Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 07:43 AM - Ipods at Altitude (Treff, Arthur)
2. 07:43 AM - MFJ-259B (Fergus Kyle)
3. 08:08 AM - Re: Ipods at Altitude (BobsV35B@aol.com)
4. 08:36 AM - Circuit breakers (Glen Matejcek)
5. 09:14 AM - circuit breakers (Glen Matejcek)
6. 10:03 AM - Re: circuit breakers (Matt Prather)
7. 11:14 AM - Re: Battery Chargers (MikeM)
8. 02:55 PM - Re: Circuit breakers (David Schaefer)
9. 04:18 PM - Re: Panel Input (royt.or@netzero.com)
Message 1
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| Subject: | Ipods at Altitude |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Treff, Arthur" <Arthur.Treff@Smartm.com>
Old Bob,
Thanks for the heads-up on the iPod, first I"ve heard of this problem. Any idea
where your info came from about ipods not liking altitude and where I can get
more on this? I know that the device is a hard disk, and as such it has heads
that 'fly' over the disc surface at a dimension in the sub micro-inch region.
I though that disks got into trouble above 25,000', but maybe not? Any help
would be appreciated.
Art
Message 2
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--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Fergus Kyle" <VE3LVO@rac.ca>
Gabe,
Excellent choice - bit pricey for one aircraft but super when
shared. HOWEVER it is very delicate when it comes to power source. Dont
fail to ensure that you provide the requisite voltage first, THEN turn it
on - or the smoke retainer lets go and it takes the long road back to
repair.
You don't need to 'hook it up' physically as it does its job
inductively and the manual should show this, otherwise give me a call
privately and will advise. I belive the induction accessories are with the
box.
My experience, even with oldtimer hams, is never loan it out - as
even the most careful tend to forget and putting a tenth of a watt thru will
blow its brains out. Take it to them and perform the task yourself is the
best policy.
Nevertheless you will find the ideal components and settings to mate
the antenna to the transmitter by means of the MFJ259B.
Good hunting,
Ferg VE3LVO
Europa classic mono
Message 3
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| Subject: | Re: Ipods at Altitude |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: BobsV35B@aol.com
In a message dated 11/7/03 9:44:11 AM Central Standard Time,
Arthur.Treff@Smartm.com writes:
Thanks for the heads-up on the iPod, first I"ve heard of this problem. Any
idea where your info came from about ipods not liking altitude and where I can
get more on this? I know that the device is a hard disk, and as such it has
heads that 'fly' over the disc surface at a dimension in the sub micro-inch
region. I though that disks got into trouble above 25,000', but maybe not? Any
help would be appreciated.
Good Morning Art,
It came up on The Beech-Owners list.
I will see if I can locate the source, but I don't generally save much.
Old Bob
Message 4
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| Subject: | Circuit breakers |
MIME_BOUND_NEXTPART
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Glen Matejcek" <aerobubba@earthlink.net>
Howdy-
While comparison shopping on the web I discovered that one can get CB's that will
work in ATC / automotive style fuse blocks. Does anyone have any insights
as to the reliability / quality / applicability of these devices to our homebuilts?
Glen Matejcek
All-electric RV-8, pulling wires
aerobubba@earthlink.net
Message 5
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| Subject: | circuit breakers |
MIME_BOUND_NEXTPART
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Glen Matejcek" <aerobubba@earthlink.net>
Howdy-
While comparison shopping on the web I discovered that one can get CB's that will
work in ATC / automotive style fuse blocks. Does anyone have any insights
as to the reliability / quality / applicability of these devices to our homebuilts?
Glen Matejcek
All-electric RV-8, pulling wires
aerobubba@earthlink.net
Message 6
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| Subject: | Re: circuit breakers |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Matt Prather" <mprather@spro.net>
Hi Glen,
I don't think I would use the breakers you are describing. The
ones I have seen have moving parts (lowering reliability), and
are more expensive than fuses. I especially wouldn't use any that
automatically reset. That's just asking to periodically get smoke
in the cockpit, should something in the system fail while in flight.
The only advantage I can think of is that if you use the manually
resettable style, you save the replacement cost of the fuse. But
at less $.30 each for ATC fuses, I can't see that replacement costs
are a real issue. If you design the system properly, you might
only have to put fuses in the system once in its lifetime.
Regards,
Matt-
N34RD
> --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Glen Matejcek"
> <aerobubba@earthlink.net>
>
> Howdy-
>
> While comparison shopping on the web I discovered that one can get CB's
> that will work in ATC / automotive style fuse blocks. Does anyone have
> any insights as to the reliability / quality / applicability of these
> devices to our homebuilts?
>
>
> Glen Matejcek
> All-electric RV-8, pulling wires
> aerobubba@earthlink.net
>
>
Message 7
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| Subject: | Re: Battery Chargers |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: MikeM <mladejov@ced.utah.edu>
On Thu, 6 Nov 2003 Pacer15P@aol.com wrote:
> Mike,
>
> Read your response about chargers and snake oil and agree with your comments.
> I would appreciate your help with my questions.
Hi Dick,
hope you dont mind if I also forward my reply back to the list.
> What charger, amp size, etc., would you recommend to slightly
> charge or maintain a std lead acid 35 series aircraft battery?
By "maintain", I assume you are concerned about what happens to
the typical G35 aircraft battery during times when the aircraft
is not flown regularly (say bi-weekly).
The answer is complicated. As long as the aircraft is flown
once every couple of weeks, assuming that the generating
capacity in the aircraft exceeds the current being drawn by the
instruments, avionics and lights, (so that the reserve capacity
is available for charging the battery), and that the voltage
regulator gets the battery voltage up to 14.2+ Volts for the
duration of a flight, then you dont need to do anything
involving external chargers.
If the aircraft generation capacity or regulation is suspect,
then instead of tinkering with chargers, you really should fix
the root cause (which is install enough generating capacity,
adjust the voltage regulator to produce said 14.2+ V, fly the
airplane an hour or two every two weeks, etc.)
The reason for the "every two weeks" statements above are based
on the physics of flooded-cell batteries. There are two parts to
prevent degradation of a battery which is sitting unused for
periods of weeks to months. Lets call this "battery
maintenance". Note that "maintenence" only needs to be done when
the aircraft is not regularly flown, as in the winter months.
First, you need to keep the battery from discharging itself even
after disconnecting anything that draws current, which should be
the case if you turn off your Master. Second, you need to
periodically stir the acid in battery to prevent the acid from
stratifying with the lowest specific gravity on top.
All lead acid batteries loose charge just by sitting around. at
100 deg F, a G35 will loose 10%-20% of its capacity per month.
In cold weather, the self discharge rate is much lower. So if
you want to maintain a battery near full capacity, you have to
replace the charge lost due to self discharge. It requires only
~ 0.25A to make up for the leakage.
Preventing self discharge is usually accomplished by "floating"
the battery using a voltage-limited charger, which puts out 13.5
+-0.1 V open-circuit. Most commercial automotive chargers such
as you would get at Sears or Checker are not voltage limited
accurately enough to leave them connected to a battery for more
than 24 hours!!! They are suitable for recharging a run-down
battery, but they must be manually disconnected after a few
hours.
The better models of the automotive chargers have a time clock
shutoff which means you dont have to drive back to the airport
to shut off the charger. If you have the disipline, you can
"maintain" an unused battery through the winter months by giving
it an 4-6 hour charge every 30 days or so, relying on the clock
in the charger to shut it off, otherwise you have to drive back
to airport to disconnect the charger.
One of the primary causes of loss of capacity of batteries is
sulfation of the lead plates; Sulfation happens when the battery
is allowed to sit around in a partially or totally discharged
state for long periods; sulfation is minimised by keeping the
Specific Gravity of the acid high (fully charged) see:
http://www.sierrasolar.com/design/b_leadbattery.htm
The acid in a stationary battery (not being sloshed around in a
car, boat, motorhome, airplane) will stratify, meaning that the
Specific gravity at the top of the battery will be much less
that at the bottom. Due to low SG at the top, the top parts of
the plates will sulfate first, reducing the capacity and cold
cranking amperage of the battery.
The solution to stratification is to mechanically stir the acid,
which happens normally if you take your battery for a ride in
the car, or for a flight in the airplane. However, if the
airplane/car is parked for six months, what then?
A good substitute for mechanical agitation is to periodically
(once every two weeks or so) connect the battery to a charger
whose voltage is set to 14.4+ V for a few hours. In the industry
this is sometimes called "equalization", but the primary benefit
comes from charging the battery hard enough to evolve gas
(hydrogen at one plate, oxygen at the other). The bubbles rise
through the acid, stirring it as they go, mixing the weaker acid
with the stronger.
So, for total automatic unattended maintenance of batteries, the
charger has to float at 13.5V continuously, and every two weeks
or so, it needs to bump up the voltage to about 14.4V while
delivering a few amps for a few hours, and then revert back to
the float mode. If the aircraft is flown regularly, then you
dont have to bother with equalization.
> Is it feasible to leave the master switch "on" to activate the
> solenoid and charge/maintain the battery thru the cigar
> lighter circuit?
> Do you think this might create any unforeseen
> problems such as overheating the solenoid if left unattended
> for several days at a time etc. Or is this just a plain bad
> idea?
Its just a bad idea. Overheating of the solenoid shouldn't be a
problem, because the solenoid is rated for it. However, your
charger has to deliver approximately 1.5A to the coil in the
solenoid, plus whatever unswitched loads there are in the aircraft (like
the fuel gauges)
Suppose someone unplugs your charger? Now the solenoid/gauges
will kill your battery. Its not hard to wire in a fused
connector which will allow direct access to the battery with the
master off.
>Is it possible to overcharge a battery with today's low
> amp chargers?
Yes.
You have to buy a charger specifically made for "float
charging", like the BatteryTender
http://www.batterytender.com/
If in doubt, connect your charger to a battery for 6 to 12
hours. Use an accurate digital voltmeter to measure the voltage
between the battery terminals with the charger still charging.
If the measured battery voltage after a few hours exceeds 13.6V,
the charger is not suitable for long term float charging.
In summary, if all you own is the typical Sears 10A charger with
the time clock, then while the aircraft/motor home/boat is not
being used, hook the charger to the battery with the time clock
set to 6 hours. Go back and do it each month. That is the best
you can do to prevent the battery from loosing capacity while
inactive. During the six hours, the charger will put back the
self discharge, and then it will bubble the battery just enough
to stir the acid. This regemin is way better than just letting
the battery sit idle for six months.
MikeM (Batteries r us)
Pacer '00Z
Skylane '1MM
Message 8
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| Subject: | Circuit breakers |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "David Schaefer" <dschaefer1@kc.rr.com>
The only problem I found was that they are only available in 10,20,30
and 40 amp from BUSSMAN. Not the 1.5, 2, 5, 7 I needed for the panel
etc.
Regards,
David
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Glen
Matejcek
Subject: AeroElectric-List: Circuit breakers
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Glen Matejcek"
<aerobubba@earthlink.net>
Howdy-
While comparison shopping on the web I discovered that one can get CB's
that will work in ATC / automotive style fuse blocks. Does anyone have
any insights as to the reliability / quality / applicability of these
devices to our homebuilts?
Glen Matejcek
All-electric RV-8, pulling wires
aerobubba@earthlink.net
=
==
==
==
==
Message 9
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--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: royt.or@netzero.com
Darwin,
The panel in my simple Zenair Zodiac, N601RT, is similar to what you have planned.
I have included my equipment differences between your plan and my actual panel
in parenthesis
Equipment list as follows (N601RT differences):
Garmin 340 audio panel
Garmin 430 GPS/Comm
Garmin 106A CDI
Garmin 330S transponder (N601RT Garmin 327)
UPS SL 40 Comm (N601RT - Icom A23, not panel mounted wired to comm2)
Trutrak 2 axis AP (N601RT - Digitrak)
Dynon EFIS (N601RT uEncoder, Electric DG, AH, TC, 3 1/2 Airspeed)
ACS2002 engine monitor (N601RT Grand Rapids EIS with fuel flow & Volt/Load meter
from Lectric Bob)
Approach systems wiring hub (N601RT panel built by Pacific Coast Avionics)
EXP buss switch panel. (Acres of breakers, and switch breakers)
Some sort of CD player (Portable CD/MP3 player, less than $50)
Back up stuff will be 2.25" airspeed, altimeter, and T&B. (N601RT 2.25 altimeter)
Ive added a 1 diameter clock from riderwearhouse (motorcycle goodies supplier). You could argue that the GPS has clock with seconds, but I prefer to have the analog display. See http://www.aerostich.com/riderwearhouse.store/3f94660209afda40271dd1f0ec070680/Offer/AddProduct/9027
I have independently powered backup GPS and comm provided with a GPS295 and Icom
A23. Both of these have their own internal batteries and are powered from the
plane under normal operation. The Garmin GPS295 is mounted on top of the glare
shield, with a permanently mounted antenna AND wired to the Garmin 430. When
I enter a flight plan in the 430, the flight plan is automatically loaded into
the GPS295.
Changes Id make plan to make are adding a dedicated antenna for the Icom A23 and
making the A23 comm1 in the audio panel. Comm1 in the audio panel is significant
because in the event of loss of power to the audio panel, comm1 is automatically
connected to the headset.
The uEncoder includes the compass module option and automatically provides air
data information, including magnetic heading to the Garmin 430.
The Rotax 912ULS in my plane has the standard 18A alternator and an optional 40A
ND alternator driven by belt from the front of the engine. Each alternator has
Bobs OV protections. Im using a single 18AH RG battery.
Regards,
Roy
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