Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 12:26 AM - Re: SEC: UNCLASSIFIED - WIRE SIZE QUESTION (Werner Schneider)
2. 07:05 AM - Re: WIRE SIZE QUESTION and ALTERNATOR LOADS (Robert L. Nuckolls, III)
3. 07:09 AM - Re: alt field and overvoltage contactor (Robert L. Nuckolls, III)
4. 07:13 AM - Re: LR-3 (Robert L. Nuckolls, III)
5. 07:50 AM - fuse question (JEEdmondson@aol.com)
6. 08:37 AM - Re: fuse question (Robert L. Nuckolls, III)
7. 08:39 AM - New books for Homebuilders (sonja.englert@juno.com)
8. 08:54 AM - Re: fuse question (Matt Prather)
9. 09:49 AM - Low Cost Wig-Wag (Robert L. Nuckolls, III)
10. 11:08 AM - Re: Connectors - its the little things that get you! (Steve Sampson)
11. 11:24 AM - Re: Re: WIRE SIZE QUESTION and ALTERNATOR LOADS (Paul Wilson)
12. 12:39 PM - Re: Connectors - its the little things that get you! (Billie Lamb)
13. 01:15 PM - Re: Connectors - its the little things that get you! (Robert L. Nuckolls, III)
14. 01:54 PM - Lancair BMA Flight Testing (Werner Schneider)
15. 02:45 PM - Re: Dead Dimmer? (Robert L. Nuckolls, III)
16. 03:00 PM - Re: Re: WIRE SIZE QUESTION and ALTERNATOR LOADS (Werner Schneider)
17. 03:03 PM - Re: Switch on a strobe line? (Phil Birkelbach)
18. 07:15 PM - Re: Dead Dimmer? (John Slade)
19. 07:46 PM - Switch Alternatives for Galls flashers (Mark Phillips)
20. 07:59 PM - Re: Lancair BMA Flight Testing (Robert L. Nuckolls, III)
21. 09:15 PM - Re: Switch Alternatives for Galls flashers (Robert McCallum)
Message 1
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| Subject: | Re: SEC: UNCLASSIFIED - WIRE SIZE QUESTION |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Werner Schneider" <WernerSchneider@compuserve.com>
Hi all,
just measured the load on my aeroflash units with a 12V Batterie:
Average Peak
each Nav bulb: 1.98A have to check again, is 3.24A in my list!
each Pos bulb: 1.72 A 2.18A
each Strobe: 1.55A 1.65A
Werner
----- Original Message -----
From: "Matt Prather" <mprather@spro.net>
Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: SEC: UNCLASSIFIED - WIRE SIZE QUESTION
> --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: Matt Prather <mprather@spro.net>
>
> David:
>
> I'll try to take a stab at it... Always make the wire big enough to
> handle the
> max current required to open the circuit protection. In this case, I
> think you
> have to make each wire size so that it won't be damaged by carrying
current
> large enough to pop the breaker. Even in this case where the wire is
tee-ed
> from the breaker, you have to look at the worst case scenario - One leg of
> the tee has a blown bulb (open, 0A), and the other gets a dead short to
> ground.
> The side that gets shorted must be able to cary the full 7A.
>
> BTW, I think that the 2A for each light might be a bit conservative. My
> buddy had a system spec'ed the same way, and he ended up with a 10A
> breaker to be able to handle 8A worth of lights. You could actually,
safely
> run even a bigger breaker, as long as all of the wire could match it.
>
> Regards,
>
> Matt Prather
> N34RD
>
> PS. Bob, I have finished my basic VariEze system, largely according
> to your design and construction ideas. I have run-tested it, and
everything
> seems to work great. No whines, buzzes, pops, or smoke. Thanks for the
> continued help.
>
>
> Francis, David CMDR wrote:
>
> >--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Francis, David CMDR"
<David.Francis@defence.gov.au>
> >
> >
> >Bob,
> >Please clarify one point for me.
> >
> >My three position lights will run from the one fuse and switch, the load
is
> >2 amps each. When ganged together I understand that the circuit
protection
> >should be for the sum of the load, 6 amps, with a bit of headroom call it
a
> >7 amp fuse. For voltage drop I can use 20AWG wire, which can take up to
> >5amps load fused (7.5 for a breaker), but could see 7 amps before the
fuse
> >blows. What wire size do I use, 20AWG based on voltage drop or up it to
> >18AWG based on the fuse size?
> >
> >Reference used is AC43.13 Chapter 11.
> >
> >Regards, David Francis, VH-ZEE.
> >Email: David.Francis@defence.gov.au
<mailto:David.Francis@defence.gov.au>
> >
> >
>
>
Message 2
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| Subject: | Re: WIRE SIZE QUESTION and ALTERNATOR LOADS |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <bob.nuckolls@cox.net>
At 09:25 AM 1/15/2003 +0100, you wrote:
>--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Werner Schneider"
><WernerSchneider@compuserve.com>
>
>Hi all,
>
>just measured the load on my aeroflash units with a 12V Batterie:
>
> Average Peak
> each Nav bulb: 1.98A have to check again, is 3.24A in my list!
> each Pos bulb: 1.72 A 2.18A
> each Strobe: 1.55A 1.65A
>
>Werner
What are you calling a Nav bulb and Position bulb? How many
total lamps are in your nav/position system . . . 3 or 4 lamps?
Can you look at the lamps and give me part numbers off of
the lamps?
By and large, incandescent lamps are rather predictable
with respect to current draw vs. light output. For example,
looking over a miniature lamp catalog I have, lamps that
draw 1.50 amps are 22-26 Candle Power, lamps that draw
1.9 to 2.1 amps are 30-32 Candle Power. There are dozens
of part numbers for lamps in the higher and lower group
of light outputs listed with minor differences in package
and recommended application.
If one has a 4-lamp, position light set (Grn/Wht left wing,
Red/Wht right wing) then the maximum anticipated current draw
for the largest lamps commonly available would be about
8A. The largest 3-light system would be about 6A. In the
former case, 10A circuit protection and 16AWG wire would
be attractive. In the later case, 7.5A protection and 20AWG
wire would suffice.
If the current readings Werner made were 1.98 for the red/grn
lamps and 1.72A for each of the white lamps in a 4-light
system, then we're still looking at 10A protection and
16AWG wire.
This ties into Paul's question earlier . . .
Bob,
Is the following correct?
The position lights are rated at 26+75 watts per wingtip or 202 watts total.
I measured the steady state current for each bulb and got 1.4 & 1.6 amps (6
amps total) at 12.33 volts (on my bench battery) or 17.26 & 19.73 watts per
bulb.
Does this make sense?
Yup, no mater what the books say, you can't beat having
REAL data from which to make your decision. Readings taken
from a 12v battery will go up by about 1/6th as the bus
voltage rises to 14v so figure 5.21 x 1.15 = 6.0 amps
So at 14.2 volts the current draw would be (17.26+19.73x2)/14.2 = 5.21 amps.
If I have this correct then my loads will be higher when I max out my
Rotax alternator since the voltage drops off as the demand goes way up.
i.e. the Rotax output is 12.6 v & 20.5 amps at 5800 rpms.
This rating for the alternator suggests that at 20.5A load,
the alternator is barely able to sustain bus voltage
at some level sufficient to avoid discharging the battery.
Of course, it cannot charge the battery at this level either.
As I recall, the Rotax alternator is good for about 18A
at 14.0 volts. This means that from the time you start the
engine until the battery is fully recharged, you should
not load the alternator to any level exceeding 18A total . . .
which INCLUDES current that is used to recharge the battery.
System loads should probably be 10A or less if you'd like
to get the battery recharged with some dispatch. So for
night flight with the semi-useless power hog that is
position lights, you may want to keep powered up electro-
whizzies to a minimum until the battery recharge current
falls below 2A or so . . . and then turn on the rest of
your toys.
Bob . . .
Message 3
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| Subject: | Re: alt field and overvoltage contactor |
connection
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <bob.nuckolls@cox.net>
At 04:51 PM 1/14/2003 -0500, you wrote:
>--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Robert Dickson"
><robert@thenews-journal.com>
>
>Bob and others
>
>I've got an internally regulated 60 amp alternator that I got from Van
>delivering its output to an s701-1 overvoltage contactor. I'd like to verify
>that I've got this stuff wired correctly.
>
>The s701-1 came with a pair of diodes, with one diode running between the
>two small posts and the other diode from one small post to the adjacent
>5/16" stud. Figure Z-24 shows only one diode (at least that's what my
>ignorant eyes see), so which side of this contactor gets the alternator
>output? Also, I assume the alt field wire connects to the small post with
>the diode marking on that side. Does this sound right?
The S701-1 contactor should have been shipped to you with
one diode and a jumper wire as shown in
http://www.aeroelectric.com/Catalog/switch/s701-1l.jpg
To use the S701-1 as a OV disconnect contactor in the b-lead
of your alternator, the jumper is removed, the terminal marked
TO MASTER SWITCH goes to ground, the terminal that used to have
the jumper on it goes to your alternator control switch, crowbar
ovm and alternator control lead.
>Another also - the alternator I've got has a plug with three wires coming
>from it - red, blue & green. I've determined from Van's accompanying
>instructions that the green wire is the one I should use, but what do I do
>with other two wires? Should I just cut them short and insulate them
>somehow?
Cut them off right at the connector.
Bob . . .
Message 4
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--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <bob.nuckolls@cox.net>
At 03:50 PM 1/14/2003 +0000, you wrote:
>--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Steve Sampson"
><SSampson.SLN21@london.edu>
>
>Bob - a couple of queries regarding the LR-3. I am looking at Fig.Z-11
>
>1. Pin 1. Is the battery temp sensor supplied with the LR-3? If not
>what is appropriate?
fewer than 1% of our customers can take advantage of
the battery temperature sensor. If you plan to cruise
at 25,000 ft for hours at a time, land, refuel and
cruise at 25,000 ft for a few more hours, you don't
need the battery temp sensor.
>2. Pin 2 is labelled 'OV PTT' & Note xx. Could you expand on these
>please.
We used to show extending this wire into the cockpit to a Press
to Test button . . . but folks were testing the thing about every
flight. Not necessary. We disconnected the lead and now recommend that
you test the OV ever so often, like every oil change. Momentarily
jumper 2 to 6 and turn on the master switch. This should pop your
ALT FLD breaker.
>3. Does the lamp on pins 3 & 5 indicate low voltage as well as high
>voltage?
Just low voltage . . . an overvoltage condition lasts only for
tens of milliseconds before the ALT FLD breaker opens whereupon
a high voltage condition quickly reverts to a low voltage condition.
Bob . . .
Message 5
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--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: JEEdmondson@aol.com
Bob,
I have purchased and read your excelent book.
I agree with your methods but have a question.
You say that if something causes a fuse to blow, replacing the fuse in
flight, or re-setting a breaker is not necessary because the problem still
exists and will just blow/pop again. On more than one occasion, in autos that
I have owned, I have had to replace a blown fuse that never blew again. Dont
know what caused it to blow, nothing was repaired and nothing changed. For
example, in a 95 ranger truck I had, the cruise control stoped working. I
changed the fuse and it worked fine and never blew the fuse again.
What can cause a fuse to blow when there is no apparent problem?
Jimmy Edmondson
<A HREF="mailto:jeedmondson@aol.com">jeedmondson@aol.com
Message 6
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| Subject: | Re: fuse question |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <bob.nuckolls@cox.net>
At 10:48 AM 1/15/2003 -0500, you wrote:
>--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: JEEdmondson@aol.com
>
>Bob,
>I have purchased and read your excelent book.
>I agree with your methods but have a question.
>
>You say that if something causes a fuse to blow, replacing the fuse in
>flight, or re-setting a breaker is not necessary because the problem still
>exists and will just blow/pop again. On more than one occasion, in autos that
>I have owned, I have had to replace a blown fuse that never blew again. Dont
>know what caused it to blow, nothing was repaired and nothing changed. For
>example, in a 95 ranger truck I had, the cruise control stoped working. I
>changed the fuse and it worked fine and never blew the fuse again.
>
>What can cause a fuse to blow when there is no apparent problem?
Happens in airplanes too . . . In airplanes, the problem is most
likely an undersized fuse/breaker for the task. In a certified
ship, there's precious little the po' guy can do about it. To
fix a design flaw is a major undertaking in a certified aircraft.
In your OBAM aircraft, you re-evaluate your fuse/breaker/wire selection
decision and probably decided to upsize the circuit whereupon
the nuisance tripping problem stops.
There may be intermittent events to consider but only lightly.
I had a Voyager that would occasionally pop a fuse when
engaging the cruise control. Same fuse powered a bunch
of panel instruments. It would do it only very occasionally
so I just carried extra fuses. After several years, the
stalk that mounted cruise controls cracked and required
replacement of the assembly. Fuse never popped again.
Keep in mind that these anecdotal stories are not a basis
for modifying decisions for design and/or flight operations.
The public is taught to fear lots of things based upon poor
reasoning . . . and pilots are as vulnerable if not more so.
The ways that any system can become unusable by NOT popping
a fuse generally outnumber the ways that it fails and does
pop a fuse by a factor of 10:1 or more.
Why would it be a good idea to gather up a fist full of
spare fuses and mount your fuse block for in-flight
accessibility when (1) majority failures are not likely
to open a fuse, (2) if it does open a fuse, likelihood
of getting system back by replacing fuse is small and
(3) while you're fiddling with systems failure analysis
and hoping for a remedy, you are NOT BEING A PILOT?
EVERY mid air between airplanes involves up to 4 pilots
with their heads down. EVERY system in your airplane is
subject to failure either due to normal wear-out or
quality issues . . . if any system is highly prized for
its ability to assist in comfortable continuation of
flight, you'd better pack a stand-by replacement for
it either in your flight bag or mounted to the panel.
If you've got backups for things you really need,
then the idea of in-flight fuse-fiddling becomes
a small, virtually insignificant consideration for
overall flight safety and comfort.
Bob . . .
Message 7
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| Subject: | New books for Homebuilders |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: sonja.englert@juno.com
Hi everyone,
I would like to introduce myself to this group. I am an aeronautical engineer,
pilot, airplane homebuilder and writer. I have written 3 new books for airplane
homebuilders, which you can check out on my web page www.caroengineering.com.
They are mainly for airplane homebuilders, but should be of interest to anyone
who wants to install engines, work with composites or flight test an airplane.
Cheers,
Sonja Englert
www.caroengineering.com
Message 8
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| Subject: | Re: fuse question |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Matt Prather" <mprather@spro.net>
Water.
> --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: JEEdmondson@aol.com
>
> Bob,
> I have purchased and read your excelent book.
> I agree with your methods but have a question.
>
> You say that if something causes a fuse to blow, replacing the fuse in
> flight, or re-setting a breaker is not necessary because the problem
> still exists and will just blow/pop again. On more than one occasion,
> in autos that I have owned, I have had to replace a blown fuse that
> never blew again. Dont know what caused it to blow, nothing was
> repaired and nothing changed. For example, in a 95 ranger truck I had,
> the cruise control stoped working. I changed the fuse and it worked
> fine and never blew the fuse again.
>
> What can cause a fuse to blow when there is no apparent problem?
>
> Jimmy Edmondson
> <A HREF="mailto:jeedmondson@aol.com">jeedmondson@aol.com
>
>
Message 9
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| Subject: | Low Cost Wig-Wag |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <bob.nuckolls@cox.net>
With thanks to Larry Martin who e-mailed me a copy of his
recommendations for a low cost Wig-Wag system, I have
taken his suggestion and expanded upon it.
There are a variety of three-terminal flashers suited to
wig-wag service on our airplanes. A part suggested
by Larry is a Wagner 537-12
http://www.copcars.com/able2/17-0537%20.htm
There are lots of thermal flashers that would work
but my personal preference leans toward a solid state
flasher that uses a real relay to alternate power
connections between the lamp circuits. These tend
to be more uniform in flash rate, duty cycle and
are more robust.
I've twisted B&C's arm and they've laid in a stock
of solid state flashers that will do the job. Whatever
flasher you use, you can wire it up as shown here:
http://216.55.140.222/articles/WigWag/WigWag.pdf
Bob . . .
|-------------------------------------------------------|
| The man who does not read good books has no advantage |
| over the man who cannot read them. |
| - Mark Twain |
|-------------------------------------------------------|
Message 10
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| Subject: | Connectors - its the little things that get you! |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Steve Sampson" <SSampson.SLN21@london.edu>
Bill / Larry - thanks for that. Can either of you easily translate that into
the AMP part numbers? Then I can just buy them locally. Thanks, Steve.
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Billie
Lamb
Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Connectors - its the little things that
get
you!
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Billie Lamb" <N254BL@cfl.rr.com>
Hi Steve,
I know you have resolved your problem, at least temporarily, but if you or
anyone else out there has the same problem I went through the same thing and
here is the info.
The Mate-n-lock 3 coductor plugs can be purchased at Digi-Key.
1-800-344-4539 or www.digikey.com
There is a minimum order price so get a friend to go in with you or plan
your purchase when you need enough treasures to make up the minimum which I
believe is $25.00.
These are Digi-key's numbers; Male plug A1429 ND
Female plug A1400 ND
Tinned Pins for 14-20 AWG
wire A1420 ND
Tinned socket " "
" " A1421 ND
Tinned Pins for 18-24 AWG
" A1422 ND
Tinned Sockets " "
" " A1423 ND
Since I needed to make up a minimum order I ordered several 2 conductor ones
also. I figured they would be good to have around for other projects.
Hope this helps someone out there.
Bill Lamb
----- Original Message -----
From: "Steve Sampson" <SSampson.SLN21@london.edu>
Subject: AeroElectric-List: Connectors - its the little things that get you!
> --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Steve Sampson"
<SSampson.SLN21@london.edu>
>
> I am wasting a mass of time trying to accurately identify the make and
part
> number for the 3-pin plugs/sockets/pins that I think both Whelen and Nova
> use on their strobes. I think they are either AMP or Mouser (and is what
> Mouser sells made by AMP). If anyone could give me the maker & part
numbers
> for the plugs sockets m & f pins I would be grateful.
>
> Thanks so much, Steve.
>
> RV9 #90360 / wings
> N Yorks.., UK
>
>
Message 11
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| Subject: | Re: WIRE SIZE QUESTION and ALTERNATOR LOADS |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: Paul Wilson <pwilson@climber.org>
Bob,
I still need more of your reassurance that I am thinking straight.
I am confused about how the Rotax alternator delivers its power. The
Rotax manual gives volts/amps/rpm data and they do not give data
above 14v. Is this because of the Ducati regulator? So if I dump the
Ducati regulator and use a B&C unit how can I figure out what the
watts will be at say 14.2V.
When I interpolated the Rotax data I got the following at Rotax
recommended cruise at 5000 to 5500 rpms for the 912UL :
Interpolating their DC output data:
@5000 rpm 12.69 v/19.3 amps = 245 watts
@5500 rpm 12.63 v/20.05 amps = 253 watts
(This is from the same data as below "i.e. the Rotax output is 12.6 v
& 20.5 amps at 5800 rpms")
QUESTION:
With a proper regulator will the Rotax deliver the following:
@ 5000RPM 245W/14.2V/17.25A or 245W/14V/17.50A
and
@ 5500RPM 253W/14.2V/17.82A or 253W/14V/18.07A
And if I am correct I have derived your 18A number.
Will the Ducati regulator do this or do I need a better unit?
Thanks, Paul
==========
At 9:04 AM -0600 1/15/03, Robert L. Nuckolls, III wrote:
>--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III"
><bob.nuckolls@cox.net>
>
>At 09:25 AM 1/15/2003 +0100, you wrote:
>>--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Werner Schneider"
>><WernerSchneider@compuserve.com>
>>
>>Hi all,
>>
>>just measured the load on my aeroflash units with a 12V Batterie:
>>
>> Average Peak
>> each Nav bulb: 1.98A have to check again, is 3.24A in my list!
>> each Pos bulb: 1.72 A 2.18A
>> each Strobe: 1.55A 1.65A
>>
>>Werner
>
> What are you calling a Nav bulb and Position bulb? How many
> total lamps are in your nav/position system . . . 3 or 4 lamps?
> Can you look at the lamps and give me part numbers off of
> the lamps?
>
> By and large, incandescent lamps are rather predictable
> with respect to current draw vs. light output. For example,
> looking over a miniature lamp catalog I have, lamps that
> draw 1.50 amps are 22-26 Candle Power, lamps that draw
> 1.9 to 2.1 amps are 30-32 Candle Power. There are dozens
> of part numbers for lamps in the higher and lower group
> of light outputs listed with minor differences in package
> and recommended application.
>
> If one has a 4-lamp, position light set (Grn/Wht left wing,
> Red/Wht right wing) then the maximum anticipated current draw
> for the largest lamps commonly available would be about
> 8A. The largest 3-light system would be about 6A. In the
> former case, 10A circuit protection and 16AWG wire would
> be attractive. In the later case, 7.5A protection and 20AWG
> wire would suffice.
>
> If the current readings Werner made were 1.98 for the red/grn
> lamps and 1.72A for each of the white lamps in a 4-light
> system, then we're still looking at 10A protection and
> 16AWG wire.
>
> This ties into Paul's question earlier . . .
>
>Bob,
>
>Is the following correct?
>The position lights are rated at 26+75 watts per wingtip or 202 watts total.
>
>I measured the steady state current for each bulb and got 1.4 & 1.6 amps (6
>amps total) at 12.33 volts (on my bench battery) or 17.26 & 19.73 watts per
>bulb.
>
>Does this make sense?
>
> Yup, no mater what the books say, you can't beat having
> REAL data from which to make your decision. Readings taken
> from a 12v battery will go up by about 1/6th as the bus
> voltage rises to 14v so figure 5.21 x 1.15 = 6.0 amps
>
>So at 14.2 volts the current draw would be (17.26+19.73x2)/14.2 = 5.21 amps.
>If I have this correct then my loads will be higher when I max out my
>Rotax alternator since the voltage drops off as the demand goes way up.
>i.e. the Rotax output is 12.6 v & 20.5 amps at 5800 rpms.
>
> This rating for the alternator suggests that at 20.5A load,
> the alternator is barely able to sustain bus voltage
> at some level sufficient to avoid discharging the battery.
> Of course, it cannot charge the battery at this level either.
> As I recall, the Rotax alternator is good for about 18A
> at 14.0 volts. This means that from the time you start the
> engine until the battery is fully recharged, you should
> not load the alternator to any level exceeding 18A total . . .
> which INCLUDES current that is used to recharge the battery.
>
> System loads should probably be 10A or less if you'd like
> to get the battery recharged with some dispatch. So for
> night flight with the semi-useless power hog that is
> position lights, you may want to keep powered up electro-
> whizzies to a minimum until the battery recharge current
> falls below 2A or so . . . and then turn on the rest of
> your toys.
>
> Bob . . .
>
--
Message 12
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| Subject: | Re: Connectors - its the little things that get you! |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Billie Lamb" <N254BL@cfl.rr.com>
I have an old note here with AMP numbers 1-480305-0 and 1-480303-0. That may
be just the plugs without the pins and sockets but I also have their Phone
number 1-800-522-6752. Just ask for a tech in that department. That's what I
did when trying to track these down. They were quite helpful. If you get
them, please post and it will save others the same grief.
Bill Lamb
----- Original Message -----
From: "Steve Sampson" <SSampson.SLN21@london.edu>
Subject: RE: AeroElectric-List: Connectors - its the little things that get
you!
> --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Steve Sampson"
<SSampson.SLN21@london.edu>
>
> Bill / Larry - thanks for that. Can either of you easily translate that
into
> the AMP part numbers? Then I can just buy them locally. Thanks, Steve.
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Billie
> Lamb
> Sent: 15 January 2003 00:55
> To: aeroelectric-list@matronics.com
> Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Connectors - its the little things
that get
> you!
>
> --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Billie Lamb" <N254BL@cfl.rr.com>
>
> Hi Steve,
>
> I know you have resolved your problem, at least temporarily, but if you or
> anyone else out there has the same problem I went through the same thing
and
> here is the info.
>
> The Mate-n-lock 3 coductor plugs can be purchased at Digi-Key.
> 1-800-344-4539 or www.digikey.com
>
> There is a minimum order price so get a friend to go in with you or plan
> your purchase when you need enough treasures to make up the minimum which
I
> believe is $25.00.
>
> These are Digi-key's numbers; Male plug A1429 ND
> Female plug A1400 ND
> Tinned Pins for 14-20 AWG
> wire A1420 ND
> Tinned socket " "
> " " A1421 ND
> Tinned Pins for 18-24 AWG
> " A1422 ND
> Tinned Sockets " "
> " " A1423 ND
>
> Since I needed to make up a minimum order I ordered several 2 conductor
ones
> also. I figured they would be good to have around for other projects.
> Hope this helps someone out there.
>
>
> Bill Lamb
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Steve Sampson" <SSampson.SLN21@london.edu>
> To: <aeroelectric-list@matronics.com>
> Subject: AeroElectric-List: Connectors - its the little things that get
you!
>
>
> > --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Steve Sampson"
> <SSampson.SLN21@london.edu>
> >
> > I am wasting a mass of time trying to accurately identify the make and
> part
> > number for the 3-pin plugs/sockets/pins that I think both Whelen and
Nova
> > use on their strobes. I think they are either AMP or Mouser (and is what
> > Mouser sells made by AMP). If anyone could give me the maker & part
> numbers
> > for the plugs sockets m & f pins I would be grateful.
> >
> > Thanks so much, Steve.
> >
> > RV9 #90360 / wings
> > N Yorks.., UK
> >
> >
>
>
Message 13
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| Subject: | Re: Connectors - its the little things that get you! |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <bob.nuckolls@cox.net>
At 03:36 PM 1/15/2003 -0500, you wrote:
>--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Billie Lamb" <N254BL@cfl.rr.com>
>
>I have an old note here with AMP numbers 1-480305-0 and 1-480303-0. That may
>be just the plugs without the pins and sockets but I also have their Phone
>number 1-800-522-6752. Just ask for a tech in that department. That's what I
>did when trying to track these down. They were quite helpful. If you get
>them, please post and it will save others the same grief.
AMP has a very informative website at www.amp.com
Note the Part Number and Text Search boxes that take you
to detailed data right from the horse's mouth . . .
Bob . . .
Message 14
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| Subject: | Lancair BMA Flight Testing |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Werner Schneider" <WernerSchneider@compuserve.com>
Hello Folks,
I wanted to share following posting from Denis Douglas in the Glastar Net.
It seems, that BMA made some progress, Bob, as you have good contacts into
Lancair, can you confirm?
-----------------------------------Posting from Denis
Douglas----------------------------------
I have been been anxiously watching the BMA-Lancair dialog/"spat" because,
if Lancair tests the BMA EFIS and finds it acceptable, I was sure that I
would also find it acceptable. To this end, I have attached (below) the
text of a 01/15/03 report from Kirk Hammersmith, Lancair's Avionics Manager.
Judge for yourself:
[QUOTE]
Last year, I promised I would (continue) to test the Blue Mountain EFIS
system and report how things were panning out. If you recall, we
attempted to flight test Greg Richter's system on several occasions and I
reported negative results. Since my post in July 2002, several things have
occurred. Most significantly, Greg Richter paired up with Malcom Thomson,
who I met in Reno at the Air Races last September. After conversation with
Malcom about our negative experiences with BMA, he assured me that things
were changing at Blue Mountain and asked for some time to prove it. I agreed
to a new round of testing, which we started in October 2002. We installed
the system in our company Lancair IV and waited for Malcom to arrive. After
our first round of flight tests with Malcom in the copilot seat, we did a
fabulous job at demonstrating pitch, roll, acceleration and deceleration
errors that were
unacceptable. After seeing the errors, Malcom agreed that they had some work
to do. Two subsequent flights were made specifically to collect data for
Greg to analyze.
Malcom arrives back at Lancair (late Nov or early Dec), this time with Greg.
Some new software code and flight tests showed vast improvements (and hope),
but additional flight-testing continues to show significant
pitch & roll errors as well as acceleration and deceleration errors. After
again collecting more data, Malcom & Greg left, promising to return with a
fix.
Malcom, Greg, and Greg's AHRS expert returned to Lancair last week with new
software and determination to demonstrate an accurate EFIS/One. The weather
was nasty all week, preventing any flight-testing. The Blue
Mountain crew headed to Portland for the weekend, returning bright and early
Monday morning. No more snog (snow-fog) and blue skies prevailing, Chief
Pilot Peter Stiles and Greg Richter took off in the company IV to put the
EFIS/One through the paces. After they returned, Peter walked into my office
to report the test flight. "I couldn't fail
the system," Peter tells me. I questioned him further about the test and
couldn't believe my ears. The Blue Mountain EFIS/One performed
flawlessly.
Additional testing and refinements to the Blue Mountain system will be done
between now and Sun N Fun. The BMA group dove in head first,
identified problems, and demonstrated incredible support in resolving those
issues. Based on the testing standards we put these guys through, the
accuracy of their system and their level of support, we will be offering the
BMA EFIS/One to our customers. As a side note, the system we are testing has
new software code, which is not released yet,
according to Greg. He mentioned it would be incorporated in his next
software release after refinements and debugging is done.
Additional testing and in-flight photos will be available soon on the
Lancair Avionics website (www.lancairavionics.com)
If you have any specific questions about the system or its performance, feel
free to contact me directly kirkh@lancair-kits.com
We are preparing for first flight-testing phase of the new Avidyne Entegra
EFIS, Garmin GTX330 Mode S Transponder w/ TIS, weather datalinking system by
WSI and the JPI EDM-900 Engine Monitoring System.
Kirk Hammersmith
Lancair Avionics
[END QUOTE]
---------------
Message 15
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--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <bob.nuckolls@cox.net>
At 10:17 AM 1/10/2003 -0500, you wrote:
>--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "John Slade" <sladerj@bellsouth.net>
>
> > Two devices are resistors . . . mounted apart from the
> > others. Two are capacitors mounted side-by-side.
> > The resistors are usually installed with the number
> > facing up. One will be marked 392 the other 909 . . . these
> > are the ones that need to be replaced.
>Thanks, Bob. I looked at the board under a magnifying glass and identified
>the resistors. They're the REALLY small ones. I also noticed that one of the
>capacitors seems to be damaged - the black covering is partly missing. I
>checked my wiring and there are no shorts. The dimmer gets hot, but doesn't
>light the lights. The board is brown around the main component. I think I
>need either a replacement board or a replacement capacitor.
Got your dimmer today. The etched circuit board under the
voltage regulator IC was scorched. One of the capacitors
had the side blown out. This dimmer has seen some hard times.
I was reluctant to rebuild it on a cooked board but since
I don't build them here any more, I don't have bare boards.
I've replaced all the components and re-configured for
a 2-12 volt adjustment range. When you power this guy
up, unless the dimmer is functioning exactly as expected
immediately, make sure it's not overloaded (scorches board),
too much or reverse polarity voltage (blows up capacitors).
It's back in the mail today.
Bob . . .
Message 16
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| Subject: | Re: WIRE SIZE QUESTION and ALTERNATOR LOADS |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Werner Schneider" <WernerSchneider@compuserve.com>
Hello Bob,
> >just measured the load on my aeroflash units with a 12V Batterie:
> >
> > Average Peak
> > each Nav bulb: 1.98A have to check again, is 3.24A in my list!
> > each Pos bulb: 1.72 A 2.18A
> > each Strobe: 1.55A 1.65A
> >
> What are you calling a Nav bulb and Position bulb? How many
> total lamps are in your nav/position system . . . 3 or 4 lamps?
> Can you look at the lamps and give me part numbers off of
> the lamps?
a Nav bulb is the red or green Navigation light (frontside), Micro Lamps ML
7512-12, a Pos is the white Position light (backside) nothing on the bulb,
the socket says SYL TP20 75W 40V, looks like the halogen lights in my
kitchen. In the middle sits the strobe (no markings).
It is a three light combo Aeroflash 156-0049, they are similar to the Whelen
A650-PG
The white position light has a separate ground, the red/green nav light uses
the ground
from the strobe, so 5 wires through the wing (power supplies are at the wing
tip).
>
> By and large, incandescent lamps are rather predictable
> with respect to current draw vs. light output. For example,
> looking over a miniature lamp catalog I have, lamps that
> draw 1.50 amps are 22-26 Candle Power, lamps that draw
> 1.9 to 2.1 amps are 30-32 Candle Power. There are dozens
> of part numbers for lamps in the higher and lower group
> of light outputs listed with minor differences in package
> and recommended application.
>
> If one has a 4-lamp, position light set (Grn/Wht left wing,
> Red/Wht right wing) then the maximum anticipated current draw
> for the largest lamps commonly available would be about
> 8A. The largest 3-light system would be about 6A. In the
> former case, 10A circuit protection and 16AWG wire would
> be attractive. In the later case, 7.5A protection and 20AWG
> wire would suffice.
>
> If the current readings Werner made were 1.98 for the red/grn
> lamps and 1.72A for each of the white lamps in a 4-light
> system, then we're still looking at 10A protection and
> 16AWG wire.
>
> This ties into Paul's question earlier . . .
So I guess, 4 lamp, about 10.6A peak and 7.6 A steady is a 10A fuse and AWG
16, or I take a 2-3 switch and two fuses with 5A (left/right or pos/nav) and
could then use AWG22?
Had you a chance to prepare an answer for my engine sensor question?
Many thanks
Werner
Message 17
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| Subject: | Re: Switch on a strobe line? |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Phil Birkelbach" <phil@petrasoft.net>
The strobe in the tail is the Whelen combo position/strobe that Van sales.
It has a little postition light with a strobe tube surrounding it. On each
wing I have the little Nova 'Hide-a-Flash' strobes sticking out from inside
the wingtip into the cavity behind the clear cover that comes on the RV-7.
Here is a picture of the setup before I put on the clear lense...
http://www.myrv7.com/viewimage.php?pictureid=242
BTW I did hook all three strobes to the PS to make sure that it would all
work and it did; flawlessly. The Nova PS uses normal Amp Mate-n-Lok
connectors which is what the Whelen stuff comes with as well so it will all
connect together. The Nova guy told me to use 18AWG 3-conductor sheilded
wire for the strobe heads.
Godspeed,
Phil Birkelbach - Houston Texas
RV-7 N727WB (Reserved) - Fuselage
http://www.myrv7.com
----- Original Message -----
From: "LarryRobertHelming" <lhelming@sigecom.net>
Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Switch on a strobe line?
> --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "LarryRobertHelming"
<lhelming@sigecom.net>
>
> Phil, with the x-pak power supply, I'm interested in knowing what actual
> strobe light units you are using/attaching to the power supply.
>
> Thanks,
>
> Indiana Larry with 3XG
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Phil Birkelbach" <phil@petrasoft.net>
> To: <aeroelectric-list@matronics.com>
> Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Switch on a strobe line?
>
>
> > --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Phil Birkelbach"
> <phil@petrasoft.net>
> >
> > If you go with a Nova Strobe power supply (I have the X-Pak 904) there
are
> > connections on the power supply for just such a reason. There are two
on
> my
> > 904 each one controls two of the heads. These control leads are very
low
> > current 12VDC and are designed for just what you are describing. It
will
> > flash the Whelen strobe heads too, I have done it. Did I mention the
> Nova's
> > are much cheaper than the Whelen's.
> >
> > The X-Pak also has a low power mode that drops the power requirement and
> > light output a little bit. It is a fairly flexible system, I think that
> > I'll be very happy with it. The only drawback is that the power supply
is
> > fairly large. It's not all that heavy but it is bigger than I thought
> that
> > it would be.
> >
> > Godspeed,
> >
> > Phil Birkelbach - Houston Texas
> > RV-7 N727WB (Reserved) - Fuselage
> > http://www.myrv7.com
> >
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: <richard@riley.net>
> > To: <aeroelectric-list@matronics.com>
> > Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Switch on a strobe line?
> >
> >
> > > --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: richard@riley.net
> > >
> > > At 10:27 AM 1/11/03 -0600, you wrote:
> > >
> > > > Why would you want to do this?
> > >
> > > My plane (a canard pusher) already has 2 nice, clear lenses just on
each
> > > side of the nose. They currently have mounts for MR-16 bulbs, as
> landing
> > > lights. Unfortunately the amount of light they put out is (IMHP)
> > > inadequate. I'm going to a pair of 50 W HID's on the main gear, which
> > > still leaves me with these clear lenses.
> > >
> > > My thought was to put a couple of strobes behind them. But then I
> thought
> > > at night with a little moisture in the air it might be pretty annoying
> to
> > > have all that blinking directly in front of me, so, some way to switch
> > them
> > > off while leaving the wing strobes on.
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
>
>
Message 18
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--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "John Slade" <sladerj@bellsouth.net>
> Got your dimmer today. The etched circuit board under the
> voltage regulator IC was scorched. One of the capacitors
> had the side blown out. This dimmer has seen some hard times.
Hmmm. Now I feel like a klutse. I wonder what I did. I definately didnt
install it reverse polarity. Maybe there was an intermittent short in one of
the outlets which isnt connected yet. The total load it was getting was a
goose neck light, four LEDs and a small dome light. I dont think I ever ran
them all at once. I'll double check the draw on each of the circuits before
I reconnect it.
> I've replaced all the components and re-configured for
> a 2-12 volt adjustment range. When you power this guy
> up, unless the dimmer is functioning exactly as expected
> immediately, make sure it's not overloaded (scorches board),
> too much or reverse polarity voltage (blows up capacitors).
>
> It's back in the mail today.
Spectacular service! Thank you very much. I'll try really hard not to break
anything else.
John Slade
Message 19
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| Subject: | Switch Alternatives for Galls flashers |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: Mark Phillips <ripsteel@edge.net>
Hello agin A-list-
I have been searching without luck for ANY alternative to bat-handle
toggle switches for my panel- let's face it, when was the last time you
plopped yer fanny down in a $60K sports car and saw bat-handles? The
combinations of these critters that Bob shows in the Connection are
testimony to their variety and versatility, but I'd sure like to know if
anyone's dug up some alternatives. I would really like to find some
illuminated rockers (or short handled toggles) with the single small LED
(or light) indicating the circuit is energized for stuff like exterior
lights, fuel pump, e-bus feed etc. but so far have only come up with
some that are SPST i.e., OFF-ON, and precious little else. Have
searched the web, Digikey, Mouser, Jap-shack, Autozone etc. with no joy.
Mouser sells a slick little switch by Mountain Switch:
http://www.mouser.com//catalog/specsheets/011115.pdf
#103-R13-112LP-02R (or Y or G) that would be perfect, but yep, itsa
SPST. This will work for fuel pump, E-bus feed, cabin blower etc, but
my biggest problem is switches for Landing/Taxi/Wigwag- On his website,
Bob published:
http://www.aeroelectric.com/articles/galls2ww.pdf
using the FS-033 "Traffic Runner". My FS020 flasher just arrived
yesterday and it looks like the same thing, just different flash timing.
So here's the big question: Using 3 SPST switches, with a landing
light in one wingtip and a taxi light in the other, will this work-
Switch one- from main bus direct to Landing light
Switch two- from e-bus direct to Taxi light
Switch tre- from main bus to white and red wires on flasher, then blue
and yellow wires from flasher to switched side of the other two switches.
My biggest concern is that selecting either light without flasher will
activate the other light THROUGH the flasher. Anyone know if this would
work before I ruin this thing? I doubt Galls will take back one of
their units oozing smelly stuff! (oh by the way, I AM using bat-handles
for the mags- the starter lockout is unbeatable!!! Thanks Bob!)
Thanks as always from The PossumWorks,
Mark Phillips do not archive
Message 20
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| Subject: | Re: Lancair BMA Flight Testing |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <bob.nuckolls@cox.net>
At 10:53 PM 1/15/2003 +0100, you wrote:
>--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Werner Schneider"
><WernerSchneider@compuserve.com>
>
>Hello Folks,
>
>I wanted to share following posting from Denis Douglas in the Glastar Net.
>
>It seems, that BMA made some progress, Bob, as you have good contacts into
>Lancair, can you confirm?
I spoke with Kirk on another matter just after they
finished installing the system in the airplane. Kirk
told me about weather problems and said the BMA crew
retired to Portland to wait it out. I've not spoken
with him since.
This is good news indeed! I'll call Kirk tomorrow
and see if he has any nitty-gritty details to share.
Bob . . .
Message 21
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| Subject: | Re: Switch Alternatives for Galls flashers |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: Robert McCallum <robert.mccallum2@sympatico.ca>
Mark Phillips wrote:
> --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: Mark Phillips <ripsteel@edge.net>
>
> Hello agin A-list-
>
> I have been searching without luck for ANY alternative to bat-handle
> toggle switches for my panel- let's face it, when was the last time you
> plopped yer fanny down in a $60K sports car and saw bat-handles? The
> combinations of these critters that Bob shows in the Connection are
> testimony to their variety and versatility, but I'd sure like to know if
> anyone's dug up some alternatives. I would really like to find some
> illuminated rockers
You might take a look at the switches listed here. Rocker style -- illuminated
or not-- single or
double pole-- and all the configurations Bob lists for the toggle style. Scroll
down to 8553 series
and 4 pole gets added to the mix with all the same configurations.
http://aerospace.eaton.com/pdfs/power/rocker.pdf
--
Bob McC
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