AeroElectric-List Digest Archive

Mon 11/20/06


Total Messages Posted: 25



Today's Message Index:
----------------------
 
     0. 12:10 AM - Why? [Please Read]  (Matt Dralle)
     1. 04:34 AM - Re: Units puzzle! (Steve Thomas)
     2. 05:21 AM - Let us not dilute the mission . . . (Robert L. Nuckolls, III)
     3. 06:15 AM - Grnd Pwr Jack ()
     4. 06:44 AM - Re: Grnd Pwr Jack (Robert L. Nuckolls, III)
     5. 06:46 AM - Volume & Transmit Issues (Tinne maha)
     6. 06:47 AM - Re: RG6 coax vx. RG400 coax (Robert L. Nuckolls, III)
     7. 07:10 AM - Re: NASA and the Electrostatic (ESD) monkey... (Ernest Christley)
     8. 07:52 AM - Re: Re: METRIC! (Ernest Christley)
     9. 08:37 AM - Re: NASA and the ESD monkey... (Robert L. Nuckolls, III)
    10. 09:06 AM - Re: AeroElectric-List Digest: 23 Msgs - 11/19/06 (Lee Logan)
    11. 09:56 AM - Re: Re: AeroElectric-List Digest: 23 Msgs - 11/19/06 (Chuck Jensen)
    12. 10:06 AM - Re: 23 Msgs - 11/19/06 (Gilles Thesee)
    13. 10:23 AM - Re:Donations (Prue Motorgliders)
    14. 10:59 AM - Re: NASA and the Electrostatic (ESD) monkey... (Greg Campbell)
    15. 11:47 AM - Re: Volume & Transmit Issues (Doug Windhorn)
    16. 12:37 PM - Wig-Wag Makes Strange Buzz (Rogers, Bob J.)
    17. 01:26 PM - Re: Re:Donations (Robert L. Nuckolls, III)
    18. 01:40 PM - Some tips on using self-sticking Velcro (Robert L. Nuckolls, III)
    19. 02:30 PM - Re: Re: AeroElectric-List Digest: 22 Msgs - 11/15/06 (Harold Kovac)
    20. 03:18 PM - Re: Metric vs English oboy (Frank Stringham)
    21. 07:06 PM - Re: Re:Donations (Matt Dralle)
    22. 07:40 PM - Re: Units puzzle! (Charlie England)
    23. 07:57 PM - Re: Wig-Wag Makes Strange Buzz (Bob McCallum)
    24. 08:23 PM - D10-a check lists and POH (Jim Jewell)
 
 
 


Message 0


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    Time: 12:10:49 AM PST US
    From: Matt Dralle <dralle@matronics.com>
    Subject: Why? [Please Read]
    Dear Listers, Each year I like to explain why I have a Fund Raiser and also take the opportunity to express why I think the List Services here provide a superior experience over the commercial equivalents. I use the List Fund Raiser each year to offset the costs involved with running a high performance email list site such as this one. With the annual support from the List members through the PBS-like Fund Raiser, I have found I can run the entire site without having to inflect any of the members with those annoying banner ads flashing up all the time trying to sell little-blue-pills or other garbage nobody wants or needs. From the comments I've received over the years regarding the Lists, the great majority of the members really appreciate the non-commercialism of my List systems and don't mind my 'go-team-go' banter once a year during November to encourage members to support the Lists. I believe that the Lists services that I provide here offer many benefits over the commercial equivalents in a number of ways. The first feature I believe to be significant is that you cannot receive a computer v*rus from any of these Lists directly. Each incoming message is filtered and dangerous attachments stripped off prior to posting. I also provide a Photo and File Share feature that allows members to share files and bitmaps with other members and everyone can be assured that these files will be prescanned for any sort of v*rus before they are posted. Safe and simple. Another very important feature of this system in my opinion is the extensive List Archives that are available for download, browsing, and searching. The Archives go all the way back to the very beginning of each List and with the very fast Search Engine, the huge size of some of the Archives is a non-issue in quickly finding the data you're looking for. And added just this year is the new Email List Forum that allows members who prefer the Web BBS-style of List interaction. The beauty of the new List Forums is that they contain the exact same content that is distributed via email. Messages posted via email are cross-posted to the respective Forum and vice versa. The Forums also allow for another convenient method of sharing pictures and other files. Additionally added this year is the new List Wiki that allows members to build their own "Online List Encyclopedia" of sorts, documenting various aspects of their project for all to share. I've been running email Lists and services under the matronics.com domain since about 1989 starting with RV-List and 30 guys I knew and who where also building RVs. It has grown into nearly 70 different aviation-related Email Lists and an associated web site that receives over 23,000,000 hits each year!! Additionally, the List Email system forwarded well over 87,000 postings last year, accounting for an unbelievable 39,000,000 (yes, that's 39 MILLION) email messages delivered to Matronics List subscribers! I think there's a lot of value in supporting a service that has gone the long haul and is still providing and improving a high quality service all _without any advertising budget_! I have to admit running these Lists is a labor of love and I hope it shows in the quality of the experience that you receive when you get a List Email Message, Search the Archives, use the List Browser, or surf the Forums and Wiki sites. The Lists will be here for a long time to come. If you just want to lurk a while for free, that's great and I encourage you to do so. If you use, appreciate, and receive value from these Lists, then please support them during the Annual List Fund Raiser! List Contribution Web Site: http://www.matronics.com/contribution Thank you, Matt Dralle Matronics Email List Administrator


    Message 1


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    Time: 04:34:39 AM PST US
    From: Steve Thomas <lists@stevet.net>
    Subject: Re: Units puzzle!
    Preach it, brother! Best Regards, Steve ____________________________________________________________________ On Nov 19, 2006, at 9:28 PM, DEAN PSIROPOULOS wrote: > Lock and load! > > Dean "Yankee" Psiropoulos > > > ___________________________Original > Message_________________________________ > > > Time: 04:37:48 AM PST US > From: "Carlos Trigo" <trigo@mail.telepac.pt> > Subject: AeroElectric-List: Re: Units puzzle > > ...... the text you wrote is an excellent example of expression of > a typical > > "Yankee-Uncle Sam" position which makes the USA to be hated by the > rest of > the world. > > Carlos > _______________________________________________________________ > DO NOT ARCHIVE


    Message 2


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    Time: 05:21:45 AM PST US
    From: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <nuckollsr@cox.net>
    Subject: Let us not dilute the mission . . .
    At 12:28 AM 11/20/2006 -0500, you wrote: ><dean.psiropoulos@verizon.net> > >Please tell us Carlos: > >Would the rest of the world be happier if we just caved in to radical Islam >and all wore burkas. Which Islam would that be, Shiite....we'd get suicide >bombed by the radical Kurds, Sunni....we'd get suicide bombed by the radical >Shiite's. Which would you prefer? Or would you like us to invite them all >in to the USA and treat them like second class citizens so that they could >work to pay for our retirement and our 6 week holiday on the Riviera like >the French, British and Germans have done? <snip> My friends, I understand the frustration with folks who do not understand, embrace or even fight for the principals of liberty as enjoyed and protected by an honorable society. It's a difficult concept to grasp by individuals who are raised and live in an atmosphere of perpetual victimhood. There are plenty of blogsites where folks are encouraged to offer their views of world conditions. Let's not let this List loose its grip on the mission. I'll encourage all participants to choose their words so that they illuminate points of fact and logic in the assembly of simple-ideas into useful systems. The single biggest threat to the usefulness of our endeavor is to pitch mud balls and cabbages at anyone for any reason. It adds nothing to the mission and discourages folks from attending to the discussions when they loose interest or believe they're being attacked. The whole notion that hatred is justified by anything other than grossly dishonorable behavior is illogical but this is not the venue for the discussion. Let's strive to offer words that expand our knowledge and understanding of physics and the art of crafting the best airplanes. But without demeaning others with pejoratives and imagined or real shortcomings in personality. Bob . . .


    Message 3


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    Time: 06:15:34 AM PST US
    From: <frank.phyllis@mindspring.com>
    Subject: Grnd Pwr Jack
    Not sure I've properly installed the Ground Power Jack per the diagram from Bob. I'm wondering if I have the circuit breaker switch properly connected--which terminal goes to the ground ("Line" or "Load") & which goes to the contactor? When I connect power to the plug the test light comes on, regardless of which position the circuit breaker switch is in. Is this what's supposed to happen? I am thinking that I should be able to test the ground pwr contactor to see if it's closed by testing the voltage across the terminals but I don't get the voltage I expect (~ 12 v?). I'm using a Schumacher Model WM-1562A "Fully Automatic Battery Charger/Maintainer" (1.5 amp slow charge)when I test the system. Frank McD


    Message 4


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    Time: 06:44:34 AM PST US
    From: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <nuckollsr@cox.net>
    Subject: Re: Grnd Pwr Jack
    At 09:13 AM 11/20/2006 -0500, you wrote: > >Not sure I've properly installed the Ground Power Jack per the diagram >from Bob. I'm wondering if I have the circuit breaker switch properly >connected--which terminal goes to the ground ("Line" or "Load") & which >goes to the contactor? >When I connect power to the plug the test light comes on, regardless of >which position the circuit breaker switch is in. Is this what's >supposed to happen? I am thinking that I should be able to test the >ground pwr contactor to see if it's closed by testing the voltage across >the terminals but I don't get the voltage I expect (~ 12 v?). I'm using >a Schumacher Model WM-1562A "Fully Automatic Battery Charger/Maintainer" >(1.5 amp slow charge)when I test the system. There are several ground power wiring options in the literature I've published. Since you speak of a light then I presume you're referring to the drawing shown in . . . http://aeroelectric.com/articles/grndpwr.pdf The symptoms you describe suggest that the light fixture is wired wrong. There are three terminals on the back that must be wired as depicted or you'll get unpredictable behavior which includes the symptoms you've described. I don't think the WM1562 charger is appropriate to simulate a ground power source. This charger is of limited output current . . . about 1 amp as I recall and the ground power contactor needs about 0.7 of the total. It MIGHT work but without trying it or doing more detailed analysis of the charger's expected behavior, I cannot predict. When you connect a ground power source (try a battery with a 10A fuse in the line), the indicator lamp should be dark as long as the breaker-switch is open. Pressing the fixture should produce a light showing that ground power is applied and that the lamp is good. Closing the breaker should also cause the contactor to close. This will happen with a audible "thunk". The light will come on also showing that ground power is now applied to ship's wiring. A reversed ground power source will cause the switch breaker to open immediately after you try to close it. Likewise, if you've installed the over voltage protection option, applying 24v to a 12v airplane will also cause the switch=breaker to open. Bob . . .


    Message 5


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    Time: 06:46:16 AM PST US
    From: "Tinne maha" <tinnemaha@hotmail.com>
    Subject: Volume & Transmit Issues
    Bob et al, I just energized my simple VFR panel for the first time this weekend. I'm happy 'cuz there is only one issue: Garmin GNC 250 XL seems to function EXCEPT volume is intermittent & it will not transmit voice. A handheld plugged into the antenna both receives & transmits fine. Also, when the PTT button is pushed the 'TX' symbol comes on in the display & the click can be heard in the headphones, yet the voice will not transmit. Any suggestions on where I can begin troubleshooting this issue? Thanks, Grant _________________________________________________________________ Fixing up the home? Live Search can help


    Message 6


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    Time: 06:47:10 AM PST US
    From: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <nuckollsr@cox.net>
    Subject: Re: RG6 coax vx. RG400 coax
    At 08:57 PM 11/19/2006 -0500, you wrote: > >Before you tear it up - get a ham to show you how to check "SWR" I bet >it will be less than 2:1 - I bet it will work okay, just not "perfectly" >So what if your comm output is 4 watts instead of 5 watts.. > >The problem is the dipole is 50 ohms so the mismatch is there, but >really not all that bad. > >try it before you tear it up. > >Bobf >W%RF - amateur Good suggestion Bob. I agree. While it's not the best we know how to do, the consequences of having the 'foreign' coax in place are probably not all that bad. Getting a good sweep of antenna SWR as-installed over the full frequency range of interest would be a good thing to do. If it stays below 3:1, it's probably not worth the $time$ to rip out and/or work around the compromised system. Bob . . .


    Message 7


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    Time: 07:10:53 AM PST US
    From: Ernest Christley <echristley@nc.rr.com>
    Subject: Re: NASA and the Electrostatic (ESD) monkey...
    David M. wrote: > > Remember too, that since the gov't wages are so low, essentially the > personnel are also the lowest bidder. People who try to make things > work for the country are quickly shut down. > One thing I did accomplish while there was to save us nearly $18 M > over the course of 5 years, simply by adopting new technology. I > worked in an Army R&D group for many years. Let me tell you some of > the worlds brightest were there, BUT the constraints they had to work > with choke all creativity. At first I was a contractor so I did it > anyway. Then, when I was hired direct, I could literally feel the > walls of the cages coming down. Back in the late 80's, for example, > to buy 1 or 100 desktop pc's required nearly $12,000 in overhead on > the gov't side. Also, the place was extremely top heavy in order to > keep up with congressional and pentagon bullshit paperwork overhead. > I lovd the challenges, though. > And just so people on the outside don't point fingers and assume that those on the inside or even the Congresspeople are all idiots....assume that the $12,000 was done away with, that a department could write a purchase order for the local BestBuy and have one of the secretaries run down and pick them up. Then the nationwide news show would replace the stories of $600 hammers with stories of how the cousin, twice removed, of department head's wife is the beneficiary of a government contract for 12 PCs worth THOUSANDS OF DOLLARS. At least with the overhead, the politicians get to look like they're doing something about corrupt purchasing procedures AND someone gets a job. -- ,|"|"|, Ernest Christley | ----===<{{(oQo)}}>===---- Dyke Delta Builder | o| d |o http://ernest.isa-geek.org |


    Message 8


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    Time: 07:52:45 AM PST US
    From: Ernest Christley <echristley@nc.rr.com>
    Subject: Re: METRIC!
    >--> <emjones@charter.net> > >Saying big grown-up words like "economic impact" makes one LOOK like he >actually knows something whereas--they are just boardroom mumbo-jumbos >targeted to get knowing nods from the clueless stock-optioned MBAs who >run our companies, but are totally BS (and that doesn't mean British >Standard or Brown and Sharpe). > > The 'economic impact' is that I would have to go out and find metric AN hardware for my project, redrill all the holes, and physically swap all the hardware out. At that point, I have to again find the metric stuff whenever I do maintenance. I, like every other builder I know, would prefer to just say, "You first." If I were running a company that built water heaters, every one of them would go out the door with fitting that matched what is commonly available at Lowe's and Home Depot; otherwise, I'd quickly be out of business. May not be a national impact, but my family wouldn't appreciate how much of a patriot I was trying to be. If I were running a company that made lawn mowers, every bolt hole would be tapped to match the hardware that was on the shelves of Ace Hardware. Same logic. You call it micro-economics. I call it feeding my family. Stop calling people clueless. It is not about metric vs the English system (and it is a system, no matter how convoluted it is). The debate is a about a new, more efficient infrastructure that was designed vs an older, ingrained one that just grew out of nothing. Why wasn't the legacy system well thought out and logical like the metric system? Because we didn't even know we needed it until we already had it, and at that point it becomes painful to switch. Europeans have had the dubious 'benefit' of having their industrial infrastructure devasted twice in the past century, thanks to a couple world wars. At the point where there is no Lowe's, Home Depot or Ace Hardware, because they ALL have to be rebuilt...might as well go with the efficient system. We also see Europe and the ex-Soviet block nations adopting advanced cellular infrastructures much quicker than the US. But people forget that the new 3G (third generation) systems there don't have to compete for customers with the legacy 2G systems. It's much easier to build an advanced system if you have a slightly less advanced system to build off of. It's also much easier to implement it if you don't have the older system to compete with. -- ,|"|"|, Ernest Christley | ----===<{{(oQo)}}>===---- Dyke Delta Builder | o| d |o http://ernest.isa-geek.org |


    Message 9


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    Time: 08:37:20 AM PST US
    From: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <nuckollsr@cox.net>
    Subject: Re: NASA and the ESD monkey...
    At 10:08 AM 11/20/2006 -0500, you wrote: ><echristley@nc.rr.com> > >And just so people on the outside don't point fingers and assume that >those on the inside or even the Congresspeople are all idiots....assume >that the $12,000 was done away with, that a department could write a >purchase order for the local BestBuy and have one of the secretaries run >down and pick them up. Then the nationwide news show would replace the >stories of $600 hammers with stories of how the cousin, twice removed, of >department head's wife is the beneficiary of a government contract for 12 >PCs worth THOUSANDS OF DOLLARS. At least with the overhead, the >politicians get to look like they're doing something about corrupt >purchasing procedures AND someone gets a job. Yup, unfortunately a group of folk in every society are burdened with the notion that critical review means to "expose" every real or imagined "bad" point that one may think of. If one wishes to be an effective reviewer, it's insufficient to simply toss in mud-balls . . . I have a proposal floating around my workplace now to set up a REAL IR&D facility with a modest budget but no windows to stand in line at. ALL purchases will be made on one credit card. At the end of the month, we get a single piece of paper that lists where every dime was spent. No secrets, no intent to defraud, but no impediments to progress. When someone needs a tool or material item, he or she does all their own procurement and turns in the receipts and packing lists at the end of the month. The successful venture depends on smart, honorable folks. I prefer to assume they're honorable and to provide the environment in which they can get smart. It's up to each individual to prove themselves worthy of the responsibility and trust. ISO (or government) approved policies and procedures are incapable of offering a cost effective filter for incompetence or dishonesty. It will be my responsibility to see that funds are properly spent. Bob . . .


    Message 10


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    Time: 09:06:30 AM PST US
    From: "Lee Logan" <leeloganster@gmail.com>
    Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List Digest: 23 Msgs - 11/19/06
    This metric "world vs the U.S." debate is entertaining. But I want to make sure I've got it straight: Americans are stupid for messing up one of the many space probes we sent to Mars because two different U.S. research and space sub-agencies used different measuring systems (of the 15-20 or so there are to choose from), causing that probe to crash. This in contrast to the genius of others who've settled on a single system for all such measurements in the many probes they've sent to Mars? Just wondering... Lee...


    Message 11


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    Time: 09:56:40 AM PST US
    Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List Digest: 23 Msgs - 11/19/06
    From: "Chuck Jensen" <cjensen@dts9000.com>
    Actually, the English/Metric problem was in the software coding. The programming code used one system when it should have used the other---splat. Chuck Jensen Do Not Archive -----Original Message----- From: owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Lee Logan Sent: Monday, November 20, 2006 12:05 PM Subject: AeroElectric-List: Re: AeroElectric-List Digest: 23 Msgs - 11/19/06 This metric "world vs the U.S." debate is entertaining. But I want to make sure I've got it straight: Americans are stupid for messing up one of the many space probes we sent to Mars because two different U.S. research and space sub-agencies used different measuring systems (of the 15-20 or so there are to choose from), causing that probe to crash. This in contrast to the genius of others who've settled on a single system for all such measurements in the many probes they've sent to Mars? Just wondering... Lee...


    Message 12


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    Time: 10:06:40 AM PST US
    From: Gilles Thesee <Gilles.Thesee@ac-grenoble.fr>
    Subject: Re: 23 Msgs - 11/19/06
    Lee, > This metric "world vs the U.S." debate is entertaining. I would like to point out that my original question was "When or why did the reversion from Celsius to Fahrenheit occur in aviation ?". The debate was all between North American citizens. There is no such thing as a "world vs the US" debate in Europe. We just use units, period. We are trained to change units if need be. Just remembering to convert into inches and pounds when talking to US citizens. We consider it a matter of politeness. > But I want to make sure I've got it straight: Americans are stupid > for messing up one of the many space probes we sent to Mars because > two different U.S. research and space sub-agencies used different > measuring systems (of the 15-20 or so there are to choose from), > causing that probe to crash. It came as a shock to the aerospace and scientific community to discover that the top brass and engineers in this project did not even give any consideration to the problem of multiple unit systems. Units and dimensional analysis have a paramount importance in science and engineering. That is...in the rest of the world ...;-) Best regards, Gilles, just joking ;-) http://contrails.free.fr


    Message 13


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    Time: 10:23:00 AM PST US
    From: Prue Motorgliders <pruemotorgliders@cox.net>
    Subject: Re:Donations
    Matt I have several lists that I look at - the AeroElectric being my primary. I contributed to that list but not others. I am not sure how the support is supposed to work - support your work or individual lists. It is OK if the intention is to support every list individually - please let me know. Thanks for your very useful work Jerry


    Message 14


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    Time: 10:59:37 AM PST US
    From: "Greg Campbell" <gregcampbellusa@gmail.com>
    Subject: Re: NASA and the Electrostatic (ESD) monkey...
    Bob wrote... This gentleman has demonstrated that the most efficient pathway to success is an exploitation of time, talent and resources of "smart people" who are not encumbered by what I call, "*impediments to progress*" and he calls, "*standing in line at windows*". I've worked with some very capable associates and managers but my professional wet-dream would be to have enjoyed an association with the likes of *Dr. Virgil Elings*. http://tinyurl.com/nudtw Greg writes... My professional dream would have been to work with *Kelly Johnson* in his *Skunk Works*. I was born a few years too late for that to happen, but I had an almost equally satisfying stint working with the *Defense Advanced Research Projects Agency* (DARPA)! http://www.*DARPA*.mil/body/overtheyears.html<http://www.DARPA.mil/body/overtheyears.html> They had very few "*impediments to progress*" - and that's only one of the many things that attracted me to the place. *DARPA* is an unusually small Government agency that funds research. They were formed back in 1958 (same year as NASA) and their research led to the ARPAnet, Stealth technology, tele-surgery, body armor, and many other things. Some items are now classified, some aren't. In accordance with their mission, DARPA has had some costly dead ends, as well as some tremendous successes. They do all this with a staff of government folks that has "swelled" to 240 people since they were formed in 1958. One of my favorite DARPA examples is a useful device that went from "concept" to "deployed" in under a month during the first Iraq war. (Can't provide more details now, try again in about 40 years. ;-) Some people argue that DARPA has reached the tipping point at 240 people, and the "good years" are all behind them. I hope (& suspect) that isn't true! My background includes many years working for DARPA; first as a military officer, then as a contractor. So when I was digging wire out of dusty boxes in Oakland and benefiting from the dietrus of the NASA and Loral contract - it wasn't that I didn't understand what or why the Loral folks had to do this. Instead, it reminded me of my years at DARPA and deepened my appreciation of the time I DIDN'T spend "*standing in line at windows*" and taking unmarked ESD bags back to my desk to dig for two tiny washers that were quite literally "lost in the paperwork". So while I was both amused & appalled, I wasn't surprised at what NASA had required or what Loral had to do to comply with their contract. NASA has a very different mission than DARPA, and the NASA staff of more than 19,000 has a longer & much more complicated chain of accountability than DARPA's staff of 240. This isn't meant as NASA bashing. Instead, consider it as encouragement and a challenge for the competent folks to seek out rewarding opportunities that still exist at places like: DARPA, Scaled Composites, and other places. These opportunities aren't gone with Kelly Johnson, they're just hard to find. A good friend of mine helped me build my *Lancair ES* and now he works at *Scaled Composites*. (I know they have some DARPA contracts.) He can't tell me what he's working on, but he can't hide the smile on his face either! The satisfying & rewarding jobs are out there - you just have to find them! Greg


    Message 15


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    Time: 11:47:00 AM PST US
    From: "Doug Windhorn" <N1DeltaWhiskey@comcast.net>
    Subject: Re: Volume & Transmit Issues
    Assume you used a headset with the panel mount, but you didn't say whether you used your headset with the handheld, but if not, the issue could be there. I recently had an experience where I did not have good communications with a new headset I was trying out - turn out that the microphone under the foam pad was facing away from my face rather than toward it. Flipped it over and it worked fine. Doug ----- Original Message ----- From: "Tinne maha" <tinnemaha@hotmail.com> Sent: Monday, 20 November, 2006 6:45 Subject: AeroElectric-List: Volume & Transmit Issues > <tinnemaha@hotmail.com> > > Bob et al, > > I just energized my simple VFR panel for the first time this weekend. I'm > happy 'cuz there is only one issue: Garmin GNC 250 XL seems to function > EXCEPT volume is intermittent & it will not transmit voice. A handheld > plugged into the antenna both receives & transmits fine. Also, when the > PTT button is pushed the 'TX' symbol comes on in the display & the click > can be heard in the headphones, yet the voice will not transmit. > > Any suggestions on where I can begin troubleshooting this issue? > > Thanks, > > Grant > > _________________________________________________________________ > Fixing up the home? Live Search can help > > >


    Message 16


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    Time: 12:37:05 PM PST US
    Subject: Wig-Wag Makes Strange Buzz
    From: "Rogers, Bob J." <BRogers@fdic.gov>
    I installed my taxi and landing lights in my Mustang II kitplane, using the WigWag system described by Bob Nuckols in his published article http://www.aeroelectric.com/articles/WigWag/WigWag.pdf The WigWag flasher came from B&C Specialty. I am using two independent 2-10 (three-way) switches with independent power sources for each light. The system is wired per the instructions. Everything works as it should, with one small exception, noted as item No. 6, below. 1. Both switches down - everything is off 2. Both switches up - both taxi and landing lights are on 3. Either switch up - the light for that switch is on 4. Both switches in the middle - power goes through the WigWag flasher and the lights alternate on and off in about one second intervals. 5. Taxi light switch (only) in the middle - light is on but no flash. 6. Landing light switch (only) in the middle - FLASHER GOES CRAZY! In the last described position (no. 6.), the landing light flickers and you can hear an audible buzz coming from the flasher. The flasher seems to be vibrating rapidly (many times or dozens of times per second) between on and off. I think the vibrating mode occurs when the power runs through the middle connector of the flasher, because when I change connections from the flasher to the Landing and Taxi Light switches, then the buzzing starts only when the other light switch is moved to the middle. I do not understand why one light merely turns on when a single switch is moved to the middle (flasher) position but when the other switch is moved (alone) to the middle position, the flasher goes nuts. Does anyone have an explanation for this strange behavior? Perhaps the answer lies in the way that the flasher works, but since I do not know or understand the mechanism of the flasher, I cannot figure it out. I guess the simple answer is, "Don't put a single switch in the middle (flasher position)." But I would still like to know why this is happening and whether there is any way to prevent it. I do not want to inadvertently damage the flasher by accidentally triggering this vibration mode and leaving it there.


    Message 17


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    Time: 01:26:03 PM PST US
    From: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <nuckollsr@cox.net>
    Subject: Re:Donations
    At 10:21 AM 11/20/2006 -0800, you wrote: ><pruemotorgliders@cox.net> > >Matt >I have several lists that I look at - the AeroElectric being my >primary. I contributed to that list but not others. >I am not sure how the support is supposed to work - support your work or >individual lists. > >It is OK if the intention is to support every list individually - please >let me know. > >Thanks for your very useful work >Jerry When you donate based on participation in a "List" community, the funds go into the big server pot in the sky that helps keep ALL the lists running . . . no matter how many Lists you subscribe to, one donation covers them all. Good question. Thanks for asking. Bob . . .


    Message 18


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    Time: 01:40:59 PM PST US
    From: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <nuckollsr@cox.net>
    Subject: Some tips on using self-sticking Velcro
    In my various capacities as supplier to the OBAM aircraft industry and skunk-werkser on the TC side of the house, I've found many uses for the self-mounting, pre-stickied Velcro products sold by Hobby Lobby, WalMart and others. On of my favorites is a "Heavy Duty Adhesive, Industrial Strength" product I've been buying at WalMart in the crafts department. A 15 foot by 2" wide roll is about $8 as I recall. I've never encountered a situation where holding power of the Velcro was lacking but getting the adhesive to stick can be iffy on some surfaces. I've found that wiping the surface down with acetone (pure acetone available in cosmetics as nail polish remover. 8 oz for about $1.50). Then use your heat gun to warm the adhesive to as hot as you can stand while holding the Velcro in your fingers. Stroke it for a minute or so under the heat gun. Press into place firmly and know that the bond is somewhat time sensitive. It may take 24 hours to reach full bond strength. Putting this stuff down with the technique described has produced some amazing attachments . . . some have required the heat gun to re-soften the adhesive so I could pull the stuff up. I've used this technique to install remote mounted instrumentation packages in the hell-hole on airplanes and in the nose compartment with results that amazed folks I was working with. One skeptical technician didn't think Velcro would hold this 5 pound data acquisition signal conditioner in place. http://www.aeroelectric.com/Pictures/Data_Acquisition/Weeder_Module_DAS_1.jpg I invited him to remove it after I'd installed it. He had to go get a pry bar to open the Velcro interface and we needed a heat gun to get the adhesive to let loose of the airplane when we were done. He's convinced. Bob . . . --------------------------------------------------------- < What is so wonderful about scientific truth...is that > < the authority which determines whether there can be > < debate or not does not reside in some fraternity of > < scientists; nor is it divine. The authority rests > < with experiment. > < --Lawrence M. Krauss > ---------------------------------------------------------


    Message 19


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    Time: 02:30:56 PM PST US
    From: "Harold Kovac" <kayce33@earthlink.net>
    Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List Digest: 22 Msgs - 11/15/06
    Just like a CIC & 1/2 the congress who say NOO-Q-LAR....be nice if they'd learn to speak English I see many non native contributers to this list who spell far better than many born US. Harold ----- Original Message ----- From: "Ron Cox" <flyboyron@gmail.com> Sent: Sunday, November 19, 2006 10:01 PM Subject: AeroElectric-List: Re: AeroElectric-List Digest: 22 Msgs - 11/15/06 > >> Time: 05:28:25 PM PST US >> Subject: RE: AeroElectric-List: Temperature units puzzle >> From: "Barlow, Jim D" <jim.d.barlow@intel.com> >> >> >> This article explains the lack of conversion. >> >> http://capitalastronomers.org/ReganMeasurements.html > > But what explains the lack of spelling ability of the website's creator? > <g> > > The late former president's name is spelled REAGAN. > > There's just something poetic about someone who's trying to make another > out to look like a moron, instead doing it for him/herself... <g> > > Ron > > >


    Message 20


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    Time: 03:18:53 PM PST US
    From: "Frank Stringham" <fstringham@hotmail.com>
    Subject: Re: Metric vs English oboy
    Alright, I have stayed out of this one....but....as an old used up Chemistry teacher I would spend the first few weeks of every school year my best to explain how....from my view point and the rest of the sciencde community why the metric system of measurement IS Superior to the "english" system of measurement. With that said what ever system is used use it and always measure trice and cut once. Flame suit RV list approved so let it rip!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Frank @ SGU and SLC wiring / fiberglassing......plus RV7A >From: Gilles Thesee <Gilles.Thesee@ac-grenoble.fr> >To: aeroelectric-list@matronics.com >Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: 23 Msgs - 11/19/06 >Date: Mon, 20 Nov 2006 19:06:05 +0100 > ><Gilles.Thesee@ac-grenoble.fr> > >Lee, >>This metric "world vs the U.S." debate is entertaining. > >I would like to point out that my original question was "When or why did >the reversion from Celsius to Fahrenheit occur in aviation ?". The debate >was all between North American citizens. >There is no such thing as a "world vs the US" debate in Europe. We just use >units, period. We are trained to change units if need be. > >Just remembering to convert into inches and pounds when talking to US >citizens. We consider it a matter of politeness. > >> But I want to make sure I've got it straight: Americans are stupid for >>messing up one of the many space probes we sent to Mars because two >>different U.S. research and space sub-agencies used different measuring >>systems (of the 15-20 or so there are to choose from), causing that probe >>to crash. > >It came as a shock to the aerospace and scientific community to discover >that the top brass and engineers in this project did not even give any >consideration to the problem of multiple unit systems. > >Units and dimensional analysis have a paramount importance in science and >engineering. >That is...in the rest of the world ...;-) > >Best regards, >Gilles, just joking ;-) >http://contrails.free.fr > > _________________________________________________________________ Fixing up the home? Live Search can help


    Message 21


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    Time: 07:06:05 PM PST US
    From: Matt Dralle <dralle@matronics.com>
    Subject: Re:Donations
    At 01:24 PM 11/20/2006 Monday, you wrote: >> >>Matt >>I have several lists that I look at - the AeroElectric being my primary. I contributed to that list but not others. >>I am not sure how the support is supposed to work - support your work or individual lists. >> >>It is OK if the intention is to support every list individually - please let me know. >> >>Thanks for your very useful work >>Jerry > > When you donate based on participation in a "List" > community, the funds go into the big server pot in the sky > that helps keep ALL the lists running . . . no > matter how many Lists you subscribe to, one donation > covers them all. > > Good question. Thanks for asking. > > Bob . . . Well said, Bob. Thanks! Matt Dralle List Admin Matt G Dralle | Matronics | PO Box 347 | Livermore | CA | 94551 925-606-1001 V | 925-606-6281 F | dralle@matronics.com Email http://www.matronics.com/ WWW | Featuring Products For Aircraft


    Message 22


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    Time: 07:40:32 PM PST US
    From: Charlie England <ceengland@bellsouth.net>
    Subject: Re: Units puzzle!
    DEAN PSIROPOULOS wrote: > >Please tell us Carlos: > >Would the rest of the world be happier if we just caved in to radical Islam >and all wore burkas. Which Islam would that be, Shiite....we'd get suicide >bombed by the radical Kurds, Sunni....we'd get suicide bombed by the radical >Shiite's. Which would you prefer? Or would you like us to invite them all >in to the USA and treat them like second class citizens so that they could >work to pay for our retirement and our 6 week holiday on the Riviera like >the French, British and Germans have done? This is not a personal attack on >you Carlos, but I do get sick and tired of the gutless Europeans who want to >appease every tin-pot dictator just so their Holidays to the Riviera are not >interrupted and their lives aren't inconvenienced! Especially when the USA >pays for most of the charity around the world, protects a good bit of the >world with it's own military at a GREAT EXPENSE to its taxpayers, covers >over half of the UN budget only to have most of the members vote against it >and have mud thrown in its face when terrorist countries like Syria and Iran >get voted in as members of the human rights commission, what a joke. > >What worries me the most though Carlos (and Gilles) is the potential for all >those Islamic second class citizens in the French ghettos to take over the >French government and its cold war era NUCLEAR WEAPONS and use them on the >USA. Given the French affinity for appeasement it will likely be without >firing a shot. From what I have heard there will be lots of French folks >happy about that, they shouldn't get too happy though because the USA would >have to retaliate and given our Yankee tendencies it's doubtful there'd be >much left of Napolean's old stomping grounds. Sorry to pick on your country >Gilles but your fellow Frenchmen just haven't given me any reason whatsoever >to think that they have any sense of justice left in their heads. > >Please, you folks are a lot closer to radical Islam than we in the USA are, >you've experienced the bombing, rioting and other acts of terrorism first >hand and some even more so than we in the USA. How can you possibly come to >the conclusion that, if you just TALK to these people and be nice to them >they will stop. HOW CAN ANY REASONBABLE THINKING PERSON POSSIBLY BELIEVE >THAT APPEASMENT IS THE ANSWER? HOW? Explain it to me, I'm all ears! The >main stream US news media and leftist press around the world have everyone >believing that "cowboy" Bush just woke up one day and decided to attack >Iraq. I beg to differ, Bill Clinton went ALL OVER THE WORLD for 8 years as >president, made "nice" with everyone, sang Kumbaiya and partied with them >and what did the USA get? September 11, 2001 that's what we got! So don't >go giving me this garbage about appeasement works, we tried that and now >North Korea and Iran will have Nuclear weapons. And, give them to the rest >of the terrorists around the world and, a bunch more "civilized people" will >have to die before the Europeans decide that they can give up a week or two >on the Riviera and be inconvenienced for a short time in order to stop these >kooks. > >Please gentleman, I'm just waiting with baited breath to hear the great >solution you have to this problem, I'm waiting! I make no apologies for my >statements, I have a real passion about this and the truth is, if more >people don't wake up there won't be any more holidays on the Riviera or >worries about life being inconvenienced because you can't be inconvenienced >when you're DEAD (or persecuted under radical Islam, or did we already >forget what Saddam did to his own people not so long ago). Personally, it's >fine with me if the rest of the world does not want to be bothered by >terrorists killing people in their own countries, unfortunately it spills >over into my country and I'm not going to live with that if I can possibly >stop it! Lock and load! > >Dean "Yankee" Psiropoulos > Since under the new Military Commissions Act any response from a non-citizen could get them treated here like Sadaam used to treat his dissidents in Iraq, perhaps you will permit me, a born once (& again) US citizen, to respond. It's really interesting how different conclusions can be, depending on your perspective when viewing a problem. How thrilled do you think Americans would be if, say, the Germans decided to secure our border with Mexico for us & moved a hundred thousand or so German troops into our border states? We might think we are doing the world a favor by protecting it with troops stationed in dozens of countries, but it doesn't mean that the 'protected' citizens of those countries necessarily feel the same way. I'd suggest that you educate yourself with a little history. Start with learning how the three groups in Iraq got artificially spliced into one country. Then look at who gave the Evil Sadaam chemical weapons to start with, when they were propping him up against the Iranians. Then back up & look at who put the Shah of Iran (just in case you're totally ignorant of history: he was a bad guy easily on par with Sadaam) in power in the early 1950's. Ask yourself if that action might have something to do with the Iranian people hating us enough to attack our Embassy & take American hostages. Next, look up who was the leader of the 'insurgency' (currently known everywhere else as terrorism) against the Soviets in Afghanistan, his nationality (it ain't Afghan), & who gave him his weapons & taught him all his terrorist techniques. Now, look up who is *actually* responsible for 911. Has his name shown up before in this exercise? Same guy, maybe? What was his nationality? He wasn't from Iraq, was he? Now look up which Royal Family has been proven to be funneling money to this the guy who is *actually* responsible for 911. (You remember the one; the guy that Jr. said he didn't think about much, any more.) Were they from the same country as our Afghan/Soviet/American terrorist? You will probably have to move completely outside US news sources to find the next item. What reason did the terrorist himself give for planning & executing 911? Hint: It wasn't Bill Clinton singing Kumbaiya. Don'tcha think it would be good to at least understand your enemy? Lots of very smart military people do. Unfortunately, not many chickenhawk neocons felt that way when they got us into the current mess. Let's move to recent history. Have you noticed how many 'retired' CIA operatives have written books detailing how they repeatedly told the Neocons *before the invasion* that there was virtually no evidence of WMD or chem/bio in Iraq? That there was virtually no evidence of any contact at all between the hedonist Sadaam & the fundamentalist Muslim terrorist that wouldn't even be able to tolerate being in the same country with someone like Sadaam? (Watching something other than the Fascist News Network will probably be required for this exercise.) Remember, the CIA is like the Mafia on steroids: you never really leave. Don'tcha think it's a pretty safe bet that what all these 'retired' agents are writing are probably pretty close to the CIA's attitude about this stuff? Have you noticed how many recently retired American Generals have gone on record criticizing our Administration's actions in invading another country based on lies? Do you really think that all those guys are bleeding heart liberals? For extra credit, go to the CIA's web site, look up & list the natural resources of Vietnam. I could go on (remember the 'missile gap', from the '60's?), but I hope that by now you're able to detect a bit of a pattern. Before we deal with some foreigner's plan for the terrorists, let's deal with yours. Do you live far enough south to be familiar with fire ants? Ever tried to intimidate a mound of 'em by reaching into the mound with your hand & crushing a few to death? Did the rest cut & run or become pacifists & submit because you were stronger? To paraphrase our illustrious president on lessons learned in Vietnam, if you continue with your technique, do you believe you will win over the fire ants unless you quit? Do you honestly believe that your technique is weakening the fire ants? When you've completed your assignments, get back to me & we'll talk. :-) Charlie (just a little old southern boy who believes that conservative beats neo-conservative any day)


    Message 23


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    Time: 07:57:33 PM PST US
    From: "Bob McCallum" <robert.mccallum2@sympatico.ca>
    Subject: Re: Wig-Wag Makes Strange Buzz
    Bob; Note 1 on the drawings you've linked to, states "The SSF-1 flasher will not operate unless both outputs are loaded with a lamp. Hence the requirement to transfer both lamps to the flasher for wig-wag priority operation" By placing either 1 or the other switches but not both in the centre position you are violating this condition, hence the flasher does not operate correctly just as the note explains. (steady in one case, berserk in the other) Bob McC ----- Original Message ----- From: Rogers, Bob J. To: aeroelectric-list@matronics.com Sent: Monday, November 20, 2006 3:29 PM Subject: AeroElectric-List: Wig-Wag Makes Strange Buzz I installed my taxi and landing lights in my Mustang II kitplane, using the WigWag system described by Bob Nuckols in his published article http://www.aeroelectric.com/articles/WigWag/WigWag.pdf The WigWag flasher came from B&C Specialty. I am using two independent 2-10 (three-way) switches with independent power sources for each light. The system is wired per the instructions. Everything works as it should, with one small exception, noted as item No. 6, below. 1. Both switches down - everything is off 2. Both switches up - both taxi and landing lights are on 3. Either switch up - the light for that switch is on 4. Both switches in the middle - power goes through the WigWag flasher and the lights alternate on and off in about one second intervals. 5. Taxi light switch (only) in the middle - light is on but no flash. 6. Landing light switch (only) in the middle - FLASHER GOES CRAZY! In the last described position (no. 6.), the landing light flickers and you can hear an audible buzz coming from the flasher. The flasher seems to be vibrating rapidly (many times or dozens of times per second) between on and off. I think the vibrating mode occurs when the power runs through the middle connector of the flasher, because when I change connections from the flasher to the Landing and Taxi Light switches, then the buzzing starts only when the other light switch is moved to the middle. I do not understand why one light merely turns on when a single switch is moved to the middle (flasher) position but when the other switch is moved (alone) to the middle position, the flasher goes nuts. Does anyone have an explanation for this strange behavior? Perhaps the answer lies in the way that the flasher works, but since I do not know or understand the mechanism of the flasher, I cannot figure it out. I guess the simple answer is, "Don't put a single switch in the middle (flasher position)." But I would still like to know why this is happening and whether there is any way to prevent it. I do not want to inadvertently damage the flasher by accidentally triggering this vibration mode and leaving it there.


    Message 24


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    Time: 08:23:41 PM PST US
    From: "Jim Jewell" <jjewell@telus.net>
    Subject: D10-a check lists and POH
    I have an RV6-A 180 HP with C/S ready for first flight. It is equipped with a Dynon D10-A EFIS. It has been updated with the latest Dynon firmware edition. There is a lot of check list etc. entries to be made and I wonder if there are any people out there that would have copies that they have made that could serave as a basis for editing to fit my RV. I am not very computer literate and I'm guessing that what I think I want can actually be done. Jim in Kelowna




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