Pietenpol-Archive.digest.vol-bb
August 13, 1999 - August 20, 1999
Thank you, Doug Page
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Hinge points for split axle gear |
With all this discussion about plans mistakes. right now I only have the 1932
Flying and Gliding manual to reference and a catalog from Replicraft which has
some orig Pietenpol drawings in it from Plans Dated 3-23-33
If I were going to buy a large set of plans (And I Will) which would you all
suggest to be the best set as I heard their are ones from Don and ones from
another friend of the Pietenpol family. I am not talking about Grega or St. Croix
either.
Gordon
PTNPOL(at)aol.com wrote:
> Thanks Earl,
> I will have to pull my bushings off of my "v"'s. I will increase the bar
> stock to 3/4" and 1". That was alot of work down the drain. I wish the plans
> were better. There are alot of
> mistakes in the plans.
>
>
> Thanks again,
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | John Greenlee <jgreenlee(at)morgan.net> |
I asked Orrin once how old he was when he drew the plans. He said "about
15".
I do know they were drawn off from the prototype ships as built.
JMG
-----Original Message-----
From: Alan Swanson
Date: Friday, August 13, 1999 3:39 PM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Plans
>I agree- many times I saw what I thought were mistakes on the plans. But
>when I studied further, I found that there was always a reason for them- it
>was my mistake, not Bernard's. A few times I built to what I thought, only
>to have to go back and redo according to the "mistake" in the plans. I bet
>I have more time in studying the plans than I do building! Plus it is fun
>to study the plans when the time I have to actually work is too short. The
>pieces do all seem to fit together.
>
>Al Swanson
>
>>Be very careful what you refer to as 'mistakes' in the original plans.
Just
>>because you don't understand something the first time through does not
mean
>>it is a mistake. Those plans are amazingly accurate for their
>>circumstances.
>>
>>JMG
>>-----Original Message-----
>>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Mc Farland, James JH SCC" <JM128240(at)MSXSCC.SHELL.COM> |
Hello, I'm considering building an aircamper. Is there anyone in the
Houston, TX area that has built one or is in the process of building one?
If so, I would like to see one in person.
Thanks,
James McFarland
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | rod funk <rphunque(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | Re: alternate wood |
Thanks, Kyle. The issues you raise are the very ones I,m trying to learn
about. With the scarcity and price of sitka I think we need to explore the
best alternatives. I have a little Douglas Fir, but it's too heavy. Rod
Funk
>From: kyle ray <rrobert(at)centuryinter.net>
>Reply-To: Pietenpol Discussion
>To: Pietenpol Discussion
>Subject: Re: alternate wood
>Date: Wed, 21 Jul 1999 12:53:58 -0500
>
>Rod,
>There's a lot of alternate woods to sitka spruce and I've heard that
>yellow poplar is approved for repairs, however I haven't seen
>the wood's strength described as I have the western conifers
>such as you'll find in the west, example would be modulus of rupture,
>shear parallel to the grain etc. Several of these have been listed
>in various publications and I think you'll find one at Decosta's site.
>My brother in law recently commented that he was pulling a couple
>of poplar trees with his tractor (that were cut off his farm)
> to his neighbors who had a band saw
>and was having them ripped up for barn doors. I asked him about the
>properties of the wood he said very strong and light but he thought
>sassafras was even better having taken advantage of it's light
>weight and strength to build cattle racks for a pickup trucks.
>I've seen several houses built of poplar and they seem strong
>but they don't seem to have the nail holding ability of some other
>woods. I would be interested in a stress analysis of Poplar
>if anyone knows of one. I would have to see a full report
>before I would construct a spar, I can buy the wood all day
>long, clear for about $ .50 a board foot. But remember
>before constucting out of any material get the facts from
>a professional source.
>
>
>----- Original Message -----
>From: rod funk <rphunque(at)hotmail.com>
>To: Pietenpol Discussion
>Sent: Wednesday, August 11, 1999 10:03 PM
>Subject: alternate wood
>
>
> > Does any one have knowledge or experience with wood other than sitka?
>I"m
> > wondering about yellow poplar, for instance. Rod Funk
> >
> >
> >
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | TJTREV(at)webtv.net (Theodore Trevorrow) |
| Subject: | Re: Hinge points for split axle gear |
Buy from Don. He also has a very interesting builders manual.
Ted.T
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | walter evans <wbeevans(at)worldnet.att.net> |
| Subject: | if it ain't broke, don't fix it |
With all of the discussion about the wall thickness on the landing gear
hinge points, I went down and measured . Mine are made to the
Pietenpol prints.The remaining wall thickness on my fittings and
matching gear is .090" , final drilled for 5/16" bolts. That seems like
its plenty of meat to me.
Just remember, that narrowest wall is never being pulled on,( in
tension) , when on the ground ,or for normal landings. Both thick sides
are in compression. There won't be very many times that piece will be
pulled on.
If it's true that a Piet has never had an accident , in 70 years, due
to a problem with design, then that means that one of these has never
broken.
Walt Evans
With all of the discussion about the
wall
thickness on the landing gear hinge points, I went down and
measured
. Mine are made to the Pietenpol prints.The remaining wall
thickness on my
fittings and matching gear is .090 , final drilled for 5/16
bolts. That seems like its plenty of meat to me.
Just remember,
that narrowest
wall is never being pulled on,( in tension) , when on the ground ,or for
normal
landings. Both thick sides are in compression. There won't
be very
many times that piece will be pulled on.
If it's true that a Piet has
never had an
accident , in 70 years, due to a problem with design, then that means
that one
of these has never broken.
Walt
Evans
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Doug Page <dougpage(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Trying to unsubscribe |
x-mac-creator="4D4F5353"
UNSUBSCRIBE PIET
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | MACKORELL(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Anyone building a Piet in the Nashville area |
Hello,
My name is Jacob MacKorell and I've pretty much made up my mind to build an
AirCamper. I live in Smyrna, TN, a suburb of Nashville, and I am curious to
know if there is anyone close by that might be building or has completed an
AirCamper or Scout.
Jacob
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | SHOEFLY180(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Trying to unsubscribe |
Doug,
Like you, I am not quite ready to begin building and the information is
a little overwhelming. If you figure out how to unsubcribe, let me know.
Thanks.
________________________________________________________________________________
Tom, I'd welcome CAD drawings also, however I have neither CAD software or
experience to help you. But I can and will learn. Thanx for your offer.
Brian Sanders
-----Original Message-----
From: tmbrant <tmbrant(at)uswest.net>
Date: Friday, August 13, 1999 5:19 PM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Plans
>I would also be more than glad to help out. I have AutoCAD at home and
>could redraw if people are interested. I have just started to look at the
>plans, and have found a few mistakes, but the more I ask, the more people
>are coming up with too. Keep in touch.
>
>Tom
>-----Original Message-----
>From: Earl Myers
>To: Pietenpol Discussion
>Date: Friday, August 13, 1999 11:36 AM
>Subject: Re: Plans
>
>
>>Randall;
>> What Warren said here is MORE than correct! Do all the metal fittings
>>cockpit forward on graph paper first as there is no room for the nuts/
>>wrenches as described. Ref the plan errors, in those days, Orrin Hoopman
>was
>>like 18 years old and had to scramble to get those drawings done for an
>>article in MECHANICS ILLUSTRATED or something like that. No time to
>>proofread I guess. The Scout just faded into history untill recently when
>>all of a sudden there are 15 or more being built. They, the plans, do need
>>updated but I don't know how that will be accomplished. The errors aren't
>so
>>much dangerous as frustrating. The bottom of the fuselage curve being the
>>most noticeable. After that, I checked everything first with a calculator
>>starting with the overalls and working backwards . A little Kentucky
>Windage
>>and there was a Scout built to the "plans"....remember Kentucky Windage,
>>that was a lot of the engineering principle used back then especially on
>the
>>Model T Fords and others of that era. Moving the truss pieces around a bit
>>here and there shouldn't be a problem as this critter is well over built.
>It
>>will be up to us users to collect the boo boo's, compile them and offer an
>>addendum somewhere on one of the websites. That is the best thing I know
to
>>do, If you compile all this, I would be glad to help. I have a second set
>of
>>drawings with several notations marked on them. The most frustrating was
>>having all the metal fittings done ahead of time then not being able to
use
>>some of them as the bolts go right thru wood edgewise and so forth or
>having
>>to make extra cover plates to glue over the new "gouges" or whatever. Just
>>be patient and you will get thru it as I did without TOO much $@#$%
!!
>>Earl Myers
>>-----Original Message-----
>>From: Warren Shoun <wbnb(at)earthlink.net>
>>To: Pietenpol Discussion
>>Date: Friday, August 13, 1999 11:45 AM
>>Subject: Re: Plans
>>
>>
>>>Hi Randall,
>>> Feedback: We build these things at least 3 times: Once in our head,
>>once
>>>with the plans and one or more times in our hands.
>>> I have found it very valuable to re-draw each part, even quickly,
with
>>a
>>>steel rule on a tablet on the shop work bench. This has saved me many
>>small
>>>problems at a stage prior to making sawdust or metal filings. Still have
>a
>>>long way to go, but the two main areas you will find, have to do with the
>>>airfoil on the plans, and the distance allowed for tool access to bolt
>>heads on
>>>the fittings.
>>> In reading the archives here, you will also find that many folks
raise
>>the
>>>Cabane struts 1-2" and adjust the seat back angle for entry and flying
>>comfort.
>>>
>>> Kind'a reminds me of the old chemistry teacher giving me an English
>>lesson
>>>when I used the excuse that I assumed I had the right bottle for my
>>>experiment...ASSUME = makes an ASS of U & ME. Don't assume
>>anything....check
>>>it for accuracy, fit and usefulness to you and your project.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | TXTdragger(at)aol.com |
James
I live near Beltway & & SW Frwy. I too am contemplating building Piet. I
have built several large R/C planes, but got sidetracked while I got my
private pilots license. I am not quite ready to start building but would
like to start researche. Not only are Piets great looking, but my experence
talking to builders of experimental aircraft, the Piet builders seem most
laid back & interesting. This bulliten board bears that out.
The most interesting person I have met at the many airshows I have attended
was a Piet driver at Sun-N-Fun from "way up north" that was as old as me (66)
but really had a great sense of humor & great stories about his Piet. His
$3.50 GPS was really cool. I really screwed up by not getting his name. Well
enough rambling but as I told my son, "thoes Piet guys seem to have a lot of
fun". Dop me a note if you want to talk about Piets.
John Davis TxTdragger(at)aol.com (all my time is in Citabria)
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Unsubscribe method |
To unsubscribe, go here: http://www.aircamper.org/MailingList.cfm
Let me know if it doesnt work (but it should!).
Richard
--- SHOEFLY180(at)aol.com wrote:
> Doug,
> Like you, I am not quite ready to begin building and the
> information is
> a little overwhelming. If you figure out how to unsubcribe, let me
> know.
> Thanks.
>
===
http://www.AirCamper.org/
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Unsubscribe method |
Why send him to a web site to unsubscribe when he can do it with a simple
email message. Everytime you subscribe to a list you will rec a message
to save incase you want to unsubscribe. Wonderfull, nobody ever saves
them.
Read below and try it.
Gordon
To unsubscribe from this list at any time, send a message to:
listserv(at)ucsnet.BYU.EDU
Include the following line in the message body:
UNSUBSCRIBE PIET
Richard DeCosta wrote:
> To unsubscribe, go here: http://www.aircamper.org/MailingList.cfm
> Let me know if it doesnt work (but it should!).
>
> Richard
>
> --- SHOEFLY180(at)aol.com wrote:
> > Doug,
> > Like you, I am not quite ready to begin building and the
> > information is
> > a little overwhelming. If you figure out how to unsubcribe, let me
> > know.
> > Thanks.
> >
>
> ===
> http://www.AirCamper.org/
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | CAho878935(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: alternate wood |
Strait grain Hemlock is an excellent alternative. stronger that spruce and
very close in streangth to weight. and much less expensive. just use same
grading criteria.
Craig
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Hinge points for split axle gear |
Buy the plans from Don Pietenpol as well as that book.........
Earl Myers
-----Original Message-----
From: Theodore Trevorrow <TJTREV(at)webtv.net>
Date: Saturday, August 14, 1999 1:20 PM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Hinge points for split axle gear
Buy from Don. He also has a very interesting builders manual.
Ted.T
________________________________________________________________________________
James,
I and two partners are building a Model A powered Piet in Comfort, Texas
which is about 40 miles north of San Antonio along IH-10. While this is
not too close to Houston you are certainly welcome to come and see our
project. The fuselage is more or less done and on its gear. The empennage
is done and we've made good progress on the wing lately. If you wish to
make a four hour trip to see it, my E-mail address is nle97(at)juno.com and
my phone is (830) 510-4641.
Sincerely,
John Langston
writes:
>Hello, I'm considering building an aircamper. Is there anyone in the
>Houston, TX area that has built one or is in the process of building
>one?
>
>If so, I would like to see one in person.
>
>Thanks,
>
>James McFarland
>
>
__________
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Hinge points for split axle gear |
We followed the plans and while there isn't much wall thickness all the
shock loads from landing will be in compression and we're not concerned
about gear failure at all. It was a job to make the gear, but I'm amazed
at how sturdy it appears.
Piets forever,
John Langston
>Hey Guys,
> I need a little advice. I have drilled my landing gear bushings
>per the
>plans.
>1/16" and 1/8" off center 1/4" hole. I have welded the bushings to
>the
>landing gear "V".
>I then noticed on the plans that the hole is suppose to come out to
>5/16" per
>the
>plans. If I bring the hole out to 5/16" this will not give me a
>enough wall
>on the
>bushing to be confortable with.
>
> Can I use a 1/4" bolt with no problem or do I have to start over
>and
>change the
>offset dimensions that are on the plans and use the 5/16" bolt?
>
> Is there alot of stress on the hinge points?
>
> If I have to go with the 5/16" bolt I would recommend builders
>to be
>careful
>with the dimensions on the plans.
>
> any advice would be appreciated.
>
>
__________
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | John Weikel <jandd(at)maverickbbs.com> |
John,
Is your Piet project the one that's at Flying RV Ranch? I have a RW-6
RagWing Parasol that I built there and am giving some thought to building a
Piet for my next project.
John W
RW-6
KR-2S
Kerrville, Tx
jandd(at)maverickbbs.com
-----Original Message-----
From: nle97(at)juno.com <nle97(at)juno.com>
Date: Sunday, August 15, 1999 1:35 AM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Houston
>James,
>I and two partners are building a Model A powered Piet in Comfort, Texas
>which is about 40 miles north of San Antonio along IH-10. While this is
>not too close to Houston you are certainly welcome to come and see our
>project. The fuselage is more or less done and on its gear. The empennage
>is done and we've made good progress on the wing lately. If you wish to
>make a four hour trip to see it, my E-mail address is nle97(at)juno.com and
>my phone is (830) 510-4641.
>Sincerely,
>John Langston
>
> writes:
>>Hello, I'm considering building an aircamper. Is there anyone in the
>>Houston, TX area that has built one or is in the process of building
>>one?
>>
>>If so, I would like to see one in person.
>>
>>Thanks,
>>
>>James McFarland
>>
>>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: alternate wood |
Steve wrote:
I have found a source for northern pine. Is this a good wood to sub for
spruce?
Steve
writes:
>Thanks, Kyle. The issues you raise are the very ones I,m trying to
>learn
>about. With the scarcity and price of sitka I think we need to
>explore the
>best alternatives. I have a little Douglas Fir, but it's too heavy.
>Rod
>Funk
>
>
>>From: kyle ray <rrobert(at)centuryinter.net>
>>Reply-To: Pietenpol Discussion
>>To: Pietenpol Discussion
>>Subject: Re: alternate wood
>>Date: Wed, 21 Jul 1999 12:53:58 -0500
>>
>>Rod,
>>There's a lot of alternate woods to sitka spruce and I've heard that
>>yellow poplar is approved for repairs, however I haven't seen
>>the wood's strength described as I have the western conifers
>>such as you'll find in the west, example would be modulus of
>rupture,
>>shear parallel to the grain etc. Several of these have been listed
>>in various publications and I think you'll find one at Decosta's
>site.
>>My brother in law recently commented that he was pulling a couple
>>of poplar trees with his tractor (that were cut off his farm)
>> to his neighbors who had a band saw
>>and was having them ripped up for barn doors. I asked him about the
>>properties of the wood he said very strong and light but he thought
>>sassafras was even better having taken advantage of it's light
>>weight and strength to build cattle racks for a pickup trucks.
>>I've seen several houses built of poplar and they seem strong
>>but they don't seem to have the nail holding ability of some other
>>woods. I would be interested in a stress analysis of Poplar
>>if anyone knows of one. I would have to see a full report
>>before I would construct a spar, I can buy the wood all day
>>long, clear for about $ .50 a board foot. But remember
>>before constucting out of any material get the facts from
>>a professional source.
>>
>>
>>
>>----- Original Message -----
>>From: rod funk <rphunque(at)hotmail.com>
>>To: Pietenpol Discussion
>>Sent: Wednesday, August 11, 1999 10:03 PM
>>Subject: alternate wood
>>
>>
>> > Does any one have knowledge or experience with wood other than
>sitka?
>>I"m
>> > wondering about yellow poplar, for instance. Rod Funk
>> >
>> >
>> >
>>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | MACKORELL(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Alternative woods |
I've looked up some properties for some alternative woods to sitka spruce
from the "Wood Handbook".
$
For Sitka Spruce:
Spec. Grav.=0.40
Mod. of Rup.=10,200psi
Mod. of Elast.=1,570psi
Shear parallel to grain=1,150psi
$
$
For Yellow Poplar:
Spec. Grav.=0.42
Mod. of Rup.=10,100psi
Mod. of Elast.=1,580psi
Shear parallel to grain=1,190psi
$
$
For Western Hemlock:
Spec. Grav.=0.45
Mod. of Rup.=11,300psi
Mod. of Elast.=1,630psi
Shear parallel to grain=1,290psi
$
$
For Douglas Fir:
Spec. Grav.=0.48
Mod. of Rup.=12,400psi
Mod. of Elast.=1,950psi
Shear parallel to grain=1,130psi
$
$
For Black Walnut:
Spec. Grav.=0.35
Mod. of Rup.=14,600psi
Mod. of Elast.=1,680psi
Shear parallel to grain=1,370psi
$
$
For Red Pine:
Spec. Grav.=0.46
Mod. of Rup.=11,000psi
Mod. of Elast.=1,630psi
Shear parallel to grain=1,210psi
Hope this helps!
Jacob
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | TXTdragger(at)aol.com |
John
You sure live in a great place to own a Piet. I have been there many times,
(during my motorcycle days) before & after the big flood. When you get a
chance, e-mail me your suggestions as to "getting started". I have been an
airplane nut for over 50 years & FINALLY got my ticket on my 64 birthday. It
was even more thrilling than I had dreamed about all those years. Thanks in
advance, for any help.
John Davis (713) 777-2954 e-mail: TxTdragger
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | John Weikel <jandd(at)maverickbbs.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Alternative woods |
Hi, my name is John Weikel and I am new to the group. I have just completed
a RagWing Parasol RW-6 which is built out of white pine. The designer
specifies White Pine, Fir or Spruce as being acceptable as long at the
grading meets specs. The pine is a heck of a lot less expensive then
spruce.....
John Weikel
Kerrville, Tx
RW-6
KR-2S
Piet (maybe someday)
jandd(at)maverickbbs.com
-----Original Message-----
From: MACKORELL(at)aol.com <MACKORELL(at)aol.com>
Date: Sunday, August 15, 1999 9:30 AM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Alternative woods
>I've looked up some properties for some alternative woods to sitka spruce
>from the "Wood Handbook".
>$
>For Sitka Spruce:
>
>Spec. Grav.=0.40
>Mod. of Rup.=10,200psi
>Mod. of Elast.=1,570psi
>Shear parallel to grain=1,150psi
>$
>$
>For Yellow Poplar:
>
>Spec. Grav.=0.42
>Mod. of Rup.=10,100psi
>Mod. of Elast.=1,580psi
>Shear parallel to grain=1,190psi
>$
>$
>For Western Hemlock:
>
>Spec. Grav.=0.45
>Mod. of Rup.=11,300psi
>Mod. of Elast.=1,630psi
>Shear parallel to grain=1,290psi
>$
>$
>For Douglas Fir:
>
>Spec. Grav.=0.48
>Mod. of Rup.=12,400psi
>Mod. of Elast.=1,950psi
>Shear parallel to grain=1,130psi
>$
>$
>For Black Walnut:
>
>Spec. Grav.=0.35
>Mod. of Rup.=14,600psi
>Mod. of Elast.=1,680psi
>Shear parallel to grain=1,370psi
>$
>$
>For Red Pine:
>
>Spec. Grav.=0.46
>Mod. of Rup.=11,000psi
>Mod. of Elast.=1,630psi
>Shear parallel to grain=1,210psi
>
>Hope this helps!
>
>Jacob
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | MACKORELL(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Continental engines |
I've decided to build an AirCamper and I want to be able to use a Continental
engine. Can anyone tell me where I should first start looking for
Continental engines. I looked up the Teledyne Continental web page but there
was nothing on the specific engines that they manufacture. I know they
manufactured a 65 hp but did they also make an 85 hp? If anyone has built an
AirCamper with this engine, can you give me some advice as to where to get
started, cost, problems, etc.?
Thank You,
Jacob
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | TXTdragger(at)aol.com |
Add me to your list of Texans wanting a Piet.........all named John ???????
LOL
I own 2 house lots & a hanger lot in Windermere. Spicewood,TX on Lake Travis
Nice people there, but most have high dollar aircraft. I think "low & slow"
better describes what I want to do. What's it like at your place?
John Davis TxTdragger(at)aol.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | SHOEFLY180(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Unsubscribe method |
Thanks.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | John Weikel <jandd(at)maverickbbs.com> |
I guess you are referring to me (john Weikel). I live a few miles north of
Kerrville on Tierra Linda Ranch. Lots of critters and quiet. Use 100 lbs
of deer feed per week and support a few of the lazy rascals. Exotic game as
well as native. Saw a mountain lion a couple of years ago. Air strip here
but no available hangar space so I keep my plane at Comfort. Different kind
of flying since there are no straight lines on the ground around here. I
was surprised to find how much I was dependent on square fields and straight
roads. I moved here from Tomball, Tx and have never gone back (and my kids
live in the Houston area). I lost my medical and am hoping the Sport Pilot
proposal goes through with it's medical self certification. I can pass the
medical but FAA wants $1600 worth of tests done annually. Priced me out of
my hobby so I built a UL. That's kind of like kissing your sister. The
Piet would qualify under Sport Pilot restrictions. I have a half completed
KR-2S that is questionable on getting down to a 39 kt stall speed. Sure
hate to abandon that project....
John W.
RW-6
KR-2S
Kerrville, Tx
jandd(at)maverickbbs.com
-----Original Message-----
From: TXTdragger(at)aol.com <TXTdragger(at)aol.com>
Date: Sunday, August 15, 1999 9:52 AM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Houston
>Add me to your list of Texans wanting a Piet.........all named John ???????
>LOL
>
>I own 2 house lots & a hanger lot in Windermere. Spicewood,TX on Lake
Travis
>Nice people there, but most have high dollar aircraft. I think "low &
slow"
>better describes what I want to do. What's it like at your place?
>
>John Davis TxTdragger(at)aol.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | walter evans <wbeevans(at)worldnet.att.net> |
| Subject: | bending rib caps |
I don't know if bending rib caps is a problem. In some of the building
books they have some pretty fancy jigs. Just wanted to pass along how I
bend mine. Take a piece of 2" PVC pipe, 18" long. Either plug the end
with wood plug or use pvc cap. Screw it to a plywood base, so that the
pipe will stand vertical.
Ten minutes before you start a rib, boil a sauce pan of water. Put the
water into the tube and add the end of the rib cap. After ten minute
soak, it bends nicely into the jig. If you left it in 30 min , you could
tie it in a knot.
Works great.
walt
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | TXTdragger(at)aol.com |
sounds like a great place.......keep me on your list for updates.....
John Davis
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "David B. Schober" <dschober(at)mail.fscwv.edu> |
| Subject: | Re: bending rib caps |
Use basically the same method but make a jig for the forward 1/3 of the
airfoil wide enough for about 4-6 capstrips. Soak or steam the capstrip
material and set up 4-6 of them at a time. When they dry you can put
them right into the rib jig, glue them up and put on the gussets and
remove the rib from the jig right away. You don't have to wait for the
capstrip to dry!
walter evans wrote:
> I don't know if bending rib caps is a problem. In some of the
> building books they have some pretty fancy jigs. Just wanted to pass
> along how I bend mine. Take a piece of 2" PVC pipe, 18" long. Either
> plug the end with wood plug or use pvc cap. Screw it to a plywood
> base, so that the pipe will stand vertical.Ten minutes before you
> start a rib, boil a sauce pan of water. Put the water into the tube
> and add the end of the rib cap. After ten minute soak, it bends
> nicely into the jig. If you left it in 30 min , you could tie it in a
> knot.Works great.walt
--
David B.Schober, CPE
Instructor, Aviation Maintenance
Fairmont State College
National Aerospace Education Center
1050 East Benedum Industrial Drive
Bridgeport, WV 26330-9503
(304) 842-8300
Use basically the same method but make a jig for the forward 1/3 of the
airfoil wide enough for about 4-6 capstrips. Soak or steam the capstrip
material and set up 4-6 of them at a time. When they dry you can put them
right into the rib jig, glue them up and put on the gussets and remove
the rib from the jig right away. You don't have to wait for the capstrip
to dry!
walter evans wrote:
I don't
know if bending rib caps is a problem. In some of the building books they
have some pretty fancy jigs. Just wanted to pass along how I bend
mine. Take a piece of 2" PVC pipe, 18" long. Either plug the end
with wood plug or use pvc cap. Screw it to a plywood base, so that the
pipe will stand vertical.Ten
minutes before you start a rib, boil a sauce pan of water. Put the
water into the tube and add the end of the rib cap. After ten minute
soak, it bends nicely into the jig. If you left it in 30 min , you could
tie it in a knot.Works
great.walt
--
David B.Schober, CPE
Instructor, Aviation Maintenance
Fairmont State College
National Aerospace Education Center
1050 East Benedum Industrial Drive
Bridgeport, WV 26330-9503
(304) 842-8300
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | kyle ray <rrobert(at)centuryinter.net> |
| Subject: | Re: bending rib caps |
Here's what seemed to work the best for Douglas fir 1/4'' X 3/8" cap
strips
soak the front 18 to 24 inches for a couple of days then steam for about
two
minutes any longer they'll crimp any less they'll break, the steamer was
very
high tech a coffee can with a slightly smaller can turned upside down
with holes punched in the top, then aluminum sheeting from the hardware
store up about 2 feet. The jig that worked best was also the simplest
a 2 x 6'' with nails driven that formed a curve! No wonder they say
longer
for first time builder!
----- Original Message -----
From: David B. Schober
To: Pietenpol Discussion
Sent: Sunday, August 15, 1999 4:37 PM
Subject: Re: bending rib caps
Use basically the same method but make a jig for the forward 1/3 of
the airfoil wide enough for about 4-6 capstrips. Soak or steam the
capstrip material and set up 4-6 of them at a time. When they dry you
can put them right into the rib jig, glue them up and put on the gussets
and remove the rib from the jig right away. You don't have to wait for
the capstrip to dry!
walter evans wrote:
I don't know if bending rib caps is a problem. In some of the
building books they have some pretty fancy jigs. Just wanted to pass
along how I bend mine. Take a piece of 2" PVC pipe, 18" long. Either
plug the end with wood plug or use pvc cap. Screw it to a plywood base,
so that the pipe will stand vertical.Ten minutes before you start a rib,
boil a sauce pan of water. Put the water into the tube and add the end
of the rib cap. After ten minute soak, it bends nicely into the jig. If
you left it in 30 min , you could tie it in a knot.Works great.walt
--
****
David B.Schober, CPE
Instructor, Aviation Maintenance
Fairmont State College
National Aerospace Education Center
1050 East Benedum Industrial Drive
Bridgeport, WV 26330-9503
(304) 842-8300
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | kyle ray <rrobert(at)centuryinter.net> |
| Subject: | Re: alternate wood |
Yes and what is your source of nothern pine?
----- Original Message -----From: <vistin(at)juno.com>
Sent: Sunday, August 15, 1999 8:22 AM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: alternate wood
> Steve wrote:
> I have found a source for northern pine. Is this a good wood to sub for
> spruce?
>
> Steve
>
> writes:
> >Thanks, Kyle. The issues you raise are the very ones I,m trying to
> >learn
> >about. With the scarcity and price of sitka I think we need to
> >explore the
> >best alternatives. I have a little Douglas Fir, but it's too heavy.
> >Rod
> >Funk
> >
> >
> >
> >>From: kyle ray <rrobert(at)centuryinter.net>
> >>Reply-To: Pietenpol Discussion
> >>To: Pietenpol Discussion
> >>Subject: Re: alternate wood
> >>Date: Wed, 21 Jul 1999 12:53:58 -0500
> >>
> >>Rod,
> >>There's a lot of alternate woods to sitka spruce and I've heard that
> >>yellow poplar is approved for repairs, however I haven't seen
> >>the wood's strength described as I have the western conifers
> >>such as you'll find in the west, example would be modulus of
> >rupture,
> >>shear parallel to the grain etc. Several of these have been listed
> >>in various publications and I think you'll find one at Decosta's
> >site.
> >>My brother in law recently commented that he was pulling a couple
> >>of poplar trees with his tractor (that were cut off his farm)
> >> to his neighbors who had a band saw
> >>and was having them ripped up for barn doors. I asked him about the
> >>properties of the wood he said very strong and light but he thought
> >>sassafras was even better having taken advantage of it's light
> >>weight and strength to build cattle racks for a pickup trucks.
> >>I've seen several houses built of poplar and they seem strong
> >>but they don't seem to have the nail holding ability of some other
> >>woods. I would be interested in a stress analysis of Poplar
> >>if anyone knows of one. I would have to see a full report
> >>before I would construct a spar, I can buy the wood all day
> >>long, clear for about $ .50 a board foot. But remember
> >>before constucting out of any material get the facts from
> >>a professional source.
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>----- Original Message -----
> >>From: rod funk <rphunque(at)hotmail.com>
> >>To: Pietenpol Discussion
> >>Sent: Wednesday, August 11, 1999 10:03 PM
> >>Subject: alternate wood
> >>
> >>
> >> > Does any one have knowledge or experience with wood other than
> >sitka?
> >>I"m
> >> > wondering about yellow poplar, for instance. Rod Funk
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >>
> >
> >
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | leonstefanhutks(at)webtv.net (Leon Stefan) |
great tip on bending capstrips but enough with "once you have tasted
flight" ok once, even 25 th time. this is a big sight. sometimes takes
a lot of space. lots of repetition.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | walter evans <wbeevans(at)worldnet.att.net> |
| Subject: | to clarify bending of cap strips |
Some RE's came back that seemed pretty complicated. Like I'd written,
that from start to finish( not counting boiling the water) takes ten
minutes. maybe the other methods are needed for different glues, but
I'm using T-88. If you read the specs. T-88 works just as good on wet
wood as dry.
walt
Some RE's came back that seemed
pretty
complicated. Like I'd written, that from start to finish( not
counting
boiling the water) takes ten minutes. maybe the other methods are
needed
for different glues, but I'm using T-88. If you read the specs.
T-88 works
just as good on wet wood as dry.
walt
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | robert hensarling <rhrocker(at)admin.hilconet.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Alternative woods |
-----Original Message-----
From: John Weikel <jandd(at)maverickbbs.com>
Date: Sunday, August 15, 1999 10:06 AM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Alternative woods
Hi John, and Welcome! I live in Uvalde, about 80 miles or so South of you.
Come down here one of these days and I'll give you a ride in my GN-1. Also
have a Rans S-12 that I just finished (today in fact) flying off the 40
hours for the AW cert.).
Robert Hensarling
http://www.mesquite-furniture.com
rhrocker(at)admin.hilconet.com
Uvalde, Texas
>Hi, my name is John Weikel and I am new to the group. I have just
completed
>a RagWing Parasol RW-6 which is built out of white pine. The designer
>specifies White Pine, Fir or Spruce as being acceptable as long at the
>grading meets specs. The pine is a heck of a lot less expensive then
>spruce.....
>John Weikel
>Kerrville, Tx
>RW-6
>KR-2S
>Piet (maybe someday)
>jandd(at)maverickbbs.com
>-----Original Message-----
>From: MACKORELL(at)aol.com <MACKORELL(at)aol.com>
>To: Pietenpol Discussion
>Date: Sunday, August 15, 1999 9:30 AM
>Subject: Alternative woods
>
>
>>I've looked up some properties for some alternative woods to sitka spruce
>>from the "Wood Handbook".
>>$
>>For Sitka Spruce:
>>
>>Spec. Grav.=0.40
>>Mod. of Rup.=10,200psi
>>Mod. of Elast.=1,570psi
>>Shear parallel to grain=1,150psi
>>$
>>$
>>For Yellow Poplar:
>>
>>Spec. Grav.=0.42
>>Mod. of Rup.=10,100psi
>>Mod. of Elast.=1,580psi
>>Shear parallel to grain=1,190psi
>>$
>>$
>>For Western Hemlock:
>>
>>Spec. Grav.=0.45
>>Mod. of Rup.=11,300psi
>>Mod. of Elast.=1,630psi
>>Shear parallel to grain=1,290psi
>>$
>>$
>>For Douglas Fir:
>>
>>Spec. Grav.=0.48
>>Mod. of Rup.=12,400psi
>>Mod. of Elast.=1,950psi
>>Shear parallel to grain=1,130psi
>>$
>>$
>>For Black Walnut:
>>
>>Spec. Grav.=0.35
>>Mod. of Rup.=14,600psi
>>Mod. of Elast.=1,680psi
>>Shear parallel to grain=1,370psi
>>$
>>$
>>For Red Pine:
>>
>>Spec. Grav.=0.46
>>Mod. of Rup.=11,000psi
>>Mod. of Elast.=1,630psi
>>Shear parallel to grain=1,210psi
>>
>>Hope this helps!
>>
>>Jacob
>>
>>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | oil can <oilcanbob(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | Re: alternate wood |
3 cheers, Hemlock is good stuff.Here in the northwest, we have piles of the
stuff. I don't know about the supply elsewhere.
I found that it's much harder to find the right grain structure in hardware
store boards than fir, or spruce, but when you find some, the reward is a
good strong wood that is niticably stronger than spruce, and cuts and bends
much better than fir.
It's a good bit harder to glue though...rough both surfaces before you glue,
and keep even fingerprint oil away from the gule-ing surface.
Make sure that it is Western Hemlock, and reject any pieces that are
noticably lighter or ....less in make up...than average.
Bob
>From: CAho878935(at)aol.com
>Reply-To: Pietenpol Discussion
>To: Pietenpol Discussion
>Subject: Re: alternate wood
>Date: Sat, 14 Aug 1999 23:08:47 -0400 (EDT)
>
>Strait grain Hemlock is an excellent alternative. stronger that spruce and
>very close in streangth to weight. and much less expensive. just use same
>grading criteria.
>
>Craig
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | John Weikel <jandd(at)maverickbbs.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Alternative woods |
Robert,
Thanks for the offer, I will take you up on that sometime.
John W
-----Original Message-----
From: robert hensarling <rhrocker(at)admin.hilconet.com>
Date: Sunday, August 15, 1999 8:47 PM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Alternative woods
>
>-----Original Message-----
>From: John Weikel <jandd(at)maverickbbs.com>
>To: Pietenpol Discussion
>Date: Sunday, August 15, 1999 10:06 AM
>Subject: Re: Alternative woods
>
>Hi John, and Welcome! I live in Uvalde, about 80 miles or so South of you.
>Come down here one of these days and I'll give you a ride in my GN-1. Also
>have a Rans S-12 that I just finished (today in fact) flying off the 40
>hours for the AW cert.).
>
>Robert Hensarling
>http://www.mesquite-furniture.com
>rhrocker(at)admin.hilconet.com
>Uvalde, Texas
>
>
>>Hi, my name is John Weikel and I am new to the group. I have just
>completed
>>a RagWing Parasol RW-6 which is built out of white pine. The designer
>>specifies White Pine, Fir or Spruce as being acceptable as long at the
>>grading meets specs. The pine is a heck of a lot less expensive then
>>spruce.....
>>John Weikel
>>Kerrville, Tx
>>RW-6
>>KR-2S
>>Piet (maybe someday)
>>jandd(at)maverickbbs.com
>>-----Original Message-----
>>From: MACKORELL(at)aol.com <MACKORELL(at)aol.com>
>>To: Pietenpol Discussion
>>Date: Sunday, August 15, 1999 9:30 AM
>>Subject: Alternative woods
>>
>>
>>>I've looked up some properties for some alternative woods to sitka spruce
>>>from the "Wood Handbook".
>>>$
>>>For Sitka Spruce:
>>>
>>>Spec. Grav.=0.40
>>>Mod. of Rup.=10,200psi
>>>Mod. of Elast.=1,570psi
>>>Shear parallel to grain=1,150psi
>>>$
>>>$
>>>For Yellow Poplar:
>>>
>>>Spec. Grav.=0.42
>>>Mod. of Rup.=10,100psi
>>>Mod. of Elast.=1,580psi
>>>Shear parallel to grain=1,190psi
>>>$
>>>$
>>>For Western Hemlock:
>>>
>>>Spec. Grav.=0.45
>>>Mod. of Rup.=11,300psi
>>>Mod. of Elast.=1,630psi
>>>Shear parallel to grain=1,290psi
>>>$
>>>$
>>>For Douglas Fir:
>>>
>>>Spec. Grav.=0.48
>>>Mod. of Rup.=12,400psi
>>>Mod. of Elast.=1,950psi
>>>Shear parallel to grain=1,130psi
>>>$
>>>$
>>>For Black Walnut:
>>>
>>>Spec. Grav.=0.35
>>>Mod. of Rup.=14,600psi
>>>Mod. of Elast.=1,680psi
>>>Shear parallel to grain=1,370psi
>>>$
>>>$
>>>For Red Pine:
>>>
>>>Spec. Grav.=0.46
>>>Mod. of Rup.=11,000psi
>>>Mod. of Elast.=1,630psi
>>>Shear parallel to grain=1,210psi
>>>
>>>Hope this helps!
>>>
>>>Jacob
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | John Greenlee <jgreenlee(at)morgan.net> |
John,
Are you the guy that used to live at Pipe Creek? If so, I tried looking you
up several years ago when I was down around Bandera or so.
How far along are you?
JMG
-----Original Message-----
From: nle97(at)juno.com <nle97(at)juno.com>
Date: Sunday, August 15, 1999 1:36 AM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Houston
>James,
>I and two partners are building a Model A powered Piet in Comfort, Texas
>which is about 40 miles north of San Antonio along IH-10. While this is
>not too close to Houston you are certainly welcome to come and see our
>project. The fuselage is more or less done and on its gear. The empennage
>is done and we've made good progress on the wing lately. If you wish to
>make a four hour trip to see it, my E-mail address is nle97(at)juno.com and
>my phone is (830) 510-4641.
>Sincerely,
>John Langston
>
> writes:
>>Hello, I'm considering building an aircamper. Is there anyone in the
>>Houston, TX area that has built one or is in the process of building
>>one?
>>
>>If so, I would like to see one in person.
>>
>>Thanks,
>>
>>James McFarland
>>
>>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | John Weikel <jandd(at)maverickbbs.com> |
Not me, I never lived at Pipe Creek.
John Weikel
-----Original Message-----
From: John Greenlee <jgreenlee(at)morgan.net>
Date: Sunday, August 15, 1999 9:15 PM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Houston
>John,
>
>Are you the guy that used to live at Pipe Creek? If so, I tried looking
you
>up several years ago when I was down around Bandera or so.
>
>How far along are you?
>
>JMG
>-----Original Message-----
>From: nle97(at)juno.com <nle97(at)juno.com>
>To: Pietenpol Discussion
>Date: Sunday, August 15, 1999 1:36 AM
>Subject: Re: Houston
>
>
>>James,
>>I and two partners are building a Model A powered Piet in Comfort, Texas
>>which is about 40 miles north of San Antonio along IH-10. While this is
>>not too close to Houston you are certainly welcome to come and see our
>>project. The fuselage is more or less done and on its gear. The empennage
>>is done and we've made good progress on the wing lately. If you wish to
>>make a four hour trip to see it, my E-mail address is nle97(at)juno.com and
>>my phone is (830) 510-4641.
>>Sincerely,
>>John Langston
>>
>> writes:
>>>Hello, I'm considering building an aircamper. Is there anyone in the
>>>Houston, TX area that has built one or is in the process of building
>>>one?
>>>
>>>If so, I would like to see one in person.
>>>
>>>Thanks,
>>>
>>>James McFarland
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
Yes, I live in Pearland, Texas. Please feel free to call and stop by my garage/hangar.
Bart D Conrad
Boeing Field Service
DC-9/MD-80/DC-10 & 737 Heavy Mtc
Phone: 713-640-5882/713-324-4192
Fax: 713-640-5891
Pager: 713-318-1625
> ----------
> From: Mc Farland, James JH SCC[SMTP:JM128240(at)MSXSCC.SHELL.COM]
> Sent: Saturday, August 14, 1999 7:46 AM
> To: Pietenpol Discussion
> Subject: Houston
>
> Hello, I'm considering building an aircamper. Is there anyone in the
> Houston, TX area that has built one or is in the process of building one?
>
> If so, I would like to see one in person.
>
> Thanks,
>
> James McFarland
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | RE: Unsubscribe method |
This is the current and most reliable method... the one that I use to
unsubscribe others when they "cant".
Best regards,
Steve Eldredge
Steve(at)byu.edu
> -----Original Message-----
> Richard DeCosta
> Sent: Saturday, August 14, 1999 7:49 PM
> To: Pietenpol Discussion
> Subject: Unsubscribe method
>
>
> To unsubscribe, go here: http://www.aircamper.org/MailingList.cfm
> Let me know if it doesnt work (but it should!).
>
> Richard
>
> --- SHOEFLY180(at)aol.com wrote:
> > Doug,
> > Like you, I am not quite ready to begin building and the
> > information is
> > a little overwhelming. If you figure out how to unsubcribe, let me
> > know.
> > Thanks.
> >
>
> ===
> http://www.AirCamper.org/
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | PLAN ERRORS/CLARIFICATIONS |
Before I add this to the KNOWN PLAN ERRORS section of aircamper.org, does everyone
agree with the following?
1. The "Supplementary Plans, Air-Camper" page lists the length of the fuselage
for the horizontal stabilizer to attach to, to be 18 7/8 inch. Believe this should
maybe be 18 1/8 inch as the horizontal stabilizer is 18 inches wide. This
matches the rudder length also.
2. Drawing number 1 of the 1933 plans does not show the width dimension of the
fueslage aft most point. After reading the Flying Manual, it should be 1 1/8
inch wide (without gussets).
3. Engine mount fittings do not show a radius in the corners. It would be good
practice to put in a radius to avoid cracking.
Bart D Conrad
Boeing Field Service
DC-9/MD-80/DC-10 & 737 Heavy Mtc
Phone: 713-640-5882/713-324-4192
Fax: 713-640-5891
Pager: 713-318-1625
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: PLAN ERRORS/CLARIFICATIONS |
Whats the Supplementary Plans? and how many sets of plans do you need to buy to
build this airplane?
Gordon
"Conrad, Bart D" wrote:
> Before I add this to the KNOWN PLAN ERRORS section of aircamper.org, does everyone
agree with the following?
>
> 1. The "Supplementary Plans, Air-Camper" page lists the length of the fuselage
for the horizontal stabilizer to attach to, to be 18 7/8 inch. Believe this
should maybe be 18 1/8 inch as the horizontal stabilizer is 18 inches wide.
This matches the rudder length also.
>
> 2. Drawing number 1 of the 1933 plans does not show the width dimension of the
fueslage aft most point. After reading the Flying Manual, it should be 1 1/8
inch wide (without gussets).
>
> 3. Engine mount fittings do not show a radius in the corners. It would be good
practice to put in a radius to avoid cracking.
>
> Bart D Conrad
> Boeing Field Service
> DC-9/MD-80/DC-10 & 737 Heavy Mtc
> Phone: 713-640-5882/713-324-4192
> Fax: 713-640-5891
> Pager: 713-318-1625
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | RE: PLAN ERRORS/CLARIFICATIONS |
The following is the best answer I can provide to your questions: The supplementary
plans are for the extended fuselage. That page also makes the aft cockpit
seat longer and adds a top lug to the top engine mount so that a strut can
be added to do away with the forward cockpit seat cross wires on the right hand
side. It has been my experience that it takes the plans purchased from Don
Pietenpol, plus the plans from the Flying Manual, plus networking such as this
discussion group. Bart
Bart D Conrad
Boeing Field Service
DC-9/MD-80/DC-10 & 737 Heavy Mtc
Phone: 713-640-5882/713-324-4192
Fax: 713-640-5891
Pager: 713-318-1625
> ----------
> From: Gordon Brimhall[SMTP:arkiesair(at)surfree.com]
> Sent: Sunday, August 15, 1999 8:13 PM
> To: Pietenpol Discussion
> Subject: Re: PLAN ERRORS/CLARIFICATIONS
>
> Whats the Supplementary Plans? and how many sets of plans do you need to buy
to build this airplane?
>
> Gordon
>
>
> "Conrad, Bart D" wrote:
>
> > Before I add this to the KNOWN PLAN ERRORS section of aircamper.org, does everyone
agree with the following?
> >
> > 1. The "Supplementary Plans, Air-Camper" page lists the length of the fuselage
for the horizontal stabilizer to attach to, to be 18 7/8 inch. Believe this
should maybe be 18 1/8 inch as the horizontal stabilizer is 18 inches wide.
This matches the rudder length also.
> >
> > 2. Drawing number 1 of the 1933 plans does not show the width dimension of
the fueslage aft most point. After reading the Flying Manual, it should be 1
1/8 inch wide (without gussets).
> >
> > 3. Engine mount fittings do not show a radius in the corners. It would be
good practice to put in a radius to avoid cracking.
> >
> > Bart D Conrad
> > Boeing Field Service
> > DC-9/MD-80/DC-10 & 737 Heavy Mtc
> > Phone: 713-640-5882/713-324-4192
> > Fax: 713-640-5891
> > Pager: 713-318-1625
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: PLAN ERRORS/CLARIFICATIONS |
Thanks Bart
I would say that the discussion group is the most valuable source of imformation
once a person has some plans.
I am in a couple three airplane groups and what a wealth of information from those
leading us into the unknown that have already built their airplanes and are
sticking around to help the new kids on the block.
Thanks
Gordon
RW1 UL Piet
Big Piet Soon
"Conrad, Bart D" wrote:
> The following is the best answer I can provide to your questions: The supplementary
plans are for the extended fuselage. That page also makes the aft cockpit
seat longer and adds a top lug to the top engine mount so that a strut can
be added to do away with the forward cockpit seat cross wires on the right hand
side. It has been my experience that it takes the plans purchased from Don
Pietenpol, plus the plans from the Flying Manual, plus networking such as this
discussion group. Bart
> Bart D Conrad
> Boeing Field Service
> DC-9/MD-80/DC-10 & 737 Heavy Mtc
> Phone: 713-640-5882/713-324-4192
> Fax: 713-640-5891
> Pager: 713-318-1625
>
> > ----------
> > From: Gordon Brimhall[SMTP:arkiesair(at)surfree.com]
> > Sent: Sunday, August 15, 1999 8:13 PM
> > To: Pietenpol Discussion
> > Subject: Re: PLAN ERRORS/CLARIFICATIONS
> >
> > Whats the Supplementary Plans? and how many sets of plans do you need to buy
to build this airplane?
> >
> > Gordon
> >
> >
> > "Conrad, Bart D" wrote:
> >
> > > Before I add this to the KNOWN PLAN ERRORS section of aircamper.org, does
everyone agree with the following?
> > >
> > > 1. The "Supplementary Plans, Air-Camper" page lists the length of the fuselage
for the horizontal stabilizer to attach to, to be 18 7/8 inch. Believe
this should maybe be 18 1/8 inch as the horizontal stabilizer is 18 inches wide.
This matches the rudder length also.
> > >
> > > 2. Drawing number 1 of the 1933 plans does not show the width dimension of
the fueslage aft most point. After reading the Flying Manual, it should be
1 1/8 inch wide (without gussets).
> > >
> > > 3. Engine mount fittings do not show a radius in the corners. It would be
good practice to put in a radius to avoid cracking.
> > >
> > > Bart D Conrad
> > > Boeing Field Service
> > > DC-9/MD-80/DC-10 & 737 Heavy Mtc
> > > Phone: 713-640-5882/713-324-4192
> > > Fax: 713-640-5891
> > > Pager: 713-318-1625
> >
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Unsubscribe method |
HELP!!!!!!!!
I signed up for the discussion group and instantly bot 61 messages...this
wont do.
How do i stop this?
I am recieving at least two of everything.
Please unsubscribe or at least unsubscribe one.
thanks
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Continental engines |
Jacob,
I just recieved my plans for the air camper and I too am planning on using a
continental. Coencidentally, Telledyne Continentals' factory is right
accross the bay from me. (15 min) I know the guy who worked up the design
for voyager engines. I will call them and ask. I think they still do more
actual overhauls than new engines anyway.
Sincerely,
Allen Smith
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Keith Hodge <KHodge(at)cwcom.net> |
----- Original Message -----
________________________________________________________________________________
Sent: 16 August 1999 16:57
| Subject: | Re: Unsubscribe method |
>
> HELP!!!!!!!!
>
> I signed up for the discussion group and instantly bot 61 messages...this
> wont do.
>
> How do i stop this?
>
> I am recieving at least two of everything.
>
> Please unsubscribe or at least unsubscribe one.
>
>
> thanks
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Keith Hodge <KHodge(at)cwcom.net> |
----- Original Message -----
________________________________________________________________________________
Sent: 16 August 1999 16:57
| Subject: | Re: Unsubscribe method |
>
> HELP!!!!!!!!
>
> I signed up for the discussion group and instantly bot 61 messages...this
> wont do.
>
> How do i stop this?
>
> I am recieving at least two of everything.
>
> Please unsubscribe or at least unsubscribe one.
>
>
> thanks
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Greg Yotz <gyachts(at)kans.com> |
Does anyone have a copy of the "Plane Crazy" documentary that aired last
July on PBS?
I have heard about it several times but have never seen it. Appearantly
the guy, Bob Cringly, built a would biplane, VW powered
in 30 days and flew it.
Greg Yotz
Does anyone have a copy of the
Plane
Crazy documentary that aired last July on PBS?
I have heard about it several times
but have
never seen it. Appearantly the guy, Bob Cringly, built a would
biplane, VW
powered
in 30 days and flew it.
Greg Yotz
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Copinfo <Copinfo(at)ix.Netcom.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Continental engines |
Try http://www.wingsonline.com/engprt.html for that Continental Engine. I
have a 65 which is fine. The 85 and 90 are good too.
Copinfo(at)ix.Netcom.Com
Tim Cunningham
Des Moines, Iowa (515) 237-1510
>I've decided to build an AirCamper and I want to be able to use a
Continental
>engine. Can anyone tell me where I should first start looking for
>Continental engines
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | TXTdragger(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: 'Plane Crazy" |
Don't have a copy, but saw it on TV. The only good thing I saw was the
people that make the 2nd kit. I don't remember their name, but it was a baby
Jungmiester, I think. They have a 1st class operation, but the guy putting
on the documentry wasn't. It was more about his ego, & less about
homebuilding. By the way, he didn't build & fly a plane in 30 days, even
with 2 tries & a lot of help the 2nd time. A real waste of time & someone's
money, except for the 2nd kit mfg's time & patience shown in 2nd try. Not a
typical "homebuilder", according to ones I have met & read about
John D
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | jshutic(at)nordson.com |
| Subject: | Re: re: Re: Continental engines |
I'm working on an aircamper with a 2 inch wider fuselage based upon the
longer fuselage plans. A continental engine will be used, but I decided to
buy an A-65 crankcase to facilitate engine mount fit-up without going too
deep into the finances. My goal is to get as much done on the airplane before
commiting to the actual engine. I paid $100.00 for the crankcase. I don't
think that is too much money for a "firewall forward construction jig". I can
still make all the engine noises I want while getting a little stick time on
the sawhorses. By the way, I may get thrown out of church for widening the
fuselage 2 inches, but what a difference in interior space. Big boys want to
fly Piets too!
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | dean dayton <dayton(at)netwalk.com> |
| Subject: | Re: 'Plane Crazy" |
I never saw it but I heard about it. The second plane was a VW powered Youngster
biplane by Fisher Aero (Mike Fisher, Ohio). It is a cute looking little plane,
but not related to the Jungmiester. Fisher Aero no longer exists, their product
line has been acquired by Fisher Flying Products (http://www.fisherflying.com).
Dean Dayton
TXTdragger(at)aol.com wrote:
> Don't have a copy, but saw it on TV. The only good thing I saw was the
> people that make the 2nd kit. I don't remember their name, but it was a baby
> Jungmiester, I think. They have a 1st class operation, but the guy putting
> on the documentry wasn't. It was more about his ego, & less about
> homebuilding. By the way, he didn't build & fly a plane in 30 days, even
> with 2 tries & a lot of help the 2nd time. A real waste of time & someone's
> money, except for the 2nd kit mfg's time & patience shown in 2nd try. Not a
> typical "homebuilder", according to ones I have met & read about
>
> John D
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Greg Yotz <gyachts(at)kans.com> |
| Subject: | Re: 'Plane Crazy" |
Thanks. I was just wondering. I've heard both sides about the show.
GY
-----Original Message-----
From: TXTdragger(at)aol.com <TXTdragger(at)aol.com>
Date: Monday, August 16, 1999 1:03 PM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: 'Plane Crazy"
>Don't have a copy, but saw it on TV. The only good thing I saw was the
>people that make the 2nd kit. I don't remember their name, but it was a
baby
>Jungmiester, I think. They have a 1st class operation, but the guy putting
>on the documentry wasn't. It was more about his ego, & less about
>homebuilding. By the way, he didn't build & fly a plane in 30 days, even
>with 2 tries & a lot of help the 2nd time. A real waste of time &
someone's
>money, except for the 2nd kit mfg's time & patience shown in 2nd try. Not
a
>typical "homebuilder", according to ones I have met & read about
>
>John D
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Chad Johnson <cjohnson(at)jayhawkpl.com> |
| Subject: | RE: 'Plane Crazy" |
I agree, I watched the program twice because I laughed so hard the first
time. I hope I don't step on any toes, but that guy was no more an
amatuer airplane builder than I am an astronaut.
I would reccomend the show for entertainment only and there are some
interesting parts towards the end when they show the "Fisher Aircraft"
kit factory. In fact it looked to me like the guys at Fisher Aircraft
did most of the building while the supposed star of the show did some
narrations occasionally interupted by threats to the camera man and vain
attempts at drama. Not what I would call a construction detail nor
technique orientated program.............but good for a laugh or two.
Cj
-----Original Message-----
Date: Mon, 16 Aug 1999 13:36:39 -0600
I think there would be a lot of interest in this modification if you would
like to post more details... Several of the larger folk at Brodhead asked
about doing something similar.
Steve Eldredge
IT Services
Brigham Young University
> -----Original Message-----
> jshutic(at)nordson.com
> Sent: Monday, August 16, 1999 12:26 PM
> To: Pietenpol Discussion
> Subject: re: Re: Continental engines
>
>
> I'm working on an aircamper with a 2 inch wider fuselage
> based upon the
> longer fuselage plans. A continental engine will be used, but
> I decided to
> buy an A-65 crankcase to facilitate engine mount fit-up
> without going too
> deep into the finances. My goal is to get as much done on the
> airplane before
> commiting to the actual engine. I paid $100.00 for the
> crankcase. I don't
> think that is too much money for a "firewall forward
> construction jig". I can
> still make all the engine noises I want while getting a
> little stick time on
> the sawhorses. By the way, I may get thrown out of church for
> widening the
> fuselage 2 inches, but what a difference in interior space.
> Big boys want to
> fly Piets too!
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | coxrod(at)WellsFargo.COM |
| Subject: | RE: 'Plane Crazy" |
I taped the program, hoping it would be worth keeping to show my
disbelieving friends that some people really do build their own airplanes.
However, this show was just an ego-fest for the Bob Cringly (the host), and
illustrated a dangerous lack of forethought and planning on his part which
in NO WAY represents me or anybody I've ever talked to who are involved in
homebuilts. It was a waste of my perfectly good video tape and I'll surely
tape over the show. Don't waste your time looking for a copy.
Bob Cox
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Greg Yotz [SMTP:gyachts(at)kans.com]
> Sent: Monday, August 16, 1999 10:12 AM
> To: Pietenpol Discussion
> Subject: 'Plane Crazy"
>
> Does anyone have a copy of the "Plane Crazy" documentary that aired last
> July on PBS?
>
> I have heard about it several times but have never seen it. Appearantly
> the guy, Bob Cringly, built a would biplane, VW powered
> in 30 days and flew it.
>
>
> Greg Yotz
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Ken Hannan <khannan(at)gte.net> |
| Subject: | Re: 'Plane Crazy" |
Greg I have A copy of it at home if you give me your address and if the kids
did not record over it I can send it out tomorrow
Ken Hannan
----- Original Message -----
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Greg Yotz <gyachts(at)kans.com> |
Sent: Monday, August 16, 1999 11:49 AM
| Subject: | Re: 'Plane Crazy" |
> Thanks. I was just wondering. I've heard both sides about the show.
> GY
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: TXTdragger(at)aol.com <TXTdragger(at)aol.com>
> To: Pietenpol Discussion
> Date: Monday, August 16, 1999 1:03 PM
> Subject: Re: 'Plane Crazy"
>
>
> >Don't have a copy, but saw it on TV. The only good thing I saw was the
> >people that make the 2nd kit. I don't remember their name, but it was a
> baby
> >Jungmiester, I think. They have a 1st class operation, but the guy
putting
> >on the documentry wasn't. It was more about his ego, & less about
> >homebuilding. By the way, he didn't build & fly a plane in 30 days, even
> >with 2 tries & a lot of help the 2nd time. A real waste of time &
> someone's
> >money, except for the 2nd kit mfg's time & patience shown in 2nd try.
Not
> a
> >typical "homebuilder", according to ones I have met & read about
> >
> >John D
> >
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Wayne and Kathy <ktokarz(at)incentre.net> |
please unsubscribe
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: unique corvair |
Has anyone used a corvair with direct coupling to the out-put shaft?
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | John Duprey <j-m-duprey(at)erols.com> |
| Subject: | Re: 'Plane Crazy" |
I saw 2nd half the program it was well done, If you can find a copy I
would like to see it also, so that I can see the first half.
John Duprey
Greg Yotz wrote:
>
> Does anyone have a copy of the "Plane Crazy" documentary that aired
> last July on PBS?
>
> I have heard about it several times but have never seen it.
> Appearantly the guy, Bob Cringly, built a would biplane, VW powered
> in 30 days and flew it.
>
>
> Greg Yotz
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: 'Plane Crazy" |
Greg
Can you pass that to me when you get done with it, I been trying to find it for
a year now.
If Ken doesn't mind.
Gordon
Ken Hannan wrote:
> Greg I have A copy of it at home if you give me your address and if the kids
> did not record over it I can send it out tomorrow
>
> Ken Hannan
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: Greg Yotz <gyachts(at)kans.com>
> To: Pietenpol Discussion
> Sent: Monday, August 16, 1999 11:49 AM
> Subject: Re: 'Plane Crazy"
>
> > Thanks. I was just wondering. I've heard both sides about the show.
> > GY
> >
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: TXTdragger(at)aol.com <TXTdragger(at)aol.com>
> > To: Pietenpol Discussion
> > Date: Monday, August 16, 1999 1:03 PM
> > Subject: Re: 'Plane Crazy"
> >
> >
> > >Don't have a copy, but saw it on TV. The only good thing I saw was the
> > >people that make the 2nd kit. I don't remember their name, but it was a
> > baby
> > >Jungmiester, I think. They have a 1st class operation, but the guy
> putting
> > >on the documentry wasn't. It was more about his ego, & less about
> > >homebuilding. By the way, he didn't build & fly a plane in 30 days, even
> > >with 2 tries & a lot of help the 2nd time. A real waste of time &
> > someone's
> > >money, except for the 2nd kit mfg's time & patience shown in 2nd try.
> Not
> > a
> > >typical "homebuilder", according to ones I have met & read about
> > >
> > >John D
> > >
> >
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Greg Yotz <gyachts(at)kans.com> |
| Subject: | Re: 'Plane Crazy" |
Fine with me if it's ok with Ken.
GY
-----Original Message-----
From: Gordon Brimhall
Date: Monday, August 16, 1999 4:45 PM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: 'Plane Crazy"
>Greg
>
>Can you pass that to me when you get done with it, I been trying to find it
for
>a year now.
>
>If Ken doesn't mind.
>
>Gordon
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | jshutic(at)nordson.com |
| Subject: | Re: re: RE: Re: Continental engines |
Steve, some additional details are offered concerning my "wide-body"
Aircamper. First of all, much thanks to Mike Cuy who let me look over his
project a few months before his first flight. It provided more than enough
inspiration. The decision to widen the fuselage by 2 inches was based upon my
dimensional challenges in the front seat of a J-3 Cub. My knees are up high
enough to interfere with the left to right travel of the stick. The upward
sloping floor is also to blame, but a full size mock-up of the Piet's forward
fuselage confirmed the voluminous (pun) benefits of the wider configuration.
In the spirit of experimenting, I decided to procede. I consider this a
concurrent engineering modification as any aspect of the airframe associated
with width or span is impacted by the 2 inch increase. I have not increased
the cross-sectional area of any fuselage cross members. I am using aircraft
grade spruce with Finish Birch metric aircraft plywood for the entire
airframe. The spruce is lighter than the Douglas Fir, and the birch plywood
is heavier than the mahogany plywood, but oh the strength! I purchase the
birch plywood from Harbor Sales in Baltimore, Maryland. It is manufactured in
Finland to German Lloyds Standard-2 (gl-2). The stuff is like sheet metal in
stiffness and tensile strength. Although it is metric, the thickness
variations are 1.5 mm 3 ply vs. 1/16", 3.0 mm 6ply vs. 1/8" and 6.0mm 12 ply
vs. 1/4". And every veneer is birch, rather than poplar core veneers like
U.S. birch plywood. The consistency of the veneer layers (.020") and the
maroon colored glue used in the manufacturing process make scarfing a real
pleasure, with the glue lines aiding by way of contrast to the birch.
Downsides? Sure. Panel sizes are limited to 50"x 50" (more scarf joints),
cost and weight. But I really enjoy the working properties of the material.
Europe has a long history of wooden aircraft constuction, both powered light
planes and sailplanes that routinely employed such plywoods. At this point my
fuselage is built, instrument panels and seats installed, numerous details
ongoing with seatbelt anchors, control system considerations etc. But hey! I
have a front seat thats two inches wider. The back seat could qualify as a
parsons bench or church pew and the fuel tank volume has increased by 10%
(estimate). Bottom line, lot's more to figure out but I dont regret the
decision. A little controversy in closing. My rudder post is 3 1/2 inches
wide. The vertical stabilizer is being built integral to the fuselage
(reference Fly-Baby, Piel Emeraude etc) in order to provide enhanced roll
over protection, also allowing for a single integral elevator horn by way of
a one piece elevator spar. No elevator cables or horns are carried outside
the airframe. This configuration also permits a tailwheel spring fulcrum
point right at the bottom of the vertical stabilizer spar. Although the
tailplanes are fuller as they posses symetrical foils, they still retain the
Piet's profiles (Reference the tailplane construction of the Issac Fury II).
The challenge is to keep the tail light. Also, the wing will have frise type
ailerons in order to address the gap seal issue while limiting adverse yaw.
Hardly a traditional Piet, but an enjoyable project all the same.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | tim moosey <mooset(at)flash.net> |
| Subject: | Re: 'Plane Crazy" |
I saw the show and was greatly disappointed. It made homebuilders look like
total idiots. T he only idiot was the guy who starred in the documentary.
Its truly idiotic to think you can design, build and fly an airplane in 30
days!!
Tim
-----Original Message-----
From: Greg Yotz <gyachts(at)kans.com>
Date: Monday, August 16, 1999 1:52 PM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: 'Plane Crazy"
>Thanks. I was just wondering. I've heard both sides about the show.
>GY
>
>
>-----Original Message-----
>From: TXTdragger(at)aol.com <TXTdragger(at)aol.com>
>To: Pietenpol Discussion
>Date: Monday, August 16, 1999 1:03 PM
>Subject: Re: 'Plane Crazy"
>
>
>>Don't have a copy, but saw it on TV. The only good thing I saw was the
>>people that make the 2nd kit. I don't remember their name, but it was a
>baby
>>Jungmiester, I think. They have a 1st class operation, but the guy
putting
>>on the documentry wasn't. It was more about his ego, & less about
>>homebuilding. By the way, he didn't build & fly a plane in 30 days, even
>>with 2 tries & a lot of help the 2nd time. A real waste of time &
>someone's
>>money, except for the 2nd kit mfg's time & patience shown in 2nd try. Not
>a
>>typical "homebuilder", according to ones I have met & read about
>>
>>John D
>>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: 'Plane Crazy" |
I understand the movie was for fun anyway and not to be taken as the real deal.
I still want to see it and see if it makes me laugh.
Gordon
tim moosey wrote:
> I saw the show and was greatly disappointed. It made homebuilders look like
> total idiots. T he only idiot was the guy who starred in the documentary.
> Its truly idiotic to think you can design, build and fly an airplane in 30
> days!!
> Tim
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Greg Yotz <gyachts(at)kans.com>
> To: Pietenpol Discussion
> Date: Monday, August 16, 1999 1:52 PM
> Subject: Re: 'Plane Crazy"
>
> >Thanks. I was just wondering. I've heard both sides about the show.
> >GY
> >
> >
> >-----Original Message-----
> >From: TXTdragger(at)aol.com <TXTdragger(at)aol.com>
> >To: Pietenpol Discussion
> >Date: Monday, August 16, 1999 1:03 PM
> >Subject: Re: 'Plane Crazy"
> >
> >
> >>Don't have a copy, but saw it on TV. The only good thing I saw was the
> >>people that make the 2nd kit. I don't remember their name, but it was a
> >baby
> >>Jungmiester, I think. They have a 1st class operation, but the guy
> putting
> >>on the documentry wasn't. It was more about his ego, & less about
> >>homebuilding. By the way, he didn't build & fly a plane in 30 days, even
> >>with 2 tries & a lot of help the 2nd time. A real waste of time &
> >someone's
> >>money, except for the 2nd kit mfg's time & patience shown in 2nd try. Not
> >a
> >>typical "homebuilder", according to ones I have met & read about
> >>
> >>John D
> >>
> >
> >
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Ken Hannan <khannan(at)gte.net> |
| Subject: | Re: 'Plane Crazy" |
Greg The video will go out UPS from California tomorrow
you my keep and pass it on, I do not need it back, one time was enough.
Thanks Ken
----- Original Message -----
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Greg Yotz <gyachts(at)kans.com> |
Sent: Monday, August 16, 1999 3:17 PM
| Subject: | Re: 'Plane Crazy" |
> Fine with me if it's ok with Ken.
>
> GY
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Gordon Brimhall
> To: Pietenpol Discussion
> Date: Monday, August 16, 1999 4:45 PM
> Subject: Re: 'Plane Crazy"
>
>
> >Greg
> >
> >Can you pass that to me when you get done with it, I been trying to find
it
> for
> >a year now.
> >
> >If Ken doesn't mind.
> >
> >Gordon
> >
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: 'Plane Crazy" |
Where at in Calif? I am in the High Desert out of Barstow on HWY 58.
Greg I'll send you my address for later if you don't mind.
Gordon
Ken Hannan wrote:
> Greg The video will go out UPS from California tomorrow
> you my keep and pass it on, I do not need it back, one time was enough.
>
> Thanks Ken
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: Greg Yotz <gyachts(at)kans.com>
> To: Pietenpol Discussion
> Sent: Monday, August 16, 1999 3:17 PM
> Subject: Re: 'Plane Crazy"
>
> > Fine with me if it's ok with Ken.
> >
> > GY
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: Gordon Brimhall
> > To: Pietenpol Discussion
> > Date: Monday, August 16, 1999 4:45 PM
> > Subject: Re: 'Plane Crazy"
> >
> >
> > >Greg
> > >
> > >Can you pass that to me when you get done with it, I been trying to find
> it
> > for
> > >a year now.
> > >
> > >If Ken doesn't mind.
> > >
> > >Gordon
> > >
> >
> >
> >
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Ken Hannan <khannan(at)gte.net> |
| Subject: | Re: 'Plane Crazy" |
Gordon,
I'm in Temecula, Ca
That's in riverside
> Where at in Calif? I am in the High Desert out of Barstow on HWY 58.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | TJTREV(at)webtv.net (Theodore Trevorrow) |
| Subject: | Re: unique corvair |
If by direct coupling you mean bolting prop to the crankshaft. There
all that way. With an engine that developes most of its horsepower in
the mid 2000's theres no reason for a speed reduction unit. The only
draw back is you need a prop that turns the other way.
Ted .T
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: 'Plane Crazy" |
Yep. My Sis used to live their on 5 acres. Property so expensive their now
they gave them a pick of a new home in the new track just to put a road
thru their property to the new track homes. Now she lives in Hemet.
I forget the road name. It was a dirt road 27 yrs ago. They paid 4,300 for
5 acres.
Gordon
Ken Hannan wrote:
> Gordon,
> I'm in Temecula, Ca
> That's in riverside
>
> > Where at in Calif? I am in the High Desert out of Barstow on HWY 58.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Replicraft(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: GN-1 Cabanes |
Ted-
As far as I know, the Cabane struts on the GN-1 are equal front and rear. The
Pietenpol struts are 1" shorter ...
The weight and balance could be your problem....try a 50 lb. weight in the
front seat while flying solo.
Steve
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Replicraft(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Pietenpol engine mount |
The latter is true...actually, there is only one style of attach fitting on
the fuselage. The steel engine mount is the difference.
Steve
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: unique corvair |
Thanks Ted: I've seen 2 corvair powered Piets recently, both had reduction
units. Thats why I asked. Do you have one or know of one? Ryder
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | william hutson <wihutson(at)yahoo.com> |
Could someone please tell me the differance between the Pietenpol Air
Camper, the GN-1 Air Camper, and the St. Croix Aircamper?
Bill
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | MACKORELL(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Continental engines |
Allen,
Thank you for responding to my email. I am very interested in what you can
find out. I too have just recieved my AirCamper plans today and have spent
several hours studying them. Let me know what you can find out. Talk to you
later.
Sincerely,
Jacob
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Ted Brousseau <nfn00979(at)naples.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Home from OSH - Finally!! |
Yes, the Piet is sold. Just got around to reading these messages as I was
1028 behind when I got back.
>GREAT trip Ted!!!
>Where did you see the Piet at a garage sale?
>Was it sold?
>I have a little sister going to college in the Michigan Upper pen.
>I would love to get her to go down and buy it and bring it home on her next
>trip.
>
>Greg
>
>
>-----Original Message-----
>From: Ted Brousseau <nfn00979(at)naples.net>
>To: Pietenpol Discussion
>Date: Tuesday, August 10, 1999 9:48 PM
>Subject: Re: Home from OSH - Finally!!
>
>
>>Hello Mike, Steve and others. After 62.6 hours flying, 3281 miles over
>>the ground, 4069 miles in the air (head winds), 37 fuel stops and 60
>>landings (lots of rides), I finally set down back in Naples Sunday evening.
>>I hope you had as great a time as I did. It was nice to finally meet you
>>after all this time.
>>
>>Things learned: 1) A Piet is a great way to see the country. 2) Seat
>>padding is a very important, but probably overlooked, item.
>>
>>Scariest momemt: clearing the trees by 2' departing Hendersonville, NC.
>>
>>Greatest discovery: A partially built Pietenpol at a garage sale in
>Michigan!!
>>
>>Happiest moment: Setting down back at my home field.
>>
>>Future plans: Anyone for a trip to Alaska...
>>
>>Ted Brousseau
>>Naples, FL
>>
>>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | MACKORELL(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Continental engines |
Thank you
Jacob
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | TJTREV(at)webtv.net (Theodore Trevorrow) |
| Subject: | Re: unique corvair |
Mine will be ford powered . I have seen several corvairs at Brodhead
over the years and I haven't seen a reduction unit yet. Contact Don
Pietenpol at the Pietenpol web sight. or check the Buckeye Pietenpol
page faq. However Don is the horses mouth so to speak. He makes a nice
aluminum hub that solves your problem.
Just my opinion but I think anyone that tells you that a reduction unit
is necessary is probably selling one. Ted.T
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | walter evans <wbeevans(at)worldnet.att.net> |
| Subject: | Fw: unique corvair |
Mark,
This is the same person. His first corvair is on Bob 's Piet and the
second on the experimental in the photo.
Some of the pics show a casting before and after modification.
walt
ps. Just yesterday Dick asked me to email the co. Vertical systems thru a
site address on their casting, but it got sent back. Do you have an address
for them ( email or postal?)
thanks again...walt
-----Original Message-----
From: mboynton(at)excite.com <mboynton(at)excite.com>
Date: Monday, August 16, 1999 5:52 PM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: unique corvair
>Walt:
>
>Interesting pic's you posted on the Piet discussion group about the
>gentleman in Sussex and the Corvair redrive. I too am planning a Corvair
>conversion with a redrive - I've purchased plans from Vertical Systems for
>the Rinker redrive.
>
>Can you give me any information about how to get ahold of the guy in
Sussex.
>I'd sure like to ask a few questions. At one point I was in touch with Bob
>Schiffel, also of Sussex, who worked with a guy who helped him with his
>redrive. I wonder if its the same person.
>
>Mark Boynton
>Gilbert, Arizona
>
>
>>
>
>
>_______
>Get FREE voicemail, fax and email at http://voicemail.excite.com
>Talk online at http://voicechat.excite.com
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | walter evans <wbeevans(at)worldnet.att.net> |
| Subject: | direct drive corvair |
It seems that the corvair is rated @ 110 hp. But if you check the specs,
that hp is at about 4500 rpm. Can't run that length prop at that speed
so when it's run at , say 2500 rpm , the hp is GREATLY deminished.
Not my data , but Dicks. I think that these run at about 3800rpm ( I
think)
walt
It seems that the corvair is rated @
110 hp. But
if you check the specs, that hp is at about 4500 rpm. Can't run that
length prop
at that speed so when it's run at , say 2500 rpm , the hp is GREATLY
deminished.
Not my data , but Dicks. I
think that
these run at about 3800rpm ( I think)
walt
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | walter evans <wbeevans(at)worldnet.att.net> |
| Subject: | Fw: unique corvair |
Ted,
Just a thought, find out what prop the corvairs are running, and compare
that to what the fords or 65 cont. are running. See if the direct coupled
Corvairs are turning a twice horsepower prop.
walt
-----Original Message-----
From: Theodore Trevorrow <TJTREV(at)webtv.net>
Date: Monday, August 16, 1999 10:55 PM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: unique corvair
Mine will be ford powered . I have seen several corvairs at Brodhead
over the years and I haven't seen a reduction unit yet. Contact Don
Pietenpol at the Pietenpol web sight. or check the Buckeye Pietenpol
page faq. However Don is the horses mouth so to speak. He makes a nice
aluminum hub that solves your problem.
Just my opinion but I think anyone that tells you that a reduction unit
is necessary is probably selling one. Ted.T
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | walter evans <wbeevans(at)worldnet.att.net> |
| Subject: | Fw: unique corvair |
Mark,
Sorry forgot his number.....Dick Lawson 973-383-7821
walt
-----Original Message-----
From: mboynton(at)excite.com <mboynton(at)excite.com>
Date: Monday, August 16, 1999 5:52 PM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: unique corvair
>Walt:
>
>Interesting pic's you posted on the Piet discussion group about the
>gentleman in Sussex and the Corvair redrive. I too am planning a Corvair
>conversion with a redrive - I've purchased plans from Vertical Systems for
>the Rinker redrive.
>
>Can you give me any information about how to get ahold of the guy in
Sussex.
>I'd sure like to ask a few questions. At one point I was in touch with Bob
>Schiffel, also of Sussex, who worked with a guy who helped him with his
>redrive. I wonder if its the same person.
>
>Mark Boynton
>Gilbert, Arizona
>
>
>>
>
>
>_______
>Get FREE voicemail, fax and email at http://voicemail.excite.com
>Talk online at http://voicechat.excite.com
>
________________________________________________________________________________
Bill;
The St. Croix issue is a fella in Iowa that makes props. He has built 2 or
3 Air Campers and a Scout. He sells wood kits for Piets as well as plans I
guess. The name St. Croix Aircamper is new to me unless it is just as above.
The GN-1 and Air Camper are two TOTALLY different airplanes that share very
similar appearances from a bit of a distance. Some of the other guys will no
doubt tell you the differances as a lot of them have GN-1s........
Earl Myers
-----Original Message-----
From: william hutson <wihutson(at)yahoo.com>
Date: Monday, August 16, 1999 9:51 PM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Confused
>Could someone please tell me the differance between the Pietenpol Air
>Camper, the GN-1 Air Camper, and the St. Croix Aircamper?
>
>
>Bill
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Continental engines |
Continental made 65, 70, 75, 85, 90, and 100 hp engines, all basically
alike. The 85 hp and up usually had electrical systems.
>I've decided to build an AirCamper and I want to be able to use a
>Continental
>engine. Can anyone tell me where I should first start looking for
>Continental engines. I looked up the Teledyne Continental web page
>but there
>was nothing on the specific engines that they manufacture. I know
>they
>manufactured a 65 hp but did they also make an 85 hp? If anyone has
>built an
>AirCamper with this engine, can you give me some advice as to where to
>get
>started, cost, problems, etc.?
>
>Thank You,
>Jacob
__________
________________________________________________________________________________
John,
I'd be glad to help in any way I can. Just let me know what you need, or
better yet, come see our project. I've made a photo album of each step of
our progress and this will probably help you as much as anything.
I started flying in 1960, but my last solo was in Jan. 1966. Nearly all
my time is in taildraggers, mostly J-3's and Cessna 140's and I'm sure
getting anxious to complete this plane and start flying again. I've
already made arrangements for some dual to get checked out again as we
near completion. We'll also have someone more competent test fly the
plane for us.
John Langston
Pipe Creek, TX
(830) 510-4641
>John
>You sure live in a great place to own a Piet. I have been there many
>times,
>(during my motorcycle days) before & after the big flood. When you
>get a
>chance, e-mail me your suggestions as to "getting started". I have
>been an
>airplane nut for over 50 years & FINALLY got my ticket on my 64
>birthday. It
>was even more thrilling than I had dreamed about all those years.
>Thanks in
>advance, for any help.
>
>John Davis (713) 777-2954 e-mail: TxTdragger
__________
________________________________________________________________________________
John,
Our Piet project is at the Flying RV Ranch. My partners are Rodger Childs
of Bandera and Dock Dixon of Comfort and we've been working on the
project quite a bit after a long layoff. Give me a call sometime and meet
us there when we're working on the plane. Rodger and I have wierd
schedules so we're there at the usual hours.
John Langston
Pipe Creek, TX
(830) 510-4641
writes:
>John,
>Is your Piet project the one that's at Flying RV Ranch? I have a
>RW-6
>RagWing Parasol that I built there and am giving some thought to
>building a
>Piet for my next project.
>John W
>RW-6
>KR-2S
>Kerrville, Tx
>jandd(at)maverickbbs.com
>
>-----Original Message-----
>From: nle97(at)juno.com <nle97(at)juno.com>
>To: Pietenpol Discussion
>Date: Sunday, August 15, 1999 1:35 AM
>Subject: Re: Houston
>
>
>>James,
>>I and two partners are building a Model A powered Piet in Comfort,
>Texas
>>which is about 40 miles north of San Antonio along IH-10. While this
>is
>>not too close to Houston you are certainly welcome to come and see
>our
>>project. The fuselage is more or less done and on its gear. The
>empennage
>>is done and we've made good progress on the wing lately. If you wish
>to
>>make a four hour trip to see it, my E-mail address is nle97(at)juno.com
>and
>>my phone is (830) 510-4641.
>>Sincerely,
>>John Langston
>>
>> writes:
>>>Hello, I'm considering building an aircamper. Is there anyone in
>the
>>>Houston, TX area that has built one or is in the process of
>building
>>>one?
>>>
>>>If so, I would like to see one in person.
>>>
>>>Thanks,
>>>
>>>James McFarland
>>>
>>>
>>
>
__________
________________________________________________________________________________
John,
I do live in Pipe Creek and have lived here for 19 years. I'm kind of
curious of why you were looking for me.
Our project is really moving along, finally. The fuselage and empennage
are basically complete and the plane is standing on its gear. We are now
in the process of making the wing, which will be one piece. We have
spliced the spars, cut to size, routed the spars, and have installed the
ribs. Our goal is to be done by the end of next summer, but we are
currently approaching 8 years of our intended 18 month project.
I'd like to hear from you,
John Langston
(830) 510-4641
writes:
>John,
>
>Are you the guy that used to live at Pipe Creek? If so, I tried
>looking you
>up several years ago when I was down around Bandera or so.
>
>How far along are you?
>
>JMG
>-----Original Message-----
>From: nle97(at)juno.com <nle97(at)juno.com>
>To: Pietenpol Discussion
>Date: Sunday, August 15, 1999 1:36 AM
>Subject: Re: Houston
>
>
>>James,
>>I and two partners are building a Model A powered Piet in Comfort,
>Texas
>>which is about 40 miles north of San Antonio along IH-10. While this
>is
>>not too close to Houston you are certainly welcome to come and see
>our
>>project. The fuselage is more or less done and on its gear. The
>empennage
>>is done and we've made good progress on the wing lately. If you wish
>to
>>make a four hour trip to see it, my E-mail address is nle97(at)juno.com
>and
>>my phone is (830) 510-4641.
>>Sincerely,
>>John Langston
>>
>> writes:
>>>Hello, I'm considering building an aircamper. Is there anyone in
>the
>>>Houston, TX area that has built one or is in the process of
>building
>>>one?
>>>
>>>If so, I would like to see one in person.
>>>
>>>Thanks,
>>>
>>>James McFarland
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>
__________
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: bending rib caps |
"David B. Schober" wrote:
>
> Use basically the same method but make a jig for the forward 1/3 of
> the airfoil wide enough for about 4-6 capstrips. Soak or steam the
> capstrip material and set up 4-6 of them at a time. When they dry you
> can put them right into the rib jig, glue them up and put on the
> gussets and remove the rib from the jig right away. You don't have to
> wait for the capstrip to dry!
>
> walter evans wrote:
>
> > I don't know if bending rib caps is a problem. In some of the
> > building books they have some pretty fancy jigs. Just wanted to
> > pass along how I bend mine. Take a piece of 2" PVC pipe, 18" long.
> > Either plug the end with wood plug or use pvc cap. Screw it to a
> > plywood base, so that the pipe will stand vertical.Ten minutes
> > before you start a rib, boil a sauce pan of water. Put the water
> > into the tube and add the end of the rib cap. After ten minute
Someone posted instructions for building a wood steamer, his device was
simple, but what I do is even simpler. When the wife isn't looking I
pour about an inch of water into her 14" fry pan. I put the nose end
of the cap strips in them and simmer for half an hour. I clamp them
into my bending jig. My jig is sawn out of a 2x4 so I can get 3 strips
in at a time. I decided I didn't trust gluing them with T88 when they
were damp so I let them dry for at least 2 days before I use them.
Cheap and simple, I love it.
Randy Stockberger
Independence, OR
> > soak, it bends nicely into the jig. If you left it in 30 min , you
> > could tie it in a knot.Works great.walt
>
>
>
> --
>
>
> David B.Schober, CPE
> Instructor, Aviation Maintenance
> Fairmont State College
> National Aerospace Education Center
> 1050 East Benedum Industrial Drive
> Bridgeport, WV 26330-9503
> (304) 842-8300
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Michael D Cuy <Michael.D.Cuy(at)lerc.nasa.gov> |
>Could someone please tell me the differance between the Pietenpol Air
>Camper, the GN-1 Air Camper, and the St. Croix Aircamper?
>
>
>Bill
Bill- Let me start by saying that both the GN-1 and Pietenpol are FUN, FUN,
open cockpit airplanes, however there are differences you should be aware of
before building.
The Pietenpol was designed in the 1930's, the GN-1 in the 60's. The GN-1 uses
some Cub parts to speed up completion time but as we know today these parts
are more expensive and less abundant. The Pietenpol wing fittings allow the
wing to be moved forward
and backward to accommodate various engines, fuel tank locations, etc. where
the
GN-1 has a 'fixed' position wing. If your CG turns out to be incorrect on the
GN-1 you
need to either change the motor mount length or add ballast...on the Piet you
make
adjustments to the wing fore and aft position to make the CG fall where you
need it to.
Piets generally have lighter empty weights and require lower horsepower as a
result.
Most GN-1's have more than 65 Continentals on them, but not all....Ted
Brousseau
has a nice GN-1 that he flies with a 65.....and just got done doing a 3,300
mile cross-
country. The GN-1's have more metal fittings to fabricate and the parts appear
to be
more stout than may be necessary. Likewise though, many Piet builders feel
inclined
to 'beef up' part of their Piet design because to them it just didn't look
strong enough, but
in the end they are just increasing their empty weight and decreasing
performance.
Bernard Pietenpol did not do widespread advertising of his design when the
GN-1 plans became
available...and many who saw the ad's which read GN-1 Aircamper where logically
led to think
that they were ordering plans or information for a Pietenpol Air Camper.
Another reason so many GN-1 plans are out there is because they are dirt cheap,
but
comparatively speaking the price of Pietenpol plans when compared to other
designs on the
market are still a good bargain.
There are some factions in the Piet/GN-1 world that tend to poke fun at each
other, sometimes
in jest, sometimes serious, but those of us who are in it for fun just think
they need to get a life.
Even within the Pietenpol enthusiast's world you will find those who think that
the only Pietenpol
is a so called 'original' Pietenpol complete with a Model A Ford engine and a
tailskid and no brakes.
True that this was the first Pietenpol design, but not the last. To Bernard
Pietenpol he merely had
a first design and a twenty-sixth design...YES, he built 26 of these wonderful
airplanes and not one
was like the other. He experimented with Model T, Model A, Corvair,
Continental, Lycoming, Velie,
and many other engines over the years. Believe it or not Pietepol even built
and flew one with
a radio, brakes, and tailwheel !! I'm sure that if Bernard were around today
he would be pleased to
see Subaru's, Fiesta, and other engines now making his design more accessible
and affordable for
all to have fun with.
Mike C.
Could someone please tell me the differance between the Pietenpol
Air
Camper, the GN-1 Air Camper, and the St. Croix Aircamper?
Bill
Bill- Let me start by saying that both the GN-1 and Pietenpol are
FUN, FUN,
open cockpit airplanes, however there are differences you should be aware
of
before building.
The Pietenpol was designed in the 1930's, the GN-1 in the 60's. The
GN-1 uses
some Cub parts to speed up completion time but as we know today these
parts
are more expensive and less abundant. The Pietenpol wing fittings
allow the wing to be moved forward
and backward to accommodate various engines, fuel tank locations, etc.
where the
GN-1 has a 'fixed' position wing. If your CG turns out to be
incorrect on the GN-1 you
need to either change the motor mount length or add ballast...on the Piet
you make
adjustments to the wing fore and aft position to make the CG fall where
you need it to.
Piets generally have lighter empty weights and require lower horsepower
as a result.
Most GN-1's have more than 65 Continentals on them, but not all....Ted
Brousseau
has a nice GN-1 that he flies with a 65.....and just got done doing a
3,300 mile cross-
country. The GN-1's have more metal fittings to fabricate and the
parts appear to be
more stout than may be necessary. Likewise though, many Piet
builders feel inclined
to 'beef up' part of their Piet design because to them it just didn't
look strong enough, but
in the end they are just increasing their empty weight and decreasing
performance.
Bernard Pietenpol did not do widespread advertising of his design
when the GN-1 plans became
available...and many who saw the ad's which read GN-1 Aircamper where
logically led to think
that they were ordering plans or information for a Pietenpol Air
Camper.
Another reason so many GN-1 plans are out there is because they are dirt
cheap, but
comparatively speaking the price of Pietenpol plans when compared to
other designs on the
market are still a good bargain.
There are some factions in the Piet/GN-1 world that tend to
poke fun at each other, sometimes
in jest, sometimes serious, but those of us who are in it for fun just
think they need to get a life.
Even within the Pietenpol enthusiast's world you will find those who
think that the only Pietenpol
is a so called 'original' Pietenpol complete with a Model A Ford engine
and a tailskid and no brakes.
True that this was the first Pietenpol design, but not the
last. To Bernard Pietenpol he merely had
a first design and a twenty-sixth design...YES, he built 26 of
these wonderful airplanes and not one
was like the other. He experimented with Model T, Model A, Corvair,
Continental, Lycoming, Velie,
and many other engines over the years. Believe it or not Pietepol
even built and flew one with
a radio, brakes, and tailwheel !! I'm sure that if Bernard
were around today he would be pleased to
see Subaru's, Fiesta, and other engines now making his design more
accessible and affordable for
all to have fun with.
Mike C.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | John Weikel <jandd(at)maverickbbs.com> |
John,
I was just out at the Flying RV yesterday evening. I will probably run into
you guys out there sooner or later. I'm anxious to look your plane over.
John W
-----Original Message-----
From: nle97(at)juno.com <nle97(at)juno.com>
Date: Tuesday, August 17, 1999 12:16 AM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Houston
>John,
>Our Piet project is at the Flying RV Ranch. My partners are Rodger Childs
>of Bandera and Dock Dixon of Comfort and we've been working on the
>project quite a bit after a long layoff. Give me a call sometime and meet
>us there when we're working on the plane. Rodger and I have wierd
>schedules so we're there at the usual hours.
>
>John Langston
>Pipe Creek, TX
>(830) 510-4641
>
>writes:
>>John,
>>Is your Piet project the one that's at Flying RV Ranch? I have a
>>RW-6
>>RagWing Parasol that I built there and am giving some thought to
>>building a
>>Piet for my next project.
>>John W
>>RW-6
>>KR-2S
>>Kerrville, Tx
>>jandd(at)maverickbbs.com
>>
>>-----Original Message-----
>>From: nle97(at)juno.com <nle97(at)juno.com>
>>To: Pietenpol Discussion
>>Date: Sunday, August 15, 1999 1:35 AM
>>Subject: Re: Houston
>>
>>
>>>James,
>>>I and two partners are building a Model A powered Piet in Comfort,
>>Texas
>>>which is about 40 miles north of San Antonio along IH-10. While this
>>is
>>>not too close to Houston you are certainly welcome to come and see
>>our
>>>project. The fuselage is more or less done and on its gear. The
>>empennage
>>>is done and we've made good progress on the wing lately. If you wish
>>to
>>>make a four hour trip to see it, my E-mail address is nle97(at)juno.com
>>and
>>>my phone is (830) 510-4641.
>>>Sincerely,
>>>John Langston
>>>
>>> writes:
>>>>Hello, I'm considering building an aircamper. Is there anyone in
>>the
>>>>Houston, TX area that has built one or is in the process of
>>building
>>>>one?
>>>>
>>>>If so, I would like to see one in person.
>>>>
>>>>Thanks,
>>>>
>>>>James McFarland
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | fishin <fishin(at)wwa.com> |
John---to ease your return in the pilots seat, listen to my very similar
recent experience....had'nt flown in 20 years, am 1 1/2 years into building
my A65 powered Piet and decided it was time to get back in the saddle. had
flown 150s, 172s, 140s & Aeronce Chief...last month started back with 2 one
sessions dual after which my instructor said "see, I told you it was like
ridding a bike, let's not waste any more time and get your biannual done."
well 1 1/2 hrs in the class and one more hour dual and I was signed off and
back in the saddle again..2 weeks later my medical was passed. I'm off this
am to shoot some landings.
JoeC
Zion, Illinois
ps---(I'm 61 years young)
nle97(at)juno.com wrote:
> John,
> I'd be glad to help in any way I can. Just let me know what you need, or
> better yet, come see our project. I've made a photo album of each step of
> our progress and this will probably help you as much as anything.
> I started flying in 1960, but my last solo was in Jan. 1966. Nearly all
> my time is in taildraggers, mostly J-3's and Cessna 140's and I'm sure
> getting anxious to complete this plane and start flying again. I've
> already made arrangements for some dual to get checked out again as we
> near completion. We'll also have someone more competent test fly the
> plane for us.
> John Langston
> Pipe Creek, TX
> (830) 510-4641
>
> >John
> >You sure live in a great place to own a Piet. I have been there many
> >times,
> >(during my motorcycle days) before & after the big flood. When you
> >get a
> >chance, e-mail me your suggestions as to "getting started". I have
> >been an
> >airplane nut for over 50 years & FINALLY got my ticket on my 64
> >birthday. It
> >was even more thrilling than I had dreamed about all those years.
> >Thanks in
> >advance, for any help.
> >
> >John Davis (713) 777-2954 e-mail: TxTdragger
>
> __________
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | John Greenlee <jgreenlee(at)morgan.net> |
John,
Thanks for the reply. I tried to look you up as I would any Piet builder I
found myself in the vicinity of. You know how I hate to talk
airplanes.......
Sounds like you are coming along. I lack 6 days making 7 years on my 3 year
project. I need to paint the last of the sheet metal and put some finish
coats on some metal pieces. Then we will start final assembly.
JMG
-----Original Message-----
From: nle97(at)juno.com <nle97(at)juno.com>
Date: Tuesday, August 17, 1999 12:17 AM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Houston
>John,
>I do live in Pipe Creek and have lived here for 19 years. I'm kind of
>curious of why you were looking for me.
>Our project is really moving along, finally. The fuselage and empennage
>are basically complete and the plane is standing on its gear. We are now
>in the process of making the wing, which will be one piece. We have
>spliced the spars, cut to size, routed the spars, and have installed the
>ribs. Our goal is to be done by the end of next summer, but we are
>currently approaching 8 years of our intended 18 month project.
>I'd like to hear from you,
>John Langston
>(830) 510-4641
>
>writes:
>>John,
>>
>>Are you the guy that used to live at Pipe Creek? If so, I tried
>>looking you
>>up several years ago when I was down around Bandera or so.
>>
>>How far along are you?
>>
>>JMG
>>-----Original Message-----
>>From: nle97(at)juno.com <nle97(at)juno.com>
>>To: Pietenpol Discussion
>>Date: Sunday, August 15, 1999 1:36 AM
>>Subject: Re: Houston
>>
>>
>>>James,
>>>I and two partners are building a Model A powered Piet in Comfort,
>>Texas
>>>which is about 40 miles north of San Antonio along IH-10. While this
>>is
>>>not too close to Houston you are certainly welcome to come and see
>>our
>>>project. The fuselage is more or less done and on its gear. The
>>empennage
>>>is done and we've made good progress on the wing lately. If you wish
>>to
>>>make a four hour trip to see it, my E-mail address is nle97(at)juno.com
>>and
>>>my phone is (830) 510-4641.
>>>Sincerely,
>>>John Langston
>>>
>>> writes:
>>>>Hello, I'm considering building an aircamper. Is there anyone in
>>the
>>>>Houston, TX area that has built one or is in the process of
>>building
>>>>one?
>>>>
>>>>If so, I would like to see one in person.
>>>>
>>>>Thanks,
>>>>
>>>>James McFarland
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | william hutson <wihutson(at)yahoo.com> |
Michael,
Thank you so much for your response. The information you provided
has helped alot.
Bill
--- Michael D Cuy wrote:
> >Could someone please tell me the differance between
> the Pietenpol Air
> >Camper, the GN-1 Air Camper, and the St. Croix
> Aircamper?
> >
> >
> >Bill
>
>
> Bill- Let me start by saying that both the GN-1 and
> Pietenpol are FUN, FUN,
> open cockpit airplanes, however there are
> differences you should be aware of
> before building.
>
> The Pietenpol was designed in the 1930's, the GN-1
> in the 60's. The GN-1 uses
> some Cub parts to speed up completion time but as we
> know today these parts
> are more expensive and less abundant. The Pietenpol
> wing fittings allow the
> wing to be moved forward
> and backward to accommodate various engines, fuel
> tank locations, etc. where
> the
> GN-1 has a 'fixed' position wing. If your CG turns
> out to be incorrect on the
> GN-1 you
> need to either change the motor mount length or add
> ballast...on the Piet you
> make
> adjustments to the wing fore and aft position to
> make the CG fall where you
> need it to.
> Piets generally have lighter empty weights and
> require lower horsepower as a
> result.
> Most GN-1's have more than 65 Continentals on them,
> but not all....Ted
> Brousseau
> has a nice GN-1 that he flies with a 65.....and just
> got done doing a 3,300
> mile cross-
> country. The GN-1's have more metal fittings to
> fabricate and the parts appear
> to be
> more stout than may be necessary. Likewise though,
> many Piet builders feel
> inclined
> to 'beef up' part of their Piet design because to
> them it just didn't look
> strong enough, but
> in the end they are just increasing their empty
> weight and decreasing
> performance.
> Bernard Pietenpol did not do widespread advertising
> of his design when the
> GN-1 plans became
> available...and many who saw the ad's which read
> GN-1 Aircamper where logically
> led to think
> that they were ordering plans or information for a
> Pietenpol Air Camper.
> Another reason so many GN-1 plans are out there is
> because they are dirt cheap,
> but
> comparatively speaking the price of Pietenpol plans
> when compared to other
> designs on the
> market are still a good bargain.
> There are some factions in the Piet/GN-1 world
> that tend to poke fun at each
> other, sometimes
> in jest, sometimes serious, but those of us who are
> in it for fun just think
> they need to get a life.
> Even within the Pietenpol enthusiast's world you
> will find those who think that
> the only Pietenpol
> is a so called 'original' Pietenpol complete with a
> Model A Ford engine and a
> tailskid and no brakes.
> True that this was the first Pietenpol design, but
> not the last. To Bernard
> Pietenpol he merely had
> a first design and a twenty-sixth design...YES, he
> built 26 of these wonderful
> airplanes and not one
> was like the other. He experimented with Model T,
> Model A, Corvair,
> Continental, Lycoming, Velie,
> and many other engines over the years. Believe it
> or not Pietepol even built
> and flew one with
> a radio, brakes, and tailwheel !! I'm sure that if
> Bernard were around today
> he would be pleased to
> see Subaru's, Fiesta, and other engines now making
> his design more accessible
> and affordable for
> all to have fun with.
>
> Mike C.
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | william hutson <wihutson(at)yahoo.com> |
Earl,
Thank you for the info. It has helped clear up my confusion.
Bill
--- Earl Myers wrote:
> Bill;
> The St. Croix issue is a fella in Iowa that makes
> props. He has built 2 or
> 3 Air Campers and a Scout. He sells wood kits for
> Piets as well as plans I
> guess. The name St. Croix Aircamper is new to me
> unless it is just as above.
> The GN-1 and Air Camper are two TOTALLY different
> airplanes that share very
> similar appearances from a bit of a distance. Some
> of the other guys will no
> doubt tell you the differances as a lot of them have
> GN-1s........
> Earl Myers
> -----Original Message-----
> From: william hutson <wihutson(at)yahoo.com>
> To: Pietenpol Discussion
> Date: Monday, August 16, 1999 9:51 PM
> Subject: Confused
>
>
> >Could someone please tell me the differance between
> the Pietenpol Air
> >Camper, the GN-1 Air Camper, and the St. Croix
> Aircamper?
> >
> >
> >Bill
> >
> >
> >Get your free @yahoo.com address at
> http://mail.yahoo.com
> >
> >
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
re: various plans
Don Pietenpol = Orin Hoopman plans (considered "THE SOURCE" for original and
supported (meaning supplemental plans, handbook, etc) Genuine PIETENPOL Air
Camper plans)
GN-1 = John Grega's Pietenpol look-a-like often mistaken for Genuine
"Pietenpol Air Camper" Aircamper.
St. Croix = Orin Hoopman plans. without support or supplement, "to the best
of my knowledge plagiarized the out of copyright 1933 plans set." I'm not
sure if they even sell them anymore with the resurgence of interest in the
design.
My suggestion is to buy and build from the Pietenpol family plans found at
www.pietenpol.com. I agree wholeheartedly with Mike Cuy's assessment of the
many versions flying however, and have found that flying either or any of
the above versions has very little to do with the personality of the various
pilots. :) better make that a double :)).
Steve Eldredge
Steve(at)byu.edu
> -----Original Message-----
> william hutson
> Sent: Monday, August 16, 1999 7:50 PM
> To: Pietenpol Discussion
> Subject: Confused
>
>
> Could someone please tell me the differance between the Pietenpol Air
> Camper, the GN-1 Air Camper, and the St. Croix Aircamper?
>
>
> Bill
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Greg Yotz <gyachts(at)kans.com> |
| Subject: | Re: unique corvair |
I didn't think you could direct drive the Corvair. You can a VW but thats
because it reaches it's full hp production at much lower RPMs than the
Corvair.
If you directly coupled the prop to the Corvair the diameter of the prop
would be to small. You have to size the thrust disk diameter (ie, prop) so
the prop tips wouldn't break the sound barrier. Then design the picth
according to the hp and torch produced by the engine.
Unless someone has figure a modification to the Corvair to make it produce
it's max hp at 2600 rpms or so.
GY
-----Original Message-----
From: ToySat(at)aol.com <ToySat(at)aol.com>
Date: Monday, August 16, 1999 4:01 PM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: unique corvair
>Has anyone used a corvair with direct coupling to the out-put shaft?
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | RE: GN-1 Cabanes |
Steve,
please use a last name or city or something to identify yourself. I am
getting confused about my, I mean your posts....
Thanks,
Stevee, stevee, steve E. or,
Steve Eldredge
IT Services
Brigham Young University
> -----Original Message-----
> Replicraft(at)aol.com
> Sent: Monday, August 16, 1999 6:59 PM
> To: Pietenpol Discussion
> Subject: Re: GN-1 Cabanes
>
>
> Ted-
> As far as I know, the Cabane struts on the GN-1 are equal
> front and rear. The
> Pietenpol struts are 1" shorter ...
> The weight and balance could be your problem....try a 50 lb.
> weight in the
> front seat while flying solo.
>
> Steve
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Greg Yotz <gyachts(at)kans.com> |
| Subject: | Re: 'Plane Crazy" |
Thanks Ken. I'll watch then pass it on.
I found an article about it in an old Kitplane mag from last year. The guy
who starred in the video has built 2 or 3 other planes. Though he said it
took him 18 months on average to build the other aircraft. I guess the
presure of building in 30 days was to much.
GY
-----Original Message-----
From: Ken Hannan <khannan(at)gte.net>
Date: Monday, August 16, 1999 5:25 PM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: 'Plane Crazy"
>Greg The video will go out UPS from California tomorrow
>you my keep and pass it on, I do not need it back, one time was enough.
>
>Thanks Ken
>----- Original Message -----
>From: Greg Yotz <gyachts(at)kans.com>
>To: Pietenpol Discussion
>Sent: Monday, August 16, 1999 3:17 PM
>Subject: Re: 'Plane Crazy"
>
>
>> Fine with me if it's ok with Ken.
>>
>> GY
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: Gordon Brimhall
>> To: Pietenpol Discussion
>> Date: Monday, August 16, 1999 4:45 PM
>> Subject: Re: 'Plane Crazy"
>>
>>
>> >Greg
>> >
>> >Can you pass that to me when you get done with it, I been trying to find
>it
>> for
>> >a year now.
>> >
>> >If Ken doesn't mind.
>> >
>> >Gordon
>> >
>>
>>
>>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
St. Croix still advertises in Kitplane.
GN-1 is not a Pietenpol, An Apple is not a orange.
I'm building a UL Piet by Ragwing, If you call a GN-1 a Pietenpol I can call my
Ragwing a Pietenpol also.
I will build a real Pietenpol at some point in time with plans from Don
Pietenpol.But I could build it from plans in 1932 Flying and Gliding Manual.
I think a real piet with a Model "A" engine being towed behind a Model "A" to a
local Fly-In and being in the Dress of the Period would be a real blast.
I also ride a Harley not a Honda that tries to look like a Harley..
This is not ment to offend anybody but lets get the apples and oranges
seperated.
Thanks
Gordon
RW1 UL Piet
Mohawk MK IV EA-81
98 ElectraGlide
KB6IE
steve(at)byu.edu wrote:
> re: various plans
>
> Don Pietenpol = Orin Hoopman plans (considered "THE SOURCE" for original and
> supported (meaning supplemental plans, handbook, etc) Genuine PIETENPOL Air
> Camper plans)
>
> GN-1 = John Grega's Pietenpol look-a-like often mistaken for Genuine
> "Pietenpol Air Camper" Aircamper.
>
> St. Croix = Orin Hoopman plans. without support or supplement, "to the best
> of my knowledge plagiarized the out of copyright 1933 plans set." I'm not
> sure if they even sell them anymore with the resurgence of interest in the
> design.
>
> My suggestion is to buy and build from the Pietenpol family plans found at
> www.pietenpol.com. I agree wholeheartedly with Mike Cuy's assessment of the
> many versions flying however, and have found that flying either or any of
> the above versions has very little to do with the personality of the various
> pilots. :) better make that a double :)).
>
> Steve Eldredge
> Steve(at)byu.edu
>
> > -----Original Message-----
> > william hutson
> > Sent: Monday, August 16, 1999 7:50 PM
> > To: Pietenpol Discussion
> > Subject: Confused
> >
> >
> > Could someone please tell me the differance between the Pietenpol Air
> > Camper, the GN-1 Air Camper, and the St. Croix Aircamper?
> >
> >
> > Bill
> >
> >
> >
> >
________________________________________________________________________________
Thats great.
Iv'e only flown and never got my Cert. took a different fork in the road 25 yrs
ago after taking all the courses up thru advanced simulater, comm, and
everything else, now hitting the books again to start over. I didn't know you
could have a Pilots Cert still after all these years and just have to get
signed off. Good Deal. I still have a chance at age 57
Gordon
fishin wrote:
> John---to ease your return in the pilots seat, listen to my very similar
> recent experience....had'nt flown in 20 years, am 1 1/2 years into building
> my A65 powered Piet and decided it was time to get back in the saddle. had
> flown 150s, 172s, 140s & Aeronce Chief...last month started back with 2 one
> sessions dual after which my instructor said "see, I told you it was like
> ridding a bike, let's not waste any more time and get your biannual done."
> well 1 1/2 hrs in the class and one more hour dual and I was signed off and
> back in the saddle again..2 weeks later my medical was passed. I'm off this
> am to shoot some landings.
> JoeC
> Zion, Illinois
> ps---(I'm 61 years young)
>
> nle97(at)juno.com wrote:
>
> > John,
> > I'd be glad to help in any way I can. Just let me know what you need, or
> > better yet, come see our project. I've made a photo album of each step of
> > our progress and this will probably help you as much as anything.
> > I started flying in 1960, but my last solo was in Jan. 1966. Nearly all
> > my time is in taildraggers, mostly J-3's and Cessna 140's and I'm sure
> > getting anxious to complete this plane and start flying again. I've
> > already made arrangements for some dual to get checked out again as we
> > near completion. We'll also have someone more competent test fly the
> > plane for us.
> > John Langston
> > Pipe Creek, TX
> > (830) 510-4641
> >
> > >John
> > >You sure live in a great place to own a Piet. I have been there many
> > >times,
> > >(during my motorcycle days) before & after the big flood. When you
> > >get a
> > >chance, e-mail me your suggestions as to "getting started". I have
> > >been an
> > >airplane nut for over 50 years & FINALLY got my ticket on my 64
> > >birthday. It
> > >was even more thrilling than I had dreamed about all those years.
> > >Thanks in
> > >advance, for any help.
> > >
> > >John Davis (713) 777-2954 e-mail: TxTdragger
> >
> > __________
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | LaurenMWilliams(at)webtv.net (Lauren Williams) |
| Subject: | Re: unique corvair |
B.H. Pietenpol's corvair conversion is direct drive. Check out the
conversion plans, still available from Don Pietenpol.
Lauren
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Michael King <mikek(at)nstar.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Continental engines |
I believe Continental made an A-80 as well.
At least that is what on my GN-1. The A-80
also does not support an electrical starter.
Mike King
GN-1
Dallas, Texas
>Continental made 65, 70, 75, 85, 90, and 100 hp engines, all basically
>alike. The 85 hp and up usually had electrical systems.
>
>>I've decided to build an AirCamper and I want to be able to use a
>>Continental
>>engine. Can anyone tell me where I should first start looking for
>>Continental engines. I looked up the Teledyne Continental web page
>>but there
>>was nothing on the specific engines that they manufacture. I know
>>they
>>manufactured a 65 hp but did they also make an 85 hp? If anyone has
>>built an
>>AirCamper with this engine, can you give me some advice as to where to
>>get
>>started, cost, problems, etc.?
>>
>>Thank You,
>>Jacob
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Marvin L. Stovall" |
unsubscribe
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Davis, Marc" <marc.davis(at)intel.com> |
| Subject: | FW: unique corvair |
I think with the Corvair engine on a Piet there is more power available than
is needed. Because of this you can afford to throw some away. By using a
prop that limits engine speed to 2600 RPM you lose some of the potential HP
of the engine but you still have plenty. With a reduction you could get
more power from the engine .
Marc
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
------------------------------------------------------
I didn't think you could direct drive the Corvair. You can a VW but thats
because it reaches it's full hp production at much lower RPMs than the
Corvair.
If you directly coupled the prop to the Corvair the diameter of the prop
would be to small. You have to size the thrust disk diameter (ie, prop) so
the prop tips wouldn't break the sound barrier. Then design the picth
according to the hp and torch produced by the engine. Unless someone has
figure a modification to the Corvair to make it produce it's max hp at 2600
rpms or so.
GY
-----Original Message-----
>Has anyone used a corvair with direct coupling to the out-put
shaft?
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Greg Yotz <gyachts(at)kans.com> |
| Subject: | Re: unique corvair |
That makes since. I wonder what the horsepower/torque is being put out at
this RPM on a direct drive unit?
I started to build around a Corvair but just came upon a Model A engine and
now I'll
probably us it instead.
GY
-----Original Message-----
From: Davis, Marc <marc.davis(at)intel.com>
Date: Tuesday, August 17, 1999 10:15 AM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: FW: unique corvair
>
>
>I think with the Corvair engine on a Piet there is more power available
than
>is needed. Because of this you can afford to throw some away. By using a
>prop that limits engine speed to 2600 RPM you lose some of the potential HP
>of the engine but you still have plenty. With a reduction you could get
>more power from the engine .
>Marc
>
>---------------------------------------------------------------------------
-
>------------------------------------------------------
>I didn't think you could direct drive the Corvair. You can a VW but thats
>because it reaches it's full hp production at much lower RPMs than the
>Corvair.
>If you directly coupled the prop to the Corvair the diameter of the prop
>would be to small. You have to size the thrust disk diameter (ie, prop) so
>the prop tips wouldn't break the sound barrier. Then design the picth
>according to the hp and torch produced by the engine. Unless someone has
>figure a modification to the Corvair to make it produce it's max hp at 2600
>rpms or so.
>
>GY
>
>-----Original Message-----
>
>
> >Has anyone used a corvair with direct coupling to the out-put
>shaft?
> >
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | tim moosey <mooset(at)flash.net> |
unsuscribe
-----Original Message-----
From: Marvin L. Stovall
Date: Tuesday, August 17, 1999 10:30 AM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: unsubscribe
>unsubscribe
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | mboynton(at)excite.com |
| Subject: | Re: Fw: unique corvair |
Walt,
I have Lars Nelson's (the proprietor of Vertical Systems) address and phone
number. The last time I checked, his web site was not active.
Unfortunately, I don't have the information with me right now, but I'll get
it to you tomorrow.
Mark
> Mark,
> This is the same person. His first corvair is on Bob 's Piet and the
> second on the experimental in the photo.
> Some of the pics show a casting before and after modification.
> walt
> ps. Just yesterday Dick asked me to email the co. Vertical systems thru a
> site address on their casting, but it got sent back. Do you have an
address
> for them ( email or postal?)
> thanks again...walt
> -----Original Message-----
> From: mboynton(at)excite.com <mboynton(at)excite.com>
> To: wbeevans(at)worldnet.att.net
> Date: Monday, August 16, 1999 5:52 PM
> Subject: Re: unique corvair
>
>
> >Walt:
> >
> >Interesting pic's you posted on the Piet discussion group about the
> >gentleman in Sussex and the Corvair redrive. I too am planning a
Corvair
> >conversion with a redrive - I've purchased plans from Vertical Systems
for
> >the Rinker redrive.
> >
> >Can you give me any information about how to get ahold of the guy in
> Sussex.
> >I'd sure like to ask a few questions. At one point I was in touch with
Bob
> >Schiffel, also of Sussex, who worked with a guy who helped him with his
> >redrive. I wonder if its the same person.
> >
> >Mark Boynton
> >Gilbert, Arizona
> >
> >
> >>
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >_______
> >Get FREE voicemail, fax and email at http://voicemail.excite.com
> >Talk online at http://voicechat.excite.com
> >
>
_______
Get FREE voicemail, fax and email at http://voicemail.excite.com
Talk online at http://voicechat.excite.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Warren Shoun <wbnb(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | Vertical Systems |
The address for Lars Nelson / Vertical Systems
Vertical Systems
34 Paradise Road
Santa Barbara, Ca. 93105
e-mail: vertsys(at)west.net (this may not be working)
Lars is active with this only if you prod him a bit. The Type II Transporter
Mountain / Alpine gear assembly that you need for this is pretty hard to find
these days.
Cheers,
Warren.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | DonanClara(at)aol.com |
Bravo Mike Cuy!! You outlined the Piet/GN-1 situation beautifully. MIne will
be mostly original (with concessions to safety) but any GN-1 driver that
wants to park his bird next to mine will be every bit as welcome as if it
were a Wright Flyer!!!
Don Hicks .
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | TXTdragger(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: 'Plane Crazy" |
or his attempt to win Emmy
John D
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | robert hensarling <rhrocker(at)admin.hilconet.com> |
-----Original Message-----
From: DonanClara(at)aol.com <DonanClara(at)aol.com>
Date: Tuesday, August 17, 1999 4:31 PM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Confused
Thank you Don. I personally appreciate your comments, unlike some of the
other comments recently. However I vowed to keep to myself on this subject
long ago, so I'm back to the lurk mode.
Robert Hensarling GN-1 N83887
http://www.mesquite-furniture.com
rhrocker(at)admin.hilconet.com
Uvalde, Texas
>Bravo Mike Cuy!! You outlined the Piet/GN-1 situation beautifully. MIne
will
>be mostly original (with concessions to safety) but any GN-1 driver that
>wants to park his bird next to mine will be every bit as welcome as if it
>were a Wright Flyer!!!
>
>Don Hicks .
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | tmbrant <tmbrant(at)uswest.net> |
Has anyone ever considered a Mazda Rotary engine in the Piet? I know,
there are probably some of you ablout ready to have a heart attack with
the idea... I have read and researched quite a bit on these, cause I
was going to use one in a Bearhawk, but that project has been put on
hold for the Piet. They have excellent HP to weight ratios! it would
more thatn likely need prop speed reduction also. Just curious. I know
that many different engines have been used, and was curious to see if
this has been attempted before.
Tom Brant
Has anyone ever considered a Mazda
Rotary engine
in the Piet? I know, there are probably some of you ablout ready
to have a
heart attack with the idea... I have read and researched quite a
bit on
these, cause I was going to use one in a Bearhawk, but that project has
been put
on hold for the Piet. They have excellent HP to weight
ratios! it
would more thatn likely need prop speed reduction also. Just
curious. I know that many different engines have been used, and
was
curious to see if this has been attempted before.
Tom Brant
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Confused - Wright Flyer |
Speaking of the Wright Flyer.
Does anybody have plans out for it, like 3/4 scale or something?
2003 will be the 100th anniversary and Oshkosh will probably have a big deal
about it. I could see about 50 Wright Flyers doing a Fly-Over
Maybe a UL version would be nice.
Gordon
RW-1 UL Piet
Real Piet in planning "A" Engine
DonanClara(at)aol.com wrote:
> Bravo Mike Cuy!! You outlined the Piet/GN-1 situation beautifully. MIne will
> be mostly original (with concessions to safety) but any GN-1 driver that
> wants to park his bird next to mine will be every bit as welcome as if it
> were a Wright Flyer!!!
>
> Don Hicks .
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | tmbrant <tmbrant(at)uswest.net> |
I am interested in Hemlock to use on the Piet. Does anyone know of
where it may be found in any supply and quality? I live in Minnesota,
near Minneapolis.
Tom Brant
I am interested in Hemlock to use on
the
Piet. Does anyone know of where it may be found in any supply and
quality? I live in Minnesota, near Minneapolis.
Tom Brant
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | MACKORELL(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Continental Engines |
Before I get started on building my AirCamper I want to decide on a specific
engine. If the cost is not too high, I would like to use the 85 h.p.
Continental.
Can anyone tell me what an overhauled 85 hp Continental would roughly run?
Has the track record for this engine been good? Would I be able to overhaul
one myself? I believe someone already answered this but does the 85 have an
onboard starter? Also, is there an engine mount available for the AirCamper
to accept this engine? Has anyone used an O-200 on an AirCamper or would
this engine bring the C.G. too far out of range?
Jacob
Jacob
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Doug <ve6zh(at)oanet.com> |
| Subject: | Re: unique corvair |
My corvair is developing 340#+ lbs of thrust at 2600' @3000 rpm static,3
blade warpdrive 60 " prop.The c-85 powered champ with a 71 41 prop was
showing 362 # thrust.
Doug Hunt
> From: Greg Yotz <gyachts(at)kans.com>
> To: Pietenpol Discussion
> Subject: Re: unique corvair
> Date: Tuesday, August 17, 1999 8:35 AM
>
> I didn't think you could direct drive the Corvair. You can a VW but
thats
> because it reaches it's full hp production at much lower RPMs than the
> Corvair.
> If you directly coupled the prop to the Corvair the diameter of the prop
> would be to small. You have to size the thrust disk diameter (ie, prop)
so
> the prop tips wouldn't break the sound barrier. Then design the picth
> according to the hp and torch produced by the engine.
> Unless someone has figure a modification to the Corvair to make it
produce
> it's max hp at 2600 rpms or so.
>
>
> GY
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: ToySat(at)aol.com <ToySat(at)aol.com>
> To: Pietenpol Discussion
> Date: Monday, August 16, 1999 4:01 PM
> Subject: Re: unique corvair
>
>
> >Has anyone used a corvair with direct coupling to the out-put shaft?
> >
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | walter evans <wbeevans(at)worldnet.att.net> |
| Subject: | Fw: unique corvair |
My point was that you are putting out less than 85hp. My friend who
gears the corvairs, is trying to get more of the 110hp out.
walt
ps I think that the one he has now, the engine turns about 3800rpm and
he wants to gear it to run about 4300/4500rpm, more into the hp curve.
-----Original Message-----
From: Doug <ve6zh(at)oanet.com>
Date: Tuesday, August 17, 1999 8:45 PM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: unique corvair
My corvair is developing 340#+ lbs of thrust at 2600' @3000 rpm static,3
blade warpdrive 60 " prop.The c-85 powered champ with a 71 41 prop was
showing 362 # thrust.
Doug Hunt
> From: Greg Yotz <gyachts(at)kans.com>
> To: Pietenpol Discussion
> Subject: Re: unique corvair
> Date: Tuesday, August 17, 1999 8:35 AM
>
> I didn't think you could direct drive the Corvair. You can a VW but
thats
> because it reaches it's full hp production at much lower RPMs than the
> Corvair.
> If you directly coupled the prop to the Corvair the diameter of the
prop
> would be to small. You have to size the thrust disk diameter (ie,
prop) so
> the prop tips wouldn't break the sound barrier. Then design the picth
> according to the hp and torch produced by the engine.
> Unless someone has figure a modification to the Corvair to make it
produce
> it's max hp at 2600 rpms or so.
>
>
> GY
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: ToySat(at)aol.com <ToySat(at)aol.com>
> To: Pietenpol Discussion
> Date: Monday, August 16, 1999 4:01 PM
> Subject: Re: unique corvair
>
>
> >Has anyone used a corvair with direct coupling to the out-put shaft?
> >
>
My point was that you are putting
out less than
85hp. My friend who gears the corvairs, is trying to get
more of the
110hp out.
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Hinge points for split axle gear |
Ted,
I will be ordering plans from Don this week, however, I was not aware of
a builders manual. Do you know the cost? Thanx, Brian Sanders
-----Original Message-----
From: Theodore Trevorrow <TJTREV(at)webtv.net>
Date: Saturday, August 14, 1999 1:16 PM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Hinge points for split axle gear
Buy from Don. He also has a very interesting builders manual.
Ted.T
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | TJTREV(at)webtv.net (Theodore Trevorrow) |
Brian
When I bought the manual it was $19.95 + $2.90 s&h . It's probably
about the same .
I would also recommend joining the Buckeye Pietenpol Ass. and get as
many of the back issues of the news letters as you can. There is an
enormous amount of info to be had there.
Ted.T
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Ted Brousseau <nfn00979(at)naples.net> |
| Subject: | RE: Home from OSH - Finally!! |
Steve,
I landed at my father's grass strip and visited (another way of saying I
worked the aches out of my butt) for a couple of days. My uncle loves
garage sales to look for wood working tools. I walked into this garage and
to my amazement, between the plywood on sawhorse tables covered with
glasses, etc., was a partially built Piet on her gear with a price tag on her.
Then, in North Carolina I landed at an airport and a fellow came up to find
the Piet that had landed. It seems he was building one. He had just
retired next to the field. I went over the next morning to see his project
... that he had started when he was in high school.
I have more stories, but I won't bore the group. Suffice it to say that
when you fly a Piet cross country you have lots of opportunity to meet lots
of interesting people.
Ted
>HOW did you get to a garage sale in MI? I thought you were landing at
>airports?
>
>
>Steve Eldredge
>IT Services
>Brigham Young University
>
>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> Wkoucky(at)aol.com
>> Sent: Wednesday, August 11, 1999 1:45 PM
>> To: Pietenpol Discussion
>> Subject: Re: Home from OSH - Finally!!
>>
>>
>>
>> << Greatest discovery: A partially built Pietenpol at a
>> garage sale in
>> Michigan!! >>
>>
>> Where in Michigan?
>>
>> William Koucky
>> Traverse City, MI
>>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | TJTREV(at)webtv.net (Theodore Trevorrow) |
Walt
I'm interested in what your friends prediction are for the life of that
engine . I had a couple of corvairs back in the 60's. And your right the
peak h.p. is in the mid 4000's. But the engine is by no means designed
to run in that range for extended periods of time.
Its an interesting experiment I guess thats why they call them
experimental.
People build Piets because there cute, or because there kind of
nostalgic, some because they are a relatively inexpensive way to get to
fly. I'm concerned that someone new to Piets will get the idea that they
must have a reduction to get their corvairs to fly. Which has been
proven repeatedly not to be the case. I personally have trouble with the
cost of a reduction unit on a 70 mph wooden airplane.
I used to race sprint cars and I understand the need for more
performance. It's genetic I think.
In fact I know of a 500 C.I. Warner radial being built for a Piet now .
But I've kind been sworn to secrecy. Ted.T
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | BARNSTMR(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: 1st Annual Pietenpol Fly-In |
In a message dated 8/14/99 1:18:14 AM Central Daylight Time, Rcaprd(at)aol.com
writes:
<< Announcing the 1st annual Pietenpol Fly-In, at Benton Airport on Sept
11,
1999. Benton KS is about 10 miles northeast of Wichita KS. >>
Hi Group,
I've been a passive discussion group participant up to now. Enjoying all
of the Pietenpol stories and sharing of information. I was surprized to find
out that you guys have planned a Pietenpol event right here in Wichita. I
plan to be there for sure. I have been wanting to build an Air Camper for a
long time. I have been in the Wichita area since early 1997. I don't know
many old airplane people in the area as I have not been in Wichita that
long...and just haven't made the rounds. But I have been around old
airplanes all of my life. (I'm 35)
About 10 years ago, I built a rib jig and even made a few ribs using some
really nice douglas fir before I was looking at the trailing edge brace one
day and began to question why the Flying/Glider manual had the brace laid out
(in what seemed to me) to be the wrong direction. That year I saw Orrin
Hoopman at Blakesburg and asked him about it. He told the story of how
Bernie had learned of that design flaw upon recovery from a tight turn
maneuver on one of his first planes. I guess there was a loud "Snap" as 7
or 8 ribs gave in to wing twist. Apparently they repaired the damage and got
the plane going again the following day. The 1933 plans I bought from Orrin
have the corrected brace plus several other BP improvements.
I fixed my jig and developed myself a good device for steaming rib
caps....but never got a beyond that before we started our family (7 yrs ago).
Since then, tho...I have recently divorced. Now I have my hands full as a
single dad raising my 3 kids on my own. But with my ex out of the picture
now.... I can see an airplane is in my future. I have a 50 hp Franklin
stored at my dads place in TX....but I hope to come across a better engine
option by the time I get started.
In 1995 or so I got a chance to fly a Corvair Piet then owned by Alex
Whitmore. I loved it. (Wish I knew where it is now.) Alex even allowed
me to take my 4 yr old boy along as a front pit passenger. It was his first
open cockpit flight. I wanted to buy it so bad, but just couldn't swing the
cash at the time. Alex had repaired the fuselage after someone had cracked
it up....and was reselling it. I don't remember the reg. no...but have it in
my logbook. Alex told me the name of the original builder...but I can't
remember his name. I was under the impression that he had been a well known
Piet builder. (I sound like an old man who's already lost his memory....but
I do remember learning a lot on that flight.)
1) Fore and aft stick movements should be opposite and proportional to
throttle movements. If you pull power back on a Pietenpol....your speed
really dies out quick.....so you might as well shove the stick forward and be
ready.
2) Corvair (direct drive) Piets climb a lot better with about half to two
thirds throttle. The tach was not working the day I flew it but after making
3 takeoffs with full throttle and wondering...Why isn't this beast climbing
any better?....I decided to try a different technique on the 4th take off.
After I got the tail up...I eased the throttle back and then suddenly the
thing leaped into the air about 200 feet sooner than all of the previous
times. Climb out was about like a 65 hp Champ then.
3) If you have the CG right and the right gear and tires...you can 3 point
every landing and not bounce too bad. At least that was the case with the
split axle gear with J-3 type wheels/tires. Wing placement seemed to be
about perfect.
4) Who needs brakes?
5) Finally...I learned that I really missed out on a fun machine by not
grabbing that airplane. (And Alex sure priced it right too.) Sigh..
I have two friends from work who are planning to attend the fly-in with
their A-Fords. (I work at Learjet as a powerplant and fuel system's engineer
.) Also...Rod Hoctor (one of our test pilots who keeps his airplanes at
Benton) is planning to have his Stearman set up for hopping passengers for
that day. Let's cross our fingers for good weather. I am looking forward to
Sept. 11th in Benton.
Terry B.
________________________________________________________________________________
Has anyone used a VW engine in a Sky Scout? I have seen one in a Pober Pixie
which is about the same size.
DG
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Marias57(at)aol.com |
unsubscribe
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: 1st Annual Pietenpol Fly-In |
Hello Pietenpals,
I thought I might give ya'all an update on the progress of my wing, which I'm
building for an Air Camper (Model A). My living / dining room sure will look
alot different once the wing is moved out to Benton, where the fuselage is
eagerly waiting for it. I'm now in the varnish stage, and the fuel cell is
ready for closure. Next is covering, stitches, and paint. I've been
spending lots of time on it, trying to get it done in time for the Pietenpol
Fly-In at Benton. We are hoping to stir up some local interest in this
wonderful airplane, and maybe find some others who would like to build one.
Terry B.. (or anyone in the Wichita area) e-mail me directly, and I'll give
ya my phone and address, if ya would like to stop by, and check out the
framework before covering.
Chuck Gantzer
Wichita KS
ps I'm REALLY looking forward to flying this plane !!
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: unique corvair |
The engine puts out 110hp @ 4400rpm; But, the max torque is produced @
2800rpm,and is 160 lbs. The hp at this point is 85.3 if I got it right.
Should be one sweet engine.
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: unique corvair |
Doug Hunt: Where do you live? Ryder Olsen
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "David B. Schober" <dschober(at)mail.fscwv.edu> |
| Subject: | Re: Continental Engines |
Any of the Continental A or C series engines are good choices for a Piet. Forget
about a starter though. The added weight and addition of an electrical system
will add 10 to 16 lbs for a gen., 16 lbs for a starter, another 20 lbs for a
battery, wiring, switches . . . You will end up with a one place airplane with
poor performance. Hand proping is neither dificult or dangerous as long as you
know what you are doing. Get someone who knows and have them teach you. You will
be glad you did with the improved performance of an airplane about 50 lbs
lighter.
MACKORELL(at)aol.com wrote:
> Before I get started on building my AirCamper I want to decide on a specific
> engine. If the cost is not too high, I would like to use the 85 h.p.
> Continental.
> Can anyone tell me what an overhauled 85 hp Continental would roughly run?
> Has the track record for this engine been good? Would I be able to overhaul
> one myself? I believe someone already answered this but does the 85 have an
> onboard starter? Also, is there an engine mount available for the AirCamper
> to accept this engine? Has anyone used an O-200 on an AirCamper or would
> this engine bring the C.G. too far out of range?
>
> Jacob
>
> Jacob
--
David B.Schober, CPE
Instructor, Aviation Maintenance
Fairmont State College
National Aerospace Education Center
1050 East Benedum Industrial Drive
Bridgeport, WV 26330-9503
(304) 842-8300
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | tpippin <tpippin(at)accessunited.com> |
Please remove my name and address from your discussion list, because the number
of messages is clogging up my mailbox.
Thank you,
Tim Pippin
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | mbell1(at)columbiaenergygroup.com |
That's a great pic, and Steve was grinning like that everytime I saw him.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Ted Brousseau <nfn00979(at)naples.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Pietenpol engine mount |
Joe,
Did you build the mount or is it from another plane, like a Jenny? If you
put an 0-200 would it require even another mount or are all Continental
mounts the same?
Ted
I was so glad you could fly with me at Brodhead.
>true on the latter,,,D.P. does have plans available for the continental motor
>mount..this is the route I'm taking....mount now completed and installing
>controls and seat belt/harnesses and starting on the fuse fuel tank.
>JoeC
>Zion, Illinois
>
>Ted Brousseau wrote:
>
>> The Pietenpol I bought at the garage sale has a constructed fuselage. I
>> don't have the plans so I need to ask the following question.
>>
>> Is the fuselage built for a particular engine or are the different engines
>> handled through the construction of the motor mounts? From discussions I
>> have glanced at (I never expected to be a Piet builder) I would guess the
>> latter. True? I want to put a Continental on it.
>>
>> Thanks, Ted
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Ted Brousseau <nfn00979(at)naples.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Ted and the Mustang |
Mike,
That makes a good tale. But, as he says, here is the rest of the story.
I showed the first linesperson my bright yellow NORADO sign that we all had
jumped through hoops to get and he said, "just a minute. I need to find out
what that means". After he came back he told me to taxi out to the next set
of linespeople. I taxied out and dutifully flashed them my NORADO sign.
The young lady looked questionly and made a motion that I took to mean, "Do
you want to park over here?" I shook my head and pointed to the little
words that said NO RADIO. They stood there scratching there heads for a
minute and finally shrugged there shoulders and pointed to the runway that
seemed to mean, "get out of here". I taxied out and saw the P51 sitting in
front of me.
That is when I thought maybe I wasn't supposed to be there on that
particular runway. After he took off I figured I would just stay above his
wake and I took off. No big problem with his vortice but was I teed off
when that ultralight passed me 2 miles out....
Ted
>Guys- I have this neat photo I'll post next week of intrepid
>aviator Ted Brousseau from Naples, Florida taxiing out for
>takeoff at Oshkosh and in front of him was this camo painted
>P-51 Mustang !! I could just hear the tower now...."November
>thirty three Papa Papa you're number two behind the Mustang,
>cleared for takeoff......"
>
>MC
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Greg Yotz <gyachts(at)kans.com> |
| Subject: | Re: unique corvair |
What is a 'fair' price for a used Corvair engine that hasn't been rebuilt?
GY
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: unique corvair |
Greg Yotz wrote:
>
> What is a 'fair' price for a used Corvair engine that hasn't been rebuilt?
$100 - $300
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | John Weikel <jandd(at)maverickbbs.com> |
| Subject: | Re: unique corvair |
About $100 if it's rebuildable...
John W
-----Original Message-----
From: Greg Yotz <gyachts(at)kans.com>
Date: Wednesday, August 18, 1999 8:06 AM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: unique corvair
>What is a 'fair' price for a used Corvair engine that hasn't been rebuilt?
>
>
>GY
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | jmcnarry(at)techplus.com (John McNarry) |
| Subject: | Re: Confused by Mike C |
Thanks Mike
I really like being a part of this Pietenpol / GN-1 / Fun Airplane,
group when we all get along and share our experiences.
Thanks again for saying ity well
John Mc
There are some factions in the Piet/GN-1 world that tend to poke
fun at each other, sometimes
in jest, sometimes serious, but those of us who are in it for fun
just think they need to get a life.
Even within the Pietenpol enthusiast's world you will find those who
think that the only Pietenpol
is a so called 'original' Pietenpol complete with a Model A Ford
engine and a tailskid and no brakes.
True that this was the first Pietenpol design, but not the last. To
Bernard Pietenpol he merely had
a first design and a twenty-sixth design...YES, he built 26 of these
wonderful airplanes and not one
was like the other. He experimented with Model T, Model A, Corvair,
Continental, Lycoming, Velie,
and many other engines over the years. Believe it or not Pietepol
even built and flew one with
a radio, brakes, and tailwheel !! I'm sure that if Bernard were
around today he would be pleased to
see Subaru's, Fiesta, and other engines now making his design more
accessible and affordable for
all to have fun with.
Mike C.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Michael D Cuy <Michael.D.Cuy(at)lerc.nasa.gov> |
| Subject: | Re: Ted and the Mustang |
>Mike,
>
>That makes a good tale. But, as he says, here is the rest of the story.
>
>I showed the first linesperson my bright yellow NORADO sign that we all had
>jumped through hoops to get and he said, "just a minute. I need to find out
>what that means".
Ted- I know what you mean.....and here is what we should have told you before
leaving Osh but forgot to. You need to go to the flight briefing building
(was near by us)
and they give you a 5 minute overview of the departure procedures, then
give you
this pink card (which signifies that you have attended a briefing) and you
show that
card to the controllers. They don't know what to do with the no radio
guys usually
though with yellow cards, so I just hold up the pink one and they get that.
I had to borrow an handheld from EAA photo dept. to do some air to air
photography
over at New Holstien across Lake Winnebago and let me tell you...after I
was done
I came back to Osh via Fisk after the airhshow was over on Sunday and wow,
that was
wild. I was full throttle from Fisk to right over the runway at Osh. They
had me 'sidestep'
twice for faster traffic behind me (like an Aerostar) but what an organized
group.
Those guys can talk fast. All you do is wag your wings when they ask you to.
They don't want to hear you say anything....nor need to. It was a fun
experience.
I also had to go into Fon DuLac to wait out the airshow. Whew, I had not
used a radio
in at least 15 years...but it sure comes back quickly. The wind noise
though and
non-shielded ignition don't help.
(PS- Ted, you sure made that P-51's day when he saw a Piet was following
him out !)
Mike C.
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | RE: Ted and the Mustang |
Ahhhh! Check your six! You've got a piet on your tail! Good thing it wasnt'
the one at B-head that was armed!
Steve Eldredge
Steve(at)byu.edu
> (PS- Ted, you sure made that P-51's day when he saw a Piet
> was following
> him out !)
>
> Mike C.
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Confused by Mike C |
Ahon, yur a Saint!
-----Original Message-----
From: John McNarry <jmcnarry(at)techplus.com>
To: Pietenpol Discussion
Date: Wednesday, August 18, 1999 10:32 AM
Subject: Re: Confused by Mike C
Thanks Mike
I really like being a part of this Pietenpol / GN-1 / Fun
Airplane, group when we all get along and share our experiences.
Thanks again for saying ity well
John Mc
poke fun at each other, sometimes
in jest, sometimes serious, but those of us who are in it for
fun just think they need to get a life.
Even within the Pietenpol enthusiast's world you will find those
who think that the only Pietenpol
is a so called 'original' Pietenpol complete with a Model A Ford
engine and a tailskid and no brakes.
True that this was the first Pietenpol design, but not the last.
To Bernard Pietenpol he merely had
a first design and a twenty-sixth design...YES, he built 26 of
these wonderful airplanes and not one
was like the other. He experimented with Model T, Model A,
Corvair, Continental, Lycoming, Velie,
and many other engines over the years. Believe it or not
Pietepol even built and flew one with
a radio, brakes, and tailwheel !! I'm sure that if Bernard
were around today he would be pleased to
see Subaru's, Fiesta, and other engines now making his design
more accessible and affordable for
all to have fun with.
Mike C.
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Confused by Mike C |
You Piet/GN guys are just taking this too serous as I'm poking fun at
ya all and I don't even have a Pietenpol or a GN Wannabie Piet. I am
building a RW-1 UL Piet by Ragwing Aviation and I am in this group
along with a bunch of folks who are not building anything yet but have
dreams of building a Pietenpol I am sure.
If this was just a list for those with or building Barnards Piet half
of the people would have to leave, me included.
Were all having fun and if anybody with thin skin gets offended by my
words I am sorry because it is all in fun, I've done it before and I
will do it again.
I may build a real Piet with a Mohawk High Gross Wing so to take off
from my property.
Gordon
RW1 UL Piet
Mohawk MK IV
John McNarry wrote:
> Thanks Mike I really like being a part of this Pietenpol / GN-1 /
> Fun Airplane, group when we all get along and share our
> experiences.Thanks again for saying ity wellJohn Mc
>
>
> There are some factions in the Piet/GN-1 world that
> tend to poke fun at each other, sometimes
> in jest, sometimes serious, but those of us who are in it
> for fun just think they need to get a life.
> Even within the Pietenpol enthusiast's world you will find
> those who think that the only Pietenpol
> is a so called 'original' Pietenpol complete with a Model
> A Ford engine and a tailskid and no brakes.
> True that this was the first Pietenpol design, but not the
> last. To Bernard Pietenpol he merely had
> a first design and a twenty-sixth design...YES, he built
> 26 of these wonderful airplanes and not one
> was like the other. He experimented with Model T, Model
> A, Corvair, Continental, Lycoming, Velie,
> and many other engines over the years. Believe it or not
> Pietepol even built and flew one with
> a radio, brakes, and tailwheel !! I'm sure that if
> Bernard were around today he would be pleased to
> see Subaru's, Fiesta, and other engines now making his
> design more accessible and affordable for
> all to have fun with.
>
> Mike C.
>
You Piet/GN guys are just taking this too serous as I'm poking fun at ya
all and I don't even have a Pietenpol or a GN Wannabie Piet. I am building
a RW-1 UL Piet by Ragwing Aviation and I am in this group along with a
bunch of folks who are not building anything yet but have dreams of building
a Pietenpol I am sure.
If this was just a list for those with or building Barnards Piet half
of the people would have to leave, me included.
Were all having fun and if anybody with thin skin gets offended by my
words I am sorry because it is all in fun, I've done it before and I will
do it again.
I may build a real Piet with a Mohawk High Gross Wing so to take off
from my property.
Gordon
RW1 UL Piet
Mohawk MK IV
John McNarry wrote:
Thanks
Mike I really
like being a part of this Pietenpol / GN-1 / Fun Airplane, group when we
all get along and share our experiences.Thanks
again for saying ity wellJohn Mc
There are some factions in the Piet/GN-1 world that tend
to poke fun at each other, sometimes
in jest, sometimes serious, but those of us who are in it for fun just
think they need to get a life.
Even within the Pietenpol enthusiast's world you will find those who
think that the only Pietenpol
is a so called 'original' Pietenpol complete with a Model A Ford engine
and a tailskid and no brakes.
True that this was the first Pietenpol design, but not the last.
To Bernard Pietenpol he merely had
a first design and a twenty-sixth design...YES, he built 26
of these wonderful airplanes and not one
was like the other. He experimented with Model T, Model A, Corvair,
Continental, Lycoming, Velie,
and many other engines over the years. Believe it or not Pietepol
even built and flew one with
a radio, brakes, and tailwheel !! I'm sure that if Bernard
were around today he would be pleased to
see Subaru's, Fiesta, and other engines now making his design more
accessible and affordable for
all to have fun with.
Mike C.
________________________________________________________________________________
Piet List;
I owed some fellas a sketck of my tail skid shoe plate, all with the
first name of Steve.......can you guys contact me off list directly with
whom and where to send the sketckes....?
Earl Myers, Ohio
Piet List;
I owed some fellas a sketck
of my tail
skid shoe plate, all with the first name of Steve.......can you guys
contact me
off list directly with whom and where to send the
sketckes....?
Earl Myers,
Ohio
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | RE: Confused by Mike C |
Thats it Gordon! I have had it. If you go and to that your banished! A
piet with a mohawk wing? What, do you think this is Experimental Aviation
or something? And what up with landing in your back yard... preposterous.
By the way, think I could do it?
On a more serious note,
If I was still in school and had to write about my "summer vacation," my
story about mingling with you folks on the list and in person would recieve
highest marks. Hope to do it again someday. Everywhere I went it was like
a hero's welcome! and I know for sure they had no idea what I was flying.
Piet, GN-1, "Heath parasol?" or otherwise. Have fun folks,
Steve Eldredge
Steve(at)byu.edu
-----Original Message-----
Brimhall
Sent: Tuesday, August 17, 1999 9:21 PM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Confused by Mike C
You Piet/GN guys are just taking this too serous as I'm poking fun at ya all
and I don't even have a Pietenpol or a GN Wannabie Piet. I am building a
RW-1 UL Piet by Ragwing Aviation and I am in this group along with a bunch
of folks who are not building anything yet but have dreams of building a
Pietenpol I am sure.
If this was just a list for those with or building Barnards Piet half of the
people would have to leave, me included.
Were all having fun and if anybody with thin skin gets offended by my words
I am sorry because it is all in fun, I've done it before and I will do it
again.
I may build a real Piet with a Mohawk High Gross Wing so to take off from my
property.
Gordon
RW1 UL Piet
Mohawk MK IV
John McNarry wrote:
Thanks Mike I really like being a part of this Pietenpol / GN-1 / Fun
Airplane, group when we all get along and share our experiences.Thanks again
for saying ity wellJohn Mc
There are some factions in the Piet/GN-1 world that tend to poke fun at
each other, sometimes
in jest, sometimes serious, but those of us who are in it for fun just think
they need to get a life.
Even within the Pietenpol enthusiast's world you will find those who think
that the only Pietenpol
is a so called 'original' Pietenpol complete with a Model A Ford engine and
a tailskid and no brakes.
True that this was the first Pietenpol design, but not the last. To Bernard
Pietenpol he merely had
a first design and a twenty-sixth design...YES, he built 26 of these
wonderful airplanes and not one
was like the other. He experimented with Model T, Model A, Corvair,
Continental, Lycoming, Velie,
and many other engines over the years. Believe it or not Pietepol even
built and flew one with
a radio, brakes, and tailwheel !! I'm sure that if Bernard were around
today he would be pleased to
see Subaru's, Fiesta, and other engines now making his design more
accessible and affordable for
all to have fun with.
Mike C.
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Confused by Mike C |
Had me worried for about half a sentence.
My property is 282' x 407' with vacant property to East and West and
back side that is 282 wide has vacant land on both sides, My neighbor
just put up a chainlink fence on N side but only half way back so the
open area is stil to my advantage and has said for a small lease of a
couple 12 paks I could land on their property that runs into mine so I
would have 600 ft running N/S with the end over vacant land and
running out into 1000's of vacant desert land.
My UL Piet only needs 100 ft for takeoff and a real Piet with Mohawk
wings would do it in 125 ft. Gestamated.
Gordon
steve(at)byu.edu wrote:
> Thats it Gordon! I have had it. If you go and to that your
> banished! A piet with a mohawk wing? What, do you think this is
> Experimental Aviation or something? And what up with landing in
> your back yard... preposterous. By the way, think I could do it?On
> a more serious note,If I was still in school and had to write about
> my "summer vacation," my story about mingling with you folks on the
> list and in person would recieve highest marks. Hope to do it again
> someday. Everywhere I went it was like a hero's welcome! and I
> know for sure they had no idea what I was flying. Piet, GN-1,
> "Heath parasol?" or otherwise. Have fun folks, Steve
> EldredgeSteve(at)byu.edu
>
> -----Original Message-----
> Behalf Of Gordon Brimhall
> Sent: Tuesday, August 17, 1999 9:21 PM
> To: Pietenpol Discussion
> Subject: Re: Confused by Mike C
>
> You Piet/GN guys are just taking this too serous as I'm
> poking fun at ya all and I don't even have a Pietenpol or
> a GN Wannabie Piet. I am building a RW-1 UL Piet by
> Ragwing Aviation and I am in this group along with a bunch
> of folks who are not building anything yet but have dreams
> of building a Pietenpol I am sure.
>
> If this was just a list for those with or building
> Barnards Piet half of the people would have to leave, me
> included.
>
> Were all having fun and if anybody with thin skin gets
> offended by my words I am sorry because it is all in fun,
> I've done it before and I will do it again.
>
> I may build a real Piet with a Mohawk High Gross Wing so
> to take off from my property.
>
> Gordon
> RW1 UL Piet
> Mohawk MK IV
>
>
> John McNarry wrote:
>
> > Thanks Mike I really like being a part of this
> > Pietenpol / GN-1 / Fun Airplane, group when we all get
> > along and share our experiences.Thanks again for saying
> > ity wellJohn Mc
> >
> >
> > There are some factions in the Piet/GN-1
> > world that tend to poke fun at each other,
> > sometimes
> > in jest, sometimes serious, but those of us
> > who are in it for fun just think they need to
> > get a life.
> > Even within the Pietenpol enthusiast's world
> > you will find those who think that the only
> > Pietenpol
> > is a so called 'original' Pietenpol complete
> > with a Model A Ford engine and a tailskid and
> > no brakes.
> > True that this was the first Pietenpol design,
> > but not the last. To Bernard Pietenpol he
> > merely had
> > a first design and a twenty-sixth
> > design...YES, he built 26 of these wonderful
> > airplanes and not one
> > was like the other. He experimented with
> > Model T, Model A, Corvair, Continental,
> > Lycoming, Velie,
> > and many other engines over the years.
> > Believe it or not Pietepol even built and flew
> > one with
> > a radio, brakes, and tailwheel !! I'm sure
> > that if Bernard were around today he would be
> > pleased to
> > see Subaru's, Fiesta, and other engines now
> > making his design more accessible and
> > affordable for
> > all to have fun with.
> >
> > Mike C.
> >
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Michael Brusilow <mb-albany(at)worldnet.att.net> |
| Subject: | continental engines |
Dave wrote:
Piet. Forget
about a starter though. The added weight and addition of an electrical
system
will add 10 to 16 lbs for a gen., 16 lbs for a starter, another 20 lbs
for a
battery, wiring, switches . . . You will end up with a one place
airplane with
poor performance. Hand proping is neither dificult or dangerous as long
as you
know what you are doing. Get someone who knows and have them teach you.
You will
be glad you did with the improved performance of an airplane about 50
lbs
lighter.>
Don't know about that.
I have been flying my Aircamper with an 0-200, starter & altenator for 8
yrs. Two years prior, it had Ford engine.
My power configuration ( battery included ) does not weigh as much as
the Ford engine plus the radtiator & water. ( give or take a few pounds
in either direction ).
As for performance, my aircraft cruises a + or - 80 mph at 2250 rpm (
which is low for an 0-200 ) & climbs at approx 600 ft/min depending on
the oat. No problem with two people.
Poor performance? Try Ford Piet on a hot day from a short grass strip
with trees at the end of the runway.
Mike B Piet N687MB ( Mr Sam )
Dave wrote:
Any of the Continental A or C series
engines are
good choices for a Piet. Forgetabout a starter though. The added
weight and
addition of an electrical systemwill add 10 to 16 lbs for a gen., 16
lbs for
a starter, another 20 lbs for abattery, wiring, switches . . . You
will end
up with a one place airplane withpoor performance. Hand proping is
neither
dificult or dangerous as long as youknow what you are doing. Get
someone who
knows and have them teach you. You willbe glad you did with the
improved
performance of an airplane about 50 lbslighter.
Don't know about that.
I have been flying my Aircamper with an
0-200, starter
altenator for 8 yrs. Two years prior, it had Ford
engine.
My power configuration ( battery included )
does not
weigh as much as the Ford engine plus the radtiator water. ( give
or take
a few pounds in either direction ).
As for performance, my aircraft cruises a + or - 80 mph at 2250 rpm
( which
is low for an 0-200 ) climbs at approx 600 ft/min depending on the
oat. No
problem with two people.
Poor performance? Try Ford Piet on a hot day from a short
grass strip
with trees at the end of the runway.
Mike B Piet N687MB ( Mr Sam )
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | RE: Confused by Mike C |
Thats great, though, I guess I'm out of luck with my 60x80' lot still.
Steve (some people have hangars that big) Eldredge
Steve(at)byu.edu
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | mbell1(at)columbiaenergygroup.com |
| Subject: | Re: Mohawk Wing? |
Whatza Mohawk wing?
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Confused by Mike C |
Or I could put the Storch Wing on it with the Flaps/Slots and do it in
less than 30 ft.
With 20 mph headwind you land in 0 ft.
That would be a wicked Piet, make Bernard Proud.
Gordon
I have the plans for both.
steve(at)byu.edu wrote:
> Thats great, though, I guess I'm out of luck with my 60x80' lot
> still. Steve (some people have hangars that big)
> EldredgeSteve(at)byu.edu
Or I could put the Storch Wing on it with the Flaps/Slots and do it in
less than 30 ft.
With 20 mph headwind you land in 0 ft.
That would be a wicked Piet, make Bernard Proud.
Gordon
I have the plans for both.
steve(at)byu.edu wrote:
Thats
great, though, I guess I'm out of luck with my 60x80' lot still.Steve
class=221261616-18081999>
(some people have hangars that big) EldredgeSteve(at)byu.edu
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Mohawk Wing? |
Mohawk, as in a Avid copied aircraft plans by a company that sells
Mohawk plans.
High Gross wing is built just like Avid/Kitfox with Flaparons and
airplane
Takeoff wt. 1000 lbs
TO is 100 ft.
Stall Flaps off 35 mph Flaps full 30 mph.
W/rotex 532
Gordon
mbell1(at)columbiaenergygroup.com wrote:
> Whatza Mohawk wing?
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Ken Beanlands <kbeanlan(at)spots.ab.ca> |
| Subject: | Re: continental engines |
Well, I'm finally back from my 3.5 week vacation and road trip from
Calgary, AB to St. John's, NF. That's a 13000 km round trip.
Unfortunately, we didn't have enough time to make it to B'head or OSH
despite the fact that we were fairly close by. However, next year we hope
to be to OSH in the Christavia.
As for engines, another possibility in the same price range is the new
Franklins. I know I've mentioned them before, but heck, I like them. They
weigh 240 lbs with accessories, puts out 120 hp and will fit on a
continental mount. Strip off the accessories an you will end up with a 200
lb engine. Although the thrust will be higher than an 0-200 or simular
engine, I don't think it would be too much for the Piet frame as it's a
much smoother engine than other 4 bangers due to a viscuously damped
flywheel.
My 150 hp version should be here early next month!!
Just a thought.
Ken
On Wed, 18 Aug 1999, Michael Brusilow wrote:
> Dave wrote:
>
>
> Piet. Forget about a starter though. The added weight and addition of an
> electrical system will add 10 to 16 lbs for a gen., 16 lbs for a
> starter, another 20 lbs for a battery, wiring, switches . . . You will
> end up with a one place airplane with poor performance. Hand proping is
> neither dificult or dangerous as long as you know what you are doing.
> Get someone who knows and have them teach you. You will be glad you did
> with the improved performance of an airplane about 50 lbs lighter.>
>
> Don't know about that.
>
> I have been flying my Aircamper with an 0-200, starter & altenator for 8
> yrs. Two years prior, it had Ford engine.
>
> My power configuration ( battery included ) does not weigh as much as
> the Ford engine plus the radtiator & water. ( give or take a few pounds
> in either direction ).
>
> As for performance, my aircraft cruises a + or - 80 mph at 2250 rpm (
> which is low for an 0-200 ) & climbs at approx 600 ft/min depending on
> the oat. No problem with two people.
>
> Poor performance? Try Ford Piet on a hot day from a short grass strip
> with trees at the end of the runway.
>
> Mike B Piet N687MB ( Mr Sam )
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | mbell1(at)columbiaenergygroup.com |
I'd really like to look at Storch wing plans. The mechanism for auto
extend/retract of the leading edge slats is especially interesting to me.
Are they in an easily copied format?
Mike Bell
Columbia,SC
Maiser(at)adena.byu.edu on 08/18/99 12:29:48 AM
Please respond to piet(at)byu.edu @ INTERNET
cc:
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Confused by Mike C
Or I could put the Storch Wing on it with the Flaps/Slots and do it in
less than 30 ft.
With 20 mph headwind you land in 0 ft.
That would be a wicked Piet, make Bernard Proud.
Gordon
I have the plans for both.
steve(at)byu.edu wrote:
> Thats great, though, I guess I'm out of luck with my 60x80' lot
> still. Steve (some people have hangars that big)
> EldredgeSteve(at)byu.edu
Or I could put the Storch Wing on it with the Flaps/Slots and do it in
less than 30 ft.
With 20 mph headwind you land in 0 ft.
That would be a wicked Piet, make Bernard Proud.
Gordon
I have the plans for both.
steve(at)byu.edu wrote:
Thats
great, though, I guess I'm out of luck with my 60x80' lot still.Steve
class=221261616-18081999>
(some people have hangars that big) EldredgeSteve(at)byu.edu
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Michael King <mikek(at)nstar.net> |
| Subject: | Re: continental engines |
How much is a new or used Franklin?
Thanks....
Mike
Dallas
>Well, I'm finally back from my 3.5 week vacation and road trip from
>Calgary, AB to St. John's, NF. That's a 13000 km round trip.
>Unfortunately, we didn't have enough time to make it to B'head or OSH
>despite the fact that we were fairly close by. However, next year we hope
>to be to OSH in the Christavia.
>
>As for engines, another possibility in the same price range is the new
>Franklins. I know I've mentioned them before, but heck, I like them. They
>weigh 240 lbs with accessories, puts out 120 hp and will fit on a
>continental mount. Strip off the accessories an you will end up with a 200
>lb engine. Although the thrust will be higher than an 0-200 or simular
>engine, I don't think it would be too much for the Piet frame as it's a
>much smoother engine than other 4 bangers due to a viscuously damped
>flywheel.
>
>My 150 hp version should be here early next month!!
>
>Just a thought.
>Ken
>
>On Wed, 18 Aug 1999, Michael Brusilow wrote:
>
>> Dave wrote:
>>
>>
>> Piet. Forget about a starter though. The added weight and addition of an
>> electrical system will add 10 to 16 lbs for a gen., 16 lbs for a
>> starter, another 20 lbs for a battery, wiring, switches . . . You will
>> end up with a one place airplane with poor performance. Hand proping is
>> neither dificult or dangerous as long as you know what you are doing.
>> Get someone who knows and have them teach you. You will be glad you did
>> with the improved performance of an airplane about 50 lbs lighter.>
>>
>> Don't know about that.
>>
>> I have been flying my Aircamper with an 0-200, starter & altenator for 8
>> yrs. Two years prior, it had Ford engine.
>>
>> My power configuration ( battery included ) does not weigh as much as
>> the Ford engine plus the radtiator & water. ( give or take a few pounds
>> in either direction ).
>>
>> As for performance, my aircraft cruises a + or - 80 mph at 2250 rpm (
>> which is low for an 0-200 ) & climbs at approx 600 ft/min depending on
>> the oat. No problem with two people.
>>
>> Poor performance? Try Ford Piet on a hot day from a short grass strip
>> with trees at the end of the runway.
>>
>> Mike B Piet N687MB ( Mr Sam )
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | mbell1(at)columbiaenergygroup.com |
| Subject: | Re: Mohawk Wing? |
Larger ailerons set up as flaperons might be really good on a Piet. Setting
the flaps would change the airfoil considerably and cause it considerable nose
down moment that doesn't exist now. The tail surface might require enlargement
in order to deal with it.
I recognize, of course, that this is "heretical" to even think about, but it is
especially interesting!
Mike Bell
Columbia, SC
Maiser(at)adena.byu.edu on 08/18/99 12:36:11 AM
Please respond to piet(at)byu.edu @ INTERNET
cc:
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Mohawk Wing?
Mohawk, as in a Avid copied aircraft plans by a company that sells
Mohawk plans.
High Gross wing is built just like Avid/Kitfox with Flaparons and
airplane
Takeoff wt. 1000 lbs
TO is 100 ft.
Stall Flaps off 35 mph Flaps full 30 mph.
W/rotex 532
Gordon
mbell1(at)columbiaenergygroup.com wrote:
> Whatza Mohawk wing?
________________________________________________________________________________
John,
Our next scheduled day to work is Friday a.m. We sholud be there at ten
to 1:30.
writes:
>John,
>I was just out at the Flying RV yesterday evening. I will probably
>run into
>you guys out there sooner or later. I'm anxious to look your plane
>over.
>John W
>-----Original Message-----
>From: nle97(at)juno.com <nle97(at)juno.com>
>To: Pietenpol Discussion
>Date: Tuesday, August 17, 1999 12:16 AM
>Subject: Re: Houston
>
>
>>John,
>>Our Piet project is at the Flying RV Ranch. My partners are Rodger
>Childs
>>of Bandera and Dock Dixon of Comfort and we've been working on the
>>project quite a bit after a long layoff. Give me a call sometime and
>meet
>>us there when we're working on the plane. Rodger and I have wierd
>>schedules so we're there at the usual hours.
>>
>>John Langston
>>Pipe Creek, TX
>>(830) 510-4641
>>
>
>>writes:
>>>John,
>>>Is your Piet project the one that's at Flying RV Ranch? I have a
>>>RW-6
>>>RagWing Parasol that I built there and am giving some thought to
>>>building a
>>>Piet for my next project.
>>>John W
>>>RW-6
>>>KR-2S
>>>Kerrville, Tx
>>>jandd(at)maverickbbs.com
>>>
>>>-----Original Message-----
>>>From: nle97(at)juno.com <nle97(at)juno.com>
>>>To: Pietenpol Discussion
>>>Date: Sunday, August 15, 1999 1:35 AM
>>>Subject: Re: Houston
>>>
>>>
>>>>James,
>>>>I and two partners are building a Model A powered Piet in Comfort,
>>>Texas
>>>>which is about 40 miles north of San Antonio along IH-10. While
>this
>>>is
>>>>not too close to Houston you are certainly welcome to come and see
>>>our
>>>>project. The fuselage is more or less done and on its gear. The
>>>empennage
>>>>is done and we've made good progress on the wing lately. If you
>wish
>>>to
>>>>make a four hour trip to see it, my E-mail address is
>nle97(at)juno.com
>>>and
>>>>my phone is (830) 510-4641.
>>>>Sincerely,
>>>>John Langston
>>>>
>>>> writes:
>>>>>Hello, I'm considering building an aircamper. Is there anyone in
>>>the
>>>>>Houston, TX area that has built one or is in the process of
>>>building
>>>>>one?
>>>>>
>>>>>If so, I would like to see one in person.
>>>>>
>>>>>Thanks,
>>>>>
>>>>>James McFarland
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>
>
__________
________________________________________________________________________________
John,
I also love talking airplanes. Am obsessed with it. Come on up sometime.
writes:
>John,
>
>Thanks for the reply. I tried to look you up as I would any Piet
>builder I
>found myself in the vicinity of. You know how I hate to talk
>airplanes.......
>
>Sounds like you are coming along. I lack 6 days making 7 years on my
>3 year
>project. I need to paint the last of the sheet metal and put some
>finish
>coats on some metal pieces. Then we will start final assembly.
>
>JMG
>-----Original Message-----
>From: nle97(at)juno.com <nle97(at)juno.com>
>To: Pietenpol Discussion
>Date: Tuesday, August 17, 1999 12:17 AM
>Subject: Re: Houston
>
>
>>John,
>>I do live in Pipe Creek and have lived here for 19 years. I'm kind
>of
>>curious of why you were looking for me.
>>Our project is really moving along, finally. The fuselage and
>empennage
>>are basically complete and the plane is standing on its gear. We are
>now
>>in the process of making the wing, which will be one piece. We have
>>spliced the spars, cut to size, routed the spars, and have installed
>the
>>ribs. Our goal is to be done by the end of next summer, but we are
>>currently approaching 8 years of our intended 18 month project.
>>I'd like to hear from you,
>>John Langston
>>(830) 510-4641
>>
>
>>writes:
>>>John,
>>>
>>>Are you the guy that used to live at Pipe Creek? If so, I tried
>>>looking you
>>>up several years ago when I was down around Bandera or so.
>>>
>>>How far along are you?
>>>
>>>JMG
>>>-----Original Message-----
>>>From: nle97(at)juno.com <nle97(at)juno.com>
>>>To: Pietenpol Discussion
>>>Date: Sunday, August 15, 1999 1:36 AM
>>>Subject: Re: Houston
>>>
>>>
>>>>James,
>>>>I and two partners are building a Model A powered Piet in Comfort,
>>>Texas
>>>>which is about 40 miles north of San Antonio along IH-10. While
>this
>>>is
>>>>not too close to Houston you are certainly welcome to come and see
>>>our
>>>>project. The fuselage is more or less done and on its gear. The
>>>empennage
>>>>is done and we've made good progress on the wing lately. If you
>wish
>>>to
>>>>make a four hour trip to see it, my E-mail address is
>nle97(at)juno.com
>>>and
>>>>my phone is (830) 510-4641.
>>>>Sincerely,
>>>>John Langston
>>>>
>>>> writes:
>>>>>Hello, I'm considering building an aircamper. Is there anyone in
>>>the
>>>>>Houston, TX area that has built one or is in the process of
>>>building
>>>>>one?
>>>>>
>>>>>If so, I would like to see one in person.
>>>>>
>>>>>Thanks,
>>>>>
>>>>>James McFarland
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>
__________
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Ken Beanlands <kbeanlan(at)spots.ab.ca> |
| Subject: | Re: continental engines |
My custom rebuild will be $6500 USD but does not include carb, mags or
altenator. The rebuilder was able to use the $15 4220 mags with a little
modification. I also had an 0-200 MS carb in the shop that he re-jetted
and used. The engine is now running and awaiting some minor tweaking.
The new ones are $7900 USD and use a lower compression cylinder putting
out 120 hp. Mine has the 10:1 jugs for 150 hp. THere is a web site at:
<http://www.ezlink.com/~franklin/>
There are two companies providing parts and engines. Franklin Aircraft
Engines, Inc. and Franklin Engines Parts and Supply. The later is building
my engine.
Hope this helps,
Ken
On Wed, 18 Aug 1999, Michael King wrote:
> How much is a new or used Franklin?
>
> Thanks....
>
> Mike
> Dallas
Ken Beanlands B.Eng (Aerospace)
Calgary, Alberta, Canada
Christavia MK 1 C-GREN
<http://www.spots.ab.ca/~kbeanlan>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | John Weikel <jandd(at)maverickbbs.com> |
| Subject: | Re: continental engines |
Doesn't Franklin make a two cyl engine of 50 hp or so also? Seems that
would beat the socks off of a 40 hp Model A.
John W
-----Original Message-----
From: Ken Beanlands <kbeanlan(at)spots.ab.ca>
Date: Wednesday, August 18, 1999 12:19 PM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: continental engines
>Well, I'm finally back from my 3.5 week vacation and road trip from
>Calgary, AB to St. John's, NF. That's a 13000 km round trip.
>Unfortunately, we didn't have enough time to make it to B'head or OSH
>despite the fact that we were fairly close by. However, next year we hope
>to be to OSH in the Christavia.
>
>As for engines, another possibility in the same price range is the new
>Franklins. I know I've mentioned them before, but heck, I like them. They
>weigh 240 lbs with accessories, puts out 120 hp and will fit on a
>continental mount. Strip off the accessories an you will end up with a 200
>lb engine. Although the thrust will be higher than an 0-200 or simular
>engine, I don't think it would be too much for the Piet frame as it's a
>much smoother engine than other 4 bangers due to a viscuously damped
>flywheel.
>
>My 150 hp version should be here early next month!!
>
>Just a thought.
>Ken
>
>On Wed, 18 Aug 1999, Michael Brusilow wrote:
>
>> Dave wrote:
>>
>>
>> Piet. Forget about a starter though. The added weight and addition of an
>> electrical system will add 10 to 16 lbs for a gen., 16 lbs for a
>> starter, another 20 lbs for a battery, wiring, switches . . . You will
>> end up with a one place airplane with poor performance. Hand proping is
>> neither dificult or dangerous as long as you know what you are doing.
>> Get someone who knows and have them teach you. You will be glad you did
>> with the improved performance of an airplane about 50 lbs lighter.>
>>
>> Don't know about that.
>>
>> I have been flying my Aircamper with an 0-200, starter & altenator for 8
>> yrs. Two years prior, it had Ford engine.
>>
>> My power configuration ( battery included ) does not weigh as much as
>> the Ford engine plus the radtiator & water. ( give or take a few pounds
>> in either direction ).
>>
>> As for performance, my aircraft cruises a + or - 80 mph at 2250 rpm (
>> which is low for an 0-200 ) & climbs at approx 600 ft/min depending on
>> the oat. No problem with two people.
>>
>> Poor performance? Try Ford Piet on a hot day from a short grass strip
>> with trees at the end of the runway.
>>
>> Mike B Piet N687MB ( Mr Sam )
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | John Weikel <jandd(at)maverickbbs.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Confused by Mike C |
Gordon,
Takeoffs are no problem it's the landings you have to watch out for.
Landing in 100 ft or whatever is fine if you can accurately pick the
touchdown point. If I tried that in my back yard I would be spitting
rocks and cactus stickers.
John W
Kerrville, Tx
RW-6
KR-2S
Piet maybe
-----Original Message-----
From: Gordon Brimhall
To: Pietenpol Discussion
Date: Wednesday, August 18, 1999 11:33 AM
Subject: Re: Confused by Mike C
Or I could put the Storch Wing on it with the Flaps/Slots and do it
in less than 30 ft.
With 20 mph headwind you land in 0 ft.
That would be a wicked Piet, make Bernard Proud.
Gordon
I have the plans for both.
steve(at)byu.edu wrote:
Thats great, though, I guess I'm out of luck with my 60x80' lot
still. Steve (some people have hangars that big) EldredgeSteve(at)byu.edu
________________________________________________________________________________
NOt.
Besides being copyright protected they are 2 x 3 ft. size plans for wing and such.
No machine around here large enough to copy anyway.
Gordon
mbell1(at)columbiaenergygroup.com wrote:
> I'd really like to look at Storch wing plans. The mechanism for auto
> extend/retract of the leading edge slats is especially interesting to me.
>
> Are they in an easily copied format?
>
> Mike Bell
> Columbia,SC
>
> Maiser(at)adena.byu.edu on 08/18/99 12:29:48 AM
> Please respond to piet(at)byu.edu @ INTERNET
>
> To: piet(at)byu.edu @ INTERNET
> cc:
>
> Subject: Re: Confused by Mike C
>
> Or I could put the Storch Wing on it with the Flaps/Slots and do it in
> less than 30 ft.
>
> With 20 mph headwind you land in 0 ft.
>
> That would be a wicked Piet, make Bernard Proud.
>
> Gordon
> I have the plans for both.
>
> steve(at)byu.edu wrote:
>
> > Thats great, though, I guess I'm out of luck with my 60x80' lot
> > still. Steve (some people have hangars that big)
> > EldredgeSteve(at)byu.edu
>
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>
>
>
> Or I could put the Storch Wing on it with the Flaps/Slots and do it in
> less than 30 ft.
> With 20 mph headwind you land in 0 ft.
> That would be a wicked Piet, make Bernard Proud.
> Gordon
> I have the plans for both.
>
> steve(at)byu.edu wrote:
> Thats
> great, though, I guess I'm out of luck with my 60x80' lot still.Steve
> class=221261616-18081999>
> (some people have hangars that big) EldredgeSteve(at)byu.edu
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | John Weikel <jandd(at)maverickbbs.com> |
John I have to drop the dog off at the vet then I will try to be there.
Thanks
John W
-----Original Message-----
From: nle97(at)juno.com <nle97(at)juno.com>
Date: Wednesday, August 18, 1999 12:34 PM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Houston
>John,
>Our next scheduled day to work is Friday a.m. We sholud be there at ten
>to 1:30.
>
>writes:
>>John,
>>I was just out at the Flying RV yesterday evening. I will probably
>>run into
>>you guys out there sooner or later. I'm anxious to look your plane
>>over.
>>John W
>>-----Original Message-----
>>From: nle97(at)juno.com <nle97(at)juno.com>
>>To: Pietenpol Discussion
>>Date: Tuesday, August 17, 1999 12:16 AM
>>Subject: Re: Houston
>>
>>
>>>John,
>>>Our Piet project is at the Flying RV Ranch. My partners are Rodger
>>Childs
>>>of Bandera and Dock Dixon of Comfort and we've been working on the
>>>project quite a bit after a long layoff. Give me a call sometime and
>>meet
>>>us there when we're working on the plane. Rodger and I have wierd
>>>schedules so we're there at the usual hours.
>>>
>>>John Langston
>>>Pipe Creek, TX
>>>(830) 510-4641
>>>
>>
>>>writes:
>>>>John,
>>>>Is your Piet project the one that's at Flying RV Ranch? I have a
>>>>RW-6
>>>>RagWing Parasol that I built there and am giving some thought to
>>>>building a
>>>>Piet for my next project.
>>>>John W
>>>>RW-6
>>>>KR-2S
>>>>Kerrville, Tx
>>>>jandd(at)maverickbbs.com
>>>>
>>>>-----Original Message-----
>>>>From: nle97(at)juno.com <nle97(at)juno.com>
>>>>To: Pietenpol Discussion
>>>>Date: Sunday, August 15, 1999 1:35 AM
>>>>Subject: Re: Houston
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>James,
>>>>>I and two partners are building a Model A powered Piet in Comfort,
>>>>Texas
>>>>>which is about 40 miles north of San Antonio along IH-10. While
>>this
>>>>is
>>>>>not too close to Houston you are certainly welcome to come and see
>>>>our
>>>>>project. The fuselage is more or less done and on its gear. The
>>>>empennage
>>>>>is done and we've made good progress on the wing lately. If you
>>wish
>>>>to
>>>>>make a four hour trip to see it, my E-mail address is
>>nle97(at)juno.com
>>>>and
>>>>>my phone is (830) 510-4641.
>>>>>Sincerely,
>>>>>John Langston
>>>>>
>>>>> writes:
>>>>>>Hello, I'm considering building an aircamper. Is there anyone in
>>>>the
>>>>>>Houston, TX area that has built one or is in the process of
>>>>building
>>>>>>one?
>>>>>>
>>>>>>If so, I would like to see one in person.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Thanks,
>>>>>>
>>>>>>James McFarland
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Copinfo <Copinfo(at)ix.Netcom.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Continental Engines |
The O-200 would be a great motor for the Piet. Probably a lot more than you
need. The 65 is a bout 170 lbs and the O-200 around 200 lbs. With a
starter, generator and battery you'll add weight but the extra horse power
will take care of that for you. The C.G. won't be a problem. Once you know
the weight of your particular engine you can figure a quick weight and
balance and make the motor mount a little longer than plans if necessary. I
made my mount 4 inches longer than the plans and I still had to move the
wing back. The cost for a good 65 is about $3000 and an O-200 will be
$5000. Good luck.
Copinfo(at)ix.Netcom.Com
Tim Cunningham
Des Moines, Iowa (515) 237-1510
-----Original Message-----
From: MACKORELL(at)aol.com <MACKORELL(at)aol.com>
Date: Tuesday, August 17, 1999 7:33 PM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Continental Engines
>Before I get started on building my AirCamper I want to decide on a
specific
>engine. If the cost is not too high, I would like to use the 85 h.p.
>Continental.
>Can anyone tell me what an overhauled 85 hp Continental would roughly run?
>Has the track record for this engine been good? Would I be able to
overhaul
>one myself? I believe someone already answered this but does the 85 have
an
>onboard starter? Also, is there an engine mount available for the
AirCamper
>to accept this engine? Has anyone used an O-200 on an AirCamper or would
>this engine bring the C.G. too far out of range?
>
>
>Jacob
>
>
>Jacob
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Mohawk Wing? |
But then it is not a Piet anymore and old Bernard would turn over in his grave
when
you fly it.
Could you say it was a Super Piet? Flaps and Slats with a EA-81 Suberu Engine.
Gordon
mbell1(at)columbiaenergygroup.com wrote:
> Larger ailerons set up as flaperons might be really good on a Piet. Setting
> the flaps would change the airfoil considerably and cause it considerable nose
> down moment that doesn't exist now. The tail surface might require enlargement
> in order to deal with it.
>
> I recognize, of course, that this is "heretical" to even think about, but it
is
> especially interesting!
>
> Mike Bell
> Columbia, SC
>
> Maiser(at)adena.byu.edu on 08/18/99 12:36:11 AM
> Please respond to piet(at)byu.edu @ INTERNET
>
> To: piet(at)byu.edu @ INTERNET
> cc:
>
> Subject: Re: Mohawk Wing?
>
> Mohawk, as in a Avid copied aircraft plans by a company that sells
> Mohawk plans.
>
> High Gross wing is built just like Avid/Kitfox with Flaparons and
> airplane
> Takeoff wt. 1000 lbs
> TO is 100 ft.
> Stall Flaps off 35 mph Flaps full 30 mph.
> W/rotex 532
>
> Gordon
>
> mbell1(at)columbiaenergygroup.com wrote:
>
> > Whatza Mohawk wing?
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Confused by Mike C |
Considering I have a 409 ft run E/W and a 600 ft run N/S with open
property on both ends I have no problem, I would only worry about
running into tumble weeds on the open propertys. We drive our
SandRails thru it all the time, me on four wheels and my Son on two
because he is always pulling the front wheels off the ground with his
1835 VW powered rail. I been trying to buy the property on my West
side, owner lives 500 miles away and has probably never seen her
property so I will drag it clean for probably 150 ft to help her clear
the tumble weeds off of it.
Fire Hazard anyway.
Gordon
John Weikel wrote:
> Gordon,Takeoffs are no problem it's the landings you have to watch
> out for. Landing in 100 ft or whatever is fine if you can
> accurately pick the touchdown point. If I tried that in my back
> yard I would be spitting rocks and cactus stickers.John WKerrville,
> TxRW-6KR-2SPiet maybe
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Gordon Brimhall
> To: Pietenpol Discussion
> Date: Wednesday, August 18, 1999 11:33 AM
> Subject: Re: Confused by Mike C
> Or I could put the Storch Wing on it with the Flaps/Slots
> and do it in less than 30 ft.
>
> With 20 mph headwind you land in 0 ft.
>
> That would be a wicked Piet, make Bernard Proud.
>
> Gordon
> I have the plans for both.
>
>
> steve(at)byu.edu wrote:
>
> > Thats great, though, I guess I'm out of luck with my
> > 60x80' lot still. Steve (some people have hangars that
> > big) EldredgeSteve(at)byu.edu
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: continental engines |
Ken Beanlands wrote:
>
> My custom rebuild will be $6500 USD but does not include carb, mags or
> altenator. The rebuilder was able to use the $15 4220 mags with a little
> modification. I also had an 0-200 MS carb in the shop that he re-jetted
> and used. The engine is now running and awaiting some minor tweaking.
How about more detail on the mag conversion. I've been told that the
15 degree lag is not enough, that the 0-200 needs something like 20-25
Pat
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | walter evans <wbeevans(at)worldnet.att.net> |
Ted,
I hear what you are saying, and you might be right. But this whole thing
started when I hear my friend Dicks opinion whenever he hears of someone
putting a direct drive corvair on a plane. People will say " I don't want
a 65hp Cont. I want a 110hp corvair, It's heavier , but look at the power"
But in fact , it seems that at the same rpm as a Cont 65, it will put out
about the same. Trouble is the corvair weighs around 250# as compaired to
the cont. 65 weighing about 175#.
If you saw the post by Doug Hunt yesterday that showed that the
corvair@3000rpm put out less thrust than a Cont . 85 probably turning
redline of 2550.
The good thing that Bernard does say is that the corvair runs a smooth as
silk.
walt
-----Original Message-----
From: Theodore Trevorrow <TJTREV(at)webtv.net>
Date: Tuesday, August 17, 1999 10:44 PM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: corvair
Walt
I'm interested in what your friends prediction are for the life of that
engine . I had a couple of corvairs back in the 60's. And your right the
peak h.p. is in the mid 4000's. But the engine is by no means designed
to run in that range for extended periods of time.
Its an interesting experiment I guess thats why they call them
experimental.
People build Piets because there cute, or because there kind of
nostalgic, some because they are a relatively inexpensive way to get to
fly. I'm concerned that someone new to Piets will get the idea that they
must have a reduction to get their corvairs to fly. Which has been
proven repeatedly not to be the case. I personally have trouble with the
cost of a reduction unit on a 70 mph wooden airplane.
I used to race sprint cars and I understand the need for more
performance. It's genetic I think.
In fact I know of a 500 C.I. Warner radial being built for a Piet now .
But I've kind been sworn to secrecy. Ted.T
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | fishin <fishin(at)wwa.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Pietenpol engine mount |
using Don Pietenpols plans for the A65 mount I built a simple jig only
lengthening it to compensate for the short fuse version--my dimensions are, from
the engine mount to the mounting bracket centr hole top is 13 1/4",,bottom is
12"---Don Ps plans show 13 3/16" & 10 5/8" but they are for the long fuse
version..
I know this mount fits the A50, A65, A75 & A80...beyound this I can't say but I
quite sure there are plenty of more knowlegeable fellows on this list that can
answer you regarding the 0-200
JoeC
Zion, Illinois
Ted Brousseau wrote:
> Joe,
>
> Did you build the mount or is it from another plane, like a Jenny? If you
> put an 0-200 would it require even another mount or are all Continental
> mounts the same?
>
> Ted
>
> I was so glad you could fly with me at Brodhead.
>
> >true on the latter,,,D.P. does have plans available for the continental motor
> >mount..this is the route I'm taking....mount now completed and installing
> >controls and seat belt/harnesses and starting on the fuse fuel tank.
> >JoeC
> >Zion, Illinois
> >
> >Ted Brousseau wrote:
> >
> >> The Pietenpol I bought at the garage sale has a constructed fuselage. I
> >> don't have the plans so I need to ask the following question.
> >>
> >> Is the fuselage built for a particular engine or are the different engines
> >> handled through the construction of the motor mounts? From discussions I
> >> have glanced at (I never expected to be a Piet builder) I would guess the
> >> latter. True? I want to put a Continental on it.
> >>
> >> Thanks, Ted
> >
> >
> >
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | fishin <fishin(at)wwa.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Home from OSH - Finally!! |
I for one love these stories of your Piet odyssey so go right ahead and regale
us
of your exploits
regards
JoeC
Zion, Illinois
Ted Brousseau wrote:
> I have more stories, but I won't bore the group. Suffice it to say that
> when you fly a Piet cross country you have lots of opportunity to meet lots
> of interesting people.
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Ken Beanlands <kbeanlan(at)spots.ab.ca> |
| Subject: | Re: continental engines |
Unfortunately, the Franklin Engine God did not share with me his secret. I
do know that it was taken apart and the fron half of the case was swapped
with another old case. As for the lag angle, 15 degrees may be enough for
the Franklin. In any case, it is running.
Ken
On Wed, 18 Aug 1999, Pat Panzera wrote:
> Ken Beanlands wrote:
> >
> > My custom rebuild will be $6500 USD but does not include carb, mags or
> > altenator. The rebuilder was able to use the $15 4220 mags with a little
> > modification. I also had an 0-200 MS carb in the shop that he re-jetted
> > and used. The engine is now running and awaiting some minor tweaking.
>
> How about more detail on the mag conversion. I've been told that the
> 15 degree lag is not enough, that the 0-200 needs something like 20-25
>
> Pat
>
Ken Beanlands B.Eng (Aerospace)
Calgary, Alberta, Canada
Christavia MK 1 C-GREN
<http://www.spots.ab.ca/~kbeanlan>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Copinfo <Copinfo(at)ix.Netcom.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Pietenpol engine mount |
Ted & Joe, The motor mount from Don Pietenpols plans will work for any
Continental 65 to 0-200. I have the new improved 1933 Piet and I made my
mount 4 inches longer than the plans. I wish I would have gone another
inch. I still had to set my wings back a couple of inches to center the
lift point where the tail was not too heavy.
Copinfo(at)ix.Netcom.Com
Tim Cunningham
Des Moines, Iowa (515) 237-1510
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | fishin <fishin(at)wwa.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Pietenpol engine mount |
I hesitated to go out much furthar since I am using a McCauley 7148 metal
prop which weighs in at 25#.---with this combo I expect my wing set-back to
be 3 to 4"...
JoeC
Copinfo wrote:
> Ted & Joe, The motor mount from Don Pietenpols plans will work for any
> Continental 65 to 0-200. I have the new improved 1933 Piet and I made my
> mount 4 inches longer than the plans. I wish I would have gone another
> inch. I still had to set my wings back a couple of inches to center the
> lift point where the tail was not too heavy.
> Copinfo(at)ix.Netcom.Com
> Tim Cunningham
> Des Moines, Iowa (515) 237-1510
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | walter evans <wbeevans(at)worldnet.att.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Pietenpol engine mount? |
Joe,
My plans show 11 3/16" top, and 10 5/8" bottom. Are our prints the same?
These are the ones I got from D. Pietenpol.
(drawn by A.C. Hanft 3-15-67)
walt
-----Original Message-----
From: fishin <fishin(at)wwa.com>
Date: Wednesday, August 18, 1999 4:31 PM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Pietenpol engine mount
>using Don Pietenpols plans for the A65 mount I built a simple jig only
>lengthening it to compensate for the short fuse version--my dimensions are,
from
>the engine mount to the mounting bracket centr hole top is 13 1/4",,bottom
is
>12"---Don Ps plans show 13 3/16" & 10 5/8" but they are for the long fuse
>version..
>I know this mount fits the A50, A65, A75 & A80...beyound this I can't say
but I
>quite sure there are plenty of more knowlegeable fellows on this list that
can
>answer you regarding the 0-200
>JoeC
>Zion, Illinois
>
>Ted Brousseau wrote:
>
>> Joe,
>>
>> Did you build the mount or is it from another plane, like a Jenny? If
you
>> put an 0-200 would it require even another mount or are all Continental
>> mounts the same?
>>
>> Ted
>>
>> I was so glad you could fly with me at Brodhead.
>>
>> >true on the latter,,,D.P. does have plans available for the continental
motor
>> >mount..this is the route I'm taking....mount now completed and
installing
>> >controls and seat belt/harnesses and starting on the fuse fuel tank.
>> >JoeC
>> >Zion, Illinois
>> >
>> >Ted Brousseau wrote:
>> >
>> >> The Pietenpol I bought at the garage sale has a constructed fuselage.
I
>> >> don't have the plans so I need to ask the following question.
>> >>
>> >> Is the fuselage built for a particular engine or are the different
engines
>> >> handled through the construction of the motor mounts? From
discussions I
>> >> have glanced at (I never expected to be a Piet builder) I would guess
the
>> >> latter. True? I want to put a Continental on it.
>> >>
>> >> Thanks, Ted
>> >
>> >
>> >
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Davis, Marc" <marc.davis(at)intel.com> |
| Subject: | RE: Mazda engines |
The Mazda 13B has a firewall forward weight of 345lbs. I thing that might
be too heavy for a piet.
More Mazda info can be had at http://www.rotaryaviation.com/
<http://www.rotaryaviation.com/>
Marc
-----Original Message-----
From: tmbrant [SMTP:tmbrant(at)uswest.net]
Sent: Tuesday, August 17, 1999 4:23 PM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Mazda engines
Has anyone ever considered a Mazda Rotary engine in the Piet? I know, there
are probably some of you ablout ready to have a heart attack with the
idea... I have read and researched quite a bit on these, cause I was going
to use one in a Bearhawk, but that project has been put on hold for the
Piet. They have excellent HP to weight ratios! it would more thatn likely
need prop speed reduction also. Just curious. I know that many different
engines have been used, and was curious to see if this has been attempted
before.
Tom Brant
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | TJTREV(at)webtv.net (Theodore Trevorrow) |
Brian.
Sorry for misinformation. I just checked the Pietenpol page and the
manual is $ 27.00 including shipping. Ted.T
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Doug <ve6zh(at)oanet.com> |
| Subject: | Re: unique corvair |
I live in Alix,Alberta Canada.(central Alberta).
Doug Hunt.
> From: ToySat(at)aol.com
> To: Pietenpol Discussion
> Subject: Re: unique corvair
> Date: Wednesday, August 18, 1999 3:52 AM
>
> Doug Hunt: Where do you live? Ryder Olsen
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: unique corvair |
Well Doug, I guess I won't be coming your way this weekend. I'm near
Chicago. I will keep in touch though and one day I'll get a chance to see
the bird. Ryder
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | MACKORELL(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: continental engines |
Dear Mike,
Thank you for respoding to my email. I don't think it is, but is the motor
mount for the O-200 the same as the one shown for the A-65 shown in the Air
Camper plans? If the mount is different from that of the A-65, where can you
find engine mount plans for the O-200 or for the C85 if I choose to use that
one? With the O-200 did you have to use the short or long fuselage version.
With the higher horsepower engine did you have to modify the fire wall in any
way?
Thank You,
Jacob
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | MACKORELL(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Continental Engines |
Dear Tim,
Thanks for the info!
Jacob
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | MACKORELL(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Anyone close by? |
Dear fellow Pietenpolers,
Is there anyone, that has built an AirCamper, that lives within a reasonable
driving distance from Smyrna, TN (A suburb of Nashville). I would really like
to look at one first hand.
Jacob
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | tmbrant <tmbrant(at)uswest.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Mazda engines |
But the 12a is also another alternative... I'm not sure of the weight but
it's considerably less, and can still put out adaquate HP.
-----Original Message-----
From: Davis, Marc <marc.davis(at)intel.com>
Date: Wednesday, August 18, 1999 6:56 PM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: RE: Mazda engines
>The Mazda 13B has a firewall forward weight of 345lbs. I thing that might
>be too heavy for a piet.
>More Mazda info can be had at http://www.rotaryaviation.com/
><http://www.rotaryaviation.com/>
>Marc
>
>
>-----Original Message-----
>From: tmbrant [SMTP:tmbrant(at)uswest.net]
>Sent: Tuesday, August 17, 1999 4:23 PM
>To: Pietenpol Discussion
>Subject: Mazda engines
>
>Has anyone ever considered a Mazda Rotary engine in the Piet? I know,
there
>are probably some of you ablout ready to have a heart attack with the
>idea... I have read and researched quite a bit on these, cause I was going
>to use one in a Bearhawk, but that project has been put on hold for the
>Piet. They have excellent HP to weight ratios! it would more thatn likely
>need prop speed reduction also. Just curious. I know that many different
>engines have been used, and was curious to see if this has been attempted
>before.
>
>Tom Brant
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | fishin <fishin(at)wwa.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Pietenpol engine mount? |
sorry about that, 11 3/16 is correct per the plans---I must have been standing
on my head when I looked at my notes
JoeC
walter evans wrote:
> Joe,
> My plans show 11 3/16" top, and 10 5/8" bottom. Are our prints the same?
> These are the ones I got from D. Pietenpol.
> (drawn by A.C. Hanft 3-15-67)
> walt
> -----Original Message-----
> From: fishin <fishin(at)wwa.com>
> To: Pietenpol Discussion
> Date: Wednesday, August 18, 1999 4:31 PM
> Subject: Re: Pietenpol engine mount
>
> >using Don Pietenpols plans for the A65 mount I built a simple jig only
> >lengthening it to compensate for the short fuse version--my dimensions are,
> from
> >the engine mount to the mounting bracket centr hole top is 13 1/4",,bottom
> is
> >12"---Don Ps plans show 13 3/16" & 10 5/8" but they are for the long fuse
> >version..
> >I know this mount fits the A50, A65, A75 & A80...beyound this I can't say
> but I
> >quite sure there are plenty of more knowlegeable fellows on this list that
> can
> >answer you regarding the 0-200
> >JoeC
> >Zion, Illinois
> >
> >Ted Brousseau wrote:
> >
> >> Joe,
> >>
> >> Did you build the mount or is it from another plane, like a Jenny? If
> you
> >> put an 0-200 would it require even another mount or are all Continental
> >> mounts the same?
> >>
> >> Ted
> >>
> >> I was so glad you could fly with me at Brodhead.
> >>
> >> >true on the latter,,,D.P. does have plans available for the continental
> motor
> >> >mount..this is the route I'm taking....mount now completed and
> installing
> >> >controls and seat belt/harnesses and starting on the fuse fuel tank.
> >> >JoeC
> >> >Zion, Illinois
> >> >
> >> >Ted Brousseau wrote:
> >> >
> >> >> The Pietenpol I bought at the garage sale has a constructed fuselage.
> I
> >> >> don't have the plans so I need to ask the following question.
> >> >>
> >> >> Is the fuselage built for a particular engine or are the different
> engines
> >> >> handled through the construction of the motor mounts? From
> discussions I
> >> >> have glanced at (I never expected to be a Piet builder) I would guess
> the
> >> >> latter. True? I want to put a Continental on it.
> >> >>
> >> >> Thanks, Ted
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >
> >
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Jay White <jwhite(at)mindq.com> |
| Subject: | '60 Corvair Engine |
I've recently decided that I'm going to eventually build an Air Camper.
Because I don't have room yet to start work on the plane, I'm going to start
with the engine. After reading as much as I could find about this subject,
I've decided to go with a Corvair engine. I talked to a man recently who has
a 1960 Corvair, two door with a 110 HP engine (50K miles-rebuilt)and
automatic transmission. He says it ran two years ago when he parked it. It
hasn't been driven since. Would this engine be a good candidate for the Air
Camper? Thanks.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Jay White <jwhite(at)mindq.com> |
| Subject: | The Cost of Spruce for an Air Camper |
I was wondering if someone could give me an idea of what it's going to cost
just for the wood to build an Air Camper. Thanks.
________________________________________________________________________________
I got my copy of Kitpalnes today and while reading the article I noticed
the Piet written about used solid plywood ribs. Is this possible?? I am
interested in this as I did build a Stewart headwind using the same type
rib construction.
If so should I use a cap strip??
Steve
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Craig L.Hanson" <chanson(at)polar.polarcomm.com> |
Tom, I am currently looking for Hemlock myself. Our local lumber yard
here in Grand Forks, ND is checking. When we get some info I will let
you know.
Craig Hanson
----- Original Message -----
From: tmbrant
To: Pietenpol Discussion
Sent: Tuesday, August 17, 1999 6:26 PM
Subject: Hemlock
I am interested in Hemlock to use on the Piet. Does anyone know of
where it may be found in any supply and quality? I live in Minnesota,
near Minneapolis.
Tom Brant
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Plywood ribs. |
Steve
Mohawk, Avid, Kitfox, Prospector all use plywood ribs with cap strips.
Mohawk has a 1" wide cap strip and the spars are 2 1/2" alum tubing with
capstrip glued right over it connecting to aileron section. Not sure just
what the Kitfox has for sure.
Gordon
vistin(at)juno.com wrote:
> I got my copy of Kitpalnes today and while reading the article I noticed
> the Piet written about used solid plywood ribs. Is this possible?? I am
> interested in this as I did build a Stewart headwind using the same type
> rib construction.
> If so should I use a cap strip??
>
> Steve
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Ted Brousseau <nfn00979(at)naples.net> |
| Subject: | RE: Confused by Mike C |
Steve,
Not if you lived in Florida. At sea level, in the winter, you could
probably make it!!! ;-)
Ted
>Thats great, though, I guess I'm out of luck with my 60x80' lot still.
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Michael Brusilow <mb-albany(at)worldnet.att.net> |
noticed
the Piet written about used solid plywood ribs. Is this possible??>
Yes, I owned an Ed Sampson built Piet for a few years that had plywood
ribs with cap strips.
Mike B Piet N687MB ( Mr Sam )
I got my copy of Kitpalnes today and
while reading
the article I noticedthe Piet written about used solid plywood ribs.
Is this
possible??
Yes, I owned an Ed Sampson built Piet for a
few years
that had plywood ribs with cap strips.
Mike B Piet N687MB ( Mr Sam
)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Clay Spurgeon <cspurgeon(at)baseballexp.com> |
| Subject: | Re: The Cost of Spruce for an Air Camper |
Jay - If you're looking to go "aircraft grade", I have an e-mail in to Aircraft
Spruce and Specialty for a breakout on their Pietenpol wood kits. They offer
a spruce kit for $800 and three other Pietenpol kits, but I can't get the
details on these through my server. They're probably plywood,
hardware and metal kits. Give 'em a call if you want the details.
Clay
> From: Jay White <jwhite(at)mindq.com>
> Subject: The Cost of Spruce for an Air Camper
> Reply-to: Pietenpol Discussion
> I was wondering if someone could give me an idea of what it's going to cost
> just for the wood to build an Air Camper. Thanks.
>
>
>
Director of Marketing & Merchandising
Baseball Express, Inc.
210-348-7000 X4300
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Clay Spurgeon <cspurgeon(at)baseballexp.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Plywood ribs. |
Steve -
How did you like the Headwind? I used to have a set of plans and
always liked the design - did you use a VW engine? I see that
Replicraft is now offering plans again.......
Thanks,
Clay
> From: vistin(at)juno.com
> Subject: Plywood ribs.
> Reply-to: Pietenpol Discussion
> I got my copy of Kitpalnes today and while reading the article I noticed
> the Piet written about used solid plywood ribs. Is this possible?? I am
> interested in this as I did build a Stewart headwind using the same type
> rib construction.
> If so should I use a cap strip??
>
> Steve
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | william hutson <wihutson(at)yahoo.com> |
Does anyone know of a Piet project or a flying Piet in the Rapid City,
S.D. area?
Bill
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Greg Yotz <gyachts(at)kans.com> |
| Subject: | Re: plywood ribs |
I'd like to talk to someone that has actually built a Piet using plywood
ribs. I'd like to know how much heavier it makes the wing.
My VP-1 uses plywood ribs. They're much simpler and faster to make.
GY
-----Original Message-----
From: Michael Brusilow <mb-albany(at)worldnet.att.net>
To: Pietenpol Discussion
Date: Thursday, August 19, 1999 7:35 AM
Subject: plywood ribs
noticed
the Piet written about used solid plywood ribs. Is this possible??>
Yes, I owned an Ed Sampson built Piet for a few years that had
plywood ribs with cap strips.
Mike B Piet N687MB ( Mr Sam )
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | leonstefanhutks(at)webtv.net (Leon Stefan) |
Jay White; I bought a spruce kit from Western Ac. Supp. In Canada for
around 1,600.00 bucks plus $115 shipping. Wood was excellent. Also nice
to have someone who knows wood get you all the right stuff. Also nice to
houses.
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: '60 Corvair Engine |
Jay White wrote:
>
> I've recently decided that I'm going to eventually build an Air Camper.
> Because I don't have room yet to start work on the plane, I'm going to start
> with the engine. After reading as much as I could find about this subject,
> I've decided to go with a Corvair engine. I talked to a man recently who has
> a 1960 Corvair, two door with a 110 HP engine (50K miles-rebuilt)and
> automatic transmission. He says it ran two years ago when he parked it. It
> hasn't been driven since. Would this engine be a good candidate for the Air
> Camper? Thanks.
But the car, restore it and drive it.
Then get William Wynne's book:
http://www.omnispace.com/Corvair/
The car may be a '60, but who know what the engine is.
William's book gives engine numbers so you can positively
identify the mill, plus his manual gives you all the information
you need to do the conversion, including building and installing
the prop hub.
You can buy remanufactured components and assembly a zero time
engine, WAY cheaper than you can buy a questionable core, and
have the components rebuilt. Plus, you will end up with EXACTLY
the engine you need for your application.
I've recently put together a Corvair website, not much there
now, but there are links to suppliers and there is a link to a
corvair aircraft engine e-mail list that you can join.
http://www.angelfire.com/ca4/CorvAIRCRAFT/index.html
Pat
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: '60 Corvair Engine |
Pat Panzera wrote:
> But the car, restore it and drive it.
oops.... that should read, "BUY the car, .."
Pat
________________________________________________________________________________
John,
The Symantec Corp site http://www.symantec.com/avcenter/
is an encyclopedia of real and hoax viruses.
The majority of virus reports are hoaxes but the initiator has achieved his aim
by getting others to disseminate the hoax.
A quick lookup of the Symantec site resolves whether a virus alert is genuine or
a hoax.
Cheers,
Leo
--
On Sat, 14 Aug 1999 07:09:02 Pat Panzera wrote:
>Please do not pass along virus warnings with out checking it out.
>It's as simple as pulling up your favorite search engine, and
>typing in the name of the virus along with the word 'hoax'. You'll
>end up getting somehing like this:
>
>http://www.stiller.com/wobbler.htm
>
>john scott wrote:
>
>> New Virus!!!!
>> >> >>>> >
>> >> >>>> >
>> >> >>>> > It will arrive on e-mail titled CALIFORNIA.
>> >> >>>> >
>> >> >>>> > IBM and AOL have announced that it is very powerful, more so than
>> >> >>>> > Melissa, there is no remedy. It will eat all your information on
>> >> >>>> > the hard drive and also destroys Netscape Navigator and Microsoft
>> >> >>>> > Internet Explorer.
>
--== Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ ==--
Share what you know. Learn what you don't.
________________________________________________________________________________
John,
The Symantec Corp site http://www.symantec.com/avcenter/
is an encyclopedia of real and hoax viruses.
The majority of virus reports are hoaxes but the initiator has achieved his aim
by getting others to disseminate the hoax.
A quick lookup of the Symantec site resolves whether a virus alert is genuine or
a hoax.
Cheers,
Leo
--
On Sat, 14 Aug 1999 07:09:02 Pat Panzera wrote:
>Please do not pass along virus warnings with out checking it out.
>It's as simple as pulling up your favorite search engine, and
>typing in the name of the virus along with the word 'hoax'. You'll
>end up getting somehing like this:
>
>http://www.stiller.com/wobbler.htm
>
>john scott wrote:
>
>> New Virus!!!!
>> >> >>>> >
>> >> >>>> >
>> >> >>>> > It will arrive on e-mail titled CALIFORNIA.
>> >> >>>> >
>> >> >>>> > IBM and AOL have announced that it is very powerful, more so than
>> >> >>>> > Melissa, there is no remedy. It will eat all your information on
>> >> >>>> > the hard drive and also destroys Netscape Navigator and Microsoft
>> >> >>>> > Internet Explorer.
>
--== Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ ==--
Share what you know. Learn what you don't.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Doug Sheets <doug_sheets(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | Re: The Cost of Spruce for an Air Camper |
Jay & Clay:
I bought the Piet wood kit from AS&S and it is NOWHERE near the right stuff
for the Aircamper. I think now that I know the difference between an
Aircamper and a GN1 that they may have the wood for a GN1. The capstrips
were 1/4 x 1/4 not 1/4 x 1/2 as shown in the plans and the center section
spars were too short to use based on my 1933 Aircamper plans. Several pieces
didn't match so I ended up buying a project from a couple guys that went
thru the plans and ordered each piece. Also AS&S DOES NOT include any
plywood for $823; only the spruce pieces.
Doug
>From: Clay Spurgeon <cspurgeon(at)baseballexp.com>
>Reply-To: Pietenpol Discussion
>To: Pietenpol Discussion
>Subject: Re: The Cost of Spruce for an Air Camper
>Date: Thu, 19 Aug 1999 08:20:22 +0000
>
>Jay - If you're looking to go "aircraft grade", I have an e-mail in to
>Aircraft
>Spruce and Specialty for a breakout on their Pietenpol wood kits. They
>offer
>a spruce kit for $800 and three other Pietenpol kits, but I can't get the
>details on these through my server. They're probably plywood,
>hardware and metal kits. Give 'em a call if you want the details.
>
>Clay
>
>
> > From: Jay White <jwhite(at)mindq.com>
> > Subject: The Cost of Spruce for an Air Camper
> > Reply-to: Pietenpol Discussion
>
> > I was wondering if someone could give me an idea of what it's going to
>cost
> > just for the wood to build an Air Camper. Thanks.
> >
> >
> >
>Director of Marketing & Merchandising
>Baseball Express, Inc.
>210-348-7000 X4300
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | TXTdragger(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: The Cost of Spruce for an Air Camper |
THANK YOU DOUG..............how interesting, hopr you got money back
John D
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Ken Beanlands <kbeanlan(at)spots.ab.ca> |
| Subject: | Re: Plywood ribs. |
I don't know about the Piet, but I did the same change on my Christavia. I
used 1/4" mahogany ply and cut lightening holes. I didn't use capstrips,
but if I had my time back, I would have. The ribs will easily bow between
the spars without them.
As I'm not fully familiar with the piet, I don't know if it has
compression struts (although I suspect they probably do). If not, the
strength of the rib becomes an even greater concern. The old Auster was
built without dedicated compression struts. Instead, four or five of the
ribs were built from approx 3/8" 4130 steel square tubes in a trus style.
They did tripple duty as compression strut, wing rib and fuel tank mount.
Quite an ingenious design. Anyway, this is one plane where substituting in
ply ribs would cause some definite weakening of the wing ;-)
BTW, It was neat to see SteveE's plane in the completitions section of
that same magazine. Way to go.
Ken
On Wed, 18 Aug 1999 vistin(at)juno.com wrote:
> I got my copy of Kitpalnes today and while reading the article I noticed
> the Piet written about used solid plywood ribs. Is this possible?? I am
> interested in this as I did build a Stewart headwind using the same type
> rib construction.
> If so should I use a cap strip??
>
> Steve
>
Ken Beanlands B.Eng (Aerospace)
Calgary, Alberta, Canada
Christavia MK 1 C-GREN
<http://www.spots.ab.ca/~kbeanlan>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | mbell1(at)columbiaenergygroup.com |
Looking at the plans, I can't tell weather there are gussets on both sides of
each rib or only one side. Both seems like overkill, but . . . ?
The same goes for the fuse. Part of the fuse is plywood covered. Does that
take care of the gussets for that section or are gussets on the inside as
well? Areas of the fuse not covered with ply, gussets on the inside, outside,
both sides?
Thanks all,
Mike Bell
Columbia, SC
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | RE: '60 Corvair Engine |
Jay,
I've read on this list that it is recommended that only Corvair engines of
1964 or newer be used as an aircraft engine. I'll try to find the comment
and repost it.
Arden
> -----Original Message-----
> Panzera
> Sent: Thursday, August 19, 1999 8:43 AM
> To: Pietenpol Discussion
> Subject: Re: '60 Corvair Engine
>
>
> Jay White wrote:
> >
> > I've recently decided that I'm going to eventually build an Air Camper.
> > Because I don't have room yet to start work on the plane, I'm
> going to start
> > with the engine. After reading as much as I could find about
> this subject,
> > I've decided to go with a Corvair engine. I talked to a man
> recently who has
> > a 1960 Corvair, two door with a 110 HP engine (50K miles-rebuilt)and
> > automatic transmission. He says it ran two years ago when he
> parked it. It
> > hasn't been driven since. Would this engine be a good candidate
> for the Air
> > Camper? Thanks.
>
>
> But the car, restore it and drive it.
>
> Then get William Wynne's book:
> http://www.omnispace.com/Corvair/
>
> The car may be a '60, but who know what the engine is.
> William's book gives engine numbers so you can positively
> identify the mill, plus his manual gives you all the information
> you need to do the conversion, including building and installing
> the prop hub.
>
> You can buy remanufactured components and assembly a zero time
> engine, WAY cheaper than you can buy a questionable core, and
> have the components rebuilt. Plus, you will end up with EXACTLY
> the engine you need for your application.
>
> I've recently put together a Corvair website, not much there
> now, but there are links to suppliers and there is a link to a
> corvair aircraft engine e-mail list that you can join.
> http://www.angelfire.com/ca4/CorvAIRCRAFT/index.html
>
> Pat
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Doug Sheets <doug_sheets(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | Re: The Cost of Spruce for an Air Camper |
No, I didn't bother - Now I have wood for 1-1/4 Piets!!!
>From: TXTdragger(at)aol.com
>Reply-To: Pietenpol Discussion
>To: Pietenpol Discussion
>Subject: Re: The Cost of Spruce for an Air Camper
>Date: Thu, 19 Aug 1999 10:42:58 -0400 (EDT)
>
>THANK YOU DOUG..............how interesting, hopr you got money back
>
>John D
________________________________________________________________________________
NOt overkill, gusset both sides of the ribs. Every joint on the fuse is
gussetted either by sheeting or by a gusset. It does take a little
visualising to determine which will cover the joint.
Steve Eldredge
IT Services
Brigham Young University
> -----Original Message-----
> mbell1(at)columbiaenergygroup.com
> Sent: Thursday, August 19, 1999 9:14 AM
> To: Pietenpol Discussion
> Subject: Re: Rib Gussets
>
>
> Looking at the plans, I can't tell weather there are gussets
> on both sides of
> each rib or only one side. Both seems like overkill, but . . . ?
>
> The same goes for the fuse. Part of the fuse is plywood
> covered. Does that
> take care of the gussets for that section or are gussets on
> the inside as
> well? Areas of the fuse not covered with ply, gussets on
> the inside, outside,
> both sides?
>
> Thanks all,
>
> Mike Bell
> Columbia, SC
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | mboynton(at)excite.com |
| Subject: | Re: Vertical Systems |
Walt Evans,
Lars Nelson's phone number is (805) 967-1415. Hope this helps.
Mark Boynton
Gilbert, Arizona
> The address for Lars Nelson / Vertical Systems
>
> Vertical Systems
> 34 Paradise Road
> Santa Barbara, Ca. 93105
> e-mail: vertsys(at)west.net (this may not be working)
>
> Lars is active with this only if you prod him a bit. The Type II
Transporter
> Mountain / Alpine gear assembly that you need for this is pretty hard to
find
> these days.
> Cheers,
> Warren.
>
_______
Get FREE voicemail, fax and email at http://voicemail.excite.com
Talk online at http://voicechat.excite.com
________________________________________________________________________________
Mike, Gussets go on both sides of each rib. For the fuselage, look at drawing
1 of the 1933 plans drawn by O. C. Hoopman. Gussets go on both sides except for
the upper and lower diagonal struts. The only go on top of the top fuselage
and on bottom of bottom fuselage.
Bart D Conrad
Boeing Field Service
DC-9/MD-80/DC-10 & 737 Heavy Mtc
Phone: 713-640-5882/713-324-4192
Fax: 713-640-5891
Pager: 713-318-1625
> ----------
> From: mbell1(at)columbiaenergygroup.com[SMTP:mbell1(at)columbiaenergygroup.com]
> Sent: Thursday, August 19, 1999 8:14 AM
> To: Pietenpol Discussion
> Subject: Re: Rib Gussets
>
> Looking at the plans, I can't tell weather there are gussets on both sides of
> each rib or only one side. Both seems like overkill, but . . . ?
>
> The same goes for the fuse. Part of the fuse is plywood covered. Does that
> take care of the gussets for that section or are gussets on the inside as
> well? Areas of the fuse not covered with ply, gussets on the inside, outside,
> both sides?
>
> Thanks all,
>
> Mike Bell
> Columbia, SC
>
________________________________________________________________________________
unsubscribe piet
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | RE: Corvair engine codes and event announcement |
> -----Original Message-----
> Peter P Frantz
> Sent: Monday, October 19, 1998 10:33 AM
> To: Pietenpol Discussion
> Subject: Corvair engine codes and event announcement
>
>
> For you corvair powered flight enthusiasts, here's a little guidance for
> distinguishing a 110hp engine from others which may be less
> desirable. The
> engine suffix codes listed below refer to a number which was
> stamped on the
> crankcase of every corvair engine on the date that it was assembled for a
> particular car. The number appears on the same surface that the
> blower housing
> (fan shroud) is attached to, and it is in plain view (under years of old
> grease) just behind the area where you will find the oil filler
> hole. It's
> behind and to the left of the distributor, if you're looking at
> an engine from
> the back of a car. The following text is pasted from a letter I
> received after
> having trouble identifying engines.
>
> Before I paste the letter, I just thought I'd mention that for
> you folks in So.
> Cal., the greatest corvair show (and swap meet) on earth takes
> place in just a
> few weeks in Palm Springs. I've been told there are often many
> whole engines
> and countless parts available from people whose wives have
> demanded they clean
> out the garage. Here's a link:
> http://www.integrators.com/sdcc/GWFBT&SM.html
>
> Here's how to pick a 110 hp engine, quoted from Brent at the
> Corvair Center
> Forum:
> "fully half the Corvairs built from 1965-67 have a 110 HP
> Powerglide and the
> suffix code for this engine is RH-
> its common and a good engine. A worn out core that still runs is
> worth a couple
> hundred dollars, a really good
> used one is worth about a grand. I'd buy the best you can find,
> its cheaper in
> the long run.
>
> T1214RH would be an example, all will have a number like this-the number
> indicates the date of engine
> manufacture, in this case, December 14 of whatever year-
>
> Powerglide engines are superior rebuild candidates generally
> speaking, as the
> automatic limits the abuse
> potential. Things like connecting rods have significantly greater
> service life
> left in them on Powerglides of
> equivalent history to manual transmission engines of similar type.
>
> The RH code means also that the engine had neither factory Air
> Conditioning,
> nor an Air Injection Reactor- this
> is a plus, as ( the latter especially, ) they both increase
> engine temperatures
> somewhat.
>
> Normal lifespan of this engine in normal service is 150,000 ish
> miles. Many
> have gone twice that far. Also,
> many 1966 versions of this engine have the 95 HP cam, as
> Chevrolet apparently
> swapped it in production for a
> while-
>
> here are all the suffix codes for 95-110 hp engines for 1965-1969
>
> RA,RD,RE,RF,RG,RH,RJ,RK,RR,RS,RU,RV,RW,RX,QO,QP,QS,AC,AD,AE
>
> most combinations are oddballs, like AIR or A/C combos, or manual
> transmission
> jobs.
>
> Theres not too much risk of getting a 140/145 cid engine in a
> later case, but
> things can happen."
>
> --Peter
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | RE: Corvair PSRU (long) |
> -----Original Message-----
> Peter P Frantz
> Sent: Wednesday, September 30, 1998 6:45 PM
> To: Pietenpol Discussion
> Subject: Re: Corvair PSRU (long)
>
>
> Craig,
>
>
> >One thing that I am concerned about is it looks as though the
> >prop is raised up almost 3". Will that affect the flying
> >characteristics of the Piet?
>
>
> Yeah, that's a good question, and I don't have an answer. I'm
> sure there are
> many things to consider when altering the geometry of the source
> of power.
> Many Pietenpols have been built with PSRUs on engines such as the Escort,
> Subaru, Geo, etc... Each of these builders has probably had to
> consider these
> issues with each new power plant. Maybe its not critical, but
> I'll be sure to
> learn more if I decide to pursue this Corvair PSRU idea.
>
> Just a couple of posts ago, I was giving advice to follow BHPs
> plans, and now
> I'm talking about reduction gears. I have a lot of faith in the
> design, and
> I'd feel comfortable mounting a prop in direct drive
> configuration. However,
> I'm interested in this because of some warnings I received from a Corvair
> mechanic regarding stresses on the engine for which it was not
> designed. Now,
> I know Corvairs have been powering aircraft for 3 decades in direct drive
> configuration, but I also know that there have been some power
> failures leading
> to dead stick forced landings. I can't help but wonder if some
> of these power
> failures have been due to accelerated wear caused by thrust loads.
> Naturally, a PSRU would prevent that, but it may introduce other
> problems.
> Does anyone know of any Corvair engine failures? Has anybody
> disassembled a
> Corvair engine after many hours of flight?
>
> The following is an excerpt from a cautionary note I received
> from a Corvair
> mechanic who often posts over at the Corvair Center Forum. Its long, but
> pithy.
>
> The #1 aspect that makes me nervous about this project is attaching the
> prop to the crank nose-
>
> Theres some problems with a Corvair engine in that area, and I
> feel that it
> will compound them considerably if anything that big and/or with a thrust
> load is attached there. It is not unusual for a Corvair passenger car with
> a manual transmission to break the gear off, or the immediately adjacent
> crank main bearing, due primarily to fatigue. Also, the thrust surface of
> the bearing on a Corvair is barely adequate for intermittent thrust from
> shifting gears, and the support for the bearing insert is rather flexible-
> One thing that is evident about Corvair engines is that they are rather
> 'rubbery' in that things move around and expand/contract a lot.
>
> To illustrate the crank bearing arrangement a bit better, a Corvair has a
> 17 lb. flywheel assembly stock. GM found it necessary to move the #4 main
> bearing 0.0015" downwards from the centerline of the other three main
> bearings to even out the wear caused by the drooping crank (it bends that
> far from the weight). The crank #4 bearing is also offset towards the #6
> cylinder (drivers side forward in a passenger car) by 0.0015" to remove
> keep a noise and fatigue problem caused by a harmonic vibration caused in
> the crank that is excited by the firing of the #6 cylinder. This
> correction
> is made in the bearing shell insert in some engines, and at the bore in
> others.It used to cause a bonk-bonk noise in Corvair engines , and it took
> GM until 1963 to figure out the cause.
>
> Fatigue failures related to the crankshaft inevitably manifest themselves
> on the #4 main bearing also-
>
> The Corvair engine was originally engineered to use only an automatic
> transmission, and the addition of a flywheel and manual
> transmission was an
> afterthought, and had a curious execution, I imagine you may have seen how
> a Corvair flywheel is made-it has a very unusual design to cancel harmonic
> vibrations - a solid flywheel does not work on the Corvair engine as an
> example, and leads to rapid fatigue failure in most cases.
>
> The 1964-69 engine uses a very good forged steel crankshaft, and
> the 140 HP
> and Turbocharged engine have further refinements, in that it is
> tufftrided,
> (hardened) for maximum fatigue strength. It is a very good peice.The gear
> on the end of the crank that drives the camshaft is not a particularly
> fancy item, its made of regular 4130 or similar material.
>
> Corvair engines work great at what they're designed to do- if you
> use it in
> a similar fashion you'll have no special concerns. They are very capable
> and efficient at providing a sustained 15-40 horsepower output, and short
> bursts of greater power- but long bouts of high power output will hurt
> them, so be conscious of that.
>
> To drive a Corvair automobile at 60 mph takes about 22 hp as example. this
> is about 100lbs of 'thrust' to overcome aerodynamic and road drag- you can
> safely assume that a propeller attached to a Corvair engine crank
> at say 80
> hp output will be tugging on the crank to the tune of 300-400 lbs. I think
> this is far too much strain. a 100 LB load would be too much in my view,
> actually. I am aware that it has been done, and could work, with
> accelerated wear, but feel its a false economy, and if it causes a failure
> (likely in my view) it could be a catastrophic economy.
>
> I would strongly encourage you to use a separate propeller support
> arrangement, with its own bearings, and take drive off the crank
> nose only.
> Theres other ways to take the drive off the engine, and I'd look into it.
> An inexpensive and reliable source of reduction gearing is as near as a
> Hydra Matic or similar big transmission- to adapt a planetary set out of
> one of those would be extremely easy. A direct drive arrangement with a
> slightly flexible coupling might be a good idea also. Please think about
> doing this, I get terribly nervous about the idea of anything hanging from
> that crank. :-)
>
> The messages on the Corvair Forum were essentially me telling someone that
> they should not direct drive off the crank, and a strong criticism of my
> outlook from another posting correspondent that he felt it would work.
>
> Theres more to this aspect than meets the eye, and I feel its
> worth playing
> it safe. If you are interested in the fatigue characteristics etc. of the
> crank I have more information- but under MAXIMUM load a new Corvair engine
> running at normal temperature will explode with catastrophic
> crank/connecting rod failure in 11 hours, according to Chevrolet's fatigue
> tests.This is GM's passenger car standard, essentially- thats how they
> decide what is an acceptable connecting rod beam size, as example, its not
> a shortcoming of the Corvair engine. This would be similar to a full
> throttle run for 11 hours installed in a car. Naturally, the less
> often the
> engine is run at high speed/load/temp the longer it lasts, but theres
> definite limits.
>
> >One thing that I am concerned about is it looks as though the
> >prop is raised up almost 3". Will that affect the flying
> >characteristics of the Piet?
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: The Cost of Spruce for an Air Camper |
Thats listed as the GN-1 Aircamper in the 1998/99 catalog #02-04700 823.00
In the 1999/2000 catalog GN-1 Aircamper 02-04700 is listed at 1,300.00
Looks like Aircraft Spruce is trying to cash in on the new popularity of the Air
Camper because most of the other wood kits have stayed the same in price.
Gordon
Clay Spurgeon wrote:
> Jay - If you're looking to go "aircraft grade", I have an e-mail in to Aircraft
> Spruce and Specialty for a breakout on their Pietenpol wood kits. They offer
> a spruce kit for $800 and three other Pietenpol kits, but I can't get the
> details on these through my server. They're probably plywood,
> hardware and metal kits. Give 'em a call if you want the details.
>
> Clay
>
> > From: Jay White <jwhite(at)mindq.com>
> > Subject: The Cost of Spruce for an Air Camper
> > Reply-to: Pietenpol Discussion
>
> > I was wondering if someone could give me an idea of what it's going to cost
> > just for the wood to build an Air Camper. Thanks.
> >
> >
> >
> Director of Marketing & Merchandising
> Baseball Express, Inc.
> 210-348-7000 X4300
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: The Cost of Spruce for an Air Camper |
Like I said in my last message.
Aircraft Spruce lists the kit for the GN-1
Not for the Aircamper.
Apples and Oranges again.
I have heard nothing but the best about that Canada company that sells kits for
the Real Aircamper.
I wonder why AS & S does not sell a wood kit for the aircamper.
Is is because more people buying the 25.00 GN plans don't know what they are
buying?
May be a better design amyway.
Gordon
Doug Sheets wrote:
> Jay & Clay:
> I bought the Piet wood kit from AS&S and it is NOWHERE near the right stuff
> for the Aircamper. I think now that I know the difference between an
> Aircamper and a GN1 that they may have the wood for a GN1. The capstrips
> were 1/4 x 1/4 not 1/4 x 1/2 as shown in the plans and the center section
> spars were too short to use based on my 1933 Aircamper plans. Several pieces
> didn't match so I ended up buying a project from a couple guys that went
> thru the plans and ordered each piece. Also AS&S DOES NOT include any
> plywood for $823; only the spruce pieces.
> Doug
>
> >From: Clay Spurgeon <cspurgeon(at)baseballexp.com>
> >Reply-To: Pietenpol Discussion
> >To: Pietenpol Discussion
> >Subject: Re: The Cost of Spruce for an Air Camper
> >Date: Thu, 19 Aug 1999 08:20:22 +0000
> >
> >Jay - If you're looking to go "aircraft grade", I have an e-mail in to
> >Aircraft
> >Spruce and Specialty for a breakout on their Pietenpol wood kits. They
> >offer
> >a spruce kit for $800 and three other Pietenpol kits, but I can't get the
> >details on these through my server. They're probably plywood,
> >hardware and metal kits. Give 'em a call if you want the details.
> >
> >Clay
> >
> >
> > > From: Jay White <jwhite(at)mindq.com>
> > > Subject: The Cost of Spruce for an Air Camper
> > > Reply-to: Pietenpol Discussion
> >
> > > I was wondering if someone could give me an idea of what it's going to
> >cost
> > > just for the wood to build an Air Camper. Thanks.
> > >
> > >
> > >
> >Director of Marketing & Merchandising
> >Baseball Express, Inc.
> >210-348-7000 X4300
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Michael D Cuy <Michael.D.Cuy(at)lerc.nasa.gov> |
| Subject: | Wicks vs. Aircraft Spruce |
Group- Just as a side note: During the 4.5 years I spent
getting very familiar with the phone, my Mastercard, and
a/c supply catalogs (and don't forget Mr. UPS man) I found
that Wicks a/c Supply in St. Louis was just a way better
company to deal with for building my Piet than Aircraft Spruce
and Specialty. Service was better, more accurate shipments,
good response in shipping time, and mostly better prices.
I ordered my wing spars and all the wood from Wicks a few
weeks before Osh '96 and asked them if they would truck it
to Osh where I would be to pick it up....rather than paying
trucking costs to my home. No problem. I met up with
Dan Dieters from Wicks at thier Osh. display and followed
him out to the truck where my spruce was all boxed and
ready to go ontop my vehicle. Piece of cake.
Mike C.
Group- Just as a side note: During the 4.5 years I spent
getting very familiar with the phone, my Mastercard, and
a/c supply catalogs (and don't forget Mr. UPS man) I found
that Wicks a/c Supply in St. Louis was just a way better
company to deal with for building my Piet than Aircraft Spruce
and Specialty. Service was better, more accurate shipments,
good response in shipping time, and mostly better prices.
I ordered my wing spars and all the wood from Wicks a
few
weeks before Osh '96 and asked them if they would truck it
to Osh where I would be to pick it up....rather than paying
trucking costs to my home. No problem. I met up with
Dan Dieters from Wicks at thier Osh. display and followed
him out to the truck where my spruce was all boxed and
ready to go ontop my vehicle. Piece of cake.
Mike C.
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Plywood ribs. |
My Flybaby biplane had 1/16" plywood ribs with 1/4" x 1/2" capstrips ROUTED
lengthwise to accept the ribs. VERY strong and light. It was difficult to
keep the same airfoil shape, one rib to another due to the variations in the
routing. Very light, very strong. End ribs had extra verticles glued on for
fabric tension..........4130 tube compression tubes as well.
Earl Myers
-----Original Message-----
From: Ken Beanlands <kbeanlan(at)spots.ab.ca>
Date: Thursday, August 19, 1999 10:54 AM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Plywood ribs.
>I don't know about the Piet, but I did the same change on my Christavia. I
>used 1/4" mahogany ply and cut lightening holes. I didn't use capstrips,
>but if I had my time back, I would have. The ribs will easily bow between
>the spars without them.
>
>As I'm not fully familiar with the piet, I don't know if it has
>compression struts (although I suspect they probably do). If not, the
>strength of the rib becomes an even greater concern. The old Auster was
>built without dedicated compression struts. Instead, four or five of the
>ribs were built from approx 3/8" 4130 steel square tubes in a trus style.
>They did tripple duty as compression strut, wing rib and fuel tank mount.
>Quite an ingenious design. Anyway, this is one plane where substituting in
>ply ribs would cause some definite weakening of the wing ;-)
>
>BTW, It was neat to see SteveE's plane in the completitions section of
>that same magazine. Way to go.
>
>Ken
>
>On Wed, 18 Aug 1999 vistin(at)juno.com wrote:
>
>> I got my copy of Kitpalnes today and while reading the article I noticed
>> the Piet written about used solid plywood ribs. Is this possible?? I am
>> interested in this as I did build a Stewart headwind using the same type
>> rib construction.
>> If so should I use a cap strip??
>>
>> Steve
>>
>
>Ken Beanlands B.Eng (Aerospace)
>Calgary, Alberta, Canada
>Christavia MK 1 C-GREN
><http://www.spots.ab.ca/~kbeanlan>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
Who sells the plans drawn by Hoopman?
Is it St. Croix
Gordon
"Conrad, Bart D" wrote:
> Mike, Gussets go on both sides of each rib. For the fuselage, look at drawing
1 of the 1933 plans drawn by O. C. Hoopman. Gussets go on both sides except
for the upper and lower diagonal struts. The only go on top of the top fuselage
and on bottom of bottom fuselage.
>
> Bart D Conrad
> Boeing Field Service
> DC-9/MD-80/DC-10 & 737 Heavy Mtc
> Phone: 713-640-5882/713-324-4192
> Fax: 713-640-5891
> Pager: 713-318-1625
>
> > ----------
> > From: mbell1(at)columbiaenergygroup.com[SMTP:mbell1(at)columbiaenergygroup.com]
> > Sent: Thursday, August 19, 1999 8:14 AM
> > To: Pietenpol Discussion
> > Subject: Re: Rib Gussets
> >
> > Looking at the plans, I can't tell weather there are gussets on both sides
of
> > each rib or only one side. Both seems like overkill, but . . . ?
> >
> > The same goes for the fuse. Part of the fuse is plywood covered. Does that
> > take care of the gussets for that section or are gussets on the inside as
> > well? Areas of the fuse not covered with ply, gussets on the inside, outside,
> > both sides?
> >
> > Thanks all,
> >
> > Mike Bell
> > Columbia, SC
> >
________________________________________________________________________________
ALL JOINTS ARE TO BE GUSSETED ON BOTH SIDES OF JOINTS rergardless of it
being a rib or longerons. That is the method of transmitting loads thru the
airframe. End joints/end grain don't provide squat except extreme
compression.
-----Original Message-----
From: mbell1(at)columbiaenergygroup.com <mbell1(at)columbiaenergygroup.com>
Date: Thursday, August 19, 1999 11:22 AM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Rib Gussets
>Looking at the plans, I can't tell weather there are gussets on both sides
of
>each rib or only one side. Both seems like overkill, but . . . ?
>
>The same goes for the fuse. Part of the fuse is plywood covered. Does
that
>take care of the gussets for that section or are gussets on the inside as
>well? Areas of the fuse not covered with ply, gussets on the inside,
outside,
>both sides?
>
>Thanks all,
>
>Mike Bell
>Columbia, SC
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Warren Shoun <wbnb(at)earthlink.net> |
Hoopman sells the plans drawn by Hoopman
Orrin C. Hoopman
800 17th St. SW
Austin, MN 55912
Gordon Brimhall wrote:
> Who sells the plans drawn by Hoopman?
>
> Is it St. Croix
>
> Gordon
>
> "Conrad, Bart D" wrote:
>
> > Mike, Gussets go on both sides of each rib. For the fuselage, look at drawing
1 of the 1933 plans drawn by O. C. Hoopman. Gussets go on both sides except
for the upper and lower diagonal struts. The only go on top of the top fuselage
and on bottom of bottom fuselage.
> >
> > Bart D Conrad
> > Boeing Field Service
> > DC-9/MD-80/DC-10 & 737 Heavy Mtc
> > Phone: 713-640-5882/713-324-4192
> > Fax: 713-640-5891
> > Pager: 713-318-1625
> >
> > > ----------
> > > From: mbell1(at)columbiaenergygroup.com[SMTP:mbell1(at)columbiaenergygroup.com]
> > > Sent: Thursday, August 19, 1999 8:14 AM
> > > To: Pietenpol Discussion
> > > Subject: Re: Rib Gussets
> > >
> > > Looking at the plans, I can't tell weather there are gussets on both sides
of
> > > each rib or only one side. Both seems like overkill, but . . . ?
> > >
> > > The same goes for the fuse. Part of the fuse is plywood covered. Does that
> > > take care of the gussets for that section or are gussets on the inside as
> > > well? Areas of the fuse not covered with ply, gussets on the inside, outside,
> > > both sides?
> > >
> > > Thanks all,
> > >
> > > Mike Bell
> > > Columbia, SC
> > >
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Ken Beanlands <kbeanlan(at)spots.ab.ca> |
| Subject: | Re: Wicks vs. Aircraft Spruce |
My experience has been exactly the same (except for the personal delivery
at OSH ;-). I do all my shopping from Wicks. The people that answer the
phone seem to be a lot more knowledgable than ASS.
Ken
On Thu, 19 Aug 1999, Michael D Cuy wrote:
> Group- Just as a side note: During the 4.5 years I spent
> getting very familiar with the phone, my Mastercard, and
> a/c supply catalogs (and don't forget Mr. UPS man) I found
> that Wicks a/c Supply in St. Louis was just a way better
> company to deal with for building my Piet than Aircraft Spruce
> and Specialty. Service was better, more accurate shipments,
> good response in shipping time, and mostly better prices.
> I ordered my wing spars and all the wood from Wicks a few
> weeks before Osh '96 and asked them if they would truck it
> to Osh where I would be to pick it up....rather than paying
> trucking costs to my home. No problem. I met up with
> Dan Dieters from Wicks at thier Osh. display and followed
> him out to the truck where my spruce was all boxed and
> ready to go ontop my vehicle. Piece of cake.
>
> Mike C.
>
Ken Beanlands B.Eng (Aerospace)
Calgary, Alberta, Canada
Christavia MK 1 C-GREN
<http://www.spots.ab.ca/~kbeanlan>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Michael D Cuy <Michael.D.Cuy(at)lerc.nasa.gov> |
>My experience has been exactly the same (except for the personal delivery
>at OSH ;-). I do all my shopping from Wicks. The people that answer the
>phone seem to be a lot more knowledgable than ASS.
>
>Ken
Ken- Thanks for the testimony that matches my experience.
I was hoping the trend was just not something that happened to me.
PS- Exactly right about the people.....good airplane people.
They make sure every employee gets at least one hour of dual instruction
as a new employee to give them a taste of flight.
My experience has been exactly the same (except for the personal
delivery
at OSH ;-). I do all my shopping from Wicks. The people that answer
the
phone seem to be a lot more knowledgable than ASS.
Ken
Ken- Thanks for the testimony that matches my experience.
I was hoping the trend was just not something that happened to me.
PS- Exactly right about the people.....good airplane people.
They make sure every employee gets at least one hour of dual
instruction
as a new employee to give them a taste of flight.
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Wicks vs. Aircraft Spruce |
That may be true Mike.
I also heard that AC Spruce bought out Wicks.
Can anybody confirm that?
Gordon
Michael D Cuy wrote:
> Group- Just as a side note: During the 4.5 years I spent
> getting very familiar with the phone, my Mastercard, and
> a/c supply catalogs (and don't forget Mr. UPS man) I found
> that Wicks a/c Supply in St. Louis was just a way better
> company to deal with for building my Piet than Aircraft Spruce
> and Specialty. Service was better, more accurate shipments,
> good response in shipping time, and mostly better prices.
> I ordered my wing spars and all the wood from Wicks a few
> weeks before Osh '96 and asked them if they would truck it
> to Osh where I would be to pick it up....rather than paying
> trucking costs to my home. No problem. I met up with
> Dan Dieters from Wicks at thier Osh. display and followed
> him out to the truck where my spruce was all boxed and
> ready to go ontop my vehicle. Piece of cake.
>
> Mike C.
That may be true Mike.
I also heard that AC Spruce bought out Wicks.
Can anybody confirm that?
Gordon
Michael D Cuy wrote:
Group- Just as a side note: During the 4.5
years I spent
getting very familiar with the phone, my Mastercard, and
a/c supply catalogs (and don't forget Mr. UPS man) I found
that Wicks a/c Supply in St. Louis was just a way better
company to deal with for building my Piet than Aircraft Spruce
and Specialty. Service was better, more accurate shipments,
good response in shipping time, and mostly better prices.
I ordered my wing spars and all the wood from Wicks
a few
weeks before Osh '96 and asked them if they would truck it
to Osh where I would be to pick it up....rather than paying
trucking costs to my home. No problem. I met up with
Dan Dieters from Wicks at thier Osh. display and followed
him out to the truck where my spruce was all boxed and
ready to go ontop my vehicle. Piece of cake.
Mike C.
________________________________________________________________________________
Didn't Hoopman draw the plans for Bernard? or was he a friend back when?
How much are his plans?
Thanks
Gordon
Warren Shoun wrote:
> Hoopman sells the plans drawn by Hoopman
>
> Orrin C. Hoopman
> 800 17th St. SW
> Austin, MN 55912
>
> Gordon Brimhall wrote:
>
> > Who sells the plans drawn by Hoopman?
> >
> > Is it St. Croix
> >
> > Gordon
> >
> > "Conrad, Bart D" wrote:
> >
> > > Mike, Gussets go on both sides of each rib. For the fuselage, look at drawing
1 of the 1933 plans drawn by O. C. Hoopman. Gussets go on both sides except
for the upper and lower diagonal struts. The only go on top of the top fuselage
and on bottom of bottom fuselage.
> > >
> > > Bart D Conrad
> > > Boeing Field Service
> > > DC-9/MD-80/DC-10 & 737 Heavy Mtc
> > > Phone: 713-640-5882/713-324-4192
> > > Fax: 713-640-5891
> > > Pager: 713-318-1625
> > >
> > > > ----------
> > > > From: mbell1(at)columbiaenergygroup.com[SMTP:mbell1(at)columbiaenergygroup.com]
> > > > Sent: Thursday, August 19, 1999 8:14 AM
> > > > To: Pietenpol Discussion
> > > > Subject: Re: Rib Gussets
> > > >
> > > > Looking at the plans, I can't tell weather there are gussets on both sides
of
> > > > each rib or only one side. Both seems like overkill, but . . . ?
> > > >
> > > > The same goes for the fuse. Part of the fuse is plywood covered. Does
that
> > > > take care of the gussets for that section or are gussets on the inside
as
> > > > well? Areas of the fuse not covered with ply, gussets on the inside,
outside,
> > > > both sides?
> > > >
> > > > Thanks all,
> > > >
> > > > Mike Bell
> > > > Columbia, SC
> > > >
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Warren Shoun <wbnb(at)earthlink.net> |
Took the Alexander Fabric Covering course thru Aircraft Spruce, in
the back floor area of their warehouse. During a break, walked into
their Spruce storage and cutting room, which is a small part of their
floor space, as well as of their revenue business.
From the shipping labels, their spruce comes from a smallish mill in
Washington State. The day I was their, pieces being cut for order were
NOT being cut by a person who had any idea of how to read end grain.
The order was being cut to dimension only. Would not recommend that
this be the primary source for construction spruce.
However, they do have a $15.00 package of "scraps" of both spruce
and ply that is a true bargain. Except for the longerons and spars, I
think a guy could probably get most of the rest of the material from
these packs for less than $300.00. I have purchased two of these across
the counter, and both had something that was at least 5 feet in length.
You would still need to be your own grain selector, and if you have more
time than $$, it is my opinion that this could be a great deal.
If you stand around their lobby for any length of time, you will see
that their spruce business is a very small portion of what they actually
sell. It is definitely worth the visit.
Warren.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | TXTdragger(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: The Cost of Spruce for an Air Camper |
the 2nd .25pirt will be light.......air'y, but might be hard to fly.......LOL
JD
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Petri David S CDR <David.Petri(at)Peterson.af.mil> |
| Subject: | Big Guys in Piets |
Hi folks,
How well do big guys fit in an Air Camper? I'm 3 meters tall and this is
always a concern of mine. I don't fit in much of anything. No local Piets
that I know of that I can hop into for a sizing.
Any insight would be appreciated.
Cheers,
Dave
David.Petri(at)Peterson.af.mil
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Warren Shoun <wbnb(at)earthlink.net> |
I purchased a set of plans from Bernard in the early 60's, and last year also
purchased a set from St. Croix and also directly from Orrin Hoopman.
All three sets are the same. All were drawn by Hoopman in May of 1934, which
rumor and hearsay tells me were updates of the drawings that he did for the
1932 Flying and Glider Manual. I think Orrin was something like 15 years old
in 1932. The same rumor tells me that
Bernard gave Orrin permission to sell the plans as drawn by him and I don't think
Don Pietenpol has ever attempted to revoke this permissive use.
I paid something like $75.00 for the plans set from Orrin, which included the
detail page of the wooden landing gear, the one page supplement of the long
fuselage corvair version, and a full size airfoil pattern, and a hand written
note from Orrin, which I keep with my
original plans from Bernard, also with a hand written note.
Warren
.
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | RE: Big Guys in Piets |
Three METERS!? Like 10 feet? Wow. Nope, no well I guess you could fit in
a piet, but forget the front cockpit and don't bother with a entry flop.
You will be the only piet pilot with unrestricted upward visibility. :) I
have given rides to folks up to 6'5" and they were fine.
Steve Eldredge
IT Services
Brigham Young University
> -----Original Message-----
> Petri David S CDR
> Sent: Thursday, August 19, 1999 11:53 AM
> To: Pietenpol Discussion
> Subject: Big Guys in Piets
>
>
> Hi folks,
> How well do big guys fit in an Air Camper? I'm 3 meters tall
> and this is
> always a concern of mine. I don't fit in much of anything.
> No local Piets
> that I know of that I can hop into for a sizing.
> Any insight would be appreciated.
> Cheers,
> Dave
>
> David.Petri(at)Peterson.af.mil
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
please try to unsubscribe through www.aircamper.org
thanks,
Steve Eldredge
IT Services
Brigham Young University
> -----Original Message-----
> Jeff Popoff
> Sent: Thursday, August 19, 1999 9:54 AM
> To: Pietenpol Discussion
> Subject:
>
>
> unsubscribe piet
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Ken Beanlands <kbeanlan(at)spots.ab.ca> |
| Subject: | Re: Big Guys in Piets |
3 meters = 9.84' ! WOW! we have the world's tallest pilot in our midst! I
certainly hope you meant 2 meters (6'-6.5") otherwise the only way to make
you fit would be to widen the fuselage to about 3.5', enlarge the rear
hole and remove the fron one all together. That way, you could sit in the
rear seat and use the fron pedals and stick.
Ken
On Thu, 19 Aug 1999, Petri David S CDR wrote:
> Hi folks,
> How well do big guys fit in an Air Camper? I'm 3 meters tall and this is
> always a concern of mine. I don't fit in much of anything. No local Piets
> that I know of that I can hop into for a sizing.
> Any insight would be appreciated.
> Cheers,
> Dave
>
> David.Petri(at)Peterson.af.mil
>
Ken Beanlands B.Eng (Aerospace)
Calgary, Alberta, Canada
Christavia MK 1 C-GREN
<http://www.spots.ab.ca/~kbeanlan>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Hoopman Plans |
Thanks Warren
That is good info for us who don't know the history behind all of this.
Gordon
Warren Shoun wrote:
> I purchased a set of plans from Bernard in the early 60's, and last year
also purchased a set from St. Croix and also directly from Orrin Hoopman.
> All three sets are the same. All were drawn by Hoopman in May of 1934, which
rumor and hearsay tells me were updates of the drawings that he did for the
1932 Flying and Glider Manual. I think Orrin was something like 15 years old
in 1932. The same rumor tells me that
> Bernard gave Orrin permission to sell the plans as drawn by him and I don't think
Don Pietenpol has ever attempted to revoke this permissive use.
> I paid something like $75.00 for the plans set from Orrin, which included
the detail page of the wooden landing gear, the one page supplement of the long
fuselage corvair version, and a full size airfoil pattern, and a hand written
note from Orrin, which I keep with my
> original plans from Bernard, also with a hand written note.
> Warren
> .
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Ken Beanlands <kbeanlan(at)spots.ab.ca> |
| Subject: | RE: Big Guys in Piets |
Forward vis would be fine too, he could just look out OVER the wing and
rad!
Ken
On Thu, 19 Aug 1999 steve(at)byu.edu wrote:
> Three METERS!? Like 10 feet? Wow. Nope, no well I guess you could fit in
> a piet, but forget the front cockpit and don't bother with a entry flop.
> You will be the only piet pilot with unrestricted upward visibility. :) I
> have given rides to folks up to 6'5" and they were fine.
>
> Steve Eldredge
> IT Services
> Brigham Young University
>
>
> > -----Original Message-----
> > Petri David S CDR
> > Sent: Thursday, August 19, 1999 11:53 AM
> > To: Pietenpol Discussion
> > Subject: Big Guys in Piets
> >
> >
> > Hi folks,
> > How well do big guys fit in an Air Camper? I'm 3 meters tall
> > and this is
> > always a concern of mine. I don't fit in much of anything.
> > No local Piets
> > that I know of that I can hop into for a sizing.
> > Any insight would be appreciated.
> > Cheers,
> > Dave
> >
> > David.Petri(at)Peterson.af.mil
> >
> >
>
Ken Beanlands B.Eng (Aerospace)
Calgary, Alberta, Canada
Christavia MK 1 C-GREN
<http://www.spots.ab.ca/~kbeanlan>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Petri David S CDR <David.Petri(at)Peterson.af.mil> |
| Subject: | RE: Big Guys in Piets |
3 meters with heels on, but 2 meters in bare feet!
Sorry for the typo. Mea culpa. Sure would look weird with the windscreen
on top of the wing, huh?
Cheers,
Dave
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Ken Beanlands [SMTP:kbeanlan(at)spots.ab.ca]
> Sent: Thursday, August 19, 1999 12:20 PM
> To: Pietenpol Discussion
> Subject: Re: Big Guys in Piets
>
> 3 meters = 9.84' ! WOW! we have the world's tallest pilot in our midst! I
> certainly hope you meant 2 meters (6'-6.5") otherwise the only way to make
> you fit would be to widen the fuselage to about 3.5', enlarge the rear
> hole and remove the fron one all together. That way, you could sit in the
> rear seat and use the fron pedals and stick.
>
> Ken
>
> On Thu, 19 Aug 1999, Petri David S CDR wrote:
>
> > Hi folks,
> > How well do big guys fit in an Air Camper? I'm 3 meters tall and this
> is
> > always a concern of mine. I don't fit in much of anything. No local
> Piets
> > that I know of that I can hop into for a sizing.
> > Any insight would be appreciated.
> > Cheers,
> > Dave
> >
> > David.Petri(at)Peterson.af.mil
> >
>
> Ken Beanlands B.Eng (Aerospace)
> Calgary, Alberta, Canada
> Christavia MK 1 C-GREN
> <http://www.spots.ab.ca/~kbeanlan>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | RE: Big Guys in Piets |
I'm 6' 3" at 180 lbs and shoulders touch both sides. I will probably move the
rudder bar a little forward. The biggest thing for comfort and fit will be to
design/install a seat that fits my contour and give me a more laid back feeling.
I have seen a go-cart seat installed in a Piet in Tulsa. I can't remember
the gentlemans name but he had several homebuilts in his hangar that he had
built. Jim Ballew (Piet builder) introduced me to him. Tulsa is where I got
hooked into Piet building. Saw one at a McDonnell Douglas open house in Tulsa
shortly before they closed the doors. I believe it was Leroy Updykes Piet that
gave me the bug. He had two, one black and I believe built during the 30's
and another one yellow that was built more recently. Enough rammbling!
Bart D Conrad
Boeing Field Service
DC-9/MD-80/DC-10 & 737 Heavy Mtc
Phone: 713-640-5882/713-324-4192
Fax: 713-640-5891
Pager: 713-318-1625
> ----------
> From: Petri David S CDR[SMTP:David.Petri(at)Peterson.af.mil]
> Sent: Thursday, August 19, 1999 10:52 AM
> To: Pietenpol Discussion
> Subject: Big Guys in Piets
>
> Hi folks,
> How well do big guys fit in an Air Camper? I'm 3 meters tall and this is
> always a concern of mine. I don't fit in much of anything. No local Piets
> that I know of that I can hop into for a sizing.
> Any insight would be appreciated.
> Cheers,
> Dave
>
> David.Petri(at)Peterson.af.mil
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Copinfo <Copinfo(at)ix.Netcom.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Corvair Engine Failure |
Yes, my Pietenpol had a Corvair engine and the pilot dead sticked it due to
loss of power. It was his own fault and not the engines. Witnesses said
his engine was icing up before he took off and it got worse every trip
around the pattern. I had the engine running and it was super but I think
car engines belong on cars so I sold the Corvair with a new Hegy Prop and
bought a Continental A-65. It cost a little more but it's your butt up
there. Oh, I had the crank and case reworked and put a new cam shaft in
the engine and still had to dead stick that one because I used old Eiseman
mags that went bad. I have new Slicks now and about 30 hours with no
problem.
If you do go with the Corvair, call me if when you get ready to sell. The
plane, not the motor. Good luck.
Copinfo(at)ix.Netcom.Com
Tim Cunningham
Des Moines, Iowa (515) 237-1510
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | TXTdragger(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Big Guys in Piets |
wind res would go up a bit, but vis would be great
JD
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | TXTdragger(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Big Guys in Piets |
Dave......you gave all these guys a chance to show their flair for
comedy........some had better stick to building Piets......Thanks
JD
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | TXTdragger(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Big Guys in Piets |
come to think of it.........the 36"+ heels would cause a stir at field
also......
JD
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Copinfo <Copinfo(at)ix.Netcom.com> |
Bill, head to Provo, UT and take a look at Steve E.'s It's the Green "Air
Camper". a classic.
Copinfo(at)ix.Netcom.Com
Tim Cunningham
Des Moines, Iowa (515) 237-1510
-----Original Message-----
From: william hutson <wihutson(at)yahoo.com>
Date: Thursday, August 19, 1999 8:38 AM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: location
>Does anyone know of a Piet project or a flying Piet in the Rapid City,
>S.D. area?
>
>
>Bill
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Copinfo <Copinfo(at)ix.Netcom.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Wicks vs. Aircraft Spruce |
Mike, where was the Wicks advice a year ago? Aircraft Spruce &
Specialty knows my American Express Card number very well. They have
been super and a great supplier if I know what I want. If I don't, they
don't either. Early on I didn't even know what size cotter keys to get
and they couldn't help. Their catalog has a lot of information for a
new guy though and all in all I'm happy with their service.
Copinfo(at)ix.Netcom.Com
Tim Cunningham
Des Moines, Iowa (515) 237-1510
Mike, where was the Wicks advice a
year
ago? Aircraft Spruce Specialty knows my American Express
Card number
very well. They have been super and a great supplier if I know
what I
want. If I don't, they don't either. Early on I didn't even
know
what size cotter keys to get and they couldn't help. Their catalog
has a
lot of information for a new guy though and all in all I'm happy with
their
service.
CunninghamDes Moines, Iowa (515)
237-1510
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Gene Tomblin <tombling(at)MercyShips.ORG> |
| Subject: | Re: '60 Corvair Engine |
Jay White wrote:
> I've recently decided that I'm going to eventually build an Air Camper.
> Because I don't have room yet to start work on the plane, I'm going to start
> with the engine. After reading as much as I could find about this subject,
> I've decided to go with a Corvair engine. I talked to a man recently who has
> a 1960 Corvair, two door with a 110 HP engine (50K miles-rebuilt)and
> automatic transmission. He says it ran two years ago when he parked it. It
> hasn't been driven since. Would this engine be a good candidate for the Air
> Camper? Thanks.
A better choice would be the later 1965 - 1969 110 Hp engine. It is 164 cubic
inch instead of 145
The later Corvair has a longer stoke than the early 145 inch engine. This
allows you to turn a larger prop.
You can expect 60 to 80 Hp from a 164 inch 110 Corvair in the direct drive
mode. Stay away from the
140 Hp engine. They ran 4 carbs, two per head and had bigger valves. The down
side to this engine is that
it is noted for having intake valve seat problems and it's horsepower and
torque peak at a higher RPM
which might be OK if you wanted to run a reduction and deal with the added
weight but does not help at all if your going direct drive. Be very careful
when shopping for used Corvair engines . Rebuilt often means someone put a set
of rings and bearings in it which is way short of what really should be done if
you expect a good service life out of it in a high stress aircraft engine
application . Your going to want new cylinders and pistons, rings plus a cam and
lifters at the very least. The heads will need a good going over too .
Hardened valve seats and new guides might be a good idea too. Auto gas in the
60's had lots of lead in it which even 100 LL is short on these days .
Gene
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | walter evans <wbeevans(at)worldnet.att.net> |
| Subject: | Re: The Cost of Spruce for an Air Camper |
Doug,
When I contacted Aircraft Spruce they put me in contact with the "spruce
dept" When I said what I was looking for , they put me in touch with a
girl ( forget her name, but can get it) who was the expert on Piets. She
said she would send me a mat'l list to look over. It was what I wanted, and
placed the order.
All components are build, except the finished wings( all ribs complete) and
everything seems to be on the money. Its a shame if you got a sales person
who didn't know.
Did they send you a materials list first?
I've always had good luck with Aircraft Spruce.
walt
-----Original Message-----
From: Doug Sheets <doug_sheets(at)hotmail.com>
Date: Thursday, August 19, 1999 10:29 AM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: The Cost of Spruce for an Air Camper
>Jay & Clay:
>I bought the Piet wood kit from AS&S and it is NOWHERE near the right stuff
>for the Aircamper. I think now that I know the difference between an
>Aircamper and a GN1 that they may have the wood for a GN1. The capstrips
>were 1/4 x 1/4 not 1/4 x 1/2 as shown in the plans and the center section
>>>>>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Big Guys in Piets |
Heels Huh, OOOOOKKKKKK Dave
Actually I thought U said 3 ft, I thought you needed a couple pillows.
Gordon
Petri David S CDR wrote:
> 3 meters with heels on, but 2 meters in bare feet!
> Sorry for the typo. Mea culpa. Sure would look weird with the windscreen
> on top of the wing, huh?
> Cheers,
> Dave
>
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: Ken Beanlands [SMTP:kbeanlan(at)spots.ab.ca]
> > Sent: Thursday, August 19, 1999 12:20 PM
> > To: Pietenpol Discussion
> > Subject: Re: Big Guys in Piets
> >
> > 3 meters = 9.84' ! WOW! we have the world's tallest pilot in our midst! I
> > certainly hope you meant 2 meters (6'-6.5") otherwise the only way to make
> > you fit would be to widen the fuselage to about 3.5', enlarge the rear
> > hole and remove the fron one all together. That way, you could sit in the
> > rear seat and use the fron pedals and stick.
> >
> > Ken
> >
> > On Thu, 19 Aug 1999, Petri David S CDR wrote:
> >
> > > Hi folks,
> > > How well do big guys fit in an Air Camper? I'm 3 meters tall and this
> > is
> > > always a concern of mine. I don't fit in much of anything. No local
> > Piets
> > > that I know of that I can hop into for a sizing.
> > > Any insight would be appreciated.
> > > Cheers,
> > > Dave
> > >
> > > David.Petri(at)Peterson.af.mil
> > >
> >
> > Ken Beanlands B.Eng (Aerospace)
> > Calgary, Alberta, Canada
> > Christavia MK 1 C-GREN
> > <http://www.spots.ab.ca/~kbeanlan>
> >
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | DonanClara(at)aol.com |
GUSSETS BOTH SIDES. DON'T EVEN THINK OF GOING ONE SIDED!
DON HICKS
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | DonanClara(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Anyone close by? |
Jacob.....My "A" powered Piet is abourt ready for cover. I'm in S.E. Alabama,
I'd guess about a six hour drive. You would probably benefit from looking at
a project before it is covered. You're certainly welcome to see it...just
give me a little advance notice. If your interested just contact me by
regular e-mail and I'll give you directions, phone, etc.
Don Hicks
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | mike cushway <mcushway(at)gdinet.com> |
| Subject: | USELESS JIBBERISH |
GUYS!
When making a personal response PLEASE don't reply to the group!
It's getting out of hand.
GUYS!
When making a personal response PLEASE don't reply to the group!
It's getting out of hand.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Warren Shoun <wbnb(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | Re: USELESS JIBBERISH |
One more vote for Mike's point of view.
This is a great place to get ideas and make contacts....and once you
have that established, maybe you could consider going direct.
Sincerely don't wish to step on any one persons toes here....just
review the last 127 group e-mails and see how many were private
conversations.....a bunch!
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Wicks vs. Aircraft Spruce |
I got tired of calling ASS and waiting 10 - 15 minutes before a human being
answered my call. I give Wicks my buisness now. Everytime I call they
answer on the first or second ring. Their customer service is great and I
let them know it everytime I call.
Scott
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Continental engines |
Great Idea! People are now wider, taller and need creature comforts.
Did you also add the door modification? The tradition, as I see it, is that B.
P.
tried many things to improve the parasol design and, if he was living now, would
applaud all the experimentation.
As to Continentals w/o generator/alternators, have you guys seen the generator
mounted within the landing gear and driven by a RC propeller? Trade a little drag
to recharge the battery for your handheld or ??
jshutic(at)nordson.com wrote:
> Steve, some additional details are offered concerning my "wide-body"
> Aircamper. First of all, much thanks to Mike Cuy who let me look over his
> ...
> Hardly a traditional Piet, but an enjoyable project all the same.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | oil can <oilcanbob(at)hotmail.com> |
There are two types of hemlock. Eastern,and Western. The eastern has pretty
much been used up, and the only stuff available is filled with knots.
That leaves western Hemlock. Which seems to grow in the pacific northwest in
stands of spruce. Around here, Eastern Washington, the hardware stores are
filled with it. Along with some spruce, and lots of fir.
washington. That leaves spruce, or fir. Fir is
considered...THE...substitute for spruce, and a heck of a lot of fine
airplanes have been made from it.
Also, it seems to me that 1 in every 5, 1/4 sawn fir boards are of (at
least nearly) aircraft quality. Where as for hemlock, the measure is closer
to 1 in 25. But then here I can get it...and can sort thru hudge stacks of
it.
My airplane is made from hemlock,as will be the spars, and I am very happy
with the wood.
If you can find it, don't hesitate to ask any questions, I'll try to answer
to my best knowledge.
ocb
>From: tmbrant <tmbrant(at)uswest.net>
>Reply-To: Pietenpol Discussion
>To: Pietenpol Discussion
>Subject: Hemlock
>Date: Tue, 17 Aug 1999 18:26:49 -0500
>
>I am interested in Hemlock to use on the Piet. Does anyone know of where
>it may be found in any supply and quality? I live in Minnesota, near
>Minneapolis.
>
>Tom Brant
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | jmcnarry(at)techplus.com (John McNarry) |
I bought two used community hall type stacking chairs at a garage sale
for $0.50 each. The steel tubing was broken(good to practice on), but the
molded plywood seats are light and sure do feel better than a flat plywood
seat. A bit of that thermal fit foam and I think I could out last my fuel
supply. I have also been thinking about changing the holes for my feet. The
Tiger moth I fly in has an aluminum bucket for the front pit. It prevents
the pilots feet from kicking the passengers butt. Not a bad Idea.
A question for you GN-1 guys, have any of you considered ways to shift the
wing position?
One more vote for replying to the point, deleting unnecessary parts of the
replies and forwarding personal e-mails to the recipient in mind and not to
the whole group.
Thanks
John Mc
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | oil can <oilcanbob(at)hotmail.com> |
mY AIRPLANE IS MADE FROM STEEL TUBE, THE WING IS MADE FROM hEMLOCK.
>From: oil can <oilcanbob(at)hotmail.com>
>Reply-To: Pietenpol Discussion
>To: Pietenpol Discussion
>Subject: Re: Hemlock
>Date: Thu, 19 Aug 1999 21:14:42 -0700 (PDT)
>
>There are two types of hemlock. Eastern,and Western. The eastern has
>pretty
>much been used up, and the only stuff available is filled with knots.
>
>That leaves western Hemlock. Which seems to grow in the pacific northwest
>in
>stands of spruce. Around here, Eastern Washington, the hardware stores are
>filled with it. Along with some spruce, and lots of fir.
>
>From what I hear, hemlock is not nearly as available outside of oregon, and
>washington. That leaves spruce, or fir. Fir is
>considered...THE...substitute for spruce, and a heck of a lot of fine
>airplanes have been made from it.
>
>Also, it seems to me that 1 in every 5, 1/4 sawn fir boards are of (at
>least nearly) aircraft quality. Where as for hemlock, the measure is closer
>to 1 in 25. But then here I can get it...and can sort thru hudge stacks of
>it.
>
>My airplane is made from hemlock,as will be the spars, and I am very happy
>with the wood.
>
>If you can find it, don't hesitate to ask any questions, I'll try to answer
>to my best knowledge.
>ocb
>
>
> >From: tmbrant <tmbrant(at)uswest.net>
>>Reply-To: Pietenpol Discussion
>>To: Pietenpol Discussion
>>Subject: Hemlock
>>Date: Tue, 17 Aug 1999 18:26:49 -0500
>>
>>I am interested in Hemlock to use on the Piet. Does anyone know of where
>>it may be found in any supply and quality? I live in Minnesota, near
>>Minneapolis.
>>
>>Tom Brant
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: USELESS JIBBERISH |
Ah MIke
Which messageges were you speaking about?
I go thru at least 500 messages a day and find it easy to delete the
ones that don't pertain to something I want to read.
Maybe it just does not bother me.
Gordon
mike cushway wrote:
> GUYS!
>
> When making a personal response PLEASE don't reply to the group!
> It's getting out of hand.
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: USELESS JIBBERISH |
I don't save all the messages, Do You?
I cull out the BS and save the good ones,
I enjoy reading all of them because they are from real people who have
something to say.
Maybe being retired I have more time than most.
Gordon
Warren Shoun wrote:
> One more vote for Mike's point of view.
>
> This is a great place to get ideas and make contacts....and once you
> have that established, maybe you could consider going direct.
> Sincerely don't wish to step on any one persons toes here....just
> review the last 127 group e-mails and see how many were private
> conversations.....a bunch!
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Wicks vs. Aircraft Spruce |
I have a question I send email to Aircraft Spruce. I always get an answer. Even
asked if I had a catalog and was told I would rec the 1999/2000 as soon as it
came off the press. I have it now. Do You?
Plus it is only 50 miles from me.
Gordon
Hatz630(at)aol.com wrote:
> I got tired of calling ASS and waiting 10 - 15 minutes before a human being
> answered my call. I give Wicks my buisness now. Everytime I call they
> answer on the first or second ring. Their customer service is great and I
> let them know it everytime I call.
>
> Scott
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Michael D Cuy <Michael.D.Cuy(at)lerc.nasa.gov> |
| Subject: | Re: Wicks vs. Aircraft Spruce |
>
> Mike, where was the Wicks advice a year ago? Aircraft Spruce & Specialty
> knows my American Express Card number very well. They have been super and a
> great supplier if I know what I want. If I don't, they don't either. Early
> on I didn't even know what size cotter keys to get and they couldn't help.
> Their catalog has a lot of information for a new guy though and all in all
> I'm happy with their service.
> Tim Cunningham
> Des Moines, Iowa (515) 237-1510
Hey Tim !
That's great to hear you are getting what you need at A/C Spruce.....and they
do have a good
catalog. I know what you mean about AN hardware, etc...it took me a while to
figure out
all the codes and lingo that go along with it...but now I almost sound like I
know what I'm
talking about :)) !!! Good to hear you are back flying.
Mike C.
Mike, where was the Wicks advice
a year ago? Aircraft Spruce Specialty knows my American
Express Card number very well. They have been super and a great
supplier if I know what I want. If I don't, they don't
either. Early on I didn't even know what size cotter keys to get
and they couldn't help. Their catalog has a lot of information for
a new guy though and all in all I'm happy with their
service.
Copinfo(at)ix.Netcom.Com
Tim Cunningham
Des Moines, Iowa (515) 237-1510
Hey Tim !
That's great to hear you are getting what you need at A/C Spruce.....and
they do have a good
catalog. I know what you mean about AN hardware, etc...it
took me a while to figure out
all the codes and lingo that go along with it...but now I almost
sound like I know what I'm
talking about :)) !!! Good to hear you are back flying.
Mike C.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Michael D Cuy <Michael.D.Cuy(at)lerc.nasa.gov> |
When using a handheld radio in a Pietenpol or GN-1, can
someone give me a simple, basic, practical way to install
some kind of antenna. I don't understand antenna lingo or
such, just how is this best done.
Mike C.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Michael Brusilow <mb-albany(at)worldnet.att.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Handheld Advice |
>When using a handheld radio in a Pietenpol or GN-1, can
>someone give me a simple, basic, practical way to install
>some kind of antenna. I don't understand antenna lingo or
>such, just how is this best done.
>
>Mike C.
I have been flying with a handheld for years.
I mounted the antenna on the aluminum fairing between the wing & center
section & brought the lead down the cabane strut to the cockpit.
BTW: I mounted the portable GPS antenna the same way.
Mike B Piet N687MB ( Mr Sam )
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | TXTdragger(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Wicks vs. Aircraft Spruce |
How about putting Wicks phone #, e-mail, address on here for everyone like me
to use.
thanks
John D
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Handheld Advice |
-----Original Message-----
From: Michael D Cuy <Michael.D.Cuy(at)lerc.nasa.gov>
Date: Friday, August 20, 1999 8:13 AM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Handheld Advice
>When using a handheld radio in a Pietenpol or GN-1, can
>someone give me a simple, basic, practical way to install
>some kind of antenna. I don't understand antenna lingo or
>such, just how is this best done.
>
>Mike C.
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Handheld Advice |
Mike....CUY is it....?
On the Champ, the antenna is mounted on the aluminum fairing between the
fuse and wing. There was a second piece of AlYouMineum called a doubler
required about 9" either side of the fairing where the antenna mounted thru
the fairing. I got one of those "bent" stainless cheapy antennas thru AS&S
(I have had good and bad from both them and WKS). The doubler was riveted on
Works like a Champ! Reception is 5 x 5.
The Great Tailwind has spoken................
-----Original Message-----
From: Michael D Cuy <Michael.D.Cuy(at)lerc.nasa.gov>
Date: Friday, August 20, 1999 8:13 AM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Handheld Advice
>When using a handheld radio in a Pietenpol or GN-1, can
>someone give me a simple, basic, practical way to install
>some kind of antenna. I don't understand antenna lingo or
>such, just how is this best done.
>
>Mike C.
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Gary Gower <ggower(at)informador.com.mx> |
| Subject: | RE: Home from OSH - Finally!! |
>I agree with these comments. I just put my seat in (partially) and found
it very uncomfortable. It is too late for any design changes at this point
for me. My only options are to install some sort of padding or to design
and install a new seat (molded to my rear and back) and install over the top
of the existing seat. Any comments?
>Bart D Conrad
>Boeing Field Service
>DC-9/MD-80/DC-10 & 737 Heavy Mtc
>Phone: 713-640-5882/713-324-4192
>Fax: 713-640-5891
>Pager: 713-318-1625
>
>>
Check in the books of Tony Bingilis (EAA) ther is an article about seat padding
Saludos
Gary Gower
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Michael D Cuy <Michael.D.Cuy(at)lerc.nasa.gov> |
| Subject: | Re: Wicks vs. Aircraft Spruce |
>How about putting Wicks phone #, e-mail, address on here for everyone like me
>to use.
>
>thanks
>
>John D
http://www.magicneedles.qpg.com/W/wicks/
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Michael D Cuy <Michael.D.Cuy(at)lerc.nasa.gov> |
| Subject: | Wicks- better web address |
http://www.wicks.com/aircraft/
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Ken Beanlands <kbeanlan(at)spots.ab.ca> |
| Subject: | Re: Wicks vs. Aircraft Spruce |
Actually, Wicks has an on-line catalogue and website at
<http://www.wicks.com/> . Interestingly enough, they also have a pipe
organ company!
Ken
On Fri, 20 Aug 1999, Michael D Cuy wrote:
> >How about putting Wicks phone #, e-mail, address on here for everyone like me
> >to use.
> >
> >thanks
> >
> >John D
>
> http://www.magicneedles.qpg.com/W/wicks/
>
Ken Beanlands B.Eng (Aerospace)
Calgary, Alberta, Canada
Christavia MK 1 C-GREN
<http://www.spots.ab.ca/~kbeanlan>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Corvair PSRU |
> > To drive a Corvair automobile at 60 mph takes about 22 hp as exam=
ple.
This can't be right.
60mph is about 3000, 3500 rpm.
(Snipped form William Wynne's website)
Performance
August 13, 1999 - August 20, 1999
Pietenpol-Archive.digest.vol-bb