---------------------------------------------------------- AeroElectric-List Digest Archive --- Total Messages Posted Tue 01/23/07: 37 ---------------------------------------------------------- Today's Message Index: ---------------------- 1. 06:15 AM - Re: inrush limiters for landing lights (Robert L. Nuckolls, III) 2. 10:01 AM - Re: inrush limiters for landing lights (Bill Boyd) 3. 10:14 AM - LED Runway Lights too! (Greg Campbell) 4. 10:16 AM - Bundling wires () 5. 10:21 AM - Re: a couple of specific wiring questions (Robert L. Nuckolls, III) 6. 10:36 AM - Wing root connector sources. (Robert L. Nuckolls, III) 7. 10:53 AM - Re: LED Runway Lights too! (Robert L. Nuckolls, III) 8. 10:54 AM - Antenna placement () 9. 11:01 AM - Bundling wires (James H Nelson) 10. 11:08 AM - Re: Bundling wires (Rob Housman) 11. 11:10 AM - Re: LED Runway Lights too! (Harold) 12. 11:24 AM - Re: LED Runway Lights / solar (DBerelsman@aol.com) 13. 11:33 AM - Re: Antenna placement (Dave N6030X) 14. 11:48 AM - Re: LED Runway Lights / solar (Robert L. Nuckolls, III) 15. 11:54 AM - Re: LED Runway Lights too! (RV Builder (Michael Sausen)) 16. 12:16 PM - Re: a couple of specific wiring questions (Bill Boyd) 17. 12:17 PM - Re: LED Runway Lights / solar (john@ballofshame.com) 18. 12:25 PM - Re: LED Runway Lights / solar (Ernest Christley) 19. 12:28 PM - Re: LED Runway Lights / solar (Bill Boyd) 20. 12:50 PM - Re: LED Runway Lights / solar (Robert L. Nuckolls, III) 21. 12:58 PM - Re: LED Runway Lights / solar (Robert L. Nuckolls, III) 22. 02:04 PM - Re: Wing root connector sources. (Ron Shannon) 23. 02:21 PM - Re: LED Runway Lights / solar (Matt Prather) 24. 02:44 PM - Re: LED Runway - HID landing lights (Dave N6030X) 25. 03:21 PM - more direct method for designing electrical system (Larry E. James) 26. 04:29 PM - Re: LED Runway Lights / solar (Buckaroo Banzai) 27. 05:06 PM - Re: Timer module (Peter Laurence) 28. 05:56 PM - Re: LED Runway Lights / solar (Earl_Schroeder) 29. 06:25 PM - Re: LED Runway Lights too! (Jerry Isler) 30. 07:52 PM - jab coilrounds (bob noffs) 31. 08:41 PM - Re: more direct method for designing electrical system (Robert L. Nuckolls, III) 32. 08:43 PM - Re: Wing root connector sources. (Robert L. Nuckolls, III) 33. 08:51 PM - IR alternators in aircraft (Robert L. Nuckolls, III) 34. 09:41 PM - Re: Re: Jack plug question (Robert L. Nuckolls, III) 35. 09:53 PM - Re: IR alternators in aircraft (David Weber) 36. 10:17 PM - Re: Antenna placement (Werner Schneider) 37. 11:35 PM - Century 2000 autopilot harness (Bob Verwey) ________________________________ Message 1 _____________________________________ Time: 06:15:50 AM PST US From: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: inrush limiters for landing lights At 01:53 PM 1/19/2007 -0500, you wrote: > >Bob- > >what's you latset thinking about using inline inrush current limiters >for those of us with halogen 100w landing lights? I'll be using mine >in wig-wag mode most of the time, and read your archived comments >about filament cooling in half-second time frames. Will limiters help >the life of my toggle switch enough to matter? I'm not using a relay >for that load when in the constant-on mode. The whole idea behind inrush limiters grew from our experiences with basically automotive incandescent lamps adapted for use on airplanes. The 4509 sealed beam bulb popular on many early landing light installations was listed in the industrial lamp supply catalogs as a "tractor headlamp". The technology of 1930 was hard pressed to perform well on tractors, much less airplanes. These bulbs were not stellar performers in some aircraft installations . . . especially those where the lamps were in the cowl right under the propeller shaft. We began considering in-rush limiters at LearJet in the early 80's on the GP-180 program. We did figure out a way to incorporate a limiter into the taxi lamp fixture mounted on the nose gear. Unfortunately, I was unable to stay connected with that program so I have no first-hand knowledge of the value of adding that feature . . . and for a single installation on only one airplane, I'm not sure the value would have be obvious. In years hence, the generic incandescent got some boosts in performance when the halogen lamps hit the market. These lamps had inrush levels that were higher still but they were also MUCH more rugged mechanically in both automotive and aircraft applications. The notion of adding inrush limiting for the purpose of increasing lamp life sort of lost its glow. However, there were control switches to consider along with a mild desire not to put funky noises onto the bus. Here, incorporation of an inrush limiter would bring the first-current at turn-on down from perhaps 70 amps to around 20 amps. Not a bad thing to do . . . but really worth it? Consider that switch ratings are based on tens of thousands of operations. How long will it take you to put even 1000 operations on your landing light switch. Consider also that most switches die in small aircraft not from electrical and usage stress but from effects of age. I'll suggest that if we did a controlled study of the benefits of adding inrush limiters to all the landing light circuits on all GA aircraft and carefully tracked lamp and switch life . . . we would find that many other stronger factors affecting service life are so strong as to hide the benefits of inrush limiters. Noises on the bus? Yes, we can reduce the noise from that source by incorporation of an inrush limiter scheme be it a thermistor or keep-warm system. But as it turns out, the amplitude and duration of an incandescent lamp turn-on transient is less than that of a starter motor . . . for accessories designed to live in the real world of vehicular DC power generation and distribution have no operational problems dealing with it. The question was raised here on the list a few years ago about incandescent lamps in wig-wag systems. It seems logical that if each turn-on event generates a transient, that a succession of transients would result from the alternate flashing of two lamps in wig-wag fashion. Lost a trace I did on this issue some years ago so I went to the bench and collected this image: http://www.aeroelectric.com/Pictures/Curves/Wig_Wag_Currents.jpg Note that the lamp DOES produce a cold-start inrush transient for first closure event but that the filament does not cool sufficiently to generate a significant transient on subsequent events. Keep in mind also that inrush limiters are thermal devices with long time constants too. They BENEFIT only while cold. If you had one in your wig-wag circuit, it's very low warm- resistance would not vary significantly between lamp flashes. I.e, and inrush limiter needs to cool for perhaps a minute before it's benefits can be realized for the next switch closure. Bottom line is that inrush limiters are of marginal benefit in modern lighting circuits. Rev 12 of the 'Connection will remove recommendations for keep-warm and/or inrush limiters. It's an idea that has gone the way of spats and buggy-whips. Bob . . . ________________________________ Message 2 _____________________________________ Time: 10:01:26 AM PST US From: "Bill Boyd" Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: inrush limiters for landing lights Thanks for the well-reasoned reply, Bob. You even anticipated my question about wig-wag contact life, etc. I'll omit the limiters from my wiring. I was puzzled to see my other question appear on the list 2 full days after I posted it- the one about the SD-8 alternator wiring... must've been some slow-moving electrons on the information superhighway this weekend. Forgive my impatience for an answer to a question- I assumed that the posting had hit the List within minutes on Saturday, but in fact it was 10:01 pm last night when it finally sprang up. Anyway, I went on with other wiring tasks last night. I'd still like to hear what is best practice for the SD-8 system. Like I said, it's confusing when the manufacturer pigtails the dynamo with potted 16 gauge wire for all leads, but then specifies 14 AWG by the user, and the 'Connection Z-diagrams show the use of 12 AWG. Even the PIDG terminals supplied with the capacitor and regulator by B&C are 18-22 AWG red ones . Put me out of my misery, here ;-) I still have the whole fuselink/ANL decision to make depending on wire gauge selected. -Bill do not archive On 1/23/07, Robert L. Nuckolls, III wrote: > > At 01:53 PM 1/19/2007 -0500, you wrote: > > > > >Bob- > > > >what's you latset thinking about using inline inrush current limiters > >for those of us with halogen 100w landing lights? I'll be using mine > >in wig-wag mode most of the time, and read your archived comments > >about filament cooling in half-second time frames. Will limiters help > >the life of my toggle switch enough to matter? I'm not using a relay > >for that load when in the constant-on mode. > > The whole idea behind inrush limiters grew from our > experiences with basically automotive incandescent > lamps adapted for use on airplanes. The 4509 sealed > beam bulb popular on many early landing light installations > was listed in the industrial lamp supply catalogs as > a "tractor headlamp". The technology of 1930 was hard > pressed to perform well on tractors, much less airplanes. > These bulbs were not stellar performers in some > aircraft installations . . . especially those where > the lamps were in the cowl right under the propeller > shaft. > > We began considering in-rush limiters at LearJet in > the early 80's on the GP-180 program. We did figure > out a way to incorporate a limiter into the taxi lamp > fixture mounted on the nose gear. Unfortunately, > I was unable to stay connected with that program so > I have no first-hand knowledge of the value of adding > that feature . . . and for a single installation on > only one airplane, I'm not sure the value would have > be obvious. > > In years hence, the generic incandescent got some > boosts in performance when the halogen lamps hit the > market. These lamps had inrush levels that were > higher still but they were also MUCH more rugged > mechanically in both automotive and aircraft > applications. The notion of adding inrush limiting > for the purpose of increasing lamp life sort of > lost its glow. > > However, there were control switches to consider > along with a mild desire not to put funky noises > onto the bus. Here, incorporation of an inrush > limiter would bring the first-current at turn-on > down from perhaps 70 amps to around 20 amps. Not > a bad thing to do . . . but really worth it? > > Consider that switch ratings are based on tens > of thousands of operations. How long will it take > you to put even 1000 operations on your landing > light switch. Consider also that most switches die > in small aircraft not from electrical and usage > stress but from effects of age. I'll suggest > that if we did a controlled study of the benefits > of adding inrush limiters to all the landing light > circuits on all GA aircraft and carefully tracked > lamp and switch life . . . we would find that > many other stronger factors affecting service > life are so strong as to hide the benefits of > inrush limiters. > > Noises on the bus? Yes, we can reduce the noise > from that source by incorporation of an inrush > limiter scheme be it a thermistor or keep-warm > system. But as it turns out, the amplitude and > duration of an incandescent lamp turn-on transient > is less than that of a starter motor . . . for > accessories designed to live in the real world > of vehicular DC power generation and distribution > have no operational problems dealing with it. > > The question was raised here on the list a few > years ago about incandescent lamps in wig-wag > systems. It seems logical that if each turn-on > event generates a transient, that a succession of > transients would result from the alternate flashing > of two lamps in wig-wag fashion. > > Lost a trace I did on this issue some years ago > so I went to the bench and collected this image: > > http://www.aeroelectric.com/Pictures/Curves/Wig_Wag_Currents.jpg > > Note that the lamp DOES produce a cold-start > inrush transient for first closure event but > that the filament does not cool sufficiently > to generate a significant transient on > subsequent events. > > Keep in mind also that inrush limiters are > thermal devices with long time constants too. > They BENEFIT only while cold. If you had one in > your wig-wag circuit, it's very low warm- > resistance would not vary significantly between > lamp flashes. I.e, and inrush limiter needs to > cool for perhaps a minute before it's benefits > can be realized for the next switch closure. > > Bottom line is that inrush limiters are of marginal > benefit in modern lighting circuits. Rev 12 of the > 'Connection will remove recommendations for keep-warm > and/or inrush limiters. It's an idea that has gone the > way of spats and buggy-whips. > > Bob . . . > > ________________________________ Message 3 _____________________________________ Time: 10:14:17 AM PST US From: "Greg Campbell" Subject: AeroElectric-List: LED Runway Lights too! I stumbled across a website that caught me by surprise. http://www.solarairportlights.com/ Maybe some of you know a runway that needs lights? It's amazing what they can do with the LED lights these days. I've never seen them in use, but the video sure looked neat. I wonder how much they are? Greg ________________________________ Message 4 _____________________________________ Time: 10:16:45 AM PST US Subject: AeroElectric-List: Bundling wires From: I am in figuring process how to physical get wires from the back of our Europa (fiberglass) to the front. The 2 easiest paths are mid fuse under the door frame on both starboard and port. Any input would be appreciated on this dart throw bundle: PORT side: ACK ELT antenna wire ACK ELT instrument panel controller wire Transponder antenna wire Com antenna wire Advanced Aircraft Electronics 5T nav com antenna wire (have antenna bent 90 degrees to work equal bad on both Nav and com for Vertex hand held Nav-Com) Kunzleman LED Position lights for port wing Ray Allen T4-5 roll servo power wires, this servo has no indicator STARBOARD side: Both battery #4 wires Wires for 2 vane style fuel pumps (Rotax 914 with capacitors installed as per Rotax) Ray Allen pitch servo and indicator wires (read of folks complaining when radio is keyed, indicator goes bonkers) 12 volt power wires for Kunzleman strobe power supply Kunzleman LED Position lights for starboard wing Opinions needed which side these go: 1 high voltage wire from a UMA transformer up front to run a EL strip in starboard headrest Headset wires that need only run a few feet with one of the bundled sides, which side? Thx. Ron Parigoris ________________________________ Message 5 _____________________________________ Time: 10:21:42 AM PST US From: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: a couple of specific wiring questions At 09:26 AM 1/20/2007 -0500, you wrote: > >First, I want to make sure I'm okay using a D-sub connector to carry >flap motor loads in an RV. I think 16 AWG is recommended for the >motor wiring; will a single D-sub pin carry the current, or should I >double-up on pins? How much current does the motor draw worst case? D-sub pins are RATED at 5A in low density loads. For longevity in aircraft environments I de-rate the pins to 3A. You CAN parallel pins for higher current conductors if you pay careful attention to the physics. The problem to be solved is making paralleled pins in a connector SHARE the total load. When mated resistance of the pin is say 5 +/- 2 milliohms, then there is a small but non-zero statistical probability for direct paralleling pins as low as 3 milliohms and as high as 7 milliohms. Here's a technique I developed for adding "ballasting resistance" to each pin . . . http://www.aeroelectric.com/Pictures/Wiring_Technique/Paralleled_DSub_Pins.pdf This was designed into and qualified on the following product: http://www.aeroelectric.com/Pictures/Misc/GQM_Power_Dist.jpg http://www.aeroelectric.com/Pictures/Misc/GQM_1st_Ops_Flight.jpg Now, I've discussed a way to make your system live long and prosper using a d-sub connector . . . but why a d-sub? I needed the d-sub in the design cited above for compactness, convenience of dropping a connector right onto an ECB combined with a need to run lots of wires on and off the board with currents ranging from 22A down to microamps. Are you sure something like a http://preview.tinyurl.com/2ccop5 Isn't more appropriate to your task? Just a suggestion. The d-sub will perform just fine within the limits driven by the physics described above. >Second, there is a wide range of recommendations and practice >regarding the B-lead wiring for the SD-8 alternator. The Z 13/8 >diagram shows 12 AWG for this run; the documents from B&C show 14 AWG, >yet the wire they supply (potted into the regulator) is 16 AWG. >Given that these critters can only do about 10A flat-out, are we >sizing for voltage drop concerns here? It's not just academic: I can >fuselink-protect a 16 AWG wire, maybe even a 14 AAWG one, but above >that it means buying ANL's. Besides, there's the 2-gram weight >difference to obsess over ;-) The Z-Figures are architecture drawings and not intended to be the final word on sizes for anything. Some SD-8's were installed on the ass-end of a LongEz and drove electronics and batteries at the head-end. Fatter than usual wires were used to improve on regulator performance. As you've noted, the alternator's output is rated at 10A max so as long as logistics and special performance issues are not a consideration 16AWG wire and 15A fusing would be most adequate. Don't get bogged down in ANY variabilities between the various Z-figures. EACH system needs to be evaluated for wire and fuse sizing based on the physics of YOUR proposed installation. Bob . . . ________________________________ Message 6 _____________________________________ Time: 10:36:32 AM PST US From: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" Subject: AeroElectric-List: Wing root connector sources. >Bob, >Your article at . . . > >http://www.aeroelectric.com/articles/wingwire/wingwire.html > >shows a very useful connector for my demountable wings, but I'm having a >deuce of a time finding the very one you display. >Can you tell me where you got it, as all my attempts to find are thwarted. >I get across to USA fairly frequently and will search the standard >hardware/auto shops. Good afternoon my friend. The connector illustrated is a trailer-wiring device that would be found in stores that offer RV and trailer parts. I think I purchased the connector shown in a blister pack at Pep Boys, Oriley's, or AutoZone. They're pretty common in a variety of pin-counts. Here are some 'net leads . . . http://tinyurl.com/34k7ug http://tinyurl.com/32d9nu http://preview.tinyurl.com/3325t6 Consider lap-splicing the wires as suggested in http://aeroelectric.com/articles/Solder_Lap_Splicing/Solder_Lap_Splices.html This should reduce the splicing bulk in adjacent cabling. Bob . . . --------------------------------------------------------- < What is so wonderful about scientific truth...is that > < the authority which determines whether there can be > < debate or not does not reside in some fraternity of > < scientists; nor is it divine. The authority rests > < with experiment. > < --Lawrence M. Krauss > --------------------------------------------------------- ________________________________ Message 7 _____________________________________ Time: 10:53:25 AM PST US From: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: LED Runway Lights too! At 01:13 PM 1/23/2007 -0500, you wrote: >I stumbled across a website that caught me by surprise. >http://www.solarairportlights.com/ > >Maybe some of you know a runway that needs lights? >It's amazing what they can do with the LED lights these days. > >I've never seen them in use, but the video sure looked neat. >I wonder how much they are? I wasn't aware until Dee and I bought an airport that the standard low-intensity runway light is a 10w lamp. Our lowest cost source for these lamps was a sewing machine dealership that would order them for us by the 24 count case . . . he had them in stock for illuminators on sewing machines too. LED's are a natural for this application. Don't need much light but you DO want long life . . . our system had just over 30 lamps spread over 1/2 mile of terrain. Bob . . . --------------------------------------------------------- < What is so wonderful about scientific truth...is that > < the authority which determines whether there can be > < debate or not does not reside in some fraternity of > < scientists; nor is it divine. The authority rests > < with experiment. > < --Lawrence M. Krauss > --------------------------------------------------------- ________________________________ Message 8 _____________________________________ Time: 10:54:36 AM PST US Subject: AeroElectric-List: Antenna placement From: Have a few questions about antenna placement for our Europa (fiberglass). The Advanced Aircraft Electronics L2 Transponder antenna came with a piece of balsa to mount it on. What is idea here? Bond the antenna to balsa, then balsa to fiberglass? As far as the fore and aft position of Transponder antenna, 2 available positions are ~ 5 feet behind pilot, or ~ 8 feet behind pilot. 5 feet will allow a slight lower position in flight, but is closer to the motor. Which choice is preferable of the 2? As far as the left and right position of the transponder antenna, there is an ~ 2" thin wall aluminium pitch tube running fore and aft. I could mount the antenna direct under this tube by ~ 2" that would make for a friendlier movement about. Or I can displace it to one side 6 (8 feet) or 12 inches (5 feet). What would preference be? I will have Advanced Aircraft Electronics 5T antenna mounted just behind the baggage bay bulkhead. It will be powering a Vertex 700 panel mounted hand held. I will mount it bent 90 degrees where approx 1/2 is vertical, and half will be on the roof horizontal(to work equal bad on both nav and Com). Talking to Advanced they said it will provide approx 70% of the performance on both Nav and Com compared to proper straight orientation, and be far better than rubber ducky antenna with 90 degree bend. Any comments from those who have done this 90 degree bend? I want to place my ELT whip antenna (ACK EO1)vertical inside fuse, where it will be diagonal from the center of 90 degree bend of Advanced 5T antenna by about 18 inches. Will this close proximity potentially cause any receive or transmit problems for Vertex? If I were to test the ACK and had the vertex on, could this close proximity cause harm the the Vertex? Other info: Transponder antenna will be either 2 or 5 feet aft of ELT antenna Primary Com antenna is a Bob Archer in top of rudder Thx. Ron Parigoris ________________________________ Message 9 _____________________________________ Time: 11:01:56 AM PST US Subject: AeroElectric-List: Bundling wires From: James H Nelson Ron, Do you have a tri gear or a mono-wheel. If a tri gear, the tunnel is the easiest. I built a mono-wheel so the stbd door channel ws the best for small wires. I ran the com and txpdr thru the port door channel ( big wires). My battery was in front. You can make the door channels as big as you need. I also ran some wires up the windshield channel to switching in the overhead. then some went back and down into the area where the pumps were located. Definitly put supports under the door frames to keep them from flexing. Also reverse the door strut mounting from the factor design. That way you won't push up the rear of the door frame. (looks bad) Jim Nelson ________________________________ Message 10 ____________________________________ Time: 11:08:34 AM PST US From: "Rob Housman" Subject: RE: AeroElectric-List: Bundling wires You have proposed essentially what I did. I have installed the Europa factory wiring harness which runs all power along the starboard side just below the door, and to keep from getting too fat a bundle there, installed all antenna cabling along the port side. From monitoring this list I realize that there is no technical reason to separate any wires from any others. Although many builders seem to prefer mounting the headset jacks in the overhead panel I mounted mine at shoulder level between the headrests thus keeping dangling wires from interfering with access to the baggage compartment. Best regards, Rob Housman Europa XS A070 Airframe complete Irvine, CA -----Original Message----- From: owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com]On Behalf Of rparigor@SUFFOLK.LIB.NY.US Sent: Tuesday, January 23, 2007 10:16 AM Subject: AeroElectric-List: Bundling wires I am in figuring process how to physical get wires from the back of our Europa (fiberglass) to the front. The 2 easiest paths are mid fuse under the door frame on both starboard and port. Any input would be appreciated on this dart throw bundle: PORT side: ACK ELT antenna wire ACK ELT instrument panel controller wire Transponder antenna wire Com antenna wire Advanced Aircraft Electronics 5T nav com antenna wire (have antenna bent 90 degrees to work equal bad on both Nav and com for Vertex hand held Nav-Com) Kunzleman LED Position lights for port wing Ray Allen T4-5 roll servo power wires, this servo has no indicator STARBOARD side: Both battery #4 wires Wires for 2 vane style fuel pumps (Rotax 914 with capacitors installed as per Rotax) Ray Allen pitch servo and indicator wires (read of folks complaining when radio is keyed, indicator goes bonkers) 12 volt power wires for Kunzleman strobe power supply Kunzleman LED Position lights for starboard wing Opinions needed which side these go: 1 high voltage wire from a UMA transformer up front to run a EL strip in starboard headrest Headset wires that need only run a few feet with one of the bundled sides, which side? Thx. Ron Parigoris ________________________________ Message 11 ____________________________________ Time: 11:10:23 AM PST US From: "Harold" Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: LED Runway Lights too! But did you check the price for "one" Harold ----- Original Message ----- From: Greg Campbell To: aeroelectric-list@matronics.com Sent: Tuesday, January 23, 2007 1:13 PM Subject: AeroElectric-List: LED Runway Lights too! I stumbled across a website that caught me by surprise. http://www.solarairportlights.com/ Maybe some of you know a runway that needs lights? It's amazing what they can do with the LED lights these days. I've never seen them in use, but the video sure looked neat. I wonder how much they are? Greg ________________________________ Message 12 ____________________________________ Time: 11:24:45 AM PST US From: DBerelsman@aol.com Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: LED Runway Lights / solar I am sure one of the smart folks on the list will discover a way to convert these into high intensity runway lights. _The Home Depot: HomeBrite Solar 30817 Plastic Solar Path Light_ (http://www.homedepot.com/prel80/HDUS/EN_US/diy_main/pg_diy.jsp?BV_SessionID=@@@@053825710 3.1169579961@@@@&BV_EngineID=ccciaddjmihhggmcgelceffdfgidglm.0&CNTTYPE=PROD_ME TA&CNTKEY=misc/searchResults.jsp&MID=9876&N=2984+4233&pos=n12) ________________________________ Message 13 ____________________________________ Time: 11:33:11 AM PST US From: Dave N6030X Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Antenna placement I'm only going to comment on a small part of this. As a ham operator with a few decades of experimentation with antennas (primarily HF, but also some VHF), I've seen most everything you can do right and wrong with antennas. First of all, almost nothing you have described here is going to have a *huge* impact. The bad effects you might achieve will be minor. When you are 50 miles from an ATC comm station trying desperately to raise someone, the minor impacts could become more significant, but for 99% of your flying, it won't matter too much. So, here are a few thoughts: Try to keep all antennas a quarter wavelength away from other metal that is in the same plane (not airplane, geometric plane). In feet, that's about 234 / Frequency in Megahertz. Run coax feeders 90 degrees away from the antenna as far as possible to prevent interference. Receivers will work with any piece of wire and you'll be able to hear *something*, but when you get the wire length exactly right and you have no interference with surrounding metal, you'll be rewarded with a really nice strong signal and low noise. Putting a 90 degree bend in the antenna will screw up its SWR. That may only affect your reception by 3db, but it could potentially cause your solid state, computer controlled transmitter to automatically reduce its output power. I'm not sure. You'll have to try it out. When you're flying in New Mexico over an area where you can't raise ATC even at 8500 feet and the terrain is fiercely hostile (for instance here: http://www.davemorris.com/Photos/Mooney%20N6030X%20Shiprock%20NM/IMG_2098.jpg) , you'll want as good a transmitter as you can get. So, the question becomes, are you going to need NAV out in the boonies more than COM, or vice versa. My guess is you're going to have a darn nice GPS on board, and you may never use your handheld NAV function on the radio. So, optimize it for COM if that applies to you. If the ELT antenna is 18 inches minimum from the COM antenna, that's not the ultimate in separation, but it will be adequate. I doubt you'd be able to tell the difference if you moved it a full quarter wavelength away. It may affect the radiation lobes, causing them to be oriented more forward and aft, and giving you less effectiveness off the wingtips, but it will be so miniscule you probably won't notice the difference unless you are way far from the ground station. When you test the ELT, turn down the volume in the Vertex, or just unplug it. It won't harm it, but you won't like the noise. Aircraft that have a non-metal tail cone about 31 inches in diameter can take advantage of my Morris Com Loop antenna, which is a full wavelength loop mounted on the fuselage wall. It provides slight gain, greater immunity to noise, and requires no ground plane. http://www.davemorris.com/MorrisComLoop.cfm Dave Morris www.N5UP.com www.N6030X.com At 11:54 AM 1/23/2007, you wrote: >I will have Advanced Aircraft Electronics 5T antenna mounted just behind >the baggage bay bulkhead. It will be powering a Vertex 700 panel mounted >hand held. I will mount it bent 90 degrees where approx 1/2 is vertical, >and half will be on the roof horizontal(to work equal bad on both nav and >Com). Talking to Advanced they said it will provide approx 70% of the >performance on both Nav and Com compared to proper straight orientation, >and be far better than rubber ducky antenna with 90 degree bend. > >Any comments from those who have done this 90 degree bend? > >I want to place my ELT whip antenna (ACK EO1)vertical inside fuse, where >it will be diagonal from the center of 90 degree bend of Advanced 5T >antenna by about 18 inches. > >Will this close proximity potentially cause any receive or transmit >problems for Vertex? > >If I were to test the ACK and had the vertex on, could this close >proximity cause harm the the Vertex? ________________________________ Message 14 ____________________________________ Time: 11:48:56 AM PST US From: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: LED Runway Lights / solar At 02:23 PM 1/23/2007 -0500, you wrote: >I am sure one of the smart folks on the list will discover a way to >convert these into high intensity runway lights. > >The >Home Depot: HomeBrite Solar 30817 Plastic Solar Path Light An experiment I've always wanted to try is based on the glue-down reflectors you often see on highways. Their light acceptance angles and reflection efficiencies are quite high. I've often wondered if one couldn't paste these things down to a runway edge and generate a most adequate runway positional awareness based completely upon the ship's landing light. Bob . . . ---------------------------------------- ( IF one aspires to be "world class", ) ( what ever you do must be exercised ) ( EVERY day . . . ) ( R. L. Nuckolls III ) ---------------------------------------- ________________________________ Message 15 ____________________________________ Time: 11:54:32 AM PST US Subject: RE: AeroElectric-List: LED Runway Lights too! From: "RV Builder (Michael Sausen)" Price is on the site. Looks like over $1000 per fixture. I'm fairly sure I can run wired low voltage for considerably less than $1000 a fixture. J Michael Sausen RV-10 #352 Fuselage From: owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Greg Campbell Sent: Tuesday, January 23, 2007 12:14 PM Subject: AeroElectric-List: LED Runway Lights too! I stumbled across a website that caught me by surprise. http://www.solarairportlights.com/ Maybe some of you know a runway that needs lights? It's amazing what they can do with the LED lights these days. I've never seen them in use, but the video sure looked neat. I wonder how much they are? Greg ________________________________ Message 16 ____________________________________ Time: 12:16:14 PM PST US From: "Bill Boyd" Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: a couple of specific wiring questions Thanks most kindly. Since I have a short run from the dynamo to the bus, I won't bother with the 12 AWG concept. Even 14 AWG seems a tad heavy for the proposed 8 amp service, and the wiring will never see much use unless the main alternator fails or goes OV (IR). As for the flap harness connector, I had already leaned towards the Molex and that is clearly the way to go, without always wondering if I should have derated those pins and ballasted the wires. -Bill On 1/23/07, Robert L. Nuckolls, III wrote: > > At 09:26 AM 1/20/2007 -0500, you wrote: > > > > >First, I want to make sure I'm okay using a D-sub connector to carry > >flap motor loads in an RV. I think 16 AWG is recommended for the > >motor wiring; will a single D-sub pin carry the current, or should I > >double-up on pins? > > How much current does the motor draw worst case? D-sub pins > are RATED at 5A in low density loads. For longevity in aircraft > environments I de-rate the pins to 3A. > > You CAN parallel pins for higher current conductors if you > pay careful attention to the physics. The problem to be > solved is making paralleled pins in a connector SHARE > the total load. When mated resistance of the pin is say > 5 +/- 2 milliohms, then there is a small but non-zero > statistical probability for direct paralleling pins as > low as 3 milliohms and as high as 7 milliohms. > > Here's a technique I developed for adding "ballasting > resistance" to each pin . . . > > http://www.aeroelectric.com/Pictures/Wiring_Technique/Paralleled_DSub_Pins.pdf > > This was designed into and qualified on the following > product: > > http://www.aeroelectric.com/Pictures/Misc/GQM_Power_Dist.jpg > > http://www.aeroelectric.com/Pictures/Misc/GQM_1st_Ops_Flight.jpg > > Now, I've discussed a way to make your system live > long and prosper using a d-sub connector . . . but why > a d-sub? I needed the d-sub in the design cited above > for compactness, convenience of dropping a connector > right onto an ECB combined with a need to run lots > of wires on and off the board with currents ranging > from 22A down to microamps. > > Are you sure something like a > > http://preview.tinyurl.com/2ccop5 > > Isn't more appropriate to your task? Just a suggestion. > The d-sub will perform just fine within the limits > driven by the physics described above. > > >Second, there is a wide range of recommendations and practice > >regarding the B-lead wiring for the SD-8 alternator. The Z 13/8 > >diagram shows 12 AWG for this run; the documents from B&C show 14 AWG, > >yet the wire they supply (potted into the regulator) is 16 AWG. > >Given that these critters can only do about 10A flat-out, are we > >sizing for voltage drop concerns here? It's not just academic: I can > >fuselink-protect a 16 AWG wire, maybe even a 14 AAWG one, but above > >that it means buying ANL's. Besides, there's the 2-gram weight > >difference to obsess over ;-) > > The Z-Figures are architecture drawings and not intended > to be the final word on sizes for anything. Some SD-8's were > installed on the ass-end of a LongEz and drove electronics > and batteries at the head-end. Fatter than usual wires > were used to improve on regulator performance. As you've > noted, the alternator's output is rated at 10A max so as > long as logistics and special performance issues are not > a consideration 16AWG wire and 15A fusing would be most > adequate. Don't get bogged down in ANY variabilities between > the various Z-figures. EACH system needs to be evaluated > for wire and fuse sizing based on the physics of YOUR > proposed installation. > > Bob . . . > > ________________________________ Message 17 ____________________________________ Time: 12:17:15 PM PST US Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: LED Runway Lights / solar From: john@ballofshame.com I'll bet this would work very well with one caveat: Every now and then some yahoo (like me) is tooling around in a 40 year old rented citabria with a flaky electrical system (or a nice, shinny new lancair with a broken landing light). No landing light + no runway light could make for an exciting flare :) -john www.ballofshame.com > > > > An experiment I've always wanted to try is based on the > glue-down reflectors you often see on highways. Their > light acceptance angles and reflection efficiencies > are quite high. I've often wondered if one couldn't > paste these things down to a runway edge and generate > a most adequate runway positional awareness based > completely upon the ship's landing light. > > > Bob . . . > > ---------------------------------------- > ( IF one aspires to be "world class", ) > ( what ever you do must be exercised ) > ( EVERY day . . . ) > ( R. L. Nuckolls III ) > ---------------------------------------- > > ________________________________ Message 18 ____________________________________ Time: 12:25:07 PM PST US From: Ernest Christley Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: LED Runway Lights / solar DBerelsman@aol.com wrote: > I am sure one of the smart folks on the list will discover a way > to convert these into high intensity runway lights. > > The Home Depot: HomeBrite Solar 30817 Plastic Solar Path Light > > > > > I've got a pile of these solar powered path lights under the house. Were'nt good for much other than mood lighting. Less than what you'd get from a candle, and that's only if they had full sunlight all day. The problem is that they run from NiCads, and not only do they need to be periodically replaced, they have practically nothing left in the wee hours of the morning. Unless they're using a newer battery technology, I'd say you'd get the same problem from the runway light setup: the need to replace a lot of expensive batteries every year, and no lights in the early morning hours. -- ,|"|"|, Ernest Christley | ----===<{{(oQo)}}>===---- Dyke Delta Builder | o| d |o http://ernest.isa-geek.org | ________________________________ Message 19 ____________________________________ Time: 12:28:31 PM PST US From: "Bill Boyd" Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: LED Runway Lights / solar Like these? http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=300072913438&ih=020&category=26197&ssPageName=WDVW&rd=1 -Bill B On 1/23/07, Robert L. Nuckolls, III wrote: > > At 02:23 PM 1/23/2007 -0500, you wrote: > > >I am sure one of the smart folks on the list will discover a way to > >convert these into high intensity runway lights. > > > >The > >Home Depot: HomeBrite Solar 30817 Plastic Solar Path Light > > An experiment I've always wanted to try is based on the > glue-down reflectors you often see on highways. Their > light acceptance angles and reflection efficiencies > are quite high. I've often wondered if one couldn't > paste these things down to a runway edge and generate > a most adequate runway positional awareness based > completely upon the ship's landing light. > > > Bob . . . > > ---------------------------------------- > ( IF one aspires to be "world class", ) > ( what ever you do must be exercised ) > ( EVERY day . . . ) > ( R. L. Nuckolls III ) > ---------------------------------------- > > ________________________________ Message 20 ____________________________________ Time: 12:50:47 PM PST US From: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: LED Runway Lights / solar At 03:27 PM 1/23/2007 -0500, you wrote: > >Like these? > >http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=300072913438&ih=020&category=26197&ssPageName=WDVW&rd=1 > >-Bill B That's the ones. A "discussion over tacos" several years ago considered the use of high efficiency reflectors for both runway edge marking and approach path measurement and display. Between our ability to routinely find a final approach point to an unlighted airport with $100 GPS receivers, it seems that creative use of reflectors might add demonstrable convenience and safety to a facility that would otherwise go unused after dark. Bob . . . ________________________________ Message 21 ____________________________________ Time: 12:58:50 PM PST US From: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: LED Runway Lights / solar At 12:15 PM 1/23/2007 -0800, you wrote: > >I'll bet this would work very well with one caveat: Every now and then >some yahoo (like me) is tooling around in a 40 year old rented citabria >with a flaky electrical system (or a nice, shinny new lancair with a >broken landing light). No landing light + no runway light could make for >an exciting flare :) Which is why we should avoid putting blanket solutions on our design recommendations without considering the big picture for the builder's mission. For example, it's easily demonstrated that you can land an airplane on a lighted field using a 6v, 0.5A, 3W fisherman's lantern. Or perhaps a couple of 25w store-floods in the wingtips to illuminate the surface during the flare. I've encouraged folks to look into low-energy alternatives to dual 100W plus klieg lights. If one's home turf has limited utility after dark for lack of light bulbs and a mile or so of wire, perhaps dual 100W bulbs (independently powered and controlled) combined with hunks of strategically placed plastic offers a new opportunity. Bob . . . ---------------------------------------- ( IF one aspires to be "world class", ) ( what ever you do must be exercised ) ( EVERY day . . . ) ( R. L. Nuckolls III ) ---------------------------------------- ________________________________ Message 22 ____________________________________ Time: 02:04:20 PM PST US From: Ron Shannon Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Wing root connector sources. FWIW, I'll second the recommendation of the Switchcraft EN3 weathertight connectors, which someone mentioned awhile back (see http://dkc3.digikey.com/PDF/T071/0321.pdf). They're feather weight, rated 7.5A, and very high quality. I'm going to use them for both trim and wing root connections. Ron ________________________________ Message 23 ____________________________________ Time: 02:21:54 PM PST US Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: LED Runway Lights / solar From: "Matt Prather" I agree with the idea of wishing to downsize the power requirements of landing lights.. From my limited night experience the most challenging runway environment is when the airport is located in a densely populated urban/suburban area. There is so much other light in the pilot's eyes while in the pattern that a dim landing light isn't much better than burned out bulb at these airports. Combine that with a bug covered windscreen, and seeing out is tough. Even the runway edge lights can be sort of hard to see in these cases, though they are visible enough to provide reference. Landing on a runway out in the boonies is much easier, though the chances of sharing the runway with a big four legged critter are much higher... For these reasons, if I have an airplane that I intend to fly at night very often, I'd strongly consider including HID landing and taxi lights. I understand that the color of these lights and their long warmup time might make them less useful for daytime recognition (less visible against sky, and not easy to wig wag). I think their robustness and low power consumption make them attractive even so. I would consider including lower wattage dedicated wig-wag lights as well. http://www.brightheadlights-hid.com/5-7in%20Round-Projectors.htm This kit is still kind of a lot of money, but with proper installation, it could last the life of the airplane.. Regards, Matt- > > > At 12:15 PM 1/23/2007 -0800, you wrote: > >> >>I'll bet this would work very well with one caveat: Every now and then >>some yahoo (like me) is tooling around in a 40 year old rented citabria >>with a flaky electrical system (or a nice, shinny new lancair with a >>broken landing light). No landing light + no runway light could make for >>an exciting flare :) > > Which is why we should avoid putting blanket solutions > on our design recommendations without considering the > big picture for the builder's mission. For example, > it's easily demonstrated that you can land an airplane > on a lighted field using a 6v, 0.5A, 3W fisherman's > lantern. Or perhaps a couple of 25w store-floods in > the wingtips to illuminate the surface during the flare. > > I've encouraged folks to look into low-energy alternatives > to dual 100W plus klieg lights. If one's home turf has > limited utility after dark for lack of light bulbs and > a mile or so of wire, perhaps dual 100W bulbs (independently > powered and controlled) combined with hunks of strategically > placed plastic offers a new opportunity. > > > Bob . . . > > ---------------------------------------- > ( IF one aspires to be "world class", ) > ( what ever you do must be exercised ) > ( EVERY day . . . ) > ( R. L. Nuckolls III ) > ---------------------------------------- > > ________________________________ Message 24 ____________________________________ Time: 02:44:56 PM PST US From: Dave N6030X Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: LED Runway - HID landing lights For a review of HID landing lights, see http://www.preciseflight.com/ufiles/06March_Aviation_Consumer_HID_Article_Main.pdf Dave Morris At 03:21 PM 1/23/2007, you wrote: > > >For these reasons, if I have an airplane that I intend to fly at night >very often, I'd strongly consider including HID landing and taxi lights. >I understand that the color of these lights and their long warmup time >might make them less useful for daytime recognition (less visible against >sky, and not easy to wig wag). I think their robustness and low power >consumption make them attractive even so. I would consider including >lower wattage dedicated wig-wag lights as well. > >http://www.brightheadlights-hid.com/5-7in%20Round-Projectors.htm > >This kit is still kind of a lot of money, but with proper installation, it >could last the life of the airplane.. ________________________________ Message 25 ____________________________________ Time: 03:21:32 PM PST US From: "Larry E. James" Subject: AeroElectric-List: more direct method for designing electrical system Thank all for the replies on and off list. Two good points were made that have me beginning slow progress: 1) paper, pencil, and a big eraser; and 2) separate circuits onto separate sheets of paper. I saw this on Randy Pflanzler's web site and it made bite-size pieces. I suppose I can render these pencil drawings to CAD later if I wish. Larry E. James Bellevue, WA Harmon Rocket ________________________________ Message 26 ____________________________________ Time: 04:29:28 PM PST US From: Buckaroo Banzai Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: LED Runway Lights / solar Do not archive A similar experiment was attempted at my local airport. Turns out that the "normal" road-type reflectors are angled to reflect back at the typical height of a car driver. The typical sitting-height of a pilot and the angle of the landing light were all wrong for getting a good reflection. However, the local airport did find some airport-specific reflectors they used for some parts of the taxiway. Greg At 02:23 PM 1/23/2007 -0500, you wrote: >I am sure one of the smart folks on the list will discover a way to >convert these into high intensity runway lights. > >The >Home Depot: HomeBrite Solar 30817 Plastic Solar Path Light An experiment I've always wanted to try is based on the glue-down reflectors you often see on highways. Their light acceptance angles and reflection efficiencies are quite high. I've often wondered if one couldn't paste these things down to a runway edge and generate a most adequate runway positional awareness based completely upon the ship's landing light. Bob . . . ---------------------------------------- ( IF one aspires to be "world class", ) ( what ever you do must be exercised ) ( EVERY day . . . ) ( R. L. Nuckolls III ) ---------------------------------------- --------------------------------- ________________________________ Message 27 ____________________________________ Time: 05:06:28 PM PST US From: "Peter Laurence" Subject: RE: AeroElectric-List: Timer module Dave, Here's another way to skin this cat. Check out : http://www.uoguelph.ca/~antoon/circ/relay1h.html Peter ________________________________ Message 28 ____________________________________ Time: 05:56:33 PM PST US From: Earl_Schroeder Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: LED Runway Lights / solar Robert L. Nuckolls, III wrote: > > An experiment I've always wanted to try is based on the > glue-down reflectors you often see on highways. Don't know about the glue-down types but the tape-type seen on the sides of semi trailers do work well. They are available from http://tinyurl.com/ysq2g7, ebay and many other sources. Just Google 'semi trailer reflective tape'. I just cut the off the white half and wrapped it around a 3/4" plastic pipe and pushed it into the ground every 200' along the runway edge. I put the red half on a pipe at each end and one at the 1/2 way point. Using an auto to test at night, one could clearly see the reflections all the way down to the end of a 2000' turf strip. One thing good about the tape-type is they reflect back at the angle of illumination so they can be seen from the air with a functioning landing light. I considered installing a 110VAC stationary 'spot' light at the end near an AC source at ground level to cover the 'in case landing light failure during flare' issue but did not. I've since moved the runway and have not reinstalled the edge lights or I would publish a night picture.. it was quite impressive. Earl ________________________________ Message 29 ____________________________________ Time: 06:25:30 PM PST US From: "Jerry Isler" Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: LED Runway Lights too! We have a set of the solar powered taxiway lights installed at 17J (Donalsonville, GA) and they have worked great for over two years. There have only been two problems that I am aware of. First, if it is cloudy for several days, the batteries will not charge enough for the lights to run all night (this has been an infrequent occurrence). Second is birds. They like to perch on top of the light assemblies where the solar cells are. If left alone they would leave enough deposits on top of the lamps to block out the solar cells to the point the batteries will not charge. We had to install wire spikes on the light assemblies to prevent them from landing on the lights. As far as performance, they are as bright as a hard wired light assembly. If you did not know they were solar powered you would not know the difference. ----- Original Message ----- From: Greg Campbell To: aeroelectric-list@matronics.com Sent: Tuesday, January 23, 2007 1:13 PM Subject: AeroElectric-List: LED Runway Lights too! I stumbled across a website that caught me by surprise. http://www.solarairportlights.com/ Maybe some of you know a runway that needs lights? It's amazing what they can do with the LED lights these days. I've never seen them in use, but the video sure looked neat. I wonder how much they are? Greg ________________________________ Message 30 ____________________________________ Time: 07:52:12 PM PST US From: "bob noffs" Subject: AeroElectric-List: jab coilrounds hi bob, thanks for the explanation of the proper wiring of the coil ground wire. bob noffs when things are going smoothly i tell myself i have obviously overlooked something so i look around and usually the truth finally comes out! ________________________________ Message 31 ____________________________________ Time: 08:41:25 PM PST US From: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: more direct method for designing electrical system At 03:20 PM 1/23/2007 -0800, you wrote: >Thank all for the replies on and off list. Two good points were made that >have me beginning slow progress: 1) paper, pencil, and a big eraser; and >2) separate circuits onto separate sheets of paper. I saw this on Randy >Pflanzler's web site and it made bite-size pieces. I suppose I can render >these pencil drawings to CAD later if I wish. Absolutely! The most important document for your project is the shop notebook. Develop all the wiring in this book with the #2 pencil and Pink Pearl eraser. Some day when it's too wet or snowy to fly, sit down at the CAD system and pretty-up your drawings. I've used this technique for decades on all manner of skunk-werks projects. This eliminates a lot of lost motion when one runs back and forth between computer and shop in some attempt to keep a computer based drawing up to date. This is exactly the kind of lost motion that drives up the costs of our type certificated ships when EVERY change to a design has to be in the computer and approved by a dozen folks before that change can go onto the airplane. It's killing us. Bob . . . ________________________________ Message 32 ____________________________________ Time: 08:43:44 PM PST US From: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Wing root connector sources. At 02:03 PM 1/23/2007 -0800, you wrote: > >FWIW, I'll second the recommendation of the Switchcraft EN3 weathertight >connectors, which someone mentioned awhile back (see >http://dkc3.digikey.com/PDF/T071/0321.pdf. They're feather weight, >rated 7.5A, and very high quality. I'm going to use them for both trim >and wing root connections. Cute little fellers . . . thanks for the heads-up on these. They look really good. Bob . . . ---------------------------------------- ( IF one aspires to be "world class", ) ( what ever you do must be exercised ) ( EVERY day . . . ) ( R. L. Nuckolls III ) ---------------------------------------- ________________________________ Message 33 ____________________________________ Time: 08:51:49 PM PST US From: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" Subject: AeroElectric-List: IR alternators in aircraft Over the past week or so I've become aware of two more incidents of uncontrolled OV conditions arising from the failure of internally regulated alternators. I've sent both folks copies of the original Z-24 along with advance data on the proposed AEC9004 IR Alternator Controller - easily incorporated into an installed OV protection system at a later date. For those interested, the document has been indexed on our What's New? page and posted at: http://aeroelectric.com/articles/Adapting_IR_Alternators_to_Aircraft.pdf The hardware is in hand to adapt our 3-phase alternator drive stand . . . http://www.aeroelectric.com/Pictures/Alternator_Test_Stand to 240 VAC, single phase. All I need is a spare weekend and a bit warmer weather out in the garage. If I can get this big dog up on his feet, I'll rip out all the existing instrumentation wiring and install a Z-11 mock-up. Development of the AEC9004 controller will be the first project to run across the drive stand. Bob . . . ---------------------------------------- ( IF one aspires to be "world class", ) ( what ever you do must be exercised ) ( EVERY day . . . ) ( R. L. Nuckolls III ) ---------------------------------------- ________________________________ Message 34 ____________________________________ Time: 09:41:47 PM PST US From: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" Subject: RE: AeroElectric-List: RE: Jack plug question At 03:10 PM 1/22/2007 +0000, you wrote: >Thanks Bob. > >The KX155 is 6 months old. This problem has been there from the beginning. >It came with harness pre-wired and i installed it. Sometimes i use a >handheld (ICOM A20) wired into the a/c power supply and aerial and there's >some ignition noise but not a serious problem. Its just the panel mounted >KX155. The microphone jack interferes with the volume (even with the >squelch turned off) and introduces interference >Two possibles i thought of were >1. The microphone socket may need an earth? The panel is fibreglass and >the socket has 2 wires running into it but is not earthed to the airframe >2. Could the wires in the microphone socket be transposed? > >As the ICOM works OK that seems to exclude power supply or aerial issues? > >Very grateful for your advice. > >Frank If the push to talk circuit is active in your microphone wiring, then the mic jack would need two wires plus a ground. See: http://aeroelectric.com/articles/micjack/micjack.html If your mic jack is intended to handle ONLY microphone audio and PTT is handled with other wiring, then only two wires would be required. Do you have a schematic of the pre-wired harness? Have you checked your harness against the diagram? Bob . . . ________________________________ Message 35 ____________________________________ Time: 09:53:00 PM PST US From: "David Weber" Subject: RE: AeroElectric-List: IR alternators in aircraft I have a IR ALT from Plane Power (14v) and am wiring per your book. Can I use the LR3C from B&C to prevent OV problems? Or, does someone else sell such a device? Thanks David Weber > [Original Message] > From: Robert L. Nuckolls, III > To: > Date: 1/23/2007 11:22:02 PM > Subject: AeroElectric-List: IR alternators in aircraft > > > Over the past week or so I've become aware of two more > incidents of uncontrolled OV conditions arising from the > failure of internally regulated alternators. I've > sent both folks copies of the original Z-24 along with > advance data on the proposed AEC9004 IR Alternator > Controller - easily incorporated into an installed OV > protection system at a later date. > > For those interested, the document has been indexed > on our What's New? page and posted at: > > http://aeroelectric.com/articles/Adapting_IR_Alternators_to_Aircraft.pdf > > The hardware is in hand to adapt our 3-phase > alternator drive stand . . . > > http://www.aeroelectric.com/Pictures/Alternator_Test_Stand > > to 240 VAC, single phase. All I need is a spare weekend > and a bit warmer weather out in the garage. If I can > get this big dog up on his feet, I'll rip out all the existing > instrumentation wiring and install a Z-11 mock-up. Development > of the AEC9004 controller will be the first project to > run across the drive stand. > > > Bob . . . > > ---------------------------------------- > ( IF one aspires to be "world class", ) > ( what ever you do must be exercised ) > ( EVERY day . . . ) > ( R. L. Nuckolls III ) > ---------------------------------------- > > ________________________________ Message 36 ____________________________________ Time: 10:17:09 PM PST US From: Werner Schneider Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Antenna placement rparigor@SUFFOLK.LIB.NY.US wrote: > > Have a few questions about antenna placement for our Europa (fiberglass). > > The Advanced Aircraft Electronics L2 Transponder antenna came with a piece > of balsa to mount it on. What is idea here? Bond the antenna to balsa, > then balsa to fiberglass? Ron, shape the Balsa so it conforms to the shape of your fuselage, epoxy it to the fuselage, glue the antenna on the balsa (blades are straight) cover blades and balsa with a layer of glass going also on the fuselage shell. That's what we did on several Glastar's and it worked out great. br Werner ________________________________ Message 37 ____________________________________ Time: 11:35:52 PM PST US From: "Bob Verwey" Subject: AeroElectric-List: Century 2000 autopilot harness Fellow listers I am looking for a 28v harness for a century 2000 autopilot. Any pointers as to where I should look? This is for a non-certified application, so paperwork is not necessary. Thanks Bob Verwey A35 Bonanza ZU-DLW ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Other Matronics Email List Services ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Post A New Message aeroelectric-list@matronics.com UN/SUBSCRIBE http://www.matronics.com/subscription List FAQ http://www.matronics.com/FAQ/AeroElectric-List.htm Web Forum Interface To Lists http://forums.matronics.com Matronics List Wiki http://wiki.matronics.com Full Archive Search Engine http://www.matronics.com/search 7-Day List Browse http://www.matronics.com/browse/aeroelectric-list Browse Digests http://www.matronics.com/digest/aeroelectric-list Browse Other Lists http://www.matronics.com/browse Live Online Chat! http://www.matronics.com/chat Archive Downloading http://www.matronics.com/archives Photo Share http://www.matronics.com/photoshare Other Email Lists http://www.matronics.com/emaillists Contributions http://www.matronics.com/contribution ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- These Email List Services are sponsored solely by Matronics and through the generous Contributions of its members.