Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 01:04 AM - Re: Aluminum wire (jerb)
2. 06:49 AM - Re: Aluminum wire (Robert L. Nuckolls, III)
3. 06:59 AM - Re: A theoretical question (Robert L. Nuckolls, III)
4. 07:07 AM - Re: GX-50 and Annunciator Light Bulbs (Jack Lockamy)
5. 08:18 AM - Re: Copper Clad Aluminum Wire (Eric M. Jones)
6. 08:26 AM - Re: Field alternator circuit breaker (Robert L. Nuckolls, III)
7. 10:55 AM - Mounting fuseblocks (Steve Sampson)
8. 11:59 AM - Re: radio wiring (Steve Sampson)
9. 12:10 PM - wigwag flasher (richard@riley.net)
10. 12:44 PM - Brass Bolt & Washers (frequent flyer)
11. 12:46 PM - Re: wigwag flasher (richard@riley.net)
12. 01:15 PM - Re: Brass Bolt & Washers (John Schroeder)
13. 01:39 PM - Re: Fire Detector (Kevin Horton)
14. 02:14 PM - Re: Brass Bolt & Washers (Terry Watson)
15. 02:21 PM - Re: Brass Bolt & Washers (Cy Galley)
16. 02:37 PM - Re: Help please - (possible) alt/battery troubles (James Redmon)
17. 04:36 PM - Field alternator circuit breaker (BAKEROCB@aol.com)
18. 05:11 PM - Fire Detector (Troy Scott)
19. 05:18 PM - Re: Brass Bolt & Washers (Robert L. Nuckolls, III)
20. 05:29 PM - Re: Brass Bolt & Washers (frequent flyer)
21. 05:41 PM - Re: Mounting fuseblocks (LarryRobertHelming)
22. 05:41 PM - Re: Brass Bolt & Washers (Neil Clayton)
23. 06:40 PM - Re: Brass Bolt & Washers (John Schroeder)
24. 07:47 PM - Re: Help please - (possible) alt/battery (Robert L. Nuckolls, III)
25. 07:51 PM - Re: radio wiring (Robert L. Nuckolls, III)
26. 08:12 PM - ignitions lock switch (Troy Scott)
27. 09:05 PM - Re: Help please - (possible) alt/battery troubles (James Redmon)
28. 10:12 PM - Re: Fire Detector (James Foerster)
Message 1
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| Subject: | Re: Aluminum wire |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: jerb <ulflyer@verizon.net>
If I recall right there was an AD on the Pipers to replace the aluminum
cable with copper $$$.
I agree with the other post - go with copper and figure another way to save
weight. If you do use aluminum there is a paste you apply to the wire
before it terminated, make sure you use it. Welding the cable to a solid
block is no different than tinning wires before you crimp them, it's a no
no on military aircraft wiring as it has been established it may break at
the junction of the tinned and bare wire.when subjected to vibration.
jerb
At 08:59 PM 4/3/04 -0600, you wrote:
>--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Cy Galley" <cgalley@qcbc.org>
>
>Piper used Aluminum cable. Bogart has an STC to replace it. If you use
>Aluminum make sure you use the sealing compound for aluminum wire as AL
>joints gradually corrode and become high resistance if it isn't used.
>
>Incidentally my Bellanca uses only copper wire (1948) Why don't you ask John
>Dyke for his opinion?
>
>Cy Galley, TC - Chair, Emergency Aircraft Repair, Oshkosh
>Editor, EAA Safety Programs
>cgalley@qcbc.org or sportpilot@eaa.org
>
>Always looking for articles for Sport Pilot
>
>----- Original Message -----
>From: "Ernest Christley" <echristley@nc.rr.com>
>To: <aeroelectric-list@matronics.com>
>Subject: AeroElectric-List: Aluminum wire
>
>
> > --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: Ernest Christley
><echristley@nc.rr.com>
> >
> > Excuse me if this has been discussed here before. I couldn't find a
> > search engine for the list, and Google has been nearly useless. Seems
> > that it is beginnning to turn up more and more sales adds, and less and
> > less information.
> >
> > I'm building a Dyke Delta (just finished the elevons today!). The
> > battery is as far back in the tail as it can be, making for a starter
> > cable run of about 15ft. I'm trying to gather up information on the
> > feasibility of making this run with aluminum wire.
> >
> > What I've gotten so far is from a thread on rec.aviation.homebuilt
> > (notice that Google in only NEARLY useless). I'd want to use #1 wire,
> > to keep the resistance low, but even that will save me about 3lbs over
> > the #4 copper. One person commented that Al wire has been used in some
> > certified ships (a solid bar was used in a Bellanca, if I remember
> > correctly).
> >
> > My plan would be to run the aluminum from one side of a manual
> > contactor, to a block on the cockpit side of the firewall. I would run
> > the rest of the electrics from this block, and a jumper of #4 welding
> > wire would go out to the starter. The Al wire would be securely
> > strapped to a longeron of the steel tube fuselage.
> >
> > What I can't find information on is what sort of connectors to use. I
> > know oxidized Al is resistive and it's different rate of expansion WILL
> > allow oxygen in a joint if the wrong metal is used. You can't just bolt
> > it down and hope for the best. Ideally, the wire ends would be TIG
> > welded onto a block of some sort of compatible metal.
> >
> > Is this a reasonable idea, or are there already a dozen airplanes
> > sitting in trees because someone tried?
> >
> > --
> > http://www.ernest.isa-geek.org/
> > "Ignorance is mankinds normal state,
> > alleviated by information and experience."
> > Veeduber
> >
> >
>
>
Message 2
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| Subject: | Re: Aluminum wire |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <bob.nuckolls@cox.net>
At 04:09 AM 4/4/2004 -0500, you wrote:
>--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: jerb <ulflyer@verizon.net>
>
>If I recall right there was an AD on the Pipers to replace the aluminum
>cable with copper $$$.
>
>I agree with the other post - go with copper and figure another way to save
>weight. If you do use aluminum there is a paste you apply to the wire
>before it terminated, make sure you use it. Welding the cable to a solid
>block is no different than tinning wires before you crimp them, it's a no
>no on military aircraft wiring as it has been established it may break at
>the junction of the tinned and bare wire.when subjected to vibration.
The downsides of soldering and/or 'welding' are fraught with
myth.
In practice, bring all strands of a multi-strand
wire together in a gas-tight crimp, solder OR "weld" will
in fact make the strands behave as if they were a single
solid strand of copper. ALL such connections benefit from
vibration support immediately adjacent to the joint to
avoid failures commonly attributed only to soldered
connections.
http://www.aeroelectric.com/articles/terminal.pdf
and
http://www.aeroelectric.com/articles/rules/review.html
All that has been offered vis-a-vis "aluminum" wires has
some degree of fact but much misunderstanding too.
Pure aluminum wire is famous for its special handling
requirements and relatively unfriendly performance in
aircraft. Piper did a short marriage with copper and wound
up scrapping it. There was no AD against them that I'm aware
of, just a rip-off STC to force an owner operator to buy
pre-assembled copper wires with terminals crimped on each
end while airplanes before-and-after-aluminum all used
copper fat wires. Any mechanic worth his a/p ticked could
envoke AC43-13 guidlines an replace the aluminum wire with
copper for a fraction of the price. Cessna's Cardinal had
aluminum wires in it first year. Operation Cardinal Rule
replace the wires with copper and accomplished a number
of additional enhancements to the airplane in the second
year of production.
There was some discussion a few months back about
COPPER CLAD aluminum wire. This is a whole new breed
of cat. In many respects it handles just like copper
wire but with the benefits of weight reduction.
Eric Jones has offered to provide fat wires to the
OBAM aircraft community fabricated from this new
material.
Bob . . .
Message 3
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| Subject: | Re: A theoretical question |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <bob.nuckolls@cox.net>
At 01:54 AM 4/4/2004 -0500, you wrote:
>--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: Jim and Lucy <jpollard@mnsi.net>
>
>There was once a french engine built called a Potez
>It was about 100 hp and had battery and points ignition.
>It had an electical system that allowed operation on
>battery only or alternator only. There was a big
>capacitor wired in the system somewhere to allow
>this alternator only mode. The wireing diagram is
>at
>http://www.jodel.com/potezwiring.htm
>
>So it may be possible to do this maybe you just
>need a particular type of alternator and big capacitor.
The wiring diagram shows a one-wire alternator (which
suggests either a PM alternator or a wound-field alternator
with a built-in regulator. Since the diagram also calls
out a regulator, it seems reasonable to presume that the
alternator IS a permanent magnet type. The alternator has
a capacitor across it in the schematic . . . but I'm mystified
by the fact that the alternator output connects to ground
and has a capacitor across the output. This suggest that
the alternator also has rectifiers in it and the capacitor
offers some degree of smoothing. This would make the regulator
some form of pure-linear design using fat transistors on fatter
heatsinks. I couldn't think of a more difficult approach
to the problem.
Elegant designs not withstanding, the addition of
a capacitor into ANY system with ANY style alternator
will offer a degree of battery emulation that would
offset some of the shortcomings of alternator-only
operations. I would encourage anyone who wishes to
explore this option to give it a try and to publish
the results of a repeatable experiment here on the
list. Let's talk about how to set up the experiment
and to test for potential benefits of this modification.
Bob . . .
-----------------------------------------
( Experience and common sense cannot be )
( replaced with policy and procedures. )
( R. L. Nuckolls III )
-----------------------------------------
Message 4
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| Subject: | Re: GX-50 and Annunciator Light Bulbs |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Jack Lockamy" <jacklockamy@att.net>
Ran a couple test yesterday on the CM386 and CM388 bulbs in my annnunciators....
The CM386 bulbs I have worked fine when 12v was applied..... maybe I have some
bad wiring to the annunciator. I'll check with Garmin AT on Monday to see if
that particular annunciator should be lit when running the System Power up checks
on the GX-50 IFR GPS. (Two of the annunciators light-up... the HOLD button/annumciator
does not light up....). Anyone with a GX-50 know the answer?
The CM388 (28v) bulbs do indeed light up in my 12v system, however, as you mentioned
they are much dimmer than the CM386s. I think you are correct.... someone
placed 28v bulbs in the annunciators to decrease the amount of light being
emitted.
Thanks to all those who have responded. Looks like I have some more trouble-shooting
ahead of me as I continue to 'de-bug' my panel wiring. And I thought I
was done..... yeah right! :-)
Jack Lockamy
Camarillo, CA
DO NOT ARCHIVE
Message 5
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| Subject: | Re: Copper Clad Aluminum Wire |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Eric M. Jones" <emjones@charter.net>
I stand guilty as charged. I apologize to those who have been waiting, and
I concede defeat in attempting to cable and insulate this stuff myself. It
was not for lack of effort!
But finally I have located a cable manufacturer that is both interested and
willing to make a reasonably quantity of the 1/0 (Substitute for the AWG 2
copper). The material is ON THE WAY THERE, ETA Tuesday. They quote 20
working days to product.
Thanks to those who supported me in this, especially Bob Nuckolls. Thanks
for the many emails of encouragement from the members of the Aeroelectric
List.
Check my website. The Space Shuttle Switch Guards are stunningly good.
Regards,
Eric M. Jones
www.PerihelionDesign.com
113 Brentwood Drive
Southbridge MA 01550-2705
Phone (508) 764-2072
Email: emjones@charter.net
Message 6
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| Subject: | Re: Field alternator circuit breaker |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <bob.nuckolls@cox.net>
At 01:59 PM 4/3/2004 -0800, you wrote:
>--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "John Karnes"
><jpkarnes@earthlink.net>
>
>
> > Okay, it's almost a sure bet that unhooking the ov module will
> > stop the tripping but it's worth a confirmation.
>
>Unhooked the ov module and the same thing happened. I pulled all fuses but
>the starter and a fuel pump and the circuit breaker still is tripping.
>HELP!
Okay, then it's a fault of some kind downstream of the breaker
that's tripping. Wire rubbed to ground, bad regulator, . . .
something along that line. You're getting close.
Bob . . .
Message 7
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| Subject: | Mounting fuseblocks |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Steve Sampson" <SSampson.SLN21@london.edu>
I have the B&C fuseblocks and am interested to know what screws/nutplates
folk have been using to mount them on an ally bulkhead. Without modifying
the fuseblocks this is not as obvious (at least to me) as it should be.
Thanks, Steve.
---
Message 8
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--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Steve Sampson" <SSampson.SLN21@london.edu>
Yes my query was perhaps too terse.
I was thinking that for the headphones (ears) even a twisted pair was not
necessary since it seemed an unlikely source of gremlins into the system.
From your email I understand a shielded wire would be best.
For the microphone I had made the assumption there would only be two wires
(hence a wire and shield) and the PTT would be activated by taking one of
these to ground, but I was planning to do this via the PTT at the radio not
jack end of the wire for routing reasons. (I havn't bought a radio yet -
probably Microair or XCOM) and am making assumptions about how the wiring
diag will look, perhaps erroniously. I will go with two shielded twisted
wires.
Whatever happens all the grounds will run back to a forest of tabs on the
firewall.
Thanks, Steve.
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com]On Behalf Of Robert
L. Nuckolls, III
Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: radio wiring
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III"
<bob.nuckolls@cox.net>
At 08:29 PM 4/3/2004 +0100, you wrote:
>--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Steve Sampson"
><SSampson.SLN21@london.edu>
>
>Am I correct in thinking the wires to the ears can be a pair of asw22 and
to
>the mike a shielded wire using the shield as the return assuming the PTT is
>acting on the radio end?
I think I'm getting an accurate image of your question . . .
If all the wires in a microphone and/or headphone circuit were
simply a twisted pair (headset) or twisted trio (microphone +
PTT), the system has a 99 plus percent chance of being just fine.
The major noise mitigation features to seek in wiring these
devices are (1) no ground loops - carry "grounds" all the way
back to radio/intercom and (2) close parallel proximity
of both inbound and outbound electrons for the device - twisted
pairs. If you choose to use shielded wires for any or all of these
circuits, you're now 99.9 plus percent assured of noise free
operation.
Bob . . .
-----------------------------------------
( Experience and common sense cannot be )
( replaced with policy and procedures. )
( R. L. Nuckolls III )
-----------------------------------------
---
Incoming mail is certified Virus Free.
---
Message 9
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--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: richard@riley.net
In the nose of my airplane (a canard pusher) I have 2 MR-16 lamps. They
were originally installed as landing lights but they aren't nearly bright
enough, so I'm putting in an HID light attached to my front landing gear.
I'd like to flash them as anti-collision lights, but they're so close
together I don't know if I should wig-wag them, or flash them
together. Will you module allow me to flash them together?
Message 10
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| Subject: | Brass Bolt & Washers |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: frequent flyer <jdhcv@yahoo.com>
Bob, bought the grond blocks from B & C for my Glasair
but the firewall is much ticker and I can only get one
nut on the bolt with no bolt left over. Need a bolt
that is abo9ut 3/4" longer and washers to make up the
firewall thickness. Havn't been able to locate any
locally. Any ideas?
Thanks,
Jack
Glasair II-S FT
Camp Verde, AZ
__________________________________
http://promotions.yahoo.com/design_giveaway/
Message 11
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| Subject: | Re: wigwag flasher |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: richard@riley.net
Sorry, I meant that to go to Eric Jones.
At 12:08 PM 4/4/04 -0700, you wrote:
>--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: richard@riley.net
>
>In the nose of my airplane (a canard pusher) I have 2 MR-16 lamps. They
>were originally installed as landing lights but they aren't nearly bright
>enough, so I'm putting in an HID light attached to my front landing gear.
Do not archive
Message 12
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| Subject: | Re: Brass Bolt & Washers |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: John Schroeder <jschroeder@perigee.net>
I got some longer ones from McMaster Carr
http://www.mcmaster.com/keywordsearch/search.asp?sesnextrep=409754603155953&input=%22brass+studs%22&link=%3CFONT+COLOR%3D%27006400%27+FACE%3D%27Verdana%27+size%3D%27%2D2%27%3E%3C%2FFONT%3E&expanded=0&nodetype=nominal#ScrollPosition
If this does not work, go to www.mcmaster.com and search for "brass
studs". Be sure to use the quotes. If you need nuts, they only sell by
the box. Same for lockwashers. I have a box of 5/16 washers and nuts if
you need a few.
Cheers,
John
Message 13
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| Subject: | Re: Fire Detector |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: Kevin Horton <khorton01@rogers.com>
>--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Troy Scott"
><tscott1217@bellsouth.net>
>
>Bob wrote:
> You've got a 40-hour fly-off to do. Suggest you investigate these
> values and then enlighten us.
>
> Bob . . .
>
>Yes, but....., I think that many times the fly-off period is when major
>problems, if any, rear their scary heads. I don't want to wait until after
>I need a fire detector to install one. Fortunately a few guys have made
>suggestions regarding maximum acceptable cowling exit air temperatures,
>ranging from 51degreesC to 86degreesC. I think I'll start out with a 95C
>encapsulated thermostat. If I get nuisance trips during the fly-off
>period, I'll increase the temperature range. Now for an important question:
>Is a NO or a NC sensor better for this application? Or does it make any
>difference? I can imagine that NC might be better, since a fire might
>"open" a sensor wire......
>
>Regards,
>Troy
How will you differentiate between a nuisance trip and a real fire?
How will you respond to a fire indication?
I'm not sure a home-brew fire detection system is worth the trouble.
I've had several fire indications over the years from supposedly well
engineered systems, and they all turned out to be false alarms. I'd
be very surprised if a home-brew system works better.
If you've got a super-reliable fire detection system, then you can
treat all fire indications as being real fires. I.e. close the fuel
valve, etc and go for a forced landing. If the indication is suspect
I'm not sure it really helps you very much.
Just my two cents worth. It's your aircraft.
--
Kevin Horton RV-8 (finishing kit)
Ottawa, Canada
http://go.phpwebhosting.com/~khorton/rv8/
Message 14
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| Subject: | Brass Bolt & Washers |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Terry Watson" <terry@tcwatson.com>
I bought a pair of brass toilet hold-down bolts for the firewall penetration
of the ground on my RV-8A but found I won't need them after all. I think
they were less than $1.00 each.
Terry
-> AeroElectric-List message posted by: frequent flyer <jdhcv@yahoo.com>
Bob, bought the grond blocks from B & C for my Glasair
but the firewall is much ticker and I can only get one
nut on the bolt with no bolt left over. Need a bolt
that is abo9ut 3/4" longer and washers to make up the
firewall thickness. Havn't been able to locate any
locally. Any ideas?
Message 15
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| Subject: | Re: Brass Bolt & Washers |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Cy Galley" <cgalley@qcbc.org>
Why not use the Plumbing department at your local hardware store?
----- Original Message -----
From: "John Schroeder" <jschroeder@perigee.net>
Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Brass Bolt & Washers
> --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: John Schroeder
<jschroeder@perigee.net>
>
> I got some longer ones from McMaster Carr
>
>
http://www.mcmaster.com/keywordsearch/search.asp?sesnextrep=409754603155953&
input=%22brass+studs%22&link=%3CFONT+COLOR%3D%27006400%27+FACE%3D%27Verdana%
27+size%3D%27%2D2%27%3E%3C%2FFONT%3E&expanded=0&nodetype=nominal#ScrollPosit
ion
>
> If this does not work, go to www.mcmaster.com and search for "brass
> studs". Be sure to use the quotes. If you need nuts, they only sell by
> the box. Same for lockwashers. I have a box of 5/16 washers and nuts if
> you need a few.
>
> Cheers,
>
> John
>
>
Message 16
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| Subject: | Re: Help please - (possible) alt/battery troubles |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "James Redmon" <james@berkut13.com>
OK, gang...Here is the report I promised. I got a new 17ah Panasonic
battery, charged it overnight, and repeated the tests....with very nearly
the SAME results. (sigh)
So...I am going to try to gang the two 17ah batteries together (mounted
about 2ft apart) and try again as soon as I receive the required
wire/terminal ends. Remember, the single 28ah battery spun the engine
easily...so two 17s should do the trick - and I'll get the benefit of extra
juice and a second battery source if I add a second electronic ignition
someday.
In review of the AEC, it is recommended to add a battery relay to isolate
the secondary battery. I'll do that...but I am wondering if there is
functional difference between connecting the second battery relay to the bus
structure (as depicted in Figure 17-6), or rather connecting it to the
battery side of the main contactor? I'm running out of room on the bus side
post of the master relay. Also, is there a good way to keep from forgetting
to turn the Aux battery off so the relay doesn't drain it? I'm already
thinking - covered rocker switch.
Thanks all,
James Redmon
Berkut #013 N97TX
http://www.berkut13.com
> >Reminder: Canard pusher Z-12 design with PM starter (SkyTek), new high
> >compression IO-360, aft mounted battery/relays/starter, .3 ohms from batt
> >ground terminal to all points on the engine, all wired with #4 and #2
wire.
> >
> >I first tested the cranking ability of the big 26ah Panasonic battery
with
> >the following results: (measured with Fluke digital on battery terminals)
> >12.5v starting charge - static
> >12.3v with master on - minimal consumption
> >9.5v when starter engaged and turning
> >Note: turns engine over easily, at least 10 blades, four tries, still has
> >more to go.
> >7.2v when starter engaged after multiple tries but prop no longer turning
> >12.2v after flogging with master off
> >
> >Immediate attempt to charge - registers 12 amps at 13.3v on automotive
> >charger.
> >
> >Next, I tested the cranking ability of the freshly charged 17ah Panasonic
> >battery with the following results: (measured with Fluke digital on
battery
> >terminals)
> >12.9v starting charge - static
> >12.6v with master on - minimal consumption
> >6.1v when starter engaged and (barely) turning
> >Note: barely turns engine over, get 2 blades then prop stops, two more
> >tries, will no longer turn prop.
> >12.3v after flogging with master off
>
> The Panasonic is probably bad. They test here at 300 to 400A
> for 9 volts at the terminals.
>
> Bob . . .
Message 17
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| Subject: | Field alternator circuit breaker |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: BAKEROCB@aol.com
AeroElectric-List message previously posted by: "John Karnes"
jpkarnes@earthlink.net
<....skip....Unhooked the ov module and the same thing happened. I pulled
all fuses but
the starter and a fuel pump and the circuit breaker still is tripping.
HELP!....skip....>
4/4/04
Hello John, have you checked out the CB itself? This could be done by
temporarily bypassing the CB and using a comparable fuse in a fuse holder to replace
the CB.
If the fuse also blows when activating the circuit then the CB is telling you
the truth -- you have a circuit fault. If the fuse doesn't blow and the
circuit works fine then you have a bad CB.
Keep in mind that equivalent amperage fuses and CB don't have exactly the
same reaction characteristics.
'OC' Baker, Builder of KIS TR-1 #116 4/14/97 - 11/17/03
Message 18
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--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Troy Scott" <tscott1217@bellsouth.net>
Phil, Robert, David (et al):
Thanks for the input!
I'll consider two "levels" of temperature alarms: One that would suggest
just an exhaust leak, and another that would suggest fire.
Also, I'll plan to use a NC sensor with some self-diagnostic feature.
Regards,
Troy
tscott1217@bellsouth.net
Message 19
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| Subject: | Re: Brass Bolt & Washers |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <bob.nuckolls@cox.net>
At 04:14 PM 4/4/2004 -0400, you wrote:
>--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: John Schroeder
><jschroeder@perigee.net>
>
>I got some longer ones from McMaster Carr
>
>http://www.mcmaster.com/keywordsearch/search.asp?sesnextrep=409754603155953&input=%22brass+studs%22&link=%3CFONT+COLOR%3D%27006400%27+FACE%3D%27Verdana%27+size%3D%27%2D2%27%3E%3C%2FFONT%3E&expanded=0&nodetype=nominal#ScrollPosition
>
>If this does not work, go to www.mcmaster.com and search for "brass
>studs". Be sure to use the quotes. If you need nuts, they only sell by
>the box. Same for lockwashers. I have a box of 5/16 washers and nuts if
>you need a few.
B&C stocks some longer ones for the composite firewalls.
Did you ask them what they could do for you?
Bob . . .
Message 20
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| Subject: | Re: Brass Bolt & Washers |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: frequent flyer <jdhcv@yahoo.com>
Good Idea, why didn't I think of that? Thanks Bob.
Jack
do not archive.
> B&C stocks some longer ones for the composite
> firewalls.
> Did you ask them what they could do for you?
>
> Bob . . .
>
__________________________________
http://promotions.yahoo.com/design_giveaway/
Message 21
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| Subject: | Re: Mounting fuseblocks |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "LarryRobertHelming" <lhelming@sigecom.net>
I used AN509 type screws with washer and AN lock nut. (I don't like
mounting plate nuts if I can get to both sides of the mounting wall after
everything is installed for maintenance purposes -- and in this case it
wasn't a problem.)
Indiana Larry, RV7 TipUp
TMX-O-360 ACS2002 Dynon CNS430 Digitrak
JeffRose Flightline Interiors
Firewall Forward, Wiring
----- Original Message -----
From: "Steve Sampson" <SSampson.SLN21@london.edu>
Subject: AeroElectric-List: Mounting fuseblocks
> --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Steve Sampson"
<SSampson.SLN21@london.edu>
>
> I have the B&C fuseblocks and am interested to know what screws/nutplates
> folk have been using to mount them on an ally bulkhead. Without modifying
> the fuseblocks this is not as obvious (at least to me) as it should be.
> Thanks, Steve.
>
> ---
>
>
Message 22
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| Subject: | Re: Brass Bolt & Washers |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: Neil Clayton <harvey4@earthlink.net>
At 04:14 PM 4/4/2004, you wrote:
>--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: John Schroeder
><jschroeder@perigee.net>
>
>I got some longer ones from McMaster Carr
>
>http://www.mcmaster.com/keywordsearch/search.asp?sesnextrep=409754603155953&input=%22brass+studs%22&link=%3CFONT+COLOR%3D%27006400%27+FACE%3D%27Verdana%27+size%3D%27%2D2%27%3E%3C%2FFONT%3E&expanded=0&nodetype=nominal#ScrollPosition
>
>If this does not work, go to www.mcmaster.com and search for "brass
>studs". Be sure to use the quotes. If you need nuts, they only sell by
>the box. Same for lockwashers. I have a box of 5/16 washers and nuts if
>you need a few.
>
>Cheers,
>
>John
Hi John....this says they come in lots of 10.
If you got ten, would you sell a couple to me?
I would like a couple of bolts and washers too pls.
Thanks
Neil
660 Forest Cove
Oviedo FL
32765
407 366 8470
Message 23
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| Subject: | Re: Brass Bolt & Washers |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: John Schroeder <jschroeder@perigee.net>
Hi Neil -
I bought a package of 5 2" x 5/16" d for $2.80 Their stock # is 93025
A973. I needed 5 of them.
How many nuts & washers do you need?
Cheers,
John
>
> Hi John....this says they come in lots of 10.
> If you got ten, would you sell a couple to me?
> I would like a couple of bolts and washers too pls.
> Thanks
> Neil
Message 24
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| Subject: | Re: Help please - (possible) alt/battery |
troubles
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <bob.nuckolls@cox.net>
At 04:38 PM 4/4/2004 -0500, you wrote:
>--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "James Redmon" <james@berkut13.com>
>
>OK, gang...Here is the report I promised. I got a new 17ah Panasonic
>battery, charged it overnight, and repeated the tests....with very nearly
>the SAME results. (sigh)
>
>So...I am going to try to gang the two 17ah batteries together (mounted
>about 2ft apart) and try again as soon as I receive the required
>wire/terminal ends. Remember, the single 28ah battery spun the engine
>easily...so two 17s should do the trick - and I'll get the benefit of extra
>juice and a second battery source if I add a second electronic ignition
>someday.
>
>In review of the AEC, it is recommended to add a battery relay to isolate
>the secondary battery. I'll do that...but I am wondering if there is
>functional difference between connecting the second battery relay to the bus
>structure (as depicted in Figure 17-6), or rather connecting it to the
>battery side of the main contactor? I'm running out of room on the bus side
>post of the master relay. Also, is there a good way to keep from forgetting
>to turn the Aux battery off so the relay doesn't drain it? I'm already
>thinking - covered rocker switch.
If you're simply needing the greater capacity, then wire the two
batteries in parallel and treat them as one battery. I'm mystified
as to what combination of things is piling up to make your engine
so hard to crank. What engine and starter combination do you have?
Where is your battery located with respect to the engine and what
size fat wire is used to hook all the cranking circuits up?
Bob . . .
Message 25
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--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <bob.nuckolls@cox.net>
At 08:01 PM 4/4/2004 +0100, you wrote:
>--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Steve Sampson"
><SSampson.SLN21@london.edu>
>
>Yes my query was perhaps too terse.
>
>I was thinking that for the headphones (ears) even a twisted pair was not
>necessary since it seemed an unlikely source of gremlins into the system.
> From your email I understand a shielded wire would be best.
>
>For the microphone I had made the assumption there would only be two wires
>(hence a wire and shield) and the PTT would be activated by taking one of
>these to ground, but I was planning to do this via the PTT at the radio not
>jack end of the wire for routing reasons. (I havn't bought a radio yet -
>probably Microair or XCOM) and am making assumptions about how the wiring
>diag will look, perhaps erroniously. I will go with two shielded twisted
>wires.
See http://www.aeroelectric.com/Catalog/avionics/760imB.pdf
for an exemplar wiring diagram for comm transceiver. Also,
if you DO decide to install the 760VHF, I still have a few
wire harnesses for that radio.
>Whatever happens all the grounds will run back to a forest of tabs on the
>firewall.
Just POWER grounds go to the forest of tabs ground block. Signal
grounds and shields wire as shown in installation diagrams.
Check out diagrams in the installation manual I cited above.
The only wires that go to the ground block have the
G3(PNL) notation on the ground symbol.
Bob . . .
Message 26
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| Subject: | ignitions lock switch |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Troy Scott" <tscott1217@bellsouth.net>
Gentlemen,
I'd like to avoid the "hot ignition syndrome" in my Glasair with dual
Electroair electronic ignition systems. I'm considering the use of a
key-operated DP switch to control the power to the two ignitions. I realize
this creates a single-point failure. However, it seems like it might be the
best way to avoid the possibility of an accidental start if/when a switch is
accidentally left on. Check out Digikey part number CKC1235-ND and let me
know if you think this switch is up to the task.
I also want to avoid an accidental actuation of the starter. Scenario: The
canopy is open at a fly-in. An incorrigibly curious person reaches in and
flips a couple of switches, including the battery and start switches. This
happens while someone is closely checking out the propeller. I've bought a
300 amp key-operated battery switch for this particular possibility.
However, I don't much like the idea. Might it be better to install a hidden
"kill switch" that only interrupts the primary on the starter contactor? An
even simpler possibility is to just pull the fuse for the starter contactor
or the battery contactor whenever the airplane is left open.
What are you guys doing about these worries?
Regards,
Troy Scott
tscott1217@bellsouth.net
Message 27
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| Subject: | Re: Help please - (possible) alt/battery troubles |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "James Redmon" <james@berkut13.com>
> If you're simply needing the greater capacity, then wire the two
> batteries in parallel and treat them as one battery. I'm mystified
> as to what combination of things is piling up to make your engine
> so hard to crank. What engine and starter combination do you have?
> Where is your battery located with respect to the engine and what
> size fat wire is used to hook all the cranking circuits up?
I'm rather frustrated with this issue too, Bob. As always, thank you for
your patience. I have a high 10:1 compression IO-360-B2B (200 hp),
w/Sky-Tek starter - PM version.
Here is the system, from battery to starter, the lay-out is exactly Z-12,
canard with battery in the back:
Panasonic 17ah battery (pos term) in aft compartment - 18" 4AWG flex cable -
master relay - 8" 2AWG cable - Starter relay on engine side of firewall -
30" 2AWG cable - starter. Ground from battery uses 20" 4AWG flex to engine
mount bolt for pass through (all major grounds terminate here) - B&C flex
strap for engine ground from the same pass through bolt (yes, sanded under
engine attach bolt). No wires get warm during extended cranking...with the
exception of the small braided strap on the Sky-Tek starter that jumps
between the integrated relay and the starter motor - it gets rather hot
during multiple starts.
From battery ground terminal to starter's case measures .3 ohms, as does
anywhere on the engine case.
Does that help? I should have the parts for connection Tuesday...I'll
report back. If that doesn't work...I got LOTS of re-work to do to
accommodate a single 28ah battery.
Thanks,
James Redmon
Berkut #013 N97TX
http://www.berkut13.com
Message 28
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| Subject: | Re: Fire Detector |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "James Foerster" <jmfpublic@comcast.net>
Troy,
I recall an article in an airplane magazine where the author showed how to build
a flame detector using a series of infrared LEDs. Apparantly, these also work
to detect as well as emit IR. This was said to detect a leak from the exhaust
quickly, and is of course independent of temperature exhausting from the cowl.
The problem, it would seem, is that a small, high temperature exhaust leak
will not heat up the large volume of cowl air until it ignites something.
I can't recall what magazine. I looked for articles by Jim Weir, and also the
Kitplanes index. I did not do a search of the EAA index, though. You might
wish to look into this.
Jim Foerster
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