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      AGaMUALmkA96AFooAYVpVAFAAwzTT9KAFwB3HtTCM9SaAFLAdD+NC59fpQA4E+tLk0AGKNvvQAbf
      elpiDZ6c0fhQAje340n1/wD1UAIQO1MAoGTUdaRID3oPtQAm2lK+vFMCOa5RB87YrOa9uJji0jOO
      jSt0H0piLFrpManM7GV+u5ugP+ytXx9KBEUqY5UNnqMd6VLsNxMpx3PrSY0Kwx9xTjoT6UtABQPY
      fWkMCP8APpSCgYpI749zQDQAgJpwFABk+1H40AH4UUAGRSZoAKMHtQAo+tGRQAuRSMfQUAAY+lJk
      9/woGL9aCPekAE0n1oAQt6UZ96AF+tKBQAZFGaYCHH+NA/8A1UgGlvY0bh3/ACpgKB64paAA0Aig
      AA9aQ/X6UAFKPekAE0gY+lMBSab9frQAufSgj1oAafc0vTpj60ANqQY7UABpp9jQAc0qg0AGaBTA
      UH0NLTENHuKaxA9KQDc+9L+IoGf/2QAA
      
________________________________________________________________________________
Date: 
Apr 04, 2011
From: 
Harley <harley(at)AgelessWings.com>
Subject: 
Re: GPS antenna reception
      
      The link that Mike sent was too long and line wrapped...
      
      Here's the tinyurl link to it: http://tinyurl.com/3kamr3d
      Harley
      -----------------------------------------------------------------
      
      On 4/4/2011 3:13 PM, Mike Welch wrote:
      > > Mike,
      > >
      > > The below works well on my ship. I couldn't find a suitable 
      > shelf at
      > > Wal-Mart, so I made one.
      > >
      > > 
      > http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_hkAHk0Xu6wo/SHOnYZwaZwI/AAAAAAAAAZQ/RsdsLydOu7
      > > 0/s1600-h/IMG_1171.JPG
      > >
      > > Glenn E. Long
      >
      > Hi Glenn,
      >
      >   Your link for a photo didn't come in.  ??    I'm building a 
      > Kolb MkIII.  It has a VERRRY
      > long windscreen (approx 65").   (see old photo.....the plane is 
      > almost finished now)
      >   The intended location that I had planned for the GPS antenna 
      > was on top of my radio
      > console/instrument pod....at the forward portion, mounted on 
      > the pod's fiberglass cover.
      >   This location would place the antenna at an unobstructed 
      > spot, forward of my view.
      >
      >   Thanks to all the replied to my question!!
      >
      > Best regards,   Mike Welch
      
________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: 
Re: GPS antenna reception
Date: 
Apr 04, 2011
From: 
<longg(at)pjm.com>
      
      Mike,
      
      Very nice. I don't think you need to worry about reception in that
      thing. You'll probably need sunscreen though J
      
      Just tie the antenna around your leg. You'll be in great shape.
      
      The mail formatter thingy broke the link (see below). Just cobble it
      together as... 
      
      http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_hkAHk0Xu6wo/SHOnYZwaZwI/AAAAAAAAAZQ/RsdsLydOu7
      0/s1600-h/IMG_1171.JPG
      
      Hopefully that helps.
      
      Glenn E. Long
      
      From: owner-aeroelectric-list-server(at)matronics.com
      [mailto:owner-aeroelectric-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Mike
      Welch
      Sent: Monday, April 04, 2011 3:14 PM
      Subject: RE: AeroElectric-List: Re: GPS antenna reception
      
      > Mike,
      > 
      > The below works well on my ship. I couldn't find a suitable shelf at
      > Wal-Mart, so I made one.
      > 
      >
      http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_hkAHk0Xu6wo/SHOnYZwaZwI/AAAAAAAAAZQ/RsdsLydOu7
      > 0/s1600-h/IMG_1171.JPG
      > 
      > Glenn E. Long
      
      Hi Glenn,
      
        Your link for a photo didn't come in.  ??    I'm building a Kolb
      MkIII.  It has a VERRRY
      long windscreen (approx 65").   (see old photo.....the plane is almost
      finished now)
        The intended location that I had planned for the GPS antenna was on
      top of my radio
      console/instrument pod....at the forward portion, mounted on the pod's
      fiberglass cover.
        This location would place the antenna at an unobstructed spot, forward
      of my view.
      
        Thanks to all the replied to my question!!
      
      Best regards,   Mike Welch
      
________________________________________________________________________________
From: 
"Jerald Folkerts" <jfolkerts1(at)gmail.com>
Subject: 
Position Light Questions
Date: 
Apr 05, 2011
      
      At Sun-N-Fun, I purchased drop in replacement LED Bulbs for position lights
      from PSA Enterprises.  No problem, I'm committed to using them for my SR2500
      Super Rebel day/night VFR objective.  Next, I went to the Parts Mart and
      purchased what appeared to be three good Grimes position lights, the
      teardrop shape for the red and green, and a typical tail assembly.  This
      year, many of the things were vacuum packed and you couldn't look at them
      closely.  When I got home, one of them, had no internal parts for the bulb
      to clip in, as if someone had removed the guts.  On the other two, the
      internals are there, but no wiring.  That said, the cases are in excellent
      condition as are the lenses.  So, how do I fix them?
      
      
      Question 1:  How would I wire to the two that have all the internals, but no
      wires?
      
      
      Question 2:  What are my options for the one without internals absent
      purchasing another?
      
      
      Question 3:  Will I need the AEC9051 Series High Intensity LED Driver Kits
      for each light?
      
      
      In addition, I also purchased two LED landing lights from Whelen, and found
      some nice mounts at the Parts Mart.  Will I need the Driver kits for them as
      well?
      
      
      Thanks,
      Jerry Folkerts
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
Date: 
Apr 05, 2011
Subject: 
Re: Position Light Questions
From: 
Jared Yates <email(at)jaredyates.com>
      
      Regarding number 3, my understanding of the PSA units is that they are read
      y
      for system voltage as-is.  I just put them into the socket that my
      incandescent bulbs came out of.
      
      On Tue, Apr 5, 2011 at 5:19 PM, Jerald Folkerts wrote
      :
      
      > At Sun-N-Fun, I purchased drop in replacement LED Bulbs for position ligh
      ts
      > from PSA Enterprises.  No problem, I=92m committed to using them for my S
      R2500
      > Super Rebel day/night VFR objective.  Next, I went to the Parts Mart and
      > purchased what appeared to be three good Grimes position lights, the
      > teardrop shape for the red and green, and a typical tail assembly.  This
      > year, many of the things were vacuum packed and you couldn=92t look at th
      em
      > closely.  When I got home, one of them, had no internal parts for the bul
      b
      > to clip in, as if someone had removed the guts.  On the other two, the
      > internals are there, but no wiring.  That said, the cases are in excellen
      t
      > condition as are the lenses.  So, how do I fix them?
      >
      >
      > Question 1:  How would I wire to the two that have all the internals, but
      > no wires?
      >
      >
      > Question 2:  What are my options for the one without internals absent
      > purchasing another?
      >
      >
      > Question 3:  Will I need the AEC9051 Series High Intensity LED Driver Kit
      s
      > for each light?
      >
      >
      > In addition, I also purchased two LED landing lights from Whelen, and fou
      nd
      > some nice mounts at the Parts Mart.  Will I need the Driver kits for them
       as
      > well?
      >
      >
      > Thanks,
      > Jerry Folkerts
      >
      > * *
      >
      >
      > *
      >
      ===========
      ===========
      ===========
      ===========
      > *
      >
      >
      
________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: 
Re: model airplane servo
From: 
"user9253" <fran4sew(at)banyanol.com>
Date: 
Apr 06, 2011
      
      
      There is an article by Paul Dye on page 63 of the May 2011 issue of Kitplanes Magazine
      about using a Firgelli PQ12 linear actuator for aileron trim on an RV-3.
      The data sheet for this actuator is located here:
      http://www.firgelli.com/pdf/PQ12_datasheet.pdf
      It can be purchased here:
      http://store.firgelli.com/pq12-linear-actuato12.html
      It seems that it is available with either limit switches or a feedback pot but
      not both.  Although the limit switch model does have an output that will light
      an LED when the limits are reached.  Weight of the actuator is 15 grams.
      Joe
      
      --------
      Joe Gores
      
      
      Read this topic online here:
      
      http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=336273#336273
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
Date: 
Apr 06, 2011
From: 
Tim Andres <tim2542(at)sbcglobal.net>
Subject: 
Re: model airplane servo
      
      
      On 4/6/2011 7:17 AM, user9253 wrote:
      > -->  AeroElectric-List message posted by: "user9253"
      >
      > There is an article by Paul Dye on page 63 of the May 2011 issue of Kitplanes
      Magazine about using a Firgelli PQ12 linear actuator for aileron trim on an RV-3.
      The data sheet for this actuator is located here:
      > http://www.firgelli.com/pdf/PQ12_datasheet.pdf
      > It can be purchased here:
      > http://store.firgelli.com/pq12-linear-actuato12.html
      > It seems that it is available with either limit switches or a feedback pot but
      not both.  Although the limit switch model does have an output that will light
      an LED when the limits are reached.  Weight of the actuator is 15 grams.
      > Joe
      >
      > --------
      > Joe Gores
      >
      >
      > Hi Joe; I'm using the Figelli L12-30-210-12-S actuator for the roll trim on my Cozy. Have not installed it yet, but it looks like it will do the job just fine although it looks a bit bigger than the one Paul used. It's small enough to mount in the wing root on my plane.http://www.firgelli.com/pdf/L12_datasheet.pdf
      Tim Andres
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
From: 
"Vern Little" <sprocket@vx-aviation.com>
Subject: 
Re: model airplane servo
Date: 
Apr 06, 2011
      
      
      I have a visit scheduled for tomorrow at the Firgelli facility.  I have 
      developed a rudder trim system using one of their servos.  I'm going to take 
      some pics and interview the principal of the company, with the aim of 
      productizing their devices for our market.  I've learned a few things along 
      the way that may be useful for them.
      
      Thanks
      Vern Little
      Vx Aviation
      
      -----Original Message----- 
      From: user9253
      Sent: Wednesday, April 06, 2011 7:17 AM
      Subject: AeroElectric-List: Re: model airplane servo
      
      
      There is an article by Paul Dye on page 63 of the May 2011 issue of 
      Kitplanes Magazine about using a Firgelli PQ12 linear actuator for aileron 
      trim on an RV-3.  The data sheet for this actuator is located here:
      http://www.firgelli.com/pdf/PQ12_datasheet.pdf
      It can be purchased here:
      http://store.firgelli.com/pq12-linear-actuato12.html
      It seems that it is available with either limit switches or a feedback pot 
      but not both.  Although the limit switch model does have an output that will 
      light an LED when the limits are reached.  Weight of the actuator is 15 
      grams.
      Joe
      
      --------
      Joe Gores
      
      
      Read this topic online here:
      
      http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=336273#336273
      
      
      -----
      No virus found in this message.
      Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
Date: 
Apr 06, 2011
From: 
Paul Millner <paulmillner(at)compuserve.com>
Subject: 
Faston connector for Ford-style regulator?
      
      
      I've got the Ford-style regulator that Cessna and others used for many 
      years.  The four Faston-style connectors enter through a common plug 
      body, and are retained in that body by a small clip on the bottom of the 
      Faston.
      
      Where do I buy that style of Faston connector, with the small clip?  
      I've replaced two, now, as wires have worn, etc. with standard Fastons, 
      but then, the wires come loose when the regulator is unplugged (which is 
      necessary to remove my intercooler plumbing, a long story...)
      
      Thanks in advance for the help!
      
      Paul
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
Date: 
Apr 06, 2011
From: 
"Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <nuckolls.bob(at)aeroelectric.com>
Subject: 
Re: Faston connector for Ford-style   regulator?
      
      
      At 02:29 PM 4/6/2011, you wrote:
      >
      >
      >I've got the Ford-style regulator that Cessna and others used for 
      >many years.  The four Faston-style connectors enter through a common 
      >plug body, and are retained in that body by a small clip on the 
      >bottom of the Faston.
      >
      >Where do I buy that style of Faston connector, with the small clip?
      >I've replaced two, now, as wires have worn, etc. with standard 
      >Fastons, but then, the wires come loose when the regulator is 
      >unplugged (which is necessary to remove my intercooler plumbing, a 
      >long story...)
      >
      >Thanks in advance for the help!
      
          I've been installing these regulators with individual
          .25" fast-ons on wires.
      
          Individual fast-ons with the retainer barb are pretty
          hard to come by in small quantities. If you wanted a
          reel of 10,000 . . .
      
          The auto-parts stores will sell you a replacement
          connector module. These tend to be populated with
          fast-on females that are un-plated brass of unknown
          pedigree. The AMP PIDG fast-ons are pretty hard
          and hold their grip well over time.
      
          The replacement connector populated with terminals
          will have pendant wires that need to be spliced into
          your ship's harness. But if you have your heart set
          on using this connector, here is one of many sources:
      
      http://terminalsupplyco.com/Store/Product.aspx?pc=170
      
          I recollection serves me well, B&C used to stock these
          terminals for use in housings that mate with the rear
          connector on their alternators. You might be able to
          get a small quantity of terminals from them.
      
      
         Bob . . . 
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: 
Re: Faston connector for Ford-style regulator?
From: 
"racerjerry" <gki(at)suffolk.lib.ny.us>
Date: 
Apr 07, 2011
      
      
      Take a look at Motormite / Dorman p/n 85842 which should be available at most any
      auto parts store.  I have in my notes that this connector fit the Ford regulator
      on my 1969  C-172K perfectly.
      
      --------
      Jerry King
      
      
      Read this topic online here:
      
      http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=336342#336342
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
From: 
"JOHN TIPTON" <jmtipton(at)btopenworld.com>
Subject: 
Duel engines gauges
Date: 
Apr 07, 2011
      
      Hi
      
      If I use a duel CHT gauge and a duel EGT gauge (i.e. both are two needle 
      instruments), would properly configured 'double pole changeover' switch 
      work, to monitor the front 2 cylinders , or the rear 2 cylinders
      
      Regards
      
      John 
      
________________________________________________________________________________
Date: 
Apr 07, 2011
From: 
Henador Titzoff <henador_titzoff(at)yahoo.com>
Subject: 
Re: Duel engines gauges
      
      John
      Sounds like these gauges intend on fighting it out! :)
      
      Henador Titzoff
      
      --- On Thu, 4/7/11, JOHN TIPTON  wrote:
      
      From: JOHN TIPTON <jmtipton(at)btopenworld.com>
      Subject: AeroElectric-List: Duel engines gauges
      Date: Thursday, April 7, 2011, 1:58 PM
      
      =0A=0A =0A =0A=0A=0A =0AHi=0A-=0AIf I use a duel CHT gauge and a duel EGT
       gauge =0A(i.e. both are two needle instruments), would properly configured
       'double pole =0Achangeover' switch work,-to monitor the front 2 cylinder
      s ,-or =0Athe-rear 2 cylinders=0A-=0ARegards=0A-=0AJohn =0A=0A=0A
      =======================0A=0A
      
________________________________________________________________________________
From: 
"dougshep(at)netzero.com" <dougshep(at)NetZero.com>
Date: 
Apr 08, 2011
Subject: 
Contactors
      
      
      What are the disadvantages in using the B&C S701-1Continuous Duty Contactor in
      place of the S702-1intermittant duty starter contactor, in a engine start application?
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
Date: 
Apr 07, 2011
From: 
"Richard E. Tasker" <retasker(at)optonline.net>
Subject: 
Re: Contactors
      
      
      Unless I am mistaken the S701 can CARRY the starting current but is not 
      designed to make or break (close or open) with the high starting 
      current.  The S702 is specifically designed to make or break with the 
      high starting current.
      
      Dick Tasker
      
      dougshep(at)netzero.com wrote:
      > -->  AeroElectric-List message posted by: "dougshep(at)netzero.com"
      >
      > What are the disadvantages in using the B&C S701-1Continuous Duty Contactor in
      place of the S702-1intermittant duty starter contactor, in a engine start application?
      >
      >
      >    
      
      -- 
      Please Note:
      No trees were destroyed in the sending of this message.  We do concede, however,
      that a significant number of electrons may have been temporarily inconvenienced.
      --
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
From: 
"Robert Taylor" <Flydad57(at)neo.rr.com>
Subject: 
Re: Contactors
Date: 
Apr 08, 2011
      
      
      Cost.
      
      Bob Taylor
      TigerCub N657RT
      
      --------------------------------------------------
      From: <dougshep(at)netzero.com>
      Sent: Thursday, April 07, 2011 9:47 PM
      Subject: AeroElectric-List: Contactors
      
      > 
      >
      > What are the disadvantages in using the B&C S701-1Continuous Duty 
      > Contactor in place of the S702-1intermittant duty starter contactor, in a 
      > engine start application?
      >
      >
      > 
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
Date: 
Apr 08, 2011
From: 
"Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <nuckolls.bob(at)aeroelectric.com>
Subject: 
Re: Duel engines gauges
      
      At 04:58 PM 4/7/2011, you wrote:
      >Hi
      >
      >If I use a duel CHT gauge and a duel EGT gauge (i.e. both are two 
      >needle instruments), would properly configured 'double pole 
      >changeover' switch work, to monitor the front 2 cylinders , or the 
      >rear 2 cylinders
      
      
          I presume we're talking about thermocouple
          instruments. You can do as you've proposed.
          Just make sure each thermocouple pathway
          gets the same 'pollution' of parasitic
          thermocouples so that their effects cancel
          each other. Review chapter on temperature
          measurement in the 'Connection.
      
      
         Bob . . . 
      
________________________________________________________________________________
Date: 
Apr 08, 2011
From: 
"Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <nuckolls.bob(at)aeroelectric.com>
Subject: 
Re: Contactors
      
      
      At 11:38 PM 4/7/2011, you wrote:
      >
      >
      >Unless I am mistaken the S701 can CARRY the starting current but is 
      >not designed to make or break (close or open) with the high starting 
      >current.  The S702 is specifically designed to make or break with 
      >the high starting current.
      
          Right on . . . The S701 draws just under 1A of
          current, is designed for continuous duty operations
          and is rated to SWITCH only 70A. It has relatively
          large area, lower pressure contacts.
      
      http://www.aeroelectric.com/Pictures/Contactors/S701-1b.jpg
      
      
          The S702 draws 3-5A, gets destructively hot if you
          leave it on too long and is rated to SWITCH hundreds
          of amps. It features low area, high pressure contacts
      
      http://www.aeroelectric.com/Pictures/Contactors/S702-1a.jpg
      
          They are entirely different breeds of cat crafted
          for specific applications.
      
          Having said all that, know that a contactor, relay or
          switch that is CONTROLLING currents many times the rated
          value WILL perform to some level. In fact, you may
          well achieve 'satisfactory performance' from an S701-style
          contactor in a starter control application. It's service
          life would be reduced to maybe 1-10% of rated . . . but
          if that number is still 500-1000 cranking events . . .
          how might it matter to you?
      
          Bottom line is that using the S701 in this manner is
          simply not the-best-we-know-how-to-do with components
          having similar costs. Further, it is not a recipe for
          disaster or even severe spikes in cost-of-ownership. So
          if you're willing to experiment, then let us know how
          it works out.
      
      
         Bob . . .  
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
Date: 
Apr 08, 2011
From: 
"Richard E. Tasker" <retasker(at)optonline.net>
Subject: 
Re: Contactors
      
      
      While I have no experience using one as a starter contactor, I think I 
      might be concerned that the S701 contacts could end up welded together 
      if the return spring is not heavy enough (depending on the particular 
      starter and engine combination).
      
      Dick Tasker
      
      Robert L. Nuckolls, III wrote:
      > 
      >
      > At 11:38 PM 4/7/2011, you wrote:
      >> 
      >>
      >> Unless I am mistaken the S701 can CARRY the starting current but is 
      >> not designed to make or break (close or open) with the high starting 
      >> current.  The S702 is specifically designed to make or break with the 
      >> high starting current.
      >
      >    Right on . . . The S701 draws just under 1A of
      >    current, is designed for continuous duty operations
      >    and is rated to SWITCH only 70A. It has relatively
      >    large area, lower pressure contacts.
      >
      > http://www.aeroelectric.com/Pictures/Contactors/S701-1b.jpg
      >
      >
      >    The S702 draws 3-5A, gets destructively hot if you
      >    leave it on too long and is rated to SWITCH hundreds
      >    of amps. It features low area, high pressure contacts
      >
      > http://www.aeroelectric.com/Pictures/Contactors/S702-1a.jpg
      >
      >    They are entirely different breeds of cat crafted
      >    for specific applications.
      >
      >    Having said all that, know that a contactor, relay or
      >    switch that is CONTROLLING currents many times the rated
      >    value WILL perform to some level. In fact, you may
      >    well achieve 'satisfactory performance' from an S701-style
      >    contactor in a starter control application. It's service
      >    life would be reduced to maybe 1-10% of rated . . . but
      >    if that number is still 500-1000 cranking events . . .
      >    how might it matter to you?
      >
      >    Bottom line is that using the S701 in this manner is
      >    simply not the-best-we-know-how-to-do with components
      >    having similar costs. Further, it is not a recipe for
      >    disaster or even severe spikes in cost-of-ownership. So
      >    if you're willing to experiment, then let us know how
      >    it works out.
      >
      >
      >   Bob . . .
      >
      >
      
      -- 
      Please Note:
      No trees were destroyed in the sending of this message.  We do concede, however,
      that a significant number of electrons may have been temporarily inconvenienced.
      --
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
Date: 
Apr 08, 2011
From: 
"Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <nuckolls.bob(at)aeroelectric.com>
Subject: 
Re: Contactors
      
      
      At 12:58 PM 4/8/2011, you wrote:
      >
      >
      >While I have no experience using one as a starter contactor, I think 
      >I might be concerned that the S701 contacts could end up welded 
      >together if the return spring is not heavy enough (depending on the 
      >particular starter and engine combination).
      
          A perceptive concern sir!
      
      
         Bob . . . 
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
From: 
"JOHN TIPTON" <jmtipton(at)btopenworld.com>
Subject: 
Re: Duel engines gauges
Date: 
Apr 09, 2011
      
      Bob
      
      Thank you
      
      John
        ----- Original Message ----- 
        From: Robert L. Nuckolls, III 
        To: aeroelectric-list(at)matronics.com 
        Sent: Friday, April 08, 2011 1:29 PM
        Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Duel engines gauges
      
      
        At 04:58 PM 4/7/2011, you wrote:
      
          Hi
           
          If I use a duel CHT gauge and a duel EGT gauge (i.e. both are two 
      needle instruments), would properly configured 'double pole changeover' 
      switch work, to monitor the front 2 cylinders , or the rear 2 cylinders
      
      
           I presume we're talking about thermocouple
           instruments. You can do as you've proposed.
           Just make sure each thermocouple pathway
           gets the same 'pollution' of parasitic
           thermocouples so that their effects cancel
           each other. Review chapter on temperature
           measurement in the 'Connection.
      
      
          Bob . . . 
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
From: 
Fergus Kyle <VE3LVO(at)rac.ca>
Subject: 
small GPS receiver
Date: 
Apr 09, 2011
      
      This may not be the ideal forum for my topic, but I try harder:
      The Europa instrument panel is a bit more than normal half-size for the
      dials I want to include. For this reason, I have Dynon EFIS D-100 / EMS-D10
      combo and want to add a GPS source to the former.
      I see the recommended list of admissible GPS's from Dynon but none possesses
      the attributes of small size to acquiesce to my needs, as above.
      The D-100 needs are for the following GPS sentences:
      $GPRMC
      $GPRMB,
      $GPGGA, and either
      $GPBOD or $GPAPB.
      I have tried BU303 and TinyTrak3 but neither satisfies the above list, as
      $GPRMB seems unpopular with miniature receivers.
      MY QUEST: A small receiver [Lord knows there are small enough models now]
      which provides the menu above but is not a full-size panel mount model.
      Can you provide any sources meeting this stupid need?
      Forever grateful
      Ferg Kyle
      Europa monowheel 914, CS prop, wiring ,wiring
      
________________________________________________________________________________
From: 
Daniel Hooper <enginerdy(at)gmail.com>
Subject: 
Re: small GPS receiver
Date: 
Apr 09, 2011
      
      The reason GPRMB is not common on interface-less GPSs is due to the 
      message content.
      Check it out: http://home.mira.net/~gnb/gps/nmea.html#gprmb
      
      GPRMB provides information about your current position in relation to 
      your next waypoint. To my knowledge, you cannot set waypoints in the 
      TinyTrak3 GPS without (at least) doing some code writing.
      
      I would guess that the D-100 doesn't *need* it, but it will never 
      provide navigation information without it. You need a GPS with an 
      interface that allows the setting of waypoints.
      
      --Daniel
      
      On Apr 9, 2011, at 10:34 AM, Fergus Kyle wrote:
      
      > This may not be the ideal forum for my topic, but I try harder:
      > 
      > The Europa instrument panel is a bit more than normal half-size for 
      the dials I want to include. For this reason, I have Dynon EFIS D-100 / 
      EMS-D10 combo and want to add a GPS source to the former.
      > 
      > I see the recommended list of admissible GPS=92s from Dynon but none 
      possesses the attributes of small size to acquiesce to my needs, as 
      above.
      > 
      > The D-100 needs are for the following GPS sentences:
      > 
      > $GPRMC
      > 
      > $GPRMB,
      > 
      > $GPGGA, and either
      > 
      > $GPBOD or $GPAPB.
      > 
      > I have tried BU303 and TinyTrak3 but neither satisfies the above list, 
      as $GPRMB seems unpopular with miniature receivers.
      > 
      > MY QUEST: A small receiver [Lord knows there are small enough models 
      now] which provides the menu above but is not a full-size panel mount 
      model.
      > 
      > Can you provide any sources meeting this stupid need?
      > 
      > Forever grateful
      > 
      > Ferg Kyle
      > 
      > Europa monowheel 914, CS prop, wiring ,wiring
      > 
      > 
      > 
      > 
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
Date: 
Apr 09, 2011
Subject: 
AEC9004
From: 
Bill Boyd <sportav8r(at)gmail.com>
      
      Bob - how's it coming?  Two years after revision 12 hit the press, we're
      still waiting  :-)     I know we can soldier on with the interim drawing,
      but wondered if the IR alternator controller was ready to be born.
      
      Bill B.
      
________________________________________________________________________________
Date: 
Apr 10, 2011
From: 
Harley <harley(at)AgelessWings.com>
Subject: 
Brock Carburetor Heat Valve
      
      All...
      
      Since I now have a ram air box with a built in carburetor heat 
      valve, I won't be installing the Ken Brock carb heat valve that I 
      had previously purchased for my Long EZ.
      
      So, I have it on eBay right now for the next ten days. Never used 
      or installed, like new, no reserve, with the 3 page installation 
      plans.  The same unit (Brock/Rutan part number VECHVA) is 
      currently being sold on Aircraft Spruce for $115 (Aircraft Spruce 
      number 01-00845).
      
      Since it mounts on the firewall, with air hoses to the 
      carburetor, it is not specific to any engine or plane and is 
      currently being used with many four cylinder engines, both 
      tractor and pusher, on hundreds of Long-EZs, Variezes, Cozy's and 
      so forth.
      
      Also included are plans to construct a cabin heat valve.
      
      You can see it here:
      http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=350454427697
      
      In case the above link wraps, here's it's tinyurl:
      http://tinyurl.com/3qwpp2h
      
      Harley
      
________________________________________________________________________________
From: 
"B Tomm" <fvalarm(at)rapidnet.net>
Subject: 
avionics ground question
Date: 
Apr 10, 2011
      
      Basically I'm using a single point pass-through ground on the firewall.
      However, I also have a forest of tabs for an avionics ground (for
      convenience) located nearby which will be connected to the main ground with
      either 5 awg20 ala Bob's drawings or a single 12awg wire.  The aircraft is
      an RV7 so the avionics ground will be bolted to a metal structure.  This
      mounting method will naturally provide a secondary ground path back to the
      single point ground.  
      
      My question is should this avionics ground be insulated from the metal
      structure that it's bolted to, to eliminate a possible ground loop or at
      least to ensure that the electrons find their way back to the single point
      ground via the intended wire rather than some willy nilly path through the
      structure?  or does it matter?
      
      Bevan
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
From: 
"B Tomm" <fvalarm(at)rapidnet.net>
Subject: 
heavy wire question
Date: 
Apr 10, 2011
      
      Think Z-13 here but other architectures probably apply.
      
      The battery is connected to the contactor in this case with a 2awg wire.
      The battery is also connected directly to the battery buss with a much
      smaller wire, say 14awg.  
      
      What is the best practical way to connect two wires to the same terminal of
      the contactor?  Two crimp connectors (ring terminal) do not seem to fit well
      together on the terminal ( I want the terminals covered with those silicone
      boots too).  I would like to crimp the two wires inside the same crimp
      terminal but they won't both fit.  Should I cut some of the strands off the
      larger wire to make room for the smaller wire?  The next size crimp
      connector looks a little bit too large to accommodate both wires but I could
      "over-crimp" until they are very snug but the connector looks a little
      mashed. Which is the best way to connect two dissimilar sized wires to the
      same terminal?
      
      I have a similar application on the "out" side of the contactor where a 6awg
      wire is to connect with a 2awg wire on the same terminal.  Looking for a
      reliable, simple and elegant solution.
      
      Thanks.
      
      Bevan
      
________________________________________________________________________________
Date: 
Apr 10, 2011
From: 
"Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <nuckolls.bob(at)aeroelectric.com>
Subject: 
Re: avionics ground question
      
      At 01:30 PM 4/10/2011, you wrote:
      >Basically I'm using a single point pass-through ground on the 
      >firewall.  However, I also have a forest of tabs for an avionics 
      >ground (for convenience) located nearby which will be connected to 
      >the main ground with either 5 awg20 ala Bob's drawings or a single 
      >12awg wire.  The aircraft is an RV7 so the avionics ground will be 
      >bolted to a metal structure.  This mounting method will naturally 
      >provide a secondary ground path back to the single point ground.
      >
      >My question is should this avionics ground be insulated from the 
      >metal structure that it's bolted to, to eliminate a possible ground 
      >loop or at least to ensure that the electrons find their way back to 
      >the single point ground via the intended wire rather than some willy 
      >nilly path through the structure?  or does it matter?
      
          This isn't so much a matter of 'wiring' as it is
          a matter of locations. A panel ground bus is located
          on the panel with the closest practical proximity to
          the potential victims of ground induced noises.
      
          Have all potential victims share a single ground
          point with other non-antagonists on the panel
          is a prophylactic against ground loops. When
          all roads lead straight to Rome, there are no
          shortcuts for unwelcome noise coupling events
          to form up. It doesn't matter how THAT ground
          point gets grounded, its a matter of WHO USES
          that ground point.
      
          The 37-pin panel ground bus we offer is insulated
          from local ground . . . but it's not necessary
          that it BE isolated.
      
      
         Bob . . . 
      
________________________________________________________________________________
Date: 
Apr 10, 2011
From: 
Charlie England <ceengland(at)bellsouth.net>
Subject: 
Re: heavy wire question
      
      On 4/10/2011 12:43 PM, B Tomm wrote:
      > Think Z-13 here but other architectures probably apply.
      > The battery is connected to the contactor in this case with a 2awg 
      > wire.  The battery is also connected directly to the battery buss with 
      > a much smaller wire, say 14awg.
      > What is the best practical way to connect two wires to the same 
      > terminal of the contactor?  Two crimp connectors (ring terminal) do 
      > not seem to fit well together on the terminal ( I want the terminals 
      > covered with those silicone boots too).  I would like to crimp the two 
      > wires inside the same crimp terminal but they won't both fit.  Should 
      > I cut some of the strands off the larger wire to make room for the 
      > smaller wire?  The next size crimp connector looks a little bit too 
      > large to accommodate both wires but I could "over-crimp" until they 
      > are very snug but the connector looks a little mashed. Which is the 
      > best way to connect two dissimilar sized wires to the same terminal?
      > I have a similar application on the "out" side of the contactor where 
      > a 6awg wire is to connect with a 2awg wire on the same terminal.  
      > Looking for a reliable, simple and elegant solution.
      > Thanks.
      > Bevan
      If you crimp both in the next larger connector, you can fill the 
      next-larger connector with scrap wire(s) before crimping, then clip off 
      the excess scrap. Avoids reducing the current capacity of the larger 
      wire, & enables a 'normal' crimp.
      
      Charlie
      
________________________________________________________________________________
Date: 
Apr 10, 2011
From: 
"Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <nuckolls.bob(at)aeroelectric.com>
Subject: 
Re: heavy wire question
      
      At 01:43 PM 4/10/2011, you wrote:
      >Think Z-13 here but other architectures probably apply.
      >
      >The battery is connected to the contactor in this case with a 2awg 
      >wire.  The battery is also connected directly to the battery buss 
      >with a much smaller wire, say 14awg.
      >
      >What is the best practical way to connect two wires to the same 
      >terminal of the contactor?  Two crimp connectors (ring terminal) do 
      >not seem to fit well together on the terminal ( I want the terminals 
      >covered with those silicone boots too).  I would like to crimp the 
      >two wires inside the same crimp terminal but they won't both 
      >fit.  Should I cut some of the strands off the larger wire to make 
      >room for the smaller wire?  The next size crimp connector looks a 
      >little bit too large to accommodate both wires but I could 
      >"over-crimp" until they are very snug but the connector looks a 
      >little mashed. Which is the best way to connect two dissimilar sized 
      >wires to the same terminal?
      >
      >I have a similar application on the "out" side of the contactor 
      >where a 6awg wire is to connect with a 2awg wire on the same 
      >terminal.  Looking for a reliable, simple and elegant solution.
      
         Using contactors with longer studs is the
         general fix. When I was selling the S701-1
      Emacs!
      
      
         I shipped it with thin, brass top-nuts but even with the
         standard nut, the RBM/Stancor part had a longer stud
         than the Cole-Hersey parts . . . and would generally
         take up to 3 terminals.
      
         Contactor posts are indeed preferred fan out
         points for distribution of power but dealing with
         the short studs on some contactors is problematic.
      
         If push comes to shove, you can replace the bottom
         nut with a thin "jam nut" and get some more exposed
         stud. This is less risky with modern versions of
         these parts.
      Emacs!
      
      
          The internal contact surface is held in better alignment
          by bosses on the molded insulator. I may have a quantity of these
          nuts left over from those times. I'll dig around in the
          moving boxes as yet unpacked.
      
      
         Bob . . . 
      
________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: 
Which Diode part number to use for dual power feed?
From: 
"plevyakh" <hplevyak(at)mac.com>
Date: 
Apr 11, 2011
      
      
      Guys,
      Can someone point me to the right type and part no. of Diode to use in a circuit
      providing a dual power feed to a single piece of equipment?
      
      I have an EIS4000 that has a single power input.  I'd like to provide both E-bus
      power and an Aux Batt power feed to it.
      
      I don't want the E-bus power backfeeding into my Aux Batt.
      
      Thanks,
      Howard
      
      --------
      Howard Plevyak
      GlaStar / North Bend, Ohio
      hplevyak(at)mac.com
      
      
      Read this topic online here:
      
      http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=336650#336650
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
Date: 
Apr 11, 2011
From: 
"Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <nuckolls.bob(at)aeroelectric.com>
Subject: 
Re: Which Diode part number to use for dual   power
      feed?
      
      At 01:55 PM 4/11/2011, you wrote:
      >
      >Guys,
      >Can someone point me to the right type and part no. of Diode to use 
      >in a circuit providing a dual power feed to a single piece of equipment?
      >
      >I have an EIS4000 that has a single power input.  I'd like to 
      >provide both E-bus power and an Aux Batt power feed to it.
      >
      >I don't want the E-bus power backfeeding into my Aux Batt.
      
           What does the architecture of your ship's
           power system look like? How many sources
           of power are available to run the EIS4000
           before you added another battery?
      
           Finally, what's the driving concerns making
           supplying an engine monitoring system with 'last-
           ditch' power?  I'm unaware of any incident where
           a plane/pilot experienced an unhappy day because
           the pilot was unable to know oil pressure or any
           other parameter unique to engine operations.
      
           I've brought airplanes home with broken tach
           cables because I KNEW that redline could not
           be exceeded on that particular airplane at full
           throttle during a climb to altitude or after
           desired altitude was reached. When in doubt, back
           it down some to achieve max maneuvering airspeed.
      
           Other parameters can be considered with respect to
           max ratings with similar avenues of thourght and
           understanding.
      
           If you've got a judiciously maintained main battery
           and a modern alternator of any stripe, (and best
           yet a second engine driven power source) you are
           FAR more likely to experience failure of the
           LCD display on the instrument than you are to
           experience loss of power to that instrument.
      
           A cursory study of aviation accidents and incidents
           worthy of reporting to the archivists will show
           that electrical systems issues are exceedingly
           rare players in aircraft accidents. Even when
           the occasional 'dark n stormy night' story
           discusses electrical systems issues, we find
           that they could have been easily avoided by judicious
           architecture changes COMBINED with a pilot's
           understanding of system operation and limits.
      
           But if your heart is set on adding this feature
           to your project, the bridge diode rectifier with
           fast-on tabs like
      
      http://aeroelectric.com/Pictures/Misc/s401-25.jpg
      
           will do the job. Power to EIS comes from terminal
           on the odd terminal set 90 degrees to the rest.
           Power in from the two sources goes to the most
           adjacent terminals. The terminal opposite the output
           or (+) corner is ignored.
      
           Suitable parts include Radio Shack 276-1185, B&C
           S401-25, All Electronics FWB-252 and others. Any
           diode assembly you can find that looks like this
           will do the job.
      
      Emacs!
      
      
           Bob . . . 
      
________________________________________________________________________________
Date: 
Apr 11, 2011
From: 
Ken <klehman(at)albedo.net>
Subject: 
Re: Which Diode part number to use for dual    power
      feed?
      
      
      If the EIS is to be your primary voltage monitor and low voltage warning 
      don't forget that it will read low by around 0.6 volts if powered 
      through a silicon diode. That said I think any 1N5400 series (1N5401, 
      1N5402, etc.) would be sufficient as I think I only have a 2 or 3 amp 
      fuse on my EIS4000.
      
      Further with the diodes you will not get a low voltage warning from the 
      main EIS voltmeter if the main supply fails. AUX inputs can be used for 
      that purpose though.
      
      Another approach is a two position power switch if you really want it. I 
      can see some comfort value in having a voltage reading if operating an 
      electric dependent engine after an alternator failure but I did not 
      consider it essential.
      
      Ken
      
      On 4/11/2011 5:32 PM, Robert L. Nuckolls, III wrote:
      > At 01:55 PM 4/11/2011, you wrote:
      >>
      >> Guys,
      >> Can someone point me to the right type and part no. of Diode to use in
      >> a circuit providing a dual power feed to a single piece of equipment?
      >>
      >> I have an EIS4000 that has a single power input. I'd like to provide
      >> both E-bus power and an Aux Batt power feed to it.
      >>
      >> I don't want the E-bus power backfeeding into my Aux Batt.
      >
      > What does the architecture of your ship's
      > power system look like? How many sources
      > of power are available to run the EIS4000
      > before you added another battery?
      >
      > Finally, what's the driving concerns making
      > supplying an engine monitoring system with 'last-
      > ditch' power? I'm unaware of any incident where
      > a plane/pilot experienced an unhappy day because
      > the pilot was unable to know oil pressure or any
      > other parameter unique to engine operations.
      >
      > I've brought airplanes home with broken tach
      > cables because I KNEW that redline could not
      > be exceeded on that particular airplane at full
      > throttle during a climb to altitude or after
      > desired altitude was reached. When in doubt, back
      > it down some to achieve max maneuvering airspeed.
      >
      > Other parameters can be considered with respect to
      > max ratings with similar avenues of thourght and
      > understanding.
      >
      > If you've got a judiciously maintained main battery
      > and a modern alternator of any stripe, (and best
      > yet a second engine driven power source) you are
      > FAR more likely to experience failure of the
      > LCD display on the instrument than you are to
      > experience loss of power to that instrument.
      >
      > A cursory study of aviation accidents and incidents
      > worthy of reporting to the archivists will show
      > that electrical systems issues are exceedingly
      > rare players in aircraft accidents. Even when
      > the occasional 'dark n stormy night' story
      > discusses electrical systems issues, we find
      > that they could have been easily avoided by judicious
      > architecture changes COMBINED with a pilot's
      > understanding of system operation and limits.
      >
      > But if your heart is set on adding this feature
      > to your project, the bridge diode rectifier with
      > fast-on tabs like
      >
      > http://aeroelectric.com/Pictures/Misc/s401-25.jpg
      >
      > will do the job. Power to EIS comes from terminal
      > on the odd terminal set 90 degrees to the rest.
      > Power in from the two sources goes to the most
      > adjacent terminals. The terminal opposite the output
      > or (+) corner is ignored.
      >
      > Suitable parts include Radio Shack 276-1185, B&C
      > S401-25, All Electronics FWB-252 and others. Any
      > diode assembly you can find that looks like this
      > will do the job.
      >
      > Emacs!
      >
      >
      > Bob . . .
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
Date: 
Apr 12, 2011
From: 
"Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <nuckolls.bob(at)aeroelectric.com>
Subject: 
Re: Which Diode part number to use for dual      power
      feed?
      
      
      At 07:36 PM 4/11/2011, you wrote:
      >
      >If the EIS is to be your primary voltage monitor and low voltage 
      >warning don't forget that it will read low by around 0.6 volts if 
      >powered through a silicon diode. That said I think any 1N5400 series 
      >(1N5401, 1N5402, etc.) would be sufficient as I think I only have a 
      >2 or 3 amp fuse on my EIS4000.
      >
      >Further with the diodes you will not get a low voltage warning from 
      >the main EIS voltmeter if the main supply fails. AUX inputs can be 
      >used for that purpose though.
      >
      >Another approach is a two position power switch if you really want 
      >it. I can see some comfort value in having a voltage reading if 
      >operating an electric dependent engine after an alternator failure 
      >but I did not consider it essential.
      
          Excellent points . . .
      
          Even when such multi-purpose instruments are operated
          from the e-bus, normal voltage readings would be at
          some level below real voltage readings. Which is not
          a particularly relevant fact.
      
          When architecture decisions are finalized, the effects
          to CALIBRATION can and should be considered. Your
          'normal' voltage readings for standard ops might now
          be 13.5 volts as opposed to 14.2 . . . this is an
          entry into the POH, not a fact that calls for any
          agonizing over making tweaks to architecture or work-
          arounds (like substituting switches for diodes).
      
          If the EIS4000 is your only source for low voltage
          annunciation, then you might consider running the
          EIS from the main bus. If you loose the alternator
          in cruising flight and your plan-B calls for
          shutting down the main bus for ENDURANCE, I see
          no increase in risks for having the EIS be dark.
          Leave the engine settings alone and guess what?
          They'll be the same when you bring the main bus
          back up for approach to landing.
      
          This discussion highlights the reason way we changed
          the E-bus from "essential" to "endurance" some years
          back. Essential goodies are those necessary to
          get you back on the ground under present conditions.
          Way back when, if your Narco VT-1 Super-Homer went
          TU just before you intended to shoot a LOC approach,
          your plan-B called for an airport in VMC . . . unless
          you were really "uptown" with two VOR/LOC radios.
      
          The point is that critical equipment be (1) backed
          up with an independent substitute or (2) change
          of flight plans to work around criticality of that
          piece of equipment.
      
          Providing multiple power sources in an already
          failure tolerant architecture assumes that the
          highest risk of failure is loss of power. Lots
          of band-aid on top of band-aid while assuming
          that the system itself is impervious to all other
          failures.
      
          Bob . . .
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: 
Re: Which Diode part number to use for dual power feed?
From: 
"plevyakh" <hplevyak(at)mac.com>
Date: 
Apr 12, 2011
      
      
      After considering your points I simplified and stayed with the Z10/8.
      
      My EIS4000 is on the Endurance bus along with my dual EFIS/AHRS.  I'll flip the
      EBus Alternate feed on prior to engine start, eliminating the brown out potential,
      which will give the AHRS time to align prior to shaking the airplane around
      with engine start....and have my EIS on line to show oil pressure right after
      engine start.
      
      I've attached my latest architecture version.   If anyone sees an error in wiring,
      please let me know.  I'm learning tons here and greatly appreciate your inputs.
      
      Thank-you.
      
      Howard
      
      --------
      Howard Plevyak
      GlaStar / North Bend, Ohio
      hplevyak(at)mac.com
      
      
      Read this topic online here:
      
      http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=336722#336722
      
      
      Attachments: 
      
      http://forums.matronics.com//files/printable_electric_glastar_w_dual_lightspeeds_architecture_v04_12apr2011_952.pdf
      http://forums.matronics.com//files/electric_glastar_w_dual_lightspeeds_architecture_v04_12apr2011_108.pdf
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: 
Autocad on the web
From: 
"JohnInReno" <john(at)morgensen.com>
Date: 
Apr 12, 2011
      
      
      I just found this link for autocad that allows you to store and edit .dwg files:
      
      https://www.autocadws.com/
      
      Can one of you knowledgeable cad folks take a look and see if it is worth it for
      casual use? It is a free service from AutoCad.
      
      --------
      RV4 - Purchased flying
      RV-9A - soon
      
      
      Read this topic online here:
      
      http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=336756#336756
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
Date: 
Apr 12, 2011
From: 
Richard Tasker <retasker(at)optonline.net>
Subject: 
Re: Autocad on the web
      
      
      I took a quick look at it.  I use AutoCAD at work and this seems to be 
      pretty much the same thing functionally.
      
      It runs in a browser using Flash and is not as responsive as the copy of 
      AutoCAD on my desktop, but it does seem to work.  I suppose it depends 
      on your internet connection speed.
      
      It is certainly a whole lot cheaper than buying AutoCAD if you already 
      know how to use AutoCAD.
      
      If you don't know AutoCAD, then I am not sure I would recommend this as 
      opposed to buying or downloading one of the inexpensive (or free) CAD 
      packages out there.  If one is going to learn how to use a CAD package I 
      would certainly want to have it on my desktop.
      
      If you need to do a quick drawing and know what you are doing, then this 
      is certainly a quick solution.
      
      Dick Tasker
      
      JohnInReno wrote:
      > -->  AeroElectric-List message posted by: "JohnInReno"
      >
      > I just found this link for autocad that allows you to store and edit .dwg files:
      >
      > https://www.autocadws.com/
      >
      > Can one of you knowledgeable cad folks take a look and see if it is worth it
      for casual use? It is a free service from AutoCad.
      >
      > --------
      > RV4 - Purchased flying
      > RV-9A - soon
      >
      >
      > Read this topic online here:
      >
      > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=336756#336756
      >
      >
      >    
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
Date: 
Apr 12, 2011
From: 
"Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <nuckolls.bob(at)aeroelectric.com>
Subject: 
Re: Autocad on the web
      
      
      >
      >If you need to do a quick drawing and know what you are doing, then 
      >this is certainly a quick solution.
      >
      >Dick Tasker
      
         Agree on all points . . .
      
         I fiddled with it a bit and became quickly frustrated with
         the latencies associated with remotely accessed applications.
         We've go 3meg down/.7meg up connectivity here.
      
         For somebody starting out to learn a cad system,
         there are some much faster ways to go for $50 down
         to even free. TurboCAD opens, edits, prints and saves
         all the AutoCAD files on the 'Connection website.
         You can get where you want to go MUCH faster by modifying
         an existing drawing than starting from scratch.
      
      
         Bob . . . 
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
Date: 
Apr 12, 2011
From: 
"Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <nuckolls.bob(at)aeroelectric.com>
Subject: 
Re: coil tuning anyone?
      
      
      >If you have any suggestions on
      >what might make the following project work better, I'm all ears.
      >http://www.easytreasure.co.uk/bfo.htm
      
         I just reviewed this schematic again with some
         attention to the audio section . . . the
         thing has serious design flaws. We were
         focused on the oscillators and I didn't really
         do any kind of sanity check on the rest of it.
         The guy who designed this obviously had little
         knowledge of how to build stable, multi-stage
         amplifiers from transistors.
      
         You may be trying to build and troubleshoot
         a circuit that is crippled right out of the
         gate.
      
      
         Bob . . . 
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
Date: 
Apr 13, 2011
From: 
Dan Billingsley <dan(at)azshowersolutions.com>
Subject: 
Re: coil tuning anyone?
      
      
      ----- Original Message ----
      > From: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <nuckolls.bob(at)aeroelectric.com>
      > To: aeroelectric-list(at)matronics.com
      > Sent: Tue, April 12, 2011 6:45:29 PM
      > Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: coil tuning anyone?
      > 
      >
      > 
      > 
      > > If you have any suggestions on
      > > what might make the following project work better, I'm all ears.
      > > http://www.easytreasure.co.uk/bfo.htm
      > 
      >  I just reviewed this schematic again with some
      >  attention to the audio section . . . the
      >  thing has serious design flaws. We were
      >  focused on the oscillators and I didn't really
      >  do any kind of sanity check on the rest of it.
      >  The guy who designed this obviously had little
      >  knowledge of how to build stable, multi-stage
      >  amplifiers from transistors.
      > 
      >  You may be trying to build and troubleshoot
      >  a circuit that is crippled right out of the
      >  gate.
      > Yes, this is what I found last weekend and then I found the one I just sent you
      
      >a pictorial on.( the one from U tube) It looks to be very similar, but has a 
      >little design change. Hoping it pans out. Thanks Bob. 
      >
      Dan
      > 
      >  Bob . . . 
      > 
      > 
      > 
      > 
      > 
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
Date: 
Apr 13, 2011
From: 
John Morgensen <john(at)morgensen.com>
Subject: 
Re: Autocad on the web
      
      
      Thanks, all.
      
      john
      
      On 4/12/2011 6:23 PM, Robert L. Nuckolls, III wrote:
      > 
      >
      >
      >>
      >> If you need to do a quick drawing and know what you are doing, then 
      >> this is certainly a quick solution.
      >>
      >> Dick Tasker
      >
      >   Agree on all points . . .
      >
      >   I fiddled with it a bit and became quickly frustrated with
      >   the latencies associated with remotely accessed applications.
      >   We've go 3meg down/.7meg up connectivity here.
      >
      >   For somebody starting out to learn a cad system,
      >   there are some much faster ways to go for $50 down
      >   to even free. TurboCAD opens, edits, prints and saves
      >   all the AutoCAD files on the 'Connection website.
      >   You can get where you want to go MUCH faster by modifying
      >   an existing drawing than starting from scratch.
      >
      >
      >   Bob . . .
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
From: 
"ROGER &  JEAN CURTIS" <mrspudandcompany(at)verizon.net>
Subject: 
Autocad on the web
Date: 
Apr 13, 2011
      
      >
      >If you need to do a quick drawing and know what you are doing, then 
      >this is certainly a quick solution.
      >
      >Dick Tasker
      
         Agree on all points . . .
      
         I fiddled with it a bit and became quickly frustrated with
         the latencies associated with remotely accessed applications.
         We've go 3meg down/.7meg up connectivity here.
      
      
         Bob . . . 
      
      		For $13.00 on Ebay, this is a very good basic package, with
      a lot of capability to open and edit cad files from Autocad and others.
      
      
      http://cgi.ebay.com/TurboCAD-Deluxe-10-PC-New-Box-Big-Manual-/20059755077
      5?p
      t=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item2eb48bb6b7
      
      		Roger
      
________________________________________________________________________________
Date: 
Apr 13, 2011
From: 
"MikeRV6-A" <mikerv6a@ao-cs.com>
Subject: 
Re: coil tuning anyone?
      
      
      For very comprehensive information about metal detectors,
      take a look at www.geotech1.com. You will find very
      extensive pursuit of the subject, and projects that
      are examples of good work.
      
      Mike Linse
      RV-6A builder- Corvallis, OR
      
      
      > 
      >
      >
      > ----- Original Message ----
      >> From: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <nuckolls.bob(at)aeroelectric.com>
      >> To: aeroelectric-list(at)matronics.com
      >> Sent: Tue, April 12, 2011 6:45:29 PM
      >> Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: coil tuning anyone?
      >>
      >>
      >>
      >>
      >> > If you have any suggestions on
      >> > what might make the following project work better, I'm all ears.
      >> > http://www.easytreasure.co.uk/bfo.htm
      >>
      >>  I just reviewed this schematic again with some
      >>  attention to the audio section . . . the
      >>  thing has serious design flaws. We were
      >>  focused on the oscillators and I didn't really
      >>  do any kind of sanity check on the rest of it.
      >>  The guy who designed this obviously had little
      >>  knowledge of how to build stable, multi-stage
      >>  amplifiers from transistors.
      >>
      >>  You may be trying to build and troubleshoot
      >>  a circuit that is crippled right out of the
      >>  gate.
      >> Yes, this is what I found last weekend and then I found the one I just
      >> sent you
      >>a pictorial on.( the one from U tube) It looks to be very similar, but
      >> has a
      >>little design change. Hoping it pans out. Thanks Bob.
      >>
      > Dan
      >>
      >>  Bob . . .
      >>
      >>
      >>
      >>
      >>
      >
      >
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
Date: 
Apr 13, 2011
From: 
"Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <nuckolls.bob(at)aeroelectric.com>
Subject: 
Re: AEC9004
      
      
      At 06:01 PM 4/9/2011, you wrote:
      >Bob - how's it coming?  Two years after revision 12 hit the press, 
      >we're still waiting  :-)     I know we can soldier on with the 
      >interim drawing, but wondered if the IR alternator controller was 
      >ready to be born.
      
          Good question. When the 9004 was conceived, I still had
          access to some alternators mounted on drive stands and the
          preliminary work suggested the idea was worth developing.
          I acquired my own drive stand.
      
      http://aeroelectric.com/Pictures/Alternator_Test_Stand/Alternator_Test_Stand_1.jpg
      
          and started to modify it for development of an aircraft
          electrical system and install it in my shop. Even
          acquired the single-phase to-three-phase converter
          and got a 60A 240 line run out to the garage.
      
          Then I moved to M.L. The fat wire 240 line is 130 feet
          away . . . and taxations on my time took a quantum
          jump by the unintended acquisition of too much
          rental property (houses we intended to sell the
          same time the housing market was diving off the cliff).
      
          So now, I have this big machine sitting in my garage
          and more man-hours away from a utilitarian state than
          before.
      
          Plan C . . . or is it D? I forget. The 9024 is
          going to be done first. I'm going to convert the
          electrical system in my '87 Jimmy to look like Z-11.
          I'll install a suite of 9024's in the truck to make
          sure I'm satisfied with the way they work. When
          that's done, the truck will become the test bed for
          the 9004.
      
          I've got to pick up the drive stand for a third time
          and haul it back to the project's benefactor who
          requested that I return it when I was finished with it.
      
          In the mean time, the pressure is off on perfecting
          the 9004. Many of you will recall my visit to MPA's
          overhaul shops and development labs a few years back.
          (See chapter 3, in 12th edition 'Connections.)
          I witnessed some spectacular demonstrations of five,
          max-temperature, max-rating load-dumps in a row on
          exemplar alternators.
      
          The engineer in charge asserted that any alternator
          builder worthy of the name puts out a product that
          is not vulnerable to the occasional b-lead disconnect.
      
          I've concluded that all the floobydust thrown into
          the air about AeroElectric crowbar systems being
          the kiss of death to otherwise 'perfectly good'
          alternators had more to do with throwing sand than
          with a sharing of useful information.
      
      
         Bob . . . 
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
Date: 
Apr 13, 2011
From: 
"Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <nuckolls.bob(at)aeroelectric.com>
Subject: 
Re: coil tuning anyone?
      
      
      At 11:42 AM 4/13/2011, you wrote:
      >
      >For very comprehensive information about metal detectors,
      >take a look at www.geotech1.com. You will find very
      >extensive pursuit of the subject, and projects that
      >are examples of good work.
      
         Cool resource Mike, thanks!
      
      
         Bob . . . 
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
From: 
Steve Thomas <lists(at)stevet.net>
Subject: 
LEMO Connectors
Date: 
Apr 14, 2011
      
      
      I have a LightSpeed Zulu with the LEMO (panel powered) connector.  I need to build
      a short extension cord for the headset cable and was wondering if anyone knew
      where I could find the connector shells and pins for a male and female LEMO
      connector.  I've looked at a number of the electronics sites, but cannot discern
      which part number I need to match the black plastic LEMO connectors that
      the headset currently uses.  Thanks!
      
      
      Steve Thomas
      ________________________________________________________________________
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
Date: 
Apr 14, 2011
From: 
"Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <nuckolls.bob(at)aeroelectric.com>
Subject: 
Re: LEMO Connectors
      
      
      At 10:28 AM 4/14/2011, you wrote:
      >
      >I have a LightSpeed Zulu with the LEMO (panel powered) connector.  I 
      >need to build a short extension cord for the headset cable and was 
      >wondering if anyone knew where I could find the connector shells and 
      >pins for a male and female LEMO connector.  I've looked at a number 
      >of the electronics sites, but cannot discern which part number I 
      >need to match the black plastic LEMO connectors that the headset 
      >currently uses.  Thanks!
      
          Have you looked over the LEMO catalogs at
      
      http://www.lemo.com/defaultwidgets.asp
      
          to identify the style and size of your connectors?
          I think Mouser stocks some LEMO products.
      
      
         Bob . . . 
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
Date: 
Apr 16, 2011
Subject: 
GNS430 Communication Voltage- 14v or 28v?
From: 
Jared Yates <email(at)jaredyates.com>
      
      I'm wiring my 14-volt panel, which includes a Garmin GNS430, non-WAAS
      "legacy" version, and I am looking for advice from someone who is familiar
      with the development timeline.  I have an older hard copy of an installation
      manual that says that the aircraft power on the P4002 (Communications)
      connector must be at 28 volts.  I noticed in the more recent 430W
      installation manual that only the "A" high power units have this 28-volt
      requirement.  Does anyone know when the change happened?  For instance, do
      all of the old non-waas units have this 28-volt communication requirement,
      or is there a mod that makes some of the non-w units (hopefully mine)
      14-volt capable?  The placard on the unit says that it is up to mod level 5,
      and I have a list of all of the various service bulletins that have been
      applied to it, in case any of that might help.
      
________________________________________________________________________________
From: 
<bakerocb(at)cox.net>
Subject: 
GNS430 Communication Voltage- 14v or 28v?
Date: 
Apr 16, 2011
      
      
      4/16/2011
      
      Hello Jared, You wrote:
      
      1) "Does anyone know when the change happened?"
      
      See this announcement from Garmin:
      
      http://www8.garmin.com/pressroom/aviation/072600.html
      
      2) "For instance, do all of the old non-waas units have this 28-volt 
      communication requirement,...?"
      
      No. Only the original 430 units required 28 volts. As described in the 
      announcement after Garmin created the 14/28 version of the GNS 430 one could 
      use either 14 or 28 volts.
      
      3) "... is there a mod that makes some of the non-w units (hopefully mine)
      14-volt capable?"
      
      If you have an original GNS 430 28 volt only version an external 14 to 28 
      volt converter will be required to make that 28 volt version work in a 14 
      volt airplane.
      
      Note this statement: "Garmin ended factory support for the 28 volt-only 
      GNS-430 on September 30,2010. The 14/28 volt version remains fully 
      supported." On this web page:
      
      http://www.bennettavionics.com/gns430-28v.html
      
      I suggest that you contact the Gamin tech people, give them your unit serial 
      number, and find out whether you have a 28 volt only unit or a 14/28 volt 
      unit. Good luck.
      
      'OC' Baker Says: "The best investment we can make is the time and effort to 
      gather and understand knowledge."
      
      ===========================================================
      
      
      Subject: AeroElectric-List: GNS430 Communication Voltage- 14v or 28v?
      From: Jared Yates <email(at)jaredyates.com>
      
      I'm wiring my 14-volt panel, which includes a Garmin GNS430, non-WAAS
      "legacy" version, and I am looking for advice from someone who is familiar
      with the development timeline.  I have an older hard copy of an installation
      manual that says that the aircraft power on the P4002 (Communications)
      connector must be at 28 volts.  I noticed in the more recent 430W
      installation manual that only the "A" high power units have this 28-volt
      requirement.  Does anyone know when the change happened?  For instance, do
      all of the old non-waas units have this 28-volt communication requirement,
      or is there a mod that makes some of the non-w units (hopefully mine)
      14-volt capable?  The placard on the unit says that it is up to mod level 5,
      and I have a list of all of the various service bulletins that have been
      applied to it, in case any of that might help.
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
Date: 
Apr 16, 2011
Subject: 
Re: GNS430 Communication Voltage- 14v or 28v?
From: 
Jared Yates <email(at)jaredyates.com>
      
      Thanks for the information, I'll call them on Monday.  The placard on the
      unit says 14/28v, but I didn't know if that meant 14 volts for everything
      except comm and 28 volts for com, or if that meant 14-28 volt input range
      for all of the inputs.  I'm glad to hear that the change was so long ago,
      though that doesn't say much for the status of my installation manual.
      
      On Sat, Apr 16, 2011 at 7:32 AM,  wrote:
      
      >
      > 4/16/2011
      >
      > Hello Jared, You wrote:
      >
      > 1) "Does anyone know when the change happened?"
      >
      > See this announcement from Garmin:
      >
      > http://www8.garmin.com/pressroom/aviation/072600.html
      >
      > 2) "For instance, do all of the old non-waas units have this 28-volt
      > communication requirement,...?"
      >
      > No. Only the original 430 units required 28 volts. As described in the
      > announcement after Garmin created the 14/28 version of the GNS 430 one could
      > use either 14 or 28 volts.
      >
      > 3) "... is there a mod that makes some of the non-w units (hopefully mine)
      > 14-volt capable?"
      >
      > If you have an original GNS 430 28 volt only version an external 14 to 28
      > volt converter will be required to make that 28 volt version work in a 14
      > volt airplane.
      >
      > Note this statement: "Garmin ended factory support for the 28 volt-only
      > GNS-430 on September 30,2010. The 14/28 volt version remains fully
      > supported." On this web page:
      >
      > http://www.bennettavionics.com/gns430-28v.html
      >
      > I suggest that you contact the Gamin tech people, give them your unit
      > serial number, and find out whether you have a 28 volt only unit or a 14/28
      > volt unit. Good luck.
      >
      > 'OC' Baker Says: "The best investment we can make is the time and effort to
      > gather and understand knowledge."
      >
      > ===========================================================
      >
      >
      > Subject: AeroElectric-List: GNS430 Communication Voltage- 14v or 28v?
      > From: Jared Yates <email(at)jaredyates.com>
      >
      > I'm wiring my 14-volt panel, which includes a Garmin GNS430, non-WAAS
      > "legacy" version, and I am looking for advice from someone who is familiar
      > with the development timeline.  I have an older hard copy of an
      > installation
      > manual that says that the aircraft power on the P4002 (Communications)
      > connector must be at 28 volts.  I noticed in the more recent 430W
      > installation manual that only the "A" high power units have this 28-volt
      > requirement.  Does anyone know when the change happened?  For instance, do
      > all of the old non-waas units have this 28-volt communication requirement,
      > or is there a mod that makes some of the non-w units (hopefully mine)
      > 14-volt capable?  The placard on the unit says that it is up to mod level
      > 5,
      > and I have a list of all of the various service bulletins that have been
      > applied to it, in case any of that might help.
      >
      >
      
________________________________________________________________________________
Date: 
Apr 16, 2011
Subject: 
Re: GNS430 Communication Voltage- 14v or 28v?
From: 
Jared Yates <email(at)jaredyates.com>
      
      For anyone else who might have this same question, I've just found the
      answer in a newer installation manual the Bob L. sent me.  Garmin changed
      the part numbers, so part number 011-00280-10 accepts 11-33 volts on all
      inputs, while part number 011-00280-00 requires the converter.  Fortunately
      mine is the -10 series.
      
      On Sat, Apr 16, 2011 at 1:34 AM, Jared Yates  wrote:
      
      > I'm wiring my 14-volt panel, which includes a Garmin GNS430, non-WAAS
      > "legacy" version, and I am looking for advice from someone who is familiar
      > with the development timeline.  I have an older hard copy of an installation
      > manual that says that the aircraft power on the P4002 (Communications)
      > connector must be at 28 volts.  I noticed in the more recent 430W
      > installation manual that only the "A" high power units have this 28-volt
      > requirement.  Does anyone know when the change happened?  For instance, do
      > all of the old non-waas units have this 28-volt communication requirement,
      > or is there a mod that makes some of the non-w units (hopefully mine)
      > 14-volt capable?  The placard on the unit says that it is up to mod level 5,
      > and I have a list of all of the various service bulletins that have been
      > applied to it, in case any of that might help.
      >
      >
      > *
      >
      > *
      >
      >
      
________________________________________________________________________________
Date: 
Apr 16, 2011
Subject: 
Re: GNS430 Communication Voltage- 14v or 28v?
From: 
Jared Yates <email(at)jaredyates.com>
      
      On a somewhat related note, how are you folks wiring the power inputs?  I
      notice on the schematic that they show the redundant power sources tied
      together downstream of the circuit protection.  Wouldn't it make more sense
      to run a separate fuse for each of the redundant sources?  This would mean 6
      fuses instead of 3, but wouldn't it eliminate a single failure point?
      
      On Sat, Apr 16, 2011 at 11:10 AM, Jared Yates  wrote:
      
      > For anyone else who might have this same question, I've just found the
      > answer in a newer installation manual the Bob L. sent me.  Garmin changed
      > the part numbers, so part number 011-00280-10 accepts 11-33 volts on all
      > inputs, while part number 011-00280-00 requires the converter.  Fortunately
      > mine is the -10 series.
      >
      >
      > On Sat, Apr 16, 2011 at 1:34 AM, Jared Yates  wrote:
      >
      >> I'm wiring my 14-volt panel, which includes a Garmin GNS430, non-WAAS
      >> "legacy" version, and I am looking for advice from someone who is familiar
      >> with the development timeline.  I have an older hard copy of an installation
      >> manual that says that the aircraft power on the P4002 (Communications)
      >> connector must be at 28 volts.  I noticed in the more recent 430W
      >> installation manual that only the "A" high power units have this 28-volt
      >> requirement.  Does anyone know when the change happened?  For instance, do
      >> all of the old non-waas units have this 28-volt communication requirement,
      >> or is there a mod that makes some of the non-w units (hopefully mine)
      >> 14-volt capable?  The placard on the unit says that it is up to mod level 5,
      >> and I have a list of all of the various service bulletins that have been
      >> applied to it, in case any of that might help.
      >>
      >>
      >> *
      >>
      >> *
      >>
      >>
      >
      
________________________________________________________________________________
Date: 
Apr 16, 2011
From: 
Tim Andres <tim2542(at)sbcglobal.net>
Subject: 
Re: GNS430 Communication Voltage- 14v or 28v?
      
      On 4/16/2011 8:19 AM, Jared Yates wrote:
      > On a somewhat related note, how are you folks wiring the power inputs? 
      >  I notice on the schematic that they show the redundant power sources 
      > tied together downstream of the circuit protection.  Wouldn't it make 
      > more sense to run a separate fuse for each of the redundant sources? 
      >  This would mean 6 fuses instead of 3, but wouldn't it eliminate a 
      > single failure point?*
      > *
      I have seen professional harnesses and all they do is tie (solder seal) 
      the 2 wires together just outside the connector.  The feeds are diode 
      isolated in the unit and I believe the intent is to be able to feed from 
      2 separate busses on on aircraft that have more than one power source.  
      In my case, I used my AUX bus/batt. to enable my GRT EFIS  and 430w to 
      boot up and prior to engine start for flight planning etc. Since I used 
      a Avionics switch this also gives a work around in case that switch 
      fails. There are also separate feeds for NAV and Comm on these and this 
      gives the installer some options on when & how to power it all up. The 
      simplest thing is to just tie them all together and run it to your 
      Avionics buss.
      
      Tim
      
________________________________________________________________________________
Date: 
Apr 16, 2011
Subject: 
Re: GNS430 Communication Voltage- 14v or 28v?
From: 
Jared Yates <email(at)jaredyates.com>
      
      I have in my notes that I was supposed to wire the inputs to the same bus,
      but I don't remember the source.  I'm using Z13/8 with a *Schottky* diode and
      would be glad to split the power inputs between the main and ebus if that
      isn't going to cause any problems.  I hadn't considered that option since I
      thought they all had to be on the same bus.
      
      On Sat, Apr 16, 2011 at 12:33 PM, Tim Andres  wrote:
      
      >  On 4/16/2011 8:19 AM, Jared Yates wrote:
      >
      > On a somewhat related note, how are you folks wiring the power inputs?  I
      > notice on the schematic that they show the redundant power sources tied
      > together downstream of the circuit protection.  Wouldn't it make more sense
      > to run a separate fuse for each of the redundant sources?  This would mean 6
      > fuses instead of 3, but wouldn't it eliminate a single failure point?*
      > *
      >
      > I have seen professional harnesses and all they do is tie (solder seal) the
      > 2 wires together just outside the connector.  The feeds are diode isolated
      > in the unit and I believe the intent is to be able to feed from 2 separate
      > busses on on aircraft that have more than one power source.  In my case, I
      > used my AUX bus/batt. to enable my GRT EFIS  and 430w to boot up and prior
      > to engine start for flight planning etc. Since I used a Avionics switch this
      > also gives a work around in case that switch fails. There are also separate
      > feeds for NAV and Comm on these and this gives the installer some options on
      > when & how to power it all up. The simplest thing is to just tie them all
      > together and run it to your Avionics buss.
      >
      > Tim
      >
      > *
      >
      > *
      >
      >
      
________________________________________________________________________________
From: 
Robert Dufresne <robertdufresne(at)videotron.ca>
Subject: 
Contactors
Date: 
Apr 18, 2011
      
      
      test
      
      -----Message d'origine-----
      De: owner-aeroelectric-list-server(at)matronics.com
      [mailto:owner-aeroelectric-list-server(at)matronics.com] De la part de Robert
      L. Nuckolls, III
      Envoy: 8 avril 2011 10:46
      : aeroelectric-list(at)matronics.com
      Objet: Re: AeroElectric-List: Contactors
      
      
      
      At 11:38 PM 4/7/2011, you wrote:
      >
      >
      >Unless I am mistaken the S701 can CARRY the starting current but is 
      >not designed to make or break (close or open) with the high starting 
      >current.  The S702 is specifically designed to make or break with 
      >the high starting current.
      
          Right on . . . The S701 draws just under 1A of
          current, is designed for continuous duty operations
          and is rated to SWITCH only 70A. It has relatively
          large area, lower pressure contacts.
      
      http://www.aeroelectric.com/Pictures/Contactors/S701-1b.jpg
      
      
          The S702 draws 3-5A, gets destructively hot if you
          leave it on too long and is rated to SWITCH hundreds
          of amps. It features low area, high pressure contacts
      
      http://www.aeroelectric.com/Pictures/Contactors/S702-1a.jpg
      
          They are entirely different breeds of cat crafted
          for specific applications.
      
          Having said all that, know that a contactor, relay or
          switch that is CONTROLLING currents many times the rated
          value WILL perform to some level. In fact, you may
          well achieve 'satisfactory performance' from an S701-style
          contactor in a starter control application. It's service
          life would be reduced to maybe 1-10% of rated . . . but
          if that number is still 500-1000 cranking events . . .
          how might it matter to you?
      
          Bottom line is that using the S701 in this manner is
          simply not the-best-we-know-how-to-do with components
          having similar costs. Further, it is not a recipe for
          disaster or even severe spikes in cost-of-ownership. So
          if you're willing to experiment, then let us know how
          it works out.
      
      
         Bob . . .  
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
From: 
Robert Dufresne <robertdufresne(at)videotron.ca>
Subject: 
Re: remote battery charging
Date: 
Apr 18, 2011
      
      
       Test 2
      
      -----Message d'origine-----
      De: owner-aeroelectric-list-server(at)matronics.com
      [mailto:owner-aeroelectric-list-server(at)matronics.com] De la part de user9253
      Envoy: 13 mars 2011 11:10
      : aeroelectric-list(at)matronics.com
      Objet: AeroElectric-List: Re: remote battery charging
      
      
      If you have a cigarette type power outlet in the cockpit, you can use one of
      these chargers for sale on eBay:
      https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/_9Rmupq9lpCs/TXzXScNgc-I/AAAAAAAAAKk/uPU9_
      yO6qpM/Charger.png
      WalMart sells a similar charger
      http://www.walmart.com/ip/Schumacher-SpeedCharge-Battery-Maintainer-and-Char
      ger/13005742  but you will have to buy a separate cigarette lighter plug.
      Or you can put flush mounted anchor nuts or nutplates on the outside of the
      fuselage and use the ring terminals that come with the charger along with
      some screws.
      Joe
      
      --------
      Joe Gores
      
      
      Read this topic online here:
      
      http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=333736#333736
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
Date: 
Apr 18, 2011
Subject: 
AEC9009 Audio Iso Amp Wiring, especially Shielded Wires
From: 
Jared Yates <email(at)jaredyates.com>
      
      AEC questions
      
      I'm wiring the AEC 9009 Audio Iso Amp and want to be sure that I'm doing it
      correctly.  I don't understand entirely about how and when wires need to be
      shielded in this case.  I have a single Nav/Com (GNS430), a Flightcom 403
      stereo intercom, a pilot position with a push-to-talk, a co-pilot position
      with a push-to-talk, and two back seat passengers.  Inputs to the 9009 are
      the Dynon warning tones from the HS34, the 430 Nav audio, and a stereo ipod
      jack.
      
      Here's my wiring plan so far:
      1. Connect the dynon HS34 tone output with a single-wire shielded cable at
      the 9009's pin 4(center conductor) and 10(sheild), leaving the Dynon's end
      of the shielded cable not connected to anything.
      
      2. Use another single-wire shielded cable to connect the 430 Nav Audio Hi
      output to the 9009's pin 2(center conductor) and the Nav Audio Lo to the
      9009 pin 11(shield).  Is this correct, or do I need two conductors and a
      shield, with the shield wired as per 1 (connected at 9009, clipped at the
      other end)?
      
      3.  Connect a 3.5mm stereo jack to the 9009 with a 2-wire shielded cable:
      one conductor from the jack to 9009 pin 1, one conductor from the jack to
      9009 pin 5, and the shield from the 3.5mm jack's ground to pin 12 on the
      9009 (and the jack isolated from the airframe ground).  Same question as
      number 2- Is this correct?  Do I instead need to run a 3-wire shielded
      cable, with the third conductor connected to the jack's ground, and the
      shield wired as in number 1 above?
      
      4. Run the left and right outputs of the 9009 (pins 7 and 6) to the
      flightcom's aux input channels.  What about shields here?  Should I run a
      single cable with two wires, or does each conductor need to be in its own
      shield?
      
      5. Run the power to pin 8 on the 9009 with a 22AWG wire that is crimped in
      the same faston terminal as the intercom's power line so that they share a
      1A fuse.
      
      6. Wire the rest of the audio system (pilot, copilot, pax mic/phone jacks)
      per the flightcom directions, using 3-wire shielded cable with the jacks
      isolated from the airframe.  What do I need to do with the shields?
      
      The Flightcom manual says that it has fail safe wiring that connects the
      pilot jacks to the radio if the intercom loses power, so I was planning to
      skip the fail-safe jacks described in the AEC9009 literature.  Is there any
      other reason why I would want to include them?  I can think of two cases
      where they would be useful.  First, as described in the flightcom manual, if
      the intercom were to become inop and I removed it to send it away, I could
      still fly the airplane with a single functioning headset by using the
      directly wired jacks.  If I omit the direct jacks, then this feature would
      not be available.  Second, if the intercom failsafe system were to fail and
      the intercom were to both fail at the same time, I would be unable to use
      the 430's Com and would have to resort to the backup handheld and its
      headset adapter cord.  Both of these circumstances seem pretty unlikely, and
      I think I'm willing to live without a solution for them.  Are there any
      other good reasons to have the failsafe jacks that I might be forgetting
      about?
      
      My plan is to keep the 430 com functions out of the 9009 completely, since
      the intercom has channels for xmit and receive audio.  This will keep the
      AEC out of the equation, and if it becomes inop then VHF communications will
      not be effected.  Is there any reason why I shouldn't do it this way?
      
________________________________________________________________________________
Date: 
Apr 18, 2011
Subject: 
Re: GNS430 Communication Voltage- 14v or 28v?
From: 
Jared Yates <email(at)jaredyates.com>
      
      I found the source that I was talking about earlier.  It's on page H-12 of
      the 430W manual that Bob has on his site.  The note says "If the aircraft
      has multiple power buses, it is recommended that all GNS 430W power inputs
      be connected to the same bus."  I wonder why they would suggest that?  Has
      anyone else separated the two inputs over a main bus and an AEC E-bus and
      had good results?  Also, I did notice in the fine print that the power
      connections to the P4006 connector only drive the superflag functions, so I
      don't need to hook them up.
      
      On Sat, Apr 16, 2011 at 1:00 PM, Jared Yates  wrote:
      
      > I have in my notes that I was supposed to wire the inputs to the same bus,
      > but I don't remember the source.  I'm using Z13/8 with a *Schottky* diode and
      > would be glad to split the power inputs between the main and ebus if that
      > isn't going to cause any problems.  I hadn't considered that option since I
      > thought they all had to be on the same bus.
      >
      > On Sat, Apr 16, 2011 at 12:33 PM, Tim Andres wrote:
      >
      >>  On 4/16/2011 8:19 AM, Jared Yates wrote:
      >>
      >> On a somewhat related note, how are you folks wiring the power inputs?  I
      >> notice on the schematic that they show the redundant power sources tied
      >> together downstream of the circuit protection.  Wouldn't it make more sense
      >> to run a separate fuse for each of the redundant sources?  This would mean 6
      >> fuses instead of 3, but wouldn't it eliminate a single failure point?*
      >> *
      >>
      >> I have seen professional harnesses and all they do is tie (solder seal)
      >> the 2 wires together just outside the connector.  The feeds are diode
      >> isolated in the unit and I believe the intent is to be able to feed from 2
      >> separate busses on on aircraft that have more than one power source.  In my
      >> case, I used my AUX bus/batt. to enable my GRT EFIS  and 430w to boot up and
      >> prior to engine start for flight planning etc. Since I used a Avionics
      >> switch this also gives a work around in case that switch fails. There are
      >> also separate feeds for NAV and Comm on these and this gives the installer
      >> some options on when & how to power it all up. The simplest thing is to just
      >> tie them all together and run it to your Avionics buss.
      >>
      >> Tim
      >>
      >> *
      >>
      >> *
      >>
      >>
      >
      
________________________________________________________________________________
Date: 
Apr 18, 2011
From: 
"Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <nuckolls.bob(at)aeroelectric.com>
Subject: 
Re: GNS430 Communication Voltage- 14v or   28v?
      
      
      At 02:26 PM 4/18/2011, you wrote:
      >I found the source that I was talking about earlier.  It's on page 
      >H-12 of the 430W manual that Bob has on his site.  The note says "If 
      >the aircraft has multiple power buses, it is recommended that all 
      >GNS 430W power inputs be connected to the same bus."  I wonder why 
      >they would suggest that?
      
         Because the multiple power inputs are not designed be
         either/or . . . all inputs are necessary for full up
         operation of the system. Therefore it is not recommended
         that one input come from say the main bus and another
         input come from the e-bus.
      
         If your design goals call for this system to be
         available in the endurance mode, then all power inputs
         to the system would come from the e-bus . . . which
         is also the most failure tolerant bus having up to
         three sources of power through two independent pathways.
      
      >   Has anyone else separated the two inputs over a main bus and an 
      > AEC E-bus and had good results?
      
         How would one guage "good results". Without going through
         a proof of concept study for abnormal operations, a system
         that was split between busses having different levels
         of accessibility would go un-explored.
      
      
         Bob . . . 
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
Date: 
Apr 18, 2011
From: 
RScott <rscott(at)cascadeaccess.com>
Subject: 
Town washed away by tsunami
      
      
      You may not want to watch this--it's both riveting and horrible.  Video 
      taken from a hillside as people overlook their town being washed away.  
      Near the end a few people are caught as they try to escape up the hill 
      and we don't know if they survived.
      
      http://www.newser.com/story/116577/new-japan-tsunami-video-shows-town-washed-away-as-residents-flee.html 
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
Date: 
Apr 18, 2011
From: 
Tim Andres <tim2542(at)sbcglobal.net>
Subject: 
Re: GNS430 Communication Voltage- 14v or 28v?
      
      
      On 4/18/2011 11:26 AM, Jared Yates wrote:
      > I found the source that I was talking about earlier.  It's on page 
      > H-12 of the 430W manual that Bob has on his site.  The note says "If 
      > the aircraft has multiple power buses, it is recommended that all GNS 
      > 430W power inputs be connected to the same bus."  I wonder why they 
      > would suggest that?  Has anyone else separated the two inputs over a 
      > main bus and an AEC E-bus and had good results?  Also, I did notice in 
      > the fine print that the power connections to the P4006 connector only 
      > drive the superflag functions, so I don't need to hook them up.
      >
      I believe it is Bob? at TCW that sells the power conditioner/backup 
      supply unit. He told me that is how it is suppose to work. If you look 
      at his website he has a schematic that shows the two power busses hooked 
      up to different pins in the 430.
      See:  
      http://tcwtech.com/Installation%20instructions%20model%20IBBS-rev1.9.pdf
      Tim
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
Date: 
Apr 18, 2011
Subject: 
Re: GNS430 Communication Voltage- 14v or 28v?
From: 
Jared Yates <email(at)jaredyates.com>
      
      Bob, thanks for your suggestion.  I was originally planning to put them all
      on the ebus, so I'll continue with that route.
      
      On Mon, Apr 18, 2011 at 8:53 PM, Tim Andres  wrote:
      
      > >
      >
      >
      > On 4/18/2011 11:26 AM, Jared Yates wrote:
      >
      >> I found the source that I was talking about earlier.  It's on page H-12 of
      >> the 430W manual that Bob has on his site.  The note says "If the aircraft
      >> has multiple power buses, it is recommended that all GNS 430W power inputs
      >> be connected to the same bus."  I wonder why they would suggest that?  Has
      >> anyone else separated the two inputs over a main bus and an AEC E-bus and
      >> had good results?  Also, I did notice in the fine print that the power
      >> connections to the P4006 connector only drive the superflag functions, so I
      >> don't need to hook them up.
      >>
      >>  I believe it is Bob? at TCW that sells the power conditioner/backup
      > supply unit. He told me that is how it is suppose to work. If you look at
      > his website he has a schematic that shows the two power busses hooked up to
      > different pins in the 430.
      > See:
      > http://tcwtech.com/Installation%20instructions%20model%20IBBS-rev1.9.pdf
      > Tim
      >
      >
      
________________________________________________________________________________
Date: 
Apr 18, 2011
From: 
"Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <nuckolls.bob(at)aeroelectric.com>
Subject: 
Re: GNS430 Communication Voltage- 14v or   28v?
      
      
      >I believe it is Bob? at TCW that sells the power conditioner/backup 
      >supply unit. He told me that is how it is suppose to work. If you 
      >look at his website he has a schematic that shows the two power 
      >busses hooked up to different pins in the 430.
      >See:
      >http://tcwtech.com/Installation%20instructions%20model%20IBBS-rev1.9.pdf
      >Tim
      
        But that's not a Garmin schematic designed to support their
        product in architectures vetted by their engineering staff.
        This schematic is about applying a 12v standby battery to
        various combinations of ship's accessories. Design goals
        for AEC architectures is to provide failure tolerant (meaning
        reliable power sources) that do not benefit from adding on
        band-aid batteries.
      
        Without a good knowledge of TCW's design goals and
        the rational for their recommendations, I'm  unable
        to offer a judgement as to potential for error or
        reduced reliability.
      
        In any case, you can't go wrong taking Garmin's advice
        for installation of their products.
      
      
         Bob . . . 
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
From: 
"bob-tcw" <rnewman(at)tcwtech.com>
Subject: 
Re: GNS430 Communication Voltage- 14v or   28v?
Date: 
Apr 19, 2011
      
      
      Regarding the recommendations for wiring found in the TCW  IBBS install 
      manual:
      
      Although the wiring diagrams are found in a TCW publication they were in 
      fact "vetted" by Garmin.   We worked very closely with Garmin in developing 
      our IBBS and IPS series of products and they tested samples of each before 
      we went forward with publishing our install manual.     Although you will 
      never find Garmin directly endorsing any third party products,   you will 
      find that these TCW products have been written into the Garmin Installation 
      Manuals for the Garmin G3x and G900x products.
      
      Perhaps I can clear up the "powered from a single bus " question that Tim 
      referred to for the 430W manual, (however I don't work for Garmin,  I just 
      worked "with them" on related product developments ).      I believe the 
      single bus statement is meant at a high level,  meaning powering the whole 
      unit for normal operation.   The 430W/530W units effectively have 3 
      significant power inputs, (ignoring the super flags). These inputs power the 
      GPS/Nav portion of the unit and Comm portion of the unit.    Two inputs 
      called Aircraft Power1 and Aircraft Power 2 are dioded ORed together to 
      power the GPS/Nav portion of the product.   Comm Power only powers the radio 
      section,  however,  powering the Comm section alone doesn't make the pretty 
      screen with useful display info work,  so to be useful the Comm power and 
      GPS/Nav power must be present at the same time if you want to use the radio. 
      Hence from a high level the single bus comment.   Now the 430 or 530 box 
      will work in the GPS/Nav only mode with the radio off line,   this is done 
      by just powering Aircraft Power 1 or Aircraft Power 2 inputs as shown in our 
      manual or in the G900x manual   (remember, the G900x has a sub-unit called 
      the GIA63W which effectively is a faceless GNS530w box, in this manual you 
      will find a TCW IPS-12v-8a providing power conditioning to the Aircraft 
      Power 2 terminal of the GIA unit and their display unit GDU1040).
      
      Now regarding the multiple pins for each of these three inputs on the Garmin 
      unit,    I was told these were for redundancy and current handling 
      capability, particularly on the Comm power input which has a higher peak 
      current requirement than the GPS/nav power input/       So for example,  the 
      Aircraft Power 2 input on a GNS-430W is provided on P4001, pins 15 and 72. 
      These pins are literally tied together on the circuit board to form a 
      redundant pair of connections,  typically the wiring harness maker will 
      connect his single feed to this "input" right at the connector body, 
      splicing the feed wire into two pins that feed the respective input.
      
      
      Hope this helps,
      
      Bob Newman
      TCW Technologies, LLC.
      
      
      ----- Original Message ----- 
      From: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <nuckolls.bob(at)aeroelectric.com>
      Sent: Monday, April 18, 2011 9:22 PM
      Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: GNS430 Communication Voltage- 14v or 28v?
      
      
      > 
      >
      >
      >>I believe it is Bob? at TCW that sells the power conditioner/backup supply 
      >>unit. He told me that is how it is suppose to work. If you look at his 
      >>website he has a schematic that shows the two power busses hooked up to 
      >>different pins in the 430.
      >>See:
      >>http://tcwtech.com/Installation%20instructions%20model%20IBBS-rev1.9.pdf
      >>Tim
      >
      >  But that's not a Garmin schematic designed to support their
      >  product in architectures vetted by their engineering staff.
      >  This schematic is about applying a 12v standby battery to
      >  various combinations of ship's accessories. Design goals
      >  for AEC architectures is to provide failure tolerant (meaning
      >  reliable power sources) that do not benefit from adding on
      >  band-aid batteries.
      >
      >  Without a good knowledge of TCW's design goals and
      >  the rational for their recommendations, I'm  unable
      >  to offer a judgement as to potential for error or
      >  reduced reliability.
      >
      >  In any case, you can't go wrong taking Garmin's advice
      >  for installation of their products.
      >
      >
      >   Bob . . .
      >
      >
      > 
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
Date: 
Apr 19, 2011
From: 
"Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <nuckolls.bob(at)aeroelectric.com>
Subject: 
Re: GNS430 Communication Voltage- 14v or     28v?
      
      
      At 08:00 AM 4/19/2011, you wrote:
      
      Regarding the recommendations for wiring found in the TCW  IBBS install manual:
      
      Although the wiring diagrams are found in a TCW publication they were 
      in fact "vetted" by Garmin.   We worked very closely with Garmin in 
      developing our IBBS and IPS series of products and they tested 
      samples of each before we went forward with publishing our install 
      manual.     Although you will never find Garmin directly endorsing 
      any third party products,   you will find that these TCW products 
      have been written into the Garmin Installation Manuals for the Garmin 
      G3x and G900x products.
      
         
      
        So for example,  the Aircraft Power 2 input on a GNS-430W is 
      provided on P4001, pins 15 and 72. These pins are literally tied 
      together on the circuit board to form a redundant pair of 
      connections,  typically the wiring harness maker will connect his 
      single feed to this "input" right at the connector body, splicing the 
      feed wire into two pins that feed the respective input.
      
      
      Hope this helps,
      
      
          Yes. I'm pleased that you were willing and
          able to achieve this level of cooperation
          and understanding with Garmin.
      
          In other matters where I've observed Garmin's
          modus operandi, I am reminded of the mind set
          and creativity of folks like Ed King. We would
          all do well to study their recipes for success.
      
          Thanks for the clarification!
      
         Bob . . . 
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: 
Your Next Plane: Beer and Barcalounger method
From: 
"jonlaury" <jonlaury(at)impulse.net>
Date: 
Apr 19, 2011
      
      
      http://www.newscientist.com/article/dn20018-acrobatic-flying-robots-steal-the-show.html
      
      
      Read this topic online here:
      
      http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=337507#337507
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
Date: 
Apr 19, 2011
From: 
"Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <nuckolls.bob(at)aeroelectric.com>
Subject: 
Re: Your Next Plane: Beer and Barcalounger   method
      
      
      At 11:55 AM 4/19/2011, you wrote:
      >
      >http://www.newscientist.com/article/dn20018-acrobatic-flying-robots-steal-the-show.html
      >
      
        I think I first observed an R/C quad-copter demo about
        two years ago. The vehicle was locally stabilized (piezo
        rate gyros and control loops not unlike your wing-leveler).
        This allowed the pilot to concentrate on maneuvering inputs
        without having to be also skilled in stability.
      
        The obvious next step was to augment the pilot for
        maneuvering control (which lets pilot move up to mission
        management). The final step will be autonomous mission
        management.
      
        I had the privilege of working with HBC on a couple
        of UAV projects . . . looking back, it was astounding
        now what we did not yet know. But we did have the right
        team. King radio for autopilot, Ball Aerospace for sensor
        package, Collins for GPS (would you believe the smallest
        and lightest P-mode GPS receiver was about 12 pounds and 75 cubic
        inches?), Singer-Kearfott for flight management computer,
        HBC for airframe, and Israel Aerospace Industries for
        the ground station. We all had proven hardware that
        was begging for a sensible integration. My job was to
        figure out how to get all those independently developed
        systems to talk to each other. We were proposing a sort
        of 'telephone exchange' and interpreter that would accept
        data from all systems, convert to new language as necessary
        and send to all systems with interest in that data. I
        had a 30 cubic inch, 1 pound budget for a very busy little
        black box.
      
        The program blew up when the prime contractor who shall
        remain nameless insisted on injecting their own expertise
        from a staff of PhD managers who had never designed or built
        anything. They proposed a system that was more pie-in-the-sky
        than a rational extension of our proven capabilities. We blew
        about $10M on that program.
      
        Looking at what these people do today has me wondering
        how the story might have evolved differently if a Walter Beech,
        Duane Wallace, Ed King or Bill Lear had been at the
        helm. You gotta love the slabs of silicon and workstations
        compilers . . . it just keeps getting better and better.
      
      
         Bob . . . 
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: 
Single shunt with two altenators Main and Stby
From: 
"rvg8tor" <rvg8tor(at)comcast.net>
Date: 
Apr 19, 2011
      
      
      I have a Z12 design with the SD20 standby alternator.  I am trying to decide if
      I can leave out the shunt for the SD20.  The Dynon FlightDEK 180 supports a single
      ammeter so here are my thoughts.
      
      1. Run each alternator to separate ANLs but tie the down stream ends of the ANLs
      together then to the high side of the ammeter shunt, the low side of the shunt
      takes the power flow to the battery side of the start contactor.  My start
      contactor is on the firewall side but the battery contactor is on the cockpit
      side, I use the fat wire that ties the battery contactor to the start contactor
      for double duty, it gets power to the starter via the start contactor but when
      not starting is carries the power from the alternator though the firewall,
      the main buss power picks up at the switched side of the battery contactor.
      
      With this setup the standby alternator only comes on when the bus voltage drops,
      which means the main alternator has or is failing, so since only one alternator
      at time is working this will allow the shunt to work double duty as it were,
      it shows the current going to the bus and battery, this current supplied is
      either from the main alternator or the standby one.
      
      So will this work or am I missing something important here.
      
      Option 2:
      
      Just don't have a shunt for the standby alternator and use the single shunt for
      the monitoring of the load on the main alternator.
      
      I know I can install a second shunt and use a switch to send the signal to the
      EMS for which shunt data I want displayed but this seems like extra parts for
      little benefit.
      
      As you can tell I really don't want to install a second shunt if I can help it.
      I also don't plan to use the hall effect option for the standby regulator.
      
      Thanks for any help.
      
      --------
      Mike "Nemo" Elliott
      RV-8A QB (Fuselage)
      
      
      Read this topic online here:
      
      http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=337526#337526
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
Date: 
Apr 19, 2011
Subject: 
TurboCAD 10
From: 
Richard Girard <aslsa.rng(at)gmail.com>
      
      Recently there was a post about cheap TC version 10. I ordered it and got it
      yesterday. This version of the software won't run on anything later than
      Windows XP. I've spent about two hours trying to find a compatibility mode
      that will let it run on my Windows Vista Lap top to no avail. Anyone know of
      a patch?
      
      Rick Girard
      
      -- 
      Zulu Delta
      Mk IIIC
      Thanks, Homer GBYM
      
      It isn't necessary to have relatives in Kansas City in order to be unhappy.
        - Groucho Marx
      
________________________________________________________________________________
Date: 
Apr 19, 2011
From: 
John Morgensen <john(at)morgensen.com>
Subject: 
Re: TurboCAD 10
      
      
      I have TurboCAD Deluxe v10.2 build 70.1 (from Help->about) running fine 
      on Windows 7.
      
      John Morgensen
      RV4 - flying
      RV9A - soon
      
      On 4/19/2011 2:00 PM, Richard Girard wrote:
      > Recently there was a post about cheap TC version 10. I ordered it and 
      > got it yesterday. This version of the software won't run on anything 
      > later than Windows XP. I've spent about two hours trying to find a 
      > compatibility mode that will let it run on my Windows Vista Lap top to 
      > no avail. Anyone know of a patch?
      >
      > Rick Girard
      >
      > -- 
      > Zulu Delta
      > Mk IIIC
      > Thanks, Homer GBYM
      >
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
Date: 
Apr 19, 2011
Subject: 
Re: TurboCAD 10
From: 
b d <gpabruce(at)gmail.com>
      
      Rick . . . are you running into that 32/64 bit delema thing?  I don't know
      but I know some 32 bit programs won't run on 64 . . .hence win 7 and Vista
      maybe? I'm only guessing . . . shooting in the dark . . .aiming for Bill
      Gates but still missing . . .how much was TC 10?
      
      Bruce
      
      On Tue, Apr 19, 2011 at 2:00 PM, Richard Girard  wrote:
      
      > Recently there was a post about cheap TC version 10. I ordered it and got
      > it yesterday. This version of the software won't run on anything later than
      > Windows XP. I've spent about two hours trying to find a compatibility mode
      > that will let it run on my Windows Vista Lap top to no avail. Anyone know of
      > a patch?
      >
      > Rick Girard
      >
      > --
      > Zulu Delta
      > Mk IIIC
      > Thanks, Homer GBYM
      >
      > It isn't necessary to have relatives in Kansas City in order to be unhappy.
      >   - Groucho Marx
      >
      >
      > *
      >
      > *
      >
      >
      
________________________________________________________________________________
Date: 
Apr 19, 2011
From: 
"Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <nuckolls.bob(at)aeroelectric.com>
Subject: 
Re: Single shunt with two altenators Main   and Stby
      
      
      >
      >As you can tell I really don't want to install a second shunt if I 
      >can help it.
      
      
          Then don't do it. Main alternator-out operations
          should be according to a PLAN.
      
      >   I also don't plan to use the hall effect option for the standby regulator.
      
          Is this a 'option'? The regulator was designed
          to annunciate failure of the main alternator
          as indicated by the alternator picking up ship's
          loads. Circuitry within the regulator reads the b-lead
          current and stops the ALTERNATOR LOADED light from
          flashing when total loads drop below 20A.
      
      >Thanks for any help.
      
          You don't need to install ANY ammeters. They
          are adjuncts to troubleshooting . . . not
          in-flight systems management. But the hall
          effect sensor on the SB1B regulator is not
          an ammeter. It is part of an adjunct to in-flight
          operations in the Z-12 configuration.
      
          You can run the SD-20 on about any alternator
          regulator for a 14V system. But the B&C standby
          regulators offer ALTERNATOR LOADED annunciation
          to signal the main alternator failure.
      
      I know I can install a second shunt and use a switch to send the 
      signal to the EMS for which shunt data I want displayed but this 
      seems like extra parts for little benefit.
      
          What's your proposed Plan-B for pressing
          the SD-20 into service as backup for a failed
          alternator?
      
      
         Bob . . . 
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: 
Re: Single shunt with two altenators Main and Stby
From: 
"rvg8tor" <rvg8tor(at)comcast.net>
Date: 
Apr 19, 2011
      
      
      I can't figure out how to break up the quoted part so my answers are in blue. 
      
      
      
      nuckolls.bob(at)aeroelect wrote:
      > 
      > > 
      > > As you can tell I really don't want to install a second shunt if I 
      > > can help it.
      > > 
      > > 
      > 
      > 
      >     Then don't do it. Main alternator-out operations
      >     should be according to a PLAN.
      > 
      > 
      > >    I also don't plan to use the hall effect option for the standby regulator.
      > > 
      > > 
      > > 
      > 
      >     Is this a 'option'? The regulator was designed
      >     to annunciate failure of the main alternator
      >     as indicated by the alternator picking up ship's
      >     loads. Circuitry within the regulator reads the b-lead
      >     current and stops the ALTERNATOR LOADED light from
      >     flashing when total loads drop below 20A.
      > 
      > 
      > > 
      > > 
      > > The light comes on when the standby alternator comes on the instructions say
      that the hall effect is optional to show when the load comes under 20A with
      the blinking light, mine would just show a steady light.  My plan is I know what
      equipment I want on and I plan to shutoff or pull the CB for all unwanted items,
      I know I will be under 20A with this plan.  Also with my main alternator
      off (I would do this as part of the failure procedure) I would see the load
      on the ammeter coming from the standby alternator with the one shunt two alternator
      connection I asked about in the first post.  So would this work,  I am trying
      to find the pitfalls.
      > > Thanks for any help.
      > > 
      > > 
      > 
      >     You don't need to install ANY ammeters. They
      >     are adjuncts to troubleshooting . . . not
      >     in-flight systems management. But the hall
      >     effect sensor on the SB1B regulator is not
      >     an ammeter. It is part of an adjunct to in-flight
      >     operations in the Z-12 configuration.
      > 
      >     You can run the SD-20 on about any alternator
      >     regulator for a 14V system. But the B&C standby
      >     regulators offer ALTERNATOR LOADED annunciation
      >     to signal the main alternator failure.
      > 
      > As far as I can tell the light will still come on to show the SD20 is providing
      power, I just will not get the blinking overloaded light unless I read it wrong.
      > 
      > From the install instructions:
      > 
      > "The SB1B-14 will operate without the hall-effect current sensor attached.  The
      Standby Alternator ON annunciator will illuminate normally but will not flash
      if the standby alternator output is below 20 amps."
      > 
      > I know I can install a second shunt and use a switch to send the 
      > signal to the EMS for which shunt data I want displayed but this 
      > seems like extra parts for little benefit.
      > 
      >     What's your proposed Plan-B for pressing
      >     the SD-20 into service as backup for a failed
      >     alternator?
      > 
      > As stated above if it comes on I would reduce the load to a know set of equipment
      and known amp level.  
      > 
      >    Bob . . .
      
      
      So will hooking both B leads to one side of the shunt be harmful in any way, since
      only one alternator is on at a time, I should always read the amperage being
      provided to the main but and battery no matter which alternator is providing
      the power.  Is there any instance when both alternators would be outputting
      power under the Z12 plan?
      
      --------
      Mike "Nemo" Elliott
      RV-8A QB (Fuselage)
      
      
      Read this topic online here:
      
      http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=337552#337552
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
Date: 
Apr 19, 2011
Subject: 
Re: TurboCAD 10
From: 
Richard Girard <aslsa.rng(at)gmail.com>
      
      Bruce, $14 including shipping.
      
      Rick
      
      On Tue, Apr 19, 2011 at 5:01 PM, b d  wrote:
      
      > Rick . . . are you running into that 32/64 bit delema thing?  I don't know
      > but I know some 32 bit programs won't run on 64 . . .hence win 7 and Vista
      > maybe? I'm only guessing . . . shooting in the dark . . .aiming for Bill
      > Gates but still missing . . .how much was TC 10?
      >
      > Bruce
      >
      > On Tue, Apr 19, 2011 at 2:00 PM, Richard Girard wrote:
      >
      >> Recently there was a post about cheap TC version 10. I ordered it and got
      >> it yesterday. This version of the software won't run on anything later than
      >> Windows XP. I've spent about two hours trying to find a compatibility mode
      >> that will let it run on my Windows Vista Lap top to no avail. Anyone know of
      >> a patch?
      >>
      >> Rick Girard
      >>
      >> --
      >> Zulu Delta
      >> Mk IIIC
      >> Thanks, Homer GBYM
      >>
      >> It isn't necessary to have relatives in Kansas City in order to be
      >> unhappy.
      >>   - Groucho Marx
      >>
      >>
      >> *
      >>
      >> ist" target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?AeroElectric-List
      >> ttp://forums.matronics.com
      >> _blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution
      >> *
      >>
      >>
      > *
      >
      > *
      >
      >
      
      
      -- 
      Zulu Delta
      Mk IIIC
      Thanks, Homer GBYM
      
      It isn't necessary to have relatives in Kansas City in order to be unhappy.
        - Groucho Marx
      
________________________________________________________________________________
From: 
"Jerald Folkerts" <jfolkerts1(at)gmail.com>
Subject: 
TurboCAD 10
Date: 
Apr 19, 2011
      
      Rick,
      
                      I went to the same page, but purchased the Turbo Cad 15
      version.  Was only 12.95 including shipping and it's Windows 7 compatible.
      I haven't done much with it yet, but it did install and I moved a few lines
      around etc.
      
      Jerry Folkerts
      
      SR2500 #093
      
      
      From: owner-aeroelectric-list-server(at)matronics.com
      [mailto:owner-aeroelectric-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of b d
      Sent: Tuesday, April 19, 2011 5:01 PM
      Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: TurboCAD 10
      
      
      Rick . . . are you running into that 32/64 bit delema thing?  I don't know
      but I know some 32 bit programs won't run on 64 . . .hence win 7 and Vista
      maybe? I'm only guessing . . . shooting in the dark . . .aiming for Bill
      Gates but still missing . . .how much was TC 10?  
      
      
      Bruce
      
      On Tue, Apr 19, 2011 at 2:00 PM, Richard Girard  wrote:
      
      Recently there was a post about cheap TC version 10. I ordered it and got it
      yesterday. This version of the software won't run on anything later than
      Windows XP. I've spent about two hours trying to find a compatibility mode
      that will let it run on my Windows Vista Lap top to no avail. Anyone know of
      a patch? 
      
      
      Rick Girard
      
      -- 
      
      Zulu Delta
      
      Mk IIIC
      
      Thanks, Homer GBYM
      
      
      It isn't necessary to have relatives in Kansas City in order to be unhappy.
        - Groucho Marx
      
      
      ist" target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?AeroElectric-List
      ttp://forums.matronics.com
      _blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
Date: 
Apr 19, 2011
Subject: 
Re: TurboCAD 10
From: 
b d <gpabruce(at)gmail.com>
      
      Which version did you get?
      
      On Tue, Apr 19, 2011 at 5:03 PM, Richard Girard  wrote:
      
      > Bruce, $14 including shipping.
      >
      > Rick
      >
      >  On Tue, Apr 19, 2011 at 5:01 PM, b d  wrote:
      >
      >>  Rick . . . are you running into that 32/64 bit delema thing?  I don't
      >> know but I know some 32 bit programs won't run on 64 . . .hence win 7 and
      >> Vista maybe? I'm only guessing . . . shooting in the dark . . .aiming for
      >> Bill Gates but still missing . . .how much was TC 10?
      >>
      >> Bruce
      >>
      >>  On Tue, Apr 19, 2011 at 2:00 PM, Richard Girard wrote:
      >>
      >>>  Recently there was a post about cheap TC version 10. I ordered it and
      >>> got it yesterday. This version of the software won't run on anything later
      >>> than Windows XP. I've spent about two hours trying to find a compatibility
      >>> mode that will let it run on my Windows Vista Lap top to no avail. Anyone
      >>> know of a patch?
      >>>
      >>>  Rick Girard
      >>>
      >>> --
      >>> Zulu Delta
      >>> Mk IIIC
      >>> Thanks, Homer GBYM
      >>>
      >>>  It isn't necessary to have relatives in Kansas City in order to be
      >>> unhappy.
      >>>   - Groucho Marx
      >>>
      >>>
      >>> *
      >>>
      >>> ist" target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?AeroElectric-List
      >>> ttp://forums.matronics.com
      >>> _blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution
      >>> *
      >>>
      >>>
      >> *
      >>
      >> ist" target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?AeroElectric-List
      >> tp://forums.matronics.com
      >> _blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution
      >> *
      >>
      >>
      >
      >
      > --
      > Zulu Delta
      > Mk IIIC
      > Thanks, Homer GBYM
      >
      > It isn't necessary to have relatives in Kansas City in order to be unhappy.
      >   - Groucho Marx
      >
      >
      >  *
      >
      > *
      >
      >
      
________________________________________________________________________________
From: 
"Jim Wickert" <jimw_btg(at)earthlink.net>
Subject: 
TurboCAD 10
Date: 
Apr 20, 2011
      
      Go to this site they have TurboCad 15 which will run all XP, Vista, W7,
      2D/3D ... $9.95   http://store.purplus.net/tu15de2d.html
      
      
      Jim Wickert
      
      Tel 920-467-0219
      
      Cell 920-912-1014
      
      
      From: owner-aeroelectric-list-server(at)matronics.com
      [mailto:owner-aeroelectric-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Jerald
      Folkerts
      Sent: Tuesday, April 19, 2011 6:42 PM
      Subject: RE: AeroElectric-List: TurboCAD 10
      
      
      Rick,
      
                      I went to the same page, but purchased the Turbo Cad 15
      version.  Was only 12.95 including shipping and it's Windows 7 compatible.
      I haven't done much with it yet, but it did install and I moved a few lines
      around etc.
      
      Jerry Folkerts
      
      SR2500 #093
      
      
      From: owner-aeroelectric-list-server(at)matronics.com
      [mailto:owner-aeroelectric-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of b d
      Sent: Tuesday, April 19, 2011 5:01 PM
      Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: TurboCAD 10
      
      
      Rick . . . are you running into that 32/64 bit delema thing?  I don't know
      but I know some 32 bit programs won't run on 64 . . .hence win 7 and Vista
      maybe? I'm only guessing . . . shooting in the dark . . .aiming for Bill
      Gates but still missing . . .how much was TC 10?  
      
      
      Bruce
      
      On Tue, Apr 19, 2011 at 2:00 PM, Richard Girard  wrote:
      
      Recently there was a post about cheap TC version 10. I ordered it and got it
      yesterday. This version of the software won't run on anything later than
      Windows XP. I've spent about two hours trying to find a compatibility mode
      that will let it run on my Windows Vista Lap top to no avail. Anyone know of
      a patch? 
      
      
      Rick Girard
      
      -- 
      
      Zulu Delta
      
      Mk IIIC
      
      Thanks, Homer GBYM
      
      
      It isn't necessary to have relatives in Kansas City in order to be unhappy.
        - Groucho Marx
      
      
      ist" target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?AeroElectric-List
      ttp://forums.matronics.com
      _blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution
      
      
      http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?AeroElectric-List
      
      http://forums.matronics.com
      
      http://www.matronics.com/contribution
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
Date: 
Apr 20, 2011
Subject: 
Re: TurboCAD 10
From: 
b d <gpabruce(at)gmail.com>
      
      Thanks Jim . . . .Bruce
      
      On Wed, Apr 20, 2011 at 6:33 AM, Jim Wickert  wrote
      :
      
      >  Go to this site they have TurboCad 15 which will run all XP, Vista, W7,
      > 2D/3D =85=85. $9.95   http://store.purplus.net/tu15de2d.html
      >
      >
      > Jim Wickert
      >
      > Tel 920-467-0219
      >
      > Cell 920-912-1014
      >
      >
      > *From:* owner-aeroelectric-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:
      > owner-aeroelectric-list-server(at)matronics.com] *On Behalf Of *Jerald
      > Folkerts
      > *Sent:* Tuesday, April 19, 2011 6:42 PM
      >
      > *To:* aeroelectric-list(at)matronics.com
      > *Subject:* RE: AeroElectric-List: TurboCAD 10
      >
      >
      > Rick,
      >
      >                 I went to the same page, but purchased the Turbo Cad 15
      > version.  Was only 12.95 including shipping and it=92s Windows 7 compatib
      le.
      > I haven=92t done much with it yet, but it did install and I moved a few l
      ines
      > around etc.
      >
      > Jerry Folkerts
      >
      > SR2500 #093
      >
      >
      > *From:* owner-aeroelectric-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:
      > owner-aeroelectric-list-server(at)matronics.com] *On Behalf Of *b d
      > *Sent:* Tuesday, April 19, 2011 5:01 PM
      > *To:* aeroelectric-list(at)matronics.com
      > *Subject:* Re: AeroElectric-List: TurboCAD 10
      >
      >
      > Rick . . . are you running into that 32/64 bit delema thing?  I don't kno
      w
      > but I know some 32 bit programs won't run on 64 . . .hence win 7 and Vist
      a
      > maybe? I'm only guessing . . . shooting in the dark . . .aiming for Bill
      > Gates but still missing . . .how much was TC 10?
      >
      >
      > Bruce
      >
      > On Tue, Apr 19, 2011 at 2:00 PM, Richard Girard 
      > wrote:
      >
      > Recently there was a post about cheap TC version 10. I ordered it and got
      > it yesterday. This version of the software won't run on anything later th
      an
      > Windows XP. I've spent about two hours trying to find a compatibility mod
      e
      > that will let it run on my Windows Vista Lap top to no avail. Anyone know
       of
      > a patch?
      >
      >
      > Rick Girard
      >
      > --
      >
      > Zulu Delta
      >
      > Mk IIIC
      >
      > Thanks, Homer GBYM
      >
      >
      > It isn't necessary to have relatives in Kansas City in order to be unhapp
      y.
      >   - Groucho Marx
      >
      >
      > * *
      >
      > * *
      >
      > *ist" target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?AeroElectric-L
      ist*
      >
      > *ttp://forums.matronics.com*
      >
      > *_blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution*
      >
      > * *
      >
      >
      > * *
      >
      > * *
      >
      > * *
      >
      > *http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?AeroElectric-List*
      >
      > * *
      >
      > *http://forums.matronics.com*
      >
      > * *
      >
      > *http://www.matronics.com/contribution*
      >
      > * *
      >
      > * *
      >
      > * *
      >
      > * *
      >
      > **
      >
      > **
      >
      > **
      >
      > **
      >
      > **
      >
      > *http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?AeroElectric-List*
      >
      > **
      >
      > **
      >
      > *http://forums.matronics.com*
      >
      > **
      >
      > **
      >
      > **
      >
      > **
      >
      > *http://www.matronics.com/contribution*
      >
      > **
      >
      > * *
      >
      > *
      >
      ===========
      >
      ===========
      ===========
      ===========
      >
      > *
      >
      >
      
________________________________________________________________________________
Date: 
Apr 20, 2011
From: 
Henador Titzoff <henador_titzoff(at)yahoo.com>
Subject: 
Re: TurboCAD 10
      
      Jim,=0A=0ATurboCAD 15 costs 10 bucks, while AutoCAD 3D costs a boatload mor
      e. =C2-What features, if any, does TurboCAD lack that AutoCAD 3D has? =C2
      -The price sure does sound good, but $10 is hardly anything for software 
      these days.=0A=0AIf it turns out that TurboCAD 15 is not too neutered, then
       it has to be the best bang for the buck we've run across in a long time!
      =0A=C2-=0AHenador Titzoff=0A=0A=0A________________________________=0AFrom
      : Jim Wickert =0ATo: aeroelectric-list(at)matronics.co
      m=0ASent: Wednesday, April 20, 2011 9:33 AM=0ASubject: Re: AeroElectric-Lis
      t: TurboCAD 10=0A=0A=0AGo to this site they have TurboCad 15 which will run
       all XP, Vista, W7, 2D/3D . $9.95=C2-=C2- http://stor
      e.purplus.net/tu15de2d.html=0A=C2-=0AJim Wickert=0ATel 920-467-0219=0ACel
      l 920-912-1014=0A=C2-=0AFrom:owner-aeroelectric-list-server(at)matronics.com
       [mailto:owner-aeroelectric-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Jerald 
      Folkerts=0ASent: Tuesday, April 19, 2011 6:42 PM=0ATo: aeroelectric-list@ma
      tronics.com=0ASubject: RE: AeroElectric-List: TurboCAD 10=0A=C2-=0ARick,
      =0A=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-
      =C2-=C2-=C2- I went to the same page, but purchased the Turbo Cad 15 
      version.=C2- Was only 12.95 including shipping and it=99s Windows 7
       compatible.=C2- I haven=99t done much with it yet, but it did inst
      all and I moved a few lines around etc.=0AJerry Folkerts=0ASR2500 #093=0A
      =C2-=0AFrom:owner-aeroelectric-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-ae
      roelectric-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of b d=0ASent: Tuesday, Apr
      il 19, 2011 5:01 PM=0ATo: aeroelectric-list(at)matronics.com=0ASubject: Re: Ae
      roElectric-List: TurboCAD 10=0A=C2-=0ARick . . . are you running into tha
      t 32/64 bit delema thing?=C2- I don't know but I know some 32 bit program
      s won't run on 64 . . .hence win 7 and Vista maybe? I'm only guessing . . .
      =C2-shooting in the dark . . .aiming for Bill Gates but still missing . .
       .how much was TC 10?=C2-=C2-=0A=C2-=0ABruce=0AOn Tue, Apr 19, 2011 a
      t 2:00 PM, Richard Girard  wrote:=0ARecently there was
       a post about cheap TC version 10. I ordered it and got it yesterday. This 
      version of the software won't run on anything later than Windows XP. I've s
      pent about two hours trying to find a compatibility mode that will let it r
      un on my Windows Vista Lap top to no avail. Anyone know of a patch? =0A=C2
      -=0ARick Girard=0A=0A-- =0AZulu Delta=0AMk IIIC=0AThanks, Homer GBYM=0A
      =C2-=0AIt isn't necessary to have relatives in Kansas City in order to be
       unhappy.=0A=C2- - Groucho Marx=0A=C2-=0A=C2-=0A=C2-=0A=C2-=0Aist
      " target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?AeroElectric-List=0A
      ttp://forums.matronics.com=0A_blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution
      =0A=C2-=0A=C2-=0A=C2-=0A=C2-=0A=C2-=0Ahttp://www.matronics.com/Na
      vigator?AeroElectric-List=0A=C2-=0Ahttp://forums.matronics.com=0A=C2-
      =0Ahttp://www.matronics.com/contribution=0A=C2-=0A=C2-=0A=C2-=0A=C2
      -=0Ahttp://www.matronics.com/Navigator?AeroElectric-List=0Ahttp://forums.
      ============= 
      
________________________________________________________________________________
From: 
"Jim Wickert" <jimw_btg(at)earthlink.net>
Subject: 
TurboCAD 15
Date: 
Apr 20, 2011
      
      Henador
      
      My Company. Business Technology Group is an Engineering Design 
      house that I owned for 31 years now, we have 10 Pro-E 
      seatsI can pound out some pretty quick designs with 
      TurboCad and not miss much in the basic 2D design and will stay head of 
      AutoCad pretty much all the time.TurboCad 15 also comes with a 
      PCB design set as well.  For the cost of $9.95 I don=99t believe 
      you can=99t lose. 
      
      
      Take Care happy designing. 
      
      
      Jim Wickert
      
      Tel 920-467-0219
      
      Cell 920-912-1014
      
      
      From: owner-aeroelectric-list-server(at)matronics.com 
      [mailto:owner-aeroelectric-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of 
      Henador Titzoff
      Sent: Wednesday, April 20, 2011 10:07 AM
      Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: TurboCAD 10
      
      
      Jim,
      
      
      TurboCAD 15 costs 10 bucks, while AutoCAD 3D costs a boatload more.  
      What features, if any, does TurboCAD lack that AutoCAD 3D has?  The 
      price sure does sound good, but $10 is hardly anything for software 
      these days.
      
      
      If it turns out that TurboCAD 15 is not too neutered, then it has to be 
      the best bang for the buck we've run across in a long time!
      
      
      Henador Titzoff
      
        _____  
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
Date: 
Apr 20, 2011
Subject: 
Re: TurboCAD 10
From: 
Richard Girard <aslsa.rng(at)gmail.com>
      
      Thanks guys, I found a good price on the latest version (17) and ordered it
      .
      I use CAD a lot so the slight extra is worth it.
      
      Rick Girard
      
      On Wed, Apr 20, 2011 at 8:33 AM, Jim Wickert  wrote
      :
      
      > Go to this site they have TurboCad 15 which will run all XP, Vista, W7,
      > 2D/3D =85=85. $9.95   http://store.purplus.net/tu15de2d.html
      >
      >
      > Jim Wickert
      >
      > Tel 920-467-0219
      >
      > Cell 920-912-1014
      >
      >
      > *From:* owner-aeroelectric-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:
      > owner-aeroelectric-list-server(at)matronics.com] *On Behalf Of *Jerald
      > Folkerts
      > *Sent:* Tuesday, April 19, 2011 6:42 PM
      > *To:* aeroelectric-list(at)matronics.com
      > *Subject:* RE: AeroElectric-List: TurboCAD 10
      >
      >
      > Rick,
      >
      >                 I went to the same page, but purchased the Turbo Cad 15
      > version.  Was only 12.95 including shipping and it=92s Windows 7 compatib
      le.
      > I haven=92t done much with it yet, but it did install and I moved a few l
      ines
      > around etc.
      >
      > Jerry Folkerts
      >
      > SR2500 #093
      >
      >
      > *From:* owner-aeroelectric-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:
      > owner-aeroelectric-list-server(at)matronics.com] *On Behalf Of *b d
      > *Sent:* Tuesday, April 19, 2011 5:01 PM
      > *To:* aeroelectric-list(at)matronics.com
      > *Subject:* Re: AeroElectric-List: TurboCAD 10
      >
      >
      > Rick . . . are you running into that 32/64 bit delema thing?  I don't kno
      w
      > but I know some 32 bit programs won't run on 64 . . .hence win 7 and Vist
      a
      > maybe? I'm only guessing . . . shooting in the dark . . .aiming for Bill
      > Gates but still missing . . .how much was TC 10?
      >
      >
      > Bruce
      >
      > On Tue, Apr 19, 2011 at 2:00 PM, Richard Girard 
      > wrote:
      >
      > Recently there was a post about cheap TC version 10. I ordered it and got
      > it yesterday. This version of the software won't run on anything later th
      an
      > Windows XP. I've spent about two hours trying to find a compatibility mod
      e
      > that will let it run on my Windows Vista Lap top to no avail. Anyone know
       of
      > a patch?
      >
      >
      > Rick Girard
      >
      > --
      >
      > Zulu Delta
      >
      > Mk IIIC
      >
      > Thanks, Homer GBYM
      >
      >
      > It isn't necessary to have relatives in Kansas City in order to be unhapp
      y.
      >   - Groucho Marx
      >
      >
      > * *
      >
      > * *
      >
      > *ist" target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?AeroElectric-L
      ist*
      >
      > *ttp://forums.matronics.com*
      >
      > *_blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution*
      >
      > * *
      >
      >
      > * *
      >
      > * *
      >
      > * *
      >
      > *http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?AeroElectric-List*
      >
      > * *
      >
      > *http://forums.matronics.com*
      >
      > * *
      >
      > *http://www.matronics.com/contribution*
      >
      > * *
      >
      > * *
      >
      > * *
      >
      > * *
      >
      > **
      >
      > **
      >
      > **
      >
      > **
      >
      > **
      >
      > *http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?AeroElectric-List*
      >
      > **
      >
      > **
      >
      > *http://forums.matronics.com*
      >
      > **
      >
      > **
      >
      > **
      >
      > **
      >
      > *http://www.matronics.com/contribution*
      >
      > **
      >
      > * *
      >
      > *
      >
      ===========
      ===========
      ===========
      ===========
      > *
      >
      >
      
      
      -- 
      Zulu Delta
      Mk IIIC
      Thanks, Homer GBYM
      
      It isn't necessary to have relatives in Kansas City in order to be unhappy.
        - Groucho Marx
      
________________________________________________________________________________
Date: 
Apr 20, 2011
Subject: 
Re: AEC9009 Audio Iso Amp Wiring, especially  Shielded
      Wires
From: 
Jared Yates <email(at)jaredyates.com>
      
      Does anyone know of any guidance about how to use shielded wires in audio
      systems?
      
      On Mon, Apr 18, 2011 at 2:09 PM, Jared Yates  wrote:
      
      > AEC questions
      >
      > I'm wiring the AEC 9009 Audio Iso Amp and want to be sure that I'm doing it
      > correctly.  I don't understand entirely about how and when wires need to be
      > shielded in this case.  I have a single Nav/Com (GNS430), a Flightcom 403
      > stereo intercom, a pilot position with a push-to-talk, a co-pilot position
      > with a push-to-talk, and two back seat passengers.  Inputs to the 9009 are
      > the Dynon warning tones from the HS34, the 430 Nav audio, and a stereo ipod
      > jack.
      >
      > Here's my wiring plan so far:
      > 1. Connect the dynon HS34 tone output with a single-wire shielded cable at
      > the 9009's pin 4(center conductor) and 10(sheild), leaving the Dynon's end
      > of the shielded cable not connected to anything.
      >
      > 2. Use another single-wire shielded cable to connect the 430 Nav Audio Hi
      > output to the 9009's pin 2(center conductor) and the Nav Audio Lo to the
      > 9009 pin 11(shield).  Is this correct, or do I need two conductors and a
      > shield, with the shield wired as per 1 (connected at 9009, clipped at the
      > other end)?
      >
      > 3.  Connect a 3.5mm stereo jack to the 9009 with a 2-wire shielded cable:
      > one conductor from the jack to 9009 pin 1, one conductor from the jack to
      > 9009 pin 5, and the shield from the 3.5mm jack's ground to pin 12 on the
      > 9009 (and the jack isolated from the airframe ground).  Same question as
      > number 2- Is this correct?  Do I instead need to run a 3-wire shielded
      > cable, with the third conductor connected to the jack's ground, and the
      > shield wired as in number 1 above?
      >
      > 4. Run the left and right outputs of the 9009 (pins 7 and 6) to the
      > flightcom's aux input channels.  What about shields here?  Should I run a
      > single cable with two wires, or does each conductor need to be in its own
      > shield?
      >
      > 5. Run the power to pin 8 on the 9009 with a 22AWG wire that is crimped in
      > the same faston terminal as the intercom's power line so that they share a
      > 1A fuse.
      >
      > 6. Wire the rest of the audio system (pilot, copilot, pax mic/phone jacks)
      > per the flightcom directions, using 3-wire shielded cable with the jacks
      > isolated from the airframe.  What do I need to do with the shields?
      >
      > The Flightcom manual says that it has fail safe wiring that connects the
      > pilot jacks to the radio if the intercom loses power, so I was planning to
      > skip the fail-safe jacks described in the AEC9009 literature.  Is there any
      > other reason why I would want to include them?  I can think of two cases
      > where they would be useful.  First, as described in the flightcom manual, if
      > the intercom were to become inop and I removed it to send it away, I could
      > still fly the airplane with a single functioning headset by using the
      > directly wired jacks.  If I omit the direct jacks, then this feature would
      > not be available.  Second, if the intercom failsafe system were to fail and
      > the intercom were to both fail at the same time, I would be unable to use
      > the 430's Com and would have to resort to the backup handheld and its
      > headset adapter cord.  Both of these circumstances seem pretty unlikely, and
      > I think I'm willing to live without a solution for them.  Are there any
      > other good reasons to have the failsafe jacks that I might be forgetting
      > about?
      >
      > My plan is to keep the 430 com functions out of the 9009 completely, since
      > the intercom has channels for xmit and receive audio.  This will keep the
      > AEC out of the equation, and if it becomes inop then VHF communications will
      > not be effected.  Is there any reason why I shouldn't do it this way?
      >
      >
      > *
      >
      > *
      >
      >
      
________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: 
Lightening up Z12
From: 
"rvg8tor" <rvg8tor(at)comcast.net>
Date: 
Apr 20, 2011
      
      
      I am going to ask this question a different way.  In Z12 there are 2 alternators,
      on plays a standby roll and will only produce power when the main alternator
      goes out or is turned off.  Given that only one alternator operates at a time
      only one ammeter would be needed to monitor the electrical load coming from
      the alternator providing the power.  
      
      This reduces parts count; takes out a shunt and switch required to look at two
      shunts with on meter and or removes extra ammeter.
      
      So does anyone see any flaws in this logic?
      
      Cheers
      
      --------
      Mike "Nemo" Elliott
      RV-8A QB (Fuselage)
      
      
      Read this topic online here:
      
      http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=337618#337618
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
Date: 
Apr 20, 2011
From: 
David <ainut(at)knology.net>
Subject: 
Re: TurboCAD 10
      
      
      Well, please tell us how much and where you found it!
      
      David
      
      
      Richard Girard wrote:
      > Thanks guys, I found a good price on the latest version (17) and 
      > ordered it. I use CAD a lot so the slight extra is worth it.
      >
      > Rick Girard
      >
      > On Wed, Apr 20, 2011 at 8:33 AM, Jim Wickert  > wrote:
      >
      >     Go to this site they have TurboCad 15 which will run all XP,
      >     Vista, W7, 2D/3D . $9.95 http://store.purplus.net/tu15de2d.html
      >
      >     Jim Wickert
      >
      >     Tel 920-467-0219 
      >
      >     Cell 920-912-1014 
      >
      >     *From:* owner-aeroelectric-list-server(at)matronics.com
      >     
      >     [mailto:owner-aeroelectric-list-server(at)matronics.com
      >     ] *On Behalf
      >     Of *Jerald Folkerts
      >     *Sent:* Tuesday, April 19, 2011 6:42 PM
      >     *To:* aeroelectric-list(at)matronics.com
      >     
      >     *Subject:* RE: AeroElectric-List: TurboCAD 10
      >
      >     Rick,
      >
      >                     I went to the same page, but purchased the Turbo
      >     Cad 15 version.  Was only 12.95 including shipping and its
      >     Windows 7 compatible.  I havent done much with it yet, but it did
      >     install and I moved a few lines around etc.
      >
      >     Jerry Folkerts
      >
      >     SR2500 #093
      >
      >     *From:* owner-aeroelectric-list-server(at)matronics.com
      >     
      >     [mailto:owner-aeroelectric-list-server(at)matronics.com
      >     ] *On Behalf
      >     Of *b d
      >     *Sent:* Tuesday, April 19, 2011 5:01 PM
      >     *To:* aeroelectric-list(at)matronics.com
      >     
      >     *Subject:* Re: AeroElectric-List: TurboCAD 10
      >
      >     Rick . . . are you running into that 32/64 bit delema thing?  I
      >     don't know but I know some 32 bit programs won't run on 64 . .
      >     .hence win 7 and Vista maybe? I'm only guessing . . . shooting in
      >     the dark . . .aiming for Bill Gates but still missing . . .how
      >     much was TC 10?
      >
      >     Bruce
      >
      >     On Tue, Apr 19, 2011 at 2:00 PM, Richard Girard
      >     > wrote:
      >
      >     Recently there was a post about cheap TC version 10. I ordered it
      >     and got it yesterday. This version of the software won't run on
      >     anything later than Windows XP. I've spent about two hours trying
      >     to find a compatibility mode that will let it run on my Windows
      >     Vista Lap top to no avail. Anyone know of a patch?
      >
      >     Rick Girard
      >
      >     -- 
      >
      >     Zulu Delta
      >
      >     Mk IIIC
      >
      >     Thanks, Homer GBYM
      >
      >     It isn't necessary to have relatives in Kansas City in order to be
      >     unhappy.
      >       - Groucho Marx
      >
      >     *  *
      >
      >     *  *
      >
      >     *ist" target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?AeroElectric-List*
      >
      >     *ttp://forums.matronics.com  <http://forums.matronics.com>*
      >
      >     *_blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution*
      >
      >     *  *
      >
      >     *  *
      >
      >     *  *
      >
      >     *  *
      >
      >     *http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?AeroElectric-List*
      >
      >     *  *
      >
      >     *http://forums.matronics.com*
      >
      >     *  *
      >
      >     *http://www.matronics.com/contribution*
      >
      >     *  *
      >
      >     *  *
      >
      >     *  *
      >
      >     *  *
      >
      >     **
      >
      >     **
      >
      >     **
      >
      >     **
      >
      >     **
      >
      >     *http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?AeroElectric-List*
      >
      >     **
      >
      >     **
      >
      >     *http://forums.matronics.com*
      >
      >     **
      >
      >     **
      >
      >     **
      >
      >     **
      >
      >     *http://www.matronics.com/contribution*
      >
      >     **
      >
      >     *  *
      >
      >     *
      >
      >     ist" target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?AeroElectric-List
      >     tp://forums.matronics.com
      >     _blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution
      >
      >     *
      >
      >
      > -- 
      > Zulu Delta
      > Mk IIIC
      > Thanks, Homer GBYM
      >
      > It isn't necessary to have relatives in Kansas City in order to be 
      > unhappy.
      >   - Groucho Marx
      >
      >
      > *
      >
      >
      > *
      
      -- 
      If you're an American, just say NO to the Obamanation, to socialism, and get rid
      of Soros.
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
Date: 
Apr 20, 2011
From: 
David <ainut(at)knology.net>
Subject: 
Re: TurboCAD 15
      
      
      Does it not handle 3d well?
      
      David
      
      
      Jim Wickert wrote:
      >
      > Henador
      >
      > My Company. Business Technology Group is an Engineering Design house 
      > that I owned for 31 years now, we have 10 Pro-E seatsI can pound out 
      > some pretty quick designs with TurboCad and not miss much in the basic 
      > 2D design and will stay head of AutoCad pretty much all the 
      > time.TurboCad 15 also comes with a PCB design set as well.  For the 
      > cost of $9.95 I dont believe you cant lose.
      >
      > Take Care happy designing.
      >
      > Jim Wickert
      >
      > Tel 920-467-0219
      >
      > Cell 920-912-1014
      >
      > *From:* owner-aeroelectric-list-server(at)matronics.com 
      > [mailto:owner-aeroelectric-list-server(at)matronics.com] *On Behalf Of 
      > *Henador Titzoff
      > *Sent:* Wednesday, April 20, 2011 10:07 AM
      > *To:* aeroelectric-list(at)matronics.com
      > *Subject:* Re: AeroElectric-List: TurboCAD 10
      >
      > Jim,
      >
      > TurboCAD 15 costs 10 bucks, while AutoCAD 3D costs a boatload more. 
      >  What features, if any, does TurboCAD lack that AutoCAD 3D has?  The 
      > price sure does sound good, but $10 is hardly anything for software 
      > these days.
      >
      > If it turns out that TurboCAD 15 is not too neutered, then it has to 
      > be the best bang for the buck we've run across in a long time!
      >
      > Henador Titzoff
      >
      > ------------------------------------------------------------------------
      > *
      >
      >
      > *
      
      -- 
      If you're an American, just say NO to the Obamanation, to socialism, and get rid
      of Soros.
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
From: 
"Terry Watson" <terry(at)tcwatson.com>
Subject: 
TurboCAD 15
Date: 
Apr 20, 2011
      
      
      The recent version of AutoCAD (2010) that I am been using handles 3D very well,
      but it costs about $4,000. I have been using AutoCAD since about 1985 for architectural
      (building) work, but I virtually never use the 3D functions because
      I have other much cheaper software that does what I need to do in 3D much easier.
      The current trend in CAD software seems to be towards specific applications.
      There are version of CAD software for architectural design, civil engineering,
      structural engineering, and of course mechanical and electrical engineering
      applications. AutoCAD has a sister program called Revit for architecture with
      versions for building structural and mechanical applications which is in a
      class called BIM, or Building Information Modeling software. The difference from
      CAD is that BIM software has an "awareness" of what it is drawing and creates
      a building model by assembling materials and components. 
      
      My favorite for 3D work is Google Sketchup, which is available FREE from their
      website. Just Google it and you can download it. I use a more expensive pro version,
      but almost everything that I do in it could be done with the free version.
      But I doubt very much if you would find Sketchup helpful for doing something
      like a wiring diagram. 
      
      Terry
      Seattle
      
      -----Original Message-----
      From: owner-aeroelectric-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-aeroelectric-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of David
      Sent: Wednesday, April 20, 2011 3:27 PM
      Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: TurboCAD 15
      
      
      Does it not handle 3d well?
      
      David
      
      
      Jim Wickert wrote:
      >
      > Henador
      >
      > My Company. Business Technology Group is an Engineering Design house 
      > that I owned for 31 years now, we have 10 Pro-E seatsI can pound out 
      > some pretty quick designs with TurboCad and not miss much in the basic 
      > 2D design and will stay head of AutoCad pretty much all the 
      > time.TurboCad 15 also comes with a PCB design set as well.  For the 
      > cost of $9.95 I dont believe you cant lose.
      >
      > Take Care happy designing.
      >
      > Jim Wickert
      >
      > Tel 920-467-0219
      >
      > Cell 920-912-1014
      >
      > *From:* owner-aeroelectric-list-server(at)matronics.com 
      > [mailto:owner-aeroelectric-list-server(at)matronics.com] *On Behalf Of 
      > *Henador Titzoff
      > *Sent:* Wednesday, April 20, 2011 10:07 AM
      > *To:* aeroelectric-list(at)matronics.com
      > *Subject:* Re: AeroElectric-List: TurboCAD 10
      >
      > Jim,
      >
      > TurboCAD 15 costs 10 bucks, while AutoCAD 3D costs a boatload more. 
      >  What features, if any, does TurboCAD lack that AutoCAD 3D has?  The 
      > price sure does sound good, but $10 is hardly anything for software 
      > these days.
      >
      > If it turns out that TurboCAD 15 is not too neutered, then it has to 
      > be the best bang for the buck we've run across in a long time!
      >
      > Henador Titzoff
      >
      > ------------------------------------------------------------------------
      > *
      >
      >
      > *
      
      -- 
      If you're an American, just say NO to the Obamanation, to socialism, and get rid
      of Soros.
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
Date: 
Apr 20, 2011
From: 
"Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <nuckolls.bob(at)aeroelectric.com>
Subject: 
Re: Lightening up Z12
      
      
      At 03:59 PM 4/20/2011, you wrote:
      >
      >I am going to ask this question a different way.  In Z12 there are 2 
      >alternators, on plays a standby roll and will only produce power 
      >when the main alternator goes out or is turned off.  Given that only 
      >one alternator operates at a time only one ammeter would be needed 
      >to monitor the electrical load coming from the alternator providing 
      >the power.
      >
      >This reduces parts count; takes out a shunt and switch required to 
      >look at two shunts with on meter and or removes extra ammeter.
      >
      >So does anyone see any flaws in this logic?
      
        That will work
      
      
         Bob . . . 
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
Date: 
Apr 20, 2011
Subject: 
Re: TurboCAD 10
From: 
Richard Girard <aslsa.rng(at)gmail.com>
      
      David, Version 17 was $60 with tax and shipping from Micro Center Online.
      
      Rick
      
      On Wed, Apr 20, 2011 at 5:22 PM, David  wrote:
      
      >
      > Well, please tell us how much and where you found it!
      >
      > David
      >
      >
      > Richard Girard wrote:
      >
      >> Thanks guys, I found a good price on the latest version (17) and ordered
      >> it. I use CAD a lot so the slight extra is worth it.
      >>
      >> Rick Girard
      >>
      >> On Wed, Apr 20, 2011 at 8:33 AM, Jim Wickert > jimw_btg(at)earthlink.net>> wrote:
      >>
      >>    Go to this site they have TurboCad 15 which will run all XP,
      >>    Vista, W7, 2D/3D =85=85. $9.95 http://store.purplus.net/tu15de2d.html
      >>
      >>    Jim Wickert
      >>
      >>    Tel 920-467-0219 
      >>
      >>    Cell 920-912-1014 
      >>
      >>    *From:* owner-aeroelectric-list-server(at)matronics.com
      >>    
      >>    [mailto:owner-aeroelectric-list-server(at)matronics.com
      >>    ] *On Behalf
      >>    Of *Jerald Folkerts
      >>    *Sent:* Tuesday, April 19, 2011 6:42 PM
      >>    *To:* aeroelectric-list(at)matronics.com
      >>    
      >>    *Subject:* RE: AeroElectric-List: TurboCAD 10
      >>
      >>    Rick,
      >>
      >>                    I went to the same page, but purchased the Turbo
      >>    Cad 15 version.  Was only 12.95 including shipping and it=92s
      >>    Windows 7 compatible.  I haven=92t done much with it yet, but it did
      >>    install and I moved a few lines around etc.
      >>
      >>    Jerry Folkerts
      >>
      >>    SR2500 #093
      >>
      >>    *From:* owner-aeroelectric-list-server(at)matronics.com
      >>    
      >>    [mailto:owner-aeroelectric-list-server(at)matronics.com
      >>    ] *On Behalf
      >>    Of *b d
      >>    *Sent:* Tuesday, April 19, 2011 5:01 PM
      >>    *To:* aeroelectric-list(at)matronics.com
      >>    
      >>    *Subject:* Re: AeroElectric-List: TurboCAD 10
      >>
      >>    Rick . . . are you running into that 32/64 bit delema thing?  I
      >>    don't know but I know some 32 bit programs won't run on 64 . .
      >>    .hence win 7 and Vista maybe? I'm only guessing . . . shooting in
      >>    the dark . . .aiming for Bill Gates but still missing . . .how
      >>    much was TC 10?
      >>
      >>    Bruce
      >>
      >>    On Tue, Apr 19, 2011 at 2:00 PM, Richard Girard
      >>    > wrote:
      >>
      >>    Recently there was a post about cheap TC version 10. I ordered it
      >>    and got it yesterday. This version of the software won't run on
      >>    anything later than Windows XP. I've spent about two hours trying
      >>    to find a compatibility mode that will let it run on my Windows
      >>    Vista Lap top to no avail. Anyone know of a patch?
      >>
      >>    Rick Girard
      >>
      >>    --
      >>    Zulu Delta
      >>
      >>    Mk IIIC
      >>
      >>    Thanks, Homer GBYM
      >>
      >>    It isn't necessary to have relatives in Kansas City in order to be
      >>    unhappy.
      >>      - Groucho Marx
      >>
      >>    *  *
      >>
      >>    *  *
      >>
      >>    *ist" target="_blank">
      >> http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?AeroElectric-List*
      >>
      >>    *ttp://forums.matronics.com  <http://forums.matronics.com>*
      >>
      >>    *_blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution*
      >>
      >>    *  *
      >>
      >>    *  *
      >>
      >>    *  *
      >>
      >>    *  *
      >>
      >>    *http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?AeroElectric-List*
      >>
      >>    *  *
      >>
      >>    *http://forums.matronics.com*
      >>
      >>    *  *
      >>
      >>    *http://www.matronics.com/contribution*
      >>
      >>    *  *
      >>
      >>    *  *
      >>
      >>    *  *
      >>
      >>    *  *
      >>
      >>    **
      >>
      >>    **
      >>
      >>    **
      >>
      >>    **
      >>
      >>    **
      >>
      >>    *http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?AeroElectric-List*
      >>
      >>    **
      >>
      >>    **
      >>
      >>    *http://forums.matronics.com*
      >>
      >>    **
      >>
      >>    **
      >>
      >>    **
      >>
      >>    **
      >>
      >>    *http://www.matronics.com/contribution*
      >>
      >>    **
      >>
      >>    *  *
      >>
      >>    *
      >>
      >>    ist" target="_blank">
      >> http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?AeroElectric-List
      >>    tp://forums.matronics.com
      >>    _blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution
      >>
      >>    *
      >>
      >>
      >>
      >>
      >> --
      >> Zulu Delta
      >> Mk IIIC
      >> Thanks, Homer GBYM
      >>
      >> It isn't necessary to have relatives in Kansas City in order to be
      >> unhappy.
      >>  - Groucho Marx
      >>
      >>
      >> *
      >>
      >>
      >> *
      >>
      >
      > --
      > If you're an American, just say NO to the Obamanation, to socialism, and
      > get rid of Soros.
      >
      >
      ===========
      ===========
      ===========
      ===========
      >
      >
      
      
      -- 
      Zulu Delta
      Mk IIIC
      Thanks, Homer GBYM
      
      It isn't necessary to have relatives in Kansas City in order to be unhappy.
        - Groucho Marx
      
________________________________________________________________________________
Date: 
Apr 20, 2011
From: 
jerb <ulflyer(at)verizon.net>
Subject: 
Re: TurboCAD 10
      
      Been going to get me a cheap cad package, this 
      topic pushed the button.  Been reading about a 
      few referenced in a couple different issues in Kit Planes.
      
      Went to the site of the link of the message below 
      - snagged me a copy of the TurboCad 15 - its 2D3D 
      for 9.95.  They do have TurboCad 17, available in 
      3 different levels starting at 39.95 up to 
      989.99.  I'm not a big cad user so I figured the 
      TurboCad 15 would do all I need.  The description 
      for the release 17 packages mention it has 
      professional-level drafting tools, not sure if 
      these are included in release 15.  Also picked up 
      a couple FloorPlan /Architect packages.  By the 
      way PurPlus takes PayPal and it appears any order 
      over $20 has free shipping, just how long it takes to get to ya.
      jerb
      
      
      At 10:06 AM 4/20/2011, you wrote:
      >Thanks guys, I found a good price on the latest 
      >version (17) and ordered it. I use CAD a lot so the slight extra is worth
       it.
      >
      >Rick Girard
      >
      >On Wed, Apr 20, 2011 at 8:33 AM, Jim Wickert 
      ><jimw_btg(at)earthlink.net> wrote:
      >
      >Go to this site they have TurboCad 15 which will 
      >run all XP, Vista, W7, 2D/3D =85=85. 
      >$9.95 
      ><http://store.purplus.net/tu15de2d.html>http://store.purplus.net/tu15de2d.h
      tml
      >
      >
      >Jim Wickert
      >snip....
      
________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: 
E-Bus Diode Question
From: 
"jvolkober" <jvolkober(at)comcast.net>
Date: 
Apr 20, 2011
      
      
      I have a .8 volt drop across my e-bus diode.  Voltage in from the main bus is 12.4.
      Voltage out to the e-bus is 11.6.  Can anyone advise if this is normal or
      if I have problem.  Wiring appears correct.  Checked it against the diagram
      on B&C.
      
      John
      
      
      Read this topic online here:
      
      http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=337671#337671
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
Date: 
Apr 21, 2011
From: 
"Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <nuckolls.bob(at)aeroelectric.com>
Subject: 
Re: E-Bus Diode Question
      
      
      At 12:22 AM 4/21/2011, you wrote:
      >
      >I have a .8 volt drop across my e-bus diode.  Voltage in from the 
      >main bus is 12.4.  Voltage out to the e-bus is 11.6.  Can anyone 
      >advise if this is normal or if I have problem.  Wiring appears 
      >correct.  Checked it against the diagram on B&C.
      >
      
         Is this with the alternator running? Sounds like you're
         running battery only. So yes, the voltages you're
         citing are expected.
      
         The only time the normal feedpath diode is in
         service is when the alternator is running. This
         gives you a main bus voltage on the order of
         14.2 to 14.8 volts. The e-bus runs at 13.4 to
         14.0.
      
         When you're running the e-bus battery only, the
         diode is out of the loop and the e-bus runs 12.4
         down to end of life on the battery . . . about
         10.5 volts.
      
      
         Bob . . . 
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
From: 
"B Tomm" <fvalarm(at)rapidnet.net>
Subject: 
E-Bus Diode Question
Date: 
Apr 21, 2011
      
      
      John,
      
      I haven't powered up my B+C E-Buss diode yet but from what I know about
      diodes, your measurement is pretty close.  The drop may be as low as 0.6
      from what I have read here and in the aerolectric connection. 
      
      Bevan 
      
      -----Original Message-----
      From: owner-aeroelectric-list-server(at)matronics.com
      [mailto:owner-aeroelectric-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of jvolkober
      Sent: Wednesday, April 20, 2011 9:22 PM
      Subject: AeroElectric-List: E-Bus Diode Question
      
      --> 
      
      I have a .8 volt drop across my e-bus diode.  Voltage in from the main bus
      is 12.4.  Voltage out to the e-bus is 11.6.  Can anyone advise if this is
      normal or if I have problem.  Wiring appears correct.  Checked it against
      the diagram on B&C.
      
      John
      
      
      Read this topic online here:
      
      http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=337671#337671
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
From: 
"Jim Wickert" <jimw_btg(at)earthlink.net>
Subject: 
TurboCAD 15
Date: 
Apr 21, 2011
      
      
      David and all,
      The question what are you going to do with 3D....  3D modeling it works great,
      3D interference analysis it works, 3D stress analysis it take an understanding
      of statics and stress pattern analysis to make it work....3d solids and layering
      it works good, for drag and drop rendering...3D hidden-line rendering with
      objects clipped behind cameras great, flexible camera views in 3D with realistic
      lighting position enhancement great, floating and shaped viewpoints 3D changing
      them on the fly it great, Auto associative dimension in 3D, comprehensive
      set of 2D/3D drag n drop symbols with Boolean operations that allow intersect,
      subtract, and slice of objects great, dynamic rotations and walk-troughs great...single-click
      3D floating palettes etc etc.  As I said most people do not
      know what they want to do with 3D...for all intent and purpose on this group
      the TurboCad 15 will be 200% of what they intend to do.  Remember you have PCB
      design and electrical circuit design as well something you will need to document
      you work....all for $9.95  ya think???  Yes ver. 17 has more features but
      for Exp plane building?  If you are using it for your work and or business yes
      the Ver. 17 is a great choice for the cost.  Hands down. 
      
      For reality sake when you have $38,000 a seat invested in Pro-E.... yes a seat
      ten of them (hardware and software) and $300,000 in Server hardware and software
      you really get embarrassed..... but then TurboCad as others were not the product
      they are today.  And simulated testing is not there in TurboCad today either.
      Believe me there is more horse power than you will ever dream to use. 
      Couple this with XPlane and your life will be occupied for ever. We also have
      one of the new photo quality vinyl ink wide bed printers $21,000.00 now we really
      can get into discussions....but is really better to fly the plane we are building
      than look at it in simulated suspension of wide screen high def printed
      form.  It all about what we really want to do.  Happy building.
      
      Jim Wickert
      Tel 920-467-0219
      Cell 920-912-1014
      
      
      -----Original Message-----
      From: owner-aeroelectric-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-aeroelectric-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of David
      Sent: Wednesday, April 20, 2011 5:27 PM
      Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: TurboCAD 15
      
      
      Does it not handle 3d well?
      
      David
      
      
      Jim Wickert wrote:
      >
      > Henador
      >
      > My Company. Business Technology Group is an Engineering Design house 
      > that I owned for 31 years now, we have 10 Pro-E seatsI can pound out 
      > some pretty quick designs with TurboCad and not miss much in the basic 
      > 2D design and will stay head of AutoCad pretty much all the 
      > time.TurboCad 15 also comes with a PCB design set as well.  For the 
      > cost of $9.95 I dont believe you cant lose.
      >
      > Take Care happy designing.
      >
      > Jim Wickert
      >
      > Tel 920-467-0219
      >
      > Cell 920-912-1014
      >
      > *From:* owner-aeroelectric-list-server(at)matronics.com 
      > [mailto:owner-aeroelectric-list-server(at)matronics.com] *On Behalf Of 
      > *Henador Titzoff
      > *Sent:* Wednesday, April 20, 2011 10:07 AM
      > *To:* aeroelectric-list(at)matronics.com
      > *Subject:* Re: AeroElectric-List: TurboCAD 10
      >
      > Jim,
      >
      > TurboCAD 15 costs 10 bucks, while AutoCAD 3D costs a boatload more. 
      >  What features, if any, does TurboCAD lack that AutoCAD 3D has?  The 
      > price sure does sound good, but $10 is hardly anything for software 
      > these days.
      >
      > If it turns out that TurboCAD 15 is not too neutered, then it has to 
      > be the best bang for the buck we've run across in a long time!
      >
      > Henador Titzoff
      >
      > ------------------------------------------------------------------------
      > *
      >
      >
      > *
      
      -- 
      If you're an American, just say NO to the Obamanation, to socialism, and get rid
      of Soros.
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
From: 
"Jay Hyde" <jay(at)horriblehyde.com>
Subject: 
E-Bus Diode Question
Date: 
Apr 21, 2011
      
      
      Voltage drop across a diode is perfectly normal and expected.  Be careful
      about what is supplied by the E-Bus though- for example, if you are
      supplying power to an EFIS that has a backup battery charging from the EFIS
      then that battery will not charge as the voltage is too low.
      
      You can minimise the voltage drop by using a Schottkey diode, which will
      bring the voltage drop down to around 0.6V.
      
      Jay
      
      -----Original Message-----
      From: owner-aeroelectric-list-server(at)matronics.com
      [mailto:owner-aeroelectric-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of jvolkober
      Sent: 21 April 2011 06:22 AM
      Subject: AeroElectric-List: E-Bus Diode Question
      
      
      I have a .8 volt drop across my e-bus diode.  Voltage in from the main bus
      is 12.4.  Voltage out to the e-bus is 11.6.  Can anyone advise if this is
      normal or if I have problem.  Wiring appears correct.  Checked it against
      the diagram on B&C.
      
      John
      
      
      Read this topic online here:
      
      http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=337671#337671
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
Date: 
Apr 21, 2011
Subject: 
Mate-N-Lok crimp tool
From: 
James Kilford <james(at)etravel.org>
      
      Gents,
      
      Do any of you happen to know of a reasonably priced crimp tool for the
      above?  I've not been able to find a tool that isn't going to break the
      bank.
      
      I could crimp them by hand I suppose -- any tips on this would be
      appreciated.
      
      Many thanks in anticipation.
      
      James
      
      --
      Jodel D-150 build in progress: 90% done... :-)
      
________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: 
Re: Mate-N-Lok crimp tool
From: 
Jared Yates <email(at)jaredyates.com>
Date: 
Apr 21, 2011
      
      I got mine from Stein and it works very well. Steinair.com
      
      
      On Apr 21, 2011, at 13:32, James Kilford  wrote:
      
      > Gents,
      > 
      > Do any of you happen to know of a reasonably priced crimp tool for the abo
      ve?  I've not been able to find a tool that isn't going to break the bank. 
      
      > 
      > I could crimp them by hand I suppose -- any tips on this would be apprecia
      ted. 
      > 
      > Many thanks in anticipation. 
      > 
      > James
      > 
      > --
      > Jodel D-150 build in progress: 90% done... :-)
      > 
      > 
      ==========================
      =========
      ==========================
      =========
      ==========================
      =========
      ==========================
      =========
      > 
      
________________________________________________________________________________
Date: 
Apr 21, 2011
From: 
"Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <nuckolls.bob(at)aeroelectric.com>
Subject: 
E-Bus Diode Question
      
      
      At 04:05 AM 4/21/2011, you wrote:
      >
      >Voltage drop across a diode is perfectly normal and expected.  Be careful
      >about what is supplied by the E-Bus though- for example, if you are
      >supplying power to an EFIS that has a backup battery charging from the EFIS
      >then that battery will not charge as the voltage is too low.
      
          Excellent point to ponder. Any devices powered from
          the e-bus that contain rechargeable back-up batteries
          should evaluated for MINIMUM supply voltage to support
          the backup battery. Check manufacturer's installation
          data for this information.
      
          At the same time, don't loose track of the notion
          that e-busses are configured and managed so that
          back-up batteries are not necessary.
      
      
         Bob . . . 
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
Date: 
Apr 21, 2011
From: 
David <ainut(at)knology.net>
Subject: 
Re: TurboCAD 15
      
      
      One of my applications is creating brackets to help finish my plane.  
      Once it's in, then we can use a 3d printer to make a plastic prototype 
      to see if it works.  Then, I can send off to get the real metal piece made.
      
      Another is to help with my electrical design of the plane.
      
      David
      
      
      Jim Wickert wrote:
      > -->  AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Jim Wickert"
      >
      > David and all,
      > The question what are you going to do with 3D....  3D modeling it works great,
      3D interference analysis it works, 3D stress analysis it take an understanding
      of statics and stress pattern analysis to make it work....3d solids and layering
      it works good, for drag and drop rendering...3D hidden-line rendering with
      objects clipped behind cameras great, flexible camera views in 3D with realistic
      lighting position enhancement great, floating and shaped viewpoints 3D changing
      them on the fly it great, Auto associative dimension in 3D, comprehensive
      set of 2D/3D drag n drop symbols with Boolean operations that allow intersect,
      subtract, and slice of objects great, dynamic rotations and walk-troughs
      great...single-click 3D floating palettes etc etc.  As I said most people do not
      know what they want to do with 3D...for all intent and purpose on this group
      the TurboCad 15 will be 200% of what they intend to do.  Remember you have PCB
      design and electrical circuit design as well someth!
      >   ing you will need to document you work....all for $9.95  ya think???  Yes ver.
      17 has more features but for Exp plane building?  If you are using it for
      your work and or business yes the Ver. 17 is a great choice for the cost.  Hands
      down.
      >
      > For reality sake when you have $38,000 a seat invested in Pro-E.... yes a seat
      ten of them (hardware and software) and $300,000 in Server hardware and software
      you really get embarrassed..... but then TurboCad as others were not the
      product they are today.  And simulated testing is not there in TurboCad today
      either.  Believe me there is more horse power than you will ever dream to use.
      Couple this with XPlane and your life will be occupied for ever. We also have
      one of the new photo quality vinyl ink wide bed printers $21,000.00 now we really
      can get into discussions....but is really better to fly the plane we are
      building than look at it in simulated suspension of wide screen high def printed
      form.  It all about what we really want to do.  Happy building.
      >
      > Jim Wickert
      > Tel 920-467-0219
      > Cell 920-912-1014
      >
      >
      > -----Original Message-----
      > From: owner-aeroelectric-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-aeroelectric-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of David
      > Sent: Wednesday, April 20, 2011 5:27 PM
      > To: aeroelectric-list(at)matronics.com
      > Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: TurboCAD 15
      >
      > -->  AeroElectric-List message posted by: David
      >
      > Does it not handle 3d well?
      >
      > David
      >
      >
      > Jim Wickert wrote:
      >    
      >> Henador
      >>
      >> My Company. Business Technology Group is an Engineering Design house
      >> that I owned for 31 years now, we have 10 Pro-E seatsI can pound out
      >> some pretty quick designs with TurboCad and not miss much in the basic
      >> 2D design and will stay head of AutoCad pretty much all the
      >> time.TurboCad 15 also comes with a PCB design set as well.  For the
      >> cost of $9.95 I dont believe you cant lose.
      >>
      >> Take Care happy designing.
      >>
      >> Jim Wickert
      >>
      >> Tel 920-467-0219
      >>
      >> Cell 920-912-1014
      >>
      >> *From:* owner-aeroelectric-list-server(at)matronics.com
      >> [mailto:owner-aeroelectric-list-server(at)matronics.com] *On Behalf Of
      >> *Henador Titzoff
      >> *Sent:* Wednesday, April 20, 2011 10:07 AM
      >> *To:* aeroelectric-list(at)matronics.com
      >> *Subject:* Re: AeroElectric-List: TurboCAD 10
      >>
      >> Jim,
      >>
      >> TurboCAD 15 costs 10 bucks, while AutoCAD 3D costs a boatload more.
      >>   What features, if any, does TurboCAD lack that AutoCAD 3D has?  The
      >> price sure does sound good, but $10 is hardly anything for software
      >> these days.
      >>
      >> If it turns out that TurboCAD 15 is not too neutered, then it has to
      >> be the best bang for the buck we've run across in a long time!
      >>
      >> Henador Titzoff
      >>
      >> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
      >> *
      >>
      >>
      >> *
      >>      
      >    
      
      -- 
      If you're an American, just say NO to the Obamanation, to socialism, and get rid
      of Soros.
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
From: 
"John Ciolino" <johnciolino(at)comcast.net>
Subject: 
E-Bus Diode Question
Date: 
Apr 21, 2011
      
      
      I have the same drop. But I also have the same question: is this normal?
      Bob?
      
      John Ciolino
      RV-8
      N894Y
      -----Original Message-----
      From: owner-aeroelectric-list-server(at)matronics.com
      [mailto:owner-aeroelectric-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of jvolkober
      Sent: Thursday, April 21, 2011 12:22 AM
      Subject: AeroElectric-List: E-Bus Diode Question
      
      
      I have a .8 volt drop across my e-bus diode.  Voltage in from the main bus
      is 12.4.  Voltage out to the e-bus is 11.6.  Can anyone advise if this is
      normal or if I have problem.  Wiring appears correct.  Checked it against
      the diagram on B&C.
      
      John
      
      
      Read this topic online here:
      
      http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=337671#337671
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: 
Re: E-Bus Diode Question
From: 
"jvolkober" <jvolkober(at)comcast.net>
Date: 
Apr 21, 2011
      
      
      Thank you all for the input.  Responding to Matt's question, I did not have the
      alternator running at time I took the measurements.
      
      John
      
      
      Read this topic online here:
      
      http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=337724#337724
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
From: 
"John Loram" <johnl(at)loram.org>
Subject: 
Siemens Solid Edge 2D Drafting - was TurboCAD 15
Date: 
Apr 21, 2011
      
      
      Siemens make the 2D version of it's high end 3D product available for free.
      
      Comes with extensive libraries of mechanical and electrical components.
      
      Outputs files in both its own format and industry standard formats.
      
      It's a very capable product: http://www.solidedge.com/free2d
      
      Takes a while to download...
      
      -john-
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
From: 
"Jim Wickert" <jimw_btg(at)earthlink.net>
Subject: 
Siemens Solid Edge 2D Drafting - was TurboCAD 15
Date: 
Apr 21, 2011
      
      
      There is one important point to remember when getting a Cad package
      Documentation.... Documentation this is one thing that makes Turbo Cad worth
      the $9.95 extremely good documentation and support.  I have the Siemens 2&3
      D Cad and their PLM package as well as others...... and for someone who is
      working with CAD everyday they will come up to speed.  But for low time CAD
      people and people who use it on a project once in the Blue Moon that
      Documentation is a life saver.  I have nothing to gain by the sale of Turbo
      Cad but as a tool for the low time user it is great and like I say the
      Documentation alone is worth the price of admission enough said.
      
      Jim Wickert
      Tel 920-467-0219
      Cell 920-912-1014
      
      
      -----Original Message-----
      From: owner-aeroelectric-list-server(at)matronics.com
      [mailto:owner-aeroelectric-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of John
      Loram
      Sent: Thursday, April 21, 2011 7:15 PM
      Subject: AeroElectric-List: Siemens Solid Edge 2D Drafting - was TurboCAD 15
      
      
      Siemens make the 2D version of it's high end 3D product available for free.
      
      Comes with extensive libraries of mechanical and electrical components.
      
      Outputs files in both its own format and industry standard formats.
      
      It's a very capable product: http://www.solidedge.com/free2d
      
      Takes a while to download...
      
      -john-
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
Date: 
Apr 21, 2011
Subject: 
Re: Siemens Solid Edge 2D Drafting - was TurboCAD 15
From: 
b d <gpabruce(at)gmail.com>
      
      I second the motion  . . . . you cannot hardly buy a book for $9.95 these
      days let alone a CAD pkg plus the book . . . .
      
      On Thu, Apr 21, 2011 at 8:19 PM, Jim Wickert  wrote:
      
      > jimw_btg(at)earthlink.net>
      >
      > There is one important point to remember when getting a Cad package
      > Documentation.... Documentation this is one thing that makes Turbo Cad
      > worth
      > the $9.95 extremely good documentation and support.  I have the Siemens 2&3
      > D Cad and their PLM package as well as others...... and for someone who is
      > working with CAD everyday they will come up to speed.  But for low time CAD
      > people and people who use it on a project once in the Blue Moon that
      > Documentation is a life saver.  I have nothing to gain by the sale of Turbo
      > Cad but as a tool for the low time user it is great and like I say the
      > Documentation alone is worth the price of admission enough said.
      >
      > Jim Wickert
      > Tel 920-467-0219
      > Cell 920-912-1014
      >
      >
      > -----Original Message-----
      > From: owner-aeroelectric-list-server(at)matronics.com
      > [mailto:owner-aeroelectric-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of John
      > Loram
      > Sent: Thursday, April 21, 2011 7:15 PM
      > To: aeroelectric-list(at)matronics.com
      > Subject: AeroElectric-List: Siemens Solid Edge 2D Drafting - was TurboCAD
      > 15
      >
      >
      > Siemens make the 2D version of it's high end 3D product available for free.
      >
      > Comes with extensive libraries of mechanical and electrical components.
      >
      > Outputs files in both its own format and industry standard formats.
      >
      > It's a very capable product: http://www.solidedge.com/free2d
      >
      > Takes a while to download...
      >
      > -john-
      >
      >
      
________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: 
Flap System trouble shoot
From: 
"jonlaury" <jonlaury(at)impulse.net>
Date: 
Apr 21, 2011
      
      
      What's wrong with this picture?
      
      I'm trying to install an over-ride switch in conjunction with the Aircraft Extras
      Flap Positioning System
      
      My flap motor is right up against the current limit of the AE FPS so I installed
      two 30A ice cube relays. On the relay, 12v+ and the motor terminals are NC.
      Pins 15 & 16 of the FPS are flaps up/down out to motor. The rocker at the top
      is the flap selector switch in to FPS.
      
      The rocker at the bottom is the FPS circuit board over-ride switch.
      
      Pins 15 & 16 are normally ground, except when there's a system flap input and either
      15 or 16 goes to 12v+. I installed the diodes on the 15/16 to relay coil
      legs because I was getting a dead short  when the override switch was closed.
      
      
      I thought that the diodes would solve the problem, but I'm still blowing fuses
      whenever the override switch is closed.
      
      Any suggestions much appreciated.
      
      Thanks,
      John
      
      
      Read this topic online here:
      
      http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=337777#337777
      
      
      Attachments: 
      
      http://forums.matronics.com//files/fps_trouble_shoot_212.pdf
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
Date: 
Apr 22, 2011
From: 
Henador Titzoff <henador_titzoff(at)yahoo.com>
Subject: 
Re: Siemens Solid Edge 2D Drafting - was TurboCAD 15
      
      Jim,=0A=0AI agree that documentation and low price are two extremely import
      ant criteria for choosing this product. Another one is support. -I went t
      o the TurboCAD website, and all they talk about is Ver. 18. -Does this me
      an that previous versions, and especially 3 versions back, do not get suppo
      rted. -By support, I'm talking things like new components for their elect
      rical schematic tool. -I did notice that Ver. 18 doesnt have this tool. 
      -Did they end life it?=0A-=0AHenador Titzoff=0A=0A=0A__________________
      ______________=0AFrom: Jim Wickert <jimw_btg(at)earthlink.net>=0ATo: aeroelect
      ric-list(at)matronics.com=0ASent: Thursday, April 21, 2011 11:19 PM=0ASubject:
       Re: AeroElectric-List: Siemens Solid Edge 2D Drafting - was TurboCAD 15=0A
      nk.net>=0A=0AThere is one important point to remember when getting a Cad pa
      ckage=0ADocumentation.... Documentation this is one thing that makes Turbo 
      Cad worth=0Athe $9.95 extremely good documentation and support.- I have t
      he Siemens 2&3=0AD Cad and their PLM package as well as others...... and fo
      r someone who is=0Aworking with CAD everyday they will come up to speed.-
       But for low time CAD=0Apeople and people who use it on a project once in t
      he Blue Moon that=0ADocumentation is a life saver.- I have nothing to gai
      n by the sale of Turbo=0ACad but as a tool for the low time user it is grea
      t and like I say the=0ADocumentation alone is worth the price of admission 
      enough said.=0A=0AJim Wickert=0ATel 920-467-0219=0ACell 920-912-1014=0A=0A
      =0A-----Original Message-----=0AFrom: owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matron
      ics.com=0A[mailto:owner-aeroelectric-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf O
      f John=0ALoram=0ASent: Thursday, April 21, 2011 7:15 PM=0ATo: aeroelectric-
      list(at)matronics.com=0ASubject: AeroElectric-List: Siemens Solid Edge 2D Draf
      Loram" =0A=0ASiemens make the 2D version of it's high end 
      3D product available for free.=0A=0AComes with extensive libraries of mecha
      nical and electrical components.=0A=0AOutputs files in both its own format 
      and industry standard formats.=0A=0AIt's a very capable product: http://www
      .solidedge.com/free2d=0A=0ATakes a while to download...=0A=0A-john-=0A=0A
      =
      
________________________________________________________________________________
Date: 
Apr 22, 2011
Subject: 
Re: Siemens Solid Edge 2D Drafting - was  TurboCAD
      15
From: 
"jcarlton3(at)cox.net" <jcarlton3(at)cox.net>
      
      
      Sent from my LG phone
      
      Henador Titzoff  wrote:
      
      >Jim,
      >
      >I agree that documentation and low price are two extremely important criteria
      for choosing this product. Another one is support. I went to the TurboCAD website,
      and all they talk about is Ver. 18. Does this mean that previous versions,
      and especially 3 versions back, do not get supported. By support, I'm talking
      things like new components for their electrical schematic tool. I did notice
      that Ver. 18 doesnt have this tool. Did they end life it?
      >
      >Henador Titzoff
      >
      >
      >________________________________
      >From: Jim Wickert <jimw_btg(at)earthlink.net>
      >To: aeroelectric-list(at)matronics.com
      >Sent: Thursday, April 21, 2011 11:19 PM
      >Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Siemens Solid Edge 2D Drafting - was TurboCAD
      15
      >
      >
      >There is one important point to remember when getting a Cad package
      >Documentation.... Documentation this is one thing that makes Turbo Cad worth
      >the $9.95 extremely good documentation and support. I have the Siemens 2&3
      >D Cad and their PLM package as well as others...... and for someone who is
      >working with CAD everyday they will come up to speed. But for low time CAD
      >people and people who use it on a project once in the Blue Moon that
      >Documentation is a life saver. I have nothing to gain by the sale of Turbo
      >Cad but as a tool for the low time user it is great and like I say the
      >Documentation alone is worth the price of admission enough said.
      >
      >Jim Wickert
      >Tel 920-467-0219
      >Cell 920-912-1014
      >
      >
      >-----Original Message-----
      >From: owner-aeroelectric-list-server(at)matronics.com
      >[mailto:owner-aeroelectric-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of John
      >Loram
      >Sent: Thursday, April 21, 2011 7:15 PM
      >To: aeroelectric-list(at)matronics.com
      >Subject: AeroElectric-List: Siemens Solid Edge 2D Drafting - was TurboCAD 15
      >
      >
      >Siemens make the 2D version of it's high end 3D product available for free.
      >
      >Comes with extensive libraries of mechanical and electrical components.
      >
      >Outputs files in both its own format and industry standard formats.
      >
      >It's a very capable product: http://www.solidedge.com/free2d
      >
      >Takes a while to download...
      >
      >-john-
      >
      >=
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: 
GNS-430 Install Manual
Date: 
Apr 22, 2011
From: 
"George, Neal Capt 505 TRS/DOJ" <Neal.George(at)hurlburt.af.mil>
      
      My Garmin GNS-400 Series Installation Manual is Revision K, dated May
      2002.
      
      Anybody know if there is a more recent version?
      
      
      Neal
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
From: 
"Ralph E. Capen" <recapen(at)earthlink.net>
Subject: 
Re: GNS-430 Install Manual
Date: 
Apr 22, 2011
      
      Neal,
      
      Mine's dated Nov '06 revision B, but it covers the WAAS version also.  
      Don't know if that's a differentiator.
      
      Ralph
        ----- Original Message ----- 
        From: George, Neal Capt 505 TRS/DOJ 
        To: aeroelectric-list(at)matronics.com 
        Sent: Friday, April 22, 2011 10:30 AM
        Subject: AeroElectric-List: GNS-430 Install Manual
      
      
        My Garmin GNS-400 Series Installation Manual is Revision K, dated May 
      2002.
      
        Anybody know if there is a more recent version?
      
         
      
        Neal
      
         
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
Date: 
Apr 22, 2011
From: 
"Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <nuckolls.bob(at)aeroelectric.com>
Subject: 
Re: Flap System trouble shoot
      
      
      At 01:54 AM 4/22/2011, you wrote:
      >
      >What's wrong with this picture?
      >
      >I'm trying to install an over-ride switch in conjunction with the 
      >Aircraft Extras Flap Positioning System
      >
      >My flap motor is right up against the current limit of the AE FPS so 
      >I installed two 30A ice cube relays. On the relay, 12v+ and the 
      >motor terminals are NC. Pins 15 & 16 of the FPS are flaps up/down 
      >out to motor. The rocker at the top is the flap selector switch in to FPS.
      >
      >The rocker at the bottom is the FPS circuit board over-ride switch.
      >
      >Pins 15 & 16 are normally ground, except when there's a system flap 
      >input and either 15 or 16 goes to 12v+. I installed the diodes on 
      >the 15/16 to relay coil legs because I was getting a dead 
      >short  when the override switch was closed.
      >
      >I thought that the diodes would solve the problem, but I'm still 
      >blowing fuses whenever the override switch is closed.
      >
      >Any suggestions much appreciated.
      
          It would help if you could offer a schematic of
          the wiring as opposed to a pictorial. If you're
          using relays to separate the output of an existing
          control system from the motor, the I would expect
          the control system to drive relay coils and the
          motor would be powered from an alternative power
          source through relay contacts. In other words, there
          would be no exchange of energy between the control
          system and the motor . . . your drawing shows some
          wires that connect to motor . . . ?????
      
      
          The forth page of
      
      http://www.aeroelectric.com/PPS/Flight/Flaps/Flaps.pdf
      
          illustrates a configuration of single-pole, double-
          throw relays used to accept inputs from a small
          switch for crew control of flaps. This same circuit
          with the switch removed would accept outputs from
          your flap control system.
      
          It would be helpful to know more about the flap
          control system. What's the 'current limit' issue
          all about. Normally, flap system draws are pretty
          benign, 10A or less. What is it about your particular
          flap configuration that makes it "oversized" for
          the control system. What is the design goal for
          an "override switch"?
      
          Can you point us to a link for the control system's
          installation manual?
      
          I would also encourage you to learn to draw in
          pure schematic form . . . it's the universal language
          of electrical systems behaviors. I once had to teach
          a group of Japanese technicians how to deal with
          some video equipment I designed. Their English was
          marginally useful, my Japanese was nil. But our mutual
          understanding of the schematics, video in general and
          the use of test equipment made a much lighter task
          of what could have been a no-value-added endeavor.
      
      
         Bob . . . 
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
From: 
Alvin Voigt <iamgodlisten(at)hotmail.com>
Subject: 
DoubleCAD and Alibre Design
Date: 
Apr 22, 2011
      
      
      IMSI Design develops and markets DoubleCAD and TurboCAD. 
      DoubleCAD is marketed as a work alike replacement for AutoCAD LT and includ
      es some extensions not in AutoCAD LT. 
      There is a DoubleCAD Pro for $695 and a DoubleCAD XT for free.
      DoubleCAD XT Version 3 can be downloaded from http://doublecad.com/. Docume
      ntation can be downloaded also. 
      DoubleCAD seems to be providing the free XT version releases at the same ti
      me the Pro releases are provided. This means the free XT version is not an 
      out of date Pro version. 
      
      I have some experience with AutoCAD and notice a bunch of stuff retained in
       AutoCAD=2C AutoCAD LT=2C and DoubleCAD from the first AutoCAD versions I u
      sed on Eagle 8086 and HP 80286 computers. 
      
      For 3D modeling=2C http://www.alibre.com/ markets Alibre design Expert for 
      $1=2C399=2C Alibre Design Professional for $699=2C and Alibre Design Person
      al Edition for $99.
      Each $99 personal edition license includes registration for installation on
       three computers.  
      
      Today=2C Friday=2C Alibre Design claims they are in a booth at Boeing's Fut
      ure of Flight annual Earth Day event. Alibre Design will be showing support
       at the WIKISPEED booth in Everett WA=2C so if you are in the Seattle area 
      they say to come stop by and say hello! I copied this from Alibre but have 
      no connection with the product expect to have spent $99 with them. I hope t
      o install soon. 
      
      I have also used TurboCAD through Version 17 but without great delight. Tur
      boCAD is a different philosophy from AutoCAD and DoubleCAD. 
      
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
From: 
Speedy11(at)aol.com
Date: 
Apr 22, 2011
Subject: 
Cool!
      
      This forum seemed to go dormant for about 6-8 months.  I'm glad to see  
      lots of discussion again.
      Stan Sutterfield
      
________________________________________________________________________________
Date: 
Apr 22, 2011
Subject: 
Re: Cool!
From: 
James Kilford <james(at)etravel.org>
      
      Well, for my part, it's too cold up at the hangar for about 6 months a year!
       We've had a few days of blue skies and I'm starting to think about the last
      couple of electrical jobs I need to do!
      
      James
      
      On 22 April 2011 17:09,  wrote:
      
      >  This forum seemed to go dormant for about 6-8 months.  I'm glad to see
      > lots of discussion again.
      > Stan Sutterfield
      >
      > *
      >
      > *
      >
      >
      
________________________________________________________________________________
From: 
"ROGER &  JEAN CURTIS" <mrspudandcompany(at)verizon.net>
Subject: 
DoubleCAD and Alibre Design
Date: 
Apr 22, 2011
      
      
      		I have also used TurboCAD through Version 17 but without
      great delight. TurboCAD is a different philosophy from AutoCAD and
      DoubleCAD. 
      
      
      				Alvin,
      
      				Would you please elaborate on the "different
      philosophy" between the CAD programs?
      
      				Thanks,
      
      				Roger
      
________________________________________________________________________________
Date: 
Apr 22, 2011
From: 
John Morgensen <john(at)morgensen.com>
Subject: 
Re: Cool!
      
      Not dormant at all. Check the web forum link below and your spam filters.
      
      john
      
      
      On 4/22/2011 9:09 AM, Speedy11(at)aol.com wrote:
      > This forum seemed to go dormant for about 6-8 months.  I'm glad to see 
      > lots of discussion again.
      > Stan Sutterfield
      > *
      >
      >
      > *
      
________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: 
GNS-430 Install Manual
Date: 
Apr 22, 2011
From: 
"George, Neal Capt 505 TRS/DOJ" <Neal.George(at)hurlburt.af.mil>
      
      
      Thanks folks - I have what I need.
      Stein comes thru again...
      
      neal
      
      ===========
      My Garmin GNS-400 Series Installation Manual is Revision K, dated May
      2002.
      Anybody know if there is a more recent version?
      	 
      Neal
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: 
Re: Lightening up Z12
From: 
"rvg8tor" <rvg8tor(at)comcast.net>
Date: 
Apr 22, 2011
      
      
      Bob,
      
      Since I would like to share one shunt, the shunt would have to come after the ANL
      for the main alternator and the fusible link for the standby alternator.  Is
      there any issue with the placement of the shunt before or after the wire protection?
      Attached is a drawing of the proposal.
      
      You can see the fuseable link attaches to the shunt along wiht the B lead from
      the main alternator
      
      
      nuckolls.bob(at)aeroelect wrote:
      > At 03:59 PM 4/20/2011, you wrote:
      > 
      > > 
      > > 
      > > I am going to ask this question a different way.  In Z12 there are 2 
      > > alternators, on plays a standby roll and will only produce power 
      > > when the main alternator goes out or is turned off.  Given that only 
      > > one alternator operates at a time only one ammeter would be needed 
      > > to monitor the electrical load coming from the alternator providing 
      > > the power.
      > > 
      > > This reduces parts count; takes out a shunt and switch required to 
      > > look at two shunts with on meter and or removes extra ammeter.
      > > 
      > > So does anyone see any flaws in this logic?
      > > 
      > > 
      > 
      >   That will work
      > 
      > 
      > 
      >    Bob . . .
      
      
      --------
      Mike "Nemo" Elliott
      RV-8A QB (Fuselage)
      
      
      Read this topic online here:
      
      http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=337834#337834
      
      
      Attachments: 
      
      http://forums.matronics.com//files/electrical_system__power_distribution_shared_shunt_278.pdf
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
From: 
Fergus Kyle <VE3LVO(at)rac.ca>
Subject: 
ATTN:gpabruce,aslsa,ainut & raymond
Date: 
Apr 22, 2011
      
      Folks,
      	I have just read today's list of messages. The plethora (a number of
      pleths) of unnecessary empty or repeated
      lines is staggering.
      	A kudos to those who are succinct and unwasteful of space but those
      above take note:
      		The number of lines needed/number of lines taken
      gpa bruce		1 / 144
      aslsa			2 / 264
      jared			2 / 72
      ainut			3 / 161
      aslsa			2 / 200
      Raymond	 	12/ 244
      
      	That's 22 lines of info and 1085 lines of explanation, most of which
      are empty or nonsensical. In one case 4 lines produced 464 of scrolling
      
      		
      
________________________________________________________________________________
From: 
"Ralph Finch" <ralphmariafinch(at)gmail.com>
Subject: 
ATTN:gpabruce,aslsa,ainut & raymond
Date: 
Apr 22, 2011
      
      Add:
      
      
      Fergus Kyle       0/36
      
      
      From: owner-aeroelectric-list-server(at)matronics.com
      [mailto:owner-aeroelectric-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Fergus
      Kyle
      Sent: Friday, April 22, 2011 12:41 PM
      Subject: AeroElectric-List: ATTN:gpabruce,aslsa,ainut & raymond
      
      
      Folks,
      
              I have just read today's list of messages. The plethora (a number of
      pleths) of unnecessary empty or repeated
      
      lines is staggering.
      
              A kudos to those who are succinct and unwasteful of space but those
      above take note:
      
      The number of lines needed/number of lines taken
      
      gpa bruce               1 / 144
      
      aslsa                   2 / 264
      
      jared                   2 / 72
      
      ainut                   3 / 161
      
      aslsa                   2 / 200
      
      Raymond         12/ 244
      
              That's 22 lines of info and 1085 lines of explanation, most of which
      are empty or nonsensical. In one case 4 lines produced 464 of scrolling
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
From: 
"ROGER &  JEAN CURTIS" <mrspudandcompany(at)verizon.net>
Subject: 
ATTN:gpabruce,aslsa,ainut & raymond
Date: 
Apr 22, 2011
      
      
      		Folks,
      		        I have just read today's list of messages. The
      plethora (a number of pleths) of unnecessary empty or repeated
      		lines is staggering.
      		        A kudos to those who are succinct and unwasteful of
      space but those above take note:
      				The number of lines needed/number of lines
      taken
      		gpa bruce               1 / 144
      		aslsa                   2 / 264
      		jared                   2 / 72
      		ainut                   3 / 161
      		aslsa                   2 / 200
      		Raymond         12/ 244
      		        That's 22 lines of info and 1085 lines of
      explanation, most of which are empty or nonsensical. In one case 4 lines
      produced 464 of scrolling
      
      
      		Kyle,
      
      		Don't you have anything better to do?  This posting is more
      of a waste of time than any of the others.  I admit that sometimes reply
      messages are posted without erasing nonessential garbage but this is
      ridiculous.  All that is necessary is an occasional gentle reminder.
      
      		Roger
      
________________________________________________________________________________
Date: 
Apr 22, 2011
From: 
"Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <nuckolls.bob(at)aeroelectric.com>
Subject: 
Re: Lightening up Z12
      
      
      At 02:50 PM 4/22/2011, you wrote:
      >
      >Bob,
      >
      >Since I would like to share one shunt, the shunt would have to come 
      >after the ANL for the main alternator and the fusible link for the 
      >standby alternator.  Is there any issue with the placement of the 
      >shunt before or after the wire protection?  Attached is a drawing of 
      >the proposal.
      >
      >You can see the fuseable link attaches to the shunt along wiht the B 
      >lead from the main alternator
      
          What you show is fine.
      
      
         Bob . . . 
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
Date: 
Apr 22, 2011
Subject: 
Re: ATTN:gpabruce,aslsa,ainut & raymond
From: 
b d <gpabruce(at)gmail.com>
      
      Gad aren't we so lucky to have someone like you to monitor and correct our
      dialog. Can you me a favor please?. . . Let's just take mine for example
      
      gpa bruce               1 / 144
      
      and please show me how I should reduce the 144 lines to 1 line so I can
      learn and conserve on cyberspace too.
      
      Thank you,
      
      Bruce
      
      
      On Fri, Apr 22, 2011 at 12:41 PM, Fergus Kyle  wrote:
      
      >  Folks,
      >
      >         I have just read today=92s list of messages. The plethora (a numb
      er
      > of pleths) of unnecessary empty or repeated
      >
      > lines is staggering.
      >
      >         A kudos to those who are succinct and unwasteful of space but
      > those above take note:
      >
      >     The number of lines needed/number of lines taken
      >
      > gpa bruce               1 / 144
      >
      > aslsa                   2 / 264
      >
      > jared                   2 / 72
      >
      > ainut                   3 / 161
      >
      > aslsa                   2 / 200
      >
      > Raymond         12/ 244
      >
      >         That=92s 22 lines of info and 1085 lines of explanation, most of
      > which are empty or nonsensical. In one case 4 lines produced 464 of
      > scrolling
      >
      >
      > *
      >
      ===========
      ===========
      ===========
      ===========
      > *
      >
      >
      
________________________________________________________________________________
From: 
Bob Meyers <bobmeyers(at)meyersfamily.org>
Subject: 
Re: ATTN:gpabruce,aslsa,ainut & raymond
Date: 
Apr 22, 2011
      
      Hi Bruce,
      
      Assuming you don't have your tongue firmly in your cheek,  I'll answer  
      
      for the original poster and politely razz him a little at the same time.
      
      I have copied your entire post that he commented on below my signature  
      
      (which probably won't please the original poster). He is upset that  
      when you replied you did not remove or snip and shorten the previous  
      posts you were replying too. A sample of how he would have liked your  
      
      post to appear is below your original (and above the untrimmed post I  
      
      am replying too).  Some people seem to feel this is bad net manners,  
      akin to spitting on the sidewalk or voting for the wrong party (take  
      your pick).
      
      Admittedly, this does waste both network bandwidth and storage space,  
      
      especially when untrimmed replies to replies to replies, etc, take  
      place.
      
      However,  we are living on a text only mail list here and your post,  
      while having a high waste of space ratio, according to the original  
      poster, is hardly very offensive in this regard.  In fact, it is  
      unlikely that it took up anymore storage space than a shortened  
      message might on anybodies hard drives as it is likely all contained  
      by itself on one sector of those hard drives because of minimum sector  
      
      size issues. It might even have been contained in one data packet on  
      the net as well - minus the mail server handshaking etc.
      
      I fully support snipping as I don't won't to waste anyones resources,  
      
      but wasting time is also wasting resources and on some posts it just  
      isn't worth it or the full context is desired.
      
      Either way, what I find down right rude is calling out specific  
      individuals by name for what is at most a modest crime and documenting  
      
      just how offensive they are to a self appointed scold. I would think  
      an occasional gentle reminder to trim posts would be much more  
      effective for someone who is upset by others netiquette.
      
      Since I want this post to be in the archives, I can't type the other  
      space saving device I will assume the original poster may want you to  
      
      use, but it starts with 'do not' and ends with 'archive' - hope the  
      parser is strict!
      
      Bob Meyers
      
      Flight Testing Sonex N982SX Web Site Index http://N982SX.com
      
      > I second the motion  . . . . you cannot hardly buy a book for $9.95  
      
      > these days let alone a CAD pkg plus the book . . . .
      >
      > On Thu, Apr 21, 2011 at 8:19 PM, Jim Wickert  
      >  wrote:
       >
      >
      > There is one important point to remember when getting a Cad package
      > Documentation.... Documentation this is one thing that makes Turbo  
      > Cad worth
      > the $9.95 extremely good documentation and support.  I have the  
      > Siemens 2&3
      > D Cad and their PLM package as well as others...... and for someone  
      
      > who is
      > working with CAD everyday they will come up to speed.  But for low  
      > time CAD
      > people and people who use it on a project once in the Blue Moon that
      > Documentation is a life saver.  I have nothing to gain by the sale  
      > of Turbo
      > Cad but as a tool for the low time user it is great and like I say the
      > Documentation alone is worth the price of admission enough said.
      >
      > Jim Wickert
      > Tel 920-467-0219
      > Cell 920-912-1014
      >
      >
      > -----Original Message-----
      > From: owner-aeroelectric-list-server(at)matronics.com
      > [mailto:owner-aeroelectric-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of  
      > John
      > Loram
      > Sent: Thursday, April 21, 2011 7:15 PM
      > To: aeroelectric-list(at)matronics.com
      > Subject: AeroElectric-List: Siemens Solid Edge 2D Drafting - was  
      > TurboCAD 15
      >
      > 
      >
      > Siemens make the 2D version of it's high end 3D product available  
      > for free.
      >
      > Comes with extensive libraries of mechanical and electrical  
      > components.
      >
      > Outputs files in both its own format and industry standard formats.
      >
      > It's a very capable product: http://www.solidedge.com/free2d
      >
      > Takes a while to download...
      >
      > -john-
      >
      >
      > s.com/Navigator?AeroElectric-List" 
      target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?AeroElectric-List
      > ronics.com/" target="_blank">http://forums.matronics.com
      > Matt Dralle, List Admin.
      > ====
      >
      >
      I second the motion  . . . . you cannot hardly buy a book for $9.95  
      these days let alone a CAD pkg plus the book . . . .
      
      
       >>>Documentation alone is worth the price of admission enough said.<<<
      
      
      > On Apr 22, 2011, at 4:40 PM, b d wrote:
      >
      >> Gad aren't we so lucky to have someone like you to monitor and  
      >> correct our dialog. Can you me a favor please?. . . Let's just take  
      
      >> mine for example
      >> gpa bruce               1 / 144
      >>
      >> and please show me how I should reduce the 144 lines to 1 line so I  
      
      >> can learn and conserve on cyberspace too.
      >>
      >> Thank you,
      >>
      >> Bruce
      >>
      >>
      >>
      >>
      >>
      >>
      >>
      >>
      >> On Fri, Apr 22, 2011 at 12:41 PM, Fergus Kyle  wrote:
      >> Folks,
      >>
      >>         I have just read today=92s list of messages. The plethora (a  
      
      >> number of pleths) of unnecessary empty or repeated
      >>
      >> lines is staggering.
      >>
      >>         A kudos to those who are succinct and unwasteful of space  
      >> but those above take note:
      >>
      >> The number of lines needed/number of lines taken
      >>
      >> gpa bruce               1 / 144
      >>
      >> aslsa                   2 / 264
      >>
      >> jared                   2 / 72
      >>
      >> ainut                   3 / 161
      >>
      >> aslsa                   2 / 200
      >>
      >> Raymond         12/ 244
      >>
      >>         That=92s 22 lines of info and 1085 lines of explanation, most 
      
      >> of which are empty or nonsensical. In one case 4 lines produced 464  
      
      >> of scrolling
      >>
      >>
      >>
      >>
      >>
      >> ist" 
      target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?AeroElectric-List
      >> ttp://forums.matronics.com
      >> _blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution
      >>
      >>
      >>
      >>
      ===========
      ===========
      ===========
      ===========
      >>
      >
      
________________________________________________________________________________
Date: 
Apr 22, 2011
Subject: 
Re: ATTN:gpabruce,aslsa,ainut & raymond
From: 
b d <gpabruce(at)gmail.com>
      
      Bob, Your point is well taken . . . is this better? And for Fergus Kyle <
      VE3LVO(at)rac.ca>  here are a couple lists I'm sure he will want to transfer to
      since he is so critical and intolerant of me and other people . . .
      
      perfect people only-list(at)matronics.com 
      
      get-a-life-list(at)matronics.com
      
      *lintolerent republicans-list(at)matronics.com *
      
      
      Thanks,
      
      Bruce
      "Save Cyber Space . . . . people are watching what you say"
      
________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: 
Re: ATTN:gpabruce,aslsa,ainut & raymond
From: 
Robert Borger <rlborger(at)mac.com>
Date: 
Apr 22, 2011
      
      Bruce,
      
      Why don't you go try out Biggoted_Democrats-list(at)craniorectalinversion.com
      
      Bob
      
      On Apr 22, 2011, at 18:08, b d wrote:
      
      > Bob, Your point is well taken . . . is this better? And for Fergus Kyle 
      here are a couple lists I'm sure he will want to transfer to since
      he is so critical and intolerant of me and other people . . .  
      >  
      > perfect people only-list(at)matronics.com 
      >  
      > get-a-life-list(at)matronics.com
      >  
      > lintolerent republicans-list(at)matronics.com
      >  
      >  
      > Thanks,
      >  
      > Bruce
      > "Save Cyber Space . . . . people are watching what you say"
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: 
Re: ATTN:gpabruce,aslsa,ainut & raymond
Date: 
Apr 22, 2011
From: 
Dj Merrill <deej(at)deej.net>
      
      On Apr 22, 2011, at 6:40 PM, Bob Meyers  wrote:
      
      > . I would think an occasional gentle reminder to trim posts would be much m
      ore effective for someone who is upset by others netiquette.
      > 
      
      To be fair, we've had many gentle reminders over the years and they apparent
      ly do not seem to help. It is not just the space being taken up, it makes se
      arching the archives a major PITA.  Because people do not trim their posts, s
      earching pulls up multiple hits of the same repeated text, often several pag
      es of hits, which makes the search function useless at times. 
      
      So not only do we get to enjoy the rudeness in realtime, it lives on forever
       in the archives...
      
      -Dj
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
Date: 
Apr 22, 2011
From: 
David <ainut(at)knology.net>
Subject: 
Re: ATTN:gpabruce,aslsa,ainut & raymond
      
      
      Usually people normally trim, but occasionally one has only a few 
      moments to respond to an email...
      
      I find it terribly difficult to follow those who answer posts who trim 
      *everything* except their own reply.
      
      David
      
      
      Dj Merrill wrote:
      > On Apr 22, 2011, at 6:40 PM, Bob Meyers  > wrote:
      >
      >> . I would think an occasional gentle reminder to trim posts would be 
      >> much more effective for someone who is upset by others netiquette.
      >>
      >
      > To be fair, we've had many gentle reminders over the years and they 
      > apparently do not seem to help. It is not just the space being taken 
      > up, it makes searching the archives a major PITA.  Because people do 
      > not trim their posts, searching pulls up multiple hits of the same 
      > repeated text, often several pages of hits, which makes the search 
      > function useless at times.
      >
      > So not only do we get to enjoy the rudeness in realtime, it lives on 
      > forever in the archives...
      >
      > -Dj
      >
      > *
      >
      >
      > *
      
      -- 
      If you're an American, just say NO to the Obamanation, to socialism, and get rid
      of Soros.
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: 
Re: ATTN:gpabruce,aslsa,ainut & raymond
From: 
Jared Yates <email(at)jaredyates.com>
Date: 
Apr 23, 2011
      
      I
      Also
      Used
      3
      Extra
      Sheets
      Of
      Tp 
      today
      But
      I
      Still
      Don't
      Know
      Anything
      More
      About
      Shielded
      Wires. 
      
      
      On Apr 22, 2011, at 15:41, Fergus Kyle  wrote:
      
      > Folks,
      > 
      >         I have just read today=99s list of messages. The plethora (a
       number of pleths) of unnecessary empty or repeated
      > 
      > lines is staggering.
      > 
      >         A kudos to those who are succinct and unwasteful of space but thos
      e above take note:
      > 
      > The number of lines needed/number of lines taken
      > 
      > gpa bruce               1 / 144
      > 
      > aslsa                   2 / 264
      > 
      > jared                   2 / 72
      > 
      > ainut                   3 / 161
      > 
      > aslsa                   2 / 200
      > 
      > Raymond         12/ 244
      > 
      >         That=99s 22 lines of info and 1085 lines of explanation, mos
      t of which are empty or nonsensical. In one case 4 lines produced 464 of scr
      olling
      > 
      > 
      > 
      > 
      > 
      ==========================
      =========
      ==========================
      =========
      ==========================
      =========
      ==========================
      =========
      > 
      
________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: 
Re: ATTN:gpabruce,aslsa,ainut 
From: 
dfritzj <dfritzj(at)yahoo.com>
Date: 
Apr 23, 2011
      
      
      Isn't shielded wire supposed to keep the noise off communication lines.....
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
Date: 
Apr 23, 2011
Subject: 
Re: ATTN:gpabruce,aslsa,ainut & raymond
From: 
b d <gpabruce(at)gmail.com>
      
      Furgusmaycomeandcheckoutyourwastepaperbaskettomakesureyouusedeverysquareinc
      hoftoiletpaperanddidn'twasteanylinesorleaveaplethoraofemptyspaces.
      bruce
      
      
      On Fri, Apr 22, 2011 at 10:57 PM, Jared Yates  wrote:
      
      >  I
      > Also
      > Used
      > 3
      > Extra
      > Sheets
      > Of
      > Tp
      > today
      > But
      > I
      > Still
      > Don't
      > Know
      > Anything
      > More
      > About
      > Shielded
      > Wires.
      >
      >
      > On Apr 22, 2011, at 15:41, Fergus Kyle  wrote:
      >
      >   Folks,
      >
      >         I have just read today=92s list of messages. The plethora (a numb
      er
      > of pleths) of unnecessary empty or repeated
      >
      > lines is staggering.
      >
      >         A kudos to those who are succinct and unwasteful of space but
      > those above take note:
      >
      >     The number of lines needed/number of lines taken
      >
      > gpa bruce               1 / 144
      >
      > aslsa                   2 / 264
      >
      > jared                   2 / 72
      >
      > ainut                   3 / 161
      >
      > aslsa                   2 / 200
      >
      > Raymond         12/ 244
      >
      >         That=92s 22 lines of info and 1085 lines of explanation, most of
      > which are empty or nonsensical. In one case 4 lines produced 464 of
      > scrolling
      >
      >
      > *
      >
      > ========================
      > st">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?AeroElectric-List
      > ========================
      > ums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com
      > ========================
      > http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/contribut
      ion
      > ========================
      > *
      >
      > *
      >
      ===========
      ===========
      ===========
      ===========
      > *
      >
      >
      
________________________________________________________________________________
From: 
"Bill Bradburry" <bbradburry(at)bellsouth.net>
Subject: 
ATTN:gpabruce,aslsa,ainut & raymond
Date: 
Apr 23, 2011
      
      Guys,
      
      You can go to Craigslist and select "jokes" if you want to waste time.
      
      
      This is a serious list.  It has enabled me to build a flying airplane with a
      safe electrical system over a period of many years.  I would not have wanted
      to have my time wasted with this BS and I doubt that the folks still
      building do either.
      
      
      Please stop!
      
      
      Bill B
      
      
        _____  
      
      From: owner-aeroelectric-list-server(at)matronics.com
      [mailto:owner-aeroelectric-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of b d
      Sent: Saturday, April 23, 2011 8:00 AM
      Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: ATTN:gpabruce,aslsa,ainut & raymond
      
      
      Furgusmaycomeandcheckoutyourwastepaperbaskettomakesureyouusedeverysquareinch
      oftoiletpaperanddidn'twasteanylinesorleaveaplethoraofemptyspaces.
      
      bruce
      
      
      On Fri, Apr 22, 2011 at 10:57 PM, Jared Yates  wrote:
      
      I
      
      Also
      
      Used
      
      3
      
      Extra
      
      Sheets
      
      Of
      
      Tp 
      
      today
      
      But
      
      I
      
      Still
      
      Don't
      
      Know
      
      Anything
      
      More
      
      About
      
      Shielded
      
      Wires. 
      
      
      On Apr 22, 2011, at 15:41, Fergus Kyle  wrote:
      
      Folks,
      
              I have just read today's list of messages. The plethora (a number of
      pleths) of unnecessary empty or repeated
      
      lines is staggering.
      
              A kudos to those who are succinct and unwasteful of space but those
      above take note:
      
      The number of lines needed/number of lines taken
      
      gpa bruce               1 / 144
      
      aslsa                   2 / 264
      
      jared                   2 / 72
      
      ainut                   3 / 161
      
      aslsa                   2 / 200
      
      Raymond         12/ 244
      
              That's 22 lines of info and 1085 lines of explanation, most of which
      are empty or nonsensical. In one case 4 lines produced 464 of scrolling
      
      
      =========
      st">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?AeroElectric-List
      =========
      ums.matronics.com <http://ums.matronics.com/> ">http://forums.matronics.com
      <http://forums.matronics.com/> 
      =========
      http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/contribution
      =========
      
      
      ist" target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?AeroElectric-List
      ttp://forums.matronics.com
      _blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
Date: 
Apr 23, 2011
From: 
"Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <nuckolls.bob(at)aeroelectric.com>
Subject: 
List decorum
      
      
      At 07:59 AM 4/23/2011, you wrote:
      >Furgusmaycomeandcheckoutyourwastepaperbaskettomakesureyouusedeverysquareinchoftoiletpaperanddidn'twasteanylinesorleaveaplethoraofemptyspaces.
      >bruce
      >
      
         Okay folks. We've all known Fergus for a whole lot of
         years here on the List. He attended a weekend seminar
         I presented in the Toronto area some years ago. I
         spent a pleasant evening across the dinner table
         from him and his wife. I don't think he's got a
         vindictive bone in his body.
      
         At the same time, we've all observed how easy it
         is to assign emotional weight to written words
         that has nothing to do with the spirit and intent
         of the writer. Some of you have come down pretty
         hard on me in past years based on some mis-interpretation
         of my spirit and intent.
      
         I have observed there are but 4 reasons that
         humans communicate with each other. To inform,
         entertain, constructively persuade, or to
         bully.
      
         The first three goals are always useful amongst
         honorable people. Bullying has no useful
         purpose except to speaker/writer who takes
         personal pleasure in the discomfort of others.
         When you write for this list, please be mindful
         of the intent for your choice of words.
      
         And let us give the benefit of the doubt
         to others . . . we may not be perfect in our
         communications skills but out of thousands
         of participants over 10+ years on the
         AeroElectric-List, we have encountered
         very few bullies . . . and they were asked
         to leave. The probability that anyone is
         deliberately practicing the bully's arts
         is very low. At the same time, a population
         of 1600 members on the List offers a high
         potential for misunderstanding.
      
         We study the simple-ideas that go into
         recipes for success in the aviation technologies
         for the benefit of any who which to participate.
         There are also simple-ideas in human behavior
         that come together nicely as recipes for
         success in the conduct of a civilized society.
      
         I'd like to believe that we who take the
         limits and capabilities of airplanes very
         seriously are equally respectful of the
         limits and capabilities of our fellow
         pilots.
      
      
         Bob . . . 
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: 
Re: ATTN:gpabruce,aslsa,ainut
From: 
Jared Yates <email(at)jaredyates.com>
Date: 
Apr 23, 2011
      
      
      When do you hook up both ends of the shield vs just one end?  Can you run a left
      and right audio channel in a two-wire shielded cable, or do they need to be
      separated? Does the Garmin lo go to the shield of the high, or do both get their
      own shields?  Two wires in the same shield, or two separate singles?
      
      
      On Apr 23, 2011, at 6:04, dfritzj  wrote:
      
      > 
      > Isn't shielded wire supposed to keep the noise off communication lines.....
      > 
      > 
      > 
      > 
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
Date: 
Apr 23, 2011
From: 
"Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <nuckolls.bob(at)aeroelectric.com>
Subject: 
Re: shields
      
      
      At 09:29 AM 4/23/2011, you wrote:
      >
      >When do you hook up both ends of the shield vs just one end?
      
          When the installation instructions for the
          system's components call for it.
      
      >  Can you run a left and right audio channel in a two-wire shielded 
      > cable, or do they need to be separated?
      
         They can share the bundle.
      
      >  Does the Garmin lo go to the shield of the high, or do both get 
      > their own shields?  Two wires in the same shield, or two separate singles?
      
         Shielding of wires has a VERY limited utility
         in fabricating our airplanes. The effect of a
         shield is to break the potential for CAPACITIVE
         coupling of a high-intensity, fast-rise time
         antagonistic stimulus into a potential victim
         small signal pathway.
      
         A pair of small wires tightly twisted together
         have an inter-wire capacitance on the order of
         1 PICOFARAD per inch. A very tiny capacitance.
         It takes a butt-ugly signal of very large magnitude
         to push across that a few pico-farads of
         inter-wire capacitance.
      
         Those kinds of antagonists were rare behind the
         panel in years past (magneto p-leads which were
         always shielded). With the advent of electronic
         ignition systems, those leads have become less
         to non-antagonistic.
      
         You could wire your entire system with unshielded,
         twisted trios or pairs with a high probability
         for success.
      
         In some, rare instances, the shield is ALSO a
         signal or ground pathway between black boxes
         and the installation wiring diagram will be
         explicit in the termination of the shield
         at both ends. In all other cases, connection
         at one end only is quite sufficient . . . and
         should you choose NOT to shield the wire, the
         probability of unwelcome behaviors from the
         system is very, very low.
      
      
         Bob . . . 
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
Date: 
Apr 23, 2011
From: 
James Robinson <jbr79r(at)yahoo.com>
Subject: 
Re: List decorum
      
      Very well put  Bob!!!
      Jim
      
       James Robinson
      Glasair lll  N79R
      Spanish Fork UT  U77
      
      
      ________________________________
      From: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <nuckolls.bob(at)aeroelectric.com>
      Sent: Sat, April 23, 2011 6:21:17 AM
      Subject: AeroElectric-List: List decorum
      
      
      
      At 07:59 AM 4/23/2011, you wrote:
      >Furgusmaycomeandcheckoutyourwastepaperbaskettomakesureyouusedeverysquareinchoftoiletpaperanddidn'twasteanylinesorleaveaplethoraofemptyspaces.
      >.
      > bruce
      > 
      
        Okay folks. We've all known Fergus for a whole lot of
        years here on the List. He attended a weekend seminar
        I presented in the Toronto area some years ago. I
        spent a pleasant evening across the dinner table
        from him and his wife. I don't think he's got a
        vindictive bone in his body.
      
        At the same time, we've all observed how easy it
        is to assign emotional weight to written words
        that has nothing to do with the spirit and intent
        of the writer. Some of you have come down pretty
        hard on me in past years based on some mis-interpretation
        of my spirit and intent.
      
        I have observed there are but 4 reasons that
        humans communicate with each other. To inform,
        entertain, constructively persuade, or to
        bully.
      
        The first three goals are always useful amongst
        honorable people. Bullying has no useful
        purpose except to speaker/writer who takes
        personal pleasure in the discomfort of others.
        When you write for this list, please be mindful
        of the intent for your choice of words.
      
        And let us give the benefit of the doubt
        to others . . . we may not be perfect in our
        communications skills but out of thousands
        of participants over 10+ years on the
        AeroElectric-List, we have encountered
        very few bullies . . . and they were asked
        to leave. The probability that anyone is
        deliberately practicing the bully's arts
        is very low. At the same time, a population
        of 1600 members on the List offers a high
        potential for misunderstanding.
      
        We study the simple-ideas that go into
        recipes for success in the aviation technologies
        for the benefit of any who which to participate.
        There are also simple-ideas in human behavior
        that come together nicely as recipes for
        success in the conduct of a civilized society.
      
        I'd like to believe that we who take the
        limits and capabilities of airplanes very
        seriously are equally respectful of the
        limits and capabilities of our fellow
        pilots.
      
      
        Bob . . . 
      
________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: 
Re: Lightening up Z12
From: 
"rvg8tor" <rvg8tor(at)comcast.net>
Date: 
Apr 23, 2011
      
      
      Thought I would follow up with a picture.  I decided to attach the standby alternator
      B lead on the downstream side of the ANL since it was more substantial
      than the screw on the shunt.  If the screws on the shunt were to work loose there
      is a tight enough fit that the copper bar should stay in place and provide
      some conductivity.  In the drawing in the second post of this thread, the standby
      B lead was attached at the shunt.
      
      Ring on terminal on the left is the standby B lead and the main is on the right
      of the ANL.
      
      Cheers
      
      
      --------
      Mike "Nemo" Elliott
      RV-8A QB (Fuselage)
      
      
      Read this topic online here:
      
      http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=337903#337903
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
From: 
Speedy11(at)aol.com
Date: 
Apr 23, 2011
Subject: 
Re: Cool!
      
      Dormant in comparison to the past 6 to 8 years.
      Stan
      
      
      In a message dated 4/23/2011 3:04:06 A.M. Eastern Daylight Time,  
      aeroelectric-list(at)matronics.com writes:
      
      Not  dormant at all. Check the web forum link below and your spam  filters.
      
      john
      
      
      On 4/22/2011 9:09 AM, Speedy11(at)aol.com  wrote:
      > This forum seemed to go dormant for about 6-8 months.  I'm  glad to see 
      > lots of discussion again.
      > Stan  Sutterfield
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
Date: 
Apr 23, 2011
From: 
David <ainut(at)knology.net>
Subject: 
Re: ATTN:gpabruce,aslsa,ainut & raymond
      
      
      Jeez, Bill, can't we lighten up SOMETIMES?? A little humor break is 
      welcomed by me now and then.
      
      David
      
      
      Bill Bradburry wrote:
      >
      > Guys,
      >
      > You can go to Craigslist and select jokes if you want to waste time.
      >
      > This is a serious list. It has enabled me to build a flying airplane 
      > with a safe electrical system over a period of many years. I would not 
      > have wanted to have my time wasted with this BS and I doubt that the 
      > folks still building do either.
      >
      > Please stop!
      >
      > Bill B
      >
      > ------------------------------------------------------------------------
      >
      > *From:* owner-aeroelectric-list-server(at)matronics.com 
      > [mailto:owner-aeroelectric-list-server(at)matronics.com] *On Behalf Of *b d
      > *Sent:* Saturday, April 23, 2011 8:00 AM
      > *To:* aeroelectric-list(at)matronics.com; VE3LVO(at)rac.ca
      > *Subject:* Re: AeroElectric-List: ATTN:gpabruce,aslsa,ainut & raymond
      >
      > Furgusmaycomeandcheckoutyourwastepaperbaskettomakesureyouusedeverysquareinchoftoiletpaperanddidn'twasteanylinesorleaveaplethoraofemptyspaces.
      >
      > bruce
      >
      >
      > On Fri, Apr 22, 2011 at 10:57 PM, Jared Yates  > wrote:
      >
      > I
      >
      > Also
      >
      > Used
      >
      > 3
      >
      > Extra
      >
      > Sheets
      >
      > O
      >
      <<>>
      
      -- 
      If you're an American, just say NO to the Obamanation, to socialism, and get rid
      of Soros.
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
Date: 
Apr 23, 2011
From: 
David <ainut(at)knology.net>
Subject: 
cad or cad-like program?
      
      
      Anyone know of a cad or cad-like program that we could use to model our 
      electrical system?  It would be great if it could simulate loads and 
      help me know if my breaker is large enough or my wire has enough 
      ampacity.  Better still would be to suggest which size breaker or wire 
      to use.
      
      Could we possibly 'standardize' on a model share format so that we could 
      send each other our schematics for comment?
      
      David M.
      
      -- 
      If you're an American, just say NO to the Obamanation, to socialism, and get rid
      of Soros.
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
Date: 
Apr 23, 2011
From: 
"Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <nuckolls.bob(at)aeroelectric.com>
Subject: 
Re: Shielding
      
      At 06:04 AM 4/23/2011, you wrote:
      >
      >Isn't shielded wire supposed to keep the noise off communication lines.....
      
          Sorta . . .
      
          I'll refer you to chapter 16 on noise but in a nutshell . . .
      
          While the term "noise" usually conjures up an image
          of un-useful things heard in the headphones, audible
          interference is but a small subset of antagonistic
          stimulus finding its way into a potentially vulnerable
          victims.
      
          Not all things electrically 'wiggly' are noise. A
          a potentially antagonistic stimulus does not become
          noise until a potential victim is sufficiently
          influenced by it that performance is unacceptable.
      
          This is why the chapter on 'noise' is entitled
          "Electromagnetic Compatibility". The broader
          spectrum of examples for 'noise' might include
          instruments that don't quite read right, ignition
          systems that "mis", panel lights that flicker, etc.
      
          Further, just because an airplane is carrying around
          one or more potential antagonists and perhaps a handful
          of potential victims is not an automatic recipe for
          failure.
      
          The noise must have a propagation mode. It can be
          directly connected (trash on the power supply,
          ground loop, etc), radiated (ammeter lays over
          by radio energy from transmitter), capacitively
          coupled (high voltage, spikey waveforms couple
          to parallel wires in the bundle), and inductively
          (high current, spikey waveforms couple to parallel
          wires).
      
          Of the four modes cited, capacitive and inductive
          coupling are the weakest. I've never fixed a noise
          problem in a system by adding shield. I've encountered
          magnetically coupled noises three times I can recall.
          Once on a Beechjet, once on a Hawker 800 and once
          on my Plymouth Voyager. The rest of my ventures into
          the dragon's lair were to find and sometimes fix
          conducted and radiated propagation issues.
      
          But know that for the kinds of potential
          noises and the manner in which our itty-bitty
          airplanes are built, shielding is the very
          least of your worries. Follow manufacturer's
          instructions. If a noise problem emerges,
          the last portal to open to the dragon's lair
          will be that of shielding.
      
          Bob . . .
          is the weakest and least
      
      
         Bob . . . 
      
________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: 
D-Sub and other small connections
From: 
"messydeer" <messydeer(at)yahoo.com>
Date: 
Apr 23, 2011
      
      
      Hi!
      
       I'm a few to several months away from completing my Sonex. I have all of the wiring
      that goes through the firewall already installed, including my MGL Enigma.
      I got a used Collins TDR-950 transponder a week or so ago and now need to buy
      and install a radio, ELT and the audio. 
      
      The transponder came only with the bare plastic 15 position single row card edge
      connector housing. I understand I'd need 15 card edge contacts to crimp or solder,
      then slide them into this housing. I'll need to connect the other end of
      most of the wires to a 9-pin male D-Sub connector. The MGL V10 (or V6) radio
      would also use a 9-pin D-sub connector. And even if the ELT and any audio devices
      use those connections, there still wouldn't be that many of them. So I am
      considering soldering all the connections instead of crimping. I feel fairly
      comfortable with soldering and wouldn't have to buy a $30-40 crimp tool. I've
      read that soldering underneath the panel isn't fun, which could be needed for
      any changes made later. Seems I'd be able to pull both ends of the wires out and
      do this out of the plane. Anything else I'd need to consider?
      
      There don't seem to be any solder cup card edge contacts at digikey, unless I want
      to buy 5,000 of them.  I'd just crimp the 15 wires with the open barrel edge
      contacts with needle nose pliers, right?
      
      As far as the D-Sub connector, is there an advantage to using a plastic hood to
      cover the end? Seems some heatshrink would make for a good strain relief fitting.
      
      Any comments appreciated. Below is a pic of the card edge contact at digikey.
      
      --------
      Dan
      
      
      Read this topic online here:
      
      http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=337940#337940
      
      
      Attachments: 
      
      http://forums.matronics.com//files/card_edge_contact_134.jpg
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
Date: 
Apr 24, 2011
From: 
"Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <nuckolls.bob(at)aeroelectric.com>
Subject: 
Re: D-Sub and other small connections
      
      
      I feel fairly comfortable with soldering and wouldn't have to buy a 
      $30-40 crimp tool. I've read that soldering underneath the panel 
      isn't fun, which could be needed for any changes made later. Seems 
      I'd be able to pull both ends of the wires out and do this out of the 
      plane. Anything else I'd need to consider?
      
          Soldered d-subs can be most adequate to the
          task . . . but except for those that go to
          etched circuit boards, I've not soldered one
          in decades. I would think that you could do
          all of your harness work out of the airplane.
      
      
      There don't seem to be any solder cup card edge contacts at digikey, 
      unless I want to buy 5,000 of them.  I'd just crimp the 15 wires with 
      the open barrel edge contacts with needle nose pliers, right?
      
         Please don't. The b-crimp tools are pretty specific
         in their design and function for getting a good grip
         on the wires. See:
      
      http://www.aeroelectric.com/articles/matenlok/matenlok.html
      
      
      As far as the D-Sub connector, is there an advantage to using a 
      plastic hood to cover the end? Seems some heatshrink would make for a 
      good strain relief fitting.
      
         Actually, heat shrink is only a marginal strain
         relief because it too is flexible. Hoods are
         always a good idea unless the bundle is
         to be supported by other means within a few
         inches of connector.
      
      
      Any comments appreciated. Below is a pic of the card edge contact at digikey.
      
         Why not get the better tools, finish the job with
         a higher degree of confidence and then sell the
         tools? There are probably folks here on the List
         that would take them off your hands for $10 less
         than you paid for them . . . which means that you
         get to 'rent' the real-deal for $10 a shot.
      
         The cost of using better tools and processes
         will seem insignificant compared to the $time$
         it will take to find a pin that has become
         detached AFTER you've installed it.
      
         At this time I am struggling with the installation
         of a new radio in my truck . . . normally a simple
         cut-out-the-old-connector-splice-in-a-new-connector
         endeavor. But an intermittent pin in one of two
         connectors in series has caused me to cut out a
         perfectly good connector and splice around it
         before zeroing in on a bad pin in a NEW connector
         that mates with the back of the radio.
      
         Now, if I'd paid $30 extra for the radio and had
         Best Buy install it, I would have save about 5 hours,
         two weeks delay and lots of cursing and crying out
         in the darkness.
      
         It goes to the interesting question of "when does
         the bargain cease to be a bargain?" The numbers of
         folk who have regretted using the right tool is
         probably zero. The folks who have regretted not using
         the right tool are . . . well . . .
      
      
         Bob . . . 
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: 
Re: Flap System trouble shoot
From: 
"jonlaury" <jonlaury(at)impulse.net>
Date: 
Apr 24, 2011
      
      
      Now in schematic form per Bob's suggestion. 
      Aircraft Extras FPS-plus nt  schematic URL - http://www.aircraftextras.com/PDF-files/FPS-Plus-ntWebE.pdf
      
      
      > 
      > It would be helpful to know more about the flap
      > control system. What's the 'current limit' issue
      > all about. Normally, flap system draws are pretty
      > benign, 10A or less. What is it about your particular
      > flap configuration that makes it "oversized" for
      > the control system. What is the design goal for
      > an "override switch"? 
      
      
      My flap motor draws 7.5 amps in a no load condition. The traces on the FPS-Plus
      board are good for 10 amps. My flap extension speed is 140mph and I was concerned
      that under load I would be near max. amperage of the FPS system. I opted
      for more margin on flap motor current draw.
      The manual flap switch is per AE's suggestion. Should the board in the FPS system
      fry for whatever reason, I can bypass the system with the manual switch.
      
      Per my original post, Pins 15 & 16 of the FPS are normally GRND. When the the FPS
      flap switch is depressed, the selected function goes to 12v+. I have diodes
      in the wires from 15 & 16 to the coils in an attempt to prevent the manual switch
      (12v+) from shorting to ground. But whenever I press the manual switch, the
      fuse blows.
      
      I can't see why.
      
      Any help appreciated.
      
      John
      
      
      Read this topic online here:
      
      http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=337983#337983
      
      
      Attachments: 
      
      http://forums.matronics.com//files/fps_trouble_shoot_131.pdf
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: 
Re: D-Sub and other small connections
From: 
"messydeer" <messydeer(at)yahoo.com>
Date: 
Apr 24, 2011
      
      
      Thanks, Bob :-)
      
      
      > ...when does the bargain cease to be a bargain?
      
      
      I'm certainly guilty of spending hours looking to save a few dollars. How much
      is my time worth? More than that...or it should be. 
      
      Yet, I don't have an open barrel crimp tool. These may be the only 15 open barrel
      contacts I'd crimp, all the others being d-sub. I see that Eclipse makes an
      open barrel crimper, 300-035, which goes for $15-20. I'd be okay with that sitting
      around in my tool box for a decade before using it again, or like you suggest,
      passing it on to another builder. The other option would be to cutoff the
      wings of the contact and just solder it to the wire. Wouldn't this work? Granted,
      if I were to do 100 of them, it wouldn't be worth the time.
      
      Also, I've seen on Frys.com that they have very cheap d-sub stuff made by Pan Pacific.
      Is this fit to use, or would it be better to stick with the digikey suppliers?
      
      --------
      Dan
      
      
      Read this topic online here:
      
      http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=337984#337984
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
Date: 
Apr 24, 2011
From: 
"Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <nuckolls.bob(at)aeroelectric.com>
Subject: 
Re: D-Sub and other small connections
      
      
      >  Wouldn't this work?
      
         I have no way to assess your skill set nor
         the outcome of using any particular product
         outside its design goals without having
         personally observed and considered the results . . .
      
      
      >  Granted, if I were to do 100 of them, it wouldn't be worth the time.
      
         Your call my friend . . .
      
      >Also, I've seen on Frys.com that they have very cheap d-sub stuff 
      >made by Pan Pacific. Is this fit to use, or would it be better to 
      >stick with the digikey suppliers?
      
         How about B&C or Steinair?
      
      
         Bob . . . 
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
Date: 
Apr 24, 2011
From: 
"Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <nuckolls.bob(at)aeroelectric.com>
Subject: 
Re: Flap System trouble shoot
      
      
      >
      >My flap motor draws 7.5 amps in a no load condition. The traces on 
      >the FPS-Plus board are good for 10 amps. My flap extension speed is 
      >140mph and I was concerned that under load I would be near max. 
      >amperage of the FPS system. I opted for more margin on flap motor current draw.
      
          Hmmmm . . . that's a REALLY big, no load draw.
          Do you have any in-flight data on maximum draw?
      
      >The manual flap switch is per AE's suggestion. Should the board in 
      >the FPS system fry for whatever reason, I can bypass the system with 
      >the manual switch.
      
          What is the likelihood that having to make a no-flaps
          landing presents a hazardous condition?
      
      >Per my original post, Pins 15 & 16 of the FPS are normally GRND. 
      >When the the FPS flap switch is depressed, the selected function 
      >goes to 12v+. I have diodes in the wires from 15 & 16 to the coils 
      >in an attempt to prevent the manual switch (12v+) from shorting to 
      >ground. But whenever I press the manual switch, the fuse blows.
      >
      >I can't see why.
      
          I can't see why either without a schematic
          that describes functionality of the compoents
          as-wired in your system.
      
          I can tell you that if wired per the figure I
          referenced in my last posting, the switch
          in the figure becomes the manual switch. Automatic
          commands could be tied in parallel with the manual
          switch if you include the diodes you've described
          to prevent back-flow into the grounded terminal
          on the ECB assembly.
      
          Are you sure your diodes are installed correclty?
      
          Bob . . .
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: 
Re: D-Sub and other small connections
From: 
Etienne Phillips <etienne.phillips(at)gmail.com>
Date: 
Apr 24, 2011
      
      
      On 23 Apr 2011, at 9:28 PM, messydeer wrote:
      
      > I've read that soldering underneath the panel isn't fun, which could be needed
      for any changes made later. 
      
      Hi Dan
      
      Having spent in excess of 100 hours on my back in the front of my Citabria soldering
      thin wires into small places, I can certainly add my voice to those who
      suggest finding another solution. I am more comfortable soldering than crimping
      for a variety of reasons, so your suggestion for making sure both ends of a
      wire can come out would have helped me considerably. My main problem is that nearly
      every instrument in my aeroplane is connected to everything other instrument,
      so the harness would have to come out in one massive loom, but the routing
      of the wires has formed a net around the supports for the panel. With more
      planning I could have avoided that though. 
      
      I'd still suggest being able to get the harness out, as crimping (even with the
      best tools available) in a cramped space on your back in the dark is probably
      only slightly more fun than soldering, which in turn is only slightly better
      than getting teeth pulled.
      
      My 2c...
      Etienne
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
Date: 
Apr 24, 2011
Subject: 
Re: shields
From: 
Jared Yates <email(at)jaredyates.com>
      
      Thanks Bob!  I'm connecting the 9009 Audio Iso Amp, so I'm sort of on the
      manufacturing team myself, and thus partly responsible for the
      manufacturer's instructions.  I'm at the phase of system integration, with
      systems that don't necessarily have harmonious instructions.  It has been a
      fun detective project so far, but I'm hoping that I can get some advice from
      more experienced folks on a couple of key points.
      
      The impression that I get from your reply is that unless I'm counting on
      using the shield as a specific conductor like a signal ground, it doesn't
      really matter very much how I hook up the shields in the audio system.  The
      9009 documentation shows the Nav 1 audio input as a single conductor
      shielded cable with the audio signal on the center conductor and the signal
      ground on the shield.  The Garmin wiring diagram that I have shows the audio
      output hi and lo as a pair in a shielded cable, which is why I'm confused
      about terminology.  When they say lo, do they also mean signal ground, or
      are the two something different?
      
      If you have time to answer any more questions on this topic, I have a few
      listed in my messages from a few days back.  Here's a link to the message
      board version:
      http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?t=81010
      <http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?t=81010>
      I can also paste the other message again, but it's a long one, and since
      some folks must have to pay by the line, I'll hold off unless you can't see
      at the link.
      
________________________________________________________________________________
Date: 
Apr 24, 2011
From: 
"Richard E. Tasker" <retasker(at)optonline.net>
Subject: 
Re: Flap System trouble shoot
      
      
      You don't say which fuse is blowing.  However, if everything is actually 
      connected exactly like the schematic shows no fuse should blow.
      
      I suggest you carefully go over the actual connections to make sure that 
      everything is really connected as shown.  I have had enough times when I 
      just knew that the connections were correct (of course they were 
      correct, I wired them!).  Then when I examined everything more closely 
      found something reversed or connected to the wrong pin.
      
      Good luck.
      
      Dick Tasker
      
      jonlaury wrote:
      > -->  AeroElectric-List message posted by: "jonlaury"
      >
      > Now in schematic form per Bob's suggestion.
      > Aircraft Extras FPS-plus nt  schematic URL - http://www.aircraftextras.com/PDF-files/FPS-Plus-ntWebE.pdf
      >
      >
      >    
      >> It would be helpful to know more about the flap
      >> control system. What's the 'current limit' issue
      >> all about. Normally, flap system draws are pretty
      >> benign, 10A or less. What is it about your particular
      >> flap configuration that makes it "oversized" for
      >> the control system. What is the design goal for
      >> an "override switch"?
      >>      
      >
      > My flap motor draws 7.5 amps in a no load condition. The traces on the FPS-Plus
      board are good for 10 amps. My flap extension speed is 140mph and I was concerned
      that under load I would be near max. amperage of the FPS system. I opted
      for more margin on flap motor current draw.
      > The manual flap switch is per AE's suggestion. Should the board in the FPS system
      fry for whatever reason, I can bypass the system with the manual switch.
      >
      > Per my original post, Pins 15&  16 of the FPS are normally GRND. When the the
      FPS flap switch is depressed, the selected function goes to 12v+. I have diodes
      in the wires from 15&  16 to the coils in an attempt to prevent the manual
      switch (12v+) from shorting to ground. But whenever I press the manual switch,
      the fuse blows.
      >
      > I can't see why.
      >
      > Any help appreciated.
      >
      > John
      >
      >
      > Read this topic online here:
      >
      > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=337983#337983
      >
      >
      > Attachments:
      >
      > http://forums.matronics.com//files/fps_trouble_shoot_131.pdf
      >
      >
      >    
      
      -- 
      Please Note:
      No trees were destroyed in the sending of this message.  We do concede, however,
      that a significant number of electrons may have been temporarily inconvenienced.
      --
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: 
Re: Flap System trouble shoot
From: 
"jonlaury" <jonlaury(at)impulse.net>
Date: 
Apr 24, 2011
      
      
      > Are you sure your diodes are installed correclty? 
      
      
      I'm pretty sure, without it being in front of me now.
      The cathode (banded end) of the diode faces the coil of the relay.
      And the FPS selector switch operates the FPS and flap motor in either direction
      as intended. If a diode was backward, then power would not flow from 15 or 16
      to the relay coil. 
      I also tested the diodes against a new one. They were identical. R is on the order
      of 1500 K ohms, voltage drop is about .54
      
      Dick Tasker said:
      
      > You don't say which fuse is blowing. However, if everything is actually
      > connected exactly like the schematic shows no fuse should blow.
      
      
      The 5a (actually 2a for testing) for the manual switch is the one that blows.
      
      I will re-check everything next time I'm at the hangar.
      
      
      Read this topic online here:
      
      http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=338025#338025
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: 
Re: ATTN:gpabruce,aslsa,ainut & raymond
From: 
"tomcostanza" <Tom(at)CostanzaAndAssociates.com>
Date: 
Apr 25, 2011
      
      
      "Parse that in the Latin declension, and my point is still moot"
      -Cliff Claven
      
      
      > Furgusmaycomeandcheckoutyourwastepaperbaskettomakesureyouusedeverysquareinchoftoiletpaperanddidn'twasteanylinesorleaveaplethoraofemptyspaces.
      
      > bruce 
      
      
      --------
      Clear Skies,
      Tom Costanza
      
      
      Read this topic online here:
      
      http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=338040#338040
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
Date: 
Apr 25, 2011
Subject: 
Re: ATTN:gpabruce,aslsa,ainut & raymond
From: 
b d <gpabruce(at)gmail.com>
      
      "Cheers" to you too!   :-)
      
      Bruce
      
      On Mon, Apr 25, 2011 at 3:24 AM, tomcostanza
      wrote:
      
      > 
      >
      > "Parse that in the Latin declension, and my point is still moot"
      > -Cliff Claven
      >
      >
      > >
      > Furgusmaycomeandcheckoutyourwastepaperbaskettomakesureyouusedeverysquareinchoftoiletpaperanddidn'twasteanylinesorleaveaplethoraofemptyspaces.
      > > bruce
      >
      >
      > --------
      > Clear Skies,
      > Tom Costanza
      >
      >
      > Read this topic online here:
      >
      > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=338040#338040
      >
      >
      
________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: 
Re: Flap System trouble shoot
From: 
"user9253" <fran4sew(at)banyanol.com>
Date: 
Apr 25, 2011
      
      
      Make sure that the manual switch is connected to the hot side of the relay coils
      and not to the grounded side.  And make sure that the switch is wired correctly.
        Depending on the size of the relays, it is possible that high inrush current
      is blowing a 2 amp fuse.  Try a 5 amp.  Or substitute a small 12 volt light bulb
      for the fuse.  If 12 volts are dropped across the light bulb, then there is
      a short to ground someplace.
      Joe
      
      --------
      Joe Gores
      
      
      Read this topic online here:
      
      http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=338058#338058
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: 
Re: D-Sub and other small connections
From: 
"messydeer" <messydeer(at)yahoo.com>
Date: 
Apr 25, 2011
      
      
      Thanks, guys :-)
      
      I've used both B&C and Steinair before and would prefer to deal with either of
      them, but they don't have the parts I'd need. I may see how soldering the 'crimp'
      card edge contacts and if it doesn't work, switch to crimping.
      
      Etienne, it sounds like both crimping and soldering under the panel is a pain,
      but you would still choose soldering if you were to do it over again, assuming
      you'd NOT be able to get the wires out?
      
      Besides this transponder, I'll be getting and installing a COM radio, headset wiring,
      and an ELT. After flying, I may install wingtip lights. Other than this,
      all the wiring is already installed, including that for the EFIS. With any luck
      I hope to not have to pull out a 'massive loom', since the avionics would
      be last in, first out.
      
      --------
      Dan
      
      
      Read this topic online here:
      
      http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=338067#338067
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
Date: 
Apr 25, 2011
From: 
Jeff Page <jpx(at)qenesis.com>
Subject: 
Re: Flap System trouble shoot
      
      John,
      
      If you have wired everything per your drawing, the fuse should not  
      blow, so look first for a wiring error.
      
      After you get that fixed, there are two changes I suggest.  In your  
      diagram, it looks like you are using a double pole switch for the  
      manual override.  So with the switch in neutral position, there is no  
      ground to the relay coils.  This means the automatic controller cannot  
      turn on the relays.  Just delete that half of the switch and ground  
      that side of both relay coils to allow automatic control.
      
      The other suggestion I have is to trade both the NC and NO connections  
      on the relays.  As shown, when not energized, all the flap motor wires  
      have +12V.  To energize, one of those wires is grounded.  Perhaps  
      better is normally both wires grounded and when activated, one goes to  
      +12V.  This way, if a wire shorts to the airframe, it would not  
      normally have power in it.  Less likely to cause a fire ?  In effect,  
      this reverses the operation of the relays, so you will need to switch  
      the wires to the flap motor, so it turns in the same direction as it  
      originally did.
      
      Just to be sure, the switch you need is a single pole, double throw,  
      center off momentary switch for manual flap activation.  If you  
      already have a double pole version, one side can be left unwired.  The  
      aeroelectric switch type is 1-7.
      
      Looks like a nifty flap controller.  If I didn't have manual flaps, I  
      would be really tempted to order one.
      
      Jeff Page
      Dream Aircraft Tundra #10
      
      > Subject: AeroElectric-List: Re: Flap System trouble shoot
      > From: "jonlaury" <jonlaury(at)impulse.net>
      >
      >> Are you sure your diodes are installed correclty?
      >
      >
      > I'm pretty sure, without it being in front of me now.
      > The cathode (banded end) of the diode faces the coil of the relay.
      > And the FPS selector switch operates the FPS and flap motor in  
      > either direction
      > as intended. If a diode was backward, then power would not flow from 15 or 16
      > to the relay coil.
      > I also tested the diodes against a new one. They were identical. R  
      > is on the order
      > of 1500 K ohms, voltage drop is about .54
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
Date: 
Apr 25, 2011
Subject: 
Re: D-Sub and other small connections
From: 
Paul Kuntz <paul.r.kuntz(at)gmail.com>
      
      Dan,
      
      I picked u a molex crimper part number
      63811-1000<http://www.jameco.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/Product_10001_10001_304928_-1>,
      which I ordered from Jameco Electronics.  There are other vendors that carry
      it as well.  It has worked well for a variety of open-barrel type crimps
      like the ones on your card edge.  I didn't have one at first and was in a
      hurry, so I tried hand crimping with small needle nose pliers, then
      soldering, because I was in a hurry.  Neither method produced results that I
      was satisfied with, so I did what I should have done at the start -- ordered
      a proper butt-cheek style crimper and worked on other things for few days
      until it arrived.  It's easy to use and produces a good crimp every time.  I
      quickly got the hang of picking the right size notch in the tool for the
      size of the connector pin and wire being crimped.
      
      Regards,
      Paul Kuntz
      
      
      On Mon, Apr 25, 2011 at 7:49 AM, messydeer  wrote:
      
      >
      > Thanks, guys :-)
      >
      > I've used both B&C and Steinair before and would prefer to deal with either
      > of them, but they don't have the parts I'd need. I may see how soldering the
      > 'crimp' card edge contacts and if it doesn't work, switch to crimping.
      >
      > Etienne, it sounds like both crimping and soldering under the panel is a
      > pain, but you would still choose soldering if you were to do it over again,
      > assuming you'd NOT be able to get the wires out?
      >
      > Besides this transponder, I'll be getting and installing a COM radio,
      > headset wiring, and an ELT. After flying, I may install wingtip lights.
      > Other than this, all the wiring is already installed, including that for the
      > EFIS. With any luck I hope to not have to pull out a 'massive loom', since
      > the avionics would be last in, first out.
      >
      > --------
      > Dan
      >
      >
      > Read this topic online here:
      >
      > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=338067#338067
      >
      >
      
________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: 
Re: Flap System trouble shoot
From: 
"jonlaury" <jonlaury(at)impulse.net>
Date: 
Apr 25, 2011
      
      
      Thank you all for your suggestions.
      
      After pulling things apart and blowing a few more fuses, the thing started working
      as intended. I was pulling off a relay coil spike-catcher diode, to see if
      that would make a difference, and I inadvertently grounded the 14 ga + to the
      flap motor and blew the 15a fuse. When  I tried the FPS system, the flap motor
      wouldn't run but the manual switch was now activating the relays. Same for the
      FPS. I replaced the 15a fuse and s-c diode and everything works fine. I don't
      know what was causing the problem, but I suspect some errant strand of wire
      that was causing a dead short. Maybe the 15a got into it and vaporized it. In
      soldering the diodes into the wire legs, I wrap the splice with a single strand
      of fine wire to hold it in place while soldering. I suspect an errant piece
      of this was lying across a coil terminal to ground invisible to these far-sighted
      eyeballs. 
      
      I also disassembled the flap motor from the worm-drive jack screw because of Bob's
      surprise at the 7.5a no-load draw. The motor by itself draws 2.4a. I thought
      that maybe the jack screw mechanism was gummed up with old hard dried-up grease
      so I disassembled it too. The grease was fresh and all parts turned easily.
      Back together the motor still draws 7a +/-. Just the nature of this beast.
      
      The Aircraft Extras Flap Positioning System works really well and is a breeze to
      use. Highly recommended for those with electric flaps.
      
      John
      
      
      Read this topic online here:
      
      http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=338107#338107
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
From: 
Etienne Phillips <etienne.phillips(at)gmail.com>
Subject: 
Re: D-Sub and other small connections
Date: 
Apr 26, 2011
      
      
      On 25 Apr 2011, at 4:49 PM, messydeer wrote:
      
      > Etienne, it sounds like both crimping and soldering under the panel is 
      a pain, but you would still choose soldering if you were to do it over 
      again, assuming you'd NOT be able to get the wires out?
      
      Yes... However, that's driven by some fairly unique factors. I've been 
      soldering almost daily since I was 6, and getting hold of decent 
      machined crimp pins for D-Subs are prohibitively expensive from here in 
      South Africa. I tried the cheap folded sheet pins, and they are 
      horrendous! My final choice was the solder-cup D-Subs, with heat-shrink 
      over each wire and a housing over the whole plug, supporting the wires 
      in a nice bundle. An entire 15-pin solder-cup D-Sub assembly is cheaper 
      than a single machined crimp pin here, and that's when ordering hundreds 
      of pins at a go, and excluding the cost of the required tooling! A point 
      to add is that the MGL V10 radio is supplied with a solder-cup plug.
      
      If I were to do it over, I would still use the solder-cup d-subs, but 
      I'd make sure I could get the harness out. As it stands, I am able to 
      remove each instrument without any difficulty. Bear in mind too that 
      significant effort went into labelling each wire, and checking that it 
      was soldered correctly. So different choices for different people. Most 
      of the arguments I've heard for crimped pins (aside from the 
      repeatability for unskilled labour) revolves around being able to 
      shuffle the pins around. If the harness is made correctly the first 
      time, the amount of shuffling that needs to be done is minimal in most 
      cases. 
      
      The next consideration is the stiffening of the wire (bad for vibration 
      tolerance) around a soldered joint due to the solder wicking up into the 
      strands of the wire. Bob can comment specifically on this, but my 
      understanding is that if the wire is supported in the D-Sub housing, 
      there should be no additional concern over crimped pins in this regard.
      
      In my aircraft, I can lose the entire electrical system with no 
      discomfort. I am day VFR only pilot, and have steam backups for the 
      airspeed, altimeter and engine indications. I also have a handheld 
      radio, no flaps, manual trim, fixed undercarriage, and twin magnetos. So 
      if any wire were to come loose, the heatshrink should stop it from 
      shorting out, but if it did then at worst it would pop a circuit 
      breaker, and I'd sort it out on the ground.
      
      My solution to the transponder problem, if it were me, would be to 
      solder pigtails directly onto the card, leading to a 15- or 25-pin 
      D-Sub. This would eliminate those awful low-pressure card-edge 
      connectors that are nigh impossible to find now days. I would use a 
      flexible epoxy to cover the soldered joints onto the card to offer some 
      form of vibration relief on the hardened wire. This might mean modifying 
      the tray, but it would yield an easily disconnectable instrument. This 
      solution may very well have hidden dragons though, so I offer it for 
      peer review!
      
      Thanks
      Etienne
      
________________________________________________________________________________
Date: 
Apr 25, 2011
From: 
"Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <nuckolls.bob(at)aeroelectric.com>
Subject: 
Re: D-Sub and other small connections
      
      
      If I were to do it over, I would still use the solder-cup d-subs, but 
      I'd make sure I could get the harness out. As it stands, I am able to 
      remove each instrument without any difficulty.
      
          In the heavy-iron factories, we endeavor to make each
          instrument harness long enough that the connectors can
          be mated up before the instrument is stuck in the hole
          and mounted. There is NO way you lay on your back and
          work behind the panel on a King Air or Beechjet.
      
        Bear in mind too that significant effort went into labelling each 
      wire, and checking that it was soldered correctly. So different 
      choices for different people. Most of the arguments I've heard for 
      crimped pins (aside from the repeatability for unskilled labour) 
      revolves around being able to shuffle the pins around. If the harness 
      is made correctly the first time, the amount of shuffling that needs 
      to be done is minimal in most cases.
      
           With reasonable care, the solder-cup connector
           is perfectly suitable component. I published this
           installation comic-book some years ago . . .
      
      http://www.aeroelectric.com/articles/dsubs/d_solder.html
      
      The next consideration is the stiffening of the wire (bad for 
      vibration tolerance) around a soldered joint due to the solder 
      wicking up into the strands of the wire. Bob can comment specifically 
      on this, but my understanding is that if the wire is supported in the 
      D-Sub housing, there should be no additional concern over crimped 
      pins in this regard.
      
           Behind-the-joints support on d-subs is necessary
           whether the pins are soldered or crimped. Neither
           pin technology offers insulation support behind
           the pin-to-wire interface. The wire is just as
           'solid' inside a crimped pin as it is on a soldered
           pin. So use the hoods . . . or pot the back side
           like . . .
      
      http://www.aeroelectric.com/articles/macservo/macservo.html
      
      My solution to the transponder problem, if it were me, would be to 
      solder pigtails directly onto the card, leading to a 15- or 25-pin 
      D-Sub. This would eliminate those awful low-pressure card-edge 
      connectors that are nigh impossible to find now days. I would use a 
      flexible epoxy to cover the soldered joints onto the card to offer 
      some form of vibration relief on the hardened wire. This might mean 
      modifying the tray, but it would yield an easily disconnectable 
      instrument. This solution may very well have hidden dragons though, 
      so I offer it for peer review!
      
          Been there, done that. Works good and lasts a long
          time. You'll want to fabricate a bench test harness
          to send along with your radio if it has to go to the
          shop so the tech can power it up.
      
         Bob . . .
      
      
         Bob . . . 
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
Date: 
Apr 25, 2011
From: 
Charlie England <ceengland(at)bellsouth.net>
Subject: 
Re: D-Sub and other small connections
      
      On 4/25/2011 6:28 PM, Etienne Phillips wrote:
      >
      > On 25 Apr 2011, at 4:49 PM, messydeer wrote:
      >
      >> Etienne, it sounds like both crimping and soldering under the panel 
      >> is a pain, but you would still choose soldering if you were to do it 
      >> over again, assuming you'd NOT be able to get the wires out?
      >
      > Yes... However, that's driven by some fairly unique factors. I've been 
      > soldering almost daily since I was 6, and getting hold of decent 
      > machined crimp pins for D-Subs are prohibitively expensive from here 
      > in South Africa. I tried the cheap folded sheet pins, and they are 
      > horrendous! My final choice was the solder-cup D-Subs, with 
      > heat-shrink over each wire and a housing over the whole plug, 
      > supporting the wires in a nice bundle. An entire 15-pin solder-cup 
      > D-Sub assembly is cheaper than a single machined crimp pin here, and 
      > that's when ordering hundreds of pins at a go, and excluding the cost 
      > of the required tooling! A point to add is that the MGL V10 radio is 
      > supplied with a solder-cup plug.
      >
      > If I were to do it over, I would still use the solder-cup d-subs, but 
      > I'd make sure I could get the harness out. As it stands, I am able to 
      > remove each instrument without any difficulty. Bear in mind too that 
      > significant effort went into labelling each wire, and checking that it 
      > was soldered correctly. So different choices for different people. 
      > Most of the arguments I've heard /for/ crimped pins (aside from the 
      > repeatability for unskilled labour) revolves around being able to 
      > shuffle the pins around. If the harness is made correctly the first 
      > time, the amount of shuffling that needs to be done is minimal in most 
      > cases.
      >
      > The next consideration is the stiffening of the wire (bad for 
      > vibration tolerance) around a soldered joint due to the solder wicking 
      > up into the strands of the wire. Bob can comment specifically on this, 
      > but my understanding is that if the wire is supported in the D-Sub 
      > housing, there should be no additional concern over crimped pins in 
      > this regard.
      >
      > In my aircraft, I can lose the entire electrical system with no 
      > discomfort. I am day VFR only pilot, and have steam backups for the 
      > airspeed, altimeter and engine indications. I also have a handheld 
      > radio, no flaps, manual trim, fixed undercarriage, and twin magnetos. 
      > So if any wire were to come loose, the heatshrink should stop it from 
      > shorting out, but if it did then at worst it would pop a circuit 
      > breaker, and I'd sort it out on the ground.
      >
      > My solution to the transponder problem, if it were me, would be to 
      > solder pigtails directly onto the card, leading to a 15- or 25-pin 
      > D-Sub. This would eliminate those awful low-pressure card-edge 
      > connectors that are nigh impossible to find now days. I would use a 
      > flexible epoxy to cover the soldered joints onto the card to offer 
      > some form of vibration relief on the hardened wire. This might mean 
      > modifying the tray, but it would yield an easily disconnectable 
      > instrument. This solution may very well have hidden dragons though, so 
      > I offer it for peer review!
      >
      > Thanks
      > Etienne
      I've successfully soldered quite a few of the edge type pins pictured in 
      an earlier email; I just manually folded the shorter wings with needle 
      nose pliers, soldered, then manually wrapped the longer wings. Not a lot 
      of fun, but very 'do-able'.  However, Etienne's solution makes even more 
      sense, as long as warranty isn't an issue.
      
      By paying the price of an extra few ounces & some careful planning, you 
      can avoid diving under the panel for future soldering or crimping 
      sessions. Just make service loops & routing so the connectors can be 
      brought out into the cockpit, or even out over the wing for soldering 
      sessions.
      
      Charlie
      
________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: 
Re: D-Sub and other small connections
From: 
"messydeer" <messydeer(at)yahoo.com>
Date: 
Apr 26, 2011
      
      
      > My solution to the transponder problem, if it were me, would be to solder pigtails
      directly onto the card, leading to a 15- or 25-pin D-Sub.
      
      
      I think I'll have that as plan B, if I can't get the edge contacts to work right.
      
      --------
      Dan
      
      
      Read this topic online here:
      
      http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=338137#338137
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
Date: 
Apr 27, 2011
From: 
Jeff Page <jpx(at)qenesis.com>
Subject: 
VM1000C and Capacitive Fuel Senders
      
      
      A datapoint for the archives, in case someone else runs into this.
      
      I helped a friend solve a problem with his Vision Microsystems VM1000C  
      and VMC capacitance probes.
      
      Before I was involved, one tank had been mis-wired and then corrected.  
        That probe no longer provides a signal, so my conclusion was that  
      the electronics in the probe are not reverse polarity protected.  This  
      is a sad state of affairs, since a repair would involve removing the  
      wing.
      
      The fuel system in this airplane has both wing tanks plumbed together,  
      and generally an indication derived from one tank is sufficient, along  
      with a separate indication for the header tank.  Fortunately, a probe  
      had been installed but never wired up in the other wing tank, so we  
      could use that.
      
      I used an oscilloscope to confirm a 5V square wave output from the  
      probes when powered by the 5V supply of the VM1000C.  I used a signal  
      generator to confirm the VM1000C operated.
      
      The maximum frequency the VM1000C would handle was just above 14KHz.   
      The header tank probe is very short, perhaps a foot and when empty,  
      and generated about 11KHz empty.  Frequency decreases as fuel is  
      added, so there is no problem with the frequency being out of range of  
      the VM1000C.
      
      So with a 5V square wave being generated by the probe, and the VM1000C  
      confirmed to accept it, everything should work, right ?  One might be  
      forgiven if they assumed that both products, offered by the same  
      company might be compatible.  Sadly wrong.
      
      The VM1000C put too much load on the signal from the probes, and  
      converted it into a 1 volt peak-peak triangularly shaped wave :-(
      
      JPI now owns the Vision Microsystems product line, and provided very  
      limited support.  Although the tech seemed to want to be helpful, he  
      did not have access to the schematics or any knowledge of the input  
      characteristics of the VM1000C.  I am quite sure this was not the  
      first non-functional installation, yet he had no knowledge of these  
      issues.  Before I was involved, the owner sent his VM1000C in for  
      testing.  The tech indicated that the unit would have been connected  
      to the same quality test equipment as new units off the production  
      line.  He indicated that a number of wiring harnesses had been shipped  
      that were incorrectly wired, and that new wiring harnesses have the  
      same error.  Although a new harness was promised to be shipped when  
      the unit went for testing, it was not included, so I was not able to  
      confirm this.  I do not know if the harness in the airplane was  
      provided by VMC or fabricated.  The tech is at a different location  
      than the factory and seemed isolated.  For example, he could not look  
      at a harness to identify if it was correct or not.
      
      My solution was buffer the signal with a transistor, and everything  
      works fine.
      
      If anyone needs to do this, what worked well is the following (repeat  
      for each fuel tank).  Resistor values were optimized by observing the  
      resulting waveform with the oscilloscope.
      
      The drawing is crude, so the description is:
      Connect the signal from the fuel probe to the base of the transistor  
      with a 2.7K resistor.  Connect the collector of the transistor as the  
      signal input to the VM1000C.  The collector is also pulled up to +5V  
      with a 1K resistor.
      The emitter is connected to the ground.
      
      
      PROBE                                                       VM1000C
      
      Red +5V ------------------------------------------------- +5V Pin 11 or 12
                                                |
                                                #
                                                # 1K resistor
                                                #
                                                |--------------- Fuel Signal 9 or 10
                                                |
                                               / C
                             2.7K resistor    |
      White Fuel Signal ------####----------B|  2N4401 NPN transistor
                                              |
                                               V E
                                                |
                                                |
      Black Ground -------------------------------------------- Ground Pin 3
      
      Jeff Page
      Dream Aircraft Tundra #10
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
Date: 
Apr 28, 2011
From: 
Peter Pengilly <peter(at)sportingaero.com>
Subject: 
Strange radio transmit problems - take 2
      
      
      In June last year I wrote about a problem I was having with the 
      transmitter in my airplane where the radio would not transmit on some 
      frequencies. I wonder if I could again ask for some advice?
      
      I thought I solved the problem by replacing the radio to antenna coax - 
      but all I in fact did was shift the frequencies that were problematic. 
      Since then I have tried several different fixes without any success. I 
      have improved the grounding of the antenna, replaced the antenna and 
      tried several different headsets, all with no change to the problem. I 
      have found that on the ground without the engine running the radio will 
      transmit on all frequencies (or at least in 1 MHz steps through the 
      frequency band). In the air some frequencies cause a problem (such as 
      118.9, 125.25 and 127.05), but throttling back to idle sometimes 
      produces an intelligible transmission, although not great. When the 
      radio does not transmit it is obvious as no side tone is heard in the 
      headset, sometimes carrier wave only is transmitted.
      
      The voltage regulator (PMR-1) for the SD-8 alternator is mounted very 
      close ahead of the radio, along with the large capacitor and OV thing, 
      I'm now wondering if there is some kind of electro magnetic interference 
      happening? Of course the best check would be to go fly with the 
      alternator off, and I should be able to do that over the next few days 
      (there's some wedding going on here tomorrow that is getting in the way 
      of everything ...). Assuming it is interference, how far away from the 
      radio should I mount the VR, is the back side of the firewall a suitable 
      location? Should the capacitor be close the the VR, or doesn't it 
      matter? Its a Becker AR-4201 radio, Becker say that if it transmits on 
      any one frequency there is nothing wrong with the radio. Transmit is 
      good on some frequencies (for example 122.6, 129.8) and receive is 
      always strong.
      
      Thanks for your help, in anticipation.
      
      Regards, Peter
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
From: 
"Mick Muller" <mmul6471(at)bigpond.net.au>
Subject: 
2 1/4 Indicator for ADF
Date: 
Apr 29, 2011
      
      
      Greetings O Electronic whizzpersons,
      I know this is probably a long shot, but here goes.
      I have a Collins 650 ADF and antenna in my possession, but no Indicator.
      Simple I hear you say, buy an IND-650 Indicator.
      My problem is that I have a 2 1/4 inch hole, whereas the IND-650 is a 3.5 
      inch unit.
      Does anyone out there know of a 2/1/4 inch indicator that will work with the 
      650 ADF.
      
      Mick Muller 
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
Date: 
Apr 29, 2011
From: 
larry dodge <n16ld(at)yahoo.com>
Subject: 
Re: AeroElectric-List Digest: 1 Msgs - 04/28/11
      
      John,=0A-=0AThanks for the pics. I see the water on our steps to dock.-
      Boys look like they like each other. =0A-=0ARegards,=0A-=0ALarry=0A=0AF
      rom: AeroElectric-List Digest Server =0ATo
      : AeroElectric-List Digest List =0A
      Sent: Friday, April 29, 2011 2:56 AM=0ASubject: AeroElectric-List Digest: 1
       Msgs - 04/28/11=0A=0A*=0A=0A===============
      ===========0A- Online Versions of Today's List Digest
       Archive=0A=====================
      =====0A=0AToday's complete AeroElectric-List Digest can also be fou
      nd in either of the =0Atwo Web Links listed below.- The .html file includ
      es the Digest formatted =0Ain HTML for viewing with a web browser and featu
      res Hyperlinked Indexes =0Aand Message Navigation.- The .txt file include
      s the plain ASCII version =0Aof the AeroElectric-List Digest and can be vie
      wed with a generic text editor =0Asuch as Notepad or with a web browser. 
      =0A=0AHTML Version:=0A=0A- - http://www.matronics.com/digest/digestview
      .php?Style=82701&View=html&Chapter 11-04-28&Archive=AeroElectric
      =0A=0AText Version:=0A=0A- - http://www.matronics.com/digest/digestview
      .php?Style=82701&View=txt&Chapter 11-04-28&Archive=AeroElectric
      =0A=0A=0A======================
      ==0A- EMail Version of Today's List Digest Archive=0A======
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       - ----------------------------------------------------------=0A- - 
      - - - - - - - - - - - AeroElectric-List Digest Archiv
      e=0A- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
       - ---=0A- - - - - - - - - - Total Messages Posted Th
      u 04/28/11: 1=0A- - - - - ---------------------------------------
      -------------------=0A=0A=0AToday's Message Index:=0A----------------------
      =0A=0A- - 1. 02:28 PM - Strange radio transmit problems - take 2- (Pe
      ter Pengilly)=0A=0A=0A=0A________________________________- Message 1- _
      m: Peter Pengilly =0ASubject: AeroElectric-List: St
      range radio transmit problems - take 2=0A=0A=0AIn June last year I wrote ab
      out a problem I was having with the =0Atransmitter in my airplane where the
       radio would not transmit on some =0Afrequencies. I wonder if I could again
       ask for some advice?=0A=0AI thought I solved the problem by replacing the 
      radio to antenna coax - =0Abut all I in fact did was shift the frequencies 
      that were problematic. =0ASince then I have tried several different fixes w
      ithout any success. I =0Ahave improved the grounding of the antenna, replac
      ed the antenna and =0Atried several different headsets, all with no change 
      to the problem. I =0Ahave found that on the ground without the engine runni
      ng the radio will =0Atransmit on all frequencies (or at least in 1 MHz step
      s through the =0Afrequency band). In the air some frequencies cause a probl
      em (such as =0A118.9, 125.25 and 127.05), but throttling back to idle somet
      imes =0Aproduces an intelligible transmission, although not great. When the
       =0Aradio does not transmit it is obvious as no side tone is heard in the 
      =0Aheadset, sometimes carrier wave only is transmitted.=0A=0AThe voltage re
      gulator (PMR-1) for the SD-8 alternator is mounted very =0Aclose ahead of t
      he radio, along with the large capacitor and OV thing, =0AI'm now wondering
       if there is some kind of electro magnetic interference =0Ahappening? Of co
      urse the best check would be to go fly with the =0Aalternator off, and I sh
      ould be able to do that over the next few days =0A(there's some wedding goi
      ng on here tomorrow that is getting in the way =0Aof everything ...). Assum
      ing it is interference, how far away from the =0Aradio should I mount the V
      R, is the back side of the firewall a suitable =0Alocation? Should the capa
      citor be close the the VR, or doesn't it =0Amatter? Its a Becker AR-4201 ra
      dio, Becker say that if it transmits on =0Aany one frequency there is nothi
      ng wrong with the radio. Transmit is =0Agood on some frequencies (for examp
      le 122.6, 129.8) and receive is =0Aalways strong.=0A=0AThanks for your help
      -========================
      
________________________________________________________________________________
Date: 
Apr 29, 2011
From: 
"Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <nuckolls.bob(at)aeroelectric.com>
Subject: 
Re: 2 1/4 Indicator for ADF
      
      
      At 03:28 AM 4/29/2011, you wrote:
      >
      >
      >Greetings O Electronic whizzpersons,
      >I know this is probably a long shot, but here goes.
      >I have a Collins 650 ADF and antenna in my possession, but no Indicator.
      >Simple I hear you say, buy an IND-650 Indicator.
      >My problem is that I have a 2 1/4 inch hole, whereas the IND-650 is 
      >a 3.5 inch unit.
      >Does anyone out there know of a 2/1/4 inch indicator that will work 
      >with the 650 ADF.
      
         Check yellowpages.com for aifcraft instruments in Wichita, KS.
         There's a bunch of folks in the business there. Some have
         inventory of vintage instruments. One in particular is
         on the east side of the Mid Continent Airport campus who's
         name escapes me at the moment. I was in their facility about
         10 years ago and they had a warehouse full of yellow-tagged
         indicators of all types.
      
         Ask around the list of folks in ICT . . .
      
      
         Bob . . . 
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: 
Connectors for small diameter 'coax" wires
From: 
Neil Clayton <harvey4(at)earthlink.net>
Date: 
Apr 29, 2011
      
      
      I know about the existence of connectors for RG0400-like coax cables, but are there
      similar connectors for small diameter wires like 18AWG shielded Tefzel wires?
      I hate the resulting "lump" in the wire when I try to connect shield and
      core wires using butt-splice connectors, and the shrink-wrap never seems to contract
      nicely around the wires afterwards.
      
      Thanks for ideas.
      Neil
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
From: 
"ROGER &  JEAN CURTIS" <mrspudandcompany(at)verizon.net>
Subject: 
Connectors for small diameter 'coax" wires
Date: 
Apr 29, 2011
      
      
      I know about the existence of connectors for RG0400-like coax cables, 
      but
      are there similar connectors for small diameter wires like 18AWG 
      shielded
      Tefzel wires? I hate the resulting "lump" in the wire when I try to 
      connect
      shield and core wires using butt-splice connectors, and the shrink-wrap
      never seems to contract nicely around the wires afterwards.
      
      Thanks for ideas.
      Neil
      
      		If the lump in the wire bothers you, then the best method of
      connecting two wires is to solder them, there is a good tutorial in the
      Aeroelectric Connection.  Be sure to use a shrink tubing size just large
      enough to pass over the wires and the soldered connection.  If shrink 
      tubing
      of too large size is used, it will, in fact, not shrink down to the wire 
      for
      a nice neat joint.
      
      		Roger
      
________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: 
Re: Jhp 520 PTT cable
From: 
"Turbo_Boss" <turbo_boss(at)cwpanama.net>
Date: 
Apr 29, 2011
      
      
      I have a JRC 520 and the external PTT work when you ground it.
      
      Here is the HEADSET and PTT schematics
      
      
      Read this topic online here:
      
      http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=338485#338485
      
      
      Attachments: 
      
      http://forums.matronics.com//files/jrc_500_520_headset_and_ptt_schematics_189.jpg
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
From: 
"DEAN PSIROPOULOS" <dean.psiropoulos(at)verizon.net>
Subject: 
VM1000 sensor question
Date: 
Apr 29, 2011
      
      
      Is there anyone who knows the ins and outs of the VM1000 B&W engine monitor
      system.  When I originally bought mine 10 years ago I ordered it for a
      carbureted engine.  The engine I finally installed has fuel injection which
      has higher fuel pressure than a carb engine.  
      
      The VM1000 display shows fuel pressure pegged and flashing at 10 PSI.  I
      thought that the only thing that might be required to fix this was a
      software change but a friend suggested I might need a new sensor with a
      higher range as well.  Would anybody know about this, did VM use two
      different fuel pressure sensors?  What brand and model number of sensor were
      they?  My sensor is a fancy 4 wire unit with a Hirschman connector.
      
      Since VM has been absorbed by JPI my unit is no longer supported (only the
      VM1000C units are still supported) and talking with JPI at Sun N Fun
      confirmed my suspicions that they bought VM to remove one of their
      competitors from the market.  That being the case, I obviously can't get a
      software update for the DPU but I might be able to recalibrate the unit to
      get some useful information by putting a resistor in parallel with the
      sensor to have the 0-10 PSI on the display correspond to 0-30 PSI at the
      sensor.
      
      Anyone know the guy who invented the VM1000?  Does he, or anyone who used to
      work at VM, have knowledge, software source code, assemblers, compilers or
      PROM burner for the legacy system?  Maybe they lurk on the list and could
      help with modifying the software to get my pressure display to work
      properly?  Just a thought, if I had the tools and software I'd be willing to
      support this thing for anybody who has one.  Thanks.
      
      Dean Psiropoulos
      RV-6A N197DM
      2.5 years of fun so far 
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
Date: 
Apr 29, 2011
From: 
"Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <nuckolls.bob(at)aeroelectric.com>
Subject: 
Re: Connectors for small diameter 'coax"   wires
      
      
      At 07:45 PM 4/29/2011, you wrote:
      >
      >I know about the existence of connectors for RG0400-like coax 
      >cables, but are there similar connectors for small diameter wires 
      >like 18AWG shielded Tefzel wires? I hate the resulting "lump" in the 
      >wire when I try to connect shield and core wires using butt-splice 
      >connectors, and the shrink-wrap never seems to contract nicely 
      >around the wires afterwards.
      
          Are you talking about coax connectors? Yes,
          virtually every series of connector is available
          tailored to a particular coax. The problem is
          having tools for crimped connectors.
      
          I've never found it useful to expand the line
          of tools for a situation that turns up once every
          couple of years. Consider this work-around I published
          for another 'coax down sizing' issue some years ago.
      
      http://www.aeroelectric.com/articles/RG58/RG58.html
      
          In years past, I've also 'jeeped' a standard UG88
          BNC connector onto a smaller diameter coax and then
          potted the wire into the back of the connector with
          epoxy.
      
          If you had a hundred of these joints to make, yeah,
          go buy the tools and right connectors. If you've got
          a couple  . . . there are practical work-arounds.
      
      
         Bob . . . 
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
From: 
"Ralph E. Capen" <recapen(at)earthlink.net>
Subject: 
Re: VM1000 sensor question
Date: 
Apr 30, 2011
      
      
      Dean,
      
      There are two different sensors - both use the Hirschmann connector.  I had 
      one of the early VM1000's and ditched it when I saw this coming.
      
      I may have a FI sensor at my hangar - but I may have already parted it 
      out...I'll check.
      
      Ralph
      ----- Original Message ----- 
      From: "DEAN PSIROPOULOS" <dean.psiropoulos(at)verizon.net>
      Sent: Friday, April 29, 2011 11:51 PM
      Subject: AeroElectric-List: VM1000 sensor question
      
      
      > 
      >
      >
      > Is there anyone who knows the ins and outs of the VM1000 B&W engine 
      > monitor
      > system.  When I originally bought mine 10 years ago I ordered it for a
      > carbureted engine.  The engine I finally installed has fuel injection 
      > which
      > has higher fuel pressure than a carb engine.
      >
      > The VM1000 display shows fuel pressure pegged and flashing at 10 PSI.  I
      > thought that the only thing that might be required to fix this was a
      > software change but a friend suggested I might need a new sensor with a
      > higher range as well.  Would anybody know about this, did VM use two
      > different fuel pressure sensors?  What brand and model number of sensor 
      > were
      > they?  My sensor is a fancy 4 wire unit with a Hirschman connector.
      >
      > Since VM has been absorbed by JPI my unit is no longer supported (only the
      > VM1000C units are still supported) and talking with JPI at Sun N Fun
      > confirmed my suspicions that they bought VM to remove one of their
      > competitors from the market.  That being the case, I obviously can't get a
      > software update for the DPU but I might be able to recalibrate the unit to
      > get some useful information by putting a resistor in parallel with the
      > sensor to have the 0-10 PSI on the display correspond to 0-30 PSI at the
      > sensor.
      >
      > Anyone know the guy who invented the VM1000?  Does he, or anyone who used 
      > to
      > work at VM, have knowledge, software source code, assemblers, compilers or
      > PROM burner for the legacy system?  Maybe they lurk on the list and could
      > help with modifying the software to get my pressure display to work
      > properly?  Just a thought, if I had the tools and software I'd be willing 
      > to
      > support this thing for anybody who has one.  Thanks.
      >
      > Dean Psiropoulos
      > RV-6A N197DM
      > 2.5 years of fun so far
      >
      >
      > 
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
From: 
"Ralph E. Capen" <recapen(at)earthlink.net>
Subject: 
Re: VM1000 sensor question
Date: 
Apr 30, 2011
      
      
      Dean,
      
      My pressure sender is already gone....
      
      Ralph
      
      ----- Original Message ----- 
      From: "DEAN PSIROPOULOS" <dean.psiropoulos(at)verizon.net>
      Sent: Friday, April 29, 2011 11:51 PM
      Subject: AeroElectric-List: VM1000 sensor question
      
      
      > 
      >
      >
      > Is there anyone who knows the ins and outs of the VM1000 B&W engine 
      > monitor
      > system.  When I originally bought mine 10 years ago I ordered it for a
      > carbureted engine.  The engine I finally installed has fuel injection 
      > which
      > has higher fuel pressure than a carb engine.
      >
      > The VM1000 display shows fuel pressure pegged and flashing at 10 PSI.  I
      > thought that the only thing that might be required to fix this was a
      > software change but a friend suggested I might need a new sensor with a
      > higher range as well.  Would anybody know about this, did VM use two
      > different fuel pressure sensors?  What brand and model number of sensor 
      > were
      > they?  My sensor is a fancy 4 wire unit with a Hirschman connector.
      >
      > Since VM has been absorbed by JPI my unit is no longer supported (only the
      > VM1000C units are still supported) and talking with JPI at Sun N Fun
      > confirmed my suspicions that they bought VM to remove one of their
      > competitors from the market.  That being the case, I obviously can't get a
      > software update for the DPU but I might be able to recalibrate the unit to
      > get some useful information by putting a resistor in parallel with the
      > sensor to have the 0-10 PSI on the display correspond to 0-30 PSI at the
      > sensor.
      >
      > Anyone know the guy who invented the VM1000?  Does he, or anyone who used 
      > to
      > work at VM, have knowledge, software source code, assemblers, compilers or
      > PROM burner for the legacy system?  Maybe they lurk on the list and could
      > help with modifying the software to get my pressure display to work
      > properly?  Just a thought, if I had the tools and software I'd be willing 
      > to
      > support this thing for anybody who has one.  Thanks.
      >
      > Dean Psiropoulos
      > RV-6A N197DM
      > 2.5 years of fun so far
      >
      >
      > 
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
From: 
"Larry Ford" <psychden(at)sonic.net>
Subject: 
Re: VM1000 sensor question
Date: 
Apr 30, 2011
      
      Your man is Lance Turk who started Vision Micro Systems. 
      http://www.jpitech.com/press_releases/Lance_Turk_PR.pdf. He was employed 
      by JPI for supporting the VM line of products when he sold the company 
      to them. I guess it didn't last. I contacted Lance at JPI approx. 2 
      years ago when an oil pressure transducer began to read 10 psi lower 
      than actual. I found that JPI would sell me a new one but was asking 
      $450 (my recollection) for the Honeywell device. I was able to find the 
      same part at Digikey for around $200 but in minimums of 5. I bought a 
      single unit from Newark for the bargain price of $300 (Yikes!).
      I had the same situation when I purchased a fuel injected engine. The 
      fix was to purchase a different transducer- fortunately from VM as they 
      were still in business. I can attempt to read the part number on my 
      transducer to help you in your search. I have the VM 800 with the 
      individual gauges which precedes the 1000 and may use a different 
      transducer. There's a battery in the CPU that maintains the clock and 
      tach time. When it eventually fails, the CPU has to be sent for a 
      component replacement that contains the battery. There is no simple 
      battery replacement according to Lance. Mine has been going 8 years and 
      likely on its last legs. What to do when it goes?  When I purchased the 
      system I asked Lance what recourse would owners have if the company 
      folded. He assured me that the proprietary info would be released to 
      those who required it to maintain their systems. Sounds like JPI owns 
      the information now. Welcome to the digital age. Good luck!
      Larry Ford
      Glasair I RG N149LF
      
________________________________________________________________________________
Date: 
May 01, 2011
From: 
rayj <raymondj(at)frontiernet.net>
Subject: 
Cad programs
      
      
      Thanks to all who commented my CAD search.  I looked at many of the 
      solid modeling programs and there is just no quick and easy way to get 
      up and running, so I guess I'll just commit to BRL CAD and start 
      applying myself.  My choice of BRL is in large part driven by my hope 
      that it will play nice with EMC for CNC work.
      
      I think for the drawings needed to design the wiring for an airplane 
      Bob's selection of TurboCad is the best bang for the $time$ investment.
      
      Here are some of the programs I looked at:
      http://sourceforge.net/projects/free-cad/
      http://sketchup.google.com/intl/en/index.html
      http://brlcad.org/
      http://www.salome-platform.org/
      And of course TurboCad
      
      -- 
      Raymond Julian
      Kettle River, MN
      
      "And you know that I could have me a million more friends,
      and all I'd have to lose is my point of view." - John Prine
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
Date: 
May 01, 2011
Subject: 
EL lighting-wire causing noise
From: 
James Kilford <james(at)etravel.org>
      
      
      Gents,
      
      I've bought some EL wire and an inverter, and I was thinking I'd run
      two lengths of it to light the panel: one above the panel and one
      above the sub-panel.
      
      Yesterday I connected it up to try, and it makes a loud high-pitched
      whine on the intercom headphones.  I know that EL strips are used in
      aircraft, so it's not EL per se that's the issue, which means it's
      either wire, or the inverter.
      
      Is there anything I can do practically to stop this, for example
      shielding the box with metal or similar?  I'll try a few things, but
      if anyone has any experience, I'd appreciate any advice going.
      
      Many thanks.
      
      James
      
      --
      Jodel D150 in progress
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: 
Re: EL lighting-wire causing noise
From: 
Daniel Hooper <enginerdy(at)GMAIL.COM>
Date: 
May 01, 2011
      
      
      EL is relatively high voltage, so it's a good idea to shield the feed wires between
      the inverter and EL, and make sure it's not running close to any audio lines.
      
      
      Can you move any wires around and affect the sound? That might give you a clue
      of physically where to look for coupling.
      
      --Daniel
      
      On May 1, 2011, at 11:35 AM, James Kilford wrote:
      
      > 
      > Gents,
      > 
      > I've bought some EL wire and an inverter, and I was thinking I'd run
      > two lengths of it to light the panel: one above the panel and one
      > above the sub-panel.
      > 
      > Yesterday I connected it up to try, and it makes a loud high-pitched
      > whine on the intercom headphones.  I know that EL strips are used in
      > aircraft, so it's not EL per se that's the issue, which means it's
      > either wire, or the inverter.
      > 
      > Is there anything I can do practically to stop this, for example
      > shielding the box with metal or similar?  I'll try a few things, but
      > if anyone has any experience, I'd appreciate any advice going.
      > 
      > Many thanks.
      > 
      > James
      > 
      > --
      > Jodel D150 in progress
      > 
      > 
      > 
      > 
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
Date: 
May 01, 2011
Subject: 
Re: EL lighting-wire causing noise
From: 
James Kilford <james(at)etravel.org>
      
      
      Thanks Daniel.  At the moment, the EL wire was all bunched up in the
      footwell, a long way from anything except the headphone in use.  I
      just connected it temporarily to the L tank fuel sender power feed.
      I'll try isolating it a bit more and see what I can fathom.  My
      concern is that it will just naturally radiate too much noise.
      
      James
      
      On 1 May 2011 20:46, Daniel Hooper  wrote:
      >
      > EL is relatively high voltage, so it's a good idea to shield the feed wires between
      the inverter and EL, and make sure it's not running close to any audio
      lines.
      >
      > Can you move any wires around and affect the sound? That might give you a clue
      of physically where to look for coupling.
      >
      > --Daniel
      >
      > On May 1, 2011, at 11:35 AM, James Kilford wrote:
      >
      >>
      >> Gents,
      >>
      >> I've bought some EL wire and an inverter, and I was thinking I'd run
      >> two lengths of it to light the panel: one above the panel and one
      >> above the sub-panel.
      >>
      >> Yesterday I connected it up to try, and it makes a loud high-pitched
      >> whine on the intercom headphones. I know that EL strips are used in
      >> aircraft, so it's not EL per se that's the issue, which means it's
      >> either wire, or the inverter.
      >>
      >> Is there anything I can do practically to stop this, for example
      >> shielding the box with metal or similar? I'll try a few things, but
      >> if anyone has any experience, I'd appreciate any advice going.
      >>
      >> Many thanks.
      >>
      >> James
      >>
      >> --
      >> Jodel D150 in progress
      >>
      >>
      >>
      >>
      >
      >
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
Date: 
May 01, 2011
From: 
"Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <nuckolls.bob(at)aeroelectric.com>
Subject: 
Re: EL lighting-wire causing noise
      
      
      At 03:02 PM 5/1/2011, you wrote:
      >
      >Thanks Daniel.  At the moment, the EL wire was all bunched up in the
      >footwell, a long way from anything except the headphone in use.  I
      >just connected it temporarily to the L tank fuel sender power feed.
      >I'll try isolating it a bit more and see what I can fathom.  My
      >concern is that it will just naturally radiate too much noise.
      
         Review chapter on noise in the 'Connection. You need to
         identify the mode of propagation. Shielding is most
         unlikely to fix the problem. Try running the lights from
         an independent 12v source . . . like a pair of cheap
         lantern batteries from WallyWorld . . . and see if
         the noise goes away.
      
      
              Bob . . . 
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________

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April 04, 2011 - May 01, 2011

AeroElectric-Archive.digest.vol-ki

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