Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 12:44 AM - Re: HOWTO K and J Thermocouples soldering (Jerzy Krasinski)
2. 02:42 AM - Re: HOWTO K and J Thermocouples soldering (Werner Schneider)
3. 04:00 AM - Re: HOWTO K and J Thermocouples soldering (Sam Hoskins)
4. 05:24 AM - Re: HOWTO K and J Thermocouples soldering (Jerzy Krasinski)
5. 06:41 AM - Strobe wire (DAVAWALKER@aol.com)
6. 07:04 AM - Re: GPS antenna question (DAVID REEL)
7. 07:12 AM - Re: HOWTO K and J Thermocouples soldering (Robert L. Nuckolls, III)
8. 09:59 AM - Internal and external shunts (Michael Ashura)
9. 02:41 PM - Re: Strobe wire (Robert L. Nuckolls, III)
10. 02:45 PM - Re: Internal and external shunts (Robert L. Nuckolls, III)
11. 02:59 PM - Re: Strobe wire (Scott Bilinski)
12. 03:24 PM - Re: HOWTO K and J Thermocouples soldering (Werner Schneider)
13. 04:28 PM - GPS antenna repainting (was GPS antenna question) (Gilles.Thesee)
14. 05:03 PM - Re: HOWTO K and J Thermocouples soldering (jmfpublic@attbi.com)
15. 06:55 PM - Re: HOWTO K and J Thermocouples soldering (Robert L. Nuckolls, III)
16. 07:56 PM - 3 terminalt contactor diode placement? ()
17. 08:14 PM - Re: Battery contactor selection (Ken Walck)
18. 08:20 PM - Re: 3 terminalt contactor diode placement? (RSwanson)
19. 08:46 PM - Re: 3 terminalt contactor diode placement? ()
20. 09:23 PM - Re: Strobe wire (Robert L. Nuckolls, III)
21. 09:26 PM - Re: 3 terminalt contactor diode placement? (Robert L. Nuckolls, III)
22. 09:33 PM - Re: 3 terminalt contactor diode placement? ()
Message 1
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| Subject: | Re: HOWTO K and J Thermocouples soldering |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: Jerzy Krasinski <krasinski@direcway.com>
Werner Schneider wrote:
>--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Werner Schneider" <wernerschneider@compuserve.com>
>
>Hello Folks,
>
>I need your experience, we prepared jesterday the CHT and EGT probes on my
>engine (4 each) to connect to a rotary switch. Preparing is one thing, but
>we found it nearly impossible to solder this exotique materials to the
>switch. There must be another way doing this, what kind of solder,
>temperature, torches/iron do we need to get a proper connection and what
>else do we have to consider doing this job?
>
>Many thanks in advance for your help
>
>Werner
>
>
>
Werner,
For lower operating temperatures I soldered thermocouples with one of
the silver solders sold in the welding stores. That is quite easy, just
use the proper flux for stainless steel since one of the K thermocouple
wires is made of chromel alloy. You can get the flux in a welding
store. The newer black flux works the best, but you should be able to
make it with the older white flux, just remember to use reducing flame
of your torch. Small welding torch works the best and has all
adjustments, but you should be able to make it even with a regular cheap
torch mounted on top of a propane bottle. I frequently use such a torch
for silver soldering. Make sure that you do not overheat the wires, that
would oxidize them and cause troubles. Try to get small diameter silver
solder wire, the diameter should be similar to the diameter of the
thermocouple wires.
It works easy if you twist the thermocouple wires together, wrap ithem
with a few turns of silver solder wire, and cover with flux. Now put it
into the torch. The flux will boil, turn into a foamy messy stuff which
will melt as the temperature goes up. When the solder melting point is
reached, the solder will spread nicely all over the junction and the
soldering is done. Remember to dissolve remnants of the flux in hot
water after this soldering, or you might have corrosion of the
thermocouple or metal in contact with the thermocouple.
I think such a silver soldered thermocouple would be fine for CHT, but
I doubt if it would work for EGT, because silver solder would melt there.
The right way to make EGT thermocouples is to weld them. You twist
together a few mm of the wires at one end of the thermocouple, connect
the wires of the other end of the thermocouple together and attach them
to the grounded end of a TIG welder, set the welder to a low current,
install a non sharpened heavy tungsten rod (~1/8" diameter) in the
welders electrode holder, mount the thermocouple twisted pair of wires
pointing wertically up, swich the HF source on, and approach from above
the twisted pair of thermocouple wires with the TIG tungsten electrode
to start the arc. The arc starts without the thermocouple touching the
tungsten electrode because of the HF voltage. The arc melts the
thermocouple quickly because the wires are thin and forms a ball of
melted metal at the tip of the thermocouple. Melting of the end of the
thermocouple increases distance between TIG electrode and the
thermocouple tip and that tends to kill the arc if the TIG electrode is
cold. Exactly for that reason you installed nonsharpened large
diameter tungsten rod in the welder and such a rod does not get hot very
fast. So you get automatic current switch off as soon as you form the
ball. You can assist that by pulling the handle with the electrode up
as soon as the arc started additionally increasing the distance Of
course you have to experiment with setting of the welder's current. If
the welder does not have small current settings, your thermocouple is
thin, and the welding action is too violent, you might be forced to put
a high current resistor in series with the welder output to reduce the
current.
You might also try to use a regular sharpened electrode for the TIG
welder, establish an arc between a big piece of steel and the tungsten
electrode, and insert the thermocouple into the arc without touching
the puddle or the tungsten. That should weld the tip, but the ball might
hang asymetrically if you insert the thermocouple off vertical position.
Regular crude welder without HF source would not work. Here you will
have to touch the thermocouple with the metal of the electrode
attempting to start the arc. The result of such touching is welding of
the tip of the thermocouple to the electrode of the welder creating a
short circuit, and following fast frying of the thermocouple with large
current from the welder.
Crazy scientists in research labs commonly use a salt solution electrode
for thermocouple welding. Unfortunately, the method contains all
elements of an electric chair. While it is simple and reliable I do not
think that it is compatible with a working space around sink in someones
home.
Jerzy
Message 2
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| Subject: | Re: HOWTO K and J Thermocouples soldering |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Werner Schneider" <wernerschneider@compuserve.com>
Hello Jerzy,
many thanks for your elaborate anwser, wher I see areal problem is, that I
would have to weld the wires to an edge connector (limited space, "low"
melting material?) I see there for sure a big problem ahead, also the switch
itslef does not look as I could weld around it, should have checked this
things before I bought them.
Will see what I can do
Anyway many thanks
Werner
----- Original Message -----
From: "Jerzy Krasinski" <krasinski@direcway.com>
Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: HOWTO K and J Thermocouples soldering
> --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: Jerzy Krasinski
<krasinski@direcway.com>
>
>
> Werner Schneider wrote:
>
> >--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Werner Schneider"
<wernerschneider@compuserve.com>
> >
> >Hello Folks,
> >
> >I need your experience, we prepared jesterday the CHT and EGT probes on
my
> >engine (4 each) to connect to a rotary switch. Preparing is one thing,
but
> >we found it nearly impossible to solder this exotique materials to the
> >switch. There must be another way doing this, what kind of solder,
> >temperature, torches/iron do we need to get a proper connection and what
> >else do we have to consider doing this job?
> >
> >Many thanks in advance for your help
> >
> >Werner
> >
> >
> >
> Werner,
>
> For lower operating temperatures I soldered thermocouples with one of
> the silver solders sold in the welding stores. That is quite easy, just
> use the proper flux for stainless steel since one of the K thermocouple
> wires is made of chromel alloy. You can get the flux in a welding
> store. The newer black flux works the best, but you should be able to
> make it with the older white flux, just remember to use reducing flame
> of your torch. Small welding torch works the best and has all
> adjustments, but you should be able to make it even with a regular cheap
> torch mounted on top of a propane bottle. I frequently use such a torch
> for silver soldering. Make sure that you do not overheat the wires, that
> would oxidize them and cause troubles. Try to get small diameter silver
> solder wire, the diameter should be similar to the diameter of the
> thermocouple wires.
> It works easy if you twist the thermocouple wires together, wrap ithem
> with a few turns of silver solder wire, and cover with flux. Now put it
> into the torch. The flux will boil, turn into a foamy messy stuff which
> will melt as the temperature goes up. When the solder melting point is
> reached, the solder will spread nicely all over the junction and the
> soldering is done. Remember to dissolve remnants of the flux in hot
> water after this soldering, or you might have corrosion of the
> thermocouple or metal in contact with the thermocouple.
> I think such a silver soldered thermocouple would be fine for CHT, but
> I doubt if it would work for EGT, because silver solder would melt there.
>
> The right way to make EGT thermocouples is to weld them. You twist
> together a few mm of the wires at one end of the thermocouple, connect
> the wires of the other end of the thermocouple together and attach them
> to the grounded end of a TIG welder, set the welder to a low current,
> install a non sharpened heavy tungsten rod (~1/8" diameter) in the
> welders electrode holder, mount the thermocouple twisted pair of wires
> pointing wertically up, swich the HF source on, and approach from above
> the twisted pair of thermocouple wires with the TIG tungsten electrode
> to start the arc. The arc starts without the thermocouple touching the
> tungsten electrode because of the HF voltage. The arc melts the
> thermocouple quickly because the wires are thin and forms a ball of
> melted metal at the tip of the thermocouple. Melting of the end of the
> thermocouple increases distance between TIG electrode and the
> thermocouple tip and that tends to kill the arc if the TIG electrode is
> cold. Exactly for that reason you installed nonsharpened large
> diameter tungsten rod in the welder and such a rod does not get hot very
> fast. So you get automatic current switch off as soon as you form the
> ball. You can assist that by pulling the handle with the electrode up
> as soon as the arc started additionally increasing the distance Of
> course you have to experiment with setting of the welder's current. If
> the welder does not have small current settings, your thermocouple is
> thin, and the welding action is too violent, you might be forced to put
> a high current resistor in series with the welder output to reduce the
> current.
>
> You might also try to use a regular sharpened electrode for the TIG
> welder, establish an arc between a big piece of steel and the tungsten
> electrode, and insert the thermocouple into the arc without touching
> the puddle or the tungsten. That should weld the tip, but the ball might
> hang asymetrically if you insert the thermocouple off vertical position.
>
> Regular crude welder without HF source would not work. Here you will
> have to touch the thermocouple with the metal of the electrode
> attempting to start the arc. The result of such touching is welding of
> the tip of the thermocouple to the electrode of the welder creating a
> short circuit, and following fast frying of the thermocouple with large
> current from the welder.
>
> Crazy scientists in research labs commonly use a salt solution electrode
> for thermocouple welding. Unfortunately, the method contains all
> elements of an electric chair. While it is simple and reliable I do not
> think that it is compatible with a working space around sink in someones
> home.
> Jerzy
>
>
Message 3
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| Subject: | HOWTO K and J Thermocouples soldering |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Sam Hoskins" <shoskins@globaleyes.net>
Purchase a rotary switch from Westach for about $30. It comes with leads,
already installed, which plug into the CHT/EGTs. No Soldering/welding
required. Simple, effective, cheap, compact.
Sam
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com]On Behalf Of Werner
Schneider
Subject: AeroElectric-List: HOWTO K and J Thermocouples soldering
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Werner Schneider"
<wernerschneider@compuserve.com>
Hello Folks,
I need your experience, we prepared jesterday the CHT and EGT probes on my
engine (4 each) to connect to a rotary switch. Preparing is one thing, but
we found it nearly impossible to solder this exotique materials to the
switch. There must be another way doing this, what kind of solder,
temperature, torches/iron do we need to get a proper connection and what
else do we have to consider doing this job?
Many thanks in advance for your help
Werner
Message 4
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| Subject: | Re: HOWTO K and J Thermocouples soldering |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: Jerzy Krasinski <krasinski@direcway.com>
Werner,
Sorry, I answered wrong question. You are clearly interested in
soldering of the thermocouple wires TO THE SWITCH and not in making of
the thermocouples. But the welding stores will help in this case too.
For soldering of thermocouple wires you can use a regular tin solder ,
however you have to use an agressive flux . Welding stores have such
flux , just ask for a flux for soft soldering of stainless steel . It
comes in a form of a liquid with acidic smell.
That acidic character is a problem, it might ruin your switch. I would
not recommend to put that flux anywhere close to the switch, I would
recommend a two step action. Cover the ends of the thermocouple wires
with tin first, using the agressive flux. After that wash these wires
with plenty of water to remove the acidic stuff, and solder them now to
the switch using a regular electronic brand flux and solder. Once the
wire is coated with tin the soldering is easy.
I am not aware of any flux for high chromium alloys that is not
corrosive. But you might check with www.omega.com . Omega is a company
making all sorts of thermocouples and they might have some special flux
that is not corrosive.
Jerzy
Werner Schneider wrote:
>--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Werner Schneider" <wernerschneider@compuserve.com>
>
>Hello Folks,
>
>I need your experience, we prepared jesterday the CHT and EGT probes on my
>engine (4 each) to connect to a rotary switch. Preparing is one thing, but
>we found it nearly impossible to solder this exotique materials to the
>switch. There must be another way doing this, what kind of solder,
>temperature, torches/iron do we need to get a proper connection and what
>else do we have to consider doing this job?
>
>Many thanks in advance for your help
>
>Werner
>
>
>
>
Message 5
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--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: DAVAWALKER@aol.com
Is it practical to cut and splice, or use a terminal block, the shielded wire
supplied by Whelen with their strobe kits? Sure would make much easier to
prewire the power supply and splice at the wing roots upon assembly.
Thanks
D. Walker RV7
Message 6
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| Subject: | Re: GPS antenna question |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "DAVID REEL" <dreel@cox.net>
Wouldn't the metallic paint layer used to protect the composite material from solar
radiation block reception?
Do not archive
Dave Reel - RV8A
Message 7
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| Subject: | Re: HOWTO K and J Thermocouples soldering |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <bob.nuckolls@cox.net>
At 06:05 AM 6/13/2003 +0200, you wrote:
>--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Werner Schneider"
><wernerschneider@compuserve.com>
>
>Hello Folks,
>
>I need your experience, we prepared jesterday the CHT and EGT probes on my
>engine (4 each) to connect to a rotary switch. Preparing is one thing, but
>we found it nearly impossible to solder this exotique materials to the
>switch. There must be another way doing this, what kind of solder,
>temperature, torches/iron do we need to get a proper connection and what
>else do we have to consider doing this job?
>
>Many thanks in advance for your help
There is an excerpt from the 'Connection on my website
on thermocouples you may find useful. See:
http://www.aeroelectric.com/articles/excerpt.pdf
I've found that several good tin/lead solders I have
around the shop will solder type J wire . . . I use
metcal irons with 700 degree tips for this. I haven't
had a chance to try K wire yet.
A technique that ALWAYS works is to "tin" or coat
the end of the wire to be soldered to you switch
with silver solder. Ordinary tin-lead solder will then
alloy with the new coating and make a satisfactory
joint to your switch or other component.
Another technique I use is to crimp a d-sub male
pin onto the thermocouple wire. Then use the pin
as a solderable medium to complete the joint. I had
to put 12 sets of thermocouple wires into an etched
circuit board on a program at RAC a few months back.
The male d-sub pins made for a really nice interface
to the board. I suspect you could snip off the
smallest diameter of the pin and use the remaining
piece of wire-grip to provide an easily soldered
connection.
Bob . . .
--------------------------------------------
( Knowing about a thing is different than )
( understanding it. One can know a lot )
( and still understand nothing. )
( C.F. Kettering )
--------------------------------------------
Message 8
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| Subject: | Internal and external shunts |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Michael Ashura" <ashuramj@hotmail.com>
Do not archive
Bob,
I am replacing an ammeter with internal shunt with a new style that requires an
external shunt. Can I wire the external shunt where the old ammeter was in the
wiring diagram? Thank you,
Mike
Message 9
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--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <bob.nuckolls@cox.net>
At 09:40 AM 6/13/2003 -0400, you wrote:
>--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: DAVAWALKER@aol.com
>
>Is it practical to cut and splice, or use a terminal block, the shielded wire
>supplied by Whelen with their strobe kits? Sure would make much easier to
>prewire the power supply and splice at the wing roots upon assembly.
>
>Thanks
>D. Walker RV7\
Why not use connectors like those used at both ends of the
wire that comes with the kit? Radio Shack stocks 4 pin
nylon connectors (274-224 and 274-234) that install with
our BCT-1 crimp tool. You'll need a tool for this same
task for rest of the strobe system pin installations.
Use a 4-pin connector and take each of three wires
plus shield ground through the connector on its own
pin.
Bob . . .
Message 10
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| Subject: | Re: Internal and external shunts |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <bob.nuckolls@cox.net>
At 04:58 PM 6/13/2003 +0000, you wrote:
>--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Michael Ashura"
><ashuramj@hotmail.com>
>
>
>Do not archive
>
>
>Bob,
>
>
>I am replacing an ammeter with internal shunt with a new style that
>requires an external shunt. Can I wire the external shunt where the old
>ammeter was in the wiring diagram? Thank you,
>
>
>Mike
Sure . . . but consider rerouting wires to shorten the length
of original wires especially if their re-location gets them
farther away from panel mounted stuff. The advantage of
an externally shunted ammeter is getting the high current
wires out of the cockpit.
But even if you can't reroute wires, the shunt will wire
directly into the leads that use to attach to the original
ammeter.
Bob . . .
Message 11
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--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: Scott Bilinski <bilinski@kyocera-wireless.com>
No sheilding is needed? If no, then how much of the wires can be exposed
before shielding is required?
At 04:40 PM 6/13/03 -0500, you wrote:
>--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III"
><bob.nuckolls@cox.net>
>
>At 09:40 AM 6/13/2003 -0400, you wrote:
>>--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: DAVAWALKER@aol.com
>>
>>Is it practical to cut and splice, or use a terminal block, the shielded wire
>>supplied by Whelen with their strobe kits? Sure would make much easier to
>>prewire the power supply and splice at the wing roots upon assembly.
>>
>>Thanks
>>D. Walker RV7\
>
> Why not use connectors like those used at both ends of the
> wire that comes with the kit? Radio Shack stocks 4 pin
> nylon connectors (274-224 and 274-234) that install with
> our BCT-1 crimp tool. You'll need a tool for this same
> task for rest of the strobe system pin installations.
>
> Use a 4-pin connector and take each of three wires
> plus shield ground through the connector on its own
> pin.
>
> Bob . . .
>
>
Scott Bilinski
Eng dept 305
Phone (858) 657-2536
Pager (858) 502-5190
Message 12
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| Subject: | Re: HOWTO K and J Thermocouples soldering |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Werner Schneider" <wernerschneider@compuserve.com>
Hello Bob,
thanks for the reply,
> There is an excerpt from the 'Connection on my website
> on thermocouples you may find useful. See:
>
> http://www.aeroelectric.com/articles/excerpt.pdf
Thanks Bob, I do posess your book, thats how I found out about the material
of the probes..
> A technique that ALWAYS works is to "tin" or coat
> the end of the wire to be soldered to you switch
> with silver solder. Ordinary tin-lead solder will then
> alloy with the new coating and make a satisfactory
> joint to your switch or other component.
we will try this.
> Another technique I use is to crimp a d-sub male
> pin onto the thermocouple wire. Then use the pin
> as a solderable medium to complete the joint. I had
> to put 12 sets of thermocouple wires into an etched
> circuit board on a program at RAC a few months back.
> The male d-sub pins made for a really nice interface
> to the board. I suspect you could snip off the
> smallest diameter of the pin and use the remaining
> piece of wire-grip to provide an easily soldered
> connection.
Very interesting, this would make things even more easier, question,
following setup
thermocouple(s) switch instrument solder connector
___________o_ _o_________o-+------+
0___________o_ X_o_________ | |
o-+------+
out of symplicity only one thermocouple drawn, if I use the d-sub pins as a
medium (in the drawing symbolised as a "o") do I have a problem in accuracy?
Do I introduce an error with this d-sub pins?
Many thanks for your help!
Werner
Message 13
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| Subject: | GPS antenna repainting (was GPS antenna question) |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Gilles.Thesee" <Gilles.Thesee@ac-grenoble.fr>
----- Message d'origine -----
De : "DAVID REEL" <dreel@cox.net>
: <aeroelectric-list@matronics.com>
Envoy : vendredi 13 juin 2003 16:04
Objet : Re: AeroElectric-List: GPS antenna question
> --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "DAVID REEL" <dreel@cox.net>
>
> Wouldn't the metallic paint layer used to protect the composite material
from solar radiation block reception?
>
Hi Bob and all,
Thanks to all those who responded to my GPS antenna question.
Lowe antennas seem attractive. I wonder if they would work with a Garmin GPS
400.
Now for the paint.
Comant and Sensor Systems antennas are polyurethane coated. What could
possibly be wrong with just another coat of polyurethane ? (Except
temperature if we repaint it black)
Regards,
Gilles
Message 14
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<Aeroelectric-List@matronics.com> (Aeroelectric-List)
| Subject: | Re: HOWTO K and J Thermocouples soldering |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: jmfpublic@attbi.com
The application note for the Analog Devices AD594 describes how to solder both
type J and type K thermocouples with three rosin core solders. These are 95%
tin-5% silver; 95%tin-5%antimony; and 90%tin-10% lead. The first one is
available at radio shack, and I have used it successfully to solder the ends of
the thermocouple wire together. It should work just as well to solder to the
switch terminals.
By the way, soldering the ends of the TC wire together should be as good as
welding in terms of accuracy--but not in terms of maximum temperature limits.
If you believe that the soldered ends of the TC would give a different voltage
than the welded pair, you would have a perpetual motion machine just by
soldering one end and welding the other. At the same temperature for both
ends, you would get current flow without a temperature differential. This
violates the second law of thermodynamics. So don't worry about soldering the
TC wires for things like CHT measurements. Welding is only needed for EGT heat
levels.
Jim Foerster
Message 15
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| Subject: | Re: HOWTO K and J Thermocouples soldering |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <bob.nuckolls@cox.net>
At 12:23 AM 6/14/2003 +0200, you wrote:
>--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Werner Schneider"
><wernerschneider@compuserve.com>
>
>Hello Bob,
>
>thanks for the reply,
>
> > There is an excerpt from the 'Connection on my website
> > on thermocouples you may find useful. See:
> >
> > http://www.aeroelectric.com/articles/excerpt.pdf
>
>Thanks Bob, I do posess your book, thats how I found out about the material
>of the probes..
>
> > A technique that ALWAYS works is to "tin" or coat
> > the end of the wire to be soldered to you switch
> > with silver solder. Ordinary tin-lead solder will then
> > alloy with the new coating and make a satisfactory
> > joint to your switch or other component.
>
>we will try this.
>
> > Another technique I use is to crimp a d-sub male
> > pin onto the thermocouple wire. Then use the pin
> > as a solderable medium to complete the joint. I had
> > to put 12 sets of thermocouple wires into an etched
> > circuit board on a program at RAC a few months back.
> > The male d-sub pins made for a really nice interface
> > to the board. I suspect you could snip off the
> > smallest diameter of the pin and use the remaining
> > piece of wire-grip to provide an easily soldered
> > connection.
>
>Very interesting, this would make things even more easier, question,
>following setup
>
>
>thermocouple(s) switch instrument solder connector
> ___________o_ _o_________o-+------+
> 0___________o_ X_o_________ | |
> o-+------+
>
>out of symplicity only one thermocouple drawn, if I use the d-sub pins as a
>medium (in the drawing symbolised as a "o") do I have a problem in accuracy?
>Do I introduce an error with this d-sub pins?
>
>Many thanks for your help!
What kind of accuracy are you concerned about? Ordinary off-the-shelf
TC wire is generally 3 degree C rated. You can buy screened high accuracy
wire but I've never found it necessary. Not sure how to interpret your
text-drawings . . . the simple rule is that for every new thermocouple
you introduce on one side, there must be an equal and opposite TC on the
other side and in the same local temperature environment. If you're
doing run-of-the-mill EGT and CHT work, there are potential inaccuracies
introduced by these techniques worth worrying about.
Bob . . .
Message 16
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| Subject: | 3 terminalt contactor diode placement? |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: <315@cox.net>
I utilized a continuous duty 3 terminal contactor for my battery disconnect and
was wondering how to place a diode?
Thanks,
Ned
Message 17
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| Subject: | Re: Battery contactor selection |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Ken Walck" <kwalck@charter.net>
What doesn't make sense about the battery fumes being the culprit is that
the sealed contactor (the most recent, a marine solenoid) lasted the
shortest amout of time. Doesn't seem like it could have corroded so
quickly.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <bob.nuckolls@cox.net>
Subject: AeroElectric-List: Battery contactor selection
> --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III"
<bob.nuckolls@cox.net>
>
> At 01:40 AM 6/12/2003 +0000, you wrote:
> >Below is the result of your inquiry. It was submitted by
> >Ken Walck (kwalck@charter.net) on Wednesday, June 11, 2003 at 18:40:34
> >
> >Wednesday, June 11, 2003
> >
> >Ken Walck
> >
> >,
> >Email: kwalck@charter.net
> >Comments/Questions: Greetings Bob,
> >
> >I need to order a solenoid but don't know which one, the continuous duty
> >or cross-feed contactor. I wonder if you could help me troubleshoot a
> >related problem and direct me to which solenoid to purchase.
>
> They are the same product to begin with, they just have different
> diode arrangements.
>
>
> >I bought a Vari-EZE last November, which has a battery solenoid and a
pull
> >cable mechanism that engages a mechanical switch for the starter as found
> >on old C-150's I believe.
>
> Yes, the manually switched and engaged starters were used on
> a number of engines in the o-200 and o-300 families from
> C-140 through C-170
>
> >The problem is that I've gone through four solenoids since I bought
> >it. The original solenoid quit working immediately and it was replaced
> >with a heavy-duty automotive solenoid. That one quit after a while and I
> >figured that the fumes from the charging battery were corroding the
> >contacts inside (evidenced by green corrosion inside). Then I tried a
> >solenoid from Wicks thinking that maybe an aviation application might
> >help, and I also replaced the battery with a heavier duty one. This one
> >never really worked well (chattered when the starter motor was engaged)
> >since the new battery had to be charged and produced corrosive fumes once
> >again, I thought. Finally I installed a marine solenoid that was
> >sealed. Its first flight after a month or so of sitting was fine but the
> >next time I wanted to fly, 2 days later, there was no response through
the
> >solenoid. Voltage gets to the input lead and through the switch but the
> >output post is totally dead.
> >
> >I should mention that there is a direct connection from the battery
ground
> >to the solenoid ground, as well as from the toggle switch ground to the
> >solenoid ground. Is this a problem?
>
>
> What kind of battery are you using? . . . there's NO reason
> to have corrosive gasses from any battery these days. You should
> be using a sealed lead-acid battery. Poor battery contactor
> life can generally be attributed to poor battery choice.
> It's voltage drops too low during cranking to keep good closure
> pressure on the contactor's inards.
>
> Check out batteries on
> http://www.panasonic.com/industrial/battery/oem/chem/seal/index.html
>
> my favorite battery for light aircraft is the LC-RD1217P described at
>
http://www.panasonic.com/industrial/battery/oem/images/pdf/Panasonic_VRLA_LC
-RD1217P.pdf
>
> This battery is made by many manufacturers and can usually be
> purchased locally for less than $75
>
> Given the distance between battery and engine, your
> fat wires should be 2AWG. After these conditions are
> met, about any contactor should do fine as a battery
> disconnect device. The continuous duty on shown on
> our website will be adequate.
>
> I will invite you to join us on the AeroElectric List
> to continue this and similar discussions. It's useful to
>
> share the information with as many folks as possible.
> You can join at . . .
>
> http://www.matronics.com/subscribe/
>
> Thanks!
>
> Bob . . .
>
> |---------------------------------------------------|
> | A lie can travel half way around the world while |
> | the truth is till putting on its shoes . . . |
> | -Mark Twain- |
> |---------------------------------------------------|
>
>
Message 18
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| Subject: | Re: 3 terminalt contactor diode placement? |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: RSwanson <rswan19@comcast.net>
http://www.aeroelectric.com/articles/strtctr.pdf
Fig. 6
R
----- Original Message -----
From: <315@cox.net>
Subject: AeroElectric-List: 3 terminalt contactor diode placement?
> --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: <315@cox.net>
>
> I utilized a continuous duty 3 terminal contactor for my battery
disconnect and was wondering how to place a diode?
>
> Thanks,
> Ned
>
>
Message 19
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| Subject: | Re: 3 terminalt contactor diode placement? |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: <315@cox.net>
Thanks R but fig 6 shows a 4 terminal contactor. I have a 3 terminal
contactor. I think that one side of the coil is internally conected to the +
positive side of the battery.
Ned
----- Original Message -----
From: "RSwanson" <rswan19@comcast.net>
Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: 3 terminalt contactor diode placement?
> --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: RSwanson <rswan19@comcast.net>
>
> http://www.aeroelectric.com/articles/strtctr.pdf
> Fig. 6
> R
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: <315@cox.net>
> To: "Aeroelectric-List@Matronics.Com" <aeroelectric-list@matronics.com>
> Subject: AeroElectric-List: 3 terminalt contactor diode placement?
>
>
> > --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: <315@cox.net>
> >
> > I utilized a continuous duty 3 terminal contactor for my battery
> disconnect and was wondering how to place a diode?
> >
> > Thanks,
> > Ned
> >
> >
>
>
Message 20
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--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <bob.nuckolls@cox.net>
At 02:59 PM 6/13/2003 -0700, you wrote:
>--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: Scott Bilinski
><bilinski@kyocera-wireless.com>
>
>No sheilding is needed? If no, then how much of the wires can be exposed
>before shielding is required?
Shielding is not like a leak in a hose . . . a hole in the shield
doesn't dump buckets of noise. There are few hard "requirements" for
shielding and those only pertain to the probability of capacitively
coupling noise from the fast rise time pulse on strobe wiring to
some adjacent wire that is a potential victim. So if your antagonist
and victim wires are routed parallel to each other for 20' (240 inches)
and you bared 3" to facilitate a connector, then the attenuation value
of the total shielding system has only been compromised to the tune
of 3/240 or about 1.5% Not a big deal because wires that share space
with strobe cables are not high on list of potential victims.
Bob . . .
Message 21
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| Subject: | Re: 3 terminalt contactor diode placement? |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <bob.nuckolls@cox.net>
At 09:55 PM 6/13/2003 -0500, you wrote:
>--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: <315@cox.net>
>
>I utilized a continuous duty 3 terminal contactor for my battery
>disconnect and was wondering how to place a diode?
>
>Thanks,
>Ned
banded end of diode gets a 5/16 terminal and shares one of the fat
terminals that goes off to battery (+). The other end of the diode
goes to small terminal.
Bob . . .
Message 22
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| Subject: | Re: 3 terminalt contactor diode placement? |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: <315@cox.net>
Thanks Bob!
Ned
----- Original Message -----
From: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <bob.nuckolls@cox.net>
Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: 3 terminalt contactor diode placement?
> --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III"
<bob.nuckolls@cox.net>
>
> At 09:55 PM 6/13/2003 -0500, you wrote:
> >--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: <315@cox.net>
> >
> >I utilized a continuous duty 3 terminal contactor for my battery
> >disconnect and was wondering how to place a diode?
> >
> >Thanks,
> >Ned
>
> banded end of diode gets a 5/16 terminal and shares one of the fat
> terminals that goes off to battery (+). The other end of the diode
> goes to small terminal.
>
> Bob . . .
>
>
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