RV9-Archive.digest.vol-aj
February 24, 2003 - April 07, 2003
| Subject: | levator Trim Indicator |
First time posting to the list. Took delivery of Emp. kit #90706 Friday 21 Feb.
On to the question:
I was over last Saturday checking out Sam Benjamin's 9A and noticed the elevator
trim indicator on the panel. I want to have an indicator but also want manual
elevator trim. Does anyone know of a panel indicator that works with the manual
elevator trim? Thanks in advance for any info!
Doug Fischer
9A #90706
Jenison, MI
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Andy Karmy" <andy(at)karmy.com> |
| Subject: | Re: N169AK First Flight |
Aerosport 0-320-D2A
Sensenish 70CM79 79 inches of pitch (it's the one the Vans order form recomends
for the 9A)
- Andy
---------- Original Message ----------------------------------
>fairings. Can you say what your engine is and what diameter and pitch
>your Sensenich FP has? I am trying to decide on propeller
>specifications.
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Fw: Elevator Trim Indicator |
> I was over last Saturday checking out Sam Benjamin's 9A and noticed the
elevator trim indicator on the panel. I want to have an indicator but also
want manual elevator trim. Does anyone know of a panel indicator that works
with the manual elevator trim? Thanks in advance for any info!
Doug,
The Ray Allen Comapny has just what you need. See:
http://www.menzimeraircraft.com/products/indsens.html
You will need a position sensor, and an indicator. Then just find a place
where the travel of the trim system is equal to the travel of the sensor and
mount it.
Dale
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Andy Karmy" <andy(at)karmy.com> |
| Subject: | Flight pictures! |
Ok for those that asked about it, the pictures are up on my website of the first
flight of N169AK. WARNING if you use dialup it will take a long time to load.
http://www.karmy.com/rv9a
- Andy Karmy
RV9A Seattle WA
7.1hrs TT
________________________________________________________________________________
Anybody know of a good website or other info on avionic installation and/or
general info on what works at a reasonable price?? What is everybody
using??thanks
Dick Migas,#90558, wings done
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: (no subject) |
| From: | "Larry PERRYMAN" <larry.perryman(at)atofina.com> |
02/25/2003 06:00:49 PM,
Serialize complete at 02/25/2003 06:00:49 PM
Try http://groups.yahoo.com/group/ExperimentalAvionics
Good general info and some technical info there. Ask your questions and
folks will respond.
Regards,
Larry Perryman
N194DL
KDMIGAS(at)aol.com
02/25/2003 10:41 AM
Please respond to rv9-list
To: rv9-list(at)matronics.com
cc:
Subject: RV9-List: (no subject)
Anybody know of a good website or other info on avionic installation
and/or
general info on what works at a reasonable price?? What is everybody
using??thanks
Dick Migas,#90558, wings done
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Albert Gardner" <albert.gardner(at)worldnet.att.net> |
Well, there might be a downside. I signed on to Yahoo just for the RV9 list
and I have been inundated with spam-20 to 30 a day. Now I can't seem to
cancel. Many builders seem to be posting to both lists anyway so we don't
miss much.
Albert Gardner
9-0132
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Douglas A. Fischer" <dfischer(at)iserv.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Fw: Elevator Trim Indicator |
Thanks for the info, Dale! I knew Ray Allen sold the indicator for their
electric trim but didn't know they also had position sensors. They sell
three travel lengths: 0.5", 0.7", and 1.2". You wouldn't happen to know
the cable longitudinal travel from full-up to full-down would you? That
tidbit of info would determine the sensor needed. Thank again for the help!
Doug Fischer
Jenison, MI
RV-9A #90706
Empennage
----- Original Message -----
From: "Dale Larsen" <slickrock@been-there.com>
Subject: Re: RV9-List: Fw: Elevator Trim Indicator
>
> > I was over last Saturday checking out Sam Benjamin's 9A and noticed the
> elevator trim indicator on the panel. I want to have an indicator but
also
> want manual elevator trim. Does anyone know of a panel indicator that
works
> with the manual elevator trim? Thanks in advance for any info!
>
> Doug,
>
> The Ray Allen Comapny has just what you need. See:
> http://www.menzimeraircraft.com/products/indsens.html
>
> You will need a position sensor, and an indicator. Then just find a place
> where the travel of the trim system is equal to the travel of the sensor
and
> mount it.
>
> Dale
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Gary" <rv9er(at)3rivers.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Yahoo RV list |
I had the same trouble with anything "Yahoo".
Gary
----- Original Message -----
From: Albert Gardner
To: rv9-list(at)matronics.com
Sent: Tuesday, February 25, 2003 6:21 PM
Subject: RV9-List: Yahoo RV list
Well, there might be a downside. I signed on to Yahoo just for the RV9 list
and I have been inundated with spam-20 to 30 a day. Now I can't seem to
cancel. Many builders seem to be posting to both lists anyway so we don't
miss much.
Albert Gardner
9-0132
---
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Miller Robert <rmiller3(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Flight pictures! |
Great photos!!!
Congratulations...again.
Best,
Robert
Andy Karmy wrote:
>
> Ok for those that asked about it, the pictures are up on my website of the first
flight of N169AK. WARNING if you use dialup it will take a long time to load.
>
> http://www.karmy.com/rv9a
>
> - Andy Karmy
> RV9A Seattle WA
> 7.1hrs TT
>
________________________________________________________________________________
Yahoo will saturate you with spam - even if you turn it off in your Yahoo
that for your Yahoo info. Keep your main account safe from all that CRA().
Bob Hassel
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv9-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv9-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of Albert Gardner
Subject: RV9-List: Yahoo RV list
Well, there might be a downside. I signed on to Yahoo just for the RV9 list
and I have been inundated with spam-20 to 30 a day. Now I can't seem to
cancel. Many builders seem to be posting to both lists anyway so we don't
miss much.
Albert Gardner
9-0132
________________________________________________________________________________
Don't know what happened to my message but...basically, I give my yahoo
account my hotmail (freebie) email address to help keep my real email free
of the garbage!
Bob Hassel
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv9-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv9-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of Bob Hassel
Subject: RE: RV9-List: Yahoo RV list
Yahoo will saturate you with spam - even if you turn it off in your Yahoo
that for your Yahoo info. Keep your main account safe from all that CRA().
Bob Hassel
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv9-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv9-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of Albert Gardner
Subject: RV9-List: Yahoo RV list
Well, there might be a downside. I signed on to Yahoo just for the RV9 list
and I have been inundated with spam-20 to 30 a day. Now I can't seem to
cancel. Many builders seem to be posting to both lists anyway so we don't
miss much.
Albert Gardner
9-0132
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Rob W M Shipley" <Rob(at)RobsGlass.com> |
| Subject: | Fw: Elevator Trim Indicator |
The MAC product with a position sensor sounds as if it might also be a neat solution
for anyone looking for a flap posiyion indicator. Thoughts on this?
Rob
Rob W M Shipley
RV9A N919RV Fuselage.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Dave Nicholson" <dnick2(at)insightbb.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Fw: Elevator Trim Indicator |
That's what I used. Here's a picture.
Dave
90347
----- Original Message -----
From: "Rob W M Shipley" <Rob(at)RobsGlass.com>
Subject: RV9-List: Fw: Elevator Trim Indicator
>
> The MAC product with a position sensor sounds as if it might also be a
neat solution for anyone looking for a flap posiyion indicator. Thoughts on
this?
> Rob
> Rob W M Shipley
> RV9A N919RV Fuselage.
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Larry Perryman" <larry-perryman(at)txucom.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Yahoo RV list |
Bob,
I went on Yahoo and edited my user setup so that it does not send me e-mail
and I just log onto groups.yahoo.com when I want to read the list. I never
get spam.
You just have to put up with pop ups when you read it there.
Regards
Larry Perryman
----- Original Message -----
From: "Bob Hassel" <bob@hassel-usa.com>
Subject: RE: RV9-List: Yahoo RV list
>
> Don't know what happened to my message but...basically, I give my yahoo
> account my hotmail (freebie) email address to help keep my real email free
> of the garbage!
>
> Bob Hassel
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-rv9-list-server(at)matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-rv9-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of Bob Hassel
> To: rv9-list(at)matronics.com
> Subject: RE: RV9-List: Yahoo RV list
>
>
> Yahoo will saturate you with spam - even if you turn it off in your Yahoo
> that for your Yahoo info. Keep your main account safe from all that
CRA().
>
> Bob Hassel
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-rv9-list-server(at)matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-rv9-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of Albert Gardner
> To: rv9-list(at)matronics.com
> Subject: RV9-List: Yahoo RV list
>
>
>
>
> Well, there might be a downside. I signed on to Yahoo just for the RV9
list
> and I have been inundated with spam-20 to 30 a day. Now I can't seem to
> cancel. Many builders seem to be posting to both lists anyway so we don't
> miss much.
> Albert Gardner
> 9-0132
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Larry Perryman" <larry-perryman(at)txucom.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Fw: Elevator Trim Indicator |
That was it's primary mission from what I have read about it.
Regards
Larry Perryman
----- Original Message -----
From: "Rob W M Shipley" <Rob(at)RobsGlass.com>
Subject: RV9-List: Fw: Elevator Trim Indicator
>
> The MAC product with a position sensor sounds as if it might also be a
neat solution for anyone looking for a flap posiyion indicator. Thoughts on
this?
> Rob
> Rob W M Shipley
> RV9A N919RV Fuselage.
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
Thanks Larry I may try that!
Bob
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv9-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv9-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of Larry Perryman
Subject: Re: RV9-List: Yahoo RV list
Bob,
I went on Yahoo and edited my user setup so that it does not send me e-mail
and I just log onto groups.yahoo.com when I want to read the list. I never
get spam.
You just have to put up with pop ups when you read it there.
Regards
Larry Perryman
----- Original Message -----
From: "Bob Hassel" <bob@hassel-usa.com>
Subject: RE: RV9-List: Yahoo RV list
>
> Don't know what happened to my message but...basically, I give my yahoo
> account my hotmail (freebie) email address to help keep my real email free
> of the garbage!
>
> Bob Hassel
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-rv9-list-server(at)matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-rv9-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of Bob Hassel
> To: rv9-list(at)matronics.com
> Subject: RE: RV9-List: Yahoo RV list
>
>
> Yahoo will saturate you with spam - even if you turn it off in your Yahoo
> that for your Yahoo info. Keep your main account safe from all that
CRA().
>
> Bob Hassel
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-rv9-list-server(at)matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-rv9-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of Albert Gardner
> To: rv9-list(at)matronics.com
> Subject: RV9-List: Yahoo RV list
>
>
>
>
> Well, there might be a downside. I signed on to Yahoo just for the RV9
list
> and I have been inundated with spam-20 to 30 a day. Now I can't seem to
> cancel. Many builders seem to be posting to both lists anyway so we don't
> miss much.
> Albert Gardner
> 9-0132
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | John Oliveira <oliveira(at)frontiernet.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Fw: Elevator Trim Indicator |
Like your N number. Mine is N909RV
Waiting for the fuselage to arrive
Rob W M Shipley wrote:
>
>The MAC product with a position sensor sounds as if it might also be a neat solution
for anyone looking for a flap posiyion indicator. Thoughts on this?
>Rob
>Rob W M Shipley
>RV9A N919RV Fuselage.
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Douglas A. Fischer" <dfischer(at)iserv.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Fw: Elevator Trim Indicator |
Wasn't able to see the picture you mention (couldn't even see an
attachment). Does this picture show a manual elevator trim using the Ray
Allen (MAC) sensor? I know it works with electric, but I'd prefer manual.
I also noticed from Van's site that the elevator trim MAC servo travel is
1.2", so that part of my earlier message is answered. Thanks for all the
help out there!
Doug Fischer
Jenison, MI
RV-9A #90706
Empennage
----- Original Message -----
From: "Dave Nicholson" <dnick2(at)insightbb.com>
Subject: Re: RV9-List: Fw: Elevator Trim Indicator
>
> That's what I used. Here's a picture.
>
> Dave
> 90347
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Rob W M Shipley" <Rob(at)RobsGlass.com>
> To: "RV9-List Digest Server"
> Subject: RV9-List: Fw: Elevator Trim Indicator
>
>
> >
> > The MAC product with a position sensor sounds as if it might also be a
> neat solution for anyone looking for a flap posiyion indicator. Thoughts
on
> this?
> > Rob
> > Rob W M Shipley
> > RV9A N919RV Fuselage.
> >
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Nightingale Michael" <NightingaleMichaelV(at)JohnDeere.com> |
"'rv-list(at)matronics.com'"
| Subject: | Softcomm ATC-2P intercom |
Question:
Does anyone have experience with Softcomm intercoms especially with the
ATC-2P panel mounted 2 place intercom?
http://www.softcommheadsets.com/aviation-products/index.htm
Thanks
90259 Fuselage
Michael V. Nightingale
DEERE & Co. Computer Center
400 19th ST.
Moline, IL. 61265
pager 563-327-7891
nightingalemichael(at)johndeere.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Rob W M Shipley" <Rob(at)RobsGlass.com> |
This is shaping up to be nearly as good as what is a good primer - I can't believe
I just said that!!!
The following appeared tonight in the list
> Sorry, I don't understand what flying time has to do with anything! A Hobb's
meter is used for engine run time for proper service intervals.
and
>I beg to differ! On all of the aircraft I've owned, to include my RV, the tachometer
has a clock. My Hobbs is for my flight time only. If you have a tach
that has no clock, then you can use it for both functions. I've never seen
an A&P use my Hobbs for engine time. It's always the tach time.
Jim Sears in KY
Jim this appears to be a very widespread misuse of the Hobbs timers. Aircraft
$pruce, Hobbs themselves and nearly all the folks I know and fly with use the
common practice of switching their Hobbs meters with an oil pressure switch.
I'm sure you are a far more experienced pilot than I but almost all the assorted
Cessnas and Pipers I've flown had oil pressure switched Hobbs timers as have
the war birds and all the experimentals bar one.
Using 'the other side' of the oil pressure switch does seem to be a very simple
way to ensure accurate engine time.
This is most certainly not intended as a flame merely as some additional input.
Fly safe
Rob
Rob W M Shipley
RV9A N919RV Fuselage.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Roger Humphrey <RogerAH3(at)attbi.com> |
| Subject: | Quick delivery - the fun begins |
What lead time? Van's says my QB RV9a wings and body have shipped. I placed my
order
for these items and the empennage kit in January. The tail kit shipped immediately
and the paper that came with it indicated the rest would be delivered in September.
As I had feared, a little longer than the 5-7 months quoted on Van's website. I
was
disappointed but got used to the notion of having lots of time to tool up, build
the
empennage, go to Oshkosh, and make the many decisions required for the final phases.
.. Then came the call a couple of weeks ago .. "Some quickbuilds are available
now do
you want one?" Was saying yes the right thing to do?
Could I leave the fuselage in the box or is there a strong reason to get it out
on
arrival? I will be working in a small two car garage. Most of the tools (air
compressor, etc.) have been delivered but not set-up. Also, there are competing
uses
for the space (kitchen rebuild project wants to store tools and supplies and needs
to
do some work in the area) I am tempted to leave the parts outside in the crates
(under plastic tarps as it will rain here in northern California) for a couple
of
months.
- Roger Humphrey
________________________________________________________________________________
Roger-
Regarding storing the QB kit:
First of all, you won't BELIEVE the size of the boxes! They are huge and
unwieldy. You will save much space if you do uncrate the thing (carefully
inventory and store the components.)
Second, you WILL need to climb into the QB fuse and make airplane noises.
Sorry, it's just a fact.
Third, I'd be real skittish about storing it under a tarp. that high-moisture
environment won't be good for al that aluminum. If you need to store
off-site, better to get a storage locker somewhere and have it delivered
there, where it can sit in dry safety.
Good luck and have fun!
Ed Winne
RV9A
Jonestown PA
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | JVonDolen(at)aol.com |
Howdy Builders,
I've got my gear mounts in and fitting pretty well but haven't drilled them
yet. I would really love to relieve the holes in the mounts just a bit since
some of the bolts tend to want to go in a little cocked and therefore hard to
get in. But I do see that sloppy bolt holes would be a bad thing for landing
gear mounts!
There was a comment in the archives about enlarging the holes being commonly
done and I'd like your thoughts on this. I was thinking of passing, say, a
17/64th drill thru the AN4 holes and something similiar thru the larger mount
holes. Would this be a good idea, and is an extra 64th the right amount?
Responses appreciated.
John Von Dohlen
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Gary" <rv9er(at)3rivers.net> |
I assume you are talking about the holes for the bolts that go through the spar,
not the 5/16 ones that mount the gear leg.
Just remove some powder coat if necessary, but you shouldn't have to drill the
holes larger.
Gary
----- Original Message -----
From: JVonDolen(at)aol.com
To: rv9-list(at)matronics.com
Sent: Sunday, March 02, 2003 12:34 AM
Subject: RV9-List: Gear Mounts
Howdy Builders,
I've got my gear mounts in and fitting pretty well but haven't drilled them
yet. I would really love to relieve the holes in the mounts just a bit since
some of the bolts tend to want to go in a little cocked and therefore hard to
get in. But I do see that sloppy bolt holes would be a bad thing for landing
gear mounts!
There was a comment in the archives about enlarging the holes being commonly
done and I'd like your thoughts on this. I was thinking of passing, say, a
17/64th drill thru the AN4 holes and something similiar thru the larger mount
holes. Would this be a good idea, and is an extra 64th the right amount?
Responses appreciated.
John Von Dohlen
---
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Curt Hoffman" <choffman9(at)cinci.rr.com> |
I looked at Todd Houg's web site and got some of Todd's input on his solution to
the wing wiring dillemma and thought I would also check and see what others
have done.
The tooling hole that Vans has you enlarge to install the flexible conduit for
wing wiring comes out right at the bellcrank. It will require a severe bend to
avoid the aileron control tube end plus it interferes with the pitot tube plumbing
where the pitot exits the wing. Todd drilled holes on the top side of the
rib- obviously having more foresight than either me or Vans.
Anyone do anything else creative that avoids having to drill new holes now that
everything is riveted together?
Curt Hoffman
RV-9A wings done for now- working on tail
1968 Mustang 302 convertible
Piper Cherokee N5320W
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Andy Karmy" <andy(at)karmy.com> |
I simply put snap bushings into those enlarged tooling holes. When I got to the
belcrank area I used 1 Adel clamp to route the wires in a nice U shape around
the belcrank area. They stay nicely in place with clearance for everything.
- Andy
---------- Original Message ----------------------------------
From: "Curt Hoffman" <choffman9(at)cinci.rr.com>
Date: Sun, 2 Mar 2003 08:22:19 -0600
>
>I looked at Todd Houg's web site and got some of Todd's input on his solution
to the wing wiring dillemma and thought I would also check and see what others
have done.
>The tooling hole that Vans has you enlarge to install the flexible conduit for
wing wiring comes out right at the bellcrank. It will require a severe bend to
avoid the aileron control tube end plus it interferes with the pitot tube plumbing
where the pitot exits the wing. Todd drilled holes on the top side of the
rib- obviously having more foresight than either me or Vans.
>Anyone do anything else creative that avoids having to drill new holes now that
everything is riveted together?
>
>Curt Hoffman
>RV-9A wings done for now- working on tail
>1968 Mustang 302 convertible
>Piper Cherokee N5320W
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "steve dwyer" <stdwyer(at)dreamscape.com> |
| Subject: | Intersection fairings |
I've decided to fabricate the modified style intersection fairing discussed on
page 9 of the third issue, 2002 RVator. It looks like a good idea but I have several
questions, if anyone has done this can you help.
Van says they made it a one piece wrap around, if so wouldn't it be in the way
and prevent removal of the gear leg faring if we had to take it off? I doubt
the intersection farring would slide up out of the way
since the tapered leg farring increases in size. How did they get the modeling
clay out?
It also looks like they platenutted the four screws onto the wheel farring??
Help anyone!
Steve Dwyer 90219
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "John Harris" <johnharris(at)nc.rr.com> |
Curt,
I laid the conduit in the second lightening hole from the forward spar and
held in place with brackets made from 2 x 1.5 inch trim. Drill a hole
about 3/8 from one end and cut a slot to the other end that is tangent to
the sides of the hole. Slip the bracket onto the conduit at each rib and
rivet to the ribs. The conduit clears the pushrod to the aileron by about
two inches and is straight. Ill try to post a picture.
John
John M. Harris
RV9A Kit number 90022 Wings
N922RV Reserved
205 Kudrow Lane
Morrisville, NC 27560
(919)469-6009
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | DThomas773(at)aol.com |
Hi Curt,
I did the same conduit and routing as John. I made a cushion for the conduit
passing through each of the lightning holes by using a 1 inch piece of
plastic, split on one side and slipped over the edge of the hole. I held
them in place with tie wraps.
Dennis Thomas
fuselage
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Richard Tasker <retasker(at)optonline.net> |
| Subject: | Top Skin Riveting |
How do you rivet the last few rivets on the most inboard end of the skin
where the rear spar doubler is? There is essentially no room there for
any kind of bucking bar (at least any I have). I tried squeezing them
and that didn't work either. Help!!
It seems that it would have been easier to rivet the rear spar assembly
together after the skin was riveted to the rear spar...
Thanks,
Dick Tasker, 90573
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | John Oliveira <oliveira(at)frontiernet.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Top Skin Riveting |
I could not remember any problem so I went to the basement and checked
the completed wings. It jarred my memory. I used a pneumatic squeezer
with the long narrow jaws to do all of the rear spar upper skin rivets.
- No problem, the look just as neat as all the rest. I back riveted the
remainder of the upper wing skin using a large mushroom shaped polished
bucking bar from avery and the extended (about 7 inch long) back
riveting set to reach through from the bottom side. Came out very nice.
I wish I could say the same for the lower skins, especially around the
flap brackets. That was the real bucking bar and reach problem.
John Oliveira
90054 N909RV - waiting for my March 17th Fuselage shipment, finishing
the last flap.
Richard Tasker wrote:
>
>How do you rivet the last few rivets on the most inboard end of the skin
>where the rear spar doubler is? There is essentially no room there for
>any kind of bucking bar (at least any I have). I tried squeezing them
>and that didn't work either. Help!!
>
>It seems that it would have been easier to rivet the rear spar assembly
>together after the skin was riveted to the rear spar...
>
>Thanks,
>
>Dick Tasker, 90573
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Don Alexander <don_shirley(at)propjock.com> |
I'm getting ready to place my order for the wings and again there is a choice to
be made. This time its "just" the type of fuel sender, which as I understand
doesn't require one to put their manhood on the line like those decision like
which end of the plane gets the third wheel or what kind of primer you're using,
if any.
My understanding is the capacitance type sender works with ONE gauge (the lady
at Van's said it was $300) and is a bear to replace should it fail. On the plus
side it's very accurate (which I'm not really sure actually is a plus since
I don't put much reliance on the gauges of my Cherokee now and don't plan to
in the future - relying instead on a conservative estimate of burn rate and using
the gauges to detect large leaks). The other choice is a float gauge sender
which isn't as accurate but is cheap, reliable, and more easily repaired/replaced
should that be necessary.
Is there anything else I need to know before making this decision? Is there another
option that's better that Van's doesn't support?
Don
90702 -empennage
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Andy Karmy" <andy(at)karmy.com> |
Well it is very accurate... But the downside is you have to calibrate it. It takes
a bunch of fiddeling around with it to get it calibrated right (mine is still
a work in progress) but is very accurate once finished.
If it works when you first try it, I find it hard to imagine that it would break
in the future. There are no moving parts as it's simply 2 plates in the tank
bolted to the baffle ribs.
I do really like the EI fuel gauge in terms of presentation in the cockpit.
So as with all of these things it's up to what you want!
- Andy Karmy
RV9A Seattle WA
12hr TT!
---------- Original Message ----------------------------------
>My understanding is the capacitance type sender works with ONE gauge (the lady
at Van's said it was $300) and is a bear to replace should it fail. On the plus
side it's very accurate (which I'm not really sure
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Richard Tasker <retasker(at)optonline.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Top Skin Riveting |
I was afraid that someone would say that (squeezer with long narrow
jaws). I assume that you are referring to the one with the really thin
end that does not use a rivet set in that jaw. Of course, I don't have
that set of jaws for my pneumatic squeezer :-( .
How much did you use those jaws? Just on this or on lots of other places?
When you used the extended back riveting set with the mushroom bucking
bar, were you able to do any of it by yourself or did you have help for
all the rivets? I tried the extended set but didn't have very good
luck. I did not use the large bucking bar (just one of the typical flat
bars) so that may have been my problem.
Thanks,
Dick Tasker
John Oliveira wrote:
>
>I could not remember any problem so I went to the basement and checked
>the completed wings. It jarred my memory. I used a pneumatic squeezer
>with the long narrow jaws to do all of the rear spar upper skin rivets.
>- No problem, the look just as neat as all the rest. I back riveted the
>remainder of the upper wing skin using a large mushroom shaped polished
>bucking bar from avery and the extended (about 7 inch long) back
>riveting set to reach through from the bottom side. Came out very nice.
>
>I wish I could say the same for the lower skins, especially around the
>flap brackets. That was the real bucking bar and reach problem.
>
>John Oliveira
>90054 N909RV - waiting for my March 17th Fuselage shipment, finishing
>the last flap.
>
>
>Richard Tasker wrote:
>
>
>
>>
>>How do you rivet the last few rivets on the most inboard end of the skin
>>where the rear spar doubler is? There is essentially no room there for
>>any kind of bucking bar (at least any I have). I tried squeezing them
>>and that didn't work either. Help!!
>>
>>It seems that it would have been easier to rivet the rear spar assembly
>>together after the skin was riveted to the rear spar...
>>
>>Thanks,
>>
>>Dick Tasker, 90573
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Richard Tasker <retasker(at)optonline.net> |
I would say that it is not a bear to replace - impossible would be a
better word! On the other hand, there is not really anything to fail.
There are no moving parts and each tank assembly is just two plates
that mount to two tank ribs with a wire connecting them together and to
a BNC connector. If you attach the wires securely and pro-seal them so
they cannot flex, it should be just about bullet-proof.
I have installed the capacitive sender in my tanks and plan to build a
small capacitive to voltage converter that will mount at the wing root
where the connection comes out of the tank (I have it designed and
"electronically" prototyped already). This will allow me to use any
gauge or electronics that can use a 0-5V signal. The parts are not
expensive and I may get a PCB made. In fact, if there is interest, I
could get lots made and sell the assembly (or the PCB or a kit for those
who like soldering).
The capacitive gauge is much more accurate than the float and has much
less "dead" area. The float would hit bottom before the gas is gone and
hit the top before it is really full (although I believe there are stops
to prevent it from actually hitting anything).
On the other hand, if you do not plan to use the gauge for anything but
gross leaks there is no real reason to use one system over the other.
Dick Tasker, 90573
Don Alexander wrote:
>
>
>I'm getting ready to place my order for the wings and again there is a choice
to be made. This time its "just" the type of fuel sender, which as I understand
doesn't require one to put their manhood on the line like those decision like
which end of the plane gets the third wheel or what kind of primer you're using,
if any.
>
>My understanding is the capacitance type sender works with ONE gauge (the lady
at Van's said it was $300) and is a bear to replace should it fail. On the plus
side it's very accurate (which I'm not really sure actually is a plus since
I don't put much reliance on the gauges of my Cherokee now and don't plan to
in the future - relying instead on a conservative estimate of burn rate and using
the gauges to detect large leaks). The other choice is a float gauge sender
which isn't as accurate but is cheap, reliable, and more easily repaired/replaced
should that be necessary.
>
>Is there anything else I need to know before making this decision? Is there another
option that's better that Van's doesn't support?
>
>Don
>
>90702 -empennage
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Larry Perryman" <larry-perryman(at)txucom.net> |
Don,
Just one thing to say that made my mind up. $100.00 for floats and gages. It
would have been almost 3 grand to light up the set of microvision senders
after I decided against the Microvision panel.
Regards
Larry Perryman
PS At empty, you have about 1 gallon of gas left or less. They will hit the
bottom skin but clear the top. I fly by time anyway so not a problem. Three
hours and pit stop.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Don Alexander" <don_shirley(at)propjock.com>
Subject: RV9-List: Fuel sender
>
>
> I'm getting ready to place my order for the wings and again there is a
choice to be made. This time its "just" the type of fuel sender, which as I
understand doesn't require one to put their manhood on the line like those
decision like which end of the plane gets the third wheel or what kind of
primer you're using, if any.
>
> My understanding is the capacitance type sender works with ONE gauge (the
lady at Van's said it was $300) and is a bear to replace should it fail. On
the plus side it's very accurate (which I'm not really sure actually is a
plus since I don't put much reliance on the gauges of my Cherokee now and
don't plan to in the future - relying instead on a conservative estimate of
burn rate and using the gauges to detect large leaks). The other choice is
a float gauge sender which isn't as accurate but is cheap, reliable, and
more easily repaired/replaced should that be necessary.
>
> Is there anything else I need to know before making this decision? Is
there another option that's better that Van's doesn't support?
>
> Don
>
> 90702 -empennage
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
Anyone know what the V speeds for the RV9A are? Such as Maximum Structural
Cruising and Never Exceed speeds?
Thanks,
Ned
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Larry Perryman" <larry-perryman(at)txucom.net> |
Max cruse at gross is 195. If I remember, the Vne listed in the article in
the RVator last fall was a bit over 200.
If you can find the RVator that went over the 9 wing design, they cover some
of the high end numbers.
Stall solo with flaps is about 46mph, w/o flaps about 50. Very gentle. I was
doing slow flight with flaps at 48mph the other day.
Vfe is about 95 - 100mph
Regards
Larry
----- Original Message -----
From: <315(at)cox.net>
Subject: RV9-List: V Speeds
>
> Anyone know what the V speeds for the RV9A are? Such as Maximum
Structural
> Cruising and Never Exceed speeds?
> Thanks,
> Ned
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "guy" <gvotuc(at)direcway.com> |
Oh my...here we go again. (smile) =0D
=0D
=0D
=0D
-------Original Message-------=0D
=0D
From: rv9-list(at)matronics.com=0D
Date: Monday, March 03, 2003 21:48:01=0D
Subject: RV9-List: Fuel sender=0D
=0D
=0D
=0D
I'm getting ready to place my order for the wings and again there is a
choice to be made. This time its "just" the type of fuel sender, which as I
understand doesn't require one to put their manhood on the line like those
decision like which end of the plane gets the third wheel or what kind of
primer you're using, if any. =0D
=0D
My understanding is the capacitance type sender works with ONE gauge (the
lady at Van's said it was $300) and is a bear to replace should it fail. On
the plus side it's very accurate (which I'm not really sure actually is a
plus since I don't put much reliance on the gauges of my Cherokee now and
don't plan to in the future - relying instead on a conservative estimate of
burn rate and using the gauges to detect large leaks). The other choice is a
float gauge sender which isn't as accurate but is cheap, reliable, and more
easily repaired/replaced should that be necessary.=0D
=0D
Is there anything else I need to know before making this decision? Is there
another option that's better that Van's doesn't support?=0D
=0D
Don =0D
=0D
90702 -empennage=0D
=0D
=0D
=0D
=0D
=0D
=0D
=2E
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Top Skin Riveting |
If you have acess to a cherry max puller, try using #3214-2-4 cm rivets. I
got some from Aero Fasteners in socal, and they really work great in tight
spots Dick Migas Wings done
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Andy Karmy" <andy(at)karmy.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Performance Numbers |
WOW Bryan,
You want my completed test flight documentation... Well it's a bit early for all
of these numbers, but I can give you what I've found thus far... See below.
- Andy
---------- Original Message ----------------------------------
>If any of you with finished RV-9A's could post some actual numbers
First, mine is an Aerosport 0-320-D2A with Sensenish 79" cruise prop
>1. Can you actually fly the airplane level into the yellow, and if so
>at what altitude does this fall below the yellow? (75% power)
Yes, and don't know...
>2. Can you list expected True Airspeeds for various altitudes?
With only the main gear leg & wheel pants on (no nosegear hardware on yet) I was
seeing 180TAS at 8000ft. I was turning 2600RPM wide open. Groundspeed at the
time was nearing 190!
>3.What are actual fuel burns for various altitudes and power settings?
I have not done much leaning yet as I am just passing 10 hours TT on a new engine.
I am buring about 11.5 GPH most of the time.
>4.What is highest you have flown in your nine and how did it
>feel/respond to thin air?
8000 felt just like 1000 (except I was going faster and it felt slower!)
>5. What airspeed did you true out at at this highest altitude?
See above
>6.Have you flown with other RV's on trips, etc. and if so could you
>stay up with them?
Not yet, but from what I am seeing I will be out there with the 0-360 crowd and
keeping up on less gas!
>7.What approach speed do you find works best for you?
Assuming a light pattern...
I enter the 45 at 160-180, by downwind slow to 120, abeam the numbers pull the
power all the way off and slow to 70, drop half flaps. Turn base at 70, drop full
flaps, turn final and slow to 65, poweroff with plenty of speed to flair a
beautiful landing! You could go slower than this as you get more comfortable
with it. Stall is 45mph with full flaps and 55mph clean.
>Thanks. The info we get on the factory website is great and from what
>all the builders who have finished and are flying say their planes
>meet Van's claims. I guess what has me curious is that if the factory
>sees 187 true at 8000' (I'm making this up, but sounds close) what is
>it at 10,000, 12,000, 4,000, etc.
I think all of the factory published numbers are fairly easy to attain with the
0-320 setup.
>yes I should spend more time building and less time worrying about
>speed, but the curiosity has me
I remember it well wishing for more data!
Most of my 10 hours thus far are with no wheel pants or gear leg fairings. I was
seeing 160mph nice and steady at 2450ish RPM. That's at 3000ft and below.
- Andy Karmy
RV9A Seattle WA
12 hours and counting...
I sure wish the weather would clear up again
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | John Oliveira <oliveira(at)frontiernet.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Top Skin Riveting |
I use the long thin jaw extensively. For example, the whole top skin to
spar could be squeezed from the rear using it. It reached across the
part of skin sticking out that became the gap filler. also many other
places. Used to rivet the rear tank baffles as well.
As far as the back riveting goes. I used help there. Used rivet tape
to keep marks on skin to minimum. Second person held the mushroom
against the wing while I back riveted. Occasionally polish the head of
the mushroom to keep it smooth.
John Oliveira
Richard Tasker wrote:
>
>I was afraid that someone would say that (squeezer with long narrow
>jaws). I assume that you are referring to the one with the really thin
>end that does not use a rivet set in that jaw. Of course, I don't have
>that set of jaws for my pneumatic squeezer :-( .
>
>How much did you use those jaws? Just on this or on lots of other places?
>
>When you used the extended back riveting set with the mushroom bucking
>bar, were you able to do any of it by yourself or did you have help for
>all the rivets? I tried the extended set but didn't have very good
>luck. I did not use the large bucking bar (just one of the typical flat
>bars) so that may have been my problem.
>
>Thanks,
>
>Dick Tasker
>
>John Oliveira wrote:
>
>>
>>I could not remember any problem so I went to the basement and checked
>>the completed wings. It jarred my memory. I used a pneumatic squeezer
>>with the long narrow jaws to do all of the rear spar upper skin rivets.
>>- No problem, the look just as neat as all the rest. I back riveted the
>>remainder of the upper wing skin using a large mushroom shaped polished
>>bucking bar from avery and the extended (about 7 inch long) back
>>riveting set to reach through from the bottom side. Came out very nice.
>>
>>I wish I could say the same for the lower skins, especially around the
>>flap brackets. That was the real bucking bar and reach problem.
>>
>>John Oliveira
>>90054 N909RV - waiting for my March 17th Fuselage shipment, finishing
>>the last flap.
>>
>>
>>Richard Tasker wrote:
>>
>>
>>
>>>
>>>How do you rivet the last few rivets on the most inboard end of the skin
>>>where the rear spar doubler is? There is essentially no room there for
>>>any kind of bucking bar (at least any I have). I tried squeezing them
>>>and that didn't work either. Help!!
>>>
>>>It seems that it would have been easier to rivet the rear spar assembly
>>>together after the skin was riveted to the rear spar...
>>>
>>>Thanks,
>>>
>>>Dick Tasker, 90573
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Gary" <rv9er(at)3rivers.net> |
I agree with Larry, and so does Van's. The SW senders and Van's inexpensive gages
are very accurate near the low end of the capacity, where you need it (if
you need it). They are consistent, reasonably priced, reliable, and repairable
if it should ever be necesary. They will not register the top few gallons in
each tank. If you want to know if it is topped off, look in the filler cap.
Of course, this debate is NEARLY as intense as primers and nose/tail draggers.
And of course, if I had spent a wheelbarrow load of cash on the other kind,
I would defend and recommend them to the end.
Gary
----- Original Message -----
From: Larry Perryman
To: rv9-list(at)matronics.com
Sent: Monday, March 03, 2003 6:55 PM
Subject: Re: RV9-List: Fuel sender
Don,
Just one thing to say that made my mind up. $100.00 for floats and gages. It
would have been almost 3 grand to light up the set of microvision senders
after I decided against the Microvision panel.
Regards
Larry Perryman
PS At empty, you have about 1 gallon of gas left or less. They will hit the
bottom skin but clear the top. I fly by time anyway so not a problem. Three
hours and pit stop.
---
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Arthur Nation <anation(at)eskimo.com> |
Hi to the list,
My first message.
I am thinking of the RV9-A and looking for a build in the state of
Washington/Oregon that I could visit..
I am located near Tacoma, WA.
Thanks,
Arthur
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Albert Gardner" <albert.gardner(at)worldnet.att.net> |
I had some problems calibrating the EI fuel gage in that the sensor numbers
for an empty tank were quite high. (If you don't have an EI FL2 gage this
probably doesn't make any sense.) I could still get reading across the range
but there were only about 15-20 sensor steps per gallon. I called EI and
they said to make sure to use a minimum amount of wire between the BNC tank
connector and the little conversion module (2 wires in, 3 wires out to the
gage) because that will likely throw the calibration procedure off.
Albert Gardner
N872RV
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Larry PERRYMAN" <larry.perryman(at)atofina.com> |
03/05/2003 12:04:47 AM,
Serialize complete at 03/05/2003 12:04:47 AM
Check out the RV White Pages from the Van's web site.
here is a list of Washington State:
USA | Washington | Anacortes | King, Monte | 360.588.1205 | 6A | FL |
N693KM | 76S
USA | Washington | Auburn | Karmy, Andy | 253.333.6695 | 9A | FS | N169AK
| K1S0
USA | Washington | Auburn | Potter, Lee | 253.941.9578 | 7 | EM | N1224K |
S50
USA | Washington | Battle Ground | Waldal, Art | 360.687.9163 | 6A | WG,,
USA | Washington | Bellevue | James,Larry | 206.940.6912 | 4 | FS |
N770TT,
USA | Washington | Bothell | Hutton,Bill/JoAnne | 425.489.1416 | 6AQB | FL
| N653RV | KAWO
USA | Washington | Bremerton | Diehl,Don | 360.377.8191 | 4 | FL | N28EW,
USA | Washington | Bremerton | Shannon,Kevin | 360.698.2229 | 9A | FS,,
USA | Washington | Cheney | Adams, Dan | 509.235.2835 | 8 | FS,,
USA | Washington | Covington | Stocker, Lester | 253.638.8645 | 7A | EM,,
USA | Washington | Enumclaw | Migas, Rich | 360.825.4014 | 9A | FS,,
USA | Washington | Everett | Rainwater,Greg | 425.353.4342 | 4 | FL |
N818GR | KAWO
USA | Washington | Everett | Rudberg, Todd | 425.290.7526 | 8 | WG |
N232TB | KS43
USA | Washington | Everett | Thomas, Dan | 425.353.2659 | 6 | FL | N43DT |
KAWO
USA | Washington | Farmington | Schoepflin,Bill | 509.287.2741 | 8QB | FK
| N8YS,
USA | Washington | Gig Harbor | Baldwin,Scott/Penny | 253.265.6405 | 6QB |
RE | N728P | TIW
USA | Washington | Gig Harbor | Calhoon,Mike | 253.858.4427 | 6 | WG |
N18MC,
USA | Washington | Gig Harbor | Casper,Steve | 253.853.7447 | 4 | FL |
N20SC | TIW
USA | Washington | Kent | Nicholas,Kim | 253.859.1058 | 9A | WG,,
USA | Washington | Lake Forest Park | Watson,Terry | 206.365.2657 | 8A |
WG,,
USA | Washington | Lakewood | Klawitter,Gordy | 253.582.4971 | 7 | FS |
N5878G,
USA | Washington | Longview | Hamilton, Keith | 360.636.3269 | 6A | FL |
N225RC | KKLS
USA | Washington | Lummi Island | Day, William | 360.758.2177 | 6A | FL |
N931RG | KBLI
USA | Washington | Lynden | Rathbun,Rick | 360.354.2968 | 8 | FS,,
USA | Washington | Marysville | Luster,Richard | 360.659.0505 | 9A | FS |
N909RL | KAWO
USA | Washington | Marysville | Nice,James | 360.659.7863 | 6A | WG,,AWO
USA | Washington | Monroe | Bentley, Dick | 360.794.8808 | 4 | FL | N81RB
| KAWO
USA | Washington | Oak Harbor | Peckenpaugh, Kent | 350.279.9845 | 6 |
WG,,
USA | Washington | Puyallup | Atkins, David/Kathy | 253.848.7776 | 6 | FL
| N6880 | 1S0
USA | Washington | Redmond | Burton,Dave | 425.868.7745 | 6 | WG,,
USA | Washington | Redmond | Drake,Marc | 425.882.1156 | 6 | FL | N3135G |
PAE
USA | Washington | Sammamish | Karie,Daniel | 425.427.2253 | 7AQB | EM |
N826RV | S50
USA | Washington | Seattle | Bass, Chuck | 425.820.5557 | 4 | FL | N88BN |
KPAE
USA | Washington | Seattle | Blank,Steven | 360.808.2435 | 6A | EM,,
USA | Washington | Seattle | Vasey,Keith | 206.935.4433 | 8QB | WG,,KBFI
USA | Washington | Spokane | Furrie, Ethan | 509.475.8472 | 7 | EM,,
USA | Washington | Spokane | Swinkels, Tim | 509.467.4629 | 8 | FK |
N128KM | KSFF
USA | Washington | Spokane | Ward,Dave | 509.328.6585 | 9A | EM | N3533W,
USA | Washington | Tacoma | Knepper,Harold | 253.588.2573 | 6AQB | WG,,
USA | Washington | Vancouver | Adams,Mike | 360.892.1299 | 4 | FS,,
USA | Washington | Vancouver | Lervold,Randy | 360.254.9291 | 8 | FK |
N558RL | KVUO
USA | Washington | Vancouver | McNamara, Jim | 360.694.8305 | 8 | EM,,
USA | Washington | Vancouver | Wotring,Dale | 360.887.3196 | 6A | RE |
N244DW | KVUO
Hope this will give you a start.
Regards,
Larry Perryman
RV9A N194DL Flying
(281) 227-5550
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: RV9-List Digest: 1 Msgs - 03/05/03 |
Arthur-
Not sure what you mean by firewall hard-wired.
The QB fuse comes with the firewall installed and riveted, without any
penetrations for wiring, throttle cables, heat, etc. Those things are all
planned and executed by the builder. Thje QB fuse doesn't have the top skins
installed over the front, so access to the whole area behind the firewall is
wide open.
Ed Winne
RV9A
Jonestown PA
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | RV9 <rv9(at)charter.net> |
| Subject: | Wiring Van's Fuel Gauges |
I'm working on getting my left fuel tank ready for sealing. I've
bought and received the SW senders and a pair of the Van's fuel
gauges, and would like to test the senders with the gauges as suggested
in the builders manual. I cannot seem to locate any information on the proper
wiring connections to the gauge. There are three terminals labeled "I', "S",
and "G".
Steve Mottin
Granbury, TX
RV-9A (wings)
N609RV (Reserved)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Steve Sampson" <SSampson.SLN21(at)london.edu> |
| Subject: | Aeroflash Strobe Unit |
Has anyone looked at using the considerably cheaper aeroflash strobe/tail
light part #153-0011 in place of the similar Whelen unit? I am trying to
check the dimensions are such that they will fit the fibreglass rudder
bottom. I assume the dimensions are the same as the Whelen unit but am
having trouble confirming this. Thanks, Steve.
#90360
UK
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Aeroflash Strobe Unit |
<200303061925.h26JPJu32636(at)matronics.com>
| From: | "Patrick E. Moseley" <moseley(at)moseley.com> |
If you go to:
http://www.aeroflash.com/plane.html#tailposition
There is a link to the "Specifications, Wiring & Spare Parts Guide" that has
the dimensions for the lamp assembly:
http://www.aeroflash.com/156-0029.pdf
Here are the dimensions cut and pasted from the above document:
Dimensions for the Lamp Assembly:
Housing .................1-5/16 Dia.
Flange ...................2-3/16 Dia.
Height....................2-1/4 (from bottom of housing to top of dome)
Patrick Moseley
Tucson, AZ
In message <200303061925.h26JPJu32636(at)matronics.com>, on 6-Mar-2003,
"Steve Sampson" writes:
>
> Has anyone looked at using the considerably cheaper aeroflash strobe/tail
> light part #153-0011 in place of the similar Whelen unit? I am trying to
> check the dimensions are such that they will fit the fibreglass rudder
> bottom. I assume the dimensions are the same as the Whelen unit but am
> having trouble confirming this. Thanks, Steve.
> #90360
> UK
>
>
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Steve Sampson" <SSampson.SLN21(at)london.edu> |
| Subject: | Aeroflash Strobe Unit <200303061925.h26JPJu32636(at)matronics.com> |
Patrick - thanks, yes I saw that, but since the base unit is not circular I
am not sure what that flange dia means. Why they don't put a simple drawing
beats me! Steve.
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv9-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv9-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Patrick E.
Moseley
Subject: Re: RV9-List: Aeroflash Strobe Unit
<200303061925.h26JPJu32636(at)matronics.com>
If you go to:
http://www.aeroflash.com/plane.html#tailposition
There is a link to the "Specifications, Wiring & Spare Parts Guide" that has
the dimensions for the lamp assembly:
http://www.aeroflash.com/156-0029.pdf
Here are the dimensions cut and pasted from the above document:
Dimensions for the Lamp Assembly:
Housing .................1-5/16 Dia.
Flange ...................2-3/16 Dia.
Height....................2-1/4 (from bottom of housing to top of dome)
Patrick Moseley
Tucson, AZ
In message <200303061925.h26JPJu32636(at)matronics.com>, on 6-Mar-2003,
"Steve Sampson" writes:
>
> Has anyone looked at using the considerably cheaper aeroflash strobe/tail
> light part #153-0011 in place of the similar Whelen unit? I am trying to
> check the dimensions are such that they will fit the fibreglass rudder
> bottom. I assume the dimensions are the same as the Whelen unit but am
> having trouble confirming this. Thanks, Steve.
> #90360
> UK
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Aeroflash Strobe Unit <200303061925.h26JPJu32636(at)matronics.com> |
| From: | "Larry PERRYMAN" <larry.perryman(at)atofina.com> |
03/07/2003 12:12:54 AM,
Serialize complete at 03/07/2003 12:12:54 AM
Steve,
The distance tip to tip across the outside of the housing is 2 3/16 inch.
The hole necessary for the body to go back into the rudder fairing is 1
5/16 inch. I suspect that you will find that this fits.
One of the best directions I have seen for installing is to take the unit
and coat it with a mold release compound or a good car wax. Remove enough
of the opening in the rudder fairing to allow the unit to go back into the
rudder fairing to the position you want. Coat the mounting screws well.
Tape the unit in place and fill the end of the fairing with a mix of epoxy
and flox or microballoons so that it holds the unit in place. The mounting
screws should be buried in the fill also. When it cures, remove and clean
the light unit. You will now have a nice tight socket for the light and
the mounting screws will thread into the epoxy to hold it.
I sure wish I had seen this method before I installed mine. I was trying
to mount nuts inside to hold the unit in.
You will sure find out if you have it well covered with wax when you try
to remove the light. If you did a poor job, the socket may be permanently
mounted for you. Another release agent that you can nick from your wife's
kitchen is some clear food wrap. It works to put it around the outside of
an item and then put epoxy over it. It will generally pull loose from
epoxy.
Probably the best is to find someone that is building a fiberglass plane.
They should have the clear plastic that is used to vacuum bag components.
Epoxy will not stick to it either. Talk them out of a piece big enough to
wrap the light up in.
Hope this helps
Regards,
Larry Perryman
"Steve Sampson"
Sent by: owner-rv9-list-server(at)matronics.com
03/06/2003 10:33 AM
Please respond to rv9-list
To:
cc:
Subject: RE: RV9-List: Aeroflash Strobe Unit
<200303061925.h26JPJu32636(at)matronics.com>
Patrick - thanks, yes I saw that, but since the base unit is not circular
I
am not sure what that flange dia means. Why they don't put a simple
drawing
beats me! Steve.
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv9-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv9-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Patrick E.
Moseley
Subject: Re: RV9-List: Aeroflash Strobe Unit
<200303061925.h26JPJu32636(at)matronics.com>
If you go to:
http://www.aeroflash.com/plane.html#tailposition
There is a link to the "Specifications, Wiring & Spare Parts Guide" that
has
the dimensions for the lamp assembly:
http://www.aeroflash.com/156-0029.pdf
Here are the dimensions cut and pasted from the above document:
Dimensions for the Lamp Assembly:
Housing .................1-5/16 Dia.
Flange ...................2-3/16 Dia.
Height....................2-1/4 (from bottom of housing to top of dome)
Patrick Moseley
Tucson, AZ
In message <200303061925.h26JPJu32636(at)matronics.com>, on 6-Mar-2003,
"Steve Sampson" writes:
>
> Has anyone looked at using the considerably cheaper aeroflash
strobe/tail
> light part #153-0011 in place of the similar Whelen unit? I am trying to
> check the dimensions are such that they will fit the fibreglass rudder
> bottom. I assume the dimensions are the same as the Whelen unit but am
> having trouble confirming this. Thanks, Steve.
> #90360
> UK
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Gary" <rv9er(at)3rivers.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Wiring Van's Fuel Gauges |
Ignition (B+), Sender, and Ground.
Gary
----- Original Message -----
From: RV9
To: rv9-list(at)matronics.com
Sent: Thursday, March 06, 2003 10:27 AM
Subject: RV9-List: Wiring Van's Fuel Gauges
I'm working on getting my left fuel tank ready for sealing. I've
bought and received the SW senders and a pair of the Van's fuel
gauges, and would like to test the senders with the gauges as suggested
in the builders manual. I cannot seem to locate any information on the proper
wiring connections to the gauge. There are three terminals labeled "I', "S",
and "G".
Steve Mottin
Granbury, TX
RV-9A (wings)
N609RV (Reserved)
---
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Gozewijn Vlasblom" <vlasblom(at)ripnet.com> |
Hi Folks,
I have just finished installing the electric flap actuator assembly.
I started off with the hardware provided by Van's and installed it according
instructions.
When I tried it out the motor kept on running although the actuator arm had
reached the end of its travel.
I did not like that. What followed was two weeks of puzzling, designing,
redesigning. countless errors and mistakes and finely a product I was happy
with. Building airplanes certainly is a learning experience.
The micro switches come from Fletchair Inc.in Houston Tx tel 713 641 2023.
They are used in a Grumman Tiger, for the electric flaps. No.: V3L-30D9 or
4604-1100 US$ 9.19/pc
I include a few pictures and a wiring diagram. Remember that drawing wiring
diagrams was not part of my education.
One more improvement could be considered: When you want to raise the flaps
for touch and goes, you may not want to spent the required 6 sec to do the
job. The Grumman tiger switch works as follows: when you put it in the up
position, you do not have to hold the switch. It will proceed until the
flaps are up completely. Switch No.: 6GM5B-50X123 a little pricier at US$
67.12
There is very little room between the control arm of the flap actuator
assembly and the elevator controll rod, but it is just enough.
The wiring diagram does not give indication re polarity and which switch
controls up movement and which one down movement. That will have to be done
emperically.
Have fun,
Goz Vlasblom 90171
vlasblom(at)ripnet.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "David Schaefer" <dschaefer1(at)kc.rr.com> |
Having owned and flown a Tiger for several years the only caveat is that
the Grumman flap switches are infamous for springing all way back up if
you just let go of them ... leaving you very fast with no flaps on
final! You just can't figure why you're still going so fast till you
look at the wing and see the flaps up!
Regards,
David W. Schaefer
RV6-A
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv9-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv9-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Gozewijn
Vlasblom
Subject: RV9-List: flap actuator
Hi Folks,
I have just finished installing the electric flap actuator assembly.
I started off with the hardware provided by Van's and installed it
according
instructions.
When I tried it out the motor kept on running although the actuator arm
had
reached the end of its travel.
I did not like that. What followed was two weeks of puzzling, designing,
redesigning. countless errors and mistakes and finely a product I was
happy
with. Building airplanes certainly is a learning experience.
The micro switches come from Fletchair Inc.in Houston Tx tel 713 641
2023.
They are used in a Grumman Tiger, for the electric flaps. No.: V3L-30D9
or
4604-1100 US$ 9.19/pc
I include a few pictures and a wiring diagram. Remember that drawing
wiring
diagrams was not part of my education.
One more improvement could be considered: When you want to raise the
flaps
for touch and goes, you may not want to spent the required 6 sec to do
the
job. The Grumman tiger switch works as follows: when you put it in the
up
position, you do not have to hold the switch. It will proceed until the
flaps are up completely. Switch No.: 6GM5B-50X123 a little pricier at
US$
67.12
There is very little room between the control arm of the flap actuator
assembly and the elevator controll rod, but it is just enough.
The wiring diagram does not give indication re polarity and which switch
controls up movement and which one down movement. That will have to be
done
emperically.
Have fun,
Goz Vlasblom 90171
vlasblom(at)ripnet.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "guy" <gvotuc(at)direcway.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Aeroflash Strobe Unit |
Someone mentioned a while back that a lot of the "other" strobes out there
didn't meet the FAA requirements for night because of the Lumens ( or lack
of ) I never verified this I just spent the bucks....=0D
=0D
guy=0D
=0D
=0D
-------Original Message-------=0D
=0D
From: rv9-list(at)matronics.com=0D
Date: Thursday, March 06, 2003 14:43:34=0D
Subject: RV9-List: Aeroflash Strobe Unit=0D
=0D
=0D
Has anyone looked at using the considerably cheaper aeroflash strobe/tail=0D
light part #153-0011 in place of the similar Whelen unit? I am trying to=0D
check the dimensions are such that they will fit the fibreglass rudder=0D
bottom. I assume the dimensions are the same as the Whelen unit but am=0D
having trouble confirming this. Thanks, Steve.=0D
#90360=0D
UK=0D
=0D
=0D
=0D
=0D
=0D
=0D
=2E
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Matthew Brandes <mbrandes(at)irr.com> |
| Subject: | RE:Aeroflash Strobe Unit |
I emailed AeroFlash and asked them pricing and about meeting FAA night
requirements for their Nav/Strobe and Pos/Strobe assemblies.
1) What is the cost of the 156-0039 Nav/Strobe assembly?
$399.00 ea USD
2) What is the cost of the 156-0029 Tail Position/Strobe assembly?
$288.75 ea USD
3) Do your units meet FAA requirements for night flight? (enough lumens?)
"our units put out 10 joules and this is sufficient for experimental
aircraft."
There ya have it. According to the Whelen site "These anti-collision systems
must produce a minimum of 400 effective candela in aviation". Can anyone
convert joules to candela??
Matthew
RV-9A Emp.
N523RV Rsvd.
> From: "Steve Sampson" <SSampson.SLN21(at)london.edu>
> Subject: RV9-List: Aeroflash Strobe Unit
>
> -->
>
> Has anyone looked at using the considerably cheaper aeroflash
> strobe/tail light part #153-0011 in place of the similar
> Whelen unit? I am trying to check the dimensions are such
> that they will fit the fibreglass rudder bottom. I assume the
> dimensions are the same as the Whelen unit but am having
> trouble confirming this. Thanks, Steve. #90360 UK
________________________________________________________________________________
Just ordered my RV9A Empennage and am tooling up. Ahybody have a
recommendation for the type of dies they are using on the emp.? That is,
regular vs spring back vs tank dies?
Looking forward to becoming active in this great group.
Thanks,
Ned
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | DThomas773(at)aol.com |
Hi Ned,
Congratulations on your decision!
Tank dies are just for construction of the fuel tanks where you have a layer
of proseal between the skins. There you need a deeper dimple otherwise the
rivets heads will stick up a bit. And you will need them in that case alone.
If used on othere parts of the airplane you will get a too deep dimple that
the rivet head will not quite fill. Guess how I know that.
The spring back dies are what you need for all other applications. The
regular dies, I'm told, are the old fashioned kind that will not readily pop
out after the dimple is made.
I'm sure by days end you will have multiple posts telling you all you need to
know.
I bought a tool kit from Cleveland Tool
(http://www5.mailordercentral.com/clevtool/Home.asp )
and was quite satisfied with them. They were also a good source tech
support, also being RV builders themselves.
Good LUck and Happy Building.
Dennis Thomas
RV-9 , # 90164
fuselage
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Larry PERRYMAN" <larry.perryman(at)atofina.com> |
03/07/2003 05:27:30 PM,
Serialize complete at 03/07/2003 05:27:30 PM
Ned,
I really like the dies from Cleveland. Good quality and they stand behind
the product. You want the spring back dies. You will want to get the tank
and screw dies when you get to the wing. They have a different set just
for the specific application.
Also take a look at the squeezer "The Main Squeeze" that they sell. It is
a few bucks more but after using the Tatco type on my plane, I would have
loved the new one.
Regards,
Larry Perryman
N194DL Flying
<315(at)cox.net>
Sent by: owner-rv9-list-server(at)matronics.com
03/07/2003 10:10 AM
Please respond to rv9-list
To:
cc:
Subject: RV9-List: Dimple Dies
Just ordered my RV9A Empennage and am tooling up. Ahybody have a
recommendation for the type of dies they are using on the emp.? That is,
regular vs spring back vs tank dies?
Looking forward to becoming active in this great group.
Thanks,
Ned
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "guy" <gvotuc(at)direcway.com> |
| Subject: | Re: RE:Aeroflash Strobe Unit |
Yea...anything is "sufficient" for experimental aircraft. I don't think the
regs seperate US for that purpose.. You either see the light or you don't=2E I
would re-phrase the question to specific night requirement in the regs.=0D
=0D
=0D
-------Original Message-------=0D
=0D
From: rv9-list(at)matronics.com=0D
Date: Friday, March 07, 2003 10:36:59=0D
Subject: RV9-List: RE:Aeroflash Strobe Unit=0D
=0D
=0D
I emailed AeroFlash and asked them pricing and about meeting FAA night=0D
requirements for their Nav/Strobe and Pos/Strobe assemblies.=0D
=0D
1) What is the cost of the 156-0039 Nav/Strobe assembly?=0D
$399.00 ea USD=0D
=0D
2) What is the cost of the 156-0029 Tail Position/Strobe assembly?=0D
$288.75 ea USD=0D
=0D
3) Do your units meet FAA requirements for night flight? (enough lumens?)=0D
"our units put out 10 joules and this is sufficient for experimental=0D
aircraft."=0D
=0D
There ya have it. According to the Whelen site "These anti-collision systems=0D
must produce a minimum of 400 effective candela in aviation". Can anyone=0D
convert joules to candela??=0D
=0D
=0D
Matthew=0D
RV-9A Emp.=0D
N523RV Rsvd.=0D
=0D
=0D
> From: "Steve Sampson" <SSampson.SLN21(at)london.edu>=0D
> Subject: RV9-List: Aeroflash Strobe Unit=0D
> =0D
> --> =0D
> =0D
> Has anyone looked at using the considerably cheaper aeroflash =0D
> strobe/tail light part #153-0011 in place of the similar =0D
> Whelen unit? I am trying to check the dimensions are such =0D
> that they will fit the fibreglass rudder bottom. I assume the =0D
> dimensions are the same as the Whelen unit but am having =0D
> trouble confirming this. Thanks, Steve. #90360 UK=0D
=0D
=0D
=0D
=0D
=0D
=0D
=2E
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Leland <Federigo(at)pacbell.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Aeroflash Strobe Unit |
Steve, generally the Aeroflash system puts out less energy per flash, so
a Whelan power supply may overdrive the Aeroflash flashlamps. I bought
an X-PAK 904 strobe power supply, which has specifications comparable to
Whelan's, is cheaper and has a longer warranty. I have operated it with
the Whelan lamps, but only in the garage.
Leland in Pleasanton
Installing the empenage fairing, which fits like an OJ glove.
PS: Buy Van's gascolator bracket (listed in the fireward-forward kit)
before drilling holes for mounting the gascolator to the firewall. This
bracket is not shown on the fuse drawings
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Steve Sampson" <SSampson.SLN21(at)london.edu> |
| Subject: | Aeroflash Strobe Unit <200303061925.h26JPJu32636(at)matronics.com> |
Larry - thanks for that , really helpful. You would not happen to know the
'short' diameter? If tip to tip is the 2 3/16" diameter the 'short' one is
at right angles to it. I just want to be sure it is not larger than the face
on VANS moulding.
Thanks, Steve.
PS Have you used the aeroflash unit?
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv9-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv9-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Larry PERRYMAN
Subject: RE: RV9-List: Aeroflash Strobe Unit
<200303061925.h26JPJu32636(at)matronics.com>
Steve,
The distance tip to tip across the outside of the housing is 2 3/16 inch.
The hole necessary for the body to go back into the rudder fairing is 1
5/16 inch. I suspect that you will find that this fits.
One of the best directions I have seen for installing is to take the unit
and coat it with a mold release compound or a good car wax. Remove enough
of the opening in the rudder fairing to allow the unit to go back into the
rudder fairing to the position you want. Coat the mounting screws well.
Tape the unit in place and fill the end of the fairing with a mix of epoxy
and flox or microballoons so that it holds the unit in place. The mounting
screws should be buried in the fill also. When it cures, remove and clean
the light unit. You will now have a nice tight socket for the light and
the mounting screws will thread into the epoxy to hold it.
I sure wish I had seen this method before I installed mine. I was trying
to mount nuts inside to hold the unit in.
You will sure find out if you have it well covered with wax when you try
to remove the light. If you did a poor job, the socket may be permanently
mounted for you. Another release agent that you can nick from your wife's
kitchen is some clear food wrap. It works to put it around the outside of
an item and then put epoxy over it. It will generally pull loose from
epoxy.
Probably the best is to find someone that is building a fiberglass plane.
They should have the clear plastic that is used to vacuum bag components.
Epoxy will not stick to it either. Talk them out of a piece big enough to
wrap the light up in.
Hope this helps
Regards,
Larry Perryman
"Steve Sampson"
Sent by: owner-rv9-list-server(at)matronics.com
03/06/2003 10:33 AM
Please respond to rv9-list
To:
cc:
Subject: RE: RV9-List: Aeroflash Strobe Unit
<200303061925.h26JPJu32636(at)matronics.com>
Patrick - thanks, yes I saw that, but since the base unit is not circular
I
am not sure what that flange dia means. Why they don't put a simple
drawing
beats me! Steve.
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv9-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv9-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Patrick E.
Moseley
Subject: Re: RV9-List: Aeroflash Strobe Unit
<200303061925.h26JPJu32636(at)matronics.com>
If you go to:
http://www.aeroflash.com/plane.html#tailposition
There is a link to the "Specifications, Wiring & Spare Parts Guide" that
has
the dimensions for the lamp assembly:
http://www.aeroflash.com/156-0029.pdf
Here are the dimensions cut and pasted from the above document:
Dimensions for the Lamp Assembly:
Housing .................1-5/16 Dia.
Flange ...................2-3/16 Dia.
Height....................2-1/4 (from bottom of housing to top of dome)
Patrick Moseley
Tucson, AZ
In message <200303061925.h26JPJu32636(at)matronics.com>, on 6-Mar-2003,
"Steve Sampson" writes:
>
> Has anyone looked at using the considerably cheaper aeroflash
strobe/tail
> light part #153-0011 in place of the similar Whelen unit? I am trying to
> check the dimensions are such that they will fit the fibreglass rudder
> bottom. I assume the dimensions are the same as the Whelen unit but am
> having trouble confirming this. Thanks, Steve.
> #90360
> UK
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Gozewijn Vlasblom" <vlasblom(at)ripnet.com> |
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv9-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv9-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of Gozewijn
Vlasblom
Subject: RV9-List: flap actuator
Hi Folks,
I have just finished installing the electric flap actuator assembly.
I started off with the hardware provided by Van's and installed it according
instructions.
When I tried it out the motor kept on running although the actuator arm had
reached the end of its travel.
I did not like that. What followed was two weeks of puzzling, designing,
redesigning. countless errors and mistakes and finely a product I was happy
with. Building airplanes certainly is a learning experience.
The micro switches come from Fletchair Inc.in Houston Tx tel 713 641 2023.
They are used in a Grumman Tiger, for the electric flaps. No.: V3L-30D9 or
4604-1100 US$ 9.19/pc
I include a few pictures and a wiring diagram. Remember that drawing wiring
diagrams was not part of my education.
One more improvement could be considered: When you want to raise the flaps
for touch and goes, you may not want to spent the required 6 sec to do the
job. The Grumman tiger switch works as follows: when you put it in the up
position, you do not have to hold the switch. It will proceed until the
flaps are up completely. Switch No.: 6GM5B-50X123 a little pricier at US$
67.12
There is very little room between the control arm of the flap actuator
assembly and the elevator controll rod, but it is just enough.
The wiring diagram does not give indication re polarity and which switch
controls up movement and which one down movement. That will have to be done
emperically.
Have fun,
Goz Vlasblom 90171
vlasblom(at)ripnet.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Steve Sampson" <SSampson.SLN21(at)london.edu> |
| Subject: | Aeroflash Strobe Unit |
Yes I also have a Nova strobe power unit. I am just trying to avoid using
the Whelen unit on the tail . I hate monopolies!
Regards, Steve.
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv9-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv9-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Leland
Subject: Re: RV9-List: Aeroflash Strobe Unit
Steve, generally the Aeroflash system puts out less energy per flash, so
a Whelan power supply may overdrive the Aeroflash flashlamps. I bought
an X-PAK 904 strobe power supply, which has specifications comparable to
Whelan's, is cheaper and has a longer warranty. I have operated it with
the Whelan lamps, but only in the garage.
Leland in Pleasanton
Installing the empenage fairing, which fits like an OJ glove.
PS: Buy Van's gascolator bracket (listed in the fireward-forward kit)
before drilling holes for mounting the gascolator to the firewall. This
bracket is not shown on the fuse drawings
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | tchoug <tchoug(at)micron.com> |
| Subject: | Aeroflash Strobe Unit |
Steve,
If you're thinking about using the aeroflash tube with the NOVA X-PAK, you might
want to look into the power rating of the aeroflash tube. The aeroflash spec
from the link listed earlier indicates that the supply is rated at 10 joules
output, it doesn't state what the tube can handle.
The X-PAK 904 used to power two wing tip strobes and one tail strobe is rated at
about 40 joules for each pair of outputs. With the wingtip strobes working as
a pair they divide this for 20 joules each. With the tail strobe being solitary,
it gets the full 40 joules! I have the X-PAK 904 and the Whelen strobe tubes.
I've hooked them up in the shop and let me tell you, they are bright! However,
the tail strobe definitely gets very hot with no airflow.
If the aeroflash tail strobe can't handle much more than the 10 joule rating of
the supply, you're likely to fry it driving it from an X-PAK. The Whelen supply
is rated very similar to the X-PAK so the Whelen tubes should be able to handle
the X-PAK supply output.
Todd
RV9A - Fuselage
-----Original Message-----
From: Steve Sampson [mailto:SSampson.SLN21(at)london.edu]
Subject: RE: RV9-List: Aeroflash Strobe Unit
Yes I also have a Nova strobe power unit. I am just trying to avoid using
the Whelen unit on the tail . I hate monopolies!
Regards, Steve.
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv9-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv9-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Leland
Subject: Re: RV9-List: Aeroflash Strobe Unit
Steve, generally the Aeroflash system puts out less energy per flash, so
a Whelan power supply may overdrive the Aeroflash flashlamps. I bought
an X-PAK 904 strobe power supply, which has specifications comparable to
Whelan's, is cheaper and has a longer warranty. I have operated it with
the Whelan lamps, but only in the garage.
Leland in Pleasanton
Installing the empenage fairing, which fits like an OJ glove.
PS: Buy Van's gascolator bracket (listed in the fireward-forward kit)
before drilling holes for mounting the gascolator to the firewall. This
bracket is not shown on the fuse drawings
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Aeroflash Strobe Unit <200303061925.h26JPJu32636(at)matronics.com> |
| From: | "Larry PERRYMAN" <larry.perryman(at)atofina.com> |
03/07/2003 11:04:16 PM,
Serialize complete at 03/07/2003 11:04:16 PM
Steve,
No I do not but if it is bigger, just take some epoxy and flocs and build
it up to the outside diameter. Remember that this fairing was just one
man' s design and minor changes will not matter. If you need it bigger,
just build it up and sand it back to the shape you like. Paint it and no
one will know the difference.
As I recall, there is a disclaimer on the fiberglass products that says
that minor refabrication and layups may be necessary.
Regards,
Larry Perryman
"Steve Sampson"
Sent by: owner-rv9-list-server(at)matronics.com
03/07/2003 01:54 PM
Please respond to rv9-list
To:
cc:
Subject: RE: RV9-List: Aeroflash Strobe Unit
<200303061925.h26JPJu32636(at)matronics.com>
Larry - thanks for that , really helpful. You would not happen to know the
'short' diameter? If tip to tip is the 2 3/16" diameter the 'short' one is
at right angles to it. I just want to be sure it is not larger than the
face
on VANS moulding.
Thanks, Steve.
PS Have you used the aeroflash unit?
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv9-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv9-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Larry PERRYMAN
Subject: RE: RV9-List: Aeroflash Strobe Unit
<200303061925.h26JPJu32636(at)matronics.com>
Steve,
The distance tip to tip across the outside of the housing is 2 3/16 inch.
The hole necessary for the body to go back into the rudder fairing is 1
5/16 inch. I suspect that you will find that this fits.
One of the best directions I have seen for installing is to take the unit
and coat it with a mold release compound or a good car wax. Remove enough
of the opening in the rudder fairing to allow the unit to go back into the
rudder fairing to the position you want. Coat the mounting screws well.
Tape the unit in place and fill the end of the fairing with a mix of epoxy
and flox or microballoons so that it holds the unit in place. The mounting
screws should be buried in the fill also. When it cures, remove and clean
the light unit. You will now have a nice tight socket for the light and
the mounting screws will thread into the epoxy to hold it.
I sure wish I had seen this method before I installed mine. I was trying
to mount nuts inside to hold the unit in.
You will sure find out if you have it well covered with wax when you try
to remove the light. If you did a poor job, the socket may be permanently
mounted for you. Another release agent that you can nick from your wife's
kitchen is some clear food wrap. It works to put it around the outside of
an item and then put epoxy over it. It will generally pull loose from
epoxy.
Probably the best is to find someone that is building a fiberglass plane.
They should have the clear plastic that is used to vacuum bag components.
Epoxy will not stick to it either. Talk them out of a piece big enough to
wrap the light up in.
Hope this helps
Regards,
Larry Perryman
"Steve Sampson"
Sent by: owner-rv9-list-server(at)matronics.com
03/06/2003 10:33 AM
Please respond to rv9-list
To:
cc:
Subject: RE: RV9-List: Aeroflash Strobe Unit
<200303061925.h26JPJu32636(at)matronics.com>
Patrick - thanks, yes I saw that, but since the base unit is not circular
I
am not sure what that flange dia means. Why they don't put a simple
drawing
beats me! Steve.
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv9-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv9-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Patrick E.
Moseley
Subject: Re: RV9-List: Aeroflash Strobe Unit
<200303061925.h26JPJu32636(at)matronics.com>
If you go to:
http://www.aeroflash.com/plane.html#tailposition
There is a link to the "Specifications, Wiring & Spare Parts Guide" that
has
the dimensions for the lamp assembly:
http://www.aeroflash.com/156-0029.pdf
Here are the dimensions cut and pasted from the above document:
Dimensions for the Lamp Assembly:
Housing .................1-5/16 Dia.
Flange ...................2-3/16 Dia.
Height....................2-1/4 (from bottom of housing to top of dome)
Patrick Moseley
Tucson, AZ
In message <200303061925.h26JPJu32636(at)matronics.com>, on 6-Mar-2003,
"Steve Sampson" writes:
>
> Has anyone looked at using the considerably cheaper aeroflash
strobe/tail
> light part #153-0011 in place of the similar Whelen unit? I am trying to
> check the dimensions are such that they will fit the fibreglass rudder
> bottom. I assume the dimensions are the same as the Whelen unit but am
> having trouble confirming this. Thanks, Steve.
> #90360
> UK
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Aeroflash Strobe Unit |
| From: | "Larry PERRYMAN" <larry.perryman(at)atofina.com> |
03/07/2003 11:28:25 PM,
Serialize complete at 03/07/2003 11:28:25 PM
Steve,
Where around London do you live? I spent almost two months in Camberley a
few years back and got to see a bit of the country. Quite a change for a
country boy from Texas. Never could get use to the roundabouts.
Regards,
Larry Perryman
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Gozewijn Vlasblom" <vlasblom(at)ripnet.com> |
Hi folks,
Last night I posted a message re limit switches for the electric flap
actuator system.
It has been brought to my attention that matronics does not facillitate
inserts with messages.
I do not have my own website yet. Anybody that is interested can E-mail me
and I wil E-mail the pictures and wiring diagram.
Greetings,
Goz Vlasblom 90171
vlasblom(at)ripnet.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Frank" <fscorpio(at)softcom.net> |
Ned,
Per Gus Funnell at vansaircraft:
Vne RV-7/7A is 230 mph
Vne RV-A is 210 mph
Va RV-7 is 142 mph
Va RV-9A is 118 mph
Vx RV-7 is 90 mph
Vx RV-9A is 80 mph
Vy RV-7 is 115 mph
Vy RV-9A is 110 mph
All are approximate.
Frank
----- Original Message -----
From: <315(at)cox.net>
Subject: RV9-List: V Speeds
>
> Anyone know what the V speeds for the RV9A are? Such as Maximum
Structural
> Cruising and Never Exceed speeds?
> Thanks,
> Ned
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Steve Sampson" <SSampson.SLN21(at)london.edu> |
| Subject: | Aeroflash Strobe Unit |
Todd - thanks for that. It's the conclusion I have reluctantly been moving
towards. That combined with the absolutely offputting style of the aeroflash
customer service have nearly sold me on going with Whelen. They sure hate to
answer a question. I just hate to pay so much for that little tail light.
Regards, Steve.
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv9-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv9-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of tchoug
Subject: RE: RV9-List: Aeroflash Strobe Unit
Steve,
If you're thinking about using the aeroflash tube with the NOVA X-PAK, you
might want to look into the power rating of the aeroflash tube. The
aeroflash spec from the link listed earlier indicates that the supply is
rated at 10 joules output, it doesn't state what the tube can handle.
The X-PAK 904 used to power two wing tip strobes and one tail strobe is
rated at about 40 joules for each pair of outputs. With the wingtip strobes
working as a pair they divide this for 20 joules each. With the tail strobe
being solitary, it gets the full 40 joules! I have the X-PAK 904 and the
Whelen strobe tubes. I've hooked them up in the shop and let me tell you,
they are bright! However, the tail strobe definitely gets very hot with no
airflow.
If the aeroflash tail strobe can't handle much more than the 10 joule rating
of the supply, you're likely to fry it driving it from an X-PAK. The Whelen
supply is rated very similar to the X-PAK so the Whelen tubes should be able
to handle the X-PAK supply output.
Todd
RV9A - Fuselage
-----Original Message-----
From: Steve Sampson [mailto:SSampson.SLN21(at)london.edu]
Subject: RE: RV9-List: Aeroflash Strobe Unit
Yes I also have a Nova strobe power unit. I am just trying to avoid using
the Whelen unit on the tail . I hate monopolies!
Regards, Steve.
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv9-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv9-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Leland
Subject: Re: RV9-List: Aeroflash Strobe Unit
Steve, generally the Aeroflash system puts out less energy per flash, so
a Whelan power supply may overdrive the Aeroflash flashlamps. I bought
an X-PAK 904 strobe power supply, which has specifications comparable to
Whelan's, is cheaper and has a longer warranty. I have operated it with
the Whelan lamps, but only in the garage.
Leland in Pleasanton
Installing the empenage fairing, which fits like an OJ glove.
PS: Buy Van's gascolator bracket (listed in the fireward-forward kit)
before drilling holes for mounting the gascolator to the firewall. This
bracket is not shown on the fuse drawings
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Leland <Federigo(at)pacbell.net> |
| Subject: | RE:Aeroflash Strobe Unit |
Mathew
A joule as used here refers to the energy supplied to the flashlamp. A
candela or candle is related to watts or joules/second of light actually
radiated by the lamp, and this relationship includes the color or
wavelength of the light and the "solid angle" over which it is radiated.
The "watts radiated" is roughly equal to the "joules radiated" divided
by the time over which it is radiated. Bottom line is that the
manufacturer will have to measure the radiated candles for a specific
light source, amount of supplied joules and pulse width.
The regulation that all aircraft must meet is FAR 23.1401. I suspect
that the Aeroflash units meet the candle requirement because they are
standard equipment on thousands of Cessnas. The Whelan units are
probably brighter.
Leland in Pleasanton
Re-plumbing some of the fuel line
"There ya have it. According to the Whelen site "These anti-collision
systems
must produce a minimum of 400 effective candela in aviation". Can
anyone
convert joules to candela??"
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bob Kelly <mmpi(at)missionmedia.org> |
| Subject: | Re: RE:Aeroflash Strobe Unit |
Leland,
My problem with 23.1401 isn't so much the amount of light, because at least
comparitively, that can be measured with either a light meter (rotating
beacon) or flash meter. With the proper amount of light (and flashes or
rotations/min) the intent of the reg would be met. I wonder about the word
"approved." Has anyone has ever actually had a system approved made by
several manufacturers?
I would love to experiment with lighting, specifically LED's, but don't want
to waste time and money. Does anyone know what is meant by "approved?"
Can a DAR do this?
Bob Kelly
On 08-Mar-03, Leland wrote:
>
> Mathew
> A joule as used here refers to the energy supplied to the flashlamp. A
> candela or candle is related to watts or joules/second of light actually
> radiated by the lamp, and this relationship includes the color or
> wavelength of the light and the "solid angle" over which it is radiated.
> The "watts radiated" is roughly equal to the "joules radiated" divided
> by the time over which it is radiated. Bottom line is that the
> manufacturer will have to measure the radiated candles for a specific
> light source, amount of supplied joules and pulse width.
>
> The regulation that all aircraft must meet is FAR 23.1401. I suspect
> that the Aeroflash units meet the candle requirement because they are
> standard equipment on thousands of Cessnas. The Whelan units are
> probably brighter.
>
> Leland in Pleasanton
> Re-plumbing some of the fuel line
>
>
> "There ya have it. According to the Whelen site "These anti-collision
> systems
> must produce a minimum of 400 effective candela in aviation". Can
> anyone
> convert joules to candela??"
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
Regards
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | [ John Harris ] : New Email List Photo Share Available! |
| From: | Email List Photo Shares <pictures(at)matronics.com> |
A new Email List Photo Share is available:
Poster: John Harris
Subject: Bracket for Wing Wiring Conduit
http://www.matronics.com/photoshare/johnharris@nc.rr.com.03.08.2003/index.html
o Main Photo Share Index
http://www.matronics.com/photoshare
o Submitting a Photo Share
If you wish to submit a Photo Share of your own, please include the
following information along with your email message and files:
1) Email List or Lists that they are related to:
2) Your Full Name:
3) Your Email Address:
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6) One-line Description of each photo or file:
Email the information above and your files and photos to:
pictures(at)matronics.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | DLOMHEIM(at)aol.com |
Ned:
I have had great luck with the dimple dies from Brown tools right out on
Meridian by Will Rodgers. I did get the tank dies from Cleaveland tools and
they worked great for the fuel tanks...I sent them to my dad in Denver
(building a 7) and the male one finally broke...I hear I can get another one
but haven't tried yet. Mitchell stopped by my house today and we talked
RV-9s for while...his quick build should be coming in the next few
months...good for him. Happy building!
Doug Lomheim
793-8647
Twin Lakes Airport "Pilot's Haven"
90116 Flaps
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | DLOMHEIM(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Sorry about my last posting! |
Sorry guys...I meant to send my last posting to Ned direct...
Doug Lomheim
90116
From: DLOMHEIM(at)aol.com
Date: Sat, 8 Mar 2003 22:19:38 EST
Subject: (no subject)
Ned:
I have had great luck with the dimple dies from Brown tools right out on
Meridian by Will Rodgers. I did get the tank dies from Cleaveland tools and
they worked great for the fuel tanks...I sent them to my dad in Denver
(building a 7) and the male one finally broke...I hear I can get another one
but haven't tried yet. Mitchell stopped by my house today and we talked
RV-9s for while...his quick build should be coming in the next few
months...good for him. Happy building!
Doug Lomheim
793-8647
Twin Lakes Airport "Pilot's Haven"
90116 Flaps
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Rob W M Shipley" <Rob(at)RobsGlass.com> |
| Subject: | 705 bulkhead alignment. |
Do others with their fuselages upside down and mostly assembled have a slight dip
(approx 3/16") at the 705 bulkhead if a straight edge is placed across it down
the longitudinal axis of the fuselage?
I hope this is clear ......... Mine appears to have everything fitting correctly
but this slight concavity in the bottom of the fuse at the 705 is quite obvious
and I'm wondering why it's there.
[The 705 is the rear spar attach / seat belt floor attach / roll bar bulkhead.]
Input welcomed.
Rob
Rob W M Shipley
RV9A N919RV Fuselage.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Joe Wiza <planejoel(at)juno.com> |
Just finished the tail section, would have bet the RV6A was easier
but then maybe I'm just remembering the easy stuff
RV9A awaiting wings. Joe.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Gary" <rv9er(at)3rivers.net> |
| Subject: | Re: 705 bulkhead alignment. |
I am not sure about this one, Rob. Mine has never been upside down. I built it
right-side-up and so missed out on the big "roll the fuselage over" party.
However, yours doesn't sound right to me.
All I know is mine appears to have smooth lines finished and sitting on the gear,
and all the holes lined up.
If you had it right side up I suppose you could cleco the top skins on as a check.
Gary
----- Original Message -----
From: Rob W M Shipley
To: RV9-List Digest Server
Sent: Sunday, March 09, 2003 12:34 AM
Subject: RV9-List: 705 bulkhead alignment.
Do others with their fuselages upside down and mostly assembled have a slight
dip (approx 3/16") at the 705 bulkhead if a straight edge is placed across it
down the longitudinal axis of the fuselage?
I hope this is clear ......... Mine appears to have everything fitting correctly
but this slight concavity in the bottom of the fuse at the 705 is quite obvious
and I'm wondering why it's there.
[The 705 is the rear spar attach / seat belt floor attach / roll bar bulkhead.]
Input welcomed.
Rob
Rob W M Shipley
RV9A N919RV Fuselage.
---
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Ernest Kells" <ernest.kells(at)sympatico.ca> |
| Subject: | Re: Diesel Power |
> What caused the 9 to be lost?
I believe that the two very experienced pilots (with extensive RV
experience) just "pushed on" during a long and tiring flight, even though
weather was deteriating. They flew into IMC conditions over primitive
land - hilly, tree-covered, low population, etc., etc. They possibly would
have been okay - but they needed to land due to very low gas.
I felt bad about it. I believe that I was the first RV-9A builder planning
an O-235 N2C engine (kit #90030). As such I had a lot of questions. Bill
Benedict was very knowledgeable and very helpful. Had better information
about the RV-9A/O-235 at that time than the current Support group does now.
Ernest Kells - RV-9A O235-N2C, Wood Prop
Finish Kit 95% Complete
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Todd Houg <thoug(at)attglobal.net> |
Jim,
Ernest pretty well summed it up, except I don't believe fuel was an issue. Bill
and his son Jeremy were both experienced RV pilots. Bill told me the day before
that he let Jeremy fly most of the long cross country legs. They pushed it
too far and got into IMC conditions over the hills of Arkansas. Witnesses on the
ground reported hearing the airplane circling prior to the crash leading one
to infer that they were possibly in a death spiral with no gyros. It was a very
firey crash indicating there was plenty of fuel on board.
For this reason, I believe all VFR only aircraft should have minimal gyros (Vacuum,
electric, solid state or whatever).
Todd Houg
RV9A - Fuselage
-----Original Message-----
From: Ernest Kells [SMTP:ernest.kells(at)sympatico.ca]
Subject: Re: RV9-List: Diesel Power
> What caused the 9 to be lost?
I believe that the two very experienced pilots (with extensive RV
experience) just "pushed on" during a long and tiring flight, even though
weather was deteriating. They flew into IMC conditions over primitive
land - hilly, tree-covered, low population, etc., etc. They possibly would
have been okay - but they needed to land due to very low gas.
I felt bad about it. I believe that I was the first RV-9A builder planning
an O-235 N2C engine (kit #90030). As such I had a lot of questions. Bill
Benedict was very knowledgeable and very helpful. Had better information
about the RV-9A/O-235 at that time than the current Support group does now.
Ernest Kells - RV-9A O235-N2C, Wood Prop
Finish Kit 95% Complete
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________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "dean van winkle" <dvanwinkle(at)royell.net> |
| Subject: | Re: 705 bulkhead alignment. |
Rob
Your message implies that you have the tip-up canopy and I have the slider
which should make absolutely no difference. Mine is upside down and has the
same dip as yours. Please note that the center line flat bottom surface of
the baggage compartment transitions to match the wing bottom airfoil contour
just forward of the 705 bulkhead. The baggage ribs are 700 series and appear
to be common to the -7 and -9 aircraft while the seat ribs are 900 series
specific to the -9 only. I suspect that this dip appears only on the -9
because of the different airfoil used and should be of no concern either
structurally or aerodynamically. Hope this helps.
Dean Van Winkle
Retired Aero Engineer
90095 Fuselage
Finish kit in transit
----- Original Message -----
From: "Rob W M Shipley" <Rob(at)RobsGlass.com>
Subject: RV9-List: 705 bulkhead alignment.
>
> Do others with their fuselages upside down and mostly assembled have a
slight dip (approx 3/16") at the 705 bulkhead if a straight edge is placed
across it down the longitudinal axis of the fuselage?
> I hope this is clear ......... Mine appears to have everything fitting
correctly but this slight concavity in the bottom of the fuse at the 705 is
quite obvious and I'm wondering why it's there.
> [The 705 is the rear spar attach / seat belt floor attach / roll bar
bulkhead.]
> Input welcomed.
> Rob
> Rob W M Shipley
> RV9A N919RV Fuselage.
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | RV-9A Elevators and Rudder |
| From: | "Ted Strand" <tstrand(at)strandcentral.com> |
I have a question that hopefully someone can answer. I am currently
finishing up on the empennage kit and I have two things remaining.
1) I need to finish the trailing edges of the Rudder and elevators. I
see in the drawings to use pro-seal on the edges of the skin. Do they
just want this in the corners, or do they want us to put it the whole
length? Is the Rudder the same?
2) I just received my fiberglass tips for the empennage (they were
backordered). Is there a trick to making them fit properly? Looks like
they want to hang up on rivets that have already been installed in some
places.
Thanks in advance!!!
-Ted Strand-
N371N
Finishing Empennage
(Wing Kit in Storage)
Clearwater, FL
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Robert scott" <rscott(at)johnsonmfginc.com> |
| Subject: | Re: RV-9A Elevators and Rudder |
----- Original Message -----
From: "Ted Strand" <tstrand(at)strandcentral.com>
Subject: RV9-List: RV-9A Elevators and Rudder
>
> I have a question that hopefully someone can answer. I am currently
> finishing up on the empennage kit and I have two things remaining.
>
> 1) I need to finish the trailing edges of the Rudder and elevators. I
> see in the drawings to use pro-seal on the edges of the skin. Do they
> just want this in the corners, or do they want us to put it the whole
> length? Is the Rudder the same?
The idea is to proseal the entire length, cleco to a piece of angle angle
iron and let it setup. Then remove clecos and instal the rivets. The
proseal will hold everything in place as you rivet.
Yes, the rudder is the same.
> 2) I just received my fiberglass tips for the empennage (they were
> backordered). Is there a trick to making them fit properly? Looks like
> they want to hang up on rivets that have already been installed in some
> places.
If you look closely you will notice a line that runs around the permiter
edge. If you trim to this line you will be very close to having a good fit.
Robert scott
> Thanks in advance!!!
>
> -Ted Strand-
> N371N
> Finishing Empennage
> (Wing Kit in Storage)
> Clearwater, FL
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Todd Houg <thoug(at)attglobal.net> |
| Subject: | RV-9A Elevators and Rudder |
Ted,
When I built my empennage the plans/directions specified using pro-seal at the
corners only. I'm not sure if the directions have changed since. I know some people
do put pro-seal along the entire edge. It's useful on the coreners to prevent
getting a corner folded up when you inadvertantly snag it on a towel or
shirt sleeve. While pro-sealing the entire edge certainly doesn't hurt, I'm nut
sure that there is any real benefit.
You can check out how I did my trailing edges at http://www.toddhoug.com.
The fiberglass tips aren't difficult. The lines in the gelcoat are pretty close.
If you take a few measurements to confirm, you can likely cut to the lines and
then do some final trimming where needed.
Todd Houg
90196 - Fuselage
-----Original Message-----
From: Ted Strand [SMTP:tstrand(at)strandcentral.com]
Subject: RV9-List: RV-9A Elevators and Rudder
I have a question that hopefully someone can answer. I am currently
finishing up on the empennage kit and I have two things remaining.
1) I need to finish the trailing edges of the Rudder and elevators. I
see in the drawings to use pro-seal on the edges of the skin. Do they
just want this in the corners, or do they want us to put it the whole
length? Is the Rudder the same?
2) I just received my fiberglass tips for the empennage (they were
backordered). Is there a trick to making them fit properly? Looks like
they want to hang up on rivets that have already been installed in some
places.
Thanks in advance!!!
-Ted Strand-
N371N
Finishing Empennage
(Wing Kit in Storage)
Clearwater, FL
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________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Todd Houg <thoug(at)attglobal.net> |
| Subject: | RV-9A Elevators and Rudder |
>> 1) I need to finish the trailing edges of the Rudder and elevators. I
>> see in the drawings to use pro-seal on the edges of the skin. Do they
>> just want this in the corners, or do they want us to put it the whole
>> length? Is the Rudder the same?
>The idea is to proseal the entire length, cleco to a piece of angle angle
>iron and let it setup. Then remove clecos and instal the rivets. The
>proseal will hold everything in place as you rivet.
>Yes, the rudder is the same.
Robert,
Does the latest plans or assembly instructions call for this? I know my older instructions
circa 2000 do not specifiy this. They specify use only on the corners,
have there been updates? I thought that this approach was one that a creative
builder came up with and it has caught on with a few others. While it sounds
like people get good results with it, it certainly isn't necessary. I got
great results on the rudder, elevator, flaps and ailerons just clamping to a long
piece of angle iron and riveting. The less I have to deal with proseal the
better!
I guess it's really up to the builder, that's what makes these experimental right?
Todd Houg
RV9A - Fuselage (still)
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________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Ken Moak <ken_moak(at)yahoo.com> |
| Subject: | Re: RV-9A Elevators and Rudder |
I used the structural epoxy (T88) the plans called for
rather than proseal on the rudder.
I used the elevator spar and cekoed the rudder to it
for a few days while it set. The spar is the same
hole pattern as the from trailing edge of the rudder
(left the plastic on to keep glue from setting on the
spar) sounds like you are too far along and will have
to drill.
I have not closed the elevators yet, still waiting on
a Tech Advisor (4 weeks, 3 advisors still no shows).
Ken
90608
About to start the wings.
--- Ted Strand wrote:
>
>
> I have a question that hopefully someone can answer.
> I am currently
> finishing up on the empennage kit and I have two
> things remaining.
>
> 1) I need to finish the trailing edges of the
> Rudder and elevators. I
> see in the drawings to use pro-seal on the edges of
> the skin. Do they
> just want this in the corners, or do they want us to
> put it the whole
> length? Is the Rudder the same?
>
> 2) I just received my fiberglass tips for the
> empennage (they were
> backordered). Is there a trick to making them fit
> properly? Looks like
> they want to hang up on rivets that have already
> been installed in some
> places.
>
> Thanks in advance!!!
>
> -Ted Strand-
> N371N
> Finishing Empennage
> (Wing Kit in Storage)
> Clearwater, FL
>
>
>
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>
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>
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> http://www.matronics.com/photoshare
> http://www.matronics.com/emaillists
>
>
>
>
>
http://taxes.yahoo.com/
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: RV-9A Elevators and Rudder |
| From: | Joe Wiza <planejoel(at)juno.com> |
I cut my tips dow so that they didn't bump up against the rivets.
RV6A9 Joe
writes:
>
>
> I have a question that hopefully someone can answer. I am
> currently
> finishing up on the empennage kit and I have two things remaining.
>
> 1) I need to finish the trailing edges of the Rudder and elevators.
> I
> see in the drawings to use pro-seal on the edges of the skin. Do
> they
> just want this in the corners, or do they want us to put it the
> whole
> length? Is the Rudder the same?
>
> 2) I just received my fiberglass tips for the empennage (they were
> backordered). Is there a trick to making them fit properly? Looks
> like
> they want to hang up on rivets that have already been installed in
> some
> places.
>
> Thanks in advance!!!
>
> -Ted Strand-
> N371N
> Finishing Empennage
> (Wing Kit in Storage)
> Clearwater, FL
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Steve Sampson" <SSampson.SLN21(at)london.edu> |
What tools should I use to shape and drill the wing tip lenses. Its not
clear to me what materials they are made of or that the canopy cutting rules
apply to these. I divied the part into two with a cutting wheel but it
largely achieved the task by melting rather than cutting. No problem so far,
but I think I will take advice before I go further.
Thanks, Steve
#90360
N Yorks., UK
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | tchoug <tchoug(at)micron.com> |
Steve,
I used a cutting wheel just like you to grind/melt my way through the rough cuts.
After cutting the lens in two, I fitted each half and marked out a rough cut
closer to the desired cut. Then I re-fitted and cut a little closer, etc. I
did the final trimming on a benchtop belt/disk sander to creep up on the desired
fit. Final clean up with a bit of sandpaper. I didn't have any troble drilling,
I'm not sure if they're as prone to cracking as the canopy.
Todd
RV9A
-----Original Message-----
From: Steve Sampson [mailto:SSampson.SLN21(at)london.edu]
Subject: RV9-List: Wing tip lenses
What tools should I use to shape and drill the wing tip lenses. Its not
clear to me what materials they are made of or that the canopy cutting rules
apply to these. I divied the part into two with a cutting wheel but it
largely achieved the task by melting rather than cutting. No problem so far,
but I think I will take advice before I go further.
Thanks, Steve
#90360
N Yorks., UK
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "The Strong's" <tstrong(at)ida.net> |
I am working on the plumbing for my tanks and was wondering if it is
necessary to use a torque wrench
for getting the flared fittings correct? Is there maybe another technique
that works just as well?
Thanks,
Tom Strong
Idaho Falls, ID
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Chris <chrisw3(at)cox.net> |
| Subject: | Re: flared fittings |
If you go to www.parker.com and download their catalog for the 37 degree flair
fittings (I think they call them triple lock), in there you will find a
detailed description of the FFFT method which stands for Flats From Finger
Tight. And for -4 and -5 fittings the number is 2 for -6 fittings it is 1.5
for tube connections and 1.25 for Swivel Nut or Hose Connections. They also
list Torque values for each size fitting but they do NOT recommend using the
Torque method if the fittings have different types of plating or there is any
lubrication on the fittings and I think the aluminum tube has a different
value than the normal steel tubing.
Chris
The Strong's wrote:
>
> I am working on the plumbing for my tanks and was wondering if it is
> necessary to use a torque wrench
> for getting the flared fittings correct? Is there maybe another technique
> that works just as well?
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Rob W M Shipley" <Rob(at)RobsGlass.com> |
| Subject: | 705 bulkhead alignment |
My thanks to Dean and Gary for the input. I called Vans today for their .02 on
this topic and spoke to Ken ? (not Krueger). He was unaware of this phenomenon
and gave the usual "if the holes line up it must be O.K." quote.
Well, they do. Gary's observation on the design of this section makes sense to
me and I'm now confident that all is well.
Thanks again guys.
Rob
Rob W M Shipley
RV9A N919RV Fuselage.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "John Kerr" <kerrjohna(at)mtwest.net> |
horror of horrors, upon completing a thorough job of sealing the baffle to my tank
I placed on the appropriate spar to cure. Looking things over with a sense
of accomplishment, I noticed something out of normal. From one of the front-most
rivet positions in the skin was a "stalagtite" of sealer. I HAD FAILED TO
INSTALL ONE RIVET.
What do I do now. I have sealed a rivet in place but am dealing with a lot of
uncertainty now.
HELP
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Phil" <Phil(at)camsnet.com> |
Call Vans. The only thing I can think to do is a Blind Rivet. Call Vans
first.
Phil 90329 78
0
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv9-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv9-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of John Kerr
Subject: RV9-List: horrors
horror of horrors, upon completing a thorough job of sealing the baffle to
my tank I placed on the appropriate spar to cure. Looking things over with a
sense of accomplishment, I noticed something out of normal. From one of the
front-most rivet positions in the skin was a "stalagtite" of sealer. I HAD
FAILED TO INSTALL ONE RIVET.
What do I do now. I have sealed a rivet in place but am dealing with a lot
of uncertainty now.
HELP
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Andy Karmy" <andy(at)karmy.com> |
AHHHHHH.......
Ok, now that that's over... :) Little humor to lighten your mood.
I would go for a sealed pop rivet. There are some that have the internals of the
pop rivet sealed up, you would slightly enlarge the hole to fit, then use a
dab of proseal and pop rivet in place. Give Vans a call they should know which
rivet would be the best to use.
- Andy
---------- Original Message ----------------------------------
From: "John Kerr" <kerrjohna(at)mtwest.net>
Date: Tue, 11 Mar 2003 09:32:31 -0700
>
>horror of horrors, upon completing a thorough job of sealing the baffle to my
tank I placed on the appropriate spar to cure. Looking things over with a sense
of accomplishment, I noticed something out of normal. From one of the front-most
rivet positions in the skin was a "stalagtite" of sealer. I HAD FAILED TO
INSTALL ONE RIVET.
>
>What do I do now. I have sealed a rivet in place but am dealing with a lot of
uncertainty now.
>
>HELP
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | RE: Building in a small space. |
03/11/2003 10:40:23 AM
I am about to order my RV-9 Fuse but have a real problem... a 32 1/4 inch
door. I have talked to a few people about this and the best advice to date
seems to be to splice the rear fuse bulkhead (706 I believe) and then the
fuse will fit out my basement door when turned on it side. This is assuming
that the steps, windshield, roll bar and rear top skin are not riveted yet.
Does anybody have more experience with this on an RV-9? I would really like
to build in the basement as I don't have a garage and renting a space is
pretty unattractive. I would really appreciate any advice (or even
ridiculous story's for that matter.)
Thanks,
Bryan
(Working on the wings).
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Larry PERRYMAN" <larry.perryman(at)atofina.com> |
03/11/2003 06:13:01 PM,
Serialize complete at 03/11/2003 06:13:01 PM
The blind rivets were included in my kit. Check your parts bins and put
one in with a little proseal. That is what I had to do and now I can not
even find the rivet after painting.
Regards,
Larry Perryman
"Andy Karmy"
Sent by: owner-rv9-list-server(at)matronics.com
03/11/2003 10:37 AM
Please respond to rv9-list
To:
cc:
Subject: Re: RV9-List: horrors
AHHHHHH.......
Ok, now that that's over... :) Little humor to lighten your mood.
I would go for a sealed pop rivet. There are some that have the internals
of the pop rivet sealed up, you would slightly enlarge the hole to fit,
then use a dab of proseal and pop rivet in place. Give Vans a call they
should know which rivet would be the best to use.
- Andy
---------- Original Message ----------------------------------
From: "John Kerr" <kerrjohna(at)mtwest.net>
Date: Tue, 11 Mar 2003 09:32:31 -0700
>
>horror of horrors, upon completing a thorough job of sealing the baffle
to my tank I placed on the appropriate spar to cure. Looking things over
with a sense of accomplishment, I noticed something out of normal. From
one of the front-most rivet positions in the skin was a "stalagtite" of
sealer. I HAD FAILED TO INSTALL ONE RIVET.
>
>What do I do now. I have sealed a rivet in place but am dealing with a
lot of uncertainty now.
>
>HELP
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | DThomas773(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: RE: Building in a small space. |
Hi Bryan,
I'm not sure your going to come up with realistic solution of getting a
fuselage through a 32 inch door. Actually there is a lot of prep work on the
skins and bulkheads. You could do as much of that as possible. As you know
you first put things together to match drill and fit, then take apart to
dimple, deburr and prime. You could go that far and then transport the parts
to a more suitable place for final assembly.
Dennis Thomas
fuselage
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Gary" <rv9er(at)3rivers.net> |
| Subject: | Re: RE: Building in a small space. |
Ridiculus stories abound. Trouble is they are all true! And much more humerous
than the actual event.
My advice would be......find a place to build you KNOW it will come out of without
heroic measures. This is a classic story. EAA made a movie called "How you
going to get it out of the Basement" documenting some real life antics you
wouldn't believe. More than a few guys have ended up excavating the back yard
and demolishing the foundation wall to get it out. Your wife would hate you
more for that than if you built it in the dining room.
A good friend of mine built a small ultralight in his basement. Had it absolutely
figured out how it would come out. That airplane will last forever, never
crash, and never burn a gallon of gas. And he has not had the use of his basement
for 9 years, and never will, until he takes a chain saw to his flying machine.
You are building the airplane of your dreams, and it will be worth more than your
house (Well, MY house anyway) when it is done. Don't do something you will
punish yourself for later.
Build a garage, rent an empty one, buy a hangar, whatever.......but get a suitable
place to work. You will be at it a while, and you will have SOOOO Much invested
by the time it won't fit through the door.
Even if you did mutilate it, and leave off the top half, where would you finish
it? Hell, if nothing else, make a bigger door! But don't try to get it up a
flight of stairs!
Gary
----- Original Message -----
From: BFlood@sauer-danfoss.com
To: rv9-list(at)matronics.com
Sent: Tuesday, March 11, 2003 9:33 AM
Subject: RV9-List: RE: Building in a small space.
I am about to order my RV-9 Fuse but have a real problem... a 32 1/4 inch
door. I have talked to a few people about this and the best advice to date
seems to be to splice the rear fuse bulkhead (706 I believe) and then the
fuse will fit out my basement door when turned on it side. This is assuming
that the steps, windshield, roll bar and rear top skin are not riveted yet.
Does anybody have more experience with this on an RV-9? I would really like
to build in the basement as I don't have a garage and renting a space is
pretty unattractive. I would really appreciate any advice (or even
ridiculous story's for that matter.)
Thanks,
Bryan
(Working on the wings).
---
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Wing tip lenses |
Used a tip from this website to drill the holes in the lenses. Worked good.
Regrind the cutting tip of a drill to 60 degrees instead of the factory
angle. When you drill thru the lens for the screws,you get a smooth hole with
no cracking.. I believe the drills sold for drilling plexiglass are this
angle. Might check the archives.
Dick 90558 fuselage waiting
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | re: flared fittings |
| From: | Mark Schrimmer <mschrimmer(at)pacbell.net> |
>If you go to www.parker.com and download their catalog for the 37 degree flair
>fittings (I think they call them triple lock), in there you will find a
>detailed description of the FFFT method which stands for Flats From Finger
>Tight.
The triple lock fittings seem to be made from steel, stainless steel or
brass. Aren't we using aluminum fittings? Does anybody know if you would
still use the same "Flats from Finger Tight" values for aluminum fittings as
you do for these other materials?
Mark Schrimmer
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Chris <chrisw3(at)cox.net> |
| Subject: | Re: re: flared fittings |
I'm pretty sure the FFFT method was developed because of the possibility of
connecting fittings of different materials and or plating. The different materials
will have different friction so a torque value would be too hard to determine for
all possible combinations. The only thing you might want to do is put a tiny pit
of lubrication on the fitting before you tighten it.
Chris
Mark Schrimmer wrote:
>
> >If you go to www.parker.com and download their catalog for the 37 degree flair
> >fittings (I think they call them triple lock), in there you will find a
> >detailed description of the FFFT method which stands for Flats From Finger
> >Tight.
>
> The triple lock fittings seem to be made from steel, stainless steel or
> brass. Aren't we using aluminum fittings? Does anybody know if you would
> still use the same "Flats from Finger Tight" values for aluminum fittings as
> you do for these other materials?
>
> Mark Schrimmer
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "C J Heitman" <cjh(at)execpc.com> |
If you decide on a blind rivet, you may want to consider a closed end rivet
which eliminates the leak path through the center of the rivet. 1/8"
diameter countersunk closed-end blind rivets are available here:
http://pegasusautoracing.com/pdfs/080.pdf (see Part No. 642-42-C) but I
don't know if 3/32" diameter ones are available.
Chris Heitman
RV-9A N94ME (reserved)
http://my.execpc.com/~cjh/rv9a.html
-----Original Message-----
I HAD FAILED TO INSTALL ONE RIVET. What do I do now?
---
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Ralph Cloud" <ercouper(at)flash.net> |
| Subject: | Pro seal measuring methods |
I have been trying to figure out something. To measure the mix for pro seal
by weight, without buying a diet scale or someting else. Isn't there a way
to configure a balance beam to compare the weights to get a 10 to 1 measure?
Any ideas
Ralph
Livermore
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "John Oliveira" <oliveira(at)frontiernet.net> |
remember, the Tank mounting brackets are riveted with blind rivets on the
back of the baffle plate. Just follow the same process. Dunk the rivet in
Pro Seal and have at it.
John Oliveira
----- Original Message -----
From: "C J Heitman" <cjh(at)execpc.com>
Subject: RE: RV9-List: horrors
>
> If you decide on a blind rivet, you may want to consider a closed end
rivet
> which eliminates the leak path through the center of the rivet. 1/8"
> diameter countersunk closed-end blind rivets are available here:
> http://pegasusautoracing.com/pdfs/080.pdf (see Part No. 642-42-C) but I
> don't know if 3/32" diameter ones are available.
>
> Chris Heitman
> RV-9A N94ME (reserved)
> http://my.execpc.com/~cjh/rv9a.html
>
> -----Original Message-----
>
> I HAD FAILED TO INSTALL ONE RIVET. What do I do now?
>
>
> ---
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "John Kerr" <kerrjohna(at)mtwest.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Pro seal measuring methods |
after struggling with this, including trying a digital postal scale accurate
to 1/10 ounce, decided that the quantities I was using still made for some
guessing. I ended up fill 60cc disposable syringes and metering the mix by
volume (1cc black with 10cc white). even at that measuring small quantities
of black is still a challenge.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Ralph Cloud" <ercouper(at)flash.net>
Subject: RV9-List: Pro seal measuring methods
>
> I have been trying to figure out something. To measure the mix for pro
seal
> by weight, without buying a diet scale or someting else. Isn't there a way
> to configure a balance beam to compare the weights to get a 10 to 1
measure?
>
> Any ideas
>
> Ralph
> Livermore
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Gary" <rv9er(at)3rivers.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Pro seal measuring methods |
You could just make a simple balance beam of scrap wood or aluminum, with one arm
10 times as far from the pivot point as the other. A lopsided teeter-totter
with a square of cereal box cardboard hung on each end to hold the components.
Make sure it sits level with the beam and whatever you use to place the material
on in place. Then it will take 10 times as much weight of one component
as the other to make it level again.
I have an Ohaus gram scale, so I just weighed them out.
The mix ratio is not critical, but it is nice to be fairly consistent, and not
have to buy more hardener.
Gary
----- Original Message -----
From: Ralph Cloud
To: rv9-list(at)matronics.com
Sent: Tuesday, March 11, 2003 11:08 PM
Subject: RV9-List: Pro seal measuring methods
I have been trying to figure out something. To measure the mix for pro seal
by weight, without buying a diet scale or someting else. Isn't there a way
to configure a balance beam to compare the weights to get a 10 to 1 measure?
Any ideas
Ralph
Livermore
---
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Leland <Federigo(at)pacbell.net> |
| Subject: | Re: RV9-List Digest: 18 Msgs - 03/11/03 |
Steve, at the time I cut wing tip lenses, I used a dremel tool with a fiberglass
wheel.
For the canopy I bought Van's cutoff discs (I think they are made by Norton). I
use both
types of wheels for fiberglass and the instrument panel. I'd assumed that the wing
tip
lenses were acrylic but they could well be polycarbonate. Polycarbonate is tougher
and
more flexible but scratches more readily. In terms of melting edges, there are
several
posts in the archives warning not to flame polish or melt acrylic or it may stress
crack
in time. A well known technique to avoid melting is to make several light passes
and use a
slower-speed drill motor.
Leland
>
> From: "Steve Sampson" <SSampson.SLN21(at)london.edu>
> Subject: RE: RV9-List: Re: Wing tip lenses
>
>
> Leland - is your cutting wheel steel or that dark brown fibery stuff? I have
> been using the latter. It cuts and melts - perhaps I will turn the speed
> down....but the job is almost done. Do you know what the lenses are made of
> ? They seem really robust. My confidence grew as I progressed. I was
> thinking if I could get a flat sheet of the same material I would make an
> inspection hatch beneath my wing leveller by the bellcrankso I can look at
> it for DI.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Steve Sampson" <SSampson.SLN21(at)london.edu> |
| Subject: | Re: RV9-List Digest: 18 Msgs - 03/11/03 |
Ralph / Leland - thanks for the inputs. Although I have been cutting/melting
the rough cuts I find the only way to get a good fit is then to sand them
down the last 1/8" or so, so melting is not in the equation at the end. I
have been sanding with rough paper then going up to 1200 as I get near
perfection! (Or as near as I ever get.) Its slow. The first one took about 5
hrs....but then building is part of the fun. Still I was out flying
today....not in an RV.
Regards, Steve.
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv9-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv9-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Leland
Subject: RV9-List: Re: RV9-List Digest: 18 Msgs - 03/11/03
Steve, at the time I cut wing tip lenses, I used a dremel tool with a
fiberglass wheel.
For the canopy I bought Van's cutoff discs (I think they are made by
Norton). I use both
types of wheels for fiberglass and the instrument panel. I'd assumed that
the wing tip
lenses were acrylic but they could well be polycarbonate. Polycarbonate is
tougher and
more flexible but scratches more readily. In terms of melting edges, there
are several
posts in the archives warning not to flame polish or melt acrylic or it may
stress crack
in time. A well known technique to avoid melting is to make several light
passes and use a
slower-speed drill motor.
Leland
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Albert Gardner" <albert.gardner(at)worldnet.att.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Pro seal measuring methods |
After you mess with this stuff for awhile the easiest way is to use a
Popsicle stick and use 1 dab of black and 10 of white and mix it up.
Albert Gardner
N872RV
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Rob W M Shipley" <Rob(at)RobsGlass.com> |
Ralph Cloud wrote
"I have been trying to figure out something. To measure the mix for pro seal
by weight, without buying a diet scale or someting else. Isn't there a way
to configure a balance beam to compare the weights to get a 10 to 1 measure?
Any ideas?"
A couple of years ago there was an enquiry from a nervous builder who had just
realised that he had accidently use half the amount of hardener necessary in his
tank. One of the wise old guys on the list told him not to worry since it
would still cure OK - just take longer.
When I heard this it made the exact ratio and use of a beam balance seem overly
precise so I made a test of the ability of Pro Seal to cure with ratios from
1:5 to 1:20. All cured well and sure enough the higher the ratio the longer it
took.
I made all my batches up by using two spoons. One for the Pro Seal and one about
a quarter the size for the hardener. Two good scoops of Pro Seal one level
scoop of hardener. It worked out fine and I reached the bottom of both containers
at the same time with everything cured well and testing air tight.
Don't get too anal. Mix up your batches with a somewhat close ratio and everything
will work fine.
I found that buttering the edges of the ribs with a popsicle stick worked well.
My Pro Seal was still usable two years after opening. Storage was in my garage
in San Diego.
Good luck
Rob
Rob W M Shipley
RV9A N919RV Fuselage.
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Videos on Construction of RV 9A |
I was going to buy the some Video's from Vans and wanted to get your reviews
first.
Does anyone recoomend the RV9 Empennage video?
How about the Tools of the trade?
What about the 21 year collection of the RVATOR?
Thanks,
Ned
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Videos on Construction of RV 9A |
Anyone know it the GBI Orndorf RV-9A Empennage video is the same as the Vans
RV-9A Empennage construction video? If not which is better?
Thanks,
Ned
----- Original Message -----
From: <315(at)cox.net>
Subject: RV9-List: Videos on Construction of RV 9A
>
> I was going to buy the some Video's from Vans and wanted to get your
reviews
> first.
>
> Does anyone recoomend the RV9 Empennage video?
>
> How about the Tools of the trade?
>
> What about the 21 year collection of the RVATOR?
>
> Thanks,
> Ned
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Glenn Brasch" <gbrasch(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Videos on Construction of RV 9A |
They are the same, and I found it informative and a good overview. Glenn in
AZ -9A Emp.
----- Original Message -----
From: <315(at)cox.net>
Subject: Re: RV9-List: Videos on Construction of RV 9A
>
> Anyone know it the GBI Orndorf RV-9A Empennage video is the same as the
Vans
> RV-9A Empennage construction video? If not which is better?
>
> Thanks,
> Ned
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: <315(at)cox.net>
> To:
> Subject: RV9-List: Videos on Construction of RV 9A
>
>
> >
> > I was going to buy the some Video's from Vans and wanted to get your
> reviews
> > first.
> >
> > Does anyone recoomend the RV9 Empennage video?
> >
> > How about the Tools of the trade?
> >
> > What about the 21 year collection of the RVATOR?
> >
> > Thanks,
> > Ned
> >
> >
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Gary" <rv9er(at)3rivers.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Videos on Construction of RV 9A |
I highly recommend the RVator collection. Selected articles with lots of good
info on a wide range of topics.
I borrowed the Orndorf videos. I consider them more or less for entertainment.
Not much practiclal how-to, and they definitely use methods I wouldn't (didn't)
use, and a level of craftsmanship that isn't up to par. Not comprehensive,
either. They would have to be MANY hours long to try to cover everything.
The best way to learn is get started, and find someone who is ahead of you to get
some coaching from. My opinion.
Gary
----- Original Message -----
From: 315(at)cox.net
To: rv9-list(at)matronics.com
Sent: Thursday, March 13, 2003 6:59 AM
Subject: RV9-List: Videos on Construction of RV 9A
I was going to buy the some Video's from Vans and wanted to get your reviews
first.
Does anyone recoomend the RV9 Empennage video?
How about the Tools of the trade?
What about the 21 year collection of the RVATOR?
Thanks,
Ned
---
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Steve Sampson" <SSampson.SLN21(at)london.edu> |
Starting to think about wiring issues - two questions come to mind:
1. How are wires (strobe/ tail light) normally taken off the rudder
onto the fuse so that mechanical movement of the wire does not lead to
failure of the wires and friction in the rudder system? The route is a bit
curious also. Presumably everyone is keeping the wires below the lowest
hinge?
2. For electric trim folk how are you joining the servo wires at the
back end. It almost needs two undoable joints. I) to be able to remove the
servo from inside the elevator, and ii) to disconnect the elevator from the
fuse. The aeroelectric solution 'A "Little Connector" Solution for MAC
servos . . .' seems to fit the bill for these but the idea of two connectors
seems to introduce complexityd can only reduce reliability. I wondered how
others have approached this.
Anyone have pictures of these?
Thanks Steve
#90360
N Yorks UK
Finish kit arriving today.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Albert Gardner" <albert.gardner(at)worldnet.att.net> |
I (and others) put the rudder light wires inside of some vinyl tubing. You
can come out of the rudder in the bottom of the opening for the lower hinge
and go into the tail cone in the area between the bottom skin and the VS
doubler. This makes a nice "S" turn and minimizes wires movement. Also there
are rubber grommets that have small ID's and quite large OD's. If you put 1
in the inboard HS rib and another in the HS rear spar, a small connector at
the trim servo in the elevator could be pulled clear back into the tail
cone.
Albert Gardner
N872RV
----- Original Message -----
From: "Steve Sampson" <SSampson.SLN21(at)london.edu>
Subject: RV9-List: Tail wiring
> Starting to think about wiring issues - two questions come to mind:
> 1. How are wires (strobe/ tail light) normally taken off the rudder
> onto the fuse so that mechanical movement of the wire does not lead to
> failure of the wires and friction in the rudder system? The route is a bit
> curious also. Presumably everyone is keeping the wires below the lowest
> hinge?
> 2. For electric trim folk how are you joining the servo wires at
the
> back end. It almost needs two undoable joints. I) to be able to remove the
> servo from inside the elevator, and ii) to disconnect the elevator from
the
> fuse. The aeroelectric solution 'A "Little Connector" Solution for MAC
> servos . . .' seems to fit the bill for these but the idea of two
connectors
> seems to introduce complexityd can only reduce reliability. I wondered how
> others have approached this.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Todd Houg <thoug(at)attglobal.net> |
| Subject: | RE: [RV-9A] Manual vs. electric elevator trim... |
Roger,
How about another option with the manual trim? I just updated my website to include
some pictures of my relocated manual trim control. To get the trim knob mounitng
plate and fuel selector housing out of the way, I relocated the trim knob
between the seats and angle the fuel selector housing down in the front. This
keeps them both out of the way!
Take a look at http://www.toddhoug.com and select the the "Manual Trim Control"
under the "Tips, Tricks, Tools and Mods" menu heading.
Todd Houg
N194TH - reserved
-----Original Message-----
From: rrd1_99
Subject: [RV-9A] Manual vs. electric elevator trim...
Ok, I hate to bring up this oldie again, but now it's crunch time on
the decision. I ordered my tail with manual trim, but I guess I'm
not 100% committed to this decision. I am tall, 6'3", and have read
that some people this size feel that the manual trim knob gets in the
way. But I like the positive feel of the manual, getting just the
right trim every time. Can anybody put the clincher on this for me,
or should I flip a coin?
Roger Barnes
To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
RV-9A-unsubscribe(at)egroups.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | BrownScottA(at)aol.com |
rv6-list(at)matronics.com, rv7-list(at)matronics.com, rv8-list(at)matronics.com,
rv9-list(at)matronics.com, kr-list(at)matronics.com
Hey guys,
I have a garmin 250xl brand new, never been installed for sale. Store price
is $2795, I will let it go to the first $2200. Please reply offline.
Thanks,
Scott
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Ron Murray" <Ronald_P_Murray(at)msn.com> |
| Subject: | Don't rivet till you have to! |
Don't rivet till you have to! This is advice someone gave me early in the construction
phase. Boy has that advice paid off. Let me give some of you new folks
some examples.
This really didn't come into play until I started working on the fuselage. Here
are a few examples:
Firewall: don't rivet it to the fuselage until you have your Fire Wall Forward
kit. I was able to easily and accurately drill several holes and install nutplates
instead of fooling around with screws (bolts) and washers and nuts. This
will make maintenance much easier in the future.
F-721B Aft canopy deck: (Slider) Don't rivet this to the longerons until after
you've fit the C-657 canopy roller track. You can easily install nutplates for
several of the screws while it is removable. Once it's riveted it would be
impossible to install these nutplates. Putting the nuts on these screws could
give you a real bad headache.
F-7112 and F-775 aft and rear top skins: Installing the empennage fairing requires
nutplates in the rear top skin. Plus several rivets must be removed for this
attachment. Easier to do this by removing a few clecos, rather than crawling
into the fear of the fuselage. (For sliders) Also, the canopy slide rail
is easier to install and remove if nutplates are used to join this to the top
skins, rather than screws and nuts.
I hope this helps someone!
Ron Murray #90291
Light wiring complete, working on canopy.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Leland <Federigo(at)pacbell.net> |
| Subject: | Choice of seat vendors |
Has anybody on this list compared the seats from Becky Orndorff with
those from D.J. Lauritsen (Cleaveland). The Lauritsen seats cost a bit
more but do they look better?
Leland in Pleasanton
Finally riveting on the skin over the baggage compartment
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Rob W M Shipley" <Rob(at)RobsGlass.com> |
| Subject: | Rudder pedal positioning |
I'm about ready to drill the rudder pedal bearing blocks to the brace and the stiffners.
I'm 6'1" and would really appreciate it if others who've got their 9's flying could
make some suggestions for hole positions.
Thanks guys.
Rob
Rob W M Shipley
RV9A N919RV Fuselage.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Gary" <rv9er(at)3rivers.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Choice of seat vendors |
Yes. I am extremely pleased with mine from DJ, and so is my picky wife. DJ will
also alter them anytime after you try them out at no charge. I can send photos
of mine if you would like. There is a layer of Conforfoam in the bottom
cushion, stick boots, arm rests, and a mid booster that goes between the bottom
cushion and the base wedge. They are all upholstered with great workmanship,
and have velcro to hold everything in place. The back cushions have a flap
that velcros to the seatback at the top to hold them in nicely.
I can send pictures off list if you like.
Gary
----- Original Message -----
From: Leland
To: RV9 List
Sent: Friday, March 14, 2003 11:15 PM
Subject: RV9-List: Choice of seat vendors
Has anybody on this list compared the seats from Becky Orndorff with
those from D.J. Lauritsen (Cleaveland). The Lauritsen seats cost a bit
more but do they look better?
Leland in Pleasanton
Finally riveting on the skin over the baggage compartment
---
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Gary" <rv9er(at)3rivers.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Rudder pedal positioning |
Rob....I am 6 ft, and I have them as far forward as the drawings recommend.......was
it 3 1/2 inches from the firewall? I made 4 sets of holes so they can be
moved later if someone else becomes captain. It would be easy to make new links
for the cables and move the pedals.
Mine is a -9A
Gary
----- Original Message -----
From: Rob W M Shipley
To: RV9-List Digest Server
Sent: Friday, March 14, 2003 11:52 PM
Subject: RV9-List: Rudder pedal positioning
I'm about ready to drill the rudder pedal bearing blocks to the brace and the
stiffners.
I'm 6'1" and would really appreciate it if others who've got their 9's flying
could make some suggestions for hole positions.
Thanks guys.
Rob
Rob W M Shipley
RV9A N919RV Fuselage.
---
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Ernest Kells" <ernest.kells(at)sympatico.ca> |
| Subject: | Re: Rudder pedal positioning |
> Rob.... I made 4 sets of holes so they can be moved later if someone else
becomes captain. It would be easy to make new links for the cables and move
the pedals. Mine is a -9A ... Gary
>> I'm about ready to drill the rudder pedal bearing blocks to the brace
and the stiffners. <<
Rob & Gary:
I have an RV-9A that is 85% complete. I have completed all tasks related to
this topic. Here is my thinking. The angles on the side are VERY
structural - I wanted to reduce the number of large holes.
The seat bottoms have three rows of adjustment. The seats should be put in
the centre position. Sit in YOUR airplane with your significant travel
companion. Adjust pedals, rudder cables, etc., for the best fit for both of
you. Agree to be travel companions forever. When you go cross-country (not
local) with someone else, move the seats to the forward row (really short
person), or to the rearward row (really tall person). Do this only on the
ground, after much grumbling.
For very major conditions (sale, death in the family, divorce, etc.,) you
may wish to redo the concept of the "centre position". Here is my thinking.
When you established the original block positions on the sides you drilled
two holes on each side angles plus two different holes on the centre brace.
I drilled two additional holes on each side, i.e.: drilled a forward hole
based upon the current forward hole becoming the future rear hole, and
likewise for the rearward hole. This means four holes on each side -
enabling three mounting positions. I did NOT drill the centre brace for
these additional holes as they will not line up with the other holes
(different spread). When you sell the plane - or you suddenly grow taller,
you can easily drill the two new required centre holes on the centre
bracket. Don't lose sleep over this. It is not a big deal.
Ernest Kells - RV-9A O235-N2C, Wood Prop
Finish Kit 95% Complete
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Gary" <rv9er(at)3rivers.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Rudder pedal positioning |
Earnest,
Your idea for 4 holes for 3 positions is fine. I only see one thing wrong with
your analysis. In my opinion the furthest forward position for the seat backs
is useless. If you put them there, the bottom cushions will not fit in the
seat wells, unless they are made too small for the other two positions.
If I were doing it again, I think I'd just mount the pedals where I want them,
and install only the rear two sets of hinges that mount the seatbacks. I am not
that tall or long legged, and I am using the furthest forward pedals and furthest
aft seat positions.
Gary
----- Original Message -----
From: Ernest Kells
To: rv9-list(at)matronics.com
Sent: Saturday, March 15, 2003 9:41 PM
Subject: Re: RV9-List: Rudder pedal positioning
> Rob.... I made 4 sets of holes so they can be moved later if someone else
becomes captain. It would be easy to make new links for the cables and move
the pedals. Mine is a -9A ... Gary
>> I'm about ready to drill the rudder pedal bearing blocks to the brace
and the stiffners. <<
Rob & Gary:
I have an RV-9A that is 85% complete. I have completed all tasks related to
this topic. Here is my thinking. The angles on the side are VERY
structural - I wanted to reduce the number of large holes.
The seat bottoms have three rows of adjustment. The seats should be put in
the centre position. Sit in YOUR airplane with your significant travel
companion. Adjust pedals, rudder cables, etc., for the best fit for both of
you. Agree to be travel companions forever. When you go cross-country (not
local) with someone else, move the seats to the forward row (really short
person), or to the rearward row (really tall person). Do this only on the
ground, after much grumbling.
For very major conditions (sale, death in the family, divorce, etc.,) you
may wish to redo the concept of the "centre position". Here is my thinking.
When you established the original block positions on the sides you drilled
two holes on each side angles plus two different holes on the centre brace.
I drilled two additional holes on each side, i.e.: drilled a forward hole
based upon the current forward hole becoming the future rear hole, and
likewise for the rearward hole. This means four holes on each side -
enabling three mounting positions. I did NOT drill the centre brace for
these additional holes as they will not line up with the other holes
(different spread). When you sell the plane - or you suddenly grow taller,
you can easily drill the two new required centre holes on the centre
bracket. Don't lose sleep over this. It is not a big deal.
Ernest Kells - RV-9A O235-N2C, Wood Prop
Finish Kit 95% Complete
---
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Andy Karmy" <andy(at)karmy.com> |
| Subject: | Re: [RV-9A] Andy, what's the fix for the heavy wing? |
Well.... It's like this. The word from Vans was that there is no easy fix for true
out of rig heavy wings on the RV9... No trailing edges to squeeze etc.
Now for the rest of the story. During wing construction I mounted the ailerons
& set to neutral per the instructions. Fixed the pushrod in place and mounted
the tips with nutplates and screws. So far so good. When I mounted the wings for
good at the airport many months later I had to face the task of rigging the
controls up to the aileron bellcranks for the first time. Lets just say I didn't
do it right and that was the start of my problems.
There are lots of places to adjust the rigging and they are all interrelated in
one way or another. By the time I was finished I had everything hooked up and
lined up, except the left wingtip was about 1/2" low compared to the neutral
position of the aileron. Now is when you should spend the time to figure out why
that is the case. I fairly quickly determined that I must have done something
wrong while mounting the tips way back when. I have heard of many RV4's and
6's that have had to slice the TE of the tip and reglass them in the proper location,
so I go off and cut the tip and reset "neutral" to be in line with the
rest of the controls.
DANGER, this is where i introduced all of my problems.
The original tip location was the right location and it was the ailerons and flaps
that were positioned wrong. I had trouble figuring out how to keep everything
in alingment while setting up the pushrods to the sticks etc.
So here's how to avoid all of this. Do the wings and tips like the manual says.
When mounting the wings, first mount the wings, then the ailerons, then the tips,
now you can clamp the aileron to the tip to hold neutral (you already set
that with the belcrank jig right?) Now you can adjust the rest of the pushrods
to match the fixed aileron locations and then adjust the flaps to match.
So in the end, I opened up everything, pulled the tips, reverted back to the airfoil
alingment in the tooling holes, reset all the links to neutral, reglassed
the tip back down and everything flys straight!
- Andy
---------- Original Message ----------------------------------
From: "Brian" <bsowell(at)digitex.net>
Date: Mon, 17 Mar 2003 15:09:50 -0000
>Thinking about the right corrective action for a heavy wing has kept
>me up at night. Have you taken care of this yet? What was
>recommended by Van's? What worked or didn't work?
>
>Thanks for everything you've done for us RV9ers.
>
>Brian
>9612S (reserved)
>Building the wings
>
>
>Make Money Online Auctions! Make $500.00 or We Will Give You Thirty Dollars for
Trying!
>http://us.click.yahoo.com/yMx78A/fNtFAA/46VHAA/1yWplB/TM
>
>To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
>RV-9A-unsubscribe(at)egroups.com
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Glenn Brasch" <gbrasch(at)earthlink.net> |
Dimpling a HS skin with a pneumatic as I am about to call it a night the thing
slips as I pull the trigger and I put a very nice hole in my skin. Of course
it is on the top side. It is 1" from the aft end and 1" in from the tip. I am
not sure how the fiberglass tips come into play later, but I don't think it
will help me in covering the hole. Is this something I can repair in the finishing/painting
process, or should I right now chalk it up to my stupidity and
buy a new skin? Your comments are appreciated in advance. Wish I could remain
anonymous! Glenn in Arizona. -9A Emp.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Glenn Brasch" <gbrasch(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | Hole in Skin Resolved |
It didn't take Scott Brown long to solve my problem (about 5 minutes) to put a
rivet in the hole, which will be covered later in the finishing process. DUH!
Looks good already. Thanks!
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | DThomas773(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Hole in Skin Resolved |
Hi Guys,
When I was back riveting my rudder skin to the stiffeners I riveted right off
the the back plate and sliced a big cut in the skin. $70 bucks, a 5 day
delay while new parts were being delivered and I learned to more careull. For
awhile at least.
Dennis Thomas
Fuselage
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Welch, Ivo" <ivo.welch(at)yale.edu> |
hi: I want to order a sensenich propeller for my RV-9A. (My Catto prop is
nice, but really does not allow me to idle the prop. It has too little
inertia
because it is too lightweight.)
now, the standard prop is 79 pitch. I would like some faster cruise speed.
usually, this would mean an 81 or 83 pitch. alas, the Vans guys have never
tried this, and are telling me that this could mean that the propeller is
overpitched, so that cruise goes down rather than up.
has anyone tried a pitch on an RV-9A that is >79? experiences would be
appreciated.
sincerely,
/iaw
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Larry PERRYMAN" <larry.perryman(at)atofina.com> |
03/20/2003 03:17:28 PM,
Serialize complete at 03/20/2003 03:17:28 PM
Ivo,
What cruise speeds were you seeing with the wood prop? I have been curious
how it would perform with a wood prop. I am currently flying a Quinti
electric adjustable on my Subaru powered 9 and seeing cruse speeds in the
160 - 170 range.
Regards,
Larry Perryman
"Welch, Ivo"
Sent by: owner-rv9-list-server(at)matronics.com
03/20/2003 07:00 AM
Please respond to rv9-list
To: rv9-list(at)matronics.com
cc:
Subject: RV9-List: prop pitch
hi: I want to order a sensenich propeller for my RV-9A. (My Catto prop
is
nice, but really does not allow me to idle the prop. It has too little
inertia
because it is too lightweight.)
now, the standard prop is 79 pitch. I would like some faster cruise
speed.
usually, this would mean an 81 or 83 pitch. alas, the Vans guys have
never
tried this, and are telling me that this could mean that the propeller is
overpitched, so that cruise goes down rather than up.
has anyone tried a pitch on an RV-9A that is >79? experiences would be
appreciated.
sincerely,
/iaw
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jones" <esnj(at)granbury.com> |
A lot of this decision depends on the engine that you are using. I am in
the early stages of testing my 9A which has a 150 HP O-320-E2D and a
Sensenich 70CM7S9-0-77 prop. I think that this 77 inch pitch prop will
certainly be all of the pitch I need with this engine. It has a static full
throttle RPM of about 2100. There is a lot of right rudder required on
take-off due to torque and "P-factor". The airplane doesn't want to
slowdown on landing with 1000 RPM with no wheel or gear leg fairings. I have
just installed the fairings and will start performance tests in the next day
or so.
Dick Jones
----- Original Message -----
From: "Welch, Ivo" <ivo.welch(at)yale.edu>
Subject: RV9-List: prop pitch
>
>
> hi: I want to order a sensenich propeller for my RV-9A. (My Catto prop
is
> nice, but really does not allow me to idle the prop. It has too little
> inertia
> because it is too lightweight.)
>
> now, the standard prop is 79 pitch. I would like some faster cruise
speed.
> usually, this would mean an 81 or 83 pitch. alas, the Vans guys have
never
> tried this, and are telling me that this could mean that the propeller is
> overpitched, so that cruise goes down rather than up.
>
> has anyone tried a pitch on an RV-9A that is >79? experiences would be
> appreciated.
>
> sincerely,
>
> /iaw
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Ed Zercher" <ez(at)sensenich.com> |
Hello Ivo,
Well, obviously we are still collecting data on this, but I have had 1
customer go up from his 79 to an 80 and was quite happy with it. Everyone
else has been holding steady with the 79. There is not a big difference
between the two so I so no reason why you couldn't consider the 80 pitch
right now. Keep in mind that when we call out a 79 pitch as standard, it is
already leaning towards cruise because a) everyone wants to go fast and b)
the RV-9A jumps off the ground anyway.
Why not try the 80 and see how you like it. The pitch can always be changed
down the road. I would however not change the pitch until you try it during
those high density altitude days of summer.
If you have any other questions or problems, please let me know. I'm looking
forward to working with you!
Ed
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Andy Karmy" <andy(at)karmy.com> |
Hi Ivo,
You are flying 944KS right? I live about 30 min from Kevin that built it originally...
So the main question is, what's your definition of cruise and what speeds are you
looking for?
I have the Vans recomended 79 inch and find that I can overspeed it at low altitude,
but up higher it's no problem. So at 3000ft I cruise at 160mph ish with
2400rpm, but at 8000 - 13.5 I can run wide open without hitting the 2600rpm limit
and get 180TAS. I know Sam B has a higher pitch and reports that he can go
wide open at lower altitudes.
So define you cruise parameters and then look at the options.
FYI with the 79 I get 1700fpm solo in climb at sea level and 700fpm at 13Kft!
- Andy
---------- Original Message ----------------------------------
From: "Welch, Ivo" <ivo.welch(at)yale.edu>
Date: Thu, 20 Mar 2003 08:00:57 -0500
>
>
>hi: I want to order a sensenich propeller for my RV-9A. (My Catto prop is
>nice, but really does not allow me to idle the prop. It has too little
>inertia
>because it is too lightweight.)
>
>now, the standard prop is 79 pitch. I would like some faster cruise speed.
>usually, this would mean an 81 or 83 pitch. alas, the Vans guys have never
>tried this, and are telling me that this could mean that the propeller is
>overpitched, so that cruise goes down rather than up.
>
>has anyone tried a pitch on an RV-9A that is >79? experiences would be
>appreciated.
>
>sincerely,
>
>/iaw
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Andy Karmy" <andy(at)karmy.com> |
I had this exact same problem, made for nice greaser landings as it floated forever...
I lowered the idle RPM to 500 and WOW now you actually can desend to the
runway when you pull the throttle!
Try it, you'll like it.
- Andy (23.5 TT!)
---------- Original Message ----------------------------------
From: "Jones" <esnj(at)granbury.com>
>The airplane doesn't want to
>slowdown on landing with 1000 RPM with no wheel or gear leg fairings.
>Dick Jones
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Steve Sampson" <SSampson.SLN21(at)london.edu> |
I wonder if I have made a mistake? I have slightly more down travel on the
trim tab than up, ie more nose up. Is this correct? There was a comment on
this recently which I have lost.
To those that have completed. Does the trim ever achieve its limits or is
there more range than needed?
Thanks, Steve
#90360
N Yorks., UK
About to start finish kit.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Andy Karmy" <andy(at)karmy.com> |
Per Scott McDaniels you should have more up than down, and in practice you will
hardly ever need much down trim (ie the trim tab moving up!) :)
Also I did runaway trim testing and you can still fly with the electric trim at
either end of the limits, however it takes 2 hands on the stick to hold it level
with either push or pull. Quite exciting I must say! I suppose you could fly
that way for a few min and get through a landing, but it wouldn't be fun.
So, to setup, just run the trim servo a bit down first, then set the link to neutral
so you get more up push, then try it through the ranges and see what you
get.
- Andy
---------- Original Message ----------------------------------
From: "Steve Sampson" <SSampson.SLN21(at)london.edu>
Date: Thu, 20 Mar 2003 15:23:57 -0000
>
>I wonder if I have made a mistake? I have slightly more down travel on the
>trim tab than up, ie more nose up. Is this correct? There was a comment on
>this recently which I have lost.
>
>To those that have completed. Does the trim ever achieve its limits or is
>there more range than needed?
>
>Thanks, Steve
>#90360
>N Yorks., UK
>About to start finish kit.
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Tip Up release mechanism interference |
| From: | Rick Smith <ricks3(at)us.ibm.com> |
03/20/2003 14:43:42,
Serialize complete at 03/20/2003 14:43:42
Greetings Everyone,
Just got my tail kit and am close to ordering a 9a QB but am rethinking
the decision to go with a tip up because of the awkward canopy jettison
mechanism.
having built and flown a RV-6 with a slider, my -9 will be a trike with
the tip up for visibility, ease of mantenance and better sealing that is
possible.
But that darn canopy release mechanism, the unsightly handle sticking out
of the panel, and the structure to support it is in the way of a central
avionics stack and after looking at the plans cannot see an elegant way to
operate the release.
Has anyone worked out a good solution?
Something using a push pull cable or bellcranks to move the handle to
under the dash may work okay. Wish I had a chance to see one.
One other thing....now that the tip up canopys have dual gas springs the
canopy jettison feature would seem to be kind of useless. It would be
ugly indeed to try and jettison but have it held on in front with those
gas struts.
Anyone else thinking along these lines?
Thanks Guys,
Rick
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Steve Sampson" <SSampson.SLN21(at)london.edu> |
Andy - thanks for that. It sounds as though I have erred in the right
direction. Yes, runaway trim does not sound like a barrel of laughs! Steve.
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv9-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv9-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Andy Karmy
Subject: Re: RV9-List: Trim
Per Scott McDaniels you should have more up than down, and in practice you
will hardly ever need much down trim (ie the trim tab moving up!) :)
Also I did runaway trim testing and you can still fly with the electric trim
at either end of the limits, however it takes 2 hands on the stick to hold
it level with either push or pull. Quite exciting I must say! I suppose you
could fly that way for a few min and get through a landing, but it wouldn't
be fun.
So, to setup, just run the trim servo a bit down first, then set the link to
neutral so you get more up push, then try it through the ranges and see what
you get.
- Andy
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Roy Taylor" <Royandjilly(at)btinternet.com> |
I'm going to re-do the fuel pipe from the pump to the Andair gascolator on the
bottom left of firewall as you look back at it. I'd be interested to know how
you managed the bends in the 3/8" tube and where you put them. I can't get a very
tight radius in the tube, and the minimum distance between 90* fittings is
limited by the length of tube you need to get the flaring tool on....are you
with me? I've either got a lot of pipe to get hot on the firewall side, or too
much in front of the pedals!
Roy, Somerset, UK.
(thinking of our lads in the Gulf)
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Hole in Skin Resolved |
| From: | "Ted Strand" <tstrand(at)strandcentral.com> |
I must confess I did the same exact thing with the rudder. I also had a
drill bit recently snap that caused the chuck to make a large hole in
the elevator. The money wasn't as bad as the frustration and time...
I have learned a lot from the experiences. I can say that things go
together much easier the second time.
-Ted Strand-
Finishing Empennage
Clearwater, FL
-----Original Message-----
From: DThomas773(at)aol.com [mailto:DThomas773(at)aol.com]
Subject: Re: RV9-List: Hole in Skin Resolved
Hi Guys,
When I was back riveting my rudder skin to the stiffeners I riveted
right off
the the back plate and sliced a big cut in the skin. $70 bucks, a 5 day
delay while new parts were being delivered and I learned to more
careull. For
awhile at least.
Dennis Thomas
Fuselage
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jim Hosie" <jhosie4(at)attbi.com> |
Working on the right wing (first one I'm doing) the w-905 bottom wing
skin lines up 100% with the w- 911 and w-912 ribs except the 7th hole
from the trailing edge in w-905 with the four outboard w-912 ribs.
I looked at all wing skins and none will line up with 912 bottom flange.
(At the 7th hole from the trailing edge.)
The 7th hole in the W-912 bottom flange seems to off set and I can't
figure out why.
Has anyone else encountered this?
Jim
Jim Hosie
916-730-8764
N-9SU
Wings, Folsom California
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jim Hosie" <jhosie4(at)attbi.com> |
Hi,
I'm fitting the elevators to the HS.
With the bearing rods in place and adjusted out to 1 27/32 it all lines
up very well, I think?
The elevator in the down position the elevators horns hit the spar on
the HS, makes sense and no rubbing or binding anywhere.
However moving the elevator upward there is no stop and eventually the
upper skin on the elevator hit the upper edge of the HS skin/span seam.
My question is how far upward is the elevator supposed to go? Is there
a max angle?
I think I'm fine, but I would like a second opinion before drilling that
last hole in the horn.
Thanks
Jim
N-9SU
Wings ship on 1/20/03, yes!
Jim Hosie
916-730-8764
N-9SU
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Miller Robert <rmiller3(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Tip Up release mechanism interference |
> Has anyone worked out a good solution?
> Something using a push pull cable or bellcranks to move the handle to
> under the dash may work okay. Wish I had a chance to see one.
>
Someone did exactly this.
There are photos on the web. Looked pretty good, and I hope to do something
similar.
Problem is... I cannot remember, and have not again found, the website.
Definitely RV site... but, Matronics, Yahoo?
If anyone knows who's site ths was on...
Robert
Rick Smith wrote:
>
> Greetings Everyone,
> Just got my tail kit and am close to ordering a 9a QB but am rethinking
> the decision to go with a tip up because of the awkward canopy jettison
> mechanism.
> having built and flown a RV-6 with a slider, my -9 will be a trike with
> the tip up for visibility, ease of mantenance and better sealing that is
> possible.
> But that darn canopy release mechanism, the unsightly handle sticking out
> of the panel, and the structure to support it is in the way of a central
> avionics stack and after looking at the plans cannot see an elegant way to
> operate the release.
> Has anyone worked out a good solution?
> Something using a push pull cable or bellcranks to move the handle to
> under the dash may work okay. Wish I had a chance to see one.
> One other thing....now that the tip up canopys have dual gas springs the
> canopy jettison feature would seem to be kind of useless. It would be
> ugly indeed to try and jettison but have it held on in front with those
> gas struts.
> Anyone else thinking along these lines?
> Thanks Guys,
> Rick
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Richard Tasker <retasker(at)optonline.net> |
Yes, and Van's knows about it already. The ribs were punched wrong.
They said to ignore the existing holes in the ribs and just drill a new
hole in the ribs using the existing skin hole. And, yes, they know they
are really close.
Dick Tasker, 90573
Left wing
Jim Hosie wrote:
>Has anyone else encountered this?
>
>
>Jim
>
>Jim Hosie
>916-730-8764
>N-9SU
>Wings, Folsom California
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Curt Hoffman" <choffman9(at)cinci.rr.com> |
There have been several comments on this problem from other builders. I had
the exact same issue with a single hole not lining up on I think 4 ribs on
the bottom skin. It appears that the computer hole puncher hiccuped when
doing that hole. I told Vans about two years ago when I first assembled my
wings but I guess he likes having everyone do the same fix. I called them
and they said to use the skin as the correct hole and drill a new one into
the ribs. Leave the extra empty hole in the rib alone. So that is what I
did.
Curt Hoffman
RV-9A wings done for now- working on tail
1968 Mustang 302 convertible
Piper Cherokee N5320W
----- Original Message -----
From: "Jim Hosie" <jhosie4(at)attbi.com>
Subject: RV9-List: Wing Help
>
> Working on the right wing (first one I'm doing) the w-905 bottom wing
> skin lines up 100% with the w- 911 and w-912 ribs except the 7th hole
> from the trailing edge in w-905 with the four outboard w-912 ribs.
>
> I looked at all wing skins and none will line up with 912 bottom flange.
> (At the 7th hole from the trailing edge.)
> The 7th hole in the W-912 bottom flange seems to off set and I can't
> figure out why.
>
>
> Has anyone else encountered this?
>
>
> Jim
>
> Jim Hosie
> 916-730-8764
> N-9SU
> Wings, Folsom California
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Gary" <rv9er(at)3rivers.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Tip Up release mechanism interference |
We have discussed this several times. Check the archives for this list, and the
RV-9 list. Or go to http://www.matronics.com/photoshare/rv9er@3rivers.net.10.12.2002/index.html
for the photo share pics.
I can't take photos of mine anymore, because it is all covered up. You just put
the existing handle up inside the tube from below, and throw the bellcrank away.
You can safety the handle to keep it secure.
Or use Dan Checkoway's method, and put AN4 bolts in for hinge pins. If you need
to get the canopy off later, you can crawl under and get the bolts out.
It is generally believed by Van's and other individuals that jettisoning a canopy
on a side-by side in flight would not be possible, or would take your face
with it if it did go.
Gary
----- Original Message -----
From: Miller Robert
To: rv9-list(at)matronics.com
Sent: Thursday, March 20, 2003 5:18 PM
Subject: Re: RV9-List: Tip Up release mechanism interference
> Has anyone worked out a good solution?
> Something using a push pull cable or bellcranks to move the handle to
> under the dash may work okay. Wish I had a chance to see one.
>
Someone did exactly this.
There are photos on the web. Looked pretty good, and I hope to do something
similar.
Problem is... I cannot remember, and have not again found, the website.
Definitely RV site... but, Matronics, Yahoo?
If anyone knows who's site ths was on...
Robert
Rick Smith wrote:
>
> Greetings Everyone,
> Just got my tail kit and am close to ordering a 9a QB but am rethinking
> the decision to go with a tip up because of the awkward canopy jettison
> mechanism.
> having built and flown a RV-6 with a slider, my -9 will be a trike with
> the tip up for visibility, ease of mantenance and better sealing that is
> possible.
> But that darn canopy release mechanism, the unsightly handle sticking out
> of the panel, and the structure to support it is in the way of a central
> avionics stack and after looking at the plans cannot see an elegant way to
> operate the release.
> Has anyone worked out a good solution?
> Something using a push pull cable or bellcranks to move the handle to
> under the dash may work okay. Wish I had a chance to see one.
> One other thing....now that the tip up canopys have dual gas springs the
> canopy jettison feature would seem to be kind of useless. It would be
> ugly indeed to try and jettison but have it held on in front with those
> gas struts.
> Anyone else thinking along these lines?
> Thanks Guys,
> Rick
---
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Gary" <rv9er(at)3rivers.net> |
Yes. Van's screwed up that one hole in those ribs. You should be able to just
ignore it, and match drill one in the rib to match the one in the skin. Watch
your edge distance. Check with Van's to be sure, then tell them to fix it for
the guys down the line.
What is your kit number? I'd have thought they'd fixed this by now. Mine was
#90263. My wings have been done for a year and a half, and I talked to them about
it then.
Gary
----- Original Message -----
From: Jim Hosie
To: rv9-list(at)matronics.com
Sent: Thursday, March 20, 2003 4:56 PM
Subject: RV9-List: Wing Help
Working on the right wing (first one I'm doing) the w-905 bottom wing
skin lines up 100% with the w- 911 and w-912 ribs except the 7th hole
from the trailing edge in w-905 with the four outboard w-912 ribs.
I looked at all wing skins and none will line up with 912 bottom flange.
(At the 7th hole from the trailing edge.)
The 7th hole in the W-912 bottom flange seems to off set and I can't
figure out why.
Has anyone else encountered this?
Jim
Jim Hosie
916-730-8764
N-9SU
Wings, Folsom California
---
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Gary" <rv9er(at)3rivers.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Elevator to HS |
Wait for your fuselage. Or read the preview plans (What! You didn't get them?!!).
There are both up and down elevator stops in the fuselage.
Gary
----- Original Message -----
From: Jim Hosie
To: rv9-list(at)matronics.com
Sent: Thursday, March 20, 2003 4:56 PM
Subject: RV9-List: Elevator to HS
Hi,
I'm fitting the elevators to the HS.
With the bearing rods in place and adjusted out to 1 27/32 it all lines
up very well, I think?
The elevator in the down position the elevators horns hit the spar on
the HS, makes sense and no rubbing or binding anywhere.
However moving the elevator upward there is no stop and eventually the
upper skin on the elevator hit the upper edge of the HS skin/span seam.
My question is how far upward is the elevator supposed to go? Is there
a max angle?
I think I'm fine, but I would like a second opinion before drilling that
last hole in the horn.
Thanks
Jim
N-9SU
Wings ship on 1/20/03, yes!
Jim Hosie
916-730-8764
N-9SU
---
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | ivo welch <ivo.welch(at)yale.edu> |
hi guys: thanks for all your comments.
larry: I have not systematically determined my airspeed. I am also a bit
envious that you have a Subaru powered RV9A. I hear they are very quiet. Are
you happy with it? On my Lycoming 160hp, I do not get TAS of 160-170mph at
10,000' altitude. I seem to be getting something more like 150mph, but again,
this is more impression than fact.
dick: I forgot to say that I have the 160hp Lycoming dinosaur. And, yes, my
plane too requires considerable right rudder right now. I need to get myself a
little rudder trim made. Slowing down an RV-9A is definitely not an easy task.
Most people who start flying one and want to do an ordinary VFR landing
(power-off landing) rather than a powered-type IFR landing overshoot the
runway. Believe me: I have done this many times. It is hard to get the RV-9A
to stop flying. I sometimes think I own a sailing plane with an engine.
Incidentally, for builders who have not yet flown: be ready for a goaround if
you cannot get the plane down. Don't be too eager. the hardest aspect of
flying the RV-9A is post-landing ground handling. It is not *very* hard,
though reasonably challenging. (in comparison, everything else is easy flying.
on the 9A.) I think the main "problem" is that the 9A is just a very light
plane. I also sometimes wonder if the landing tires are closer together than
they are on the pipers, but I think the flimsier and freely moving front wheel
together with the powerful rudder is what makes control after landing more
difficult. Maybe it might have been better for the 9A not to let the front
wheel pivot so freely, but to give it a tendency to want to keep straight.
(Anyone tried this? Maybe two small springs could do the job.)
ed: thanks again for your email. great to see you on this forum, too. The
RV-9A definitely is a real jumper off the ground. I see 2000fpm alone and
1500fpm with a passenger. This is at sea level. I vaguely remember that I can
still get standard IFR climb rates at 11,000 feet with passenger during the
absolute heat wave on the east coast last year. At this altitude, I stopped
experimenting. In other words, this thing climbs so fast, climb speed is not a
concern. This is also why I can pitch higher if this were to get me more
cruise speed.
I think I can only order 79 or 81 from Vans. So, I posted here to get an
educated guess on whether the 81 is too overspun for maximum cruise speed. I
gather from your note that you are not sure, but you would guess not.
Andy: you are correct, I am flying N994KS. Kevin did a great job (and is a
really nice chap, too!) I got lucky. Now, how do you determine that something
is "oversped" rather than "undersped"? Does Sam B get better cruise TAS
speeds? (I presume these are all impressions, anyway, as this is really
difficult to determine, except in a perfectly controlled wind tunnel.)
And, for those of you who are wondering about avionics, my panel revamp plan is
at http://welch.som.yale.edu/n994ks/newpanel.html . I have learned from flying
what I want.
thanks again, and regards,
/iaw
PS: I only subscribe to the list, so I only get once per day the emails.
--
Ivo Welch, Professor of Finance/Economics, Yale/SOM+NBER
http://welch.som.yale.edu/
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Ed Zercher" <ez(at)sensenich.com> |
Ivo and all,
Since Ivo made the statement, "I think I can only order 79 or 81 from Vans,"
and I hear it all the time, I thought I would get the word out that you can
order whichever pitch best suits your aircraft's needs. In Ivo's case, if
you would like to start out sitting on the fence, you may order an 80 pitch.
The 70CM series can be ordered anywhere from a 73 to an 84.
Ed
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Ken" <ken(at)peggyking.com> |
| Subject: | w-905 bottom wing |
I found this also, along with some other things that I dedided to
change/correct. The list is copied below. Sorry for the lengthy discourse.
Ken Anderson
Kirkland, WA
RV 9A Builder 90376
Wing Construction Instruction and drawing suggestions
1. Description, Part # or process
2. Drawing
3. Problem statement
4. Corrective action
5. Sketch or photo
1. Wing panel outer, bottom. Match drilling to ribs
2. Drawing
3. The outer four ribs do not have matching holes ( the fourth hole from
the
TE is misplaced by xx inches
4. Drilled rib to match hole in the skin
1. Rivets -Flap & Aileron Fairings to wing skin
2. Drawing
3. The rivets called out were AN4260AD3-3. They should be AN4260AD3-3.5.
4. Used AN4260AD3-3.5 rivets
1. Aileron drill counterbalance tube to rib
2. Drawing
3. The instructions say to drill the mark/drill the counterbalance tube
to
the spar/fwd rib assembly. This could (and did) cause the counterbalance
tube to put a built-in twist to the aileron assembly.
4. Wait until after attaching the bottom skin on the main ribs with keeper
rivets, and make sure the aileron is flat on the bench top before marking
and drilling the counterbalance tube.
1. Aileron spar
2. Drawing
3. The right spar (A-90xx-R) is identical to the left spar. I expected
a
mirror image, because the holes for the fwd ribs are not symmetrical ( the
center hole is located more toward the top hole). Also, the spar inboard
end is different from the outboard end. Therefore, the holes for the fwd
ribs do not match the holes on the spar ( the ribs would otherwise be upside
down.)
4. Re-drill the spar to match the center hole on the fwd ribs. The spar
ends up with an extra hole for each rib.
1. Aileron Spar to skin rivets
2. Drawing 11
3. The rivets callout for the spar-skin-leading edge skin is a 3.5.
Measuring with a gauge, it seems that the rivets are a little short.
4. I chose to use AN4260AD3-4 rivets, although the called for rivets would
be sufficient.
1. Aileron trailing edge rivet callout
2. Drawing 11
3. The callout for the trailing edge rivets is for AN4260AD3-3.0 rivets.
Which were to short
4. I chose to use AN4260AD3-3.5 rivets
Working on the right wing (first one I'm doing) the w-905 bottom wing
skin lines up 100% with the w- 911 and w-912 ribs except the 7th hole
from the trailing edge in w-905 with the four outboard w-912 ribs.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "The Strong's" <tstrong(at)ida.net> |
This is interesting. My kit number is #90489 and those holes are still
mismatched. I guess Van's just likes to make
sure they will have a few easy questions to answer.
Tom (working on wings)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | JOHN KERR <kerrjohna(at)comcast.net> |
there is an extra hole in the bottom of the leaing edge skin, about
where the pitot will go but it misses the spar flange. what is its
purpost?
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "John Oliveira" <oliveira(at)frontiernet.net> |
The hole for the tie downs
John Oliveira - 90054
Fuselage arrives this week - Wings and Tail done
----- Original Message -----
From: "JOHN KERR" <kerrjohna(at)comcast.net>
Subject: RV9-List: estra hole
>
>
> there is an extra hole in the bottom of the leaing edge skin, about
> where the pitot will go but it misses the spar flange. what is its
> purpost?
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Leland <Federigo(at)pacbell.net> |
| Subject: | Re: RV9A Prop Pitch |
Ivo, here are some thoughts on your posting and website:
With regard to your nosewheel steering, Van's specifies a specific
breakout force for setting the big nosewheel nut. This could affect
ground handling. This procedure would be shown on the plans (also on
the Preview plans).
On your panel layout, the glovebox is too low and will encounter
interferences. Consider buying the the rather inexpensive glovebox kit
which has drawings with it.
When Fabian Leffler redoes your panel, be sure he has full access to
your ship as you have to finagle instrument locations to avoid
interference with the ribs.
People tell me that the SL40 is a much better radio than the ICOM 760
although it will cost $300 more. Consider buying your avionics from John
Stark at Stark Avionics in Georgia as he gives the best prices and good
service, as noted by a number of other listers.
Happy flying
Leland
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jim Hosie" <jhosie4(at)attbi.com> |
Thanks everyone for the help with the w-912 ribs, BTW my kit is 90640 and
the wing kit arrived in feb. 2003 with the incorrect holes.
Sealing tanks this weekend...
Jim Hosie
----- Original Message -----
From: "The Strong's" <tstrong(at)ida.net>
Subject: Re: RV9-List: Wing Help
>
> This is interesting. My kit number is #90489 and those holes are still
> mismatched. I guess Van's just likes to make
> sure they will have a few easy questions to answer.
>
>
> Tom (working on wings)
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jones" <esnj(at)granbury.com> |
| Subject: | Re: RV9A Prop Pitch |
Ivo:
Thanks for your reply. You have some excellent advice for landings. I just
wish I had read your note before I went to fly Friday afternoon. It was my
first flight with wheel and gear leg fairings. I'm now waiting for Van's to
open so I can order a new nose gear strut and associated fiberglass. Also,
I hope I get good news from the prop shop. As I was warned by some 6A guys,
you just better not land these things too fast. Live and hopefully learn!
Dick Jones
----- Original Message -----
From: "ivo welch" <ivo.welch(at)yale.edu>
Subject: RV9-List: RV9A Prop Pitch
>
>
> hi guys: thanks for all your comments.
>
>
> larry: I have not systematically determined my airspeed. I am also a bit
> envious that you have a Subaru powered RV9A. I hear they are very quiet.
Are
> you happy with it? On my Lycoming 160hp, I do not get TAS of 160-170mph
at
> 10,000' altitude. I seem to be getting something more like 150mph, but
again,
> this is more impression than fact.
>
>
> dick: I forgot to say that I have the 160hp Lycoming dinosaur. And, yes,
my
> plane too requires considerable right rudder right now. I need to get
myself a
> little rudder trim made. Slowing down an RV-9A is definitely not an easy
task.
> Most people who start flying one and want to do an ordinary VFR landing
> (power-off landing) rather than a powered-type IFR landing overshoot the
> runway. Believe me: I have done this many times. It is hard to get the
RV-9A
> to stop flying. I sometimes think I own a sailing plane with an engine.
>
> Incidentally, for builders who have not yet flown: be ready for a
goaround if
> you cannot get the plane down. Don't be too eager. the hardest aspect
of
> flying the RV-9A is post-landing ground handling. It is not *very* hard,
> though reasonably challenging. (in comparison, everything else is easy
flying.
> on the 9A.) I think the main "problem" is that the 9A is just a very
light
> plane. I also sometimes wonder if the landing tires are closer together
than
> they are on the pipers, but I think the flimsier and freely moving front
wheel
> together with the powerful rudder is what makes control after landing more
> difficult. Maybe it might have been better for the 9A not to let the
front
> wheel pivot so freely, but to give it a tendency to want to keep straight.
> (Anyone tried this? Maybe two small springs could do the job.)
>
>
> ed: thanks again for your email. great to see you on this forum, too.
The
> RV-9A definitely is a real jumper off the ground. I see 2000fpm alone and
> 1500fpm with a passenger. This is at sea level. I vaguely remember that
I can
> still get standard IFR climb rates at 11,000 feet with passenger during
the
> absolute heat wave on the east coast last year. At this altitude, I
stopped
> experimenting. In other words, this thing climbs so fast, climb speed is
not a
> concern. This is also why I can pitch higher if this were to get me more
> cruise speed.
>
> I think I can only order 79 or 81 from Vans. So, I posted here to get an
> educated guess on whether the 81 is too overspun for maximum cruise speed.
I
> gather from your note that you are not sure, but you would guess not.
>
>
> Andy: you are correct, I am flying N994KS. Kevin did a great job (and is
a
> really nice chap, too!) I got lucky. Now, how do you determine that
something
> is "oversped" rather than "undersped"? Does Sam B get better cruise TAS
> speeds? (I presume these are all impressions, anyway, as this is really
> difficult to determine, except in a perfectly controlled wind tunnel.)
>
>
> And, for those of you who are wondering about avionics, my panel revamp
plan is
> at http://welch.som.yale.edu/n994ks/newpanel.html . I have learned from
flying
> what I want.
>
> thanks again, and regards,
>
> /iaw
>
> PS: I only subscribe to the list, so I only get once per day the emails.
>
> --
> Ivo Welch, Professor of Finance/Economics, Yale/SOM+NBER
> http://welch.som.yale.edu/
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Matt Dralle <dralle(at)matronics.com> |
| Subject: | 7-Day Matronics List Browse Enhancement... |
Dear Listers,
Neil Hulin of the Zenith-List at Matronics wrote to me suggesting I add a
"total of available messages" column to the 7-Day List Browse Main page,
and it seemed like a great idea! I've made the modifications and I think
many will find it extremely helpful as well. Have a look at the following URL:
http://www.matronics.com/listbrowse/
Best regards,
Matt Dralle
Matronics Email List Admin...
Matt G Dralle | Matronics | PO Box 347 | Livermore | CA | 94551
925-606-1001 V | 925-606-6281 F | dralle(at)matronics.com Email
http://www.matronics.com/ WWW | Featuring Products For Aircraft
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Matthew Brandes <mbrandes(at)irr.com> |
| Subject: | RE: RV9-List Digest: 4 Msgs - 03/21/03 |
Ed,
Can you give us a short primer on propellers for those of us not quite in
the know yet. (You may have an FAQ already typed up.)
I was flipping through my "Bingelis on Engines" book last night and he
described pitch as "... the distance in inches that a propeller section will
advance in one revolution. Both blade angle and pitch are measured at the
airfoil section located at 75% of the blade radius, but apparently not
always in the same manner."
Given this (and his example) the pitch of a blade is determined by it's
diameter. How does one re-pitch a blade? Are you really just changing the
angle of the blade?
Matthew
RV-9A
.. and a long way from choosing a prop.
-----Original Message-----
From: RV9-List Digest Server
Subject: RV9-List Digest: 4 Msgs - 03/21/03
______ Message 2______________________
From: "Ed Zercher" <ez(at)sensenich.com>
Subject: RE: RV9-List: RV9A Prop Pitch
Ivo and all,
Since Ivo made the statement, "I think I can only order 79 or 81 from
Vans,"
and I hear it all the time, I thought I would get the word out that you
can
order whichever pitch best suits your aircraft's needs. In Ivo's case,
if
you would like to start out sitting on the fence, you may order an 80
pitch.
The 70CM series can be ordered anywhere from a 73 to an 84.
Ed
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Gozewijn Vlasblom" <vlasblom(at)ripnet.com> |
| Subject: | Free castering nose wheel |
There was a report about nose wheel shimmering after landing.
This is a problem that I am familiar with.
I presently fly a Grumman Tiger. This plane is very comparible to an RV,
particularly on the ground.
The nose wheel of a tiger is limited in the movement along the vertical axis
by means of friction washers. I tighten the bolt on the vertical axel until
I need 20 lbs of traction on the nose wheel axel to make it move. For this I
use a fisherman's scale! Very unsophisticated but very easy and effective.
Hope this will elp.
Goz Vlasblom 90171
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Larry Perryman" <larry-perryman(at)txucom.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Free castering nose wheel |
This is the same procedure described for the RV also.
It works.
Regards
Larry Perryman
----- Original Message -----
From: "Gozewijn Vlasblom" <vlasblom(at)ripnet.com>
Subject: RV9-List: Free castering nose wheel
>
> There was a report about nose wheel shimmering after landing.
> This is a problem that I am familiar with.
> I presently fly a Grumman Tiger. This plane is very comparible to an RV,
> particularly on the ground.
> The nose wheel of a tiger is limited in the movement along the vertical
axis
> by means of friction washers. I tighten the bolt on the vertical axel
until
> I need 20 lbs of traction on the nose wheel axel to make it move. For this
I
> use a fisherman's scale! Very unsophisticated but very easy and effective.
> Hope this will elp.
> Goz Vlasblom 90171
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Ken Moak <ken_moak(at)yahoo.com> |
| Subject: | Wing Jig Question |
Thanks to everyone that helped me with the empennage.
A Technical Counselor (Jim) came out last week and the
first milestone has happened. No rework, so I closed
things up. Thanks to all the advise, either direct or
in the archives.
Now I'm starting the Wing and have a couple of
questions.
1. About how heavy is a wing?
2. About how far off the uprights do you place the
spar? I am making it movable much like Todd Houg
shows on his WEB site. I have a cross member running
between my uprights and need to determine how much
space I need to get between the wing and the cross
member.
3. About how high off the floor did you put the spar?
I know this would depend on the person, but a general
idea would be nice
4. I would like to hang both wings at once, any
comments?
Any advice would be appreciated.
Ken
90608
Building the wing jig
http://platinum.yahoo.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | [ Bob Paulo ] : New Email List Photo Share Available! |
| From: | Email List Photo Shares <pictures(at)matronics.com> |
A new Email List Photo Share is available:
Poster: Bob Paulo
Subject: RV Project For Sale
http://www.matronics.com/photoshare/Bobpaulo@aol.com.03.23.2003/index.html
o Main Photo Share Index
http://www.matronics.com/photoshare
o Submitting a Photo Share
If you wish to submit a Photo Share of your own, please include the
following information along with your email message and files:
1) Email List or Lists that they are related to:
2) Your Full Name:
3) Your Email Address:
4) One line Subject description:
5) Multi-line, multi-paragraph description of topic:
6) One-line Description of each photo or file:
Email the information above and your files and photos to:
pictures(at)matronics.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | JOHN KERR <kerrjohna(at)comcast.net> |
thanks, pardon the senior moment.....
----- Original Message -----
From: John Oliveira <oliveira(at)frontiernet.net>
Date: Saturday, March 22, 2003 5:53 am
Subject: Re: RV9-List: estra hole
>
> The hole for the tie downs
>
> John Oliveira - 90054
> Fuselage arrives this week - Wings and Tail done
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "JOHN KERR" <kerrjohna(at)comcast.net>
> To:
> Subject: RV9-List: estra hole
>
>
> >
> >
> > there is an extra hole in the bottom of the leaing edge skin,
> about
> > where the pitot will go but it misses the spar flange. what is
> its
> > purpost?
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>
> _-
>
======================================================================_-
= - The RV9-List Email Forum -
> _-
>
======================================================================_-
= !! NEWish !!
> _-
>
======================================================================_-
= List Related Information
> _-
> ======================================================================
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Larry Perryman" <larry-perryman(at)txucom.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Wing Jig Question |
Ken,
For my RV-9A:
1. Two people can easily handle a wing. They are a bit bulky for one. Weight
maybe 100 lbs.
2. I put mine about the middle of my chest. Measure one rib. That is about
how far it will hang down.
3. My bottom spar was about 20 inches off the floor. Just enough to get a
screw jack on a milk crate under the spar.
4. No. You will need to get to both sides of the wing so do them one at a
time.
The wing skins are one place where two people is almost a necessity.
I went to the local aviation store (Home Depot) and got some 1.5 x 1.5
aluminum angle and made the cross braces . I then got some felt strips with
adhesive backing and put on top to cushion the spar. A hardware bolt through
one of the end holes in the spar helps hold it in place while riveting. You
may have to get creative on the wing tip end since one rib goes right at the
end.
Once you get one skin on, you can take the wing and put it on a table to do
the other skins. It helps being able to work at one height.
Hope my ramblings help. Keep building. It is worth it in the end.
Regards
Larry Perryman
N194DL
----- Original Message -----
From: "Ken Moak" <ken_moak(at)yahoo.com>
Subject: RV9-List: Wing Jig Question
>
> Thanks to everyone that helped me with the empennage.
> A Technical Counselor (Jim) came out last week and the
> first milestone has happened. No rework, so I closed
> things up. Thanks to all the advise, either direct or
> in the archives.
>
> Now I'm starting the Wing and have a couple of
> questions.
>
> 1. About how heavy is a wing?
>
> 2. About how far off the uprights do you place the
> spar? I am making it movable much like Todd Houg
> shows on his WEB site. I have a cross member running
> between my uprights and need to determine how much
> space I need to get between the wing and the cross
> member.
>
> 3. About how high off the floor did you put the spar?
> I know this would depend on the person, but a general
> idea would be nice
>
> 4. I would like to hang both wings at once, any
> comments?
>
> Any advice would be appreciated.
>
> Ken
> 90608
> Building the wing jig
>
> http://platinum.yahoo.com
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Welch, Ivo" <ivo.welch(at)yale.edu> |
| Subject: | ground handling and nosewheel |
Thanks, Leland. I will definitely check into panel design and nosewheel nut
breakout force. I think I will try the XCOM rather than the ICOM, though.
They
are not as strong a radio as the SL40, but the weaker radios will suffice
for my
purpose. (Emergency, low power.) The SL40 is still quite a bit bigger.
I will check with David on avionics purchases, too. My big problem is not
finding someone to sell me avionics cheap, but someone to install a
panel/avionics cheap *and* good. I have one recommendation on a shop
already,
but I would love another one. I am not the builder, so I am not even
allowed to
install if I wanted it. I need a good licensed avionics mechanic. Know
someone?
But you have piqued even more curiosity: is there a specific tradeoff
between
high-speed ground handling and turning radius? that is, can I do something
to
improve left-right stability on landing and takeoff, if I rarely need to
turn in
small circles?
regards,
/iaw
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | DThomas773(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Wing Jig Question |
Hi,
I agree with everything Larry says except the weight of the wing. 100
pounds? I think my completed wing with control surfaces, wing tips and all
lighting would be less than 60 pounds.
Dennis Thomas
tail dragger tip up
fuselage
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Larry Perryman" <larry-perryman(at)txucom.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Wing Jig Question |
Dennis,
You could be right. It has been almost a year since I built my wings and the
memory falters after a while. My point was that it is not the weight as much
as the bulk of the wings that make them a two person job to move around.
Regards
Larry Perryman
----- Original Message -----
From: <DThomas773(at)aol.com>
Subject: Re: RV9-List: Wing Jig Question
>
> Hi,
> I agree with everything Larry says except the weight of the wing. 100
> pounds? I think my completed wing with control surfaces, wing tips and
all
> lighting would be less than 60 pounds.
>
> Dennis Thomas
> tail dragger tip up
> fuselage
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | david edgemon <dedgemon(at)knology.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Wing jig question |
Ken,
Since I just finished the wings I'll give you my two cents worth.
Wings really pretty light. My wife and I could lift it really easily.
Maybe 50 lbs or so a panel. (just a guess).
Put the wings as far apart as you need to get a cordless drill (screwdriver)
and screws between the wings. Don't ask how I know this.
Put them as low as you can and still assemble the rear spar and hinges.
Maybe 6 inches off the floor for the rear spar would be could. This will
make working on the tanks, landing lights, etc... easier. Plus at some
point you'll want to flight them and work on the rear spar area for hinges.
Definately do both at once. It's much faster to do the second set of
operations
since you just did the first ones.
Have fun.
>
>
>>1. About how heavy is a wing?
>>
>>2. About how far off the uprights do you place the
>>spar? I am making it movable much like Todd Houg
>>shows on his WEB site. I have a cross member running
>>between my uprights and need to determine how much
>>space I need to get between the wing and the cross
>>member.
>>
>>3. About how high off the floor did you put the spar?
>> I know this would depend on the person, but a general
>>idea would be nice
>>
>>4. I would like to hang both wings at once, any
>>comments?
>>
>>
>>
>>
--
David Edgemon
Summit Research Corp.
Huntsville Al.
_______
|
\__________________(*)__________________/
"NN"
Huntsville Soaring Club
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | JOHN KERR <kerrjohna(at)comcast.net> |
| Subject: | leading edge installation |
for those of you who have finished attaching the leading edge to the
spar...how does one with out and extra elbow get to the rivets
attaching the 4th rib from the tip to the spar. It is the one between
the most inboard lightening (small)hole and the aileron bellcrank.
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: leading edge installation |
03/24/2003 10:21:25 AM
Very Carefully.
JOHN KERR
To: rv9 -list
Sent by: cc:
owner-rv9-list-server@mat Subject: RV9-List: leading
edge installation
ronics.com
03/24/2003 09:34 AM
Please respond to
rv9-list
for those of you who have finished attaching the leading edge to the
spar...how does one with out and extra elbow get to the rivets
attaching the 4th rib from the tip to the spar. It is the one between
the most inboard lightening (small)hole and the aileron bellcrank.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "fcs(at)jlc.net" <fcs(at)jlc.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Wing Jig Question |
I agree with everything Larry says, except I would build BOTH wings at the
same time. This is easily done if you build your jig so it carries both
wings and leaves some room in between. The wings are light enough that I
could lift them off and turn them around when working on the opposite side.
The reason I say to do both, is for project enthusiasm. Finishing a big
project like a wing, then facing doing it all over for the other one, can
really knock the wind out of your sails. Doing them both at once means
less tool and mindset changing. And when you're done, you're DONE!
I don't have a really good photo of the jig I used, but all I did was
modify the "H" jig used to build the empennage by adding a couple of
cross-members to hang the wing spars on. The following photo will give you
the general idea. I continued to use this jig all the way through building
and aligning the control surfaces, which I also built upright, attached to
the hinges.
http://www.jlc.net/~fcs/images/wing/w_rearspar.jpg
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "fcs(at)jlc.net" <fcs(at)jlc.net> |
| Subject: | leading edge installation |
That's a favorite one. Everyone who has done this, will recall the nearly
bloody red rings around their forearms. Basically you have to develop that
third elbow you described, or if your arms are just too big, enlist a
competent smaller person to help.
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | horizontal stabilizer riveting |
| From: | "Bruce Anthony" <bruce.anthony(at)holidaycompanies.com> |
Need some advice on riveting a nose rib in a 9A horizontal stabilizer. I put in
the end ribs first to give the stabilizer some form, but now that I'm trying
to rivet in the middle rib, I get a depression deformation in the skin right
at the rib. How do I avoid this? Should I drill out the end ribs and do the
middle one first? Would clecoing in the forward spar help? Thanks.
Bruce Anthony
RV9A Horizontal Stabilizer
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Ken Moak <ken_moak(at)yahoo.com> |
| Subject: | Re: horizontal stabilizer riveting |
Bruce
Welcome to the club.
When the spar is out it can take some odd shapes. A
depression gave me fits. There is a real good
explanation in the archives by I think John Williams,
may be on the Yahoo groups.
I drilled and worked on one side of mine so much I had
to go to oversized rivets so be careful. I don't
remember putting in the end ribs that soon. Some
things that helped for me
1. Put the wood clamps close to the center rib.
2. Start at the nose.
3. Do the top first. If it is going to act up try and
get it on the bottom.
4. I made shims for my worse side, .040 (i think) and
cover all but the most forward hole.
Never got mine looking as good as I would like. Tech
guy did not think it was a problem. If I was to do it
again I think it would be better but I was about to
start buying a skins so I decided I could live with
it.
Ken
90608
Starting Wings Today!
--- Bruce Anthony
wrote:
>
>
> Need some advice on riveting a nose rib in a 9A
> horizontal stabilizer. I put in the end ribs first
> to give the stabilizer some form, but now that I'm
> trying to rivet in the middle rib, I get a
> depression deformation in the skin right at the
> rib. How do I avoid this? Should I drill out the
> end ribs and do the middle one first? Would
> clecoing in the forward spar help? Thanks.
>
>
> Bruce Anthony
> RV9A Horizontal Stabilizer
>
>
>
> Contributions
> any other
> Forums.
>
> latest messages.
> List members.
>
> http://www.matronics.com/subscription
> http://www.matronics.com/FAQ/RV9-List.htm
> Digests:http://www.matronics.com/digest/rv9-list
> http://www.matronics.com/archives
> http://www.matronics.com/photoshare
> http://www.matronics.com/emaillists
>
>
>
>
>
http://platinum.yahoo.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Gary" <rv9er(at)3rivers.net> |
| Subject: | Re: leading edge installation |
Not quite all of us. Some of us used blind rivets in a few of those holes, and
still have the use of our arms.
Gary
----- Original Message -----
From: fcs(at)jlc.net
To: rv9-list(at)matronics.com
Sent: Monday, March 24, 2003 11:17 AM
Subject: RE: RV9-List: leading edge installation
That's a favorite one. Everyone who has done this, will recall the nearly
bloody red rings around their forearms. Basically you have to develop that
third elbow you described, or if your arms are just too big, enlist a
competent smaller person to help.
---
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Curt Hoffman" <choffman9(at)cinci.rr.com> |
| Subject: | Re: leading edge installation |
There was some discussion a while back on use of blind rivets, special
bucking bars, etc. I even talked to Vans to get their thoughts on use of
blind rivets and such. Their advise was basically "Just Do it". So I did.
Fortunately I had good help on the gun while I held my trustly little Avery
bar which is about 3" x 1" x2". Ultimately is is doable and other than a few
red marks on your arms, once you get in there all the rivets are reachable.
I am average size and my arms fit ok.
I couldn't see all the rivets I was bucking but I could feel them. I started
with the ones I could see so we got into a rythem on how long to take. It
actually came out quite good and I didn't use any blind rivets.
Curt Hoffman
RV-9A wings done for now- working on tail
1968 Mustang 302 convertible
Piper Cherokee N5320W
----- Original Message -----
From: "JOHN KERR" <kerrjohna(at)comcast.net>
Subject: RV9-List: leading edge installation
>
>
> for those of you who have finished attaching the leading edge to the
> spar...how does one with out and extra elbow get to the rivets
> attaching the 4th rib from the tip to the spar. It is the one between
> the most inboard lightening (small)hole and the aileron bellcrank.
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Curt Hoffman" <choffman9(at)cinci.rr.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Wing Jig Question |
Given the responses this seems to be an area of personal preference. So
here's mine:
I built both wings at once with the jigs set up end to end- I have a long
basement. I left room between the two jigs to walk between but barely.
I set up the supports so that the spar was about neck high. I could then
mount my ailerons and flaps while still in the jig. The only problem I ran
into was I had one set or uprights slightly closer together than the other
and when I mounted the flap the end couldn't quite clear the upright. Not a
big deal but annoying. I would make the uprights as far apart as I could
which would be about 3" less than the length of the spar.
Making both at the same time was definitely a plus. Many jobs were good to
do together. Some are boring enough that I was afraid if I didn't do them at
the same time I'd never get up the energy to do the other. Having said that
it was a little hard to get the energy up to go to the basement when I knew
all I would be doing is deburring holes for the next 6 hours.
My wife and I moved the wings off the jog and laid down on the workbench and
ultimately into my roll around support. I agree they aren't all that heavy
but they sure are big.
Curt Hoffman
RV-9A wings done for now- working on tail
1968 Mustang 302 convertible
Piper Cherokee N5320W
----- Original Message -----
From: "Ken Moak" <ken_moak(at)yahoo.com>
Subject: RV9-List: Wing Jig Question
>
> Thanks to everyone that helped me with the empennage.
> A Technical Counselor (Jim) came out last week and the
> first milestone has happened. No rework, so I closed
> things up. Thanks to all the advise, either direct or
> in the archives.
>
> Now I'm starting the Wing and have a couple of
> questions.
>
> 1. About how heavy is a wing?
>
> 2. About how far off the uprights do you place the
> spar? I am making it movable much like Todd Houg
> shows on his WEB site. I have a cross member running
> between my uprights and need to determine how much
> space I need to get between the wing and the cross
> member.
>
> 3. About how high off the floor did you put the spar?
> I know this would depend on the person, but a general
> idea would be nice
>
> 4. I would like to hang both wings at once, any
> comments?
>
> Any advice would be appreciated.
>
> Ken
> 90608
> Building the wing jig
>
> http://platinum.yahoo.com
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: leading edge installation |
| From: | Tom Lutgring <rv9abldr(at)juno.com> |
John ,
Yeah those leading edge to spar rivets are tricky. The one you describe
has a small lightening hole next to it. The four center rivets can easily
be squeezed with a Tatco squeezer with 3" jaws. I would imagine most
brands would work. I squeezed all of the rib to spar rivets that have
lightening holes next to them. The few that could not be reached (upper
and bottom most rivets at small lightening hole location only) I used
blind rivets on. Vans support okayed the use of LP4-3 or cherrymax
rivets. Tom, Ohio RV-9A fuselage
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Mike Duiven" <emduiven(at)chaffee.net> |
90517's Kit had the holes mismatched too.
Mike
N711ED (Reserved)
----- Original Message -----
From: "The Strong's" <tstrong(at)ida.net>
Subject: Re: RV9-List: Wing Help
>
> This is interesting. My kit number is #90489 and those holes are still
> mismatched. I guess Van's just likes to make
> sure they will have a few easy questions to answer.
>
>
> Tom (working on wings)
>
>
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "John Oliveira" <oliveira(at)frontiernet.net> |
| Subject: | Re: leading edge installation |
Small hands. Was not really a problem, but that was a year ago
----- Original Message -----
From: "JOHN KERR" <kerrjohna(at)comcast.net>
Subject: RV9-List: leading edge installation
>
>
> for those of you who have finished attaching the leading edge to the
> spar...how does one with out and extra elbow get to the rivets
> attaching the 4th rib from the tip to the spar. It is the one between
> the most inboard lightening (small)hole and the aileron bellcrank.
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "John Oliveira" <oliveira(at)frontiernet.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Wing jig question |
I did my wings much as described. Rear spar about 18 inches off of the
floor. I then flipped them over to do the lower skins so I was reaching up
after I attached all the hinge brackets and the gap fairings. I could then
attach and adjust the ailerons mounted facing up. The instructions talk
about doing the lower skins while on the bench, but it worked very well
doing the skins vertically in the fixture.
John Oliveira
N909RV, 90054
Wings and empennage done - Fuselage on it's way.
----- Original Message -----
From: "david edgemon" <dedgemon(at)knology.net>
Subject: RV9-List: Re: Wing jig question
>
> Ken,
> Since I just finished the wings I'll give you my two cents worth.
>
> Wings really pretty light. My wife and I could lift it really easily.
> Maybe 50 lbs or so a panel. (just a guess).
>
> Put the wings as far apart as you need to get a cordless drill
(screwdriver)
> and screws between the wings. Don't ask how I know this.
>
> Put them as low as you can and still assemble the rear spar and hinges.
> Maybe 6 inches off the floor for the rear spar would be could. This will
> make working on the tanks, landing lights, etc... easier. Plus at some
> point you'll want to flight them and work on the rear spar area for
hinges.
>
> Definately do both at once. It's much faster to do the second set of
> operations
> since you just did the first ones.
>
> Have fun.
>
> >
> >
> >>1. About how heavy is a wing?
> >>
> >>2. About how far off the uprights do you place the
> >>spar? I am making it movable much like Todd Houg
> >>shows on his WEB site. I have a cross member running
> >>between my uprights and need to determine how much
> >>space I need to get between the wing and the cross
> >>member.
> >>
> >>3. About how high off the floor did you put the spar?
> >> I know this would depend on the person, but a general
> >>idea would be nice
> >>
> >>4. I would like to hang both wings at once, any
> >>comments?
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> --
>
> David Edgemon
> Summit Research Corp.
> Huntsville Al.
>
>
> _______
> |
> \__________________(*)__________________/
> "NN"
> Huntsville Soaring Club
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Todd Houg <thoug(at)attglobal.net> |
| Subject: | Wing Jig Question |
Hello Ken,
In response to your posted questions as well as your direct inquiry . . .
I would estimate that each wing complete with skins weighs somehwere around 80
lbs each +/- 20, maybe less with no ailerons, flaps or 150 clecos attached! I
have moved the wings by myself, but I prefer not to. My wife can easily handle
one end when I need to swap them around.
My wing jig has 36" base legs with the uprights 2/3 offset to one side, leaving
12" to center on one end and 24" to center on the other. My intention was to
build a jig that would hold one wing, thus the offset would keep the weight centered
when I has the wing on. When I mounted the angle supports for the spar
I had extra material so I decided to extend them on the short side of the uprights.
This worked out quite well, since the wing jig is quite stable with both
wings on it. If I'm working with one wing it's always on the long side. The jig
is still stable with one wing on the short side, but I still put some bags
of lead shot on the base legs while I'm swapping wings around.
If I were planning for two wings, I would probably move the uprights to the center
of the base legs and still use 36" legs. This would still give eighteen inches
of leg on either side, and the spar supports don't need to extend any more
than twelve inches from the upright.
I mounted my spar supports about shoulder height. This work out quite well, but
I wouldn't want them any higher. A little lower than shoulder height would work
OK also.
I made two wood self like supports on one wall so I could remove one wing from
the jig and hang it on the wall out of the way. This worked great, you just have
to swap them arouns once in a while.
My lower cross memeber between the uprights is about 24" off the floor. Mine is
positioned just below the level of the rear spar although itcould be higher since
the wing is offset from the uprights. With it below the rear spar I was able
to put support block under the rear spar to remove the sag when fitting the
skins.
Let me know if you have any more questions . . .
Todd
RV9A fuselage - temporarily stalled . . .
-----Original Message-----
From: Ken Moak [SMTP:ken_moak(at)yahoo.com]
Subject: RV9-List: Wing Jig Question
Thanks to everyone that helped me with the empennage.
A Technical Counselor (Jim) came out last week and the
first milestone has happened. No rework, so I closed
things up. Thanks to all the advise, either direct or
in the archives.
Now I'm starting the Wing and have a couple of
questions.
1. About how heavy is a wing?
2. About how far off the uprights do you place the
spar? I am making it movable much like Todd Houg
shows on his WEB site. I have a cross member running
between my uprights and need to determine how much
space I need to get between the wing and the cross
member.
3. About how high off the floor did you put the spar?
I know this would depend on the person, but a general
idea would be nice
4. I would like to hang both wings at once, any
comments?
Any advice would be appreciated.
Ken
90608
Building the wing jig
http://platinum.yahoo.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | DThomas773(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Wing Jig Question |
Larry,
You are absolutely right. I would not attempt to move a wing without a good
sturdy person on the other end of it. It is just too long and wide to handle
alone.
Dennis Thomas
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | DThomas773(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: horizontal stabilizer riveting |
Hi Bruce,
This is a problem we have all had. I just accepted the depression, or
pillowing as some call it. It is caused by the skin not being uniformly held
to the shape needed and you actually are squeezing the skin in to meet the
rib. Some folks say they have overcome it by adding additional cradles to
your jig. I'm sure you will get addtional advice as well.
Dennis Thomas
fuselage
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Todd Houg <thoug(at)attglobal.net> |
| Subject: | leading edge installation |
Find a friend with long skinny arms! My arms are too fat to fit back there, but
fortunately my friend and neighbor had the perfect long skinny arms. If that's
not an option, others have used pop rivets, but make sure you use the structural
cherrymax rivets of you go that route.
Good luck,
Todd Houg
-----Original Message-----
From: JOHN KERR [SMTP:kerrjohna(at)comcast.net]
Subject: RV9-List: leading edge installation
for those of you who have finished attaching the leading edge to the
spar...how does one with out and extra elbow get to the rivets
attaching the 4th rib from the tip to the spar. It is the one between
the most inboard lightening (small)hole and the aileron bellcrank.
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OiAAAAAAAwANNP03AAB6Yg==
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Neil Henderson" <neil.mo51(at)btopenworld.com> |
I've spent the last few days wrestling with the canopy frame and have achieved
almost perfect alignment apart from the slider track which is offset by about
=BC in. I'm tempted to leave it there and either fix the track off centre or reposition
the frame hinge bracket. Has anyone had a similar problem if so did
you continue wrestling or adopt the solution I'm thinking of?
Secondly, it seems to me that now would be a good time to fix the rear pin anchor
blocks rather than, as the Vans manual implies, after the canopy has been fitted.
If the blocks were fitted surely this would hold the frame in the final
and correct position during the installation of the canopy. Having not been
there before am I missing something?
Thanking you in advance for your thoughts during this trying and challenging phase.
Neil Henderson RV9A Finishing
Nr Aylesbury UK
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Matthew Brandes <mbrandes(at)irr.com> |
| Subject: | O-320-H2AD Cowl Modifications |
I emailed Van's about any cowl modifications required if one selected the
H2AD engine. Here is their response for those of you considering this
model.
"It will require changes. The oil door needs to be moved as the filler neck
is in a different place. Also the H2AD has the fuel pump on the front left
and it will be necessary to put a small bulge in the top of the cowl there
to clear the pump. You also need the special H2 engine mount, not the
standard D1. -- Vans"
Matthew
RV-9A
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "fcs(at)jlc.net" <fcs(at)jlc.net> |
I don't understand how your track would end up off-center. Is there a
visible difference in the curvature of your top skin on either side?
Assuming your canopy frame was welded symetrically, there's no reason why
the track wouldn't be centered unless the frame was distorted somehow. I
didn't see how far off it is in your prior posting because it was garbled.
If we're talking a tiny amount, then it's probably OK.
Regarding the rear blocks, I would hold off installing them, per plans.
The canopy puts all sorts of strain on the frame as you assemble the bubble
and the skirts. You will achieve the best fit in the blocks if you hold
off until the bubble and skirts are at least cleco'ed together.
Fun little sucker isn't it? But you've got to admit, it works pretty well.
Gary
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | JOHN KERR <kerrjohna(at)comcast.net> |
thank you for your suggestions. the task was completed on the first
wing last night with the help of an able assistant with thin arms.
John
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: leading edge installation |
| From: | Mark Schrimmer <mschrimmer(at)pacbell.net> |
>I squeezed all of the rib to spar rivets that have lightening holes next to
them. The few that could not be reached (upperand bottom most rivets at
small lightening hole location only) I used blind rivets on. Vans support
okayed the use of LP4-3 or cherrymax rivets.
__________________________________
About a year ago, I asked Van's about using LP4-3 rivets. Here is there
reply . . .
>Yes, the LP4-3 can be used as long as the grip of the rivet is not exceeded...
one rib thickness+the spar web thickness... in places where a nose and a
main rib and the web might be riveted with the same rivet, then a longer
grip would be required and we don't have them....
>Van's
After reading this, I used LP-3 rivets in all the holes where the grip
length was long enough, and I used Cherry N rivets (not Cherrymax) in the
holes where I needed a longer grip. I didn't use any solid rivets. Anybody
see a problem with this? I'd hate to have to drill out all those pop rivets!
Mark Schrimmer
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Terry Hobert" <terhobey(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | Re: horizontal stabilizer riveting |
Hey Guys, I'm so glad that I got my HS done before reading all the woes, it
would have scared me off. I guess I was lucky (or just dumb), but the tip
ribs were a little trouble, but not torturous. Andy Karmy gave me a hunk of
steel to make a little bucking bar out of anf that helped a little also.
Terry 90860, wings ordered.
>From: DThomas773(at)aol.com
>Reply-To: rv9-list(at)matronics.com
>To: rv9-list(at)matronics.com
>Subject: Re: RV9-List: horizontal stabilizer riveting
>Date: Mon, 24 Mar 2003 23:30:00 EST
>
>
>Hi Bruce,
>This is a problem we have all had. I just accepted the depression, or
>pillowing as some call it. It is caused by the skin not being uniformly
>held
>to the shape needed and you actually are squeezing the skin in to meet the
>rib. Some folks say they have overcome it by adding additional cradles to
>your jig. I'm sure you will get addtional advice as well.
>
>Dennis Thomas
>fuselage
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | DThomas773(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Leveling fuselage |
Hi Folks,
I'm at the point where the instructions say" roll the canoe over. level it
at the mid section and at f-910 bulkhead to check for twist." How much twist
is an allowable amount? I am real close but am wondering how close it should
be. Appreciate any and all input.
Dennis Thomas
Taildragger/tipup
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Gary" <rv9er(at)3rivers.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Leveling fuselage |
Close as you can measure with a good level, is how I did mine.
Gary
----- Original Message -----
From: DThomas773(at)aol.com
To: rv9-list(at)matronics.com
Sent: Tuesday, March 25, 2003 7:49 PM
Subject: RV9-List: Leveling fuselage
Hi Folks,
I'm at the point where the instructions say" roll the canoe over. level it
at the mid section and at f-910 bulkhead to check for twist." How much twist
is an allowable amount? I am real close but am wondering how close it should
be. Appreciate any and all input.
Dennis Thomas
Taildragger/tipup
---
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "John Oliveira" <oliveira(at)frontiernet.net> |
| Subject: | Fuselage Kit Arrived |
Received two boxes today with the fuselage kit. - looks like more fun begins!
Wings are done accept tips.
John Oliveira
90054 - N909RV
Rochester, NY
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Steve Sampson" <SSampson.SLN21(at)london.edu> |
| Subject: | Tipper canopy release? |
Has anyone implemented John Moskel's approach to the canopy release? John.
Are you there?
http://www.bmnellis.com/BuilderIdeas/JohnMoskel.htm
<http://www.bmnellis.com/BuilderIdeas/JohnMoskel.htm>
The aspect of it that concerns me is how to stop it releasing by accident.
It seems it still needs a spring to stop the rod rotating somehow.
Thanks, Steve.
#90360
N Yorks UK
Canopy
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Terry Hobert" <terhobey(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Fuselage Kit Arrived |
John, How long was it after your order were they ready to ship? The full 8
weeks? Thanks, Terry Ordering wings, emp finished.
>From: "John Oliveira" <oliveira(at)frontiernet.net>
>Reply-To: rv9-list(at)matronics.com
>To:
>Subject: RV9-List: Fuselage Kit Arrived
>Date: Wed, 26 Mar 2003 20:46:08 -0500
>
>
>Received two boxes today with the fuselage kit. - looks like more fun
>begins! Wings are done accept tips.
>
>John Oliveira
>90054 - N909RV
>Rochester, NY
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "John Oliveira" <oliveira(at)frontiernet.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Fuselage Kit Arrived |
check the Vans site http://www.vansaircraft.com/public/kitprice.htm
fuselage Kit times are 14 weeks. I ordered approximately the 2nd week in
December and the ship date was the week of the 17th. Actual ship date was
the 20th. That is close enough for me. They have been great to deal with
on everything I have ordered to date.
I opened it and started the inventory last night. Got side tracked studying
some plans actually big enough for my 56 year old eyes to read.
No surprises. Everything is up to there usual standards. If you look at my
serial number you will notice I am one of the early kits. Received the
empennage on April 12, 2000, only about three months after they started
shipping. I have not really had any problems with anything other than all
my other activities.
I race a 36 foot sailboat on Lake Ontario which has taken up my summers. I
am not going to race this year, so It will not be quite so intense. I hope
to get a lot more done. To date my airplane building has been an October
through March activity. So far the wings and empennage are done accept for
wing tips and I have 480 hours invested.
John Oliveira
N909RV - 90054
----- Original Message -----
From: "Terry Hobert" <terhobey(at)hotmail.com>
Subject: Re: RV9-List: Fuselage Kit Arrived
>
> John, How long was it after your order were they ready to ship? The full
8
> weeks? Thanks, Terry Ordering wings, emp finished.
>
>
> >From: "John Oliveira" <oliveira(at)frontiernet.net>
> >Reply-To: rv9-list(at)matronics.com
> >To:
> >Subject: RV9-List: Fuselage Kit Arrived
> >Date: Wed, 26 Mar 2003 20:46:08 -0500
> >
> >
> >Received two boxes today with the fuselage kit. - looks like more fun
> >begins! Wings are done accept tips.
> >
> >John Oliveira
> >90054 - N909RV
> >Rochester, NY
> >
> >
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "John Oliveira" <oliveira(at)frontiernet.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Fuselage Kit Arrived |
for more information go to my project as part of the EAA chapter 44 Web
site. Look under member projects. By the way, the Chummy display is very
interesting. The chapter built the replica of the Taylor Chummy that hangs
in the ROC terminal building. My wife upholstered the seat, and I took all
the pictures you see. Used a Kodak Professional digital camera.
http://eaa44.org/
John Oliveira
N909RV - 90054
----- Original Message -----
From: "Terry Hobert" <terhobey(at)hotmail.com>
Subject: Re: RV9-List: Fuselage Kit Arrived
>
> John, How long was it after your order were they ready to ship? The full
8
> weeks? Thanks, Terry Ordering wings, emp finished.
>
>
> >From: "John Oliveira" <oliveira(at)frontiernet.net>
> >Reply-To: rv9-list(at)matronics.com
> >To:
> >Subject: RV9-List: Fuselage Kit Arrived
> >Date: Wed, 26 Mar 2003 20:46:08 -0500
> >
> >
> >Received two boxes today with the fuselage kit. - looks like more fun
> >begins! Wings are done accept tips.
> >
> >John Oliveira
> >90054 - N909RV
> >Rochester, NY
> >
> >
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Andy Karmy" <andy(at)karmy.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Nose wheel handling |
This is the one area that Mike Seager spent much time on and went out of his way
to make sure that I understood on my transition training. BABY that nose gear.
He told me to always keep it full back, do full stall landings and hold the
stick back while slowing on the runway etc. What you never want to do is push
it onto the runway as the mains will lift off and for a few seconds you'll roll
on just the nose gear just before it bends back... Ouch.
Sorry to hear about your problem, good luck on future landings...
- Andy
---------- Original Message ----------------------------------
From: "Jones" <esnj(at)granbury.com>
Date: Sat, 22 Mar 2003 20:47:33 -0600
>
>Ivo:
>
>Thanks for your reply. You have some excellent advice for landings. I just
>wish I had read your note before I went to fly Friday afternoon. It was my
>first flight with wheel and gear leg fairings. I'm now waiting for Van's to
>open so I can order a new nose gear strut and associated fiberglass. Also,
>I hope I get good news from the prop shop. As I was warned by some 6A guys,
>you just better not land these things too fast. Live and hopefully learn!
>
>Dick Jones
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Andy Karmy" <andy(at)karmy.com> |
| Subject: | Re: ground handling and nosewheel |
I've been gone for the last week, but now as I dig through all these messages about
ground handling problems I am confused...
What's the problem that you're having.
My RV9A is the best handling plane I've flown and just a joy both on and off the
runway. Let's look at a few things about how you're flying it and see if there's
something there.
First to mind is speeds. What speed are you doing on short final? I fly 60mph IAS
at that point just before I start rounding out. This is on a 3000ft runway
as reference.
Second, what's you idle speed? I flew mine for a few hours at 900rpm and it floated
forever, would not slowdown and was hard to handle. I slowed it to 500rpm
and it's a different plane. Now poweroff gives a nice descent.
3rd, Full stall landings, get that nose up. Trim for nose up all the way around
the pattern. By the time you're on final you should not be holding nose up pressure
it should already be trimed out for your 60mph glide. Then just hold it
nose slightly high as you near the ground. The mains should hit with the nose
still nicely in the air. Keep the stick back and hold the nose off the runway
as long as possible. By the time the elevator is not effective anymore you will
be going so slow that there's no way to have nosewheel steering problems now.
4th as others said, check the nosewheel breakout force and set per the plans. That's
key to not having the nosewheel shimmy.
Lastly, same drill on takeoff, pull the nosewheel up and get the weight off it
as you accelerate for liftoff. Not too high, just above the horizon and it will
fly off very nicely.
What did I miss? Are you already doing all of these things?
- Andy
---------- Original Message ----------------------------------
From: "Welch, Ivo" <ivo.welch(at)yale.edu>
>But you have piqued even more curiosity: is there a specific tradeoff
>between
>high-speed ground handling and turning radius? that is, can I do something
>to
>improve left-right stability on landing and takeoff, if I rarely need to
>turn in
>small circles?
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Pneumatic Squeezer |
| From: | Brice Bowman <brice(at)earshotaudiopost.com> |
I'm getting ready to rivet my empennage and I'm looking at a pneumatic
squeezer - the Chicago Pneumatic #214 style squeezer fron Avery (Part
#7500). Looking for input, experience, etc. on pneumatic squeezers in
general and suggestions on yoke choice...is the logeron yoke worth having,
etc. Any input would be appreciated before I spend the big bucks.
Brice Bowman
RV-9A #90620
Ready to rivet empennage/ordering wings
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | DThomas773(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Pneumatic Squeezer |
Hi Brice,
I got a real good deal on a air driven squeezer but after using it a couple
times it is on the bench gathering dust. It is great for where you have a
large number of rivets you can reach that are the same size. But there are
not many of those situations on the airplane you ae building. It is time
consuming to set up and and it is a large, heavy tool that can do a lot of
damage if it gets out of hand. I now use my hand squeezer or the 2X gun.
Dennis Thomas
fuselage
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Ken Moak <ken_moak(at)yahoo.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Pneumatic Squeezer |
Brice
My 2 cents worth...I bought the hand squeezer first,
and pretty quickly switched to the Avery pneumatic,
longeron yoke with the adjustable set holder. Have
not used a hand squeezer since and would not want to
go back. They can be a little heavy and the airhose
can be a pain. I put a swivel on the hose and after a
short period of getting used to it I really like it.
I have purchased another yoke, the long 4" no hole
one, but have almost never missed the hand squeezer.
A lot of it is personal preferance. A friend bought
an Alligator Pneumatic and I never liked it as much.
I'm glad I bought it. I'm just starting my wings so
you can tell I'm by no means anyone with a lot of
experiance. I have clamped it to the work bench and
used it like a small permenat one for a lot of
dimpling too.
Anyway thats my take on it, hope it helps
Ken
90608
Wings
--- Brice Bowman wrote:
>
>
> I'm getting ready to rivet my empennage and I'm
> looking at a pneumatic
> squeezer - the Chicago Pneumatic #214 style squeezer
> fron Avery (Part
> #7500). Looking for input, experience, etc. on
> pneumatic squeezers in
> general and suggestions on yoke choice...is the
> logeron yoke worth having,
> etc. Any input would be appreciated before I spend
> the big bucks.
>
> Brice Bowman
> RV-9A #90620
> Ready to rivet empennage/ordering wings
>
>
>
> Contributions
> any other
> Forums.
>
> latest messages.
> List members.
>
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>
>
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________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Todd Houg <thoug(at)attglobal.net> |
| Subject: | Pneumatic Squeezer |
Brice,
I have to side with Ken on this. The pnuematic squeezer is the single most productive
tool I own. Get an Avery adjustable set and, contrary to other opinions,
the setup is easy and takes less time than changing dies. You get very quick
at visually estimating the gap required; just load the dies, squeeze the trigger
and spin the set holder to set the gap on the conservative side. Squeeze your
first rivet and give it another spin or two to fine tune it and your all set.
There are rows and rows of rivets that you will be able to set all exactly
the same every time.
I built over half of my Empennage before aquiring the pnuematic, since then the
my manual squeezer hasn't left the drawer.
As for yokes, the Longeron id probably the most useful. If I had only one yoke
it weould be the longeron, I use use it 80% of the time. There's a few places
where it won't fit and you need a standard yoke. I also have a small no hole and
a 4" yoke. The small no hole gets the least usage, the 4" is really nice for
the few places that you can use it. If you only get one get get a longeron,
second get a standard 1 1/2". The others are luxuries.
Todd
RV9A Fuselage
-----Original Message-----
From: Ken Moak
Subject: Re: RV9-List: Pneumatic Squeezer
Brice
My 2 cents worth...I bought the hand squeezer first,
and pretty quickly switched to the Avery pneumatic,
longeron yoke with the adjustable set holder. Have
not used a hand squeezer since and would not want to
go back. They can be a little heavy and the airhose
can be a pain. I put a swivel on the hose and after a
short period of getting used to it I really like it.
I have purchased another yoke, the long 4" no hole
one, but have almost never missed the hand squeezer.
A lot of it is personal preferance. A friend bought
an Alligator Pneumatic and I never liked it as much.
I'm glad I bought it. I'm just starting my wings so
you can tell I'm by no means anyone with a lot of
experiance. I have clamped it to the work bench and
used it like a small permenat one for a lot of
dimpling too.
Anyway thats my take on it, hope it helps
Ken
90608
Wings
--- Brice Bowman wrote:
>
>
> I'm getting ready to rivet my empennage and I'm
> looking at a pneumatic
> squeezer - the Chicago Pneumatic #214 style squeezer
> fron Avery (Part
> #7500). Looking for input, experience, etc. on
> pneumatic squeezers in
> general and suggestions on yoke choice...is the
> logeron yoke worth having,
> etc. Any input would be appreciated before I spend
> the big bucks.
>
> Brice Bowman
> RV-9A #90620
> Ready to rivet empennage/ordering wings
>
>
> Contributions
> any other
> Forums.
>
> latest messages.
> List members.
>
> http://www.matronics.com/subscription
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>
>
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________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | JohnCClarkVA(at)cs.com |
| Subject: | Re: Pneumatic Squeezer |
Brice, the pneumatic squeezer is great. I am 1/2 way through the metal work
on the fuselage. Lots of places to use - flaps, wings, ailerons, rudder,
stabs, frames, ribs, outer edges, spars, .... Makes fast work of dimples and
sets very nice, standard rivets. Just make sure you squeeze it when you mean
it and keep your fingers clear. You can hold the parts with one hand and use
the squeezer with the other. Can't do that with the manual one. I do use
the manual one every once in a while, in tight places. I use the longeron,
and 3 in. yokes and have the adjustable part. Would like to have the 4 in
no-hole. Next best toy is a pneumatic cleco puller (less than $80??). It
makes for fast work anywhere you have to pull or set more than 10-15 clecos.
I have the Avery model, but there is a less expensive one at the Yard Store
in Wichita (about $40??). It looks good and others think that the Yard model
is great.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Welch, Ivo" <ivo.welch(at)yale.edu> |
| Subject: | rv-9a ground handling |
hi andy:
definitely keep the nosegear off the ground. the issue is left-right
stability,
not up-down stability. a fast driving car very much wants to go straight.
a
fast rolling airplane with two wheels on the ground has very little
left-right
stability. with the third wheel on the ground, it is a bit better...but the
third wheel is, for lack of a better word, too loose to provide much
straight
ahead stability. it really should IMHO.
I think the rest of your message is an interestin discussion about landings,
but
not what I would like to improve (left-right control). I find that at 60mph
IAS
on final, the plane becomes very difficult to control. it is more stable at
80mph. Curious what others are flying. Idle speed on my prop is relatively
high, because it is a catto prop (for now). it does not have enough inertia
to
keep the engine running at 500rpm. I cannot go less than 700rpm.
The one thing I need to do is to check the nosewheel breakout force. Maybe
I
want it even higher than the standard 20lbs. I really want my nosewheel to
induce the plane to head straight. I am not the builder, so I need to get a
hold of my mechanic.
regards,
/iaw
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Gary" <rv9er(at)3rivers.net> |
| Subject: | Re: rv-9a ground handling |
Ivo.......I think Andy was right on with his comments. I have not flown my -9A
yet, but have 35 hours in an RV-4. Even in the -4, I could use 65 mph on final
with two adults on a 95 degree day at a 3700 ft elevation airport, and make
good landings. You could fly that -4 around at altitude in the same conditions
indicating 55 mph, with good control response in all axes.
What I hear Andy saying is, slow landings are easier to control. Are you pushing
the nosewheel down at speed? (DON'T.) What is your speed at touchdown?
Unless we are talking monster crosswinds here, it is the TAIL that provides
yaw stability down to very slow speeds, not the nosewheel. Reading reports
of -9A ground handling, the brakes are not needed to steer above a very slow speed,
which means the rudder is very effective.
The reason nosedraggers are more directionally stable is that the MAINS are further
back, behind the CG, not because the nosewheel (ahead of the CG) makes them
stable.
If the thing just wants to veer off to the side when rolling along undisturbed,
either you have a brake dragging, or something must be wrong with the main gear
alignment. If so, yours is the first I've heard of.
I would check the nosewheel breakout force, and set it appropriately, but that
should only effect its tendency to shimmy.
How about getting an experienced RV'er to fly it and see what he thinks?
On the idle speed, you can set it down so it idles slower on final, and then open
the throttle slightly to make it idle where you want on the ground, taxiing,
etc.
Gary
----- Original Message -----
From: Welch, Ivo
To: rv9-list(at)matronics.com
Sent: Saturday, March 29, 2003 2:49 PM
Subject: RV9-List: rv-9a ground handling
hi andy:
definitely keep the nosegear off the ground. the issue is left-right
stability,
not up-down stability. a fast driving car very much wants to go straight.
a
fast rolling airplane with two wheels on the ground has very little
left-right
stability. with the third wheel on the ground, it is a bit better...but the
third wheel is, for lack of a better word, too loose to provide much
straight
ahead stability. it really should IMHO.
I think the rest of your message is an interestin discussion about landings,
but
not what I would like to improve (left-right control). I find that at 60mph
IAS
on final, the plane becomes very difficult to control. it is more stable at
80mph. Curious what others are flying. Idle speed on my prop is relatively
high, because it is a catto prop (for now). it does not have enough inertia
to
keep the engine running at 500rpm. I cannot go less than 700rpm.
The one thing I need to do is to check the nosewheel breakout force. Maybe
I
want it even higher than the standard 20lbs. I really want my nosewheel to
induce the plane to head straight. I am not the builder, so I need to get a
hold of my mechanic.
regards,
/iaw
---
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Laurel Mckone" <lmckone(at)xtalwind.net> |
The price of fuel at Dunnellon Airport X-35 is priced less than the other airports
in this area. Its about 70 miles north of Lakeland. Its an uncontroled field,
good runways, 122.8 CTAF. Home of the Florida Davision of the Yankee Airforce.
Hamburgers on the grill. Pass the word.
RV-9A
Laurel McKone
N120LM
Inverness, Fl
Don't archieve
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Andy Karmy" <andy(at)karmy.com> |
| Subject: | Re: rv-9a ground handling |
Lots of interesting discussion below... Keep in mind I'm just trying to help, there
are not really clear right and wrongs with any of these settings and techniques.
---------- Original Message ----------------------------------
From: "Welch, Ivo" <ivo.welch(at)yale.edu>
>fast rolling airplane with two wheels on the ground has very little
>left-right stability.
I think you have hit on the key point. I don't think there is a way to solve this
except slowing down when on the ground.
>I find that at 60mph IAS on final, the plane becomes very
>difficult to control. it is more stable at 80mph.
What's your stall speed. Standard thought is that the aproach speed should be 1.3
times stall speed. (assuming no wind or obstructions). So in my case Vso full
flaps is 45mph. I agree that 60mph feels much looser than cruise in the RV9,
but if stall is demonstrated at 45 and you are comfortable flying just above
stall in practice, then it should be fully under control. I use 60 for short
final and 70 if it's rough and windy, but somewhere just above the runway I end
up slowing enough so that you full stall as the mains touch.
>Idle speed on my prop is relatively high, because it is a catto
>prop (for now). it does not have enough inertia to keep the engine
>running at 500rpm. I cannot go less than 700rpm.
This may be a key to getting a good descent rate at idle. From what I rember talking
to Kevin that Catto prop was pitched as a climb prop. This too would explain
your lower cruise numbers referenced elseware.
>The one thing I need to do is to check the nosewheel breakout force.
>Maybe I want it even higher than the standard 20lbs.
This also is interesting. I find that at times if I lift off with a small force
on the nosewheel it is off center just a touch after liftoff. I can notice half
a ball of skid that lasts for about 5 mins into the flight. Eventually it fully
centers back into trail and the ball is centered again. I imagine that you
would notice this even more if you have it too tight.
>I am not the builder, so I need to get a hold of my mechanic.
Don't forget that "legally" you can do any and all work on your expieremental airplane.
Even without being the builder. You only legally need a mechanic to do
the yearly inspections. Of course this must be balanced against what you are
comfortable doing and working with your mechanic.
Good luck with it. Seems like there is always something to do with homebuilts tuning
and tweaking to get the best possible airplane...
- Andy
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "John Oliveira" <oliveira(at)frontiernet.net> |
| Subject: | Re: rv-9a ground handling |
I think the original poster is right, he needs to contact is mechanic.
In order to do any work on you experimental you need to be the person the
repairman's certificate was issued to, or do the work under the supervision
of an A&P. Only one certificate is issues per project, so if it is a
partnership, you have to decide who gets the certificate.
The certificate is not transferable to a new owner. If you don't have one
the same rules apply as certified. Change oil, plugs, and minor cosmetic
stuff.
John Oliveira - N909RV - working of Fuselage
----- Original Message -----
From: "Andy Karmy" <andy(at)karmy.com>
Subject: Re: RV9-List: rv-9a ground handling
>I am not the builder, so I need to get a hold of my mechanic.
> Don't forget that "legally" you can do any and all work on your
expieremental airplane. Even without being the builder. You only legally
need a mechanic to do the yearly inspections. Of course this must be
balanced against what you are comfortable doing and working with your
mechanic.
>
> Good luck with it. Seems like there is always something to do with
homebuilts tuning and tweaking to get the best possible airplane...
>
> - Andy
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Richard Tasker <retasker(at)optonline.net> |
| Subject: | Closed end pop rivets |
Last night I went to close up my first (left) fuel tank. I got
everything out and ready to go, put all the pro-seal in place, put the
rear baffle on and clecoed everything together. I installed the AD41H
closed end rivets into the edges of the ribs, riveted the mounting
brackets to the end ribs and riveted the skin to the baffle. When I
went to install the mounting brackets I discovered that the rivets in
the AD42H rivet drawer were the same length as the AD41H rivets! As a
stop gap measure, I clecoed the mounting brackets to the baffle and will
use extra pro-seal when I get the correct rivets.
I don't know if I have only "AD41H" or "AD42H" rivets so I don't know
what I used on the edges of the ribs. I suspect that they were correct
since they only took a little pulling with the pop rivet tool.
Does anyone have these rivets and can tell me what the dimensions are
supposed to be. The ones I have are 0.280 overall length and 0.230 from
under the head to the end.
Dick Tasker, 90573
Left wing
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Andy Karmy" <andy(at)karmy.com> |
| Subject: | Re: rv-9a ground handling |
Is there a chance we could get a reference to this opinion? Attached below is info
from the EAA faq website about the subject. That's where I got my information
from
- Andy
---------- Original Message ----------------------------------
From: "John Oliveira" <oliveira(at)frontiernet.net>
>I think the original poster is right, he needs to contact is mechanic.
----------------------- begin included message -------------------
Non-builder Maintenance Frequently Asked Questions
I'm am going to buy a used homebuilt, what work can I perform myself?
FAR Part 43 specifically states that the rules of that part do not apply to experimental,
amateur-built aircraft. Therefore, any work (not just maintenance)
on an experimental aircraft can be performed virtually by anyone regardless of
credentials. (This does not apply to the condition inspection). Let common sense
be your guide as to what maintenance you conduct yourself.
What is a Condition Inspection?
A condition inspection is the equivalent of an "annual" for a type certificated
aircraft. Although FAR Part 91.409(c)(1) specifically states that experimental
aircraft do not require annual inspections, the operating limitations on your
homebuilt will include the following (or something similar):
No person shall operate this aircraft unless within the preceding 12 calendar months
it has had a condition inspection performed in accordance with the scope
and detail of appendix D to part 43, or other FAA-approved programs, and found
to be in a condition for safe operation. This inspection will be recorded in
the aircraft maintenance records. Condition inspections shall be recorded in
the aircraft maintenance records showing the following or a similarly worded statement:
"I certify that this aircraft has been inspected on (insert date) in
accordance with the scope and detail of appendix D to part 43 and found to be
in a condition for safe operation." The entry will include the aircraft total
time in service, and the name, signature, certificate number, and type of certificate
held by the
person performing the inspection.
See the condition inspection checklist for use in conducting annual condition inspections
under the Operating section of this web.
Since I don't have a Repairman Certificate, who must perform the Condition Inspection?
The inspection can be performed by any licensed A&P mechanic, an FAA Approved Repair
Station, or by the original builder of the airplane provided the builder
has a "Repairman Certificate" for that aircraft from the FAA. Note that unlike
an annual for a type certificated aircraft, the A&P mechanic does NOT have to
have his/her "Inspection Authorization". Sometimes, if you are lucky, you can
include as part of the purchase that the builder will continue to perform the
condition inspections.
I'm having trouble finding an A&P to perform my Condition Inspection, any ideas
where to find one?
The best place to find a local A&P willing to work on homebuilt aircraft is through
your local EAA Chapter. Many EAA Chapters have A&Ps who are chapter members
and will help you out. Usually, the Technical Counselor is the best person
to ask. If that doesn't work, see if someone else in the chapter owns a homebuilt
he did not build and find out who he is getting to perform his condition inspection.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Gary" <rv9er(at)3rivers.net> |
| Subject: | Re: rv-9a ground handling |
Not so, John. Anyone can work on an Experimental. The Repairman Certificate allows
you to sign off the Annual Condition Inspection.
Gary
----- Original Message -----
From: John Oliveira
To: rv9-list(at)matronics.com
Sent: Monday, March 31, 2003 10:59 AM
Subject: Re: RV9-List: rv-9a ground handling
I think the original poster is right, he needs to contact is mechanic.
In order to do any work on you experimental you need to be the person the
repairman's certificate was issued to, or do the work under the supervision
of an A&P. Only one certificate is issues per project, so if it is a
partnership, you have to decide who gets the certificate.
The certificate is not transferable to a new owner. If you don't have one
the same rules apply as certified. Change oil, plugs, and minor cosmetic
stuff.
John Oliveira - N909RV - working of Fuselage
---
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Curt Hoffman" <choffman9(at)cinci.rr.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Closed end pop rivets |
I measured my 41H and 42H and this is what I got:
41H- .25" from under the head to the end of the rivet
42H- .30" from under the head to the end of the rivet.
I suspect your .23" is my .25" ( I am looking through bi-focal glasses after
all). The 42H are noticeable longer. Sounds like you have 41H left.
Curt Hoffman
RV-9A wings done for now- working on tail
1968 Mustang 302 convertible
Piper Cherokee N5320W
----- Original Message -----
From: "Richard Tasker" <retasker(at)optonline.net>
Subject: RV9-List: Closed end pop rivets
>
> Last night I went to close up my first (left) fuel tank. I got
> everything out and ready to go, put all the pro-seal in place, put the
> rear baffle on and clecoed everything together. I installed the AD41H
> closed end rivets into the edges of the ribs, riveted the mounting
> brackets to the end ribs and riveted the skin to the baffle. When I
> went to install the mounting brackets I discovered that the rivets in
> the AD42H rivet drawer were the same length as the AD41H rivets! As a
> stop gap measure, I clecoed the mounting brackets to the baffle and will
> use extra pro-seal when I get the correct rivets.
>
> I don't know if I have only "AD41H" or "AD42H" rivets so I don't know
> what I used on the edges of the ribs. I suspect that they were correct
> since they only took a little pulling with the pop rivet tool.
>
> Does anyone have these rivets and can tell me what the dimensions are
> supposed to be. The ones I have are 0.280 overall length and 0.230 from
> under the head to the end.
>
> Dick Tasker, 90573
> Left wing
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Richard Tasker <retasker(at)optonline.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Closed end pop rivets |
I was afraid of that - they are all 41H rivets. So I have to get some
42H to finish the tank. I sure hope it doesn't leak after waiting for
the rivets...
Thanks for the measurements,
Dick Tasker, 90573
Left wing
Curt Hoffman wrote:
>
>I measured my 41H and 42H and this is what I got:
>41H- .25" from under the head to the end of the rivet
>42H- .30" from under the head to the end of the rivet.
>
>I suspect your .23" is my .25" ( I am looking through bi-focal glasses after
>all). The 42H are noticeable longer. Sounds like you have 41H left.
>
>Curt Hoffman
>RV-9A wings done for now- working on tail
>1968 Mustang 302 convertible
>Piper Cherokee N5320W
>----- Original Message -----
>From: "Richard Tasker" <retasker(at)optonline.net>
>Subject: RV9-List: Closed end pop rivets
>
>
>
>
>>
>>Last night I went to close up my first (left) fuel tank. I got
>>everything out and ready to go, put all the pro-seal in place, put the
>>rear baffle on and clecoed everything together. I installed the AD41H
>>closed end rivets into the edges of the ribs, riveted the mounting
>>brackets to the end ribs and riveted the skin to the baffle. When I
>>went to install the mounting brackets I discovered that the rivets in
>>the AD42H rivet drawer were the same length as the AD41H rivets! As a
>>stop gap measure, I clecoed the mounting brackets to the baffle and will
>>use extra pro-seal when I get the correct rivets.
>>
>>I don't know if I have only "AD41H" or "AD42H" rivets so I don't know
>>what I used on the edges of the ribs. I suspect that they were correct
>>since they only took a little pulling with the pop rivet tool.
>>
>>Does anyone have these rivets and can tell me what the dimensions are
>>supposed to be. The ones I have are 0.280 overall length and 0.230 from
>>under the head to the end.
>>
>>Dick Tasker, 90573
>>Left wing
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Matt Dralle <dralle(at)matronics.com> |
| Subject: | Matronics ISP Upgrade TODAY... |
Dear Listers,
The time has finally arrived for the Internet Service Provider (ISP)
upgrade! You'll recall that I was looking into upgrading the existing SDSL
connection from 768k to 1.1M. As it turned out, the copper line wouldn't
support any speeds greater than the current 768k. In light of that news, I
just bit-the-bullet and ordered a full, commercial-grade T1
connection. The T1 connection will provide a full-duplex, high priority,
1.5Mb Internet connection which should be a substantial performance
enhancement for all of the List services!
Pacbell delivered the T1 Loop last week and it tested out fine. This past
weekend I pulled the tail circuit from the demark to the office. This
afternoon, Tuesday 4/1/03, the ISP is suppose come and install the new
router and bring up routing on a test subnet. Assuming that everything
checks out okay with the T1, new router, and routing, I will have them
swing the main Matronics subnet off the SDSL and onto the T1. In theory,
the swing could be nearly transparent to users, but that's usually not the
case... ;-)
Please expect a bit of instability in connectivity this afternoon as we
work though the transition issues. I will post a follow up message when
everything is up and running on the new T1 line.
Finally, please know that it is solely your Contributions that make these
kinds of List upgrades happen! There is no advertising budget (aka,
flashing banner ads and annoying pop up browser windows) to pay these
bills; operational support is solely from List members like you during the
yearly List Fund Raiser. If you would like to make your Contribution to
support the Lists and upgrades like this T1 connectivity enhancement,
please see the List Contribution Web Site where you can make your
Contribution with a Credit Card, PayPal, or Personal Check. You can even
get a free List Archive CDROM with a qualifying List Contribution! The URL
is: http://www.matronics.com/contribution
Thanks again to EVERYONE that made a generous Contribution last year and
enabled this awesome upgrade to T1 service!
Matt Dralle
Matronics Email List Admin.
Matt G Dralle | Matronics | PO Box 347 | Livermore | CA | 94551
925-606-1001 V | 925-606-6281 F | dralle(at)matronics.com Email
http://www.matronics.com/ WWW | Featuring Products For Aircraft
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Gozewijn Vlasblom" <vlasblom(at)ripnet.com> |
looking to buy/take over:
RV-7 or RV-9 quick build crate.
I am in the proces of moving acros the country and have just finished the
tail, wings and fuse.
Can anybody help out?
Goz vlasblom 90171
vlasblom@ripnet com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Matt Dralle <dralle(at)matronics.com> |
| Subject: | Matronics ISP Upgrade COMPLETED! |
Dear Listers,
I just wanted to send out a quick note to let everyone know that the 1.5Mb
T1 connection upgrade went smoothly today. They brought up the new line
and router yesterday on a test subnet and today the ISP switched over
connectivity about 12 noon with little to no incident. I just finished
some performance testing, and it appears that actual throughput and
interactive response is noticeably improved as advertised!
Enjoy!
Matt Dralle
Matronics Email List Admin.
Matt G Dralle | Matronics | PO Box 347 | Livermore | CA | 94551
925-606-1001 V | 925-606-6281 F | dralle(at)matronics.com Email
http://www.matronics.com/ WWW | Featuring Products For Aircraft
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | [ Fred Stucklen ] : New Email List Photo Share Available! |
| From: | Email List Photo Shares <pictures(at)matronics.com> |
A new Email List Photo Share is available:
Poster: Fred Stucklen
Subject: Electronic Ignition Power
http://www.matronics.com/photoshare/Fred.Stucklen@UTCFuelCells.com.04.02.2003/index.html
o Main Photo Share Index
http://www.matronics.com/photoshare
o Submitting a Photo Share
If you wish to submit a Photo Share of your own, please include the
following information along with your email message and files:
1) Email List or Lists that they are related to:
2) Your Full Name:
3) Your Email Address:
4) One line Subject description:
5) Multi-line, multi-paragraph description of topic:
6) One-line Description of each photo or file:
Email the information above and your files and photos to:
pictures(at)matronics.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Steve Sampson" <SSampson.SLN21(at)london.edu> |
Anyone had problems with this weldement. It's the front component in the
tipper canopy. I think it is welded wrongly.
The problem is this. The aft tube is notched prior to welding, presumably so
it fits into the end plate of the weldement for stabilisation during
welding. However, when the welding was done this was not used and the tube
was tucked under this plate with the notch performing no function. The
result is that there is no way the C-702 can be pulled down flush against
the tube for several of the last holes. The skin stands in excess of "
above the tube half way around the bend, considerably too far away to use
shims. Because the tube has been placed inside the end plate the distance
along the surface of the tube is considerably less than along the skin.
I have advised VANS but they are probably mostly away.
Steve
#90360 UK
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Roger Evenson <revenson(at)comcast.net> |
| Subject: | Where to start in QB plans? |
Van's won't say where in the instructions they stopped construction of quickbuild
fuselage and wings.
Can someone tell me where in section 7 (wings) and/or section 8 (fuselage) to begin?
(Already checked the archives without success).
Roger, Tucson, Arizona, 9A
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Where to start in QB plans? |
| From: | "Patrick E. Moseley" <moseley(at)moseley.com> |
Roger,
From what I have read, the best thing to do is to start at the beginning of
the instructions and check that each thing is done and check it off as you go.
I don't know that the quickbuild is just the kit completed up to some point,
I think that there might be things that were skipped in the instructions that
you need to complete; however, I don't know for sure since I have not built
one.
Patrick Moseley
Tucson, AZ
dreaming/planning 9A
In message <200304050011.h350BmV19313(at)matronics.com>, on 4-Apr-2003,
Roger Evenson writes:
>
> Van's won't say where in the instructions they stopped construction of quickb
> uild fuselage and wings.
>
> Can someone tell me where in section 7 (wings) and/or section 8 (fuselage) to
> begin? (Already checked the archives without success).
>
> Roger, Tucson, Arizona, 9A
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Gary" <rv9er(at)3rivers.net> |
Hi, Steve.
There is a huge gap between the skin and the tube on that curve, as you say. On
each side, I made some thick shims of aluminum, curved to seat against the tube,
for two or three of the holes, and just filled one hole with a rivet. There
was a lot of shimming and fitting for the mating of the skin to the frame,
not just on the curved tube, but the sides as well.
I talked to Van's about it at the time, too. They said people fill in the gap
in various ways, including fiberglass, but it is not necessary to fill it all
in.
I do feel that the tip-up reinforcement kit is not an option, but necessary. I
would not build a tip-up without it.
I fussed over this problem at first, too, but I was pleased with the rigidity
and appearance of the frame when it was finished. Since it is welded aluminum
made of channels, tubes, and formed sheet, I can see that it would be pretty
difficult to build it so the skin would fit smoothly and tightly all over, without
some shimming and fitting, and that a gap on the outside curve of the tube
is quite unimportant.
If you could send me a picture or two of yours off list, I'll see if it looks different
than mine.
Gary
----- Original Message -----
From: Steve Sampson
To: rv9-list(at)matronics.com
Sent: Wednesday, April 02, 2003 11:19 PM
Subject: RV9-List: Wd716
Anyone had problems with this weldement. It's the front component in the
tipper canopy. I think it is welded wrongly.
The problem is this. The aft tube is notched prior to welding, presumably so
it fits into the end plate of the weldement for stabilisation during
welding. However, when the welding was done this was not used and the tube
was tucked under this plate with the notch performing no function. The
result is that there is no way the C-702 can be pulled down flush against
the tube for several of the last holes. The skin stands in excess of "
above the tube half way around the bend, considerably too far away to use
shims. Because the tube has been placed inside the end plate the distance
along the surface of the tube is considerably less than along the skin.
I have advised VANS but they are probably mostly away.
Steve
#90360 UK
---
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | DThomas773(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Where to start in QB plans? |
Hi Roger,
I was at one time considering a quickbuild fuselage and called Van's about
the difference. They told me you use the same plane just start at the
beginning and work through it. Ultimately I ordered a standard kit rather
than wait the 6/7 months for the quickbuild.
Dennis Thomas
fuselage
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Steve Sampson" <SSampson.SLN21(at)london.edu> |
| Subject: | Where to start in QB plans? |
Roger - this comes up regularly and I was wondering the same thing 18 mos
ago. When I rec'd QB wings / fuse #90360 Jan 02, there is NOT a clear place
where they have built up to. (Or there was not then.) At first what you have
to do stutters. You do a bit, they have done a bit and then finally you are
doing it all. That sounds complicated but it isn't. When you have completed
the inventory go to the beginning sit down in front of it with the
instructions, plans and a pencil and if it is done put a tick against the
paragraph. If not, do it.
I think it is well worth while for two reasons:
1. You will understand a lot of worthwhile things about how it is
constructed which will haelp you at a later stage. I have to admit where a
whole subsystem was completed I did not go into the details. For instance I
did not build the tanks and have never fully understoofd the joys orf
proseal!!!!!!
2. There were a surprising number of places where I had to take rivets out!
There seemed to be a need in the Philipines to put a rivet in any empty
hole. They are not good at reading the notes which say "don't put a rivet in
......."
It really wont take more than a couple of hours which in the scheme of
things is nothing, and helps you get the big picture, which I think you
need.
Have fun, Steve.
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv9-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv9-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Roger Evenson
Subject: RV9-List: Where to start in QB plans?
Van's won't say where in the instructions they stopped construction of
quickbuild fuselage and wings.
Can someone tell me where in section 7 (wings) and/or section 8 (fuselage)
to begin? (Already checked the archives without success).
Roger, Tucson, Arizona, 9A
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Steve Sampson" <SSampson.SLN21(at)london.edu> |
Gary - thanks.
I have a message from Ken Scott and it looks as though my part has been
welded up incorrectly. (The tube is entirely INSIDE the gusset plate rather
than part in and part out. I take it your tube is part in and part out?) I
will try and borrow a digital camera since he also would like to see the
problem. If I shim it I would have to get blind rivets that are longer than
any in the kit it is so far away!
What is the tip-up reinforcement kit?
Steve.
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv9-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv9-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Gary
Subject: Re: RV9-List: Wd716
Hi, Steve.
There is a huge gap between the skin and the tube on that curve, as you say.
On each side, I made some thick shims of aluminum, curved to seat against
the tube, for two or three of the holes, and just filled one hole with a
rivet. There was a lot of shimming and fitting for the mating of the skin
to the frame, not just on the curved tube, but the sides as well.
I talked to Van's about it at the time, too. They said people fill in the
gap in various ways, including fiberglass, but it is not necessary to fill
it all in.
I do feel that the tip-up reinforcement kit is not an option, but necessary.
I would not build a tip-up without it.
I fussed over this problem at first, too, but I was pleased with the
rigidity and appearance of the frame when it was finished. Since it is
welded aluminum made of channels, tubes, and formed sheet, I can see that it
would be pretty difficult to build it so the skin would fit smoothly and
tightly all over, without some shimming and fitting, and that a gap on the
outside curve of the tube is quite unimportant.
If you could send me a picture or two of yours off list, I'll see if it
looks different than mine.
Gary
----- Original Message -----
From: Steve Sampson
To: rv9-list(at)matronics.com
Sent: Wednesday, April 02, 2003 11:19 PM
Subject: RV9-List: Wd716
Anyone had problems with this weldement. It's the front component in the
tipper canopy. I think it is welded wrongly.
The problem is this. The aft tube is notched prior to welding, presumably
so
it fits into the end plate of the weldement for stabilisation during
welding. However, when the welding was done this was not used and the tube
was tucked under this plate with the notch performing no function. The
result is that there is no way the C-702 can be pulled down flush against
the tube for several of the last holes. The skin stands in excess of "
above the tube half way around the bend, considerably too far away to use
shims. Because the tube has been placed inside the end plate the distance
along the surface of the tube is considerably less than along the skin.
I have advised VANS but they are probably mostly away.
Steve
#90360 UK
---
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jim Smith" <jsmith(at)openairnet.com> |
Whoa... "Philipines"?
Hi Steve. I just joined the rv9 group and am thinking of building one. Could
you elaborate on the "Philipines" thing. Does Van send his QBs out?
Thanks!
Jim
----- Original Message -----
From: "Steve Sampson" <SSampson.SLN21(at)london.edu>
Subject: RE: RV9-List: Where to start in QB plans?
>
> Roger - this comes up regularly and I was wondering the same thing 18 mos
> ago. When I rec'd QB wings / fuse #90360 Jan 02, there is NOT a clear
place
> where they have built up to. (Or there was not then.) At first what you
have
> to do stutters. You do a bit, they have done a bit and then finally you
are
> doing it all. That sounds complicated but it isn't. When you have
completed
> the inventory go to the beginning sit down in front of it with the
> instructions, plans and a pencil and if it is done put a tick against the
> paragraph. If not, do it.
>
> I think it is well worth while for two reasons:
> 1. You will understand a lot of worthwhile things about how it is
> constructed which will haelp you at a later stage. I have to admit where a
> whole subsystem was completed I did not go into the details. For instance
I
> did not build the tanks and have never fully understoofd the joys orf
> proseal!!!!!!
> 2. There were a surprising number of places where I had to take rivets
out!
> There seemed to be a need in the Philipines to put a rivet in any empty
> hole. They are not good at reading the notes which say "don't put a rivet
in
> ......."
>
> It really wont take more than a couple of hours which in the scheme of
> things is nothing, and helps you get the big picture, which I think you
> need.
>
> Have fun, Steve.
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-rv9-list-server(at)matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-rv9-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Roger Evenson
> Sent: 05 April 2003 01:11
> To: rv9-list(at)matronics.com
> Subject: RV9-List: Where to start in QB plans?
>
>
> Van's won't say where in the instructions they stopped construction of
> quickbuild fuselage and wings.
>
> Can someone tell me where in section 7 (wings) and/or section 8 (fuselage)
> to begin? (Already checked the archives without success).
>
> Roger, Tucson, Arizona, 9A
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Fred & Ester New" <fred.new(at)delfi.ee> |
That's right. If you look at Van's Quick-build Web page
(http://www.vansaircraft.com/public/kit-qb.htm) you'll see that, "QuickBuild
Kits are assembled by Wright Aircraft, Inc. in the Philippines, or High
Performance Aircraft International in the Czech Republic, from parts
supplied by Van's." One of the recent RVators stated that the Phillipines
plant wasn't able to produce fast enough so they started contracting with
the Czech firm. As I recall, they were very pleased with the products from
the Czech Republic. (By the way, you should order the RVator from Van's if
you haven't already.)
Fred New
-9A wannabuild
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv9-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv9-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of Jim Smith
Subject: RV9-List: Philipines
Whoa... "Philipines"?
Hi Steve. I just joined the rv9 group and am thinking of building one. Could
you elaborate on the "Philipines" thing. Does Van send his QBs out?
Thanks!
Jim
----- Original Message -----
From: "Steve Sampson" <SSampson.SLN21(at)london.edu>
Subject: RE: RV9-List: Where to start in QB plans?
>
> Roger - this comes up regularly and I was wondering the same thing 18 mos
> ago. When I rec'd QB wings / fuse #90360 Jan 02, there is NOT a clear
place
> where they have built up to. (Or there was not then.) At first what you
have
> to do stutters. You do a bit, they have done a bit and then finally you
are
> doing it all. That sounds complicated but it isn't. When you have
completed
> the inventory go to the beginning sit down in front of it with the
> instructions, plans and a pencil and if it is done put a tick against the
> paragraph. If not, do it.
>
> I think it is well worth while for two reasons:
> 1. You will understand a lot of worthwhile things about how it is
> constructed which will haelp you at a later stage. I have to admit where a
> whole subsystem was completed I did not go into the details. For instance
I
> did not build the tanks and have never fully understoofd the joys orf
> proseal!!!!!!
> 2. There were a surprising number of places where I had to take rivets
out!
> There seemed to be a need in the Philipines to put a rivet in any empty
> hole. They are not good at reading the notes which say "don't put a rivet
in
> ......."
>
> It really wont take more than a couple of hours which in the scheme of
> things is nothing, and helps you get the big picture, which I think you
> need.
>
> Have fun, Steve.
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-rv9-list-server(at)matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-rv9-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Roger Evenson
> Sent: 05 April 2003 01:11
> To: rv9-list(at)matronics.com
> Subject: RV9-List: Where to start in QB plans?
>
>
> Van's won't say where in the instructions they stopped construction of
> quickbuild fuselage and wings.
>
> Can someone tell me where in section 7 (wings) and/or section 8 (fuselage)
> to begin? (Already checked the archives without success).
>
> Roger, Tucson, Arizona, 9A
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jim Smith" <jsmith(at)openairnet.com> |
Thanks Fred!
Good to know. I can see that this RV9 email tool will come in very handy. I
will order my RVator today.
Jim Smith
Lead Internet Specialist
www.fun-places-to-fly.com
----- Original Message -----
From: "Fred & Ester New" <fred.new(at)delfi.ee>
Subject: RE: RV9-List: Philipines
>
> That's right. If you look at Van's Quick-build Web page
> (http://www.vansaircraft.com/public/kit-qb.htm) you'll see that,
"QuickBuild
> Kits are assembled by Wright Aircraft, Inc. in the Philippines, or High
> Performance Aircraft International in the Czech Republic, from parts
> supplied by Van's." One of the recent RVators stated that the Phillipines
> plant wasn't able to produce fast enough so they started contracting with
> the Czech firm. As I recall, they were very pleased with the products
from
> the Czech Republic. (By the way, you should order the RVator from Van's
if
> you haven't already.)
>
> Fred New
> -9A wannabuild
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-rv9-list-server(at)matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-rv9-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of Jim Smith
> To: rv9-list(at)matronics.com
> Subject: RV9-List: Philipines
>
>
> Whoa... "Philipines"?
> Hi Steve. I just joined the rv9 group and am thinking of building one.
Could
> you elaborate on the "Philipines" thing. Does Van send his QBs out?
>
> Thanks!
> Jim
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Steve Sampson" <SSampson.SLN21(at)london.edu>
> To:
> Subject: RE: RV9-List: Where to start in QB plans?
>
>
>
> >
> > Roger - this comes up regularly and I was wondering the same thing 18
mos
> > ago. When I rec'd QB wings / fuse #90360 Jan 02, there is NOT a clear
> place
> > where they have built up to. (Or there was not then.) At first what you
> have
> > to do stutters. You do a bit, they have done a bit and then finally you
> are
> > doing it all. That sounds complicated but it isn't. When you have
> completed
> > the inventory go to the beginning sit down in front of it with the
> > instructions, plans and a pencil and if it is done put a tick against
the
> > paragraph. If not, do it.
> >
> > I think it is well worth while for two reasons:
> > 1. You will understand a lot of worthwhile things about how it is
> > constructed which will haelp you at a later stage. I have to admit where
a
> > whole subsystem was completed I did not go into the details. For
instance
> I
> > did not build the tanks and have never fully understoofd the joys orf
> > proseal!!!!!!
> > 2. There were a surprising number of places where I had to take rivets
> out!
> > There seemed to be a need in the Philipines to put a rivet in any empty
> > hole. They are not good at reading the notes which say "don't put a
rivet
> in
> > ......."
> >
> > It really wont take more than a couple of hours which in the scheme of
> > things is nothing, and helps you get the big picture, which I think you
> > need.
> >
> > Have fun, Steve.
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: owner-rv9-list-server(at)matronics.com
> > [mailto:owner-rv9-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Roger Evenson
> > Sent: 05 April 2003 01:11
> > To: rv9-list(at)matronics.com
> > Subject: RV9-List: Where to start in QB plans?
> >
> >
> > Van's won't say where in the instructions they stopped construction of
> > quickbuild fuselage and wings.
> >
> > Can someone tell me where in section 7 (wings) and/or section 8
(fuselage)
> > to begin? (Already checked the archives without success).
> >
> > Roger, Tucson, Arizona, 9A
> >
> >
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
> Whoa... "Philipines"?
> Hi Steve. I just joined the rv9 group and am thinking of building one.
Could
> you elaborate on the "Philipines" thing. Does Van send his QBs out?
Jim,
I've inspected a cuple of the QB's right out of the crate. The workmanship
is very good.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Tim <rv9a_000(at)deru.com> |
| Subject: | Rudder travel and stops |
OK, I seem to have a measurement problem somewhere
but I can't see it.
I have the tail mounted to the fuse, and I am trying
to place the rudder stops. However, when the rudder
swings, it contacts the elevators long before the horn
can contact the stop.
My first thought was that the rod ends were way too far
out so I double checked drawing 6pp & 7 and verified the
distances between the spars at the top and bottom. They
all seem to check out OK - the spar webs are 2.5" apart
at the bottom.
The stops are made to plan, and when clecoed on with the
one prepunched mounting hole, the aft edge of the angle
is flush with the aft edge of the tailcone.
Can anyone tell me what I missed??
Thanks,
- Tim.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Steve Sampson" <SSampson.SLN21(at)london.edu> |
Jim - you have your answer from others. No complaints about the
workmanship....its better than mine. They just like filling holes with
rivets even when it says don't! Steve.
PS I believe the Czech ones are exceptionally good, but then they are the
best engineers. Havnt seen one.
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv9-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv9-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Jim Smith
Subject: RV9-List: Philipines
Whoa... "Philipines"?
Hi Steve. I just joined the rv9 group and am thinking of building one. Could
you elaborate on the "Philipines" thing. Does Van send his QBs out?
Thanks!
Jim
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "The Strong's" <tstrong(at)ida.net> |
| Subject: | Flap hinge bracket |
I am working on the flap hinge brackets. I've found the W-925B parts but
it says to make the W925C parts out of AA6-063x3/4x3/4.
As near as I can figure the only AA6-063x3/4x3/4 I have are 2 pieces 12'
long. Is this the piece I should use? I can't figure what
these two 12' pieces are for unless they are suppose to be saved for the
fuselage.
Thanks, Tom
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Edcarris(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Flap hinge bracket |
Look at the last page of your inventory sheet.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Mike Duiven" <emduiven(at)chaffee.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Flap hinge bracket |
I called Van's and they indicated you should cut the 12' hunk to length.
You'll need more in the Fuselage so don't use it all!
Mike Duiven
----- Original Message -----
From: "The Strong's" <tstrong(at)ida.net>
Subject: RV9-List: Flap hinge bracket
>
> I am working on the flap hinge brackets. I've found the W-925B parts but
> it says to make the W925C parts out of AA6-063x3/4x3/4.
> As near as I can figure the only AA6-063x3/4x3/4 I have are 2 pieces 12'
> long. Is this the piece I should use? I can't figure what
> these two 12' pieces are for unless they are suppose to be saved for the
> fuselage.
>
> Thanks, Tom
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jim Smith" <jsmith(at)openairnet.com> |
| Subject: | Compressor question |
I have an old compressor that is 1.5 HP with a 3 gallon tank. Will this do
the job or should I get a bigger one? Suggestions welcome.
Jim Smith
Lead Internet Specialist
www.fun-places-to-fly.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Gary" <rv9er(at)3rivers.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Compressor question |
You might want more tank capacity. If you keep the pressure down below 80 psi
or so, you could hook an old water heater tank in series with what you have.
Patch the pin holes with JB Weld and use a filter/dryer. Toss it in the trash
when you are ready to go fly.
Gary
----- Original Message -----
From: Jim Smith
To: rv9-list(at)matronics.com
Sent: Monday, April 07, 2003 11:34 AM
Subject: RV9-List: Compressor question
I have an old compressor that is 1.5 HP with a 3 gallon tank. Will this do
the job or should I get a bigger one? Suggestions welcome.
Jim Smith
Lead Internet Specialist
www.fun-places-to-fly.com
---
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Boyd Butler" <linbb(at)worldnet.att.net> |
Please do not use anything other than an approved tank for air the resulting
disaster if it explodes can and will be devastating if you or any one is near,do
not patch as described. Also the more air pressure for a given volume of tank
will result in more capacity in the tank to draw from.
The results of using anything like described has been witnessed after my neighbor
did that with an old heater that wasn't leaking.
Boyd Butler
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Im7shannon(at)aol.com |
You could, however pressure test your system first at about 200 psi from a
safe distance. This should be done anyway for any added components which have
not been tested by the manufacturer.
Kevin
>
> Please do not use anything other than an approved tank for air the
> resulting disaster if it explodes can and will be devastating if you or any
> one is near,do not patch as described. Also the more air pressure for a
> given volume of tank will result in more capacity in the tank to draw from.
> The results of using anything like described has been witnessed after my
> neighbor did that with an old heater that wasn't leaking.
> Boyd Butler
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Chris W <chrisw3(at)cox.net> |
I have to agree. If you want to just add more tank capacity look around for someone
with a dead compressor that is replacing it, take the dead compressor off
sell the motor on ebay and use just the tank, or there are some places you
can buy an air tank with out the compressor.
Chris W
Boyd Butler wrote:
>
> Please do not use anything other than an approved tank for air the resulting
disaster if it explodes can and will be devastating if you or any one is near,do
not patch as described. Also the more air pressure for a given volume of
tank will result in more capacity in the tank to draw from.
> The results of using anything like described has been witnessed after my neighbor
did that with an old heater that wasn't leaking.
> Boyd Butler
>
--
Chris Woodhouse
3147 SW 127th St.
Oklahoma City, OK 73170
405-691-5206
chrisw(at)programmer.net
N35 20.492'
W97 34.342'
"They that can give up essential liberty
to obtain a little temporary safety
deserve neither liberty nor safety."
-- Benjamin Franklin, 1759 Historical Review of Pennsylvania
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Cy Galley" <cgalley(at)qcbc.org> |
February 24, 2003 - April 07, 2003
RV9-Archive.digest.vol-aj