---------------------------------------------------------- AeroElectric-List Digest Archive --- Total Messages Posted Mon 07/21/03: 33 ---------------------------------------------------------- Today's Message Index: ---------------------- 1. 04:37 AM - Re: RFI problems with Van's gages (Robert L. Nuckolls, III) 2. 06:03 AM - Icom A-200 pinout (Doug Landmann) 3. 06:28 AM - Re: XM Radio whine (Robert L. Nuckolls, III) 4. 06:29 AM - Re: alternator wires (Robert L. Nuckolls, III) 5. 06:33 AM - Re: WESTACH instrument lighting, new link (Robert L. Nuckolls, III) 6. 06:38 AM - Re: Icom A-200 pinout (Robert L. Nuckolls, III) 7. 06:42 AM - Re: generating .pdf files . . . (Robert L. Nuckolls, III) 8. 06:44 AM - Re: Strobe shield grounding question (Robert L. Nuckolls, III) 9. 07:09 AM - RFI problems (Shannon Knoepflein) 10. 07:27 AM - Re: Infinity grip (Scott Bilinski) 11. 07:33 AM - Re: Annunciator Panel on the cheap (Neville Kilford) 12. 07:40 AM - Re: Strobe shield grounding question (mailbox bob at mail.flyboybob.com) 13. 07:43 AM - Switch-breaker same style as toggle switch? (Neville Kilford) 14. 09:01 AM - Re: Strobe shield grounding question (Dan Checkoway) 15. 10:15 AM - Re: Strobe shield grounding question (Larry Bowen) 16. 10:25 AM - Re: Strobe shield grounding question (BobsV35B@aol.com) 17. 10:58 AM - Re: Strobe shield grounding question (Larry Bowen) 18. 11:01 AM - hi or lo headset wires (cary rhodes) 19. 11:58 AM - Re: Strobe shield grounding question (Robert L. Nuckolls, III) 20. 12:02 PM - Re: RFI problems (Robert L. Nuckolls, III) 21. 12:08 PM - Re: hi or lo headset wires (Dan Checkoway) 22. 12:20 PM - Re: Either fixed or variable Rehostat (jmfpublic@comcast.net) 23. 12:23 PM - Re: Annunciator Panel on the cheap (Robert L. Nuckolls, III) 24. 12:42 PM - Re: Narco ID-825 VOR/LOC/GS Indicator and Apollo SL-30 (jmfpublic@comcast.net) 25. 01:10 PM - Molex Pins (frequent flyer) 26. 01:46 PM - Re: Molex Pins (Richard M. Martin) 27. 02:17 PM - Re: Switch-breaker same style as toggle switch? (N1deltawhiskey@aol.com) 28. 03:59 PM - Re: Molex Pins (Robert L. Nuckolls, III) 29. 04:20 PM - Re: Strobe shield grounding question (Robert L. Nuckolls, III) 30. 04:23 PM - Re: Strobe shield grounding question (Robert L. Nuckolls, III) 31. 08:37 PM - Re: KX-125 problem (Robert L. Nuckolls, III) 32. 08:41 PM - Re: wire current & Resistance for 26ga wire. (Robert L. Nuckolls, III) 33. 09:04 PM - KX155 Squelch Question (N223RV@aol.com) ________________________________ Message 1 _____________________________________ Time: 04:37:23 AM PST US From: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" Subject: AeroElectric-List: RE: RFI problems with Van's gages --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" At 09:22 PM 7/20/2003 -0500, you wrote: >BOB, > >HAVE YOU HAD A CHANCE TO LOOK INTO VANS GAGES (SPECIFICALLY THE MANIFOLD >PRESSURE AND AMP METER) PROBLEMS WHICH KEEP CROPPING UP WHEN TRANSMITTING? > >I'VE GOT EM AND CAN WAVE A TRANSMITTING HANDHELD AROUND THE PANEL AND MAKE >THE GAGES DANCE. SAME THING WITH THE GNS430 WHEN TRANSMITTING. > >I DO HAVE SINGLE POINT GROUNDING, SO DO NOT THINK THAT THIS IS A SIMPLE >WIRING ISSUE. I think you're right. From what I've learned so far about these instruments is that they have some active devices inside (transistors, ic's, etc.) that are probably not well configured for RF immunity. Not an uncommon problem with wannabe aircraft parts suppliers that haven't done their homework. Have you talked with Van's about these? I'd be willing to help the manufacturer clean up his act. Bob . . . -------------------------------------------- ( Knowing about a thing is different than ) ( understanding it. One can know a lot ) ( and still understand nothing. ) ( C.F. Kettering ) -------------------------------------------- ________________________________ Message 2 _____________________________________ Time: 06:03:25 AM PST US From: Doug Landmann Subject: AeroElectric-List: Icom A-200 pinout --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: Doug Landmann Anyone out there have a pinout diagram for the Icom A-200 radio? Thanks, Doug Landmann DO NOT ARCHIVE ________________________________ Message 3 _____________________________________ Time: 06:28:09 AM PST US From: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: XM Radio whine --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" At 09:31 PM 7/17/2003 -0700, you wrote: >--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: richard@riley.net > >A friend of mine has just installed a Delphi XM radio in a Berkut 540, >feeding a PS 2000 intercom. We're using Lightspeed headsets. > >Prior to the radio install the audio system was fine, now there's a very >loud high pitched whine. The whine varies pitch directly with engine RPM. > >Three things make the whine stop completely - shutting off the alt. field, >disconnecting the audio output from the XM radio to the music input of the >intercom, and disconnecting the power going to the XM radio. Turning the >radio off doesn't stop the whine. > >The radio was wired directly to the battery (with an inline fuse), then >wired to the battery through a 20 amp Radio Shack noise filter. The filter >does nothing. > >We're about to fly from Los Angeles to Kitty Hawk, to Dayton, Oshkosh, >Texas and back to LA. Music would make the trip much nicer. Any suggestions? This sounds like a ground loop problem. ALL accessories should be grounded to the single point ground. At the least, the radio needs to ground at the same place as the audio system. A power line filter will have no effect on a ground loop induced noise. Bob . . . -------------------------------------------- ( Knowing about a thing is different than ) ( understanding it. One can know a lot ) ( and still understand nothing. ) ( C.F. Kettering ) -------------------------------------------- ________________________________ Message 4 _____________________________________ Time: 06:29:08 AM PST US From: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: alternator wires --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" At 07:19 AM 7/18/2003 -0700, you wrote: >--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: cary rhodes > >You guys did such a good job w/ the first question, I >will see it I can solve another. > >My nippon Denso alternator has a plug w/ three wires. > >There are marked IG, DL and L. Big white, black w/ >yellow stripe, and yellow respectively. > >I got it on the big white wire, its the current out >wire. > >One of the others is the field or excitation and the >other may be a indicator light or something. > >Which which is which. > >thanks > >cary I'm guessing but I suspect the alternator will function using only the IG wire as the control lead. Leave other leads un-connected. Bob . . . Bob . . . -------------------------------------------- ( Knowing about a thing is different than ) ( understanding it. One can know a lot ) ( and still understand nothing. ) ( C.F. Kettering ) -------------------------------------------- ________________________________ Message 5 _____________________________________ Time: 06:33:24 AM PST US From: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" Subject: AeroElectric-List: Re: WESTACH instrument lighting, new link --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" > > Bill, > > Sounds like you're working with Westach instruments. Here's a comic > book on dealing with those or any other instruments that give you > short pigtails for internal lighting. > > http://216.55.140.222/articles/InstLight1/InstLight1.html > > Bob . . . I've added a wiring diagram to go with the original Shop Notes and organized the linkage a bit better. The new link to this article and companion drawing is: http://216.55.140.222/articles/Instrument_Lighting/westachlights.html Bob . . . ________________________________ Message 6 _____________________________________ Time: 06:38:27 AM PST US From: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Icom A-200 pinout --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" At 08:02 AM 7/21/2003 -0500, you wrote: >--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: Doug Landmann > > >Anyone out there have a pinout diagram for the Icom A-200 radio? > >Thanks, >Doug Landmann go to http://www.aeroelectric.com/Installation_Data Bob . . . ________________________________ Message 7 _____________________________________ Time: 06:42:33 AM PST US From: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" Subject: AeroElectric-List: Re: generating .pdf files . . . --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" At 10:50 PM 7/17/2003 -0500, you wrote: >--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "David Carter" > > > >Just trying to get a better understanding of how to REALLY convert from dwg >or dxf to readable pdf. What software are you using to edit .dwg files and what utility are you using to generate .pdf files. I use ACAD2000 and Acrobat 5.0. When you "print" to Acrobat, ACAD lets you set up a template for Acrobat as a unique printer where you can control the lineweight of each color. Really easy to use and improves your .pdf output a bunch. Bob . . . ________________________________ Message 8 _____________________________________ Time: 06:44:25 AM PST US From: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Strobe shield grounding question --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" At 05:48 PM 7/17/2003 -0700, you wrote: >--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Dan Checkoway" > >(sorry if this is a duplicate message) > >I'm installing the Whelen Comet Flash power supply (single central p/s for >both wingtip and tail strobes) in my RV-7, and I'm a little confused about >how I should ground the shielding on the strobe wires. > >The Whelen instructions say to "GROUND SHIELD WIRE AT POWER SUPPLY END." > >Now, if I didn't know any better, I would just run 'em to a ring terminal >and locally ground them to one of the power supply mount bolts. Yup, that's what I would do too . . . >But I *think* I know better...and would like to run the ground all the way >back to the 24/48 ground tab forest at the firewall. The question is this: >can "this ground" share the same wire as the power supply's ground wire, or >should it be run separately? > >Or...am I really over-thinking this and locally grounding the shield won't >induce any noise? > >I really don't mind running an extra wire to insure that there won't be >noise, but if I can share the existing 14AWG ground wire I'll be a happy >camper. Ground to the power supply mounting bolt. Shields are ALWAYS system specific and will tie to some feature on a system connector or to the case. They never get pigtails to a remote ground point . . . Bob . . . ________________________________ Message 9 _____________________________________ Time: 07:09:59 AM PST US From: "Shannon Knoepflein" Subject: AeroElectric-List: RFI problems --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Shannon Knoepflein" I'm getting a similar problem with my fuel probes from Electronics International. When I transmit over the 430 or the sl30, the fuel quantity goes towards zero. There are two small black plastic boxes that house the electronics. I'm not really sure what to try. I'm thinking of trying to move them. However, I already have them as far away from the comm coax as possible...all the way to the right of the panel, while comm. is in center and feeds out to left. Wire is shielded 3 conductor. Any thoughts. --- Shannon Knoepflein <---> kycshann@kyol.net >I'VE GOT EM AND CAN WAVE A TRANSMITTING HANDHELD AROUND THE PANEL AND MAKE >THE GAGES DANCE. SAME THING WITH THE GNS430 WHEN TRANSMITTING. ________________________________ Message 10 ____________________________________ Time: 07:27:23 AM PST US From: Scott Bilinski Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Infinity grip --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: Scott Bilinski I installed the relay..............Dont remember exactly why, but at the time it made sense. Dosent Infinity recommend a relay? I dont remember. I HIGHLY RECOMMEND BONDING ON SOME TYPE OF SWITCH PROTECTION!!!!!!!! Lets just say that the switch got bumped buy the guy in the cocpit while I was working on the engine, with the prop on!!!! This switch is very dangerous while working on the plane with more than one person around. No one was hurt and I am actually glad it happened the way it did. Switch guard WILL be fabricated!! At 08:52 AM 7/20/03 -0500, you wrote: >--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Greg's Mail" ><50coperhed@jbntelco.com> > >Has anyone used the engine start switch on the Infinity stick grip? >The momentary switch is rated at 8 amps, do you need a relay >to operate the Ford type of starter soleniod? Thanks >Greg Davis RV 4 > > Scott Bilinski Eng dept 305 Phone (858) 657-2536 Pager (858) 502-5190 ________________________________ Message 11 ____________________________________ Time: 07:33:56 AM PST US From: "Neville Kilford" Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Annunciator Panel on the cheap --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Neville Kilford" Mark, John, Thanks for your replies. I'm not entirely sure which LR3C I'm using. I've been under the seemingly-mistaken idea that there's just one model -- the incandescent version. Bob, if you're reading this, can you throw any light on the subject, and in particular whether I can just put the LR3C lamp output into Mark's nifty annunciator circuit. Can you describe how the LR3C lights its lamp? Many thanks. Nev ----- Original Message ----- From: "Mark Phillips" Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Annunciator Panel on the cheap > --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: Mark Phillips > > Hi Nev- > > I had John send me a copy of the bi-color LED lamp unit he sent you. If I > understand this thing correctly, the bi-color LED simply is two LEDs connected > backwards to each other, which you could do on the annunciator blocks as well, using > much smaller resistor values- bear in mind that your 30mm long blocks each have 5 > LEDs in them. If the intermediate LED terminals are connected in series (as shown > on my drawing with 3 in series) the appropriate resistor would normally be 220 ohms > for 20mA flow, or about 180 ohms to overdrive them to about 30mA as shown on my > drawing. > > If I understand your question below about using the LEDs instead of the bulb, I'm > not sure if it would work with your regulator, as the bi-color feature appears > unique to that particular model LR3C regulator (I think!) It is important to know > how the LR3 handles the light output- it appears to be a ground path for the warning > lamp on the drawing John sent. I'm guessing that in normal operation there is > voltage applied by the regulator on pin #5 to the bi-polar LED, causing the green > one to light- if an undervoltage condition, I would guess that pin 5 is switched to > ground, causing the red one to light. > > It appears that the LR3s come in at least 3 flavors- one for incandescent lamp, one > for single LED, and the bi-polar. Which model LR3 regulator are you using, and do > you have a link to an AeroElectric drawing for this regulator similar to the one > John sent you? I could take a look at it and query Bob as to the correct connect > you wish to employ. Note in my drawing that I am using one of Bobs 9005-201 Low > Voltage Monitor Modules and a generic regulator instead of the LR3. > > Mark > > John Schroeder wrote: > > > --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: John Schroeder > > > > Nev - > > > > I'm going to pipe both of our LR3C regulator lights to the annunciator. Bob > > drew up the resistor arrangement (needs 2 per LED). I have a copy and will > > send it to you via separate email. > > > > Cheers, > > > > John > > > > On Sat, 19 Jul 2003 20:22:10 +0100, Neville Kilford > > wrote: > > > > > --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Neville Kilford" > > > > > > > > > Mark, > > > > > > I'm definitely in on this, and I've been meaning to ask you about > > > connecting > > > to different input levels... but I just twigged that you can support both > > > those indicator feeds that are +ve and those that are -ve. Cunning. > > > > > > I've got some of the LED light bars on order. I've gone for the 30 x 7mm > > > ones. > > > > > > Here's a further question for you or Bob, or anyone else using the LR3C > > > alternator controller -- can I use your LED setup in place of the > > > B&C-supplied bulb? It looks as though the output from the LR3C could fit > > > right into the "+ve feed" part of your annunciator. > > > ________________________________ Message 12 ____________________________________ Time: 07:40:42 AM PST US From: "mailbox bob at mail.flyboybob.com" Subject: RE: AeroElectric-List: Strobe shield grounding question --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "mailbox bob at mail.flyboybob.com" Bob (Nuckolls) wrote: Ground to the power supply mounting bolt. Shields are ALWAYS system specific and will tie to some feature on a system connector or to the case. They never get pigtails to a remote ground point . . . My understanding is that shields should only be connected on one end to prevent introduction of ground loops through the shield. It doesn't matter which end of the shield is grounded as it only serves to block radiation of FRI from the enclosed wires to other systems. Do you concur with my recollection or do I need some retraining? Regards, Bob (Lee) ______________________________ N52BL KR2 Suwanee, GA 30024 91% done only 51% to go! Phone/Fax: 770/844-7501 mailto:bob@flyboybob.com http://flyboybob.com ________________________________ Message 13 ____________________________________ Time: 07:43:33 AM PST US From: "Neville Kilford" Subject: AeroElectric-List: Switch-breaker same style as toggle switch? --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Neville Kilford" Hi guys, I note in the Aeroelectric Connection, Bob recommends using a switch breaker for ground power connector o/v protection. A good idea, but does anyone know whether the switch breakers are exactly the same size and look as the toggles that I've bought from B&C? Many thanks. Nev -- Jodel D150 in progress UK ________________________________ Message 14 ____________________________________ Time: 09:01:31 AM PST US From: "Dan Checkoway" Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Strobe shield grounding question --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Dan Checkoway" Let me address these in the opposite order: > My understanding is that shields should only be connected on one end to > prevent introduction of ground loops through the shield. It doesn't matter > which end of the shield is grounded as it only serves to block radiation of > FRI from the enclosed wires to other systems. Do you concur with my > recollection or do I need some retraining? That's exactly what Whelen recommends...grounding the shields at the power supply end, but leaving them unattached at the strobe lamp ends. > Ground to the power supply mounting bolt. Shields are ALWAYS system > specific and will tie to some feature on a system connector or to > the case. They never get pigtails to a remote ground point . . . I'm not sure I agree with this, or maybe I don't understand the concepts (likely). If you're gonna ground the shields to the airframe at the power supply, why not ground them all the way back to the firewall ground block? It just seems like that's where the electrons are going anyway...give 'em the shortest, simplest path, right? I guess I need to slow down or something, because yesterday I soldered the shields to the power supply ground wire (goes back to the forest tabs on the firewall), as pictured here: http://rvproject.com/images/2003/20030720_shields_grounded.jpg Please let me know if you think this was a BAD move, and not just possibly superfluous. Again, just so you don't get the wrong idea, the sheilds are grounded like this ONLY at the power supply end. Thanks, )_( Dan RV-7 N714D http://www.rvproject.com ________________________________ Message 15 ____________________________________ Time: 10:15:39 AM PST US Subject: RE: AeroElectric-List: Strobe shield grounding question From: "Larry Bowen" --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Larry Bowen" I don't know if it depends on the application, but I can tell you that the UPS SL30 and MC200-306 I wired recently explicitly said to ground both ends of the shield for the resolver wires. - Larry Bowen Larry@BowenAero.com http://BowenAero.com mailbox bob at mail.flyboybob.com said: > --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "mailbox bob at > mail.flyboybob.com" > > Bob (Nuckolls) wrote: > > Ground to the power supply mounting bolt. Shields are ALWAYS system > specific and will tie to some feature on a system connector or to > the case. They never get pigtails to a remote ground point . . . > > My understanding is that shields should only be connected on one end to > prevent introduction of ground loops through the shield. It doesn't > matter > which end of the shield is grounded as it only serves to block radiation > of > FRI from the enclosed wires to other systems. Do you concur with my > recollection or do I need some retraining? > > Regards, > > Bob (Lee) > ______________________________ > N52BL KR2 Suwanee, GA 30024 > 91% done only 51% to go! > Phone/Fax: 770/844-7501 > mailto:bob@flyboybob.com > http://flyboybob.com ________________________________ Message 16 ____________________________________ Time: 10:25:05 AM PST US From: BobsV35B@aol.com Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Strobe shield grounding question --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: BobsV35B@aol.com In a message dated 7/21/03 12:16:21 PM Central Daylight Time, Larry@BowenAero.com writes: > I don't know if it depends on the application, but I can tell you that the > UPS SL30 and MC200-306 I wired recently explicitly said to ground both > ends of the shield for the resolver wires. > Good Afternoon Larry, Did the directions say to actually ground the shield to a ship's ground point at each end or did it tell you to connect the shield at each end to something on the component? In some cases, the shield is used as the ground return to the main component. The rest of the auxiliary component is isolated from the ship's ground. Happy Skies, Old Bob ________________________________ Message 17 ____________________________________ Time: 10:58:29 AM PST US Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Strobe shield grounding question From: "Larry Bowen" --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Larry Bowen" Hi Bob. On the component. I'm going by these instructions http://www.upsat.com/dwnlds/sldoc/sl30-ins-03.pdf Page 22, the notes at the bottom. I'm still not 100% certain I did it right. The chasis of the MD200 seems to be isolated from everything. There is no continuity between it and the mounting screws or even the d-sub in the back of it. Most of this is still black-magic from my point of view..... - Larry Bowen Larry@BowenAero.com http://BowenAero.com BobsV35B@aol.com said: > --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: BobsV35B@aol.com > > In a message dated 7/21/03 12:16:21 PM Central Daylight Time, > Larry@BowenAero.com writes: > >> I don't know if it depends on the application, but I can tell you that >> the >> UPS SL30 and MC200-306 I wired recently explicitly said to ground both >> ends of the shield for the resolver wires. >> > > Good Afternoon Larry, > > Did the directions say to actually ground the shield to a ship's ground > point > at each end or did it tell you to connect the shield at each end to > something > on the component? > > In some cases, the shield is used as the ground return to the main > component. > The rest of the auxiliary component is isolated from the ship's ground. > > Happy Skies, > > Old Bob > ________________________________ Message 18 ____________________________________ Time: 11:01:43 AM PST US From: cary rhodes Subject: AeroElectric-List: hi or lo headset wires --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: cary rhodes Bob Good to see you are back In my wiring harness I have a cable of multiple wires in a shielded case headed for the mic and headset jacks. The diagram shows a HI and Lo designation on the mic and headphone wires. I'm thinking impedance here, but that's about as far as my knowledge goes. Which wire should I solder to the respective pins on the jack?? HI or LO thanks cary rhodes __________________________________ ________________________________ Message 19 ____________________________________ Time: 11:58:47 AM PST US From: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" Subject: RE: AeroElectric-List: Strobe shield grounding question --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" At 10:40 AM 7/21/2003 -0400, you wrote: >--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "mailbox bob at >mail.flyboybob.com" > >Bob (Nuckolls) wrote: > >Ground to the power supply mounting bolt. Shields are ALWAYS system > specific and will tie to some feature on a system connector or to > the case. They never get pigtails to a remote ground point . . . > >My understanding is that shields should only be connected on one end to >prevent introduction of ground loops through the shield. It doesn't matter >which end of the shield is grounded as it only serves to block radiation of >FRI from the enclosed wires to other systems. Do you concur with my >recollection or do I need some retraining? > >Regards, > >Bob (Lee) Shields use purely as electro-static coupling breaks between adjacent wires needs to be grounded at one end only. Adding a ground at the other end will not make it work better and it MIGHT cause a new problem with ground loop induced noises. Some installers use shields as ground returns in addition to electro-static shielding. This the case, installation wiring diagrams are explicit as to where you hook the shields. For example, I show headset and microphone wiring carried on shielded single and trio wires in the installation manual I did for the Microair 760VHF . . . the radio would probably work fine and noise free had these circuits been simply wired with open, twisted wires and no shielding. In this case, getting the wires already assembled in a twisted mini-bundle with a shield was a convenience. The shield is useful to insure concentricity of the bundle's magnetic fields for reduced susceptibility to noise in addition to providing a ground return for the remote component . . . its benefits as an electro-static shield are not necessary nor utilized in this case. Check out the headset and microphone wiring in http://216.55.140.222/Catalog/avionics/760imB.pdf where you'll see that shield termination at both ends of the run are quite explicit. The short story is that there is no single, hard rule for use of shielded wire and terminating the shield. Unless the schematic shows otherwise, hook up one end only and as depicted on the diagram. If it wants you to hook up both ends, it should be equally explicit. And whether or not the designer intended the shielding to work as electrostatic de-coupling, electromagnetic de-coupling, or just as another wire in the bundle . . . you'll have to ask because it cannot always be deduced by dissecting the wiring diagram. Bob . . . ________________________________ Message 20 ____________________________________ Time: 12:02:41 PM PST US From: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: RFI problems --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" At 10:06 AM 7/21/2003 -0400, you wrote: >--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Shannon Knoepflein" > > >I'm getting a similar problem with my fuel probes from Electronics >International. When I transmit over the 430 or the sl30, the fuel >quantity goes towards zero. There are two small black plastic boxes >that house the electronics. I'm not really sure what to try. I'm >thinking of trying to move them. However, I already have them as far >away from the comm coax as possible...all the way to the right of the >panel, while comm. is in center and feeds out to left. Wire is shielded >3 conductor. Any thoughts. Your coax doesn't radiate as long as there is a reasonable antenna on the other end. Sounds like another case of inattention to details for a device intended to operate in close proximity with very strong VHF signals. What kind of airplane and where are antennas with respect to victim system? Bob . . . -------------------------------------------- ( Knowing about a thing is different than ) ( understanding it. One can know a lot ) ( and still understand nothing. ) ( C.F. Kettering ) -------------------------------------------- ________________________________ Message 21 ____________________________________ Time: 12:08:34 PM PST US From: "Dan Checkoway" Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: hi or lo headset wires --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Dan Checkoway" Cary, I forget where I dug this image up, but anyway, I found it helpful: http://www.rvproject.com/images/jack_wiring.jpg For the mic: HI goes to the Ring, LO goes to the barrel/ground. For the headset: HI goes to the Tip, LO goes to the barrel/ground. )_( Dan RV-7 N714D http://www.rvproject.com ----- Original Message ----- From: "cary rhodes" Subject: AeroElectric-List: hi or lo headset wires > --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: cary rhodes > > Bob > > Good to see you are back > > In my wiring harness I have a cable of multiple wires > in a shielded case headed for the mic and headset > jacks. > > The diagram shows a HI and Lo designation on the mic > and headphone wires. > > I'm thinking impedance here, but that's about as far > as my knowledge goes. > > Which wire should I solder to the respective pins on > the jack?? > > HI or LO > > thanks > > cary rhodes > > > __________________________________ > > ________________________________ Message 22 ____________________________________ Time: 12:20:56 PM PST US From: jmfpublic@comcast.net (Aeroelectric-List) Subject: AeroElectric-List: RE: Either fixed or variable Rehostat --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: jmfpublic@comcast.net Jeff, Just take the RC pulse width controller with the smallest output that you can find, and use it to drive the gate of one more more paralleled field effect transistors. The FETs are either enhancement or depletion gate types, and they will be driven on or off by the zero to 12 volt output of the pulse width modulator. The motor load goes in series with "source" lead of the FET. The "gate" lead may need a 100 ohm resistor to ground to provide some sort of load for the pulse width controller. If you want, the data sheet for the 555 IC shows various pulse width oscillators, but then you would need to do a little more building. It would be cleaner to use the 555 IC and put everything on one circuit board. Here is one link, go to page 8 http://www.fairchildsemi.com/ds/SA/SA555.pdf For cheap FETs try http://allelectronics.com and look for the CAT# IRF540N which is good for 33 amps. Less than a dollar. By the way, you will need a diode from the +12 volt terminal of the fan to ground, so that the reverse voltage won't go too far negative during the "off" periods of the PW modulator. This is just like the diode across the contactor coil that Bob talks about. If you need to parallel the FETs for enough current, they parallel nicely: load sharing works with these, unlike regular transistors. Where did you find that monster 15 amp fan? Best I could find was 4 amps for a 12 volt blower to help cool my plane. Jim Foerster ________________________________ Message 23 ____________________________________ Time: 12:23:32 PM PST US From: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Annunciator Panel on the cheap --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" At 03:34 PM 7/21/2003 +0100, you wrote: >--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Neville Kilford" > > >Mark, John, > >Thanks for your replies. > >I'm not entirely sure which LR3C I'm using. I've been under the >seemingly-mistaken idea that there's just one model -- the incandescent >version. That's correct. >Bob, if you're reading this, can you throw any light on the subject, and in >particular whether I can just put the LR3C lamp output into Mark's nifty >annunciator circuit. Can you describe how the LR3C lights its lamp? I published a circuit for adapting a single LED to the output of the LR3 at: http://216.55.140.222/temp/LV_Led.jpg The LR3 lamp driver is an open collector, pull-down NPN with a leakage resistor added so that the lv warn light will illuminate should the LR3 loose power needed to keep circuitry active. This is a sort of fail-safe feature but it will cause enough leakage to keep an LED dimly lit when it should be OFF. Hence the resistor network on the LED to make it look more like an incandescent bulb. Bob . . . ________________________________ Message 24 ____________________________________ Time: 12:42:29 PM PST US From: jmfpublic@comcast.net (Aeroelectric-List) Subject: AeroElectric-List: RE: Narco ID-825 VOR/LOC/GS Indicator and Apollo SL-30 --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: jmfpublic@comcast.net Kevin, Check out the Blue Mountain EFIS/Lite, which will interface with the SL-30 using only 3 wires in a serial link. You get a *lot* more for your money with this combo. to quote: UPS Radio owners! The EFIS/Lite now supports FULL HSI FUNCTIONALITY when used with UPS radios and selecting the serial type resolver during setup of the radio. This combination allows the Lite to select the OBS, display a CDI based upon the Nav radio and/or display a GS/LOC. The UPS radio can also be remotely tuned by selecting frequencies from the EFIS/Lite database. It really a great combination. This also gives you the altimeter, airspeed, etc of the /Lite. I own the SL-30 and also the EFIS/One, but the EFIS/lite is more affordable and might be perfect for your application. If I recall correctly, a new Narco ID-825 is more than the EFIS/Lite. Reconditioned, the narco is cheaper, as the EFIT/lite with the HSI function is $4500, and the Narco is ??? negotiable. If you already own the Narco unit, this info is not useful to you, of course. Jim Foerster ________________________________ Message 25 ____________________________________ Time: 01:10:12 PM PST US From: frequent flyer Subject: AeroElectric-List: Molex Pins --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: frequent flyer Bob, I've searched the Molex site for the pins for my Molex 09-01-2181 connector on the Narco AT50-A transponder and came up blank. Can you supply the #? Thanks, Jack do not archive __________________________________ ________________________________ Message 26 ____________________________________ Time: 01:46:47 PM PST US From: "Richard M. Martin" Subject: RE: AeroElectric-List: Molex Pins --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Richard M. Martin" Hi Jack, The Molex pin part number is: 1917-T For crimping the pins on use one of the following crimpers: Molex Hand Crimper HT-1921 Norco 41314-0001 Waldon Wire Stripper HT-1921 Richard -----Original Message----- From: owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com]On Behalf Of frequent flyer Subject: AeroElectric-List: Molex Pins --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: frequent flyer Bob, I've searched the Molex site for the pins for my Molex 09-01-2181 connector on the Narco AT50-A transponder and came up blank. Can you supply the #? Thanks, Jack do not archive __________________________________ ________________________________ Message 27 ____________________________________ Time: 02:17:50 PM PST US From: N1deltawhiskey@aol.com Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Switch-breaker same style as toggle switch? --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: N1deltawhiskey@aol.com In a message dated 7/21/2003 7:44:11 AM Pacific Daylight Time, nkilford@etravel.org writes: > --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Neville Kilford" org> > > Hi guys, > > I note in the Aeroelectric Connection, Bob recommends using a switch breaker > for ground power connector o/v protection. A good idea, but does anyone > know > whether the switch breakers are exactly the same size and look as the > toggles > that I've bought from B&C? > > Many thanks. > > Nev > Nev, Probably not. And you probably do not want them to be. The major difference is that switchbreakers have their amp rating stamped on the end of the toggle, a flat surface rather than the rounded surface of the Carling switches sold by B&C. But otherwise, they go well together and look pretty identical on the front side. The SW's are 0.75" wide. Doug Windhorn ________________________________ Message 28 ____________________________________ Time: 03:59:59 PM PST US From: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Molex Pins --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" At 01:09 PM 7/21/2003 -0700, you wrote: >--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: frequent flyer > >Bob, > >I've searched the Molex site for the pins for my Molex >09-01-2181 connector on the Narco AT50-A transponder >and came up blank. Can you supply the #? Check these data heets: http://216.55.140.222/Mfgr_Data/Molex/Molex_5559b.pdf http://216.55.140.222/Mfgr_Data/Molex/Molex_5558_Pins.pdf First one is for housings, second lists a whole bunch of pins that fit these housings depending on finish and wire size. B&C's BCT-1 tool will install these pins. Bob . . . ________________________________ Message 29 ____________________________________ Time: 04:20:48 PM PST US From: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Strobe shield grounding question --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" At 01:57 PM 7/21/2003 -0400, you wrote: >--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Larry Bowen" > >Hi Bob. > >On the component. I'm going by these instructions > >http://www.upsat.com/dwnlds/sldoc/sl30-ins-03.pdf > >Page 22, the notes at the bottom. > >I'm still not 100% certain I did it right. The chasis of the MD200 seems >to be isolated from everything. There is no continuity between it and the >mounting screws or even the d-sub in the back of it. > >Most of this is still black-magic from my point of view..... > >- >Larry Bowen >Larry@BowenAero.com >http://BowenAero.com Not at all. If you look at the resolver lead wires at the top of the schematic, the designer specifically shows shields for all wires grounded to case at both ends. The notes only reenforce what is explicit in the drawing. I see some noise about keeping "pigtails of shield grounds to less than 1.25" . . . which is pretty much no big deal if you need to make them longer to have the installation go together easier. The designer may have a good reason for doing this and he may not . . . but what he is asking you to do is quite clear. Bob . . . ________________________________ Message 30 ____________________________________ Time: 04:23:35 PM PST US From: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" Subject: RE: AeroElectric-List: Strobe shield grounding question --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" At 01:14 PM 7/21/2003 -0400, you wrote: >--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Larry Bowen" > >I don't know if it depends on the application, but I can tell you that the >UPS SL30 and MC200-306 I wired recently explicitly said to ground both >ends of the shield for the resolver wires. Here's a good example of what happens when we let the topic creep . . . my initial answer was keyed to the subject of strobes . . . it took me a couple more whacks at it to see that you were REALLY talking about radios and further, that you had specific information pertaining to installation of shield grounds. Bob . . . ________________________________ Message 31 ____________________________________ Time: 08:37:22 PM PST US From: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: KX-125 problem --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" At 02:43 PM 7/17/2003 -0400, you wrote: >--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: Bruce Green > >Bob, >Well I finally got the radio back and they replaced the power amp this >time. They reported that the powere amp was drawing excessive current >and found a burned pc track. Hmmmm . . .shorted output transistor? Transmitters are SUPPOSED to be relatively immune from output transistor damage due to poor SWR on antenna . . . in this case, I think I'd get an SWR bridge, power meter, or antenna analyzer look at your comm antenna. > The first time it was a diode. The radio >shop said that I might have a short in the audio panel, when I told them > dont have an audio panel, they said maybe a headset jack had a short. Gesshhh! I'd sure like to know how malfeasance in external audio wiring overloads output transistors in transmitters . . . >I spoke with a man at King and he felt that it might have been a voltage >spike and that I should install an avionics master!! Would like to have a name and phone number for that individual . . . > He also suggested a >loose wire could cause a spike. He also said that this was specualtion >on his part and he didn't really know that there was anything in the >airframe that would cause this. At this point, I think all i can do is >to check all my connections and fly around for a while monitoring the >buss voltage. > >Any ideas??? It's a sure bet that the folks at King didn't have any. Do we know for sure that you have a properly functioning ov protection system? Bob . . . ________________________________ Message 32 ____________________________________ Time: 08:41:04 PM PST US From: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: wire current & Resistance for 26ga wire. --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" At 06:18 PM 7/18/2003 -0400, you wrote: >--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: WHigg1170@aol.com > >Hello need some help on wire sizing, all my wire size charts only go up to 24 >GA wire The vans instruments have 26 GA wire for the instrument lighting and >the charts don't give me the maximum current (amps) and resistance (ohms/ft) >IM looking for. What I want to do is connect one light to the next for six >lights but the wire coming from the lights is only 26 gage and I don't >know if at >the end when I have one 26 GA wire powering 6 instrument lights is big >enough. > maybe this is not the way to wire them but how do I get 6 wires onto the > one >screw on the circuit breaker. Thanks for any input. Bill, Did you see the post I made on the daisy-chaining technique for dealing with WESTACH style instrument lighting . . . and did this address your uncertainties? Bob . . . ________________________________ Message 33 ____________________________________ Time: 09:04:19 PM PST US From: N223RV@aol.com Subject: AeroElectric-List: KX155 Squelch Question --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: N223RV@aol.com I installed some electronics in my airplane, and it now appears that it is causing some interference in my radio. In particular it seems to act just like the squelch needs to be adjusted on the radio, although I cannot find any squelch adjustment. I have King KX-155, it has a pull to test (volume knob), but that does not adjust the squelch. When I transmit or the tower calls out, the radio is clear and fine, but when there is no transmissions, there is a ton of 'white noise' or static. The noise is exactly the same sound and loudness as when I pull to test on the volume knob. It appears to work fine on some frequencies, but not on all frequencies. I have adjusted the squelch on the intercom, but it just appears to set the level for the voice activation on the mic, not on the radio. To me it seems like I need to adjust the squelch. Is that possible on a KX155, I have an older radio that is out of warranty so I am not afraid to open it up if there is a potentiometer or some way to adjust it. Any advice would be greatly appreciated. Mike Kraus RV-4, flying and now painted!