Zenith-Archive.digest.vol-cu
March 14, 2002 - April 09, 2002
that appears logical to me: Approach the authorities in Australia and request real
details
on Jabiru engine performance over the last decade. I did this for 20 years of VW
engine
history a year back and it was very interesting indeed.
It would probably be better to make a joint approach to the Bureau of Air Safety
Investigation
or the Australian Ultralight Federation (both have web pages and contact details).
The thick file I got from BASI is like the data from ATSB and it convinced me that
the
venerable VW is a good engine in its intended role. Mostly what went wrong were
the things
that went wrong with all engines (fuel, finger trouble etc) and also that the VW
is a pretty
marginal 2 place powerplant. I didn't use it though.
In terms of the Jabiru range, it is more logical to revew the accumulated service
history
evidence than even the viewpoint of aviation authorities, engineers, manufacturers
or isolated
pilots. Bear in mind that plenty of engineers have spent years designing things
that didn't
work well until they were used for a reasonable period of time. Quite often they
looked
great, the price was right etc. But in the end the proof of the pudding is in the
eating.
If the real evidence (and not someone's opinion) convinces you, buy the engine.
If not, don't.
Perry Morrison
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Cleone Markwell <cleone(at)rr1.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Glareshield edge treatment |
George, I used the moulding which I didn't use on the canopy. Since I
haven't painted yet I just let the glass rub on the aluminum. Not the best
Idea but will get some more when the painting time comes. It makes a lot
better head bumper than the raw edge. 103.5 hrs now. Cleone
>
>A question for 601 builders:
>
>If you are using the aft end of the 6-F-16 forward top skin as a
>glareshield,how are you treating that skull-splitting .025 edge? I"m
>thinking about of some sort of molding that would have a finished appearance
>yet protect the edge and the occupants from (at least) minor impact. I
>haven't located anything suitable yet.
>
>All serious suggestions appreciated.
>
>George
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Mike Fothergill <mfothergill(at)sympatico.ca> |
| Subject: | Re: Fuel Sight Gage |
Hi Kelly;
Yes, the HD & HDS do cruise at slightly different angle of attack and so
will the HD depending on airspeed and load etc. I nother words, you
can't get it perfect for all of your flight conditions with a sight
guage. I suggest that you calibrate it with the top longeron level. That
should be about average. You will be nose down at full speed and nose
high at slow speeds.
Rots o' luck
Mike
UHS spinners
C-FRND 601HDS (900+ hours)
The Meiste's wrote:
>
>
> Question for the guys with the 601 header tank, and visual sight gage.
> I'm trying to mark my IP for the visual sight gage (16 gal tank). I was
> going to indicate the gallon levels next to the sight gage, but was
> wondering at what angle the fuse is at when in normal flight? I would
> like to mark my IP to show the fuel level in the planes cruise position
> (not on level ground). Also my plane is the HD, not HDS. But do the HD &
> HDS cruise at different angles of attack?
> Thanks for any advise!
>
> Kelly Meiste
> 601 HD Stratus (90.0000000001%)
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: CH 701 SUBARU EA 81 ENGINE |
THANKS DR MORRISON FOR THE INFO ON JABIRU, I PLAN TO LOOK THEM UP AT SUN N'
FUN - CHIP MULDOON doon47(at)aol.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "HINDE,FRANK (HP-Corvallis,ex1)" <frank_hinde(at)hp.com> |
| Subject: | Re: engine compartment temperatures, was Re:Fuel Pum |
p
Not quite true David. It depends on where your fuel tank is. If you have the
header tank then your position is probably OK as it will be gravity primed
anywhere on the firewall.
If you only have wing tanks then potentially you will be sucking fuel uphill
which could well lead to your premature death due to vapor lock.
This is a hotly debabted issue and if your not full conversant with the
effect on sucking on high vapor pressure liquids like gasoline I suggest you
look in the archives to design your system.
Frank
I would suggest that if the fuel pump mounted on the side of a 912 at the
front works OK, then you don't have to worry about a Facet mounted on the
firewall.
David Tanner
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Ivan Rosales <ivanrosalest(at)prodigy.net.mx> |
Hi guys:
I'm about to mount the tires to the wheel rims. Do you have to take
apart the rims in it's two halves to do it? If so, how did you manage to
take off the 3 bolts that hold them? I tried but none of my tools made
it through the small hole they're in.
Thank you.
Ivan Rosales
601HD From Kit
Mexico City
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Zenith-List Digest: 23 Msgs - 03/13/02 |
| From: | Grant Corriveau <grantC(at)total.net> |
on 3/14/02 02:57, Zenith-List Digest Server at
zenith-list-digest(at)matronics.com wrote:
> From: "George Swinford" <grs-pms(at)mindspring.com>
> Subject: Zenith-List: Glareshield edge treatment
>
>
> A question for 601 builders:
>
> If you are using the aft end of the 6-F-16 forward top skin as a
> glareshield,how are you treating that skull-splitting .025 edge?
I cut the aluminum overhang flush to the panel. I will install a padded
overhang made with plastic/finishing fabric of some sort. I think this will
be safer, and also if it is deformed by someone grabbing it, it won't stay
bent like the aluminum edge. fwiw,
--
Grant Corriveau
Montreal
Zodiac 601hds/CAM100
C-GHTF
www.theWingStayedON.ca
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Zenith-List Digest: 23 Msgs - 03/13/02 |
| From: | Grant Corriveau <grantC(at)total.net> |
on 3/14/02 02:57, Zenith-List Digest Server at
> The paper that came with the pump says not to mount in the engine
> compartment to avoid temps over 140F (60 C).
>
> Has anybody else mounted a Facet on the firewall and if so, any
> problems?
The higher volatility of auto gas vs. avgas should be considered. I'd
recommend that fuel lines and the pump itself, be insulated from the engine
heat, and ventilated by cooler air where possible. I had an episode of
engine faltering this past summer after a prolonged ground delay in hot
weather. I'm pretty sure, the culprit was heat buildup under the cowling
affecting my carb and the lines to it.
fwiw
--
Grant Corriveau
Montreal
Zodiac 601hds/CAM100
C-GHTF
www.theWingStayedON.ca
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Lyle Pahnke" <ldpahnke(at)netwitz.net> |
| Subject: | Re: mounting tires |
>
>Hi guys:
>I'm about to mount the tires to the wheel rims. Do you have to
take
>>Ivan Rosales
>601HD From Kit
>Mexico City
Ivan: a 1/4 in drive deep socket should do the trick. Some on the
list didn't split the rims. I did though. LDP
Netwitz Internet Services www.netwitz.net (618)533-5447
Call Today And Ask About Wireless Broadband
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Pinneo, George" <George.Pinneo(at)trw.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Zenith-List Digest: 23 Msgs - 03/13/02 |
I have two Facet pumps on the Firewall, the Header Tank unit down below the battery
in the factory suggested location, in-cowl and the wing-locker Tank transfer
unit inside the cockpit on the same bolts. I've seen no issue of vapor-lock,
fuel-heating, frabulation, distillation or conjunctivitus, etc. in 380. hours
of operation of my 912. I'm using alum and stainless/teflon lines w/ no issues.
GGP
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "HINDE,FRANK (HP-Corvallis,ex1)" <frank_hinde(at)hp.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Zenith-List Digest: 23 Msgs - 03/13/02 |
George,
I respect your experience but I think there is real danger in someone not
knowing the difference between pumping and sucking on fuel.
You do not suck on fuel because you have the header tank....
Your scarcastic reply might lead the unawre to believe sucking on fuel (like
with a facet on the firewall and wing tanks only) is ok...It is NOT and
someone somewhere is going to get killed because of it...
Please guys...Never rely on sucking fuel uphill during take off..!
Hoping your conjunctivitis remains clear!...:-)
Frank
-----Original Message-----
From: Pinneo, George [mailto:George.Pinneo(at)trw.com]
Subject: RE: Zenith-List: Re: Zenith-List Digest: 23 Msgs - 03/13/02
I have two Facet pumps on the Firewall, the Header Tank unit down below the
battery in the factory suggested location, in-cowl and the wing-locker Tank
transfer unit inside the cockpit on the same bolts. I've seen no issue of
vapor-lock, fuel-heating, frabulation, distillation or conjunctivitus, etc.
in 380. hours of operation of my 912. I'm using alum and stainless/teflon
lines w/ no issues.
GGP
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bryan Martin <bryanmmartin(at)comcast.net> |
| Subject: | Re: fuel flow and vapor lock |
>
> I have two Facet pumps on the Firewall, the Header Tank unit down below the
> battery in the factory suggested location, in-cowl and the wing-locker Tank
> transfer unit inside the cockpit on the same bolts. I've seen no issue of
> vapor-lock, fuel-heating, frabulation, distillation or conjunctivitus, etc. in
> 380. hours of operation of my 912. I'm using alum and stainless/teflon lines
> w/ no issues.
>
> GGP
>
As long as the fuel is always under pressure, either gravity pressure or
pump pressure, vapor lock is unlikely. When you draw suction on a fuel line
by putting it above the level of fuel in the tank or by having a partially
clogged filter upstream of the pump you greatly increase the risk of vapor
lock. In the case of a transfer pump, vapor lock is not a great risk because
the pump is feeding fuel to another tank and not directly to the engine.
--
Bryan Martin
N61BM, CH 601 XL, Stratus Subaru
Wings, tail and fuselage done, wheels mounted
installing tail feathers.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "zodiacjeff" <zodiacjeff(at)email.msn.com> |
| Subject: | Re: mounting tires |
> I'm about to mount the tires to the wheel rims. Do you have to take
> apart the rims in it's two halves to do it? If so, how did you manage to
> take off the 3 bolts that hold them?
Ivan,
If you're doing it yourself you'll need to get them apart. Need a 1/4 inch
hex wrench and a 1/2 inch deep socket. Most find they have to grind the
outside of the socket to make it fit in the small holes. Go slowly on the
bench grinder and finish up on the belt sander. I used a 1/2 inch Craftsman
that measures .680 in diameter. After grinding down to .640 (only in the
first 3/4 inch or so) the fit was fine.
This is now a "special" tool and need to be included with the a/c when you
travel.
A hint: sprinkle a little baby/talcum powder inside the tire and on the
inner tube, you'll find things slip into place a bit easier. Don't pinch
the tube between the wheel halves for obvious reasons.
Regards Jeff
Area 41 SWE
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Jerry Jensen <jensenm(at)gtcinternet.com> |
| Subject: | Re: mounting tires |
Ivan, Yes you should split the rims to mount the tires. I had to find a socket
that was close and grind down the od.
Jerry Jensen
601HDS Jab 3300 90% ?
Ivan Rosales wrote:
>
> Hi guys:
> I'm about to mount the tires to the wheel rims. Do you have to take
> apart the rims in it's two halves to do it? If so, how did you manage to
> take off the 3 bolts that hold them? I tried but none of my tools made
> it through the small hole they're in.
> Thank you.
> Ivan Rosales
> 601HD From Kit
> Mexico City
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Shay King" <shaking(at)eircom.net> |
| Subject: | matco wheel bearings |
Dear List,
I've been reading the instructions that came with my kit for the Matco
wheels. They say the bearings are oiled at the factory to prevent
corrosion, but before use, the bearings have to be cleaned, dried, and
filled with suitable grease.
Can anyone tell me how to go about doing this? Do I hammer the
bearing out of the hub and prise the seal off to get inside? I'm
scared of doing damage so would like some advice before I attack the
things.
All advice much appreciated.
Regards,
Shay King. 701, still half complete.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "The Meiste's" <meiste(at)essex1.com> |
| Subject: | Re: mounting tires |
> This is now a "special" tool and need to be included with the a/c when you
> travel.
Good idea Jeff, but now I've got a question on this one.
If you get a flat on a 601's main gear I'd guess the gear would be jacked
off the ground by placing a board across the two extrusions straddling the
gear leg, and push up on the board.
But how does one jack the front tri-gear off the ground to change a tire?
Kelly
601 (Tri-Gear)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jon Croke" <Jon(at)joncroke.com> |
| Subject: | Re: matco wheel bearings |
>
> Dear List,
> I've been reading the instructions that came with my kit for the Matco
> wheels. They say the bearings are oiled at the factory to prevent
> corrosion, but before use, the bearings have to be cleaned, dried, and
> filled with suitable grease.
,
> Shay King. 701, still half complete.
>
Shay,
I called Matco on this very same issue... they said these instructions were
for their old style and that the bearings I have are sealed (for your
protection!) and require no maintenance.
One of my bearings (still brand new) has a 'flat' spot as I turn it... Im
still trying to figure a *safe* way to get the bearing out w/o hacking up
that fine gold finish! Another call to Matco, I guess!
Jon
near Green Bay
701 69.3% completed
-----------------------
www.joncroke.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "HINDE,FRANK (HP-Corvallis,ex1)" <frank_hinde(at)hp.com> |
| Subject: | matco wheel bearings |
NO!!!!
If the bearings have seals on them (one on each side) they already have
grease in them and no further lube is required. In fact you will put more
dirt in them by doing what you suggest (have read).
We call 'em sealed for life (death!) bearings.
Frank
waiting for the weather to improve to get past 256 hours)
Dear List,
I've been reading the instructions that came with my kit for the Matco
wheels. They say the bearings are oiled at the factory to prevent
corrosion, but before use, the bearings have to be cleaned, dried, and
filled with suitable grease.
Can anyone tell me how to go about doing this? Do I hammer the
bearing out of the hub and prise the seal off to get inside? I'm
scared of doing damage so would like some advice before I attack the
things.
All advice much appreciated.
Regards,
Shay King. 701, still half complete.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "David Tanner" <vk3auu(at)vic.australis.com.au> |
| Subject: | Re: engine compartment temperatures, was Re:Fuel Pum |
p
We are probably only talking of a negative suction head of no more than a
foot so we are looking at a pressure reduction of around 0.3 psi, hardly
significant.
David Tanner
>
> Not quite true David. It depends on where your fuel tank is. If you have
the
> header tank then your position is probably OK as it will be gravity primed
> anywhere on the firewall.
>
> If you only have wing tanks then potentially you will be sucking fuel
uphill
> which could well lead to your premature death due to vapor lock.
>
> This is a hotly debabted issue and if your not full conversant with the
> effect on sucking on high vapor pressure liquids like gasoline I suggest
you
> look in the archives to design your system.
>
> Frank
>
> I would suggest that if the fuel pump mounted on the side of a 912 at the
> front works OK, then you don't have to worry about a Facet mounted on the
> firewall.
>
> David Tanner
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "HINDE,FRANK (HP-Corvallis,ex1)" <frank_hinde(at)hp.com> |
| Subject: | Re: engine compartment temperatures, was Re:Fuel Pum |
p
Partly true and like any argument on this subject....why take the risk...
Do you know what the vapor pressure is of gasoline (87 octane autogas) at
say 100F on the tarmac?
Add to that the friction loss of the fuel hose at max flow (take off). I
know of folks who have seen fuel boiling in the sight tube of their header
tank'd airplanes..Ok, an unusual worse case but.....
Some folks even put a filter on the suction side of the pump...what pressure
drop is that contributing, partially blocked at full flow.
Believe me (I'm a professional Engineer that works in this field) any
suction head at all could become very significant indeed!
Frank
-
We are probably only talking of a negative suction head of no more than a
foot so we are looking at a pressure reduction of around 0.3 psi, hardly
significant.
David Tanner
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Ed Kramer" <edkramer(at)prodigy.net> |
| Subject: | Zenith List: mounting tires |
Good idea Jeff, but now I've got a question on this one.
If you get a flat on a 601's main gear I'd guess the gear would be
jacked
off the ground by placing a board across the two extrusions straddling
the
gear leg, and push up on the board.
But how does one jack the front tri-gear off the ground to change a
tire?
Kelly,
To get the nose wheel off the ground enough to change the tire. Just
place a sand bag or something similar on the inboard end of the
horizontal stabilizer at the fuselage and let the tail sit on the
ground.
Ed Kramer
West Seneca, NY
STOL CH 701, just started
edkramer(at)prodigy.net
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "George Swinford" <grs-pms(at)mindspring.com> |
| Subject: | Glareshield Edge Trim |
Thanks to everyone who responded to my query on the glareshield edge. I
guess some split tubing is the way to go.
I'm planning about 45mm of overhang for the glareshield. Does that sound
about right?
George
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Rich <rich(at)carol.net> |
| Subject: | Re: engine compartment temperatures, was Re:Fuel Pump |
Since there's a thread on fuel, there is a link in the new Experimenter.
http://www.eaa.org/education/fuel/recommended_practices.html
by "Mr. Cesar Gonzales... has 47 years of fuel system design experience working
for Cessna."
Has lots of good info with friction line formulas, pressure & temps, etc.
Rich
801
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "zodiacjeff" <zodiacjeff(at)email.msn.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Glareshield Edge Trim |
> I'm planning about 45mm of overhang for the glareshield. Does that sound
> about right?
George,
Using 50mm here, probably far more than many of you out there, but having
flown in a few 601's I thought the most possible protection from glare on
the IP the better.
As far as the "skull slicer" edge, Tony Bingelis in Sportplane Construction
Techniques (the yellow book) has a good idea on page 193 - an idea that even
allows adding extra overhang for those of you who cut short and now think
you might like a bit more.
His cockpit coaming treatment on page 187 might give you guys some "light
bulbs."
Far and away, his best ideas come out in the article "About That Instrument
Panel..." in the November 1992 issue of Sport Aviation. If your personal
library doesn't go back that far, maybe your local chapter will have a copy.
In this article he takes the fuel tube splitting theme a step further and
uses aluminum tubing instead of rubber or poly. Page 87 of the article
shows how to "split" aluminum tubing in a drill press with an abrasive disc
or cutoff wheel. The tubing is then covered with rubber tubing or the foam
pipe insulation many of you have on the hot water pipes in your homes. That
.025 front skin will never come through an overlay of aluminum tube.
This is what we did in SnailWorks East, slitting a 3/8 inch 5052 aluminum
tube for the glareshield which in turn is covered with a slit piece of
fabric/fiber reinforced tubing from the auto parts as Grant S. suggested.
Now if I can come up with a way of fitting or wrapping some naugahyde
around, it should match the interior.
Likewise, I did the same for the middle skin where it comes up and over hoop
B2. Knowing I lacked the skill to hammer the skin over B2 and have it look
decent, I slit a piece of 5/16 5052 aluminum and bent it into place. The
skin is cut to extend just far enough past B2 to allow the 5/16 tubing to
slip on, and being 5052, it's easy to bend into place. The tubing and the
hoop are in contact along their entire length and add a measure of strength
in an area where you naturally place your hand while boarding. This edge
protector was fastened by squeezing JB Weld and silicon into the slit. Up
front Tony suggest ty-wraps.
If anyone would like a pixs of Tony's drill press/tubing slitting idea,
contact me off list and I'll try to take one with the digital camera.
Sorry, don't have a fax.
Now George, I know you're quite innovative in taking ideas and expanding
upon them - so when you add to this let all of us know.
Regards Jeff
Area 41 SWE
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "doug" <dm10495(at)cedarnet.org> |
It looks like the easiest place to mount my facet pumps will be just in
front of the spar on the cockpit floor. Will the noise be a problem? Or can
anyone else see any other problems?
Thanks
Doug Mattson
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "The Meiste's" <meiste(at)essex1.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Zenith List: mounting tires |
> But how does one jack the front tri-gear off the ground to change a
> tire?
>
> Kelly,
> To get the nose wheel off the ground enough to change the tire. Just
> place a sand bag or something similar on the inboard end of the
> horizontal stabilizer at the fuselage and let the tail sit on the
> ground.
> Ed Kramer
Would this be safe to do with my heavy EA-81 engine?
Kelly
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "zodiacjeff" <zodiacjeff(at)email.msn.com> |
| Subject: | Re: mounting tires |
> If you get a flat on a 601's main gear I'd guess the gear would be jacked
> off the ground by placing a board across the two extrusions straddling the
> gear leg, and push up on the board.
That would be a good jack location, never thought of it. Go a step further
and make a "special" board to be kept in hangar: maybe a foot long piece of
2X6 with saw kerfs in it that match the spacing of the extrusions. On the
flip side take a 1 1/2 of 2 inch woodbit or forstner bit and make a recess
about 1/2 inch deep to take and hold in place the top of the hydraulic jack.
Anything to lessen the possibility of things moving unexpectedly. Still
think the wing should rest on a padded sawhorse or similar to prevent any
slipping that could injure you while doing wheel/tire/brake maintenance.
Laugh for the night on me: not flying yet but already have had a flat. When
mounting wheel pants I managed to not only drill through the thick aluminum
fork but into the tire. Made a nice hissing sound which went well with the
stream of expletives that suddenly seemed necessary.
> But how does one jack the front tri-gear off the ground to change a tire?
Are we all carrying or going to carry tiedown ropes? Most strips or
airports have ring tiedowns or cables out in the tiedown areas. Use the aft
tiedown hook and attach to one of those. Would guess that the safest place
to push down on the tail of a tri-gear 601 would be along the line of rivets
over bulkhead B6. Where do you guys who are flying push down to maneuver
your Zodie Rockets around?
Regards Jeff
Area 41 SWE
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Randy L. Thwing" <n4546v(at)mindspring.com> |
| Subject: | Re: mounting tires |
Subject: Re: Zenith-List: mounting tires
Why push? Use a rachet strap and just winch the tail down. I try to
purchase ones made of the finest Chinese nylon! Works great on the 48
Bonanza, but I always hook up two straps, one for safety in case one breaks
with the nose wheel removed.
Randy L. Thwing, 701 plans
>Use the aft
> tiedown hook and attach to one of those. Would guess that the safest
place
> to push down on the tail of a tri-gear 601 would be along the line of
rivets
> over bulkhead B6. Where do you guys who are flying push down to maneuver
> your Zodie Rockets around?
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Kilby, Roger" <Roger.Kilby(at)DynCorp.com> |
I just got a Skysport fuel gauge and am putting the sender on an 8 gallon
header tank.
The docs say to use a "fuel-proof sealant" around the gasket and bolts that
hold the sender
to the tank.
Anyone have any suggestions for a good sealant?
Thanks,
Roger Kilby
N98RK
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Zenith-List Digest: 32 Msgs - 03/14/02 |
| From: | Grant Corriveau <grantC(at)total.net> |
on 3/15/02 02:57, Zenith-List Digest Server at
zenith-list-digest(at)matronics.com wrote:
> From: "doug" <dm10495(at)cedarnet.org>
> Subject: Zenith-List: Facet fuel pump
>
>
> It looks like the easiest place to mount my facet pumps will be just in
> front of the spar on the cockpit floor. Will the noise be a problem? Or can
> anyone else see any other problems?
> Thanks
> Doug Mattson
My Facets can be pretty loud if they are sucking (air?). When flowing
properly they quiten down a lot. I'd still not want them inside the cockpit
area, personally.
--
Grant Corriveau
Montreal
Zodiac 601hds/CAM100
C-GHTF
www.theWingStayedON.ca
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Dave Austin" <daveaustin2(at)sprint.ca> |
| Subject: | Re: Glareshield Edge Trim |
Geo., I put a hand-hold at the centre top of the instr. panel - three inches
of 1 X 1 extrusion on the rivet line. I've had no problem with the overhang
being bent and it really helps in getting in/out.
Dave Austin 601HDS - 912
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Dave Austin" <daveaustin2(at)sprint.ca> |
| Subject: | Re: Facet fuel pump |
Doug, I think you would find it very noisy. Mine is on the front of the
firewall at the bottom, next to the gascolator. Even then, it can be heard.
I only use it for takeoff and landings.
Dave Austin 601HDS - 912
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "patrick walsh" <pwalsh4539(at)msn.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Facet fuel pump |
NOISE??!!...probably will not be a problem as the engine noise will easily drown
the pump noise out..
Patrick Walsh
200 loud hours and 15 very quiet seconds..
----- Original Message -----
From: doug
Subject: Zenith-List: Facet fuel pump
It looks like the easiest place to mount my facet pumps will be just in
front of the spar on the cockpit floor. Will the noise be a problem? Or can
anyone else see any other problems?
Thanks
Doug Mattson
=
=
=
=
Get mor
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "HINDE,FRANK (HP-Corvallis,ex1)" <frank_hinde(at)hp.com> |
As long as your passengers don't step on them it will be OK.... Personally I
wanted all thet stuff OUT of the cockpit. Electrical supply and fuel in the
same device under my legs was not a good combination for me.
I put mine insede of the outer most rib of the center wing section. This
enabled me to keep the suction line short and to seal the cockpit with a
couple of plate riveted over the ligthening holes.
Frank
-----Original Message-----
From: doug [mailto:dm10495(at)cedarnet.org]
Subject: Zenith-List: Facet fuel pump
It looks like the easiest place to mount my facet pumps will be just in
front of the spar on the cockpit floor. Will the noise be a problem? Or can
anyone else see any other problems?
Thanks
Doug Mattson
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Matthew Mucker" <matthew(at)mucker.net> |
| Subject: | Re: engine compartment temperatures, was Re:Fuel Pum |
p
> We are probably only talking of a negative suction head of no more than a
> foot so we are looking at a pressure reduction of around 0.3 psi, hardly
> significant.
>
> David Tanner
>
Without knowing the vapor pressure of gasoline, it's not possible to *know*
whether or not this is significant. (I'm not too keen on betting my life on
a "probably.") At my home field in Dallas, hundred-degree-plus days are the
norm in summer. The black tarmac gets really hot. How hot does the fuel
sitting in that oven in the wing get? What's the vapor pressure of the gas
at that point? Add a partially blocked fuel line in the equation and see
what happens when sucking gas uphill.
Then there's the reality that the vapor pressure of gasoline is just a
guess. Refineries constantly change their formulation for different
geographies and weather conditions. The gasoline you buy in summer is NOT
the same mix that comes out of the same pump from the same refinery in
summer. (We won't even talk about differences between refineries.)
The answer to "Can I suck gas uphill with my fuel pump?" seems to be a
religious debate. Everyone has his or her own opinion and can't be swayed
by the arguments of the other side.
One thing we all seem to agree on is that gasoline under positive pressure
(being pushed by the pump) is less likely to vaporize in the fuel line than
gasoline being sucked by a pump. (And when gas vaporizes in the fuel line,
that big fan at the front of the plane that keeps the pilot cool stops
spinning.)
While there have been many advocates of "it doesn't matter" and many
advocates of "it's safer to push the gas uphill," I have yet to hear anyone
say "it's safer to pull the gas uphill." For that reason, my choice is
clear: the pump goes at the tank.
-Matt
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jeff & Marcia Davidson" <jdavidso(at)fcc.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Fuel Gauge... |
Roger - I don't have personal experience but Sealube available from ACS is
commonly recommended.
Jeff Davidson
> Anyone have any suggestions for a good sealant?
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | charles.long(at)gm.com |
| Subject: | Facet pump location |
I mounted my pumps to the outboard side of Nose rib #6. I drilled 4, A4
holes into the bracket for mounting and riveted it in place. The rivets go
inside to outside thru the rib, then the pump. The whole reason for this
approach is to allow the rivets to be easily drilled out to replace the pump.
I
used right angle fittings on both inlet and outlet. This allows a straight shot
6" of hose from the tank to the pump. The pump gives an upward and forward jog
to the fuel flow which allows the outlet to point through the nose rib
lightening hole. I also take the wiring for the pump + and fuel level sensor
(sig & ground) out the same opening and terminate with a Mate-n-lock connector
(Same connectors used on the Zac Strobe Kit). The mate-n-locks work great and
can be purchased from Mouser Electronics. The crimp tool can be purchased from
B & C Aeroelectrics.
The advantage to mounting the pumps in this location is four fold. First,
very clean suction side path for the fuel. Second, should reduce the
perceptable noise level of the pumps having them located out in the wing.
Third, since you need a connector at the wing joint anyway, might as well make
the fuel pump and strobe power supply connections at this point also,
eliminating an extra set of connections. Finally, the wing joint location does
allow for fuel pump servicing, although I don't know at this point whether it
will be possible to do so without also removing the wing. My two cents, so take
it for what it's worth.
Chuck Long, P.E.
From: "doug" <dm10495(at)cedarnet.org>
Subject: Zenith-List: Facet fuel pump
It looks like the easiest place to mount my facet pumps will be just in
front of the spar on the cockpit floor. Will the noise be a problem? Or can
anyone else see any other problems?
Thanks
Doug Mattson
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Matthew Mucker" <matthew(at)mucker.net> |
> NOISE??!!...probably will not be a problem as the engine noise will easil> y
drown the pump noise out..
> Patrick Walsh
> 200 loud hours and 15 very quiet seconds..
>
LOL!
Patrick, were you ever able to reach a verdict on the cause of those 15
quiet seconds?
-Matt
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "zodiacjeff" <zodiacjeff(at)email.msn.com> |
Hi Roger,
Sounds like the top skin is off.
Never used this stuff personally but have seen the A&P our partnership uses
apply it all the time - Pro-Seal: messy, sticky, ugly, and expensive, but
holds and seals like bubble gum in the kids' hair. He used it to hold new
glass in a friend's Mooney along with sealing tanks and fittings.
ACS has a pint for about $37, however, it lists 2-1/2 oz. and 6 oz.
cartridges for less than $2. Would that be enough?
Sealube will not harden, it's rather like STP. Great for use on the
threaded parts of aluminum fittings (use very sparingly) but I don't think
it what you're seeking.
Regards Jeff
Area 41 SWE
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "zodiacjeff" <zodiacjeff(at)email.msn.com> |
| Subject: | noisy Facet pumps |
>My Facets can be pretty loud if they are sucking (air?). When flowing
>properly they quiet down a lot. I'd still not want them inside the cockpit
>area, personally.
Doug,
The sound might be a good idea if it's a transfer pump that only runs for
about five to eight minutes before shut off. The noise would remind you not
to overfill the header - now this assumes you're pumping to a header which
won't be the case for all. Same type of warning can be visual by wiring in
a "witness light" on the panel when your pumps are on.
Some guys have automatic shutoff systems (Pillar Point?) that do it for
them.
If they're to be on all the time, move 'em to the wing. If you do put in
cockpit on the floor in front of spar, take very seriously the advice to
protect them from being stepped on. A pump in the cockpit that suddenly
begin spewing fuel would make for an interesting flight.
Archives are full of ideas as this topic is debated mucho.
Regards Jeff
Area 41 SWE
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "LEO CORBALIS" <l.corbalis(at)worldnet.att.net> |
I have a Facet pump on my lower left firewall, 290 hrs with no problem. It
is plumbed in paralell with the engine driven pump on my Rotax 912. I ran a
check on underhood temps, using Radio Shack in/out temp units (2) . I
mounted one remote sensor in back of the lip on the lower cowl out of the
wind and taped the other to the back of the rt. carb air cleaner. There was
only 2 degrees F differience! I think some performance enhancing boarding up
that headwind right behind the prop is in order. No I don't worry about
vapor lock. See experimenting is what its all about
Leo Corbalis
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "HINDE,FRANK (HP-Corvallis,ex1)" <frank_hinde(at)hp.com> |
| Subject: | Facet pump location |
Yes this works great.
I did mount mine on the between the two outer ribs of the center wing
section but to be honest there is enough room to bolt the pump on the
outboard side of the center wing rib or indeed on the inboad side of
thefirst outer wing panel rib...in other words put the pump in the wing
joint.
Even though my install is tight, there is enough room to service the pump
and change the filter without removing the wing.
Like Charles said this type of install gives you a nice straight shot on the
suction line. I used a 3/8ths hose here with a 3/8ths to 1/8th NPT 90 degree
fitting that screws directly into the inlet of the pump. Mine too has a 90
fitting on the pump outlet pointing upwards so that air/vapor bubbles won't
get trapped in the pump.
Frank...P.E
HDS 256 hours..STILL waiting on weather
-
I mounted my pumps to the outboard side of Nose rib #6. I drilled 4,
A4
holes into the bracket for mounting and riveted it in place. The rivets go
inside to outside thru the rib, then the pump. The whole reason for this
approach is to allow the rivets to be easily drilled out to replace the
pump. I
used right angle fittings on both inlet and outlet. This allows a straight
shot
6" of hose from the tank to the pump.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | David Terrell <dl_terrell(at)yahoo.com> |
| Subject: | Matronics - Extruded Longerons |
I like the idea of using extruded angle for longerons.
It actually simplifies my construction, since I don't
have access to a brake over 4'.
What does Zenithair have to say on the subject?
What size extruded do you recommend?
The biggest issue, as I see it, is the weight penalty.
However, there is also an issue with the fact that
the extruded will not fit nearly as flush as the
0.040".
I will probably fly unpainted for a while and store
the plane outside. Will the 'non-flush' fitting
become an issue?
QUOTED FROM MATRONICS:
wings amazingly seem to be OK. But after seeing this
happy
that I decided to run extruded for all Longerons.
http://sports.yahoo.com/
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: mounting tires |
In a message dated 03/14/2002 9:12:57 PM US Mountain Standard Time,
zodiacjeff(at)email.msn.com writes:
> Laugh for the night on me: not flying yet but already have had a flat. When
> mounting wheel pants I managed to not only drill through the thick aluminum
>
Thank you so much for sharing this story. I swear to God I thought I was the
only person to do stuff like that! You made my day!
Steve (never popped a tire, but done similar) Freeman
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Mark Townsend" <601xl(at)sympatico.ca> |
| Subject: | RE: Extruded Longeron |
HI David here is my reply to your questions.
What does Zenithair have to say on the subject?
Chris said it is not necessary but he doesn't see any other problem
other then weight. and gave me his blessing.
What size extruded do you recommend?
I used .125 as it was the only size around. Total weight gain was 4 lbs.
I accounted for it by dumping my 28lb wheelchair battery for a 12 lb
Oddessy battery. Same cranking power but in a dry cell. Down side was
the extra 100 bucks for the battery.
I will probably fly unpainted for a while and store
the plane outside. Will the 'non-flush' fitting
become an issue?
Yes it becomes a Huge pain in the Ass when you have to allow for another
5 mils of material. Both HD';s in the rear had to be adjusted
accordingly and a .125 shim was placed under both as well as where the
lower rudder hinges attach. Bonus part is that the rear Tie-down ring
now goes through .270 of material and is directly attached to the
extrusion which runs right to the engine. and with a .060 plate added
between extrusions for the battery area the battery also is supported by
extruded material instead of the .040 longeron and .016 skin. I really
think it's worth the effort personally.
Has anyone else done Extruded for all longeron material? Or am I the
only weird one here?
Mark Townsend
601XL EA-82 SPFI
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "patrick walsh" <pwalsh4539(at)msn.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Facet fuel pump |
Matt,
...nope...not for certain. I do have around four hours on it since I reworked everything
up front...may have swallowed a little water...and I did
have a small paper type filter UPSTREAM of the boost pump....perhaps that or vapor
lock. Everything checked out perfectly...so there's the rub....you just
never know....just maintain the airplane as best as possible...which I was doing...
I can tell you I ruled out anything electrical....or mechanical. I was
a fuel problem. Wish I had a pressure gauge installed at the time...I have one
now. It wouldnt have stopped the problem perhaps, but it sure would have helped
in a diagnosis.
Patrick
----- Original Message -----
From: Matthew Mucker
Subject: RE: Zenith-List: Facet fuel pump
> NOISE??!!...probably will not be a problem as the engine noise will easil
> y drown the pump noise out..
> Patrick Walsh
> 200 loud hours and 15 very quiet seconds..
>
LOL!
Patrick, were you ever able to reach a verdict on the cause of those 15
quiet seconds?
-Matt
=
=
=
=
Get mor
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Damien Graham" <dgraham7(at)twcny.rr.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Glareshield Edge Trim |
> I did not like the edge of the glareshield sticking out so far, so I cut
my off, still leaving enough to make the rivet holes legal. Was that a
mistake?
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bill Morelli <billvt(at)together.net> |
| Subject: | Bing Carbs Model |
Are the Bing carbs on the Stratus Subaru the same ones that are on the
Rotax 912?
What is the model number of the Stratus Bing carbs?
Thanks,
Bill
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Gary K" <flyink(at)efortress.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Bing Carbs Model |
Yes, Same as 912, 914 and HKS.
Bing Type 64, 32mm. I have a manual if you need info.
Gary K.
>
> Are the Bing carbs on the Stratus Subaru the same ones that are on the
> Rotax 912?
>
> What is the model number of the Stratus Bing carbs?
>
> Thanks,
> Bill
>
>
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Mark Townsend" <601xl(at)sympatico.ca> |
| Subject: | Re: Photo of overturned 601 |
Hey Mike
Did you fly down today and see it ? If you did I wish I had known as I was
in a hanger close to it working on the XL. Yup it is still upside down. The
Airport got so embarrassed by it that they through a tarp over it, That way
passengers boarding the local charter company's plane won't see it as well
as they have been. For some darn reason it was spooking the passengers !!
LOL. I tried several times to E-mail the owner so see if I could buy the
salvage from him as I know it wasn't insured but he doesn't seem to be
replying to anyone about it. Not a big surprise. My guess is that it will be
there for another 3 mos or more.
Mark Townsend
601XL EA-82
-----Original Message-----
>
>The 601 is still upside down as of to-day.
>Mike
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Carlos Sa <wings1(at)videotron.ca> |
Hello, all
I finally have something to show for all the $ and time spent: the
rudder was completed last night and received its final polish today. I'm
impressed with it, even though I always thought of it as a "no big deal"
part - people build it in one weekend, don't they. Right. Big learning
curve there, particularly if scratch building. But what do I know,
there's a whole aeroplane waiting to be built - less rudder, of
course... :o)
Here is a summary of issues/tools/by-products of this first step:
Home made tool: fluting pliers from the RV Canadian West Wing site (I
added one extra piece to the centre leaf, at it was too narrow)
http://www.vansairforce.org/tools/index.shtml
Polish: I used "Mother's mag & aluminium polish". Smells like cleaning
products (as opposed to petrol). I applied it with with paper towel
attached to a pad on my corded drill. Lots of work, but I haven't heard
of any polishing process that is quick and labour-free...
Polishing was done before bending/drilling the skins. Much easier to do
the first polishing when the part is laying flat on a table. To avoid
scratches, I covered then with paper, which I kept until the priming
stage. I then removed it and covered all the holes with masking tapes,
and the whole thing with paper again. It was only removed during final
assembly.
Talking about primer, I used an aerosol from Canadian Tire, I believe
the can says it is a replacement for zinc chromate. Nasty! I applied it
on a day when the temperature rose to 16 C, so I kept the garage door
open. It's really bad. I need to find something I can apply with a
brush.
During the skin riveting phase, knowing from the skeleton build process
that I would probably hit the parts with the riveter, I used a piece of
cardboard about 6"x6" with a small whole in the middle (about 1 cm
across). I placed this "mask" on top of the whole to receive the rivet
thus protecting the adjacent area. Judging from the marks on the mask,
I'd have hit the rudder skins with the riveter some 8 to 10 times. Well
worth it.
On the tail part of the tip rib, there was no room to place a rivet: the
un-popped rivet was too long and the rib too narrow at that spot. I saw
that the popped rivet would fit with room to spare, so I enlarged the
hole a bit, and squeezed a rivet just enough so it would fit. Then it
was just a matter of placing it in the enlarged whole and popping it.
I made 3 pairs of spar doublers. One was discarded, one became part of
the rudder and one found home in Grant C's 601, holding something behind
the instrument panel and/or the elevator fairing.
I made two spars, two of each rib and four tip ribs. The first spar had
too much of a banana effect. Same for the two larger ribs, which were
made on forming blocks - I remade them on a bending brake. The other
ribs were re-made because the flange was too short.
Now, the tip rib is a different story. It's a pain to make. The compound
curve on its tip was tough to make, and only the last one was acceptable
[though I think Michel T will say I'm being picky... :o) ]
I spent a ton of additional time to make a transparent fairing and to
mount a light inside, which is actually sold as a marker light for
trucks. I also spent time looking for a suitable bulb and making a
support for its socket. Indeed, mods will stretch building time beyond
the wildest dreams/nightmares...
Now on to the next challenge. Stabilizer?
Happy building
Carlos
CH601 HD, plans - 0.01% done.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Mark Townsend" <601xl(at)sympatico.ca> |
| Subject: | Re: first milestone |
All I can say is "WOW"!!!!, by any chance Carlos did you ever read the
section "It's not a fighter plane?" Only kidding you spend as much time as
you wish and enjoy every step towards your day of flight.
Mark
-----Original Message-----
>
>Hello, all
>
>
>I finally have something to show for all the $ and time spent: the
>rudder was completed last night and received its final polish today. I'm
>impressed with it, even though I always thought of it as a "no big deal"
>part - people build it in one weekend, don't they. Right. Big learning
>curve there, particularly if scratch building. But what do I know,
>there's a whole aeroplane waiting to be built - less rudder, of
>course... :o)
>
>Here is a summary of issues/tools/by-products of this first step:
>
>Home made tool: fluting pliers from the RV Canadian West Wing site (I
>added one extra piece to the centre leaf, at it was too narrow)
>http://www.vansairforce.org/tools/index.shtml
>
>Polish: I used "Mother's mag & aluminium polish". Smells like cleaning
>products (as opposed to petrol). I applied it with with paper towel
>attached to a pad on my corded drill. Lots of work, but I haven't heard
>of any polishing process that is quick and labour-free...
>Polishing was done before bending/drilling the skins. Much easier to do
>the first polishing when the part is laying flat on a table. To avoid
>scratches, I covered then with paper, which I kept until the priming
>stage. I then removed it and covered all the holes with masking tapes,
>and the whole thing with paper again. It was only removed during final
>assembly.
>
>Talking about primer, I used an aerosol from Canadian Tire, I believe
>the can says it is a replacement for zinc chromate. Nasty! I applied it
>on a day when the temperature rose to 16 C, so I kept the garage door
>open. It's really bad. I need to find something I can apply with a
>brush.
>
>During the skin riveting phase, knowing from the skeleton build process
>that I would probably hit the parts with the riveter, I used a piece of
>cardboard about 6"x6" with a small whole in the middle (about 1 cm
>across). I placed this "mask" on top of the whole to receive the rivet
>thus protecting the adjacent area. Judging from the marks on the mask,
>I'd have hit the rudder skins with the riveter some 8 to 10 times. Well
>worth it.
>
>On the tail part of the tip rib, there was no room to place a rivet: the
>un-popped rivet was too long and the rib too narrow at that spot. I saw
>that the popped rivet would fit with room to spare, so I enlarged the
>hole a bit, and squeezed a rivet just enough so it would fit. Then it
>was just a matter of placing it in the enlarged whole and popping it.
>
>I made 3 pairs of spar doublers. One was discarded, one became part of
>the rudder and one found home in Grant C's 601, holding something behind
>the instrument panel and/or the elevator fairing.
>
>I made two spars, two of each rib and four tip ribs. The first spar had
>too much of a banana effect. Same for the two larger ribs, which were
>made on forming blocks - I remade them on a bending brake. The other
>ribs were re-made because the flange was too short.
>Now, the tip rib is a different story. It's a pain to make. The compound
>curve on its tip was tough to make, and only the last one was acceptable
>[though I think Michel T will say I'm being picky... :o) ]
>
>I spent a ton of additional time to make a transparent fairing and to
>mount a light inside, which is actually sold as a marker light for
>trucks. I also spent time looking for a suitable bulb and making a
>support for its socket. Indeed, mods will stretch building time beyond
>the wildest dreams/nightmares...
>
>Now on to the next challenge. Stabilizer?
>
>
>Happy building
>
>Carlos
>CH601 HD, plans - 0.01% done.
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Matthew Mucker" <matthew(at)mucker.net> |
Carlos,
You ever plannin' on flyin' that thing? :)
I've been in the "preparing to start building" stage for three years now,
but suddenly my pace doesn't seem so slow!
I'm certain, however, that you're going to end up with one beautiful bird.
I hope to see it when it's done.
-Matt
> Hello, all
>
>
> I finally have something to show for all the $ and time spent: the
> rudder was completed last night and received its final polish today. I'm
> impressed with it, even though I always thought of it as a "no big deal"
> part - people build it in one weekend, don't they. Right. Big learning
> curve there, particularly if scratch building. But what do I know,
> there's a whole aeroplane waiting to be built - less rudder, of
> course... :o)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Todd Osborne" <todd(at)toddtown.com> |
| Subject: | Tail kiit for XL is same as HDS, right? |
I could swear I read this somewhere, but cannot find it now on the
Zenith web site. The tail kit for the XL is the same as for the other
601 models, right? I am looking at picking up the rest of my tail from
another gentleman that is selling his HDS tail, which I am hoping is the
same as the XL. Thanks,
Todd Osborne
Internet E-Mail: todd(at)toddtown.com
AOL Messenger: toddosborn
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Mike Fothergill <mfothergill(at)sympatico.ca> |
| Subject: | Re: Photo of overturned 601 |
Hi Mark;
We did not go there specifically to see it, but did see it while taxiing
back to 32. Actually, Kitchener was picked for it's restaurant.
Sorry we missed you.
Mike
UHS Spinners
Mark Townsend wrote:
>
>
> Hey Mike
> Did you fly down today and see it ? If you did I wish I had known as I was
> in a hanger close to it working on the XL. Yup it is still upside down. The
> Airport got so embarrassed by it that they through a tarp over it, That way
> passengers boarding the local charter company's plane won't see it as well
> as they have been. For some darn reason it was spooking the passengers !!
> LOL. I tried several times to E-mail the owner so see if I could buy the
> salvage from him as I know it wasn't insured but he doesn't seem to be
> replying to anyone about it. Not a big surprise. My guess is that it will be
> there for another 3 mos or more.
>
> Mark Townsend
> 601XL EA-82
> -----Original Message-----
>
>
> >
> >The 601 is still upside down as of to-day.
> >Mike
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "michael brook" <walruss(at)optushome.com.au> |
| Subject: | ALLLLLMMMMMMOOOOOSSSSSTTTTT there |
Updating the list,
My machine was inspected last week. THere were a few things to fix up and
I'll be finished by next friday. I will have a first flight next weekend.
That is what I'll be gunning for.
mike 2 planes..
----- Original Message -----
From: Carlos Sa <wings1(at)videotron.ca>
Subject: Zenith-List: first milestone
>
> Hello, all
>
>
> I finally have something to show for all the $ and time spent: the
> rudder was completed last night and received its final polish today. I'm
> impressed with it, even though I always thought of it as a "no big deal"
> part - people build it in one weekend, don't they. Right. Big learning
> curve there, particularly if scratch building. But what do I know,
> there's a whole aeroplane waiting to be built - less rudder, of
> course... :o)
>
> Here is a summary of issues/tools/by-products of this first step:
>
> Home made tool: fluting pliers from the RV Canadian West Wing site (I
> added one extra piece to the centre leaf, at it was too narrow)
> http://www.vansairforce.org/tools/index.shtml
>
> Polish: I used "Mother's mag & aluminium polish". Smells like cleaning
> products (as opposed to petrol). I applied it with with paper towel
> attached to a pad on my corded drill. Lots of work, but I haven't heard
> of any polishing process that is quick and labour-free...
> Polishing was done before bending/drilling the skins. Much easier to do
> the first polishing when the part is laying flat on a table. To avoid
> scratches, I covered then with paper, which I kept until the priming
> stage. I then removed it and covered all the holes with masking tapes,
> and the whole thing with paper again. It was only removed during final
> assembly.
>
> Talking about primer, I used an aerosol from Canadian Tire, I believe
> the can says it is a replacement for zinc chromate. Nasty! I applied it
> on a day when the temperature rose to 16 C, so I kept the garage door
> open. It's really bad. I need to find something I can apply with a
> brush.
>
> During the skin riveting phase, knowing from the skeleton build process
> that I would probably hit the parts with the riveter, I used a piece of
> cardboard about 6"x6" with a small whole in the middle (about 1 cm
> across). I placed this "mask" on top of the whole to receive the rivet
> thus protecting the adjacent area. Judging from the marks on the mask,
> I'd have hit the rudder skins with the riveter some 8 to 10 times. Well
> worth it.
>
> On the tail part of the tip rib, there was no room to place a rivet: the
> un-popped rivet was too long and the rib too narrow at that spot. I saw
> that the popped rivet would fit with room to spare, so I enlarged the
> hole a bit, and squeezed a rivet just enough so it would fit. Then it
> was just a matter of placing it in the enlarged whole and popping it.
>
> I made 3 pairs of spar doublers. One was discarded, one became part of
> the rudder and one found home in Grant C's 601, holding something behind
> the instrument panel and/or the elevator fairing.
>
> I made two spars, two of each rib and four tip ribs. The first spar had
> too much of a banana effect. Same for the two larger ribs, which were
> made on forming blocks - I remade them on a bending brake. The other
> ribs were re-made because the flange was too short.
> Now, the tip rib is a different story. It's a pain to make. The compound
> curve on its tip was tough to make, and only the last one was acceptable
> [though I think Michel T will say I'm being picky... :o) ]
>
> I spent a ton of additional time to make a transparent fairing and to
> mount a light inside, which is actually sold as a marker light for
> trucks. I also spent time looking for a suitable bulb and making a
> support for its socket. Indeed, mods will stretch building time beyond
> the wildest dreams/nightmares...
>
> Now on to the next challenge. Stabilizer?
>
>
> Happy building
>
> Carlos
> CH601 HD, plans - 0.01% done.
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Zenith-List Digest: 16 Msgs - 03/16/02 |
| From: | Grant Corriveau <grantC(at)total.net> |
on 3/17/02 02:57, Zenith-List Digest Server at
zenith-list-digest(at)matronics.com wrote:
> Now on to the next challenge. Stabilizer?
>
>
> Happy building
>
> Carlos
> CH601 HD, plans - 0.01% done.
Way to go Carlos! And I will continue to gladly incorporate any other
'imperfect' parts that you decide to discard!!! ;-) Your rudder should find
a place of honour on the wall above your mantle (temporarily until needed
for flight of course! Your aircraft will be an example of craftsmanship that
I can only admire as I just don't possess such tenacity and patience.
For your priming, I suggest that you want to wear a good mask -- the type
with the renewable filters with official ratings against all sorts of nasty
stuff. I have one that I bought especially for this project, and now of
course it isn't being used much. I would gladly lend it to you. I think it
cost about 35 $ at Can. Tire -- if you decide to buy one.
I'm wearing it in the photo of me priming my steel tubes etc. outside the
garage (in the online album). I didn't want to spray this stuff inside the
house or in an enclosed space (especially given the fact that I share my
living space with a couple of pet birds!).
Congrats again!
--
Grant Corriveau
Montreal
Zodiac 601hds/CAM100
C-GHTF
www.theWingStayedON.ca
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Walt Cannon" <grnlake(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | Post us a picture |
Michael Brook,
Post us a picture of the bird that is getting ready to fly. Good luck!!
Walt Cannon
CH 701 Seattle
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "David Tellet" <telletdl(at)erols.com> |
| Subject: | RMI Micro-encoder |
List,
I know I'm getting ahead of myself, but I'm starting to look at
instrumentation, and wondered if anyone out there is flying with, or
planning to install, the Rocky Mountain Instruments microencoder or
micromonitor? They seem like good composite instruments and they are even
available in kits (link is below in case you haven't seen them).
Any lessons learned out there?
Thanks,
David Tellet, 601HD, tail and wings done (almost)
http://www.rkymtn.com/
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Gary Liming <gary(at)liming.org> |
| Subject: | Re: RMI Micro-encoder |
>
>List,
>
> I know I'm getting ahead of myself, but I'm starting to look at
>instrumentation, and wondered if anyone out there is flying with, or
>planning to install, the Rocky Mountain Instruments microencoder or
>micromonitor? They seem like good composite instruments and they are even
>available in kits (link is below in case you haven't seen them).
>
> Any lessons learned out there?
David,
There is a photo report of the monitor kit build at www.liming.org/ch801
that you can look at - take the instruments link, and scroll down to the
image of the monitor. I'm not flying yet, so I don't have that experience
to share. I liked the user interface over the Grand Rapids monitor (but
you might not) and also liked the fuel flow option. Also, the lighting
matches the green UMA bezels you can get for look alike lighted panel.
Gary Liming
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Phil Maxson" <pmaxpmax(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Tail kit for XL is same as HDS, right? |
Right. The rudder, stabilizer, and elevator are the same. The rear
fuselage, however, is not. The fuselage middle longerons and floor skins
(and maybe the side skins, I don't remember) are different. The primary
difference is because the XL uses a different method of joining the rear and
forward fuselage sections together.
Phil Maxson
601XL, Working on the controls.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Carl Bertrand" <cgbrt(at)mondenet.com> |
| Subject: | Re: ANGWQ (A New Guy With Questions) |
----- Original Message -----
From: "tongaloa" <tongaloa(at)alltel.net>
Subject: Zenith-List: ANGWQ (A New Guy With Questions)
>
> New to list and seriously considering a ch701 plans built.
> Size, construction method, and load capacity are all perfect for
> intended use.
>
> Here are some things I've been wondering about...
>
> Building from scratch:
> Have perused archives and don't see too many constructing
> plans built. Just how many of you guys are doing this.
I have and there are three others in my area.>
>
> CAD:
> Has anyone transfered the plans to autocad? I would very much like to
> run some of a plans built on the CNC machines and it will save a lot
> of work if I can find DXF files(any revision of plan) to check
> and update, rather than having to key in from scratch. Another reason
> I would like the files is for revisions and notes.
> Please, just let me know if you have.
No
I will not ask for a copy of these
> until I've purchased the plans and have a serial number. I've written to
> Zenith air, and they are not offering DXF files for the plans, with the
> plans.
>
> Complaints with kit:
> I've seen a few complaints regarding errors in plans and complaints
> regarding QC of kit components. I wonder if anyone has tabulated
> these. I'm curious about both because QC problems with particular
> kit components suggests that the plans builder should take extra
> care in these areas.
Zenair Newsletter or a builder close to you is your best source. >
> Flanging/bending:
> Curious as to whether anyone has built or used a mandrel(flaring tool)
> for making the flanges. Also curious as to bending experiences with
> forms and press as opposed to a brake and if anyone has done
> forms for a press that also flanged. I'm not talking dies here. Just
> wooden forms.
I used wooden forms.
>
> Web site performance numbers ch701:
> cruise as 80/95 mph at 75/100% with Bombardier/Rotax 912
> Actual experience?
That's about right.
> Only number I could find in archives 75mph at 5000rpm with
> 912 and climb prop
That is low. 80/85 mph is what you should get on wheels.
Carl
701/912/amphibs
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> UMIDS FROM ADDRESS: owner-zenith-list-server(at)matronics.com
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "The Meiste's" <meiste(at)essex1.com> |
| Subject: | Oil Filter Wrench |
For you 601 Stratus flyers,
I was trying to get my oil filter wrench on my Stratus oil filter today
without any luck. Just not enough clearance between the filter end, and
the lower engine mount to get my steel band wrench (about 1" wide) to
slide on.
What style wrench is everyone else out there using for this job?
Thanks for any tips on this!
Kelly Meiste
601 HD
90.000002% there ................
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bill Morelli <billvt(at)together.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Oil Filter Wrench |
I've been able to take the filter off (I have done three so far) with my
hands without using a wrench.
Regards,
Bil
>For you 601 Stratus flyers,
>I was trying to get my oil filter wrench on my Stratus oil filter today
>without any luck. Just not enough clearance between the filter end, and
>the lower engine mount to get my steel band wrench (about 1" wide) to
>slide on.
>What style wrench is everyone else out there using for this job?
>Thanks for any tips on this!
>
>Kelly Meiste
>601 HD
>90.000002% there ................
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bill Morelli <billvt(at)together.net> |
You guys with LE tanks that are flying. Do you have the ZAC vents in the
tanks which I understand are a tube inside the tank near the filler that
exits through the bottom skin. If yes, do the vents leak?
My local A&P mechanic says that the fuel will leak out of this type of vent
when the aircraft is banked. He said that the method used in the certified
world is to run the vent from the left tank to the right wing and visa
versa. This prevents fuel leaking during banks.
I will be pulling my leaking LE tank soon and will add a flush mount cap
which will require me to add a vent line. Plumbing the vent to the opposite
wing makes sense but it is much more work then I really want to do. Is
there another way to get a non leaking vent line?
Regards,
Bill (flight hours just reached 120 today)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jeff Paden" <jeffpaden(at)madbbs.com> |
| Subject: | Re: LE wing tanks |
Yes, My ch-300 has the the same type of vents and YES, they do leak! ERRRG!
Not only do they leak during a bank but the also leak every time I have the
aircraft filled with fuel. I have been looking for a fix for this for the
past few months and was just getting ready to plug the vents and put a
vented cap on the tanks. Not sure if that would work but I really don't see
any reason why not.
I too am very interested in any input on this subject.
Jeff Paden
> You guys with LE tanks that are flying. Do you have the ZAC vents in the
> tanks which I understand are a tube inside the tank near the filler that
> exits through the bottom skin. If yes, do the vents leak?
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Cy Galley" <cgalley(at)qcbc.org> |
| Subject: | Re: LE wing tanks |
Not if you are in a coordinately turn!
Cy Galley, TC - Chair, Emergency Aircraft Repair, Oshkosh
Editor, EAA Safety Programs
cgalley(at)qcbc.org or experimenter(at)eaa.org
Always looking for articles for the Experimenter
----- Original Message -----
From: "Bill Morelli" <billvt(at)together.net>
Subject: Zenith-List: LE wing tanks
You guys with LE tanks that are flying. Do you have the ZAC vents in the
tanks which I understand are a tube inside the tank near the filler that
exits through the bottom skin. If yes, do the vents leak?
My local A&P mechanic says that the fuel will leak out of this type of vent
when the aircraft is banked. He said that the method used in the certified
world is to run the vent from the left tank to the right wing and visa
versa. This prevents fuel leaking during banks.
I will be pulling my leaking LE tank soon and will add a flush mount cap
which will require me to add a vent line. Plumbing the vent to the opposite
wing makes sense but it is much more work then I really want to do. Is
there another way to get a non leaking vent line?
Regards,
Bill (flight hours just reached 120 today)
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Zenith-List Digest: 13 Msgs - 03/17/02 |
| From: | Grant Corriveau <grantC(at)total.net> |
on 3/18/02 02:57, Zenith-List Digest Server at
zenith-list-digest(at)matronics.com wrote:
> My local A&P mechanic says that the fuel will leak out of this type of vent
> when the aircraft is banked. He said that the method used in the certified
> world is to run the vent from the left tank to the right wing and visa
> versa. This prevents fuel leaking during banks.
Bill,
I don't think that leaking during banks is the main problem. After all this
should only happen during an uncoordinated bank maneuver such as a side
slip, or maybe a spin, etc..and these are all of relatively short duration.
(Also, my inspector required that the bottom of the vent tube be cut off to
a 45 degree angle facing forward to give a positive airpressure into the
tank during flight... if that helps stop overflow, I don't know.. maybe?)
The bigger nuisance is probably the overflow from a tank when it is full and
the aircraft is parked on an angle...? Solution - don't park the aircraft
with the tanks full - or park it on very level ground?
Grant
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Mark Sandidge" <MSandidge(at)peabodyenergy.com> |
03/18/2002 07:47:14 AM
I have been working on my canopy for the past several weeks and am about
finished. I installed the canopy to the tubes per ZAC instructions. Drilled
the plexi and installed nylon bushings then washers and screws and only
tightened with two fingers on screwdriver. After setting in the garage for
a few days with some temperature changes I noticed some small hair line
cracks around four of the holes where the canopy is screwed to the 3/4"
tube. There are several at each hole and are about 5mm long in 180 deg
pattern.
Is this normal? They were not there when I drilled the holes. Any
suggestions?
Thanks
Mark Sandidge
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Kafka, Jeff" <JKafka(at)trojanuv.com> |
I don't feel so bad now. I have been dithering on the decision to buy 601XL
plans for about 1 year, and am proceeding toward building a rudder from the
plans available online (plus the current amendment list the Mark circulated
a while back). I have been making small fittings from extrusions as reveled
in the online sample plans (for practice and hoping the plans are accurate
for those parts).
So far my plane fits in one zip-loc bag with room to spare.
My latest indulgence was to find and buy a 4'x4' piece of .016" 6061T6.
Yesterday I completed a Rudder Rear Rib #4 using a forming block, cut with
an electric jigsaw (not as good as a band saw, but did the job well) but
working it down to the final dimensions by hand (files and sanding block---a
losing proposition) and then making a 10 degree bevel by hand. End result
was a rib whose dimensions are very close to spec (within 1mm) angles look
close, and flanges are "kind of" straight -either my hammering technique or
my form is defective), plus there was an unfortunate incident with the
vise....after 4 hours I had something I convinced myself was OK to use (I
figure the riveting process will deal with the slightly less than straight
flanges.
I am going back to revisit the plans I have for a bending brake!
Jeff Kafka
Prospective 601XL Plans
-----Original Message-----
From: Matthew Mucker [mailto:matthew(at)mucker.net]
Subject: RE: Zenith-List: first milestone
Carlos,
You ever plannin' on flyin' that thing? :)
I've been in the "preparing to start building" stage for three years now,
but suddenly my pace doesn't seem so slow!
I'm certain, however, that you're going to end up with one beautiful bird.
I hope to see it when it's done.
-Matt
> Hello, all
>
>
> I finally have something to show for all the $ and time spent: the
> rudder was completed last night and received its final polish today. I'm
> impressed with it, even though I always thought of it as a "no big deal"
> part - people build it in one weekend, don't they. Right. Big learning
> curve there, particularly if scratch building. But what do I know,
> there's a whole aeroplane waiting to be built - less rudder, of
> course... :o)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Dave Austin" <daveaustin2(at)sprint.ca> |
Mark, mine did the same thing on several holes. I drilled 1/16 stop holes
just beyond the visible end of each crack. They've stayed ok for seven
years now.
Dave Austin 601HDS - 912
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Dave Austin" <daveaustin2(at)sprint.ca> |
| Subject: | Re: first milestone |
Jeff, make sure those flanges are really true at the proposed rivetting
locations (where you are going to drill the holes) or your panels will be
pulled out of shape when you rivet.
Dave Austin 601HDS - 912
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | David Terrell <dl_terrell(at)yahoo.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Zenith-List Digest: 13 Msgs - 03/17/02 |
Subject: Zenith-List: Oil Filter Wrench
If you are taking the filter off to replace it and
can't break it loose with your hands, just drive a
screwdriver through it and use the screw driver to
break it free... Yes its a bit messy, but...
Of course, if you want to save the filter for future
use, you'll need to be a bit craftier...
For you 601 Stratus flyers,
I was trying to get my oil filter wrench on my Stratus
oil filter today
without any luck. Just not enough clearance between
the filter end, and
the lower engine mount to get my steel band wrench
(about 1" wide) to
slide on.
What style wrench is everyone else out there using for
this job?
Thanks for any tips on this!
http://sports.yahoo.com/
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Don Walker" <dwalk3dw(at)msn.com> |
When I drilled those holes, I spent a lot of time sanding the holes extremely smooth..no
rough spots on the edges...no cracks in 4 years and they
are screwed down firmly...I think that may be critical to minimize cracking. Don
----- Original Message -----
From: Dave Austin
Subject: Re: Zenith-List: canopy
Mark, mine did the same thing on several holes. I drilled 1/16 stop holes
just beyond the visible end of each crack. They've stayed ok for seven
years now.
Dave Austin 601HDS - 912
=
=
=
=
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "P. L. Jenkins" <capt_over(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | Horizontal Stab Tips |
I'm thinking something is wrong here, but I just want to make sure. I have
the fiberglass tips for the horizontal stabilizer here, but they don't seem
to fit well at all. More specifically, it seems that the tips are too
narrow. There's about 5 to 7mm of space between where the skin overhangs
the end rib and the the rib tip... I'll get some pics of it here on my site
soon, but in the mean time, has anyone else run into this? Do just have bum
tips, or is this somehow intentional and I'm not seeing it? Thanks!
Paul Jenkins
601HDS - Working on tail
http://members.tripod.com/kb9vwj
Join the worlds largest e-mail service with MSN Hotmail.
http://www.hotmail.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Bill Steer" <bsteer(at)gwi.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Horizontal Stab Tips |
Yep, I had the same thing. I cut a piece of 2x4 to the shape of the rib, heated
the fiberglass tip with a hair dryer, inserted the rib-shaped piece of 2x4, and
let it cool. It fit fine after that.
Bill
----- Original Message -----
From: "P. L. Jenkins" <capt_over(at)hotmail.com>
Subject: Zenith-List: Horizontal Stab Tips
>
>
> I'm thinking something is wrong here, but I just want to make sure. I have
> the fiberglass tips for the horizontal stabilizer here, but they don't seem
> to fit well at all. More specifically, it seems that the tips are too
> narrow. There's about 5 to 7mm of space between where the skin overhangs
> the end rib and the the rib tip... I'll get some pics of it here on my site
> soon, but in the mean time, has anyone else run into this? Do just have bum
> tips, or is this somehow intentional and I'm not seeing it? Thanks!
>
> Paul Jenkins
> 601HDS - Working on tail
> http://members.tripod.com/kb9vwj
>
> Join the worlds largest e-mail service with MSN Hotmail.
> http://www.hotmail.com
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | richard priebus <rpriebus(at)yahoo.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Horizontal Stab Tips |
--- "P. L. Jenkins" wrote:
>
>
>
> I'm thinking something is wrong here, but I just
> want to make sure. I have
> the fiberglass tips for the horizontal stabilizer
> here, but they don't seem
> to fit well at all. More specifically, it seems
> that the tips are too
> narrow. There's about 5 to 7mm of space between
> where the skin overhangs
> the end rib and the the rib tip... I'll get some
> pics of it here on my site
> soon, but in the mean time, has anyone else run into
> this? Do just have bum
> tips, or is this somehow intentional and I'm not
> seeing it? Thanks!
>
> Paul Jenkins
> 601HDS - Working on tail
> http://members.tripod.com/kb9vwj
>
Hi Paul, I encountered the same problem with my
stabilizer. I drilled the holes as the plans said too
and clecoed them. It did not look as good as they
might if it where straight, but the slack was taken up
by the bottom and top so it evened out a little. If
all fails, I'll smooth it out with body filler.
Richard Priebus
rpriebus(at)yahoo.com
> Join the worlds largest e-mail service with MSN
> Hotmail.
> http://www.hotmail.com
>
>
>
> Contributions of
> any other form
>
> latest messages.
> other List members.
>
> http://www.matronics.com/subscription
> http://www.matronics.com/photoshare
> http://www.matronics.com/search
> http://www.matronics.com/archives
> http://www.matronics.com/emaillists
>
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Michel Therrien <mtherr(at)yahoo.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Horizontal Stab Tips |
I had that problem too. I suppose it would take too
much time to make a new form which would match the
shape of the stab... ;-)
I looked at my construction log book and found that I
reshaped the fairing with a heat gun. It now fits
nicely.
Michel
--- "P. L. Jenkins" wrote:
>
> I'm thinking something is wrong here, but I just
> want to make sure. I have
> the fiberglass tips for the horizontal stabilizer
> here, but they don't seem
> to fit well at all. More specifically, it seems
=====
----------------------------
Michel Therrien CH601-HD
http://pages.infinit.net/mthobby
http://mthobby.pcperfect.com/ch601
http://sports.yahoo.com/
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | JEEdmondson(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | contributers video? |
has anyone received their video for contributions of $ 50.00 or more to the
list?
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Todd Osborne" <todd(at)toddtown.com> |
| Subject: | Bondo for seams? |
Does anyone have any good/bad experiences using Bondo body filler to
fill the seams between skins and structural members? For instance, I am
wanting a smooth finish on my rudder skin to the upper and lower ribs.
Not much mud, but enough to make the skin flows into the ribs.
Todd Osborne
Internet E-Mail: todd(at)toddtown.com
AOL Messenger: toddosborn
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Pinneo, George" <George.Pinneo(at)trw.com> |
| Subject: | Bondo for seams? |
Don't use Bondo; it won't stay on and it adds weight!
GGP
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Gary Liming <gary(at)liming.org> |
I just had a frustrating call to Avemco, the insurance company that the EAA
seems to promote - they no longer will insure Zenith CH601's, CH701's, or
CH801's. as of a couple of weeks ago! I called them to find out what the
difference might be between a stock O-360 and a XP-360, and I guess it sure
won't matter now.
I can't understand why the EAA has such strong ties to a company that won't
insure kitplanes that have such a good safety record.
Could someone tell me who else I might take a look at?
Thanks,
Gary Liming
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Bill Steer" <bsteer(at)gwi.net> |
AIG has been mentioned in the past few months. I don't have their number, but
think you can find it in the archives.
Bill
----- Original Message -----
From: "Gary Liming" <gary(at)liming.org>
Subject: Zenith-List: Insurance
>
>
> I just had a frustrating call to Avemco, the insurance company that the EAA
> seems to promote - they no longer will insure Zenith CH601's, CH701's, or
> CH801's. as of a couple of weeks ago! I called them to find out what the
> difference might be between a stock O-360 and a XP-360, and I guess it sure
> won't matter now.
>
> I can't understand why the EAA has such strong ties to a company that won't
> insure kitplanes that have such a good safety record.
>
> Could someone tell me who else I might take a look at?
>
> Thanks,
>
> Gary Liming
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Pinneo, George" <George.Pinneo(at)trw.com> |
AOPA uses AIG; it saved me money.
GGP
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "zodiacjeff" <zodiacjeff(at)email.msn.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Horizontal Stab Tips |
> I'm thinking something is wrong here, but I just want to make sure. I
have
> the fiberglass tips for the horizontal stabilizer here, but they don't
seem
> to fit well at all. Do I just have bum tips, or is this somehow
intentional...
Doubt if they're either bum or intentional. Most fiberglass parts of this
nature taken from a female mold will curl a little and that's what you're
facing - most of us had the same problem.
+Yep, I had the same thing. I cut a piece of 2x4 to the shape of the rib,
heated
+the fiberglass tip with a hair dryer, inserted the rib-shaped piece of 2x4,
and
+let it cool. It fit fine after that.
Bill suggests a great cure here and it's worked for many builders - pixs can
be found in the ZAC Photo Directories somewhere - sorry, can't remember
which one. You can make one from a 2x4 (bandsaw is almost a must) a piece
of 3/4 ply (ditto on the bandsaw), or a cheap piece of 1/4 ply or leftover
paneling (which was done here). Bills' 2x4 allows both tips to be done at
the same time. Hair dryer or safe heat source in the shop will restore them
very close to what you want. Many of you are still heating the shop with a
supplemental source and sitting them near the kerosene heater will work -
keep a close eye on the process and start further away than you think will
work, gradually moving closer.
Here's another suggestion: I still wasn't pleased with the fit so the front
third of the 1/4 ply rib template (made by holding up to the end of the stab
and tracing around, then cutting just inside the mark) was forced into place
and epoxied there. For the back two-thirds take a piece of 3/4 or one-inch
builders foam (green, blue or pink), press it against the elevator end(s)
and extend the lines forward a bit to include an inch or two of the stab
area. Cut this on the bandsaw (how can you build without a bandsaw?), wedge
into place and make a trial fit into the tip. If ok then glue in with some
epoxy smeared inside, but allow about 1/16 to stick up above the sides of
the fiberglass tip. When the epoxy dries you take your file/big sanding
block and remove the excess. Nice flat surface, right?
Now take a layer of heavy glass cloth (8 oz. or more) and epoxy to the foam.
You don't even need laminating epoxy, the 6 or 30 minute stuff you have on
hand works fine. If you've never done glass work before brush the epoxy on
the foam and lay the glass atop. Use your epoxy brush (those cheap 25 cent
jobs usually called acid brushes) to push the glass onto the foam allowing
the epoxy to come up through the weave. You usually don't need to brush on
any more. Allow to cure completely, don't worry about trimming edges yet,
but don't get sloppy and get excess epoxy and fibers down on the sides;
you're making extra work for yourself.
Don't have the little bit of glass needed for this? How about an R/C
modeling friend or visit the local boat sales/repair business.
Cured? Get out large sanding block with #80 grit or so and go to cutting
off the glass on the sides and trimming them up. Try not to cut into the
gel coat. A little sanding on the flat surface will show if you need to
apply an additional coat of epoxy - most of which you will end up sanding
away.
That's all that's to it. It may sound like a lot of time but it isn't.
While waiting for the epoxy/glass to set up you go to other projects.
Typically, glass work in Area 41 is something done early and then late in
the shop day, other things get done in between (sometimes). This might add
three hours to the building log but the visual results are well worth it
IMHO. Just think, when you walk up to the tail of your bird and see a
finished, smooth stabilizer tip instead of the aluminum-riveted-in-rib of
the plans, you'll consider it worth the effort.
(I know, I'm crazy, but these little things are the parts of the project I
love.)
Then...you take the aluminum ribs that you didn't use for the stab tips and
with a little modification you put them into the elevator cutouts for the
rudder. Voila, another hole filled in.
The same foam pressed into the drag making hole under the rudder front skin
(then covered in glass) is another project that only takes about two hours
but should yield some drag reduction. Just fasten in with silicone.
Paul, sending you a jpg of finished tips before installation. If anyone
else would like them contact off list.
Regards Jeff SnailWorks East
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bill Morelli <billvt(at)together.net> |
Gary,
I would go to two places. If you are an AOPA member, call them and they
will give you a quote. Also try SkySmith at 800-743-1439 or www.skysmith.com
Now you would think that AOPA could get the insurance cheaper from the same
underwriter but in my case, Skysmith was cheaper. I had insurance (full
coverage) last year through AOPA and it was underwritten by AIG. They sent
me a renewal and the insurance went up substantially even though I now have
over 100 flight hours in my HDS and had zero flight hours last year when
they first insured me. When I questioned AOPA and mentioned my numerous
incdent free flight hours in my HDS they said it did not matter, ALL
insurance rates are going up. That answer pissed me of so I checked with
Skysmith and they got me the same exact coverage through AIG and it was
$70.00 cheaper than the AOPA quote! While I think AOPA does a great job
(especially throughout this post 9/11 period) I got a bit ticked off that
they were going to charge me more than an independent agent (Skysmith) for
the same insurance underwritten by the same company!!! Just on general
principals I would have gone with SkySmith if it was $1.00 cheaper.
And that is my sad story.
Regards,
Bill (N812BM - HDS - Tri - Stratus - Vermont - 120.2 flight hrs.)
web site -> http://homepages.together.net/~billvt/
>I just had a frustrating call to Avemco, the insurance company that the EAA
>seems to promote - they no longer will insure Zenith CH601's, CH701's, or
>CH801's. as of a couple of weeks ago! I called them to find out what the
>difference might be between a stock O-360 and a XP-360, and I guess it sure
>won't matter now.
>
>I can't understand why the EAA has such strong ties to a company that won't
>insure kitplanes that have such a good safety record.
>
>Could someone tell me who else I might take a look at?
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "John Maselli - Starband" <jmaselli(at)starband.net> |
I used AIG to insure my cherokee B they are a fine company nice to work
with! Hope they will insure the 801
----- Original Message -----
From: "Bill Steer" <bsteer(at)gwi.net>
Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Insurance
>
> AIG has been mentioned in the past few months. I don't have their number,
but
> think you can find it in the archives.
>
> Bill
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Gary Liming" <gary(at)liming.org>
> To:
> Subject: Zenith-List: Insurance
>
>
> >
> >
> > I just had a frustrating call to Avemco, the insurance company that the
EAA
> > seems to promote - they no longer will insure Zenith CH601's, CH701's,
or
> > CH801's. as of a couple of weeks ago! I called them to find out what
the
> > difference might be between a stock O-360 and a XP-360, and I guess it
sure
> > won't matter now.
> >
> > I can't understand why the EAA has such strong ties to a company that
won't
> > insure kitplanes that have such a good safety record.
> >
> > Could someone tell me who else I might take a look at?
> >
> > Thanks,
> >
> > Gary Liming
> >
> >
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Darryl West (Home)" <rdwest(at)shaw.ca> |
Hi Gary:
Just wondering, are you in the USA? Avemco Canada stopped insuring my
CH601HD last November. No reason. I then went to COPA and actually saved
some money.
Darryl
rdwest(at)shaw.ca
http://members.shaw.ca/rdwest/index.htm
I just had a frustrating call to Avemco, the insurance company that the EAA
seems to promote - they no longer will insure Zenith CH601's, CH701's, or
CH801's. as of a couple of weeks ago! I called them to find out what the
difference might be between a stock O-360 and a XP-360, and I guess it sure
won't matter now.
I can't understand why the EAA has such strong ties to a company that won't
insure kitplanes that have such a good safety record.
Could someone tell me who else I might take a look at?
Thanks,
Gary Liming
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | rico vosso <vozzen(at)yahoo.com> |
> Avemco Canada
> stopped insuring my
> CH601HD last November.
I was beginning to wonder whether the timing of
Avemco's refusal to insure Zeniths was related to the
overturned 601, recently pictured here. Only
coincidence, I'm sure.....
QUESTION: Is the tie-down system strong enough, or
was that a freak storm that flipped the plane?
http://sports.yahoo.com/
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Mark Townsend" <601xl(at)sympatico.ca> |
Wind gusted to 100 kms and the yellow rope was 3 years old. The planes tie
down ring is still intact, it was the neglected rope that broke. The plane
was not insured.
Mark Townsend
601XL EA-82
-----Original Message-----
From: rico vosso <vozzen(at)yahoo.com>
Date: Tuesday, March 19, 2002 1:46 AM
Subject: RE: Zenith-List: Insurance
>
>
>> Avemco Canada
>> stopped insuring my
>> CH601HD last November.
>
>I was beginning to wonder whether the timing of
>Avemco's refusal to insure Zeniths was related to the
>overturned 601, recently pictured here. Only
>coincidence, I'm sure.....
>
>QUESTION: Is the tie-down system strong enough, or
>was that a freak storm that flipped the plane?
>
>http://sports.yahoo.com/
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Gil Jennings" <gjennings(at)mail1.com> |
| Subject: | RE: Zenith-List Digest: 13 Msgs - 03/17/02 |
>From: Bill Morelli <billvt(at)together.net>
>Subject: Zenith-List: LE wing tanks
>
>My local A&P mechanic says that the fuel will leak out of this type
>of vent
>when the aircraft is banked. He said that the method used in the
>certified
>world is to run the vent from the left tank to the right wing and
>visa
Seems to me that one wouldn't have to run the vent all the way to the
opposite wing. Gas can't rise any higher than the level of fuel in
the tank, so it would seem to me that running the vent a few inches
higher than the highest edge of the fuel tank in a banking
configuration would work.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Peter Chapman <pchapman(at)ionsys.com> |
| Subject: | your 601 spreadsheet |
Hi Charles,
Would you mind sending me a copy of your 601 performance spreadsheet again?
While I don't have the time to play much with it now, I lost the last
couple months worth of emails in a hard drive crash, so I lost the most
recent version of your file.
Peter Chapman
Toronto, ON 601 HDS / 912 / C-GZDC
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Cliffsuss(at)aol.com |
"The plane was not insured"
Ouch.....that's a shame
Cliff
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Kevin Kinney <kkinney(at)fuse.net> |
| Subject: | Re:Bondo for seams? |
> Does anyone have any good/bad experiences using Bondo body filler to
> fill the seams between skins and structural members?
First - I'm using West Systems epoxy with the microlite filler. It's far lighter
than Bondo and that means something when you're talking about the tail. It's
stronger and from what I'm told, won't shrink like Bondo.
I picked up a maxi-repair kit for the little I've done thus far. I patched up
a little gap between the LE skin & top rib on my rudder. The gaps in my stab
& fiberglass tips are next.
(OPINION ALERT!!)
Second - You're going to use it where? Between the skin & ribs? I haven't heard
of this before. It's just my opinion, but I can't think of a good reason to
do this and can think of many, many reasons NOT to do this.
1) Moving the skin away from a rib will increase torque on the rivet, increasing
the load demands on each rivet.
2) With much movement, Bondo or epoxy will crumble, leaving you with badly seated
rivets and loose skins.
3) Bondo & epoxy expand and contract at different temperatures, meaning the skin
may buckle or deform at heat/cold extremes.
I assume you're trying to get rid of the wavy skin Zenith aircraft are prone to?
From what little, I know I'm not sure there is a remedy to that.
Why do you want to put anything between ribs & skin?
Todd, I honestly think this might be a question better addressed to Nick.
Regards,
Kevin Kinney
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Mark Townsend" <601xl(at)sympatico.ca> |
IT would be if it were you or me but most people are saying "Time wounds all
Heels" .
-----Original Message-----
>
>"The plane was not insured"
>
>Ouch.....that's a shame
>
>Cliff
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "David Tanner" <vk3auu(at)vic.australis.com.au> |
| Subject: | Re:Bondo for seams? |
If you have this type of problem, then you should put shims of thin sheet,
the width of the rib, underneath the skin on top of the rib. I think Chris
has made reference to this somewhere. Just make sure you have enough rivet
showing through to form a head. Again if I remember correctly the
specifications for the total thickness allowed for both A4 and A5 rivets is
in there somewhere.
David Tanner.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Kevin Kinney" <kkinney(at)fuse.net>
Subject: Zenith-List: Re:Bondo for seams?
>
> > Does anyone have any good/bad experiences using Bondo body filler to
> > fill the seams between skins and structural members?
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Todd Osborne" <todd(at)toddtown.com> |
| Subject: | Re:Bondo for seams? |
No, not BETWEEN the skin and ribs, where the skins overlap on top of the
top and bottom rib, the exposed part.
Todd Osborne
Internet E-Mail: todd(at)toddtown.com
AOL Messenger: toddosborn
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-zenith-list-server(at)matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-zenith-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of
> Kevin Kinney
> Sent: Tuesday, March 19, 2002 3:08 PM
> To: zenith-list(at)matronics.com
> Subject: Zenith-List: Re:Bondo for seams?
>
>
>
> > Does anyone have any good/bad experiences using Bondo body
> filler to
> > fill the seams between skins and structural members?
>
> First - I'm using West Systems epoxy with the microlite
> filler. It's far lighter than Bondo and that means something
> when you're talking about the tail. It's stronger and from
> what I'm told, won't shrink like Bondo. I picked up a
> maxi-repair kit for the little I've done thus far. I patched
> up a little gap between the LE skin & top rib on my rudder.
> The gaps in my stab & fiberglass tips are next.
>
> (OPINION ALERT!!)
> Second - You're going to use it where? Between the skin &
> ribs? I haven't heard of this before. It's just my opinion,
> but I can't think of a good reason to do this and can think
> of many, many reasons NOT to do this.
> 1) Moving the skin away from a rib will increase torque on
> the rivet, increasing the load demands on each rivet.
> 2) With much movement, Bondo or epoxy will crumble, leaving
> you with badly seated rivets and loose skins.
> 3) Bondo & epoxy expand and contract at different
> temperatures, meaning the skin may buckle or deform at
> heat/cold extremes.
>
> I assume you're trying to get rid of the wavy skin Zenith
> aircraft are prone to? From what little, I know I'm not sure
> there is a remedy to that.
>
> Why do you want to put anything between ribs & skin?
>
> Todd, I honestly think this might be a question better
> addressed to Nick.
>
>
> Regards,
> Kevin Kinney
>
>
> ===========
> ===========
> ===========
> http://www.matronics.com/browselist/zenith-> list
> Search Engine: http://www.matronics.com/search
>
> ===========
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bill Morelli <billvt(at)together.net> |
| Subject: | Wing Locker Doors |
For those of you still building, I just added a photo to my web site of my
left wing locker door in flight. It shows how much the door lifts due to
the negative pressure over the wing. I made some mods to the door as
described on the web site. It was my understanding that without some
modification, the wing locker doors have a large bulge during flight. The
lifting you see in the photo is pretty minimal.
Follow the link "Filler Neck fairings & Wing Locker Door" to see the photo.
Regards,
Bill (N812BM - HDS - Tri - Stratus - Vermont - 120.2 flight hrs. - 182
landings)
web site -> http://homepages.together.net/~billvt/
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Brent Battles <brentbattles(at)pipeline.com> |
FWIW . . . I carry only liability: $1M per occurrence, $100K per
passenger, $1K medical per passenger or crew. Cost last year was $430,
this year (February renewal) it is $470. My 601HD is insured with a local
independent agent through Arlington/Roe Co., Inc. which is apparently a
"managing general agent" and "surplus lines broker" with underlying carrier
being ANPAC this year and Nobel Insurance Company last year.
Brent Battles N16BZ 206 hrs
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Kilby, Roger" <Roger.Kilby(at)DynCorp.com> |
Gary,
Give AIG a call. They are at 1-800-825-2828 or 800-654-4215.
I would also give Scott Smith of SkySmith Insurance a call at: (515)
289-1439.
Roger Kilby
N98RK 601HDS
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Fred or Sandy Hulen" <hulens61(at)birch.net> |
| Subject: | Insurance from Avemco |
* I just got off the phone from talking to Avemco and EAA headquarters
regarding insuring Zenith Aircraft. EAA told me that Avemco was going
through some sort of re-organization and re-evaluation of experimental
aircraft, and that they (EAA) didn't know much more than that for now. They
have been receiving phone calls and messages but wouldn't give me anything
more than "we'll be happy to let you know more after Avemco gives us more
information". I left my e-address,... we'll see.
Then.... I called Avemco, and talked to a fellow by the name of Chris. He
confirmed that they were not able to offer quotes or offer coverage on my
601HDS. He wasn't offering anything other than an answer to each question,
so I asked him for a direct answer to "WHY?", and he him-hawed around a bit
and mentioned higher claims from the Experimental aircraft category, and
indicated that they were "re-evaluating" the "Experimental" group of
aircraft.
* So,... I mentioned a friend of mine that is building an RV-8, and asked if
they were still writing insurance for that one. He fumbled around a bit and
finally said that for now, he wouldn't be able to offer a quote on the RV-8
either. That at least made me feel better knowing that it's not just Zenith
aircraft that is being excluded.
So there you have it.... The most expensive insurer, directly linked up
with the "Experimental" Aircraft Association is NOT offering insurance on
our aircraft or an RV-8. I would think that more kit-planes are also
effected, but I only asked about the RV as I knew it had a really good track
record.
Fred
Area 41 Snailworks
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Fred or Sandy Hulen" <hulens61(at)birch.net> |
| Subject: | Insurance from Avemco |
** Update...
I copied this from a message I just received from a Sonex builder that
called Avemco:
++++++++++++++++++++++++
They won't write a policy for the Sonex either,
because of "excessive losses paid". I called their
bluff on that one, because nobody has filed any claims
for a broken Sonex yet! She quickly back-pedalled,
saying "excessive for experimentals in general".
The long and short of it is she said to call back in a
couple of weeks, and they should have the
re-evaluation finished by then and have new
underwriting guidelines in place.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Thilo Kind" <thilo.kind(at)freemail.de> |
| Subject: | Re: Wing Locker Doors |
That's pretty much what mine look during flight, although I stiffened the
doors up with L-angle as well. Next time I build the 601 I would re-consider
the baggage compartments. There is a lot of room on the baggage shelf and
the doors create at least some drag bulking up in flight.
Thilo Kind
----- Original Message -----
From: "Bill Morelli" <billvt(at)together.net>
Subject: Zenith-List: Wing Locker Doors
>
> For those of you still building, I just added a photo to my web site of my
> left wing locker door in flight. It shows how much the door lifts due to
> the negative pressure over the wing. I made some mods to the door as
> described on the web site. It was my understanding that without some
> modification, the wing locker doors have a large bulge during flight. The
> lifting you see in the photo is pretty minimal.
>
> Follow the link "Filler Neck fairings & Wing Locker Door" to see the
photo.
>
> Regards,
> Bill (N812BM - HDS - Tri - Stratus - Vermont - 120.2 flight hrs. - 182
> landings)
> web site -> http://homepages.together.net/~billvt/
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Pinneo, George" <George.Pinneo(at)trw.com> |
| Subject: | Wing Locker Doors |
I don't get any 'bulge' in flight w/ my wing locker doors. I use 8 Dzeus on each
and have L-angle stiffeners.
GGP
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Todd Osborne" <todd(at)toddtown.com> |
Let the letters flow: Here are copies of letters I sent to Avemco and
EAA today:
To Avemco:
SUBJECT:
I hope EAA severs all ties with your lame company
MESSAGE:
You should be ashamed of yourselves and your recent actions against
experimental aircraft. I have been a member of EAA for many years and am
encouraging them to take immediate action by not only dropping their
association with Avemco, but also come out publicy against your company.
To EAA:
SUBJECT:
EAA should sever all ties with Avemco
MESSAGE:
From Todd Osborne, EAA #347188
It has recently come to my attention that Avemco is no longer insuring
experimental aircraft, refusing to accept new policies and cancelling
existing ones. They are claiming a higher number of claims made against
experimental aircraft as their reason. I feel their refusal to insure
experimental aircraft alone is justification for EAA to immediately
sever all ties with Avemco, and make a public announcement in all EAA
publications denouncing Avemco, possibly providing information on
insurance companies that will treat homebuilders and other experimental
owners/builders with the respect and service they deserve. It would be a
sad day for the EAA to embrace a company that is apparently
anti-Experimental aircraft. Thanks,
Todd Osborne
Internet E-Mail: todd(at)toddtown.com
AOL Messenger: toddosborn
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Gary Liming <gary(at)liming.org> |
To Zenith List,
I wrote to the EAA as below, and I did get this response from Joe Norris of
the EAA:
>From: Joe Norris <jnorris(at)eaa.org>
>To: 'Gary Liming'
>Subject: RE: Avemco/EAA ties
>Date: Tue, 19 Mar 2002 17:49:24 -0600
>X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19)
>
>Gary,
>
>Thanks for your note, and I appreciate your situation and feelings. The
>fact is, Avemco is currently undergoing some major management changes, and
>has recently made some decisions on insurance without EAA's knowledge. In
>fact, we were made aware of the situation through a call from a member, and
>were just as surprised as you are now.
>
>Please understand that EAA is working hard to rectify this situation, or
>find alternate solutions. Officials from Avemco are coming to EAA
>headquarters early next week, and we plan on having some serious discussions
>with them regarding all manner of aviation insurance. We hope to be able to
>find solutions to the immediate problem, and to assure that similar problems
>won't come up in the future.
>
>We are also looking at what other alternatives might be available to us.
>However, we don't have any solid info to pass along at this time. I ask for
>your patience in this frustrating time, and hope that you'll keep a close
>watch on the EAA web site and Sport Aviation magazine for news of
>developments on this issue.
>
>Please let me know if you have further questions or comments.
>
>Joe Norris
>EAA Aviation Information Services
>EAA Aviation Center, Oshkosh, WI
>888-322-4636, extension 6806
>jnorris(at)eaa.org
>-----Original Message-----
>From: Gary Liming [mailto:gary(at)liming.org]
>Sent: Monday, March 18, 2002 5:35 PM
>To: infoserv(at)eaa.org
>Subject: Avemco/EAA ties
>
>I just had a dissapointing call to Avemco.
>
>I am currently building a Zenith CH801 (that's the one whose panel is
>displayed on the main page of the Homebuilders website banner.) and am
>getting ready to make the engine selection. I hope to fly it to Airventure
>next year for the First Flight program.
>
>I picked the Zenith CH801 because Zenith has such a good safety record
>(never had a structural failure) and they have such good safety and
>completion records.
>
>I called Avemco because they are promoted by the EAA web site and
>participate in the EAA Flight Advisors and Tech Counselor programs.
>
>Imagine my surprise when I was told that Avemco no longer will insure any
>of the kit planes offered by Zenith! They said they will still insure a
>few of the RV's, but they were cutting back on writing any policies for
>them, too.
>
>If Avemco wants to get out of the kitplane insurance business, that's their
>decision. I can't understand why the EAA would promote Avemco on their
>website when they are refusing to underwrite policies for their
>homebuilders. Could you explain to me what is going on?
>
>Please note that I am not building anything unusual - a standard Zenith kit
>with a certified engine.
>
>Can the EAA offer me any help for insuring my plane?
>
>Thanks,
>
>Gary Liming
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Mark Townsend" <601xl(at)sympatico.ca> |
Hi Guys I need some opinions. I just got my hands on a EA-82 MPFI turbo
with all wires, puter, intake, exhaust and panel. Engine has 35,000 miles
on it and car has tree laying across trunk( car totaled). Question is that
I'm building a 601XL and had planned on building a re-drive for my EA-82
SPFI but would I be OK to go direct drive now with a turbo? The weight
penalty from one EA to the other is a bit but I like the idea of a turbo
under the bonnet. Any suggestions would be well received !
Mark Townsend
601XL EA-82 MPFI Turbo
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Don Walker" <dwalk3dw(at)msn.com> |
the EA-82 is more powerful in the car than the 81, but could still use some hopping
up for your plane. My friend Joe, an engineer, has one on his
gyro. He flew direct for a while then put on a redrive...his thrust increased
significantly. Problem with the EA-82 may be that it is a couple inches wider
than the EA-81, which already is too wide for the stock cowl. My guess is that
you could easily get 115 h.p. or more out of that engine if you can make it
fit. Joe dogs his out like hell....he flies it wide open all the time and doesn't
think a thing about it...tuff little engine. Don Walker Stratus HDS 200plus
hrs
----- Original Message -----
From: Mark Townsend
Subject: Zenith-List: New Engine
Hi Guys I need some opinions. I just got my hands on a EA-82 MPFI turbo
with all wires, puter, intake, exhaust and panel. Engine has 35,000 miles
on it and car has tree laying across trunk( car totaled). Question is that
I'm building a 601XL and had planned on building a re-drive for my EA-82
SPFI but would I be OK to go direct drive now with a turbo? The weight
penalty from one EA to the other is a bit but I like the idea of a turbo
under the bonnet. Any suggestions would be well received !
Mark Townsend
601XL EA-82 MPFI Turbo
=
=
=
=
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "HINDE,FRANK (HP-Corvallis,ex1)" <frank_hinde(at)hp.com> |
Get on the "Airsoob" list at Yahoo groups.
A few folks have been using the EA 82 both in DD and redrive configuration.
I now of a few EA 81's DD turbos as well.
Frank
Hi Guys I need some opinions. I just got my hands on a EA-82 MPFI turbo
with all wires, puter, intake, exhaust and panel. Engine has 35,000 miles
on it and car has tree laying across trunk( car totaled). Question is that
I'm building a 601XL and had planned on building a re-drive for my EA-82
SPFI but would I be OK to go direct drive now with a turbo? The weight
penalty from one EA to the other is a bit but I like the idea of a turbo
under the bonnet. Any suggestions would be well received !
Mark Townsend
601XL EA-82 MPFI Turbo
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Insurance from Avemco |
| From: | "Matthew P. Cummings" <cummings(at)stingray.net> |
"Fred or Sandy Hulen" wrote:
> because of "excessive losses paid". I called their
> bluff on that one, because nobody has filed any claims
> for a broken Sonex yet! She quickly back-pedalled,
And lets not forget they're the ones who won't write for commercial
usage as in flight schools either, again as they say, too many losses.
What they really want to insure is a hangar queen. I wonder what the
real numbers are? They sent me a survey after I didn't renew with them
and I let them know how I felt their actions justified me finding other
insurers.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | TOMGILES(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Wing Locker Doors |
On my HDS my right wing locker door doesn't bulge but the left one does to
the rear of the center Dzus fasteners. I have a single angle, parallel to
the spar in the center of the door. Recommendation when building, pull them
aft tightly before putting in the fasteners. Make sure there is no slack in
the door and it will go a long way to correcting the problem.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Tom Prugh & Evanne Browne <tomvan(at)erols.com> |
Hi Listers,
I'm about to mount the leading edge skin to my 601 rudder. The pre-bent
skin has a pretty small radius on the leading edge, much tighter than
the radiuses of the tip rib and the nose rib, and it won't be a snug fit
without some forcing. How tightly is the skin supposed to conform to the
ribs here? (I assume very tight, just like the wing leading edge skin
and ribs.) Nick H. suggested standing the rudder up on the trailing edge
and more or less cramming the skin against the ribs, then duct-taping
the thing in place while drilling the rivet line. Is that what y'all
have done on your own rudders? Or is there a better way?
Thanks for any suggestions.
Tom Prugh
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Larry C. McFarland" <larrymc(at)qconline.com> |
Mark,
You need a redrive, because the engine cannot turn a large enough
prop at the RPMs that develop real HP. You'll get speed,
but will have long takeoffs, which is the wrong end of things
for a 601 series plane. There are lots of them. I bought a Stratus,
but there is a gear type (expensive) that puts the Soob prop flange
on center with the crank about where a Lycoming would be.
Eggenfelder I think.
Happy hunting
Larry C. McFarland- 601hds @ macsmachine.com
----- Original Message -----
From: "Mark Townsend" <601xl(at)sympatico.ca>
Subject: Zenith-List: New Engine
>
> Hi Guys I need some opinions. I just got my hands on a EA-82 MPFI turbo
> with all wires, puter, intake, exhaust and panel. Engine has 35,000 miles
> on it and car has tree laying across trunk( car totaled). Question is that
> I'm building a 601XL and had planned on building a re-drive for my EA-82
> SPFI but would I be OK to go direct drive now with a turbo? The weight
> penalty from one EA to the other is a bit but I like the idea of a turbo
> under the bonnet. Any suggestions would be well received !
>
> Mark Townsend
> 601XL EA-82 MPFI Turbo
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Oil Filter Wrench |
I use a simple oil filter wrench you should be able to buy at any autoparts
outlet. This wrench is for small oil filters. I will try to describe it
without showing a picture. It looks like two 90-degree pieces of metal
joined together by a bolt and some mechanism such that when turning the bolt
with a wrench, the two 90-degree bends come closer together. For each
90-degree piece, one side is flat and the other side is bent in such a way
that the edges are curved. The flat sides of two 90-degree pieces are joined
together by the above mentioned bolt and when the bolt is turned, the curved
sides bite into the filter to grip the filter so you can turn it with your
socket wrench (7/8" or so socket) and a longer extension. I hope this
helps. It works great for removing filters in my EA-81 Soob.
Dick (601-HDS, 102 hours)
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Subaru Oil Filter - Update |
Hello Subaru Owners!
I'd like to share an update on my search for the elusive oil filter for my
EA-81 Soob. As discussed in previous posts, the WIX 51065 filters are
getting harder to find. During my search, it is a fact that the 51065 and
clones will no longer be produced. There are other filters that are as small
as .4" longer that can be used, such as the NAPA 1056 filters, that will
screw onto the Soob engine, but they are just too long to fit between the
adapter and the engine mount.
I visited a CarQuest outlet to pick up their last CarQuest 85065 filter,
which is exactly the same at the Wix 51065 filter, and they confirmed that
the filter is no longer produced. They did say that a Michigan warehouse had
about 161 85065 filters, so I ordered 10 filters, at $7.60 each. With the
filter I bought today, the 10 I ordered, and the new filter recently
installed on my engine, at 102 hours, I am good until 700 hours. I didn't
order any more because it's hard to say where I'll be when I reach 700 hours.
Hopefully by then, there will be a way to alter the makeup of the oil filter
attachment to allow use of the longer filters, like the NAPA 1056.
You might do well to call CarQuest and get those 85065's from the Michigan
warehouse.
I was at a tractor store the other day and they sell Luber Finer oil filters.
I found one filter (PH3656) that is the exact same size as the Wix 51065
filter. They sell for less than $4 each. I wasn't impressed with the
quality of the filter, so I didn't buy one. Have anyone have any experience
with Luber Finer filters?
Everywhere I go, salesmen ask me for what car am I buying the filter for. I
always say that I modified a tractor with a Subaru 1800 cc engine and that I
had a lot of fun working on it. They are always helpful when I tell them
that. Such fun we have with our Soobs...
Dick (601-HDS)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Larry C. McFarland" <larrymc(at)qconline.com> |
| Subject: | Re: rudder question |
Tom,
You can undo a little of the radius by placing it down and spreading
the sides to widen the center. Cut a sample 3" piece to get the idea
of how much. Then, the nose skin should slide on and fit like a glove.
If you put too much pressure in the fit, the ribs will show thru at the
nose.
Larry C. McFarland 601hds @ macsmachine.com
----- Original Message -----
From: "Tom Prugh & Evanne Browne" <tomvan(at)erols.com>
Subject: Zenith-List: rudder question
>
> Hi Listers,
>
> I'm about to mount the leading edge skin to my 601 rudder. The pre-bent
> skin has a pretty small radius on the leading edge, much tighter than
> the radiuses of the tip rib and the nose rib, and it won't be a snug fit
> without some forcing. How tightly is the skin supposed to conform to the
> ribs here? (I assume very tight, just like the wing leading edge skin
> and ribs.) Nick H. suggested standing the rudder up on the trailing edge
> and more or less cramming the skin against the ribs, then duct-taping
> the thing in place while drilling the rivet line. Is that what y'all
> have done on your own rudders? Or is there a better way?
>
> Thanks for any suggestions.
>
> Tom Prugh
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Jim and Lucy <jpollard(at)mnsi.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Oil Filter Wrench |
I have a filter wrench that is most useful and will fit on any spin on filter.
Its very simple and you can make it yourself.
I bought mine but all it is a piece of square tubing 6 inches long.
The inside dimension fits over a half inch drive ratchet end.
One end of the wrench has nylon type strap on it in a loop big
enough to go over the largest of filters. To use it you loop the
strap around the filter then turn the steel tubing winding the
strap around the tube until it is tight around the filter. Then you
put the ratchet handle in the other end and continue turning
until the filter comes off. A bit hard to explain but if you have
a pop can sitting on your computer desk ... stand a pencil up
beside it. turning the pencil from one end tightens up the strap
by winding it up. It fits around anything you can get clearance
for the strap which is just about any filter. On hard to reach
filters you can put as many extensions on your ratchet to
reach into an engine compartment to get at. Much nicer
than poking a screwdriver through the filter to get a good
grip on hard turning filters. The harder the filter is to turn
the tighter the strap grips.
I have many different kinds but this one fits in all my applications.
Jim Pollard
ch601hds
ea81
plumbing
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Matthew Mucker" <matthew(at)mucker.net> |
> To Avemco:
>
> SUBJECT:
> I hope EAA severs all ties with your lame company
>
> MESSAGE:
> You should be ashamed of yourselves and your recent actions against
> experimental aircraft. I have been a member of EAA for many years and am
> encouraging them to take immediate action by not only dropping their
> association with Avemco, but also come out publicy against your company.
>
This is childish and petty.
The insurance companies are in business to make money. If claims exceed
their plans it's only natural for them to stop issuing policies until they
can figure out how things fit together.
Their dishonesty (or rather lack of disclosure) is what I find infinitely
more disturbing than the cessation of writing new policies.
Letters like this are not going to help. Statistical evidence that shows
experimentals are good insurance risks would be far more valuable in a
letter writing campaign.
-Matt
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Matthew Mucker" <matthew(at)mucker.net> |
| Subject: | Insurance from Avemco |
>
>
> "Fred or Sandy Hulen" wrote:
> > because of "excessive losses paid". I called their
> > bluff on that one, because nobody has filed any claims
> > for a broken Sonex yet! She quickly back-pedalled,
>
> And lets not forget they're the ones who won't write for commercial
> usage as in flight schools either, again as they say, too many losses.
>
> What they really want to insure is a hangar queen. I wonder what the
> real numbers are? They sent me a survey after I didn't renew with them
> and I let them know how I felt their actions justified me finding other
> insurers.
>
Well... DUH! Of course they'd want to insure a hagar queen. Wouldn't you,
if it were your money paid on claims? I know I would.
No one on this list has been able to offer any numbers on what Avemco's
claims rates are, yet people are quick to criticize and attack. Personally,
I find it quite plausible that the claims rates on experimentals are A)
probably higher than GA craft, and B) all over the board and very hard to
predict/generalize for an actuary.
Finding another insurer is probably the BEST way to let this company know
how you feel. Talk with your wallet!
-Matt
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Todd Osborne" <todd(at)toddtown.com> |
I agree my approach is somewhat childish, but so are their actions. I
also agree that their handling of this is also disturbing. But really,
for years they have made a living at least partially by their
association with the EAA. I would think that if statistical evidence
proves that experimentals are good risks, they would be aware of this. I
don't know, statistically, how experimentals compare to homebuilts, but
I would think that the pilot experience is much more of an issue than
the aircraft. If they are losing money, then the obvious (to me) thing
to do would be to raise rates. That is what other insurance companies do
for cars, etc. They base the premium on age/experience and type of car.
I don't really see how experimental (or any other) form of aviation is
any different.
I don't have a problem with them making money, and certainly understand
the business decisions they may have to make if they are losing money. I
don't agree with their method of doing it, nor with their sneaky and
underhanded dealing with their customers.
Todd Osborne
Internet E-Mail: todd(at)toddtown.com
AOL Messenger: toddosborn
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-zenith-list-server(at)matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-zenith-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of
> Matthew Mucker
> Sent: Thursday, March 21, 2002 12:25 AM
> To: zenith-list(at)matronics.com
> Subject: RE: Zenith-List: Letter Campaign
>
>
>
>
> > To Avemco:
> >
> > SUBJECT:
> > I hope EAA severs all ties with your lame company
> >
> > MESSAGE:
> > You should be ashamed of yourselves and your recent actions against
> > experimental aircraft. I have been a member of EAA for many
> years and
> > am encouraging them to take immediate action by not only dropping
> > their association with Avemco, but also come out publicy
> against your
> > company.
> >
>
> This is childish and petty.
>
> The insurance companies are in business to make money. If
> claims exceed their plans it's only natural for them to stop
> issuing policies until they can figure out how things fit together.
>
> Their dishonesty (or rather lack of disclosure) is what I
> find infinitely more disturbing than the cessation of writing
> new policies.
>
> Letters like this are not going to help. Statistical
> evidence that shows experimentals are good insurance risks
> would be far more valuable in a letter writing campaign.
>
> -Matt
>
>
> ===========
> ===========
> ===========
> http://www.matronics.com/browselist/zenith-> list
> Search Engine: http://www.matronics.com/search
>
> ===========
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Todd Osborne" <todd(at)toddtown.com> |
| Subject: | Of Rudders and Rivets... |
I am having a hard time determining where the bottommost rivet through
the rudder skin on the spar-line goes. Seems there need to be one down
there, with the fairing, to hold the fairing and skin tight to the
bottom. But, since the doubler is cut at an angle and the flange of RR
#1 ends at about the spar centerline, it does not look like a good place
to put a rivet. Appears the rivet would hold the skin on just fine, but
would certainly violate edge distances of a couple of parts, possibly
boogering the end of the doubler. What have you done about this?
Todd Osborne
Internet E-Mail: todd(at)toddtown.com
AOL Messenger: toddosborn
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | dixieshack(at)webtv.net (Mike and Dixie Shackelford) |
| Subject: | questions about scratch building a CH 701 |
I'd like to ask a couple questions about the 701 and what experiences
those of you have had in its construction from plans.
First, would you do it again, from plans I mean....no reference to
airplane.
How about build times? I know that's a BIG variable. I do have a
small shop with lathe, drill press, mill, power hack saw and welder.
It's not a first project (Kolb Firestar) but is a first all metal
undertaking.
Take-off performance with say, the 80 horse Jabiru or an EA-81 with psru
on a standard day (sea level at 59 degrees?) I currently use a 600 ft.
strip at home.
Difficulties during the build process.
Just thinking about my next project.
Thanks a bunch
Mike Shackelford in West Virginia
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Garrou, Douglas" <dgarrou(at)hunton.com> |
Whether or not a Zenith or a Sonex or an RV has had an accident is almost
certainly immaterial. My guess is that Avemco's real problem isn't "excess
losses paid in the homebuilt market," it's "excess losses incurred in the
stock market." Insurance companies invest our premium dollars, and when
they don't make money on those investments, they can get real squeezed real
quick. So they either yank up premiums or dump less profitable lines of
business. Or both.
Put another way, ANY losses in the homebuilt or flight training markets
probably look "excessive" when Avemco's underlying investments aren't making
money. Avemco probably figures that it has to bust its business back to the
really profitable things (which MUST include my overpriced renter's
insurance, since I haven't received a call from them yet....).
Of course all of this is extremely annoying, since many of us have been
loyal Avemco customers for many years, and we don't "deserve" this kind of
treatment. But the response is simple -- insure with somebody else (if you
can). If and when Avemco wants to get back into insuring homebuilts, tell
them to go pound sand!
Doug G.
newly rehashed Project 801 (and Garrou family) web page, including videos,
at www.garrou.com
and "Project 801 web page classic" at www.geocities.com/dmg2
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "tongaloa" <tongaloa(at)alltel.net> |
How much room is there for modifications to the Subaru 4 banger?
After market stroker kit and cam optimized for more low end power?
Thanks,
-bob
----- Original Message -----
From: "Larry C. McFarland" <larrymc(at)qconline.com>
Subject: Re: Zenith-List: New Engine
>
> Mark,
> You need a redrive, because the engine cannot turn a large enough
> prop at the RPMs that develop real HP. You'll get speed,
> but will have long takeoffs, which is the wrong end of things
> for a 601 series plane. There are lots of them. I bought a Stratus,
> but there is a gear type (expensive) that puts the Soob prop flange
> on center with the crank about where a Lycoming would be.
> Eggenfelder I think.
> Happy hunting
> Larry C. McFarland- 601hds @ macsmachine.com
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Mark Townsend" <601xl(at)sympatico.ca>
> To:
> Subject: Zenith-List: New Engine
>
>
> >
> > Hi Guys I need some opinions. I just got my hands on a EA-82 MPFI turbo
> > with all wires, puter, intake, exhaust and panel. Engine has 35,000
miles
> > on it and car has tree laying across trunk( car totaled). Question is
that
> > I'm building a 601XL and had planned on building a re-drive for my EA-82
> > SPFI but would I be OK to go direct drive now with a turbo? The weight
> > penalty from one EA to the other is a bit but I like the idea of a turbo
> > under the bonnet. Any suggestions would be well received !
> >
> > Mark Townsend
> > 601XL EA-82 MPFI Turbo
> >
> >
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Matthew P. Cummings" <cummings(at)stingray.net> |
"Matthew Mucker" wrote:
> This is childish and petty.
Well, when you exhaust all possibilities what else is left? I suppose he could
have just meekly accepted the facts and silently moved on, but I for one believe
he did the right thing in writing the letter. I did as much on a questionaire
they sent me, but it was worded much differently of course.
> The insurance companies are in business to make money. If claims exceed
> their plans it's only natural for them to stop issuing policies until they
> can figure out how things fit together.
But you have to consider the fact that they started dropping policies that had
time left on them, that's not what a reputable company does, and a company that
does that deserves to be raked over the coals.
I didn't write the origional post to which you responded, but I can tell you
this much, anybody who would do business with a company that does this is not
using their head. Why? Well, if they are willing to drop you before a claim is
ever issued on ficticious issues, imagine what they would do to deny paying a
claim. Is that a company I want to insure me, one I can't trust to do what's
right? I personally don't care if they do or do not make money, and I find it
hard to believe they don't, what I care about is that when I pay my money I get
what I paid for.
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Subaru Oil Filter - Update |
| From: | zoe c johnson <zoejohnson(at)juno.com> |
I've been using NAPA Gold 1348 with no problems..seem plentiful and good
quality!!
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Larry C. McFarland" <larrymc(at)qconline.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Of Rudders and Rivets... |
Todd,
The edge distance in the manual regards 3 diameters as optimum &
2 diameters minimum, but you can pre-mark the lines on the rudder
and predrill the skin without much difficulty and line up the holes.
My site has a few rudder images that may help you visualize the spot and
text
in the journal, if sparce at the beginning, alludes to the problems we
have with this assembly.
Hope it is helpful,
Larry C. McFarland - 601hds at macsmachine.com
----- Original Message -----
From: "Todd Osborne" <todd(at)toddtown.com>
Subject: Zenith-List: Of Rudders and Rivets...
>
> I am having a hard time determining where the bottommost rivet through
> the rudder skin on the spar-line goes. Seems there need to be one down
> there, with the fairing, to hold the fairing and skin tight to the
> bottom. But, since the doubler is cut at an angle and the flange of RR
> #1 ends at about the spar centerline, it does not look like a good place
> to put a rivet. Appears the rivet would hold the skin on just fine, but
> would certainly violate edge distances of a couple of parts, possibly
> boogering the end of the doubler. What have you done about this?
>
> Todd Osborne
> Internet E-Mail: todd(at)toddtown.com
> AOL Messenger: toddosborn
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Darryl West (Home)" <rdwest(at)shaw.ca> |
An interesting footnote:
Avemco sent me a form-letter saying how they noticed I did not renew and
were sorry to lose my business. This after THEY dumped ME!
Hey left-hand, meet right-hand.
Darryl
rdwest(at)shaw.ca
http://members.shaw.ca/rdwest/index.htm
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bill Morelli <billvt(at)together.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Subaru Oil Filter - Update |
Zoe,
Do they fit on the Stratus EA-81?
>I've been using NAPA Gold 1348 with no problems..seem plentiful and good
>quality!!
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Chris Weber" <chrisoz(at)gmx.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Zenith-List Digest: 11 Msgs - 03/21/02 |
Hello list,
an other lurker surfaces, I must admit I have been an avid reader of this
list for the last year. What questions I had were answered without me
asking, and the rest I found in the archives. But the main thing was to know
that there are others like me.
I started building a 601 UL taildragger in August 2000, from a kit I bought
unstarted secondhand, a very early one, from way back when they were still
produced in Canada.
Over the last one and a half years I managed to work four month full time on
it, in leaps and bounds, the airframe took me 460 hours, and by the time I
had my inspection I had 640 hours total time. Changed a couple of things,
alternate canopy lock with the sliding hinges, false ribs and additional
stringers in the rear fuse to avoid oilcanning, stiffer baggage doors, sort
of a reclinig bucket seat from thicker gauge aluminium as I'm six foot four,
and the baggage shelf is so stiff that I can actually sit on it. I had to
order 2500 additional rivets at aircraft spruce, but the plane still only
weights in at 246 kg, including oil and coolant, with the 912.
I put the radiator flush in the cowling, it looks pretty clean.
I built it under the new Australian Ultralight Experimental Class, bugger
all paper work or red tape, I am still surprised the official side was so
easy.
It kind of seems a very long way from the first rivet to were I am now, but
640 hours is just three years of holidays, so it's not that long. Never had
such a lot of fun so consistently over such a long time, and the moment when
you switch the engine on for the first time, and the heap of sheetmetal
suddenly transforms into a plane is pure magic.
So tomorrow is the day, she's checked over, oiled up, the tires have been
kicked, and the the time has come for the first flight.
It's my first plane, and I am kind of nervous.
Well, that's all for now,
Chris Weber
CH 601 TD 912 100% and a small step to go
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Schemmel, Grant" <Grant.Schemmel(at)utmc.aeroflex.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Zenith-List Digest: 11 Msgs - 03/21/02 |
Good luck Chris! I'll be in the same boat here in a couple of weeks (I hope!).
Grant Schemmel
Penrose, CO
601hds/o-200, N602GS
> So tomorrow is the day, she's checked over, oiled up, the
> tires have been
> kicked, and the the time has come for the first flight.
> It's my first plane, and I am kind of nervous.
> Well, that's all for now,
>
> Chris Weber
> CH 601 TD 912 100% and a small step to go
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Zenith-List Digest: 22 Msgs - 03/20/02 |
| From: | Grant Corriveau <grantC(at)total.net> |
>>
>> ...It shows how much the door lifts due to
>> the negative pressure over the wing. I made some mods to the door as
I don't get any bulging at all from my locker doors! They are currently
closed with a seamless joining of 6061-T6 molecules! Mind you, to store
anything in them, I will have to use the tin-snip/openers... (sorry,
couldn't resist!).
I appreciate Thilo's comment about the storage capacity of the main cargo
shelf. Perhaps I'll just add one cargo compartment this summer as a place
to store chocks, or ropes, or canopy covers, or other 'stuff' that gets wet
and messy and would be better kept outside the cockpit(?)
I'm curious how useful/necessary others are finding these lockers to be?
--
Grant Corriveau
Montreal
Zodiac 601hds/CAM100
C-GHTF
www.theWingStayedON.ca
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Matthew Mucker" <matthew(at)mucker.net> |
> > The insurance companies are in business to make money. If claims exceed
> > their plans it's only natural for them to stop issuing policies
> until they
> > can figure out how things fit together.
>
> But you have to consider the fact that they started dropping
> policies that had
> time left on them, that's not what a reputable company does, and
> a company that
> does that deserves to be raked over the coals.
I had not heard about Avemco dropping existing policies. I heard that they
were not issuing new policies and not renewing policies at the end of the
policy term. Dropping a policy midterm without claims filed against it
sounds like it might be illegal. Since I haven't heard of this happening to
anyone yet, I'm hoping this is mere rumor. And if it is indeed as illegal
as it sounds, I can't believe Avemco is doing this. They have a LOT more to
lose by breaking the law than by cutting losses of an allegedly money-losing
business.
However.
Avemco's failure to come clean with their customers about homebuilt aircraft
insurance does amount to a relationship that is, in my book, less than
trustworthy. Cancelling policies that are already in place, if it indeed
has been done, is downright wrong. (So far I haven't heard of this
happening, and EAA's homepage indicates only that EAA is not writing new
policies.) In any case, it really does make a potential customer wonder
what will happen if it ever becomes necessary to file a claim. I, for one,
will certainly pay higher premiums to insure my aircraft/home/car/whatever
with an agency that I trust will be there for me if it ever does become
necessary. Avemco is working hard to destroy that trust with their
customers and the entire homebuilt community.
Writing letters of the caliber posted on this list earlier will not,
however, change this company's practices. Aggressive lobbying with EAA is
probably our healthiest line of attack. If one has already resigned oneself
to getting insurance with another carrier, perhaps complaints should be
filed with the state insurance board in the state in which Avemco does their
business, as well as the policyholder's home state. (Avemco's home office
appears to be in Maryland. The Maryland Insurance Administration's website
lists contacts for consumer complaints at
http://www.mdarchives.state.md.us/msa/mdmanual/25ind/html/47insur.html#compl
aint.)
Avemco is certainly shooting themselves in the foot here. They're losing
all credibility with the homebuilder market and if and when they decide this
can be a profitable business, they may find themselves lacking customers.
Had they simply come forward to the homebuilder/aviation community, and with
the EAA, and told us what was going on, this might be a different story. It
appears that Avemco's representatives have, even on the phone with current
customers attempting to renew policies, been evasive about the current state
of their homebuilder insurance offerings. (EAA's home page indicates that
even EAA was not made aware of Avemco's change of heart until members
started complaining.) Sadly, even now there does not appear to be any
mention of this on Avemco's website. It does appear that they are doing all
they can to lose customers.
Now, I am not an Avemco customer (my plane's not built yet), but when the
time comes to insure my aircraft, this thread has primed me to be very
prejudiced against Avemco.
I am sending a copy of this email to Avemco's contact email address
(avemco(at)ave.com according to their website). If I receive any reply, I will
post it to the mailing list.
-Matt
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Dave Austin" <daveaustin2(at)sprint.ca> |
| Subject: | Re: Zenith-List Digest: 22 Msgs - 03/20/02 |
Grant,
I flew to Oshkosh a few years ago with a 200 lb passenger and plans to camp
under the wings. My spreadsheet clearly showed that with approx 30 lbs in
each wing locker and gas tank 1/4 full, I could put no more than two
sleeping bags and 5 lbs more on the baggage shelf without going outside the
balance limit to the rear. (And my pilot only balance with full gas and no
luggage is close to the front.)
A couple of my landings also told me I was close to the rear limit as well.
Message I would give is "build in those lockers in the wings if you plan to
carry any weight and a passenger". MHO.
Dave Austin 601HDS - 912
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "HINDE,FRANK (HP-Corvallis,ex1)" <frank_hinde(at)hp.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Zenith-List Digest: 22 Msgs - 03/20/02 |
Hi Grant,
It really comes down to what you want the plane for. My Wife and I like to
load up ang go camping/backpacking and with the standard HDS we can go for
tem days if we find water when we get there.
Both of us togehter weigh 285Lbs so loading to a gross of 1300 gives us a
huge carrying capacity. We always run out of space before we run out of
weight capacity.
Also the the wing baggae lockers are very close to the CG, unlike the rear
parcel shelf.
The next project is to make additional lockers by having a hinged cover as
the wing joint panels...Can then get the tent and lots of other stuff in
there!
Frank
And yes mine bulge in flight...especially when I over stuff them!
287 hours....got to fly last night!
I'm curious how useful/necessary others are finding these lockers to be?
--
Grant Corriveau
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "HINDE,FRANK (HP-Corvallis,ex1)" <frank_hinde(at)hp.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Zenith-List Digest: 22 Msgs - 03/20/02 |
This is one more reason to have LE wing tanks only. There is practically any
change of CG during fuel burn.
With my pilot only full fuel, CG is about 1 inch aft of the forward limit.
Its impossible to reach the rear limit with a normal sized px... Then again
I only weigh 145lbs.
Frank
Grant,
I flew to Oshkosh a few years ago with a 200 lb passenger and plans to camp
under the wings. My spreadsheet clearly showed that with approx 30 lbs in
each wing locker and gas tank 1/4 full, I could put no more than two
sleeping bags and 5 lbs more on the baggage shelf without going outside the
balance limit to the rear. (And my pilot only balance with full gas and no
luggage is close to the front.)
A couple of my landings also told me I was close to the rear limit as well.
Message I would give is "build in those lockers in the wings if you plan to
carry any weight and a passenger". MHO.
Dave Austin 601HDS - 912
_
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Don Walker" <dwalk3dw(at)msn.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Zenith-List Digest: 11 Msgs - 03/21/02 |
Yeah, Good luck Chris! Don
----- Original Message -----
From: Schemmel, Grant
Subject: RE: Zenith-List: Re: Zenith-List Digest: 11 Msgs - 03/21/02
.Aeroflex.com>
Good luck Chris! I'll be in the same boat here in a couple of weeks (I hope!).
Grant Schemmel
Penrose, CO
601hds/o-200, N602GS
> So tomorrow is the day, she's checked over, oiled up, the
> tires have been
> kicked, and the the time has come for the first flight.
> It's my first plane, and I am kind of nervous.
> Well, that's all for now,
>
> Chris Weber
> CH 601 TD 912 100% and a small step to go
>
=
=
=
=
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Builder's Bookstore" <winterland(at)rkymtnhi.com> |
| Subject: | Free Thunderbird, Blue Angels videos |
Free Thunderbird, Blue Angels videos
I've got 5 copies of a Thunderbirds / Blue Angles video which we'll give
away for Free to the first 5 people who ask for it along with any other
regular order from Builder's Bookstore.
It's a 50 minute video, 1/2 on the Thunderbirds, and 1/2 on the Blue
Angels. The Thunderbird segment is excellent. The Blue Angels section
is not as good.
To get one, just write FREE THUNDERBIRDS VIDEO in the special
instructions box on the Builder's Bookstore on-line order form, or say
so if you prefer to order something by phone.
Also, in case you are caller #6 or later, note if your regular order
depends on whether there is a free video left to include in your
package.
Andy
Builder's Bookstore
http://buildersbooks.com
800 780-4115
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Phil Owens" <owensp(at)charter.net> |
| Subject: | Oil & Air Filters Etc. |
Dear Listers,
I have noticed lately a lot of questions regarding oil filters and
where to get quality oil,air,fuel & other similar type quality products.
May I suggest you try looking at www.amsoil.com here you will find
a wealth of information as well as top notch products and the related
information to go with them. In the event you need to cross reference a
number of a filter with a specific brand to find an equivalent amsoil
filter the cross reference tables are on the web site.
Yes, I am a Certified Amsoil T-1 Dealer, and I am also a builder so
I can understand what you may be looking for, "QUALITY". I believe you
will find that quality in all amsoil products. I will tell you that
AMSOIL oils are great with the automotive type engines, but will also
advise you they are NOT recommended for aircraft type engines such as
Lycoming, Continental,Franklin,etc., because of the materials used in
the construction of these engines have different requirements than the
auto type engines.
In the event you wish to order from the web site you can and the
products will be shipped to your door, you may if you wish indicate my
Z.O. number 81427 is you wish but you are not required to do so, I am
placing this information on the site as an assistance to fellow builders
and not as a sales tool. I sincerely hope this will solve some problems
for many fellow builders.
Sincerely,
Phil Owens
CH-801 Builder
N84349
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Cy Galley" <cgalley(at)qcbc.org> |
| Subject: | Re: Letter Campaign |
From the EAA Friday Gram..
EAA PURSUES ANSWERS IN HOMEBUILT INSURANCE CRUNCH
EAA is seeking answers and solutions for its members after a recent
moratorium on insurance for many types of homebuilt aircraft. That
moratorium is on new policies written under the EAA Insurance Plan by Avemco
Insurance. It was put in place after reported losses in Avemco's homebuilt
insurance business. We are asking for data to back up these reported
losses. To leave large groups of homebuilt aircraft without coverage is
simply unacceptable. It is absolutely essential that we know if there are
any problems with particular models of homebuilt aircraft and how that
affects coverage for the entire homebuilt community. When similar
situations in insurance coverage have emerged in the past, EAA has met the
challenges to keep our members' aircraft flying. EAA is just as committed
now to finding solutions and securing coverage across the broad spectrum of
aircraft flown by our members. Avemco suddenly announced the moratorium
little more than a week ago. Since that point, EAA staff members have been
in continual contact with Avemco representatives, requesting data and
background, and will be meeting with the company to find possible solutions
to the situation.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Matthew Mucker" <matthew(at)mucker.net>
Subject: RE: RE[2]: Zenith-List: Letter Campaign
> > The insurance companies are in business to make money. If claims exceed
> > their plans it's only natural for them to stop issuing policies
> until they
> > can figure out how things fit together.
>
> But you have to consider the fact that they started dropping
> policies that had
> time left on them, that's not what a reputable company does, and
> a company that
> does that deserves to be raked over the coals.
I had not heard about Avemco dropping existing policies. I heard that they
were not issuing new policies and not renewing policies at the end of the
policy term. Dropping a policy midterm without claims filed against it
sounds like it might be illegal. Since I haven't heard of this happening to
anyone yet, I'm hoping this is mere rumor. And if it is indeed as illegal
as it sounds, I can't believe Avemco is doing this. They have a LOT more to
lose by breaking the law than by cutting losses of an allegedly money-losing
business.
However.
Avemco's failure to come clean with their customers about homebuilt aircraft
insurance does amount to a relationship that is, in my book, less than
trustworthy. Cancelling policies that are already in place, if it indeed
has been done, is downright wrong. (So far I haven't heard of this
happening, and EAA's homepage indicates only that EAA is not writing new
policies.) In any case, it really does make a potential customer wonder
what will happen if it ever becomes necessary to file a claim. I, for one,
will certainly pay higher premiums to insure my aircraft/home/car/whatever
with an agency that I trust will be there for me if it ever does become
necessary. Avemco is working hard to destroy that trust with their
customers and the entire homebuilt community.
Writing letters of the caliber posted on this list earlier will not,
however, change this company's practices. Aggressive lobbying with EAA is
probably our healthiest line of attack. If one has already resigned oneself
to getting insurance with another carrier, perhaps complaints should be
filed with the state insurance board in the state in which Avemco does their
business, as well as the policyholder's home state. (Avemco's home office
appears to be in Maryland. The Maryland Insurance Administration's website
lists contacts for consumer complaints at
http://www.mdarchives.state.md.us/msa/mdmanual/25ind/html/47insur.html#compl
aint.)
Avemco is certainly shooting themselves in the foot here. They're losing
all credibility with the homebuilder market and if and when they decide this
can be a profitable business, they may find themselves lacking customers.
Had they simply come forward to the homebuilder/aviation community, and with
the EAA, and told us what was going on, this might be a different story. It
appears that Avemco's representatives have, even on the phone with current
customers attempting to renew policies, been evasive about the current state
of their homebuilder insurance offerings. (EAA's home page indicates that
even EAA was not made aware of Avemco's change of heart until members
started complaining.) Sadly, even now there does not appear to be any
mention of this on Avemco's website. It does appear that they are doing all
they can to lose customers.
Now, I am not an Avemco customer (my plane's not built yet), but when the
time comes to insure my aircraft, this thread has primed me to be very
prejudiced against Avemco.
I am sending a copy of this email to Avemco's contact email address
(avemco(at)ave.com according to their website). If I receive any reply, I will
post it to the mailing list.
-Matt
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Bruce Bockius" <bruce(at)whiteantelopesoftware.com> |
| Subject: | Oil & Air Filters Etc. |
Phil,
If you've been following this thread you'll know we're specifically
looking for a filter to use on the Stratus Subaru engine conversion.
I've been using NAPA Gold 1065 filters to this point. The
cross-reference you mention on the Amsoil site says the LF503 is an
equivelant ($8.15/ea, 3-5 week special order). It then goes on to say
that they cannot be responsible for misapplications. I've previously
looked up other filter manufacturers cross-references and found them to
specify filters that are not really the same size as the original, and
subsequently don't fit. So how do I know if the Amsoil filter really
will fit?
-Bruce/601HD/TDO/Stratus/303 hrs
>
> Dear Listers,
> I have noticed lately a lot of questions regarding oil
> filters and where to get quality oil,air,fuel & other similar
> type quality products.
> May I suggest you try looking at www.amsoil.com here you
> will find a wealth of information as well as top notch
> products and the related information to go with them. In the
> event you need to cross reference a number of a filter with a
> specific brand to find an equivalent amsoil filter the cross
> reference tables are on the web site.
> In the event you wish to order from the web site you can
> and the products will be shipped to your door, you may if you
> wish indicate my Z.O. number 81427 is you wish but you are
> not required to do so, I am placing this information on the
> site as an assistance to fellow builders and not as a sales
> tool. I sincerely hope this will solve some problems for many
> fellow builders.
>
> Sincerely,
> Phil Owens
> CH-801 Builder
> N84349
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bill Morelli <billvt(at)together.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Zenith-List Digest: 22 Msgs - 03/20/02 |
I use one of my lockers to store my canopy cover, tie downs and a small
pair of chocks. That takes up probably 2/3 of that locker. When I went on
my first extended trip last summer, my wife and I filled the other locker
and the rear cargo. The rear cargo compartment does hold much more than you
might think. Some guys (Frank H. I think) has added a place behind the
seats, under the cargo compartment to carry larger items such as sleeping
bags. Good idea.
Bill
>I'm curious how useful/necessary others are finding these lockers to be?
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bill Morelli <billvt(at)together.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Zenith-List Digest: 22 Msgs - 03/20/02 |
Dave has a great point. The lockers and rear baggage are only useful if you
can load them up. In my case, I weight 180, my wife weights 130. I can load
up all three baggage areas to 40 lbs each, load 26 gallons of fuel and
still be well within CG limits. So if you have two heavy persons, your
baggage load will suffer significantly.
Bill
>I flew to Oshkosh a few years ago with a 200 lb passenger and plans to camp
>under the wings. My spreadsheet clearly showed that with approx 30 lbs in
>each wing locker and gas tank 1/4 full, I could put no more than two
>sleeping bags and 5 lbs more on the baggage shelf without going outside the
>balance limit to the rear. (And my pilot only balance with full gas and no
>luggage is close to the front.)
>A couple of my landings also told me I was close to the rear limit as well.
>Message I would give is "build in those lockers in the wings if you plan to
>carry any weight and a passenger". MHO.
>Dave Austin 601HDS - 912
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "HINDE,FRANK (HP-Corvallis,ex1)" <frank_hinde(at)hp.com> |
| Subject: | Baggage lockers and stuff |
Yup...I almost forgot that...
I added two straps on each side that sucks the sleeping bags up under the
rear baggage shelf. So ne extra metal, just four 1/2 inch nylon straps from
G I JOES's....Do do this on your Cessna!
I sewed a couple of loops on the sleeping bag's bag to stop the strap
slipping off in flight.
That with the extra lockers between the wing sections you can turn this
thing into a virtual flying RV....No not that sort of RV...
Frank
I use one of my lockers to store my canopy cover, tie downs and a small
pair of chocks. That takes up probably 2/3 of that locker. When I went on
my first extended trip last summer, my wife and I filled the other locker
and the rear cargo. The rear cargo compartment does hold much more than you
might think. Some guys (Frank H. I think) has added a place behind the
seats, under the cargo compartment to carry larger items such as sleeping
bags. Good idea.
Bill
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Battery Contactors |
Hi List,
Have any of you that have used the battery contactors that ZAC supplies with
their FWF packages had any trouble with them failing? I have had one go bad
for sure and now it looks like a second one has as well. It has me very
concerned that there is something inherently wrong with my electrical system.
But the one I got from Aeroelectric seems to be bullet proof.
Just curious,
thanks,
Steve Freeman
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Subaru Oil Filter - Update |
| From: | zoe c johnson <zoejohnson(at)juno.com> |
Bill,
Can't swear to it, but I'd think so..I have NSI setup, and
there's little clearance between mount and filter mount..NAPA called for
this filter and it's same size as FRam one's that's been mentioned, but
definitely better quality..Wix builds them..you could always take one of
the filters you're using and compare..runs 5-6 bucks around here..hope
this helps...P.S. Zoe is better half! don't know nutin bout filters.
Hope some of you other guys shows up at S&F..been lonely last few
years..finally had a couple Tampa friends and guy from N.C. last
year..would be nice to see a few other Zodiacs!!!!!
Jackie N5JZ
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bill Morelli <billvt(at)together.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Battery Contactors |
I have the ZAC supplied contactor and have just surpassed the 120 hour mark
with no problem.
Did you add a diode across the contactor? You need one to help prevent
arcing and prolong the contactor life.
Regards,
Bill
>Have any of you that have used the battery contactors that ZAC supplies with
>their FWF packages had any trouble with them failing? I have had one go bad
>for sure and now it looks like a second one has as well. It has me very
>concerned that there is something inherently wrong with my electrical system.
> But the one I got from Aeroelectric seems to be bullet proof.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "The Meiste's" <meiste(at)essex1.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Battery Contactors |
>
> Have any of you that have used the battery contactors that ZAC supplies
with
> their FWF packages had any trouble with them failing?
Steve,
Yup, I've had one of my ZAC supplied units fail also. It seems my problem
was one of the main (large) post. I believe they are VERY sensitive to over
torquing the nuts. I may have simply over torqued my nut??? My planes not
even flying yet and it failed during the testing of my electrical system
last summer.
Kelly Meiste
601 Stratus (87.54632% complete, was 90.00002%, don't ask)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Chris Weber" <chrisoz(at)gmx.net> |
| Subject: | Been there, done it |
Hello Listers,
the first flight of Zodiac 19-3678 was a complete success. At half past
eight this morning a friend of mine, who has been flying taildraggers since
1944, took her up for the first time (being a low-time pilot that seemed the
sensible thing to do), after two circuits I jumped in with him and we
checked her out for an hour. Some things need attention, the airspeed
indicator is overreading a fair bit, in order to get out of the compression
zone under the wing I will extend the pitot tube a bit. Idle is to low and
needs adjusting, oiltemp only goes up to 120F, so I have to partly block
off the oil-cooler. The prop is overpitched, max rpms are 5200.
How does she fly? Basically leaps of the ground and climbs two up at 25C
and msl with 1100ft/min at 75 knots (gps). Turns on a dime, the wings look
very short from the cockpit, all the controls are nice and direct, elevator
is very prominent and she is quite twitchy in pitch. Trim is oversensitive.
Cruise at 4200rpm is approx. 80 knots, haven't had a go at top speed yet,
but at 5000 rpm the ASI claimed 105 knots (liar, liar). The stall is mushy,
both power on and power off, with a fair bit of buffeting and slight
oilcanning close to the ailerons. In normal flight there is no oilcanning at
all, and the splice covers are nice and tight during the stall (I can
tighten them through the baggage-lockers). Due to the additional stiffeners
the baggage lockers don't bulge at all.
I am happy as a lark, this thing wants to fly and the peformance is
stunning. Never mind the ASI, it feels fast, what a rush!
I will rectify the little things, put the radio and intercom in and have
another go then. I will keep you posted on the results.
All you out there still building, don't loose faith, the day will come!
Chris Weber
Zodiac 601 TD 912, 100% and 1 hour
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Fred or Sandy Hulen" <hulens61(at)birch.net> |
| Subject: | Successful first flight |
> Hello Listers,
> the first flight of Zodiac 19-3678 was a complete success.
++ Tremendous !!! Another one leaves the nest. Congratulations Chris, and
keep us posted !
Fred
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Zenith-List Digest: 25 Msgs - 03/22/02 |
| From: | Grant Corriveau <grantC(at)total.net> |
> All you out there still building, don't loose faith, the day will come!
>
> Chris Weber
> Zodiac 601 TD 912, 100% and 1 hour
Congrats Chris! It's a special accomplishment!
I only managed to log 17 hours on GHTF last summer, and right now it's in
the garage awaiting more 'tweaking' and the return of summer weather.
Although it looks the same as it did sitting in the garage during
construction, now there's a huge difference. Now I know that it flies, and
flies well. Now it has been proven up to 7,500 ASL, and up to 140 mph (in a
dive of course! ;-), and it truly is a REAL airplane. And I am amazed that
somehow, over many years and many hours of construction, 'I did this!'....
I appreciate your sense of joy and accomplishment and assure you that this
will continue to grow as your experience with the aircraft grows.
Well done!
--
Grant Corriveau
Montreal
Zodiac 601hds/CAM100
C-GHTF
www.theWingStayedON.ca
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Don" <grandpanma(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | Partial Kit For Sale 601HDS |
Hi List, *** Price Reduced ***
*********** MUST SELL ************
Get a head start or add cheaply to what you already have.
I have been a reader on this list for a long time (4-5 yrs.), very
seldom comment or say anything. It has been very helpful at times and enjoy
following everyone's progress.
BUT, my financial situation has changed and I can no longer afford to
continue building.
I started out building the 601HDS Rudder in the factory weekend
workshop, brought the "Tail kit" home with me. Finished the "Tail kit", now
was working on the "Wing kit".
I only finished the skeleton of one wing, that's where I stopped.
Must sell what I have.
Drawings & Manuals: $340.00
Complete Tail Kit W/flush electric trim tab:(Finished) 1495.00
Wing & Aileron Kit: (finished skeleton of one wing) 4580.00
Leading Edge fuel tank kit: 875.00
Navigation/strobe light kit: 465.00
____________
Total: 7755.00
Have a few EXTRA parts I will include.
Will sell at a very reasonable price: ---- Around ---- $5900.00 or a
reasonable offer.
My E-mail Address is: grandpanma(at)earthlink.net
I live in Puckett, MS. That's about 25 miles south/east of Jackson, MS.
My phone No. 601-591-1589
Sincerely,
Donald Vough Jr.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Fred or Sandy Hulen" <hulens61(at)birch.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Been there, done it |
> Chris Weber
> Zodiac 601 TD 912, 100% and 1 hour
++ Enjoyed re-reading your first flight report. Is you 601 an HD or HDS?
Fred
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "zodiacjeff" <zodiacjeff(at)email.msn.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Battery Contactors |
> 601 Stratus (87.54632% complete, was 90.00002%, don't ask)
You know I'm going to ask!
Jeff
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Chris Weber" <chrisoz(at)gmx.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Zenith-List Digest: 7 Msgs - 03/23/02 |
> ++ Enjoyed re-reading your first flight report. Is you 601 an HD or HDS?
>
> Fred
>
Hello Fred,
it is the UL version with the HD-wings. Take the speeds with a fair bit of
salt, still have to check the ASI with the GPS, will do that after Eastern.
With no static port and the pitot tube to close to the wing there is a big
margin for error, but fast taxi with GPS gave me overreading of 7 knots at
40. If that is absolute it won't be to bad, if it's linear and we're talking
14 at 80 knots it's not so good. It shure feels very different from all the
other Rotax 912 planes I have flown, exept for the 912S Dallach Fascination
over in Germany (retractable undercarriage, 240km/h cruise, 290 km/h VNe).
We will know soon,
Chris
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Fred or Sandy Hulen" <hulens61(at)birch.net> |
| Subject: | Intake air coupling to Jabiru engine |
For those of you that are building a Zenith aircraft or in any case may have
a difficult time of making a smooth sweeping turn to get the air coupled
into the back side of a Jabiru engine, Pete has now posted several pictures
of the plenum adaptor I made, and shows the complete installation coupling
the engine to the air-box. The exact site is
http://www.usjabiru.com/Tech%20Tips.htm#Oil%20Cooler%20Installation
If that page doesn't come up for you, then go to the regular
www.usjabiru.com and click on "technical tips", then when that page comes
up, click on "Zenith airbox installation". The reason for making this
adaptor is that there have been established testing that revealed that
making that sharp turn in the air path with hose the diameter of the carb
intake produces a lot of turbulence and top revs are not being met until
adaptors such as this one are installed.
As we say here on the builder-lists, "hope this helps".
Fred
Area 41, Snailworks
Zenith 601HDS / 3300
N-601LX ... perpetually in the last 5% stages
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | canapies for 601 |
Would anyone in the Fort Lauderdale or Southeast Florida area be interested
in letting a canopy designer, who is designing a sleeker, low drag canapy for
the 601 measure your fuselage for a correct fit. He is a small company who
builds a stonger better canapy at a very reasonable price. His canapy
makes the 601 a better airplane. Anyone's help would be appreciated.
Contact:
TPDSR(at)aol.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Gary Liming <gary(at)liming.org> |
| Subject: | Re: Zenith-List Digest: 7 Msgs - 03/23/02 |
Hi Chris,
Congratulations on first flight!
>With no static port and the pitot tube to close to the wing there is a big
>margin for error
How close is your pitot tube to the wing? I know I've asked the question
about the static port on the list before, and the few respondants just have
the static port open to the cockpit, and they've reported a 5 mph or so
inaccuracy. If you do anything to improve that, would you tell us?
If anyone has a different experience with it, would you share it?
Thanks,
Gary Liming
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Carlos Sa <wings1(at)videotron.ca> |
Hello, Listers
I just finished uploading some pictures to my ISP server.
It is not intended to be a thorough, fancy or frequently updated site.
There are not enough hours in a day to allow for that, building a plane
and that other annoying activity that brings money into my pocket so I
can afford building and eating...
Here's the address, hope some of the items are useful.
http://pages.infinit.net/wings/zodiac/main.html
Carlos
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bill Morelli <billvt(at)together.net> |
Carlos,
Nice shine!! What are you using for Polish and what is your technique.
Regards,
Bill (N812BM - HDS - Tri - Stratus - Vermont - 122.1 flight hrs. - 184
landings)
web site -> http://homepages.together.net/~billvt/
>I just finished uploading some pictures to my ISP server.
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: canapies for 601 |
| From: | Greg P Jannakos <gpjann(at)juno.com> |
Greg Jannakos
Atlanta area
6-4211 Zodiac 601HDS
Corvair power
60% plans building
Question.
I'm getting ready to build the canopy lock as shown on 6E2-1.
Using the dimensions and mounting locations shown on the plans it looks
like the spring and bent 5/16 rod will be in front of the seats. Is this
correct or am I missing something?
Thanks
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "patrick walsh" <pwalsh4539(at)msn.com> |
| Subject: | Re: canapies for 601 |
The bent rod is behind the seat...
----- Original Message -----
From: Greg P Jannakos
Subject: Re: Zenith-List: canapies for 601
Greg Jannakos
Atlanta area
6-4211 Zodiac 601HDS
Corvair power
60% plans building
Question.
I'm getting ready to build the canopy lock as shown on 6E2-1.
Using the dimensions and mounting locations shown on the plans it looks
like the spring and bent 5/16 rod will be in front of the seats. Is this
correct or am I missing something?
Thanks
=
=
=
=
Get mor
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Instrument panel buildup and center console |
Greetings listers... I am inching forward and about to complete the fuselage
and move toward engine and instruments. One facet of construction that I plan
to farm out is that of engaging an outside party to help me design and build
my 601HDS panel. Over a year ago, I had conferred with Gulf Coast Avionics
who took a number of parameters and did a sample panel w/ pricing. I was
pleased and know that they did the Popular Mechanics 601 panel. The
individual who had done that is no longer there. Has anyone else had
experiences with Gulf Coast? AS&S also does panels, Lisa Turner's Pulsar
comes to mind. A look at Trade-A-Plane shows any number of other possible
sources. I am leaning toward Gulf Coast but would appreciate any input from
others on the list regarding this issue. Good/bad experiences with someone.
Things to do/avoid. I don't plan to be unconventional but may allow myself
the installation of a Garmin GNS 430 and 327 xponder if business continues
well ;-). (vs 250XL and 320 but then would be without VOR). Plan on using
the EIS and engine choice at this point is leaning to Jabiru 3300.
Also would like any sources/suggestions or jpegs of nice center console
panels that have been created for the 601.
I would appreciate your candid opinions of any suppliers and avionics firms
or anything else related so please feel free to contact me directly at:
SEAL2CC(at)aol.com
Many thanks in advance...
Chris Carey
601HDS N601BZ
Richmond, VA
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | WIng Joint Cover |
Hi List,
I'm pretty sure I've asked this before but can't remember the response I got.
Has anyone fabricated a fiberglass cover for the leading edge nose where the
wings splice together?
I put my wings on this weekend (best feeling since the kids were born) for
the first time and in looking at how they will ultimately join there it seems
that a fiberglass cover/fairing would look a million times better than trying
to get the aluminum strips to make a complex bends there.
I plan on using the strip over the flat top portion of the wings but want to
make a fiberglass piece for the nose. Has anyone done similar? Any advice
from anyone who has done similar would be appreciated.
Thanks,
Steve (It looks like an airplane now) Freeman
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "HINDE,FRANK (HP-Corvallis,ex1)" <frank_hinde(at)hp.com> |
| Subject: | WIng Joint Cover |
Steve,
I have not done it but I got the advice from a fiberglass plane builder that
says its pretty easy.
Cover the metal with aluminium tape (stops the glass sticking), the layup
two layers of woven glass cloth directl to this. You might want to tape some
strips of flat alu strip to cover the gap to stop the glass falling into the
hole.
Let it set, remove and trim. Fix in place with sheet metal screws.
The other way (less good but OK for the last 3 years) is to make the alu
strip narrow (say 1 inch wide) at the nose. This makes the gap much less
noticable.
Frank
Hi List,
I'm pretty sure I've asked this before but can't remember the response I
got.
Has anyone fabricated a fiberglass cover for the leading edge nose where the
wings splice together?
I
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Zenith-List Digest: 10 Msgs - 03/24/02 |
| From: | Grant Corriveau <grantC(at)total.net> |
on 3/25/02 02:57, Zenith-List Digest Server at
zenith-list-digest(at)matronics.com wrote:
> How close is your pitot tube to the wing? I know I've asked the question
> about the static port on the list before, and the few respondants just have
> the static port open to the cockpit, and they've reported a 5 mph or so
> inaccuracy. If you do anything to improve that, would you tell us?
>
> If anyone has a different experience with it, would you share it?
Static port inside cockpit - not good....
The standard Aircraft Spruce combined static/pitot tube, mounted far enough
outboard to be out of the prop wash, and simply mounted near the main spar,
at a careful right angle to the 'typical' airflow, turns out to be very
accurate for my aircraft. (I've never seen more than plus/minus five at all
attitudes).
fwiw
--
Grant Corriveau
Montreal
Zodiac 601hds/CAM100
C-GHTF
www.theWingStayedON.ca
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Peter Chapman <pchapman(at)ionsys.com> |
| Subject: | Re: wing lockers |
At 10:31 22-03-02 , Grant C. wrote:
>I'm curious how useful/necessary others are finding these lockers to be?
A big factor is what percentage of the time one takes longer, overnight
trips. It is those occasions that the added baggage volume and weight
capacity is great to have. When my dad and I flew to and camped at Oshkosh
2000, we had on the order of 85 lbs of baggage with us -- which isn't out
of line with what two people would have split between their backpacks
during a multi-day hiking trip.
We might dream of long crosscountry flights, but for some of us, most of
our flights are spent within a couple hours flying time from home base.
Peter Chapman
Toronto, ON 601 HDS / 912 / C-GZDC
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Pinneo, George" <George.Pinneo(at)trw.com> |
| Subject: | Re: wing lockers |
Once fabricated,(w/L-angle reinforcement) they may prove useful to you, they have
to me. You don't have to use them!
GGP
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "George Swinford" <grs-pms(at)mindspring.com> |
| Subject: | Tubing For Glareshield Edge |
Several helpful responses to my enquiry about glareshield edge treatment
suggested using foam tubing. I have found what seems to be an ideal tube for
the purpose, but don't know where to get it in the length required. It is a
closed cell extruded tube with a smooth exterior surface. It is sold in
short lengths to pad up pencils, pens, utensils and tool handles for people
whose ability to grip small articles is impared, by arthritis, for example.
The short length I have has a one inch OD with a .25 inch ID, and is black.
It came from the physical therapy department of the local hospital,some
years ago.
A Google search for foam tubing turns up some 15,000 hits. In the first 250
or so I find several medical supply houses that sell packaged one foot
lengths in various diameters and colors. I didn't find any offered in bulk.
Can anyone out there identify the particular plastic involved so I can
refine the search? Or can anyone identify a source?
Tony Bingelis suggested using the insulating foam that is used on water
lines, covered with leather or naugahyde. The stuff I'm seeking has a good
appearance without covering.
As always, any help will be much appreciated.
George
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Larry C. McFarland" <larrymc(at)qconline.com> |
| Subject: | Re: WIng Joint Cover |
Steve,
I used fiberglass strips at the nose of my hds wings and right over
the top to the rear edge. These were fastened with tinnerman edge
fasteners. They came out looking great. Not a tough job. I detailed this
process in
rather excruciating detail in my journal and included a few pictures.
Hope this helps.
Larry C. McFarland - 601hds at macsmachine.com
----- Original Message -----
From: <STEFREE(at)aol.com>
Subject: Zenith-List: WIng Joint Cover
>
> Hi List,
>
> I'm pretty sure I've asked this before but can't remember the response I
got.
>
> Has anyone fabricated a fiberglass cover for the leading edge nose where
the
> wings splice together?
>
> I put my wings on this weekend (best feeling since the kids were born) for
> the first time and in looking at how they will ultimately join there it
seems
> that a fiberglass cover/fairing would look a million times better than
trying
> to get the aluminum strips to make a complex bends there.
>
> I plan on using the strip over the flat top portion of the wings but want
to
> make a fiberglass piece for the nose. Has anyone done similar? Any
advice
> from anyone who has done similar would be appreciated.
>
> Thanks,
>
> Steve (It looks like an airplane now) Freeman
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Mike Fothergill <mfothergill(at)sympatico.ca> |
| Subject: | Re: wing lockers |
Hi Peter;
We have done the trip thing with the lockers holding enough stuff for a
week away. At other times I put a 4 gallon can (plastic) in a locker for
extra fuel for the return journey. Saves buying expensive 100LL.
Mike
UHS Spinners
CH-601HDS 900+ hours
Peter Chapman wrote:
>
>
> At 10:31 22-03-02 , Grant C. wrote:
>
> >I'm curious how useful/necessary others are finding these lockers to be?
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: WIng Joint Cover |
Hi LArry,
What is the URL for where your information is at? I can't seem to pull it up
from the info in your posting.
Steve
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "George Swinford" <grs-pms(at)mindspring.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Tubing For Glareshield Edge |
Thanks, Peter:
I had looked in the J.C. Whitney catalog for the material you describe. When
I didn't find it, I assumed it wasn't available any more. I never thought to
try the nearby NAPA store, but I will now.
George
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bryan Martin <bryanmmartin(at)comcast.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Glareshield Edge |
There is a material made for protecting wires passing through cable tray
openings. It is similar in appearance to the door edge protector sold at
auto parts stores but is made out of a textured black vinyl covering a metal
shell. I don't know for sure where you would get it (I got some from work)
but you could try an electrical supplier.
--
Bryan Martin
N61BM, CH 601 XL, Stratus Subaru.
Wings, tail and fuselage done, wheels and tail mounted.
Working on canopy.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Kilby, Roger" <Roger.Kilby(at)DynCorp.com> |
| Subject: | ...Been there, done it... |
Way to go Chris!!
Roger Kilby
N98RK 601HDS
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Zenith-List Digest: 16 Msgs - 03/25/02 |
| From: | Grant Corriveau <grantC(at)total.net> |
> I would appreciate your candid opinions of any suppliers and avionics firms
> or anything else related so please feel free to contact me directly at:
>
> SEAL2CC(at)aol.com
>
> Many thanks in advance...
>
> Chris Carey
> 601HDS N601BZ
> Richmond, VA
Chris,
Just ensure that you communicate to the designger that the Zodiac has a
center control stick with the throttle outboard. This might influence the
location of some items that are best operated by one hand or the other.
You might also want to define how much of the panel you can reach
conveniently with your throttle hand, as this is often the one that is free
for radio freq. changes, light switch operations, etc..
--
Grant Corriveau
Montreal
Zodiac 601hds/CAM100
C-GHTF
www.theWingStayedON.ca
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Sam Cajun" <sam.caj(at)worldnet.att.net> |
701 builders and flyers, any thoughts on the need for the false
ribs as pictured at:
http://www.zenithair.com/stolch701/images/7-wing/7wing-wt.jpg
Would appreciate your thoughts, experiences or ponderings. I'm
almost at the point of dicision whether to or not to. This topic
was discussed a good while back but can't seem to pull it up in
the archives. From the wing photos I've seen, it looks about
50/50 for including and not including. I'm sure it would make a
better looking wing, i.e. the wing would keep it's shape better
but would require several additional hours of work.
Is the reason for including totally asthetic or does the skin
distort sufficiently in flight to affect lift?
All comments appreciated.
Sam(701, fuse , tail group done, controls in)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Randy L. Thwing" <n4546v(at)mindspring.com> |
| Subject: | Re: 701 false ribs |
Everytime I look at my completed wings, I wish I had added them for
asthetics alone.
Randy L. Thwing, 701 plans
Subject: Zenith-List: 701 false ribs
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "zodiacjeff" <zodiacjeff(at)email.msn.com> |
| Subject: | Re: 701 false ribs |
>701 builders and flyers, any thoughts on need for the false ribs
>better looking wing, i.e. the wing would keep its shape better
>but would require several additional hours of work
Sam,
Could you do what 601 builders do - take standard L angle and using fluting
pliers make false ribs to conform to the top and bottom of ribs between the
spars. Exactly what is seen in the picture but not attached to the spars,
just riveted to the wing skins. Allow for a little bit of clearance front
and aft. This way you don't have to make any complicated hanger/attach
points on the spars.
Big improvement in the aesthetics department and should stiffen the skins.
A few hours now ( and this didn't take long at all) against a lifetime of
wishing you had.
Regards Jeff
HDS/3300
Area 41 SnailWorks East
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jon Croke" <Jon(at)joncroke.com> |
| Subject: | Re: 701 false ribs |
> Big improvement in the aesthetics department and should stiffen the skins.
> A few hours now ( and this didn't take long at all) against a lifetime of
> wishing you had.
>
> Regards Jeff
> HDS/3300
> Area 41 SnailWorks East
Jeff,
I understand what you are describing with the fabrication of these false
ribs, but could you describe briefly what the appearance problem is w/o
these?? I never looked that closely to a finished wing... is it bowed or
outa-shape between the ribs?? You really got me wondering!! Thanks for the
insight
Jon
near Green Bay
701 (wings under construction!)
-------------------
www.joncroke.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Larry C. McFarland" <larrymc(at)qconline.com> |
| Subject: | Re: WIng Joint Cover |
Steve,
The journal entrys for wing joint covers are in the 3rd segment, October 25
and the pictures
for ailerons and wing joint covers are oddly not in the album yet. Will fix
that
soon.
Thanks,
Larry C. McFarland at macsmachine.com
----- Original Message -----
From: <STEFREE(at)aol.com>
Subject: Re: Zenith-List: WIng Joint Cover
>
> Hi LArry,
>
> What is the URL for where your information is at? I can't seem to pull it
up
> from the info in your posting.
>
> Steve
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "michael brook" <walruss(at)optushome.com.au> |
| Subject: | Re: 701 false ribs |
I used stringers in my wings. I got some extra L angles and made them to the
profile of the the wing rib and put them in between the ribs. I improves the
shape of the wing a lot. I might have some very minor aerodynamic advantages
to the wing bt the main reason you do it is cosmetic and audial. THe wings
unreinforced can bang around a lot. It really doesn't taken that much extra
time to do them. You don't have to use stringers. You can make your own ribs
or a mate of mine made them out of a light weight polymer material in the
web with l angles put on the side of the rib flange.
I wouldn't make a 701 wing without them. I have pictures of the way I did
mine for anyone that is interested.
mike2planes
----- Original Message -----
From: Jon Croke <Jon(at)joncroke.com>
Subject: Re: Zenith-List: 701 false ribs
>
> > Big improvement in the aesthetics department and should stiffen the
skins.
> > A few hours now ( and this didn't take long at all) against a lifetime
of
> > wishing you had.
> >
> > Regards Jeff
> > HDS/3300
> > Area 41 SnailWorks East
>
> Jeff,
>
> I understand what you are describing with the fabrication of these false
> ribs, but could you describe briefly what the appearance problem is w/o
> these?? I never looked that closely to a finished wing... is it bowed or
> outa-shape between the ribs?? You really got me wondering!! Thanks for
the
> insight
>
> Jon
> near Green Bay
> 701 (wings under construction!)
>
>
> -------------------
> www.joncroke.com
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Sam Cajun" <sam.caj(at)worldnet.att.net> |
| Subject: | Re: 701 false ribs |
Jeff,
Luckily on the 701 only four spaces on each wing need the rib and
two of these already have holes for riveting an L to the front
side of the spar at the appropriate point. On these two its a
simple matter to include an L on the other side of the spar ,
furnishing an attachment point. Another of the spaces has a fuel
tank partition channel(one on mine, two in the photo) with the
flanges facing aft making for an attachment point with tack
rivet. Leaving only one place to drill additional holes in the
spar. In the rear we have the rear channel with flanges facing
forward, again providing a place for a tack rivet.
Letting the L 's float should accomplish the same thing but since
we can easily attach, I think drilling and riveting L 's to skin
will be made somewhat simpler by attaching to spar and rear
channel.
Anyways, with Randy's experience and observation and your
comments I've about mustered the courage and decided to go out
and rip a dozen or so strips of .025 and do some bendin, crimpin
and attachin. Adding another 3 - 5 hours to my building
experience:-).
Thanks for your obsers. and comments.
Sam(701, not sour, just ready to fly, unfortunately only me not
the plane)
>Everytime I look at my completed wings, I wish I had >added them
for
>asthetics alone.
>Randy L. Thwing, 701 plans
> Could you do what 601 builders do - take standard L angle and
using fluting
> pliers make false ribs to conform to the top and bottom of ribs
between the
> spars. Exactly what is seen in the picture but not attached to
the spars,
> just riveted to the wing skins. Allow for a little bit of
clearance front
> and aft. This way you don't have to make any complicated
hanger/attach
> points on the spars.
>
> Big improvement in the aesthetics department and should stiffen
the skins.
> A few hours now ( and this didn't take long at all) against a
lifetime of
> wishing you had.
>
> Regards Jeff
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "George Swinford" <grs-pms(at)mindspring.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Tubing For Glareshield Edge |
Hi Peter:
Thanks again. I have no idea whether we have such a store nearby, but a look
in the phone book should give me a clue.
George
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Chris Weber" <chrisoz(at)gmx.net> |
Hello Listers,
regarding false ribs. I was never really impressed by the way the false ribs
on the 601 HD wing stabilize the skin, there is still a fair amount of
oilcanning and sag noticable. On my wings I made up two braces for each
false rib, width about 10 cm, flanged on all sides, height and curvature
follows the the ribs. After closing the wing and before attaching the nose
skin I reached in through the spar holes (you need a long arm for that) and
inserted them between the upper and lower Ls on the skins, pushing them in
so they are slightly under compression and the false rib is in line with the
neighbouring true ribs. A low one about one third from the rear Z, and the
longer one one third from the spar. I halved the rivet spacing and that way
was able to ensure two rivets hold each brace on top and bottom. That way
the false rib is much stiffer, and even when stalling the wing there is
hardly any oilcanning or flutter. Makes for a very nice and clean wing.
Regards,
Chris Weber 601 TD 912, 1 hour
>
> Could you do what 601 builders do - take standard L angle and using
fluting
> pliers make false ribs to conform to the top and bottom of ribs between
the
> spars. Exactly what is seen in the picture but not attached to the spars,
> just riveted to the wing skins. Allow for a little bit of clearance front
> and aft. This way you don't have to make any complicated hanger/attach
> points on the spars.
>
> Big improvement in the aesthetics department and should stiffen the skins.
> A few hours now ( and this didn't take long at all) against a lifetime of
> wishing you had.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Tom Prugh & Evanne Browne <tomvan(at)erols.com> |
| Subject: | re need for false ribs in 601s |
I'm wondering if HDS builders and drivers have seen the oil-canning on
their tapered wings as much as the HD guys have? You'd think the shorter
ribs might reduce it.
Tom Prugh
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Carlos Sa <wings1(at)videotron.ca> |
Hello, folks
Just back home from business trip, and noticed several pictures on my
site were not accessible ("rudder" and "tools" pages).
I have fixed the problem, so you should now be able to view larger size
pictures by clicking the eyeball icons...
http://pages.infinit.net/wings/zodiac/main.html
Carlos
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "RUSSELL JOHNSON" <entec1(at)pld.com> |
| Subject: | wing joint cover |
Yesterday was too nice to stay inside, so I took the afternoon off and
worked on the wing joint cover strips.
Took a few photos of the finished results, if your interested they can be
viewed at my site in the "Builder Listing Database".
Russell J. / 601-HDS
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Larry C. McFarland" <larrymc(at)qconline.com> |
Hi guys,
I've come nearer the place where seat belts
and shoulder harnesses are concerned. What
is typical for the 601 hds in shoulder safety? Are
we using the y-strap, the H-strap or the single
shoulder diagonal type? If any of you have a
particular type you like or dislike, I'd like to know.
Thanks,
Larry C. McFarland - 601hds
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | MAC / Ray Allen control stick grips |
I hope to use the MAC/ Ray Allen control grips on my 601 HDS. Their site
cautions against using on sticks larger than 1" in diameter but ours are 1
1/8" diameter. They warn of tearing of the grip. However, I seem to have seen
a number of pics of various Zeniths with these grips though the thought did
not register with me at the time.
Have any of you used these grips and did you have any fitting / tearing
problems?
Thanks,
Chris
601 HDS N601BZ
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: MAC / Ray Allen control stick grips |
In a message dated 03/29/2002 3:37:36 PM US Mountain Standard Time,
SEAL2CC(at)aol.com writes:
>
I have these grips on my stick. If we are talking about the same product
they seem to fit perfectly. The real problem is that the top portion is too
small for the stick so you have to find an insert that you can put in to shim
up the space in there. After that they look and feel great.
Steve Freeman
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bill Morelli <billvt(at)together.net> |
| Subject: | Re: MAC / Ray Allen control stick grips |
I was warned against using the MAC grips by other builders (because of the
fat stick) but I lubricated mine with shaving cream and they went on fine.
Have not split in > 120 hours of flying.
Regards,
Bill (N812BM - HDS - Tri - Stratus - Vermont - 122.1 flight hrs. - 184
landings)
web site -> http://homepages.together.net/~billvt/
>I hope to use the MAC/ Ray Allen control grips on my 601 HDS. Their site
>cautions against using on sticks larger than 1" in diameter but ours are 1
>1/8" diameter. They warn of tearing of the grip. However, I seem to have seen
>a number of pics of various Zeniths with these grips though the thought did
>not register with me at the time.
>
>Have any of you used these grips and did you have any fitting / tearing
>problems?
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Phil Owens" <owensp(at)charter.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Oil & Air Filters Etc. |
Dear Bruce,
The only other option would be to locate an Amsoil Dealer in your
vacinity and inquire if he has any LF503's in stock, always a possibility
since Subaru is a fairly common engine. I believe the reason they state the
misapplication is that lots of folke don't really know what engine they are
ordering the part for, seems to happen a lot, I would believe since you are
far more familiar with your engine you would have it right, you could also
take the physical measurements of your current filter and verify they are
the same on the phone with H.O. Hope this helps.
Phil
----- Original Message -----
From: "Bruce Bockius" <bruce(at)whiteantelopesoftware.com>
Subject: RE: Zenith-List: Oil & Air Filters Etc.
>
> Phil,
>
> If you've been following this thread you'll know we're specifically
> looking for a filter to use on the Stratus Subaru engine conversion.
> I've been using NAPA Gold 1065 filters to this point. The
> cross-reference you mention on the Amsoil site says the LF503 is an
> equivelant ($8.15/ea, 3-5 week special order). It then goes on to say
> that they cannot be responsible for misapplications. I've previously
> looked up other filter manufacturers cross-references and found them to
> specify filters that are not really the same size as the original, and
> subsequently don't fit. So how do I know if the Amsoil filter really
> will fit?
>
> -Bruce/601HD/TDO/Stratus/303 hrs
>
> >
> > Dear Listers,
> > I have noticed lately a lot of questions regarding oil
> > filters and where to get quality oil,air,fuel & other similar
> > type quality products.
> > May I suggest you try looking at www.amsoil.com here you
> > will find a wealth of information as well as top notch
> > products and the related information to go with them. In the
> > event you need to cross reference a number of a filter with a
> > specific brand to find an equivalent amsoil filter the cross
> > reference tables are on the web site.
> > In the event you wish to order from the web site you can
> > and the products will be shipped to your door, you may if you
> > wish indicate my Z.O. number 81427 is you wish but you are
> > not required to do so, I am placing this information on the
> > site as an assistance to fellow builders and not as a sales
> > tool. I sincerely hope this will solve some problems for many
> > fellow builders.
> >
> > Sincerely,
> > Phil Owens
> > CH-801 Builder
> > N84349
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Lee Thomas <cltvet(at)mail.ocis.net> |
Anyone using a McCauley prop on a Continental 0-200 on a 701?
What length and pitch.
Lee (scratch building a 701)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "James Brigman" <jbrigman(at)nc.rr.com> |
| Subject: | Installing Grips |
>
> I hope to use the MAC/Ray Allen control grips on my 601 HDS.
> Their site cautions against using on sticks larger than 1"
> in diameter but ours are 1-1/8" diameter. They warn of
> tearing of the grip. However, I seem to have seen
> a number of pics of various Zeniths with these grips
> though the thought did not register with me at the time.
>
> Have any of you used these grips and did you have any fitting / tearing
> problems?
Chris;
Cyclists face this problem all the time if they use foam grips on their
handlebars, or on kid's bikes, the little plastic handgrips on the ends of
the handlebars. We use soap to get the stuff to go on. You can do hand soap,
like you are washing your hands, or for neater and more precise placement of
the soap, liquid dishwashing soap works OK. Be extremely conservative and
use water with it, it doesn't take much and if you apply too much, it'll
squish out of the end and make a mess. The advantage of soap is that when
the water dries, it doesn't remain slick, so your grip won't want to come
off. (We never use a conventional lubricant for this reason...the grips on
bikes will move around a lot if you do.) No problems with corrosion on the
handlebars when doing this. Most are aluminum, but cheaper ones are steel. I
don't think it'll corrode the metal, particularly if it's primed.
I think the Ray Allen people are correct about their cautions. Without using
lubricant, I'm sure there's a good chance of stressing or ripping the grip
when putting it on.
JKB
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jeff Paden" <jeffpaden(at)madbbs.com> |
I hope this is allowed on this list.. if not then let me know and I will be
sure to never do this again.
I have a McCauley Prop 72" that I have removed from my CH-300 since I just
purchased a new WarpDrive prop 66" for better ground clearance. If anyone
here needs a prop, I am willing to sell my olf mcCauley prop. It only has
60 total hours on it and I will donate part of the sale to the list to help
keep this list going. Not sure how much yet since I don't know what I will
get for the prop, but I will be very generous.
please email me off the list at jeffpaden(at)madbbs.com if you are interested.
BTW Hope to see a few of you at Sun-N-Fun, I am flying my ch-300 from
Jamestown, NY if the weather permits VFR.... (this should be fun ).
Jeff Paden
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Canpy directions |
Hi LIst,
Does anyone out there have a good step-by-step of how you made your canopy?
I find the plans a little confusing in this area so am looking to the "been
there, done that" crowd for some guidance. I especially want to make sure
that I leave as much room as possible for head clearance. I once sat in a
601 that had "a little higher than normal seats, and a little lower than
normal canopy" and with head phones on I had to tilt my head a little to
avoid hitting the canopy with the headset. I have been concerend about this
for a long time. And now that it is getting time to do it I want to make
sure a do it right the first time.
This project is getting exciting! That light at the end of tunnel is
starting to glow a little brighter each time I go out to the hangar now. I
might acutallu finish this thing!
THanks in advance for any and all help.
Steve Freeman
601HDS
N902AL
Transmorgrifier
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Rich <rich(at)carol.net> |
| Subject: | 801 torque tube bearings |
Section 3a page 6 of 11, pic fa3-7 says to drill the holes to 3/16 & the bottom
pic says to rivet.
Does anyone have 3/16 rivets in their kit? Is this supposed to be for AN3 bolts
or 5/32 holes with
A5 rivets?
Rich
801
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Carl Bertrand" <cgbrt(at)mondenet.com> |
| Subject: | Re: 701 false ribs |
Hi Sam,
I added extra .016 ribs to my 701 wings and I believe they do control oil
canning.
Oil canning causes airflow separation on top of the wing (visible with
tufts) but the effect on performance is not measurable.
Carl
701/912
----- Original Message -----
From: "Sam Cajun" <sam.caj(at)worldnet.att.net>
Subject: Zenith-List: 701 false ribs
>
> 701 builders and flyers, any thoughts on the need for the false
> ribs as pictured at:
> http://www.zenithair.com/stolch701/images/7-wing/7wing-wt.jpg
> Would appreciate your thoughts, experiences or ponderings. I'm
> almost at the point of dicision whether to or not to. This topic
> was discussed a good while back but can't seem to pull it up in
> the archives. From the wing photos I've seen, it looks about
> 50/50 for including and not including. I'm sure it would make a
> better looking wing, i.e. the wing would keep it's shape better
> but would require several additional hours of work.
> Is the reason for including totally asthetic or does the skin
> distort sufficiently in flight to affect lift?
> All comments appreciated.
>
> Sam(701, fuse , tail group done, controls in)
>
>
> UMIDS FROM ADDRESS: owner-zenith-list-server(at)matronics.com
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Doug Waer <dwaer(at)yahoo.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Installing Grips |
--- James Brigman wrote:
>
> >
> > I hope to use the MAC/Ray Allen control grips on my 601 HDS.
> > Their site cautions against using on sticks larger than 1"
> > in diameter but ours are 1-1/8" diameter. They warn of
> > tearing of the grip. However, I seem to have seen
> > a number of pics of various Zeniths with these grips
> > though the thought did not register with me at the time.
> >
> > Have any of you used these grips and did you have any fitting / tearing
> > problems?
>
> Chris;
> Cyclists face this problem all the time if they use foam grips on their
> handlebars, or on kid's bikes, the little plastic handgrips on the ends of
> the handlebars. We use soap to get the stuff to go on. You can do hand soap,
> like you are washing your hands, or for neater and more precise placement of
> the soap, liquid dishwashing soap works OK. Be extremely conservative and
> use water with it, it doesn't take much and if you apply too much, it'll
> squish out of the end and make a mess. The advantage of soap is that when
> the water dries, it doesn't remain slick, so your grip won't want to come
> off. (We never use a conventional lubricant for this reason...the grips on
> bikes will move around a lot if you do.) No problems with corrosion on the
> handlebars when doing this. Most are aluminum, but cheaper ones are steel. I
> don't think it'll corrode the metal, particularly if it's primed.
Actually, what I use when I'm putting grips on the bike is hair spray. It
works like a lubricant when it's wet, but when it dries, the grip is assured to
NEVER move.
Doug
601 Rudder.
=====
Douglas Waer :: Boeing Helicopter Systems :: Mesa, AZ :: 85215
http://home.earthlink.net/~dwaer/flying.html
http://greetings.yahoo.com/
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Joe Wooten" <wooten(at)nelsondesigngroup.com> |
I have been reading the Zenith list and have really not decided which
aircraft to build. With the new sport pilot on the horizon,why does the
601 hd not qualify and the 601xl does? What I can tell with the weigh
the H.D. would fit and cruise be right also? I must be overlooking
something? I like the useful load of the H.D . but the XL goes down
in that Cat. Could somebody clarify ,I need the high useful load for me
and my wide buddies. Is anyone actually using an 0-200 on the H.D. and
what does it do to the useful load? I would like to carry 500 lb.
passenger and pilot and very light bags. Thanks for any info,Joe Wooten
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Installing Grips |
In a message dated 3/30/02 8:39:24 PM Eastern Standard Time,
bryanmmartin(at)comcast.net writes:
> Are you sure your stick is 1 1/8"? The stick on my 601XL is 1 inch.
>
Actually that's probably a good question. I was just looking at the plans
specs which say 1 1/8". The stick is at the hangar and I won't be there for a
few days...I'll certainly double check.
Thanks,
Chris
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jerry Latimer" <ljm10587(at)qwest.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Installing Grips |
My HDS stick is 1 1/8 inches
Jerry Latimer
CH601HDS
----- Original Message -----
From: <SEAL2CC(at)aol.com>
Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Installing Grips
>
> In a message dated 3/30/02 8:39:24 PM Eastern Standard Time,
> bryanmmartin(at)comcast.net writes:
>
>
> > Are you sure your stick is 1 1/8"? The stick on my 601XL is 1 inch.
> >
>
> Actually that's probably a good question. I was just looking at the plans
> specs which say 1 1/8". The stick is at the hangar and I won't be there
for a
> few days...I'll certainly double check.
>
> Thanks,
> Chris
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "The Meiste's" <meiste(at)essex1.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Installing Grips |
I believe all the HD, & HDS models are 1 1/8".
Not sure on the XL???
Kelly
601 HD
> > Are you sure your stick is 1 1/8"? The stick on my 601XL is 1 inch.
> >
>
> Actually that's probably a good question. I was just looking at the plans
> specs which say 1 1/8".
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "The Meiste's" <meiste(at)essex1.com> |
With the new sport pilot on the horizon,why does the
601 hd not qualify and the 601xl does?
Joe,
I think it's because the XL has flaps, thus allowing the slower stall speed.
But if I recall you can lower the HD's gross from 1200 lbs, to 1050 lbs then
the HD will also qualify.
I've also heard rumors the HD & HDS were going to be discontinued, and only
the XL would carry on the 601 name. Seems it's to much hassle to produce
three planes that are very similar. And since the XL has the best of both
the HD, & HDS (high & low speeds + it's the newest) there's not much
incentive to build all three.
Kelly
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Joe Wooten" <wooten(at)nelsondesigngroup.com> |
Gang, I still may not totally understand what I am reading. I get
pretty blind sometimes when it is right before my face. If you optimize
the XL for sport pilot, you reduce the total gross for that? The H.D.
may be under weight if you really work at it but may fly slower and have
smaller stall number? According to the web site the XL has lower useful
load or does it? Is it is because the wing tanks and the fact the
useful load is not affected because of the wing tanks? The Mustang 2
has that ability and effectively increases the useful load by using the
wing tanks,no stress on the fuse. Those are my 2 main concerns is the
actual payload and a little baggage. I weigh 250 to 260 and all my
friends are close in weight about 225 to 235 . Sorry for the ignorance
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | ZodiacBuilder(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Shoulder belts |
In a message dated 3/29/2002 4:08:25 PM Eastern Standard Time,
larrymc(at)qconline.com writes:
> What
> is typical for the 601 hds in shoulder safety?
I have gone away from the Zenith design of having the strap bolted to the
gusset on the B1 tube. This put the belt at an angle that could cause spinal
compression in a frontal impact. Instead I cut a .040 al strip similar to
the ones the lap belts bolt too. Then I riveted it to the rear top skin,
between the tunes and skin, just behind the pilot and passenger seat head.
This puts the angle of the rear Y strap above the occupants head and reducing
the chance of injury.
John W. Tarabocchia
Web Site: http://hometown.aol.com/zodiacbuilder/Home.html
N6042T 60hrs Flown.....
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jeff & Marcia Davidson" <jdavidso(at)fcc.net> |
Joe,
In round numbers, the HD has a normal gross of 1200 pounds. Most
finished planes are about 600 pounds. With close to 475 pounds of pilot and
passenger, you only have 125 pounds left for fuel, baggage, dirt, paint, and
pilot stuff. The 16 gallon header tank would weigh 96 pounds full. It gets
a little iffy from there. Obviously, reducing the gross for Sport Pilot
would make the problem worse.
Jeff Davidson
CH 601 HD
----- Those are my 2 main concerns is the
> actual payload and a little baggage. I weigh 250 to 260 and all my
> friends are close in weight about 225 to 235 .
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Phil Owens" <owensp(at)charter.net> |
| Subject: | Re: 801 torque tube bearings |
Dear Rich, When I did mine I believe I used A-6 rivets and be careful to
make sure the rivets in the rear corners are flush as indicated in fa3-93,
the flap torque tube 8c8-6 has flanges on it that need to be able to pass
over the head of the rivet. I suppose if you don't have any A6 rivets one
could use the A5's as these are not structual and only hold the bearing in
place. Also be careful of ups, & forwards, I found it very important to read
ahead quite a bit here as there are several other things which connect. If
you have riveted the fuselage like I did you will find it necessary to drill
out some of the rivets and replace them when you install the brackets. Hope
all is going well, I have most of the controls installed as well as the
brakes and brake lines, I am now working on installing the fuel lines on the
interior of the fuselage from the wing roots to the firewall, along with the
fuel line covers, man, have they ever left out a lot of information from
here on in!!! I have advised ZAC of this and they say they are working on it
but I don't see any results yet so I am flying sort of blind and trying to
make sense of it all. Hope all is gooing well for you.
Phil
----- Original Message -----
From: "Rich" <rich(at)carol.net>
Subject: Zenith-List: 801 torque tube bearings
>
> Section 3a page 6 of 11, pic fa3-7 says to drill the holes to 3/16 & the
bottom pic says to rivet.
> Does anyone have 3/16 rivets in their kit? Is this supposed to be for AN3
bolts or 5/32 holes with
> A5 rivets?
>
> Rich
> 801
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Schemmel, Grant" <Grant.Schemmel(at)utmc.aeroflex.com> |
Hey guys,
I think some of us are quoting sport pilot AC numbers off the top of our heads - here are the requirements from www.sportpilot.org:
Certification of Aircraft
(printable version)
This NPRM establishes two new airworthiness certificates in the "Special" category-1)
a "Special light-sport" aircraft [FAR 21, paragraph 186] and 2) an "experimental
light-sport aircraft" [FAR 21, paragraph 191]. Note that the "Special"
airworthiness certificate category is a second category separate from "Standard"
airworthiness certificates (i.e. type-certificated aircraft).
Any aircraft seeking an airworthiness certificate in either the special light-sport
or experimental light-sport category must meet the following parameters:
1. Maximum Gross takeoff weight of 1,232 lbs (560 kg.) or less.
2. Lighter-than-air light-sport aircraft maximum gross weight of 660 lbs (300 kg.)
or less
3. Maximum stall speed-landing configuration (Vso): 39 knots or less
4. Maximum stall speed-without the use of lift-enhancement devices, (Vs1): 44 knots
or less
5. Maximum speed in level flight with maximum continuous power (Vh) of 115 knots
6. Two-place maximum (pilot and one passenger)
7. Single, non-turbine engine only
8. Fixed or ground adjustable propeller
9. Unpressurized cabin
10. Fixed landing gear
Just want to help set the record straight. ;)
Grant Schemmel
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Jeff & Marcia Davidson [mailto:jdavidso(at)fcc.net]
> Sent: Tuesday, December 31, 2002 9:45 PM
> To: zenith-list(at)matronics.com
> Subject: Re: Zenith-List: optimize xl
>
>
>
>
> Joe,
> In round numbers, the HD has a normal gross of 1200 pounds. Most
> finished planes are about 600 pounds. With close to 475
> pounds of pilot and
> passenger, you only have 125 pounds left for fuel, baggage,
> dirt, paint, and
> pilot stuff. The 16 gallon header tank would weigh 96 pounds
> full. It gets
> a little iffy from there. Obviously, reducing the gross for
> Sport Pilot
> would make the problem worse.
> Jeff Davidson
> CH 601 HD
>
> ----- Those are my 2 main concerns is the
> > actual payload and a little baggage. I weigh 250 to 260 and all my
> > friends are close in weight about 225 to 235 .
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "patrick walsh" <pwalsh4539(at)msn.com> |
...sounds to me as though the 601 HD would fit in nicely in the sport plane category.
Am I missing something?
----- Original Message -----
From: Schemmel, Grant
Subject: RE: Zenith-List: optimize xl
.Aeroflex.com>
Hey guys,
I think some of us are quoting sport pilot AC numbers off the top of our
heads - here are the requirements from www.sportpilot.org:
Certification of Aircraft
(printable version)
This NPRM establishes two new airworthiness certificates in the "Special" category-1)
a "Special light-sport" aircraft [FAR 21, paragraph 186] and 2) an "experimental
light-sport aircraft" [FAR 21, paragraph 191]. Note
that the "Special" airworthiness certificate category is a second category separate
from "Standard" airworthiness certificates (i.e. type-certificated aircraft).
Any aircraft seeking an airworthiness certificate in either the special light-sport
or experimental light-sport category must meet the following parameters:
1. Maximum Gross takeoff weight of 1,232 lbs (560 kg.) or less.
2. Lighter-than-air light-sport aircraft maximum gross weight of 660 lbs
(300 kg.) or less
3. Maximum stall speed-landing configuration (Vso): 39 knots or less
4. Maximum stall speed-without the use of lift-enhancement devices, (Vs1): 44 knots
or less
5. Maximum speed in level flight with maximum continuous power (Vh) of 115 knots
6. Two-place maximum (pilot and one passenger)
7. Single, non-turbine engine only
8. Fixed or ground adjustable propeller
9. Unpressurized cabin
10. Fixed landing gear
Just want to help set the record straight. ;)
Grant Schemmel
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Jeff & Marcia Davidson [mailto:jdavidso(at)fcc.net]
> Sent: Tuesday, December 31, 2002 9:45 PM
> To: zenith-list(at)matronics.com
> Subject: Re: Zenith-List: optimize xl
>
>
>
>
> Joe,
> In round numbers, the HD has a normal gross of 1200 pounds. Most
> finished planes are about 600 pounds. With close to 475
> pounds of pilot and
> passenger, you only have 125 pounds left for fuel, baggage,
> dirt, paint, and
> pilot stuff. The 16 gallon header tank would weigh 96 pounds
> full. It gets
> a little iffy from there. Obviously, reducing the gross for
> Sport Pilot
> would make the problem worse.
> Jeff Davidson
> CH 601 HD
>
> ----- Those are my 2 main concerns is the
> > actual payload and a little baggage. I weigh 250 to 260 and all my
> > friends are close in weight about 225 to 235 .
>
>
=
=
=
=
Get mor
________________________________________________________________________________
Hi List,
This question is a touch premature but I was just wondering as I prep to do
the canopy. I haven't even tried yet, but is there a trick to getting the
protective film off of the canopy or does it just pull off? Obviously I
don't want to take it off until absolutely necessary but was just wondering.
Thanks,
Steve
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | AWilson62(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Installing Grips |
I used the mac grips on my 701 with the 1-1/8 inch tubes. It still fits, you
just have to persuade it alittle. I used a lubricant, shaving cream. I was
all ready to modify things and I said I will try it as it is first. It has
been on for 3 years and the foam hasnt split or anything.
Alan
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | AWilson62(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: 701 false ribs |
Its asthetic, but I didn't do it and I think it would help with things like
removing snow and washing the aircraft. It seems so fragile between ribs.
But I also know that I havent damaged anything yet so its probably all in my
mind.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Steve Danielson" <steved(at)nc.rr.com> |
I thought I saw that there were 2 minimum stall speeds in sport pilot, one
for planes with flaps and one for planes without flaps. This is new, and I
think it means that the 601 HD will qualify at the 1200# gross.
Steve
----- Original Message -----
From: "The Meiste's" <meiste(at)essex1.com>
Subject: Re: Zenith-List: 601 hd
>
> With the new sport pilot on the horizon,why does the
> 601 hd not qualify and the 601xl does?
>
>
> Joe,
> I think it's because the XL has flaps, thus allowing the slower stall
speed.
> But if I recall you can lower the HD's gross from 1200 lbs, to 1050 lbs
then
> the HD will also qualify.
> I've also heard rumors the HD & HDS were going to be discontinued, and
only
> the XL would carry on the 601 name. Seems it's to much hassle to produce
> three planes that are very similar. And since the XL has the best of both
> the HD, & HDS (high & low speeds + it's the newest) there's not much
> incentive to build all three.
>
> Kelly
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bob <rab22(at)bigfoot.com> |
| Subject: | Zenith 601 in bay area? |
If anyone has a 601 in the SF bay area, either flying or under construction,
I would really appreciate a chance to to see it.
Thanks in advance,
Bob Belshe
Moraga, CA
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "George Swinford" <grs-pms(at)mindspring.com> |
Steve:
It pulls off easily. I pulled off just enough to attach the bubble to the
frame, cut it with scissors and left the rest in place.
George
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Joe Wooten" <wooten(at)nelsondesigngroup.com> |
That is what I get out of it that the H.D. should qualify for the sport
pilot. It has enough useful load for me but not the XL. I guess the
difference is the engine used. I wonder if you took the XL and H.D and
weighed just the airplane ,would they be the same? I wonder if they
get the less useful load ,according to the web site of 30 lb. less for
the XL in the configured weight of 1300 lb. verses the H.D. of 1200 lb.
gross. I suspect Zenith will not put the H.D in the sport cat. if they
are going to discontinue it. Would it be a big deal to the FAA to put
it in that cat. if Zenith discontinues? Say you bought a partial kit
later and it weighed under the 1230 lb.. and qualified under all the
rules. Would it be a problem to use it for that purpose of Sport Pilot
rules? Joe Wooten
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Upper middle skin |
| From: | Michael R Fortunato <wizard-24(at)juno.com> |
I'm wrestling with attaching the upper rear skin on my XL, and have two
questions:
1. At the front of the skin, near the bottom edge, where it needs to
follow the curve around the fuselage at the upper longeron, how did
everyone do that without having the skin bunch up on you? It's a compound
curve, and a flat skin, and the two just don't seem to mesh.
2. At the front edge where you're supposed to "use a block of wood to
bend the edge down over the tube frame"....is that what everyone is
doing? Does it end up looking OK? This is one of those areas that once
it's done, it's done.
I'm building an XL, but I'm fairly sure the other 601 models have the
same situation.
Thanks!
Mike Fortunato
601XL
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Upper middle skin |
In a message dated 04/01/2002 4:38:06 PM US Mountain Standard Time,
wizard-24(at)juno.com writes:
> At the front of the skin, near the bottom edge, where it needs to
> follow the curve around the fuselage at the upper longeron, how did
> everyone do that without having the skin bunch up on you? It's a compound
>
Mine had a little bit of wave to the last couple of inches as has every
zodiac I have seen so far. Some are less than others, but I have never seen
one without any at all. One thing you will find is that when you button it
up with rivets much of it becomes much less noticable, and you can decrease
the rivet pitch (add more rivets) in that area to further reduce the ripple
effect there.
Also, I don;t know if you have trimmed the sides off yet (the skin is much
wider than needed as supplied by the factory.) But once you get the skin to
the appropriate size much of the ripple goes away as well.
<>
I have used some rubber edging material that I glued along the forward edge
of the top middle skin. I left a little bit of an overhang and then glued
that stuff on there. I think it looks far superior than trying to force that
skin around the tubes. Some people have uses split fuel hose around there
also.
Good luck, that was a tricky section drilling those tubes!
Steve Freeman
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "George Swinford" <grs-pms(at)mindspring.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Upper middle skin |
Mike:
I notched the skin at the forward edge where it wraps around the tube. That
allowed it to wrap OK, but if I were to do it again I would let the edge
project and use a rubber trim strip to give it a finished appearance. P/N
05-01400 on page 126 of the current ACS catalog would be good. One builder
reported using a slit piece of rubber fuel line to finish off that edge.
I trimmed my upper skin at frame B3 and used a separate triangular skin on
each side between B3 and B2. That way the small contour discrepancies
between B3 and B2 are not a problem, and the lower edge is easy to fit to
the longeron. Also, if you don't get a good looking fit the first time you
haven't spoiled that whole big top skin. I really advise doing it that way.
I hope this gives you some ideas.
George
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bryan Martin <bryanmmartin(at)comcast.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Upper middle skin |
> I'm wrestling with attaching the upper rear skin on my XL, and have two
> questions:
>
> 1. At the front of the skin, near the bottom edge, where it needs to
> follow the curve around the fuselage at the upper longeron, how did
> everyone do that without having the skin bunch up on you? It's a compound
> curve, and a flat skin, and the two just don't seem to mesh.
>
I put an old piece of coax cable under the edge of the skin here and worked
it over with a wood block to try to form the metal into the compound curve.
It took a few hours and I eventually drilled twice as many rivet holes as
called for (Iended up with a rivet pitch of about 20mm in this area) and now
it looks like it will work out fairly smooth.
> 2. At the front edge where you're supposed to "use a block of wood to
> bend the edge down over the tube frame"....is that what everyone is
> doing? Does it end up looking OK? This is one of those areas that once
> it's done, it's done.
>
I worked it with a block then unclecoed the skin and moved it forward a
little and tapped back on the edge, reclecoed it and worked it some more and
many hours later it looks pretty good although there are still a few small
wrinkles along this edge. You are trying to shrink the skin to form it over
these curves, it can be done just take it a little at a time. I have a few
wrinkles because I tried to go too fast.
--
Bryan Martin
N61BM, CH 601 XL, Stratus Subaru.
Wings, tail and fuselage done, wheels and tail mounted.
Working on canopy.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Pinneo, George" <George.Pinneo(at)trw.com> |
| Subject: | 601 HDS Wing Root Fairing Reinforcement |
I spoke with Nicholas recently about dented/dinged trailing edges of the Wing Root
Fairing. He acknowledged the .016" skin is too thin to withstand much abuse.
He recommends bending up a piece of .040" thick material into about a 9 degree
included angle and A4 riveting it across the trailing edge, inside the Fairing.
I used 3003 H14 for the reinforcement angle with a 50 mm rivet pitch; it does add
weight. I'll tell you in a year or so how well it holds up to weekly flying,
sometimes with kids.
GGP
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Rich <rich(at)carol.net> |
| Subject: | Re: 801 torque tube bearings |
Ok, thanks for the heads up. Did you use the plastic brake lines or alum tubing?
I think I'll go for
the alum tubing option. I read a few posts where the brakes were spongy because
the plastic lines
were expanding.
Rich
Phil Owens wrote:
>
>
> Dear Rich, When I did mine I believe I used A-6 rivets and be careful to
> make sure the rivets in the rear corners are flush as indicated in fa3-93,
> the flap torque tube 8c8-6 has flanges on it that need to be able to pass
> over the head of the rivet. I suppose if you don't have any A6 rivets one
> could use the A5's as these are not structual and only hold the bearing in
> place. Also be careful of ups, & forwards, I found it very important to read
> ahead quite a bit here as there are several other things which connect. If
> you have riveted the fuselage like I did you will find it necessary to drill
> out some of the rivets and replace them when you install the brackets. Hope
> all is going well, I have most of the controls installed as well as the
> brakes and brake lines, I am now working on installing the fuel lines on the
> interior of the fuselage from the wing roots to the firewall, along with the
> fuel line covers, man, have they ever left out a lot of information from
> here on in!!! I have advised ZAC of this and they say they are working on it
> but I don't see any results yet so I am flying sort of blind and trying to
> make sense of it all. Hope all is gooing well for you.
>
> Phil
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Rich" <rich(at)carol.net>
> To:
> Subject: Zenith-List: 801 torque tube bearings
>
> >
> > Section 3a page 6 of 11, pic fa3-7 says to drill the holes to 3/16 & the
> bottom pic says to rivet.
> > Does anyone have 3/16 rivets in their kit? Is this supposed to be for AN3
> bolts or 5/32 holes with
> > A5 rivets?
> >
> > Rich
> > 801
> >
> >
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Collins <collins(at)pali.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Zenith 601 in bay area? |
Hi Bob,
I know of several in the bay area including 2 on the ramp
at RHV. I will contact the owners if you are interested.
Bob Collins
Sunnyvale CA USA
Bob wrote:
>
>
> If anyone has a 601 in the SF bay area, either flying or under construction,
> I would really appreciate a chance to to see it.
>
> Thanks in advance,
>
> Bob Belshe
> Moraga, CA
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Kilby, Roger" <Roger.Kilby(at)DynCorp.com> |
Steve,
I recall that it just peeled off mine.
Roger Kilby
N98RK 601HDS
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | djohn <djohn(at)ekns.net> |
| Subject: | 601 rib forming blocks |
I made the 601 hd nose rib forming blocks as per 6-v-1.
After forming the ribs they are a couple of mm taller
than the factory built center spar.
Has anyone else had this problem?
Doug Johnson
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Bill Steer" <bsteer(at)gwi.net> |
| Subject: | Re: 601 rib forming blocks |
On page 16 of the Manual, under "OUTBOARD WING PANELS," it notes that the ribs
are sized to fit the center wing spar and will be too tall for the outboard
panels. It says to lightly hammer them down until they fit.
Hope this helps.
Bill
> I made the 601 hd nose rib forming blocks as per 6-v-1.
> After forming the ribs they are a couple of mm taller
> than the factory built center spar.
> Has anyone else had this problem?
>
> Doug Johnson
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Zenith-List Digest: 22 Msgs - 04/01/02 |
| From: | Grant Corriveau <grantC(at)total.net> |
on 02/04/02 02:57, Zenith-List Digest Server at
zenith-list-digest(at)matronics.com wrote:
> I notched the skin at the forward edge where it wraps around the tube. That
> allowed it to wrap OK, but if I were to do it again I would let the edge
> project and use a rubber trim strip to give it a finished appearance. P/N
> 05-01400 on page 126 of the current ACS catalog would be good. One builder
> reported using a slit piece of rubber fuel line to finish off that edge.
I used a piece of foam tubing that is sold for insulating household pipes -
and didn't have to leave an edge on the skin at it goes over the tube itself
as well. It makes it look a little like a roll-bar (i.e. larger diameter),
and provides a comfortable hand-grip from all angles.
Grant
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Bruce Bockius" <bruce(at)whiteantelopesoftware.com> |
> What would stop you from rating your airplane with two
> configurations...similar to a Cessna with normal and utility
> ratings. You just make the baggage lockers unusable (lower
> gross weight )when operated by a sport licensed pilot and
> they can't use the nav lights etc etc.
And how does one, or actually the FAA, determine the stall speed of a
kitplane? When I tested my 601HD w/Stratus I got a stall speed at
1200lbs gross weight of 34KIAS. Quite possibly this is in error due to
the position of the pitot tube... But who knows? As far as I'm
concerned, and as the manufacturer, I'm declaring N269BB's stall speed
to be 34kts at 1200lbs...
-Bruce/601HD/Stratus/TDO/303hrs
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Pinneo, George" <George.Pinneo(at)trw.com> |
| Subject: | Front Hinged Canopy 601HD |
See archived records for my forward-hinged canopy. Mine is simpler than Zenith's,
I believe.
GGP
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "P. L. Jenkins" <capt_over(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | Inspection Schedule |
I remember reading on the EAA site about when you should have an inspector
come by and take a looksee at your plane in progress, but I can't seem to
find that information again. I'm getting ready to close the horizontal stab
and thought maybe I should make sure that it's okay to do so without someone
"official" taking a peek.. Could someone give me an idea when I should have
the FAA rep come by and take a looksee? Thanks!
Paul Jenkins
601HDS
http://members.tripod.com/kb9vwj
Join the worlds largest e-mail service with MSN Hotmail.
http://www.hotmail.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Pinneo, George" <George.Pinneo(at)trw.com> |
| Subject: | Inspection Schedule |
The FAA didn't want to, refused to, come look at my HDS, 6 years ago; they're too
busy with commercial aircraft. They wanted me to use a D.A.R.; so I did.
My DAR looked at my plane when I declared I was ready to take it to the airport
and begin taxi-tests and had my tail number on the aircraft. He signed mine
off after a less than one hour inspection in my garage. I made my first flight
a week later, after he gave me the 40-hour limited airworthyness cert.
GGP
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Ed Kramer" <edkramer(at)prodigy.net> |
| Subject: | Inspection Schedule |
Question:
I'm getting ready to close the horizontal stab
and thought maybe I should make sure that it's okay to do so without
someone
"official" taking a peek.. Could someone give me an idea when I should
have
the FAA rep come by and take a looksee? Thanks!
Paul,
Before closing any part of your project you should have an EAA
Technical Advisor look at it. Any IA, A&P or even someone who has
already built that type of airplane can take a look (not the FAA at this
time). The FAA basically, wants another set of eyes looking at it. Make
sure to record it in your log.
When the airplane is finished and ready for the Airworthiness
Certificate an FAA DAR must do the final inspection. If I can find where
that rule is I'll post it.
Ed Kramer
West Seneca, NY
STOL CH 701
edkramer(at)prodigy.net
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Cy Galley" <cgalley(at)qcbc.org> |
| Subject: | Re: Inspection Schedule |
20 years ago there was a "pre-closure" inspection. Now there is only the
final air worthiness inspection.
Cy Galley, TC - Chair, Emergency Aircraft Repair, Oshkosh
Editor, EAA Safety Programs
cgalley(at)qcbc.org or experimenter(at)eaa.org
Always looking for articles for the Experimenter
----- Original Message -----
From: "P. L. Jenkins" <capt_over(at)hotmail.com>
Subject: Zenith-List: Inspection Schedule
I remember reading on the EAA site about when you should have an inspector
come by and take a looksee at your plane in progress, but I can't seem to
find that information again. I'm getting ready to close the horizontal stab
and thought maybe I should make sure that it's okay to do so without someone
"official" taking a peek.. Could someone give me an idea when I should have
the FAA rep come by and take a looksee? Thanks!
Paul Jenkins
601HDS
http://members.tripod.com/kb9vwj
Join the worlds largest e-mail service with MSN Hotmail.
http://www.hotmail.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Cy Galley" <cgalley(at)qcbc.org> |
| Subject: | Re: Inspection Schedule |
However, your should contact your local EAA Technical Counselor to check up
on your work so you are building correctly and safely.
Cy Galley, TC - Chair, Emergency Aircraft Repair, Oshkosh
Editor, EAA Safety Programs
cgalley(at)qcbc.org or experimenter(at)eaa.org
Always looking for articles for the Experimenter
----- Original Message -----
From: "P. L. Jenkins" <capt_over(at)hotmail.com>
Subject: Zenith-List: Inspection Schedule
I remember reading on the EAA site about when you should have an inspector
come by and take a looksee at your plane in progress, but I can't seem to
find that information again. I'm getting ready to close the horizontal stab
and thought maybe I should make sure that it's okay to do so without someone
"official" taking a peek.. Could someone give me an idea when I should have
the FAA rep come by and take a looksee? Thanks!
Paul Jenkins
601HDS
http://members.tripod.com/kb9vwj
Join the worlds largest e-mail service with MSN Hotmail.
http://www.hotmail.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "P. L. Jenkins" <capt_over(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | Inspection Schedule |
George,
So, you only had one inspection, and that was after you completed the
assembly?
Paul Jenkins
601-HDS
http://members.tripod.com/kb9vwj
>From: "Pinneo, George" <George.Pinneo(at)trw.com>
>Reply-To: zenith-list(at)matronics.com
>To: zenith-list(at)matronics.com
>Subject: RE: Zenith-List: Inspection Schedule
>Date: Tue, 2 Apr 2002 15:30:13 -0800
>
>
>The FAA didn't want to, refused to, come look at my HDS, 6 years ago;
>they're too busy with commercial aircraft. They wanted me to use a D.A.R.;
>so I did. My DAR looked at my plane when I declared I was ready to take it
>to the airport and begin taxi-tests and had my tail number on the aircraft.
> He signed mine off after a less than one hour inspection in my garage. I
>made my first flight a week later, after he gave me the 40-hour limited
>airworthyness cert.
>
>GGP
>
>
Join the worlds largest e-mail service with MSN Hotmail.
http://www.hotmail.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "The Meiste's" <meiste(at)essex1.com> |
List,
My Stratus came with foam UNI air filters on my Bing Carbs.
Can anyone tell me if these foam filters need to be oiled, or are they
left dry?
Kelly Meiste
601 HD
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Ed Kramer" <edkramer(at)prodigy.net> |
| Subject: | Inspection Schedule |
Question:
I'm getting ready to close the horizontal stab
and thought maybe I should make sure that it's okay to do so without
someone
"official" taking a peek.. Could someone give me an idea when I should
have
the FAA rep come by and take a looksee? Thanks!
This is from the EAA website.
Common sense tells us we will want to have precover or in-process
inspections of our project accomplished. These inspections should be
performed by a person with proper qualifications. Several choices are
available. You should be involved with your local EAA Chapter and find
out if an EAA Technical Counselor is available. A Technical Counselor is
a designated individual with a proven broad background who has been
selected by his EAA Chapter as an advisor. Most Chapters have Technical
Counselors who have building experience. If possible, select a person
who has experience in building your particular airplane or at least with
the same type of construction. If a counselor is not available, find
someone else who has built a similar type airplane who would be willing
to look over your shoulder and help you look for problem areas. Finally,
a licensed mechanic (A&P) can be valuable in performing inspections.
Preferably, the mechanic should have experience with experimental
airplanes.
This article is at: eaa.org From the Home Page click Homebuilts,
then, Homebuilders headquarters, Planning, and finally Where Do I Begin
Ed Kramer
West Seneca, NY
STOL CH 701
edkramer(at)prodigy.net
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "P. L. Jenkins" <capt_over(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Inspection Schedule |
Cy,
Thanks for the reply... So, legally, no one needs to look at my airplane
until the airworthyness inspection? (logic notwithstanding.)
P.
>From: "Cy Galley" <cgalley(at)qcbc.org>
>Reply-To: zenith-list(at)matronics.com
>To:
>Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Inspection Schedule
>Date: Tue, 2 Apr 2002 18:47:48 -0600
>
>
>20 years ago there was a "pre-closure" inspection. Now there is only the
>final air worthiness inspection.
>
>Cy Galley, TC - Chair, Emergency Aircraft Repair, Oshkosh
>
>Editor, EAA Safety Programs
>cgalley(at)qcbc.org or experimenter(at)eaa.org
>
>Always looking for articles for the Experimenter
>
>----- Original Message -----
>From: "P. L. Jenkins" <capt_over(at)hotmail.com>
>To:
>Subject: Zenith-List: Inspection Schedule
>
>
>I remember reading on the EAA site about when you should have an inspector
>come by and take a looksee at your plane in progress, but I can't seem to
>find that information again. I'm getting ready to close the horizontal
>stab
>and thought maybe I should make sure that it's okay to do so without
>someone
>"official" taking a peek.. Could someone give me an idea when I should
>have
>the FAA rep come by and take a looksee? Thanks!
>
>Paul Jenkins
>601HDS
>http://members.tripod.com/kb9vwj
>
>Join the worlds largest e-mail service with MSN Hotmail.
>http://www.hotmail.com
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Cy Galley" <cgalley(at)qcbc.org> |
| Subject: | Re: Inspection Schedule |
That is correct but I strongly suggest you get an experienced mechanic,
builder, EAA Tech Counselor to look it over before you go too far.
Cy Galley, TC - Chair, Emergency Aircraft Repair, Oshkosh
Editor, EAA Safety Programs
cgalley(at)qcbc.org or experimenter(at)eaa.org
Always looking for articles for the Experimenter
----- Original Message -----
From: "P. L. Jenkins" <capt_over(at)hotmail.com>
Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Inspection Schedule
Cy,
Thanks for the reply... So, legally, no one needs to look at my airplane
until the airworthyness inspection? (logic notwithstanding.)
P.
>From: "Cy Galley" <cgalley(at)qcbc.org>
>Reply-To: zenith-list(at)matronics.com
>To:
>Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Inspection Schedule
>Date: Tue, 2 Apr 2002 18:47:48 -0600
>
>
>20 years ago there was a "pre-closure" inspection. Now there is only the
>final air worthiness inspection.
>
>Cy Galley, TC - Chair, Emergency Aircraft Repair, Oshkosh
>
>Editor, EAA Safety Programs
>cgalley(at)qcbc.org or experimenter(at)eaa.org
>
>Always looking for articles for the Experimenter
>
>----- Original Message -----
>From: "P. L. Jenkins" <capt_over(at)hotmail.com>
>To:
>Subject: Zenith-List: Inspection Schedule
>
>
>I remember reading on the EAA site about when you should have an inspector
>come by and take a looksee at your plane in progress, but I can't seem to
>find that information again. I'm getting ready to close the horizontal
>stab
>and thought maybe I should make sure that it's okay to do so without
>someone
>"official" taking a peek.. Could someone give me an idea when I should
>have
>the FAA rep come by and take a looksee? Thanks!
>
>Paul Jenkins
>601HDS
>http://members.tripod.com/kb9vwj
>
>Join the worlds largest e-mail service with MSN Hotmail.
>http://www.hotmail.com
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jeff & Marcia Davidson" <jdavidso(at)fcc.net> |
Grant,
What I was trying to say to Joe is that the 601 would probably be over
the 1200 gross with a normal empty weight (600), fuel (96), and passengers
(475). The math, in round numbers, gives you just under 1200 pounds and you
haven't figured the weight any pilot goodies, tools, or baggage. I was
saying that the 601 might not meet Joe's needs because of the gross weight,
not any problem with sport pilot. He has since indicated otherwise as far
as the useful load is concerned. My thought is that the weight may "tip
the scales" away from the 601 toward a choice of something bigger for his
mission.
Do you not agree that the maximum gross limit might be a problem for his
mission?
Jeff Davidson
----- Original Message -----
From: "Schemmel, Grant" <Grant.Schemmel(at)utmc.aeroflex.com>
Subject: RE: Zenith-List: optimize xl
>
> Hey guys,
>
> I think some of us are quoting sport pilot AC numbers off the top of our
heads - here are the requirements from www.sportpilot.org:
>
>
> Certification of Aircraft
> (printable version)
>
> This NPRM establishes two new airworthiness certificates in the "Special"
category-1) a "Special light-sport" aircraft [FAR 21, paragraph 186] and 2)
an "experimental light-sport aircraft" [FAR 21, paragraph 191]. Note that
the "Special" airworthiness certificate category is a second category
separate from "Standard" airworthiness certificates (i.e. type-certificated
aircraft).
>
> Any aircraft seeking an airworthiness certificate in either the special
light-sport or experimental light-sport category must meet the following
parameters:
>
> 1. Maximum Gross takeoff weight of 1,232 lbs (560 kg.) or less.
>
> 2. Lighter-than-air light-sport aircraft maximum gross weight of 660 lbs
(300 kg.) or less
>
> 3. Maximum stall speed-landing configuration (Vso): 39 knots or less
>
> 4. Maximum stall speed-without the use of lift-enhancement devices, (Vs1):
44 knots or less
>
> 5. Maximum speed in level flight with maximum continuous power (Vh) of 115
knots
>
> 6. Two-place maximum (pilot and one passenger)
>
> 7. Single, non-turbine engine only
>
> 8. Fixed or ground adjustable propeller
>
> 9. Unpressurized cabin
>
> 10. Fixed landing gear
>
> Just want to help set the record straight. ;)
>
> Grant Schemmel
>
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: Jeff & Marcia Davidson [mailto:jdavidso(at)fcc.net]
> > Sent: Tuesday, December 31, 2002 9:45 PM
> > To: zenith-list(at)matronics.com
> > Subject: Re: Zenith-List: optimize xl
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Joe,
> > In round numbers, the HD has a normal gross of 1200 pounds. Most
> > finished planes are about 600 pounds. With close to 475
> > pounds of pilot and passenger, you only have 125 pounds left for fuel,
baggage,
> > dirt, paint, and pilot stuff. The 16 gallon header tank would weigh 96
pounds
> > full. It gets a little iffy from there. Obviously, reducing the gross
for
> > Sport Pilot would make the problem worse.
> > Jeff Davidson
> > CH 601 HD
> >
> > ----- Those are my 2 main concerns is the
> > > actual payload and a little baggage. I weigh 250 to 260 and all my
> > > friends are close in weight about 225 to 235 .
> >
> >
> >
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Darryl West (Home)" <rdwest(at)shaw.ca> |
Kelly:
I had a bad experience with the UNI foam air filters I installed on my Rotax
912UL.
They worked OK for a while, then cracked thru the rubber neck and one fell
of in flight. Caused a melted mess on my muffler.
If you really want to use them, they do required oiling (try
motorcycle/snowmobile/boat store).
I now use the K&N filters (also need oiling).
Darryl
rdwest(at)shaw.ca
http://members.shaw.ca/rdwest/index.htm
List,
My Stratus came with foam UNI air filters on my Bing Carbs.
Can anyone tell me if these foam filters need to be oiled, or are they
left dry?
Kelly Meiste
601 HD
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Cleone Markwell <cleone(at)rr1.net> |
Bully for you! I like your idea, but will it fly? I had quite a time with
getting a good static system before I felt like I had a fairly accurate
airspeed reading. I bought two static ports from Wag, one on each side,
and used a Y connection. It is still difficult to nail down the stall
speed since I never have had mine 'fall through', but the mushing decent
gets very bad around 45 mph indicated. I use an angle of attack indicator
and calibrated it so that the stall indication is reached at 45 + or -. Cleone
>
>
>> What would stop you from rating your airplane with two
>> configurations...similar to a Cessna with normal and utility
>> ratings. You just make the baggage lockers unusable (lower
>> gross weight )when operated by a sport licensed pilot and
>> they can't use the nav lights etc etc.
>
>And how does one, or actually the FAA, determine the stall speed of a
>kitplane? When I tested my 601HD w/Stratus I got a stall speed at
>1200lbs gross weight of 34KIAS. Quite possibly this is in error due to
>the position of the pitot tube... But who knows? As far as I'm
>concerned, and as the manufacturer, I'm declaring N269BB's stall speed
>to be 34kts at 1200lbs...
>
> -Bruce/601HD/Stratus/TDO/303hrs
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bill Morelli <billvt(at)together.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Inspection Schedule |
As it was explained to me by the DAR that inspected my aircraft, he (the
DAR) does inspect the aircraft but does not certify it airworthy. You as
the builder make an entry in the aircraft log that the aircraft is
airworthy and then you sign it as the builder. The final inspection makes
sure that all paperwork and regs have been complied with to allow an
airworthiness certificate to be issued. The DAR does issue the
airworthiness certificate based on your signing off on the aircraft. Here
are the entries that are recorded in my log:
By the DAR: "I find that this aircraft meets the requirements for the
certification requested and have issued a special airworthiness certificate
dated: (date goes here). The next inspection is due (one year from this
date) Signed (DAR signature and his DAR#)"
By me: "Completed kit of airplane - Inspected and determined to be
airworthy - by manufacturer per FAR 43 App. D (Signed by me as manufacturer)"
I did have this same DAR look at my aircraft two times before the final
inspection.
Regards,
Bill (N812BM - HDS - Tri - Stratus - Vermont - 123.9 flight hrs. - 189
landings)
web site -> http://homepages.together.net/~billvt/
>Cy,
>
> Thanks for the reply... So, legally, no one needs to look at my airplane
>until the airworthyness inspection? (logic notwithstanding.)
>
>P.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bill Morelli <billvt(at)together.net> |
Kelly,
I have the foam filters and do not oil them. Maybe I'm supposed to but no
one (including Stratus) ever said to. I have not had any problems in > 120
hours. I do check my entire engine compartment before each flight by
pulling the top cowl. Checking the filters is part of the check.
How about All of you other Stratus flyers, are you using the foam and and
oiling them?
Regards,
Bill (N812BM - HDS - Tri - Stratus - Vermont - 123.9 flight hrs. - 189
landings)
web site -> http://homepages.together.net/~billvt/
>My Stratus came with foam UNI air filters on my Bing Carbs.
>Can anyone tell me if these foam filters need to be oiled, or are they
>left dry?
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bill Morelli <billvt(at)together.net> |
I know this is very premature but I am wondering if anyone is planning on
flying their ZAC aircraft from the Northeast to OshKosh. I plan on flying
my HDS and would like to meet up with other aircraft to make the trip in a
group of two or more.
Thanks,
Bill
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Hal Rozema <hartist1(at)cox.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Inspection Schedule |
My EAA Tech Advisor here in Phoenix makes regular reports which are on file for
my
A/C in Oshkosh (in some file drawer or Computer file). It is also good insurance
on the sales value of the aircraft to have all the reports at EAA and your log
and
all assembly photos available when sold as well as inspected for first flight.
My
EAA tech Adv. is in charge of all fixed wing and rotarcraft for Maricopa County,
Engine, Instrument and Air Frame.
I won't sweat quite so hard on that first crime.... committing aviating.
Incidentally got my custom N number in less than a week by using the new internet
application and a credit card.
We are N701Poppa Fox
Hal R
theplanefolks.net
Bill Morelli wrote:
>
> As it was explained to me by the DAR that inspected my aircraft, he (the
> DAR) does inspect the aircraft but does not certify it airworthy. You as
> the builder make an entry in the aircraft log that the aircraft is
> airworthy and then you sign it as the builder. The final inspection makes
> sure that all paperwork and regs have been complied with to allow an
> airworthiness certificate to be issued. The DAR does issue the
> airworthiness certificate based on your signing off on the aircraft. Here
> are the entries that are recorded in my log:
>
> By the DAR: "I find that this aircraft meets the requirements for the
> certification requested and have issued a special airworthiness certificate
> dated: (date goes here). The next inspection is due (one year from this
> date) Signed (DAR signature and his DAR#)"
>
> By me: "Completed kit of airplane - Inspected and determined to be
> airworthy - by manufacturer per FAR 43 App. D (Signed by me as manufacturer)"
>
> I did have this same DAR look at my aircraft two times before the final
> inspection.
>
> Regards,
> Bill (N812BM - HDS - Tri - Stratus - Vermont - 123.9 flight hrs. - 189
> landings)
> web site -> http://homepages.together.net/~billvt/
>
> >Cy,
> >
> > Thanks for the reply... So, legally, no one needs to look at my airplane
> >until the airworthyness inspection? (logic notwithstanding.)
> >
> >P.
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Chuck Deiterich" <cfd(at)tstar.net> |
The instruction book for my ELT says that:
"With a current Private Aircraft Radio Station License, no further
station licensing is required for the ELT installation."
I thought that you no longer needed an aircraft radio license (in the
USA). Does anyone know for sure?
Chuck D.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Gary K" <flyink(at)efortress.com> |
I took my UNI foam filters off and replaced them with K&N, but these are the
same foam filters that I used on motocross bikes for years. Yes, they
should be oiled (very light coat). Foam filter oil is available at any
motorcycle shop. Of course the dirt bike filters would be totally crusted
in dirt so they had to be cleaned and re-oiled almost every ride. The oil
helps collect the dust.
Gary K.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Bill Morelli" <billvt(at)together.net>
Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Air Filter
>
> Kelly,
>
> I have the foam filters and do not oil them. Maybe I'm supposed to but no
> one (including Stratus) ever said to. I have not had any problems in > 120
> hours. I do check my entire engine compartment before each flight by
> pulling the top cowl. Checking the filters is part of the check.
>
> How about All of you other Stratus flyers, are you using the foam and and
> oiling them?
>
> Regards,
> Bill (N812BM - HDS - Tri - Stratus - Vermont - 123.9 flight hrs. - 189
> landings)
> web site -> http://homepages.together.net/~billvt/
>
>
> >My Stratus came with foam UNI air filters on my Bing Carbs.
> >Can anyone tell me if these foam filters need to be oiled, or are they
> >left dry?
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Zenith-List Digest: 34 Msgs - 04/02/02 |
| From: | Grant Corriveau <grantC(at)total.net> |
on 03/04/02 02:57, Zenith-List Digest Server at
zenith-list-digest(at)matronics.com wrote:
>> And how does one, or actually the FAA, determine the stall speed of a
>> kitplane? When I tested my 601HD w/Stratus I got a stall speed at
>> 1200lbs gross weight of 34KIAS. Quite possibly this is in error due to
>> the position of the pitot tube... But who knows? As far as I'm
>> concerned, and as the manufacturer, I'm declaring N269BB's stall speed
>> to be 34kts at 1200lbs...
>>
>> -Bruce/601HD/Stratus/TDO/303hrs
For meeting the requirements of the regulations, I'm pretty sure you'll have
to use TAS. However, for marking your ASI with green arcs, red lines, etc
etc, you should use indicated speeds.
For an aircraft that doesn't have a definite 'break' entering the stall, use
the point at which you can no longer maintain altitude (i.e. zero VSI). Use
a slow deceleration entry - about 1 kt. per second with power on, and
whatever you need to maintain altitude exactly, with power off. Fly the
maneuver several times to get an accurate measurement, trying to avoid
'zoom' entries as this will give unrealisticly low readings (i.e. you're
aiming for exactly 1G vertical load throughout). (do it on reciprocal
HEADINGS and average the gps groundspeed numbers to get TAS).
For certification tests, calibration, etc. this should be tested at max.
gross wt. as the stall speed will be less when the inflight weight is less.
If you're aiming for a specific number, like the sportplane category, and
you find that the stall speed is too high at gross weight, then you'll have
to reduce the weight and try again. (Of course if you've determined it at
gross wt. you can reduce it mathematically to see what it should be at
particular lesser weights -- everything else being ideal.)
--
Grant Corriveau
Montreal
Zodiac 601hds/CAM100
C-GHTF
www.theWingStayedON.ca
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Michel Therrien <mtherr(at)yahoo.com> |
| Subject: | Parking brake valve |
I have a Matco parking brake valve that I would like
to install.
Did any of you installed such valve? Where/how did
you install it?
Thanks!
Michel
=====
----------------------------
Michel Therrien CH601-HD
http://pages.infinit.net/mthobby
http://mthobby.pcperfect.com/ch601
http://taxes.yahoo.com/
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Cy Galley" <cgalley(at)qcbc.org> |
That is TRUE! I even got a refund!
----- Original Message -----
From: "Chuck Deiterich" <cfd(at)tstar.net>
Subject: Zenith-List: ELT
The instruction book for my ELT says that:
"With a current Private Aircraft Radio Station License, no further
station licensing is required for the ELT installation."
I thought that you no longer needed an aircraft radio license (in the
USA). Does anyone know for sure?
Chuck D.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Ed Kramer" <edkramer(at)prodigy.net> |
| Subject: | Zenith List: ELT |
I thought that you no longer needed an aircraft radio license (in the
USA). Does anyone know for sure?
A radio license is no longer required in the US. (AROW) the R for radio
has been removed.
Ed Kramer
West Seneca, NY
STOL CH 701
edkramer(at)prodigy.net
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Schemmel, Grant" <Grant.Schemmel(at)utmc.aeroflex.com> |
> as the useful load is concerned. My thought is that the
> weight may "tip
> the scales" away from the 601 toward a choice of something
> bigger for his
> mission.
> Do you not agree that the maximum gross limit might be a
> problem for his
> mission?
>
> Jeff Davidson
>
>
Jeff,
Indeed, with the figures quoted for people-weight, that really does limit his mission
capabilities. However, if you were not concerned with the sport-pilot
limits, one could declare that the gross weight was 1300lbs instead (you are the
manufacturer after all), and accept limitations on performance like +/- 3g's
instead of the designers +/-6.
Grant Schemmel
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Pinneo, George" <George.Pinneo(at)trw.com> |
I oil my K it keeps dust from abrading the Bings. Corona Muni is a pretty dusty
airport.
GGP
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | charles.long(at)gm.com |
| Subject: | Tools for Splice Plate Replacement - 601HDS |
I finally got around to inspecting my splice plates. Sure enough, the Rear
Plates are well below the 10 mm edge distance from the holes. The good news is
that I can just make the 10 mm minimum with new plates, so ordered the Aluminum
replacements from ZAC. Last fall Jim Karnes generously offered to borrow out
the tools he had to do the job. Jim, I couldn't reach you at your old E-mail
address. Is your offer still good? Anyone else out there passing the tools
around if I can't get a hold of Jim? Thanks everyone.
I've just completed both my outboard wing sections! This was a big
milestone for me. Took a year off after making some mistakes and didn't know
whether I'd ever get myself back into building again. Have been working a
steady 30 hours a month since December & hope to stay with it this time. For
those of you out there just getting started, you do get up the learning curve
with time and less anxiety comes with more experience. The initial excitement
is coming back! I just finished flying Ray Ridenour's HDS over the weekend and
what a great airplane to fly! Like having your own custom sports car; a
convertible w/o the wind.
Rear fuselage and tail also complete. Tackling the forward fuselage next.
From: "John Karnes" <karnesj(at)harbornet.com>
Subject: Zenith-List: splice plate tools
Just completed the splice plate mod. Anybody out there need the tools for
making the new splice plates?
John Karnes
Port Orchard, WA
karnesj(at)harbornet.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "The Meiste's" <meiste(at)essex1.com> |
Don,
I don't think the oil is intended to protect the air filter (prolong it's
life). I've flown ultralights for years, & we always oil the filters to help
filter out the fine dust, & grit that will eventually find it's way into
your engine.
Sounds like others have found out the same.
Kelly
601 HD Stratus (90% + / - 50%)
> No oil on mine for over 200 hrs on my Stratus HDS. Original filters still
> look pretty good...Where are you guys getting these filters? Don Walker
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Inspection Schedule |
| From: | Greg P Jannakos <gpjann(at)juno.com> |
Another good reason for getting 3 EAA Technical Inspections and sign-off
by an EAA Flight Advisor is Insurance.
These inspections and flight advisor sign-off will help when insuring
your airplane.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Gary K" <flyink(at)efortress.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Parking brake valve |
> I have a Matco parking brake valve that I would like
> to install.
>
> Did any of you installed such valve? Where/how did
> you install it?
Yup, I just installed mine. Not much as far as directions for
installation or operation, even after a call to Matco. They are very
helpful but I still didn't understand quite how it worked.
The valve is "off" when the lever is parallel to the body, pointing in the
direction of the flow. Make sure it is like this when you fill with fluid -
and it's easier if you order the $10 brake filler unit from Matco or make
one from an old oil can. You fill from the bleeder valve on the calipers up
to the master cylinders so there's no air in the lines. Easier than filling
from the top and bleeding. See their website or I can lend mine out.
The valve is "on" when the lever is moved anywhere more than about 45
degrees from "off" in either direction. 90 degrees or more is pretty much
fully locked I think, I can play with it more if you have questions.
Matco said many builders put it between the seats and just operate it by
hand. I put mine on the firewall (not a Zenith) right in front of the brake
pedals. I'll have to rig a push-pull cable but that'll be easy.
The lever moves very easily, you can move it by hand and it stays where
you put it. You need to have the lever off, push on the brakes, THEN move
the lever to lock the brakes. The lever then stays wherever you leave it,
and if it's more than about 45 degrees (closer to 90), the brakes stay on
however hard you were pushing. It's pretty simple now that I understand, it
just turns a ball-type valve and locks the amount of fluid that was pushed
thru. Sorry if this is obvious to anyone, it was all new to me. Seems to
work fine.
Gary K.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Michel Therrien" <mtherr(at)yahoo.com>
Subject: Zenith-List: Parking brake valve
>
>
> Thanks!
>
> Michel
>
>
> =====
> ----------------------------
> Michel Therrien CH601-HD
> http://pages.infinit.net/mthobby
> http://mthobby.pcperfect.com/ch601
>
> http://taxes.yahoo.com/
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Cliffsuss(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Parking brake valve |
Michel,
Marion Williamson down in Tidewater, Virginia came to our state fly-in 2
years ago in his 601HD. He had rigged up a valve in the brake line system to
act as a parking brake. As memory serves, the valve was located on the floor
,behind the pedals. He had a connector rod that ran to the IP. Step on the
pedals,close the valve and it held pressure on the brakes. As he said, it
would hold good enough on inclines to allow him to get out and set the chocks.
If by chance he shows up again this year with the HD at the fly-in I'll get
some pics of the location and install arrangement.
Cliff
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jon Croke" <Jon(at)joncroke.com> |
Fellow Zenith builders,
I am looking forward to meeting any/all of you at Sun-n-Fun this next week!
To borrow an idea from the Kolb builder's list: any of you interested in
hooking up with fellow Zenith builders should bring a FRS radio (they are
now just $15 at Walmart!) and I will suggest using channel 4, code 4 (to
help keep a relatively clear channel). This way, anyone interested in
'finding' another builder in the Zenith area (or any area for that matter)
can simply give an informal shout and we'll all be able to respond! These
FRS radios are also a great investment for many other purposes beyond the
show, of course. Also, maybe we can arrange a get together (dinner/lunch)
one of the days....?
Anyone not sure about Sun-n-Fun.... I will say that this will be my 5th year
in attendance.... I enjoy it much more than OshKosh (and I live 50 mi from
Osh Kosh!) More friendly, better weather, less expensive, and its FLORIDA!
A great time every year...... just bumming from exhibit to exhibit... forum
to forum... there is even a Budweiser truck with free samples coming out the
sides.......
I should arrive starting Sunday and leave 2 days later or so... let me know
if I should watch or listen out for you!
Jon
701
50%
near Green Bay, Wi
www.joncroke.com
________________________________________________________________________________
Hi List:
I did not oil my foam air filter for my Stratus engine. There are no filter
issues now after 103 hours. Nowhere have I seen any instruction to oil the
filter.
Dick (601-HDS, Stratus Subaru, 103 hours)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jeff Paden" <jeffpaden(at)madbbs.com> |
Hope to see you and others at the show. We just "TRIED" to install my new
warp-drive prop today on my ch-300 and even though we ran into MANY
problems, the guys at warp-drive are GREAT and are shipping me the last few
parts that I need overnight so we should be able to complete the install and
testing in time to fly to Sun-n-Fun. I plan on flying down Saturday or
Sunday and will be in the Armature Built Camping Area. My aircraft is N569Z
and is a brown and white ch-300. We should have all gotten Zenith shirts or
something
By the way... if any of you are planning on installing a Warp-Drive prop,
then please note that we ran into a problem installing it on a Lycoming
O-320 150hp engine. The problem is that the prop has smaller holes than the
normal bolts for the Lycoming O-320. I was lucky enough to find a company
that had used prop hub bushings so we will be installing the new bushings in
the morning... also you have to get new bolts and I found them at
Aircraft-Spruce... also being overnighted. HEHE sounds like fun huh.
Jeff Paden
>
> I am looking forward to meeting any/all of you at Sun-n-Fun this next
week!
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Gary K" <flyink(at)efortress.com> |
These filters are made for motorcycles where it is critical to oil them.
For aircraft application, running within a cowling on paved runways then
flying thru the relatively dust-free air, it's probably not necessary much
less critical. But, I don't think a very light coat of oil would hurt
either.
This is from www.unifilter.com under "Care/Maintenance";
Filter Preparation and Maintenance
FOAM FILTER OIL IS NECESSARY FOR PROPER FILTRATION!
Gary K.
________________________________________________________________________________
In a message dated 4/4/02 4:58:55 AM US Mountain Standard Time,
flyink(at)efortress.com writes:
> . But, I don't think a very light coat of oil would hurt
> either.
>
I've never even heard or oiling an air filter. Once again this is NEW to me.
How do you oil an air filter? What kind of oil do you use and how does it
get applied.
Thanks
Steve
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | threejaguar(at)hotpop.com |
Get your FREE POP email at www.HotPOP.com
-----------------------------------------------
On 4 Apr 02, at 8:34, STEFREE(at)aol.com wrote:
> I've never even heard or oiling an air filter. Once again this is NEW to me.
> How do you oil an air filter? What kind of oil do you use and how does it
> get applied.
Foam air filters are a fairly standard item for the hotrod crowd.
Remove the foam element from the holder, sop up some 30 weight
with it, and wring most of it out. Replace filter element into its
metal holder.
--
Regards,
Kristopher Barrett
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Tom Prugh & Evanne Browne <tomvan(at)erols.com> |
Listers,
Not long ago I was freaked out by a list message that mentioned rumors
of the discontinuation of the HD and HDS models. I'm building
ve-e-e-r-r-y slowly and had visions of a pile of riveted aluminum
turning instantly to scrap midway through. So I asked ZAC. Sebastien
Heintz replied with this:
"We have no specific plans of discontinuing the 601 HD or HDS model.
As long as sufficient orders come in for these designs, we'll
continue to supply kits for these models.
The new ZODIAC XL was developed with the proposed Sport Pilot
category in mind - to provide maximum performance allowed under the
new rules. The XL model combines the advantages of the HDS model
(higher speed) with those of the HD (lower stall), while also
providing some new attractive features, such as the new spring gear,
longer cabin, and the ability to use larger engines.
Whether or not the HD and HDS models will be offered in the future,
and how far in the future, will depend on our customers. At this
time, we don't know the full impact that the proposed Sport Pilot
category will have on pilots and kit buyers, and subsequently on
which aircraft models we will continue to produce.:"
When I asked about continuing to produce kits for midstream builders
even if overall interest in new kits has declined, he said "Yes,
definately, unless you're talking 10 or 20 yrs. out :)"
Of course whether demand for the HDS continues depends to some extent on
whether ZAC continues to market it, so this answer seems a little
circular to me. They could emphasize the differences in cost, simplicity
and build-time between the HD/HDS line and the XL and keep a market
alive for both...
Anybody got any insights into this?
Tom Prugh
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Gary K" <flyink(at)efortress.com> |
See the Uni website, plenty of instructions. Foam filter oil is different
than regular oil, it is very tacky. Collects dust and stays on the filter.
Any motorcycle shop should have some.
Gary K.
----- Original Message -----
From: <STEFREE(at)aol.com>
Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Re: Air Filter
>
> In a message dated 4/4/02 4:58:55 AM US Mountain Standard Time,
> flyink(at)efortress.com writes:
>
>
> > . But, I don't think a very light coat of oil would hurt
> > either.
> >
>
> I've never even heard or oiling an air filter. Once again this is NEW to
me.
> How do you oil an air filter? What kind of oil do you use and how does
it
> get applied.
>
> Thanks
>
> Steve
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Mark Townsend" <mark.townsend(at)sympatico.ca> |
| Subject: | Re: no more HDS? |
I have recorded on tape from Chris Heintz that the HD/hds will be
discontinued in the near future with the XL as the sole surviving 601 for
sale. Though he added that support and parts will be available for an
indefinite period of time.
Mark
-----Original Message-----
From: Tom Prugh & Evanne Browne <tomvan(at)erols.com>
Date: Thursday, April 04, 2002 10:18 AM
Subject: Zenith-List: no more HDS?
>
>Listers,
>
>Not long ago I was freaked out by a list message that mentioned rumors
>of the discontinuation of the HD and HDS models. I'm building
>ve-e-e-r-r-y slowly and had visions of a pile of riveted aluminum
>turning instantly to scrap midway through. So I asked ZAC. Sebastien
>Heintz replied with this:
>
>"We have no specific plans of discontinuing the 601 HD or HDS model.
>As long as sufficient orders come in for these designs, we'll
>continue to supply kits for these models.
>
>The new ZODIAC XL was developed with the proposed Sport Pilot
>category in mind - to provide maximum performance allowed under the
>new rules. The XL model combines the advantages of the HDS model
>(higher speed) with those of the HD (lower stall), while also
>providing some new attractive features, such as the new spring gear,
>longer cabin, and the ability to use larger engines.
>
>Whether or not the HD and HDS models will be offered in the future,
>and how far in the future, will depend on our customers. At this
>time, we don't know the full impact that the proposed Sport Pilot
>category will have on pilots and kit buyers, and subsequently on
>which aircraft models we will continue to produce.:"
>
>When I asked about continuing to produce kits for midstream builders
>even if overall interest in new kits has declined, he said "Yes,
>definately, unless you're talking 10 or 20 yrs. out :)"
>
>Of course whether demand for the HDS continues depends to some extent on
>whether ZAC continues to market it, so this answer seems a little
>circular to me. They could emphasize the differences in cost, simplicity
>and build-time between the HD/HDS line and the XL and keep a market
>alive for both...
>
>Anybody got any insights into this?
>
>Tom Prugh
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "David Tanner" <vk3auu(at)vic.australis.com.au> |
| Subject: | Re: Air Filter Get your FREE POP email at www.HotPOP.com ----------------------------------------------- |
That technique puts too much oil in the filter and will impede the air flow
too much. These filters are not really all that suitable for aircraft anyway
as the foam element has been known to get sucked into the throat of the
carby.
Better to get the proper K&N filter and visit you local motorbike shop for
the correct oil which comes in a pressure pak with the appropriate
instructions.
David Tanner
>
> Remove the foam element from the holder, sop up some 30 weight
> with it, and wring most of it out. Replace filter element into its
> metal holder.
>
>
> --
> Regards,
>
> Kristopher Barrett
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: no more HDS? |
In a message dated 4/4/02 3:08:26 PM US Mountain Standard Time,
mark.townsend(at)sympatico.ca writes:
> I have recorded on tape from Chris Heintz that the HD/hds will be
> discontinued in the near future with the XL
Sebastien Heintz makes all of the business decisions for the Mexico, MO
plant, I can not speak to what happens north of the border. I realize that
his father might be a powerful influence but Sebastien is still responsible
for all business decisions in that respect and if he did in fact state what
was quoted in the previous post I would take that as good information.
I know from speaking to him myself that they do not plan to discontinue the
HDS at this time, who knows what will happen down the road, but he did tell
me in an off the record comment that parts would be available though the
anticapated service life of the last kit they sell. So what would that be,
15-20 years? I hope so because at the rate I'm building I might be buying
some of the last parts off the assembly line.
Take care all,
Steve
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "James Brigman" <jbrigman(at)nc.rr.com> |
Jon, et. al;
Your suggestion of an FRS radio, channel 4, code 4, is excellent. I'm a ham,
(AD4SH) so it'll be a bit of a step-down for me, but at least it's not CB
radio! ;-)
I'll be volunteering in the sheemetal tent. Don't know the schedule yet, but
odds are you'll find me, or a couple other Zenith builders there this year.
I'll be the big guy with wide-brimmed hat and a pronounced southern accent.
I'm also be doing a little of my own kitplane work and will be seeking out
some raw materials at the show-best place on earth to buy airplane parts!
I expect to be there most of the week. Hope to see as many of you there as
can make it!
JKB
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Todd Osborne <todd(at)toddtown.com> |
| Subject: | The Rudder is Done! |
Well, after 23.5 hours of (mostly) fun work, my rudder is now done. This is
the first assembly I have completed on my XL, and will start the rest of
the tail this weekend. I am building from partial kits, and money and time
are tight, but I am hoping to make steady progress. I am keeping a diary of
the building process (with pictures) on my web site. You are all welcome to
visit if you like:
http://www.toddtown.com/index.php?pageID=family/todd/hobbies/aviation/index
Todd Osborne
Internet E-Mail: todd(at)toddtown.com
AOL Messenger: toddosborn
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Zenith-List Digest: 10 Msgs - 04/04/02 |
| From: | Grant Corriveau <grantC(at)total.net> |
on 05/04/02 02:57, Zenith-List Digest Server at
zenith-list-digest(at)matronics.com wrote:
> I've never even heard or oiling an air filter. Once again this is NEW to me.
> How do you oil an air filter? What kind of oil do you use and how does it
> get applied.
>
> Thanks
>
> Steve
K&N airfilters from your local auto speed shop can be bought with a kit of
'special' oil specially for the job.
Grant C.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Carlos Sa <wings1(at)videotron.ca> |
| Subject: | Electric riveter (RiveDrill) |
Hello, lister
Some might remember a while ago when Graham Byass told us about this
riveting gadget that attaches to an electric drill.
It is not available in North America, so I contacted the manufacturer
(in Spain) and ordered one unit. See details below.
I did not receive anything yet, but I'll let you know how the gadget
performs when it arrives.
Carlos
xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
"SP
EDITORES"
<a004367@sp-editores.es>
Sa/Quebec/IBM@IBMCA
Subject: RE:
Prices
2002-04-02
13:24
Please respond to "SP
EDITORES"
Yes we can send the RIveDrill RD98 Item N 210.000 at 30 USD plus
delivery
charge by post at 27,65 USD or if you prefer we can send by the
forwarder
you tell us freight prepaid.
...
I look forward for your news. Thank you.
Kind regards,
MAQUINAS ANDREA, S.A.
Nuria Prez
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Dave Alberti" <daberti(at)execpc.com> |
| Subject: | Re: oil or not to oil (filters) |
This is a link to the K&N site.
http://www.knfilters.com/clningins.htm
----- Original Message -----
From: "Fred Poor" <fredspoor2002(at)yahoo.com>
Subject: Zenith-List: oil or not to oil (filters)
>
> K&N filters have a cotton type material inside and do
> not work well UNLESS oiled properly.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "macwood" <macwood(at)tinyworld.co.uk> |
Hi all- I'm Mac McConnell-Wood, new boy to this list. Have just rebuilt
my KR2 and am hoping to trade her in for a 701 kit-trouble is I'm in
England and most of you chaps are over the pond!
I have a dual
Bendix mag on my Revmaster ,not run much but about 20yrs old. Have heard
all sorts of dire warnings about this mag, but what's the grass roots
thinking over there?
Best regards Mac
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Chris Weber" <chrisoz(at)gmx.net> |
Hello Listers,
After extending the pitot tube in front of the leading edge and adding a
centrepanel with radio and intercom I took my taildragger 601 up yesterday
for bumps and circuits and some flight tests.
I must confess that emphasis lies on bumps, I am still working on those last
two meters before touch down. The sensitivity in pitch is quite marked, and
on roundout I still tend to overcontrol. Go-arounds are easy, just slam the
throttle in and the plane claws it's way up, very impressive.
GPS runs over the coast gave a cruise of 90 kn at 5000rpm, and climb with
full fuel and two aboard full throttle (25c, 1022mbar) checks out at
1100ft/min at a height of 2000 feet. I seem to use approx. 12 l/h. The
airspeed indicator overeads by approx. 12 kn, new pitot tube, no static
port.
Stalls at 5000 rpm are weird, the nose goes up till there is nothing but
blue sky to be seen, flat on the back in the seat, hanging from the prop,
and all that happens after the usual shudder is a nose down pitch at 40kn
and she resumes flying. No wing drop, no nothing. I have never flown in a
Zodiac before, actually mine is the first one I ever sat in, and the climb
rate and the bubble canopy with it's unrestricted view are great. I find it
a bit anoying that the short left sleeve of my shirt gets sucked out through
the gap between the canopy and the side of the fuselage, I can't seal it as
I'd die from the heat on the ground while tax. Well, a good excuse to wear
my USAF Nomex-coverall.
I do have a problem, though. The engine runs sweet enough, but at rpms
higher than 1200 I can't switch the engine off. It goes koff, koff, koff and
just keeps on jerking around. When I advance the throttle she starts to run
smooth at 1600 rpm, and I can smoothly rev her through the whole range above
that without a miss or a shudder. Doesn't seem to be preignition, as oil and
cht are both at 190F, and she wouldn't run smooth.
I checked the ignition switch by hooking additional grounding wires into the
ignition circuit were it leaves the little black boxes, if I touch either of
them to ground I get the usual rpm drop, but if I ground them both the
engine runs merrily on. I basically can't switch the engine of in flight,
and if I should loose a propblade in flight I would be up the proverbial
creek without a paddle.
Any ideas?
Chris Weber
Zodiac 601 TD 912, 4 hours
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Philip Polstra" <ppolstra(at)yahoo.com> |
| Subject: | Repairing a cracked canopy |
Yesterday when the canopy was off the plane, someone accidently stepped on
the front edge while trying to pick it up. I now have a crack several
inches long that runs along the tube at the very front of the canopy and
down toward the front edge. How can I repair this? Is there any sort of
glue or epoxy that would fix this? Eventually we'll probably replace the
canopy, but for now I just want to get it in the air.
Philip A. Polstra
Certified Flight Instructor - Airplane Single Engine; Instrument Airplane
Ground Instructor - Advanced; Instrument
NAFI Instructor
http://www.philsflying.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Philip Polstra" <ppolstra(at)yahoo.com> |
While trying to put the finishing touches on the plane yesterday, we found
that we could not remove the nosegear. One of the bolts had bottomed out
into the axle. Of course, there is no way to keep the axle from turning
while you try and remove the bolt. I was thinking of drilling out the
threads in the axle and putting a bolt that runs all the way through. Has
anyone else done this? What size bolt did you use?
On another note, I was hoping to move the plane to the airport today. I was
stopped by the cracked canopy, this nosegear problem, and my tach which
seems to be misbehaving. Once I can get these issues worked out I might
actually get my HDS in the air after 5.5 years.
Philip A. Polstra
Certified Flight Instructor - Airplane Single Engine; Instrument Airplane
Ground Instructor - Advanced; Instrument
NAFI Instructor
http://www.philsflying.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Paul Besing" <azpilot(at)extremezone.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Repairing a cracked canopy |
Use a plexi drill bit and stop drill the hole. Then you can get a product
called Weldon-3 or Weldon-5. I think Spruce sells it. Use a small syringe
if you have access to one. It will "weld" the plastic back together.
Paul Besing
RV-6A Sold
http://www.lacodeworks.com/besing
Kitlog Pro Builder's Log Software
http://www.kitlog.com
----- Original Message -----
From: "Philip Polstra" <ppolstra(at)yahoo.com>
Subject: Zenith-List: Repairing a cracked canopy
>
> Yesterday when the canopy was off the plane, someone accidently stepped on
> the front edge while trying to pick it up. I now have a crack several
> inches long that runs along the tube at the very front of the canopy and
> down toward the front edge. How can I repair this? Is there any sort of
> glue or epoxy that would fix this? Eventually we'll probably replace the
> canopy, but for now I just want to get it in the air.
>
>
> Philip A. Polstra
> Certified Flight Instructor - Airplane Single Engine; Instrument Airplane
> Ground Instructor - Advanced; Instrument
> NAFI Instructor
> http://www.philsflying.com
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Zenith-List Digest: 1 Msgs - 04/06/02 |
| From: | Grant Corriveau <grantC(at)total.net> |
on 07/04/02 03:57, Zenith-List Digest Server at
zenith-list-digest(at)matronics.com wrote:
> This is the fun part when you can see things work.
> Chuck D.
> N701TX
These were the kind of small 'victories' towards the final goal that helped
keep me building! Congratulations!
Grant
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "zodiacjeff" <zodiacjeff(at)email.msn.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Nosegear axle |
> I was thinking of drilling out the
> threads in the axle and putting a bolt that runs all the way through. Has
> anyone else done this? What size bolt did you use?
Phil,
Try an AN5-53.
Regards Jeff
Area 41 SnailWorks East
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Sam Cajun" <sam.caj(at)worldnet.att.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Nosegear axle |
> One of the bolts had bottomed out
> into the axle. Of course, there is no way to keep the axle
from turning
> while you try and remove the bolt. I was thinking of drilling
out the
> threads in the axle and putting a bolt that runs all the way
through. Has
> anyone else done this? What size bolt did you use?
I think this has been the fix used most for this problem. If I
remember correctly, 5/16 all-thread is generally used. 'Don't
know if plain ole hardware store grade is being used or
something a little better. Right now mine is held as per plans,
like yours but I will probably modify before flying. I can get a
thin wrench between spacer and fork onto welded nut. Not wild
about this since wrench is less than 2mm thick and want take much
torque and also wrench might not be available when needed. Some
more info on this subject is in the archives. I think Frank H.
and maybe a couple more list members did this mod.
Also, you might want to look at Plathey's solution, drill fork
holes to let axle extend through. Of coarse this requires longer
axle.
Sam(701)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bill Morelli <billvt(at)together.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Nosegear axle |
I drilled out the nose gear axle with a 5/16" drill and used an AN5-54.
AN5-53 as suggested by Jeff will work also with 1 less washer than I used.
Bill
> > I was thinking of drilling out the
> > threads in the axle and putting a bolt that runs all the way through. Has
> > anyone else done this? What size bolt did you use?
>
>Phil,
>
>Try an AN5-53.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Darryl West (Home)" <rdwest(at)shaw.ca> |
My guess is a wiring problem.
My 912UL does not behave like this.
I used a conventional aircraft type ignition key switch
(off-left-right-both-start) that I bought from ACS instead of the
winky-looking plastic doo-dads Zenair supplied at the time (1993). Maybe go
over the hookup again?
Darryl
rdwest(at)shaw.ca
http://members.shaw.ca/rdwest/index.htm
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-zenith-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-zenith-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of Chris Weber
Subject: Zenith-List: Performance
I do have a problem, though. The engine runs sweet enough, but at rpms
higher than 1200 I can't switch the engine off. It goes koff, koff, koff and
just keeps on jerking around. When I advance the throttle she starts to run
smooth at 1600 rpm, and I can smoothly rev her through the whole range above
that without a miss or a shudder. Doesn't seem to be preignition, as oil and
cht are both at 190F, and she wouldn't run smooth.
I checked the ignition switch by hooking additional grounding wires into the
ignition circuit were it leaves the little black boxes, if I touch either of
them to ground I get the usual rpm drop, but if I ground them both the
engine runs merrily on. I basically can't switch the engine of in flight,
and if I should loose a propblade in flight I would be up the proverbial
creek without a paddle.
Any ideas?
Chris Weber
Zodiac 601 TD 912, 4 hours
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Todd Osborne <todd(at)toddtown.com> |
| Subject: | Is this an acceptable repair? |
Well, I broke a cardinal rule of homebuilder, working past 10:00 PM. While
drilling my rear horizontal stabilizer spar, I had it mounted upside down.
Yal, I know, but it looked right :)
Anyway, the damage is not near what I imagined. When I flipped over, all
the drill holes lined up perfectly (180 mirror image), except 3. These were
all A4's through the web, not any A5's and nothing through the doublers.
The 3 holes I had to drill out left a figure 8 pattern where two holes
overlapped. They would not hold an A4. To fix this, and salvage the rear
spar, I cut a couple out pieces of .025 to act as washers behind the bad
holes. Since the thickness will be greater, I went ahead and drilled the
holes out to A5 size.
Is the an acceptable repair? It seems like it to me, but then again I am
stupid enough to drill my rear spar backwards :)
Todd Osborne
Internet E-Mail: todd(at)toddtown.com
AOL Messenger: toddosborn
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Repairing a cracked canopy |
| From: | "Mark Sandidge" <MSandidge(at)peabodyenergy.com> |
04/08/2002 06:37:29 AM
Philip,Don't feel too bad, I have been working on my canopy for over a
month. Had it on two saw horses when one corner slid off and hit the corner
of horse. Put a serious crack about a foot long up the side of the canopy.
Look at a copy of AC43.13 it gives several repair methods.
"Philip Polstra" To:
cc:
Sent by: Subject: Zenith-List:
Repairing a cracked
owner-zenith-list-server@mat canopy
ronics.com
04/07/2002 08:11 AM
Please respond to
zenith-list
Yesterday when the canopy was off the plane, someone accidently stepped on
the front edge while trying to pick it up. I now have a crack several
inches long that runs along the tube at the very front of the canopy and
down toward the front edge. How can I repair this? Is there any sort of
glue or epoxy that would fix this? Eventually we'll probably replace the
canopy, but for now I just want to get it in the air.
Philip A. Polstra
Certified Flight Instructor - Airplane Single Engine; Instrument Airplane
Ground Instructor - Advanced; Instrument
NAFI Instructor
http://www.philsflying.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Lyle Pahnke" <ldpahnke(at)netwitz.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Nosegear axle |
---------- Original Message ----------------------------------
>I drilled out the nose gear axle with a 5/16" drill and used an
AN5-54.
>AN5-53 as suggested by Jeff will work also with 1 less washer
than I used.
>> > I was thinking of drilling out the threads in the axle and
putting a bolt that runs all the way through. Has
>> > anyone else done this? What size bolt did you use?
>>
>>Phil,
>>
>>Try an AN5-53.
>
If you are going to drill out the end threads anyway, you might
try an easy-out screw extractor into the axle end that has the
bolt out to get a purchase on the axle to remove the bolt at the
other end. This is of course if you can't get a thin wrench
between the spacer and nut to hold the axle from turning.Certainly
would recommend conversion of this to a through bolt anyway
because of increased strength. Good luck LDP
Netwitz Internet Services www.netwitz.net (618)533-5447
Call Today And Ask About Wireless Broadband
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Pinneo, George" <George.Pinneo(at)trw.com> |
Congratulations!
I suggest you build an armrest or extend the one you have, so you can rest your
elbow and fly with thumb and forefinger. Think of it as a side-stick in the
middle; you now know you don't need (or want) wrist or arm movements to fly the
Zodiac.
GGP
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Chesterman_Bell" <chesterman(at)on.aibn.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Nosegear axle |
Is this axlebolt for the narrow gear or the tundra gear
Dave Chesterman
----- Original Message -----
From: Lyle Pahnke <ldpahnke(at)netwitz.net>
Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Nosegear axle
>
>
> ---------- Original Message ----------------------------------
>
>
> >I drilled out the nose gear axle with a 5/16" drill and used an
> AN5-54.
> >AN5-53 as suggested by Jeff will work also with 1 less washer
> than I used.
> >> > I was thinking of drilling out the threads in the axle and
> putting a bolt that runs all the way through. Has
> >> > anyone else done this? What size bolt did you use?
> >>
> >>Phil,
> >>
> >>Try an AN5-53.
> >
>
> If you are going to drill out the end threads anyway, you might
> try an easy-out screw extractor into the axle end that has the
> bolt out to get a purchase on the axle to remove the bolt at the
> other end. This is of course if you can't get a thin wrench
> between the spacer and nut to hold the axle from turning.Certainly
> would recommend conversion of this to a through bolt anyway
> because of increased strength. Good luck LDP
>
> Netwitz Internet Services www.netwitz.net (618)533-5447
> Call Today And Ask About Wireless Broadband
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Peter Chapman <pchapman(at)ionsys.com> |
| Subject: | arm rests (was: Performance) |
At 11:33 08-04-02 , you wrote:
>I suggest you build an armrest or extend the one you have, so you can rest
>your elbow and fly with thumb and forefinger. Think of it as a side-stick
>in the middle; you now know you don't need (or want) wrist or arm
>movements to fly the Zodiac.
The above was in response to a comment about pitch sensitivity on a first
flight.
I'll caution that for some pilots, a bigger arm rest may not be as useful
as it has been for others.
My personal experience is as someone who is 6'1", long limbed, and has the
seat pans mounted low to provide head room. I need space for the elbow of
the arm that's using the center stick. Adding an armrest above the existing
center tunnel would just force my elbow out to the side, into the space for
the other occupant. I'm also glad that in my case, the seat back cushions
don't extend between the seats. For pulling the stick back nearly all the
way for flaring or stalls, I want to get the elbow as far back as possible
without arm contortions.
On my 601, there are a couple thin layers of foam underneath the upholstery
over the center tunnel. It's still nice to have just that bit of
cushioning, otherwise I'd have a sore elbow. (There's maybe 1/4" foam
thickness -- two or three layers of the thin but dense closed cell foam
that I think is used as underlay for flooring.)
I'm not sure whether a compromise is possible, where one would have an arm
rest that's higher in front (to add lower arm support) and low at the back
(to leave space for the elbow).
Peter Chapman
Toronto, ON 601 HDS / 912 / C-GZDC
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "The Meiste's" <meiste(at)essex1.com> |
| Subject: | One step forward, two steps back! |
I just wanted to pass along this advice to anyone out there using the 16
gallon header fuel tank on their 601. I purchased my kit in 99 and just
now got around to installing my fuel tank. Like a fool I believed the
writing on the side that stated "tested OK & dated".
Wrong ...... after shoehorning that huge tank between my IP & FW, and
adding fuel I find it leaked due to a bad weld along one side! I was a
little steamed over this turn of events, but Nick soon made things right
by promptly sending me a new tank. I requested they do a leak check on
it BEFORE sending it to me. A few days later I had my new tank, which
was clearly marked "tested OK & dated". COOL I'm back in business right
... not so fast! What's the old saying, "fool me once, shame on you ....
fool me twice shame on me". Well I guess I'm the fool. I installed this
second tank and you got it ... the sucker LEAKED! AAAHHHHHHH!!!!!!!!!!!!
This time ZAC wasn't as accommodating. Basically, sorry but that's all
you get................................................
SOOOOOOOO if any of you guys are getting ready to install that tank, do
yourself a huge favor & fill it with WATER before installing & check
closely for leaks. Now that I've added gas to mine there's not a welder
around that would attempt to patch it now.
Kelly (the fool) Meiste
601 HD (90% & holding)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Pinneo, George" <George.Pinneo(at)trw.com> |
I had the same problem w/ my header tank, too: they didn't pick you out for special
treatment.
Now: if you want to clean it and have a welder weld it, here's what I did, THREE
TIMES!
Take the tank out of the plane and remove all fittings. Drain out all the gas
that will run out. Rinse and slosh acetone in tank to wet all surfaces; drain
out acetone (& dissolved gas). Now fill tank with water to remove acetone.
Tank will now not have a smell and will be perfectly safe to weld along edge seams.
Use dye/water to find leak and get it welded.
GGP
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Larry Shull <larryshu(at)pacbell.net> |
| Subject: | Re: One step forward, two steps back! |
Kelly,
You can get it welded up no problem, just find a welder that knows how to
do it. I've had several tanks welded after they have had gasoline in them.
All that needs to be done is fillthe tank with an inert gas such as nitrogen
or argon, or carbon dioxide, and keep a tube in the tank running a constant
purge on it as you weld it up. No problem at all.
Larry Shull
----- Original Message -----
From: "The Meiste's" <meiste(at)essex1.com>
Subject: Zenith-List: One step forward, two steps back!
>
>
> I just wanted to pass along this advice to anyone out there using the 16
> gallon header fuel tank on their 601. I purchased my kit in 99 and just
> now got around to installing my fuel tank. Like a fool I believed the
> writing on the side that stated "tested OK & dated".
> Wrong ...... after shoehorning that huge tank between my IP & FW, and
> adding fuel I find it leaked due to a bad weld along one side! I was a
> little steamed over this turn of events, but Nick soon made things right
> by promptly sending me a new tank. I requested they do a leak check on
> it BEFORE sending it to me. A few days later I had my new tank, which
> was clearly marked "tested OK & dated". COOL I'm back in business right
> ... not so fast! What's the old saying, "fool me once, shame on you ....
> fool me twice shame on me". Well I guess I'm the fool. I installed this
> second tank and you got it ... the sucker LEAKED! AAAHHHHHHH!!!!!!!!!!!!
> This time ZAC wasn't as accommodating. Basically, sorry but that's all
> you get................................................
> SOOOOOOOO if any of you guys are getting ready to install that tank, do
> yourself a huge favor & fill it with WATER before installing & check
> closely for leaks. Now that I've added gas to mine there's not a welder
> around that would attempt to patch it now.
>
> Kelly (the fool) Meiste
> 601 HD (90% & holding)
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bill Morelli <billvt(at)together.net> |
| Subject: | Re: One step forward, two steps back! |
Kelly,
I would look around for a welder that works on stock cars and such. These
guys weld tanks that have had fuel in them all the time. After I had my
tank modified by having some flanges welded on, it leaked. The welder I use
just asked me to drain all the fuel, then blow compressed air in to dry it
as much as possible. He then used a technique he called "Smoking the Tank"
which amounted to connecting the exhaust of a running auto (via several
feet of hose) to the filler neck of the tank. This purges all of the oxygen
and allows safe welding.
Regards,
Bill
>SOOOOOOOO if any of you guys are getting ready to install that tank, do
>yourself a huge favor & fill it with WATER before installing & check
>closely for leaks. Now that I've added gas to mine there's not a welder
>around that would attempt to patch it now.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Cy Galley" <cgalley(at)qcbc.org> |
| Subject: | Re: One step forward, two steps back! |
That is not true. Used gas tanks are welded all the time. One trick is to
run an engine exhaust into the tank for about an hour. Another is to fill
with nitrogen or other inert gas and weld away. You can also clean and lay
a layer of fiber glass and epoxy over the bad weld. The tank can be sloshed
with a sealant. You can rivet a patch over the bad weld with proseal as the
sealant. there are many options especially when the welder knows what to
do.
Cy Galley, TC - Chair, Emergency Aircraft Repair, Oshkosh
Editor, EAA Safety Programs
cgalley(at)qcbc.org or experimenter(at)eaa.org
Always looking for articles for the Experimenter
----- Original Message -----
From: "The Meiste's" <meiste(at)essex1.com>
Subject: Zenith-List: One step forward, two steps back!
I just wanted to pass along this advice to anyone out there using the 16
gallon header fuel tank on their 601. I purchased my kit in 99 and just
now got around to installing my fuel tank. Like a fool I believed the
writing on the side that stated "tested OK & dated".
Wrong ...... after shoehorning that huge tank between my IP & FW, and
adding fuel I find it leaked due to a bad weld along one side! I was a
little steamed over this turn of events, but Nick soon made things right
by promptly sending me a new tank. I requested they do a leak check on
it BEFORE sending it to me. A few days later I had my new tank, which
was clearly marked "tested OK & dated". COOL I'm back in business right
... not so fast! What's the old saying, "fool me once, shame on you ....
fool me twice shame on me". Well I guess I'm the fool. I installed this
second tank and you got it ... the sucker LEAKED! AAAHHHHHHH!!!!!!!!!!!!
This time ZAC wasn't as accommodating. Basically, sorry but that's all
you get................................................
SOOOOOOOO if any of you guys are getting ready to install that tank, do
yourself a huge favor & fill it with WATER before installing & check
closely for leaks. Now that I've added gas to mine there's not a welder
around that would attempt to patch it now.
Kelly (the fool) Meiste
601 HD (90% & holding)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Cy Galley" <cgalley(at)qcbc.org> |
| Subject: | Re: One step forward, two steps back! |
By the Way; BOTH tanks in our club Skyhawk were welded after they developed
cracks around the filler. Have no problem finding a welder either time.
Cy Galley, TC - Chair, Emergency Aircraft Repair, Oshkosh
Editor, EAA Safety Programs
cgalley(at)qcbc.org or experimenter(at)eaa.org
Always looking for articles for the Experimenter
----- Original Message -----
From: "The Meiste's" <meiste(at)essex1.com>
Subject: Zenith-List: One step forward, two steps back!
I just wanted to pass along this advice to anyone out there using the 16
gallon header fuel tank on their 601. I purchased my kit in 99 and just
now got around to installing my fuel tank. Like a fool I believed the
writing on the side that stated "tested OK & dated".
Wrong ...... after shoehorning that huge tank between my IP & FW, and
adding fuel I find it leaked due to a bad weld along one side! I was a
little steamed over this turn of events, but Nick soon made things right
by promptly sending me a new tank. I requested they do a leak check on
it BEFORE sending it to me. A few days later I had my new tank, which
was clearly marked "tested OK & dated". COOL I'm back in business right
... not so fast! What's the old saying, "fool me once, shame on you ....
fool me twice shame on me". Well I guess I'm the fool. I installed this
second tank and you got it ... the sucker LEAKED! AAAHHHHHHH!!!!!!!!!!!!
This time ZAC wasn't as accommodating. Basically, sorry but that's all
you get................................................
SOOOOOOOO if any of you guys are getting ready to install that tank, do
yourself a huge favor & fill it with WATER before installing & check
closely for leaks. Now that I've added gas to mine there's not a welder
around that would attempt to patch it now.
Kelly (the fool) Meiste
601 HD (90% & holding)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Dave Alberti" <daberti(at)execpc.com> |
| Subject: | 912 Propeller hub flange nut |
I was doing some preliminary mounting for my prop today and I am a
little concerned by the fit of the special flange nuts in the Rotax hub.
In my efforts to measure the fit between the bore in the hub and the od
of the nut it would appear that there is about a .001" press fit. Have
any of you experienced the same thing? The hub size is within tolerance
per Rotax...the nuts were supplied by Zenith. I'm fitting a Warp prop.
On a good note you guys made me paranoid talking about your leaky tanks
so I had to check mine. IT'S GOOD! and the vented gas cap works too!.
Dave
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: One step forward, two steps back! |
Hey Kelly,
How do you like this offer, I have an extra 16 gallon header tank....Want to
see if 3 is the charm...Just pay shipping...And some day you owe me a
favor.......I promise nothing crazy....
Steve Freeman
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Eric Tauch" <erictauch(at)attbi.com> |
| Subject: | arm rests (was: Performance)...seat pan height |
Hello,
I am also 6'1" and have a long torso. Can you provide any more
information as to how much further down you located the seat
pans for the additional head room? This would be with respect
to what is shown in the drawings.
I know I should go and sit in one, but would like to know what
you did.
Thanks,
Eric Tauch
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-zenith-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-zenith-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of Peter
Chapman
Subject: Zenith-List: arm rests (was: Performance)
At 11:33 08-04-02 , you wrote:
>I suggest you build an armrest or extend the one you have, so you can rest
>your elbow and fly with thumb and forefinger. Think of it as a side-stick
>in the middle; you now know you don't need (or want) wrist or arm
>movements to fly the Zodiac.
The above was in response to a comment about pitch sensitivity on a first
flight.
I'll caution that for some pilots, a bigger arm rest may not be as useful
as it has been for others.
My personal experience is as someone who is 6'1", long limbed, and has the
seat pans mounted low to provide head room. I need space for the elbow of
the arm that's using the center stick. Adding an armrest above the existing
center tunnel would just force my elbow out to the side, into the space for
the other occupant. I'm also glad that in my case, the seat back cushions
don't extend between the seats. For pulling the stick back nearly all the
way for flaring or stalls, I want to get the elbow as far back as possible
without arm contortions.
On my 601, there are a couple thin layers of foam underneath the upholstery
over the center tunnel. It's still nice to have just that bit of
cushioning, otherwise I'd have a sore elbow. (There's maybe 1/4" foam
thickness -- two or three layers of the thin but dense closed cell foam
that I think is used as underlay for flooring.)
I'm not sure whether a compromise is possible, where one would have an arm
rest that's higher in front (to add lower arm support) and low at the back
(to leave space for the elbow).
Peter Chapman
Toronto, ON 601 HDS / 912 / C-GZDC
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Chuck Deiterich" <cfd(at)tstar.net> |
My Westach CHT gauge came with 14mm diameter type J probes. I need 12mm
diameter (Jabiru 2200). Aircraft Spruce has some UMA CHT 12mm diameter
type J probes. Is type J all that is needed for these to work on my
Westach?
Chuck D.
March 14, 2002 - April 09, 2002
Zenith-Archive.digest.vol-cu