---------------------------------------------------------- AeroElectric-List Digest Archive --- Total Messages Posted Sat 02/26/05: 29 ---------------------------------------------------------- Today's Message Index: ---------------------- 1. 03:17 AM - aircraft wiring course slides (Jay Brinkmeyer) 2. 03:20 AM - wire labeling practices (Jay Brinkmeyer) 3. 04:56 AM - Re: SD-8 on a Rotax 914 (Jim Butcher) 4. 06:47 AM - Re: wire labeling practices (Richard Dudley) 5. 07:55 AM - Re: SD-8 on a Rotax 914 (Robert L. Nuckolls, III) 6. 07:56 AM - Re: aircraft wiring course slides (Robert L. Nuckolls, III) 7. 07:59 AM - Re: Re: Battery cables (Robert L. Nuckolls, III) 8. 08:00 AM - Re: transponder antenna cable near other (Robert L. Nuckolls, III) 9. 08:07 AM - Re: crossfeed contactor (Robert L. Nuckolls, III) 10. 08:10 AM - Re: Re: Mixing Z13 and Z14 (Robert L. Nuckolls, III) 11. 08:20 AM - Re: What is this device? (Robert L. Nuckolls, III) 12. 08:27 AM - Re: Antenna / aerial questions (Robert L. Nuckolls, III) 13. 08:34 AM - Re: transponder antenna cable near other cables? (Mickey Coggins) 14. 08:40 AM - Avionics wiring redo (Ken Simmons) 15. 09:15 AM - Re: Switch type (Robert McCallum) 16. 09:26 AM - Re: Switch type (Robert McCallum) 17. 09:46 AM - Re: Avionics wiring redo (rv-9a-online) 18. 09:58 AM - Re: wire labeling practices (rv-9a-online) 19. 11:23 AM - Re: Switch type (Scott Winn (Matronics List)) 20. 01:37 PM - JPI EDM-930 information (Jeff Hildebrand) 21. 04:34 PM - Air Pressure "Squat" Switch (Dennis Johnson) 22. 05:13 PM - Re: Re: Mixing Z13 and Z14 (James E. Clark) 23. 06:28 PM - Re: Hi Bob, My alternator controller. (Robert L. Nuckolls, III) 24. 09:09 PM - Re: Ex Pilot Question (Robert L. Nuckolls, III) 25. 09:11 PM - Re: Switch type (Robert L. Nuckolls, III) 26. 09:13 PM - Re: Re: [Stinson] Genave marker receiver (Robert L. Nuckolls, III) 27. 09:33 PM - EFIS Backup Battery (Scott Winn (Matronics List)) 28. 09:49 PM - Master Alarm (Scott Winn (Matronics List)) 29. 11:01 PM - Re: EFIS Backup Battery (AI Nut) ________________________________ Message 1 _____________________________________ Time: 03:17:49 AM PST US From: Jay Brinkmeyer Subject: AeroElectric-List: aircraft wiring course slides --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: Jay Brinkmeyer My apologies if this is information is already widely distributed: I ran across this PowerPoint wiring course while surfing the net. While I haven't read everything, the topic appears to be relevant to wiring best practices... Some information appears to be restatement of information already contained AC43-13. http://www.academy.jccbi.gov/airdl/wiringcourse/ ===== __________________________________ ________________________________ Message 2 _____________________________________ Time: 03:20:14 AM PST US From: Jay Brinkmeyer Subject: AeroElectric-List: wire labeling practices --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: Jay Brinkmeyer Can someone point me to a good source/example of wire labeling and identification best practices? Are folks using fancy mil-spec labels, just printing & heat shrinking them on, or something else??? Thanks in advance, Jay P.S. This group is a much appreciated resource! ===== __________________________________ ________________________________ Message 3 _____________________________________ Time: 04:56:33 AM PST US From: "Jim Butcher" Subject: AeroElectric-List: Re: SD-8 on a Rotax 914 --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Jim Butcher" Kevin, You won't get much because the vacuum drive runs at 54% of engine rpm. Even the SD 20 only gives about 10A at 5000 rpm on the Rotax. On my Europa with 914 I copied Jim Nelson's install of the alternator driven off the rear of the crankshaft. It fits nicely inside the engine frame and produces over 40A. I can supply more details, photos and even parts if you wish. I understand that B&C is developing a similar setup. Another solution is the belt driven Rotax alternator. Flightcrafters did this on the Yellow Bird Europa. It involved a lot of rework of the cowl. Lastly, Flightcrafters has an alternator that mounts to the vacuum pad that puts out more than the SD8 or SD20. Check with Bob Berube for details. Jim Butcher Europa N241BW A185 Paint done, doing final engine install ________________________________ Message 4 _____________________________________ Time: 06:47:58 AM PST US From: Richard Dudley Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: wire labeling practices --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: Richard Dudley Hi Jay, I have followed the procedure that Bob Nuccolls wrote about. That is printing labels and covering them with clear shrink tubing. I used a couple of wrinkles that might be a slightly different. Since I use an ink jet printer, and knowing that the ink is water affected, I printed them on plain paper using the label program for a specific Avery label. Then took the paper to Kinko's and had them copy them onto Avery labels that I supplied. Their charge was the regular copying per page charge. I then peeled off the labels, cut out the pieces that I wanted to use, wrapped the label around the wire and shrunk clear shrink tubing that I bought from Aeroelectric (now, probably from B&S). By using a small point size font and repeating the text vertically, some text will show without having to specially orient the label. This worked well for me and was very easy to do. If some of this is a bit unclear, I' d be glad to try to re-explain any part. Regards and good luck, Richard Dudley -6A flying Jay Brinkmeyer wrote: >--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: Jay Brinkmeyer > >Can someone point me to a good source/example of wire labeling and >identification best practices? Are folks using fancy mil-spec labels, just >printing & heat shrinking them on, or something else??? > >Thanks in advance, >Jay > >P.S. This group is a much appreciated resource! > >===== > > > >__________________________________ > > > > ________________________________ Message 5 _____________________________________ Time: 07:55:02 AM PST US From: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: SD-8 on a Rotax 914 --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" At 06:40 AM 2/26/2005 -0800, you wrote: >--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: Kevin And Ann Klinefelter > > >Hi All > >I have a 914 which is dependent on electric fuel pumps. I am thinking of >putting an SD-8 on the empty vacume pump pad. Does anyone know what >output I might expect from the SD-8 in cruise, say 5200 rpm? Call B&C and find out. I think you're going to hear that the vacuum pump pad on the Rotax engines turns too slow for any practical output from B&C's pad mounted products. Their number is 316.283.8000 >Kevin >Europa nearing completion, no electrical plan started yet. Now is a VERY good time to get started! Bob . . . ________________________________ Message 6 _____________________________________ Time: 07:56:20 AM PST US From: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: aircraft wiring course slides --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" At 03:15 AM 2/26/2005 -0800, you wrote: >--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: Jay Brinkmeyer > > >My apologies if this is information is already widely distributed: > >I ran across this PowerPoint wiring course while surfing the net. While I >haven't read everything, the topic appears to be relevant to wiring best >practices... Some information appears to be restatement of information already >contained AC43-13. > >http://www.academy.jccbi.gov/airdl/wiringcourse/ This is the first I've heard of them. Thank you for the heads up. I've downloaded them and may add them to the CD rom of data we offer after I review them. Bob . . . ________________________________ Message 7 _____________________________________ Time: 07:59:59 AM PST US From: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Re: Battery cables --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" At 06:07 PM 2/25/2005 -0500, you wrote: >--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: Ken > >Mine are all parallel. It's neater and just as effective as twisting >AFAIK. Either way should cancel the magnetic effects. >The only ones I twisted were the AC feed from the PM alternator to make >sure they stayed close together when bundled. >Ken > >Angier & Gynna wrote: > > >--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: Angier & Gynna > > > >The battery is behind the co-pilot seat in my Lancair. When installing > the +/- cables going forward through the firewall, should these cables > have several twists or is it ok to simply run then parallel to eachother? Run them parallel for as far as practical . . . twisting is difficult, makes them look messy and has minimal benefits. Bob . . . ________________________________ Message 8 _____________________________________ Time: 08:00:47 AM PST US From: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" cables? Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: transponder antenna cable near other cables? --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" cables? At 08:35 PM 2/25/2005 +0100, you wrote: >--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: Mickey Coggins > > >Hi, > >The most convenient routing for my transponder antenna cable is >along with cables for my flap motor cables, autopilot servo >cables, and aileron trim cables. Does anyone know if this >might cause any problems with electrical interference? > >Thanks, >Mickey Very unlikely Bob . . . ________________________________ Message 9 _____________________________________ Time: 08:07:31 AM PST US From: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: crossfeed contactor --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" At 08:27 PM 2/24/2005 -0500, you wrote: >--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "John Schroeder" > > >Ron - > >If I read the Z-14 diagram correctly, the crossfeed coil is fed from both >sides thru the two diodes. Let me know if this is true. > >Thanks, > >John > > > If the crossfeed contactors coil is being powered from the side that is > > dead, it will not work. Does it make sense to power the coil to this > > contactor from both battery busses? > > John is correct. There are 3 diodes on a crosfeed contactor such that it can power from either bus and enjoy the benefits of spike suppression. See: http://www.aeroelectric.com/Pictures/S701-2.jpg Bob . . . ________________________________ Message 10 ____________________________________ Time: 08:10:07 AM PST US From: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" Subject: RE: AeroElectric-List: Re: Mixing Z13 and Z14 --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" At 04:44 PM 2/24/2005 -0500, you wrote: >--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "James E. Clark" > > >Ooopps. Didn't mean to imply anything about anyone but me. I was calling >**ME** overweight. :-) > >Second, I am NOT flying yet. > >I would *probably* fly with the cross-feed closed **IF** I confirm that this >does not cause a problem. The way I see it, my larger (B&C) alternator would >have a bit more load and its regulator would cause it to come online. It >would do the charging of both batteries. > >This will mean that all things will be able to get juice from all sources so >to speak. > >Otherwise, I will fly with it open and if "stuff goes dark", I throw the >cross-feed switch. > >It just seems so much cleaner from an operational standpoint. Maybe I am >kidding myself but I feel I then have twice the reliability (two potentially >independent systems) for keeping the lights on. Belt and suspenders so I >sweat less if I am ever IFR, at night, over the mountains, blah, blah :-) The idea for Z-14 is that one system can go completely dark and not affect the other system. If you're going to fly with the crossfeed closed, you might as well do something simpler like Z-12 where two alternators feed a common bus. This is the "upgrade" architecture for spam cans getting an SD-20 installation. Bob . . . ________________________________ Message 11 ____________________________________ Time: 08:20:46 AM PST US From: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" Subject: RE: AeroElectric-List: What is this device? --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" At 02:35 PM 2/23/2005 -0500, you wrote: >--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Michael D Crowe" > > >Hal, > >It is a capacitor. Used for noise filtering. > >Mike Crowe > >Subject: AeroElectric-List: What is this device? > >--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: Hal Kempthorne > > > >What the heck is this part? It is red, about half an inch square and about >1/16th thick plastic with two leads . > >Marked > >ERIE > >3.3 M > >100V > > >Found connect from power bus to ground. Most folks have correctly opined that it is a capacitor. Does disconnection of this device have any observable effects on system operation? I am skeptical of the intent for installing this kind of device right on the bus. I suspect that it's insurance against stampeding pink elephants. The only time I've found devices in this range useful is for reduction of noises detected by ADF and the occasional LORAN installations. Even then, the capacitor goes right on the offending device, not on the bus. If leaving it out produces no observable effects then I wouldn't bother to replace it. Bob . . . ________________________________ Message 12 ____________________________________ Time: 08:27:24 AM PST US From: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" Subject: RE: AeroElectric-List: Antenna / aerial questions --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" At 04:50 PM 2/22/2005 +1000, you wrote: >--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Kingsley Hurst" > > >Bob K wrote > > Check out the files you'll find at: > >http://www.aeroelectric.com/articles/Antennas > >Excellent help thank you Bob. >Will have to see if I can find Shoe Goo or equivalent over here. It's identical to a hobby adhesive sold as E6000 and dozens of other part numbers and brands. E6000 is handled by many hardware stores and at Hobby Lobby. Bob . . . ________________________________ Message 13 ____________________________________ Time: 08:34:33 AM PST US From: Mickey Coggins Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: transponder antenna cable near other cables? --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: Mickey Coggins >>The most convenient routing for my transponder antenna cable is >>along with cables for my flap motor cables, autopilot servo >>cables, and aileron trim cables. Does anyone know if this >>might cause any problems with electrical interference? > > > Very unlikely > > Bob . . . Cool - Bob's back! Thanks for the info, Bob. -- Mickey Coggins http://www.rv8.ch/ #82007 Wiring ________________________________ Message 14 ____________________________________ Time: 08:40:59 AM PST US From: "Ken Simmons" Subject: AeroElectric-List: Avionics wiring redo --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Ken Simmons" I'm trying to troubleshoot a whine in the headset audio. I bought the plane finished and it wasn't an issue until I started using a high quality stereo headset. I had already planned to replace the existing PM501 with a stereo intercom, possibly a Flightcom 403. The noise is present with everything off but the engine and intercom and changes with engine RPM. The plane does have electronic ignition on one side. I believe the problem is in how the avionics were wired. For some reason the builder passed power and audio signals through a terminal strip. I haven't completely traced it, but it looks like the grounds to the headset jacks originate from a common ground on the terminal strip, which all go back to a ground bus. I'm also going to install an auto pilot when I upgrade the intercom. Since I'll have to tap into the only comm/gps radio and replace the intercom it seems sensible to just redo the entire avionics wiring. Am I creating to much work for myself or does this seem a reasonable approach? Thanks. Ken ________________________________ Message 15 ____________________________________ Time: 09:15:26 AM PST US From: Robert McCallum Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Switch type --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: Robert McCallum Scott; One way to achieve what you want is to use a commonly available 2 pole on-on-on progressive transfer switch. You jumper terminal 1 to 5, connect your load to terminal 2, connect your primary supply to terminal 6, and your auxiliary supply to terminal 4. This, when installed key way up, gives you down = off, mid = primary, and up = aux. See http://www.aeroelectric.com/articles/Carling_Micro/Carling_Micro.pdf for how this switch works. Bob McC Scott Winn (Matronics List) wrote: >--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Scott Winn (Matronics List)" > >I have a switching application on my panel that selects between Off, >Primary and Aux. The switch I selected to perform the switching is a >2-1 type switch. The problem I am having is that everything else on my >panel is pointed down for the off positsion. The 2-1 switch has it's >off position in the middle which isn't what I want. I would really like >to be consistent with the operation of the switches on my panel so that >when something is turned Off, it is pointed down. I need a DP3T switch >to perform this task, but B & C doesn't carry one. It is also very >important to me to have identical size and feel of switches on the >panel, so I'd prefer to get a switch that exactly matches the size, >shape and operation of the B & C switches. Since I ordered a bunch of >switches from them, I Iooked up the manufacturer and it appears that >they do not manufacture a DP3T switch. Does anyone know of a DP3T >switch that has the same size bat toggle as the B&C switches? > >--Scott > > ________________________________ Message 16 ____________________________________ Time: 09:26:37 AM PST US From: Robert McCallum Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Switch type --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: Robert McCallum Scott; Sorry, I clicked sent a little too quickly. B&C does carry this switch. It is a 700-2-10 and is shown at $19.50 on their web site under switches here. http://www.bandc.biz/cgi-bin/ez-catalog/cat_display.cgi?11X358218#s700-2-10 Bob McC Robert McCallum wrote: >--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: Robert McCallum > >Scott; > >One way to achieve what you want is to use a commonly available 2 pole >on-on-on progressive transfer switch. You jumper terminal 1 to 5, >connect your load to terminal 2, connect your primary supply to terminal >6, and your auxiliary supply to terminal 4. This, when installed key way >up, gives you down = off, mid = primary, and up = aux. >See >http://www.aeroelectric.com/articles/Carling_Micro/Carling_Micro.pdf >for how this switch works. > >Bob McC > > ________________________________ Message 17 ____________________________________ Time: 09:46:03 AM PST US From: rv-9a-online Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Avionics wiring redo --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: rv-9a-online Sounds like you are on the right track. As for re-doing the avionics wiring, if I was a betting man, I'd gamble that you will. Once you start digging and deciphering some one else's wiring, you probably find it faster and more enjoyable to just start again. And I bet you'll add a few things to the panel as well. You know, once it's out... how about a moving map, satellite radio, microwave oven... Good luck. Anyone can pound rivets. Real men wire their own panels. :-). Vern Little Ken Simmons wrote: >--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Ken Simmons" > >I'm trying to troubleshoot a whine in the headset audio. I bought the plane finished and it wasn't an issue until I started using a high quality stereo headset. I had already planned to replace the existing PM501 with a stereo intercom, possibly a Flightcom 403. > >The noise is present with everything off but the engine and intercom and changes with engine RPM. The plane does have electronic ignition on one side. I believe the problem is in how the avionics were wired. For some reason the builder passed power and audio signals through a terminal strip. I haven't completely traced it, but it looks like the grounds to the headset jacks originate from a common ground on the terminal strip, which all go back to a ground bus. > >I'm also going to install an auto pilot when I upgrade the intercom. Since I'll have to tap into the only comm/gps radio and replace the intercom it seems sensible to just redo the entire avionics wiring. Am I creating to much work for myself or does this seem a reasonable approach? > >Thanks. >Ken > > > > > > > > > ________________________________ Message 18 ____________________________________ Time: 09:58:49 AM PST US From: rv-9a-online Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: wire labeling practices --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: rv-9a-online Has anyone had experience with the Rite-Zit labeller? Google Rite-Zit (unfortunate name) to see it. Apparently it wraps an adhesive label around the wire with a special tool. This allows labelling a wire after installation, and does not require heatshrink which can stiffen a wire or bind up when pulling. It's pretty cheap, too. If I hadn't finished my wiring already, I'd try one. Vern Little Richard Dudley wrote: >--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: Richard Dudley > >Hi Jay, >I have followed the procedure that Bob Nuccolls wrote about. That is >printing labels and covering them with clear shrink tubing. I used a >couple of wrinkles that might be a slightly different. Since I use an >ink jet printer, and knowing that the ink is water affected, I printed >them on plain paper using the label program for a specific Avery label. >Then took the paper to Kinko's and had them copy them onto Avery labels >that I supplied. Their charge was the regular copying per page charge. I >then peeled off the labels, cut out the pieces that I wanted to use, >wrapped the label around the wire and shrunk clear shrink tubing that I >bought from Aeroelectric (now, probably from B&S). By using a small >point size font and repeating the text vertically, some text will show >without having to specially orient the label. > >This worked well for me and was very easy to do. > >If some of this is a bit unclear, I' d be glad to try to re-explain any >part. > >Regards and good luck, > >Richard Dudley >-6A flying > >Jay Brinkmeyer wrote: > > > >>--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: Jay Brinkmeyer >> >>Can someone point me to a good source/example of wire labeling and >>identification best practices? Are folks using fancy mil-spec labels, just >>printing & heat shrinking them on, or something else??? >> >>Thanks in advance, >>Jay >> >>P.S. This group is a much appreciated resource! >> >>===== >> >> >> >>__________________________________ >> >> >> >> >> >> > > > > ________________________________ Message 19 ____________________________________ Time: 11:23:01 AM PST US From: "Scott Winn (Matronics List)" Subject: RE: AeroElectric-List: Switch type --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Scott Winn (Matronics List)" Robert, I saw that configuration in the AeroElectric connection. However, I need this functionality on a dual pole device. A 2-10 switch wired in this way functions as a one pole device. I just noticed that Bob mentions a 4 pole ON-ON-ON device, and it can be used as I described. I'm pretty sure B&C doesn't stock the four pole switch, but maybe they can order it for me. --Scott --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: Robert McCallum --> Scott; Sorry, I clicked sent a little too quickly. B&C does carry this switch. It is a 700-2-10 and is shown at $19.50 on their web site under switches here. http://www.bandc.biz/cgi-bin/ez-catalog/cat_display.cgi?11X358218#s700-2 -10 Bob McC Robert McCallum wrote: >--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: Robert McCallum >--> > >Scott; > >One way to achieve what you want is to use a commonly available 2 pole >on-on-on progressive transfer switch. You jumper terminal 1 to 5, >connect your load to terminal 2, connect your primary supply to terminal >6, and your auxiliary supply to terminal 4. This, when installed key way >up, gives you down = off, mid = primary, and up = aux. >See >http://www.aeroelectric.com/articles/Carling_Micro/Carling_Micro.pdf >for how this switch works. > >Bob McC > > ________________________________ Message 20 ____________________________________ Time: 01:37:38 PM PST US From: "Jeff Hildebrand" Subject: AeroElectric-List: JPI EDM-930 information --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Jeff Hildebrand" I would like to put a JPI EDM-930 engine monitor in our Lancair ES. I want to get the panel laser cut before we get the instrument, but I am having a lot of trouble with JPI getting the correct cutout information. They gave me a cutout drawing, but it is missing information on the button cutouts. Does anyone have an EDM-930 that they could get me some information on? I would appreciate and photo of the unit. Thanks, Jeff Hildebrand Lancair ES C-GSPH HYPERLINK "http://www.lancaires.com/"www.lancaires.com -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. ________________________________ Message 21 ____________________________________ Time: 04:34:04 PM PST US From: "Dennis Johnson" Subject: AeroElectric-List: Air Pressure "Squat" Switch --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Dennis Johnson" Lancair Kit Components sells an air pressure activated "squat" switch, although it's pretty pricey at $250. On the other hand, you can be relatively confident that it will be suited to your application. Here's the link: http://www.aerocraftparts.com/ItemForm.aspx?item710 Good luck, Dennis Johnson Lancair Legacy #257 ________________________________ Message 22 ____________________________________ Time: 05:13:56 PM PST US From: "James E. Clark" Subject: RE: AeroElectric-List: Re: Mixing Z13 and Z14 --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "James E. Clark" Thanks for the comment below Bob. Which means that I will NOW *probably* fly with the cross-feed "open". :-) James Seriously, I plan to assign things to the two independent systems in a manner such that if one dies totally, it is a non-event. That's what I like about it. {SNIP} | > | >I would *probably* fly with the cross-feed closed **IF** I confirm that | this | >does not cause a problem. The way I see it, my larger (B&C) alternator {SNIP} | > | >Otherwise, I will fly with it open and if "stuff goes dark", I throw the | >cross-feed switch. | > | >It just seems so much cleaner from an operational standpoint. Maybe I am | >kidding myself but I feel I then have twice the reliability (two | potentially | >independent systems) for keeping the lights on. Belt and suspenders so I | >sweat less if I am ever IFR, at night, over the mountains, blah, blah :- | ) | | | The idea for Z-14 is that one system can go completely dark | and not affect the other system. If you're going to fly with | the crossfeed closed, you might as well do something simpler | like Z-12 where two alternators feed a common bus. This is | the "upgrade" architecture for spam cans getting an SD-20 | installation. | | Bob . . . | ________________________________ Message 23 ____________________________________ Time: 06:28:06 PM PST US From: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Hi Bob, My alternator controller. --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" What kind of meter and what scale? There's no way that any failure other than something like lightning strike could "ground" all terminals . . . and even then, the values read at each toasted terminal would show some variability. I suspect your controller is fine and the instrument you're using is incapable of resolving the resistance characteristics of the individual pins. Bob . . . At 05:35 PM 2/21/2005 -0800, you wrote: >--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: cecilth@juno.com > > >I do the checking with a meter. >I touch the case and all 7 terminals and get a full needle deflection >at each terminal. The other probe is grounded to the airframe. >Cecil > > >On Mon, 21 Feb 2005 17:27:02 -0700 (MST) "Matt Prather" > writes: > > --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Matt Prather" > > > > > > Since Bob is out of town for a few days... > > > > I assume you are using a meter of some sort to determine that > > they are 'grounded.' > > > > I wouldn't be surprised if each of the inputs have a diode stack or > > similar structure connected as input polarity protection. Some > > terminals may have fairly large capacitors on them. Depending on > > what kind of meter you have and how you hook it up to each terminal, > > they may look nearly like they are shorted to ground. > > > > If you need an answer right away, you could probably contact one > > of the techies at B and C. They have been very responsive to my > > questions and requests in the past. > > > > Regards, > > > > Matt- > > > > > --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: cecilth@juno.com > > > > > > > > > Hi Bob, > > > My Alternator Controller ( from BNC) has never had volts hooked up > > to it > > > yet. > > > Its bolted to a grounded surface. I find all seven stations are > > then > > > grounded > > > with no wires hooked to it at all. Something smells in denmark. > > Whats > > > going on? > > > Bad Controller?? > > > Cecil Hatfield > > > > > > > > > > > > http://www.matronics.com/FAQ/AeroElectric-List.htm > > > > > > > > > > > > >-- >No virus found in this incoming message. >Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. >Version: 7.0.300 / Virus Database: 266.5.0 - Release Date: 2/25/2005 > > >-- incoming mail is certified Virus Free. >Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. >Version: 7.0.300 / Virus Database: 266 - Release Date: 2/25/2005 Bob . . . -------------------------------------------------------- < Throughout history, poverty is the normal condition > < of man. Advances which permit this norm to be > < exceeded -- here and there, now and then -- are the > < work of an extremely small minority, frequently > < despised, often condemned, and almost always opposed > < by all right-thinking people. Whenever this tiny > < minority is kept from creating, or (as sometimes > < happens) is driven out of a society, the people > < then slip back into abject poverty. > < > < This is known as "bad luck". > < -Lazarus Long- > <------------------------------------------------------> http://www.aeroelectric.com ________________________________ Message 24 ____________________________________ Time: 09:09:37 PM PST US From: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Ex Pilot Question --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" At 02:38 PM 2/22/2005 +0100, you wrote: >--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: Mickey Coggins > > >Hi Dean, > >Thanks for pointing this out. I've already wired my Trio Avionics >EZ Pilot servo, but didn't notice the recommendation to use shielded >wire on the PWM line. How the heck did I miss this? Anyway... > >One question for the experts - would it hurt to have all three >lines - ground, +14v, and the PWM be in the same shielded bundle? > >One concern I have is that the documentation says to ground both >ends of the shield. This seems to be in conflict with Bob's >teachings. Are autopilot servos different from strobes in this >regard? Conflicting in what way? I think I've always suggested that manufacturer's instructions should be followed to the letter first. Do the instructions say to separate the leadwires? If not then I would presume that it's okay to bundle them together like most system installations. I don't ever recall installation instructions for an appliance that recommended separation of certain kinds of wires for the purpose of reducing noise. Bob . . . ________________________________ Message 25 ____________________________________ Time: 09:11:58 PM PST US From: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Switch type --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" At 09:36 PM 2/25/2005 -0800, you wrote: >--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Scott Winn (Matronics List)" > > >I have a switching application on my panel that selects between Off, >Primary and Aux. Primary and Aux what? > The switch I selected to perform the switching is a >2-1 type switch. The problem I am having is that everything else on my >panel is pointed down for the off positsion. The 2-1 switch has it's >off position in the middle which isn't what I want. I would really like >to be consistent with the operation of the switches on my panel so that >when something is turned Off, it is pointed down. I need a DP3T switch >to perform this task, but B & C doesn't carry one. I'm not sure what you need is made. > It is also very >important to me to have identical size and feel of switches on the >panel, so I'd prefer to get a switch that exactly matches the size, >shape and operation of the B & C switches. Since I ordered a bunch of >switches from them, I Iooked up the manufacturer and it appears that >they do not manufacture a DP3T switch. Does anyone know of a DP3T >switch that has the same size bat toggle as the B&C switches? Need more input on your application. Bob . . . ________________________________ Message 26 ____________________________________ Time: 09:13:37 PM PST US From: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" pinout? Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Re: [Stinson] Genave marker receiver pinout? --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" pinout? Sorry, my data base doesn't cover this radio. Bob . . . At 09:01 PM 2/25/2005 -0600, you wrote: >--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "cgalley" > >http://www.aeroelectric.com/Installation_Data Bob Nuckolls has a data base >of radio pin-outs/ But it doesn't seem to be on the site. > >I am forwarding your request to the aeroelectric-list@matronics list > >Cy Galley >EAA Safety Programs Editor >Always looking for ideas and articles for EAA Sport Pilot > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: fixbritishcars > To: Stinson@yahoogroups.com > Sent: Friday, February 25, 2005 9:27 AM > Subject: [Stinson] Genave marker receiver pinout? > > > I an have a Genave Delta 300 marker beacon receiver that I want to > install in my Stinson. I have no diagram for it. Does anyone have the > pin out for this? If so please e-mail me, phone me 314-808-0281 or > fax inro to 573-237-3605. MANY THANKS > Andy > 8968K > > > ADVERTISEMENT > > > a.. To visit your group on the web, go to: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Stinson/ > > b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > Stinson-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > >-- >No virus found in this incoming message. >Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. >Version: 7.0.300 / Virus Database: 266.5.0 - Release Date: 2/25/2005 > > >-- incoming mail is certified Virus Free. >Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. >Version: 7.0.300 / Virus Database: 266 - Release Date: 2/25/2005 Bob . . . -------------------------------------------------------- < Throughout history, poverty is the normal condition > < of man. Advances which permit this norm to be > < exceeded -- here and there, now and then -- are the > < work of an extremely small minority, frequently > < despised, often condemned, and almost always opposed > < by all right-thinking people. Whenever this tiny > < minority is kept from creating, or (as sometimes > < happens) is driven out of a society, the people > < then slip back into abject poverty. > < > < This is known as "bad luck". > < -Lazarus Long- > <------------------------------------------------------> http://www.aeroelectric.com ________________________________ Message 27 ____________________________________ Time: 09:33:10 PM PST US From: "Scott Winn (Matronics List)" Subject: AeroElectric-List: EFIS Backup Battery --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Scott Winn (Matronics List)" The EFIS we are installing in our aircraft provides multiple power input terminals, and automatically selects the terminal with the highest voltage present to power the device. The primary power input is from our endurance bus. I'd like to utilize a small, 1.2AH sealed lead acid AGM battery to provide sufficient voltage to drive the EFIS during engine start when the main bus voltage will fall and cause the EFIS to reset. I would like this battery to be charged by the ships main bus, but not allow current to flow from this battery to the main bus. I can isolate the battery from the main bus with a diode, but I'm concerned that it won't get fully charged with the voltage drop across the diode. My second idea is to use a comparator circuit that drives a relay to connect the 1.2AH battery to the main bus when the bus voltage exceeds 13.0 volts, and disconnect it when it falls below this value. This would allow the small battery to receive a full charge when the alternator is charging, but disconnect it when the voltage falls below the charge current. Has anyone done something like this before? Is there a better/simpler way to provide suffient voltage to the EFIS during tartup than what I proposing? I thought about a capacitor, but I think it would have to be pretty large. The total EFIS current draw will be about 4 amps and I want the EFIS to continue to function even during extended cranking. --Scott ________________________________ Message 28 ____________________________________ Time: 09:49:52 PM PST US From: "Scott Winn (Matronics List)" Subject: AeroElectric-List: Master Alarm --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Scott Winn (Matronics List)" With all of the talk of Voice annunciation and forced landings, I'm looking for a warning system to put in my panel. I've seen a few of the high priced ones ($1500+) they cost too much. Before I go re-invent the wheel, I wanted to check here and see if anyone is aware of any low cost warning systems that provide functions such as: - Aural annunciation, warning tone or voice. - Flight mode aware (I.E. different warning configurations based on airspeed or something similar) - Configurable inputs (Not all inputs would produce audible warnings, some could be caution, etc...) - External outputs for visual annunciation to allow connection of my own LEDs/Light as desired. The ideal device would function in a manner similar to the transport class devices some have mentioned with an 'acknowledge' button to shut the warning up after it was noticed by the pilot. It would also cost somewhere around $100-$300 --Scott San Diego, CA ________________________________ Message 29 ____________________________________ Time: 11:01:06 PM PST US From: AI Nut Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: EFIS Backup Battery --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: AI Nut I think something from the RV (as in motorhomes, not airplane) world might be needed here. Look for a unit called 'battery isolator.' HTH, David Scott Winn (Matronics List) wrote: >--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Scott Winn (Matronics List)" > >The EFIS we are installing in our aircraft provides multiple power input >terminals, and automatically selects the terminal with the highest >voltage present to power the device. The primary power input is from >our endurance bus. I'd like to utilize a small, 1.2AH sealed lead acid >AGM battery to provide sufficient voltage to drive the EFIS during >engine start when the main bus voltage will fall and cause the EFIS to >reset. > >I would like this battery to be charged by the ships main bus, but not >allow current to flow from this battery to the main bus. I can isolate >the battery from the main bus with a diode, but I'm concerned that it >won't get fully charged with the voltage drop across the diode. > >My second idea is to use a comparator circuit that drives a relay to >connect the 1.2AH battery to the main bus when the bus voltage exceeds >13.0 volts, and disconnect it when it falls below this value. This >would allow the small battery to receive a full charge when the >alternator is charging, but disconnect it when the voltage falls below >the charge current. > >Has anyone done something like this before? Is there a better/simpler >way to provide suffient voltage to the EFIS during tartup than what I >proposing? I thought about a capacitor, but I think it would have to be >pretty large. The total EFIS current draw will be about 4 amps and I >want the EFIS to continue to function even during extended cranking. > >--Scott > > >. > > >