Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 10:46 AM - Marker Beacon Antenna Lead (Charles Brame)
2. 12:14 PM - Re: transient spikes (Robert L. Nuckolls, III)
3. 12:19 PM - Re: UMA 12-100-100 OAT Pinout? (DHPHKH@aol.com)
4. 01:47 PM - Re: Battery location (Neville Kilford)
5. 05:20 PM - Crimped Connections - Pull Out Strength... (Don Honabach)
6. 06:22 PM - Re: Crimped Connections - Pull Out (Robert L. Nuckolls, III)
7. 07:05 PM - Re: Battery location (Robert L. Nuckolls, III)
8. 07:41 PM - Re: Marker Beacon Antenna Lead (J. Oberst)
9. 08:09 PM - Re: Marker Beacon Antenna Lead (Robert L. Nuckolls, III)
10. 09:46 PM - Re: Q: KT76 NAV Audio Pin (Robert L. Nuckolls, III)
Message 1
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| Subject: | Marker Beacon Antenna Lead |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: Charles Brame <charleyb@earthlink.net>
Still wondering what is required for a marker beacon antenna lead.
Didn't get a response to the following message.
Charlie Brame
RV-6A N11CB
San Antonio
-------------------
> I have an Apollo SL-10 intercom with a built in Marker Beacon. Unlike
> Comm/Nav avionics the SL-10 does not have a BNC connection for the antenna.
> The SL-10 antenna connection is
> merely one D-sub pin in a fully loaded connector. This leads me to believe
> that RG-400 or RG-58 cable is unnecessary. The installation manual says
> nothing about antenna leads. I intend to have a simple wire antenna in
> the wing tip for the marker beacon.
>
> What sort of antenna lead do I need? Will just a strand of 22AWG wire
> work, or should it be some sort of shielded wire?
Message 2
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| Subject: | Re: transient spikes |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <bob.nuckolls@cox.net>
At 11:55 AM 6/14/2003 -0400, you wrote:
>--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: BAKEROCB@aol.com
>
>6/14/2003
>
>Hello Bob Nuckolls, I thought that you might be interested in the two
>postings below copied from the Pulsar builder's web serve list. No
>indication of
>which EIS is involved.
>
>'OC' Baker, Builder of KIS TR-1 #116 4/14/97 - ?/?/?
>
>Brian
Appreciate the heads-up on this. I'm not surprised. There is a lot
of product coming into the certified market that cannot thrive in
the real world. Airframe OEMs and government watchdog organizations
are so engrossed in following the ever expanding set of rules they've
lost sight of a need for and value of sound, rudimentary engineering.
The OBAM community fares no better but the saddest thing is that
there is no regulatory dogma to discourage good design. None-
the-less, both manufacturers and consumers seem ready to accept
such BS because TOLERANCE of BS in the certified world is
mistaken for ACCEPTANCE. Alan Kay of Xerox PARC (the birthplace of
personal computing) once said, "Don't worry about what anybody
else is going to do The best way to predict the future is to invent
it. Really smart people with reasonable funding can do just about
anything that doesn't violate too many of Newton's Laws!"
I'll elaborate on that thought by adding "Don't step off into the
quagmire of historical non-accomplishment as a guiding light
for future goals. Some folks recognize and understand the value of
the OBAM aircraft community as a platform for demonstrating how
really good a product can be . . . and some do not.
Bob . . .
>The Full Alan Kay Quote
>"Don't worry about what anybody else is going to do The best way to
>predict the future is to invent it. Really smart people with reasonable
>funding can do just about anything that doesn't violate too many of
>Newton's Laws!"
>I have an EIS and I have a switch on it. I start the engine then turn on the
>EIS to avoid the start up spike. Once the engine died just after start up
>and
>I restarted without turning off the EIS and the spike messed up the EIS
>readings. All you need is to switch the EIS.
>
>Clarke
> > A few days ago I decided to make some transient suppressors [filters]
> to fit
> > into my electrical system to see if that helps solve the mysterious and
> > intermittent problem regarding the distorted audio [on transmit] reports
> > that I have been getting.
> >
> > As an aside, transient spikes can do interesting things to your EIS system.
> > I don't have an on-off switch for my EIS, so early on I was starting the
> > engine, and stopping it, with the EIS operational. On a few occasions all
> > the presets I had in the non-volatile memory were wiped, and the readings
> > were all haywire. Easy enough to re-program, but since then I have avoided
> > the problem by leaving the EIS off when starting and stopping. The
> cause has
> > to be transients or spikes on the +12 volt supply rail.
> >
> > So, I have three filters to fit today. One each in the supply line for the
> > EIS, the intercom and the com radio. The filters consist of a pi filter,
> > with 470 mf each side of a choke wound on a powdered iron toroid. No
>
> > particular value of inductance, but reasonably heavy enamelled wire. 0.1mf
> > caps in parallel with the electrolytics [because they have lower impedance
> > at high frequencies], and an 18 volt zener diode across the load side. The
> > zener is to make absolutely sure that the tops are sliced off any
> transients
> > that happen to get through the filter, and the maximum voltage that can
> > appear at any connected equipment is 18 volts. If there is a whopping
> > transient that is sustained long enough then the zener might blow, or the
> > fuse might blow, but these are a lot less expensive to replace than an EIS
> > or a radio.
> >
> > Don't know if anyone else has gone to these lengths, but it is not
> expensive
> > to do this. Should at least eliminate some potential transient
> problems, and
> > make sure that the system is as "quiet" as possible. The only difficulty is
> > getting access to the wiring behind the panel.
> >
> > Brian
>
>
Bob . . .
--------------------------------------------
( Knowing about a thing is different than )
( understanding it. One can know a lot )
( and still understand nothing. )
( C.F. Kettering )
--------------------------------------------
Message 3
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| Subject: | Re: UMA 12-100-100 OAT Pinout? |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: DHPHKH@aol.com
Gang,
Cancel the request. Took it apart, found a broken solder joint where
the display connects to the board. A little flux, a dot of solder, and all is
well.
Dan
Message 4
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| Subject: | Re: Battery location |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Neville Kilford" <nkilford@etravel.org>
Thanks Bob,
It sure makes a bit more room under the panel for the battery with it out
front. What about contactors? Do you prefer them inside or out. It's one
side of the firewall or the other, so there's not much cable length involved.
Environmental factors are the only considerations.
If I put them in the engine compartment, do you recommend covering them?
Cheers.
Nev
--
Jodel D150 in progress
UK
----- Original Message -----
From: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <bob.nuckolls@cox.net>
Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Battery location
> >I've been thinking I would put the battery inside the firewall, with the
> >contactors -- in the dry, in the warm, and close to everything. I think
this
> >might be a kinder environment for them. However, I've been rather put-off
by
> >the number of people who swing by the hangar, look at the build project,
and
> >say:
> >
> >1) they think the battery is too small
>
> If it were a flooded battery it might be true. RG technology
> is a whole new ballgame.
>
> >2) that it should go in front of the firewall, next to the engine.
>
> That works too. If there is room for it, I'd go for up
> front. There is little difference in service life of the
> gizmos for the two mounting locations. A forward of the
> firewall location is easier to wire and probably easier
> to maintain.
>
>
> >Point 1) I'm happy about -- the battery can, according to Yuasa, deliver
> >about 250 amps! More than enough to turn a B&C starter on a 115hp engine,
I
> >would think. In any case, when I ask the people why they think the
battery
> >is too small, they don't talk about deep current, they just talk about how
> >big the battery is on their plane, and none can deliver a good argument
for a
> >larger battery.
> >
> >But I'm wondering about 2). Is my plan to keep the contactors, etc.,
inside
> >a good one? I can see what people are saying when they say that it's not
so
> >accessible under the panel, especially if it needs to be charged up, but
I've
> >no idea if I will need to get at it. I've never owned a plane, so I'm not
> >sure about the level of maintenance involved. I'm guessing it's low, and
> >that I'll hardl need to get at the battery.
>
> If it were my airplane, I count on having to put
> my hands on a battery once a year . . . to put
> a new one in. See page 12 of
> http://www.aeroelectric.com/articles/Rev9/ch17-9.pdf
> and
> http://www.aeroelectric.com/articles/battest.pdf
>
> It's your choice. As for "charging" consider some
> variety of ground power connector. See article
> on website for heavy duty ground power connector
> that will carry cranking currents . . . or you can
> include some lighter connector that allows you to
> charge the battery from some conveniently accessable
> connector and not have to crawl under the panel.
>
> Given the superior performance of the RG battery
> for storage life -AND- the modern approach to system
> architecture, fabrication and maitenance, it's unlikely
> that you will ever need to attach ground power to your airplane
> due to discharged battery . . . that's a pleasure
> reserved for our brothers not so blessed as we.
>
>
> >Any information & opinions would be appreciated.
>
> When folks come by and offer their opinions based on
> what they know of the past 100 years of certified
> aviation technology and progress, you might invite them
> to visit our website and perhaps join this list.
>
> If all they have for a knowledge base is what has
> gone before in contemporary certified aviation, then
> they're missing about 80% of what aviation is really
> all about.
>
> Bob . . .
>
>
Message 5
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| Subject: | Crimped Connections - Pull Out Strength... |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Don Honabach" <don@pcperfect.com>
How much force should it take to pull the wire out of a crimped
connection? For instance, if you are crimping a fast-on tab connector to
a piece of wire - how much weight/force should the connection be able to
withstand before the wire comes loose?
Also, does any one have any close up pictures of a good crimped
connection for the typical 20 to 24 guage wires and is it important to
apply the crimp tool so the top of the tool is in line with the top of
the connector?
Thanks!
Don Honabach
Tempe, AZ - 601HDS
Message 6
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| Subject: | Re: Crimped Connections - Pull Out |
Strength...
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <bob.nuckolls@cox.net>
At 05:19 PM 6/15/2003 -0700, you wrote:
>--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Don Honabach" <don@pcperfect.com>
>
>How much force should it take to pull the wire out of a crimped
>connection? For instance, if you are crimping a fast-on tab connector to
>a piece of wire - how much weight/force should the connection be able to
>withstand before the wire comes loose?
see http://www.aeroelectric.com/articles/terminal.pdf
>Also, does any one have any close up pictures of a good crimped
>connection for the typical 20 to 24 guage wires and is it important to
>apply the crimp tool so the top of the tool is in line with the top of
>the connector?
Not sure what your asking here. With the PreInsulated, Diamond
Grip (PIDG) style terminals, the terminal can be captured in
the crimp tool by closing it a few "clicks" until the dies
just grab the plastic sleeve. The sleeve is centered longitudinally
in the tool's dies. When the crimp is finished, the cut strands of
wire should be visible and extend just outside the crimped area
of the wire grip but not so far as to extend out of the insulating
sleeve.
Bob . . .
Message 7
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| Subject: | Re: Battery location |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <bob.nuckolls@cox.net>
At 09:47 PM 6/15/2003 +0100, you wrote:
>--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Neville Kilford"
><nkilford@etravel.org>
>
>Thanks Bob,
>
>It sure makes a bit more room under the panel for the battery with it out
>front. What about contactors? Do you prefer them inside or out. It's one
>side of the firewall or the other, so there's not much cable length involved.
>Environmental factors are the only considerations.
>
>If I put them in the engine compartment, do you recommend covering them?
>
>Cheers.
>Nev
nope, just hang 'em out there. If there is any chance that RADIANT
heat from exhaust stacks can impinge on plastic surface of battery,
you might need some kind of shield . . .
I've seen lots of RG batteries installed under the cowl. There
have to be some folks here on the list that can tell you of
successful installations on their airplanes or others they've
seen.
Bob . . .
Message 8
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| Subject: | Re: Marker Beacon Antenna Lead |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "J. Oberst" <joberst@cox-internet.com>
Charlie, I talked with Bob Archer, an antenna expert, about this several
years ago. He told me to just mount a single wire 40" long on my rear
fuselage floor (I have a Glasair) and that would work fine. Haven't flown
yet, so I have no data to report. I'm not sure what you should do if you
have a metal airplane, but it's clear that the MB antenna does not need to
be sophisticated.
Jim Oberst
Hot Springs Village, Arkansas
----- Original Message -----
From: "Charles Brame" <charleyb@earthlink.net>
Subject: AeroElectric-List: Marker Beacon Antenna Lead
> --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: Charles Brame
<charleyb@earthlink.net>
>
> Still wondering what is required for a marker beacon antenna lead.
> Didn't get a response to the following message.
>
> Charlie Brame
> RV-6A N11CB
> San Antonio
>
> -------------------
>
> > I have an Apollo SL-10 intercom with a built in Marker Beacon. Unlike
> > Comm/Nav avionics the SL-10 does not have a BNC connection for the
antenna.
> > The SL-10 antenna connection is
> > merely one D-sub pin in a fully loaded connector. This leads me to
believe
> > that RG-400 or RG-58 cable is unnecessary. The installation manual says
> > nothing about antenna leads. I intend to have a simple wire antenna in
> > the wing tip for the marker beacon.
> >
> > What sort of antenna lead do I need? Will just a strand of 22AWG wire
> > work, or should it be some sort of shielded wire?
>
>
Message 9
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| Subject: | Re: Marker Beacon Antenna Lead |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <bob.nuckolls@cox.net>
At 12:42 PM 6/15/2003 -0500, you wrote:
>--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: Charles Brame
><charleyb@earthlink.net>
>
>Still wondering what is required for a marker beacon antenna lead.
>Didn't get a response to the following message.
>
>Charlie Brame
>RV-6A N11CB
>San Antonio
Marker beacon is a very strong, 75 MHz signal that
can be handled on ordinary shielded wire that
might otherwise be considered a VERY poor grade
of coaxial cable.
What kind of airplane are you building? If it's
plastic, you might try just hooking a 40' piece
of 22AWG wire to the pin and stretch it out along
the inside of the fuselage with as much clearance
as practical from other conductors.
But if you must go out to the wingtip to get
some radio-transparent "skin" then you could
use ordinary single conductor shielded wire
and exposed 40" of center conductor at far end.
Tape to inside of tip fairing as "spread out"
as the inside surface and volume will allow.
Bob . . .
Message 10
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| Subject: | Re: Q: KT76 NAV Audio Pin |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <bob.nuckolls@cox.net>
At 06:32 PM 6/14/2003 -0500, you wrote:
>--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Jon Finley" <jon@finleyweb.net>
>
>Hi all,
>
>I would like to install an external switch on my King KX155 NAV audio
>(the internal switch will not allow me to turn the NAV audio down/off).
>I'm a bit confused looking at the pin out (a feeling that I am quite
>familiar with!).
>
>The following lines are listed:
>1) NAV AUDIO HI
>2) NAV AUDIO LO
>
>They come out of one connector and into another connector (both on the
>KX155). Are these the right wires to switch? If so, should I install
>the switch in one (single pole) or both (double pole) of these
>connections?
Do you have the installation manual for the radio? I believe this
radio has an audio isolation amplifier built in. Audio output from
comm and nav are headphone level signals that are normally looped
back into auxiliary inputs to the isolation amplifier via a
phones/off/speaker select switch. There may also be a need for
certain pins to be jumpered together for the audio system to
work. The installation manual will explain this in detail.
Bob . . .
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