---------------------------------------------------------- AeroElectric-List Digest Archive --- Total Messages Posted Sat 10/08/05: 48 ---------------------------------------------------------- Today's Message Index: ---------------------- 1. 04:26 AM - Really Dead Concorde RG Battery (MikeEasley@aol.com) 2. 05:09 AM - Re: Alternator Noise (LarryRobertHelming) 3. 05:41 AM - Re: Really Dead Concorde RG Battery (LarryRobertHelming) 4. 06:15 AM - IR alternator (Franz Fux) 5. 07:51 AM - Re: IR alternator (Robert L. Nuckolls, III) 6. 07:51 AM - Re: Really Dead Concorde RG Battery (Robert L. Nuckolls, III) 7. 07:55 AM - Re: Off the topic - Buss (Robert L. Nuckolls, III) 8. 08:01 AM - Re: Alternator Noise (Robert L. Nuckolls, III) 9. 08:06 AM - Re: Alternator Noise (Robert L. Nuckolls, III) 10. 08:50 AM - In honor of the "Repeatable Experiment". (Robert L. Nuckolls, III) 11. 10:34 AM - Re: Firewall penetration (Eric M. Jones) 12. 12:47 PM - Re: Off the topic - pronunciations & (Dave Morris \) 13. 02:48 PM - Check out Jeff's F1 Rocket Page (RV4WGH@aol.com) 14. 02:54 PM - LINKS - Jeff's F1 Rocket Page (RV4WGH@aol.com) 15. 02:54 PM - Fw: Check out ACME Mapper @ N 36.391337 W 105.27891, 8 m/p (RV4WGH@aol.com) 16. 02:54 PM - Fw: A MAN AND HIS GRASS-ROOTS SPACE SHIP (RV4WGH@aol.com) 17. 02:54 PM - Check out http://www.avweb.com/newspics/scaceshiponearrival1.jpg (RV4WGH@aol.com) 18. 02:55 PM - Fw: GARMIN 396 - Aviation Consumer (RV4WGH@aol.com) 19. 02:55 PM - Fw: Check out RV Operating Instructions and Checklists (RV4WGH@aol.com) 20. 02:55 PM - Fw: Check out SuperCub.org :: View topic - A real pilot? (RV4WGH@aol.com) 21. 02:55 PM - Fw: LYCOMING DIGEST NO. 802 (RV4WGH@aol.com) 22. 02:56 PM - (RV4WGH@aol.com) 23. 02:56 PM - Fw: Check out Kevin Horton's RV-8 Project - Instrument Panel Labels - Silk S... (RV4WGH@aol.com) 24. 02:56 PM - Fw: Check out Mark & Dave's RV-7 (RV4WGH@aol.com) 25. 02:56 PM - Fw: Check out Niborex, Inc. - Home Page (RV4WGH@aol.com) 26. 02:56 PM - Fw: Finalists - ART VIA SIMULATORS (RV4WGH@aol.com) 27. 02:56 PM - Fw: Check out Experimental Panel Builder (RV4WGH@aol.com) 28. 02:56 PM - Fw: Check out Builder Ideas (RV4WGH@aol.com) 29. 02:56 PM - Fw: *** Team Rocket Aircraft Online Catalog Order *** (RV4WGH@aol.com) 30. 02:56 PM - Fw: Check out Classic Aero Designs (RV4WGH@aol.com) 31. 02:57 PM - Check out Destination Direct Flight Planning Software (RV4WGH@aol.com) 32. 02:57 PM - Check out Taking the "Search" Out of "Search-and-Rescue" (RV4WGH@aol.com) 33. 02:57 PM - Check out Survival Tech Aviation Survival Kit (RV4WGH@aol.com) 34. 02:57 PM - Check out Survival Tech Aviation Survival Kit (RV4WGH@aol.com) 35. 02:57 PM - Fw: Check out Ohio Valley RVators (RV4WGH@aol.com) 36. 02:58 PM - Check out EZ-Trim Altitude Hold Home Page (RV4WGH@aol.com) 37. 02:59 PM - VAN'S NEW REAR SEAT VENT (RV4WGH@aol.com) 38. 04:35 PM - Re: LINKS - Jeff's F1 Rocket Page (Richard Riley) 39. 04:40 PM - Re: Re: Firewall penetration (George Braly) 40. 04:51 PM - Re: Check out Jeff's F1 Rocket Page (Robert L. Nuckolls, III) 41. 04:57 PM - EMAILS SENT IN ERROR (RV4WGH@AOL.com) 42. 05:06 PM - Re: LINKS - Jeff's F1 Rocket Page (Robert L. Nuckolls, III) 43. 06:04 PM - New comic book on circuit breaker issues (Robert L. Nuckolls, III) 44. 06:04 PM - Re: Re: Firewall penetration (Rick Lindstrom) 45. 06:07 PM - Re: Re: Firewall penetration (Robert L. Nuckolls, III) 46. 07:46 PM - Re: Positronic removal with hammer (CardinalNSB@aol.com) 47. 08:46 PM - Re: Re: Firewall penetration (George Braly) 48. 08:46 PM - Re: Re: Firewall penetration (George Braly) ________________________________ Message 1 _____________________________________ Time: 04:26:08 AM PST US From: MikeEasley@aol.com Subject: AeroElectric-List: Really Dead Concorde RG Battery --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: MikeEasley@aol.com My aircraft has been down for paint and interior for about 8 months. I went to charge my two 25ah RG batteries, one did fine, the other was so dead it wouldn't even take a charge. I must have left a small overhead lamp on and ran it all the way down to zero. I'm getting less than 1/10 volt. My car charger is the automatic type. Can I resurrect my battery? Mike Easley Lancair ES Colorado Springs ________________________________ Message 2 _____________________________________ Time: 05:09:48 AM PST US From: "LarryRobertHelming" Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Alternator Noise --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "LarryRobertHelming" I had some noise develop with my alternator that could be heard in the headsets. The whine would change with rpm speed. Not real bad noise but I could hear it and it was not there before. Then after a couple of hours of flying time with the noise, the alternator died. After replacing it with like kind (rebuilt from AutoZone) I did an autopsy. It showed signs of being very hot. Also two of the three screws that hold the two halves together had somehow become less than tight. You might check that. The brushes looked fine. I am not sure what actually died in it to cause it to fail. It turned smoothly. Mine was/is an externally regulated 77 Honda Civic 35amp. I am supplying more cooling air to the back of the replacement. I got 62 hours of service out of the failed one. Indiana Larry in Evansville, RV7 Tip Up SunSeeker ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jim Pack" Subject: AeroElectric-List: Alternator Noise > --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Jim Pack" > > I've got some pretty heavy Radio noise that I've traced to my Alternator. > I cut the alternator and - Quite. > > Any suggestions on where to look? It's a B&C 60 amp. > > - Jim > > > ________________________________ Message 3 _____________________________________ Time: 05:41:01 AM PST US From: "LarryRobertHelming" Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Really Dead Concorde RG Battery --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "LarryRobertHelming" Do you fly at night? You don't say how old the battery is. But why work with a battery that might not take a charge even if you get it over this hump?? You could replace the bad one and make a policy of swapping out the oldest one every year so you know you have at least one new, reliable battery in the plane. Have you read Bob's recommendation on batteries? Indiana Larry in Evansville, RV7 Tip Up SunSeeker ----- Original Message ----- From: Subject: AeroElectric-List: Really Dead Concorde RG Battery > --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: MikeEasley@aol.com > > My aircraft has been down for paint and interior for about 8 months. I > went > to charge my two 25ah RG batteries, one did fine, the other was so dead > it > wouldn't even take a charge. I must have left a small overhead lamp on > and > ran it all the way down to zero. I'm getting less than 1/10 volt. My > car > charger is the automatic type. Can I resurrect my battery? > > Mike Easley > Lancair ES > Colorado Springs > > > ________________________________ Message 4 _____________________________________ Time: 06:15:16 AM PST US From: "Franz Fux" Subject: AeroElectric-List: IR alternator --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Franz Fux" Hi group, I have an internally regulated 60v alternator from Vans as supplied in the firewall foreward kit. I have wired it according to Bob's drawing Z11 with the additional protection according to his drawing, using the contactor(S701-1) he suggested. It is a prewired contactor that has a small wire from the battery side to the smaller post where also the one side of the diode terminates. Each time I turn on the battery this wire burns through. I have checked all connections and they are according to Bob's drawings. I am wondering if anybody could help me safe this puzzle and may know what could be causing this short. Thanks in advance Franz Fux C-FUXI reserved ---- -- ________________________________ Message 5 _____________________________________ Time: 07:51:39 AM PST US From: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: IR alternator --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" At 06:14 AM 10/8/2005 -0700, you wrote: >--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Franz Fux" > > >Hi group, >I have an internally regulated 60v alternator from Vans as supplied in the >firewall foreward kit. I have wired it according to Bob's drawing Z11 with >the additional protection according to his drawing, using the >contactor(S701-1) he suggested. It is a prewired contactor that has a small >wire from the battery side to the smaller post where also the one side of >the diode terminates. Each time I turn on the battery this wire burns >through. I have checked all connections and they are according to Bob's >drawings. I am wondering if anybody could help me safe this puzzle and may >know what could be causing this short. The contactor you purchased had certain features pre-installed for the device to serve as a BATTERY contactor. If you study the z-figures for battery contactor wiring, you'll see that a wire between one of the fat terminals (battery side) connects to an adjacent small terminal. This wire is not shown in the old Z-24 depiction of a b-lead contactor. You need to remove this jumper for use as a b-lead contactor. Be aware that while Figure Z-24 (and documents describing installation of B&C over voltage protection products) increase risk for damage to an alternator if the alternator is switched off under load. The system you've installed WILL fulfill its intended purpose for absolute control of alternator combined with over-voltage protection. Just be aware that the alternator should not be switched off until after the engine stops except in cases of system malfunction where the alternator must be shut off due to OV condition -or- other reasons (like smoke in cockpit) where it's more important to get things electric shut down than it is to worry about hazards to the alternator. Studies are under way to devise an alternative to Z-24 so as to reduce if not eliminate risks to the alternator . . . in the mean time, you're on solid ground to proceed with an awareness of risks and operating procedures in place to mitigate those risks. Bob . . . ________________________________ Message 6 _____________________________________ Time: 07:51:41 AM PST US From: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Really Dead Concorde RG Battery --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" At 07:24 AM 10/8/2005 -0400, you wrote: >--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: MikeEasley@aol.com > >My aircraft has been down for paint and interior for about 8 months. I went >to charge my two 25ah RG batteries, one did fine, the other was so dead it >wouldn't even take a charge. I must have left a small overhead lamp on and >ran it all the way down to zero. I'm getting less than 1/10 volt. My car >charger is the automatic type. Can I resurrect my battery? Probably not. In fact I'll say no. This has been much too long a period of time for a battery to set in a discharged condition. Bob . . . ________________________________ Message 7 _____________________________________ Time: 07:55:22 AM PST US From: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Off the topic - Buss --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" At 01:13 PM 10/7/2005 -0400, you wrote: >--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "John Schroeder" > > >DO NOT ARCHIVE > >Ferg - > >You are entirely correct. Google is great but not for getting correct >spellings. No flames from me :-)) An always-hot link on my browser is to http://m-w.com . . . a very useful on-line resource. Bob . . . ________________________________ Message 8 _____________________________________ Time: 08:01:44 AM PST US From: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Alternator Noise --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" At 11:06 PM 10/7/2005 -0600, you wrote: >--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Jim Pack" > >I've got some pretty heavy Radio noise that I've traced to my >Alternator. I cut the alternator and - Quite. > >Any suggestions on where to look? It's a B&C 60 amp. > >- Jim Have you reviewed chapter 16? There are a number of possible cause/effect scenarios that could be operating here. You need to investigate them and have results of those investigations in-hand when you toss the problem into the group. Has the noise always been there? What kind of ground system are you using? Have you done the independent battery tests to determine the pathway by which the noise is getting into your headsets? Have you opened signal pathways and/or adjusted volume controls to deduce what part of your system is the real victim? Are your microphone and headset jacks insulated from airframe? It's answers to these questions that will be necessary for you or anyone else to deduce a plan of attack for eliminating the noise. Bob . . . ________________________________ Message 9 _____________________________________ Time: 08:06:32 AM PST US From: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Alternator Noise --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" At 07:09 AM 10/8/2005 -0500, you wrote: >--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "LarryRobertHelming" > > >I had some noise develop with my alternator that could be heard in the >headsets. The whine would change with rpm speed. Not real bad noise but I >could hear it and it was not there before. Then after a couple of hours of >flying time with the noise, the alternator died. After replacing it with >like kind (rebuilt from AutoZone) I did an autopsy. It showed signs of >being very hot. Also two of the three screws that hold the two halves >together had somehow become less than tight. You might check that. The >brushes looked fine. I am not sure what actually died in it to cause it to >fail. It turned smoothly. Mine was/is an externally regulated 77 Honda >Civic 35amp. > >I am supplying more cooling air to the back of the replacement. I got 62 >hours of service out of the failed one. What got hot? Wires? I suspect one or more shorted diodes . . . which MAY be linked to inadequate cooling. Is there anything about your installation that is unique compared with other aircraft? I can tell you that the average alternator installation on an OBAM aircraft would probably not pass the part 23 cooling test for hot day, Vy climb at max load. However, given that nobody operates their airplane this way, 99.9% of what might be called "inadequate" installations perform just fine. If you still have the dead machine, I'd be pleased to dissect it in more detail. In the mean time, more cooling never hurts but without real data (thermocouples in the windings) you can never be 100% sure that you've fixed anything. Bob . . . ________________________________ Message 10 ____________________________________ Time: 08:50:00 AM PST US From: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" Subject: AeroElectric-List: In honor of the "Repeatable Experiment". --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" I've often used the term "repeatable experiment" much to the consternation and derision of some here on the list so it seems appropriate to take two lessons from the planned investigations into alternator performance and operating characteristics under abnormal conditions. I just received a shiny new ND alternator from one of the participants in this activity. Thank you Mr. Coggins! I'll endeavor to please you with a useful return on your investment. I've been talking with the folks who own the big variable speed drive and they're quite willing to give me access to it. However, after studying the brackets needed to mount a small, belt driven alternator on it and then constrict my study to time when they're open (my normal work hours) the time-to-first-test-results seems like it will be greater than if I were to build my own drive stand tailored to the task. I have a 2 hp DC motor and variable speed drive controller for it. My father-in-law is going to craft a fixture to hold the motor and alternator. In the mean time, I've shifted discussions with my old employer about trading some gray-matter time for an old environmental chamber they've relegated to the mod shop and are using as an oven for curing epoxies. This was the first chamber we ever owned and I was the first to operate the thing after it was purchased in 1976 for about $1200. If I can refurbish this ol' dog into operating condition, I'll end up with a tool that will allow me to test from -55C to +70C to explore temperature related issues with small articles that will fit in the chamber (it's about 1 cubic foot in volume). So, we're moving ahead with both tools and test articles to explore the burning questions we have about alternator performance and system integration. We're also crafting a series of experiments to be conducted with these tools and materials for the purpose of gathering data. Data will permit a deduction and crafting of activities that enable integration of these alternators into our aircraft with confidence and understanding. I'll start a series of pages on the website that will chronicle the experiment(s) in detail. The goals are (1) to arrive at useful conclusions about the topic under investigation (alternators) AND (2) to demonstrate and illustrate what is meant by "repeatable experiment". There will be no detail of the activity purposefully concealed or ignored. All questions about the process will be forthrightly addressed; all constructive critical review welcomed. My intention is to provide sufficient details on the whole process so that anyone who chooses may repeat the experiment to the end that data acquired and deductions crafted are VALIDATED by others. I'll suggest that repeatable experiments are the most powerful tools in science wherein activities carried in the lab by ONE ultimately become activities carried out in the shop by MANY; the EXPERIMENT morphs from an exploration ideas to a PROCESS by which the MANY will derive benefits of performance and confidence in soundness of design. This should be fun. To my way of thinking, this is what engineering is all about. Bob . . . ________________________________ Message 11 ____________________________________ Time: 10:34:45 AM PST US From: "Eric M. Jones" Subject: AeroElectric-List: Re: Firewall penetration --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Eric M. Jones" --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Mark Cochran" >Eric, >I couldn't find any data about the Exitair smoke hood's capabilities to >protect against carbon monoxide. The Exitair may be an adequate device to >use for escape if you're already on the deck. A better choice to carry in >the cockpit may be a hood that does filter CO, such as the Evac-U8. >Combined >with an in-flight CO detector, a CO-filtering hood could provide the >necessary time to land the aircraft from altitude if CO is detected, or >there is smoke or a fire. Yes, the Evac-U8 and similar are more expensive >and take up more space, but.... Mark, I didn't think the CO problem went much much beyond detectors. In the even of CO in the cabin, close the heat (and forward air vents), get outside air. I'd hate to have to land an airplane in one of those hoods. >Would be very interested to know more about firewall alternatives, can you >point us in the right direction? Mark Cochran There is no prescription like the stainless steel sheet mentioned by the FAA advisory circular AC20-135. The FAA says you can do it some other way but must prove it. The test is not hard, but you should probably get the buy-in of the person who will sign off your airworthiness certifcate, or you risk disappointment. Check http://www.3m.com/market/industrial/ceramics/ and go from there. Remember that you really want a number of layers. a) Cosmetic and perhaps reflective. Lots of stuff looks like heck after a few hours under the cowl, and it must be fuel proof, etc. b) FAA flame barrier 2000 F, 15 minute without burn-thru. c) Acoustic barrier (optional) The FAA requirement for flame barriers seems to be in flux right now. We'll see..... Regards, Eric M. Jones www.PerihelionDesign.com 113 Brentwood Drive Southbridge MA 01550-2705 (508) 764-2072 Don't worry about people stealing an idea. If it's original, you will have to ram it down their throats." -- Howard Aiken ________________________________ Message 12 ____________________________________ Time: 12:47:07 PM PST US From: "Dave Morris \"BigD\"" spelling Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Off the topic - pronunciations & spelling --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Dave Morris \"BigD\"" spelling This is the only country in the world with the concept of the "Spelling Bee". No other language has such a dastardly set of exceptions for every rule. We should all convert to Russian and be done with our spelling problems. Dave Morris At 10:07 PM 10/7/2005, you wrote: >--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: sportav8r@aol.com > >Man, I hope that's all tongue-in-cheek. "Mispellings," (sic) >indeed... You almost had me taking the bait. > >-Stormy > >-----Original Message----- >From: Harold Kovac >To: aeroelectric-list@matronics.com >Subject: AeroElectric-List: Off the topic - pronunciations & spelling > > >--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Harold Kovac" > > > > It is interesting to note that the "leader of the free world" and many > of the >congress cannot pronounce the word "NOO Q LAR" (nuclear). > Also how many times I note the lack of understanding that there is a >difference between your (belonging to) and you're (the contraction for you >are). this poor spelling has been going on for at least 30+ years when >checking >a childs homework pointing out a mispelled word and being told that the >teacher >said it's al-right as long as you get your thoughts down. This same teacher >later sent a note home with mispellings. Our educational system is in >decline ! > "nuff" said > kaycee > Ferg > > I can't wait for channel X Pajama Patty to refer to a meeting as a > > rendess-vowse. > Stop it! > > > Ferg > > flames expected > As an ex-Fighter Pilot I think you can defend yourself well! > > Regards > > Gerry in UK where is English is spoken particularly badly!! > > do not archive > > ________________________________ Message 13 ____________________________________ Time: 02:48:47 PM PST US From: RV4WGH@aol.com Subject: AeroElectric-List: Check out Jeff's F1 Rocket Page --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: RV4WGH@aol.com _Click here: Jeff's F1 Rocket Page_ (http://www3.telus.net/public/deucharj/) ________________________________ Message 14 ____________________________________ Time: 02:54:08 PM PST US From: RV4WGH@aol.com Subject: AeroElectric-List: LINKS - Jeff's F1 Rocket Page --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: RV4WGH@aol.com _Click here: Jeff's F1 Rocket Page_ (http://www3.telus.net/public/deucharj/) ________________________________ Message 15 ____________________________________ Time: 02:54:21 PM PST US From: RV4WGH@aol.com Subject: AeroElectric-List: Fwd: Check out ACME Mapper @ N 36.391337 W 105.27891, 8 m/p --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: RV4WGH@aol.com From: RV4WGH@aol.com Subject: Fwd: Check out ACME Mapper @ N 36.391337 W 105.27891, 8 m/p -------------------------------1126477413 -------------------------------1126477413 -------------------------------1126477413-- From: RV4WGH@aol.com Subject: Check out ACME Mapper @ N 36.391337 W 105.27891, 8 m/p -------------------------------1124141418 _Click here: ACME Mapper @ N 36.391337 W 105.27891, 8 m/p_ (http://mapper.acme.com/?lat=36.391346&long=-105.27891&scale=13&theme=Image&width=4&height=3&dot =Yes) -------------------------------1124141418 Click here: ACME Mapper @ N 36.391337 W 105.27891, 8 m/p -------------------------------1124141418-- ________________________________ Message 16 ____________________________________ Time: 02:54:37 PM PST US From: RV4WGH@aol.com Subject: AeroElectric-List: Fwd: A MAN AND HIS GRASS-ROOTS SPACE SHIP --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: RV4WGH@aol.com From: RV4WGH@aol.com Subject: Fwd: A MAN AND HIS GRASS-ROOTS SPACE SHIP -------------------------------1126477399 -------------------------------1126477399 -------------------------------1126477399-- From: T18WGH@aol.com Subject: A MAN AND HIS GRASS-ROOTS SPACE SHIP YSIFLY2@charter.net, jbuford@insightbb.com, clcjunk@Yahoo.com, ronaldgcus@earthlink.net, mike.hernden@hs.utc.com, Jack48N@aol.com, DGH1951@aol.com, RavnTaz@msn.com, huntr@ix.netcom.com, flyertom@worldnet.att.net, Ken.Reynolds@cubic.com, Lewmoon@worldnet.att.net, epicworld1@juno.com, SAXYMORRIS@yahoo.com, Ngroom@aol.com, ChasNLois@aol.com, ohyahh69@msn.com, LarryBojac@earthlink.net, bob.murphy@insightbb.com, GeneSelchow@aol.com, ronswrd@juno.com, gdsieg@atcyber.net, Wndhvr1@aol.com, tcasserly@juno.com, iflyasonex@msn.com, MPGPLUS@aol.com -------------------------------1124159373 Picture Of The Week... A man and his grass-roots space ship. -------------------------------1124159373

Picture Of The Week...

A man and his grass-roots space ship. -------------------------------1124159373-- ________________________________ Message 17 ____________________________________ Time: 02:54:54 PM PST US From: RV4WGH@aol.com Subject: AeroElectric-List: Check out http://www.avweb.com/newspics/scaceshiponearrival1.jpg --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: RV4WGH@aol.com _Click here: http://www.avweb.com/newspics/scaceshiponearrival1.jpg_ (http://www.avweb.com/newspics/scaceshiponearrival1.jpg) ________________________________ Message 18 ____________________________________ Time: 02:55:07 PM PST US From: RV4WGH@aol.com Subject: AeroElectric-List: Fwd: GARMIN 396 - Aviation Consumer --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: RV4WGH@aol.com From: RV4WGH@aol.com Subject: Fwd: GARMIN 396 - Aviation Consumer -------------------------------1126477365 -------------------------------1126477365 -------------------------------1126477365-- From: T18WGH@aol.com Subject: GARMIN 396 - Aviation Consumer -------------------------------1124158015 _Click here: Aviation Consumer Breaking News_ (http://www.aviationconsumer.com/breakingnews/index.html) -------------------------------1124158015 Click here: Aviation Consumer Breaking News -------------------------------1124158015-- ________________________________ Message 19 ____________________________________ Time: 02:55:18 PM PST US From: RV4WGH@aol.com Subject: AeroElectric-List: Fwd: Check out RV Operating Instructions and Checklists --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: RV4WGH@aol.com From: RV4WGH@aol.com Subject: Fwd: Check out RV Operating Instructions and Checklists -------------------------------1126477151 -------------------------------1126477151 -------------------------------1126477151-- From: RV4WGH@aol.com Subject: Check out RV Operating Instructions and Checklists -------------------------------1124132087 _Click here: RV Operating Instructions and Checklists_ (http://www.vansairforce.org/POH/) -------------------------------1124132087 Click here: RV Operating Instructions and Checklists -------------------------------1124132087-- ________________________________ Message 20 ____________________________________ Time: 02:55:52 PM PST US From: RV4WGH@aol.com Subject: AeroElectric-List: Fwd: Check out SuperCub.org :: View topic - A real pilot? --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: RV4WGH@aol.com From: RV4WGH@aol.com Subject: Fwd: Check out SuperCub.org :: View topic - A real pilot? -------------------------------1126486512 -------------------------------1126486512 -------------------------------1126486512-- From: RV4WGH@aol.com Subject: Check out SuperCub.org :: View topic - A real pilot? -------------------------------1124132139 _Click here: SuperCub.org :: View topic - A real pilot?_ (http://www.supercub.org/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=7203&highlight=) -------------------------------1124132139
Click here: SuperCub.org :: View topic - A real pilot? -------------------------------1124132139-- ________________________________ Message 21 ____________________________________ Time: 02:55:58 PM PST US From: RV4WGH@aol.com Subject: AeroElectric-List: Fwd: LYCOMING DIGEST NO. 802 --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: RV4WGH@aol.com From: RV4WGH@aol.com Subject: Fwd: LYCOMING DIGEST NO. 802 -------------------------------1126486518 -------------------------------1126486518 -------------------------------1126486518-- From: RV4WGH@aol.com Subject: Fwd: LYCOMING DIGEST NO. 802 -------------------------------1124132146 -------------------------------1124132146 -------------------------------1124132146-- From: RV4WGH@aol.com Subject: Fwd: LYCOMING DIGEST NO. 802 -------------------------------1121784222 -------------------------------1121784222 -------------------------------1121784222-- From: RV4WGH@aol.com Subject: LYCOMING DIGEST NO. 802 -------------------------------1119919648 Give the gift of life to a sick child. Support St. Jude Children's Research Hospital's 'Thanks & Giving.' _Click Here!_ (http://us.click.yahoo.com/5iY7fA/6WnJAA/Y3ZIAA/jrDrlB/TM) There are 9 messages in this issue. Topics in this digest: 1. Re: Core engine prices From: "Bob Condrey" 2. lycoming breather tube From: luckymacy@comcast.net 3. Re: lycoming breather tube From: "LarryRobertHelming" 4. Re: lycoming breather tube From: "grhanka" 5. Re: lycoming breather tube From: "Mark Richardson" 6. Re: Re: lycoming breather tube From: luckymacy@comcast.net 7. Re: Re: lycoming breather tube From: "LarryRobertHelming" 8. Re: fixed pitch to CS conversion From: "mark" 9. Re: fixed pitch to CS conversion From: "mark" Message: 1 From: "Bob Condrey" Subject: Re: Core engine prices Hamilton, I found a good deal on a 540 through Wentworth in Minneapolis. Here's the link http://www.wentworthaircraft.com and Steve is probably the best person to talk to up there. Email me off-line and I'll give you more info if you're interested. Bob RV-10 #40105 --- In lycoming@yahoogroups.com, "Hamilton Cartwright" wrote: > > > I am in the market for a IO-540-D4A5 and am getting a wide price > range on what a cores are worth or run outs . I have seen core for > $6000to$10500 with 2000+ since overhaul . I would take a rebuild for > aprox $23,000 with O time since major . Does anybody have any > thoughts on this or what are others running into .I am hearing that > the RV-10 is driving used equipment prices up . > Thanks > Hamilton Cartwright > 40238 > emp. finshed > wings finished > waiting for QB fuse Message: 2 From: luckymacy@comcast.net Subject: lycoming breather tube Van's FW drawing shows the bottom bend of their breather tube facing forwards (looking kind of like a ram air effect is going on). They don't show any exhaust stack in relation to the breather tube. How important is it to mount the bend in the tube forward and should I have mounted the breather tube so that the overflow would have landed on the hot exhaust or just let the crap fall on the inside of the cowl? Also, they hint two adel clamps should be used but I only used one because I didn't want to hard mount the tube so much since it's attached to the shaking engine. Is that going to generally be OK or should I go with what Van's sort of drew? thx, lucky [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Message: 3 From: "LarryRobertHelming" Subject: Re: lycoming breather tube ----- Original Message ----- From: luckymacy@comcast.net Subject: [lycoming] lycoming breather tube Van's FW drawing shows the bottom bend of their breather tube facing forwards (looking kind of like a ram air effect is going on). I think the forward bend is just to get around the bottom around the firwall flange. It should not be low enough to be hanging down in the air stream. They don't show any exhaust stack in relation to the breather tube. How important is it to mount the bend in the tube forward and should I have mounted the breather tube so that the overflow would have landed on the hot exhaust or just let the crap fall on the inside of the cowl? I have chosen to let the output fall right on the top of the exhaust pipe. The amount of bad stuff that comes out is not great but it can be messy if you let it get on the belly or fall into your cowling bottom. Also, they hint two adel clamps should be used but I only used one because I didn't want to hard mount the tube so much since it's attached to the shaking engine. Is that going to generally be OK or should I go with what Van's sort of drew? I have a rubber tube at the top where it connects to the engine and then to the metal tube. The metal tube is at the bottom. Only one clamp holds the metal tube to the firewall. Clamps hold the rubber tube to the breather output and to the connecting metal tube. I only used about half the metal tube. Remember to put a whistle slot near the top of the rubber hose where it connects to the breather output. Larry in Indiana thx, lucky [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Message: 4 From: "grhanka" Subject: Re: lycoming breather tube It seems important that the whistle slot be in high pressure relative to the breather tube exit, otherwise ram air will blow into the exit and out of the whistle slot, carrying all the crankcase fumes and oil mist right onto your mags, firewall, etc. IMO, the breather tube exit should be half-inch stainless clamped directly to the end of an exhaust pipe, to keep the vapors vaporized. If stainless OD = rubber tube ID the connection will be simple. If you drip onto an exhaust then blowing a slug of oil out the breather might start a little fire. There have been a few oil fires on Honda CRVs, which have the oil filter mounted right above the exhaust manifold. gordon --- In lycoming@yahoogroups.com, "LarryRobertHelming" wrote: > > > Remember to put a whistle slot near the top of the rubber hose > where it connects to the breather output. Larry in Indiana > > Message: 5 From: "Mark Richardson" Subject: Re: lycoming breather tube Hi Lucky I had mounted mine to land on an exhaust pipe at the bottom, and my inspector made me move it at final inspection It now points overboard essentially aft between the two pipes. The other thing I had to do was drill a 1/4" about 6 inches up from the end of the tube such that if the end of the tube became blocked with ice or something, there would be a pressure relief hole. I know this arrangement works as I filled my IO-360-A3B6D with 8 liters of oil, only to have about a liter of it sprayed onto the bottom of the fuselage. Not a big deal as I haven't painted yet. Cheers Mark --- In lycoming@yahoogroups.com, luckymacy@c... wrote: > > Van's FW drawing shows the bottom bend of their breather tube facing forwards (looking kind of like a ram air effect is going on). They don't show any exhaust stack in relation to the breather tube. How important is it to mount the bend in the tube forward and should I have mounted the breather tube so that the overflow would have landed on the hot exhaust or just let the crap fall on the inside of the cowl? > > Also, they hint two adel clamps should be used but I only used one because I didn't want to hard mount the tube so much since it's attached to the shaking engine. Is that going to generally be OK or should I go with what Van's sort of drew? > > > thx, > lucky > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Message: 6 From: luckymacy@comcast.net Subject: Re: Re: lycoming breather tube Interesting and contradictory in a couple of ways to what "dumb ol americans" experimental builder seem to do. :-) One diff is to cut a fine slit in the rubber hose (Larry says about an inch long) as opposed to drilling a hole in the tube. Normal pressure will keep the slit closed but an outright blockages will open the slit up for relief. Second is the dripping of the oil onto the exhaust and getting "away" with it during inspection and operations. "Canadian way" may be better. I'll think about it some today. Hate to pull it off to drill a freakin' hole. ;-) Lucky -------------- Original message -------------- Hi Lucky I had mounted mine to land on an exhaust pipe at the bottom, and my inspector made me move it at final inspection It now points overboard essentially aft between the two pipes. The other thing I had to do was drill a 1/4" about 6 inches up from the end of the tube such that if the end of the tube became blocked with ice or something, there would be a pressure relief hole. I know this arrangement works as I filled my IO-360-A3B6D with 8 liters of oil, only to have about a liter of it sprayed onto the bottom of the fuselage. Not a big deal as I haven't painted yet. Cheers Mark --- In lycoming@yahoogroups.com, luckymacy@c... wrote: > > Van's FW drawing shows the bottom bend of their breather tube facing forwards (looking kind of like a ram air effect is going on). They don't show any exhaust stack in relation to the breather tube. How important is it to mount the bend in the tube forward and should I have mounted the breather tube so that the overflow would have landed on the hot exhaust or just let the crap fall on the inside of the cowl? > > Also, they hint two adel clamps should be used but I only used one because I didn't want to hard mount the tube so much since it's attached to the shaking engine. Is that going to generally be OK or should I go with what Van's sort of drew? > > > thx, > lucky > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ADVERTISEMENT To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/lycoming/ To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: lycoming-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Message: 7 From: "LarryRobertHelming" Subject: Re: Re: lycoming breather tube Just a comment on Mark's input. I just got my airworthiness certificate and my DAR showed no concern about the breather exit pipe/tube being about 1/4" directly above the Vetterman exhaust pipe right at the cowling exit gap. He looked at it closely and commented about the new method of hanging the supports for the exhaust off the engine rather than the engine mount. As I understand it, not that much oil junk should come out of the breather if you don't overfill and you stay in positive G. I am not going to put more than 6 quarts in to minimize the amount that gets spit back out and I will monitor the oil level closely at each stop/startup to make sure I stay above 5. Indiana Larry ----- Original Message ----- From: Mark Richardson Subject: [lycoming] Re: lycoming breather tube Hi Lucky I had mounted mine to land on an exhaust pipe at the bottom, and my inspector made me move it at final inspection It now points overboard essentially aft between the two pipes. The other thing I had to do was drill a 1/4" about 6 inches up from the end of the tube such that if the end of the tube became blocked with ice or something, there would be a pressure relief hole. I know this arrangement works as I filled my IO-360-A3B6D with 8 liters of oil, only to have about a liter of it sprayed onto the bottom of the fuselage. Not a big deal as I haven't painted yet. Cheers Mark --- In lycoming@yahoogroups.com, luckymacy@c... wrote: > > Van's FW drawing shows the bottom bend of their breather tube facing forwards (looking kind of like a ram air effect is going on). They don't show any exhaust stack in relation to the breather tube. How important is it to mount the bend in the tube forward and should I have mounted the breather tube so that the overflow would have landed on the hot exhaust or just let the crap fall on the inside of the cowl? > > Also, they hint two adel clamps should be used but I only used one because I didn't want to hard mount the tube so much since it's attached to the shaking engine. Is that going to generally be OK or should I go with what Van's sort of drew? > > > thx, > lucky > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ADVERTISEMENT a.. To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/lycoming/ b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: lycoming-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Message: 8 From: "mark" Subject: Re: fixed pitch to CS conversion FWIW about OSH award winner From: "Rosales, Paul" Subject: Re: [SoCAL-RVlist] We've upgraded to a Hartzell prop, yea! As I wrote before, Pop, myself, Todd, Subie and Smokey were able to get the C/S prop installed on Saturday, and I even fired up the engine, however, the cowl did not fit. The spinner backing plate was up against the cowl on the left and right sides of the spinner with (maybe) 1/8" on the top and bottom. Todd & Hog arrived L00 about 9am on Sunday morning, and I was ready to start cutting at the cowl when Todd said 'What do you think about putting spacers on the firewall and moving the engine forward....YEA MAN!' I see that Laird also did the same thing when he upgraded (just saw the post late last night). I got an engine hoist today, and with Smokey's help, it took about 3 hours to get 0.200" of spacers behind the six mount points. I have about 3/8" around the spinner and it looks good. I called in to work today (I work swings) and told them I'd be in REAL late. I was able to get 3 hours flight testing in, and there was NO WIND here (rare). I was able to get data for my 2400 RPM Test point from 12.5K down to 7.5K where I hit 24 squared. I hope to finish up on Thursday. Here are some data points: 12.5K (pressure altitude), 160 KTAS 11.5K: 162 KTAS 10.5K: 166 KTAS 9.5K: 168 KTAS 8.5K: 169 KTAS 7.5K: 170 KTAS (24 squared) The governor is set for maximum of 2600 rpm (I did not change anything from the setting Jeff Farrar was running it on his -8A). I went from the 83 fixed pitch Sensenich to the Hartzell and it's a kick in the pants!!!! Once the prop 'bites' that air, the acceleration is SO MUCH different that when running a fixed pitch prop. At takeoff, I was half fuel and climbed at 2600 fpm for bit after takeoff :-) I'm liking this a LOT!!!! Rosie Message: 9 From: "mark" Subject: Re: fixed pitch to CS conversion more posts about FP to CS. FWIW From: "Gary A. Sobek" Subject: Rosie's flying with his new prop Just got off the phone with Paul. He has 3 of his 5 hours flying done. It was unbeleavable listening to him talk about the experience. I could see that RV Smile on his face over the phone. Will let him tell everyone how much different (for the better) the airplane performance is. I do not want to say that he picked up 20 Kts speed or that he had a 2,800 fpm climb to 5,000 feet out of WJF solo with 1/2 fuel. All this with an engine that has over 2,000 hours since new and has never had any internal work done on it. Wish I did not have to work during the day so that I could go CHASE him around the sky. Gary <*> To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/lycoming/ <*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: lycoming-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ -------------------------------1119919648 --------------------~-- Give the gift of life=20to a sick child. Support St. Jude Children's Research Hospital's 'Thanks Giving.' Click Here! There are 9 messages in this issue. Topics in this digest: 1. Re: Core engine prices From: "Bob Condrey" bob.condrey@baesystems.com 2. lycoming breather tube From: luckymacy@comcast.net 3. Re: lycoming breather tube From: "LarryRobertHelming" lhelming@sigecom.net 4. Re: lycoming breather tube From: "grhanka" ghanka@skybest.com 5. Re: lycoming breather tube From: "Mark Richardson" rv8bldr@gmail.com 6. Re: Re: lycoming breather tube From: luckymacy@comcast.net 7. Re: Re: lycoming breather tube From: "LarryRobertHelming" lhelming@sigecom.net 8. Re: fixed pitch to CS conversion From: "mark" mark2nite@yahoo.com 9. Re: fixed pitch to CS conversion From: "mark" mark2nite@yahoo.com Message: 1 Date: Sat, 12 Mar 2005 19:00:09 -0000 From: "Bob Condrey" bob.condrey@baesystems.com Subject: Re: Core engine prices Hamilton, I found a good deal on a 540 through Wentworth in Minneapolis. Here's the link http://www.wentworthaircraft.com and Steve is probably the best person to talk to up there. Email me off-line and I'll give you more info if you're interested. Bob RV-10 #40105 --- In lycoming@yahoogroups.com, "Hamilton Cartwright" hamc101@b... wrote: I am in the market for a IO-540-D4A5 and am getting a wide price range on what a cores are worth or run outs .=20I have seen core for $6000to$10500 with 2000+ since overhaul . I would take a rebuild for aprox $23,000 with O time since major . Does anybody have any thoughts on this or what are others running into .I am hearing that the RV-10 is driving used equipment prices up . Thanks Hamilton Cartwright 40238 emp. finshed wings finished waiting for QB fuse Message: 2 Date: Sat, 12 Mar 2005 21:06:18 +0000 From: luckymacy@comcast.net Subject: lycoming breather tube Van's FW drawing shows the bottom bend of their breather tube facing forwards (looking kind of like a ram air effect is going on). They don't show any exhaust stack in relation to the breather tube. How important is it to mount the bend in the tube forward and should I have mounted the breather tube so that the overflow would have landed on the hot exhaust or just let the crap fall on the inside of the cowl? Also, they hint two adel clamps should be used but I only used one because I didn't want to hard mount the tube so much since it's attached to=20the shaking engine. Is that going to generally be OK or should I go with what Van's sort of drew? thx, lucky [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Message: 3 Date: Sat, 12 Mar 2005 19:57:22 -0600 From: "LarryRobertHelming" lhelming@sigecom.net Subject: Re: lycoming breather tube ----- Original Message ----- From: luckymacy@comcast.net To: RV-List Cc: lycoming@yahoogroups.com Sent: Saturday, March 12, 2005 3:06 PM Subject: [lycoming] lycoming breather tube Van's FW drawing shows the bottom bend of their breather tube facing forwards (looking kind of like a ram air effect is going on). I think the forward bend is just to get around the bottom around the firwall flange. It should not be low enough to be hanging down in the air stream. They don't show any exhaust stack in relation to the breather tube. How important is it to mount the bend in the tube forward and should I have mounted the breather tube so that the overflow would have landed on the hot exhaust or just let the crap fall on the inside of the cowl? I have chosen to let the output fall right on the top of the exhaust pipe. The amount of bad stuff that comes out is not great but it can be messy if you let it get on the belly or fall into your cowling bottom. Also, they hint two adel clamps should be used but I only used one because I didn't want to hard mount the tube so much since it's attached to the shaking engine. Is that going to generally be OK or should I go with what Van's sort of drew? I have a rubber tube at the top where it connects to the engine and then to the metal tube. The metal tube is at the bottom. Only one clamp holds the metal tube to the firewall. Clamps hold the rubber=20tube to the breather output and to the connecting metal tube. I only used about half the metal tube. Remember to put a whistle slot near the top of the rubber hose where it connects to the breather output. Larry=20in Indiana thx, lucky [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Message: 4 Date: Sun, 13 Mar 2005 13:51:59 -0000 From: "grhanka" ghanka@skybest.com Subject: Re: lycoming breather tube It seems important that the whistle slot be in high pressure relative to the breather tube exit, otherwise ram air will blow into the exit and out of the whistle slot, carrying all the crankcase fumes and oil mist right onto your mags, firewall, etc. IMO, the breather tube exit should be half-inch stainless clamped directly to the end of an exhaust pipe, to keep the vapors vaporized. If stainless OD rubber tube ID the connection will be simple. If you drip onto an exhaust then blowing a slug of oil out the breather might start a little fire. There have been a few oil fires on Honda CRVs, which have the oil filter mounted right above the exhaust manifold. gordon --- In lycoming@yahoogroups.com, "LarryRobertHelming" lhelming@s... wrote: Remember to put a whistle slot near the top of the rubber hose where it connects to the breather output. Larry in Indiana Message: 5 Date: Sun, 13 Mar 2005 14:01:25 -0000 From: "Mark Richardson" rv8bldr@gmail.com Subject: Re: lycoming breather tube Hi Lucky I had mounted mine to land on an exhaust pipe at the bottom, and my inspector made me move it at final inspection=20It now points overboard essentially aft between the two pipes. The other thing I had to do was drill a 1/4" about 6 inches up from the end of the tube such that if the end of the tube became blocked with ice or something, there would be a pressure relief hole. I know this arrangement works as=20I filled my IO-360-A3B6D with 8 liters of oil, only to have about a liter of it sprayed onto the bottom of the fuselage. Not a big deal as I haven't painted yet. Cheers Mark --- In lycoming@yahoogroups.com, luckymacy@c... wrote: Van's FW drawing shows the bottom bend of their breather tube facing forwards (looking kind of like a ram air effect is going on). They don't show any exhaust stack in relation to the breather tube. How important is it to mount the bend in the tube forward and should I have mounted the breather tube so that the overflow would have landed on the hot exhaust or just let the crap fall on the inside of the cowl? Also, they hint two adel clamps should=20be used but I only used one because I didn't want to hard mount the tube so=20much since it's attached to the shaking engine. Is that going to generally be OK or should I go with what Van's sort of drew? thx, lucky [Non-text portions of this message have=20been removed] Message: 6 Date: Sun, 13 Mar 2005 15:32:19 +0000 From: luckymacy@comcast.net Subject: Re: Re: lycoming breather tube Interesting and contradictory in a couple=20of ways to what "dumb ol americans" experimental builder seem to do. :-) One diff is to cut a fine slit in the rubber hose (Larry says about an inch long) as opposed to drilling a hole in the tube. Normal pressure will keep the slit closed but an outright blockages will open the slit up for relief. Second is the dripping of the oil onto the exhaust and getting "away" with it during inspection and operations. "Canadian way" may=20be better. I'll think about it some today. Hate to pull it off to drill a freakin' hole. ;-) Lucky -------------- Original message -------------- Hi Lucky I had mounted mine to land on an exhaust pipe at the bottom, and my inspector made me move it at final inspection It now points overboard essentially aft between the two pipes. The other thing I had to do was drill a 1/4" about 6 inches up from the end of the tube such that if the end of the tube became blocked with ice or something, there would be a pressure relief hole. I know this arrangement works as I filled my IO-360-A3B6D with 8 liters of oil, only=20to have about a liter of it sprayed onto the bottom of the fuselage. Not a big deal as I haven't painted yet. Cheers Mark --- In lycoming@yahoogroups.com, luckymacy@c... wrote: Van's FW drawing shows the bottom bend of their breather tube facing forwards (looking kind of like a ram air effect is going on). They don't show any exhaust stack in relation to the breather tube. How important is it to mount the bend in the tube forward and should I have mounted the breather tube=20so that the overflow would have landed on the hot exhaust or just let the crap fall on the inside of the cowl? Also, they hint two=20adel clamps should be used but I only used one because I didn't want to hard mount the tube so much since it's attached to the shaking engine. Is that going to generally be OK or should I go with what Van's sort of drew? thx, lucky [Non-text portions of=20this message have been removed] Sponsor ADVERTISEMENT Links To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/lycoming/ To unsubscribe=20from this group, send an email to: lycoming-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Message: 7 Date: Sun, 13 Mar 2005 10:00:58 -0600 From: "LarryRobertHelming" lhelming@sigecom.net Subject: Re: Re: lycoming breather tube Just a comment on Mark's input. I just got my airworthiness certificate and my DAR showed no concern about the breather exit pipe/tube being about 1/4" directly above the Vetterman exhaust pipe right at the cowling exit gap. He looked at it closely and commented about the=20new method of hanging the supports for the exhaust off the engine rather than the engine mount. As I understand it, not that much oil junk should come out of the breather if you don't overfill and you stay in positive G. I am not going to put more than 6 quarts in to minimize the amount that gets spit back out and I will monitor the oil level closely at each stop/startup to make sure I stay above 5. Indiana Larry ----- Original Message ----- From: Mark Richardson To: lycoming@yahoogroups.com Sent: Sunday, March 13, 2005 8:01 AM Subject: [lycoming] Re: lycoming breather tube Hi Lucky =20I had mounted mine to land on an exhaust pipe at the bottom, and my inspector made me move it at final inspection It now points overboard essentially aft between the two pipes. The other thing I had to do was drill a 1/4" about 6 inches up from the end of the tube such that if the end of the tube became blocked with ice or something, there would be a pressure relief hole. I know this arrangement works as I filled my IO-360-A3B6D with 8 liters of oil, only to have about a liter of it sprayed onto the bottom of the fuselage. Not a big deal as I haven't painted yet. Cheers Mark --- In lycoming@yahoogroups.com, luckymacy@c... wrote: Van's FW drawing shows the bottom bend of their breather tube facing forwards (looking kind of like a ram air effect is going on). They don't show any exhaust stack in relation to the breather tube. How important is it to mount the bend in the=20tube forward and should I have mounted the breather tube so that the overflow would have landed on the hot exhaust or just let the crap fall on the inside of the cowl? Also,=20they hint two adel clamps should be used but I only used one because I didn't want to hard mount the tube so much since it's attached to=20the shaking engine. Is that going to generally be OK or should I go with what Van's sort of drew? thx, lucky [Non-text portions=20of this message have been removed] ADVERTISEMENT a.. To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/lycoming/ b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: lycoming-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Terms of Service. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Message: 8 Date: Sun, 13 Mar 2005 17:31:46 -0000 From: "mark" mark2nite@yahoo.com Subject: Re: fixed pitch to CS conversion FWIW about OSH award winner From: "Rosales, Paul" rosales@bigfoot.com Subject: Re: [SoCAL-RVlist] We've upgraded to a Hartzell prop, yea! As I wrote before, Pop, myself, Todd, Subie and Smokey were able to get the C/S prop installed on Saturday, and I even fired up the engine, however, the cowl did not fit. The spinner backing plate was up against the cowl on the left and right sides of the spinner with (maybe) 1/8" on the top and bottom. Todd Hog arrived L00 about 9am on Sunday morning, and I was ready to start cutting at the cowl when Todd said 'What do you think about putting spacers on the firewall and moving=20the engine forward....YEA MAN!' I see that Laird also did the same thing when he upgraded (just saw the post late last night). I got an engine hoist today, and with Smokey's help, it took about 3 hours to get 0.200" of spacers behind the six mount points. I have about 3/8" around the spinner and it looks good. I called in to work today (I work swings) and told them I'd be in REAL late. I was able to get 3 hours flight testing in, and there was NO WIND here (rare). I was able to get data for my 2400 RPM Test point from 12.5K down to 7.5K where I hit 24 squared. I hope to finish up on Thursday. Here are some data points: 12.5K (pressure altitude), 160 KTAS 11.5K: 162 KTAS 10.5K: 166 KTAS 9.5K: 168 KTAS 8.5K: 169 KTAS 7.5K: 170 KTAS (24 squared) The governor is set for maximum of 2600 rpm (I did not change anything from the setting Jeff Farrar was running it on his -8A). I went from the 83 fixed pitch Sensenich to the Hartzell=20and it's a kick in the pants!!!! Once the prop 'bites' that air, the acceleration is SO MUCH different that when running a fixed pitch prop. At takeoff, I=20was half fuel and climbed at 2600 fpm for bit after takeoff :-) I'm liking this a LOT!!!! Rosie Message: 9 Date: Sun, 13 Mar 2005 17:36:22 -0000 From: "mark" mark2nite@yahoo.com Subject: Re: fixed pitch to CS conversion more posts about FP to CS. FWIW From: "Gary A. Sobek" GASobek@Comcast.net 2005 7:50 pm Subject: Rosie's flying with his new prop Just got off the phone with Paul. He has 3 of his 5 hours flying done. It was unbeleavable listening to him talk about the experience. I could see that RV Smile on his face over the phone. Will let him tell everyone how much different (for the better) the airplane performance is. I do not want to say that he picked up 20 Kts speed or that he had a 2,800 fpm climb to 5,000 feet out of WJF solo with 1/2 fuel. All this with an engine that has over 2,000 hours since new and has never had any internal work done on it. Wish I did not have to work during the day=20so that I could go CHASE him around the sky. Gary Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/lycoming/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: lycoming-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ -------------------------------1119919648-- ________________________________ Message 22 ____________________________________ Time: 02:56:02 PM PST US From: RV4WGH@aol.com --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: RV4WGH@aol.com From: RV4WGH@aol.com -------------------------------1126486506 -------------------------------1126486506 -------------------------------1126486506-- From: RV4WGH@aol.com -------------------------------1124132117 _Click here: Littlite=AE_ (http://www.littlite.com/products.php?category8) -------------------------------1124132117 Click here: Littlite=AE -------------------------------1124132117-- ________________________________ Message 23 ____________________________________ Time: 02:56:02 PM PST US From: RV4WGH@aol.com Subject: AeroElectric-List: Fwd: Check out Kevin Horton's RV-8 Project - Instrument Panel Labels - Silk S... --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: RV4WGH@aol.com From: RV4WGH@aol.com Subject: Fwd: Check out Kevin Horton's RV-8 Project - Instrument Panel Labels - Silk S... -------------------------------1126486490 -------------------------------1126486490 -------------------------------1126486490-- From: RV4WGH@aol.com Subject: Check out Kevin Horton's RV-8 Project - Instrument Panel Labels - Silk Screen -------------------------------1124131959 _Click here: Kevin Horton's RV-8 Project - Instrument Panel Labels - Silk Screening?_ (http://go.phpwebhosting.com/~khorton/rv8/article.php?story=2004092618235625) -------------------------------1124131959 Click here: Kevin Horton's RV-8 Project - Instrument Panel Labels - Silk Screening? -------------------------------1124131959-- ________________________________ Message 24 ____________________________________ Time: 02:56:04 PM PST US From: RV4WGH@aol.com Subject: AeroElectric-List: Fwd: Check out Mark & Dave's RV-7 --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: RV4WGH@aol.com From: RV4WGH@aol.com Subject: Fwd: Check out Mark & Dave's RV-7 -------------------------------1126486499 -------------------------------1126486499 -------------------------------1126486499-- From: RV4WGH@aol.com Subject: Fwd: Check out Mark & Dave's RV-7 -------------------------------1124131974 -------------------------------1124131974 -------------------------------1124131974-- From: RV4WGH@aol.com Subject: Fwd: Check out Mark & Dave's RV-7 -------------------------------1121784149 -------------------------------1121784149 -------------------------------1121784149-- From: RV4WGH@aol.com Subject: Check out Mark & Dave's RV-7 -------------------------------1119919413 _Click here: Mark & Dave's RV-7_ (http://home.comcast.net/~mtaylo17/RV7/) -------------------------------1119919413 Click here: Mark Dave's RV-7 -------------------------------1119919413-- ________________________________ Message 25 ____________________________________ Time: 02:56:06 PM PST US From: RV4WGH@aol.com Subject: AeroElectric-List: Fwd: Check out Niborex, Inc. - Home Page --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: RV4WGH@aol.com From: RV4WGH@aol.com Subject: Fwd: Check out Niborex, Inc. - Home Page -------------------------------1126486477 -------------------------------1126486477 -------------------------------1126486477-- From: RV4WGH@aol.com Subject: Check out Niborex, Inc. - Home Page -------------------------------1124131871 _Click here: Niborex, Inc. - Home Page_ (http://www.niborex.com/) -------------------------------1124131871 Click here: Niborex, Inc. - Home Page -------------------------------1124131871-- ________________________________ Message 26 ____________________________________ Time: 02:56:07 PM PST US From: RV4WGH@aol.com Subject: AeroElectric-List: Fwd: Finalists - ART VIA SIMULATORS --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: RV4WGH@aol.com From: RV4WGH@aol.com Subject: Fwd: Finalists - ART VIA SIMULATORS -------------------------------1126486484 -------------------------------1126486484 -------------------------------1126486484-- From: RV4WGH@aol.com Subject: Finalists - ART VIA SIMULATORS -------------------------------1124131918 _Click here: Finalists_ (http://www.barnstorming.com/Finalists/) -------------------------------1124131918 Click here: Finalists -------------------------------1124131918-- ________________________________ Message 27 ____________________________________ Time: 02:56:13 PM PST US From: RV4WGH@aol.com Subject: AeroElectric-List: Fwd: Check out Experimental Panel Builder --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: RV4WGH@aol.com From: RV4WGH@aol.com Subject: Fwd: Check out Experimental Panel Builder -------------------------------1126486524 -------------------------------1126486524 -------------------------------1126486524-- From: RV4WGH@aol.com Subject: Fwd: Check out Experimental Panel Builder -------------------------------1124132157 -------------------------------1124132157 -------------------------------1124132157-- From: RV4WGH@aol.com Subject: Fwd: Check out Experimental Panel Builder -------------------------------1121784227 -------------------------------1121784227 -------------------------------1121784227-- From: RV4WGH@aol.com Subject: Fwd: Check out Experimental Panel Builder -------------------------------1119919657 -------------------------------1119919657 -------------------------------1119919657-- From: RV4WGH@aol.com Subject: Check out Experimental Panel Builder -------------------------------1117591511 _Click here: Experimental Panel Builder_ (http://epanelbuilder.com/) -------------------------------1117591511 Click here: Experimental Panel Builder -------------------------------1117591511-- ________________________________ Message 28 ____________________________________ Time: 02:56:18 PM PST US From: RV4WGH@aol.com Subject: AeroElectric-List: Fwd: Check out Builder Ideas --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: RV4WGH@aol.com From: RV4WGH@aol.com Subject: Fwd: Check out Builder Ideas -------------------------------1126486531 -------------------------------1126486531 -------------------------------1126486531-- From: RV4WGH@aol.com Subject: Check out Builder Ideas -------------------------------1124132173 _Click here: Builder Ideas_ (http://bmnellis.com/BuilderIdeas.htm) -------------------------------1124132173 Click here: Builder Ideas -------------------------------1124132173-- ________________________________ Message 29 ____________________________________ Time: 02:56:26 PM PST US From: RV4WGH@aol.com Subject: AeroElectric-List: Fwd: *** Team Rocket Aircraft Online Catalog Order *** --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: RV4WGH@aol.com From: RV4WGH@aol.com Subject: Fwd: *** Team Rocket Aircraft Online Catalog Order *** -------------------------------1126486537 -------------------------------1126486537 -------------------------------1126486537-- From: RV4WGH@aol.com Subject: Fwd: *** Team Rocket Aircraft Online Catalog Order *** -------------------------------1124132184 -------------------------------1124132184 -------------------------------1124132184-- From: RV4WGH@aol.com Subject: Fwd: *** Team Rocket Aircraft Online Catalog Order *** -------------------------------1121784243 -------------------------------1121784243 -------------------------------1121784243-- From: RV4WGH@aol.com Subject: Fwd: *** Team Rocket Aircraft Online Catalog Order *** -------------------------------1119919675 -------------------------------1119919675 -------------------------------1119919675-- From: sales@TeamRocketAircraft.com Subject: *** Team Rocket Aircraft Online Catalog Order *** Wallace, Thanks for your order! A copy of your invoice is included below. If you have any questions, contact us at 512-365-8131. Give the order ID shown below as an identifier. *** ORDER ID: 20050531215053-67663573 *** Quantity Product Code Product Name Unit Price SubTotal -------- ---------------------- ------------------------ ---------- ---------- 1 TRWP Rocket Wheel Pants 225.00 225.00 -------- ---------------------- ------------------------ ---------- ---------- Sub-Total: 225.00 Shipping: 11.75 Total: 236.75 *** BILLING INFO: Name: Wallace Hunt Street: 1658 Plaza Drive : City: Rockford Locality: IL Postal Code: 61108-6949 Country: USA Phone: 815-262-3153 Email: RV4WGH@aol.com Hostname: Browser: Mozilla/4.0 (compatible; MSIE 6.0; AOL 9.0; Windows NT 5.1; SV1; .NET CLR 1.1.4322) Referer: http://www.teamrocketaircraft.com/teamrocketaircraftcgi/hazel.exe Payment Method: Credit Card *** SHIPPING INFO: Method: Regular Shipping Name: Wallace Hunt Street: 1658 Plaza Drive : City: Rockford Locality: IL Postal Code: 61108-6949 Country: USA *** ORDER NOTES: * $11.75 shipping for orders up to $250. ---------------------------- comments ------------------------------ No comment. ---------------------------- comments ------------------------------ ________________________________ Message 30 ____________________________________ Time: 02:56:27 PM PST US From: RV4WGH@aol.com Subject: AeroElectric-List: Fwd: Check out Classic Aero Designs --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: RV4WGH@aol.com From: RV4WGH@aol.com Subject: Fwd: Check out Classic Aero Designs -------------------------------1126486542 -------------------------------1126486542 -------------------------------1126486542-- From: RV4WGH@aol.com Subject: Check out Classic Aero Designs -------------------------------1124132207 _Click here: Classic Aero Designs_ (http://www.classicaerodesigns.com/vans/) -------------------------------1124132207 Click here: Classic Aero Designs -------------------------------1124132207-- ________________________________ Message 31 ____________________________________ Time: 02:57:01 PM PST US From: RV4WGH@aol.com Subject: AeroElectric-List: Check out Destination Direct Flight Planning Software --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: RV4WGH@aol.com _Click here: Destination Direct Flight Planning Software_ (http://www.avweb.com/news/reviews/184225-1.html) ________________________________ Message 32 ____________________________________ Time: 02:57:12 PM PST US From: RV4WGH@aol.com Subject: AeroElectric-List: Check out Taking the "Search" Out of "Search-and-Rescue" --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: RV4WGH@aol.com _Click here: Taking the "Search" Out of "Search-and-Rescue"_ (http://www.avweb.com/news/reviews/185236-1.html) ________________________________ Message 33 ____________________________________ Time: 02:57:31 PM PST US From: RV4WGH@aol.com Subject: AeroElectric-List: Check out Survival Tech Aviation Survival Kit --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: RV4WGH@aol.com _Click here: Survival Tech Aviation Survival Kit_ (http://www.avweb.com/news/reviews/185812-1.html) ________________________________ Message 34 ____________________________________ Time: 02:57:37 PM PST US From: RV4WGH@aol.com Subject: AeroElectric-List: Check out Survival Tech Aviation Survival Kit --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: RV4WGH@aol.com _Click here: Survival Tech Aviation Survival Kit_ (http://www.avweb.com/news/reviews/185812-1.html) ________________________________ Message 35 ____________________________________ Time: 02:57:45 PM PST US From: RV4WGH@aol.com Subject: AeroElectric-List: Fwd: Check out Ohio Valley RVators --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: RV4WGH@aol.com From: RV4WGH@aol.com Subject: Fwd: Check out Ohio Valley RVators -------------------------------1126486599 -------------------------------1126486599 -------------------------------1126486599-- From: RV4WGH@aol.com Subject: Check out Ohio Valley RVators -------------------------------1124132306 _Click here: Ohio Valley RVators_ (http://rv6rick.tripod.com/ohiovalleyrvators/index.html) -------------------------------1124132306 Click here: Ohio Valley RVators -------------------------------1124132306-- ________________________________ Message 36 ____________________________________ Time: 02:58:03 PM PST US From: RV4WGH@aol.com Subject: AeroElectric-List: Check out EZ-Trim Altitude Hold Home Page --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: RV4WGH@aol.com _Click here: EZ-Trim Altitude Hold Home Page_ (http://hometown.aol.com/ccady/eztrim.htm) ________________________________ Message 37 ____________________________________ Time: 02:59:21 PM PST US From: RV4WGH@aol.com Subject: AeroElectric-List: VAN'S NEW REAR SEAT VENT --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: RV4WGH@aol.com _ Don=E2=80=99t know why it wouldn=E2=80=99t work. I haven=E2=80=99t seen one on a plane. You might want to find someone who has one. Typically the back seat is very comfortable in the summer. Very Cold in the Winter. I have taken the scat tube and bypassed the heat muff. This puts air from the high pressure plenum side of the cowl into the cabin. Very comfortable. I have also seen some small eyeball vents. Easier to install. Thanks, Jim -----Original Message----- From: RV4WGH@aol.com [mailto:RV4WGH@aol.com] Subject: NEW REAR SEAT VENT FROM VAN'S Click here: Van's Aircraft - Ordering - Accessories Catalog_ (http://www.vansaircraft.com/cgi-bin/catalog.cgi?ident1119923073-200-393&browsenew&product1 0vent_kit) How is the ventilation in the rear seat? This useful? Wally ________________________________ Message 38 ____________________________________ Time: 04:35:49 PM PST US From: Richard Riley Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: LINKS - Jeff's F1 Rocket Page --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: Richard Riley Do you mean to send 3 and 4 messages per minute to the list, with nothing but a link? Or has your computer been invaded by spyware? -- ________________________________ Message 39 ____________________________________ Time: 04:40:51 PM PST US Subject: RE: AeroElectric-List: Re: Firewall penetration From: "George Braly" --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "George Braly" In the event of CO detection, one of the first things to be done is to set the mixture well LOP. It stops the SOURCE of the CO - - at the source. Then figure out where the leak is coming from. George -----Original Message----- From: owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Eric M. Jones Subject: AeroElectric-List: Re: Firewall penetration --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Eric M. Jones" --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Mark Cochran" >Eric, >I couldn't find any data about the Exitair smoke hood's capabilities to >protect against carbon monoxide. The Exitair may be an adequate device to >use for escape if you're already on the deck. A better choice to carry in >the cockpit may be a hood that does filter CO, such as the Evac-U8. >Combined >with an in-flight CO detector, a CO-filtering hood could provide the >necessary time to land the aircraft from altitude if CO is detected, or >there is smoke or a fire. Yes, the Evac-U8 and similar are more expensive >and take up more space, but.... Mark, I didn't think the CO problem went much much beyond detectors. In the even of CO in the cabin, close the heat (and forward air vents), get outside air. I'd hate to have to land an airplane in one of those hoods. >Would be very interested to know more about firewall alternatives, can you >point us in the right direction? Mark Cochran There is no prescription like the stainless steel sheet mentioned by the FAA advisory circular AC20-135. The FAA says you can do it some other way but must prove it. The test is not hard, but you should probably get the buy-in of the person who will sign off your airworthiness certifcate, or you risk disappointment. Check http://www.3m.com/market/industrial/ceramics/ and go from there. Remember that you really want a number of layers. a) Cosmetic and perhaps reflective. Lots of stuff looks like heck after a few hours under the cowl, and it must be fuel proof, etc. b) FAA flame barrier 2000 F, 15 minute without burn-thru. c) Acoustic barrier (optional) The FAA requirement for flame barriers seems to be in flux right now. We'll see..... Regards, Eric M. Jones www.PerihelionDesign.com 113 Brentwood Drive Southbridge MA 01550-2705 (508) 764-2072 Don't worry about people stealing an idea. If it's original, you will have to ram it down their throats." -- Howard Aiken ________________________________ Message 40 ____________________________________ Time: 04:51:14 PM PST US From: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Check out Jeff's F1 Rocket Page --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" Sir, your flood of miscellaneous announcements and promotions to the AeroElectric-List are in direct contradiction with the list-server's rules of conduct as defined by the owner of the system on which this list-server resides. You're most welcome to join us in any technical or practical discussions that contribute to a group understanding of aircraft . . . but please don't repeat the behavior I've cited above. If necessary, we can have you "blacklisted" with the server's administrator but to my knowledge, this has never been necessary in the history of the AeroElectric-List. I'd be most pleased not to have this incident mark a black milestone in the list's history. Thank you for your swift and diligent attention to this matter. Bob . . . At 05:47 PM 10/8/2005 -0400 you wrote: >--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: RV4WGH@aol.com > >_Click here: Jeff's F1 Rocket Page_ (http://www3.telus.net/public/deucharj/) > > >-- > > >-- incoming mail is certified Virus Free. Bob . . . -------------------------------------------------------- < Throughout history, poverty is the normal condition > < of man. Advances which permit this norm to be > < exceeded -- here and there, now and then -- are the > < work of an extremely small minority, frequently > < despised, often condemned, and almost always opposed > < by all right-thinking people. Whenever this tiny > < minority is kept from creating, or (as sometimes > < happens) is driven out of a society, the people > < then slip back into abject poverty. > < > < This is known as "bad luck". > < -Lazarus Long- > <------------------------------------------------------> http://www.aeroelectric.com ________________________________ Message 41 ____________________________________ Time: 04:57:07 PM PST US From: RV4WGH@AOL.com Subject: AeroElectric-List: EMAILS SENT IN ERROR --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: RV4WGH@aol.com My apology to the list. I have emailed Matt and asked him to delete anything from my email address sent today. Sorry. Wally ________________________________ Message 42 ____________________________________ Time: 05:06:44 PM PST US From: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: LINKS - Jeff's F1 Rocket Page --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" At 04:32 PM 10/8/2005 -0700, you wrote: >--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: Richard Riley > >Do you mean to send 3 and 4 messages per minute to the list, with >nothing but a link? Or has your computer been invaded by spyware? An astute call Richard. The email address belongs to a Wally Hunt who is a long time participant on the Matronics Lists. It's almost a certainty that he understands list server etiquette. Wally. Please forgive my hasty conclusion. It seems quite likely that either your computer has been invaded -or- someone is spoofing your e-mail address in posting the promotional items to the AeroElectric-List. Not sure how this gets fixed. It may be that Matt will ask you to change your e-mail address and re-subscribe to the list so that the old address can be blocked. Let's see what happens over the next few days before we go to Matt . . . although it may be that the "spoofer" has attacked every list you subscribe to and it's only a matter of time before someone switches you OFF. I'll suggest you contact Matt directly at mailto:dralle@matronics.com and explain what's going on. He'll no doubt have good suggestions as to how you proceed. My condolences for having to suffer this pestilence. It happened to me a few years ago and I had to roll my email address. Bob . . . ________________________________ Message 43 ____________________________________ Time: 06:04:21 PM PST US From: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" Subject: AeroElectric-List: New comic book on circuit breaker issues --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" Thanks to Ken Baker's willingness to send me some very good data on a circuit breaker failure he experienced, I've been able to craft a new article on the topic. See: http://aeroelectric.com/articles/Breakers/Breakers.html If anyone else has breakers that might broaden our selection (or de-selection) of parts, I'd be pleased to get exemplar devices for study. Bob . . . ________________________________ Message 44 ____________________________________ Time: 06:04:22 PM PST US From: Rick Lindstrom Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Re: Firewall penetration --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: Rick Lindstrom Good point, George. And only fitting that you would think of posting that! Of course, SOME fuel injected engines run MUCH better lean of peak than others... Thanks for the chuckle. Best, Rick Lindstrom George Braly wrote: >--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "George Braly" > > >In the event of CO detection, one of the first things to be done is to >set the mixture well LOP. > >It stops the SOURCE of the CO - - at the source. > >Then figure out where the leak is coming from. > >George > >-----Original Message----- >From: owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com >[mailto:owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Eric >M. Jones >To: aeroelectric-list@matronics.com >Subject: AeroElectric-List: Re: Firewall penetration > >--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Eric M. Jones" > > >--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Mark Cochran" > > > >>Eric, >>I couldn't find any data about the Exitair smoke hood's capabilities to >>protect against carbon monoxide. The Exitair may be an adequate device >> >> >to > > >>use for escape if you're already on the deck. A better choice to carry >> >> >in > > >>the cockpit may be a hood that does filter CO, such as the Evac-U8. >>Combined >>with an in-flight CO detector, a CO-filtering hood could provide the >>necessary time to land the aircraft from altitude if CO is detected, or >>there is smoke or a fire. Yes, the Evac-U8 and similar are more >> >> >expensive > > >>and take up more space, but.... >> >> > >Mark, > >I didn't think the CO problem went much much beyond detectors. In the >even >of CO in the cabin, close the heat (and forward air vents), get outside >air. >I'd hate to have to land an airplane in one of those hoods. > > > >>Would be very interested to know more about firewall alternatives, can >> >> >you > > >>point us in the right direction? Mark Cochran >> >> > >There is no prescription like the stainless steel sheet mentioned by the >FAA >advisory circular AC20-135. The FAA says you can do it some other way >but >must prove it. The test is not hard, but you should probably get the >buy-in >of the person who will sign off your airworthiness certifcate, or you >risk >disappointment. > >Check http://www.3m.com/market/industrial/ceramics/ and go from there. >Remember that you really want a number of layers. > >a) Cosmetic and perhaps reflective. Lots of stuff looks like heck after >a >few hours under the cowl, and it must be fuel proof, etc. >b) FAA flame barrier 2000 F, 15 minute without burn-thru. >c) Acoustic barrier (optional) > >The FAA requirement for flame barriers seems to be in flux right now. >We'll >see..... > >Regards, >Eric M. Jones >www.PerihelionDesign.com >113 Brentwood Drive >Southbridge MA 01550-2705 >(508) 764-2072 > >Don't worry about people stealing an idea. If it's original, you will >have >to ram it down their throats." >-- Howard Aiken > > > > ________________________________ Message 45 ____________________________________ Time: 06:07:34 PM PST US From: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" Subject: RE: AeroElectric-List: Re: Firewall penetration --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" At 06:42 PM 10/8/2005 -0500, you wrote: >--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "George Braly" > > >In the event of CO detection, one of the first things to be done is to >set the mixture well LOP. > >It stops the SOURCE of the CO - - at the source. > >Then figure out where the leak is coming from. > >George Cool work-around George . . . made possible by the wonderful world of chemistry! Would it also be advisable to drop to or below 60% power to avoid problems of very lean combustion effects? Bob . . . ________________________________ Message 46 ____________________________________ Time: 07:46:33 PM PST US From: CardinalNSB@aol.com Subject: AeroElectric-List: Re: Positronic removal with hammer --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: CardinalNSB@aol.com Thank you Bob for the link, I was at least able to get an idea of the shape. I went to the hobby store and got some thinwall tubing to try to emulate the factory removal tool-it looks like a tube but has a spring loaded "gun" inside it to punch out the contactor. I used a thinwall tube to go down past the "springs", then a small phillips inside the tube with some gentle tapping with a ballpeen hammer. (my wife always gets nervous when I use a hammer in my aircraft repair). They popped out, some with a little more persuasion than others. These are the female solder cup types. I found a source for the crimp type female, but not for the contactor block so I needed to get these out. I stuck a few back in and they seem to work ok. Would it be imprudent to reuse these? How can I easily remove the old solder-propane torch, should I heat them in a skillet, will hearing them harm them? Should I remove the tiny spring loaded retaining clip before heating? These appear to be brass, but there is a lengthwise slit down the barrell which provides the tenion for the male pen. Thanks again for the help. Skip Simpson ________________________________ Message 47 ____________________________________ Time: 08:46:39 PM PST US Subject: RE: AeroElectric-List: Re: Firewall penetration From: "George Braly" --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "George Braly" Bob, Not necessary to reduce power except that it might reduce the pressure of the exhaust gases in a turbo'd engine and thereby reduce the amount that gets into the heater plumbing. However, CO makes up about 4 to 9% of the exhaust when 50 to 150d F rich of peak EGT. One of the primary sources of the efficiency of LOP operations comes from further oxidizing the CO to COO (CO2) and it turns out that at 25 to 50F LOP the level of CO in the exhaust stream is down about one order of magnitude. Regards, George -----Original Message----- From: owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Robert L. Nuckolls, III Subject: RE: AeroElectric-List: Re: Firewall penetration --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" At 06:42 PM 10/8/2005 -0500, you wrote: >--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "George Braly" > > >In the event of CO detection, one of the first things to be done is to >set the mixture well LOP. > >It stops the SOURCE of the CO - - at the source. > >Then figure out where the leak is coming from. > >George Cool work-around George . . . made possible by the wonderful world of chemistry! Would it also be advisable to drop to or below 60% power to avoid problems of very lean combustion effects? Bob . . . ________________________________ Message 48 ____________________________________ Time: 08:46:39 PM PST US Subject: RE: AeroElectric-List: Re: Firewall penetration From: "George Braly" --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "George Braly" Bob, We have hundreds of 300 Hp class TCM engines running 70F LOP of peak TIT - - at 80 to 85% of rated power. These engines are operating with exceptional reliability and durability. Just borescoped one high time engine this week and it was almost stunning to look inside the cylinders and NOT see pancaked crude and deposits everywhere which is what you see in the typical ROP engine at that stage of life. Regards, George -----Original Message----- From: owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Robert L. Nuckolls, III Subject: RE: AeroElectric-List: Re: Firewall penetration --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" At 06:42 PM 10/8/2005 -0500, you wrote: >--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "George Braly" > > >In the event of CO detection, one of the first things to be done is to >set the mixture well LOP. > >It stops the SOURCE of the CO - - at the source. > >Then figure out where the leak is coming from. > >George Cool work-around George . . . made possible by the wonderful world of chemistry! Would it also be advisable to drop to or below 60% power to avoid problems of very lean combustion effects? Bob . . .