RV9-Archive.digest.vol-an
February 08, 2004 - April 18, 2004
Regards, Steve.
Engine cowls
UK
---
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Steve Sampson" <SSampson.SLN21(at)london.edu> |
| Subject: | Fitting lower cowl |
Dale - I am interested in your query since although I dont have your
problem, it is certainly close, little more than the 1/4" I think. But I do
have the exhaust very close to the bolts at the bottom of the firewall and
also the lower cowl where it drops down. How far off these are you? Not only
will the engine move but I see no reason why they should not move left and
right as a pair. I have the heat muff pushed right up to the ball joint.
Steve.
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv9-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv9-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of Dale Larsen
Subject: Re: RV9-List: Fitting lower cowl
Gary,
Thanks for the reply. I twisted mine, but it still contacts the cowl. I
can't slide it forward any farther because it is already butting against the
ball joint in the exhaust pipe. I'm thinking I might have to make the muff
shorter so it won't contact the cowl. It it will need at least 1/4"
clearance because the engine will move with respect to the cowl.
Dale
RV9A N61DX
> It was a tight fit on mine, had to twist the ends and offset it just
right. I also added a muff on the crossovers, and put the two in series.
---
Incoming mail is certified Virus Free.
---
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | RV9A O320B3B coniclal mount (straight mount) |
| From: | Joe Wiza <planejoel(at)juno.com> |
I purchased O320B3B completly overhauled and ordered my mount from Vans
requiring several hundred dollars in advance. Well I think I've got
anothe tear jerker, the engine mounts up against the engine itself to the
point with proper torque I can't get the cotter pins in.No space between
engine and engine mount. Also the bracket holes for throttle and mixture
line up with mount looks like new holes have to drilled. Any body
encounter this problem. unless I'm missing something completly Engine
comes off with washer spacers or something, (erg remove engine).
RV9A Trying to mount engine.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Gary Zilik <zilik(at)direcpc.com> |
| Subject: | Re: RV9A O320B3B coniclal mount (straight mount) |
You might try metal lock nuts instead of castle nuts. This is what I
have seen used on the Lancairs.
Gary
Joe Wiza wrote:
>
>I purchased O320B3B completly overhauled and ordered my mount from Vans
>requiring several hundred dollars in advance. Well I think I've got
>anothe tear jerker, the engine mounts up against the engine itself to the
>point with proper torque I can't get the cotter pins in.No space between
>engine and engine mount. Also the bracket holes for throttle and mixture
>line up with mount looks like new holes have to drilled. Any body
>encounter this problem. unless I'm missing something completly Engine
>comes off with washer spacers or something, (erg remove engine).
>
>RV9A Trying to mount engine.
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Steve Sampson" <SSampson.SLN21(at)london.edu> |
| Subject: | #6 & #8 dimple dies |
Richard - I am not a tool nut, but my view is buy all the dimple dies and
then you have them. They are cheap in the scheme of things. I cant tell you
how many times they crop up, but from time to time. Several of the locations
are in highly visible places. As I write that I am thinking of the tipper
canopy. My own view is I wish VANS just told you to get them all at the
start. Steve.
---
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Fitting lower cowl |
Steve,
Thaer is from 1/2-3/4" clearance between the cowl and exhaust pipe where the
pipes exit the cowl. The pipes are only 1/2" away from the bottom firewall
though.
Dale
>
> Dale - I am interested in your query since although I dont have your
> problem, it is certainly close, little more than the 1/4" I think. But I
do
> have the exhaust very close to the bolts at the bottom of the firewall and
> also the lower cowl where it drops down. How far off these are you? Not
only
> will the engine move but I see no reason why they should not move left and
> right as a pair. I have the heat muff pushed right up to the ball joint.
>
> Steve.
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: RV9A O320B3B coniclal mount (straight mount) |
Joe,
Are you talking about the engine mount mounting bolts, or the bolts in the
dynafocal mounts?
Dale
----- Original Message -----
From: "Joe Wiza" <planejoel(at)juno.com>
Subject: RV9-List: RV9A O320B3B coniclal mount (straight mount)
>
> I purchased O320B3B completly overhauled and ordered my mount from Vans
> requiring several hundred dollars in advance. Well I think I've got
> anothe tear jerker, the engine mounts up against the engine itself to the
> point with proper torque I can't get the cotter pins in.No space between
> engine and engine mount. Also the bracket holes for throttle and mixture
> line up with mount looks like new holes have to drilled. Any body
> encounter this problem. unless I'm missing something completly Engine
> comes off with washer spacers or something, (erg remove engine).
>
> RV9A Trying to mount engine.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Harold Kovac" <kayce(at)sysmatrix.net> |
Hi Gary,
I've been lurking for a long while on this list and just found a HUD Display
mentioned on the Yahoo Glass Cockpit forum.
http://www.jrl-engineering.com I suspect it could be worthwhile to take a
look at.
Harold Kovac,
RV9A-wings nearly complete, Fuse on order
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jones" <esnj(at)granbury.com> |
Steve: My finished empty weight (with paint) is 1079 lbs. and the CG is
7.63 inches aft of the leading edge with an O320-E2D, SkyTec starter,
Electro Systems (large) alternator, standard instruments, and a Sensenich FP
prop. This is exactly where Van's shows the empty weight CG in their sample
calculations in the manual. Their sample weight is 1071 lbs.
Dick Jones 90062
----- Original Message -----
From: "Steve Sampson" <SSampson.SLN21(at)london.edu>
Subject: RV9-List: RV9a W & B
>
> I would be interested to know from those of you that have weighed your
> aircraft, is the CofG tending to be to far forward or aft? I ask this
> because as I install the few bits and pieces which can be put in a variety
> of places I dont know which way to bias things. Did the example in the
> manual seem similar to your own aircraft? I believe these figures are from
> the O-320 VANS demonstrator.
>
> Mine is an O-320-E2D with an electric MT prop. The prop is quite a bit
> lighter than a Hartzell CS but clearly heavier than an FP prop. PC680 on
the
> firewall. The panel will have little in it, most of which weighs little
more
> than nothing. (Dynon, GR4000, ASI, Navaid, Microair rad and Transponder,
> Skyforce and a few switches.)
>
> All inputs welcome.
>
> Regards, Steve.
> Engine cowls
> UK
>
> ---
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | DThomas773(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: RV9A O320B3B coniclal mount (straight mount) |
Have you called and talked with the at Van's?
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | kerrjohna(at)comcast.net |
either I'm really fumble-fingered or the canopy/windscreen process is the toughest
part of the airframe. going into the 3rd week of 5-6 days/week trying to get
all the edges lined up.
last night reading ahead to take my mind off things in the section on the fiberglass
layup around the base of the windscreen a sentence jumps off the page at
me:"....where the plex lies under the skin". nowhere does my plex lay under
the skin, i have to really suck it in to get the bottom edge to the skin.
what am I missing?
in the meantime I will be out at the hangar shaping the bows attaching the canopy,
measuring, then doing it all over again.
John Kerr 800hrs and not making much progress right now.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Andy Karmy" <andy(at)karmy.com> |
I have a Sensenich metal prop and an 0-320. I came in right in the
middle of the range and can't load it out of CG range with any
normal loads. I can load to over gross and it's still in the range.
- Andy
---------- Original Message
----------------------------------
From: "Steve Sampson" <SSampson.SLN21(at)london.edu>
Date: Sun, 8 Feb 2004 17:43:09 -0000
>
>I would be interested to know from those of you that have
weighed your
>aircraft, is the CofG tending to be to far forward or aft? I ask this
>because as I install the few bits and pieces which can be put in a
variety
>of places I dont know which way to bias things. Did the example
in the
>manual seem similar to your own aircraft? I believe these figures
are from
>the O-320 VANS demonstrator.
>
>Mine is an O-320-E2D with an electric MT prop. The prop is quite
a bit
>lighter than a Hartzell CS but clearly heavier than an FP prop.
PC680 on the
>firewall. The panel will have little in it, most of which weighs little
more
>than nothing. (Dynon, GR4000, ASI, Navaid, Microair rad and
Transponder,
>Skyforce and a few switches.)
>
>All inputs welcome.
>
>Regards, Steve.
>Engine cowls
>UK
>
>---
>
>
>_-
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>_-
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>_-
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>_-
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>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Albert Gardner" <spudnut(at)worldnet.att.net> |
Another thing to look out for is the alignment of the square tubes at the
bottom of the canopy frame compared the fuse sides. This is a key point:
the sides of those square tubes should be vertical (like the fuse sides) but
inset about 1/16". Later on when you are fitting the side skirts, this keeps
you from having a wrinkle in the bottom skirts. (See page 9-9 bottom, DWG
43 Section F-F).
The windscreen sets on top of the skin and is held in place by small metal
clips that are later buried in the fillet that matches the windscreen to the
fuse.
Albert Gardner
RV-9A 872RV
Yuma, AZ
----- Original Message -----
Subject: RV9-List: windscreen
> either I'm really fumble-fingered or the canopy/windscreen process is the
toughest part of the airframe. going into the 3rd week of 5-6 days/week
trying to get all the edges lined up.
> last night reading ahead to take my mind off things in the section on the
fiberglass layup around the base of the windscreen a sentence jumps off the
page at me:"....where the plex lies under the skin". nowhere does my plex
lay under the skin, i have to really suck it in to get the bottom edge to
the skin.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Albert Gardner" <spudnut(at)worldnet.att.net> |
Hey Steve, how's it going?
My RV-9A weighs 1104 lbs., a little on the heavy side from what I hear with
the CG at 79.09". Most forward is at 1470 lbs and 80.14" (150 lb pilot, full
fuel, no baggage) while most aft is 1654 lbs and 84.75" (pilot & passenger
at 220 ea, 5 gal gas and 80 lb baggage.)
A few months ago on this or the RV-List, somebody was asking for W&B data on
the 9's that were flying. Anybody remember that?
Albert Gardner
RV-9A 872RV 160 hrs.
Yuma, AZ
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Roger Evenson" <revenson(at)comcast.net> |
That might have been me. I was trying to compare avg Lycoming weights with
Subaru weights. Here's the Lycoming info. It didn't format well coming out
of an excel spreadsheet, but if you are interested the numbers are
decipherable. Roger E.
RV9A's avg who's O320 O320FP O320CS
0235, wood, no paint, electric panel 990 wesley
0320, wood, no paint 1032 gary 1032 1032
0320, metal fixed, paint electric ifr 1104 albert 1104 1104
0320, constant, vfr 1087 jim 1087 1087
0320, metal fixed, no paint, full vfr 1034 andy 1034 1034
0320, metal fixed, w/paint, skytech 1079 dick 1079 1079
0360, constant 1178 earl
O235 960 stan
0320, CS hartzell 1100 dave 1100 1100
0320, CS hartzell, elec ifr no paint 1083 chris 1083 1083
0320, fixed metal 1078 don 1078 1078
0320, fixed metal 1055 owen 1055 1055
O320, fixed metal 1048 bob 1048 1048
mean 1063.6923 1070 1061.429 1090
----- Original Message -----
From: "Albert Gardner" <spudnut(at)worldnet.att.net>
Subject: Re: RV9-List: RV9a W & B
>
> Hey Steve, how's it going?
> My RV-9A weighs 1104 lbs., a little on the heavy side from what I hear
with
> the CG at 79.09". Most forward is at 1470 lbs and 80.14" (150 lb pilot,
full
> fuel, no baggage) while most aft is 1654 lbs and 84.75" (pilot & passenger
> at 220 ea, 5 gal gas and 80 lb baggage.)
>
> A few months ago on this or the RV-List, somebody was asking for W&B data
on
> the 9's that were flying. Anybody remember that?
>
> Albert Gardner
> RV-9A 872RV 160 hrs.
> Yuma, AZ
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: RV9A O320B3B coniclal mount (straight mount) |
| From: | Joe Wiza <planejoel(at)juno.com> |
This is a conical mount (straaight)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Rob W M Shipley" <rob(at)robsglass.com> |
Listers,
Do any of you who are flying ahve any thoughts on stick length. The various RVs
I've flown all seem to fly well with the stick held about half way down.
Clearly the 9 will fly a little differently but does anyone feel the stick too
long? How about in recovery from unusual attitudes or in steep turns? Would
shortening the stick leave too little mechanical advantage in the stressful corners
of the flight envelope?
Your .02 much appreciated.
Rob
Rob W M Shipley
N919RV (res) Fuselage .....still!
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | robert watson <bob1629r(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Stick length |
-----Original Message-----
From: Rob W M Shipley <rob(at)robsglass.com>
Subject: RV9-List: Stick length
I was going to cut stick down after flying for a period of time.But found out that
I like it at full length.less sensative at low speeds during landing and flair.In
steep turns it is also a plus. and at top speed less over control. Bob.
9-A N194BN
Listers,
Do any of you who are flying ahve any thoughts on stick length. The various RVs
I've flown all seem to fly well with the stick held about half way down.
Clearly the 9 will fly a little differently but does anyone feel the stick too
long? How about in recovery from unusual attitudes or in steep turns? Would
shortening the stick leave too little mechanical advantage in the stressful corners
of the flight envelope?
Your .02 much appreciated.
Rob
Rob W M Shipley
N919RV (res) Fuselage .....still!
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "fcs(at)jlc.net" <fcs(at)jlc.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Stick length |
I cut 2" off the sticks on my 9, mainly to keep them further away from the
panel and fuselage sides. In flight, you rarely move the stick more than
an inch in any direction, except during landing flare or high bank turns.
Stick forces are so light I didn't feel the need for more leverage, and I
like the fast response. It's really a matter of personal taste. You can
always shorten them later on if you're careful about the wiring.
Gary
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Matthew Brandes" <matthew(at)n523rv.com> |
| Subject: | Center console/throttle setup |
Does anyone recognize this RV interior?
http://www.n523rv.com/images/RVCenterConsole.jpg
I really like this setup with the throttle in the middle and the little
pedestal running up with fuel gauge and trim indicators. I would like to
talk with whoever did this.
Matthew Brandes,
Van's RV-9A (Wings/Fuselage)
EAA Chapter 868/91
www.n523rv.com <http://www.n523rv.com/>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Racing4funn(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: RV-List: Center console/throttle setup |
FUCK YOU!!!
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Center console/throttle setup |
Matthew,
Don't recognize it, but did something similar. See
http://www.27zero.com/N61DX.htm
Dale
> Does anyone recognize this RV interior?
> http://www.n523rv.com/images/RVCenterConsole.jpg
>
> I really like this setup with the throttle in the middle and the little
> pedestal running up with fuel gauge and trim indicators. I would like to
> talk with whoever did this.
>
> Matthew Brandes,
> Van's RV-9A (Wings/Fuselage)
> EAA Chapter 868/91
> www.n523rv.com <http://www.n523rv.com/>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | [ Jim Jewell ] : New Email List Photo Share Available! |
| From: | Email List Photo Shares <pictures(at)matronics.com> |
A new Email List Photo Share is available:
Poster: Jim Jewell
Subject: Dynon Compass Module
http://www.matronics.com/photoshare/jjewell@telus.net.02.11.2004/index.html
o Main Photo Share Index
http://www.matronics.com/photoshare
o Submitting a Photo Share
If you wish to submit a Photo Share of your own, please include the
following information along with your email message and files:
1) Email List or Lists that they are related to:
2) Your Full Name:
3) Your Email Address:
4) One line Subject description:
5) Multi-line, multi-paragraph description of topic:
6) One-line Description of each photo or file:
Email the information above and your files and photos to:
pictures(at)matronics.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Terrence Gardner" <ttandt(at)mindspring.com> |
| Subject: | Stock Blank Panel |
I have an unused Van's blank instrument panel for sale. Part number is
F7103 if anyone is interested. Price is negotiable.
Terry Gardner
RV9A Avionics/Finishing
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Source of Acetone ? |
| From: | Gerry Filby <gerf(at)gerf.com> |
Anyone know of a source for Acetone apart from Aircraft Spruce
- preferrably one the in SF Bay Area that I can go to in person ?
Aircraft Spruce do such a bad job of packing that the aluminum
cans they use end up leaking after UPS is done beating them up.
g
==========================================================
Gerry Filby gerf(at)gerf.com
Home (415) 239 4846
Cell (415) 203 9177
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Source of Acetone ? |
Your local Home Depot should have it.
Or an automotive supply store. (PepBoys/etc.)
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Source of Acetone ? |
| From: | "Larry PERRYMAN" <larry.perryman(at)atofina.com> |
02/12/2004 10:24:00 PM,
Serialize complete at 02/12/2004 10:24:00 PM
Try the other aircraft parts stores - Home Depot or Lowes. They both
carry it in the paint section.
Regards,
Larry Perryman
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Richard Tasker <retasker(at)optonline.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Source of Acetone ? |
Home Depot sells it in NJ, but I don't know about CA with their smog laws.
Dick Tasker, 90573
Gerry Filby wrote:
>
>
>Anyone know of a source for Acetone apart from Aircraft Spruce
>- preferrably one the in SF Bay Area that I can go to in person ?
>
>Aircraft Spruce do such a bad job of packing that the aluminum
>cans they use end up leaking after UPS is done beating them up.
>
>g
>
>
>==========================================================
>Gerry Filby gerf(at)gerf.com
> Home (415) 239 4846
> Cell (415) 203 917
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Pitner, Timothy" <TPitner(at)flowcorp.com> |
| Subject: | Source of Acetone ? |
I was in Tracy a few months ago, and Ace hardware had some on the shelves.
TIM PITNER
Technical Service
Flow International Corporation | www.flowcorp.com
23500 64th Ave. S. | Kent, WA 98032 | USA
tel: 253.813.3318 | fax: 253.813.3282 | tpitner(at)flowcorp.com
-----Original Message-----
From: Gerry Filby [mailto:gerf(at)gerf.com]
Subject: RV9-List: Source of Acetone ?
Anyone know of a source for Acetone apart from Aircraft Spruce
- preferrably one the in SF Bay Area that I can go to in person ?
Aircraft Spruce do such a bad job of packing that the aluminum
cans they use end up leaking after UPS is done beating them up.
g
==========================================================
Gerry Filby gerf(at)gerf.com
Home (415) 239 4846
Cell (415) 203 9177
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Source of Acetone ? |
| From: | "Larry PERRYMAN" <larry.perryman(at)atofina.com> |
02/12/2004 11:10:27 PM,
Serialize complete at 02/12/2004 11:10:27 PM
Yup, You have to wonder about the "left" coast. I thought about that after
I sent my reply.
Regards,
Larry Perryman
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Stein Bruch" <stein(at)steinair.com> |
"Rv8-List" , "Rv7-List" ,
"Rv6-List"
| Subject: | Wire Sizes in the wing |
SUSPICIOUS_RECIPS
Hi Guys,
Just a quick note about something that I've seen in the past month or two
that is a little confusing. I've had no less than at least 6 people ask me
for some AWG10 wire to use in their wings. Seems someone "out there" has
recommened AWG10 or AWG12 for running to the landing lights.
To anyone who is currently wiring your plane, don't fall into the trap that
some people do.....that being "if some is perfect, more must be better" -
with wire sizes, this is just a huge waste of money, weight, resources,
etc.. If the recommened wire is AWG16 or AWG18, there is NO reason to use
an AWG10.
Just a quick FYI, an AWG10 wire running the approximate length of a RVxx
wing, will carry something in the area of 800+ Watts. Who has a landing
light requiring that much power?!?! Heck, an AWG16 wire should carry well
over 180 Watts in that length.
Here's the simple breakdown before adding in resistance per 1K.
AWG10 - 70amps current carrying capacity
AWG12 - 50amps
AWG14 - 40amps
So, if you are one of those people running those huge AWG10 wires to your
wingtips, ask yourselves why?!? Two big reasons NOT to are:
1). Cost--AWG16-18 averages around $.17/ft & AWG10 is around $.50/ft (300%
higher).
2). Weight--AWG16-18 averages .005 lbs/ft, where AWG10 = .03lbs/ft.
Meaning, for an average set of wings at 2 wires x 18' = 36' x 2 wings = 72'
of wire. At AWG16 or 18 the weight would only be about 8oz's total. AWG10
would be over 2 POUNDS!!
Anyway, sorry about the rant...I just thought it might be a good idea to
bring this to the surface. Somehow, somewhere, there is a movement to put
fat wires into the wings, and I don't know why. If you are one of those
people, please enlighten me and the rest of us!
FYI, I do have AWG12 on up, and will stock some AWG10 in the future, but in
all reality, there isn't much need for it.
Cheers,
Stein Bruch
RV6's, Minneapolis
http://www.steinair.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "John Oliveira" <oliveira(at)frontiernet.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Source of Acetone ? |
Try your local hardware store
----- Original Message -----
From: "Gerry Filby" <gerf(at)gerf.com>
Subject: RV9-List: Source of Acetone ?
>
>
> Anyone know of a source for Acetone apart from Aircraft Spruce
> - preferrably one the in SF Bay Area that I can go to in person ?
>
> Aircraft Spruce do such a bad job of packing that the aluminum
> cans they use end up leaking after UPS is done beating them up.
>
> g
>
>
> ==========================================================
> Gerry Filby gerf(at)gerf.com
> Home (415) 239 4846
> Cell (415) 203 9177
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Boyd Butler" <linbb(at)worldnet.att.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Wire Sizes in the wing |
I don't know where you got the amps for wire size but in most cases they
are fused
for the following, 10 ga, 30 amps; 12 ga 20 amps; 14 ga 15 amps. I do wiring
and am a certified mechanic and would not run 70 amps tru 10 ga wire, check
your house wiring its fused the same.Also use the FAA requirements for your
wire size and fusing not what someone thinks is right. I was also an
aircraft mechanic for several years and went to A& E school which I
graduated from, I learned that for aircraft you follow the FAA guidelines
not sayso by someone else. Boyd Butler
-------Original Message-------
From: rv9-list(at)matronics.com
Date: Thursday, February 12, 2004 16:38:09
Subject: RV9-List: Wire Sizes in the wing
Hi Guys,
Just a quick note about something that I've seen in the past month or two
that is a little confusing. I've had no less than at least 6 people ask me
for some AWG10 wire to use in their wings. Seems someone "out there" has
recommened AWG10 or AWG12 for running to the landing lights.
To anyone who is currently wiring your plane, don't fall into the trap that
some people do.....that being "if some is perfect, more must be better" -
with wire sizes, this is just a huge waste of money, weight, resources,
etc.. If the recommened wire is AWG16 or AWG18, there is NO reason to use
an AWG10.
Just a quick FYI, an AWG10 wire running the approximate length of a RVxx
wing, will carry something in the area of 800+ Watts. Who has a landing
light requiring that much power?!?! Heck, an AWG16 wire should carry well
over 180 Watts in that length.
Here's the simple breakdown before adding in resistance per 1K.
AWG10 - 70amps current carrying capacity
AWG12 - 50amps
AWG14 - 40amps
So, if you are one of those people running those huge AWG10 wires to your
wingtips, ask yourselves why?!? Two big reasons NOT to are:
1). Cost--AWG16-18 averages around $.17/ft & AWG10 is around $.50/ft (300%
higher).
2). Weight--AWG16-18 averages .005 lbs/ft, where AWG10 .03lbs/ft.
Meaning, for an average set of wings at 2 wires x 18' 36' x 2 wings 72'
of wire. At AWG16 or 18 the weight would only be about 8oz's total. AWG10
would be over 2 POUNDS!!
Anyway, sorry about the rant...I just thought it might be a good idea to
bring this to the surface. Somehow, somewhere, there is a movement to put
fat wires into the wings, and I don't know why. If you are one of those
people, please enlighten me and the rest of us!
FYI, I do have AWG12 on up, and will stock some AWG10 in the future, but in
all reality, there isn't much need for it.
Cheers,
Stein Bruch
RV6's, Minneapolis
http://www.steinair.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Wire Sizes in the wing |
Ampacity of wire is calculated by the length of the wire (ohms/foot), and
the acceptable temperature rise. The temperature rise is different for free
air or in a bundle or conduit. 'Lectric Bob explains it best here:
http://aeroelectric.com/articles/wiresize.pdf.
I think Steins point is some people are using wire way too big for the
application. Boyd is correct also, AC 43.13 Acceptable Methods shaould
rule.
Dale
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Boyd Butler" <linbb(at)worldnet.att.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Wire Sizes in the wing |
Thank you Dale, the way that it was put by Steins about using too large a
wire size was correct, the part that bothered me was the amp rating he gave
the wire sizes. I don't know the publications any more to quote FAA wise as
am out of that loop now but one can use house wiring as an example of gauge
and amp raitings. Also using the correct type of wire for aircraft is a must
as it has certain properties of insulation and conductor material that is a
know item rather than some of the automotive wiring one gets at the local
auto parts store. Another thing that I am wondering why people don't use in
experimental aircraft for wiring is weather pack connectors like GM and many
others use in there cars. We use them extensively at work very well in all
low amp applications,below 30 amps. To go along with this the use of split
loom for abrasion resistance for wiring bundles. Again am out of the loop on
some of this as some may be using such already. This forum provides many
views on things and wish that it was around when I was building my RV3 as it
was the dark ages then no computer forums just phones and flyins. Good luck
to all of you builders out there. Boyd Butler.
>
-------Original Message-------
From: rv9-list(at)matronics.com
Date: Friday, February 13, 2004 02:43:26
Subject: Re: RV9-List: Wire Sizes in the wing
Ampacity of wire is calculated by the length of the wire (ohms/foot), and
the acceptable temperature rise. The temperature rise is different for free
air or in a bundle or conduit. 'Lectric Bob explains it best here:
http://aeroelectric.com/articles/wiresize.pdf.
I think Steins point is some people are using wire way too big for the
application. Boyd is correct also, AC 43.13 Acceptable Methods shaould
rule.
Dale
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Ken Moak" <airplanestuff(at)sbcglobal.net> |
| Subject: | Wire Sizes in the wing |
I don't claim to know anything about electric, but AC 43.13 has a couple of
charts, Continuous Flow and Intermittent, then decide if it is a single wire
or in a bundle. Makes my decisions easy, figure if I ever get this thing
built and past looking like an Alcoa stock pile it is one less thing to
worry about. I don't want the FAA asking me questions I can't point to their
specs.
You are right the auto industry has some nice ways of dealing with things
like connectors; unfortunately they sure seem to be slow to move to aircraft
(except some of the more true experimental folks). I would say look at the
engines, but let's not go there.
ken
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv9-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv9-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Boyd Butler
Subject: Re: RV9-List: Wire Sizes in the wing
Thank you Dale, the way that it was put by Steins about using too large a
wire size was correct, the part that bothered me was the amp rating he gave
the wire sizes. I don't know the publications any more to quote FAA wise as
am out of that loop now but one can use house wiring as an example of gauge
and amp raitings. Also using the correct type of wire for aircraft is a must
as it has certain properties of insulation and conductor material that is a
know item rather than some of the automotive wiring one gets at the local
auto parts store. Another thing that I am wondering why people don't use in
experimental aircraft for wiring is weather pack connectors like GM and many
others use in there cars. We use them extensively at work very well in all
low amp applications,below 30 amps. To go along with this the use of split
loom for abrasion resistance for wiring bundles. Again am out of the loop on
some of this as some may be using such already. This forum provides many
views on things and wish that it was around when I was building my RV3 as it
was the dark ages then no computer forums just phones and flyins. Good luck
to all of you builders out there. Boyd Butler.
>
-------Original Message-------
From: rv9-list(at)matronics.com
Date: Friday, February 13, 2004 02:43:26
Subject: Re: RV9-List: Wire Sizes in the wing
Ampacity of wire is calculated by the length of the wire (ohms/foot), and
the acceptable temperature rise. The temperature rise is different for free
air or in a bundle or conduit. 'Lectric Bob explains it best here:
http://aeroelectric.com/articles/wiresize.pdf.
I think Steins point is some people are using wire way too big for the
application. Boyd is correct also, AC 43.13 Acceptable Methods shaould
rule.
Dale
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "fcs(at)jlc.net" <fcs(at)jlc.net> |
| Subject: | Wire Sizes in the wing |
I did use GM Weather Pack connectors at my wing roots. They are not as
nice as Cannon Plugs, but I've got no complaint about them. I crimped,
then soldered them. By the way, I used 14awg wire for my Duckworth 100W
landing lights. Haven't smelled any smoke yet ;
)
"GM" Newsted - 110hrs on RV-9E and iced-in &!@#%
!
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "fcs(at)jlc.net" <fcs(at)jlc.net> |
| Subject: | Stock Blank Panel |
I'll start the bidding at $50, plus shipping. Let me know.
Gary Newsted
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Stein Bruch" <stein(at)steinair.com> |
| Subject: | Wire Sizes in the wing |
Hi Guys,
Both of you make good points, but let me re-iterate a couple things. The
Ampacity for this wire is NOT car wire. The Ampacity tables for
Teflon/Tefzel wire are based on Conductor & Jacket heat
ratings/lenth/conductor coating/resitance-1K, etc.. I have many tables from
the wire mfgrs which are NEC (National Electric Code) stats. I stand by my
Ampacity ratings, I double checked them this morning, and they are in fact
correct for Mil-22759/16 Tefzel wire, NOT PVC Bare Copper Auto wire.
There are many places to get recommended wire charts from, Van's even
includes on it the construction manual, there is good data in the AC43.13,
and 'lectric Bobs book. When I get my new website done, I'll post a bunch
of these tables for all too read, but everyone should buy a 43.13 and Bob's
book.
My point is this, don't just select your wire sizes because it's what you
have in your car, or you heard it from someone else. Aircraft wire is
different in many ways from standard car wire. You gain NOTHING by putting
in extra large wire. Instead of frying the wire or breaker, now you'll fry
something else.
In the end, AWG10 is WAYYYYY to big for a wingtip light. The fact of the
matter is that wire in Tefzel will support at nearly 800 watts at 12V over
an 18-20' run. Ohm's law doesn't lie. Why in the world do people think
they need that to run a 100W light when AWG16 or 14 will do more than
enough!?!?
I won't even get into house wiring. Different current(AC), Different
conductor (solid), Different Voltage(110-220), etc... Comparing house
wiring and airplane wiring isn't remotely similar in any way, shape, or
form, other than they both are electrically based.
Didn't want to start a battle here, but you can see there may be some
"mis-informed" soles that might be considering putting extra weight, money,
etc.. into wiring their airplanes needlessly.
I'm just trying to stop that!
Cheers,
Stein Bruch
http://www.steinair.com
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv9-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv9-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of Boyd Butler
Subject: Re: RV9-List: Wire Sizes in the wing
Thank you Dale, the way that it was put by Steins about using too large a
wire size was correct, the part that bothered me was the amp rating he gave
the wire sizes. I don't know the publications any more to quote FAA wise as
am out of that loop now but one can use house wiring as an example of gauge
and amp raitings. Also using the correct type of wire for aircraft is a must
as it has certain properties of insulation and conductor material that is a
know item rather than some of the automotive wiring one gets at the local
auto parts store. Another thing that I am wondering why people don't use in
experimental aircraft for wiring is weather pack connectors like GM and many
others use in there cars. We use them extensively at work very well in all
low amp applications,below 30 amps. To go along with this the use of split
loom for abrasion resistance for wiring bundles. Again am out of the loop on
some of this as some may be using such already. This forum provides many
views on things and wish that it was around when I was building my RV3 as it
was the dark ages then no computer forums just phones and flyins. Good luck
to all of you builders out there. Boyd Butler.
>
-------Original Message-------
From: rv9-list(at)matronics.com
Date: Friday, February 13, 2004 02:43:26
Subject: Re: RV9-List: Wire Sizes in the wing
Ampacity of wire is calculated by the length of the wire (ohms/foot), and
the acceptable temperature rise. The temperature rise is different for free
air or in a bundle or conduit. 'Lectric Bob explains it best here:
http://aeroelectric.com/articles/wiresize.pdf.
I think Steins point is some people are using wire way too big for the
application. Boyd is correct also, AC 43.13 Acceptable Methods shaould
rule.
Dale
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | DThomas773(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Source of Acetone ? |
You can find it in just about any hardware or paint store.
Dennis Thomas
RV9, taildragger/tip up
waiting for inspection
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Paul Eastham <eastham(at)netapp.com> |
| Subject: | W-919 tank splice plate |
Hi everyone in rv9land,
I just started to dimple the splice plate the joins the LE to the
tank, and I'm suddenly not sure I drilled this thing right. The tank
screw dimples go right to the edge of the plate, distorting the edge
slightly, and the #40 platenut attach holes are right at minimum edge
distance, .22" or so.
Is this similar to anyone else's? I read the drilling directions
again and I seem to have followed those, but it sure looks like the
whole plate should have been placed further inboard, toward the tank.
Thanks,
Paul
http://hmb.dyndns.org/~eastham/rv
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Glenn Brasch" <gbrasch(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | Re: W-919 tank splice plate |
Paul, I just finished doing that on mine. Is your exposed edge of the 919
the proper distance out from the skin? If so, I don't know how you would
have a problem since you should have match drilled the holes thru the tank
skin into the 919. Does that make sense?
Glenn in Tucson, -9A Wings, fuselage ordered.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Paul Eastham" <eastham(at)netapp.com>
Subject: RV9-List: W-919 tank splice plate
>
> Hi everyone in rv9land,
> I just started to dimple the splice plate the joins the LE to the
> tank, and I'm suddenly not sure I drilled this thing right. The tank
> screw dimples go right to the edge of the plate, distorting the edge
> slightly, and the #40 platenut attach holes are right at minimum edge
> distance, .22" or so.
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Richard E. Tasker" <retasker(at)optonline.net> |
| Subject: | Re: W-919 tank splice plate |
I don't know what version of the plans you have, but my manual said that
the W-919 should extend 5/8" past the outboard skin. This is WRONG! It
should extend 7/8" from the outboard skin.
My tanks are attached to the wings so I can't measure it, but with that
much extension, there should be plenty of room for the platenut attach
holes. I don't have a good picture either - sorry.
Dick Tasker, RV9A #90573
Paul Eastham wrote:
>
>Hi everyone in rv9land,
> I just started to dimple the splice plate the joins the LE to the
>tank, and I'm suddenly not sure I drilled this thing right. The tank
>screw dimples go right to the edge of the plate, distorting the edge
>slightly, and the #40 platenut attach holes are right at minimum edge
>distance, .22" or so.
> Is this similar to anyone else's? I read the drilling directions
>again and I seem to have followed those, but it sure looks like the
>whole plate should have been placed further inboard, toward the tank.
>
>Thanks,
>Paul
>http://hmb.dyndns.org/~eastham/rv
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Dimples, rivets and gaps |
| From: | Gerry Filby <gerf(at)gerf.com> |
Getting ready to rivet up the VS. My reading of the
recommendations for dimpling vs countersinking leads me to
believe that the spars in the VS should be dimpled to accept
the dimples in the skin. The spars are too thin to be
countersunk. So that's the way I went.
But when I cleco the ribs, spars and skins together after
dimpling - there is a gap between the skins and the spars, they
don't sit perfectly flush against each other- probably less
than half a millimeter of gap. The interlocking dimples does
make the assembled structure quite rigid, but still I'm
concerned ... seems like the rivets might "work" over time. I
would really like to see the skins flat against the spars.
When I countersank the HS spars it led to a much nicer mate
with the skins. Am I going in the right direction here ?
g
==========================================================
Gerry Filby gerf(at)gerf.com
Home (415) 239 4846
Cell (415) 203 9177
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Paul Eastham <eastham(at)netapp.com> |
| Subject: | Re: W-919 tank splice plate |
My manual says that 11/16" should remain to support the tank.
(goes out to garage to cleco plate to skin)
Mine actually wound up being slightly short of that at 21/32".
What makes you say that the manual is wrong? Did Van's tell you that?
Wouldn't be the first time, their j-stiffener measurements are all
wrong too. Alas, no plans updates seem to be forthcoming...
I'll have a picture up of what the plate looks like shortly:
http://hmb.dyndns.org/~eastham/rv
Paul
>
> I don't know what version of the plans you have, but my manual said that
> the W-919 should extend 5/8" past the outboard skin. This is WRONG! It
> should extend 7/8" from the outboard skin.
>
> My tanks are attached to the wings so I can't measure it, but with that
> much extension, there should be plenty of room for the platenut attach
> holes. I don't have a good picture either - sorry.
>
> Dick Tasker, RV9A #90573
>
>
> Paul Eastham wrote:
>
> >
> >Hi everyone in rv9land,
> > I just started to dimple the splice plate the joins the LE to the
> >tank, and I'm suddenly not sure I drilled this thing right. The tank
> >screw dimples go right to the edge of the plate, distorting the edge
> >slightly, and the #40 platenut attach holes are right at minimum edge
> >distance, .22" or so.
> > Is this similar to anyone else's? I read the drilling directions
> >again and I seem to have followed those, but it sure looks like the
> >whole plate should have been placed further inboard, toward the tank.
> >
> >Thanks,
> >Paul
> >http://hmb.dyndns.org/~eastham/rv
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Paul Eastham <eastham(at)netapp.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Dimples, rivets and gaps |
Hey Gerry,
Is it the dimples themselves that are holding the skin apart? Can
you tell? If it's the dimples, I'll bet the skin will come together
when riveted. To a point, riveting will often pull layers together,
especially with dimples.
I think you're probably fine, but I'd have to look at it (got a digital
camera?) to give you a more definite opinion.
Yep, dimpling was the right thing to do...always dimple when practical...
Paul
>
>
> Getting ready to rivet up the VS. My reading of the
> recommendations for dimpling vs countersinking leads me to
> believe that the spars in the VS should be dimpled to accept
> the dimples in the skin. The spars are too thin to be
> countersunk. So that's the way I went.
>
> But when I cleco the ribs, spars and skins together after
> dimpling - there is a gap between the skins and the spars, they
> don't sit perfectly flush against each other- probably less
> than half a millimeter of gap. The interlocking dimples does
> make the assembled structure quite rigid, but still I'm
> concerned ... seems like the rivets might "work" over time. I
> would really like to see the skins flat against the spars.
>
> When I countersank the HS spars it led to a much nicer mate
> with the skins. Am I going in the right direction here ?
>
> g
>
> ==========================================================
> Gerry Filby gerf(at)gerf.com
> Home (415) 239 4846
> Cell (415) 203 9177
>
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Dave Nicholson" <n347sd(at)insightbb.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Dimples, rivets and gaps |
This is one of the many places where I used the "Tank Dimple Dies" from
Cleaveland Aircraft Tool.
These dies are just a little deeper than the stand die.
When it is used on the inner layer, the outer layer, with the standard
dimple, sits better in the deeper dimple on the inner layer.
Dave Nicholson
90347
----- Original Message -----
From: "Gerry Filby" <gerf(at)gerf.com>
Subject: RV9-List: Dimples, rivets and gaps
>
>
> Getting ready to rivet up the VS. My reading of the
> recommendations for dimpling vs countersinking leads me to
> believe that the spars in the VS should be dimpled to accept
> the dimples in the skin. The spars are too thin to be
> countersunk. So that's the way I went.
>
> But when I cleco the ribs, spars and skins together after
> dimpling - there is a gap between the skins and the spars, they
> don't sit perfectly flush against each other- probably less
> than half a millimeter of gap. The interlocking dimples does
> make the assembled structure quite rigid, but still I'm
> concerned ... seems like the rivets might "work" over time. I
> would really like to see the skins flat against the spars.
>
> When I countersank the HS spars it led to a much nicer mate
> with the skins. Am I going in the right direction here ?
>
> g
>
> ==========================================================
> Gerry Filby gerf(at)gerf.com
> Home (415) 239 4846
> Cell (415) 203 9177
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Richard E. Tasker" <retasker(at)optonline.net> |
| Subject: | Re: W-919 tank splice plate |
Well, according to my manual (and I asked this question in Jan 03):
The instructions say to draw a line 5/16" from one edge and then insert
the strip between the skin and the nose rib until the line is visible
through the skin holes.
It further states that this allows 5/8" of protrusion to support the
tank skin. The numbers don't add up... The strip is 1.5" wide. The hole
centers are 5/16" from the edge of the skin. This uses up 5/8" of the
strip width (5/16" on either side of the holes). If we subtract this
from 1.5" we get 7/8" of protrusion, not 5/8" as stated in the manual.
The answer then was that 7/8" was correct and it worked for my parts.
Don't know what your instructions say now though.
On the other hand, as long as you have enough edge distance, I don't see
anything wrong with going with what you have.
I have reported half a dozen things like this to Van's and they say they
will fix them. Of course, I don't know whether they do or not since I
never see anything but my plans. Additionally, I have gotten
conflicting answers when I asked the same question twice some time
apart. I think you have to use the plans as a guide and use some common
sense when building. My $0.02...
Dick Tasker, RV9A #90573
Paul Eastham wrote:
>
>My manual says that 11/16" should remain to support the tank.
>(goes out to garage to cleco plate to skin)
>Mine actually wound up being slightly short of that at 21/32".
>
>What makes you say that the manual is wrong? Did Van's tell you that?
>Wouldn't be the first time, their j-stiffener measurements are all
>wrong too. Alas, no plans updates seem to be forthcoming...
>
>I'll have a picture up of what the plate looks like shortly:
>http://hmb.dyndns.org/~eastham/rv
>
>Paul
>
>
>
>
>>
>>I don't know what version of the plans you have, but my manual said that
>>the W-919 should extend 5/8" past the outboard skin. This is WRONG! It
>>should extend 7/8" from the outboard skin.
>>
>>My tanks are attached to the wings so I can't measure it, but with that
>>much extension, there should be plenty of room for the platenut attach
>>holes. I don't have a good picture either - sorry.
>>
>>Dick Tasker, RV9A #90573
>>
>>
>>Paul Eastham wrote:
>>
>>
>>
>>>
>>>Hi everyone in rv9land,
>>>I just started to dimple the splice plate the joins the LE to the
>>>tank, and I'm suddenly not sure I drilled this thing right. The tank
>>>screw dimples go right to the edge of the plate, distorting the edge
>>>slightly, and the #40 platenut attach holes are right at minimum edge
>>>distance, .22" or so.
>>>Is this similar to anyone else's? I read the drilling directions
>>>again and I seem to have followed those, but it sure looks like the
>>>whole plate should have been placed further inboard, toward the tank.
>>>
>>>Thanks,
>>>Paul
>>>http://hmb.dyndns.org/~eastham/rv
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Paul Eastham <eastham(at)netapp.com> |
| Subject: | Re: W-919 tank splice plate |
Well, there is enough edge distance for the #40 platenut holes,
but who knows what proper edge distance is for a monster #19
hole for a screw. I'm guessing it's a tension load so it may
not matter so much...anyway I'll ask Van's.
As for the manual, I got my wing kit in Nov 03, so it sounds like your
revision didn't make it. *Very* disappointing.
Paul
>
> Well, according to my manual (and I asked this question in Jan 03):
> The instructions say to draw a line 5/16" from one edge and then insert
> the strip between the skin and the nose rib until the line is visible
> through the skin holes.
> It further states that this allows 5/8" of protrusion to support the
> tank skin. The numbers don't add up... The strip is 1.5" wide. The hole
> centers are 5/16" from the edge of the skin. This uses up 5/8" of the
> strip width (5/16" on either side of the holes). If we subtract this
> from 1.5" we get 7/8" of protrusion, not 5/8" as stated in the manual.
>
> The answer then was that 7/8" was correct and it worked for my parts.
> Don't know what your instructions say now though.
>
> On the other hand, as long as you have enough edge distance, I don't see
> anything wrong with going with what you have.
>
> I have reported half a dozen things like this to Van's and they say they
> will fix them. Of course, I don't know whether they do or not since I
> never see anything but my plans. Additionally, I have gotten
> conflicting answers when I asked the same question twice some time
> apart. I think you have to use the plans as a guide and use some common
> sense when building. My $0.02...
>
> Dick Tasker, RV9A #90573
>
>
> Paul Eastham wrote:
>
> >
> >My manual says that 11/16" should remain to support the tank.
> >(goes out to garage to cleco plate to skin)
> >Mine actually wound up being slightly short of that at 21/32".
> >
> >What makes you say that the manual is wrong? Did Van's tell you that?
> >Wouldn't be the first time, their j-stiffener measurements are all
> >wrong too. Alas, no plans updates seem to be forthcoming...
> >
> >I'll have a picture up of what the plate looks like shortly:
> >http://hmb.dyndns.org/~eastham/rv
> >
> >Paul
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >>
> >>I don't know what version of the plans you have, but my manual said that
> >>the W-919 should extend 5/8" past the outboard skin. This is WRONG! It
> >>should extend 7/8" from the outboard skin.
> >>
> >>My tanks are attached to the wings so I can't measure it, but with that
> >>much extension, there should be plenty of room for the platenut attach
> >>holes. I don't have a good picture either - sorry.
> >>
> >>Dick Tasker, RV9A #90573
> >>
> >>
> >>Paul Eastham wrote:
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>>
> >>>Hi everyone in rv9land,
> >>>I just started to dimple the splice plate the joins the LE to the
> >>>tank, and I'm suddenly not sure I drilled this thing right. The tank
> >>>screw dimples go right to the edge of the plate, distorting the edge
> >>>slightly, and the #40 platenut attach holes are right at minimum edge
> >>>distance, .22" or so.
> >>>Is this similar to anyone else's? I read the drilling directions
> >>>again and I seem to have followed those, but it sure looks like the
> >>>whole plate should have been placed further inboard, toward the tank.
> >>>
> >>>Thanks,
> >>>Paul
> >>>http://hmb.dyndns.org/~eastham/rv
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Mike Hoover" <mikehoover(at)sc.rr.com> |
| Subject: | Re: W-919 tank splice plate |
Paul,
I got a reply from Vans the other day on this. I had been confused because
the 7/8 on the drawing didn't agree with the manual (Revision 9s7r3
3/14/03). Their reply as follows:
Mike,
We revised the manual since you bought your preview plans and
the 1/2" and 11/16" dimensions are correct. We failed to update
the drawing. Thanks for bringing it to our attention. Most builders
don't read the drawings that closely.
Bruce Reynolds
brucer(at)vansaircraft.com
> Hey Vans,
>
> I am resending this in case it did not arrive on my first try:
>
> I have installed the W-919 joint strip in the inboard end the leading
> edge skin per the manual. I am a bit confused when I reference Drawing
> 9, Section D-D. There is a reference on the right side of Section D-D
> that states, "7/8 distance from inbd edge of W-901 skin to the inbd
> edge of W-919." What is the 7/8 in reference too? Page 7-5 of the
> manual (Revision 9s7r3 3/14/03) instructs the builder to "mark a line
> on the W-919 Splice Strip 1/2" from the edge. This will match up to
> the holes in the skin, leaving 11/16" exposed to support the tank
> skin." This is what I have done, so the "7/8" on Drawing 9, Section
> D-D is confusing. Furthermore, the same Section D-D shows that the
> W-919 outboard edge lines up with the W-908L Wing Leading Edge Rib
> flange edge. In actuallity, the W-919 outboard edge extends about 1/8"
> or more beyond the edge of the 908 rib flange. It seems that the
> drawing is more inline with a prior version of the manual (perhaps
> 9s7r3 1/22/03 that was in my preview set). Even then, the manual says
> to mark a line 5/16" from the edge (this will get the 919 and 908
> flange lined flush) and also says there will be 5/8" exposed to
> support the wing tank skin. But still, the "7/8" on the drawing
> doesn't make sense. Please advise.
>
> Thanks!
>
> Mike Hoover
> 90707
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Don Alexander <don(at)propjock.com> |
| Subject: | Joint plate hole location |
Paul,
> just started to dimple the splice plate the joins the LE to the
>tank, and I'm suddenly not sure I drilled this thing right. The tank
>screw dimples go right to the edge of the plate, distorting the edge
>slightly, and the #40 platenut attach holes are right at minimum edge
>distance, .22" or so.
I didn't have the problem you described. The holes were definitely more
centrally located on the joint plate than you're describing. Here are
links to a couple of photos on my web site that may be helpful. It
sounds like you may not have located the joint plate correctly before
you started drilling the holes.
http://www.propjock.com/images/Wings/W-jointplate-72.JPG
http://www.propjock.com/images/Wings/Wing-left-joint-strip-72.jpg
http://www.propjock.com/images/Wings/JointStrip1.jpg
Don
90702 Finishing the wings and the fuselage inventory
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | DThomas773(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Dimples, rivets and gaps |
In respect to the tank dimple dies, be sure when you'r through with them to
mark or store them where you won't confuse them with you regular dies. Don't
ask why I'm giving this tip.
Dennis Thomas,
RV-9
waiting for inspection
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Leland <Federigo(at)pacbell.net> |
| Subject: | Baffling pictures |
Does anybody know of a website that shows detailed photographs of the
baffling for a Lycoming? Van's baffle drawing package is hard to
comprehend.
Leland in Pleasanton
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | DThomas773(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Baffling pictures |
Hi Leyland,
I just finished my baffling last month and the joke in hanger was: the
baffling instructions are baffling.
The advice given me was to just start with the large pieces, bolt them on,
one at a time, and study the plans as you go.
I set up my work table by the engine compartment, spread the plans along the
wing and taped them down and started with the part that screws to the #2
cylinder. I put all the parts that screw to the cylinders and with that much on
the other parts start to be come understandable. We spent a good 2 weeks
getting it all done.
Keep hacking at it and good luck.
Dennis Thomas
waiting for inspection
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Bill Repucci" <bill(at)repucci.com> |
FYI - I have been going to WT Tools for things like 3M deburring wheels
and the V-block ($14) you need for drilling the control rods. Great
prices for this kind of stuff. (They have a warehouse by my office in
Charlotte and I can walk to it during lunch. Can you say, "Very
dangerous!")
They have brand name tools and as well as off-brand tools. The off
brand tools are OK but be careful.
We site: http://www.wttool.com/Merchant2/merchant.mvc
Bill R.
RV-9
SN: 90737 N941WR (Reserved)
Wings
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Bill Repucci" <bill(at)repucci.com> |
| Subject: | Joint plate hole location |
I messed up the first plate joint by following the plans and had the
same problem you describe. On the second 919 strip I measured the width
of the rib web and marked both sides of the doubler plate with that
measurement. I then measured and drilled on hole on one end of the 919
strip and cleco'ed it to the outside of the LE skin and bent it around,
watching to make sure the line I scribed matched the edge of the skin.
I then removed the end rib and cleco'ed the strip to the inside of the
skin w/o the end rib in place. Again, watching to make sure my line was
on the edge of the skin I started at the one cleco (This doesn't matter
if it is on the top or bottom of the wing, just as long it is the first
hole by the spar.) and drilled the next hole up & cleco'ed it in place.
I worked my way up to the LE and back down the other side to the spar.
Once all that was done, I removed the strip, put the rib back in place
and drilled it to match the skin, cleco'ing as I went. Now everything
should be drilled so you can put it together and test fit it all. I ran
the drill through the holes again and this helped everything line up
just right w/o enlarging the holes out of spec.
Good luck!
Bill R.
RV-9
SN: 90737 N941WR (Reserved)
Just sealed my first tank, will leak test it later this week.
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv9-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv9-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Don Alexander
Subject: RV9-List: Joint plate hole location
Paul,
> just started to dimple the splice plate the joins the LE to the tank,
>and I'm suddenly not sure I drilled this thing right. The tank screw
>dimples go right to the edge of the plate, distorting the edge
>slightly, and the #40 platenut attach holes are right at minimum edge
>distance, .22" or so.
I didn't have the problem you described. The holes were definitely more
centrally located on the joint plate than you're describing. Here are
links to a couple of photos on my web site that may be helpful. It
sounds like you may not have located the joint plate correctly before
you started drilling the holes.
http://www.propjock.com/images/Wings/W-jointplate-72.JPG
http://www.propjock.com/images/Wings/Wing-left-joint-strip-72.jpg
http://www.propjock.com/images/Wings/JointStrip1.jpg
Don
90702 Finishing the wings and the fuselage inventory
==
direct advertising on the Matronics Forums.
==
==
==
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Mike Duiven" <emduiven(at)chaffee.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Source of Acetone ? |
John:
Acetone can be found at any Hardware Store. So can MEK.
Mike D.
----- Original Message -----
From: "John Oliveira" <oliveira(at)frontiernet.net>
Subject: Re: RV9-List: Source of Acetone ?
>
> Try your local hardware store
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Gerry Filby" <gerf(at)gerf.com>
> To:
> Subject: RV9-List: Source of Acetone ?
>
>
> >
> >
> > Anyone know of a source for Acetone apart from Aircraft Spruce
> > - preferrably one the in SF Bay Area that I can go to in person ?
> >
> > Aircraft Spruce do such a bad job of packing that the aluminum
> > cans they use end up leaking after UPS is done beating them up.
> >
> > g
> >
> >
> > ==========================================================
> > Gerry Filby gerf(at)gerf.com
> > Home (415) 239 4846
> > Cell (415) 203 9177
> >
> >
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Merems" <merems(at)cox.net> |
, ,
,
| Subject: | ExperimentalAero has just introduced a new dimpling tool |
Fellow RV builders,
ExperimentalAero has just introduced a new dimpling tool the DRDT-2. Take a look at http://www.experimentalaero.com/DRDT-2.htm for details. It is professionally designed for the experimental builder in mind. I just wished I had one when I built my RV-4.
I understand that Bob Avery (Avery tools) will have a DRDT-2 for demonstration
at Sun' N Fun in April.
Paul (RV-4/RV-7A)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | tchoug <tchoug(at)micron.com> |
| Subject: | Dimples, rivets and gaps |
Gerry,
One technique that helps is to use a hole deburring tool with the three cutting
edges that are the same angle as the countersink tools. This is the standard
offset (crank style) screwdriver tool that Avery and most others sell. Use this
to cleanup the dimples in the bottom structure after dimpling. About three or
four turns is all that's required. It removes very little metal, but cleans
up the high spots enough to get a better fit between the parts.
Todd Houg
Finally back to it and riveting the fuselage.
-----Original Message-----
From: Gerry Filby [mailto:gerf(at)gerf.com]
Subject: RV9-List: Dimples, rivets and gaps
Getting ready to rivet up the VS. My reading of the
recommendations for dimpling vs countersinking leads me to
believe that the spars in the VS should be dimpled to accept
the dimples in the skin. The spars are too thin to be
countersunk. So that's the way I went.
But when I cleco the ribs, spars and skins together after
dimpling - there is a gap between the skins and the spars, they
don't sit perfectly flush against each other- probably less
than half a millimeter of gap. The interlocking dimples does
make the assembled structure quite rigid, but still I'm
concerned ... seems like the rivets might "work" over time. I
would really like to see the skins flat against the spars.
When I countersank the HS spars it led to a much nicer mate
with the skins. Am I going in the right direction here ?
g
==========================================================
Gerry Filby gerf(at)gerf.com
Home (415) 239 4846
Cell (415) 203 9177
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Steve Sampson" <SSampson.SLN21(at)london.edu> |
| Subject: | Firewall insulation |
I would be interested to know how many are insulating the firewall? I
believe the VANS demonstrator is bare and I supose since one wears a headset
noise is not a significant issue? Heat?
Anyone flying without insulation? Would you do it the same way again?
I certainly intend to put some carpet on the floor, to protect it and I have
heard it said there is significant drumming from the exhaust through it but
lean towards weight saving on the firewall.
Steve
Wheel Pants
#90360
UK
---
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "John Oliveira" <oliveira(at)frontiernet.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Source of Acetone ? |
I am the one that said "try your local hardware store", I think Gerry Filby
was looking for help.
John Oliveira
Working on Fueslage
Reserved N909RV
----- Original Message -----
From: "Mike Duiven" <emduiven(at)chaffee.net>
Subject: Re: RV9-List: Source of Acetone ?
>
> John:
>
> Acetone can be found at any Hardware Store. So can MEK.
>
> Mike D.
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "John Oliveira" <oliveira(at)frontiernet.net>
> To:
> Subject: Re: RV9-List: Source of Acetone ?
>
>
> >
> > Try your local hardware store
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: "Gerry Filby" <gerf(at)gerf.com>
> > To:
> > Subject: RV9-List: Source of Acetone ?
> >
> >
> > >
> > >
> > > Anyone know of a source for Acetone apart from Aircraft Spruce
> > > - preferrably one the in SF Bay Area that I can go to in person ?
> > >
> > > Aircraft Spruce do such a bad job of packing that the aluminum
> > > cans they use end up leaking after UPS is done beating them up.
> > >
> > > g
> > >
> > >
> > > ==========================================================
> > > Gerry Filby gerf(at)gerf.com
> > > Home (415) 239 4846
> > > Cell (415) 203 9177
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Andy Karmy" <andy(at)karmy.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Baffling pictures |
While not directly baffel pictures, you can see much of them on my
FWF pictures page.
http://www.karmy.com/rv9a/pictures/fuselage/fwf/finished/
index.htm
- Andy
---------- Original Message
----------------------------------
From: Leland <Federigo(at)pacbell.net>
Date: Sun, 15 Feb 2004 07:30:48 -0800
>
>Does anybody know of a website that shows detailed
photographs of the
>baffling for a Lycoming? Van's baffle drawing package is hard to
>comprehend.
>Leland in Pleasanton
>
>
>_-
=========================================
===============================
>_-
=========================================
===============================
>_-
=========================================
===============================
>_-
=========================================
===============================
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Andy Karmy" <andy(at)karmy.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Firewall insulation |
I flew with no insulation, or carpet for 20 hours at first. Then added
sound pad and carpet later. I still have nothing on the firewall and
don't think it would make much difference. Most of the noise
comes from the exhaust on the floor boards, so carpet and sound
proofing work good there. There is also quite a bit of air noise
from the canopy and other locations. With ANR headsets it's quiet
enough... I don't know about heat, here in the NW it's never hot
enough so...
- Andy
---------- Original Message
----------------------------------
From: "Steve Sampson" <SSampson.SLN21(at)london.edu>
Date: Mon, 16 Feb 2004 19:59:29 -0000
>
>I would be interested to know how many are insulating the
firewall? I
>believe the VANS demonstrator is bare and I supose since one
wears a headset
>noise is not a significant issue? Heat?
>
>Anyone flying without insulation? Would you do it the same way
again?
>
>I certainly intend to put some carpet on the floor, to protect it
and I have
>heard it said there is significant drumming from the exhaust
through it but
>lean towards weight saving on the firewall.
>
>Steve
>Wheel Pants
>#90360
>UK
>
>---
>
>
>_-
=========================================
===============================
>_-
=========================================
===============================
>_-
=========================================
===============================
>_-
=========================================
===============================
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Source of Acetone ? |
| From: | Gerry Filby <gerf(at)gerf.com> |
Thanks all for your many suggestions - my local Orchard
Hardware has a shelf full of every conceivable type of thinner
and solvent - including Acetone.
Now if I just fill my bathtub with Alodine, the priming process
would be a lot less trouble ;-)
g
>
>
>
> I am the one that said "try your local hardware store", I think
> Gerry Filby
> was looking for help.
>
> John Oliveira
> Working on Fueslage
> Reserved N909RV
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Mike Duiven" <emduiven(at)chaffee.net>
> To:
> Subject: Re: RV9-List: Source of Acetone ?
>
>
> >
> > John:
> >
> > Acetone can be found at any Hardware Store. So can MEK.
> >
> > Mike D.
> >
> >
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: "John Oliveira" <oliveira(at)frontiernet.net>
> > To:
> > Subject: Re: RV9-List: Source of Acetone ?
> >
> >
>
> > >
> > > Try your local hardware store
> > > ----- Original Message -----
> > > From: "Gerry Filby" <gerf(at)gerf.com>
> > > To:
> > > Subject: RV9-List: Source of Acetone ?
> > >
> > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > Anyone know of a source for Acetone apart from Aircraft Spruce
> > > > - preferrably one the in SF Bay Area that I can go to in person ?
> > > >
> > > > Aircraft Spruce do such a bad job of packing that the aluminum
> > > > cans they use end up leaking after UPS is done beating them up.
> > > >
> > > > g
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > ==========================================================
> > > > Gerry Filby gerf(at)gerf.com
> > > > Home (415) 239 4846
> > > > Cell (415) 203 9177
> > > >
> > > >
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
--
RV-9 #90842
==========================================================
Gerry Filby gerf(at)gerf.com
Home (415) 239 4846
Cell (415) 203 9177
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Leland <Federigo(at)pacbell.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Baffling pictures |
Thanks Andy. The pictures of the Inlet Baffle Ramp and the Front Baffle
Seal are especially useful. Question: can you install and remove the
back baffles after parts 5 and 6 are riveted together? Part 5 contains
the oil cooler.
Leland in Pleasanton
Not as Baffled as I was
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Firewall insulation |
Hi, Steve. I followed about the same line of reasoning as you. I put good
sound deadening insulation and carpet on the floor. I also cut the same
insualtion to fit the firewall, but never installed it. I don't think noise is
a factor, most people have commented mine seems fairly quiet in the cockpit.
It feels like I am getting some heat, since my oil cooler is firewall mounted,
and exhausts down the firewall. It has been mostly cool to cold weather so
far. If I seem to be getting too much heat in the summer, I may install the
insulation. But, since it is good sound deadening, it is quite heavy, so I'll
do without the firewall portion if I can.
Gary 75 hours.
Quoting Steve Sampson :
>
> I would be interested to know how many are insulating the firewall? I
> believe the VANS demonstrator is bare and I supose since one wears a headset
> noise is not a significant issue? Heat?
>
> Anyone flying without insulation? Would you do it the same way again?
>
> I certainly intend to put some carpet on the floor, to protect it and I have
> heard it said there is significant drumming from the exhaust through it but
> lean towards weight saving on the firewall.
>
> Steve
> Wheel Pants
> #90360
> UK
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | [ Jim Cone ] : New Email List Photo Share Available! |
| From: | Email List Photo Shares <pictures(at)matronics.com> |
A new Email List Photo Share is available:
Poster: Jim Cone
Subject: Jim Cone's Canopy Installation Instructions
http://www.matronics.com/photoshare/jimnbev@olypen.com.02.17.2004/index.html
o Main Photo Share Index
http://www.matronics.com/photoshare
o Submitting a Photo Share
If you wish to submit a Photo Share of your own, please include the
following information along with your email message and files:
1) Email List or Lists that they are related to:
2) Your Full Name:
3) Your Email Address:
4) One line Subject description:
5) Multi-line, multi-paragraph description of topic:
6) One-line Description of each photo or file:
Email the information above and your files and photos to:
pictures(at)matronics.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Steve Sampson" <SSampson.SLN21(at)london.edu> |
Roger - your list is interesting. Even with O-320 fixed metal there is about
a 60lb range. Have you worked out how this can be? Any idea what an extra
coat of paint weighs? Instrumentation I can see varying by perhaps 20lb but
not much more. I assume everyone uses all the bits VANS sends!
Steve.
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv9-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv9-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of Roger Evenson
Subject: Re: RV9-List: RV9a W & B
That might have been me. I was trying to compare avg Lycoming weights with
Subaru weights. Here's the Lycoming info. It didn't format well coming out
of an excel spreadsheet, but if you are interested the numbers are
decipherable. Roger E.
RV9A's avg who's O320 O320FP O320CS
0235, wood, no paint, electric panel 990 wesley
0320, wood, no paint 1032 gary 1032 1032
0320, metal fixed, paint electric ifr 1104 albert 1104 1104
0320, constant, vfr 1087 jim 1087 1087
0320, metal fixed, no paint, full vfr 1034 andy 1034 1034
0320, metal fixed, w/paint, skytech 1079 dick 1079 1079
0360, constant 1178 earl
O235 960 stan
0320, CS hartzell 1100 dave 1100 1100
0320, CS hartzell, elec ifr no paint 1083 chris 1083 1083
0320, fixed metal 1078 don 1078 1078
0320, fixed metal 1055 owen 1055 1055
O320, fixed metal 1048 bob 1048 1048
mean 1063.6923 1070 1061.429 1090
---
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Steve Sampson" <SSampson.SLN21(at)london.edu> |
| Subject: | Firewall insulation |
Andy - that is really helpful. You have confirmed my view. Yet another thing
I dont need. Steve.
PS I think the UK can compete very effectively with the NW for cool damp
weather!
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv9-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv9-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of Andy Karmy
Subject: Re: RV9-List: Firewall insulation
I flew with no insulation, or carpet for 20 hours at first. Then added
sound pad and carpet later. I still have nothing on the firewall and
don't think it would make much difference. Most of the noise
comes from the exhaust on the floor boards, so carpet and sound
proofing work good there. There is also quite a bit of air noise
from the canopy and other locations. With ANR headsets it's quiet
enough... I don't know about heat, here in the NW it's never hot
enough so...
- Andy
---------- Original Message
----------------------------------
From: "Steve Sampson" <SSampson.SLN21(at)london.edu>
Date: Mon, 16 Feb 2004 19:59:29 -0000
>
>I would be interested to know how many are insulating the
firewall? I
>believe the VANS demonstrator is bare and I supose since one
wears a headset
>noise is not a significant issue? Heat?
>
>Anyone flying without insulation? Would you do it the same way
again?
>
>I certainly intend to put some carpet on the floor, to protect it
and I have
>heard it said there is significant drumming from the exhaust
through it but
>lean towards weight saving on the firewall.
>
>Steve
>Wheel Pants
>#90360
>UK
>
>---
>
>
>_-
=========================================
===============================
>_-
=========================================
===============================
>_-
=========================================
===============================
>_-
=========================================
===============================
>
>
---
Incoming mail is certified Virus Free.
---
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Terry Hobert" <terhobey(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | Dimples, rivets and gaps |
Gerry,
Throughout my building at times if a dimple is to shallow I have taken the
deburing tool and run it in the dimple some. Don't get carried away, but
you can end up with really nice fits that way. Van's evens mentions this in
some parts of the manual. They will tell you to do so on the rear spar on
the wings. Hope that helps.
Terry Hobert 9a fuselage
>From: Gerry Filby <gerf(at)gerf.com>
>Reply-To: rv9-list(at)matronics.com
>To: rv9-list(at)matronics.com
>Subject: RV9-List: Dimples, rivets and gaps
>Date: Fri, 13 Feb 2004 20:02:02 -0800
>
>
>Getting ready to rivet up the VS. My reading of the
>recommendations for dimpling vs countersinking leads me to
>believe that the spars in the VS should be dimpled to accept
>the dimples in the skin. The spars are too thin to be
>countersunk. So that's the way I went.
>
>But when I cleco the ribs, spars and skins together after
>dimpling - there is a gap between the skins and the spars, they
>don't sit perfectly flush against each other- probably less
>than half a millimeter of gap. The interlocking dimples does
>make the assembled structure quite rigid, but still I'm
>concerned ... seems like the rivets might "work" over time. I
>would really like to see the skins flat against the spars.
>
>When I countersank the HS spars it led to a much nicer mate
>with the skins. Am I going in the right direction here ?
>
>g
>
>==========================================================
>Gerry Filby gerf(at)gerf.com
> Home (415) 239 4846
> Cell (415) 203 9177
>
>
Say good-bye to spam, viruses and pop-ups with MSN Premium -- free trial
offer! http://click.atdmt.com/AVE/go/onm00200359ave/direct/01/
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Paul Pflimlin" <pablo(at)phonewave.net> |
I am unable to locate the product "Alodine" at any chemical outlet in Northern
Nevada. Does anyone know of a generic name for this product?
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | What is this engine worth? |
| From: | Mark Schrimmer <mschrimmer(at)pacbell.net> |
RV-9 List
Anybody care to guess what this engine is worth? The seller and I are trying
to determine a fair price. Here are the details . . .
Lycoming 0-320-E2D
150 h.p.
Two cylinders in the 60s, two in the mid 70s
Uses about 1 quart of oil every 10 hours
Approximately 3,400 hours total time
Approximately 1,200 hours since overhaul by an A&P
Comes with a MA4-SPA carb with metal float
Comes with a 149 tooth starter ring
Uses an oil screen, not a filter
Oil changed every 25 hours since overhaul
All ADs complied with
The present owner is going to re-use the accessories on his new engine, so
the magnetos, starter, alternator, vacuum pump, oil cooler, etc. are not
included.
Thanks,
Mark
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Merems" <merems(at)cox.net> |
Paul,
I purchased my Alodine/iradite and metalprep/alumiprep from http://autobodydepot.net. Their shipping was very reasonable.
Paul Merems RV-4/RV-7A
----- Original Message -----
From: Paul Pflimlin
To: rv7-list(at)matronics.com ; rv9-list(at)matronics.com
Sent: Tuesday, February 17, 2004 6:34 PM
Subject: RV9-List: Alodine
I am unable to locate the product "Alodine" at any chemical outlet in Northern
Nevada. Does anyone know of a generic name for this product?
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Gerry Filby <gerf(at)gerf.com> |
I know some folks don't like Aircraft Spruce - but they sell it
in various quantities ...
g
>
>
> I am unable to locate the product "Alodine" at any chemical
> outlet in Northern Nevada. Does anyone know of a generic name
> for this product?
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
--
RV-9 #90842
==========================================================
Gerry Filby gerf(at)gerf.com
Home (415) 239 4846
Cell (415) 203 9177
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Stein Bruch" <stein(at)steinair.com> |
| Subject: | Re: What is this engine worth? |
I'd say oil consumption is ok,. so the bottom end is probably ok. I'd go for a
top overhaul, with new cylinders. That will run you around $3500, add a few
other goodies and you should have a great engine with an addition of less than
$5K.
That means the core should be worth no more than $7500.00 and here's why.... To
get that engine up to nearly new shape will take a minimum of $4-5K making your
total expense somewhere around $11-13K. You shouldn't spend any more than
that for a good O-320, since you can pick up an O-360 kit for $14-15K.
As far as accessories go, the prestolite starters are dirt cheap, carbs are $4-600.00
for overhauled ones, so you've got to buy everything else anyway. Same
price whether it's a 320 or 360.
Just my 2 cents!
Cheers,
Stein Bruch
RV6's, Minneapolis
---------- Original Message ----------------------------------
From: Mark Schrimmer <mschrimmer(at)pacbell.net>
Date: Tue, 17 Feb 2004 17:41:10 -0800
>
>Anybody care to guess what this engine is worth? The seller and I are trying
>to determine a fair price. Here are the details . . .
>
>Lycoming 0-320-E2D
>150 h.p.
>Two cylinders in the 60s, two in the mid 70s
>Uses about 1 quart of oil every 10 hours
>Approximately 3,400 hours total time
>Approximately 1,200 hours since overhaul by an A&P
>Comes with a MA4-SPA carb with metal float
>Comes with a 149 tooth starter ring
>Uses an oil screen, not a filter
>Oil changed every 25 hours since overhaul
>All ADs complied with
>
>The present owner is going to re-use the accessories on his new engine, so
>the magnetos, starter, alternator, vacuum pump, oil cooler, etc. are not
>included.
>
>Thanks,
>
>Mark
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Mike Hoover" <mikehoover(at)sc.rr.com> |
DuPont sells the equivalent 226 - their version of alodine. I get it at my
local FinishMaster.
Mike
Wings...slow but deliberate
----- Original Message -----
From: "Gerry Filby" <gerf(at)gerf.com>
Subject: Re: RV9-List: Alodine
>
> I know some folks don't like Aircraft Spruce - but they sell it
> in various quantities ...
>
> g
>
> >
> >
> > I am unable to locate the product "Alodine" at any chemical
> > outlet in Northern Nevada. Does anyone know of a generic name
> > for this product?
> >
> >
> >
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Roger Ping" <rpping(at)qwest.net> |
| Subject: | What is this engine worth? |
Wait, wait first of all you can find a complete engine core for around
$5000. to $6000. Oil consumption has nothing to do with the lower end.
With compression that low I don't believe the oil consumption figure.
It's an E series engine so chances are it has a 2 piece front bearing
and cant be bumped up to 160 hp.
Figure $1000 for cylinders.
Carbs are $600. for and O/H WITH a core
Just my nickle
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv9-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv9-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Stein Bruch
Subject: Re: RV9-List: What is this engine worth?
I'd say oil consumption is ok,. so the bottom end is probably ok. I'd
go for a top overhaul, with new cylinders. That will run you around
$3500, add a few other goodies and you should have a great engine with
an addition of less than $5K.
That means the core should be worth no more than $7500.00 and here's
why.... To get that engine up to nearly new shape will take a minimum of
$4-5K making your total expense somewhere around $11-13K. You shouldn't
spend any more than that for a good O-320, since you can pick up an
O-360 kit for $14-15K.
As far as accessories go, the prestolite starters are dirt cheap, carbs
are $4-600.00 for overhauled ones, so you've got to buy everything else
anyway. Same price whether it's a 320 or 360.
Just my 2 cents!
Cheers,
Stein Bruch
RV6's, Minneapolis
---------- Original Message ----------------------------------
From: Mark Schrimmer <mschrimmer(at)pacbell.net>
Date: Tue, 17 Feb 2004 17:41:10 -0800
>
>Anybody care to guess what this engine is worth? The seller and I are
trying
>to determine a fair price. Here are the details . . .
>
>Lycoming 0-320-E2D
>150 h.p.
>Two cylinders in the 60s, two in the mid 70s
>Uses about 1 quart of oil every 10 hours
>Approximately 3,400 hours total time
>Approximately 1,200 hours since overhaul by an A&P
>Comes with a MA4-SPA carb with metal float
>Comes with a 149 tooth starter ring
>Uses an oil screen, not a filter
>Oil changed every 25 hours since overhaul
>All ADs complied with
>
>The present owner is going to re-use the accessories on his new engine,
so
>the magnetos, starter, alternator, vacuum pump, oil cooler, etc. are
not
>included.
>
>Thanks,
>
>Mark
>
>
==
==
==
==
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Paul Pflimlin" <pablo(at)phonewave.net> |
----- Original Message -----
From: "Merems" <merems(at)cox.net>
Subject: Re: RV9-List: Alodine
Thanks to all in response to Alodine question. My last purchase of Alodine
from Spruce included interstate Haz-Mat charge, that was almost as much as
the product. I took Paul Merems advice and placed an order with Autobody
Depot. They advertise NO Haz-Mat chg. I am still curious though if Alodine
is Just a name for a generic product? Thanks to all. Paul P. RV-7A Fuse.
>
> Paul,
>
> I purchased my Alodine/iradite and metalprep/alumiprep from
http://autobodydepot.net. Their shipping was very reasonable.
>
> Paul Merems RV-4/RV-7A
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: Paul Pflimlin
> To: rv7-list(at)matronics.com ; rv9-list(at)matronics.com
> Sent: Tuesday, February 17, 2004 6:34 PM
> Subject: RV9-List: Alodine
>
>
> I am unable to locate the product "Alodine" at any chemical outlet in
Northern Nevada. Does anyone know of a generic name for this product?
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Paul Pflimlin" <pablo(at)phonewave.net> |
| Subject: | Re: What is this engine worth? |
----- Original Message -----
From: "Mark Schrimmer" <mschrimmer(at)pacbell.net>
Subject: RV9-List: What is this engine worth?
Strictly core, about 4k. and hope the crank is useable.
>
> Anybody care to guess what this engine is worth? The seller and I are
trying
> to determine a fair price. Here are the details . . .
>
> Lycoming 0-320-E2D
> 150 h.p.
> Two cylinders in the 60s, two in the mid 70s
> Uses about 1 quart of oil every 10 hours
> Approximately 3,400 hours total time
> Approximately 1,200 hours since overhaul by an A&P
> Comes with a MA4-SPA carb with metal float
> Comes with a 149 tooth starter ring
> Uses an oil screen, not a filter
> Oil changed every 25 hours since overhaul
> All ADs complied with
>
> The present owner is going to re-use the accessories on his new engine, so
> the magnetos, starter, alternator, vacuum pump, oil cooler, etc. are not
> included.
>
> Thanks,
>
> Mark
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Matthew Brandes" <matthew(at)n523rv.com> |
| Subject: | Passenger control stick alignment (F-665) |
I bolted the control sticks onto the spar last night and noticed that the passenger
control stick leans to the left when the pilot stick is straight. I checked
the F-665 rod connecting the two sticks and they were 18 7/8" as the plans
state. In order to get both sticks to be vertical, I have to screw the rod ends
almost all the way in.
Anybody else notice this? Is my right eye crooked??
Matthew
RV-9A Fuselage
EAA Chapter 868
www.n523rv.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Richard E. Tasker" <retasker(at)optonline.net> |
Alodine is a registered trademark of Henkel Surface Technologies.
Although they are the only ones that can sell "alodine" there are
substitutes and other similar formulations from other companies. They
sell the alodine along with other chemicals for working with aluminum on
the following website - choose "store" and you will eventually get to
the "store" where you can order their chemicals.
https://www.buyhstna.com/aboutus.htm
I don't know how the place you ordered it from gets away without a
haz-mat charge. The haz-mat cost from Henkel is rolled into the
material cost so the more you buy, the less per gallon it costs.
Dick Tasker
Paul Pflimlin wrote:
>
>
>----- Original Message -----
>From: "Merems" <merems(at)cox.net>
>To:
>Subject: Re: RV9-List: Alodine
>
>Thanks to all in response to Alodine question. My last purchase of Alodine
>from Spruce included interstate Haz-Mat charge, that was almost as much as
>the product. I took Paul Merems advice and placed an order with Autobody
>Depot. They advertise NO Haz-Mat chg. I am still curious though if Alodine
>is Just a name for a generic product? Thanks to all. Paul P. RV-7A Fuse.
>
>
>
>>
>>Paul,
>>
>>I purchased my Alodine/iradite and metalprep/alumiprep from
>>
>>
>http://autobodydepot.net. Their shipping was very reasonable.
>
>
>>Paul Merems RV-4/RV-7A
>> ----- Original Message -----
>> From: Paul Pflimlin
>> To: rv7-list(at)matronics.com ; rv9-list(at)matronics.com
>> Sent: Tuesday, February 17, 2004 6:34 PM
>> Subject: RV9-List: Alodine
>>
>>
>>
>> I am unable to locate the product "Alodine" at any chemical outlet in
>>
>>
>Northern Nevada. Does anyone know of a generic name for this product?
>
>
>>
>>
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Albert Gardner" <spudnut(at)worldnet.att.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Passenger control stick alignment (F-665) |
Assuming you don't have a problem with proper spacing somewhere, that's the
way you make them both vertical.
Albert Gardner
RV-9A 872RV
Yuma, AZ
----- Original Message -----
From: "Matthew Brandes" <matthew(at)n523rv.com>
Subject: RV9-List: Passenger control stick alignment (F-665)
>
> I bolted the control sticks onto the spar last night and noticed that the
passenger control stick leans to the left when the pilot stick is straight.
I checked the F-665 rod connecting the two sticks and they were 18 7/8" as
the plans state. In order to get both sticks to be vertical, I have to
screw the rod ends almost all the way in.
>
> Anybody else notice this? Is my right eye crooked??
>
> Matthew
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Sargentclt(at)cs.com |
Good call Bill. I found they also carry numbered drill bits.
Tad RV7A
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Rob W M Shipley" <rob(at)robsglass.com> |
| Subject: | Exhaust on floor. |
Andy wrote:
Subject: Re: RV9-List: Firewall insulation
I flew with no insulation, or carpet for 20 hours at first. Then added
sound pad and carpet later. I still have nothing on the firewall and
don't think it would make much difference. Most of the noise
comes from the exhaust on the floor boards, so carpet and sound
proofing work good there..........
Andy,
Do you any other listers have any comments about the heat from the exhaust on the
floor and hence the insulation? What did builders use on top of the insulation?
Aluminium? Hexcel?
Rob
Rob W M Shipley
N919RV (res) Fuselage .....still!
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Richard Scott <rscott(at)cascadeaccess.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Dimples, rivets and gaps |
I had the same concern when I riveted my HS skin. One side of the HS skin
was flush and the other had a little gap between the skin & spar. Called
Van's & Tom Green told me this was normal and that on the side that was
flush, I had countersunk too deep. Said not to worry & forge on!
Richard Scott
9A Rudder & elevators
At 08:02 PM 2/13/2004, you wrote:
>
>
>Getting ready to rivet up the VS. My reading of the
>recommendations for dimpling vs countersinking leads me to
>believe that the spars in the VS should be dimpled to accept
>the dimples in the skin. The spars are too thin to be
>countersunk. So that's the way I went.
>
>But when I cleco the ribs, spars and skins together after
>dimpling - there is a gap between the skins and the spars, they
>don't sit perfectly flush against each other- probably less
>than half a millimeter of gap. The interlocking dimples does
>make the assembled structure quite rigid, but still I'm
>concerned ... seems like the rivets might "work" over time. I
>would really like to see the skins flat against the spars.
>
>When I countersank the HS spars it led to a much nicer mate
>with the skins. Am I going in the right direction here ?
>
>g
>
>==========================================================
>Gerry Filby gerf(at)gerf.com
> Home (415) 239 4846
> Cell (415) 203 9177
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Andy Karmy" <andy(at)karmy.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Exhaust on floor. |
I really have not noticed "heat" as such, we are talking about warm
air against the outside when you're screaming across the sky...
Right? It's all about sound and vibration In my mind.
I put down 1/2" of sound deadening foam that I got from Aircraft
spruce. It's black and fairly dense. No aluminum backing. then I
used velcro to hold the carpet down to the foam.
I noticed quite a bit of vibration in my heels before installing the
carpet and foam, so that's the main advantage that I found. I did
have the engine dynamically balanced and that helped, but did not
remove all of it.
- Andy
>
>Andy,
>Do you any other listers have any comments about the heat from
the exhaust on the floor and hence the insulation? What did
builders use on top of the insulation? Aluminium? Hexcel?
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Ken Anderson" <ken(at)peggyking.com> |
I am considering using the Aero'lectric aux bat system for my RV-9A, and
would like to know if others have installed an additional bat, and where
they installed it.
Ken Anderson
fuselage
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | DThomas773(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Another RV9, flying |
support(at)vansaircraft.com, jbullock(at)csusb.edu, Kilee7769(at)aol.com,
SgtJBurns(at)aol.com...john.burns, MEB814(at)aol.com, chapters(at)eaa.org,
dabullethead(at)yahoo.com, tdonato1(at)hotmail.com, buzzardbuns(at)nwtec.com,
frugaldy(at)netzero.net, dhiggins(at)genesco.com, info(at)vansaircraft.com,
gmeadows55(at)hotmail.com, Jeanne.Khoury(at)HCAHealthcare.com,
kimttokurt(at)emailias.com, DennisTtoKurt(at)emailias.com, kurt7431(at)comcast.net,
marycat(at)cruzio.com, micraby(at)comcast.net, nancyt(at)cats.ucsc.edu,
momabon1(at)sbcglobal.net, ggparr(at)arbuckleonline.com, davidraby(at)attbi.com,
saylor(at)redshift.com, Sfallon612(at)cs.com, melissa_shaffer(at)excite.com,
Ann.THOMAS(at)state.or.us, marycat(at)cruzio.com, kimt1(at)att.net, Chldpsy2(at)aol.com,
Cindylwest(at)aol.com, white7(at)ix.netcom.com, flightline(at)worldnet.att.net,
Caryn428(at)aol.com, JudieZehnder(at)uamc.com, reziegler(at)earthlink.net
Hi Folks,
Friday. February 20 at 8:45, the FAA Air Worthiness Inspector showed up at my
hanger. He introduced himself and spent the next 35 minutes inspecting my
airplane. He questioned the length of my pitot tube and recommended shortening
it 2 inches. We quickly did this. He then congratulated me, gave me my Air
Worthiness Certificate and told me to go flying.
It took me and my building partner, Jerry Olsen, about an hour and a half to
put all the fairings, panels and inspection covers back on the airplane. We
then followed his advice and I flew the airplane
What a rush! I can tell you guys, it is worth all the work. It flew hands
off on the first flight, all systems were in the green and it flys and performs
better than I could ever hoped that it could.
So far we have logged 3.5 hours and am looking forward to a lot more. I'll
keep you posted.
Dennis Thomas
RV9 N164DV
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Cy Galley" <cgalley(at)QCBC.ORG> |
| Subject: | Re: Another RV9, flying |
What was the rational for shortening your pitot tube. I always thought the
farther away from the plane the more accurate the reading.
Cy Galley
Editor, EAA Safety Programs
cgalley(at)qcbc.org or sportpilot(at)eaa.org
>
> Hi Folks,
> Friday. February 20 at 8:45, the FAA Air Worthiness Inspector showed up at
my
> hanger. He introduced himself and spent the next 35 minutes inspecting my
> airplane. He questioned the length of my pitot tube and recommended
shortening
> it 2 inches. We quickly did this. He then congratulated me, gave me my
Air
> Worthiness Certificate and told me to go flying.
> It took me and my building partner, Jerry Olsen, about an hour and a half
to
> put all the fairings, panels and inspection covers back on the airplane.
We
> then followed his advice and I flew the airplane
> What a rush! I can tell you guys, it is worth all the work. It flew
hands
> off on the first flight, all systems were in the green and it flys and
performs
> better than I could ever hoped that it could.
> So far we have logged 3.5 hours and am looking forward to a lot more.
I'll
> keep you posted.
>
> Dennis Thomas
> RV9 N164DV
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Don Alexander <don(at)propjock.com> |
| Subject: | Congratulations! |
Dennis,
Congratulations on a job well done. Keep us posted on your performance
numbers if you don't mind.
Don 90702 Wings
www.propjock.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | DThomas773(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Another RV9, flying |
He didn't offer any reason but just asked if the length was correct. We dug
out the plan and it called for an overall length of 7 to 8 inches. Ours
measured about 10 1/2. I suppose the longer it is the more easily damaged it would
be.
Dennis Thomas
Happy Builder
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Richard E. Tasker" <retasker(at)optonline.net> |
| Subject: | Fire Extinguisher |
I am working on the fuselage and am planning to include a fire
extinguisher in the cabin. What size (5 lb, 10 lb, ???) have some of
you used? Any suggestions regarding sources for plumbing, etc. so I
could also install one to extinguish a fire in the cowl?
Dick Tasker, RV9A #90573
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Clay R <clayr_55(at)yahoo.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Fire Extinguisher |
I mounted a small halon fire extinguisher between the
fuel selector valve and gear leg mounting on the left
side in front of the spar. One screw went through the
mounting bracket into an existing nutplate that is
used to hold cover in front of the spar, and the other
side of the mounting bracket is held with a screw and
nut through the cover.
I bought the 14oz size from www.safeair1.com and had
it personally delivered to me by Monte!
I think your best bet for dealing with a fire in the
cowl is to turn off the fuel and point the nose down.
I doubt the additional weight and complexity of a FWF
system will be worth it.
See this site for more info on Halon.
http://www.h3r.com/
-Clay
--- "Richard E. Tasker"
wrote:
>
>
> I am working on the fuselage and am planning to
> include a fire
> extinguisher in the cabin. What size (5 lb, 10 lb,
> ???) have some of
> you used? Any suggestions regarding sources for
> plumbing, etc. so I
> could also install one to extinguish a fire in the
> cowl?
>
> Dick Tasker, RV9A #90573
>
>
__________________________________
http://antispam.yahoo.com/tools
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Clifford Begnaud" <shoeless(at)barefootpilot.com> |
| Subject: | Incredible Service! |
I've never seen anything like this!
I own two Lightspeed headsets. One of them, a 20 XL was purchased at Oshkosh
2002, the other, a 20K, is 6 years old. The K model was so badly used and
abused that it was falling apart. The headband was broken, head pad falling
off, ear seals completely worn out and it just plain didn't work. The 20XL
was in good physical shape except that the chord had been stretched and the
wires broken.
I sent them to Lightspeed last week on Wednesday. I included a note for them
to call me to tell me how much it would cost to repair the older headset.
Well, today, Thursday, a week and day after I shipped them, I found a box on
my door with both headsets repaired and looking like new. Best of all, there
was no charge. Not even for the old beat up headset. They even apologized
for the inconvenience. My hats off to Lightspeed!
Cliff
Erie, CO -9A, wings
Currently flying a kitfox 5
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Fabian Lefler" <fablef(at)bellsouth.net> |
,
| Subject: | Instruments For Sale |
I have a few items for sale. Here is a list:
ICOM A-200
GARMIN GTX327
AMERIKING AK-350
GPS 196
Altimeter
United VSI
MONROY ADT-200
DYNON
All items are brand new. See a detailed list here: http://www.affordablepanels.com/forsale2.htm
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Phil Brown" <philipbrown(at)onetel.net.uk> |
| Subject: | Re: W-919 tank splice plate |
Hi Paul ,
Phil Brown from the U.K. here! how did you get on with the strip, like
you I agree there isn't much meat for the nut plates....did you go ahead
anyway? I'm at that stage now. My plans are even older than yours! I cant
even find a reference to go about drilling and attaching the nut plates!!!!
phil
----- Original Message -----
From: "Paul Eastham" <eastham(at)netapp.com>
Subject: RV9-List: W-919 tank splice plate
>
> Hi everyone in rv9land,
> I just started to dimple the splice plate the joins the LE to the
> tank, and I'm suddenly not sure I drilled this thing right. The tank
> screw dimples go right to the edge of the plate, distorting the edge
> slightly, and the #40 platenut attach holes are right at minimum edge
> distance, .22" or so.
> Is this similar to anyone else's? I read the drilling directions
> again and I seem to have followed those, but it sure looks like the
> whole plate should have been placed further inboard, toward the tank.
>
> Thanks,
> Paul
> http://hmb.dyndns.org/~eastham/rv
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Paul Eastham <eastham(at)netapp.com> |
| Subject: | Re: W-919 tank splice plate |
Hi Phil,
Van's said that it was fine and to forge ahead. However, now that my
LE is all riveted up, it sure looks like it ought to stick out more
than they specify....there is about a half inch of extra metal
outboard past the LE rib flange. On my other wing I will certainly
pull it out further or at least err slightly on the tank side.
Also check the archives regarding trimming the aft edges of the strip
forward of the spar. Not mentioned in the directions and impossible to see
on the plans.
Regards,
Paul
>
> Hi Paul ,
> Phil Brown from the U.K. here! how did you get on with the strip, like
> you I agree there isn't much meat for the nut plates....did you go ahead
> anyway? I'm at that stage now. My plans are even older than yours! I cant
> even find a reference to go about drilling and attaching the nut plates!!!!
> phil
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Paul Eastham" <eastham(at)netapp.com>
> To:
> Subject: RV9-List: W-919 tank splice plate
>
>
> >
> > Hi everyone in rv9land,
> > I just started to dimple the splice plate the joins the LE to the
> > tank, and I'm suddenly not sure I drilled this thing right. The tank
> > screw dimples go right to the edge of the plate, distorting the edge
> > slightly, and the #40 platenut attach holes are right at minimum edge
> > distance, .22" or so.
> > Is this similar to anyone else's? I read the drilling directions
> > again and I seem to have followed those, but it sure looks like the
> > whole plate should have been placed further inboard, toward the tank.
> >
> > Thanks,
> > Paul
> > http://hmb.dyndns.org/~eastham/rv
> >
> >
>
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Mike Hoover" <mikehoover(at)sc.rr.com> |
| Subject: | Re: W-919 tank splice plate |
FYI,
I had emailed Vans earlier about the discrepencies in between the manual and
the drawings regarding the W-919 splce strip. Here is their reply: We
revised the manual since you bought your preview plans and the 1/2" and
11/16" dimensions are correct. We failed to update the drawing. Thanks for
bringing it to our attention. Most builders don't read the drawings that
closely.
I followed the manual (revised Mar 03) and used the 1/2" edge line for the
LE rivets holes, and have 11/16" exposed for the tank skin overlap. The
screw holes are closer to the edge and the outboard edge of the 919 does
extend beyond the 908 LE nose rib flange by about 3/16". This is apparently
what Vans intended, so I'm sticking with it. Hope this helps.
Mike
SC
90709 wings ...sealing first tank.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Paul Eastham" <eastham(at)netapp.com>
Subject: Re: RV9-List: W-919 tank splice plate
>
> Hi Phil,
> Van's said that it was fine and to forge ahead. However, now that my
> LE is all riveted up, it sure looks like it ought to stick out more
> than they specify....there is about a half inch of extra metal
> outboard past the LE rib flange. On my other wing I will certainly
> pull it out further or at least err slightly on the tank side.
>
> Also check the archives regarding trimming the aft edges of the strip
> forward of the spar. Not mentioned in the directions and impossible to
see
> on the plans.
>
> Regards,
> Paul
>
> >
> > Hi Paul ,
> > Phil Brown from the U.K. here! how did you get on with the strip,
like
> > you I agree there isn't much meat for the nut plates....did you go ahead
> > anyway? I'm at that stage now. My plans are even older than yours! I
cant
> > even find a reference to go about drilling and attaching the nut
plates!!!!
> > phil
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: "Paul Eastham" <eastham(at)netapp.com>
> > To:
> > Subject: RV9-List: W-919 tank splice plate
> >
> >
> > >
> > > Hi everyone in rv9land,
> > > I just started to dimple the splice plate the joins the LE to the
> > > tank, and I'm suddenly not sure I drilled this thing right. The tank
> > > screw dimples go right to the edge of the plate, distorting the edge
> > > slightly, and the #40 platenut attach holes are right at minimum edge
> > > distance, .22" or so.
> > > Is this similar to anyone else's? I read the drilling directions
> > > again and I seem to have followed those, but it sure looks like the
> > > whole plate should have been placed further inboard, toward the tank.
> > >
> > > Thanks,
> > > Paul
> > > http://hmb.dyndns.org/~eastham/rv
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Phil Brown" <philipbrown(at)onetel.net.uk> |
| Subject: | Re: W-919 tank splice plate |
Thanks Paul
I think I'll follow you, even taking into consideration
wing flexing there's one hell of a lot of room between strip and tank.
phil brown
----- Original Message -----
From: "Paul Eastham" <eastham(at)netapp.com>
Subject: Re: RV9-List: W-919 tank splice plate
>
> Hi Phil,
> Van's said that it was fine and to forge ahead. However, now that my
> LE is all riveted up, it sure looks like it ought to stick out more
> than they specify....there is about a half inch of extra metal
> outboard past the LE rib flange. On my other wing I will certainly
> pull it out further or at least err slightly on the tank side.
>
> Also check the archives regarding trimming the aft edges of the strip
> forward of the spar. Not mentioned in the directions and impossible to
see
> on the plans.
>
> Regards,
> Paul
>
> >
> > Hi Paul ,
> > Phil Brown from the U.K. here! how did you get on with the strip,
like
> > you I agree there isn't much meat for the nut plates....did you go ahead
> > anyway? I'm at that stage now. My plans are even older than yours! I
cant
> > even find a reference to go about drilling and attaching the nut
plates!!!!
> > phil
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: "Paul Eastham" <eastham(at)netapp.com>
> > To:
> > Subject: RV9-List: W-919 tank splice plate
> >
> >
> > >
> > > Hi everyone in rv9land,
> > > I just started to dimple the splice plate the joins the LE to the
> > > tank, and I'm suddenly not sure I drilled this thing right. The tank
> > > screw dimples go right to the edge of the plate, distorting the edge
> > > slightly, and the #40 platenut attach holes are right at minimum edge
> > > distance, .22" or so.
> > > Is this similar to anyone else's? I read the drilling directions
> > > again and I seem to have followed those, but it sure looks like the
> > > whole plate should have been placed further inboard, toward the tank.
> > >
> > > Thanks,
> > > Paul
> > > http://hmb.dyndns.org/~eastham/rv
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "MICK MULLER" <MULLERPHARM(at)bigpond.com> |
Reading the plans for the wings, it is suggested that when preparing the
ribs for the wings, consideration should be given to providing extra holes
to run wires to strobes, landing lights etc. Looking at those gaping
lighmening holes in all the 911 and 912 ribs, I'm scratching my head
wondering why on earth I need to add more? Why not just use the lightening
holes?
Mick Muller
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Matthew Brandes" <matthew(at)n523rv.com> |
| Subject: | Dimple or countersink the 904/976/972 |
I'm about ready to disassemble the center section assembly but before I do, I need
some input. The F-972 floor skin overlaps the F-976 center section skin which
in turn sits on the flange of the 904 E&F. The plans note four places you
should countersink the 976/904 because this is where the floor angles attach
on the inside. This implies that you should dimple the rest. The flange on
the 904 is pretty thick, and dimpling this plus the two skins could leave a not
so hot mating surfaces between them all.
I'm thinking I'll countersink the entire row of 976 skin/904 flange and dimple
the 972 skin to sit inside the countersink. Is this what others did?? Am I missing
something??
Matthew Brandes
Van's RV-9A (Wings)
EAA Chapter 91 & 868
www.n523rv.com
matthew(at)n523rv.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Dave Nicholson" <n347sd(at)insightbb.com> |
| Subject: | Re: wires in wings |
If you want to run the wires through the existing lightening holes, there is
plenty of room, but you will have to stabalize these wires at each rib,
which will require you to make/buy some type of 90 bracket to hold the
wires and attach to the rib.
If you want to "really" secure the wires, you can run a plastic conduit
through these lightening holes, but you will still have to secure the
conduit to each rib.
I chose the conduit route, but went ahead and drilled additonal 1/2" holes
through each rib for the conduit, eliminating the need for any brackets.
Since I have an Auto Pilot in one wing and Static/Pitot Lines in the other,
I have two 1/2" OD plastic conduits in each wing (One is for lighting wires,
the other for A/P wires, or tubing.). This makes it very easy to install
the wires and tubes after the wings are closed.
Dave
90347
----- Original Message -----
From: "MICK MULLER" <MULLERPHARM(at)bigpond.com>
Subject: RV9-List: wires in wings
>
> Reading the plans for the wings, it is suggested that when preparing the
> ribs for the wings, consideration should be given to providing extra
holes
> to run wires to strobes, landing lights etc. Looking at those gaping
> lighmening holes in all the 911 and 912 ribs, I'm scratching my head
> wondering why on earth I need to add more? Why not just use the lightening
> holes?
> Mick Muller
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | DThomas773(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: wires in wings |
You might want to take a look at where your lights will be and where your
wire will need to go into the fuselage. Also the aileron pushrod travels through
one set of theses holes. If wire runs share the same holes as the aileron
pushrod be sure hey securd it well away from one another.
I used these holes attached them at each rib with tie wraps, cushioned by a
small piece of plastic tubing.
Dennis Thomas
RV-9, flying
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | DThomas773(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Dimple or countersink the 904/976/972 |
I'm away from my shopand plans, but as I remember where are talking about,
your rivets go through 2 layers of skin and the wing center section. THe center
section is too thick to dimple and so the layers of skin on top of it can't
be dimpled either.
Dennis Thomas
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Dimple or countersink the 904/976/972 |
Of course they can. The dimpled skin sits in the dimpled skin, which sits in
the countersunk holes.
There is recurrent discussion on this point, just like the wires in the
wings. The archives might be a good place to look. Some folks countersunk
the entire belly skin, but I asked Van's when doing mine, and they recommended
dimpling it. I did, and I'm glad. This area takes some pretty good drumming
from the exhaust and turbulence off the prop and cowl. Dimples are tougher.
The .040 dimples a bit harder, but comes out fine.
Gary
Quoting "DThomas773(at)aol.com" :
>
> I'm away from my shopand plans, but as I remember where are talking about,
> your rivets go through 2 layers of skin and the wing center section. THe
> center
> section is too thick to dimple and so the layers of skin on top of it can't
> be dimpled either.
>
> Dennis Thomas
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Phil Brown" <philipbrown(at)onetel.net.uk> |
| Subject: | Re: W-919 tank splice plate |
Yeah, thanks Mike......I flagged your previous correspondence when you
originally posted it and inserted it into my build manual for when I came to
that point.....which is now!
thanks again
phil
----- Original Message -----
From: "Mike Hoover" <mikehoover(at)sc.rr.com>
Subject: Re: RV9-List: W-919 tank splice plate
>
> FYI,
>
> I had emailed Vans earlier about the discrepencies in between the manual
and
> the drawings regarding the W-919 splce strip. Here is their reply: We
> revised the manual since you bought your preview plans and the 1/2" and
> 11/16" dimensions are correct. We failed to update the drawing. Thanks for
> bringing it to our attention. Most builders don't read the drawings that
> closely.
>
> I followed the manual (revised Mar 03) and used the 1/2" edge line for the
> LE rivets holes, and have 11/16" exposed for the tank skin overlap. The
> screw holes are closer to the edge and the outboard edge of the 919 does
> extend beyond the 908 LE nose rib flange by about 3/16". This is
apparently
> what Vans intended, so I'm sticking with it. Hope this helps.
>
> Mike
> SC
> 90709 wings ...sealing first tank.
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Paul Eastham" <eastham(at)netapp.com>
> To:
> Subject: Re: RV9-List: W-919 tank splice plate
>
>
> >
> > Hi Phil,
> > Van's said that it was fine and to forge ahead. However, now that my
> > LE is all riveted up, it sure looks like it ought to stick out more
> > than they specify....there is about a half inch of extra metal
> > outboard past the LE rib flange. On my other wing I will certainly
> > pull it out further or at least err slightly on the tank side.
> >
> > Also check the archives regarding trimming the aft edges of the strip
> > forward of the spar. Not mentioned in the directions and impossible to
> see
> > on the plans.
> >
> > Regards,
> > Paul
> >
> > >
> > > Hi Paul ,
> > > Phil Brown from the U.K. here! how did you get on with the strip,
> like
> > > you I agree there isn't much meat for the nut plates....did you go
ahead
> > > anyway? I'm at that stage now. My plans are even older than yours! I
> cant
> > > even find a reference to go about drilling and attaching the nut
> plates!!!!
> > > phil
> > > ----- Original Message -----
> > > From: "Paul Eastham" <eastham(at)netapp.com>
> > > To:
> > > Subject: RV9-List: W-919 tank splice plate
> > >
> > >
> > > >
> > > > Hi everyone in rv9land,
> > > > I just started to dimple the splice plate the joins the LE to the
> > > > tank, and I'm suddenly not sure I drilled this thing right. The
tank
> > > > screw dimples go right to the edge of the plate, distorting the edge
> > > > slightly, and the #40 platenut attach holes are right at minimum
edge
> > > > distance, .22" or so.
> > > > Is this similar to anyone else's? I read the drilling directions
> > > > again and I seem to have followed those, but it sure looks like the
> > > > whole plate should have been placed further inboard, toward the
tank.
> > > >
> > > > Thanks,
> > > > Paul
> > > > http://hmb.dyndns.org/~eastham/rv
> > > >
> > > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "fcs(at)jlc.net" <fcs(at)jlc.net> |
| Subject: | Re: wires in wings |
I just enlarged the existing tooling holes in the ribs to run Vans
conduit. The conduit has already proven its value as I decided to change
some wiring after the initial installation. This was simple with the
conduit and would have been major surgery any other way. One suggestion
for conduit users,,, place a blob of weatherstrip adhesive at each place
where the plastic conduit passes through a rib. Over time, the small
amount of vibration against the sharp rib hole can wear through the
conduit. A drop of adhesive eliminates the vibration.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Terry Hobert" <terhobey(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | Re: wires in wings |
I ran the conduit through the lightening holes. At each rib I would cut a
piece of conduit about 2" long slice it lengthwise and wrap it around the
conduit where it would meet the edge of the lightening hole. I then deilled
a #40 hole alittle away from the edge of the lightening hole and put a small
tie wrap throught it, I then put a larger tie wrap 90 degrees through that
one and around the two layers of conduit. This holds it secure. I then
dropped of wires at the aileron bellcrank (for auto pilot and pitot heat if
used) continued on and dropped off wire for the landing light and continued
the cable for the position/strobes on to wing tip. Dito on right wing w/o
bellcrank drop, but have landing light in both wings and etc.
Could send picture, but pretty straight forward.
Terry 9A fuselage
>From: DThomas773(at)aol.com
>Reply-To: rv9-list(at)matronics.com
>To: rv9-list(at)matronics.com
>Subject: Re: RV9-List: wires in wings
>Date: Sun, 29 Feb 2004 16:53:28 EST
>
>
>You might want to take a look at where your lights will be and where your
>wire will need to go into the fuselage. Also the aileron pushrod travels
>through
>one set of theses holes. If wire runs share the same holes as the aileron
>pushrod be sure hey securd it well away from one another.
>I used these holes attached them at each rib with tie wraps, cushioned by a
>small piece of plastic tubing.
>
>Dennis Thomas
>RV-9, flying
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Richard Scott <rscott(at)cascadeaccess.com> |
| Subject: | Re: wires in wings |
My AI tells me not to use ty wraps to attach anything directly to
metal. Says it can vibrate thru the metal, even steel. The A&P who
restored my Interstate Cadet says the same thing. I don't know if this is
true, but both of these guys are top notch mechanics, so I take their word
for it, especially in regard to aluminum.
You might bend up a small aluminum bracket, attach that to your rib with a
rivet or two, then attach the conduit to the bracket with a ty wrap cradle
(p. 397 of Spruce's catalog) or an Adel clamp.
Richard Scott
9A Emp.
At 12:08 PM 3/1/2004, you wrote:
>
>I ran the conduit through the lightening holes. At each rib I would cut a
>piece of conduit about 2" long slice it lengthwise and wrap it around the
>conduit where it would meet the edge of the lightening hole. I then deilled
>a #40 hole alittle away from the edge of the lightening hole and put a small
>tie wrap throught it, I then put a larger tie wrap 90 degrees through that
>one and around the two layers of conduit. This holds it secure. I then
>dropped of wires at the aileron bellcrank (for auto pilot and pitot heat if
>used) continued on and dropped off wire for the landing light and continued
>the cable for the position/strobes on to wing tip. Dito on right wing w/o
>bellcrank drop, but have landing light in both wings and etc.
>Could send picture, but pretty straight forward.
>Terry 9A fuselage
>
>
> >From: DThomas773(at)aol.com
> >Reply-To: rv9-list(at)matronics.com
> >To: rv9-list(at)matronics.com
> >Subject: Re: RV9-List: wires in wings
> >Date: Sun, 29 Feb 2004 16:53:28 EST
> >
> >
> >You might want to take a look at where your lights will be and where your
> >wire will need to go into the fuselage. Also the aileron pushrod travels
> >through
> >one set of theses holes. If wire runs share the same holes as the aileron
> >pushrod be sure hey securd it well away from one another.
> >I used these holes attached them at each rib with tie wraps, cushioned by a
> >small piece of plastic tubing.
> >
> >Dennis Thomas
> >RV-9, flying
> >
> >
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Dave Nicholson" <n347sd(at)insightbb.com> |
| Subject: | Re: wires in wings |
Something to keep in mind is the expected life of wire ties. They are
subject to heat degradation as well a vibration, and both conditions exist
inside the wings over time. Pulling a small radius with a wire tie also
reduces it's strength at the "gripper" because of the sharp angle entering
the tooth section. I have had some fail under these conditions.
Detecting and replacing broken wire ties inside the wing would be pretty
difficult, and having the Aileron Push Rod chafe a hole in a wire would not
be good.
Adel's (MS21919 Cushion Clamps) with mechanical fasteners (bolts) and
self-locking nuts are much more reliable, even if they are more expensive,
complex, and heavy.
Because of all these issues, I chose to run my conduits through enlarged
tooling holes in the ribs.
Dave Nicholson
90347
----- Original Message -----
From: "Terry Hobert" <terhobey(at)hotmail.com>
Subject: Re: RV9-List: wires in wings
>
> I ran the conduit through the lightening holes. At each rib I would cut a
> piece of conduit about 2" long slice it lengthwise and wrap it around the
> conduit where it would meet the edge of the lightening hole. I then
deilled
> a #40 hole alittle away from the edge of the lightening hole and put a
small
> tie wrap throught it, I then put a larger tie wrap 90 degrees through that
> one and around the two layers of conduit. This holds it secure. I then
> dropped of wires at the aileron bellcrank (for auto pilot and pitot heat
if
> used) continued on and dropped off wire for the landing light and
continued
> the cable for the position/strobes on to wing tip. Dito on right wing w/o
> bellcrank drop, but have landing light in both wings and etc.
> Could send picture, but pretty straight forward.
> Terry 9A fuselage
>
>
> >From: DThomas773(at)aol.com
> >Reply-To: rv9-list(at)matronics.com
> >To: rv9-list(at)matronics.com
> >Subject: Re: RV9-List: wires in wings
> >Date: Sun, 29 Feb 2004 16:53:28 EST
> >
> >
> >You might want to take a look at where your lights will be and where your
> >wire will need to go into the fuselage. Also the aileron pushrod travels
> >through
> >one set of theses holes. If wire runs share the same holes as the
aileron
> >pushrod be sure hey securd it well away from one another.
> >I used these holes attached them at each rib with tie wraps, cushioned by
a
> >small piece of plastic tubing.
> >
> >Dennis Thomas
> >RV-9, flying
> >
> >
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Paul Pflimlin" <pablo(at)phonewave.net> |
| Subject: | Re: wires in wings |
----- Original Message -----
From: "Richard Scott" <rscott(at)cascadeaccess.com>
Subject: Re: RV9-List: wires in wings
The following information is Platinum, believe it!!
>
> My AI tells me not to use ty wraps to attach anything directly to
> metal. Says it can vibrate thru the metal, even steel. The A&P who
> restored my Interstate Cadet says the same thing. I don't know if this is
> true, but both of these guys are top notch mechanics, so I take their word
> for it, especially in regard to aluminum.
>
> You might bend up a small aluminum bracket, attach that to your rib with a
> rivet or two, then attach the conduit to the bracket with a ty wrap cradle
> (p. 397 of Spruce's catalog) or an Adel clamp.
>
> Richard Scott
> 9A Emp.
>
> At 12:08 PM 3/1/2004, you wrote:
> >
> >I ran the conduit through the lightening holes. At each rib I would cut
a
> >piece of conduit about 2" long slice it lengthwise and wrap it around the
> >conduit where it would meet the edge of the lightening hole. I then
deilled
> >a #40 hole alittle away from the edge of the lightening hole and put a
small
> >tie wrap throught it, I then put a larger tie wrap 90 degrees through
that
> >one and around the two layers of conduit. This holds it secure. I then
> >dropped of wires at the aileron bellcrank (for auto pilot and pitot heat
if
> >used) continued on and dropped off wire for the landing light and
continued
> >the cable for the position/strobes on to wing tip. Dito on right wing
w/o
> >bellcrank drop, but have landing light in both wings and etc.
> >Could send picture, but pretty straight forward.
> >Terry 9A fuselage
> >
> >
> > >From: DThomas773(at)aol.com
> > >Reply-To: rv9-list(at)matronics.com
> > >To: rv9-list(at)matronics.com
> > >Subject: Re: RV9-List: wires in wings
> > >Date: Sun, 29 Feb 2004 16:53:28 EST
> > >
> > >
> > >You might want to take a look at where your lights will be and where
your
> > >wire will need to go into the fuselage. Also the aileron pushrod
travels
> > >through
> > >one set of theses holes. If wire runs share the same holes as the
aileron
> > >pushrod be sure hey securd it well away from one another.
> > >I used these holes attached them at each rib with tie wraps, cushioned
by a
> > >small piece of plastic tubing.
> > >
> > >Dennis Thomas
> > >RV-9, flying
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "John Oliveira" <oliveira(at)frontiernet.net> |
| Subject: | Re: wires in wings |
Terry, that sounds like a lot of work. I used the snap bushings in Vans
catalogue. They snap in to slightly enlarged holes. 10 seconds per hole.
Just run the wires. Don't need the conduit to run additional wires for the
future as you can reach the whole wing through inspection port, tips, or
root. Simple, cheap, less work, made for the job.
John Oliveira
9a fuselage
----- Original Message -----
From: "Terry Hobert" <terhobey(at)hotmail.com>
Subject: Re: RV9-List: wires in wings
>
> I ran the conduit through the lightening holes. At each rib I would cut a
> piece of conduit about 2" long slice it lengthwise and wrap it around the
> conduit where it would meet the edge of the lightening hole. I then
deilled
> a #40 hole alittle away from the edge of the lightening hole and put a
small
> tie wrap throught it, I then put a larger tie wrap 90 degrees through that
> one and around the two layers of conduit. This holds it secure. I then
> dropped of wires at the aileron bellcrank (for auto pilot and pitot heat
if
> used) continued on and dropped off wire for the landing light and
continued
> the cable for the position/strobes on to wing tip. Dito on right wing w/o
> bellcrank drop, but have landing light in both wings and etc.
> Could send picture, but pretty straight forward.
> Terry 9A fuselage
>
>
> >From: DThomas773(at)aol.com
> >Reply-To: rv9-list(at)matronics.com
> >To: rv9-list(at)matronics.com
> >Subject: Re: RV9-List: wires in wings
> >Date: Sun, 29 Feb 2004 16:53:28 EST
> >
> >
> >You might want to take a look at where your lights will be and where your
> >wire will need to go into the fuselage. Also the aileron pushrod travels
> >through
> >one set of theses holes. If wire runs share the same holes as the
aileron
> >pushrod be sure hey securd it well away from one another.
> >I used these holes attached them at each rib with tie wraps, cushioned by
a
> >small piece of plastic tubing.
> >
> >Dennis Thomas
> >RV-9, flying
> >
> >
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Albert Gardner" <spudnut(at)worldnet.att.net> |
| Subject: | Re: wires in wings |
This is a point to consider. Also, when I had to remove my left wing tank
last week to fix a leak at the BNC connector that always bothered me, I
found that access to the tank bolts that go through the spar was hampered
somewhat by the locations I had chosen for the pitot and static lines. If
you run wire conduit think about reaching in through a inspection hole, then
through the lightening hole to remove those bolts. The worst one is the
inboard set that lies between the closely spaced ribs.
Remember all those times you cussed auto engineers for the maintenance
difficulties that they built into their designs?
Albert Gardner
RV-9A 872RV
Yuma, AZ
----- Original Message -----
From: "John Oliveira" <oliveira(at)frontiernet.net>
> Terry, that sounds like a lot of work. I used the snap bushings in Vans
> catalogue. They snap in to slightly enlarged holes. 10 seconds per hole.
> Just run the wires. Don't need the conduit to run additional wires for the
> future as you can reach the whole wing through inspection port, tips, or
> root. Simple, cheap, less work, made for the job.
>
> John Oliveira
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: wires in wings |
| From: | "Larry PERRYMAN" <larry.perryman(at)atofina.com> |
03/02/2004 08:26:36 PM,
Serialize complete at 03/02/2004 08:26:36 PM
Albert,
Get you a 1/4 inch air rachet. The only way to go in getting the tank
bolts out.
Regards,
Larry Perryman
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Albert Gardner" <spudnut(at)worldnet.att.net> |
| Subject: | Re: wires in wings |
RE: Re: RV9-List: wires in wingsBill, I'm going to reply to the list since it
might be useful info for someone else.
The problem with the BNC bulkhead connector leaking at the center pin has been
an issue only for some. I was aware of this and bought a BNC connector from DigiKey
made for a pressure bulkhead. I anticipated that because it was made for
a pressure bulkhead there would not be a leakage problem. The right tank connector
did not leak but the left one would ooze a few drops of fuel when the tank
was full enough to put fuel against the connector. It probably needed a small
amount of pressure also but it left a stain and also caused a larger problem.
I use EI gages (EI is a great co. to work with and I love the gages especially
the fuel computer) and the fuel would work its way down the wires and into
the cabin leaving a small stain on the floor. In the process, it sometimes would
get the interface module that EI uses wet and sometimes the gage would go
to 0 for awhile until it dried out. Plus, if I ever smell fuel it the cabin I'd
like it to be an unusual event. Additionally, at the time EI sent their interface
module with ring terminals so you had to cut them off and install a BNC
connector but I think now you can get the modules with either ring terminals
or a BNC installed when you buy them. I can tell you I prosealed the hell out
of the wires, connector, and anything else I thought might possibly leak but somehow
something let gas out of the tank when it was full. I stress that this
is not usually the case but several others have reported the problem.
My fix involved filling the hole left by the BNC bulkhead connector with a presealed
3/8" bolt with SAE washers on each side of the tank bulkhead. For the electrical
connection, I drilled a 1/4" hole. From Lowe's I bought a nylon spacer
1/2" long, 1/4" OD and .140" ID. I drilled the ID out to #19 so a No. 8 screw
would go through it. I stuck this spacer through the 1/4" hole and on each
side of it I put a 1/4" thick nylon spacer, 1/2" OD, .257" ID. I used a threaded
No. 8-32 rod and used ring terminals on both the inside wire and the EI interface
module. I put lots of proseal around and used some no. 8 brass washers
to help compress the large nylon spacers against the tank bulkhead. So far I'm
very happy. It's possible that larger nylon spacers are available so the same
arrangement could have been done using the old hole that the BNC connector was
in and I could have avoided drilling a new 1/4" hole. BTW, the only reason Vans
uses a BNC connector is because they wanted a locking connector and that setup
worked well for many builders.
It wasn't that hard to get the tank off (about 2 hours) and a little less to get
it back on but I was very happy I had cleaned up the edges of the lightening
holes. I thought about the air ratchet but didn't want to buy any more tools.
All I'm saying is don't put stuff that covers up access to those bolts when you
run wires, pitot lines, whatever.
Albert Gardner
RV-9A 872RV
Yuma, AZ
----- Original Message -----
From: Repucci, Bill
Subject: RE: Re: RV9-List: wires in wings
Albert,
What kind of problem did you have with the BNC connector and what did you do
to fix it?
I am riveting up my first (left) wing and there is a leak out of the center of
the BNC connector that I have tired to seal twice. (and think I might have
it fixed but I'm not sure yet.) Van's told me to clean the wire and connector,
rough them up, and COVER them with proseal.
As for the wire, I cut the holes to install Van's conduit and will probably continue
to install it in both wings. Your comments about removing the tanks after
the bottom skin is installed frightens me a bit.
Bill R.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Terry Hobert" <terhobey(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | Re: wires in wings |
Thanks for the tip, I think I will replace the ty wraps with adel clamps.
It wasn't really much work and I kept the conduit toward the trailing edge
and toward the top skin. It is weel clear of the inspection openings and
the aileron bellcrank. I had wondered about the ty wraps wearing and had
figured my tech counciler may have me change them. That's why I've left the
bottom skins off and figured I won't button the wings all up until alittle
before mounting them.
Thanks again,
Terry 9A fuselage
>From: "Albert Gardner" <spudnut(at)worldnet.att.net>
>Reply-To: rv9-list(at)matronics.com
>To:
>Subject: Re: RV9-List: wires in wings
>Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2004 10:39:05 -0700
>
>
>This is a point to consider. Also, when I had to remove my left wing tank
>last week to fix a leak at the BNC connector that always bothered me, I
>found that access to the tank bolts that go through the spar was hampered
>somewhat by the locations I had chosen for the pitot and static lines. If
>you run wire conduit think about reaching in through a inspection hole,
>then
>through the lightening hole to remove those bolts. The worst one is the
>inboard set that lies between the closely spaced ribs.
>Remember all those times you cussed auto engineers for the maintenance
>difficulties that they built into their designs?
>Albert Gardner
>RV-9A 872RV
>Yuma, AZ
>
>----- Original Message -----
>From: "John Oliveira" <oliveira(at)frontiernet.net>
> > Terry, that sounds like a lot of work. I used the snap bushings in Vans
> > catalogue. They snap in to slightly enlarged holes. 10 seconds per
>hole.
> > Just run the wires. Don't need the conduit to run additional wires for
>the
> > future as you can reach the whole wing through inspection port, tips, or
> > root. Simple, cheap, less work, made for the job.
> >
> > John Oliveira
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Bill Repucci" <bill(at)repucci.com> |
| Subject: | Re: wires in wings |
Albert,
Thanks for the info. I need to wait another week before retesting my
tank as my shop is cold, 59 most days, so the proseal will take some
time to set.
Bill
RV-9
SN: 90737
N941WR (Reserved)
Riveting Left top wing skins in place.
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv9-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv9-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Albert Gardner
Subject: Re: Re: RV9-List: wires in wings
-->
RE: Re: RV9-List: wires in wingsBill, I'm going to reply to the list
since it might be useful info for someone else.
The problem with the BNC bulkhead connector leaking at the center pin
has been an issue only for some. I was aware of this and bought a BNC
connector from DigiKey made for a pressure bulkhead. I anticipated that
because it was made for a pressure bulkhead there would not be a leakage
problem. The right tank connector did not leak but the left one would
ooze a few drops of fuel when the tank was full enough to put fuel
against the connector. It probably needed a small amount of pressure
also but it left a stain and also caused a larger problem. I use EI
gages (EI is a great co. to work with and I love the gages especially
the fuel computer) and the fuel would work its way down the wires and
into the cabin leaving a small stain on the floor. In the process, it
sometimes would get the interface module that EI uses wet and sometimes
the gage would go to 0 for awhile until it dried out. Plus, if I ever
smell fuel it the cabin I'd like it to be an unusual event.
Additionally, at t! he time EI sent their interface module with ring
terminals so you had to cut them off and install a BNC connector but I
think now you can get the modules with either ring terminals or a BNC
installed when you buy them. I can tell you I prosealed the hell out of
the wires, connector, and anything else I thought might possibly leak
but somehow something let gas out of the tank when it was full. I stress
that this is not usually the case but several others have reported the
problem.
My fix involved filling the hole left by the BNC bulkhead connector with
a presealed 3/8" bolt with SAE washers on each side of the tank
bulkhead. For the electrical connection, I drilled a 1/4" hole. From
Lowe's I bought a nylon spacer 1/2" long, 1/4" OD and .140" ID. I
drilled the ID out to #19 so a No. 8 screw would go through it. I stuck
this spacer through the 1/4" hole and on each side of it I put a 1/4"
thick nylon spacer, 1/2" OD, .257" ID. I used a threaded No. 8-32 rod
and used ring terminals on both the inside wire and the EI interface
module. I put lots of proseal around and used some no. 8 brass washers
to help compress the large nylon spacers against the tank bulkhead. So
far I'm very happy. It's possible that larger nylon spacers are
available so the same arrangement could have been done using the old
hole that the BNC connector was in and I could have avoided drilling a
new 1/4" hole. BTW, the only reason Vans uses a BNC connector is because
they wanted a lo! cking connector and that setup worked well for many
builders.
It wasn't that hard to get the tank off (about 2 hours) and a little
less to get it back on but I was very happy I had cleaned up the edges
of the lightening holes. I thought about the air ratchet but didn't want
to buy any more tools. All I'm saying is don't put stuff that covers up
access to those bolts when you run wires, pitot lines, whatever.
Albert Gardner
RV-9A 872RV
Yuma, AZ
----- Original Message -----
From: Repucci, Bill
Subject: RE: Re: RV9-List: wires in wings
Albert,
What kind of problem did you have with the BNC connector and what did
you do to fix it?
I am riveting up my first (left) wing and there is a leak out of the
center of the BNC connector that I have tired to seal twice. (and think
I might have it fixed but I'm not sure yet.) Van's told me to clean the
wire and connector, rough them up, and COVER them with proseal.
As for the wire, I cut the holes to install Van's conduit and will
probably continue to install it in both wings. Your comments about
removing the tanks after the bottom skin is installed frightens me a
bit.
Bill R.
==
direct advertising on the Matronics Forums.
==
==
==
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "John Oliveira" <oliveira(at)frontiernet.net> |
| Subject: | Re: wires in wings |
The hardest job on th whole plane so far for me was riveting the bottom wing
skins to the trailing edge spar. Be careful of where you put your conduit.
the solid tubing may interfere with your ability to get your arm in there to
do the riveting.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Terry Hobert" <terhobey(at)hotmail.com>
Subject: Re: RV9-List: wires in wings
>
> Thanks for the tip, I think I will replace the ty wraps with adel clamps.
> It wasn't really much work and I kept the conduit toward the trailing edge
> and toward the top skin. It is weel clear of the inspection openings and
> the aileron bellcrank. I had wondered about the ty wraps wearing and had
> figured my tech counciler may have me change them. That's why I've left
the
> bottom skins off and figured I won't button the wings all up until alittle
> before mounting them.
> Thanks again,
> Terry 9A fuselage
>
>
> >From: "Albert Gardner" <spudnut(at)worldnet.att.net>
> >Reply-To: rv9-list(at)matronics.com
> >To:
> >Subject: Re: RV9-List: wires in wings
> >Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2004 10:39:05 -0700
> >
> >
> >This is a point to consider. Also, when I had to remove my left wing tank
> >last week to fix a leak at the BNC connector that always bothered me, I
> >found that access to the tank bolts that go through the spar was hampered
> >somewhat by the locations I had chosen for the pitot and static lines. If
> >you run wire conduit think about reaching in through a inspection hole,
> >then
> >through the lightening hole to remove those bolts. The worst one is the
> >inboard set that lies between the closely spaced ribs.
> >Remember all those times you cussed auto engineers for the maintenance
> >difficulties that they built into their designs?
> >Albert Gardner
> >RV-9A 872RV
> >Yuma, AZ
> >
> >----- Original Message -----
> >From: "John Oliveira" <oliveira(at)frontiernet.net>
> > > Terry, that sounds like a lot of work. I used the snap bushings in
Vans
> > > catalogue. They snap in to slightly enlarged holes. 10 seconds per
> >hole.
> > > Just run the wires. Don't need the conduit to run additional wires for
> >the
> > > future as you can reach the whole wing through inspection port, tips,
or
> > > root. Simple, cheap, less work, made for the job.
> > >
> > > John Oliveira
> >
> >
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Sargentclt(at)cs.com |
| Subject: | Re: wires in wings |
Bill, what method are you using to test the tanks.
Tad
"Bill Repucci" wrote:
>
>Albert,
>
>Thanks for the info. I need to wait another week before retesting my
>tank as my shop is cold, 59 most days, so the proseal will take some
>time to set.
>
>Bill
>RV-9
>SN: 90737
>N941WR (Reserved)
>Riveting Left top wing skins in place.
>
>-----Original Message-----
>From: owner-rv9-list-server(at)matronics.com
>[mailto:owner-rv9-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Albert Gardner
>To: rv9-list(at)matronics.com; bill(at)repucci.com
>Subject: Re: Re: RV9-List: wires in wings
>
>
>-->
>
>RE: Re: RV9-List: wires in wingsBill, I'm going to reply to the list
>since it might be useful info for someone else.
>
>The problem with the BNC bulkhead connector leaking at the center pin
>has been an issue only for some. I was aware of this and bought a BNC
>connector from DigiKey made for a pressure bulkhead. I anticipated that
>because it was made for a pressure bulkhead there would not be a leakage
>problem. The right tank connector did not leak but the left one would
>ooze a few drops of fuel when the tank was full enough to put fuel
>against the connector. It probably needed a small amount of pressure
>also but it left a stain and also caused a larger problem. I use EI
>gages (EI is a great co. to work with and I love the gages especially
>the fuel computer) and the fuel would work its way down the wires and
>into the cabin leaving a small stain on the floor. In the process, it
>sometimes would get the interface module that EI uses wet and sometimes
>the gage would go to 0 for awhile until it dried out. Plus, if I ever
>smell fuel it the cabin I'd like it to be an unusual event.
>Additionally, at t! he time EI sent their interface module with ring
>terminals so you had to cut them off and install a BNC connector but I
>think now you can get the modules with either ring terminals or a BNC
>installed when you buy them. I can tell you I prosealed the hell out of
>the wires, connector, and anything else I thought might possibly leak
>but somehow something let gas out of the tank when it was full. I stress
>that this is not usually the case but several others have reported the
>problem.
>
>My fix involved filling the hole left by the BNC bulkhead connector with
>a presealed 3/8" bolt with SAE washers on each side of the tank
>bulkhead. For the electrical connection, I drilled a 1/4" hole. From
>Lowe's I bought a nylon spacer 1/2" long, 1/4" OD and .140" ID. I
>drilled the ID out to #19 so a No. 8 screw would go through it. I stuck
>this spacer through the 1/4" hole and on each side of it I put a 1/4"
>thick nylon spacer, 1/2" OD, .257" ID. I used a threaded No. 8-32 rod
>and used ring terminals on both the inside wire and the EI interface
>module. I put lots of proseal around and used some no. 8 brass washers
>to help compress the large nylon spacers against the tank bulkhead. So
>far I'm very happy. It's possible that larger nylon spacers are
>available so the same arrangement could have been done using the old
>hole that the BNC connector was in and I could have avoided drilling a
>new 1/4" hole. BTW, the only reason Vans uses a BNC connector is because
>they wanted a lo! cking connector and that setup worked well for many
>builders.
>
>It wasn't that hard to get the tank off (about 2 hours) and a little
>less to get it back on but I was very happy I had cleaned up the edges
>of the lightening holes. I thought about the air ratchet but didn't want
>to buy any more tools. All I'm saying is don't put stuff that covers up
>access to those bolts when you run wires, pitot lines, whatever.
>
>Albert Gardner
>RV-9A 872RV
>Yuma, AZ
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: Repucci, Bill
> Subject: RE: Re: RV9-List: wires in wings
> Albert,
> What kind of problem did you have with the BNC connector and what did
>you do to fix it?
> I am riveting up my first (left) wing and there is a leak out of the
>center of the BNC connector that I have tired to seal twice. (and think
>I might have it fixed but I'm not sure yet.) Van's told me to clean the
>wire and connector, rough them up, and COVER them with proseal.
> As for the wire, I cut the holes to install Van's conduit and will
>probably continue to install it in both wings. Your comments about
>removing the tanks after the bottom skin is installed frightens me a
>bit.
>
> Bill R.
>
>
>==
>direct advertising on the Matronics Forums.
>==
>==
>==
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Terry Hobert" <terhobey(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | Re: wires in wings |
Thanks, I used the flex tubing that Van's offers. I didn't want it to be
solid and I did want the ability to flex it around exactly for the reasons
you bring up. This can prevent damaging wires that aren't in a conduit when
maintenance or mods are made in the future. That is another reason I used
the existing lightening holes was to keep the flex conduit away from where
the shop heads of rivets will be. I never felt right about the one ty wrap
around the rib (it would contact the edge of the lightening hole) so I am
changing those to a very small SS eye bolt and it will attach to the #40
hole I had drilled back from the lightening hole edge. Of course the hole
will be increased to the diameter of a 6/32 screw. this way the wrap arounf
the doubled flex conduit will be held by the smooth radius of the eye. I
didn't attach to every single rib either, I attached only enough for
adequate support.
Terry 9A fuselage
>From: "John Oliveira" <oliveira(at)frontiernet.net>
>Reply-To: rv9-list(at)matronics.com
>To:
>Subject: Re: RV9-List: wires in wings
>Date: Wed, 3 Mar 2004 06:09:14 -0500
>
>
>The hardest job on th whole plane so far for me was riveting the bottom
>wing
>skins to the trailing edge spar. Be careful of where you put your conduit.
>the solid tubing may interfere with your ability to get your arm in there
>to
>do the riveting.
>
>
>----- Original Message -----
>From: "Terry Hobert" <terhobey(at)hotmail.com>
>To:
>Subject: Re: RV9-List: wires in wings
>
>
> >
> > Thanks for the tip, I think I will replace the ty wraps with adel
>clamps.
> > It wasn't really much work and I kept the conduit toward the trailing
>edge
> > and toward the top skin. It is weel clear of the inspection openings
>and
> > the aileron bellcrank. I had wondered about the ty wraps wearing and
>had
> > figured my tech counciler may have me change them. That's why I've left
>the
> > bottom skins off and figured I won't button the wings all up until
>alittle
> > before mounting them.
> > Thanks again,
> > Terry 9A fuselage
> >
> >
> > >From: "Albert Gardner" <spudnut(at)worldnet.att.net>
> > >Reply-To: rv9-list(at)matronics.com
> > >To:
> > >Subject: Re: RV9-List: wires in wings
> > >Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2004 10:39:05 -0700
> > >
>
> > >
> > >This is a point to consider. Also, when I had to remove my left wing
>tank
> > >last week to fix a leak at the BNC connector that always bothered me, I
> > >found that access to the tank bolts that go through the spar was
>hampered
> > >somewhat by the locations I had chosen for the pitot and static lines.
>If
> > >you run wire conduit think about reaching in through a inspection hole,
> > >then
> > >through the lightening hole to remove those bolts. The worst one is the
> > >inboard set that lies between the closely spaced ribs.
> > >Remember all those times you cussed auto engineers for the maintenance
> > >difficulties that they built into their designs?
> > >Albert Gardner
> > >RV-9A 872RV
> > >Yuma, AZ
> > >
> > >----- Original Message -----
> > >From: "John Oliveira" <oliveira(at)frontiernet.net>
> > > > Terry, that sounds like a lot of work. I used the snap bushings in
>Vans
> > > > catalogue. They snap in to slightly enlarged holes. 10 seconds per
> > >hole.
> > > > Just run the wires. Don't need the conduit to run additional wires
>for
> > >the
> > > > future as you can reach the whole wing through inspection port,
>tips,
>or
> > > > root. Simple, cheap, less work, made for the job.
> > > >
> > > > John Oliveira
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
>
>
Frustrated with dial-up? Lightning-fast Internet access for as low as
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Stein Bruch" <stein(at)steinair.com> |
"Rv8-List" , "Rv9-List" ,
"Rv-List"
| Subject: | Quick Fit Tabs for Ground Blocks |
Hi Guys,
Just a quick update. Awhile back people were looking for the ground block
tabs separate from fuse blocks and pre-made ground blocks.
I now have several hundred in stock. They have 10 tabs, (2 double rows of
5), are the 1/4 faston, with holes for mounting to a brass bar, bulkhead,
etc..
Basically, you can "roll your own" ground blocks now, and it's much cheaper
than buying one already made. I thought about making ground blocks, but it's
easier just to sell the tabs, and let the builder make their own if they
like.
They are listed under "Accessories" on my website. Also, under switches
you'll see some new Vinyl Toggle switch boots in 6 colors. They really dress
up the switches nice!
Last thing.....I now have all the 4 conductor shielded wire in stock for the
Dynon Harnesses, and all harnesses/kits from this point forward will be
delivered with Shielded wire as standard.
Happy building and have a great day.
Cheers,
Stein Bruch
http://www.steinair.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | dralle(at)matronics.com (Matt Dralle) |
DNA: not not archive
| Subject: | [PLEASE READ] Virus Laden Spam Purports To Be From Matronics... |
Dear Listers,
First let me say that I normally don't condone the sharing of warnings
about Internet viruses on the Matronics Email Lists. I don't want to
start a storm of discussion regarding computer viruses on the Lists, so
please just note the information below and refrain from commenting to
the List. The circumstances I describe below are disturbing enough
that I felt an explanation is necessary. That being said...
There is a new email-bourne virus running rampant on the Internet that
is cleverly disguising itself as legitimate email warning of such
things as:
"your email account is disabled because of unauthorized access"
"Some of our clients complained about the spam (negative e-mail
content) outgoing from your e-mail account"
"Probably, you have been infected by a proxy-relay trojan server. In
order to keep your computer safe, follow the instructions."
"Our main mailing server will be temporary unavailable for next two
days, to continue receiving mail in these days you have to
configure our free auto-forwarding service."
All of these messages include an attachment that you are instructed to
click upon to "Get more information", "clean the virus from your
system", or "check your system for infections".
These enclosures all contain a virus that will infect your system and
propagate even more copies of the original message.
The disturbing part of these messages is that they appear to be coming
from very legitimate addresses and have very legitimate, convincing
dialog. For example, I have received a number of them today that
appear to be from "support(at)matronics.com", "management(at)matronics.com",
"administration(at)matronics.com", and "staff(at)matronics.com".
The text of the messages seems believable enough, and given the forged
source address, seem even more legitimate.
Please be assured that no one at Matronics.com will be sending you
these kinds of messages. If you receive one, it is a spam/virus that
has forged headers and was sent to you from someone other than
Matronics. Delete the message and the attachment promptly. Invest in
a copy of Norton Antivirus and keep the definitions up dated on a daily
basis.
Again, I want to stress that I *DO NOT* want a big discussion of
viruses on the Matronics Email Lists. Please do not reply to this
email with any comments. You may write to me directly at
dralle(at)matronics.com if you wish, but do not include the List.
Since many of these appear to come from matronics.com, I wanted to
assure everyone that Matronics wasn't the real source of these messages.
Let's be careful out there and keep those virus definitions up to date!
Today alone, the Matronics spam filter and virus blocking appliance
has filtered out 11,550 spam messages and 375 viruses! That's just in
an 18 hour period!
Best regards,
Matt Dralle
Matronics Email List Administrator
--
Matt G. Dralle | Matronics | P.O. Box 347 | Livermore | CA | 94551
925-606-1001 Voice | 925-606-6281 FAX | dralle(at)matronics.com Email
http://www.matronics.com/ W.W.W. | Featuring Products For Aircraft
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "rob" <edmist_r(at)bellsouth.net> |
"Rv8-List" , "Rv9-List" ,
"Rv-List"
________________________________________________________________________________
"Rv8-List" , "Rv9-List" ,
"Rv-List"
| From: | George Frost <ghfrost(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | Mag impulse assembly |
I need an impulse assembly for a slick magneto, part number M3529.
Anyone have an extra one for sale or can suggest a source? AC Spruce
is out of stock.
George
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | G B <microsys(at)alltel.net> |
Hello all,
Just received my empennage kit for an RV-9.
I have built most of a LongEz and also have a Dragonfly which was
damaged (not by me), and I am
repairing it.
I live in southwest GA in Moultrie. There are several RV owners here,
and a couple
builders. There is an RV-9 builder about 40 miles from here,
thankfully, and he has a grass
strip.
Anyway, would like to hear from others around me. I hope to make Sun N Fun.
Any advice for someone new to RV's and metal construction welcome.
I design electronics and write software for a living.
Thanks,
Glen Bankston
WB4ZNW
N12LZ
N556DF
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Sargentclt(at)cs.com |
When dimpling the skins, strike the die one time with a 12oz. hammer smartly
tad s.
G B wrote:
>
>Hello all,
>
>Just received my empennage kit for an RV-9.
>
>I have built most of a LongEz and also have a Dragonfly which was
>damaged (not by me), and I am
>repairing it.
>
>I live in southwest GA in Moultrie. There are several RV owners here,
>and a couple
>builders. There is an RV-9 builder about 40 miles from here,
>thankfully, and he has a grass
>strip.
>
>Anyway, would like to hear from others around me. I hope to make Sun N Fun.
>Any advice for someone new to RV's and metal construction welcome.
>
>I design electronics and write software for a living.
>
>Thanks,
>
>Glen Bankston
>WB4ZNW
>N12LZ
>N556DF
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Gerry Filby <gerf(at)gerf.com> |
Don't try to save money on the toolkit - buy the whole package
from Avery or Cleveland - you're going to need them all anyway,
and you'll spend a lot more money if you have to have something
rush delivered so you can keep working. The extra long and
double offset air gun set for 470 rivets will really help in
certain corners of the Horiz Stab.
g
>
>
> Hello all,
>
> Just received my empennage kit for an RV-9.
>
> I have built most of a LongEz and also have a Dragonfly which was
> damaged (not by me), and I am
> repairing it.
>
> I live in southwest GA in Moultrie. There are several RV owners here,
> and a couple
> builders. There is an RV-9 builder about 40 miles from here,
> thankfully, and he has a grass
> strip.
>
> Anyway, would like to hear from others around me. I hope to
> make Sun N Fun.
> Any advice for someone new to RV's and metal construction welcome.
>
> I design electronics and write software for a living.
>
> Thanks,
>
> Glen Bankston
> WB4ZNW
> N12LZ
> N556DF
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
--
RV-9 #90842
==========================================================
Gerry Filby gerf(at)gerf.com
Home (415) 239 4846
Cell (415) 203 9177
________________________________________________________________________________
My buddy and I also recently purchased the RV-9A empenage kit and we are scheduled
to build the entire kit at the Alexander Technical Center down in Griffin
GA. We are going to the March 29th - April 3rd class and should have our complete
Tail Kit finished by that weekend. We are new to sheetmetal buidling and homebuilts
but truly love the Rv's.
Here is a brief review of the course:
This 5-7 day program will help the new RV builder in the following ways:
Build your entire tail assembly in our climate controlled sheet metal shop in
less than 1 week
Learn basic sheet metal construction under the supervision of our professional
instructors
Work with our tools so you will know what you need before you spend a lot of money
on unnecessary equipment
Gain a level of confidence while working with our instructors that will carry
over as you build the rest of the airplane in your workshop
Learn how to read aircraft building instructions and plans
In a few days you will develop the skills necessary to complete the remainder
of the airplane
We will help you start the builder's log for your RV
You can get more information on the Alexaner Tech Center at http://www.buildtofly.com/
Good Luck with your buidling.....
Richard Hebert
PCS: 678-860-3656
This email is confidential and T-Mobile Proprietary. It's contents are Attorney/Client
privileged information. You may not read, copy or distribute it's contents
unless you are the intended recipient.
-----Original Message-----
From: Gerry Filby [mailto:gerf(at)gerf.com]
Subject: Re: RV9-List: newbie
Don't try to save money on the toolkit - buy the whole package
from Avery or Cleveland - you're going to need them all anyway,
and you'll spend a lot more money if you have to have something
rush delivered so you can keep working. The extra long and
double offset air gun set for 470 rivets will really help in
certain corners of the Horiz Stab.
g
>
>
> Hello all,
>
> Just received my empennage kit for an RV-9.
>
> I have built most of a LongEz and also have a Dragonfly which was
> damaged (not by me), and I am
> repairing it.
>
> I live in southwest GA in Moultrie. There are several RV owners here,
> and a couple
> builders. There is an RV-9 builder about 40 miles from here,
> thankfully, and he has a grass
> strip.
>
> Anyway, would like to hear from others around me. I hope to
> make Sun N Fun.
> Any advice for someone new to RV's and metal construction welcome.
>
> I design electronics and write software for a living.
>
> Thanks,
>
> Glen Bankston
> WB4ZNW
> N12LZ
> N556DF
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
--
RV-9 #90842
==========================================================
Gerry Filby gerf(at)gerf.com
Home (415) 239 4846
Cell (415) 203 9177
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Bill Repucci" <bill(at)repucci.com> |
Sounds like you are off to a good start already by looking up who else
in your area is building an RV.
Set aside cash to buy tools! The real shock to me has been the monthly
tool purchases. I have allocated about $200 a month for tools and that
was after I bought all the basic tools.
In short, get the CORRECT tool for the job you are about to undertake.
Don't try and make something work, you will only bugger up parts.
Also, don't get discouraged by mistakes, you can always buy new parts
and the best part is, the 2nd or 3rd part you make will come out
perfect. (I had to buy two HS skins and three HS nose ribs before I got
it right.)
Bill R.
SN: 90737
450 hours & riveting the top wing skins on the first wing.
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv9-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv9-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Hebert,
Richard
Subject: RE: RV9-List: newbie
--> <Richard.Hebert@T-Mobile.com>
My buddy and I also recently purchased the RV-9A empenage kit and we are
scheduled to build the entire kit at the Alexander Technical Center down
in Griffin GA. We are going to the March 29th - April 3rd class and
should have our complete Tail Kit finished by that weekend. We are new
to sheetmetal buidling and homebuilts but truly love the Rv's. Here is a
brief review of the course: This 5-7 day program will help the new RV
builder in the following ways: Build your entire tail assembly in our
climate controlled sheet metal shop in less than 1 week
Learn basic sheet metal construction under the supervision of our
professional instructors
Work with our tools so you will know what you need before you spend a
lot of money on unnecessary equipment
Gain a level of confidence while working with our instructors that will
carry over as you build the rest of the airplane in your workshop
Learn how to read aircraft building instructions and plans
In a few days you will develop the skills necessary to complete the
remainder of the airplane
We will help you start the builder's log for your RV
You can get more information on the Alexaner Tech Center at
http://www.buildtofly.com/
Good Luck with your buidling.....
Richard Hebert
PCS: 678-860-3656
This email is confidential and T-Mobile Proprietary. It's contents are
Attorney/Client privileged information. You may not read, copy or
distribute it's contents unless you are the intended recipient.
-----Original Message-----
From: Gerry Filby [mailto:gerf(at)gerf.com]
Subject: Re: RV9-List: newbie
Don't try to save money on the toolkit - buy the whole package
from Avery or Cleveland - you're going to need them all anyway,
and you'll spend a lot more money if you have to have something
rush delivered so you can keep working. The extra long and
double offset air gun set for 470 rivets will really help in
certain corners of the Horiz Stab.
g
>
>
> Hello all,
>
> Just received my empennage kit for an RV-9.
>
> I have built most of a LongEz and also have a Dragonfly which was
> damaged (not by me), and I am
> repairing it.
>
> I live in southwest GA in Moultrie. There are several RV owners here,
> and a couple
> builders. There is an RV-9 builder about 40 miles from here,
> thankfully, and he has a grass
> strip.
>
> Anyway, would like to hear from others around me. I hope to
> make Sun N Fun.
> Any advice for someone new to RV's and metal construction welcome.
>
> I design electronics and write software for a living.
>
> Thanks,
>
> Glen Bankston
> WB4ZNW
> N12LZ
> N556DF
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
--
RV-9 #90842 ==========================================================
Gerry Filby gerf(at)gerf.com
Home (415) 239 4846
Cell (415) 203 9177
==
direct advertising on the Matronics Forums.
==
==
==
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Bill Repucci" <bill(at)repucci.com> |
I thought I would forward this on for the others to follow. The picture
should help everyone understand how to get good dimples and as Tad said,
us a good hammer and hit each hole only once and hit it hard.
Bill R.
RV-9
SN: 90737
-----Original Message-----
From: Bill Repucci [mailto:bill(at)repucci.com]
Subject: RE: dimpling
Randy,
Not a problem, the trick is to build some small tables that will rest on
either side of the C frame so the surface is level or just a little
above the height of the dimple die. If you don't do this you will put
smiley faces around each dimple because the skin isn't level. Then
lower the dimple by hand and hold it down in each hole before hitting it
with the hammer. If you don't do this, there is a good chance you will
miss the hole and punch a new one in the wrong place. (Don't ask how I
know this!)
See the picture on my web site:
http://www.repucci.com/bill/images/Dimpling%20the%20left%20HS%20skin001.
jpg
This should help explain how it works.
Bill R.
-----Original Message-----
From: Randy [mailto:rer51(at)lincsat.com]
Subject: dimpling
I am also a newbie. I have the hs to the point of dimpling and
riveting. I have looked at the dimpler riveter, and I am absolutely
perplexed on how to use it without damaging the other surface of the hs
skins. It appears that the stand would sit directly on the other
surface while dimpling the one side. I am a retired tool and die guy,
and this apparatus isn't logical to me. I looks like it would work on
the edges, but on the deep parts where the skin curves... HELP!!! Randy
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Bill Repucci" <bill(at)repucci.com> |
Randy and others,
One other thing, my work table.
I built it out of 2x4's with a 4x8 foot sheet of 3/4" particle board
rabbited into it so the edges of the particle board are protected by the
edge of the 2x4's. There are 2x4 "joists" 12 inch on center under the
particle board surface and it has six legs for stability. You can dance
on this thing and it won't move. Here's a picture:
http://www.repucci.com/bill/images/HS%20Spar%20
<http://www.repucci.com/bill/images/HS%20Spar%20&%20Ribs%20-%20Fitting%2
0and%20drilling014.jpg> &%20Ribs%20-%20Fitting%20and%20drilling014.jpg
The real beauty of it is the particle board surface, when match drilling
parts you can drill right into the surface and cleco your parts down.
When you completely trash the surface, the particle board will lift
right out and a replacement sheet will drop in, no screws or tools
required.
The other tip I would suggest is to build a painting table using chicken
wire, this will keep the paint from blowing back in your face or on the
parts. Here is a picture of my trim tab parts on the table waiting to
be primed:
http://www.repucci.com/bill/images/Trim%20tab%20and%20Eleveator%20traili
ng%20edge%20waiting%20to%20get%20primed001.jpg Since this picture was
taken, I've added a rack so I can suspend parts above it.
I sure hope all this helps.
Bill
RV-9
SN: 90737
-----Original Message-----
From: Randy [mailto:rer51(at)lincsat.com]
Subject: dimpling
I am also a newbie. I have the hs to the point of dimpling and
riveting. I have looked at the dimpler riveter, and I am absolutely
perplexed on how to use it without damaging the other surface of the hs
skins. It appears that the stand would sit directly on the other
surface while dimpling the one side. I am a retired tool and die guy,
and this apparatus isn't logical to me. I looks like it would work on
the edges, but on the deep parts where the skin curves... HELP!!! Randy
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "MICK MULLER" <MULLERPHARM(at)bigpond.com> |
| Subject: | Fw: priming wing ribs |
> Greetings fellow builders,
> After aloding my wing ribs, I am about to prime them. The question I have
> is, should I rivet them onto the wing spar, and then prime the spar and
ribs
> together, or prime them beforehand?. The reason I am thinking thus is that
> by priming after fitting the ribs, I can fit the skins, drill out and
dimple
> the holes in the rib flanges and prime over the screw dimples in the wing
> spar flanges. Is there a problem with priming directly over the alodized
> spar?
> Thanks,
> Mick Muller
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Stein Bruch" <stein(at)steinair.com> |
| Subject: | Fw: priming wing ribs |
OK,
I guess my question would be if you alodined the ribs and the spar is
anodized, why are you bothering priming??
Alodine and Anodize are both corrosion protectents by their very nature, so
IMHO priming over alodined/anodized parts is redundant at best.
Cheers,
Stein Bruch
RV6's, Minneapolis (Alodnied ribs, and bulkheads).
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv9-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv9-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of MICK MULLER
Subject: RV9-List: Fw: priming wing ribs
> Greetings fellow builders,
> After aloding my wing ribs, I am about to prime them. The question I have
> is, should I rivet them onto the wing spar, and then prime the spar and
ribs
> together, or prime them beforehand?. The reason I am thinking thus is that
> by priming after fitting the ribs, I can fit the skins, drill out and
dimple
> the holes in the rib flanges and prime over the screw dimples in the wing
> spar flanges. Is there a problem with priming directly over the alodized
> spar?
> Thanks,
> Mick Muller
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Bill Repucci" <bill(at)repucci.com> |
| Subject: | Fw: priming wing ribs |
Mick,
I would do them off the spar so they are fully covered.
I am priming over alodined/anodized, I call it my belt, suspenders, and
duct tape approach to corrosion protection. Plus, I hope to put my RV-9
on floats sometime in the future so the extra protection should hurt a
bit.
Bill
RV-9
SN: 90737
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv9-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv9-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Stein Bruch
Subject: RE: RV9-List: Fw: priming wing ribs
OK,
I guess my question would be if you alodined the ribs and the spar is
anodized, why are you bothering priming??
Alodine and Anodize are both corrosion protectents by their very nature,
so IMHO priming over alodined/anodized parts is redundant at best.
Cheers,
Stein Bruch
RV6's, Minneapolis (Alodnied ribs, and bulkheads).
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv9-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv9-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of MICK MULLER
Subject: RV9-List: Fw: priming wing ribs
> Greetings fellow builders,
> After aloding my wing ribs, I am about to prime them. The question I
> have is, should I rivet them onto the wing spar, and then prime the
> spar and
ribs
> together, or prime them beforehand?. The reason I am thinking thus is
> that by priming after fitting the ribs, I can fit the skins, drill out
> and
dimple
> the holes in the rib flanges and prime over the screw dimples in the
> wing spar flanges. Is there a problem with priming directly over the
> alodized spar? Thanks,
> Mick Muller
>
==
direct advertising on the Matronics Forums.
==
==
==
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Randy" <rer51(at)lincsat.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Fw: priming wing ribs |
Your help is invaluable. Thanks for the great tips. I will watch your
progress. Randy Russell Ontario, Canada
----- Original Message -----
From: "Bill Repucci" <bill(at)repucci.com>
Subject: RE: RV9-List: Fw: priming wing ribs
>
> Mick,
>
> I would do them off the spar so they are fully covered.
>
> I am priming over alodined/anodized, I call it my belt, suspenders, and
> duct tape approach to corrosion protection. Plus, I hope to put my RV-9
> on floats sometime in the future so the extra protection should hurt a
> bit.
>
> Bill
> RV-9
> SN: 90737
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-rv9-list-server(at)matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-rv9-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Stein Bruch
> To: rv9-list(at)matronics.com
> Subject: RE: RV9-List: Fw: priming wing ribs
>
>
> OK,
>
> I guess my question would be if you alodined the ribs and the spar is
> anodized, why are you bothering priming??
>
> Alodine and Anodize are both corrosion protectents by their very nature,
> so IMHO priming over alodined/anodized parts is redundant at best.
>
> Cheers,
> Stein Bruch
> RV6's, Minneapolis (Alodnied ribs, and bulkheads).
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-rv9-list-server(at)matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-rv9-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of MICK MULLER
> To: rv9-list(at)matronics.com
> Subject: RV9-List: Fw: priming wing ribs
>
>
> > Greetings fellow builders,
> > After aloding my wing ribs, I am about to prime them. The question I
> > have is, should I rivet them onto the wing spar, and then prime the
> > spar and
> ribs
> > together, or prime them beforehand?. The reason I am thinking thus is
> > that by priming after fitting the ribs, I can fit the skins, drill out
>
> > and
> dimple
> > the holes in the rib flanges and prime over the screw dimples in the
> > wing spar flanges. Is there a problem with priming directly over the
> > alodized spar? Thanks,
> > Mick Muller
> >
>
>
> ==
> direct advertising on the Matronics Forums.
> ==
> ==
> ==
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "MICK MULLER" <MULLERPHARM(at)bigpond.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Fw: priming wing ribs |
Yep, couldn't agree more. I figure priming over alodining/anodising can't
hurt. I will still prime over them.
Mick Muller
----- Original Message -----
From: "Randy" <rer51(at)lincsat.com>
Subject: Re: RV9-List: Fw: priming wing ribs
>
> Your help is invaluable. Thanks for the great tips. I will watch your
> progress. Randy Russell Ontario, Canada
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Bill Repucci" <bill(at)repucci.com>
> To:
> Subject: RE: RV9-List: Fw: priming wing ribs
>
>
> >
> > Mick,
> >
> > I would do them off the spar so they are fully covered.
> >
> > I am priming over alodined/anodized, I call it my belt, suspenders, and
> > duct tape approach to corrosion protection. Plus, I hope to put my RV-9
> > on floats sometime in the future so the extra protection should hurt a
> > bit.
> >
> > Bill
> > RV-9
> > SN: 90737
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: owner-rv9-list-server(at)matronics.com
> > [mailto:owner-rv9-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Stein Bruch
> > To: rv9-list(at)matronics.com
> > Subject: RE: RV9-List: Fw: priming wing ribs
> >
> >
> >
> > OK,
> >
> > I guess my question would be if you alodined the ribs and the spar is
> > anodized, why are you bothering priming??
> >
> > Alodine and Anodize are both corrosion protectents by their very nature,
> > so IMHO priming over alodined/anodized parts is redundant at best.
> >
> > Cheers,
> > Stein Bruch
> > RV6's, Minneapolis (Alodnied ribs, and bulkheads).
> >
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: owner-rv9-list-server(at)matronics.com
> > [mailto:owner-rv9-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of MICK MULLER
> > To: rv9-list(at)matronics.com
> > Subject: RV9-List: Fw: priming wing ribs
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > > Greetings fellow builders,
> > > After aloding my wing ribs, I am about to prime them. The question I
> > > have is, should I rivet them onto the wing spar, and then prime the
> > > spar and
> > ribs
> > > together, or prime them beforehand?. The reason I am thinking thus is
> > > that by priming after fitting the ribs, I can fit the skins, drill out
> >
> > > and
> > dimple
> > > the holes in the rib flanges and prime over the screw dimples in the
> > > wing spar flanges. Is there a problem with priming directly over the
> > > alodized spar? Thanks,
> > > Mick Muller
> > >
> >
> >
> > ==
> > direct advertising on the Matronics Forums.
> > ==
> > ==
> > ==
> >
> >
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Roger Crandell" <rwc000(at)hotmail.com> |
rv8-list(at)matronics.com, rv9-list(at)matronics.com
Can anyone recommend a source for a two port (two transducer) manifold?
Van's sells a three port unit, but I only need two ports. I could cut off
one port on the Van's unit, but would rather not do that.
Thanks Roger Crandell
Get business advice and resources to improve your work life, from bCentral.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | tchoug(at)micron.com |
I also built a five legged workbench with a built in recess for the
C-frame. The fifth leg is directly under the C-frame to provide support
for the pounding that it will take. It also has a sacrificial work
surface that can be drilled into and clecod to also.
Here's a tip when using the C-frame for dimpling . . . It sounds like
some people are dimpling with the face (outside surface) up which
requires careful alignment and holding the male dimple die in the hole
by hand. I've always dimpled with the face down and the male die in the
bottom of the C-frame. You simply slide the sheet over the male die and
let it protrude through the hole. Then you can strike the dimple without
having to hold the dies in alignment. With this method I generally use
two hits to form a good dimple. The first is a lighter hit that forms
70-80% of the dimple and is less likely to cause radial cracks in the
aluminum. The second hit is firmer and forms a nice clean dimple.
Todd Houg
Fuselage just about ready to flip right side up!
-----Original Message-----
From: Bill Repucci [mailto:bill(at)repucci.com]
Subject: RV9-List: FW: dimpling
I thought I would forward this on for the others to follow. The picture
should help everyone understand how to get good dimples and as Tad said,
us a good hammer and hit each hole only once and hit it hard.
Bill R.
RV-9
SN: 90737
-----Original Message-----
From: Bill Repucci [mailto:bill(at)repucci.com]
Subject: RE: dimpling
Randy,
Not a problem, the trick is to build some small tables that will rest on
either side of the C frame so the surface is level or just a little
above the height of the dimple die. If you don't do this you will put
smiley faces around each dimple because the skin isn't level. Then
lower the dimple by hand and hold it down in each hole before hitting it
with the hammer. If you don't do this, there is a good chance you will
miss the hole and punch a new one in the wrong place. (Don't ask how I
know this!)
See the picture on my web site:
http://www.repucci.com/bill/images/Dimpling%20the%20left%20HS%20skin001.
jpg
This should help explain how it works.
Bill R.
-----Original Message-----
From: Randy [mailto:rer51(at)lincsat.com]
Subject: dimpling
I am also a newbie. I have the hs to the point of dimpling and
riveting. I have looked at the dimpler riveter, and I am absolutely
perplexed on how to use it without damaging the other surface of the hs
skins. It appears that the stand would sit directly on the other
surface while dimpling the one side. I am a retired tool and die guy,
and this apparatus isn't logical to me. I looks like it would work on
the edges, but on the deep parts where the skin curves... HELP!!! Randy
==
direct advertising on the Matronics Forums.
==
==
==
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bill Ervin <n57wc(at)yahoo.com> |
If you haven't bought a C-frame yet check into
Experimentalaero.com, the DRDT-2. Its does great
dimples and makes a lot less noise (None) Its also
easier to control the metal sheet and dimple at the
same time.
Bill
__________________________________
http://search.yahoo.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Richard Tasker <retasker(at)optonline.net> |
| Subject: | Re: FW: dimpling |
tchoug(at)micron.com wrote:
>I've always dimpled with the face down and the male die in the
>bottom of the C-frame. You simply slide the sheet over the male die and
>let it protrude through the hole. Then you can strike the dimple without
>having to hold the dies in alignment. With this method I generally use
>two hits to form a good dimple. The first is a lighter hit that forms
>70-80% of the dimple and is less likely to cause radial cracks in the
>aluminum. The second hit is firmer and forms a nice clean dimple.
>
>
Be careful when doing this without holding the dimple die down. I did
it your way at first and discovered that the male die was not always
centered relative to the female die - causing wear on each die. I
suspect this was due to slight play in the bronze bushing holding the
vertical rod that the female die was in. Also, hitting it any way but
perfectly vertically would guarantee that any play would make the dies
hit slightly off center. If you choose to do it this way, make sure
that there is an absolute minimum amount of clearance between the two
dies - just enough to get the aluminum sheet between them.
Now I still put the male die on the bottom, but I also now hold the dies
together before I make the hit.
Dick Tasker, 90573
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | tchoug(at)micron.com |
That's a good point Dick, I do adjust the slider shaft with the female
die to float just above the work. I have noticed a bit of wear on the
tip of the male die from slightly off center strikes, but nothing that
effects the formation of the dimple. This has worked well for me with
98% of the dimpling behind me now - Yeah!!!
Todd
-----Original Message-----
From: Richard Tasker [mailto:retasker(at)optonline.net]
Subject: Re: RV9-List: FW: dimpling
tchoug(at)micron.com wrote:
>I've always dimpled with the face down and the male die in the bottom
>of the C-frame. You simply slide the sheet over the male die and let it
>protrude through the hole. Then you can strike the dimple without
>having to hold the dies in alignment. With this method I generally use
>two hits to form a good dimple. The first is a lighter hit that forms
>70-80% of the dimple and is less likely to cause radial cracks in the
>aluminum. The second hit is firmer and forms a nice clean dimple.
>
>
Be careful when doing this without holding the dimple die down. I did
it your way at first and discovered that the male die was not always
centered relative to the female die - causing wear on each die. I
suspect this was due to slight play in the bronze bushing holding the
vertical rod that the female die was in. Also, hitting it any way but
perfectly vertically would guarantee that any play would make the dies
hit slightly off center. If you choose to do it this way, make sure
that there is an absolute minimum amount of clearance between the two
dies - just enough to get the aluminum sheet between them.
Now I still put the male die on the bottom, but I also now hold the dies
together before I make the hit.
Dick Tasker, 90573
==
direct advertising on the Matronics Forums.
==
==
==
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | DThomas773(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: FW: dimpling |
I agree with Dick. It is better to bring the dies together with hand
pressure before the hammer comes down. I found also, if you have the male die
on the
bottom, you need to exercise care not to let the aluminum slide over the male
pilot. It will scratch the BeJesus out of your alclad.
Dennis Thomas
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | G B <microsys(at)alltel.net> |
| Subject: | empennage question |
Hello,
I need help right off the bat with the RV-9 empennage!
There are three small holes punched into the HS-907 doubler plate that
are
NOT in the HS-902 front spar. I am assuming that the hole nearest the
center
of the spar is the 'alignment' hole for the two angles I have to make.
What are the two other holes for, or, asked in another way, why are they
not punched through? They look like they are along the top edge of the
spar, not the bottom.
Can you help me clear this up?
Thanks,
Glen
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Paul Eastham <eastham(at)netapp.com> |
| Subject: | Re: empennage question |
Sure you got your doubler flipped the right way? Since there is
one alignment hole for the attach bracket and two rivets above that,
if it's upside down you'll have 3 non-matching holes per half, 6 total.
I honestly don't remember if these were drilled through or not, though.
Check the spars themselves...if every hole in the spar is finding one
in the doubler, I would press on...
Paul
>
> Hello,
>
> I need help right off the bat with the RV-9 empennage!
>
> There are three small holes punched into the HS-907 doubler plate that
> are
> NOT in the HS-902 front spar. I am assuming that the hole nearest the
> center
> of the spar is the 'alignment' hole for the two angles I have to make.
>
> What are the two other holes for, or, asked in another way, why are they
>
> not punched through? They look like they are along the top edge of the
> spar, not the bottom.
>
> Can you help me clear this up?
>
> Thanks,
>
> Glen
>
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Mike Hoover" <mikehoover(at)sc.rr.com> |
| Subject: | Re: empennage question |
Glen,
Seems like I remember a couple of holes not being drilled in the HS spar. I
would recommend studying the drawing carefully and if rivets are called out
for those "undrilled" holes then just match drill them with the existing
doubler plate holes while you have it clecoed on the spar. The rivet
call-outs are tricky here, so it does require careful attention. Hope this
helps.
Mike
SC
90709 wings...left tank...almost ready to install baffle
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | DThomas773(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: empennage question |
Hi Glen,
I did my empennage a long time ago and my memory is not what I'd like it to
be. I do remember, I think, the first thing you actually make is the 2 little
attach angles that attach the stab to the fuselage. I do know that if you
turn the spar upside down, attach the angles on the top rather than the bottom,
they fit but not correctly. That was my first call to tech support. Very
embarrassing. However they didn't laugh, and they did encourage me to call
anytime. I did and they were always helpful. If I give you any advise, it would
be
to do the same. Those guys are really great.
Dennis
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Warren W Hurd <warren(at)ahyup.com> |
| Subject: | Re: empennage question |
Hmmm.....
Take it apart, look at the prints......
put it back together, and it will fit ; )
I have a couple of photos at
http://ahyup.com/drill
Good Luck
Warren
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Steve Sampson" <SSampson.SLN21(at)london.edu> |
| Subject: | Nosewheel fairing |
Two questions regarding the nosewheel and its fairing:
1) I think I have built the fairing to plan however there seems no remaining
room for the jubilee clip (thats english for the band that screws up tight
that I have forgotten the american term for) that holds the noseleg fairing
in place. Is this a common problem?
2) I am a bit surprised how many times I am having to lift the nosewheel off
the ground to get this fairing sorted out. How are others doing this? I cant
lift high enough with the engine hoist. Anyone found a way to grip on the
noseleg without damaging it?
Thanks guys! Steve.
#90360
UK
---
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Nosewheel fairing |
| From: | "Larry PERRYMAN" <larry.perryman(at)atofina.com> |
03/10/2004 07:55:47 PM,
Serialize complete at 03/10/2004 07:55:47 PM
Steve
Try a jack under the firewall.
Regards,
Larry Perryman
"Steve Sampson"
Sent by: owner-rv9-list-server(at)matronics.com
03/10/2004 12:49 PM
Please respond to rv9-list
To:
cc:
Subject: RV9-List: Nosewheel fairing
Two questions regarding the nosewheel and its fairing:
1) I think I have built the fairing to plan however there seems no
remaining
room for the jubilee clip (thats english for the band that screws up tight
that I have forgotten the american term for) that holds the noseleg
fairing
in place. Is this a common problem?
2) I am a bit surprised how many times I am having to lift the nosewheel
off
the ground to get this fairing sorted out. How are others doing this? I
cant
lift high enough with the engine hoist. Anyone found a way to grip on the
noseleg without damaging it?
Thanks guys! Steve.
#90360
UK
---
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "fcs(at)jlc.net" <fcs(at)jlc.net> |
| Subject: | Nosewheel fairing |
Steve, a floor jack with a wooden block across the fuselage at the
firewall does the trick. There's a lot of trial-and-error fitting to get
the wheel pant and fairings right, and not much you can do about it.
The "hose clamp" is to be oriented so that the screw part of the clamp is
behind the nose gear leg. That way it just barely clears the cutout in the
nose wheel pant as you turn the wheel through its travel. Look around and
find a narrow hose clamp.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Albert Gardner" <spudnut(at)worldnet.att.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Nosewheel fairing |
On a completed aircraft it only takes 4 or 5 stone on the empennage (50-70
lbs) to push the tail down. Without the emp. or the wings it's a little
different. Push down on the tail and tie it to the floor, hang a bucket of
sand on it, or put a padded block under the firewall. After it's flying, I
find moving the plane into parking it best accomplished by pushing down on
the HS and pushing it into the tiedown spot rather than pushing on the prop
and trying to steer it into place.
Albert Gardner
RV-9A 872RV
Yuma, AZ
----- Original Message -----
From: "Steve Sampson" <SSampson.SLN21(at)london.edu>
> 2) I am a bit surprised how many times I am having to lift the nosewheel
off
> the ground to get this fairing sorted out. How are others doing this? I
cant
> lift high enough with the engine hoist. Anyone found a way to grip on the
> noseleg without damaging it?
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Andy Karmy <andy(at)karmy.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Nosewheel fairing |
On 1) you use a small hose clamp (that's our term for them) but it must
be fairly narrow to clear everything. The only problem is that mine is
now starting to slip and fall off. Leaving my nose fairing to float
where it will. Not fun. This is not a very elegant solution to mounting
that fairing, but I have not heard of a better one.
For 2) I got rid of the requirement to remove the wheel, by holding the
standoff bracket onto the pants with screws and nutplates instead of
rivets. That way the wheel stays on and you simply bend the rear pant
out a bit to clear the mounting hardware. This has worked great for me
and I have not had to remove the nosewheel now for 170 hours!
- Andy Karmy
andy(at)karmy.com
On Mar 10, 2004, at 10:49 AM, Steve Sampson wrote:
>
>
> Two questions regarding the nosewheel and its fairing:
>
> 1) I think I have built the fairing to plan however there seems no
> remaining
> room for the jubilee clip (thats english for the band that screws up
> tight
> that I have forgotten the american term for) that holds the noseleg
> fairing
> in place. Is this a common problem?
>
> 2) I am a bit surprised how many times I am having to lift the
> nosewheel off
> the ground to get this fairing sorted out. How are others doing this?
> I cant
> lift high enough with the engine hoist. Anyone found a way to grip on
> the
> noseleg without damaging it?
>
> Thanks guys! Steve.
>
> #90360
> UK
>
> ---
>
>
> _-
> =======================================================================
> _-
> =======================================================================
> _-
> =======================================================================
> _-
> =======================================================================
> >
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Steve Sampson" <SSampson.SLN21(at)london.edu> |
| Subject: | Nosewheel fairing |
Thanks guys, your input together with some thinking makes me realise I have
made a mistake and the noseleg was not fully 'relaxed' when i drilled the
forward brackets. Relatively easy to correct.
I dont like the idea of jacking on the firewall. Any reason why I should not
jack on the edge of the sump if I spread the load with a block of wood?
(Albert - I am amazed you can easily get the nose off the ground on the
finished aircraft. Its as heavy as hell right now!)
Thanks all, Steve.
PS Will I EVER get this finished???????
---
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Albert Gardner" <spudnut(at)worldnet.att.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Nosewheel fairing |
Concerning the finished aircraft:
I found at gross weight it's possible to bump the tail tiedown ring when
landing. Fortunately, the rudder doesn't hit, only the tiedown ring. Also,
crawling back into the tail cone on the ground requires the tail be
supported since it wants to tip back. And of course, if your passenger puts
his weight on the step at the same time you do, it will tip back. The
finished aircraft is very easy to maneuver by one person at the tail.
My a/c has an O-320 and during construction I don't remember finding it too
difficult to raise the nose by pushing down on the tail even with the emp
off. It may have taken two of us but I don't think so.
I made no provision for checking tire air pressure with the pants on.
Sometimes I wish I had and sometimes it isn't a big deal.
Albert Gardner
----- Original Message -----
From: "Steve Sampson" <SSampson.SLN21(at)london.edu>
> Thanks guys, your input together with some thinking makes me realise I
have
> made a mistake and the noseleg was not fully 'relaxed' when i drilled the
> forward brackets. Relatively easy to correct.
>
> I dont like the idea of jacking on the firewall. Any reason why I should
not
> jack on the edge of the sump if I spread the load with a block of wood?
>
> (Albert - I am amazed you can easily get the nose off the ground on the
> finished aircraft. Its as heavy as hell right now!)
>
> Thanks all, Steve.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Gary" <rv9(at)3rivers.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Nosewheel fairing |
Steve.......I put a low clearance floor jack under the nose wheel pivot point.
Gary
----- Original Message -----
From: Steve Sampson
To: rv9-list(at)matronics.com
Sent: Thursday, March 11, 2004 12:49 AM
Subject: RE: RV9-List: Nosewheel fairing
Thanks guys, your input together with some thinking makes me realise I have
made a mistake and the noseleg was not fully 'relaxed' when i drilled the
forward brackets. Relatively easy to correct.
I dont like the idea of jacking on the firewall. Any reason why I should not
jack on the edge of the sump if I spread the load with a block of wood?
(Albert - I am amazed you can easily get the nose off the ground on the
finished aircraft. Its as heavy as hell right now!)
Thanks all, Steve.
PS Will I EVER get this finished???????
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | G B <microsys(at)alltel.net> |
Hello,
They say that the only stupid question is one not asked...
In that vein...
There is a wide blue outline on my plywood HS jig. Do I cut on the
inside of the wide mark, or on the
outside? Yes is not a good answer ;-)
Thanks,
Glen
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Mike Hoover" <mikehoover(at)sc.rr.com> |
| Subject: | Re: HS jig block |
Glen,
I can't remember how thick the line is, but I cut mine down the middle. I
had about 1/8" of the mark left on the cut out piece. This is not critical.
The jig is just to hold the skin close to something like the final shape of
the HS leading edge so you don't have to fight it while working with it.
Hope this helps.
Mike
SC
90709 wings...fuel tank - proseal...yeehigh!
----- Original Message -----
From: "G B" <microsys(at)alltel.net>
Subject: RV9-List: HS jig block
>
> Hello,
>
> They say that the only stupid question is one not asked...
>
> In that vein...
>
> There is a wide blue outline on my plywood HS jig. Do I cut on the
> inside of the wide mark, or on the
> outside? Yes is not a good answer ;-)
>
> Thanks,
>
> Glen
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Ernest Kells" <ernest.kells(at)sympatico.ca> |
| Subject: | Re: Nosewheel fairing |
> Concerning the finished aircraft........
> I made no provision for checking tire air pressure with the pants on.
> Sometimes I wish I had and sometimes it isn't a big deal. Albert Gardner
>
This is easy to do when you need a light job to feel good. I bought the
Camloc Access Doors for each wheel pant. See Page 103 of the ACS catalogue
(part # KM713-16-064 - $9.70 for each wheel). Drill a hole perpendicular
to the location of the tire valve. File out the hole until the recess on
the camloc fits in the hole - then drill the two rivet holes.
These camlocs provide a flush surface with the wheel fairing as they are
held snug by the spring. Makes checking your tire pressure and adding air a
fast operation - one hand ! ! You just have to move the airplane until the
valve stems line up with the hole.
Ernest Kells - RV-9A O235-N2C, Wood Prop
90% Complete - electrical, external paint.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Terry Hobert" <terhobey(at)hotmail.com> |
Never dump questions, sometimes I am aprehensive about asking (that human
rejection fear we all have), but it's better to have peace of mind I think.
Anyway, here is a question I sent tech support on the center section of the
fuselage. If it helps others Great. I seem to find myself scratching my
head at alot of steps in this process, I hope it's common to all of us the
first time around.
Question:
Terry Hobert Builder #90680
On the 9A Center Section referencing Dwg 16.
The callout for the rivet for the F-904G Center section vertical bar
is a AN426AD4-14. I used the rivets provided in the bag and the
inventory did indicate they were 14s. Looking at them they do appear to
be 14s.
After drilling, deburring and then driving the rivets - it appears that
the shop head really isn't thick enough to meet the usual standards. I
even drilled them out once and tried re-riveting making sure everything
was tightly clamped up, etc. Same results. Is this only because the
rivets function as to hold the bar in place until the bolts are placed
in final assembly and torqued up? Or should I get some 15 length rivets
and use them?
Answer from Tech Support Vans:
Just leave them, you were right about their function, just there to
hold the bar until the 'real' fasteners go in.... DON't drill them out
again... (:>) Tom
Terry Hobert 9A fuselage
>From: G B <microsys(at)alltel.net>
>Reply-To: rv9-list(at)matronics.com
>To: RV9 List
>Subject: RV9-List: HS jig block
>Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2004 17:31:15 -0500
>
>
>Hello,
>
>They say that the only stupid question is one not asked...
>
>In that vein...
>
>There is a wide blue outline on my plywood HS jig. Do I cut on the
>inside of the wide mark, or on the
>outside? Yes is not a good answer ;-)
>
>Thanks,
>
>Glen
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Richard Tasker <retasker(at)optonline.net> |
| Subject: | Re: HS jig block |
Sheesh.... If you got a shop head at all then yours is better than
mine. I had basically no shop head. I asked Van's as well and got the
same answer.
Dick Tasker, 90573
Terry Hobert wrote:
>
>Never dump questions, sometimes I am aprehensive about asking (that human
>rejection fear we all have), but it's better to have peace of mind I think.
>Anyway, here is a question I sent tech support on the center section of the
>fuselage. If it helps others Great. I seem to find myself scratching my
>head at alot of steps in this process, I hope it's common to all of us the
>first time around.
>
>Question:
>Terry Hobert Builder #90680
>
>On the 9A Center Section referencing Dwg 16.
>The callout for the rivet for the F-904G Center section vertical bar
>is a AN426AD4-14. I used the rivets provided in the bag and the
>inventory did indicate they were 14s. Looking at them they do appear to
>be 14s.
>After drilling, deburring and then driving the rivets - it appears that
>the shop head really isn't thick enough to meet the usual standards. I
>even drilled them out once and tried re-riveting making sure everything
>was tightly clamped up, etc. Same results. Is this only because the
>rivets function as to hold the bar in place until the bolts are placed
>in final assembly and torqued up? Or should I get some 15 length rivets
>and use them?
>
>Answer from Tech Support Vans:
>Just leave them, you were right about their function, just there to
>hold the bar until the 'real' fasteners go in.... DON't drill them out
>again... (:>) Tom
>
>Terry Hobert 9A fuselage
>
>
>
>
>>From: G B <microsys(at)alltel.net>
>>Reply-To: rv9-list(at)matronics.com
>>To: RV9 List
>>Subject: RV9-List: HS jig block
>>Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2004 17:31:15 -0500
>>
>>
>>Hello,
>>
>>They say that the only stupid question is one not asked...
>>
>>In that vein...
>>
>>There is a wide blue outline on my plywood HS jig. Do I cut on the
>>inside of the wide mark, or on the
>>outside? Yes is not a good answer ;-)
>>
>>Thanks,
>>
>>Glen
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Steve Sampson" <SSampson.SLN21(at)london.edu> |
| Subject: | Nosewheel fairing / Tyre pressure |
Thanks everyone for help with the nosewheel fairing. By jacking on a block
under the engine sump I have got everything in the correct position and
there will be room for the hose clamp (aka jubilee clip).
It raises another question which a couple have touched on, and that is how
to check and maintain tyre pressure. Andy K's solution of nutplates would be
the path I would take if I was building it again, but having riveted and
bonded the main support brackets in, I do not want to break them out.
Ernest's little ACS door looks useful, but I still do not see a) how I am
going to get the valve cover off/on through a 1" hole, and b) unless I can
find an unusually long valve extension an air line onto the valve.
Lots of you who are flying must be doing this however. Once again what am I
missing? Surely you are not getting the valve cover off by pushing your
fingers up the side of the tyre? The one positive thought I have is perhaps
if I changed the valve cover for a hex one, like the main wheels, I could
get it off without loosing it, with a socket.
Having got this far without too many dumb questions I am feeling a clutz (I
think I remember that as the appropriate American word) right now. I wonder
how the hell I got this far?
Steve
#90360
UK
---
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Nosewheel fairing / Tyre pressure |
| From: | "Larry PERRYMAN" <larry.perryman(at)atofina.com> |
03/15/2004 03:37:34 PM,
Serialize complete at 03/15/2004 03:37:34 PM
Steve,
A 3/8 inch nut driver (like a socket on an extension with a screwdriver
like handle - all in one) or any metric one that will fit tightly on the
cap. You can then unscrew it and air the tire up.
I cut about 1.25 inch holes in my wheel pants with a hole saw at the point
where the valve stem was in the 9 o'clock position. I then used the piece
I cut out to make a door in the wheel pants. You will need a piece of some
springy steel. I used the saw blade from a saber saw (the kind that the
blade sticks out front and is about 1 inch wide by 6 inches long. The
metal cutting ones have smaller teeth to grind off.) for the spring. Grind
off the teeth so you have nice dull edged spring.
You can drill and install a plate nut about 1 inch from the end of the
blade. I thought it would be hard to drill but a sharp bit went right
through it. On the other end, rivet the piece of the wheel pants that you
cut out and an aluminum plate that is bigger than the cut out for a
backing plate on the side opposite the plate nut. You can then position
the whole thing inside the wheel pants so that the hole is now filled up
again. With a light source inside the wheel pants, you can see where to
drill for the plate nut. I put another plate inside the wheel pants where
the plate nut goes for a wear plate and attached it with a rivet or two to
the wheel pants so it would not turn as you slide the little door open.
Now put a pan head screw into the plate nut and tighten until you can
slide the door open with a little force. You now have a hole that will
allow you to air up the tire and still give a smooth appearance to the
wheel pants.
Use a screwdriver in the screw to bring the door back closed after airing
up the tire.
If you want to get fancy, you can use some fiberglass to fill the area
where the hole saw cut the plug out of the wheel pants and make it an even
tighter fit and to fill up the hole in the middle where the pilot drill
was. It is up to you.
Regards,
Larry Perryman
N194DL
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Andy Karmy <andy(at)karmy.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Nosewheel fairing / Tyre pressure |
Steve,
You hit directly on the head with your assumption. I only added the
nutplates to be able to remove the part without taking the wheel off.
For air duty I have those ACS spring loaded doors. You can get a 6 inch
valve stem extension from a truck repair shop, or like I did from
Cleveland Tool. Then you use a hex valve stem cover, take it off with a
nut driver, screw on the extension, air up or check the pressure, all
through the little spring loaded door. Works great.
What works even better for my main tires I replaced the tubes with
"AIRSTOP" tubes and now I don't need the little doors anymore as the
tubes don't leak air at all.
- Andy Karmy
andy(at)karmy.com
On Mar 14, 2004, at 10:52 AM, Steve Sampson wrote:
>
>
> It raises another question which a couple have touched on, and that is
> how
> to check and maintain tyre pressure. Andy K's solution of nutplates
> would be
> the path I would take if I was building it again, but having riveted
> and
> bonded the main support brackets in, I do not want to break them out.
> Ernest's little ACS door looks useful, but I still do not see a) how I
> am
> going to get the valve cover off/on through a 1" hole, and b) unless I
> can
> find an unusually long valve extension an air line onto the valve.
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Gnash ... I goofed ... MK-319-BS vs AD ???? |
| From: | Gerry Filby <gerf(at)gerf.com> |
The Rudder counterbalance skin overlaps the main skin and the
spar and where it does - 8 rivets total - AN460AD3-4 rivets are
called out. In my enthusiasm with that wicked Avery pneumatic
squeezer (which I just got yesterday) I riveted all around the
ribs and counterbalance skin, forgetting 6 of the rivets that
secure the skin to the counterbalance skin to the rear spar -
the inner ones ... if you're groaning with disgust at this
point, you can imagine how I felt as the adolescent nature of
my actions dawned on me.
So since the inside of the counterbalance skin is no longer
accessible I have two choices - blind rivet with MK-319-BS or
call up vans with a parts list for a new rudder. Can I get
away with the blind rivets ?
g
--
RV-9 #90842
==========================================================
Gerry Filby gerf(at)gerf.com
Home (415) 239 4846
Cell (415) 203 9177
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Glenn Brasch" <gbrasch(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Gnash ... I goofed ... MK-319-BS vs AD ???? |
I am not sure if I am missing something, but why not just drill out the
one's you already did and start over? Glenn in Arizona -9A wings, fuselage
ordered.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Gerry Filby" <gerf(at)gerf.com>
Subject: RV9-List: Gnash ... I goofed ... MK-319-BS vs AD ????
>
>
> The Rudder counterbalance skin overlaps the main skin and the
> spar and where it does - 8 rivets total - AN460AD3-4 rivets are
> called out. In my enthusiasm with that wicked Avery pneumatic
> squeezer (which I just got yesterday) I riveted all around the
> ribs and counterbalance skin, forgetting 6 of the rivets that
> secure the skin to the counterbalance skin to the rear spar -
> the inner ones ... if you're groaning with disgust at this
> point, you can imagine how I felt as the adolescent nature of
> my actions dawned on me.
>
> So since the inside of the counterbalance skin is no longer
> accessible I have two choices - blind rivet with MK-319-BS or
> call up vans with a parts list for a new rudder. Can I get
> away with the blind rivets ?
>
> g
>
> --
> RV-9 #90842
> ==========================================================
> Gerry Filby gerf(at)gerf.com
> Home (415) 239 4846
> Cell (415) 203 9177
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Gnash ... I goofed ... MK-319-BS vs AD ???? |
| From: | "Larry PERRYMAN" <larry.perryman(at)atofina.com> |
03/17/2004 12:09:40 AM,
Serialize complete at 03/17/2004 12:09:40 AM
Gerry,
The short answer is YES. The best answer is to call VANS Support and ask
them.
Regards,
Larry Perryman
Gerry Filby
Sent by: owner-rv9-list-server(at)matronics.com
03/16/2004 04:57 PM
Please respond to rv9-list
To: rv9-list(at)matronics.com
cc:
Subject: RV9-List: Gnash ... I goofed ... MK-319-BS vs AD ????
Can I get
away with the blind rivets ?
g
--
RV-9 #90842
==========================================================
Gerry Filby gerf(at)gerf.com
Home (415) 239 4846
Cell (415) 203 9177
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | kerrjohna(at)comcast.net |
| Subject: | Re: Gnash ... I goofed ... MK-319-BS vs AD ???? |
can you drill out the rivets and correct the problem?
it will be good practice when you make the same kind of mistake later,d:
)
>
>
> The Rudder counterbalance skin overlaps the main skin and the
> spar and where it does - 8 rivets total - AN460AD3-4 rivets are
> called out. In my enthusiasm with that wicked Avery pneumatic
> squeezer (which I just got yesterday) I riveted all around the
> ribs and counterbalance skin, forgetting 6 of the rivets that
> secure the skin to the counterbalance skin to the rear spar -
> the inner ones ... if you're groaning with disgust at this
> point, you can imagine how I felt as the adolescent nature of
> my actions dawned on me.
>
> So since the inside of the counterbalance skin is no longer
> accessible I have two choices - blind rivet with MK-319-BS or
> call up vans with a parts list for a new rudder. Can I get
> away with the blind rivets ?
>
> g
>
> --
> RV-9 #90842
> ==========================================================
> Gerry Filby gerf(at)gerf.com
> Home (415) 239 4846
> Cell (415) 203 9177
>
>
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Gnash ... I goofed ... MK-319-BS vs AD ???? |
| From: | Gerry Filby <gerf(at)gerf.com> |
My experience drilling out rivets so far is that its rarely
"clean" and if you can avoid it you're better off going that
way. Also there's two blind rivets between the tip rib and the
end of the spar which, if I heed the many warnings I've seen,
are very difficult to drill out. I'm not worried so much about
the cosmetics of it, more the strength.
I better call Vans and get the "official" line ... thanks all.
g
>
>
> can you drill out the rivets and correct the problem?
>
> it will be good practice when you make the same kind of mistake later,d:
> )
> >
> >
> > The Rudder counterbalance skin overlaps the main skin and the
> > spar and where it does - 8 rivets total - AN460AD3-4 rivets are
> > called out. In my enthusiasm with that wicked Avery pneumatic
> > squeezer (which I just got yesterday) I riveted all around the
> > ribs and counterbalance skin, forgetting 6 of the rivets that
> > secure the skin to the counterbalance skin to the rear spar -
> > the inner ones ... if you're groaning with disgust at this
> > point, you can imagine how I felt as the adolescent nature of
> > my actions dawned on me.
> >
> > So since the inside of the counterbalance skin is no longer
> > accessible I have two choices - blind rivet with MK-319-BS or
> > call up vans with a parts list for a new rudder. Can I get
> > away with the blind rivets ?
> >
> > g
> >
> > --
> > RV-9 #90842
> > ==========================================================
> > Gerry Filby gerf(at)gerf.com
> > Home (415) 239 4846
> > Cell (415) 203 9177
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
--
RV-9 #90842
==========================================================
Gerry Filby gerf(at)gerf.com
Home (415) 239 4846
Cell (415) 203 9177
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | DThomas773(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Gnash ... I goofed ... MK-319-BS vs AD ???? |
If you are drilling out #3 rivets and planning to replace them with pop
rivets, don't worry about drilling them out. You are drilling out a rivet that
went into a number 40 hole, and replacing it with a rivet that needs to be
drilled out to number 30, or 1/8 inch. So, if your drilling isn't perfect, it
won't
matter. You will be enlarging the hole anyway.
Dennis Thomas
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "John Oliveira" <oliveira(at)frontiernet.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Gnash ... I goofed ... MK-319-BS vs AD ???? |
Blind rivets are easy to drill out. they have a built in "guide"
----- Original Message -----
From: "Gerry Filby" <gerf(at)gerf.com>
Subject: Re: RV9-List: Gnash ... I goofed ... MK-319-BS vs AD ????
>
>
> My experience drilling out rivets so far is that its rarely
> "clean" and if you can avoid it you're better off going that
> way. Also there's two blind rivets between the tip rib and the
> end of the spar which, if I heed the many warnings I've seen,
> are very difficult to drill out. I'm not worried so much about
> the cosmetics of it, more the strength.
>
> I better call Vans and get the "official" line ... thanks all.
>
> g
>
> >
> >
> > can you drill out the rivets and correct the problem?
> >
> > it will be good practice when you make the same kind of mistake later,d:
> > )
> > >
> > >
> > > The Rudder counterbalance skin overlaps the main skin and the
> > > spar and where it does - 8 rivets total - AN460AD3-4 rivets are
> > > called out. In my enthusiasm with that wicked Avery pneumatic
> > > squeezer (which I just got yesterday) I riveted all around the
> > > ribs and counterbalance skin, forgetting 6 of the rivets that
> > > secure the skin to the counterbalance skin to the rear spar -
> > > the inner ones ... if you're groaning with disgust at this
> > > point, you can imagine how I felt as the adolescent nature of
> > > my actions dawned on me.
> > >
> > > So since the inside of the counterbalance skin is no longer
> > > accessible I have two choices - blind rivet with MK-319-BS or
> > > call up vans with a parts list for a new rudder. Can I get
> > > away with the blind rivets ?
> > >
> > > g
> > >
> > > --
> > > RV-9 #90842
> > > ==========================================================
> > > Gerry Filby gerf(at)gerf.com
> > > Home (415) 239 4846
> > > Cell (415) 203 9177
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
> --
> RV-9 #90842
> ==========================================================
> Gerry Filby gerf(at)gerf.com
> Home (415) 239 4846
> Cell (415) 203 9177
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Ray L" <Justplane(at)comcast.net> |
| Subject: | Subaru Engine Prices |
Hello Listeners,
When looking at data from October 2001, I noticed the 2.5I engine package
went for $13,000 and it included a lot of accessories. Now I see the price
is $22,000 for the 2.5 XT variable valve timing firewall package. Can
somebody explain the $9,000 difference?
Respectfully,
Ray Lackwitz
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Terry Hobert" <terhobey(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Gnash ... I goofed ... MK-319-BS vs AD ???? |
If worried about increasing the hole then use oops rivets. an4 stems with
an3 heads. They work fine. With so much pratice, I can drill out rivets
perfectly. I don't know if thats a good thing or not, but tells you that
you'll be drilling out alot down the road, believe me!
Terry 9A fuselage
>From: DThomas773(at)aol.com
>Reply-To: rv9-list(at)matronics.com
>To: rv9-list(at)matronics.com
>Subject: Re: RV9-List: Gnash ... I goofed ... MK-319-BS vs AD ????
>Date: Tue, 16 Mar 2004 22:29:14 EST
>
>
>If you are drilling out #3 rivets and planning to replace them with pop
>rivets, don't worry about drilling them out. You are drilling out a rivet
>that
>went into a number 40 hole, and replacing it with a rivet that needs to be
>drilled out to number 30, or 1/8 inch. So, if your drilling isn't perfect,
>it won't
>matter. You will be enlarging the hole anyway.
>
>Dennis Thomas
>
>
http://moneycentral.msn.com/tax/home.asp
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Gary Newsted" <fcs(at)jlc.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Subaru Engine Prices |
Ray, wrong newsgroup. Try "subaruaircraft" on Yahoo.
The short answer is that these are brand new, 2004 engines with many
refinements.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Sargentclt(at)cs.com |
| Subject: | Re: Subaru Engine Prices |
It seems as though simple economics have trespassed into the art of
"New Engine Technology". I have two arguments. One, if you are the sort of
person to build an airplane, why not venture into building an engine ie. the
Titan kit for $14500 add a propeller (fixed) for $2000 and your done. Or call
Mattituck Engines and buy an already built one for $18000. Either way you save
money over the Subaru. And lets not forget that every mechanic knows how to
turn a wrench on the Lycoming. No offense to those who like the Subaru but you
are the mechanic in this choice like it or not. I've heard all the discussion
for the Soob and both it and the Lycoming are fine choices but not when price
is a factor.
Hey just my .02 worth.
Tad Sargent RV7A
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Gary Newsted" <fcs(at)jlc.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Subaru Engine Prices |
It could just be that we love our Subaru's enough to pay top dollar for
them.
I prefer to save money on fuel rather than on engine selection. Anyone
thinking
these powerplants should be less valuable than a Lyco, hasn't looked very
closely.
...my two cents...
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "TED JONES" <rv6(at)LOCKHART.NET> |
I HAVE FOUND THAT ANY ENGINE IN THE RV OTHER THAN LYCOMING OR IT'S CLONE DEVALUES
THE AIRCRAFT
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bob Kelly <mmpi(at)missionmedia.org> |
| Subject: | Re: Subaru Engine Prices |
Gary,
Always trying for the best of both worlds, is anyone except me following the
development of the RV exhaust system by www.powerflowsystems.com ? There
are a couple around here and everyone says they really add power and save
fuel. A 150 hp Cherokee owner here (OVO) says he saves over a gallon per
hour and has had to change props. His climbouts are great and he says he
added over ten knots with the new prop. Of course, that is compared to a
Piper exhaust, and I have no idea how it would compare to one from Van's.
Bob Kelly
90854
On 03/18/04, Gary Newsted wrote:
>
> It could just be that we love our Subaru's enough to pay top dollar for
> them.
> I prefer to save money on fuel rather than on engine selection. Anyone
> thinking
> these powerplants should be less valuable than a Lyco, hasn't looked very
> closely.
> ...my two cents...
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Noel & Yoshie Simmons" <noel(at)blueskyaviation.net> |
"Rv-List(at)Matronics. Com" ,
"Rv9-List(at)Matronics. Com" ,
"Rv8-List(at)Matronics. Com" ,
, ,
, ,
I am posting this to all the RV lists so if you get duplicates dont be
upset.
It is that time for me at Blue Sky Aviation to add another set of
experienced hands. I am looking for someone with prior building experience,
A&P would be nice, along with private pilot ticket. Must be trustworthy,
hard working, reliable, and a good eye for detail.
If you are or know of someone, please have him or her give me a call or drop
me an email. This is a full time permanent position and is available
immediately.
Sincerely,
Noel Simmons
Blue Sky Aviation, Inc.
Phone & Fax: 406-538-6574
noel(at)blueskyaviation.net
www.blueskyaviation.net
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "fcs(at)jlc.net" <fcs(at)jlc.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Subaru Engine Prices |
You mean...
Always "flying" the best of both worlds...
"Resale" was not high on my list of priorities when building the finest
aircraft I was capable of. If anyone can honestly evaluate my Subaru
installation and tell me my aircraft has poor resale value, then I just
won't sell it to them. ;
) Much of this is just making mirth out of myth.
Competitive powerplants have always carried this stigma. Yet we will soon
have over 300 RV's flying with this excellent powerplant. Different
strokes for different folks. Choice is good.
Gary
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | DLOMHEIM(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Market value on used Subies? |
In a message dated 3/18/04 1:57:59 AM Central Standard Time, Gary Newsted
writes:
Anyone thinking these powerplants should be less valuable than a Lyco, hasn't
looked very closely.
Gary:
Have any Subie powered RV's come up for sale of late so we can get an idea
what the "fair market value" of a Subie equipped RV really is? If not with so
many that have been sold it's just a matter of time before we start seeing
them show up on Barnstormers etc. and can get an idea what pilots are really
offering for them...
I am still going the Mazda 13B route and don't expect to command the same $$
value for mine (should I choose to sell it someday) as a Lycoming or
Subie...but then again I believe should have less than $12K in the firewall forward
(including a fixed pitch prop) when it's ready to fly.
Doug
90116 fuselage; 13B overhaul
"ONCE YOU HAVE TASTED FLIGHT YOU WILL WALK THIS EARTH WITH YOUR EYES TURNED
SKYWARD. FOR THERE YOU HAVE BEEN, AND THERE YOU LONG TO RETURN"
Leonardo Da Vinci
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "D, C, Jones" <chaseglass(at)look.ca> |
| Subject: | RV-9A Landing light drawings |
Hi. I'm looking for drawings to install the landing lights, because I'm going
to design my own light adjusting system and make my own lenses from lexan.
Thanks. Cliff
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Paul Eastham <eastham(at)netapp.com> |
| Subject: | riveting flap attach angles |
Hi all,
I had a pretty tough day in the shop today trying to rivet all the
flap attach stuff onto the ribs. We managed with only minor mishaps until
we got to the piece of angle that contacts the rear spar. Any hints
on riveting this? Even my Avery double-offset set can't get square on the
rivet head due to the body of the gun impacting the spar.
I was thinking about sending away for a single-offset set, though the
prospect of using it frightens me. Seems like it would be easy to jump
off the rivet.
(PS: The Yard sells some offset sets called "suicide sets", maybe I need
one of those :)
I don't see much about this in the archives, so I'm hoping there's an
easier way I'm missing...
Paul
http://hmb.dyndns.org/~eastham/rv
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Norman Hunger" <nhunger(at)sprint.ca> |
| Subject: | Re: Fire Extinguisher |
> I mounted a small halon fire extinguisher between the
> fuel selector valve and gear leg mounting on the left
> side in front of the spar. One screw went through the
> mounting bracket into an existing nutplate that is
> used to hold cover in front of the spar, and the other
> side of the mounting bracket is held with a screw and
> nut through the cover.
>
> I bought the 14oz size from www.safeair1.com and had
> it personally delivered to me by Monte!
>
> I think your best bet for dealing with a fire in the
> cowl is to turn off the fuel and point the nose down.
> I doubt the additional weight and complexity of a FWF
> system will be worth it.
>
> See this site for more info on Halon.
> http://www.h3r.com/
My aircraft is being built primarily for higher altitude XC so I feel a
Halon system under the cowl is very important. Think how long it would take
you to get on the ground from 10,000.
I plumbed a 10 lbs bottle to the front side of the cowl. I haven't done the
outlets yet but am planning to saturate the whole cowl. 10 lbs is alot and
my bottle is controlled by a hand valve so I should be able to handle a full
on fire and some residual flame ups. I also have a 10 lbs for the cabin but
that might be over doing it. Both mount side by side in between the
occupants feet.
Norman Hunger
RV6A Delta BC
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Oil Canning on lower wing skin |
Hello,
I am just about done riveting my outboard lower wing skin on my QB wing an I
have oil canning in the innermost bay. It looks to be about 1/4" movement
with concave being the predominant state. Is this acceptable? If not what
is the remedy? It is the same bay as the access panel so I can get behind
the skin.
TIA - Pete
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Cory Emberson" <bootless(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Fire Extinguisher |
Norman,
I just wanted to put a "me too" in there for the info on the H3R site.
Disclosure: I did word processing work for Steve Berg (the founder) about
nine years ago, and saw his demo for putting electrical fires out. It was
impressive.
And I did buy a Halonaire extinguisher from him to contribute to the Tiger's
onboard equipment. Haven't had to use it, but it's good to know that the
panel won't get wasted by the extinguisher.
Cory
> >
> > See this site for more info on Halon.
> > http://www.h3r.com/
>
> My aircraft is being built primarily for higher altitude XC so I feel a
> Halon system under the cowl is very important. Think how long it would
take
> you to get on the ground from 10,000.
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Bruce Cruikshank" <n19z(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | Single off set rivet set |
Paul,
I have used a single offset set with an overall length of 5 1/2" countless times.
Since most of my riveting is done with one hand on the gun and one on the
bucking bar, a couple pieces of duck tape around the set and the gun keep the
set from rotating. This is with a slow hitting 4X gun. With a fast hitting
gun you'd best have a helper so you can use both hands on the gun and rivet set.
Bruce Cruikshank
n19z(at)earthlink.net
Why Wait? Move to EarthLink.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "John Oliveira" <oliveira(at)frontiernet.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Fire Extinguisher |
I may be wrong, but I thought Halon worked by aggressively replacing all the
air in a compartment with an inert gas. I did not think you wanted it in a
passenger compartment as if it is sealed it will extinguish Humans as well
as the fire.
Also, since it works in that manner rather than by smothering the fire with
a retardant, it may not be all that effective because of outside ventilation
coming into the cockpit.
John Oliveira
working of fuselage
----- Original Message -----
From: "Cory Emberson" <bootless(at)earthlink.net>
Subject: Re: RV9-List: Fire Extinguisher
>
> Norman,
>
> I just wanted to put a "me too" in there for the info on the H3R site.
>
> Disclosure: I did word processing work for Steve Berg (the founder) about
> nine years ago, and saw his demo for putting electrical fires out. It was
> impressive.
>
> And I did buy a Halonaire extinguisher from him to contribute to the
Tiger's
> onboard equipment. Haven't had to use it, but it's good to know that the
> panel won't get wasted by the extinguisher.
>
> Cory
>
> > >
> > > See this site for more info on Halon.
> > > http://www.h3r.com/
> >
> > My aircraft is being built primarily for higher altitude XC so I feel a
> > Halon system under the cowl is very important. Think how long it would
> take
> > you to get on the ground from 10,000.
> >
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Leland <Federigo(at)pacbell.net> |
I am having trouble fabricating the airbox with all of Van's required
items, which are: airbox short enough so lower cowl can be dropped
straight down (with prop in place), an upward bend in the top plate so
incoming air makes a smoother transition, room for the rubber baffle
seal material to be riveted on, and enough length so the carb-heat door
can swing back without hitting the filter. I have an O320D1A (new engine
from Van's) with a fixed pitch prop. A constant speed prop installation
would not present as much difficulty with the airbox because its cowling
is longer. Did anybody else have this problem with the airbox?
Leland in Pleasanton, California
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Clay R <clayr_55(at)yahoo.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Fire Extinguisher |
Halon in the cowl (or in a computer room) is designed
to add enough halon to the air to smother the fire.
(approx 4%) In such an installed system, the jets
can't be "pre-aimed" at the fire so they have to flood
the entire area and hope for the best.
If you have a fire in the cockpit, you want a small
handheld extinguisher you can use to shoot a blast
directly at the fire. This will put the fire out in
an instant. You can then get your vents open for some
fresh air to clear the smoke and halon.
There are recommendations in AC 20-42C for the maximum
size system for in-cabin use to avoid smothering the
occupants. The 10lb system mentioned previously for an
RV cabin is much, much too big and unnecessary.
See the Advisory Circular here:
http://www.h3r.com/halon/ac2042c.htm
If you think about it, the smoke IS going to kill you,
so using some Halon to stop the fire and smoke to give
you an opportunity to get some fresh air is your only
choice.
-Clay
--- John Oliveira wrote:
>
>
> I may be wrong, but I thought Halon worked by
> aggressively replacing all the
> air in a compartment with an inert gas. I did not
> think you wanted it in a
> passenger compartment as if it is sealed it will
> extinguish Humans as well
> as the fire.
>
> Also, since it works in that manner rather than by
> smothering the fire with
> a retardant, it may not be all that effective
> because of outside ventilation
> coming into the cockpit.
__________________________________
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Steve Sampson" <SSampson.SLN21(at)london.edu> |
| Subject: | Oil Canning on lower wing skin |
Pete - I am no expert but had the same problem. It was not acceptable to me.
I drilled it out and rerivetted in a different order and the problem went
away. The movement was minute in the metal but enough to loose the 'extra'.
I am sorry but I forget more details than that.
Steve.
#90360
UK
PS Perhaps the problem was I had not rivetted strictly from the centre to
the edges.
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv9-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv9-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of Pete Howell
Subject: RV9-List: Oil Canning on lower wing skin
Hello,
I am just about done riveting my outboard lower wing skin on my QB wing an I
have oil canning in the innermost bay. It looks to be about 1/4" movement
with concave being the predominant state. Is this acceptable? If not what
is the remedy? It is the same bay as the access panel so I can get behind
the skin.
TIA - Pete
---
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | JohnCClarkVA(at)cs.com |
| Subject: | Re: Fire Extinguisher |
The potential harmful effects of Halon are minor when compared the the
extreme danger of an open fire in the cockpit. If the flame is big enough to cause
Halon to break down and create toxic fumes, Halon or its byproducts are not
your problem. If you fight the fire agressively, you won't need much halon and
it will decompose very little. Check out
https://www.ntsb.gov/Recs/letters/letters.htm and look for A01-83 through 87. Look on about page 8 or 9 for a
discussion of the subject. The AC overstates the risks at the expense of the
benefits. Also the entire rec letter may be of interest although it deals with
airline in-flight fire fighting training.
If you have an engine compartment fire, first thing is to shut off the fuel
source if you can. If it is a fuel fire, that is easy. If it is an oil fed
fire, I guess you can shut down the engine. Not sure how good Halon would be
under the cowl because of the ventilation but it does not take much and it is
fast.
Also, keep combustibles off the back side of the firewall. A fire in front
will quickly autoignite anything flammable on the backside. Most foams that
are readily available are very flammable, and pound for pound, a great energy
source. Forward or aft of the firewall, keep it clean, free of buildup. John.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Rob W M Shipley" <rob(at)robsglass.com> |
Hello,
I am just about done riveting my outboard lower wing skin on my QB wing an I
have oil canning in the innermost bay. It looks to be about 1/4" movement
with concave being the predominant state. Is this acceptable? If not what
is the remedy? It is the same bay as the access panel so I can get behind
the skin.
TIA - Pete
Pete,
I seem to remember this coming up before so you may wish to check the archives.
I think the solution suggested was to use a length of stiffener prosealed to
the inside of the offending skin to correct its shape. You would need to make
sure you get the prosealed stiffener wedged in place for several days. Clean
with MEK or similar.
Good luck.
Rob
Rob W M Shipley
N919RV (res) Fuselage .....still!
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Roger Evenson" <revenson(at)comcast.net> |
| Subject: | Dropped bucking bar--Need ding fix |
While helping a friend (previous friend?), I dropped a bucking bar inside the wing
near the leading edge, and left two noticeable dings. Surely this isn't
the first time this has happened.
Other than starting over with the new skin, do you have any suggestions for a fix?
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bob Kelly <mmpi(at)missionmedia.org> |
| Subject: | Re: Dropped bucking bar--Need ding fix |
Roger,
I had a few of these (of which I am not proud) that I worked out with a
little care. Search on "paintless dent removal" and you should be able to
find some info. Basically, you can use a soft tool (wood or plastic works
well) and patience to rub on the "high" side of the bump. Start at the
very edge of the bump, not the center. Use strong light and watch the
opposite side as you work. If it isn't too bad, you can remove all or most
of the dent. My 75 pound Lab put a paw print in a rudder skin (don't ask
why it was on the floor in the living room) and it came out so well I can't
find it now. Took about half an hour. BTW, the dog is still alive.
Bob Kelly, Wings
90854
On 03/24/04, Roger Evenson wrote:
>
> While helping a friend (previous friend?), I dropped a bucking bar inside
> the wing near the leading edge, and left two noticeable dings. Surely this
> isn't the first time this has happened.
>
> Other than starting over with the new skin, do you have any suggestions
> for a fix?
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Richard Scott <rscott(at)cascadeaccess.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Dropped bucking bar--Need ding fix |
Roger,
On flat or near flat surfaces I have had good luck using a rivet gun with a
flush set, and of course a bucking bar on the back side. Turn the pressure
way down. Result was not perfect, but good enough that a minimal amount of
Bondo would fix just fine. Practice on scrap first.
Richard Scott
9A, Still on emp--very slow , but somewhat steady
At 08:04 AM 3/24/2004, you wrote:
>
>Roger,
>
>
>I had a few of these (of which I am not proud) that I worked out with a
>little care. Search on "paintless dent removal" and you should be able to
>find some info. Basically, you can use a soft tool (wood or plastic works
>well) and patience to rub on the "high" side of the bump. Start at the
>very edge of the bump, not the center. Use strong light and watch the
>opposite side as you work. If it isn't too bad, you can remove all or most
>of the dent. My 75 pound Lab put a paw print in a rudder skin (don't ask
>why it was on the floor in the living room) and it came out so well I can't
>find it now. Took about half an hour. BTW, the dog is still alive.
>
>Bob Kelly, Wings
>90854
>
>On 03/24/04, Roger Evenson wrote:
> >
> > While helping a friend (previous friend?), I dropped a bucking bar inside
> > the wing near the leading edge, and left two noticeable dings. Surely this
> > isn't the first time this has happened.
> >
> > Other than starting over with the new skin, do you have any suggestions
> > for a fix?
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Steve Sampson" <SSampson.SLN21(at)london.edu> |
Leland - I did not see any reply to you on this so I will give it my best
shot.
The way I have taken this is that the cowl has to start off dropping
straight down, HOWEVER, after a short way it must move forward for the
airbox to clear the 'lip' above the air inlet in the cowl. By the time it
has dropped this far the front of the cowl should be clear of the spinner
and is free to move further forward. It is tight though and I have not
bolted my prop back on to prove it all works but I am pretty confident it
will. (In fact it can NEVER drop straight down because the hinges must
disengage first - but that is a bit pedantic.)
The 'gotcha' I nearly was trapped by was very little space for the hot air
door fore and aft. To ease the cowl removal you want the neck on the front
of the air box as short as possible, however you need to be sure you have
enough space left to fit the door. I was surprised that you had a potential
door/filter interference. Mine are far apart.
The question I am struggling with is how you arrange the seals on the air
box/cowl junction. My plan is a 'U' shaped bit around the sides and bottom
of the air inlet, and a horizontal piece across the top of the air box. All
input welcome on that.
Its pretty clear the bloke that wrote the -9a build docs has not built one.
I was interested by a friends comment who has a -6 and is building a -9a
that although the kit is much better the instructions are much worse.
Steve
#90360
UK
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv9-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv9-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of Leland
Subject: RV9-List: Airbox
I am having trouble fabricating the airbox with all of Van's required
items, which are: airbox short enough so lower cowl can be dropped
straight down (with prop in place), an upward bend in the top plate so
incoming air makes a smoother transition, room for the rubber baffle
seal material to be riveted on, and enough length so the carb-heat door
can swing back without hitting the filter. I have an O320D1A (new engine
from Van's) with a fixed pitch prop. A constant speed prop installation
would not present as much difficulty with the airbox because its cowling
is longer. Did anybody else have this problem with the airbox?
Leland in Pleasanton, California
---
Incoming mail is certified Virus Free.
---
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "MICK MULLER" <MULLERPHARM(at)bigpond.com> |
Greetings Listers, I am about to start on the W919. The instructions say to
get the specs from drawing 9. The drawing says what to make it from , but
does not specify a length. Do I assume that it finishes level with the
leading edge skin? It only protrudes about 3/4 of an inch either top and
bottom, so I could tuck it underneath the 904/905 skins if it is not
supposed to be trimmed.
Thanks,
Mick Muller
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Glenn Brasch" <gbrasch(at)earthlink.net> |
I cut mine to 28 3/4" and they worked fine.
Glenn in Arizona -9A wings, fuselage ordered.
----- Original Message -----
From: "MICK MULLER" <MULLERPHARM(at)bigpond.com>
Subject: RV9-List: W919
>
> Greetings Listers, I am about to start on the W919. The instructions say
to
> get the specs from drawing 9. The drawing says what to make it from , but
> does not specify a length. Do I assume that it finishes level with the
> leading edge skin? It only protrudes about 3/4 of an inch either top and
> bottom, so I could tuck it underneath the 904/905 skins if it is not
> supposed to be trimmed.
> Thanks,
> Mick Muller
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Ernest Kells" <ernest.kells(at)sympatico.ca> |
I cut the W919 strips a little on the long side. I did the final cutting
after the W919 strips were dimpled and clecoed in place with the wing
leading edge (fully riveted on the spar) and the fuel tank (clecoed and
temporarily attached to the spar). I wanted all three things to fit
beautifully as it would be very noticeable - I "may" have been overly
concerned but I would do the same again.
Ernest Kells - RV-9A O235-N2C, Wood Prop
90% Complete - Electrical and Final Paint
>
> I cut mine to 28 3/4" and they worked fine....Glenn in Arizona -9A wings
>
> >
> > Greetings Listers, I am about to start on the W919. The instructions
say
> to
> > get the specs from drawing 9. The drawing says what to make it from ,
but
> > does not specify a length. Do I assume that it finishes level with the
> > leading edge skin? It only protrudes about 3/4 of an inch either top and
> > bottom, so I could tuck it underneath the 904/905 skins if it is not
> > supposed to be trimmed.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Rudy Doerwald <rudy(at)doerwald.net> |
| Subject: | Re: RV9-List Digest: 6 Msgs - 03/24/04 |
Steve Sampson, I would advise against putting the seal in a "U" around
the cowl inlet. I was very close to doing this myself just a few weeks
ago.It would have been perfect for dropping and lowering the cowl, but
at closer inspection I saw that there would no longer be a smooth
transition to the air box. Any engine sag or movement and the incoming
air could easily go under or beside the lip of the airbox. I put the
seal all around on the air box only, as per the plans, and the results
were very good.
Rudy Doerwald
90529
Canada
>
>________________________________ Message 4 _____________________________________
>
>
>From: "Steve Sampson" <SSampson.SLN21(at)london.edu>
>Subject: RE: RV9-List: Airbox
>
>
>Leland - I did not see any reply to you on this so I will give it my best
>shot.
>
>The way I have taken this is that the cowl has to start off dropping
>straight down, HOWEVER, after a short way it must move forward for the
>airbox to clear the 'lip' above the air inlet in the cowl. By the time it
>has dropped this far the front of the cowl should be clear of the spinner
>and is free to move further forward. It is tight though and I have not
>bolted my prop back on to prove it all works but I am pretty confident it
>will. (In fact it can NEVER drop straight down because the hinges must
>disengage first - but that is a bit pedantic.)
>
>The 'gotcha' I nearly was trapped by was very little space for the hot air
>door fore and aft. To ease the cowl removal you want the neck on the front
>of the air box as short as possible, however you need to be sure you have
>enough space left to fit the door. I was surprised that you had a potential
>door/filter interference. Mine are far apart.
>
>The question I am struggling with is how you arrange the seals on the air
>box/cowl junction. My plan is a 'U' shaped bit around the sides and bottom
>of the air inlet, and a horizontal piece across the top of the air box. All
>input welcome on that.
>
>Its pretty clear the bloke that wrote the -9a build docs has not built one.
>I was interested by a friends comment who has a -6 and is building a -9a
>that although the kit is much better the instructions are much worse.
>
>Steve
>#90360
>UK
>
>-----Original Message-----
>From: owner-rv9-list-server(at)matronics.com
>[mailto:owner-rv9-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of Leland
>Subject: RV9-List: Airbox
>
>
>I am having trouble fabricating the airbox with all of Van's required
>items, which are: airbox short enough so lower cowl can be dropped
>straight down (with prop in place), an upward bend in the top plate so
>incoming air makes a smoother transition, room for the rubber baffle
>seal material to be riveted on, and enough length so the carb-heat door
>can swing back without hitting the filter. I have an O320D1A (new engine
>from Van's) with a fixed pitch prop. A constant speed prop installation
>would not present as much difficulty with the airbox because its cowling
>is longer. Did anybody else have this problem with the airbox?
>Leland in Pleasanton, California
>
>
>---
>Incoming mail is certified Virus Free.
>
>---
>
>
>_
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Merems" <merems(at)cox.net> |
, ,
, "RV10 Group"
| Subject: | ExperimentalAero Website and Email |
ExperimentalAero's website and email have been having connection problems for the
last few weeks. The site and email has switched to a new server and should
be more reliable.
For those who have tried to email ExperimentalAero and haven't received any reply
it is due to the intermittent loss of service. Please try again now that EA
is on a new server. You don't want to miss out on the new DRDT-2 dimpling tool.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Terry Hobert" <terhobey(at)hotmail.com> |
I will probably get a verbal thrashing on this question, but anyway.....
Ever since my training days in the Piper Warriors I have thought that the
fuselage steps up to the wing walk are about the ugliest things on an
airplane. With a tri-gear, I know that some step is almost a neccessity.
The question is has anyone found an alternative to the standard step? In
the three years I've followed the RV list, I don't remember the subject
coming up and I will expand my search, but thought maybe someone has a
direction?
Thanks All,
Terry Hobert 9A Fuselage
download! http://toolbar.msn.com/go/onm00200413ave/direct/01/
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Steve Sampson" <SSampson.SLN21(at)london.edu> |
Terry - I raised this issue about 2 years ago because I had the same
concerns. If you are a Harlem globetrotter you might manage without, but you
wouldnt fit in. Now its up on its wheels the fact that they are an option is
clearly absurd.
Order 2 steps!
Have fun, Steve.
#90360
UK
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv9-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv9-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of Terry Hobert
Subject: RV9-List: Fuselage Steps
I will probably get a verbal thrashing on this question, but anyway.....
Ever since my training days in the Piper Warriors I have thought that the
fuselage steps up to the wing walk are about the ugliest things on an
airplane. With a tri-gear, I know that some step is almost a neccessity.
The question is has anyone found an alternative to the standard step? In
the three years I've followed the RV list, I don't remember the subject
coming up and I will expand my search, but thought maybe someone has a
direction?
Thanks All,
Terry Hobert 9A Fuselage
download! http://toolbar.msn.com/go/onm00200413ave/direct/01/
---
Incoming mail is certified Virus Free.
---
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Mike Hoover" <mikehoover(at)sc.rr.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Fuselage Steps |
Terry,
I can't remember the website, but somebody came up with a step that retracts
when you shut your canopy. If I find the link, I'll post it.
Mike
SC
90709 wings
----- Original Message -----
From: "Terry Hobert" <terhobey(at)hotmail.com>
Subject: RV9-List: Fuselage Steps
>
> I will probably get a verbal thrashing on this question, but anyway.....
> Ever since my training days in the Piper Warriors I have thought that the
> fuselage steps up to the wing walk are about the ugliest things on an
> airplane. With a tri-gear, I know that some step is almost a neccessity.
> The question is has anyone found an alternative to the standard step? In
> the three years I've followed the RV list, I don't remember the subject
> coming up and I will expand my search, but thought maybe someone has a
> direction?
> Thanks All,
> Terry Hobert 9A Fuselage
>
> download! http://toolbar.msn.com/go/onm00200413ave/direct/01/
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Fuselage Steps |
| From: | Gerry Filby <gerf(at)gerf.com> |
http://www.stepupaviation.com/
Could that be it ?
g
>
>
> Terry,
>
> I can't remember the website, but somebody came up with a step
> that retracts
> when you shut your canopy. If I find the link, I'll post it.
>
> Mike
> SC
> 90709 wings
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Terry Hobert" <terhobey(at)hotmail.com>
> To:
> Subject: RV9-List: Fuselage Steps
>
>
> >
> > I will probably get a verbal thrashing on this question, but anyway.....
> > Ever since my training days in the Piper Warriors I have thought that the
> > fuselage steps up to the wing walk are about the ugliest things on an
> > airplane. With a tri-gear, I know that some step is almost a neccessity.
> > The question is has anyone found an alternative to the standard step? In
> > the three years I've followed the RV list, I don't remember the subject
> > coming up and I will expand my search, but thought maybe someone has a
> > direction?
> > Thanks All,
> > Terry Hobert 9A Fuselage
> >
> > download! http://toolbar.msn.com/go/onm00200413ave/direct/01/
> >
> >
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
--
RV-9 #90842
==========================================================
Gerry Filby gerf(at)gerf.com
Home (415) 239 4846
Cell (415) 203 9177
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Terry Hobert" <terhobey(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Fuselage Steps |
Gerry,
Very interesting, thanks so!
Terry Hobert
>From: Gerry Filby <gerf(at)gerf.com>
>Reply-To: rv9-list(at)matronics.com
>To: rv9-list(at)matronics.com
>Subject: Re: RV9-List: Fuselage Steps
>Date: Fri, 26 Mar 2004 12:25:54 -0800
>
>
>http://www.stepupaviation.com/
>
>Could that be it ?
>
>g
>
> >
> >
> > Terry,
> >
> > I can't remember the website, but somebody came up with a step
> > that retracts
> > when you shut your canopy. If I find the link, I'll post it.
> >
> > Mike
> > SC
> > 90709 wings
> >
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: "Terry Hobert" <terhobey(at)hotmail.com>
> > To:
> > Subject: RV9-List: Fuselage Steps
> >
> >
> > >
> > > I will probably get a verbal thrashing on this question, but
>anyway.....
> > > Ever since my training days in the Piper Warriors I have thought that
>the
> > > fuselage steps up to the wing walk are about the ugliest things on an
> > > airplane. With a tri-gear, I know that some step is almost a
>neccessity.
> > > The question is has anyone found an alternative to the standard step?
>In
> > > the three years I've followed the RV list, I don't remember the
>subject
> > > coming up and I will expand my search, but thought maybe someone has a
> > > direction?
> > > Thanks All,
> > > Terry Hobert 9A Fuselage
> > >
> > > download! http://toolbar.msn.com/go/onm00200413ave/direct/01/
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>--
>RV-9 #90842
>==========================================================
>Gerry Filby gerf(at)gerf.com
> Home (415) 239 4846
> Cell (415) 203 9177
>
>
http://toolbar.msn.com/go/onm00200414ave/direct/01/
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | DThomas773(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Fuselage Steps |
Hey Guys,
The best solution to this problem, and the route I took, is build a
taildragger.
Dennis Thomas
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Bill Repucci" <bill(at)repucci.com> |
Dennis you beat me to it. The -9A is a TALL airplane, I was stunned at
how tall they are the first time I stood next to one. I can't wait to
see a TD version up close and personal.
Bill R.
RV-9
SN: 90737
Right wing
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv9-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv9-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of
DThomas773(at)aol.com
Subject: Re: RV9-List: Fuselage Steps
Hey Guys,
The best solution to this problem, and the route I took, is build a
taildragger.
Dennis Thomas
==
direct advertising on the Matronics Forums.
==
==
==
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Sargentclt(at)cs.com |
| Subject: | Re: Dropped bucking bar--Need ding fix |
Aircraft Spruce sell a two part dent filler specifically for metal.
Or you can use automotive body filler if the dent is shallow, say 1\8 " or
less. Hope that helps
Tad Sargent
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Sargentclt(at)cs.com |
| Subject: | Re: Fuselage Steps |
Beauty is in the eye. They are a functional necessity. I have a
friend with a Cirrus 22 and they have these steps. Anyway if you have a trigear
configuration and you install them they tend to dissapear when it is finished.
My .02 worth.
Tad
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Cory Emberson" <bootless(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | Santa Maria CA Fly-in (April 30-May 2) |
Hello everyone!
With Matt Dralle's blessing (thank you, Matt!), I'm pleased to post this announcement
for a terrific aviation fly-in weekend. SMXgig (in Santa Maria, CA) has
become the year's largest face-to-face get-together of electronically networked
aviators. We hope you'll plan to attend because we expect this year's gig to
be the best ever.
People come from all over the country (and sometimes overseas) to attend, and most of the sessions qualify for FAA Wings cards. The dates are 4/30-5/2/04 (Friday-Sunday) - it's a lot of fun, and a great chance for pilots from all over to mingle and share aviation stories, ideas, etc. The announcement below contains most of the crucial information, and you can get the rest from the website (www.smxgig.org). If you have any questions at all, just let me know, and thanks!
~~Cory Emberson
KHWD
>>> NOTICE TO AIRMEN! <<<
Announcing the Sixteenth Annual SMXgig
to be held on April 30 - May 2, 2004
at the Radisson on the Santa Maria (CA) Airport (aka SMX)
www.smxgig.org
SMXgig will be April 30 - May 2, 2004, at the Santa Maria Radisson. This year,
our featured speaker after Friday night's dinner will be Rod Machado!
"MACH 2 WITH MACHADO" is the byline Rod Machado has earned for his rapid fire delivery
at his lively safety seminars and keynote speeches. His programs are information-packed,
energetic, and humorous. He has spoken in all fifty of the
United States and in Europe sharing his fresh approach to aviation education.
If you can make it, please do. It's going to be pretty special. More information and the announcement/ registration info is available at www.smxgig.org You may also contact me by email at: cory(at)smxgig.org.
All technical sessions will be held in the Enterprise Ballroom at the SMX Radisson.
Each session will last about an hour. We schedule four tech sessions on Saturday
morning, and four on Sunday morning. Most of the speakers are set (I'm
still firming up a couple of slots - I'm working on a session about Experimentals):
MIKE BUSCH - The Art and Science of Troubleshooting
Your A frequently, that person is you. That's particularly true of problems that
occur only in-flight and/or are intermittent. This session offers methodology
for troubleshooting aimed at aircraft owners who aren't A&Ps.
ED WILLIAMS - GPS - How It Works, and How to Work It
Ed is a nuclear physicist working at Lawrence Livermore Labs. Ed does a
remarkable job of making physics phun!
BRENT BLUE, M.D. - Pilot Medicals: How to Avoid Problems with the FAA
Brent is an AME Advocate, who specializes in helping the tough cases renew their
medicals. He's a former member of EAA's medical advisory committee.
DOUG RITTER - Equipping Yourself To Survive - Personal Survival Gear for Pilots
Doug is a survival evangelist, personally driven to help pilots live through whatever comes next. www.equipped.org
PAUL MILLNER - The Future of Avgas
Paul works with ChevronTexaco, and is right in the middle of the industry developments
regarding our fuel of choice.
MARY DUFFY & UWE LEMKE - Flying in Europe
Mary and Uwe are a Scot and a German who live in the San Francisco Bay Area, but
return "home" often.
As always, each qualifying session will get you a WINGS Safety Session card.
Our Saturday evening event should be a delicious one! At 5:45 p.m., the BFUB (Big Fat Ugly Bus) will arrive at the Santa Maria Radisson to bring us to the Far Western Tavern for dinner in beautiful Guadalupe (www.farwesterntavern.com).
DOLLARS AND CENTS
Just as in previous years, there will be one flat all-encompassing "gig" fee that
covers all events that involve significant out-of-pocket costs for the organizers.
The fee is $160 per person, and will cover:
- Friday afternoon welcome party
- Friday evening dinner banquet
- Saturday and Sunday tech sessions
- Saturday afternoon lunch
- Saturday evening dinner at the Far Western Tavern in Guadalupe
- Meeting rooms and coffee service at the Santa Maria Radisson
- Transportation to (and from) the Far Western Tavern
Lodging at the SMX Radisson will cost $89.00/night for either a single or double
room, which is far below the regular hotel room rate. Be sure you check in as
a SMXgig attendee and get the special rate. We have our definitive preference
listed with the hotel for rampside rooms - early registration can only help,
but of course, the rampside rooms are subject to availability depending on how
many existing guests are in those rooms.
You do not need to register with the hotel - just give me your preferences, and
I will take care of the reservations.
Important: This year, our final rooming lists are due to the hotel on April 11,
2004 (the even of Sun 'n Fun), which will guarantee space and the group rate.
The hotel will accept additional room reservations after that, on a space- and
rate-available basis. They will try their best to accommodate us after that
date, but the hotel is already sold out for the weekend.
The website (www.smxgig.org) has detailed information about the schedule, meals, hotel accommodations, and online registration. If you'd like your own announcement/registration emailed to you, or have any other questions, just let me know. (cory(at)smxgig.org or bootless(at)earthlink.net ).
Thanks, and see you there!
best, Cory Emberson
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Merems" <merems(at)cox.net> |
, ,
,
| Subject: | ExperimentalAero is alive and well (DRDT-2) |
Fellow RV builders,
ExperimentalAero website and email are back on line.
Once in a while a tool comes along that changes the way we do things. The DRDT-2 is such a tool. Visit www.experimentalaero.com and see the future of dimpling tools. If you going to be at Sun and Fun next month, stop by Avery Tools and test drive the DRDT-2 and experience for yourself what builders across the globe are using to easily, safely, consistently, and quietly dimple their RV components.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Laurel Mckone" <lmckone(at)xtalwind.net> |
| Subject: | Fuel Tank Vent Tubing |
While doing a 10hr check I found that the left Rudder cable was rubbing on the
fuel tank vent where it goes up past the rudder cable. Aparently when I tightned
the tubing the elbow turned and bent the tubing in slightly. The rudder cable
was just touching and had just pollished the tubing where it come in contact,
no damage done. It might be advisable for all to check theirs also. Happy
Flying, Laurel N120LM
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Terry Hobert" <terhobey(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Fuselage Steps |
Good point Tad. I took a look atr the retractables, only the unsightly part
still shows. The RV is such a nice clean aircraft and these type steps are
a lot of parasitic drag. Just wondering.
Terry Hobert 9A, fuselage
>From: Sargentclt(at)cs.com
>Reply-To: rv9-list(at)matronics.com
>To: rv9-list(at)matronics.com
>Subject: Re: RV9-List: Fuselage Steps
>Date: Sat, 27 Mar 2004 13:50:29 EST
>
>
> Beauty is in the eye. They are a functional necessity. I have a
>friend with a Cirrus 22 and they have these steps. Anyway if you have a
>trigear
>configuration and you install them they tend to dissapear when it is
>finished.
>My .02 worth.
>Tad
>
>
download! http://toolbar.msn.com/go/onm00200413ave/direct/01/
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Andy Karmy <andy(at)karmy.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Fuselage Steps |
Hum, drag? They are in the wash of the wing and fuselage. I think Van
once said they "might" make 1kt difference.
- Andy (with 2 steps and using them every time I go flying!)
On Mar 29, 2004, at 8:09 AM, Terry Hobert wrote:
>
> Good point Tad. I took a look atr the retractables, only the
> unsightly part
> still shows. The RV is such a nice clean aircraft and these type
> steps are
> a lot of parasitic drag. Just wondering.
>
> Terry Hobert 9A, fuselage
>
>
>> From: Sargentclt(at)cs.com
>> Reply-To: rv9-list(at)matronics.com
>> To: rv9-list(at)matronics.com
>> Subject: Re: RV9-List: Fuselage Steps
>> Date: Sat, 27 Mar 2004 13:50:29 EST
>>
>>
>> Beauty is in the eye. They are a functional necessity. I
>> have a
>> friend with a Cirrus 22 and they have these steps. Anyway if you
>> have a
>> trigear
>> configuration and you install them they tend to dissapear when it is
>> finished.
>> My .02 worth.
>> Tad
>>
>>
>
> download! http://toolbar.msn.com/go/onm00200413ave/direct/01/
>
>
> _-
> =======================================================================
> _-
> =======================================================================
> _-
> =======================================================================
> _-
> =======================================================================
> >
>
>
- Andy Karmy
andy(at)karmy.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Garey Wittich <gareywittich2000(at)yahoo.com> |
| Subject: | A GUIDE TO AIRCRAFT PAINTING & CORROSION CONTROL |
rv7-list(at)matronics.com, rv8-list(at)matronics.com
For helpful information see:
See Nov 03 Archieves:
"A GUIDE TO AIRCRAFT PAINTING & CORROSION
CONTROL"
__________________________________
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | A good day's remotivation .... |
| From: | Gerry Filby <gerf(at)gerf.com> |
Spent the afternoon at SQL in a 2000 Cessna 172SP ... one more
BFR under my belt .... first time I'd flown an all aluminum
certified bird, thought it would be interesting since my
regular ride is a Diamond Katana
Man, what an eye opener the pre-flight was - have you ever
taken a close look at the construction of those Cessnas ? All
the rivets (double the spacing of our RVs) are raised head.
The fit and finish is ... well, amateur is the word that comes
to mind, but that doesn't make sense. As for the motor - a
bitch to start, sounded worse than my old Dad's lawn mower. And
it drives like a tractor.
When I got home I had to take a shower - boy was this project
ever the right decision ... for me.
g
==========================================================
Gerry Filby gerf(at)gerf.com
Home (415) 239 4846
Cell (415) 203 9177
-----------------------------7d42872a90110
1
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | JVonDolen(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Steel Fittings vs Aluminum |
My engine came with an AN 823-6 fitting at the carb inlet (45 degree elbow,
steel). I was all set to use it in attaching my fuel inlet hose but noticed
that Van's calls out a 823-6D (aluminum). I went ahead and put the alum fitting
in, but an wondering in general when are steel fittings used and what are the
differences?
Thanks,
John von Dohlen
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Paul Eastham <eastham(at)netapp.com> |
| Subject: | drilling counterweights |
Hi all,
I tried to start on my ailerons today and ran into a couple roadblocks.
For one, I got two right nose skins and no left nose skins. Hopefully
Van's won't make me buy a left one.
More importantly, on my right aileron, I've marked up the steel
counterweight tube and am trying to figure out a good way to drill it.
I've seen the drill-press jig that Avery sells... Is that the way to
go or can I improvise with something else? I was thinking about
clamping some wood blocks on the drill press to keep it on target.
(or can I just drill it with a hand drill? my experience with steel
is nil. I know I need lubrication and slower drill speeds but that's
about it.)
Also, I saw someone mention priming the *inside* of these tubes...really.
Is this stainless steel or what?
Thanks,
Paul (fuselage coming soon, trying to finish wings as much as possible)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Paul Pflimlin" <pablo(at)phonewave.net> |
| Subject: | Re: drilling counterweights |
----- Original Message -----
From: "Paul Eastham" <eastham(at)netapp.com>
Subject: RV9-List: drilling counterweights
With the 1/2" galvanized pipe clamped in place, leading edge and end pieces
clecoed on; the hand held drill works fine!
>
> Hi all,
> I tried to start on my ailerons today and ran into a couple roadblocks.
> For one, I got two right nose skins and no left nose skins. Hopefully
> Van's won't make me buy a left one.
>
> More importantly, on my right aileron, I've marked up the steel
> counterweight tube and am trying to figure out a good way to drill it.
> I've seen the drill-press jig that Avery sells... Is that the way to
> go or can I improvise with something else? I was thinking about
> clamping some wood blocks on the drill press to keep it on target.
> (or can I just drill it with a hand drill? my experience with steel
> is nil. I know I need lubrication and slower drill speeds but that's
> about it.)
>
> Also, I saw someone mention priming the *inside* of these tubes...really.
> Is this stainless steel or what?
>
> Thanks,
> Paul (fuselage coming soon, trying to finish wings as much as possible)
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Andy Karmy <andy(at)karmy.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Steel Fittings vs Aluminum |
I decided to use steel on all locations that were attached to the
engine that carried fuel. I figure that the steel should be more crack
resistant and in a location that moves quite a bit (attached to the
carb) I don't want a crack on that fitting. I used aluminum everywhere
else.
- Andy
On Apr 2, 2004, at 12:54 PM, JVonDolen(at)aol.com wrote:
>
> My engine came with an AN 823-6 fitting at the carb inlet (45 degree
> elbow,
> steel). I was all set to use it in attaching my fuel inlet hose but
> noticed
> that Van's calls out a 823-6D (aluminum). I went ahead and put the
> alum fitting
> in, but an wondering in general when are steel fittings used and what
> are the
> differences?
>
> Thanks,
>
> John von Dohlen
>
>
> _-
> =======================================================================
> _-
> =======================================================================
> _-
> =======================================================================
> _-
> =======================================================================
> >
>
>
- Andy Karmy
andy(at)karmy.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | DThomas773(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Annual Maintenance Manual |
Hi Guys,
I know if we build the things we should be smart enough to do an annual on
them. However, I'm a by the numbers,step #1, step #2 etc, kind of person. I'm
more comfortable with a book or list or someone to tell me just what needs to
be done.
Is there a generic guideline out there somewhere?
Ken Scott said to go to the Van's Air Force sight by Reeves, but I don't find
anything there and they don't return my emails.
Appreciate any input.
Dennis Thomas
RV9 flying, until it went to the paint shop.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Roger Ping" <rpping(at)qwest.net> |
| Subject: | Annual Maintenance Manual |
Look at FAR Part 43 appendix D.
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv9-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv9-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of
DThomas773(at)aol.com
Subject: RV9-List: Annual Maintenance Manual
Hi Guys,
I know if we build the things we should be smart enough to do an annual
on
them. However, I'm a by the numbers,step #1, step #2 etc, kind of
person. I'm
more comfortable with a book or list or someone to tell me just what
needs to
be done.
Is there a generic guideline out there somewhere?
Ken Scott said to go to the Van's Air Force sight by Reeves, but I don't
find
anything there and they don't return my emails.
Appreciate any input.
Dennis Thomas
RV9 flying, until it went to the paint shop.
==
==
==
==
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Andy Karmy <andy(at)karmy.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Annual Maintenance Manual |
Hey Dennis,
I took an original source from Randy Levold which was for an RV8 and
modified it to work for my RV9A.
http://www.karmy.com/rv9a/reference/index.htm
You may need to modify it some more to fit your plane, but the basics
are there. I Just did my first inspection last month!
185 trouble free hours!
- Andy
On Apr 4, 2004, at 9:10 PM, DThomas773(at)aol.com wrote:
>
> Hi Guys,
> I know if we build the things we should be smart enough to do an
> annual on
> them. However, I'm a by the numbers,step #1, step #2 etc, kind of
> person. I'm
> more comfortable with a book or list or someone to tell me just what
> needs to
> be done.
> Is there a generic guideline out there somewhere?
> Ken Scott said to go to the Van's Air Force sight by Reeves, but I
> don't find
> anything there and they don't return my emails.
> Appreciate any input.
>
> Dennis Thomas
> RV9 flying, until it went to the paint shop.
>
>
> _-
> =======================================================================
> _-
> =======================================================================
> _-
> =======================================================================
> _-
> =======================================================================
> >
>
>
- Andy Karmy
andy(at)karmy.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Edcarris(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Longeron Bending Drawing |
Does are the big drawings you got (you should have two copys)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | DThomas773(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Annual Maintenance Manual |
In a message dated 4/5/2004 8:09:19 AM Pacific Standard Time, andy(at)karmy.com
writes:
> http://www.karmy.com/rv9a/reference/index.htm
>
Hi Andy,
Wow! 185 hours. My first flight was 2/22/04. Barely have 30 hours and I bit
the bullet and put it in the paint shop. It's going to cost a fortune but I
didn't want to do it myself and I know the longer you wait the worse it will
be.
Thanks for the information. I am sort of embarrassed. I looked at your
website before I made my post and did see the new heading"Condition Inspection
Checklist".
I thought, or didn't think, that was something else and went right on by.
Thanks a lot.
Dennis
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | DLOMHEIM(at)aol.com |
I would like to build a light weight deck into the back of my fuselage and
behind the baggage area bulkhead to place a couple of fishing fly rods, skis,
etc. up there. Anyway, have any of you considered this or know of anyone
already doing it? Thanks.
Doug
90116 fuselage
"ONCE YOU HAVE TASTED FLIGHT YOU WILL WALK THIS EARTH WITH YOUR EYES TURNED
SKYWARD. FOR THERE YOU HAVE BEEN, AND THERE YOU LONG TO RETURN"
Leonardo Da Vinci
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Andy Karmy <andy(at)karmy.com> |
There are pictures of how to do it on Doug Reves site under builder
modifications.
On Apr 12, 2004, at 5:11 AM, DLOMHEIM(at)aol.com wrote:
>
> I would like to build a light weight deck into the back of my fuselage
> and
> behind the baggage area bulkhead to place a couple of fishing fly
> rods, skis,
> etc. up there. Anyway, have any of you considered this or know of
> anyone
> already doing it? Thanks.
>
> Doug
> 90116 fuselage
>
>
> "ONCE YOU HAVE TASTED FLIGHT YOU WILL WALK THIS EARTH WITH YOUR EYES
> TURNED
> SKYWARD. FOR THERE YOU HAVE BEEN, AND THERE YOU LONG TO RETURN"
> Leonardo Da Vinci
>
>
> _-
> =======================================================================
> _-
> =======================================================================
> _-
> =======================================================================
> _-
> =======================================================================
> >
>
>
- Andy Karmy
andy(at)karmy.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | daniel conners <conners(at)erols.com> |
| Subject: | No subject was specified. |
Lack of time and funds is forcing the sale my completed tail kit and 30%
complete
wing kit . (RV-9) If interested please reply offline
work phone 610-622-1771
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | JVonDolen(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Shield on Manifold Pressure 4 Conductor Cable |
Greetings,
The kit from Van's for hooking up your manifold pressure gage includes a
shielded 4 conductor cable to use, but the instructons don't mention what to do
with the shield. Did yall connect it to the ground stud on the instrument or
what?
Thanks,
John Von Dohlen
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | James Nelson <europajim(at)juno.com> |
Hi guys,
I am looking for someone who has decided to give it up and sell
their tail plane kit. (completed of course). I am going to build the RV
9A. Please let me know.
Jim Nelson
Europajim(at)juno.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bill Ervin <n57wc(at)yahoo.com> |
| Subject: | Re: RV9-List Digest: 1 Msgs - 04/14/04 |
Go to Dougs website (www.vansaircraft.net) check the
classifieds. There was a 9 tail kit for sale
yesterday.
Bill
--- RV9-List Digest Server
wrote:
> *
>
> ==================================================
> Online Versions of Today's List Digest Archive
> ==================================================
>
> Today's complete RV9-List Digest can be also be
> found in either
> of the two Web Links listed below. The .html file
> includes the Digest
> formatted in HTML for viewing with a web browser and
> features Hyperlinked
> Indexes and Message Navigation. The .txt file
> includes the plain ASCII
> version of the RV9-List Digest and can be viewed
> with a generic
> text editor such as Notepad or with a web browser.
>
> HTML Version:
>
>
>
http://www.matronics.com/digest/rv9-list/Digest.RV9-List.2004-04-14.html
>
> Text Version:
>
>
>
http://www.matronics.com/digest/rv9-list/Digest.RV9-List.2004-04-14.txt
>
>
> ================================================
> EMail Version of Today's List Digest Archive
> ================================================
>
>
>
>
> RV9-List Digest Archive
> ---
> Total Messages Posted Wed
> 04/14/04: 1
>
>
>
>
> Today's Message Index:
> ----------------------
>
> 1. 04:54 PM - Re: Rear Deck (James Nelson)
>
>
>
> ________________________________ Message 1
> _____________________________________
>
>
> Subject: Re: RV9-List: Rear Deck
> From: James Nelson <europajim(at)juno.com>
>
>
>
> Hi guys,
> I am looking for someone who has decided to
> give it up and sell
> their tail plane kit. (completed of course). I am
> going to build the RV
> 9A. Please let me know.
>
> Jim Nelson
> Europajim(at)juno.com
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Contributions
> any other
> Forums.
>
> http://www.matronics.com/chat
>
> http://www.matronics.com/subscription
> http://www.matronics.com/FAQ/RV9-List.htm
> http://www.matronics.com/archives
> http://www.matronics.com/photoshare
> http://www.matronics.com/emaillists
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
__________________________________
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Paul Eastham <eastham(at)netapp.com> |
Hi All,
So I was finishing up my first aileron today, doing the trailing-edge
double-flush rivets. "Boy, these -3 rivets sure look short for this
hole"... But remembering the manual's advice not to go for longer rivets
here, I forged ahead.
My shop heads are really pretty small. Much smaller than on the
rudder, where the dimples seem pretty full. Here, there is a lot of
empty space in the dimple. They are clearly smaller than the avery
shop-head gauge when placed over them. You can't see the edge of the
hole, though. (poor picture...look at the right hand one:
http://hmb.dyndns.org/~eastham/rv/images/20040415_IMG_0657.JPG )
I think the problem stems from my AEX wedge location; mine is probably
slightly further aft than it should be. I was definitely catching a
thicker part of it than on the rudder/elevators.
Anyone else have a similar experience? I'm tempted to drill them out
and go to -3.5. I guess I could try a few first then see how they go.
Paul
http://hmb.dyndns.org/~eastham/rv
PS: Anyone found a fast(er) way to countersink the AEX yet? I have
been spring-clamping the thing to my drill press for each hole, to
keep the countersink from taking a huge bite. I've got 1 aileron and
2 huge flaps to go, not looking forward to that...
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Paul Eastham <eastham(at)netapp.com> |
| Subject: | More on aileron TE |
So all the double-flush trailing edges in the kit use the same 11.9
AEX extrusion. Yet the rudder and elevator call for -3.5 rivets while
the aileron and flaps call for -3. Makes no sense!
I'm worried about the ability of my undersize shop heads to hold onto
that skin...I'll see what Van's has to say about it, though I think
they're all still away at SnF.
Paul
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Dean" <dvanwinkle(at)royell.net> |
| Subject: | Re: More on aileron TE |
Paul
I missed the difference in rivet callout between the two kits and started
with the -3s and had less than satisfactory results. I had to remove
the -3s because they were giving insufficent clamp-up with the shop head. Go
with -3.5s from the beginning and you won't be sorry. I wish Van's would
correct that callout. I suggested it at the time of my problems.
Dean Van Winkle ( Retired Aero Engineer )
RV-9A Fuselage/Finish
----- Original Message -----
From: "Paul Eastham" <eastham(at)netapp.com>
Subject: RV9-List: More on aileron TE
>
> So all the double-flush trailing edges in the kit use the same 11.9
> AEX extrusion. Yet the rudder and elevator call for -3.5 rivets while
> the aileron and flaps call for -3. Makes no sense!
>
> I'm worried about the ability of my undersize shop heads to hold onto
> that skin...I'll see what Van's has to say about it, though I think
> they're all still away at SnF.
>
> Paul
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Dean" <dvanwinkle(at)royell.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Aileron oops? |
Paul
I answered your second post before I found this one. Regarding
countersinking the AEX wedges, I built the rectangular 2x4/particleboard
frame called out under Aileron Preparations. You can see a corner of it in
Fig 7-24. I clamped the thin side of the AEX wedges even with the edges of
the particleboard and drilled the hole patterns into the particle board
before starting the countersinking. The particleboard holes accept the
countersink pilot and keep it from drifting. This edge mounting of the
wedges allows the countersink tool base to stay flat on the wedge itself.
Hope this helps.
Dean Van Winkle
----- Original Message -----
From: "Paul Eastham" <eastham(at)netapp.com>
Subject: RV9-List: Aileron oops?
>
> Hi All,
> So I was finishing up my first aileron today, doing the trailing-edge
> double-flush rivets. "Boy, these -3 rivets sure look short for this
> hole"... But remembering the manual's advice not to go for longer rivets
> here, I forged ahead.
>
> My shop heads are really pretty small. Much smaller than on the
> rudder, where the dimples seem pretty full. Here, there is a lot of
> empty space in the dimple. They are clearly smaller than the avery
> shop-head gauge when placed over them. You can't see the edge of the
> hole, though. (poor picture...look at the right hand one:
> http://hmb.dyndns.org/~eastham/rv/images/20040415_IMG_0657.JPG )
>
> I think the problem stems from my AEX wedge location; mine is probably
> slightly further aft than it should be. I was definitely catching a
> thicker part of it than on the rudder/elevators.
>
> Anyone else have a similar experience? I'm tempted to drill them out
> and go to -3.5. I guess I could try a few first then see how they go.
>
> Paul
> http://hmb.dyndns.org/~eastham/rv
>
> PS: Anyone found a fast(er) way to countersink the AEX yet? I have
> been spring-clamping the thing to my drill press for each hole, to
> keep the countersink from taking a huge bite. I've got 1 aileron and
> 2 huge flaps to go, not looking forward to that...
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Mike Hoover" <mikehoover(at)sc.rr.com> |
| Subject: | Re: More on aileron TE |
Seems like I remember somebody contacting Vans recently about this and Vans
said they are planning to change to drawings to call for 3.5's.
Mike
90709 wings
----- Original Message -----
From: "Dean" <dvanwinkle(at)royell.net>
Subject: Re: RV9-List: More on aileron TE
>
> Paul
>
> I missed the difference in rivet callout between the two kits and started
> with the -3s and had less than satisfactory results. I had to remove
> the -3s because they were giving insufficent clamp-up with the shop head.
Go
> with -3.5s from the beginning and you won't be sorry. I wish Van's would
> correct that callout. I suggested it at the time of my problems.
>
> Dean Van Winkle ( Retired Aero Engineer )
> RV-9A Fuselage/Finish
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Paul Eastham" <eastham(at)netapp.com>
> To:
> Subject: RV9-List: More on aileron TE
>
>
> >
> > So all the double-flush trailing edges in the kit use the same 11.9
> > AEX extrusion. Yet the rudder and elevator call for -3.5 rivets while
> > the aileron and flaps call for -3. Makes no sense!
> >
> > I'm worried about the ability of my undersize shop heads to hold onto
> > that skin...I'll see what Van's has to say about it, though I think
> > they're all still away at SnF.
> >
> > Paul
> >
> >
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Aileron oops? |
| From: | Mark Schrimmer <mschrimmer(at)pacbell.net> |
Paul,
Looking at your picture, I'd say that your trailing edge rivets look like
mine. I haven't flown yet, but my trailing edges seem pretty sturdy. Please
let us know what you learn from the factory. I'd hate to have to drill out
all those trailing edge rivets!
With regards to countersinking the trailing edges, I bought some extra
pieces of AEX wedge and placed them under the AEX wedge I was trying to
countersink. This kept the wedge reasonably level and I was able to keep the
countersink cage on the wedge without any problems. I left a gap between the
pieces of AEX directly under the hole I was countersinking so the
countersink cutter could go all the way through, without bottoming out on
the pieces underneath.
Mark
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | DThomas773(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Aileron oops? |
Hi Paul,
This is an issue that has come up several times in the past couple years and
I believe Van's will tell you to go to 3.5 rivets. That is what I did and
they came out fine.
Dennis Thomas
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bob Kelly <mmpi(at)missionmedia.org> |
| Subject: | Re: Aileron oops? |
Paul,
I know not many people have one, but a small lathe or milling machine really
speeds things up. I did the right elevator trailing edge in about 15-20
minutes and the results were great. You can pick up a Taig lathe with a
milling adapter for about $300 and I would think a ShopSmith could be
adapted. I have a picture at www.missionmedia.org/RV-9A.html Click on the
"Emp Tips" button. There is a wood block in the jaws (not visible) that
holds the proper angle and allows a slip fit for the wedge.
Bob Kelly, Wings
> PS: Anyone found a fast(er) way to countersink the AEX yet? I have
> been spring-clamping the thing to my drill press for each hole, to
> keep the countersink from taking a huge bite. I've got 1 aileron and
> 2 huge flaps to go, not looking forward to that...
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "John Oliveira" <oliveira(at)frontiernet.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Aileron oops? |
Mine look the same as the ones one the elevator and rudder. No problem.
Wait until you get to the flaps. It is really satisfying when you get that
almost 7 foot long trailing edge done and it is actually true!
John Oliveira
Working on Fuselage N909RV reserved
----- Original Message -----
From: "Paul Eastham" <eastham(at)netapp.com>
Subject: RV9-List: Aileron oops?
>
> Hi All,
> So I was finishing up my first aileron today, doing the trailing-edge
> double-flush rivets. "Boy, these -3 rivets sure look short for this
> hole"... But remembering the manual's advice not to go for longer rivets
> here, I forged ahead.
>
> My shop heads are really pretty small. Much smaller than on the
> rudder, where the dimples seem pretty full. Here, there is a lot of
> empty space in the dimple. They are clearly smaller than the avery
> shop-head gauge when placed over them. You can't see the edge of the
> hole, though. (poor picture...look at the right hand one:
> http://hmb.dyndns.org/~eastham/rv/images/20040415_IMG_0657.JPG )
>
> I think the problem stems from my AEX wedge location; mine is probably
> slightly further aft than it should be. I was definitely catching a
> thicker part of it than on the rudder/elevators.
>
> Anyone else have a similar experience? I'm tempted to drill them out
> and go to -3.5. I guess I could try a few first then see how they go.
>
> Paul
> http://hmb.dyndns.org/~eastham/rv
>
> PS: Anyone found a fast(er) way to countersink the AEX yet? I have
> been spring-clamping the thing to my drill press for each hole, to
> keep the countersink from taking a huge bite. I've got 1 aileron and
> 2 huge flaps to go, not looking forward to that...
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "John Oliveira" <oliveira(at)frontiernet.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Aileron oops? |
I hate to admit this with all you guys coming up with all these fixtures and
fancy ways of doing the counter sinking. I just did mine with air drill and
counter sink tool, hand holding. Results look great. Message is, don't
kill yourself being too precise. It is not necessary.
John Oliveira
N909RV reserved
----- Original Message -----
From: "Bob Kelly" <mmpi(at)missionmedia.org>
Subject: Re: RV9-List: Aileron oops?
>
> Paul,
>
> I know not many people have one, but a small lathe or milling machine
really
> speeds things up. I did the right elevator trailing edge in about 15-20
> minutes and the results were great. You can pick up a Taig lathe with a
> milling adapter for about $300 and I would think a ShopSmith could be
> adapted. I have a picture at www.missionmedia.org/RV-9A.html Click on
the
> "Emp Tips" button. There is a wood block in the jaws (not visible) that
> holds the proper angle and allows a slip fit for the wedge.
>
> Bob Kelly, Wings
>
>
> > PS: Anyone found a fast(er) way to countersink the AEX yet? I have
> > been spring-clamping the thing to my drill press for each hole, to
> > keep the countersink from taking a huge bite. I've got 1 aileron and
> > 2 huge flaps to go, not looking forward to that...
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Nut torques on Rod End Bearings |
| From: | Gerry Filby <gerf(at)gerf.com> |
Folks,
I'm installing the rod end bearings into the rudder and
elevators and wondering what to torque down the locking nuts to
- its probably under my nose in the Standard Aircraft Handbook
but its eluding me at the moment.
Thx
g
==========================================================
Gerry Filby gerf(at)gerf.com
Home (415) 239 4846
Cell (415) 203 9177
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Aileron oops? |
> PS: Anyone found a fast(er) way to countersink the AEX yet? I have
> been spring-clamping the thing to my drill press for each hole, to
> keep the countersink from taking a huge bite. I've got 1 aileron and
> 2 huge flaps to go, not looking forward to that...
If you place another piece of AEX wedge below the one you're drilling, in
the opposite orientation, the top surface now becomes flat. Now you can use
a drill press to get perfect countersinks. You can cleco the two aileron
wedges together (since hole spacing is the same) and countersink one side,
then the other. Seperate them, turn them over and do the other sides.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | DThomas773(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Aileron oops? |
As Van's once said top me,don't worry about it. You'r just building an
airplane".
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Paul Eastham <eastham(at)netapp.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Aileron oops? |
>
> Paul,
>
> Looking at your picture, I'd say that your trailing edge rivets look like
> mine. I haven't flown yet, but my trailing edges seem pretty sturdy. Please
> let us know what you learn from the factory. I'd hate to have to drill out
> all those trailing edge rivets!
After staring at it for a long while, I realized:
- I wasn't going to feel safe with it as it is, regardless of what the
factory says (still haven't heard back from them)
- With all the time spent emailing and staring at the darn thing, I
could have fixed it by now!
So I drilled them all out. This may have been unwise, because about 5
of the shop heads grabbed the bottom skin and caused the skin to
explode outward as I punched out the head (despite using a backing
block). FORTUNATELY, a couple whacks with the mushroom set and they
popped right back in to place. (This is with a prosealed wedge -- might
have been worse without)
Now re-riveted with 3.5's, the shop heads look somewhat better but due to
hole expansion and whatnot are still not as good as my rudder and elevators.
But passable, I think.
I will send out what Van's says when they get back to me...
I will also yell at them for not revising the plans! :) Sounds like people
have been reporting this problem to them for a while.
Paul
>
> With regards to countersinking the trailing edges, I bought some extra
> pieces of AEX wedge and placed them under the AEX wedge I was trying to
> countersink. This kept the wedge reasonably level and I was able to keep the
> countersink cage on the wedge without any problems. I left a gap between the
> pieces of AEX directly under the hole I was countersinking so the
> countersink cutter could go all the way through, without bottoming out on
> the pieces underneath.
>
> Mark
>
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Merems" <merems(at)cox.net> |
, ,
, "RV10 Group"
| Subject: | Test drive the DRDT-2 at Sun and Fun |
Check out the DRDT-2 dimpling tool from ExperimentalAero at Avery Tools both at
Sun and Fun. Dimpling will never be the same.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Terry Hobert" <terhobey(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Aileron oops? |
I wasn't going to jump in on this, but!!!! I have to agree with John, I just
hand held the AEX wedges and drilled them with the countersink. I building
my fuselage now and after doing the rudder, elevators, ailerons and flaps,
they all came out beautiful! If you have to have a machine shop to do the
wedges then is it really home building?
Sorry, no disrespect meant! We all have our own ways and that is good to.
Terry Hobert 9A fuselage
February 08, 2004 - April 18, 2004
RV9-Archive.digest.vol-an