Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 05:08 AM - Re: Ex Pilot Question (Mickey Coggins)
2. 05:44 AM - Re: Fluke Meter (pengilly@southwest.com.au)
3. 05:48 AM - Re: wire labeling practices (Charlie Kuss)
4. 06:22 AM - Re: Fluke Meter (Robert L. Nuckolls, III)
5. 06:24 AM - Re: Wire ratings (Robert L. Nuckolls, III)
6. 06:27 AM - Re: Re: Avionics wiring redo (Robert L. Nuckolls, III)
7. 07:53 AM - Re: Ex Pilot Question (Robert L. Nuckolls, III)
8. 08:06 AM - Re: wire labeling practices (Terry Watson)
9. 08:17 AM - Re: wire labeling practices (Ken)
10. 08:40 AM - Instrument Panel Wiring (Guy Buchanan)
11. 09:02 AM - Re: Air pressure switch (Ken)
12. 09:17 AM - Re: Wire Labeling (Franz Fux)
13. 09:58 AM - Re: Instrument Panel Wiring (Rick)
14. 10:04 AM - Re: Wiring trace for headset? (Leo J. Corbalis)
15. 10:21 AM - Re: Instrument Panel Wiring (rv-9a-online)
16. 10:22 AM - Re: Instrument Panel Wiring (f1rocket@comcast.net)
17. 10:43 AM - MX-20 Alt flag (Stewart, Michael (ISS Atlanta))
18. 11:01 AM - Re: Instrument Panel Wiring (Stewart, Michael (ISS Atlanta))
19. 11:03 AM - Re: MX-20 Alt flag (Pat Hatch)
20. 12:15 PM - Re: wire labeling practices (Robert L. Nuckolls, III)
21. 12:30 PM - Re: wire labeling practices (Robert L. Nuckolls, III)
22. 12:31 PM - Re: Wire Labeling (Robert L. Nuckolls, III)
23. 01:24 PM - ADF Debug (Matt Prather)
24. 02:59 PM - ADF Debug (BobsV35B@aol.com)
25. 03:06 PM - Re: Wire Labeling (glaesers)
26. 03:47 PM - Re: Wire Labeling ()
27. 04:01 PM - Re: Wire Labeling (LRE2@aol.com)
28. 05:28 PM - Over Voltage Module/Relay (Troy Maynor)
29. 05:49 PM - Re: SD-8 on a Rotax 914 (Jan de Jong)
30. 05:59 PM - parallelling batteries (Jan de Jong)
31. 06:24 PM - Re: crossfeed contactor (glong2)
32. 06:26 PM - Re: Instrument Panel Wiring (Charlie Kuss)
33. 07:14 PM - Re: Fluke Meter (Phil Birkelbach)
34. 07:27 PM - Re: Fluke Meter ()
35. 07:37 PM - Re: Wire Labeling (Franz Fux)
36. 07:46 PM - Re: parallelling batteries (Robert L. Nuckolls, III)
37. 08:04 PM - Off the topic (Fergus Kyle)
38. 08:39 PM - Re: Over Voltage Module/Relay (Robert L. Nuckolls, III)
39. 08:40 PM - Re: Re: Wire Labeling (Robert L. Nuckolls, III)
40. 09:02 PM - Re: SD-8 on a Rotax 914 (Robert L. Nuckolls, III)
41. 09:33 PM - Re: Instrument Panel Wiring (Guy Buchanan)
42. 09:52 PM - Re: SD-8 on a Rotax 914 (D Wysong)
Message 1
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| Subject: | Re: Ex Pilot Question |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: Mickey Coggins <mick-matronics@rv8.ch>
>>One concern I have is that the documentation says to ground both
>>ends of the shield. This seems to be in conflict with Bob's
>>teachings. Are autopilot servos different from strobes in this
>>regard?
>
>
> Conflicting in what way? I think I've always suggested that
> manufacturer's instructions should be followed to the letter
> first.
You are right - bad choice of words on my part. Your explanation
about why you should ground only one side of a shield is pretty
clear and convincing. When the supplier of the servo says to
ground both ends, without any reason why, it makes me wonder if
they really have a reason, or they just don't know as much about
this stuff as you do.
--
Mickey Coggins
http://www.rv8.ch/
#82007 Wiring
Message 2
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--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: pengilly@southwest.com.au
Greg I have had a Fluke 75 for many years and have used it in my trade as
a E/I tech and you could not go wrong with this basic model, mine has
survived many a drop or wrong setting, thats what I love about Flukes if
you have the wrong setting it tells you so not like other meters which
tell you so by blowing up in your face.
I also have a Fluke 87 and they are the meter to buy if you are getting a
great deal on one, the extra features that they have really put them in a
class of their own.
I hope this helps you
Regards
Paul P
>
> I have the opportunity to buy a Fluke multimeter (any) at a substantial
> discount. Any recommendations on which model or features I need for
> building a RV-7?
>
> Thanks, Greg
>
>
Message 3
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| Subject: | Re: wire labeling practices |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: Charlie Kuss <chaztuna@adelphia.net>
>
> >Well someone has to enter a minority opinion here. I tried the clear
> >heat shrink and abandoned it. Trimming labels, rolling the little
> >devils, and squeezing heat shrink over them was slow and tedious and I
> >abandoned it.
>
> I print labels out in full sheets of Avery label material . . .
> stick the whole sheet down on a poly cutting board and then
> use an Xacto knife to cut out the labels.
snipped
Bob,
Do you have a product number for the Avery labels in question? I was in
Office Max yesterday. I nearly went blind, looking at the endless variety
of labels available.
Charlie Kuss
Message 4
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--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <b.nuckolls@cox.net>
At 09:50 PM 2/27/2005 -0800, you wrote:
>--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Greg Larson" <hanzonn@earthlink.net>
>
>Greetings,
>
>I have the opportunity to buy a Fluke multimeter (any) at a substantial
>discount. Any recommendations on which model or features I need for
>building a RV-7?
>
>Thanks, Greg
ANY product from Fluke in the way of a multimeter will suffice
to most of your measurement needs. So purchase based on what your
budget dictates. Keep in mind that while Fluke is the gold standard
for instruments in this class, accuracy of readings is so easy to
attain that the cheapest instruments (including on sale $5 instruments
from Harbor Freight) will produce satisfactory readings for your
tasks. The biggest difference between HF and Fluke will be ruggedness
and service life.
Bob . . .
Message 5
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| Subject: | Re: Wire ratings |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <b.nuckolls@cox.net>
At 10:18 PM 2/27/2005 -0500, you wrote:
>--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Richard E. Tasker"
><retasker@optonline.net>
>
>Bob:
>
>I was just browsing through the new stuff on aeroelectric.com and came
>across some conflicting data.
>
>The "Wire chart excerpted from chapter 8 of the 'Connection" shows lots
>of useful information but it shows the current ratings with a heading of
>"10C rise current". The entries are the same for the 35 C column in
>your "Wire Size Selection" paper where you list the ratings for both 10
>C rise and 35 C rise.
>
>I believe that the heading should be "35 C", not "10 C".
Correct. That's been marked up for correction the next time
I update the wiring chapter. Your note does suggest that we
might publish an errata page for older work to fill the gaps
between chapter updates. Thanks for bringing it up.
Bob . . .
Message 6
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| Subject: | Re: Avionics wiring redo |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <b.nuckolls@cox.net>
At 08:02 PM 2/27/2005 -0700, you wrote:
>--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Ken Simmons" <ken@truckstop.com>
>
>I found some if not all of my noise problem. I checked the wiring a little
>more carefully and discovered the mic and headset jacks are grounded to
>the airframe. I thought neither one of these should be grounded to the
>airframe, but a couple of intercom manuals I looked at indicate only the
>microphone ground should be isolated. The simple test I did seems to
>indicate the headphone jack does make a difference. I pulled it from it's
>mount and the small noise from the strobe system was gone. I didn't get a
>chance to fire up the engine today, but I'm confident most of that noise
>would be eliminated as well.
ALL grounds for avionics/audio should come to a SINGLE point in the
system. Rev 11 will introduce the idea of an avionics ground bus
located at or near the radio stack for the purpose of bringing
avionics and audio grounds together before carrying the whole
system off to the panel/firewall ground.
Bob . . .
Message 7
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| Subject: | Re: Ex Pilot Question |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <b.nuckolls@cox.net>
At 02:06 PM 2/28/2005 +0100, you wrote:
>--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: Mickey Coggins
><mick-matronics@rv8.ch>
>
> >>One concern I have is that the documentation says to ground both
> >>ends of the shield. This seems to be in conflict with Bob's
> >>teachings. Are autopilot servos different from strobes in this
> >>regard?
> >
> >
> > Conflicting in what way? I think I've always suggested that
> > manufacturer's instructions should be followed to the letter
> > first.
>
>You are right - bad choice of words on my part. Your explanation
>about why you should ground only one side of a shield is pretty
>clear and convincing. When the supplier of the servo says to
>ground both ends, without any reason why, it makes me wonder if
>they really have a reason, or they just don't know as much about
>this stuff as you do.
Grounding one end only is good practice for a lot
of reasons which may be set aside when other goals
are identified.
I have designed many systems where shielding is both
electro-static de-coupling (for noise) -AND- a current
pathway (for system operation). There are instances
where shielded wire is used for mechanical convenience
and has no noise reduction functionality. See:
http://aeroelectric.com/articles/lvwarn/Prep2B.jpg
http://aeroelectric.com/articles/lvwarn/Prep2C.jpg
It's okay to be skeptical of ANY usage of shielding
but skepticism is easy to mitigate when the
designer shares the thought processes that drove
the design. When the designer is not readily available
for good conversation, you're stuck with taking the
drawings at face value . . . assume there's a good
reason and wire per directions.
Bob . . .
Message 8
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| Subject: | wire labeling practices |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Terry Watson" <terry@tcwatson.com>
Charlie,
The ones I have been using are Avery #8165, White full sheet labels, Ink
Jet.
Terry
Bob,
Do you have a product number for the Avery labels in question? I was in
Office Max yesterday. I nearly went blind, looking at the endless variety
of labels available.
Charlie Kuss
Message 9
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| Subject: | Re: wire labeling practices |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: Ken <klehman@albedo.net>
>
>
> These labels will slide on the wire. I put them on the end to "find"
> the wire and slide it so that it's just at the terminal end when
> trimmed to fit.
>
>
I must have been away that day as I heat shrunk them tight and they
didn't slide. Never thought of trying to keep them loose.
> Bulk? Where were you using labels where more than 4-6 wires came
> together into a single component?
>
>
The EFI computers and the EIS4000 engine monitor accumulated hefty wire
bundles. I definitely have more wires than normal as I indicated but
computerized items with lots of wires and DB25 and DB37 connectors seem
to be proliferating. Even without avionics, I have at least seven
connectors behind the panel with an average of well over a dozen wires each.
Ken
Message 10
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| Subject: | Instrument Panel Wiring |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: Guy Buchanan <bnn@nethere.com>
All,
I'm beginning to wire my Kitfox panel. Would someone please offer
a good reference for physical wiring techniques? I'd like to address issues
like the following:
1. Should I put Molex or sub-D(?) connectors on all panel wires so I can
remove it easily? Or should I just plan on disconnecting wiring at the
instruments?
2. What wire color convention should I use?
3. What labelling convention should I use?
That's the idea.
Thanks,
Guy Buchanan
K-IV 1200 / 582 / 99% done, thanks to Bob Ducar.
Do not archive
Message 11
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| Subject: | Re: Air pressure switch |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: Ken <klehman@albedo.net>
Interesting find Larry
If I read the bottom of http://designflexswitches.com/designflex_psf103.htm
correctly the hysterisis (dead band) might be a bit much. 75% would work
for me but at 50% it would arm at say 100mph and trip the warning at
50mph which is a bit too much spread for my application.
The 102 series might be worth looking at.
Ken
Larry Ford wrote:
>--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Larry Ford" <psychden@sonic.net>
>
>Take a look at the World Magnetics Ultra Sensitive Pressure Switch # 9011-902.
Digikey # 384-1010-ND. It is adjustable between 0.1- 0.4 PSI which should provide
a range of 65- 160 kts. There is a deadband noted but not a value but it's
under $15 so two switches could be used with each set for a specific airspeed.
The device uses fast-on spade connectors with a NO and NC plus common. I'm
searching for a pressure switch NC with a 1/8" NPT, set point anywhere from
200- 500psi (proof pressure in excess of 1500 psi) that would warn of a low pressure/
gear not down and locked situation. In series with the above airspeed
sensor, one would have an even better landing gear alarm design as opposed to
just having power to the "down" circuit. Larry Ford, Glasair I RG N149LF, 270hrs
>
>
Message 12
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--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Franz Fux" <franz@lastfrontierheli.com>
I bought a small labeling machine for 30.- at Home Depot and use the
smallest tape available (6mm). The labels are just about the right size to
wrap around the wires, shrink tube over top and you have a very good looking
labeled wire. The advantage of this system is that it is portable, I can
print and label anytime in the garage and I don't need a printer or
computer, works great,
Franz
RV7A
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com]On Behalf Of
bakerocb@cox.net
Subject: AeroElectric-List: Wire Labeling
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: <bakerocb@cox.net>
AeroElectric-List message previously posted by: Jay Brinkmeyer
<jaybrinkmeyer@yahoo.com>
<<Can someone point me to a good source/example of wire labeling and
identification best practices? Are folks using fancy mil-spec labels, just
printing & heat shrinking them on, or something else??? Thanks in advance,
Jay>>
2/27/2005
Hello Jay, There are many different ways to skin this cat. Here is one of
the simplest and cheapest -- very durable.
1) Print labels on plain printer paper in small type (or to suit wire
diameter) with either Microsoft Word or Excel. You can copy and paste to
generate many dozens of labels on one sheet of paper.
2) Cut the labels off the sheet one at a time with a scissors as you need
them. Two line labels work best for me.
3) Crimp roll the cut off label a bit along their length around a round
toothpick or piece of wire.
4) Cut off a piece of clear shrink tube about a 1/4 -- 3/8 inch longer on
each end than the length of the label. Choose a size of shrink tube that
will squeeze down tight on the wire when heated.
5) Stuff the cut off and curled label into the shrink tube -- a straightened
out large size paper clip (or other poking tool) can be used to center the
label lengthwise in the piece of shrink tube.
(Actually I normally cut off the piece of shrink tube before I cut the label
off so that once I cut the label off the large paper sheet I can curl the
label and stuff it in the tube without ever setting the teeny label down).
6) Slide the shrink tube with the label curled inside into position on the
wire -- preferably before you crimp on the terminal unless you just want
practice in cutting off and replacing terminals.
7) Heat the shrink tube with a heat gun. Admire. Move on to the next label
needed. Pretty soon you realize that you can set up several labels and
shrink them all with one heating of the heat gun.
A tip: If you are using multiple wire connectors like AMP Mate-n-Lock or
similar, consider positioning the labels at different places along the
various wires so that you don't wind up with all the shrink tubes clumped
together.
'OC' Baker, Builder of KIS TR-1 #116 4/14/97 - 11/17/03
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Message 13
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| Subject: | Re: Instrument Panel Wiring |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: Rick <n701rr@yahoo.com>
This link sells a great DVD:
http://www.kolbpilot.com/HomebuiltHELP/wiring101.htm
Plus EAA sport offeres a great class in electrics and avionics.
Guy Buchanan <bnn@nethere.com> wrote:
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: Guy Buchanan
All,
I'm beginning to wire my Kitfox panel. Would someone please offer
a good reference for physical wiring techniques? I'd like to address issues
like the following:
1. Should I put Molex or sub-D(?) connectors on all panel wires so I can
remove it easily? Or should I just plan on disconnecting wiring at the
instruments?
2. What wire color convention should I use?
3. What labelling convention should I use?
That's the idea.
Thanks,
Guy Buchanan
K-IV 1200 / 582 / 99% done, thanks to Bob Ducar.
Do not archive
Rick
Orlando, FL
http://www.geocities.com/n701rr/index.html
Message 14
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| Subject: | Re: Wiring trace for headset? |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Leo J. Corbalis" <leocorbalis@sbcglobal.net>
You can get insulating washers for phone jacks so that the socket is not
grounded at the jack end.They are matched pairs, one flat and one with a
collar that centers inside the enlarged jack hole.
Leo Corbalis
----- Original Message -----
From: "Dr. Andrew Elliott" <a.s.elliott@cox.net>
Subject: AeroElectric-List: Wiring trace for headset?
> --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Dr. Andrew Elliott"
<a.s.elliott@cox.net>
>
> Gang:
>
> I have a headphone/mic jack pair installed in my plane in a location
> where it would be very hard to get a meter on the back side. Elsewhere
> in the panel, I have the ends of four wires that run to these jacks. I
> know that they must be audio signal, audio ground, mic audio and mic
> key. My question is: Using a multimeter and a headset with a
> push-to-talk button built in, can I determine which wire is which? If
> so, how?
>
> Thanks,
> Andy Elliott
> N481HY/AA-1(TD,160)/KFFZ
> That's "One Hot Yankee"
> http://members.cox.net/n481hy/
>
>
Message 15
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| Subject: | Re: Instrument Panel Wiring |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: rv-9a-online <rv-9a-online@telus.net>
Gary, the following link has good info
http://www.academy.jccbi.gov/airdl/wiringcourse/
As for wiring color, my experience is that it's hard to keep a color code working
as you run out of wire or make changes. So everything ends up being white.
White is an easier color to buy as well. Then, you just use your labels to
identify wires.
For connectors, I've used several techniques:
1) Fast ons directly to the back of my switches.
2) D-Sub for low current signals (audio, autopilot servo, engine sensors etc)
3) Molex/Amp plugs/receptacles for higher currents/fatter wires or when I need
just a couple of pins connected.
As for wire labelling convention, my experience is don't be too clever. My designations
were letter, number such as:
A15, V1, L23
The letter had some significance, but it really does not matter. What matters
is that each wire has a unique identifier and that your schematic has it called
out. 5 years from now, you need to identify a wire, just look on the schematic.
I designed a removable panel for my RV-9A. A complete editable schematic, plus
special wiring adapters to allow panel disconnect using D-sub connectors are
shown.
http://www3.telus.net/aviation/vx
Thanks, Vern Little RV-9A
Guy Buchanan wrote:
>--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: Guy Buchanan <bnn@nethere.com>
>
>All,
> I'm beginning to wire my Kitfox panel. Would someone please offer
>a good reference for physical wiring techniques? I'd like to address issues
>like the following:
>
>1. Should I put Molex or sub-D(?) connectors on all panel wires so I can
>remove it easily? Or should I just plan on disconnecting wiring at the
>instruments?
>
>2. What wire color convention should I use?
>
>3. What labelling convention should I use?
>
> That's the idea.
>
>Thanks,
>
>
>Guy Buchanan
>K-IV 1200 / 582 / 99% done, thanks to Bob Ducar.
>
>Do not archive
>
>
>
>
Message 16
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| Subject: | Re: Instrument Panel Wiring |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: f1rocket@comcast.net
> 1. Should I put Molex or sub-D(?) connectors on all panel wires so I can
> remove it easily? Or should I just plan on disconnecting wiring at the
> instruments?
You can put connectors on everything but I wouldn't unless you see a burning need
to pull your entire panel all the time. Generally speaking, the more connectors,
the more potential points of failure in your system. I strive for one
continious wire from device to device where possible. Some instruments like electric
gyros, EFIS units, etc come with a connector so you don't have to do much
else.
> 2. What wire color convention should I use?
I use all Tefzel white wire. With the proper wiring diagram, I easily know where
each wire starts and where it ends. If you must use color, I'd stick with
red for power and black for ground and then make up the rest to suite your fancy.
>
> 3. What labelling convention should I use?
Again, I don't think any is necessary outside of labeling the ground blocks so
I know which device terminates on which specific terminal of the ground block.
I've found that helpful in tracking down problems. Other than that, I've never
really seen the need to get fancy. However, I have a full set of CAD drawn
wiring diagrams for every circuit in my airplane. With that and a continuity
tester, I can trace any wire in the airframe.
You can really do anything you want. It's a matter of trading off convenience
for the extra work and extra risk. Many folks do none of these and many folks
do all of these. Your call.
Randy
F1 Rocket
www.pflanzer-aviation.com
1. Should I put Molex or sub-D(?) connectors on all panel wires so I can
remove it easily? Or should I just plan on disconnecting wiring at the
instruments?
You can put connectors on everything but I wouldn't unless you see a burning need
to pull your entire panel all the time. Generally speaking, the more connectors,
the more potential points of failure in your system. I strive for one continious
wire from device to device where possible. Some instruments like electric
gyros, EFIS units, etc come with a connector so you don't have to do much
else.
2. What wire color convention should I use?
I use all Tefzel white wire. With the proper wiring diagram, I easily know where
each wire starts and where it ends. If you must use color, I'd stick with red
for power and black for ground and then make up the rest to suite your fancy.
3. What labelling convention should I use?
Again, I don't think any is necessary outside of labeling the ground blocks so
I know which device terminates on which specific terminal of the ground block.
I've found that helpful in tracking down problems. Other than that, I've never
really seen the need to get fancy. However, I have a full set of CAD drawn wiring
diagrams for every circuit in my airplane. With that and a continuity tester,
I can trace any wire in the airframe.
You can really do anything you want. It's a matter of trading off convenience for
the extra work and extra risk. Many folks do none of these and many folks do
all of these. Your call.
Randy
F1 Rocket
www.pflanzer-aviation.com
Message 17
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--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Stewart, Michael (ISS Atlanta)" <mstewart@iss.net>
Hey you MX20 guru's..
I have an MX20 wired to a 330 wired to a 430 ARINC interface. In my
basement, with 430 headin to a waypoint, the MX20 does not have altitude
on the display and keeps an ALT flag up.
I have pushed the alt button on the 330 since it does not go into this
mode by default until is gets gps movement.
Since the MX20 map is working and the waypoint data is there, I know it
is talking to the 330. Any reason why altitude is not there? The 330 is
showing FL 009 from the encoder so I know that is working. Would it not
send altitude data if the gps data had zero ground speed from the 430?
The MX20 manual does not tell me squat, only that you would get the flag
if it looses alt info. But if the ARINC datastream IS getting to the
unit, and it clearly is, then why would the altitude not be there?
Thanks for you help
Mike
Do not archive
Message 18
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| Subject: | Instrument Panel Wiring |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Stewart, Michael (ISS Atlanta)" <mstewart@iss.net>
Randy's advice is real real good.
I chose Molex for their cost and convenience. My 6 has a ton, and so
does my 8. They are so cheap and easy to use. I crimp and solder and
have only had one failure which was on a pin on a molex on my pax stick.
There was a lot of movement on the connector and the wire broke at the
pin at 1100hrs. I should not have put the connector there in the
movement area.
I am very religious about their use. I have every molex identified and
logged and the pinouts(a list of every pin and connector) stay on the
web, or the plane, so I always have access to them no matter where I am.
On labeling, I am also a nutcase, with little labels on EVERY wire at
their termination and some enroute if it is near an access panel or
something. Looks good and sure does make troubleshooting a breeze. I
label and heat shrink every wire. It is very tedious for sure. But.. I
like doing it, I like the results, and I almost look fwd to
troubleshooting cause I have made it so easy on myself. I have helped
enough builders who have not done this to know that I will not get
caught not knowing exactly what each wire is supposed to be doing. Now
what is actually does might be a different story:)
On my 6, every damn wire is white and is a pain to wire trace. On the 8
I used colored wire and it has helped a lot just to keep me straight
during the wiring process. I used:
Blk for grounds
Red for hots
Yellow for signals
Blue for lighting
The colored wire is readily available now and so it makes sense to do
this for me.
I also have drawings for every circuit in my plane, and I keep them on
the web in case I get stuck somewhere with a problem.
Mike
S8 Cowl...ARGH!
Do not archive
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of
f1rocket@comcast.net
Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Instrument Panel Wiring
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: f1rocket@comcast.net
> 1. Should I put Molex or sub-D(?) connectors on all panel wires so I
can
> remove it easily? Or should I just plan on disconnecting wiring at the
> instruments?
You can put connectors on everything but I wouldn't unless you see a
burning need to pull your entire panel all the time. Generally
speaking, the more connectors, the more potential points of failure in
your system. I strive for one continious wire from device to device
where possible. Some instruments like electric gyros, EFIS units, etc
come with a connector so you don't have to do much else.
> 2. What wire color convention should I use?
I use all Tefzel white wire. With the proper wiring diagram, I easily
know where each wire starts and where it ends. If you must use color,
I'd stick with red for power and black for ground and then make up the
rest to suite your fancy.
>
> 3. What labelling convention should I use?
Again, I don't think any is necessary outside of labeling the ground
blocks so I know which device terminates on which specific terminal of
the ground block. I've found that helpful in tracking down problems.
Other than that, I've never really seen the need to get fancy. However,
I have a full set of CAD drawn wiring diagrams for every circuit in my
airplane. With that and a continuity tester, I can trace any wire in
the airframe.
You can really do anything you want. It's a matter of trading off
convenience for the extra work and extra risk. Many folks do none of
these and many folks do all of these. Your call.
Randy
F1 Rocket
www.pflanzer-aviation.com
1. Should I put Molex or sub-D(?) connectors on all panel wires so I
can
remove it easily? Or should I just plan on disconnecting wiring at the
instruments?
You can put connectors on everything but I wouldn't unless you see a
burning need to pull your entire panel all the time. Generally speaking,
the more connectors, the more potential points of failure in your
system. I strive for one continious wire from device to device where
possible. Some instruments like electric gyros, EFIS units, etc come
with a connector so you don't have to do much else.
2. What wire color convention should I use?
I use all Tefzel white wire. With the proper wiring diagram, I easily
know where each wire starts and where it ends. If you must use color,
I'd stick with red for power and black for ground and then make up the
rest to suite your fancy.
3. What labelling convention should I use?
Again, I don't think any is necessary outside of labeling the ground
blocks so I know which device terminates on which specific terminal of
the ground block. I've found that helpful in tracking down problems.
Other than that, I've never really seen the need to get fancy. However,
I have a full set of CAD drawn wiring diagrams for every circuit in my
airplane. With that and a continuity tester, I can trace any wire in the
airframe.
You can really do anything you want. It's a matter of trading off
convenience for the extra work and extra risk. Many folks do none of
these and many folks do all of these. Your call.
Randy
F1 Rocket
www.pflanzer-aviation.com
Message 19
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--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Pat Hatch" <pat_hatch@msn.com>
Mike,
When this happened to me, it turned out to be that I had not turned ON the
port for this. It's buried in the install manual somewhere...make sure the
serial ports are turned on.
Pat Hatch
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Stewart,
Michael (ISS Atlanta)
Subject: AeroElectric-List: MX-20 Alt flag
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Stewart, Michael (ISS Atlanta)"
<mstewart@iss.net>
Hey you MX20 guru's..
I have an MX20 wired to a 330 wired to a 430 ARINC interface. In my
basement, with 430 headin to a waypoint, the MX20 does not have altitude
on the display and keeps an ALT flag up.
I have pushed the alt button on the 330 since it does not go into this
mode by default until is gets gps movement.
Since the MX20 map is working and the waypoint data is there, I know it
is talking to the 330. Any reason why altitude is not there? The 330 is
showing FL 009 from the encoder so I know that is working. Would it not
send altitude data if the gps data had zero ground speed from the 430?
The MX20 manual does not tell me squat, only that you would get the flag
if it looses alt info. But if the ARINC datastream IS getting to the
unit, and it clearly is, then why would the altitude not be there?
Thanks for you help
Mike
Do not archive
Message 20
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| Subject: | Re: wire labeling practices |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <b.nuckolls@cox.net>
At 11:19 AM 2/28/2005 -0500, you wrote:
>--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: Ken <klehman@albedo.net>
>
> >
> >
> > These labels will slide on the wire. I put them on the end to "find"
> > the wire and slide it so that it's just at the terminal end when
> > trimmed to fit.
> >
> >
>I must have been away that day as I heat shrunk them tight and they
>didn't slide. Never thought of trying to keep them loose.
I've never had them be tight. They'll have some "stiction" for
the first time you move them but after that, they slide nicely.
> > Bulk? Where were you using labels where more than 4-6 wires came
> > together into a single component?
> >
> >
>The EFI computers and the EIS4000 engine monitor accumulated hefty wire
>bundles. I definitely have more wires than normal as I indicated but
>computerized items with lots of wires and DB25 and DB37 connectors seem
>to be proliferating. Even without avionics, I have at least seven
>connectors behind the panel with an average of well over a dozen wires each.
Understand . . . this brings up another recommendation for
wiring labels:
The BIG advantage of wire labels is to reduce probability of
errors when replacing the component (switch, relay, etc) to
which wires attach. These devices seldom have more than 6
wires going to them. Connectors are seldom (if ever) replaced
on a working airplane. I wouldn't label these wires for
maintenance but for assembly where pieces of masking tape
work really well.
Fabrication labels and maintenance labels can be entirely
different critters. I built a harness a couple of days ago
and used the following technique:
http://www.aeroelectric.com/articles/Wire_Labels
You can find plastic tape at most hardware stores.
Harbor Freight offers white vinyl tape in 2" widths
for very low cost.
Ken is right. The shrink-over-sticker labels would be
very difficult to deal with where a fat bundle of wires
comes into a multi-pin connector.
Bob . . .
Message 21
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| Subject: | wire labeling practices |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <b.nuckolls@cox.net>
I use Avery 5165 full sheets for laser printers. This brings up
another point I had not considered for the original suggestion.
Inkjet printer ink may run under your sweaty fingers or later
when the labels get wet under the shrink.
You can buy Laserjet 5L or 6L printers dirt cheap off ebay.
I keep several around here for "spares". If one craps, I toss it.
The last one I bought was about $40+shipping. I put a $9 feeder mod kit
in it and use locally charged cartridges (which can be salvaged
from a crapped printer). I've put a handle on one so that I can
drag it around with my Tektronix 'scope and dump screens directly
to paper.
They're HP hardware and as robust as any printer in the wild. Used
ones have given very good value. Wouldn't consider any other
machine until these get too hard to find.
Bob . . .
P.S. this exchange reminded me that my last trek to the field
with a "portable" 6L got rained on. It's making lots of noise now.
Just ordered another 6L off Ebay for $55 including shipping.
Message 22
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--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <b.nuckolls@cox.net>
At 09:16 AM 2/28/2005 -0800, you wrote:
>--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Franz Fux"
><franz@lastfrontierheli.com>
>
>I bought a small labeling machine for 30.- at Home Depot and use the
>smallest tape available (6mm). The labels are just about the right size to
>wrap around the wires, shrink tube over top and you have a very good looking
>labeled wire. The advantage of this system is that it is portable, I can
>print and label anytime in the garage and I don't need a printer or
>computer, works great,
Franz, what department sells these? I'd like to go get one
to play with. Can you advise as to brand and perhaps model
number?
Bob . . .
Message 23
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--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Matt Prather" <mprather@spro.net>
I bought a C150 to do some instrument training in. Everything is okay
except the little Narco ADF is lazy. Sometimes it works and points to
the station, and sometimes it doesn't. I have played with all of the
controls
and haven't been able to find any way to make it work better. It doesn't
seem to matter how close I am to the ground station. I have tried tuning
in a couple of different transmitters - an NDB and a compass locator, (I
think). I can select the BFO and get a solid tone, and I can also hear the
station identifier relatively clearly - no noticeable ignition noise.
Anyone have experience debugging this kind of behavior? Do the symptoms
tell me anything about the problem?
If the ADF is trash, I can get a KR87 and indicator from barnstormers for
about $1000 or an overhauled unit from Vista for $1300. Another option
is to bag the ADF altogether and get an IFR cert GPS. Not sure how
much that will run me, but I am guessing about 2x the price for a used
unit. The nice thing about the GPS is that the airplane doesn't have a DME,
and I think a certified GPS can perform those functions. Is that correct?
I know, I know, you can't tune talk radio with a GPS.
Any ideas?
Regards,
Matt-
VE N34RD, C150 N714BK
Message 24
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--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: BobsV35B@aol.com
In a message dated 2/28/2005 3:24:52 P.M. Central Standard Time,
mprather@spro.net writes:
The nice thing about the GPS is that the airplane doesn't have a DME,
and I think a certified GPS can perform those functions. Is that correct?
I know, I know, you can't tune talk radio with a GPS.
Good Afternoon Matt,
Here I can be of some help!
For flight within the United States National Airspace System, any IFR
approved GPS can be used in lieu of all ADF and DME functions except to execute
an
ADF approach.
The GPS does not have to be an approach approved set to use it for this
function. Enroute and terminal approval is adequate.
If the approach plate has the words "ADF Required" or "DME Required", the
GPS may be used in lieu of that requirement.
There are two or three pages within the AIM that explain all of the where's
and why's of this function, but, since I was involved in getting this
interpretation from the FAA published in the AIM, I would be happy to s discuss
any
of the fine points involved.
For what it is worth, I feel that the KR-87 is the best ADF that I have ever
used. Too bad it wasn't developed until the days when we hardly need it!
Once again, any questions concerning the allowed uses of an IFR approved GPS
in lieu of ADF and DME are more than welcomed.
Happy Skies,
Old Bob
AKA
Bob Siegfried
Ancient Aviator
Stearman N3977A
Brookeridge Airpark LL22
Downers Grove, IL 60516
630 985-8502
Message 25
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| Subject: | RE: Wire Labeling |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "glaesers" <glaesers@wideopenwest.com>
My schoolteacher wife got a "Dymo Letra Tag 2000" at Target last year for
about $30. It is a handheld unit that runs on 6 AA batteries. It prints
both horizontal and vertical, has different fonts and you can get a variety
of colors and sizes of tape . It will make a wonderful wire labeler.
Dennis Glaeser
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III"
<b.nuckolls@cox.net>
At 09:16 AM 2/28/2005 -0800, you wrote:
>--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Franz Fux"
><franz@lastfrontierheli.com>
>
>I bought a small labeling machine for 30.- at Home Depot and use the
>smallest tape available (6mm). The labels are just about the right size to
>wrap around the wires, shrink tube over top and you have a very good
looking
>labeled wire. The advantage of this system is that it is portable, I can
>print and label anytime in the garage and I don't need a printer or
>computer, works great,
Franz, what department sells these? I'd like to go get one
to play with. Can you advise as to brand and perhaps model
number?
Bob . . .
Message 26
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--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: <chaztuna@adelphia.net>
> >I bought a small labeling machine for 30.- at Home Depot and use the
> >smallest tape available (6mm). The labels are just about the right size to
> >wrap around the wires, shrink tube over top and you have a very good looking
> >labeled wire. The advantage of this system is that it is portable, I can
> >print and label anytime in the garage and I don't need a printer or
> >computer, works great,
>
>
> Franz, what department sells these? I'd like to go get one
> to play with. Can you advise as to brand and perhaps model
> number?
>
> Bob . . .
Bob,
I was in my local Office Max on Sunday. I noticed that they had several label
making machine (various manufacturers) priced from $30 to $100. You might want
to stop by your local Office Max store.
Charlie Kuss
Message 27
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| Subject: | Re: Wire Labeling |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: LRE2@aol.com
Bob, I have used a portable Casio KL-7000 E-Z label printer ( from Office
Depot for about $50) for labeling. It can accomidate 6mm or 9mm tapes in various
color combinations. Tapes available from Casio on line. I've used black on
white for hot lines, gold on green for ground lines, black on red for
ignition...etc. LRE
Message 28
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| Subject: | Over Voltage Module/Relay |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Troy Maynor" <wingnut54@charter.net>
I posted these questions on the website then when I found out Bob had gone
out of town I posted it on the forum. Still in holding pattern....
Bob,
I want to install an OVM14. I have a Rotax 912S. On the Z-7 diagram it shows
an overvoltage relay that, in the description of OVM14, should be used with
an alternator having an internal regulator. (See quote below). However the
Z-7 diagram shows both an EXTERNAL regulator AND the OV disconnect relay. In
addition, your parts catalog does not show a overvoltage relay available.
Where can I get one, at an auto parts store? One other thing, I have LEDs
already installed in my panel as warning lights, including the alternator
fail light. Will this work in place of the Alt. lamp shown on Z-7?
Thanks.
Troy Maynor
N120EU Europa Monowheel Classic
Left to finish:
Paint,interior,engine install, wiring.
Quotes from website concerning overvoltage modules for 14 volt systems.
"for additional commentary on the matter . . . However over voltage
protection may be added alternators with built-in regulators by
incorporating an external contactor and a crowbar O.V. module"
.<http://www.aeroelectric.com/articles/bleadov.pdf>
Message 29
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| Subject: | Re: SD-8 on a Rotax 914 |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: Jan de Jong <jan.de.jong@xs4all.nl>
As an interested party I once made a graph from data on B&C's website:
3000 RPM 0.2 A
3500 RPM 1.7 A
4000 RPM 3.1 A
4500 RPM 4.4 A
5000 RPM 5.6 A
5500 RPM 6.8 A
6000 RPM 7.9 A
With http://www.rotec.com/manuals.htm , the 914 operating manual, I get
55% 4300 RPM 3.9 A
65% 4800 RPM 5.2 A
75% 5000 RPM 5.6 A
100% 5500 RPM 6.8 A
115% 5800 RPM 7.5 A
Also, according to the installation manual, manifold pressure is between
1000 and 1200 hPa and fuel pressure is kept 250 hPa above that.
Atmosferic pressure at sea level is about 1000 hPa. So a fuel pump has
to supply at a pressure difference of 250 to 450 hPa at sea level.
At 16000 ft (4800 m) atmosferic pressure is about 550 hPa and the fuel
pump supplies at 700 to 900 hPa.
There is a graph showing a fuel pump taking about 2.0 A for 300 hPa,
increasing to 2.5 A for 900 hPa.and 3.0 A for 1250 hPa.
So a fuel pump takes between 2.0 and 2.5 A mostly depending on altitude
(and two fuel pumps in series probably between 4.0 and 4.5 A).
Net of the running of one fuel pump the SD-8 would seem to have about
1.5 to 3 spare amps to help the endurance of the endurance bus and/or
keep a second battery charged.
For VFR-only this seems nice enough although not ideal (= redundant
infinite endurance supplying all consumers).
Jan de Jong
Europa 461
Message 30
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| Subject: | parallelling batteries |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: Jan de Jong <jan.de.jong@xs4all.nl>
"There are no differences in condition (state of charge, size, age,
temperature, rate of charge/discharge) that would make one 6-cell
lead-acid battery take charge from another 6-cell lead-acid battery when
they are connected in parallel."
I would like to know to what extent this statement is true?
Jan de Jong
Message 31
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| Subject: | crossfeed contactor |
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
4d6c55494dc5e95509eca19c797dcc0d3dfce52d01495cf59d18f528d8185cdda96dbd6d817588c83859c8616859889171a57c393d35a83d5c388ca1c5eca109ccec8c552538a998c961b5d9d1c1d95d2d21798d21654c8d2d0c29c9918c9c4d098969e9cca1c52cec2519792905b9cd28b931f52805adbc1900b12129bd01f9e1e1
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "glong2" <glong2@netzero.net>
Ron:
I have my crossover relay powered with two diodes, one from each bus. I
have, during construction, run each of my batteries down and the crossover
relay is activated when just one battery/bus has power. I then use a power
supply connected to the alternator B+ terminal to charge both batteries.
Eugene Long
Lancair Super ES
glong2@netzero.net
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com]On Behalf Of Ron
Raby
Subject: AeroElectric-List: crossfeed contactor
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Ron Raby"
<ronr@advanceddesign.com>
To Everyone
If the crossfeed contactors coil is being powered from the side that is
dead, it will not work. Does it make sense to power the coil to this
contactor from both battery busses?
Regards
Ron Raby
Message 32
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| Subject: | Instrument Panel Wiring |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: Charlie Kuss <chaztuna@adelphia.net>
Mike
I like your ideas. Keeping the schematics on the web is brilliant!
Charlie Kuss
>--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Stewart, Michael (ISS Atlanta)"
><mstewart@iss.net>
>
>Randy's advice is real real good.
>
>I chose Molex for their cost and convenience. My 6 has a ton, and so
>does my 8. They are so cheap and easy to use. I crimp and solder and
>have only had one failure which was on a pin on a molex on my pax stick.
>There was a lot of movement on the connector and the wire broke at the
>pin at 1100hrs. I should not have put the connector there in the
>movement area.
>I am very religious about their use. I have every molex identified and
>logged and the pinouts(a list of every pin and connector) stay on the
>web, or the plane, so I always have access to them no matter where I am.
>
>On labeling, I am also a nutcase, with little labels on EVERY wire at
>their termination and some enroute if it is near an access panel or
>something. Looks good and sure does make troubleshooting a breeze. I
>label and heat shrink every wire. It is very tedious for sure. But.. I
>like doing it, I like the results, and I almost look fwd to
>troubleshooting cause I have made it so easy on myself. I have helped
>enough builders who have not done this to know that I will not get
>caught not knowing exactly what each wire is supposed to be doing. Now
>what is actually does might be a different story:)
>
>On my 6, every damn wire is white and is a pain to wire trace. On the 8
>I used colored wire and it has helped a lot just to keep me straight
>during the wiring process. I used:
>Blk for grounds
>Red for hots
>Yellow for signals
>Blue for lighting
>
>The colored wire is readily available now and so it makes sense to do
>this for me.
>
>I also have drawings for every circuit in my plane, and I keep them on
>the web in case I get stuck somewhere with a problem.
>
>Mike
>S8 Cowl...ARGH!
>Do not archive
>
>
>-----Original Message-----
>From: owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com
>[mailto:owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of
>f1rocket@comcast.net
>To: aeroelectric-list@matronics.com
>Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Instrument Panel Wiring
>
>--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: f1rocket@comcast.net
>
> > 1. Should I put Molex or sub-D(?) connectors on all panel wires so I
>can
> > remove it easily? Or should I just plan on disconnecting wiring at the
>
> > instruments?
>
>You can put connectors on everything but I wouldn't unless you see a
>burning need to pull your entire panel all the time. Generally
>speaking, the more connectors, the more potential points of failure in
>your system. I strive for one continious wire from device to device
>where possible. Some instruments like electric gyros, EFIS units, etc
>come with a connector so you don't have to do much else.
>
> > 2. What wire color convention should I use?
>
>I use all Tefzel white wire. With the proper wiring diagram, I easily
>know where each wire starts and where it ends. If you must use color,
>I'd stick with red for power and black for ground and then make up the
>rest to suite your fancy.
> >
> > 3. What labelling convention should I use?
>
>Again, I don't think any is necessary outside of labeling the ground
>blocks so I know which device terminates on which specific terminal of
>the ground block. I've found that helpful in tracking down problems.
>Other than that, I've never really seen the need to get fancy. However,
>I have a full set of CAD drawn wiring diagrams for every circuit in my
>airplane. With that and a continuity tester, I can trace any wire in
>the airframe.
>
>You can really do anything you want. It's a matter of trading off
>convenience for the extra work and extra risk. Many folks do none of
>these and many folks do all of these. Your call.
>
>Randy
>F1 Rocket
>www.pflanzer-aviation.com
>
> 1. Should I put Molex or sub-D(?) connectors on all panel wires so I
>can
> remove it easily? Or should I just plan on disconnecting wiring at the
> instruments?
>
>You can put connectors on everything but I wouldn't unless you see a
>burning need to pull your entire panel all the time. Generally speaking,
>the more connectors, the more potential points of failure in your
>system. I strive for one continious wire from device to device where
>possible. Some instruments like electric gyros, EFIS units, etc come
>with a connector so you don't have to do much else.
>
> 2. What wire color convention should I use?
>
>I use all Tefzel white wire. With the proper wiring diagram, I easily
>know where each wire starts and where it ends. If you must use color,
>I'd stick with red for power and black for ground and then make up the
>rest to suite your fancy.
>
> 3. What labelling convention should I use?
>
>Again, I don't think any is necessary outside of labeling the ground
>blocks so I know which device terminates on which specific terminal of
>the ground block. I've found that helpful in tracking down problems.
>Other than that, I've never really seen the need to get fancy. However,
>I have a full set of CAD drawn wiring diagrams for every circuit in my
>airplane. With that and a continuity tester, I can trace any wire in the
>airframe.
>
>You can really do anything you want. It's a matter of trading off
>convenience for the extra work and extra risk. Many folks do none of
>these and many folks do all of these. Your call.
>
>Randy
>F1 Rocket
>www.pflanzer-aviation.com
>
>
Message 33
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--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: Phil Birkelbach <phil@petrasoft.net>
The 87 is a great meter. It can check caps and diodes it has min and
max hold with averages and the thing is bulletproof. Mine got hosed
with hydraulic fluid once and it ate batteries for a while but
eventually it started working right. You can kick 'em, dunk 'em, drop
'em and they just keep on working.
Can you get me a 787 at a substantial discount? :-)
You'll be happy with just about any fluke, they are great meters.
Godspeed,
Phil
On Feb 27, 2005, at 23:50, Greg Larson wrote:
> --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Greg Larson"
> <hanzonn@earthlink.net>
>
> Greetings,
>
> I have the opportunity to buy a Fluke multimeter (any) at a substantial
> discount. Any recommendations on which model or features I need for
> building a RV-7?
>
> Thanks, Greg
>
>
Message 34
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--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: <kcorr@charter.net>
You can't beat a Fluke meter. I have a 179 that does most anything that a person
needs. It has the usual volts, amps, and resistance. Plus it has diode, capacitance,
frequency, temperature, milivolt, miliamp and probably a few others
I can't remember. Also, get the silicone test leads that will accept different
probes. You can get probes that are the traditional points plus several styles
of clamps. Fluke has a good website with all of the features and accessories.
Good luck.
Kent orr
>
> From: "Greg Larson" <hanzonn@earthlink.net>
> Date: 2005/02/28 Mon AM 05:50:12 GMT
> To: <aeroelectric-list@matronics.com>
> Subject: AeroElectric-List: Fluke Meter
>
>
Message 35
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--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Franz Fux" <franz@lastfrontierheli.com>
Bob,
I will check ones I am back at home in about a week and will let you know
the model,
Franz
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com]On Behalf Of
chaztuna@adelphia.net
Subject: RE: AeroElectric-List: Wire Labeling
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: <chaztuna@adelphia.net>
> >I bought a small labeling machine for 30.- at Home Depot and use the
> >smallest tape available (6mm). The labels are just about the right size
to
> >wrap around the wires, shrink tube over top and you have a very good
looking
> >labeled wire. The advantage of this system is that it is portable, I can
> >print and label anytime in the garage and I don't need a printer or
> >computer, works great,
>
>
> Franz, what department sells these? I'd like to go get one
> to play with. Can you advise as to brand and perhaps model
> number?
>
> Bob . . .
Bob,
I was in my local Office Max on Sunday. I noticed that they had several
label making machine (various manufacturers) priced from $30 to $100. You
might want to stop by your local Office Max store.
Charlie Kuss
--
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Message 36
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| Subject: | Re: parallelling batteries |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <b.nuckolls@cox.net>
At 03:05 AM 3/1/2005 +0100, you wrote:
>--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: Jan de Jong <jan.de.jong@xs4all.nl>
>
>"There are no differences in condition (state of charge, size, age,
>temperature, rate of charge/discharge) that would make one 6-cell
>lead-acid battery take charge from another 6-cell lead-acid battery when
>they are connected in parallel."
>I would like to know to what extent this statement is true?
Not very. A 100% fully charged battery at room temperature
has a terminal voltage just under 13.0 volts . . . usually
about 12.8
It takes 13.8 to 14.6 volts to convince a battery that it
should accept sufficient energy to bring it up to full charge.
If you connect a fully discharged battery across a fully charged
battery, you will measure a short duration of current flowing
into the discharged battery but it dies down in a few seconds.
If allowed to run to a stable condition, the "charged" battery
will have transferred less than 1% of it's energy to the
"discharged" battery.
It is practical to run batteries in parallel for
charging and discharging even if they're different sizes
and at different points in their service lives. Each battery
will accept only what it's capable of holding and deliver
back only the energy it contains.
The cautions circulating in the wild about paralleling
batteries are not founded in physics or experience.
The way we use paralleled batteries is to run them paralleled
only in the charge mode (normal alternator operations) and
separate them into separate duties within seconds of alternator
failure as indicated by ACTIVE notification of low voltage.
This operation IS founded in physics and practical experience
in aircraft.
Bob . . .
Message 37
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--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Fergus Kyle" <VE3LVO@rac.ca>
I had permission to send this message.....................
Good day,
During and after the Battle of Britain, which older folk will
remember is the turning point in the air [mainly] for the defence of
Britain, and thus of Hitler's attempt to eradicate the western world, one of
the many airfields is North Weald, just NE of London.
Of the over 800 airfields and air harbours used in WW II, this
field was extensively used by fighter aircraft (including my RCAF Squadron
401) in the defence of London and the mauling of the Luftwaffe bomber force.
Unsuccessful in the destruction of Brit airfields, Goering sent bombers to
the city centres - never thinking it would rebound on Germany one
thousandfold.
Following WW II, North Weald gradually became a mecca for
wartime aircraft and a popular centre for Fighter airshows. Having the
opportunity to visit Uk during these events brought back the recollection of
desparate days which saved the war. It showed the brilliance and dedication
of ordinary men and women to protect our way of life and stave off the
bestiality of the Hitler regime - and displayed a myriad of forgotten
aircraft types - a magnificent day........... and just at the end of the
London Underground with a short walk to the field.
The usual politicos in regional Britain want to scrap this
memorial ground to jam in 6,000 houses in accordance with a major plan to
re-organise and fill in a precious part of the country - and to Hell with
history. No doubt streets will be named after them. What they don't realise
is that the names could be Adolph Schickelgruber or Hermann Goering were it
not for North Weald.
Since many of the fields are now given over to mills, firms and
houses, only a few truly memorable ones remain and NW is one of these. If
you are a vet of those days, or visitted NW for one of its brilliant
airshows, I urge you to contact the defenders at:
http://www.northwealdevents.com/ and add your words to the growing
defence of this place. Too soon we regret the bottom-line urgency of burying
history for the art of concrete and gain.
The last great war saved us all - let's fight to preserve the
thought!
Ferg Kyle
Message 38
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| Subject: | Re: Over Voltage Module/Relay |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <b.nuckolls@cox.net>
At 08:19 PM 2/28/2005 -0500, you wrote:
>--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Troy Maynor" <wingnut54@charter.net>
>
>
>I posted these questions on the website then when I found out Bob had gone
>out of town I posted it on the forum. Still in holding pattern....
>
>Bob,
>
>I want to install an OVM14. I have a Rotax 912S. On the Z-7 diagram it shows
>an overvoltage relay that, in the description of OVM14, should be used with
>an alternator having an internal regulator. (See quote below).
The OVM-14 is a generic ov protection device suited for
use in ANY alternator system when incorporated as suggested
in the various Z-figures . . .
> However the
>Z-7 diagram shows both an EXTERNAL regulator AND the OV disconnect relay. In
>addition, your parts catalog does not show a overvoltage relay available.
The latest diagram replacing Z-7 is Z-16 Revision K which will
be published in an upcoming Rev 11 to the AeroElectric Connection.
You can get a sneak preview copy at:
http://www.aeroelectric.com/PPS/Architecture/Zfigs_K_3.pdf
>Where can I get one, at an auto parts store?
The B&C catalog at:
http://www.bandc.biz/cgi-bin/ez-catalog/cat_display.cgi?11X358218#s700-2-3
lists an S704-1 relay (about 3/4 way down the page) which is the same
one called out on Z-7/Z-16. If you choose to go with the latest
Z-16 configuration, the ALT WARN light is replaced with ACTIVE
notification of LOW VOLTS. This means that you can use a single
pole, single throw version of the S704-1 . . . These can be had
from Radio Shack p/n 275-226
> One other thing, I have LEDs
>already installed in my panel as warning lights, including the alternator
>fail light. Will this work in place of the Alt. lamp shown on Z-7?
Yes . . . in fact, if you purchase or duplicate the LV Warning
module described at:
http://aeroelectric.com/articles/lvwarn/LVWarn-ABMM.html
and
http://aeroelectric.com/articles/lvwarn/9021-620.pdf
you can perhaps use your existing LED to satisfy this
functionality. However, I would caution you that the LED
should be EASY to see, high intensity LED with no series
resistor . . . the LV warn module has the necessary
resistor built in.
Bob . . .
Message 39
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| Subject: | Re: RE: Wire Labeling |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <b.nuckolls@cox.net>
At 06:03 PM 2/28/2005 -0500, you wrote:
>--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "glaesers"
><glaesers@wideopenwest.com>
>
>My schoolteacher wife got a "Dymo Letra Tag 2000" at Target last year for
>about $30. It is a handheld unit that runs on 6 AA batteries. It prints
>both horizontal and vertical, has different fonts and you can get a variety
>of colors and sizes of tape . It will make a wonderful wire labeler.
I have one of these. It's a thermal printer. The whole label
turns black under the heatshrink. Besides, the smallest font
it generates is too big for anything but largest wires.
Bob . . .
Message 40
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| Subject: | Re: SD-8 on a Rotax 914 |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <b.nuckolls@cox.net>
>As an interested party I once made a graph from data on B&C's website:
>3000 RPM 0.2 A
>3500 RPM 1.7 A
>4000 RPM 3.1 A
>4500 RPM 4.4 A
>5000 RPM 5.6 A
>5500 RPM 6.8 A
>6000 RPM 7.9 A
<snip>
The Rotax standard alternator is permanent magnet. VERY robust.
The weakest link in Rotax's electrical system is their piece of
@#$@# regulator. There are more robust products out there. Further,
one might craft a dual regulator system to back up the standard
regulator. Putting an SD-8 on the Rotax vacuum pump drive is a
VERY marginal proposition.
Bob . . .
Message 41
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| Subject: | Instrument Panel Wiring |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: Guy Buchanan <bnn@nethere.com>
At 02:00 PM 2/28/2005 -0500, you wrote:
>--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Stewart, Michael (ISS Atlanta)"
><mstewart@iss.net>
>
>Randy's advice is real real good.
>
>I chose Molex for their cost and convenience. My 6 has a ton, and so
>...
>I also have drawings for every circuit in my plane, and I keep them on
>the web in case I get stuck somewhere with a problem.
>
>Mike
>S8 Cowl...ARGH!
>Do not archive
Thanks everyone for all the good advice. Coupled with the wire labeling
thread I'm off to a good start. I've got AC 43.13 so I'll review that
first. Since I'm a simple Kitfox I think I'll minimize connectors but wire
the panel so I can lay it out without disconnecting any wiring. (I'll have
to disconnect the throttle and primer, though.)
Thanks again,
Guy Buchanan
K-IV 1200 / 582 / 99% done, thanks to Bob Ducar.
Do not archive
Message 42
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| Subject: | Re: SD-8 on a Rotax 914 |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: D Wysong <hdwysong@gmail.com>
... how do you REALLY feel about that Rotax 914 Ducati regulator, Bob? ;-)
What are the preferred part numbers for replacing the "piece of @#$@#"
914 regulator?
Thanks!
D
----------------
Robert L. Nuckolls, III wrote:
> --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <b.nuckolls@cox.net>
>
>
>>As an interested party I once made a graph from data on B&C's website:
>>3000 RPM 0.2 A
>>3500 RPM 1.7 A
>>4000 RPM 3.1 A
>>4500 RPM 4.4 A
>>5000 RPM 5.6 A
>>5500 RPM 6.8 A
>>6000 RPM 7.9 A
>
>
>
> <snip>
>
> The Rotax standard alternator is permanent magnet. VERY robust.
> The weakest link in Rotax's electrical system is their piece of
> @#$@# regulator. There are more robust products out there. Further,
> one might craft a dual regulator system to back up the standard
> regulator. Putting an SD-8 on the Rotax vacuum pump drive is a
> VERY marginal proposition.
>
> Bob . . .
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
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