Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 12:37 AM - Re: FM antenna (Neville Kilford)
2. 12:53 AM - Re: Re:Pro Crimper II & hole punches (jrourke@allied-computer.com)
3. 01:03 AM - Re: Re:Pro Crimper II & hole punches (Don Honabach)
4. 03:23 AM - Re: power supply (KITFOXZ@aol.com)
5. 05:24 AM - Re: AC rated key switch (Dennis O'Connor)
6. 06:02 AM - Re: power supply (Dave von Linsowe)
7. 06:21 AM - Re: power supply (Werner Schneider)
8. 06:31 AM - Re: fadec / Z14 (Robert L. Nuckolls, III)
9. 06:56 AM - Re: AC rated key switch (Robert L. Nuckolls, III)
10. 06:59 AM - Re: special terminals for LR3?????? (Robert L. Nuckolls, III)
11. 07:03 AM - Re: Contacts for Narco 111 or 112 (Robert L. Nuckolls, III)
12. 07:09 AM - Re: Voltage Regulator (Robert L. Nuckolls, III)
13. 07:28 AM - Re: AC rated key switch (Richard Tasker)
14. 08:17 AM - Re: Re: special terminals for LR3?????? (Jeff Point)
15. 08:59 AM - Re: power supply (Dave von Linsowe)
16. 09:11 AM - $10 fix for Noisy Transmissions??? (Ed Anderson)
17. 09:25 AM - Re: Re: special terminals for LR3?????? (Jeff Point)
18. 09:50 AM - Re: AC rated key switch (John & Amy Eckel)
19. 10:04 AM - Re: $10 fix for Noisy Transmissions??? ()
20. 10:17 AM - Re: $10 fix for Noisy Transmissions??? (Dennis O'Connor)
21. 05:10 PM - Re: Contacts for Narco 111 or 112 (Dean Head)
Message 1
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--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Neville Kilford" <nkilford@etravel.org>
Mark,
>What have y'all done for FM reception that does not require another wire
>poking out of the fuse somewhere?
I'm a bit anti-wires-poking-out too, so I decided to get all the aerials
inside.
The FM aerial is in the back of the fuselage, mounted vertically. The ground
plane, six aluminium spokes, is mounted at the top longeron level, and they
just about fit in with a bit of, er, persuasion. The aerial's fixed at the
top to a stiffener that goes across the fuselage. At the bottom, it slides
into a locating block (fixed to the fuselage floor) to stop the aerial from
wobbling about too much.
It's untested, but anecdotal evidence from other Jodel builders suggests that
it should be good performance.
Cheers.
Nev
--
Jodel D-150 project
UK
----- Original Message -----
From: "Mark Phillips" <ripsteel@edge.net>
Subject: AeroElectric-List: FM antenna
> --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: Mark Phillips <ripsteel@edge.net>
>
> Howdy A-list-
>
> I am toying with putting an FM antenna on top of the VS hidden inside
> the tips- the base would be attached to the front of the top rib of the
> VS, get bent back 90 degrees and pass through a small hole in the front
> of the rudder tip extending to the rear of it. Total length would be
> about 23". Would perhaps require a smaller diameter wire for
> flexibility. (sources for such a wire?)
>
> Would this even work, or is a ground plane necessary? Any thoughts
> appreciated!
>
> What have y'all done for FM reception that does not require another wire
> poking out of the fuse somewhere?
>
> From The PossumWorks and do not archive these silly questions...
>
> Mark
>
>
Message 2
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| Subject: | Re:Pro Crimper II & hole punches |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: jrourke@allied-computer.com
Looking up that part number, I see PG terminals, (which I think are the
Plast-Grip terminals from page 172)... not the PIDG Diamond Grips (from
page 181)... which did you receive, or have you received the kit yet?
Considering that the PGs are only half the price of the PIDGs, I'd
suspect they are the more ordinary automotive-type... can you confirm it
one way or the other?
-John R.
Don Honabach wrote:
>--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Don Honabach" <don@pcperfect.com>
>
>Steve,
>
>I bought it at www.digikey.com
>
>Part # A9821-ND
>
>Includes the AMP Pro Crimper II, Red/Blue/Yellow PIDG Die, and an
>assortment of PIDG connectors.
>
>Cost was $112.50 plus shipping.
>
>Don
>
>
>-----Original Message-----
>From: KahnSG@aol.com [mailto:KahnSG@aol.com]
>To: aeroelectric-list@matronics.com
>Subject: AeroElectric-List: Re:Pro Crimper II & hole punches
>
>
>--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: KahnSG@aol.com
>
>Where did Don buy the crimper for $120.00?
>
>Does anyone have a cheaper source for 3.125 & 2.250 in. hole punches for
>
>instruments than Greenlee?
>
>Steve
>
>
>direct advertising on the Matronics Forums.
>
>
>
>
Message 3
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| Subject: | Re:Pro Crimper II & hole punches |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Don Honabach" <don@pcperfect.com>
The kit comes with an assortment of both styles - check out Tyco/AMPs
site and search on the mfg. part. It will have a better description of
the kit.
Don
-----Original Message-----
From: jrourke@allied-computer.com [mailto:jrourke@allied-computer.com]
Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Re:Pro Crimper II & hole punches
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: jrourke@allied-computer.com
Looking up that part number, I see PG terminals, (which I think are the
Plast-Grip terminals from page 172)... not the PIDG Diamond Grips (from
page 181)... which did you receive, or have you received the kit yet?
Considering that the PGs are only half the price of the PIDGs, I'd
suspect they are the more ordinary automotive-type... can you confirm it
one way or the other?
-John R.
Don Honabach wrote:
>--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Don Honabach"
>--> <don@pcperfect.com>
>
>Steve,
>
>I bought it at www.digikey.com
>
>Part # A9821-ND
>
>Includes the AMP Pro Crimper II, Red/Blue/Yellow PIDG Die, and an
>assortment of PIDG connectors.
>
>Cost was $112.50 plus shipping.
>
>Don
>
>
>-----Original Message-----
>From: KahnSG@aol.com [mailto:KahnSG@aol.com]
>To: aeroelectric-list@matronics.com
>Subject: AeroElectric-List: Re:Pro Crimper II & hole punches
>
>
>--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: KahnSG@aol.com
>
>Where did Don buy the crimper for $120.00?
>
>Does anyone have a cheaper source for 3.125 & 2.250 in. hole punches
>for
>
>instruments than Greenlee?
>
>Steve
>
>
>direct advertising on the Matronics Forums.
>
>
>
>
direct advertising on the Matronics Forums.
Message 4
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| Subject: | Re: power supply |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: KITFOXZ@aol.com
In a message dated 7/10/2003 10:22:33 AM Eastern Standard Time,
davevon@tir.com writes:
> Active noise reduction systems require a very stable and clean power
> supply. Our panel-mount power supply has 2 voltage regulators, a DC-DC converter
> for isolation, and an in-line 1/4 amp fuse.
>
>
Dave,
The ANR headset manufacturer's statement is true to get the best performance
possible. A DC-DC converter is considerable more parts count than just an
LM-317 and voltage divider resistors. They are building or selling a power
supply that truly isolates input and supplied output voltages.
If cheap is what you want, see how many 9 V batteries you can buy for $80.
...A stand alone battery is the best isolation possible...You could attach a
small charging circuit to your ship's power cheaply that could keep a 9.6 V
NiCad battery pack alive and switch it out of the circuit manually, etc.
John P. Marzluf
Columbus, Ohio
Kitfox Outback (out back in the garage)
Message 5
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| Subject: | Re: AC rated key switch |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Dennis O'Connor" <doconnor@chartermi.net>
Put your toggle switches under a locking cover and forego the extra failure
point of an additional switch...
Denny
----- Original Message -----
From: "Jeff Point" <jpoint@mindspring.com>
Subject: AeroElectric-List: AC rated key switch
> --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: Jeff Point
<jpoint@mindspring.com>
>
> Bob,
>
> I have decided to use toggle switches for the ignition and a push button
> for the starter, per your book. I would like to add some measure of
> security for overnights away from home, airshows etc.
Message 6
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| Subject: | Re: power supply |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Dave von Linsowe" <davevon@tir.com>
Thanks John,
I was wondering about the LM-317 being a clean enough power source. My main
reason for wanting to go with the aircraft power system is to eliminate the
need to turn the ANR on and off separate from everything else.
Dave
----- Original Message -----
From: <KITFOXZ@aol.com>
Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: power supply
> --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: KITFOXZ@aol.com
>
> In a message dated 7/10/2003 10:22:33 AM Eastern Standard Time,
> davevon@tir.com writes:
>
> > Active noise reduction systems require a very stable and clean power
> > supply. Our panel-mount power supply has 2 voltage regulators, a DC-DC
converter
> > for isolation, and an in-line 1/4 amp fuse.
> >
> >
>
> Dave,
>
> The ANR headset manufacturer's statement is true to get the best
performance
> possible. A DC-DC converter is considerable more parts count than just an
> LM-317 and voltage divider resistors. They are building or selling a
power
> supply that truly isolates input and supplied output voltages.
>
> If cheap is what you want, see how many 9 V batteries you can buy for $80.
> ...A stand alone battery is the best isolation possible...You could attach
a
> small charging circuit to your ship's power cheaply that could keep a 9.6
V
> NiCad battery pack alive and switch it out of the circuit manually, etc.
>
> John P. Marzluf
> Columbus, Ohio
> Kitfox Outback (out back in the garage)
Message 7
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| Subject: | Re: power supply |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Werner Schneider" <wernerschneider@compuserve.com>
John,
I have two of the kits integratet into my system, going to one fuse on the
panel, I can
send you some pictures. I do not worrie about a switch, power on means ANR
power
available, if it dies, I have standard headsets, together with the ANR kit
they are anyway
cheaper.
Werner
----- Original Message -----
From: "Dave von Linsowe" <davevon@tir.com>
Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: power supply
> --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Dave von Linsowe"
<davevon@tir.com>
>
> Thanks John,
>
> I was wondering about the LM-317 being a clean enough power source. My
main
> reason for wanting to go with the aircraft power system is to eliminate
the
> need to turn the ANR on and off separate from everything else.
>
> Dave
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: <KITFOXZ@aol.com>
> To: <aeroelectric-list@matronics.com>
> Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: power supply
>
>
> > --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: KITFOXZ@aol.com
> >
> > In a message dated 7/10/2003 10:22:33 AM Eastern Standard Time,
> > davevon@tir.com writes:
> >
> > > Active noise reduction systems require a very stable and clean power
> > > supply. Our panel-mount power supply has 2 voltage regulators, a DC-DC
> converter
> > > for isolation, and an in-line 1/4 amp fuse.
> > >
> > >
> >
> > Dave,
> >
> > The ANR headset manufacturer's statement is true to get the best
> performance
> > possible. A DC-DC converter is considerable more parts count than just
an
> > LM-317 and voltage divider resistors. They are building or selling a
> power
> > supply that truly isolates input and supplied output voltages.
> >
> > If cheap is what you want, see how many 9 V batteries you can buy for
$80.
> > ...A stand alone battery is the best isolation possible...You could
attach
> a
> > small charging circuit to your ship's power cheaply that could keep a
9.6
> V
> > NiCad battery pack alive and switch it out of the circuit manually, etc.
> >
> > John P. Marzluf
> > Columbus, Ohio
> > Kitfox Outback (out back in the garage)
>
>
Message 8
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--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <bob.nuckolls@cox.net>
At 10:10 PM 7/9/2003 -0700, you wrote:
>--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "David Schaefer"
><dschaefer1@kc.rr.com>
>
>I'm clearly confused by your reference to the second bus in Z14 as the
>"fantasy" bus. I am using that bus for critical items such as my backup
>electric gyro and essential items that the smaller of the two
>alternators can safely run. Otherwise most of my critical components,
>including the FADEC are dual-homed so they will work off either bus
>without having to throw the cross-feed.
>Are you implying that the 2nd bus is unnecessary in an all-electric
>aircraft? If so, how can I feed one primary bus with two alternators
>etc. and an automatic cutover?
No, just ranting over the fact that there are a number
of products offered for use in both certified and
OBAM aircraft including FADEC's, EFIS systems, engine
instrumentation systems, etc. that cannon live in
the real world of operation in an airplane. 25 years
ago it was a challenge to design these systems for
good behavior in spite of momentary brownout during cranking.
Today it's much easier. I'm mystified as to why suppliers
would push off requirements for a second battery
onto the customer for things like EFIS and other
processor based accessories.
In the case of FADEC, advantages of fully redundant sources are
easy to understand as with ANY other form of electrically
dependent engine. FADEC guys can sorta slide into home plate
with nobody noticing they've got holes in their shoes . . . unless
their shortcomings negate the advantage of what Z-14 architecture
offers for improved cranking on two relatively small batteries
COMBINED with there reliability of dual, independent
electrical systems.
Part of that advantage has to be given up to allow one of the
ship's batteries keep the FADEC alive during cranking. Hence
our aux bus having become a 'fantasy' bus . . . a bus for
products that purchased on faith that they're ready to
function in the real world.
>On the FADEC issue, there is no question they are erring on the side of
>caution (and their STC) as you are well aware producing SPAM cans for
>the general public. I suspect they have no choice.
I can't disagree on range of choices but I'll bet few
of the choices were support by engineering caution.
I can cite several cases where bureaucratic/regulatory
tomfoolery masquerading as caution has impeded
simple fixes to problems which have cost
$millions$ and years of lost opportunity.
I've been going over the drawings from Aerosance
and was astounded at the amount of wire and connectors it takes
to put one of these systems in an airplane. If one installs a wire it's
fair to assume that it has a useful purpose. It may even be required
for a particular system to function. If a system like FADEC is
required to function for continued flight in spite of a failure,
then there must be a back-up system -AND- a way of detecting and
annunciating the failure -AND- an hopefully a way to help a mechanic
localize and repair the failure on the ground. I am immediately
suspicious of a system that brings 51 wires into the cockpit
from system black boxes and needs 8 circuits protected at 10A each
distributed on two busses. Additionally, the system appears
to have three toggle switches in addition to something called
a start/control switch that uses a totally mystifying symbology.
>I as most builders on the other hand am striving for a much better
>electrical system design than most production aircraft ... one that
>brings the aircraft into the 20th century. Just like the FADEC finally
>brings engine technology into the same. I'm stuck in the middle trying
>to strike a balance between the two ... thus my questions to experts
>such as yourself.
Understand . . . but keep in mind that complexity is often
mistaken for useful redundancy . . . but in this case,
suppose the system could have been designed to meet single
failure operational goals with say 12 wires and 2 protected circuits
from two buses, the system would be 1/4th as likely to suffer
a maintenance event due to wiring problems. The detection,
annunciation and troubleshooting tasks would be markedly
reduced as well. Studies of their vision of a single engine
system architecture as depicted on the drawings suggest
a poor understanding of how their system would be installed
in a real airplane. They've produced a drawing that may
well explain requirements for the FADEC system but I now
understand why lister Schroeder sent me the drawings. There
is no part of the Aerosance drawing that remotely matches
how a stock certified or OBAM ship is wired so that one can
easily see where his stock airplane ends and the FADEC system
begins.
I've started some system integration drawings in an
attempt to sort out the options and make it look like
something we'd actually want to build. Obviously can't
help the FADEC, it's a what-you-see-is-what-you-get
deal. I can hook it up to Z-14 in a reasoned manner
but it will take some conversation with the manufacturer
to better understand real requirements.
Bob . . .
Message 9
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| Subject: | Re: AC rated key switch |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <bob.nuckolls@cox.net>
At 12:50 AM 7/11/2003 -0500, you wrote:
>--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: Jeff Point <jpoint@mindspring.com>
>
>Bob,
>
>I have decided to use toggle switches for the ignition and a push button
>for the starter, per your book. I would like to add some measure of
>security for overnights away from home, airshows etc. My idea is to
>place a simple two position key switch, with key removable from either
>position, in series with the DC master power switch. The switch I am
>looking at is Digikey p/n 360-1456-ND.
>
>http://dkc3.digikey.com/PDF/T032/0864.pdf
>
>This switch is not DC rated, but is AC rated for 3A @250V. Since the
>switch would not be used to actually control the circuit, only prevent
>it from being energized, I do not believe the lack of a DC rating would
>be an issue. I am aware that this adds another potential point of
>failure, but I am willing to trade this for the added security.
>
>Your thoughts?
Security against what?
How many things does a thief break through BEFORE he
gets to your magneto switches? I used to have a tenant
in one of the hangars on our airport that left
the doors on his airplane unlocked. This was to
make sure the thief didn't do many hundreds of dollars
damage to his door -AND- get the radios to boot.
Recall that twin engine airplanes don't have TWO
keyswitches . . . if you get inside a King-Air
or a C-310 . . . you own the airplane.
I once brought a rental airplane home after having lost the keys
and if the battery had been dead, I STILL could have brought the
airplane home (couldn't crank it with the battery, had to prop
the engine). If someone wants your airplane bad enough
and knows what he is doing, he'll get it . . . unless you make
it so difficult compared to stealing the airplane next door that he
won't bother with yours. My personal favorite security is a piece
of really hard chain, covered with leather jacket, and just long
enough to do a figure-8 over your prop hub to be secured with
a really good padlock. See locksmith for the lock.
This kind of security is right out in front visible to lots of
other folks should some thief think he is going to work on the
chain . . . You can get a leather cover sewn up at any seat cover
or custom leather shop. Wont scratch the prop or spinner. Best thing
yet is that it adds nothing to parts count for your airplane's
operating systems.
As to switch "ratings" see
http://www.aeroelectric.com/articles/swtchrat.pdf
Any switch with any ratings would do for the application
you propose.
Bob . . .
Message 10
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| Subject: | Re: special terminals for LR3?????? |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <bob.nuckolls@cox.net>
At 12:30 AM 7/11/2003 -0500, you wrote:
>--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: Jeff Point <jpoint@mindspring.com>
>
>Sure, now you tell me. I will just go with the molex type connector
>included with the alternator.
>
>As long as we are on the topic of connectors...
>In wiring up my shiny new LR3C-14 regulator, I noticed that it uses
>spade type connectors. Since B & C doesn't sell these, I was forced to
>go to Radio Shack and use the el-cheapo crimped terminals. It appears
>that there are three options for using these:
>
>1. use as is.
>2. remove insulating jacket, crimp wire, put heat shrink over crimp.
>3. crimp as is and put heat shrink over the insulating jacket and wire
>
>I went with option 2, which seemed to make the connection more
>mechanically sound, but it is not too late to change. Your thoughts Bob?
>
>Also, given your affinity for faston terminals, I am curious why the
>LR3C-14 does not use them?
What makes you think the LR3 uses spade terminals? The
screws are easily removed for the use of ring terminals.
We've never carried nor recommended the use of a "spade"
(I think you mean open fork) terminals.
The screw terminals were Bill's wish at the time of
the design effort. If it were my regulator, it would
have a d-sub connector on it.
Bob . . .
Message 11
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| Subject: | Re: Contacts for Narco 111 or 112 |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <bob.nuckolls@cox.net>
At 11:18 PM 7/10/2003 -0400, you wrote:
>--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Dean Head" <banana@atlantic.net>
>
>Hi,
>I was wondering if anyone knows what contacts are used in the Narco 111 or
>112 15 pin card edge connector? Narco gave me a Molex connector and contact
>number but it no longer appears valid. I have compared the contact to the
>ones used in my double sided Icom and Terra connectors but, due to the
>single sided Narco design the contacts do not appear interchangeable.
>Thanks in advance,
>Dean Head
what Molex numbers were you given?
Bob . . .
Message 12
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| Subject: | Re: Voltage Regulator |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <bob.nuckolls@cox.net>
At 09:55 PM 7/10/2003 -0500, you wrote:
>--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Tom Parks" <flightwork2@msn.com>
>
>Bob!
>
>Will the Ford VR166 regulator work with B&C's L-60 alternator or do I need
>to purchase B&C's LR3C-14 regulator? Can buy a whole lot of VR166 units
>for the pricey LR3C-14 unit.
Yes it will . . . but keep in mind that the LR3 is THREE
products in one package. Regulator, OV Protection, Active
Notification of Low Voltage. If you choose the VR166 route,
you should count on procuring and mounting the other two
feature by alternative means. If you call the LR3 a "regulator"
the price is breathtaking. If you call it an "alternator system
controller" with everything you need in one box, the price
makes more sense.
Bob . . .
--------------------------------------------
( Knowing about a thing is different than )
( understanding it. One can know a lot )
( and still understand nothing. )
( C.F. Kettering )
--------------------------------------------
Message 13
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| Subject: | Re: AC rated key switch |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: Richard Tasker <retasker@optonline.net>
Robert L. Nuckolls, III wrote:
>--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <bob.nuckolls@cox.net>
>
>At 12:50 AM 7/11/2003 -0500, you wrote:
>
>
>>--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: Jeff Point <jpoint@mindspring.com>
>>
>>Bob,
>>
>>I have decided to use toggle switches for the ignition and a push button
>>for the starter, per your book. I would like to add some measure of
>>security for overnights away from home, airshows etc. My idea is to
>>place a simple two position key switch, with key removable from either
>>position, in series with the DC master power switch. The switch I am
>>looking at is Digikey p/n 360-1456-ND.
>>
>>http://dkc3.digikey.com/PDF/T032/0864.pdf
>>
>>This switch is not DC rated, but is AC rated for 3A @250V. Since the
>>switch would not be used to actually control the circuit, only prevent
>>it from being energized, I do not believe the lack of a DC rating would
>>be an issue. I am aware that this adds another potential point of
>>failure, but I am willing to trade this for the added security.
>>
>>Your thoughts?
>>
>>
>
> Security against what?
>
> How many things does a thief break through BEFORE he
> gets to your magneto switches? I used to have a tenant
> in one of the hangars on our airport that left
> the doors on his airplane unlocked. This was to
> make sure the thief didn't do many hundreds of dollars
> damage to his door -AND- get the radios to boot.
>
One of the reasons to use a switch like this is if you live in (which I
do) or fly to NJ is that the state requires at least two locking devices
for a GA aircraft. Can be a locked hanger and a locked canopy or, if it
is tied down rather than hangered, a locked canopy and a starter lock.
I would have to assume that your method of a chain and padlock would be
acceptable as one of the locking devices also, although a bit heavy to
carry around in the plane.
Can't say as I agree with it, but unfortunately it is the law now.
Dick Tasker
Message 14
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| Subject: | Re: special terminals for LR3?????? |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: Jeff Point <jpoint@mindspring.com>
I played around with using ring terminals, but it was sufficiently
difficult to re-insert the screw that I concluded that a spade was
called for. In my (admittedly limited) experience with electronic
devices, a receptacle of this type usually indicates a spade terminal.
Apparently my reasoning was flawed, and I will try again using a ring
terminal. I do mean the "open fork" type when I refer to a spade. It
is what I have always known it as (perhaps because it's shaped like a
garden spade? Who knows.)
I have a copy of your book, a big box full of electric goodies from B &
C and a thousand questions. I do appreciate the time you spend on the
list answering all of our dumb questions and helping improve the state
of the art of electric systems.
Jeff Point
> What makes you think the LR3 uses spade terminals? The
> screws are easily removed for the use of ring terminals.
> We've never carried nor recommended the use of a "spade"
> (I think you mean open fork) terminals.
>
> The screw terminals were Bill's wish at the time of
> the design effort. If it were my regulator, it would
> have a d-sub connector on it.
>
> Bob . . .
>
>
>
>
Message 15
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| Subject: | Re: power supply |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Dave von Linsowe" <davevon@tir.com>
Bob,
What are your thoughts on how clean the power source for ANR headsets need
to be? If I build a LM-317 voltage regulator and it's not good enough,
could I damage the ANR circuitry? How will the ANR respond if the input is
not clean enough?
I've got the Headset Inc. ANR setup in a Peltor 7005 and it really works
great! I'm also using their auto shut off battery box, which I'm sure has
saved me a couple of batteries already. The problem is that the battery box
lays on the floor in front of the spar (RV-6) out of sight and out of mind.
The headset plugs are down under the panel (I didn't put them there). I'll
forget to turn it on before I'm strapped in and can't reach the box and/or
forget to turn it off when I hop out. (I know, could be a check list item,
but I think something like this should be transparent)
I'm going to upgrade my copilot's (wife) headset soon and just wanted to get
a handle on this.
Not affiliated with Headsets Inc. in any way, just like the way it works.
Thanks,
Dave
RV-6
The Silver Turtle
----- Original Message -----
From: "Dave von Linsowe" <davevon@tir.com>
Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: power supply
> --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Dave von Linsowe"
<davevon@tir.com>
>
> Thanks John,
>
> I was wondering about the LM-317 being a clean enough power source. My
main
> reason for wanting to go with the aircraft power system is to eliminate
the
> need to turn the ANR on and off separate from everything else.
>
> Dave
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: <KITFOXZ@aol.com>
> To: <aeroelectric-list@matronics.com>
> Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: power supply
>
>
> > --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: KITFOXZ@aol.com
> >
> > In a message dated 7/10/2003 10:22:33 AM Eastern Standard Time,
> > davevon@tir.com writes:
> >
> > > Active noise reduction systems require a very stable and clean power
> > > supply. Our panel-mount power supply has 2 voltage regulators, a DC-DC
> converter
> > > for isolation, and an in-line 1/4 amp fuse.
> > >
> > >
> >
> > Dave,
> >
> > The ANR headset manufacturer's statement is true to get the best
> performance
> > possible. A DC-DC converter is considerable more parts count than just
an
> > LM-317 and voltage divider resistors. They are building or selling a
> power
> > supply that truly isolates input and supplied output voltages.
> >
> > If cheap is what you want, see how many 9 V batteries you can buy for
$80.
> > ...A stand alone battery is the best isolation possible...You could
attach
> a
> > small charging circuit to your ship's power cheaply that could keep a
9.6
> V
> > NiCad battery pack alive and switch it out of the circuit manually, etc.
> >
> > John P. Marzluf
> > Columbus, Ohio
> > Kitfox Outback (out back in the garage)
Message 16
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| Subject: | $10 fix for Noisy Transmissions??? |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Ed Anderson" <eanderson@carolina.rr.com>
Regarding noisy radio transmissions. Well, I flew with the Turn Coordinator
turned off and no one could understand my transmissions, so its apparently
my problem is not noise generated by the gyro motor. I've had my Terra 760D
into shops three times and nothing can be found wrong. Then in surfing the
web I came across this very interesting bit of information regarding the
effects of very noisy cabin environments (mine is very noisy) on the
electret microphone that most of our headsets have.
Apparently if the noisy level reaches over 95db it causes the microphone to
go into some sort of harmonic resonation such that it not only does not
cancel out the cabin noise but actually adds to it. The end effect being
that your transmission is totally garbled by the resulting noise.
There is an interesting article on this effect on the electret mic on the
Oregon Aero web site (URL below). If it doesn't take you to the discussion,
try www. Oregonareo.com, select "Product"/ "Headset Upgrade"/"Why do I have
trouble communicating..." and that will bring you to the article that
describes the effect.
http://www.oregonaero.com/p5657_2001.html
Bob, I would be interested in your assessment of this. A $10 fix would sure
be nice.
Ed Anderson
RV-6A N494BW Rotary Powered
Matthews, NC
eanderson@carolina.rr.com
Message 17
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| Subject: | Re: special terminals for LR3?????? |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: Jeff Point <jpoint@mindspring.com>
A closer examination of the LR3C reveals that the plastic cover over the
terminals is removable, making the use of rings a snap. I feel a little
foolish for not noticing this sooner.
Jeff Point
Message 18
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| Subject: | Re: AC rated key switch |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "John & Amy Eckel" <eckel1@comcast.net>
----- Original Message -----
From: "Richard Tasker" <retasker@optonline.net>
Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: AC rated key switch
> --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: Richard Tasker
<retasker@optonline.net>
>
>
> Robert L. Nuckolls, III wrote:
>
> >--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III"
<bob.nuckolls@cox.net>
> >
> >At 12:50 AM 7/11/2003 -0500, you wrote:
> >
> >
> >>--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: Jeff Point
<jpoint@mindspring.com>
> >>
> >>Bob,
> >>
> >>I have decided to use toggle switches for the ignition and a push button
> >>for the starter, per your book. I would like to add some measure of
> >>security for overnights away from home, airshows etc. My idea is to
> >>place a simple two position key switch, with key removable from either
> >>position, in series with the DC master power switch. The switch I am
> >>looking at is Digikey p/n 360-1456-ND.
> >>
> >>http://dkc3.digikey.com/PDF/T032/0864.pdf
> >>
> >>This switch is not DC rated, but is AC rated for 3A @250V. Since the
> >>switch would not be used to actually control the circuit, only prevent
> >>it from being energized, I do not believe the lack of a DC rating would
> >>be an issue. I am aware that this adds another potential point of
> >>failure, but I am willing to trade this for the added security.
> >>
> >>Your thoughts?
> >>
> >>
> >
> > Security against what?
> >
> > How many things does a thief break through BEFORE he
> > gets to your magneto switches? I used to have a tenant
> > in one of the hangars on our airport that left
> > the doors on his airplane unlocked. This was to
> > make sure the thief didn't do many hundreds of dollars
> > damage to his door -AND- get the radios to boot.
> >
>
> One of the reasons to use a switch like this is if you live in (which I
> do) or fly to NJ is that the state requires at least two locking devices
> for a GA aircraft. Can be a locked hanger and a locked canopy or, if it
> is tied down rather than hangered, a locked canopy and a starter lock.
> I would have to assume that your method of a chain and padlock would be
> acceptable as one of the locking devices also, although a bit heavy to
> carry around in the plane.
>
> Can't say as I agree with it, but unfortunately it is the law now.
If you leave NJ or spend less than 24 hours at another NJ airport you do not
need to carry the chain with you.
John Eckel
>
> Dick Tasker
>
>
Message 19
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| Subject: | Re: $10 fix for Noisy Transmissions??? |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: <racker@rmci.net>
Not Bob, but have some experience with Oregon Aero mic muffs in an RV
(Lycosaur powered though <g>).
First, if your headset microphone has a gain control, try turning it down
all the way (helped my backround noise somewhat). I tried the Oregon Aero
mic muffs next. They did not fix my root noise problem (tried them before
homing in on the turn coordinator issue).
However, they did significantly improve the intercom squelch breaking open
all the time (squelch control had a *very* narrow window between everthing
dead and fully open due to the high background noise apparently). I have
much less transmitted background interior wind/engine noise, giving much
improved communications both over the intercom and ATC than before.
Worth $10 ($20, every headset on the intercom needs a muff to equalize the
input level) imho even if its not the root cause. While I was at it I
also upgraded my eon old H10-30 with the rest of Oregon Aero's stuff (ear
seals, headband, etc), and I feel I have a brand new totally comfortable
headset.
Rob Acker (RV-6 flying)
do not archive
> --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Ed Anderson"
> <eanderson@carolina.rr.com>
>
> Regarding noisy radio transmissions. Well, I flew with the Turn
> Coordinator turned off and no one could understand my transmissions, so
> its apparently my problem is not noise generated by the gyro motor.
> I've had my Terra 760D into shops three times and nothing can be found
> wrong. Then in surfing the web I came across this very interesting bit
> of information regarding the effects of very noisy cabin environments
> (mine is very noisy) on the electret microphone that most of our
> headsets have.
>
> Apparently if the noisy level reaches over 95db it causes the microphone
> to go into some sort of harmonic resonation such that it not only does
> not cancel out the cabin noise but actually adds to it. The end effect
> being that your transmission is totally garbled by the resulting noise.
>
> There is an interesting article on this effect on the electret mic on
> the Oregon Aero web site (URL below). If it doesn't take you to the
> discussion, try www. Oregonareo.com, select "Product"/ "Headset
> Upgrade"/"Why do I have trouble communicating..." and that will bring
> you to the article that describes the effect.
>
> http://www.oregonaero.com/p5657_2001.html
>
> Bob, I would be interested in your assessment of this. A $10 fix would
> sure be nice.
>
> Ed Anderson
> RV-6A N494BW Rotary Powered
> Matthews, NC
> eanderson@carolina.rr.com
>
Message 20
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| Subject: | Re: $10 fix for Noisy Transmissions??? |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Dennis O'Connor" <doconnor@chartermi.net>
Borrow an old hand mike from someone - every fbo will have a drawer full of
them... If it clears up the audio then your theory is likely...
Denny
----- Original Message -----
From: "Ed Anderson" <eanderson@carolina.rr.com>
Subject: AeroElectric-List: $10 fix for Noisy Transmissions???
> --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Ed Anderson"
<eanderson@carolina.rr.com>
>
> Regarding noisy radio transmissions. Well, I flew with the Turn
Coordinator
> turned off and no one could understand my transmissions, so its apparently
> my problem is not noise generated by the gyro motor. I've had my Terra
760D
> into shops three times and nothing can be found wrong. Then in surfing
the
> web I came across this very interesting bit of information regarding the
> effects of very noisy cabin environments (mine is very noisy) on the
> electret microphone that most of our headsets have.
>
> Apparently if the noisy level reaches over 95db it causes the microphone
to
> go into some sort of harmonic resonation such that it not only does not
> cancel out the cabin noise but actually adds to it. The end effect being
> that your transmission is totally garbled by the resulting noise.
>
> There is an interesting article on this effect on the electret mic on the
> Oregon Aero web site (URL below). If it doesn't take you to the
discussion,
> try www. Oregonareo.com, select "Product"/ "Headset Upgrade"/"Why do I
have
> trouble communicating..." and that will bring you to the article that
> describes the effect.
>
> http://www.oregonaero.com/p5657_2001.html
>
> Bob, I would be interested in your assessment of this. A $10 fix would
sure
> be nice.
>
> Ed Anderson
> RV-6A N494BW Rotary Powered
> Matthews, NC
> eanderson@carolina.rr.com
>
>
Message 21
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| Subject: | Re: Contacts for Narco 111 or 112 |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Dean Head" <banana@atlantic.net>
Bob,
Following up I realized that the part number that Narco had provided was
their number. The contacts are available from them but, at a high price
($1.74 ea). This is a single sided 15 contact "molex/amp" style connector.
The contacts are identical to the more common 2 sided Molex 4338 style
connector except, the extension ears that locate the contact within the
connector body (between the crimp area and finger of the contact) are longer
than the 2 sided version. This is due to the construction of the single
sided connector body. Does this description make any sense? Maybe the $1.74
ea 'aint such a bad deal!
Thanks
Dean
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