking in to stay up with every 5 holes annoying
to my ears, but the spitting of the light oil from the air drill onto my hands
and onto the parts I was drilling made matters intolerable. Seeing that I could
barely tolerate the noise in the shop, my neighbors would have to endure some
of the collateral noise coming from my shop. Considering there are over 10,000
rivets in an RV, my compressor would mostly be running continuously when
I would be drilling and a few pints of oil (exaggerated) would be misting on
my parts. If I bought the 60 gallon compressor it wouldn't run as much, but still
quiet a bit.
After considering the noise (to me and my neighbors-which might just be your wife
in the room next to the garage), the oily mess, the cost of the Mega compressor,
I decided the electric drill worked before and it will work again. I researched
what was available on the market and was disappointed by the weight of
many of the electric drills out there. If you buy the cheep electric drills,
they won't last through the project. I settled on a Makita 6410 3/8 VSR 2200
RPM. It has a low noise rating and is 1/2 lbs or so lighter then any other
"quality" drill on the market. I bought it for $32.00 delivered (Tool King).
Van talks about cutting speeds of 2000-3000 rpms to drill aluminum. Since most
of the new RV kits are pre-punched, you are not drilling out a lot of material.
In fact, I find that I run my drill rather slowly most of the time. When
I microstop machine countersink is when I run my drill at full bore.
Food for thought
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Merems" <merems(at)cox.net> |
As you mentioned most if not all reamers are straight fluted. The main
difference between a drill and a reamer is that drills have a angled cutting
edge (on the tip) and a spiral twist to remove the material and a reamer
cuts on sides of the reamer and has several cutting edges. A reamer is also
more precisely ground. Typically a reamer might be 4" long with 2" long
cutting edges. The remaining shank will be about .030" smaller in diameter
then the cutting diameter. Sometimes you can insert a reamer in a hole that
is already reamed to size and turn it in a drill and move it in and out of
the hole (never actually removing it completely from the hole) to clean up
the hole to get a little more clearance. Reamers are only design to remove
a very small amount of material. Reamers wear so it maybe possible that
when some of the parts were originally reamed they were reamed with a
slightly worn reamer and produced a slightly undersized hole.
I hope this helps,
----- Original Message -----
From: <DThomas773(at)aol.com>
Subject: Re: RV9-List: Drilling
>
> I find this discussion of reaming interesting because I have none of these
> tools in my box and don't know how to use them. The only reamers I've
seen
> for sale are in the Cleveland catologue and called straight flute reamers.
> How do they work? It would seem if the hole is large enough for the tool
to
> be inserted it would be as large as it needs to be. What good is turning
a
> cutter inside a hole that is already full size? If it isn't full size, how
do
> you get the tool in it? I'm looking at the wing attach bolts and tried
test
> fitting them in the center section. They are really tight! I sprayed them
> with WD-40 and they go in but really need coaxing. Just pushing them in
with
> my fingers tends to remove some of the cadmium plating. I would appreciate
> any general information anyone would care to share with me.
>
> Dennis Thomas 90164
> 9-taildragger, tip up
> starting fuselage
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Andy Karmy" <andy(at)karmy.com> |
Those are the exact reamers that I have. The ones from Cleveland. Just your basic
straight fluted reamers.
As to how to use them. The key is that the nose end of the reamer is tapered just
enough and has the flutes sharpened so that you simply drill one size down
from what you are trying to ream, then press it into the hole where the nose bites
in and the reamer goes in nice as can be.
I just did this for my rear spar attach holes. I started with #30, then 1/4", then
just under the 5/16" final hole, then reamed to 5/16. Came out as perfect
as you please. Nice and round.
- Andy Karmy
RV9A Seattle WA - WINGS ARE ON!
http://www.karmy.com/rv9a
---------- Original Message ----------------------------------
From: DThomas773(at)aol.com
Date: Mon, 3 Feb 2003 21:27:49 EST
>
>I find this discussion of reaming interesting because I have none of these
>tools in my box and don't know how to use them. The only reamers I've seen
>for sale are in the Cleveland catologue and called straight flute reamers.
>How do they work? It would seem if the hole is large enough for the tool to
>be inserted it would be as large as it needs to be. What good is turning a
>cutter inside a hole that is already full size? If it isn't full size, how do
>you get the tool in it? I'm looking at the wing attach bolts and tried test
>fitting them in the center section. They are really tight! I sprayed them
>with WD-40 and they go in but really need coaxing. Just pushing them in with
>my fingers tends to remove some of the cadmium plating. I would appreciate
>any general information anyone would care to share with me.
>
>Dennis Thomas 90164
>9-taildragger, tip up
>starting fuselage
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Albert Gardner" <albert.gardner(at)worldnet.att.net> |
I (and many other) clekoed the tank together, let the proseal set up for 2
or 3 days and then put rivets in. It's less messy, I think the rivets are
set better because the bucking bar isn't sliding around, and a lot easier.
You put a small dab of proseal in the hole when you set the rivet to seal
it. The clekoes are fairly easy to clean, you pull most of the cured stuff
off and I chucked up a rotary wire brush in my drill press to clean off the
remainder. After proseal cures it is quite rubbery. No leaks, but either
method seems to work quite well for others.
Albert Gardner
N872RV
Airworthiness Inspection scheduled for this coming Sat.!
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Albert Gardner" <albert.gardner(at)worldnet.att.net> |
On some occasions you can take the Unibit as far as it will go-then use a
grinder to take the hole the rest of the way matching what the Unibit has
removed..
Albert Gardner
----- Original Message -----
From: "Steve Sampson" <SSampson.SLN21(at)london.edu>
>
> The hole is too deep in the rear spar attachment for the unibit. You need
to
> go through 4 thick layers!
>
> Thanks, Steve.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Gary" <rv9er(at)3rivers.net> |
Dennis........don't ream those main spar holes! While what the others have said
about reaming is good information, you don't want to loosten those holes that
mount the front wing spar.
Try different bolts in a given hole. There is some variation in the diameter of
the bolts. I juggled mine around to find the smaller bolts for the tighter
holes. If you can get them in with some careful tapping with a wood mallet, even
if it marks the plating a little, leave it at that.
As Andy and others said, use a reamer on the rear spar hole that you drill. The
only thing on the main spar assembly that I would clean or enlarge the holes
on would be the powder coated steel gear webs.
Gary
I'm looking at the wing attach bolts and tried
test
> fitting them in the center section. They are really tight! I sprayed them
> with WD-40 and they go in but really need coaxing. Just pushing them in
with
> my fingers tends to remove some of the cadmium plating. I would appreciate
> any general information anyone would care to share with me.
>
> Dennis Thomas 90164
> 9-taildragger, tip up
> starting fuselage
---
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Merems" <merems(at)cox.net> |
| Subject: | Quiet drills-revenge of the air drill |
Gents,
My purpose for writing about air drill vs electric drills was to help others out
who maybe deciding on which path to take. The responses to this email have
been very interesting. As I mentioned in the email, all aerospace companies us
air drills so that must be the best, right? Not always. Why do they use them.
I have heard several possibilities. Many of them make sense. But lets put
our thinking caps on and look back when they first started building metal airplanes.
I don't know the exact date, but maybe 1915 or so. Back then most
powered shop tools were driven by overhead belts and a central motor sources.
The electric hand drill wasn't even invented back then.
"In the early 1900's the electric drill weighed upwards of 50 pounds, required
two people to operate it and a third to control the power source. But in 1917,
on a kitchen table, S. Duncan Black and Alonzo B. Decker, Sr. conceived the first
portable drill. "
The only way to get a hand power tool in someone's hands on the assembly line was
to use air. It was easy to plumb through the shop, and was safe. You could
get a lot of power out of a very small and lightweight package, easy to maintain
and you could easily control the speed. That's how it all started. And
if you haven't figured it out, metal aircraft production hasn't changed very much
over the last 80 or so years. This maybe why they still use them. Electric
drills have come along way since the 1960's. I remember my father's Porter-Cable.
All metal construction single speed, weighed 4 to 5 pounds. With in
the use of plastics, lightweight alloys and variable speed control, electric drills
can be just as good as their air powered counterparts.
For those who are interested in keeping the noise levels down, not needing a "mega"
compressor, look into electric (corded) drills. Makita makes several, but
I chose the #6410 for the following reasons, 2.6# (lightest weight of all professional
drills from all the brands), 2200 rpm, and variable speed. I haven't
been disappointed yet. I burned up two 2500 rpm B&D (non-professional series)
drills building my RV-4. Based on my experiences with other Makita products,
I believe the Makita will make it through my RV-7.
I hope this helps others.
Paul
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Curt Hoffman" <choffman9(at)cinci.rr.com> |
| Subject: | Aileron lock nut |
The inboard aileron bracket has a screw that secures the bracket to the control
tube.The print calls for this screw to be secured with a MS21083-N3 lock nut.
It appears on the print to be a thinner version of an AN365-1032. None of these
21083 nuts came in the kit. I checked all the inventory sheets and there is
no mention of this nut.
Am I the only one to not get these or did Vans substitute the thicker nuts and
not change the print. I wrote to Vans but thought I'd check the list as well.
As an aside, what did most people do to shorten this screw as called for. Just
hack saw it off and clean up the end?
Curt Hoffman
RV-9A wings almost done- working on tail
1968 Mustang 302 convertible
Piper Cherokee N5320W
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Larry Perryman" <larry-perryman(at)txucom.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Quiet drills-revenge of the air drill |
I just have to jump in on this topic. I also used an electric cordless drill
for most of the drilling on my plane. I started off with an air drill and
like everyone else, the compressor had a hard time keeping up. I found a
Royobi drill on sale at Home Depot for $27.99 It was a two speed drill and
I still grab it when I need to do something even though the battery is about
dead.
If I had it to do over again, I would skip the air drill and buy two or
three ccordless drills and a couple of cordless screwdrivers. Here is a plug
for Avery's 1/4 hex shaft 1/4x24 adaptor. It fits into the screwdriver blade
socket of the cordless screwdriver. With the three flute reamer, it makes
the best deburring tool arround. It will also accept all the countersink
bits, I have worn out my Balck & Decker screwdriver on this project.
One thing that I have noticed since drilling slower, the bits seem to last a
lot longer.
Regards
Larry Perryman
N194DL Flying
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Miller Robert <rmiller3(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Quiet drills-revenge of the air drill |
Larry Perryman wrote:
> One thing that I have noticed since drilling slower, the bits seem to last a
> lot longer.
Are the drilled holes as clean?
Robert
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Quiet drills-revenge of the air drill |
| From: | "Larry PERRYMAN" <larry.perryman(at)atofina.com> |
02/05/2003 03:34:21 PM,
Serialize complete at 02/05/2003 03:34:21 PM
Yes,
I can not tell the difference in holes drilled by either drill.
Regards,
Larry Perryman
Miller Robert
02/05/2003 07:42 AM
Please respond to rv9-list
To: rv9-list(at)matronics.com
cc:
Subject: Re: RV9-List: Quiet drills-revenge of the air drill
Larry Perryman wrote:
> One thing that I have noticed since drilling slower, the bits seem to
last a
> lot longer.
Are the drilled holes as clean?
Robert
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Bruce Cruikshank" <cruikshank(at)attbi.com> |
A picture of my favorite drill can be seen at http://www.woodturnerscatalog.com/template/235-8000.html
The one I use is an older model with a hard plastic case.
Milwakee makes one that looks the same but only goes to 1250 RPM.
Its expensive, but a quality tool.
Found on first page of a Google search. Further search may get a better price.
Bruce
90364 fuse
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Gary Newsted" <fcs(at)jlc.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Quiet drills-revenge of the air drill |
Well somebody needs to speak out on behalf of the poor, unappreciated, super
compressors of the world. So I guess its up to me to either step forward or
stomp on my air hose. A "real" aircraft mechanic uses all sorts of drills and
absolutely must be within one arms reach of at least three models at any given
time. Furthermore, he/she must have an equal number of right-angle and flexible
attachments with chucks of the micro and macro variety, none of those sissy
chuckless types please. Well OK, but only for deburring in your pocket sized
electric screwdriver-drill. As for the compressor, just try to blow away all
those shavings with the lame breeze produced by your Black and Decker. NOT.
A
compressor serves so many useful purposes that I have on numerous occasions
stated my firm belief that ALL men, sorry ladies, should be provided with a
compressor of at least 60 gallons as soon as they are weaned. My faithful
compressor, a pearl blue, two-stage, 8hp upright, 220, stands at the ready with
110psi of pure clean oiless air (yes they make oil separators), 24 x 7 x 364
1/4. It's been wired into my house breaker panel for the last twenty years and
ain't even got no stinkin' on/off switch. I use it for drilling, riveting,
sanding, cutting, grinding, sandblasting, vacuming, dusting, sweeping the
driveway, washing the cars, inflating stuff, starting the siphon, clearing ice,
drying off the Harley's, painting, polishing, sweeping the floors, chasing away
stray animals, and other stuff that's none of yer darn business; sheeeit, I can
even comb the crumbs from my beard with it. Try that with a stinkin cordless
drill! Compressor fans stand united! Noise? NOISE? It's music to my ears
and I get chills down the neckbone whenever I approach a shop with a singing
compressor! I can ignore those bothersome phone calls, don't have to listen to
nagging or afternoon soaps. My baby is mounted on rubber isolation cushions so
the house doesn't quiver and she won't walk around. As for oil spray from the
drill, I don't oil my tools and never have. Once in a great while one will
lock up and I toss it in the junk drawer. Tools are expendable, my compressor
is not. I hope to be burried by a pneumatic backhoe!
So there! Back to riveting... G
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Quiet drills-revenge of the air drill |
| From: | "Streiker, Stephen D (Steve), WHLSL" <streiker(at)att.com> |
Well said.
Stephen D. Streiker
Global Account Manager - AT&T Service Provider Markets
32 Avenue of the Americas - W616 - New York, NY 10013
Phone: 212-387-5355 Fax: 360-397-7362 Mobile: 917-865-9875
-----Original Message-----
From: Gary Newsted [mailto:fcs(at)jlc.net]
Subject: Re: RV9-List: Quiet drills-revenge of the air drill
Well somebody needs to speak out on behalf of the poor, unappreciated, super
compressors of the world. So I guess its up to me to either step forward or
stomp on my air hose. A "real" aircraft mechanic uses all sorts of drills and
absolutely must be within one arms reach of at least three models at any given
time. Furthermore, he/she must have an equal number of right-angle and flexible
attachments with chucks of the micro and macro variety, none of those sissy
chuckless types please. Well OK, but only for deburring in your pocket sized
electric screwdriver-drill. As for the compressor, just try to blow away all
those shavings with the lame breeze produced by your Black and Decker. NOT.
A
compressor serves so many useful purposes that I have on numerous occasions
stated my firm belief that ALL men, sorry ladies, should be provided with a
compressor of at least 60 gallons as soon as they are weaned. My faithful
compressor, a pearl blue, two-stage, 8hp upright, 220, stands at the ready with
110psi of pure clean oiless air (yes they make oil separators), 24 x 7 x 364
1/4. It's been wired into my house breaker panel for the last twenty years and
ain't even got no stinkin' on/off switch. I use it for drilling, riveting,
sanding, cutting, grinding, sandblasting, vacuming, dusting, sweeping the
driveway, washing the cars, inflating stuff, starting the siphon, clearing ice,
drying off the Harley's, painting, polishing, sweeping the floors, chasing away
stray animals, and other stuff that's none of yer darn business; sheeeit, I can
even comb the crumbs from my beard with it. Try that with a stinkin cordless
drill! Compressor fans stand united! Noise? NOISE? It's music to my ears
and I get chills down the neckbone whenever I approach a shop with a singing
compressor! I can ignore those bothersome phone calls, don't have to listen to
nagging or afternoon soaps. My baby is mounted on rubber isolation cushions so
the house doesn't quiver and she won't walk around. As for oil spray from the
drill, I don't oil my tools and never have. Once in a great while one will
lock up and I toss it in the junk drawer. Tools are expendable, my compressor
is not. I hope to be burried by a pneumatic backhoe!
So there! Back to riveting... G
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Merems" <merems(at)cox.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Quiet drills-revenge of the air drill |
Gary,
Thanks for your thoughts. I knew I would spark some interesting responses
to my email. Yours ranks up there with the best. Even though I use an
electric drill (and darn proud of it) I do see many uses for a large air
compressor besides drilling. However, many builders may not have the right
space or environment for one of those big boys. I have a 20 gal 2 cylinder
110 vac portable that lived through the riveting of my RV-4. I really
thought about replacing it for the "mega" unit, but I would rather save up
for the 12x36 metal lathe that is on my wish list at this time.
I can rock out to my favorite CD and drill at the same without a headset.
Can you say the same for you air powered turbine driven screaming hand
machine.
Paul
----- Original Message -----
From: "Gary Newsted" <fcs(at)jlc.net>
Subject: Re: RV9-List: Quiet drills-revenge of the air drill
>
> Well somebody needs to speak out on behalf of the poor, unappreciated,
super
> compressors of the world. So I guess its up to me to either step forward
or
> stomp on my air hose. A "real" aircraft mechanic uses all sorts of
drills and
> absolutely must be within one arms reach of at least three models at any
given
> time. Furthermore, he/she must have an equal number of right-angle and
flexible
> attachments with chucks of the micro and macro variety, none of those
sissy
> chuckless types please. Well OK, but only for deburring in your pocket
sized
> electric screwdriver-drill. As for the compressor, just try to blow away
all
> those shavings with the lame breeze produced by your Black and Decker.
NOT. A
> compressor serves so many useful purposes that I have on numerous
occasions
> stated my firm belief that ALL men, sorry ladies, should be provided with
a
> compressor of at least 60 gallons as soon as they are weaned. My faithful
> compressor, a pearl blue, two-stage, 8hp upright, 220, stands at the ready
with
> 110psi of pure clean oiless air (yes they make oil separators), 24 x 7 x
364
> 1/4. It's been wired into my house breaker panel for the last twenty
years and
> ain't even got no stinkin' on/off switch. I use it for drilling,
riveting,
> sanding, cutting, grinding, sandblasting, vacuming, dusting, sweeping the
> driveway, washing the cars, inflating stuff, starting the siphon, clearing
ice,
> drying off the Harley's, painting, polishing, sweeping the floors, chasing
away
> stray animals, and other stuff that's none of yer darn business; sheeeit,
I can
> even comb the crumbs from my beard with it. Try that with a stinkin
cordless
> drill! Compressor fans stand united! Noise? NOISE? It's music to my
ears
> and I get chills down the neckbone whenever I approach a shop with a
singing
> compressor! I can ignore those bothersome phone calls, don't have to
listen to
> nagging or afternoon soaps. My baby is mounted on rubber isolation
cushions so
> the house doesn't quiver and she won't walk around. As for oil spray from
the
> drill, I don't oil my tools and never have. Once in a great while one
will
> lock up and I toss it in the junk drawer. Tools are expendable, my
compressor
> is not. I hope to be burried by a pneumatic backhoe!
>
> So there! Back to riveting... G
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Gary Newsted" <fcs(at)jlc.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Quiet drills-revenge of the air drill |
> I can rock out to my favorite CD and drill at the same without a headset.
> Can you say the same for you air powered turbine driven screaming hand
> machine.
No but I can tell ya it's my second favorite tool!
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Merems" <merems(at)cox.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Quiet drills-revenge of the air drill |
Point taken
----- Original Message -----
From: "Gary Newsted" <fcs(at)jlc.net>
Subject: Re: RV9-List: Quiet drills-revenge of the air drill
>
> > I can rock out to my favorite CD and drill at the same without a
headset.
> > Can you say the same for you air powered turbine driven screaming hand
> > machine.
>
> No but I can tell ya it's my second favorite tool!
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Gary Newsted" <fcs(at)jlc.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Quiet drills-revenge of the air drill |
Well this is New Hampshire afterall, we get at least one power out day each
winter, usually several, so I drain the sump that day.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Paulbaird(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: RV-9A Air Speeds |
Steve,
I have a constant speed prop.
I don't use the brakes too hard. I don't need to with a 1300ft strip.
Regards,
Paul
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "steve dwyer" <stdwyer(at)dreamscape.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Quiet drills-revenge of the air drill |
Here's an interesting slant on air power that may cap this off once and for
all. A couple of years ago an old timer ( thats a RV-4 builder) gave a
presentation on riveting during a RV forum, he did a great job he knew the
ins and outs of everything and made one point that stuck. He said if you use
your compressed air tools all the time be very careful of constantly
breathing the discharged air from your tools. He went on to say the
condensed moisture that accumulates in the storage tank can provide a place
for some nasty things to grow and we dont want to breathe in these little
microrganisms. Of course he was hacking and spitting throughout his pitch
probably just to further his point and went on further to remind us of the
legionares disease found in cooling tower water. Any way after two years of
breathing this wonderful source of power to perforate my favorite airplane
I had stripped the threads on my tank bleed valve. During the replacement of
the valve I decided to follow his recomendation and pour in a small amount
of bleach. He was a sales rep for one of the major rivet gun manufacturers
so I assumed he was confident this wouldn't wreck the tools. As far as
breathing the "bad air" or for that matter concentrations of chlorine who
knows whats what anymore. I use both the noisy compressor and the cordless
and love it! I'm also taking a non script product called Tussin CF a great
nasal decongestant, cough suppressant and expectorant, I really wonder why
for the past two winters I've had a nagging chest cough????
You guys are an interesting bunch.....see ya!
Steve Dwyer
----- Original Message -----
From: Merems <merems(at)cox.net>
Subject: Re: RV9-List: Quiet drills-revenge of the air drill
>
> Point taken
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Gary Newsted" <fcs(at)jlc.net>
> To:
> Subject: Re: RV9-List: Quiet drills-revenge of the air drill
>
>
> >
> > > I can rock out to my favorite CD and drill at the same without a
> headset.
> > > Can you say the same for you air powered turbine driven screaming hand
> > > machine.
> >
> > No but I can tell ya it's my second favorite tool!
> >
> >
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "fcs(at)jlc.net" <fcs(at)jlc.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Quiet drills-revenge of the air drill |
By all means, practice safe compressing! A line filter/dryer will catch
any crud that comes out of the compressor. This is critical if you do any
painting with air power. Also, you can get a slick little device that will
automatically drain the sump when pressure drops. Just be sure to put a
pan under it and empty the nasty thing once in a while. You'll find a mix
of water and oil which results in a Kahlua-Sombrero appearance. Don't
drink the stuff or you'll find yourself hacking and coughing and requiring
Tussin. ;
)
If you leave your compressor powered up all the time, like I do, then you
need to develop a ritual of draining the sump every month, particularly
during the wet seasons. I've never heard tales of compressor-based
microorganisms. I would think the pressure and oils would destroy most
lifeforms, but who knows? I know it is a good practice to depressurize the
tank once a year and rinse it out with non-flamable spirits. Your local
auto parts store should have stuff specifically for this purpose. My
understanding is that this is to prevent corrosion from eventually eating
through the tank, but if it also pushes a few lifeforms to extinction, hey,
that's the human way!
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Miller Robert <rmiller3(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Quiet drills-revenge of the air drill |
I would not suggest chlorine. Chlorine gasses are very toxic.
Seems to me the more benign, (but hopefully effective), disinfectant used for
SCUBA tanks might be a good choice, as it is intended for compressed air
breathing tanks.
This should be available at any SCUBA store that services air tanks.
Robert
steve dwyer wrote:
>
> Here's an interesting slant on air power that may cap this off once and for
> all. A couple of years ago an old timer ( thats a RV-4 builder) gave a
> presentation on riveting during a RV forum, he did a great job he knew the
> ins and outs of everything and made one point that stuck. He said if you use
> your compressed air tools all the time be very careful of constantly
> breathing the discharged air from your tools. He went on to say the
> condensed moisture that accumulates in the storage tank can provide a place
> for some nasty things to grow and we dont want to breathe in these little
> microrganisms. Of course he was hacking and spitting throughout his pitch
> probably just to further his point and went on further to remind us of the
> legionares disease found in cooling tower water. Any way after two years of
> breathing this wonderful source of power to perforate my favorite airplane
> I had stripped the threads on my tank bleed valve. During the replacement of
> the valve I decided to follow his recomendation and pour in a small amount
> of bleach. He was a sales rep for one of the major rivet gun manufacturers
> so I assumed he was confident this wouldn't wreck the tools. As far as
> breathing the "bad air" or for that matter concentrations of chlorine who
> knows whats what anymore. I use both the noisy compressor and the cordless
> and love it! I'm also taking a non script product called Tussin CF a great
> nasal decongestant, cough suppressant and expectorant, I really wonder why
> for the past two winters I've had a nagging chest cough????
> You guys are an interesting bunch.....see ya!
>
> Steve Dwyer
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: Merems <merems(at)cox.net>
> To:
> Subject: Re: RV9-List: Quiet drills-revenge of the air drill
>
> >
> > Point taken
> >
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: "Gary Newsted" <fcs(at)jlc.net>
> > To:
> > Subject: Re: RV9-List: Quiet drills-revenge of the air drill
> >
> >
> > >
> > > > I can rock out to my favorite CD and drill at the same without a
> > headset.
> > > > Can you say the same for you air powered turbine driven screaming hand
> > > > machine.
> > >
> > > No but I can tell ya it's my second favorite tool!
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Curt Hoffman" <choffman9(at)cinci.rr.com> |
| Subject: | Aileron Lock Nut |
For those of you who have not yet done your aileron attachment I had asked Vans
the following question (same one I posted). They responded it appears they had
an oversight and did not include the correct nuts in the RV-9 inventory. The
AN365-1032 nut will work, but it is tight. Vans is correcting their inventory
and sending me the bag with the correct nuts. I suspect many if not all of the
RV9 wing packages did not include these nuts.
"The inboard aileron bracket has a screw that secures the bracket to the control
tube.The print calls for this screw to be secured with a MS21083-N3 lock nut.
It appears on the print to be a thinner version of an AN365-1032. None of these
21083 nuts came in the kit. I checked all the inventory sheets and there is
no mention of this nut."
Curt Hoffman
RV-9A wings almost done- working on tail
1968 Mustang 302 convertible
Piper Cherokee N5320W
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Compressor Sump drains |
Wow where do you get those? Sounds like a great idea.
Bob Hassel
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv9-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv9-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of fcs(at)jlc.net
Subject: Re: RV9-List: Quiet drills-revenge of the air drill
By all means, practice safe compressing! A line filter/dryer will catch
any crud that comes out of the compressor. This is critical if you do any
painting with air power. Also, you can get a slick little device that will
automatically drain the sump when pressure drops. Just be sure to put a
pan under it and empty the nasty thing once in a while. You'll find a mix
of water and oil which results in a Kahlua-Sombrero appearance. Don't
drink the stuff or you'll find yourself hacking and coughing and requiring
Tussin. ;
)
If you leave your compressor powered up all the time, like I do, then you
need to develop a ritual of draining the sump every month, particularly
during the wet seasons. I've never heard tales of compressor-based
microorganisms. I would think the pressure and oils would destroy most
lifeforms, but who knows? I know it is a good practice to depressurize the
tank once a year and rinse it out with non-flamable spirits. Your local
auto parts store should have stuff specifically for this purpose. My
understanding is that this is to prevent corrosion from eventually eating
through the tank, but if it also pushes a few lifeforms to extinction, hey,
that's the human way!
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Gary" <rv9er(at)3rivers.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Aileron Lock Nut |
Curt.........I am still not clear on which part this is. Can you give us a part
number on the aileron bracket? Is it the bellcrank that joins the aileron push-pull
tubes from the control column and the aileron?
Gary
----- Original Message -----
From: Curt Hoffman
To: rv9-list(at)matronics.com
Sent: Friday, February 07, 2003 5:04 PM
Subject: RV9-List: Aileron Lock Nut
For those of you who have not yet done your aileron attachment I had asked Vans
the following question (same one I posted). They responded it appears they
had an oversight and did not include the correct nuts in the RV-9 inventory. The
AN365-1032 nut will work, but it is tight. Vans is correcting their inventory
and sending me the bag with the correct nuts. I suspect many if not all of
the RV9 wing packages did not include these nuts.
"The inboard aileron bracket has a screw that secures the bracket to the control
tube.The print calls for this screw to be secured with a MS21083-N3 lock nut.
It appears on the print to be a thinner version of an AN365-1032. None of
these 21083 nuts came in the kit. I checked all the inventory sheets and there
is no mention of this nut."
Curt Hoffman
RV-9A wings almost done- working on tail
1968 Mustang 302 convertible
Piper Cherokee N5320W
---
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Steve Sampson" <SSampson.SLN21(at)london.edu> |
| Subject: | Wing attach brackets. |
Sorry guys. Me again. I seem to ask lots of dumb questions.
The F996tank attach brackets are meant to have a 2.7degree bend put in them.
How the hell does one do this. (Despite my surname) I am finding it quite
impossible to move this gauge of metal. Technique?
Thanks, Steve.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Albert Gardner" <albert.gardner(at)worldnet.att.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Wing attach brackets. |
Steve:
Do this one when your wings are on for the trial fitting. Clamp the bracket
in a vise and whack it with a hammer and see if it fits, If not, whack it
again. The band will occur in the area away from the corner and all it needs
is a small amount of bend.
Albert
----- Original Message -----
From: "Steve Sampson" <SSampson.SLN21(at)london.edu>
Subject: RV9-List: Wing attach brackets.
>
> Sorry guys. Me again. I seem to ask lots of dumb questions.
>
> The F996tank attach brackets are meant to have a 2.7degree bend put in
them.
> How the hell does one do this. (Despite my surname) I am finding it quite
> impossible to move this gauge of metal. Technique?
>
> Thanks, Steve.
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Curt Hoffman" <choffman9(at)cinci.rr.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Aileron Lock Nut |
This nut is called out on Dwg 13 Section B-B. It goes on screw MS24694-S67
that holds the aileron control tube W918 onto the Aileron bracket A907.
Curt Hoffman
RV-9A wings almost done- working on tail
1968 Mustang 302 convertible
Piper Cherokee N5320W
----- Original Message -----
From: "Gary" <rv9er(at)3rivers.net>
Subject: Re: RV9-List: Aileron Lock Nut
>
> Curt.........I am still not clear on which part this is. Can you give us
a part number on the aileron bracket? Is it the bellcrank that joins the
aileron push-pull tubes from the control column and the aileron?
>
> Gary
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: Curt Hoffman
> To: rv9-list(at)matronics.com
> Sent: Friday, February 07, 2003 5:04 PM
> Subject: RV9-List: Aileron Lock Nut
>
>
> For those of you who have not yet done your aileron attachment I had
asked Vans the following question (same one I posted). They responded it
appears they had an oversight and did not include the correct nuts in the
RV-9 inventory. The AN365-1032 nut will work, but it is tight. Vans is
correcting their inventory and sending me the bag with the correct nuts. I
suspect many if not all of the RV9 wing packages did not include these nuts.
>
> "The inboard aileron bracket has a screw that secures the bracket to the
control tube.The print calls for this screw to be secured with a MS21083-N3
lock nut. It appears on the print to be a thinner version of an AN365-1032.
None of these 21083 nuts came in the kit. I checked all the inventory sheets
and there is no mention of this nut."
>
> Curt Hoffman
> RV-9A wings almost done- working on tail
> 1968 Mustang 302 convertible
> Piper Cherokee N5320W
>
>
> ---
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | KIKIDEEMAX(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Wing attach brackets. |
I'M NOT THERE YET, BUT THE F996 ATTACH BRACKETS : ARE THESE ALUM. OR
STEEL? WACKING AL MAKES ME NERVOUS, STEEL WACKING HOWEVER THRILLS ME.
DAVID MORGAN #90079
CAPACITIVCE TANK PREP
"CLAMP THE BRACKET IN A VICE AND WACK IT WITH A
HAMMER" TIL IT FITS...
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Albert Gardner" <albert.gardner(at)worldnet.att.net> |
| Subject: | Things I'd do differently next time |
There is another RV-9A builder here in Yuma that has left his forward side
skins off far later in the building stage than the manual calls for. They
are ready to rivet and he plans to take care not to wait too long. His is
working on the wiring, panel, and rudder pedals and I am amazed how much
easier it makes all of those tasks. I wish I had done the same.
Albert Gardner, Yuma, AZ
N872RV
Airworthiness inspection in 6 days!
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Joe Wiza <planejoel(at)juno.com> |
hAS ANYONE HAD A PROBLEM MATCHING UP THE HOLES IN STIFFNERS (915) WITH
THE 901 L/R SKINS OR AM i JUST LOSING IT.?????
JOE rv9a
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Gary Newsted" <fcs(at)jlc.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Compressor Sump drains |
Northern Products catalog carries the automatic compressor sump drains. You
should be able to find these from most places that carry large compressors.
They replace the standard drain valve. I think I paid about $5, but that was
about 10 years ago, so they're probably $500 now ;
)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | MNHDrider(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Compressor Sump drains |
Also any heavy duty truck repair shop will have spring loaded drain valves
with a cable attached, just pull on it to drain water, Steve.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Gary Newsted" <fcs(at)jlc.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Compressor Sump drains |
Hey, I like that even better! The problem with my automatic drain valve is
that I never turn the compressor off, so it hardly ever drains automatically.
I end up crawing under it and draining it manually. A cable-operated one would
be nice. You still have to dump the nasty stuff in a can, but any improvement
is welcome. Ironically, all this macho talk about my compressor must have had
something to do with its failure this weekend! I think my motor needs a new
startup capacitor. I have to give it a nudge with a stick to get it going.
Then again, the same could be said about a lot of us!
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Dave Nicholson" <dnick2(at)insightbb.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Compressor Sump drains |
I tried an automatic drain valve on my shop compressor, but one morning I
found the pipe nipple attaching it to the bottom of the storage tank was
broken, and the compressor had run most of the night.
I replaced it with a simple ball valve and piped the drain line to the
outside of the shop.
I manually blow it down every few days.
Dave Nicholson
90347
----- Original Message -----
From: "Gary Newsted" <fcs(at)jlc.net>
Subject: Re: RV9-List: Compressor Sump drains
>
>
> Hey, I like that even better! The problem with my automatic drain valve
is
> that I never turn the compressor off, so it hardly ever drains
automatically.
> I end up crawing under it and draining it manually. A cable-operated one
would
> be nice. You still have to dump the nasty stuff in a can, but any
improvement
> is welcome. Ironically, all this macho talk about my compressor must
have had
> something to do with its failure this weekend! I think my motor needs a
new
> startup capacitor. I have to give it a nudge with a stick to get it
going.
> Then again, the same could be said about a lot of us!
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Gary" <rv9er(at)3rivers.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Wing attach brackets. |
Guess you haven't made your fuselage longerons yet! You'll get your thrills on
those parts, too.
Gary
I'M NOT THERE YET, BUT THE F996 ATTACH BRACKETS : ARE THESE ALUM. OR
STEEL? WACKING AL MAKES ME NERVOUS, STEEL WACKING HOWEVER THRILLS ME.
DAVID MORGAN #90079
CAPACITIVCE TANK PREP
"CLAMP THE BRACKET IN A VICE AND WACK IT WITH A
HAMMER" TIL IT FITS...
---
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Malcolm Wheatley <rv9a_builder(at)btopenworld.com> |
Joe,
Start with the right skin, the one without the bent back section. Work
from the rear-most hole, so that the excess overhangs the forward edge of
the skin. If you do this, they fit. If you don't, you waste hours trying
to figure it out.
Malcolm
Subject: RV9-List: mISSMATCH
From: Joe Wiza <planejoel(at)juno.com>
hAS ANYONE HAD A PROBLEM MATCHING UP THE HOLES IN STIFFNERS (915) WITH
THE 901 L/R SKINS OR AM i JUST LOSING IT.?????
JOE rv9a
AD
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Andy Karmy" <andy(at)karmy.com> |
| Subject: | Wing attach brackets. (flap rigging) |
I just finished rigging the flaps and ailerons. With everything neutral and lined
up using the aileron belcrank jig, with the flaps pulled all the way up, there
is about 1/4-3/8" of a gap on the underside of the fuselage to the bottom
of the flap. I'm working on a gentle bend of the lip on the end of the flap to
shrink that down.
- Andy
---------- Original Message ----------------------------------
From: "Steve Sampson" <SSampson.SLN21(at)london.edu>
>PS I mounted the first flap since I could not bend the brackets. How far off
>the underside of the fuse should it be in the 'up ' position? I could not
>find this specified.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Mark Schrimmer <mschrimmer(at)pacbell.net> |
| Subject: | RE: aileron lock nut |
>The inboard aileron bracket has a screw that secures the bracket to the control
>tube.The print calls for this screw to be secured with a MS21083-N3 lock
>nut. It appears on the print to be a thinner version of an AN365-1032.
Curt:
What version of drawing 13 do you have? Mine were drawn on 11/15/99 (no
revisions) and specify the AN365-1032 nut for the MS24694-S67 screw.
Mark Schrimmer
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bob Haan <bhaan(at)easystreet.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Wing attach brackets. |
Steve,
I heated them up with a heat gun and they bent very easily using a vise and
a hammer.
>
>Sorry guys. Me again. I seem to ask lots of dumb questions.
>
>The F996tank attach brackets are meant to have a 2.7degree bend put in them.
>How the hell does one do this. (Despite my surname) I am finding it quite
>impossible to move this gauge of metal. Technique?
>
>Thanks, Steve.
>
>
Bob
RV6A almost
http://easystreet.com/~bhaan/
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Curt Hoffman" <choffman9(at)cinci.rr.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Compressor Sump drains |
I had a well pump motor that acted like that once. Unfortunately I couldn't
find a 300 foot stick to hit it with so I had to pay a bunch of money to
pull it up to change the capacitor start, and then of course they said it
was obsolete and I should really put a new style motor on it, and while I'm
at it the pump was a little old, yada, yada, yada.
Curt Hoffman
RV-9A wings almost done- working on tail
1968 Mustang 302 convertible
Piper Cherokee N5320W
----- Original Message -----
From: "Gary Newsted" <fcs(at)jlc.net>
Subject: Re: RV9-List: Compressor Sump drains
>
>
> Hey, I like that even better! The problem with my automatic drain valve
is
> that I never turn the compressor off, so it hardly ever drains
automatically.
> I end up crawing under it and draining it manually. A cable-operated one
would
> be nice. You still have to dump the nasty stuff in a can, but any
improvement
> is welcome. Ironically, all this macho talk about my compressor must
have had
> something to do with its failure this weekend! I think my motor needs a
new
> startup capacitor. I have to give it a nudge with a stick to get it
going.
> Then again, the same could be said about a lot of us!
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Curt Hoffman" <choffman9(at)cinci.rr.com> |
| Subject: | Re: RE: aileron lock nut |
Mine is also 11/15/99 with no revisions. I suspect you're looking at the
second screw on that same bracket. The one with the special nut is the one
that holds the aileron control tube.
I just received my bag of stuff from Vans today. It had the thinner lock
nuts and a bunch of other nuts. God knows where they go since I am about
done with the wing and didn't realize I was missing them.
Curt Hoffman
RV-9A wings almost done- working on tail
1968 Mustang 302 convertible
Piper Cherokee N5320W
----- Original Message -----
From: "Mark Schrimmer" <mschrimmer(at)pacbell.net>
Subject: RV9-List: RE: aileron lock nut
>
> >The inboard aileron bracket has a screw that secures the bracket to the
control
> >tube.The print calls for this screw to be secured with a MS21083-N3 lock
> >nut. It appears on the print to be a thinner version of an AN365-1032.
>
>
> Curt:
>
>
> What version of drawing 13 do you have? Mine were drawn on 11/15/99 (no
> revisions) and specify the AN365-1032 nut for the MS24694-S67 screw.
>
> Mark Schrimmer
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Curt Hoffman" <choffman9(at)cinci.rr.com> |
| Subject: | Flap bracket- revisted |
If anyone is in the Loveland Oh area would you please stop over and slit my wrists
for me. I'm afraid I'd screw it up and have to do it again.
I just reinstalled the center flap brackets I was whining about with new bushings.
When I put all the bolts in the holes to the flap brackets, and then swung
the loose center bracket back into position, the rivet holes almost exactly line
up with the original holes. In fact I was able to push a few rivets back in
the holes.
It looks like I may only have to skim a few holes to get the rest of the rivets
in. man this baby was close. I still can't believe I couldn't get that center
bolt in. Maybe I should have tried harder.
Anway, alls well that ends well I guess. Forget the wrists. But you can come over
and rivet if you like.
Curt Hoffman
RV-9A wings almost done- working on tail
1968 Mustang 302 convertible
Piper Cherokee N5320W
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Steve Sampson" <SSampson.SLN21(at)london.edu> |
| Subject: | Flap distance from the fuse? |
I now have both ailerons and flaps on. I am interested to know how far the
trailing corner of the flap / or the overlap skin sits below the fuse. Andy
K said his were to 3/8th of an inch and mine are ". Another UK builder
sais his sit flush - and it sure looks as though they ought to be. Gus F
effectively said to me just reference them off the ailerons with them set as
described, and accept what you get...which is what I have done. I would sure
like them to have been flush.
I would not have thought there would be so much variation. If the incidence
is set correctly even 3/8 seems a lot. I would have thought the design
intention was flush. It might cost me .1 Knot!
Thanks for your inputs, Steve.
#90360
N Yorks., UK
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Neil Henderson" <neil.mo51(at)btopenworld.com> |
Listers
I have decided to fit a Wilksch WAM120 Diesel engine to my RV9-A. This is a new
engine manufactured in the UK designed specifically for aviation and is available
as a firewall package for the RV9. Putting aside the issues of using a new and
relatively untried design the package offers many
benefits, Single lever control i.e. - No mixture or carb heat, No ignigition system
i.e - No magnetos and spark plugs, No shock cooling( Water Cooled ), Superior
altitude performance, a modern design not a 40 year old dinosaur and most
significantly relatively inexpensive fuel available for the foreseeable future.
Check out www.wilksch.com
At the present the unit is available at 120 HP although a 160HP version will be
available next year. My question is doe's anyone know of a RV9 flying on 120HP
and if so how well does it perform.
Neil Henderson
Near Aylesbury in the UK
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | John Oliveira <oliveira(at)frontiernet.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Diesel Power |
Prototype flew very well with 115HP O235. Probably a little lighter
than yours.
Performance specs are in literature for that combo based on prototype.
Neil Henderson wrote:
>
>
>Listers
>
>I have decided to fit a Wilksch WAM120 Diesel engine to my RV9-A. This is a new
engine manufactured in the UK designed specifically for aviation and is available
>
>as a firewall package for the RV9. Putting aside the issues of using a new and
relatively untried design the package offers many
>
>benefits, Single lever control i.e. - No mixture or carb heat, No ignigition system
i.e - No magnetos and spark plugs, No shock cooling( Water Cooled ), Superior
altitude performance, a modern design not a 40 year old dinosaur and most
significantly relatively inexpensive fuel available for the foreseeable future.
Check out www.wilksch.com
>
>At the present the unit is available at 120 HP although a 160HP version will be
available next year. My question is doe's anyone know of a RV9 flying on 120HP
>
>and if so how well does it perform.
>
>Neil Henderson
>
>Near Aylesbury in the UK
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Sargentclt(at)cs.com |
| Subject: | Re: Diesel Power |
does this not cost as much as a new lycoming 0-320 when installed
________________________________________________________________________________
Great news! I can't wait to hear more of your experiences. I've been
following that engine development for awhile.
Another European diesel I've been watching is the Centurion. This will be
sold by Superior-airparts over here in the states. The draw back is it
doesn't have a TBO - only TBR (replacement).
Please keep us updated!
Bob Hassel
RV9A
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv9-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv9-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of Neil Henderson
Subject: RV9-List: Diesel Power
Listers
I have decided to fit a Wilksch WAM120 Diesel engine to my RV9-A. This is a
new engine manufactured in the UK designed specifically for aviation and is
available
as a firewall package for the RV9. Putting aside the issues of using a new
and relatively untried design the package offers many
benefits, Single lever control i.e. - No mixture or carb heat, No ignigition
system i.e - No magnetos and spark plugs, No shock cooling( Water Cooled ),
Superior altitude performance, a modern design not a 40 year old dinosaur
and most significantly relatively inexpensive fuel available for the
foreseeable future. Check out www.wilksch.com
At the present the unit is available at 120 HP although a 160HP version will
be available next year. My question is doe's anyone know of a RV9 flying on
120HP
and if so how well does it perform.
Neil Henderson
Near Aylesbury in the UK
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "L. Mark Thomasson" <lmthomasson(at)adelphia.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Diesel Power |
Is Diesel available at most airports?
Listers
I have decided to fit a Wilksch WAM120 Diesel engine to my RV9-A. This is a
new engine manufactured in the UK designed specifically for aviation
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Andy Karmy" <andy(at)karmy.com> |
Ok everyone...
I pulled this link from Doug Reeves site (which I'm sure all of you watch already)
It apears to answer most all of the questions that we all had while doing this
task recently. Questions like, why are some flaps flush and others not, how much
sweep is acceptable, etc etc...
http://www.metronet.com/~dreeves/pdf/WINGINCIDENCEDRILLINGSIMPLIFIED.pdf
In classic fashion, I just finished drilling mine last week and now the better
instructions come out!
- Andy Karmy
RV9A Seattle WA
Inspection this weekend!
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Richard E. Tasker" <retasker(at)optonline.net> |
| Subject: | Heated Pitot-Static tube |
I want to put a heated pitot-static tube on my RV-9 rather than the
standard unheated one that Van's calls out (that we fabricate) for that
"just in case" time...
While I don't want to "cheap out" on a part such as this, the best deal
I have been able to find is $395 from Gretzaero (plus the mounting kit).
I don't mind paying a fair price for an aircraft part, even if it seems
high, but this part seems too simple to cost so much.
Am I missing something or has anyone found a more reasonably priced
heated pitot-static tube anywhere?
If this is what is available I will purchase one, but even for an
aircraft part it seems a tad high.
Dick Tasker, 90573
Wings
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | DLOMHEIM(at)aol.com |
Have any of you installed leather covered seat cushions in your RV? If so,
how do you like them vs. fabric material? Also, do you have a digital
picture of one you could send me off list, or do any of you know of a few
sites where I could view a nice finished cushion on the web? Thanks for any
replies and information.
Doug Lomheim
90116 (Wings; Fuselage in miod-March!)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Steve Sampson" <SSampson.SLN21(at)london.edu> |
Just in case you have an 'older' builders manual.
I recently spent an afternoon trying to decide why I could not achieved the
40 degree flap deflection indicated on P15-2 in the builders manual. Having
contacted Gus he advised this has been changed and the correct deflection is
32 degrees.
Steve
#90360
N Yorks UK
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | James Murray <jmurraymd(at)yahoo.com> |
| Subject: | Re: RV9-List Digest: 1 Msgs - 02/15/03 |
I have ordered leather seats through Becky Orndorf.
Due in March. 4 month wait.
Jim Murray finishing kit 90430
--- RV9-List Digest Server
wrote:
> *
>
> ==================================================
> Online Versions of Today's List Digest Archive
> ==================================================
>
> Today's complete RV9-List Digest can be also be
> found in either
> of the two Web Links listed below. The .html file
> includes the Digest
> formatted in HTML for viewing with a web browser and
> features Hyperlinked
> Indexes and Message Navigation. The .txt file
> includes the plain ASCII
> version of the RV9-List Digest and can be viewed
> with a generic
> text editor such as Notepad or with a web browser.
>
> HTML Version:
>
>
>
http://www.matronics.com/digest/rv9-list/Digest.RV9-List.2003-02-15.html
>
> Text Version:
>
>
>
http://www.matronics.com/digest/rv9-list/Digest.RV9-List.2003-02-15.txt
>
>
> ================================================
> EMail Version of Today's List Digest Archive
> ================================================
>
>
>
>
> RV9-List Digest Archive
> ---
> Total Messages Posted Sat
> 02/15/03: 1
>
>
>
>
> Today's Message Index:
> ----------------------
>
> 1. 05:47 AM - Seats (DLOMHEIM(at)aol.com)
>
>
>
> ________________________________ Message 1
> _____________________________________
>
>
> From: DLOMHEIM(at)aol.com
> Subject: RV9-List: Seats
>
>
> Have any of you installed leather covered seat
> cushions in your RV? If so,
> how do you like them vs. fabric material? Also, do
> you have a digital
> picture of one you could send me off list, or do any
> of you know of a few
> sites where I could view a nice finished cushion on
> the web? Thanks for any
> replies and information.
>
> Doug Lomheim
> 90116 (Wings; Fuselage in miod-March!)
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Contributions
> any other
> Forums.
>
> latest messages.
> List members.
>
> http://www.matronics.com/subscription
> http://www.matronics.com/FAQ/RV9-List.htm
> Digests:http://www.matronics.com/digest/rv9-list
> http://www.matronics.com/archives
> http://www.matronics.com/photoshare
> http://www.matronics.com/emaillists
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Jerry2DT(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Alternative Subaru engines |
Listers...
For those who may be interested, there are new pix of the beautifully crafted
NSI 2.5 Subaru aero engine at http://groups.yahoo.com/group/E-SubieForum/ Go
to the left and click on "photos". You will also see previously posted pix of
the neat looking Eggenfellner Subaru.
Jerry Cochran
Wilsonville, OR
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Andy Karmy" <andy(at)karmy.com> |
WOW What a feeling, it's alive!
First engine run was successful! With a belch of smoke, a spray of oil... Yep you
guessed it, another Lycoming comes to life. Here's some pictures to keep you
all building!
http://www.karmy.com/rv9a/pictures/assembly/EngineStart/index.htm
- Andy Karmy
RV9A Seattle WA
Inspection Today!
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Ken Moak <ken_moak(at)yahoo.com> |
Congratulations. Im jealous, but more motivated.
Good luck on the upcoming big day.
--- Andy Karmy wrote:
>
>
> WOW What a feeling, it's alive!
>
> First engine run was successful! With a belch of
> smoke, a spray of oil... Yep you guessed it, another
> Lycoming comes to life. Here's some pictures to keep
> you all building!
>
>
http://www.karmy.com/rv9a/pictures/assembly/EngineStart/index.htm
>
> - Andy Karmy
> RV9A Seattle WA
> Inspection Today!
>
>
>
> Contributions
> any other
> Forums.
>
> latest messages.
> List members.
>
> http://www.matronics.com/subscription
> http://www.matronics.com/FAQ/RV9-List.htm
> Digests:http://www.matronics.com/digest/rv9-list
> http://www.matronics.com/archives
> http://www.matronics.com/photoshare
> http://www.matronics.com/emaillists
>
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Joe Wiza <planejoel(at)juno.com> |
I #40 drilled all the elev skin holes and dimpled. Reading ahead I see
that the top of the spar gets 3/32 rivets and the bottom #30 for the pop
rivets. Do I drill and machine counter sink the bottom of the spar to #30
??????? Thanks ahead.
RV9A
Joe
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Phil" <Phil(at)camsnet.com> |
Hello Joe
I drilled #30 and dimpled #30. I squeeze as many rivets as I could w/ 1/8"
countersunk
rivet and blind riveted the rest.
Do a quick test of a #30 and #6 dimple to compare the fit of a blind rivet.
Phil
I #40 drilled all the elev skin holes and dimpled. Reading ahead I see
that the top of the spar gets 3/32 rivets and the bottom #30 for the pop
rivets. Do I drill and machine counter sink the bottom of the spar to #30
??????? Thanks ahead.
RV9A
Joe
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | DAVID MORGAN <KIKIDEEMAX(at)comcast.net> |
| Subject: | locking gas caps |
Has anyone purchased Vans locking gas caps and installed them?
Do they refund for returned standared caps. Are there other caps out
there avalable?
I just received the proseal and prefab. fuel pickup tubes.
David in Denver
KIKIDEEMAX(at)COMCAST.NET
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Terry Hobert" <terhobey(at)hotmail.com> |
Way to go Andy! Sure looks cool!
Terry
>From: "Andy Karmy" <andy(at)karmy.com>
>Reply-To: rv9-list(at)matronics.com
>To: , "RV-9A(at)yahoogroups.com"
>
>Subject: RV9-List: It's alive!
>Date: Mon, 17 Feb 2003 09:27:19 -0600
>
>
>WOW What a feeling, it's alive!
>
>First engine run was successful! With a belch of smoke, a spray of oil...
>Yep you guessed it, another Lycoming comes to life. Here's some pictures to
>keep you all building!
>
>http://www.karmy.com/rv9a/pictures/assembly/EngineStart/index.htm
>
>- Andy Karmy
> RV9A Seattle WA
> Inspection Today!
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | DThomas773(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | F-915 floor ribs |
From Dennis Thomas, working on fuselage center section.
I'm more than a little puzzled by these ribs. Looking at them it would
appear they need to bend outwards towards the side of the cabin by about an
inch and a half. However they are attached to the F-904 center section in
front and to the F905 bulkhead in they back. How does this happen. I have
read all the way through my instructions and do not see where, when or how
these get drilled and or installed.
Any contributions of information from you folks what been there and done that
be much appreciated.
Dennis Thomas #90164
Tail Dragger/ Tip Up
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Nightingale Michael" <NightingaleMichaelV(at)JohnDeere.com> |
"'RV-9 LIST'"
| Subject: | AOA audio out to UPS/Apollo GX-65 intercom |
Question:
Can the audio output (Bitching Betty) of the Proprietary Software AOA (Angle
of Attack) be tied parallel to head phone output of the com. radio/intercom
of a UPS GX-65. The AOA has output impedances of 560 Ohms & 26 Ohms and
also has a volume control. We would like to use just the built-in intercom
of GX-65.
Thanks
RV-9A
90259
Michael V. Nightingale
DEERE & Co. Computer Center
400 19th ST.
Moline, IL. 61265
pager 563-327-7891
nightingalemichael(at)johndeere.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Steve Sampson" <SSampson.SLN21(at)london.edu> |
| Subject: | Tips on the tips |
Just about to put the tips on. Have them all ready and taped into position
and am about to start drilling. Before I do any gotchas? I am a little
concerned that with the trailing edge in alignement there is going to be
some 'extra' f'glass that does not know where to go just outside the rear
spar (like an oilcan effect). Perhaps the spanwise rib will take it away?
All input welcome.
Steve
#90360
N Yorks., UK
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Andy Karmy" <andy(at)karmy.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Tips on the tips |
Just make extra sure that you have the aileron's setup with the belcrank jig all
setup etc. Now is the only easy time you will have getting the trailing edges
to match up.
I did this carefully (I thought) but when I did the final assembly and rigging
one of the tips was about 1/2" low from the neutral aileron! Sucked... I had to
cut the TE of the tip and reglass it together to make everything work out.
Just measure, fit and go for it! Good Luck Steve!
- Andy
---------- Original Message ----------------------------------
From: "Steve Sampson" <SSampson.SLN21(at)london.edu>
Date: Sat, 22 Feb 2003 19:01:56 -0000
>
>Just about to put the tips on. Have them all ready and taped into position
>and am about to start drilling. Before I do any gotchas? I am a little
>concerned that with the trailing edge in alignement there is going to be
>some 'extra' f'glass that does not know where to go just outside the rear
>spar (like an oilcan effect). Perhaps the spanwise rib will take it away?
>
>All input welcome.
>Steve
>#90360
>N Yorks., UK
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "dean van winkle" <dvanwinkle(at)royell.net> |
| Subject: | Re: F-915 floor ribs |
Dennis
I too found no obvious guidance for the F-915 ribs. The process that I used
was to take a thin piece of aluminum roof flashing and tape it in place on
the F-976 center bottom skin over the curved pre-punched rivet line for the
F-915 rib and marked the locations of the F-904 and F-905 bulkheads. I
transferred the rivet pattern to the flashing using a sharpie ink pen and
drew a faired curved line thru the center of the rivet line. Next, I cut
the flashing along the curved line to generate a template. Finally, I drew a
center line on the lower flanges of the ribs and fluted the ribs between the
rivet marks on the template so the center line matched the curve of the
template. Just flip the template over for the second rib. Lastly,
temporarily mount the ribs to the 904 and 905 bulkheads. The centerlines on
the 915 ribs should now align with the rivet lines in the 976 skin so the
matching holes can be drilled. Perhaps there is an easier approach, but this
worked well for me.
Dean Van Winkle, Retired Aero Engineer
90095
Still working fuselage, Finish Kit due mid March
----- Original Message -----
From: <DThomas773(at)aol.com>
Subject: RV9-List: F-915 floor ribs
>
> From Dennis Thomas, working on fuselage center section.
>
> I'm more than a little puzzled by these ribs. Looking at them it would
> appear they need to bend outwards towards the side of the cabin by about
an
> inch and a half. However they are attached to the F-904 center section in
> front and to the F905 bulkhead in they back. How does this happen. I have
> read all the way through my instructions and do not see where, when or how
> these get drilled and or installed.
>
> Any contributions of information from you folks what been there and done
that
> be much appreciated.
>
> Dennis Thomas #90164
> Tail Dragger/ Tip Up
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Noel & Yoshie Simmons" <noel(at)blueskyaviation.net> |
| Subject: | AOA audio out to UPS/Apollo GX-65 intercom |
Should be able put it in to a music input so it will soft mute during
transmission or ICS.
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv9-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv9-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of Nightingale
Michael
Subject: RV9-List: AOA audio out to UPS/Apollo GX-65 intercom
Question:
Can the audio output (Bitching Betty) of the Proprietary Software AOA (Angle
of Attack) be tied parallel to head phone output of the com. radio/intercom
of a UPS GX-65. The AOA has output impedances of 560 Ohms & 26 Ohms and
also has a volume control. We would like to use just the built-in intercom
of GX-65.
Thanks
RV-9A
90259
Michael V. Nightingale
DEERE & Co. Computer Center
400 19th ST.
Moline, IL. 61265
pager 563-327-7891
nightingalemichael(at)johndeere.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Steve Sampson" <SSampson.SLN21(at)london.edu> |
| Subject: | Tips on the tips |
Andy - thanks for that.
I have checked the position of the ailerons and flaps 'til I am blue and all
are locked within about 1/3 of a degree with each other and in position. I
am concerned however that there is a tendency for the trailing edge of the
flaps to droop. Is this what happened to you (or yours)?
In the end I will have to go for it. However these incidence and position
issues I like to live with for a while. Not because I like the indecision,
because I find it reduces the chances of mistakes!
Thanks, Steve.
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv9-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv9-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Andy Karmy
Subject: Re: RV9-List: Tips on the tips
Just make extra sure that you have the aileron's setup with the belcrank jig
all setup etc. Now is the only easy time you will have getting the trailing
edges to match up.
I did this carefully (I thought) but when I did the final assembly and
rigging one of the tips was about 1/2" low from the neutral aileron!
Sucked... I had to cut the TE of the tip and reglass it together to make
everything work out.
Just measure, fit and go for it! Good Luck Steve!
- Andy
---------- Original Message ----------------------------------
From: "Steve Sampson" <SSampson.SLN21(at)london.edu>
Date: Sat, 22 Feb 2003 19:01:56 -0000
>
>Just about to put the tips on. Have them all ready and taped into position
>and am about to start drilling. Before I do any gotchas? I am a little
>concerned that with the trailing edge in alignement there is going to be
>some 'extra' f'glass that does not know where to go just outside the rear
>spar (like an oilcan effect). Perhaps the spanwise rib will take it away?
>
>All input welcome.
>Steve
>#90360
>N Yorks., UK
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Paul Eckenroth" <jeckenroth(at)nbn.net> |
I have requested an answer from Van's engineers on the following but would also
appreciate opinions from knowledgeable listers. My left rear spar has a 3/16"
arch upward in the center when assembled. Obviously this will preclude constructing
a straight wing. Assuming Van's says "no problem", what effect might
this have on aileron, flap adjustments and on the final flight characteristics
of the finished plane. Will the results be bad enough to warrant replacing
the parts now? Wing is assembled - not riveted.
Paul Eckenroth
Palmyra, PA
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Gary Newsted" <fcs(at)jlc.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Wing rear spar |
3/16 is not a huge arch, and will probably flatten out as you construct the
wing, but considering that this is a spar, and spars of all things, should be
straight, I might be tempted to ask for a replacement. My two cents....
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Ken Moak <ken_moak(at)yahoo.com> |
Am I doing something wrong? I use the rivet length
that the plans call for and often it seems like I need
a 1/2 size longer. If the plans call for a 3.5 I seem
to need a 4. If it calls for a 4 a sanded down 5.
Often (not always) I end up with a thin shop head,
diameter is right, if I blindly stick the rivet in
without measuring. I have clecoed every hole to make
sure it is tight. Found this on several areas on the
empennage. Has anyone else had this happen?
Ken
90608
http://taxes.yahoo.com/
________________________________________________________________________________
Yes - I have had this happen. Could be due to a number of reasons but I
find myself going up a half size of rivet length periodically. As you say
it's worth checking.
Bob Hassel
RV9A
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv9-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv9-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of Ken Moak
Subject: RV9-List: Rivet Length
Am I doing something wrong? I use the rivet length
that the plans call for and often it seems like I need
a 1/2 size longer. If the plans call for a 3.5 I seem
to need a 4. If it calls for a 4 a sanded down 5.
Often (not always) I end up with a thin shop head,
diameter is right, if I blindly stick the rivet in
without measuring. I have clecoed every hole to make
sure it is tight. Found this on several areas on the
empennage. Has anyone else had this happen?
Ken
90608
http://taxes.yahoo.com/
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Albert Gardner" <albert.gardner(at)worldnet.att.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Rivet Length |
I would get a set of rivet gages. One tells you the length required and the
other checks the shop head after you set it. Length is easy to check and
either confirms what the plans call for or tells you what you really need.
generally the plans are correct but not in every case. After you get some
practice setting rivets you can often tell if they are OK just by feel but I
still check some every now and again just to be sure.
Albert Gardner, Yuma, AZ
N872RV
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Gary" <rv9er(at)3rivers.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Rivet Length |
Ken.....this is very common. I have gotten to the point where I use my homemade
rivet gage to check the lengths on most everything. I also made a rivet set
gage for each size. I often use different length rivets than the drawings call
out........sometimes shorter, sometimes longer.
I use a rivet cutter sometimes to make adjustments in the length. If it is an
awkward rivet to set, it may tend to clinch over if it is a bit too long.
Gary 90263
----- Original Message -----
From: Ken Moak
To: rv9-list(at)matronics.com
Sent: Sunday, February 23, 2003 9:14 AM
Subject: RV9-List: Rivet Length
Am I doing something wrong? I use the rivet length
that the plans call for and often it seems like I need
a 1/2 size longer. If the plans call for a 3.5 I seem
to need a 4. If it calls for a 4 a sanded down 5.
Often (not always) I end up with a thin shop head,
diameter is right, if I blindly stick the rivet in
without measuring. I have clecoed every hole to make
sure it is tight. Found this on several areas on the
empennage. Has anyone else had this happen?
Ken
90608
---
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Steve Sampson" <SSampson.SLN21(at)london.edu> |
| Subject: | Tips on the tips |
Andy - that should have read ................the trailing edge of the tips
to droop...... Oops! Steve.
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv9-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv9-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Steve Sampson
Subject: RE: RV9-List: Tips on the tips
Andy - thanks for that.
I have checked the position of the ailerons and flaps 'til I am blue and all
are locked within about 1/3 of a degree with each other and in position. I
am concerned however that there is a tendency for the trailing edge of the
flaps to droop. Is this what happened to you (or yours)?
In the end I will have to go for it. However these incidence and position
issues I like to live with for a while. Not because I like the indecision,
because I find it reduces the chances of mistakes!
Thanks, Steve.
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv9-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv9-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Andy Karmy
Subject: Re: RV9-List: Tips on the tips
Just make extra sure that you have the aileron's setup with the belcrank jig
all setup etc. Now is the only easy time you will have getting the trailing
edges to match up.
I did this carefully (I thought) but when I did the final assembly and
rigging one of the tips was about 1/2" low from the neutral aileron!
Sucked... I had to cut the TE of the tip and reglass it together to make
everything work out.
Just measure, fit and go for it! Good Luck Steve!
* Andy
---------- Original Message ----------------------------------
From: "Steve Sampson" <SSampson.SLN21(at)london.edu>
Date: Sat, 22 Feb 2003 19:01:56 -0000
>
>Just about to put the tips on. Have them all ready and taped into position
>and am about to start drilling. Before I do any gotchas? I am a little
>concerned that with the trailing edge in alignement there is going to be
>some 'extra' f'glass that does not know where to go just outside the rear
>spar (like an oilcan effect). Perhaps the spanwise rib will take it away?
>
>All input welcome.
>Steve
>#90360
>N Yorks., UK
>
>
advertising on the Matronics Forums.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Steve Sampson" <SSampson.SLN21(at)london.edu> |
I agree with Gary! It would bug me forever. Even if it did fly right I
would swear it did not. Steve.
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv9-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv9-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Gary Newsted
Subject: Re: RV9-List: Wing rear spar
3/16 is not a huge arch, and will probably flatten out as you construct the
wing, but considering that this is a spar, and spars of all things, should
be
straight, I might be tempted to ask for a replacement. My two cents....
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Curt Hoffman" <choffman9(at)cinci.rr.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Wing rear spar |
You mention the rise is when the skeleton is assembled but not riveted. I
would probably try clecoeing on the skins on one side and see what it looks
like. With the ribs all being the same length it's not clear how you could
actually end up with a rise once riveted but you should also be able to tell
if you can clecoe on the skins. If all the skins go on, the wing has to be
straight, or at least as good as it gets. There are too many holes to allow
much misalignment.
Curt Hoffman
RV-9A wings done- working on tail
1968 Mustang 302 convertible
Piper Cherokee N5320W
----- Original Message -----
From: "Paul Eckenroth" <jeckenroth(at)nbn.net>
Subject: RV9-List: Wing rear spar
>
> I have requested an answer from Van's engineers on the following but would
also appreciate opinions from knowledgeable listers. My left rear spar has
a 3/16" arch upward in the center when assembled. Obviously this will
preclude constructing a straight wing. Assuming Van's says "no problem",
what effect might this have on aileron, flap adjustments and on the final
flight characteristics of the finished plane. Will the results be bad
enough to warrant replacing the parts now? Wing is assembled - not riveted.
>
> Paul Eckenroth
> Palmyra, PA
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Gary Newsted" <fcs(at)jlc.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Rivet Length |
Ken, As a good rule of thumb, 1.5 times the diameter of the rivet should be
showing to get a good shop head. The variance you are experiencing is commonly
a result of a larger hole size than "spec". You'll find that in thicker metals
and places you countersunk instead of dimpled, the rivets behave as expected,
but in thin metals you'll occasionally need to use the next size longer. This
is because the drilling and dimpling process often results in a hole slightly
larger than the drill bit you started out with. This is not bad, and in fact
it is to be expected, so don't try to undersize the holes, just grab the rivet
that works. Rest assured, you've got a ton of extra rivets. I am down to one
last panel in the project, maybe 200 rivets to go, and I'd guess I've got
several thousand spare rivets. I don't even bother checking the plans anymore
when selecting rivets. Once you've got your zen going, you just know which ones
will yield that perfect fit. A secure joint is the goal. You're doing the
right thing.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Andy Karmy" <andy(at)karmy.com> |
"RV-9A(at)yahoogroups.com"
| Subject: | N169AK First Flight |
RV9A 90374 - N169AK first flight
The day dawned clear and cold Sunday February 23, 2003. With the inspection over,
the planning done, checks and double checks finished, fuel added, it was time
to fly. Pulling the plane from the hanger people started showing up. My wife
and I had the plan in mind, but it was great to see a few of my local EAA buds
from the chapter show up just because they knew that I was going to fly today
Engine starts easily, and a quick trip down to the pumps for 5 more gallons of
gas. Now its run up time. 2200 RPM static full throttle on the ground is good
for the Sensenich FP prop. Everything is still looking good, so out to the runway
we go. Lineup full throttle, with no flaps I am off in a very short amount
of time. I run a bit on the main gear with the nose in the air as the RV9 has
such a large tail and good elevator control. Lift off is smooth and climb out
is brisk. Its about 40degrees and I am seeing 1600fpm at 100+mph! Still turning
about 2250 RPM during climb out.
Pitch felt good, ailerons needed just 2-3 taps on the electric aileron trim. Hey
this is just too cool The RV grin is starting! By downwind I am at 2000agl and
climbing, level off at 3000 and start the racetrack around the airport. I flew
about 20 minuets of just turning right and left in circles around the airport.
Next came slow flight, everything felt nice a easy at 70mph, so I dropped
the flaps to half and then full. Everything still nice and balanced, controls
are now much lighter in feel at 70mph. Everything looking good I accelerated
back to cruise.
At 3000agl with 2400RPM I was indicating a solid 160mph with no gear leg fairings
or wheel pants. Not bad, this baby is going to cruise nicely. Well everything
is still looking good, so its time to let down for landing. Pushing the nose
downhill winds the airspeed through 185+ very quickly, pull the power back and
float down onto the 45. Downwind established at about 120mph, pull the power
to idle abeam the numbers and start feeding in flaps as I come through 85, full
flaps on base and capture 70mph and about 500fpm descent. Sweeping around
to final and holding about 70 gives a nice approach for this first one, everything
is lined up and working great as I setup the landing flair from memory of
my training in the RV6A (Thanks Mike Seager) I hold the pitch attitude and wait,
however I was used to the 6A which sits quite a bit lower than the 9A, so
next thing I know the wheels hit and I get a little bounce out of it, holding
attitude the speed bleeds off and the second landing is smooth YEA first flight
is a success!
Post flight inspection did not uncover any leaks, or anything else that needed
working on. So whats a guy to do, but a second flight. While I was orbiting on
the second flight a friend from the EAA chapter came up in his RV6 to do some
formation inspection and video camera work. We had a great 30 min of air to air
shots and compared airspeeds etc. Great fun!
All in all 1.5 hours TT today and my face is still hurting from the famous RV grin!
As in those famous words, Keep pounding those rivets, because you are going to
love this plane!
Andy Karmy
RV9A Seattle WA
N169AK - Flying
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Ken Moak <ken_moak(at)yahoo.com> |
| Subject: | Re: N169AK First Flight |
Andy
Congratulations!
Great to hear the first flight went so well.
I'm jealous, got a lot of work to do. Thanks for the
motivation.
--- Andy Karmy wrote:
>
>
>
> RV9A 90374 - N169AK first flight
>
> The day dawned clear and cold Sunday February 23,
> 2003. With the inspection over, the planning done,
> checks and double checks finished, fuel added, it
> was time to fly. Pulling the plane from the hanger
> people started showing up. My wife and I had the
> plan in mind, but it was great to see a few of my
> local EAA buds from the chapter show up just because
> they knew that I was going to fly today
>
> Engine starts easily, and a quick trip down to the
> pumps for 5 more gallons of gas. Now its run up
> time. 2200 RPM static full throttle on the ground is
> good for the Sensenich FP prop. Everything is still
> looking good, so out to the runway we go. Lineup
> full throttle, with no flaps I am off in a very
> short amount of time. I run a bit on the main gear
> with the nose in the air as the RV9 has such a large
> tail and good elevator control. Lift off is smooth
> and climb out is brisk. Its about 40degrees and I am
> seeing 1600fpm at 100+mph! Still turning about 2250
> RPM during climb out.
>
> Pitch felt good, ailerons needed just 2-3 taps on
> the electric aileron trim. Hey this is just too cool
> The RV grin is starting! By downwind I am at 2000agl
> and climbing, level off at 3000 and start the
> racetrack around the airport. I flew about 20
> minuets of just turning right and left in circles
> around the airport. Next came slow flight,
> everything felt nice a easy at 70mph, so I dropped
> the flaps to half and then full. Everything still
> nice and balanced, controls are now much lighter in
> feel at 70mph. Everything looking good I accelerated
> back to cruise.
>
> At 3000agl with 2400RPM I was indicating a solid
> 160mph with no gear leg fairings or wheel pants. Not
> bad, this baby is going to cruise nicely. Well
> everything is still looking good, so its time to let
> down for landing. Pushing the nose downhill winds
> the airspeed through 185+ very quickly, pull the
> power back and float down onto the 45. Downwind
> established at about 120mph, pull the power to idle
> abeam the numbers and start feeding in flaps as I
> come through 85, full flaps on base and capture
> 70mph and about 500fpm descent. Sweeping around to
> final and holding about 70 gives a nice approach for
> this first one, everything is lined up and working
> great as I setup the landing flair from memory of my
> training in the RV6A (Thanks Mike Seager) I hold the
> pitch attitude and wait, however I was used to the
> 6A which sits quite a bit lower than the 9A, so next
> thing I know the wheels hit and I get a little
> bounce out of it, holding attitude the speed bleeds
> off and the second landing!
> is smooth YEA first flight is a success!
>
> Post flight inspection did not uncover any leaks, or
> anything else that needed working on. So whats a guy
> to do, but a second flight. While I was orbiting on
> the second flight a friend from the EAA chapter came
> up in his RV6 to do some formation inspection and
> video camera work. We had a great 30 min of air to
> air shots and compared airspeeds etc. Great fun!
>
> All in all 1.5 hours TT today and my face is still
> hurting from the famous RV grin!
>
> As in those famous words, Keep pounding those
> rivets, because you are going to love this plane!
>
> Andy Karmy
> RV9A Seattle WA
> N169AK - Flying
>
>
>
> Contributions
> any other
> Forums.
>
> latest messages.
> List members.
>
> http://www.matronics.com/subscription
> http://www.matronics.com/FAQ/RV9-List.htm
> Digests:http://www.matronics.com/digest/rv9-list
> http://www.matronics.com/archives
> http://www.matronics.com/photoshare
> http://www.matronics.com/emaillists
>
>
>
>
>
=====
Ken Moak #90608
Fort Worth, TX
Empennage, wings have arrived!
ken_moak(at)yahoo.com
http://taxes.yahoo.com/
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Joosten, Craig" <CJoosten(at)infiltratorsystems.net> |
| Subject: | N169AK First Flight |
Congratulations Andy!
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv9-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv9-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of Andy Karmy
Subject: RV9-List: N169AK First Flight
RV9A 90374 - N169AK first flight
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Leland <Federigo(at)pacbell.net> |
| Subject: | Re: N169AK First Flight |
Great going Andy. I can almost imagine myself taking that first flight
one day. I see that you turned 2400 RPM doing 160 mph at 3000 agl. Those
numbers sound just about perfect for a plane with no pants or gearleg
fairings. Can you say what your engine is and what diameter and pitch
your Sensenich FP has? I am trying to decide on propeller
specifications.
Leland in Pleasanton
Done with wheel fairings and back to wiring
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | DThomas773(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: N169AK First Flight |
Hey Andy,
Congrtulations! What a treat to look forward to.
Dennis Thomas
Mid section fuselage
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Rob W M Shipley" <Rob(at)RobsGlass.com> |
| Subject: | N169AK First Flight |
VERY well done indeed Andy. I can hardly wait for my first flight.
Rob
Rob W M Shipley
RV9A N919RV Fuselage.
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | N169AK First Flight |
| From: | "Ted Strand" <tstrand(at)strandcentral.com> |
Andy,
Congrats!!!
I am getting an RV grin just from your description of your flight. I
guess it is time to dust off the rivet gun and get back to work!
Hundreds of hours to go, but sounds like it will be well worth every
minute spent building.
-Ted Strand-
Clearwater, FL
Wing Kit Inventoried (& still finishing up empennage trailing edges)
-----Original Message-----
From: Andy Karmy [mailto:andy(at)karmy.com]
Subject: RV9-List: N169AK First Flight
RV9A 90374 - N169AK first flight
The day dawned clear and cold Sunday February 23, 2003. With the
inspection over, the planning done, checks and double checks finished,
fuel added, it was time to fly. Pulling the plane from the hanger people
started showing up. My wife and I had the plan in mind, but it was great
to see a few of my local EAA buds from the chapter show up just because
they knew that I was going to fly today
Engine starts easily, and a quick trip down to the pumps for 5 more
gallons of gas. Now its run up time. 2200 RPM static full throttle on
the ground is good for the Sensenich FP prop. Everything is still
looking good, so out to the runway we go. Lineup full throttle, with no
flaps I am off in a very short amount of time. I run a bit on the main
gear with the nose in the air as the RV9 has such a large tail and good
elevator control. Lift off is smooth and climb out is brisk. Its about
40degrees and I am seeing 1600fpm at 100+mph! Still turning about 2250
RPM during climb out.
Pitch felt good, ailerons needed just 2-3 taps on the electric aileron
trim. Hey this is just too cool The RV grin is starting! By downwind I
am at 2000agl and climbing, level off at 3000 and start the racetrack
around the airport. I flew about 20 minuets of just turning right and
left in circles around the airport. Next came slow flight, everything
felt nice a easy at 70mph, so I dropped the flaps to half and then full.
Everything still nice and balanced, controls are now much lighter in
feel at 70mph. Everything looking good I accelerated back to cruise.
At 3000agl with 2400RPM I was indicating a solid 160mph with no gear leg
fairings or wheel pants. Not bad, this baby is going to cruise nicely.
Well everything is still looking good, so its time to let down for
landing. Pushing the nose downhill winds the airspeed through 185+ very
quickly, pull the power back and float down onto the 45. Downwind
established at about 120mph, pull the power to idle abeam the numbers
and start feeding in flaps as I come through 85, full flaps on base and
capture 70mph and about 500fpm descent. Sweeping around to final and
holding about 70 gives a nice approach for this first one, everything is
lined up and working great as I setup the landing flair from memory of
my training in the RV6A (Thanks Mike Seager) I hold the pitch attitude
and wait, however I was used to the 6A which sits quite a bit lower than
the 9A, so next thing I know the wheels hit and I get a little bounce
out of it, holding attitude the speed bleeds off and the second landing!
is smooth YEA first flight is a success!
Post flight inspection did not uncover any leaks, or anything else that
needed working on. So whats a guy to do, but a second flight. While I
was orbiting on the second flight a friend from the EAA chapter came up
in his RV6 to do some formation inspection and video camera work. We had
a great 30 min of air to air shots and compared airspeeds etc. Great
fun!
All in all 1.5 hours TT today and my face is still hurting from the
famous RV grin!
As in those famous words, Keep pounding those rivets, because you are
going to love this plane!
Andy Karmy
RV9A Seattle WA
N169AK - Flying
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Douglas A. Fischer" <dfischer(at)iserv.net> |
| Subject: | Fw: Elevator Trim Indicator |
----- Original Message -----
From: Douglas A. Fischer
December 12, 2002 - February 24, 2003
RV9-Archive.digest.vol-ai