Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 10:03 AM - RF Radiation ()
2. 11:47 AM - Contributions (Terry Watson)
3. 12:22 PM - Re: Contributions (Mickey Coggins)
4. 07:31 PM - Re: Contributions (David Carter)
5. 08:17 PM - Re: Alternator terminals (Robert L. Nuckolls, III)
6. 09:31 PM - Re: AeroElectric-List Digest: 24 Msgs - 11/20/05 (CardinalNSB@aol.com)
7. 09:36 PM - Re: gps install under AC 20 138A (CardinalNSB@aol.com)
8. 10:01 PM - Re: Re: gps install under AC 20 138A (BobsV35B@aol.com)
Message 1
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INNOCENT GLOBAL 0.0000 1.0000 -4.4912
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: <bakerocb@cox.net>
Avionics-List message previously posted by: "Paul McAllister"
<paul.mcallister@qia.net>
<<Hi guys, I am looking for a few ideas. I have a fiberglass aircraft I am
having problems
with RF getting into systems and causing problems.
The first area is headsets, I couldn't get my Lightspeeds to work properly.
Lightspeed
acknowledged that there can be problems and offered to modify the battery
box. That improved things, but from time to time I still have problems.
The next on the list is my Navaid. Despite following Navaids suggestion of
disabling
the Navaid whenever the PTT is pressed I still have issues, if I transmit
for long enough it will still swing over to a 30 degree bank which is a real
pain if I am flying in IFR conditions.
The latest trick is my intercom. Occasionally when I transmit I will get a
stuck
mike. I called the manufacturer and managed to speak to the design
engineer.
He acknowledged that is there is enough RF present then this could happen.
The company are currently working with me to resolve the issue.
So..... does anyone have any ideas. I have a GX60 as my nav / com and the
antenna
(which is a Bob Archer) is buried in the tail. I have a single point ground
on the firewall.>>
11/24/2005
Hello Paul, I had an RF interference problem in my KIS TR-1 composite
airplane -- I won't bother you with the details.
My solution was so simple, basic, crude, un analytical and inexpensive that
I am almost embarassed to describe it to you. What I did is just buy a bunch
of split ferrite beads and spread them liberally aroung in various places
and the problem went away.
If you research ferrite split beads on the internet you will find that they
are a staple in the ham radio community and their construction (material)
and other characteristics can be highly technical in nature. I didn't get
too deeply involved in that.
I got my beads from Surplus Sales of Nebraska
http://www.surplussales.com/FerSplit/FerSplit-1.html. Phone: 402-346-4750.
Item number ICH-264-3164251. $2.00 each (the cheapest). I installed them
just by wrapping
them with black plastic tape.
One of these days when I get real curious I will start removing them one by
one to see if the problems come back and to get a better handle on the
source. I
suspect that the problem came from antenna radiations getting into my
systems at certain frequencies.
OC
PS: I don't have much hope for making the Navaid more resistant to RF. It is
a real sieve / sponge. I'll put in a Tru Trak or Trio control unit in some
day.
Message 2
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INNOCENT GLOBAL 0.0000 1.0000 -4.4912
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Terry Watson" <terry@tcwatson.com>
I have a lot of subscriptions. My Wall Street Journal costs about $175 a
year; the Seattle Times another $135 or so. Then there are the business and
professional magazines, and the science and technology and political
periodicals, and the flying related magazines such as AOPA Pilot, EAA's
Sport Aviation, Plane & Pilot, Flying, Private Pilot, GA News, Kit Planes,
Light Plane Maintenance, and a few others that I can't think of at the
moment.
The point is that I spend well over a thousand dollars a year on newspaper
and magazine subscriptions, and none of them come close to giving me the
immediately useful information and entertainment that I get from just the
few of Matt's lists that I subscribe to. AOPA Pilot doesn't tell me as much
about flying experimental airplanes as just a few of test pilot Kevin
Horton's posts to the RV list do. Kit Planes doesn't come close to telling
me as much about building an RV as Sam Buchanan's or Dan Checkoway's web
sites do, which of course I would never have known about had it not been for
Matt's RV list. But I think the most impressive service that Matt brings to
us is Bob Nuckolls on the Aeroelectric list. I am constantly amazed at the
solid knowledge and patient good will that Bob brings to us about wiring
little airplanes, and he does it for free. I have learned much more from Bob
than the aeroelectric list name would suggest.
I may not have had the fortitude to keep plugging along on the great project
had it not been for the help and inspiration I get from reading the posts
from you guys who have gone before or the many who have started after and
already passed me by.
So let Matt know that he makes your life better. Send him some money, and
sleep soundly with a clear conscience, knowing that you have done your part
to support truth, justice, and the airplane builder's way.
Terry
RV-8A #80829
Finishing?
I promise it will fly someday.
Message 3
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| Subject: | Re: Contributions |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: Mickey Coggins <mick-matronics@rv8.ch>
Well said, Terry!
> ... The point is that I spend well over a thousand dollars a year on newspaper
> and magazine subscriptions, and none of them come close to giving me the
> immediately useful information and entertainment that I get from just the
> few of Matt's lists that I subscribe to. AOPA Pilot doesn't tell me as much
> about flying experimental airplanes as just a few of test pilot Kevin
> Horton's posts to the RV list do. Kit Planes doesn't come close to telling
> me as much about building an RV as Sam Buchanan's or Dan Checkoway's web
> sites do, which of course I would never have known about had it not been for
> Matt's RV list. But I think the most impressive service that Matt brings to
> us is Bob Nuckolls on the Aeroelectric list. I am constantly amazed at the
> solid knowledge and patient good will that Bob brings to us about wiring
> little airplanes, and he does it for free. I have learned much more from Bob
> than the aeroelectric list name would suggest. ...
--
Mickey Coggins
http://www.rv8.ch/
#82007 finishing
do not archive
Message 4
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| Subject: | Re: Contributions |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "David Carter" <dcarter11@sbcglobal.net>
Well said. Here, here. (or, is it, "Hear, hear" or "Hear here"?) Me, too.
I agree!!!!
David Carter
----- Original Message -----
From: "Terry Watson" <terry@tcwatson.com>
Subject: AeroElectric-List: Contributions
> --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Terry Watson"
> <terry@tcwatson.com>
>
> I have a lot of subscriptions. My Wall Street Journal costs about $175 a
> year; the Seattle Times another $135 or so. Then there are the business
> and
> professional magazines, and the science and technology and political
> periodicals, and the flying related magazines such as AOPA Pilot, EAA's
> Sport Aviation, Plane & Pilot, Flying, Private Pilot, GA News, Kit Planes,
> Light Plane Maintenance, and a few others that I can't think of at the
> moment.
>
>
> The point is that I spend well over a thousand dollars a year on newspaper
> and magazine subscriptions, and none of them come close to giving me the
> immediately useful information and entertainment that I get from just the
> few of Matt's lists that I subscribe to. AOPA Pilot doesn't tell me as
> much
> about flying experimental airplanes as just a few of test pilot Kevin
> Horton's posts to the RV list do. Kit Planes doesn't come close to telling
> me as much about building an RV as Sam Buchanan's or Dan Checkoway's web
> sites do, which of course I would never have known about had it not been
> for
> Matt's RV list. But I think the most impressive service that Matt brings
> to
> us is Bob Nuckolls on the Aeroelectric list. I am constantly amazed at the
> solid knowledge and patient good will that Bob brings to us about wiring
> little airplanes, and he does it for free. I have learned much more from
> Bob
> than the aeroelectric list name would suggest.
>
>
> I may not have had the fortitude to keep plugging along on the great
> project
> had it not been for the help and inspiration I get from reading the posts
> from you guys who have gone before or the many who have started after and
> already passed me by.
>
>
> So let Matt know that he makes your life better. Send him some money, and
> sleep soundly with a clear conscience, knowing that you have done your
> part
> to support truth, justice, and the airplane builder's way.
>
>
> Terry
>
> RV-8A #80829
>
> Finishing?
>
>
> I promise it will fly someday.
>
>
>
Message 5
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| Subject: | Re: Alternator terminals |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <nuckollsr@cox.net>
At 11:49 AM 11/23/2005 -0700, you wrote:
>--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Mark R. Supinski"
><mark.supinski@gmail.com>
>
>Haven't gotten any feedback from anyone yet. More investigation on my part
>has turned up some additional info -- here is an auto wiring diagram for the
>alternator.
>
>http://www.rx7.org/jes/images/altsys91.jpg
>
>I presume the "B/W" lead corresponds to the "B" lead from the Z diagrams.
>The remaining L and S remain confusing to me -- obviously I need to use one
>of them (how to tell them apart on the connector is problem for the future.)
>
>Still looking for an insightful someone to stear me in the right
>direction...
Interesting diagram. If one blows it up enough, you can
see a schematic of the voltage regulator! Aha! DATA!
See:
http://www.aeroelectric.com/Pictures/Alternators/IR_Alternator_Circa_1980.pdf
for a redrawn schematic of what you posted above.
Assuming the diagram matches the machine you have, one may deduce
that this alternator's regulator is one of those "latch on"
devices. A "tickler" current coming in through EITHER the IGN switch
and series light bulb circuit "L" or through terminal "S" on my
diagram will bring this alternator on line.
This particular regulator is very simple . . . only 10 discrete
components. Bill of materials in manufacturing volumes under
$1.00. I visited the Wells Electronics plant in Fon du Lac, WI
in 1988 and saw the same devices being manufactured on ceramic
substrates by automated machines. The guy who gave me the grand
tour said that his typical regulator had a manufacturing cost of
under $1.50. The machine that assembled them built about 1200
regulators per hour.
However, if one studies the diagram, you'll see that power to
run the regulator and energize the field comes off a separate trio
of diodes (D7-D9) separate from the diodes that rectify b-lead
output power (D1-D6). Once the alternator comes up, removing power
from either the "L" or "S" leads will have no effect . . . the
alternator will continue to provide output.
If I were going to use this alternator in any application, I would
attempt to identify the "S" lead with an ohmmeter. Depending on
the instrument, a resistance measurement from each of the two
terminals with respect to alternator case ground should produce
some evidence of continuity. In the case of the "L" terminal,
continuity will be indicated irrespective of the polarity of
the meter leads. For the "S" terminal, the included diode (D11)
will cause one of the ohmmeter connections to show infinite ohms.
I'd run the "S" terminal to the alternator control switch
KNOWING that until some other provisions are installed, the
switch only controls ONSET of alternator operation and cannot
turn it OFF later.
This is a good example of the value of having internal schematics
to any product. You need this kind of DATA to deduce things
not revealed by a manufacturer's data sheets -AND/OR-
to confirm that some supplier has adequately understood the
finer points of some product he's trying to sell you.
Bob . . .
Message 6
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| Subject: | Re: AeroElectric-List Digest: 24 Msgs - 11/20/05 |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: CardinalNSB@aol.com
Hi, I am ready to install the intercom/wiring but I don't want to buy
headphones until I am ready to fly. Can I simply use a small speaker with an
inline resister to total 150 ohms per side? Any tricks? thanks, skip simpson
Message 7
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| Subject: | Re: gps install under AC 20 138A |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: CardinalNSB@aol.com
Has anyone been successful installing a gps as a minor modification? In
particular, I want to put in a Garmin 300xl with a dedicated king 202 cdi, and
to eliminate any cdi switching relays and not use the expensive integrated
annunciator box. I plan to use Electro Mech aircraft style switches and
annunciators, as being the "functional equivalent" of the "storebought box
annunciator". For about $2500 I have the 300xl and cdi, less than $200 more and
that
should do it? Or just 2 quality mini-switches and some leds?
I guess the trick will be to get the FAA to accept the flight manual
supplement.
Any thoughts? thanks skip simpson
Message 8
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| Subject: | Re: gps install under AC 20 138A |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: BobsV35B@aol.com
Good Evening Skip,
We did discuss a similar problem on this list last week. I am not sure just
what it is that you want to do, but there is NO requirement that any
switching relays be installed and there is no requirement for any annunciator IF
you
are using a dedicated CDI. If you are installing it in an experimental
aircraft, there is no need for any FAA approval.
If you are installing it in a normally certificated airplane, you will
probably need a local approval. It may not be considered a minor alteration,
but
the FAA folks have recently been given guidance that makes it the next thing
to a minor alteration!
For that, I do not have the interpretation currently being used, but even
the old guidance is very simple when you use a dedicated CDI.
Modifying the FAA Approved Airplane Flight Manual Supplement to reflect the
actual installation is a no brainer. The procedure is spelled out completely
in the TSO guidance.
If you are planning to use the same CDI for both VHF and GPS navigation,
there will be a need for some method of telling the pilot which is in use. If
that is your plan, let me know and I will repeat what I said last week or you
could check it in the archives.
Any help at all?
Happy Skies,
Old Bob
AKA
Bob Siegfried
Ancient Aviator
Stearman N3977A
Brookeridge Air Park LL22
Downers Grove, IL 60516
630 985-8503
In a message dated 11/24/2005 11:38:39 P.M. Central Standard Time,
CardinalNSB@aol.com writes:
Has anyone been successful installing a gps as a minor modification? In
particular, I want to put in a Garmin 300xl with a dedicated king 202 cdi,
and
to eliminate any cdi switching relays and not use the expensive integrated
annunciator box. I plan to use Electro Mech aircraft style switches and
annunciators, as being the "functional equivalent" of the "storebought box
annunciator". For about $2500 I have the 300xl and cdi, less than $200
more and that
should do it? Or just 2 quality mini-switches and some leds?
I guess the trick will be to get the FAA to accept the flight manual
supplement.
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