---------------------------------------------------------- AeroElectric-List Digest Archive --- Total Messages Posted Tue 11/15/05: 15 ---------------------------------------------------------- Today's Message Index: ---------------------- 1. 06:19 AM - Re: Strobe noise on Piper Archer II - resolved (Mickey Coggins) 2. 08:58 AM - Re: eis (Larry McFarland) 3. 09:57 AM - Appropriate Faston Connectors (Phil Hooper) 4. 11:05 AM - Re: Appropriate Faston Connectors (Dave Morris \) 5. 11:05 AM - Re: eis (Dave Morris \) 6. 11:11 AM - Re: Appropriate Faston Connectors (D Wysong) 7. 11:51 AM - Re: Appropriate Faston Connectors (SteinAir, Inc.) 8. 12:03 PM - Re: eis (Larry McFarland) 9. 12:19 PM - Re: eis (Reginald E. DeLoach) 10. 12:45 PM - Re: Appropriate Faston Connectors (Hinde, Frank George (Corvallis)) 11. 01:03 PM - Re: 12 Volt Ipod....Now Need Volume Help (Tinne maha) 12. 01:35 PM - Re: Appropriate Faston Connectors (Phil Hooper) 13. 01:39 PM - Re: 12 Volt Ipod....Now Need Volume Help (Bill Denton) 14. 02:01 PM - Magneto switch wiring (eddyfernan@aol.com) 15. 09:02 PM - Re: 12 Volt Ipod....Now Need Volume Help (Denny Mortensen) ________________________________ Message 1 _____________________________________ Time: 06:19:00 AM PST US From: Mickey Coggins Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Strobe noise on Piper Archer II - resolved --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: Mickey Coggins > I'm getting a lot of strobe noise - kind of a > whooping sound - in one of our club's Pipers. > It's so bad I can't run the strobes and listen > to the radio. I've read in the archives that > people have solved this problem with a capacitor > somewhere, but I can't find the details. Any > hints appreciated before we give it to the shop > for them to spend 2 weeks debugging it at a > thousand dollars an hour, or whatever they charge. Just a follow-up on this thread. I didn't get to do the work myself, but it seems the problem was with multiple ground paths. They say they brought everything to a single ground point, and that has solved the problem. I was out chasing needles today, and I can confirm that the whoop-whoop sound is gone. Many thanks to all for the various hints and tips that you sent me. -- Mickey Coggins http://www.rv8.ch/ #82007 finishing ________________________________ Message 2 _____________________________________ Time: 08:58:59 AM PST US From: Larry McFarland Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: eis --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: Larry McFarland Bob, I'm using the EIS by g.r. and it's extremely solid functonally. Easier yet to adjust limits and I've never looked back on the unit. The visual aspect of seeing 6 readings at at time and paging allows combinations to be optimized for flight. I exceeded temp limits early on in flight testing, being overly cautious and was able to adjust temp warnings to allowable limits as the engine broke in. Warnings are never ambiguous because the errant temp reading is flashing in the display along with the external warning light. There are prettier displays, but after the wow factor rubs off, I doubt the Grand Rapids system can be beat on simplicity, readability for the long term. Excellent technical support, but I doubt you'll need them. Everything worked just as it should from the beginning. I use 2 EGTs, 2 CHTs, Oil press and temp, water press and temp, ambient temp, Hourmeter, Voltmeter and Tachometer. This is for a Stratus Subaru engine. Larry McFarland - 601HDS at www.macsmachine.com bob noffs wrote: >--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "bob noffs" > >hi all, anyone have any experience with either the grand rapids e.i.s. or the stratomaster information system/ i had pretty much decided on the g.r. eis but i read a lot about the relatively new stratomaster. i know g.r. has an excellent reliability record and the company stands behind their product. any input on either unit would be appeeciated. > bob noffs > > >_ > > ________________________________ Message 3 _____________________________________ Time: 09:57:45 AM PST US From: "Phil Hooper" Subject: AeroElectric-List: Appropriate Faston Connectors --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Phil Hooper" Greetings all. I'm new to the list. I purchased some Faston connectors from Spruce, and then some from our local electronic warehouse, Fry's in Anaheim. They look the same except plastic sleeves are vinal, and the metal looks slightly different. The parts warehouse products are made by JT&T Products, a company that focuses on retail, moving product. I'm concerned about quality for aircraft use. I don't want gremlins sneaking in about 10 years from now. Should I stay with Spruce only, "certified" type parts, or will these electronic parts store connectors be safe, and last in aircraft application? Thanks very much! ________________________________ Message 4 _____________________________________ Time: 11:05:50 AM PST US From: "Dave Morris \"BigD\"" Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Appropriate Faston Connectors --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Dave Morris \"BigD\"" Buy them from B&C and buy their crimper too. Then you'll be certain they are correct. Dave Morris At 11:43 AM 11/15/2005, you wrote: >--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Phil Hooper" > >Greetings all. I'm new to the list. I purchased some Faston connectors >from Spruce, and then some from our local electronic warehouse, Fry's in >Anaheim. > > >They look the same except plastic sleeves are vinal, and the metal looks >slightly different. The parts warehouse products are made by JT&T Products, >a company that focuses on retail, moving product. > > >I'm concerned about quality for aircraft use. I don't want gremlins >sneaking in about 10 years from now. > > >Should I stay with Spruce only, "certified" type parts, or will these >electronic parts store connectors be safe, and last in aircraft application? > > >Thanks very much! > > ________________________________ Message 5 _____________________________________ Time: 11:05:50 AM PST US From: "Dave Morris \"BigD\"" Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: eis --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Dave Morris \"BigD\"" What form of tach pickup did you use? Did you have any trouble with the tach reading? Dave Morris At 10:57 AM 11/15/2005, you wrote: >--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: Larry McFarland > > >Bob, >I'm using the EIS by g.r. and it's extremely solid functonally. Easier >yet to adjust limits and I've never looked back on the unit. >The visual aspect of seeing 6 readings at at time and paging allows >combinations to be optimized for flight. I exceeded temp limits >early on in flight testing, being overly cautious and was able to adjust >temp warnings to allowable limits as the engine broke in. >Warnings are never ambiguous because the errant temp reading is >flashing in the display along with the external warning light. >There are prettier displays, but after the wow factor rubs off, I doubt >the Grand Rapids system can be beat on simplicity, readability for the >long term. >Excellent technical support, but I doubt you'll need them. Everything >worked just as it should from the beginning. >I use 2 EGTs, 2 CHTs, Oil press and temp, water press and temp, ambient >temp, Hourmeter, Voltmeter and >Tachometer. This is for a Stratus Subaru engine. > >Larry McFarland - 601HDS at www.macsmachine.com > > >bob noffs wrote: > > >--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "bob noffs" > > > >hi all, anyone have any experience with either the grand rapids e.i.s. > or the stratomaster information system/ i had pretty much decided on the > g.r. eis but i read a lot about the relatively new stratomaster. i know > g.r. has an excellent reliability record and the company stands behind > their product. any input on either unit would be appeeciated. > > bob noffs > > > > > >_ > > > > > > ________________________________ Message 6 _____________________________________ Time: 11:11:11 AM PST US From: D Wysong Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Appropriate Faston Connectors --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: D Wysong I'm sticking with the PIDG terminals for my airplane, Phil. I crimped and cut open a few of those "car stereo" terminals and convinced myself to leave them in the glove box. No strain relief, and I wasn't satisfied that I'd get a consistent "gas tight" crimp on the conductor. Maybe it was the terminal... maybe it was the crimper... maybe it was the fellow doing the crimping!? Regardless, I found that making "gas tight" connections with PIDG terminals is a breeze. Plus, the PIDG barrel allows you to crimp the conductor as well as the insulation... so no worries about strain relief. My advice -- invest in a good crimp tool and stick to PIDG fastons. D ---------------- Phil Hooper wrote: > --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Phil Hooper" > > Greetings all. I'm new to the list. I purchased some Faston connectors > from Spruce, and then some from our local electronic warehouse, Fry's in > Anaheim. > > > They look the same except plastic sleeves are vinal, and the metal looks > slightly different. The parts warehouse products are made by JT&T Products, > a company that focuses on retail, moving product. > > > I'm concerned about quality for aircraft use. I don't want gremlins > sneaking in about 10 years from now. > > > Should I stay with Spruce only, "certified" type parts, or will these > electronic parts store connectors be safe, and last in aircraft application? > > > Thanks very much! > > > > > > > ________________________________ Message 7 _____________________________________ Time: 11:51:11 AM PST US From: "SteinAir, Inc." Subject: RE: AeroElectric-List: Appropriate Faston Connectors --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "SteinAir, Inc." Do NOT use automotive grade connectors or terminals in your aircraft. Aside from Vinyl insulation being inferior and inadequate, that is not the only difference in the connectors. There is an additional insulation/jacket support sleeve built in between the actual connector and the insulation that provides a bit more strain relief for the insulation. Spend the extra few pennies on aircraft quality terminals and you won't go wrong. Also, make sure to buy at least a decent crimper. Don't go with an automotive type crimper that has the plain old half barrel shaped crimp terminals. Aircraft crimp dies should have 2 separate cavities, one that is elliptical and one that is "bowtie" shaped, hence providing 2 crimps for each terminal simultaneously. Stay away from the retail outlets for that stuff. If you buy the stuff from any of us aircraft supply houses you'll be just fine (B&C, SteinAir, Spruce, Van's, etc..). Be ware of extra cheap stuff, because sometimes you get what you pay for. Cheers, Stein. > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com > [mailto:owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com]On Behalf Of Phil > Hooper > Sent: Tuesday, November 15, 2005 10:44 AM > To: aeroelectric-list@matronics.com > Subject: AeroElectric-List: Appropriate Faston Connectors > > > --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Phil Hooper" > > Greetings all. I'm new to the list. I purchased some Faston connectors > from Spruce, and then some from our local electronic warehouse, Fry's in > Anaheim. > > > They look the same except plastic sleeves are vinal, and the metal looks > slightly different. The parts warehouse products are made by > JT&T Products, > a company that focuses on retail, moving product. > > > I'm concerned about quality for aircraft use. I don't want gremlins > sneaking in about 10 years from now. > > > Should I stay with Spruce only, "certified" type parts, or will these > electronic parts store connectors be safe, and last in aircraft > application? > > > Thanks very much! > > ________________________________ Message 8 _____________________________________ Time: 12:03:15 PM PST US From: Larry McFarland Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: eis --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: Larry McFarland Dave, If I remember correctly (2 years ago) it's the gray wire from the EIS to the positive side of the coil going to the points. Larry Dave Morris "BigD" wrote: >--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Dave Morris \"BigD\"" > >What form of tach pickup did you use? Did you have any trouble with the >tach reading? > >Dave Morris > > > > > > ________________________________ Message 9 _____________________________________ Time: 12:19:53 PM PST US From: "Reginald E. DeLoach" Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: eis --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Reginald E. DeLoach" As anyone tried the Blue Mountain unit (s)? red :} Larry McFarland wrote: > --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: Larry McFarland > > Bob, > I'm using the EIS by g.r. and it's extremely solid functonally. Easier > yet to adjust limits and I've never looked back on the unit. > The visual aspect of seeing 6 readings at at time and paging allows > combinations to be optimized for flight. I exceeded temp limits > early on in flight testing, being overly cautious and was able to adjust > temp warnings to allowable limits as the engine broke in. > Warnings are never ambiguous because the errant temp reading is > flashing in the display along with the external warning light. > There are prettier displays, but after the wow factor rubs off, I doubt > the Grand Rapids system can be beat on simplicity, readability for the > long term. > Excellent technical support, but I doubt you'll need them. Everything > worked just as it should from the beginning. > I use 2 EGTs, 2 CHTs, Oil press and temp, water press and temp, ambient > temp, Hourmeter, Voltmeter and > Tachometer. This is for a Stratus Subaru engine. > > Larry McFarland - 601HDS at www.macsmachine.com > > bob noffs wrote: > > >--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "bob noffs" > > > >hi all, anyone have any experience with either the grand rapids e.i.s. or the stratomaster information system/ i had pretty much decided on the g.r. eis but i read a lot about the relatively new stratomaster. i know g.r. has an excellent reliability record and the company stands behind their product. any input on either unit would be appeeciated. > > bob noffs > > > > > >_ > > > > > ________________________________ Message 10 ____________________________________ Time: 12:45:53 PM PST US Subject: RE: AeroElectric-List: Appropriate Faston Connectors From: "Hinde, Frank George (Corvallis)" --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Hinde, Frank George (Corvallis)" Yes I seen this argument before, and I certainly am in the "you get what you pay for" camp. Howver, my own experience with terminal crimps has been opposite to convential wisdom. I have a high quality 2 cavity ratchet crimper that I have had for a couple of decades. The crimps however I got from my local Bi Mart hardware store very economically. I have never had a single crimp fail in the airplane or several automotive projects I have completed. First plane has been flying 6 years and has 400 hours on it. The insulation appears to be hard to burn through although maybe it is inferior to a proper high quality crimp. I dunno on that one. Frank -----Original Message----- From: owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of SteinAir, Inc. Subject: RE: AeroElectric-List: Appropriate Faston Connectors --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "SteinAir, Inc." --> Do NOT use automotive grade connectors or terminals in your aircraft. Aside from Vinyl insulation being inferior and inadequate, that is not the only difference in the connectors. There is an additional insulation/jacket support sleeve built in between the actual connector and the insulation that provides a bit more strain relief for the insulation. Spend the extra few pennies on aircraft quality terminals and you won't go wrong. Also, make sure to buy at least a decent crimper. Don't go with an automotive type crimper that has the plain old half barrel shaped crimp terminals. Aircraft crimp dies should have 2 separate cavities, one that is elliptical and one that is "bowtie" shaped, hence providing 2 crimps for each terminal simultaneously. Stay away from the retail outlets for that stuff. If you buy the stuff from any of us aircraft supply houses you'll be just fine (B&C, SteinAir, Spruce, Van's, etc..). Be ware of extra cheap stuff, because sometimes you get what you pay for. Cheers, Stein. > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com > [mailto:owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com]On Behalf Of Phil > Hooper > Sent: Tuesday, November 15, 2005 10:44 AM > To: aeroelectric-list@matronics.com > Subject: AeroElectric-List: Appropriate Faston Connectors > > > --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Phil Hooper" > --> > > Greetings all. I'm new to the list. I purchased some Faston > connectors from Spruce, and then some from our local electronic > warehouse, Fry's in Anaheim. > > > They look the same except plastic sleeves are vinal, and the metal > looks slightly different. The parts warehouse products are made by > JT&T Products, a company that focuses on retail, moving product. > > > I'm concerned about quality for aircraft use. I don't want gremlins > sneaking in about 10 years from now. > > > Should I stay with Spruce only, "certified" type parts, or will these > electronic parts store connectors be safe, and last in aircraft > application? > > > Thanks very much! > > ________________________________ Message 11 ____________________________________ Time: 01:03:32 PM PST US From: "Tinne maha" Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: 12 Volt Ipod....Now Need Volume Help --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Tinne maha" Thanks for the response Mickey. I think I confused you some. I'll try to explain it a little better: I believe your mini is taking the audio signal from the top of the Ipod & putting charge into the bottom. Mine is running both charge & audio through the bottom plug. (i.e. the volume control on the front of the Ipod will only work with the top audio out put.) Please correct me if I'm wrong though. What I'm looking for is a way of controlling volume between the aux music input jack & the intercomm. Again, any suggestions would be helpful. Thanks, Grant Time: 05:23:31 AM PST US From: Mickey Coggins Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: 12 Volt Ipod....Now Need Volume Help --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: Mickey Coggins >Now I have another small issue: There is no volume contol. (Not a big >surprise....The salesperson told me I would lose use of the Ipod volume >contol if I used the plug on the bottom....I just had to see for myself) I >believe adding a volume control behind my panel is not too difficult, but I >did not find anything in the archives. Can someone please enlighten me? I don't understand this. I have an external power adapter for my ipod mini, and I can still use the volume on the front. The power adapter is a 3rd party AC adapter, with a plug that goes into the bottom of the ipod. -- Mickey Coggins http://www.rv8.ch/ #82007 finishing ________________________________ Message 12 ____________________________________ Time: 01:35:56 PM PST US From: "Phil Hooper" Subject: RE: AeroElectric-List: Appropriate Faston Connectors --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Phil Hooper" Thank you all for the responses on using quality. I purchased the AMP crimper from Tyco, $100. It does a great job. I'll return these trash connectors and purchase the good stuff from B&C or Spruce. I'm building a Velocity XL RG so I'll be back for more good wisdom from you folks. Thanks so much. -----Original Message----- From: owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Hinde, Frank George (Corvallis) Subject: RE: AeroElectric-List: Appropriate Faston Connectors --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Hinde, Frank George (Corvallis)" Yes I seen this argument before, and I certainly am in the "you get what you pay for" camp. Howver, my own experience with terminal crimps has been opposite to convential wisdom. I have a high quality 2 cavity ratchet crimper that I have had for a couple of decades. The crimps however I got from my local Bi Mart hardware store very economically. I have never had a single crimp fail in the airplane or several automotive projects I have completed. First plane has been flying 6 years and has 400 hours on it. The insulation appears to be hard to burn through although maybe it is inferior to a proper high quality crimp. I dunno on that one. Frank -----Original Message----- From: owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of SteinAir, Inc. Subject: RE: AeroElectric-List: Appropriate Faston Connectors --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "SteinAir, Inc." --> Do NOT use automotive grade connectors or terminals in your aircraft. Aside from Vinyl insulation being inferior and inadequate, that is not the only difference in the connectors. There is an additional insulation/jacket support sleeve built in between the actual connector and the insulation that provides a bit more strain relief for the insulation. Spend the extra few pennies on aircraft quality terminals and you won't go wrong. Also, make sure to buy at least a decent crimper. Don't go with an automotive type crimper that has the plain old half barrel shaped crimp terminals. Aircraft crimp dies should have 2 separate cavities, one that is elliptical and one that is "bowtie" shaped, hence providing 2 crimps for each terminal simultaneously. Stay away from the retail outlets for that stuff. If you buy the stuff from any of us aircraft supply houses you'll be just fine (B&C, SteinAir, Spruce, Van's, etc..). Be ware of extra cheap stuff, because sometimes you get what you pay for. Cheers, Stein. > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com > [mailto:owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com]On Behalf Of Phil > Hooper > Sent: Tuesday, November 15, 2005 10:44 AM > To: aeroelectric-list@matronics.com > Subject: AeroElectric-List: Appropriate Faston Connectors > > > --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Phil Hooper" > --> > > Greetings all. I'm new to the list. I purchased some Faston > connectors from Spruce, and then some from our local electronic > warehouse, Fry's in Anaheim. > > > They look the same except plastic sleeves are vinal, and the metal > looks slightly different. The parts warehouse products are made by > JT&T Products, a company that focuses on retail, moving product. > > > I'm concerned about quality for aircraft use. I don't want gremlins > sneaking in about 10 years from now. > > > Should I stay with Spruce only, "certified" type parts, or will these > electronic parts store connectors be safe, and last in aircraft > application? > > > Thanks very much! > > ________________________________ Message 13 ____________________________________ Time: 01:39:40 PM PST US From: "Bill Denton" Subject: RE: AeroElectric-List: 12 Volt Ipod....Now Need Volume Help --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Bill Denton" Don't know specifically about iPods, but on most portable music gear, the volume control doesn't affect the volume of the "line out" jack; it only affects the volume on the "headphone out" jack. -----Original Message----- From: owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com]On Behalf Of Tinne maha Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: 12 Volt Ipod....Now Need Volume Help --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Tinne maha" Thanks for the response Mickey. I think I confused you some. I'll try to explain it a little better: I believe your mini is taking the audio signal from the top of the Ipod & putting charge into the bottom. Mine is running both charge & audio through the bottom plug. (i.e. the volume control on the front of the Ipod will only work with the top audio out put.) Please correct me if I'm wrong though. What I'm looking for is a way of controlling volume between the aux music input jack & the intercomm. Again, any suggestions would be helpful. Thanks, Grant Time: 05:23:31 AM PST US From: Mickey Coggins Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: 12 Volt Ipod....Now Need Volume Help --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: Mickey Coggins >Now I have another small issue: There is no volume contol. (Not a big >surprise....The salesperson told me I would lose use of the Ipod volume >contol if I used the plug on the bottom....I just had to see for myself) I >believe adding a volume control behind my panel is not too difficult, but I >did not find anything in the archives. Can someone please enlighten me? I don't understand this. I have an external power adapter for my ipod mini, and I can still use the volume on the front. The power adapter is a 3rd party AC adapter, with a plug that goes into the bottom of the ipod. -- Mickey Coggins http://www.rv8.ch/ #82007 finishing ________________________________ Message 14 ____________________________________ Time: 02:01:08 PM PST US From: eddyfernan@aol.com Subject: AeroElectric-List: Magneto switch wiring --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: eddyfernan@aol.com Does anyone out there have a drawing of how to wire the magnetos with toggle switches and a separate starter button? I'd also like wire them with a lockout in case of kickback (one impulse). Thanks in advance! Eddy Fernandez RV 9A Finishing! ________________________________ Message 15 ____________________________________ Time: 09:02:26 PM PST US From: "Denny Mortensen" Subject: RE: AeroElectric-List: 12 Volt Ipod....Now Need Volume Help --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Denny Mortensen" Hi Grant, I am guessing this is just a line level output. You should be able to simply put a 10K Ohm audio taper pot, or actually two of them for stereo in the line. Either mounted in your IP or in a small project box in the line. You can take a look at this page for how to make a small mixer. http://www.aaroncake.net/circuits/mixer2.htm You of course don't need the amplifier portion but you can see how to hook up your pot by looking at R4, 5 or 6. Just use one for each channel. Actually since this circuit is for microphone level signals you would probably be better off using a 100K ohm pot instead of the 10K. Basically one side hooks to your output signal the other side to ground or common. The center wiper is the feed to your audio panel. Good Luck Denny dennymortensen@cableone.net Life may not be the party we hoped for... but while we are here we might as well dance! -----Original Message----- From: owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Tinne maha Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: 12 Volt Ipod....Now Need Volume Help --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Tinne maha" --> Thanks for the response Mickey. I think I confused you some. I'll try to explain it a little better: I believe your mini is taking the audio signal from the top of the Ipod & putting charge into the bottom. Mine is running both charge & audio through the bottom plug. (i.e. the volume control on the front of the Ipod will only work with the top audio out put.) Please correct me if I'm wrong though. What I'm looking for is a way of controlling volume between the aux music input jack & the intercomm. Again, any suggestions would be helpful. Thanks, Grant