RV-Archive.digest.vol-fb

July 17, 1998 - July 23, 1998



      > I passed up the quickbuild and the pre-assembled spar and tanks.  But my
      
      > self-imposed completion deadline (and electrical phobia) makes a
      > "panel-in-a-box" look mighty interesting.  $50 per hour labor, however
      > antithetical to homebuilding, may save later trouble-shooting.
      >
      > Caveats, recommendations, endorsements...I'll take 'em all.  Thanks.
      >
      > Jim       6A canopy in New Mexico
      >
      >
      >
      >
      >
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 17, 1998
From: Frank van der Hulst <frankv(at)pec.co.nz>
Subject: Re: basic acro
SportAV8R(at)aol.com wrote: > Ergo, I am trying to recall the particulars of the rolls I did > with Mike Segar a few months ago. Those and the wing-overs > constute all the acro training I've ever had, Bill, Please don't do this! Go out and get some proper aerobatic instruction, either in an RV or a spamcan. When things go wrong, they can go wrong *bigtime*. Apart from that, there may be some legal aspects??? I dunno what the FAA says, but here in New Zealand, you must get an endorsement before you're allowed to do aerobatics. > I've never spun any plane; not about to try this one on purpose.. Why not? I believe that experiencing a spin, and being able to get out of one, is useful to any pilot. Absolutely essential for anyone contemplating aerobatics (even tame ones). This is not to say that learning about spinning solo in your new RV is a good idea. From all accounts, it's a wild and scary ride. But, if you're going to attempt aerobatics, and (as you say) you're not proficient, the least you can do is give yourself a chance to save yourself and your plane. If you go up (with an instructor!) and do a few spins in a 152 Aerobat or something similar, you'll learn a) spinning is not necessarily fatal b) it's actually not even dangerous, if you're careful c) it is scary (the first several times) d) what conditions actually cause a spin e) it's harder to start one than you've been led to believe f) by applying the proper technique, it's easier than you think to break a spin Frank. ________________________________________________________________________________
From: RV4131rb(at)aol.com
Date: Jul 16, 1998
Subject: Re: Idiot Alert!
<< I'm no expert, but I have successfully removed dings from skins by using the back rivet set/rivet gun to drive the ding back out from the back side. A lead shot filled bag is placed on the outer surface to absorb most of the blow from the rivet gun. This was recommended by Jerry Scott up at Chino. If you try this I recommend lots of practice before trying this on your plane but it worked for me. >> I agree with Mike here, although I use a rubber mallet on the back side rather than a rivet set. Its a little more forgiving and with a little time and practice youl be surprised what you can work out. Ryan Bendure Co. ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Doug Rozendaal" <dougr(at)petroblend.com>
Subject: Re: basic acro
Date: Jul 16, 1998
> >The FAA sez all maneuvers the a/c will ever be approved to do must be >documented as having been done during phase one of the test period. Ergo, I >am trying to recall the particulars of the rolls I did with Mike Segar a few >months ago. Those and the wing-overs constute all the acro training I've ever >had, but having Mike along to demonstrate and then supervise certainly made >the maneuvers seem effortless. Until now, I have not even considered trying >any tame acro until I got the engine running reliably, but I believe I'm there >now. PLEASE! If you have never done acro, PLEASE do not go out and tackle it yourself! If you wish to add acro during your flight test, find a qualified pilot and have him fly the maneuvers. Then go get some dual, preferably in something other than an RV ie Citabria, or Decathalon. Akro is really easy in the RV until you botch a maneuver. Then it can becomes terrifying in a heartbeat. The RV is not an aerobatic trainer. If you have concerns about spins you have Absolutely NO Business What so ever teaching yourself Acro in anything, certainly not in an airplane that builds speed like an RV. I am not opposed to Acro. I do it all the time. Acro in the RV is a kick and it is the most fun you can have in an RV except for passing Bonanzas & Senecas. (especially with Dr's or Lawyers aboard) I don't mean to come down hard, but if you propose to teach yourself acro in an RV it is a BAD Idea. You might get away with it, but it is still a BAD Idea. Find your local IAC Chapter and someone will help you find the training you need. (It is not alot) Or they will help you find some one who would fly the maneuvers in your plane. PLEASE! Tailwinds, Doug Rozendaal dougr(at)petroblend.com http://www.petroblend.com/dougr ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 16, 1998
From: Tom Craig-Stearman <tcraigst(at)ionet.net>
Subject: Re: Rocket RV-8???
I don't know of any other IO-540-powered RV-8s, but I do know one builder who plans to install an Allison turboprop. Talk about a rocket! > >A friend of mine is thinking about building a RV-8 and installing an IO-540. >Is anybody already doing a IO-540 installation in an -8? Is anybody turning >a RV-8 into a Rocket? ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Ross Mickey" <rmickey(at)ix.netcom.com>
Subject: Re: basic acro
Date: Jul 16, 1998
If you are not ready (properly trained and practiced) to do all the acro you would like your plane to be endorsed to do, you have two options. 1) Have someone else do these in your plane during the initial test period. 2) When you have become proficient in acro, reopen your test period with the FAA and add these maneuvers then. I agree with the other recommendations made thus far. Ross Mickey > The FAA sez all maneuvers the a/c will ever be approved to do must be > documented as having been done during phase one of the test period. ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Tim Lewis" <timrv6a(at)earthlink.net>
Date: Jul 16, 1998
Subject: Re: More Slider Questions
On 15 Jul 98, at 23:40, michael d hilger wrote: > What are you folks using for shims under the forward edge of the > slider canopy plex at the forward frame bow? Also, I get the impression > that some of you are using fasteners other than those called out in the > plans to attach the plex to the frames. If so, what is being used and how > much oversized are the holes in the plex? Finally, I have read (Justice, I > believe) that countersinking the plex and installing a countersunk > fastener directly in the hole (no dimpled washer or dimpled metal strip) > will cause a crack. Comments? I used small washers on top of the bow, then a 5/8" wide strip of aluminum, then the plexi. I made the plexi holes oversize, put a small plastic bushing inside the hole, and used a countersunk washer and pop riets to hold the canopy to the frame. Not yet flown. Tim _+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_ Tim Lewis N47TD (reserved) RV-6AQ #60023 on gear, engine mounted Springfield VA http://home.earthlink.net/~timrv6a timrv6a(at)iname.com ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 16, 1998
From: Sharlene Shipley or Bruce Knoll <snsbfk(at)mail.sage.net>
Subject: Re: basic acro
> >The FAA sez all maneuvers the a/c will ever be approved to do must be >documented as having been done during phase one of the test period. > Hi Bill, There is a book that I picked up a year ago at Osh. entitled, Primary Aerobatic Flight Training by Art Medore, USAFR (ret). Pub. by Banaire Enterprises, Inc., 962 E. Lincoln St., Banning, CA 92220. Sticker price $10.75. Looks like a good one to start with. Bruce Knoll Empennaage rv6 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Karl Ahamer" <ascot(at)hinet.net.au>
Subject: australian experimental category
Date: Jul 17, 1998
hi peter this is one of the best news i have heard lately and i thought it never would happen. congratulations and thanks to all involved making it happen. regards Karl Ahamer Bowral near Sydney RV6AQ still wiring and getting fuse ready for priming ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 16, 1998
From: Thomas Gummo <tgummo(at)orion.csci.csusb.edu>
Subject: rv-acro
Bill Boyd, I am an old F-4G Wild Weasel pilot who has plenty of time upside down in 50,000 lbs of USAF hardware (building a RV-4). I don't have lots of time in RVs therefore, take this for what it is worth. One thing to think about is what were called unusual attitudes. Nose low attitudes are normally the ones that will kill you. Nose high are mostly likely not going to kill you (at least not right away). There are basically four : 1) nose high - high speed, 2) nose high - low speed, 3) nose low - high speed (BAD), 4) nose low - low speed (not as bad). You can fly out of the first if you have enough speed. We would just roll inverted and pull down to the horizon and roll back to level flight. DONE. The second we would roll to 90 degrees of bank and just let the nose fall through the horizon and once flying airspeed was regained recover. I would try to keep just enought positive G to keep the motor happy but DON'T STALL. If you don't stall YOU CAN'T SPIN. You may have to trust me on this but they beat that idea into our heads and I believe it. The last one is another one where you just fly out of it. The worst case is number three for example upside down with the nose 45 degrees down. Your first reaction may be to pull out of the dive. However, the rule is REDUCE POWER, ROLL TO THE NEAREST HORIZON and RECOVER FROM THE DIVE. If you just pull back on the stick you will have to move the nose through 135 degress before you are back to level flight. If you roll out and then recover you only have to move the nose through 45 degress. You recover in much less time. I know I am not explaining this well but try it with your hands a couple of times and it should make sense. I would chair fly all the different attitudes you can think of and hopefully you won't see anything in the air that you did think of on the ground. We didn't do spins in the F-4 as they developed into flat spins and were unrecoveralbe. In fact, the book answer was that if we were below 10,000 feet AGL = EJECT. So, I can't help you there. Hope I didn't spam the network. Please contact me off the net if you want to talk more or have questions about unusual attitudes. Tom Thomas L. Gummo Major, USAF Retired, Society of Wild Weasels # 1573 http://web.csusb.edu/public/csci/tgummo/home.html skinning wings, fuselage kit has arrived N561FS (reserved) my last fighter squadron was the 561st Fighter Squadron. ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Morrissey, John" <John.Morrissey(at)its.csiro.au>
Subject: Australian Experimental Category
Date: Jul 17, 1998
Hi Fred, It wasn't really that bad before - having been through the whole 'First of type" process with the first RV6 in Australia - all we had to do was to wait for four of you guys in the US to survive the first 50hrs of flying and we were away!!. Thanks for all that free test flying guys. :-) Admittedly under the previous system building up a new design from the ground up took a lot of determination and was rarely successful due to the high costs involved. Although a couple of advantages with the old system included the fact that all our homebuilts were certified and allowed to fly anywhere they wanted - VH-JOH took a couple of little jaunts around the world :-),also having certification does make a second hand homebuilt a fair bit more marketable here in OZ. I am looking forward to the flood of new designs we should see coming out of Australia with the new system. Cheers John Morrissey -----Original Message----- From: Stucklen, Frederic IFC [mailto:stuckle(at)ifc.hsd.utc.com] Sent: Friday, July 17, 1998 12:51 AM Subject: RE: RV-List: Australian Experimental Category Peter, Congratulations! This should make it significantly easier for all you down under to get more RV's into the air..... Fred Stucklen N925RV RV-6A E. Windsor, Ct >-----Original Message----- >From: pbennett(at)zip.com.au [SMTP:pbennett(at)zip.com.au] >Sent: Thursday, July 16, 1998 5:07 PM >To: rv-list(at)matronics.com >Subject: RV-List: Australian Experimental Category > > >I am delighted to be able to advise that after decades of arguing >with bureaucrats, Australian homebuilders have at last got a US style >Experimental Category. > >The Governor General signed the Act into law at 11.45 am on Wednesday >15th July. > >Many dedicated people have contributed to this landmark achievement, >but it is undoubtedly the determined leadership of the National >President of the Sport Aircraft Association of Australia, Peter >Wilkinson, which has brought this about. May his Nieuport now take to >the skies, unfettered by the weight of Canberra shiney-bums. > > > > >Peter Bennett >Sydney Australia >RV6 doing cowls > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 16, 1998
From: "David A. Barnhart" <barnhart(at)a.crl.com>
Subject: Re: Leaning
>What method are you using to lean your bird? Fuel flow (from a power chart), >EGT, or lean 'er till she shakes and richen up a bit? What is your indicated >(TAS would be better) airspeed at what indicated fuel flow? I have an RMI uMonitor with a manual switch so I can check all four cylinders. Though all four cylinders peak at slightly different temps, they al peak at the same time (within a quarter-turn of the mixture control). Lycoming provides two points on the power chart, one for Best Power (150 F rich of peak) and Best Economy (50F rich of Peak). I've noticed that my engine seems to 'like' a point about 40-50 C (50C = 90F) rich of peak at 65%. The engine seems to run smoother at that setting, so that's what I do. That results in about 8 gph at 65% and 5000 ft Density Alt. BEst Regards, Dave Barnhart rv-6 sn 23744 N601DB Flying ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Steve Kimura" <skimura(at)dnc.net>
Subject: This weekend's aviation events
Date: Jul 16, 1998
(my appologies if you got this already from the OPA or EAA list; I'll condense all three next time) July 17-19 Family Fly-In Kalispell, Montana (800) 457-9917 http://www.faa.gov/fsdo/hln/ Astoria, CAP practice SAR 541-688-9408 July 18 Corvallis EAA Breakfast and BBQ Lunch Pancake breakfast at 8:00-9:00, Lunch at 12:00 Noon Corvallis Municipal Airport http://www.dnc.net/eaa/eaa-cv.htm A Bazaar Fly-In, Astoria/Warrenton Regional Airport Sponsored by Crossings Aviation & Harbor Airlines 7 AM to ??? Music and Dancing in the Evening For more information Call Sheila Greenwood (503) 861-1222 July 18-19 Mulino Blueberry Pancake Feed and EAA fly-in and campout (503) 635-8116 Oregon Air & Space Museum Air Fair Eugene Mahlon Sweet Field Unlimited pylon racers in action! Airport open during Air Fair but closed during races (541) 461-1101 Prospect Unit of Jackson County Search and Rescue's 9th Annual Fly-in/Breakfast Prospect, OR. Prospect State Airport. (benefits Prospect Unit, Jackson County Search and Rescue). Call 541/560-3647 or 541/560-3667. July 18-25 Klamath Falls, CAP Cadet encampment 541-688-9408 July 19-23 Oregon Trail Tour, starts at Cottage Grove OACAC Oregon Air Tour, Cottage Grove, John Day, McCall ID, Joseph, Hood River, Packwood WA, Tillamook, (541) 746-3387 =========== And for you armchair pilots: Oregon PBS is running a program called Plane Crazy, Wednesday, July 22, 8pm and repeating Sunday, July 26, 1pm. It is about a Bob Cringely, who is trying to design build and fly and experimental in 30 days. (From Jon Croghan) =========== Hope to see some of you in Corvallis on Saturday! Steve Kimura skimura(at)dnc.net ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Vanremog(at)aol.com
Date: Jul 16, 1998
Subject: Re: Farming Out the Panel
<< my self-imposed completion deadline (and electrical phobia) makes a "panel-in-a-box" look mighty interesting. $50 per hour labor, however antithetical to homebuilding, may save later trouble-shooting. Caveats, recommendations, endorsements. >> IMO, do it yourself. I'll even send you a schematic of my wiring file on AutoCAD. You can have it plotted at your local copy or drafting store, if they have ACAD. It really is the most fun part of the project. I'm never really happy with other peoples' wiring jobs anyway. -GV ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Vanremog(at)aol.com
Date: Jul 16, 1998
Subject: Re: basic acro
<< I would highly advise you to get the appropriate instruction prior to trying any acro in your airplane. If you are concerned about the FAA and documentation, ask or hire someone to do it for you who has time doing acro in your type of RV. It's not worth becoming another statistic. Let's keep the RV record as clean as possible. I don't want to sound like a nag, but this is big stuff. It's great fun, but must be handled with right attitude and preparation. >> I took an hour of acro in a Grob trainer. It is similar to what you will feel in the RV but much slower and heavier. I was okay in the Grob, but the RV-6A is so much faster and lighter that it's much easier to do loops and rolls in the RV. The problem is that if you goof up, you need to react properly without overspeed and overstress. I agree that you should try and get some training in a similar craft first, but you will love the way the RV does acro. BTW, I use entry IAS of 150-160 mph for aileron rolls and 170-180 mph for loops. -GV ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Bob Japundza <bjapundza@iis-intellect.com>
Subject: Rocket RV-8???
Date: Jul 16, 1998
Van's is reportedly installing the Franklin 220hp engine in the early RV-8 prototype which had its engine reinstalled in the RV-8A prototype. Cool because the Franklin engine some Stinson and Swift people say are silky-smooth engines. The engine is currently being produced in Poland and has been available to homebuilders for a couple of years now. The price of a new engine from Atlas Motors was, last I heard, around $16,000; a lot cheaper than a new IO-360, and 20 more ponies. Not sure what the weight is. Atlas motors can be reached at 800-336-9878. Bob Japundza RV-6, finishing electrical system, installing cowling ________________________________________________________________________________
From: JamesCone(at)aol.com
Date: Jul 16, 1998
Subject: Re: basic acro
You can reopen your phase one testing to add new aerobatic tricks any time. You just have to make a note of it in your logbook. Jim Cone ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "JimNolan" <JimNolan(at)kconline.com>
Subject: Re: basic acro
Date: Jul 16, 1998
> The FAA sez all maneuvers the a/c will ever be approved to do must be > documented as having been done during phase one of the test period. Ergo, I > am trying to recall the particulars of the rolls I did with Mike Segar a few > months ago. Those and the wing-overs constute all the acro training I've ever > had, but having Mike along to demonstrate and then supervise certainly made > the maneuvers seem effortless. Until now, I have not even considered trying > any tame acro until I got the engine running reliably, but I believe I'm there > now. > Bill Boyd > rv-6A 15 hrs Bill, I might get flamed big time for telling you this but here goes anyway. I once heard of a guy that built an RV and when the FAA inspector came to look at it, he found everything in order and issued a certificate on the spot. The gentleman that built the RV asked the FAA inspector about the rule stating that all aerobatic maneuvers had to be done in the test period. THE FAA INSPECTOR SAID, DO NOT DO ANY AEROBATICS FOR AT LEAST 100 HRS. The gentleman told him that he had no previous experience flying RVs but the rules stated that he must perform these maneuvers within the 25 hrs. the FAA inspector had allocated. THE FAA INSPECTOR SAID, FOR YOUR BENEFIT DO NOT DO AEROBATIC MANEUVERS UNTIL YOU ARE COMFORTABLE FLYING YOUR PLANE, AND WITH MOST PEOPLE I HAVE MET THAT IS AROUND 100 HRS. I DON'T CARE WHAT YOUR LOG BOOK SAYS, JUST DON'T DO AEROBATIC MANEUVERS UNTIL YOU ARE COMFORTABLE FLYING YOUR PLANE. NUFF SAID From what I understand the gentleman who built the RV took the FAA inspectors advice. I think he has 700 hrs on his RV , enjoys rolls and loops and his logbook has every maneuver an RV is capable of doing recorded in his log book. ( And they were recorded under 25 hrs. ) Remember, this is just something I heard about. But I think the FAA Inspector that inspected this guys airplane knew the difference between common sense and bad rules. Don't let bad rules fog your judgment. Jim Nolan N444JN ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "J. Farrar" <fourazjs(at)email.msn.com>
Subject: Re: basic acro
Date: Jul 16, 1998
Bill, And to add my $.02 to this and all that went before, I'll also restress ... DO NOT DO AKRO W/O TRAINING! It can be disorienting and you need to make the right control inputs at the right time to recover from an error. Please take 10 or so hours of dual. Jeff Farrar, RV8A, Empennage done waiting for QB, Chandler, AZ -----Original Message----- From: JimNolan <JimNolan(at)kconline.com> Date: Thursday, July 16, 1998 7:44 PM Subject: Re: RV-List: basic acro > > > >> The FAA sez all maneuvers the a/c will ever be approved to do must be >> documented as having been done during phase one of the test period. Ergo, I >> am trying to recall the particulars of the rolls I did with Mike Segar a few >> months ago. Those and the wing-overs constute all the acro training I've ever >> had, but having Mike along to demonstrate and then supervise certainly made >> the maneuvers seem effortless. Until now, I have not even considered trying >> any tame acro until I got the engine running reliably, but I believe I'm there >> now. >> Bill Boyd >> rv-6A 15 hrs > > >Bill, > I might get flamed big time for telling you this but here goes anyway. >I once heard of a guy that built an RV and when the FAA inspector came to >look at it, he found everything in order and issued a certificate on the spot. >The gentleman that built the RV asked the FAA inspector about the >rule stating that all aerobatic maneuvers had to be done in the test period. > THE FAA INSPECTOR SAID, DO NOT DO ANY AEROBATICS FOR >AT LEAST 100 HRS. The gentleman told him that he had no previous >experience flying RVs but the rules stated that he must perform these >maneuvers within the 25 hrs. the FAA inspector had allocated. THE FAA >INSPECTOR SAID, FOR YOUR BENEFIT DO NOT DO AEROBATIC >MANEUVERS UNTIL YOU ARE COMFORTABLE FLYING YOUR PLANE, >AND WITH MOST PEOPLE I HAVE MET THAT IS AROUND 100 HRS. I >DON'T CARE WHAT YOUR LOG BOOK SAYS, JUST DON'T DO >AEROBATIC MANEUVERS UNTIL YOU ARE COMFORTABLE FLYING >YOUR PLANE. >NUFF SAID > From what I understand the gentleman who built the RV took the FAA >inspectors advice. I think he has 700 hrs on his RV , enjoys rolls and loops >and his logbook has every maneuver an RV is capable of doing recorded in >his log book. ( And they were recorded under 25 hrs. ) > Remember, this is just something I heard about. But I think the FAA >Inspector that inspected this guys airplane knew the difference between >common sense and bad rules. Don't let bad rules fog your judgment. > >Jim Nolan >N444JN > > > > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: GURLEYP51(at)aol.com
Date: Jul 16, 1998
Subject: Re: basic acro
PLEASE DO NOT EMAIL THIS ADDRESS REPEDATIVELY ________________________________________________________________________________
From: GURLEYP51(at)aol.com
Date: Jul 16, 1998
Subject: Re: Farming Out the Panel
ONE MESSAGE IS ENOUGH ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 16, 1998
From: Alex Peterson <alexpeterson(at)mci2000.com>
Subject: Re: More Slider Questions
> What are you folks using for shims under the forward edge of the > slider canopy plex at the forward frame bow? Aircraft Spruce has some nylon washers the appropriate size, I used up to two of them in any one location, and did not have trouble with the length of the AACQ4-4 (or whatever they are) pop rivets. I think three would cause problems, though. I also enlarged the through portion of the holes in the plex. to 3/16" or so, to insure that the rivet would not expand against the plex. I spent a few hours and built strips of aluminum to cover the plex. on the front bow of the slider, so nowhere do I have rivets directly on the plex. Alex Peterson Maple Grove MN ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 16, 1998
From: jerry calvert <calverjl(at)flash.net>
Subject: Re: Rocket RV-8???
Mlfred(at)aol.com wrote: > > > > << A friend of mine is thinking about building a RV-8 and installing an > IO-540. > Is anybody already doing a IO-540 installation in an -8? Is anybody turning > a RV-8 into a Rocket? > > > Phil Lehrke > RV-6A >> > > Have your friend contact me or John Harmon (805-836-1028). I see no reason for > him to re-invent the wheel...such a plane already exists, and it's called the > Harmon Rocket II. Not everyone needs one, but those who do *know* who they > are. > > Check six! > Mark > HR2 265 hrs Austin, TX > 512-365-8131 > Hey group, Mark you are too modest! I,m going to do a little horn toot'n for you. If you guys want to see his Harmon Rocket II, check out Sport Aviation(Sept 1997; pg48) and read a 7 page article about Mark and his HR2. His plane is nothing short of AWESOME!! Jerry Calvert Edmond Ok -6a doing the wings ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "baremetl" <baremetl(at)gvtc.com>
Subject: Re: basic acro
Date: Jul 16, 1998
-----Original Message----- From: Vanremog(at)aol.com <Vanremog(at)aol.com> Date: Thursday, July 16, 1998 9:16 PM Subject: Re: RV-List: basic acro >I agree that you should try and get some training in a similar craft first, >but you will love the way the RV does acro. > >BTW, I use entry IAS of 150-160 mph for aileron rolls and 170-180 mph for >loops. > >-GV >At what weight do you do these manuevers? >HIH > > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Vanremog(at)aol.com
Date: Jul 17, 1998
Subject: Re: Arlington
Hey guys and gals. Please indulge me while I revel in the moment. Imagine my surprise today when I got in my mail a package from Arlington. Hubba hubba! We got the 1998-Champion Plaque for Custombuilt Kit! Our first award after five years of work. With all the other RVs there, it is very special to have received an award at any level. My fiance swears she didn't bribe or threaten the judges. It was great trip from California to do some sightseeing and visiting of displaced family members in the Seattle area. Meeting fellow RV-listers Jerry & Judy VanGrunsven, Jim Nice & wife, Tracy Saylor, Jerry Springer and others was a treat. It is just the size fly-in we like (not so big as OSH) and we generally had good weather. If you thought about going, but didn't, you missed out. We'll definitely be back! -GV ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Rocket RV-8???
From: smcdaniels(at)Juno.com (SCOTT R MCDANIELS)
Date: Jul 17, 1998
The >price of a new engine from Atlas Motors was, last I heard, around >$16,000; a lot cheaper than a new IO-360, and 20 more ponies. Not >sure >what the weight is. > Actually the engine we are installing in the #1 RV-8 has a data tag on it that says 205 HP. And this 205 HP is produced at 2800 RPM. I don't know for certian if this is the same engine that would be purchased new because this one is a factory reman. Sorry, don't yet have an installation weight. I can say that the motor mount is going to be more complex, heavier, and yes as a result probably more expensive. Scott McDaniels These opinions and ideas are my own and do not necessarily reflect the opinions of my employer. ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 16, 1998
From: Jerry Springer <jsflyrv(at)ix.netcom.com>
Subject: Re: Australian Experimental Category
Morrissey, John wrote: > > It wasn't really that bad before - having been through the whole 'First > of type" process with the first RV6 in Australia - all we had to do was > to wait for four of you guys in the US to survive the first 50hrs of > flying and we were away!!. Thanks for all that free test flying guys. > :-) > Cheers > > John Morrissey John Are you the one that built that pretty yellow RV-6 back in the about 1990-91? I was one of the ones to fill out some paper work for you as I had about 100 or so hours on my RV-6 at the time. Van ask me to fill out some papers for someone in Australia. If that was you I asked you to send me a picture of your RV-6 when you received the paper work which you did. That's how I know it was a pretty yellow RV-6:) -- Jerry Springer RV-6 N906GS First flight July 14, 1989 :-) Hillsboro, OR jsflyrv(at)ix.netcom.com ________________________________________________________________________________
From: dralle(at)matronics.com (Matt Dralle 510-606-1001)
Date: Jul 17, 1998
Subject: Special Thank You...
Hi Listers, I would like to send out a special thank you to the members below that made a contribution to the Internet Upgrade Fund this time around. Contribution amounts were exceptionally generous and the support has helped a great deal. Again, I would like to thank everyone that took the time to send or 'click' in a contribution! If you forgot to make a contribution, feel free to surf over to the following URLs for more information how you can support the RV and Zenith list operation: RV-List - http://www.matronics.com/rv-list/contribution.html Zenith-List - http://www.matronics.com/zenith-list/contribution.html Matt Dralle RV and Zenith List Admin. ============================================================================== Thanks again to the following members: Brent Allen Edward Anderson Gary Baker Warren Bishop Gregory Booze Bob Bower Garrett Bray Charles Brietigam Don Champagne Moe Colontonio G. Corriveau David Faile Jeff Farrar George Fetzer Chris Good Denny Harjehausen Ken Harrill Nick Haurplen Wesley Hays Randall Henderson Michael Hilger Brian Holman Kevin Horton Fred Hulen Bruce Knoll Charlie Kuss Philip Lehrke Randy Lervold Jim Lyden Jim MacDonald Michael McKenna S. Mehrhoff Warren Moore William Morelli Jim Nolan Chris Olsen Jeff Orear Jeff Orear Derek Reed Robert Rimbold Les Rowles Thomas Sargent Richard Sipp Charles Sonberg Jerry Springer Terrel Stern J. Tompkins Robert Trumpfheller Terrence Watson Doug Weiler Jim Wendel Ron Wilcox Leslie Williams Louis Willig Joseph Wiza Greg Young Richard Zeidman -- Matt G. Dralle | Matronics | P.O. Box 347 | Livermore | CA | 94551 925-606-1001 Voice | 925-606-6281 FAX | dralle(at)matronics.com Email http://www.matronics.com/ W.W.W. | Featuring Products For Aircraft ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Peter O'Brien" <petero(at)orbital.com.au>
Date: Jul 17, 1998
Subject: Re: Rocket RV-8???
> Date: Thu, 16 Jul 1998 16:59:12 -0500 > To: rv-list(at)matronics.com > From: Tom Craig-Stearman <tcraigst(at)ionet.net> > Subject: Re: RV-List: Rocket RV-8??? > Reply-to: rv-list(at)matronics.com > > I don't know of any other IO-540-powered RV-8s, but I do know one builder > who plans to install an Allison turboprop. Talk about a rocket! > > > > >A friend of mine is thinking about building a RV-8 and installing an IO-540. > >Is anybody already doing a IO-540 installation in an -8? Is anybody turning > >a RV-8 into a Rocket? We have a two place Pitts with on IO-540 power plant, on our Aero Club line, it is bloody unreal! > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 17, 1998
From: scott <acepilot(at)mwt.net>
Subject: My first kit is here, but...
My tail kit for my RV4 has arrived! Now the very first question (and in less than 24 hours!). During inventory, I noticed that a couple skins have about 1/4 inch of one corner bent over at a 90 degree angle, like they got dropped on that corner. Also, my vertical stab skin has a slight bend in one corner (approx 10 degrees outward) starting about 1.5 - 2 inches back from the corner. Is this a concern or should I just bend them back. If so, how should I do it. As a kid I remember bending metal back and forth until it breaks! Should I bother Van's or is it something I can live with? Scott -- Gotta Fly or Gonna Die ! --Ask me about my Aeronca Super Chief-- amended 8-29-97: Now after feeling the "Need for Speed", building an RV-4! Tail kit arrived!! Somewhat regretfully, the Super Chief is now for sale. $8500 :( ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Karl Ahamer" <ascot(at)hinet.net.au>
Subject: fluid in compass
Date: Jul 17, 1998
hi listers,does anyone know out there what kind of fluid is used in the magnetic compasses? i have to top mine up it smells like diesel.... regards Karl Ahamer RV6AQ Sydney ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 06, 1998
From: lindsay richards <admin(at)tmba.design.net.au>
Subject: LAUGH
Dear Peter, Got this from my son David. Regards, Lindsay ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 17, 1998
From: Tom Craig-Stearman <tcraigst(at)ionet.net>
Subject: Re: My first kit is here, but...
Scott, No, don't try to bend them back. You will get a Z-shaped bend. Call Van's and I'm sure they will replace the skins. Have fun building. It will be worth the effort. By the way, I wish I had discovered the RV-list when I was at your stage. I made quite a few mistakes all by myself that I might have prevented with this resource. Regards, Tom Craig-Stearman tcraigst(at)ionet.net RV-4 50TC (reserved) mounting the engine > >My tail kit for my RV4 has arrived! Now the very first question (and in >less than 24 hours!). During inventory, I noticed that a couple skins >have about 1/4 inch of one corner bent over at a 90 degree angle, like >they got dropped on that corner. Also, my vertical stab skin has a >slight bend in one corner (approx 10 degrees outward) starting about 1.5 >- 2 inches back from the corner. Is this a concern or should I just bend >them back. If so, how should I do it. As a kid I remember bending metal >back and forth until it breaks! Should I bother Van's or is it something >I can live with? > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: MLaboyteau(at)aol.com
Date: Jul 17, 1998
Subject: Humbling Landings.......
Well I've got 35 hours on the plane now. For the last two flights, I've flown around the perimeter of my flight area, simulating long cross country flights of 400 miles. I've really gotten to know how to use the GPS receiver, man is that thing cool! Yesterday, before I got started, I decided to swing by Tulsa Int. and use thier compass rose to recheck my compass. So they set me up inbound for runway 36R, which is the main runway that the big boys use. Great!, now I have a chance to tune up the ILS receiver and see how it works, and use the power and flap settings that I've been working on for approaches. Everything was lookin' good, airspeed nailed (100 mph), flaps 20 degrees,map 15.5", right down the glideslope, textbook approach. Oh, look, there's a TWA DC-9 waiting just off the runway for a hold clearance to Chicago, and a Southwest 737's taxing up, too. Great! an audience! Now I get to show off my superb landing skills. I'm thinking, "I bet they wish they were out flying an RV like me, instead of driving skypigs all day." This is gonna be great. All right, power off, 30 degrees flaps, 90 mph indicated, start bleeding off speed, oops, got a little cross wind here, straighten it out, starting to flare, BOOIIIINNNNNGGGG, what the ?, BBBBOOOOIIIINNNNGGGG, BOING, BOING. Watch the nose gear, moron! You're porpoising! Yikes! It seems I was about a half a cycle out of step with the porpoise, and everything I did just made it worse. I added power, got it under control, back to idle, start to flare, BOING, BOING, BOING. Crap. I think in the middle of this, the TWA captain called out "Ride 'em cowboy!". The tower had asked me to make the first turn off to the left. I sailed right on by it. Taxing across the ramp, I thought I saw the Southwest Captain and FO both holding their hands out the windows with their thumbs down. Maybe not, it could have just been a reflection. I felt like tucking my tail between my legs and slinking back home to lick my wounds. My worst landing, ever. Usually, landing on extra wide runways, it's common to think you're lower than you really are, and flare too high, but it's obvious that I touched down with way too much speed, which started the porpoising action. The TWA crew probably laughed all the way to Chicago. Oh, well, I'll just have to go back another day and redeem myself, of course, maybe I'll use a different call sign so they won't know it's me, "Oh, you thought I said Bonanza 6 romeo victor? no it's Van's 106 romeo victor, sorry. Say, how'd you like that landing?" Mark "PogoStick" LaBoyteaux RV-6A N106RV "The Silver Streak!" MLaboyteau(at)aol.com Broken Arrow, Ok ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 17, 1998
From: Glenn & Judi <glenng(at)megsinet.net>
Subject: Re: fluid in compass
> Karl, I have always been told that Kerosene is used in the "whiskey compass". Can anyone out there in RV land verify that this is correct? You might want to make sure that the compass is meant to me completely "topped off". Is a small air pocket required for expansion during temperature changes? -Glenn Gordon > > > hi listers,does anyone know out there what kind of fluid is used in the > magnetic compasses? i have to top mine up it smells like > diesel.... > regards > Karl Ahamer > RV6AQ > Sydney ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 17, 1998
From: Glenn & Judi <glenng(at)megsinet.net>
Subject: Re: Farming Out the Panel
A couple of custom panel shops suggest that I rebend the panel out of .080" 2024T3 Aluminum. Has anyone else heard about this? Does anyone think it is necessary? -Glenn Gordon ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "John Morrissey" <John.Morrissey(at)its.csiro.au>
Subject: Re: Australian Experimental Category
Date: Jul 17, 1998
Hi Jerry, The project belonged to Simon Pike of Temora Australia - My part in the project was mainly on the other end of the bucking bar for around 6000 rivets. :-) and also two brains sure made finding all the errors in the early plans a lot easier. Simon is now on his third and they are getting better each time. I managed to put in a lot of flying hours in that yellow RV6 including a lot of the early test flying with Simon when we were sorting out the first of type certification here in OZ - I was sure sad to see it go. Simon's second RV6 has the distinction of being the lightest RV6 built so far - also a real delight to fly. Can't wait to get my hands on the next one. Thanks for you help with the paperwork - without it we would have had to go through a whole lot more stress and the first one would not have flown as early as it did. Cheers John Morrissey -----Original Message----- From: Jerry Springer <jsflyrv(at)ix.netcom.com> Date: Friday, July 17, 1998 5:26 PM Subject: Re: RV-List: Australian Experimental Category > >Morrissey, John wrote: > > >> >> It wasn't really that bad before - having been through the whole 'First >> of type" process with the first RV6 in Australia - all we had to do was >> to wait for four of you guys in the US to survive the first 50hrs of >> flying and we were away!!. Thanks for all that free test flying guys. >> :-) > >> Cheers >> >> John Morrissey > >John >Are you the one that built that pretty yellow RV-6 back in the about >1990-91? I was one of the ones to fill out some paper work for you as >I had about 100 or so hours on my RV-6 at the time. Van ask me to fill >out some papers for someone in Australia. If that was you I asked you to >send me a picture of your RV-6 when you received the paper work which you >did. That's how I know it was a pretty yellow RV-6:) >-- >Jerry Springer RV-6 N906GS First flight July 14, 1989 :-) Hillsboro, OR >jsflyrv(at)ix.netcom.com > > > > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "John Darby" <johnd@our-town.com>
Subject: Re: fluid in compass
Date: Jul 17, 1998
Karl; In the old days we used kerosene (parafin to you?). John C Darby Jr. RV6 sold, Cessna 210 bought Stephenville TX -----Original Message----- From: Karl Ahamer <ascot(at)hinet.net.au> Date: Friday, July 17, 1998 06:42 Subject: RV-List: fluid in compass > >hi listers,does anyone know out there what kind of fluid is used in the >magnetic compasses? i have to top mine up it smells like >diesel.... ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Stucklen, Frederic IFC" <stuckle(at)ifc.hsd.utc.com>
Subject: Australian Experimental Category
Date: Jul 17, 1998
John, Guess I really didn't understand your old cert system as well as I thought. My impression was that you had to go through a complete certification test program similar to the cert testing done on the major manufacture planes here in the US - Cessna's and Pipers... Are you saying that to certify an RV all you had to do was show that it was built to the plans and that the same type of aircraft had been built and tested in the US? I also recall that you had to have other "basic" flying aids, like stall warning devices, installed before you could get them certified. That approach sounds rather easy, and the reward of having the freedom to fly anywhere in the world without the need for special paperwork is nice also. What will happen now that you have an "Experimental" cert? I had the honor of flying in formation with VH-JOH over the Rockies three years ago when Jon was traveling through the Fort Collins Col. area. I was there on vacation visiting Rod Woodard (on the RV list). Rod told me he had a hanger for me while I was there. He didn't tell me that Jon was one of the others in it! We had an unforgettable ride up to the highest airport in the US, (can't remember the name, must be a "senior moment"!). Jon, Dean Hall (EAA regional Director) Rod and myself in three RV's in loose formation over the highest peaks in the Rockies, at 15,500' MSL, doing rolls! Not something one forgets too soon. Best of luck to you on the kit! Fred Stucklen N925RV RV-6A E. Windsor, Ct Building a 2'd RV-6 (or 6A) >-----Original Message----- >From: Morrissey, John [SMTP:John.Morrissey(at)its.csiro.au] >Sent: Thursday, July 16, 1998 7:24 PM >To: 'rv-list(at)matronics.com' >Subject: RE: RV-List: Australian Experimental Category > > > >Hi Fred, > >It wasn't really that bad before - having been through the whole 'First >of type" process with the first RV6 in Australia - all we had to do was >to wait for four of you guys in the US to survive the first 50hrs of >flying and we were away!!. Thanks for all that free test flying guys. >:-) >Admittedly under the previous system building up a new design from the >ground up took a lot of determination and was rarely successful due to >the high costs involved. Although a couple of advantages with the old >system included the fact that all our homebuilts were certified and >allowed to fly anywhere they wanted - VH-JOH took a couple of little >jaunts around the world :-),also having certification does make a second >hand homebuilt a fair bit more marketable here in OZ. > >I am looking forward to the flood of new designs we should see coming >out of Australia with the new system. > >Cheers > >John Morrissey > >-----Original Message----- >From: Stucklen, Frederic IFC [mailto:stuckle(at)ifc.hsd.utc.com] >Sent: Friday, July 17, 1998 12:51 AM >To: 'rv-list(at)matronics.com' >Subject: RE: RV-List: Australian Experimental Category > > > > >Peter, > > Congratulations! This should make it significantly easier for all >you down under to get more RV's into the air..... > >Fred Stucklen >N925RV RV-6A >E. Windsor, Ct > > >>-----Original Message----- >>From: pbennett(at)zip.com.au [SMTP:pbennett(at)zip.com.au] >>Sent: Thursday, July 16, 1998 5:07 PM >>To: rv-list(at)matronics.com >>Subject: RV-List: Australian Experimental Category >> >> >>I am delighted to be able to advise that after decades of arguing >>with bureaucrats, Australian homebuilders have at last got a US style >>Experimental Category. >> >>The Governor General signed the Act into law at 11.45 am on Wednesday >>15th July. >> >>Many dedicated people have contributed to this landmark achievement, >>but it is undoubtedly the determined leadership of the National >>President of the Sport Aircraft Association of Australia, Peter >>Wilkinson, which has brought this about. May his Nieuport now take to >>the skies, unfettered by the weight of Canberra shiney-bums. >> >> >> >> >>Peter Bennett >>Sydney Australia >>RV6 doing cowls >> >> >> > > > > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: RVer273sb(at)aol.com
Date: Jul 17, 1998
Subject: Re: fluid in compass
YOU CAN GET A SMALL AMOUNT FROM AN INSTRUMENT OVERHAUL PLACE. THERE IS A DIAPHRAM IN IT TO COMPENSATE FOR EXPANSION. RVER273SB ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Stucklen, Frederic IFC" <stuckle(at)ifc.hsd.utc.com>
Subject: fluid in compass
Date: Jul 17, 1998
Karl, Compass fluid is available through Spruce & Specialty, as well as other sources. This is a low viscosity fluid that allows the compass to swing freely. I had an old timer once tell me to fill the compass up with Johnson's baby Oil - the clear kind - if I wanted to dampen out the swings. Works great, especially in turbulence. be sure to use the clear type, not the amber colored stuff normally found on the store shelves.... Fred Stucklen N925RV RV-6A E. Windsor, Ct > -----Original Message----- > From: Karl Ahamer [SMTP:ascot(at)hinet.net.au] > Sent: Friday, July 17, 1998 7:27 AM > To: rv-list(at)matronics.com > Subject: RV-List: fluid in compass > > > hi listers,does anyone know out there what kind of fluid is used in > the > magnetic compasses? i have to top mine up it smells like > diesel.... > regards > Karl Ahamer > RV6AQ > Sydney > > > > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 17, 1998
From: Denny Harjehausen <harje(at)proaxis.com>
Subject: Re: Rocket RV-8???
>If you guys want to see his Harmon Rocket II, check out Sport >Aviation(Sept 1997; pg48) and read a 7 page article about Mark and his >HR2. His plane is nothing short of AWESOME!! I just checked it out....wow Mark, will have to give you more respect now! Did anyone catch the Harmon Rocket II acro demo at Arlington? It sure got a lot of attention in the area I was observing it. Have a good one! Denny Harjehausen RV-6 Fiberglass/systems Lebanon, OR ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Vanremog(at)aol.com
Date: Jul 17, 1998
Subject: Re: basic acro
<< BTW, I use entry IAS of 150-160 mph for aileron rolls and 170-180 mph for >loops. > >-GV >At what weight do you do these manuevers? >> I pull about 3g in loops right around 1450 lbs solo. -GV ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 17, 1998
From: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <nuckolls(at)aeroelectric.com>
Subject: RE: Australian Experimental Category
>Admittedly under the previous system building up a new design from the >ground up took a lot of determination and was rarely successful due to >the high costs involved. Although a couple of advantages with the old >system included the fact that all our homebuilts were certified and >allowed to fly anywhere they wanted - VH-JOH took a couple of little >jaunts around the world :-),also having certification does make a second >hand homebuilt a fair bit more marketable here in OZ. > >I am looking forward to the flood of new designs we should see coming >out of Australia with the new system. > Me too . . . Now, if we could just get our guardian angels in Washington to allow "de-certification" of old factory built ships, (like in Canada) we might begin to demonstrate how little some rules contribute to real safety and how much they drive airplanes out of existence. . . better not to know what the numbers were. I passed just in front of a 727 preparing for departure and was in pretty good shape with the mains on the ground and working the wheel back to keep the nose up when a gust weathercocked the airplane. Not fast enough with my feet, the airplane skidded and was past 45 degress to the runway when I got it stopped. I powered up and taxied toward the runway exit when the 727 captain said "Don't know how we're going to follow and act like that but TWA flight xxx is ready on 19 left." All the way to the ramp I was wondering how many PAX in the 727 were setting there debating the sanity of their travel decision that day. Bob . . . //// (o o) ===========o00o=(_)=o00o========= < If you continue to do > < What you've always done > < You will continue to be > < What you've always been. > ================================= <http://www.aeroelectric.com> ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Mack, Don" <DMack(at)tuthill.com>
Subject: RE: Australian Experimental Category
Date: Jul 17, 1998
Now, if we could just get our guardian angels in Washington to allow "de-certification" of old factory built ships, (like in Canada) we might begin to demonstrate how little some rules contribute to real safety and how much they drive airplanes out of existence. You miss the point, that is exactly what Uncle would love. Don Mack RV-6A - Installing Seats Ercoupe - 415D (1946) - In the middle of an expensive, time consuming, FAA mandated service that I can't do so myself even though I can build an RV. http://www.flash.net/~donmack donmack(at)flash.net ________________________________________________________________________________
From: OrndorffG(at)aol.com
Date: Jul 17, 1998
Subject: Re: Mike Seagar in Ft. Worth to give instruction
Ft. Worth RV'ers, Mike Seagar will be in Ft. Worth TX. at Hicks Airfield (T67) on Sept 28th, 29th, 30th to give instruction in the factory RV6 . Cost $70 per hour and will be limited to RV builders. 1 hour slots are still open on the 29th and 30th. For more information call George Orndorff at 817-439-3280. If you are getting close to flying here's your chance to get that dual you wanted in an RV6......................George Orndorff ________________________________________________________________________________
From: ABAYMAN(at)aol.com
Date: Jul 17, 1998
Subject: Re: RE: panel planner problems
dear listers, i'm having trouble getting the updated version of panel planner. i've contacted via e-mail the company, for 4 months now. all i keep getting is empty promises, it was shipped yesterday, i was on vacation, i thought i sent it already , the check is in the mail. you get the picture. anyone else getting pissed like i am scott winging it in tampa rv6a wings ________________________________________________________________________________
From: SportAV8R(at)aol.com
Date: Jul 17, 1998
Subject: Re: Humbling Landings.......
Mark- great post! Man, can I ever identify with that experience.. I've had it 4 times in 15 hrs, and it's scary the first few times, just humiliating after that. My first three porpoise landings were all on sod strips, and two were bad enough to flood the engine to the point of cutoff from all the up-and -down. The first time was terrifying as the rough strip and my being caught unawares and getting out of phase with it both made it worse. I had to talk myself out of the next control movement so as to get back in sync with the plane, and for a moment I feared I would bend the nose gear or have a prop strike. The last of my badly botched landings was when I aborted a takeoff due to a rough-running engine, and figured that halfway down a 7000 ft runway at 50 ft and 100 mph it would be a piece of cake to settle back down to the tarmac.. wrong! The RV has loads of energy in the bank by then, and even full flaps didn't help much. Takeoff climb angle is not a good attitude from which to pull power and attempt an approach - it's anything but stabilized. That gear is springy enough to really vault you back into the air! By the time I got it figured out, "Okay, Bill - don't panic, you've been here before... don't just do something, sit there - you're in a P.I.O.!" the end of the runway was suddenly right there and I had the mains in the air more than on the ground: not good for braking efficiency. I skidded to a stop just a few feet from the REIL lights as the engine coughed rich and quit.. WHEW! I didn't have to face any guffawing TWA captains at the end of the runway, but the lone voice in the tower said "At least we know your brakes work..." Critiquing my own flying over the last month, I am almost certain that I flare too high or else fail to flare smoothly and fully, so I often drop in or fly into the runway slightly, and either way I hear more than one set of tire chirps from that springy gear. An RV is easy to get on the ground safely, but harder to do so with grace and style ;-) Bill Boyd RV-6A 15 hrs. ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 17, 1998
From: Rob Reece <reece(at)rt66.com>
Subject: Re: fluid in compass
>> hi listers,does anyone know out there what kind of fluid is used in the >> magnetic compasses? i have to top mine up it smells like >> diesel.... >> regards >> The fluid that we've always used and the best we've found is the plain, or clear lamp oil that you can usually get for <$1.00 at a store like WalMart, Kmart, etc. I put this is a small coffee can (or similar) and submerge the compass in the can of oil until all the bubbles are gone. . . .and seal it back up. . . . .then after about two "dunks" in the can (because you usually don't get all the air out/displaced the first try), you've got it. Rob Reece RV-3 SN 45 (into my spar mods about ass deep!) Socorro, NM Rob Reece Microcosm c/o EMRTC New Mexico Tech Mail Station Socorro, NM 87801 Phone: (505) 835-5716 Fax: (505) 835-5714/5680 Email: reece(at)rt66.com ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Rvator97(at)aol.com
Date: Jul 17, 1998
Subject: Arlington - First big trip!
What a wonderful week: Left LA area last Thursday evening with my hangar partner Dwain Harris,(RV-6 N164DH) . Flew to Georgetown, Ca. to camp for the night. In the morning , on to Grant's Pass, Or. for fuel and flight planning to Arlington,(around/over weather). ________________________________________________________________________________ Flew in pattern with a B-17! Parked in HUIGE RV parking area at 11:30am. WOW! We made it!!! (We have been "planning" this trip for 6 yrs.! GREAT airshow, met lots of RVers, J.Nice, A. Tolle, J. Harmon, J. VanGrunsven... Departed Arlington on Sunday at 11am; Flew with Dwain south to Scappoose, Or. At Scappoose, I headed East to the Columbia River Gorge, Dwain south to Calif and home. I flew the gorge at 1000 msl through the Cascades and on to Kenniwick Wa. From there, went north to Spokane > Cour de Lene, Idaho > Missoula, Mt, and finally landed at Hamilton, Mt. where my parents and sister were waiting . Spent two days at Hamilton giving rides and flying the Bitterroot Valley,(BEAUTIFUL!) Departed Hamilton on Wed. morning; flew south through Idaho to Brigham Ccity, Utah for fuel. On to the Great Salt Lake > Delta, Ut, > St. George, Ut. > Boulder City, NV > landed for fuel at Bullhead City, AZ. ( Bullhead was 120 degrees F!!!) Fueled up and took off, temp at field was then 122!! She handled it well and climbed out pretty well, although oil temps got pretty high before reaching cooler altitudes. 1.5 hrs later, landing at home field, Whiteman Airpark. Total time for trip: 19.5 hours... Wonderful time!! Thanks Van! Walt Hastings RV-6A N79WH ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 17, 1998
From: John Ammeter <ammeterj(at)seanet.com>
Subject: Re: Humbling Landings.......
> > Well I've got 35 hours on the plane now. All right, power off, 30 degrees flaps, 90 mph indicated, start bleeding off >speed, oops, got a little cross wind here, straighten it out, starting to >flare, BOOIIIINNNNNGGGG, what the ?, BBBBOOOOIIIINNNNGGGG, BOING, BOING. Watch >the nose gear, moron! You're porpoising! Yikes! It seems I was about a half a >cycle out of step with the porpoise, and everything I did just made it worse. >I added power, got it under control, back to idle, start to flare, BOING, >BOING, BOING. Crap. I think in the middle of this, the TWA captain called out >"Ride 'em cowboy!". > >Mark "PogoStick" LaBoyteaux >RV-6A N106RV "The Silver Streak!" >MLaboyteau(at)aol.com >Broken Arrow, Ok > I can't let Mark think he's the only one that can BOOIIIINNNGGGG it on the runway. A few years ago, I was leading a flight of 5 or 6 aircraft into a fly-in at Tacoma Narrows Airport. I had a Long-Ez in back of me so I decided to be a nice guy and land long. Well, I made a 'little' mistake. I flew down the runway at about 95 mph and as I passed the midpoint I decided it was time to think about putting it down. I cut the power and floated and floated and floated---- flaps at full, still floated---- tried to put the mains on but when I started to lower the tail up I came---wheels on, lower tail, up I went--- about that time the brush at the end of the runway began to become individual branches and leaves. I put the throttle in and went around. On downwind the tower called to me, ground point 8; I rather tersely answered that I wasn't on the ground I was on downwind. As I was turning left base to final the tower called out that I was number two behind the Bonanza turning right base. No way could I find that guy. Around again I went. Now I'm getting a little rattled. On the THIRD time down final I vowed this would be the shortest landing I had ever made. It was so short I could have stopped within 600 feet of the numbers if I had wanted to. As it was I had to taxi about 3000 feet to the base of the tower where ALL of my friends were graciously waiting for me. I opened the canopy as Earl Root approached me smiling broadly. He offered me a full roll of toilet paper asking me if I needed it. I've still got that roll to look at whenever I am tempted to laugh at someone else's landing or when I get too cocky. You've heard that there are them that has groundlooped a taildragger and them that will; well that also applies to bouncing an RV onto the runway. How do you put shocks on RV landing gear??? John Ammeter ammeterj(at)seanet.com Seattle WA USA 1974 1/2 JH-5 RV-6 (sold 4/14/98) ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 17, 1998
From: "Owens" <owens(at)Aerovironment.com>
Subject: Arlington - First big trip!
Walt, That sure beats 22 hours in a motorhome driving back from Arlington to L.A. Keep up the words of inspiration. It makes the long hours somehow easier. It was good to see you and Dwain at the show. BTW, your paint job came out really nice. It sure was a nice show, and I look forward to flying up next year (I hope, but ya gotta have goals, don't ya) See ya around WHP. Laird RV-6 (doing major assy stuff at the airport) We had 106degF outside yesterday, much hotter in the hanger. From: rv-list(at)matronics.com on Fri, Jul 17, 1998 9:55 AM Subject: RV-List: Arlington - First big trip! What a wonderful week: Left LA area last Thursday evening with my hangar partner Dwain Harris,(RV-6 N164DH) . Flew to Georgetown, Ca. to camp for the night. In the morning , on to Grant's Pass, Or. for fuel and flight planning to Arlington,(around/over weather). ________________________________________________________________________________ Flew in pattern with a B-17! Parked in HUIGE RV parking area at 11:30am. WOW! We made it!!! (We have been "planning" this trip for 6 yrs.! GREAT airshow, met lots of RVers, J.Nice, A. Tolle, J. Harmon, J. VanGrunsven... Departed Arlington on Sunday at 11am; Flew with Dwain south to Scappoose, Or. At Scappoose, I headed East to the Columbia River Gorge, Dwain south to Calif and home. I flew the gorge at 1000 msl through the Cascades and on to Kenniwick Wa. From there, went north to Spokane > Cour de Lene, Idaho > Missoula, Mt, and finally landed at Hamilton, Mt. where my parents and sister were waiting . Spent two days at Hamilton giving rides and flying the Bitterroot Valley,(BEAUTIFUL!) Departed Hamilton on Wed. morning; flew south through Idaho to Brigham Ccity, Utah for fuel. On to the Great Salt Lake > Delta, Ut, > St. George, Ut. > Boulder City, NV > landed for fuel at Bullhead City, AZ. ( Bullhead was 120 degrees F!!!) Fueled up and took off, temp at field was then 122!! She handled it well and climbed out pretty well, although oil temps got pretty high before reaching cooler altitudes. 1.5 hrs later, landing at home field, Whiteman Airpark. Total time for trip: 19.5 hours... Wonderful time!! Thanks Van! Walt Hastings RV-6A N79WH ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Leslie B. Williams" <lesliebwilliams(at)email.msn.com>
Subject: Re: Humbling Landings.......
Date: Jul 17, 1998
This may be like ground looping a tail dragger - there's those that have and those that are going to. I'm one of the former, so I got my spurs, my ten gallon hat, and a good "yahoo" ready just in case! Actually, I'm prepared to give it a little throttle to hold it off the runway if I bounce. As I'm sure you know by now, it doesn't take much throttle to do that in an RV. Then I try to gradually bleed off the excess speed and hopefully make a normal touchdown. One other thing that will help keep you from bouncing so much is to keep the air pressure in the mains about 30 PSI or below. Any more it tends to bounce real good. I've had numerous kinds of "fun" while landing where heavies operate and I don't think it was all due to my piloting skills or lack thereof! The air gets really stirred up and it takes a while to dissipate, so I too tend to land with a little more speed than normal. Glad you didn't bend anything. Les Williams/RV-6AQ/Tacoma WA (displaced "Okie") >Everything was lookin' good, airspeed nailed (100 mph), flaps 20 degrees,map >15.5", right down the glideslope, textbook approach. >flare, BOOIIIINNNNNGGGG, what the ?, BBBBOOOOIIIINNNNGGGG, BOING, BOING. Watch >the nose gear, moron! You're porpoising! Yikes! It seems I was about a half a >cycle out of step with the porpoise, and everything I did just made it worse. >I added power, got it under control, back to idle, start to flare, BOING, >BOING, BOING. Crap. I think in the middle of this, the TWA captain called out >"Ride 'em cowboy!". >Mark "PogoStick" LaBoyteaux >RV-6A N106RV "The Silver Streak!" >MLaboyteau(at)aol.com >Broken Arrow, Ok ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 17, 1998
From: Paul Besing <rv8er(at)doitnow.com>
Subject: Re: RE: panel planner problems
You can download the update on his website, www.panelplanner.com Paul Besing > >dear listers, >i'm having trouble getting the updated version of panel planner. i've >contacted via e-mail the company, for 4 months now. all i keep getting is >empty promises, it was shipped yesterday, i was on vacation, i thought i sent >it already , the check is in the mail. you get the picture. anyone else >getting pissed like i am >scott >winging it in tampa >rv6a wings > > > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: ABAYMAN(at)aol.com
Date: Jul 17, 1998
Subject: Re: Humbling Landings...
dear listers, i quess it's confession time. 8 years ago when i was learning to fly, just got soloed, living in tampa, i decided i wanted to land at tampa international without an instructor. you can land there with an instructor, but not as a student alone. now i know. anyway, the tower sandwiched me between 2- 747s and kept telling me to expidite my landing, on the 3rd time i scensed the controller was getting paniced, which in turn paniced me, with a whole 15 hours ( 5 which was solo, 15 minutes in class B airspace ) feeling the pressure from the boys in the tower, to scared to look back at what i might see, i slipped the cessna 152 to the left and greased a perfect landing, :-) on the taxiway.!!! thank god i was a student, and they spared my career as a future aviator, of coarse my instructor got a nasty phone call. scott winging it in tampa ( out of class b for now ;-) ) ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 17, 1998
From: randall(at)edt.com (Randall Henderson)
Subject: Re: My first kit is here, but...
> No, don't try to bend them back. You will get a Z-shaped bend. > >My tail kit for my RV4 has arrived! Now the very first question (and in Is the bend a sharp radius? If not, I'd try bending them back before hassling with a re-ship. Especially the one that's only 10 degrees. Do you have a hand-seamer? If not, get one now (you're gonna need it later!) and try bending back with that. The vise grip ones from Avery work well. The bends that are 90 degrees, clamp the seamer over just the part outside of the bend and bend it back to about 45 degrees, then clamp it over the skin so that it bridges the bend and clamp it down to flatten out the bend. Yes bending back and forth will weaken it but for something like a skin corner one cycle isn't likely to make much difference. Also make sure this isn't an edge that is going to get trimmed off anyway. Silly to send back stuff that gets trimmed. Randall ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Fesenbek, Gary" <gfesenbek(at)Meridium.com>
Subject: fluid in compass
Date: Jul 17, 1998
>> hi listers,does anyone know out there what kind of fluid is used in the >> magnetic compasses? i have to top mine up it smells like >> diesel.... >> regards >> You might want to consider using a good Scotch only the single malt stuff though. (:'o) That way if you get stranded you can use it. (For medicinal purposes only of course). I think that is what they do with the Mooneys. Canopy anxiety! RV6AQ, Ronaoke, VA ************************************************* * Gary Fesenbek * * Meridium Inc. * * (540) 344-9205 x112 * * gfesenbek(at)meridium.com * * http://www.meridium.com * ************************************************* ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 17, 1998
From: Richard Bibb <rbibb(at)fore.com>
Subject: Re: Humbling Landings.......
My second landing in my RV-4 resulted in a go aaround due to a PIO. I think it resulted from overconfidence in that I truly greased the first one on. In any event you got to get these suckers slowed down or they will bounce and if the do you better freeze the stick, add power if necessary, or you willchase the airplane all the way across the county... > >This may be like ground looping a tail dragger - there's those that have and >those that are going to. I'm one of the former, so I got my spurs, my ten >gallon hat, and a good "yahoo" ready just in case! Actually, I'm prepared >to give it a little throttle to hold it off the runway if I bounce. As I'm >sure you know by now, it doesn't take much throttle to do that in an RV. >Then I try to gradually bleed off the excess speed and hopefully make a >normal touchdown. One other thing that will help keep you from bouncing so >much is to keep the air pressure in the mains about 30 PSI or below. Any >more it tends to bounce real good. > >I've had numerous kinds of "fun" while landing where heavies operate and I >don't think it was all due to my piloting skills or lack thereof! The air >gets really stirred up and it takes a while to dissipate, so I too tend to >land with a little more speed than normal. Glad you didn't bend anything. > >Les Williams/RV-6AQ/Tacoma WA (displaced "Okie") > > > > >>Everything was lookin' good, airspeed nailed (100 mph), flaps 20 >degrees,map >>15.5", right down the glideslope, textbook approach. >flare, >BOOIIIINNNNNGGGG, what the ?, BBBBOOOOIIIINNNNGGGG, BOING, BOING. Watch >>the nose gear, moron! You're porpoising! Yikes! It seems I was about a half >a >>cycle out of step with the porpoise, and everything I did just made it >worse. >>I added power, got it under control, back to idle, start to flare, BOING, >>BOING, BOING. Crap. I think in the middle of this, the TWA captain called >out >>"Ride 'em cowboy!". >Mark "PogoStick" LaBoyteaux >>RV-6A N106RV "The Silver Streak!" >>MLaboyteau(at)aol.com >>Broken Arrow, Ok > > > > > > > > > Richard E. Bibb Direct: 703-245-4505 Vice President, Federal Operations Main: 703-245-4544 Fore Systems Federal, Inc. FAX: 703-245-4500 1595 Spring Hill Road Pager: 800-719-1246 5th Floor Vienna, VA 22182 We're from Pittsburgh, we make networks that last. ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 17, 1998
From: Sam Buchanan <sbuc(at)traveller.com>
Subject: Re: fluid in compass
I was told by a usually reliable source that "compass fluid" is basically regular ol' lighter fluid. That is what I used when I rebuilt a compass a while back (which legally must be done by a certificated repair station). Sam Buchanan sbuc(at)traveller.com "The RV Journal" http://www.ath.tis.net/~sbuc/rv6 Stucklen, Frederic IFC wrote: > > > Karl, > > Compass fluid is available through Spruce & Specialty, as well as > other sources. This is a low viscosity fluid that allows the compass to > swing freely. I had an old timer once tell me to fill the compass up > with Johnson's baby Oil - the clear kind - if I wanted to dampen out the > swings. Works great, especially in turbulence. be sure to use the clear > type, not the amber colored stuff normally found on the store > shelves.... > > Fred Stucklen > N925RV RV-6A > E. Windsor, Ct > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: Karl Ahamer [SMTP:ascot(at)hinet.net.au] > > Sent: Friday, July 17, 1998 7:27 AM > > To: rv-list(at)matronics.com > > Subject: RV-List: fluid in compass > > > > > > hi listers,does anyone know out there what kind of fluid is used in > > the > > magnetic compasses? i have to top mine up it smells like > > diesel.... > > regards > > Karl Ahamer > > RV6AQ > > Sydney > > > > > > > > > > > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Mlfred(at)aol.com
Date: Jul 17, 1998
Subject: Rocket photo shoot
<< If you guys want to see his Harmon Rocket II, check out Sport >Aviation(Sept 1997; pg48) and read a 7 page article about Mark and his >HR2. His plane is nothing short of AWESOME!! I just checked it out....wow Mark, will have to give you more respect now! Well, thanks. And thanks to the original poster, too (I'm a little too enthusiastic with that delete key from time to time). That picture of me is one that only a mother could love...ruins the whole shoot, IMHO. That head-on shot was a real attention getter- I was about 8' from the h stab of the photo 210 in trail. In other words, that shot is not done with a tele lens. The fellas hanging out of that 210 to actually take the photos have large, brass cajones. Flying with Budd for the write-up was a hoot, too. You know how you can tell some guys have "the touch" when you ride in a plane with 'em? He's one of those guys... After doing that shoot, I found that the EAA will sell you or anyone else any size blow up of any photo used in Sport Aviation articles. You'd better believe that I have a few poster size from that article. If you see one that you like, you can call up and order it! Prices are very fair. Did anyone catch the Harmon Rocket II acro demo at Arlington? It sure got a lot of attention in the area I was observing it. That fella does his act with a stock airframe (built light) and a very healthy engine. Speeds approach 300 MPH. I'm told that we might be able to see this act at OSH, if those in charge see fit to let him perform there. Check six! Mark ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 17, 1998
From: Scott Malone <scottm(at)pld.com>
Subject: COPPER BRAKE LINES
IS THERE A "RULE" AGAINST USING COPPER BRAKE LINES? I WAS WANTING TO USE COPPER FROM THE BRAKES UP TO THE FUSELAGE. SCOTT MALONE RV6 ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 17, 1998
From: Scott Malone <scottm(at)pld.com>
Subject: COPPER BRAKE LINES
IS THERE A "RULE" AGAINST USING COPPER FOR BRAKE LINES? I WAS WANTING TO USE COPPER ALONG THE GEAR LEGS FROM THE BRAKE UP TO THE FUSELAGE. ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 17, 1998
From: Paul Besing <rv8er(at)doitnow.com>
Subject: Re: COPPER BRAKE LINES
Why do you want to use copper? The alluminum lines that are supplied will resist corrosion, where copper will not.... > >IS THERE A "RULE" AGAINST USING COPPER BRAKE LINES? I WAS WANTING TO >USE COPPER FROM THE BRAKES UP TO THE FUSELAGE. > >SCOTT MALONE RV6 > > > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: GURLEYP51(at)aol.com
Date: Jul 17, 1998
Subject: Re: LAUGH
NO MORE EMAIL LEASE NO MORE EMAIL ________________________________________________________________________________
From: GURLEYP51(at)aol.com
Date: Jul 17, 1998
Subject: Re: LAUGH
DONT EMAIL ME ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 17, 1998
From: Jerry Springer <jsflyrv(at)ix.netcom.com>
Subject: Re: GURLEYP51
GURLEYP51(at)aol.com wrote: > > > NO MORE EMAIL > I would suggest that you read the tag at the end of all messages that tells you how to unsubscribe from the RV-LIST. It appears to me that there are a lot of people that do not read that message from the amount of post to the list that say "unsubscribe me" from the list. -- Jerry Springer RV-6 N906GS First flight July 14, 1989 :-) Hillsboro, OR jsflyrv(at)ix.netcom.com ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Allan.Gibson(at)fluordaniel.com
Date: Jul 18, 1998
Subject: COPPER BRAKE LINES
Just a note on the chemistry, copper reacts with the alcohol in some brake fluids forming a green/blue toxic sludge, straight mineral oil is OK. ______________________________ Reply Separator _________________________________ Subject: Re: RV-List: COPPER BRAKE LINES Date: 17-07-98 13:13 Why do you want to use copper? The alluminum lines that are supplied will resist corrosion, where copper will not.... > >IS THERE A "RULE" AGAINST USING COPPER BRAKE LINES? I WAS WANTING TO >USE COPPER FROM THE BRAKES UP TO THE FUSELAGE. > >SCOTT MALONE RV6 > > > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: cecilth(at)Juno.com
Subject: Re: RV-List Panel swings down
Date: Jul 17, 1998
A month ago several people wanted me to send them photos of the panel that swings down in my RV6A. My saved mail went bye-bye and I need to know those that want this info again. Please Email to Cecilth(at)juno.com, your address so I can send the material this week. Thanks for your patience. Cecil Thousand Oaks CA ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 17, 1998
From: Jerry Springer <jsflyrv(at)ix.netcom.com>
Subject: Re: Humbling Landings.......
SportAV8R(at)aol.com wrote: > > > > Critiquing my own flying over the last month, I am almost certain that I flare > too high or else fail to flare smoothly and fully, so I often drop in or fly > into the runway slightly, and either way I hear more than one set of tire > chirps from that springy gear. An RV is easy to get on the ground safely, but > harder to do so with grace and style ;-) > > Bill Boyd > RV-6A 15 hrs. > Bill Just out of curiosity how fast do you think you are going at touch down? Most of the new RV pilots that I check out have a tendency to want to land to to fast. I like to use 70-75mph on close final and than round out and hold it 6-12" of the runway with just a slight nose high attitude as the speed bleeds off and it settles down on the runway. Also some of the RV-6A pilots try to land to flat almost in a three point attitude which will almost guarantee PIO. Another thing is to just sit in your RV on the ground and get a good mental picture of how far off the ground you are when sitting on the ground then try to picture the 6-12" higher mentioned above. It is a lot easier for me to show and teach this than it is to write it and I am probably telling you stuff you already know but I also know that it can take some of the fun out of flying a RV if you have to be worried about making a good landing each time. -- Jerry Springer RV-6 N906GS First flight July 14, 1989 :-) Hillsboro, OR jsflyrv(at)ix.netcom.com ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Terrence C. Watson" <tcwatson(at)pstbbs.com>
Subject: Re: Rocket photo shoot
Date: Jul 17, 1998
< If you guys want to see his Harmon Rocket II, check out Sport Aviation(Sept 1997; pg48) and read a 7 page article about Mark and his HR2. His plane is nothing short of AWESOME!! >Did anyone catch the Harmon Rocket II acro demo at Arlington? It sure got a lot of attention in the area I was observing it. What follows is a piece of a note I posted with Phil Arter's RV-8 short list last week after going to Arlington: ... it's (Harmon Rocket's) takeoff with smoke reminded me of a space shuttle launch ... Terry Watson RV8 #729 Seattle Tail ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 17, 1998
Subject: Re: fluid in compass
From: rvpilot(at)Juno.com (William R. Davis Jr)
Karl, The proper fluid to use in compasses is mineral spirits. Fill it as full as you can, the diaphram in the back will take care of expansion. Regards, Bill, RV4, N66WD ________________________________________________________________________________
From: WLPMAP(at)aol.com
Date: Jul 17, 1998
Subject: Re: fluid in compass
just a note. you might check with a company in Bridgeton Mo. called Airpath. Two brothers started the company way back when Bill Lear was getting started and he liked their compasses so well..all Lears have them, as well as most McDonald Douglas fighters and the list goes on and on.. but they could tell you and probably sell you some.. call information at 314 -555- 1212 as I dont know their number. ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Vanremog(at)aol.com
Date: Jul 17, 1998
Subject: Re: COPPER BRAKE LINES
<< IS THERE A "RULE" AGAINST USING COPPER FOR BRAKE LINES? I WAS WANTING TO USE COPPER ALONG THE GEAR LEGS FROM THE BRAKE UP TO THE FUSELAGE. >> Why? Copper weighs more than the aluminum lines. IMO, if you really want the best, don't mind the weight and don't mind the cost, the Earl's s/s braided teflon lines are the way to go. I used ends that fit -4 fittings but accomodate -3 hose (p/n 600143). Try a local performance shop for Earl's stuff. -GV ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 17, 1998
From: larry <B747400(at)compuserve.com>
Subject: COPPER BRAKE LINES
copper hardens as it bends and then it breaks. Atill weant copper? LKD RV8 skining Stab erself acro in any airplane. LKD Skining the stab ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 17, 1998
From: Gert <gert(at)execpc.com>
Subject: Countersink HS810 and HS812
Hi Folks How deep should I countersink the center holes in the HS810 and HS814 ?? I thought conventional wisdom is so a AN426AD-4 head is flush with the top. However, my HS 602 spars don't lay flat on the HS810 and 812. Also after assembling and drilling the HS405's to the HS810/HS814/HS602 assembly, the hole distance for the top AN470AD4-7 rivet to the top edge of the vertical flange of the HS405 rib is rather minimal. This distance, however, is a function of the hole distance as given for the HS810. How critical is this rivet here as there are plenty other rivets holding this rib in place. Gert RV8-A #80712 ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 17, 1998
From: sarg314(at)azstarnet.com (tom sargent)
Subject: dimpling mistake - now what?
It seems I'm destined to make every dumb mistake in the book. I was dimpling the HS skins with the C-frame tool and trying to get those last few rivet holes that mate with the HS607. It's hard to get the C-frame tool in towards the leading edge. Trying to flex one side of the skin back and keep the other side flat on the platform, it slipped off the male dimple die and I smashed a hole into the skin with the dimple die. Two questions: 1- How do you dimple those last few holes? I don't think the C-frame tool is the way. Is this where I use the pop-rivet dimpler? 2- What do I do with this half formed hole/dimple that's about 5/16 inch from the nearest rivet hole? It's close to the rivet line hence over the hs607 flange, so I have to flatten it out. I guess I drill it out and try to flatten what's left? Just shoot me. --- Tom Sargent, sarg314(at)azstarnet.com ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 17, 1998
From: Tom Moore <qba321tm(at)airmail.net>
Subject: FS RV-4 Tail Assy
FOR SALE: RV-4 TAIL ASSEMBLY Vertical stabilizer, Rudder, Horizontal stabilizer, and Elevator with elevator trim tab (all closed), tip fairings Very nice work. $700.00 Contact Gary @ 972-575-8126 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Brian Holman" <bholman(at)fullcomp.com.au>
Subject: Re: Countersink HS810 and HS812
Date: Jul 18, 1998
When countersinking if you don't countersink enough, you won't have a problem, just a slightly high rivet. But if you countersink even one thou. too much you will have a LOOSE RIVET and then you have got a problem. (At least you will, if using AN rivets.) The rivet set or dolly only sits flush with the surface of the material, therefore if the countersink is one thou too deep that one thou will be UNDER the head of the rivet. Countersinking too deep is one of the reasons the manual now recommends you dimple where ever possible. Check out the loose rivets on the flight line next time and you will see most are on c/s rivets and rarely on dimpled rivets. Brian > > Hi Folks > > How deep should I countersink the center holes in the HS810 and HS814 ?? > > I thought conventional wisdom is so a AN426AD-4 head is flush with the > top. ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Brian Holman" <bholman(at)fullcomp.com.au>
Subject: Re: COPPER BRAKE LINES
Date: Jul 18, 1998
It was also banned years ago for use as fuel lines due to it's propensity to harden and crack with vibration. Don't use plastic lines right to the caliper either. I have seen these let go twice now. Both times were when taxiing in a strong crosswind and both at a very remote strip . ( Murphy's law) oop's, is that politically correct ? The nylon or whatever overheats where it enters the caliper, gets soft and blows out of the fitting. Brian ---------- > > > Just a note on the chemistry, copper reacts with the alcohol in some > brake fluids forming a green/blue toxic sludge, straight mineral oil > is OK. > > > >IS THERE A "RULE" AGAINST USING COPPER BRAKE LINES? I WAS WANTING TO > >USE COPPER FROM THE BRAKES UP TO THE FUSELAGE. > > > >SCOTT MALONE RV6 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Jim Sears <sears(at)searnet.com>
Subject: Re: GURLEYP51
Date: Jul 18, 1998
>I would suggest that you read the tag at the end of all messages >that tells you how to unsubscribe from the RV-LIST. It appears to >me that there are a lot of people that do not read that message from >the amount of post to the list that say "unsubscribe me" from the list. Alas, Jerry is right on this. I've sent this fella two notes already to explain how to get off. However, it's very difficult for folks to follow instructions. We see it every day on the list. How many of us have read the notes sent to us that ask us to keep replies short and only list the part of the note that will aide in giving the reply? Or, how about the one that asks us to keep one-on-one conversations off line to help keep the archives smaller and more useful? It's very simple to replace rv-list with a person's mailing address by doing a simple delete of rv-list and copy of the person's mailing address into it's place. Instead, all of us get to read the personal mail between two folks that contains no items of interest for the rest of us. Alas, it would be so much more simple for the rest of us if some of us would just read and adhere to the rules. Jim Sears in KY RV-6A N198JS (Registration complete. Ready to glass canopy.) ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 18, 1998
From: Frank van der Hulst <frankv(at)pec.co.nz>
Subject: Re: dimpling mistake - now what?
sarg314(at)azstarnet.com wrote: > > > It seems I'm destined to make every dumb mistake in the book. I > was dimpling the HS skins with the C-frame tool and trying to get those > last few rivet holes that mate with the HS607. It's hard to get the C-frame > tool in towards the leading edge. Trying to flex one side of the skin back > and keep the other side flat on the platform, it slipped off the male > dimple die and I smashed a hole into the skin with the dimple die. > > Two questions: > 1- How do you dimple those last few holes? I don't think the C-frame tool > is the way. Is this where I use the pop-rivet dimpler? I did them all with the C-frame... see http://members.xoom.com/frankv/bunny1a.htm for my HS mistakes (and solutions) and other such-like stuff mostly culled from the list. > 2- What do I do with this half formed hole/dimple that's about 5/16 inch > from the nearest rivet hole? It's close to the rivet line hence over the > hs607 flange, so I have to flatten it out. I guess I drill it out and try > to flatten what's left? I'd suggest you just put a rivet in it. There's answers to this question in the Bunny's Guide too. For an index to the Bunny's Guide, go to http://members.xoom.com/frankv/bunny.htm (previous readers of the Guide please note that it has moved). > Just shoot me. It's just a mistake. No big deal. When I build my third RV, I plan to not make any mistakes at all, or at least to hide them so no-one can see them. Frank. ________________________________________________________________________________
From: OrndorffG(at)aol.com
Date: Jul 18, 1998
Subject: Re: Farming Out the Panel
Brain, We do panel layouts, cutout, and setup here in the center at shop rates $30 per hour please call if I can be of any help....George Orndorff ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 18, 1998
From: Doug Gray <doug.gray(at)hlos.com.au>
Subject: Re: Countersink HS810 and HS812
> > How deep should I countersink the center holes in the HS810 and HS814 ?? > > > > I thought conventional wisdom is so a AN426AD-4 head is flush with the > > top. In my experience it needs to be just a tad deeper than flush to have the dimpled spar flange sit properly in the countersunk angles. Best is to give it a try both ways with some scrap. Doug ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 18, 1998
From: Gert <gert(at)execpc.com>
Subject: Re: Countersink HS810 and HS812
Brian I believe it does not quite apply because the rivet head will be in the HS602 spar which has been dimpled. It is flush or slightly proud of it. It is where the other side of the dimple sits in the countersinks in the HS810 and HS814. There is a small gap between the HS810/814 and the HS602 spar because the dimple is keeping the HS602 up. It looks like I would have to deepen the c'sink. Gert Brian Holman wrote: > > > When countersinking if you don't countersink enough, you won't have a > problem, just a slightly high rivet. But if you countersink even one thou. > too much you will have a LOOSE RIVET and then you have got a problem. (At > least you will, if using AN rivets.) The rivet set or dolly only sits > flush with the surface of the material, therefore if the countersink is > one thou too deep that one thou will be UNDER the head of the rivet. > Countersinking too deep is one of the reasons the manual now recommends you > dimple where ever possible. Check out the loose rivets on the flight line > next time and you will see most are on c/s rivets and rarely on dimpled > rivets. Brian > > > > > > Hi Folks > > > > How deep should I countersink the center holes in the HS810 and HS814 ?? > > > > I thought conventional wisdom is so a AN426AD-4 head is flush with the > > top. > ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 18, 1998
From: "James K. Hurd" <hurd(at)riolink.com>
Subject: Drilling Plexi
Preparatory to building my slider, I obtained a set of plastic drill bits from Avery. Experimenting on scrap from initial canopy trimming, I find a problem. The 5/32 bit cracks the plastic no matter what size pilot hole precedes it. Tried this with pilots from 1/16 to 1/8. No such problem with 1/8 and 3/16 plastic bits. Slow turn rates and moderate pressure used throughout. Slight loading on plexi to simulate actual on-AC drilling. No lube used on bits. Could those of you who "have been there" comment on drilling techniques that work? It looks like drilling the holes will be the most perilous part of this operation... Jim Trimming 6A slider in New Mexico ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Rv4george(at)aol.com
Date: Jul 18, 1998
Subject: Re: Riveting problem
Scott, although I am on the list, I am mainly directing this to you. I've been working on an RV-4 on and off for a number of years. I would like to get more active. I have the empenage finished and the wings in jigs, riveting ribs to rear spars. Belcranks are in as areaileron brackets. I have no trouble accomplishing the mechanical work, planning the sequence of tasks really slows me down. It would be nice if someone at Van's , with building experience, would write down a sequence of tasks. I realize it wouldn't be the only sequence ,but a proven one. It would be a tremendous help for me and possibly others, a real time saver. Thanks James F. George RV4George(at)AOL.com or juno.com 1853 E. Chestnut Ave. Vineland, N.J. 08361-8402 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Larry Bowen" <larry(at)bowen.com>
Subject: Crossflow Engines?
Date: Jul 18, 1998
Does anyone know of a Crossflow engine in an RV? I only know what I've seen in the advertizing in Sport Avaiation and on their web page (http://www.crossflow.com/default.htm), but it sounds very interesting. -Larry RV-8, skinning HS Email: larry(at)bowen.com Web: http://larry.bowen.com ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 18, 1998
From: Bob Skinner <bskinr(at)trib.com>
Subject: Re: dimpling mistake - now what?
Tom, >I was dimpling the HS skins with the C-frame tool and trying to get those >last few rivet holes that mate with the HS607. It's hard to get the C-frame >tool in towards the leading edge. Trying to flex one side of the skin back >and keep the other side flat on the platform, it slipped off the male >dimple die and I smashed a hole into the skin with the dimple die. I found that it was easier to dimple pre-bent skins in the area your talking about if I put the female die in the bottom of the tool and the male die in the ram. I put the tool on the edge of the table and let the side of the skin not being worked on hang over and under the edge of the table. You'll probably want to put some tape on the edges of the Avery tool top prevent scratching. >2- What do I do with this half formed hole/dimple that's about 5/16 inch >from the nearest rivet hole? It's close to the rivet line hence over the >hs607 flange, so I have to flatten it out. I guess I drill it out and try >to flatten what's left? >Tom Sargent, sarg314(at)azstarnet.com Or, you could drill a hole through the flange, dimple and set a rivet in the extra hole. Bob Skinner RV-6 425 hrs. Buffalo, WY bskinr(at)trib.com ________________________________________________________________________________
From: donspawn(at)Juno.com
Subject: 6A skin overlap distance
Date: Jul 18, 1998
I have the 6A fuselage skeleton ready for drilling. I am planning on pre drilling the skeleton & back drill the skins. 1> What should be the trim distance from the rivet pattern when I trim the overlapping skin? 2> I meet a super craftsmen from W. Virginia at sun-n-fun . HIs roll on his overlap skins were much smaller than what I have on my wing butt joints. I have the Avery's 2 roller on a round base. I came out with 7/32 from the rivet pattern on my wings. Is there a method of adjusting the rollers, or shimming the skin out to get a smaller distance? 3> I would like to joggle the access holes on each side of the fuselage. Which tool do I buy? and will it look as good as with a back plate type? Don Jordan ~ 76DJ ~ 6A fuselage ~ Arlington,Tx ~ donspawn(at)juno.com ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Robert Dimeo <Robert.Dimeo(at)digital.com>
Subject: COPPER BRAKE LINES
Date: Jul 18, 1998
Scott, I don't think that copper can take the pressures. Why not go with steel and chrome or polish them if you want them to look cute? Regards, Bob RV8#423 (wings on order) ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 18, 1998
From: Alex Peterson <alexpeterson(at)mci2000.com>
Subject: Re: Drilling Plexi
> Could those of you who "have been there" comment on drilling techniques > that work? It looks like drilling the holes will be the most perilous > part of this operation... Jim, Not so - the most perilous part is the tendency one has to throw the whole thing out into the street... Drilling technique has little to do with whether or not drills crack plexi., as the drill bit is the key. Regular drills can be easily modified to prevent their cracking plexiglas. What causes the cracks is the screw effect that the bit has - it pulls itself into the plexi too rapidly. It is a little difficult to explain without a sketch, but all it takes is a little grinding on the leading edge of each flute of the drill. An analogy might be to think of pushing a scraper at a 45 degree angle or so into clay versus holding the scraper at 90 degrees to the surface. The former case tries to dig in, while the latter is dependent upon how hard the scraper is pushed into the surface. The surface that needs to be ground is the surface that the chip "rides" up on, or the leading surface of the cutting edge. These reliefs need only be .010 or .020". Look at the plastic bits you got from Avery's, and maybe what I just tried to explain will make sense. Alex Peterson Maple Grove, MN 6A ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 18, 1998
From: Scott Gesele <scottg(at)icsnet.com>
Subject: Re: Drilling Plexi
I found that a Unibit drills perfect holes in plexi. This trick came from Van's after I had the same problems with the plastic drill bits. Hope this helps. Scott Gesele N506RV - Flying ________________________________________________________________________________
From: MAlexan533(at)aol.com
Date: Jul 18, 1998
Subject: Comant Antenna
I have a Comant CI-122 Loran Antenna, and while looking at a CI-122 Com Antenna, I noticed that the two look identical. Can the Loran Antenna, which I already have, be used for a com antenna? I am guessing there must be a difference, but with the same model #, and the same outward appearance, I had to ask. Thanks. Von Alexander RV-8#544 MAlexan533(at)aol.com ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 18, 1998
From: "Scott A. Jordan" <SAJ_SLJ(at)compuserve.com>
Subject: Re: Riveting problem
Message text written by INTERNET:rv-list(at)matronics.com >planning the sequence of tasks really slows me down. It would be nice if someone at Van's , with building experience, would write down a sequence< James, I know I'm not the Scott you were talking to but I have a lead for you. George Kilishek has done this for his RV-8 wings. The sequence shouldn't be much different for the -4. After seeing them I suggested he market them but he isn't too interested in that idea. It is a shame, I know some kits (ie Kitfox) have a very detailed step by step manual with a place to sign off every operation. Of course, you end up paying for this and after getting accustomed to to task the process seems to get easier. Anyway, contact George at: aeronut(at)mci2000.com Hope this helps Scott 80331 wing skeleons ready for riveting ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Jeff Orear" <jorear(at)mari.net>
Subject: Basement Blues
Date: Jul 18, 1998
Hello Fellow RVer's: Just got done trying to get a mockup of a wing panel out of my basement. As fate would have it, the bugger would not make a turn required to get up the stairs. As a result, I will have to assemble the wings in half of my two car garage. I plan to do all the parts prep, construction of the spars, ailerons and flaps in the basement. This would leave the assembly of the wing skeleton and riveting of the wing skins in the garage. My question concerns my jig. Would I be asking for trouble if I were to do everything regarding construction of the wing skeleton right up to where I would rivet everything together, and then disassemble the jig and move the whole works up to the garage for riveting and skinning? My concern is that I would introduce some inaccuracies with moving the jig. I wouldn't go to all the bother, except that it gets colder than a mother-in-law's love up here in the winter, and my garage is not heated. I would appreciate any input from those who have had a similar dilema. Thanks in advance group. BTW....Are there any plans for the list members to get together at Oshkosh? I suppose we could do it at my campsite. I'll be the one in the tent next to the white camper! (grin) Regards, Jeff Orear RV6A 25171 waiting on the wings, and bummed about my basement Peshtigo, WI ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Rob Acker" <roba(at)globalink.net>
Subject: Re: Drilling Plexi
Date: Jul 18, 1998
> > Could those of you who "have been there" comment on drilling techniques > that work? It looks like drilling the holes will be the most perilous > part of this operation... > > Jim Trimming 6A slider in New Mexico Just got done with the initial drilling of my canopy this morning...no cracks yet (I guess today's 102F temps help ). I used Mlfred's suggestion of drilling through both the plexi *and* the steel rollover/frame with a regular #40 bit. Then followed by opening up the canopy holes to 5/32" with a unibit. Like I said...no cracks yet...will finish up this weekend. Rob (RV-6Q). ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 18, 1998
Subject: Re: Drilling Plexi
From: rvsixer(at)Juno.com (michael d hilger)
>Could those of you who "have been there" comment on drilling >techniques >that work? It looks like drilling the holes will be the most perilous >part of this operation... > >Jim Trimming 6A slider in New Mexico I am doing the initial drilling on my canopy but nothing larger than #40. Turning slow (cordless drill) they are no problem. I have been practicing on some scrap plex with a #1 Unibit which starts at 1/8 and (also turned slowly) it does a great job. I did use it to bore the hole for the canopy latch tube and it worked super. Any thing with a single flute (c'sinks, too) is less likely to chatter and cause a crack. Mike Hilger RV-6 N207AM ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 18, 1998
From: John Kitz <jkitz(at)greenapple.com>
Subject: Re: COPPER BRAKE LINES
> Why? Copper weighs more than the aluminum lines. > > IMO, if you really want the best, don't mind the weight and don't mind the > cost, the Earl's s/s braided teflon lines are the way to go. I used ends that > fit -4 fittings but accomodate -3 hose (p/n 600143). Try a local performance > shop for Earl's stuff. Look for Earl's parts on their web site http://www.earls3.com/ They have good oil coolers, hoses, fittings, and good service. John Kitz N721JK Ohio ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 18, 1998
From: Jim Cimino <jcimino(at)epix.net>
Subject: Re: Basement Blues
Bite the bullet! Insulate and heat the garage and then you won't have to worry when the fuselage comes. Jim Cimino RV-8 sn 80039 http://www.geocities.com/MotorCity/5771 (717)842-4057 N.E. Pennsylvania ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Barry Boepple" <barry(at)summetric.com>
Subject: RE: panel planner problems
Date: Jul 17, 1998
Yes. When I did get it, it was crap. I sent it back! -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of Paul Besing Sent: Friday, July 17, 1998 4:36 AM Subject: Re: RV-List: RE: panel planner problems You can download the update on his website, www.panelplanner.com Paul Besing > >dear listers, >i'm having trouble getting the updated version of panel planner. i've >contacted via e-mail the company, for 4 months now. all i keep getting is >empty promises, it was shipped yesterday, i was on vacation, i thought i sent >it already , the check is in the mail. you get the picture. anyone else >getting pissed like i am >scott >winging it in tampa >rv6a wings > > > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 18, 1998
From: Thomas Velvick <tvelvick(at)caljet.com>
Subject: rv-6 aileron spar question
The drawing for the aileron spar says it is bent at 80.5 degrees on top and 83.5 degrees on the bottom flange. On my spars, both flanges are bent at 83.5 (using a smart level to check). Should I try to bend one flange an additional 3 degrees with my hand seamer? I am afraid that if I try, I will make an inconsistant bend along the flange. Does the extra 3 degrees really matter? Regards, Tom Velvick rv-6a ailerons ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 18, 1998
From: Scott Gesele <scottg(at)icsnet.com>
Subject: Re: Basement Blues
>My question concerns my jig. Would I be asking for trouble if I were to do >everything regarding construction of the wing skeleton right up to where I >would rivet everything together, and then disassemble the jig and move the >whole works up to the garage for riveting and skinning? My concern is that >I would introduce some inaccuracies with moving the jig. I wouldn't go to >all the bother, except that it gets colder than a mother-in-law's love up >here in the winter, and my garage is not heated. > That should work just fine. My wing was built and then, prior to riveting, the whole assembly was taken apart to prime. It should make no difference if it reassembled in a different location. Question, if you are having a problem getting the wing out of the basement, where do you plan on assembling the fuse? Here on Long Island, the winters are also cold. I used a Reedy heater (kerosene) from Home Depot and had no problems in the winter. I built in an uninsulated, drafty two car garage and the 55,000 BTU heater would heat the workshop in 20 minutes. There is an optional thermostat for the heater so that during the building session, you just set it and forget it. The heater and thermostat was just under $200. Have you considered this as a possibility? >BTW....Are there any plans for the list members to get together at Oshkosh? >I suppose we could do it at my campsite. I'll be the one in the tent next >to the white camper! (grin) I'll be there this year. What's the N-number on your camper :) Take care. Scott Gesele N506RV - Flying ________________________________________________________________________________
From: donspawn(at)Juno.com
Subject: F 630 on 6A
Date: Jul 18, 1998
Does the f 630 plate sit under the f629 & F628? I just dempled the F606 for the 3 #4 rivets & I have the F630 offset to the side of where the F628 is going to be one of these days. Don Jordan ~ N76DJ ~ 6A-fuselage donspawn(at)juno.com ~ Arlington, Tx ________________________________________________________________________________
From: SportAV8R(at)aol.com
Date: Jul 18, 1998
Subject: funny noise
Thanks to all the concerned listers who wrote imploring me not to teach myself acro in the RV. The most useful responses were the two or three individuals who pointed out that the acro maneuvers could be added in to the ops limitations but re-opening the test period with a ball point pen and a logbook -I didn't realize that, and it solves my problem nicely. Fact is, I have had recent acro tinstruction in an RV-6 with the Top Gun himself, but it was several months ago and not as long as I would have liked. I think with a few reminders as to details, I would be ready to give those particular maneuvers a try, but you are entitled to your opinions to the contrary ;-) Tonight's question concerns a strange sound that I have begun to take notice of when my engine is running. It may have been present all along, but my awareness of it has grown over the last several weeks. It sounds _EXACTLY_like a brake dragging (ask me how I know!) but isn't; it is present even when the plane is sitting absolutely still. It is heard best at idle, but is hard (impossible) for my mechanic to hear outside the plane, altho another friend noticed it from a quarter mile away during takeoff. Moving me head in the cockpit makes a big difference in how well I hear it. Loudest at the left side othe canopy. It does not change pitch appreciably with engine rpm, (definitely NOT a one-to-one correlation between its frequency and the rpm) and becomes lost (to the pilot) in the engine noise at about 1700 rpm and over. Shutting down the gyros (or anything else electrical) makes no difference in the sound. Opening the tip-up canopy changes the loudness (open=less loud) but makes no pitch change. The noise has a graoning character, and disappears as the engine is being shut down, but before the prop stops turning. I would say as the engine winds down to about 300 rpm during shut down that the sound abruptly quits. At idle I have noted the sound to waver a bit and to drop out briefly (engine is running strong and smooth all the while.) I had hoped it might be the electronic ignition sensor, but that has been removed and the noise changed not. My setup is a freshly o'hauled 150 hp O-320 with old style (pre-AD) oil pump gears and shaft, a fixed metal Sensenich prop, Van's 35 amp alternator, f/w mounted Van's oil cooler, no vacuum system, dual Slick 4300 series mags. I feel this is some kind of flow noise: oil in the cooler??? Air in the NACA ducts?? (closing/opening ducts makes no change) Alternator bearing or belt problems? I am stumped! The plane runs and flies wonderfully now. I flew 3.5 hrs today, nailed most of my landings, did a few wingovers (don't say it!) and grinned like an idiot. But I want to know what this sound is that only certain people can hear. (I need to find a mechanic who isn't tonally- challenged.) Anyone have ideas or similar experiences? Bill Boyd RV-6A 18 hrs. western VA ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 19, 1998
From: Charlie Kuss <chaskuss(at)miami.gdi.net>
Subject: Questions regarding one piece wing skins
Hello listers, 2 local RV builders have suggested I consider going to one piece, .032" wing skins. [I can ignore a suggestion made by one person, but when two or more suggest something, I'll usually at least think about it! :-) ] How much of a weight penalty is involved in using one piece skins? How much damage will be done to my wallet? Are there any GOTCHA'S to be aware of during assembly? Thanks in advance Charlie Kuss RV-8 wings Boca Raton, Fl. ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Humbling Landings.......
<35AFE655.AC20B200(at)ix.netcom.com>
From: smcdaniels(at)Juno.com (SCOTT R MCDANIELS)
Date: Jul 19, 1998
>Most of the new RV pilots that I check out have a tendency to want to >land to to fast. I like to use 70-75mph on close final and than round >out >and >hold it 6-12" of the runway with just a slight nose high attitude as >the >speed bleeds off and it settles down on the runway. Also some of the >RV-6A >pilots try to land to flat almost in a three point attitude which will >almost guarantee PIO. >Jerry Springer RV-6 N906GS > > > Please pay attention to what Jerry just described. We recently received a video tape of an RV-6A first flight that I think took place somewhere in Australia. Where ever it was, they are required to have at least the first flight performed by an experienced test pilot. The video showed the 6A on what looked to be a rather steep decent for its first landing. It didn't appear like there was a very substantial flair executed. The airplane touched down nearly 3 point attitude (which means probably at much higher than optimal airspeed). It immediately went into a PIO rocking type motion between the nose wheel and the mains that appeared to have a cycle rate of a couple seconds or less. after about six or seven seconds the nose gear leg failed with the airplane finally coming to a stop sliding on its nose and the main gear. Extra (unneeded) airspeed can be a big problem in some situations. Practice flying precisely, and if things aren't they way you know they should be... then go around and try again. Scott McDaniels These opinions and ideas are my own and do not necessarily reflect the opinions of my employer. ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Comant Antenna
From: smcdaniels(at)Juno.com (SCOTT R MCDANIELS)
Date: Jul 19, 1998
> >I have a Comant CI-122 Loran Antenna, and while looking at a CI-122 >Com >Antenna, I noticed that the two look identical. Can the Loran Antenna, >which I >already have, be used for a com antenna? I am guessing there must be a >difference, but with the same model #, and the same outward >appearance, I had >to ask. Thanks. >Von Alexander >RV-8#544 >MAlexan533(at)aol.com > > > If I recall correctly, most loran antenna's of that type had a special signal pre amp built into the base of the ant. so it probably cant be used for a com ant. Scott McDaniels These opinions and ideas are my own and do not necessarily reflect the opinions of my employer. ickness of the material that is dimpled (and it is the materials thickness that requires the countersink to be deeper). In the shop at Van's we have a bunch of what we call test patches. Little scrap pieces of aluminum with a 45 deg. bend in them. They have different sized holes in them (for rivets and screws) that have been dimpled. The 45 deg. bend provides a handle to let you test fit the dimple in a countersink when adjusting the countersink cage. You can make a few of your own to use when you have to machine countersink for a mating dimpled part or skin. Scott McDaniels These opinions and ideas are my own and do not necessarily reflect the opinions of my employer. ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Riveting problem
From: smcdaniels(at)Juno.com (SCOTT R MCDANIELS)
Date: Jul 19, 1998
>Scott, although I am on the list, I am mainly directing this to you. > I've been working on an RV-4 on and off for a number of >years. I >would like to >get more active. I have the empenage finished and the wings in jigs, >riveting >ribs to >rear spars. Belcranks are in as areaileron brackets. I have no trouble >accomplishing >the mechanical work, planning the sequence of tasks really slows me >down. It >would be nice if someone at Van's , with building experience, would >write down >a sequence >of tasks. I realize it wouldn't be the only sequence ,but a proven >one. It >would be a >tremendous help for me and possibly others, a real time saver. Thanks > > > James F. George > RV4George(at)AOL.com or juno.com > 1853 E. Chestnut Ave. > Vineland, N.J. 08361-8402 > > George, By the shear # of RV's that have been completed so far it appears that the current manuals do a reasonably good job of leading builders through the construction process. For those that feel they would benefit from more detail; I believe quite a few builders have already written exactly what you are talking about. I'm sure some other list members can point you towards where to find them (I don't know how to access any of them). Scott McDaniels These opinions and ideas are my own and do not necessarily reflect the opinions of my employer. ________________________________________________________________________________
From: WoodardRod(at)aol.com
Date: Jul 19, 1998
Subject: Re: Questions regarding one piece wing skins
Finally, a question I can answer! :-) In a message dated 7/18/98 10:45:44 PM Mountain Daylight Time, chaskuss(at)miami.gdi.net writes: > How much of a weight penalty is involved in using one piece skins? Somebody... and I don't remember who... did the calculation and determined that the penalty was something in the neighborhood of 1.7# per wing. I remember thinking at the time that it made about as much difference as a salad for lunch vs. a double Quarter Pounder with cheese... > How much damage will be done to my wallet? I ordered the 4 x 20 foot roll from the place that advertises in the back of Sport Aviation with the elderly (now deceased) woman standing inside a roll of aluminum. Delivered to my door (near Denver) it was just less than $240. All this being said, wouldn't you feel more comfortable just buying my entire wing kit... one piece skins and all! :-) Best regards, Rod Woodard Loveland, Colorado Everything's for sale! House, 1 car, motorcycle, wing kit, Aeronca Champ... ater. Now, time to unstack all those ribs.... Thanks for your help. Chris Hand RV-6A just starting wings Seaside, CA ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 18, 1998
From: Mike Denman <mikedenman(at)earthlink.net>
Subject: Re: Questions regarding one piece wing skins
Charlie, The Aircraft Spruce Catalog has the weight per square foot for various thicknesses of aluminum. As I recall, and it been a couple of years so I could be wrong, the .032 weighs 2.5 pounds more than skinning the wings with what was provided in the kit. I have installed the one piece skins on my plane and it really isn't much harder than the two piece skins. Most people I know buy their one piece skins from the firm that advertises in Sport Aviation with a picture of a woman standing in a roll of aluminum. They seem to have the best prices. One problem is that the sheets are wider than what you need for your wing. After watching a friend trim his by hand I thought that there must be a better way. I called another friend that owned a sheetmetal shop and asked if he could shear a 10 foot piece of aluminum. He said sure. When I asked what kind of tolerance could he hold over the 10 feet he replied plus or minus .010. Since he was a friend he didn't charge me anything and it sure made the installation simple. And as far as I could tell, the sheets were well within his .010 tolerance. Mike Denman RV6 Sweat the small shit. Pay attention to the details! Charlie Kuss wrote: > > 2 local RV builders have suggested I consider going to one piece, .032" > wing skins. > > How much of a weight penalty is involved in using one piece skins? > > How much damage will be done to my wallet? > > Are there any GOTCHA'S to be aware of during assembly? > > Charlie Kuss ________________________________________________________________________________
From: pbennett(at)zip.com.au
Date: Jul 19, 1998
Subject: Starter motor gear
I have managed to get the starter motor gear engaged with the ring gear. While this is very useful to hold the dummy spinner plate to locate the cowls, I'm damned if I can see how to disengage it and get it to retreat into the guts of the starter where it belongs. I have the clunky old Lycoming starter. Any advice would be appreciated. Peter Bennett Sydney Australia RV6 doing cowls ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Brian Holman" <bholman(at)fullcomp.com.au>
Subject: Re: Humbling Landings.......
Date: Jul 19, 1998
Scott,the big worry here is that the leg snapped of so cleanly just where it enters the mounting tube. One would expect if the leg was tempered correctly it would eventually bend but not snap off so cleanly. I have drilled a few sets of legs and they seem to vary in hardness. Also I checked my RV6 legs and can see no sign of the indent usually evident when a hardness test is done. Are they tested after tempering and do you know what part of the leg the test is carried out on if they are tested ? If the incident referred to was the one in Perth, West Australia, I am assured the landing was not a hard landing and if PIO (or possibly nose wheel shimmy) was the cause of this failure then we should expect a lot more nose leg failures. I would not expect there are many pilots around who have tested more homebuilts than this one has. Brian > > Please pay attention to what Jerry just described. We recently received a video tape of an RV-6A first flight that I think took place somewhere in Australia. Where ever it was, they are required to have at least the first flight performed by an experienced test pilot. The video showed the 6A on what looked to be a rather steep decent for its first landing. It didn't appear like there was a very substantial flair executed. The airplane touched down nearly 3 point attitude (which means probably at much higher than optimal airspeed). It immediately went into a PIO rocking type motion between the nose wheel and the mains that appeared to have a cycle rate of a couple seconds or less. after about six or seven seconds the nose gear leg failed with the airplane finally coming to a stop sliding on its nose and the main gear. Extra (unneeded) airspeed can be a big problem in some situations. Practice flying precisely, and if things aren't they way you know they > should be... then go around and try again. > > > Scott McDaniels > These opinions and ideas are my own > and do not necessarily reflect the opinions > of my employer. > > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Mike and Tricia Garrett" <tmjcgarret(at)earthlink.net>
Subject: Aileron gap fairing-to rear spar attachment
Date: Jul 19, 1998
Chris, you wrote: I read in Frank Justice's notes the suggestion to leave out the lower row of rivets in the W-607E&F reinforcement plates to allow using them for attaching the aileron gap fairing later. Leave the rivets out. Also leave the lower rivets out that attach the ribs to the rear spar in the area of the aileron gap fairing. The fairing is cut to allow the ends of the fairing to step up onto the reinforcement plates and leave the rest of the fairing flush against the rear spar. Have fun. Fran Malczynski RV6 Wings (almost done, riveting on bottom skins) Olcott, NY ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 19, 1998
From: Unistar Computers <unistar(at)mindspring.com>
Subject: Re: Starter motor gear
>I have managed to get the starter motor gear engaged with the ring >gear. While this is very useful to hold the dummy spinner plate to >locate the cowls, I'm damned if I can see how to disengage it and get >it to retreat into the guts of the starter where it belongs. I have >the clunky old Lycoming starter. >Any advice would be appreciated. >Peter Bennett You'll have to start the engine to retract the starter pinion. :-( It retracts after the engine speed spins the gear. This is why having to prop a Lycoming after the battery has run down is such a pain. The extra drag of the starter *really* cuts down the force of the blade being flipped. Bob Steward, A&P IA AA-1B N8978L AA-5A N1976L ________________________________________________________________________________
From: SportAV8R(at)aol.com
Date: Jul 19, 1998
Subject: Re: Starter motor gear
<< I have >the clunky old Lycoming starter. >Any advice would be appreciated. >Peter Bennett You'll have to start the engine to retract the starter pinion. :-( It retracts after the engine speed spins the gear. This is why having to prop a Lycoming after the battery has run down is such a pain. The extra drag of the starter *really* cuts down the force of the blade being flipped. Bob Steward, A&P IA This has happened to me, too, and to all of us who couldn't resist fiddling with the pinion gear when we should have been enjoying ourselves with woven glass cloth and assorted gooey resins (oxymoron). It's one more reason to "throw away 10 lbs with our revolutionary lightweight starter." At least, I'm glad I did.... Bill Boyd RV-6A with mystery noises ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 19, 1998
Subject: Listers meeting at Oshkosh
From: bcostello3(at)Juno.com (William M Costello)
Hi Folks, Didn't someone suggest we listers head for Van's tent at noon each day if possible? It would be fun meeting and those who wanted to could have lunch together. Just a thought, but I think I will check it out. Not sure which days I will be there this year yet. Best regards, Bill Bill Costello bcostello3(at)juno.com Chicago N97WC reserved building RV-6 SBGA source ________________________________________________________________________________
From: MLaboyteau(at)aol.com
Date: Jul 19, 1998
Subject: Re: Humbling Landings.......
<< The video showed the 6A on what looked to be a rather steep decent for its first landing. It didn't appear like there was a very substantial flair executed. The airplane touched down nearly 3 point attitude (which means probably at much higher than optimal airspeed). It immediately went into a PIO rocking type motion between the nose wheel and the mains that appeared to have a cycle rate of a couple seconds or less. after about six or seven seconds the nose gear leg failed with the airplane finally coming to a stop sliding on its nose and the main gear. >> Boy am I glad that my experience with PIO during landing didn't end up like this one! On one of the bounces I did hear a noise that I thought was wheel shimmy. During visual inspection this weekend because of the hard landing I discovered that the aft piece of the nose wheel fairing was busted up on the bottom. It looks like the tire was deformed bad enough on one of the bounces that it struck the fairing, and split it along the bottom seam and cracking it where the outside edges of the tire struck it. I thought that I had enough clearance around the tire, but I obviously needed just a little more! It's easy enough to repair, and I couldn't find evidence of any other damage, so lesson learned. Mark LaBoyteaux RV-6A N106RV "The Silver Streak!" MLaboyteau(at)aol.com Broken Arrow, Ok ________________________________________________________________________________
From: RICKRV6(at)aol.com
Date: Jul 19, 1998
Subject: Re: Questions regarding one piece wing skins
In a message dated 7/19/98 3:15:08 AM Eastern Daylight Time, mikedenman(at)earthlink.net writes: << One problem is that the sheets are wider than what you need for your wing. After watching a friend trim his by hand I thought that there must be a better way. >> The method I used, suggested by Phil Art, was to trim the skin using a router with a small straight fluted carbide bit. You'll need to make a sturdy fence but it makes a wonderfully straight, clean cut. Be careful when you back drill the skin to the spar. The skin needs to be on perfectly straight or you'll develop a gap at the but joint with the leading edge and tank skins. Temporarily mount those two skins to ensure a tight joint. I dimpled my top skins and they turned out very nice. I would do it again with no hesitation. Rick McBride 80027 ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 19, 1998
From: John Perri <jperri(at)aros.net>
Subject: HVLP
Thinking about changing to HVLP for laying down some paint. Have been advised that the Lex-Aire 2002 (although a bit expensive) is a great choice. Anyone on the list had experience with this gun? How about HVLP in general? These new finishes are getting expensive...Could almost pay for the gun in time with the paint savings.. Thanks JMP ________________________________________________________________________________
From: MLaboyteau(at)aol.com
Date: Jul 19, 1998
Subject: Re: Aileron gap fairing-to rear spar attachment
What I did (I learned it from another builder) was to use flush rivets on the re-enforcing plates and on the ribs in the areas where the aileron gap seal would set on the rear spar. Then I used the pop rivets to rivet the seal to the rear spar, but spaced in order to avoid the ribs and w-607's. I notched the gap seal slightly so it would set up on the w-607 plates. I think this is similar to how the Orndorff's did theirs, if you have access to one of their videos. On mine, I trimmed the forward pointing edge of the seal to butt up against the flange of the rear spar. I've seen some builders install this piece where it lays inbetween the top skin and the flange on the rear spar, in order to avoid the row of rivets that attach the seat to the top skin, but on the ones that I've seen done like this, it makes a slight joggle in the top skin at each rib. It's mostly cosmetic, so you can do it either way. Mark LaBoyteaux RV-6A N106RV "The Silver Streak!" MLaboyteau(at)aol.com Broken Arrow, Ok ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Brian Holman" <bholman(at)fullcomp.com.au>
Subject: Re: Crossflow Engines?
Date: Jul 19, 1998
Looking at their web site I would'nt get too excited yet. They say they have sold 45 engines with a total accumulated flight time of 350 hours. That's about an average of 8 hours each. They then talk about 1200 plus hours engine life based only on it's supposed slower piston speed than "conventional aircooled engines" (Lycon ?). Using their figures of 180hp @ 5800 rpm, it would need to have a stroke of less than 2 inches to even equal the piston speed of a Lycoming. When they have demonstrated 43 engines each with 1200 hours actual in flight time with few if any problems with the engine or it's cooling system, then it will be time to get interested. Brian > > Does anyone know of a Crossflow engine in an RV? I only know what I've seen > in the advertizing in Sport Avaiation and on their web page > (http://www.crossflow.com/default.htm), but it sounds very interesting. > ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 19, 1998
From: Joe Walker <joewalk@hal-pc.org>
Subject: Re: funny noise
Get an engine stethoscope. The noise you described is the sound of metal on metal which is sometimes focused in the cockpit. You can buy them for a few dollars from JC Whitney. Joe Repairing Wreaked RV6 SportAV8R(at)aol.com wrote: > > But I want to know what this sound is that only > certain people can hear. (I need to find a mechanic who isn't tonally- > challenged.) Anyone have ideas or similar experiences? > > Bill Boyd > RV-6A 18 hrs. > western VA > ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 19, 1998
From: Jim & Phyllis Mead <Jim_Mead(at)bc.sympatico.ca>
Subject: Starter motor gear
Hi all To Peter Bennett and others who want to retract a starter drive gear, (it sounds like your cowels are still off) remove the starter and hold the drive gear firmly against a wire wheel on a good bench grinder. This will get it spinning fast enough to get the gear to retract. Make sure you turn the gear in the same direction that a running engine would turn it. Regards. Jim Mead RV-6 350 hours Kamloops, BC Canada Jim_Mead(at)bc.sympatico.ca ________________________________________________________________________________
From: JDaniel343(at)aol.com
Date: Jul 19, 1998
Subject: Re: Listers meeting at Oshkosh
Sounds like a great idea. I would like to meet some of the people who help us out with our RV related questions. I can just imagine 50-100 people gathering at Vans tent each day at noon. Keep us posted/ I would like to here from other too. John L. Danielson JLD AirCraft Tools 13020 Welcome Lane Burnsville, MN 55337 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "David Malott" <drmalott(at)hotmail.com>
Subject: Folding Bike
Date: Jul 19, 1998
Can I carry a folding Bike in a RV 6 ? Any information would be appreciated. David Malott ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 19, 1998
From: Bob Skinner <bskinr(at)trib.com>
Subject: Re: Questions regarding one piece wing skins
Charlie, I sure like the looks of the one piece top skin. No seam and the .032" doesn't get as "wrinkly" as the outboard .025" skin. I ordered 3 sets of one piece top skins from Van's. A couple for me and one set for Gillette Charlie's RV6. I think Van's charged $50-60 for crating and I think the skins were around $115.00. Van's shears the skins to size and you get to keep the cut offs. I prefer the idea of using flat sheet as opposed to rolled aluminum like you get from KC Airparts. The rolled stuff can get a little wrinkly, especially if it comes off the end of a roll. The back riveted top skins on Charlie's RV6A wings look great! I believe there is a couple of pounds weight increase. You can easily figure the weight penalty. According to ACS, the .032 weighs .101 lbs/sq ft. more than the .025" The only gotcha that I can think of---don't drop the skin. I always put a couple of chairs under the skins as they are hanging from the framework, just in case. Bob Skinner RV-6 425 hrs. Buffalo, WY bskinr(at)trib.com >2 local RV builders have suggested I consider going to one piece, .032" >wing skins. >How much of a weight penalty is involved in using one piece skins? >How much damage will be done to my wallet? >Are there any GOTCHA'S to be aware of during assembly? >Charlie Kuss RV-8 wings Boca Raton, Fl. ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "John Fasching" <jfasching(at)hotmail.com>
Subject: Re: Starter motor gear
Date: Jul 19, 1998
Don't worry about it; when you "hit" the starter switch and the engine kicks over centrifical force will throw the starter back in and lock it until the next start sequence. No problem ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Don Mack" <donmack(at)flash.net>
Subject: Finishing kit questions
Date: Jul 19, 1998
I will be ordering the 6A finishing kit right after OSH. Besides split main gear covers and third party gear fairings, what other options has everyone chosen? Also, how far can (should) I go with the finishing kit minus the engine? I am planning on a 360 but am not sure about CS prop or not. Don Mack RV-6A Fuselage Ercoupe 415-D donmack(at)flash.net http://www.flash.net/~donmack ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 19, 1998
From: Shawn Grubb <sgrubb(at)bankofhydro.com>
Subject: Oshkosh Hotel Room Available?
I know there's nothing like waiting till the last minute, but does anyone know of a hotel room available near Oshkosh? The closest I have found is in Madison and Milwaukee. Thanks, Shawn Grubb ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Humbling Landings.......
From: smcdaniels(at)Juno.com (SCOTT R MCDANIELS)
Date: Jul 19, 1998
>Scott,the big worry here is that the leg snapped of so cleanly just >where >it enters the mounting tube. If the leg gets overloaded this is where it would be expected to brake. It is at this point that the load concentration is the highest. I have seen the gear leg (it was sent back to Van's) and it has the appearance of a classic stress overload failure. One would expect if the leg was tempered >correctly it would eventually bend but not snap off so cleanly. Actually just the reverse, if a gear leg is not heat treated to the proper hardness it bends at far to low of a load but does not break. I have >drilled a few sets of legs and they seem to vary in hardness. Also I >checked my RV6 legs and can see no sign of the indent usually evident >when >a hardness test is done. Are they tested after tempering and do you >know >what part of the leg the test is carried out on if they are tested ? I know that testing is done, but I don't know where on the leg they complete the test. I am not certain that every leg is tested, I think they may test a few samples in each batch that has been heat treated together but you would have to ask Tom to be sure. I know that the failed leg was tested after Van's received it back and it was within spec. >If >the incident referred to was the one in Perth, West Australia, I am >assured >the landing was not a hard landing I agree, the video I saw didn't appear to show a hard landing (and I didn't think I said it was), but it plainly showed some type of PIO that ended in with a nose gear leg failure. and if PIO (or possibly nose wheel >shimmy) was the cause of this failure then we should expect a lot more >nose >leg failures. I doubt that nose wheel shimmy could cause the leg to fail. I have experienced it quite severely from a mis adjusted fork friction and an over inflated nose tire (worst case situation), but had no damage occur of any kind. I think the fleet of flying 6A's is now well over 200 and there is no other incident such as this that I am aware of. I would not expect there are many pilots around who have >tested more homebuilts than this one has. That may be true, and if anything, that fact should make us pay even more attention to the possibility of something like this happening. My post wasn't meant to comment on any particular persons flying skills. It was to simple provide information (which is the only reason I participate on this list) to other RV pilots about something to watch out for. BTW I viewed this video myself 4 or 5 times and from the angle the camera was at, the landing (approach, flair, etc) didn't seem to be what would be seen in a typical full stall landing for an RV-6A. It is impossible to tell with certainty just from the video what actually caused the oscillation to occur (pilot or otherwise). The pilot may not even know, but the touch down looked very flat which as every one is usually taught in tricycle gear airplanes (assuming you have ever received training in one :-) ), and as has already been mentioned here on the list by Jerry and others, is a very bad position to be in. Scott McDaniels These opinions and ideas are my own and do not necessarily reflect the opinions of my employer. > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Stanley Blanton" <stanb(at)door.net>
Subject: Re: Folding Bike
Date: Jul 19, 1998
>Can I carry a folding Bike in a RV 6 ? Almost any small folding bike will easily fit in an RV-6. However, the best solution I have seen is to use a bike with an S&S couplinginstalled. The company has a web page at: www.sandsmachine.com This is what I plan on doing. Stan Blanton RV-6 Lubbock, TX ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Jeff Orear" <jorear(at)mari.net>
Subject: Re: Listers meeting at Oshkosh
Date: Jul 19, 1998
-----Original Message----- From: rv-list(at)matronics.com <rv-list(at)matronics.com> Date: Sunday, July 19, 1998 12:44 PM Subject: Re: RV-List: Listers meeting at Oshkosh Hi Group: Is it official that we are to meet at noon any day of the convention at Van's? I'm not sure if this was the official directive. Would be great to meet everyone. Regards, Jeff Orear RV6A 25171 waiting on the wings Peshtigo, WI > >Sounds like a great idea. I would like to meet some of the people who help us >out with our RV related questions. >I can just imagine 50-100 people gathering at Vans tent each day at noon. >Keep us posted/ I would like to here from other too. >John L. Danielson >JLD AirCraft Tools > 13020 Welcome Lane > Burnsville, MN 55337 > > > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 19, 1998
From: "David A. Barnhart" <barnhart(at)a.crl.com>
Subject: Re: Basement Blues
Jeff: The wing is very rigid with the skins riveted on. Your plan sounds fine. Best Regards, Dave Barnhart rv-6 sn 23744 N601DB Flying > >Hello Fellow RVer's: > >Just got done trying to get a mockup of a wing panel out of my basement. As >fate would have it, the bugger would not make a turn required to get up the >stairs. As a result, I will have to assemble the wings in half of my two >car garage. I plan to do all the parts prep, construction of the spars, >ailerons and flaps in the basement. This would leave the assembly of the >wing skeleton and riveting of the wing skins in the garage. > >My question concerns my jig. Would I be asking for trouble if I were to do >everything regarding construction of the wing skeleton right up to where I >would rivet everything together, and then disassemble the jig and move the >whole works up to the garage for riveting and skinning? My concern is that >I would introduce some inaccuracies with moving the jig. I wouldn't go to >all the bother, except that it gets colder than a mother-in-law's love up >here in the winter, and my garage is not heated. > >I would appreciate any input from those who have had a similar dilema. >Thanks in advance group. > >BTW....Are there any plans for the list members to get together at Oshkosh? >I suppose we could do it at my campsite. I'll be the one in the tent next >to the white camper! (grin) > > >Regards, >Jeff Orear >RV6A 25171 waiting on the wings, and bummed about my basement >Peshtigo, WI > > > > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 19, 1998
From: jerry parr <parravion(at)mcmail.com>
Subject: Thanks to the Listers & UK Fly-In
Dear Listers Many thanks to all those who answered my cry of anguish at seemingly being snubbed by the list last week. (Now when I get bored I go and see who has been thrown off the List!!) Today we had the 3rd Annual UK RV Fly-In here at Sibson, Peterborough. Unfortunately the weather forecast must have put a lot of people off (30kt winds and rain - yes the weather is crap here in England as well as the US. No doubt Oz is suffering mid-winter blues of 100 degrees in the shade, Brian et all!). Still the turn-out was fair with many prospective builders sampling the delights of RV-6 G-RIVT courtesy of Nigel Reddish. That damn aeroplane gets everywhere! Even the chairman of the Europa Club (for Europa read small British pl*stic aircraft)turned up - confessing to building an RV-6..... We have (somewhat rashly) promised to have our '6 at the Fly-In next year - I fear the Fly-In may be later than 19th July next year!! Jerry Parr Peterborough, UK RV-6, G-RVVI The engine fits - nice frame, Van's! Now for the cowlings.... ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Morrissey, John" <John.Morrissey(at)its.csiro.au>
Subject: Australian Experimental Category
Date: Jul 20, 1998
Hi Frederic, -----Original Message----- From: Stucklen, Frederic IFC [mailto:stuckle(at)ifc.hsd.utc.com] Sent: Friday, July 17, 1998 11:01 PM Subject: RE: RV-List: Australian Experimental Category > Guess I really didn't understand your old cert system as well as I >thought. My impression was that you had to go through a complete >certification test program similar to the cert testing done on the major >manufacture planes here in the US - Cessna's and Pipers... Are you >saying that to certify an RV all you had to do was show that it was >built to the plans and that the same type of aircraft had been built and >tested in the US? Yes - This was certainly the case for proven designs such as the RV series. One off's have to go through a full design analysis and structural tests. >I also recall that you had to have other "basic" >flying aids, like stall warning devices, installed before you could get >them certified. That approach sounds rather easy, and the reward of >having the freedom to fly anywhere in the world without the need for >special paperwork is nice also. Also correct, we were required to use certified components as well, so the cheap "homebuilt" non-certified engines were off limits. The flight test program was fairly formal with a number of set maneuvers to be preformed although spin testing is not required. Probably the most interesting maneuver you had to do was a stall with flaps in a 60 degree turn. Fortunately the RV6 is very well behaved during all the test flights. Funny thing about it all was the CAA (our FAA) then sent out one of their test pilots to confirm our figures - there was a man that came back with and RV grin - he asked where he could buy a kit from. >What will happen now that you have an >"Experimental" cert? Not totally sure now what the new rule's will mean in practice I'm still building under the old rules as both sets of rules will run concurrently for a fair while yet. > I had the honor of flying in formation with VH-JOH over the Rockies >three years ago when Jon was traveling through the Fort Collins Col. >area. I was there on vacation visiting Rod Woodard (on the RV list). Rod >told me he had a hanger for me while I was there. He didn't tell me that >Jon was one of the others in it! We had an unforgettable ride up to the >highest airport in the US, (can't remember the name, must be a "senior >moment"!). Jon, Dean Hall (EAA regional Director) Rod and myself in >three RV's in loose formation over the highest peaks in the Rockies, at >15,500' MSL, doing rolls! Not something one forgets too soon. You can't help yourself when you get into an RV can you - you just have to play. :-) Happy building John Morrissey ________________________________________________________________________________
From: JDaniel343(at)aol.com
Date: Jul 19, 1998
Subject: Re: Listers meeting at Oshkosh
Lets meet at Vans tent at noon any day. Lets just call this official John L. Danielson JLD AirCraft Tools 13020 Welcome Lane Burnsville, MN 55337 ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 19, 1998
From: Edward Cole <emcole(at)ix.netcom.com>
Subject: DPS Fuel Watch
Listers, I just inherited a DPS Fuel Watch System with no documentation. I believe from looking through the archives that DPS is no longer in business. This post was from John Ammeter back in 1996 (John, are you still on the list??) Does anyone have one of these or any documentation? Ed Cole RV6A Fuselage skins ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Jeff Orear" <jorear(at)mari.net>
Subject: Re: Basement Blues
Date: Jul 19, 1998
Hi Dave: Thanks for the responses folks. I am happy to report, however, upon further review, I *will* be able to get my assembled wing out of the basement after all!! Like a numbsckull, I forgot that the tanks can be riveted on after I get the wing out of the basement. That 48 inches was just what the Doctor ordered! So life is good again! Regards, Jeff Orear RV6A 25171 Waiting on the wings Peshtigo, WI -----Original Message----- From: rv-list(at)matronics.com <rv-list(at)matronics.com> Date: Sunday, July 19, 1998 6:16 PM Subject: Re: RV-List: Basement Blues > > >Jeff: > >The wing is very rigid with the skins riveted on. Your plan sounds fine. > >Best Regards, >Dave Barnhart >rv-6 sn 23744 N601DB >Flying > > > >> >>Hello Fellow RVer's: >> >>Just got done trying to get a mockup of a wing panel out of my basement. As >>fate would have it, the bugger would not make a turn required to get up the >>stairs. As a result, I will have to assemble the wings in half of my two >>car garage. I plan to do all the parts prep, construction of the spars, >>ailerons and flaps in the basement. This would leave the assembly of the >>wing skeleton and riveting of the wing skins in the garage. >> >>My question concerns my jig. Would I be asking for trouble if I were to do >>everything regarding construction of the wing skeleton right up to where I >>would rivet everything together, and then disassemble the jig and move the >>whole works up to the garage for riveting and skinning? My concern is that >>I would introduce some inaccuracies with moving the jig. I wouldn't go to >>all the bother, except that it gets colder than a mother-in-law's love up >>here in the winter, and my garage is not heated. >> >>I would appreciate any input from those who have had a similar dilema. >>Thanks in advance group. >> >>BTW....Are there any plans for the list members to get together at Oshkosh? >>I suppose we could do it at my campsite. I'll be the one in the tent next >>to the white camper! (grin) >> >> >>Regards, >>Jeff Orear >>RV6A 25171 waiting on the wings, and bummed about my basement >>Peshtigo, WI >> >> >> >> >> >> > > > > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 20, 1998
From: jandjnetserv <jandjnetserv(at)ibm.net>
Subject: Re: Thanks to the Listers & UK Fly-In
jerry parr wrote: > Today we had the 3rd Annual UK RV Fly-In here at Sibson, Peterborough. > Unfortunately the weather forecast must have put a lot of people off > (30kt winds and rain - yes the weather is crap here in England as well > as the US. No doubt Oz is suffering mid-winter blues of 100 degrees in > the shade, Brian et all!). > We have (somewhat rashly) promised to have our '6 at the Fly-In next > year - I fear the Fly-In may be later than 19th July next year!! > Yes, Sydney yesterday was typical dreadful winter weather - high of about 19c and mostly sunny :-> Ahh, only nine more days to Oshkosh Express and some REAL sunshine! JD ***************************************************************** ...... I'd rather be flying .....or building an RV8.... John Duncan M.C.N.E. PPL(A) J.P. AOPA(Aust)#42745 EAA#548147 J & J Network Services Pty Ltd P.O. Box 109 Minto N.S.W. 2566 Australia jandjnetserv(at)ibm.net ***************************************************************** ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 19, 1998
From: MoeJoe <moejoe(at)bellatlantic.net>
Subject: numbered drill index
Anyone know where I can get a numbered drill index without having to buy $80 worth of bits? I can not find just an index for sale in any of the catalogs. They all sell drill sets that come with an index, but no index's without drills. -- Moe Colontonio moejoe(at)bellatlantic.net Check out my RV-8 page at: http://members.bellatlantic.net/~moejoe ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Marcus Cooper" <mcooper(at)cnetech.com>
Subject: Re: Finishing kit questions
Date: Jul 19, 1998
I got the new S glass cowl, pretty pricey but it sure is nice, went together real easy. You can do everything except mount the cowling without the prop, I'd recommend CS if the bucks are available. Marcus > I will be ordering the 6A finishing kit right after OSH. > > Besides split main gear covers and third party gear fairings, what other > options has everyone chosen? > > Also, how far can (should) I go with the finishing kit minus the engine? I > am planning on a 360 but am not sure about CS prop or not. > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Allan.Gibson(at)fluordaniel.com
Date: Jul 20, 1998
Subject: Re: numbered drill index
By this do you mean a listing of drill number versus drill size? If so try a little book called "Standard Aviation Maintanence Handbook", published by IAP,Inc, Casper, WY. (page 51) or one of the many others of a similar sort. ______________________________ Reply Separator _________________________________ Subject: RV-List: numbered drill index Date: 19-07-98 20:52 Anyone know where I can get a numbered drill index without having to buy $80 worth of bits? I can not find just an index for sale in any of the catalogs. They all sell drill sets that come with an index, but no index's without drills. -- Moe Colontonio moejoe(at)bellatlantic.net Check out my RV-8 page at: http://members.bellatlantic.net/~moejoe ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Mike Ducote" <mjd(at)mailhost.accesscom.net>
Subject: Countersink HS810 and HS812
Date: Jul 19, 1998
I use a 120degree cutter to countersink the underlying material to accept a dimpled skin etc. The 120degree countersink allows the dimpled material to sit flush without having to cut deeper as would be required with a 100degree cutter. Mike Ducote RV-6 wings New Orleans ---------- > From: SCOTT R MCDANIELS <smcdaniels(at)Juno.com> > To: rv-list(at)matronics.com > Subject: Re: RV-List: Countersink HS810 and HS812 > Date: Sunday, July 19, 1998 12:15 AM > > > > >How deep should I countersink the center holes in the HS810 and HS814 > >?? > > > >I thought conventional wisdom is so a AN426AD-4 head is flush with the > >top. > >However, my HS 602 spars don't lay flat on the HS810 and 812. > > > This is something that seems to be misunderstood by a large # of builders > so I will try to explain. > > The machine countersink required for a flush (AN426) rivet to fit flush, > and the countersink for a dimpled skin to fit flush are 2 different > depths. If you simply use the countersink cage that you have set for > rivets the skin will not lay down flush. > The depth of countersink required for a dimple somewhat depends on the > thickness of the material that is dimpled (and it is the materials > thickness that requires the countersink to be deeper). > In the shop at Van's we have a bunch of what we call test patches. > Little scrap pieces of aluminum with a 45 deg. bend in them. > They have different sized holes in them (for rivets and screws) that have > been dimpled. The 45 deg. bend provides a handle to let you test fit the > dimple in a countersink when adjusting the countersink cage. You can > make a few of your own to use when you have to machine countersink for a > mating dimpled part or skin. > > > Scott McDaniels > These opinions and ideas are my own > and do not necessarily reflect the opinions > of my employer. > > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 19, 1998
From: MoeJoe <moejoe(at)bellatlantic.net>
Subject: Re: numbered drill index
By drill index, I mean the little box you use to hold all your drill bits. Right now I'm using the regular kind labeled in 64ths, and it gets on my nerves having to inspect every drill for it's size when I grab it. > > Anyone know where I can get a numbered drill index without having to buy > $80 worth of bits? I can not find just an index for sale in any of the > catalogs. They all sell drill sets that come with an index, but no > index's without drills. -- Moe Colontonio moejoe(at)bellatlantic.net Check out my RV-8 page at: http://members.bellatlantic.net/~moejoe ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 19, 1998
From: Al Mojzisik <prober(at)iwaynet.net>
Subject: One piece, RV6/6A wing skins for sale
Bob, I want the skins if no one else has called them. E-mail me ASAP and I'll get you a check and address to send them and we'll find out what the freight will be to Columbus Ohio. Al > > I have one set of one piece, RV6/6A wing skins left for sale. They are >sheared by Van's to final dimension and are in a sturdy crate, ready to >ship. $115 for the set and the cut offs. I paid for the crate, you pay the >freight from Wyoming. > Contact me off list at bskinr(at)trib.com. > >Bob Skinner RV-6 425 hrs. Buffalo, WY bskinr(at)trib.com > > > > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "martin" <martin(at)gbonline.com>
Subject: Re: funny noise
Date: Jul 19, 1998
Dear Bill, First disconnect the belt from the alternator, and see if the noise persists. If this doesn't work than proceed with a listening device. You do not need to buy a sthethescope. An old fashioned listening device consists of a hardwood dowel (3/8, 1/2") placed against various suspicious places on the engine with the other end in your ear, while another person operates engine etc. will allow you to pinpoint the noise source. Good Luck. Dick Martin RV8 80124 essentially complete installing innards etc. ---------- > From: SportAV8R(at)aol.com > To: rv-list(at)matronics.com > Subject: RV-List: funny noise > Date: Saturday, July 18, 1998 10:22 PM > > > Thanks to all the concerned listers who wrote imploring me not to teach myself > acro in the RV. The most useful responses were the two or three individuals > who pointed out that the acro maneuvers could be added in to the ops > limitations but re-opening the test period with a ball point pen and a logbook > -I didn't realize that, and it solves my problem nicely. Fact is, I have had > recent acro tinstruction in an RV-6 with the Top Gun himself, but it was > several months ago and not as long as I would have liked. I think with a few > reminders as to details, I would be ready to give those particular maneuvers a > try, but you are entitled to your opinions to the contrary ;-) > > > Tonight's question concerns a strange sound that I have begun to take notice > of when my engine is running. It may have been present all along, but my > awareness of it has grown over the last several weeks. It sounds > _EXACTLY_like a brake dragging (ask me how I know!) but isn't; it is present > even when the plane is sitting absolutely still. It is heard best at idle, > but is hard (impossible) for my mechanic to hear outside the plane, altho > another friend noticed it from a quarter mile away during takeoff. Moving me > head in the cockpit makes a big difference in how well I hear it. Loudest at > the left side othe canopy. It does not change pitch appreciably with engine > rpm, (definitely NOT a one-to-one correlation between its frequency and the > rpm) and becomes lost (to the pilot) in the engine noise at about 1700 rpm > and over. Shutting down the gyros (or anything else electrical) makes no > difference in the sound. Opening the tip-up canopy changes the loudness > (open=less loud) but makes no pitch change. The noise has a graoning > character, and disappears as the engine is being shut down, but before the > prop stops turning. I would say as the engine winds down to about 300 rpm > during shut down that the sound abruptly quits. At idle I have noted the > sound to waver a bit and to drop out briefly (engine is running strong and > smooth all the while.) I had hoped it might be the electronic ignition > sensor, but that has been removed and the noise changed not. > > My setup is a freshly o'hauled 150 hp O-320 with old style (pre-AD) oil pump > gears and shaft, a fixed metal Sensenich prop, Van's 35 amp alternator, f/w > mounted Van's oil cooler, no vacuum system, dual Slick 4300 series mags. I > feel this is some kind of flow noise: oil in the cooler??? Air in the NACA > ducts?? (closing/opening ducts makes no change) Alternator bearing or belt > problems? I am stumped! The plane runs and flies wonderfully now. I flew > 3.5 hrs today, nailed most of my landings, did a few wingovers (don't say it!) > and grinned like an idiot. But I want to know what this sound is that only > certain people can hear. (I need to find a mechanic who isn't tonally- > challenged.) Anyone have ideas or similar experiences? > > Bill Boyd > RV-6A 18 hrs. > western VA > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "martin" <martin(at)gbonline.com>
Subject: Re: Oshkosh Hotel Room Available?
Date: Jul 19, 1998
Dear Shawn, You won't find a hotel room but there are a lot of bed and breakfasts etc from privaate homes available. Call the housing hotline in sport aviation or Norm Petersen at EAA. One of the two will have some names and places for you. Dick Martin Green Bay, Wis RV8 80124 essentially complete installing innards ---------- > From: Shawn Grubb <sgrubb(at)bankofhydro.com> > To: rv-list(at)matronics.com > Subject: RV-List: Oshkosh Hotel Room Available? > Date: Sunday, July 19, 1998 1:30 PM > > > > I know there's nothing like waiting till the last minute, but does anyone > know of a hotel room available near Oshkosh? > > The closest I have found is in Madison and Milwaukee. > > Thanks, > > Shawn Grubb > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 19, 1998
From: "Flying Phil's Circus" <sisson(at)ctnet.net>
Subject: Re: Starter motor gear
Try the B&C Specialties starter from Kansas. It does not have the problems of the 1931 Ford starter Phil Jim & Phyllis Mead wrote: > > > Hi all > > To Peter Bennett and others who want to retract a starter drive gear, > (it sounds like your cowels are still off) remove the starter and hold > > the drive gear firmly against a wire wheel on a good bench grinder. > This will get it spinning fast enough to get the gear to retract. > Make > sure you turn the gear in the same direction that a running engine > would > turn it. > > Regards. > > Jim Mead RV-6 350 hours > Kamloops, BC Canada > Jim_Mead(at)bc.sympatico.ca > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: BrownTool(at)aol.com
Date: Jul 19, 1998
Subject: Re: numbered drill index
<< Anyone know where I can get a numbered drill index without having to buy $80 worth of bits? I can not find just an index for sale in any of the catalogs. They all sell drill sets that come with an index, but no index's without drills. >> We have the numbered drill index available, it is part number HU60, and holds #1 - #60 drill bits. Index Box is all metal construction and made in the USA by HUOT Mfg. Price is $6.95 ea. We also have the Letter A-Z Index Box, and the 1/16" -1/2" index box. Give us a call with any questions. Michael Brown Brown Aviation Tool Supply Co. Bethany, Oklahoma 1-800-587-3883 405-495-4991 FAX 405-495-4992 BrownTool(at)aol.com ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 19, 1998
From: John Ammeter <ammeterj(at)seanet.com>
Subject: Re: DPS Fuel Watch
> >Listers, >I just inherited a DPS Fuel Watch System with no documentation. I >believe from looking through >the archives that DPS is no longer in business. This post was from John >Ammeter back in 1996 (John, are you still on the list??) > >Does anyone have one of these or any documentation? >Ed Cole >RV6A Fuselage skins > I sent you an email responding to your rec.aviation.homebuilt post. If you don't get any other response I can probably find a copy of the documentation from some local guys. The DPS founder/owner sold about 12 units to some of the Puget Sound RVators back in 1993 or 94. I had two in my RV-6, one on each tank. I gave all the documentation to the buyer about 3 months ago. John Ammeter ammeterj(at)seanet.com Seattle WA USA 1974 1/2 JH-5 RV-6 (sold 4/14/98) ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 19, 1998
From: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <nuckolls(at)aeroelectric.com>
Subject: OSH '98 Rooms Available
Just got a phone call from a family that we met on our first trip to OSH in 1986. They tell me that many of their regular boarders are not coming this year. I offered to spread the word. Anyone needing lodging can contact: Karin & Tom Livingood 1922 Olive (North Osh) Oshkosh, WI 54901 Phone (920) 231-4899 They DO have central air conditioning!!!! Bob . . . //// (o o) ===========o00o=(_)=o00o========= < If you continue to do > < What you've always done > < You will continue to be > < What you've always been. > ================================= <http://www.aeroelectric.com> ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 19, 1998
Subject: RV-4 Cowling
From: tcastella(at)Juno.com (Anthony J Castellano)
Our EAA chapter has a new (unused) RV-4 cowling that we wish to sell. Is anyone interested? Tony Castellano tcastella(at)juno.com Hopewell Junction, NY RV-6 (fuselage on the gear) ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Lothar Klingmuller <lothark(at)worldnet.att.net>
Subject: Re: Humbling Landings.......
Date: Jul 20, 1998
>>almost guarantee PIO. >went into a PIO rocking type motion between the nose wheel and the mains Dumb question of the week: What is an PIO? Just a little humor:-) PS Also, the Australian test pilot might have watched too many kangaroos. We used to call these landinges 'the KANGAROO' hops. Lothar ||-6A|| Denver, CO || Ready to jig fuselage|| ________________________________________________________________________________
From: jsflyrv(at)ix.netcom.com
Date: Jul 20, 1998
Subject: Re: funny noise
On 07/19/98 21:07:05 you wrote: > > >Dear Bill, >First disconnect the belt from the alternator, and see if the noise >persists. If this doesn't work than proceed with a listening device. You >do not need to buy a sthethescope. An old fashioned listening device >consists of a hardwood dowel (3/8, 1/2") placed against various >suspicious places on the engine with the other end in your ear, while >another person operates engine etc. will allow you to pinpoint the noise >source. Good Luck. >Dick Martin >RV8 80124 essentially complete installing innards etc. > >---------- I would rather teach myself how to do aerobatics than to be out by that prop with a wood dowel or a sthethescope. ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "John Hughes" <jhughes@net-quest.com>
Subject: Scat Ducting
Date: Jul 20, 1998
Hi All I have a question reguarding Scat ducting. This stuff in hard to slip on the 2.000 flanges because the I.D. of the ducting is right on 2.000. I went round and round for hours trying to put this ducting on the various items (heat muff =2.000,cabin heat box = 2.000).I did have a flange the was 1.980 and the ducting slipped on effortlessly.There must be a certain way to get these to slip on easier if all these flanges are manufactured at 2.000,and the ducting is 2.000.Can someone share it with me. Thanks, John Hughes RV-6 N164JH So CaL, Hookin engine stuff up. ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Stephen J. Soule" <SSoule(at)pfclaw.com>
Subject: Aileron gap fairing-to rear spar attachment
Date: Jul 20, 1998
Chris, I did it the way F. Justice suggested and I like the way it came out. The gap fairing does pull over the rear reinforcing on the spar. The next question you will have is how big a gap to leave between the aileron and the gap seal. I left mine at the widest allowed by the plans. Most RV's that I see, however, have a very close fit between the aileron and the gap seal. Steve Soule Fuselage upright and beginning to fit top skins -----Original Message----- From: chriskelhand(at)Juno.com [mailto:chriskelhand(at)Juno.com] Sent: Sunday, July 19, 1998 2:11 AM To: RV-list(at)matronics.com Subject: RV-List: Aileron gap fairing-to rear spar attachment (Kellie D Hand) Hi, I just got my wing kit (RV-6A) a couple weeks ago and am ready to rivet the rear spars together. I read in Frank Justice's notes the suggestion to leave out the lower row of rivets in the W-607E&F reinforcement plates to allow using them for attaching the aileron gap fairing later. The plans show to rivet the plates in now and use pop rivets later to attach the gap fairings. I saw several references to methods of attaching the fairing in the archives, but I'm not sure I understand how it fits against the rear spar. Even if you use the solid rivets at this location, is the fairing still just pulled over the reinforcement plates or do you somehow joggle it to fit around the plate? If you use the pop rivets, can you just drill a hole in the fairing large enough to keep the fairing from pulling up against the AN470 rivet heads? I just wanted to get some opinions from some who have passed this stage before I decide whether to put those bottom row rivets in now or later. Now, time to unstack all those ribs.... Thanks for your help. Chris Hand RV-6A just starting wings Seaside, CA ________________________________________________________________________________
From: DFaile(at)aol.com
Date: Jul 20, 1998
Subject: Re: numbered drill index
To buy drill index boxes Try HUOT Manufacturing Company 550 North Wheeler St St Paul MN 55104-1788 612 646-1869 order desk 800 832-3838 http://www.huot.com email: huot(at)huot.com Combination Indeses 115 11700 Holds 115 drills $36.00 They never returned my email. Let me know what you hear! david faile, fairfield, ct mcfii/a&p eaa technical counselor/flight advisor christen eagle ii since '82 (n13bf) rv6 n44df started ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 20, 1998
From: Bob Skinner <bskinr(at)trib.com>
Subject: RV6/6A wing skins
The one piece wing skins offered for sale were snapped up instantly. Thanks for the response. Stand by for more bargins:) Bob Skinner RV-6 425 hrs. Buffalo, WY bskinr(at)trib.com ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Stucklen, Frederic IFC" <stuckle(at)ifc.hsd.utc.com>
Subject: Listers meeting at Oshkosh
Date: Jul 20, 1998
Bill, Not a bad idea. I'll be there Fri, July 31'st to Mon, Aug 3'd. .. Fred Stucklen N925RV RV-6A E. Windsor, Ct > -----Original Message----- > From: bcostello3(at)juno.com [SMTP:bcostello3(at)juno.com] > Sent: Sunday, July 19, 1998 8:39 AM > To: RV-list(at)matronics.com > Subject: RV-List: Listers meeting at Oshkosh > > Costello) > > Hi Folks, > Didn't someone suggest we listers head for Van's tent at noon each day > if > possible? It would be fun meeting and those who wanted to could have > lunch together. Just a thought, but I think I will check it out. Not > sure which days I will be there this year yet. > > Best regards, > Bill > > Bill Costello bcostello3(at)juno.com Chicago > N97WC reserved building RV-6 SBGA source ________________________________________________________________________________
From: RVer273sb(at)aol.com
Date: Jul 20, 1998
Subject: Re: Scat Ducting
Try cutting the wire coil back two inchs from the end, put a bend in the wire, back on itself to pervent a sharp end. Fold the material back on itself for one inch to form a double layer. Lube the inside of the scat and outside of the flanged fitting, spit works fine. You then should be able to slowly slip it on. You then have a double thickness of scat to clamp on. Rver273sb ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 20, 1998
From: Terry Jantzi <tjantzi(at)netrover.com>
Subject: Re: Scat Ducting
I had the same problemgetting 2" scat on to the flanges. It was always in the most awkward of spots as well. I ended up using a fine fluting pliers to place a few crimps around the flange about a .5" in, to shrink the OD and create a small taper. Terry RV-6 C-GZRV (out of the paint shop and grounded until OSH) S.ONT John Hughes wrote: > > > Hi All > I have a question reguarding Scat ducting. This stuff in hard to > slip on the 2.000 flanges because the I.D. of the ducting is right on ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Stanley Blanton" <stanb(at)door.net>
Subject: Re: Oshkosh Hotel Room Available?
Date: Jul 20, 1998
>Does anyone know of a hotel room available near Oshkosh? Our EAA chapter may have a couple of extra dorm rooms. Contact me off the list if interested. Stan Blanton RV-6 Lubbock, TX EAA Ch. 19 806-799-4664 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Stucklen, Frederic IFC" <stuckle(at)ifc.hsd.utc.com>
Subject: Scat Ducting
Date: Jul 20, 1998
Which way do you fold the material back onto itself? Fold in or out? Fred Stucklen N925RV RV-6A E. Windsor, Ct >-----Original Message----- >From: RVer273sb(at)aol.com [SMTP:RVer273sb(at)aol.com] >Sent: Monday, July 20, 1998 8:47 AM >To: rv-list(at)matronics.com >Subject: Re: RV-List: Scat Ducting > > >Try cutting the wire coil back two inchs from the end, put a bend > in the wire, back on itself to pervent a sharp end. Fold the material back > on itself for one inch to form a double layer. Lube the inside of the scat > and outside of the flanged fitting, spit works fine. You then should be able > to slowly slip it on. You then have a double thickness of scat to clamp on. > Rver273sb > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: RVer273sb(at)aol.com
Date: Jul 20, 1998
Subject: Re: Scat Ducting
OUT ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 20, 1998
From: Don Hyde <hyde(at)bcl.net>
Subject: Re: dimpling mistake - now what?
I made the same dumb mistake. What I did was not to drill it out, but to smash it back as flat as possible with a flush rivet set and bucking bar. I was surprised at how well it worked, leaving just a tiny hole, which I am confident I will be able to fill with bondo when painting time comes. I found it much easier to dimple the skins by clamping the C-frame tool so that it extends a foot or so past the table edge, and putting the male die on top so that I can see where it's going. I screwed 2x4 covered with a carpet strip to the table so that it hung off nearby to help support the floppy skins, and found that this way I could dimple all the way to the last rivet without messing with special dies or anything. Some lister (I forgot who) suggested sawing the corners off the bottom of the C-frame. I haven't gotten around to trying this, but it seems like it would probably help a little, too. > > It seems I'm destined to make every dumb mistake in the book. I >was dimpling the HS skins with the C-frame tool and trying to get those >last few rivet holes that mate with the HS607. It's hard to get the C-frame >tool in towards the leading edge. Trying to flex one side of the skin back >and keep the other side flat on the platform, it slipped off the male >dimple die and I smashed a hole into the skin with the dimple die. > >Two questions: >1- How do you dimple those last few holes? I don't think the C-frame tool >is the way. Is this where I use the pop-rivet dimpler? > >2- What do I do with this half formed hole/dimple that's about 5/16 inch >from the nearest rivet hole? It's close to the rivet line hence over the >hs607 flange, so I have to flatten it out. I guess I drill it out and try >to flatten what's left? > >Just shoot me. > >--- >Tom Sargent, sarg314(at)azstarnet.com > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Barry Boepple" <barry(at)summetric.com>
Subject: remove
Date: Jul 20, 1998
________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Listers meeting at Oshkosh
From: cecilth(at)Juno.com (cecil t hatfield)
Date: Jul 20, 1998
I think its a great idea too. But I wonder if Vans wants 200 people out front. On second thought, maybe with the crowd around it will draw new people over to get in on the bargin. However, how will I know you from who? Cecil writes: > > >Bill, > > Not a bad idea. I'll be there Fri, July 31'st to Mon, Aug 3'd. .. > >Fred Stucklen >N925RV RV-6A >E. Windsor, Ct > > >> -----Original Message----- >> From: bcostello3(at)juno.com [SMTP:bcostello3(at)juno.com] >> Sent: Sunday, July 19, 1998 8:39 AM >> To: RV-list(at)matronics.com >> Subject: RV-List: Listers meeting at Oshkosh >> >> Costello) >> >> Hi Folks, >> Didn't someone suggest we listers head for Van's tent at noon each >day >> if >> possible? It would be fun meeting and those who wanted to could >have >> lunch together. Just a thought, but I think I will check it out. >Not >> sure which days I will be there this year yet. >> >> Best regards, >> Bill >> >> Bill Costello bcostello3(at)juno.com Chicago >> N97WC reserved building RV-6 SBGA source > > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: RV6ator(at)aol.com
Date: Jul 20, 1998
Subject: Lycoming O-320 FOR SALE
Dear RV-Listers, I have a NEW Lycoming O-320-A2C engine for sale, this is a conical mount, hollow crank, slick mag , fuel pump equipped engine which was purchased new from lycoming and installed in a Sea Hawker project, which was taxi tested (run approx. 30 minutes) and removed. $12,000. Engine located Danbury, CT. PLEASE REPLY OFF LIST TO: Bill Mahoney RV6ator(at)aol.com RV-6 s/n 20477 N747W ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 20, 1998
From: halk(at)sybase.com (Hal Kempthorne)
Subject: Re: HVLP
Hi all, > Lex-Aire 2002 (although a bit expensive) is a great choice. Anyone on > the list had experience with this gun? Lexaire has a web page. Someone suggested they make guns for factories like Ford etc. They seem to be available direct only. I sent them email asking what I do if I have trouble with the gun, is there local rep etc. Never got an answer. Binks is the top pro choice and locally sold and serviced. hal ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 20, 1998
From: halk(at)sybase.com (Hal Kempthorne)
Subject: My wife is a good sport!
Hi, I have to share this. My wife likes flying and my building an airplane but sharing the limited space in the garage, especially around her laundry area, has sometimes been an issue. Yesterday she came out to the garage and said, "Could lower the flaps, I need to get to the dryer". hal ________________________________________________________________________________
From: robin.y.wessel(at)exgate.tek.com
Subject: Spray painting site
Date: Jul 20, 1998
Listers- While surfing around I found this great WWWboard about spray painting. The site is hosted by some experienced paint jobbers- great reading! Robin Wessel RV-6A Robin.y.wessel(at)tek.com http://robin.getbiz.net ________________________________________________________________________________
From: robin.y.wessel(at)exgate.tek.com
Subject: Spray painting site
Date: Jul 20, 1998
opps forgot the link- Listers- While surfing around I found this great WWWboard about spray painting. The site is hosted by some experienced paint jobbers- great reading! http://www.horizonweb.com/wwwboard/Spray_101/wwwboard.html Robin Wessel RV-6A Robin.y.wessel(at)tek.com http://robin.getbiz.net ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 20, 1998
From: halk(at)sybase.com (Hal Kempthorne)
Subject: Re: Crossflow Engines?
This is the problem makers of *ANY* new engine designed specifically for aircraft use face. Low volume of production is a problem for Lyc and Continental too. It is difficult to justify any expenditure on product development since the costs must be spread over such a small sales volume. It is also a quality control problem as there are too few to get reliable statistics on problems and failures. > Looking at their web site I would'nt get too excited yet. They say they > have sold 45 engines with a total accumulated flight time of 350 hours. Hal Kempthorne RV-6AQ -- The damned canopy fits! halk(at)sybase.com Santa Clara, CA. Debonair N6134V @ SJC ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Roger Bocox" <rbocox(at)ryko.com>
Date: Jul 20, 1998
info Roger E. Bocox, [ RBocox(at)Ryko.com ] ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Ross Mickey" <rmickey(at)ix.netcom.com>
Subject: Electronic testers
Date: Jul 20, 1998
I am beginning to work on the electronics of my bird. What type of tester are you folks using? I will be assembling the microMONITOR and microENCODER Kits as well as doing all the other great stuff having to do with electrons whizzing around my plane. I am looking on page 513 of the Digi-Key catalog and see testers from $13 to $200. Any suggestions? Ross Mickey Canopy....nuf said!!! ________________________________________________________________________________
From: RVer273sb(at)aol.com
Date: Jul 20, 1998
Subject: Re: My wife is a good sport!
Hal, Keep her! ________________________________________________________________________________
From: RVer273sb(at)aol.com
Date: Jul 20, 1998
Subject: Re: HVLP
Hal, try the Wagner Capspray! RVer273sb ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Steve Hamer" <shamer(at)mscomm.com>
Subject: Re: DPS Fuel Watch
Date: Jul 20, 1998
Ed, Send me your address or fax, and I'll get you some info. Mine is the model without fuel pressure. Steve Hamer shamer(at)mscomm.com Message phone (909)465-7854 ---------- > > > Listers, > I just inherited a DPS Fuel Watch System with no documentation. I > believe from looking through > the archives that DPS is no longer in business. This post was from John > Ammeter back in 1996 (John, are you still on the list??) > > Does anyone have one of these or any documentation? > Ed Cole > RV6A Fuselage skins > > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 20, 1998
From: "Anderson Ed" <anderson_ed(at)bah.com>
Subject: Re: Wheel Nuts Cotter Pin hole
Thanks Doug, and rest of the List. Turns out (as many of you said) that drilling the cotter pin holes in the hollow axle was a non-event. Guess I just remembered drilling the gear retaining hole on a drill press with a cobalt drill bit and assumed the same ordeal for the wheel nut. Took about 5 minutes. Ed RV-6A N494BW anderson_ed(at)bah.com Douglas G. Murray wrote: > -Use a 12" drill bit (to get passed the tire & rim) in your hand drill and LOTS of > cutting oil. Drill one side and put an AN 470 - 4 rivet in the hole. Drill the > other side. Remove the rivet and install the cotter pin. The holes should be > drilled on the horizontal plane ( no pun intended) . > > Hope this helps. > > DGM > ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 20, 1998
From: Edward Cole <emcole(at)ix.netcom.com>
Subject: PS Engineering Intercom
Listers, I have a PS Engineering Model 501 Intercom for sale with less than 20 hrs on it. New price from ACS is $179. Will sell for $100 including shipping. Please contact me off list. Ed Cole RV6A Fuselage Skinning emcole(at)ix.netcom.com ________________________________________________________________________________
From: BSivori(at)aol.com
Date: Jul 20, 1998
Subject: Re: Listers meeting at Oshkosh
Fred, I still have no motor & I think my RV may be in the air before the Seneca... Cylinders are in, so I have a shot at this week, but that means not too much test flying prior to OSH. Bill ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 20, 1998
From: Don Hyde <hyde(at)bcl.net>
Subject: Re: Electronic testers
I've had a Pocket DMM like the BK2700-ND on that page for years, and it works fine for me. There are fancier ones, and ruggeder ones, but those one is small, accurate and cheap. Every electronics place seems to have them, and I've had one since they first appeared over 10 years ago. The only reason I had to replace mine was that it got stolen. My only problem is that it is easy to leave it turned on and run the batteries down, though that defect is shared by most of the highest-priced DMM's as well. Ten years ago, the batteries were hard to find and expensive, but they're used in watches so you can get them at K-Mart now. > >I am beginning to work on the electronics of my bird. What type of tester >are you folks using? I will be assembling the microMONITOR and >microENCODER Kits as well as doing all the other great stuff having to do >with electrons whizzing around my plane. I am looking on page 513 of the >Digi-Key catalog and see testers from $13 to $200. Any suggestions? > >Ross Mickey >Canopy....nuf said!!! > Don Hyde Quincy, IL 6A, Building! VS done, Working on rudder. ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 20, 1998
From: halk(at)sybase.com (Hal Kempthorne)
Subject: Sequence of tasks in building an RV
James George wrote: >I have no trouble accomplishing the mechanical work, planning the >sequence of tasks really slows me down. While I haven't done any real Industrial Engineering for some time I did get a degree in it. So what, huh? Well, I know something about the problem we all face which is a problem in project management. To do it really right you need project management software. Here is a brief overview of the process. First, make a list of all the tasks that must be done - this is a BIG job; one that I have not seen done yet. - each task's duration needs to be at least one hour; if the tasks are too short or too long the process is useless. "Mash rivet" is too short a task and "build left wing" is too large. Second, put each task on a separate 3X5 card. Along with the task's description, put an id number or code. Also list what tasks (id's) have to be done before this task can be done. Third, stick the cards on a board. Those that depend on no others, like "make rudder stiffeners" and "fit nosewheel tire", go on the left side. Others go to the right and are connected to those they depend on with lines or strings. Fourth, For each task, enter on the card, the earliest possible date the task can begin and the latest date when it can end which is just the earliest starting date plus the maximum number of days it will take to do. The earliest ending date is the earliest starting date plus the minimum number of days it will take to do. Days might be hours instead. This is how it was done before computer, as I recall. A lot of work. I imagine that is why it slows us down so. But it does help do know which tasks remain to do and what is holding them up. It also makes it clear what task to do if you get held up on another. I'm saving the rudder for last, for example, so that I'll have something to work on evenings while the rest of the project is at an airport many miles away - like Wyoming? A chart of the project is something we might do as a group. Hal Kempthorne RV-6AQ -- Looking for an airport halk(at)sybase.com Santa Clara, CA. Debonair N6134V @ SJC ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 20, 1998
From: Martin Shorman <kskids(at)netins.net>
Subject: Re: Listers meeting at Oshkosh
Stucklen, Frederic IFC wrote: > > > Not a bad idea. I'll be there Fri, July 31'st to Mon, Aug 3'd. .. > I've not had the chance to see Oshkosh yet, but am trying to figure a way. What is the best day/s to see the most RVs? Which day/s to avoid? Anyone flying over Sioux City, IA? martin shorman ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Jeff Orear" <jorear(at)mari.net>
Subject: Re: Listers meeting at Oshkosh
Date: Jul 20, 1998
Howdy; Yeah, I was wondering how we would identify ourselves as rv-listers too. I suppose that we will be the ones with the combination rv-drool and computer-related glazed over eyes! Regards, Jeff Orear RV6A 25171 waiting on the wings and packing for OSH Peshtigo, WI -----Original Message----- From: rv-list(at)matronics.com <rv-list(at)matronics.com> Date: Monday, July 20, 1998 1:17 PM Subject: Re: RV-List: Listers meeting at Oshkosh > > >I think its a great idea too. But I wonder if Vans wants 200 people out >front. On second thought, maybe with the crowd around it will draw new >people over to get in on the bargin. However, how will I know you from >who? > >Cecil > > > writes: >> >> >>Bill, >> >> Not a bad idea. I'll be there Fri, July 31'st to Mon, Aug 3'd. .. >> >>Fred Stucklen >>N925RV RV-6A >>E. Windsor, Ct >> >> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: bcostello3(at)juno.com [SMTP:bcostello3(at)juno.com] >>> Sent: Sunday, July 19, 1998 8:39 AM >>> To: RV-list(at)matronics.com >>> Subject: RV-List: Listers meeting at Oshkosh >>> >>> Costello) >>> >>> Hi Folks, >>> Didn't someone suggest we listers head for Van's tent at noon each >>day >>> if >>> possible? It would be fun meeting and those who wanted to could >>have >>> lunch together. Just a thought, but I think I will check it out. >>Not >>> sure which days I will be there this year yet. >>> >>> Best regards, >>> Bill >>> >>> Bill Costello bcostello3(at)juno.com Chicago >>> N97WC reserved building RV-6 SBGA source >> >> >> >> > > > > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 20, 1998
From: jerry calvert <calverjl(at)flash.net>
Subject: Wing spar
To those who are just starting to build wing spars, I was tapering the spar flanges(2 per spar) that are tapered by the builder and putting the 1/4" radius on the end of all flanges and found an easy way to mark a nice 1/4" radius. If you bought the plastic buttons from Avery to run the string through to align your HS jig brackets, use them as a template to mark the radius. They fit the spar flange hole perfectly. Just pop it in and draw the radius around the button. While we're on the topic of the spars, be sure to examine the root end of each spar. There are marks engraved on the spar flanges that insure that you assemble the spar flanges back to their original positions. The RV manual discusses it at the start of the wing chapter. I also recommend using Will Crittenden's notes, they are very helpful. Jerry Calvert Edmond Ok -6a Wings ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 20, 1998
From: Joe Walker <joewalk@hal-pc.org>
Subject: Re: Electronic testers
Apparently I have one like Don's. I love it but I have killed every set of batteries by leaving it on. Oddly, I just got back from WalMart where I spent $12 to put new watch batteries in. I have spent much more on batteries than on the original unit. My advice is to look around and see if you can find one that turns itself off after 20 minutes or so; or failing that one that uses AAA batteries instead of the watch type. Even if you get one like Don and I have you will enjoy a small well made piece of equipment. Joe Walker, Houston Rebuilding Wreaked RV6 Don Hyde wrote: > > I've had a Pocket DMM like the BK2700-ND on that page for years, and it > works fine for me. There are fancier ones, and ruggeder ones, but those > one is small, accurate and cheap. > > My only problem is that it is easy to leave it turned on and run the > batteries down, though that defect is shared by most of the highest-priced > DMM's as well. Ten years ago, the batteries were hard to find and > expensive, but they're used in watches so you can get them at K-Mart now. > > > > >I am beginning to work on the electronics of my bird. What type of tester > >are you folks using? I will be assembling the microMONITOR and > >microENCODER Kits as well as doing all the other great stuff having to do > >with electrons whizzing around my plane. I am looking on page 513 of the > >Digi-Key catalog and see testers from $13 to $200. Any suggestions? > > > >Ross Mickey > >Canopy....nuf said!!! > > > > Don Hyde > Quincy, IL > 6A, Building! VS done, > Working on rudder. > ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 20, 1998
From: "James K. Hurd" <hurd(at)riolink.com>
Subject: Rivnuts
I want to use rivnuts/screws to attach slider canopy to frame. Article in 8/97 RVator illustrates use of *steel* rivnuts. Is steel needed for strength or is this a dissimilar metals issue? Aircraft Spruce lists only aluminum rivnuts and they cost more than Cherry Max rivets, fer cryin' out loud. What are the options here? (Don't think I want to use my Harbor Freight rivnuts...) Jim Trimming 6A canopy in canopy-cutting weather 100F+ ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 20, 1998
From: MoeJoe <moejoe(at)bellatlantic.net>
Subject: Elevator to HS attachment
Hello all. Today I finally finished my left elevator, and mounted both right and left to my HS. When I did, I noticed that using the 2.25" from HS spar to elevator spar was a tight fit, and my elevator leading edge was rubbing slightly. I backed the rod end bearings out 1.5 turns, and all fits well. Is it ok to do this? I already know the answer, but I need somebody else to confirm that the 2.25 is just a guidline. My elavtor horns also do not line up exactly. I can see how this may be a problem. They are very slightly out of alignment vertically. Sould I worry, or should I first check to see if I have any "drift" about the hinge axis? I'm going to try to see another builders tommorrow, then I may drill mine tommorrow night. -- Moe Colontonio moejoe(at)bellatlantic.net Check out my RV-8 page at: http://members.bellatlantic.net/~moejoe ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 20, 1998
From: Bob Skinner <bskinr(at)trib.com>
Subject: Re: Listers meeting at Oshkosh
>Yeah, I was wondering how we would identify ourselves as rv-listers too. I >suppose that we will be the ones with the combination rv-drool and >computer-related glazed over eyes! >Jeff Orear I know, I know---we could all wear RV hats and shirts. No, that won't work. How about all of us wearing our caps backwards. NO, that lowers I.Q. by 40-50 points and we wouldn't be able to build our airplanes, then. How about listers wearing a short piece of red yard, tied with an overhand knot on their hats. The symbolisim? The overhand knot signifies a group tied together with a common bond. The red---well, that's the color of yarn that I have lying around. Think of all the interest this would create. Kind of like a secret club. Everyone would want to know what's going on. Heck, they have ribbons for everything else. Why not red yarn for listers? Bob Skinner RV-6 425 hrs. Buffalo, WY bskinr(at)trib.com ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 19, 1998
From: "David A. Barnhart" <barnhart(at)a.crl.com>
Subject: Re: Weather Chatter
> Yes, Sydney yesterday was typical dreadful winter weather - high of about 19c > and mostly sunny... And it has cooled off considerably here in Phoenix, Arizona where the high today was only 103 F (39C). After last week's high of 116F, it's almost downright chilly ;-) dave Barnhart RV-6 sn 23744 N601DB Flying (but only in the mornings when it is a 'cool' 90 degrees) ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 20, 1998
From: "Gary A. Sobek" <rv6flier(at)yahoo.com>
Subject: Flying RV Trip report. (Very long.)
Tim Bronson TBronson(at)compuserve.com wrote: > How was your trip back? I hope it went well. From what I saw the WX was pretty decent across the country, so I'd guess your return was fine. Incidentally, if you choose to write a piece on your trip for the RV-list, I'm sure it would be well received. Those of us who aren't flying RV's yet just eat that stuff up. Those that are probably do too. > > Take care. > > Tim Tim and RV-List: "My Sanity" (RV-6, N157GS) has been on 4 trips in 4 weeks. June 19 we flew to Redding,CA (RDD). Had dinner with a friend and his family then departed in the morning as a flight to Scoppoose, OR. (1S4). Most of the flight in Oregon was VFR on top of overcast. Thanks to the "DUCK" for broadcasting on 122.75 that 1S4 was VFR under a scattered to broken layer. The HomeWing RV fly-in was a complete success. From 1S4, Don and I flew together as a flight for 30 minutes. I then went direct Jackson, CA (O70). Visited with friends and departed the next day for Camarillo (CMA). One-hour north of CMA, the Attitude Gyro tumbled. CMA was 1,600 overcast and I was at 11,500. Found a hole and started a spiral down. After a 360, it became clear that it was a "Sucker Hole" as I could see the hidden hill (mountain) that it was trying to get me to fly into. I enter home in the GPS and went direct. Sure enjoyed the 18-knot tailwind and 184 knot ground speed. Sunday June 28, one of my friends wanted to fly to Las Vegas (VGT) to see his daughter. When he showed up at my hangar, I put him in the left seat and made him fly to Las Vegas. I did the landing from the right seat but he did all the rest of the flying. I did need to help with a little rudder / stick pressure on the take-off. I flew back that afternoon. It was 108 when we departed and never saw over 220 oil temp on climb out. This was my first trip that I did not pay for fuel, food or taxi. The next week was off to Lake Tahoe (TVL). It was a beautiful 2:15 flight. I was at 14,000' 10 miles south of the airport. I was cruising at 12,500 and needed to climb above the clouds. There was a 10,000' mountain peak somewhere below the clouds and did not want to meet it. After clear of the clouds, I called the tower and started down. In the smooth air, there was no problem going from 14,000 to 7,500 in 10 miles at or below 170 KTAS. Before heading home 2 days latter, I gave a friend a ride around the lake. The flight home was just as uneventful. The July 11th weekend was the biggest problem. There were 3 places I wanted to be. Connellsville, PA, Arlington, WA and Torrance, CA. Had to make a decision. I wanted to fly to the airport that I learned to fly at and it was the farthest away. FSS had issued a convective SIGMET for Arizona and New Mexico. I did not want to mess with Thunderstorms in any airplane. I did take a few days off work and started east. From the weather brief, I figured that I would turn back before I reached Prescott and go to Arlington. Beautiful flight to Prescott on 8 July. After fuel, started toward Tucumcari. Flight Watch did have a few thunderstorms north and south of my course. I could see the dark clouds several hundred miles off on both sides. At 9,500 over Albuquerque class C, I diverted south of course to keep out of dark clouds and high terrain. I could see lightening 20 miles to my left. I was about 10 miles south of course. Around 100 miles from Tucumcari, I was seeing no more lighting and turned direct on course. Not more than 5 minutes, lightening struck at 12 o'clock about 20 miles in front of me. I immediately went into a 60-degree bank turn toward clear skis. Need to find a place to land for fuel. The GPS had 3 airports that looked good for fuel. Pressed the info button on the GPS to find out what they were. This one ROW was directly ahead. ROW was Roswell, New Mexico. If it is good enough for aliens, then it is good enough for me. On the ground, I review my charts and where my last leg of the day would take me. After 45 minutes, I fired up N157GS and headed toward Amarillo. Weather looked good and the next airport on my list was Hutchinson County Airport (BGD) in Borger, TX. At 10 miles out, that dark cloud in front of me stated spitting electricity toward the ground. It was at least 20 miles ahead so the decision was made to stop and spend the night. Picked a great place. Fuel was $1.75, hotel was mile away, airplane in hangar for $10, and courtesy car was available. Hotel was only $28.60 and had a great meal. Next morning I could not get a DUATs briefing so call FSS and talked to a briefer. Not use to doing it this way. Route of flight called for near perfect flying weather. After 2.8 hours, I need to find a restroom. HRO looked promising. (Boone County, Harrison, AK) As I approached, I heard on the radio that the runway was closed and that they were landing on the taxiway. Do I want to land on a taxiway? Never done that before so I did. After fueling and resting, I set course toward Louisville, KY. Landed at Clark (JVY) for fuel and restroom. I decided to phone my parents to let them know that I was coming. Should be there in about 2.5 hours. At 11,500 over West Virginia, I was 100 miles out. The broken layer went overcast. Down I went to get under it. Flew the last 90 miles at 3,500 in 3-mile visibility at 55% power and 135 KTAS. Reaching PA, the visibility went up to >6 miles with broken sky. Over flew my parent's house at 1,000 AGL and did a couple lazy eight's. Landed at Rostraver, PA (P35) for the night. The next day (10 July), I flew the plane to Connellsville for the night. Gave my parents rides the next day and talked to many people at the Air Fest. 7 RVs were there. The return flight stated Sunday 12 July. First stop was Bowling Green, KY (BWG) after a 2.5-hour flight. Fuel burn was 9.44 GPH at 6,500 feet. Departed toward Tulsa. Back to 6,500 then 8,500 to get over clouds. Needed a pit stop 1.6 hours out. Came down through the broken layer to Malden, MO (MAW). Need to know the aviation radio frequency to access the pilots lounge. After the pit stop, refueling and planning, off I went. Did not wish to fly 3,500 under the clouds in 3-mile visibility. Worked my way up through the broken layer to 8,500. On the way to Tulsa, I went under, over and around clouds. Down to 6,500 twice and up to 12,500 twice. Approaching Tulsa, I evaluated fuel burn, reserves and looked for a place to land. Borger, TX was looking possible. Would be there after total flight duration of just under 4 hours. Fuel reserve would still exceed VFR minimums. About 50 miles out, a dark thunderstorm was to the south of course. I altered course 10 miles north of the direct path. AWOS indicated that sky was clear at BGD. Started looking for alternates. Had 4 airports that I could make and not use the fuel reserve. Was on the 45 for runway 03 when the low fuel alarm went off. (6 gallons left) The alarm startled me and I called right traffic as I made left traffic. Landed, fueled, put the airplane in the hangar and spent the night. I had 6.2 gallons left when I refueled. Had been burning 7.7 GPH and flew 4 hours. Fuel flow was off 0.3 gallons. The aircraft can do four-hour legs with more than legal reserves. The pilot can also but does not like to push his luck. The next morning was again perfect flying weather. Departed Texas for Winslow, Arizona (IWA). Next stop Cable Airport, Upland, CA (CCB). Touch down at home 12:00 Noon local time. 14.8 hours east bound and 14.1 west bound. This was the biggest test of man and his machine that I have ever done. It was also the first cross US trip that I have flow in a GA aircraft. I did it in a machine that I built really made it special for me. The machine and its systems functioned, as they should. The attention to all the systems details during the building process has paid off. I am averaging about one (1) hour of maintenance / repair for every ten (10) hours of flying. There are now over 171 hours on the airplane since its first flight in September 1997. Oil consumption has been one quart at 25 hours after change then another at an additional 15 hours (40). Now I feel that I am a PILOT and not an airplane driver any more. I meet a LOT of nice people and am looking forward to meeting you on one of my next long cross-countries. VAN: Thanks for designing such a wonderful aircraft, for the help in making my dreams of building and owning my own aircraft come true. Sorry for the long report. Hope a few enjoy and offers encourgement to finish and join me. == Gary A. Sobek RV-6 N157GS O-320 Hartzell So. CA, USA RV6flier(at)yahoo.com ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 20, 1998
From: MoeJoe <moejoe(at)bellatlantic.net>
Subject: Re: RE: Where in the world is Steve Barnard
Just want to let you all know that PBS will be airing a 3 hour show on a guy who built a kitplane, start to finish, in 28 days. It will be showing on this Wed, July 22. Check your local listings for showtimes. -- Moe Colontonio moejoe(at)bellatlantic.net Check out my RV-8 page at: http://members.bellatlantic.net/~moejoe ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 20, 1998
From: Smith <kpsmith(at)ais.net>
Subject: Bit index
Not an index, but a stamped plate with the drill sized holes is what I use for $2.50 at OSH, or from several catalogs. I made a rack of sccrap wood and keep it in a deep drawer by the press. I drilled 3/8 holes to hold the bits, and keep matching bits in the same holes. I have many #30, #40, #41, etc, and can easily get one in the wrong hole...so I am now in the habit of checking a bit size when I pull it out. Works for me. Ken Smith Plainfield IL RV6 in the wait tank... ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 20, 1998
From: Smith <kpsmith(at)ais.net>
Subject: PIO or porposing (ala Flipper)
At the risk of placing my truly low time experience up for a dart target, my first solo in an American Yankee resulted in porposing -- hopping down the runway. My instructor had warned me of the possibility, antd the solution: Add power, lift the nose off (or lift off) and go around. Around I went. Later, on a dual cross country, a similar incident happened on landing at Friendship (BWI). Same answer, but with 6000 feet to play with, the solution was up, glide, flair and touch down. Landing at full stall, or at least nose high, is the cure... Ken Smith Plainfield, IL ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 20, 1998
From: MoeJoe <moejoe(at)bellatlantic.net>
Subject: PBS kitplane special
Just want to let you all know that PBS will be airing a 3 hour show on a guy who built a kitplane, start to finish, in 28 days. It will be showing on this Wed, July 22. Check your local listings for showtimes. -- Moe Colontonio moejoe(at)bellatlantic.net Check out my RV-8 page at: http://members.bellatlantic.net/~moejoe ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Scott D. Morgan" <smorgan(at)pdq.net>
Subject: Re: Oshkosh Hotel Room Available?
Date: Jul 20, 1998
Shawn, I went to OSH in 96 with a hotel reservation in Milwaukee. After arriving at OSH, I checked with the housing booth. They gave me names of 5 people who rent out bedrooms in their homes. This service was great. I called a lady and two hours later, I had a room in a house on the Lake. There were about 10 guests and we all sat out on the balcony of the house overlooking the lake and talking "hangar" till 2 a.m. All for the low price of $50 per night. I highly recommend this option. I just cancelled my hotel from a payphone at OSH after making my connection with the home owner. Good Luck Scott Morgan ---------- > From: Shawn Grubb <sgrubb(at)bankofhydro.com> > To: rv-list(at)matronics.com > Subject: RV-List: Oshkosh Hotel Room Available? > Date: Sunday, July 19, 1998 1:30 PM > > > > I know there's nothing like waiting till the last minute, but does anyone > know of a hotel room available near Oshkosh? > > The closest I have found is in Madison and Milwaukee. > > Thanks, > > Shawn Grubb > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "MartyRV6A" <emrath(at)email.msn.com>
Subject: RV6 Wing Rib Undersized
Date: Jul 20, 1998
Listeners, Vans sent me a new wing rib for my RV6, part T-403R. This is a tank rib. My wing kit was delivered at the end of May. I discovered one tank end rib was fabricated of 0.025" material instead of 0.032" as per the packing list. No problem with Vans getting a replacement, but I suggest if you have a recent wing kit you might watch for this problem. Slow building in Nashville. ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Elevator to HS attachment
<35B3EC29.30D70829(at)bellatlantic.net>
From: cecilth(at)Juno.com (cecil t hatfield)
Date: Jul 20, 1998
writes: > >Hello all. Today I finally finished my left elevator, and mounted both >right and left to my HS. When I did, I noticed that using the 2.25" >from >HS spar to elevator spar was a tight fit, and my elevator leading edge >was rubbing slightly. I backed the rod end bearings out 1.5 turns, and >all fits well. Is it ok to do this? I already know the answer, but I >need somebody else to confirm that the 2.25 is just a guidline. Moe, I just went thru a senerio of that nature. I have the controls hooked up and I just couldn't get the 30 degree up and the 25 degrees down from the elevator. I had done many things. Then called Tom at the factory. He fixed my problem. I didn't have the 13/16 called out, for the center of the rod end bearing to the spar. So screwed them in and took 1/8th inch off the horozintal stabilazer skins and presto. Fixed. My >elavtor horns also do not line up exactly. I can see how this may be a >problem. They are very slightly out of alignment vertically. Sould I >worry, or should I first check to see if I have any "drift" about the >hinge axis? I'm going to try to see another builders tommorrow, then I >may drill mine tommorrow night. Mine are too. I clamped the elevators togeather out where the lead is, then using a pre drilled spacer drilled the horns. > >-- >Moe Colontonio >moejoe(at)bellatlantic.net >Check out my RV-8 page at: >http://members.bellatlantic.net/~moejoe > > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Listers meeting at Oshkosh
From: cecilth(at)Juno.com (cecil t hatfield)
Date: Jul 20, 1998
Sounds good to me, now truthfully am I going to be the only one looking silly? Cecil > >>Yeah, I was wondering how we would identify ourselves as rv-listers >too. I >>suppose that we will be the ones with the combination rv-drool and >>computer-related glazed over eyes! >>Jeff Orear > > I know, I know---we could all wear RV hats and shirts. No, that >won't >work. How about all of us wearing our caps backwards. NO, that >lowers I.Q. >by 40-50 points and we wouldn't be able to build our airplanes, then. > How about listers wearing a short piece of red yard, tied with an >overhand >knot on their hats. The symbolisim? The overhand knot signifies a >group >tied together with a common bond. The red---well, that's the color of >yarn >that I have lying around. Think of all the interest this would >create. >Kind of like a secret club. Everyone would want to know what's going >on. >Heck, they have ribbons for everything else. Why not red yarn for >listers? > >Bob Skinner RV-6 425 hrs. Buffalo, WY bskinr(at)trib.com > > > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Listers meeting at Oshkosh
From: smcdaniels(at)Juno.com (SCOTT R MCDANIELS)
Date: Jul 20, 1998
>Yeah, I was wondering how we would identify ourselves as rv-listers >too. I >suppose that we will be the ones with the combination rv-drool and >computer-related glazed over eyes! > > Out front of Van's display area there will be a banner tower with banners that say "RV Land" (or something like that). You could form a circle around that :-) Scott McDaniels These opinions and ideas are my own and do not necessarily reflect the opinions of my employer. ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 21, 1998
From: Marty Sailer <mwsailer(at)erols.com>
Subject: Re: Listers meeting at Oshkosh
> Kind of like a secret club. Everyone would want to know what's going on. > Heck, they have ribbons for everything else. Why not red yarn for listers? I think that will work Bob. Why not bring the rest of the spool and ask Van to cut 6" pieces for the rest of us :-) On second thought I'll just hit the local fabric store and beg for a sample. Marty (be there Wednesday) Sailer ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 20, 1998
From: John Ammeter <ammeterj(at)seanet.com>
Subject: Re: Listers meeting at Oshkosh
> How about listers wearing a short piece of red yard, tied with an overhand >knot on their hats. The symbolisim? The overhand knot signifies a group >tied together with a common bond. The red---well, that's the color of yarn >that I have lying around. Think of all the interest this would create. >Kind of like a secret club. Everyone would want to know what's going on. >Heck, they have ribbons for everything else. Why not red yarn for listers? > >Bob Skinner RV-6 425 hrs. Buffalo, WY bskinr(at)trib.com > At the Arlington Airfair some of us Rec.Aviation.Homebuilt posters wore a red tag with the letters, 'R.A.H.'. Maybe something like that would work for Oshkosh. John Ammeter ammeterj(at)seanet.com Seattle WA USA 1974 1/2 JH-5 RV-6 (sold 4/14/98) ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 21, 1998
From: Tien Do <wizard(at)tartarus.uwa.edu.au>
Subject: RV6A W418
Listers A question regarding the W418 assembly (bellcrank to aileron pushrod). It seems to me that the HIEM F3414M part and the AN490 Ht8P do not match. The diameter of the thread on the An490 is smaller than the HIEM F3414M. Am I missing something or just not reading the plans right. Cheers Tien RV6A Perth ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 20, 1998
From: "Michael J. Robbins" <kitfox(at)gte.net>
Subject: OSH 2 meter ham frequencies
Anybody know what 2m repeaters are being used at OSH? Mike Robbins RV-8 #491 N7LHM Issaquah, WA ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 20, 1998
From: "Michael J. Robbins" <kitfox(at)gte.net>
Subject: Supporting Parts w/ Lead Bags
Don't know if this has been mentioned before, but I have found that 25 lb. lead shot bags are of immense help in holding down skins while dimpling (I also have an "extra" hole in my horizontal stab from the dimple die) and while riveting parts on the work bench. I have four bags that I use to brace parts and "flop" over them. Almost as good as an extra set of hands. Put one on the skins when using the C-frame to keep it from jumping out. (I learned the hard way). Mike Robbins RV-8 #491 Issaquah, WA ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Mitch Faatz <mfaatz(at)SagentTech.com>
Subject: OSH 2 meter ham frequencies
Date: Jul 21, 1998
There is a simplex repeater on 147.425 (REC.AVIATION, 107.2PL) Also: 147.090 2 meter Repeater (Fond du Lac) 145.750 Internet rec.aviation simplex freq 147.240 2 meter Repeater KE9XH (Oshkosh) 147.345 2 meter Repeater WB9ZHN pl 107.2 (Oshkosh) Mitch Faatz San Jose, CA N727MF (reserved) RV-6AQME working on the sliding canopy... KN6NC, will be on either 2 meter or 440 simplex frequencies > -----Original Message----- > From: Michael J. Robbins > Sent: Monday, July 20, 1998 9:04 PM > To: rv-list(at)matronics.com > Subject: RV-List: OSH 2 meter ham frequencies > > > Anybody know what 2m repeaters are being used at OSH? > > Mike Robbins > RV-8 #491 > N7LHM > Issaquah, WA > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Rvmils(at)aol.com
Date: Jul 21, 1998
Subject: exhaust(vetterman vs spruce)
Looks like the vetterman crossover system w/heat muffs will run me 711.00 and the rv crossover from spruce for an 0360 w/heat muffs will run 580.00. The add in spruce sounds pertty good. Can anyone tell me the difference. carey mills ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 21, 1998
From: scott <acepilot(at)mwt.net>
Subject: Re: OSH 2 meter ham frequencies
Michael J. Robbins wrote: > > > Anybody know what 2m repeaters are being used at OSH? > > Mike Robbins > RV-8 #491 > N7LHM > Issaquah, WA > 147.345 + has great coverage. My old (1994) repeater directory lists a PL of 107.2. Might check in a newer copy...seems like I didn't use PL while there and the repeater came up. Scott N0EDV -- Gotta Fly or Gonna Die ! --Ask me about my Aeronca Super Chief-- amended 8-29-97: Now after feeling the "Need for Speed", building an RV-4! Tail kit arrived!! Somewhat regretfully, the Super Chief is now for sale. $8500 :( ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 21, 1998
From: scott <acepilot(at)mwt.net>
Subject: Meeting at OSH and a question
I'll be easy to find...I'll be advertising for the RV-list on my Tee shirt...either by defacing one with a black magic marker or those iron on transfers for ink jet printers. Now the question. Having just received my tail kit, Van's suggests priming or oiling the steel parts to prevent corrosion before building. If I oil them, what oil would be best? Mineral oil? Aeroshell 15W/50 at $3.50 or so a quart? Used drain oil? Then, best way to remove it for priming later? Scott -- Gotta Fly or Gonna Die ! --Ask me about my Aeronca Super Chief-- amended 8-29-97: Now after feeling the "Need for Speed", building an RV-4! Tail kit arrived!! Somewhat regretfully, the Super Chief is now for sale. $8500 :( ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Fesenbek, Gary" <gfesenbek(at)Meridium.com>
Subject: Check those weldments
Date: Jul 21, 1998
After I had my canopy frame attached I noticed that the weldment on one side was only tack welded. A quick call to Vans said that over the past many years they have only seen about 4 with this problem. It was pretty scary for me though because of all the handling I did to the thing to prep and paint it prior to putting it on. Oh well! I guess even a keen QA department like Vans has will let the occasional bad goods slip by. But, just wanted the list to know so that you guys(and gals??) could check yours. Tot ziens! Gary Fesenbek RV6a Quickbuild @!#!#@Canopy ************************************************* * Gary Fesenbek * * Meridium Inc. * * (540) 344-9205 x112 * * gfesenbek(at)meridium.com * * http://www.meridium.com * ************************************************* > -----Original Message----- > From: Rvmils(at)aol.com [SMTP:Rvmils(at)aol.com] > Sent: Tuesday, July 21, 1998 5:24 AM > To: rv-list(at)matronics.com > Subject: RV-List: exhaust(vetterman vs spruce) > > > Looks like the vetterman crossover system w/heat muffs will run me > 711.00 and > the rv crossover from spruce for an 0360 w/heat muffs will run 580.00. > The > add in spruce sounds pertty good. Can anyone tell me the difference. > carey mills > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "John Darby" <johnd@our-town.com>
Subject: Re: Humbling Landings.......
Date: Jul 20, 1998
I think it is what we old Air Force guys use to call the JC manuever in the F-80s and early T-33s. When it started to porpoise, and got hairy, it usually caused the pilot to call out to 'Jesus Christ!!" for assistance. John C Darby Jr. RV6 sold, Cessna 210 bought Stephenville TX > >What is an PIO? > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Nick Nafsinger" <nicknaf(at)hotmail.com>
Subject: Re: Electronic testers
Date: Jul 21, 1998
I have been useing the Fluke 77/BN for the last several years at work with absolutly no problems. I'm not exactly sure how much they sell for retail, but it does have some very nice features. It turns it self off after about 30 min or inactivity, uses one regular 9vdc battery, and has an awsome protective cover that really helps when your fingers get a little slipery (go ahead ask me how I know!). I'll look around and see if I can find out how much they are, but I wouldn't expect it to cost too much.... Nick Nafsinger Off the coast of Hawaii, USS Carl Vinson Still dreaming of a -6 >-----Original Message----- >From: Joe Walker [SMTP:joewalk@hal-pc.org] >Sent: Monday, July 20, 1998 7:37 PM >To: rv-list(at)matronics.com >Subject: Re: RV-List: Electronic testers > > >Apparently I have one like Don's. I love it but I have killed every >set of batteries by leaving it on. Oddly, I just got back from WalMart >where I spent $12 to put new watch batteries in. I have spent much >more on batteries than on the original unit. My advice is to look >around and see if you can find one that turns itself off after 20 >minutes or so; or failing that one that uses AAA batteries instead of >the watch type. Even if you get one like Don and I have you will enjoy >a small well made piece of equipment. >Joe Walker, Houston >Rebuilding Wreaked RV6 > >Don Hyde wrote: >> >> I've had a Pocket DMM like the BK2700-ND on that page for years, >and it >> works fine for me. >> > >> >Ross Mickey >> >Canopy....nuf said!!! >> > >> >> Don Hyde >> Quincy, IL >> 6A, Building! VS done, >> Working on rudder. >> > > > > > > > - = > >-+ posting! > - = > >-+ > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 21, 1998
From: Gary kozinski <KOZINSKI(at)symbol.com>
Subject: Oiling parts/corrosion
Use WD-40. I read a history on it and it was invented/used for back in the 40's in San Diego to prevent corrosion of aircraft parts sitting on the docks. It wipes off pretty easily when it come time to prime. Gary RV-6 20038 finishing N38GK (reserved) on Long Island ________________________________________________________________________________
From: RVosberg(at)uhc.com
Subject: Re: Listers meeting at Oshkosh
Date: Jul 21, 1998
I think its a great idea too. But I wonder if Vans wants 200 people out front. On second thought, maybe with the crowd around it will draw new people over to get in on the bargin. However, how will I know you from who? Cecil ------------------------------------------------------------------ A good idea would be to make name tags. Maybe take a picture of your project, trim up the picture, write your name, project, and status on it and pin it to your shirt. I would like to do this for our MN Wing Vans Airforce meetings simply because I cannot remember anyone's name or what they are working on. I'm afraid to ask, just not sure if they would laugh at my idea or not. Roy Vosberg Twin Cities, MN RV-6 picking up wing kit at Roadway tonight. ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 21, 1998
From: "Bill Costello" <bcostello(at)mbsi.net>
Subject: Help for a visitor from Scotland
Hi Folks, Hope I am not misusing the list too much. I just met via phone an RV-6 builder who is arriving in Chicago from Scotland early eve of 23rd of July. He would like to visit someone that eve who is on the fuselage of an RV6 or 6A. I am trying to find Ernie Cleveland's phone number or anyone else who can help me. Can you help? Please email me, off-list if you like, to work and home, if I can impose on you so much. Addresses are: bcostello(at)mbsi.net and bcostello3(at)juno.com Since this is pretty much the last hour, I certainly would appreciate the help today. If before 4 Chi time, you can just email to the mbsi address. Sorry for the intrusion and thanks much to anyone who can help.l Bill ________________________________________________________________________________
From: ABAYMAN(at)aol.com
Date: Jul 21, 1998
Subject: Re: Wing spar
dear jerry, i just received my kit last week and it looks to me so far, that Van's tapered all the spars, cut out all the lightning holes, cut all the rib slots, etc. looks like it will save many hours. but i'm not finished reading the manual, there may be something i'm not seeing. scott winging it in tampa ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Daniel H. Morris III" <Morristec(at)icdc.com>
Subject: Re: exhaust(vetterman vs spruce)
Date: Jul 21, 1998
The Vetterman exhaust is high quality, has great installation flexibility, and works well. The service history as far as cracking, etc. is excellent. Check the archives and you'll find many good comments. Other exhaust systems have not been so successful. Dan Morris Now flying RV6 -----Original Message----- From: Rvmils(at)aol.com <Rvmils(at)aol.com> Date: Tuesday, July 21, 1998 2:27 AM Subject: RV-List: exhaust(vetterman vs spruce) > >Looks like the vetterman crossover system w/heat muffs will run me 711.00 and >the rv crossover from spruce for an 0360 w/heat muffs will run 580.00. The >add in spruce sounds pertty good. Can anyone tell me the difference. >carey mills > > > > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Listers meeting at Oshkosh
<19980720.203106.2710.0.SMCDANIELS(at)juno.com>
From: smcdaniels(at)Juno.com (SCOTT R MCDANIELS)
Date: Jul 21, 1998
>Out front of Van's display area there will be a banner tower with >banners >that say "RV Land" (or something like that). > >You could form a circle around that :-) > > Now I remember, it actually says "RV Country" Scott McDaniels These opinions and ideas are my own and do not necessarily reflect the opinions of my employer. ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 21, 1998
From: Paul Besing <rv8er(at)doitnow.com>
Subject: Re: Elevator to HS attachment
Moe: Mine, (and many others) are misaligned as well..as long as each elevator is aligned with the HS when you drill the horns, you are ok...mine were about 3/4" off from eachother.. Paul Besing RV-6A (197AB) Panel ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 21, 1998
From: jerry calvert <calverjl(at)flash.net>
Subject: Re: Wing spar
ABAYMAN(at)aol.com wrote: > > > dear jerry, > i just received my kit last week and it looks to me so far, that Van's tapered > all the spars, cut out all the lightning holes, cut all the rib slots, etc. > looks like it will save many hours. but i'm not finished reading the manual, > there may be something i'm not seeing. > scott > winging it in tampa > Scott, All of the mentioned work was completed on my kit too ,except the longest spar flanges(w606c) were not tapered. The w606c's do not require much tapering, only about the last 16". In fact, tapering is optional. The outboard corners can just be trimmed according to plans. You're right about Van saving us some time by doing the extra work on the wing kits! I used a large scotch-brite wheel on a bench grinder to polish the flange edges to a mirror finish. Wear some gloves while working the spar flanges or your hands become almost black with aluminum. Did you notice that the root ends of the spar flanges are engraved? Very helpful marks :^) Good luck on the wing, Jerry Calvert Edmond Ok -6a Wing ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 21, 1998
From: Joe Drumm <jdrumm(at)dgs.dgsys.com>
Subject: RV-8 in Norway
Hello everyone. I'm new to the list and my RV8 tail kit is in the mail. I'm from the U.S.A. on Long Island, NY, but am working in Oslo Norway for at least a year and am starting construction here. After 6 hours of RV time (watching the promotional video, that is), I can't wait any longer. Are there any other RV builders from Norway on the list? Also, does anyone know if I manage to finish and fly the plane in Norway, can it later be certified in the US as a homebuilt, or does it have to be built in the US? The most likely scenario will be that I just do the tail kit here, ship it home and finish the rest when I am back in the States, but am just wondering. Thanks and good luck to everyone with their RV's Joe ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 21, 1998
From: Edward Cole <emcole(at)ix.netcom.com>
Subject: PS Intercom
Listers, The PM501 Intercom I offerd for sale yesterday has been sold. Thanks. Ed Cole RV6A Fuselage skins Cupertino, Ca ________________________________________________________________________________
From: SWasher1(at)aol.com
Date: Jul 21, 1998
Subject: Plane ticket to Oshkosh
Listers, I have one cheap airline ticket to Appleton (22 miles to Oshkosh) on the 28th returning on the 2nd if anyone is leaving from the northeast. Reply off-line if you are interested. Steve W SWasher1(at)aol.com ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Rick Jory" <rickjory(at)email.msn.com>
Subject: Re: Listers meeting at Oshkosh
Date: Jul 21, 1998
Gentleman. There will be numerous people at Oshkosh that are building planes using squeegees and brushes. I say we all wear leather holsters and pack a 2x or 3x. That should separate us. Rick Jory Highlands Ranch, CO Expecting to Order 8a after Oshkosh, b'gosh. -----Original Message----- From: SCOTT R MCDANIELS <smcdaniels(at)Juno.com> Date: Tuesday, July 21, 1998 8:18 AM Subject: Re: RV-List: Listers meeting at Oshkosh > > >>Out front of Van's display area there will be a banner tower with >>banners >>that say "RV Land" (or something like that). >> >>You could form a circle around that :-) >> >> >Now I remember, it actually says "RV Country" > > >Scott McDaniels >These opinions and ideas are my own >and do not necessarily reflect the opinions >of my employer. > > > > > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: donspawn(at)Juno.com
Subject: a question
Date: Jul 21, 1998
>Now the question. Having just received my tail kit, Van's suggests >priming or oiling the steel parts to prevent corrosion before >building. >If I oil them, what oil would be best? Mineral oil? Aeroshell 15W/50 >at $3.50 or so a quart? Used drain oil? Then, best way to remove it for >priming later? > Scott : I would clean & prime now. Otherwise just an 10 weight oil. Don Jordan ~ 76DJ ~ 6A fuselage ~ Arlington,Tx ~ donspawn(at)juno.com ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 21, 1998
From: Terry Jantzi <tjantzi(at)netrover.com>
Subject: just painted
Hey fellow listers, I just can't contain myself any longer. The latest pictures of my RV are at http://netrover.com/~tjantzi/terry/. Looking forward to seeing many of you at Oshkosh. Terry Jantzi RV-6 C-GZRV ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 21, 1998
From: "Vince S. Himsl" <himsl(at)mail.wsu.edu>
Subject: Re: a question
Hello, I used Havoline 2 cycle oil because that was what was lying around. Cleaning? I am using Variprime and the prep used for that takes care of the oil. Actually, it comes pretty well oiled from Van's if I remember correctly. You'll find a can of that non-flammable spot remover quite useful. It was almost 8 months before I primed the steel parts and I didn't notice any rust. Of course I am in Idaho, %RH @ 20% year round. Welcome to the club! Regards, Vince Himsl RV8 - Wings Moscow, ID USA At 10:29 AM 98.07.21 , you wrote: > > >>Now the question. Having just received my tail kit, Van's suggests >>priming or oiling the steel parts to prevent corrosion before >>building. >>If I oil them, what oil would be best? Mineral oil? Aeroshell 15W/50 >>at $3.50 or so a quart? Used drain oil? Then, best way to remove it >for >>priming later? >> >Scott : > >I would clean & prime now. Otherwise just an 10 weight oil. > > >Don Jordan ~ 76DJ ~ 6A fuselage ~ Arlington,Tx ~ donspawn(at)juno.com > > > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Chris Hinch" <chinch(at)arl.co.nz>
Subject: Meeting at OSH and a question
Date: Jul 22, 1998
> Now the question. Having just received my tail kit, Van's suggests > priming or oiling the steel parts to prevent corrosion before building. Hey, a question I can answer!!! I used a 3M product called SoftSeal, which comes in an spraycan. After cleaning my steel parts, I sprayed this stuff on and then forgot about them. It comes right off with kerosene. As I recall, it cost me $10 for the can, of which I've used about third. It works GREAT! Chris Dunedin, New Zealand, RV80630, HS nearing completion. ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 21, 1998
From: Michael_Markert(at)vul.com (Michael Markert)
Subject: Low-time pilots in RV's
I am wondering if there are many/any RV builders or flyers who have less than 100 hours? Judging by my low flying/building time ratio, I will still be a low-time pilot when my RV-6A is ready to fly. It looks like I'll only have 60-70 hours. However, I am planning on getting at least 10 hours of RV time shortly prior to first flight. Any advice/admonitions are welcome. Also, I'm assuming insurance will be high, any estimates on how high? Thanks Mike Markert RV-6A Empennage ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 21, 1998
From: jerry parr <parravion(at)mcmail.com>
Subject: Idents and TV
Dear Listers Not that I can afford to go to Oshkosh agin until the '6 is flying and paid for (it is a bit further to go from dear old blighty than for you lot who are already on the right site of the pond) but I have a couple of ideas for your Oshkosh identity parade. My idea: Dead boring really, just wear a badge that says 'RV-Lister' and your name. Too easy really, I s'pose! Frankie (my other half) reckons wearing a cleco in the ear should signify something about you being different from others... Which cleco should denote what she hasn't decided yet! The other thing of note is that TV programme mentioned concerning the guy building his aeroplane in 30 days. For some unknown reason we actually endured this documentary last year - strange that it should be before you statesided people. Anyway, without wishing to spoil the plot I really would not recommend wasting three hours of building/drinking/sleeping/hair-washing time to sit down in front of the box and watch it. Yes it really is that bad. And that was the opinion of everyone over here. Anytime an outsider finds out that you are a homebuilder, all you hear is 'oh, you're one of those are you. Did you see that bloke on Channel 4....are you like him? He was a bit strange wasn't he....'etc. Jerry Parr Peterborough, England RV-6 G-RVVI The engine fits, the cowlings don't (yet!) - still we've got 29 days left! ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 21, 1998
From: scott <acepilot(at)mwt.net>
Subject: Re: Check those weldments
Fesenbek, Gary wrote: > > > After I had my canopy frame attached I noticed that the weldment on one > side was only tack welded. Maybe instead of calling it a quick builD they call that quick builT :) Thanks for the heads up...I just got my first installment the other day (tail) and my weldments look beautiful. Notes like these will help keep me outta trouble. Scott... inventory RV4 tail feathers -- Gotta Fly or Gonna Die ! --Ask me about my Aeronca Super Chief-- amended 8-29-97: Now after feeling the "Need for Speed", building an RV-4! Tail kit arrived!! Somewhat regretfully, the Super Chief is now for sale. $8500 :( ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Mike Lauritsen" <clevtool(at)tdsi.net>
Subject: Re: Help for a visitor from Scotland
Date: Jul 21, 1998
Ernie Cleveland's phone number is 708-771-6203 What a nice fellow! Tell him hello from DJ. See you all at Oshkosh maybe. DJ Lauritsen -----Original Message----- From: Bill Costello <bcostello(at)mbsi.net> Date: Tuesday, July 21, 1998 8:56 AM Subject: RV-List: Help for a visitor from Scotland > >Hi Folks, >Hope I am not misusing the list too much. I just met via phone an RV-6 >builder who is arriving in Chicago from Scotland early eve of 23rd of July. He would like to visit someone that eve who is on the fuselage of an RV6 or 6A. I am trying to find Ernie Cleveland's phone number or anyone else who can help me. > >Can you help? Please email me, off-list if you like, to work and home, if I can impose on you so much. Addresses are: > bcostello(at)mbsi.net and > bcostello3(at)juno.com >Since this is pretty much the last hour, I certainly would appreciate the help today. If before 4 Chi time, you can just email to the mbsi address. > >Sorry for the intrusion and thanks much to anyone who can help.l > >Bill > > > > > > > name="Cleaveland Aircraft Tool.vcf" filename="Cleaveland Aircraft Tool.vcf" BEGIN:VCARD VERSION:2.1 N:Tool;Cleaveland Aircraft FN:Cleaveland Aircraft Tool ORG:Cleaveland Aircraft Tool TEL;WORK;VOICE:515-432-6794 TEL;WORK;FAX:515-432-7804 ADR;WORK:;;2225 First St.;Boone;Iowa;50036;USA Iowa 50036=3D0D=3D0AUSA URL: URL:http://www.cleavelandtool.com EMAIL;PREF;INTERNET:clevtool(at)tdsi.net REV:19980721T220137Z END:VCARD ________________________________________________________________________________
From: AcroII(at)aol.com
Date: Jul 21, 1998
Subject: Re: WD-40 for Rust Protection
Having (almost) built a tube & rag airplane, I can assure you that WD-40 will protect the steel parts from rusting, but only for a short time. You will have to re-apply regularly. Couple times a month or more if it's very humid. Tom De Winter ________________________________________________________________________________
From: AcroII(at)aol.com
Date: Jul 21, 1998
Subject: Re: exhaust(vetterman vs spruce)
I have the A/C Spruce x-over on my Acro Sport (O-360). I didn't want the muffler / heatmuff that Spruce sells. Looked too big & heavy. When I checked out the muffs that Van sells and the end plates for rolling your own, I found that they are all designed for 1-3/4" pipes. The Spruce ones are 2" from the bell joint aft. Had to make my own from scratch. Have you ever heard a bad word about Vetterman Exhaust? Buy the best and cry once. Regards, Tom De Winter Acro Sport II - cabin heat system RV-6 next? ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 21, 1998
From: pagan <pagan(at)CBOSS.COM>
Subject: Re: Low-time pilots in RV's
> > > I am wondering if there are many/any RV builders or flyers who have less than > 100 hours? > > Mike Markert > RV-6A Empennage Good question Mike, I've wondered the same myself as I am also a very low time pilot, (63hrs, but adding) having earned my PP-ASEL after starting my project. Bill Pagan -8 (80555) wing things > > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Allan.Gibson(at)fluordaniel.com
Date: Jul 22, 1998
Subject: Electronic testers
If you have to ask you cant afford one.... Nice meter but there are MUCH cheaper ones that still work well. ______________________________ Reply Separator _________________________________ Subject: Re: RV-List: Electronic testers Date: 21-07-98 05:37 I have been useing the Fluke 77/BN for the last several years at work with absolutly no problems. I'm not exactly sure how much they sell for retail, but it does have some very nice features. It turns it self off after about 30 min or inactivity, uses one regular 9vdc battery, and has an awsome protective cover that really helps when your fingers get a little slipery (go ahead ask me how I know!). I'll look around and see if I can find out how much they are, but I wouldn't expect it to cost too much.... Nick Nafsinger Off the coast of Hawaii, USS Carl Vinson Still dreaming of a -6 ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 21, 1998
From: Paul Besing <rv8er(at)doitnow.com>
Subject: Re: Low-time pilots in RV's
Your not alone, Mike...I have about 90 hours myself...It will be interesting to hear the responses on this one.. Paul Besing RV-6A (197AB)Arizona Panel > > I am wondering if there are many/any RV builders or flyers who have less than > 100 hours? > > Judging by my low flying/building time ratio, I will still be a low-time pilot > when my RV-6A is ready to fly. It looks like I'll only have 60-70 hours. > However, I am planning on getting at least 10 hours of RV time shortly prior to > first flight. > > Any advice/admonitions are welcome. > > Also, I'm assuming insurance will be high, any estimates on how high? > > Thanks > > Mike Markert > RV-6A Empennage > > > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Chris Hinch" <chinch(at)arl.co.nz>
Subject: Low-time pilots in RV's
Date: Jul 22, 1998
> > I am wondering if there are many/any RV builders or flyers who have less > than > > 100 hours? Well, I've logged 100 hours, so I know just enough to be dangerous, right? About 30 hours of that is aerobatics. No taildragger rating. I'm guessing that I'll need to get at least another 50 under my belt (taildragger rating and lots of time in something RV like, maybe a Pitts?) before I'm going to be able to even step into my RV-8. Chris Hinch RV Builder 80630 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "TOMMY E. WALKER" <twsurveyor(at)email.msn.com>
Subject: Re: Low-time pilots in RV's
Date: Jul 21, 1998
-----Original Message----- From: Michael Markert <Michael_Markert(at)vul.com> Date: Tuesday, July 21, 1998 4:36 PM Subject: RV-List: Low-time pilots in RV's > > I am wondering if there are many/any RV builders or flyers who have less than > 100 hours? > > Mike Markert > RV-6A Empennage > >Mike, I've been thinking about that very thing. I have 300 hrs and am instrument rated, but kind of have "cold feet" about that first flight! In talking to my RV buddies they assure me that if I can fly a 152 I won't have any problem. Somehow that doesn't relieve my mind much! I'm very much interested in the responce on this one. Tommy 6A Wing tips > > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "John Fasching" <jfasching(at)hotmail.com>
Subject: Re: Low-time pilots in RV's
Date: Jul 21, 1998
I had only 55 hours (dual and solo) when I flew the RV-6A the first time. BUT I got 7hrs of dual from Mike Segar in Van's red RV-6B; the RV is not like anything you flew before if you are a typical low time pilot. Its definately NOT a Cessna 172/150/152. GET SOME DUAL. BTW the first flight was a breeze. Even greased it on. (tho' my significant other believed she'd never see me again in one piece! ________________________________________________________________________________
From: DFaile(at)aol.com
Date: Jul 21, 1998
Subject: Re: Low-time pilots in RV's
<< I am wondering if there are many/any RV builders or flyers who have less than > 100 hours? >> We have checked out several low time pilots in their RV's. This happens after the time is flown off by experienced pilots and dual can now be given in the RV. Most FSDO's will not allow anyone other than the pilot flying off the test time to be in the aircraft when it is flying, until that test time is complete and the paperwork is complete. The rule is only required crew members on board during test flying. After the test period, it is usually a matter of learning a new airplane with an appropriate Certificated Flight Instructor. For most low time pilots, it is a complete check out. I think the RV6A flys better than most Cessnas and Pipers. My experience is that it lands better than both of the above. A good place to use your EAA Flight Advisor to make sure you have a qualified CFI. david faile, fairfield, ct mcfii/a&p eaa technical counselor/flight advisor christen eagle ii since '82 (n13bf) rv6 n44df started ________________________________________________________________________________
From: DFaile(at)aol.com
Date: Jul 21, 1998
Subject: Re: WD-40 for Rust Protection
<< I can assure you that WD-40 will protect the steel parts from rusting, but only for a short time. >> The "WD" in WD40 stands for Water Displacing. Another product that protects well is LPS. it comes in three forms, LPS 1, LPS 2, and LPS 3. Each variation is better at protecting as the number goes up. I do not know a lot about removing it before painting, but I would do the same final cleaning (thinner, etc.) before priming. david faile, fairfield, ct mcfii/a&p eaa technical counselor/flight advisor christen eagle ii since '82 (n13bf) rv6 n44df started ________________________________________________________________________________
From: KBoatri144(at)aol.com
Date: Jul 21, 1998
Subject: Fuse Jig for Sale... (Atlanta, GA)
I should be finished with my fuselage jig in 1.5 to 2 weeks. It will need a new home at that time, so I can open up some space in the garage (er.. shop). It is made of plywood and dimensional lumber, and was accurate to +/- 1/16" when built. It should move fairly easily, and at $100, the price is right. Drop me a note (off-list) if you are interested. Kyle Boatright ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 21, 1998
Subject: shoe goo
From: rvpilot(at)Juno.com (William R. Davis Jr)
Listers, Some one mentioned "Shoe Goo" adhesive on the list about a week or so ago. Have not seen this stuff around, what stores might carry it? Thanks for the help. Regards, Bill, RV4, N66WD ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 21, 1998
From: "Flying Phil's Circus" <sisson(at)ctnet.net>
Subject: Re: Fuse Jig for Sale... (Atlanta, GA)
Kyle and anyone else who is interested. Your fuselage jig can be sawed in two and reassembled if needs to be. I hauled mine from Seattle area in a pickup truck to the midwest. It is built just like yours. When I got it in position I spliced the sides back together again using a peice of 2x6 on each side and about 8 or 10 deck screws. I allowed a small gap for the saw kerf . It is solid and accurate. Phil KBoatri144(at)aol.com wrote: > > I should be finished with my fuselage jig in 1.5 to 2 weeks. It will > need a > new home at that time, so I can open up some space in the garage (er.. > shop). > It is made of plywood and dimensional lumber, and was accurate to +/- > 1/16" > when built. It should move fairly easily, and at $100, the price is > right. > > Drop me a note (off-list) if you are interested. > > Kyle Boatright > ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 21, 1998
From: Mark Graf <markgraf(at)SprintMail.com>
Subject: Re: Low-time pilots in RV's
Dear Listers, Those with low time: Yep, been there, I had about 85 hours when I started transition training in our RV-6. I had the benefit of two excellent people, Bill Mitchell and Mas Yoshida in the Denver Area that helped me get past some of those early crashes and dashes, and roundy rounds. I found most helpful that during my initial training, I was taught to follow the numbers, you know Cessena 172 numbers around a square pattern, etc. During my training (which is ongoing) I was taught to look outside the cockpit for entire circuits of the field, don't look at the airspeed, altimeter, and all of those clocks. Yes I had some embarashing times, and yes, I took her off the runway twice when I didn't have anyone with me, but....now....I am almost comfortable with the bird. One problem was cross wind landings. Reason one, I had trained in the tri gear, and it just doesn't land the same, and two, the RV is very good at minimizing the cross winds, so I didn't have to get after the aircraft until the winds got higher, and I got nervous. Like I said, two excursions off the runway, two runway lights down. No damage other than cosmetic, and of course to my ego. My wife says that three more and I am an Ace (She is also the one the told me, do you want an airplane or a museum piece, the answer,,,I fly the airplane). Short version: Find an old taildragger instructor....Fly....Fly....Fly. Find a second taildragger instructor....Fly....Fly...Fly. Be safe and have a good time. Mark Graf N71CG RV-6 150 hp Denver CO Three more and I'm an Ace ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Joe Rex" <jfr(at)ix.netcom.com>
Subject: Painting over powder coat
Date: Jul 21, 1998
Just got my -4 engine mount back from being powder coated. Looks great, but there are a couple of spots where the paint is a little thin. Can you paitnt over powder coat, and if so how should I prep it? Joe Rex ________________________________________________________________________________
From: RichH10453(at)aol.com
Date: Jul 21, 1998
Subject: Re: Low-time pilots in RV's
You are a fool if you don't get some dual prior to testing your expensive multiyear investment. I had 350 hours in mostly high wing trainer types before getting one and 1/2 hours of dual training for my RV6A. I was good to go after that, but it's definitely different.....thank god. Richard Hartin Cedar Park, Tx RV6A Purchased ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 21, 1998
From: MICHAEL <lottmc(at)datasync.com>
Subject: Re: Low-time pilots in RV's
Hey! You guys had to start somewhere. Your off to a great start. Keep going! ________________________________________________________________________________
From: MOOREWAR(at)aol.com
Date: Jul 21, 1998
Subject: greetings
Have been listening in on the list for a few months now, wish I had started sooner as you guys and the archives are a great help. Been working on my -4 for about 20 months, finished with the tail, wings, and have the fuselage in the canoe stage now. Working in my Huntington Beach, Ca garage while my car rusts away in the salt air. Oh well. Not sure where I will do the the final assembly which is about 6 mo. away. Maybe Corolla, Riverside -Flabob, or Chino -- any suggestions? Any other OC/ Long Beach builders want to swap notes or need a hand with a bucking bar please don't hesitate to contact me. ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Brian Denk" <akroguy(at)hotmail.com>
Subject: Re: shoe goo
Date: Jul 21, 1998
> >Listers, > > >Some one mentioned "Shoe Goo" adhesive on the list about a week or so >ago. Have not seen this stuff around, what stores might carry it? Thanks >for the help. > > >Regards, Bill, RV4, N66WD Bill, It was I that mentioned it. It can be found in most Walgreens type stores, even supermarkets where you find household items like glue, tape, screws, etc. I have also found it in the adhesives aisle at Home Depot. Try it..you'll like it! Brian Denk http://geocities.com/CapeCanaveral/Hangar/9656/index.html RV-8 #379 Fuse bulkheads under way ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "J. Farrar" <fourazjs(at)email.msn.com>
Subject: Re: shoe goo
Date: Jul 21, 1998
Bill, I bought two tubes at a large sporting goods store that sells athletic shoes. I imagine that a place like Footlocker might have it. Jeff Farrar, RV8A, Empennage done waiting for QB, Chandler, AZ -----Original Message----- From: William R. Davis Jr <rvpilot(at)Juno.com> Date: Tuesday, July 21, 1998 6:43 PM Subject: RV-List: shoe goo > >Listers, > > >Some one mentioned "Shoe Goo" adhesive on the list about a week or so >ago. Have not seen this stuff around, what stores might carry it? Thanks >for the help. > > >Regards, Bill, RV4, N66WD > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Morrissey, John" <John.Morrissey(at)its.csiro.au>
Subject: Low-time pilots in RV's
Date: Jul 22, 1998
Hi All, Having flown an RV4, RV6 and the 6A - you guys in a 6A should have no real problems in converting to the type. The best thing I can suggest is that you go and get yourself into a Grumman Tiger or a Mooney for a few hours. Both of these aircraft are relatively slippery in the circuit and require you to begin to slow down early so that you can get the numbers right on your final approach. As for getting time in a Pitts - If you can get one of them on the ground in a nice way then you will have no trouble with an RV. As a taildragger the RV is very well behaved and as a Trike its a non-event. Now should you do the first flight - well that's up to your own assessment of your abilities. I would strongly suggest a fair bit of practice in engine failure landings before you hop into your nice new RV as this is going to be your main danger on a first flight. Tie the tail down and do a run-up to full power - if everything appears to be running smoothly then you should not run into any major problems on the first flight. High speed taxy tests - well I've seen more damage than good done during this type of testing. Some guys have no problems and for them this is a good way to build confidence while others go skidding and weaving all over the place - again a matter of personal skill and preference. Good luck happy flying John Morrissey -----Original Message----- From: TOMMY E. WALKER [mailto:twsurveyor(at)email.msn.com] Sent: Wednesday, July 22, 1998 10:33 AM Subject: Re: RV-List: Low-time pilots in RV's -----Original Message----- From: Michael Markert <Michael_Markert(at)vul.com> Date: Tuesday, July 21, 1998 4:36 PM Subject: RV-List: Low-time pilots in RV's Markert) > > I am wondering if there are many/any RV builders or flyers who have less than > 100 hours? > > Mike Markert > RV-6A Empennage > >Mike, I've been thinking about that very thing. I have 300 hrs and am instrument rated, but kind of have "cold feet" about that first flight! In talking to my RV buddies they assure me that if I can fly a 152 I won't have any problem. Somehow that doesn't relieve my mind much! I'm very much interested in the responce on this one. Tommy 6A Wing tips > > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 21, 1998
From: Joe Larson <jpl(at)showpg.mn.org.showpg.mn.org>
Subject: Re: a question
> >Now the question. Having just received my tail kit, Van's suggests > >priming or oiling the steel parts to prevent corrosion before > >building. > > I would clean & prime now. Otherwise just an 10 weight oil. Another recommendation -- prime *everything* now. Okay, maybe not the exterior of the skins, but everything else. If you prime it all now (while the weather cooperates) you won't wonder what to do come winter when it's too cold. AND you won't have to keep getting out the spray gun and everything. Just take a day and prime everything up front. In Van's directions, he tells you that you'll be able to read the part numbers through the primer. This is *mostly* true. However, it's a real pain when it's not true. Take steps to make sure you can identify the parts once they are primed. You can tell what most of them are, anyways, but you can still waste a lot of time a few minutes here, a few there, trying to match the part in your hand with a small drawing in the plans. -Joe RV-6A wings in jig, fuse on order ________________________________________________________________________________
From: MAlexan533(at)aol.com
Date: Jul 21, 1998
Subject: RV-8 Fuse-Jig, Oregon
Have RV-8 fuse jig available now, comes apart into 2 pieces. $95.00. Located Salem, Or. just off I-5. Straight, dry wood. Von Alexander MAlexan533(at)aol.com ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Low-time pilots in RV's
From: smcdaniels(at)Juno.com (SCOTT R MCDANIELS)
Date: Jul 21, 1998
I'll give my 2 cents worth. I am certainly know authority on compairing RV's to other certified aircraft that most pilots are probably familiar with, though I did test fly my 6A with about 225 hours of total flight time in a variety of single fixed gear Piper and Cessna's. I also had the chance to fly about 15 hours in each of a Grumman Cheeta and a Katchina Varga. The thing that seems to give a lot of pilots trouble with an RV (if they haven't flown anything with similar performance) is that they tend to get behind the airplane. A typical RV's best rate of climb speed is about the same as a C-150 in maxed out cruise. So some adjustments compaired to what you are accustomed to are in order, but I think mike or any of the other instructors that give dual in RV's would agree that a 100 hr pilot can be safe in an RV if they get some dual from an instructor before hand. As for doing the first test flight with that little flying experience? That's one that you will have to decide. I'm sure one of the RV instructors or an EAA flight advisor would be glad to help you make that decision. As for flying quality differences... The controls are much more responsive than most pilots are accustomed to, but it usually takes only a short time to feel comfortable with the amount of control that you hold in your hand. Keeping ahead of the airplane can take a little more effort for someone only familiar with a C-152 or similar. Fortunately an RV will fly slowly as well as fast and while getting familiar with the airplane, making an effort to use much lower power setting than is available, seems to help some new RV pilots. Unless you are breaking in a new engine, then that's not really what you want to do. Some of this is also more good reasons for flying at least the first few hours with the gear leg fairings and wheel pants removed. It lets you keep the power settings higher without having as much airspeed (for engine brake-in), and it gives you more drag to help in slowing down when you need to. Bottom line - The best advice for anyone who has not flown (I don't mean been on a demo flight, I mean actually flown a full flight in an RV) is to find someone that is a CFI that has done dual training in RV's. A CFI that hasn't given dual in an RV I guess is better than nothing, but one with RV experience would be preferred. I have given demo flights to CFI's that it was obvious that they would have needed a few hours them self just to feel comfortable in the airplane. My 2 cents are up. Hope this is of some value to someone P.S. What ever you decide, it is highly recommended that you try and fly regularly (at least a couple times a week) as you get close to your first flight in an RV (regardless of whether it is the airplanes first flight or not). Scott McDaniels These opinions and ideas are my own and do not necessarily reflect the opinions of my employer. ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 21, 1998
From: Joe Larson <jpl(at)showpg.mn.org.showpg.mn.org>
Subject: Re: Low-time pilots in RV's
> > I am wondering if there are many/any RV builders or flyers who have less > than > > 100 hours? I've asked around and also have a small amount of stick time in a -6 and a -4. The general concensus is -- 1. This is a responsive airplane. Do NOT try to first flight without any RV stick time. 2. Mike @ Van's is a great source for some dual. 3. Low time pilots can handle this airplane if they approach with respect and caution. (That is -- see #1.) There's a good chance my wife will learn to fly in the RV. Doug Weiler and John Morgan both thought this was doable when I asked them both in May, but pointed out she probably won't solo at 8 hours like she might in a 152. John said, "Whatever you get used to will seem 'right'." The largest concern I have in this airplane for new pilots is learning how to slow down. You do *not* want to enter the pattern at 160 knots. Back to building. -J ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 21, 1998
From: Mike Denman <mikedenman(at)earthlink.net>
Subject: Re: Painting over powder coat
Hi Joe, I have had the same problem on occassion. The easiest thing to do is take it back to your powder coater and have them fix it. Apparently they can fix it without stripping it back down to bare metal. I haven't watched them do it but I get the impression that they reclean it, shoot it again and run it back through the oven. At any rate, my parts came back looking great. Mike Denman RV6 Pay attention to the details. Sweat the small shit! Joe Rex wrote: > > Just got my -4 engine mount back from being powder coated. Looks great, but > there are a couple of spots where the paint is a little thin. ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 21, 1998
From: "Michael J. Robbins" <kitfox(at)gte.net>
Subject: OSH 2 meter ham frequencies
Mitch & Scott; Thanks for the info. Mike Robbins (San Jose State 1969) Issaquah, WA RV-8 N7LHM & Jennifer N7LHT > >There is a simplex repeater on 147.425 (REC.AVIATION, 107.2PL) ) > >Mitch Faatz San Jose, CA N727MF (reserved) >RV-6AQME working on the sliding canopy... >KN6NC, will be on either 2 meter or 440 simplex frequencies > >47.345 + has great coverage. My old (1994) repeater directory lists a PL of 107.2. Scott N0EDV ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 22, 1998
From: Tim Bronson <TBronson(at)compuserve.com>
Subject: Re: Low-time pilots in RV's
Forgive me for being too quick to delete. Someone (the names escape my memory as well as my computer's) posted the question about low time pilots flying RV's, and several others expressed interest in the answers that should be forthcoming from the list. Here's one, with a disclaimer: I have looked at many RV's, sat in one, and flown in none. However, I have been around the patch once or twice. For those of you who are interested in the the subject of low time pilots in RV's, you have already cleared the first hurdle. While low time in type is a factor in some mishaps, this pilot's opinion is that what's in your logbook or what's on your resume is of much less import than what resides in the old gray matter. Attitude is everything. If your approach is: "I hear they're easy to fly, and I'm not worried about it," I suppose we'll all be hearing about you soon. On the other hand, if you get some dual IN TYPE from a competent instructor, and exercise good common sense, you'll still be flying when I'm finally finished with my RV, and I'll be asking YOU questions about flying it. Never be embarassed about: Getting more dual Cancelling a flight (even if it's just because "something doesn't feel right") Diverting to a different airport (longer runway, less crosswind, etc.) Going around Before you know it you'll be saying: "I've got ____ hours, mostly in RV's." Keep your eyes and ears open. Good luck and have fun. And here's a question: what kind of problems do "high-time" pilots have when transitioning to RV's? None, of course, because we know it all. Right? ; ) Tim Pittsburgh 23-year "student" pilot RV-8 this fall ________________________________________________________________________________
From: JRWillJR(at)aol.com
Date: Jul 22, 1998
Subject: Re: Oiling parts/corrosion
LPS # I think is the number that is great for longer term corrosion/rust proofing.JR ________________________________________________________________________________
From: wvu(at)mail.ameritel.net
Date: Jul 22, 1998
Subject: Re: Low-time pilots in RV's
I've recently gotten a few quotes from Insurance companies. I have 300 hours total time, none in RV's (I'm looking to buy an RV-6). I don't have any tail dragger time either. Base on this and a few more items: aircraft will be hangared, at least 5 hours in type, aircraft value of $50K, $1 million liability, $100K for passengar, EAA member, let see what else.... AVEMCO quoted me for $2000, $2200 if not an EAA member. Local AOPA Underwriter quoted $1200. I'm waiting for a few other companies so take these figures for what they're worth. Seems like a wide spread between companies so far. Looking for quotes from an Underwriter seems a lot more attractive so far. By the way, I'm looking to get time in RV-6's. If any CFI near Maryland who owns an RV-6 can help ou, please let me know. Anh > >Your not alone, Mike...I have about 90 hours myself...It will be interesting >to hear the responses on this one.. > >Paul Besing >RV-6A (197AB)Arizona >Panel > > >> >> I am wondering if there are many/any RV builders or flyers who have less than >> 100 hours? >> >> Judging by my low flying/building time ratio, I will still be a low-time >pilot >> when my RV-6A is ready to fly. It looks like I'll only have 60-70 hours. >> However, I am planning on getting at least 10 hours of RV time shortly >prior to >> first flight. >> >> Any advice/admonitions are welcome. >> >> Also, I'm assuming insurance will be high, any estimates on how high? >> >> Thanks >> >> Mike Markert >> RV-6A Empennage >> >> >> >> >> > > > > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 22, 1998
From: Tim Bronson <TBronson(at)compuserve.com>
Subject: shoe goo
Bill wrote: From: JRWillJR(at)aol.com
Date: Jul 22, 1998
Subject: Re: compass fluid
How about triple refined Whisky--that is why they call it a Whisky Compass.JR ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Rvator97(at)aol.com
Date: Jul 22, 1998
Subject: Re: Low-time pilots in RV's
In my case: I had about 180 hrs total time when I made my first flight. (None in the last twelve months.... before spending 4 hours with Mike Seager. The time with Mike was the key to a sucessful first flight. In my opinion, any pilot with 75 - 100 hours will not have a problem handing an RV, as long as you get the dual time with Seager in an RV just prior to that first flight. He keeps working you until he knows you can handle it. Walt. RV-6A N79WH (52 hrs now!) ________________________________________________________________________________
From: WoodardRod(at)aol.com
Date: Jul 22, 1998
Subject: Re: shoe goo
In a message dated 7/21/98 8:25:09 PM Mountain Daylight Time, rvpilot(at)Juno.com writes: > Some one mentioned "Shoe Goo" adhesive on the list about a week or so > ago. Have not seen this stuff around, what stores might carry it? Thanks > for the help. > I've usually seen it near the checkout lanes in the Wal-Mart, K-Mart, Target type stores. If not there, try the sporting goods section near the sports teeth protectors (mouthpieces). Rod Woodard Loveland, Colorado World renouned Shoe Goo authority ________________________________________________________________________________
From: MAlexan533(at)aol.com
Date: Jul 22, 1998
Subject: Looking for engine; RV-8
Listers in the Northwest; I am ready to buy an engine for my RV-8. Will consider either an 0-320 or an 0-360, fixed prop compatible or constant speed. Any leads for a fellow lister? Thanks. Von Alexander Salem, Or. MAlexan533(at)aol.com ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 22, 1998
From: Mark Nielsen <Mark.Nielsen@fiedler-lp.com>
Subject: Re: Low-time pilots in RV's
> > I am wondering if there are many/any RV builders or flyers who have less than > 100 hours? > > Judging by my low flying/building time ratio, I will still be a low-time pilot > when my RV-6A is ready to fly. It looks like I'll only have 60-70 hours. > However, I am planning on getting at least 10 hours of RV time shortly prior to > first flight. > Mike: I started taking flying lessons (in a C150) in 1991, the same time I started my RV-6. (Yes, I built the tail dragger.) I got my private ticket in December 1991; my total time was 51 hours. Shortly thereafter, I quit flying because I couldn't afford to both build and fly. In the summer of 1995 I got about 5 hours of dual in a Champ; this included some training in spins and loops. I also got 1.1 hours with Mike Seager in the RV-6 prototype. I then layed off again. In March 1997, I got a couple of hours of dual in a Champ and a couple of hours in a C150 for my biennial flight review. I then went to Oregon and got 8.1 hours with Mike in the RV-6. Almost all of this time was spent in the pattern. During the next four weeks I had three more dual sessions (Champ & C150 again) to help me remember to keep the blue side up and the green side down. The first flight in my RV-6 was on April 18, 1997. Joe Schumacher from EAA was kind enough to fly his SX300 up from Oshkosh to Green Bay to make the first flight for me. (Although I wanted to, I didn't think that it was too smart to make the first flight myself.) Joe told me that my airplane flew "beautifully" so I made the second first flight the following day -- solo. My log book indicated a total time of just under 75 hours. I spent the first 10-15 hours in my RV-6 getting comfortable and just flying the airplane. I mainly did turns, slow flight, stalls and landings. I started a test program after that. I was also very cautious about what the wind was doing for the first 40 to 50 hours. If there was much of a x-wind, I wouldn't fly. I now have put 246 hours on my RV, but I still consider myself to be a novice pilot. I try to get better each time I fly. Everyone asks me how my ariplane flies. I tell them that it is a fun little airplane to fly. I always add however, that I am unqualified to make comparisons since for all practical purposes, the RV-6 is the only airplane that I am familiar with. (Don't ALL airplanes fly like an RV....) > > Also, I'm assuming insurance will be high, any estimates on how high? > I got full coverage from AVEMCO for the first year. This included first flight coverage. To get this coverage, I participated in the EAA flight advisor program and got a log book sign-off from Mike Seager stating that I had completed the factory training program. The cost was around $1900. When the policy came up for renewal, AVEMCO offered about a 10% reduction in premium, but I found adequate coverage elsewhere for a significantly lower price. Mark Nielsen Green Bay, WI ________________________________________________________________________________
From: JRWillJR(at)aol.com
Date: Jul 22, 1998
Subject: Re: Oiling parts/corrosion
Sorry to duplicate posts but it was LPS #3 that is good for long term corrosion proofing --not the #1 I said earlier--sorry about that. JR ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 22, 1998
From: jim jewell <jjewell(at)okanagan.net>
Subject: Re: Low-time No-timers in RV's
Hello listers: With all the talk about high and low times currently about. I am forced to ask if there are any other fools with no-time such as I that have bought an RV6-eh, oops, I mean RV6-a kit and started building like a happy madman. For almost a year and a half I've been pushing my cat away and stareing at the plans, reading, various manuals over and over, lurking the list, screwing up parts,drilling holes in everything including my fingers. I,ve taken to wandering around hardware stores, equipment supliers and even junk dealers like some kind of drooling degenerate tool junkie muttering words like clecoe, countersink cage, dimple dies and vise grip dimplers. Vice grip what?! the guy in the local tool outlet said, I slunk away to my two car RV lair to call long distance yet again. All this time I thought high times were ripping lids off of kit boxes,getting new tools and parts in the mail and taking the horizontal stab etc. out off it's jig. Low times have been like when I drilled a hole in my finger,dropped the drill motor on my toe and damaged the part I had so carefully prepared all in one somewhat less than gracefull motion. Now you listers are telling me There are other kinds of RV builders other than no timers, well who'd a thunk? If it ain't one thing it's another. WHERE'S THAT PHONE BOOK DAMN IT! gee's now I've got to start getting in some hours on top of everything else. Hmmm... flying schools......--I wonder what this'll cost-----------?. What do they call no timers like me that hang around airports, runway rats?, apron idiots? hanger hoods mabe?. A chance for yet another new identity, Ah Life is sweet!!. Please don't tell me I'm the only no-timer out here. Come on you guys fess up. no-time jim RV6-eh tanks in Kelowna B.C. Canada When dreams come true the sky is the limit. ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 22, 1998
From: jim jewell <jjewell(at)okanagan.net>
Subject: Re: shoe goo
> >In a message dated 7/21/98 8:25:09 PM Mountain Daylight Time, rvpilot(at)Juno.com >writes: >> Some one mentioned "Shoe Goo" the answer; I've usually seen it near the checkout lanes in the Wal-Mart, K-Mart, Target >type stores. If not there, try the sporting goods section near the sports >teeth protectors (mouthpieces). "Shoo Goo" and mouthpieces! sure creates quite a picture don't ya think? I would'nt get in the ring with that dude!, adds definition to the word determination don't it?!!!. no time jim When dreams come true the sky is the limit. ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 22, 1998
From: Fran Malczynski <fmalczy(at)ibm.net>
Subject: RV-List Shoe Goo
Bill, I found "Shoe Goo" in the shoe department at Wal-Mart. Stuff works great....Thanks Brian Denk Fran Malczynski RV6 (Closing Wings) Olcott, NY ________________________________________________________________________________
From: KBoatri144(at)aol.com
Date: Jul 22, 1998
Subject: Re: Fuse Jig for Sale... (Atlanta, GA)
By the way, this is a fuse jig for an RV-6. KB ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Zeidman, Richard B" <Richard.Zeidman(at)PHL.Boeing.com>
Subject: Electric Flap Option
Date: Jul 22, 1998
Listers- I'm getting ready to order the fuselage kit for my RV6a and I can't decide whether or not to order the electric flap option. Does anyone have opinions pro or con as to the necessity or ease of installation. Has anyone experienced a failure? Thanks, Rich Zeidman SN 25224 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Rv4george(at)aol.com
Date: Jul 22, 1998
Subject: Re: Sequence of tasks in building an RV
Hi: I'd like to thank Scott A. Jordan for the lead he gave me. I also wish to thank Hal Kempthorne for his engineering outline for product management. I suppose I could have called it "order of building" to make it clearer. Or"what to do next". I also thank Scott McDaniels for putting me on the right track in searching out those builders who have written of their building experiences. I am doing just that now. I have obtained a phenomenal write up of building instructions written by Frank Justice for a RV-6 not prepunched off the internet. This is so detailed that I wont need any other,it's 7/8" thick. Thanks to all. Jim George RV-4 Building Wings with new enthusiasm Rv4George(at)AOL.com ________________________________________________________________________________
From: RVer273sb(at)aol.com
Date: Jul 22, 1998
Subject: Re: Electric Flap Option
Rich, I've only got 155hrs on 4 with electric flaps, but have had no problems. A whle ago some one was having problems blowing 5 amp fuses ect. must have had a poor installation. I use a 1 amp breaker with a redundant flap switch. The single throw, double pole spring loaded center off switch allows 2 contacts for each position. If say one contact welds shut, the other will open. The breaker can also be used as a switch to kill power if necessary. RV4 RVer273sb ________________________________________________________________________________
From: RVer273sb(at)aol.com
Date: Jul 22, 1998
Subject: Re: Electric Flap Option
Rich, I've only got 155hrs on 4 with electric flaps, but have had no problems. A whle ago some one was having problems blowing 5 amp fuses ect. must have had a poor installation. I use a 1 amp breaker with a redundant flap switch. The single throw, double pole spring loaded center off switch allows 2 contacts for each position. If say one contact welds shut, the other will open. The breaker can also be used as a switch to kill power if necessary. RV4 RVer273sb ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 22, 1998
From: Craig Hiers <craig-RV4(at)worldnet.att.net>
Subject: Re: Low-time No-timers in RV's
jim jewell wrote: > Now you listers are telling me There are other kinds of RV builders other > than no timers, well who'd a thunk? > If it ain't one thing it's another. WHERE'S THAT PHONE BOOK DAMN IT! > gee's now I've got to start getting in some hours on top of everything else. > Hmmm... flying schools......--I wonder what this'll cost-----------?. > > What do they call no timers like me that hang around airports, runway rats?, > apron idiots? hanger hoods mabe?. > A chance for yet another new identity, Ah Life is sweet!!. > Please don't tell me I'm the only no-timer out here. Come on you guys fess up. > > no-time jim RV6-eh tanks in Kelowna B.C. Canada > When dreams come true the sky is the limit. > Jim If truth be told, I have 0.0 hours of log book flight time. Thats the bad news, the good news is my -4 will be finished in 6-8 weeks. I really thought I would be more exited about getting my P.P. ticket, I'm more interested in getting the plane in the air than taking time away from the project to go fly some damn airplane. My backs aginst the wall now. Craig Hiers Tallahassee,FL RV-4 N143CH ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 22, 1998
From: wntzl(at)execpc.com (David M Wentzell)
Subject: Re: RV-Listers - Oshkosh Id. Solution
Hello, There has been a thread as to how to identify ourselves at Oshkosh. How about this - pick up your sticker at Van's tent, stick it on your hat, shirt, or forehead. The price is right (free),(my donation - I'm a printer!) I am willing to do this and follow through IF the interest is there, If not I will continue to spend my time fluting my wing ribs! Do we have any interest? David Wentzell, Racine, WI RV-6 Wings ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 22, 1998
From: Edward Cole <emcole(at)ix.netcom.com>
Subject: Engines Manuals
Listers, Does anyone have access to a Lycoming parts manual that coverrs the "C" series Lycomings, specifically an IO-360 C1C. I need the part number for the sump. I have a manual for the "B" series, but it is of no help. Please respond direct to my email address. Thanks-- Ed Cole RV6A Fuselage skins. ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Mlfred(at)aol.com
Date: Jul 22, 1998
Subject: Re: Low-time No-timers in RV's
<< If truth be told, I have 0.0 hours of log book flight time. Thats the bad news, the good news is my -4 will be finished in 6-8 weeks. I really thought I would be more exited about getting my P.P. ticket, I'm more interested in getting the plane in the air than taking time away from the project to go fly some damn airplane. My backs aginst the wall now. Craig Hiers Tallahassee,FL RV-4 N143CH >> Craig: Why don't you see if you can get an exemption to ride in the thing during the fly-off period? A friendly FAA type just might allow this, if you have installed full dual controls. It sure would speed up your flight training!! You are gonna LOVE this airplane! I'm not going to say anything about building an a/c and not having a license- I bought a C-140, and then had to learn to fly the thing. Oh, the decisions I made during my mis-spent days of youth... If you need an RV qualified CFI, give me a call. Check six! Mark HR2 Austin, TX ________________________________________________________________________________
From: resteffe(at)dukeengineering.com
Date: Jul 22, 1998
Subject: Re: Low-time pilots in RV's
I had about 100 hours, all in a Citabria, before I made the first flight in my RV-6. I had a couple of demo rides in an RV, hour of dual acrobatics in an Pitts S2A, and a couple of rides in a Yak-52. My RV-6 was the second plane I ever flew solo.Had to make the first flight myself. I just knew I could do it. Would I do it again? Even though it seems dumb in hindsight, if I had that same feeling of confidence I did then, I would...... Now when I finish the Pitts Super Stinker I'm now building.....we'll see... Dick Steffens, RV-6 - flying, Pitts S1-11- welding fuselage. ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 22, 1998
From: charles(at)onramp.net (charles young)
Subject: Exhaust For Sale
Allan Tolle Exhaust System for Lycoming 360, new, $300.00 plus shipping. Contact Charles(at)Onramp.Net. ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 22, 1998
From: "Bill Costello" <bcostello(at)mbsi.net>
Subject: Re: RV-Listers - Oshkosh Id. Solution
David Wentzell wrote: Hello, How about this - pick up your sticker at Van's tent, stick it on your hat, shirt, or forehead. Do we have any interest? David Wentzell, Racine, WI RV-6 Wings I think it is a great idea. Make it so you can pin it on a hat as well as stick it on. Can spot each other while drooling on the RVs on the line. Bill Costello ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 23, 1998
From: Frank van der Hulst <frankv(at)pec.co.nz>
Subject: Re: Sequence of tasks in building an RV
Rv4george(at)aol.com wrote: > I have obtained a phenomenal write up of building instructions > written by Frank Justice for a RV-6 not prepunched off the > internet. This is so detailed that I wont need any > other,it's 7/8" thick. > Jim George > RV-4 Building Wings with new enthusiasm Jim, if you're building the wings, you really should use Will Cretsinger's notes <http://www.flash.net/~gila/wing_docs/wing_notes1.htm>. IMHO they're 100% better than Frank Justice's (which I also have). You might also want to read my Bunny's Guide stuff at <http://members.xoom.com/frankv/bunny.htm> -- not really instructions, more like a commentary of tips and traps. Frank. ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Jeff Orear" <jorear(at)mari.net>
Subject: 6A dual
Date: Jul 22, 1998
Hi Group: I keep hearing and reading that Mike will give dual in the 6, but does he also do it in Old Blue, the 6A? If so, does he take it around the country to various locations like he does with the -6? Not that I am anywhere close to being ready ( where the heck is that wing kit anyway!!?? I don't CARE if it hasn't been 12 weeks!!!), but was just wondering. I too am a low time pilot (69hrs), but plan to build on that over the years (very few I hope ) that I am building. Regardless of how many hours I have by the time 25171 is ready to fly, I plan to get with Mike and do some dual. Why take the chance of doing something really stupid? See Ya at OSH! Regards, Jeff Orear RV6A 25171 Waiting on the wings Peshtigo, WI ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "m00nman" <idealhob(at)barint.on.ca>
Subject: Re: RV-Listers - Oshkosh Id. Solution
Date: Jul 22, 1998
think it would be a great idea .i will be around to pick one up and wear it for new pilots is learning >how to slow down. You do *not* want to enter the pattern at 160 knots. Why not? Do a high-G overhead break and land it like a proper airplane! ;-) Tom Craig-Stearman tcraigst(at)ionet.net USAF Instructor Pilot RV-4 64ST connecting all those thingies in the engine room ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 22, 1998
From: Charlie and Tupper England <cengland(at)netdoor.com>
Subject: Re: Low-time pilots in RV's
I must confess to not reading every post on this subject, but I haven't noticed anyone commenting on the effects of low time (experience) if you have a less-than-perfect first flight. To me, the ability to handle an emergency would be more important than handling a relatively docile a/c. This, combined with the very strong desire to preserve tens of thousands of dollars plus thousands of hours' work, could make for a very bad day if things don't go as planned. I had my -4's canopy "unlatch" (no safety, & my fault) at about 90 kts & 400' agl. I didn't lose the canopy, but if this had happened to me when I had only 60 hours, I'm pretty sure that more than the canopy would have been lost. I think that 10 years of reading about guys crashing on takeoff because a cabin door opened 3 inches combined with 10 years of hearing "FLY THE AIRP:ANE" from instructors is all that kept me from adding to the statistics. I hope this perspective is useful to someone. Charlie ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 22, 1998
From: scott <acepilot(at)mwt.net>
Subject: Re: Electric Flap Option
Zeidman, Richard B wrote: > > > Listers- > I'm getting ready to order the fuselage kit for my RV6a and I can't > decide whether or not to order the electric flap option. Does anyone > have opinions pro or con as to the necessity or ease of installation. > Has anyone experienced a failure? > Thanks, > Rich Zeidman > SN 25224 > I'm planning on manual flaps in my RV4. My (minor) concern is if there was an inflight electrical fire and you shut off the master and want to do a precautionary landing, you'd have no flaps. What are the odds, but I like simplicity. Scott -- Gotta Fly or Gonna Die ! --Ask me about my Aeronca Super Chief-- amended 8-29-97: Now after feeling the "Need for Speed", building an RV-4! Tail kit arrived!! Somewhat regretfully, the Super Chief is now for sale. $8500 :( ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 22, 1998
From: scott <acepilot(at)mwt.net>
Subject: 2 new builder questions
1. Why did Van decide to use stiffeners in the rudder and elevators instead of putting in a couple ribs? 2. During inventory of my tail kit I noticed the rivets have a kind of brassy color. I plan to polish my RV4. Will the rivet heads polish up to silver or do I need different type rivets? Yellowish rivets everywhere would kind of look silly!! Scott -- Gotta Fly or Gonna Die ! --Ask me about my Aeronca Super Chief-- amended 8-29-97: Now after feeling the "Need for Speed", building an RV-4! Tail kit arrived!! Somewhat regretfully, the Super Chief is now for sale. $8500 :( ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 22, 1998
From: Louis Willig <larywil(at)home.com>
Subject: Re: RV-Listers - Oshkosh Id. Solution
M Wentzell) > >Hello, > There has been a thread as to how to identify ourselves at Oshkosh. How >about this - pick up your sticker at Van's tent, stick it on your hat, >shirt, or forehead. The price is right (free),(my donation - I'm a >printer!) I am willing to do this and follow through IF the interest is >there, If not I will continue to spend my time fluting my wing ribs! > Do we have any interest? > > David Wentzell, Racine, WI > RV-6 Wings Dave, Your offer is very generous. For simplicity, perhaps you could provide a sticker or pin that had a header" Matt's RV-List" or "Matronics RV-List". The rest of the sticker could be left blank, and the user could fill in his/her name, address, and RV type and status. I don't know how many "listers" will attend 'Kosh, but we usually have 20-40 people at the banquet. Many more listers attend but don't go to the banquet. I would guess that 100 name tags would suffice (don't rely on this number) . Next year, Matt Dralle should sell hats to raise money. The hats could be real fancy with the owner's name embroidered. Matt...are you listening? Louis Louis I. Willig larywil(at)home.com (610) 668-4964 Philadelphia, PA ________________________________________________________________________________
From: donspawn(at)Juno.com
Subject: Re: 2 new builder questions
Date: Jul 22, 1998
> >1. Why did Van decide to use stiffeners in the rudder and elevators >instead of putting in a couple ribs? I will guess weight !!! >2. During inventory of my tail kit I noticed the rivets have a kind >of >brassy color. I plan to polish my RV4. Will the rivet heads polish >up >to silver or do I need different type rivets? Yellowish rivets >everywhere would kind of look silly!! Thats anodize, opps I mean the Chromate coat. IT will pollish off. Don Jordan ~ 76DJ ~ 6A fuselage ~ Arlington,Tx ~ donspawn(at)juno.com ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 22, 1998
From: Will Cretsinger <cretsinger(at)arlington.net>
Subject: [Fwd: BWB Engine out]
New engines have bad days, too... (/\##/\ Smail3.1.30.16 #30.249) with smtp for sender: From: cwcrane(at)NOSPAMairmail.net (CW Crane) Subject: BWB Engine out Date: Thu, 16 Jul 1998 13:59:40 -0500 Subject: I Just Dead Sticked the RV-6 Into the Desert! From: billphil(at)ix.netcom.com (Badwater Bill) Date: 1998/07/14 I don't have a ton of time right now to talk but I just had an engine failure in Karl Strom's RV-6. I had to make an emergency landing in the desert about 9am this morning. The flight was a check out for a CFI to take over the rest of the flight training of both Karl and Stefan. We were doing simple steep turns about 10 miles north of town at about 3000 AGL when the cockpit filled with blue smoke. I pulled the power to determine if I was on fire and a lot of the smoke subsided. At that point I became PIC from the right seat and headed for I-95 in case I had to stick it. Within 10 seconds oil was gushing all over the front window and I had basically no forward visibility. My thoughts were to just watch the oil pressure and see if I could limp all the way back to the airport. At about 8 miles north the oil pressure dropped through 60 psi, then 50, then 40, then 30, then 20. I had her back to flight idle so I wouldn't seize her up and was pretty much a glider pilot at that time. I thought, "shit, I hope I don't hit a car but I have to dead-stick this baby on the highway.' I got lucky, however, there is a flash flood water retention basin at about 6 miles north and to the west a bit. I radioed the tower and told them I had an engine failure, call the police, send the emergency medical people, I had 2 souls on board and 40 gallons of fuel. There was some confusion as to where I was so I squawked 7700. I know that lit up every radar scope from here to San Francisco so there was no problem figuring out exactly where I was going down. Well, to make a long story short (I'll write more later) I dead sticked it into the desert. I tore up the nice wheel pants on the big rocks and caught the trailing edge of the right aileron on a rock sitting up on a small burm. I had no brakes in the right seat so I was yelling at Tim to get on the brake to minimize the ground roll as we went careening through the rocks, bushes and desert. At the very moment we came to a stop I looked over at Tim and got a big smile on my face. I extended a shaking right hand as he did and we congratulated each other for still being alive. Later I was to see that there was a rock about 15 inches in diameter only 18 inches in front of where the right wheel came to rest. Fourteen minutes later the Metro helicopter was there as were the fire dept. and the EMT's. Early on, I did relay to an over flying aircraft to tell the tower that there were no medical injuries, we were fine and needed absolutely no medical assistance. Next came every news reporter on Earth and a bunch of other people including other police helicopters, news helicopters, newspaper people etc. All I could think of is that no one was hurt, there was no significant damage and there would be no law suits so I gave them all an interview of what happened. Karl and Stefan showed up and we pulled the cowling to find the problem. It was the wonderful Lycoming engine Karl paid $25,000 (including accessories). The front oil seal behind the prop flange and blown forward on one side and allowed our oil to blow out. We pulled the dip stick and there was still a trace on the very tip. I pulled the engine through before we removed the prop and compression was still just fine. Also the oil on the stick looked fine, no signs of over-temp. I think I saved the engine. We took a ton of pictures of it. I'll get a copy of them later today and load them up on my webpage for all to see in the morning. Looks like I lived to fly another day?.. So goes test flight! Badwater Bill ________________________________________________________________________________
From: RVer273sb(at)aol.com
Date: Jul 22, 1998
Subject: Re: 2 new builder questions
Scott First question, probably simplicity and weight Second question, thoes rivets are just annodized a diff color they will polish out like the others. Try one. RV4 rver273sb ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 22, 1998
From: Tom Craig-Stearman <tcraigst(at)ionet.net>
Subject: Re: 2 new builder questions
Scott, 1. The stiffeners are much easier to install and are perfectly adequate as the designer factored them into the strength of the tail surfaces. I think you will be surprised how stiff the control surfaces become after you have riveted the leading edge radius. 2. The gold color of the rivets is cadmium plating which will polish off quite easily to a silver aluminum color. Tom Craig-Stearman tcraigst(at)ionet.net RV-4 64ST connecting all those thingies in the engine room > >1. Why did Van decide to use stiffeners in the rudder and elevators >instead of putting in a couple ribs? > >2. During inventory of my tail kit I noticed the rivets have a kind of >brassy color. I plan to polish my RV4. Will the rivet heads polish up >to silver or do I need different type rivets? Yellowish rivets >everywhere would kind of look silly!! ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 22, 1998
Subject: Re: shoe goo
From: rvpilot(at)Juno.com (William R. Davis Jr)
Brian,Rod, Tim, et.all Thanks for the info. Did not see it in our Home Depot here in Ft. Myers but will try the other places. Regards, Bill, RV4, N66WD, Working on an RV8 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: RVer273sb(at)aol.com
Date: Jul 22, 1998
Subject: Re: [Fwd: BWB Engine out]
WHAT HAPPENED? RVER273SB ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 22, 1998
From: Paul Besing <rv8er(at)doitnow.com>
Subject: Re: Electric Flap Option
My (minor) concern is if there was an inflight electrical fire and you shut off the master and want to do a precautionary landing, you'd have no flaps." You have simulated landings without flaps, haven't you? They should be considered a luxury, since you can have a mechanical failure, as well as an electrical failure....so if you want electrical flaps, go for it! My 2 cents... Paul Besing ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "martin" <martin(at)gbonline.com>
Subject: Re: shoe goo
Date: Jul 22, 1998
DEar Bill, Shoe Goo is available at almost all TRUE VALUE OR TRU SERVE STORES. Dick Martin RV 8 ---------- > From: William R. Davis Jr <rvpilot(at)Juno.com> > To: rv-list(at)matronics.com > Subject: RV-List: shoe goo > Date: Tuesday, July 21, 1998 8:38 PM > > > Listers, > > > Some one mentioned "Shoe Goo" adhesive on the list about a week or so > ago. Have not seen this stuff around, what stores might carry it? Thanks > for the help. > > > Regards, Bill, RV4, N66WD > > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: A20driver(at)aol.com
Date: Jul 22, 1998
Subject: Re: shoe goo
Bill Davis is that you with the 4??? Jim Brown..Matawan,NJ ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 22, 1998
From: Patrick Kelley <patk(at)megsinet.net>
Subject: Re: 2 new builder questions
scott wrote: > > 1. Why did Van decide to use stiffeners in the rudder and elevators > instead of putting in a couple ribs? Weight and ease of construction. Once you've riveted the skins on the stabilizers, think about how hard it would be to rivet the ribs into the elevator and rudder skins. Then, look at the flap construction - those ribs don't go full depth, and the construction is somewhat more complicated. > 2. During inventory of my tail kit I noticed the rivets have a kind of > brassy color. I plan to polish my RV4. Will the rivet heads polish up > to silver or do I need different type rivets? I believe the rivets are alodined or cadmium plated. Either way, it's just a surface condition. Once in place, it is not noticible and tends to polish off anyway. By the way, check out a polished RV in person - I decided against it after seeing that I would be looking at the ground next to a couple of blinding mirrors (wings). They look nice, but think about what it is like to fly one. PatK - RV-6A - Project in Mich until after OSH, builder in Chicago ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Vanremog(at)aol.com
Date: Jul 23, 1998
Subject: Re: 2 new builder questions
<< The gold color of the rivets is cadmium plating which will polish off quite easily to a silver aluminum color. >> Actually the golden color on aluminum rivets is a chromate chem film (conversion coating: alodine, alumidine are tradenames) per MIL-C-5541, not cadmium or anodizing. A plating would fracture upon bucktail upset. The plating on alloy steel AN hardware is Cadmium, but again, it is the chromate chem film surface treatment that gives them their golden appearance. This can be confusing to new builders. Tom is correct in that the oxide film is quite thin and will polish off in a heartbeat to the familiar aluminum luster. As long as we are discussing platings, most hardware store bolts are Zinc plated (blue tinted) and some are also chromate treated making them visually similar (except for the head markings) to their Cadmium plated cousins. The Zinc is an inferior (especially in salt fog tests) plating for our applications. -GV ________________________________________________________________________________
From: AB320FLYER(at)aol.com
Date: Jul 23, 1998
Subject: Rooms at Oshkosh
If anyone is still looking for lodging at Oshkosh, the place I've stayed for the last two years has some beds available. It's an especially good deal for anyone who flys in, because the lady will pick you up as far away as Appleton and also take you to and from the airport every day, so you don't need a rental car. It's fifty bucks a night for a bedroom with two single beds, and that price includes a good breakfast. The ladies name is Helen and her number is 920-231-1587. Joel ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 22, 1998
From: C&F Hiatt <hiatt001(at)gold.tc.umn.edu>
Subject: Re: RV-Listers - Oshkosh Id. Solution
Count me in. Fred Hiatt, RV-6A ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: 2 new builder questions
From: smcdaniels(at)Juno.com (SCOTT R MCDANIELS)
Date: Jul 23, 1998
> >1. Why did Van decide to use stiffeners in the rudder and elevators >instead of putting in a couple ribs? > Because it would have still required a rib in each position that has a stiffener (because the skin is very light and would be floppy between the ribs otherwise) which would be more weight, which would require heavier balance weights, which then again would mean more weight, etc., etc. >2. During inventory of my tail kit I noticed the rivets have a kind >of >brassy color. If you look closer you may also find some that are silver color. What ever color they are, when polished they become plain old aluminum color. I plan to polish my RV4. You are a gluten for punishment. From the eagle eye RV builders that will be able to detect every single little mistake you make every where, but mostly for all the work that it constantly takes to keep it looking nice. Scott McDaniels These opinions and ideas are my own and do not necessarily reflect the opinions of my employer. ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 23, 1998
From: Todd Lattimer <todd(at)lis.net.au>
Subject: Tools in Australia
Hi All, I'll be ordering an RV-8 very shorly (god bless the taxation office for this years bountiful return ;) and need to get 'tooled up' first. I was told not so long ago about the 'RV master builders tool kit' that contains many of the tools needed to build an RV. Does anyone know who in Australia stocks these kits or sells a similar kit? Are these kits the way to go? or is it easire/ cheeper to purchase the tools individually? cheers Todd ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: [Fwd: BWB Engine out]
From: smcdaniels(at)Juno.com (SCOTT R MCDANIELS)
Date: Jul 23, 1998
The front oil seal behind the prop flange >and blown forward on one side and allowed our oil to blow out. > >Looks like I lived to fly another day?.. > >So goes test flight! > >Badwater Bill > > > > Bill, Glad to hear that you got it down with no major damage or injuries. Obviously you remembered to "fly the airplane". One thing I am interested to find out (after things have settled down a bit and you guys get a chance to look the engine over good) is whether their is anything unusual about this RV as far is the engine breather system goes. Like a home made air/oil separator. Or an after market one, etc. This kind of thing can happen when something like this is installed in a way that causes some restriction in the breather system. Add to that a new engine with a lot of blow by because the rings haven't seated yet, and you can have enough crank case pressure to blow out the front seal. Let us know what you find. Scott McDaniels These opinions and ideas are my own and do not necessarily reflect the opinions of my employer. ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 23, 1998
From: "Chris\\Susie" <cmcgough(at)eck.net.au>
Subject: Re: Tools in Australia
Todd look up Avery in USA . Tools are heaps cheaper from states,even after adding freight. You can ring me at home 57843215 Chris Rv6 wings > > Hi All, > > I'll be ordering an RV-8 very shorly (god bless the taxation office for > this years bountiful return ;) and need to get 'tooled up' first. > I was told not so long ago about the 'RV master builders tool kit' that > contains many of the tools needed to build an RV. > Does anyone know who in Australia stocks these kits or sells a similar kit? > Are these kits the way to go? or is it easire/ cheeper to purchase the > tools individually? > > cheers > Todd > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: PILOT8127(at)aol.com
Date: Jul 23, 1998
Subject: RE: RV-Listers Id. Oshkosh
Oh yes! STICKERS are the way to go..... I thought about a TaToo. "RV-Lister" across the chest maybe. But by the time the 5" letters healed and the painful scab fell off, OSH would be over! 8^) Looking forward to meeting all the "listers" !! Gary Rodgers (Indiana) RV-3 160, slider See Ya at OSH (Wed. thru Sun.) ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 23, 1998
From: scott <acepilot(at)mwt.net>
Subject: Re: Electric Flap Option
Paul Besing wrote: > > > > My (minor) concern is if there > was an inflight electrical fire and you shut off the master and want to > do a precautionary landing, you'd have no flaps." > > You have simulated landings without flaps, haven't you? They should be > considered a luxury, since you can have a mechanical failure, as well as an > electrical failure....so if you want electrical flaps, go for it! > > My 2 cents... > > Paul Besing > Well, yes, I usually make every landing without flaps on my Chief (since it doesn't have flaps)...I was refering to off-airport landings and I concede it can be done without flaps, but back in the training days, I was taught to use full flaps once you know you have the field made to get the sppeds as slow as possible since "speed kills" in these instances. But...like I said, it's probably really a minor concern! A plus with electric is you can put on 3,6,8, 12,20 or 40 or any desired amount on at any time. My personal preferance is to keep everything simple. If an o-320 wasn't so hard to prop, I'd probably leave the electrical system out!! Scott -- Gotta Fly or Gonna Die ! --Ask me about my Aeronca Super Chief-- amended 8-29-97: Now after feeling the "Need for Speed", building an RV-4! Tail kit arrived!! Somewhat regretfully, the Super Chief is now for sale. $8500 :( ________________________________________________________________________________
From: DFaile(at)aol.com
Date: Jul 23, 1998
Subject: OSH Dorm Room Available
Looks like I might have a dorm room available 7/27 through 8/03. Reason is that I am flying out with another pilot who has a room. Contact me OFF LIST it you are interested. DFaile(at)aol.com david faile, fairfield, ct mcfii/a&p eaa technical counselor/flight advisor christen eagle ii since '82 (n13bf) rv6 n44df started ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: RV-Listers - Oshkosh Id. Solution
From: cecilth(at)Juno.com (cecil t hatfield)
Date: Jul 23, 1998
I'm All for it. Lets do it. Times a wasting Cecil writes: > >David Wentzell wrote: >Hello, > >How about this - pick up your sticker at Van's tent, stick it on your >hat, >shirt, or forehead. Do we have any interest? > David Wentzell, Racine, WI > RV-6 Wings > >I think it is a great idea. Make it so you can pin it on a hat as >well as stick it on. Can spot each other while drooling on the RVs on >the line. >Bill Costello > > > > > > > > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 23, 1998
From: Patrick Kelley <patk(at)megsinet.net>
Subject: Re: RE: RV-Listers Id. Oshkosh
There's always next year, Gary. How about the Vans Air Force Logo with RV-List scripted above and the model (or models, for the repeat offenders) scripted below? Ideally, this would be on the left arm below the short-sleeve line (sorry, most of us who already have tats have already used the right arm). To really show willing, you could also get one that pictures your RV surrounded by "Live to fly - fly to live". Maybe we could get 'temporary tatoos' printed up for the faint of heart. By the way, I like the sticker idea; count that as two votes (Judi, too) in the interest poll. PatK PILOT8127(at)aol.com wrote: > > > Oh yes! STICKERS are the way to go..... I thought about a TaToo. "RV-Lister" > across the chest maybe. But by the time the 5" letters healed and the painful > scab fell off, OSH would be over! 8^) Looking forward to meeting all the > "listers" !! > Gary Rodgers (Indiana) RV-3 160, slider See Ya at OSH (Wed. thru Sun.) > ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 23, 1998
From: Richard Bibb <rbibb(at)fore.com>
Subject: Re: Electric Flap Option
I went with manual flaps in my -4 but after 130 hours decided to "upgrade" to electric. This will be much nicer in the passenger comfort arena as the flap arm on the -4 is in the way of the passenger's foot. Also, while the retrofit is doable it would have been a WHOLE lot easier to accomplish this while constructing the fuselage. If I had to do it over again I would go with electric from the git go. The RV-4 slips real nicely so I'm not worried if I have to land without flaps - it is not a problem... Richard E. Bibb RV-4 N144KT Oak Hill, VA rbibb(at)fore.com ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Scott VanArtsdalen" <svanarts(at)jps.net>
Subject: Aileron help!
Date: Jul 23, 1998
Okay, what's the secret to building ailerons with no dents in them? This is the second aileron skin that I have put a ding in. I'm not even sure how I did it. What has everyone else done about dings in the aileron skin? LIve with it? Tap it out? Bondo? Help?!! -- Scott VanArtsdalen RV-4 #1054 ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 23, 1998
From: Bob Skinner <bskinr(at)trib.com>
Subject: rv for sale
For Sale: N369X RV6 425 Hrs TTA&E 150 HP Lycoming O-320-E2A 180 mph TAS. Tip up canopy, manual flaps and elevator trim. $60,000 US. This is a pretty nice airplane. Several listers have seen & flown in it. Reason for sale? I want to buy my wife a new Miata and I get to fly Gillette Charlie's new 6A with a 160 hp & constant speed for gas! If the weather cooperates, the plane will be at OSH. If interested, e-mail me off list for a full list of equipment and features as the list takes up too much room, here. If anyone on the list could post pictures of my RV on their web page, that would be great. Please drop me a note, off-list. Bob Skinner RV-6 425 hrs. Buffalo, WY bskinr(at)trib.com ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Scott VanArtsdalen" <svanarts(at)jps.net>
Subject: Electric Flap Option
Date: Jul 23, 1998
Hey, Scott! Welcome to the world of RV-realities. I had to sell my C-85 Champ so I could start saving up to buy the engine! It was painful. Now I'm just a....a....renter! > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com > [mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of scott > Sent: Thursday, July 23, 1998 11:43 AM > To: rv-list(at)matronics.com > Subject: Re: RV-List: Electric Flap Option > > > > Paul Besing wrote: > > > > > > > > My (minor) concern is if there > > was an inflight electrical fire and you shut off the master > and want to > > do a precautionary landing, you'd have no flaps." > > > > You have simulated landings without flaps, haven't you? > They should be > > considered a luxury, since you can have a mechanical > failure, as well as an > > electrical failure....so if you want electrical flaps, go for it! > > > > My 2 cents... > > > > Paul Besing > > > > Well, yes, I usually make every landing without flaps on my > Chief (since > it doesn't have flaps)...I was refering to off-airport landings and I > concede it can be done without flaps, but back in the > training days, I > was taught to use full flaps once you know you have the field > made to get > the sppeds as slow as possible since "speed kills" in these > instances. > But...like I said, it's probably really a minor concern! A plus with > electric is you can put on 3,6,8, 12,20 or 40 or any desired > amount on at > any time. My personal preferance is to keep everything > simple. If an > o-320 wasn't so hard to prop, I'd probably leave the > electrical system > out!! > Scott > > -- > Gotta Fly or > Gonna Die ! > --Ask me about my > Aeronca Super Chief-- > > amended 8-29-97: Now after feeling the "Need for Speed", building an > RV-4! > Tail kit arrived!! Somewhat regretfully, the Super Chief is now for > sale. $8500 :( > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Stucklen, Frederic IFC" <stuckle(at)ifc.hsd.utc.com>
Subject: [Fwd: BWB Engine out]
Date: Jul 23, 1998
Bill, Glad to hear you weren't hurt..... And that the plane didn't suffer significant damage. Just another thought: Was the crankshaft plug for a constant speed prop removed if you are using the fixed pitch prop? Fred Stucklen N925RV RV-6A E. Windsor, Ct > -----Original Message----- > From: smcdaniels(at)juno.com [SMTP:smcdaniels(at)juno.com] > Sent: Thursday, July 23, 1998 1:21 AM > To: rv-list(at)matronics.com > Subject: Re: RV-List: [Fwd: BWB Engine out] > > > The front oil seal behind the prop flange > >and blown forward on one side and allowed our oil to blow out. > > > >Looks like I lived to fly another day?.. > > > >So goes test flight! > > > >Badwater Bill > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Enter your name here" <mongo7(at)ix.netcom.com>
Subject: Re: Plane ticket to Oshkosh
Date: Jul 23, 1998
Sreve, I'm Don Champagne and live in the Manchester NH area. Give me more info. Thanks Don ________________________________________________________________________________
From: MLaboyteau(at)aol.com
Date: Jul 23, 1998
Subject: Fuel Injection Hot Idle, a solution!
Well I installed some sleeving on my injector lines, and it's made a big difference on my rough idle while heat soaked problem. What I wound up using is Spark Plug wire sleeve from Moroso, part #72000. It's a high temp silicone sleeve thats lined with fiberglass, and it will just fit over the "B" nuts on the injector lines. My idle with the engine heat soaked now is almost normal, it still idles rough when restarted after being shut down for a few minutes, but an engine run-up will smooth it out. It's still not perfect, but from all of the information I can gather, FI engines just don't idle well in hot conditions. I had some of this stuff left over, and sent it to another builder who was having the same problems as I. He's reported that it's had the same effect on his hot idle problem, it's much improved, although still not perfect. About the only other thing that I think I could do to help, would be to try and lower the heat that is absorbed by the fuel servo itself. I could either wrap the crossover exhaust pipes at the front of the engine, or make some sort of shroud and direct cooling air around the servo. One day, I had been cruising at a high altitude with an OAT of 11 C. I wound up making a rapid descent and landing where the OAT was 38 C (100 F!) I taxied around for a few minutes, and man that idle was as smooth as silk! I noticed while putting her back in the barn, that the bottoms of the fuel tanks were sweating and water was dripping off the wings! The fuel was still very cool, and this must've been the reason for the smooth idle, even though the ambient temps were hot. Mark LaBoyteaux RV-6A N106RV "The Silver Streak!" MLaboyteau(at)aol.com Broken Arrow, Ok ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 23, 1998
From: Edward Cole <emcole(at)ix.netcom.com>
Subject: Astrotech Chronometer
Lister's, Does any one have any documentation on an Astrotech L-6 LCD Chronometer or can get me the address /phone number of Astrotech.? The label says Phoenix, AZ Please respond to me directly. Thanks Ed Cole RV6A Fuse skins emcole(at)ix.netcom.com ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 23, 1998
From: Jerry Springer <jsflyrv(at)ix.netcom.com>
Subject: Re: [Fwd: BWB Engine out]
Stucklen, Frederic IFC wrote: > IFC" > > Bill, > > Glad to hear you weren't hurt..... And that the plane didn't suffer > significant damage. > > Just another thought: Was the crankshaft plug for a constant speed > prop removed if you are using the fixed pitch prop? > > Fred Stucklen > N925RV RV-6A > E. Windsor, Ct > I am not sure Badwater Bill monitors this list, the message about his engine out was takem from the R.A.H. news group. Bill was parked next to me at Arlington with his RV-6 that he bought from John Darby????? who is on this list. Do you lurk here BWB? -- Jerry Springer RV-6 N906GS First flight July 14, 1989 :-) Hillsboro, OR jsflyrv(at)ix.netcom.com


July 17, 1998 - July 23, 1998

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