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RV10-Archive.digest.vol-cn
August 23, 2007 - September 12, 2007

________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 23, 2007
From: Scott Schmidt <scottmschmidt(at)yahoo.com>
Subject: FYI - Ceiling idea using a plastic box from Radio Shack
Here is an idea I used for lights in the ceiling that covered the four bolt s for the front brace. =0Ahttp://www.vansairforce.com/community/showthread .php?t 787=0A =0AScott Schmidt=0Ascottmschmidt(at)yahoo.com ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Baggage door alarm
From: "nick(at)nleonard.com" <nick(at)nleonard.com>
Date: Aug 23, 2007
For those of you that havent put in your door alarms yet, I might suggest a slight improvement. For some reason Vans is using a Normally Open (N.O.) reed switch (magnetic contact switch) for the door alarms which requires that you put a relay in-line to reverse the function to a Normally Closed (N.C.) operation. I wanted to add a door open alarm to the baggage door as well, but didnt want the added complexity of the relays. I found a N.C. switch that comes with a flanged press fit for a simple clean installation in the baggage door frame. I installed it just below the latch area by drilling through from the rib behind the door using the hole that was already there but used for manufacturing the rib and drilled straight through into the baggage door frame. This same unit can be used in the cabin doors, either mounted as the plans suggest or you could do the press fit at any part along the frame and the magnet press fit into the door. Now you can wire the units without the relays in-line, simplifying the parts count, weight, and points of failure, plus have the same parts for all locations. I used mine in combination with the Riverhead-Aero Door Guides and Pins that have the built in magnet in the pins. The contacts that I found are from GRI (www.grisk.com) and made for the home alarm industry. I used the 3030-12W (the W is white, also available in brown and black). It has a 3/8 diameter press fit but is also available in a as the 60-RF. They are also available without the flange if you arent going to take advantage of the flush fit on the baggage door frame. Either form factor can be adapted if you need to. They also have several different magnet strengths available. I would suggest the standard, weakest magnets which should give you up to a gap. You dont want to have it reading closed while the door is still partially open. The Wide-Gap (-WG) will give you up to a 1 opening. These units come with 6 wired leads or you can order them with screw terminals. I got mine at Metro Electronics (916-442-1512) in Sacramento. They have no web ordering (www.metro-electronics.com) but will ship if you call them directly. I also found them at a place called ASI Home (http://www.asihome.com/ASIshop/product_info.php?manufacturers_id=39&products_id=739) ASI normally sells them in packages of 10 at $1.63 each for the 3030-12W version and $2.03 for the 60RF-12W. It is about a wash if you buy five sets vs. the package of ten but check the pricing. They all come as a set with the magnet. I think I paid ~$3.65 for the individual pairs (3030-12W) at Metro. ASI will also sell them individually but you will need to call them (800-263-8608) to get pricing and availability since they dont seem to list the 3030 version on the website but do stock some. When ordering; confirm that you are getting the Normally Closed, 12 volt, flanged (or unflanged), standard magnet, white (if you care), 6 leads (or screw terminals) in either the or 3/8 version. If you mount the switches on the doors the way the plans suggest using the Adel clamp rather than the flush mount in the frame you have the advantage of being able to adjust the gap distance which could be helpful if you order the wide gap (WG) version of the magnet. Enjoy, Nick C:916-425-1064 Nick(at)NLeonard.com -------- Nick Leonard RV-10 (40015) Finish Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=130554#130554 ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 23, 2007
From: Scott Schmidt <scottmschmidt(at)yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: Baggage door alarm
The door alarm is a great idea. Just FYI, while I was doing my tranisition training with Mike Seager, we landed and the door swung open. During our flight the screw that holds the latch on vibrated out. It was at least goo d to know that if you forget to latch it won't just rip off. I put some re d locktite on mine and haven't had any issues. =0A =0AScott Schmidt=0Ascott mschmidt(at)yahoo.com=0A=0A=0A=0A----- Original Message ----=0AFrom: "nick@nle onard.com" =0ATo: rv10-list(at)matronics.com=0ASent: Thursd ay, August 23, 2007 12:39:31 PM=0ASubject: RV10-List: Baggage door alarm=0A om>=0A=0AFor those of you that haven=92t put in your door alarms yet, I mig ht suggest a slight improvement. For some reason Van=92s is using a Normal ly Open (N.O.) reed switch (magnetic contact switch) for the door alarms wh ich requires that you put a relay in-line to reverse the function to a Norm ally Closed (N.C.) operation. I wanted to add a door open alarm to the bag gage door as well, but didn=92t want the added complexity of the relays. I found a N.C. switch that comes with a flanged press fit for a simple clean installation in the baggage door frame. I installed it just below the lat ch area by drilling through from the rib behind the door using the hole tha t was already there but used for manufacturing the rib and drilled straight through into the baggage door frame. This same unit can be used in the ca bin doors, either mounted as the plans suggest or you could do the press fi t at any part along the frame and the magnet press fit into the door. Now you can wire the units !=0Awithout the relays in-line, simplifying the par ts count, weight, and points of failure, plus have the same parts for all l ocations. I used mine in combination with the Riverhead-Aero Door Guides a nd Pins that have the built in magnet in the pins.=0A=0AThe contacts that I found are from GRI (www.grisk.com) and made for the home alarm industry. I used the 3030-12W (the W is white, also available in brown and black). I t has a 3/8=94 diameter press fit but is also available in a =BC=94 as the 60-RF. They are also available without the flange if you aren=92t going to take advantage of the flush fit on the baggage door frame. Either form fa ctor can be adapted if you need to. They also have several different magnet strengths available. I would suggest the standard, weakest magnets which should give you up to a =BD=94 gap. You don=92t want to have it reading =93closed=94 while the door is still partially open. The Wide-Gap (-WG) wil l give you up to a 1=94 opening. These units come with 6=94 wired leads or you can order them with screw terminals.=0A=0AI got mine at Metro Electron ics (916-442-1512) in Sacramento. They have no web ordering (www.metro-ele ctronics.com) but will ship if you call them directly. I also found them a t a place called ASI Home (http://www.asihome.com/ASIshop/product_info.php? manufacturers_id=39&products_id=739)=0AASI normally sells them in packa ges of 10 at $1.63 each for the 3030-12W version and $2.03 for the 60RF-12W . It is about a wash if you buy five sets vs. the package of ten but check the pricing. They all come as a set with the magnet. I think I paid ~$3.65 for the individual pairs (3030-12W) at Metro. ASI will also sell them ind ividually but you will need to call them (800-263-8608) to get pricing and availability since they don=92t seem to list the 3030 version on the websit e but do stock some. When ordering; confirm that you are getting the Norma lly Closed, 12 volt, flanged (or unflanged), standard magnet, white (if you care), 6=94 leads (or screw terminals) in either the =BC=94 or 3/8=94 vers ion.=0A=0AIf you mount the switches on the doors the way the plans suggest using the Adel clamp rather than the flush mount in the frame you have the advantage of being able to adjust the gap distance which could be helpful i f you order the wide gap (WG) version of the magnet.=0A=0AEnjoy,=0A=0ANick =0AC:916-425-1064=0ANick(at)NLeonard.com=0A=0A--------=0ANick Leonard=0ARV-10 (40015) Finish=0A=0A=0A=0A=0ARead this topic online here:=0A=0Ahttp://forum ===================== ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: E-Mag update
Date: Aug 23, 2007
From: <tdawson-townsend(at)aurora.aero>
The fellows at E-Mag had this to say to a recent inquiry from me on 6-cylinder versions: Yes we are working on our six cylinder version right now. I'd expect to see something perhaps around the first of the year. Having said that, I need to add my standard disclaimer: You are advised to give NO weight to anything we ever say regarding product release dates. Please don't hesitate to call or write if you have any other questions. Kindest Regards, Brad Dement E-MAG Ignitions 2014 Greg Street Azle, Texas 76020 (817) 444-5310 Tim Dawson-Townsend Aurora Flight Sciences tdt(at)aurora.aero 617-500-4812 (office) 617-905-4800 (mobile) ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 23, 2007
From: MauleDriver <MauleDriver(at)nc.rr.com>
Subject: Re: Testing 1 2 3 - Is This Thing On? Where'd Everyone
Go? Well Tim, I'm still on Cloud 9 after that FANTASTIC flight you gave me at Oshkosh. Adrenaline does quite cover it. If I can just get thru all this electrical stuff! Tim Olson wrote: > (snip) > Another observation: Ever year it seems that after OSH it gets > quiet. I'm guessing that when people return from OSH, it's like > getting a shot of builders-adrenaline...you get highly motivated > and start to focus harder on the build. For me, I put in almost > 900 hours of building a year and a half, but after attending > OSH, I put in almost 900 in the final 6 months. That motivation > was ignited at OSH. It's very VERY common to see people go > more silent when they're within 2-3 months of completion. So, > perhaps we're on the verge of an RV-10 population explosion! > (snip) > Tim Olson - RV-10 N104CD - Flying ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 23, 2007
From: Patrick Thyssen <jump2(at)sbcglobal.net>
Subject: Re: What's required for IFR operation of an Experimental A/C?
Deems, I'm listening. I've just been busy doing annuals and other things. Have two more over the next three weeks and then will start back wiring. Did you ever get anything from Freeflight? Pat Deems Davis wrote: Boy, is this opening up a can of worms ! I've seen the other responses to this inquiry, I think I've read most everything I can find on this subject, as in most things the devil is in the details. E.g. What do you need to have to be legal to fly IFR WAAS approaches in an EXP aircraft? Do you need a TSO'd WAAS GPS? (I'm under the impression that you do, as opposed to a WAAS 'enabled/capable GPS'). If the WAAS GPS is a sensor (Freeflight) and not a Garmin 430/480/480 and is attached/integrated with an EXP EFIS system, does the EFIS system need to be able to supply the RAIM error notification for the WAAS GPS ? (I dont' believe any of the EXP EFIS systems currently do this) . ?????? Pat Thyssen, you got your ears on???? I've put 3 calls into my FSDO and left 3 messages on this topic and haven't got a call back. I spoke with one builder who indicated he was told by his FSDO that they are individually approving ea EXP IFR aircraft !!! Deems Davis # 406 'Its all done....Its just not put together' http://deemsrv10.com/ Bill Reining wrote: > > I had a discussion tonight after our monthly EAA chapter meeting with another builder about glass panels and backup steam gauges. He had heard that the major reason folks put in backup steam gauges (e.g. analog airspeed, altimeter and horizon) is: they are a relatively inexpensive way to obtain some TSO'd instruments. Why TSO? Because they have demonstrated compliance to various specs necessary for IFR qualification. On the other hand, the various glass EFIS are not certified, thus have no credentials to prove they can meet IFR specs. It's not that they have to be certified, just that one has to be able to show that certain important instruments meet IFR requirements (whatever that might be... accuracy? stability?) Well anyway, does any of this make sense? Perhaps a better question: are there really any requirements that must be met before an Experimental category aircraft can fly IFR? > > -------- > Bill (and Jon) Reining > 40514 > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=130414#130414 > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 23, 2007
From: Deems Davis <deemsdavis(at)cox.net>
Subject: Control stick freq flip/flop
I'm debating whether or not to connect the Freq Flip-Flop switch to my control grips. My initial thought is to NOT connect it, I have the capability of changing freq's either through my EFIS or direct through the radio/s and adding yet another option increases complexity and failure points. However in the back of my mind I recall a post from someone how either loved or hated this feature on their stick, anybody out there? Deems Davis # 406 'Its all done....Its just not put together' http://deemsrv10.com/ ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "gary" <speckter(at)comcast.net>
Subject: OP Tech Acquisition
Date: Aug 23, 2007
I was down at Stein's today trying to debug some items on the panel and needed to call OP for info. Because of the purchase they are not taking any calls. Does not give one a warm fuzzy. Visions of Direct to? Gary 40274 -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Deems Davis Sent: Thursday, August 23, 2007 9:59 AM Subject: Re: RV10-List: OP Tech Acquisition I don't know, My guess is that they want to continue to support the EXP market as thats the ONLY source for revenue for OP at the moment. As all mergers/acquisitions go ultimately it depends on how its managed. Op was growing and expanding at the time. (their prices were increasing as well!).There major focus this past year has been certification of their 10 inch product for the Cirus retro fit market. Its got all of the function that the G1000 has (minus the same functions that we have in the EXP product, syn vis, HITS, etc). Some of the things they are putting in the certified product have found their way into the EXP product recently (XM weather, e.g) and talking to Darren, they have a list of others they want to move as well. Deems Davis # 406 'Its all done....Its just not put together' http://deemsrv10.com/ Now if only I could find an 'affordable' FLIR camera........... ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Control stick freq flip/flop
Date: Aug 23, 2007
From: "Robin Marks" <robin1(at)mrmoisture.com>
I have decided to include it on both pilot & pax control sticks (plus a full pax deactivation switch). I debated and debated and finally decided to include it on my stick. I figure removing the feature it is easier than deciding later that I want to add it. My thinking was when I am flying ahead of my plane either my G900X will have the next comm loaded or I will have entered it in the stand by and rather than reach up again I will just hit the switch. Why not... Robin ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Patrick ONeill" <poneill(at)irealms.com>
Subject: E-Mag update
Date: Aug 23, 2007
I emailed them with the same question 2 months ago and they said they expected to ship it this summer. I don't think we will be seeing it anytime soon. Best Regards, Patrick ONeikk #40715 -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of tdawson-townsend(at)aurora.aero Sent: Thursday, August 23, 2007 12:49 PM Subject: RV10-List: E-Mag update The fellows at E-Mag had this to say to a recent inquiry from me on 6-cylinder versions: Yes we are working on our six cylinder version right now. I'd expect to see something perhaps around the first of the year. Having said that, I need to add my standard disclaimer: You are advised to give NO weight to anything we ever say regarding product release dates. Please don't hesitate to call or write if you have any other questions. Kindest Regards, Brad Dement E-MAG Ignitions 2014 Greg Street Azle, Texas 76020 (817) 444-5310 Tim Dawson-Townsend Aurora Flight Sciences tdt(at)aurora.aero 617-500-4812 (office) 617-905-4800 (mobile) ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Ted" <ted_french(at)telus.net>
Subject: Re: Baggage door alarm
Date: Aug 23, 2007
I used micro switches for all my door adjar indicators. More positive than magnets and no stray magnetic fields to mess things up. See http://www3.telus.net/elfrench/RV-10_main.htm , go to the blog and open the February archive. Go to the bottom of the page for photos. Ted French C-FXCS flying ----- Original Message ----- From: <nick(at)nleonard.com> Sent: Thursday, August 23, 2007 11:39 AM Subject: RV10-List: Baggage door alarm > > For those of you that haven?Tt put in your door alarms yet, I might suggest a slight improvement. For some reason Van?Ts is using a Normally Open (N.O.) reed switch (magnetic contact switch) for the door alarms which requires that you put a relay in-line to reverse the function to a Normally Closed (N.C.) operation. I wanted to add a door open alarm to the baggage door as well, but didn?Tt want the added complexity of the relays. I found a N.C. switch that comes with a flanged press fit for a simple clean installation in the baggage door frame. I installed it just below the latch area by drilling through from the rib behind the door using the hole that was already there but used for manufacturing the rib and drilled straight through into the baggage door frame. This same unit can be used in the cabin doors, either mounted as the plans suggest or you could do the press fit at any part along the frame and the magnet press fit into the door. Now you can wire the units ! > without the relays in-line, simplifying the parts count, weight, and points of failure, plus have the same parts for all locations. I used mine in combination with the Riverhead-Aero Door Guides and Pins that have the built in magnet in the pins. > > The contacts that I found are from GRI (www.grisk.com) and made for the home alarm industry. I used the 3030-12W (the W is white, also available in brown and black). It has a 3/8? diameter press fit but is also available in a ? as the 60-RF. They are also available without the flange if you aren?Tt going to take advantage of the flush fit on the baggage door frame. Either form factor can be adapted if you need to. They also have several different magnet strengths available. I would suggest the standard, weakest magnets which should give you up to a ? gap. You don?Tt want to have it reading ?oclosed? while the door is still partially open. The Wide-Gap (-WG) will give you up to a 1? opening. These units come with 6? wired leads or you can order them with screw terminals. > > I got mine at Metro Electronics (916-442-1512) in Sacramento. They have no web ordering (www.metro-electronics.com) but will ship if you call them directly. I also found them at a place called ASI Home (http://www.asihome.com/ASIshop/product_info.php?manufacturers_id=39&product s_id=739) > ASI normally sells them in packages of 10 at $1.63 each for the 3030-12W version and $2.03 for the 60RF-12W. It is about a wash if you buy five sets vs. the package of ten but check the pricing. They all come as a set with the magnet. I think I paid ~$3.65 for the individual pairs (3030-12W) at Metro. ASI will also sell them individually but you will need to call them (800-263-8608) to get pricing and availability since they don?Tt seem to list the 3030 version on the website but do stock some. When ordering; confirm that you are getting the Normally Closed, 12 volt, flanged (or unflanged), standard magnet, white (if you care), 6? leads (or screw terminals) in either the ? or 3/8? version. > > If you mount the switches on the doors the way the plans suggest using the Adel clamp rather than the flush mount in the frame you have the advantage of being able to adjust the gap distance which could be helpful if you order the wide gap (WG) version of the magnet. > > Enjoy, > > Nick > C:916-425-1064 > Nick(at)NLeonard.com > > -------- > Nick Leonard > RV-10 (40015) Finish > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=130554#130554 > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "SteinAir, Inc." <stein(at)steinair.com>
Subject: OP Tech Acquisition
Date: Aug 23, 2007
Well...I truly don't have any more information than anyone else regaring the OP acquisition. What I do know from past lives in the airline business is that Aerosonic is not some small player in a small market. They are a large (many tens of million $$) company that supplies products to very high end and heavy iron. At least in that market I know they are well entrenched and well respected. I've not personally dealt with them or their products in a long time. I also do not yet have any 1st hand knowledge of the situation other than what we all have read online so I'd be remiss to comment any further without knowing any details. What I do know is that both Gary and Deems have REALLY nice panels. The work Gary did on his panel looks like it came out of an professional avionics shop, and I think you'll all be impressed when you see it in the plane. Deems already has a panel that is good looking so I don't want to make his head any bigger! Hopefully we'll all have some good news in the near future. I guess we'll all have to sit and wait to see how this shakes out. Just my 2 cents as usual. Cheers, Stein. >-----Original Message----- >From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com >[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of gary >Sent: Thursday, August 23, 2007 4:18 PM >To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com >Subject: RE: RV10-List: OP Tech Acquisition > > >I was down at Stein's today trying to debug some items on the panel and >needed to call OP for info. Because of the purchase they are not >taking any >calls. Does not give one a warm fuzzy. Visions of Direct to? > >Gary >40274 > >-----Original Message----- >From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com >[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Deems Davis >Sent: Thursday, August 23, 2007 9:59 AM >To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com >Subject: Re: RV10-List: OP Tech Acquisition > > >I don't know, My guess is that they want to continue to support the EXP >market as thats the ONLY source for revenue for OP at the moment. As >all mergers/acquisitions go ultimately it depends on how its managed. Op >was growing and expanding at the time. (their prices were increasing as >well!).There major focus this past year has been certification of their >10 inch product for the Cirus retro fit market. Its got all of the >function that the G1000 has (minus the same functions that we have in >the EXP product, syn vis, HITS, etc). Some of the things they are >putting in the certified product have found their way into the EXP >product recently (XM weather, e.g) and talking to Darren, they have a >list of others they want to move as well. > >Deems Davis # 406 >'Its all done....Its just not put together' >http://deemsrv10.com/ > > >Now if only I could find an 'affordable' FLIR camera........... > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: JSMcGrew(at)aol.com
Date: Aug 23, 2007
Subject: Re: Flap switch install?
Here's where I put mine (pictures attached). Note, one picture has a mirror in it to show switch actuation on the bottom of the flap actuator. For guys on the digest, go to _http://forums.matronics.com_ (http://forums.matronics.com) and search for this thread. The pictures are available there. -Jim 40134 In a message dated 8/19/2007 9:33:13 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time, tdawson-townsend(at)aurora.aero writes: Where have folks installed the micro-switch on the flap system for use with an AOA Sport? I checked the website, but couldn=99t find anything sp ecific on the preferred install location. Pictures appreciated, if you can send them directly to my email address. (us digest folks don=99t get attachments) Thanks, TDT Tim Dawson-Townsend Aurora Flight Sciences _tdt(at)aurora.aero_ (mailto:tdt(at)aurora.aero) 617-500-4812 (office) 617-905-4800 (mobile) Jim "Scooter" McGrew _http://www.mit.edu/~jsmcgrew_ (http://www.mit.edu/~jsmcgrew) t http://discover.aol.com/memed/aolcom30tour ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Sheldon Olesen <saolesen(at)sirentel.net>
Subject: Tough nut on SD-20
Date: Aug 23, 2007
If you are using an SD-20 and a 90 degree oil filter adapter on your RV-10 you will find that placing and tightening the lower inboard nut on the alternator is very difficult. I thought about taking the oil filter adapter off but then it looked like I would have similar problems with the bolts on the adapter. The problem is that the space is so limited that if you can hold the nut to the threads of the stud you can't turn it. After trying off and on for a week I finally came up with a solution. I hot glued the nut to the outside of a 1/2" router bearing and then I glued a small piece of sheet metal to the hole in the center of the bearing making sure it was free to spin. A 90 degree bend in the sheet metal at the bearing got the nut lined up with the stud. I was finally able to get the nut on by holding it in position and my wife spun it on the stud. Breaking the hot glue joints is easy but the nut is still not tight. To tighten the nut I used a tool from Aircraft Tool Supply the Rapco vacuum pump wrench # RA716 ($26.95)which after a small bend did the job nicely. I've enclosed a couple of photos. I hope none of you guys are going to tell me there is a really easy way to do this. Sheldon Olesen #40080 Finishing baffling

________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: FW: [LML] New Avionics
Date: Aug 23, 2007
From: "John W. Cox" <johnwcox(at)pacificnw.com>
John is a noted attorney with one of Oregon's most respected Law firms - Davis, Wright Tremaine. That aside and my general distrust of attorney's in general, his post on avionics is worth posting for the lurking RV-10 crowd solely because he is noted for his kit-building accomplishments. What is more impressive is his spectacular production of a Lancair Legacy it's evolutionary and progressive panel replacements and his ability to "Walk the Walk". With the recent sale of OP Technologies and the slams that Rob Hickman has taken on product delivery, this post shines some needed light on our passion. Oh Yeh, I think I remember reading that Rob was working with (dare I say) Honeywell. Boy, did Matt say the list was quiet? John Cox -----Original Message----- From: Lancair Mailing List [mailto:lml(at)lancaironline.net] On Behalf Of Halle, John Sent: Thursday, August 23, 2007 2:06 PM Subject: [LML] New Avionics In the avalanche of criticisim of this or that avionics manufacturer, one point seems to have been lost: think back 10, or even 5 years ago. A good deal of what homebuilders are routinely putting in their aircraft for all-in panel prices in the $40-100K range was not available at all, anywhere, for any aircraft, at any price. Most of the rest was available in high-end business aircraft for prices in the millions (that's for the panel, not the airplane.) There is a revolution going on in avionics and a great deal of it is being led (for the first time in history) by the experimental market, i.e. by individuals or small groups of individuals with some knowledge, very little money and a dream that they are willing to work 18 hour days, 7 days a week to realize. Many of them have left well-paying, secure, "normal" jobs to pursue that dream and we are the beneficiaries of their efforts. Having gone through the installation of two complete panels in the last six years, I have had an opportunity both to witness and to benefit from this revolution. What my small airplane is now capable of is quite simply amazing. It equals or exceeds the capability of the most advanced airliners in service (in terms of features if not reliability) and costs a miniscule fraction of what the airline systems cost. We have come to expect (and for the most part have been delivered) performance just short of miraculous at prices that, compared to comparable certified products, are laughable. The price we pay (and it is a small one compared to the benefit) is that the cutting edge products that we get with the latest revs available are effectively "beta" products. While the basic system generally works, the latest features often have "glitches" that require tweaking. The small companies that make these products encounter (not surprisingly) unexpected issues that sometimes delay the deployment of some incredible, whizbang feature for a few weeks. The excruciating, expensive and time-consuming testing that goes into a certified product is replaced by the actual, in-use experience of pilots who elect to buy and install these sytems. In the end, everything works but it is a process, not a plug-and-play event. For those who expect everying to work as advertized, there is a simple solution: Go see Honeywell. They will sell you, for several million dollars, an FMS system that works to spec from day one (at least following acceptance tests.) Of course it won't fit in your RV or Lancair or Glassair of whatever so you will have to shell out another $40-60 million to get a G-5 and you will have a really awesome system, just like the one Phil Knight has in the hangar next to mine. For the rest of us, for whom this is neither a viable nor an attractive alternative, we owe an immense debt of gratitude to all of the small avionics manaufacturere (yes, all of them) who have done so much to make possible what, only a few years ago, we could not even have dreamed of. (But I still don't agree with you about the AOA, Rob.) -- For archives and unsub http://mail.lancaironline.net:81/lists/lml/List.html ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: FW: [LML] New Avionics
Date: Aug 23, 2007
From: "John W. Cox" <johnwcox(at)pacificnw.com>
Oh blasphemy. John Halle is with Stoel, Rives not Davis, Wright, Tremaine. Another large group of successful litigators. John Cox #600 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "gary" <speckter(at)comcast.net>
Subject: OP Tech Acquisition
Date: Aug 23, 2007
Thanks Stein for the compliment. Large head feels good Gary -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of SteinAir, Inc. Sent: Thursday, August 23, 2007 5:39 PM Subject: RE: RV10-List: OP Tech Acquisition Well...I truly don't have any more information than anyone else regaring the OP acquisition. What I do know from past lives in the airline business is that Aerosonic is not some small player in a small market. They are a large (many tens of million $$) company that supplies products to very high end and heavy iron. At least in that market I know they are well entrenched and well respected. I've not personally dealt with them or their products in a long time. I also do not yet have any 1st hand knowledge of the situation other than what we all have read online so I'd be remiss to comment any further without knowing any details. What I do know is that both Gary and Deems have REALLY nice panels. The work Gary did on his panel looks like it came out of an professional avionics shop, and I think you'll all be impressed when you see it in the plane. Deems already has a panel that is good looking so I don't want to make his head any bigger! Hopefully we'll all have some good news in the near future. I guess we'll all have to sit and wait to see how this shakes out. Just my 2 cents as usual. Cheers, Stein. >-----Original Message----- >From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com >[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of gary >Sent: Thursday, August 23, 2007 4:18 PM >To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com >Subject: RE: RV10-List: OP Tech Acquisition > > >I was down at Stein's today trying to debug some items on the panel and >needed to call OP for info. Because of the purchase they are not >taking any >calls. Does not give one a warm fuzzy. Visions of Direct to? > >Gary >40274 > >-----Original Message----- >From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com >[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Deems Davis >Sent: Thursday, August 23, 2007 9:59 AM >To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com >Subject: Re: RV10-List: OP Tech Acquisition > > >I don't know, My guess is that they want to continue to support the EXP >market as thats the ONLY source for revenue for OP at the moment. As >all mergers/acquisitions go ultimately it depends on how its managed. Op >was growing and expanding at the time. (their prices were increasing as >well!).There major focus this past year has been certification of their >10 inch product for the Cirus retro fit market. Its got all of the >function that the G1000 has (minus the same functions that we have in >the EXP product, syn vis, HITS, etc). Some of the things they are >putting in the certified product have found their way into the EXP >product recently (XM weather, e.g) and talking to Darren, they have a >list of others they want to move as well. > >Deems Davis # 406 >'Its all done....Its just not put together' >http://deemsrv10.com/ > > >Now if only I could find an 'affordable' FLIR camera........... > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: What engine would you buy?
Date: Aug 23, 2007
From: "John W. Cox" <johnwcox(at)pacificnw.com>
Here is a testimonial that I take to the bank. For those lurkers who are making a single lifetime selection, it is worthy of the time you invest to research. I don't know if they do Subies yet ;-)? John Cox (no financial interest in BPE just in long-term sustained safe flight and enjoyable hours of operation of ownership after the purchase decision) #40600 ________________________________ From: Lancair Mailing List [mailto:lml(at)lancaironline.net] On Behalf Of Brent Regan Sent: Thursday, August 23, 2007 2:06 PM Subject: [LML] Re: What engine would you buy? Monty Barrett did the original overhaul on the IO540K Lycoming I converted to a TIO540 for my IV-P. I used to own a race prep shop and have built dozens of endurance racing Porsche and Mazda engines. I also had a dynamometer in the shop. Before picking BPA to do the overhaul I visited his shop and talked to Monty at length. Not only does he know how to build engines, he knows engine theory and is well respected by those who design engines. I have over 1,000 hours on my engine and only the magnetos, plugs, filters and oil have been changed. Compression is still in the mid 70's You may be able to find someone who can do as good a job as BPE but I seriously doubt you can find someone who can do a better job. Regards Brent Regan ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 23, 2007
From: Deems Davis <deemsdavis(at)cox.net>
Subject: Re: Tough nut on SD-20
When BPE built my engine Allen said that if I'd send him the SD-20 they'd install it during the build, he said it would be a !#$$!$ afterward, now I know. THANKS Allen! Deems Davis # 406 'Its all done....Its just not put together' http://deemsrv10.com/ Sheldon Olesen wrote: > If you are using an SD-20 and a 90 degree oil filter adapter on your > RV-10 you will find that placing and tightening the lower inboard nut > on the alternator is very difficult. I thought about taking the oil > filter adapter off but then it looked like I would have similar > problems with the bolts on the adapter. The problem is that the space > is so limited that if you can hold the nut to the threads of the stud > you can't turn it. After trying off and on for a week I finally came > up with a solution. I hot glued the nut to the outside of a 1/2" > router bearing and then I glued a small piece of sheet metal to the > hole in the center of the bearing making sure it was free to spin. A > 90 degree bend in the sheet metal at the bearing got the nut lined up > with the stud. I was finally able to get the nut on by holding it in > position and my wife spun it on the stud. Breaking the hot glue > joints is easy but the nut is still not tight. To tighten the nut I > used a tool from Aircraft Tool Supply the Rapco vacuum pump wrench # > RA716 ($26.95)which after a small bend did the job nicely. I've > enclosed a couple of photos. > > I hope none of you guys are going to tell me there is a really easy > way to do this. > > Sheldon Olesen > #40080 Finishing baffling > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > >
> > href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List > > href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com > >
> ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 23, 2007
From: Kelly McMullen <kellym(at)aviating.com>
Subject: Re: What's required for IFR operation of an Experimental
A/C? Not sure you REALLY want to ask your questions, but the person at SDL FSDO that knows something on the subject, if I remember the name correctly is something like Bruce Bessette. Deems Davis wrote: > > Boy, is this opening up a can of worms ! I've seen the other responses > to this inquiry, I think I've read most everything I can find on this > subject, as in most things the devil is in the details. E.g. What do > you need to have to be legal to fly IFR WAAS approaches in an EXP > aircraft? Do you need a TSO'd WAAS GPS? (I'm under the impression that > you do, as opposed to a WAAS 'enabled/capable GPS'). If the WAAS GPS > is a sensor (Freeflight) and not a Garmin 430/480/480 and is > attached/integrated with an EXP EFIS system, does the EFIS system > need to be able to supply the RAIM error notification for the WAAS GPS > ? (I dont' believe any of the EXP EFIS systems currently do this) . > ?????? > > Pat Thyssen, you got your ears on???? > > I've put 3 calls into my FSDO and left 3 messages on this topic and > haven't got a call back. > > I spoke with one builder who indicated he was told by his FSDO that > they are individually approving ea EXP IFR aircraft !!! > > > Deems Davis # 406 > 'Its all done....Its just not put together' > http://deemsrv10.com/ > > Bill Reining wrote: >> >> I had a discussion tonight after our monthly EAA chapter meeting with >> another builder about glass panels and backup steam gauges. He had >> heard that the major reason folks put in backup steam gauges (e.g. >> analog airspeed, altimeter and horizon) is: they are a relatively >> inexpensive way to obtain some TSO'd instruments. Why TSO? Because >> they have demonstrated compliance to various specs necessary for IFR >> qualification. On the other hand, the various glass EFIS are not >> certified, thus have no credentials to prove they can meet IFR >> specs. It's not that they have to be certified, just that one has to >> be able to show that certain important instruments meet IFR >> requirements (whatever that might be... accuracy? stability?) Well >> anyway, does any of this make sense? Perhaps a better question: are >> there really any requirements that must be met before an Experimental >> category aircraft can fly IFR? >> >> -------- >> Bill (and Jon) Reining >> 40514 >> >> >> >> >> Read this topic online here: >> >> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=130414#130414 >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Tough nut on SD-20
Date: Aug 24, 2007
From: "BPA" <BPA(at)bpaengines.com>
There is...Snap-On makes a 7/16 open end angle wrench. It's worth having in the tool box. Oh, you're welcome Deems. NICE COWL Allen -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Sheldon Olesen Sent: Thursday, August 23, 2007 8:49 PM Subject: RV10-List: Tough nut on SD-20 If you are using an SD-20 and a 90 degree oil filter adapter on your RV-10 you will find that placing and tightening the lower inboard nut on the alternator is very difficult. I thought about taking the oil filter adapter off but then it looked like I would have similar problems with the bolts on the adapter. The problem is that the space is so limited that if you can hold the nut to the threads of the stud you can't turn it. After trying off and on for a week I finally came up with a solution. I hot glued the nut to the outside of a 1/2" router bearing and then I glued a small piece of sheet metal to the hole in the center of the bearing making sure it was free to spin. A 90 degree bend in the sheet metal at the bearing got the nut lined up with the stud. I was finally able to get the nut on by holding it in position and my wife spun it on the stud. Breaking the hot glue joints is easy but the nut is still not tight. To tighten the nut I used a tool from Aircraft Tool Supply the Rapco vacuum pump wrench # RA716 ($26.95)which after a small bend did the job nicely. I've enclosed a couple of photos. I hope none of you guys are going to tell me there is a really easy way to do this. Sheldon Olesen #40080 Finishing baffling ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 24, 2007
From: linn Walters <pitts_pilot(at)bellsouth.net>
Subject: Re: Tough nut on SD-20
Easy??? There probably isn't an 'easy' way!!! I find a set of crows foot wrenches invaluable in places like this. For starting a nut on a hard to reach stud, a flexible 'grabber' works wonders. Works for washers too. If I can't get the nut to grab the first thread with the grabber, I resort to using a small phillips screwdriver to guide the nut onto the stud and a flat bladed screwdriver to spin the nut until it catches. Linn Sheldon Olesen wrote: > If you are using an SD-20 and a 90 degree oil filter adapter on your > RV-10 you will find that placing and tightening the lower inboard nut > on the alternator is very difficult. I thought about taking the oil > filter adapter off but then it looked like I would have similar > problems with the bolts on the adapter. The problem is that the > space is so limited that if you can hold the nut to the threads of > the stud you can't turn it. After trying off and on for a week I > finally came up with a solution. I hot glued the nut to the outside > of a 1/2" router bearing and then I glued a small piece of sheet > metal to the hole in the center of the bearing making sure it was > free to spin. A 90 degree bend in the sheet metal at the bearing got > the nut lined up with the stud. I was finally able to get the nut > on by holding it in position and my wife spun it on the stud. > Breaking the hot glue joints is easy but the nut is still not tight. > To tighten the nut I used a tool from Aircraft Tool Supply the Rapco > vacuum pump wrench # RA716 ($26.95)which after a small bend did the > job nicely. I've enclosed a couple of photos. > > I hope none of you guys are going to tell me there is a really easy > way to do this. > > Sheldon Olesen > #40080 Finishing baffling ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Testing 1 2 3 - Is This Thing On? Where'd Everyone
Go?
Date: Aug 24, 2007
From: "Chris Johnston" <CJohnston(at)popsound.com>
harrumph. just getting out from under an 80 hours in 5 days work week with a crazy Icelandic band. didn't make it to osh for some re-invigoration, so i've been trudging along making my nutty modifications on a perfectly acceptable design. apparently, i'm crazy. i've decided to limit myself now to no further modifications unless absolutely necessary. i'm going to build exactly (sort of) to plans from here on out. mods take time, and make you bonkers because there are no steps to check off! i'm getting to the bottom of my list of custom things that i really care about, and now i can get back on track. did the final riveting, bolting, and epoxying of the cabin top to the fuse over the weekend. phew! the list of nutty mods: tailcone shelf accuracy avionics overhead console seatbelt system re-design throttle quadrant sunk into tunnel custom reverse-engraved closeout panels for overhead console (temp ones in place for now, but the cad files are final) custom reverse-engraved closeout panel for throttle quadrant/fuel selector i think the list goes further, but this is all the stuff that i've been stuck on. i'll have to take a day in the near future to update the website to reflect the progress. i keep falling asleep before i can get to it in the evenings! i did attach a couple pics of the main closeout panel for the accuracy avionics overhead console that i made out of reverse-engraveable acrylic. i built the logo in a cad program, made a cam file, and cut it using my CNC desktop mill. the protective plastic is still stuck to the front, but you get the idea. as you enter the aircraft, this should be clearly visible, (the lettering is about 13" wide and 2.5" tall) and since it's reverse engraved, i'll be backlighting it for use as the cabin overhead light. double duty. sweet. time consuming. yup. i've lost my mind. got to get back to checking stuff off in the plans.... cj aka "bonkers" #40410 www.perfectlygoodairplane.net ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Testing 1 2 3 - Is This Thing On? Where'd Everyone
Go?
Date: Aug 24, 2007
From: "Chris Johnston" <CJohnston(at)popsound.com>
Whoops. Forgot the pics ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 24, 2007
From: curtis groote <cgroote1(at)yahoo.com>
Subject: Aircraft tugs
I'd like to get a tug for the -10 but in looking around I find that Power Tow does not have anything readymade and Skyline Aviation's Nosedragger will not work. Anyone have any ideas? ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Tough nut on SD-20
Date: Aug 24, 2007
From: "Condrey, Bob (US SSA)" <bob.condrey(at)baesystems.com>
There is a Snap-on wrench that Ed Hayden told me about last year and that made it a LOT easier. It was still difficult but as I recall, I was able to install the alternator in a single evening with the engine on the mount. Bob -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Sheldon Olesen Sent: Thursday, August 23, 2007 10:49 PM Subject: RV10-List: Tough nut on SD-20 If you are using an SD-20 and a 90 degree oil filter adapter on your RV-10 you will find that placing and tightening the lower inboard nut on the alternator is very difficult. I thought about taking the oil filter adapter off but then it looked like I would have similar problems with the bolts on the adapter. The problem is that the space is so limited that if you can hold the nut to the threads of the stud you can't turn it. After trying off and on for a week I finally came up with a solution. I hot glued the nut to the outside of a 1/2" router bearing and then I glued a small piece of sheet metal to the hole in the center of the bearing making sure it was free to spin. A 90 degree bend in the sheet metal at the bearing got the nut lined up with the stud. I was finally able to get the nut on by holding it in position and my wife spun it on the stud. Breaking the hot glue joints is easy but the nut is still not tight. To tighten the nut I used a tool from Aircraft Tool Supply the Rapco vacuum pump wrench # RA716 ($26.95)which after a small bend did the job nicely. I've enclosed a couple of photos. I hope none of you guys are going to tell me there is a really easy way to do this. Sheldon Olesen #40080 Finishing baffling ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Aircraft tugs
Date: Aug 24, 2007
From: dougpflyrv(at)aol.com
I GOT A USED LAWN TRACTOR AND MY MECH. MADE A TOW BAR. WORKS GREAT WITH ABOUT $400 INVESTED. Doug Preston N372RV -----Original Message----- From: curtis groote <cgroote1(at)yahoo.com> Sent: Fri, 24 Aug 2007 11:02 am Subject: RV10-List: Aircraft tugs I'd like to get a tug for the -10 but in looking around I find that Power Tow does not have anything readymade and Skyline Aviation's Nosedragger will not work. Anyone have any ideas? ________________________________________________________________________ Email and AIM finally together. You've gotta check out free AOL Mail! - http://mail.aol.com ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 24, 2007
From: Scott Schmidt <scottmschmidt(at)yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: RV-10 builders in quiet summer retreat
The lights in the smoke system really look great. I am kicking myself for not going up with those guys now. =0AThanks for the link John. =0A=0Ado no t archive=0A =0AScott Schmidt=0Ascottmschmidt(at)yahoo.com=0A=0A=0A=0A----- Or iginal Message ----=0AFrom: John W. Cox <johnwcox(at)pacificnw.com>=0ATo: rv10 -list(at)matronics.com=0ASent: Friday, August 24, 2007 9:48:35 AM=0ASubject: R V10-List: RV-10 builders in quiet summer retreat=0A=0A=0Ahttp://www.youtube .com/watch?v=AN2WlS-VjMo=0AFor the many who are lurking, here is a teaser as to why I didn=92t spend more time with my RV-10 friends this year on th e ground at OSH. At least Paul Grimstad (#450)and Deems Davis (#406)can re late.=0ASH (Sierra Hotel)' Redstars in action. =93Great aircraft / Lousy politics=94. My other plane is the RV-10. Next year is the 50th anniversa ry of the CJ-6 Redstars, and you can expect a Really Big Show there. Now - =================== ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 24, 2007
From: Scott Schmidt <scottmschmidt(at)yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: Control stick freq flip/flop
Sounds like I will be the first to be neutral on this issue. =0AI have the com and nav flip/flop on my stick and honestly I don't use it much. That d oesn't mean I wouldn't put it in.=0AFor me, the time when I am changing fre quency the most is either in very busy class B airspace or IFR. During tho se times you are changing at the request of ATC, you typically don't know w hat frequency your switching to, and your hand is already on the panel anyw ay rotating the knob.=0A =0AThis may sound crazy, but I wish I was able to wire the volume for my xm radio into the stick. I find myself adjusting tha t depending on if I like the tunes that are on. =0A =0AScott Schmidt=0Asco ttmschmidt(at)yahoo.com =0A=0A=0A=0A----- Original Message ----=0AFrom: Deems Davis =0ATo: rv10-list(at)matronics.com=0ASent: Thursday, August 23, 2007 1:53:41 PM=0ASubject: RV10-List: Control stick freq flip/fl >=0A=0AI'm debating whether or not to connect the Freq Flip-Flop switch to my =0Acontrol grips. My initial thought is to NOT connect it, I have the =0Acapability of changing freq's either through my EFIS or direct through =0Athe radio/s and adding yet another option increases complexity and =0Afa ilure points. However in the back of my mind I recall a post from =0Asomeon e how either loved or hated this feature on their stick, anybody =0Aout the re?=0A=0ADeems Davis # 406=0A'Its all done....Its just not put together'=0A ======== ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Aircraft tugs
From: "2eyedocs" <2eyedocs(at)tx.rr.com>
Date: Aug 24, 2007
dougpflyrv(at)aol.com wrote: > I GOT A USED LAWN TRACTOR AND MY MECH. MADE A TOW BAR. > WORKS GREAT WITH ABOUT $400 INVESTED. > Doug Preston > N372RV > > > -- In a past life I had a HEAVY 182 that I had to roll uphill into my hangar. Bought a used electric golf cart with similar fabricated attachment, and that worked perfectly for several years. Also made a nice vehicle for those bathroom runs at the airport. [Shocked] Mark Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=130818#130818 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "RV Builder (Michael Sausen)" <rvbuilder(at)sausen.net>
Date: Aug 24, 2007
Subject: Aircraft tugs
There was an article in the 2005 April Kitplanes that shows you how to make a homemade power tow hook on the cheap. You should be able to look it up now if you have a subscription. Michael -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of curtis groote Sent: Friday, August 24, 2007 11:03 AM Subject: RV10-List: Aircraft tugs I'd like to get a tug for the -10 but in looking around I find that Power Tow does not have anything readymade and Skyline Aviation's Nosedragger will not work. Anyone have any ideas? ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 24, 2007
From: Tim Lewis <Tim_Lewis(at)msm.umr.edu>
Subject: Re: Aircraft tugs
I got a Tow Buddy from Wag Aero. Works for my RV-6A and my RV-10. http://store.wagaero.com/product_info.php?products_id=9307 tim -- Tim Lewis -- HEF (Manassas, VA) RV-6A N47TD -- 900 hrs RV-10 #40059 under construction curtis groote wrote: > > I'd like to get a tug for the -10 but in looking > around I find that Power Tow does not have anything > readymade and Skyline Aviation's Nosedragger will not > work. Anyone have any ideas? > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "John Lenhardt" <av8or(at)cox.net>
Subject: Re: Retractable 3 point seat belt
Date: Aug 24, 2007
How about sharing them with the group? I'd like to see them too. JT #40262 Send me a separate email and I'll send you a few pictures of the install on mine. Or better yet, ask Dave McNeill at dlm46007(at)cox.net. He worked the design and installation. I was the first one to install them in a 10. Grumpy N184JM ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Albert Gardner" <ibspud(at)roadrunner.com>
Subject: Racing with Deems
Date: Aug 24, 2007
OK Deems, have you got any of these on your plane yet? Trial fit of wings today. It's starting to look like a flying machine. Albert Gardner Yuma, AZ ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Albert Gardner" <ibspud(at)roadrunner.com>
Subject: Racing with Deems
Date: Aug 24, 2007
Oops! I attached the wrong pic-probably very few of us have a chopper on any kind on our planes. Albert -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list- Subject: RV10-List: Racing with Deems OK Deems, have you got any of these on your plane yet? Trial fit of wings today. It's starting to look like a flying machine. Albert Gardner Yuma, AZ ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "ddddsp1(at)juno.com" <ddddsp1(at)juno.com>
Date: Aug 25, 2007
Subject: Air conditioning?
I ran across this website the other nite........http://www.swampy.net/ai rcraft.html.......curious if anyone has seen one of these or checked the m out? They appear to be smaller than the ArticAir units that were at OSH 07. DEEMS............they are located in Mesa, AZ...........any idea if ther e are worth the money? Dean 805HL ________________________________________________________________________ Surprise your friends with a FREE Juno Video Mail! Sign up today. 177 ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: 611TT Paint is done, interior is next
From: "tintopranch" <mark_sutherland(at)yahoo.com>
Date: Aug 25, 2007
see attached[/img][/img] -------- MARK SUTHERLAND RV-10 40292 Flying since June 07 Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=130966#130966 Attachments: http://forums.matronics.com//files/img_2588_844.jpg ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 25, 2007
From: Deems Davis <deemsdavis(at)cox.net>
Subject: Re: Air conditioning?
I don't know about the Swampy, I bought the large Artic Air @ OSH, it just fits in the baggage area of the -10. and it works fine ...... in the garage...... (not in direct sunlight) Deems Davis # 406 'Its all done....Its just not put together' http://deemsrv10.com/ ddddsp1(at)juno.com wrote: > > I ran across this website the other > nite........http://www.swampy.net/aircraft.html.......curious if > anyone has seen one of these or checked them out? They appear to be > smaller than the ArticAir units that were at OSH 07. > > DEEMS............they are located in Mesa, AZ...........any idea if > there are worth the money? > > Dean 805HL > > > ________________________________________________________________________ > /2-2130421-177">Surprise your friends with a FREE Juno Video Mail! > Sign up today. > > * > > > * ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 25, 2007
From: "Stephen Blank" <sblankdds(at)gmail.com>
Subject: Re: 611TT Paint is done, interior is next
Mark, WOW, looks great. Makes me want to go rivet right now!!! Steve On 8/25/07, tintopranch wrote: > > > -------- > MARK SUTHERLAND > RV-10 40292 > Flying since June 07 > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=130966#130966 > > > Attachments: > > http://forums.matronics.com//files/img_2588_844.jpg > > -- Stephen G. Blank, DDS 184 NW Central Park Plaza Port St. Lucie, FL 34986 772-475-5556 >>> Cell ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: 611TT Paint is done, interior is next
Date: Aug 25, 2007
From: "John W. Cox" <johnwcox(at)pacificnw.com>
Smart, Clean, Simple and Striking. Great Ramp Appearance. Congrats. John C. -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of tintopranch Sent: Saturday, August 25, 2007 8:13 AM Subject: RV10-List: 611TT Paint is done, interior is next see attached[/img][/img] -------- MARK SUTHERLAND RV-10 40292 Flying since June 07 Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=130966#130966 Attachments: http://forums.matronics.com//files/img_2588_844.jpg ________________________________________________________________________________
From: kilopapa(at)antelecom.net
Subject: Re: Testing 1 2 3 - Is This Thing On? Where'd Everyone Go?
Date: Aug 25, 2007
Thanks for the write up. Kevin 40494 no not archive ----- Original Message Follows ----- From: "Wayne Edgerton" <wayne.e(at)grandecom.net> Subject: Re: RV10-List: Testing 1 2 3 - Is This Thing On? Where'd Everyone Go? Date: Thu, 23 Aug 2007 07:35:14 -0500 >Hell I thought everyone made there 10's a trail dragger not >just me :>} >Wayne Edgerton #40336 >N602WT flying ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 25, 2007
From: "Rick Leach" <papadaddyo(at)tampabay.rr.com>
Subject: 611TT Paint is done, interior is next
Very nice Mark, Congrats Rick Leach 40397 -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of tintopranch Sent: Saturday, August 25, 2007 11:13 AM Subject: RV10-List: 611TT Paint is done, interior is next see attached[/img][/img] -------- MARK SUTHERLAND RV-10 40292 Flying since June 07 Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=130966#130966 Attachments: http://forums.matronics.com//files/img_2588_844.jpg ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Bob Leffler" <rvmail(at)thelefflers.com>
Subject: Testing 1 2 3 - Is This Thing On? Where'd Everyone Go?
Date: Aug 26, 2007
So where are all the pictures, enquiring minds want to know..... >Lloyd, Daniel R. wrote: > > I will be taking all kinds of pictures tomorrow, once we get it fitted > up, and I finally get to install my $500 worth of Mil-Spec fasteners, > they have been sitting on the bench just begging to be put in. > Oh and I get to fly two additional RV10 Subaru builders, you guys better > watch out because we are multiplying! > Dan > N289DT RV10E Flying > "Counting the days to my "free" Ice Cream Sundae in Arizona!" > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: PILOTDDS(at)aol.com
Date: Aug 26, 2007
Subject: sept 2006 service letter axle-wheel bearing
When doing routine maintenance on my nose wheel, due to a felt vibration, I inspected the axle and wheel bearing. I discovered the bearing was no longer preloading and the axle sleeve was spinning and damaging the forks. There was approximately a fifteen thousandths groove worn in the fork on one side only and the bearing was not preloading. When I originally made the installation, which was prior to Van's letter, I noted that I had to shorten the axle shaft on a mill in order to get the spacers to preload the wheel bearing. The bearing functioned well at the time and the wheel and tire spun with considerable resistance. In effect, I complied with Van's recommendation in the September 2006 letter. I am concerned that there may be other individuals with similar problems and I would recommend you check the front axles periodically. I know I am rehashing a subject that there was considerable comment on, but in light of the fact that I did comply with Van's recommendations I feel this may be somewhat of a new issue. I recall from earlier discussions some of you had used a set screw to prevent this from happening, if anyone has any information or reports of success, after some time in service, I would appreciate comment. It should also be noted, that I had the earlier stainless steel spacers. Great airplane. I hope everyone who is flying is having half as much fun as I am. Sincerely, Jim Rore ************************************** all-new AOL at http://discover.aol.com/memed/aolcom30tour ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Chris and Susie McGough" <VHMUM(at)bigpond.com>
Subject: Spinner help
Date: Aug 27, 2007
Bit confused with spinner as first part of instructions say match drill all the #30 holes to1/8 of the doubler ring to spinner back plate. What 1/8th holes regards Chris ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Testing 1 2 3 - Is This Thing On? Where'd Everyone Go?
Date: Aug 26, 2007
From: "Lloyd, Daniel R." <LloydDR(at)wernerco.com>
On the Eggenfellner page, click news and there are several, and we installed a gullwing hinge on the top, so all the builder does is undo the mil-spec fasteners on one side and the entire side of the cowl raises up to expose the engine. This mod, splitting the cowl down the top and bottom makes it very easy to de-cowl the plane and not have to worry about the gear leg fairing or more importantly the 3/4 bladed prop. The 10 builders using the 3 bladed MT might look at something like this also, it was an easy mod to accomplish. Dan N289DT RV10E -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Bob Leffler Sent: Sunday, August 26, 2007 4:14 PM Subject: RE: RV10-List: Testing 1 2 3 - Is This Thing On? Where'd Everyone Go? So where are all the pictures, enquiring minds want to know..... >Lloyd, Daniel R. wrote: > > I will be taking all kinds of pictures tomorrow, once we get it fitted > up, and I finally get to install my $500 worth of Mil-Spec fasteners, > they have been sitting on the bench just begging to be put in. > Oh and I get to fly two additional RV10 Subaru builders, you guys better > watch out because we are multiplying! > Dan > N289DT RV10E Flying > "Counting the days to my "free" Ice Cream Sundae in Arizona!" > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "ddddsp1(at)juno.com" <ddddsp1(at)juno.com>
Date: Aug 27, 2007
Subject: Re: Spinner help
Tip on the SPINNER: If you wanna be able to use CS washers and flush sc rews ...........DO NOT center drill the holes for the back spinner plate per the instruction. If you do there is not enough room for the CS was her. Drill the holes more toward the spinner tip......approx 1/8" off c enter line. DEAN 805HL ________________________________________________________________________ Surprise your friends with a FREE Juno Video Mail! Sign up today. 177 ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 27, 2007
From: "bruce breckenridge" <bbreckenridge(at)gmail.com>
Subject: Mural
Fellow builders - a favor! Becky and I spend weekends at 7s9 and have started a wall mural of sectionals in 2005. Naturally, I've got it covered from Vancouver Island to Gaudalupe Mexico, but it's going really slow. I'd like to add more to the wall, which is about 40ft long. IF you have an expired sectional in a not-too-ratty condition, and wouldn't mind mailing it to me instead of disposing of it, please contact me off list for my address, and, so that I can save you the postage if I've already received one. Thanks! Bruce Breckenridge 40018 Wings ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Three Bladed Hartzell & IO-540 Combination
Date: Aug 28, 2007
From: "Patrick Pulis" <patrick.pulis(at)seagas.com.au>
________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Jerry Hansen" <jerry-hansen(at)cox.net>
Subject: You've gotta read this
Date: Aug 27, 2007
http://www.avweb.com/news/ceocockpit/ceo_of_the_cockpit_73_those_devilish_li ttle_airplanes_195936-1.html Jerry Hansen Gillespie Field, CA ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Three Bladed Hartzell & IO-540 Combination
Date: Aug 27, 2007
From: "John W. Cox" <johnwcox(at)pacificnw.com>
Patrick - Don't go there. The Hartzell guys were evasive at Arlington and downright rude at OSH. They want $27,000 for the three blade composite which is now Type Certificated for the Cirrus SR-22 G2 and G3. Which by the way runs on a Continental IO-550N or TSIO-550 from Tornado Alley. Several airshow performers have a more robust composite three blade on IO-540s running higher compression pistons at upward of $35,000. Their official answer, "Hah, If you want a three blade Hartzell for the IO-540 then get VAN to personally request it otherwise.... Its not for sale on kitbuilts to individual builders". I came away licking my wounds and swearing that Deems and those who have gone with AeroComp and an American Propeller three color finished paint job have chosen wisely. If necessary, I kept their business cards in my "Do not ever frequent business with these guys". Just my opinion. Their two blade aluminum scimitar is the best you can get for the RV-10 if you want to climb slower (1700 fpm) and have VANS blessing. John C #40600 -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Patrick Pulis Sent: Monday, August 27, 2007 4:00 PM Subject: RV10-List: Three Bladed Hartzell & IO-540 Combination ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Ben Westfall" <rv10(at)sinkrate.com>
Subject: You've gotta read this
Date: Aug 27, 2007
Ha Ha. from this article is the best quote ever. It had to happen," Sally said. "Airline managements are running out of excuses for their extremely poor behavior and performance. They can't get any more pay cuts out of anybody. They've taken all of that. They can't take my pension away. They took that away last year. Unless they get a change in the FARs, all they are going to get out of me is a thousand hours a year and their ramp workers are making less money than an orange picker in Florida. "God forbid they change their methods of operation. There must be another scapegoat so they don't have to admit they are lamer than an Elvis impersonator at a snow-cone stand grand opening. You watch -- within a year, I predict the management people will start blaming the passengers for being too heavy and costing too much money to haul around." -Ben PDX #40579 (the end of Sec29 is in sight. finally) _____ From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Jerry Hansen Sent: Monday, August 27, 2007 4:38 PM Subject: RV10-List: You've gotta read this http://www.avweb.com/news/ceocockpit/ceo_of_the_cockpit_73_those_devilish_li ttle_airplanes_195936-1.html Jerry Hansen Gillespie Field, CA ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Mike Kraus" <n223rv(at)wolflakeairport.net>
Subject: Flap switch install?
Date: Aug 27, 2007
Here is what I did, hopefully you can see it in the picture. I riveted a tab on the end of the flap horn (left side of picture) and it hits the switch on the right side of the picture. -Mike Kraus -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of tdawson-townsend(at)aurora.aero Sent: Sunday, August 19, 2007 9:27 PM Subject: RV10-List: Flap switch install? Where have folks installed the micro-switch on the flap system for use with an AOA Sport? I checked the website, but couldn't find anything specific on the preferred install location. Pictures appreciated, if you can send them directly to my email address. (us digest folks don't get attachments) Thanks, TDT Tim Dawson-Townsend Aurora Flight Sciences tdt(at)aurora.aero 617-500-4812 (office) 617-905-4800 (mobile) ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Three Bladed Hartzell & IO-540 Combination
Date: Aug 27, 2007
From: "John W. Cox" <johnwcox(at)pacificnw.com>
Correction, the second engine choice was a Turbo-Normalized TNIO not the TSIO as I unfortunately typed too fast. I have several pictures of multi color blade paint schemes which can match airframe designs if readers want to consider an AeroComposite. Visit Deems site for his specific finish. Hartzell makes a great two blade metallic but I find value in three and the dampening effect of composite. The replaceable nickel leading edge and ability to correct rock chips is a big consideration. Wouldn't it be a perfect world if VANS would offer the Hartzell 3 blade composite to RV-10 builders?? John -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of John W. Cox Sent: Monday, August 27, 2007 4:56 PM Subject: RE: RV10-List: Three Bladed Hartzell & IO-540 Combination Patrick - Don't go there. The Hartzell guys were evasive at Arlington and downright rude at OSH. They want $27,000 for the three blade composite which is now Type Certificated for the Cirrus SR-22 G2 and G3. Which by the way runs on a Continental IO-550N or TSIO-550 from Tornado Alley. Several airshow performers have a more robust composite three blade on IO-540s running higher compression pistons at upward of $35,000. Their official answer, "Hah, If you want a three blade Hartzell for the IO-540 then get VAN to personally request it otherwise.... Its not for sale on kitbuilts to individual builders". I came away licking my wounds and swearing that Deems and those who have gone with AeroComp and an American Propeller three color finished paint job have chosen wisely. If necessary, I kept their business cards in my "Do not ever frequent business with these guys". Just my opinion. Their two blade aluminum scimitar is the best you can get for the RV-10 if you want to climb slower (1700 fpm) and have VANS blessing. John C #40600 -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Patrick Pulis Sent: Monday, August 27, 2007 4:00 PM Subject: RV10-List: Three Bladed Hartzell & IO-540 Combination ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 27, 2007
From: Deems Davis <deemsdavis(at)cox.net>
Subject: Op Tech Panel Pictures
Some folks are curious about the Op Tech EFIS screens. Today I got my reassembled, painted, silkscreened, rewired panel powered up and shot some pictures. I posted them on the website: http://deemsrv10.com/album/Panel/slides/DSC05320.html Dual Alt, Dual Batt Dual Op Tech 8.4" 1500 NIT portrait EFIS Dynon D10A backup EFIS, (w/ internal b/u battery) Freeflight WAAS GPS Heads UP XM weather receiver SL30 SL40 JPI EIU Shadin ADC Crossbow AHRS I haven't flown behind these yet, but every time I power them up and 'play' with them, I get all itchy!!!!!!!!! Deems Davis # 406 'Its all done....Its just not put together' http://deemsrv10.com/ ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "gary" <speckter(at)comcast.net>
Subject: Op Tech Panel Pictures
Date: Aug 28, 2007
When I power mine up it doesn't look near as cool because the moving map shows the surrounding area which is all green because the Midwest is pretty flat. Looks good. Gary 40274 -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Deems Davis Sent: Monday, August 27, 2007 10:19 PM Subject: RV10-List: Op Tech Panel Pictures Some folks are curious about the Op Tech EFIS screens. Today I got my reassembled, painted, silkscreened, rewired panel powered up and shot some pictures. I posted them on the website: http://deemsrv10.com/album/Panel/slides/DSC05320.html Dual Alt, Dual Batt Dual Op Tech 8.4" 1500 NIT portrait EFIS Dynon D10A backup EFIS, (w/ internal b/u battery) Freeflight WAAS GPS Heads UP XM weather receiver SL30 SL40 JPI EIU Shadin ADC Crossbow AHRS I haven't flown behind these yet, but every time I power them up and 'play' with them, I get all itchy!!!!!!!!! Deems Davis # 406 'Its all done....Its just not put together' http://deemsrv10.com/ ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Rob Hunter" <rwhunter(at)integra.net>
Subject: Fuel Tank Sealant
Date: Aug 28, 2007
How long can you go past the expiration date on the fuel tank sealant if you kept it in the freezer since you received it. Rob Hunter 40432 Fuel tanks ________________________________________________________________________________
From: JSMcGrew(at)aol.com
Date: Aug 28, 2007
Subject: Protecting Fiberglass Parts
I've realized it is going to be while before I get paint on my RV-10 so I think I need to put something on the fiberglass parts to keep them from being damaged from sunlight. It is hangared so it only gets exposed when flying or parked at a destination airfield. I was thinking of just putting a coat of some inexpensive Rustoleum primer on all the exposed fiberglass, do you think that will that provide the UV protection necessary? -Jim 40134 Jim "Scooter" McGrew _http://www.mit.edu/~jsmcgrew_ (http://www.mit.edu/~jsmcgrew) http://discover.aol.com/memed/aolcom30tour ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 28, 2007
From: "pascal" <rv10builder(at)verizon.net>
Subject: Re: Protecting Fiberglass Parts
A few years ago I built a fairing for my motorcycle. I used a walmart brand spray primer that was for wicker and fiberglass (rustoleum is more for metals) I painted it yellow and the bike sits outside while I build. No loss of color, no flaking, etc.. granted the speed is less than an RV but it works. Just get a primer that works for fiberglass and you'll be fine. Not sure about the UV protection however, you might want to spray some paint on top of the primer for the extra protection. Personally, I would get a Home depot brand (behr) white primer/paint and either spray it or roll it on. Pascal ----- Original Message ----- From: JSMcGrew(at)aol.com To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com Sent: Tuesday, August 28, 2007 7:24 AM Subject: RV10-List: Protecting Fiberglass Parts I've realized it is going to be while before I get paint on my RV-10 so I think I need to put something on the fiberglass parts to keep them from being damaged from sunlight. It is hangared so it only gets exposed when flying or parked at a destination airfield. I was thinking of just putting a coat of some inexpensive Rustoleum primer on all the exposed fiberglass, do you think that will that provide the UV protection necessary? -Jim 40134 Jim "Scooter" McGrew http://www.mit.edu/~jsmcgrew AOL.com. ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Mark Ritter" <mritter509(at)msn.com>
Subject: Composite Prop Repair
Date: Aug 28, 2007
Does anyone know where I can find information on repairing nicks in an MT composite prop (or any composite prop for that matter). I picked up a several rock nicks over in Baja and used some JB Weld to repair the prop that seems to be working but not sure if this is the best way. Mark RV-10/N410MR _________________________________________________________________ Booking a flight? Know when to buy with airfare predictions on MSN Travel. http://travel.msn.com/Articles/aboutfarecast.aspx&ocid=T001MSN25A07001 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Rob Hunter" <rwhunter(at)integra.net>
Subject: Composite Prop Repair
Date: Aug 28, 2007
Mark, Download the manual of the MT site and it will give you methods of repair and what might have to be sent back to the shop. http://www.mt-propeller.com/pdf/manuals/e-118.pdf Rob -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Mark Ritter Sent: Tuesday, August 28, 2007 10:26 AM Subject: RV10-List: Composite Prop Repair Does anyone know where I can find information on repairing nicks in an MT composite prop (or any composite prop for that matter). I picked up a several rock nicks over in Baja and used some JB Weld to repair the prop that seems to be working but not sure if this is the best way. Mark RV-10/N410MR _________________________________________________________________ Booking a flight? Know when to buy with airfare predictions on MSN Travel. http://travel.msn.com/Articles/aboutfarecast.aspx&ocid=T001MSN25A07001 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "RV Builder (Michael Sausen)" <rvbuilder(at)sausen.net>
Date: Aug 28, 2007
Subject: Protecting Fiberglass Parts
I believe you need something with a very high solids content in order to protect from UV which is the primary concern. Just painting it won't do th e job. I've seen fiberglass microwave antennas that were painted with a ra ttle can paint and a year later it was in rough shape. If it was me I would spend the extra couple $ and put on a coat of UV Smo othprime even if it means sanding it off later just to do it again. It tak es surprising little time for UV to degrade fiberglass and make it brittle. Michael Sausen -10 #352 Limbo From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@m atronics.com] On Behalf Of JSMcGrew(at)aol.com Sent: Tuesday, August 28, 2007 9:24 AM Subject: RV10-List: Protecting Fiberglass Parts I've realized it is going to be while before I get paint on my RV-10 so I t hink I need to put something on the fiberglass parts to keep them from bein g damaged from sunlight. It is hangared so it only gets exposed when flying or parked at a destination airfield. I was thinking of just putting a coat of some inexpensive Rustoleum primer on all the exposed fiberglass, do you think that will that provide the UV protection necessary? -Jim 40134 Jim "Scooter" McGrew http://www.mit.edu/~jsmcgrew AOL.com. ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "RV Builder (Michael Sausen)" <rvbuilder(at)sausen.net>
Date: Aug 28, 2007
Subject: Fuel Tank Sealant
If you are using it for anything critical like sealing your tank, I personally wouldn't go much past the date. Tank sealant is cheap compared to the $time$ and aggravation of fixing leaks in a tank. Michael -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Rob Hunter Sent: Tuesday, August 28, 2007 8:09 AM Subject: RV10-List: Fuel Tank Sealant How long can you go past the expiration date on the fuel tank sealant if you kept it in the freezer since you received it. Rob Hunter 40432 Fuel tanks ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 28, 2007
From: Scott Schmidt <scottmschmidt(at)yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: Composite Prop Repair
THE BAJA! I hope you type up a trip report and let us know where you went, and which places you liked. =0AThere were 5 planes that left on Saturday f rom my airport to the Baja for 10 days. They do a "boys" trip every year. It sure sounds fun. =0A=0AI would call MT directly. They may say don't wor ry about it at all. Alot of times it is difficult to keep the epoxy in the nicks.=0AI've talked to them at Oshkosh and they said it really depends on the size and if there are any cracks and if there are cracks the direction of the cracks can be critical. =0AThey get concerned if there are cracks that go in the direction of the chord but are less worried about cracks tha t go along the prop. =0AGood luck and post some pictures. =0A =0AScott Schm idt=0Ascottmschmidt(at)yahoo.com=0A=0A=0A=0A----- Original Message ----=0AFrom : Mark Ritter =0ATo: rv10-list(at)matronics.com=0ASent: Tu esday, August 28, 2007 8:26:27 AM=0ASubject: RV10-List: Composite Prop Repa om>=0A=0A=0A=0ADoes anyone know where I can find information on repairing n icks in an MT =0Acomposite prop (or any composite prop for that matter). I picked up a =0Aseveral rock nicks over in Baja and used some JB Weld to re pair the prop =0Athat seems to be working but not sure if this is the best way.=0A=0AMark=0ARV-10/N410MR=0A=0A________________________________________ _________________________=0ABooking a flight? Know when to buy with airfare predictions on MSN Travel. =0Ahttp://travel.msn.com/Articles/aboutfarecast ========= ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Bob Leffler" <rvmail(at)thelefflers.com>
Subject: FW: Dimple challenged tonight
Date: Aug 28, 2007
While dimpling the skins of the elevator, I started getting tired and was pushing myself to complete the tasks at hand. As you might suspect, Murphy showed up and I screwed up. The attached picture isn't all that good, but you can clearly see that I missed the hole and it's now elongated. This is the bottom outside corner of the trailing edge of the elevator. I see my options as: 1. The anal perfectionist in me wants to order a new skin. 2. Find a way to make a repair that doesn't look too bad. 3. Whatcha worried about, just keep building, the proseal will keep things together. Thoughts, comments? Thanks, Bob ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "RV Builder (Michael Sausen)" <rvbuilder(at)sausen.net>
Date: Aug 28, 2007
Subject: FW: Dimple challenged tonight
Any chance you can drill it to a 30 and use an oops rivet? Michael From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@m atronics.com] On Behalf Of Bob Leffler Sent: Tuesday, August 28, 2007 8:16 PM Subject: RV10-List: FW: Dimple challenged tonight While dimpling the skins of the elevator, I started getting tired and was p ushing myself to complete the tasks at hand. As you might suspect, Murphy showed up and I screwed up. The attached picture isn't all that good, but you can clearly see that I missed the hole and it's now elongated. This is the bottom outside corner of the trailing edge of the elevator. I see my options as: 1. The anal perfectionist in me wants to order a new skin. 2. Find a way to make a repair that doesn't look too bad. 3. Whatcha worried about, just keep building, the proseal will keep t hings together. Thoughts, comments? Thanks, Bob ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 28, 2007
From: "Rick Leach" <papadaddyo(at)tampabay.rr.com>
Subject: FW: Dimple challenged tonight
We've all been there. Looks like you can drill it larger and use an oops rivet. If you can keep it smooth and the trailing edge is not out of whack, it'll fly. Keep on building. Rick 40397 _____ From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Bob Leffler Sent: Tuesday, August 28, 2007 9:16 PM Subject: RV10-List: FW: Dimple challenged tonight While dimpling the skins of the elevator, I started getting tired and was pushing myself to complete the tasks at hand. As you might suspect, Murphy showed up and I screwed up. The attached picture isn't all that good, but you can clearly see that I missed the hole and it's now elongated. This is the bottom outside corner of the trailing edge of the elevator. I see my options as: 1. The anal perfectionist in me wants to order a new skin. 2. Find a way to make a repair that doesn't look too bad. 3. Whatcha worried about, just keep building, the proseal will keep things together. Thoughts, comments? Thanks, Bob ________________________________________________________________________________
From: LessDragProd(at)AOL.COM
Date: Aug 28, 2007
Subject: Re: Composite Prop Repair
Use 5 minute Epoxy. It's use and the acceptable repair information is in the manual you received with the propeller. You know where the manual is. It is in the little paper envelope with the other propeller documents, that you stored in a safe place. :-) Regards, Jim Ayers In a message dated 08/28/2007 8:29:23 A.M. Pacific Daylight Time, mritter509(at)msn.com writes: --> RV10-List message posted by: "Mark Ritter" Does anyone know where I can find information on repairing nicks in an MT composite prop (or any composite prop for that matter). I picked up a several rock nicks over in Baja and used some JB Weld to repair the prop that seems to be working but not sure if this is the best way. Mark RV-10/N410MR http://discover.aol.com/memed/aolcom30tour ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Bob Leffler" <rvmail(at)thelefflers.com>
Subject: FW: Dimple challenged tonight
Date: Aug 29, 2007
My concern is that the where the other hole is located is right at the rim of the dimple. It appears that the factory head, even for an oops rivet may not cover the mistake. Also, this is the bottom skin, so it should have the shop head of the rivet on this side (remember this is the trailing edge). The shop head of an oops rivet will certainly be larger. From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of RV Builder (Michael Sausen) Sent: Tuesday, August 28, 2007 9:42 PM Subject: RE: RV10-List: FW: Dimple challenged tonight Any chance you can drill it to a 30 and use an oops rivet? Michael From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Bob Leffler Sent: Tuesday, August 28, 2007 8:16 PM Subject: RV10-List: FW: Dimple challenged tonight While dimpling the skins of the elevator, I started getting tired and was pushing myself to complete the tasks at hand. As you might suspect, Murphy showed up and I screwed up. The attached picture isn't all that good, but you can clearly see that I missed the hole and it's now elongated. This is the bottom outside corner of the trailing edge of the elevator. I see my options as: 1. The anal perfectionist in me wants to order a new skin. 2. Find a way to make a repair that doesn't look too bad. 3. Whatcha worried about, just keep building, the proseal will keep things together. Thoughts, comments? Thanks, Bob __________ NOD32 2490 (20070829) Information __________ ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Wingtip lens
From: "ddnebert" <doug(at)mapcontext.com>
Date: Aug 29, 2007
I have installed the wingtip lights and need to cut and install the clear plastic lens on the end. What tool should I use to cut and trim what seems to be a somewhat flexible plastic? Words of advice here? -------- RV-10 Builder #40546 Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=131512#131512 ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: FW: Dimple challenged tonight
Date: Aug 29, 2007
From: "Lloyd, Daniel R." <LloydDR(at)wernerco.com>
Like everyone else is saying, rivet it and move on, you will have proseal and several other rivets to hold the trailing edge together. But in my opinion, I would not use an oops in the trailing edge because you would have to enlarge the hole in the wedge, and this is already a tight area. I would do as Jesse recommends and put in a slightly longer rivet, and be careful when setting it, so it does not cleat over and then fill the exposed hole, which is already backed by the wedge with proseal and sand it flat. Just my .02 Dan N289DT RV10E _____ From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Bob Leffler Sent: Tuesday, August 28, 2007 9:16 PM Subject: RV10-List: FW: Dimple challenged tonight While dimpling the skins of the elevator, I started getting tired and was pushing myself to complete the tasks at hand. As you might suspect, Murphy showed up and I screwed up. The attached picture isn't all that good, but you can clearly see that I missed the hole and it's now elongated. This is the bottom outside corner of the trailing edge of the elevator. I see my options as: 1. The anal perfectionist in me wants to order a new skin. 2. Find a way to make a repair that doesn't look too bad. 3. Whatcha worried about, just keep building, the proseal will keep things together. Thoughts, comments? Thanks, Bob ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: FW: Dimple challenged tonight
Date: Aug 29, 2007
From: "Lloyd, Daniel R." <LloydDR(at)wernerco.com>
If you use an oops on the wedge, you will end up with the shop head side being way too big on the backside that is exposed for people to see, IE it will be real easy to see a -4 shop head when everything else is a -3. If the small extra dimple is bothering you, wait until you have a -4 in a line of -3's....but by the time you get to the end you will have forgotten about it, right up until Smoozer comes up and looks at the trailing edge and asks what you did there! LOL Dan _____ From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Bob Leffler Sent: Wednesday, August 29, 2007 6:13 AM Subject: RE: RV10-List: FW: Dimple challenged tonight My concern is that the where the other hole is located is right at the rim of the dimple. It appears that the factory head, even for an oops rivet may not cover the mistake. Also, this is the bottom skin, so it should have the shop head of the rivet on this side (remember this is the trailing edge). The shop head of an oops rivet will certainly be larger. From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of RV Builder (Michael Sausen) Sent: Tuesday, August 28, 2007 9:42 PM Subject: RE: RV10-List: FW: Dimple challenged tonight Any chance you can drill it to a 30 and use an oops rivet? Michael From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Bob Leffler Sent: Tuesday, August 28, 2007 8:16 PM Subject: RV10-List: FW: Dimple challenged tonight While dimpling the skins of the elevator, I started getting tired and was pushing myself to complete the tasks at hand. As you might suspect, Murphy showed up and I screwed up. The attached picture isn't all that good, but you can clearly see that I missed the hole and it's now elongated. This is the bottom outside corner of the trailing edge of the elevator. I see my options as: 1. The anal perfectionist in me wants to order a new skin. 2. Find a way to make a repair that doesn't look too bad. 3. Whatcha worried about, just keep building, the proseal will keep things together. Thoughts, comments? Thanks, Bob http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List http://forums.matronics.com __________ NOD32 2490 (20070829) Information __________ ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 29, 2007
From: LES KEARNEY <Kearney(at)shaw.ca>
Subject: Re: FW: Dimple challenged tonight
Hmmm What is the roleof the proseal in this aplicaton. I would hav thought that it is not structural but is merely holding the parts in alignment when setting up prior to rivetting etc. Inquiring minds need to know.... Les Kearney #40643 ----- Original Message ----- From: "Lloyd, Daniel R." <LloydDR(at)wernerco.com> Date: Wednesday, August 29, 2007 7:38 am Subject: RE: RV10-List: FW: Dimple challenged tonight > Like everyone else is saying, rivet it and move on, you will have > proseal and several other rivets to hold the trailing edge > together. But > in my opinion, I would not use an oops in the trailing edge > because you > would have to enlarge the hole in the wedge, and this is already > a tight > area. I would do as Jesse recommends and put in a slightly > longer rivet, > and be careful when setting it, so it does not cleat over and > then fill > the exposed hole, which is already backed by the wedge with > proseal and > sand it flat. > Just my .02 > Dan > N289DT RV10E > > _____ > > From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com > [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Bob Leffler > Sent: Tuesday, August 28, 2007 9:16 PM > To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com > Subject: RV10-List: FW: Dimple challenged tonight > > > > While dimpling the skins of the elevator, I started getting > tired and > was pushing myself to complete the tasks at hand. As you > might suspect, > Murphy showed up and I screwed up. The attached picture > isn't all that > good, but you can clearly see that I missed the hole and it's now > elongated. This is the bottom outside corner > of the trailing edge of > the elevator. > > > > I see my options as: > > > > 1. The anal perfectionist in > me wants to order a new skin. > > > > 2. Find a way to make a > repair that doesn't look too bad. > > > > 3. Whatcha worried about, > just keep building, the proseal will > keep things together. > > > > Thoughts, comments? > > > > Thanks, > > > > Bob > > > > > > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 29, 2007
From: "pascal" <rv10builder(at)verizon.net>
Subject: Re: FW: Dimple challenged tonight
flip the rivet over and have the smaller rivet head on the top side. Tim and others have riveted in opposite directions with their trailing edges so it's not uncommon. Been there myself than when all was done I realized I couldn't even find some of my mistakes unless I specifically look for it. Pascal ----- Original Message ----- From: Bob Leffler To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com Sent: Wednesday, August 29, 2007 3:13 AM Subject: RE: RV10-List: FW: Dimple challenged tonight My concern is that the where the other hole is located is right at the rim of the dimple. It appears that the factory head, even for an oops rivet may not cover the mistake. Also, this is the bottom skin, so it should have the shop head of the rivet on this side (remember this is the trailing edge). The shop head of an oops rivet will certainly be larger. From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of RV Builder (Michael Sausen) Sent: Tuesday, August 28, 2007 9:42 PM To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com Subject: RE: RV10-List: FW: Dimple challenged tonight Any chance you can drill it to a 30 and use an oops rivet? Michael From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Bob Leffler Sent: Tuesday, August 28, 2007 8:16 PM To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com Subject: RV10-List: FW: Dimple challenged tonight While dimpling the skins of the elevator, I started getting tired and was pushing myself to complete the tasks at hand. As you might suspect, Murphy showed up and I screwed up. The attached picture isn't all that good, but you can clearly see that I missed the hole and it's now elongated. This is the bottom outside corner of the trailing edge of the elevator. I see my options as: 1. The anal perfectionist in me wants to order a new skin. 2. Find a way to make a repair that doesn't look too bad. 3. Whatcha worried about, just keep building, the proseal will keep things together. Thoughts, comments? Thanks, Bob http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-Listhttp://forums.matronics.com __________ NOD32 2490 (20070829) Information __________ ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "RV Builder (Michael Sausen)" <rvbuilder(at)sausen.net>
Date: Aug 29, 2007
Subject: FW: Dimple challenged tonight
Correct. From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@m atronics.com] On Behalf Of LES KEARNEY Sent: Wednesday, August 29, 2007 8:45 AM Subject: Re: RE: RV10-List: FW: Dimple challenged tonight Hmmm What is the roleof the proseal in this aplicaton. I would hav thought that it is not structural but is merely holding the parts in alignment when sett ing up prior to rivetting etc. Inquiring minds need to know.... Les Kearney #40643 ----- Original Message ----- From: "Lloyd, Daniel R." <LloydDR(at)wernerco.com> Date: Wednesday, August 29, 2007 7:38 am Subject: RE: RV10-List: FW: Dimple challenged tonight > Like everyone else is saying, rivet it and move on, you will have > proseal and several other rivets to hold the trailing edge > together. But > in my opinion, I would not use an oops in the trailing edge > because you > would have to enlarge the hole in the wedge, and this is already > a tight > area. I would do as Jesse recommends and put in a slightly > longer rivet, > and be careful when setting it, so it does not cleat over and > then fill > the exposed hole, which is already backed by the wedge with > proseal and > sand it flat. > Just my .02 > Dan > N289DT RV10E > > _____ > > From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com > [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Bob Leffler > Sent: Tuesday, August 28, 2007 9:16 PM > To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com > Subject: RV10-List: FW: Dimple challenged tonight > > > While dimpling the skins of the elevator, I started getting > tired and > was pushing myself to complete the tasks at hand. As you > might suspect, > Murphy showed up and I screwed up. The attached picture > isn't all that > good, but you can clearly see that I missed the hole and it's now > elongated. This is the bottom outside corner > of the trailing edge of > the elevator. > > > I see my options as: > > > 1. The anal perfectionist in > me wants to order a new skin. > > > 2. Find a way to make a > repair that doesn't look too bad. > > > 3. Whatcha worried about, > just keep building, the proseal will > keep things together. > > > Thoughts, comments? > > > Thanks, > > > Bob > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: <rvmail(at)thelefflers.com>
Subject: Re: FW: Dimple challenged tonight
Date: Aug 29, 2007
Actually, Rick has given a suggestion that hasn't been mentioned here yet. Since he fiberglassed his tips, the last rivet will be hidden under the transition, so whether or not I use a longer rivet or an oops rivet, it would be hidden and add additional support. The lesson I learned that if you get tired, just stop, even if you only have a little bit more to complete the task at hand. Thanks for all the feedback! > > From: "Lloyd, Daniel R." <LloydDR(at)wernerco.com> > Date: 2007/08/29 Wed AM 08:30:57 EST > To: > Subject: RE: RV10-List: FW: Dimple challenged tonight > > If you use an oops on the wedge, you will end up with the shop head side > being way too big on the backside that is exposed for people to see, IE > it will be real easy to see a -4 shop head when everything else is a -3. > If the small extra dimple is bothering you, wait until you have a -4 in > a line of -3's....but by the time you get to the end you will have > forgotten about it, right up until Smoozer comes up and looks at the > trailing edge and asks what you did there! LOL > Dan > > > > _____ > > From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com > [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Bob Leffler > Sent: Wednesday, August 29, 2007 6:13 AM > To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com > Subject: RE: RV10-List: FW: Dimple challenged tonight > > > > My concern is that the where the other hole is located is right at the > rim of the dimple. It appears that the factory head, even for an oops > rivet may not cover the mistake. Also, this is the bottom skin, so it > should have the shop head of the rivet on this side (remember this is > the trailing edge). The shop head of an oops rivet will certainly be > larger. > > > > From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com > [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of RV Builder > (Michael Sausen) > Sent: Tuesday, August 28, 2007 9:42 PM > To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com > Subject: RE: RV10-List: FW: Dimple challenged tonight > > > > Any chance you can drill it to a 30 and use an oops rivet? > > > > Michael > > > > From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com > [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Bob Leffler > Sent: Tuesday, August 28, 2007 8:16 PM > To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com > Subject: RV10-List: FW: Dimple challenged tonight > > > > While dimpling the skins of the elevator, I started getting tired and > was pushing myself to complete the tasks at hand. As you might suspect, > Murphy showed up and I screwed up. The attached picture isn't all that > good, but you can clearly see that I missed the hole and it's now > elongated. This is the bottom outside corner of the trailing edge of > the elevator. > > > > I see my options as: > > > > 1. The anal perfectionist in me wants to order a new skin. > > > > 2. Find a way to make a repair that doesn't look too bad. > > > > 3. Whatcha worried about, just keep building, the proseal will > keep things together. > > > > Thoughts, comments? > > > > Thanks, > > > > Bob > > > > > > > > > > http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List > http://forums.matronics.com > > > > > __________ NOD32 2490 (20070829) Information __________ > > > > > > > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: JSMcGrew(at)aol.com
Date: Aug 29, 2007
Subject: Re: Protecting Fiberglass Parts
Thanks for the advice, guys. I plan on rolling on a few coats of UV smooth prime to protect the fiberglass. I've already got a can laying around somewh ere in the shop. -Jim 40134 In a message dated 8/28/2007 9:19:09 A.M. Pacific Daylight Time, rvbuilder(at)sausen.net writes: I believe you need something with a very high solids content in order to protect from UV which is the primary concern. Just painting it won =99t do the job. I=99ve seen fiberglass microwave antennas that were painted with a rattle can paint and a year later it was in rough shape. If it was me I would spend the extra couple $ and put on a coat of UV Smoothprime even if it means sanding it off later just to do it again. It takes surprising little time for UV to degrade fiberglass and make it brittle. Michael Sausen -10 #352 Limbo From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of JSMcGrew(at)aol.com Sent: Tuesday, August 28, 2007 9:24 AM Subject: RV10-List: Protecting Fiberglass Parts I've realized it is going to be while before I get paint on my RV-10 so I think I need to put something on the fiberglass parts to keep them from bei ng damaged from sunlight. It is hangared so it only gets exposed when flying o r parked at a destination airfield. I was thinking of just putting a coat of some inexpensive Rustoleum primer on all the exposed fiberglass, do you thi nk that will that provide the UV protection necessary? -Jim 40134 Jim "Scooter" McGrew _http://www.mit.edu/~jsmcgrew_ (http://www.mit.edu/~jsmcgrew) Jim "Scooter" McGrew _http://www.mit.edu/~jsmcgrew_ (http://www.mit.edu/~jsmcgrew) t http://discover.aol.com/memed/aolcom30tour ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: FW: Dimple challenged tonight
Date: Aug 29, 2007
From: "Lloyd, Daniel R." <LloydDR(at)wernerco.com>
It is only there for alignment during the riveting, but it will also add some adhesion, plus it will fill the hole and is sandable/ paintable. Dan _____ From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of LES KEARNEY Sent: Wednesday, August 29, 2007 9:45 AM Subject: Re: RE: RV10-List: FW: Dimple challenged tonight Hmmm What is the roleof the proseal in this aplicaton. I would hav thought that it is not structural but is merely holding the parts in alignment when setting up prior to rivetting etc. Inquiring minds need to know.... Les Kearney #40643 ----- Original Message ----- From: "Lloyd, Daniel R." <LloydDR(at)wernerco.com> Date: Wednesday, August 29, 2007 7:38 am Subject: RE: RV10-List: FW: Dimple challenged tonight > Like everyone else is saying, rivet it and move on, you will have > proseal and several other rivets to hold the trailing edge > together. But > in my opinion, I would not use an oops in the trailing edge > because you > would have to enlarge the hole in the wedge, and this is already > a tight > area. I would do as Jesse recommends and put in a slightly > longer rivet, > and be careful when setting it, so it does not cleat over and > then fill > the exposed hole, which is already backed by the wedge with > proseal and > sand it flat. > Just my .02 > Dan > N289DT RV10E > > _____ > > From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com > [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Bob Leffler > Sent: Tuesday, August 28, 2007 9:16 PM > To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com > Subject: RV10-List: FW: Dimple challenged tonight > > > > While dimpling the skins of the elevator, I started getting > tired and > was pushing myself to complete the tasks at hand. As you > might suspect, > Murphy showed up and I screwed up. The attached picture > isn't all that > good, but you can clearly see that I missed the hole and it's now > elongated. This is the bottom outside corner > of the trailing edge of > the elevator. > > > > I see my options as: > > > > 1. The anal perfectionist in > me wants to order a new skin. > > > > 2. Find a way to make a > repair that doesn't look too bad. > > > > 3. Whatcha worried about, > just keep building, the proseal will > keep things together. > > > > Thoughts, comments? > > > > Thanks, > > > > Bob > > > > > > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 29, 2007
From: carlos <carlosh@sec-engr.com>
Subject: Re: FW: Dimple challenged tonight
/"it is not structural but is merely holding the parts in alignment when setting up prior to riveting"/ Almost verbatim from Ken at Vans when I called on a VERY similar question. Carlos LES KEARNEY wrote: > Hmmm > > What is the roleof the proseal in this aplicaton. I would hav thought > that it is not structural but is merely holding the parts in alignment > when setting up prior to rivetting etc. > > Inquiring minds need to know.... > > Les Kearney > #40643 > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Lloyd, Daniel R." <LloydDR(at)wernerco.com> > Date: Wednesday, August 29, 2007 7:38 am > Subject: RE: RV10-List: FW: Dimple challenged tonight > To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com > > > Like everyone else is saying, rivet it and move on, you will have > > proseal and several other rivets to hold the trailing edge > > together. But > > in my opinion, I would not use an oops in the trailing edge > > because you > > would have to enlarge the hole in the wedge, and this is already > > a tight > > area. I would do as Jesse recommends and put in a slightly > > longer rivet, > > and be careful when setting it, so it does not cleat over and > > then fill > > the exposed hole, which is already backed by the wedge with > > proseal and > > sand it flat. > > Just my .02 > > Dan > > N289DT RV10E > > > > _____ > > > > From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com > > [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Bob Leffler > > Sent: Tuesday, August 28, 2007 9:16 PM > > To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com > > Subject: RV10-List: FW: Dimple challenged tonight > > > > > > > > While dimpling the skins of the elevator, I started getting > > tired and > > was pushing myself to complete the tasks at hand. As you > > might suspect, > > Murphy showed up and I screwed up. The attached picture > > isn't all that > > good, but you can clearly see that I missed the hole and it's now > > elongated. This is the bottom outside corner > > of the trailing edge of > > the elevator. > > > > > > > > I see my options as: > > > > > > > > 1. The anal perfectionist in > > me wants to order a new skin. > > > > > > > > 2. Find a way to make a > > repair that doesn't look too bad. > > > > > > > > 3. Whatcha worried about, > > just keep building, the proseal will > > keep things together. > > > > > > > > Thoughts, comments? > > > > > > > > Thanks, > > > > > > > > Bob > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > * > > > * > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > -- Carlos Hernandez <carlosh@sec-engr.com> Structural Engineers, LLC 2963 W. Elliot Rd. - Suite 3 Chandler, AZ 85224 Phone: 480.968.8600 Fax: 480.968.8608 www.sec-engr.com CONFIDENTIALITY NOTICE The information in this email may be confidential and/or privileged. This email is intended to be reviewed by only the individual or organization named above. If you are not the intended recipient or an authorized representative of the intended recipient, you are hereby notified that any review, dissemination or copyingof this email and its attachments, if any, or the information contained herein is prohibited. If you havereceived this email in error, please immediately notify the sender by return email and delete this email from your system. ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 29, 2007
From: Deems Davis <deemsdavis(at)cox.net>
Subject: Re: Wingtip lens
Here's what I did. http://deemsrv10.com/album/Sec%2024%20Wing%20Tips/slides/DSC02085.html Deems Davis # 406 'Its all done....Its just not put together' http://deemsrv10.com/ David Maib wrote: > What have others done? > ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 29, 2007
From: David Maib <dmaib(at)mac.com>
Subject: Re: Wingtip lens
Thanks Deems, That is exactly what I had in mind. David Maib 40559 On Wednesday, August 29, 2007, at 01:27PM, "Deems Davis" wrote: > >Here's what I did. > >http://deemsrv10.com/album/Sec%2024%20Wing%20Tips/slides/DSC02085.html > >Deems Davis # 406 >'Its all done....Its just not put together' >http://deemsrv10.com/ > > >David Maib wrote: >> What have others done? >> > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "John Gonzalez" <indigoonlatigo(at)msn.com>
Subject: FW: Dimple challenged tonight
Date: Aug 29, 2007
Exactly my opinion aswell. One additional thing you can do is glue in the fiberglass wingtip to take more of the strain off the corner rivet with the bad hole. Make sure to glue both rt and lf wingtips to keep it all syimetrical. make sure your botched dimple fits well into the wedge countersink!!!!!! This will not even show if you do a good job. Remember, In WWll, a bullet hole in the skins didn't ground a plane and they didn't put a new skin on either. John G. 409 Hiatus, Last soaring day coming up this weekend. >From: "Lloyd, Daniel R." <LloydDR(at)wernerco.com> >Reply-To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com >To: >Subject: RE: RV10-List: FW: Dimple challenged tonight >Date: Wed, 29 Aug 2007 09:22:17 -0400 > >Like everyone else is saying, rivet it and move on, you will have >proseal and several other rivets to hold the trailing edge together. But >in my opinion, I would not use an oops in the trailing edge because you >would have to enlarge the hole in the wedge, and this is already a tight >area. I would do as Jesse recommends and put in a slightly longer rivet, >and be careful when setting it, so it does not cleat over and then fill >the exposed hole, which is already backed by the wedge with proseal and >sand it flat. >Just my .02 >Dan >N289DT RV10E > > _____ > >From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com >[mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Bob Leffler >Sent: Tuesday, August 28, 2007 9:16 PM >To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com >Subject: RV10-List: FW: Dimple challenged tonight > > >While dimpling the skins of the elevator, I started getting tired and >was pushing myself to complete the tasks at hand. As you might suspect, >Murphy showed up and I screwed up. The attached picture isn't all that >good, but you can clearly see that I missed the hole and it's now >elongated. This is the bottom outside corner of the trailing edge of >the elevator. > > >I see my options as: > > >1. The anal perfectionist in me wants to order a new skin. > > >2. Find a way to make a repair that doesn't look too bad. > > >3. Whatcha worried about, just keep building, the proseal will >keep things together. > > >Thoughts, comments? > > >Thanks, > > >Bob > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 29, 2007
From: Scott Schmidt <scottmschmidt(at)yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: Wingtip lens
Just to be the different one, I used only two screws and I have a great fit and so far I've had no problems. =0AI've flown near the Vne 200 kts TAS a nd no problems. Adding more screws makes sense though. =0AIt is not like you take the lens on and off very often and it doesn't hurt. =0ASo those of you with 2 screws, don't get too nervous. It will work great and you will be able to care a couple more =0Adimes in your pockets at gross. =0A =0ASc ott Schmidt=0Ascottmschmidt(at)yahoo.com ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 29, 2007
From: Deems Davis <deemsdavis(at)cox.net>
Subject: Re: Wingtip lens
Here's another idea that 'hides' the nut plates and I think gives a bit of decoration. http://deemsrv10.com/album/LED%20Nav%20&%20Strobes/slides/DSC02219.html Deems Davis # 406 'Its all done....Its just not put together' http://deemsrv10.com/ > ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 29, 2007
From: "pascal" <rv10builder(at)verizon.net>
Subject: Re: autopilot install
I am looking for things to wait on, like the autopilot and aileron trim until I'm flying and determine what would work best based on real flying experience, in addition to cutting initial costs of building.How hard is it to install the ap and trim servos after the wings are closed versus doing it while I have the bottom wing open?Is it worth doing it now? I know I can buy just the servos from TT and deal with the AP later but I still want to know how hard it is now versus after completion.Thanks! Pascal ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 29, 2007
From: Deems Davis <deemsdavis(at)cox.net>
Subject: Re: autopilot install
Tim Olson wrote: > then sure, > you could experiment with tons of things over time. Experimenting > though usually either costs, in either time, or money. Amen! Usually both! Deems Davis # 406 'Its all done....Its just not put together' http://deemsrv10.com/ ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 29, 2007
From: Deems Davis <deemsdavis(at)cox.net>
Subject: Here's something I just received direct from the President
of Op Technologies In response to an e-mail I sent earlier today I just received this from Dexter Turner who was the Owner/President of OP and now VP of Display Products @ Aerosonic. Deems, We are working to get the attached letter out to everyone. It went out to Dealers yesterday because that was a smaller list and now we are compiling a complete customer list to sent it out to. If you are able to post this to any of the RV builders sites, chat areas, etc. that would be a big help to get the word out too. The bottom line is that this is a positive development for the product because we now have a publicly traded company that has been in business over 50 years behind us and their motivation is to expand our business. Best regards, Dexter Turner Aerosonic -----Original Message----- From: Deems Davis [mailto:deemsdavis(at)cox.net] Sent: Wednesday, August 29, 2007 9:18 AM Subject: How about a letter from you to your customers regarding the acquisition? Dexter, I called the ph # today and was answered by Aerosonics receptionist. I had heard the news about the acquisition, and decided to remain calm and wait for 'more news' The mail lists have been buzzing. I was really happy to see the improved customer service responsiveness to customers this past year, and while I sit here waiting for a return call from tech support, my anxiety level is increasing. I hope this is indeed a good thing for you and for your customers, and sincerely hope that Aerosonic doesn't abandon the experimental roots as it looks to the gold mine of certified and military business. An e-mail/letter from you to your customers would go a long way to reassuring us that we're still your customers. Thanks Deems Davis RV-10 623 218 6442 home 623 521 2000 mobile ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 29, 2007
From: Deems Davis <deemsdavis(at)cox.net>
Subject: Re: autopilot install- now which one?
Pascal, I may be wrong, as I'm electron challenged, but I believe that the Tru Trak AP requires their servos, not sure they will work with others. IIRC TT either updated their servo or recommmended one of their larger servo's for the -10. I went with the Digiflight VSVG , with vertical steering from the OP (in development but not yet available) I can fly WAAS overlay approaches and will not require the ILS from the Sorcerer. (At least that's what my reasoning has been to this point :-\ ). Deems Davis # 406 'Its all done....Its just not put together' http://deemsrv10.com/ pascal wrote: > > As always, thanks for the insight Tim. Want simple; tried and true, > will go with Trutrak the problem is do I spend $2350 for a top notch > servo to fit the RV-10ap, and sorcerer or will the simple $1000 cut > it.. that is my dilemma. > So survey here (for everyone): > which AP version was bought and would get/recommend (trutrak only) > based on flying the RV-10. > Is the Van's Aileron trim equal to the Aerotrim Jesse keeps > suggesting? either one work better in one way.. etc. > > Thanks! ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 29, 2007
From: David Maib <dmaib(at)mac.com>
Subject: Re: Wingtip lens
That really looks great, Deems. Is that your airplane? What is the material that is covering the nut plates? David On Wednesday, August 29, 2007, at 05:53PM, "Deems Davis" wrote: > >Here's another idea that 'hides' the nut plates and I think gives a bit >of decoration. > >http://deemsrv10.com/album/LED%20Nav%20&%20Strobes/slides/DSC02219.html > >Deems Davis # 406 >'Its all done....Its just not put together' >http://deemsrv10.com/ > >> > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Wingtip lens
Date: Aug 29, 2007
From: "Robin Marks" <robin1(at)mrmoisture.com>
I also thought we needed a few more screws: That should do it! Robin ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Wingtip lens
From: "ddnebert" <doug(at)mapcontext.com>
Date: Aug 29, 2007
Thanks, all. I'll try the cutoff wheel approach I think. I got the strobes (from strobes-n-more with controller for $149 total), position lights (from SNF vendor with glass globes for $50 each, and the halogen landing lights installed. Took time out tonight to pressure test the fuel tanks using the valve and balloon and soapsuds method. Pleased to report it worked wonderfully and I have not a single leak! Now to screw the fuel tanks back on completely and install the heated pitot ('50s era Kollsman) before attacking the bottom skins. That's the plan this weekend - finish the wings! OK, now - any suggestions on where to find glass globes to cover the strobes? I know it'll be inside the plexiglass but think extra protection is in order... -------- RV-10 Builder #40546 Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=131704#131704 Attachments: http://forums.matronics.com//files/tank_test_874.jpg http://forums.matronics.com//files/wingtip_lights_105.jpg ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 29, 2007
From: Deems Davis <deemsdavis(at)cox.net>
Subject: Re: Wingtip lens
It's mine and all it is is silver rattle can paint applied from the inside of the lens. Jeff Bordelon (my LED nav/strobe lite guy) did this to his plane and I shamelessly copied it! Deems David Maib wrote: > > That really looks great, Deems. Is that your airplane? What is the material that is covering the nut plates? > > David > > On Wednesday, August 29, 2007, at 05:53PM, "Deems Davis" wrote: > >> >> Here's another idea that 'hides' the nut plates and I think gives a bit >> of decoration. >> >> http://deemsrv10.com/album/LED%20Nav%20&%20Strobes/slides/DSC02219.html >> >> Deems Davis # 406 >> 'Its all done....Its just not put together' >> http://deemsrv10.com/ >> >> >>> >>> >> >> >> >> >> >> > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 29, 2007
From: David Maib <dmaib(at)mac.com>
Subject: Re: Wingtip lens
And I shall shamelessly copy both of you! ^_^ David On Wednesday, August 29, 2007, at 09:27PM, "Deems Davis" wrote: > >It's mine and all it is is silver rattle can paint applied from the >inside of the lens. Jeff Bordelon (my LED nav/strobe lite guy) did this >to his plane and I shamelessly copied it! > >Deems > >David Maib wrote: >> >> That really looks great, Deems. Is that your airplane? What is the material that is covering the nut plates? >> >> David >> >> On Wednesday, August 29, 2007, at 05:53PM, "Deems Davis" wrote: >> >>> >>> Here's another idea that 'hides' the nut plates and I think gives a bit >>> of decoration. >>> >>> http://deemsrv10.com/album/LED%20Nav%20&%20Strobes/slides/DSC02219.html >>> >>> Deems Davis # 406 >>> 'Its all done....Its just not put together' >>> http://deemsrv10.com/ >>> >>> >>>> >>>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 29, 2007
From: David Maib <dmaib(at)mac.com>
Subject: Wingtip lens
Now that looks like a "nuclear hardened" wingtip lens! David On Wednesday, August 29, 2007, at 09:00PM, "Robin Marks" wrote: >I also thought we needed a few more screws: > >That should do it! > >Robin > > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Marcus Cooper" <coop85(at)cableone.net>
Subject: Wingtip lens
Date: Aug 29, 2007
Same thoughts as Scott. I have 194 hours with multiple runs a high speed with no issues on just 2 screws, but a few extra might provide some peace of mind. Marcus 40286 _____ From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Scott Schmidt Sent: Wednesday, August 29, 2007 3:53 PM Subject: Re: RV10-List: Wingtip lens Just to be the different one, I used only two screws and I have a great fit and so far I've had no problems. I've flown near the Vne 200 kts TAS and no problems. Adding more screws makes sense though. It is not like you take the lens on and off very often and it doesn't hurt. So those of you with 2 screws, don't get too nervous. It will work great and you will be able to care a couple more dimes in your pockets at gross. Scott Schmidt scottmschmidt(at)yahoo.com ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 30, 2007
From: Werner Schneider <glastar(at)gmx.net>
Subject: Re: Wingtip lens
Nice photoshop try, but you would need to colour around rivets and screws a bit better ;-) Werner Robin Marks wrote: > > I also thought we needed a few more screws: > > That should do it! > > Robin > > wingtip.jpg > ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: autopilot install
From: "tsts4" <tsts4(at)verizon.net>
Date: Aug 30, 2007
Yes, you can buy the servos separately. As an example, I think the TT RV-10 API pitch and trim servos and associated installation hardware altogether run about $2300. -------- Todd Stovall 728TT (reserved) RV-10 Empacone Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=131744#131744 ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Wingtip lens
Date: Aug 30, 2007
From: "Lloyd, Daniel R." <LloydDR(at)wernerco.com>
And I copied yours! But used blue instead so they match my paint stripe out there...we all copy the good ideas, and Deems has allot of them and freely shares. The RV community is great about that, each of us trying to build a better mousetrap and sharing that info with others! Dan N289DT RV10E -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Deems Davis Sent: Wednesday, August 29, 2007 10:21 PM Subject: Re: RV10-List: Wingtip lens It's mine and all it is is silver rattle can paint applied from the inside of the lens. Jeff Bordelon (my LED nav/strobe lite guy) did this to his plane and I shamelessly copied it! Deems David Maib wrote: > > That really looks great, Deems. Is that your airplane? What is the material that is covering the nut plates? > > David > > On Wednesday, August 29, 2007, at 05:53PM, "Deems Davis" wrote: > >> >> Here's another idea that 'hides' the nut plates and I think gives a bit >> of decoration. >> >> http://deemsrv10.com/album/LED%20Nav%20&%20Strobes/slides/DSC02219.html >> >> Deems Davis # 406 >> 'Its all done....Its just not put together' >> http://deemsrv10.com/ >> >> >>> >>> >> >> >> >> >> >> > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Wingtip lens
From: "ddnebert" <doug(at)mapcontext.com>
Date: Aug 30, 2007
Deems Davis wrote: > It's mine and all it is is silver rattle can paint applied from the > inside of the lens. Jeff Bordelon (my LED nav/strobe lite guy) did this > to his plane and I shamelessly copied it! > > Deems > > I see you do not have a glass globe on your strobe. Is this not something to worry about? Doug Nebert Builder # 40546 - in the wings -------- RV-10 Builder #40546 Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=131953#131953 ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 30, 2007
From: Deems Davis <deemsdavis(at)cox.net>
Subject: Re: Wingtip lens
It's not something I'm worrying about at the present. What is the hazard and related consequence that would be avoided with a glass cover? I'm not trying to be smart, I really don't know. The strobe is 'protected' from direct moisture by virtue of the plexi. Deems Davis # 406 'Its all done....Its just not put together' http://deemsrv10.com/ ddnebert wrote: > > > Deems Davis wrote: > >> It's mine and all it is is silver rattle can paint applied from the >> inside of the lens. Jeff Bordelon (my LED nav/strobe lite guy) did this >> to his plane and I shamelessly copied it! >> >> Deems >> >> >> > > > I see you do not have a glass globe on your strobe. Is this not something to worry about? > > Doug Nebert > Builder # 40546 - in the wings > > -------- > RV-10 Builder #40546 > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=131953#131953 > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 30, 2007
From: Perry Casson-home <pcasson(at)sasktel.net>
Subject: Re: autopilot install- now which side?
I've got a two axis TruTrak installed in my 10 one thing that really bugs me is how much friction is added to the control system when the AP is not in use. RV's normally have such nice smooth and balanced controls especially if I compare it to my Glastar where the ailerons are very stiff and not coordinated to the pitch force. Adding the TT servos added a lot of friction to the -10 control system. My other plane has a single axis an old Navaid AP but it's servo had a clutch that disconnected the motor from the control system when it was not in use so if the AP was off there is no added friction from spinning a powered down motor like the TT servo. I would think the -46789 guys would find this an even bigger deal. There is no way I would mess up a -4's lovely control feel by hanging a pair of TT servos on them if they all work like mine. Am I the only one who has this complaint? Are my servos bad or did I wire them wrong? Assuming my TT stuff is operating as it's designed I'd say there is some room for improvement in the TT product before I'd give it an unqualified recommendation. Perry Casson C-FMHP - Regina, Sk. Waiting on paperwork... http://casson.2y.net/rv-10 ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 30, 2007
From: Rick Sked <ricksked(at)embarqmail.com>
Subject: Re: autopilot install- now which side?
Although I haven't flown yet, the drag you mention is not as noticable when everything is connected and you use the stick to move the controls. The aileron trim springs add more to the mix as well but I don't find any of this added tension very noticable ie like hard to move the stick. But this ain't no RV-4 either. Rick S. 40185 Wiring & panel almost done ----- Original Message ----- From: "Perry Casson-home" <pcasson(at)sasktel.net> Sent: Thursday, August 30, 2007 8:35:20 PM (GMT-0800) America/Los_Angeles Subject: RE: Re: was Re: RV10-List: Re: autopilot install- now which side? I've got a two axis TruTrak installed in my 10 one thing that really bugs me is how much friction is added to the control system when the AP is not in use. RV's normally have such nice smooth and balanced controls especially if I compare it to my Glastar where the ailerons are very stiff and not coordinated to the pitch force. Adding the TT servos added a lot of friction to the -10 control system. My other plane has a single axis an old Navaid AP but it's servo had a clutch that disconnected the motor from the control system when it was not in use so if the AP was off there is no added friction from spinning a powered down motor like the TT servo. I would think the -46789 guys would find this an even bigger deal. There is no way I would mess up a -4's lovely control feel by hanging a pair of TT servos on them if they all work like mine. Am I the only one who has this complaint? Are my servos bad or did I wire them wrong? Assuming my TT stuff is operating as it's designed I'd say there is some room for improvement in the TT product before I'd give it an unqualified recommendation. Perry Casson C-FMHP - Regina, Sk. Waiting on paperwork... http://casson.2y.net/rv-10 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Wayne Edgerton" <wayne.e(at)grandecom.net>
Subject: was Re: Re: autopilot install- now which one?was Re: autopilot
install- now which one?Re: autopilot install
Date: Aug 31, 2007
Just as an FYI. When I ordered my TT Sorcerer ( I have the full blown version) I ass/u/med ( you know the / saying ) that it had an auto trim feature included, but since I've starting flying I now realize that the auto trim feature is a separate option. What happens without it is the auto pilot will audio out for the pilot to "trim up" or trim down" . Yesterday while flying at around 2500' I was showing someone how the auto pilot worked. It was a little bumpy here in the TX warm afternoon and the AP was saying trim up or trim down a bunch. It gets a little annoying, you're trying to talk and it's saying "trim up" or "trim down". When I first starting flying the plane, the auto pilot would say trim up or down and I thought it was just telling me everything that it was doing not that I needed to do the trimming, so I wasn't doing anything and it would just keep telling me. In my last plane I had the Century IV AP and it did that function for me so I was use to not having to do this.. Anyway I have since ordered the auto trim feature, another $650, and will be installing it shortly. I probably could live without it but it's sometimes a little distracting for it to be putting out audio trim commands all the time. In hard IFR I'm concerned that it could become a major distraction from the tasks at hand. I absolutely love the AP though. This thing can do about anything you could want it to do and then some. For those who have the Chelton's and the TruTrak AP, I started out with Chelton software ver 6.0A9 and when I used the GPS steer (GPSS) function the AP would kind of wonder around trying to keep on coarse. I have since upgraded to Chelton's latest ver 6.0A16 and it' really tracks the coarse great now. Wayne Edgerton N602WT flying and going to paint on Tuesday :>} ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Marcus Cooper" <coop85(at)cableone.net>
Subject: Re: autopilot install- now which side?
Date: Aug 31, 2007
Perry, It sounds like my experience is similar to the other responses. I can't even tell it's there when I don't have the autopilot engaged and I have time in a lot of high performance machines as well as the RV-6. I'm not sure if that's what you wanted to hear. Marcus 40286 -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Perry Casson-home Sent: Thursday, August 30, 2007 10:35 PM Subject: RE: Re: was Re: RV10-List: Re: autopilot install- now which side? I've got a two axis TruTrak installed in my 10 one thing that really bugs me is how much friction is added to the control system when the AP is not in use. RV's normally have such nice smooth and balanced controls especially if I compare it to my Glastar where the ailerons are very stiff and not coordinated to the pitch force. Adding the TT servos added a lot of friction to the -10 control system. My other plane has a single axis an old Navaid AP but it's servo had a clutch that disconnected the motor from the control system when it was not in use so if the AP was off there is no added friction from spinning a powered down motor like the TT servo. I would think the -46789 guys would find this an even bigger deal. There is no way I would mess up a -4's lovely control feel by hanging a pair of TT servos on them if they all work like mine. Am I the only one who has this complaint? Are my servos bad or did I wire them wrong? Assuming my TT stuff is operating as it's designed I'd say there is some room for improvement in the TT product before I'd give it an unqualified recommendation. Perry Casson C-FMHP - Regina, Sk. Waiting on paperwork... http://casson.2y.net/rv-10 ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Magneto Spark Plug Wires
From: "zackrv8" <zackrv8(at)verizon.net>
Date: Sep 03, 2007
Guys, I have a Lightspeed Ignition on top with the beautiful MSD 8.5 Super Conductor Wires that Klauss supplies in the kit. However, I see that some of you have the nice Silicone wires (red in color) on the bottom magneto. Where can I get the "colored" silicone magento wires for the mag? Zack -------- RV8 #80125 RV10 # 40512 Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=132595#132595 ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Sep 03, 2007
From: "Kelly McMullen" <apilot2(at)gmail.com>
Subject: Tinted windows
Does Vans, or anyone else offer tinted windshield and windows? Seems like would be desirable for all VFR flight to cut heat gain. ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Sep 03, 2007
From: Rick Sked <ricksked(at)embarqmail.com>
Subject: Since we have a few OT's....check out this Tri-motor
This is workmanship to strive for. http://www.ipass.net/ginkgo/N9612home.html Rick S. 40185 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: JSMcGrew(at)aol.com
Date: Sep 04, 2007
Subject: Re: Tinted windows
I wouldn't expect that anyone would want tinted windows in an airplane. It is hard enough to see at night without looking through a tinted windscreen! :) -Jim 40134 In a message dated 9/3/2007 11:27:07 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time, apilot2(at)gmail.com writes: --> RV10-List message posted by: "Kelly McMullen" Does Vans, or anyone else offer tinted windshield and windows? Seems like would be desirable for all VFR flight to cut heat gain. (http://www.mit.edu/~jsmcgrew) http://discover.aol.com/memed/aolcom30tour ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "RV Builder (Michael Sausen)" <rvbuilder(at)sausen.net>
Date: Sep 04, 2007
Subject: Tinted windows
Don't recall if the windscreen had any tint but the side windows come pre t inted. Michael From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@m atronics.com] On Behalf Of JSMcGrew(at)aol.com Sent: Tuesday, September 04, 2007 7:50 AM Subject: Re: RV10-List: Tinted windows I wouldn't expect that anyone would want tinted windows in an airplane. It is hard enough to see at night without looking through a tinted windscreen! :) -Jim 40134 In a message dated 9/3/2007 11:27:07 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time, apilot2@gm ail.com writes: Does Vans, or anyone else offer tinted windshield and windows? Seems like would be desirable for all VFR flight to cut heat gain. AOL.com. ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Sep 04, 2007
From: "Fred Williams, M.D." <drfred(at)suddenlinkmail.com>
Subject: Alodine
For my current RV, I alumini preped, alodine and then put SW primer on all the interior surfaces. I am happy with what I have chosen to do with this plane. Is there anything wrong with just stopping with the alodine step? Someday, (ok, maybe after my current wife is no longer able to remember how much I spent on the 10) I'd like to build an rv 12 to have for fun day VFR . I have seen a couple of RV 10 's with no interior prep/treatment. Would doing nothing be better than something? With nothing, one does have the pure aluminum which does have an oxidized layer. With the alodine, we are adding a chromic oxidized layer. Thoughts? anybody have any real data? Fred Williams 40515 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "RV Builder (Michael Sausen)" <rvbuilder(at)sausen.net>
Date: Sep 04, 2007
Subject: Alodine
I think where you live has a lot to do with what level you would want to take surface prep to. If I lived anywhere near a salt water or high humidity climate I would probably prime all surfaces. Because I don't, I stopped at Alodining all surfaces and will follow that up with a corrosion inhibiting "fog" every few years. Too each his own but for me that was enough to make me feel comfortable. Now if I were to move near an ocean, it might give me a good reason to sell and build something new. Gotta have the justification for the CFO ya know. ;-) Michael -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Fred Williams, M.D. Sent: Tuesday, September 04, 2007 10:56 AM Subject: RV10-List: Alodine For my current RV, I alumini preped, alodine and then put SW primer on all the interior surfaces. I am happy with what I have chosen to do with this plane. Is there anything wrong with just stopping with the alodine step? Someday, (ok, maybe after my current wife is no longer able to remember how much I spent on the 10) I'd like to build an rv 12 to have for fun day VFR . I have seen a couple of RV 10 's with no interior prep/treatment. Would doing nothing be better than something? With nothing, one does have the pure aluminum which does have an oxidized layer. With the alodine, we are adding a chromic oxidized layer. Thoughts? anybody have any real data? Fred Williams 40515 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "gary" <speckter(at)comcast.net>
Subject: Silence
Date: Sep 04, 2007
This is a test to see if I am still connected to the list. I have had no responces for days. Gary 40274 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: John Ackerman <johnag5b(at)cableone.net>
Subject: Re: phosphoric acid etch for windscreen installation?
Date: Sep 04, 2007
Alumiprep is an etchant commonly used on aircraft prior to Alodining or painting; I suspect most of this thread is really about it or substitutes for it. Alumiprep is a fairly dilute water solution that contains not only phosphoric acid, but also fluoride ion. That means that it contains HF (hydrofluoric acid). HF is very aggressive toward aluminum, dissolving the protective aluminum oxide coat from its surface. That exposes a fresh, uncontaminated aluminum metal surface to the acid solution. The aluminum then reacts very rapidly with the solution to make hydrogen. You can see the tiny hydrogen bubbles forming on the surface. When the entire surface is making hydrogen and looks whitish from the layer of hyrdrogen bubbles, the Alumiprep has done its job. The idea is that when you dissolve away the aluminum oxide coating, you also remove any contaminants (skin grease, paint, oil, whatever) that were on top of it, and have a fresh, active, reproducible surface to accept your alodine or whatever coating you may want to apply. At this point you rinse thoroughly and dry, then put your chosen coating on as soon as you can. A couple safety points: 1. HF is Godawful Nasty Stuff - it can eat away at you and not stop until it hits bone. Most chemists whom I know are truly respectful of it. Phosphoric acid is also nasty, but nearly as bad. 2. If you do like I did and put longerons and other long, narrow things into a plastic pipe with Alumiprep, cap the pipe, then rock and roll to cover the aluminum with Alumiprep, you WILL build up hydrogen gas under pressure in the pipe. There is a significant potential for pressurization of the pipe. There could also be a nasty explosion if a spark hit the hydrogen-air mixture you've made. The worst part of that is that the acid solution is something you really don't want on your skin, let alone in your eyes. I vented the pipe frequently (several time a minute) to avoid building up pressure On Sep 4, 2007, at 8:14 AM, RV Builder (Michael Sausen) wrote: > > > I personally haven't done this but I don't see what the difference > would be. The common Lowes Depot products for "etching" and > "cleaning" concrete prior to painting is nothing more than > phosphoric acid. Look for it in the paint section. Just check the > label and make sure it is straight phosphoric acid. I believe the > one Home Depot sells is even labeled as phosphoric acid. > > Michael > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: RobHickman(at)aol.com
Date: Sep 04, 2007
Subject: Lancair Panel
Has anyone installed one of the Lancair panels with the Throttle quadrant? I am looking for pictures of one. Thanks, Rob Hickman N402RH RV-10 Finish Kit. http://discover.aol.com/memed/aolcom30tour ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Sep 04, 2007
From: Scott Schmidt <scottmschmidt(at)yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: Lancair Panel
Here are a few. Let me know if you want more offline. I moved the console back about 1" from what =0Athe stock setting is to give my hand more room between the throttle and dimmer knobs. This =0Aalso meant all new custom ca bles for the throttle. =0A =0AScott Schmidt=0Ascottmschmidt(at)yahoo.com =0A =0A=0A=0A----- Original Message ----=0AFrom: "RobHickman(at)aol.com" <RobHickm an(at)aol.com>=0ATo: rv10-list(at)matronics.com=0ASent: Tuesday, September 4, 200 7 1:56:54 PM=0ASubject: RV10-List: Lancair Panel=0A=0A=0AHas anyone install ed one of the Lancair panels with the Throttle quadrant?=0A =0A =0AI am loo king for pictures of one.=0A =0AThanks,=0A =0ARob Hickman=0AN402RH RV-10 Fi ======== ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Paul Walter" <pdwalter(at)bigpond.net.au>
Subject: Cool Jugs
Date: Sep 05, 2007
I just read an article on the water cooling jackets for Lycoming engines. Any one in the extended RV community installed these or have any feed back or data, are they as efficient as claimed ?. Paul Walter ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: phosphoric acid etch for windscreen installation?
Date: Sep 04, 2007
From: "John W. Cox" <johnwcox(at)pacificnw.com>
Outstanding safety advice. All of it is accurate and timely. John Cox -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of John Ackerman Sent: Tuesday, September 04, 2007 1:01 PM Subject: Re: RV10-List: phosphoric acid etch for windscreen installation? Alumiprep is an etchant commonly used on aircraft prior to Alodining or painting; I suspect most of this thread is really about it or substitutes for it. Alumiprep is a fairly dilute water solution that contains not only phosphoric acid, but also fluoride ion. That means that it contains HF (hydrofluoric acid). HF is very aggressive toward aluminum, dissolving the protective aluminum oxide coat from its surface. That exposes a fresh, uncontaminated aluminum metal surface to the acid solution. The aluminum then reacts very rapidly with the solution to make hydrogen. You can see the tiny hydrogen bubbles forming on the surface. When the entire surface is making hydrogen and looks whitish from the layer of hyrdrogen bubbles, the Alumiprep has done its job. The idea is that when you dissolve away the aluminum oxide coating, you also remove any contaminants (skin grease, paint, oil, whatever) that were on top of it, and have a fresh, active, reproducible surface to accept your alodine or whatever coating you may want to apply. At this point you rinse thoroughly and dry, then put your chosen coating on as soon as you can. A couple safety points: 1. HF is Godawful Nasty Stuff - it can eat away at you and not stop until it hits bone. Most chemists whom I know are truly respectful of it. Phosphoric acid is also nasty, but nearly as bad. 2. If you do like I did and put longerons and other long, narrow things into a plastic pipe with Alumiprep, cap the pipe, then rock and roll to cover the aluminum with Alumiprep, you WILL build up hydrogen gas under pressure in the pipe. There is a significant potential for pressurization of the pipe. There could also be a nasty explosion if a spark hit the hydrogen-air mixture you've made. The worst part of that is that the acid solution is something you really don't want on your skin, let alone in your eyes. I vented the pipe frequently (several time a minute) to avoid building up pressure ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Lancair Panel
Date: Sep 04, 2007
From: "John W. Cox" <johnwcox(at)pacificnw.com>
Scott Schmidt has and it's a beauty. I will forward a shot direct to your email address. Scott can give more details. John ________________________________ From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of RobHickman(at)aol.com Sent: Tuesday, September 04, 2007 1:57 PM Subject: RV10-List: Lancair Panel Has anyone installed one of the Lancair panels with the Throttle quadrant? I am looking for pictures of one. Thanks, Rob Hickman N402RH RV-10 Finish Kit. ________________________________ AOL.com. ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: RE: XC machine
Date: Sep 04, 2007
From: "John W. Cox" <johnwcox(at)pacificnw.com>
Dave McNeill, I could be resembling the same remark and as you all know, I am not about to shy away from Safety discussions on an aviation forum. I love Scott's posts and look forward to many more. Hope RV-10 builders are more passionate about open discussion than motorcycle dudes. Just call me cynical that after more than 20 years as a pilot examiner the FAA still clings to a concept (Not acknowledged here) that Peer Pressure and Opinion has the most direct effect on changing pilot behavior to the benefit of future generations. As one who created a series of Safety Seminars to improve the gene pool, it became clear that the safe pilots often attend and the unsafe pilot's tend to avoid participation and any effort to reach out to them. Offering opinions should always be encouraged. After several years with accident investigations, I clung to (and will continue to cling to) the perverted but accurate phrase "The tree of life is self pruning". "Hope springs eternal". I watched on the sideline as literally scores of Lancair IV builders abandoned years of passion, effort and thousands of dollars as a few but measurable renegades crashed planes, maimed and killed themselves and others. They still suffer with the insurance industries efforts to maintain profitability without risk adjustments. Only the surviving gene pool pays future insurance rates set by those who go before them. RV-10 builders deserve to benefit from the lessons of others. Wellness is underrated and someday rates will transfer the rightful burden to the correct insured's who don't follow sound principles. We are soon to have 100 flying and hopefully insured when the fly. Now are there only a few of you who believe low fuel levels on landing make sense in the quest for a record? It appears I have lost another close aviation friend, Steve Fossett, today in his pursuit of yet another world record - the land speed record in Scott's backyard. Can you tell my frustration. Flame away. Not looking for support. Just more pilots with some common sense on an RV-10 reflector with over 1,000 readers. John Cox ________________________________ From: David McNeill [mailto:dlm46007(at)cox.net] Sent: Tuesday, September 04, 2007 6:11 PM Subject: XC machine Sounds like I am being called a flame thrower. Would you launch VFR (as a VFR pilot, my guess) into the last 10% of fuel and plan an arrival at 2AM? Just because he arrived safely does not mean it was a safe operation in my opinion. Every thing had to be right for it to work? ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Sep 04, 2007
From: "Kelly McMullen" <apilot2(at)gmail.com>
Subject: Re: Tinted windows
Doesn't make much difference after dark. Makes a big difference when the afternoon sun is beating down on you in 110 here in Phoenix. Heck, I could feel the heat gain in 410RV in Aurora on a cloudy day. On 9/4/07, JSMcGrew(at)aol.com wrote: > > > I wouldn't expect that anyone would want tinted windows in an airplane. It > is hard enough to see at night without looking through a tinted windscreen! > :) > > -Jim > 40134 > > In a message dated 9/3/2007 11:27:07 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time, > apilot2(at)gmail.com writes: > > Does Vans, or anyone else offer tinted windshield and windows? Seems > like would be desirable for all VFR flight to cut heat gain. > > > AOL.com. > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Sep 04, 2007
From: Scott Schmidt <scottmschmidt(at)yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: RE: XC machine
John, Steve Fossett isn't lost yet is he? I have only read that he is miss ing. Apparently flying a Decathlon at the time. I sure hope they find him alive as well. =0A =0AJohn, I have an question about insurance though and I'm hoping you can help me with them. What were main reasons for the incre ase in insurance rates over the past 5-7 years? =0AI understand that press urized aircraft saw some of the highest increases. I also understand that many private pilots flying pressurized planes are required to attend Flight Safety training every year. =0AAnother gentlemen just sold his Meridian a t my airport. He said his insurance was $12,000 per year plus the cost of Flight Safety training for about a week. (Don't know what that costs)=0AWa s this caused by an increase in accidents or due to poor piloting? I ask b ecause I have a very hard time believing that pilots over the past 5-7 year s are worse than pilots in the 10 years preceding it. =0AAlso, I recentl y talked to an RV-6 owner here in Utah who was going to buy a completed RV- 10 but didn't because he was required to have 250 hours total time and 20 h ours of transition training, yet=0Ahe had no problems getting insurance for an RV-6A with under 100 hours total time. (This makes zero sense) When I started building in 2003 my initial quotes at the beginning of 2005 were 15 0 hours total and 1 hour of transition=0Atraining. By the time I had finis hed they wanted 200 hours and 10 hours, now it is 250 hours and 20 hours. There have been no accidents yet they continue to increase requirements and cost. It is data like this that makes me think that =0Aour rates are not tied to other RV-10 owners but to the 4 place high performance market. Do you think that is right? =0AI hope my rates continue to go down as our fle et is shown to be the safest 4 place. :)=0A =0AScott Schmidt=0Ascottmschmid t(at)yahoo.com =0A=0A=0A=0A----- Original Message ----=0AFrom: John W. Cox <jo hnwcox(at)pacificnw.com>=0ATo: rv10-list(at)matronics.com=0ASent: Tuesday, Septem ber 4, 2007 8:38:15 PM=0ASubject: RV10-List: RE: XC machine=0A=0A=0ADave Mc Neill, I could be resembling the same remark and as you all know, I am not about to shy away from Safety discussions on an aviation forum.=0A =0AI lov e Scott=92s posts and look forward to many more. Hope RV-10 builders are m ore passionate about open discussion than motorcycle dudes.=0A =0AJust call me cynical that after more than 20 years as a pilot examiner the FAA still clings to a concept (Not acknowledged here) that Peer Pressure and Opinion has the most direct effect on changing pilot behavior to the benefit of fu ture generations. As one who created a series of Safety Seminars to improv e the gene pool, it became clear that the safe pilots often attend and the unsafe pilot=92s tend to avoid participation and any effort to reach out to them. Offering opinions should always be encouraged.=0A =0AAfter several years with accident investigations, I clung to (and will continue to cling to) the perverted but accurate phrase =93The tree of life is self pruning =94. =93Hope springs eternal=94. I watched on the sideline as literally s cores of Lancair IV builders abandoned years of passion, effort and thousan ds of dollars as a few but measurable renegades crashed planes, maimed and killed themselves and others. They still suffer with the insurance industri es efforts to maintain profitability without risk adjustments. Only the su rviving gene pool pays future insurance rates set by those who go before th em. RV-10 builders deserve to benefit from the lessons of others.=0A =0AWe llness is underrated and someday rates will transfer the rightful burden to the correct insured=92s who don=92t follow sound principles. We are soon to have 100 flying and hopefully insured when the fly.=0A =0ANow are there only a few of you who believe low fuel levels on landing make sense in the quest for a record? It appears I have lost another close aviation friend, Steve Fossett, today in his pursuit of yet another world record ' the la nd speed record in Scott=92s backyard.=0A =0ACan you tell my frustration. Flame away. Not looking for support. Just more pilot s with some common sense on an RV-10 reflector with over 1,000 readers.=0A =0AJohn Cox=0A =0A=0A=0A=0AFrom: David McNeill [mailto:dlm46007(at)cox.net] =0ASent: Tuesday, September 04, 2007 6:11 PM=0ATo: John W. Cox=0ASubject: X C machine=0A =0ASounds like I am being called a flame thrower. Would you la unch VFR (as a VFR pilot, my guess) into the last 10% of fuel and plan an a rrival at 2AM? Just because he arrived safely does not mean it was a safe o peration in my opinion. Every thing had to be right for it to work? =0A ================== ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Sep 04, 2007
From: Scott Schmidt <scottmschmidt(at)yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: Tinted windows
The greenhouse effect of the RV-10 is amazing. I have used those stick on =0Ashades where ever the sun is coming in and they work pretty good. =0Ahtt p://www.sportys.com/acb/showdetl.cfm?&did=19&product_id=7937=0A=0AI wou ld rather have the visibility than not. It really makes for fun flying. =0A =0AScott Schmidt=0Ascottmschmidt(at)yahoo.com=0A=0A=0A=0A----- Original Me ssage ----=0AFrom: Kelly McMullen <apilot2(at)gmail.com>=0ATo: rv10-list@matro nics.com=0ASent: Tuesday, September 4, 2007 9:11:07 PM=0ASubject: Re: RV10- en" =0A=0ADoesn't make much difference after dark. Makes a big difference when=0Athe afternoon sun is beating down on you in 110 he re in Phoenix. Heck,=0AI could feel the heat gain in 410RV in Aurora on a c loudy day.=0A=0AOn 9/4/07, JSMcGrew(at)aol.com wrote:=0A> =0A>=0A>=0A>=0A> I wouldn't expect that anyone would want tinted windows in an airplane. It=0A> is hard enough to see at night without looking through a tinted windscreen!=0A> :)=0A>=0A> -Jim=0A> 40134=0A>=0A> In a message da ted 9/3/2007 11:27:07 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time,=0A> apilot2(at)gmail.com wri om>=0A>=0A> Does Vans, or anyone else offer tinted windshield and windows? Seems=0A> like would be desirable for all VFR flight to cut heat gain.=0A> =========== ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Sep 04, 2007
From: Kelly McMullen <kellym(at)aviating.com>
Subject: Re: Tinted windows
Point is, night flying is a small percentage of use, the only things you will see are lit anyway, so tint has virtually zero impact on visibility. Stick on shades work okay for blocking some of the light, but little for heat gain. I guess will have to focus on ventiliation. Scott Schmidt wrote: > The greenhouse effect of the RV-10 is amazing. I have used those stick on > shades where ever the sun is coming in and they work pretty good. > http://www.sportys.com/acb/showdetl.cfm?&did=19&product_id=7937 > <http://www.sportys.com/acb/showdetl.cfm?&did=19&product_id=7937> > > I would rather have the visibility than not. It really makes for fun > flying. > > Scott Schmidt > scottmschmidt(at)yahoo.com > > > ----- Original Message ---- > From: Kelly McMullen <apilot2(at)gmail.com> > To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com > Sent: Tuesday, September 4, 2007 9:11:07 PM > Subject: Re: RV10-List: Tinted windows > > > Doesn't make much difference after dark. Makes a big difference when > the afternoon sun is beating down on you in 110 here in Phoenix. Heck, > I could feel the heat gain in 410RV in Aurora on a cloudy day. > > On 9/4/07, JSMcGrew(at)aol.com wrote: > > > > > > > > > > I wouldn't expect that anyone would want tinted windows in an > airplane. It > > is hard enough to see at night without looking through a tinted > windscreen! > > :) > > > > -Jim > > 40134 > > > > In a message dated 9/3/2007 11:27:07 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time, > > apilot2(at)gmail.com writes: > > > > Does Vans, or anyone else offer tinted windshield and windows? Seems > > like would be desirable for all VFR flight to cut heat gain. > > > > > > > > AOL.com. > > > > > > > ?RV10-List" target=_blank>http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List > > * > > > * ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Tinted windows
Date: Sep 05, 2007
From: "Robin Marks" <robin1(at)mrmoisture.com>
Some people are talking about tinting only the rear windows? Kinda sporty. Thoughts? Also some tint before installing. I figure if they can tint my car after production I would do the same in the -10 (if at all). Robin From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Scott Schmidt Sent: Tuesday, September 04, 2007 9:01 PM Subject: Re: RV10-List: Tinted windows The greenhouse effect of the RV-10 is amazing. I have used those stick on shades where ever the sun is coming in and they work pretty good. http://www.sportys.com/acb/showdetl.cfm?&did=19&product_id=7937 I would rather have the visibility than not. It really makes for fun flying. Scott Schmidt scottmschmidt(at)yahoo.com ----- Original Message ---- From: Kelly McMullen <apilot2(at)gmail.com> Sent: Tuesday, September 4, 2007 9:11:07 PM Subject: Re: RV10-List: Tinted windows Doesn't make much difference after dark. Makes a big difference when the afternoon sun is beating down on you in 110 here in Phoenix. Heck, I could feel the heat gain in 410RV in Aurora on a cloudy day. On 9/4/07, JSMcGrew(at)aol.com wrote: > > > I wouldn't expect that anyone would want tinted windows in an airplane. It > is hard enough to see at night without looking through a tinted windscreen! > :) > > -Jim > 40134 > > In a message dated 9/3/2007 11:27:07 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time, > apilot2(at)gmail.com writes: > > Does Vans, or anyone else offer tinted windshield and windows? Seems > like would be desirable for all VFR flight to cut heat gain. > > > AOL.com. > > ?RV10-List" target=_blank>http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List - NEW MATRONICS WE== ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Wayne Edgerton" <wayne.e(at)grandecom.net>
Subject: Re: Tinted windowsTinted windows
Date: Sep 05, 2007
I didn't order tinted window but another builder on my field who built an RV7A has his tinted and said you can order it that way from Van's. Wayne Edgerton N602WT Flying but in the paint shop ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: RE: XC machine
Date: Sep 05, 2007
From: "John W. Cox" <johnwcox(at)pacificnw.com>
The correlation on insurance rate increases were and continue to be a direct result of exorbitant settlements by the surviving family members of "harmed" parties brought about by teams of aggressive professionals in a judicial system gone amuck. Tort reform is sorely needed. Dialog about attorneys is only fodder for cocktail jokes. The pain is just not great enough yet to pilots yet. Anyone out their follow the results of the late Governor Carnahan and what his widow 's professional advisors did after that pilot error incident? Millions upon millions claimed against every component used in the aircraft. The report showed pilot error. Anyone remember the settlement against Lycoming on the crankshaft lawsuit in Texas? That was treble damages in the tens of millions. The price of litigation is understandably spread to those who can pay. The individuals who buy the product after the tort system equitably distributes the wealth foot the bill. Now should the professional every get more than 10% many get 40%. Every year the age of pilots jumps faster than the calendar pages turn. Every year the cost of aviation makes it harder to continue. Thank heavens for kit builders or only a handful could afford the new half million dollar entry aircraft being charged for liability costs. Even the new Lancair Evolution is going to cost $1,000,000 for a kit built. Boy do I think the RV-10 is a great deal. In the case of kit builders of Lancair IV, not all were pressurized. Almost every incident which became classified as a fatal accident had stratospheric claims of aircraft value. Just a month ago here in Oregon the pilot delivering it for Pre Purchase inspection and selling it for just under one half million. Way too many of those accidents were the loss of life of both the pilot and additional members onboard. 4 is a lot worse than one or two. Just last week another went down in Cameron Park, CA with six bodies in a four passenger aircraft. You're the one's that will pay for that excursion. It has been found that lots of money, chasing professional builders of kit aircraft often mate with low time pilots for the purchase of complex aircraft. It is not unanticipated the unintended conclusion which come together with concentric circles collide on the lap of every pilot. Now it is coming to the attention of insurance actuaries. In an effort to bring sanity to aviation, many high ticket aircraft insurers began requiring professional pilot training specific to Manufacturer, Make and Model. An instrument rating backed by regular competency became expected. More hours leads them to believe there is less chance of a repeat of claims. The Lancair guys regularly review the accident reports for patterns. We should not assume that RV-10s are exempt from the same considerations. More and more low time pilots fly highly complex aircraft without adequate and frequent High Performance Training. Transition Training is not the same as Factory sponsored High Performance Training. It is time many builders responded to Deems request to begin a sound curriculum, solicit the best instruction and lobby responsible insurance companies to participate and help underwrite a pool of proactive builders. The last thing we need is fewer underwriters and more professional tort specialists trying to redirect personal wealth as the other 700 builders try to join the ranks of the first 100 that are flying. My crystal ball says - Private Pilot 500 hours+, IFR ticket with 100 hours logged actual and 50 hours per year of currency in Make and Model with successful completion of High Performance Procedures annually. In the next five years that could grow to 1000+, IFR with 250 hours and no less than 10 hours of Dual specific to High Performance in make and model. Just wait till the tort boys get a hold of the professional builders for hire when the first one of those makes headlines. Who was that builders "manufacturer's" name again? We will be the ones footing whatever the bill comes to. Want to bet the percentage of builders who will operate "Uncovered"? John ________________________________ From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Scott Schmidt Sent: Tuesday, September 04, 2007 8:21 PM Subject: Re: RV10-List: RE: XC machine John, Steve Fossett isn't lost yet is he? I have only read that he is missing. Apparently flying a Decathlon at the time. I sure hope they find him alive as well. John, I have an question about insurance though and I'm hoping you can help me with them. What were main reasons for the increase in insurance rates over the past 5-7 years? I understand that pressurized aircraft saw some of the highest increases. I also understand that many private pilots flying pressurized planes are required to attend Flight Safety training every year. Another gentlemen just sold his Meridian at my airport. He said his insurance was $12,000 per year plus the cost of Flight Safety training for about a week. (Don't know what that costs) Was this caused by an increase in accidents or due to poor piloting? I ask because I have a very hard time believing that pilots over the past 5-7 years are worse than pilots in the 10 years preceding it. Also, I recently talked to an RV-6 owner here in Utah who was going to buy a completed RV-10 but didn't because he was required to have 250 hours total time and 20 hours of transition training, yet he had no problems getting insurance for an RV-6A with under 100 hours total time. (This makes zero sense) When I started building in 2003 my initial quotes at the beginning of 2005 were 150 hours total and 1 hour of transition training. By the time I had finished they wanted 200 hours and 10 hours, now it is 250 hours and 20 hours. There have been no accidents yet they continue to increase requirements and cost. It is data like this that makes me think that our rates are not tied to other RV-10 owners but to the 4 place high performance market. Do you think that is right? I hope my rates continue to go down as our fleet is shown to be the safest 4 place. :) Scott Schmidt scottmschmidt(at)yahoo.com ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Sep 05, 2007
From: Jae Chang <jc-matronics_rv10(at)jline.com>
Subject: F-1071 to F-1069 skin gap
Guys, While clecoing my upper fuse skin, i noticed there is a gap at the join between F-1071 and F-1069 at the firewall. pictures below... I am curious, if any others have this gap? all my other joins have been tight, so not sure if this is normal or not for this area. To seal this area, i figure i should try and glob in some proseal then let it ooze out the gap, then wipe it flush with the skin? Thus, use proseal like drywall mud to smooth this area out? Does that sound right? http://www.jline.com/log/aviation/build/airframe/fuselage/sec31/photos/IMG_4703.html http://www.jline.com/log/aviation/build/airframe/fuselage/sec31/photos/IMG_4704.html http://www.jline.com/log/aviation/build/airframe/fuselage/sec31/photos/IMG_4705.html http://www.jline.com/log/aviation/build/airframe/fuselage/sec31/photos/IMG_4706.html Jae 40533 ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Sep 05, 2007
From: Rick Sked <ricksked(at)embarqmail.com>
Subject: Re: F-1071 to F-1069 skin gap
Jae, Looks like you might have been a little over zealous smooting out the side skin. I doesn't look like you violated any edge distance rules. I actually had to fit my skins, it was a bit to tight, only a few passes with the file to make it perfect, hard to stretch it though. Have you already riveted the upper skin to the ribs? If not you may find that they will close in after that is done. Rick S. 40185 ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jae Chang" <jc-matronics_rv10(at)jline.com> Sent: Wednesday, September 5, 2007 10:52:01 AM (GMT-0800) America/Los_Angeles Subject: RV10-List: F-1071 to F-1069 skin gap Guys, While clecoing my upper fuse skin, i noticed there is a gap at the join between F-1071 and F-1069 at the firewall. pictures below... I am curious, if any others have this gap? all my other joins have been tight, so not sure if this is normal or not for this area. To seal this area, i figure i should try and glob in some proseal then let it ooze out the gap, then wipe it flush with the skin? Thus, use proseal like drywall mud to smooth this area out? Does that sound right? http://www.jline.com/log/aviation/build/airframe/fuselage/sec31/photos/IMG_4703.html http://www.jline.com/log/aviation/build/airframe/fuselage/sec31/photos/IMG_4704.html http://www.jline.com/log/aviation/build/airframe/fuselage/sec31/photos/IMG_4705.html http://www.jline.com/log/aviation/build/airframe/fuselage/sec31/photos/IMG_4706.html Jae 40533 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Rene Felker" <rene(at)felker.com>
Subject: F-1071 to F-1069 skin gap
Date: Sep 05, 2007
I have a gap also. Small, but a gap. Rene' Felker N423CF 40322 801-721-6080 -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Jae Chang Sent: Wednesday, September 05, 2007 11:52 AM Subject: RV10-List: F-1071 to F-1069 skin gap Guys, While clecoing my upper fuse skin, i noticed there is a gap at the join between F-1071 and F-1069 at the firewall. pictures below... I am curious, if any others have this gap? all my other joins have been tight, so not sure if this is normal or not for this area. To seal this area, i figure i should try and glob in some proseal then let it ooze out the gap, then wipe it flush with the skin? Thus, use proseal like drywall mud to smooth this area out? Does that sound right? http://www.jline.com/log/aviation/build/airframe/fuselage/sec31/photos/IMG_4 703.html http://www.jline.com/log/aviation/build/airframe/fuselage/sec31/photos/IMG_4 704.html http://www.jline.com/log/aviation/build/airframe/fuselage/sec31/photos/IMG_4 705.html http://www.jline.com/log/aviation/build/airframe/fuselage/sec31/photos/IMG_4 706.html Jae 40533 ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Cool Jugs
From: "Bill Reining" <wreining(at)gmail.com>
Date: Sep 05, 2007
How about posting the article, or a link to it, so we can all share? -------- Bill (and Jon) Reining 40514 Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=132930#132930 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "RV Builder (Michael Sausen)" <rvbuilder(at)sausen.net>
Date: Sep 05, 2007
Subject: Re: Cool Jugs
I read about these guys years ago but haven't heard anything since then. Neat idea but adds a fair amount of weight and complexity. http://www.liquidcooledairpower.com/ Michael -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Bill Reining Sent: Wednesday, September 05, 2007 1:43 PM Subject: RV10-List: Re: Cool Jugs How about posting the article, or a link to it, so we can all share? -------- Bill (and Jon) Reining 40514 Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=132930#132930 ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Lancair Panel
From: "Michael Wellenzohn" <rv-10(at)wellenzohn.net>
Date: Sep 05, 2007
Scott, where can I order the cables for throttle, Mixer and Prop to the length required? I use the center console from Henkjan so this puts the throttle at least 3 inches back. I also had to construct new mounts for the throttle quadrant (see attached CAD pictures). Michael www.wellenzohn.net -------- RV-10 builder (wings) #511 Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=132939#132939 Attachments: http://forums.matronics.com//files/throttelquadrant_519.jpg http://forums.matronics.com//files/tunnel_assembly_106.jpg http://forums.matronics.com//files/fwf_014_145.jpg ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Ben Westfall" <rv10(at)sinkrate.com>
Subject: Re: Lancair Panel
Date: Sep 05, 2007
Michael, John Cox has offered several builders assistance in getting custom cables made. Check with him. On another note... In looking at your panel mockup in one of the pictures it appears we are planning a very similar panel. Are your paper printout instruments to scale? How did you do that? If the graphics are already to scale that you have can you email me the files to print maybe? -Ben Portland, OR #40579 -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Michael Wellenzohn Sent: Wednesday, September 05, 2007 12:33 PM Subject: RV10-List: Re: Lancair Panel Scott, where can I order the cables for throttle, Mixer and Prop to the length required? I use the center console from Henkjan so this puts the throttle at least 3 inches back. I also had to construct new mounts for the throttle quadrant (see attached CAD pictures). Michael www.wellenzohn.net -------- RV-10 builder (wings) #511 Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=132939#132939 Attachments: http://forums.matronics.com//files/throttelquadrant_519.jpg http://forums.matronics.com//files/tunnel_assembly_106.jpg http://forums.matronics.com//files/fwf_014_145.jpg ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Ben Westfall" <rv10(at)sinkrate.com>
Subject: Re: Lancair Panel
Date: Sep 05, 2007
Michael, John Cox has offered several builders assistance in getting custom cables made. Check with him. On another note... In looking at your panel mockup in one of the pictures it appears we are planning a very similar panel. Are your paper printout instruments to scale? How did you do that? If the graphics are already to scale that you have can you email me the files to print maybe? -Ben Portland, OR #40579 -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Michael Wellenzohn Sent: Wednesday, September 05, 2007 12:33 PM Subject: RV10-List: Re: Lancair Panel Scott, where can I order the cables for throttle, Mixer and Prop to the length required? I use the center console from Henkjan so this puts the throttle at least 3 inches back. I also had to construct new mounts for the throttle quadrant (see attached CAD pictures). Michael www.wellenzohn.net -------- RV-10 builder (wings) #511 Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=132939#132939 Attachments: http://forums.matronics.com//files/throttelquadrant_519.jpg http://forums.matronics.com//files/tunnel_assembly_106.jpg http://forums.matronics.com//files/fwf_014_145.jpg ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Paul Walter" <pdwalter(at)bigpond.net.au>
Subject: Cool jugs
Date: Sep 06, 2007
Here is the article. It was back in 2003 so they may have encounted problems with thier product. Certaily havent heard or seen of any in Australia. Paul Walter ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: F-1071 to F-1069 skin gap
From: "egohr1" <EGOHR86(at)alumni.carnegiemellon.edu>
Date: Sep 05, 2007
I had the same gap prior to riveting the skin down. I riveted from aft to forward this last weekend and the gap was closed after riveting. The "spring back" in the skin makes it hard to get a tight fit with the cleos. -------- eric gohr EGOHR86(at)alumni.carnegiemellon.edu Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=132968#132968 ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Sep 05, 2007
Subject: Re: Lancair Panel
From: "William Curtis" <wcurtis(at)nerv10.com>
Michael, Based on the position of your avionics stack you may want to check the clearance with the middle bracket. The depth of the Garmin 430 with connector is 11 inches and if you leave your stack in that position, you would have to cut a LOT of the middle bracket away. The Garmin 330 is also lengthy at 11.5 inches. The distance between the instrument panel and the middle panel is 9.5 inches. For this reason, I left the middle bracket untouched and put my avionics stack just to the right of it. http://wcurtis.nerv10.com/91Panel/index.html http://wcurtis.nerv10.com/08fuselage/fuselage31s.html William http://wcurtis.nerv10.com/ -------- Original Message -------- > X-Rcpt-To: > > > Michael, > > John Cox has offered several builders assistance in getting custom cables > made. Check with him. > > On another note... > > In looking at your panel mockup in one of the pictures it appears we are > planning a very similar panel. Are your paper printout instruments to > scale? How did you do that? If the graphics are already to scale that you > have can you email me the files to print maybe? > > -Ben > Portland, OR > #40579 > > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com > [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Michael > Wellenzohn > Sent: Wednesday, September 05, 2007 12:33 PM > To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com > Subject: RV10-List: Re: Lancair Panel > > > Scott, > > where can I order the cables for throttle, Mixer and Prop to the length > required? > I use the center console from Henkjan so this puts the throttle at least 3 > inches back. I also had to construct new mounts for the throttle quadrant > (see attached CAD pictures). > > Michael > > www.wellenzohn.net > > -------- > RV-10 builder (wings) > #511 > > > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=132939#132939 > > > > > Attachments: > > http://forums.matronics.com//files/throttelquadrant_519.jpg > http://forums.matronics.com//files/tunnel_assembly_106.jpg > http://forums.matronics.com//files/fwf_014_145.jpg > > > > > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Sep 05, 2007
From: Scott Schmidt <scottmschmidt(at)yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: Lancair Panel
Lancair supplied me with a few different panel designs and I then started t aking pictures off the Internet, imported them into Photoshop and started l aying different ideas out. =0AI used Photoshop to reduce different picture s from the Internet. =0AI think my final version with Lancair was v.14 by t he time I was finished. =0A =0AScott Schmidt=0Ascottmschmidt(at)yahoo.com =0A =0A=0A=0A----- Original Message ----=0AFrom: Ben Westfall <rv10(at)sinkrate.co m>=0ATo: rv10-list(at)matronics.com=0ASent: Wednesday, September 5, 2007 3:25: 37 PM=0ASubject: RE: RV10-List: Re: Lancair Panel=0A=0A=0A--> RV10-List mes sage posted by: "Ben Westfall" =0A=0AMichael,=0A=0AJohn Cox has offered several builders assistance in getting custom cables=0Amade . Check with him.=0A=0AOn another note...=0A=0AIn looking at your panel mo ckup in one of the pictures it appears we are=0Aplanning a very similar pan el. Are your paper printout instruments to=0Ascale? How did you do that? If the graphics are already to scale that you=0Ahave can you email me the files to print maybe?=0A=0A-Ben=0APortland, OR=0A#40579=0A=0A-----Original Message-----=0AFrom: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com=0A[mailto:owner-r v10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Michael=0AWellenzohn=0ASent: We dnesday, September 05, 2007 12:33 PM=0ATo: rv10-list(at)matronics.com=0ASubjec ael Wellenzohn" =0A=0AScott,=0A=0Awhere can I order t he cables for throttle, Mixer and Prop to the length=0Arequired?=0AI use th e center console from Henkjan so this puts the throttle at least 3=0Ainches back. I also had to construct new mounts for the throttle quadrant=0A(see attached CAD pictures).=0A=0AMichael=0A=0Awww.wellenzohn.net=0A=0A-------- =0ARV-10 builder (wings)=0A#511=0A=0A=0A=0A=0ARead this topic online here: =0A=0Ahttp://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=132939#132939=0A=0A=0A =0A=0AAttachments: =0A=0Ahttp://forums.matronics.com//files/throttelquadran t_519.jpg=0Ahttp://forums.matronics.com//files/tunnel_assembly_106.jpg=0Aht ===================== ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Sep 05, 2007
From: Scott Schmidt <scottmschmidt(at)yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: Lancair Panel
What I did was hook up the cables that Van's sent me to the engine side and then measured the additional length I would need to tie them into the thro ttle quadrant. =0AI called Van's direct and they took the old cables back, and ordered new custom cables. They said it could be 4 weeks but showed u p in about 10 days. =0A =0AScott Schmidt=0Ascottmschmidt(at)yahoo.com =0A=0A =0A=0A----- Original Message ----=0AFrom: Ben Westfall <rv10(at)sinkrate.com> =0ATo: rv10-list(at)matronics.com=0ASent: Wednesday, September 5, 2007 3:25:37 PM=0ASubject: RE: RV10-List: Re: Lancair Panel=0A=0A=0A--> RV10-List messa ge posted by: "Ben Westfall" =0A=0AMichael,=0A=0AJohn Co x has offered several builders assistance in getting custom cables=0Amade. Check with him.=0A=0AOn another note...=0A=0AIn looking at your panel mock up in one of the pictures it appears we are=0Aplanning a very similar panel . Are your paper printout instruments to=0Ascale? How did you do that? I f the graphics are already to scale that you=0Ahave can you email me the fi les to print maybe?=0A=0A-Ben=0APortland, OR=0A#40579=0A=0A-----Original Me ssage-----=0AFrom: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com=0A[mailto:owner-rv1 0-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Michael=0AWellenzohn=0ASent: Wedn esday, September 05, 2007 12:33 PM=0ATo: rv10-list(at)matronics.com=0ASubject: l Wellenzohn" =0A=0AScott,=0A=0Awhere can I order the cables for throttle, Mixer and Prop to the length=0Arequired?=0AI use the center console from Henkjan so this puts the throttle at least 3=0Ainches b ack. I also had to construct new mounts for the throttle quadrant=0A(see a ttached CAD pictures).=0A=0AMichael=0A=0Awww.wellenzohn.net=0A=0A-------- =0ARV-10 builder (wings)=0A#511=0A=0A=0A=0A=0ARead this topic online here: =0A=0Ahttp://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=132939#132939=0A=0A=0A =0A=0AAttachments: =0A=0Ahttp://forums.matronics.com//files/throttelquadran t_519.jpg=0Ahttp://forums.matronics.com//files/tunnel_assembly_106.jpg=0Aht ===================== ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Lancair Panel
Date: Sep 05, 2007
From: "John W. Cox" <johnwcox(at)pacificnw.com>
Scott's approach is not unlike that used by Jim Hergert in his national award winning N6XE (Sexy). Once your conceptual plan is developed, put it to construction board or thin gatorboard and begin working the ergonomics and functional reach issues. A few hours conceptually flying your conceptual panel will save hundreds in actual installation and years of flying enjoyment. I believe Tim could even chime in on how many iterations he used to get it right. It doesn't hurt opening the discussion to a handful of close friends to find potential weaknesses in design. Don't forget serviceability after you put down your manufacturer hat. John ________________________________ From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Scott Schmidt Sent: Wednesday, September 05, 2007 6:15 PM Subject: Re: RV10-List: Re: Lancair Panel Lancair supplied me with a few different panel designs and I then started taking pictures off the Internet, imported them into Photoshop and started laying different ideas out. I used Photoshop to reduce different pictures from the Internet. I think my final version with Lancair was v.14 by the time I was finished. Scott Schmidt scottmschmidt(at)yahoo.com ----- Original Message ---- From: Ben Westfall <rv10(at)sinkrate.com> Sent: Wednesday, September 5, 2007 3:25:37 PM Subject: RE: RV10-List: Re: Lancair Panel Michael, John Cox has offered several builders assistance in getting custom cables made. Check with him. On another note... In looking at your panel mockup in one of the pictures it appears we are planning a very similar panel. Are your paper printout instruments to scale? How did you do that? If the graphics are already to scale that you have can you email me the files to print maybe? -Ben Portland, OR #40579 -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Michael Wellenzohn Sent: Wednesday, September 05, 2007 12:33 PM Subject: RV10-List: Re: Lancair Panel Scott, where can I order the cables for throttle, Mixer and Prop to the length required? I use the center console from Henkjan so this puts the throttle at least 3 inches back. I also had to construct new mounts for the throttle quadrant (see attached CAD pictures). Michael www.wellenzohn.net <http://www.wellenzohn.net/> -------- RV-10 builder (wings) #511 Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=132939#132939 Attachments: http://forums.matronics.com//files/throttelquadrant_519.jpg <http://forums.matronics.com/files/throttelquadrant_519.jpg> http://forums.matronics.com//files/tunnel_assembly_106.jpg <http://forums.matronics.com/files/tunnel_assembly_106.jpg> http://forums.matronics.com//files/fwf_014_145.jpg <http://forums.matronics.com/files/fwf_014_145.jpg> http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?R - NEW MAT--> http://foru=================== <http://forums.matronics.com/> <http://forums.matronics.com/> <http://forums.matronics.com/> <http://forums.matronics.com/> <http://forums.matronics.com/> <http://forums.matronics.com/> <http://forums.matronics.com/> <http://forums.matronics.com/> <http://forums.matronics.com/> http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Richard Sipp" <rsipp(at)earthlink.net>
Subject: Re: F-1071 to F-1069 skin gap
Date: Sep 05, 2007
Jae: I would tend to agree with Rick's comment. The skins on earlier models that were not designed and cut with CAD/CAM were oversize and required "trim to fit" I noticed (luckily) on the 10 the skins were nearly perfect out of the box and only required the slightest deburring to remove the shear marks. Fixing the issue cosmetically during paint should not be too hard. Dick Sipp N110DV at the airport ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jae Chang" <jc-matronics_rv10(at)jline.com> Sent: Wednesday, September 05, 2007 1:52 PM Subject: RV10-List: F-1071 to F-1069 skin gap > > Guys, > > While clecoing my upper fuse skin, i noticed there is a gap at the join > between F-1071 and F-1069 at the firewall. pictures below... > > I am curious, if any others have this gap? all my other joins have been > tight, so not sure if this is normal or not for this area. ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Lancair Panel
From: "Michael Wellenzohn" <rv-10(at)wellenzohn.net>
Date: Sep 05, 2007
Thanks for the advice guys, I actually just pinned some pictures of my desired avionics on the panel to get a more realistic feel while making plane noises ;-) I am currently designing my panel also in the 3D CAD system but once I have a virtually solution I will transfer it into scale pictures and put it into the cockpit. I had to wait until I can sit in the plane to really feel the distance and ergonomics. I bought the VP-200 and in Osh and now have to see where I will put it. Maintenance accessibility is important, how many times did you guys (flying) had to open the tunnel so far and what for? Michael www.wellenzohn.net -------- RV-10 builder (wings) #511 Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=133037#133037 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "RV Builder (Michael Sausen)" <rvbuilder(at)sausen.net>
Date: Sep 06, 2007
Subject: Rosen Visors
Also, there is the visors that Alex is selling for considerably less than t he Rosens. http://www.aviationtechproducts.com/html/new_products.html From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@m atronics.com] On Behalf Of Jesse Saint Sent: Thursday, September 06, 2007 10:00 AM Subject: RV10-List: Rosen Visors For those who didn't get in on the group buy for Rosen Visors, I have a few extra here. Contact me off the list if you are interested. Jesse Saint Saint Aviation, Inc. jesse(at)saintaviation.com www.saintaviation.com<http://www.saintaviation.com> Cell: 352-427-0285 Fax: 815-377-3694 ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Another one begins #40761
From: "n277dl" <dljinia(at)yahoo.com>
Date: Sep 06, 2007
Well guys & gals the building begins again for me. I built a 7A with first flight in 2004. Have about 550 hrs on it but now it's time for a more roomy XC edition. The tail kit arrived this afternoon so I've spent the last couple hours getting the big pieces out and inventoried. Did slow build on the -7A but will probably go QB on the -10. I've met a few of you up at Boone as I'm located in Muscatine, IA. My son lives in Boone so the plane ends up there frequently. Interesting (at least for me) bit of useless information... the night I filled out the order form for the 7A was the first time the four seat plane was discussed on Vans web site. I called the next morning before faxing the order for the 7A in and asked about the four seater but was told it would be a couple years before it was in production. I couldn't wait that long to begin building so we decided to build the two seater and if the four seater made it and lived up to expecations and if we could complete the two seater we'd do it again. It did, we did so here we go again. Doug www.oncloud7.com/rv7.htm 10 builder #40761 7A flyer 550hrs -------- Doug RV7A flying ~500hrs Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=133186#133186 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Wayne Edgerton" <wayne.e(at)grandecom.net>
Subject: Looking for some advise
Date: Sep 07, 2007
I have couple of issues that maybe you ace mechanics/builders out there can assist me with. Problem 1 It appears that I have a right wing that is a little bit heavy. On the ground when I push the stick to the right it will spring back to the center/ neutral position when I let go. However when I push the stick to the left, again on the ground, and let go it doesn't return to the center position. The trim spring is in the left wing so to me I guess that make sense, but is this the same thing that all of you are experiencing? I'm thinking I may need to lower my right flap just a little to bring the wing back up. Has anyone had this problem? Problem 2 - A little more complex. I have an Aerosport Power new IO540 engine with LASAR Electronic Ignition. On my first flight I lost one of my mags. We installed a new mag and retimed the engine. I am having a 200 to 225 rpm drop on each mag on run-up check, even for both sides. In flight at 23sq and leaned out, I did a mag test and got little or no mag drop on either mag. Also if on the ground I lean out the engine for 1700rpm run-up I will get a normal mag drop of 50 to 100. The symptom appears to be too rich of a fuel servo on the ground. Anyway here's what we've done so far, some sound a little strange, but people were giving me their suggestions and I have been giving their ideas a go. - I changed the plugs to a fine wire plug. - I changed the fuel servo out, which I really believed was going to solve the problem. - I leaned out the idle mixture more, but in my mind this really doesn't affect the mixture at 1700rpm, but just taking suggested measures. - I talked to a tech at Unison, LASAR, and he says he is confident that it's not the LASAR box. I'm still not sure on this one. Anyway after all of this I still have the mag drop. I've talked at length with Bart at Aerosport, really nice guy, and he's a little stumped also. They are going to fuel flow another fuel servo for me that will be leaned out by them at the factory. I'm really not understanding this one. Why would I need a fuel servo that has had special adjustments made to it versus any other IO540. I need to talk to him again on this. I still keep thinking it's the way we've timed it, but we've checked that a couple of times. ?? Anyway if any of you smart sharp shooters out there have any great ideas for me I would appreciate your feed back. Wayne Edgerton N602WT In the paint shop and stuck with honey do lists :>} ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: FAA reminder of the change to 406 MHz ELTs, in case you're
in the buying mood
Date: Sep 07, 2007
From: John Jessen <n212pj(at)gmail.com>
Termination of 121.5 MHz Beacons for Satellite Alerting is Coming Soon Notice Number: NOTC0981 On 1 February 2009, the International Cospas-Sarsat [1] Organization (U.S. included) will terminate processing of distress signals emitted by 121.5 MHz Emergency Locator Transmitters (ELTs). This means that pilots flying aircraft equipped with 121.5 MHz ELTs after that date will have to depend on pilots of over flying aircraft and or ground stations monitoring 121.5 to hear and report distress alert signals, transmitted from a possible crash site. Why is this happening? Although lives have been saved by 121.5 MHz ELTs, the downside has been their propensity to generate false alerts (approximately 98 percent of all 121.5 MHz alerts are false), and their failure to provide rescue forces with timely and accurate crash location data. Both of which actually delay rescue efforts and have a direct effect on an individual's chance for survival. Rescue forces have to respond to all 121.5 MHz alerts to determine if they are real distress alerts or if they are being generated by an interferer, an inadvertent activation (by the owner) or equipment failure. Is there an alternative? Yes, the Cospas-Sarsat System (U.S. included) has been and will continue processing emergency signals transmitted by 406 MHz ELTs. These 5 Watt digital beacons transmit a much stronger signal, are more accurate, verifiable and traceable to the registered beacon owner (406 MHz ELTs must be registered by the owner in accordance with Federal Communications Commission (FCC) regulation). Registration allows the search and rescue authorities to contact the beacon owner, or his or her designated alternate by telephone to determine if a real emergency exists. Therefore, a simple telephone call often solves a 406 MHz alerts without launching costly and limited search and rescue resources, which would have to be done for a 121.5 MHz alert. For these reasons, the search and rescue community is encouraging aircraft owners to consider retrofit of 406 MHz ELTs or at a minimum, consider the purchase of a handheld 406 MHz Personal Locator Beacon (PLB) which can be carried in the cockpit while continuing to maintain a fixed 121.5 MHz ELT mounted in the aircraft's tail. Remember, after February 1, 2009, the world-wide Cospas-Sarsat satellite system will no longer process 121.5 MHz alert signals. Pilots involved in aircraft accidents in remote areas will have to depend on pilots of over flying aircraft and or ground stations to hear emergency ELT distress signals. For further information concerning the termination of 121.5 MHz data processing visit www.sarsat.noaa.gov _____ [1] The Cospas-Sarsat Organization provides a satellite based world-wide monitoring system that detects and locates distress signals transmitted by Emergency Locator Transmitters (ELTs), Emergency Position Indicating Radio Beacons (EPIRBs) and Personal Locator Beacons (PLBs). The system includes space and ground segments which process the signals received from the beacon source and forwards the distress alert data to the appropriate RescueCoordinationCenter for action. Address SARSAT inquiries to: NOAA SARSAT NSOF. E/SP3 4231 SuitlandRoad Suitland, MD 20746 Phone: 301.817.4515 Toll free: 888.212.7283 Fax: 301.817.4565 You have received this notice from FAASafety.gov because you have selected "General Information" in your preferences on your FAASafety.gov account. Click here to log in and edit your preferences on FAASafety.gov. Safety is a learned behavior...Learn to be safer at the Learning Center found on FAASafety.gov Right-click here to download pictures. To help protect your privacy, Outlook prevented automatic download of this picture from the Internet. <http://www.faasafety.gov/include/lookandfeel/images/email/spacer.gif> <http://www.faasafety.gov/> FAASafety.gov | <http://www.faasafety.gov/SPANS/preferences.aspx> Email Preferences | <http://www.faasafety.gov/SPANS/optout.aspx> Opt Out Do not reply to this email as it is an unmonitored alias. <http://www.faasafety.gov/about/contact.aspx> Contact us for comments or questions. ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Sep 07, 2007
From: Dave Lammers <davelammers(at)mchsi.com>
Subject: Re: Looking for some advise
Wayne, On problem 1, I suggest that before you do anything with the airframe such as flap adjustment, that you evaluate the wing heaviness with the trim springs disconnected. In a (theoretically) frictionless system, it should make no difference as to which wing the trim springs/servo is mounted. Your on ground problem sounds to me like something is rubbing (friction) differently when you move left to right. Again, in my judgment, your in air problem should be evaluated first with the trim system not "in the loop". Problem 2 ?????????/ Regards Dave Lammers Wayne Edgerton wrote: > I have couple of issues that maybe you ace mechanics/builders out > there can assist me with. > > Problem 1 > > It appears that I have a right wing that is a little bit heavy. On the > ground when I push the stick to the right it will spring back to the > center/ neutral position when I let go. However when I push the stick > to the left, again on the ground, and let go it doesn't return to the > center position. The trim spring is in the left wing so to me I guess > that make sense, but is this the same thing that all of you are > experiencing? I'm thinking I may need to lower my right flap just a > little to bring the wing back up. Has anyone had this problem? > > Problem 2 - A little more complex. > > I have an Aerosport Power new IO540 engine with LASAR Electronic > Ignition. On my first flight I lost one of my mags. We installed a new > mag and retimed the engine. I am having a 200 to 225 rpm drop on each > mag on run-up check, even for both sides. In flight at 23sq and leaned > out, I did a mag test and got little or no mag drop on either mag. > Also if on the ground I lean out the engine for 1700rpm run-up I will > get a normal mag drop of 50 to 100. The symptom appears to be too rich > of a fuel servo on the ground. > > Anyway here's what we've done so far, some sound a little strange, but > people were giving me their suggestions and I have been giving their > ideas a go. > > - I changed the plugs to a fine wire plug. > > - I changed the fuel servo out, which I really believed was going > to solve the problem. > > - I leaned out the idle mixture more, but in my mind this really > doesn't affect the mixture at 1700rpm, but just taking suggested measures. > > - I talked to a tech at Unison, LASAR, and he says he is confident > that it's not the LASAR box. I'm still not sure on this one. > > Anyway after all of this I still have the mag drop. I've talked at > length with Bart at Aerosport, really nice guy, and he's a little > stumped also. They are going to fuel flow another fuel servo for me > that will be leaned out by them at the factory. I'm really not > understanding this one. Why would I need a fuel servo that has had > special adjustments made to it versus any other IO540. I need to talk > to him again on this. I still keep thinking it's the way we've timed > it, but we've checked that a couple of times. ?? > > Anyway if any of you smart sharp shooters out there have any great > ideas for me I would appreciate your feed back. > > Wayne Edgerton N602WT > > In the paint shop and stuck with honey do lists :>} > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- > Text inserted by Panda Platinum 2005 Internet Security: > > This message has NOT been classified as spam. If it is unsolicited > mail (spam), click on the following link to reclassify it: It is spam! > <http://127.0.0.1:6083/Panda?ID=pav_50490&SPAM=true> > --------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: First time Epoxy
From: "Michael Wellenzohn" <rv-10(at)wellenzohn.net>
Date: Sep 07, 2007
Today I used for the first time epoxy, after I read through Tims website I bought West System and the pump kit. I used the 206 Hardener (slow) plus the thickener 406 Colloidal Silica and glued the gas strut attach doubler in the inner door shell. After at least 1 hour the epoxe still wasn't hard, it definately got harder but I was under the assumption that it will be hard as a brick after half an hour. Is that normal? Michael www.wellenzohn.net -------- RV-10 builder (wings) #511 Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=133258#133258 ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Sep 07, 2007
From: Deems Davis <deemsdavis(at)cox.net>
Subject: Re: First time Epoxy
Michael, depending upon the temperature/humidity of the environment its curing in, it may be entirely normal. Heat has a dramatic effect on the cure time for epoxy. I'm sure some chemist could elaborate, but while most epoxies will harden to the point where they can be worked with shaping tools (files and sandpaper) within hours (say 2-8 hours @ room temperature) they don't' develop their full strength usually for 24 hours. I have used Halogen shop lights directed directly at some parts to generate local heat to speed the curing times. (Be careful of generating too much heat and a fire potential). The 'Pot' life of epoxy is different than the cure time. Pot life usually refers to the time that you can effectively work with it in a cup until it begins to thicken to the point that it begins to get lumpy or is difficult to wet-out the glass cloth. Additionally, you will find that mixing large amounts of epoxy in a single container/cup will result in the mixture generating it's own heat as the catalytic reaction begins to take place, when this happens a cup/pot of epoxy can VERY quickly harden, to the point of burning your hand if holding it. With the west system pumps it's easy to mix a couple pumps worth in a cup at a time and then mix more if you need it. Deems Davis # 406 'Its all done....Its just not put together' http://deemsrv10.com/ Michael Wellenzohn wrote: > > Today I used for the first time epoxy, after I read through Tims website I bought West System and the pump kit. I used the 206 Hardener (slow) plus the thickener 406 Colloidal Silica and glued the gas strut attach doubler in the inner door shell. > > After at least 1 hour the epoxe still wasn't hard, it definately got harder but I was under the assumption that it will be hard as a brick after half an hour. > > Is that normal? > > Michael > > www.wellenzohn.net > > -------- > RV-10 builder (wings) > #511 > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=133258#133258 > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Rene Felker" <rene(at)felker.com>
Subject: First time Epoxy
Date: Sep 07, 2007
It depends on the temperature of the air. But I normally plan on waiting 24 hours unless the temperature is > 85F. Needs to be at least 70F. Rene' Felker N423CF 40322 801-721-6080 -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Michael Wellenzohn Sent: Friday, September 07, 2007 11:20 AM Subject: RV10-List: First time Epoxy Today I used for the first time epoxy, after I read through Tims website I bought West System and the pump kit. I used the 206 Hardener (slow) plus the thickener 406 Colloidal Silica and glued the gas strut attach doubler in the inner door shell. After at least 1 hour the epoxe still wasn't hard, it definately got harder but I was under the assumption that it will be hard as a brick after half an hour. Is that normal? Michael www.wellenzohn.net -------- RV-10 builder (wings) #511 Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=133258#133258 ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Sep 07, 2007
From: "Kelly McMullen" <apilot2(at)gmail.com>
Subject: Re: Looking for some advise
Re problem 2. You need to isolate the problem. The easiest way to do that is to switch the LASAR system off, so that you are operating on the mags only. Then make the same checks you have done before. It should be have normally, indicating the electronic ignition is the problem. If it does the same as with the electronics, it would seem you have a fuel problem. Lean the idle fuel adjustment to where you get no more than 25rpm rise on pulling mixture to idle cutoff. However, idle mixture makes no difference for your runup rpm and above. Question would be what EGT you see on takeoff, and at low altitude full throttle, full rich. It should be around 1250, plus or minus 50. Any colder is too rich. Hotter that is too lean. On 9/7/07, Wayne Edgerton wrote: > > I have couple of issues that maybe you ace mechanics/builders out there > can assist me with. > > Problem 1 > > It appears that I have a right wing that is a little bit heavy. On the > ground when I push the stick to the right it will spring back to the center/ > neutral position when I let go. However when I push the stick to the left, > again on the ground, and let go it doesn't return to the center position. > The trim spring is in the left wing so to me I guess that make sense, but is > this the same thing that all of you are experiencing? I'm thinking I may > need to lower my right flap just a little to bring the wing back up. Has > anyone had this problem? > > Problem 2 - A little more complex. > > I have an Aerosport Power new IO540 engine with LASAR Electronic Ignition. > On my first flight I lost one of my mags. We installed a new mag and retimed > the engine. I am having a 200 to 225 rpm drop on each mag on run-up check, > even for both sides. In flight at 23sq and leaned out, I did a mag test and > got little or no mag drop on either mag. Also if on the ground I lean out > the engine for 1700rpm run-up I will get a normal mag drop of 50 to 100. The > symptom appears to be too rich of a fuel servo on the ground. > > Anyway here's what we've done so far, some sound a little strange, but > people were giving me their suggestions and I have been giving their ideas a > go. > > - I changed the plugs to a fine wire plug. > > - I changed the fuel servo out, which I really believed was going to solve > the problem. > > - I leaned out the idle mixture more, but in my mind this really doesn't > affect the mixture at 1700rpm, but just taking suggested measures. > > - I talked to a tech at Unison, LASAR, and he says he is confident that > it's not the LASAR box. I'm still not sure on this one. > > Anyway after all of this I still have the mag drop. I've talked at length > with Bart at Aerosport, really nice guy, and he's a little stumped also. > They are going to fuel flow another fuel servo for me that will be leaned > out by them at the factory. I'm really not understanding this one. Why would > I need a fuel servo that has had special adjustments made to it versus any > other IO540. I need to talk to him again on this. I still keep thinking it's > the way we've timed it, but we've checked that a couple of times. ?? > > Anyway if any of you smart sharp shooters out there have any great ideas > for me I would appreciate your feed back. > > Wayne Edgerton N602WT > > In the paint shop and stuck with honey do lists :>} > > * > > > * > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "RV_10" <john_rv10(at)yahoo.com>
Subject: Lancair Panel
Date: Sep 08, 2007
Rob, The attached photo of an early Lancair panel with a quadrant is from Tony Sustare of Accuracy Avionics. John _____ From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of RobHickman(at)aol.com Sent: Wednesday, 5 September 2007 6:57 AM Subject: RV10-List: Lancair Panel Has anyone installed one of the Lancair panels with the Throttle quadrant? I am looking for pictures of one. Thanks, Rob Hickman N402RH RV-10 Finish Kit. _____ AOL.com. "http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List"http://www.matronics.com/Navig ator?RV10-List 5:54 PM 3:18 PM ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Sep 07, 2007
From: Scott Schmidt <scottmschmidt(at)yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: Another one begins #40761
That is one of the most fun days in my life.=0AHere is a blurring picture o f my wife and I putting our tails on the tail. =0A=0ANext thing you know, y our at Oshkosh! =0A=0AIt is a rare breed that has the confidence, motiviat ion, and vision to build your own airplane. =0AThat first step is the hard est part of the process (even though you are a second offender), but once y ou take it, the journey is amazing. =0A=0AHave fun building! I miss it. =0A =0AScott Schmidt=0Ascottmschmidt(at)yahoo.com=0A=0A=0A=0A----- Original Me ssage ----=0AFrom: n277dl <dljinia(at)yahoo.com>=0ATo: rv10-list(at)matronics.com =0ASent: Thursday, September 6, 2007 7:40:05 PM=0ASubject: RV10-List: Anoth inia(at)yahoo.com>=0A=0AWell guys & gals the building begins again for me. I built a 7A with first flight in 2004. Have about 550 hrs on it but now it' s time for a more roomy XC edition. =0A=0AThe tail kit arrived this aftern oon so I've spent the last couple hours getting the big pieces out and inve ntoried. Did slow build on the -7A but will probably go QB on the -10.=0A =0AI've met a few of you up at Boone as I'm located in Muscatine, IA. My s on lives in Boone so the plane ends up there frequently. =0A=0AInteresting (at least for me) bit of useless information... the night I filled out the order form for the 7A was the first time the four seat plane was discussed on Vans web site. I called the next morning before faxing the order for t he 7A in and asked about the four seater but was told it would be a couple years before it was in production. I couldn't wait that long to begin buil ding so we decided to build the two seater and if the four seater made it a nd lived up to expecations and if we could complete the two seater we'd do it again. =0A=0AIt did, we did so here we go again.=0A=0ADoug=0Awww.onclou d7.com/rv7.htm=0A10 builder #40761 =0A7A flyer 550hrs=0A=0A--------=0ADoug =0ARV7A flying ~500hrs=0A=0A=0A=0A=0ARead this topic online here:=0A=0Ahttp ://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=133186#133186=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A ======================== ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Lights, Engine, & FF Kit Q's
From: "orchidman" <gary(at)wingscc.com>
Date: Sep 07, 2007
I have a couple questions. Any thoughts or comments would be greatly appreciated. 1. For the stock VANs landing lights, the visible aluminum piece (W-1032) that the light is mounted to and the light shines through, what are people doing with it? Are you painting it with the airplane color paint, polishing it and then clear coating it to keep it bright, or ??? 2. I am starting to work with my local engine shop and one question that came up early in the conversation was experimental or certified? I asked him why he asked and he explained the differences in the engine that he was talking about and I can live with them. The pro is saving several thousand $ but he said that some people want certified for insurance reasons. My question is that when you went for insurance on your 10, did they ask about the engine whether it was certified or not and if so what were the differences in premiums and insurability? Was there a difference? 3. I will be ordering my firewall forward kit in the next month and am starting to collect thoughts about substitutions. The alternator is the Deluxe Plain Power 60 A. which I think is fine for my needs. I might sub the oil cooler. There has been some discussion here lately about a replacement cooler but when I have gone to the sites, the replacement model is not that obvious. For those suggesting a substitute, do you have any model numbers? If I do sub, I would like to get the correct one the first time. The other item up for consideration to be substituted are the hoses. Is there anything else that people might suggest modifying the FF Kit? -------- Gary Blankenbiller RV10 - # 40674 Fuselage SB (N410GB reserved) Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=133333#133333 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Jesse Saint" <jesse(at)saintaviation.com>
Subject: Lights, Engine, & FF Kit Q's
Date: Sep 07, 2007
I'll reply below. Jesse Saint Saint Aviation, Inc. jesse(at)saintaviation.com www.saintaviation.com Cell: 352-427-0285 Fax: 815-377-3694 -----Original Message----- From: orchidman [mailto:gary(at)wingscc.com] Sent: Friday, September 07, 2007 9:35 PM Subject: RV10-List: Lights, Engine, & FF Kit Q's I have a couple questions. Any thoughts or comments would be greatly appreciated. 1. For the stock VANs landing lights, the visible aluminum piece (W-1032) that the light is mounted to and the light shines through, what are people doing with it? Are you painting it with the airplane color paint, polishing it and then clear coating it to keep it bright, or ??? [Jesse Saint] We painted them to match the plane. 2. I am starting to work with my local engine shop and one question that came up early in the conversation was experimental or certified? I asked him why he asked and he explained the differences in the engine that he was talking about and I can live with them. The pro is saving several thousand $ but he said that some people want certified for insurance reasons. My question is that when you went for insurance on your 10, did they ask about the engine whether it was certified or not and if so what were the differences in premiums and insurability? Was there a difference? [Jesse Saint] A certified engine will save you 15 hours on the Phase 1 flight testing period, 25 instead of 40 hours, assuming that you keep everything certified including the prop. Beyond that, you are getting the exact same engine if you stick with the O-540 or IO-540. If you want to go with a used or overhauled engine, then you will most likely be certified, unless you make some changes that will make it experimental, like electronic ignition, experimental fuel injection system, etc. I have not heard of any insurance rate differences. In fact, I haven't even heard any reports of the insurance company asking, possibly not even on the alternative engines, but I am just going from personal experience here, not having talked to everybody about their experience. 3. I will be ordering my firewall forward kit in the next month and am starting to collect thoughts about substitutions. The alternator is the Deluxe Plain Power 60 A. which I think is fine for my needs. I might sub the oil cooler. There has been some discussion here lately about a replacement cooler but when I have gone to the sites, the replacement model is not that obvious. For those suggesting a substitute, do you have any model numbers? If I do sub, I would like to get the correct one the first time. The other item up for consideration to be substituted are the hoses. Is there anything else that people might suggest modifying the FF Kit? [Jesse Saint] Airflow systems has an oil cooler that Bill claims will lower your temps 8-10 degrees I believe. Depending on where you live and how hot it gets, you might also consider cowl louvers that Bill sells as well. I haven't talked to anybody unrelated who has done enough testing to truly compare, so this is just what I have heard as advertised. I know someone who is changing from the stock cooler to a high-volume one and I should have numbers from him within the next week or so. -------- Gary Blankenbiller RV10 - # 40674 Fuselage SB (N410GB reserved) Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=133333#133333 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Patrick ONeill" <poneill(at)irealms.com>
Subject: FAA reminder of the change to 406 MHz ELTs, in case you're
in the buying mood
Date: Sep 07, 2007
I was actually thinking about this the other day. What are builders installing right now? TSO-C91a (121.5mhz/243mhz) or TSO-C126 (406mhz)? As I understand it C91a still satisfies FAR 91.207 but will be of limited utility after Feb 1, 2007. I am curious as to what other builders are installing. I haven't purchased one yet but was planning on a C126 unit. They are all expensive and prices range widely. Does anyone have make/model recommendations for C126 devices? Best Regards, Patrick #40715 -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of John Jessen Sent: Friday, September 07, 2007 7:19 AM Subject: RV10-List: FAA reminder of the change to 406 MHz ELTs, in case you're in the buying mood Termination of 121.5 MHz Beacons for Satellite Alerting is Coming Soon Notice Number: NOTC0981 On 1 February 2009, the International Cospas-Sarsat [1] Organization (U.S. included) will terminate processing of distress signals emitted by 121.5 MHz Emergency Locator Transmitters (ELTs). This means that pilots flying aircraft equipped with 121.5 MHz ELTs after that date will have to depend on pilots of over flying aircraft and or ground stations monitoring 121.5 to hear and report distress alert signals, transmitted from a possible crash site. Why is this happening? Although lives have been saved by 121.5 MHz ELTs, the downside has been their propensity to generate false alerts (approximately 98 percent of all 121.5 MHz alerts are false), and their failure to provide rescue forces with timely and accurate crash location data. Both of which actually delay rescue efforts and have a direct effect on an individual's chance for survival. Rescue forces have to respond to all 121.5 MHz alerts to determine if they are real distress alerts or if they are being generated by an interferer, an inadvertent activation (by the owner) or equipment failure. Is there an alternative? Yes, the Cospas-Sarsat System (U.S. included) has been and will continue processing emergency signals transmitted by 406 MHz ELTs. These 5 Watt digital beacons transmit a much stronger signal, are more accurate, verifiable and traceable to the registered beacon owner (406 MHz ELTs must be registered by the owner in accordance with Federal Communications Commission (FCC) regulation). Registration allows the search and rescue authorities to contact the beacon owner, or his or her designated alternate by telephone to determine if a real emergency exists. Therefore, a simple telephone call often solves a 406 MHz alerts without launching costly and limited search and rescue resources, which would have to be done for a 121.5 MHz alert. For these reasons, the search and rescue community is encouraging aircraft owners to consider retrofit of 406 MHz ELTs or at a minimum, consider the purchase of a handheld 406 MHz Personal Locator Beacon (PLB) which can be carried in the cockpit while continuing to maintain a fixed 121.5 MHz ELT mounted in the aircraft's tail. Remember, after February 1, 2009, the world-wide Cospas-Sarsat satellite system will no longer process 121.5 MHz alert signals. Pilots involved in aircraft accidents in remote areas will have to depend on pilots of over flying aircraft and or ground stations to hear emergency ELT distress signals. For further information concerning the termination of 121.5 MHz data processing visit www.sarsat.noaa.gov _____ [1] The Cospas-Sarsat Organization provides a satellite based world-wide monitoring system that detects and locates distress signals transmitted by Emergency Locator Transmitters (ELTs), Emergency Position Indicating Radio Beacons (EPIRBs) and Personal Locator Beacons (PLBs). The system includes space and ground segments which process the signals received from the beacon source and forwards the distress alert data to the appropriate RescueCoordinationCenter for action. Address SARSAT inquiries to: NOAA SARSAT NSOF. E/SP3 4231 SuitlandRoad Suitland, MD 20746 Phone: 301.817.4515 Toll free: 888.212.7283 Fax: 301.817.4565 You have received this notice from FAASafety.gov because you have selected "General Information" in your preferences on your FAASafety.gov account. Click here to log in and edit your preferences on FAASafety.gov. Safety is a learned behavior...Learn to be safer at the Learning Center found on FAASafety.gov Right-click here to download pictures. To help protect your privacy, Outlook prevented automatic download of this picture from the Internet. <http://www.faasafety.gov/include/lookandfeel/images/email/spacer.gif> <http://www.faasafety.gov/> FAASafety.gov | <http://www.faasafety.gov/SPANS/preferences.aspx> Email Preferences | <http://www.faasafety.gov/SPANS/optout.aspx> Opt Out Do not reply to this email as it is an unmonitored alias. <http://www.faasafety.gov/about/contact.aspx> Contact us for comments or questions. ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Lights, Engine, & FF Kit Q's
Date: Sep 07, 2007
From: "Robin Marks" <robin1(at)mrmoisture.com>
Jessie, Will you report back to the list as soon as you have results on the oil cooler "upgrade"? Thanks, Robin Engine arrives in 3 weeks! ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: First time Epoxy
From: "Michael Wellenzohn" <rv-10(at)wellenzohn.net>
Date: Sep 08, 2007
Thank you guys for your answers. According to what you wrote I should be fine. Sorry to ask one one question for the door shell gluing. Do you apply the epoxy with a brush on the parabeam glass until its wet and then put it on the door shell? Michael www.wellenzohn.net -------- RV-10 builder (wings) #511 Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=133366#133366 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Patrick ONeill" <poneill(at)irealms.com>
Subject: First time Epoxy
Date: Sep 08, 2007
I haven't gotten to the glass parts of the construction yet, but I was wondering if most people are using the slow hardener? I haven't worked with fiberglass for a while, but I did do a lot of glass work on boats years ago. I remember the West slow hardener as taking forever to kick and always used the fast. Do some of the tasks require that long of a pot life or cure time? Best Regards, Patrick #40715 -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Michael Wellenzohn Sent: Friday, September 07, 2007 10:20 AM Subject: RV10-List: First time Epoxy --> Today I used for the first time epoxy, after I read through Tims website I bought West System and the pump kit. I used the 206 Hardener (slow) plus the thickener 406 Colloidal Silica and glued the gas strut attach doubler in the inner door shell. After at least 1 hour the epoxe still wasn't hard, it definately got harder but I was under the assumption that it will be hard as a brick after half an hour. Is that normal? Michael www.wellenzohn.net -------- RV-10 builder (wings) #511 Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=133258#133258 ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Sep 08, 2007
From: Larry Rosen <LarryRosen(at)comcast.net>
Subject: Re: First time Epoxy
Use the slow hardener when joining the door shells. You will want the extra time. I used one of those small metal handled brushes that plumbers use to wet out the parabeam glass, but any brush would work. Larry Patrick ONeill wrote: > > I haven't gotten to the glass parts of the construction yet, but I was > wondering if most people are using the slow hardener? I haven't worked with > fiberglass for a while, but I did do a lot of glass work on boats years ago. > I remember the West slow hardener as taking forever to kick and always used > the fast. Do some of the tasks require that long of a pot life or cure > time? > > Best Regards, > Patrick #40715 > > > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com > [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Michael > Wellenzohn > Sent: Friday, September 07, 2007 10:20 AM > To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com > Subject: RV10-List: First time Epoxy > > > --> > > Today I used for the first time epoxy, after I read through Tims website I > bought West System and the pump kit. I used the 206 Hardener (slow) plus the > thickener 406 Colloidal Silica and glued the gas strut attach doubler in the > inner door shell. > > After at least 1 hour the epoxe still wasn't hard, it definately got harder > but I was under the assumption that it will be hard as a brick after half an > hour. > > Is that normal? > > Michael > > www.wellenzohn.net > > -------- > RV-10 builder (wings) > #511 > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=133258#133258 > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "RV Builder (Michael Sausen)" <rvbuilder(at)sausen.net>
Date: Sep 08, 2007
Subject: FAA reminder of the change to 406 MHz ELTs, in case you're
in the buying mood Personally, I'm going with a 121.5 for now and then I will also be purchasi ng a 406 PLB like the Microfix. Of course this scenario requires someone t o be conscious to activate the PLB From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@m atronics.com] On Behalf Of Patrick ONeill Sent: Friday, September 07, 2007 9:42 PM Subject: RE: RV10-List: FAA reminder of the change to 406 MHz ELTs, in case you're in the buying mood I was actually thinking about this the other day. What are builders instal ling right now? TSO-C91a (121.5mhz/243mhz) or TSO-C126 (406mhz)? As I understand it C91a still satisfies FAR 91.207 but will be of limited u tility after Feb 1, 2007. I am curious as to what other builders are instal ling. I haven't purchased one yet but was planning on a C126 unit. They are all expensive and prices range widely. Does anyone have make/model recommendat ions for C126 devices? Best Regards, Patrick #40715 -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@m atronics.com] On Behalf Of John Jessen Sent: Friday, September 07, 2007 7:19 AM Subject: RV10-List: FAA reminder of the change to 406 MHz ELTs, in case you 're in the buying mood Termination of 121.5 MHz Beacons for Satellite Alerting is Coming Soon Notice Number: NOTC0981 On 1 February 2009, the International Cospas-Sarsat [1][1] Organization (U. S. included) will terminate processing of distress signals emitted by 121.5 MHz Emergency Locator Transmitters (ELTs). This means that pilots flying a ircraft equipped with 121.5 MHz ELTs after that date will have to depend on pilots of over flying aircraft and or ground stations monitoring 121.5 to hear and report distress alert signals, transmitted from a possible crash s ite. Why is this happening? Although lives have been saved by 121.5 MHz ELTs, the downside has been the ir propensity to generate false alerts (approximately 98 percent of all 121 .5 MHz alerts are false), and their failure to provide rescue forces with t imely and accurate crash location data. Both of which actually delay rescue efforts and have a direct effect on an individual's chance for survival. R escue forces have to respond to all 121.5 MHz alerts to determine if they a re real distress alerts or if they are being generated by an interferer, an inadvertent activation (by the owner) or equipment failure. Is there an alternative? Yes, the Cospas-Sarsat System (U.S. included) has been and will continue pr ocessing emergency signals transmitted by 406 MHz ELTs. These 5 Watt digita l beacons transmit a much stronger signal, are more accurate, verifiable an d traceable to the registered beacon owner (406 MHz ELTs must be registered by the owner in accordance with Federal Communications Commission (FCC) re gulation). Registration allows the search and rescue authorities to contact the beacon owner, or his or her designated alternate by telephone to deter mine if a real emergency exists. Therefore, a simple telephone call often s olves a 406 MHz alerts without launching costly and limited search and resc ue resources, which would have to be done for a 121.5 MHz alert. For these reasons, the search and rescue community is encouraging aircraft owners to consider retrofit of 406 MHz ELTs or at a minimum, consider the purchase of a handheld 406 MHz Personal Locator Beacon (PLB) which can be carried in t he cockpit while continuing to maintain a fixed 121.5 MHz ELT mounted in th e aircraft's tail. Remember, after February 1, 2009, the world-wide Cospas-Sarsat satellite sy stem will no longer process 121.5 MHz alert signals. Pilots involved in air craft accidents in remote areas will have to depend on pilots of over flyin g aircraft and or ground stations to hear emergency ELT distress signals. F or further information concerning the termination of 121.5 MHz data process ing visit www.sarsat.noaa.gov ________________________________ Address SARSAT inquiries to: NOAA SARSAT NSOF. E/SP3 4231 SuitlandRoad Suitland, MD 20746 Phone: 301.817.4515 Toll free: 888.212.7283 Fax: 301.817.4565 You have received this notice from FAASafety.gov because you have selected "General Information" in your preferences on your FAASafety.gov account. Cl ick here to log in and edit your preferences on FAASafety.gov. Safety is a learned behavior...Learn to be safer at the Learning Center fou nd on FAASafety.gov FAASafety.gov<http://www.faasafety.gov/> | Email Preferences | Opt Out<http://www.faasafety.gov/SPANS /optout.aspx> Do not reply to this email as it is an unmonitored alias. Contact us for comments or questions. ________________________________ [1][1] The Cospas-Sarsat Organization provides a satellite based world-wide monitoring system that detects and locates distress signals transmitted by Emergency Locator Transmitters (ELTs), Emergency Position Indicating Radio Beacons (EPIRBs) and Personal Locator Beacons (PLBs). The system includes space and ground segments which process the signals received from the beaco n source and forwards the distress alert data to the appropriate RescueCoor dinationCenter for action. ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Rene" <rene(at)felker.com>
Subject: First time Epoxy
Date: Sep 08, 2007
I used the slow for the joining the doors and have used fast everywhere else. When it is real hot out side, >90F, I just make smaller batches and work faster. :) Rene' 801-721-6080 -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Patrick ONeill Sent: Saturday, September 08, 2007 3:41 AM Subject: RE: RV10-List: First time Epoxy I haven't gotten to the glass parts of the construction yet, but I was wondering if most people are using the slow hardener? I haven't worked with fiberglass for a while, but I did do a lot of glass work on boats years ago. I remember the West slow hardener as taking forever to kick and always used the fast. Do some of the tasks require that long of a pot life or cure time? Best Regards, Patrick #40715 -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Michael Wellenzohn Sent: Friday, September 07, 2007 10:20 AM Subject: RV10-List: First time Epoxy --> Today I used for the first time epoxy, after I read through Tims website I bought West System and the pump kit. I used the 206 Hardener (slow) plus the thickener 406 Colloidal Silica and glued the gas strut attach doubler in the inner door shell. After at least 1 hour the epoxe still wasn't hard, it definately got harder but I was under the assumption that it will be hard as a brick after half an hour. Is that normal? Michael www.wellenzohn.net -------- RV-10 builder (wings) #511 Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=133258#133258 ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Lights, Engine, & FF Kit Q's
Date: Sep 08, 2007
From: "Lloyd, Daniel R." <LloydDR(at)wernerco.com>
My answers: #1 I polished the plate and then clear coated it #2 Since I have an Eggenfellner Subaru I can tell you Falcon insurance does not differentiate between engines, Lycoming certified or not, or Eggenfellner. They were charging the same rate regardless. Dan N289DT RV10E -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of orchidman Sent: Friday, September 07, 2007 9:35 PM Subject: RV10-List: Lights, Engine, & FF Kit Q's I have a couple questions. Any thoughts or comments would be greatly appreciated. 1. For the stock VANs landing lights, the visible aluminum piece (W-1032) that the light is mounted to and the light shines through, what are people doing with it? Are you painting it with the airplane color paint, polishing it and then clear coating it to keep it bright, or ??? 2. I am starting to work with my local engine shop and one question that came up early in the conversation was experimental or certified? I asked him why he asked and he explained the differences in the engine that he was talking about and I can live with them. The pro is saving several thousand $ but he said that some people want certified for insurance reasons. My question is that when you went for insurance on your 10, did they ask about the engine whether it was certified or not and if so what were the differences in premiums and insurability? Was there a difference? 3. I will be ordering my firewall forward kit in the next month and am starting to collect thoughts about substitutions. The alternator is the Deluxe Plain Power 60 A. which I think is fine for my needs. I might sub the oil cooler. There has been some discussion here lately about a replacement cooler but when I have gone to the sites, the replacement model is not that obvious. For those suggesting a substitute, do you have any model numbers? If I do sub, I would like to get the correct one the first time. The other item up for consideration to be substituted are the hoses. Is there anything else that people might suggest modifying the FF Kit? -------- Gary Blankenbiller RV10 - # 40674 Fuselage SB (N410GB reserved) Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=133333#133333 ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Rivethead Aero, are you out there?
From: "Michael Wellenzohn" <rv-10(at)wellenzohn.net>
Date: Sep 08, 2007
In case you have the door guide and pin set could you probably give me close up photos and measurements? I didn't get any order confirmation or reply or any communication at all. I will produce them myself and if they come out good I might produce more for people interested. I cannot understand how people can be so ignorant about customer. I mean I am just expecting an email. I don't even recall how many weeks ago I ordered these parts, and I don't even have a clue if they ever received it. Emails or phone calls are not answered. Michael www.wellenzohn.net -------- RV-10 builder (wings) #511 Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=133415#133415 ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Sep 08, 2007
From: Matt Dralle <dralle(at)matronics.com>
Subject: New Realtime Spell Checker Added To Matronics Forums!
Dear Listers, Today 9/8/2007 I have added a new real-time spell checker function to all of the BBS Forums at Matronics. When you reply or create a new message on the Forums, you will notice that misspelled words will be high-lighted in yellow. If you left-click on the word, you will be prompted with a drop-down list of suggested spellings. http://forums.matronics.com Enjoy! Matt Dralle Matornics Email List and Forum Administrator ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Chris and Susie McGough" <VHMUM(at)bigpond.com>
Subject: Re: Rivethead Aero, are you out there?
Date: Sep 09, 2007
Yep we are still waiting to. Hope we have not blown $100 AUS Chris Melb AUS ----- Original Message ----- From: "Michael Wellenzohn" <rv-10(at)wellenzohn.net> Sent: Sunday, September 09, 2007 3:06 AM Subject: RV10-List: Re: Rivethead Aero, are you out there? > > > In case you have the door guide and pin set could you probably give me > close up photos and measurements? > I didn't get any order confirmation or reply or any communication at all. > I will produce them myself and if they come out good I might produce more > for people interested. > I cannot understand how people can be so ignorant about customer. I mean I > am just expecting an email. I don't even recall how many weeks ago I > ordered these parts, and I don't even have a clue if they ever received > it. Emails or phone calls are not answered. > > Michael > > www.wellenzohn.net > > -------- > RV-10 builder (wings) > #511 > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=133415#133415 > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Sep 08, 2007
From: Larry Rosen <LarryRosen(at)comcast.net>
Subject: Re: Rivethead Aero, are you out there?
I placed an order with them. Didn't hear boo, but after 3 weeks a package showed up at my door. The quality of the products are outstanding. Be patient, they will show up and you will be pleased. The product fill a void and I am grateful that Rivethead is helping out. If you still want dimensions let me know, but I doubt the effort to build them yourself would be worth it. Larry Michael Wellenzohn wrote: > > In case you have the door guide and pin set could you probably give me close up photos and measurements? > I didn't get any order confirmation or reply or any communication at all. I will produce them myself and if they come out good I might produce more for people interested. > I cannot understand how people can be so ignorant about customer. I mean I am just expecting an email. I don't even recall how many weeks ago I ordered these parts, and I don't even have a clue if they ever received it. Emails or phone calls are not answered. > > Michael > > www.wellenzohn.net > > -------- > RV-10 builder (wings) > #511 > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=133415#133415 > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Chris and Susie McGough" <VHMUM(at)bigpond.com>
Subject: Re: Rivethead Aero, are you out there?
Date: Sep 09, 2007
Maybe we could go through PAYPAL and try and get our money back. Its a hard one as people say he will deliver but how long is one meant to wait with no comunication from supplier. Is 2 months to long? Its a bit hard to knock on his door from the other side of the world. regards Chris ----- Original Message ----- From: "Michael Wellenzohn" <rv-10(at)wellenzohn.net> Sent: Sunday, September 09, 2007 3:06 AM Subject: RV10-List: Re: Rivethead Aero, are you out there? > > > In case you have the door guide and pin set could you probably give me > close up photos and measurements? > I didn't get any order confirmation or reply or any communication at all. > I will produce them myself and if they come out good I might produce more > for people interested. > I cannot understand how people can be so ignorant about customer. I mean I > am just expecting an email. I don't even recall how many weeks ago I > ordered these parts, and I don't even have a clue if they ever received > it. Emails or phone calls are not answered. > > Michael > > www.wellenzohn.net > > -------- > RV-10 builder (wings) > #511 > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=133415#133415 > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Lights, Engine, & FF Kit Q's
From: "orchidman" <gary(at)wingscc.com>
Date: Sep 08, 2007
[quote="LloydDR(at)wernerco.com"]My answers: #1 I polished the plate and then clear coated it #2 Since I have an Eggenfellner Subaru I can tell you Falcon insurance does not differentiate between engines, Lycoming certified or not, or Eggenfellner. They were charging the same rate regardless. Dan N289DT RV10E --[/quote Good news, thanks. Since even Van's sells both, I was a little concerned but wanted to ask. -------- Gary Blankenbiller RV10 - # 40674 Fuselage SB (N410GB reserved) Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=133513#133513 ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Rivethead Aero, are you out there?
Date: Sep 08, 2007
From: "Robin Marks" <robin1(at)mrmoisture.com>
I had a similar situation where I ordered the product and paid via PP but I paid to the email address on his product website (I think rvsilverbullet(at)comcast.net) unfortunately he did not have a PP account under that address and thus was never notified of the purchase. The refund from PP was easy (for a change) and I did finally get him on the phone and my parts shipped immediately but the total time was ~6 weeks from first order to receipt. As a long time e-merchant of many different items from many different sites I can appreciate the challenges of a mom & pop situation however if you don't take care of you don't take care of your customer they won't take care of you. Even more so with a small community like the -10 folks. I personally own all the software & Haas CNC mills to make any of these products but no inclination for mass production. Robin Engine arrives in 3 weeks ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Chris and Susie McGough" <VHMUM(at)bigpond.com>
Subject: Re: Rivethead Aero, are you out there?
Date: Sep 09, 2007
Lucky you try 2 months and still waiting!!! ----- Original Message ----- From: "Larry Rosen" <LarryRosen(at)comcast.net> Sent: Sunday, September 09, 2007 7:31 AM Subject: Re: RV10-List: Re: Rivethead Aero, are you out there? > > I placed an order with them. Didn't hear boo, but after 3 weeks a package > showed up at my door. The quality of the products are outstanding. Be > patient, they will show up and you will be pleased. The product fill a > void and I am grateful that Rivethead is helping out. > > If you still want dimensions let me know, but I doubt the effort to build > them yourself would be worth it. > > Larry > > Michael Wellenzohn wrote: >> >> >> In case you have the door guide and pin set could you probably give me >> close up photos and measurements? I didn't get any order confirmation or >> reply or any communication at all. I will produce them myself and if they >> come out good I might produce more for people interested. >> I cannot understand how people can be so ignorant about customer. I mean >> I am just expecting an email. I don't even recall how many weeks ago I >> ordered these parts, and I don't even have a clue if they ever received >> it. Emails or phone calls are not answered. >> >> Michael >> >> www.wellenzohn.net >> >> -------- >> RV-10 builder (wings) >> #511 >> >> >> >> >> Read this topic online here: >> >> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=133415#133415 >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Chris and Susie McGough" <VHMUM(at)bigpond.com>
Subject: Re: Rivethead Aero, are you out there?
Date: Sep 09, 2007
Does anyone have a direct contact with this mob that could have a chat to see what is going on as it has been 2 months I am happy to send the reciept from Paypal. They dont answer there phone or emails. If not I will take it the money is lost and I will just put up with Vans Parts regards Chris Melb Aus ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: New Realtime Spell Checker Added To Matronics Forums!
Date: Sep 08, 2007
From: "John W. Cox" <johnwcox(at)pacificnw.com>
Matornics Email list spelled in the same article as spell checking... Cute Matt. -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Matt Dralle Sent: Saturday, September 08, 2007 1:47 PM Subject: RV10-List: New Realtime Spell Checker Added To Matronics Forums! Dear Listers, Today 9/8/2007 I have added a new real-time spell checker function to all of the BBS Forums at Matronics. When you reply or create a new message on the Forums, you will notice that misspelled words will be high-lighted in yellow. If you left-click on the word, you will be prompted with a drop-down list of suggested spellings. http://forums.matronics.com Enjoy! Matt Dralle Matornics Email List and Forum Administrator ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Bob Leffler" <rvmail(at)thelefflers.com>
Subject: Alodine Question
Date: Sep 09, 2007
I've been using Dorado Kote 1 for some time now with good results. All the parts that I put into the dip tank this afternoon came out looking great. In the past, I've used a foam brush to coat the solution on the inside of the skins and other parts too large to fit into the tank. I not had any problems doing this before. However, today on several of the skins, I had some blue-green splotches appear instead of the normal bronze color. Any idea what may have caused this? Should this cause a concern? Should I attempt to remove this or is it ok to prime with AKZO? I've also sent an email off to Eldorado already, so hopefully I'll hear back from them tomorrow. ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "gary" <speckter(at)comcast.net>
Subject: RE: Oshkosh followup
Date: Sep 09, 2007
It is my understanding that Bill Watson received an award for his performance at OSH. Bill, Fill in the group please. Gary 40274 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "gary" <speckter(at)comcast.net>
Subject: RE: Oshkosh followup
Date: Sep 09, 2007
It is my understanding that Bill Watson received an award for his performance at OSH. Bill, Fill in the group please. Gary 40274 ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: ELTs
Date: Sep 09, 2007
From: <tdawson-townsend(at)aurora.aero>
Linn, make sure you aren't criticizing systems based on acronyms alone. You seem to have a low opinion of ELTs, but 406 MHz ELTs are a different animal. That's why they have a completely separate TSO. They are higher power than 121.5 ELTs, send coded signals, and reduce the "footprint" that CAP needs to search for you by more than an order of magnitude. If you have to buy a brand-new ELT for a brand-new airplane, why wouldn't you go for the superior system? Linn wrote: "I'm not sure if there were many (if any) 'saves' through an ELT/satellite link, but the general consensus (from what I'm hearing) is that an ELT by itself just doesn't save lives." Here's some data from the NOAA site. For these numbers, they only count rescues where the SARSAT system was actually involved, not just somebody yelling over the radio. August 31, 2007 Number of Persons Rescued (To Date) in the United States: 262 - Rescues at sea: 191 people rescued in 53 incidents - Aviation rescues: 23 people rescued in 15 incidents - PLB rescues: 48 people rescued in 22 incidents =B7 Worldwide ' Over 22,058 People Rescued (since 1982) =B7 United States ' 5,658 People Rescued (since 1982) Numbers from 2006 272 people rescued in 105 incidents in the United States - Rescues at sea: 220 people rescued in 71 incidents - Aviation rescues: 15 people rescued in 12 incidents - PLB rescues: 37 people rescued in 22 incidents Linn wrote: "The EPIRBs that boaters have been using for decades work a whole lot better" You hit the nail on the head there, because the boaters have been using 406 MHz for several years now. Any boating EPIRB built in the last probably 8 years was 406 MHz. So yes, please do at least get a handheld EPIRB. But that is going to be $500 anyway, so why not get a real 406 MHz ELT? I have seen the Artex unit for less than $900 . . . Just remember the Learjet that crashed a few years back out of Lebanon, NH. It went down less than 20 or 30 miles from the airport, but it took them 2 or 3 years to find it in the woods. Without a 406 MHz ELT after next year, you end up in pretty much the same boat. TDT ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: ELTs, again
Date: Sep 09, 2007
From: <tdawson-townsend(at)aurora.aero>
That SARSAT web site actually has a lot of good information regarding the changeover to 406 MHz and the rationale. Note that it was an international decision, with NOAA as the US representative. http://www.sarsat.noaa.gov/ ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Sep 09, 2007
From: MauleDriver <MauleDriver(at)nc.rr.com>
Subject: Re: RE: Oshkosh followup
Since I didn't have an aircraft to judge, apparently my beverage habits were being tracked. It was noticed that while enjoying various premium brews, I was never prepared with the tool necessary to open those perversely sealed bottles. So, framed in my shop is the award for "RV10 Builder Least Likely to have a Bottle Opener" along with a silver plated opener.... or perhaps that was just tinned. Ms Mauledriver observed that I never seem to bring all the tools needed for the dance - whether that dance is in the shop, on the road, or at home. Maybe that's why she wasn't at OSH! Anyway, Thanks to Gary for noticing my dilemma and providing that much needed builder assist! And to all the RV10 builders for the beer, ice, and camraderie. I even got to see a few RV10s! We'll be back! Bill "wrestling with the electrical system" Watson gary wrote: > > It is my understanding that Bill Watson received an award for his > performance at OSH. Bill, Fill in the group please. > > > > Gary > > 40274 > > * > > > * ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Sep 09, 2007
From: "Fred Williams, M.D." <drfred(at)suddenlinkmail.com>
Subject: Re: Alodine Question
Bob; I have used the same solution as you have and have also had occasional staining of areas. I think it is the chromate. It seems to form more in the older solutions. I keep the mixed dorado kote in a clean plastic bucket. As it gets older a green ring will start to form around the top of the bucket. Concurrently, the solution takes longer to react with the surface. I can usually rinse most of it off. I have used Sherwin Williams primer over the top of those stains and have not seen any flaking or change in the coat. I would be interested in hearing their reply. Fred Williams 40515 Bob Leffler wrote: > > Ive been using Dorado Kote 1 for some time now with good results. All > the parts that I put into the dip tank this afternoon came out looking > great. In the past, Ive used a foam brush to coat the solution on the > inside of the skins and other parts too large to fit into the tank. I > not had any problems doing this before. However, today on several of > the skins, I had some blue-green splotches appear instead of the > normal bronze color. > > Any idea what may have caused this? Should this cause a concern? > Should I attempt to remove this or is it ok to prime with AKZO? > > Ive also sent an email off to Eldorado already, so hopefully Ill > hear back from them tomorrow. > > * > > > * > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Bob Leffler" <rvmail(at)thelefflers.com>
Subject: Alodine Question
Date: Sep 09, 2007
I used about 5 gallons in my dip tank, which is the shipping crate that the spars for the empennage came in. The first time I used it was back in March, then in May, and finally today. I've added about a gallon of new each time. I haven't seen rings in the plastic containers I store the alodine in and I keep it in a dark corner of the basement. I didn't get any discoloration in the pieces that were fully dipped, just the larger pieces that were painted with a foam brush. I'll pass along Eldorado's comments when/if I get them. Bob -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Fred Williams, M.D. Sent: Sunday, September 09, 2007 7:15 PM Subject: Re: RV10-List: Alodine Question Bob; I have used the same solution as you have and have also had occasional staining of areas. I think it is the chromate. It seems to form more in the older solutions. I keep the mixed dorado kote in a clean plastic bucket. As it gets older a green ring will start to form around the top of the bucket. Concurrently, the solution takes longer to react with the surface. I can usually rinse most of it off. I have used Sherwin Williams primer over the top of those stains and have not seen any flaking or change in the coat. I would be interested in hearing their reply. Fred Williams 40515 Bob Leffler wrote: > > I've been using Dorado Kote 1 for some time now with good results. All > the parts that I put into the dip tank this afternoon came out looking > great. In the past, I've used a foam brush to coat the solution on the > inside of the skins and other parts too large to fit into the tank. I > not had any problems doing this before. However, today on several of > the skins, I had some blue-green splotches appear instead of the > normal bronze color. > > Any idea what may have caused this? Should this cause a concern? > Should I attempt to remove this or is it ok to prime with AKZO? > > I've also sent an email off to Eldorado already, so hopefully I'll > hear back from them tomorrow. > > * > > > * > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > __________ NOD32 2516 (20070909) Information __________ ________________________________________________________________________________
From: DLIUDVINAITIS(at)aol.com
Date: Sep 09, 2007
Subject: Re: Alodine Question
BOB I ALSO SEEN THIS BLUE STAINING WHEN USING ALODINE, IT DID TAKE LONGER TO REACT TO ALUMINUM. MUST BE CONTAMINATED WITH METAL PREP CLEANING SOLUTION. I DUMPED OLD SOLUTION WENT WITH NEW, NO PROBLEMS NOW, I AM APPLYING IT FULL STRENGHT WITH A SPONGE. IT REACTS IN 3 MINS TURNING LIGHT GOLD IN COLOR, NO NEED TO BE ANY DARKER JUST GOLD. DAVE LUDD #40466 FUSELAGE ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Second Airplane?
Date: Sep 10, 2007
From: "Robin Marks" <robin1(at)mrmoisture.com>
Noel, Very funny. My thinking was probably a 7A. I believe you described my situation pretty well except we look for whales more than cows on the left coast. I also have a regular 55 minute commute that would work well for either plane. I am dying to order an 8A because I would probably like the a war bird paint scheme but the side by side is more practical and I suspect more comfortable, especially when giving tours. The matching panels is a good idea in theory but I hope the 7A will cost just a touch more than my -10 panel. I think the small plane that I NEED will be an all glass VFR bird vs. a hard IFR traveler. Robin From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Noel Simmons Sent: Sunday, September 09, 2007 2:40 PM Subject: RE: RV10-List: Second Airplane? Robin, I get a chance to fly several different RV's thought the year. The RV-10 I built was great for XC, lousy for "checking the Cows". The RV-7 I just watched fly over the horizon to its new home was great for Checking cows and could easily do some shorter XC like 1.5 hours. The -7 was easier and faster to get out of the shop and in the air than the -10. So what I am saying is you NEED both! Don't need cows there are plenty other people have those scattered around. If you are going to go somewhere get in the -10 if you are just going to be with one other person eating pancakes within 30 minutes of the house get in the -7. Interestingly enough you might think about having the same panel design for both aircraft. That way you will not get lost bouncing between the two. Daily time I have spent in each model and comments RV-6A = 7hours really ready to get out RV-7 = 6hours just right, did sleep good that night RV-8A = 9hours should have gotten out 4 hours earlier RV-9A= 13.7hours should have gotten out 9 hours earlier RV-10 = 10.5hours was ready for diner and could have flown a few more hours. Now when Van's get the motor glider up you will NEED one of those too. Noel Simmons A&P CFI Builder of fine aircraft www.blueskyaviation.net <http://www.blueskyaviation.net/> ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Bob Leffler" <rvmail(at)thelefflers.com>
Subject: Alodine Question
Date: Sep 10, 2007
I suspect some sort of contamination, but not with the alodine solution. During the same session, I treated fifty plus components with no issues what so ever. It was only on the four elevator skins, which couldn't fit into the dip tank. My thoughts that the contamination may have come from the foam brush, but it came from the same package of brushes that I used before without incident. Hopefully, I can identify the true cause of this so it can be prevented in the future. Also, these blue-green splotches cleared up after completing drying. They now appear as if those areas were never treated. From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of DLIUDVINAITIS(at)aol.com Sent: Sunday, September 09, 2007 11:16 PM Subject: Re: RV10-List: Alodine Question BOB I ALSO SEEN THIS BLUE STAINING WHEN USING ALODINE, IT DID TAKE LONGER TO REACT TO ALUMINUM. MUST BE CONTAMINATED WITH METAL PREP CLEANING SOLUTION. I DUMPED OLD SOLUTION WENT WITH NEW, NO PROBLEMS NOW, I AM APPLYING IT FULL STRENGHT WITH A SPONGE. IT REACTS IN 3 MINS TURNING LIGHT GOLD IN COLOR, NO NEED TO BE ANY DARKER JUST GOLD. DAVE LUDD #40466 FUSELAGE _____ See what's n="_blank">Make AOL Your Homepage. __________ NOD32 2518 (20070910) Information __________ ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "RV Builder (Michael Sausen)" <rvbuilder(at)sausen.net>
Date: Sep 10, 2007
Subject: Alodine Question
Bob, I used mine for almost 2 years without ever mixing in new and I occasionally saw what you are talking about. After about 6 months or so the Alodine mix didn't seem to be working as well and started to show some of what you are seeing. Turns out the stuff just needed to be mixed up and kept agitated. Because I always kept mine in a 30 gal trash can I just threw in a fairly large aquarium power head with a long hose attached to it. I left it on 24/7 and when I need to fill a dip tank it also doubled as a way to pump it in to the tank via the hose. Worked fine from then on. Michael -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Bob Leffler Sent: Sunday, September 09, 2007 7:07 PM Subject: RE: RV10-List: Alodine Question I used about 5 gallons in my dip tank, which is the shipping crate that the spars for the empennage came in. The first time I used it was back in March, then in May, and finally today. I've added about a gallon of new each time. I haven't seen rings in the plastic containers I store the alodine in and I keep it in a dark corner of the basement. I didn't get any discoloration in the pieces that were fully dipped, just the larger pieces that were painted with a foam brush. I'll pass along Eldorado's comments when/if I get them. Bob -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Fred Williams, M.D. Sent: Sunday, September 09, 2007 7:15 PM Subject: Re: RV10-List: Alodine Question Bob; I have used the same solution as you have and have also had occasional staining of areas. I think it is the chromate. It seems to form more in the older solutions. I keep the mixed dorado kote in a clean plastic bucket. As it gets older a green ring will start to form around the top of the bucket. Concurrently, the solution takes longer to react with the surface. I can usually rinse most of it off. I have used Sherwin Williams primer over the top of those stains and have not seen any flaking or change in the coat. I would be interested in hearing their reply. Fred Williams 40515 Bob Leffler wrote: > > I've been using Dorado Kote 1 for some time now with good results. All > the parts that I put into the dip tank this afternoon came out looking > great. In the past, I've used a foam brush to coat the solution on the > inside of the skins and other parts too large to fit into the tank. I > not had any problems doing this before. However, today on several of > the skins, I had some blue-green splotches appear instead of the > normal bronze color. > > Any idea what may have caused this? Should this cause a concern? > Should I attempt to remove this or is it ok to prime with AKZO? > > I've also sent an email off to Eldorado already, so hopefully I'll > hear back from them tomorrow. > > * > > > * > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > __________ NOD32 2516 (20070909) Information __________ ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "RV Builder (Michael Sausen)" <rvbuilder(at)sausen.net>
Date: Sep 10, 2007
Subject: Alodine Question
Hmm, now that does sound different than what I have seen. Try cleaning those areas with some soapy water and run through the process again to see if that makes some difference. From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@m atronics.com] On Behalf Of Bob Leffler Sent: Monday, September 10, 2007 5:39 AM Subject: RE: RV10-List: Alodine Question I suspect some sort of contamination, but not with the alodine solution. D uring the same session, I treated fifty plus components with no issues what so ever. It was only on the four elevator skins, which couldn't fit into the dip tank. My thoughts that the contamination may have come from the fo am brush, but it came from the same package of brushes that I used before w ithout incident. Hopefully, I can identify the true cause of this so it can be prevented in the future. Also, these blue-green splotches cleared up after completing d rying. They now appear as if those areas were never treated. From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server@m atronics.com] On Behalf Of DLIUDVINAITIS(at)aol.com Sent: Sunday, September 09, 2007 11:16 PM Subject: Re: RV10-List: Alodine Question BOB I ALSO SEEN THIS BLUE STAINING WHEN USING ALODINE, IT DID TAKE LONGER TO RE ACT TO ALUMINUM. MUST BE CONTAMINATED WITH METAL PREP CLEANING SOLUTION. I DUMPED OLD SOLUTION WENT WITH NEW, NO PROBLEMS NOW, I AM APPLYING IT FULL S TRENGHT WITH A SPONGE. IT REACTS IN 3 MINS TURNING LIGHT GOLD IN COLOR, NO NEED TO BE ANY DARKER JUST GOLD. DAVE LUDD #40466 FUSELAGE ________________________________ See what's n="_blank">Make AOL Your Homepage. http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List http://forums.matronics.com __________ NOD32 2518 (20070910) Information __________ ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "David McNeill" <dlm46007(at)cox.net>
Subject: Second Airplane?
Date: Sep 10, 2007
My Glastar panel is GRT Sport EFIS with backup partial panel and a TT Pictorial Pilot with a SL30 and G320. I am currently using XM weather in the Glastar. My 10 (not yet flying) has dual Cheltons as primary and a GRT Sport for backup and weather and a TT digitrak. I have found that after using the glass for a while a person's brain just rewires for the functions needed. If I keep the Glastar, it will be for low and slow and training my children. _____ From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Robin Marks Sent: Sunday, September 09, 2007 10:42 PM Subject: RE: RV10-List: Second Airplane? Noel, Very funny. My thinking was probably a 7A. I believe you described my situation pretty well except we look for whales more than cows on the left coast. I also have a regular 55 minute commute that would work well for either plane. I am dying to order an 8A because I would probably like the a war bird paint scheme but the side by side is more practical and I suspect more comfortable, especially when giving tours. The matching panels is a good idea in theory but I hope the 7A will cost just a touch more than my -10 panel. I think the small plane that I NEED will be an all glass VFR bird vs. a hard IFR traveler. Robin From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Noel Simmons Sent: Sunday, September 09, 2007 2:40 PM Subject: RE: RV10-List: Second Airplane? Robin, I get a chance to fly several different RV's thought the year. The RV-10 I built was great for XC, lousy for "checking the Cows". The RV-7 I just watched fly over the horizon to its new home was great for Checking cows and could easily do some shorter XC like 1.5 hours. The -7 was easier and faster to get out of the shop and in the air than the -10. So what I am saying is you NEED both! Don't need cows there are plenty other people have those scattered around. If you are going to go somewhere get in the -10 if you are just going to be with one other person eating pancakes within 30 minutes of the house get in the -7. Interestingly enough you might think about having the same panel design for both aircraft. That way you will not get lost bouncing between the two. Daily time I have spent in each model and comments RV-6A = 7hours really ready to get out RV-7 = 6hours just right, did sleep good that night RV-8A = 9hours should have gotten out 4 hours earlier RV-9A= 13.7hours should have gotten out 9 hours earlier RV-10 = 10.5hours was ready for diner and could have flown a few more hours. Now when Van's get the motor glider up you will NEED one of those too. Noel Simmons A&P CFI Builder of fine aircraft www.blueskyaviation.net <http://www.blueskyaviation.net/> ________________________________________________________________________________
From: <rvmail(at)thelefflers.com>
Subject: Re: Alodine Question
Date: Sep 10, 2007
Michael, This may be a contributing factor. I store my alodine in gallon jugs and pour it into the plastic lined shipping crate when I use it. The only agitation that it would have received would have been from being dumped from one container to another. Probably not very good. The other alternative is tht I did mix a new gallon that was added just a few minutes beforehand. Perhaps I didn't get it throughly mixed up. I guess that's the downside of going with the powder version and mixing it yourself. I'm going to have to look for another type of container if I want to continue to dip parts. Other than the longerons, I don't think may parts in the tail cone will fit. Thanks for your comments..... bob > > From: "RV Builder (Michael Sausen)" <rvbuilder(at)sausen.net> > Date: 2007/09/10 Mon AM 06:11:25 EST > To: "rv10-list(at)matronics.com" > Subject: RE: RV10-List: Alodine Question > > > Bob, > > I used mine for almost 2 years without ever mixing in new and I occasionally saw what you are talking about. After about 6 months or so the Alodine mix didn't seem to be working as well and started to show some of what you are seeing. Turns out the stuff just needed to be mixed up and kept agitated. Because I always kept mine in a 30 gal trash can I just threw in a fairly large aquarium power head with a long hose attached to it. I left it on 24/7 and when I need to fill a dip tank it also doubled as a way to pump it in to the tank via the hose. Worked fine from then on. > > Michael > > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Bob Leffler > Sent: Sunday, September 09, 2007 7:07 PM > To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com > Subject: RE: RV10-List: Alodine Question > > > I used about 5 gallons in my dip tank, which is the shipping crate that the > spars for the empennage came in. The first time I used it was back in > March, then in May, and finally today. I've added about a gallon of new > each time. > > I haven't seen rings in the plastic containers I store the alodine in and I > keep it in a dark corner of the basement. I didn't get any discoloration in > the pieces that were fully dipped, just the larger pieces that were painted > with a foam brush. > > I'll pass along Eldorado's comments when/if I get them. > > Bob > > > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com > [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Fred Williams, > M.D. > Sent: Sunday, September 09, 2007 7:15 PM > To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com > Subject: Re: RV10-List: Alodine Question > > > > Bob; > > I have used the same solution as you have and have also had occasional > staining of areas. I think it is the chromate. It seems to form more in > the older solutions. I keep the mixed dorado kote in a clean plastic > bucket. As it gets older a green ring will start to form around the top > of the bucket. Concurrently, the solution takes longer to react with the > surface. I can usually rinse most of it off. I have used Sherwin > Williams primer over the top of those stains and have not seen any > flaking or change in the coat. > > I would be interested in hearing their reply. > > Fred Williams > 40515 > > Bob Leffler wrote: > > > > I've been using Dorado Kote 1 for some time now with good results. All > > the parts that I put into the dip tank this afternoon came out looking > > great. In the past, I've used a foam brush to coat the solution on the > > inside of the skins and other parts too large to fit into the tank. I > > not had any problems doing this before. However, today on several of > > the skins, I had some blue-green splotches appear instead of the > > normal bronze color. > > > > Any idea what may have caused this? Should this cause a concern? > > Should I attempt to remove this or is it ok to prime with AKZO? > > > > I've also sent an email off to Eldorado already, so hopefully I'll > > hear back from them tomorrow. > > > > * > > > > > > * > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > > > > > > > > > __________ NOD32 2516 (20070909) Information __________ > > > > > > > > > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "David McNeill" <dlm46007(at)cox.net>
Subject: FW: check this
Date: Sep 10, 2007
_____ From: David McNeill [mailto:dlm46007(at)cox.net] Sent: Monday, September 10, 2007 7:03 AM Subject: check this http://www.modbee.com/local/story/57854.html ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "RV Builder (Michael Sausen)" <rvbuilder(at)sausen.net>
Date: Sep 10, 2007
Subject: Alodine Question
I went with the powder from ElDorado also. What I ended up doing was getting a heavy duty 32 gallon Rubbermaid trash bin and put the castors on it so I can roll it around. I mixed up about 25 gallons and then I just keep it in there where it's safe from light and evaporation. I did notice before I was keeping it agitated there was a fair amount of precipitation of stuff out of the solution on the bottom of the bin when I pumped it into a dip tank. Michael -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of rvmail(at)thelefflers.com Sent: Monday, September 10, 2007 8:43 AM Subject: Re: RE: RV10-List: Alodine Question Michael, This may be a contributing factor. I store my alodine in gallon jugs and pour it into the plastic lined shipping crate when I use it. The only agitation that it would have received would have been from being dumped from one container to another. Probably not very good. The other alternative is tht I did mix a new gallon that was added just a few minutes beforehand. Perhaps I didn't get it throughly mixed up. I guess that's the downside of going with the powder version and mixing it yourself. I'm going to have to look for another type of container if I want to continue to dip parts. Other than the longerons, I don't think may parts in the tail cone will fit. Thanks for your comments..... bob > > From: "RV Builder (Michael Sausen)" <rvbuilder(at)sausen.net> > Date: 2007/09/10 Mon AM 06:11:25 EST > To: "rv10-list(at)matronics.com" > Subject: RE: RV10-List: Alodine Question > > > Bob, > > I used mine for almost 2 years without ever mixing in new and I occasionally saw what you are talking about. After about 6 months or so the Alodine mix didn't seem to be working as well and started to show some of what you are seeing. Turns out the stuff just needed to be mixed up and kept agitated. Because I always kept mine in a 30 gal trash can I just threw in a fairly large aquarium power head with a long hose attached to it. I left it on 24/7 and when I need to fill a dip tank it also doubled as a way to pump it in to the tank via the hose. Worked fine from then on. > > Michael > > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Bob Leffler > Sent: Sunday, September 09, 2007 7:07 PM > To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com > Subject: RE: RV10-List: Alodine Question > > > I used about 5 gallons in my dip tank, which is the shipping crate that the > spars for the empennage came in. The first time I used it was back in > March, then in May, and finally today. I've added about a gallon of new > each time. > > I haven't seen rings in the plastic containers I store the alodine in and I > keep it in a dark corner of the basement. I didn't get any discoloration in > the pieces that were fully dipped, just the larger pieces that were painted > with a foam brush. > > I'll pass along Eldorado's comments when/if I get them. > > Bob > > > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com > [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Fred Williams, > M.D. > Sent: Sunday, September 09, 2007 7:15 PM > To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com > Subject: Re: RV10-List: Alodine Question > > > > Bob; > > I have used the same solution as you have and have also had occasional > staining of areas. I think it is the chromate. It seems to form more in > the older solutions. I keep the mixed dorado kote in a clean plastic > bucket. As it gets older a green ring will start to form around the top > of the bucket. Concurrently, the solution takes longer to react with the > surface. I can usually rinse most of it off. I have used Sherwin > Williams primer over the top of those stains and have not seen any > flaking or change in the coat. > > I would be interested in hearing their reply. > > Fred Williams > 40515 > > Bob Leffler wrote: > > > > I've been using Dorado Kote 1 for some time now with good results. All > > the parts that I put into the dip tank this afternoon came out looking > > great. In the past, I've used a foam brush to coat the solution on the > > inside of the skins and other parts too large to fit into the tank. I > > not had any problems doing this before. However, today on several of > > the skins, I had some blue-green splotches appear instead of the > > normal bronze color. > > > > Any idea what may have caused this? Should this cause a concern? > > Should I attempt to remove this or is it ok to prime with AKZO? > > > > I've also sent an email off to Eldorado already, so hopefully I'll > > hear back from them tomorrow. > > > > * > > > > > > * > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > > > > > > __________ NOD32 2516 (20070909) Information __________ > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: William DeLacey <whd721(at)msn.com>
Subject: FW: check this
Date: Sep 10, 2007
If you play russian roulette long enough-- you will lose. From: dlm46007(at)cox.netTo: rv10-list(at)matronics.comSubject: RV10-List: FW: ch eck thisDate: Mon, 10 Sep 2007 07:04:55 -0700 From: David McNeill [mailto:dlm46007(at)cox.net] Sent: Monday, September 10, 2 007 7:03 AMTo: 'David McNeill'Subject: check this http://www.modbee.com/local/story/57854.html ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Lights, Engine, & FF Kit Q's
Date: Sep 10, 2007
From: "Rhonda Bewley" <Rhonda(at)bpaengines.com>
Gary: What are the differences he's telling you that account for several thousand dollars in savings? What parts that are required at o'h is he using, what is he leaving out? What parts are "experimental only?" If you're talking about cases and a crankshaft that are experimental only, that could mean that they are not in airworthy condition (i.e., outside of serviceable limits.) This would be something akin to what airboat builders do as we've discussed on this list before. You can put anything you want to in your airplane, but make sure that you know what you're getting and that you're perfectly comfortable putting your family behind that engine. Rhonda 2. I am starting to work with my local engine shop and one question that came up early in the conversation was experimental or certified? I asked him why he asked and he explained the differences in the engine that he was talking about and I can live with them. The pro is saving several thousand $ but he said that some people want certified for insurance reasons. My question is that when you went for insurance on your 10, did they ask about the engine whether it was certified or not and if so what were the differences in premiums and insurability? Was there a difference? [Jesse Saint] A certified engine will save you 15 hours on the Phase 1 flight testing period, 25 instead of 40 hours, assuming that you keep everything certified including the prop. Beyond that, you are getting the exact same engine if you stick with the O-540 or IO-540. If you want to go with a used or overhauled engine, then you will most likely be certified, unless you make some changes that will make it experimental, like electronic ignition, experimental fuel injection system, etc. I have not heard of any insurance rate differences. In fact, I haven't even heard any reports of the insurance company asking, possibly not even on the alternative engines, but I am just going from personal experience here, not having talked to everybody about their experience. ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Lights, Engine, & FF Kit Q's
From: "orchidman" <gary(at)wingscc.com>
Date: Sep 10, 2007
Rhonda(at)bpaengines.com wrote: > Gary: > > What are the differences he's telling you that account for several thousand dollars in savings? What parts that are required at o'h is he using, what is he leaving out? What parts are "experimental only?" If you're talking about cases and a crankshaft that are experimental only, that could mean that they are not in airworthy condition (i.e., outside of serviceable limits.) This would be something akin to what airboat builders do as we've discussed on this list before. > > Rhonda > The considerations are with the case. A case could have the flange out by a couple thousandths and when trued up the flange mating thickness might not meet Lyc thickness tolerances. Depending on where it is located, it could be very safe but not meeting tolerances. The builder is a real straight shooter and we will talk out each step of the whole process. I need to know all the ramifications and the insurance one was the only variable of many under consideration that I didn't have any experience with. -------- Gary Blankenbiller RV10 - # 40674 Fuselage SB (N410GB reserved) Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=133766#133766 ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Sep 10, 2007
From: "Fred Williams, M.D." <drfred(at)suddenlinkmail.com>
Subject: Alodine
After thinking some more about the "green/blue precipitate" I googled alodine and started looking down the list. I recommend using a respirator when mixing the powder. Inhaled in humans it is reported to be carcinogenic. I think the trash can idea on wheels is a good one. Fred Williams, MD. ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "John Gonzalez" <indigoonlatigo(at)msn.com>
Subject: Fuel senders
Date: Sep 10, 2007
What have others done when putting in there fuel senders. Are people using the rubber supplied gasket in addition to the proseal or just using the proseal? Thanks, John G. #409, building again ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Fuel senders
Date: Sep 10, 2007
From: pilotdds(at)aol.com
Cork gaskets work better.The rubber ones distorted after a few hours and I replaced them with cork. -----Original Message----- From: John Gonzalez <indigoonlatigo(at)msn.com> Sent: Mon, 10 Sep 2007 11:52 am Subject: RV10-List: Fuel senders ? What have others done when putting in there fuel senders. Are people using the rubber supplied gasket in addition to the proseal or just using the proseal?? ? Thanks,? ? John G. #409, building again? ? ? ? ? ________________________________________________________________________ Email and AIM finally together. You've gotta check out free AOL Mail! - http://mail.aol.com ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Sep 10, 2007
Subject: Re: Fuel senders
From: evmeg(at)snowcrest.net
Throw out the gasket and just use sealant.....and a dab of it under each screw head as well. As you tighten, it will squidge out and make a perfect gasket. Cheers.... Evan > > What have others done when putting in there fuel senders. Are people using > the rubber supplied gasket in addition to the proseal or just using the > proseal? > > Thanks, > > John G. #409, building again > > --------------------------------------------- This message was sent using SnowCrest WebMail. http://www.snowcrest.net ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Vernon Smith <planesmith(at)hotmail.com>
Subject: Side mounting Odyssey PC925 battery
Date: Sep 10, 2007
Does anyone have pictures of their hold-down system for mounting a Odyssey PC 925 on its side? I've looked at Tim's and Deems' sites, but they both mo unted the battery top side up. My understanding is by side mounting it the original tray wouldn't need to be cut up. Any input would be helpful. Thanks, Vern Smith (#324) _________________________________________________________________ Can you find the hidden words?- Take a break and play Seekadoo! http://club.live.com/seekadoo.aspx?icid=seek_wlmailtextlink ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Chris and Susie McGough" <VHMUM(at)bigpond.com>
Subject: Re: Side mounting Odyssey PC925 battery
Date: Sep 11, 2007
Yes thats correct it fits side ways without any modification Chris ----- Original Message ----- From: Vernon Smith To: RV 10 list Sent: Tuesday, September 11, 2007 6:15 AM Subject: RV10-List: Side mounting Odyssey PC925 battery Does anyone have pictures of their hold-down system for mounting a Odyssey PC 925 on its side? I've looked at Tim's and Deems' sites, but they both mounted the battery top side up. My understanding is by side mounting it the original tray wouldn't need to be cut up. Any input would be helpful. Thanks, Vern Smith (#324) ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ----- Can you find the hidden words? Take a break and play Seekadoo! Play now! ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Sep 11, 2007
From: Larry Rosen <LarryRosen(at)comcast.net>
Subject: Re: Fuel senders
John, Look through the archives. You will find that you will get both answers, use the gasket and don't use the gasket. I don't remember the suggestion to replacing the rubber gasket with cork gasket. In my mind, there is no convincing argument one way or the other. My summary of what has been writen: Use the gasket, it will ease removal of the sender in the future. No gasket, the proseal will form the gasket, don't have to worry about rubber or cork failure. Larry evmeg(at)snowcrest.net wrote: > > > Throw out the gasket and just use sealant.....and a dab of it under each > screw head as well. As you tighten, it will squidge out and make a perfect > gasket. > Cheers.... > Evan > > > >> >> What have others done when putting in there fuel senders. Are people using >> the rubber supplied gasket in addition to the proseal or just using the >> proseal? >> >> Thanks, >> >> John G. #409, building again >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> > > > --------------------------------------------- > This message was sent using SnowCrest WebMail. > http://www.snowcrest.net > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Sep 11, 2007
From: Tim Olson <Tim(at)MyRV10.com>
Subject: Re: Nose Wheel Torque
Jeff, You know, after seeing what it did to the forks and now seeing people with the new aluminum spacers have them deform to fit the taper of the harder steel bearings, I'm convinced more than ever that simple things like the torque value are not a good permanent fix. That torque value will change drastically over the first hours of operation, and it will continue to change for a long time. It will keep loosening as the bearing seats better and wears and the aluminum or stainless (if you're still nuts enough to use the stock original spacer as-is) spacer develops it's taper to match the bearing. Over time, you will find it will, without a doubt, loosen up, and will likely at some point start spinning. Many people are now finding some great ways to keep the spacer from turning. Van's latest SB seems be just a torque spec designed to keep the bearing from spinning on the shaft instead of spinning on the wheel. So yeah, I'd torque it to their specs, but, don't think that this will let you out of the issues with the fork wear...that's still a critical problem that should be dealt with somehow by keeping that spacer from rotating. In the end, through some creative methods, people can have this be a very minor issue. This is my favorite fix so far: http://www.vansairforce.com/community/showthread.php?t=17878 It's definitely something worth doing before you fly, and it will be more fun to do when the fork and wheel are still clean. Tim Olson - RV-10 N104CD - Flying Jeff Carpenter wrote: > > Vans has a Nose Wheel Torque posting up on the website... put up on > 9/6. It seems to me that it addresses a problem Tim Olson brought up a > while back relative to wear on the forks. Have I got this right? What > say you Tim? > > Jeff Carpenter > 40304 > N410CF (reserved) > Firewall backward > ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Sep 11, 2007
From: Tim Olson <Tim(at)MyRV10.com>
Subject: Re: WSI AV-300 delivered
Some of this is edited for brevity, but it's what I asked WSI.... ------------------ Regarding the antenna mounting... On the GPS antennas and the old WSI antennas, everyone always said that you don't really need a ground PLANE, but you needed to provide a good ground to the case of the antenna for return power. The new manual says that a ground plane of 12" in diameter is best for reception. Do you know if this for sure is something required? My current installation is on the top of the fiberglass canopy, and I have power ground to the screws, but I don't have any ground plane. Since I'll be completely mounting the antenna all new this time, I have choices to make. First and easiest to route wires is to mount the antenna on the cabin top, the same way I currently have, and it will be horizontal with a full view of the sky in all directions. The alternative is to mount the receiver and the antenna on the top of the tail behind the baggage area, very similar to your Cessna 182 install example, which would be mounted on a backslope of the roof, so it wouldn't have as nice of a forward view....and it would be mounted within 8" of a GPS antenna. If you can find out what's *really* important to getting the best signal, I'd appreciate it. If it's the ground plane, then perhaps the best is on the tail if the other GPS antenna won't interfere. If it's the view of the sky, then on the cabin top would be OK, but the cabin top is 1" thick and the ground plane if any would have to be something like self-stick aluminum on the interior of the cabin. ------------------- Their Replies: There is a section in the antenna install manual regarding installation on composite aircraft. Basically, it says to use an metallic doubler per FAA AC 43.13.2A, Chapter 3, Section 38b(2). As for mounting location, top of the wing is preferred to back of the canopy so as to get the more horizontal mounting. -- and -- A ground plane for this antenna isn't really required - the doubler is more for structural purposes. The FAA AC really does address this well and should be the reference here. Agree on placement. ----------------------------------------------------- I think they mistook "top of the wing" being the canopy top of a Cessna High Wing, but that's OK, the point is, you want a nice high mounting spot that's as horizontal as possible as the preferred location. This concurs with what the manufacturers say about certified WAAS GPS installs also. Tim Olson - RV-10 N104CD - Flying Tim Olson wrote: > > Yesterday I picked up my AV-300 WSI receiver from SteinAir, my dealer. I > haven't powered it yet, but hope to within the next day or two. It's a > nice looking box, complete with the ability to separately talk to 2 full > EFIS's and one "Listen Only" box, and also via ethernet it can talk to > tablet PC's and other PC based systems without using serial. It looks > like perhaps all receivers are actually audio-integrated, but you need a > bit of external hardware for the sirius radio options. > > Right now I'm just trying to get clarification on the antenna mounting > because with the previous system, it was stated at least by Comant that > a ground plane wasn't needed, but the install manual for the AV-300 > antenna seems to indicate that best performance is with a 12" or larger > ground plane. I've not had to install a ground plane on fiberglass > canopies before, and so I'll either be adding one to my canopy top and > see if the ground plane still works when it's 1" below the antenna base, > or I'll be getting some additional cable and mounting my antenna back on > the forward tailcone top. I've asked WSI for comments and will pass them > on. > > Just thought y'all would like to know they've actually delivered one. > ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Fuel senders
Date: Sep 11, 2007
From: "John W. Cox" <johnwcox(at)pacificnw.com>
Just to add more fuel to the consideration. Why not use the cork gasket and coat it with tank sealant as well including a fillet between the unit and the upper surface of the wing? John Cox #600 -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Larry Rosen Sent: Tuesday, September 11, 2007 4:37 AM Subject: Re: RV10-List: Fuel senders John, Look through the archives. You will find that you will get both answers, use the gasket and don't use the gasket. I don't remember the suggestion to replacing the rubber gasket with cork gasket. In my mind, there is no convincing argument one way or the other. My summary of what has been writen: Use the gasket, it will ease removal of the sender in the future. No gasket, the proseal will form the gasket, don't have to worry about rubber or cork failure. Larry evmeg(at)snowcrest.net wrote: > > > Throw out the gasket and just use sealant.....and a dab of it under each > screw head as well. As you tighten, it will squidge out and make a perfect > gasket. > Cheers.... > Evan > > > >> >> What have others done when putting in there fuel senders. Are people using >> the rubber supplied gasket in addition to the proseal or just using the >> proseal? >> >> Thanks, >> >> John G. #409, building again >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> > > > --------------------------------------------- > This message was sent using SnowCrest WebMail. > http://www.snowcrest.net > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Is AmeriKing going to create a 406 Mhz ELT.
Date: Sep 12, 2007
From: "Doerr, Ray R [NTK]" <Ray.R.Doerr(at)sprint.com>
Here is the email chain I had with Ameri-King about there plans for a 406 Mhz ELT. Thank You Ray Doerr 40250 N519RV (Hobbs = 310) Looking forward to LOE 07 -----Original Message----- From: Keith Van [mailto:sales@ameri-king.com] Sent: Wednesday, September 12, 2007 12:48 AM Subject: Re: Is AmeriKing going to create a 406 Mhz ELT. Dear Ray : Thank you for your Email today, The new ELT 406.0 MHz P/N AK-451 shall be the same footprint and size as our ELT AK-450 for easy retrofit direct replacement. Another version of ELT 406.00 MHz is also available with an option of included the GPS feature within the ELT. Please accept our sincere appreciation for your interest in AMERI-KING'S products. I'll look forward to hearing from you soon. BEST REGARDS, VICTOR VAN SALES MANAGER AMERI-KING CORP. 17881 Sampson Lane Huntington Beach, CA 92648 USA Tel (714) 842-8555 Fax (714) 842-4235 Email ameriking9(at)aol.com, Sales(at)ameri-king.com Web Site: www.ameri-king.com -----Original Message----- From: "Doerr, Ray R [NTK]" <Ray.R.Doerr(at)sprint.com> Sent: 2007-09-11 08:47:58 Subject: RE: Is AmeriKing going to create a 406 Mhz ELT. Thanks for your reply. Based on your reply, I was not clear if your AK-451 was the same footprint and size as the AK-450. Will the AK-451 support an RS-232 Serial In Line from a Panel Mounted GPS so that the AK-451 would transmit the last known Long and Lat from the GPS Data? I would like to see the AK-451 read this GPS Data and then save the most recent copy that it would then use if the ELT was activated. Thank You Ray Doerr CDNI Principal Engineer Sprint PCS 16020 West 113th Street Lenexa, KS 66219 Mailstop KSLNXK0101 (913) 859-1414 (Office) (913) 226-0106 (Pcs) (913) 859-1234 (Fax) Ray.R.Doerr(at)sprint.com -----Original Message----- From: Keith Van [mailto:sales@ameri-king.com] Sent: Tuesday, September 11, 2007 12:18 AM Subject: Re: Is AmeriKing going to create a 406 Mhz ELT. Dear Ray : Thank you for your Email today, We shall manufacture the ELT 406 MHz in the next few months. We are now at the last step of FAA TSO Certification stage for ELT 406 MHz P/N AK-451. However, we have been contact with the FAA almost everyday and confirmed that there will not have any requirement from FAA about ELT 406 MHz in 2008. May be there are strong opposition from AOPA. The requirement of ELT 406.0 MHz will be for the Marine only in 2009. The Military Satellites of 121.0/243.0 MHz will be available after 2009 for sure. If we distribute the new ELT 406.0 MHz P/N AK-451 with the same footprints, same sizes as our ELT AK-450 for easy retrofit direct replacement. We also have a program of exchange to ELT 406.0 MHz P/N AK-451 and credit to your old ELT AK-450. Please accept our sincere appreciation for your interest in AMERI-KING'S products. I'll look forward to hearing from you soon. BEST REGARDS, VICTOR VAN SALES MANAGER AMERI-KING CORP. 17881 Sampson Lane Huntington Beach, CA 92648 USA Tel (714) 842-8555 Fax (714) 842-4235 Email ameriking9(at)aol.com, Sales(at)ameri-king.com Web Site: www.ameri-king.com -----Original Message----- From: "Doerr, Ray R [NTK]" <Ray.R.Doerr(at)sprint.com> Sent: 2007-09-10 12:02:36 Subject: Is AmeriKing going to create a 406 Mhz ELT. I was hoping AmeriKing would create a 406 Mhz ELT using the same package as the AK-450 ELT. Do you have any info you can share on this topic? Thank You Ray Doerr CDNI Principal Engineer Sprint PCS 16020 West 113th Street Lenexa, KS 66219 Mailstop KSLNXK0101 (913) 859-1414 (Office) (913) 226-0106 (Pcs) (913) 859-1234 (Fax) Ray.R.Doerr(at)sprint.com ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Is AmeriKing going to create a 406 Mhz ELT.
Date: Sep 12, 2007
From: "Phillips, Jack" <Jack.Phillips(at)cardinalhealth.com>
Good information, Ray. Did they happen to mention their proposed price for the AK-451? Jack Phillips #40610 -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Doerr, Ray R [NTK] Sent: Wednesday, September 12, 2007 8:29 AM Subject: RV10-List: Is AmeriKing going to create a 406 Mhz ELT. --> Here is the email chain I had with Ameri-King about there plans for a 406 Mhz ELT. Thank You Ray Doerr 40250 N519RV (Hobbs = 310) Looking forward to LOE 07 -----Original Message----- From: Keith Van [mailto:sales@ameri-king.com] Sent: Wednesday, September 12, 2007 12:48 AM Subject: Re: Is AmeriKing going to create a 406 Mhz ELT. Dear Ray : Thank you for your Email today, The new ELT 406.0 MHz P/N AK-451 shall be the same footprint and size as our ELT AK-450 for easy retrofit direct replacement. Another version of ELT 406.00 MHz is also available with an option of included the GPS feature within the ELT. Please accept our sincere appreciation for your interest in AMERI-KING'S products. I'll look forward to hearing from you soon. BEST REGARDS, VICTOR VAN SALES MANAGER AMERI-KING CORP. 17881 Sampson Lane Huntington Beach, CA 92648 USA Tel (714) 842-8555 Fax (714) 842-4235 Email ameriking9(at)aol.com, Sales(at)ameri-king.com Web Site: www.ameri-king.com -----Original Message----- From: "Doerr, Ray R [NTK]" <Ray.R.Doerr(at)sprint.com> Sent: 2007-09-11 08:47:58 Subject: RE: Is AmeriKing going to create a 406 Mhz ELT. Thanks for your reply. Based on your reply, I was not clear if your AK-451 was the same footprint and size as the AK-450. Will the AK-451 support an RS-232 Serial In Line from a Panel Mounted GPS so that the AK-451 would transmit the last known Long and Lat from the GPS Data? I would like to see the AK-451 read this GPS Data and then save the most recent copy that it would then use if the ELT was activated. Thank You Ray Doerr CDNI Principal Engineer Sprint PCS 16020 West 113th Street Lenexa, KS 66219 Mailstop KSLNXK0101 (913) 859-1414 (Office) (913) 226-0106 (Pcs) (913) 859-1234 (Fax) Ray.R.Doerr(at)sprint.com -----Original Message----- From: Keith Van [mailto:sales@ameri-king.com] Sent: Tuesday, September 11, 2007 12:18 AM Subject: Re: Is AmeriKing going to create a 406 Mhz ELT. Dear Ray : Thank you for your Email today, We shall manufacture the ELT 406 MHz in the next few months. We are now at the last step of FAA TSO Certification stage for ELT 406 MHz P/N AK-451. However, we have been contact with the FAA almost everyday and confirmed that there will not have any requirement from FAA about ELT 406 MHz in 2008. May be there are strong opposition from AOPA. The requirement of ELT 406.0 MHz will be for the Marine only in 2009. The Military Satellites of 121.0/243.0 MHz will be available after 2009 for sure. If we distribute the new ELT 406.0 MHz P/N AK-451 with the same footprints, same sizes as our ELT AK-450 for easy retrofit direct replacement. We also have a program of exchange to ELT 406.0 MHz P/N AK-451 and credit to your old ELT AK-450. Please accept our sincere appreciation for your interest in AMERI-KING'S products. I'll look forward to hearing from you soon. BEST REGARDS, VICTOR VAN SALES MANAGER AMERI-KING CORP. 17881 Sampson Lane Huntington Beach, CA 92648 USA Tel (714) 842-8555 Fax (714) 842-4235 Email ameriking9(at)aol.com, Sales(at)ameri-king.com Web Site: www.ameri-king.com -----Original Message----- From: "Doerr, Ray R [NTK]" <Ray.R.Doerr(at)sprint.com> Sent: 2007-09-10 12:02:36 Subject: Is AmeriKing going to create a 406 Mhz ELT. I was hoping AmeriKing would create a 406 Mhz ELT using the same package as the AK-450 ELT. Do you have any info you can share on this topic? Thank You Ray Doerr CDNI Principal Engineer Sprint PCS 16020 West 113th Street Lenexa, KS 66219 Mailstop KSLNXK0101 (913) 859-1414 (Office) (913) 226-0106 (Pcs) (913) 859-1234 (Fax) Ray.R.Doerr(at)sprint.com _________________________________________________ or otherwise private information. If you have received it in error, please notify the sender Dansk - Deutsch - Espanol - Francais - Italiano - Japanese - Nederlands - Norsk - Portuguese ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Patrick ONeill" <poneill(at)irealms.com>
Subject: Is AmeriKing going to create a 406 Mhz ELT.
Date: Sep 12, 2007
With regard to the GPS location data option, has anyone seen any statistics on the benefit of this? How accurate is the satellite positioning on the 406 mhz units? Is the accuracy such that the GPS link makes a big difference in locating the beacon? Best Regards, Patrick #40715 -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Doerr, Ray R [NTK] Sent: Wednesday, September 12, 2007 5:29 AM Subject: RV10-List: Is AmeriKing going to create a 406 Mhz ELT. Here is the email chain I had with Ameri-King about there plans for a 406 Mhz ELT. Thank You Ray Doerr 40250 N519RV (Hobbs = 310) Looking forward to LOE 07 -----Original Message----- From: Keith Van [mailto:sales@ameri-king.com] Sent: Wednesday, September 12, 2007 12:48 AM Subject: Re: Is AmeriKing going to create a 406 Mhz ELT. Dear Ray : Thank you for your Email today, The new ELT 406.0 MHz P/N AK-451 shall be the same footprint and size as our ELT AK-450 for easy retrofit direct replacement. Another version of ELT 406.00 MHz is also available with an option of included the GPS feature within the ELT. Please accept our sincere appreciation for your interest in AMERI-KING'S products. I'll look forward to hearing from you soon. BEST REGARDS, VICTOR VAN SALES MANAGER AMERI-KING CORP. 17881 Sampson Lane Huntington Beach, CA 92648 USA Tel (714) 842-8555 Fax (714) 842-4235 Email ameriking9(at)aol.com, Sales(at)ameri-king.com Web Site: www.ameri-king.com -----Original Message----- From: "Doerr, Ray R [NTK]" <Ray.R.Doerr(at)sprint.com> Sent: 2007-09-11 08:47:58 Subject: RE: Is AmeriKing going to create a 406 Mhz ELT. Thanks for your reply. Based on your reply, I was not clear if your AK-451 was the same footprint and size as the AK-450. Will the AK-451 support an RS-232 Serial In Line from a Panel Mounted GPS so that the AK-451 would transmit the last known Long and Lat from the GPS Data? I would like to see the AK-451 read this GPS Data and then save the most recent copy that it would then use if the ELT was activated. Thank You Ray Doerr CDNI Principal Engineer Sprint PCS 16020 West 113th Street Lenexa, KS 66219 Mailstop KSLNXK0101 (913) 859-1414 (Office) (913) 226-0106 (Pcs) (913) 859-1234 (Fax) Ray.R.Doerr(at)sprint.com -----Original Message----- From: Keith Van [mailto:sales@ameri-king.com] Sent: Tuesday, September 11, 2007 12:18 AM Subject: Re: Is AmeriKing going to create a 406 Mhz ELT. Dear Ray : Thank you for your Email today, We shall manufacture the ELT 406 MHz in the next few months. We are now at the last step of FAA TSO Certification stage for ELT 406 MHz P/N AK-451. However, we have been contact with the FAA almost everyday and confirmed that there will not have any requirement from FAA about ELT 406 MHz in 2008. May be there are strong opposition from AOPA. The requirement of ELT 406.0 MHz will be for the Marine only in 2009. The Military Satellites of 121.0/243.0 MHz will be available after 2009 for sure. If we distribute the new ELT 406.0 MHz P/N AK-451 with the same footprints, same sizes as our ELT AK-450 for easy retrofit direct replacement. We also have a program of exchange to ELT 406.0 MHz P/N AK-451 and credit to your old ELT AK-450. Please accept our sincere appreciation for your interest in AMERI-KING'S products. I'll look forward to hearing from you soon. BEST REGARDS, VICTOR VAN SALES MANAGER AMERI-KING CORP. 17881 Sampson Lane Huntington Beach, CA 92648 USA Tel (714) 842-8555 Fax (714) 842-4235 Email ameriking9(at)aol.com, Sales(at)ameri-king.com Web Site: www.ameri-king.com -----Original Message----- From: "Doerr, Ray R [NTK]" <Ray.R.Doerr(at)sprint.com> Sent: 2007-09-10 12:02:36 Subject: Is AmeriKing going to create a 406 Mhz ELT. I was hoping AmeriKing would create a 406 Mhz ELT using the same package as the AK-450 ELT. Do you have any info you can share on this topic? Thank You Ray Doerr CDNI Principal Engineer Sprint PCS 16020 West 113th Street Lenexa, KS 66219 Mailstop KSLNXK0101 (913) 859-1414 (Office) (913) 226-0106 (Pcs) (913) 859-1234 (Fax) Ray.R.Doerr(at)sprint.com ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Sep 12, 2007
From: "James K Hovis" <james.k.hovis(at)gmail.com>
Subject: Re: Is AmeriKing going to create a 406 Mhz ELT.
I think it could make a big difference in time needed to locate a beacon. Older ELT's bsically just send out a toned signal. You need direction finding radio equipment to find the bearing to the transmitter and then triangulate that with one or two other DF stations to find the location. This could take some time. Also, transmitter power and terrain may limit the effectiveness of the DF equipment recieving the signal. As far as accuracy of the GPS reading, the ELT itself will contain a GPS reciever that should be as accurate as any other TSO'd GPS unit. The ELT signal will contain a data stream containing the GPS coordinates that is relayed by satellite to the central processing center. Once the coordinates are decoded, this can be relayed to the rescue units. This should save quite a bit of time. Of course, the accuracy of the GPS data the ELT transmits is a function of how many GPS satellites it "sees" at any one time (need at least three), just as it is with any GPS unit. In a crash I suppose this could be an issue. Kevin H. On 9/12/07, Patrick ONeill wrote: > > With regard to the GPS location data option, has anyone seen any statistics > on the benefit of this? How accurate is the satellite positioning on the > 406 mhz units? Is the accuracy such that the GPS link makes a big > difference in locating the beacon? > > Best Regards, > Patrick #40715 > > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com > [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Doerr, Ray R > [NTK] > Sent: Wednesday, September 12, 2007 5:29 AM > To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com > Subject: RV10-List: Is AmeriKing going to create a 406 Mhz ELT. > > > > Here is the email chain I had with Ameri-King about there plans for > a 406 Mhz ELT. > > > Thank You > Ray Doerr > 40250 > N519RV (Hobbs = 310) > Looking forward to LOE 07 > > > -----Original Message----- > From: Keith Van [mailto:sales@ameri-king.com] > Sent: Wednesday, September 12, 2007 12:48 AM > To: Doerr, Ray R [NTK] > Subject: Re: Is AmeriKing going to create a 406 Mhz ELT. > > Dear Ray : > > Thank you for your Email today, > > The new ELT 406.0 MHz P/N AK-451 shall be the same footprint and size as our > ELT AK-450 for easy retrofit direct replacement. > > Another version of ELT 406.00 MHz is also available with an option of > included the GPS feature within the ELT. > > Please accept our sincere appreciation for your interest in AMERI-KING'S > products. I'll look forward to hearing from you soon. > > BEST REGARDS, > > > VICTOR VAN > SALES MANAGER > AMERI-KING CORP. > 17881 Sampson Lane > Huntington Beach, CA 92648 USA > Tel (714) 842-8555 > Fax (714) 842-4235 > Email ameriking9(at)aol.com, Sales(at)ameri-king.com > Web Site: www.ameri-king.com > > > -----Original Message----- > From: "Doerr, Ray R [NTK]" <Ray.R.Doerr(at)sprint.com> > Sent: 2007-09-11 08:47:58 > To: Keith Van <sales@ameri-king.com> > Subject: RE: Is AmeriKing going to create a 406 Mhz ELT. > > Thanks for your reply. Based on your reply, I was not clear if your AK-451 > was the same footprint and size as the AK-450. > > Will the AK-451 support an RS-232 Serial In Line from a Panel > Mounted GPS so that the AK-451 would transmit the last known Long and Lat > from the GPS Data? I would like to see the AK-451 read this GPS Data and > then save the most recent copy that it would then use if the ELT was > activated. > > > Thank You > Ray Doerr > CDNI Principal Engineer > Sprint PCS > 16020 West 113th Street > Lenexa, KS 66219 > Mailstop KSLNXK0101 > (913) 859-1414 (Office) > (913) 226-0106 (Pcs) > (913) 859-1234 (Fax) > Ray.R.Doerr(at)sprint.com > > > -----Original Message----- > From: Keith Van [mailto:sales@ameri-king.com] > Sent: Tuesday, September 11, 2007 12:18 AM > To: Doerr, Ray R [NTK] > Subject: Re: Is AmeriKing going to create a 406 Mhz ELT. > > Dear Ray : > > Thank you for your Email today, > > We shall manufacture the ELT 406 MHz in the next few months. We are now at > the last step of FAA TSO Certification stage for ELT 406 MHz P/N AK-451. > However, we have been contact with the FAA almost everyday and confirmed > that there will not have any requirement from FAA about ELT 406 MHz in 2008. > May be there are strong opposition from AOPA. > > The requirement of ELT 406.0 MHz will be for the Marine only in 2009. The > Military Satellites of 121.0/243.0 MHz will be available after 2009 for > sure. > > If we distribute the new ELT 406.0 MHz P/N AK-451 with the same footprints, > same sizes as our ELT AK-450 for easy retrofit direct replacement. > > We also have a program of exchange to ELT 406.0 MHz P/N AK-451 and credit to > your old ELT AK-450. > > Please accept our sincere appreciation for your interest in AMERI-KING'S > products. I'll look forward to hearing from you soon. > > BEST REGARDS, > > > VICTOR VAN > SALES MANAGER > AMERI-KING CORP. > 17881 Sampson Lane > Huntington Beach, CA 92648 USA > Tel (714) 842-8555 > Fax (714) 842-4235 > Email ameriking9(at)aol.com, Sales(at)ameri-king.com > Web Site: www.ameri-king.com > > > -----Original Message----- > From: "Doerr, Ray R [NTK]" <Ray.R.Doerr(at)sprint.com> > Sent: 2007-09-10 12:02:36 > To: sales@ameri-king.com > Subject: Is AmeriKing going to create a 406 Mhz ELT. > > I was hoping AmeriKing would create a 406 Mhz ELT using the same package as > the AK-450 ELT. Do you have any info you can share on this topic? > > > Thank You > Ray Doerr > CDNI Principal Engineer > Sprint PCS > 16020 West 113th Street > Lenexa, KS 66219 > Mailstop KSLNXK0101 > (913) 859-1414 (Office) > (913) 226-0106 (Pcs) > (913) 859-1234 (Fax) > Ray.R.Doerr(at)sprint.com > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "RV Builder (Michael Sausen)" <rvbuilder(at)sausen.net>
Date: Sep 12, 2007
Subject: Is AmeriKing going to create a 406 Mhz ELT.
>From what I have read, GPS data get's you a couple things. First and foremost it gives rescuers immediate coordinates to begin their search within a 100 meter radius. With just the 406 beacon, it will take several passes of low orbit SAR satellites to narrow down your location using Doppler Shift. The feds also say accuracy using DS is 1-3 miles, time & samples variable. Michael -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Patrick ONeill Sent: Wednesday, September 12, 2007 8:20 AM Subject: RE: RV10-List: Is AmeriKing going to create a 406 Mhz ELT. With regard to the GPS location data option, has anyone seen any statistics on the benefit of this? How accurate is the satellite positioning on the 406 mhz units? Is the accuracy such that the GPS link makes a big difference in locating the beacon? Best Regards, Patrick #40715 -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Doerr, Ray R [NTK] Sent: Wednesday, September 12, 2007 5:29 AM Subject: RV10-List: Is AmeriKing going to create a 406 Mhz ELT. Here is the email chain I had with Ameri-King about there plans for a 406 Mhz ELT. Thank You Ray Doerr 40250 N519RV (Hobbs = 310) Looking forward to LOE 07 -----Original Message----- From: Keith Van [mailto:sales@ameri-king.com] Sent: Wednesday, September 12, 2007 12:48 AM Subject: Re: Is AmeriKing going to create a 406 Mhz ELT. Dear Ray : Thank you for your Email today, The new ELT 406.0 MHz P/N AK-451 shall be the same footprint and size as our ELT AK-450 for easy retrofit direct replacement. Another version of ELT 406.00 MHz is also available with an option of included the GPS feature within the ELT. Please accept our sincere appreciation for your interest in AMERI-KING'S products. I'll look forward to hearing from you soon. BEST REGARDS, VICTOR VAN SALES MANAGER AMERI-KING CORP. 17881 Sampson Lane Huntington Beach, CA 92648 USA Tel (714) 842-8555 Fax (714) 842-4235 Email ameriking9(at)aol.com, Sales(at)ameri-king.com Web Site: www.ameri-king.com -----Original Message----- From: "Doerr, Ray R [NTK]" <Ray.R.Doerr(at)sprint.com> Sent: 2007-09-11 08:47:58 Subject: RE: Is AmeriKing going to create a 406 Mhz ELT. Thanks for your reply. Based on your reply, I was not clear if your AK-451 was the same footprint and size as the AK-450. Will the AK-451 support an RS-232 Serial In Line from a Panel Mounted GPS so that the AK-451 would transmit the last known Long and Lat from the GPS Data? I would like to see the AK-451 read this GPS Data and then save the most recent copy that it would then use if the ELT was activated. Thank You Ray Doerr CDNI Principal Engineer Sprint PCS 16020 West 113th Street Lenexa, KS 66219 Mailstop KSLNXK0101 (913) 859-1414 (Office)

August 23, 2007 - September 12, 2007

RV10-Archive.digest.vol-cn