Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 07:16 AM - Re: Re: AOA Indicator and piece-meal development programs (Sigma Eta Aero)
2. 08:02 AM - Re: B&C 20 amp vac pad major failure (richard@riley.net)
3. 08:11 AM - Re: B&C 20 amp vac pad major failure (BobsV35B@aol.com)
4. 09:15 AM - Re: B&C 20 amp vac pad major failure (richard@riley.net)
5. 09:43 AM - Re: Re: AOA Indicator and piece-meal (Robert L. Nuckolls, III)
6. 10:00 AM - Re: B&C 20 amp vac pad major failure (Robert L. Nuckolls, III)
7. 10:26 AM - Re: Battery Failure (Robert L. Nuckolls, III)
8. 10:28 AM - Re: 10792 Dari (Robert L. Nuckolls, III)
9. 12:14 PM - [Fw: XCOM Radio Update] ()
10. 02:14 PM - Faston Terminals on 7.2 ah Aux Battery (Pat Hatch)
11. 05:21 PM - Re: Z-14 with two rear batteries (Dan O'Brien)
12. 05:47 PM - Re: Faston Terminals on 7.2 ah Aux Battery (Gkb5577@aol.com)
13. 08:33 PM - Auxiliary Electrical System (Paul)
Message 1
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| Subject: | Re: AOA Indicator and piece-meal development programs |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: Sigma Eta Aero <sigmatero@yahoo.com>
Yes, good advice. One reason I considered a vane type vs a differential pressure
type is that it would be mounted on the wing right outside my window and a
quick glance outside would "calibrate" the interior electronic reading. Helps
keep that ice nice and thick out there on the edge : )
The other thing is that this really isn't rocket science- just a simple readout
of position with a couple of alarms so I figured it would be less risky than
a more elaborate means of measuring angle of attack.
In any event when I get time I'll probably start playing around on a breadboard
and develop and test the hardware (vane, mounting system, etc) and then be back
asking more questions when the time comes to build a board. I'm sure, as you
say, that there are some really good things I could do to make a nice robust
circuit.
Thanks!
Joa
.
Neat thing about this system is that it is non-electric,
with one moving part (instrument pointer). Only
down-side I see is the rather chunky, non-aviation
looking instrument . . . but like one's homely sister
who never has dates but makes straight A's in everything,
there is great value beyond appearances.
---------------------------------
Message 2
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| Subject: | Re: B&C 20 amp vac pad major failure |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: richard@riley.net
OK, my bad. They've been forwarded to Matronics photo sharing. They're
about 225k each.
Basically, the nose casting broke clean through, leaving the alt sitting
quietly in the engine compartment.
At 10:43 PM 9/22/03 -0700, richard@riley.net wrote:
>--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: richard@riley.net
>
>Normally I wouldn't dream of forwarding pictures to this list, but these
>are ultra-topical. They're what remain of a 20 amp B&C backup alternator
>that was mounted on the vacuum pad of a Lycoming 260 hp IO-540 on a
>Berkut. More details as I get them.
>
>
Message 3
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| Subject: | Re: B&C 20 amp vac pad major failure |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: BobsV35B@aol.com
In a message dated 9/23/03 10:03:10 AM Central Daylight Time,
richard@riley.net writes:
> Basically, the nose casting broke clean through, leaving the alt sitting
> quietly in the engine compartment.
>
>
Good Morning Richard,
Since I am not smart enough to find the pictures, could you supply a bit more
detail?
Did the break occur right at the pad, somewhere along the webs or all the way
back where the webs attach to the alternator housing itself?
Were you able to discern any evidence of a pre-existing crack?
That mount looks to be heck for stout!
Amazing that it broke.
Thanks for the warning.
Happy Skies,
Old Bob
AKA
Bob Siegfried
Ancient Aviator
Message 4
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| Subject: | Re: B&C 20 amp vac pad major failure |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: richard@riley.net
I'm looking for someplace on the web to stash them - if anyone has a
suggestion, let me know. Preferably someplace that you don't have to join
to access
At 11:11 AM 9/23/03 -0400, BobsV35B@aol.com wrote:
>--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: BobsV35B@aol.com
>
>In a message dated 9/23/03 10:03:10 AM Central Daylight Time,
>richard@riley.net writes:
>
> > Basically, the nose casting broke clean through, leaving the alt sitting
> > quietly in the engine compartment.
> >
> >
>
>Good Morning Richard,
>
>Since I am not smart enough to find the pictures, could you supply a bit more
>detail?
>
>Did the break occur right at the pad, somewhere along the webs or all the way
>back where the webs attach to the alternator housing itself?
>
>Were you able to discern any evidence of a pre-existing crack?
>
>That mount looks to be heck for stout!
>
>Amazing that it broke.
>
>Thanks for the warning.
>
>Happy Skies,
>
>Old Bob
>AKA
>Bob Siegfried
>Ancient Aviator
>
>
Message 5
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| Subject: | Re: AOA Indicator and piece-meal |
development programs
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <bob.nuckolls@cox.net>
At 07:15 AM 9/23/2003 -0700, you wrote:
>--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: Sigma Eta Aero <sigmatero@yahoo.com>
>
>Yes, good advice. One reason I considered a vane type vs a differential
>pressure type is that it would be mounted on the wing right outside my
>window and a quick glance outside would "calibrate" the interior
>electronic reading. Helps keep that ice nice and thick out there on the
>edge : )
>
>The other thing is that this really isn't rocket science- just a simple
>readout of position with a couple of alarms so I figured it would be less
>risky than a more elaborate means of measuring angle of attack.
>
>In any event when I get time I'll probably start playing around on a
>breadboard and develop and test the hardware (vane, mounting system, etc)
>and then be back asking more questions when the time comes to build a
>board. I'm sure, as you say, that there are some really good things I
>could do to make a nice robust circuit.
Okay, perhaps not "rocket science" but still subject to
numerous simple but critical ideas not the least of which
have been well described by others in this thread.
Given the possibility and risk of erroneous measurement
and display a heightened degree of caution is prudent.
Bob . . .
Message 6
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| Subject: | Re: B&C 20 amp vac pad major failure |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <bob.nuckolls@cox.net>
At 10:43 PM 9/22/2003 -0700, you wrote:
>--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: richard@riley.net
>
>Normally I wouldn't dream of forwarding pictures to this list, but these
>are ultra-topical. They're what remain of a 20 amp B&C backup alternator
>that was mounted on the vacuum pad of a Lycoming 260 hp IO-540 on a
>Berkut. More details as I get them.
Richard, the list-server won't pass attachments. Mail them
to me directly and I'll post them on the server.
Bob . . .
Message 7
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| Subject: | Re: Battery Failure |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <bob.nuckolls@cox.net>
At 06:25 PM 9/16/2003 -0400, you wrote:
>--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: <jimk36@comcast.net>
>
>Bob et al --
>
>I'm presently planning to equip my F1 Rocket with 2 alternators and a
>single batt.as per Z-12. My question is with respect to batt failure in
>flight and possible negative effect on alternator{s} powering the system.
>
>Over many years with automobiles and airplanes [too many years] I have had
>numerous batt failures, usually but not always due to poor maintenance,
>and alternator failures. But I have never had a batt failure which, with
>the engine running, inhibited the ability of the alternator to power the
>electrics.
Most alternators will continue to run self-excited should the
battery become unavailable due either to battery or contactor
failure. The resulting power is always noisier and always
less stable. If the system is hit with a momentary inrush
like landing light, landing gear motor, etc, the alternator
may be momentarily deprived of field excitation and may
simply quit and may not come back by itself.
>I expect that if engine RPM is less than that needed by the alternator to
>support the load, and the batt is discharged, at some point power to the
>field will drop below minimum and the lights will go out.
>
>Are there other conditions one should be concerned about?
Nope, there's a lot of "ifs" and "mays" in the scenarios cited
above. Bonanzas and Barons have been architectured and alternators
selected to self excite and run sans battery. There may be other
airplanes capable of this kind of operation but I'm not aware
of them.
Construction of the modern RG battery and always hot feeds to
the e-bus will mitigate 99% of the historical failure modes.
I don't think there is much of a basis for concern.
Bob . . .
Message 8
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--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <bob.nuckolls@cox.net>
At 04:07 PM 9/16/2003 +0000, you wrote:
>Below is the result of your inquiry. It was submitted by
>Steve Dari (stevedari@msn.com) on Tuesday, September 16, 2003 at 09:07:22
>
>Tuesday, September 16, 2003
>
>Steve Dari
>
>,
>Email: stevedari@msn.com
>Comments/Questions: Hi Bob! I'm a subscriber to your publication. It was a
>tremendous help in preparing my Formula One racing aircraft. Just returned
>from our rookie year at Reno with a 5th place in the Bronze. We've
>determined that the plane is at the extreme rear of the CG envelope. This
>makes the plane extremely pitch sensitive. We have a 17AH RG battery
>behind the pilot's seat. We'd like to use a 7.5AH RG battery on the
>firewall (plenty of power!), but the battery connecting lugs are a
>problem. Does ANYONE make a 7.5 battery with heavy bolt on lugs? Could we
>make such a powerpack ourselves using smaller batteries connected
>together? (probably way too much internal rsistance...) Thanks again for
>your publication and website. I look forward to your response. All the
>best, Steve Dari - Pilot, Redhead Racing.
Check with Bill at B&C (316) 283-8000
He has some small batteries with fat lugs.
Bob . . .
--------------------------------------------
( Knowing about a thing is different than )
( understanding it. One can know a lot )
( and still understand nothing. )
( C.F. Kettering )
--------------------------------------------
Message 9
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| Subject: | [Fwd: XCOM Radio Update] |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: <kkinney@fuse.net>
I've expressed some interest in the XCOM760 radio. It's comparable in price to
the MicroAir in a similar form factor with more features. The down side is that
it's not shipping yet.
I've received an update on the XCOM760 status. Here is an editted version of the
status update. Email me offline if you'd like the entire posting.
Regards,
Kevin Kinney
> From: Michael Coates XCOM Avionics
>
> Date: Tuesday, September 23, 2003
>
> =95 I personally think its 8 to 12 weeks for shipping
>
> =95 We will source either an ICOM, Becker or Microair (or any other radio of
your choice) at better than retail price for you, match it to the XCOM Intercom
and a custom harness to get you airborne in the quickest time with the minimum
amount of fuss
>
> =95 If you=92re one of the few who have a harness from us we will either modify
it to fit the new radio of your choice or you can return it for refund because
of the delays
>
> =95 Or you can be patient and wait for the radio if your not in an immediate
rush
>
> Thanks Michael Coates X-COM Avionics
Message 10
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| Subject: | Faston Terminals on 7.2 ah Aux Battery |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Pat Hatch" <pat_hatch@msn.com>
Bob,
I am using the 7.2 ah aux batt from B & C on Z-14, coupled with the 20 amp vac
pad alternator.
I am trying to figure out how to terminate the #4 AWG wires to plug into the Faston
terminals of the battery. Any suggestions?
Thanks as always.
Pat Hatch
RV-4
RV-6
RV-7 QB (Building)
Vero Beach, FL
Message 11
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| Subject: | Re: Z-14 with two rear batteries |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Dan O'Brien" <danobrien@cox.net>
Bob,
I have a few questions about your drawing of Z-14 with two rear-mounted
batteries, which you posted at
<http://www.aeroelectric.com/articles/Appendix_Z_Drawings/Z-14_Rear_Bats.pdf>http://www.aeroelectric.com/articles/Appendix_Z_Drawings/Z-14_Rear_Bats.pdf.
You indicate that the connection from the crossfeed contactor to the
starter and the main alternator current limiter should be a copper/brass
strap, .032" by .70". First, for educational purposes, what is the purpose
for this strap rather than, say, 2 AWG wire? Second, can one substitute,
say, 2AWG wire, welding wire, etc.? Third, if the strap is best, where can
it be obtained?
Thanks,
Dan O'Brien
Lancair ES, beginning an electrical system with two rear-mounted batteries
Message 12
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| Subject: | Re: Faston Terminals on 7.2 ah Aux Battery |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: Gkb5577@aol.com
Just saw your note(not to me directly of course). I just handled that
problem on my Kitfox: It has two 12AH RGs in parallel. I took a faston connector
at
the end , and again at an appropriate distance to match up to the second
battery terminal, bared the 2AWG (happened to be silver coated stranded) got out
my
propane torch to provide instant hi heat but locally (not so much conducted
heat while waiting for the iron to heat up the metal) I buried them into the
wire and soldered them up. I also happened to have some 4:1 heat shrink that
was put over them and shrunk. On the ends ( there were two: one for the pos pair
and one for the neg pair) I dipped them in liquid tool handle compound
(WalWort, tool stores,etc.)--red for the positive and black for the neg. I suppose
liquid electrical tape is the same. Sure looks good. Geoff
Message 13
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| Subject: | Auxiliary Electrical System |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Paul" <list@incont.com>
I have a '54 Cessna 170B with a C145-2 Engine and 60Amp Ford
alternator (14V system). I would like to remove the venturii's
(2) and go to a secondary electrical system with enough power to
run an electric directional gyro, artificial horizon and a Garmin
300XL GPS/COM for up to 4 hours. Any suggestions? THANKS, Paul
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