Zenith-Archive.digest.vol-fz

September 05, 2006 - September 20, 2006



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Thanks Monty
 
Yes it is a Porsche  914  2.0L engine that I'm building into a 2.6L  engine, with fuel injection.  I'm also going to add a 2.2 reduction drive so that I can develop the true power(72" 3B prop)  of the engine around 5200 rpm(take off).  This should give me about 115hp.
 
So far I have not been able to find anyone who has used the type 4 engine only the type 1.  I did contact the folks in Australia, but they are very difficult to deal with - not very nice.  On there web site they advertise there redrive for sale for type 4 engines - but when you ask for pricing they won't sell it to you, has to be sold with there engine - they get very nasty when questioned about their faulty advertising.
 
There are quite a few web sites offering type 1 conversions along with redrives - but only for the type 1.  Mind you about 90% of the parts could be used for the type 4.
Some of them are:
http://www.airdromeaeroplanes.com /
http://members.socket.net/~ranc hair/
http://www.greatplainsas.c om/welcome.html
http://www.vw-engines.com/
 
I did find one redrive supplier  that can supply all the individual parts needed along with construction drawing to build one. The only problem is its designed for a Subaru but thats no big deal.  Basically all that I would have to have made is a crank hub and mount, which I have done already.. and you can buy it i piece at a time.  The company is very easy to deal with, the web site is:  
Don Parham
RFI Power systems
P.O. Box 263
Indianola, Ok 74442

Phone: 918-823-4610
Fax: 918-823-4690

e-mail rfi(at)oklatel.net
 
PS: I have been in touch with the Smith's. They have a vice setup but it is for the type 1 case.  It's nice to hear that the type 1 will work in a 701.  I will be building on floats so I need all the grunt at the low end that I can get... and that means installing a redrive.  It also helps to dampen any stresses on the crank, which can be a problem with the type 1.
 
Thanks again for your help
Ron Leclerc
 
 
Graves wrote:
>--->-Zenith-List message posted by: Monty Graves <mgraves(at)usmo.com>
>
>
>-Ron,
>
>-I don't know of anyone that has put a type IV engine in the CH701.
>- - There are a few Type I-III VW engines with Valley Eng redrives,
>-made by the Smiths at Culver Props.
>
>-One is my friend B.J. Schwaller, -he has a 1915cc VW and redrive on
>-his 701. - The plane flys weekly now out of Eldon MO. -Pictures of
>-his plane are in Zenith's Builders secton site......
>
>-www.culverprops.com
>
>-The Smiths build and sell VW engines, - redrives for the VW, -and
>-engine mounts for the 701, -and of course really nice wood props.
>
>-I was just over to their shop on Wednesday of this week. - They had
>-just finished another engine mount for the VW engine and Diel Case
>-for a 701 in New Zealand and it was being shipped that day. - -Also
>-word on an IDAHO 701 builder that was just starting to test fly his
>-701 with -the Smiths, -engine mount and their 2275cc VW engine and
>-redrive -Culver Prop package...........So far he is very happy.
>
>-In the next few weeks, -hopefully still in Sept. - -another
>-K.C.Missouri 701 builder is also going to install their complete,
>-mount, -engine, redrive, Culver Prop combo in hsi airplane......
>
>-Monty Graves
>
>

>>--->-Zenith-List message posted by: Ron D Leclerc <infow(at)mts.net>
>>
>>
>>-Has anyone out there had the opportunity to install a Porsche
>>-Type 4 2.6L engine in a 701? -I need some info on an engine mount
>>-and building a redrive... -perhaps someone has built one.
>>
>>-Ron Leclerc
>>-Winnipeg MB Canada
>
>
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>-Features Navigator to browse
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>-and much much more:
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________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Dave" <daberti(at)sbcglobal.net>
Subject: throttle
Date: Sep 05, 2006
Hugh, How do you counter the thrust inputs on the engine? I would think with this setup engine thrust equates to carbs out of sync. It doesn't take much of a movement on the linkage arm to pull different vacuum loads form one carb to the other. ----- Original Message ----- From: Hugh Roberts To: zenith-list(at)matronics.com Sent: Tuesday, September 05, 2006 2:34 PM Subject: Zenith-List: throttle Didn't like cable throttle system,hard to tune carbs. third 912 I have converted,no problem. must build all new bell crank system.line up arms with carb levers. put spring loaded friction on cross tube. Both throttles kept. Hugh Roberts ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: 601 XL
From: "Phyrcooler" <phyrcooler(at)HOTMAIL.COM>
Date: Sep 05, 2006
ggower_99(at)yahoo.com wrote: > I think the problem of doing some acrobatics in any airplane not designed to handle them, is very dangerours... > > > Agreed However - I think that both of us are trying to clarify what, if any acro maneuvers the engineers feel are OK with this craft. While I don't believe that an experimental aircraft is rated as "utility" or "Acrobatic" - the designers should be able to detail the design parameters and/or limits. Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=59750#59750 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Bill Naumuk" <naumuk(at)alltel.net>
Subject: Re: White corrosion
Date: Sep 05, 2006
Kevin- That's what I wanted to hear. Don't care where you live- there's a NAPA within spitting distance. Of course, if it's not in stock........ Here's my big question. It means a lot to me because depending on the answer, I have to shift from "Build" to "Scrub down" mode before going any farther. Once you get some corrosion, do you have to strip interior surfaces clean like you would for a painted surface BEFORE applying your Zinc Chromate or other protectant, or can you just apply the protectant? I don't know- maybe skins stop corroding when you separate so moisture doesn't collect between them and you don't have to do anything. I don't think you have a choice but to thoroughly clean the painted surfaces. All input, especially from builders who found themselves in the same situation, is appreciated. do not archive Bill Naumuk HDS Fuselage Townville, Pa ----- Original Message ----- From: Trainnut01(at)aol.com To: zenith-list(at)matronics.com Sent: Tuesday, September 05, 2006 1:45 AM Subject: Re: Zenith-List: White corrosion Kevin NAPA carries a Martin-Senour product called "Twin Etch". Van's recommends it on their RVs. ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Dave Ruddiman" <pacificpainting(at)comcast.net>
Subject: Re: Leading Edge Dents
Date: Sep 05, 2006
Hi Kenny, I'd like to see the pictures of how you did the leading edge wrap. From your post and the others that I've seen, it sounds like I am doing it the same way. I didn't pull the skin in quite as tight as I should have. I also adjusted how the wing sits on the table so I can pull more to the back instead of straight down or to the front. That alone seems to help. Also, using more boards on the leading edge seems to help. I think I am going to shim the areas by the slat brackets a little bit and move on. Thanks to everyone for the helpful comments and suggestions. This isn't my first project and I have to quit getting so fixated on things when they don't go completely as planned. Dave in Salem 801 ----- Original Message ----- From: Kenny Aron To: zenith-list(at)matronics.com Sent: Tuesday, September 05, 2006 7:08 AM Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Leading Edge Dents Dave, I'm also one of those lonely 801 builders, and just wrapped my r/w leading edge last week. To bring the skin up snug to the nose ribs, I did two things: 1. I cleco'd in place the slat pickups. This gave me "handles" to keep the nose ribs aligned as I was wrapping the skin. 2. After initially positioning the skin, (and noticing the same gap you have), I placed a 12ft 2x4 edgewise along the slat pickups, then repositioned the straps around it. Doing this concentrated the pulling force of the straps directly onto the area it was most needed. The 2x4 will cover the bottom-most hole, but if you drill & cleco the other's, they will hold the skin in position while you reposition the straps again. I've got pictures of the process, but since I just did this I haven't uploaded them to the site yet. Let me know if you want to see them & I'll post them tonight. Good luck -- \|/-\|/-\|/-\|/-\|/-\|/-\|/-\|/-\|/-\|/-\|/-\|/-\|/-\|/-\|/ --Kenny A. http://websites.expercraft.com/kennya/ ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "kevinbonds" <kevinbonds(at)comcast.net>
Subject: White corrosion
Date: Sep 05, 2006
This is a good question. I am no expert so I can give you no expert opinion. But my thinking is that, while I plan to clean everything as well as zinc oxide, I think self-etching Zinc oxide would offer good control because of its galvanic properties. I would not prefer a wash primer like Cortec for a surface that was showing some signs of oxidation. I copied the following from Wikipedia: "Zinc coatings prevent oxidation of the protected metal by forming a barrier, and by acting as a sacrificial <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sacrificial_anode> anode if this barrier is damaged. Zinc oxide <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zinc_oxide> is a fine white dust that (in contrast to iron oxide) does not cause a breakdown of the substrate <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Plating> 's surface integrity as it is formed. Indeed the zinc oxide, if undisturbed, can act as a barrier to further oxidation <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oxidation> , in a way similar to the protection <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Passivation> afforded to <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aluminium> aluminium and stainless <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stainless_steel> steels by their oxide layers." Also it is my understanding that this galvanic protection can extend beyond the treatment area by 1/8 inch (?) or so. Kevin Bonds Nashville TN 601XL Plans building. <http://home.comcast.net/~kevinbonds> http://home.comcast.net/~kevinbonds _____ From: owner-zenith-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-zenith-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Bill Naumuk Sent: Tuesday, September 05, 2006 6:13 PM Subject: Re: Zenith-List: White corrosion Kevin- That's what I wanted to hear. Don't care where you live- there's a NAPA within spitting distance. Of course, if it's not in stock........ Here's my big question. It means a lot to me because depending on the answer, I have to shift from "Build" to "Scrub down" mode before going any farther. Once you get some corrosion, do you have to strip interior surfaces clean like you would for a painted surface BEFORE applying your Zinc Chromate or other protectant, or can you just apply the protectant? I don't know- maybe skins stop corroding when you separate so moisture doesn't collect between them and you don't have to do anything. I don't think you have a choice but to thoroughly clean the painted surfaces. All input, especially from builders who found themselves in the same situation, is appreciated. do not archive Bill Naumuk HDS Fuselage Townville, Pa ----- Original Message ----- From: Trainnut01(at)aol.com Sent: Tuesday, September 05, 2006 1:45 AM Subject: Re: Zenith-List: White corrosion Kevin NAPA carries a Martin-Senour product called "Twin Etch". Van's recommends it on their RVs. bsp; available via -========================nbsp; Email List nbsp; generous bsp; ================ ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Another 601 trainer
Date: Sep 05, 2006
From: "Bill Cardell" <Bill(at)flyinmiata.com>
I don't know anything about this guy yet, just sent him an email after seeing an ad at a local airport, but if anyone is looking for training in a 601in Colorado, check this out. www.gjsportpilot.com He's in Delta, CO. No affiliation, yada, yada. TurboDog's Dad Bill Cardell www.flyinmiata.com 1-800-FLY-MX5S 970-242-3800 ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Hard woods
From: "Ron Lendon" <rlendon(at)comcast.net>
Date: Sep 05, 2006
I asked that question about a year ago and found that the consensus was MDF. I used the premium MDF and made my wing rib forms just about 10 months ago then sealed them with poly urethane. Here we are now taking them off the self and cutting the reliefs (crimps) in them to begin forming. They are real flat and true and I only need em to make one right and one left hand part. I think they will be just fine. I was careful with the nose rib form and made 9 rights and 9 lefts on them and they held up OK. I did make a small aluminum block so smooth out the very forward radius. The nice thing about the MDF is it works real quick and is fairly cheap. Oak might take more time but will last forever, are you going into production? -------- Ron Lendon, Clinton Township, MI Corvair Zodiac XL, ScrapBuilder ;-) Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=59866#59866 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Noel Loveys" <noelloveys(at)yahoo.ca>
Subject: White corrosion
Date: Sep 06, 2006
When you do the Alumiprep make sure you do a water break test. Just pour fresh water across the part and it should sheet evenly... If not scrub again in places where the water didn't sheet. Noel -----Original Message----- From: owner-zenith-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-zenith-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Bill Naumuk Sent: Tuesday, September 05, 2006 8:43 PM Subject: Re: Zenith-List: White corrosion Kevin- That's what I wanted to hear. Don't care where you live- there's a NAPA within spitting distance. Of course, if it's not in stock........ Here's my big question. It means a lot to me because depending on the answer, I have to shift from "Build" to "Scrub down" mode before going any farther. Once you get some corrosion, do you have to strip interior surfaces clean like you would for a painted surface BEFORE applying your Zinc Chromate or other protectant, or can you just apply the protectant? I don't know- maybe skins stop corroding when you separate so moisture doesn't collect between them and you don't have to do anything. I don't think you have a choice but to thoroughly clean the painted surfaces. All input, especially from builders who found themselves in the same situation, is appreciated. do not archive Bill Naumuk HDS Fuselage Townville, Pa ----- Original Message ----- From: Trainnut01(at)aol.com Sent: Tuesday, September 05, 2006 1:45 AM Subject: Re: Zenith-List: White corrosion Kevin NAPA carries a Martin-Senour product called "Twin Etch". Van's recommends it on their RVs. bsp; available via -======================== nbsp; Email List nbsp; generous bsp; ================ ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Hugh Roberts" <hughfr(at)evertek.net>
Subject: Re: throttle
Date: Sep 06, 2006
Dave, The throttle settings do change as the engine moves from thrust and roll from torque. I think if the control rods are parallel in all directions both carbs will change the same amount. I'm not sure how much they move but I bet it's just a few thousanths due to the 14 inch long throttle rod. I think the vacuum crossover tube should fix any slight variations. I use ball rod ends to get rid of any side loads on carb. Hugh P.S. Forgot to mention----912S engine--CH701. Kept cheap T throttles. hughfr(at)evertek.net ----- Original Message ----- From: Dave To: zenith-list(at)matronics.com Sent: Tuesday, September 05, 2006 5:41 PM Subject: RE: Zenith-List: throttle Hugh, How do you counter the thrust inputs on the engine? I would think with this setup engine thrust equates to carbs out of sync. It doesn't take much of a movement on the linkage arm to pull different vacuum loads form one carb to the other. ----- Original Message ----- From: Hugh Roberts To: zenith-list(at)matronics.com Sent: Tuesday, September 05, 2006 2:34 PM Subject: Zenith-List: throttle Didn't like cable throttle system,hard to tune carbs. third 912 I have converted,no problem. must build all new bell crank system.line up arms with carb levers. put spring loaded friction on cross tube. Both throttles kept. Hugh Roberts ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Sep 06, 2006
From: "Kenny Aron" <kenny.aron(at)gmail.com>
Subject: Re: Leading Edge Dents
Dave, I posted the pics, you can find them on my project site here: http://websites.expercraft.com/kennya/index.php?q=log_entry&log_id=11959 -- \|/-\|/-\|/-\|/-\|/-\|/-\|/-\|/-\|/-\|/-\|/-\|/-\|/-\|/-\|/ --Kenny A. http://websites.expercraft.com/kennya/ http://users3.ev1.net/%7Ekennyarn/ ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Sep 06, 2006
From: LarryMcFarland <larry(at)macsmachine.com>
Subject: Re: White corrosion
Bill, In the process of preparing for paint, especially my water-thinned primer, you have to scrub the plane clean, etch and rinse it. The problem I find is that to be able to prime, you must do it within 12 hours of rinse so that the oxides don't re-establish before primer. Hard to do because the interior of wings and things get damp during the rinse and are somewhat resistant to the air gun blow dry process. Do check that the primer you're going to use is compatible with the zinc chromate you put inside your plane. I've been doing a work-around for an external primer that isn't compatible by extensively drying the seams and rivets. Larry McFarland - 601HDS at www.macsmachine.com Bill Naumuk wrote: > Kevin- > That's what I wanted to hear. Don't care where you live- there's a > NAPA within spitting distance. Of course, if it's not in stock........ > Here's my big question. It means a lot to me because depending on > the answer, I have to shift from "Build" to "Scrub down" mode before > going any farther. > Once you get some corrosion, do you have to strip interior > surfaces clean like you would for a painted surface BEFORE applying > your Zinc Chromate or other protectant, or can you just apply the > protectant? I don't know- maybe skins stop corroding when you separate > so moisture doesn't collect between them and you don't have to do > anything. I don't think you have a choice but to thoroughly clean the > painted surfaces. > All input, especially from builders who found themselves in the > same situation, is appreciated. > do not > archive > > Bill Naumuk > HDS Fuselage > Townville, Pa ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Throttle Cable for Rotax
From: "Johann G. Johannsson" <johann(at)rafpostur.is>
Date: Sep 06, 2006
Hello Tommy. I used the Vernier throttle from ACS wit the solid wire end, A820 on both sides. I started with the throttle on the left side, and then decided to install it on both sides, because it was the perfect setup. The old T from Zenith is still on the right side in the picture on my home page. Did not like that long stick because it was hard to control. If you need the part to attatch the cable to the steel rod, I could send it to you. Just contact me off list with your address, and I will ship it to you. Best regards, Johann G. Iceland. -------- Johann G. Iceland. Flying Zenith 701. Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=60016#60016 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Bryan Martin <bryanmmartin(at)comcast.net>
Subject: RE: throttle
Date: Sep 06, 2006
The throttle pictured on your website is an A-820 push-pull friction lock throttle, not a vernier throttle (A-750, A-790 or A-970). A-820 friction lock throttle control A vernier throttle does not have the friction lock knob like yours. It has a ball bearing mechanism inside the barrel that allows small adjustments to be made by twisting the knob and a button in the center of the knob that releases the vernier mechanism to allow large adjustments to be made by pushing or pulling on the knob. A-790 Vernier throttle control I don't know any convenient way to use two of these vernier controls to control the same engine or even any other type of control along with a vernier. You would have to disable the vernier mechanism on one to use the other because the vernier mechanism prevents the control from moving unless you turn the knob or push the button. That's why I decided to eliminate the second throttle control when I installed a vernier control. > > > Hello Tommy. > > I used the Vernier throttle from ACS wit the solid wire end, A820 > on both sides. > I started with the throttle on the left side, and then decided to > install it > on both sides, because it was the perfect setup. > The old T from Zenith is still on the right side in the picture on > my home page. > > Did not like that long stick because it was hard to control. > If you need the part to attatch the cable to the steel rod, I could > send it to > you. Just contact me off list with your address, and I will ship it > to you. > > Best regards, > Johann G. > Iceland. > > -------- > Johann G. > Iceland. > Flying Zenith 701. -- Bryan Martin N61BM, CH 601 XL, RAM Subaru, Stratus redrive.

      
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Sep 06, 2006
From: TYA2 <tya2@4-fly.net>
Subject: Re: Zenith-List:Changing out the Lexan windshields on CH2000
Any one got any tips on changing out the SH_T lexan windshields and side panels on a Ch2000? Mine are about to be replaced for the 4 th time in 12 years but the first time by me. What do I do? Drill out the old rivets? Try and match the rivet pattern on the new one, cleco it in place, and then pop rivet it in place? DO I start at the side and work around to the front, or start at the front and work to the side? What about the stuff that keeps it from leaking. Zenair sold me new windshield but no new washers? Are they standard pop rivet washers? What about the stuff that seals the windshields? In talking with my local a an p he indicated it was fiddly scut work that he didn't want to be bothered with and that I might as well do it myself. What about corrosion proofing the rivets head before reassembly? Looking for ideas. I was disappointed Zenair had not come up with a better system than flat pieces of lexan that have to be forced into shape. Rocky in Edmonton ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "R.P." <zodie(at)adelphia.net>
Subject: Youtube video of Zodiac at Brian Ranch airport
Date: Sep 06, 2006
I've been trying out a new camera mount on my Zodiac. Here's a video clip on I put together. I'm not really happy with the quality of the video, so I'd appreciate anyone who has some tips on getting video from the digital video camera through the computer and onto Youtube with some better quality. Here goes: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MYX52rNWFXk Rick Pitcher ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Sep 06, 2006
From: "Gerald A. Applefeld VMD" <jerryvmd(at)comcast.net>
Subject: Radio opinion
List, I have an opportunity to purchase a used Microair 760 radio for a good price. I current use an ICOM handheld as my primary COM radio attached to an external antenna. I works well, gives a good signal and is easy to change frequencies. The down side is the display is small, difficult to read esp. in sunlight. I thought a panel mount compact unit might be ideal. Does anyone have experience with the Microair? Would you buy it again? Any problems other than some compaints I've read of ignition noise? Anything to look out for.? I must make a desion by tomorrow afternoon. Thanks Jerry ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Sigmo(at)aol.com
Date: Sep 06, 2006
Subject: Re: Radio opinion
Microair 760 is a great radio but the XCOM is better and has an internal intercom for about the same price. Mike Sigman N7092N ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Noel Loveys" <noelloveys(at)yahoo.ca>
Subject: throttle
Date: Sep 06, 2006
The easy way around that, if it bothers you, is to attach the throttle rod to the engine block instead of the fire wall. Noel -----Original Message----- From: owner-zenith-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-zenith-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Hugh Roberts Sent: Wednesday, September 06, 2006 12:53 PM Subject: Re: Zenith-List: throttle Dave, The throttle settings do change as the engine moves from thrust and roll from torque. I think if the control rods are parallel in all directions both carbs will change the same amount. I'm not sure how much they move but I bet it's just a few thousanths due to the 14 inch long throttle rod. I think the vacuum crossover tube should fix any slight variations. I use ball rod ends to get rid of any side loads on carb. Hugh P.S. Forgot to mention----912S engine--CH701. Kept cheap T throttles. hughfr(at)evertek.net ----- Original Message ----- From: Dave <mailto:daberti(at)sbcglobal.net> Sent: Tuesday, September 05, 2006 5:41 PM Subject: RE: Zenith-List: throttle Hugh, How do you counter the thrust inputs on the engine? I would think with this setup engine thrust equates to carbs out of sync. It doesn't take much of a movement on the linkage arm to pull different vacuum loads form one carb to the other. ----- Original Message ----- From: Hugh <mailto:hughfr(at)evertek.net> Roberts Sent: Tuesday, September 05, 2006 2:34 PM Subject: Zenith-List: throttle Didn't like cable throttle system,hard to tune carbs. third 912 I have converted,no problem. must build all new bell crank system.line up arms with carb levers. put spring loaded friction on cross tube. Both throttles kept. Hugh Roberts ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Trevor Page <webmaster(at)upac.ca>
Subject: Re: Youtube video of Zodiac at Brian Ranch airport
Date: Sep 07, 2006
Hey Rick, how did you mount the camera? I've been dying to do the same and I can't figure out a way to mount my DV cam to get decent shots... Trev Page C-IDUS 601HD R912 On Sep 6, 2006, at 9:03 PM, R.P. wrote: > I've been trying out a new camera mount on my Zodiac. Here's a > video clip on I put together. I'm not really happy with the quality > of the video, so I'd appreciate anyone who has some tips on getting > video from the digital video camera through the computer and onto > Youtube with some better quality. > > Here goes: > http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MYX52rNWFXk > > Rick Pitcher > http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Zenith-List_- > ============================================================ _- > forums.matronics.com_- > ============================================================ _- > ============================================================ _- > contribution_- > =========================================================== > ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Zenith-List:Changing out the Lexan windshields on CH2000
From: "steveadams" <dr_steve_adams(at)yahoo.com>
Date: Sep 07, 2006
Actually, they did come up with a better system. The windshield and side windows are now plexiglass and are epoxied in. Only the little rear side windows are now Lexan. Unfortunately they also changed the cabin canopy and I don't think that the new plexi windows will fit the older canopy. You can ask them. They do offer an upgrade to the new windows and canopy (along with a lot of other stuff), but it's not cheap. From their website..................... "Airframe up-grade Up-grade from the Zenith to the Alarus model Includes: new canopy and engine cowling, new upholstery, nose gear up-grade, painting of new cowling and canopy, and general airframe parts up-grade. $19,900.00. This is done at the AMD factory in Eastman GA and includes parts / labor. It does not include or cover replacement or fixing of damaged parts or equipment. Cost of parts for the up-grade is $9,900.00 (does not include paint). " Just for your information, the "canopy kit" for the CH640, which is identical to the Alarus canopy, costs $4900 including all windows etc. Since my CH640 has the newer windows and canopy, I don't know how to replace yours. Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=60171#60171 ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Sep 07, 2006
From: TYA2 <tya2@4-fly.net>
Subject: Re: Zenith-List:Changing out the Lexan windshields on CH2000
Dear Steve, $20,000 upgrade not including paint is roughly the value of these aircraft. The windows on the plane have been replaced 3 times already in 9 years. Chris Heinz should have copied Jim Bedes design on the BD 4. Those windows were easily removable and didn't require removal because he used the right materials in the first place. I was surprised when the replacement windows arrived as a package of flat plastic bits all bound up in cardboard. No wonder they don't last... Too many curves out of flat stock... Reg > >Actually, they did come up with a better system. The windshield and side >windows are now plexiglass and are epoxied in. Only the little rear side >windows are now Lexan. Unfortunately they also changed the cabin canopy >and I don't think that the new plexi windows will fit the older canopy. >You can ask them. They do offer an upgrade to the new windows and canopy >(along with a lot of other stuff), but it's not cheap. From their >website..................... > >"Airframe up-grade Up-grade from the Zenith to the Alarus model Includes: >new canopy and engine cowling, new upholstery, nose gear up-grade, >painting of new cowling and canopy, and general airframe parts up-grade. >$19,900.00. This is done at the AMD factory in Eastman GA and includes >parts / labor. It does not include or cover replacement or fixing of >damaged parts or equipment. Cost of parts for the up-grade is $9,900.00 >(does not include paint). " > >Just for your information, the "canopy kit" for the CH640, which is >identical to the Alarus canopy, costs $4900 including all windows etc. > >Since my CH640 has the newer windows and canopy, I don't know how to >replace yours. > > >Read this topic online here: > >http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=60171#60171 > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "R.P." <zodie(at)adelphia.net>
Subject: Re: Youtube video of Zodiac at Brian Ranch airport
Date: Sep 07, 2006
----- Original Message ----- From: Trevor Page >Hey Rick, how did you mount the camera? I've been dying to do the >same and >I can't figure out a way to mount my DV cam to get decent >shots... >Trev Page >C-IDUS 601HD R912 Hi Trev. I made a simple little mount that attaches to the top of the turtledeck. I'll take a pic of it next time I'm at the hangar and email it to you. Rick Pitcher ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Sep 07, 2006
From: "Dave Thompson" <dave.thompson(at)verizon.net>
Subject: RE: throttle - Vernier
Here's a story that you might consider: In the late 80's my father, brother & I built a single seat Quickie. We installed a vernier throttle in it. She came up to speed very fast on the takeoff roll but at first you really had to be quick with your feet to keep the nose straight. After three successful flights, my father's friend from WWII came out to see it. He was a colonel in SAC, flying B52's then, B17's during WWII. He also had a Navion and a Cub. Due to the fact that he had so many hours in a variety of airframes, my father allowed the Colonel to fly the Quickie after a quick briefing. During the briefing, the colonel was shown that the button on the vernier throttle had to be pushed in order to move it. The Colonel taxied out. When he applied full takeoff power, the tail began to yaw, as usual. He over compensated several times and then tried to pull the throttle back to idle. He forgot to push the button. In his "panic??" he jerked the throttle and broke it out of the fiberglass panel. At the same time, he went off the runway into the grass. One wheel (the mains were on the wingtips) stuck in the mud, she ground looped and ended up upside down. He was not hurt. It took us 6-months of work to get her airworthy again. When she flew again she had a standard throttle control installed in the new reinforced panel. The moral to the story: Vernier throttles are very cool! However, they do not use standard control input which could cause problems in an emergency. I'm not condemning vernier throttle controls, just sharing a story so you can make your own decision. Note: The enclosed picture was before we installed plackarding. Dave Thompson dave.thompson(at)verizon.net Westminster, CA ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "don wentz" <dasduck(at)comcast.net>
Subject: RE: throttle - Vernier
Date: Sep 07, 2006
I had a vernier in my plane for several hundred hours, I liked the easy adjustment for small changes. It was an issue sometimes during landings. When I began flying a lot of formation, it became a real issue, so I grudgingly converted to std push-pull with the adjustable friction lock. I have to say that ALL things considered, after several hundred hours of both configurations in the SAME plane, I would give preference to the push-pull. At least my vernier was the type that I could remove a bit of the mechanism and =91easily=92 convert to push-pull. dw _____ From: owner-zenith-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-zenith-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Dave Thompson Sent: Thursday, September 07, 2006 11:23 AM Subject: Zenith-List: RE: throttle - Vernier Here=92s a story that you might consider: In the late 80=92s my father, brother & I built a single seat Quickie. We installed a vernier throttle in it. She came up to speed very fast on the takeoff roll but at first you really had to be quick with your feet to keep the nose straight. After three successful flights, my father=92s friend from WWII came out to see it. He was a colonel in SAC, flying B52=92s then, B17=92s during WWII. He also had a Navion and a Cub. Due to the fact that he had so many hours in a variety of airframes, my father allowed the Colonel to fly the Quickie after a quick briefing. During the briefing, the colonel was shown that the button on the vernier throttle had to be pushed in order to move it. The Colonel taxied out. When he applied full takeoff power, the tail began to yaw, as usual. He over compensated several times and then tried to pull the throttle back to idle. He forgot to push the button. In his =93panic??=94 he jerked the throttle and broke it out of the fiberglass panel. At the same time, he went off the runway into the grass. One wheel (the mains were on the wingtips) stuck in the mud, she ground looped and ended up upside down. He was not hurt. It took us 6-months of work to get her airworthy again. When she flew again she had a standard throttle control installed in the new reinforced panel. The moral to the story: Vernier throttles are very cool! However, they do not use standard control input which could cause problems in an emergency. I=92m not condemning vernier throttle controls, just sharing a story so you can make your own decision. Note: The enclosed picture was before we installed plackarding. Dave Thompson HYPERLINK "mailto:dave.thompson(at)verizon.net"dave.thompson(at)verizon.net Westminster, CA -- -- ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Sep 07, 2006
From: <jlatimer1(at)cox.net>
Subject: Re: Youtube video of Zodiac at Brian Ranch airport
> > Hi Trev. > I made a simple little mount that attaches to the top of the turtledeck. > I'll take a pic of it next time I'm at the hangar and email it to you. > > Rick Pitcher > Please email the photo to the least so all can see how to mount the camera. Thanks Jerry HDS 912S ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Bill Naumuk" <naumuk(at)alltel.net>
Subject: Re: Youtube video of Zodiac at Brian Ranch airport
Date: Sep 07, 2006
Rick- Rudder input looked pretty twitchy. Is it that sensitive, or was that PIO? Gotta remember, I'm a C-172 driver. Bill Naumuk HDS Fuselage Townville, Pa ----- Original Message ----- From: R.P. To: zenith-list(at)matronics.com Sent: Wednesday, September 06, 2006 9:03 PM Subject: Zenith-List: Youtube video of Zodiac at Brian Ranch airport I've been trying out a new camera mount on my Zodiac. Here's a video clip on I put together. I'm not really happy with the quality of the video, so I'd appreciate anyone who has some tips on getting video from the digital video camera through the computer and onto Youtube with some better quality. Here goes: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MYX52rNWFXk Rick Pitcher ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Bill Naumuk" <naumuk(at)alltel.net>
Subject: Stripper
Date: Sep 07, 2006
All- Screwed up with my files somewhere. Mea culpa! What was the name of the stripper available from NAPA? Bill Naumuk HDS Fuselage (Progress in quicksand) Townville, Pa ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Bill Naumuk" <naumuk(at)alltel.net>
Subject: Re: Stripper
Date: Sep 07, 2006
Forget it. I'm about ready to unsubscribe. Thanks alot. Bill Naumuk HDS Fuselage Townville, Pa ----- Original Message ----- From: Bill Naumuk To: zenith list Sent: Thursday, September 07, 2006 7:40 PM Subject: Zenith-List: Stripper All- Screwed up with my files somewhere. Mea culpa! What was the name of the stripper available from NAPA? Bill Naumuk HDS Fuselage (Progress in quicksand) Townville, Pa ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Stripper
From: "Chris In Madison" <cowens(at)cnw.com>
Date: Sep 07, 2006
Hi Bill, >From a reply to your "White Corrosion" post from yesterday: NAPA carries a Martin-Senour product called "Twin Etch". Best regards, Chris -------- Chris Owens Waunakee, WI Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=60279#60279 ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Sep 07, 2006
From: "Steve Hulland" <marinegunner(at)gmail.com>
Subject: Re: RE: throttle - Vernier
I use a verneer throttle on a fire truck every day that I work. It is a great throttle and I am very used to it. However, it is backwards when compaired to a traditional aircraft push pull throttle with friction lock. And, it is forever causing a problem because it gets either loose or stuck and one cannot properly operate engine. This on a pretty new 2003 fire truck, and it has been happening ever since truck was purchased. Same thing on most other fire trucks that I have used with this type throttle. One can almost always fix the throttle, but would hate to attempt to do so while flying. My CH 600 has a traditional push-pull with simple friction lock, seems to always work. I think there is a reason for common aircraft throttles, they work and work well. I would not have something else on my airplane. -- Semper Fi, Steven R. Hulland CH 600 Taildragger Amado, AZ This and all other incoming/outgoing email, attachments and replies scanned prior to opening/sending and uses an external firewall to help insure virus free email and attachments. ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "ljkyle" <ljkyle(at)insightbb.com>
Subject: Re: Stripper
Date: Sep 07, 2006
Well, here's my 2 cents worth. I started out using zinc chromate, but switched to the NAPA self-etching primer. Number one reason...better adhesion (with same prep). I prep with Scotch-Brite followed by cleaning with acetone. The zinc chromate is easy to scratch off. The self etching primer is virtually bullet proof. It really sticks. The NAPA primer is cheap and readily available. I'm sure there are better (i.e. more expensive) alternatives, but any primer should be better than no primer. ----- Original Message ----- From: Bill Naumuk To: zenith-list(at)matronics.com Sent: Thursday, September 07, 2006 7:55 PM Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Stripper Forget it. I'm about ready to unsubscribe. Thanks alot. Bill Naumuk HDS Fuselage Townville, Pa ----- Original Message ----- From: Bill Naumuk To: zenith list Sent: Thursday, September 07, 2006 7:40 PM Subject: Zenith-List: Stripper All- Screwed up with my files somewhere. Mea culpa! What was the name of the stripper available from NAPA? Bill Naumuk HDS Fuselage (Progress in quicksand) Townville, Pa ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ----- ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Sep 07, 2006
From: Terry Turnquist <ter_turn(at)yahoo.com>
Subject: Scratch built Spars
A while back someone asked for a picture of a Spar being scratch built. Here's on my Grandson is working on:) Terry Turnquist 601 XL Plans St. Peters, MO --------------------------------- ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "R.P." <zodie(at)adelphia.net>
Subject: Re: Youtube video of Zodiac at Brian Ranch airport
Date: Sep 08, 2006
----- Original Message ----- From: Bill Naumuk Sent: Thursday, September 07, 2006 4:07 PM Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Youtube video of Zodiac at Brian Ranch airport >Rick- > Rudder input looked pretty twitchy. Is it that sensitive, or was that > >PIO? Gotta remember, I'm a C-172 driver. >Bill Naumuk > http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MYX52rNWFXk Yeah Bill, I really noticed that on this video. I'm not sure if it's PIO or just the result of keeping the wings level in the turbulent air that morning, probably a little of both. I'll be more more consious of this now that I have seen what it looks like in the video. After flying Quicksilvers for several years I have a tendency to use more rudder than aileron to lift a low wing. Rick Pitcher ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Scratch built Spars
From: "TxDave" <dclaytx2(at)HOTMAIL.COM>
Date: Sep 08, 2006
Hey Terry, I was the guy making the inquiry about scratch building spars. Thanks for sharing the photo. I'm to the point of deburring all those many, many holes. Any advice you have to offer would be appreciated. Dave Clay Temple, Texas Ch601XL Scratch Builder http://www.daves601xl.com Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=60357#60357 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: VideoFlyer(at)aol.com
Date: Sep 08, 2006
Subject: Re: Scratch built Spars
In a message dated 9/8/06 dclaytx2(at)HOTMAIL.COM writes: > I'm to the point of deburring all those many, many holes. Any advice you > have to offer would be appreciated Start deburring! ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Sep 08, 2006
From: Steven Janicki <mmesa005(at)yahoo.com>
Subject: New to the Group - Plan to Build CH601XL
Hello All, I am new to this group and am planning to start building a CH601XL before the end of this year. With that said, I have been doing quite a bit of reading and made a phone call to Zenith to better understand the differences between the QB and Standard Kits. After my conversation with Sebastian I am leaning towards the Standard kit. My impression is that the standard kit will save me a fair sum of money and still provide features such as pilot holes on wing, fuselage and other surface skins. The difference in cost will also help towards my engine, avionics, paint funds. I also plan to start with the tail kit and build from components as I understand improvements to the kit are planned and I would like to take advantage of them if and when they are released. I live in Northern California (Redwood City to be exact) and plan to build in my garage in order to maximize my time availability. I have built in the past but never completed an aircraft primarily due to my desire to fly more than build. Fortunately I have most if not all of the tools I need to build having purchased them along the way durning my past building episodes. Now that I am older (and hopefully wiser) I have settled on the CH601XL and plan to take advantage being able to fly under LSA in the future as my flying needs have become more about enjoying an hour or two in the air vs. IFR, cross country flying, etc. I am also leaning on the Jabiru 3300 engine and a budget glass cockpit. Any advice would be greatly appreciated and I look forward to getting started and completing the CH601XL! Regards, Steven --------------------------------- Everyone is raving about the all-new Yahoo! Mail. ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Dave Austin" <daveaustin2(at)can.rogers.com>
Subject: Re: Youtube video of Zodiac at Brian Ranch airport
Date: Sep 08, 2006
Re these videos.. How do I download these videos as a file and store on the PC? Dave Austin 601HDS - 912, Spitfire Mk VIII ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Grant Corriveau <grant.corriveau(at)TELUS.NET>
Subject: Rudder twitchy's
Date: Sep 08, 2006
Hi Bill, I fly a 601HDS with CAM100 (Honda conversion). I noticed the yaw in the movie clip too. I must say I've never noticed it while flying my aircraft, but then I wasn't looking for it. (I'd say it is probably there alright, waiting to be 'outed' when I too mount a camera some day ha ha.! ) The airplane is easy to keep straight during takeoff and landing roll. But there is a very noticeable yaw reaction from thrust changes. When I pay close attention to the ball on the T&B, I'm surprised to see how much rudder "trim" is required, from a lot of left pedal during full power ops (climb out), to a significant amount of right pedal during glides/approaches. (NOTE* You may need to reverse those left/right indications for your engine - mine rotates counterclockwise as viewed from the cockpit ;-) ... In summary, due to the short coupling of the airplane, definite rudder inputs are required to counteract engine/prop tourque/effect etc... Meanwhile, when rolling into turns there is mild adverse yaw requiring only small rudder pressure. My conclusion about the 601 is that it is easy to fly, but challenging to fly well, keeping all these various 'twitchys' to a minumum. fwiw, Grant Corriveau Nanaimo, B.C. C-GHTF ================ On 7-Sep-06, at 11:58 PM, Zenith-List Digest Server wrote: > From: "Bill Naumuk" <naumuk(at)alltel.net> > Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Youtube video of Zodiac at Brian Ranch > airport > > Rick- > Rudder input looked pretty twitchy. Is it that sensitive, or was > that PIO? Gotta remember, I'm a C-172 driver. > Bill Naumuk > HDS Fuselage > Townville, Pa ------------------------------- grant.corriveau(at)telus.net --------------------------------------- The Wings Stayed On! http://aluwings.blogspirit.com --------------------------------------- ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Sep 08, 2006
From: rwhall(at)telusplanet.net
Subject: Zenair for sale
I have an airworthy CH601 which regrettably I must sell. I would appreciate any suggestions as to the best way or place to sell. Regards, Robert Hall ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Sep 08, 2006
From: Robert Schoenberger <hrs1(at)frontiernet.net>
Subject: Re: Scratch built Spars
Check the archives regarding a special type of file - the name might be a Vixen (somebody have the exact name?). It has curved ridges and lightly rubbed against the line of rivet holes, takes a lot of the rough stuff off. Then deburr in the normal manner with a drill point, etc. Robert Schoenberger 701 VideoFlyer(at)aol.com wrote: > In a message dated 9/8/06 dclaytx2(at)HOTMAIL.COM writes: > >> I'm to the point of deburring all those many, many holes. Any advice >> you have to offer would be appreciated > > > Start deburring! > * > > > * ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Center Spar Completed
From: "TxDave" <dclaytx2(at)HOTMAIL.COM>
Date: Sep 08, 2006
For those of you who might be interested, I recently finished my scratch-built XL center spar. My hat's off to Chris H for designing a very solid structure. Photos attached. Dave Clay Temple, TX Ch601XL Plans builder http://www.daves601xl.com Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=60392#60392 Attachments: http://forums.matronics.com//files/centerspar_3_143.jpg http://forums.matronics.com//files/centerspar_2_744.jpg http://forums.matronics.com//files/centerspar_1_329.jpg ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Randy Bryant" <randy(at)n344rb.com>
Subject: Re: Center Spar Completed
Date: Sep 08, 2006
Nope Dave, no photos attached... Randy XL Wings - Plans Only ----- Original Message ----- From: "TxDave" <dclaytx2(at)hotmail.com> Sent: Friday, September 08, 2006 1:26 PM Subject: Zenith-List: Center Spar Completed > > For those of you who might be interested, I recently finished my > scratch-built XL center spar. My hat's off to Chris H for designing a very > solid structure. Photos attached. > > Dave Clay > Temple, TX > Ch601XL Plans builder > http://www.daves601xl.com > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=60392#60392 > > > Attachments: > > http://forums.matronics.com//files/centerspar_3_143.jpg > http://forums.matronics.com//files/centerspar_2_744.jpg > http://forums.matronics.com//files/centerspar_1_329.jpg > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Sep 08, 2006
From: Mike Fothergill <mfothergill(at)sympatico.ca>
Subject: Re: Rudder twitchy's
HI; My HDS with a 912S requires a significant amount of right rudder on take-off but very little anytime after that. Mike CH-601HDS 1400+ hours Grant Corriveau wrote: > Hi Bill, > > I fly a 601HDS with CAM100 (Honda conversion). I noticed the yaw in the > movie clip too. I must say I've never noticed it while flying my > aircraft, but then I wasn't looking for it. (I'd say it is probably > there alright, waiting to be 'outed' when I too mount a camera some day > ha ha.! ) > > The airplane is easy to keep straight during takeoff and landing roll. > But there is a very noticeable yaw reaction from thrust changes. When I > pay close attention to the ball on the T&B, I'm surprised to see how > much rudder "trim" is required, from a lot of left pedal during full > power ops (climb out), to a significant amount of right pedal during > glides/approaches. (NOTE* You may need to reverse those left/right > indications for your engine - mine rotates counterclockwise as viewed > from the cockpit ;-) ... > > In summary, due to the short coupling of the airplane, definite rudder > inputs are required to counteract engine/prop tourque/effect etc... > Meanwhile, when rolling into turns there is mild adverse yaw requiring > only small rudder pressure. > > My conclusion about the 601 is that it is easy to fly, but challenging > to fly well, keeping all these various 'twitchys' to a minumum. > > fwiw, > Grant Corriveau > Nanaimo, B.C. > C-GHTF > > ================ > On 7-Sep-06, at 11:58 PM, Zenith-List Digest Server wrote: > >> From: "Bill Naumuk" <naumuk(at)alltel.net <mailto:naumuk(at)alltel.net>> >> >> Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Youtube video of Zodiac at Brian Ranch airport >> >> >> Rick- >> >> Rudder input looked pretty twitchy. Is it that sensitive, or was >> >> that PIO? Gotta remember, I'm a C-172 driver. >> >> Bill Naumuk >> >> HDS Fuselage >> >> Townville, Pa >> > > ------------------------------- > grant.corriveau(at)telus.net > --------------------------------------- > The Wings Stayed On! > http://aluwings.blogspirit.com > --------------------------------------- > > > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: CH 640 Controls
From: "moorecomp" <moorecomp(at)yahoo.com>
Date: Sep 08, 2006
Hello, I think Jeff Paden has the best pictures of the setup for the aileron controls. Go here: http://www.madbbs.com/~jpaden/fuselage/13-Fuselage-Hull-stage-1-part2/index10.html Best regards, Craig Moore A&P 701 builder wannabe Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=60412#60412 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Stanley Challgren <challgren(at)mac.com>
Subject: Re: Zenair for sale
Date: Sep 08, 2006
Robert: We tried a number of ways before contacting Trade-a-Plane. It took about two weeks and it was sold. Stan Sold 601 HDS Building 701 On Sep 8, 2006, at 11:12 AM, rwhall(at)telusplanet.net wrote: > > > I have an airworthy CH601 which regrettably I must sell. I would > appreciate any > suggestions as to the best way or place to sell. Regards, Robert Hall > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Sep 08, 2006
From: Carlos Sa <carlosfsa(at)yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: Center Spar Completed - photos URLs below
Not literaly attached - click the URLs given... (bottom of this thread) Carlos --- Randy Bryant a crit : > > Nope Dave, no photos attached... > > Randy > XL Wings - Plans Only > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "TxDave" <dclaytx2(at)hotmail.com> > To: > Sent: Friday, September 08, 2006 1:26 PM > Subject: Zenith-List: Center Spar Completed > > > > > > For those of you who might be interested, I recently finished my > > scratch-built XL center spar. My hat's off to Chris H for designing a very > > solid structure. Photos attached. > > > > Dave Clay > > Temple, TX > > Ch601XL Plans builder > > http://www.daves601xl.com > > Attachments: > > > > http://forums.matronics.com//files/centerspar_3_143.jpg > > http://forums.matronics.com//files/centerspar_2_744.jpg > > http://forums.matronics.com//files/centerspar_1_329.jpg __________________________________________________________ ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Chuck Deiterich" <cffd(at)pgrb.com>
Subject: Re: Rudder twitchy's
Date: Sep 08, 2006
Grant, In my 701, I have taken videos out the front as well. On approach, I was surprised to see how much the nose moved back and forth in the video. I don't notice this myself during approach. If the video camera is zoomed in a bit, I think it might exaggerate the motion. I flew today with the camera aimed at the instrument panel. In cruise the turn and bank was fairly calm. But on approach it was active, I think we make corrections as needed without realizing it. You can sure tell when you are not coordinated. I only need rudder on take off. The right thrust takes care of cruise and no power is ok for approach. I need a bit more down thrust as the elevator trim changes a lot from cruise to approach. Chuck D. N701TX Jabiru 2200 ----- Original Message ----- From: Grant Corriveau To: zenith-list(at)matronics.com Sent: Friday, September 08, 2006 12:00 PM Subject: Zenith-List: Rudder twitchy's Hi Bill, I fly a 601HDS with CAM100 (Honda conversion). I noticed the yaw in the movie clip too. I must say I've never noticed it while flying my aircraft, but then I wasn't looking for it. (I'd say it is probably there alright, waiting to be 'outed' when I too mount a camera some day ha ha.! ) The airplane is easy to keep straight during takeoff and landing roll. But there is a very noticeable yaw reaction from thrust changes. When I pay close attention to the ball on the T&B, I'm surprised to see how much rudder "trim" is required, from a lot of left pedal during full power ops (climb out), to a significant amount of right pedal during glides/approaches. (NOTE* You may need to reverse those left/right indications for your engine - mine rotates counterclockwise as viewed from the cockpit ;-) ... In summary, due to the short coupling of the airplane, definite rudder inputs are required to counteract engine/prop tourque/effect etc... Meanwhile, when rolling into turns there is mild adverse yaw requiring only small rudder pressure. My conclusion about the 601 is that it is easy to fly, but challenging to fly well, keeping all these various 'twitchys' to a minumum. fwiw, Grant Corriveau Nanaimo, B.C. C-GHTF ================ On 7-Sep-06, at 11:58 PM, Zenith-List Digest Server wrote: From: "Bill Naumuk" <naumuk(at)alltel.net> Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Youtube video of Zodiac at Brian Ranch airport Rick- Rudder input looked pretty twitchy. Is it that sensitive, or was that PIO? Gotta remember, I'm a C-172 driver. Bill Naumuk HDS Fuselage Townville, Pa ------------------------------- grant.corriveau(at)telus.net --------------------------------------- The Wings Stayed On! http://aluwings.blogspirit.com --------------------------------------- ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Robert L. Stone" <rstone4(at)hot.rr.com>
Subject: Re: Zenair for sale
Date: Sep 08, 2006
Robert, Barnstormers is the best aviation web site and adds are free unless you want to make a donation. I have used them and always make a donation after the sale. It's also a good idea to tell people where you are because there might be someone close who is looking for a Zenith/Zodiac aircraft to buy. http://www.barnstormers.com/cat.php?PHPSESSID=2ef94a86daa861b6da0186831 53522ef Bob Stone, Harker Heights ZodiacXL ----- Original Message ----- From: <rwhall(at)telusplanet.net> Sent: Friday, September 08, 2006 12:12 PM Subject: Zenith-List: Zenair for sale > > > I have an airworthy CH601 which regrettably I must sell. I would appreciate any > suggestions as to the best way or place to sell. Regards, Robert Hall > > > > > > > > > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Dan Forney" <dforney(at)bctonline.com>
Subject: Zenair for sale
Date: Sep 08, 2006
Anytime that I talk to someone about the possibility of selling a homebuilt if or when I was ever unable to fly it, they always caution me against the thought due to possible liability lawsuits as the manufacturer. Anyone else ever worry about that when selling, or are there ways to protect yourself? -----Original Message----- From: owner-zenith-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-zenith-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Stanley Challgren Sent: Friday, September 08, 2006 12:14 PM Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Zenair for sale Robert: We tried a number of ways before contacting Trade-a-Plane. It took about two weeks and it was sold. Stan Sold 601 HDS Building 701 On Sep 8, 2006, at 11:12 AM, rwhall(at)telusplanet.net wrote: > > > I have an airworthy CH601 which regrettably I must sell. I would > appreciate any > suggestions as to the best way or place to sell. Regards, Robert Hall > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Robert L. Stone" <rstone4(at)hot.rr.com>
Subject: Re: Center Spar Completed
Date: Sep 08, 2006
Randy, Just keep on scrolling down and you will find three web site address's (URL's) each one shows a different view of the center spar Dave is talking about. Bob Stone, Harker Heights, Tx ZodiacXL ----- Original Message ----- From: "Randy Bryant" <randy(at)n344rb.com> Sent: Friday, September 08, 2006 1:01 PM Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Center Spar Completed > > Nope Dave, no photos attached... > > Randy > XL Wings - Plans Only > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "TxDave" <dclaytx2(at)hotmail.com> > To: > Sent: Friday, September 08, 2006 1:26 PM > Subject: Zenith-List: Center Spar Completed > > >> >> For those of you who might be interested, I recently finished my >> scratch-built XL center spar. My hat's off to Chris H for designing a >> very solid structure. Photos attached. >> >> Dave Clay >> Temple, TX >> Ch601XL Plans builder >> http://www.daves601xl.com >> >> >> >> >> Read this topic online here: >> >> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=60392#60392 >> >> >> >> >> Attachments: >> >> http://forums.matronics.com//files/centerspar_3_143.jpg >> http://forums.matronics.com//files/centerspar_2_744.jpg >> http://forums.matronics.com//files/centerspar_1_329.jpg >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Bill Naumuk" <naumuk(at)alltel.net>
Subject: Re: Stripper
Date: Sep 08, 2006
Chris- Twin etch. Thanks. I live 56 miles from a NAPA store, but only 3 when you figure I commute 53 to work, and that's in the city where the store is located. If I'd received a straight answer from the list yesterday, I could have picked up what I needed on my lunch break. Now I have to either drive 100+ miles or wait until Monday and modify my building schedule. I'm as big an offender as anyone else, but remember people, the site is supposed to be used for helping fellow builders. Archive Bill Naumuk HDS Fuselage Townville, Pa ----- Original Message ----- From: "Chris In Madison" <cowens(at)cnw.com> Sent: Thursday, September 07, 2006 9:24 PM Subject: Zenith-List: Re: Stripper > > Hi Bill, > >>From a reply to your "White Corrosion" post from yesterday: > > > NAPA carries a Martin-Senour product called "Twin Etch". > > > Best regards, > Chris > > -------- > Chris Owens > Waunakee, WI > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=60279#60279 > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Bill Naumuk" <naumuk(at)alltel.net>
Subject: Re: Rudder twitchy's
Date: Sep 08, 2006
All- I don't think rudder trim is the solution, either. It would seem from a geometrical perspective that an increase in the width of the rudder bellcrank would calm things down. By width, I mean the distance between the control cable attachment (Unless, of course, there are other aerodynamic factors at work.) You'd pay a minute penalty in drag from the additional metal hanging in the wind, but is it worth it? While it's obviously evident in the video, it's not evident to people closer to the CG. I was in the back seat of an A-36 Bonanza and the Dutch Roll was so bad you wanted to puke. 2' each way on each oscillation. The guys up front didn't beleive me until they sat in the back. Dutch roll can't improve performance and fuel consumption. Unfortunately, changing the geometry of a bellcrank is a major (And to be avoided) airframe modification. I don't know who else to contact. Mark (Zodie)- can you kick this question upstairs? Thanks. Bill Naumuk HDS Fuselage Townville, Pa ----- Original Message ----- From: Grant Corriveau To: zenith-list(at)matronics.com Sent: Friday, September 08, 2006 1:00 PM Subject: Zenith-List: Rudder twitchy's Hi Bill, I fly a 601HDS with CAM100 (Honda conversion). I noticed the yaw in the movie clip too. ------------------------------- grant.corriveau(at)telus.net --------------------------------------- The Wings Stayed On! http://aluwings.blogspirit.com --------------------------------------- ________________________________________________________________________________
From: David Wright <davidhwright(at)mac.com>
Subject: Re: Center Spar Completed - solid riveter design
Date: Sep 09, 2006
> Dave / List Members > > > Thanks for the off list reply another amazing invention! > I tried the ch601.org rivet / dimpler design and am having trouble > lining up the cup head with the striking bar. My inept attempt have > so far cost me =A370 - your $15 design looks good. I will try it > tomorrow I would have attached the .pdf file with the full description of the device - but it is too big for the list. Could you post it on your web site so that everyone can have sight of it > > Dave > 601XL - Scratchbuild wings > Washington UK > > Begin forwarded message: > >> From: Dave and Jan Clay <dclaytx2(at)hotmail.com> >> Date: 8 September 2006 23:30:19 BDT >> To: davidhwright(at)mac.com >> Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Center Spar Completed >> >> >> Hello David, >> >> I've been using a drill bit to deburr. I was hoping someone might >> suggest a more elegant method. Maybe there isn't one. >> >> Like you, I had no experience with solid rivets. I had built this >> up in my mind as a terribly difficult task. I constructed this >> little rivet setting device. It works amazingly well. All but one >> of my rivets turned out close to perfect. I was able to do the >> entire center spar in less than 45 minutes. >> >> The secret is to just align the punch by hand. The device just >> acts like a third hand to support the punch. It really could not >> have been easier. I was very pleased with the results. >> >> Thanks for your input on the deburring. Hope I've helped with your >> solid rivet issue. >> >> Dave Clay >> Temple, TX >> http://www.daves601xl.com >> >> _________________________________________________________________ >> Get the new Windows Live Messenger! http://imagine-msn.com/ >> messenger/launch80/default.aspx?locale=en-us&source=wlmailtagline > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Zodie Rocket" <zodierocket(at)hsfx.ca>
Subject: Rudder twitchy's
Date: Sep 08, 2006
I honestly believe that no change is necessary, in flight the rudder acts as it should and as noted your turn and bank hardly move with only a small pressure to help in your coordinated turns. On approach we all (well not all but I=92m just as guilty) seem to do the two step all over the rudder pedals, now this is normal and with such a big rudder we tend to go back and forth just for something to do. But when it comes to cross wind landings we all know that the Zodiac and 701 handle far far more then most others planes of the same size, this is also due to the rudder=92s ability, it has a lot to do without having a vertical stabilizer. Of which I believe is a golden point of our planes. So for something that cannot be perceived in the last couple minutes of flight by the pilot and passenger, playing with the geometry of the rudder is unwarranted. Simply put, to gain so little on a small part of our flight we would sacrifice to much on a large part of our adventure and in the safety of our chosen bird. Nevertheless, to each their own, when I fly with seasoned 601 owners I don=92t notice and tail wag but new owners are a different story. Mark Townsend Alma, Ontario Zodiac 601XL C-GOXL, CH801 C-FHUC HYPERLINK "http://www.ch601.org"www.ch601.org / HYPERLINK "http://www.ch701.com"www.ch701.com/ HYPERLINK "http://www.Osprey2.com"www.Osprey2.com -----Original Message----- From: owner-zenith-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-zenith-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Bill Naumuk Sent: Friday, September 08, 2006 7:35 PM Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Rudder twitchy's All- I don't think rudder trim is the solution, either. It would seem from a geometrical perspective that an increase in the width of the rudder bellcrank would calm things down. By width, I mean the distance between the control cable attachment (Unless, of course, there are other aerodynamic factors at work.) You'd pay a minute penalty in drag from the additional metal hanging in the wind, but is it worth it? While it's obviously evident in the video, it's not evident to people closer to the CG. I was in the back seat of an A-36 Bonanza and the Dutch Roll was so bad you wanted to puke. 2' each way on each oscillation. The guys up front didn't beleive me until they sat in the back. Dutch roll can't improve performance and fuel consumption. Unfortunately, changing the geometry of a bellcrank is a major (And to be avoided) airframe modification. I don't know who else to contact. Mark (Zodie)- can you kick this question upstairs? Thanks. Bill Naumuk HDS Fuselage Townville, Pa ----- Original Message ----- From: HYPERLINK "mailto:grant.corriveau(at)TELUS.NET"Grant Corriveau "mailto:zenith-list(at)matronics.com"zenith-list(at)matronics.com Sent: Friday, September 08, 2006 1:00 PM Subject: Zenith-List: Rudder twitchy's Hi Bill, I fly a 601HDS with CAM100 (Honda conversion). I noticed the yaw in the movie clip too. ------------------------------- HYPERLINK "mailto:grant.corriveau(at)telus.net"grant.corriveau(at)telus.net --------------------------------------- The Wings Stayed On! HYPERLINK "http://aluwings.blogspirit.com"http://aluwings.blogspirit.com --------------------------------------- "http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Zenith-List"http://www.matronics.com /Navigator?Zenith-List "http://forums.matronics.com"http://forums.matronics.com "http://wiki.matronics.com"http://wiki.matronics.com "http://www.matronics.com/contribution"http://www.matronics.com/contribu tion -- -- ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "R.P." <zodie(at)adelphia.net>
Subject: Video Camera mount
Date: Sep 08, 2006
----- Original Message ----- From: <jlatimer1(at)cox.net>>> > Please email the photo to the least so all can see how to mount the > camera. > Thanks > Jerry > HDS 912S Got out to the hangar this afternoon and shot a couple pics of that mount. It's a piece of .063 6061-T6 (10" X 3") with the edges bent for stiffness. I bolted on a stainless steel Adel clamp that just clips over the bows in the front of the turtledeck. There's one bolt at the back that holds it on, but I plan on changing that over to a camlock for quick installation and removal. Had to add a stiffner top and bottom to take out the springiness, otherwise the camera bobbed up and down too much in turbs. Ain't real pretty, but it seems to work OK. ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: New to the Group - Plan to Build CH601XL
From: "Ron Lendon" <rlendon(at)comcast.net>
Date: Sep 08, 2006
Welcome to the wonderful land of home building. One other option that I took is scratch building. Zenith has good detailed drawings and that is going to save me more money, and keep me busy for longer. Everything is a trade off one way or the other. I am having so much fun, hope you do too. -------- Ron Lendon, Clinton Township, MI Corvair Zodiac XL, ScrapBuilder ;-) Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=60490#60490 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Bill Naumuk" <naumuk(at)alltel.net>
Subject: Re: Rudder twitchy's
Date: Sep 08, 2006
Thanks, Mark, for your quick response. If the movement doesn't occur in cruise flight as it did in the A36 I spoke of, no big deal. A definite PIA if it does. Maybe some cruise photos could be taken with, say, a road for reference. The movement has probably been going on since day 1. No one could see it until digital camcorders came around. Once again, no big deal, but an opportunity for improvement. Bill Naumuk HDS Fuselage Townville, Pa ----- Original Message ----- From: Zodie Rocket To: zenith-list(at)matronics.com Sent: Friday, September 08, 2006 8:39 PM Subject: RE: Zenith-List: Rudder twitchy's I honestly believe that no change is necessary, in flight the rudder acts as it should and as noted your turn and bank hardly move with only a small pressure to help in your coordinated turns. On approach we all (well not all but I=92m just as guilty) seem to do the two step all over the rudder pedals, now this is normal and with such a big rudder we tend to go back and forth just for something to do. But when it comes to cross wind landings we all know that the Zodiac and 701 handle far far more then most others planes of the same size, this is also due to the rudder=92s ability, it has a lot to do without having a vertical stabilizer. Of which I believe is a golden point of our planes. So for something that cannot be perceived in the last couple minutes of flight by the pilot and passenger, playing with the geometry of the rudder is unwarranted. Simply put, to gain so little on a small part of our flight we would sacrifice to much on a large part of our adventure and in the safety of our chosen bird. Nevertheless, to each their own, when I fly with seasoned 601 owners I don=92t notice and tail wag but new owners are a different story. Mark Townsend Alma, Ontario Zodiac 601XL C-GOXL, CH801 C-FHUC www.ch601.org / www.ch701.com/ www.Osprey2.com -----Original Message----- From: owner-zenith-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-zenith-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Bill Naumuk Sent: Friday, September 08, 2006 7:35 PM To: zenith-list(at)matronics.com Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Rudder twitchy's All- I don't think rudder trim is the solution, either. It would seem from a geometrical perspective that an increase in the width of the rudder bellcrank would calm things down. By width, I mean the distance between the control cable attachment (Unless, of course, there are other aerodynamic factors at work.) You'd pay a minute penalty in drag from the additional metal hanging in the wind, but is it worth it? While it's obviously evident in the video, it's not evident to people closer to the CG. I was in the back seat of an A-36 Bonanza and the Dutch Roll was so bad you wanted to puke. 2' each way on each oscillation. The guys up front didn't beleive me until they sat in the back. Dutch roll can't improve performance and fuel consumption. Unfortunately, changing the geometry of a bellcrank is a major (And to be avoided) airframe modification. I don't know who else to contact. Mark (Zodie)- can you kick this question upstairs? Thanks. Bill Naumuk HDS Fuselage Townville, Pa ----- Original Message ----- From: Grant Corriveau To: zenith-list(at)matronics.com Sent: Friday, September 08, 2006 1:00 PM Subject: Zenith-List: Rudder twitchy's Hi Bill, I fly a 601HDS with CAM100 (Honda conversion). I noticed the yaw in the movie clip too. ------------------------------- grant.corriveau(at)telus.net --------------------------------------- The Wings Stayed On! http://aluwings.blogspirit.com --------------------------------------- - The Zenith-List Email Forum - --> - NEW MATRONICS WEB FORUMS - --> - NEW MATRONICS LIST WIKI - --> - List Contribution Web Site - Thank you for your generous support! -Matt Dralle, List Admin. --> -- 9/8/2006 -- 9/8/2006 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "R.P." <zodie(at)adelphia.net>
Subject: Another Youtube video of Zodiac at Fox Field (KWJF)
Date: Sep 08, 2006
----- Original Message ----- From: "Dave Austin" <daveaustin2(at)can.rogers.com>> Re these videos.. > How do I download these videos as a file and store on the PC? > Dave Austin 601HDS - 912, Spitfire Mk VIII I just found Youtube a couple of days ago and don't know how to download and save. Here's another video of a high and fast landing at Fox Field http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V5tljAPJ328 I'll put a larger filesize version at http://www.lightflyers.com/kwjf.mpg that you can download and save. ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Sep 08, 2006
From: Paul Mulwitz <p.mulwitz(at)worldnet.att.net>
Subject: Re: New to the Group - Plan to Build CH601XL
Hi Steven, Welcome aboard. I am also building a 601XL and plan to use a Jabiru 3300 along with one of the lower end EFIS units. I think I may end up with one of the newer combined units from Dynon that has both flight instrumentation and engine monitoring functions as well. Since my wife is also a Pilot, I may put one of those units on each side of the panel to allow for switching which side the pilot operates from. For now my only contribution to the instrument panel is a Lift Reserve Indicator I made while waiting for the long lead time on the wing kit. I am also building from the standard kit. The quick-build kit wasn't available when I started about 15 months ago. I tend to work on my plane every day but only for an hour or two. I am well into the fuselage and have completed the wings and tail section. I had to build three wings since I messed up the first one - something to do with the alignment of the nose skin. If I were to do it again I would still use the standard kit. I enjoy building, but I don't want to go crazy trying to figure out how to make 12 foot long bends in sheet metal or spend a lot of time making wing ribs or welding. I am happy to pay ZAC for those specialized efforts as well as the hunting down of proper materials. That makes me a poor candidate for scratch building, and I agree with you that I would rather do the building myself than pay for some "Outsourced" building of the basic structure which I believe is how the quick-build kits are done. I have found ZAC does a great job of supplying the correct materials and the cutting and bending seems quite good. I wish I could say such nice things about the pre-drilled holes in some of the parts. They may have improved recently with the new equipment, but I doubt the whole process has been changed enough to make the pilot holes work out well. I think the problem is they drill pilot holes in the wing skin (for example) but the builder locates and drills all the holes for the ribs and rear channel. That means the holes in the skin are not specific to the exact position of the ribs and rear channel. This is not a show stopper, I found by several trials I could minimize the "Error" in the pilot hole positions and wind up with a perfectly acceptable wing. It just is not as easy as you might think having the pilot holes done at the factory. (Indeed when I reordered parts for the third wing I needed I got the wing skins undrilled. That worked out better for me than having the pilot holes in places that didn't match my ribs.) My last comment is this email list is a great resource for me and I am sure you will find it valuable too. There are many posts that are best ignored, but every now and then there is a real jewel which makes the whole process worthwhile. Best regards, Paul XL fuselage At 09:38 AM 9/8/2006, you wrote: >Hello All, > >I am new to this group and am planning to start building a CH601XL >before the end of this year. > >With that said, I have been doing quite a bit of reading and made a >phone call to Zenith to better understand the differences between >the QB and Standard Kits. > >After my conversation with Sebastian I am leaning towards the >Standard kit. My impression is that the standard kit will save me a >fair sum of money and still provide features such as pilot holes on >wing, fuselage and other surface skins. The difference in cost will >also help towards my engine, avionics, paint funds. > >I also plan to start with the tail kit and build from components as >I understand improvements to the kit are planned and I would like to >take advantage of them if and when they are released. > >I live in Northern California (Redwood City to be exact) and plan to >build in my garage in order to maximize my time availability. I have >built in the past but never completed an aircraft primarily due to >my desire to fly more than build. Fortunately I have most if not all >of the tools I need to build having purchased them along the way >durning my past building episodes. > >Now that I am older (and hopefully wiser) I have settled on the >CH601XL and plan to take advantage being able to fly under LSA in >the future as my flying needs have become more about enjoying an >hour or two in the air vs. IFR, cross country flying, etc. > >I am also leaning on the Jabiru 3300 engine and a budget glass >cockpit. > >Any advice would be greatly appreciated and I look forward to >getting started and completing the CH601XL! > >Regards, > >Steven > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Sep 08, 2006
From: N5SL <nfivesl(at)yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: Stripper (Humor - Erase now if you don't want a
chuckle) I got this story today via email. Erase if you don't want to laugh: A man and his ever-nagging wife went on vacation to Jerusalem. While they were there, the wife passed away. The undertaker told the husband, "You can have her shipped home for $5,000, or you can bury her here, in the Holy Land, for $150." The man thought about it and told him he would just have her shipped home. The undertaker asked, "Why would you spend $5,000 to ship your wife home, when it would be wonderful to be buried here and you would spend only $150?" The man replied, "Long ago a man died here, was buried here, and three days later he rose from the dead. I just can't take that chance." Scott Laughlin Working on engine Cowl http://www.cooknwithgas.com/9_2_06_Intake5.JPG --- Bill Naumuk wrote: > > > John- > I know, I left myself open. Maybe we ought to > have a code for when we're > serious and when we're not. > Bill Naumuk __________________________________________________ ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Rmtnview(at)aol.com
Date: Sep 08, 2006
Subject: 701 sub kits
Might anyone know of unworked 701 sub kits for sale? By unworked, I mean that haven't been started yet. Thanks ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Dave Ruddiman" <pacificpainting(at)comcast.net>
Subject: Strobe wires.
Date: Sep 08, 2006
I plan on running the strobe wires through the leading edge ribs on my 801. Any reasons for or against? Dave in Salem 801 ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Sep 08, 2006
From: Paul Mulwitz <p.mulwitz(at)worldnet.att.net>
Subject: Re: Strobe wires.
Hi Dave, That wouldn't work very well on a 601, but I don't know about the 801. The 601 has fuel tanks on the inboard half of the nose rib area. They would get in the way of the strobe wires. One question: Will you install the power supplies for the strobes at the wing tips or in the fuselage? If you are running the wires that connect the power supplies to the actual strobe lamps all the way down the length of the wings, I would recommend shielding them. That means putting them in a conductive sleeve of some sort with one end (probably the fuselage end) grounded to the frame and the other end floating electrically. The idea is to keep the high voltage impulses away from your radios and antennas. Best regards, Paul XL fuselage At 09:13 PM 9/8/2006, you wrote: >I plan on running the strobe wires through the leading edge ribs on >my 801. Any reasons for or against? > >Dave in Salem >801 --------------------------------------------- Paul Mulwitz 32013 NE Dial Road Camas, WA 98607 --------------------------------------------- ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Dave Ruddiman" <pacificpainting(at)comcast.net>
Subject: Re: Strobe wires.
Date: Sep 08, 2006
Hi Paul, I have 2 tanks per wing and they are located behind the main spar. There is nothing between the leading edge of the spar and the nose skin except a lot of room. I am mounting the strobe power supplies to the spar tips and running the strobe and nav light wires through the wing to a switch. I think I will also run a ground wire along with them instead of grounding to the wing structure. I don't know if it makes any difference, but it's easy to do at this stage and it can't hurt anything. I'm always curious how other people do things and this is a good group to pick up a lot of useful information. Thanks for the input. Dave in Salem 801 ----- Original Message ----- From: Paul Mulwitz To: zenith-list(at)matronics.com Sent: Friday, September 08, 2006 9:56 PM Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Strobe wires. Hi Dave, That wouldn't work very well on a 601, but I don't know about the 801. The 601 has fuel tanks on the inboard half of the nose rib area. They would get in the way of the strobe wires. One question: Will you install the power supplies for the strobes at the wing tips or in the fuselage? If you are running the wires that connect the power supplies to the actual strobe lamps all the way down the length of the wings, I would recommend shielding them. That means putting them in a conductive sleeve of some sort with one end (probably the fuselage end) grounded to the frame and the other end floating electrically. The idea is to keep the high voltage impulses away from your radios and antennas. Best regards, Paul XL fuselage At 09:13 PM 9/8/2006, you wrote: I plan on running the strobe wires through the leading edge ribs on my 801. Any reasons for or against? Dave in Salem 801 --------------------------------------------- Paul Mulwitz 32013 NE Dial Road Camas, WA 98607 --------------------------------------------- ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: New to the Group - Plan to Build CH601XL
From: "Ron Lendon" <rlendon(at)comcast.net>
Date: Sep 08, 2006
Paul, I read your post and I think I noticed that you drill holes in your ribs then matched them up to the outer skin? Here is how I do that operation: Pilot drill the skin first. Draw lines on the ribs where the holes should go Insert ribs and line up the lines through the holes in the skin. Drill one hole through rib, add cleco (start with the silver) Go to the next rib and repeat paying paticular attention to keeping the skin tight to the ribs. Tip: you may need to stick a pointy tool in one hole to line up the one you want to drill. FWIW -------- Ron Lendon, Clinton Township, MI Corvair Zodiac XL, ScrapBuilder ;-) Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=60534#60534 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Roger Venables" <roger(at)nwtradingpost.com>
Subject: Strobe wires.
Date: Sep 09, 2006
Dave I am building a 701 just to the north of you and went through the same set of questions with the strobes before I finished my wings The advice that made the most sense to me was to mount the power supplies in the fuselage (behind the seats in the 701) and run shielded cable from here out to the strobes on the wing tips This has 2 main advantages, 1. it makes it easier to maintain/replace the power supplies, and 2. it takes the weight out of the wing tips and puts it lower down in the fuselage I called Aeroflash in Chicago and they were perfectly happy with this and supplied me with the shielded cable. I will be using Molex connectors at the wing root and the short piece of exposed wiring at the connector is also no problem, so they tell me as long as I also connect the shielding. As Paul says, ground the power supply side of the shielded cable, not the outboard end I have been following your project with interest Roger 701, busy on flaps and slats Kenmore, WA _____ From: owner-zenith-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-zenith-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Dave Ruddiman Sent: Friday, September 08, 2006 10:33 PM Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Strobe wires. Hi Paul, I have 2 tanks per wing and they are located behind the main spar. There is nothing between the leading edge of the spar and the nose skin except a lot of room. I am mounting the strobe power supplies to the spar tips and running the strobe and nav light wires through the wing to a switch. I think I will also run a ground wire along with them instead of grounding to the wing structure. I don't know if it makes any difference, but it's easy to do at this stage and it can't hurt anything. I'm always curious how other people do things and this is a good group to pick up a lot of useful information. Thanks for the input. Dave in Salem 801 ----- Original Message ----- From: Paul <mailto:p.mulwitz(at)worldnet.att.net> Mulwitz Sent: Friday, September 08, 2006 9:56 PM Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Strobe wires. Hi Dave, That wouldn't work very well on a 601, but I don't know about the 801. The 601 has fuel tanks on the inboard half of the nose rib area. They would get in the way of the strobe wires. One question: Will you install the power supplies for the strobes at the wing tips or in the fuselage? If you are running the wires that connect the power supplies to the actual strobe lamps all the way down the length of the wings, I would recommend shielding them. That means putting them in a conductive sleeve of some sort with one end (probably the fuselage end) grounded to the frame and the other end floating electrically. The idea is to keep the high voltage impulses away from your radios and antennas. Best regards, Paul XL fuselage At 09:13 PM 9/8/2006, you wrote: I plan on running the strobe wires through the leading edge ribs on my 801. Any reasons for or against? Dave in Salem 801 --------------------------------------------- Paul Mulwitz 32013 NE Dial Road Camas, WA 98607 --------------------------------------------- ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Sep 09, 2006
From: Paul Mulwitz <p.mulwitz(at)worldnet.att.net>
Subject: Re: Strobe wires.
Hi Dave, I chose the other route for the ground path. I am using the wing skin and structure for the ground return path for the strobe supplies. I also chose not to use any paint on my internal joints for corrosion control, so I have a really nice electrical connection between all the structural parts. Aluminum is not as good a conductor as copper or silver, but there is so much of it I think it should make a superb ground path. To prevent radio noise, I intend to run a heavy copper ground wire from the common ground point near the engine to the instrument panel. I realize this is a controversial approach, but I am reminded of a popular saying from the designer of the MiniMax I built about 20 years ago. His comment was -- if you are thinking of adding anything to the structure, try throwing it up in the air. If it comes back down, it is too heavy. Given the location of your fuel tanks, the nose area of the wing sounds like a perfect place to route the wires. The next question is whether to install some sort of conduit for them or route the wires through the nose ribs using grommets or some sort of trellis in the lightening holes. I chose to skip the conduit (see the test above) and used lacing tape to bind the wires together. The idea is to keep the wires reasonably tightly suspended so they don't rattle around when flying in bumpy air. I had a hard time doing this until I discovered lacing tape. It is like dental floss but a bit larger and covered with a lot of wax. The method I found worked best for me was to route the bundle through a rubber grommet and tie it on both sides of the rib through a hole drilled next to the grommet - perhaps 1/4" from the rubber. The resulting "U' shaped cord seems to do a good job of holding the bundle in place. The lacing tape is available from AS&S and is the only stuff I have found that actually sticks (a little) to the Tefzel insulation on aircraft grade wire. The alternative of using nylon cable ties seems good until you discover that the wire just slips right through the tightly pulled ties -- making it impossible to really fix the wire bundle in place. One other thing I decided to do was install connectors on all the wires at the wing root. This allows removal of the wing without cutting the wires. I opted for automotive spade connectors with nylon covers and use a little more of the lacing tape to tie the connectors together to make sure they don't slip apart. I have heard some people say not to use automotive connectors, but I have no idea why not. Good luck, Paul XL fuselage At 10:32 PM 9/8/2006, you wrote: >Hi Paul, > >I have 2 tanks per wing and they are located behind the main spar. >There is nothing between the leading edge of the spar and the nose >skin except a lot of room. I am mounting the strobe power supplies >to the spar tips and running the strobe and nav light wires through >the wing to a switch. I think I will also run a ground wire along >with them instead of grounding to the wing structure. I don't know >if it makes any difference, but it's easy to do at this stage and it >can't hurt anything. I'm always curious how other people do things >and this is a good group to pick up a lot of useful information. >Thanks for the input. > >Dave in Salem >801 > - ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Sep 09, 2006
From: Paul Mulwitz <p.mulwitz(at)worldnet.att.net>
Subject: Re: New to the Group - Plan to Build CH601XL
Hi Ron, I use a similar approach for attaching the skin. The only difference is I mark the center of the rib flanges first and transfer the lines to set to locations of the pilot holes in the skin. The problem I tried to describe is related to the fact that the ribs are attached to the spar and rear channel using "Random" alignment. That means the actual location of each end of each rib varies a few mm from the "Ideal" location. The holes drilled in the skin at the factory cannot allow for this randomness in the rib locations, so the pilot holes don't really line up exactly with the flanges on the ribs. The issue is getting good edge distance on all the holes at the same time. I found that a trial fitting of the skin to the skeleton allows measuring the distance from the pre-drilled rivet lines and the lines marked on the rib flanges. After a little study it is possible to find an ideal offset from the marked lines to the pre-drilled skin so none of the rivets violates the edge distance rules. That means a small percentage of the rivets are actually on the lines marked on the rib flanges, but it all works out OK. I'm afraid this is one of those issues where a picture would work a lot better than words. Alas, I didn't take the pictures at the time and my wings are all closed up now. Best regards, Paul XL fuselage At 11:51 PM 9/8/2006, you wrote: >Paul, > >I read your post and I think I noticed that you drill holes in your ribs >then matched them up to the outer skin? > >Here is how I do that operation: > >Pilot drill the skin first. > >Draw lines on the ribs where the holes should go > >Insert ribs and line up the lines through the holes in the skin. > >Drill one hole through rib, add cleco (start with the silver) > >Go to the next rib and repeat paying paticular attention to keeping >the skin tight to the ribs. > >Tip: you may need to stick a pointy tool in one hole to line up the >one you want to drill. > >FWIW > >-------- >Ron Lendon, Clinton Township, MI >Corvair Zodiac XL, ScrapBuilder ;-) --------------------------------------------- Paul Mulwitz 32013 NE Dial Road Camas, WA 98607 --------------------------------------------- ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Clive Richards" <stephen(at)crichards.flyer.co.uk>
Subject: Re: Rudder twitchy's
Date: Sep 09, 2006
Hi list I agree with Grants Comments I have been doing a large number of Tuch & Go's to get the landings correct in Rays 601hd Continental 0 200 and have not noticed a problem with the rudder. I just need to get the speed & flare correct for a good landing as the pich is very sensitive. We did however have to fit a fixed rudder trim tab which now allows hands off at cruse. ----- Original Message ----- From: Grant Corriveau To: zenith-list(at)matronics.com Sent: Friday, September 08, 2006 6:00 PM Subject: Zenith-List: Rudder twitchy's Hi Bill, I fly a 601HDS with CAM100 (Honda conversion). I noticed the yaw in the movie clip too. I must say I've never noticed it while flying my aircraft, but then I wasn't looking for it. (. My conclusion about the 601 is that it is easy to fly, but challenging to fly well, keeping all these various 'twitchys' to a minumum. fwiw, Grant Corriveau Nanaimo, B.C. C-GHTF ================ On 7-Sep-06, at 11:58 PM, Zenith-List Digest Server wrote: From: "Bill Naumuk" <naumuk(at)alltel.net> Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Youtube video of Zodiac at Brian Ranch airport Rick- Rudder input looked pretty twitchy. Is it that sensitive, or was that PIO? Gotta remember, I'm a C-172 driver. Bill Naumuk HDS Fuselage Townville, Pa ------------------------------- grant.corriveau(at)telus.net --------------------------------------- The Wings Stayed On! http://aluwings.blogspirit.com --------------------------------------- -- This message has been scanned for viruses and dangerous content by MailScanner, and is believed to be clean. ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Sep 09, 2006
From: Monty Graves <mgraves(at)usmo.com>
Subject: Re: Scratch built Spars
use a short vixen file or a dog leg de burr tool.. I prefer the latter, to each his own. http://www.yardstore.com/index.cfm?action=ViewDetails&ItemID=118&Category=25 Its item number14031 if the link doesn't work http://www.yardstore.com Monty > >Hey Terry, > >I was the guy making the inquiry about scratch building spars. Thanks for >sharing the photo. I'm to the point of deburring all those many, many >holes. Any advice you have to offer would be appreciated. > >Dave Clay >Temple, Texas >Ch601XL Scratch Builder > >http://www.daves601xl.com > > >Read this topic online here: > >http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=60357#60357 > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Sep 09, 2006
From: 601corvair <airvair601(at)yahoo.com>
Subject: 601Corvair Exhaust, intake, carb, Dinwiddie VA
Hello all: I am hoping someone can help me with a potential issue. We are months/years away from making noise with our Corvair and still collecting material/parts. We like to make as much as we can and have found the drawing, updates and materials list in WW manual excellent. With the exception of stuff Weve bought from Clarks my partner and I have scratch built about every thing, usually using WW plans. We have taken a break from the engine and are working on the airframe. Just for a change of pace ( and the hope of finding a reasonable MA3 to rebuild). Our 601 HDS has several modifications which we will not share until we have flown behind it. Some of the modifications will require alteration in the exhaust and intake rigging. It would help us out greatly to get a measured drawing and materials list for the 3 inch exhaust stubs. We wont need them for sometime but I see that WW has discontinued this item, so I must buy them now ahead of schedule while the supply lasts, or be confident we can make them later. Getting the drawings would increase my confidence. We have access to a machine shop with large presses, so I think we can make it ourselves and then weld them to additional tubes when we fit the final instillation. Any info on intake manifolds would also be helpful. If you want to respond off list I can be reached at: airvair601 at yahoo.com Or phartigatmindspring.com Thanks phill. Ps. Any 601 HDS guys going to be at Dinwiddie Sept 30? --------------------------------- ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Noel Loveys" <noelloveys(at)yahoo.ca>
Subject: Strobe wires.
Date: Sep 09, 2006
the DC wires for the nav lights won't require the shielding. If you use the shielded wire for that application you may add a few ounces to your plane. Obviously you are aware the wires to the strobe lights themselves are another ball of wax. Grounding the shielding at one end only, usually the inboard end, is a common avionics practice. That practice will even be carried to the much shorter interconnects between various radios, audio panels and display indicators. I think the important thing with wires running through the wings is to make sure the wires are supported properly in cushion clamps so they can't interfere with any flight controls or rub against any structural members. Noel -----Original Message----- From: owner-zenith-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-zenith-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Roger Venables Sent: Saturday, September 09, 2006 4:45 AM Subject: RE: Zenith-List: Strobe wires. Dave I am building a 701 just to the north of you and went through the same set of questions with the strobes before I finished my wings The advice that made the most sense to me was to mount the power supplies in the fuselage (behind the seats in the 701) and run shielded cable from here out to the strobes on the wing tips This has 2 main advantages, 1. it makes it easier to maintain/replace the power supplies, and 2. it takes the weight out of the wing tips and puts it lower down in the fuselage I called Aeroflash in Chicago and they were perfectly happy with this and supplied me with the shielded cable. I will be using Molex connectors at the wing root and the short piece of exposed wiring at the connector is also no problem, so they tell me as long as I also connect the shielding. As Paul says, ground the power supply side of the shielded cable, not the outboard end I have been following your project with interest Roger 701, busy on flaps and slats Kenmore, WA _____ From: owner-zenith-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-zenith-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Dave Ruddiman Sent: Friday, September 08, 2006 10:33 PM Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Strobe wires. Hi Paul, I have 2 tanks per wing and they are located behind the main spar. There is nothing between the leading edge of the spar and the nose skin except a lot of room. I am mounting the strobe power supplies to the spar tips and running the strobe and nav light wires through the wing to a switch. I think I will also run a ground wire along with them instead of grounding to the wing structure. I don't know if it makes any difference, but it's easy to do at this stage and it can't hurt anything. I'm always curious how other people do things and this is a good group to pick up a lot of useful information. Thanks for the input. Dave in Salem 801 ----- Original Message ----- From: Paul Mulwitz <mailto:p.mulwitz(at)worldnet.att.net> Sent: Friday, September 08, 2006 9:56 PM Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Strobe wires. Hi Dave, That wouldn't work very well on a 601, but I don't know about the 801. The 601 has fuel tanks on the inboard half of the nose rib area. They would get in the way of the strobe wires. One question: Will you install the power supplies for the strobes at the wing tips or in the fuselage? If you are running the wires that connect the power supplies to the actual strobe lamps all the way down the length of the wings, I would recommend shielding them. That means putting them in a conductive sleeve of some sort with one end (probably the fuselage end) grounded to the frame and the other end floating electrically. The idea is to keep the high voltage impulses away from your radios and antennas. Best regards, Paul XL fuselage At 09:13 PM 9/8/2006, you wrote: I plan on running the strobe wires through the leading edge ribs on my 801. Any reasons for or against? Dave in Salem 801 --------------------------------------------- Paul Mulwitz 32013 NE Dial Road Camas, WA 98607 --------------------------------------------- ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Noel Loveys" <noelloveys(at)yahoo.ca>
Subject: Strobe wires.
Date: Sep 09, 2006
The guy who first thought of using nylon wire ties should be flogged severely with a wet cod fish! Unless the ends of these ties have been properly sanded after the excess has been removed, they are the worst hand gashing items ever inflicted on aircraft. So far I haven't heard of any one being sliced open by waxed string. It may take a bit longer to install but for the application it works a lot better. For heavier applications use Coraseal... its heavier and can stretch to keep things nice and taught. As for using the aircraft skin for a ground shield nope.... no way .... nada. the skin will form a huge capacitor with the positive charged wires running through it. This is why shielded wire is only grounded at one end. They say for metal to corrode two things are required; two dissimilar metals and moisture ( salt water makes a better electrolyte). But you may have noticed how the battery terminals on your car will corrode unless they are covered with a good quality of grease. What do you think will happen when you attach copper wires to a nice aluminium skin and run a current through it and then to top things off go playing in the clouds??? A better idea... use a shielded wire grounded at one end only or for a DC current like the nav lights a two conductor cable. There are places where an aircraft frame, like that of a car will provide a common ground. Usually that occurs in the 4130 steel sub frames of many planes. even when this is done extra grounding straps are usually installed to supply current to high drain devices like starting motors. Noel -----Original Message----- From: owner-zenith-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-zenith-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Paul Mulwitz Sent: Saturday, September 09, 2006 7:48 AM Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Strobe wires. Hi Dave, I chose the other route for the ground path. I am using the wing skin and structure for the ground return path for the strobe supplies. I also chose not to use any paint on my internal joints for corrosion control, so I have a really nice electrical connection between all the structural parts. Aluminum is not as good a conductor as copper or silver, but there is so much of it I think it should make a superb ground path. To prevent radio noise, I intend to run a heavy copper ground wire from the common ground point near the engine to the instrument panel. I realize this is a controversial approach, but I am reminded of a popular saying from the designer of the MiniMax I built about 20 years ago. His comment was -- if you are thinking of adding anything to the structure, try throwing it up in the air. If it comes back down, it is too heavy. Given the location of your fuel tanks, the nose area of the wing sounds like a perfect place to route the wires. The next question is whether to install some sort of conduit for them or route the wires through the nose ribs using grommets or some sort of trellis in the lightening holes. I chose to skip the conduit (see the test above) and used lacing tape to bind the wires together. The idea is to keep the wires reasonably tightly suspended so they don't rattle around when flying in bumpy air. I had a hard time doing this until I discovered lacing tape. It is like dental floss but a bit larger and covered with a lot of wax. The method I found worked best for me was to route the bundle through a rubber grommet and tie it on both sides of the rib through a hole drilled next to the grommet - perhaps 1/4" from the rubber. The resulting "U' shaped cord seems to do a good job of holding the bundle in place. The lacing tape is available from AS&S and is the only stuff I have found that actually sticks (a little) to the Tefzel insulation on aircraft grade wire. The alternative of using nylon cable ties seems good until you discover that the wire just slips right through the tightly pulled ties -- making it impossible to really fix the wire bundle in place. One other thing I decided to do was install connectors on all the wires at the wing root. This allows removal of the wing without cutting the wires. I opted for automotive spade connectors with nylon covers and use a little more of the lacing tape to tie the connectors together to make sure they don't slip apart. I have heard some people say not to use automotive connectors, but I have no idea why not. Good luck, Paul XL fuselage At 10:32 PM 9/8/2006, you wrote: Hi Paul, I have 2 tanks per wing and they are located behind the main spar. There is nothing between the leading edge of the spar and the nose skin except a lot of room. I am mounting the strobe power supplies to the spar tips and running the strobe and nav light wires through the wing to a switch. I think I will also run a ground wire along with them instead of grounding to the wing structure. I don't know if it makes any difference, but it's easy to do at this stage and it can't hurt anything. I'm always curious how other people do things and this is a good group to pick up a lot of useful information. Thanks for the input. Dave in Salem 801 - ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Robert L. Stone" <rstone4(at)hot.rr.com>
Subject: Re: Strobe wires.
Date: Sep 09, 2006
Dave, If you do, be sure to install rubber grommets in each hole. Vibration will soon cause a dead short to ground when the sharp edge of hole wears through the insulation. Another way to protect wiring is, install a plastic tube first using bulkhead seal at each hole, then run your wires through the tube. Bob Stone, Harker Heights, Tx ZodiacXL ----- Original Message ----- From: Dave Ruddiman To: zenith-list(at)matronics.com Sent: Friday, September 08, 2006 11:13 PM Subject: Zenith-List: Strobe wires. I plan on running the strobe wires through the leading edge ribs on my 801. Any reasons for or against? Dave in Salem 801 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Edward Moody II" <dredmoody(at)cox.net>
Subject: Re: Video Camera mount
Date: Sep 09, 2006
Most camera stores and mail order outfits sell some version of a pocket tripod. Many of them feature a C-clamp design that could be tightened down over the turtledeck edge without any modification. I use one clamped to the cockpit side rail of my ultralight to get inflight videos from just outside the airplane. Ed Moody II ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Bill Naumuk" <naumuk(at)alltel.net>
Subject: Re: Another Youtube video of Zodiac at Fox Field (KWJF)
Date: Sep 09, 2006
R.P- I'm really impressed. Builders still on dial-up- if there was ever a reason to go broadband, Youtube is it. The video quality was much better on Youtube than the file on Lightflyers, at least on my computer. Was that an HD or HDS? Bill Naumuk HDS Fuselage Townville, Pa ----- Original Message ----- From: "R.P." <zodie(at)adelphia.net> Sent: Friday, September 08, 2006 9:58 PM Subject: Zenith-List: Another Youtube video of Zodiac at Fox Field (KWJF) > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Dave Austin" <daveaustin2(at)can.rogers.com>> Re these videos.. >> How do I download these videos as a file and store on the PC? >> Dave Austin 601HDS - 912, Spitfire Mk VIII > > I just found Youtube a couple of days ago and don't know how to download > and save. Here's another video of a high and fast landing at Fox Field > http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V5tljAPJ328 > > I'll put a larger filesize version at http://www.lightflyers.com/kwjf.mpg > that you can download and save. > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Zenair for sale
Date: Sep 09, 2006
From: "Garrou, Douglas" <dgarrou(at)hunton.com>
This one has been discussed quite a bit and should be in the archives. I don't know much about Scotch Brite, but this stuff I know. I can give free thoughts, worth what you paid, so long as you agree you aren't my client, etc. etc. etc. ad nauseum, ipso facto, e pluribus unum. Laws in different states are different, I am the worst lawyer in history, everything below is wrong, and nobody should pay any attention to anything I say because they will likely instantly burst into flame if they do. I love disclaimers. In selling a homebuilt, through careful contracting, you may be able to obtain some lawsuit protection from the person who buys your airplane, and perhaps his or her family/estate. You may also be able to work out some kind of insurance deal that covers you both. That would be unusual and difficult, but it isn't inconceivable. All this falls into the "unsatisfactory but better than nothing" category. But you will NOT be able to immunize yourself effectively against lawsuits brought by third parties. And that's a big "but," so to speak. Worst case scenario: you build the airplane, and leave a wrench in the tail with your name on it. You sell the airplane. The new owner crashes into a school bus because the wrench jams the controls. Every kid on the school bus sues you (and everyone else in sight of course, possibly including the wrench manufacturer and Wilbur Wright.....). You are sued because you are the "defective" airplane's manufacturer (they'll think of something "defective"), and you were arguably individually negligent, as a mechanic and/or manufacturer, in leaving the wrench in the tail. You have all kinds of problems at this point. The kids on the bus never gave you a hold harmless agreement. The indemnification deal you did with the buyer isn't much help because he doesn't have any money. The insurance bids $100,000 per kid, up to 10 kids -- *assuming you're even covered, which would require an unusual arrangement and careful monitoring of the buyer long after the sale* -- and then the insurance company says "see ya." An extreme example, of course, but there are a lot of fact scenarios out there that would approximate this. You can substitute the new owner's passengers for the kids on the bus, and it's the same analysis. I have discovered that many homebuilders do not like this analysis, but (a) not many of them are commercial litigators and (b) I have yet to hear any of them explain how, exactly, I can prevent exposure to the new owner's passengers, or to the kids on the bus. Perhaps after a certain number of years you could claim immunity under GARA, but that's well beyond my expertise, and the wrench issue will still stick you, probably. Those of you in other countries, keep all this in mind the next time someone criticizes your legal system. :) I do not worry about these kinds of things, however. Life is waaaaay too short. I would sell my homebuilt, make sure my name and address were all over the inside, and go drink a beer. But that's just me. If you followed that advice you would surely burst into flame. :) Cheers Doug Garrou Project 801 www.garrou.com -----Original Message----- From: "Dan Forney" <dforney(at)bctonline.com> Subject: RE: Zenith-List: Zenair for sale Anytime that I talk to someone about the possibility of selling a homebuilt if or when I was ever unable to fly it, they always caution me against the thought due to possible liability lawsuits as the manufacturer. Anyone else ever worry about that when selling, or are there ways to protect yourself? ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Bill Naumuk" <naumuk(at)alltel.net>
Subject: Re: Polishing
Date: Sep 09, 2006
Tim- Will corrosion protectant stick to a polished surface? If it will, between Carlo's comments and yours, I just might totally change my mind about painting. I've got 3 stinkin' skins out of the whole lot that have some corrosion- and it's on the interior surface. It would take no more time to polish the crud off than to strip it off, at about the same expense. The only place I'd have to paint would be the wing and stab tips. I could use adhesive trim to cover up my one smiley on the stab leading edge and just put a rivet in the stray hole in my right outboard. Only a Zenith builder would know it didn't belong there! Bill Naumuk HDS Fuselage Townville, Pa __________________________________________________________ L=E8che-vitrine ou l=E8che-=E9cran ? ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Clyde Barcus" <barcusc(at)comcast.net>
Subject: Strobe Wires
Date: Sep 09, 2006
I used about two inches of shrink tubing every few inches and I also use liquid tape on the grommets to keep the wires from sliding. The wires are not drawn completely tight to allow for a little flex and it makes a nice bundle, I tried pulling the wires back and forth and it did not move. Originally I grounded my wires to the frame of the wing, when I tested the lights they did not work very well so I ran a ground wire, it works great now. Clyde Barcus 601 XL, Corvair Powered Wings, Tail & Engine Complete Working on Fuselage ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Jeff " <jeffrey_davidson(at)earthlink.net>
Subject: Zenair for sale
Date: Sep 09, 2006
And that is the practical question: "Has anyone ever actually been successfully sued as the manufacturer of a homebuilt aircraft?" When I last asked some time ago, the answer was "no". Maybe Doug can update us on this if he has new information about cases that have actually occurred. Jeff Davidson Unless you are rolling in dough, you are not at a great risk of being sued in one of these cases. The lawyers generally go after the "deep pockets". This is why very few, if any homebuilders have ever been sued as a result of aircraft accidents. There is simply no money to be made. In my opinion, a generous insurance policy just makes you a bigger target for a lawsuit. I would just sell the plane and walk away and not worry too much about liability risks. On Sep 9, 2006, at 10:15 AM, Garrou, Douglas wrote: > > But you will NOT be able to immunize yourself effectively against > lawsuits brought by third parties. And that's a big "but," so to > speak. > > ... > > Doug Garrou ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Edward Moody II" <dredmoody(at)cox.net>
Subject: Re: Zenair for sale
Date: Sep 09, 2006
I agree that many times the availability of a big lump of insurance money is like waving a red flag in front of a bull. Ain't it a bitch though that having worked hard or worked smart or both makes you a target as well. It reminds me of the injustice of the anti-hunting crowd who don't mind eating chickens, pigs, and cattle. They mostly object to the death of "cute" animals. One friend wanted to use the engine that he had previously mounted on a wood and fabric ultralight. He moved it to a CGS Hawk. The old airframe was perceived as a liability so he rolled it a safe distance from his house (out in the country) and set fire to it. He claims that in 15 minutes there was not enough left to bother to rake up. So much for carrying a fire extinguisher, I guess. Ed > > Unless you are rolling in dough, you are not at a great risk of being > sued in one of these cases. The lawyers generally go after the "deep > pockets". This is why very few, if any homebuilders have ever been sued > as a result of aircraft accidents. There is simply no money to be made. > In my opinion, a generous insurance policy just makes you a bigger target > for a lawsuit. I would just sell the plane and walk away and not worry > too much about liability risks. ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Grant Corriveau <grant.corriveau(at)TELUS.NET>
Subject: Rudder twitchy's
Date: Sep 09, 2006
: "Zodie Rocket" Subject: RE: Zenith-List: Rudder twitchy's ----------------- I honestly believe that no change is necessary, ----------------- I agree completely with Mark. Don't waste time trying to 'improve' the handling by messing with the design. It handles like a dream if you want a quick, sporty little airplane that is still easy to fly. I call it a Mazda Miata with wings 'cause that's how it seems to handle to me. Sporty. Rudder trim is unnecessary. The plane is designed to be neutral in cruise (the engine mount is offset to counter the Tourque/P effects) and this works nicely. ( -- I'm smiling, so please read this in a light-hearted tone.) Trim tab systems are intended to counter-act imbalances in Long Term stable conditions. For shorter-term, dynamically changing conditions, (i.e. climbs, power changes, speed changes, altitude changes, rolling into/outof banks; etc, etc.) we use hands and feet to control rudder, ailerons and elevators. It's called 'aircraft handling' and forms just part of the skills set known as "piloting" <> Build the plane and go fly! All the best, Grant Corriveau GHTF ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Grant Corriveau <grant.corriveau(at)TELUS.NET>
Subject: YouTube
Date: Sep 09, 2006
> I think that this kind of online video viewer is built to prevent downloading. Now, having said that, I do believe I saw a share/free ware program the other day somewhere that is intended to record flash and/or realplayer movies....? not sure... > I just found Youtube a couple of days ago and don't know how to > download > and save. Here's another video of a high and fast landing at Fox Field ------------------------------- grant.corriveau(at)telus.net --------------------------------------- The Wings Stayed On! http://aluwings.blogspirit.com --------------------------------------- ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Bill Naumuk" <naumuk(at)alltel.net>
Subject: Re: Rudder twitchy's
Date: Sep 09, 2006
All- As I said before, I don't think this is a job for the builder. I got thinking about all the possible causes and realized it's way out of my league. Also, if Beech can live with a nasty Dutch Roll in their A36 (Although I'm sure they don't advertise it) I guess we can live with a much less severe case in the Zenith. Still, an opportunity for improvement. Bill Naumuk HDS Fuselage Townville, Pa ----- Original Message ----- From: "Grant Corriveau" <grant.corriveau(at)TELUS.NET> Sent: Saturday, September 09, 2006 1:38 PM Subject: Zenith-List: Rudder twitchy's > > > : "Zodie Rocket" > Subject: RE: Zenith-List: Rudder twitchy's > ----------------- > I honestly believe that no change is necessary, > ----------------- > > I agree completely with Mark. Don't waste time trying to 'improve' the > handling by messing with the design. It handles like a dream if you want > a quick, sporty little airplane that is still easy to fly. I call it a > Mazda Miata with wings 'cause that's how it seems to handle to me. > Sporty. > > Rudder trim is unnecessary. The plane is designed to be neutral in > cruise (the engine mount is offset to counter the Tourque/P effects) and > this works nicely. > > ( -- I'm smiling, so please read this in a light-hearted tone.) > Trim tab systems are intended to counter-act imbalances in Long Term > stable conditions. For shorter-term, dynamically changing conditions, > (i.e. climbs, power changes, speed changes, altitude changes, rolling > into/outof banks; etc, etc.) we use hands and feet to control rudder, > ailerons and elevators. It's called 'aircraft handling' and forms just > part of the skills set known as "piloting" <> > > Build the plane and go fly! > All the best, > Grant Corriveau > GHTF > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Sep 09, 2006
From: "John Marzulli" <john.marzulli(at)gmail.com>
Subject: Re: YouTube
There is a pluggin for Firefox that will do this. Works on Mac & Windows. ( name escapes me at the moment and it's installed on another computer... ) On 9/9/06, Grant Corriveau wrote: > > > I think that this kind of online video viewer is built to prevent > downloading. Now, having said that, I do believe I saw a share/free ware > program the other day somewhere that is intended to record flash and/or > realplayer movies....? not sure... > > I just found Youtube a couple of days ago and don't know how to download > > and save. Here's another video of a high and fast landing at Fox Field > > > ------------------------------- > grant.corriveau(at)telus.net > --------------------------------------- > The Wings Stayed On! > http://aluwings.blogspirit.com > --------------------------------------- > > > * > > > * > > -- John Marzulli http://701Builder.blogspot.com/ "Flying a plane is no different than riding a bicycle... it's just a lot harder to put baseball cards in the spokes. ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Sep 09, 2006
From: Tim & Diane Shankland <tshank(at)core.com>
Subject: Re: Polishing
Bill, I'm kind of guessing here but I think it would stick if you cleaned off any residue oils that are in the polish. I polished the exterior of my plane and only primed the mating internal surfaces. I also use the demon zinc chromate primer, stuff woks great and I've been using it for over forty years. There is a weight advantage to polishing, there has been some debate but it is probably 20 to 30 pounds lighter. Tim Shankland Bill Naumuk wrote: > Tim- > Will corrosion protectant stick to a polished surface? If it will, > between Carlo's comments and yours, I just might totally change my > mind about painting. I've got 3 stinkin' skins out of the whole lot > that have some corrosion- and it's on the interior surface. It would > take no more time to polish the crud off than to strip it off, at > about the same expense. The only place I'd have to paint would be the > wing and stab tips. I could use adhesive trim to cover up my one > smiley on the stab leading edge and just put a rivet in the stray hole > in my right outboard. Only a Zenith builder would know it didn't > belong there! > Bill Naumuk > HDS Fuselage > Townville, Pa > > > >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >>__________________________________________________________ >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Craftsman Drill Press sale
From: "lwinger" <larrywinger(at)gmail.com>
Date: Sep 09, 2006
For all builders, especially scratch builders, Sears has an online sale that ends today on their 10 in. 2/3 hp Drill Press with Laser. It is normally $119.99, but through today it is $99.99. I'm picking mine up at the local Sears store, but they are even offering a free shipping rebate as well. I know at least one builder who is using this with great success, especially on critical parts like the spars. The laser alignment seems to be working well for him. Craftsman 10 in. Drill Press with Laser Mfr. Model #: 21900 00921900000 $99.99 LaserTrac - projects X and Y axis laser lines for accurate pre-alignment of drilling location Quick release table elevation - Effortlessly raise, lower and make fine adjustments to the worktable On/Off Switch With Removable Locking Key - Switch is easy to use and removable key helps prevent unauthorized usage Beveling Table - 7-5/8 x 6-1/2 in. table will bevel 45-deg. and swivel 360-deg. Fence And Stop Block Included - Fence and stop block help to secure the workpeice. Stop block aids in repetitive drilling Depth Adjustment Rod - Sets the dept of the drill bit for repetitive drilling Cast Iron Table And Base - Cast iron adds strength, stability, and support -------- Larry Winger Tustin, CA 601XL #6493 from scratch Rudder completed -- drilling stab spars Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=60625#60625 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Jaybannist(at)cs.com
Date: Sep 09, 2006
Subject: Steering rod seal
I am at the point of sealing the slots in the firewall (gravanized steel) for the steering rods, against air leakage and fire. I'm sure someone has solved this. There has been a lot of chatter about Honda boots, but that doesn't appeal to me. I am also concerned about the effect of the threads on any seal. Has anyone ground down the threads to make the rods smooth in the vicinity of the slots? By the way, the dimensions shown on the drawings for the slots are wrong. The rods are thicker than the width shown for the slots and the slots are much taller than required for the travel of the nose gear strut. Jay in Dallas, working on XL fuselage N2620J ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Paul Moore" <pmoore505(at)msn.com>
Subject: Re: Stripper
Date: Sep 09, 2006
You know, it's sad when useless backbiting, flaming, and worthless BS get defended but a tiny bit of humor that you obviously set yourself up for gets slammed as a detraction from the value of the site. I've lost any interest in being on this list any longer. Hope everyone finishes and flys safe. Paul Moore Silver City, New Mexico, USA XL-O200 Later dudes................ Definitely ARCHIVE ----- Original Message ----- From: "Bill Naumuk" <naumuk(at)alltel.net> > If I'd received a straight answer from the list yesterday, I could have > picked up what I needed on my lunch break. Now I have to either drive 100+ > miles or wait until Monday and modify my building schedule. > I'm as big an offender as anyone else, but remember people, the site is > supposed to be used for helping fellow builders. > Archive ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Bill Naumuk" <naumuk(at)alltel.net>
Subject: Re: Polishing
Date: Sep 09, 2006
Tim- Considering that except for the 3 skins with interior corrosion I'd be working with virgin aluminum, could I just use the finish polish or is there a definite benefit to using the grade 2 first? I've made up my mind to polish the airframe and trim the leading edges and tips. Also, how much am I going to need? ACS lists the stuff in 1/2lb cans. I figure if I order tonight, my building progress and the arrival of the polish will coincide. Thanks big time. Bill Naumuk HDS Fuselage Townville, Pa ----- Original Message ----- From: Tim & Diane Shankland To: zenith-list(at)matronics.com Sent: Saturday, September 09, 2006 2:53 PM Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Polishing Bill, I'm kind of guessing here but I think it would stick if you cleaned off any residue oils that are in the polish. I polished the exterior of my plane and only primed the mating internal surfaces. I also use the demon zinc chromate primer, stuff woks great and I've been using it for over forty years. There is a weight advantage to polishing, there has been some debate but it is probably 20 to 30 pounds lighter. Tim Shankland Bill Naumuk wrote: Tim- Will corrosion protectant stick to a polished surface? If it will, between Carlo's comments and yours, I just might totally change my mind about painting. I've got 3 stinkin' skins out of the whole lot that have some corrosion- and it's on the interior surface. It would take no more time to polish the crud off than to strip it off, at about the same expense. The only place I'd have to paint would be the wing and stab tips. I could use adhesive trim to cover up my one smiley on the stab leading edge and just put a rivet in the stray hole in my right outboard. Only a Zenith builder would know it didn't belong there! Bill Naumuk HDS Fuselage Townville, Pa __________________________________________________________ L=E8che-vitrine ou l=E8che-=E9cran ? ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Sep 09, 2006
From: Frank Stutzman <stutzman(at)stutzman.com>
Subject: Strobe wires.
On Sat, 9 Sep 2006, Roger Venables wrote: > The advice that made the most sense to me was to mount the power supplies in > the fuselage (behind the seats in the 701) and run shielded cable from here > out to the strobes on the wing tips > > This has 2 main advantages, 1. it makes it easier to maintain/replace the > power supplies, and 2. it takes the weight out of the wing tips and puts it > lower down in the fuselage Well, I don't think I disagree, but here is an opposing point of view anyway ;-) If you are going to add weight to a plane, the wing tips arn't such bad places (within reason). One simple reason is that usually puts that weight right on the longitudal center of gravity. Another is that putting the weight out there reduces the bending moment of the wing. Notice all the planes with after market tip tanks? Those STCs also usually include a gross weight increase that stipulates that any weight over the original gross weight must be carried in fuel in those tip tanks. Yet another reason is that some strobe power supplies generate rf noise that isn't always easy to shield and putting those supplies out on the tips can mitigate this problem to a bit. Your point about ease of maintenace is very valid, but I've seen some clever access panels done on the tips of a 701. Frank Stutzman Bonanza N494B "Hula Girl" Hood River, OR ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Sep 09, 2006
From: N5SL <nfivesl(at)yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: Steering rod seal
Hey Jay in Dallas: I came up with another solution. I didn't like the threads rubbing on the seals either so I used a steel rod and bored a hole in each end. Then I turned down a couple of bolts to insert into the steel rods: http://www.cooknwithgas.com/11_28_04_SteeringRods2.JPG http://www.cooknwithgas.com/11_28_04_SteeringRods.JPG I had them chromed along with the pedals: http://www.cooknwithgas.com/2_19_05_Pedals.jpg I think they work well. Scott in Omaha. http://www.cooknwithgas.com/ --- Jaybannist(at)cs.com wrote: > I am at the point of sealing the slots in the > firewall (gravanized steel) for > the steering rods, against air leakage and fire. I'm > sure someone has solved > this. There has been a lot of chatter about Honda > boots, but that doesn't > appeal to me. __________________________________________________ ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Bill Naumuk" <naumuk(at)alltel.net>
Subject: Re: Stripper
Date: Sep 09, 2006
Paul- Unfortunately, it's getting hard to tell a genuine request from help from worthless BS on the list. I was disgusted enough to quit because of this incident, but on the other hand, the positive aspects of membership outweigh the bad. You hope everyone finishes and flys safe? What's the list for- humor or information? I made so many mistakes on my project in the first 4 months of toughing it out on my own that now I won't drill a hole until I'm good and sure it's in the right place. I've learned that conducting a thorough research before acting is a lot less time consuming than cleaning up after a mistake. As a result, I haven't had to rebuild or replace a part in over a year.. I came close to quitting, but will stick with the list. My fault for phrasing a request for help that some people interpreted as grounds for a joke. I didn't realize you had to signal your intentions. Bill Naumuk HDS Fuselage Townville, Pa ----- Original Message ----- From: "Paul Moore" <pmoore505(at)msn.com> Sent: Saturday, September 09, 2006 7:03 PM Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Re: Stripper > > You know, it's sad when useless backbiting, flaming, and worthless BS get > defended but a tiny bit of humor that you obviously set yourself up for > gets > slammed as a detraction from the value of the site. I've lost any interest > in being on this list any longer. Hope everyone finishes and flys safe. > > Paul Moore > Silver City, New Mexico, USA > XL-O200 > Later dudes................ > Definitely ARCHIVE > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Bill Naumuk" <naumuk(at)alltel.net> > >> If I'd received a straight answer from the list yesterday, I could > have >> picked up what I needed on my lunch break. Now I have to either drive >> 100+ >> miles or wait until Monday and modify my building schedule. >> I'm as big an offender as anyone else, but remember people, the site > is >> supposed to be used for helping fellow builders. >> Archive > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Gary Boothe" <gboothe(at)calply.com>
Subject: Craftsman Drill Press sale
Date: Sep 09, 2006
Does Sears have strippers? Gary Boothe Cool, CA 601 HDSTD, WW Conversion Tail done, wings done, working on c-section For all builders, especially scratch builders, Sears has an online sale that ends today on their 10 in. 2/3 hp Drill Press with Laser. It is normally $119.99, but through today it is $99.99. I'm picking mine up at the local Sears store, but they are even offering a free shipping rebate as well. I know at least one builder who is using this with great success, especially on critical parts like the spars. The laser alignment seems to be working well for him. Craftsman 10 in. Drill Press with Laser Mfr. Model #: 21900 00921900000 $99.99 -------- Larry Winger Tustin, CA 601XL #6493 from scratch Rudder completed -- drilling stab spars Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=60625#60625 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Jaybannist(at)cs.com
Date: Sep 09, 2006
Subject: Re: Steering rod seal
Scott, Very neat! I somtimes wish I had the ability to weld up parts like that, but I don't. I just make do with what I've got Thanks - Jay ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Sep 09, 2006
From: Tim & Diane Shankland <tshank(at)core.com>
Subject: Re: Polishing
Bill, I did the whole plane with a little over 1 lb of of the F8 and 1/2 lb of the C and S. The only way to tell what you need is to try it . If you can start with the C and get a good finish go with it. I had to do three passes of F8 and all top parts and two on the bottom part, you can't see them as well. Then one of C and one of S. When I was done with a part it was usually like a mirror. Interestingly the bottom of the plane is like a full length mirror when you are laying under it, this has a lot to do with it being a very flat surface. If your aluminum is in good shape it won't take too much, the 1/2 lb cans should be enough and you can always order more. If you have been to Osh. and watched the demo or talked to the people at Nuvite they will tell you it is important not to use too much. You just dip the end of your finger in and make six or nine dabs on the aluminum. Spread it around with the bonnet then buff. If you are using the F8 you should us wool bonnets that are not looped. If you go to Nuvite's web site or look at their brochure all this is explained. Tim Bill Naumuk wrote: > Tim- > Considering that except for the 3 skins with interior > corrosion I'd be working with virgin aluminum, could I just use the > finish polish or is there a definite benefit to using the grade 2 > first? I've made up my mind to polish the airframe and trim the > leading edges and tips. > Also, how much am I going to need? ACS lists the stuff in 1/2lb > cans. I figure if I order tonight, my building progress and the > arrival of the polish will coincide. > Thanks big time. > Bill Naumuk > HDS Fuselage > Townville, Pa > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: Tim & Diane Shankland <mailto:tshank(at)core.com> > To: zenith-list(at)matronics.com > Sent: Saturday, September 09, 2006 2:53 PM > Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Polishing > > Bill, > I'm kind of guessing here but I think it would stick if you > cleaned off any residue oils that are in the polish. I polished > the exterior of my plane and only primed the mating internal > surfaces. I also use the demon zinc chromate primer, stuff woks > great and I've been using it for over forty years. There is a > weight advantage to polishing, there has been some debate but it > is probably 20 to 30 pounds lighter. > > Tim Shankland > > Bill Naumuk wrote: > >> Tim- >> Will corrosion protectant stick to a polished surface? If it >> will, between Carlo's comments and yours, I just might totally >> change my mind about painting. I've got 3 stinkin' skins out of >> the whole lot that have some corrosion- and it's on the interior >> surface. It would take no more time to polish the crud off than >> to strip it off, at about the same expense. The only place I'd >> have to paint would be the wing and stab tips. I could use >> adhesive trim to cover up my one smiley on the stab leading edge >> and just put a rivet in the stray hole in my right outboard. Only >> a Zenith builder would know it didn't belong there! >> Bill Naumuk >> HDS Fuselage >> Townville, Pa >> >> >> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>>__________________________________________________________ >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Sep 09, 2006
From: Tim & Diane Shankland <tshank(at)core.com>
Subject: Re: Steering rod seal
Jay, I used a method without boots. I explained it before but here are a couple of picture. The important thing to remember is the rods don't have to be sealed until you are flying, if it leaks air while you are on the ground it doesn't make much difference. As you can see they are just two little doors that close when the weight is taken off the front wheel. To eliminate the noise of the threaded rod I found a piece of thin wall aluminum tubing in may stash of junk and slid them over the rods held in place with a couple of nuts. Tim Shankland Jaybannist(at)cs.com wrote: > I am at the point of sealing the slots in the firewall (gravanized > steel) for the steering rods, against air leakage and fire. I'm sure > someone has solved this. There has been a lot of chatter about Honda > boots, but that doesn't appeal to me. > > I am also concerned about the effect of the threads on any seal. Has > anyone ground down the threads to make the rods smooth in the vicinity > of the slots? > > By the way, the dimensions shown on the drawings for the slots are > wrong. The rods are thicker than the width shown for the slots and > the slots are much taller than required for the travel of the nose > gear strut. > > Jay in Dallas, working on XL fuselage N2620J > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Sep 09, 2006
From: Tim & Diane Shankland <tshank(at)core.com>
Subject: Re: Steering rod seal Trying again with attachments
Jay, I used a method without boots. I explained it before but here are a couple of picture. The important thing to remember is the rods don't have to be sealed until you are flying, if it leaks air while you are on the ground it doesn't make much difference. As you can see they are just two little doors that close when the weight is taken off the front wheel. To eliminate the noise of the threaded rod I found a piece of thin wall aluminum tubing in may stash of junk and slid them over the rods held in place with a couple of nuts. Tim Shankland Jaybannist(at)cs.com wrote: > I am at the point of sealing the slots in the firewall (gravanized > steel) for the steering rods, against air leakage and fire. I'm sure > someone has solved this. There has been a lot of chatter about Honda > boots, but that doesn't appeal to me. > > I am also concerned about the effect of the threads on any seal. Has > anyone ground down the threads to make the rods smooth in the vicinity > of the slots? > > By the way, the dimensions shown on the drawings for the slots are > wrong. The rods are thicker than the width shown for the slots and > the slots are much taller than required for the travel of the nose > gear strut. > > Jay in Dallas, working on XL fuselage N2620J > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Craig Payne" <craig(at)craigandjean.com>
Subject: Steering rod seal
Date: Sep 09, 2006
Look in the list's photo/file archives for shots of a couple of different solutions using metal shutters or slides. -- Craig _____ From: owner-zenith-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-zenith-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Jaybannist(at)cs.com Sent: Saturday, September 09, 2006 4:22 PM Subject: Zenith-List: Steering rod seal I am at the point of sealing the slots in the firewall (gravanized steel) for the steering rods, against air leakage and fire. I'm sure someone has solved this. There has been a lot of chatter about Honda boots, but that doesn't appeal to me. I am also concerned about the effect of the threads on any seal. Has anyone ground down the threads to make the rods smooth in the vicinity of the slots? By the way, the dimensions shown on the drawings for the slots are wrong. The rods are thicker than the width shown for the slots and the slots are much taller than required for the travel of the nose gear strut. Jay in Dallas, working on XL fuselage N2620J ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Robin Bellach" <601zv(at)ritternet.com>
Subject: Re: Steering rod seal
Date: Sep 09, 2006
I used the Yamaha snowmobile boots with the rods sleeved with aluminum tube riding in a brass bushing in the boot. But if you don't like Honda you probably are anti-Yamaha too. Anyway, seems lile sleeving the rods is an eary way to eliminate the rough threads. Here's where the scratch builders have an advantage, as they can just use smooth solid rod with only the end threaded instead of the all-thread that ZAC uses. ----- Original Message ----- From: Jaybannist(at)cs.com To: zenith-list(at)matronics.com Sent: Saturday, September 09, 2006 5:21 PM Subject: Zenith-List: Steering rod seal I am at the point of sealing the slots in the firewall (gravanized steel) for the steering rods, against air leakage and fire. I'm sure someone has solved this. There has been a lot of chatter about Honda boots, but that doesn't appeal to me. I am also concerned about the effect of the threads on any seal. Has anyone ground down the threads to make the rods smooth in the vicinity of the slots? By the way, the dimensions shown on the drawings for the slots are wrong. The rods are thicker than the width shown for the slots and the slots are much taller than required for the travel of the nose gear strut. Jay in Dallas, working on XL fuselage N2620J ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Lee Thomas" <cltvet(at)mail.ocis.net>
Subject: Steering rod seal
Date: Sep 09, 2006
Shrink wrap on rods and boots made of fireproof cloth same as fireman suits Lee 701 _____ From: owner-zenith-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-zenith-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Jaybannist(at)cs.com Sent: Saturday, September 09, 2006 3:22 PM Subject: Zenith-List: Steering rod seal I am at the point of sealing the slots in the firewall (gravanized steel) for the steering rods, against air leakage and fire. I'm sure someone has solved this. There has been a lot of chatter about Honda boots, but that doesn't appeal to me. I am also concerned about the effect of the threads on any seal. Has anyone ground down the threads to make the rods smooth in the vicinity of the slots? By the way, the dimensions shown on the drawings for the slots are wrong. The rods are thicker than the width shown for the slots and the slots are much taller than required for the travel of the nose gear strut. Jay in Dallas, working on XL fuselage N2620J ________________________________________________________________________________
From: NYTerminat(at)aol.com
Date: Sep 09, 2006
Subject: Re: Stripper
Lighten up!!!!!!!!!!! In a message dated 9/9/2006 8:45:28 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time, naumuk(at)alltel.net writes: --> Zenith-List message posted by: "Bill Naumuk" Paul- Unfortunately, it's getting hard to tell a genuine request from help from worthless BS on the list. I was disgusted enough to quit because of this incident, but on the other hand, the positive aspects of membership outweigh the bad. You hope everyone finishes and flys safe? What's the list for- humor or information? I made so many mistakes on my project in the first 4 months of toughing it out on my own that now I won't drill a hole until I'm good and sure it's in the right place. I've learned that conducting a thorough research before acting is a lot less time consuming than cleaning up after a mistake. As a result, I haven't had to rebuild or replace a part in over a year.. I came close to quitting, but will stick with the list. My fault for phrasing a request for help that some people interpreted as grounds for a joke. I didn't realize you had to signal your intentions. Bill Naumuk HDS Fuselage Townville, Pa ----- Original Message ----- From: "Paul Moore" <pmoore505(at)msn.com> Sent: Saturday, September 09, 2006 7:03 PM Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Re: Stripper > --> Zenith-List message posted by: "Paul Moore" > > You know, it's sad when useless backbiting, flaming, and worthless BS get > defended but a tiny bit of humor that you obviously set yourself up for > gets > slammed as a detraction from the value of the site. I've lost any interest > in being on this list any longer. Hope everyone finishes and flys safe. > > Paul Moore > Silver City, New Mexico, USA > XL-O200 > Later dudes................ > Definitely ARCHIVE > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Bill Naumuk" <naumuk(at)alltel.net> > >> If I'd received a straight answer from the list yesterday, I could > have >> picked up what I needed on my lunch break. Now I have to either drive >> 100+ >> miles or wait until Monday and modify my building schedule. >> I'm as big an offender as anyone else, but remember people, the site > is >> supposed to be used for helping fellow builders. >> Archive ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Sep 09, 2006
From: Steven Janicki <mmesa005(at)yahoo.com>
Subject: Soon to be 601XL Builder - Thanks for advice / responses
Thanks to all who replied to my introduction! Regards, Steven --------------------------------- All-new Yahoo! Mail - Fire up a more powerful email and get things done faster. ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Noel Loveys" <noelloveys(at)yahoo.ca>
Subject: Strobe wires.
Date: Sep 10, 2006
Re weight on wingtips: How about how having weight at the wing tips in relationship to spin characteristics. Also...In the case of wing tip tanks how about if one tank is full and the other is three quarters full??? Re: flasher unit installation Now days the flasher units are getting down to mere ounces and if your wing design will allow you to install and service without the use of a crowbar the outboard weight would be insignificant. Noel > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-zenith-list-server(at)matronics.com > [mailto:owner-zenith-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of > Frank Stutzman > Sent: Saturday, September 09, 2006 9:07 PM > To: zenith-list(at)matronics.com > Subject: RE: Zenith-List: Strobe wires. > > > > > On Sat, 9 Sep 2006, Roger Venables wrote: > > > > The advice that made the most sense to me was to mount the > power supplies in > > the fuselage (behind the seats in the 701) and run shielded > cable from here > > out to the strobes on the wing tips > > > > This has 2 main advantages, 1. it makes it easier to > maintain/replace the > > power supplies, and 2. it takes the weight out of the wing > tips and puts it > > lower down in the fuselage > > Well, I don't think I disagree, but here is an opposing point of view > anyway ;-) > > If you are going to add weight to a plane, the wing tips > arn't such bad > places (within reason). One simple reason is that usually puts that > weight right on the longitudal center of gravity. Another is > that putting > the weight out there reduces the bending moment of the wing. > Notice all > the planes with after market tip tanks? Those STCs also > usually include a > gross weight increase that stipulates that any weight over > the original > gross weight must be carried in fuel in those tip tanks. Yet another > reason is that some strobe power supplies generate rf noise that isn't > always easy to shield and putting those supplies out on the tips can > mitigate this problem to a bit. > > Your point about ease of maintenace is very valid, but I've seen some > clever access panels done on the tips of a 701. > > Frank Stutzman > Bonanza N494B "Hula Girl" > Hood River, OR > > > > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Sep 10, 2006
From: LarryMcFarland <larry(at)macsmachine.com>
Subject: Re: Steering rod seal
Jay, I made a couple of slider assemblies in which the center plate has a grommet that slides on the steering rods. The center plate moves within the two slotted plates and offers sufficient movement and sealing that cold air in winter cannot be felt nor does it impede movement of the rods. Very simple and two bolt assembly. see links, http://www.macsmachine.com/images/controllinkages/full/steer-rod-air-barrier.gif http://www.macsmachine.com/images/controllinkages/full/steer-rod-air-barrier-2.gif A little goop around the periphery of the attachment keeps it sealed at the firewall. Larry McFarland - 601HDS at www.macsmachine.com Jaybannist(at)cs.com wrote: > I am at the point of sealing the slots in the firewall (gravanized > steel) for the steering rods, against air leakage and fire. I'm sure > someone has solved this. There has been a lot of chatter about Honda > boots, but that doesn't appeal to me. > > I am also concerned about the effect of the threads on any seal. Has > anyone ground down the threads to make the rods smooth in the vicinity > of the slots? > > By the way, the dimensions shown on the drawings for the slots are > wrong. The rods are thicker than the width shown for the slots and > the slots are much taller than required for the travel of the nose > gear strut. > > Jay in Dallas, working on XL fuselage N2620J > >* > > >* > ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Steering rod seal
From: "lgingell" <lgingell@matrix-logic.com>
Date: Sep 10, 2006
I filled the threads on the rods with JBWeld and smoothed them out that way. It was quick, and works. ..lance http://lancegingell.com/plane.asp -------- Zodiac XL/Jab 3300 http://lancegingell.com/plane.asp Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=60782#60782 ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Sep 10, 2006
From: Paul Mulwitz <p.mulwitz(at)worldnet.att.net>
Subject: Strobe wiring reality check.
With all the differing opinions on the conductivity of aluminum and copper, I decided to do a little research and calculations to try to come up with a fair analysis of this issue. First, I found a nice web page that tells the actual story about resistivity of aluminum and copper. It is: http://www.schoolscience.co.uk/content/5/physics/copper/copelech2pg1.html It shows copper is a better conductor than aluminum (which we all knew already) but also tells how much better. It turns out the ratio is only 3.2 /1.7 which means the cross section of an aluminum wire needs to be 1.88 times larger in area to have the same resistance as a copper wire. (This didn't surprise me a lot since I already knew aluminum wire is commonly used for house wiring and for long distance high voltage transmission lines.) I went out to my shop and did a few measurements to see how large a copper wire would have to be to have the same resistance as the aluminum in my wing. The short answer is the aluminum wing is roughly equivalent to a wire with a diameter of 59.5 mm. An equivalent copper wire would have to be only 43.4 mm in diameter to have the same resistance. (I will spare the list the math, anyone wanting the details can send me an off-list email and I will send the spreadsheet.) Tying it all together, my calculations show it would take a copper wire 43.4 mm in diameter to have the same electrical property (resistance) as the wing does. This would be a really heavy ground wire to string the length of the wing. Caveats: For this to work, the power supply must be mounted in the wing tip. Also, it assumes good contact between the skin and spar which might not be the case if there is anti-corrosion paint used in the joints. Also, I wouldn't use this method if the power supply for the strobe was mounted in the fuselage since the voltage carried in the wires is much higher than the 12V going to the power supply. Paul XL fuselage -- ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Chuck Deiterich" <cffd(at)pgrb.com>
Subject: CO Monitor
Date: Sep 10, 2006
Some time ago, someone mentioned getting a Kidde Nighthawk carbon monoxide monitor Model number KN-COPP-B. I got one from ebay for $20 + $10 shipping. Works great. I used velcro to mount it on the right fuselage side (CH701) near the shoulder strap anchor, where I can see and reach it in flight. It displays 30 ppm or greater, but stores peak level from 11 ppm up. After landing, I checked the peak and it was 13 ppm. ( This was my first flight with it.) It will be interesting to see the peak after each flight. Chuck D. N701TX ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Throttle Cable for Rotax
From: "Tommy Walker" <twalker(at)cableone.net>
Date: Sep 10, 2006
Johann, I sent email, but I'm not sure you got it, so I will reply here. I would sure like to have the part. I can send you a check, just let me know. My Address: Tommy Walker 28 Old Coach Road Anniston, AL 36207 Ph. 256-835-6610 email: twalker(at) cableone.net Johann G. Johannsson wrote: > Hello Tommy. > > I used the Vernier throttle from ACS wit the solid wire end, A820 on both sides. I started with the throttle on the left side, and then decided to install it on both sides, because it was the perfect setup. > The old T from Zenith is still on the right side in the picture on my home page. > Did not like that long stick because it was hard to control. > If you need the part to attatch the cable to the steel rod, I could send it to you. Just contact me off list with your address, and I will ship it to you. > > Best regards, > Johann G. > Iceland. -------- Tommy Walker Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=60795#60795 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: JAPhillipsGA(at)aol.com
Date: Sep 10, 2006
Subject: Jab 3300 CHT Update
Dear Thread Friends, After so many fellows have helped my battle with the CHT monster and having been so disappointed in progress so many times I felt I needed to report that the dragon is dead and the CHTs have gone down and are stable. I flew her very hard today in 90 + heat and No. 4 stabilized at about 270 degrees. That is down from 340 degrees only a couple weeks ago. I owe a bunch to Ron, Fred, Jim, Harold, Derrick, Gene, Neil and a couple other guys that came by, drank my beer and offered opinions, and anybody else that ever told them anything about air ducting and cooling airplane engines. You guys will never have to buy a beer if I'm anywhere around ! Best regards, Bill of Georgia N505WP 601XL-3300 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Noel Loveys" <noelloveys(at)yahoo.ca>
Subject: Strobe wiring reality check.
Date: Sep 10, 2006
Aluminium cable is used on larger commercial liners for longer high voltage runs something in the order of 400V@ 100Hz. I don't think there is any Al used for smaller apps. As for the wing tip strobes they are getting light enough to be installed in the wingtips with no appreciable degradation of the aircraft handling characteristics. Grounding of the lights themselves is a non issue as they are regularly being installed in composite wings and composite fairings on fling wings. Older heavier units can be safely installed closer to the wing roots and wired with the appropriate wire. As with all things RTFM ( Read the Funny Manual) BTW the working voltage is close to 13.8V, rounded up that's 14V. The battery will actually provide less than 12V Noel > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-zenith-list-server(at)matronics.com > [mailto:owner-zenith-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of > Paul Mulwitz > Sent: Sunday, September 10, 2006 1:53 PM > To: zenith-list(at)matronics.com > Subject: Zenith-List: Strobe wiring reality check. > > > > > With all the differing opinions on the conductivity of aluminum and > copper, I decided to do a little research and calculations to try to > come up with a fair analysis of this issue. > > First, I found a nice web page that tells the actual story about > resistivity of aluminum and copper. It is: > http://www.schoolscience.co.uk/content/5/physics/copper/copele > ch2pg1.html > > It shows copper is a better conductor than aluminum (which we all > knew already) but also tells how much better. It turns out the ratio > is only 3.2 /1.7 which means the cross section of an aluminum wire > needs to be 1.88 times larger in area to have the same resistance as > a copper wire. (This didn't surprise me a lot since I already knew > aluminum wire is commonly used for house wiring and for long distance > high voltage transmission lines.) > > I went out to my shop and did a few measurements to see how large a > copper wire would have to be to have the same resistance as the > aluminum in my wing. The short answer is the aluminum wing is > roughly equivalent to a wire with a diameter of 59.5 mm. An > equivalent copper wire would have to be only 43.4 mm in diameter to > have the same resistance. (I will spare the list the math, anyone > wanting the details can send me an off-list email and I will send the > spreadsheet.) > > Tying it all together, my calculations show it would take a copper > wire 43.4 mm in diameter to have the same electrical property > (resistance) as the wing does. This would be a really heavy ground > wire to string the length of the wing. > > Caveats: For this to work, the power supply must be mounted in the > wing tip. Also, it assumes good contact between the skin and spar > which might not be the case if there is anti-corrosion paint used in > the joints. Also, I wouldn't use this method if the power supply for > the strobe was mounted in the fuselage since the voltage carried in > the wires is much higher than the 12V going to the power supply. > > Paul > XL fuselage > > > -- > > > > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Sep 10, 2006
From: ron dewees <rdewees(at)mindspring.com>
Subject: Re: Jab 3300 CHT Update
I need directions to your hangar and a taxi to the bar!!! Congratulations again! Ron JAPhillipsGA(at)aol.com wrote: > Dear Thread Friends, After so many fellows have helped my battle with > the CHT monster and having been so disappointed in progress so many > times I felt I needed to report that the dragon is dead and the CHTs > have gone down and are stable. I flew her very hard today in 90 + heat > and No. 4 stabilized at about 270 degrees. That is down from 340 > degrees only a couple weeks ago. I owe a bunch to Ron, Fred, Jim, > Harold, Derrick, Gene, Neil and a couple other guys that came by, > drank my beer and offered opinions, and anybody else that ever told > them anything about air ducting and cooling airplane engines. You guys > will never have to buy a beer if I'm anywhere around ! > Best regards, Bill of Georgia > N505WP > 601XL-3300 > >* >* > ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Sep 10, 2006
From: Gary Gower <ggower_99(at)yahoo.com>
Subject: Craftsman Drill Press sale
Lets ALL take it with humor Is a fact.... Scotch Brite and Strippers will be part of this great list for ever. Here we say (hope I can translate to english): If your AKA name makes you angy... is a good one and will be with you for life. Please put a little humor on top of any building frustration... Will make building and flying our airplanes a joy. Saludos Gary Gower. Flying from Chapala, Mexico. Does Sears have strippers? Gary Boothe Cool, CA 601 HDSTD, WW Conversion Tail done, wings done, working on c-section --------------------------------- ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Sep 10, 2006
From: rwhall(at)telusplanet.net
Subject: Re: Zenair for sale
Bob Thank you for your tip. I have listed my Zenair on the Barnstomers site and already had some interest. Best regards, Robert Quoting "Robert L. Stone" : > > > > Robert, > Barnstormers is the best aviation web site and adds are free unless you > want to make a donation. I have used them and always make a donation after > the sale. It's also a good idea to tell people where you are because there > might be someone close who is looking for a Zenith/Zodiac aircraft to buy. > http://www.barnstormers.com/cat.php? PHPSESSID=2ef94a86daa861b6da018683153522ef > > Bob Stone, Harker Heights > ZodiacXL > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: <rwhall(at)telusplanet.net> > To: > Sent: Friday, September 08, 2006 12:12 PM > Subject: Zenith-List: Zenair for sale > > > > > > > > I have an airworthy CH601 which regrettably I must sell. I would appreciate > any > > suggestions as to the best way or place to sell. Regards, Robert Hall > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: CH 640 Controls
From: "steveadams" <dr_steve_adams(at)yahoo.com>
Date: Sep 11, 2006
Hello, I built and fly a CH640. I will try and post a picture later, but will try to explain if I can. Starting from the ailerons. Cables from the aileron bell cranks attach to a torque tube which runs forward through the spar. Attached to the forward portion of the torque tube is a vertical tube. Think of it as a single control stick that runs up behind the panel. The photo is looking down on the controls behind the panel and forward is the top of the picture. It is really simple and works well. There is probably a bit more resistance than a system using a chain mechanism. Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=60925#60925 Attachments: http://forums.matronics.com//files/controls_152.jpg ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Robert L. Stone" <rstone4(at)hot.rr.com>
Subject: Re: Zenair for sale
Date: Sep 11, 2006
Robert, You still have not told anyone where you are. There may be someone a block away who is looking for what you are selling and you will miss out on a sale just because no one knows were you are. If you are a criminal hiding from the law forget all I have said. LOL Bob Stone, Harker Heights, Tx ZodiacXL ----- Original Message ----- From: <rwhall(at)telusplanet.net> Sent: Sunday, September 10, 2006 11:39 PM Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Zenair for sale > > Bob Thank you for your tip. I have listed my Zenair on the Barnstomers > site > and already had some interest. Best regards, Robert > > > Quoting "Robert L. Stone" : > >> >> >> >> Robert, >> Barnstormers is the best aviation web site and adds are free unless >> you >> want to make a donation. I have used them and always make a donation >> after >> the sale. It's also a good idea to tell people where you are because >> there >> might be someone close who is looking for a Zenith/Zodiac aircraft to >> buy. >> http://www.barnstormers.com/cat.php? > PHPSESSID=2ef94a86daa861b6da018683153522ef >> >> Bob Stone, Harker Heights >> ZodiacXL >> >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: <rwhall(at)telusplanet.net> >> To: >> Sent: Friday, September 08, 2006 12:12 PM >> Subject: Zenith-List: Zenair for sale >> >> >> > >> > >> > I have an airworthy CH601 which regrettably I must sell. I would >> > appreciate >> any >> > suggestions as to the best way or place to sell. Regards, Robert Hall >> > >> > >> > >> > > > > > > >> > >> > > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Zenair for sale
Date: Sep 11, 2006
From: "Garrou, Douglas" <dgarrou(at)hunton.com>
A few followups on the ever-popular liability issue. I'll cut and paste from various responses: "Has anyone ever actually been successfully sued as the manufacturer of a homebuilt aircraft?" "Unless you are rolling in dough, you are not at a great risk of being sued in one of these cases. The lawyers generally go after the "deep pockets". This is why very few, if any homebuilders have ever been sued as a result of aircraft accidents. There is simply no money to be made. In my opinion, a generous insurance policy just makes you a bigger target for a lawsuit. I would just sell the plane and walk away and not worry too much about liability risks." I agree on all fronts, as a practical matter (hence my "write your name all over the inside and go drink a beer" comment). And I am not aware of anyone being sued for building a bad homebuilt. My point was more to the fact that people often claim you can protect yourself completely, and those people are, to use a very technical legal word, "wrong." Two additional caveats: we wouldn't necessarily know if claims against homebuilt "manufacturers" have been made, since the case might not be reported or might have been settled without litigation. Also, some very well-heeled people fly homebuilts -- maybe not Zeniths.... :) -- and the number of high-end homebuilts seems to be growing substantially. I think it is only a matter of time before we see a lawsuit going after the well-heeled "manufacturer" (builder/first owner) of a high-performance homebuilt, if it hasn't happened already. When that happens, watch the sparks fly as the plaintiff ALSO sues one of those ridiculous "builder assist" (also known as "we build it for the rich guy while he watches") operations as well! "I was told once that you should always sell an experimental as a unsafe non flyable aircraft. It would be up to the buyer to certify it as safe and flyable again." This approach is no different, really, than getting an indemnification from the buyer. In fact, this approach is probably far less effective. In any event, this will not be a viable defense in a claim brought by an injured third party. Here's another interesting issue along the same lines -- AOPA, etc., all push renter's insurance very hard. And it isn't cheap. Certainly aircraft renters are theoretically exposed when they fly rented airplanes (the FBO's insurance rarely, if ever, covers them). But I don't actually see those cases happening either. They almost certainly have happened, but before buying renter's insurance, I would want the person selling the insurance to tell me on how many occasions, exactly, in the past 10 years, a renter has actually had a judgment entered against him or her after wrecking the FBO's plane. I strongly suspect the insurers know the answer to this question, and that the number isn't large. But I could be wrong, it's just a hunch. All disclaimers from previous posts apply..... Doug Garrou Project 801 www.garrou.com ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Sep 11, 2006
From: Steve <steve(at)cccparis.com>
Subject: Re: Porsche Engine in a 701
I have a Porsche Type IV that has been converted for aircraft use ( it was in a KR1) I'd take $800.00 for it (that's what I paid). Contact me off list if you are interested steve(at)cccparis.com Steve Russell 701 scratch -----Original message----- From: "R.D.(Ron) Leclerc" infow(at)mts.net Date: Tue, 5 Sep 2006 15:51:54 -0500 Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Porsche Engine in a 701 > > Thanks Monty > > Yes it is a Porsche 914 2.0L engine that I'm building into a 2.6L engine,> with fuel injection. I'm also going to add a 2.2 reduction drive so that I> can develop the true power(72" 3B prop) of the engine around 5200 rpm(take> off). This should give me about 115hp. > > So far I have not been able to find anyone who has used the type 4 engine> only the type 1. I did contact the folks in Australia, but they are very> difficult to deal with - not very nice. On there web site they advertise> there redrive for sale for type 4 engines - but when you ask for pricing> they won't sell it to you, has to be sold with there engine - they get very> nasty when questioned about their faulty advertising. > > There are quite a few web sites offering type 1 conversions along with> redrives - but only for the type 1. Mind you about 90% of the parts could> be used for the type 4. > Some of them are: > http://www.airdromeaeroplanes.com/ > http://members.socket.net/~ranchair/ > http://www.greatplainsas.com/welcome.html > http://www.vw-engines.com/ > http://www.revmasteraviation.com/ > > I did find one redrive supplier that can supply all the individual parts> needed along with construction drawing to build one. The only problem is> its designed for a Subaru but thats no big deal. Basically all that I> would have to have made is a crank hub and mount, which I have done> already.. and you can buy it i piece at a time. The company is very easy> to deal with, the web site is: > http://www.geocities.com/rfisubaru/rfi.html > Don Parham > RFI Power systems > P.O. Box 263 > Indianola, Ok 74442 > > Phone: 918-823-4610 > Fax: 918-823-4690 > > e-mail rfi(at)oklatel.net > > PS: I have been in touch with the Smith's. They have a vice setup but it is> for the type 1 case. It's nice to hear that the type 1 will work in a 701.> I will be building on floats so I need all the grunt at the low end that I> can get... and that means installing a redrive. It also helps to dampen> any stresses on the crank, which can be a problem with the type 1. > > Thanks again for your help > Ron Leclerc > > > >-->Zenith-List message posted by: Monty Graves > > > > > >Ron, > > > >I don't know of anyone that has put a type IV engine in the CH701. > > There are a few Type I-III VW engines with Valley Eng redrives, > >made by the Smiths at Culver Props. > > > >One is my friend B.J. Schwaller, he has a 1915cc VW and redrive on > >his 701. The plane flys weekly now out of Eldon MO. Pictures of > >his plane are in Zenith's Builders secton site...... > > > >www.culverprops.com > > > >The Smiths build and sell VW engines, redrives for the VW, and > >engine mounts for the 701, and of course really nice wood props. > > > >I was just over to their shop on Wednesday of this week. They had > >just finished another engine mount for the VW engine and Diel Case > >for a 701 in New Zealand and it was being shipped that day. Also > >word on an IDAHO 701 builder that was just starting to test fly his > >701 with the Smiths, engine mount and their 2275cc VW engine and > >redrive Culver Prop package...........So far he is very happy. > > > >In the next few weeks, hopefully still in Sept. another > >K.C.Missouri 701 builder is also going to install their complete, > >mount, engine, redrive, Culver Prop combo in hsi airplane...... > > > >Monty Graves > > > > > >>-->Zenith-List message posted by: Ron D Leclerc > >> > >> > >>Has anyone out there had the opportunity to install a Porsche > >>Type 4 2.6L engine in a 701? I need some info on an engine mount > >>and building a redrive... perhaps someone has built one. > >> > >>Ron Leclerc > >>Winnipeg MB Canada > > > > > >Features Navigator to browse > >and much much more: > > - NEW MATRONICS WEB FORUMS - > >-->http://forums.matronics.com > >generous support! > >>http://www.matronics.com/contribution > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Jab 3300 CHT Update
From: "lgingell" <lgingell@matrix-logic.com>
Date: Sep 11, 2006
So....what changes/baffels etc. did you end up with? How was your oil temp doing? ..lance -------- Zodiac XL/Jab 3300 http://lancegingell.com/plane.asp Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=60971#60971 ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Sep 11, 2006
From: rwhall(at)telusplanet.net
Subject: Re: Zenair for sale
Bob I am in Edmonton, Alberta. Thanks again. Robert Quoting "Robert L. Stone" : > > Robert, > You still have not told anyone where you are. There may be someone a > block away who is looking for what you are selling and you will miss out on > a sale just because no one knows were you are. If you are a criminal hiding > > from the law forget all I have said. LOL > > Bob Stone, Harker Heights, Tx > ZodiacXL > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: <rwhall(at)telusplanet.net> > To: > Sent: Sunday, September 10, 2006 11:39 PM > Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Zenair for sale > > > > > > Bob Thank you for your tip. I have listed my Zenair on the Barnstomers > > site > > and already had some interest. Best regards, Robert > > > > > > > > Quoting "Robert L. Stone" : > > > >> > >> > >> > >> Robert, > >> Barnstormers is the best aviation web site and adds are free unless > >> you > >> want to make a donation. I have used them and always make a donation > >> after > >> the sale. It's also a good idea to tell people where you are because > >> there > >> might be someone close who is looking for a Zenith/Zodiac aircraft to > >> buy. > >> http://www.barnstormers.com/cat.php? > > PHPSESSID=2ef94a86daa861b6da018683153522ef > >> > >> Bob Stone, Harker Heights > >> ZodiacXL > >> > >> ----- Original Message ----- > >> From: <rwhall(at)telusplanet.net> > >> To: > >> Sent: Friday, September 08, 2006 12:12 PM > >> Subject: Zenith-List: Zenair for sale > >> > >> > >> > > >> > > >> > I have an airworthy CH601 which regrettably I must sell. I would > >> > appreciate > >> any > >> > suggestions as to the best way or place to sell. Regards, Robert Hall > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > > > > > > >> > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Sep 11, 2006
From: Klaus Truemper <klaus(at)utdallas.edu>
Subject: Re: Steering rod seal
Hi, I used delrin slides. To prevent wear by the the threads, I covered them with nylong tubing. It has worked well for 1000 hrs of flying. The following page has details: http://www.utdallas.edu/~klaus/Airplane/nose_gear_delrin_slide.html Best wishes, Klaus -- Klaus Truemper Professor Emeritus of Computer Science University of Texas at Dallas Erik Jonsson School of Engineering and Computer Science EC31 P.O. Box 830688 Richardson, TX 75083-0688 (972) 883-2712 klaus(at)utdallas.edu www.utdallas.edu/~klaus ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Sep 11, 2006
From: Klaus Truemper <klaus(at)utdallas.edu>
Subject: Warning Sign of Bungee Cord Failure in 601
Hi, One sign of a failing nose gear bungee is reduced tension of the rudder cables when the plane is empty. The reduction is due to the angle of the nose gear tube relative to the surface defined by the rudder cables. In the 601, that angle is less than 90 degrees when the nose gear is as far extended as possible, which is the case when the plane is empty, assuming a Rotax engine is installed. As a result, the cable tension is maximum at that point. When the bungee begins to fail, the nose gear moves up a bit from the stop when the plane is empty, and the tension of the rudder cables is reduced. An easy way to test whether reduced cable tension is due to failing of the bungee, is as follows. A friend steps onto the wing aft of the spar, as if climbing into the plane. This unloads the nose gear and causes it to move down toward the stop if it was not at the stop originally. Any such nose gear movement increases the rudder cable tension, which can be easily checked near the bellcrank of the rudder. If a change is detected, then this is a warning sign of bungee failure. These facts motivate the following recommendation. 1. During the preflight check, one should always test the tension of the rudder cables at the rudder bellcrank. 2. If the cable tension has dropped, one should NOT retension the cables, but should investigate the cause. Most likely, the nose gear bungee is beginning to fail. In my plane the bungee has been failing every 500 hrs, most recently when I reached 1000 hrs TTAE. In each case, the bungee began to fail on the hook behind the nose gear tube, a hard-to-inspect location. On the other hand, the rudder cable test was a reliable indicator. Best wishes, Klaus -- Klaus Truemper Professor Emeritus of Computer Science University of Texas at Dallas Erik Jonsson School of Engineering and Computer Science EC31 P.O. Box 830688 Richardson, TX 75083-0688 (972) 883-2712 klaus(at)utdallas.edu www.utdallas.edu/~klaus ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Trevor Page <webmaster(at)upac.ca>
Subject: 601 Rotax install question
Date: Sep 11, 2006
Does anyone have dimensions of these 2 radiator brackets used on a 601XL Rotax 912 install? I'm changing my stock cowl and moving the rads on my 601HD and I need to make these but I don't have the measurements. Thanks in advance! =EF=BC=EF=BC Trev Page C-IDUS 601HD R912 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: JAPhillipsGA(at)aol.com
Date: Sep 11, 2006
Subject: Re: Jab 3300 CHT Update
Lance, I used some of Jeff Small's fins and Ron DeWeess' fins and well as Fred H's fins, plus, enclosing the area beside the duct and diverting that air around No. 6. Adding between barrel diverters, at the bottom, closed up the front of the duct bottom, added metal air ducts between valve covers with internal V type diverters, plus attaching a metal plate below the spark plugs that is bolted down with valve cover bolts. Really Lance there is so many things I can't really write and describe them. You are welcome to come by my hanger and I'll show them to you and you can measure, photo, etc.. A problem is that one or more of these mods may actually have nil effect or may even work against some other mod. So perhaps some combination? would have the same effect without some of the mods. I just don't know. Best regards, Bill ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Sep 11, 2006
From: Klaus Truemper <klaus(at)utdallas.edu>
Subject: gust lock for 601 HD/HDS
Hi, There are various ways to lock aileron and elevator in place. For us, a small gust block attached to the center stick has worked well. Details are given on http://www.utdallas.edu/~klaus/Airplane/gustlock.html Elsewhere it has been proposed that a bungee cord be used as gust lock. That approach pulls the control stick forward and pushes the elevator down against the stop. As a result, the bungee imposes a force on the elevator bellcrank that, due to the leverage of the control stick, can be much higher than any force ever encountered in flight. Philip Welsh has a fix for this, in the form of a small high-density styrofoam block that acts as forward stop of the control stick when the bungee cord is used. That way, no load is imposed on the aileron bellcrank. Best wishes, Klaus -- Klaus Truemper Professor Emeritus of Computer Science University of Texas at Dallas Erik Jonsson School of Engineering and Computer Science EC31 P.O. Box 830688 Richardson, TX 75083-0688 (972) 883-2712 klaus(at)utdallas.edu www.utdallas.edu/~klaus ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Sep 11, 2006
From: "Kenny Aron" <kenny.aron(at)gmail.com>
Subject: Pitot system parts
All, I'm wrapping my 801's leading edges, and need to run the tubing for the pitot probe. (sorry, no strippers or scotch-brite in this post!) I intend to use Dynon's AOA probe (already have the mast) which has aluminum 3/16ths OD connectors. I mistakenly ordered "3/16ths" tubing from Aircraft spruce which has a 3/16's OD (not ID). Looking around, I only see OD's specified for tubing. So, what's the correct size tubing to use with the dynon probe? Also, I was watching the "installing a glass panel" dvd this weekend (raining outside...), where they demonstrated a "quick-lock" connector for the static/pitot lines. They didn't state the manufacturer, or even exactly what they're called. (there's no nut to thread over the tube, you thread the connector into the instrument, push a lock back, insert the tube end, then pull the ring-lock back forward- done) Anyone know what these are called? And what size to order to use with the above-mentioned unknown-size tubing? Thanks! -- \|/-\|/-\|/-\|/-\|/-\|/-\|/-\|/-\|/-\|/-\|/-\|/-\|/-\|/-\|/ --Kenny A. http://websites.expercraft.com/kennya/ http://users3.ev1.net/%7Ekennyarn/ ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Sep 11, 2006
From: Paul Mulwitz <p.mulwitz(at)worldnet.att.net>
Subject: Re: Pitot system parts
Hi Kenny, The system used for the ZAC pitot/static probe uses 3/16 barb connectors and tubing along with some 3/16 O.D. rubber tubing to make the joints. You just put a little rubber tubing over the barb connector and stick the other end over the main tubing line to go into the instrument panel. You can use some sort of hose clamps to hold them in place, but I just used a couple of turns of safety wire on mine. ZAC supplies some fancy polyurethane tubing with the kit, but you should do just fine with fuel line rubber tubing available at any auto parts store. Paul XL fuselage At 01:23 PM 9/11/2006, you wrote: >All, > >I'm wrapping my 801's leading edges, and need to run the tubing for >the pitot probe. (sorry, no strippers or scotch-brite in this post!) >I intend to use Dynon's AOA probe (already have the mast) which has >aluminum 3/16ths OD connectors. I mistakenly ordered "3/16ths" >tubing from Aircraft spruce which has a 3/16's OD (not ID). Looking >around, I only see OD's specified for tubing. So, what's the correct >size tubing to use with the dynon probe? > >Also, I was watching the "installing a glass panel" dvd this weekend >(raining outside...), where they demonstrated a "quick-lock" >connector for the static/pitot lines. They didn't state the >manufacturer, or even exactly what they're called. (there's no nut >to thread over the tube, you thread the connector into the >instrument, push a lock back, insert the tube end, then pull the >ring-lock back forward- done) Anyone know what these are called? And >what size to order to use with the above-mentioned unknown-size tubing? > >Thanks! > >-- >\|/-\|/-\|/-\|/-\|/-\|/-\|/-\|/-\|/-\|/-\|/-\|/-\|/-\|/-\|/ >--Kenny A. ><http://websites.expercraft.com/kennya/>http://websites.expercraft.com/kennya/ >http://users3.ev1.net/%7Ekennyarn/ > - ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Sep 11, 2006
From: ernie <ernieth(at)gmail.com>
Subject: New Englanders interested in workshop
Hi, I am interested in attending the rudder workshop for the 601xl either Oct or November. I am in New Hampshire and am wondering in if anyone else is thinking of attending and interested in sharing the ride? Ernie ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Sep 11, 2006
From: Carlos Sa <carlosfsa(at)yahoo.com>
Subject: HD wing nose skin
Hello, all Has anybody tried the David Barth method (http://ch601.org/tools/nose%20skin.htm)for bending a nose skin for a CH601-HD? (The radius is much larger on the -HD than on the -XL, thence the question). Carlos CH601-HD, plans Montreal, Canada __________________________________________________________ ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Sep 11, 2006
From: ron dewees <rdewees(at)mindspring.com>
Subject: Re: [601_HD-HDS] Test flight N201MS 601HDS
________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Sep 11, 2006
From: ron dewees <rdewees(at)mindspring.com>
Subject: Tri gear vs tailwheel test flight
> > >>> >>> >> >>>> Listers-- I hope this won't be too boring to you veteran Zenith >>>> pilots out there but I got a chance to fly a friend's brand new >>>> 601HDS registered as N201MS. It's powered by a Continental A 75-8 >>>> (75 hp) motor and is a tri gear model. I thought it might be >>>> interesting to those who have flown one, but not both wheel >>>> configurations of Zenith 601s if I shared my reactions. I wrote >>>> this review after flying N201MS for two hours. I think my hours >>>> were number 10 and 11, so it's a brand new bird! Mike Stewart was >>>> kind enough to ask me to help fly off the Phase One hours since he >>>> has watched me tweak my HDS/Jab 3300 taildragger for over 150 >>>> hours. He has also owned or built over 60 airplanes and did the >>>> first flight on my 601HDS so he knows his stuff! The original >>>> post was to our Yahoo group called: 601_HD-HDS. There are more >>>> pictures and information posted there. The group was set up for >>>> Georgia area Zenith drivers to communicate but it is open to >>>> everyone. I am sure my experience will not be the same as everybody >>>> else's but I just call them the way I see them-- One additional >>>> note-- the aileron stiffness I noticed is now completely gone. >>>> Mike found a binding bearing and fixed it so it's effortless to use >>>> ailerons now. He says that when I get out of his plane next time I >>>> will head for mine and pick up the shears to put hinges on my >>>> ailerons. We will see- >>>> ----------- >>>> Zenair N601TD wrote: >>>> >>>>> Hi fellow Zenith drivers and builders-- I did take Mike Stewart up on >>>>> his offer to help fly off phase I hours on N201MS and yesterday I put >>>>> almost 2 hours flight in the perky red bird. Mike missed his career >>>>> as a test pilot as he had nailed all the critical flight numbers >>>>> right >>>>> on the button, which made the flight a lot less "experimental" for me >>>>> than it could have been. >>>>> First of all it's tempting to think that a Zenith 601 HDS is a >>>>> 601HDS, etc. NOT SO! I'm sure there is a lot of variation within >>>>> identically configured planes of any model but there was a lot more >>>>> difference than I expected between Mike's HDS tri gear and my HDS >>>>> taildragger. I was to see for myself as the flight progressed. >>>>> To recap Mike's configuration it's a VERY light 601HDS (speed wing) >>>>> that actually came out lighter than Chris Heintz' prototype at 569 >>>>> pounds. It's powered by a Continental A 75-8 non- electric motor >>>>> swinging a 60X58 pitch Tennessee prop. That's 8 inches more pitch >>>>> than my Jabiru 3300 120 hp motor is pulling! Mike and Tennessee >>>>> Propellers came up with that configuration after looking at >>>>> performance charts and projected cruse speeds for the A 65@2300 rpm. >>>>> Tennessee actually sent a 58 inch pitch rather than the 57 that was >>>>> agreed upon. In spite of this optomistic task for the little A75, A >>>>> digital tachometer confirmed 2260 static rpm with the prop. It easily >>>>> cruses at 2300 at altitude and gives a bit more, but not much at full >>>>> throttle. >>>>> Back to the flight-- Mike told me that the right brake was very easy >>>>> to depress when using right rudder because of the toe brake setup of >>>>> the Heintz's flyers and he was right. The A75 is a torquey little >>>>> engine that requires noticable right rudder to offset the "P" factor >>>>> on taxiing for takeoff. The mechanical brakes are similar to mine but >>>>> seem more effective. Mike told me to accelerate to 65/70 mph, apply a >>>>> little back pressure and let it rotate. Best climb speed seems to be >>>>> between 85 and 90. This gives about 650 to 800 fpm climb rate out of >>>>> our turf strip. This is certainly adequate but not terribly >>>>> thrilling, altho it sure got up to altitude in a dependable and >>>>> reassuring manner. The A75 sounds throaty and powerful both on the >>>>> ground and in the plane. Mike used larger exhaust pipes on the >>>>> manifolds and we think it may be the reason for the nice exhaust >>>>> note. Several on the ground thought it was an 0320 rather than a >>>>> "cub" motor. Mike liked that! >>>>> Flying is rather different from my taildragger. The first thing I >>>>> noticed was ground handling. It drives like a go-cart because of the >>>>> direct and positive linkage to the nosewheel. There isn't any need to >>>>> goose the throttle to throw the tail around like the taildragger >>>>> requires for tight turns. OTOH, the nice ground handling gives way to >>>>> sort of clunky rudder corrections in the air since the nosewheel is >>>>> resting on a rather stiff bearing on the firewall. There has been a >>>>> lot of discussion from Zenith drivers about changing this setup, but >>>>> it's simple, and seems to live on from model to model. >>>>> The ailerons were the next thing I wanted to compare, since Mike >>>>> installed hinges on his ailerons, rather than the "skin flex" >>>>> ailerons >>>>> on my HDS. Well, there is good news and bad news-- The ailerons are, >>>>> indeed easier to deflect on the ground and there is no self-centering >>>>> tendency as in the skin flex aileron. Since the plane is so new >>>>> (about 11 hours now) there is some friction in the linkage and minor >>>>> aileron corrections sometimes just remain deflected until the pilot >>>>> centers the stick again. I think this will improve with usage and >>>>> probably not be noticed as quickly by pilots who have not flown with >>>>> skin flexed ailerons. >>>>> The flight characteristics are very nice and reminiscent of my >>>>> taildragger. It's solid and feels like a heavier plane than it is. >>>>> OTOH when you lean it over for a mild turn it seems more in its >>>>> element. It cheerfully banks over and stays there unless you correct >>>>> the angle. The A75 is a little strained to maintain lift at steep >>>>> bank angles so the rpm drops a little bit but it returns immediately >>>>> when the wing starts suppling full lift again. You feel like Walter >>>>> Mitty chasing the Red Barron as you yank and bank it a bit. It's a >>>>> really nice combination of a trainer with great manners and an entry >>>>> level fighter plane. You never see it's fun personality till you feel >>>>> comfortable with the snappy handling. Wingovers and steep turns are >>>>> great, but we all agreed it's a bit lacking in power for a roll or >>>>> loop. >>>>> Mike was right on with his cruse and landing numbers, too. He got >>>>> 110 to 115 mph at 2300 rpm cruse and that's about what I saw. It >>>>> feels faster than that and the plane just seems to like those speeds >>>>> cause full throttle or 2250 rpm don't change it much up or down. Mike >>>>> weighs about 40 pounds more than I do so I was curious to sii if >>>>> the stall >>>>> speed would be different. He gets 51 mph power off and 47 ish power >>>>> on. I seemed to get similar numbers so it is Light Sport Aircraft >>>>> qualified. As expected, the big fat wing gives a lot of warning of >>>>> impending stalls. It gripes a bit, shakes a little, shakes more, >>>>> and finally breaks mildly into an increased rate of descent. No >>>>> tendancy to drop a wing at all. You would have to be >>>>> distracted by Angelina Jolie in the right seat to ignore the warnings >>>>> of a stall. >>>>> I was mildly anxious about the first landing at our 2500 foot turf >>>>> strip with a 8 knot tailwind so I went to Covington and Monroe >>>>> airports to get some landing experience. Mike suggested 100 on >>>>> downwind, 90 on base, and 80 on final, with a mild flare with power >>>>> and 60/65 at touchdown. These numbers sounded hot to me since I use >>>>> about 10 mph less in landing configuration on my taildragger. >>>>> As usual Mike's numbers were very close and the first landing I set >>>>> up at Covington would have been impossibly high in my plane. The >>>>> nosegear configuration seems to settle into a solid descent angle >>>>> without picking up speed and high approaches are almost always >>>>> recoverable. I noticed up to 1500 fpm descent at 1800 rpm and the >>>>> airspeed seemed nailed to the gauge. As you would expect, the speed >>>>> will bleed off pretty fast as you rotate to a flare with these >>>>> approach angles and you would be right. I added power and it rounded >>>> >>>>> nicely and made an acceptable aquaintance with runway 10 at Covington >>>>> at about 60 indicated airspeed. I opened the throttle and watched out >>>>> for the right brake interaction with the rudder pedal and rotated >>>>> in a >>>>> few hundred feet. The torque factor wasn't as bad as from dead start >>>>> but it still needed right rudder. It climbed better than out of >>>>> Lenora and I saw up to 1000 feet at times. After a few more landings >>>>> at Covington and Monroe I felt better about landing at Lenora and had >>>>> no problem at all getting back into Lenora. >>>>> All in all it's a great plane! It's different from mine, but 45 >>>>> less horsepower is bound to make any plane feel different. The >>>>> biggest >>>>> change I noticed was the descent angle with power off. It has a very >>>>> solid and predictable glide angle for landings that Mike says is >>>>> almost identical to the Piper Pacer. I haven't flown a Pacer but >>>>> bet I >>>>> would like it. The rudder pedals will remain stiff due to the >>>>> nosewheel linkage and the ailerons will certainly loosten up. BTW >>>>> Mike >>>>> installed a mechanical trim tab on the elevator and it's awesome! >>>>> Half >>>>> inch movement on the tab sets it up for climb or cruse and takes off >>>>> almost all stick pressure. >>>>> Mike and I discussed the dramatic landing differences between our >>>>> planes and decided that maybe the nosewheel disturbs the airflow >>>>> under the flat belly of the plane. It does make for a better trainer >>>>> or transition plane than the taildragger because speed management >>>>> isn't much of an issue. Just to prove this I made a flight in my >>>>> taildragger later in the afternoon and came in hot and high because I >>>>> didn't bleed off speed on the downwind as I should have. Slipping the >>>>> tailwheel HDS just lets it gain speed even as it increases it's >>>>> descent rate, and you get the momentum right back as soon as you take >>>>> the crab angle out. Not so in Mike's plane. >>>>> Mike is getting a little bored with flying off the rest of his 40 >>>>> hours of Phase I because he us used to high performance planes that >>>>> cruse about 80 miles an hour faster than his little HDS but for the >>>>> rest of us it's a refreshing little plane with nice manners and >>>>> surprising performance for it's power. >>>>> What will Mike's Aircraft Factory come up with next? >>>>> Ron DeWees >>>>> N601TD >>>>> >> ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Sep 12, 2006
Subject: Re: Window tinting
From: Larry Landucci <lllanducci(at)tds.net>
When I purchased my 801 kit in August, 2003 from Zenith, it came with a tinted Lexan top window. Larry Landucci -- N801LL ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Window tinting
From: "Chris In Madison" <cowens(at)cnw.com>
Date: Sep 12, 2006
Hi Larry, I didn't notice that your top glass was tinted. Reckon I should be more observant :-) Best regards, Chris -------- Chris Owens Waunakee, WI Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=61239#61239 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Phil Maxson" <pmaxpmax(at)HOTMAIL.COM>
Subject: gust lock for 601 HD/HDS
Date: Sep 12, 2006
I just wrap the passenger seat-belt around the stick. It pulls it back and to the right. No problems so far.Phil Maxson601XL/CorvairNorthwest New Je rsey _________________________________________________________________ Express yourself with gadgets on Windows Live Spaces http://discoverspaces.live.com?source=hmtag1&loc=us ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Bill Naumuk" <naumuk(at)alltel.net>
Subject: Re: HD wing nose skin
Date: Sep 12, 2006
Carlos- Couldn't open your attachment. Did my HDS skins using Larry Mac's set-up. Being lazy, I made a few mods to make it easier to build. I had a hard drive crash but later estimated the build time at 25 hours. Cost- about $25 with scrounging, $75 if you used new steel. I'll let you borrow my rig (Less the wood for weight reasons), but it will cost you more in shipping than building your own. Let me know if you want pictures. Bill Naumuk HDS Fuselage Townville, Pa ----- Original Message ----- From: "Carlos Sa" <carlosfsa(at)yahoo.com> Sent: Monday, September 11, 2006 9:02 PM Subject: Zenith-List: HD wing nose skin > > Hello, all > > > Has anybody tried the David Barth method > (http://ch601.org/tools/nose%20skin.htm)for bending a > nose skin for a CH601-HD? > (The radius is much larger on the -HD than on the -XL, thence the > question). > > > Carlos > CH601-HD, plans > Montreal, Canada > > > __________________________________________________________ > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Craftsman Drill Press sale
From: "Ron Lendon" <rlendon(at)comcast.net>
Date: Sep 12, 2006
Larry, Thanks for the notice of the Sears sale. Picked one up today after looking at the other places, Lowes, Home Depot, Harbor Freight. It should come in real handy for making the wing spars. -------- Ron Lendon, Clinton Township, MI Corvair Zodiac XL, ScrapBuilder ;-) Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=61292#61292 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Phil Maxson" <pmaxpmax(at)HOTMAIL.COM>
Subject: EAA Chapter 70 Fly-in
Date: Sep 12, 2006
This weekend my eight year old son and I flew over to Easton, PA to the EAA Chapter 70 fly-in. He was particularly interested in the RC Model air sho w. I flew in about a half-hour before the airport was closed for the event , and hopped out. Before I could even get out of the plane, people where c oming over to ask what kind of plane it was, and what kind of engine. I'm continually amazed at how many people are interested in the engine. I spend the bulk of the day answering questions about the Corvair conversio n, and talking with a Corvair mechanic from Kutztown, PA. By the way, he s ays he has lots of engines and parts, and he's willing to sell core engines , if anyone is interested in the area. Contact me off-list and I'll give y ou his number and address. I have about 92 hours trouble free on my engine/airframe and am loving it. It is actually getting faster, this weekend showing 130 mph indicated with an additional 100 rpm. I suspect the engine is breaking in. In any case, it is getting more fun every time I fly. I'm ready for some long distance flying before the snow flies.Phil Maxson601XL/CorvairNorthwest New Jersey _________________________________________________________________ Search from any Web page with powerful protection. Get the FREE Windows Liv e Toolbar Today! http://get.live.com/toolbar/overview ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: HD wing nose skin
From: "Ron Lendon" <rlendon(at)comcast.net>
Date: Sep 12, 2006
Carlos, I have used that method for Rudder, Stabilizer, Flaps and Aileron skins. The flaps and ailerons were actually a modified version to close them up. The Icon shows me using the "Gravity Feed Stomp Press" on the Flap Skins. The most important thing is the stop, and of course carpet if using the concrete floor. I do plan on trying it when I get to that point. Finishing up rear wing ribs then it's on to the spars. -------- Ron Lendon, Clinton Township, MI Corvair Zodiac XL, ScrapBuilder ;-) Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=61300#61300 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Ryan Vechinski" <brothapig(at)HOTMAIL.COM>
Subject: Re: Craftsman Drill Press sale
Date: Sep 12, 2006
I picked one up myself for the same reason. So far it's doing a great job, although I'm still trying to determine if the laser sight is saving time or not. Thanks for the notice! ----Original Message Follows---- From: "Ron Lendon" <rlendon(at)comcast.net> Subject: Zenith-List: Re: Craftsman Drill Press sale Date: Tue, 12 Sep 2006 18:39:10 -0700 Larry, Thanks for the notice of the Sears sale. Picked one up today after looking at the other places, Lowes, Home Depot, Harbor Freight. It should come in real handy for making the wing spars. -------- Ron Lendon, Clinton Township, MI Corvair Zodiac XL, ScrapBuilder ;-) Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=61292#61292 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "LRM" <lrm(at)skyhawg.com>
Subject: Re: Window tinting
Date: Sep 12, 2006
Yep, it's a pretty dark smoked grey. Notice my little side windows, the top is out of the same piece. I bought a 4X8 piece from the distributor in Little Rock. If I remember right is was about $90, plus it's 1/8". My windshield and doors are also tinted. I got them from Zenith. Larry, N1345L, www.skyhawg.com ----- Original Message ----- From: "Chris In Madison" <cowens(at)cnw.com> Sent: Tuesday, September 12, 2006 2:42 PM Subject: Zenith-List: Re: Window tinting > > Hi Larry, > > I didn't notice that your top glass was tinted. Reckon I should be more > observant :-) > > Best regards, > Chris > > -------- > Chris Owens > Waunakee, WI > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=61239#61239 > > > -- > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Craftsman Drill Press sale
From: "lwinger" <larrywinger(at)gmail.com>
Date: Sep 12, 2006
Glad the info helped. Thanks go to Dave Clay for putting me onto this model. I just found the sale. After a few tries at adjusting the lasers, I'm finding they really save me time and give me greater confidence when drilling those critical parts. -------- Larry Winger Tustin, CA 601XL #6493 from scratch Rudder completed -- drilling stab spars Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=61323#61323 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "vwknott" <vwknott(at)cox.net>
Subject: Re: EAA Chapter 70 Fly-in
Date: Sep 13, 2006
How do I contact you off-list?? Vernon Knott ----- Original Message ----- From: Phil Maxson To: zenith-list(at)matronics.com Sent: Tuesday, September 12, 2006 10:07 PM Subject: Zenith-List: EAA Chapter 70 Fly-in This weekend my eight year old son and I flew over to Easton, PA to the EAA Chapter 70 fly-in. He was particularly interested in the RC Model air show. I flew in about a half-hour before the airport was closed for the event, and hopped out. Before I could even get out of the plane, people where coming over to ask what kind of plane it was, and what kind of engine. I'm continually amazed at how many people are interested in the engine. I spend the bulk of the day answering questions about the Corvair conversion, and talking with a Corvair mechanic from Kutztown, PA. By the way, he says he has lots of engines and parts, and he's willing to sell core engines, if anyone is interested in the area. Contact me off-list and I'll give you his number and address. I have about 92 hours trouble free on my engine/airframe and am loving it. It is actually getting faster, this weekend showing 130 mph indicated with an additional 100 rpm. I suspect the engine is breaking in. In any case, it is getting more fun every time I fly. I'm ready for some long distance flying before the snow flies. Phil Maxson 601XL/Corvair Northwest New Jersey ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ----- Search from any Web page with powerful protection. Get the FREE Windows Live Toolbar Today! Try it now! ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Grant Corriveau <grant.corriveau(at)TELUS.NET>
Subject: Nose gear axle revisited
Date: Sep 13, 2006
Hi gang, Simple jobs are never as simple as you expect... the new 601HD axle uses an AN bolt that is slightly smaller than the hole I have in my gear forks (from the older model of nose wheel axle). I'm certain that this is not acceptable. I'm faced with reaming out the new axle assembly and using a larger bolt size... or ... I seem to recall that someone proposed the idea of replacing the axle with a single, long, 5/8" AN bolt right through the forks, with a castle nut of course on the end. This seems to be my easiest option at the moment, but I'm no mechanic and I want to know what are the reasons that this works/doesn't work as compared to using a specific 'axle' assembly? Thanks for the insight. Grant ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Zenith Aircraft Co." <info(at)zenithair.com>
Subject: FOR SALE: Used Bi-Fold Hangar Doors from Zenith Aircraft
Co.
Date: Sep 13, 2006
Zenith Aircraft recently replaced its two bifold aircraft hangar doors (with new larger and faster one-piece hydraulic doors), and is selling the original bifold doors. If you're building a hangar for your Zenith or want to put doors on an existing hangar, this is a unique opportunity (if you've <http://www.zenithair.com/factory.htm> visited Zenith Aircraft in the past 14 years, chances are that you've seen these bifold doors). Each door is approx. 40-ft wide x 9-ft tall. Each door features electric push button operation, with manual door locks. Each door comes with the heavy-duty electric operator (110 v.). Galvanized aircraft cable lifts the door at four points along the bottom framework. The doors are located on the south side of the Zenith factory at the Mexico Memorial Airport in Mexico, Missouri and can be viewed anytime. Details, see: http://www.zenithair.com/temp/bifold-door.htm Zenith Aircraft Company ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Sep 13, 2006
From: ron dewees <rdewees(at)mindspring.com>
Subject: test
test message ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Dave Ruddiman" <pacificpainting(at)comcast.net>
Subject: 801 Builders (I know you're out there)
Date: Sep 13, 2006
I have the opportunity to buy an 0320 Lycoming with governor and prop. Anyone know of an 801 that is flying with this combination. I am planning on an 0360 with a fixed pitch prop, but thought I'd see if there were any information on this engine and prop combo that has actually been installed and flown on an 801. Dave in Salem 801 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Robin Bellach" <601zv(at)ritternet.com>
Subject: Re: FOR SALE: Used Bi-Fold Hangar Doors from Zenith Aircraft
Co.
Date: Sep 13, 2006
How much $? ----- Original Message ----- From: Zenith Aircraft Co. To: zenith-list(at)matronics.com Sent: Wednesday, September 13, 2006 5:36 PM Subject: Zenith-List: FOR SALE: Used Bi-Fold Hangar Doors from Zenith Aircraft Co. Zenith Aircraft recently replaced its two bifold aircraft hangar doors (with new larger and faster one-piece hydraulic doors), and is selling the original bifold doors. If you're building a hangar for your Zenith or want to put doors on an existing hangar, this is a unique opportunity (if you've visited Zenith Aircraft in the past 14 years, chances are that you've seen these bifold doors). Each door is approx. 40-ft wide x 9-ft tall. Each door features electric push button operation, with manual door locks. Each door comes with the heavy-duty electric operator (110 v.). Galvanized aircraft cable lifts the door at four points along the bottom framework. The doors are located on the south side of the Zenith factory at the Mexico Memorial Airport in Mexico, Missouri and can be viewed anytime. Details, see: http://www.zenithair.com/temp/bifold-door.htm Zenith Aircraft Company ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Sep 13, 2006
From: Jim and Lucy <jpollard(at)ciaccess.com>
Subject: Re: Nose gear axle revisited
At 03:02 PM 9/13/2006, you wrote: >I seem to recall that someone proposed the idea of replacing the axle >with a single, long, 5/8" AN bolt right through the forks, with a >castle nut of course on the end. Thats what I did on mine. Every motorcycle I ever had, held the wheels on with this method and this is the very same setup. I took the bearings to our local bolt seller and checked the fit on different bolts and ended up with a grade 8 bolt fine threaded for the job. Not that I wanted a grade 8 bolt but i happened to be the best fit on the bearings.I have not drilled the hole for the cotter key (one of those jobs I am not looking forward too). Fine thread makes it easier to line the key up with the desired tension on the nut. You just need to tighten it till the spacers between the bearing and fork will not rotate by hand. There really was not much point in getting an an bolt for this application because if you did something bad enough to brake a bolt this size, the rest of the plane would be confetti. Jim Pollard Merlin Ont ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Sep 13, 2006
From: Alex MacKay <mackay(at)physics.ubc.ca>
Subject: Jabiru/Zenith 601 Installation Workshop at Quality Sportplanes
last weekend Hi Builders This is a brief report on the Jabiru Installation Workshop in Cloverdale, Ca last weekend. Jim McCormick from Jabiru Pacific brought a Jabiru 3300 engine plus Firewall Forward package to the Cloverdale Hangar and Brad Demeo made his builder assisted 601xl kit available for the engine installation. In the time between noon Friday and noon Sunday the engine was pulled out of its box, made ready for hanging from the mount, attached to the xl, various lines were connected and the bottom cowl was installed. Jim started the engine at about 12:20 on Sunday- it worked beautifully. I think that all the workshop participants left with the confidence to put a Jabiru into their own kits. Michael Heniz was an incredible host providing meals, local information and demo xl rides. Bob Archibald of Dragonfly aviation provided instruction flights in another xl to several of the participants. Lance Gringell showed up Sunday morning with his beautiful Jabiru equipped xl. This was a very well organised, entertaining and worthwhile event. In a few weeks there will be a similar Corvair / Zenith 601 workshop and a Rotax event might happen later in Cloverdale Thanks to Jim and Michael for doing this! Thanks also to Ken, Doug, Bob, Lance and others who helped. Alex MacKay 601 HDS, nearly ready for a Jabiru 3300. ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: 801 Builders (I know you're out there)
From: "Jay Herron" <jay(at)agstore.net>
Date: Sep 14, 2006
Dave, Jim Frisby has a O320 in his 801, but I don't think he has the constant speed prop. Search the archives for Frisby in case he misses this post. I have a O360 in my 801. It came with a governor and constant speed prop but I sold the prop and bought a wood one from Props Inc. The wood prop is about 15 pounds in weight. The constant speed was around 50 pounds. Other builders suggested that the 801 is slightly nose-heavy to begin with, so I went with wood. I was also having a hard time finding room for the governor. I still have about a month of work to do on my 801 before it is ready to fly. Jay Herron Salem, Ohio Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=61543#61543 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Dave Ruddiman" <pacificpainting(at)comcast.net>
Subject: Re: 801 Builders (I know you're out there)
Date: Sep 14, 2006
Jay, Thanks for the reply. I'm about 99% sure that I'll go with the 0360 because of weight, among other things. I am building my plane without to many frills. I don't want to ad to the complexity of addtional systems and costs on things I probably won't use anyway. The engine prop combination is more a curiosity than anything else. I also found out the engine that I had referred to has been pickled for about 9 years. I think I will probably use an XP360. Haven't thought to much about a prop yet. What are you using? Dave in Salem (Oregon) 801 ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jay Herron" <jay(at)agstore.net> Sent: Thursday, September 14, 2006 5:31 AM Subject: Zenith-List: Re: 801 Builders (I know you're out there) > > Dave, > Jim Frisby has a O320 in his 801, but I don't think he has the constant > speed prop. Search the archives for Frisby in case he misses this post. > > I have a O360 in my 801. It came with a governor and constant speed prop > but I sold the prop and bought a wood one from Props Inc. The wood prop > is about 15 pounds in weight. The constant speed was around 50 pounds. > Other builders suggested that the 801 is slightly nose-heavy to begin > with, so I went with wood. I was also having a hard time finding room for > the governor. > > I still have about a month of work to do on my 801 before it is ready to > fly. > Jay Herron > Salem, Ohio > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=61543#61543 > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: LHusky(at)aol.com
Date: Sep 14, 2006
Subject: Re: Jabiru/Zenith 601 Installation Workshop at Quality Sportplan...
I am registered to go to the Corvair version. I am excited and can't wait. I will be taking lots of pictures and any notes I can during the process for those that are putting this engine on the front of your plane. I was down there in may and I expect this to be a great time. Hope to see one or two from the list there as well. Larry Husky Lakeview, OR 601XL / Corvair Building Fuse Do Not Archive ________________________________________________________________________________
From: JAPhillipsGA(at)aol.com
Date: Sep 14, 2006
Subject: Re: 601 Canopy Covers
Ron, you are the luckiest guy I know. If I knew a fellow whose plane was bent he would probably want me to loan him some money. You, get a free canopy cover. Must be all those years of clean living. I'll keep looking, Best regards, Bill. ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Zodie Rocket" <zodierocket(at)hsfx.ca>
Subject: Re: 801 Builders (I know you're out there)
Date: Sep 14, 2006
I'm in the same boat, the 801 were building is about a month away and has an 0-360 with a metal prop from Zenith's FWF kit. The constant speed application only increases cruise by about 3 knts and is not worth the 5G's or more in cost. But one thing I can truly say is that this is one huge plane to build. It is only about 15% bigger then the 701 but wow it is incredible how much more of the hanger it fills. Cdngoose -----Original Message----- From: owner-zenith-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-zenith-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Jay Herron Sent: Thursday, September 14, 2006 8:32 AM Subject: Zenith-List: Re: 801 Builders (I know you're out there) Dave, Jim Frisby has a O320 in his 801, but I don't think he has the constant speed prop. Search the archives for Frisby in case he misses this post. I have a O360 in my 801. It came with a governor and constant speed prop but I sold the prop and bought a wood one from Props Inc. The wood prop is about 15 pounds in weight. The constant speed was around 50 pounds. Other builders suggested that the 801 is slightly nose-heavy to begin with, so I went with wood. I was also having a hard time finding room for the governor. I still have about a month of work to do on my 801 before it is ready to fly. Jay Herron Salem, Ohio Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=61543#61543 -- 9/13/2006 -- 9/13/2006 ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: 801 Builders (I know you're out there)
From: "Jay Herron" <jay(at)agstore.net>
Date: Sep 14, 2006
Dave, The prop that I have mounted on my 0360 is a 72x46 made from hard maple with fiberglass tips and leading edge protection. Cost was $995 from Props Inc. Jay Herron Salem, Ohio CH801 95% complete Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=61696#61696 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Robert L. Stone" <rstone4(at)hot.rr.com>
Subject: Lowrance 2000c
Date: Sep 14, 2006
Members, I just got delivery of a new Lowrance 2000c yesterday and so far I have only been able to figure out how to find my position on the ground. I seem to remember someone on the net said he has one of these and loves it. Right now I hate mine because I cant figure out how to program it to go from one airport to another. What I would like and very much appreciate is someone who owns one of these little monsters provide me with step by step (being careful not to miss a step) instruction on which buttons to push to go from Skylark Field, Killeen, Tx to Enid Regional Airport, Enid, Oklahoma. For those of you who don't know about this web site, you can get the three digit code for all US Airports. Here is the URL http://www.airnav.com/airports/ Bob Stone, Harker Heights, Tx ZodiacXL ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Sep 14, 2006
From: "Michael Valentine" <mgvalentine(at)gmail.com>
Subject: Baggage hinge alternative
I was wondering if anyone else has tried this cabinet hinge idea (found on CH601.org) that Roger Parnow used as an alternative to the piano hinge on the baggage lockers. If you gave it a try, how did it work? (I am not completely happy with the fit it looks like I will get with my piano hinge - just debating alternatives.) http://www.ch601.org/resources/wing%20Lockers/wing_lockers.htm Thanks, Michael Valentine Contoocook, NH ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Sep 14, 2006
From: Rick R <rick(at)n701rr.com>
Subject: Re: Lowrance 2000c
Bob, Piece of cake. I'm away from home now but get in the manual and go to "plan a route". There you can name your path and enter those identifiers as your way points.....when I get some Saturday you can call me if you like and we'll step through it...... "Robert L. Stone" wrote: Members, I just got delivery of a new Lowrance 2000c yesterday and so far I have only been able to figure out how to find my position on the ground. I seem to remember someone on the net said he has one of these and loves it. Right now I hate mine because I cant figure out how to program it to go from one airport to another. What I would like and very much appreciate is someone who owns one of these little monsters provide me with step by step (being careful not to miss a step) instruction on which buttons to push to go from Skylark Field, Killeen, Tx to Enid Regional Airport, Enid, Oklahoma. For those of you who don't know about this web site, you can get the three digit code for all US Airports. Here is the URL http://www.airnav.com/airports/ Bob Stone, Harker Heights, Tx ZodiacXL Rick Sharpsburg, GA. USA http://www.n701rr.com ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Edward Moody II" <dredmoody(at)cox.net>
Subject: Re: Lowrance 2000c
Date: Sep 14, 2006
Hi Bob, The guy who loves his 2000C was (and is) me. It's not really all that tough if you take a little time to read the manual. For instance, when you are at your home strip and turn it on, it will "find itself" in about 2 - 3 minutes. When the airplane icon quits flashing, it has found its location (and, of course, yours as well unles you wandered away from the plane). To get a course to any destination, press the FIND button then use the arrow buttons to enter the designator code for the destination airport and select GO TO. Voila! You will return to the map screen of your present location with a nice red line to follow to the destination. Read the instructions.... you will find out how to display useful data on the map screen, such as distance to your destination, bearing to it, ground speed, ALT, ETE at your present speed and ground track, and even a nifty CDI graphic. You can choose up to eight data windows to display at the bottom of the map screen. On the other hand, if you really don't want to spend time reading the manual, you might want to return it...... there is s learning curve to deal with. Ed Moody II ----- Original Message ----- From: Robert L. Stone To: zenith-list(at)matronics.com Sent: Thursday, September 14, 2006 7:37 PM Subject: Zenith-List: Lowrance 2000c Members, I just got delivery of a new Lowrance 2000c yesterday and so far I have only been able to figure out how to find my position on the ground. I seem to remember someone on the net said he has one of these and loves it. Right now I hate mine because I cant figure out how to program it to go from one airport to another. ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Graham Kirby" <gk(at)601hd.com>
Subject: Lowrance 2000c
Date: Sep 14, 2006
Bob, You may already know this but Lowrance have an emulator for the 2000c that you can run on a PC. Its available at: http://www.lowrance.com/Software/PCSoftware/Install/AirMap2000C/AirMap200 0C_ demo.asp Looks like a handy way to explore the features. Graham Kirby 601HD -----Original Message----- From: owner-zenith-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-zenith-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Robert L. Stone Sent: Thursday, September 14, 2006 5:37 PM Subject: Zenith-List: Lowrance 2000c Members, I just got delivery of a new Lowrance 2000c yesterday and so far I have only been able to figure out how to find my position on the ground. ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Sep 15, 2006
Subject: Re: 801 Builders (I know you're out there)801 Builders
(I know you're out there)
From: Larry Landucci <lllanducci(at)tds.net>
I have an O-360 Lycoming in my 801 with a metal cruise prop supplied by Zenith and the aircraft is certainly NOT nose heavy as apparently some 801 builders claim. In fact, if I had to do it over again I would probably put the battery on the firewall rather than under the seat to get more weight in the front end. My empty CG is 14.8 in (allowable range is between 12.8 and 22.4 in), and I have the shorter horizontal tail. My empty weight is 1310 lbs (I have the extended range fuel tanks) It is not a big deal but with an empty CG closer to the forward limit you would have a greater latitude in loading profiles. As it is, when I start to load the back seat I sometimes will reach the aft CG limit before I reach gross weight. Larry Landucci -- N801LL ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: 801 Builders (I know you're out there)801 Builders (I
know y
From: "Chris In Madison" <cowens(at)cnw.com>
Date: Sep 15, 2006
Hi Larry, Please forgive me if this is a silly question, but is that 1310 lb. empty weight with full fuel, empty or somewhere in between? It's a lot higher than the stated 1150 lbs. empty weight on their spec sheet. It wouldn't surprise me if their specfied empty weights were on the light side for marketing purposes, though. I remember you said you built yours a little heavy, but I didn't realize it was that much heavier. It's still plenty for two large people to fly with plenty of cargo, however :-) Best regards, Chris -------- Chris Owens Waunakee, WI Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=61773#61773 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Wade Jones" <waj(at)quik.com>
Subject: 601XL Wing Spars
Date: Sep 15, 2006
Hello group ,I thank you all for the responses I received when I first wrote .I received my first AL. order from ASC. on July 26th 2006 .Since that time I have built the rudder, horz. stab.,Ribs for flaps ,elevator, ailerons .Both front and rear wing ribs ,center section is built (not riveted yet) , all the main spars components are cut and ready for drilling .Dave Clay from Temple Texas has been a great help ,he has many good ideas in this construction .I am ready to drill the wing spar parts together today .Do any of you scratch builders have any suggestions how to do this that may help me . Thank you Wade Jones ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Robert L. Stone" <rstone4(at)hot.rr.com>
Subject: Re: Lowrance 2000c
Date: Sep 15, 2006
Rick, Thanks for the response and information. I will call you tomorrow, Saturday but you didn't include your phone number. When you send your phone number, include the best time to call. Bob Stone ----- Original Message ----- From: Rick R To: zenith-list(at)matronics.com Sent: Thursday, September 14, 2006 8:09 PM Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Lowrance 2000c Bob, Piece of cake. I'm away from home now but get in the manual and go to "plan a route". There you can name your path and enter those identifiers as your way points.....when I get some Saturday you can call me if you like and we'll step through it...... "Robert L. Stone" wrote: Members, I just got delivery of a new Lowrance 2000c yesterday and so far I have only been able to figure out how to find my position on the ground. I seem to remember someone on the net said he has one of these and loves it. Right now I hate mine because I cant figure out how to program it to go from one airport to another. What I would like and very much appreciate is someone who owns one of these little monsters provide me with step by step (being careful not to miss a step) instruction on which buttons to push to go from Skylark Field, Killeen, Tx to Enid Regional Airport, Enid, Oklahoma. For those of you who don't know about this web site, you can get the three digit code for all US Airports. Here is the URL http://www.airnav.com/airports/ Bob Stone, ________________________________________________________________________________
From: JAPhillipsGA(at)aol.com
Date: Sep 15, 2006
Subject: Re: 601 Canopy Covers
Al, thanks. How long til we see a report on flying ? My offer for flight time is still open to you. You would be welcome to stay with my Wife and I so other than travel and buying beer the expense would be minimal. Best regards, Bill ________________________________________________________________________________
From: JAPhillipsGA(at)aol.com
Date: Sep 15, 2006
Subject: Re: 601 Canopy Covers
Jack, that sounds like just what I'm looking for. I would really appreciate you putting me in touch with this fine lady. My home phone is 478-994-9196, work is 478-827-0236. Thanks and best regards, Bill ________________________________________________________________________________
From: LHusky(at)aol.com
Date: Sep 15, 2006
Subject: Snow
Well, I went out to do a little work on my fuselage and it started snowing. I can't believe it is snowing this early in the year. I rushed to get my fuse parts back into my garage since I had taken them out to do a little work on my wife's truck. I was using air conditioning two days ago and now I have to find a heater. It is going to get down to 29 tonight. OUCH!!! Larry Husky Lakeview, OR 601XL / Corvair Building Fuse Do Not Archive ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: 801 Builders (I know you're out there)
From: "Jay Herron" <jay(at)agstore.net>
Date: Sep 15, 2006
Ben, You are probably right about being underpropped for top speed. But as you know if I was looking for top cruise speed, I wouldn't be building an 801. My intention is for fast acceleration on take off and leisurely flying. If this prop doesn't work out, I'll swap in another. I'll post the results after I do the test phase. Thanks, Jay Herron 801 Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=61813#61813 ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: 601 Canopy Covers
From: "lgingell" <lgingell@matrix-logic.com>
Date: Sep 15, 2006
I'm borrowing a KennonCovers.com cover (thanks Roy), and thinking of either buying one or making my own from the pattern. The Kennon is nice, but heavy also. They are $350/$425 (deluxe). I have a neighbour who made a *very* light cover from rip-stop nylon. I may do that for the occasional overnighter. However.....if someone knows a good source and has a picture (Jack sounds like he's on to something!) I'd be interested too. Cheers, ..lance http://lancegingell.com/plane.asp -------- Zodiac XL/Jab 3300 http://lancegingell.com/plane.asp Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=61815#61815 ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: 601XL Wing Spars
From: "Ron Lendon" <rlendon(at)comcast.net>
Date: Sep 15, 2006
Wade, I am heading in the same direction as you. One Idea I had was to tram (square up) my drill press spindle to the table top. What I mean here is to invert the base so the spindle can reach the table top and move the spar along the table while drilling. That looks like the easiest way to keep it supported while drilling. -------- Ron Lendon, Clinton Township, MI Corvair Zodiac XL, ScrapBuilder ;-) Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=61884#61884 ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Sep 15, 2006
From: Carlos Sa <carlosfsa(at)yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: 601XL Wing Spars
What?? (My spars are done, but I have to know.) Carlos CH601-HD, plans Montreal, Canada --- Ron Lendon a crit : > ... What I mean here is to invert the base so the spindle can > reach the table top and move the spar along the table while drilling. ... __________________________________________________________ ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Dave VanLanen" <davevanlanen(at)sbcglobal.net>
Subject: Cost of Reducer For Zinc Chromate
Date: Sep 15, 2006
I was going to order a quart of reducer from ACS for the zinc chromate primer I purchased. However I was surprised to learn that although the price is $9.70, the total cost of shipping, with the hazmat surcharge, is $41. That's a four-fold increase in cost just to get it here! Does anyone know of a cheaper way to acquire this product? I live in Madison, WI. Thanks, Dave Van Lanen 601XL - stabilizer ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: RE : Re: 601XL Wing Spars
From: "Ron Lendon" <rlendon(at)comcast.net>
Date: Sep 15, 2006
I'll send a picture up when I get it set up. All should be come clear then. -------- Ron Lendon, Clinton Township, MI Corvair Zodiac XL, ScrapBuilder ;-) Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=61905#61905 ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Sep 15, 2006
From: Paul Mulwitz <p.mulwitz(at)worldnet.att.net>
Subject: Re: Cost of Reducer For Zinc Chromate
Hi Dave, I just made a trip to my local "Automotive" paint store. This is a different retail location from the paint stores that sell house paint. They offered me some good primer to use instead of the Zinc Chromate on steel - some sort of red oxide primer. They also have all the stuff to paint aluminum including alumiprep, allodine, self-etching primer (for cabin interior use), polyurethane top coat in spray cans for interior use, epoxy primer, and polyurethane top coat which can be configured as a single coat or base coat with clear top coat. The guy there also convinced me these materials are a little hazardous but easy to work with so long as I use a little common sense. He also said the total cost for materials (and maybe a mask?) to paint my plane would run around $500. This was good news since I have heard of a guy around here who paid $7,000 to get his RV-9A painted. Of course, all of these materials are available locally and with no wait or hazmat shipping charges. I will have to pay sales tax. You may have such a store in your area too. If you have problems finding it, perhaps you can talk to whoever does auto painting and ask where they get their materials. Best regards, Paul At 08:00 PM 9/15/2006, you wrote: >I was going to order a quart of reducer from ACS for the zinc >chromate primer I purchased. However I was surprised to learn that >although the price is $9.70, the total cost of shipping, with the >hazmat surcharge, is $41. That's a four-fold increase in cost just >to get it here! Does anyone know of a cheaper way to acquire this >product? I live in Madison, WI. > >Thanks, > >Dave Van Lanen > >601XL - stabilizer --------------------------------------------- Paul Mulwitz 32013 NE Dial Road Camas, WA 98607 --------------------------------------------- ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Sep 15, 2006
From: Gary Gower <ggower_99(at)yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: 601 Canopy Covers
Hello Bill,=0A=0AOne thing to consider very important in any canopy cover, is not the price directly, but the type of material that is touching the ca nopy, is important to be sure that will not scratch it with the normal mo vememt by the wind... =0A=0AI still have no experience with canopy covers, but I have seen some airplane windshields replaced, because of seroius scra tches by the cover (probably with some dust), looked like scratched with sand paper.=0A=0AWe are planning to install instead of a canopy cover in ou r 601 XL (once is finished), some kind of instrument and seat cover (ins ide the canopy), mostly to hide what is inside... we now use converted ca r shades to cover our 701 canopy from the inside... =0A=0ASaludos=0AGary Go wer.=0Aflying from Chapala, Mexico.=0A=0A----- Original Message ----=0AFrom : "JAPhillipsGA(at)aol.com" =0ATo: zenith-list@matronics .com=0ASent: Thursday, September 14, 2006 2:19:56 PM=0ASubject: Zenith-List : 601 Canopy Covers=0A=0ADear Thread Friends, I am looking to buy a canopy cover for my XL. She stays hangered most all the time and any of you all th at have visited probably have seen that fine Bart Simpson bed sheet I use t o cover the canopy from dust and bugs. I do plan on doing a bit of over nig ht traveling this fall and need a "real" canopy cover. I contacted Bruce's Custom Covers in California and the nice fellow indicated they had sold 58 covers for 601s and his price was $379.00 plus shipping. Further, he said t heir cover weighs a little over 6 pounds. I figure I don't really need a co ver that will withstand meteor showers, hurricanes, tornados. The plane wou ld end up in Kansas with Dorothy and Toto anyway with the cover the only th ing holding it together !. Anybody know a lighter, less indestructible and cheaper source for a canopy cover ? Hope to hear from you and best regards ================0A=0A ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Cost of Reducer For Zinc Chromate
From: "Jay Herron" <jay(at)agstore.net>
Date: Sep 16, 2006
Dave, I purchased a case of Tempo zinc chromate aerosol cans from Skygeek a couple years ago for my 801. They had the best price at the time and did not charge hazmat. I see they now have a generic zinc chromate for less money than the Tempo. Their website now mentions a hazmat charge on the Tempo but not on the generic. The hazmat charge did not show up on the order total when I put in a pretend order this morning: $9.90 for 2 cans plus $7.43 shipping = $17.33 You might call them first to confirm that there is no hazmat charge. They have yellow and green. Here is a link to the green: http://www.skygeek.com/a7-6889a.html Jay Herron Salem, Ohio 801 Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=61932#61932 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "David Mikesell" <skyguynca(at)skyguynca.com>
Subject: Re: Cost of Reducer For Zinc Chromate
Date: Sep 16, 2006
Cost of Reducer For Zinc ChromateYou can find it at some marine stores/boating shops. Many carry zinc chromate primer. David Mikesell 23597 N. Hwy 99 Acampo, CA 95220 209-609-8774 skyguynca(at)skyguynca.com www.skyguynca.com ----- Original Message ----- From: Dave VanLanen To: zenith-list(at)matronics.com Sent: Friday, September 15, 2006 8:00 PM Subject: Zenith-List: Cost of Reducer For Zinc Chromate I was going to order a quart of reducer from ACS for the zinc chromate primer I purchased. However I was surprised to learn that although the price is $9.70, the total cost of shipping, with the hazmat surcharge, is $41. That's a four-fold increase in cost just to get it here! Does anyone know of a cheaper way to acquire this product? I live in Madison, WI. Thanks, Dave Van Lanen 601XL - stabilizer ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Sep 16, 2006
Subject: Re: 801 Builders (I know you're out there)801 Builders (I
know y
From: Larry Landucci <lllanducci(at)tds.net>
The empty weight (1310 lb) that I quoted for my 801 is one commonly defined as the weight of the aircraft including unusable fuel (about 4-6 gal), and full oil (12 qts). The empty weight of the Zenith factory 801 is reasonable considering that they have only two fuel tanks, no soundproofing/thermal insulation surrounding the entire interior of the cabin as I do, and a lot simpler (and lighter) instrument panel. The one-inch thick closed-cell foam insulation from Wicks or Spruce is quite heavy. In fact, in the forward floor I have a two inch layer underneath a 1/8 inch masonite sheet and carpet over that. I did that because my rubber fuel lines are routed underneath the "false" floor through rigid PVC tubing on their way to my Andair fuel selector on a center panel (an additional extra weight). I also installed additional aluminum angles (diagonally) on both the top and bottom rear fuselage to minimize "oil canning" during flight and glued random scrap pieces of the 1" foam to the sides of the rear fuselage as well to accomplish the same thing. I have about 160 hours on my 801 and so far have not yet heard any sounds due to flexing of the aluminum skins ("oil canning"). So, with all this I think an extra 160 lbs doesn't seem too bad. Larry Landucci -- N801LL ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Robert L. Stone" <rstone4(at)hot.rr.com>
Subject: Canopy covers
Date: Sep 16, 2006
Members, There is no point or advantage in having a custom fitted cover made for your aircraft. A cotton blanket and a silver 10' X 12' tarp with grommets that you can tie 1/4" nylon rope will work just as well as an expensive custom cover. Also if you have a problem as I did when I was living in California with birds thinking your airplane is a toilet for their use, do the following. Get a small piece rabbit skin with the hair still on it and cut it out so it looks like four legs and a head. Put two eyes on the head and glue a piece of Velcro on the bottom side of it. Glue a piece of Velcro on the turtle deck of your aircraft and you will not have any more birds sitting on your airplane and taking a dump. The idea is not really new, farmers have been using scarecrows for years to protect their crops. The rabbit skin is the same principal and it works Bob Stone, Harker Heights, Tx ZodiacXL ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Edward Moody II" <dredmoody(at)cox.net>
Subject: Re: Cost of Reducer For Zinc Chromate
Date: Sep 16, 2006
Cost of Reducer For Zinc ChromateI'm not an industrial paint tech wizard (someone else on the list is one but I don't remember who he is) but I would try buying Laquer Thinner by the gallon at the local paint store, Home Depot, or Lowes etc. It will disolve almost anything other than glass or titanium and flashed off for a quick drying time. It does not etch aluminum for you so you should wash the part, use some sort of etcher (Alumaprep) then brush or spray it on. Hope that helps, Ed Moody II ----- Original Message ----- From: Dave VanLanen To: zenith-list(at)matronics.com I was going to order a quart of reducer from ACS for the zinc chromate primer I purchased. However I was surprised to learn that although the price is $9.70, the total cost of shipping, with the hazmat surcharge, is $41. That's a four-fold increase in cost just to get it here! Does anyone know of a cheaper way to acquire this product? I live in Madison, WI. Thanks, Dave Van Lanen ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Cost of Reducer For Zinc Chromate
From: "Chris In Madison" <cowens(at)cnw.com>
Date: Sep 16, 2006
Hi Dave, To tail onto Paul's comment, there's an auto paint store on Watts Road across from Woodman's on the west side. Maybe there's a chance they'd have what you're after. Best regards, Chris (who knows nothing about paint) -------- Chris Owens Waunakee, WI Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=61962#61962 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Randy" <rpf(at)wi.rr.com>
Subject: speed range for flaps
Date: Sep 16, 2006
This question is for people that have built, or are building, 601xl's. I was looking at Zenith's website for the speed range for operating the flaps, but could not find it. Does anyone know what the speed range is for the flaps? Thanks for your help, Randy Ferri 601xl Jab. 3300 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Jari Kaija" <jari.kaija(at)pp.inet.fi>
Subject: Re: Snow
Date: Sep 17, 2006
> Pussies! ....41degrees Are you talking about fahrenheits? Pussie! :-) At normal winter day, we have minus 35 degrees celsius easily. Do you know, what we do then? Personally, I heat my outdoor bathtub to 36 degrees celsius, going to sauna, where is about 80-110 degrees celsius. It's very dreamfull to take GOOD sauna session (about 30min to 1 hour) and then go to outside to bath, where only stars and moon shines. Pussies! :-) ---------------------------------- http://www.jarikaija.com http://www.project-ch701.net ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Sep 16, 2006
From: 601corvair <airvair601(at)yahoo.com>
Subject: BFR in HDS ?
Does anyone know where I can get a BFR in an HDS on the East Coast? I dont want to solo the airplane, so I really never need to be PIC. So does anyone know a CFI with a HDS? I can be reached off list at: phartig(at)mindspring.com or airvari601(at)yahoo.com --------------------------------- ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Jerry Latimer" <jlatimer1(at)cox.net>
Subject: Snow
Date: Sep 16, 2006
Isn't -40 C equal to -40 F? It's 94 F and bright sunshine here in Phoenix. Jerry _____ From: owner-zenith-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-zenith-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Jari Kaija Sent: Saturday, September 16, 2006 2:18 PM Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Snow > Pussies! ....41degrees Are you talking about fahrenheits? Pussie! :-) At normal winter day, we have minus 35 degrees celsius easily. ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: speed range for flaps
From: "jetboy" <sanson.r(at)xtra.co.nz>
Date: Sep 16, 2006
Please add CH701 rev-4 flaps speed range to the question. When the 701 was changed to 1100lbs revision the max flap setting was changed to 16 deg. I have been unable to find a revised flight manual or documentation covering this change Ralph CH701 / 2200a -------- Ralph - CH701 / 2200a Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=61994#61994 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Phil Maxson" <pmaxpmax(at)HOTMAIL.COM>
Subject: Canopy covers
Date: Sep 16, 2006
Please don't take offense with the following comments. It's hard to believ e, but on occasion, people on this list take my comments the wrong way :-) I admire the frugal nature of your suggestion. I saw the post many months ago, about the blanket and tarp idea, and also a "custom cover" using a table cloth with a soft interior surface. The reas on I didn't go with this option is I thought it would look like a tarp and a blanket! Or a tablecloth strapped to my plane! I didn't like the look o f it. SO, I went with the a custom, color matched cover from Bruce's Custo m Covers. He already had the template for the XL and it looks beautiful. I liked it so much I went back for a prop/spinner cover. I liked the idea about the rabbit skin.Phil Maxson601XL/CorvairNorthwest Ne w Jersey From: rstone4(at)hot.rr.comTo: zenith-list(at)matronics.comSubject: Zenith-List: Canopy coversDate: Sat, 16 Sep 2006 11:57:13 -0500 Members, There is no point or advantage in having a custom fitted cover made fo r your aircraft. A cotton blanket and a silver 10' X 12' tarp with grommet s that you can tie 1/4" nylon rope will work just as well as an expensive c ustom cover. <> _________________________________________________________________ Express yourself with gadgets on Windows Live Spaces http://discoverspaces.live.com?source=hmtag1&loc=us ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: 801 Builders (I know you're out there)801 Builders (I
know
From: "Chris In Madison" <cowens(at)cnw.com>
Date: Sep 16, 2006
I agree. Larry has a very nice plane. He was kind enough to give me a ride in it one beautiful summer evening here in Madison (Middleton), WI. Beautiful sunset on the horizon. It was a very comfortable ride, and his plane is nicely outfitted. I spent some more time going over it at a recent fly-in and like it more each time I see it. I wish you had your plane at Oshkosh this year. I *really* wanted to see it! It was sad that Larry's was the only one there (other than the factory plane). Maybe John Faulkner's new white one with the Eggenfellner 6-cyl will be there next year :-). Best regards, Chris -------- Chris Owens Waunakee, WI Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=62015#62015 ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: 801 Builders (I know you're out there)801 Builders (I
know y
From: "Chris In Madison" <cowens(at)cnw.com>
Date: Sep 16, 2006
Thanks for the details, Larry. Much appreciated. You've got a wonderful airplane, to be sure :-) Best regards, Chris -------- Chris Owens Waunakee, WI Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=62016#62016 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Bryan Martin <bryanmmartin(at)comcast.net>
Subject: Re: speed range for flaps
Date: Sep 16, 2006
On Sep 16, 2006, at 5:13 PM, Randy wrote: > This question is for people that have built, or are building, > 601xl's. I was looking at Zenith's website for the speed range for > operating the flaps, but could not find it. Does anyone know what > the speed range is for the flaps? > > Thanks for your help, > Randy Ferri > 601xl Jab. 3300 I recieved this file in reply to an email I sent to ZAC, It lists a Vf of 80 mph: Nick Heintz Zenith Aircraft Company support(at)zenithair.com http://www.zenithair.com Technical Support Disclaimer: While we strive to ensure that the advice/information provided through our support is correct, Zenith Aircraft Company does not accept any responsibility for errors or omissions. Any advice or information that Zenith Aircraft Company gives you via any form of communication is not a guarantee that it will correct your problem. It is only offered as assistance to you. Zenith Aircraft Company will not be held responsible for any loss or damage as a result of our advice or information supplied. The following section of this message contains a file attachment prepared for transmission using the Internet MIME message format. If you are using Pegasus Mail, or any other MIME-compliant system, you should be able to save it or view it from within your mailer. If you cannot, please ask your system administrator for assistance. ---- File information ----------- File: speed limitations.JPG Date: 10 Jun 2004, 12:45 Size: 158168 bytes. Type: JPEG-image =EF=BC -- Bryan Martin N61BM, CH 601 XL, RAM Subaru, Stratus redrive. ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Robert L. Stone" <rstone4(at)hot.rr.com>
Subject: Re: Canopy covers
Date: Sep 16, 2006
Phil, My suggestion was for those who want protection for their aircraft and nothing else. You like a custom made cover with your aircraft tail number on it for the same reason I have a gold emblem on my Cadillac. The car came with black tire valve screw on covers, and the hood ornament was silver but I had to have gold. The rabbit skin really works if you have a problem with birds landing on your aircraft when it is parked and craping on it whenever they feel like it. I made one up when I had a Beachcraft parked at Meadow Lark Field, Hunting Beach, California and it got craped on all the time until I put that "Scarecrow" on it and no more bird crap. I am never offended by people who have a different view point than I do. Bob Stone ----- Original Message ----- From: Phil Maxson To: Robert L. Stone Sent: Saturday, September 16, 2006 5:19 PM Subject: RE: Zenith-List: Canopy covers Please don't take offense with the following comments. It's hard to believe, but on occasion, people on this list take my comments the wrong way :-) I admire the frugal nature of your suggestion. I saw the post many months ago, about the blanket and tarp idea, and also a "custom cover" using a table cloth with a soft interior surface. The reason I didn't go with this option is I thought it would look like a tarp and a blanket! Or a tablecloth strapped to my plane! I didn't like the look of it. SO, I went with the a custom, color matched cover from Bruce's Custom Covers. He already had the template for the XL and it looks beautiful. I liked it so much I went back for a prop/spinner cover. I liked the idea about the rabbit skin. Phil Maxson 601XL/Corvair Northwest New Jersey ------------------------------------------------------------------------- --- From: rstone4(at)hot.rr.com To: zenith-list(at)matronics.com Subject: Zenith-List: Canopy covers Date: Sat, 16 Sep 2006 11:57:13 -0500 Members, There is no point or advantage in having a custom fitted cover made for your aircraft. A cotton blanket and a silver 10' X 12' tarp with grommets that you can tie 1/4" nylon rope will work just as well as an expensive custom cover. <> ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ----- Express yourself with gadgets on Windows Live Spaces Try it! ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Ryan Vechinski" <brothapig(at)HOTMAIL.COM>
Subject: 701 Upper Elevator Horn
Date: Sep 16, 2006
Fellow 701 builders; I am currently working on finishing up the elevator, and I am trying to figure out the upper elevator horn, part number 7H5-1. First of all, I don't believe that it is drawn correctly when looking at the "top" view. I cannot figure out how far in to taper the front of the horn (the dashed line with the work "cut" in the drawings) Could someone help me understand this? I hope I am explaining this enough. I will try to scan an image in if necessary. Thanks in advance. Ryan ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Phil Maxson" <pmaxpmax(at)HOTMAIL.COM>
Subject: speed range for flaps
Date: Sep 16, 2006
I have mine placarded (white arc) to use flaps below 80 mph indicated. I r egularly deploy them at that speed, and have never had a problem.Phil Maxso n601XL/CorvairNorthwest New Jersey From: rpf(at)wi.rr.comSubject: Zenith-List: speed range for flaps Does anyone know what the speed range is for the flaps? _________________________________________________________________ Use Messenger to talk to your IM friends, even those on Yahoo! http://ideas.live.com/programpage.aspx?versionId=7adb59de-a857-45ba-81cc- 685ee3e858fe ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Sep 17, 2006
From: "John Marzulli" <john.marzulli(at)gmail.com>
Subject: Re: 701 Upper Elevator Horn
While I didn't scratch build the horns, they did cause me a large amount of trouble. Here are all my notes from the elevator build: http://701builder.blogspot.com/search/label/Elevator While not a direct answer to your issue, hopefully you can avoid the same mistakes I made. Good luck! -John in Seattle On 9/16/06, Ryan Vechinski wrote: > > > > > Fellow 701 builders; > > I am currently working on finishing up the elevator, and I am trying to > figure out the upper elevator horn, part number 7H5-1. First of all, I > don't believe that it is drawn correctly when looking at the "top" > view. I > cannot figure out how far in to taper the front of the horn (the dashed > line > with the work "cut" in the drawings) Could someone help me understand > this? > I hope I am explaining this enough. I will try to scan an image in if > necessary. Thanks in advance. > > Ryan > > -- John Marzulli http://701Builder.blogspot.com/ "Flying a plane is no different than riding a bicycle... it's just a lot harder to put baseball cards in the spokes. ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "John Bolding" <jnbolding1(at)teleshare.net>
Subject: Re: Zenith-List Digest: 27 Msgs - 09/16/06
Date: Sep 17, 2006
AW Shucks, That pesky seat belt bracket keeps interrupting our life and death discussion of zinc chromate and canopy covers... Interesting timing, yesterday I talked to a good friend of mine that had his first aircraft accident in almost 40 yrs of flying. forgot to turn on the fuel, engine quit at 75' and he hit the ground at about 40 degrees, tore the gear out,flipped over and busted up the plane pretty good but other than a puncture wound in the calf and MASSIVE bruises the size of a saucer from the seat belt/shoulder harness he was in good shape, no failure of the restraint system. This is on a 250# airplane so a good system does not have to weigh much, just be properly designed. Seems like I'm gonna be the designated hitter on this issue so I'll write a letter to Zenith expressing my (our??) concerns in this very important area of design and see what shakes out. Stay tuned, this has the potential to get ugly. LOW&SLOW John > From: "n801bh(at)netzero.com" <n801bh(at)netzero.com> > n another note we lost another 801 last month. The pilot/builder is ok t > hank god and he will share his story when he feels more comfortable talk > I will say he is concerned that the seat belt attach bracket failed too.... > Ben Haas > N801BH > www.haaspowerair.com > ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Sep 17, 2006
Subject: Re: 801 Builders --OOPS)
From: Larry Landucci <lllanducci(at)tds.net>
Sorry, but my recent description of my 801 had a significant error. When I spoke of the one inch thick insulation foam, I actually meant one/half inch thick. But in most locations I used two layers for a total thickness of one inch. Larry Landucci -- N801LL ________________________________________________________________________________
From: JAPhillipsGA(at)aol.com
Date: Sep 17, 2006
Subject: Re: 601 Canopy Covers
Al, I'm sorry to hear your wife is still ill. Joy and I hope she recovers quickly. On the cover, sure sounds good to me. Ask him to make one, if you are satisfied I want one as well. I have to fly up to Griffin Tuesday to get the transponder certified. I plan on making some x-county flights this fall and winter. Best regards, Bill ________________________________________________________________________________
From: JAPhillipsGA(at)aol.com
Date: Sep 17, 2006
Subject: Re: 601 Canopy Covers
Jim, your still here !!. I haven't heard from or seen you in an age. Do you ever get out to the airport ? I haven't called the Kennon folks yet, but I have their number. Hope to see you soon, come by the hanger sometime. I'll probably be there, Best regards, Bill ________________________________________________________________________________
From: JAPhillipsGA(at)aol.com
Date: Sep 17, 2006
Subject: Re: 601 Canopy Covers
Jack, sure looks good to me. Are you satisfied with the workmanship? I think I will try to order a cover from Marcie when I get the number, thanks, Bill ________________________________________________________________________________
From: JAPhillipsGA(at)aol.com
Date: Sep 17, 2006
Subject: Jab 3300 CHT Solution Photos
Dear Thread, the other day several folks asked for photos of the mods I made to the ducts that reduced CHTs. I took some photos and will be happy to send them. Unfortunately, I'm not too much up on the transfer options. Where can I send these so that anybody can pull them that wants them ? Also, that my dial up speed won't piss off those that give a dam about computer speed ? Hope to hear back, Bill of Georgia N505WP 601XL-3300 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Dave" <daberti(at)sbcglobal.net>
Subject: Cost of Reducer For Zinc Chromate
Date: Sep 17, 2006
Cost of Reducer For Zinc ChromateIt's plain ol toluene get it at menards, home depot, local hardware store, etc. Dave 601-HD 912ULS I was going to order a quart of reducer from ACS for the zinc chromate primer I purchased. However I was surprised to learn that although the price is $9.70, the total cost of shipping, with the hazmat surcharge, is $41. That's a four-fold increase in cost just to get it here! Does anyone know of a cheaper way to acquire this product? I live in Madison, WI. ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Jari Kaija" <jari.kaija(at)pp.inet.fi>
Subject: Re: Snow Blind Curse
Date: Sep 17, 2006
> Course, GOD blessing us to been born down here abouts, helped out some too. Best What the god has do with it? Thank your parents. Yep. I want live some warm countries too, but thanks to my parents, they didn't move away from Finland :-) ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Afterfxllc(at)aol.com
Date: Sep 17, 2006
Subject: 601 XL Factory Kit for sale
MAKE OFFER I hate to sell this but wife lost her medical and I have no choice. The tail is finished and primed inside and out with DuPont 2 part primer. The fush. is 80% complete and is also primed inside and out, it is on it's mains and has the dual stick option. The canopy is 60% complete on the fush. The wings haven't been started. I bought the landing light option and the wing baggage doors. I also got the strobe option. I have 2 corvair motors along with WW's books and tapes. Please contact me off line at 502-644-8123 Kit is located in Louisville Ky. Jeff ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: 701 Aileron rod horn interference
From: "Geoff Heap" <stol10(at)comcast.net>
Date: Sep 17, 2006
I bought the control kit from ZAC. After assembly I see that without the elevator wires hooked up, the torque tube is able to slide forward until the boltheads going through the aileron rod horn 7C2-3 (and rod ends) interfere with the top flange of the BOTTOM CHANNEL 7F6-1. In this position the ailerons cannot work. The only scenario I can see where this can be disastrous is if the elevator wires go slack in flight (for any reason you care to think of) In this situation hopefully the wires just go a little slack ( I'm not even talking about complete failure such as a broken wire). OK, but now there is no tension from said wire to hold the torque tube in the aftmost position. If the torque tube now slides forward about 5/16" I've lost aileron control. There is an in flight fix for this which is not acceptable to me. Simply push the torque tube back with my right hand and aileron control is back. Variation in assy from one 701 to another does not alter this condition that I can see. On page 7C2 two dimension changes for the rod horn would solve this. Dims 25 mm and 8 mm should both be increased by 9mm to 34 and 17. I solved this to my satisfaction with a piece of pvc tube from home depot cost about 0.50c. OD is 1.25. I had to open up the ID to 1.135 then cut it off and belt sand it to .30 long. It weighs nothing and hopefully will sit there for years doing nothing as it doesn't touch anything. But one day..............it might have a job to do. see attached Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=62144#62144 Attachments: http://forums.matronics.com//files/dscf0025_185.jpg ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Dave Ruddiman" <pacificpainting(at)comcast.net>
Subject: IO-360
Date: Sep 17, 2006
This might be a silly question, and since I have never flown a plane with fuel injection, what do you do about mixture. Is that compensated for with the injection? Just one more thing I would like to know for the future. Also, pros and cons of fuel injection? Also for you 801 builders, did you buy firewall forward stuff from Zenith. How about the prop? I'm not really an experimenter, just an assembler and trying to make this as easy as possible. Thanks in advance. Dave in Salem CH801 (Fuel injected?) ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Dave Ruddiman" <pacificpainting(at)comcast.net>
Subject: IO-360 Fuel Tanks
Date: Sep 17, 2006
Do I need a return line to the tank for fuel injection, like on a car? Thanks again, Dave in Salem CH801 trying to figure out a few things. ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Sep 17, 2006
Subject: 7H5-1
From: rhartwig11(at)juno.com
Ryan, I drilled and clecoed 7H5-1 in place, then marked a taper back to the angle extrusion, and a taper on the flange back to the spar. Rich Hartwig Waunakee, WI rhartwig11(at)juno.com >part number 7H5-1. First of all, I >don't believe that it is drawn correctly when looking at the "top" view. I >cannot figure out how far in to taper the front of the horn (the dashed line >with the work "cut" in the drawings) ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Robert L. Stone" <rstone4(at)hot.rr.com>
Subject: Re: 601 XL Factory Kit for sale
Date: Sep 17, 2006
Jeff, Don't you think it might be a good idea to tell us what you are selling and what price you have in mind????? ----- Original Message ----- From: Afterfxllc(at)aol.com To: zenith-list(at)matronics.com Sent: Sunday, September 17, 2006 4:18 PM Subject: Zenith-List: 601 XL Factory Kit for sale MAKE OFFER I hate to sell this but wife lost her medical and I have no choice. The tail is finished and primed inside and out with DuPont 2 part primer. The fush. is 80% complete and is also primed inside and out, it is on it's mains and has the dual stick option. The canopy is 60% complete on the fush. The wings haven't been started. I bought the landing light option and the wing baggage doors. I also got the strobe option. I have 2 corvair motors along with WW's books and tapes. Please contact me off line at 502-644-8123 Kit is located in Louisville Ky. Jeff ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "george may" <gfmjr_20(at)HOTMAIL.COM>
Subject: Familiarization flight time
Date: Sep 17, 2006
Well, it was bound to happen eventually-----the bird is complete and the FAA inspection scheduled. Now I need some flight time in a 601XL. Is there anyone in New England that would be willing to help out in getting me a couple of hours flight time in their 601XL? Would really appreciate it. Please contact me offlist if you can accommodate Thanks George May 601XL 912s _________________________________________________________________ Got something to buy, sell or swap? Try Windows Live Expo ttp://clk.atdmt.com/MSN/go/msnnkwex0010000001msn/direct/01/?href=http://expo.live.com/ ________________________________________________________________________________
From: 4rcsimmons(at)comcast.net (Rich Simmons)
Subject: Instruments
Date: Sep 18, 2006
For those of you flying or far enough along to have purchaesed gauges/instruments, what is hot and what is not. i would like to see what others are doing. I am still thinking about the standard six pack. -- Thanks, Rich Simmons 601 XL - Working on the wings
For those of you flying or far enough along to have purchaesed gauges/instruments, what is hot and what is not.
 
i would like to see what others are doing. I am still thinking about the standard six pack.
 
--
Thanks,
Rich Simmons
601 XL - Working on the wings

      
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Sep 17, 2006
Subject: Re: 701 Upper Elevator Horn
From: johndread(at)wildblue.net
Hi Ryan: I was just working on the same part last evening. I have noticed that none of the angles shown on the Zenith drawings are very precise. Part of the learning experience I suppose! The way I generated the angle for the "cut" on the part was as follows. After locating the upper horn on the elevator I made a mark where the rivet flange aligned with the front edge of the spar. Then I measured 20mm as is shown on the drawing along the flange, make a line at right angles across the flange. Where this line meets the curve of the vertical is where the bottom of the "cut" is located. Draw a line from this position to the 12mm radius indicated on the drawings. Then bandsaw and file to shape. Hope this helps. Call me at 303-648-3261 if you need more help. John Read - working hard on my 701 in Colorado > > > Fellow 701 builders; > > I am currently working on finishing up the elevator, and I am trying to > figure out the upper elevator horn, part number 7H5-1. First of all, I > don't believe that it is drawn correctly when looking at the "top" view. > I > cannot figure out how far in to taper the front of the horn (the dashed > line > with the work "cut" in the drawings) Could someone help me understand > this? > I hope I am explaining this enough. I will try to scan an image in if > necessary. Thanks in advance. > > Ryan > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: J2j3h4(at)aol.com
Date: Sep 17, 2006
Subject: Re: Instruments
If you decide to go with the standard instruments, I have most of these for sale, used, from an RV-7 project I was planning before I learned that I could not pass the medical. Jim Hasper In a message dated 9/17/2006 10:13:06 P.M. Central Daylight Time, 4rcsimmons(at)comcast.net writes: For those of you flying or far enough along to have purchased gauges/instruments, what is hot and what is not. i would like to see what others are doing. I am still thinking about the standard six pack. -- Thanks, Rich Simmons 601 XL - Working on the wings (http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Zenith-List) (http://www.matronics.com/contribution) ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Craig Payne" <craig(at)craigandjean.com>
Subject: Ballistic recovery chute in an XL
Date: Sep 17, 2006
I've been looking at the feasibility of installing a chute in an XL. The way I read the weight and balance numbers installing 28 to 30 pounds of gear at the rear of the luggage platform would leave you with a plane with greatly reduced usability - especially with two adults but no luggage. Interestingly the trouble come as fuel gets low - around 7 gallons with two FAA standard 170 lb adults. I'm basing my analysis on a spreadsheet that David X. sent out on July 31st. Can anyone with experience installing a chute in an XL give me their analysis? -- Craig ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Craig Payne" <craig(at)craigandjean.com>
Subject: Instruments
Date: Sep 17, 2006
Lots of folks are going with the newer, entry-level glass panels. The Dynon units are popular especially the new D180 EMS/EFIS combo: www.dynonavionics.com/ Other candidates are from Grand Rapids Technologies, Blue Mountain Avionics and MGL Avionics: www.grtavionics.com/images.htm www.bluemountainavionics.com www.mglavionics.co.za and www.sportflyingshop.com/ I'm going with MGL's new "Enigma". -- Craig ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Craig Payne" <craig(at)craigandjean.com>
Subject: Instruments
Date: Sep 17, 2006
One vendor I forgot: Advanced Flight Systems: www.advanced-control-systems.com BTW: there is a two-edged sword with the new glass panels: things are changing rapidly so put off choosing and ordering as long as you can (same with GPS's). But most vendors pre-announce and have long delivery times (Dynon is one exception). So order early ;-) -- Craig ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Sep 18, 2006
From: David Barth <davids601xl(at)yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: 601XL Wing Spars
Hi Wade. Here are a few tips. I also have some photos if you want some. Email me offlist. Number 8 and 10 machine screws with wing nuts make great clecos as you drill. (be sure to use washers on both ends to avoid marking those spar caps) I always started with a smaller bit and did a pilot hole first. More drilling overall but all my holes are round so I think it was worth it. I turned the drill head on my drill press 90 degrees and clamped the base to a small table beside my worktable. This allowed me the reach I needed. Then I slid the spar along the work table and drilled as I went. It worked well. It is important that the spar remains flat (straight) throughout the drilling process or you will build in some warp. I use a small piece of angle or some other suitable tool to check that the drill bit is square to the spar cap in both directions. If the hole isn't square to the material the heads of the rivets don't sit right. Polish those spar caps. There should be no nicks or scratches in them whatsoever as that is where stresses will build up. I hope that little bit helps. A lot is common sense but spars are a lot of work and absolutely crucial to the structural integrity of your airframe. I would hate to see anyone make a set that were not airworthy. have fun. David --- Wade Jones wrote: > Hello group ,I thank you all for the responses I > received when I first wrote .I received my first AL. > order from ASC. on July 26th 2006 .Since that time I > have built the rudder, horz. stab.,Ribs for flaps > ,elevator, ailerons .Both front and rear wing ribs > ,center section is built (not riveted yet) , all the > main spars components are cut and ready for drilling > .Dave Clay from Temple Texas has been a great help > ,he has many good ideas in this construction .I am > ready to drill the wing spar parts together today > .Do any of you scratch builders have any suggestions > how to do this that may help me . Thank you Wade Jones David Barth 601 XL Plansbuilder 15% done? Working on Wings www.ch601.org __________________________________________________ ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Sep 18, 2006
From: ernie <ernieth(at)gmail.com>
Subject: Re: 601 XL Factory Kit for sale
Jeff, I am concidering building a 601xl. But I will need to consult with other builders, I am new to this and have not taken the rudder class or flown in a zenith. ernie On 9/17/06, Afterfxllc(at)aol.com wrote: > > MAKE OFFER > > I hate to sell this but wife lost her medical and I have no choice. > The tail is finished and primed inside and out with DuPont 2 part primer. > The fush. is 80% complete and is also primed inside and out, it is on it's > mains and has the dual stick option. The canopy is 60% complete on the fush. > > The wings haven't been started. I bought the landing light option and the > wing baggage doors. > I also got the strobe option. > I have 2 corvair motors along with WW's books and tapes. > Please contact me off line at 502-644-8123 > Kit is located in Louisville Ky. > Jeff > > > * > > > * > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Ryan Vechinski" <brothapig(at)HOTMAIL.COM>
Subject: Re: 701 Upper Elevator Horn
Date: Sep 18, 2006
John, thanks for your reply. It looks like that is the only way to do it, as the required information is missing. It makes me feel better to hear the way other people have done it. Thanks! Ryan ----Original Message Follows---- From: johndread(at)wildblue.net Subject: Re: Zenith-List: 701 Upper Elevator Horn Date: Sun, 17 Sep 2006 21:31:18 -0600 (MDT) Hi Ryan: I was just working on the same part last evening. I have noticed that none of the angles shown on the Zenith drawings are very precise. Part of the learning experience I suppose! The way I generated the angle for the "cut" on the part was as follows. After locating the upper horn on the elevator I made a mark where the rivet flange aligned with the front edge of the spar. Then I measured 20mm as is shown on the drawing along the flange, make a line at right angles across the flange. Where this line meets the curve of the vertical is where the bottom of the "cut" is located. Draw a line from this position to the 12mm radius indicated on the drawings. Then bandsaw and file to shape. Hope this helps. Call me at 303-648-3261 if you need more help. John Read - working hard on my 701 in Colorado > > > Fellow 701 builders; > > I am currently working on finishing up the elevator, and I am trying to > figure out the upper elevator horn, part number 7H5-1. First of all, I > don't believe that it is drawn correctly when looking at the "top" view. > I > cannot figure out how far in to taper the front of the horn (the dashed > line > with the work "cut" in the drawings) Could someone help me understand > this? > I hope I am explaining this enough. I will try to scan an image in if > necessary. Thanks in advance. > > Ryan > > > > > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Sep 18, 2006
From: N5SL <nfivesl(at)yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: Ballistic recovery chute in an XL
Craig: 30 lbs. is not all in the luggage area. I have my harness installed and a lot of it is forward of the gear - the reinforcing angle, bolts, harness, steel rings, pull handle etc. I'm waiting to order the actual parachute and rocket on advice from BRS. I'll weigh this stuff when I get it. Click on the link below to see pictures of the harness installed on my 601XL. Scott Laughlin 601XL / Omaha, Nebraska http://www.cooknwithgas.com/BRS.html --- Craig Payne wrote: The way I read the weight and balance numbers installing 28 to 30 pounds of gear at the rear of the luggage platform __________________________________________________ ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Sep 18, 2006
From: N5SL <nfivesl(at)yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: Ballistic recovery chute in an XL
Craig: 30 lbs. is not all in the luggage area. I have my harness installed and a lot of it is forward of the gear - the reinforcing angle, bolts, harness, steel rings, pull handle etc. I'm waiting to order the actual parachute and rocket on advice from BRS. I'll weigh this stuff when I get it. Click on the link below to see pictures of the harness installed on my 601XL. Scott Laughlin 601XL / Omaha, Nebraska http://www.cooknwithgas.com/BRS.html --- Craig Payne wrote: The way I read the weight and balance numbers installing 28 to 30 pounds of gear at the rear of the luggage platform __________________________________________________ ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Sep 18, 2006
From: <dredmoody(at)cox.net>
Subject: Instruments
The Enigma unit is very attractive and promises to be versatile as well. The teething pains associated with a newly released product of this complexity may be a problem. Then again, I'm going with Advanced Flight Systems' AF-3500 combo unit which has only been flying a very short while. On the positive side, the AF-3500 is based on their previously proven EIS technology with the AHRS guts of the Chelton systems. That product can be viewed at http://www.advanced-control-systems.com/Products/AF-3500/AF-3500.html Ed Moody II Rayne, LA 601XL / firewall ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Wade Jones" <waj(at)quik.com>
Subject: Re: 601XL Wing Spars
Date: Sep 18, 2006
Hi David ,thanks a lot for your imput .I finished drilling the spars yesterday (8 hours) lots of drilling .I used a method similar to yours .Thanks again wade ----- Original Message ----- From: "David Barth" <davids601xl(at)yahoo.com> Sent: Monday, September 18, 2006 7:35 AM Subject: Re: Zenith-List: 601XL Wing Spars > > Hi Wade. > Here are a few tips. I also have some photos if you > want some. Email me offlist. > > Number 8 and 10 machine screws with wing nuts make > great clecos as you drill. (be sure to use washers on > both ends to avoid marking those spar caps) > > I always started with a smaller bit and did a pilot > hole first. More drilling overall but all my holes > are round so I think it was worth it. > > I turned the drill head on my drill press 90 degrees > and clamped the base to a small table beside my > worktable. This allowed me the reach I needed. Then I > slid the spar along the work table and drilled as I > went. It worked well. It is important that the spar > remains flat (straight) throughout the drilling > process or you will build in some warp. > > I use a small piece of angle or some other suitable > tool to check that the drill bit is square to the spar > cap in both directions. If the hole isn't square to > the material the heads of the rivets don't sit right. > > Polish those spar caps. There should be no nicks or > scratches in them whatsoever as that is where stresses > will build up. > > I hope that little bit helps. A lot is common sense > but spars are a lot of work and absolutely crucial to > the structural integrity of your airframe. I would > hate to see anyone make a set that were not airworthy. > > have fun. > David > > --- Wade Jones wrote: > >> Hello group ,I thank you all for the responses I >> received when I first wrote .I received my first AL. >> order from ASC. on July 26th 2006 .Since that time I >> have built the rudder, horz. stab.,Ribs for flaps >> ,elevator, ailerons .Both front and rear wing ribs >> ,center section is built (not riveted yet) , all the >> main spars components are cut and ready for drilling >> .Dave Clay from Temple Texas has been a great help >> ,he has many good ideas in this construction .I am >> ready to drill the wing spar parts together today >> .Do any of you scratch builders have any suggestions >> how to do this that may help me . Thank you Wade > Jones > > > David Barth > 601 XL Plansbuilder 15% done? > Working on Wings > www.ch601.org > > __________________________________________________ > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Gordon" <cscsail(at)gmavt.net>
Subject: Rotax
Date: Sep 18, 2006
I'm at the point were I need to order something that will make noise and spin a propeller. It's going to be a Rotax 912ULS and from what I can tell online, everyone seems to sell this engine for about the same price including Zenith. I was wondering if anyone had any advise for who to deal with. I've got to believe that some are better than others especially if I were to have a problem with the engine. I'm in Northern Vt. (no snow yet) so Canada may also be an option. Thanks, Gordon CH701 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Trevor Page <webmaster(at)upac.ca>
Subject: Re: Rotax
Date: Sep 18, 2006
Gordon, Rotax does not give dealers any real margin on the products so that's why the prices are pretty much the same everywhere you go. So basically find a dealer that's relatively close and has good service. I can vouch the folks @ Aeropropulsion just outside of Montreal, that's probably not too far from you. Their website is at http://www.rotaxservice.com/ Might I suggest the Warp Drive propeller for your plane. It's a perfect match for a 912 and smooth as silk. I've owned various props from both the US and Europe and they're one of the best if you want to have a North American prop. European props (DUC, Woodcomp, etc) are excellent as well however much more expensive (the DUC was superb). Also, ZAC has a new cowling and FWF kit of the 701 that was originally designed in Germany (http://www.zenithair.com/stolch701/7- engine.html). It's way nicer and better than the kit ZAC has been using over the years but I know others have had great experience with the CZAW FWF kit sold by SkyShops as well (http://www.skyshops.org/ FIREWALLFOW.htm) . I've seen their cowl on the weekend and it makes a 701 look fantastic! I'm currently switching over to the CZAW cowl kit for my 601. Trev Page C-IDUS 601HD R912 On Sep 18, 2006, at 12:51 PM, Gordon wrote: > I'm at the point were I need to order something that will make > noise and spin a propeller. It's going to be a Rotax 912ULS and > from what I can tell online, everyone seems to sell this engine for > about the same price including Zenith. I was wondering if anyone > had any advise for who to deal with. I've got to believe that some > are better than others especially if I were to have a problem with > the engine. I'm in Northern Vt. (no snow yet) so Canada may also be > an option. > Thanks, > Gordon > CH701 > http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Zenith-List_- > ============================================================ _- > forums.matronics.com_- > ============================================================ _- > ============================================================ _- > contribution_- > =========================================================== > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Afterfxllc(at)aol.com
Date: Sep 18, 2006
Subject: Re: 601 XL Factory Kit for sale
If you read you would know ....it says 601 xl Factory kit and it also says make offer. ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Gordon" <cscsail(at)gmavt.net>
Subject: Re: Rotax
Date: Sep 18, 2006
Trevor, Thanks for the info. I liked the appearance of the CZ cowling as well and ordered the CZAF FWF kit from skyshop in mid July, so hopefully it will be arriving soon. As I recall, they provide a woodcomp propeller with the kit. I'll check with Aeropropulsion in the morning. Gordon ----- Original Message ----- From: Trevor Page To: zenith-list(at)matronics.com Sent: Monday, September 18, 2006 5:10 PM Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Rotax Gordon, Rotax does not give dealers any real margin on the products so that's why the prices are pretty much the same everywhere you go. So basically find a dealer that's relatively close and has good service. I can vouch the folks @ Aeropropulsion just outside of Montreal, that's probably not too far from you. Their website is at http://www.rotaxservice.com/ Might I suggest the Warp Drive propeller for your plane. It's a perfect match for a 912 and smooth as silk. I've owned various props from both the US and Europe and they're one of the best if you want to have a North American prop. European props (DUC, Woodcomp, etc) are excellent as well however much more expensive (the DUC was superb). Also, ZAC has a new cowling and FWF kit of the 701 that was originally designed in Germany (http://www.zenithair.com/stolch701/7-engine.html). It's way nicer and better than the kit ZAC has been using over the years but I know others have had great experience with the CZAW FWF kit sold by SkyShops as well (http://www.skyshops.org/FIREWALLFOW.htm) . I've seen their cowl on the weekend and it makes a 701 look fantastic! I'm currently switching over to the CZAW cowl kit for my 601. Trev Page C-IDUS 601HD R912 On Sep 18, 2006, at 12:51 PM, Gordon wrote: I'm at the point were I need to order something that will make noise and spin a propeller. It's going to be a Rotax 912ULS and from what I can tell online, everyone seems to sell this engine for about the same price including Zenith. I was wondering if anyone had any advise for who to deal with. I've got to believe that some are better than others especially if I were to have a problem with the engine. I'm in Northern Vt. (no snow yet) so Canada may also be an option. Thanks, Gordon CH701 - The Zenith-List Email Forum class="Apple-converted-space"> --> http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Zenith-List - NEW MATRONICS WEB FORUMS - class="Apple-converted-space"> --> http://forums.matronics.com - NEW MATRONICS LIST WIKI - class="Apple-converted-space"> --> http://wiki.matronics.com - List Contribution Web Site - -Matt Dralle, List Admin. class="Apple-converted-space"> --> http://www.matronics.com/contribution ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "george may" <gfmjr_20(at)HOTMAIL.COM>
Subject: Rotax
Date: Sep 18, 2006
Gordon-- I've dealt with two differnt vendors. I purchased my 912uls from Lockwood in Florida since they are a known quantity and are excellent on support. I also have a Rotax 582 that I have had rebuilt twice by Light Engines in Ontario Canada. Also excellent service and was a great help in troublshooting some early issues. Wish there was a dealer in the northeast George May 601XL 912s >From: "Gordon" <cscsail(at)gmavt.net> >Reply-To: zenith-list(at)matronics.com >To: >Subject: Zenith-List: Rotax >Date: Mon, 18 Sep 2006 12:51:17 -0400 > >I'm at the point were I need to order something that will make noise and >spin a propeller. It's going to be a Rotax 912ULS and from what I can tell >online, everyone seems to sell this engine for about the same price >including Zenith. I was wondering if anyone had any advise for who to deal >with. I've got to believe that some are better than others especially if I >were to have a problem with the engine. I'm in Northern Vt. (no snow yet) >so Canada may also be an option. >Thanks, >Gordon >CH701 _________________________________________________________________ All-in-one security and maintenance for your PC. Get a free 90-day trial! http://clk.atdmt.com/MSN/go/msnnkwlo0050000001msn/direct/01/?href=http://www.windowsonecare.com/?sc_cid=msn_hotmail ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "george may" <gfmjr_20(at)HOTMAIL.COM>
Subject: Ballistic recovery chute in an XL
Date: Sep 18, 2006
Craig-- You might want to check out the Zenith factory in Atlanta that build the Light sport version of the zodiac. One of the options they have is the BRS. They mount it in front of the passenger under the instrument panel (ahead of the cg) George May 601XL 912s >From: "Craig Payne" <craig(at)craigandjean.com> >Reply-To: zenith-list(at)matronics.com >To: >Subject: Zenith-List: Ballistic recovery chute in an XL >Date: Sun, 17 Sep 2006 22:10:21 -0600 > > >I've been looking at the feasibility of installing a chute in an XL. The >way >I read the weight and balance numbers installing 28 to 30 pounds of gear at >the rear of the luggage platform would leave you with a plane with greatly >reduced usability - especially with two adults but no luggage. >Interestingly >the trouble come as fuel gets low - around 7 gallons with two FAA standard >170 lb adults. I'm basing my analysis on a spreadsheet that David X. sent >out on July 31st. > >Can anyone with experience installing a chute in an XL give me their >analysis? > >-- Craig > > _________________________________________________________________ Get today's hot entertainment gossip http://movies.msn.com/movies/hotgossip ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Craig Payne" <craig(at)craigandjean.com>
Subject: Ballistic recovery chute in an XL
Date: Sep 18, 2006
I asked BRS: "What is the weight of just the parachute & rocket package?" They replied: "That's most of the weight, probably 27 pounds." -- Craig ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Dave" <daberti(at)sbcglobal.net>
Subject: 601 XL Factory Kit for sale
Date: Sep 18, 2006
This was the last straw for me!!! I'm sure glad my plane is flying and wish the best to the sensible, polite, and courteous posters on the list as well as those with a sense of humor that can make light of the stress often encountered while we build our flying machines. Comments like the one below are best contemplated while over inhospitable terrain when the engine goes silent. PS Dump the 18 point font unless your blind too! Dave 601-HD 912ULS -----Original Message----- From: owner-zenith-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-zenith-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of Robert L. Stone Sent: Monday, September 18, 2006 10:03 AM To: zenith-list(at)matronics.com Subject: Re: Zenith-List: 601 XL Factory Kit for sale Don't you think it would be a good idea for you to mind your own god dam business. ----- Original Message ----- From: Robin Bellach To: zenith-list(at)matronics.com Sent: Sunday, September 17, 2006 8:43 PM Subject: Re: Zenith-List: 601 XL Factory Kit for sale Robert, Don't you think it might be a good idea to contact Jeff directly as he requested if your are interested in the 601XL kit that he described and indicated that he was open to offers on? ----- Original Message ----- From: Robert L. Stone To: zenith-list(at)matronics.com Sent: Sunday, September 17, 2006 8:07 PM Subject: Re: Zenith-List: 601 XL Factory Kit for sale Jeff, Don't you think it might be a good idea to tell us what you are selling and what price you have in mind????? ----- Original Message ----- From: Afterfxllc(at)aol.com To: zenith-list(at)matronics.com Sent: Sunday, September 17, 2006 4:18 PM Subject: Zenith-List: 601 XL Factory Kit for sale MAKE OFFER I hate to sell this but wife lost her medical and I have no choice. The tail is finished and primed inside and out with DuPont 2 part primer. The fush. is 80% complete and is also primed inside and out, it is on it's mains and has the dual stick option. The canopy is 60% complete on the fush. The wings haven't been started. I bought the landing light option and the wing baggage doors. I also got the strobe option. I have 2 corvair motors along with WW's books and tapes. Please contact me off line at 502-644-8123 Kit is located in Louisville Ky. Jeff ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Al Young" <armyret(at)mchsi.com>
Subject: Re: 601 Canopy Covers
Date: Sep 18, 2006
Bill- I'll get on the cover soon. Right now I am expecting to start painting within a week or so. So that might take precedence. I hope the transponder certification goes well. I'm still jealous!! Regards, Al ----- Original Message ----- From: JAPhillipsGA(at)aol.com To: zenith-list(at)matronics.com Sent: Sunday, September 17, 2006 9:52 AM Subject: Re: Zenith-List: 601 Canopy Covers Al, I'm sorry to hear your wife is still ill. Joy and I hope she recovers quickly. On the cover, sure sounds good to me. Ask him to make one, if you are satisfied I want one as well. I have to fly up to Griffin Tuesday to get the transponder certified. I plan on making some x-county flights this fall and winter. Best regards, Bill ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Dave Ruddiman" <pacificpainting(at)comcast.net>
Subject: Re: 801 Builders (I know you're out there)801 Builders (I
know y
Date: Sep 18, 2006
Larry, Is there a reason for the foam other than the oil canning? I suppose it helps on sound also. Is there a reason you can't use construction foam board. It does seem like a good idea. How about gluing the foam on before assembling? Just curious. I'm thinking about using metal fuel lines. Thought I would look through the archives for some information. If there are any pros or cons I won't find there, I would welcome any input. (as long as I agree with it) HA. Dave in Salem 801 ----- Original Message ----- From: "Larry Landucci" <lllanducci(at)tds.net> Sent: Saturday, September 16, 2006 9:41 AM Subject: Re: Zenith-List: 801 Builders (I know you're out there)801 Builders (I know y > > The empty weight (1310 lb) that I quoted for my 801 is one commonly > defined as the weight of the aircraft including unusable fuel (about 4-6 > gal), and full oil (12 qts). > The empty weight of the Zenith factory 801 is reasonable considering that > they have only two fuel tanks, no soundproofing/thermal insulation > surrounding the entire interior of the cabin as I do, and a lot simpler > (and lighter) instrument panel. > The one-inch thick closed-cell foam insulation from Wicks or Spruce is > quite heavy. In fact, in the forward floor I have a two inch layer > underneath a 1/8 inch masonite sheet and carpet over that. I did that > because my rubber fuel lines are routed underneath the "false" floor > through rigid PVC tubing on their way to my Andair fuel selector on a > center panel (an additional extra weight). > I also installed additional aluminum angles (diagonally) on both the top > and bottom rear fuselage to minimize "oil canning" during flight and glued > random scrap pieces of the 1" foam to the sides of the rear fuselage as > well to accomplish the same thing. I have about 160 hours on my 801 and so > far have not yet heard any sounds due to flexing of the aluminum skins > ("oil canning"). > So, with all this I think an extra 160 lbs doesn't seem too bad. > > > Larry Landucci -- N801LL > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Rotax
From: "N601RT" <N601RT(at)comcast.net>
Date: Sep 18, 2006
Gordon, I purchased my 912ULS from a small dealer who sold mostly two stroke Rotaxes. 20-20 hindsight is this could have been a mistake. I live in Oregon and now do most of my Rotax business with Lockwood. As already noted, most of the prices are very similar. I like Lockwood because: Phil Lockwood does Rotax seminars across the country. I find him personable, helpful and approachable. Lockwood has a free tech line. Lockwood seems to be a high volume Rotax dealer and has a good parts supply. They probably have fresh engines. I don't like Lockwood's return policy (something like 10% restocking fee for returns). I also don't like Lockwood's web page, which can be very difficult to navigate and can be slow. CPS is the closest dealer to me. Mike who runs CPS can be less than pleasant. In my experience, the people who answer CPS's phones are not as courteous or as knowledgeable as those at Lockwood. You may consider posting your question to the RotaxEngines-list that Matronics hosts. IF you were getting a Warp Drive prop, I was going to recommend NOT getting the nickel leading edge inlay. The inlay increases the rotational mass of the propeller so it may not remain within the Rotax specification. Regards, Roy N601RT: CH601HDS, nose gear, Rotax 912ULS, All electric, IFR equipped, 632hrs, 730 landings Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=62460#62460 ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: IO-360
From: "steveadams" <dr_steve_adams(at)yahoo.com>
Date: Sep 19, 2006
Another option if you are just interested in having fuel injection, not the extra horsepower, is looking at the XP-360 or other 360 clone. You can configure the engine with fuel injection, but the engine will fit the standard cowl. Steve Adams CH640 Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=62493#62493 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Dave Ruddiman" <pacificpainting(at)comcast.net>
Subject: Re: IO-360
Date: Sep 19, 2006
The XP360 is actually the engine I have been looking at. I guess I don't have enough information to know what questions to ask. Is the size difference in the engine or the fuel injection system? ----- Original Message ----- From: "steveadams" <dr_steve_adams(at)yahoo.com> Sent: Tuesday, September 19, 2006 6:04 AM Subject: Zenith-List: Re: IO-360 > > Another option if you are just interested in having fuel injection, not > the extra horsepower, is looking at the XP-360 or other 360 clone. You can > configure the engine with fuel injection, but the engine will fit the > standard cowl. > > Steve Adams > CH640 > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=62493#62493 > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "CH701" <701stol(at)gmail.com>
Subject: Treetop Flyer Video
Date: Sep 19, 2006
This is a must see video for any aviation enthusiast. <http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ij1qWr99qLE> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ij1qWr99qLE No need to respond or create a new thread - Just enjoy it (the music is perfect)! Todd Henning West Bend, WI Scratch 701 - WIP ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Sep 19, 2006
From: Rico Voss <vozzen(at)yahoo.com>
Subject: XL canopy issues
Greetings, Larry, I found your response in the archives, concerning the inside flashing of the canopy side rail. "Mark, I shortened the inside flashing so it rolls in before getting to the panel. " I'm at that point, but wondering how the air leakage is, from the gap in front of the fwd tube. There's no way of laying the inside flashing vertical (alongside the panel edge) if it wraps around the tube. I'm thinking of cutting (perhaps the top half) the inside flashing just fwd of the tube, then leaving the fwd part to run vertical above the side-rail frame. It's not really structural in front of the tube. Any thoughts? I looked thru your pictures -- fantastic web site -- I refer to it often. Many thanks, Richard V., XL/3300, Kansas City. ps--Ol Ray has about 12 hours on his HD/EA-81, but not without some engine probs. First problem (blowing oil-smoke) turns out was caused by over filling oil (oh, well..). Now he's got coolant showing inside the valve covers. Took heads off -- they check out OK. Still looking. Also is nose "heavy". He's adding a trimtab extension, for starters, before he messes with remounting stab. __________________________________________________ ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Sep 19, 2006
Subject: Re: 801 Builders (I know you're out there)
From: Larry Landucci <lllanducci(at)tds.net>
I don't think that substituting construction foam board for the closed-cell insulation/soundproofing foam would be a very good idea because: 1. It is certainly not FAA approved and would be a real problem in the rare case of a fire. The closed-cell foam meets or exceeds certain FAR standards for fire retardancy. 2. Construction foam is very light and rigid. I think that the flexibility and relatively high density of the closed-cell foam is the main reason for its effectiveness. 3. The closed-cell foam is very easy to apply with random dabs of contact cement even on curved surfaces. You want to be able to remove it to gain access to fuel lines, electrical wires, etc. 4. Another big plus of the closed-cell foam is that it is very easily cut with a pair of scissors, and also,since it is flexible it can be pushed into crevices and areas which would be very difficult to access with a rigid and brittle foam board. Larry Landucci -- N801LL ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Dave Ruddiman" <pacificpainting(at)comcast.net>
Subject: Re: 801 Builders (I know you're out there)
Date: Sep 19, 2006
THANKS, SOUNDS REASONABLE TO ME. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Larry Landucci" <lllanducci(at)tds.net> Sent: Tuesday, September 19, 2006 8:11 AM Subject: Re: Zenith-List: 801 Builders (I know you're out there) > > I don't think that substituting construction foam board for the > closed-cell insulation/soundproofing foam would be a very good idea > because: > > 1. It is certainly not FAA approved and would be a real problem in > the rare case of a fire. The closed-cell foam meets or exceeds certain > FAR standards for fire retardancy. > 2. Construction foam is very light and rigid. I think that the > flexibility and relatively high density of the closed-cell foam is the > main reason for its effectiveness. > 3. The closed-cell foam is very easy to apply with random dabs of > contact cement even on curved surfaces. You want to be able to remove > it to gain access to fuel lines, electrical > wires, etc. > 4. Another big plus of the closed-cell foam is that it is very easily > cut with a pair of scissors, and also,since it is flexible it can be > pushed into crevices and areas which would be > very difficult to access with a rigid and brittle foam board. > > Larry Landucci -- N801LL > > > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: 601 XL Factory Kit for sale
Date: Sep 19, 2006
From: crvsecretary(at)aol.com
Dave: I hope you will reconsider and stay on as an active member of this community. Inasmuch as I personally did not appreciate the venom in this thread, I hope we can all overlook it and move on in the spirit of comraderie and tolerance. Your ability to soar high over the morass of negativity on this list (as your response below shows) makes you a better man than I or most. Clear skies to you Tracy Smith Naugatuck, CT N458XL (reserved) working on wings -----Original Message----- From: daberti(at)sbcglobal.net Sent: Mon, 18 Sep 2006 9:54 PM Subject: RE: Zenith-List: 601 XL Factory Kit for sale This was the last straw for me!!! I'm sure glad my plane is flying and wish the best to the sensible, polite, and courteous posters on the list as well as those with a sense of humor that can make light of the stress often encountered while we build our flying machines. Comments like the one below are best contemplated while over inhospitable terrain when the engine goes silent. PS Dump the 18 point font unless your blind too! Dave 601-HD 912ULS -----Original Message----- From: owner-zenith-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-zenith-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of Robert L. Stone Sent: Monday, September 18, 2006 10:03 AM Subject: Re: Zenith-List: 601 XL Factory Kit for sale Don't you think it would be a good idea for you to mind your own god dam business. ----- Original Message ----- From: Robin Bellach Sent: Sunday, September 17, 2006 8:43 PM Subject: Re: Zenith-List: 601 XL Factory Kit for sale Robert, Don't you think it might be a good idea to contact Jeff directly as he requested if your are interested in the 601XL kit that he described and indicated that he was open to offers on? ----- Original Message ----- From: Robert L. Stone Sent: Sunday, September 17, 2006 8:07 PM Subject: Re: Zenith-List: 601 XL Factory Kit for sale Jeff, Don't you think it might be a good idea to tell us what you are selling and what price you have in mind????? ----- Original Message ----- From: Afterfxllc(at)aol.com Sent: Sunday, September 17, 2006 4:18 PM Subject: Zenith-List: 601 XL Factory Kit for sale MAKE OFFER I hate to sell this but wife lost her medical and I have no choice. The tail is finished and primed inside and out with DuPont 2 part primer. The fush. is 80% complete and is also primed inside and out, it is on it's mains and has the dual stick option. The canopy is 60% complete on the fush. The wings haven't been started. I bought the landing light option and the wing baggage doors. I also got the strobe option. I have 2 corvair motors along with WW's books and tapes. Please contact me off line at 502-644-8123 Kit is located in Louisville Ky. Jeff ________________________________________________________________________ Check out the new AOL. Most comprehensive set of free safety and security tools, free access to millions of high-quality videos from across the web, free AOL Mail and more. ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: IO-360
From: "steveadams" <dr_steve_adams(at)yahoo.com>
Date: Sep 19, 2006
This does get very confusing. When you say IO-360, most people think of the Lycoming which is a little wider and is 200 HP. It is not just an 0-360 with fuel injection. However, the XP-360 is basically the same engine whether you get it with a carb (0-360) or fuel injection (IO-360). Both have the same dimensions for the engine itself. Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=62543#62543 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Dave Ruddiman" <pacificpainting(at)comcast.net>
Subject: Re: IO-360
Date: Sep 19, 2006
That clears up a few more things. Thanks, Dave in Salem ----- Original Message ----- From: "steveadams" <dr_steve_adams(at)yahoo.com> Sent: Tuesday, September 19, 2006 9:49 AM Subject: Zenith-List: Re: IO-360 > > This does get very confusing. When you say IO-360, most people think of > the Lycoming which is a little wider and is 200 HP. It is not just an > 0-360 with fuel injection. However, the XP-360 is basically the same > engine whether you get it with a carb (0-360) or fuel injection (IO-360). > Both have the same dimensions for the engine itself. > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=62543#62543 > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Dave Ruddiman" <pacificpainting(at)comcast.net>
Subject: Re: 801 Builders (I know you're out there)801 Builders
(I know you're out there)
Date: Sep 19, 2006
Larry, How do you like the prop you have. What size is it? Dave in Salem ----- Original Message ----- From: "Larry Landucci" <lllanducci(at)tds.net> Sent: Friday, September 15, 2006 2:52 AM Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Re: 801 Builders (I know you're out there)801 Builders (I know you're out there) > > I have an O-360 Lycoming in my 801 with a metal cruise prop supplied by > Zenith and the aircraft is certainly NOT nose heavy as apparently some 801 > builders claim. > In fact, if I had to do it over again I would probably put the battery on > the firewall rather than under the seat to get more weight in the front > end. > My empty CG is 14.8 in (allowable range is between 12.8 and 22.4 in), and > I have the shorter horizontal tail. My empty weight is 1310 lbs (I have > the extended range fuel tanks) > It is not a big deal but with an empty CG closer to the forward limit you > would have a greater latitude in loading profiles. As it is, when I start > to load the back seat I sometimes will reach the aft CG limit before I > reach gross weight. > > Larry Landucci -- N801LL > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Jeff " <jeffrey_davidson(at)earthlink.net>
Subject: XL canopy issues
Date: Sep 19, 2006
FWIW I'm at the point where my canopy is almost finished too. One of the last things to do is to act on the decision I already made to cut the inside flashing just forward of the front tube. It rubs against the corner of the instrument panel. Even in the photo guide, the same problem is evident in the pictures. I'm thinking that a piece of rubber weather stripping on the vertical end of the inside flashing after cutting it would seal the gap with the panel. Just a thought. Jeff Davidson CH 601 HD w/XL Canopy RE: "Mark, I shortened the inside flashing so it rolls in before getting to the panel." ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Crowned rear wing ribs
From: "Ron Lendon" <rlendon(at)comcast.net>
Date: Sep 19, 2006
Group, I have made the rear wing ribs and after forming the flange on the lightening holes there is a little crown (8mm) in the ribs. It was removed on the first four ribs with the L angles. Should all the ribs get L angles? -------- Ron Lendon, Clinton Township, MI Corvair Zodiac XL, ScrapBuilder ;-) Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=62685#62685 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Afterfxllc(at)aol.com
Date: Sep 20, 2006
Subject: Pics of Zenith 601XL for sale
If the PICS don't come thru email me and I will send them to you. Here are some PICS of the kit I am selling. I would consider taking on a partner or finishing this project for someone with a $15,000.00 down payment. I have 2 corvair engines 1 has had the case cleaned and was checked and given the green light to use, the crank has been turned and is ready for nitron and safety shaft. My wife lost her medical ins. at work not her medical to fly sorry for not saying that. I can work with someone on payments with enough down. once again if you have any questions please call me at 502-644-8123 Jeff ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Afterfxllc(at)aol.com
Date: Sep 20, 2006
Subject: More pics
________________________________________________________________________________
From: Afterfxllc(at)AOL.COM
Date: Sep 20, 2006
Subject: More pics
________________________________________________________________________________
From: Afterfxllc(at)aol.com
Date: Sep 20, 2006
Subject: Still more pics
________________________________________________________________________________
From: Afterfxllc(at)aol.com
Date: Sep 20, 2006
Subject: Yet some more pics
________________________________________________________________________________
From: Afterfxllc(at)aol.com
Date: Sep 20, 2006
Subject: Ba De Ba De Ba De Ba De Dats all folks
________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Jonathan Starke" <jonathan(at)entry.co.za>
Subject: 601XL Flap settings
Date: Sep 20, 2006
Hi All, I now have 24hrs on my Zodiac XL. I have a problem, however, with the amount of flap I am able to set. I can only get about 17degrees of flap extension, before the bar that runs from the flap motor, to the flap actuator arm, touches the top of the compression strut, that the wings attach to. Has anyone else had this problem, and is the solution just to extend the arm length, so that the actuator rod from the motor is higher off the copression strut? I have plenty of place on the aux bar, the one with the micro switches on, to move the micro switches, so that is NOT a problem. What do you guys think? Thnx Jonathan P.S. Am loving every minute of the flying ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Daniel Dempsey" <leinad(at)hughes.net>
Subject: wheels/brakes for XL
Date: Sep 20, 2006
Listers, I noticed that in my drawings only the nose wheel is specified. There is nothing about the mains, or the brakes to use. What are you other scratch builders using? What comes with the kit for mains? Dan ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Gary Boothe" <gboothe(at)calply.com>
Subject: Crowned rear wing ribs
Date: Sep 20, 2006
A technique discussed in the Metal Working 101 DVD was to increase some of the crimps in the edge flanges using a crimping tool. Currently I am scratch building the center section and, though I have not done the rear ribs, yet, the technique worked on the nose ribs. Gary Boothe Cool, CA 601 HDSTD, WW Conversion Tail done, wings done, working on c-section -----Original Message----- From: owner-zenith-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-zenith-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Ron Lendon Sent: Tuesday, September 19, 2006 9:24 PM Subject: Zenith-List: Crowned rear wing ribs Group, I have made the rear wing ribs and after forming the flange on the lightening holes there is a little crown (8mm) in the ribs. It was removed on the first four ribs with the L angles. Should all the ribs get L angles? -------- Ron Lendon, Clinton Township, MI Corvair Zodiac XL, ScrapBuilder ;-)


September 05, 2006 - September 20, 2006

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