Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 07:38 AM - automatic electric trim switch (Mickey Coggins)
2. 12:39 PM - AW: automatic electric trim switch (Europa (Alfred Buess))
3. 01:14 PM - Re: Burned out switch (europa flugzeug fabrik)
4. 03:28 PM - Forced Learning (Speedy11@aol.com)
5. 04:04 PM - automatic electric trim switch (Paul McAllister)
6. 04:12 PM - Re: Re: Burned out switch (Vern Little)
7. 06:19 PM - charging system problems (Collin Campbell)
8. 06:26 PM - Re: Re: Burned out switch (Richard E. Tasker)
9. 06:39 PM - Re: new to this list (Robert L. Nuckolls, III)
10. 06:48 PM - Re: new to this list (Robert L. Nuckolls, III)
11. 06:54 PM - Off line for a few days . . . (Robert L. Nuckolls, III)
12. 07:10 PM - Re: automatic electric trim switch (RV Builder (Michael Sausen))
13. 07:15 PM - Re: Burned out switch (europa flugzeug fabrik)
14. 08:47 PM - Re: AW: automatic electric trim switch (Mickey Coggins)
15. 09:15 PM - Re: Off line for a few days . . . (raymondj)
Message 1
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Subject: | automatic electric trim switch |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: Mickey Coggins <mick-matronics@rv8.ch>
Hi,
I'm installing a trio avionics altitude hold, and it has a cool feature
where it will trim the aircraft for you when it is on. They recommend a
radio shack bridge rectifier (part number 276-1183) and a DPDT relay
(275-206) to allow the normal trim to work even when the altitude hold
is engaged.
I vaguely recall someone selling a little kit with a the stuff needed so
that the pilot and co-pilot can use the trim without having to switch
manually. I assume this must be the same thing. Anyone have any links
to this product? I'd like to see if it either has better packaging or
other features that might be useful.
Thanks,
Mickey
--
Mickey Coggins
http://www.rv8.ch/
#82007 finishing
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Subject: | automatic electric trim switch |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Europa (Alfred Buess)" <ykibuess@bluewin.ch>
Mickey,
I use the Matronics Governor - http://www.matronics.com/governor/index.htm -
it has the additional advantage of speed regulation of your trim servo.
Greetings from Zollikofen and best wishes,
Alfred
Alfred Buess
Europa XS #097, Monowheel, Foam shortwing, Rotax 912S, Airmaster 332 CS
-----Ursprngliche Nachricht-----
Von: owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com] Im Auftrag von Mickey
Coggins
Gesendet: Sonntag, 8. Oktober 2006 15:35
An: aeroelectric-list@matronics.com
Betreff: AeroElectric-List: automatic electric trim switch
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: Mickey Coggins
--> <mick-matronics@rv8.ch>
Hi,
I'm installing a trio avionics altitude hold, and it has a cool feature
where it will trim the aircraft for you when it is on. They recommend a
radio shack bridge rectifier (part number 276-1183) and a DPDT relay
(275-206) to allow the normal trim to work even when the altitude hold is
engaged.
I vaguely recall someone selling a little kit with a the stuff needed so
that the pilot and co-pilot can use the trim without having to switch
manually. I assume this must be the same thing. Anyone have any links
to this product? I'd like to see if it either has better packaging or
other features that might be useful.
Thanks,
Mickey
--
Mickey Coggins
http://www.rv8.ch/
#82007 finishing
Message 3
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Subject: | Re: Burned out switch |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "europa flugzeug fabrik" <n3eu@comcast.net>
rv-9a-online(at)telus.net wrote:
> The strobe has about a constant 7 amp load (nominal). If the voltage drop, this
current increases, as I mentioned... thus overloading the switch and circuit
breaker.
Uh, no, the current decreases with decreased voltage.
Fred F.
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=66562#66562
Message 4
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Dave,
Why do you think everyone must study and learn the "lesson?"
We are all learned people in different subject areas. I am willing to bet
that anyone who monitors or participates in this forum is not lazy, ignorant,
stupid, or unwilling to learn. In fact, just the opposite is true. We are all
learning.
BUT, when all I need is the time, then that's all I need! I have other, more
important things to do than learn how to build the clock (it probably
wouldn't keep correct time anyway).
Academics don't understand that.
Engineers and pilots do.
Stan Sutterfield
Tampa
RV-8A
"Dude!, I asked you for the time,
not how to build a clock!" reaction, usually from those taking a
course because it's required, not because they are interested in the
subject. As a guy who can only understand amps and volts in terms of
water spurting from a garden hose - and I have to be looking at one
to get a clear picture, I am more likely than most on this list to
reach for the inhaler if an answer to a question leaves me with
another question. But, hey, I figure I'm learning, so I reach for
the 'Connection, call Stein, reread installation instructions, search
the archives, kick the cat, or have another beer, and try to work it
out for myself.
Message 5
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Subject: | automatic electric trim switch |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Paul McAllister" <paul.mcallister@qia.net>
Mickey,
I have the one Matt sells and its great!. Take a look at
http://www.matronics.com/governor/index.htm
Paul
Europa N378PJ
Message 6
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Subject: | Re: Burned out switch |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: Vern Little <rv-9a-online@telus.net>
Sorry, Fred... the strobe power supply is a "constant power" as opposed
to a resistive load device. If you decrease the voltage to the power
supply (subject to the lower operating limit), the current increases in
order for it to generate the same strobe output power.
That's why the current required at 28V is about half that required at 12V.
Vern
europa flugzeug fabrik wrote:
> --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "europa flugzeug fabrik" <n3eu@comcast.net>
>
>
> rv-9a-online(at)telus.net wrote:
>> The strobe has about a constant 7 amp load (nominal). If the voltage drop,
this current increases, as I mentioned... thus overloading the switch and circuit
breaker.
>
> Uh, no, the current decreases with decreased voltage.
>
> Fred F.
>
>
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=66562#66562
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
Message 7
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Subject: | charging system problems |
I am still trying to figure this thing out. The bus voltage is a
constant 14.5 volts. On the last two flights I made (1hr each) I had to
reset the system twice in the first 10 min or so. The rest of the
flight everything seemed to work fine.
Collin,
Bearhawk (N370CC)
>Let me try to describe the problem as best I can. I am using a Van's
35
>amp alt. a VR-371 voltage/over-voltage protector, and a Electronics
>International (VA-1) guage installed in the alt lead. Also using a
Odyssey
>680 battery.
>
>The problem is this: Everything seems to work just fine until maybe
10-15
>minutes into the flight when the discharge light on the VA-1 comes on.
I
>can reset the system by recyling the field breaker and everything goes
>back to normal--charging again. This will last maybe another 10-15
>minutes and the whole process repeats itself. I have checked all my
>conections, replaced the battery, and now am beginning to suspect the
>alternator or even the regulator. But I need some advice before I go
>replacing stuff that doesn't need replacing. (been there done that
before!)
If your system needs "reset", then the symptoms suggest
that the OV protection system in your voltage regulator
is being tripped. This becomes a problem of deducing whether
a real OV condition existed -or- the circuit is being nuisance
tripped.
It's a rational component of troubleshooting to suspect
any component. But it's much better to do measurements
to determine the physics behind the difficulty before embarking
on a swaptronics excursion where one can only hope to pick
the right component . . . with the attendant risk that NONE
of the components replaced will fix the problem.
What are your bus voltages when the system is operating
normally? I'm curious as to how you integrated the VR-371
voltage regulator with a Van's alterantor. I was under the
impression that Van's sold only internally regulated machines.
Let's do the detective work before you pull out any hardware.
Bob . . .
Message 8
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Subject: | Re: Burned out switch |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Richard E. Tasker" <retasker@optonline.net>
europa flugzeug fabrik wrote:
>--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "europa flugzeug fabrik" <n3eu@comcast.net>
>
>
>rv-9a-online(at)telus.net wrote:
>
>
>>The strobe has about a constant 7 amp load (nominal). If the voltage drop, this
current increases, as I mentioned... thus overloading the switch and circuit
breaker.
>>
>>
>
>Uh, no, the current decreases with decreased voltage.
>
>
Uh, no, yourself. This is an electronic product and will try to keep
the strobe firing voltage the same regardless of the input voltage.
That means that the power to the strobe head is relatively constant -
which is what you want. To do this the strobe supply draws more current
if the input voltage falls (power = voltage x current).
Dick Tasker
--
Please Note:
No trees were destroyed in the sending of this message. We do concede, however,
that a significant number of electrons may have been temporarily inconvenienced.
--
Message 9
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Subject: | Re: new to this list |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <nuckollsr@cox.net>
Mike,
Welcome aboard! You've met a few folks on the List and
for the short term at least, I'll leave you in good
hands. I've got some pressing family matters that
will keep me out of circulation for a few days.
Bob . . .
At 07:57 AM 10/7/2006 -0800, you wrote:
>Hello,
>
>I have just completed the fuselage on the RV-9 I am building and am about
>to begin the process of putting in all things electric. I find myself
>overwhelmed with the vast unknown pool of knowledge and I just don't know
>where to jump in or begin.
>
>I have the Aeroelectric book on order. I have talked with Bob.
>
>Up until this point in the building process I have found pretty clear
>instructions for each step (ok, sometimes the plans and drawings were a
>little vague) but not for electric installation.
>
>Is there a "cook book" to use to at least have a place to begin?
>
>Mike Ice
>Anchorage, Alaska
Message 10
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Subject: | Re: new to this list |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <nuckollsr@cox.net>
At 09:25 PM 10/7/2006 -0800, you wrote:
>--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Michael T. Ice" <aurbo@ak.net>
>
>Dave,
>
>Thanks for the great ideas. I have begun to make lists and your right it
>gives me something to do which is a big help.
>
>Mike
Check out the blank form at:
http://www.aeroelectric.com/articles/LoadAnalysis.pdf
You need one for EACH bus, typically main, e-bus and battery bus.
Work this in #2 pencil and use pink eraser for modifying the
work product. If you're handy with Excel, you might consider
downloading the spread sheets at:
http://www.aeroelectric.com/PPS/Load_Analysis
These are good examples and starting points for developing
a load analysis that describes what your dream machine
is going to look like. This is a good exercise to do BEFORE
you buy any hardware or start drilling holes in the panel.
The load analysis is a living document so get comfortable
with it (you'll be 95% DONE until a year after the airplane
flies).
Bob . . .
Message 11
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Subject: | Off line for a few days . . . |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <nuckollsr@cox.net>
My stepmother of some 47 years pass away last Friday
after nearly 2 years of very uncomfortable wrestling with
inoperable cancers. She was 90.
There's a gathering of the clan in Medicine Lodge, Kansas
this week. Given that my father is not in the best of health
either, I'm the surrogate head of family on my father's
behalf with number of important but not necessarily unwelcome
tasks to attend to. Should be back in the saddle on Thursday.
Bob . . .
---------------------------------------------------------
< What is so wonderful about scientific truth...is that >
< the authority which determines whether there can be >
< debate or not does not reside in some fraternity of >
< scientists; nor is it divine. The authority rests >
< with experiment. >
< --Lawrence M. Krauss >
---------------------------------------------------------
Message 12
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Subject: | automatic electric trim switch |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "RV Builder (Michael Sausen)" <rvbuilder@sausen.net>
Mickey,
This might have been it....
http://www.f1-rocketboy.com/tcm.html
Cheers,
Michael Sausen
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of
Mickey Coggins
Sent: Sunday, October 08, 2006 9:35 AM
Subject: AeroElectric-List: automatic electric trim switch
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: Mickey Coggins
--> <mick-matronics@rv8.ch>
Hi,
I'm installing a trio avionics altitude hold, and it has a cool feature
where it will trim the aircraft for you when it is on. They recommend a
radio shack bridge rectifier (part number 276-1183) and a DPDT relay
(275-206) to allow the normal trim to work even when the altitude hold
is engaged.
I vaguely recall someone selling a little kit with a the stuff needed so
that the pilot and co-pilot can use the trim without having to switch
manually. I assume this must be the same thing. Anyone have any links
to this product? I'd like to see if it either has better packaging or
other features that might be useful.
Thanks,
Mickey
--
Mickey Coggins
http://www.rv8.ch/
#82007 finishing
Message 13
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Subject: | Re: Burned out switch |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "europa flugzeug fabrik" <n3eu@comcast.net>
rv-9a-online(at)telus.net wrote:
> Sorry, Fred... the strobe power supply is a "constant power" as opposed to a
resistive load device. If you decrease the voltage to the power supply (subject
to the lower operating limit), the current increases in order for it to generate
the same strobe output power.
If you are referring to a strobe power supply designed for 14V/28V, well then yes
we do have a different story. Whelen is like that, but I just now put a 4.0
A Whelen PS on the electronics bench, and the 4.0V spec is apparently peak current,
which occurs in a very brief spike. At 12.3V, that spike is 4.5A, and
mostly below 4.0 through the up/down cycle. At 14.1V, it is within spec at brief
peak. For a 7A Whelen supply, that predicts to no more than an extra 1.0
amp at peak run off batt only, verses charging voltage. If we then look at the
trip curves of a breaker, we will see that a 10A breaker (presume you have
that) does not trip instantly at 10A, or even a notable amount above that, except
after many seconds lapsing. So whats causing your problem such as to burn
up fast-ons, I dont know. Perhaps others can help.
Fred F.
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=66644#66644
Message 14
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Subject: | Re: automatic electric trim switch |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: Mickey Coggins <mick-matronics@rv8.ch>
Europa (Alfred Buess) wrote:
> I use the Matronics Governor - http://www.matronics.com/governor/index.htm -
> it has the additional advantage of speed regulation of your trim servo.
Thanks for the pointers! I also found one on this site:
http://www.strongpitchtrim.com/
With the rocketboy trim, I now have three to chose from. Most excellent!
--
Mickey Coggins
http://www.rv8.ch/
#82007 finishing
Message 15
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Subject: | Off line for a few days . . . |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "raymondj" <raymondj@frontiernet.net>
Sorry to hear of your loss.
Raymond Julian
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com]On Behalf Of Robert
L. Nuckolls, III
Sent: Sunday, October 08, 2006 8:53 PM
Subject: AeroElectric-List: Off line for a few days . . .
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III"
<nuckollsr@cox.net>
My stepmother of some 47 years pass away last Friday
after nearly 2 years of very uncomfortable wrestling with
inoperable cancers. She was 90.
There's a gathering of the clan in Medicine Lodge, Kansas
this week. Given that my father is not in the best of health
either, I'm the surrogate head of family on my father's
behalf with number of important but not necessarily unwelcome
tasks to attend to. Should be back in the saddle on Thursday.
Bob . . .
---------------------------------------------------------
< What is so wonderful about scientific truth...is that >
< the authority which determines whether there can be >
< debate or not does not reside in some fraternity of >
< scientists; nor is it divine. The authority rests >
< with experiment. >
< --Lawrence M. Krauss >
---------------------------------------------------------
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