---------------------------------------------------------- AeroElectric-List Digest Archive --- Total Messages Posted Mon 11/13/06: 19 ---------------------------------------------------------- Today's Message Index: ---------------------- 0. 12:39 AM - WLAS [Please Read] (Matt Dralle) 1. 01:08 AM - Re: Re: Garmin manuals on PDF file (Gilles Thesee) 2. 03:45 AM - Re: Garmin manuals on PDF file (Dave) 3. 04:59 AM - alternator woes (Collin Campbell) 4. 05:16 AM - Re: alternator woes (Robert L. Nuckolls, III) 5. 05:27 AM - Re: alternator woes (Bill Boyd) 6. 05:41 AM - Re: Transistorture (Robert L. Nuckolls, III) 7. 05:51 AM - Re: Grounding lugs (belated response) (Robert L. Nuckolls, III) 8. 06:26 AM - Joining copper wire to aluminum tube (Ernest Christley) 9. 07:03 AM - Re: Joining copper wire to aluminum tube (Bill Boyd) 10. 09:40 AM - Re: Transistorture (Don Vs) 11. 10:08 AM - Re: Joining copper wire to aluminum tube () 12. 10:11 AM - Re: Grounding lugs (belated response) (John McMahon) 13. 01:06 PM - homebuilder's kit plane database (Brian Meyette) 14. 02:11 PM - Re: AeroElectric-List Digest: 11 Msgs - 11/12/06 (Ron Cox) 15. 02:46 PM - Re: alternator woes (Collin Campbell) 16. 05:25 PM - Re: alternator woes (Robert L. Nuckolls, III) 17. 07:28 PM - ring terminal (N777TY) 18. 07:37 PM - Re: alternator woes (Bill Boyd) ________________________________ Message 0 _____________________________________ Time: 12:39:52 AM PST US From: Matt Dralle Subject: AeroElectric-List: WLAS [Please Read] Dear Listers, I sat down at the 'ol computer tonight to have a look at a few of the nice comments List Members have been including along with their Contributions this year. I was amazed at how many I found and even more amazed at some of the very nice things Listers have been saying about the Lists and how valuable the they are to them. I've included quite a few of these nice comments below. Please read over some of this great Lister feedback. No doubt you will find that you agree with at least one or two of those comments - maybe all of them! If you find that do, won't you please make a Contribution to support these Lists today!! Its fast and easy with the Matronics List Contribution Web Site: http://www.matronics.com/contribution Don't forget that I've now fully implemented the new *List Fund Raiser Squelch* feature that will automatically intercept any future iterations of my "Please Contribute" messages -- that is, *once you've made YOUR Contribution*! How cool is that? (Make sure the email address you enter along with your Contribution matches exactly your subscribed List email address. An exact match is how it works.) Thank you for your generous Contributions this year and for all the wonderful comments!! Matt Dralle Matronics Email List Administrator ================= What Listers Are Saying (WLAS) ================ Absolutely the best deal on the Internet!! -Owen B I love The Matronics... -Robeto B My wife has her soaps & I've got my lists! -Hal B These lists are, indeed, the lifeline of our hobby. -Bob R The best source of information for my a/c. -Tony C The Zenith list is the first thing I read in the morning. -Herbert H You do more good than you can imagine. I wish I'd known about you while I was building my Kitfox, but you are still an after-the-fact resource. -Ben B ..an excellent site. -Ashley M The "List" has been the ultimate help for my Zenith CH 701 project!! -Brian U I appreciate the list being here for me. -Geoff H ..a great service. -William C The List continues to be an interesting and useful facility. -David M Your list is a constant goad to keep me working on my project. -Thomas S ..a great service. -Robert W The Pietenpol list is a great resource. -Benjamin W The Yak-list is Awesome! -James S ..great service. -Robert S The features you have implemented recently have you poised to knock out yahoo groups... -Danny D I like how your forum looks/works and the list service... -Ken E ..great service. -David P Very useful web site. -Wayne E ..a very valuable service. -Chris D Great sites... -Randall R I used to look at [that other] site also but it's gotten so cluttered with advertising that I've stopped looking at it. -Wayne E Without your services, the build would be a grope in the dark... -Fergus K The information and help I've received greatly outweighs the donation... -Lee P ..great service! -Christopher D I really don't think I could be building my plane without the wisdom I find on this list. -William G It really makes building a pleasure. -James P ..great service. -Doug W I'm getting near the end of my build (Europa tri XS) don't think I could have done it with out the help of the forum. -Stanislaus S Marvelous service. Couldn't have done it without you. -Jim G Love the list, this is a wonderful way to help others... -Michael S ..good service. -Derek L The list is responsible for helping me complete this project and educating me in the process. -Jeff D Definitely worth the donation. -Ron L ..great service to the aviation community. -Tony P I have been flying my plane for 5 years (RV-6) but I still get valuable information from this service. -Don N A very helpful site. -Roland S It's a great community to be part of. -David L Great sites. -John C A great place to find and share not only information but to meet people across the country and make lasting relationships. -Uncle Craig Great facility. -Peter H Its a great source of information! -Michael W Great improvements to the List... -Edward A Great service!!! -Rich D ..great resource! -William C ..excellent lists! -Michael S Couldn't have built my RV4 without the list. -Warren M ..a great service... -James N I would not have missed [the list] for anything during the building of my Europa. -Svein J ..another great year. -Robert D ..this [is an] essential builder's resource. -David A ..excellent service. -Gregory B I've learned a huge amount of "stuff" over the past year and look forward to it every day! -Smith M ..a great communication tool... -Jon M Finished building 5 years ago, but still are lurking on your great list! -Lothar K ..a valuable service. At 11:00 pm Matronics is the goto place for my RV questions. -Mike D ================= What Listers Are Saying (WLAS) ================ ________________________________ Message 1 _____________________________________ Time: 01:08:28 AM PST US From: Gilles Thesee Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: re: Garmin manuals on PDF file > > > Try this: > > http://www2.mstewart.net:8080/Downloads/howtogetagarminmanual.htm > Or that : http://contrails.free.fr/gps_manuels.php Regards, Gilles Thesee Grenoble, France http://contrails.free.fr ________________________________ Message 2 _____________________________________ Time: 03:45:59 AM PST US From: Dave Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Garmin manuals on PDF file This site is generally helpful http://www2.mstewart.net:8080/Downloads/howtogetagarminmanual.htm. GMA340 is at http://www.garmin.com/manuals/GMA340AudioPanel_InstallationManual.pdf GNS430 http://www.garmin.com/manuals/143_InstallationManual.pdf GTX330 http://www.garmin.com/manuals/GTX330Transponder_InstallationManual.pdf ________________________________ Message 3 _____________________________________ Time: 04:59:23 AM PST US From: "Collin Campbell" Subject: AeroElectric-List: alternator woes I am still trying to solve the problem with my alternator. I have read the troubleshooting suggestions in Appendix Z (note 8). I made up the test cable to the alternator field as suggested and tested in flight. As I mentioned earlier, the problem is intermittent, the volts usually go away once or twice in an hour or so of flying. The test shows some healthy voltage (12+) on the field when the output is 0. According to the appendix, this suggests the alternator has failed. But the intermittent thing is driving my nuts. Why does it work most of the time? It begins to work immediately when I recycle the field breaker. My voltage regulator has ground fault protection, could it be that I have a nuisance problem that is tripping it? I have checked and rechecked all wiring connections and they seem fine. Some have suggested that I may have a "flying short" in the alternator itself. This would explain the intermittent thing. Just needed some advice before I resort to tearing into and replacing things. Collin ________________________________ Message 4 _____________________________________ Time: 05:16:02 AM PST US From: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: alternator woes Subject: AeroElectric-List: alternator woes I am still trying to solve the problem with my alternator. I have read the troubleshooting suggestions in Appendix Z (note 8). I made up the test cable to the alternator field as suggested and tested in flight. As I mentioned earlier, the problem is intermittent, the volts usually go away once or twice in an hour or so of flying. The test shows some healthy voltage (12+) on the field when the output is 0. According to the appendix, this suggests the alternator has failed. More than a suggestion, it's an accusing finger. There is no way a functioning alternator can be at zero output while the field voltage is so high. But the intermittent thing is driving my nuts. Why does it work most of the time? It begins to work immediately when I recycle the field breaker. My voltage regulator has ground fault protection, could it be that I have a nuisance problem that is tripping it? I have checked and rechecked all wiring connections and they seem fine. Some have suggested that I may have a "flying short" in the alternator itself. This would explain the intermittent thing. It's probably slip ring brushes. These can become flakey for a variety of ills including loss of spring tension, contamination causing hang-ups in the holders, worn out, etc. It's a 99.9% bet that the problem is downstream of the field terminal on the back of the alternator . . . and all the likely suspects reside inside the alternator. Bob . . . ________________________________ Message 5 _____________________________________ Time: 05:27:19 AM PST US From: "Bill Boyd" Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: alternator woes Let me jump in here and address a quick aside to Bob: my replacement Hyundai 95 amp alternator appears to have solved the car's electrical issues completely. At 500 bucks for the job, including core charge of $75, I should hope it would! (Leaves me wondering what hardware on that little Sonata requires a 95 amp current budget!) So, I have the failed alternator core if you are interested in putting it on your test stand. Please advise. Thanks, Bill B On 11/13/06, Collin Campbell wrote: > > > I am still trying to solve the problem with my alternator. ________________________________ Message 6 _____________________________________ Time: 05:41:19 AM PST US From: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" Subject: RE: AeroElectric-List: Transistorture At 09:14 PM 11/11/2006 -0800, you wrote: > >Bob, >I would like to use a transistor to convert a normally open switch to >normally closed. I need to switch a circut ground off. This would be very >simple with a relay, but, I would like to use a transistor if this can be >done. Is this a reasonable approach? If yes can you draw me a diagrtam? >Thanks. Can you sketch the surrounding circuitry? Do you have access to both ends of "the switch" or is one end already connected to ground . . . or perhaps 12v? What do you what the output to control? Bob . . . ________________________________ Message 7 _____________________________________ Time: 05:51:48 AM PST US From: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Grounding lugs (belated response) At 02:10 PM 7/16/2006 -0700, you wrote: >Ok, got the transponder info, now... > >I am still wondering if I need to change out the 1/4" brass thru firewall >studs put in by Lancair. I am using #2 welding cable for the >batteries. If I've done the calculations correctly the diameter of AWG2 >is .27", just slightly more than 1/4". Would that .02 require going to >5/16" studs? .25 in threaded brass is pretty light mechanically. The minor diameter of the threads is 0.2" Given our interest in gas-tight joints it's nice to have enough strength to put some pressure on the terminals when torqued to near max value for the fastener. Bob . . . --------------------------------------------------------- < What is so wonderful about scientific truth...is that > < the authority which determines whether there can be > < debate or not does not reside in some fraternity of > < scientists; nor is it divine. The authority rests > < with experiment. > < --Lawrence M. Krauss > --------------------------------------------------------- ________________________________ Message 8 _____________________________________ Time: 06:26:47 AM PST US From: Ernest Christley Subject: AeroElectric-List: Joining copper wire to aluminum tube I'm attempting to use my pitot tube for an antennae as described here: http://contrails.free.fr/instruments_ant_sonex.php I'm looking for a way to reliably attach a BNC connector to the 3/16" aluminum tube with a short jumper wire. It's to small to rivet, and I can't crush it as it still has to operate as a pitot tube. The only viable alternative I've identified to date is aluminum brazing rod. -- ,|"|"|, Ernest Christley | ----===<{{(oQo)}}>===---- Dyke Delta Builder | o| d |o http://ernest.isa-geek.org | ________________________________ Message 9 _____________________________________ Time: 07:03:39 AM PST US From: "Bill Boyd" Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Joining copper wire to aluminum tube You might try the flux paste for aluminum made by Solder-It company. I've torch-soldered to aluminum wwith fair success using this. Once the flux/solder paste adheres to the aluminum, you can pretty much join any other solderable metal to it at that one spot. I bought mine online from the company, but I've since seen it at Lowe's. Can't recall if Lowe's had only the silver solder paste, which won;t help you, or the aluminum paste, which is what you need. -Bill B On 11/13/06, Ernest Christley wrote: > > I'm attempting to use my pitot tube for an antennae as described here: > > http://contrails.free.fr/instruments_ant_sonex.php > > I'm looking for a way to reliably attach a BNC connector to the 3/16" > aluminum tube with a short jumper wire. It's to small to rivet, and I > can't crush it as it still has to operate as a pitot tube. The only > viable alternative I've identified to date is aluminum brazing rod. > > -- > ,|"|"|, Ernest Christley | > ----===<{{(oQo)}}>===---- Dyke Delta Builder | > o| d |o http://ernest.isa-geek.org | > > ________________________________ Message 10 ____________________________________ Time: 09:40:40 AM PST US From: "Don Vs" Subject: RE: AeroElectric-List: Transistorture The circuit is just a ground to tell my TCAD that it is on the ground. A pressure switch ( I can only find NO in the range I need) is in the pitot system. The switch closes at roughly 50 knots. I have access to both ends of the switch. The switch is a micro pneumatic logic 503. Maybe you know a supplier that would sell me one that is NC.The closing of the switch is supposed to open the ground on the TCAD. I can easily convert the no to nc by using a relay, but, I thought a transistor may also work?? Just making an attempt to learn more electric stuff. I hope that this explanation works. -----Original Message----- From: owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com]On Behalf Of Robert L. Nuckolls, III Sent: Monday, November 13, 2006 5:40 AM Subject: RE: AeroElectric-List: Transistorture At 09:14 PM 11/11/2006 -0800, you wrote: > >Bob, >I would like to use a transistor to convert a normally open switch to >normally closed. I need to switch a circut ground off. This would be very >simple with a relay, but, I would like to use a transistor if this can be >done. Is this a reasonable approach? If yes can you draw me a diagrtam? >Thanks. Can you sketch the surrounding circuitry? Do you have access to both ends of "the switch" or is one end already connected to ground . . . or perhaps 12v? What do you what the output to control? Bob . . . ________________________________ Message 11 ____________________________________ Time: 10:08:16 AM PST US Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Joining copper wire to aluminum tube From: Hello Ernest A few ideas that fell out of my head: Use a copper pitot tube if you can www.McMaster.com sells conductive epoxy (ain't cheap) Buy 1 foot of Erics Copper coated aluminium wire (get both sizes if strand sizes are different) and sand off copper so you have an aluminium to aluminium joint, the other end you can crimp or solder, see if you can clamp with a few aluminium clamps like adel or make some, could also put 4 strands, with lets say 1 inch contact at 12,3,6 and 9 O-Clock and wrap with Spectra fishing line, or Size E Dacron thread, or probably even cotton sewing thread and put a drop of Model thin CA to hold in place. Better? Do the 4 strands of Eric aluminium wire with 1.5" contact area. Heat shrink a 1/4" band on each end and one in the middle to hold in position for wrap. After wrap is complete heat shrink the whole thing (adhesive lined for good seal) or paint with something as CA is not waterproof. Ron Parigoris ________________________________ Message 12 ____________________________________ Time: 10:11:03 AM PST US From: "John McMahon" Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Grounding lugs (belated response) Bob, I changed out the 1/4" brass studs for 5/16" brass as you suggest for the positive and negative thru the firewall. Thanks for the answer. On 11/13/06, Robert L. Nuckolls, III wrote: > > nuckollsr@cox.net> > > At 02:10 PM 7/16/2006 -0700, you wrote: > >....wondering if I need to change out the 1/4" brass thru firewall > >studs put in by Lancair. I am using #2 welding cable for the > >batteries. If I've done the calculations correctly the diameter of AWG2 > >is .27", just slightly more than 1/4". Would that .02 require going to > >5/16" studs? > > > .25 in threaded brass is pretty light mechanically. The minor diameter > of the threads is 0.2" Given our interest in gas-tight joints it's > nice to have enough strength to put some pressure on the terminals > when torqued to near max value for the fastener. > > Bob . . . > > -- John McMahon Lancair Super ES, N9637M ________________________________ Message 13 ____________________________________ Time: 01:06:25 PM PST US From: "Brian Meyette" Subject: AeroElectric-List: homebuilder's kit plane database I've made an Excel spreadsheet of kit aircraft data, and put it up on my web site. I'm sure it still contains lots of errors and omissions, but I thought I'd get it out to people while I continue to perfect it. Please let me know of any errors or omissions, and I'll keep it updated on an ongoing basis for the benefit of all homebuilders. Feel free to copy this link & info to other homebuilders' lists. brian http://brian76.mystarband.net/misc.htm#directory -- No virus found in this outgoing message. 7:34 PM ________________________________ Message 14 ____________________________________ Time: 02:11:29 PM PST US From: "Ron Cox" Subject: AeroElectric-List: Re: AeroElectric-List Digest: 11 Msgs - 11/12/06 John, If your A&P has the authority to do it himself, he can sign it off if you do it. You'll just have to make sure he is satisfied with your plan and execution before expecting him to sign it off. He will have to inspect the work to make sure he'd be satisfied. You don't need an A&P to DO anything on the airplane, only to sign it off as airworthy. Ron > If I install an ICOM A-200 in my Aeronca Champ can I legally have an A&P > sign off > the installation?? > I am not an A&P but have done many radios installations in experimentals. > > John ________________________________ Message 15 ____________________________________ Time: 02:46:20 PM PST US From: "Collin Campbell" Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: alternator woes Thanks for the input. New alternator is on the way. Collin ----- Original Message ----- From: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" Sent: Monday, November 13, 2006 7:15 AM Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: alternator woes > > > To: > Subject: AeroElectric-List: alternator woes > > > I am still trying to solve the problem with my alternator. I have read > the troubleshooting suggestions in Appendix Z (note 8). I made up the > test cable to the alternator field as suggested and tested in flight. As > I mentioned earlier, the problem is intermittent, the volts usually go > away once or twice in an hour or so of flying. The test shows some > healthy voltage (12+) on the field when the output is 0. According to the > appendix, this suggests the alternator has failed. > > More than a suggestion, it's an accusing finger. > There is no way a functioning alternator can be > at zero output while the field voltage is so > high. > > But the intermittent thing is driving my nuts. Why does it work most of > the time? It begins to work immediately when I recycle the field breaker. > My voltage regulator has ground fault protection, could it be that I have > a nuisance problem that is tripping it? I have checked and rechecked all > wiring connections and they seem fine. Some have suggested that I may > have a "flying short" in the alternator itself. This would explain the > intermittent thing. > > It's probably slip ring brushes. These can become > flakey for a variety of ills including loss of spring > tension, contamination causing hang-ups in the holders, > worn out, etc. > > It's a 99.9% bet that the problem is downstream of the > field terminal on the back of the alternator . . . and > all the likely suspects reside inside the alternator. > > Bob . . . > > > ________________________________ Message 16 ____________________________________ Time: 05:25:49 PM PST US From: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: alternator woes At 08:26 AM 11/13/2006 -0500, you wrote: > >Let me jump in here and address a quick aside to Bob: my replacement >Hyundai 95 amp alternator appears to have solved the car's electrical >issues completely. At 500 bucks for the job, including core charge of >$75, I should hope it would! (Leaves me wondering what hardware on >that little Sonata requires a 95 amp current budget!) So, I have the >failed alternator core if you are interested in putting it on your >test stand. Please advise. Hmmm . . . okay. That's a bit more than I hand hopped. Go ahead and turn it in for the core credit. I've got about $700 worth of materials to buy to get the alternator stand running and there's no dearth of alternators already here to run on it! Thanks for considering me. Bob . . . --------------------------------------------------------- < What is so wonderful about scientific truth...is that > < the authority which determines whether there can be > < debate or not does not reside in some fraternity of > < scientists; nor is it divine. The authority rests > < with experiment. > < --Lawrence M. Krauss > --------------------------------------------------------- ________________________________ Message 17 ____________________________________ Time: 07:28:41 PM PST US Subject: AeroElectric-List: ring terminal From: "N777TY" Any thoughts about putting a 1/4" ring terminal (for 8 awg wire) onto a #10 (approx 3/16" dia.) stud on the fuse box? Is that a no-no? Thanks! -------- RV-7A N777TY (res) Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=74425#74425 ________________________________ Message 18 ____________________________________ Time: 07:37:25 PM PST US From: "Bill Boyd" Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: alternator woes Will do. Thanks for your help with the problem. Any thoughts on what a compact car needs with 95 amps?! -Bill On 11/13/06, Robert L. Nuckolls, III wrote: > > At 08:26 AM 11/13/2006 -0500, you wrote: > > > > >Let me jump in here and address a quick aside to Bob: my replacement > >Hyundai 95 amp alternator appears to have solved the car's electrical > >issues completely. At 500 bucks for the job, including core charge of > >$75, I should hope it would! (Leaves me wondering what hardware on > >that little Sonata requires a 95 amp current budget!) So, I have the > >failed alternator core if you are interested in putting it on your > >test stand. Please advise. > > Hmmm . . . okay. That's a bit more than I hand hopped. Go ahead > and turn it in for the core credit. I've got about $700 worth > of materials to buy to get the alternator stand running and > there's no dearth of alternators already here to run on it! > > Thanks for considering me. > > Bob . . . > > --------------------------------------------------------- > < What is so wonderful about scientific truth...is that > > < the authority which determines whether there can be > > < debate or not does not reside in some fraternity of > > < scientists; nor is it divine. The authority rests > > < with experiment. > > < --Lawrence M. Krauss > > --------------------------------------------------------- > >