Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 03:50 AM - Re: 11133 Hersha (Jan de Jong)
2. 05:49 AM - Re: Flap breaker size (Robert L. Nuckolls, III)
3. 05:51 AM - Re: Shielded wire options (Robert L. Nuckolls, III)
4. 05:57 AM - Re: OV Protection for Internally Regulated (Robert L. Nuckolls, III)
5. 07:27 AM - Re: OV protection for internally regulated alternators (Jack Bloodgood)
6. 07:44 AM - Re: Re: 11133 Hersha (Richard Tasker)
7. 11:02 AM - Re: OV Protection for Internally Regulated .. Another Question (James E. Clark)
8. 01:02 PM - Navigatin lighting (Kenneth Gresham)
9. 02:59 PM - Re: Navigatin lighting (Scott Hersha)
10. 03:56 PM - Re: Re: 11133 Hersha (Dave Morris)
11. 03:59 PM - Re: Navigatin lighting (Dave Morris)
12. 05:01 PM - Re: Navigatin lighting (LarryRobertHelming)
13. 07:23 PM - Shielded wire options (hollandm)
14. 09:46 PM - Power supply (Joel Harding)
Message 1
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| Subject: | Re: 11133 Hersha |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: Jan de Jong <jan.de.jong@xs4all.nl>
"It was nearly impossibe to get solder to stick to the bare copper when
soldering a tinned wire to it."
You may have to scrape the "bare copper" to get to the bare copper...
Jan de Jong
Message 2
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aeroelectric-list@matronics.com
| Subject: | Re: Flap breaker size |
<5.0.0.25.2.20040106090414.01a21320@pop.central.cox.net>
<5.0.0.25.2.20040107094407.01613008@pop.central.cox.net>
<5.0.0.25.2.20040108104000.01b115f0@pop.central.cox.net>
<5.0.0.25.2.20040114094816.01b2d630@pop.central.cox.net>
<5.0.0.25.2.20040126085640.01a85e40@pop.central.cox.net>
<5.0.0.25.2.20040126221300.01a651b8@pop.central.cox.net>
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <bob.nuckolls@cox.net>
At 07:18 PM 2/5/2004 -0600, you wrote:
>Hi Bob
>I have that flap motor working now but think I may have a problem with the
>circuit breaker. As you remember, I had the panel built and installed
>"acres of breakers"...this was PB (pre-Bob). They used a 15 amp CB for the
>flap circuit. Zenith showed a 5 amp breaker on their drawing. You used a
>10 amp breaker on your drawing...I am using a 16 ga wire as you drew in your
>schematic to the main bus.
>
>With this set-up, should I trade out the 15 amp breaker?
>
>Dale
The Z-drawings are for describing architecture. The
final selection for circuit protection has to be based
on load analysis of the particular accessory being
protected. If you have 16AWG run in, put a 10A breaker
on it for now. Let's do some real measurements during
your flyoff to see if the breaker is the right size.
The recommendations by most kit suppliers for electrical
issues are based on hearsay and seldom on calculations
or measurements to refine the design.
I will invite you to join us on the AeroElectric List
to continue this and similar discussions. It's useful to
share the information with as many folks as possible.
A further benefit can be realized with membership on
the list. There are lots of technically capable folks
on the list who can offer suggestions too.
Thanks!
Bob . . .
--------------------------------------------
( Knowing about a thing is different than )
( understanding it. One can know a lot )
( and still understand nothing. )
( C.F. Kettering )
--------------------------------------------
Message 3
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| Subject: | Re: Shielded wire options |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <bob.nuckolls@cox.net>
At 10:43 PM 2/5/2004 -0800, you wrote:
>--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "hollandm" <hollandm@pacbell.net>
>
>In choosing shielded wire to hook up the radio jacks I've used some
>relatively inexpensive stuff that I found. Rather than the hightech stuff
>with braided shields this wire has a mylar foil, with a bleed wire. Is
>this an acceptable to use for audio hookups? I'm intend to use it to
>connect the Dynon external mag compass, which has been alleged to induce
>EMI problems.
>
>I don't want to cut corners when it makes a difference in safety,
>performance or reliability.
The "Beldfoil" shield is electrically superior to braided
shield when it comes to electrical characteristics that
define shielding effectiveness. It's just not available in
tefzel insulated conductors. It will be fine for the application
you proposed.
Bob . . .
-----------------------------------------
( Experience and common sense cannot be )
( replaced with policy and procedures. )
( R. L. Nuckolls III )
-----------------------------------------
Message 4
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| Subject: | Re: OV Protection for Internally Regulated |
.. Another Question
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <bob.nuckolls@cox.net>
.. Another Question
At 12:23 AM 2/6/2004 -0500, you wrote:
>--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "James E. Clark"
><james@nextupventures.com>
>
>There has been a LOT of dialog along the lines mentioned below (opening up
>the alternator). I have looked but probably overlooked it so my question is:
>
>Is there a *summary* recommendation (or opinion) on what one could
>reasonably do to get additional protection WITHOUT opening the
>alternator????
>
>The one is question is the 55 amp model from Van's.
Yup, Figure Z-24 in the back of the AeroElectric Connection
suggests a means for providing (1) absolute control of an
internally regulated alternator and (2) providing ov
protection. The question under consideration now is which,
if any, alternators would do better with some means of
filtering off the "load dump" phenomenon that seems to be
responsible for damaging the regulators in some alternators.
Risk of damage is VERY low if one observes simple operating
protocols for panel switches that is consistent with the
way these switches are operated 99.999% of the time anyhow.
We may be able to drive the risk to essentially zero by
(1) selecting alternators with regulators already immune
to the load-dump phenomenon (as most OEM automotive products
probably are) or (2) a judicious addition of devices to
the alternator designed to address the physics of the
phenomenon in a well considered manner.
Bob . . .
-----------------------------------------
( Experience and common sense cannot be )
( replaced with policy and procedures. )
( R. L. Nuckolls III )
-----------------------------------------
Message 5
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| Subject: | Re: OV protection for internally regulated alternators |
21, 2004) at 02/06/2004 10:26:42
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: Jack Bloodgood <jackb@us.ibm.com>
Hello,
Just a thought that where appropriate we might profit from the marine
industry. Almost all private boats have a battery switch which isolates the
battery and alternator. They have found that alternator diodes blow when
this switch is opened while the field windings are still energized. The
alternator is charging into an open circuit.
An internally regulated alternator wired as Z-24 with the alternator
disconnect contactor looks to have the same problem. The solution that the
marine industry has developed is the Zap-Stop, which appears to be Bob's
proposed solution in
http://www.aeroelectric.com/articles/Alternator_Failures.pdf
Might be something to consider. Make sure you get all of the URL:
http://www.westmarine.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/ProductDisplay?storeId=10001&langId=-1&catalogId=10001&productId=46596&catalogId=10001&classNum=12105&subdeptNum=544&storeNum=9
Jack Bloodgood
Just a Lurker
jackb@us.ibm.com
Message 6
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| Subject: | Re: 11133 Hersha |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: Richard Tasker <retasker@optonline.net>
What he is saying is that the coil probably uses magnet wire. This wire
has a very thin insulation similar to varnish and is similar in color to
the copper. You have to scrape this insulation off if you want to
solder to the copper wire.
Dick Tasker
Jan de Jong wrote:
>--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: Jan de Jong <jan.de.jong@xs4all.nl>
>
>
>"It was nearly impossibe to get solder to stick to the bare copper when
>soldering a tinned wire to it."
>
>You may have to scrape the "bare copper" to get to the bare copper...
>
>Jan de Jong
>
Message 7
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| Subject: | OV Protection for Internally Regulated .. Another |
Question
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "James E. Clark" <james@nextupventures.com>
Thanks Bob.
I had overlooked it.
James
[snip]
>
> Yup, Figure Z-24 in the back of the AeroElectric Connection
> suggests a means for providing (1) absolute control of an
> internally regulated alternator and (2) providing ov
> protection. The question under consideration now is which,
>
Message 8
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| Subject: | Navigatin lighting |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Kenneth Gresham" <kgresham@mtco.com>
I would like to know what is required lighting in U.S. for night VFR and later
possibly IFR. Is wing lighting with colored front, strobe center, and white at
rear of same fixture adequate? If not please give lights and specific locations.
I would like to keep wiring to rear of fuselage to a minimum. I intend to
run wing tip wiring through a conduit since this is a composite airframe Any other
thoughts or suggestions are appreciated.
Ken Gresham
Europa Kit # A268 Rigging wings
Message 9
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| Subject: | Re: Navigatin lighting |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Scott Hersha" <shersha@fuse.net>
Night flying requires navigation lights (red/left, green/right), white tail
lights, and an aniti-collision lighting system for the exterior of the
airframe. The tail lights can be the aft facing white light that is on many
nav light setups. There would be a light fixture on each wingtip with a red
or green light forward and the white light aft. These also come (very
popular) with a strobe light on the end of the fixture. The strobe lights
take the place of the anti-collision light that would otherwise have to
located somewhere on the fuselage, making it visible for 360 degrees. You
also need adequate lighting to read required flight and engine instruments
in the cockpit. No difference for IFR except I think you might also need to
have landing light....I wouldn't want to fly at night without them. If you
have an Aircraft Spruce catalog, check out the lighting section. There is a
good description of required exterior lighting as well as where they need to
be mounted for proper coverage. You don't need to have any lights on your
tail.....not required.
Scott Hersha
----- Original Message -----
From: "Kenneth Gresham" <kgresham@mtco.com>
Subject: AeroElectric-List: Navigatin lighting
> --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Kenneth Gresham"
<kgresham@mtco.com>
>
> I would like to know what is required lighting in U.S. for night VFR and
later possibly IFR. Is wing lighting with colored front, strobe center, and
white at rear of same fixture adequate? If not please give lights and
specific locations. I would like to keep wiring to rear of fuselage to a
minimum. I intend to run wing tip wiring through a conduit since this is a
composite airframe Any other thoughts or suggestions are appreciated.
>
> Ken Gresham
> Europa Kit # A268 Rigging wings
>
>
Message 10
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| Subject: | Re: 11133 Hersha |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: Dave Morris <dave@davemorris.com>
I used to light a match and flame the end of magnet wire and then the
varnish will crumple off into powder and wipe off easily. They may have
changed the chemical formulation since I did that last many years ago, but
it beat the heck out of sandpaper.
Dave Morris
At 09:44 AM 2/6/2004, you wrote:
>--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: Richard Tasker
><retasker@optonline.net>
>
>What he is saying is that the coil probably uses magnet wire. This wire
>has a very thin insulation similar to varnish and is similar in color to
>the copper. You have to scrape this insulation off if you want to
>solder to the copper wire.
>
>Dick Tasker
>
>Jan de Jong wrote:
>
> >--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: Jan de Jong <jan.de.jong@xs4all.nl>
> >
> >
> >"It was nearly impossibe to get solder to stick to the bare copper when
> >soldering a tinned wire to it."
> >
> >You may have to scrape the "bare copper" to get to the bare copper...
> >
> >Jan de Jong
> >
>
>
Message 11
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| Subject: | Re: Navigatin lighting |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: Dave Morris <dave@davemorris.com>
At 04:56 PM 2/6/2004, you wrote:
>--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Scott Hersha" <shersha@fuse.net>
>
>Night flying requires navigation lights (red/left, green/right), white tail
>lights, and an aniti-collision lighting system for the exterior of the
>airframe. The tail lights can be the aft facing white light that is on many
>nav light setups. There would be a light fixture on each wingtip with a red
>or green light forward and the white light aft. These also come (very
>popular) with a strobe light on the end of the fixture. The strobe lights
>take the place of the anti-collision light that would otherwise have to
>located somewhere on the fuselage, making it visible for 360 degrees. You
>also need adequate lighting to read required flight and engine instruments
>in the cockpit. No difference for IFR except I think you might also need to
>have landing light....I wouldn't want to fly at night without them. If you
>have an Aircraft Spruce catalog, check out the lighting section. There is a
>good description of required exterior lighting as well as where they need to
>be mounted for proper coverage. You don't need to have any lights on your
>tail.....not required.
>Scott Hersha
Also, if you're interested in saving weight, heat, and current, check out
the advances in LED technology that are happening. You've probably seen
the new car tail lights and traffic signals that use LEDs.
Here are just a few references on LEDs that should give you an idea of
what's developing and what's possible in experimental aviation:
Brightest LEDs are from Lumileds:
http://www.lumileds.com/luxeon/products/products_index.html
They can be purchased here, but only by phone, and check for what is in
stock before getting too excited:
http://www.quickar.com/leds.php
or from the authorized distributor here:
http://www.futureelectronics.com/1033/promos/lumileds/
Tail light kits:
http://www.periheliondesign.com/ledlightkits.htm
Position lights:
http://www.killacycle.com/Lights.htm
http://www.periheliondesign.com/ledpositionlights.htm
White paper on position lights:
http://www.periheliondesign.com/pdf_files/redandgreenledpositionlights.pdf
Research:
http://members.misty.com/don/led.html
http://ledmuseum.home.att.net/ledleft.htm
Dave Morris
Message 12
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| Subject: | Re: Navigatin lighting |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "LarryRobertHelming" <lhelming@sigecom.net>
You might want to pick up an Aircraft Spruce Catalog sometime. It has a
nice description of the lighting requirements.
Indiana Larry, RV7 Tip-up TMX-O-360 ACS2002 Dynon CNS430 Digitrak
On Finish Kit
----- Original Message -----
From: "Kenneth Gresham" <kgresham@mtco.com>
Subject: AeroElectric-List: Navigatin lighting
> --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Kenneth Gresham"
<kgresham@mtco.com>
>
> I would like to know what is required lighting in U.S. for night VFR and
later possibly IFR. Is wing lighting with colored front, strobe center, and
white at rear of same fixture adequate? If not please give lights and
specific locations. I would like to keep wiring to rear of fuselage to a
minimum. I intend to run wing tip wiring through a conduit since this is a
composite airframe Any other thoughts or suggestions are appreciated.
>
> Ken Gresham
> Europa Kit # A268 Rigging wings
>
>
Message 13
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| Subject: | Shielded wire options |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "hollandm" <hollandm@pacbell.net>
Thanks Bob,
In that case I want to pass along this source of the least expensive wire that
will handle this application. They also stock various connectors and antenna
wire.
http://www.thewireman.com/index.shtml
Message 14
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| Subject: | ic-List:Power supply |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: Joel Harding <cajole76@ispwest.com>
A short time ago a suggestion was given to hook up the power supply to
the B- lead to power up the airplane. Is there any need to disconnect
the alternator before power is applied?
Joel
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