Zenith-Archive.digest.vol-cy
June 25, 2002 - July 29, 2002
> > Milwaukee School of Engineering
> > 1025 N. Broadway, Milwaukee, WI 53202
> > lumkes(at)msoe.edu
> > http://www.msoe.edu/~lumkes
> > -----------------------------------------
> >
> >
>
>
http://www.hotmail.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Schallgren(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Canopy Hook Impact |
"However, I haven't seen any mention of the impact of the canopy on cabin
room. In particular, do the hooks on the side opening option cut down on
the width at the shoulders?"
I have not noticed any reduction in cabin room as a result of the hooks.
Once I have closed the canopy and inserted the retention sliders I don't
notice the canopy hooks until I do the takeoff check list. When two are in
the cockpit with a combined weight on the North side of 400# we are still
surprised at how much room there is. In short, the side opening option has
no impact on width at the shoulders or anywhere else.
Stan
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Schallgren(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: OAT - where to put? |
We installed our OAT probe in the left wing stub attaching it to the litening
hole. Works great, easy to get at if necessary but still out of the way.
Stan
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jon Croke" <Jon(at)joncroke.com> |
| Subject: | Battery powered 701 !!!! |
Here's a story with a plea to scientists for understanding:
I am working on my wing tanks for the 701... I assembled the fuel sender
unit as prescribed and tested it out of the tank with its guage and 12
volts. All is well and the float was adjusted for the tank depth. Cut
the hole in the tank and installed the sender.
I now proceed to fill the tank with WATER to test for leaks and confirm
that the guage reads from empty to full.
Everything looks great as I fill... about the first gallon doesnt move
the needle (OK), then the needle on the guage slowly creeps up as I fill
the tank.
When I put gallon 9 of water in the tank, the guage drops to half and
remains there even with all 10 gals in the tank (an honest 10 gallon
tank, BTW).
I cant understand why the very last gallons would cause a failure in the
indicated level... but AHA, the last gallons actually cover the rheostat
of the sender unit. SO, I figure the water is shorting the rheostat and
giving false indications. BUT, I place my OHm meter on the sender unit
and find, that with the tank full, the resistance is s l o w l y
creeping up from about 30 ohms to 100 over a minute of time!! I scratch
my head (picturing that plastic ball somehow not floating properly) and
call VDO. Big mistake. They are convinced I have not
calibrated/installed/ or otherwise assembled the unit properly. They
make it CLEAR that WATER will not affect the reading. Thank them and
hang up
I now regress to my childhood days of playing with electrolytic
capacitors. Im a ham operator from WAY back and this what you
did when tearing apart radios and screwing around! When you put an
ohmeter on a capacitor, it will charge up slowly and the resistance will
increase as it charges. So.... I switch to VOLTAGE reading on the meter
and another AHA....I am getting a solid .16 volts generating from the
sending unit!! Free voltage as the tank sits there full of water. I
have a BATTERY! and no wonder the fuel guage reads wrong when the water
gets to the full level!
Now, I need help understanding why a ten gallon aluminum tank full of
water is steadily generating .16 volts???? I know my water isnt great
(from a well) but what are the key ingredients here?? And what about the
rheostat helps this situation??
Moral of the story.... dont trust the manufacturer support for help
(e.g. water is NOT OK for testing) and I can not beleive I am the first
one to run into this problem.... doesnt everyone use water to test their
tanks and fuel senders??? Please feel free to tell me this was not a
good idea.... I am here to learn.. I hope someone some day doesnt waste
an afternoon like I did and can benefit from this story.
Do I have the beginnings of an electric car/plane?? no fuel, just a tank
of well water?? PLease explain how this batery thing is working! Thanks
Jon
near Green Bay
701 electric plane
_______________________________
www.joncroke.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Jeff Cours <zenith-j(at)moriarti.org> |
| Subject: | Re: Battery powered 701 !!!! |
Momentarily de-lurking :-)
Jon Croke wrote:
> BUT, I place my OHm meter on the sender unit
> and find, that with the tank full, the resistance is s l o w l y
> creeping up from about 30 ohms to 100 over a minute of time!!
> I now regress to my childhood days of playing with electrolytic
> capacitors. Im a ham operator from WAY back and this what you
> did when tearing apart radios and screwing around! When you put an
> ohmeter on a capacitor, it will charge up slowly and the resistance will
> increase as it charges. So.... I switch to VOLTAGE reading on the meter
> and another AHA....I am getting a solid .16 volts generating from the
> sending unit!!
> Now, I need help understanding why a ten gallon aluminum tank full of
> water is steadily generating .16 volts????
Congratulations on creating your perpetual motion machine!
Seriously, though, if I recall correctly an ohm meter applies voltage
to the thing it's measuring. By applying a known voltage and measuring
the current through the resistor, it can use ohm's law to figure out
the resistance, where more current = less resistance.
A volt meter has high internal resistance. You connect it across
something that's experiencing a voltage drop. A small amount of
current makes its way through the internal resistance of the meter
(hopefully much smaller than the current going through the source of
the voltage drop), and by measuring that current the meter can tell
you how big the voltage drop is.
So, what happens when you put an ohm meter across a circuit with a
Great Big Capacitor and a resistor in series? The G.B.C. starts off
discharged and looks like a wire to the meter, so you start measuring
the resistor's true resistance. But an ohm meter applies voltage, so
you're slowly charging up the capacitor and the meter shows increasing
resistance.
Now you've got the G.B.C. all charged up and you put a volt meter
across it. The G.B.C. tries to discharge through the volt meter, but
the volt meter has high internal resistance, so it takes a while.
Net result: I'm guessing you charged the G.B.C. to 0.16 volts and
it'll probably take a while to discharge through the volt meter, so it
looks like you're creating energy for nothing.
As for why the sudden nosedive in indicated fuel, unfortunately I
can't help you there - don't know enough about the sender or the gague
to know why that would happen.
Jeff Cours
contempating a 601XL or 640
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Jeff Cours <zenith-j(at)moriarti.org> |
| Subject: | Re: Battery powered 701 !!!! |
Momentarily de-lurking :-)
Jon Croke wrote:
> BUT, I place my OHm meter on the sender unit and find, that with
> the tank full, the resistance is s l o w l y creeping up from
> about 30 ohms to 100 over a minute of time!!
> I now regress to my childhood days of playing with electrolytic
> capacitors. Im a ham operator from WAY back and this what you did
> when tearing apart radios and screwing around! When you put an
> ohmeter on a capacitor, it will charge up slowly and the
> resistance will increase as it charges. So.... I switch to VOLTAGE
> reading on the meter and another AHA....I am getting a solid .16
> volts generating from the sending unit!!
> Now, I need help understanding why a ten gallon aluminum tank full
> of water is steadily generating .16 volts????
Congratulations on creating your perpetual motion machine!
Seriously, though, if I recall correctly an ohm meter applies voltage
to the thing it's measuring. By applying a known voltage and measuring
the current through the resistor, it can use ohm's law to figure out
the resistance, where more current = less resistance.
A volt meter has high internal resistance. You connect it across
something that's experiencing a voltage drop. A small amount of
current makes its way through the internal resistance of the meter
(hopefully much smaller than the current going through the source of
the voltage drop), and by measuring that current the meter can tell
you how big the voltage drop is.
So, what happens when you put an ohm meter across a circuit with a
Great Big Capacitor and a resistor in series? The G.B.C. starts off
discharged and looks like a wire to the meter, so you start measuring
the resistor's true resistance. But an ohm meter applies voltage, so
you're slowly charging up the capacitor and the meter shows increasing
resistance.
Now you've got the G.B.C. all charged up and you put a volt meter
across it. The G.B.C. tries to discharge through the volt meter, but
the volt meter has high internal resistance, so it takes a while.
Net result: I'm guessing you charged the G.B.C. to 0.16 volts and
it'll probably take a while to discharge through the volt meter, so it
looks like you're creating energy for nothing.
As for why the sudden nosedive in indicated fuel, unfortunately I
can't help you there - don't know enough about the sender or the gague
to know why that would happen.
Jeff Cours
contempating a 601XL or 640
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Peter" <peterd(at)metec.co.nz> |
| Subject: | OAT - where to put? |
Date: 26 June 2002
Hi Michel
I located my OAT probe immediately behind
the area of the port side wing gear leg
and under the rear fairing.
Reasoning: Absolutely no exposure to direct
Or indirect sunlight influence.
The turbulent airpattern should
avoid wind-chill effects, but....the fairings
used fore and aft of the gear leg housing will
limit serious airflow over the probe anyway
and yet allow a reasonable rate of air-change
to permit good response times for temp variation
occurrences. (I could put some air-bleed holes in if reqd.)
NB. My probe is secured with rubber rings sandwiched
on either side of the underside wing skin in order to
more accurately respond to AIR temp change rather
than the underside wing skin temp to which it is
affixed. (The rubber being the thermal insulation
medium)
Hope this helps.
Best regards
Peter Dunning
CH601HD/ZK-SPD/912S
Working on lower engine cowling.
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-zenith-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-zenith-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Michel
Therrien
Subject: Zenith-List: OAT - where to put?
With my Grand-Rapid's EIS, I got an OAT (outside air
temp) probe... where and how do I install it?
Thanks!
Michel
=====
----------------------------
Michel Therrien CH601-HD
http://pages.infinit.net/mthobby
http://mthobby.pcperfect.com/ch601
http://www.zenithair.com/bldrlist/profiles/mthobby
=
=
=
=
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Michel Therrien <mtherr(at)yahoo.com> |
| Subject: | OAT - where to put? |
Thanks to all who answered my question on OAT
installation. I got varied answers with no two
individuals putting it at the same place. I've seen
(next to a rib on the side of the center wing, under
the front fuselage, around a faired gear leg, inside a
naca cabin vent and inside the carburator air intake.
Michel
=====
----------------------------
Michel Therrien CH601-HD
http://pages.infinit.net/mthobby
http://mthobby.pcperfect.com/ch601
http://www.zenithair.com/bldrlist/profiles/mthobby
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bill Morelli <billvt(at)together.net> |
| Subject: | OAT - where to put? |
There is no wind chill affect on inanimate objects such as thermometers.
The probe measures the same air temp regardless of how fast it is moving
through the air.
Bill
>The turbulent airpattern should
>avoid wind-chill effects, but....the fairings
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Benford2(at)aol.com |
I think that any probes mounted under the fuselage is a great idea. That way
it gets them out of direct sunlight. But, If placed in the airstream of the
exhaust by accident you will get a high reading. I might have a belly cooler
mounted on my 801 to cool the V-8 Ford so I am debating where to put my
probe. On a different matter, Has anyone used those HID landing lights
yet???? Ben Haas, 801BH.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | owner-zenith-list-server(at)matronics.com |
If you mean the Czech Kremen Sport Prop, I can tell a little bit as it is very
popular here in Spain. It is a wooden Prop which the flight adjustable version
has some problems with the electrical system pitch (it's all electrical) from
+/- 300 hours of use. Despite of it, gets a great performance.
Yago Osset
Spain
601 HD
www.osset.com/yago
Any experiences with the Czech Sport Prop?
Perry Morrison
---------------------------------
Copa del Mundo de la FIFA 2002
El nico lugar de Internet con vdeos de los 64 partidos Apntante ya!.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Grant Corriveau <grantC(at)total.net> |
on 6/26/02 3:32 AM, Dr. Perry Morrison at prm(at)softhome.net wrote:
>
> Any experiences with the Czech Sport Prop?
Check with Flypass (the Zenair dealer in Ontario) - Art Mitchel. I saw this
prop (or another Czech-made model?) on one or two of his aircraft....
--
Grant Corriveau
Montreal
Zodiac 601hds/CAM100
C-GHTF
www.theWingStayedON.ca
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Mark Townsend" <601xl(at)sympatico.ca> |
Art has one on a 601UL which was made by the Czech dealer. Also Paul Sharpe
a member of this list has one on his 601HD, but he is waiting for his
inspection right now so I doubt he has any data on it. But he must have some
knowledge as he sold his warp drive prop in favor of the Czech Sport prop.
Mark Townsend
601XL EA-82 MPFI Turbo
-----Original Message-----
From: Grant Corriveau <grantC(at)total.net>
Date: Wednesday, June 26, 2002 5:23 AM
Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Which Prop?
>
>on 6/26/02 3:32 AM, Dr. Perry Morrison at prm(at)softhome.net wrote:
>
>>
>> Any experiences with the Czech Sport Prop?
>
>Check with Flypass (the Zenair dealer in Ontario) - Art Mitchel. I saw
this
>prop (or another Czech-made model?) on one or two of his aircraft....
>
>
>--
>Grant Corriveau
>Montreal
>Zodiac 601hds/CAM100
>C-GHTF
>www.theWingStayedON.ca
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Dave Austin" <daveaustin2(at)sprint.ca> |
Recently I sent a msg on this subject, and due to some queries I should
clarify what I've said about the advantages of air-adjustable props and
specifically the Arplast.
Although the Arplast has gained me speed, climb and flexibility, I must
advise users or people considering using the Arplast PV50 on the Rotax 912
the it is not without some problems.
I have had two in- flight failures with the pitch adjustment motor. The
first was after 35 hours and the motor was replaced under warranty. The
second failure was after 12 hours of use and Arplast refused to consider it
a warranty failure. It cost me $350.00 CDN to replace it.
Mike Fothergill has had one failure of the pitch adjustment also, while in
flight.
Barry Hailey had a failure of one of the blades causing loss of pitch
control on one blade during take-off. He was able to abort take-off
successfully.
I thought the list should be aware of these facts.
Dave Austin 601HDS - 912
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Chip W. Erwin" <aircraft(at)czaw.cz> |
I can offer some information on this subject. We have had excellent results
from the Czech-made Sport Prop. Czech Aircraft Works has been supplying them
as the standard propeller for our Rotax Firewall-forward package for both
the CH601 and the CH701.
The propeller we recommend is the Sportprop 3-blade, 1700R,
ground-adjustable carbon propeller. The cost is $585.00. A nice matching
composite spinner is also available for $99.00. Many of the aircraft on our
web site are sporting these props.
The propeller that was referred to by the Spanish pilot is made by the same
company now. It was Kremen Propellers. They recently merged with Sportprop,
and now the new company is called Woodcomp. The 3-blade electric in-flight
adjustable propeller does have excellent performance. And it is now
available with a constant-speed option. The cost of this prop with spinner
is $2,950, plus considerable crating and freight expense. And it is also a
bit heavy at around 12kg.
Sportprop (now Woodcomp) also offers a 2-blade mechanically in-flight
adjustable propeller. We did ship one to Leo Corbalis, and he appears to be
quite happy from his last e-mail on this list. However, it is not readily
available in the USA.
Based on our European success with the Sportprops, and our increased
business with quick-build Zenair kits in the USA we have negotiated the USA
distribution rights for these propellers. We now have a nice inventory of
new propellers and spinners at our USA importer in Florida - Sky Shop. The
propellers are easily sent by UPS.
Please note we will stock plenty of the 1700R ground adjustable carbon props
for Zenair, and 3-4 of the other most popular sizes and models. Woodcomp
offers dozens of models so if someone wants something special, we can ship
from the Czech Republic with the next container to Florida.
We can also bring propellers to Oshkosh for anyone wanting to pick up a prop
at the show.
We do not have any plans to import the 2-blade in-flight adjustable
propeller. We think there could be a service problem down the road as they
need to be returned to the factory for major service.
Danny at Sky Shop has been to the Woodcomp factory for training twice now
and is fully qualified to maintain the 3-blade electric in-flight adjustable
propeller. However, these propellers will be special-order as well. As they
probably will not be legal on the new Sportplanes, we do not plan to keep
stock in Florida. But we can easily add a prop to our next container...
We are willing to send a prop to the fellow who started this thread. If he
likes it then he can buy it, if not, send it back. I am confident of the
performance.
To order your propeller, or to arrange a test, contact Danny at:
SKY SHOP INC
USA distributor for Czech Aircraft Works
e-mail zaneta(at)skyshops.org Phone # 561-223-8915 Fax # 561-382-0607
cell # 561-341-6749
1837 S. FEDERAL HWY # 200, STUART, FLORIDA 34994 USA
www.skyshops.org
Regards,
CHIP
PS: We just flew 2 new CH601XL's to the PFA Cranfeild airshow in the UK and
back. We have 3 flying XL's in our hanger now, I guess the biggest fleet of
XL's anywhere!
Chip W. Erwin
CZECH AIRCRAFT WORKS, S.R.O.
Manufacturer of sport aircraft & AIRCRAFT FLOATS
Lucn 1824, 686 02 Star Mesto, Czech Republic
Tel: (420 632) 543 456 Fax: (420 632) 543 692
USA Fax: (561) 264 0936
Mobile Tel: (420) 602 342 717
E-mail: aircraft(at)czaw.cz www.airplane.cz
Art has one on a 601UL which was made by the Czech dealer. Also Paul Sharpe
a member of this list has one on his 601HD, but he is waiting for his
inspection right now so I doubt he has any data on it. But he must have some
knowledge as he sold his warp drive prop in favor of the Czech Sport prop.
Mark Townsend
601XL EA-82 MPFI Turbo
---
Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | David Terrell <dl_terrell(at)yahoo.com> |
| Subject: | Battery powered 701 !!!! |
The charged G.B.C. (great big capacitor) is probably
the culprit on the voltage generation issue. That
discussion seems sounds.
The only thing I'd say different is that an Ohm meter
puts a known current through the object and reads the
resultant voltage to determine resistance. But, the
result is the same...
The reason "distilled water" is used in batteries, is
that pure H2O is a better insulator than a conductor.
Put impurities in the water, and BOOM, you have a
better conductor... Well water would almost certainly
be a better conductor.
I assume that by now you have confirmed that when the
water level is below the sender (and the sender is
dry) the readings are correct (enough). Therefore,
deductively, the water must be shorting out the sender
some how. Fuel should not short the sender, as fuel
is generally a poor conductor.
However, I would not want exposed electrical circuits
anywhere near my fuel. NO MATTER WHAT the
manufacturer might say. A blown voltage regulator may
lead to higher voltage, which may lead to sparks.
Vented fuel tanks, nearly empty with a litle bit of
fuel sloshing around, and sparks just can't be a good
combination.
I'd seal off the sender somehow. Test it with a
temporary seal using a trash bag or something. If
that works, then come up with a good fuel resistant
seal. You might "pot" the whole underside with some
compound. I'd suggest silicone, but I'm sure there
are those that would freak out...
Dave
701
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "LEO CORBALIS" <l.corbalis(at)worldnet.att.net> |
Being lazy I do it the easy way. 1. open the caliper valve and pump out all
the old juice.
2. Take the screw out of the valve body (on the pedal). 3 get a plastic
bottle, fill it with mil. 5606 and connect to the caliper valve, wrap an old
tee shirt around the valve body. 4. squeeze the bottle until the cockpit is
full of brake fluid or a friend yells STOP! 5. close the caliper valve, put
the filler screw back, wipe up the mess, now disconnect the caliper
cannection and you are all bleeded!
On a similar note, when you change the oil in your 912, after everything
done and wipe up, stick a piece of fuel hose 1/2 inch O.D. up the 12mm.
reservoir vent line. Hook up a bypass switch to the starter solenoid ( so
the ignition stays OFF) blow as hard as you can into the hose to get the oil
to rise up and flow out of the reservoir to the engine. Now you can start
cranking the engine and you will get oil pressure in a few seconds, without
starting the engine.
Leo Corbalis
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Engine for 601XL |
| From: | Michael R Fortunato <wizard-24(at)juno.com> |
OK, I'm at the point where I need to make an engine decision for my XL. I
have it narrowed down between two possible engines: The Jabiru 3300, or
the Honda CAM 125. Costs are about the same. The Honda performs a bit
better, but is a bit heavier and requires a redrive. So, I'd like advice
on the following three questions, which should enable me to (finally)
make up my mind:
1. The Honda is of course water cooled, and the Jabiru is air cooled.
What I'm concerned about is what happens if I blow a radiator hose while
flying...or what if the thermostat sticks...or the water pump goes? I
only know that of all the problems I've had with cars over the years,
cooling system failure has been a relatively common one. Will air cooling
be enough to keep the plane flying if I go with the Honda? The benefits
of water cooling are probably to avoid the effects of thermal shock, but
I'm wondering if that is enough of a benefit to offset another element
that can go wrong.
2. The Honda is fuel injected -- the Jabiru is not. I'm not sure why
everything isn't fuel injected these days, but is that issue worth
worrying about?
3. Does the redrive itself contribute to the increased possibility of
failure? Or are they relatively maintenance free?
Thanks in advance for the help.
Mike Fortunato
601XL
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Ken Lyons <krl55(at)att.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Battery powered 701 !!!! |
Hi all,
I think I remember a little from when I got my Physics degree that may
apply here. The tank is aluminum. The water, since it is not ultra pure,
is an electrolyte, that is, a liquid that conducts electricity. The
rheostat in the sending unit is probably nichrome or another definitely
non aluminum metal. So you have different metals with different
potentials. I forget the exact term, but will look it up if I do not see
it posted here soon. Any way, this is how a lot of batteries work. Ions
from one metal are dissolving into the water and migrating under the
resulting electric field and depositing on the other metal. Ions carry
charge, so you get a voltage and a little current. This is probably more
familiar in the use of zinc compounds to percent corrosion of the metal
in the aluminum airplane, or in the attachment of "zincs" to metal boats
and motors, especially those used in salt water. The zinc is more likely
to lose ions than the aluminum, so it is sacrificed to save the
aluminum. This is noticeable in a zinc on an outboard motor used in salt
water. The zinc gets smaller over time. You can do the same thing by
putting a zinc wire and a copper wire into a lemon, or other fruit or
vegetable. The acid fruit works better because the electrolyte is more
conductive. I suppose this is as clear as mud, but I tried. All for now.
Ken Lyons
CH701 1% done
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Engine for 601XL |
| From: | John P Moyle <jmoyle1(at)juno.com> |
Mike,
Not to throw a monkey wrench into the gears.....after all you did
say that you have
narrowed your choices down to these two engines of about 120hp.......BUT
!! (pausing
for dramatic effect...) Have you looked into the possibility of the
Corvair conversion??
This is what's going in my XL, and it's truly the most bang for
your buck, I believe.
Mine has all the whistles and bells, 3.2 liters, cheap, six cylinder
smoothness, cheap, direct
drive, cheap, air cooled simplicity, cheap and easy to build (cheaply!!)
Even with all the
aforementioned "toots and clangs" such as roller rockers, blueprinting
and balancing,
altitude compensating carb, custom prop extension, etc........I've got
less than $5,000
invested and everything is new or "as new to factory specs". Tough to
beat !!
This engine will weight less fire wall forward than the Lycoming
0-235 and be
more powerful as well. ( IMHO ). I can offer up some links to excellent
web sites if
anyones interested.
While I'm throwing my 2 cents around, I'll comment on your
questions by the number..
>
> 1. The Honda is of course water cooled, and the Jabiru is air
> cooled.
> What I'm concerned about is what happens if I blow a radiator hose
> while
> flying...or what if the thermostat sticks...or the water pump goes?
> I
> only know that of all the problems I've had with cars over the
> years,
> cooling system failure has been a relatively common one. Will air
> cooling
> be enough to keep the plane flying if I go with the Honda? The
> benefits
> of water cooling are probably to avoid the effects of thermal shock,
> but
> I'm wondering if that is enough of a benefit to offset another
> element
> that can go wrong.
Okay, water cooling is great, works very reliably as long as you keep the
wet
stuff inside were it belongs......lot's of designs with water cooled
engines flying
successfully, including my own RANS S-12 with it's 65 hp Rotax........
But, air cooled is what you want in most cases, it's lighter, air is
available at 100%
of the places you might have to land ;-) and unless you plan to do a lot
of rapid
descents from the upper flight levels "thermal shock" just isn't a
realistic concern..
> 2. The Honda is fuel injected -- the Jabiru is not. I'm not
> sure why
> everything isn't fuel injected these days, but is that issue worth
> worrying about?
Real fuel injection systems are heavy and expensive and provide no magic
for your
application.......great for our cars.....thank God we have them, but they
don't offer
anything very exceptional for us, at least not when you weight it against
the issues
of complexity and weight...........a common Stromberg carb will do nicely
if you feel
you absolutely must manually control the mixture settings.......but the
Jabiru won't
offer that and neither will a computer activated Honda auto system, so
for my money
an Edelbrock Qwiksilver II altitude compensating throttle body is a steal
at around $200
and you can get one (or repair parts should they be needed) at almost any
Harley-Davidson
shop on the planet.
> 3. Does the re drive itself contribute to the increased
possibility of
> failure? Or are they relatively maintenance free?
Well, any "additional" system just adds to the list of things that can
fail.....but the cog belt
style re drives have a solid reputation in general, they are simple and
durable if well designed.
If you are choosing an engine that requires higher than normal rpm's to
generate it's rated power
you don't really have a choice, so the discussion is two fold.....do you
want an engine that will
be spending it's cruise-flight-life at 5,000 rpm wearing out in half the
time of a direct drive unit??
I know you can balance the cost of the Honda overhaul (pretty low I'd
guess?) against that
eventuality.......but toss in the added cost of the re drive, and the
extra weight (way out in front!!)
and the picture may not appeal to you any more.
Of course there are no BAD choices here, you probably know how much time
and money you
have to experiment with, and that may play as much in you plans as
anything else. I encourage all
builders to follow their dreams and share their experiences. I only tried
to entice you with the
Corvair info because I believe it's the best kept secret in experimental
light aircraft.
>
> Thanks in advance for the help.
>
> Mike Fortunato
> 601XL
>
You're welcome !!!!! John Moyle
5552 West
Oak Avenue
Fresno CA
93722
mailto:jmoyle1(at)juno.com
>
>
> messages.
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Larry C. McFarland" <larrymc(at)qconline.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Engine for 601XL |
Michael,
What an opportunity! Go with the CAM 125! It's really well engineered.
The liquid cooled engine is so much better to fly with than an air cooled
one. Liquid cooled engines are inherently quieter, burn less gas, have no
shock cooling, burn less oil, and they have a parts network in America
that is better than any engine from Australia. I've going with a Stratus
Drive Subaru,
but would consider a Honda engine if to do over. I've got an 89 800cc Honda
Pacific Coast
and a 91 Honda Civic (same CAM engine), both liquid cooled and each have
run trouble free for all this time!
The distance between overhaul and valve adjustment for the liquid cooled
engines is
non-issue for Subaru or the Honda compared to Jabaru, 0-200s?
Would expect you'd need less costly hearing protection with the CAM engine.
I also fly a Cessna 150 (0-200) and it needs better head phones than I can
afford.
Just a thought................
Larry C. McFarland - 601hds (liquid cooled)
----- Original Message -----
From: "Michael R Fortunato" <wizard-24(at)juno.com>
Subject: Zenith-List: Engine for 601XL
>
>
> OK, I'm at the point where I need to make an engine decision for my XL. I
> have it narrowed down between two possible engines: The Jabiru 3300, or
> the Honda CAM 125. Costs are about the same. The Honda performs a bit
> better, but is a bit heavier and requires a redrive. So, I'd like advice
> on the following three questions, which should enable me to (finally)
> make up my mind:
>
> 1. The Honda is of course water cooled, and the Jabiru is air
cooled.
> What I'm concerned about is what happens if I blow a radiator hose while
> flying...or what if the thermostat sticks...or the water pump goes? I
> only know that of all the problems I've had with cars over the years,
> cooling system failure has been a relatively common one. Will air cooling
> be enough to keep the plane flying if I go with the Honda? The benefits
> of water cooling are probably to avoid the effects of thermal shock, but
> I'm wondering if that is enough of a benefit to offset another element
> that can go wrong.
>
> 2. The Honda is fuel injected -- the Jabiru is not. I'm not sure
why
> everything isn't fuel injected these days, but is that issue worth
> worrying about?
>
> 3. Does the redrive itself contribute to the increased possibility
of
> failure? Or are they relatively maintenance free?
>
> Thanks in advance for the help.
>
> Mike Fortunato
> 601XL
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "James Brigman" <jbrigman(at)nc.rr.com> |
| Subject: | Fuel Sender Dudes Unite |
Fuel Sender Dudes!
> I am working on my wing tanks for the 701... I assembled the fuel sender
> unit as prescribed and tested it out of the tank with its guage and 12
...
> Everything looks great as I fill... about the first gallon doesnt move
> the needle (OK), then the needle on the guage slowly creeps up as I fill
> the tank.
> When I put gallon 9 of water in the tank, the guage drops to half and
> remains there even with all 10 gals in the tank (an honest 10 gallon
> tank, BTW).
I don't know about the VDO gauge in particular, but it sounds like it
operates just like the WesTach does. Please be aware:
1) You didn't say if you disconnected the meter when you made your voltage
measurement. If not, unhook the gauge from the meter and THEN measure.
Bet'cha it goes to 0 volts relative to frame ground.
> giving false indications. BUT, I place my OHm meter on the sender unit
> and find, that with the tank full, the resistance is s l o w l y
> creeping up from about 30 ohms to 100 over a minute of time!! I scratch
2) If I recall correctly, these meters use a wheatstone bridge for measuring
the resistance of the sensor element and have an internal capacitor to
dampen the meter movement. Wheatstone bridges have a "null" that represents
the meter peak (full) and will "fall" on either side of the null. You could
have a merely un-calibrated meter, or if it's like the Westach, there's an
internal diode that may have failed. The damping capacitor is the charging
capacitance you are measuring.
> my head (picturing that plastic ball somehow not floating properly) and
> call VDO. Big mistake. They are convinced I have not
> calibrated/installed/ or otherwise assembled the unit properly. They
> make it CLEAR that WATER will not affect the reading. Thank them and
> hang up
3 They are correct that it isn't calibrated correctly. If you can see the
back of the meter, there should be some kind of a small screw-adjustment
there. Best to "tune" it with a NON-magnetic type of screwdriver so-as not
to affect the meter movement. If you do NOT have an adjustment on the back
of the meter, then it's not externally calibrated, and THEY screwed up.
> I now regress to my childhood days of playing with electrolytic
> capacitors. Im a ham operator from WAY back and this what you
...
> Moral of the story.... dont trust the manufacturer support for help
> (e.g. water is NOT OK for testing) and I can not beleive I am the first
> one to run into this problem.... doesnt everyone use water to test their
> tanks and fuel senders??? Please feel free to tell me this was not a
> good idea.... I am here to learn.. I hope someone some day doesnt waste
> an afternoon like I did and can benefit from this story.
Dude! check the back of the meter. This isn't the twilight zone you're
in....just some very elegant old genius technology that uses an analog
series-parallel comparator (the Wheatstone bridge). They do this because all
fuel sensors vary in their final resistance when they come off the assembly
line and due to conditions in the tank. With the bridge, you can adjust the
meter to match the sensor.
If you need more help, a ham friend is a good way to go, but be careful who
you seek for your "prophet of electronics". You really need a Yoda to help
you. You might be able to fix it yourself by just adjusting the meter. If it
won't adjust, call back VDO and talk to their Yoda and find out if there's a
clamping diode (a zener) inside. If so, it may have failed and they need to
replace the unit for you.
Please echo back what you find to the list and check me: I'm not afraid to
be wrong.
Good luck! May the (electromotive) force be with you!
JKB
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jon Croke" <Jon(at)joncroke.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Battery powered 701 !!!! |
Ken,
If there was a prize to win... you'd be the winner!
I researched galvanic cells (batteries) and came to the very same
conclusions you did about the mysterious gas tank battery. The mising piece
of information for your conclusion is the electrolyte: my water passes
through a water softener at home (which uses salt to clean the resin bead
every few days) so there is a measurable amount of salt in the water I used.
In fact my water softener manual actually provides the number of milligrams
of sodium per gallon for people who might drink the water.
For the benefit of those who are not following me: The fuel guage is a
voltmeter that reads the voltage drop provided by the fuel sender ( a
variable resistor using winds of copper or nichrome). As the plastic ball
floats up and down, the resistance changes and thus the fuel guage
(voltmeter) indicates this change in resistance. As soon as I filled the
tank to the very top, the fuel sender was covered with the electrolyte (salt
water) and a galvanic reaction occurs as Ken described. Instead of being a
variable resistor, the fuel sender is now sending voltage to the guage,
disrupting the normal reading.
Moral of the story: dont use water to test these things! I was trying to
test for leaks AND guage calibration at the same time.
In science class you couldnt get an experiment like this to work.... and
then it comes to haunt you like this! Nature is full of surprises and
wonders. The internet is full of neat information: I now have a copy of the
galvanic chart hanging on my wall.
Thank you Ken and the others who responded!
> I think I remember a little from when I got my Physics degree that may
> apply here. The tank is aluminum. The water, since it is not ultra pure,
> is an electrolyte, that is, a liquid that conducts electricity. The
> rheostat in the sending unit is probably nichrome or another definitely
> non aluminum metal. So you have different metals with different
> potentials. I forget the exact term, but will look it up if I do not see
> it posted here soon. Any way, this is how a lot of batteries work. Ions
> from one metal are dissolving into the water and migrating under the
> resulting electric field and depositing on the other metal. Ions carry
> charge, so you get a voltage and a little current. This is probably more
> familiar in the use of zinc compounds to percent corrosion of the metal
> in the aluminum airplane, or in the attachment of "zincs" to metal boats
> and motors, especially those used in salt water. The zinc is more likely
> to lose ions than the aluminum, so it is sacrificed to save the
> aluminum. This is noticeable in a zinc on an outboard motor used in salt
> water. The zinc gets smaller over time. You can do the same thing by
> putting a zinc wire and a copper wire into a lemon, or other fruit or
> vegetable. The acid fruit works better because the electrolyte is more
> conductive. I suppose this is as clear as mud, but I tried. All for now.
>
> Ken Lyons
> CH701 1% done
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | owner-zenith-list-server(at)matronics.com |
| Subject: | Re: Engine for 601XL |
Jabiru 3300 was built to achieve simplicity, which is the biggest warranty they
can offer you. "Air cooled? that's not a problem, in Australia there are desserts
too" - that's what they said to me in a Jabiru Forum, you just have to take
care of making a good flow channel over the cilinders.
No drive means no friction, therefore nothing to brake/maintain. Besides low cost,
you get high liability.
I chose a 912 ULS which is not a bad engine, but I'm thinking seriusly to change
to a 3300 in the future.
Yago Osset
Spain
601 HD almost finished.
www.osset.com/yago
Mike,
Not to throw a monkey wrench into the gears.....after all you did
say that you have
narrowed your choices down to these two engines of about 120hp.......BUT
!! (pausing
for dramatic effect...) Have you looked into the possibility of the
Corvair conversion??
This is what's going in my XL, and it's truly the most bang for
your buck, I believe.
Mine has all the whistles and bells, 3.2 liters, cheap, six cylinder
smoothness, cheap, direct
drive, cheap, air cooled simplicity, cheap and easy to build (cheaply!!)
Even with all the
aforementioned "toots and clangs" such as roller rockers, blueprinting
and balancing,
altitude compensating carb, custom prop extension, etc........I've got
less than $5,000
invested and everything is new or "as new to factory specs". Tough to
beat !!
This engine will weight less fire wall forward than the Lycoming
0-235 and be
more powerful as well. ( IMHO ). I can offer up some links to excellent
web sites if
anyones interested.
While I'm throwing my 2 cents around, I'll comment on your
questions by the number..
>
> 1. The Honda is of course water cooled, and the Jabiru is air
> cooled.
> What I'm concerned about is what happens if I blow a radiator hose
> while
> flying...or what if the thermostat sticks...or the water pump goes?
> I
> only know that of all the problems I've had with cars over the
> years,
> cooling system failure has been a relatively common one. Will air
> cooling
> be enough to keep the plane flying if I go with the Honda? The
> benefits
> of water cooling are probably to avoid the effects of thermal shock,
> but
> I'm wondering if that is enough of a benefit to offset another
> element
> that can go wrong.
Okay, water cooling is great, works very reliably as long as you keep the
wet
stuff inside were it belongs......lot's of designs with water cooled
engines flying
successfully, including my own RANS S-12 with it's 65 hp Rotax........
But, air cooled is what you want in most cases, it's lighter, air is
available at 100%
of the places you might have to land ;-) and unless you plan to do a lot
of rapid
descents from the upper flight levels "thermal shock" just isn't a
realistic concern..
> 2. The Honda is fuel injected -- the Jabiru is not. I'm not
> sure why
> everything isn't fuel injected these days, but is that issue worth
> worrying about?
Real fuel injection systems are heavy and expensive and provide no magic
for your
application.......great for our cars.....thank God we have them, but they
don't offer
anything very exceptional for us, at least not when you weight it against
the issues
of complexity and weight...........a common Stromberg carb will do nicely
if you feel
you absolutely must manually control the mixture settings.......but the
Jabiru won't
offer that and neither will a computer activated Honda auto system, so
for my money
an Edelbrock Qwiksilver II altitude compensating throttle body is a steal
at around $200
and you can get one (or repair parts should they be needed) at almost any
Harley-Davidson
shop on the planet.
> 3. Does the re drive itself contribute to the increased
possibility of
> failure? Or are they relatively maintenance free?
Well, any "additional" system just adds to the list of things that can
fail.....but the cog belt
style re drives have a solid reputation in general, they are simple and
durable if well designed.
If you are choosing an engine that requires higher than normal rpm's to
generate it's rated power
you don't really have a choice, so the discussion is two fold.....do you
want an engine that will
be spending it's cruise-flight-life at 5,000 rpm wearing out in half the
time of a direct drive unit??
I know you can balance the cost of the Honda overhaul (pretty low I'd
guess?) against that
eventuality.......but toss in the added cost of the re drive, and the
extra weight (way out in front!!)
and the picture may not appeal to you any more.
Of course there are no BAD choices here, you probably know how much time
and money you
have to experiment with, and that may play as much in you plans as
anything else. I encourage all
builders to follow their dreams and share their experiences. I only tried
to entice you with the
Corvair info because I believe it's the best kept secret in experimental
light aircraft.
>
> Thanks in advance for the help.
>
> Mike Fortunato
> 601XL
>
You're welcome !!!!! John Moyle
5552 West
Oak Avenue
Fresno CA
93722
mailto:jmoyle1(at)juno.com
>
>
> messages.
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
---------------------------------
Copa del Mundo de la FIFA 2002
El nico lugar de Internet con vdeos de los 64 partidos Apntante ya!.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Phil & Michele Miller <millerpg(at)ps.gen.nz> |
If you can get a look at the earlier (Version 2) plans I think you wil find
shown a very crude (but probably effective) adjustable bungy on the control
stick. Electric trim is much nicer although I find that I am running out of
"UP" trim when setting up a normal descent. Another local 701 with 912S
reports the same problem. Weight and balance are OK on both machines. Does
anyone have any suggestions??
Phil Miller
New Zealand
(912S CH701)
-----Original Message-----
From: David Terrell [SMTP:dl_terrell(at)yahoo.com]
Subject: Re: Zenith-List: 701 Questions
As far as I know, there is no manual trim option on
the 701, other than building in a fixed (ground
adjustable) trim tab like the small cessnas and pipers
have on the rudder.
It's quite possible that some of the more industrious
builders out there have created their own manual trim
system.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Phil & Michele Miller <millerpg(at)ps.gen.nz> |
| Subject: | OAT - where to put? |
Hi Michel,
Can I suggest that you check out where they put it on a similar GA
aircraft. That should give you a good idea of where to put it on your own
machine.
Regards,
Phil Miller
New Zealand
(912S CH701)
-----Original Message-----
From: Michel Therrien [SMTP:mtherr(at)yahoo.com]
Subject: RE: Zenith-List: OAT - where to put?
Thanks to all who answered my question on OAT
installation. I got varied answers with no two
individuals putting it at the same place. I've seen
(next to a rib on the side of the center wing, under
the front fuselage, around a faired gear leg, inside a
naca cabin vent and inside the carburator air intake.
Michel
=====
----------------------------
Michel Therrien CH601-HD
http://pages.infinit.net/mthobby
http://mthobby.pcperfect.com/ch601
http://www.zenithair.com/bldrlist/profiles/mthobby
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Lyle Pahnke" <ldpahnke(at)netwitz.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Engine for 601XL |
---------- Original Message ----------------------------------
Honda Vs Jabiru
I have the CAM 100 but not flying yet. Water cooled. Not really a
serious threat for instantaneous engine failure. IF water pump
fails it is gradually manifest by a leak. Hose failure rare with
good pre flight. Use silicone racing hoses for water system.
Probably relatively easier to install a radiator in good location
than to make baffles, cowling vents flaps etc to get good air
cooling. I believe the jabiru comes with cooling ducts though.
Air cooled engines noisier, have to be have larger tolerances and
are cooled with oil and fuel expenditures as well. Need to be
overhauled sooner and vibrate more.
In favor of the Honda: proven reliability some 15 million engines
made in past few years. No pushrods simple proven design. High
RPM not a problem. S. Honda understood this when introduced the
engine in 1940's power based on piston feet travelled works out to
about the same. See kit planes article on this few mo's ago. Fuel
injection. Simple reliable no carb icing or altitude probs.
attitude probs. Ignition system bullet-proof.
Power development Jabiru necessisarily develops it's peak power at
higher than 2500 RPM because smaller displacement direct drive --
translates to smaller less efficient prop.
REdrives not really a problem Honds redrive is massive bearings at
both ends of drive shaft, no eccentric crank loads, No problems.
Will handle over 500 HP
Sugest talk to Bob Master's at the Honda conversion plant. He is
an engineer and understands a lot more theory about engines that
I do and can be very enlightening regarding this matter. Good luck
LDP
Netwitz Internet Services www.netwitz.net (618)533-5447
Call Today And Ask About Wireless Broadband
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Chuck Deiterich" <cfd(at)thegateway.net> |
| Subject: | Re: 701 Questions |
Phil
Shorten the trim push rod, this will give more up trim but less down
trim(tab itself actually goes down to trim elevator up).
Chuck D.
----- Original Message -----
From: Phil & Michele Miller <millerpg(at)ps.gen.nz>
Subject: RE: Zenith-List: 701 Questions
>
. Electric trim is much nicer although I find that I am running out of
> "UP" trim when setting up a normal descent. Another local 701 with 912S
> reports the same problem. Weight and balance are OK on both machines. Does
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Randy L. Thwing" <n4546v(at)mindspring.com> |
| Subject: | Re: 701 Questions |
Listers:
ZA offered a manual trim option for the 701. It consisted of a movable
trim tab on the elevator operated from the cabin by a automotive style
manual choke cable. I bought the plans sheets for this option and have them
somewhere. If anyone is interested, I could find them.
Regards,
Randy L. Thwing, 701 plans, Las Vegas
> As far as I know, there is no manual trim option on
> the 701,
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Using water to calibrate fuel sensors not a good procedure |
| From: | charles.long(at)gm.com |
06/27/2002 11:46:21 AM
I also experienced the same problem with my HDS leading edge tanks.
Water doesn't work. After reaching the half full point (sender starts to
submerge), adding additional water made no change in the reading. Gaged
stayed at 1/2 full. So, dumped the water, dried the tank with a hair drier
and tried again with gasoline. This time everything worked fine and the
calibration came out nice and linear. Chuck Long, HDS, 50% complete
From: "Jon Croke" <Jon(at)joncroke.com>
Subject: Zenith-List: Battery powered 701 !!!!
Here's a story with a plea to scientists for understanding:
I am working on my wing tanks for the 701... I assembled the fuel sender
unit as prescribed and tested it out of the tank with its guage and 12
volts. All is well and the float was adjusted for the tank depth. Cut
the hole in the tank and installed the sender.
I now proceed to fill the tank with WATER to test for leaks and confirm
that the guage reads from empty to full.
Everything looks great as I fill... about the first gallon doesnt move
the needle (OK), then the needle on the guage slowly creeps up as I fill
the tank.
When I put gallon 9 of water in the tank, the guage drops to half and
remains there even with all 10 gals in the tank (an honest 10 gallon
tank, BTW).
From: "Edwin Ulrich" <eulrich(at)escape.ca>
Subject: RE: Zenith-List: Battery powered 701 !!!!
I really wish I knew what was happening with your fuel sender/gauge...
because mine did exactly the same thing when I tested it with water. I
assumed the sender was giving erroneous readings due to the water. I did
not
want to test with fuel yet because I didn't want to live with fuel fumes in
my shop for the next X-years. I left the problem to be resolved later... If
you do manage to figure this one out, I'd sure appreciate an update to the
list...
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "The Meiste's" <meiste(at)essex1.com> |
I've slaved away at my 601 project 3 1/2 years now and will soon be
making that long awaited journey to the airport. But the problem is my
hanger has a slight rodent problem. After all this time and effort I
don't want to see my new machine eaten from the inside out by them furry
varmints. I'm just curious what others have found effective short of the
obvious traps, & poisons to protect our prize possession from these
chewing machines.
Thanks,
Kelly Meiste
601 HD (98% and counting)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Tim & Diane Shankland <tshank(at)megsinet.net> |
A couple of weeks ago I went out to Mexico and picked up a canopy for my
601HD. I am finishing fabricating an XL type of opener. (no need to
rehash that discussion) What I need to know is has anyone purchased the
gas spring used. McMaster-Carr has a selection of them and if someone
else has all ready figured out which one it is it would save me the time
and possible mistake. Another possibility is that those of you building
the XL kit might notice a model number on yours or at least its open and
compressed length. My drawings off then web showing the mechanism are
quite vague on this point.
Thanks
Tim Shankland
601HD Tail -wings done on the wheels
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | tomlazear(at)netscape.net (John Lazear) |
When I first installed my Battery behind the seat I was flying with the CG in the
middle of the loading range. In this configuration the nose was a little heavy
on landing flair with no power. I moved the battery to the tail cone after
about 80 hrs. The CG when flying in the aft third of the loading range, but still
in the aft CG limet. This made the nose more responsive during landing flair,
this is my preferance.
Tom 701,912UL 150 hrs.
"Chuck Deiterich" wrote:
>
>Has anybody flown the 701 throughout the CG envelop?
>Any comments?
>Chuck D.
>
>
Your favorite stores, helpful shopping tools and great gift ideas. Experience the convenience of buying online with Shop@Netscape! http://shopnow.netscape.com/
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Gary Liming <gary(at)liming.org> |
| Subject: | Re: calibrate fuel sensors |
I can't explain why water as a fluid would mess up the readings (unless it
had a lot of free ions in it) but I had to play a lot with the sender arms
and add some series resistance (330 ohms, in my case) in order to get Empty
on the gauge to match the arm position at one end, and Full on the gauge to
match the other. (I just turned the tank over to get the arm to swing
without using any fluids.) I have four tanks with four senders, and I
actually managed to install one sender with the arm on the wrong side, so
full read Empty and vice versa! It pays to check them out to make sure
they work as you intend before putting them in the wing.
Gary Liming
801
>
> I also experienced the same problem with my HDS leading edge tanks.
>Water doesn't work. After reaching the half full point (sender starts to
>submerge), adding additional water made no change in the reading. Gaged
>stayed at 1/2 full. So, dumped the water, dried the tank with a hair drier
>and tried again with gasoline. This time everything worked fine and the
>calibration came out nice and linear. Chuck Long, HDS, 50% complete
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Gary Liming <gary(at)liming.org> |
| Subject: | Re: calibrate fuel sensors |
>
>
>I can't explain why water as a fluid would mess up the readings (unless it
>had a lot of free ions in it) but I had to play a lot with the sender arms
>and add some series resistance (330 ohms, in my case)
Sorry, that should have been 33 ohms
Gary Liming
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Michel Therrien <mtherr(at)yahoo.com> |
The current XL plans says: compressed lenght = 4.6",
extended lenght = 8.1", 40 lbs, part no. 9416K12
The price from ZAC is very reasonable (comparable with
Reid Tools and McMaster), so it may just be simpler to
order from them. I plan on doing that an on ordering
several other parts at the same time (the handles).
Did you figure out a way to make or buy the latch?
Michel
--- Tim & Diane Shankland wrote:
> Shankland
>
> A couple of weeks ago I went out to Mexico and
> picked up a canopy for my
> 601HD. I am finishing fabricating an XL type of
> opener. (no need to
> rehash that discussion) What I need to know is has
> anyone purchased the
> gas spring used. McMaster-Carr has a selection of
> them and if someone
> else has all ready figured out which one it is it
> would save me the time
> and possible mistake. Another possibility is that
> those of you building
> the XL kit might notice a model number on yours or
> at least its open and
> compressed length. My drawings off then web showing
> the mechanism are
> quite vague on this point.
>
> Thanks
>
> Tim Shankland
> 601HD Tail -wings done on the wheels
=====
----------------------------
Michel Therrien CH601-HD
http://pages.infinit.net/mthobby
http://mthobby.pcperfect.com/ch601
http://www.zenithair.com/bldrlist/profiles/mthobby
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Phil & Michele Miller <millerpg(at)ps.gen.nz> |
Chuck,
Thanks for the suggestion. At present the maximum up and down trim tab
travel from neutral are identical. I have been told that if I increase the
travel I run the risk of stalling the trim tab thereby losing effectiveness
and creating drag. Any thoughts?
Phil M
-----Original Message-----
From: Chuck Deiterich [SMTP:cfd(at)thegateway.net]
Subject: Re: Zenith-List: 701 Questions
Phil
Shorten the trim push rod, this will give more up trim but less down
trim(tab itself actually goes down to trim elevator up).
Chuck D.
----- Original Message -----
From: Phil & Michele Miller <millerpg(at)ps.gen.nz>
Subject: RE: Zenith-List: 701 Questions
>
. Electric trim is much nicer although I find that I am running out of
> "UP" trim when setting up a normal descent. Another local 701 with 912S
> reports the same problem. Weight and balance are OK on both machines.
Does
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Lyle Pahnke" <ldpahnke(at)netwitz.net> |
---------- Original Message ----------------------------------
I have an Ultrasonic pest deterrent unit in the hangar. Seems to
help wi/ most varmin Get the more expensive unit. I think they
have a better range and cover a wider area. Also the solid sticks
of rat poison might help along the perimeter of the hangar.
Good luck
LDP
Netwitz Internet Services www.netwitz.net (618)533-5447
Call Today And Ask About Wireless Broadband
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Engine for 601XL |
| From: | Grant Corriveau <grantC(at)total.net> |
on 6/26/02 9:39 PM, John P Moyle at jmoyle1(at)juno.com wrote:
> do you
> want an engine that will
> be spending it's cruise-flight-life at 5,000 rpm wearing out in half the
> time of a direct drive unit??
.... FYI the CAM100 has a 5 year/500 hour guarantee on the core engine...
Does the CAM125 also have this? How does this compare to others?
--
Grant Corriveau
Montreal
Zodiac 601hds/CAM100
C-GHTF
www.theWingStayedON.ca
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Engine for 601XL |
| From: | Grant Corriveau <grantC(at)total.net> |
...
> Probably relatively easier to install a radiator in good location
> than to make baffles, cowling vents flaps etc to get good air
> cooling. I believe the jabiru comes with cooling ducts though.
> Power development Jabiru necessisarily develops it's peak power at
> higher than 2500 RPM because smaller displacement direct drive --
> translates to smaller less efficient prop.
These are the two most important issues with the Jabiru. How are the actual
cooling airflows and airspeeds working out for those on this list flying the
3300? Getting good air to the rear cylinders in a 3-cylinder bank has
historically always been a challenge.
The small prop diameters have historically posed performance penalties on VW
engines using similar RPM ranges - so you want some hard numbers here and
not just engineering estimates. imho.
The CAM125s biggest 'issue' is the weight, but it is in the same range as
the Lycoming etc. I believe. The VTEC delivers excellent torque to the prop
through a wide range of rpms (a good candidate for constant speed prop?)...
the dual electronic ignition is an excellent, dependable unit...
I'm surprised that the original posting said both engines were equal on
price. When I chose the CAM100, one reason was that it was significantly
less expensive than the Jabiru 2200. Has something changed in the exchange
rate between CAN and AUSSIE bucks?
--
Grant Corriveau
Montreal
Zodiac 601hds/CAM100
C-GHTF
www.theWingStayedON.ca
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Chuck Deiterich" <cfd(at)thegateway.net> |
| Subject: | Re: 701 Questions |
Phil,
I don't know how the skin is bent on the trailing edge of your elevator. The
rear 20 mm on mine has the top of the skin bent up as per the plans and the
bottom skin just follows it along. Thus the last 20 mm of the elevator is
bent up about 20 degrees (this bend is to give the trailing edge some
stiffness). Thus, effectively, the elevator has some built-in down trim.
Too bad that the top and bottom skins were not bent about 10 degrees each so
they would mate without the trailing edge being up or down. ZAC had this
problem on their 701 and bent the trailing edge of the elevator to a neutral
position. Mine is per the plans and I expect to start off this way, as
trying to bend the riveted trailing edge might be hard to do and get it
straight.
As far as performance, the added drag is negligible. I would try my
suggestion and see what happens. Also, I am going to try different flaperon
adjustments to find the optimal zero flap position. Hey, this is what
experimental is all about.
Chuck D.
----- Original Message -----
From: Phil & Michele Miller <millerpg(at)ps.gen.nz>
>
> Thanks for the suggestion. At present the maximum up and down trim tab
> travel from neutral are identical. I have been told that if I increase the
> travel I run the risk of stalling the trim tab thereby losing
effectiveness
> and creating drag. Any thoughts?
>
> Phil M
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Leo Gates <leogates(at)ev1.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Using water to calibrate fuel sensors not a good procedure |
I purchased my fuel senders and gauge from J C Whitney. I used water to
check the calabration in my HDS leading edge tanks (per Nick at ZAC).
Worked just fine for me - maybe cheaper is better.
Leo Gates
N601Z
charles.long(at)gm.com wrote:
>
> I also experienced the same problem with my HDS leading edge tanks.
>Water doesn't work. After reaching the half full point (sender starts to
>submerge), adding additional water made no change in the reading. Gaged
>stayed at 1/2 full. So, dumped the water, dried the tank with a hair drier
>and tried again with gasoline. This time everything worked fine and the
>calibration came out nice and linear. Chuck Long, HDS, 50% complete
>
>From: "Jon Croke" <Jon(at)joncroke.com>
>Subject: Zenith-List: Battery powered 701 !!!!
>
>
>Here's a story with a plea to scientists for understanding:
>
>I am working on my wing tanks for the 701... I assembled the fuel sender
>unit as prescribed and tested it out of the tank with its guage and 12
>volts. All is well and the float was adjusted for the tank depth. Cut
>the hole in the tank and installed the sender.
>I now proceed to fill the tank with WATER to test for leaks and confirm
>that the guage reads from empty to full.
>Everything looks great as I fill... about the first gallon doesnt move
>the needle (OK), then the needle on the guage slowly creeps up as I fill
>the tank.
>When I put gallon 9 of water in the tank, the guage drops to half and
>remains there even with all 10 gals in the tank (an honest 10 gallon
>tank, BTW).
>
>
>From: "Edwin Ulrich" <eulrich(at)escape.ca>
>Subject: RE: Zenith-List: Battery powered 701 !!!!
>
>
>I really wish I knew what was happening with your fuel sender/gauge...
>because mine did exactly the same thing when I tested it with water. I
>assumed the sender was giving erroneous readings due to the water. I did
>not
>want to test with fuel yet because I didn't want to live with fuel fumes in
>my shop for the next X-years. I left the problem to be resolved later... If
>you do manage to figure this one out, I'd sure appreciate an update to the
>list...
>
>
>.
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Engine for 601XL |
| From: | Michael R Fortunato <wizard-24(at)juno.com> |
> I'm surprised that the original posting said both engines were equal
> on price.
That was me, and indeed the prices are very close to being the same, when
you factor everything in (engine, cowling, redrive, prop, etc). That's
part of what makes this decision so tough! :)
Anyway, looks like I'm leaning towards the Jabiru. For a simpleton
builder like me, ease of installation is a HUGE issue, and the Jab would
seem to be much easier. After objectively analyzing the numbers made
available to me by both manufacturers (and other listers), the CAM would
seem to be the better performer, even with the added weight (you won't
get 125 hp out of the Jab unless you run it full throttle, I'm told).
But, there's also much more to go wrong with the additional components of
the CAM, so I'm not sure this little extra performance (assuming it
exists in the real world) is worth it.
Nonetheless, as others have mentioned, a builder could probably use
either powerplant and be perfectly happy. I just wish they weren't so
darned expensive!
Mike Fortunato
601XL
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Shay King" <shaking(at)eircom.net> |
| Subject: | installing engine |
Dear List,
I just took delivery of a 912uls engine for my 701. Hope to start
installing next week, that is if I can figure out how to do it. I've
just been trying to search the archive for info but it's not giving
answers today for some reason.
If anyone's got any advice before I start I'd appreciate it.
Regards,
Shay King.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Brett Hanley <bretttdc(at)yahoo.com> |
Does any one ouy there know how much force is exerted
on the electric servo by the trim tab (please excuse
the spanish speaking computer) If this fact is known
it should not be too hard to devise a manual control
for the standard trim tab.
Brett
San Jose
Costa Rica
http://health.yahoo.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Don Gordon" <dojo(at)polymembranepipe.com.au> |
| Subject: | Re: 701 Questions |
As am alternative to the electric trim tab on the 701
on page 372 Aircraft Spruce Book you will find a
RANS manual push rod trim system
Also listed in Zac's Manual page38 it explains a simple
bungee pitch trim system
I personally have gone with the electric trim system
started on fuslage wings and tail made
Don
----- Original Message -----
From: "Phil & Michele Miller" <millerpg(at)ps.gen.nz>
Subject: RE: Zenith-List: 701 Questions
>
> Chuck,
>
> Thanks for the suggestion. At present the maximum up and down trim tab
> travel from neutral are identical. I have been told that if I increase the
> travel I run the risk of stalling the trim tab thereby losing
effectiveness
> and creating drag. Any thoughts?
>
> Phil M
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Chuck Deiterich [SMTP:cfd(at)thegateway.net]
> Sent: Friday, 28 June 2002 3:26 AM
> To: zenith-list(at)matronics.com
> Subject: Re: Zenith-List: 701 Questions
>
>
> Phil
> Shorten the trim push rod, this will give more up trim but less down
> trim(tab itself actually goes down to trim elevator up).
> Chuck D.
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: Phil & Michele Miller <millerpg(at)ps.gen.nz>
> To:
> Subject: RE: Zenith-List: 701 Questions
>
>
>
> >
> . Electric trim is much nicer although I find that I am running out of
> > "UP" trim when setting up a normal descent. Another local 701 with 912S
> > reports the same problem. Weight and balance are OK on both machines.
> Does
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Larry C. McFarland" <larrymc(at)qconline.com> |
| Subject: | Battery and Starter Contactors |
Builders,
Does anyone know if the solenoids for the battery
and starter have any orientation requirements, The print
on the ones I've recieved seems to be upside down to what
I'm used to looking at. Is there an up or a down for these
things?
Thanks,
Larry McFarland - 601hds
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Tim & Diane Shankland <tshank(at)megsinet.net> |
Michel,
Thanks for the info. I'll check the price at Zenith too. Regarding the
latches it took some doing to track them down but I found them. They are made
by the SPAE-NAUR company, Toronto. They can be purchased from the Windsor
Factory Supply 519-966-2202. The part numbers are 099-031 for the left hand
one and 099-030 for the right hand one. They cost $36.40 Canadian each. There
is a part that has to be cut off and then an extension welded on.
Tim
Michel Therrien wrote:
>
> The current XL plans says: compressed lenght = 4.6",
> extended lenght = 8.1", 40 lbs, part no. 9416K12
>
> The price from ZAC is very reasonable (comparable with
> Reid Tools and McMaster), so it may just be simpler to
> order from them. I plan on doing that an on ordering
> several other parts at the same time (the handles).
>
> Did you figure out a way to make or buy the latch?
>
> Michel
>
> --- Tim & Diane Shankland wrote:
> > Shankland
> >
> > A couple of weeks ago I went out to Mexico and
> > picked up a canopy for my
> > 601HD. I am finishing fabricating an XL type of
> > opener. (no need to
> > rehash that discussion) What I need to know is has
> > anyone purchased the
> > gas spring used. McMaster-Carr has a selection of
> > them and if someone
> > else has all ready figured out which one it is it
> > would save me the time
> > and possible mistake. Another possibility is that
> > those of you building
> > the XL kit might notice a model number on yours or
> > at least its open and
> > compressed length. My drawings off then web showing
> > the mechanism are
> > quite vague on this point.
> >
> > Thanks
> >
> > Tim Shankland
> > 601HD Tail -wings done on the wheels
>
> =====
> ----------------------------
> Michel Therrien CH601-HD
> http://pages.infinit.net/mthobby
> http://mthobby.pcperfect.com/ch601
> http://www.zenithair.com/bldrlist/profiles/mthobby
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Gary Gower <ggower_99(at)yahoo.com> |
Here we use a galvanized cal 28 open "cylinder" around
the wheels high enough for the rodents not to climb. a
"cowling" bolt on top and bottom of the joining walls
of the cilinder will allow fast removing of the
cilinder each time. Alex also uses a little of poison
food inside the cylinder area just in case to protect
his 1947 Stintson.
Saludos
Garyt Gower
--- The Meiste's wrote:
>
>
> I've slaved away at my 601 project 3 1/2 years now
> and will soon be
> making that long awaited journey to the airport. But
> the problem is my
> hanger has a slight rodent problem. After all this
> time and effort I
> don't want to see my new machine eaten from the
> inside out by them furry
> varmints. I'm just curious what others have found
> effective short of the
> obvious traps, & poisons to protect our prize
> possession from these
> chewing machines.
> Thanks,
>
> Kelly Meiste
> 601 HD (98% and counting)
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Don and Carol Dalziel <nodf(at)clsurf.com> |
If anyone is interested Wag Aero at Lyons Wisconsin has a
Cam100 that's still in the crate. I think it was bought
for one of their projects . They have had it for several
years so maybe it could be gotten for a good price.
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Back in the air! |
| From: | Grant Corriveau <grantC(at)total.net> |
Finally! After a couple of setbacks (overly wet, rainy spring weather,/
garage breakin and loss of wing attachment hardware not to mention
handtools, etc...) I've got everything back together and I was up for three
circuits and a short tour this morning.
No one can ever accuse the 601HDS of being a docile aircraft! This thing
growls! I usually open the throttle slowly to avoid gravel damage on my
local strip, and I hardly get the second barrel of the carb 'kicked in' and
I'm almost airborne. I'm sure this thing will out-accelerate the Airbus 319
-- at least for the first 60 mph! ;-)
My landings are still 'carrier arrivals'... I think I stop flaring because
the nose gets so high and I'm losing sight of the horizon... then boom - it
hits and sticks.... anyways, I need to spend more time playing with it in
slow flight and flight on the edge of the stall, out in the practice area,
to get more familiar with the attitude at min. speeds.
I still over-estimate the glide (if you can call it that! ha ha), and need
to add power on final often. I'm still practicing mostly power off landings
from circuit altitude, to force myself to know the glide characteristics. I
don't like long shallow approaches with single engine aircraft, especially
if there are houses below and few landing spots.... old training from my ab
initio training days, I guess.
Happy building all! Keep going - it's worth it.
--
Grant Corriveau
Montreal
Zodiac 601hds/CAM100
C-GHTF
www.theWingStayedON.ca
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Ten thousand and still going... |
| From: | Grant Corriveau <grantC(at)total.net> |
I lifted the flight envelope to 10,000 feet this morning (10,400 on the
gps). The average climb from 2,500 asl was somewhere in the vicinity of 300
fpm...
At 10,000 the climb rate was still about 200 fpm... I was getting cold at 8
degres C (no heater) and shorts (hey - it was 25 at the ground). When I
levelled off, the cruise speed settled down around 90 mph ias (about 107 tas
using gps), so I know there was more climb left still...
I was getting about 5200 rpm at takeoff power near sea-level, the climb at
full throttle (of course) produced almost 5000 rpm most of the way up, and
an honest 5,000 in cruise. I guess part of the reason for this consistent
rpm is the Warp Drive prop's tapered ends that are supposed to provide some
sort of 'twisting' effect (If I understand the theory correctly), and the
CAM100s excellent torque applied through the 2.4-1 reduction drive.
In the dive/descent back down to warmer air, I took advantage of the water
cooling. I pulled on the carb heat, throttled back to about 3,000 rpm, and
dove the speed up to 140 mph with about a 20 to 25 degree nose-down
attitude. FUN! Almost worth the climb-time... I peaked out the speed to 150
(carefully) - new top speed so far. Everthing remained attached to the
aircraft as it should! ;-).
The aircraft is sensitive to lateral imbalances. I've increased the size of
my aileron trim tab and it helps a little, but burning the fuel down on the
left a couple of gallons helped a lot more. Once I get the wing lockers cut
in, I may have to be methodical about the lateral balance by moving stuff
from locker to locker.
--
Grant Corriveau
Montreal
Zodiac 601hds/CAM100
C-GHTF
www.theWingStayedON.ca
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | MAC trim control grip - no like it! |
| From: | Grant Corriveau <grantC(at)total.net> |
Does anyone else not like the MAC stick grip with the imbedded trim buttons?
This seems to be a poplular unit, and the motor, etc. is certainly reliable
enough and seems to work well. BUT - the grip with the five buttons (4 for
trim plus Push to talk) is a nuisance. To be specific, here are my beefs:
1/ in the first place, having to solder together those teeny little #26
wires was a job I didn't want. Why didn't they tell me it was a
'do-it-yourself'? Or maybe I didn't notice the fine print?
2/ the trim buttons themselves are too small and the tactile feel is such
that it's hard to find the correct button without accidentally trimming
something - usually something I didn't want.
3/ the trim buttons don't provid much feed back as to when contact is being
made.
4/ the trim buttons are way too easy to accidentally hit! I've had my leg
run my aileron trim full over, and sometimes while resting my hand on the
stick, or using the outboard hand temporarily, I've accidentally sent the
elevator trim into 'pilot-induced-runaway' mode. I thought I was having a
serious control problem of some sort the first time it happened!
I plan to move the aileron trim off the stick onto a panel switch somewhere
as this is not a switch that gets used much. Long term I hope to sell the
thing and replace it with some sort of 2-switch model with a nice tactile
'pickle' or 'top=hat' swicth for the pitch trim, and a trigger for the
PTT... but for now I must remember to keep my knee clear of the trim
switch...
--
Grant Corriveau
Montreal
Zodiac 601hds/CAM100
C-GHTF
www.theWingStayedON.ca
p.s. don't let anyone else read this as I may want them to sell them this
unit later! (joking)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Grant Corriveau <grantC(at)total.net> |
For all you detectives out there, here's one for you...
Last year my VSI seemed to work perfectly fine. This year it is acting
strange:
1/ It reads zero on the ground
2/ as soon as I'm airborne it under-reads by about 300 fpm in the climb...
3/ in cruise, when flying level, it indicates minus 300 fpm...
4/ after landing, it shows zero again.
5/ the asi and altimeter seem to be working fine
I need to check it after a long-term level off (i.e. is it a leak in the
static line that eventually equalizes?), and during descent... The fact that
it is zero on the ground, seems to tell me that the problem is not just
gauge calibration, but something in the lines. I've connected them the
same as last year, but I'd better check the hoses I've used for cuts or
holes....?
Other ideas?
Thanks
Grant Corriveau
Montreal
Zodiac 601hds/CAM100
C-GHTF
www.theWingStayedON.ca
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Paul Sharpe" <fly601(at)rogers.com> |
Hi Grant,
Have you perhaps had a bug make a nest in your static line between your
VSI and the static source?
Paul Sharpe
----- Original Message -----
From: "Grant Corriveau" <grantC(at)total.net>
Subject: Zenith-List: VSI problem
>
> For all you detectives out there, here's one for you...
>
> Last year my VSI seemed to work perfectly fine. This year it is acting
> strange:
>
> 1/ It reads zero on the ground
>
> 2/ as soon as I'm airborne it under-reads by about 300 fpm in the climb...
>
> 3/ in cruise, when flying level, it indicates minus 300 fpm...
>
> 4/ after landing, it shows zero again.
>
> 5/ the asi and altimeter seem to be working fine
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Chuck Deiterich" <cfd(at)thegateway.net> |
Grant,
It sounds as if you have a restriction in the static line or, perhaps, the
case on the VSI has a leak.
Chuck D.
----- Original Message -----
From: Grant Corriveau <grantC(at)total.net>
Subject: Zenith-List: VSI problem
>
> For all you detectives out there, here's one for you...
>
> Last year my VSI seemed to work perfectly fine. This year it is acting
> strange:
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Cowl Pin Consensus |
Hi List,
I need some advice/consensus from the list regarding the cowl pins that are
supposes to be installed in the very front portion of the cowling. To do
this though the steel flanges need to be bent/molded to fit the curvature of
the cowl. I cannot see anyway of doing this without using an acetylene torch
or something similar to heat that metal making pliable enough to bend.
The other choice would be to move the cowl pins around to the side of the
canopy but I do not know if that is an acceptable solution.
From those of you that have been there, done that, what are you doing, have
you done to install those canopy pins.
Steve (got the canopy on, what a chore) Freeman
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Peter Chapman <pchapman(at)ionsys.com> |
At 06:24 01-07-02 , you wrote:
>Last year my VSI seemed to work perfectly fine. This year it is acting
>strange:
A possibility, other than problems with the lines to the gauge:
It may be that the gauge itself is leaking. I have a UMA VSI that has acted
up in a similar way. A UMA rep told me at Oshkosh to try sealing around the
edge of the glass face with cyanoacrylate glue (crazy glue). That solved
the problem for me. (For a while -- I'll have to try resealing again.)
Peter Chapman
Toronto, ON 601 HDS / 912 / C-GZDC
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Pinneo, George" <George.Pinneo(at)trw.com> |
You can bend them in a vise with a hammer (small) in true Zenith tradition. I've
replaced mine with truss-head machine screws that are secured with elastic
nut plates. Both work.
GGP
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Pinneo, George" <George.Pinneo(at)trw.com> |
You can bend them in a vise with a hammer (small) in true Zenith tradition. I've
replaced mine with truss-head machine screws that are secured with elastic
nut plates. Both work.
GGP
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Dave Austin" <daveaustin2(at)sprint.ca> |
| Subject: | Re: Cowl Pin Consensus |
My two cents worth..
The pins were too long anyway on both parts, so I made up a wad of
resin-soaked glasscloth and positioned the metal parts through the holes
drilled in the lower cowl. Once the resin had set I drilled and installed
rivets to give a permanent hold. This all solved the problem of the two
parts not fitting well.
Dave Austin 601HDS - 912 - 510 hrs
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "LEO CORBALIS" <l.corbalis(at)worldnet.att.net> |
You don't need a torch to bend the support strips, mine are .063 so they can
be bent cold to such a large radius. Cut off the pins at about 1 and 1/2 rod
diameters sticking out the front and grind the tip to a round profile. Don't
go DZUZ happy. Its great to be able to pull the whole cowl quickly and
easily if you want to inspect anything!! Less worry more flying.
LEO CORBALIS
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Cowl Pin Consensus |
In a message dated 07/01/2002 11:43:34 AM US Mountain Standard Time,
daveaustin2(at)sprint.ca writes:
> so I made up a wad of
> resin-soaked glasscloth and positioned the metal parts through the holes
> drilled in the lower cowl. Once the resin had set I drilled and installed
> rivets to give a permanent hold.
I can picture the wad of resined cloth holding the steel flange and being
crammed into the nose area, and getting glassed in, but what did you drill
through to apply rivets? It seems like the end result would be much to thick
for the grip length of the rivets. Do you have any pics you would be willing
to forward?
Thanks for your suggestions folks. Lots of good ideas as usual.
Steve Freeman
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Clive Richards" <stephen(at)crichards.flyer.co.uk> |
I suggest that the gauge case or glass seal is leaking to the sealed
capsull ie the case bypassing the metering orifice, when you are flying the
cabin pressure is probably less than the static port pressure so if you are
flying level it shows you decending, on the ground the pressures will be
equal & so the gauge will read zero
Clive Richards
----- Original Message -----
From: "Grant Corriveau" <grantC(at)total.net>
Subject: Zenith-List: VSI problem
>
> For all you detectives out there, here's one for you...
>
> Last year my VSI seemed to work perfectly fine. This year it is acting
> strange:
>
> 1/ It reads zero on the ground
>
> 2/ as soon as I'm airborne it under-reads by about 300 fpm in the climb...
>
> 3/ in cruise, when flying level, it indicates minus 300 fpm...
>
> 4/ after landing, it shows zero again.
>
> 5/ the asi and altimeter seem to be working fine
>
> Grant Corriveau
> Montreal
> Zodiac 601hds/CAM100
> C-GHTF
> www.theWingStayedON.ca
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Fred Poor <fredspoor2002(at)yahoo.com> |
I would guess an insect (i.e.) mud dapper etc. has
blocked the static port of the vsi. "Fred"
do not archieve
-
> >
> > 1/ It reads zero on the ground
> >
> > 2/ as soon as I'm airborne it under-reads by about
> 300 fpm in the climb...
> >
> > 3/ in cruise, when flying level, it indicates
> minus 300 fpm...
> >
> > 4/ after landing, it shows zero again.
> >
> > 5/ the asi and altimeter seem to be working fine
> >
> > Grant Corriveau
> > Montreal
> > Zodiac 601hds/CAM100
> > C-GHTF
> > www.theWingStayedON.ca
> >
> >
>
>
>
> Contributions of
> any other form
>
> latest messages.
> other List members.
>
> http://www.matronics.com/subscription
> http://www.matronics.com/photoshare
> http://www.matronics.com/search
> http://www.matronics.com/archives
> http://www.matronics.com/emaillists
>
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Chesterman Family <chesterman(at)on.aibn.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Cowl Pin Consensus |
I installed dsuz fasteners here instead.
STEFREE(at)aol.com wrote:
>
> Hi List,
>
> I need some advice/consensus from the list regarding the cowl pins that are
> supposes to be installed in the very front portion of the cowling. To do
> this though the steel flanges need to be bent/molded to fit the curvature of
> the cowl. I cannot see anyway of doing this without using an acetylene torch
> or something similar to heat that metal making pliable enough to bend.
>
> The other choice would be to move the cowl pins around to the side of the
> canopy but I do not know if that is an acceptable solution.
>
> >From those of you that have been there, done that, what are you doing, have
> you done to install those canopy pins.
>
> Steve (got the canopy on, what a chore) Freeman
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | VSI problem - thanks for the ideas |
| From: | Grant Corriveau <grantC(at)total.net> |
> I would guess an insect (i.e.) mud dapper etc. has
> blocked the static port of the vsi.
> --------------------------
> I suggest that the gauge case or glass seal is leaking...
These have to be the two favorites because they are localized to the VSI
instrument itself -- my ASI and Altimeter are normal. I consider the 400
feet difference between the indicated altitude and the gps 'true' altitude
at 10,000 ft. to be quite normal. I haven't run the numbers into my
'plastic wheel', but I should do that for interest).
I'm leaning towards the 'seal the glass' idea as it seems to better explain
the instrument's behaviour. The 'proof' I think, will be to cruise for a
longer term at say, 1,000 feet and see if the VSI eventually zeros. If it
does, then the problem is a blockage in the VSI inlet/tube somewhere. If it
is continuously 300 feet negative, then it is due to leaking at the
instrument, sensing the lower relative cabin pressure vs. the static port on
the wing...
Does that make sense? I'll check it out and let you know. Thanks for the
help.
--
Grant Corriveau
Montreal
Zodiac 601hds/CAM100
C-GHTF
www.theWingStayedON.ca
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Time to do the HOOK mod! |
| From: | Grant Corriveau <grantC(at)total.net> |
I was just levelling off and accelerating, and noticed my T-shirt sleeve
tickling against my left (i.e. outboard) upper arm. I've felt this before
(my canopy isn't well-sealed yet), but this time when I glanced over my
shoulder, I was shocked to see daylight under my canopy edge directly AT the
left rear canopy hook, and the hook was partially 'unhooked'! OOPS!
I immediately reduced the power and eased the speed back to 80 mph and made
sure the aircraft was fairly stable. Then I looked again to see if it would
be safe to try to close this, or might I just cause the forward hook to let
go? I checked the front hook and safety pin, and it looked nice and secure.
The rear hook was just partially displaced inward, so I gripped the inside
handle and squeezed down, while pushing the hook outward, setting it back
into the fully-latched position. It seemed to be happy to stay there, so I
assumed that maybe I hadn't checked it carefully enough before takeoff. I
maintained 80 mph, and eased on home, frequently checking for any further
signs of movement in the hook.
After landing, everything seemed normal, so I more or less wrote it off to
'not properly closed' before takeoff. Today, however, I discovered that
this is not the case. After takeoff, I checked the hook, and again, I found
the hook had worked its way toward partially unlatching! Same drill - easy
power reduction and slow down (i.e. no sudden, lift-inducing pull-ups) to
80-90 mph. Push outward on the hook and squeeze the canopy rim down. It
worked again, and I returned to a normal landing.
The problem is definitely a combination of speed/lift on the rear canopy,
and the fact that my hook doesn't reach far enough outward over the tube,
and doesn't have any 'over-centering' function. Actually when I built the
thing, I was surprised to see the shape of the hooks. These original units
depend entirely upon the spring-loaded/tourque force to keep them in place.
With some stretching outward/upward by the canopy frame against the white
nylon 'saddle', and maybe a less-than-perfect amount of overhang on the
flat-bottomed hook, this corner was just waiting for an opportunity to let
go.
Anyway - I bought a piece of steel on the way home from the airport and will
install the new hook mods that Chris Heinz has posted on the web site.
I stronly recommend to everyone that you take some sort of remedial action
to improve the original hook designs. Minimally, install a lock-pin in each
of the 4 hooks. Better - install the new hooks designed by Chris and also
install a lock-pin; or use the 'sliding bolt/hinge' arrangement, or a
forward-hinging mod to the entire canopy.
Build Happy! Fly safe!
--
Grant Corriveau
Montreal
Zodiac 601hds/CAM100
C-GHTF
www.theWingStayedON.ca
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Chuck Deiterich" <cfd(at)thegateway.net> |
| Subject: | Re: VSI problem - thanks for the ideas |
Grant,
Remember the old trick, that if the static line gets plugged and there is
not an alternate static source, you can break out the glass in the VSI. The
altimeter will have a lag due to the orifice in the VSI and the VSI will
read backwards, but you at least have a static source.
Chuck D.
----- Original Message -----
From: Grant Corriveau <grantC(at)total.net>
Subject: Zenith-List: VSI problem - thanks for the ideas
> I'm leaning towards the 'seal the glass' idea as it seems to better
explain
> the instrument's behaviour. The 'proof' I think, will be to cruise for a
> longer term at say, 1,000 feet and see if the VSI eventually zeros.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Hodges, Mitch" <n601mh(at)BELLSOUTH.NET> |
| Subject: | Help with the HDS Outboard rear skin |
OK, this is what I get for finally working on my plane! I think I've
goofed. I just sent a note into Zenith about the following, but was
wondering if the real world experts had any ideas. I only checked this
about 800 times before I drilled!! Here's the note I sent to Zenith:
=============
I'm placing the rear skin on the right outboard wing. After lining it up,
clamping it down AND drilling out the ribs, I noticed a problem with the
alignment. With the skin clecoed to the ribs, it aligns with the Rear Zee
until you get to S9. From there to the outboard edge of the Rear Z, the Z
now shows. It goes from flush to about 7mm exposed where the Z ends. The
skin also extends over the Spar towards the leading edge by about 7mm at
this location.
I can "twist" the Z at the tip so that it fits correctly to the skin edge,
but this appears to be putting a strain on the tip rib, bending the flange
slightly. It also leaves the skin over the spar. This twist causes the Z
to run at a 90 degree angle from the table as well at the tip.
Alternatively, I can remove the clecos from S9, move the skin to line it up,
but this misaligns the holes I just drilled in S9. It also put a slight
pucker in the skin, that seems to work out in securing down the skin, but I
can't be sure at this point.
Is either of these a viable fix, or do you have another idea? Obviously,
I'm hoping I haven't completely ruined the wing skeleton
==============
Any ideas from the list?
Thanks,
Mitch Hodges
Powder Springs, GA
Z601 HDS (N601MH, at least on paper)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Paul Hartl" <pdhartl(at)mindspring.com> |
| Subject: | HDS skin problem |
Hi Mitch,
I found a similar problem on mine, and, after investigating it further,
found that it was caused by a backward bend in the main spar near
the tip. I hadn't drilled any holes yet - just clamps at that point. I
was able to straighten the spar using clamps and carpenter's
squares and some jury-rigged jigging using blocks drilled into the
table top. Once the top and bottom skins were drilled and riveted,
all came out straight.
Since you have drilled your holes, you have a more "advanced"
problem, but certainly fixable. First, check the spar for a warp or
bend, then, once straightened, check to see how far off the holes
are. Is it possible to replace A4 with A5 holes to cover the offset?
If not, how about adding new holes between those already drilled,
and then re-drilling the old skin holes into new spots in the ribs and
zee (but don't put the holes too close - especially be careful with
the spar in this regard). New "in-between" rivets won't win you any
prizes for cosmetics, but will only be noticed by experts, and will
only add strength - if not too closely set.
If these techniques are not possible, another possibility is to put in
new metal using "L-angles" under the rib flanges and rear zee (L's
under the zee will need to be bent to accommodate the zee's
obtuse or acute angle). Rivet one flange of the L to the rib side,
with the other directly underneath the rib flange, making undrilled
metal for new drill holes (because of the crimps, this may require
several short L's between the crimps). Now, just drill through the re-
inforced rib flange and ignore the old rib flange holes.
If these approaches are not to your liking, it may be necessary to
get new ribs and possibly the zee, but certainly not a new spar. It
won't help to get new skins, since the pre-drilled holes will be in the
same place. Unless, of course, the skin holes are so badly out of
whack with the spar holes ........ which is not likely.
However, if at the end of the day you find yourself with a new skin,
you will need to "find" the spar holes with some technique. I have
found the best method of doing so is get an overhead projection
acetate sheet - get them at any copy store - and tape it over the
spar, marking the holes through the clear acetate. Then, WITH IT
STILL TAPED IN PLACE, clamp down your skin on the spar and
flip the acetate sheet overtop of the skin and then tape the loose
end down. The marks on the acetate will be right over the spar
holes, and you just then drill through the acetate to find them. It
works like I charm - I know, as I have far too much experience at
it!!!!!
Hope this helps!
Paul
Paul Hartl, 601HDS with LE tanks, Stratus Subaru EA-81
Tail, rear fuse, central wing completed; wings mostly there!
FS2002 Aircraft Website: http://home.mindspring.com/~pdhartl/
email: pdhartl(at)mindspring.com or paul_hartl(at)communityschool.org
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Grant Corriveau <grantC(at)total.net> |
Well, as is often the case, my faulty hook was a combination of a couple of
small things with my amateur (very) building technique.
1/ I did have a 'negative' angle on the bottom of that hook so vibration
tended to work it off the fully engaged position, especially as the tourque
tube/spring pressures have 'worn in' (i.e. reduced) with use.
2/ There was some extra outward force on the canopy in that back corner from
the insulation/foam grip that I'd applied around the baggage/turtle deck
edge. (now cut away to provide definite clearance)
The new hook is much more secure and Nicholas Heinz emailed me some good
photos to indicate the way the hook tips must overhang outside the canopy
sides. (thanks)
--
Grant Corriveau
Montreal
Zodiac 601hds/CAM100
C-GHTF
www.theWingStayedON.ca (and so did the canopy!)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | prm(at)softhome.net |
| Subject: | Re: Canopy Hook mod |
Grant,
Can you put these photos in the archive?
Thanks
Perry Morrison
Grant Corriveau writes:
>
> Well, as is often the case, my faulty hook was a combination of a couple of
> small things with my amateur (very) building technique.
>
> 1/ I did have a 'negative' angle on the bottom of that hook so vibration
> tended to work it off the fully engaged position, especially as the tourque
> tube/spring pressures have 'worn in' (i.e. reduced) with use.
>
> 2/ There was some extra outward force on the canopy in that back corner from
> the insulation/foam grip that I'd applied around the baggage/turtle deck
> edge. (now cut away to provide definite clearance)
>
> The new hook is much more secure and Nicholas Heinz emailed me some good
> photos to indicate the way the hook tips must overhang outside the canopy
> sides. (thanks)
>
> --
> Grant Corriveau
> Montreal
> Zodiac 601hds/CAM100
> C-GHTF
> www.theWingStayedON.ca (and so did the canopy!)
>
>
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Damien Graham" <dgraham7(at)twcny.rr.com> |
Group:
I finished installing the canopy hook mod yesterday. I bolted the new
hooks onto the existing hooks. I think that it will work well. The new
hooks go through the canopy frame and stick out about half an inch or
so. The canopy feels solid when it is closed.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Greg Ferris <ferret(at)forbin.net> |
| Subject: | 912UL Oil Pressure |
I am having higher oil pressure than what I would expect with my 912UL.
My engine is an older 912UL that I bought used a couple of years ago.
The data that belongs to the engine states the max oil pressure at
72psi. If you look at current data, the max is now 100psi. I am
running Mobil 1 15W-50 oil. It is in the 90's here.
After starting the engine the first few times, the oil pressure ran
70~80 psi at idle. When I contacted Rotax, one distributor told me not
to worry about it. I decided to contact another distributor for a
second opinion. They told me to replace the spring that holds the ball
against the seat, just off to the side of the oil pump. When I asked
why this would lower the oil pressure, he had no clue. I ran it again
today and got even higher pressures (up to 96psi). I have connected a
analog pressure gauge to confirm my readings, so I have ruled-out the
sender.
Has anyone else had this problem? If so, did you replace the regulator
spring to fix it? When I look at a cutaway view, it sure looks like
that spring and ball arrangement is a bypass valve across the oil
filter. Lockwood called the spring an oil pressure regulator spring
though.
Any help would be greatly appreciated! Thank you.
Greg
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Hodges, Mitch" <n601mh(at)BELLSOUTH.NET> |
| Subject: | Re: Help with the HDS Outboard rear skin |
Regarding the issue of my original message, I want to thank Paul Hartl for
his suggestions. They were similar those provided by Zenith. Looks like
I've gotten it straightened out. What really solved the problem was taking
a step back, and a break to clear my mind, then simply re-adjusting
everything a bit. I removed the clecos from S9 and was able to slide the
rear top skin enough so it now aligns with the Rear Zee. I'll need to put
one A5 rivet at the #2 rivet from the rear of the S9 rib but everything
looks OK
.
From what I can tell the skin slipped in (but not out of) the clamps as I
was drilling the S9 rib. Guess I'll have to be more careful next time
around!
Mitch Hodges
Powder Springs, GA
Z601 HDS (N601MH, at least on paper)
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Canopy Hook mod |
| From: | Grant Corriveau <grantC(at)total.net> |
on 7/4/02 2:49 AM, prm(at)softhome.net at prm(at)softhome.net wrote:
>
> Grant,
>
> Can you put these photos in the archive?
Done
--
Grant Corriveau
Montreal
Zodiac 601hds/CAM100
C-GHTF
www.theWingStayedON.ca
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Bill Richter" <wrichter(at)aristotle.net> |
I am building the 601 hds and with reference to 6-V-10 of the plan
drawings and V-19b & V 20 of the step by step manual:
I made the plywood horn positioning template exactly as per the
specifications on V-19b and followed the directions # 31 on V-20, but I
can not come near the measurements that are shown on 6-V-10 with regard
to the 25mm from the center line of the 5/16th hole and the extended
line of the aileron. Using the horn positioning template the distance
is 42mm and the tip (5/16th hole) is forward of the rear Zee.
I even made another template but the results are the same.
The plan drawings that I have are dated 4th addition 04/01 (3rd printing
08/01) and the assembly manual is the one that Nic at ZAC had me
download off the internet site.
Has there been an update with regards to the Horn installation that has
not been provided?
Thanks to all for your advice.
Bill
Zodiac 601 HDS/Jabiru 3300
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Larry C. McFarland" <larrymc(at)qconline.com> |
Bill,
These were my comments entered in my journal for the control horns. I
frustration
on these is typical, because the drawings led me into what you seem to be
describing.
I solved the problem by what you read below.
Control Horns for the Ailerons
Jan 26 The afternoon was spent making horns like the plans. The matching
surfaces and angles seem skewed a little even if only because of alignment
with the top edge and the rib is perpendicular with the aileron. On matching
up the aileron with the wing and fitting the horn, one discovers the horn
has little to no down travel because it bumps into the zspar attach plate.
The horn needs to be set rearward " and re-angled a little to reposition
the forward edge of the horn ahead of the bottom 98 degree corner of the
aileron " behind the horn leading edge. Some adjustment may be required in
the length of the attaching push rod.
Hope this is helpful
Larry C. McFarland - 601hds at http://www.macsmachine.com
----- Original Message -----
From: "Bill Richter" <wrichter(at)aristotle.net>
Subject: Zenith-List: Need Advice
>
> I am building the 601 hds and with reference to 6-V-10 of the plan
> drawings and V-19b & V 20 of the step by step manual:
>
> I made the plywood horn positioning template exactly as per the
> specifications on V-19b and followed the directions # 31 on V-20, but I
> can not come near the measurements that are shown on 6-V-10 with regard
> to the 25mm from the center line of the 5/16th hole and the extended
> line of the aileron. Using the horn positioning template the distance
> is 42mm and the tip (5/16th hole) is forward of the rear Zee.
>
> I even made another template but the results are the same.
>
> The plan drawings that I have are dated 4th addition 04/01 (3rd printing
> 08/01) and the assembly manual is the one that Nic at ZAC had me
> download off the internet site.
>
> Has there been an update with regards to the Horn installation that has
> not been provided?
>
> Thanks to all for your advice.
>
> Bill
> Zodiac 601 HDS/Jabiru 3300
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Matt Dralle <dralle(at)matronics.com> |
| Subject: | Four New Email Lists At Matronics!! |
Dear Listers,
I've just added four new email Lists to the current lineup at
Matronics. These new lists include:
KRNet:
krnet-List(at)matronics.com The RANS KR1 and KR2 Series
Cub:
cub-List(at)matronics.com The Piper J-3 Cub
RV10:
rv10-List(at)matronics.com The New 4-place RV from Van's!
Europa:
europa(at)matronics.com The Slick European Composite
All the usual features are available with the new Lists including the
search engine, archive download, 7-day List browse, and PhotoShare!
To sign up for any or all of the new lists, please go to the List
Subscription page and put in your email address and select the Lists of
your choice. The URL for the Subscription page is:
http://www.matronics.com/subscibe
Don't forget that its your posts that generate traffic on the respective
Lists! Post an introduction and a description of your project or dreams!
Best regards,
Matt Dralle
Matronics Email List Admin.
Matt G Dralle | Matronics | PO Box 347 | Livermore | CA | 94551
925-606-1001 V | 925-606-6281 F | dralle(at)matronics.com Email
http://www.matronics.com/ WWW | Featuring Products For Aircraft
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Matt Dralle <dralle(at)matronics.com> |
| Subject: | [With Good URL This Time!] Four New Email Lists At Matronics!! |
[Typo in the subscribe page URL last time - SORRY! -Matt]
Dear Listers,
I've just added four new email Lists to the current lineup at
Matronics. These new lists include:
KRNet:
krnet-List(at)matronics.com The RANS KR1 and KR2 Series
Cub:
cub-List(at)matronics.com The Piper J-3 Cub
RV10:
rv10-List(at)matronics.com The New 4-place RV from Van's!
Europa:
europa(at)matronics.com The Slick European Composite
All the usual features are available with the new Lists including the
search engine, archive download, 7-day List browse, and PhotoShare!
To sign up for any or all of the new lists, please go to the List
Subscription page and put in your email address and select the Lists of
your choice. The URL for the Subscription page is:
http://www.matronics.com/subscribe
Don't forget that its your posts that generate traffic on the respective
Lists! Post an introduction and a description of your project or dreams!
Best regards,
Matt Dralle
Matronics Email List Admin.
Matt G Dralle | Matronics | PO Box 347 | Livermore | CA | 94551
925-606-1001 V | 925-606-6281 F | dralle(at)matronics.com Email
http://www.matronics.com/ WWW | Featuring Products For Aircraft
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Collins <collins(at)pali.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Four New Email Lists At Matronics!! |
Hi Matt,
I assume that you didn't know that there was already a Cub list on
Yahoo with almost 300 members. Check out:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/piper-cub-builders/
Would seem to me that there would be no point in fragmenting the
online population like that. I seem to remember a busy Europa
list too, but it has been a while.
Bob Collins
Sunnyvale CA USA
Matt Dralle wrote:
>
> Dear Listers,
>
> I've just added four new email Lists to the current lineup at
> Matronics. These new lists include:
>
> KRNet:
> krnet-List(at)matronics.com The RANS KR1 and KR2 Series
>
> Cub:
> cub-List(at)matronics.com The Piper J-3 Cub
>
> RV10:
> rv10-List(at)matronics.com The New 4-place RV from Van's!
>
> Europa:
> europa(at)matronics.com The Slick European Composite
>
> All the usual features are available with the new Lists including the
> search engine, archive download, 7-day List browse, and PhotoShare!
>
> To sign up for any or all of the new lists, please go to the List
> Subscription page and put in your email address and select the Lists of
> your choice. The URL for the Subscription page is:
>
> http://www.matronics.com/subscribe
>
> Don't forget that its your posts that generate traffic on the respective
> Lists! Post an introduction and a description of your project or dreams!
>
> Best regards,
>
> Matt Dralle
> Matronics Email List Admin.
>
> Matt G Dralle | Matronics | PO Box 347 | Livermore | CA | 94551
> 925-606-1001 V | 925-606-6281 F | dralle(at)matronics.com Email
> http://www.matronics.com/ WWW | Featuring Products For Aircraft
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Collins <collins(at)pali.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Four New Email Lists At Matronics!! |
Sorry, I meant to send that to Matt.
Bob
Collins wrote:
>
>
> Hi Matt,
>
> I assume that you didn't know that there was already a Cub list on
> Yahoo with almost 300 members. Check out:
> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/piper-cub-builders/
> Would seem to me that there would be no point in fragmenting the
> online population like that. I seem to remember a busy Europa
> list too, but it has been a while.
>
> Bob Collins
> Sunnyvale CA USA
>
> Matt Dralle wrote:
> >
> > Dear Listers,
> >
> > I've just added four new email Lists to the current lineup at
> > Matronics. These new lists include:
> >
> > KRNet:
> > krnet-List(at)matronics.com The RANS KR1 and KR2 Series
> >
> > Cub:
> > cub-List(at)matronics.com The Piper J-3 Cub
> >
> > RV10:
> > rv10-List(at)matronics.com The New 4-place RV from Van's!
> >
> > Europa:
> > europa(at)matronics.com The Slick European Composite
> >
> > All the usual features are available with the new Lists including the
> > search engine, archive download, 7-day List browse, and PhotoShare!
> >
> > To sign up for any or all of the new lists, please go to the List
> > Subscription page and put in your email address and select the Lists of
> > your choice. The URL for the Subscription page is:
> >
> > http://www.matronics.com/subscribe
> >
> > Don't forget that its your posts that generate traffic on the respective
> > Lists! Post an introduction and a description of your project or dreams!
> >
> > Best regards,
> >
> > Matt Dralle
> > Matronics Email List Admin.
> >
> > Matt G Dralle | Matronics | PO Box 347 | Livermore | CA | 94551
> > 925-606-1001 V | 925-606-6281 F | dralle(at)matronics.com Email
> > http://www.matronics.com/ WWW | Featuring Products For Aircraft
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jari Kaija" <jari.kaija(at)pp.inet.fi> |
At last! I have my live webcam online and my summer holiday starts.
So, if you don't have anything better to do, just go to my website and
click "Webcam" link.
www.project-ch701.net
-Jari
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Daniel Pelletier" <pelletie1(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Battery and Starter Contactors |
Hi Larry,
A mecanician said me that it must be upside down, because there is a kind of
hammer in and the natural position for that hammer is down.
Daniel
601HDS
>From: "Larry C. McFarland" <larrymc(at)qconline.com>
>Reply-To: zenith-list(at)matronics.com
>To:
>Subject: Zenith-List: Battery and Starter Contactors
>Date: Fri, 28 Jun 2002 20:14:42 -0500
>
>
>
>Builders,
>Does anyone know if the solenoids for the battery
>and starter have any orientation requirements, The print
>on the ones I've recieved seems to be upside down to what
>I'm used to looking at. Is there an up or a down for these
>things?
>Thanks,
>Larry McFarland - 601hds
>
>
http://www.hotmail.com/fr
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Fuel for thought... |
| From: | Grant Corriveau <grantC(at)total.net> |
I had a 'hiccup' (i.e. momentary loss of power) in my engine the other day
on the way back to the airport. Does that ever wake a body up!!
I thought that by insulating my fuel lines I'd cured the problem when it
occurred last year one time on the ground on the hottest day of the year.
Basically, it seems associated to a combination of 1) the chin-mounted
radiator sending it's heated air through the engine compartment and 2) Honda
has a stock feature that preheats the intake manifold (and so the base of
the carb) with engine coolant. This works fine in cooler weather, and
apparently helps with engine emissions, efficiency, etc.... but in a
tightly-cowled aircraft installation cruising at 5,000 rpm in hot hot
weather, this feature is undesirable. Other CAM100 operaters have done
things like running this pre-heat circuit through their cabin heater, so
that it is switched off in warmer conditions.
I've confirmed that my carb bowl, and firewall-mounted Facet pumps can get
up to temperatures in the range of 50 to 60C (140F) which is definitely
getting to the fuel boiling-point range, so I'll be making some mods before
flying again in hot weather. I'm going to deactivate the manifold preheat
somehow, and add a jet of cool air blast onto the fuel pump/lines and maybe
add shield of some sort to help protect them further. Solve one problem,
move onto the next... ;-)
While researching fuel, I came across the following site that contains some
good information for mogas as well as avgas:
http://www.eagle-racing.com/fuel.htm
--
Grant Corriveau
Montreal
Zodiac 601hds/CAM100
C-GHTF
www.theWingStayedON.ca
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Chuck Deiterich" <cfd(at)thegateway.net> |
Below is a table of speeds from (1) my construction manual, (2) the sample
701 Flight Manual and (3) the ZAC web site. I converted all of the speeds
to mph (miles per hour). Not all sources had all of the speeds. The VA from
the Construction Manual and the Flight Manual are quite different (84 mph vs
71 mph). Does any one have a better set of numbers for these speeds?
Construction Manual (1), 701 Flight Manual (2), ZAC WEB Site (3)
Speed Definition IAS (MPH)
(1), (2), (3)
VNE Never exceed speed 110, 108, 110,
VNO Maximum structural ?, 90, ?
cruising speed
VA Maneuvering speed 84, 71, ?
VFE Maximum Flap 60, 63, ?
extend speed
Vmax L/D Best angle of glide ?, 46, ?
gross wt., with flaps up
VSI Stall Flaps Up ?, 36, ?
VSO Stall Flaps Down, gross wt ?, 31, 30
Vy Best rate of climb ?, 46, ?
Vx Best angle of climb ?, 35, ?
flaps in middle setting
(1) Construction Manual Edition #3 Date Jan 91, Jan 96
(2) 701 Flight Manual, Czech Aircraft Works,
Czech Republic, edition. 3 CZ - March 99
(3) ZAC WEB Page Specs
Chuck D.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jim Frisby" <marslander(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | CH801/701 Ugly flaperon control slot |
Has anyone thought about redesigning this feature on the 701 and 801, the
curved slot in the cabin side for the flaperon push pull rod is ugly and
will let in the rain and snow. Here's my idea for a solution, anyone tried
something like this?
http://www.mtaonline.net/~flyingj/NoSlotFlaperonControl.jpg
MSN Photos is the easiest way to share and print your photos:
http://photos.msn.com/support/worldwide.aspx
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: CH801/701 Ugly flaperon control slot |
| From: | "Ihab A.B. Awad" <iawad(at)scimagix.com> |
Hi Jim,
On Sat, 2002-07-06 at 19:46, Jim Frisby wrote:
> Has anyone thought about redesigning this feature on the 701 and 801, the
> curved slot in the cabin side for the flaperon push pull rod is ugly and
> will let in the rain and snow. Here's my idea for a solution, anyone tried
> something like this?
> http://www.mtaonline.net/~flyingj/NoSlotFlaperonControl.jpg
Sorry if I'm speaking from ignorance, but I'm wondering ... does your
bellcrank hinge around the root hinge pin of the flaperon?
Peace,
Ihab
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jim Frisby" <marslander(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | Re: CH801/701 Ugly flaperon control slot |
Ihab,
Thanks for your note,
The drawing/photo shows a concept, I haven't implemented it yet. The plan
is to replace the root hinge pin with a torque tube located on the same
center. The torque tube would be affixed to the flaperon. A bearing block
on the inside of the fuselage would be made to provide support for the
torque tube. The bearing would have to be canted because the fuselage side
is not perpendicular to the flapeon axis of rotation. On the inside end of
the torque tube, there would be a bellcrank with the same length as the
outer bellcrank in ZAC's design. I retouched the photo (of a completed 801)
to show how the redesigned linkage would look.
Jim Frisby
N801ZA
>From: "Ihab A.B. Awad" <iawad(at)scimagix.com>
>Reply-To: zenith-list(at)matronics.com
>To: zenith-list(at)matronics.com
>Subject: Re: Zenith-List: CH801/701 Ugly flaperon control slot
>Date: 06 Jul 2002 21:35:04 -0700
>
>
>Hi Jim,
>
>On Sat, 2002-07-06 at 19:46, Jim Frisby wrote:
> > Has anyone thought about redesigning this feature on the 701 and 801,
>the
> > curved slot in the cabin side for the flaperon push pull rod is ugly and
> > will let in the rain and snow. Here's my idea for a solution, anyone
>tried
> > something like this?
> > http://www.mtaonline.net/~flyingj/NoSlotFlaperonControl.jpg
>
>Sorry if I'm speaking from ignorance, but I'm wondering ... does your
>bellcrank hinge around the root hinge pin of the flaperon?
>
>Peace,
>
>Ihab
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Dumb Question of the day |
Hi List,
What does it mean when a horizontal indicator says it has a "push to cage"
button? In all of the planes I trained in and have subsequently flown the
knob you use to adjust the HI does not push, rather it just turns clockwise
or counter for adjusting.
Does caging mean reseting the Indicator?
Thanks for the help in filling this hole in my aviation vocabulary.
Steve
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Gary Liming <gary(at)liming.org> |
| Subject: | Re: CH801/701 Ugly flaperon control slot |
Interesting idea. How would the internal and external bellcranks get
connected? If all one piece, how would they be installed?
Gary
>
>
>Has anyone thought about redesigning this feature on the 701 and 801, the
>curved slot in the cabin side for the flaperon push pull rod is ugly and
>will let in the rain and snow. Here's my idea for a solution, anyone tried
>something like this?
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | [ Grant Corriveau ] : New Email List Photo Share Available! |
| From: | Email List Photo Shares <pictures(at)matronics.com> |
A new Email List Photo Share is available:
Poster: Grant Corriveau
Subject: Zodiac 601HD/S Canopy Hooks
http://www.matronics.com/photoshare/grantC@total.net.07.07.2002/index.html
--------------------------------------------
o EMAIL LIST PHOTO SHARE
Share your files and photos with other List members simply by
emailing the files to:
pictures(at)matronics.com
Please view the typical Share above and include the Description Text
Fields as shown along with your submission of files and photos.
o Main Photo Share Index:
http://www.matronics.com/photoshare
--------------------------------------------
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: CH801/701 Ugly flaperon control slot |
| From: | "Ihab A.B. Awad" <iawad(at)scimagix.com> |
On Sat, 2002-07-06 at 23:01, Jim Frisby wrote:
> The drawing/photo shows a concept, I haven't implemented it yet. The plan
> is to replace the root hinge pin with a torque tube located on the same
> center. The torque tube would be affixed to the flaperon. ...
[ Once again, I'm no expert (and not even a builder) but, as a CH 701
"dreamer", I have long felt, as you do, that the flaperon mechanism is
the one thing in the design that I would consider a bit "ugly" rather
than "practical and functional". ]
I seem to notice that some of the more well-upholstered CH 801s show
what seems to be interior trim covering the mechanism --
http://www.zenithair.com/stolch801/construction/cabin/rear-sear-airlink2.jpg
Is this not adequate to keep the cabin adequately sealed?
Peace,
Ihab
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jim Frisby" <marslander(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | Re: CH801/701 Ugly flaperon control slot |
In my mind, the internal bellcrank would be welded to a 1" OD tube, the
external one would be welded to a tube that would fit inside that, they
would be connected by a thru bolt or two.
Jim
>From: Gary Liming <gary(at)liming.org>
>Reply-To: zenith-list(at)matronics.com
>To: zenith-list(at)matronics.com
>Subject: Re: Zenith-List: CH801/701 Ugly flaperon control slot
>Date: Sun, 07 Jul 2002 11:55:40 -0500
>
>
>Interesting idea. How would the internal and external bellcranks get
>connected? If all one piece, how would they be installed?
>
>Gary
>
> >
> >
> >Has anyone thought about redesigning this feature on the 701 and 801, the
> >curved slot in the cabin side for the flaperon push pull rod is ugly and
> >will let in the rain and snow. Here's my idea for a solution, anyone
>tried
> >something like this?
>
>
http://www.hotmail.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "patrick walsh" <pwalsh4539(at)msn.com> |
| Subject: | Re: [ Grant Corriveau ] : New Email List Photo Share Available! |
----- Original Message -----
From: Email List Photo Shares
Subject: Zenith-List: [ Grant Corriveau ] : New Email List Photo Share Available!
onics.com>
A new Email List Photo Share is available:
Poster: Grant Corriveau
Subject: Zodiac 601HD/S Canopy Hooks
http://www.matronics.com/photoshare/grantC@total.net.07.07.2002/index.html
--------------------------------------------
o EMAIL LIST PHOTO SHARE
Share your files and photos with other List members simply by
emailing the files to:
pictures(at)matronics.com
Please view the typical Share above and include the Description Text
Fields as shown along with your submission of files and photos.
o Main Photo Share Index:
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--------------------------------------------
=
=
=
=
Get mor
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Carl Bertrand" <cgbrt(at)mondenet.com> |
| Subject: | 912UL Oil Pressure |
----- Original Message -----
From: "Carl Bertrand" <cgbrt(at)mondenet.com>
Subject: Re: Zenith-List: 912UL Oil Pressure
> Hi.
> My understanding is that the max oil press should not exceed 100 psi on
> start, (Probably to prevent damage to the oil filter) and pressure should
> drop to below 72 psi when the oil temp stabalizes at 230-250 F.
> My engine has 260 hrs SN and now runs at 65-68 psi at normal operating
> temperatures.
> That spring is to control oil pressure but the pressure is affected by
other
> factors and can be very difficult to adjust using the recommended shims
(to
> get higher pressure). My reading of your info is that you were in the
normal
> range and did not need to change the spring.
>
> Hope this helps.
> Carl
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Greg Ferris" <ferret(at)forbin.net>
> To:
> Sent: Thursday, July 04, 2002 6:41 AM
> Subject: Zenith-List: 912UL Oil Pressure
>
>
> >
> > I am having higher oil pressure than what I would expect with my 912UL.
> > My engine is an older 912UL that I bought used a couple of years ago.
> > The data that belongs to the engine states the max oil pressure at
> > 72psi. If you look at current data, the max is now 100psi. I am
> > running Mobil 1 15W-50 oil. It is in the 90's here.
> >
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Damien Graham" <dgraham7(at)twcny.rr.com> |
Group:
Has anyone found a production tow bar that fits the 601 HD tricycle gear
? I checked the archives and all I found was a tow bar that had been
specially made by one of our group.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "patrick walsh" <pwalsh4539(at)msn.com> |
I just clamped a 2 inch electrical service hook on the nose gear (the kind used
for outdoor overhead service cable)....with a little bolt on each
side. Lots of towbars fit it...havent noticed which ones though....I just made
my own...although it isnt very pretty...it does work.
----- Original Message -----
From: Damien Graham
Subject: Zenith-List: Tow Bar
>
Group:
Has anyone found a production tow bar that fits the 601 HD tricycle gear
? I checked the archives and all I found was a tow bar that had been
specially made by one of our group.
=
=
=
=
Get mor
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "r.p.reynolds" <r.p.reynolds(at)blueyonder.co.uk> |
| Subject: | The Avdel "Avex" Rivets |
Dear Zenair Builders,
I am waiting for my 49% kit to arrive from the Cz air craft works, My
workshop and building bench are complete and ready to go. I have borrowed a
bulid manual, and in there under blind rivets on page nine it says a
specially groung head piece on the plier is required.
Question . What are the dimensions of the specially ground area to produce
the correct rivet shape?
My kit is a CH601ul
I have read most of the listings and gained a lot of knowledge already..
Regards Paul Reynolds
UK
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Kilby, Roger" <Roger.Kilby(at)DynCorp.com> |
Damien,
I have a tow bar I got from Aircraft Spruce that is designed for a Cessna.
This bar has the handle you pull out to spread
the tow bar ends. Due to the depth of the 601 nose wheel, I had to move
this handle back about 2 inches.
This only required that I unbolt the one bolt, drilling a new hole, and
replacing the bolt.
I then dipped the tow bar ends into a solution that is normally used to coat
the ends of hand tools in order
to put a rubberized grip on them. This makes for a nice no-slip and soft end
on the tow bar.
To use this arrangement, I place the tow bar on the bolts that stick out of
either side of the nose gear and are used to
bolt in the fork doubler. This arrangement works very well and the tow bar
even has the handle that slides into itself.
This allows it to fit into the 601's baggage compartment.
I am sorry I don't have pictures or P/N's but email me and I will get this
to you if you so desire.
Roger Kilby
N98RK 601HDS
rkmk(at)erols.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Kilby, Roger" <Roger.Kilby(at)DynCorp.com> |
| Subject: | Dumb Question of the day |
Steve,
The caging feature is usually found on gyroscopic instruments (usually the
attitude indicator) of aerobatic
aircraft. It is used to reset the gyro as, during aerobatic maneuvering, the
gyro will tumble.
Roger Kilby
N98RK 601HDS
P.S. ...never a dumb question....
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Robilliard" <royrobilliard(at)iprimus.com.au> |
| Subject: | RE:Dumb Question of the day |
From: STEFREE(at)aol.com
Subject: Zenith-List:
Hi List,
What does it mean when a horizontal indicator says it has a "push to
cage"
Dear Steve
Your HI is a gyro and to get it to an erect and stable state quickly
after power up, pushing the cage knob will align the internal gymbals.
This can also be used to protect the inner workings of a gyro when its
not powered up (Electric or Vacuum). Some gyro instruments have a means
to hold the instrument caged when there is no power applied. In my
airforce days part of the pre flight and after flight was to uncage and
cage the gyros.
Roy R
601HD Tail-Horz Stab and Spars.....
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bryan Martin <bryanmmartin(at)comcast.net> |
| Subject: | Re: The Avdel "Avex" Rivets |
> workshop and building bench are complete and ready to go. I have borrowed a
> bulid manual, and in there under blind rivets on page nine it says a
> specially groung head piece on the plier is required.
> Question . What are the dimensions of the specially ground area to produce
> the correct rivet shape?
What I did was chuck the riveter head piece in my drill and and spin it
while grinding a dome shape in it with my dremel tool. I'd grind a little
and test pull a rivet and grind some more until I got the correct shape. It
only took a few minutes to do both heads. I think Zenith sells modified
riveters or will grind your heads for you for a small fee.
--
Bryan Martin
N61BM, CH 601 XL, Stratus Subaru.
Wings, tail, fuselage and canopy done, wheels and tail mounted.
Working on instrument panel and electrical.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "H. Robert Schoenberger" <HRS4(at)prodigy.net> |
| Subject: | Re: The Avdel "Avex" Rivets |
I believe the fee at ZAC is about $16, but verify this with them. Hap
Schoenberger 701 tail.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Bryan Martin" <bryanmmartin(at)comcast.net>
Subject: Re: Zenith-List: The Avdel "Avex" Rivets
>
> > workshop and building bench are complete and ready to go. I have
borrowed a
> > bulid manual, and in there under blind rivets on page nine it says a
> > specially groung head piece on the plier is required.
> > Question . What are the dimensions of the specially ground area to
produce
> > the correct rivet shape?
>
> What I did was chuck the riveter head piece in my drill and and spin it
> while grinding a dome shape in it with my dremel tool. I'd grind a little
> and test pull a rivet and grind some more until I got the correct shape.
It
> only took a few minutes to do both heads. I think Zenith sells modified
> riveters or will grind your heads for you for a small fee.
>
>
> --
> Bryan Martin
> N61BM, CH 601 XL, Stratus Subaru.
> Wings, tail, fuselage and canopy done, wheels and tail mounted.
> Working on instrument panel and electrical.
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Matthew Mucker" <matthew(at)mucker.net> |
Yay!
I was waiting for someone to start this thread this year so I didn't have
to.
I too will be seeing my first Airventure this year. I'm taking the cheap
way out and hoping I can snag a campsite when I get there.
Any survival tips from the veterans?
-Matt
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Tim & Diane Shankland <tshank(at)megsinet.net> |
| Subject: | Re: The Avdel "Avex" Rivets |
r.p
Zenith doesn't provide any dimensions for that modification. You just grind it
out
and try it until the set rivet looks good.
Tim Shankland
"r.p.reynolds" wrote:
>
> Dear Zenair Builders,
> I am waiting for my 49% kit to arrive from the Cz air craft works, My
> workshop and building bench are complete and ready to go. I have borrowed a
> bulid manual, and in there under blind rivets on page nine it says a
> specially groung head piece on the plier is required.
> Question . What are the dimensions of the specially ground area to produce
> the correct rivet shape?
>
> My kit is a CH601ul
>
> I have read most of the listings and gained a lot of knowledge already..
>
> Regards Paul Reynolds
> UK
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Mark Townsend" <601xl(at)sympatico.ca> |
Ok All this seems like a GRAND idea, Lets all meet in Todd's Driveway ! That
way we won't miss each other ! Todd do you have a spot for a campfire?
Mark Townsend
601XL EA-82 MPFI Turbo
-----Original Message-----
>I live about 2 hours from Oshkosh, near Madison, WI. I will of course be
>attending the show, but not sure which day(s). If any of you are near Cross
>Plains, WI (Madison) and want to grab a beer, or pull some rivets :) just
>let me know. Also, if you are pulling a camper, RV, whatever and need a
>place to spend a night before or after the show, I have a pretty big
driveway.
>
>Todd
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Todd Osborne <todd(at)toddtown.com> |
I have better than a spot, I have a nice firepit and lots of scrap wood
from a remodeling project. Bring your Deep Woods off and Zinc Cr and head
over to my place :)
Todd
>
>Ok All this seems like a GRAND idea, Lets all meet in Todd's Driveway ! That
>way we won't miss each other ! Todd do you have a spot for a campfire?
>
>Mark Townsend
>601XL EA-82 MPFI Turbo
>
>-----Original Message-----
>
> >I live about 2 hours from Oshkosh, near Madison, WI. I will of course be
> >attending the show, but not sure which day(s). If any of you are near Cross
> >Plains, WI (Madison) and want to grab a beer, or pull some rivets :) just
> >let me know. Also, if you are pulling a camper, RV, whatever and need a
> >place to spend a night before or after the show, I have a pretty big
>driveway.
> >
> >Todd
>
>
Todd Osborne
Internet E-Mail: todd(at)toddtown.com
AOL Messenger: toddosborn
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Dabusmith(at)aol.com |
Paul
I don't think anyone mentioned cutting and polishing some of the pulled test
rivets down the middle. This is to make sure the shape of the domed set is
not so deep that it leaves a void under the pulled head.
Dave Smith
Atlanta ( 701 installing electrical)
>Question . What are the dimensions of the specially ground area to produce
the correct rivet shape?
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Murray Johnson" <murray.j(at)sympatico.ca> |
| Subject: | Re: The Avdel "Avex" Rivets |
> > Question . What are the dimensions of the specially ground area to
produce
> > the correct rivet shape?
Although you will need to pull some test rivets to satisfy yourself that
you've got it right, here are the dimensions of the dome depressions as
measured on my heads:
A4: 0.220" diameter 0.026" deep
A5: 0.260" diameter 0.036" deep
I used my dremel tool to grind what I thought were pretty good dome shapes
into my rivet heads, and then took them to the Zenith Rudder Workshop that
Flypass runs near Kitchener. I asked Art Mitchell to check them out, and he
ground them out some more... The dimensions above were measured after Art
was finished.
After grinding you may want to slightly polish the surface of the head using
200 grit wet sandpaper and the head chucked into a drill press. You don't
want to make them really shiny though or there may not be enough "tooth" for
paint to stick well. The rivets take on the exact shape of the rivet head,
grinding marks and all!
- Murray
scratch building 701, pieces all over the place.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | JEEdmondson(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: The Avdel "Avex" Rivets |
just my 2 cents worth but, for the price that zenith sells their rivet puller
with the properly ground heads, i would not attempt to do them myself
Jimmy
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | David Terrell <dl_terrell(at)yahoo.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Zenith-List Digest: 12 Msgs - 07/08/02 |
Subject: RE: Zenith-List: Oshkosh
This will be my first year too. I'm flying in out of
Kansas City on Jul 26 in a Cherokee, since the 701
isn't ready yet. I would really appreciate any
pointers, since I assume it will be something of a
madhouse with all those other aircraft around...
My Dad is driving his motor home up from Alabama. So,
it looks like I have a comfortable place to stay...
Dave
701
http://sbc.yahoo.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | big bucks canopy |
| From: | mawood(at)zoo.uvm.edu |
Hello,
I just called Zenith about ordering a canopy for my 601HD. I would like to go
with the forward opening one but was told it was more than $500 extra. Does
anyone have a good set of plans I could use to buy and start with the old side
to side type canopy and end up building a forward opening one.
Anyone have any other ideas on how to do this without dishing out $1500.
Thanks
Mark Wood
N221MW
Mark Wood
Assistive Technology Consultant
Vermont I-Team
Center on Disability and Community Inclusion
University of Vermont
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Philip Polstra" <ppolstra(at)mindspring.com> |
> I have a tow bar I got from Aircraft Spruce that is designed for a Cessna.
> This bar has the handle you pull out to spread
> the tow bar ends.
I have the same towbar, described as the "deluxe Cessna towbar". I just
attach to the bolts on the fork doubler and it seems to work well. I
haven't coated mine with antiscratch materials (yet).
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Larry C. McFarland" <larrymc(at)qconline.com> |
| Subject: | Re: big bucks canopy |
Mark,
Nick will sell you the plans for just the XL Canopy if you ask. I did this
and have recieved 4 drawings that are more than enough to go with. You may
have
to buy some parts from Zenith, like cylinders and locking hardware and
there may be some differences that require a little of your own
interpolation
going from side to forward fitting canopy bows etc. I've not begun the
canopy frame yet,
but it's getting close.
Larry C. McFarland - 601hds
----- Original Message -----
From: <mawood(at)zoo.uvm.edu>
Subject: Zenith-List: big bucks canopy
>
> Hello,
> I just called Zenith about ordering a canopy for my 601HD. I would like to
go
> with the forward opening one but was told it was more than $500 extra.
Does
> anyone have a good set of plans I could use to buy and start with the old
side
> to side type canopy and end up building a forward opening one.
>
> Anyone have any other ideas on how to do this without dishing out $1500.
>
> Thanks
> Mark Wood
> N221MW
>
> Mark Wood
> Assistive Technology Consultant
> Vermont I-Team
> Center on Disability and Community Inclusion
> University of Vermont
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Tim & Diane Shankland <tshank(at)megsinet.net> |
| Subject: | Re: big bucks canopy |
Mark,
There are a set of plans on the Zenith XL web site. I am just finishing up my
front opening canopy. I might warn you that the are errors and omissions in the
drawings and the dimensions have to be changed to fit the HD. Overall I am quite
happy with the way mine is turning out. I fabricating all the parts myself ( just
the excuse I needed to buy the MIG welder) and made some modifications. Such as
mine has a key lock built in and the emergency releases that don't require a
screwdriver. Another point which I had heard in the past from this group is that
the rear hoop is nowhere near the shape indicated in the drawings. I'm glad I bent
my own, if I had paid $60 for $2.00 worth of bent aluminum and still had to bend
it that much to make it fit I would have been steamed. Contact me if you need
information on sourcing some of the parts. The only really expensive part was the
canopy itself. All the rest of the materials probably added up to less than $200
(
not including the welder)
Tim Shankland
mawood(at)zoo.uvm.edu wrote:
>
> Hello,
> I just called Zenith about ordering a canopy for my 601HD. I would like to go
> with the forward opening one but was told it was more than $500 extra. Does
> anyone have a good set of plans I could use to buy and start with the old side
> to side type canopy and end up building a forward opening one.
>
> Anyone have any other ideas on how to do this without dishing out $1500.
>
> Thanks
> Mark Wood
> N221MW
>
> Mark Wood
> Assistive Technology Consultant
> Vermont I-Team
> Center on Disability and Community Inclusion
> University of Vermont
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Randy Wallenhorst <flynbfun(at)yahoo.com> |
| Subject: | Pointers when flying to Oshkosh |
In yesterdays daily digest David Terrell wrote:
Subject: RE: Zenith-List: Oshkosh
"This will be my first year too. I'm flying in out of
Kansas City on Jul 26 in a Cherokee, since the 701
isn't ready yet. I would really appreciate any
pointers, since I assume it will be something of a
madhouse with all those other aircraft around...
My Dad is driving his motor home up from Alabama. So,
it looks like I have a comfortable place to stay...
Dave
701"
Dave,
This will be my eight year there and from past experience here is my
.02 worth on the mater.
You will have a wonderful time flying into Oshkosh!
You have memorized the notam so I wont go into that! (grin)
Things to remember: Have LOTS of fuel... and save a tank just for the
approach you do not want to be switching when close in. You may have to
circle for quite a while if it gets busy.
Get atis as early as you can! It will be long and take a while to
understand.
Aim for Rippon or actually Green lake just west of Rippon. It is
important to get to this point exactly with your eyes outside the
plane! You want to be down to the notam altitude at this point. If you
are low wing be about 100 feet low, if high wing about 100 feet high.
Keep your eyes open! This is the most difficult part of the flight,
aircraft are coming from all directions and descending to form a line.
Coming from the west allows you a better view of them (assuming you are
not arriving at dawn!). Have clean windows and all lights on! If you
have others in the plane have them point out other planes. Remember
there are 12,000+ others! About 8% of the worlds active aircraft! Rock
the wings often so you can see around them and so others can see you.
Now that you are at Rippon the rest is easy! The navigation is IFR (I
Follow Railroad) or just follow the plane in front. Know the heading by
heart so if you wander off while looking for other planes you can
return to the correct heading quickly. Listen to the controllers, do
NOT talk unless you have a problem. It is so ingrained to respond to
ATC this is much harder than you think! When they ask you to rock your
wings ROCK them! You don't need knife edge to knife edge but try to
give them 30 degrees. They get tired of trying to watch someone just
wiggle the ailerons. Use LOTS on control travel. Listen for the type
and color of the plane you are to follow and try to get a POSITIVE id
on it. (Oh, and be sure and know the type and color of what you are
flying! I know this sounds dumb but you would be surprised how many do
not!) There are a lot of planes in a line. If you have a passenger have
them keep contact on the plane you are told to follow, then you can
watch for others and navigate. Keep your speed so you stay the same
distance behind the plane in front. PLEASE keep the speed that is
correct for your altitude do NOT fly slower unless you are closing on
the plane in front of you! This is really important; lots of the planes
will be really struggling to stay at the low speeds.
As you turn base you can start to adjust your speed for landing. ATC
will tell you where to land. Make a normal landing this is not the time
to prove you can stop in 100 feet! Taxi off the runway as instructed in
ATIS. This usually means just turn off at any point, but be sure to
turn the correct way or it will be a LONG taxi. Hold up your sign
saying where you are going (see EAA web site) to everyone you see. They
will direct you to the parking. This is the most difficult part! Have
patience and keep your eyes open so you don't end up pointed at someone
else's spinner! When you turn in to the parking spot don't power in if
there are aircraft behind you, just turn and then pull it, you will
make lots of friends that way!
Have FUN! The flight is not as harrowing to fly as it is to read about.
It is really very civil, just take your time, keep an eye out, and
enjoy it! It is no real different that any other busy field (except the
controllers are MUCH better).
If you have bad weather or get cold feet for any reason land at one of
the outlying airports, there are a lot of them. Or go to one of the
"relievers" and take the bus in. But if you can OSH is wonderful!
Have a GREAT flight!
Randy
http://sbc.yahoo.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Randy Wallenhorst <flynbfun(at)yahoo.com> |
| Subject: | Oshkosh Tips, for those that drive |
Good morning all,
I was just in my chat room and one of the members of this list popped
in to say "Hi" and then went on to say that he was going to OSH for the
first time this year and would be driving there.
Well, I've done that too, the first few years I attended and thought
maybe some of the others here who have never been there before could
learn from some of the mistakes I made those first couple of years.
First of all, once your past the EAA museum you will encounter a lot of
people trying to persuade you to park in their private parking lots.
Ignore all of them! Many first time visitors pull into these private
lots only to regret it later when they discover they have a 1+ mile
(1.6 km) walk to the actual entrance to the EAA grounds and see that
there was ample parking available in the EAA parking lots.
Second, get there early! The EAA parking lots open promptly at 6 AM.
If your there then you will be able to park within a few feet of the
entrance points. The latest I ever arrived was about 7:15 AM, on a
Thursday morning 7 years ago. On that day I was still able to park
within a couple of hundred yards of the entrance, but the parking area
was filling fast and had I been 20 minutes later the walk would have
been considerably longer.
Third, food and beverage prices at the show are outrageous! As long as
your driving in, take a cooler and have plenty of food and beverages in
it. Chances are that since you parked so close your going to be
returning several times with bags of information, catalogues, and
freebies that are handed out. You may as well eat and drink the food
you bring with you and save yourself the $15 you would spend on a
burger and soda at the show.
Fourth, be sure and bring along a comfortable camp chair for the
afternoons airshow. These collapseable canvass chairs are available at
K-mart or Wal-mart for about $6 each. They also sell them at the
airshow, but they are triple that price.
Fifth, If you plan on visiting the sea plane parking facility, mosquito
repellent is a very good thing to have.
Sixth, be sure to have an ample supply of your basic necessities like
film, batteries, sunscreen, etc.
Seventh, If you forget your camera, get to the Cannon photo booth
which is next door to the press booth. These are located directly
North of the the tower. Cannon gives out a limited supply of digital
cameras to use for free each day. Each camera is capable of taking
about 60 pictures. Once you have the memory card full you simply turn
the camera back in and they will dump the pictures onto a CD and give
it to you, for free! I've utilized this service for the past 3
consecutive years, I love it, but you want to be at the Cannon booth
right when it opens, lots of people know about this and these cameras
go out fast.
That is all I can think of at the moment. If you have any specific
questions please feel free to contact me directly or ask them here at
the ZAC list. I get the digest and read it each morning so any
responses will appear the next day.
Randy
Do not achieve
http://sbc.yahoo.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Peter Chapman <pchapman(at)ionsys.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Zenith Oshkosh 2002 Banquet |
At 13:39 10-07-02 , you wrote:
>I was wondering about the Banquet as well since this will be my First
>Oshkosh.
>ZenairT Builders Dinner: Wednesday, July 24: 6:00 - 7:30 pm: Robbins
>Restaurant, 1810 Omro Road (Hwy 21), Oshkosh, WI. "Family-style dinner"
I won't be at Oshkosh this year, but for those who go, perhaps someone can
bring name tags/stickers or ask Zenith to!
Tags would have been a big, big help a couple years ago when I attended, to
meet old acquaintances from the Zenith list or to find new people to meet.
Peter Chapman
Toronto, ON
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | John Montgomery <1arm(at)rogers.com> |
| Subject: | making form for stabilizer ribs |
I'm just getting started on my stabilizer and am starting to cut out the
wooden forms for the ribs.
I instinctively wanted to cut holes through the form and backing plate
(actually the opposite rib form) to hold them together like is done for
the wing rib forms, but the plans do not indicate this. There are no
lightening holes in these ribs. At this point I'm not sure if I will
get the fibreglass tips or not so I'm not sure if I want holes in the
end ribs.
What have others done for this? Is there a structural cost to having
holes in the rib blanks?
thanks,
John M.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Mark Townsend" <601xl(at)sympatico.ca> |
| Subject: | Re: making form for stabilizer ribs |
HI John I just clamped the two pieces in a vice and banged away. Since they
are so small they will not be a problem. I don't think you have enough
material to put holes big enough to help you into the rib. Just a personal
opinion but I would go for the Fiberglass tips! it looks neater and I have
been informed by a high time Zodiac flyer that they do make a difference in
handling.
Mark Townsend
601XL EA-82 MPFI Turbo
-----Original Message-----
From: John Montgomery <1arm(at)rogers.com>
Date: Thursday, July 11, 2002 9:02 PM
Subject: Zenith-List: making form for stabilizer ribs
>
>I'm just getting started on my stabilizer and am starting to cut out the
>wooden forms for the ribs.
>
>I instinctively wanted to cut holes through the form and backing plate
>(actually the opposite rib form) to hold them together like is done for
>the wing rib forms, but the plans do not indicate this. There are no
>lightening holes in these ribs. At this point I'm not sure if I will
>get the fibreglass tips or not so I'm not sure if I want holes in the
>end ribs.
>
>What have others done for this? Is there a structural cost to having
>holes in the rib blanks?
>
>thanks,
>
>John M.
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Damien Graham" <dgraham7(at)twcny.rr.com> |
Does anyone know an instructor giving lessons in a 601 HD , besides at
Kitchener/Waterloo ? Jim Martin , from Kitchener Airport, is going to
lease some planes for instruction in the near future, and a Rudy Hane is
giving lessons, again at Kitchener, but I am trying to find someplace
closer. Does anyone know of an instrcutor in the Ottawa area?
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Bill Steer" <bsteer(at)gwi.net> |
I've finished the outer wings of my 601, including running the high
voltage cables to the strobes. I plan to put the strobe power supplies
in the cabin somewhere, so the strobe cables will need to run through
the wing joint. Has anybody else done their strobes this way? If so,
did you break the high voltage cable at the wing joint, and what kind of
connector did you use?
In retrospect, I should have put the power supplies in the outboard wing
tip, but it's too late now.
Thanks for any advice or info.
Bill
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Philip Polstra" <ppolstra(at)mindspring.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Strobe cable |
> the wing joint. Has anybody else done their strobes this way? If so,
> did you break the high voltage cable at the wing joint, and what kind of
> connector did you use?
>
I bought some trailer light connectors from my local auto supply store. I
bought a connector with more wires for my aileron trim. The strobes I got
from Zenith had one power supply for both strobes, so you have to mount this
somewhere in the center.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "L.D. Pahnke" <ldpahnke(at)netwitz.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Strobe cable |
I've finished the outer wings of my 601, including running the high
voltage cables to the strobes. I plan to put the strobe power supplies
in the cabin somewhere, so the strobe cables will need to run through
the wing joint.
Each of my Zenith supplied strobe sets had its own separate unit
independent of each other . FWIW, I put the strobe units on the inside end
rib of the outer wing and ran the strobe cable diagonally through a 1/2 in
polyethelene (water piping) "conduit" behin\d the wing tank out to the end
rib. This way the weight is out of the wing tips and the units are
accessible at the outer-center wing joint on each side. Only the power cord
is divided this way in a molex plug in the event of wing removal. The strobe
cable is in one piece and the wingtip would not have to be dismantled to
service the unit. A new strobe wire could be pulled if needed by removing
the strobe light and fishtaping a new cable out to the wingtip through the
light mounting hole via the conduit. The strobe cable shield is grounded
only at the inboard end not at the outside end for radio static supression.
Good luck. LDP
---
[This E-mail scanned for viruses by Netwitz. Are your virus definitions up to date?]
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | charles.long(at)gm.com |
07/12/2002 12:13:50 PM
Why not put the stobe power unit on the inboard side of rear wing rib
#6? I located mine there and just riveted it in place with 6 A4's. I fits
nicely between the two front lightening holes and this provides easy
access. The harness needs be be shortened or you can just bundle the extra
wire. I ended up buying a crimp tool for mate-n-locks from Electric Bob
and ordered some extra pins from Mouser Electronics. Both companies are on
the Net. In fact I decided to use Mate-n-Locks everywhere. They are used
on many certified Cessna aircraft. I bundled all the wires coming out of
each wing at the Strobe unit location and added a connector there for easy
detachment of the wings. This allowed me to avoid splicing the Power wire
on the strobe unit. I grounded the unit to the #6 Rib using an A5 rivet
and washer. The fewer connections the better.
Chuck Long,
Z601HDS, 50% complete
From: "Bill Steer" <bsteer(at)gwi.net>
Subject: Zenith-List: Strobe cable
I've finished the outer wings of my 601, including running the high
voltage cables to the strobes. I plan to put the strobe power supplies
in the cabin somewhere, so the strobe cables will need to run through
the wing joint. Has anybody else done their strobes this way? If so,
did you break the high voltage cable at the wing joint, and what kind of
connector did you use?
In retrospect, I should have put the power supplies in the outboard wing
tip, but it's too late now.
Thanks for any advice or info.
Bill
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Michael R Fortunato <wizard-24(at)juno.com> |
OK, I'm ready to start filling my instrument panel with all the goodies
required for VFR flight. Anyone know a good source of CHEAP instruments?
I checked all the usual sources (Aircraft Spruce, etc) and just about
passed out with sticker shock. I don't care if the things are TSO'd or
not, so long as they work. :)
Mike Fortunato
601XL
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Alex MacKay <mackay(at)physics.ubc.ca> |
| Subject: | Re: 601 HD lessons |
This doesn't help you, Damien, but those in the Pacific Northwest may not
know that there is a company at Kamloops Airport in British Columbia that
provides instruction in a 601UL. The details are available on the FlyPass
web site. I haven't had the opportunity to visit them yet.
Alex MacKay
601HDS, ~50% complete
On Thu, 11 Jul 2002, Damien Graham wrote:
> Does anyone know an instructor giving lessons in a 601 HD , besides at
> Kitchener/Waterloo ? Jim Martin , from Kitchener Airport, is going to
> lease some planes for instruction in the near future, and a Rudy Hane is
> giving lessons, again at Kitchener, but I am trying to find someplace
> closer. Does anyone know of an instrcutor in the Ottawa area?
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Jerry Jensen <jensenm(at)gtcinternet.com> |
Michael, Try ebay!
Jerry Jensen
601HDS Jab 3300 85%
Michael R Fortunato wrote:
>
> OK, I'm ready to start filling my instrument panel with all the goodies
> required for VFR flight. Anyone know a good source of CHEAP instruments?
> I checked all the usual sources (Aircraft Spruce, etc) and just about
> passed out with sticker shock. I don't care if the things are TSO'd or
> not, so long as they work. :)
>
> Mike Fortunato
> 601XL
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Paul Sharpe" <fly601(at)rogers.com> |
It Flies !!!
C-IABP has slipped the surly bonds for the first time. Wednesday, July
10 at Waterloo Regional Airport, Ontario, Canada.
CH601HD - serial no. 6-3903 - powered by a Rotax 912S coupled to a
3-blade g/a Kremen Sport Prop, we spent about 45 minutes in the vicinity of
CYKF and all went very well (a few minor bugs surfaced; my radio in
particular.) Art Mitchell, CEO of Flypass, and very experienced on the 601
went along to keep me out of trouble; and just as well as I'm certainly
going to have to learn how to land (seems I have to flare a lot lower than
in the Airbus.)
Hopefuly I'll have it back up on the weekend.
Paul Sharpe
Guelph, Ontario, Canada
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Randy Stout" <r5t0ut(at)earthlink.net> |
Mike
Better have someone stand by with the smelling salts. Even the discount
places will make you want to pass out. Most of my flight instruments were
bought from ACS. I picked up a Tiny Tach from Great Plains AS. The engine
and electrical system instruments from local auto parts and boat shop. Check
out Southeast Aerospace http://www.seaerospace.com/ for a rebuilt
transponder.
Randy Stout
San Antonio
CH601HD
r5t0ut(at)earthlink.net
> OK, I'm ready to start filling my instrument panel with all the goodies
> required for VFR flight. Anyone know a good source of CHEAP instruments?
> I checked all the usual sources (Aircraft Spruce, etc) and just about
> passed out with sticker shock. I don't care if the things are TSO'd or
> not, so long as they work. :)
>
> Mike Fortunato
> 601XL
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Wayne McMullen" <cmcmullen(at)attbi.com> |
Hi Randy,
What does ACS stand for?
Wayne
----- Original Message -----
From: "Randy Stout" <r5t0ut(at)earthlink.net>
Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Instruments
>
> Mike
>
> Better have someone stand by with the smelling salts. Even the discount
> places will make you want to pass out. Most of my flight instruments were
> bought from ACS. I picked up a Tiny Tach from Great Plains AS. The engine
> and electrical system instruments from local auto parts and boat shop.
Check
> out Southeast Aerospace http://www.seaerospace.com/ for a rebuilt
> transponder.
>
> Randy Stout
> San Antonio
> CH601HD
> r5t0ut(at)earthlink.net
>
>
> > OK, I'm ready to start filling my instrument panel with all the goodies
> > required for VFR flight. Anyone know a good source of CHEAP instruments?
> > I checked all the usual sources (Aircraft Spruce, etc) and just about
> > passed out with sticker shock. I don't care if the things are TSO'd or
> > not, so long as they work. :)
> >
> > Mike Fortunato
> > 601XL
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Michel Therrien <mtherr(at)yahoo.com> |
| Subject: | Re: making form for stabilizer ribs |
I don't know that there would be any implication of
drilling that (those) hole(s), but in my case, I just
clamped the form, rib blank and backing bloc together
and hammered the flange.
--- John Montgomery <1arm(at)rogers.com> wrote:
> <1arm(at)rogers.com>
>
> I'm just getting started on my stabilizer and am
> starting to cut out the
> wooden forms for the ribs.
>
> I instinctively wanted to cut holes through the form
> and backing plate
> (actually the opposite rib form) to hold them
> together like is done for
> the wing rib forms, but the plans do not indicate
> this. There are no
> lightening holes in these ribs. At this point I'm
> not sure if I will
> get the fibreglass tips or not so I'm not sure if I
> want holes in the
> end ribs.
>
> What have others done for this? Is there a
> structural cost to having
> holes in the rib blanks?
>
> thanks,
>
> John M.
>
>
>
> Contributions of
> any other form
>
> latest messages.
> other List members.
>
> http://www.matronics.com/subscription
> http://www.matronics.com/photoshare
> http://www.matronics.com/search
> http://www.matronics.com/archives
> http://www.matronics.com/emaillists
>
>
>
>
>
=====
----------------------------
Michel Therrien CH601-HD
http://pages.infinit.net/mthobby
http://mthobby.pcperfect.com/ch601
http://www.zenithair.com/bldrlist/profiles/mthobby
http://autos.yahoo.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Mark Townsend" <601xl(at)sympatico.ca> |
HI Mike I'm also doing the E-Bay thinggy ! IF you see the_cdngoose then it's
me bidding. SO Far I have alt, horizon gyro, airspeed, Hobbs timer, and turn
coordinator. Prices are not bad. But don't get caught up in it! Set a price
and let the piece go if it goes over your set price. You will always see it
again in a week or so.
Mark Townsend
601XL EA-82 MPFI Turbo
-----Original Message-----
From: Michael R Fortunato <wizard-24(at)juno.com>
Date: Friday, July 12, 2002 12:29 PM
Subject: Zenith-List: Instruments
>
>
>OK, I'm ready to start filling my instrument panel with all the goodies
>required for VFR flight. Anyone know a good source of CHEAP instruments?
>I checked all the usual sources (Aircraft Spruce, etc) and just about
>passed out with sticker shock. I don't care if the things are TSO'd or
>not, so long as they work. :)
>
>Mike Fortunato
>601XL
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jeff & Marcia Davidson" <jdavidso(at)fcc.net> |
| Subject: | Re: CH-300 for sale |
Jeff Paden,
For those of us not familiar with earlier Chris Heintz designs, I
believe that the list has a general interest in learning about the
characteristics of the earlier models. Especially those models no longer
available. On occasion I have wondered why they were discontinued. Was it
solid rivets vs. blind? To my knowledge, this information is not generally
available. Maybe it should be added to the Zenith site. All that I find
there
is a diagram of the Design History with no explanation or descriptions.
This is
the history of the designer and related companies that most of us have some
level of
commitment to. Certainly everyone that has committed to building by buying
Zenith/Zenair/AMD/etc. products does. I saw two 250's at Sun-N-Fun and
wondered about those
too. My impression, however, is that there simply aren't too many 250s and
300s in existence. At least not in the US. I would certainly like to hear
a comparison between the 300 and the 640. Is there a clear genealogy?
The chart indicates that there is a "design relationship". I presume that
you
have some knowledge in that area since you made the decision to change.
I certainly understand your reluctance to place sales information on the
list, and that probably is appropriate whether it is a rule or not.
Jeff Davidson
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Cowl DZUS Fasteners |
Hi List,
I am finishing up cowling fitting (taking so long because it has been 110
degrees + in the shade of the hangar here in Phoenix) and I am placing the
DZUS fasteners. It seems like the grip length on the DZUS fastener is just
barely long enough to make it through the cowling glass. By looking at the
drawing in the construction manual an by what seems to make sense to me the
last DZUS fastener will go through the side skin forard of the firewall and
then through the top and bottom half of the cowling. I am concerned that the
grip on the DZUS will not be long enough. Any insight or tips fromt the been
there done that crowd as to placement of the DZUS fasteners?
As an aside, has anyone figured out a hinged cowling?
thanks,
Steve
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Kent Brown" <kbplanner(at)email.msn.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Cowl DZUS Fasteners |
Steve,
I'm nowhere near the cowl yet, but Dzus fasteners come in various lengths.
Check ACS.
Kent
----- Original Message -----
From: <STEFREE(at)aol.com>
Subject: Zenith-List: Cowl DZUS Fasteners
>
> Hi List,
>
> I am finishing up cowling fitting (taking so long because it has been 110
> degrees + in the shade of the hangar here in Phoenix) and I am placing the
> DZUS fasteners. It seems like the grip length on the DZUS fastener is
just
> barely long enough to make it through the cowling glass. By looking at
the
> drawing in the construction manual an by what seems to make sense to me
the
> last DZUS fastener will go through the side skin forard of the firewall
and
> then through the top and bottom half of the cowling. I am concerned that
the
> grip on the DZUS will not be long enough. Any insight or tips fromt the
been
> there done that crowd as to placement of the DZUS fasteners?
>
> As an aside, has anyone figured out a hinged cowling?
>
> thanks,
>
> Steve
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Philip Polstra" <ppolstra(at)mindspring.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Cowl DZUS Fasteners |
> then through the top and bottom half of the cowling. I am concerned that
the
> grip on the DZUS will not be long enough. Any insight or tips fromt the
been
> there done that crowd as to placement of the DZUS fasteners?
>
They aren't long enough. I bought some longer ones from ASS East.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Kevin Kinney <kkinney(at)fuse.net> |
| Subject: | Bellcrank access nutplates |
I'd like some opinions on how to install the nutplates in the 601
bellcrank access covers.
Bingelis says to rivet nutplates. I can't see how to do this, short of
dimpling the rivet holes.
I've seen in the archives that sometimes people have epoxied nutplates.
What would be the best way to secure these nutplates?
Regards,
Kevin Kinney
601XL
Tail done, wing skeleton done & skins in process
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jeff Paden" <jeffpaden(at)madbbs.com> |
| Subject: | Re: CH-300 for sale |
The CH-300 is very similar to the CH-640, the big difference is that the
CH-300 is smaller, hence the 210 pound limit on the rear seats and it does
not have an area for bagage... well not large enough to call bagage any
ways. If you want to see the aircraft I have a few pics on my web site at
http://www.madbbs.com/~jpaden The pics can be found at the bottom left of
the page under the link that says MY CH-300. My web page is not very pretty
and the pics are just in a directory that you click on the file you want to
see, but it will show you the aircraft. This aircraft was built by Bob
Andrews and I purchased it for something to fly while building my CH-640...
the problem with that is that I find myself flying more than building
and I need the cash to build my CH-640. I have flown it to Sun-N-Fun and
will also fly it to Oshkosh on the 23rd.
Jeff Paden
> For those of us not familiar with earlier Chris Heintz designs, I
> believe that the list has a general interest in learning about the
> characteristics of the earlier models. Especially those models no longer
> available. On occasion I have wondered why they were discontinued. Was
it
> solid rivets vs. blind?
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Larry C. McFarland" <larrymc(at)qconline.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Bellcrank access nutplates |
Kevin,
I put nutplates at the rear end of the wing joint covers.
But, I used tinnerman edge fasteners for the length of the
covers over the top. You might get an idea here from
pictures on my site. (see largeassembly/wing to center section)
I like the tinnermans a lot for the ability to hide under the edge
of the top skins. It's the wing-angle that holds the edges down.
Hope this helps.
Larry C. McFarland 601hds @ http://www.macsmachine.com
----- Original Message -----
From: "Kevin Kinney" <kkinney(at)fuse.net>
Subject: Zenith-List: Bellcrank access nutplates
>
> I'd like some opinions on how to install the nutplates in the 601
> bellcrank access covers.
>
> Bingelis says to rivet nutplates. I can't see how to do this, short of
> dimpling the rivet holes.
> I've seen in the archives that sometimes people have epoxied nutplates.
>
> What would be the best way to secure these nutplates?
>
> Regards,
> Kevin Kinney
> 601XL
> Tail done, wing skeleton done & skins in process
>
>
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Cowl DZUS Fasteners |
In a message dated 7/13/02 1:25:14 PM US Mountain Standard Time,
ppolstra(at)mindspring.com writes:
> They aren't long enough. I bought some longer ones from ASS East.
What size/length did you get? And then do you need to replace the springs as
well? I wouldn't think so but thought I should ask.
Steve
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Jerry Jensen <jensenm(at)gtcinternet.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Bellcrank access nutplates |
Kevin, I countersunk the rivits to hold the nut plates. You have to use a
flat anvil on the rivet puller.
Jerry Jensen
Kevin Kinney wrote:
>
> I'd like some opinions on how to install the nutplates in the 601
> bellcrank access covers.
>
> Bingelis says to rivet nutplates. I can't see how to do this, short of
> dimpling the rivet holes.
> I've seen in the archives that sometimes people have epoxied nutplates.
>
> W
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Michel Therrien <mtherr(at)yahoo.com> |
| Subject: | Looking for HD Wings |
A friend of mine posted this on the AirSoob forum...
--- Gilbert Martel wrote:
> To:
> From: "Gilbert Martel" <gmartel(at)techmatron.com>
> Date: Sat, 13 Jul 2002 21:29:35 -0700
> Subject: RE: [AirSoob] Digest Number 999
>
>
> Hello everyone;
> I have a ZENAIR ZODIAC CH601 HDS with Subaru EA82
> MPFI power.
> I am looking at the possibility of replacing my HDS
> (Taper wings) by the
> regular HD wings.
> If anybody has a set of ZODIAC 601HD wings that they
> would like to sell
> (because they changed from HD to HDS Wings), please
> contact me.
> Gilbert Martel
> gmartel(at)techmatron.com
> ZENAIR ZODIAC CH601 HDS , Subaru EA82 MPFI
> Tl;:450-969-0496
>
=====
----------------------------
Michel Therrien CH601-HD
http://pages.infinit.net/mthobby
http://mthobby.pcperfect.com/ch601
http://www.zenithair.com/bldrlist/profiles/mthobby
http://autos.yahoo.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Daniel Pelletier" <pelletie1(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | Re: distributor nippo-denso |
Hi List,
I'm looking for a EA81 nippo denso distributor for my Soob. If someone have
one please contact me.
pelletie1(at)hotmail.com
Daniel
601hds/soob
http://www.hotmail.com/fr
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Looking for HD Wings |
A friend of mine has an extra pair of HD wings that he got when he bought his
partially built kit. The wings are poorly built though and I would not fly
them to save my own life. However, I am sure they could be taken apart and
rebuilt correctly, and I bet they could be gotten cheap. If you are
interested contact me off list and I will hook you up with this guy.
Steve Freeman
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jeff & Marcia Davidson" <jdavidso(at)fcc.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Looking for HD Wings |
> I suspect that he would like the slower approaches
> that the HD allows for. One of our friend as a 601HD
> that he operates from a grass strip.
I'll guess that when published, we will see more of this in order to take
advantage of the proposed Sport Plane rules.
Jeff Davidson
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | NACA research papers of old |
| From: | Grant Corriveau <grantC(at)total.net> |
http://naca.larc.nasa.gov/
The above link contains many NACA research papers (circa 1917-1958) into
various aerodynamic phenomena - which probably form the basis for all the
stuff that we 'just know' today about how airplanes work. Some of it might
be of interest to those builders who like to dabble in design....?
fwiw
--
Grant Corriveau
Montreal
Zodiac 601hds/CAM100
C-GHTF
www.theWingStayedON.ca
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | wizard-24(at)juno.com |
I hate to be a pest, but have another question....
I plan to install a fuel selector valve in the center panel, but to do
that, that means I would need to run the fuel lines up to the selector
valve, then back down to the gascolator (lowest point in the system),
then back up to the engine.
Does this up and down situation pose any problems with fuel flow? Thanks,
Mike Fortunato
601XL
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Bill Steer" <bsteer(at)gwi.net> |
| Subject: | Brake cylinder orientation |
Pardon what might be a dumb question, but... I'm assembling the brake
cylinders onto the rudder pedals on my 601. The bottom of the cylinder
is drilled so that it can be oriented with the outlet port either facing
forward, toward the firewall, or toward the side. How have folks who've
been there oriented that outlet port, or does it really matter, since I
can use either an "L" fitting or a straight fitting in the cylinder?
Thanks for any info.
Bill
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Dave Austin" <daveaustin2(at)sprint.ca> |
Mike,
Absolutely it would be a problem. The flow from the tank to the gascolator
must be down-hill all the way, so that any water in the tank will go down to
the lowest point where it gets trapped.
Imagine if you got some water in the line to your selector, it would settle
in the lowest point. If you fly in freezing temperatures it could be
upsetting. Or just the weight of the water could cause a flow lock.
Dave Austin 601HDS - 912
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Cy Galley" <cgalley(at)qcbc.org> |
I haven't seen the plans but why are you changing them? The number one
reason engines quit is lack of fuel. Screw with the designed system and
odds are you will have a fuel delivery problem. If you want to make the
valve easier to reach then make an extension to reach the valve like Cessna.
Even this I think it counter to the KISS principle of design and light
weight.
Cy Galley, TC - Chair, Emergency Aircraft Repair, Oshkosh
Editor, EAA Safety Programs
cgalley(at)qcbc.org or experimenter(at)eaa.org
Always looking for articles for the Experimenter
----- Original Mesage -----
From: <wizard-24(at)juno.com>
Subject: Zenith-List: Fuel lines
I hate to be a pest, but have another question....
I plan to install a fuel selector valve in the center panel, but to do
that, that means I would need to run the fuel lines up to the selector
valve, then back down to the gascolator (lowest point in the system),
then back up to the engine.
Does this up and down situation pose any problems with fuel flow? Thanks,
Mike Fortunato
601XL
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "The Meiste's" <meiste(at)essex1.com> |
| Subject: | Stratus fuel octane? |
Can any Stratus users give me your advice on the fuel octane you are
using?
The owners manual says anything from 87 to 92 octane auto gas will work,
but I'm wondering what you guys that are fling have found to work the
best.
Also as I live in the Midwest the mid grade 89 octane gasohol is
plentiful, but is this stuff a no no in our engines?
Thanks for the advice ...........
Kelly Meiste
601 HD Stratus 99.9% complete!
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Mark Townsend" <601xl(at)sympatico.ca> |
HI Mike
Since your building the XL like me think about installing an Andair fuel
selector just behind and slightly above the gascolator which is between the
two seats with an extension arm and a universal elbow then you can install
selector portion remotely in the center panel just in front of the "Y" stick
your fuel lines will not have to be raised and it will look great.
Also I just spent a little time with Chris Heintz on Saturday and I asked
him about the plumbing for the 4 leading edge tanks on the XL. His response
was to install two pipes between the two tanks one low and one high with no
vent line on the inboard tank. This basically makes it two large tanks with
simplicity to boot. He also suggests that as habit you should always switch
tanks every half hour.
As I had a chance to peek into the Zenair shop there will be no new
surprises at Oshkosh this year. IT would seem that attention was placed on
other avenues over the last 6 mos and physical development of new products
came to a screeching halt. But I sneaked a peek at the wings and WOW is all
I can say ! My next trip up will be later in the fall. Hope to be able to
share a bit more with you all at that time.
Mark Townsend
601XL EA-82MPFI Turbo
-----Original Message-----
Subject: Zenith-List: Fuel lines
>
>I plan to install a fuel selector valve in the center panel, but to do
>that, that means I would need to run the fuel lines up to the selector
>valve, then back down to the gascolator (lowest point in the system),
>then back up to the engine.
>
>Does this up and down situation pose any problems with fuel flow? Thanks,
>
>Mike Fortunato
>601XL
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bryan Martin <bryanmmartin(at)comcast.net> |
> I hate to be a pest, but have another question....
>
> I plan to install a fuel selector valve in the center panel, but to do
> that, that means I would need to run the fuel lines up to the selector
> valve, then back down to the gascolator (lowest point in the system),
> then back up to the engine.
>
> Does this up and down situation pose any problems with fuel flow? Thanks,
>
> Mike Fortunato
> 601XL
The fuel should flow downhill all the way to the gascolater so that any
condensation from the tank will drain into the gascolater where it can be
drained out during pre-flight not get trapped in a local low spot where it
might freeze or work it's way through the system and get to the carburetor
jets just about the time you are climbing out after take off.
--
Bryan Martin
N61BM, CH 601 XL, Stratus Subaru.
Wings, tail, fuselage and canopy done, wheels and tail mounted.
Working on instrument panel and electrical.
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Cowl DZUS Fasteners |
Hi List,
The Dzus fasteners supplied by Zenith are AJ5-30. I ordered some larger ones
from Aircraft Spruce and they fit where the originals didn't. I ordered a
few AJ5-40 fasteners. Hope this helps.
Dick (601-HDS, Stratus Subaru, 115 hours)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | wizard-24(at)juno.com |
> I haven't seen the plans but why are you changing them?
Ummm...if you ever get the chance to see the XL plans, you'll soon
discover that there isn't squat concerning details on running the fuel
lines when you install ZAC's auxilliary tank "system" (yes, I contacted
ZAC, and they simply say they don't have them yet). So, I'm faced with
either waiting for them, or trying to figure out how to plumb four tanks
on my own. The plans only indicate a separate shut-off valve per tank (I
guess you only run one wing tank at a time, or both through a "T"
fitting?). But it doesn't indicate what to do when you have 4 tanks....so
I figured a selector valve would be the way to go. Plus, I've seen HD &
HDS photos that seem to indicate others have placed selector valves on
the center console. Given the cautions I've received, I wonder how they
got away with that....
But I do appreciate the good advice, and I will avoid the "up and downs"
in the lines. Now I just need to figure out a good alternative. :)
Mike Fortunato
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Brake cylinder orientation |
| From: | wizard-24(at)juno.com |
I faced the outlet ports on both cylinders towards the left outboard side
to make the brake lines easier to run. But, it really doesn't matter
which way you face them so long as you can install the brake lines so
they're out of the way.
Mike Fortunato
601XL
>
> Pardon what might be a dumb question, but... I'm assembling the
> brake
> cylinders onto the rudder pedals on my 601. The bottom of the
> cylinder
> is drilled so that it can be oriented with the outlet port either
> facing
> forward, toward the firewall, or toward the side. How have folks
> who've
> been there oriented that outlet port, or does it really matter,
> since I
> can use either an "L" fitting or a straight fitting in the cylinder?
>
> Thanks for any info.
>
> Bill
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Stratus fuel octane? |
I use regular 87 octane unleaded auto fuel for my Stratus Subaru engine. No
issues. Engine runs fine.
Dick (601-HDS, Stratus Soob)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Grant Corriveau <grantC(at)total.net> |
on 7/14/02 11:55 PM, wizard-24(at)juno.com at wizard-24(at)juno.com wrote:
...
> But I do appreciate the good advice, and I will avoid the "up and downs"
> in the lines. Now I just need to figure out a good alternative. :)
Mike,
As I understand it, you can run the lines the way you wanted, but you have
to provide a way to drain the fuel at EVERY LOW POINT in a run where water
could collect.
So, for the sake of simplicity, it is good to keep the reversals to a
minimum. But what form 'simplicity' will simplicity take in your design?
Sometimes it might be easier to have an extra gascolater/drain point than to
have to fabricate some sort of complex selector valve... ?
On previous HD/HDS wing tank set ups, builders with 4 wing tanks have
plumbed the two in each wing together into a T so that they can operate them
as effectively 2 larger tanks. I wonder if this would work on the XL?
--
Grant Corriveau
Montreal
Zodiac 601hds/CAM100
C-GHTF
www.theWingStayedON.ca
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Schemmel, Grant" <Grant.Schemmel(at)utmc.aeroflex.com> |
Congratulations Paul, Great Job!
-----Original Message-----
From: Paul Sharpe [mailto:fly601(at)rogers.com]
Subject: Zenith-List: First Flight
It Flies !!!
C-IABP has slipped the surly bonds for the first time. Wednesday, July
10 at Waterloo Regional Airport, Ontario, Canada.
CH601HD - serial no. 6-3903 - powered by a Rotax 912S coupled to a
3-blade g/a Kremen Sport Prop, we spent about 45 minutes in the vicinity of
CYKF and all went very well (a few minor bugs surfaced; my radio in
particular.) Art Mitchell, CEO of Flypass, and very experienced on the 601
went along to keep me out of trouble; and just as well as I'm certainly
going to have to learn how to land (seems I have to flare a lot lower than
in the Airbus.)
Hopefuly I'll have it back up on the weekend.
Paul Sharpe
Guelph, Ontario, Canada
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Daniel Pelletier" <pelletie1(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | Re: nippo-denso distributor |
Hi list,
I'm looking for au EA-81 Nippo Denso distributor, if somebody have one
please contact me off list.
Daniel Pelletier
pelletie1(at)hotmail.com
601HDS/SOOB
Discutez en ligne avec vos amis ! http://messenger.msn.fr
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | wizard-24(at)juno.com |
> Also I just spent a little time with Chris Heintz on Saturday and I
> asked him about the plumbing for the 4 leading edge tanks on the XL.
His
> response was to install two pipes between the two tanks one low and one
high
> with no vent line on the inboard tank. This basically makes it two
large
> tanks
Not sure I understand this part, given the way the tanks are shipped (and
in my case, already installed). The fuel lines for outboard tanks
(extended tanks) is made to run through the inboard tanks through a
welded sleeve for that purpose. So, given that situation, how would the
two tanks be tied together outside of the wing? And, all the tanks are
vented as supplied. Would it be better to "T" the inboard tanks to each
other, and do the same to the outboard tanks, which would result in two
separate systems (main and aux)? And if so, will the fuel draw equally
from both wings?
Excuse my ignorance on this, but it just isn't making much sense to me.
Thanks!
Mike Fortunato
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Gary K" <flyink(at)efortress.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Fuel lines (selector) |
There is another way to get the fuel selector on the panel and leave the
actual selector on the firewall. I was looking at the $200+ Andair fuel
selector with extension and universal joints. It was way too flashy for my
Pelican so I stuck with the plans. They use a $20 Weatherhead fuel shutoff
valve (see Spruce, etc) and remove the handle, cut the shaft in half, then
use an aluminum tube for an extension and mount the shaft and handle back on
the extension tube. Lots of them flying for years so it works fine.
Another neat trick is that you can drill out the fuel shutoff valve and make
a left/right/on/off valve out of it for 5 minutes work and $free. Very
clever people at Ultravia. I didn't like where it came out on the panel so
I added a Sears 1/4" socket universal joint, and I didn't like the
Weatherhead plumbing valve handle so I used a BMW knob from the automotive
recycling facility. Those Andairs belong in Lancairs and RV's, this is a
real homebuilders list ;<) Just an idea - I'd be happy to share more
details. (I do have the Andair mini gascolator and it's a beauty, but I
cover it up so no one will see).
Gary K.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Mark Townsend" <601xl(at)sympatico.ca> |
Sorry Mike I'm making my own tanks and won't have the carry through on the
inboard. Art Mitchell from Flypass suggested putting in two "T" connections
so that there are outboard and inboard tanks.
Mark
-----Original Message-----
From: wizard-24(at)juno.com <wizard-24(at)juno.com>
Date: Tuesday, July 16, 2002 9:12 PM
Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Fuel lines
>
>
>> Also I just spent a little time with Chris Heintz on Saturday and I
>> asked him about the plumbing for the 4 leading edge tanks on the XL.
>His
>> response was to install two pipes between the two tanks one low and one
>high
>> with no vent line on the inboard tank. This basically makes it two
>large
>> tanks
>
>Not sure I understand this part, given the way the tanks are shipped (and
>in my case, already installed). The fuel lines for outboard tanks
>(extended tanks) is made to run through the inboard tanks through a
>welded sleeve for that purpose. So, given that situation, how would the
>two tanks be tied together outside of the wing? And, all the tanks are
>vented as supplied. Would it be better to "T" the inboard tanks to each
>other, and do the same to the outboard tanks, which would result in two
>separate systems (main and aux)? And if so, will the fuel draw equally
>from both wings?
>
>Excuse my ignorance on this, but it just isn't making much sense to me.
>Thanks!
>
>Mike Fortunato
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "George Swinford" <grs-pms(at)mindspring.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Fuel lines (selector) |
Gary:
Could you elaborate a bit on the "cut the shaft in half" part of your
directions. Not having seen the installation, it isn't clear to me how to
couple the shaft to an extension tube.
Thanks,
George
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | John Montgomery <1arm(at)rogers.com> |
| Subject: | crimping positions on stab ribs |
I know I'm being a little anal here, but it bugs me that the location
for crimps on the stab rib form is not in the plans like they are for
the wing ribs.
After looking at some pictures various people's web sites it looks like
most ribs have 4 crimps between the spars, and the tip ribs have 3
crimps between the node and the front spar. Am I missing something in
the plans here?
I was looking at a rib blank when I was at Flypass a couple weeks ago.
Art Mitchell had created the crimp positions on the rib form with a
dremel sanding drum. They seem wider than what I expected. Art said he
used a socket as a male dies to tap in the crimp positions. Seems
straighforward. I was wondering how other people create their forms
with smaller crimp positions?
I wouldn't worry about it so much but every picture of a rib I see on
various web pages has everything soooo perfect ;) I've got a high
standard to live up to!
thanks,
John M.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Paul Hartl" <pdhartl(at)mindspring.com> |
| Subject: | FS2002 Zodiac XL cruise speed |
>>Hi Paul and group,
>>The Sim files are great! I have been flying around and even
>>downloaded the T38. But, I notice that the Zodiac XL tricylce
>>only makes about 95knots in level flight at 2600 rpm. Is this the
>>way the model was designed, or is it my setup. What are the
>>cruise on your system?
Hi Eric,
I get a faster cruise than your 95 knots. I get 100 kts IAS @ 3,000
ft MSL and 68 degrees F, which translates to 106 kts TAS (or 122
mph). At 6,000 ft MSL and 57 degrees F, I get 98 kts IAS, which
makes for 109 TAS (125 mph). I suspect that you perhaps don't
have the "Automixture" option selected in FS2002, which means it
will perform poorly at altitude because it is too rich. Check this
under the "Aircraft" pulldown, subheading "realism settings".
However....... I was at the EAA fly-in last Friday (in Arlington, WA)
and spoke with Rodger about the XL and was surprised to hear him
say it is a bit faster than the HDS. He claims 135 mph cruise @
5,000 feet, which is faster than my FS2002 model; thus I need to
modify the flight file - or you can do so easily yourself if you have
the "Professional Version" of FS2002. If so, just use the "FSEdit"
program to open the Flight Dynamics file and, under "Tuning", set
the "parasite drag scalar" to 0.75 instead of 1.0. That should get
you about 135 mph @ 5,000 ft MSL.
I also noted that the Zenith demo 601XL is a more orange-red color
than I painted it in FS2002, so I guess I need to modify that, too
and get a modified XL up on my site soon with both fixes - give me
a day or two.
Thanks for the input!
Paul
Paul Hartl, 601HDS with LE tanks, Stratus Subaru EA-81
Tail, rear fuse, central wing completed; wings mostly there!
FS2002 Aircraft Website: http://home.mindspring.com/~pdhartl/
email: pdhartl(at)mindspring.com or paul_hartl(at)communityschool.org
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Carlos Sa <wings1(at)videotron.ca> |
| Subject: | Re: crimping positions on stab ribs |
Hi, John
> I know I'm being a little anal here, but it bugs me that the location
> for crimps on the stab rib form is not in the plans like they are for
> the wing ribs.
>
> After looking at some pictures various people's web sites it looks like
> most ribs have 4 crimps between the spars, and the tip ribs have 3
> crimps between the node and the front spar. Am I missing something in
> the plans here?
I recall visiting all sites I had bookmarks for, printing pictures and
measuring them.
I think the important point is to make all ribs similar, with the crimps
in the same position.
> I was looking at a rib blank when I was at Flypass a couple weeks ago.
> Art Mitchell had created the crimp positions on the rib form with a
> dremel sanding drum.
I did that too. The sanding drum is perfect for that.
> They seem wider than what I expected. Art said he
> used a socket as a male dies to tap in the crimp positions. Seems
> straighforward. I was wondering how other people create their forms
> with smaller crimp positions?
For the stabiliser ribs, I think I used a round file. It's been a while,
don't remember so well, but I know I didn't own a Dremmel then.
To make the actual crimp, I built the tool described here, but I doubled
the centre piece (look for the flooting pliers):
http://www.vansairforce.org/tools/index.shtml
Also here, under "tools":
http://pages.infinit.net/wings/zodiac/main.html
> I wouldn't worry about it so much but every picture of a rib I see on
> various web pages has everything soooo perfect ;) I've got a high
> standard to live up to!
Up close they are not that perfect ;o) (talking for the ones I made, of
course).
God luck
Carlos
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Michel Therrien <mtherr(at)yahoo.com> |
| Subject: | Re: crimping positions on stab ribs |
As mentioned by Carlos, you can set those positions
yourself. This being said, when I made mine, I
considered the pitch 60 for the center ribs, but not
the smaller pitch of the end-ribs. I ended up with an
irregular rivet pattern on the end rib. If I was to
do it again, I would have modified the crimps of the
end ribs or I would have done new ribs to have a nice
rivet pattern....
--- Carlos Sa wrote:
>
>
> Hi, John
>
>
> > I know I'm being a little anal here, but it bugs
> me that the location
> > for crimps on the stab rib form is not in the
> plans like they are for
> > the wing ribs.
> >
> > After looking at some pictures various people's
> web sites it looks like
> > most ribs have 4 crimps between the spars, and the
> tip ribs have 3
> > crimps between the node and the front spar. Am I
> missing something in
> > the plans here?
>
> I recall visiting all sites I had bookmarks for,
> printing pictures and
> measuring them.
> I think the important point is to make all ribs
> similar, with the crimps
> in the same position.
>
=====
----------------------------
Michel Therrien CH601-HD
http://pages.infinit.net/mthobby
http://mthobby.pcperfect.com/ch601
http://www.zenithair.com/bldrlist/profiles/mthobby
http://autos.yahoo.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Gary K" <flyink(at)efortress.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Fuel lines (selector) |
The Weatherhead fuel shutoff shaft is about 3/8" solid brass about 1"
long. The handle fits over the "D"-shaped end of the shaft and is held on
by a screw that goes into the end of the shaft. If you cut this shaft in
half lengthwise, each end could be slid into the proper I.D. aluminum tube
extension (I can go out and take measurements). A hole is drilled thru and
each end is pinned with a 1/16" cotter pin. This allows the Weatherhead
handle to be reused if you want, and the extension can fit thru a rubber
grommet in the panel.
In my plane the fuel lines meet at the center of the firewall from each
high wing tank and go into the selector, then down and thru the firewall to
the gascolator. The extension shaft brings the fuel selector handle right
out to the bottom center of the panel. A picture is worth more than another
page of description (or something like that) so I can take a picture and
send it if you are interested.
Gary K.
----- Original Message -----
From: "George Swinford" <grs-pms(at)mindspring.com>
Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Fuel lines (selector)
>
> Gary:
>
> Could you elaborate a bit on the "cut the shaft in half" part of your
> directions. Not having seen the installation, it isn't clear to me how to
> couple the shaft to an extension tube.
>
> Thanks,
>
> George
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Swiss-style muffler? |
| From: | Grant Corriveau <grantC(at)total.net> |
Listers,
In the interests of good airport neighbourliness, I'm looking for a muffler
for my CAM100 and I'd like to try the Swiss-style mufflers Tony Bingelis
writes about in one of his manuals. Does anyone know of a source for
completed versions of this muffler? Or alternatively, does anyone know of a
good source (in Canada or U.S.A.?) for the seamless stainless steel tube
required to build one?
(From Bingelis' article: "The aluminum tube is readily available in Europe,
as this sort of tube just happens to be the standard vertical rainwater
downspout found on houses. It is about 0.5 mm thick and can be obtained from
building supply stores in europe. Any similar light-wall, large-diameter
tube could be used. In the U.S. about the only source for such a large
diameter aluminum, would be companies producing telescopes and telescope
kits.")
Thanks,
--
Grant Corriveau
Montreal
Zodiac 601hds/CAM100
C-GHTF
www.theWingStayedON.ca
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Swiss style muffler - correction |
| From: | Grant Corriveau <grantC(at)total.net> |
Correction - I'm looking for a seamless aluminum tube -- not steel --
" 80 mm diameter aluminum tube. (This would be approximately 3 1/8 inches in
diameter, if you don't have a metric scale)" -- TB
Thanks again
--
Grant Corriveau
Montreal
Zodiac 601hds/CAM100
C-GHTF
www.theWingStayedON.ca
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Schemmel, Grant" <Grant.Schemmel(at)utmc.aeroflex.com> |
| Subject: | Swiss-style muffler? |
Hi Grant
I had this company make me a stainless glasspack for my zodie. The finished product
looks and sounds great, albeit somewhat heavy at around 10 lbs. The one
they built for me is 4" in outside diameter w/ 2" core and has a body length
of 30". The website is:
http://www.stainless-specialties.com/
The unit is filled with a ceramic packing, and they guarantee the muffler for life.
I am using an o-200, and have the muffler slung underneath and somewhat
to the rear of the main spar. At idle, it's extremely quiet, and even at full
power I think there's more prop noise than engine.
Grant Schemmel
N602GS; o-200 601hds ~1.5 hrs
Listers,
In the interests of good airport neighbourliness, I'm looking for a muffler
for my CAM100 and I'd like to try the Swiss-style mufflers Tony Bingelis
writes about in one of his manuals. Does anyone know of a source for
completed versions of this muffler? Or alternatively, does anyone know of a
good source (in Canada or U.S.A.?) for the seamless stainless steel tube
required to build one?
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Swiss-style muffler? |
| From: | "Pinneo, George" <George.Pinneo(at)trw.com> |
Grant: a good metal supply house will have extruded alum. tubing up to maybe 6"
OD. in different wall thicknesses. Some will have steel and stainless steel,
as well.
McMaster-Carr only goes up to 2" in my old catalog. Custom Aircraft Parts in El
Cajon, CA, makes aircraft mufflers, tubing, etc. from 321 Stainless for ACS.
They can make anything you draw.
GGP
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | mawood(at)zoo.uvm.edu |
Hello All
I am building a cowling for my 601 to go over an O-200. I am doing a male plug
and will glass over this. I am thinking 3 layers of 3 oz glass with a couple of
more layers around hard point connection areas. Does this sound about right for
the amount of glass to use?
Thanks for any input
Mark Wood
N221MW
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | cowling/muffler question |
| From: | mawood(at)zoo.uvm.edu |
Hi Grant
I am in the process of building the cowling for my 601 with an O-200 and I see
you have just taken flight in yours. (Way to go) I am finding it takes a blunt
nose to make a cowling to fit the C-150 mufflers I have on my O-200. Why did you
put the muffler outside the cowling and what would you say this does from
aesthetic, engine power, and wind resistance points of view.
Any other feedback from you or others is as always greatly appreciated.
Mark Wood
N221MW
> Grant Schemmel
> N602GS; o-200 601hds ~1.5 hrs
> I had this company make me a stainless glasspack for my zodie. The
> finished product looks and sounds great, albeit somewhat heavy at around
> 10 lbs. The one they built for me is 4" in outside diameter w/ 2" core
> and has a body length of 30". The website is:
>
> http://www.stainless-specialties.com/
>
> The unit is filled with a ceramic packing, and they guarantee the
> muffler for life. I am using an o-200, and have the muffler slung
> underneath and somewhat to the rear of the main spar. At idle, it's
> extremely quiet, and even at full power I think there's more prop noise
> than engine.
>
> Grant Schemmel
> N602GS; o-200 601hds ~1.5 hrs
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Schemmel, Grant" <Grant.Schemmel(at)utmc.aeroflex.com> |
| Subject: | cowling/muffler question |
Mark,
I made my cowling based upon my choice of a nose bowl - which is one I got from
ZAC. I assume that the nose bowl is for either a VW or the Continental. I mounted
the nose bowl to 6 angles extending from the firewall, then wrapped sheet
metal around the whole thing. It makes a pretty good looking cowling, but
clearances are tight, especially on the 2 leading cylinders.
The clearance issue, and the desire for a quiet plane (muffler size) are what drove
me to hang the muffler underneath. Since the muffler is up tight against
the fuselage, you can't even see it as you walk up to the plane; I have had to
point it out to people on occasion. As to wind resistance, the muffler is your
typical bullet shaped glasspack, so is at least somewhat streamlined. I also
used stainless sheet clamps, which have a pretty small cross-sectional area.
I don't think there is any impact on the power, as being a glasspack, it's
a straight-thru 2" tube.
Overall, I think the whole exhaust is non-restrictive. I had the headers and y-tube
made by Custom Aircraft Parts in CA., and they stepped the tube size of
each runner up to 1 3/4" right after the exhaust port, then joined the runners
together into a 2" tube, that goes back to the muffler thru a couple of ball
joints. The whole thing is 321 stainless.
Hope this helps some.
Grant Schemmel
601hds - still fighting the oil temps
Hi Grant
I am in the process of building the cowling for my 601 with an O-200 and I see
you have just taken flight in yours. (Way to go) I am finding it takes a blunt
nose to make a cowling to fit the C-150 mufflers I have on my O-200. Why did you
put the muffler outside the cowling and what would you say this does from
aesthetic, engine power, and wind resistance points of view.
Any other feedback from you or others is as always greatly appreciated.
Mark Wood
N221MW
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Gary K" <flyink(at)efortress.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Swiss-style muffler? |
Always glad to hear about someone else trying to keep it quiet. I got a
deal on a Vance & Hines carbon fiber motorcycle silencer and I tried it on
my Stratus in adition to the stock Stratus muffler. It quieted the engine
considerably. I haven't run it with the silencer at full throttle but at
lower rpm's it was as quiet as a car, I could barely hear the exhaust. It
is a straight thru silencer that weighs under 5 lbs and is about 16" long
with a 2" steel pipe. It is very expensive new but if you could find a used
motorcycle silencer it would probably work great. The ones for newer
high-tech sport bikes are built very well and are light. As a matter of
fact, the first thing most guys do is take off the stock quiet muffler and
replace it with an aftermarket one so there should be a bunch around.
Gary K.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Grant Corriveau" <grantC(at)total.net>
Subject: Zenith-List: Swiss-style muffler?
>
> Listers,
>
> In the interests of good airport neighbourliness, I'm looking for a
muffler
> for my CAM100 and I'd like to try the Swiss-style mufflers Tony Bingelis
> writes about in one of his manuals. Does anyone know of a source for
> completed versions of this muffler? Or alternatively, does anyone know of
a
> good source (in Canada or U.S.A.?) for the seamless stainless steel tube
> required to build one?
>
> (From Bingelis' article: "The aluminum tube is readily available in
Europe,
> as this sort of tube just happens to be the standard vertical rainwater
> downspout found on houses. It is about 0.5 mm thick and can be obtained
from
> building supply stores in europe. Any similar light-wall, large-diameter
> tube could be used. In the U.S. about the only source for such a large
> diameter aluminum, would be companies producing telescopes and telescope
> kits.")
>
> Thanks,
> --
> Grant Corriveau
> Montreal
> Zodiac 601hds/CAM100
> C-GHTF
> www.theWingStayedON.ca
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Warm enough for you? |
| From: | Grant Corriveau <grantC(at)total.net> |
It may be warm now, but wait a few weeks.... grooaan - do we have to have
winter again?
Well someone earlier mentioned electrcally-heated motorcylce clothing -- hmm
interesting concept for winter flying...
check this out:
http://www.widderca.com/main.php3?lang=en
--
Grant Corriveau
Montreal
Zodiac 601hds/CAM100
C-GHTF
www.theWingStayedON.ca
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: cowling/muffler question |
| From: | Grant Corriveau <grantC(at)total.net> |
on 7/17/02 1:13 PM, Schemmel, Grant at Grant.Schemmel(at)utmc.aeroflex.com
wrote:
> Grant Schemmel
> 601hds - still fighting the oil temps
Grant, and all...
My CAM100 radiator has worked fine since the get-go even though it goes to
the the top limit on the 35C (95F) days we've had.
However, I wasnt' getting enough cooling air around some of the accessories
- especially the fuel pump and lines under the cowl, and also the carb bowl
and the carb itself were getting too hot.
I think I've solved this problem. I used the diagram from the Zenith web
site to construct two NACA vent inlets. One I now use to bring cooler
outside air directly into my carb inlet box. The second one I use to create
a direct blast of cool air onto the accessories. I then also added an
exhaust vent to help suck air out from the top of the cowling. The last two
flights show marked reduction in the under-cowl temps.
Grant, you might help cool the oil pan with something like this. Also,
fellow-lister Doug Pahanke found a cooling fin that can be strapped onto the
oil filter to help it become an oil cooler fwiw. -->
Doug Pahanke wrote:
...You can get a finned heat sink and mount on the metallic
crossbar perhaps, also on the oil filter.See this in the JEG
catalogue/website, or JC whitney
http://www.jcwhitney.com/product.jhtml?CATID=5217&BQ=mot
--
Grant Corriveau
Montreal
Zodiac 601hds/CAM100
C-GHTF
www.theWingStayedON.ca
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Kilby, Roger" <Roger.Kilby(at)DynCorp.com> |
Last Saturday, after the first flight with my new Arplast prop, I pulled the
cowl and discovered 2 cracks in my ZAC
muffler. I called on Monday and Nick said they are now using a ball joint
arrangement and, if I sent my muffler back,
they would fix/convert it. It should arrive at ZAC today.
If you have the Rotax 912 muffler where the pipes come from the engine and
are welded to the collector without any
other support you had better keep a close eye on them.
By the way, the cracks were on the collector, just outside the weld area
where the rear pipes attach to the collector.
Roger Kilby
N98RK - 601HDS
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Schemmel, Grant" <Grant.Schemmel(at)utmc.aeroflex.com> |
| Subject: | cowling/muffler question |
Grant,
Thanks for the suggestion about the oil filter, but I'm already trying something
like that. I made a shroud that goes around the oil filter, and directed a
1" blast tube into the shroud from the cylinder baffles. Didn't seem to do much
good.
Last night, I made my latest change, which was to put a 1 1/4" lip all around the
air exit at the bottom of the cowling (which is about 1.5 times the inlet size).
I think my setup is now almost identical to a Cessna 150's. Again, not
a lot of effect, though it did help some. At this point I'm somewhat baffled
(pun intended ;-)).
I'm curious about your top vent openings though. Do you know if anyone has done
any tufting around the cowling to determine what the pressure distributions
are? Mine feels like it's flying at a bit of a nose high attitude (I don't have
ANY fairings on it yet, so it's REALLY draggy), and if that was the case, then
the top of the cowling would be a low pressure area. Maybe I need to switch
over to a top exit? Any suggestions are welcome at this point.
Grant Schemmel
a direct blast of cool air onto the accessories. I then also added an
exhaust vent to help suck air out from the top of the cowling. The last two
flights show marked reduction in the under-cowl temps.
Grant, you might help cool the oil pan with something like this. Also,
fellow-lister Doug Pahanke found a cooling fin that can be strapped onto the
oil filter to help it become an oil cooler fwiw. -->
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jari Kaija" <jari.kaija(at)pp.inet.fi> |
| Subject: | New webring for Zenair builders? |
Has anyone enough _time_ and skills to create and host _new_
webring for zenair builders. And I mean BUILDERS webring without
any commercial sites in it. Many people contacted me with this
subject...
I am totally pissed commercial sites on ANY ring. Just wasting
time, when trying to catch needed information/pictures/source codes/
you name it...
Yes, I'm rude. So what...
-Jari
www.project-ch701.net
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: cowling/muffler question |
| From: | Grant Corriveau <grantC(at)total.net> |
on 7/18/02 9:31 AM, Schemmel, Grant at Grant.Schemmel(at)UTMC.Aeroflex.com
wrote:
...
> that was the case, then the top of the cowling would be a low pressure area.
> Maybe I need to switch over to a top exit? Any suggestions are welcome at
> this point.
I definitely think that adding some 'exit' room is important, especially on
mine where the rad is dumping hot air under the cowling... Here's a photo
that Iztok Salomon (Zenair dealer in Slovenia) sent me of his CAM100 top
cowl mod...
I'll post my vents asap...
Grant
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Dave Austin" <daveaustin2(at)sprint.ca> |
| Subject: | Re: New webring for Zenair builders? |
It would seem to me that to create another Zenith builders' website would
only result in fragmentation of information and builder experiences. Not in
the best interests of any builder or flyer.
I can hit the erase button with very little effort on the occasional
commercial entry. Also on the rather irrational entries like this one.
Dave Austin 601HDS - 912
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "PFlyer" <pfergus2(at)tampabay.rr.com> |
| Subject: | Re: New webring for Zenair builders? |
Ouch.... If it helps any, I am bringing my old web site back ( with a
cleaner look )
I was going to announce it up and running in about a week...but if you want
to peek at it now.. www.peteshangar.com
It's commercial free and full of spelling errors,bad grammar. No I'm not
volunteering, it cuts into my building / airport time way to much...
Peter Ferguson
N601PK
601HDS
Jab 3300
----- Original Message -----
From: "Jari Kaija" <jari.kaija(at)pp.inet.fi>
Subject: Zenith-List: New webring for Zenair builders?
>
> Has anyone enough _time_ and skills to create and host _new_
> webring for zenair builders. And I mean BUILDERS webring without
> any commercial sites in it. Many people contacted me with this
> subject...
>
> I am totally pissed commercial sites on ANY ring. Just wasting
> time, when trying to catch needed information/pictures/source codes/
> you name it...
>
> Yes, I'm rude. So what...
>
> -Jari
> www.project-ch701.net
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jari Kaija" <jari.kaija(at)pp.inet.fi> |
| Subject: | Re: New webring for Zenair builders? |
> I can hit the erase button with very little effort on the occasional
> commercial entry. Also on the rather irrational entries like this one.
> Dave Austin 601HDS - 912
Ach! You are webring master of "Zenith..."? Yes, please, use
"the button". When these commercial & non-zenair sites are
gone, I'll be back.
-Jari
btw. sorry all folks, I had a VERY bad day yesterday and day
before that. Too much other works to do, maybe, or....
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "The Meiste's" <meiste(at)essex1.com> |
I didn't think I'd ever see the day but I'm now getting ready to do the
W & B on my 601 HD (tri-gear).
Looking at the info posted by ZAC they have the arm for the header tank
(16 gal in my case) at -9.5, this looks to be about at the firewall.
Also the arm for the rear baggage shelf is shown at 55.1, which looks to
be approx the front of the shelf.
I would think these locations should be measured as close to the center
as possible. Soooooo in short I'm just wondering what everyone else out
there is using for numbers here?
Thanks for any advice!
Kelly
601 HD Stratus
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Mark Townsend" <601xl(at)sympatico.ca> |
| Subject: | Re: New webring for Zenair builders? |
I actually like some of the commercial web sites. It's where I borrow some
of my best ideas.
Mark
-----Original Message-----
>
>It would seem to me that to create another Zenith builders' website would
>only result in fragmentation of information and builder experiences. Not
in
>the best interests of any builder or flyer.
>I can hit the erase button with very little effort on the occasional
>commercial entry. Also on the rather irrational entries like this one.
>Dave Austin 601HDS - 912
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Bill Steer" <bsteer(at)gwi.net> |
Has anyone evaluated the Skydat GX1 from Sport Flying Shop or, better
yet, used it? It seems to be an alternative to similar instruments from
RMI and others, but I'm wondering about actual experiences with it.
Thanks for any info.
Bill
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Gary Liming <gary(at)liming.org> |
| Subject: | Re: Headset Jack location |
>
>List,
>Anyone want to suggest the best place to locate the headset jacks in a 701?
I've been thinking about that myself. It seems to me that putting the
pilot's jacks just next to the right seat aft and facing up would make it
easy to reach and keep the cord out of the way, and the right seat's jacks
would be next to the pilot's seat as well. I wonder if this is a good idea
since you don't see this arrangement very often.
Anyone doing this with advice about how it works out? Is it better to
mount them on or near the panel?
Gary Liming
801 (same seat arrangement as 701)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Steve Danielson" <steved(at)nc.rr.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Headset Jack location |
On my 701 the portable intercom (and thus the jacks) were in exactly the
location you describe, and it worked out great. Kept the cords out of the
way.
Steve
> I've been thinking about that myself. It seems to me that putting the
> pilot's jacks just next to the right seat aft and facing up would make it
> easy to reach and keep the cord out of the way, and the right seat's jacks
> would be next to the pilot's seat as well. I wonder if this is a good
idea
> since you don't see this arrangement very often.----- Original
Message -----
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "michael brook" <walruss(at)optushome.com.au> |
| Subject: | Re: CH801/701 Ugly flaperon control slot |
When you are flying the machine through the air, ugly tends not to to be one
of my considerations. Practical and functional an dkeepign me alive is.
mike2planes
----- Original Message -----
From: Ihab A.B. Awad <iawad(at)scimagix.com>
Subject: Re: Zenith-List: CH801/701 Ugly flaperon control slot
>
>
> On Sat, 2002-07-06 at 23:01, Jim Frisby wrote:
> > The drawing/photo shows a concept, I haven't implemented it yet. The
plan
> > is to replace the root hinge pin with a torque tube located on the same
> > center. The torque tube would be affixed to the flaperon. ...
>
> [ Once again, I'm no expert (and not even a builder) but, as a CH 701
> "dreamer", I have long felt, as you do, that the flaperon mechanism is
> the one thing in the design that I would consider a bit "ugly" rather
> than "practical and functional". ]
>
> I seem to notice that some of the more well-upholstered CH 801s show
> what seems to be interior trim covering the mechanism --
>
>
http://www.zenithair.com/stolch801/construction/cabin/rear-sear-airlink2.jpg
>
> Is this not adequate to keep the cabin adequately sealed?
>
> Peace,
>
> Ihab
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | owner-zenith-list-server(at)matronics.com |
| Subject: | Manifold Pressure Gauge |
Dear listers:
Excuse my ignorance in this question:
I have a 912 ULS and chose a flight adjustment pitch prop. Also I have recently acquire this flow & consume monitor http://www.jabiru.co.uk/fuelmon.html. The point is that I doubt a manifold pressure gauge is needed since you can control the rpms and the good performance of the prop knowing the fuel flow ratio constantly.
My answer is if this is true, I mean, if I can do it without the manifold pressure
gauge or otherwise if it's completely needed.
Thanks in advance
Yago Osset
www.osset.com/yago
---------------------------------
Nueva versin: Webcam, voz, y mucho ms Gratis!
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jim Frisby" <marslander(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | Re: CH801/701 Ugly flaperon control slot |
Mike,
Thanks for your thoughts. I agree that performance can't be subverted to
style. My main concern about the "slot" is my perception that snow and rain
will enter the airframe and cause corrosion and possible freezup in the
belly and under the rear seat.
Jim Frisby
>From: "michael brook" <walruss(at)optushome.com.au>
>Reply-To: zenith-list(at)matronics.com
>To:
>Subject: Re: Zenith-List: CH801/701 Ugly flaperon control slot
>Date: Sat, 20 Jul 2002 03:03:51 +1000
>
>
>
>When you are flying the machine through the air, ugly tends not to to be
>one
>of my considerations. Practical and functional an dkeepign me alive is.
>
>mike2planes
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Greg Ferris <ferret(at)forbin.net> |
When I did my W & B, I decided to calculate the arms by putting known weights
in each area and getting the weight under each wheel. From those weights,
and distances from the wheels to the datum, one can calculate actual arms for
each item (fuel, baggage, passengers). I then put that in a spreadsheet so
it's a snap to do a quick W&B.
Greg Ferris
FAA Inspection next Tuesday!
The Meiste's wrote:
>
> I didn't think I'd ever see the day but I'm now getting ready to do the
> W & B on my 601 HD (tri-gear).
>
> Looking at the info posted by ZAC they have the arm for the header tank
> (16 gal in my case) at -9.5, this looks to be about at the firewall.
> Also the arm for the rear baggage shelf is shown at 55.1, which looks to
> be approx the front of the shelf.
>
> I would think these locations should be measured as close to the center
> as possible. Soooooo in short I'm just wondering what everyone else out
> there is using for numbers here?
> Thanks for any advice!
>
> Kelly
> 601 HD Stratus
>
________________________________________________________________________________
Kelly,
When I did my W&B on my 601-HDS, I measured to the center of my header tank
and wing tanks. As for the baggage area, I measured it in two places; the
first place at 1/3rd length from the front to back and the second at 2/3rd
length and assumed a maximum of 20 pounds at each location to simulate even
weight distribution. I agree that we should measure at the center of
everything, including the pilot and passenger locations.
Dick (601-HDS, Stratus Subaru, getting ready to polish)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Phil & Michele Miller" <millerpg(at)ps.gen.nz> |
Hi, Bill,
I have a Skydat GX1 in my 701 which I have owned for only 2 months. I
found that it took no longer to get used to than any other unfamiliar
cockpit layout. I have only 2 direct concerns and 1 indirect. I think
the character size for the altimeter readout could be a wee bit bigger
to give it more prominence. I find that sunlight on my body can be
reflected back off the screen making it difficult to read occasionally.
My third concern is that I would lose all instrumentation in the case of
a power failure. I am considering a backup power system for this reason.
Apart from these issues I am very happy with the system. I have the
optional fuel flow meter which gives fuel flow and accumulated fuel
usage which is very useful. I recommend it. I also have the digital
compass from the same supplier and have found it to be very accurate and
a heck of a lot easier to read than normal compass.
In summary, it's good gear, it's priced competitively and it's certainly
a viable (and lighter weight) alternative to traditional instumentation
unless you are "old school" or have a high RC (Resistance to Change)
quotient.
Hope this helps,
Phil Miller
New Zealand
CH701 with 912S
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-zenith-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-zenith-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Bill Steer
Subject: Zenith-List: Skydat GX1
Has anyone evaluated the Skydat GX1 from Sport Flying Shop or, better
yet, used it? It seems to be an alternative to similar instruments from
RMI and others, but I'm wondering about actual experiences with it.
Thanks for any info.
Bill
=
=
=
=
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Gary Liming <gary(at)liming.org> |
| Subject: | Re: CH801/701 Ugly flaperon control slot |
> I agree that performance can't be subverted to
>style. My main concern about the "slot" is my perception that snow and rain
>will enter the airframe and cause corrosion and possible freezup in the
>belly and under the rear seat.
Not to mention the drag from a slot in the fuselage.
Gary Liming
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Frank Stutzman <stutzman(at)stutzman.com> |
| Subject: | Re: CH801/701 Ugly flaperon control slot |
On Sat, 20 Jul 2002, Gary Liming wrote:
> Not to mention the drag from a slot in the fuselage.
Uhh, if you are worried about drag on a CH801/701, you've got a lot to
worry about.
Frank Stutzman
Hood River, OR
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Gary Liming <gary(at)liming.org> |
| Subject: | Re: CH801/701 Ugly flaperon control slot |
>
>On Sat, 20 Jul 2002, Gary Liming wrote:
>
> > Not to mention the drag from a slot in the fuselage.
>
>Uhh, if you are worried about drag on a CH801/701, you've got a lot to
>worry about.
They both make drag tradeoffs for lift, true, but its still no reason to
have unnecessary drag, is it?
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Screw Question!?! |
Hi List,
I just purchased my HSI for my panel and when I went to install it (it's
always something) the screws are not long enough to go through the panel, and
the light ring and then into the instrument. The instrument does not bolt
from behind the screws actually go into the instrument.
My question is I can not find a matching screw anywhere. It appears to be a
metric thread and size but I can;t find anything in any hardware store
locally. This would probably be easy to find if I knew exactly what to ask
for.
For size purposes, it appears to be between a 4 and a 6 machine screw but the
pitch in the threading is different, and I need about 3/4" in length.
The instrument is the electric HSI AC Spruce./ Does anyone have any idea
what size screw I might be needing to look for and where I might find them.
Thanks a lot guys. Sometimes this little stuff is frustrating as hell!
Steve
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Randy L. Thwing" <n4546v(at)mindspring.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Screw Question!?! |
It could be a No. 5, which magically is halfway between a 4 and a 6. It is
a standard screw but not common. The major screw diameter is .125, the tap
hole size is No. 38 wire guage (.1015") for the Course thread of 40 Threads
per inch, the tap hole size for the Fine thread of 44 TPI is No. 37 (.104").
I suspect it is 5-40, I'd be surprised if it was 5-44 or metric, but I am
surprised a lot these days! If you strike out everywhere else, I can send a
5-40 screw in an envelope for you to try, we use them in our product, so
it's not a problem.
Good Luck.
Randy L. Thwing, 701 plans
Subject: Zenith-List: Screw Question!?!
> For size purposes, it appears to be between a 4 and a 6 machine screw
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Gary Gower <ggower_99(at)yahoo.com> |
| Subject: | First Mexican aircraft that north in Alazka... |
Hello friends,
One member (Miguel Ramirez) from our club, succesfully
made it two ways to Alazka with his Kitfox.
We are very proud, this event is something important
for our aviation here in Mexico.
You can take a look to our clubs page.
http://www.ultraligeros.com.mx/
There also in the aerophotos section, you can see "La
Bamba", Also you can see a photo of myself , I have a
blue and white strips shirt in the lowest right set of
photos...
Saludos
Gary Gower
PS Good news about aviation is always welcome in the
News all over the world!
Saludos
Gary Gower
CH 701 912S in progress.
http://health.yahoo.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "David Tellet" <telletdl(at)erols.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Progress Report |
Thanks for the status report, Paul. I am planning to have a similar
configuration so I am interested in the data. But why put the do not arch.
at the bottom? This is just the sort of posting that I like to see in the
archives - even though it doesn't have performance numbers, it give the rest
of us some idea of how the things fly.
So I'm leaving your whole post copied here.
David Tellet 601 HD
----- Original Message -----
From: "Paul Sharpe" <fly601(at)rogers.com>
Subject: Zenith-List: Progress Report
>
> I now have completed several flights in my 601HD. In addition to
> putting it through a test program I find I'm having to "learn to fly" all
> over again, since all I've flown for many years is airliners.
>
> No true performance numbers yet as my ASI isn't exactly accurate;
> indicates too high in the low speed (stall) range, but too low at the
upper
> end. I've been adjusting the pitot tube angle and now have both internal
> and external static sources. Forecast nearly zero wind aloft tonight in
> this area, so maybe I can compare ASI to GPS and see how accurate the
> indicated airspeed is.
>
> Engine runs very well. Smooth throughout the RPM range. Sport Prop
> blade angle set to 17 degrees at the tips. Static full throttle RPM with
> the tail tied down 5300 RPM; in cruise (OAT 30deg C) at 3000 feet full
> throttle RPM 5700.
>
> Slight left roll tendency with weight laterally balanced. Will
probably
> add electric aileron trim later. For now not a problem.
>
> Intercom picking up noise from strobes; will relocate strobe box to
one
> of the wing tips.
>
> Handling is great. Stall is a non event; just burbles and mushes
> straight ahead, no wing or nose drop at all. Elevator very responsive,
> especially for a long time pilot of heavy metal. I'll get used to it
> eventually.
>
> Ground handling and steering are fantastic. The brakes hold it still
> for a run-up at 4000RPM but no higher.
>
> Last flight I found the oil temp stabilized a little higher than I'd
> like (245F) but it was hot outside (30C). I've since carefully sealed the
> oil cooler inlet ducting, and redirected the outlet ducting slightly, so
> I'll check it out tonight.
>
> Stay tuned, I'll keep you all posted on my progress. It sure is fun
flying
> my own bird!
>
> Paul Sharpe, Guelph, ON Canada
> C-IABP CH601HD - R912S- 3 blade Sport Prop
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Randy L. Thwing" <n4546v(at)mindspring.com> |
| Subject: | screw thread chart link |
Listers:
This info is widely available, but if you need a chart showing US
machine screw threads, drilling and tapping info here is a good basic
chart.
http://w3.one.net/~shender4/thread_chart.htm
Regards,
Randy L. Thwing, 701 plans
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Progress Report |
| From: | Grant Corriveau <grantC(at)total.net> |
Hey Paul - great report. Glad to see someone else experiencing 'heavy metal
shock'!! Some short comments/responses fyi --
on 7/20/02 3:33 PM, Paul Sharpe at fly601(at)rogers.com wrote:
>... I find I'm having to "learn to fly" all
> over again, since all I've flown for many years is airliners.
Tell me about it! This thing glides like a parachute compared to the A320!
Great for close-on circuits and over-obstacle approaches though.
> No true performance numbers yet as my ASI isn't exactly accurate;
The original Zenair recommendation of static source inside the cockpit seems
to be too low and gives erroneously high asi readings -- according to
previous postings on this list. A single static source well outboard on the
wing seems to get better readings.
>.. maybe I can compare ASI to GPS and see how accurate the
> indicated airspeed is.
Take the gps groundspeed on three different headings, then go to Bill
Morelli's web page - he has a calculator to give TAS from these.
> Last flight I found the oil temp stabilized a little higher than I'd
> like (245F)
fwiw - Mine fluctuates between 230 and 250 in this hot weather. Strangely
enough it gets hotter when I reduce power and cools down slightly when I
increase power..
--
Grant Corriveau
Montreal
Zodiac 601hds/CAM100
C-GHTF
www.theWingStayedON.ca
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Hal Rozema <hartist1(at)cox.net> |
| Subject: | Re: CH801/701 Ugly flaperon control slot |
Hal 701 in Phx, AZ has two comments
1. The marvelous simplicity of Chris flaperon control system trumps its few
drawbacks. Compare to usual flap and aileron control systems in everything else
from Cessna to Vans to Jodel to Kitfox.
2. If the water/rain issue bothers, cover it. Inside rivet a flexible membrane
like thin inner tube rubber, cut a knife slit for the control rod arc travel.
The same gimmick works to close the gap in the firewall where the nose wheel
steering rods move.
tail and wings done since Christmas 2001 in a downtown condo.
<http://theplanefolks.net>
Keepatit yall
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Lyle Pahnke" <ldpahnke(at)netwitz.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Screw Question!?! |
---------- Original Message ----------------------------------
From: STEFREE(at)aol.com
Date: Sat, 20 Jul 2002 14:15:03 EDT
>
>Hi List,
>
>I just purchased my HSI for my panel and when I went to install
it (it's
>always something) the screws are not long enough to go through
the panel, and
>the light ring and then into the instrument. The instrument does
not bolt
>from behind the screws actually go into the instrument.
>
Steve: would it not be possible just to re-thread the hole in the
instrument with a #6 SAE machine screw tap? Then you have a
standard size that you can easily replace the screw with any
length you need. If you don't have a tap and die set, just buy a
single tap at the local hardware store. Should'nt be too much
trouble. Good Luck LDP
Netwitz Internet Services www.netwitz.net (618)533-5447
Call Today And Ask About Wireless Broadband
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jim Frisby" <marslander(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | Re: CH801/701 Ugly flaperon control slot |
>2. If the water/rain issue bothers, cover it. Inside rivet a flexible
>membrane
>like thin inner tube rubber, cut a knife slit for the control rod arc
>travel.
>The same gimmick works to close the gap in the firewall where the nose
>wheel
>steering rods move.
I have doubts that the rubber membrane idea would work very well with the
curved slot. Let me know your results. I agree it works fine with straight
slots.
Jim
http://www.hotmail.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Damien Graham" <dgraham7(at)twcny.rr.com> |
| Subject: | Throttles for Dummies |
Group:
I am having a problem with the throttle for my 601 HD. I am not sure
what the linkages look like on other 601s, but mine has a metal cable
inside a metal sheath, inside of a rubber outside coating. (I hope to go
to the Gatineau gathering to look at other 601s). Also, the cables seem
a lot longer than they have to be: ( I bought this project partly
built).
Any suggestions would be appreciated.
Regards,
Damien
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Damien Graham" <dgraham7(at)twcny.rr.com> |
| Subject: | Throttles for Dummies |
Sorry Group. When I edited the previous message I edited out the point
of the message.
I am having problems adjusting the throttle. The cable sticks when it
moves in and out of the metal connectors. I cut off some of the rubber
sheathing but it still gets caught. I hope to see other throttle setups
when I go to Gatineau for the Fly-IN in August, but until then I would
appreciate any suggestions.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Larry C. McFarland" <larrymc(at)qconline.com> |
| Subject: | Electrical access |
601 builders,
I'm routing a good deal of electrical and pitot tubes thru the main spar
center
lightening hole just above the control stick bearing plate into a
console. Brake lines
battery cable go thru below the plate. I put a split hose on the edge
to protect the brake lines and cable, but due to the volume of wires,
I'm looking at rolling the upper flange a 1/16th to keep them from
getting into the insulation. Have any of you used this path and had a
better solution to protect the wiring?
Thanks for any replies.
Larry C. McFarland 601hds 66% in 90-degree heat.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Paul Sharpe" <fly601(at)rogers.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Throttles for Dummies |
Damien,
You're right, the cables supplied are much longer than needed. Once
you've established the cable routing you'll have to cut them to fit. Choke
cables too. Since I didn't have a header fuel tank to go around, I ran my
choke actuator cable straight through from the instrument panel through the
firewall. Having no bends in the choke cable makes it much easier to
operate.
Paul Sharpe
C-IABP
CH601HD
----- Original Message -----
From: "Damien Graham" <dgraham7(at)twcny.rr.com>
. Also, the cables seem
> a lot longer than they have to be: ( I bought this project partly
> built).
> Any suggestions would be appreciated.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | JEEdmondson(at)aol.com |
corvaircraft(at)yahoogroups.com
I havent seen a post about this, but I just found out that EAA and Avemco
have parted ways.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Hal Rozema <hartist1(at)cox.net> |
| Subject: | Re: EAA and Avemco |
Meanwhile, it should be noted that AVEMCO has specifically OKd policies on
Zenith Aircraft. This according to ZAC July/August Newsletter.
From other sources on the web, AVEMCOs problems with kit / plans built aircraft
has stemmed from nearly crippling loses in the carbon-fiber and other composite
birds.
I read that Zenith and Vans are the only two designs that they will look at.
Could it be "aluminum"? 99% of the Certified Aircraft are, we recognize,
aluminum.
Hal and Jackie N701PF
<http://theplanefolks.net>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "RUSSELL JOHNSON" <entec1(at)pld.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Zinc Chromate container with brush |
> List . . . I am looking for a container with a self contained brush that
> will hold a small amount of zinc chromate. The lid should be airtight
> so the zn chr does not evaporate or dry up between uses.
I used a small can (4oz.) that had contained solvent for cleaning PVC pipe.
The lid has a wire attached with a swab on the end.
Russell J. / 601-HDS
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Canopy materials |
| From: | mawood(at)zoo.uvm.edu |
> most of the parts would probably not fit the
>HD anyway. You have noticed the mix of dimensions on the drawings and as
>I have previously mentioned when you go to build you will find
>dimensions missing. I can provide more details as to dimensions when I
>finish fitting the canopy. Hopefully this weekend. I will then be
>disassembling it to install the gas springs and I will document the
>parts I fabricated.
>
>Tim
Tim and others.
I am trying to order the parts for the XL canopy for my HD. I have the drawings
from the web site and the material list from ZAC web site but part # 6-C-2-3 has
me scratching my head. ZAC is of no help this week as they are at OSH.
As I see it, to build 6C2-3 I will need;
820 mm sq steel tube 3/4 X 3/4 times 2
105 mm sq steel tube 3/4 X 3/4 times 2
side plate 330mm X 21mm X 1/8in times 2
top plate 330mm X 17mm X 1/8in times 2
4130 steel .080in plate 260mm X 45mm times 2
1/8in steel plate 67mm X 15mm times 2
anyone have info on the latch casing??
For Steel 7/8 tube, I assume that the Al tube for 6C3-1 will slide inside this.
Did I miss anything??
Can I assume that the 815mm of sq tube shown on the upper right drawing of page
6C2 is the same tube listed as 820mm sq tube on the third drawing down on the
right side of page 6C2
Can I assume that 6C2-2 is made of .080 steel with the 30mm X 18mm ear made of
1/8in steel?
Also anyone see a problem with going with .040 Al for the parts that are listed
as .032?
Thanks everyone.
Mark Wood
N221MW 601HD with O-200
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "rwripper" <rwripper(at)prodigy.net> |
| Subject: | Re: EAA and Avemco |
That was after they raised my policy 53% and I dropped them!
I had no claims from my 200+ hours in my 601HD. Avemco told
me it was due to wind damage claims, specifically in Florida
where I am.
They said nothing about composites but later news implicated
high cruise, fast planes.
I ended up with AUA with better coverage and a little less
than last years premium.
Dick
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Pinneo, George" <George.Pinneo(at)trw.com> |
You need to read about the Gimli Glider! A superb story and it's true; Grant better
know all about it, he's an Airbus driver.
GGP
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Peter Chapman <pchapman(at)ionsys.com> |
At 17:52 18-07-02 , you wrote:
>Looking at the info posted by ZAC they have the arm for the header tank
>(16 gal in my case) at -9.5, this looks to be about at the firewall.
>Also the arm for the rear baggage shelf is shown at 55.1, which looks to
>be approx the front of the shelf.
I also saw the -9.5 figure but I'm guessing that it refers to the small
header tank, rather than the 16 gal one. An old owner's manual gave -3.9
inches for the bigger tank. I calculated -5" on the scales after partially
filling my 16 gallon tank with 58 lb of gas. But don't take that as a
precise figure, just as an example. The shape of the tank naturally means
the arm will shift depending on the fuel load.
Might not be a bad idea to measure the landing gear positions too. Small
variations in those numbers (vs. whatever Zenith says) can significantly
affect the calculated arms for other weights. (This is assuming one is
calculating a moment arm rather than trying to measure physically. Both
methods have sources of inaccuracy.) I've seen both +27" and +26.5" given
in Zenith docs for the main wheels, while George Pinneo measured +26.2" in
one of his on-line documents.
The Zenith turtledeck baggage shelf numbers aren't very useful for watching
out for any aft CG problems. The number I measured was +69" for the center
of the shelf, where _in my personal definition_, I don't include the
section ahead of the aft hoop.
Peter Chapman
Toronto, ON 601 HDS / 912 / C-GZDC
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Pinneo, George" <George.Pinneo(at)trw.com> |
I expect one of you CANADIANS to tell us about the Gimli Glider episode.
Gimli was a WWII airbase. A big jet had to glide in there not too many years ago!
The pilot was cashiered but then reinstated. C'mon, look it up. I don't
have the details anymore, darn it!
GGP
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Paul Sharpe" <fly601(at)rogers.com> |
> I expect one of you CANADIANS to tell us about the Gimli Glider episode.
Well George, I don't have all the details at hand but it goes like this:
Happened about 20 years ago, maybe more. Boeing 767-233, number 604 in
the Air Canada fleet had a problem with fuel gauge indications on the ground
prior to departure. Canada was in the midst of changing from imperial to
metric measurements, and the 767 was the first aircraft type in the AC fleet
to have metric gauges, thus plenty of confusion in determining how much fuel
was actually on board. A couple of hours later, westbound at cruise
altitude, both engines flamed out due to fuel starvation. OOPS! Now the
767 was a big glider. Landing in Winnipeg was the first choice for the crew
but they quickly realised they wouldn't make it. Gimli, Manitoba was in the
vicinity, a former WWII air force training base, but by then a drag race
facility. So the captain put the 767 down at Gimli, with surprisingly
little damage (hit a guard rail I believe). The airplane was repaired and
remains in AC service today; in fact I have a number of hours logged on that
airframe myself.
Like George says, a great story to read.
Paul Sharpe
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Screws, Argh................. |
Hi list,
I my quest to find the right screw I never thought this would be such an
ordeal. I finally had to take the screw that came with my directional gyro
to a machine shop to see if they could decipher what it actually was.
What they told me is that it is a metric screw, with a standard thread
pattern, or 3mm on the outside diameter with a 40 for the thread. OK fine.
No such animal exists in any of their experience, but a 5-40 or a 6-40 are
both very close, with the 6 40 being closer mathematically.
I have found someone who maybe carries a 6-40 in the length I need but it is
a challenge.
Who would ever have thought this would be so difficult. When I called the
manufacturer of the instrument they told me they didn't know the screw size
but said they would send 4 more that were a little longer. I'm not holding
my breath.
Thanks for all of the help, it is appreciated.
Steve
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Gimli Glider |
| From: | Grant Corriveau <grantC(at)total.net> |
on 7/22/02 6:12 PM, Doug Waer at dwaer(at)yahoo.com wrote:
>
> I learned about the Gimli at work when somebody asked if the RAT had every
> deployed on an airliner. The RAT provides enough hydraulic pressure via a
> prop-driven pump to drive the control surfaces in the unlikely event that the
> engines quit. Quite a story...
As I recall, the aircraft was not only being controlled via the RAT
hydraulics, but also had only minimal electrics - so none of the nice
'glass' instruments were working. Apparently Capt. Bob Pearson was using
the VSI from the cabin pressurization system to determine his rate of
descent -- after the cabin had depressurized (another side effect when both
engines fail).
I'd flown privately into Gimli several times in the year before this
incident - it has two parallel runways - one of which has been converted
into a dragstrip. The black ashphalt of the dragstrip shows up from miles
and miles away, whereas the washed out gray pavement of the serviceble
runway, is hard to see until you're almost there. Consequently, they landed
on the dragstrip and the center-rail caught the nose gear of the B767,
causing it to collapse. Too bad 'cause otherwise there'd have been no
damage at all.
Along with the more recent landing of the Air Transat Airbus A330 in the
Azores(?) enroute across the Atlantic, you begin to think there's something
going on with Canadian airlines, fuel and glider landings!!!??? Wots up?
Where's the third one (if you know the old saying - never two but three...
;-)
Grant
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Randy L. Thwing" <n4546v(at)mindspring.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Screws, Argh................. |
Steve:
I Would love to know how your "Machinists" determined the OD from your
internally tapped thread in your instrument. Most production threading is
not right on the money, so their deduction that it is metric diameter with a
UN (Unified National, Fine or Course) thread is a real stretch. I have
thread charts from "Machinery's Handbook" in front of me. The outside
(major) diameter of a:
No. 4 = .112"
No. 5 = .125"
No. 6 = .138"
In metric 3mm = .11811"
Let's assume we are all taking the same drugs and agree it truly is a
"3mm x 40 tpi (threads per inch)", then the 4-40 screw, being slightly
undersize, but with the same thread pitch would readily screw into your
instrument. But you said you had 4-40's to try at the "hardware store", you
know, the one where the clerk guaranteed you that there was no such thing as
a No 5'! So if you tried their 4-40's and they wouldn't work, obviously the
holes are not 3 mm, or the smaller No. 4 would have screwed in, You also had
a No. 6 to try, were they too big? I'm still betting it's a 5-40. If you
still can't find one locally (in Phoenix?) I can mail you a screw from my
inventory to check your threads. It is not the screw you need, it is an
example 5-40 screw for thread checking. Another Lister advised checking
hobby shops for 5-40 as a readily available screw size. From the charts: a
4-40 is a course thread, a 5-40 is a course thread, a 6-40 is a Fine thread.
This has been fun, keeps One from real work!
Regards,
Randy L. Thwing, Las Vegas, 701 plans, CNC machine tapped 140, 4-40 holes
at work today!
Subject: Zenith-List: Screws, Argh.................
>
> Hi list,
>
> I my quest to find the right screw I never thought this would be such an
> ordeal. I finally had to take the screw that came with my directional
gyro
> to a machine shop to see if they could decipher what it actually was.
>
> What they told me is that it is a metric screw, with a standard thread
> pattern, or 3mm on the outside diameter with a 40 for the thread. OK
fine.
> No such animal exists in any of their experience, but a 5-40 or a 6-40 are
> both very close, with the 6 40 being closer mathematically.
>
> I have found someone who maybe carries a 6-40 in the length I need but it
is
> a challenge.
>When I called the
> manufacturer of the instrument they told me they didn't know the screw
size
Steve
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Philip Polstra" <ppolstra(at)mindspring.com> |
| Subject: | Foam and my radiator |
I made a couple tweaks to my Stratus-powered HDS today. I tried to seal off
the rear of the radiator, but wasn't convinced that the way I had done so
wasn't creating lots of drag. I shot some of that expanding foam in that
huge crack between the radiator and the rear piece and did some flying.
Despite the 90 degree heat, I was able to fly around at 1-2k AGL at a fairly
high-power cruise (4800 rpm, 125 mph) without any overheating.
I also figured out that my carbs were not in sync near full throttle because
one of the springs wasn't pulling the cable tight near the very end. I cut
off the hook on the end of the spring and bent another hook. It seems to be
working much better now.
I also bumped my canopy hard enough to knock the it out of the rear
semi-circle. It was wedged between the nylon piece and the hook. I landed
the plane and when I went to fix it, it had already sorted itself out.
Philip A. Polstra
Certified Flight Instructor - Airplane Single Engine; Instrument Airplane
Ground Instructor - Advanced; Instrument
NAFI Instructor
http://www.philsflying.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Tim & Diane Shankland <tshank(at)megsinet.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Canopy materials |
Mark,
There should be two 1/8 inch plates 250 mm X 45 mm for where the latch is mounted.
The 815 and 820 refer to the same piece of tubing but they won't be that long.
The
latches are made by the SPAE-NAUR company, Toronto. They can be purchased from
the
Windsor Factory Supply
519-966-2202. The part numbers are 099-031 for the left hand one and 099-030 for
the
right hand one. They cost $36.40 Canadian each. There is a part that has to be
cut
off and then an extension welded on. The cables for the latch release were purchased
at a local bike shop, they come in bulk and are cut to size. I used my own design
for the knobs to incorporate a
lock so I can't help you there. I just finished installing he gas spring on the
left
side. It is a little tight getting the getting it all in but I did. One error in
the
drawing is the lower bracket for the gas spring. The total width is shown as 14
mm
yet the vertical part is 12 mm from one side and 5 mm from the other plus it has
thickness( maybe negative thickness), so be careful building form these drawings.
When I get back from Osh. I should be able to do the final assembly and then put
it
up in the attic with the wings.
Tim Shankland
mawood(at)zoo.uvm.edu wrote:
>
> > most of the parts would probably not fit the
> >HD anyway. You have noticed the mix of dimensions on the drawings and as
> >I have previously mentioned when you go to build you will find
> >dimensions missing. I can provide more details as to dimensions when I
> >finish fitting the canopy. Hopefully this weekend. I will then be
> >disassembling it to install the gas springs and I will document the
> >parts I fabricated.
> >
> >Tim
>
> Tim and others.
>
> I am trying to order the parts for the XL canopy for my HD. I have the drawings
> from the web site and the material list from ZAC web site but part # 6-C-2-3
has
> me scratching my head. ZAC is of no help this week as they are at OSH.
>
> As I see it, to build 6C2-3 I will need;
> 820 mm sq steel tube 3/4 X 3/4 times 2
> 105 mm sq steel tube 3/4 X 3/4 times 2
> side plate 330mm X 21mm X 1/8in times 2
> top plate 330mm X 17mm X 1/8in times 2
> 4130 steel .080in plate 260mm X 45mm times 2
> 1/8in steel plate 67mm X 15mm times 2
> anyone have info on the latch casing??
> For Steel 7/8 tube, I assume that the Al tube for 6C3-1 will slide inside this.
> Did I miss anything??
>
> Can I assume that the 815mm of sq tube shown on the upper right drawing of page
> 6C2 is the same tube listed as 820mm sq tube on the third drawing down on the
> right side of page 6C2
>
> Can I assume that 6C2-2 is made of .080 steel with the 30mm X 18mm ear made of
> 1/8in steel?
>
> Also anyone see a problem with going with .040 Al for the parts that are listed
> as .032?
>
> Thanks everyone.
>
> Mark Wood
> N221MW 601HD with O-200
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | John Montgomery <1arm(at)rogers.com> |
| Subject: | developed length, bend radius |
I have a bunch of parts for the stabilizer cut out to hopefully bend
correctly on a friend's brake.
Of course now that I have my spar templates, etc cut out I am getting
paranoid that I have done them wrong. I have assumed that the developed
length was the length before the bend - seems to make sense to me since
this is detailed on the drawings and gives me a dimension to use when
cutting out parts...
I thought I has better double check this, but cannot see this point
clarified in the archives. Could someone tell me if I am going about
this wrong?
Also, any pointers on how to place my spar templates on the brake for
bending, etc. would be appreciated.
thanks,
John M.
601XL scratch building
- rudder pretty well done, starting stabilizer, long way to go
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Michel Therrien <mtherr(at)yahoo.com> |
| Subject: | Re: developed length, bend radius |
Yes the dl is the lenght before bending the part and
if you noticed, it is shorter than the sum of all side
dimensions.
The actual dl will depend on the actual bend radius
you achieve and as a result, I found the plans
specified dl to be an approximation. But in anyway,
before bending any part, make sure to bend "test
pieces" until satisfied. For each test, take note of
how you achieved the bend so you can repeat the
process for the actual part. You'll most likely find a
way to use your pre-cut parts.
Oh... on some parts, the dl was simply erroneous (I
build a CH601-HD).
Michel
--- John Montgomery <1arm(at)rogers.com> wrote:
> <1arm(at)rogers.com>
>
> I have a bunch of parts for the stabilizer cut out
> to hopefully bend
> correctly on a friend's brake.
>
> Of course now that I have my spar templates, etc cut
> out I am getting
> paranoid that I have done them wrong. I have
> assumed that the developed
> length was the length before the bend - seems to
> make sense to me since
> this is detailed on the drawings and gives me a
> dimension to use when
> cutting out parts...
>
> I thought I has better double check this, but cannot
> see this point
> clarified in the archives. Could someone tell me if
> I am going about
> this wrong?
>
> Also, any pointers on how to place my spar templates
> on the brake for
> bending, etc. would be appreciated.
>
> thanks,
>
> John M.
> 601XL scratch building
> - rudder pretty well done, starting stabilizer, long
> way to go
>
>
>
> Contributions of
> any other form
>
> latest messages.
> other List members.
>
> http://www.matronics.com/subscription
> http://www.matronics.com/photoshare
> http://www.matronics.com/search
> http://www.matronics.com/archives
> http://www.matronics.com/emaillists
>
>
>
>
>
=====
----------------------------
Michel Therrien CH601-HD
http://pages.infinit.net/mthobby
http://mthobby.pcperfect.com/ch601
http://www.zenithair.com/bldrlist/profiles/mthobby
http://health.yahoo.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Weston, Jim" <Jim.Weston(at)delta.com> |
| Subject: | Foam and my radiator |
Philip,
I have done some similar work on the radiator to help control the temp. The
radiator installation provided by Zenith is marginal at best. I also
installed neoprene rubber seals along the edges, between the radiator and
the lower L-angle that runs the length of the radiator.
Have you tried the high temp. exhaust wrap for the muffler and header pipes?
This also cools the air entering the radiator, since the muffler is right in
front of the radiator. Aircraft Spruce sells the wrap.
Jim Weston
-----Original Message-----
From: Philip Polstra [mailto:ppolstra(at)mindspring.com]
Subject: Zenith-List: Foam and my radiator
I made a couple tweaks to my Stratus-powered HDS today. I tried to seal off
the rear of the radiator, but wasn't convinced that the way I had done so
wasn't creating lots of drag. I shot some of that expanding foam in that
huge crack between the radiator and the rear piece and did some flying.
Despite the 90 degree heat, I was able to fly around at 1-2k AGL at a fairly
high-power cruise (4800 rpm, 125 mph) without any overheating.
I also figured out that my carbs were not in sync near full throttle because
one of the springs wasn't pulling the cable tight near the very end. I cut
off the hook on the end of the spring and bent another hook. It seems to be
working much better now.
I also bumped my canopy hard enough to knock the it out of the rear
semi-circle. It was wedged between the nylon piece and the hook. I landed
the plane and when I went to fix it, it had already sorted itself out.
Philip A. Polstra
Certified Flight Instructor - Airplane Single Engine; Instrument Airplane
Ground Instructor - Advanced; Instrument
NAFI Instructor
http://www.philsflying.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | developed length, bend radius |
| From: | "Kafka, Jeff" <JKafka(at)trojanuv.com> |
I did a lot of research into this topic before I got started on my project this
year. The developed length in the plans is the pre-bend dimension you use to
cut out the parts. The location of the bend lines, sight lines etc. you may
need do not appear to be in the plan and may have to be calculated.
The book "Aircraft Sheet Metal" available from ACS is very helpful on this topic.
Jeff Kafka
601XL Plans on order, Rudder done.
I have assumed that the developed
length was the length before the bend - seems to make sense to me since
this is detailed on the drawings and gives me a dimension to use when
cutting out parts...
John M.
601XL scratch building
- rudder pretty well done, starting stabilizer, long way to go
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Foam and my radiator |
In a message dated 7/22/02 11:58:46 PM Pacific Daylight Time,
zenith-list-digest(at)matronics.com writes:
<<
I made a couple tweaks to my Stratus-powered HDS today. I tried to seal off
the rear of the radiator, but wasn't convinced that the way I had done so
wasn't creating lots of drag. I shot some of that expanding foam in that
huge crack between the radiator and the rear piece and did some flying.
Despite the 90 degree heat, I was able to fly around at 1-2k AGL at a fairly
high-power cruise (4800 rpm, 125 mph) without any overheating.
>>
Phil,
Thanks for your post. I did seal off the rear of my radiator last year by
fabricating a piece of .025 and fastening in place. I was amazed that doing
so reduced my speed by about 1 or 2 mph at cruise, so it did create a little
more drag.
If you'll recall, about two years ago, I experienced a valve guide failure
during flight in my Stratus-powered 601-HDS. The engine never overheated but
many others attributed this to overheating. Since then, I have been overly
cautious about how fast I run the engine and am constantly looking at the
engine temps during each flight.
My questions are: 1) What are your engine temps that you consider "normal"
during cruise and climbs? 2) What are your props pitched at?
My props are pitched at 15.5 degrees, so at full throttle my engine revs at
about 4700 rpms and the airspeed tops off at 120 mph. I probably should
reduce my pitch to about 14 degrees. Also, during the hot summer days, I
cruise a little slower to keep the engine temps no higher than 210 degrees
(cruise at 3800 rpms at 90 mph - real slow). During cooler days (less than
70 degrees), my engine temps averages 195 degrees at 3800 rpm, but averages
around 210 on hot days. I rarely go higher than about 4200 rpm, or 105 mph.
I'm going to try to seal the gaps on the sides of the radiator and the
brackets to see if I can get better temps results. Have you tried that?
Finally, I drew plans to use a cabin heater radiator to help with dissipating
more heat to the outside and be switched to serve as a cabin heater as well.
I'll let everyone know how this works when I get this done hopefully soon...
Thanks, and fly safe!
Dick (601-HDS, Stratus, too hot to fly!)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "The Meiste's" <meiste(at)essex1.com> |
All this talk about cooling the Stratus has me wondering about my
installation. A few months ago I installed my radiator, standard belly ZAC
style. After running my engine I've found several leaks around my hose
connections (I probably lost a cup of coolant during my debugging process).
I now have them all stopped, but I'm curious if I have to remove my radiator
again to refill it & remove the air as we had to do before installing the
radiator? Or will the air that got into the system by the leaks be purged
and replaced by the coolant in the overflow tank? I haven't flown the plane
yet, and don't want to see the water temp go to max do to a lack of coolant
when I do.
Thanks for any words of advice on this,
Kelly Meiste
601 HD Stratus (99.99% complete)
PS. While working on my plane last Sunday I had a few guest stop in (fly in)
to check out my nearly completed 601. It was the ZAC team on their way to
OSH! Who could ask for more! They arrived with 5 planes (601XL, 601HDS, 640,
701, & 801). Nick and Roger spent at least an hour with me! Poor ol Nick was
kind enough to climb under, over, & inside my plane checking it out (this
was a 95+ degree day). That was pretty good of him, especially after he just
finished a 2 hour flight in a hot 601. And as they left they all
complemented me on the fine job I did on the plane! I thought I should pinch
myself to see if I was dreaming, luckily my hanger has a WIDE door, so I was
still able to get my head through it after they left.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | AWilson62(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Headset Jack location |
I also did this. It's great, no cords running down and around my legs across
the floor.
Alan
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Mark Snelling" <mark_927(at)msn.com> |
| Subject: | Rudder Skin and Tail Light |
I'm ready to rivet on the rudder skins. But I plan to install a tail light
when that step comes. Will riveting on the rudder skins prevent me or make
it difficult to install the tail lighting?
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bryan Martin <bryanmmartin(at)comcast.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Rudder Skin and Tail Light |
>
>
> I'm ready to rivet on the rudder skins. But I plan to install a tail light
> when that step comes. Will riveting on the rudder skins prevent me or make
> it difficult to install the tail lighting?
>
The flange on the fiberglass tail light bracket I received with my kit was
very rough looking so I decided to install it with the flange on the inside
of the rudder out of sight. This made a real neat looking installation. I
suggest that you leave at least one side of the rudder open until you
install your tail light. This will also make it easier to clear out the
metal shavings from cutting out for the light.
--
Bryan Martin
N61BM, CH 601 XL, Stratus Subaru.
Wings, tail, fuselage and canopy done, wheels and tail mounted.
Working on instrument panel and electrical.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | ZodiacXL2B(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Rudder straight?? |
Well, I have been off line for a while, but have a question about my rudder.
I have scratch-built an XL rudder, and when you look at it from behind the
trailing edge has a slight bow to it. How is this going to effect my
performance?? Can I compensate with trim?
Dwayne Eckley
601XL - scratch building sheet metal parts
Rudder??, ribs, & right wing spar complete.
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Radiator Talk |
Kelly
Congrats on your getting the Zenair team to visit and admire your work. Like
you, my smile would indeed be as wide as my hangar door if I got such as an
honor.
If you only lost a cup of coolant during your test, you mostly likely did not
get any air in your cooling system because the coolant, one flowing, is under
pressure. If the pressure remains or gets low because of the leak, the
system would replace the lost coolant from the overflow bottle.
Before your next test, check if you need to add more coolant into the
pressure bottle. After your test and after letting the engine cool down,
check the level again.
Once the level stabilized, you pretty much have removed just about all the
air bubbles that might remain in the system.
Hope this helps...
Dick (601-HDS, Stratus)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "George Fetzer" <george.f(at)worldnet.att.net> |
I have been flying the Soob powered HDS for a year in SW Florida heat
with no coolant problems (oil temp too high, but that's another story).
I closed off the rear of radiator with a metal plate and used foam
weatherstrip on the sides. I even raised the front of the radiator 1
1/4 inch from the stock position and saw no increase in water temp.
This has me convinced the radiator is adequately sized for the engine
and efficiency is determined by the volume of air forced through the
core by the sealing measures I have taken. As for the purging of air,
my experience (30 years of automotive and a lot less of aviation) has
been that a couple heat cycles with the proper radiator cap (one with
both pressure and vacuum valving) will usuqall purge almost all the air
from the system. The exceptions to this are a couple vehicles where the
cap is not the highest point in the system. I have placed my cap at the
highest point and ran a few heat/cool cycles before the first flight.
Temp never ran over 220 F with 50% glycol coolant and a 13# cap. Oil
temp, on the other hand is running close to 250 and is being dealt with
by the addition of an oil cooler. Coolant leaks are quite normal after
the installation of new hoses used with SS worm gear clamps. A 10 hour
retorquing of the clamps should be sufficient. This could be eliminated
through the use of the constant tension spring clamps that the
manufacturers are now using. Hope this long-winded post was some help.
George Fetzer
N601G 601HDS 90 hrs
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-zenith-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-zenith-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of The
Meiste's
Subject: Zenith-List: Radiator talk
All this talk about cooling the Stratus has me wondering about my
installation. A few months ago I installed my radiator, standard belly
ZAC
style. After running my engine I've found several leaks around my hose
connections (I probably lost a cup of coolant during my debugging
process).
I now have them all stopped, but I'm curious if I have to remove my
radiator
again to refill it & remove the air as we had to do before installing
the
radiator? Or will the air that got into the system by the leaks be
purged
and replaced by the coolant in the overflow tank? I haven't flown the
plane
yet, and don't want to see the water temp go to max do to a lack of
coolant
when I do.
Thanks for any words of advice on this,
Kelly Meiste
601 HD Stratus (99.99% complete)
PS. While working on my plane last Sunday I had a few guest stop in (fly
in)
to check out my nearly completed 601. It was the ZAC team on their way
to
OSH! Who could ask for more! They arrived with 5 planes (601XL, 601HDS,
640,
701, & 801). Nick and Roger spent at least an hour with me! Poor ol Nick
was
kind enough to climb under, over, & inside my plane checking it out
(this
was a 95+ degree day). That was pretty good of him, especially after he
just
finished a 2 hour flight in a hot 601. And as they left they all
complemented me on the fine job I did on the plane! I thought I should
pinch
myself to see if I was dreaming, luckily my hanger has a WIDE door, so I
was
still able to get my head through it after they left.
=
=
=
=
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Johann G." <johann-g(at)tal.is> |
| Subject: | Flaperon o/b plate |
Hello list members,
I need some advise from you 701 builders regarding 4th edition drawings.
I am working on the Flaperons, and it seems that there is an error in
the new edition drawings.
On page 7-A-2 and the Rear Splice Plate.
The figure from rear of part to the location of the AN3-3A bolt is 40mm
in the new drawings, but on the 3rd edition drawings, the figure is 60
mm.
It looks to be the correct figure, according to the drawing of the part.
Can anyone help me with this problem an confirm that the new drawing is
incorrect with 40mm.
Best regards from Iceland.
Johann G.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Terry Rogers" <terryr(at)xtra.co.nz> |
Hi George, I am just at that stage with my soob/701, and am considering
which radiator to use and where to place it. Have you used the volks
radiator? What model is it, would it measure about 330mm x 770mm ? Have you
put it under the seats with front edge down? what does your scoop look like?
thanks, TerryR...NZ
I have been flying the Soob powered HDS for a year in SW Florida heat
with no coolant problems (oil temp too high, but that's another story).
I closed off the rear of radiator with a metal plate and used foam
weatherstrip on the sides. I even raised the front of the radiator 1
1/4 inch from the stock position and saw no increase in water temp.
This has me convinced the radiator is adequately sized for the engine
and efficiency is determined by the volume of air forced through the
core by the sealing measures I have taken.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Sam Cajun" <sam.caj(at)worldnet.att.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Flaperon o/b plate |
Page 6 of
http://www.zenithair.com/stolch701/data/7-flaperons-2.pdf
indicates the old plans are correct (60mm) since the hole is off
set from center to the front in the photo.
Sam
>some advise from you 701 builders regarding 4th edition
drawings.
> I am working on the Flaperons, and it seems that there is an
error in
> the new edition drawings.
> On page 7-A-2 and the Rear Splice Plate.
> The figure from rear of part to the location of the AN3-3A bolt
is 40mm
> in the new drawings, but on the 3rd edition drawings, the
figure is 60
> mm.
> It looks to be the correct figure, according to the drawing of
the part.
> Can anyone help me with this problem an confirm that the new
drawing is
> incorrect with 40mm.
>
> Best regards from Iceland.
>
> Johann G.
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | AWilson62(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Radiator talk |
Hey, what is the ideal range for oil temp anyway?
Alan
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Ed" <orion(at)silcom.com> |
| Subject: | Another one airborne... |
After much frustration in the last month or so, at 0800 this morning
N447WB (601HDS) got her feet off the ground for the first time. Due to
the restriction of one take-off applied by the FAA...it was classed as a
high speed taxy only...but test pilot and myself aboard we lifted off
and flew in ground effect the length of the runway, landed then turned
and repeated the flight back the other way in calm conditions.
Aircraft behaved perfectly.
Haven't been able to get the grin off my face all day.
Ed (601HDS/Lyc0-235)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jonathan J. Kim" <jkflyer(at)adelphia.net> |
| Subject: | Another one airborne... |
Congratulations!!! Ed.
Please post some performance data when you get them.
It would be interesting to see what the 601 HDS with Lycoming O-235 can do.
- Jonathan Kim
Fullerton, CA
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-zenith-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-zenith-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of Ed
Subject: Zenith-List: Another one airborne...
After much frustration in the last month or so, at 0800 this morning
N447WB (601HDS) got her feet off the ground for the first time. Due to
the restriction of one take-off applied by the FAA...it was classed as a
high speed taxy only...but test pilot and myself aboard we lifted off
and flew in ground effect the length of the runway, landed then turned
and repeated the flight back the other way in calm conditions.
Aircraft behaved perfectly.
Haven't been able to get the grin off my face all day.
Ed (601HDS/Lyc0-235)
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Radiator talk |
| From: | Grant Corriveau <grantC(at)total.net> |
on 7/25/02 10:09 PM, AWilson62(at)aol.com at AWilson62(at)aol.com wrote:
>
> Hey, what is the ideal range for oil temp anyway?
> Alan
A mechanic on our airfield told me 200 would be good -- 180 even better.
Mine is running between 220 - 250, while my radiator is steady at 190 - 200.
My radiator and oil temps hover about 200F on the ground with little or no
head-wind and after about 35 minutes there is no tendancy at all to keep
rising, so this part is very good (measured on a 28C/82F day).
I'm adding more cowling exhaust vents to get more airflow under the hood in
flight. I'd like to hear more reports from fliers regarding their water/oil
temps and what measures they've found to be most helpful. This is obviously
an ongoing challenge once we get the airframe flying.
--
Grant Corriveau
Montreal
Zodiac 601hds/CAM100
C-GHTF
www.theWingStayedON.ca
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Hal Rozema <hartist1(at)cox.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Flaperon o/b plate |
Ask Nick or Sebastien at ZAC.
"Johann G." wrote:
>
> Hello list members,
>
> I need some advise from you 701 builders regarding 4th edition drawings.
> I am working on the Flaperons, and it seems that there is an error in
> the new edition drawings.
> On page 7-A-2 and the Rear Splice Plate.
> The figure from rear of part to the location of the AN3-3A bolt is 40mm
> in the new drawings, but on the 3rd edition drawings, the figure is 60
> mm.
> It looks to be the correct figure, according to the drawing of the part.
> Can anyone help me with this problem an confirm that the new drawing is
> incorrect with 40mm.
>
> Best regards from Iceland.
>
> Johann G.
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Rick Campbell <rcampbell(at)me.vccs.edu> |
| Subject: | 801 Rear Fuselage |
Hello all,
While I have monitored the list for over a year this is my first post
to the group. I have a question about the assembly of the rear
fuselage of the CH-801; When installing the side channels, do the
window gussets go behind the channel or do they go in between
the skin and the channel? I have the new fuselage manual but it does
not make this clear.
Oh, one other thing. I have been building by the componet
kits, with the fuselage kit I did not receive the hardware
(nuts & bolts) to attach the rudder hinges to the fuselage.
Do these come in another componet kit (controls)?
Any help would be appreciated,
Rick Campbell
Almost 700 hours down!
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Phil Maxson" <pmaxpmax(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | Re: 801 Rear Fuselage |
All the nuts, bolts, turnbuckles, washers, etc. for my XL were shipped in
the controls kit. Prior to ordering that kit, I just drilled the holes for
the bolts with smaller holes and clecoed them.
Phil Maxson
601XL, Working on Flap Controls
>Oh, one other thing. I have been building by the componet
>kits, with the fuselage kit I did not receive the hardware
> (nuts & bolts) to attach the rudder hinges to the fuselage.
>Do these come in another componet kit (controls)?
http://www.hotmail.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "George Fetzer" <george.f(at)worldnet.att.net> |
> Hey, what is the ideal range for oil temp anyway?
> Alan
>A mechanic on our airfield told me 200 would be good -- 180 even
better.
>Mine is running between 220 and 250, while my radiator is steady at 190
- >200F.
These numbers are also true for my HDS with EA81.
I read somewhere that, from a purely scientific point of view, oil at
180F has an unlimited life and for each 10 degree rise that life is
reduced by some factor. The water that accumulates in the crankcase
would best be removed by elevated temperatures, so 200-220F would
accomplish this while still giving some reasonable service life. I am
in agreement with any mechanic who wants to keep oil temps low on an
air-cooled engine, but how about a water-cooled installation? What
happens at elevated temperatures? My contact at XXX Oil Co. says
250-280F is max. After that the additives break down rapidly. A recent
certification test in the lab had a 3.8L Chevy running at 3600RPM (80
MPH) for 80 hours at 320 - 330F. (but he wouldn't recommend this for the
real world). He obviously doesn't ever hear the word airplane from my
mouth. Has anyone submitted a sample for oil analysis? Seems like the
scientist types could tell how much life is left in our oil.
George Fetzer N601G
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "George Fetzer" <george.f(at)worldnet.att.net> |
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-zenith-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-zenith-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Terry
Rogers
Subject: RE: Zenith-List: Radiator talk
>Hi George, I am just at that stage with my soob/701, and am
considering
>which radiator to use and where to place it. Have you used the volks
>radiator?
Yes, 1985 Rabbit Diesel radiator has both hose connections (1 1/4") at
one end tank to simplify plumbing. It is a 2 row core, so it has a good
surface area. It also has a sensor port you'll need to plug. I used the
fan switch that the VW uses. It's a big metric thread with a gasket and
I just couldn't find a cheaper and lighter way to do it. I used
straight 1 1/4" hose where possible and found a couple of curved hoses
at my auto parts store to make the bends. Where I needed a 90 degree
bend, I used copper elbows (heavy, but I haven't found a suitable
replacement yet). I saw a gyro installation at Sun-n-Fun that used
plastic elbows, but I am not ready to try that yet.
>What model is it, would it measure about 330mm x 770mm ?
Look for Modine 1R938 (about $150 US) measures about 31" x 13" (sorry,
left my metric ruler at the hanger)
>Have you put it under the seats with front edge down?
Yes, front edge was down about 4 inches, but I found it works as well at
a 3" drop. I think the key is sealing the sides and rear well to force
all air flow through the core.
>what does your scoop look like?
No scoop, just side plates and a rear cover plate. I don't know if the
air flow comes off the bottom of cowling or if some of the air comes out
of the cowling discharge (which would be heated by the muffler).
I will add, if you plan to fly off sod (with a 701 I would be on sod all
the time) check for debris accumulation between the radiator and
fuselage. The one time I taxied on the grass I picked up enough grass
clippings to feed the horse for a week.
Interested in an oil cooler? I have part numbers.
George Fetzer N601G
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Gary Gower <ggower_99(at)yahoo.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Flaperon o/b plate |
Johann,
I also have the 4th edition, and the plans are
correct:
40 mm from the "top" of the part, 60 mm from the rear.
Could happen that you did not pay enough atention.
We also have to give always a second look to the plans
and drawings... The problem is that the plane is
design so simple that we get overconfident when
"looking" at the plans, instead of "watching" them,
then we make errors.
Saludos
Gary Gower
701 912 S
tail feathers, flaperons, slats and working with the
tanks and wing skins...
Guadalajara, Mexico.
--- "Johann G." wrote:
>
>
> Hello list members,
>
> I need some advise from you 701 builders regarding
> 4th edition drawings.
> I am working on the Flaperons, and it seems that
> there is an error in
> the new edition drawings.
> On page 7-A-2 and the Rear Splice Plate.
> The figure from rear of part to the location of the
> AN3-3A bolt is 40mm
> in the new drawings, but on the 3rd edition
> drawings, the figure is 60
> mm.
> It looks to be the correct figure, according to the
> drawing of the part.
> Can anyone help me with this problem an confirm that
> the new drawing is
> incorrect with 40mm.
>
> Best regards from Iceland.
>
> Johann G.
>
>
>
> Contributions of
> any other form
>
> latest messages.
> other List members.
>
> http://www.matronics.com/subscription
> http://www.matronics.com/photoshare
> http://www.matronics.com/search
> http://www.matronics.com/archives
> http://www.matronics.com/emaillists
>
>
>
>
>
http://health.yahoo.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | <thilo.kind(at)gmx.net> |
Hi folks,
got a problem. I have installed an imported altimeter bought from A/S. The
instrument developed a serious calibration error. If I set the pressure in
the window (by turning the knob) the altimeter reads 2,000' too high. There
must be a way the calibrate the altimeter. How is that done?
Next to the knob is a small bolt. If I remove the bolt, is it possible to
pull out the knob and calibrate the instrument that way (I remember reading
something like that a long time ago)?
Any help is highly appreciated.
Thilo Kind
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Gary Gower <ggower_99(at)yahoo.com> |
| Subject: | Re: 801 Rear Fuselage |
One thing I have done in previous projects (this is my
first aluminun plane) is to use TEMPORAL hardware
bolts with red strings (like the "remove before
flights" signs), just to fit and align everything
while building, then when ready for the final
assembly, (or when the bolts will be covered), I use
the "real" AN bolts. Always keep track of them, dont
forget to change anyone!
This way the bolts & nuts are used only once, this is
important for the nylon inserts in the nuts...
Saludos
Gary Gower
--- Phil Maxson wrote:
>
>
> All the nuts, bolts, turnbuckles, washers, etc. for
> my XL were shipped in
> the controls kit. Prior to ordering that kit, I
> just drilled the holes for
> the bolts with smaller holes and clecoed them.
>
> Phil Maxson
> 601XL, Working on Flap Controls
>
> >Oh, one other thing. I have been building by the
> componet
> >kits, with the fuselage kit I did not receive the
> hardware
> > (nuts & bolts) to attach the rudder hinges to the
> fuselage.
> >Do these come in another componet kit (controls)?
>
>
> http://www.hotmail.com
>
>
>
> Contributions of
> any other form
>
> latest messages.
> other List members.
>
> http://www.matronics.com/subscription
> http://www.matronics.com/photoshare
> http://www.matronics.com/search
> http://www.matronics.com/archives
> http://www.matronics.com/emaillists
>
>
>
>
>
http://health.yahoo.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | John Thompson <rcav8r(at)chorus.net> |
| Subject: | Back from Oshkosh |
I just got back to Oshkosh. Other than one 801, I didn't see any
non-zeith or flypass owned planes. Where are y'all?
Anyways, I'm determined to get started on my 701 now. The Jab. 3300 is
now at the top of my list for engine choices!
John
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: 801 Rear Fuselage |
| From: | Grant Corriveau <grantC(at)total.net> |
on 7/27/02 5:06 PM, Gary Gower at ggower_99(at)yahoo.com wrote:
> This way the bolts & nuts are used only once, this is
> important for the nylon inserts in the nuts...
fwiw The nylon insert nuts can be reused as long as they are tight and not
easy to put on/off with your fingers... check the archives for a long
discussion about the ins and outs of these, as well as 'how many washers can
I put on one bolt to make it fit, etc..'
Happy building,
--
Grant Corriveau
Montreal
Zodiac 601hds/CAM100
C-GHTF
www.theWingStayedON.ca
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Clyde D Ehlers <clydes-shop(at)juno.com> |
HI: Thilo
yes thair is a way to set the altitude yes you screw out that screw but
not all the way and slide it over and then pull out the knob and set
it is tricky to set because the barometric setting needs to be seat at
29.92 and the altitude to zero. the press altitude and present field
elevation when known. Clyde of #CH 25 An Instrument tech for 41 Years
Retired
>
> Hi folks,
>
> got a problem. I have installed an imported altimeter bought from
> A/S. The
> instrument developed a serious calibration error. If I set the
> pressure in
> the window (by turning the knob) the altimeter reads 2,000' too
> high. There
> must be a way the calibrate the altimeter. How is that done?
> Next to the knob is a small bolt. If I remove the bolt, is it
> possible to
> pull out the knob and calibrate the instrument that way (I remember
> reading
> something like that a long time ago)?
>
> Any help is highly appreciated.
>
> Thilo Kind
>
>
>
>
> messages.
>
> ======================
>
>
>
>
>
Yours Truly,
Clyde Ehlers
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "zodiacjeff" <zodiacjeff(at)email.msn.com> |
The EAA may call it AirVenture but for many it will always be Oshkosh. And
for most it will always be about friends and airplanes - with the emphasis
on friends.
This year it was a double treat, first to meet up again with Zodie builders
Fred Hulen and Bob "Ace" Wiley, and topped with introducing Aussie HDS
builder Barry Mayne and his friend Iian Douglas to their first Oshkosh
experience. Fred and I had "planted" the idea of a visit long ago and Barry
took the bait. I'll let it to Barry to tell of his view of the 50th EAA
Convention.
The ZAC bunch were in the north exhibit area in their usual location. Got
to talk with Seb, Nick, Roger and Chris for a few minutes and then left them
to their task of answering questions for potential buyers. They had two
701's, an 801, the XL demonstrator, and the 640. Walking by the site the
next day saw a 2000 with the blue/yellow 701 having been moved to the
ultralight area.
Rows 22 and 23 in the Homebuilt Show area always have the Zenith products.
The Flypass 801 was there Monday and Tuesday with four 601's: Dennis Carley
in a very nice white HD (detailed pixs can be seen on Michel Therrin's
site), Cleon Maxwell in an HD with his own forward opening canopy design (he
has posted pixs to the matronics file), Stan Challgren flew from CO to
Mexico and then headed north with the ZAC crew in his Jabiru 3300 powered
HDS, and Bill Nichelson in his HDS/3300 "Casual Passion." Someone said
another 601 was there for less than a day.
There is nothing "casual" about Bill's a/c, with detailing everywhere.
Self-designed double-cam forward opening canopy, wonderfully slick yet
hidden latching system, homemade NACA vents with operating doors that close
flush, a homebuilt metal cowling that looked so good the factory should
adopt it RIGHT NOW...the list goes on. A truly impressive piece of
workmanship. All of the Zodiacs present reflected the involvement of their
builders and the fun they were having in flying them.
It's very, very possible that other ZAC a/c were there but we couldn't get
everywhere.
Met up with builders Dave Alberti and Wayne Beattie (Dave will fly soon) at
the show and then talked with 801 builder Phil Owens at the Jabiru BB&CR.
(Beer, bratwurst, and corn roast - after all, it is Wisconsin). Phil seems
very pleased with using latex paint to finish his 801, maybe when finished
he'll detail things for the list.
Airshows were the typical OSH usual - great performers, lots of acro,
warbirds by the dozens, and announcers that never shut up. Sean Tucker is
always a crowd favorite and Manfred Radius' sailplane routine added some
variety. The weekend shows have a longer warbird segment.
The EFIS/Compac type units seemed to draw crowds at every booth that had
some variety of them to sell. I figure that if I wait four years the size
will double and the price will be half - hey, I can dream!
The Garmin GPSMAP 196 had guys five to six deep around demonstrations. Show
prices hovered near $869 (retail $1049) and you could get it shipped home
free without taxes...so, "Honey, I just saved us almost $230." It has so
many features that I don't know if I can remember how to access/use them
all.
EAA, AOPA, AvWeb, all have sites that will tell you far more. Get on the
Garmin site for 196 info.
And one more thing, Fred and I WILL be there in '03 with our Zodie Rockets -
right Fred...
regards jeff
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Richard Rourke" <danarourke(at)msn.com> |
Oshkosh
To Jeff's informative report, let me add:
1) I did not find, either, this year, HD or HDS to see at the Zenith station,
but of course the Heintz family could again refer folks to the field. Still,
it says something about their priorities with retard to new customers.
2) A sample prop and floats were shown from Skyshop - a marketing agent for Czech Aircraft Works in the US (www.skyshops.org) (but separated for the usual reasons, I suppose). Props, from "Woodcomp" - a combination of two outfits including Kremen - include adjustable models (some, in flight) but I didn't discover if any of these apply to Zenith models. Both builder assistance programs (seven days; one is flown to Czech Republic and the completed craft sent to the US for 51% approval) and 100% planes are offered. This info from a pamphlet offered off to the side from the tables.
________________________________________________________________________________
Hi List,
To the lister who suggested 5-40 as the right screw to fix my problem I
humbly bow and extol "I'm not worthy!" That screw did the job although it
was very difficult to find, the proper head type was not available at hobby
stores and I ended up at an industrial fastener comapny. And even though I
now have the proper size and thread pattern the proper length is still not
for sure determined. The longest this comapny stocked was 3/4 inch, and I
think I need 1" which would be a special order. I should know within a day or
so, but as with so many other aspects of this project, one success allmost
always breeds another challenge. I now have to file out a notch for my push
to cage nob. File a litle, trial fit, file a little more, etc. It's always
something!
What an experience! Thanks again for the help list!
Steve (moving along again) Freeman
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Carlos Sa <wings1(at)videotron.ca> |
Hello, folks
Three years after starting this project (less 12 months in
"hibernation"), I found an 8' bending brake (a must for scratch
building).
And this at a kit manufacturer 100' away from the airport I fly from!
Anyway, I spent all day Thursday in their shop. A couple of hours were
wasted trying to figure how to get the 1/8" bend radius.
I new people usually bend and leave in place a bunch of fillers, but
working with more than one filler proved to be not feasible:
the fillers would not stay in place and the tool would not clamp (or
would take a lot of strength to do it).
The only person that uses it in that shop (it's a small operation, as -
I believe - most kit planes manufacturers), told me he uses a single
filler of .020".
Knowing the 1/8" radius rule is a simplification, I made a filler .040"
thick and bent as many parts as I could - until a splitting headache and
a couple of bad results suggested it was time to pack and go home.
At home, I measured the radius in the parts I made by dropping a drill
bit inside the curve.
The best fit is a 5/32" bit, or 5/64" radius (.156" diameter, .078"
radius). According to table 4-6 in AC 43.13, this radius should be
adequate for thickness > .032", going up to .064" (for each thickness
the table gives a range for the radius, like 1 to 2 times the
thickness).
The thickest parts I bent are .040".
My conclusion is that all is well, but I sure would rest easier if
someone would drop me a line agreeing (or disagreeing) with the above.
Thanks in advance
Carlos
CH601 HD - one rudder done, 185 parts made - less six rejects from the
bending session.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jari Kaija" <jari.kaija(at)pp.inet.fi> |
> My conclusion is that all is well, but I sure would rest easier if
> someone would drop me a line agreeing (or disagreeing) with the above.
As long as you can't find any cracks everything is fine. In fact.
the "bible for aircraft builders" tolds, that even "0"-radius for
6061-T6 .016 would be suitable. Still, I like to make my all parts
as "I don't believe it". I noticed, 2 times radius against material
thickness works more than good. It's quite funny to bend and test
6061 and __2024__ materials and use magnifier to inspect result...
-Jari Kaija
...the idiot from Finland...
www.project-ch701.net
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Larry C. McFarland" <larrymc(at)qconline.com> |
| Subject: | New engine type? |
List builders,
I think the most interesting new engine offering seen at Oshkosh for
the Zenith, lighter weight birds, was the Raven Redrives
1300 SVS. This 4-cylinder Suzuki engine lay flat with a belt adaptation
2 to1 or 2.26 to 1 reduction and was said to develop 90 hp
on 165 lbs. They beat 912s on cost.
It's a lot simpler than most and had a really thin profile.
This would seem a great engine for the 701s.
Larry McFarland 601hds at macsmachine.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "The Meiste's" <meiste(at)essex1.com> |
List,
Hope everyone is able to find a copy of this months Experimenter
(August). It has a nice article about ZAC, highlighting the new 601 XL.
Nice photos, & four pages of good reading.
Kelly
601 HD (waiting for FAA inspector)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | John Montgomery <1arm(at)rogers.com> |
Great that you found a break to use Carlos - that radius requirement
certainly slows down the less-brave builders (like me).
My bigger problem is not the radius - its getting the bend in the right
place. I have a small 30 inch brake and get a 1/8 radius by using a
piece of stair nosing instead of the zero-radius leaf (or tongue - just
what is the the proper name for this???) that came with the break. I
can get access to larger brakes to do by stabilizer spar but thought I
better master the "art" first with bends on my smaller break first.
I have been experimenting on test pieces and a couple of small parts.
What a pain!! Let's just say my success % is pretty pathetic. I'm
just glad I decided to play with smaller pieces first before I ruined my
much larger stabilizer spars (which are waiting to go on my table).
How do people line their work pieces up in the break? Do you use the
bend allowance, tangent line, sight line method described in the
Bingelis books? Or is the simple method to get a sight line mention in
the Zenith Assembly guide good enough? I have already realized that the
simple rule of thumb just mentioned is not accurate for the two 1/4
radius bends I just did- dohh!!
I have seem many pages refer to mistakes with bending - but they don't
give much detail on typical mistakes - and how to prevent them?
Boy, I wish they did some bending as part of the workshop when I did my
rudder at Flypass.... Methinks it is time to visit some people for some
hands-on instruction!
regards all,
John M.
601XL scratch building
- rudder pretty well done, starting stabilizer, long way to go
Carlos Sa wrote:
>
>
>Hello, folks
>
>Three years after starting this project (less 12 months in
>"hibernation"), I found an 8' bending brake (a must for scratch
>building).
>And this at a kit manufacturer 100' away from the airport I fly from!
>
>Anyway, I spent all day Thursday in their shop. A couple of hours were
>wasted trying to figure how to get the 1/8" bend radius.
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Mark Sandidge" <MSandidge(at)peabodyenergy.com> |
07/29/2002 06:45:58 AM
John, I found the simplest way to get the right measurement is to cut your
pieces oversize, bend, then trim to correct size. I never could get it
right using the formulas.
Mark Sandidge
John Montgomery To: zenith-list(at)matronics.com
<1arm(at)rogers.com> cc:
Sent by: Subject: Re: Zenith-List:
The bends
owner-zenith-list-server@ma
tronics.com
07/28/2002 06:43 PM
Please respond to
zenith-list
Great that you found a break to use Carlos - that radius requirement
certainly slows down the less-brave builders (like me).
My bigger problem is not the radius - its getting the bend in the right
place. I have a small 30 inch brake and get a 1/8 radius by using a
piece of stair nosing instead of the zero-radius leaf (or tongue - just
what is the the proper name for this???) that came with the break. I
can get access to larger brakes to do by stabilizer spar but thought I
better master the "art" first with bends on my smaller break first.
I have been experimenting on test pieces and a couple of small parts.
What a pain!! Let's just say my success % is pretty pathetic. I'm
just glad I decided to play with smaller pieces first before I ruined my
much larger stabilizer spars (which are waiting to go on my table).
How do people line their work pieces up in the break? Do you use the
bend allowance, tangent line, sight line method described in the
Bingelis books? Or is the simple method to get a sight line mention in
the Zenith Assembly guide good enough? I have already realized that the
simple rule of thumb just mentioned is not accurate for the two 1/4
radius bends I just did- dohh!!
I have seem many pages refer to mistakes with bending - but they don't
give much detail on typical mistakes - and how to prevent them?
Boy, I wish they did some bending as part of the workshop when I did my
rudder at Flypass.... Methinks it is time to visit some people for some
hands-on instruction!
regards all,
John M.
601XL scratch building
- rudder pretty well done, starting stabilizer, long way to go
Carlos Sa wrote:
>
>
>Hello, folks
>
>Three years after starting this project (less 12 months in
>"hibernation"), I found an 8' bending brake (a must for scratch
>building).
>And this at a kit manufacturer 100' away from the airport I fly from!
>
>Anyway, I spent all day Thursday in their shop. A couple of hours were
>wasted trying to figure how to get the 1/8" bend radius.
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Carlos Sa <wings1(at)videotron.ca> |
Hi, John
> My bigger problem is not the radius - its getting the bend in the right
> place. I have a small 30 inch brake and get a 1/8 radius by using a
> piece of stair nosing instead of the zero-radius leaf (or tongue - just
> what is the the proper name for this???) that came with the break.
What I do is, for every thickness and for every angle, to prepare a
rectangle 1 to 2 inches wide by 4 to 6 inches long.
I graduate it (across) with parallel lines, 10 mm apart. I then place
this sample on the bending brake and align a chosen reference line (near
the middle) with the brake's clamp (or tongue, or whatever - the part
that holds the sample in place).
After bending it with the desired angle, I can measure the location of
the bend in relation to the placement of the part on the brake and, if
necessary, compensate when I bend the actual part.
Of course, a successful test before committing is advisable.
BTW, if you want a bigger brake (48"), take a look here. I made one like
this, but made it long enough so the rudder spar would fit.
http://www.vansairforce.org/tools/index.shtml
Regards
Carlos
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | alex trent <atrent7(at)cogeco.ca> |
Carlos Sa wrote:
>
> Hi, John
>
> > My bigger problem is not the radius - its getting the bend in the right
> > place. I have a small 30 inch brake and get a 1/8 radius by using a
> > piece of stair nosing instead of the zero-radius leaf (or tongue - just
> > what is the the proper name for this???) that came with the break.
There was an article in, I believe, Kit Planes re: bend set backs. I
scanned and saved it. If anybody wants, I can post it.
It appears to be very accurate for the little I tried.
alex
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | <thilo.kind(at)gmx.net> |
Hi Clyde,
thanks for the tip. I remember from inspecting an old altimeter a long time
ago, that loosening the screw and pulling out the knob will disengage a gear
drving the barometric pressure indicator (or altimeter hands - I don't
remember anymore).
Anyway, I have tried that, but can't get the knob to pull out. Maybe I'm not
doing it right. Your description is not clear do me. What exactly do you
mean by "slide it over"?
Thanks a lot for your help.
Also, thanks to the other folks. I'm hesitating to send the instrument back
to A/S. You might remember, that I relocated to Europe. The service of A/S
in the US was already not the best... Besides, shipping of instruments
accross borders is a pain with customs. Thus, my first option is to get the
altimeter fixed by myself.
Best regards and happy building / happy flying
Thilo Kind
----- Original Message -----
From: "Clyde D Ehlers" <clydes-shop(at)juno.com>
Subject: Re: Zenith-List: Altimeter
>
> HI: Thilo
> yes thair is a way to set the altitude yes you screw out that screw but
> not all the way and slide it over and then pull out the knob and set
> it is tricky to set because the barometric setting needs to be seat at
> 29.92 and the altitude to zero. the press altitude and present field
> elevation when known. Clyde of #CH 25 An Instrument tech for 41 Years
> Retired
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | oswaldo10(at)globo.com |
Alex
I'm interested in the article. Thanx in advance if you can post it.
Oswaldo
Rio de Janeiro - Brazil
'>'... If anybody wants, I can post it.
A busca mais veloz e precisa da internet. Acesse agora: http://www.zoom.com.br.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Wayne Beattie" <wyne.beattie(at)snet.net> |
Nice seeing you again, Jeff.
Boy, does a formation trip to Wisconsin next year sound very tempting.
Wayne
-----Original Message-----
From: zodiacjeff <zodiacjeff(at)email.msn.com>
Date: Saturday, July 27, 2002 11:16 PM
Subject: Zenith-List: OSH 2002
>
>The EAA may call it AirVenture but for many it will always be Oshkosh. And
>for most it will always be about friends and airplanes - with the emphasis
>on friends.
>
>This year it was a double treat, first to meet up again with Zodie builders
>Fred Hulen and Bob "Ace" Wiley, and topped with introducing Aussie HDS
>builder Barry Mayne and his friend Iian Douglas to their first Oshkosh
>experience. Fred and I had "planted" the idea of a visit long ago and
Barry
>took the bait. I'll let it to Barry to tell of his view of the 50th EAA
>Convention.
>
>The ZAC bunch were in the north exhibit area in their usual location. Got
>to talk with Seb, Nick, Roger and Chris for a few minutes and then left
them
>to their task of answering questions for potential buyers. They had two
>701's, an 801, the XL demonstrator, and the 640. Walking by the site the
>next day saw a 2000 with the blue/yellow 701 having been moved to the
>ultralight area.
>
>Rows 22 and 23 in the Homebuilt Show area always have the Zenith products.
>The Flypass 801 was there Monday and Tuesday with four 601's: Dennis Carley
>in a very nice white HD (detailed pixs can be seen on Michel Therrin's
>site), Cleon Maxwell in an HD with his own forward opening canopy design
(he
>has posted pixs to the matronics file), Stan Challgren flew from CO to
>Mexico and then headed north with the ZAC crew in his Jabiru 3300 powered
>HDS, and Bill Nichelson in his HDS/3300 "Casual Passion." Someone said
>another 601 was there for less than a day.
>
>There is nothing "casual" about Bill's a/c, with detailing everywhere.
>Self-designed double-cam forward opening canopy, wonderfully slick yet
>hidden latching system, homemade NACA vents with operating doors that close
>flush, a homebuilt metal cowling that looked so good the factory should
>adopt it RIGHT NOW...the list goes on. A truly impressive piece of
>workmanship. All of the Zodiacs present reflected the involvement of their
>builders and the fun they were having in flying them.
>
>It's very, very possible that other ZAC a/c were there but we couldn't get
>everywhere.
>
>Met up with builders Dave Alberti and Wayne Beattie (Dave will fly soon) at
>the show and then talked with 801 builder Phil Owens at the Jabiru BB&CR.
>(Beer, bratwurst, and corn roast - after all, it is Wisconsin). Phil seems
>very pleased with using latex paint to finish his 801, maybe when finished
>he'll detail things for the list.
>
>Airshows were the typical OSH usual - great performers, lots of acro,
>warbirds by the dozens, and announcers that never shut up. Sean Tucker is
>always a crowd favorite and Manfred Radius' sailplane routine added some
>variety. The weekend shows have a longer warbird segment.
>
>The EFIS/Compac type units seemed to draw crowds at every booth that had
>some variety of them to sell. I figure that if I wait four years the size
>will double and the price will be half - hey, I can dream!
>
>The Garmin GPSMAP 196 had guys five to six deep around demonstrations.
Show
>prices hovered near $869 (retail $1049) and you could get it shipped home
>free without taxes...so, "Honey, I just saved us almost $230." It has so
>many features that I don't know if I can remember how to access/use them
>all.
>
>EAA, AOPA, AvWeb, all have sites that will tell you far more. Get on the
>Garmin site for 196 info.
>
>And one more thing, Fred and I WILL be there in '03 with our Zodie
Rockets -
>right Fred...
>
>regards jeff
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Clyde D Ehlers <clydes-shop(at)juno.com> |
HI: thilo
the screw is in a brass slide that has to move away from the shaft it
has a grove in the shaft. To unlock it. It has to be out of the way of
the grove.
>
> Hi Clyde,
>
> thanks for the tip. I remember from inspecting an old altimeter a
> long time
June 25, 2002 - July 29, 2002
Zenith-Archive.digest.vol-cy