---------------------------------------------------------- AeroElectric-List Digest Archive --- Total Messages Posted Thu 05/08/03: 17 ---------------------------------------------------------- Today's Message Index: ---------------------- 1. 05:27 AM - Source for Brass Bolt (William Bernard) 2. 05:46 AM - Re: Source for Brass Bolt (David Swartzendruber) 3. 06:40 AM - Re: Source for Brass Bolt (Scott Bilinski) 4. 08:40 AM - Re: Source for Brass Bolt (Cy Galley) 5. 08:41 AM - Re: falcon t (Don Honabach) 6. 09:25 AM - Z-13 and Dual Electronic Ignitions (Muzzy Norman E) 7. 01:51 PM - Re: Source for Brass Bolt (Robert L. Nuckolls, III) 8. 02:09 PM - Whelen strobe current draw and grounding (Treff, Arthur) 9. 02:14 PM - Re: Source for Brass Bolt (N2321G@aol.com) 10. 03:12 PM - relay diode soldering (Gilles.Thesee) 11. 03:12 PM - Circuit protection question (Gilles.Thesee) 12. 04:22 PM - Re: Z-13 and Dual Electronic Ignitions (Joel Harding) 13. 04:51 PM - Re: Builder documentation on the Web-summary (Robert L. Nuckolls, III) 14. 04:58 PM - Re: Whelen strobe current draw and grounding (Robert L. Nuckolls, III) 15. 05:02 PM - Re: Circuit protection question (Robert L. Nuckolls, III) 16. 09:58 PM - LR3B Warning Light (DHPHKH@aol.com) 17. 10:07 PM - Re: relay diode soldering (Robert L. Nuckolls, III) ________________________________ Message 1 _____________________________________ Time: 05:27:25 AM PST US From: "William Bernard" Subject: AeroElectric-List: Source for Brass Bolt --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "William Bernard" I'm trying to follow Bob's recommendation to use a 5/16" (or bigger)brass bolt to get the ground wire through the firewall. I need to get the wire up from the bottom of the aircraft around a large fuel tank mounted near the firewall, up to the top where the ground buss is located. Does anyone have a source for a 5/16" bolt? The biggest I've been able to locate so far is 1/4". Thanks for the help. Bill ________________________________ Message 2 _____________________________________ Time: 05:46:29 AM PST US From: "David Swartzendruber" Subject: RE: AeroElectric-List: Source for Brass Bolt --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "David Swartzendruber" McMaster-Carr at www.mcmaster.com has them. P/N for a 2" bolt is 92941A591 and costs $5.97 for ten. B&C might sell you a bolt also. Dave in Wichita > > Does anyone have a source for a 5/16" bolt? The biggest I've been able to > locate so far is 1/4". > > Bill ________________________________ Message 3 _____________________________________ Time: 06:40:16 AM PST US From: Scott Bilinski Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Source for Brass Bolt --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: Scott Bilinski McMaster-Carr, 5/16-18 X 1 Do a search on McMaster-Carr P/N 92941A583 At 07:26 AM 5/8/03 -0500, you wrote: >--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "William Bernard" > > >I'm trying to follow Bob's recommendation to use a 5/16" (or bigger)brass >bolt to get the ground wire through the firewall. I need to get the wire up >from the bottom of the aircraft around a large fuel tank mounted near the >firewall, up to the top where the ground buss is located. > >Does anyone have a source for a 5/16" bolt? The biggest I've been able to >locate so far is 1/4". > >Thanks for the help. > >Bill > > Scott Bilinski Eng dept 305 Phone (858) 657-2536 Pager (858) 502-5190 ________________________________ Message 4 _____________________________________ Time: 08:40:08 AM PST US From: "Cy Galley" Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Source for Brass Bolt --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Cy Galley" Plumbing Supply? ----- Original Message ----- From: "William Bernard" Subject: AeroElectric-List: Source for Brass Bolt > --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "William Bernard" > > I'm trying to follow Bob's recommendation to use a 5/16" (or bigger)brass bolt to get the ground wire through the firewall. I need to get the wire up from the bottom of the aircraft around a large fuel tank mounted near the firewall, up to the top where the ground buss is located. > > Does anyone have a source for a 5/16" bolt? The biggest I've been able to locate so far is 1/4". > > Thanks for the help. > > Bill > > ________________________________ Message 5 _____________________________________ Time: 08:41:07 AM PST US Subject: RE: AeroElectric-List: falcon t From: "Don Honabach" --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Don Honabach" My panel is just going to be VFR, but I decided to go with the Dynon unit as well and received mine just last week. Extremely nice all in one unit and since I'm VFR only, the instrument count and panel complexity (both in front and in back) has just decreased dramatically. For what it's worth, they also have options for an internal battery backup and an external battery backup. So it would be very easy to have the instrument stay alive during an electric failure. Only issue so far is that the magnetic heading seems to jump around, but I haven't had a chance to do their calibration procedure yet and I'm still waiting on my external compass box which should also help. My only real complaint is that I don't have enough free time to try and design one myself. According to the folks at Dynon it's based 4 Cypress uControllers linked to solid-state gyros. I can't wait until someone comes out with a solid-state gyro package with a USB or similar interface - just jury rig a PC and screen and you've got your on customized EFIS unit. Regards, Don -----Original Message----- From: DAVID REEL [mailto:dreel@cox.net] Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: falcon t --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "DAVID REEL" If anyone out there thinks radio noise from a turn & bank indicator is going to be a problem, just wait until you have to try flying partial panel in an emergency. The Dynon EFIS provides a real backup considering that my own, and I would guess most people's, partial panel skills are lethally rusty. Yes it's 2 grand and not IFR certified, but it's just the ticket for emergency backup in a VFR panel. I'd toss the turn and bank. Dave Reel - RV8A direct advertising on the Matronics Forums. ________________________________ Message 6 _____________________________________ Time: 09:25:48 AM PST US From: "Muzzy Norman E" Subject: AeroElectric-List: Z-13 and Dual Electronic Ignitions --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Muzzy Norman E" I will run with a 40A alternator and an SD-8 for engine driven power sources, and a pair of electronic ignition systems (no mags). The Z-13 diagram lays out the architecture for the SD-8 and L40 charging system with one battery. I could wire my ignition systems directly to the Battery bus as shown. It has been said several times that an electrically dependent ignition design really deserves two batteries. So, where do we go to achieve this? We could adopt the architecture of Z-14 but use the SD-8 as a second alternator. One of the challenges with this architecture is that it requires a minimum of two contactors to power the busses where the essential items reside. The ignition systems would be located one each on the battery busses. I think that Z-14 makes sense with two big alternators, but may not be optimized for the SD-8. Or, we could add an additional battery to Z-13 using Figure Z-30. In this manner, we can run the essential bus philosophy, with an additional battery that could be isolated from the rest of the charging system. In order to supply the essential bus from the second battery, we need to modify how the essential bus is powered. As soon as you do that, it begins to smell a lot like an avionics bus, which can be powered from either Battery 1 or Battery 2. We can: A) leave it as is, with the diode to one of the main busses and alt feed from the same battery. B) use a 3 position switch as a selector between the two batteries (There's that avionics bus smell again...), eliminate the diode (to prevent tying the batteries together during starting if the alt feed switch were on, or if one of the battery busses were somehow pulled close to ground). While we are considering how to tie this second battery in, we are also being reminded that using lightweight washers instead of standard washers could save a few ounces on your airframe. And that adding weight is even worse than installing a split master switch! So, that little voice in the back of our head encourages us to install the Z-13 system with a single battery and save the weight. My gut tells me to add a second battery to the Z-13 architecture, using the Z-30 technique. Tie the E-bus to the Battery bus that is associated with the SD-8. I suspect that I am not alone in debating these possibilities, and would like to here some discussion on what would be the appropriate manner to handle feeding the E-bus. Regards- Norm ________________________________ Message 7 _____________________________________ Time: 01:51:15 PM PST US From: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Source for Brass Bolt --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" I've purchased them at the specialty hardware sections of Home Depot, Lowes, etc. Floor flange bolts for a commode are 5/16 brass but coarse thread. If push comes to shove, B&C can fix you up. They stock several lengths along with brass washers, phosphor bronze lockwashers, and brass nuts to go with them. Bob . . . > > > > I'm trying to follow Bob's recommendation to use a 5/16" (or bigger)brass >bolt to get the ground wire through the firewall. I need to get the wire up >from the bottom of the aircraft around a large fuel tank mounted near the >firewall, up to the top where the ground buss is located. > > > > Does anyone have a source for a 5/16" bolt? The biggest I've been able to >locate so far is 1/4". > > ________________________________ Message 8 _____________________________________ Time: 02:09:34 PM PST US Subject: AeroElectric-List: Whelen strobe current draw and grounding From: "Treff, Arthur" --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Treff, Arthur" Bob, I just got off the phone with Whelen regarding power requirements of the A413A.HDA-CF-14. This is the power supply that operates 3 strobe lights simultaneously. According to the installation sheet, Outlet 1 produces 42 Joules and alternates with strobe outlets 3 & 4 which are producing 21 Joules apiece (or 42 joules). The Whelen tech said that this unit requires 7 amps continuously. When I asked him to go thru the calculations of Watt/seconds with me to prove it, he just said that the alternator will see 7 additional amps when strobes are switched on. I don't think he knew what a Joule really was, he further stated the inrush current was alot higher (but he didn't know what that value was), but that it's duration was too small to be of concern. He said that the wire size and fuse should be for 10-15 amps. I'm not sure I agree, see my reasoning below. I am using your analysis in the Connection page12-12 of 70 flashes per minute. I did not confirm this with Whenen. So, if we assume that the strobe outlets produce a flash once every 860 milliseconds, then Outlets 3 42 watt/seconds divided by .86 seconds is 48 watts, or 4 amps in a 12 volt system. This 4 amp "event" is alternating with Outlet 1. Therefore, the power pack is drawing 4 amps continuously, am I right? 1) So, my question is one of alternator load. This 4 amps that is alternating between outlet 1 and 2/3, is it additive for a continuous load of 8 amps, or is it 4 amps? Additionally, I'll size my fuse to be 10 amps and the wire accordingly for round trip length. 2) For grounding, I plan on running the strobe power supply ground forward to the instrument panel ground "forest of tabs" to avoid spurious ground loops in the airframe, correctamundo? Thanks for all your devotion providing sage advice to guys like me who are all mechanical and not much upstairs electrically.. Arthur Treff RV-8 N666AT (reserved) Asheville, NC ________________________________ Message 9 _____________________________________ Time: 02:14:37 PM PST US From: N2321G@aol.com Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Source for Brass Bolt --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: N2321G@aol.com I dont know if they have it in brass, but Ive bought 3/4-10 silicon bronze bolts from these guys. They carry a lot of hardware for small boat builders. Mess around a sailboat for awhile then move to an airplane and you begin to notice they are more alike than they are different. http://www.jamestowndistributors.com/ ________________________________ Message 10 ____________________________________ Time: 03:12:08 PM PST US From: "Gilles.Thesee" Subject: AeroElectric-List: relay diode soldering --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Gilles.Thesee" Hi Bob and all, Is it a good practice to solder the diode direct across the faston lugs of a relay ? (as opposed to installing it with crimp terminals). I've seen our kit factory do it that way, and I was wondering. Thanks Gilles ________________________________ Message 11 ____________________________________ Time: 03:12:08 PM PST US From: "Gilles.Thesee" Subject: AeroElectric-List: Circuit protection question --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Gilles.Thesee" Hi Bob and all, Please allow me to ask again a question that may have remained unnoticed. Thanks in advance, Gilles See below : ----- Message d'origine ----- De : "Gilles.Thesee" : Envoy : lundi 28 avril 2003 19:11 Objet : AeroElectric-List: Circuit protection question > --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Gilles.Thesee" > > Hi Bob and all, > > I started the wiring for real last week. No hassles except keeping those > wire coils clear. Oh, and a 'crimper elbow' ! > > Here is my question : > We're using some parts supplied by the kit manufacturer for the flaps > control and motors. > They say they wire with 16 AWG, despite the fact they use a 25 amp breaker. > > My intention is to use a fuse, and fatter wires. > Does it make sense to use 14 AWG wires, since the 25 amp protection is only > there for the very momentary inrush current draw ? > And do I add a 18 AWG fuselink in case of faulted wire or shorted motor ? > > Thanks, > > Gilles Thesee ________________________________ Message 12 ____________________________________ Time: 04:22:46 PM PST US Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Z-13 and Dual Electronic Ignitions From: Joel Harding --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: Joel Harding Norm, I have been contemplating many of the same ideas you just presented. I started out with Z-11 and added dual electronic ignitions. Then I took the Lightspeed recommendation to install a small 4.5 A H aux battery as a backup for one of the ignitions, and started thinking about using it as a second power source for the essential bus. But then, like you I began thinking why not install a disconnect between the main and essential bus and use it as like an avionics bus since most of the same items would be on both. The questions I have are: 1. What are the negative consequences of installing a switch between the main and essential buses? 2. Is a contactor needed with the small aux battery? Joel Harding On Thursday, May 8, 2003, at 10:25 AM, Muzzy Norman E wrote: > --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Muzzy Norman E" > > > I will run with a 40A alternator and an SD-8 for engine driven power > sources, and a pair of electronic ignition systems (no mags). The Z-13 > diagram lays out the architecture for the SD-8 and L40 charging system > with > one battery. I could wire my ignition systems directly to the Battery > bus > as shown. It has been said several times that an electrically > dependent > ignition design really deserves two batteries. So, where do we go to > achieve this? > > We could adopt the architecture of Z-14 but use the SD-8 as a second > alternator. One of the challenges with this architecture is that it > requires a minimum of two contactors to power the busses where the > essential > items reside. The ignition systems would be located one each on the > battery > busses. I think that Z-14 makes sense with two big alternators, but > may not > be optimized for the SD-8. > > Or, we could add an additional battery to Z-13 using Figure Z-30. In > this > manner, we can run the essential bus philosophy, with an additional > battery > that could be isolated from the rest of the charging system. In order > to > supply the essential bus from the second battery, we need to modify > how the > essential bus is powered. As soon as you do that, it begins to smell > a lot > like an avionics bus, which can be powered from either Battery 1 or > Battery > 2. We can: A) leave it as is, with the diode to one of the main busses > and > alt feed from the same battery. B) use a 3 position switch as a > selector > between the two batteries (There's that avionics bus smell again...), > eliminate the diode (to prevent tying the batteries together during > starting > if the alt feed switch were on, or if one of the battery busses were > somehow > pulled close to ground). > > While we are considering how to tie this second battery in, we are also > being reminded that using lightweight washers instead of standard > washers > could save a few ounces on your airframe. And that adding weight is > even > worse than installing a split master switch! So, that little voice in > the > back of our head encourages us to install the Z-13 system with a single > battery and save the weight. > > My gut tells me to add a second battery to the Z-13 architecture, > using the > Z-30 technique. Tie the E-bus to the Battery bus that is associated > with > the SD-8. > > I suspect that I am not alone in debating these possibilities, and > would > like to here some discussion on what would be the appropriate manner to > handle feeding the E-bus. > > Regards- > Norm > > > _- > ====================================================================== > _- > ====================================================================== > _- > ====================================================================== > _- > ====================================================================== > > ________________________________ Message 13 ____________________________________ Time: 04:51:16 PM PST US From: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Builder documentation on the Web-summary --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" At 10:47 PM 5/7/2003 -0500, you wrote: >--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "David Carter" > > >I received 13 excellent, helpful replies to my request for "how to create >drawings, sketches, & tables viewable on a web site". Thank you all. > >Here's a summary of what I learned: > >1. Drawings made by CAD programs (Autocad, Intellicad-an Autocad "full >features clone" (I have Airplane PDQ which has full Intellicad embedded): > a. File, Export to File, in the Save As box navigate to the desired > folder, use or change the file name, then go to File Type & scroll down > to & select .bmp; that all disappears and you are back in Intellicad with > the "Selection Menu" box popped up - click "select all" then press > "Enter" (a non-intuitive response to a command line question) and in a > short moment the conversion is completed. > b. Then use Paint (MSPAINT) to open the file & immediately Save As a > .jpg Everyone with Windows has Microsoft's "Paint" for this .bmp > to .jpg conversion. And everyone with Windows has Kodak's "Imaging" > program that views .jpgs, plus .jpg files/images are imbedded directly > into aweb page and thus viewable by a browser. > (interesting side note: My "Imaging" pgm won't let me save anything > as .jpg . . . weird.) > >2. Non-cad drawings and sketches (fuel system, simple electrical >schematics or wire diagrams, etc) > a. Hand draw and color sketches and simply scan them as .jpg files > to insert into web page; or, > b. Use "Paint" (MSPAINT.EXE in Programs, Accessories) for Sketches - > c. Excel has a "drawing" mode with lots of features. > - Another lister several months ago shared how he used Excel to > "draw" a very neat electrical schematic. > - My impression is that one would be able to "draw" a neater, > more detailed drawing than using PAINT - maybe easier, too, since Exel > has more drawing features than the rudimentary lines, rectangle, and > "free hand with a mouse" of PAINT. Better yet. Get Adobe Acrobat. It's for sale all over ebay and other places on the 'net. Acrobat fools your computer into thinking that it is a printer . . . you can "print" to Acrobat and instead of getting paper out of a printer, you get .pdf file on your hard drive. >Other tips (summary listing): >1. Eric M. Jones: If you have an interest in CAD, please see >http://www.tenlinks.com/CAD/products/free/cad.htm. This is a repository of >all things in free cad, and add-ons too > >2. Chris Good: Powerpoint has an "export to html" function that creates >the pages on the web site. > >3. Ernest Christley: Try "The Gimp". There is a version for Windo[ws] > It's a Photoshop wannabe, that will cost you exactly $0. You'll be >able to work on the JPG files and do lots of other neat things if you'll >just spend a few hours with the included documentation. As a bonus, the >JPG files it produces tend to be about 1/4th the size of what my digital >camera program produces. > >4. Dale Smith: "jpeg optimizer" will trim your photos' file size >literally to any size you like, all the while showing you in a window what >the downsized picture file looks like! ... it's shareware located for >download on CNet at: http://download.com.com/3000-2192-9623164.html > - File sizes a third of the original show with almost negligible > differences. If it does degrade, just kick it up a few percent. You > don't need to re-size most pics down to enjoy the benefits, but cropping > out the unneeded always helps keep the filesize in check. > >5. Rob Housman: Use "FinePrint" to save the file in Adobe Acrobat's pdf >format. Go to www.fineprint.com and download the free version of that >program. [ This sounds like one to get familiar with. ] > >6. Dan Checkoway: There are plenty of forums and self-teach web sites >out there for web development. See http://www.w3schools.com, for >example. [ I went to this and will use it as my primary learning tool for >web stuff.] > >7. Joshua Siler: Adobe Photoshop and Illustrator, with a tablet input >device, are the >best ways to do this [sketches]. However they are quite expensive. > - Try Paint Shop Pro 8.0 - you can find it at http://www.download.com > . It will let you create an >image, and then you can save it as a file format that windows can read. Our CD Rom has three Autocad compatible drafting programs on it. You can download from the website at http://216.55.140.222/CD/AEC8_0.zip or purchase at http://www.aeroelectric.com/Catalog/AECcatalog.htm Acrobat reader is free to everybody. Your published works will be easily read and printed. I often publish .jpg photos to .pdf files just to insure the manner in which they are displayed and printed. The REALLY neat thing about going the Adobe route is that Acrobat allows you to edit multiple .pdf files together. For example, http://216.55.140.222/temp/Audio_Prelim.pdf contains pages of data that were generated on three different applications: Autocad.dwg, camera.jpg, and ECB layout.jpg. I could easily have included pages of word processor text and maybe even pages from a .pdf file generated by another source. Very, VERY powerful and easy on your readers. Bob . . . ________________________________ Message 14 ____________________________________ Time: 04:58:42 PM PST US From: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Whelen strobe current draw and grounding --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" At 05:08 PM 5/8/2003 -0400, you wrote: >--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Treff, Arthur" > > >Bob, >I just got off the phone with Whelen regarding power requirements of the >A413A.HDA-CF-14. This is the power supply that operates 3 strobe lights >simultaneously. According to the installation sheet, Outlet 1 produces 42 >Joules and alternates with strobe outlets 3 & 4 which are producing 21 >Joules apiece (or 42 joules). The Whelen tech said that this unit >requires 7 amps continuously. When I asked him to go thru the >calculations of Watt/seconds with me to prove it, he just said that the >alternator will see 7 additional amps when strobes are switched on. I >don't think he knew what a Joule really was, he further stated the inrush >current was alot higher (but he didn't know what that value was), but that >it's duration was too small to be of concern. He said that the wire size >and fuse should be for 10-15 amps. I'm not sure I agree, see my reasoning >below. > >I am using your analysis in the Connection page12-12 of 70 flashes per >minute. I did not confirm this with Whenen. So, if we assume that the >strobe outlets produce a flash once every 860 milliseconds, then Outlets 3 >42 watt/seconds divided by .86 seconds is 48 watts, or 4 amps in a 12 volt >system. This 4 amp "event" is alternating with Outlet 1. Therefore, the >power pack is drawing 4 amps continuously, am I right? Sounds pretty good . . . actually, you have a 14v system so the current is likely to be lower yet. >1) So, my question is one of alternator load. This 4 amps that is >alternating between outlet 1 and 2/3, is it additive for a continuous load >of 8 amps, or is it 4 amps? Additionally, I'll size my fuse to be 10 amps >and the wire accordingly for round trip length. 7A fuse and 20AWG wire would be just fine. >2) For grounding, I plan on running the strobe power supply ground >forward to the instrument panel ground "forest of tabs" to avoid spurious >ground loops in the airframe, correctamundo? You can ground locally. This is often done and as long as all the potential victims are grounded at the tabs, whatever noise the strobe puts into the airframe can't get at the victims anyhow. >Thanks for all your devotion providing sage advice to guys like me who are >all mechanical and not much upstairs electrically.. When you've deduced more about Whelen's product than they can tell you . . . you're doin' better than most. Bob . . . ________________________________ Message 15 ____________________________________ Time: 05:02:29 PM PST US From: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Circuit protection question --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" At 11:54 PM 5/8/2003 +0200, you wrote: >--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Gilles.Thesee" > > >Hi Bob and all, > >Please allow me to ask again a question that may have remained unnoticed. >Thanks in advance, > >Gilles > >See below : > >----- Message d'origine ----- >De : "Gilles.Thesee" > : >Envoy : lundi 28 avril 2003 19:11 >Objet : AeroElectric-List: Circuit protection question > > > > --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Gilles.Thesee" > > > > > Hi Bob and all, > > > > I started the wiring for real last week. No hassles except keeping those > > wire coils clear. Oh, and a 'crimper elbow' ! > > > > Here is my question : > > We're using some parts supplied by the kit manufacturer for the flaps > > control and motors. > > They say they wire with 16 AWG, despite the fact they use a 25 amp >breaker. The flap system on a King Air doesn't draw that much power. This doesn't sound like the folks who did the kit backed up their suggestions with any research. > > > > My intention is to use a fuse, and fatter wires. > > Does it make sense to use 14 AWG wires, since the 25 amp protection is >only > > there for the very momentary inrush current draw ? > > And do I add a 18 AWG fuselink in case of faulted wire or shorted motor ? No, fuses are always MUCH faster than breakers and faster still than fusible links. Wire it with 16AWG and fuse it at 10A and go fly. I'll bet you don't pop the 10A fuse. Try flying for awhile on a 7A fuse. I'll bet it doesn't pop either. Bob . . . ________________________________ Message 16 ____________________________________ Time: 09:58:41 PM PST US From: DHPHKH@aol.com Subject: AeroElectric-List: LR3B Warning Light --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: DHPHKH@aol.com Bob, Quick dumb question. LR3B instructions state that the low voltage warning lamp is a "midget flanged #330 bulb". Is there something special about it's specifications, or may any small 12V incandescent warning light be substituted? Thanks Dan Horton ________________________________ Message 17 ____________________________________ Time: 10:07:35 PM PST US From: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: relay diode soldering --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" At 12:09 AM 5/9/2003 +0200, you wrote: >--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Gilles.Thesee" > > >Hi Bob and all, > >Is it a good practice to solder the diode direct across the faston lugs of a >relay ? (as opposed to installing it with crimp terminals). >I've seen our kit factory do it that way, and I was wondering. > >Thanks > >Gilles Not sure it matters much. If the relay case plastic will let you do it without distorting the terminal mounting, soldering is probably okay. Bob . . .