Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 07:09 AM - Re: Bob - AEC70.zip (Robert L. Nuckolls, III)
2. 07:42 AM - Re: How to crimp d-sub pins (Robert L. Nuckolls, III)
3. 07:59 AM - Re: Strobe wiring (Robert L. Nuckolls, III)
4. 08:58 AM - Re: Bob - AEC70.zip (Jon Croke)
5. 10:06 AM - Re: Bob - AEC70.zip (Jim Sower)
6. 10:24 AM - Voltage Regulator .... (Jim Sower)
7. 10:42 AM - Re: Voltage Regulator .... (David Swartzendruber)
8. 12:29 PM - Re: Voltage Regulator .... (Jim Sower)
9. 01:27 PM - Re: Bob - AEC70.zip (John Schroeder)
10. 02:15 PM - Re: Voltage Regulator .... (Robert L. Nuckolls, III)
11. 02:24 PM - Re: Voltage Regulator .... (Robert L. Nuckolls, III)
12. 08:20 PM - Re: Voltage Regulator .... (Jim Sower)
13. 08:20 PM - Mag wiring (Bill Irvine)
14. 08:59 PM - Re: Voltage Regulator .... (Robert L. Nuckolls, III)
15. 09:31 PM - Re: 10157 Jones (Robert L. Nuckolls, III)
Message 1
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| Subject: | Re: Bob - AEC70.zip |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <bob.nuckolls@cox.net>
At 08:50 PM 12/15/2002 -0500, you wrote:
>--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: Jim and Lucy <jpollard@mnsi.net>
>
>
> >The server that this big file is on does not support resumeing if
>the file download is interupted. I have seen this only a few times
>before. Is there any way to turn this feature off . I takes about
>6 or 7 hours to get this file where I live and I have gotten close
>but have not been able to get the whole thing. When the file
>restarts it must restart from Zero. If it is a simple thing to
>do could this be altered.
>( I got the book but often its in the shop and I'm in the house or
>versa visa)
>
>Thanks
>
>Jim Pollard
>Merlin Ont
>28000 kbits/sec internet connection
The slow, cantankerous nature of dial up connection is
why the CD was offered in the first place. As our website
grew, it became increasingly difficult for dial-up folks
to conveniently browse the site.
I posted the CD with no illusions that dial-up connected
users would be any better off than before. Sorry, but it's
the nature of the beast. The server upon which the website
resides belongs to me and my partner (http://www.stirlingengine.com/)
and to keep costs (and administrator time) low, we have not
endeavored to add many gee-whiz features.
I won't discourage them from trying but people should be aware
of a high probability for difficulties when trying to
download the CD via telephone modem
I recall a few odd notes on the list during Matt's fund
raiser wherein the writers declined financial support
for Matt's endeavors. It illustrated a lack of understanding
about just what it takes to put a high volume service up
on the 'net and keep it running reliably. If folks knew
how much uncompensated time Matt has put into the bells
and whistles, not to mention purchasing and maintaining
connectivity and hardware . . . well . . . 'nuf said.
My itty-bitty server in SanDiego is on a very fast
line and it was brand new equipment a year ago. It has
accumulated thousands of hours of zero-down-time
service record. There WILL come a day when the little
fellow is going to burp a puff of smoke . . . I won't
hit on anyone for donations to replace it but I will
continue to support Matt's work generously. His talent
and time invested to support the OBAM community probably
exceeds my own by perhaps 100-fold.
Bob . . .
Message 2
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| Subject: | Re: How to crimp d-sub pins |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <bob.nuckolls@cox.net>
At 06:56 PM 12/15/2002 -0500, you wrote:
>--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Dan O'Brien" <danobrien@cox.net>
>
>I'm starting to wire my radios. I'm looking for a lesson on how to install
>the close-barrel pins that come with the radios using the RCT-3
>crimper. How much wire should be stripped,
just enough for wire to bottom out in back of pin
and not have the insulation touch the pin . . .
> should any insulation go inside
>the barrel, etc.?
no . . .
Bob . . .
Message 3
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| Subject: | Re: Strobe wiring |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <bob.nuckolls@cox.net>
At 11:30 AM 12/15/2002 -0700, you wrote:
>--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Ken Simmons" <ken@truckstop.com>
>
>I'm considering changing from individual strobe supplies to one central
>unit. I've read the issues with mounting and the high voltage runs with
>other wiring. Those aren't the questions I have.
>
>I'm working on the wings (RV-8) and had planned on single power supplies
>with one wire for the supply (along with the nav and landing light
>supply) and use the airframe for ground return. With the single supply
>I'll need to use the shielded wire, which is obviously larger. Question,
>what is the diameter of wire people are using? I found a 3 conductor
>shielded cable at Mouser that shows an OD of .25 inch. Is that typical?
You need 3-conductor, foil shielded wire of 20AWG minimum
size conductors. 18AWG would be okay too.
>The other question, which is more of a general wiring question, but came
>up with the strobe quandary. Are connectors normally used at the wing
>root so the wing is more easily removable? If so, is a shielded
>connector necessary for the high voltage strobe supply or will a
>standard connector work (similar to the ones on the power supply)?
Every connector you put in a wire adds 3 new joints to every
conductor. Once installed, wings very seldom need to be
removed. If it were my airplane, I'd put a 6" diameter "service
loop" of wire at the root of each wing. If and when the wing
needs to be pulled in the future, you have plenty of slack to
add connectors (or butt splices) to re-install the wing.
Bob . . .
Message 4
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| Subject: | Re: Bob - AEC70.zip |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Jon Croke" <Jon@joncroke.com>
Werner,
You MADE my day!
I've been looking for a program like that for sooo long. I tried it out
this morning and cant beleive how easy and useful this is.... It allows me
to collect photos of other's projects to help my own construction along...
use to spend hours downloading one picture at a time and babysitting the
thing waiting for each picture to finish... and that doesnt even count the
opportunities to now download LARGE files and resume when my ISP disconnects
every couple hours...
THANKS!
Jon
CH 701
www.joncroke.com
P.S. to Bob... I have enjoyed reading my copy of the Aerolectric
Connection... copies still available from B&C... (talked to you last week
before my trip)
> --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Werner Schneider"
<WernerSchneider@compuserve.com>
>
> Hello Jim,
>
> use a tool like netvampire (www.shareware.com) or similar, this does save
> the content and is able to restart where it broke, or easier, buy the CD
> with all the stuff from Bob =(;o)
>
> Kind regards
>
> Werner
>
Message 5
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| Subject: | Re: Bob - AEC70.zip |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: Jim Sower <canarder@starband.net>
John & Bob,
I got it downloaded, all 97mb of it. When I tried to unzip it with WinZip, I ended
up in a window where the choices were: Install Screen Saver from AEC7)0... ; Update
AEC7_0 ...(like zip something else into it); and Create New Zip file. Nothing
about unzip it or where do I want to put the output or anything. What am Idoing
wrong??
Thanks, Jim S.
John Schroeder wrote:
> --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: John Schroeder <jschroeder@perigee.net>
>
> Bob -
>
> I downloaded it too. Ain't DSL wonderful?!! Lots of great stuff on it,
> too.
>
> Thanks,
>
> John
>
> DO NOT ARCHIVE
>
> > >Bob, is your AEC70.zip file still available on the web somewhere? I tried
> > >the old link but it wasn't there.
> > >Dave
> >
> > Try http://216.55.140.222/CD/AEC7_0.zip
> >
> > Bob . . .
>
Message 6
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| Subject: | Voltage Regulator .... |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: Jim Sower <canarder@starband.net>
This *&
#%$@# voltage regulator stuff is driving me NUTS!! I
just installed a '94 or so Ford unit with spades labeled: I S
A F. I connected the "F" tab to alternator field, shunted the
S and A tabs together (as I understood Bob's instructions) and
connected them to the battery via the Alternator (Cessna split)
switch. I thought I had the problem solved when I cranked it up
and saw 14.5 - 14.7 volts. Then I went to fly and when I turned
the engine up, the voltage went to over 16 volts.
I have the link to that website Bob discussed that has all those
$5 regulators. All I could find was part numbers and prices.
No application information at all. How do we order from those
folks without application information?
If I ever get the regulator to regulate, I can go to work on
overvoltage protection.
Jim S.
Message 7
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| Subject: | Voltage Regulator .... |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "David Swartzendruber" <dswartzendruber@earthlink.net>
Was the case of the regulator grounded?
David Swartzendruber
Wichita
> This *&
> #%$@# voltage regulator stuff is driving me NUTS!! I
> just installed a '94 or so Ford unit with spades labeled: I S
> A F. I connected the "F" tab to alternator field, shunted the
> S and A tabs together (as I understood Bob's instructions) and
> connected them to the battery via the Alternator (Cessna split)
> switch. I thought I had the problem solved when I cranked it up
> and saw 14.5 - 14.7 volts. Then I went to fly and when I turned
> the engine up, the voltage went to over 16 volts.
>
> Jim S.
Message 8
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| Subject: | Re: Voltage Regulator .... |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: Jim Sower <canarder@starband.net>
Yes. Regulator and fusible link are bolted to baffling (one on each side, with
the same bolts).
Ground wire from mounting bolt to ground stud on engine. Don't know how I could
ground it better
than that.
Jim S.
David Swartzendruber wrote:
> --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "David Swartzendruber" <dswartzendruber@earthlink.net>
>
> Was the case of the regulator grounded?
>
> David Swartzendruber
> Wichita
>
> > This *&
> > #%$@# voltage regulator stuff is driving me NUTS!! I
> > just installed a '94 or so Ford unit with spades labeled: I S
> > A F. I connected the "F" tab to alternator field, shunted the
> > S and A tabs together (as I understood Bob's instructions) and
> > connected them to the battery via the Alternator (Cessna split)
> > switch. I thought I had the problem solved when I cranked it up
> > and saw 14.5 - 14.7 volts. Then I went to fly and when I turned
> > the engine up, the voltage went to over 16 volts.
> >
> > Jim S.
>
Message 9
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| Subject: | Re: Bob - AEC70.zip |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: John Schroeder <jschroeder@perigee.net>
Jim -
I had no problem un zipping the file with Winzip 8.1 SR-1.
John Schroeder
DO NOT ARCHIVE
Jim Sower wrote:
>
> --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: Jim Sower <canarder@starband.net>
>
> John & Bob,
> I got it downloaded, all 97mb of it. When I tried to unzip it with WinZip, I
ended
> up in a window where the choices were: Install Screen Saver from AEC7)0... ;
Update
> AEC7_0 ...(like zip something else into it); and Create New Zip file. Nothing
> about unzip it or where do I want to put the output or anything. What am Idoing
> wrong??
> Thanks, Jim S.
Message 10
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| Subject: | Re: Voltage Regulator .... |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <bob.nuckolls@cox.net>
At 03:29 PM 12/16/2002 -0500, you wrote:
>--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: Jim Sower <canarder@starband.net>
>
>Yes. Regulator and fusible link are bolted to baffling (one on each side,
>with the same bolts).
>Ground wire from mounting bolt to ground stud on engine. Don't know how I
>could ground it better
>than that.
>Jim S.
How did the fusible link get mounted on baffling adjacent
to the regulator. Remember that all protective devices are
mounted as close to the source of energy that puts the
wire in danger. Fuses, breakers and fusible links
are generally installed as close to the bus as practical
if not actually ON the bus.
You need to measure the voltage AT the regulator. (+)
terminal of voltmeter on A-S and the (-) lead on
regulator case. This will tell you what the regulator
thinks it's seeing in the way of bus voltage. Regulators
can respond only to what they see at their terminals.
See figure 4-5 in the 'Connection. I suspect you will
find that voltage at the regulator terminals is
14.2 to 14.6 while the bus voltage is higher.
Voltage drops in regulator wiring can make it
appear that the regulator is malfunctioning.
Bob . . .
Message 11
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| Subject: | Re: Voltage Regulator .... |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <bob.nuckolls@cox.net>
>
>
>I have the link to that website Bob discussed that has all those
>$5 regulators. All I could find was part numbers and prices.
>No application information at all. How do we order from those
>folks without application information?
Don't understand . . . you want a list of cars that use
these regulators? I think you can take the list I linked
into any parts store and they can supply one of the numbers
listed or cross one or more numbers listed to a brand
they stock.
This regulator was generic to Ford products from
1965 to 1992.
Bob . . .
|-------------------------------------------------------|
| The man who does not read good books has no advantage |
| over the man who cannot read them. |
| - Mark Twain |
|-------------------------------------------------------|
Message 12
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| Subject: | Re: Voltage Regulator .... |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: Jim Sower <canarder@starband.net>
"Robert L. Nuckolls, III" wrote:
> --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <bob.nuckolls@cox.net>
>
> At 03:29 PM 12/16/2002 -0500, you wrote:
> >--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: Jim Sower <canarder@starband.net>
> >
> >Yes. Regulator and fusible link are bolted to baffling (one on each side,
> >with the same bolts).
> >Ground wire from mounting bolt to ground stud on engine. Don't know how I
> >could ground it better
> >than that.
> >Jim S.
>
> How did the fusible link get mounted on baffling adjacent
> to the regulator. Remember that all protective devices are
> mounted as close to the source of energy that puts the
> wire in danger. Fuses, breakers and fusible links
> are generally installed as close to the bus as practical
> if not actually ON the bus.
This is a Velocity. The baffling in question is about 3" from the alternator.
Regulator on
the alternator side of the baffle, FL (at least that's what it looks like - a 1"
x 1" x .5"
tin box with B+ going in one side and out the other) the other side.
>
>
> You need to measure the voltage AT the regulator. (+)
> terminal of voltmeter on A-S and the (-) lead on
> regulator case. This will tell you what the regulator
> thinks it's seeing in the way of bus voltage. Regulators
> can respond only to what they see at their terminals.
> See figure 4-5 in the 'Connection. I suspect you will
> find that voltage at the regulator terminals is
> 14.2 to 14.6 while the bus voltage is higher.
Makes sense. Regulator is AT alternator. A-S wire has to go from battery at firewall
(or
main buss near panel) all the way to the panel switch and all the way back through
the
firewall, around the engine to the regulator. That could be the problem. If it
is, how do I
address it? I have #6 or #8 cable from battery forward to main buss ~ not much
drop there,
but #20 from panel back to A-S. That could be a drop. Voltage is, I suspect,
measured at
main buss.
>
>
> Voltage drops in regulator wiring can make it
> appear that the regulator is malfunctioning.
>
> Bob . . .
>
Message 13
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--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: Bill Irvine <wgirvine@yahoo.com>
> From: "Robert Dickson" <robert@thenews-journal.com>
> I'm a little confused about how to properly wire my
> slick mags...
I just finished installing two Slicks on a customer's
C-182, so maybe I can help.
> I assume the p lead terminal goes between the
> splined lock washer and
> the fiber washer. Right?
The mags I installed didn't have a fiber washer. The
only purpose I can see for this washer is to act as an
insulator in case the terminal gets bent down against
the mag case. I would question the ability of the
fiber washer to withstand the torque of the nut
without crushing. However, if you determine that the
washer is up to the task, then yes, install the
terminal between the fiber washer and lock washer.
> Also, why is this stud flat on one side?
To prevent the stud from turning when you tighten the
nut.
> Does the mag case work as engine ground?
Yes.
> and is there a specific screw I'm supposed to use
for
> this ground?
There should be a threaded hole in the mag case very
close to the stud. Connect the shield to this hole
with a screw (should have been included in the mag
installation kit.)
> Or, do I run it to the firewall ground block?
No.
> Ignorance sure ain't bliss.
That's what we're here for. As the Beatles once said,
"I get by with a little help from my friends."
Bill
Message 14
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| Subject: | Re: Voltage Regulator .... |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <bob.nuckolls@cox.net>
At 11:20 PM 12/16/2002 -0500, you wrote:
>--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: Jim Sower <canarder@starband.net>
>
>
>"Robert L. Nuckolls, III" wrote:
>
> > --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III"
> <bob.nuckolls@cox.net>
> >
> > At 03:29 PM 12/16/2002 -0500, you wrote:
> > >--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: Jim Sower <canarder@starband.net>
> > >
> > >Yes. Regulator and fusible link are bolted to baffling (one on each side,
> > >with the same bolts).
> > >Ground wire from mounting bolt to ground stud on engine. Don't know how I
> > >could ground it better
> > >than that.
> > >Jim S.
> >
> > How did the fusible link get mounted on baffling adjacent
> > to the regulator. Remember that all protective devices are
> > mounted as close to the source of energy that puts the
> > wire in danger. Fuses, breakers and fusible links
> > are generally installed as close to the bus as practical
> > if not actually ON the bus.
>
>This is a Velocity. The baffling in question is about 3" from the
>alternator. Regulator on
>the alternator side of the baffle, FL (at least that's what it looks like
>- a 1" x 1" x .5"
>tin box with B+ going in one side and out the other) the other side.
Oh, are you talking about the B-lead fuse? The really
BIG fuse in series with the output of the alternator?
When you said fusible link, I assumed you were talking
about a critter like this:
http://www.aeroelectric.com/articles/fuselink/fuselink.html
. . . that's recommended in our system diagrams for the
alternator field supply if you use fuseblocks. I don't
understand the 1" x 1" x .5" . . . this is much smaller
than the ANL or JJN series devices from our catalog . . .
What kind of device are you using?
> > You need to measure the voltage AT the regulator. (+)
> > terminal of voltmeter on A-S and the (-) lead on
> > regulator case. This will tell you what the regulator
> > thinks it's seeing in the way of bus voltage. Regulators
> > can respond only to what they see at their terminals.
> > See figure 4-5 in the 'Connection. I suspect you will
> > find that voltage at the regulator terminals is
> > 14.2 to 14.6 while the bus voltage is higher.
>
>Makes sense. Regulator is AT alternator. A-S wire has to go from battery
>at firewall (or
>main buss near panel) all the way to the panel switch and all the way back
>through the
>firewall, around the engine to the regulator. That could be the
>problem. If it is, how do I
>address it? I have #6 or #8 cable from battery forward to main buss ~ not
>much drop there,
>but #20 from panel back to A-S. That could be a drop. Voltage is, I
>suspect, measured at
>main buss.
Yup. LONG wires between the bus and the A-S terminals
can upset these critters . . . especially as the alternator
loads go up.
Where is your battery located?
Bob . . .
Message 15
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--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <bob.nuckolls@cox.net>
> Bob, I posted this on the RV-7 Yahoo group list in response to a
> discussion that was taking place about electric gyros. I didn't get my
> question answered so I'll try you. What I'm really trying to find out is
> why would I spend the extra $1,500 dollars for an electric version of
> gyros and also what the failure rate is for the electric gyros. Thanks
> for you book. Very useful for me a first time builder. Doug
>
>Group:
>Please help me to understand some things about electric gyros.
>I've been all over the board on what I want to do. Everything from
>put the suction pump in to looking at the EFIS lite or the Dynon
>EFIS.
>
>I am assuming that in this discussion we are not talking about
>solid state gyros, but instead something like an electric RC Allen
>artificial horizon. How do they work? With suction pump the
>suction turns vanes and spins up the gyros. What causes the
>electric gyros to spin up? An electric motor in each gyroscopic
>instrument?
Yes . . .
> What is the failure rate of the electric motor versus
>the suction pump?
I don't have hard numbers from any formal studies. Further,
there is more to consider than pump of failures. The
general consensus is that overall reliability of all-electric
gyros is more reliable than vacuum because you don't have a
single failure (pump) that takes down both gyros. Further,
cost of system ownership is lower in the long run because
you're not dragging filtered but still microscopically
contaminated air through the gyros which accelerates their
overhaul cycles.
> When a suction pump goes, there is typically an
>indication that the pump is getting weak by reduced suction gauge
>readings over time. (Flame suit on, I'm sure that some have
>experienced catastrophic pump failures.)
They generally do not fail gracefully. The pump
performance is pretty good until one vane fails.
The debris then takes the rest of the vanes out.
It's all over an a few milliseconds.
> Is there an indication of
>electric gyros degrading?
They too have gross failure modes that will cause
a gyro not to spin up . . . or to precess badly. But
one gyro going belly up doesn't take the other one
with it.
> Future maintenance expense? Replace
>suction pump (which you can do yourself) versus overhauling the
>electric gyros by an avionics shop?
Over the lifetime of the airplane, cost of ownership
for the electric gyros should be lower. You get the
further benefits of having two engine driven power
sources which adds robustness not only to the gyro
system but to other electrically driven essentials
as well. Your airplane is easier to build, work on
and should be 4-5 pounds lighter as for having left
out the vacuum plumbing.
>I'm planning out my panel now and it includes the basic 6 pack. The
>exception is what to do about the DG & AI. Whether to replace with
>the Dynon or not. The cost of the electric DG & AI versus the
>suction is really steering me away from the "old fashioned" electric
>gyros. Either way, Dynon or the standard 6 pack, I would choose to
>have the T&B, VSI and good old fashioned compass for backup.
>
>The only reason that I have been able to justify to myself to use
>the Dynon type EFIS's is that it just seems cool! I would still
>have to have the same backup instruments to feel comfortable in IFR.
that would really blow the budget would it not?
>I can't seem to get buying the electric gyros. (I consider myself
>conservative, my wife says cheap). From Aircraft Spruce for RC
>Allen instruments, Electric DG 1850, Electric AI 1750 total cost
>$3,600. Vac DG 689, Vac AI 728 & vac pump 685 for a total cost of
>$2,100.
>
>Honestly, I'm not trying to rain on anyone's parade, I'm just trying
>to understand why I should spend $1,500 dollars more for the same
>function.
You pay it up front or pay more later . . . and if you don't
have the benefit of a second alternator in the vacated vacuum
pump pad, then you miss the opportunity to craft one of the
most reliable electrical systems flying in any light aircraft.
Bob . . .
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