Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 02:33 AM - Strobe wireing (Hans - Peter Reusser)
2. 06:02 AM - sealed connectors (Gary Casey)
3. 06:48 AM - Re: sealed connectors (Benford2@aol.com)
4. 06:54 AM - Re: Names (Robert L. Nuckolls, III)
5. 07:01 AM - Re: sealed connectors (David Swartzendruber)
6. 07:01 AM - Re: Power Distribution (Robert L. Nuckolls, III)
7. 07:04 AM - Re: Strobe wireing (Robert L. Nuckolls, III)
8. 07:19 AM - Re: 12 volts to 28 volts (Robert L. Nuckolls, III)
9. 07:33 AM - Mechanical A/H backup (Fergus Kyle)
10. 07:49 AM - Re: 12 volts to 28 volts (Jim V. Wickert)
11. 07:53 AM - Re: Mechanical A/H backup (BobsV35B@aol.com)
12. 08:18 AM - Ford alternator vs B&C (N823ms@aol.com)
13. 08:48 AM - B&C Alternators 60A/20A (N823ms@aol.com)
14. 08:58 AM - Re: wind driven power source? (Robert L. Nuckolls, III)
15. 09:05 AM - Re: B&C Alternators 60A/20A (Robert L. Nuckolls, III)
16. 09:09 AM - Re: Ford alternator vs B&C (Robert L. Nuckolls, III)
17. 10:48 AM - avionics mounting (mike.weed@acterna.com)
18. 11:24 AM - Fw: amp/volt gauge/ shunts and wiring (N823ms@aol.com)
19. 11:35 AM - Common Ground/Ground power contactor# (N823ms@aol.com)
20. 11:41 AM - Re: avionics mounting (Robert L. Nuckolls, III)
21. 11:54 AM - Re: Fw: amp/volt gauge/ shunts and wiring (Canyon)
22. 12:09 PM - Re: Fw: amp/volt gauge/ shunts and wiring (N823ms@aol.com)
23. 12:11 PM - Aeroelectric contactors/Z-14 (N823ms@aol.com)
24. 01:28 PM - Re: avionics mounting (BobsV35B@aol.com)
25. 02:04 PM - AW: Strobe wireing (Hans - Peter Reusser)
26. 03:20 PM - Re: 12 volts to 28 volts (Stephen J. Soule)
27. 03:36 PM - Re: Aeroelectric contactors/Z-14 (Robert L. Nuckolls, III)
28. 03:36 PM - sealed connector part #'s (Benford2@aol.com)
29. 03:39 PM - Re: AW: Strobe wireing (Robert L. Nuckolls, III)
30. 05:40 PM - Re: 12 volts to 28 volts (Tom Brusehaver)
31. 05:52 PM - Re: 12 volts to 28 volts (Jerzy Krasinski)
32. 06:29 PM - Re: 12 volts to 28 volts (richard@riley.net)
33. 08:15 PM - Re: 12 volts to 28 volts (Jerzy Krasinski)
Message 1
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--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Hans - Peter Reusser" <hpreusser@tiscalinet.ch>
Could anyone give me some advice on the following subject?
I'm building a whelen wing strobelight system in to my Europa XS. As I mount
the power sply. at about half span in to the wing, (trough the ail.
bellcrank acess door), I would like to have a connector for the feeder and
the high tension leeds for ease of maint.
Now my question? Is it possible to go with the 2 feeder wires and the 3 high
tension wires through one single 5 pin connector? or would I risk to get
radio interference from this layout?
What kind of connector should I use for it, or if I need to seperate the
installation, what kind of connector is necessary for the high tension
leeds?
Many thanks, Hans-Peter, Europa XS, Mono, 700 hrs buildtime
*****************************************************************
Hans-Peter und Christa Reusser Tel: +41 (33) 654 00 24
Spiezbergstr. 13 Fax: +41 (33) 654 30 21
3700 Spiez E-mail: hpreusser@tiscalinet.ch
*****************************************************************
Message 2
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| Subject: | sealed connectors |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Gary Casey" <glcasey@adelphia.net>
<<Gary -
Could you provide a website or other info on these connectors. They sound
interesting.
John Schroeder
Super ES
>The "USCAR" connectors use a shroud over the seal to protect against water
>>>>>spray.>>
Welcome to the Black Hole of automotive connectors. It is a difficult
morass to traverse as many of the connectors are custom-designed and are not
available to the public. Many others are only available in one half as the
other mate is always integrated into some device (like our sensors). The
most readily available connector is from Packard Electric, a division of
Delphi Automotive (www.delphiauto.com), as they put just about every type in
their catalog and they sell through Pioneer-Standard
(www.pioneer-standard.com). Their current line does NOT meet the "USCAR"
standards and mostly are not available with gold pins. However, I wouldn't
be worried about using them in any but the most intense vibration or
water-spray environments. AMP, a division of TYCO, is probably worldwide
the most commonly used USCAR connector and you can find their products in
Mouser, Newark and others. The big problem is that their sealed automotive
connectors aren't there and you will have a terrible time trying to get them
at a reasonable price. I recently had to buy 1,000 directly from TYCO as an
OEM purchase just to get 25. However, with appropriate wandering through
their website (www.tycoint.com), also not easy, you can sometimes get them
to send you a few free samples which might be all you need. With all these
connector suppliers to find inline connectors (both mating pairs) in a
variety of pin numbers is not easy. Packard has a reasonable variety of
1,2,3, and 4-pin types. TYCO, as I recall, has 2,3 and 4-pin versions.
Sometimes there are more, sometimes not. Yazaki is another big supplier in
Detroit and a division of Sylvania is also in there. Deutsch
(http://www.deutschipd.com/) is one of the best, but I haven't worked my
way through their website. The list goes on.
Gary Casey
Message 3
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| Subject: | Re: sealed connectors |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: Benford2@aol.com
I have used those watertight connectors all throughout my plane. Every place
where moisture is present like tail feathers to fuselage/ wings to
fuselage/landing light etc. You can buy them at auto parts stores. I got mine
at a Federated jobber but I have seen them at NAPA too. These plugs are the
ones used in sensors and have O rings for a sealing device and are a positive
lock, almost too positive. They come in 1,2,3,and four wire configs.
JT&T is the name on the package but I am not sure if they are the
manufacturer. When the parts store opens this mornin I will get you guys the
part numbers for those. I have to warn ya they are not cheap, seems to me
they were 12-17$ for each mating pair. They do have 14ga pig tails on them
so they were perfect for my strobes/fuel senders/nav lights position
lights,trim servos and other stuff. Seeya. Ben Haas. N801BH.
Message 4
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--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <bob.nuckolls@cox.net>
At 09:31 PM 2/20/2003 -0700, you wrote:
>--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Jim Pack" <jpack@igs3.com>
>
>Bob,
>
>In a dual battery / dual alt system, why do you call it a Main & Aux bus?
When one of the alternators is much smaller than the other,
the notion is that the big kahuna is the "main" alternator
and the smaller is an auxiliary support device. This doesn't
mean that both cannot or should not have 100% duty cycle
tasks as depicted in Z-14 . . .
>In the dual/dual configuration the Aux bus isn't really for auxiliary (or
>backup) power - its for primary power to the items on that bus. Either bus
>is a backup to the other.
>
>Wouldn't "bus one" and "bus two" (not to be confused with "thing one and
>thing two" from my kids books) or "Left Bus & Right Bus", or "Big Bus &
>Little Bus" or "Bus 60 & Bus 20" or something of the sort be more
>descriptive?
We do Right/Left for equal sized systems . . . I suppose
a tandem twin might go Forward/Aft. But like naming your
kids, the bottom line is that you can name them anything
you like.
Bob . . .
|-------------------------------------------------------|
| The man who does not read good books has no advantage |
| over the man who cannot read them. |
| - Mark Twain |
|-------------------------------------------------------|
Message 5
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| Subject: | sealed connectors |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "David Swartzendruber" <dswartzendruber@earthlink.net>
I've been using some Deutsch IPD connectors. They're sealed, use high
quality solid pins and sockets, and are easy to buy in small quantities
from www.laddinc.com. The DTM series are good up to 7.5 amps, DT up to
13 amps. These are both plastic connectors. They also have round
connectors in both plastic and aluminum.
Dave in Wichita
Message 6
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| Subject: | Re: Power Distribution |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <bob.nuckolls@cox.net>
At 11:00 PM 2/20/2003 -0500, you wrote:
>--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: N823ms@aol.com
>
>Bob: Would like to run this by you one more time. I have included some of my
>thought process on some items. Would appreciate your comments and
>recommendations, I have also asked John Schroeder for his comments since Ron
>and him are building a Lancair ES as well.
>
>Thanks,
>
>Ed Silvanic
>
># 1 POWER DISTRIBUTION BUS
>
>Main Alt Fld 5A. Ford Motorcraft 60A 12vdc. Internal regulator. How is
>Z-24 incorporated into Z-14 so as to behave like the Z-14, i.e., LO Voltage
>sensor. Since this is not a LR3, would an ABMM be good here?
With an internally regulated alternator, you remove the Z-14
alternators and regulators and drop in Z-24 to replace them. You
then have to ADD LV warning which can be accomplished with
the LVWarn/ABMM or similar product.
> Or should I just
>ask my manufacturer to swap out the ford alternator for a B&C 60A?
The B&C alternator will probably run the lifetime of your
airplane. Wouldn't give you $20 for a boat load of Fords.
>Main Alt OV/LV sensor 2A?
This lead draws less than 1A . . . any
size from 5A (22AWG limited) down will be fine.
>OV I know would take one of those crowbar modules.
Yes, for Z-24
>Strobe light 7A.
Okay
> Opposed to the normal lights on the Lancair Es, I am
>installing the three way lighting system. Where the Nav light would normally
>go, I am putting some 55watt miniature white halogen lights which will be
>used as taxi lights or sometimes know as runway turnoff lights. Left and
>right taxi lights will have separate switches.
Fine
>Landing Light 10A
>
>NAV/POS lights will be wired together. 7A
>
>Left/Right taxi lights 10A? I will have to check the spec sheet here for
>these AutoZone lights. Question here is: Since I will have separate
>switches,LT/RT, do I run both of the same fuse box circuit, or use separate
>fuse for each side?
I like to power each device through it's own
circuit protection and control. Position lights
are the notable exception.
>Electric Directional Gyro
>Flap motor 5A
>Flap indicator 2A
>Pitot 10A
>Cabin Fan 5A
>Door seal Pump 5A
>Cabin lights 5A will have four individual eyeball lights that have there own
>on/off switch. Should run them all through one circuit i.e. a master on/off
>power switch?
>These lights are reading/map lights.
>Cabin Dome light
>Pitch trim 2A
>Roll trim 2A
>Yaw Trim 2A
>Engine Gauges by Electronics International
>Ultimate Bar graph
>FP5-L
>Oil/Temp
>RPM
>MAP
>Electric DG
>Starter 7A
>Spare
>Spare
>#2 POWER DISTRIBUTION
>
>Aux Alt Fld-B&C 20 amp, on the vacuum pad
>Aux Alt Lo volt sensor
>Garmin Aud/Com 340
>Garmin GNS-530
>Garmin GNS-430
>Garmin GTX-327
>Dynon EFIS D10
>TruTrak Autopilot
>Six pack lighting rings
>GI-106A
>GI-102
>Electric Attitude Indicator
>
>MAIN BATTERY BUS
>
>Amp/Volt gauge: I can use a switch to read Aux battery, or utilize the
>amp/volt function on the Dynon EFIS to read one of the systems.
>GNS-530/430 memory
>Clock
>Fuel boost pump High/Low positions
>Future Electronic Ignition
>Power receptacle for handheld nav/com/gps
>
>Looking at the above Bus, may have to go to a 10 fuse box
>
>AUX BATTERY BUS
>
>Hobbs meter
>Future Electronic Ignition
>Power receptacle for handheld nav/com/gps.
>Cargo light-timer
>
>Well there you have it. Now to complete the load analysis part of it.
>Regards----Ed
>
Looks good at first blush. Load Analysis is the
true acid test.
Bob . . .
Message 7
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| Subject: | Re: Strobe wireing |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <bob.nuckolls@cox.net>
At 11:31 AM 2/21/2003 +0100, you wrote:
>--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Hans - Peter Reusser"
><hpreusser@tiscalinet.ch>
>
>Could anyone give me some advice on the following subject?
>
>I'm building a whelen wing strobelight system in to my Europa XS. As I mount
>the power sply. at about half span in to the wing, (trough the ail.
>bellcrank acess door), I would like to have a connector for the feeder and
>the high tension leeds for ease of maint.
>Now my question? Is it possible to go with the 2 feeder wires and the 3 high
>tension wires through one single 5 pin connector? or would I risk to get
>radio interference from this layout?
>What kind of connector should I use for it, or if I need to seperate the
>installation, what kind of connector is necessary for the high tension
>leeds?
Don't understand. The power supply already has
connectors right on it. Do I deduce that you want to
run short leads from two connectors into a single
connector? If so, the gain in convenience is low,
increase in parts count drives reliability down.
But if you gotta do this, a 5-pin plastic connector
would function with low risk of noise problems.
Bob . . .
Message 8
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| Subject: | Re: 12 volts to 28 volts |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <bob.nuckolls@cox.net>
At 06:09 PM 2/20/2003 -0500, you wrote:
>--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Stephen J. Soule"
><SSoule@pfclaw.com>
>
>As the owner of a nice 28 volt Bendix-King KY-196, I would like to install
>it in my 12 volt RV-8 under construction. Where could I buy a device to step
>up the voltage from 12 to 28 volts, or where can I find plans to build a
>device that will work for a com radio? Also, I would appreciate any real
>world advice from those who have tried it. By the way, I have an email to
>Sure Power, who builds such devices, but they have not responded yet with a
>recommendation.
KGS makes a line of these. A 6A device is about $600 dealer net.
If you could get a toroidal core wound with right amount of
wire, the rest of a two-transistor, saturated core power
oscillator is pretty easy to fabricate. We built hundreds of
these things for various power conditioning/conversion tasks
back in the 70's and 80's
You could dig through the application notes from Linear
Technology and perhaps come up with a circuit using a
more modern, high frequency, switch-mode power supply.
Bob . . .
Message 9
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| Subject: | Mechanical A/H backup |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Fergus Kyle" <VE3LVO@rac.ca>
Cheers,
"I have no idea how the "big boys" do AHRS systems in a Boeing, but they
always have a mechanical gyro backup.
Just a few things to consider."
Boeing have no choice - it's mandated.
Ferg
Message 10
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| Subject: | Re: 12 volts to 28 volts |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Jim V. Wickert" <JimW_btg@compuserve.com>
If yoiu are in to building your own Radio Shack has a book Building Power
Supplies that also has several chapters and projects to build step down and
step up converters. They include both the design theory, the actual
schematics and BOM's for each design and several version of each as well
for various current requirements. Quite easy to understand.
New Second Edition, PTNO. 62-1337, by David Lines, Published by Master
Publishing, Inc., Lincolnwood IL, I got mine for $1.97 at my local Radio
Shack about three weeks ago.
Jim Wickert
Vision #159
Message 11
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| Subject: | Re: Mechanical A/H backup |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: BobsV35B@aol.com
In a message dated 2/21/03 9:33:53 AM Central Standard Time, VE3LVO@rac.ca
writes:
> Boeing have no choice - it's mandated.
> Ferg
>
Good Morning Ferg,
I agree that a standby attitude instrument is required equipment, but does it
have to be a gyro?
I think there are solid state devices that are approved for the backup unit.
However, the prices I have seen were between twenty-five and forty-five
thousand US dollars per unit.
Makes for a rather high priced back up for we little guys. On top of that,
all that I have seen required twenty-eight volts for power.
Happy Skies,
Old Bob
Message 12
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| Subject: | Ford alternator vs B&C |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: N823ms@aol.com
In a message dated 2/21/2003 9:04:04 AM Central Standard Time,
bob.nuckolls@cox.net writes:
>
> Looks good at first blush. Load Analysis is the
> true acid test.
>
Bob:
Thanks for looking at my second pass. Now I will rap up the load analysis for
the true test. Were you suggesting and/or recommending the swap out of the
Ford Alternator for the B&C? I'll see if the manufacturer will do that.
Probably not much of a credit, perhaps I should just try to sell it on E-Bay.
Ed
Message 13
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| Subject: | B&C Alternators 60A/20A |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: N823ms@aol.com
Bob:
Before you even get a chance of answering my last question. What are
the model numbers/prices of the B&C 60A/20A alternators for a Continental
IO-520 "D" engine. The 20A going on the vacuum pad, and the 60A would replace
the belt driven Ford Motorcraft.
Ed Silvanic
Message 14
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| Subject: | Re: wind driven power source? |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <bob.nuckolls@cox.net>
At 10:33 AM 2/21/2003 -0600, you wrote:
>Bob,
>First, thanks for the reply.
>As far as output, I think 15 amps (plus or minus a few) would drive
>lights, radio, Xponder, and an electronic ignition (far into the
>future). Most of the automotive alternators weigh I've checked from 9.5
>to 12 pounds and put out a max of 50 to 60 amps (way too much). There are
>light weight aircraft alternators I've seen but, the cost is over the
>top. I can go a few more pounds for the difference in cost ($25 or so
>versus $300).
>I'm guessing a blade small enough to turn it at 1000 RPM would provide all
>the power I need and I have a good mounting place on the gear that could
>handle that (the gear is virtually a copy of an early Cub).
>Thanks again, Karl
Minimum speed for output voltage on most
alternators will be something on the order
of 3,000 rpm. Minimum speed for full output
is on the order of 5,000 rpm. For example,
a 40A Nipon-Denso running at about 3,900
rpm gives you 20A . . . you can probably
count on 15A with with perhaps 3,500 rpm.
15A at 14 volts is 210 watts output. Assuming
60% efficiency in alternator at this edge of
the envelope operation, and 50% efficiency
in a propeller, you'll have to take 700 watts
of energy out of the slip stream . . . almost
1 h.p.
I'd have to dig out the books to see how
big a propeller this is for an 80 mph
airplane . . . but I suspect it's
pretty breathtaking. Have you considered
finding a -12 accessory case for your
engine?
Bob . . .
Message 15
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| Subject: | Re: B&C Alternators 60A/20A |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <bob.nuckolls@cox.net>
At 11:46 AM 2/21/2003 -0500, you wrote:
>--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: N823ms@aol.com
>
>Bob:
>
> Before you even get a chance of answering my last question. What are
>the model numbers/prices of the B&C 60A/20A alternators for a Continental
>IO-520 "D" engine. The 20A going on the vacuum pad, and the 60A would replace
>the belt driven Ford Motorcraft.
SD-20 on teh vacuum pump pad. L-60 for the belt driven. Don't
know if B&C has brackets to attach L-60 to your engine. We have
an L-60 on the back of a Continental powered Bonanza at
RAC . . . I think our shops had to fabricate a bracket. Call
B&C at 316.283.8000 and get more details.
Bob . . .
Message 16
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| Subject: | Re: Ford alternator vs B&C |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <bob.nuckolls@cox.net>
At 11:17 AM 2/21/2003 -0500, you wrote:
>--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: N823ms@aol.com
>
>In a message dated 2/21/2003 9:04:04 AM Central Standard Time,
>bob.nuckolls@cox.net writes:
>
>
> >
> > Looks good at first blush. Load Analysis is the
> > true acid test.
> >
>
>Bob:
>
>Thanks for looking at my second pass. Now I will rap up the load analysis for
>the true test. Were you suggesting and/or recommending the swap out of the
>Ford Alternator for the B&C? I'll see if the manufacturer will do that.
>Probably not much of a credit, perhaps I should just try to sell it on E-Bay.
That's what I'd do if it were my airplane. OTOH, you
may find yourself at the upper end of the bell-curve
on Ford alternator longevity . . . given that you already
have it, -AND FURHTER- you plan dual alternators, there
is little risk in running the Ford. You can make your
repair/replace decision based on experience
as opposed to anyone else's personal preferences.
Bob . . .
Message 17
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| Subject: | avionics mounting |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: mike.weed@acterna.com
Is there a standard for mounting screw distances between centers and front
to back spacing for avionics? I know there are standards for the Dzus
mount style, but what about the "normal" stuff. I'm looking for something
similar to the EIA-310 standard for rack mount equipment. In other words,
can I make up a set of tapped rails for the avionics stack and know that
everything will line up? Or is everything "line drilled"?
Thanks,
Mike
Message 18
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| Subject: | Fwd: amp/volt gauge/ shunts and wiring |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: N823ms@aol.com
Bob:
This is a reply from Electronics International, concerning my volt/amp
gauge.
Ed
From: "EI Tech Support" <Sales@Buy-Ei.com>
Subject: RE: amp/volt gauge/ shunts and wiring
Ed -
Thank you for your email. I am unaware of a voltammeter that will read
correctly from two different shunts that have different shunt values.
As far shunts are concerned, there are no "correct" or "incorrect" shunt
values. The only concern is that you select a shunt that will accommodate
your generator or alternator. In your case, you have 60 Amp and 20 Amp
alternators. You will need to select at least a 60 Amp shunt to accommodate
both.
There are two possible installations that come to mind when I picture your
system. If the two alternators feed into one line that goes to the bus, you
can get away with installing one shunt in the line after both alternators.
If, however, the two alternators are parallel and feed into separate lines
that both go to the bus, you will need two shunts.
Electronics International's Voltammeter's will not read from two different
shunts that have different shunt values. A possible solution to the second
installation would be to install two S-50 shunts and one VA-1A-50. Both
shunts have the same value and the instrument will read both of them. You
could then install an RSVA-2 switch to select between the two systems. You
could also install a third shunt in your battery lead and install an RSVA-3
switch.
The shunts I mentioned retail for $35. The switches are each $100. The
instrument retails for $342.
If you have any questions, or if I can be of any assistance, please don't
hesitate to contact me.
Tyler Speed
Electronics International Inc.
63296 Powell Butte Highway
Bend, OR 97701
Phone: (541) 318-6060
Fax: (541) 318-7575
Web: <http://www.buy-ei.com/> www.Buy-Ei.com
-----Original Message-----
From: N823ms@aol.com [mailto:N823ms@aol.com]
Subject: amp/volt gauge/ shunts and wiring
Hey Guys,
I am beginning to install and wire up my instrument panel for a
Lancair ES. I will be running an all electric airplane, i.e. 60A/20A
alternators. What is the correct shunt for these alternators? Lancair sent
me the volt/amp gauge with the external shunt 60A/100mv. I have seen where
yo can install a switch so as to read either the 60A alt, or the 20A alt
system. With the current shunt, I believe this means that at full amp load,
60amp system, a full deflection on the gauge would occur. Flip the switch
and now full deflection would mean a 20amp load. So with that in mind,
unless there is specific required shunt, if I get the 60A/50mv shunt, would
this mean that the gauge would indicate a full load of 60amps with a half
deflection on the gauge? If so, then anything further would indicate a load
of more than 60A/20A respectively as the gauge went toward a full
deflection. Is this something I would want to be aware of should I
temporarily exceed? Do you have the electrical schematics for wiring a
switch so as to read either system? What kind of amperage rating is on this
gauge? I will be installing in the future a Dynon EFIS -10, which has a
function of reading volts/amps. Until then I'll have to use the switch
method, or even do both if that is possible so as to have a back up if
either gauge was to fail.
Thanks,
Ed Silvanic
N823MS@aol.com
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Ed -
<span 10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>
<span 10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>Thank you for your email. I am
unaware of a voltammeter that will read correctly from two different shunts
that have different shunt values.
<span 10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>
<span 10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>As far shunts are concerned, there are
no
correct or incorrect shunt values. The only
concern is that you select a shunt that will accommodate your generator or
alternator. In your case, you have 60 Amp and 20 Amp alternators.
You will need to select at least a 60 Amp shunt to accommodate both.
<span 10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>
<span 10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>There are two possible installations
that
come to mind when I picture your system. If the two alternators feed into
one line that goes to the bus, you can get away with installing one shunt in
the line after both alternators. If, however, the two alternators are
parallel and feed into separate lines that both go to the bus, you will need
two shunts.
<span 10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>
<span 10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>Electronics International's Voltammeter's
will not read from two different shunts that have different shunt values.
A possible solution to the second installation would be to install two S-50
shunts and one VA-1A-50. Both shunts have the same value and the
instrument will read both of them. You could then install an RSVA-2
switch to select between the two systems. You could also install a third
shunt in your battery lead and install an RSVA-3 switch.
<span 10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>
<span 10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>The shunts I mentioned retail for
$35. The switches are each $100. The instrument retails for $342.
<span 10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>
<span 10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>If you have any questions, or if I can
be
of any assistance, please don't hesitate to contact me.
<span 10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>
<span 10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>
<span 10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>Tyler Speed
Electronics
International Inc.
63296
Powell Butte Highway
Bend, OR 97701
Phone: (541) 318-6060
Fax: (541) 318-7575
Web: <a href"http://www.buy-ei.com/">www.Buy-Ei.com
-----Original Message-----
From: N823ms@aol.com [mailto:N823ms@aol.com]
10:20 PM
Subject: amp/volt gauge/ shunts
and wiring
Hey Guys,
I am beginning to install and wire up my
instrument panel for a Lancair ES. I will be running an all electric airplane,
i.e. 60A/20A alternators. What is the correct shunt for these alternators?
Lancair sent me the volt/amp gauge with the external shunt 60A/100mv. I have
seen where yo can install a switch so as to read either the 60A alt, or the=2020A
alt system. With the current shunt, I believe this means that at full amp load,
60amp system, a full deflection on the gauge would occur. Flip the switch and
now full deflection would mean a 20amp load. So with that in mind, unless there
is specific required shunt, if I get the 60A/50mv shunt, would this mean that
the gauge would indicate a full load of 60amps with a half deflection on the
gauge? If so, then anything further would indicate a load of more than 60A/20A
respectively as the gauge went toward a full deflection. Is this something I
would want to be aware of should I temporarily exceed? Do you have the
electrical schematics for wiring a switch so as to read either system? What
kind of amperage rating is on this gauge? I will be installing in the future a
Dynon EFIS -10, which has a function of reading volts/amps. Until then I'll
have to use the switch method, or even do both if that is possible so as to
have a back up if either gauge was to fail.
Thanks,
Ed Silvanic
N823MS@aol.com
Message 19
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| Subject: | Common Ground/Ground power contactor# |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: N823ms@aol.com
Bob:
You mentioned awhile back about a common ground point for people who
install their batteries in the back such as I will with this Lancair ES. What
device would you use as a common ground point? Second, you mentioned then to
run 4AWG wire to the front from the battery contactors to the cross-feed
contactor. Since I have abundant amount of welding 2awg cable; would it be ok
to use this vise 4awg.
Thanks
Ed Silvanic
Message 20
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| Subject: | Re: avionics mounting |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <bob.nuckolls@cox.net>
At 01:51 PM 2/21/2003 -0500, you wrote:
>--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: mike.weed@acterna.com
>
>Is there a standard for mounting screw distances between centers and front
>to back spacing for avionics? I know there are standards for the Dzus
>mount style, but what about the "normal" stuff. I'm looking for something
>similar to the EIA-310 standard for rack mount equipment. In other words,
>can I make up a set of tapped rails for the avionics stack and know that
>everything will line up? Or is everything "line drilled"?
I suspect it's pretty much drill-to-match. We ARE fortunate
that they settled on a common width. . . .
Bob . . .
Message 21
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| Subject: | Re: Fwd: amp/volt gauge/ shunts and wiring |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: Canyon <steve.canyon@verizon.net>
N823ms@undoubtedly.com wrote:
>Electronics International's Voltammeter's will not read from two
>different
>shunts that have different shunt values.
---
I'm sure Bob will give you the scoop on this, but for my own
clarification, is the EI instrument truly a two in one? That is, it
has two scales, one for voltage and the other for current? If so, are
there 4 terminals, or 3 terminals or what?
In any event, this kind of ammeter is really a voltmeter anyway. It
reads the voltage across the shunt and reports the value in amps, only
because of the scale provided on the instrument, and is often called an
ammeter. If it also reads voltage, it undoubtedly has at least 3
terminals and a separate calibration resistor for the voltage scale,
probably internal.
You may be able to use two shunts quite easily if each has the shunt
value required to read full scale @ 60 A on one and 20 A on the
other. Whether that's wise may also be another matter. And if the
scale is wrong for the two different ammeter values, that might be
problematic -- you might rescale it for % of capacity?
Message 22
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| Subject: | Re: Fwd: amp/volt gauge/ shunts and wiring |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: N823ms@aol.com
Thanks for your comments. I am doing the Z-14 system. I have the gauge
already, I'll just have to take a look at the schematics and determine what
exactly the capability of this gauge is.
Thanks,
Ed
Message 23
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| Subject: | Aeroelectric contactors/Z-14 |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: N823ms@aol.com
Bob:
Do all the contactors for the Z-14 system come with the diodes?
Ed Silvanic
Message 24
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| Subject: | Re: avionics mounting |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: BobsV35B@aol.com
In a message dated 2/21/03 1:42:21 PM Central Standard Time,
bob.nuckolls@cox.net writes:
> In other words,
> >can I make up a set of tapped rails for the avionics stack and know that
> >everything will line up? Or is everything "line drilled"?
>
Good Afternoon All,
Has anyone checked out the Radiorax Products?
I have set of their "experimental" version on the way.
We shall see what we shall see.
See them at <A HREF="www.radiorax.com">www.radiorax.com
Happy Skies,
Old Bob
Message 25
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--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Hans - Peter Reusser" <hpreusser@tiscalinet.ch>
>Now my question? Is it possible to go with the 2 feeder wires and the 3
high
>tension wires through one single 5 pin connector? or would I risk to get
>radio interference from this layout?
>What kind of connector should I use for it, or if I need to seperate the
>installation, what kind of connector is necessary for the high tension
>leeds?
Don't understand. The power supply already has
connectors right on it. Do I deduce that you want to
run short leads from two connectors into a single
connector? If so, the gain in convenience is low,
increase in parts count drives reliability down.
But if you gotta do this, a 5-pin plastic connector
would function with low risk of noise problems.
Bob . . .
Thanks
I have the whelen A490T, CF which have no connectors on it but two cables
running out of them with plastic connectors on the high tension cable. This
cable is too short to reach the wingtip and too long to get at it trough the
access door. My plan is to shorten both cables from the pwr sply. and make
the connection close to the access door.
Hans-Peter...
Message 26
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|
| Subject: | 12 volts to 28 volts |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Stephen J. Soule" <SSoule@pfclaw.com>
Thanks for the information. Are you trying to use a 28 volt radio in a 12
system, too?
Steve
-----Original Message-----
New Second Edition, PTNO. 62-1337, by David Lines, Published by Master
Publishing, Inc., Lincolnwood IL, I got mine for $1.97 at my local Radio
Shack about three weeks ago.
Jim Wickert
Vision #159
Message 27
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| Subject: | Re: Aeroelectric contactors/Z-14 |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <bob.nuckolls@cox.net>
At 03:10 PM 2/21/2003 -0500, you wrote:
>--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: N823ms@aol.com
>
>Bob:
>
>Do all the contactors for the Z-14 system come with the diodes?
>
>Ed Silvanic
If you order them from B&C, yes.
Bob . . .
Message 28
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| Subject: | sealed connector part #'s |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: Benford2@aol.com
JT&T
2865F is a single connector
2866F double
2867F triple
2868F quad
Message 29
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| Subject: | Re: Strobe wireing |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <bob.nuckolls@cox.net>
At 11:01 PM 2/21/2003 +0100, you wrote:
>--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Hans - Peter Reusser"
><hpreusser@tiscalinet.ch>
>
>
> >Now my question? Is it possible to go with the 2 feeder wires and the 3
>high
> >tension wires through one single 5 pin connector? or would I risk to get
> >radio interference from this layout?
> >What kind of connector should I use for it, or if I need to seperate the
> >installation, what kind of connector is necessary for the high tension
> >leeds?
>
> Don't understand. The power supply already has
> connectors right on it. Do I deduce that you want to
> run short leads from two connectors into a single
> connector? If so, the gain in convenience is low,
> increase in parts count drives reliability down.
>
> But if you gotta do this, a 5-pin plastic connector
> would function with low risk of noise problems.
>
> Bob . . .
>
>Thanks
>I have the whelen A490T, CF which have no connectors on it but two cables
>running out of them with plastic connectors on the high tension cable. This
>cable is too short to reach the wingtip and too long to get at it trough the
>access door. My plan is to shorten both cables from the pwr sply. and make
>the connection close to the access door.
Aha! That makes sense. Go ahead with what you've
suggested . . . it will be fine. Do you have access
to a source of plastic connectors like the Molex or
AMP Mate-n-Lock series? By the way, I got your book
dropped the mailbox a few minutes ago.
Bob . . .
Message 30
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| Subject: | Re: 12 volts to 28 volts |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: Tom Brusehaver <cozytom@mn.rr.com>
National Semiconductor has always gotten the web,
I usually appreciate their efforts, but usually
take them for granted. Last night at robotics club
one guy reminded me about them.
http://www.national.com/appinfo/webench/power/SS/SS.cgi?flow=power&step=0A
This page, you enter your requirements, min/max
Volts in, V out, and current. It'll pick your
parts, and give you a design. Really impressive!
The best I could get for these requirements tho
was about 2A out. Might not be enough for a
comm radio.
Message 31
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| Subject: | Re: 12 volts to 28 volts |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: Jerzy Krasinski <krasinski@direcway.com>
Before you start building a 12V to 24V converter check ASTRON 1212
converters. Their application is to convert positive ground 12 V into
negative ground 12 volt, for use in positive ground trucks, for driving
standard radio equipment. There are two models, one is good for
something around 6 or 8 amps and the other 1212-18 is good up to 18A.
It is easy to use this converters to get 24V. If you connect the
negative input of the converter to the plane's ground, connect the
ground wire of the converter to +13.5V battery line, you will get + 27V
between the output of the converter and the plane's ground. You would
pay around $130, if you buy the 18A version new from the company. But
if you check EBAY as I did, you can get it for $30.
The disadvantage of using it as I described is that you would have the
converter case floating at a hard 12V. It is not a big problem in a
composite plane but I hate if a box hangs out there at some hard
voltage. I opened the box and I found that the case is connected
only through four #6 screws holding the two pc boards. It is easy to
replace the steel screws with nylon and use nylon washers underneath the
mounting ears of the pc boards. Or use power transistor isolating
mounting plastic hardware and smaller steel screws. I did it the last
way because I did not have nylon screws at home but I had the plastic
sleeves for mounting transistors. Now, after checking with ohmmeter that
the case is really floating, you can connect the converter case to the
plane's ground , and it is all done.
I checked the converter and I was amazed by its good performance.
1) unlike most crude converters it takes very little current when the
output is not loaded.
2) it is electronically regulated and holds the output 12V voltage quite
rigid
3) it has decent filtering both on the input and on the output. It
shows very little ripple in mV range.The ripple frequency is around
500Hz I havent checked it with nav receivers yet, but considering small
ripple voltage I would be surprised if it caused troubles. If necessary,
an external filter in the power and output lines might help.
The smaller 1212 converter is more than sufficient to drive a 24V
navcom. I bought the big 1212-18 because it must also drive a 400Hz
converter for the gyros. The small converter cost from the factory is
somewhere around $70, but I am not very certain about that. Check
withAstron, Irvine California or hunt on Ebay.
Keep in mind that using this unorthodox type of arrangement one
connects 12V local battery IN SERIES with the regulated 12V output of
the converter. A purist might get not happy that the resulting total
output of 24V is not regulated since the battery is not regulated. But
the battery holds voltage in a narrow range and I have no problems with
that.
I work in electronics and initially I considered an idea of making 12V
to 24V converter because prices of aviation equipment are insane. I
immediately abandoned that idea as soon as I discovered Astron. I
thought it was worth the risk to buy it even factory new. Now after I
got it for $30 and it works as I thought it would, it seems that it was
one of my best recent deals.
I doubt if I would make a better and much cheaper converter and I know
that it would take me a lot of time, while moving the case ground of
the Astron converter took me only one evening, including all the
other testing and thinking.
Jerzy
Message 32
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| Subject: | Re: 12 volts to 28 volts |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: richard@riley.net
Check out http://freespace.virgin.net/andy.wright617/dcdc.htm
DC-DC CONVERTERS
We currently offer 2 types of dc-dc converters.
1) A switched capacitor converter designed to be used with 24V turn and
slip indicators. In common with all switched capacitor type converters the
output voltage is less than 24V when on load. This normally present no
problems. This converter takes the form of a circuit board with mounting
pillars to allow direct mounting on the back of large turn and slip
indicators.
2) A switched inductor converter capable of producing any output voltage
upto 65V DC. Output current is dependant upon output voltage and ranges
from about 3 amps down to 1 amp at the higher output voltages. The output
voltage does not droop on load.
This converter is ideal for use with instruments which consume larger
currents, such as 14V or 28V DC artificial horizons, or 28VDC turn and slip
indicators. The converter is housed in a rugged diecast box with screw
locking connectors for the input and output leads. This converter is also
ideal for eliminating unreliable 14V batteries which are used solely for
powering 14VDC artificial horizons.
Switched Capacitor Converter 20
Switched Inductor Converter 70
t 07:51 PM 2/21/03 -0600, Jerzy Krasinski wrote:
>--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: Jerzy Krasinski
><krasinski@direcway.com>
>
>Before you start building a 12V to 24V converter check ASTRON 1212
>converters. Their application is to convert positive ground 12 V into
>negative ground 12 volt, for use in positive ground trucks, for driving
>standard radio equipment. There are two models, one is good for
> something around 6 or 8 amps and the other 1212-18 is good up to 18A.
Message 33
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| Subject: | Re: 12 volts to 28 volts |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: Jerzy Krasinski <krasinski@direcway.com>
One thing I forgot to add about Astron converter.
After you mount the pc boards on plastic shims and with insulating
hardware, trim the top edge of copper on the copper coated pc board with
several electrolytic caps on it. That board will be in contact with the
cover, and if copper is left to the very edge of the board that would
create big sparks when you power it. You can also glue electrical tape
or a plastic sheet
inside the cover where the cover might get in contact with the pc board.
The other board, at least in my converter, did not have copper coating
to the very top, so I did not change anything there.
You do not have to make any extra connection since the case was used
only as a shield, and there are connecting wires already in place.
Jerzy
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