Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 01:21 AM - RV10 VOR/GS Antenna (Richard Garforth)
2. 05:41 AM - Re: SD-8 Self-Excitation Option (Robert L. Nuckolls, III)
3. 05:45 AM - Re: rv10 antennas (Robert L. Nuckolls, III)
4. 05:58 AM - Ground Wire for Starter Contactor? (Tinne maha)
5. 06:06 AM - Re: charging system problems (Robert L. Nuckolls, III)
6. 06:11 AM - Re: another dark and stormy night story (Robert L. Nuckolls, III)
7. 08:52 AM - anti-rotation washer (Fergus Kyle)
8. 10:45 AM - Re: Ground Wire for Starter Contactor? (Robert L. Nuckolls, III)
9. 11:22 AM - Re: Ground Wire for Starter Contactor? (Mickey Coggins)
10. 11:45 AM - Re: Ground Wire for Starter Contactor? (Robert L. Nuckolls, III)
11. 11:53 AM - Re: anti-rotation washer (Robert L. Nuckolls, III)
12. 01:13 PM - need AOL Communicator (philwhite9@aol.com)
13. 02:38 PM - Re: another dark and stormy night story (B Tomm)
14. 07:38 PM - Re: rv10 antennas (Peter Pengilly)
15. 07:51 PM - Re: Ground Wire for Starter Contactor? (DonVS)
16. 08:10 PM - Re: AeroElectric-List Digest: 38 Msgs - 10/02/06 (Lee Logan)
17. 08:13 PM - Re: Ground Wire for Starter Contactor? (Robert L. Nuckolls, III)
18. 08:57 PM - Re: Ground Wire for Starter Contactor? (DonVS)
Message 1
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| Subject: | RV10 VOR/GS Antenna |
Hugo,
I found that the standard Commant antenna will not fit on the fin. The
rudder movement is too great and hits the dipoles. Several RV10s I saw
at Osh had them fitted to the bottom rear fuselage. Some GA a/craft have
them fitted on the fin 'back to front' to provide clearance.
Normal practice is to position the diplexer with the Nav equipment.
Richard
Message 2
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| Subject: | Re: SD-8 Self-Excitation Option |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <nuckollsr@cox.net>
>>
>> Here's a schematic that is quite common to
>> all PM alternator regulators.
>>
>>http://www.aeroelectric.com/Pictures/Schematics/PM_Regulator/Kubota_Schematic.jpg
>>
>>
>> This design looks like it's free of power-down leakage.
>> As long as the Q4eb, Z1, D6 pathway is out of conduction,
>> it doesn't appear that anything would be turned on. There
>> are no voltage dividers across the battery lead either.
>>
>> Bob . . .
>
>Gee if they had only put component values on that schematic ;)
>Ken L.
This circuit is not one that would benefit much
from gain and bias optimization. I'll bet if
you used 2N3906 for all transistors, 1K for
all resistors, 1N5243 for zener, and 1N400x
for small diodes, it would come up and run
just fine.
There are a variety of options for SCR's and
power diodes in the rectifier. SCR's should be
selected to trigger on less than 10ma else
value of R3 needs reduction accordingly.
Bob . . .
Message 3
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| Subject: | Re: rv10 antennas |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <nuckollsr@cox.net>
At 07:52 PM 10/13/2006 -0400, you wrote:
>--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: <gommone7@bellsouth.net>
>
>Good evening folks,
>Hugo with an RV10 ,actually 1300 punds of aluminum wich soon or later will
>be an rv10,
>Question I install a VOR-glideslope antenna at the top of the rudder,the
>cable finish at the mid section ,I suppose I need a diplexer in order to
>use both features,the cable split at mid fuse ,asking,will be OK ,in your
>opinion connect with male -female at the mid section an install the
>splitter under the panel,or use the juncion there to instal the
>diplexer,I wonder if will be any kind of lose in the reception.
>thanks for the help.
Passive antenna splitters or diplexers are
not something for nothing devices. For every
pico-watt of energy entering one port, the sum
of energies leaving the other ports is less than
a pico-watt. Yes, there are losses in these devices
but few GA users would find them to be objectionable
or even observable without aid from pretty
sophisticated test equipment. We use them in the
biz jets a lot.
Bob . . .
---------------------------------------------------------
< What is so wonderful about scientific truth...is that >
< the authority which determines whether there can be >
< debate or not does not reside in some fraternity of >
< scientists; nor is it divine. The authority rests >
< with experiment. >
< --Lawrence M. Krauss >
---------------------------------------------------------
Message 4
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| Subject: | Ground Wire for Starter Contactor? |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Tinne maha" <tinnemaha@hotmail.com>
Hi List,
I followed the Z-11 diagram for my simple system & see that the starter
contactor has a 'firewall ground'. To me, that means it grounds through the
stainless steel firewall it is mounted on. Indeed, that is what my ohmeter
says & I'm confident it will perform fine (As I'm not flying yet & haven't
quite fired up the engine yet, I haven't actually seen the contactor work)
However, this seems to conflict with the single point ground idea basic to
Bob's philosophy. My starter contactor is the only component of my system
without a dedicated wire running to the forest of ground tabs.
Any experienced advice or opinions on this?
I've been absent the list for a long time & couldn't find anything on this
in the archives. Hope you haven't already gone over it a hundred times.
Thanks,
Grant
Message 5
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| Subject: | Re: charging system problems |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <nuckollsr@cox.net>
At 08:55 PM 10/13/2006 -0500, you wrote:
>--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Collin Campbell"
><collinc@alltel.net>
>
>Matt,
>
>Ok, I forgot to mention that the discharge light comes on. The amp
>reading goes to "0" and the voltage drops to 12.8 (a fully charged battery)
>
>Thanks for the reply
>
>Collin
Given that the alternator in question is externally regulatred,
the system lends itself to rudimentary trouble shooting techniques.
I believe I referred you to Note 8 on page Z-8 of
http://aeroelectric.com/articles/Rev11/AppZ_R11J.pdf
as a guide for chasing out the bugs. It would be useful
to know what field voltage the alternator is seeing during
a failure. This means that you need to bring a wire into
the cockpit from the alternator's field terminal and watch
it with a voltmeter so you can observe and report the
readings during normal and failed operations.
Bob . . .
Message 6
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| Subject: | Re: another dark and stormy night story |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <nuckollsr@cox.net>
At 10:17 AM 10/13/2006 -0700, you wrote:
>--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Ed Holyoke" <bicyclop@pacbell.net>
>
>http://www.aopa.org/pilot/never_again/2006/na0610.html
>
>Once again they're talking about how dangerous it is when the lights go
>out, but there's no mention of why they did or how to keep it from
>happening.
>
>Pax,
>
>Ed Holyoke
It's sad that flagship publications like AOPA Pilot,
Sport Aviation, etc. are so disconnected from the
real mission (journalism and teaching) that so little
of what they publish is truly useful. It's even sadder
that folks who read the articles believe they're
getting the best-we-know-how-to-do advice simply
because of the publication's prestige.
Bob . . .
Message 7
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| Subject: | anti-rotation washer |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Fergus Kyle" <VE3LVO@rac.ca>
Beats the devil outta me, Sarge.
(a) The search button is `way at the bottom, after scanning a bunch of lines
(b) When poked, filled with WASHERS, it revealed 17 items, most of which
had no washers except if one is to read each one in order and search by
eyeball for an applicable WASHER,
(c) Thass when I gave up.
Fetch me the dictionary.
Ferg Kyle
Europa A064 914 Classic
Message 8
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| Subject: | Re: Ground Wire for Starter Contactor? |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <nuckollsr@cox.net>
At 05:57 AM 10/14/2006 -0700, you wrote:
>--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Tinne maha" <tinnemaha@hotmail.com>
>
>Hi List,
>
>I followed the Z-11 diagram for my simple system & see that the starter
>contactor has a 'firewall ground'. To me, that means it grounds through
>the stainless steel firewall it is mounted on. Indeed, that is what my
>ohmeter says & I'm confident it will perform fine (As I'm not flying yet &
>haven't quite fired up the engine yet, I haven't actually seen the
>contactor work)
>However, this seems to conflict with the single point ground idea basic to
>Bob's philosophy. My starter contactor is the only component of my system
>without a dedicated wire running to the forest of ground tabs.
>
>Any experienced advice or opinions on this?
>
>I've been absent the list for a long time & couldn't find anything on this
>in the archives. Hope you haven't already gone over it a hundred times.
The commonly utilized automotive starter contactors
do get a ground for the coil through the base provided
that the firewall sheet is metallic and your system
has a firewall ground stud and forest-of-tabs for
other systems.
This is fine as installed. The contactor is VERY
intermittent duty and is neither a potential victim
nor potential antagonist for ground-loop coupled
noises. I guess I should add "starter contactors" to
the list of items that integrate nicely into airplanes
using LOCAL grounds.
Bob . . .
---------------------------------------------------------
< What is so wonderful about scientific truth...is that >
< the authority which determines whether there can be >
< debate or not does not reside in some fraternity of >
< scientists; nor is it divine. The authority rests >
< with experiment. >
< --Lawrence M. Krauss >
---------------------------------------------------------
Message 9
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| Subject: | Re: Ground Wire for Starter Contactor? |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: Mickey Coggins <mick-matronics@rv8.ch>
> The commonly utilized automotive starter contactors
> do get a ground for the coil through the base provided
> that the firewall sheet is metallic and your system
> has a firewall ground stud and forest-of-tabs for
> other systems.
Sorry I may have missed it, but did we ever get to the bottom of why the
"newer" B&C battery contactors have rubber boots on the mounting tabs?
If we have that model, should we remove the boots, or otherwise ground
the contactor?
Thanks,
Mickey
--
Mickey Coggins
http://www.rv8.ch/
#82007 finishing
do not archive
Message 10
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| Subject: | Re: Ground Wire for Starter Contactor? |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <nuckollsr@cox.net>
At 08:20 PM 10/14/2006 +0200, you wrote:
>--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: Mickey Coggins
><mick-matronics@rv8.ch>
>
>> The commonly utilized automotive starter contactors
>> do get a ground for the coil through the base provided
>> that the firewall sheet is metallic and your system
>> has a firewall ground stud and forest-of-tabs for
>> other systems.
>
>Sorry I may have missed it, but did we ever get to the bottom of why the
>"newer" B&C battery contactors have rubber boots on the mounting tabs? If
>we have that model, should we remove the boots, or otherwise ground the
>contactor?
Never did see any documents or conversation that
explained why the boots were added and/or considered
a good thing to do under any circumstances. I'm
thinking we're on firm ground to recommend removal
for installation under the prevailing philosophy.
Bob . . .
---------------------------------------------------------
< What is so wonderful about scientific truth...is that >
< the authority which determines whether there can be >
< debate or not does not reside in some fraternity of >
< scientists; nor is it divine. The authority rests >
< with experiment. >
< --Lawrence M. Krauss >
---------------------------------------------------------
Message 11
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| Subject: | Re: anti-rotation washer |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <nuckollsr@cox.net>
At 11:50 AM 10/14/2006 -0400, you wrote:
>--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Fergus Kyle" <VE3LVO@rac.ca>
>
>Beats the devil outta me, Sarge.
>(a) The search button is `way at the bottom, after scanning a bunch of lines
>(b) When poked, filled with WASHERS, it revealed 17 items, most of which
>had no washers except if one is to read each one in order and search by
>eyeball for an applicable WASHER,
>(c) Thass when I gave up.
>Fetch me the dictionary.
>Ferg Kyle
>Europa A064 914 Classic
I presume you're looking for keyway washers for the
standard toggle switch. B&C has them listed in their
"all parts" order form at:
http://www.bandc.biz/cgi-bin/ez-order/order?X358218
Do a an EDIT_Find-in-this-Page search for S700KW
and it will jump to the line item where you can enter
a quantity in their shopping cart utility.
This is a good page to access for B&C. I believe it's a
single url that lists every line item available for sale
irrespective of where it appears in the catalog pages.
Bob . . .
Message 12
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| Subject: | need AOL Communicator |
Just had to replace a dead hard disk, and lost the AOL Communicator software that
allowed me to automatically sort AeroElectric email digests into the AeroElectric
folder. AOL no longer lists it as a download.
Anyone have a copy of the software they could send me?
Philwhite9@aol.com (Mazda 20B in an RV-10)
________________________________________________________________________
Message 13
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| Subject: | another dark and stormy night story |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "B Tomm" <fvalarm@rapidnet.net>
Ed
They didn't mention it because they probably didn't know what to say. Lots
of unexplained things happened in the "old days" because things just weren't
understood. Trouble is there are too many 20-50 year old airplanes still
flying today in the face of newer technologies. Makes me think of all the
old patched up cars in Cuba when they could have much newer models.
One of the main reasons I am building my own is because I want something
better than 1950' technology without the unreasonably high cost of a
certified aircraft with modern technology (if one even exists). Voltmeters,
ammeters, E-buss, Engine monitors with alarms etc and knowing how to use
them makes OBAM aircraft much better in my opinion. Having the right
equipment (technology) and knowing how to use it is better than just
"noticing" that the panel lights "seem" a little dim. I know simpler is
better when all other things are considered equal, but for me, a more
"complex" machine is more "capable". I will learn the systems.
Bevan
RV7A starting canopy today (wish me luck).
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Ed
Holyoke
Sent: Friday, October 13, 2006 10:18 AM
Subject: AeroElectric-List: another dark and stormy night story
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Ed Holyoke"
--> <bicyclop@pacbell.net>
http://www.aopa.org/pilot/never_again/2006/na0610.html
Once again they're talking about how dangerous it is when the lights go out,
but there's no mention of why they did or how to keep it from happening.
Pax,
Ed Holyoke
Message 14
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--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Peter Pengilly" <peter@sportingaero.com>
Or use an Archer wing-tip antenna (from Steinair & else where). Minimize the
number of connectors for best performance.
Pete
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com]On Behalf Of
gommone7@bellsouth.net
Sent: Friday, October 13, 2006 6:52 PM
Subject: AeroElectric-List: rv10 antennas
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: <gommone7@bellsouth.net>
Good evening folks,
Hugo with an RV10 ,actually 1300 punds of aluminum wich soon or later will
be an rv10,
Question I install a VOR-glideslope antenna at the top of the rudder,the
cable finish at the mid section ,I suppose I need a diplexer in order to use
both features,the cable split at mid fuse ,asking,will be OK ,in your
opinion connect with male -female at the mid section an install the splitter
under the panel,or use the juncion there to instal the diplexer,I wonder if
will be any kind of lose in the reception.
thanks for the help.
Hugo
Message 15
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| Subject: | Ground Wire for Starter Contactor? |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "DonVS" <dsvs@comcast.net>
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com]On Behalf Of Robert
L. Nuckolls, III
Sent: Saturday, October 14, 2006 11:40 AM
Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Ground Wire for Starter Contactor?
-
>
>Sorry I may have missed it, but did we ever get to the bottom of why the
>"newer" B&C battery contactors have rubber boots on the mounting tabs? If
>we have that model, should we remove the boots, or otherwise ground the
>contactor?
Never did see any documents or conversation that
explained why the boots were added and/or considered
a good thing to do under any circumstances. I'm
thinking we're on firm ground to recommend removal
for installation under the prevailing philosophy.
Bob . . .
I tried to get the "boots" off and gave up. I think they are oin to
stay. Any good ideas as to how to remove them?
---------------------------------------------------------
< What is so wonderful about scientific truth...is that >
< the authority which determines whether there can be >
< debate or not does not reside in some fraternity of >
< scientists; nor is it divine. The authority rests >
< with experiment. >
< --Lawrence M. Krauss >
---------------------------------------------------------
Message 16
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| Subject: | Re: AeroElectric-List Digest: 38 Msgs - 10/02/06 |
I've just seen the Garmin GXM 30 "smart antenna" for the first time.
Apparently it supports XM radio and XM weather on "compatible" Garmin GPS
systems (396 and 496, for example). Does anyone know if it is compatible
with any of the other systems out there such as AnywhereMap or Vista or
similar? The WxWorx receiver is several times more than the GXM 30. Was
wondering if it is a suitable substitute??
Regards,
Lee...
Message 17
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| Subject: | Ground Wire for Starter Contactor? |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <nuckollsr@cox.net>
>
> Never did see any documents or conversation that
> explained why the boots were added and/or considered
> a good thing to do under any circumstances. I'm
> thinking we're on firm ground to recommend removal
> for installation under the prevailing philosophy.
>
> Bob . . .
>
>
> I tried to get the "boots" off and gave up. I think they are oin to
>stay. Any good ideas as to how to remove them?
Hmmmm . . . I guess I've never seen them either. Got
a digital camera? Send me some pictures. I note that
B&C is still using the pictures I took.
Bob . . .
Message 18
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| Subject: | Ground Wire for Starter Contactor? |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "DonVS" <dsvs@comcast.net>
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com]On Behalf Of Robert
L. Nuckolls, III
Sent: Saturday, October 14, 2006 8:13 PM
Subject: RE: AeroElectric-List: Ground Wire for Starter Contactor?
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III"
<nuckollsr@cox.net>
>
> Never did see any documents or conversation that
> explained why the boots were added and/or considered
> a good thing to do under any circumstances. I'm
> thinking we're on firm ground to recommend removal
> for installation under the prevailing philosophy.
>
> Bob . . .
>
>
> I tried to get the "boots" off and gave up. I think they are oin to
>stay. Any good ideas as to how to remove them?
Hmmmm . . . I guess I've never seen them either. Got
a digital camera? Send me some pictures. I note that
B&C is still using the pictures I took.
Bob . . .
Will try to take some tomorrow. The contactor is mounted and I am not sure
that I can get a good enough shot to show any thing about the boot
attachment. They appear to be molded on and I think the legs were drilled
to allow the molding to form pass a through to hold them on.
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