---------------------------------------------------------- AeroElectric-List Digest Archive --- Total Messages Posted Wed 12/14/05: 31 ---------------------------------------------------------- Today's Message Index: ---------------------- 1. 12:53 AM - Re: headphone wiring / bluetooth? (Frank) 2. 03:46 AM - bonding strap (The Minearts) 3. 04:33 AM - Re: Battery Monitor - Bogus or Brilliant? (Chuck Jensen) 4. 06:12 AM - Re: headphone wiring / bluetooth? (Carlos Sa) 5. 06:17 AM - Re: bonding strap (Robert L. Nuckolls, III) 6. 06:28 AM - Re: headphone wiring / bluetooth? (Fiveonepw@aol.com) 7. 06:37 AM - Re: headphone wiring / bluetooth? (Lloyd, Daniel R.) 8. 06:41 AM - Re: Battery Monitor - Bogus or Brilliant? (Eric M. Jones) 9. 06:44 AM - Re: headphone wiring / bluetooth? (Kevin Seuferer) 10. 07:12 AM - -List: headphone wiring / bluetooth? (Jim Wickert) 11. 07:34 AM - Re: Mini-EFIS Panel Considerations INNOCENT GLOBAL 0.3072 1.0000 -0.3180 (Hinde, Frank George (Corvallis)) 12. 08:01 AM - Re: headphone wiring / bluetooth? (Craig Payne) 13. 08:05 AM - Re: headphone wiring / bluetooth? (N1deltawhiskey@aol.com) 14. 08:11 AM - Re: headphone wiring / bluetooth? (Craig Payne) 15. 11:16 AM - Re: Temperature compensation (Gilles Tatry) 16. 11:40 AM - Re: Re: headphone wiring (Steve Sampson) 17. 12:23 PM - Solid state dimmer control (Bill and Marsha) 18. 01:34 PM - Converting IR to ER (Mark R. Supinski) 19. 01:57 PM - Re: Converting IR to ER (Mark R Steitle) 20. 02:23 PM - Re: Solid state dimmer control (glaesers) 21. 03:48 PM - Re: Converting IR to ER (Eric M. Jones) 22. 04:05 PM - Re: Re: Converting IR to ER (Sean Stephens) 23. 04:36 PM - Re: headphone wiring / blue tooth? (Charlie Kuss) 24. 05:06 PM - Re: Re: Solid state dimmer control (John Schroeder) 25. 08:05 PM - Re: Battery Monitor - Bogus or Brilliant? (Brian Lloyd) 26. 08:13 PM - Re: Re: Battery Monitor - Bogus or Brilliant? (Brian Lloyd) 27. 08:38 PM - Re: Converting IR to ER (Charlie Kuss) 28. 08:38 PM - Re: Re: headphone wiring (Charlie Kuss) 29. 08:48 PM - Re: Solid state dimmer control (Bob White) 30. 10:04 PM - Re: Battery Monitor - Bogus or Brilliant? (Speedy11@aol.com) 31. 10:11 PM - Re: Battery Monitor - Bogus or Brilliant? (Speedy11@aol.com) ________________________________ Message 1 _____________________________________ Time: 12:53:00 AM PST US From: Frank Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: headphone wiring / bluetooth? --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: Frank Your cordless phone doesn't generate static... it picks up radio signals that it doesn't understand and you hear 'static'. From this point of view, a cockpit is a more suitable environment for a wireless device than your home, because there are less sources of radio signals, and those that are there (transponder, comm radio) are tightly controlled. Charlie Kuss wrote: >--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: Charlie Kuss > >Matt, > Modern cordless phones work quite well. However, my point is that the >cockpit of an aircraft is a different environment compared to your home. My >cordless phones work well most of the time. Sometimes though, they will >generate some static when I walk around while using them. Does your phone >act up if you walk near an operating TV set? There are more electronic at >much closer distances. > Comparing the environment consumer electronics operate in to the aviation >environment is an apples to oranges comparison, in my view. I'm not saying >it can't be done, but it would cost a lot more than the price of comparable >consumer electronics. I remember cabin speakers, but why would I (or >anyone) want to go back to that. I remember black and white TV as well. I >certainly will never buy another one, though. (of course, that's just me.) >If you or any other Lister wants to attempt to tackle that challenge, I >wish you the best of luck. >Charlie > > ________________________________ Message 2 _____________________________________ Time: 03:46:04 AM PST US From: "The Minearts" Subject: AeroElectric-List: bonding strap --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "The Minearts" I bought a piece of the biggest tinned copper braid from Wicks, 5/8 in. wide. Is this big enough for bonding/grounding straps for a 14v system- (Odyssey PC680, John Deere 18A Alt)? Steve Mineart, CH601/Corvair ________________________________ Message 3 _____________________________________ Time: 04:33:44 AM PST US Subject: RE: AeroElectric-List: Battery Monitor - Bogus or Brilliant? From: "Chuck Jensen" --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Chuck Jensen" Brian Lloyd, where have you been? We've missed your erudiant postings. On a long cruise or were you on one of those missions 'you can't talk about?' Chuck Jensen > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner- > aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Brian Lloyd > Sent: Wednesday, December 14, 2005 1:10 AM > To: aeroelectric-list@matronics.com > Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Battery Monitor - Bogus or Brilliant? > > --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: Brian Lloyd > > Craig Payne wrote: > > > "The Peukert number is determined empirically, by testing the battery at > > different rates." > > > > So how does this box discern the Peukert number for the battery it is > > monitoring? At least they have a chance of tracking the amount of energy > in > > the battery as they are monitoring current flow in and out with a shunt. > I > > would have used a Hall effect sensor but I don't know Peukert's formula > from > > a hole in the ground. > > Craig, you have to actually measure the capacity of the battery at two > different discharge rates. You may find that many of the gel-cell makers > will give capacity in AH at two different discharge rates. If you know > that you can calculate Peukert's exponent. > > lead-acid battery capacity is given by the following: > > I > n * t = C > > Where I = discharge current > t = time > n = Peukert's exponent, typically about 1.25 > C = battery capacity constant > > If you want to calculate Peukert's exponent for your battery, discharge > it using two different currents and take the time for each. You then > plug the two currents and the two times into the following equation: > > > n = (log t2 - log t1) / (log I1 - log I2) > > Once you know n you can calculate the capacity of the battery over a > wide range of discharge currents. Try to pick two discharge rates that > bracket your normal usage. > > On my boat I would not always have the ability to recharge the battery > bank fully so knowing the exact charge state was important. I could go > several cycles of charge and discharge without ever reaching a full > discharge or a full charge. With a proper value for Peukert's exponent > my battery monitor was very accurate on remaining energy (more on this > later). But this is pretty much a moot point because in aircraft we are > going to recharge the battery after each discharge cycle. > > BTW, a number of the battery energy monitors out there may claim to do a > calculation based on Peukert's exponent but most just have a lookup > table for a range of currents and don't allow the adjustment of the > exponent. The only energy monitor I know of that actually uses Peukert's > exponent to do accurate on-the-fly calculation of remaining capacity is > Ample Power's "EMON-2". I can attest to its accuracy. > > And it is way overkill for use in an airplane for all the reasons Bob > mentioned. > > > -- > Brian Lloyd 2243 Cattle Dr. > brian-yak at lloyd dot com Folsom, CA 95630 > +1.916.367.2131 (voice) +1.270.912.0788 (fax) > > I fly because it releases my mind from the tyranny of petty things . . .. > - Antoine de Saint-Exupery > > > > > ________________________________ Message 4 _____________________________________ Time: 06:12:51 AM PST US From: Carlos Sa Subject: RE: AeroElectric-List: headphone wiring / bluetooth? --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: Carlos Sa Interesting question, Craig http://www.mobileinfo.com/Bluetooth/FAQ.htm#g2 do not archive Carlos Craig Payne wrote: --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Craig Payne" Extra points to anyone who can describe why Bluetooth is called Bluetooth. -- Craig --------------------------------- ________________________________ Message 5 _____________________________________ Time: 06:17:15 AM PST US From: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: bonding strap --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" At 05:36 AM 12/14/2005 -0600, you wrote: >--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "The Minearts" > >I bought a piece of the biggest tinned copper braid from Wicks, 5/8 in. >wide. Is this big enough for bonding/grounding straps for a 14v system- >(Odyssey PC680, John Deere 18A Alt)? >Steve Mineart, CH601/Corvair Sure. Actually, if B&C is still building them the same way I used to, I threaded two strands of braid INSIDE the outer braid for VERY low resistance and robust mechanics. Bob . . . ________________________________ Message 6 _____________________________________ Time: 06:28:59 AM PST US From: Fiveonepw@aol.com Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: headphone wiring / bluetooth? --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: Fiveonepw@aol.com In a message dated 12/13/05 8:59:02 PM Central Standard Time, chaztuna@adelphia.net writes: > I think that this isn't a really good idea for aviation. >>>> Seems they used to say the same thing about nosewheels.... (Uh-oh!) Sorry, Charlie- just couldn't resist! 8-) Mark do not archive ________________________________ Message 7 _____________________________________ Time: 06:37:21 AM PST US Subject: RE: AeroElectric-List: headphone wiring / bluetooth? From: "Lloyd, Daniel R." --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Lloyd, Daniel R." I will take those points now :) The system is named after a Danish king Harald Bltand (Harold I of Denmark in English), King of Denmark and Norway from 935 and 936 respectively, to 940 known for his unification of previously warring tribes from Denmark (including Skne, present-day Sweden, where the Bluetooth technology was invented) and Norway. Bluetooth likewise was intended to unify different technologies like computers and mobile phones. The Bluetooth logo merges the Nordic runes analogous to the modern Latin H and B: and . This is the official story; however, the actual Harald Bltand that was referred to in naming Bluetooth was most probably the liberal interpretation given to him in The Long Ships by Frans Gunnar Bengtsson, a Swedish best-selling Viking-inspired novel. The name was originally only a code-name for the project but ended up sticking... -----Original Message----- From: owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Craig Payne Subject: RE: AeroElectric-List: headphone wiring / bluetooth? --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Craig Payne" Here is the link to the Aveo non-Bluetooth wireless headset: http://aveousa.com/avionics/intercom/index.php They make a number of arguments as to why you *don't* want to use Bluetooth in your wireless headset. Not sure I agree with them but you should at least read it before you buy. Extra points to anyone who can describe why Bluetooth is called Bluetooth. -- Craig -----Original Message----- From: owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Jim Baker Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: headphone wiring / bluetooth? --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Jim Baker" --> > While we are on the subject of headset wiring how long before we will > see bluetooth headset/intercoms. Is this just round the corner so I > should hold off working out wiring runs for headsets? Aveo USA FreeSpeech I'd wait for version 2. Jim Baker 580.788.2779 '71 SV, 492TC Elmore City, OK ________________________________ Message 8 _____________________________________ Time: 06:41:00 AM PST US From: "Eric M. Jones" Subject: AeroElectric-List: Re: Battery Monitor - Bogus or Brilliant? --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Eric M. Jones" --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: Brian Lloyd brian-yak@lloyd.com Welcome back Brian. The method of measurement is just a distraction from the real issue--The battery is important to remaining in the air, especially with an electrically dependent airplane. As such, the battery juice becomes a critical expendable if the alternator fails. The voltmeter and ammeter are not good indicators of HOW LONG YOU'VE GOT. And that is what you need to know and why the battery monitor is a pretty good idea. Don't even consider a battery monitor without a "Time to Empty" reading. One could argue that you could plot the current/voltage relationship against a known load.....well the computer does that for you. Furthermore, other variables like temperature are tagged on to get better accuracy. Changing the battery blindly every year, or swapping batteries, is crazy if you can get the information from a meter. I submit that for VFR at least, various strategies (like another battery or a wind-driven turbine) are used because you don't really know what's going on inside the battery case. The Xantrex XBM and similar devices are the best solution. (Ebay often has Xantrex XBM's for about US$200.) It handily takes the place of several other engine instrument too. More advanced systems monitor and charge the battery cell by cell, and can have a spare cell or two that could be switched in while the bad cell is switched out. But for these you have to roll your own. >And it is way overkill for use in an airplane for all the reasons Bob >mentioned. Such a statement gives GMCJetPilot atomic afterburners..... Regards, Eric M. Jones www.PerihelionDesign.com 113 Brentwood Drive Southbridge MA 01550-2705 (508) 764-2072 Regards, Eric M. Jones www.PerihelionDesign.com 113 Brentwood Drive Southbridge MA 01550-2705 (508) 764-2072 Don't worry about people stealing an idea. If it's original, you will have to ram it down their throats." -- Howard Aiken ________________________________ Message 9 _____________________________________ Time: 06:44:56 AM PST US From: Kevin Seuferer Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: headphone wiring / bluetooth? --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: Kevin Seuferer Another interesting tidbit is the origin of the name Bluetooth which was taken from the 10th century Danish Viking King Harald Blatand (Bluetooth is the rough English translation of Blatand). King Harald united Denmark and Norway during a time of bitter fighting and it was this power to unite disparate entities that inspired the original developers. Google rules... Kevin -- Kevin Seuferer -- http://www.bearhawkin.com -- Bearhawk Serial #774 -- N774KD Kevin > > > Extra points to anyone who can describe why Bluetooth is called Bluetooth. > > -- Craig > > > > -- ________________________________ Message 10 ____________________________________ Time: 07:12:04 AM PST US From: Jim Wickert Subject: AeroElectric-List: -List: headphone wiring / bluetooth? --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: Jim Wickert It may not be bluetooth with the law suits taking place on blue tooth technology...also many of the component mfgs are looking at WIFI in place of bluetooth. Jim Wickert Vision Vair #159 -----Original Message----- From: Steve Sampson Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: headphone wiring / bluetooth? --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Steve Sampson" While we are on the subject of headset wiring how long before we will see bluetooth headset/intercoms. Is this just round the corner so I should hold off working out wiring runs for headsets? Thanks,Steve RV4 Kit No.4478 RV-9A G-IINI (sold) PA18-150 G-BVMI ________________________________ Message 11 ____________________________________ Time: 07:34:57 AM PST US Subject: RE: AeroElectric-List: Mini-EFIS Panel Considerations INNOCENT GLOBAL 0.3072 1.0000 -0.3180 From: "Hinde, Frank George (Corvallis)" --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Hinde, Frank George (Corvallis)" Where I got to Larry (and I'm not flying yet) was a Dynon D100 (would have been a D10A with a smaller panel) and a EMS engine monitor. The EFIS is backed up with 2 steam guages (alt and a/s) and the Pictorial pilot (autopilot)...The idea is if the EFIS goes south in IFR then the A/P has both a turn coordintaor readout and will level the plane when engaged. I found the all electric six pack was expensive for the lack of functionality. As to the rear seat, personally I would just stick an A/s and alt steam guage in the there. Unless you feel like you will be acting as safety pilot to an IFR recurrancy person in the rear seat, why would they need anymore than that? With the A/p up front its not like you need your passenger to keep it level for you from the rear seat. You will be limited for panel space so the BMA will give you the VOR/G/S function...To me though this was too much dependant on one instrument, so for navigation I have a GNS 430 (just bought the trays to defer cost until phase 1) with the GI 206 (G/s/VOR) This is wired to the A/p...to take you there. A PMA 7000b stereo audio panel (for marker beakons and entertainment). A GTX 327 transponder (push button). Note the EFIS provides the altitude encoder function. Oh yes and a ICOM A200 for Comm 2...Nice little unit I have on my current plane. I wasn't going to bother with a a second radio...My first IFR flight to watch my buddy from the back seat made me realise I needed a way to monitor about 6 radio prequencies at the same time...Gee! Frank RV7A...Baffles/cowl -----Original Message----- From: owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Larry E. James Subject: AeroElectric-List: Mini-EFIS Panel Considerations INNOCENT GLOBAL 0.3072 1.0000 -0.3180 --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Larry E. James" --> I'm coming close to having to make final decisions for my panel and order units. My flight mission includes "light" IFR capability and my personal preference is to keep a simple more/less old-fashioned scan. If I cannot satisfy myself that one of the current "new" products is better; I'll stick with an all electric six-pack. My version of the six-pack would include an electric gyro horizon with a Sandel below. That being said, I can imagine that by simply replacing the AH and CDI with identical EFIS display units could be a rather elegant solution. My current conundrum comes from the EFIS units currently available. First, I'm not a fan of their packaging. All other instruments mount flush with the panel; I'd like these to also. Second, none have the ability to interface with another of the same. While at Oshkosh I asked both Dynon and BMA about this and neither was interested. Additionally, I could see the possibility of placing a third display in the backseat (Rocket; tandem). But alas, my knowledge on all of this is very limited. Can anyone offer some sound advice ?? thank you in advance, -- Larry E. James Bellevue, WA HR2 ________________________________ Message 12 ____________________________________ Time: 08:01:26 AM PST US From: "Craig Payne" Subject: RE: AeroElectric-List: headphone wiring / bluetooth? --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Craig Payne" Yup, you get the prize. I have actually been to Bluetooth's castle. -- Craig -----Original Message----- From: owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Carlos Sa Subject: RE: AeroElectric-List: headphone wiring / bluetooth? --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: Carlos Sa Interesting question, Craig http://www.mobileinfo.com/Bluetooth/FAQ.htm#g2 do not archive Carlos Craig Payne wrote: --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Craig Payne" Extra points to anyone who can describe why Bluetooth is called Bluetooth. -- Craig --------------------------------- ________________________________ Message 13 ____________________________________ Time: 08:05:13 AM PST US From: N1deltawhiskey@aol.com Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: headphone wiring / bluetooth? --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: N1deltawhiskey@aol.com In a message dated 13-Dec-05 19:05:03 Pacific Standard Time, craig@craigandjean.com writes: They make a number of arguments as to why you *don't* want to use Bluetooth in your wireless headset. Not sure I agree with them but you should at least read it before you buy. Craig, The latest issue of Aviation Consumer had an article on "electronic flight bags." A sidebar addressed Bluetooth in the cockpit as being "finicky" and working in some cockpits and not others. Given that, I would be a little suspicious at this point, by being sure that the supplier provided a full money back guarantee if one couldn't get the system to work satisfactorily. Doug ________________________________ Message 14 ____________________________________ Time: 08:11:25 AM PST US From: "Craig Payne" Subject: RE: AeroElectric-List: headphone wiring / bluetooth? --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Craig Payne" Sorry, you were the second to reply. How about a consolation prize: "Contrary to popular opinion, Bluetooth or "Bltand" as it was in old Viking language had nothing to do with a blue tooth. It means dark complexion he had very dark hair, which was unusual for Vikings. ... Ericssons R&D facility at Lund is undoubtedly a centre of creative excellence. Bluetooths genesis there follows many other new ideas, including the Ericsson mobile phone. In fact, the first portable NMT and GSM phones on the market were developed there. It seems that Ericsson is not only making history, but celebrating it, too." (http://www.cellular.co.za/bluetooth_king_harald.htm) I've been to Ericsson's facility in Lund twice to help on a failing (and ultimately failed) project. -- Craig -----Original Message----- From: owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Lloyd, Daniel R. Subject: RE: AeroElectric-List: headphone wiring / bluetooth? --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Lloyd, Daniel R." --> I will take those points now :) The system is named after a Danish king Harald Bltand (Harold I of Denmark in English), King of Denmark and Norway from 935 and 936 respectively, to 940 known for his unification of previously warring tribes from Denmark (including Skne, present-day Sweden, where the Bluetooth technology was invented) and Norway. Bluetooth likewise was intended to unify different technologies like computers and mobile phones. The Bluetooth logo merges the Nordic runes analogous to the modern Latin H and B: and . This is the official story; however, the actual Harald Bltand that was referred to in naming Bluetooth was most probably the liberal interpretation given to him in The Long Ships by Frans Gunnar Bengtsson, a Swedish best-selling Viking-inspired novel. The name was originally only a code-name for the project but ended up sticking... -----Original Message----- From: owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Craig Payne Subject: RE: AeroElectric-List: headphone wiring / bluetooth? --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Craig Payne" --> Here is the link to the Aveo non-Bluetooth wireless headset: http://aveousa.com/avionics/intercom/index.php They make a number of arguments as to why you *don't* want to use Bluetooth in your wireless headset. Not sure I agree with them but you should at least read it before you buy. Extra points to anyone who can describe why Bluetooth is called Bluetooth. -- Craig -----Original Message----- From: owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Jim Baker Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: headphone wiring / bluetooth? --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Jim Baker" --> > While we are on the subject of headset wiring how long before we will > see bluetooth headset/intercoms. Is this just round the corner so I > should hold off working out wiring runs for headsets? Aveo USA FreeSpeech I'd wait for version 2. Jim Baker 580.788.2779 '71 SV, 492TC Elmore City, OK ________________________________ Message 15 ____________________________________ Time: 11:16:20 AM PST US From: "Gilles Tatry" Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Temperature compensation --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Gilles Tatry" > Okay, what you COULD do is build an external signal conditioner > using the Analog Devices AD596/597 to provide the cold-junction > compensation and treat the instrument like a millivolt input > linear instrument. > > See > > http://www.analog.com/UploadedFiles/Data_Sheets/664361174AD596_597_b.pdf > > I keep pretty good quantities of this chip on hand. I use > them several times a year on various investigations. > > There are some low cost, fast-turn etched circuit board > houses that supply free artwork layout programs. My personal > favorite is at http://expresspcb.com > > I use these folks a LOT for one-of instrumentation and > low volume production projects at RAC and for my clients. > I could sketch the circuit for you but I'll need to know > the input impedance of the instrument. If you have some > resistors, a variable bench supply and a digital voltmeter, > we can craft an experiment to characterize the instrument's > input. Great! I'me quite sure the guy who does my harness is properly equipped. How will we proceed to characterize the instrument's input? Thanks a lot, Gilles ________________________________ Message 16 ____________________________________ Time: 11:40:39 AM PST US From: "Steve Sampson" Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Re: headphone wiring --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Steve Sampson" All, thanks for the bluetooth input. Steve. PS For Charlie I suggest two cans and a bit of string! ----- Original Message ----- From: "Eric M. Jones" Subject: AeroElectric-List: Re: headphone wiring > --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Eric M. Jones" > > > --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Steve Sampson" > >>While we are on the subject of headset wiring how long before we will see >>bluetooth headset/intercoms. Is this just round the corner so I should >>hold >>off working out wiring runs for headsets? Thanks,Steve > > Steve et al: > > Lots of wireless solutions, and more coming. I'm having a Bluetooth system > implanted in my brain next year. > > But I have to wonder why the IR headsets never took off? Were they > forgotten > between noise-cancelling and Bluetooth? > > This is still an easy conversion to make, as long as no wing walking is > planned. See: > > http://www.st.com/stonline/prodpres/standard/rf/chipset.htm > > Regards, > Eric M. Jones > www.PerihelionDesign.com > 113 Brentwood Drive > Southbridge MA 01550-2705 > (508) 764-2072 > > "Beaten paths are for beaten men." > -E. A. Johnston > > > ______________________________________________________________________ > > This email has been scanned by the MessageLabs Email Security System > on behalf of the London Business School community. > For more information please visit http://www.messagelabs.com/email > ______________________________________________________________________ > > > -- > 13/12/2005 > > ________________________________ Message 17 ____________________________________ Time: 12:23:04 PM PST US From: "Bill and Marsha" Subject: AeroElectric-List: Solid state dimmer control --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Bill and Marsha" Bob and others On page 12-17 of aeroelectrics manual Bob shows an example of dimmer control useing solid state circuitry. Can anyone tell me the component values used for this ckt? I would like to use this for my Pulsar III. Bill S. ________________________________ Message 18 ____________________________________ Time: 01:34:49 PM PST US From: "Mark R. Supinski" Subject: AeroElectric-List: Converting IR to ER --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Mark R. Supinski" Based on feedback from Bob, I decided to try and rewire my IR 80 Amp alternator to make it an ER. I didn't get very far -- after getting the case cracked, and removing several screws, I am at the point where I cannot remove any of the internal bits which (presumably) are the regulator. Attached are a series of photos along the way: http://supinski.net:8080/IMG_2379.JPG http://supinski.net:8080/IMG_2380.JPG http://supinski.net:8080/IMG_2381.JPG http://supinski.net:8080/IMG_2382.JPG http://supinski.net:8080/IMG_2383.JPG http://supinski.net:8080/IMG_2384.JPG http://supinski.net:8080/IMG_2385.JPG The final photo shows all the screws removed. (The screw in the lower left is unscrewed, but cannot be removed due to the windings being in the way.) Tugging will not pull out the assembly that presumably in the regulator. In any case -- my question is: am I done? Chuck it & start looking for a new alternator to order? Thanks, Mark Supinski ________________________________ Message 19 ____________________________________ Time: 01:57:10 PM PST US Subject: RE: AeroElectric-List: Converting IR to ER From: "Mark R Steitle" --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Mark R Steitle" Mark, There was an article on how to convert the Mitsubishi alternator in Contact Magazine some years back. I think it was issue #19, but not sure. Check their web site and order the issue. It will walk you through the process. Mark Steitle -----Original Message----- From: owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Mark R. Supinski Subject: AeroElectric-List: Converting IR to ER --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Mark R. Supinski" Based on feedback from Bob, I decided to try and rewire my IR 80 Amp alternator to make it an ER. I didn't get very far -- after getting the case cracked, and removing several screws, I am at the point where I cannot remove any of the internal bits which (presumably) are the regulator. Attached are a series of photos along the way: http://supinski.net:8080/IMG_2379.JPG http://supinski.net:8080/IMG_2380.JPG http://supinski.net:8080/IMG_2381.JPG http://supinski.net:8080/IMG_2382.JPG http://supinski.net:8080/IMG_2383.JPG http://supinski.net:8080/IMG_2384.JPG http://supinski.net:8080/IMG_2385.JPG The final photo shows all the screws removed. (The screw in the lower left is unscrewed, but cannot be removed due to the windings being in the way.) Tugging will not pull out the assembly that presumably in the regulator. In any case -- my question is: am I done? Chuck it & start looking for a new alternator to order? Thanks, Mark Supinski ________________________________ Message 20 ____________________________________ Time: 02:23:44 PM PST US From: "glaesers" Subject: AeroElectric-List: Re: Solid state dimmer control --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "glaesers" > Bob and others On page 12-17 of aeroelectrics manual Bob shows an >example of dimmer control useing solid state circuitry. Can anyone tell me >the component values used for this ckt? >I would like to use this for my Pulsar III. Bill S. ----------- Eric Jones sells a nice one (http://periheliondesign.com/Vregflyer.htm). The basis is the LM317 voltage regulator. If you google that you'll get lots of info. Dennis Glaeser RV7A ________________________________ Message 21 ____________________________________ Time: 03:48:45 PM PST US From: "Eric M. Jones" Subject: AeroElectric-List: RE: Converting IR to ER --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Eric M. Jones" --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Mark R Steitle" mark.steitle@austin.utexas.edu The article in Contact describing the conversion of an IR alternator to ER was issue 46. The author was Paul Messinger. Regards, Eric M. Jones www.PerihelionDesign.com 113 Brentwood Drive Southbridge MA 01550-2705 (508) 764-2072 "THE-VERY-BIG-STUPID" is a thing which breeds by eating The Future. Have you seen it? It sometimes disguises itself as a good-looking quarterly bottom line, derived by closing the R&D Department. --Frank Zappa ________________________________ Message 22 ____________________________________ Time: 04:05:09 PM PST US From: Sean Stephens Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: RE: Converting IR to ER --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: Sean Stephens or -Sean RV-10 #40303 Eric M. Jones wrote: > --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Eric M. Jones" > > --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Mark R Steitle" > mark.steitle@austin.utexas.edu > > The article in Contact describing the conversion of an IR alternator to ER > was issue 46. The author was Paul Messinger. > > Regards, > Eric M. Jones > www.PerihelionDesign.com > 113 Brentwood Drive > Southbridge MA 01550-2705 > (508) 764-2072 > > "THE-VERY-BIG-STUPID" is a thing which breeds by eating > The Future. Have you seen it? It sometimes disguises itself as a > good-looking quarterly bottom line, derived by closing the R&D > Department. > --Frank Zappa > > > ________________________________ Message 23 ____________________________________ Time: 04:36:46 PM PST US From: Charlie Kuss Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: headphone wiring / blue tooth? --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: Charlie Kuss Frank, Yes, poor choice of words on my part. I understand that cordless receivers are the victim, not the antagonist. The ear pieces in a wireless headset will also be victims. I suspect the success or failure of these units will depend largely on the quality of wiring that builders of OBAM aircraft do. Charlie >--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: Frank > >Your cordless phone doesn't generate static... it picks up radio signals >that it doesn't understand and you hear 'static'. From this point of >view, a cockpit is a more suitable environment for a wireless device >than your home, because there are less sources of radio signals, and >those that are there (transponder, comm radio) are tightly controlled. > >Charlie Kuss wrote: > > >--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: Charlie Kuss > > > > >Matt, > > Modern cordless phones work quite well. However, my point is that the > >cockpit of an aircraft is a different environment compared to your home. My > >cordless phones work well most of the time. Sometimes though, they will > >generate some static when I walk around while using them. Does your phone > >act up if you walk near an operating TV set? There are more electronic at > >much closer distances. > > Comparing the environment consumer electronics operate in to the aviation > >environment is an apples to oranges comparison, in my view. I'm not saying > >it can't be done, but it would cost a lot more than the price of comparable > >consumer electronics. I remember cabin speakers, but why would I (or > >anyone) want to go back to that. I remember black and white TV as well. I > >certainly will never buy another one, though. (of course, that's just me.) > >If you or any other Lister wants to attempt to tackle that challenge, I > >wish you the best of luck. > >Charlie > > > > > > ________________________________ Message 24 ____________________________________ Time: 05:06:42 PM PST US Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Re: Solid state dimmer control From: "John Schroeder" --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "John Schroeder" Bill - B&C sells several sizes of this dimmer. They work very well. Periheliondesign also has a nice one. It makes it very easy to forego the urge to roll your own. John >> Bob and others On page 12-17 of aeroelectrics manual Bob shows an >> example of dimmer control useing solid state circuitry. Can anyone tell >> me >> the component values used for this ckt? >> I would like to use this for my Pulsar III. Bill S. > ----------- > > Eric Jones sells a nice one (http://periheliondesign.com/Vregflyer.htm). > The basis is the LM317 voltage regulator. If you google that you'll get > lots of info. > > Dennis Glaeser > RV7A > > -- ________________________________ Message 25 ____________________________________ Time: 08:05:59 PM PST US From: Brian Lloyd Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Battery Monitor - Bogus or Brilliant? --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: Brian Lloyd Chuck Jensen wrote: > --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Chuck Jensen" > > Brian Lloyd, where have you been? We've missed your erudiant postings. > On a long cruise or were you on one of those missions 'you can't talk > about?' Ah, no. I sold the WISP in the Virgin Islands and am back in Sacramento. I am now trying to decide what I want to do when I grow up. I think it probably has something to do with aviation. Of course it is possible that I have annoyed so many people elsewhere that I had to come back here. ;-) -- Brian Lloyd 2243 Cattle Dr. brian-yak at lloyd dot com Folsom, CA 95630 +1.916.367.2131 (voice) +1.270.912.0788 (fax) I fly because it releases my mind from the tyranny of petty things . . . - Antoine de Saint-Exupery ________________________________ Message 26 ____________________________________ Time: 08:13:36 PM PST US From: Brian Lloyd Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Re: Battery Monitor - Bogus or Brilliant? --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: Brian Lloyd Eric M. Jones wrote: > --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Eric M. Jones" > > --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: Brian Lloyd brian-yak@lloyd.com > > Welcome back Brian. > > The method of measurement is just a distraction from the real issue--The > battery is important to remaining in the air, especially with an > electrically dependent airplane. As such, the battery juice becomes a > critical expendable if the alternator fails. The voltmeter and ammeter are > not good indicators of HOW LONG YOU'VE GOT. And that is what you need to > know and why the battery monitor is a pretty good idea. Don't even consider > a battery monitor without a "Time to Empty" reading. But such a device could be relatively simple, just sampling the current drain periodically and integrating it. Like the venerable fuel level gauge you don't need pinpoint accuracy, just a pretty good idea of how much is left. > One could argue that you could plot the current/voltage relationship against > a known load.....well the computer does that for you. Furthermore, other > variables like temperature are tagged on to get better accuracy. Changing > the battery blindly every year, or swapping batteries, is crazy if you can > get the information from a meter. I agree with the first part. I think that building an energy monitor that deals with temp and Peukert's exponent is probably overkill for an airplane battery monitor since the battery always starts at pretty close to fully charged to begin with and will not go through multiple partial charge/discharge cycles. Don't get me wrong, I love my Amplepower battery energy monitor in my boat. It does a fantastic job. It just isn't the same job that needs to be done in an airplane. > I submit that for VFR at least, various strategies (like another battery or > a wind-driven turbine) are used because you don't really know what's going > on inside the battery case. The Xantrex XBM and similar devices are the best > solution. (Ebay often has Xantrex XBM's for about US$200.) It handily takes > the place of several other engine instrument too. For what we are talking about here a Xantrex monitor for $200 is probably a good deal. > More advanced systems monitor and charge the battery cell by cell, and can > have a spare cell or two that could be switched in while the bad cell is > switched out. But for these you have to roll your own. That seems a bit overkill. >>And it is way overkill for use in an airplane for all the reasons Bob >>mentioned. > > > Such a statement gives GMCJetPilot atomic afterburners..... I still hold it is overkill. But for $200 a box that replaces a voltmeter and two ammeters to monitor two batteries is probably a pretty reasonable thing to do if you have the real estate in the panel. -- Brian Lloyd 2243 Cattle Dr. brian-yak at lloyd dot com Folsom, CA 95630 +1.916.367.2131 (voice) +1.270.912.0788 (fax) I fly because it releases my mind from the tyranny of petty things . . . - Antoine de Saint-Exupery ________________________________ Message 27 ____________________________________ Time: 08:38:53 PM PST US From: Charlie Kuss Subject: RE: AeroElectric-List: Converting IR to ER --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: Charlie Kuss >--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Mark R Steitle" > > >Mark, >There was an article on how to convert the Mitsubishi alternator in >Contact Magazine some years back. I think it was issue #19, but not >sure. Check their web site and order the issue. It will walk you >through the process. > >Mark Steitle That Contact Magazine article also shows how to convert ND alternators as well. Charlie Kuss ________________________________ Message 28 ____________________________________ Time: 08:38:53 PM PST US From: Charlie Kuss Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Re: headphone wiring --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: Charlie Kuss At 01:58 PM 12/14/2005, you wrote: >--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Steve Sampson" > > >All, thanks for the bluetooth input. Steve. > >PS For Charlie I suggest two cans and a bit of string! The world IS flat! Tin cans and string? What, do you think I'm made of money?? :-) Charlie do not archive ________________________________ Message 29 ____________________________________ Time: 08:48:10 PM PST US From: Bob White Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Solid state dimmer control --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: Bob White On Wed, 14 Dec 2005 14:21:19 -0600 "Bill and Marsha" wrote: > --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Bill and Marsha" > > Bob and others On page 12-17 of aeroelectrics manual Bob shows an > example of dimmer control useing solid state circuitry. Can anyone tell me > the component values used for this ckt? > I would like to use this for my Pulsar III. Bill S. > > Hi, You have received several responses for purchasing pre-made dimmers, all good choices, but just in case you want to build something yourself, try: C2 = 0.1 ufd C5 = 1.0 ufd C7 = 1.0 ufd R3 = 500 ohm R4 = 2K ohm pot R6 = 240 ohm This should give you an output adjustable from just under 4V to just about 14V. The upper value will be limited by your input of course. Bob W. -- http://www.bob-white.com N93BD - Rotary Powered BD-4 (Projected engine start - maybe next week) Custom Cables for your rotary installation - http://www.roblinphoto.com/shop/ ________________________________ Message 30 ____________________________________ Time: 10:04:27 PM PST US From: Speedy11@aol.com Subject: AeroElectric-List: Re: Battery Monitor - Bogus or Brilliant? --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: Speedy11@aol.com Aha. As a mathematics-oriented guy, this explanation caused me to understand the real value of doing a load analysis. Yes, I know it just makes sense todo a load analysis so as to know the potential load one can expect in battery-only ops, but this formula made it crystal clear to me. I'm planning dual Odyssey PC680s (16 Ah) and if I am down to only the standby (endurance) battery, then at a load of 10 amps I don't have 1.6 hours of battery life from a fully charged battery. With a Peukert exponent of 1.2, I will only have 1.0 hour of battery life. I can greatly extend that life by reducing the load. At a load of 5 amps, the 16 Ah battery life will extend to beyond 2 hours. My load analysis is taking on more life now. Armed with that info and the knowledge of your electrical system, an airborne pilot could make very informed decisions regarding load shedding. Having an accurate battery monitor indicating Ah remaining or % remaining could be a valuable tool. The lights are slowly coming on. Stan Sutterfield www.rv-8a.net >"The Peukert number is determined empirically, by testing the battery at >different rates." > >So how does this box discern the Peukert number for the battery it is >monitoring? At least they have a chance of tracking the amount of energy in >the battery as they are monitoring current flow in and out with a shunt. I >would have used a Hall effect sensor but I don't know Peukert's formula from >a hole in the ground. Found a better explanation yet! http://www.amplepower.com/pwrnews/beer ________________________________ Message 31 ____________________________________ Time: 10:11:55 PM PST US From: Speedy11@aol.com Subject: AeroElectric-List: Re: Battery Monitor - Bogus or Brilliant? --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: Speedy11@aol.com "If you want to calculate Peukert's exponent for your battery, discharge it using two different currents and take the time for each. You then plug the two currents and the two times into the following equation: n = (log t2 - log t1) / (log I1 - log I2) Once you know n you can calculate the capacity of the battery over a wide range of discharge currents. Try to pick two discharge rates that bracket your normal usage." Couldn't the battery manufacturer do the tests and provide Peukert's exponent for a particular type of battery? Stan Sutterfield