Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 07:46 AM - UV Light (Boddicker)
2. 09:21 AM - Re: UV Light (Robert L. Nuckolls, III)
3. 09:33 AM - Re: UV Light (sportav8r@aol.com)
4. 09:58 AM - RF (Hinde, Frank George (Corvallis))
5. 10:18 AM - Re: KR 87 (F. ILMAIN)
6. 11:28 AM - Key Ignition Switch ()
7. 12:07 PM - Re: Key Ignition Switch (Bill Denton)
8. 12:20 PM - Key Ignition Switch ()
9. 12:51 PM - Re: Key Ignition Switch (Hinde, Frank George (Corvallis))
10. 01:00 PM - Re: Key Ignition Switch (Hinde, Frank George (Corvallis))
11. 01:16 PM - Re: Key Ignition Switch (Matt Prather)
12. 01:23 PM - Re: Key Ignition Switch (Mickey Coggins)
13. 02:04 PM - Re: Key Ignition Switch (Dave Morris \)
14. 02:55 PM - Avionics for Dummies (tomcostanza@comcast.net)
15. 03:13 PM - Z diagrams and fuseable links (Jekyll)
16. 03:30 PM - Gas Detector Sensor (Carlos Trigo)
17. 03:52 PM - Re: Key Ignition Switch (Terry Watson)
18. 04:08 PM - Re: UV Light (Boddicker)
19. 05:09 PM - Thermal wire stripper? ()
20. 06:32 PM - Re: Thermal wire stripper? (Bruce Gray)
21. 06:47 PM - Re: Z diagrams and fuseable links (Robert L. Nuckolls, III)
22. 07:46 PM - Re: Key Ignition Switch (LarryRobertHelming)
23. 07:58 PM - Re: Z diagrams and fuseable links (Jekyll)
24. 08:11 PM - Re: Key Ignition Switch (Robert G. Wright)
25. 08:52 PM - Re: Key Ignition Switch (Brian Lloyd)
26. 09:09 PM - Re: Key Ignition Switch (Ed Holyoke)
27. 09:15 PM - Re: Re: Z diagrams and fuseable links (Bill Schlatterer)
28. 10:07 PM - Re: Key Ignition Switch (Robert L. Nuckolls, III)
29. 10:32 PM - Re: Gas Detector Sensor (Mickey Coggins)
Message 1
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--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: Boddicker <trumanst@netins.net>
Bob,
I was making my third flight in my Tri Q 200 this past Sat. I noticed that
every time I presses the mic remote key switch, the OV light would come on.
Nothing is connected to ships power at this time. Using nine volt on
intercom, and a new IC-A6 with it's own battery. Ever heard of anything like
this before? I did not have the ships antenna hooked up either. Rubber ducky
only.
I did not notice it on the first two flights, but may have not been aware of
it. Had other tasks on my mind.
Thanks for all you do.
Kevin Boddicker
Luana, Iowa
Tri Q200 N7868B
Flying!!!! 2.6 HRS
Message 2
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--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <nuckollsr@cox.net>
At 09:45 AM 3/20/2006 -0600, you wrote:
>--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: Boddicker <trumanst@netins.net>
>
>Bob,
>I was making my third flight in my Tri Q 200 this past Sat. I noticed that
>every time I presses the mic remote key switch, the OV light would come on.
>Nothing is connected to ships power at this time. Using nine volt on
>intercom, and a new IC-A6 with it's own battery. Ever heard of anything like
>this before? I did not have the ships antenna hooked up either. Rubber ducky
>only.
Who's OV light?
>I did not notice it on the first two flights, but may have not been aware of
>it. Had other tasks on my mind.
At first blush, it sounds like the OV sensor is sensitive
to RF. Hand-helds with rubber duck antennas can be the
worst antagonists with respect to cockpit mounted accessories.
In fact, I used my hand-held as a quick-looksee for RF susceptibility
for hardware on the bench.
Bob . . .
< What is so wonderful about scientific truth...is that >
< the authority which determines whether there can be >
< debate or not does not reside in some fraternity of >
< scientists; nor is it divine. The authority rests >
< with experiment. >
< --Lawrence M. Krauss >
Message 3
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--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: sportav8r@aol.com
Dang, I was expecting to read something interesting about applied fluorescence
technology or day-glo instruments in the cockpit... apparently the UV in the
header is actually OV??
do not archive
-----Original Message-----
From: Robert L. Nuckolls, III <nuckollsr@cox.net>
Sent: Mon, 20 Mar 2006 11:16:24 -0600
Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: UV Light
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III"
<nuckollsr@cox.net>
At 09:45 AM 3/20/2006 -0600, you wrote:
>--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: Boddicker <trumanst@netins.net>
>
>Bob,
>I was making my third flight in my Tri Q 200 this past Sat. I noticed that
>every time I presses the mic remote key switch, the OV light would come on.
>Nothing is connected to ships power at this time. Using nine volt on
>intercom, and a new IC-A6 with it's own battery. Ever heard of anything like
>this before? I did not have the ships antenna hooked up either. Rubber ducky
>only.
Who's OV light?
>I did not notice it on the first two flights, but may have not been aware of
>it. Had other tasks on my mind.
At first blush, it sounds like the OV sensor is sensitive
to RF. Hand-helds with rubber duck antennas can be the
worst antagonists with respect to cockpit mounted accessories.
In fact, I used my hand-held as a quick-looksee for RF susceptibility
for hardware on the bench.
Bob . . .
< What is so wonderful about scientific truth...is that >
< the authority which determines whether there can be >
< debate or not does not reside in some fraternity of >
< scientists; nor is it divine. The authority rests >
< with experiment. >
< --Lawrence M. Krauss >
Message 4
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--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Hinde, Frank George (Corvallis)" <frank.hinde@hp.com>
Speaking of RF...I have had a long standing noise in my radio
problem...Ok unitl the alternator starts charging then you get
everything, ignition, alternator, strobes...Lovely....And its not on the
intercom as it varies with radio volume.
A complete aside...While working in my shop I noticed National public
broadcasting got noisy the moment I plugged in my battery drill battery
to its smart charger...Hmmm I wonder?
In the plane I have a battery charger on the GPS powered from ship....So
yesterday while out flying I unplugged it.
Noise went away immediately and I can turn the noise on and off by
plugging and plugging the power lead...Ah HA!
Did I simply not ground the charger properly?
Frank
Message 5
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--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "F. ILMAIN" <f_ilmain@hotmail.com>
Too big a file to e mail.
Any specific pages you need ?
Cheers
Franck
>From: "Richard Garforth" <richard@hawk.flyer.co.uk>
>To: <aeroelectric-list@matronics.com>
>Subject: AeroElectric-List: KR 87
>Date: Sun, 19 Mar 2006 09:14:22 -0000
>
>--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Richard Garforth"
><richard@hawk.flyer.co.uk>
>
>Has anyone a copy of the KR 87 install manual that they could Email me
>please ?
>
>Richard
>RV10
>
>
Message 6
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| Subject: | Key Ignition Switch |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: <bakerocb@cox.net>
3/20/2006
Hello Fellow Builders, Several of us have a real dislike for the key type
ignition switches found in many type certificated airplanes and also
installed by builders who may just assume "that's the best way".
The following web page offers another data point on why that type of
ignition switch is dislked by many of us.
http://www.avweb.com/news/columns/191792-1.html
OC
Message 7
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| Subject: | Key Ignition Switch |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Bill Denton" <bdenton@bdenton.com>
Obviously, the article describes a skew, as it was a defective switch "out
of the box".
But, you must also look at the size of the ring of keys involved in
situations like this. If your airplane key is one of the 50 keys on that 2"
key ring, you are putting mechanical loads on the switch that it was not
designed for.
But in the interests of learning something here, how would you secure your
airplane other than with a keyed ignition switch?
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com]On Behalf Of
bakerocb@cox.net
Sent: Monday, March 20, 2006 1:24 PM
Subject: AeroElectric-List: Key Ignition Switch
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: <bakerocb@cox.net>
3/20/2006
Hello Fellow Builders, Several of us have a real dislike for the key type
ignition switches found in many type certificated airplanes and also
installed by builders who may just assume "that's the best way".
The following web page offers another data point on why that type of
ignition switch is dislked by many of us.
http://www.avweb.com/news/columns/191792-1.html
OC
Message 8
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| Subject: | Key Ignition Switch |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: <bakerocb@cox.net>
3/20/2006
Hello Fellow Builders, Several of us have a real dislike for the key type
ignition switches found in many type certificated airplanes and also
installed by builders who may just assume "that's the best way".
The following web page offers another data point on why that type of
ignition switch is dislked by many of us.
Please put this in web page form starting
here//http://www.avweb.com/news/columns/191792-1.html
OC
Message 9
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| Subject: | Key Ignition Switch |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Hinde, Frank George (Corvallis)" <frank.hinde@hp.com>
Yes and if the this type of switch fails on a mag it sort of fails
same...sort of...If it fails when you have both electromic ignition
sysytems running through it your engine will quit.
That is why over and over again we warn of not using ANY single single
point of failure common to both ignition systems (or fuel pumps for that
matter).
In other words you need an indvidial on/off switch for each critical
component.
Good reminder OC
Do not archive
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of
bakerocb@cox.net
Sent: Monday, March 20, 2006 12:19 PM
Subject: AeroElectric-List: Key Ignition Switch
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: <bakerocb@cox.net>
3/20/2006
Hello Fellow Builders, Several of us have a real dislike for the key
type ignition switches found in many type certificated airplanes and
also installed by builders who may just assume "that's the best way".
The following web page offers another data point on why that type of
ignition switch is dislked by many of us.
Please put this in web page form starting
here//http://www.avweb.com/news/columns/191792-1.html
OC
Message 10
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| Subject: | Key Ignition Switch |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Hinde, Frank George (Corvallis)" <frank.hinde@hp.com>
You can still use a keyed switch but better to make sure it only
controls a single ignition and the starter. The second ignition will be
on a separate switch. Hard to start it unless you want to swing the prop
by hand.
Frank
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Bill
Denton
Sent: Monday, March 20, 2006 12:05 PM
Subject: RE: AeroElectric-List: Key Ignition Switch
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Bill Denton"
--> <bdenton@bdenton.com>
Obviously, the article describes a skew, as it was a defective switch
"out of the box".
But, you must also look at the size of the ring of keys involved in
situations like this. If your airplane key is one of the 50 keys on that
2"
key ring, you are putting mechanical loads on the switch that it was not
designed for.
But in the interests of learning something here, how would you secure
your airplane other than with a keyed ignition switch?
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com]On Behalf Of
bakerocb@cox.net
Sent: Monday, March 20, 2006 1:24 PM
Subject: AeroElectric-List: Key Ignition Switch
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: <bakerocb@cox.net>
3/20/2006
Hello Fellow Builders, Several of us have a real dislike for the key
type ignition switches found in many type certificated airplanes and
also installed by builders who may just assume "that's the best way".
The following web page offers another data point on why that type of
ignition switch is dislked by many of us.
http://www.avweb.com/news/columns/191792-1.html
OC
Message 11
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| Subject: | Key Ignition Switch |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Matt Prather" <mprather@spro.net>
Hi Bill,
With a chain around the propeller.. How about a padlock through the guard
on the toggle switch which controlls the starter?
How do you propose that a key switch provides significant security for
your airplane? Granted, the dumbest criminals don't know how a magneto
works, but the determined ones will. As has been discussed here in the
past, airplanes are easy to hotwire.
BTW, I don't think multiengine airplanes have keyswitches...
Matt-
> --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Bill Denton"
> <bdenton@bdenton.com>
>
> Obviously, the article describes a skew, as it was a defective switch
> "out of the box".
>
> But, you must also look at the size of the ring of keys involved in
> situations like this. If your airplane key is one of the 50 keys on that
> 2" key ring, you are putting mechanical loads on the switch that it was
> not designed for.
>
> But in the interests of learning something here, how would you secure
> your airplane other than with a keyed ignition switch?
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com]On Behalf Of
> bakerocb@cox.net
> Sent: Monday, March 20, 2006 1:24 PM
> To: aeroelectric-list@matronics.com
> Subject: AeroElectric-List: Key Ignition Switch
>
>
> --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: <bakerocb@cox.net>
>
> 3/20/2006
>
> Hello Fellow Builders, Several of us have a real dislike for the key
> type ignition switches found in many type certificated airplanes and
> also installed by builders who may just assume "that's the best way".
>
> The following web page offers another data point on why that type of
> ignition switch is dislked by many of us.
>
> http://www.avweb.com/news/columns/191792-1.html
>
> OC
>
>
Message 12
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| Subject: | Re: Key Ignition Switch |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: Mickey Coggins <mick-matronics@rv8.ch>
> Hello Fellow Builders, Several of us have a real dislike for the key type
> ignition switches found in many type certificated airplanes and also
> installed by builders who may just assume "that's the best way".
Me too. I'm leaning towards a canopy lock and a prop lock. I've
also seen a very clever control stick lock.
Got any better suggestions?
--
Mickey Coggins
http://www.rv8.ch/
#82007 finishing
do not archive
Message 13
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| Subject: | Re: Key Ignition Switch |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Dave Morris \"BigD\"" <BigD@DaveMorris.com>
I'm wondering more about the kid at Oshkosh that likes to push buttons,
than the hardened criminal who thinks he's gonna steal an airplane with the
word "EXPERIMENTAL" written all over it and a bunch of controls he's never
seen before in his life.
Dave Morris
At 03:22 PM 3/20/2006, you wrote:
>--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: Mickey Coggins
><mick-matronics@rv8.ch>
>
> > Hello Fellow Builders, Several of us have a real dislike for the key type
> > ignition switches found in many type certificated airplanes and also
> > installed by builders who may just assume "that's the best way".
>
>Me too. I'm leaning towards a canopy lock and a prop lock. I've
>also seen a very clever control stick lock.
>
>Got any better suggestions?
>
>--
>Mickey Coggins
>http://www.rv8.ch/
>#82007 finishing
>
>
>do not archive
>
>
Message 14
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| Subject: | Avionics for Dummies |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: tomcostanza@comcast.net
I have an electronics background and am looking for an intro tutorial text for
light aircraft avionics. In particular, what the different components are, what
signals go between them, how do I connect OBS "A" to nav receiver "B", etc.
I hear terms like "resolver", and have no idea what that is. Is there a technician
out there that can recommend a book or two?
Thanks,
Tom Costanza
RV-7A
Wings
I have an electronics background and am looking for an introtutorial text for light
aircraft avionics. In particular, what the different components are, what
signals go between them, how do I connect OBS "A" to nav receiver "B", etc. I
hear terms like "resolver", and have no idea what that is. Is there a technician
out there that can recommend a book or two?
Thanks,
Tom Costanza
RV-7A
Wings
Message 15
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| Subject: | Z diagrams and fuseable links |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Jekyll" <rcitjh@aol.com>
I'm planning my electrical system and am intending to use a cludge of the Z-13/8
and Z-12. Basically, I'm deleting the SD-20 circuits from the Z-12 and inserting
the SD-8 circuitry from the Z-13/8. Said another way, my intent is to use
the Z13/8 but substituting the B&C VR (LRC3-14) for the VR shown. I'm using an
E-Mag/P-Mag combination. I thought the remainder would be identical but close
examination shows some differences (other than the ignition) which I don't understand.
a. The E-Bus alternate feed in Z-13/8 has a fuseable link and a 7A fuse but the
Z-12 has just the fuse. Why the difference between the drawings? Why have both
a fuseable link and a fuse in the same wire? I thought thier purpose and function
were the same.
b. The Z-13/8 has a fuseable link and a 5 amp pullable CB between the main bus
and the DC master power switch. The Z-12 just has the CB. Why the difference and
should I use the fuseable link or just the CB?
c. The Z-13/8 indicates the E-bus and the main bus should be no more than 6 inches
apart. Am I to read that as no more than 12 inches because of the isolation
diode (6 inch max on each side of the diode) or should it be a combined total
of 6 inches? The Z-12 doesn't identify this requirment. Should the 2 Z figures
be the same in this regard and if not, which should I use (6 inches each or
in total)?
d. The avionics ground bus shows a connection to the instrument panel ground bus
indicated as 5X20AWG. I'm thinking this indicates a ground connection based
on 5 seperate 20 AWG wires to individual faston tabs between the busses. Please
confirm or correct my read on this.
Thanks
Jekyll
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=23001#23001
Message 16
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| Subject: | Gas Detector Sensor |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Carlos Trigo" <trigo@mail.telepac.pt>
I bought the gas detector sensor kit that Dan Checkoway indicated in this
forum
>
> http://www.electronic-kits-and-projects.com/4055.htm
>
It came with a green LED to indicate the presence of gas, but since I want
it to indicate CO in my airplane's cabin, it seems more logical to put a red
LED instead.
I will replace the LED, but my (electronic ignorant guy) question is: how
can I put a blinking red LED? Is it the type of LED or anything else I
should add to make the LED blink?
The kit also has a relay-operated contact which I plan to use as an audio
alarm. Which device shall I install to have that feature? A beeper? Anything
else? Where can I get it?
TIA
Carlos
Message 17
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| Subject: | Key Ignition Switch |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Terry Watson" <terry@tcwatson.com>
In an RV-8 you could install a switch in the front baggage compartment that
disables the starter switch. You would probably only use it when you thought
there was some risk, such as leaving the plane out overnight or at a fly-in.
Locking the baggage compartment would prevent anyone from getting to the
switch.
Terry
RV-8A finishing
Seattle
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Dave Morris \"BigD\""
<BigD@DaveMorris.com>
I'm wondering more about the kid at Oshkosh that likes to push buttons,
than the hardened criminal who thinks he's gonna steal an airplane with the
word "EXPERIMENTAL" written all over it and a bunch of controls he's never
seen before in his life.
Dave Morris
At 03:22 PM 3/20/2006, you wrote:
>--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: Mickey Coggins
><mick-matronics@rv8.ch>
>
> > Hello Fellow Builders, Several of us have a real dislike for the key
type
> > ignition switches found in many type certificated airplanes and also
> > installed by builders who may just assume "that's the best way".
>
>Me too. I'm leaning towards a canopy lock and a prop lock. I've
>also seen a very clever control stick lock.
>
>Got any better suggestions?
>
>--
>Mickey Coggins
>http://www.rv8.ch/
>#82007 finishing
Message 18
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--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: Boddicker <trumanst@netins.net>
on 3/20/06 11:16 AM, Robert L. Nuckolls, III at nuckollsr@cox.net wrote:
> --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III"
> <nuckollsr@cox.net>
>
> At 09:45 AM 3/20/2006 -0600, you wrote:
>
>> --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: Boddicker <trumanst@netins.net>
>>
>> Bob,
>> I was making my third flight in my Tri Q 200 this past Sat. I noticed that
>> every time I presses the mic remote key switch, the OV light would come on.
>> Nothing is connected to ships power at this time. Using nine volt on
>> intercom, and a new IC-A6 with it's own battery. Ever heard of anything like
>> this before? I did not have the ships antenna hooked up either. Rubber ducky
>> only.
>
> Who's OV light?
B&C Specilaties.
The light comes on steady when the mic is keyed.
Today, while doing a cowl off inspection, I noticed that the small stranded
wire from the large post to the small post on the S701-1 contactor was
burned in two. I did have a OV trip a few months back while taxi testing,
but figured it was a nuisance trip. Without the small wire the alternator
has been functioning. The battery seems to have full charge. Did not use
tester it was at home. Just looked at the volt meter. Turning the master on
did not bring up the LV sensor light.
>
>> I did not notice it on the first two flights, but may have not been aware of
>> it. Had other tasks on my mind.
>
> At first blush, it sounds like the OV sensor is sensitive
> to RF. That is what we thought also but I was curious. Hand-helds with
rubber duck antennas can be the
> worst antagonists with respect to cockpit mounted accessories.
> In fact, I used my hand-held as a quick-looksee for RF susceptibility
> for hardware on the bench.
>
> Bob . . .
>
>
> < What is so wonderful about scientific truth...is that >
> < the authority which determines whether there can be >
> < debate or not does not reside in some fraternity of >
> < scientists; nor is it divine. The authority rests >
> < with experiment. >
> < --Lawrence M. Krauss >
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
Message 19
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| Subject: | Thermal wire stripper? |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: <rparigor@suffolk.lib.ny.us>
I was talking to a friend today about stripping teflon wire. He said his
favorite that he used to use was a thermal wire stripper made by American
Beauty.
I have a resistance soldering set up that he thinks is the same power
supply that he used to use.
Has / does anyone use one of these on Tefzel wire? Has anyone made a pair
of tweezers?
Thx.
Ron Parigoris
Message 20
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| Subject: | Thermal wire stripper? |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Bruce Gray" <Bruce@glasair.org>
Check ebay for 'stripall'.
Bruce
www.glasair.org
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of
rparigor@SUFFOLK.LIB.NY.US
Sent: Monday, March 20, 2006 8:06 PM
Subject: AeroElectric-List: Thermal wire stripper?
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: <rparigor@suffolk.lib.ny.us>
I was talking to a friend today about stripping teflon wire. He said his
favorite that he used to use was a thermal wire stripper made by American
Beauty.
I have a resistance soldering set up that he thinks is the same power
supply that he used to use.
Has / does anyone use one of these on Tefzel wire? Has anyone made a pair
of tweezers?
Thx.
Ron Parigoris
Message 21
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| Subject: | Re: Z diagrams and fuseable links |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <nuckollsr@cox.net>
At 03:11 PM 3/20/2006 -0800, you wrote:
>--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Jekyll" <rcitjh@aol.com>
>
>I'm planning my electrical system and am intending to use a cludge of the
>Z-13/8 and Z-12. Basically, I'm deleting the SD-20 circuits from the Z-12
>and inserting the SD-8 circuitry from the Z-13/8. Said another way, my
>intent is to use the Z13/8 but substituting the B&C VR (LRC3-14) for the
>VR shown. I'm using an E-Mag/P-Mag combination. I thought the remainder
>would be identical but close examination shows some differences (other
>than the ignition) which I don't understand.
How does figure Z-13/8 fall short of your design goals?
I presume you understand that if you close the master
contactor during main alternator inop operations that
you have the same functionality as replacing the SD-20
with an SD-8 in Z-12 . . .
However, when wired as Z-13, you can continue flight
to airport of intended destination with minimal loads
thus saving the battery for approach to landing by reclosing
the master contactor and powering up everything you need
knowing that the battery's full capacity + SD8 output
is available for completion of flight.
I don't understand what you want to achieve with the
architecture you've suggested.
>a. The E-Bus alternate feed in Z-13/8 has a fuseable link and a 7A fuse
>but the Z-12 has just the fuse. Why the difference between the drawings?
>Why have both a fuseable link and a fuse in the same wire? I thought thier
>purpose and function were the same.
Sorta . . . the operating time constant between fuses and fusible links
could not be further apart. Circuit breakers reside in between.
Sizing of fuses, breakers, wire and choices for style of
protective devices are all up to you. When you see protection
at both ends of a wire, it suggests that their are sources
of energy that put the wire at risk from either end.
>b. The Z-13/8 has a fuseable link and a 5 amp pullable CB between the main
>bus and the DC master power switch. The Z-12 just has the CB. Why the
>difference and should I use the fuseable link or just the CB?
I'll suggest you review the fusible link discussion
at
http://aeroelectric.com/articles/fuselink/fuselink.html
>c. The Z-13/8 indicates the E-bus and the main bus should be no more than
>6 inches apart. Am I to read that as no more than 12 inches because of the
>isolation diode (6 inch max on each side of the diode) or should it be a
>combined total of 6 inches? The Z-12 doesn't identify this requirment.
>Should the 2 Z figures be the same in this regard and if not, which should
>I use (6 inches each or in total)?
There are no requirements, only recommendations based on
carry-overs and rules-of-thumb from the certified world.
The rule-of-thumb for leaving a wire "unprotected" is 6"
of length. If your own thumb is longer, feel free.
If you're not comfortable/conversant with the tradeoffs
for selection of protection, go for breakers/fuses sized
for your particular load analysis. Fusible links are limited
use devices and not universal replacements for more
conventional device.
>d. The avionics ground bus shows a connection to the instrument panel
>ground bus indicated as 5X20AWG. I'm thinking this indicates a ground
>connection based on 5 seperate 20 AWG wires to individual faston tabs
>between the busses. Please confirm or correct my read on this.
Yes, this is one option. See Figure 18-17 in:
http://aeroelectric.com/articles/Rev11/18Audio_R11.pdf
You can use multiple pins within the bus connector or
take a couple of fatter from the bus to firewall ground
block.
Message 22
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| Subject: | Re: Key Ignition Switch |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "LarryRobertHelming" <lhelming@sigecom.net>
>
> But in the interests of learning something here, how would you secure your
> airplane other than with a keyed ignition switch?
>
>
I secure mine by locking the canopy. If someone wants to break the canopy
and fly my plane with winds blasting them smack in the face, that is their
life they will risk.
Indiana Larry
----- Original Message -----
>
> Obviously, the article describes a skew, as it was a defective switch "out
> of the box".
>
> But, you must also look at the size of the ring of keys involved in
> situations like this. If your airplane key is one of the 50 keys on that
> 2"
> key ring, you are putting mechanical loads on the switch that it was not
> designed for.
>
>
> But in the interests of learning something here, how would you secure your
> airplane other than with a keyed ignition switch?
>
>
Message 23
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| Subject: | Re: Z diagrams and fuseable links |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Jekyll" <rcitjh@aol.com>
nuckollsr(at)cox.net wrote:
> At 03:11 PM 3/20/2006 -0800, you wrote:
>
> How does figure Z-13/8 fall short of your design goals?
> I presume you understand that if you close the master
> contactor during main alternator inop operations that
> you have the same functionality as replacing the SD-20
> with an SD-8 in Z-12 . . .
>
Well, I think I said that 13/8 is using a generic Ford VR and that I looking at
using the B&C VR part number LRC3-14. In looking at 13/8 and 12, I at first thought
the only difference in the main alternator wiring is that the crow bar
and low voltage monitoring portions depicted in the 13/8 are internal to the B&C
VR used on the Z-12. But then I noticed subtle differences in the form of the
fuseable links I mentioned.
I'm no genius at this stuff so I bought your book and use your site for assistance.
Though I'm a babe in the woods with wiring airplanes, the main alternator
circuitry and the logic flow between the e-bus, main bus, bat bus and instrument
bus appear to be the same. This causes me to wonder why the differences I
mentioned exist namely the fuseable link between the e bus and switch, the fuseable
link between the main bus and the alt CB. With the similarities between
the 2 drawings, I would have expected the same callouts in these areas.
So- why fuseable links in one and not the other? I'm not critisizing your designs,
just trying to understand so that I can wire my bird with the confidence that
comes from understanding.
Jekyll
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=23059#23059
Message 24
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| Subject: | Key Ignition Switch |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Robert G. Wright" <armywrights@adelphia.net>
Bill,
Do a quick friendly ramp check on your local Bell 206 JetRanger. There is a
key switch that enables/disables the starter circuit, but in itself has no
bearing on the operation of the start switch. In fact the keyswitch is on
the Pilot's side of the center console beside his calf, and the starter
switch is on the collective. I'm thinking about using some kind of
arrangement like this to disable the starter circuit on my airplane and keep
it safer from theft...
Rob
RV-10
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Bill
Denton
Sent: Monday, March 20, 2006 2:05 PM
Subject: RE: AeroElectric-List: Key Ignition Switch
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Bill Denton" <bdenton@bdenton.com>
Obviously, the article describes a skew, as it was a defective switch "out
of the box".
But, you must also look at the size of the ring of keys involved in
situations like this. If your airplane key is one of the 50 keys on that 2"
key ring, you are putting mechanical loads on the switch that it was not
designed for.
But in the interests of learning something here, how would you secure your
airplane other than with a keyed ignition switch?
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com]On Behalf Of
bakerocb@cox.net
Sent: Monday, March 20, 2006 1:24 PM
Subject: AeroElectric-List: Key Ignition Switch
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: <bakerocb@cox.net>
3/20/2006
Hello Fellow Builders, Several of us have a real dislike for the key type
ignition switches found in many type certificated airplanes and also
installed by builders who may just assume "that's the best way".
The following web page offers another data point on why that type of
ignition switch is dislked by many of us.
http://www.avweb.com/news/columns/191792-1.html
OC
Message 25
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| Subject: | Re: Key Ignition Switch |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: Brian Lloyd <brian-yak@lloyd.com>
Dave Morris "BigD" wrote:
> --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Dave Morris \"BigD\"" <BigD@DaveMorris.com>
>
> I'm wondering more about the kid at Oshkosh that likes to push buttons,
> than the hardened criminal who thinks he's gonna steal an airplane with the
> word "EXPERIMENTAL" written all over it and a bunch of controls he's never
> seen before in his life.
And that happens. I climbed into my airplane to fly in the airshow at
OSH several years ago only to find every switch in the airplane, master
included, turned on and battery dead. No flight for me that day.
--
Brian Lloyd 361 Catterline Way
brian-yak at lloyd dot com Folsom, CA 95630
+1.916.367.2131 (voice) +1.270.912.0788 (fax)
I fly because it releases my mind from the tyranny of petty things . . .
- Antoine de Saint-Exupery
Message 26
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| Subject: | Key Ignition Switch |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Ed Holyoke" <bicyclop@pacbell.net>
A throttle lock would do more good than a key switch.
Pax,
Ed Holyoke
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Bill
Denton
Sent: Monday, March 20, 2006 12:05 PM
Subject: RE: AeroElectric-List: Key Ignition Switch
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Bill Denton"
<bdenton@bdenton.com>
Obviously, the article describes a skew, as it was a defective switch
"out
of the box".
But, you must also look at the size of the ring of keys involved in
situations like this. If your airplane key is one of the 50 keys on that
2"
key ring, you are putting mechanical loads on the switch that it was not
designed for.
But in the interests of learning something here, how would you secure
your
airplane other than with a keyed ignition switch?
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com]On Behalf Of
bakerocb@cox.net
Sent: Monday, March 20, 2006 1:24 PM
Subject: AeroElectric-List: Key Ignition Switch
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: <bakerocb@cox.net>
3/20/2006
Hello Fellow Builders, Several of us have a real dislike for the key
type
ignition switches found in many type certificated airplanes and also
installed by builders who may just assume "that's the best way".
The following web page offers another data point on why that type of
ignition switch is dislked by many of us.
http://www.avweb.com/news/columns/191792-1.html
OC
Message 27
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| Subject: | Re: Z diagrams and fuseable links |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Bill Schlatterer" <billschlatterer@sbcglobal.net>
Bob, your original Z13 from a couple of years back used the LRC3-14
regulator but recently you pulled that one and substituted a diagram using
the Ford Regulator. I understood Jekyll to say that he was using the Z13
diagram but needed to pull the regulator circuit from Z12 which you still
show with the LRC3-14. Thus the blend of Z13 and Z12. I have an old copy
of the original Z13 with the B&C regulator if that would help!
If I were to ask you for my perfect Z13 it would be the Z13/8 with B&C
regulator and one P-Mag,... But then you always said "they are just
architecture examples, modify as needed". :-)
Thanks for all your help!
Bill S
7a wiring
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Jekyll
Sent: Monday, March 20, 2006 9:57 PM
Subject: AeroElectric-List: Re: Z diagrams and fuseable links
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Jekyll" <rcitjh@aol.com>
nuckollsr(at)cox.net wrote:
> At 03:11 PM 3/20/2006 -0800, you wrote:
>
> How does figure Z-13/8 fall short of your design goals?
> I presume you understand that if you close the master
> contactor during main alternator inop operations that
> you have the same functionality as replacing the SD-20
> with an SD-8 in Z-12 . . .
>
Well, I think I said that 13/8 is using a generic Ford VR and that I looking
at using the B&C VR part number LRC3-14. In looking at 13/8 and 12, I at
first thought the only difference in the main alternator wiring is that the
crow bar and low voltage monitoring portions depicted in the 13/8 are
internal to the B&C VR used on the Z-12. But then I noticed subtle
differences in the form of the fuseable links I mentioned.
I'm no genius at this stuff so I bought your book and use your site for
assistance. Though I'm a babe in the woods with wiring airplanes, the main
alternator circuitry and the logic flow between the e-bus, main bus, bat bus
and instrument bus appear to be the same. This causes me to wonder why the
differences I mentioned exist namely the fuseable link between the e bus and
switch, the fuseable link between the main bus and the alt CB. With the
similarities between the 2 drawings, I would have expected the same callouts
in these areas.
So- why fuseable links in one and not the other? I'm not critisizing your
designs, just trying to understand so that I can wire my bird with the
confidence that comes from understanding.
Jekyll
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=23059#23059
Message 28
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| Subject: | Key Ignition Switch |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <nuckollsr@cox.net>
At 09:07 PM 3/20/2006 -0800, you wrote:
>--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Ed Holyoke" <bicyclop@pacbell.net>
>
>A throttle lock would do more good than a key switch.
>
>Pax,
. . . or a padded chain over the prop. I've talked with
numerous operators who prefer this method. It's right out
in front so the midnight airplane shopper will see it
right off. Further, it's right out in front where any
attempts to removed it (time consuming) is more
likely to be observed. It's inexpensive even when the
hardest chain and locks are used and one size fits most.
http://www.aeroelectric.com/Pictures/Misc/AC_Theft_Protection.jpg
A keyed mag switch is only a slight inconvenience. I once
lost the key to a rental machine and brought the
airplane home by breaking the p-lead terminals off the
back of the mags with my fingers, hand-propped the
airplane and came home. 20 minutes with a crimp tool
and strippers repaired the 'work-around' and I cut some
new keys from the office spare. Others have told me
that they did similar work-arounds by breaking the
terminals off at the mag switch. One or the
other is easy to get at. If you're really
crude . . . a pair of diagonal wire cutters works too.
Bob . . .
Message 29
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| Subject: | Re: Gas Detector Sensor |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: Mickey Coggins <mick-matronics@rv8.ch>
> I will replace the LED, but my (electronic ignorant guy) question is: how
> can I put a blinking red LED? Is it the type of LED or anything else I
> should add to make the LED blink?
Carlos, if you send me your postal address I can send you a
blinking red LED. I bought some from Fry's last time I
was in the US, but I'm not going to use them. They take
12v input - I hope that's what you need.
--
Mickey Coggins
http://www.rv8.ch/
#82007 finishing
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