---------------------------------------------------------- AeroElectric-List Digest Archive --- Total Messages Posted Thu 08/12/04: 20 ---------------------------------------------------------- Today's Message Index: ---------------------- 1. 05:59 AM - Re: Fixture for wiring a 25 pin D-Sub connector (Eric M. Jones) 2. 06:14 AM - Re: Hello everyone. I'm having a terrible time (echristley@nc.rr.com.getting.the.radio.to.work.properly) 3. 06:58 AM - Re: Load Dump redux (Robert L. Nuckolls, III) 4. 07:35 AM - Re: Hello everyone. I'm having a terrible time (erie) 5. 08:03 AM - For and aft slide switch (Mark Banus) 6. 08:35 AM - Re: For and aft slide switch (Bruce Gray) 7. 09:42 AM - Strobe supply question (Charlie Kuss) 8. 09:46 AM - non-adhesive stretchy tape (Joa Harrison) 9. 10:00 AM - Re: For and aft slide switch (Jaye and Scott Jackson) 10. 10:10 AM - Re: non-adhesive stretchy tape (Dan Checkoway) 11. 10:18 AM - Re: non-adhesive stretchy tape (f1rocket@comcast.net) 12. 10:48 AM - Re: non-adhesive stretchy tape (Joel Jacobs) 13. 10:58 AM - Re: non-adhesive stretchy tape (Joa Harrison) 14. 01:10 PM - Re: non-adhesive stretchy tape (Paul) 15. 02:38 PM - Re: non-adhesive stretchy tape (Larry McFarland) 16. 02:43 PM - Re: non-adhesive stretchy tape (John Schroeder) 17. 02:58 PM - Noise filter (Mark Sherman) 18. 04:04 PM - Re: Noise filter (Matt Prather) 19. 05:46 PM - Re: non-adhesive stretchy tape (Ken) 20. 08:37 PM - Question about Switches (Dennis Johnson) ________________________________ Message 1 _____________________________________ Time: 05:59:49 AM PST US From: "Eric M. Jones" Subject: AeroElectric-List: Re: Fixture for wiring a 25 pin D-Sub connector --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Eric M. Jones" --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: jerb >--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: Neil Clayton > >Bob....I spent two frustrating hours trying to solder a D-sub connector >onto the 19+ wires of an Infinity Stick. The idea is to be able to remove >the stick during annuals, etc. I eventually threw up the idea and decided >there MUST be some kind of professional jig for wiring these things. >Can you direct me to such a device? > >Many thanks >Neil Removal of the control part of the stick is common practice in jets. I have seen those round Amphenol circular bayonet-lock connectors. My opinion is to find a real professional electronics assembler (usually older women ) to do the job for you. Don't believe that you can easily develop the skill to do this correctly yourself. By the way: Jig---a device, often temporary, to guide a tool or tool bit. Fixture---a device to hold a part that is being worked on. Regards, Eric M. Jones www.PerihelionDesign.com 113 Brentwood Drive Southbridge MA 01550-2705 Phone (508) 764-2072 Email: emjones@charter.net "A man's got to know his limitations." (Clint Eastwood's Dirty Harry in Magnum Force, 1973) ________________________________ Message 2 _____________________________________ Time: 06:14:39 AM PST US From: echristley@nc.rr.com.getting.the.radio.to.work.properly Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Hello everyone. I'm having a terrible time getting the radio to work properly --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: echristley@nc.rr.com getting the radio to work properly > I too have an Icom handheld on the dash. I take the 12 volt wire > thatfeeds the radio to a 2,200uf capacitor to ground then through > an iron core > choke then another 2,200uf to ground, this then Isn't this an oscillator? I'm not sure of the relationship between iron core chokes and inductors, but wouldn't an oscillator be 'bad' at this point in the circuit? ________________________________ Message 3 _____________________________________ Time: 06:58:24 AM PST US From: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" Subject: AeroElectric-List: Re: Load Dump redux --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" >Comments/Questions: Hello Bob, > >I'm considering the electrical system in my RV-6 project. > >I work on computers, so mobile 12V is a little foreign, and I'm not >looking to beat a dead horse, but... > >When I went looking for load dump information as it applies to airplanes I >found your link on voltage spikes. > >My understanding is that if a battery circuit opens the energy stored in >the leakage inductance of the stator windings of the alternator is what >might cause a voltage spike. > >As you point out, the stator windings are not tightly coupled to the >field, this limits the short circuit output current. > >This lose coupling also prevents an infinitely fast voltage regulator on >the field windings from controlling the voltage on the alternator output >terminal if the battery is quickly disconnected. > >Am I wrong? Only slightly. The excess voltage is not a problem of energy stored on alternator inductance. It's a matter of alternator/regulator dynamics. Suppose you're playing tug-of-war and one side suddenly releases their grip. It's nearly impossible for folks on the other side to avoid falling. Even if they're braced for the event, their reaction to sudden release of tension is subject to reaction time and their position is certain to transit backwards for a period of time required to react to the reduced stress. Alternators (indeed all servo systems) exhibit the same response to one degree or another unless they are over-damped. Over-damping the servo response is generally not acceptable in most control situations. The event is rare in aircraft and only came to light again a few months ago when Van's Aircraft noted that some builders were killing their alternators when wired for external OV protection and they happened to operate the alternator's ON/OFF control switch at a time when the alternator was producing significant power. Alternators with built in regulators need a b-lead disconnect contactor for absolute over the consequences of a failed regulator. Opening this contactor when the alternator was producing significant power caused the alternator to overshoot and kill its own regulator. There are efforts under way to quantify the magnitude of this voltage perturbation and size a transient clamping device that will mitigate the event. In any case, this an isolated event that happens only when the alternator is operated in a mode inconsistent the normal operation of the aircraft. By the way, the production Bonanza has separate alternator and battery switches. I could sit in the seat of a brand new airplane and produce an alternator overshoot event with a particular manipulation of the controls. For the event cited on Van's alternators, only the alternator is at-risk. Except for inadvertent but stressful mis-operation of controls that MIGHT kill the alternator, the system still does the task for which it was designed - protect the ship's system from ov events. Bob . . . >Ole Moyer >Power Supply Application Engineer >On Semiconductor On of my favorite silicon foundries. You guys make some nifty parts! Bob . . . ----------------------------------------- ( Experience and common sense cannot be ) ( replaced with policy and procedures. ) ( R. L. Nuckolls III ) ----------------------------------------- ________________________________ Message 4 _____________________________________ Time: 07:35:04 AM PST US From: erie Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Hello everyone. I'm having a terrible time getting the radio to work properly --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: erie Actually, If I'm not mistaken it's a pi filter, quite good at attenuating noise out ... erie ________________________________ Message 5 _____________________________________ Time: 08:03:28 AM PST US From: "Mark Banus" Subject: AeroElectric-List: For and aft slide switch --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Mark Banus" I'm working on the design for my throttle. I want to put an on-off-on spring loaded to off slide switch in the end of the handle. Military jets have this type of switch in the throttle for speed brakes. Anyone know what they are called and where does one get them. Thanks Mark Banus Glasair SII FT ________________________________ Message 6 _____________________________________ Time: 08:35:59 AM PST US From: "Bruce Gray" Subject: RE: AeroElectric-List: For and aft slide switch --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Bruce Gray" Try, http://www.ottoeng.com/index.html Bruce www.glasair.org -----Original Message----- From: owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Mark Banus Subject: AeroElectric-List: For and aft slide switch --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Mark Banus" I'm working on the design for my throttle. I want to put an on-off-on spring loaded to off slide switch in the end of the handle. Military jets have this type of switch in the throttle for speed brakes. Anyone know what they are called and where does one get them. Thanks Mark Banus Glasair SII FT == == == == ________________________________ Message 7 _____________________________________ Time: 09:42:56 AM PST US From: Charlie Kuss Subject: AeroElectric-List: Strobe supply question --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: Charlie Kuss Bob & Listers, Is there any "minimum" distance that one should keep between a strobe power supply and your intercom wiring? Is this a potential issue? All intercom and strobe wiring will be shielded. Charlie Kuss ________________________________ Message 8 _____________________________________ Time: 09:46:00 AM PST US From: Joa Harrison Subject: AeroElectric-List: non-adhesive stretchy tape --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: Joa Harrison Anybody know the name and maybe a place to buy the stretchy tape that sticks to itself (really well) without adhesive? They had it on demo at Oshkosh and it was pretty impressive. Anybody use it for large wire bundles? Joa --------------------------------- ________________________________ Message 9 _____________________________________ Time: 10:00:54 AM PST US From: "Jaye and Scott Jackson" Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: For and aft slide switch --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Jaye and Scott Jackson" My 6 has a surplus throttle grip from a F-86, and I've used the speedbrake slide switch for the electric flaps. When I opened up the grip to find out which wires were which, I was surprized to find the speedbrake switch was actually just a toggle, with the top of the handle allen-keyed to the plastic thumb slide. That would explain why the speedbrake part of the grip is a little arc between two side ears. Scott in Vancouver ----- Original Message ----- From: "Bruce Gray" Subject: RE: AeroElectric-List: For and aft slide switch > --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Bruce Gray" > > Try, http://www.ottoeng.com/index.html > > Bruce > www.glasair.org > > > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com > [mailto:owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Mark > Banus > To: aeroelectric-list@matronics.com > Subject: AeroElectric-List: For and aft slide switch > > > --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Mark Banus" > > > I'm working on the design for my throttle. I want to put an on-off-on > spring loaded to off slide switch in the end of the handle. Military > jets have this type of switch in the throttle for speed brakes. Anyone > know what they are called and where does one get them. Thanks > > Mark Banus > > Glasair SII FT > > > == > == > == > == > > ________________________________ Message 10 ____________________________________ Time: 10:10:23 AM PST US From: "Dan Checkoway" Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: non-adhesive stretchy tape --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Dan Checkoway" Uni-wrap silicone tape. http://www.aircraftspruce.com/catalog/appages/uniwrap.php You get better value in the roll from Spruce than you do from B&C. )_( Dan RV-7 N714D http://www.rvproject.com ----- Original Message ----- From: "Joa Harrison" Subject: AeroElectric-List: non-adhesive stretchy tape > --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: Joa Harrison > > > Anybody know the name and maybe a place to buy the stretchy tape that sticks to itself (really well) without adhesive? They had it on demo at Oshkosh and it was pretty impressive. Anybody use it for large wire bundles? > > > Joa > > > --------------------------------- > > ________________________________ Message 11 ____________________________________ Time: 10:18:30 AM PST US From: f1rocket@comcast.net Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: non-adhesive stretchy tape --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: f1rocket@comcast.net I found it at Radio Shack. I don't remember the exact name, but it is rubberized silicon tape. It only sticks to itself. I use it to wrap wire bundles where they touch other bundles. I think Bob's shop notes also refer to this and picture it in the article about tying wire bundles. Randy F1 Rocket http://f1rocket.home.comcast.net/ -------------- Original message -------------- > --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: Joa Harrison > > > Anybody know the name and maybe a place to buy the stretchy tape that sticks to > itself (really well) without adhesive? They had it on demo at Oshkosh and it > was pretty impressive. Anybody use it for large wire bundles? > > > Joa > > > > --------------------------------- > > > > > > I found it at Radio Shack. I don't remember the exact name, but it is rubberized silicon tape. It only sticks to itself. I use it to wrap wire bundles where they touch other bundles. I think Bob's shop notes also refer to this and picture it in the article about tying wire bundles. Randy F1 Rocket http://f1rocket.home.comcast.net/ -------------- Original message -------------- -- AeroElectric-List message posted by: Joa Harrison Anybody know the name and maybe a place to buy the stretchy tape that sticks to itself (really well) without adhesive? They had it on demo at Oshkosh and it was pretty impressive. Anybody use it for large wire bundles? Joa --------------------------------- ================================================== & ________________________________ Message 12 ____________________________________ Time: 10:48:29 AM PST US From: "Joel Jacobs" Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: non-adhesive stretchy tape --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Joel Jacobs" Sounds like you're describing Scotch 130C linerless electrical tape. You can get it at http://www.mcmaster.com/ Joel ----- Original Message ----- From: "Joa Harrison" Subject: AeroElectric-List: non-adhesive stretchy tape > --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: Joa Harrison > > > Anybody know the name and maybe a place to buy the stretchy tape that sticks to itself (really well) without adhesive? They had it on demo at Oshkosh and it was pretty impressive. Anybody use it for large wire bundles? > > > Joa > > > --------------------------------- > > ________________________________ Message 13 ____________________________________ Time: 10:58:03 AM PST US From: Joa Harrison Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: non-adhesive stretchy tape --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: Joa Harrison Great replies, thanks everyone. A buddy here at work went to New Zealand recently and said that this kind of tape was at all the convenience stores and such for a really low price. Guess it just hasn't caught on that fast out here for household use. Thanks again folks! Joa --------------------------------- ________________________________ Message 14 ____________________________________ Time: 01:10:09 PM PST US From: Paul Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: non-adhesive stretchy tape --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: Paul Home Depot has the tape, as do most electrical supply places. Its very popular with electricians for house wiring. Paul ======= At 10:57 AM -0700 8/12/04, Joa Harrison wrote: >--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: Joa Harrison > >Great replies, thanks everyone. A buddy here at work went to New Zealand recently and said that this kind of tape was at all the convenience stores and such for a really low price. Guess it just hasn't caught on that fast out here for household use. > >Thanks again folks! -- ________________________________ Message 15 ____________________________________ Time: 02:38:29 PM PST US From: "Larry McFarland" Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: non-adhesive stretchy tape --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Larry McFarland" The stuff you refer to is called self-fusing tape. It's kind of rubbery, but does stretch and stick to itself extremely well. Radio Shack is where I've been getting it. Good for overwrapping electrical quick disconnects. Larry > Anybody know the name and maybe a place to buy the stretchy tape that sticks to itself (really well) without adhesive? They had it on demo at Oshkosh and it was pretty impressive. Anybody use it for large wire bundles? > > > Joa ________________________________ Message 16 ____________________________________ Time: 02:43:28 PM PST US Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: non-adhesive stretchy tape From: "John Schroeder" --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "John Schroeder" Any electrical supply house will have this. I believe it is silicone-based. We used it to wrap the connections to the runway & taxiway lights here at the airpark before stuffing the wires into the big cans. Had one error and traced it to the malfunction. Getting that stuff off is difficult. You literally have to cut it off. It is "self vulcanizing" and I believe it. It is legal - code wise for waterproofing a connection. The guys used it on my well pump and that is 150 feet into the water. Cheers, John > Anybody know the name and maybe a place to buy the stretchy tape that > sticks to itself (really well) without adhesive? ________________________________ Message 17 ____________________________________ Time: 02:58:21 PM PST US From: Mark Sherman Subject: AeroElectric-List: Noise filter --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: Mark Sherman Good afternoon all. I am having a problem with strobe noise in the headsets. I have searched the archives and tried all the fixes. Everything wired per AeroElectric Connection. I have decided to install a choke filter, but the one described in Bob's notes will only handle 2.0 continuous amps. I need at least 8 amps for the ValCom 760 I'm using. Can anyone recommend the size, part numbers and supplier for parts to handle the 8 amps? ===== Mark S. CH-701/912ULS N752MS reserved __________________________________ http://promotions.yahoo.com/new_mail ________________________________ Message 18 ____________________________________ Time: 04:04:17 PM PST US Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Noise filter From: "Matt Prather" --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Matt Prather" Does the ValCom 760 use vacuum tubes?? 8A is more than 96watts, 48 radiated - enough to talk all over the planet on, or since its VHF, to the moon (with the right antenna) anyway. You could guess that a modern transmitter was 50% efficient. If the radiated power were 6 watts (makes the math easy), then it would be burning 12 watts on the input. 12watts is about 1amp.... 2amps should handle up to 12 watts continuous radiated. I'll bet that the 8A spec was a WAG on the part of the ValCom engineers, and the 2A continuous should be plenty. Regards, Matt- VE N34RD, C150 N714BK > --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: Mark Sherman > > > Good afternoon all. > > I am having a problem with strobe noise in the > headsets. I have searched the archives and tried all > the fixes. Everything wired per AeroElectric > Connection. > > I have decided to install a choke filter, but the one > described in Bob's notes will only handle 2.0 > continuous amps. I need at least 8 amps for the > ValCom 760 I'm using. > > Can anyone recommend the size, part numbers and > supplier for parts to handle the 8 amps? > > ===== > Mark S. > CH-701/912ULS > N752MS reserved > > > __________________________________ > http://promotions.yahoo.com/new_mail > > ________________________________ Message 19 ____________________________________ Time: 05:46:22 PM PST US From: Ken Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: non-adhesive stretchy tape on juliet --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: Ken Actually the more common cheaper black stuff like Scotch 130 is some type of rubber not silicone if it matters to your application. The silicone stuff like Scotch 70 is I believe usually not black and substantially more expensive. Ken John Schroeder wrote: >--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "John Schroeder" > >Any electrical supply house will have this. I believe it is >silicone-based. We used it to wrap the connections to the runway & taxiway >lights here at the airpark before stuffing the wires into the big cans. >Had one error and traced it to the malfunction. Getting that stuff off is >difficult. You literally have to cut it off. It is "self vulcanizing" and >I believe it. It is legal - code wise for waterproofing a connection. The >guys used it on my well pump and that is 150 feet into the water. > >Cheers, > >John > > > >>Anybody know the name and maybe a place to buy the stretchy tape that >>sticks to itself (really well) without adhesive? >> >> ________________________________ Message 20 ____________________________________ Time: 08:37:20 PM PST US From: "Dennis Johnson" Subject: AeroElectric-List: Question about Switches --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Dennis Johnson" Hi Bob, In a recent reply about switches, you said: My personal preference would be a 4 pole, progressive transfer, three position toggle which can be wired to provide double-pole, three position operation as described in Figure 11-16 of the 'Connection (except you have two poles of circuit instead of one). A good switch for this task is a ITT-Cannon/CK 7411SYZQE which you can also find in Digikey's catalog at: http://dkc3.digikey.com/PDF/T042/1005.pdf My question is how could you tell just by looking at the info in the catalog that it is a progressive transfer switch? Are all 4 pole, three position, switches progressive transfer? Unless a switch comes with your standardized numbering system, I'm lost. Thanks again for helping me resolve my alternative magneto switch scheme questions. Best, Dennis Johnson