Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 03:56 AM - the fellowship of the list (Rodney Dunham)
2. 04:57 AM - Re: the fellowship of the list (Robert L. Nuckolls, III)
3. 04:57 AM - Re: To buy or not to buy, that is the question (Robert L. Nuckolls, III)
4. 05:51 AM - Re: Re: To buy or not to buy, that is the question (RV Builder (Michael Sausen))
5. 05:55 AM - Re: Re: To buy or not to buy, that is the question (Bob Verwey)
6. 06:24 AM - Re: Re: To buy or not to buy, that is the question (Robert L. Nuckolls, III)
7. 06:39 AM - Re: the fellowship of the list (Dave N6030X)
8. 06:45 AM - Re: Aircraft wiring for smart people (jdalton77)
9. 06:53 AM - Re: the fellowship of the list (Lloyd, Daniel R.)
10. 07:00 AM - Re: shielded wires (Robert L. Nuckolls, III)
11. 07:17 AM - Sharing ship's COMM antenna with the hand-held (Robert L. Nuckolls, III)
12. 07:29 AM - Re: Re: The case for an IR&D facility . . . (Ernest Christley)
13. 07:57 AM - Re: 8awg line to forrest of tabs (Eric M. Jones)
14. 08:08 AM - Re: To buy or not to buy, that is the question (John Coloccia)
15. 08:11 AM - Re: the fellowship of the list (Robert L. Nuckolls, III)
16. 04:49 PM - Re: Scuse me - bare Nuckolls (Fiveonepw@aol.com)
17. 06:57 PM - Re: AeroElectric-List Digest: 39 Msgs - 01/29/07 (Lee Logan)
18. 07:01 PM - Re: AeroElectric-List Digest: 39 Msgs - 01/29/07 (Lee Logan)
19. 07:20 PM - Fusible link question (Bill Steer)
20. 08:53 PM - Re: the fellowship of the list (Kelly McMullen)
Message 1
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Subject: | the fellowship of the list |
>Do you suffer from sleepless nights 'cause yer head is busy considering a
>problem?<
Not really. But I do put myself to sleep building airplanes in my mind! I
try to work through an upcoming task or problem as far as I can by
visualizing each step as I lay in bed. The next thing I know, the alarm
clock is going off, it's 5:30AM and time to go out to the garage and DO it!
It's better than Ambien!
>"Would you rather buy a new tool than go to a ball game?<
Oh heck yeah! I've never understood the attraction of sports, so this one is
a no brainer. My friends marvel at my 'lectric tool kit(s). "You're so
organized!" Well, if I didn't keep the tools all together, I wouldn't be
able to find them when I need them at 5:30AM :o)
>Are the drawers and shelves in your shop stuffed with junque you picked up
>at garage sales and industrial surplus stores?<
Well, my WIFE calls it junk, but YOU don't have too :o(
>You may be a victim of "the disease"<
Busted!
>...now if some kid in your family or perhaps the neighborhood is really
>lucky, he/she
may "catch the disease" from you. If that happens, you'll find yourself
compelled to take on yet another "project" in an already too-full schedule.<
Actually, that sounds kinda cool! I love to teach and folks say I'm really
good at it. Last summer I held ground school (I'm not a CFI) every Saturday
for 10 weeks to help the guys at the flight park study for their Sport Pilot
tickets. The trucker that I told my wife wasn't going to make it is the
first to complete his check ride and get his ticket! He approached me right
after his check ride and, in a humble and appreciative way, thanked me for
helping him achieve his dream. It was great!
Rodney in Tennessee
Unabashed Nuckollhead
_________________________________________________________________
Turn searches into helpful donations. Make your search count.
Message 2
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Subject: | Re: the fellowship of the list |
At 06:52 AM 1/30/2007 -0500, you wrote:
><rdunhamtn@hotmail.com>
<snip>
>Actually, that sounds kinda cool! I love to teach and folks say I'm really
>good at it. Last summer I held ground school (I'm not a CFI) every
>Saturday for 10 weeks to help the guys at the flight park study for their
>Sport Pilot tickets. The trucker that I told my wife wasn't going to make
>it is the first to complete his check ride and get his ticket! He
>approached me right after his check ride and, in a humble and appreciative
>way, thanked me for helping him achieve his dream. It was great!
>
>
>Rodney in Tennessee
>Unabashed Nuckollhead
Welcome to the community of teachers.
Bob . . .
----------------------------------------
( IF one aspires to be "world class", )
( what ever you do must be exercised )
( EVERY day . . . )
( R. L. Nuckolls III )
----------------------------------------
Message 3
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Subject: | RE: To buy or not to buy, that is the question |
At 08:04 AM 1/30/2007 +0200, you wrote:
>
>Dave, apparently the folks at Google have the same philosophy, right down to
>sleeping facilities!
>
>Bobv
>A35 Bonanza
I'd heard that before. Is there a link to something on the 'net
that might talk about it?
Bob . . .
Message 4
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Subject: | RE: To buy or not to buy, that is the question |
Try http://www.google.com/corporate/culture.html. Google has a very
open attitude with their employees and follow the old mantra that a
happy employee is a productive employee. They even allow employees to
spend something like 10-20% of their time on their own pet projects
while on the clock. They are so popular now that they recently designed
a custom algorithm to weed down the 100,000+ applications they get a
year by trying to determine if they will fit in Google's culture before
even bothering to look at their qualifications. Me, I work at a company
that is more like Google's Bizzaro. Heh
Do not archive
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of
Robert L. Nuckolls, III
Sent: Tuesday, January 30, 2007 6:56 AM
Subject: AeroElectric-List: RE: To buy or not to buy, that is the
question
<nuckollsr@cox.net>
At 08:04 AM 1/30/2007 +0200, you wrote:
<bonanza@vodamail.co.za>
>
>Dave, apparently the folks at Google have the same philosophy, right
down to
>sleeping facilities!
>
>Bobv
>A35 Bonanza
I'd heard that before. Is there a link to something on the 'net
that might talk about it?
Bob . . .
Message 5
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Subject: | RE: To buy or not to buy, that is the question |
I caught the last bit of a TV programme about how they operate....couple of
months ago now!
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Robert L.
Nuckolls, III
Sent: 30 Jan 2007 02:56 PM
Subject: AeroElectric-List: RE: To buy or not to buy, that is the question
--> <nuckollsr@cox.net>
At 08:04 AM 1/30/2007 +0200, you wrote:
>--> <bonanza@vodamail.co.za>
>
>Dave, apparently the folks at Google have the same philosophy, right
>down to sleeping facilities!
>
>Bobv
>A35 Bonanza
I'd heard that before. Is there a link to something on the 'net
that might talk about it?
Bob . . .
Message 6
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Subject: | RE: To buy or not to buy, that is the question |
At 07:43 AM 1/30/2007 -0600, you wrote:
><rvbuilder@sausen.net>
>
> Try http://www.google.com/corporate/culture.html. Google has a very
>open attitude with their employees and follow the old mantra that a
>happy employee is a productive employee.
Thanks! Very useful data.
About a year ago a survey was circulated around
the department that stated, "We're trying to attract
fresh engineering talent to Wichita and to the company.
On a scale of 1 to 10, how important is it that . . ."
Then followed with some inane items like:
Wichita have a symphony orchestra?
Wichita have a good bus system?
The questions went on like that for a time before
ending up with . . .
"How important is it that the prospective employee have
interesting and exciting work to do?"
Well duh . . . I hope we didn't pay this company more
than $10 to conduct this sophomoric piece of work. I wrote
about two pages of critical review on the real issues
for talent acquisition and retention and pasted it into
the little comments box at the bottom of the survey.
Don't know if anyone in the company ever saw it. The
writing style was certainly identifiable as words coming
from me. Never heard a peep about the outcome of the
survey or my mini-dissertation on human resources management.
Some days I think I'm in the Twilight Zone when perfectly
serious folks make judgements and assign $high$ tasks that
are completely detached from logical assembly of simple-ideas!
Bob . . .
Message 7
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Subject: | Re: the fellowship of the list |
May I go one step further, and ask all of you who had a great teacher
sometime in your past to please go THANK that teacher for what you
learned. I did that last year with 2 of my best friends in high
school. We all 3 decided that Mr. Palm had been the greatest teacher
in our lives and that we needed to find him and thank him.
For me that involved flying to Frankfurt, Germany, and driving 2
hours south to Karlsruhe. He was now in a wheelchair but was so
excited to see us after 35 years, it brought tears to his eyes. I
suggest he won't have to *think* that maybe he made a difference in
someone's life; he will *know* he did.
Photos of "then" and "now". As you can see, you're always still a
kid to your teacher:
http://tinyurl.com/2ustxn
http://tinyurl.com/2rrj4y
With the Internet, Google, and online white pages, it's now much
easier to find people from your distant past.
Dave Morris
At 06:54 AM 1/30/2007, you wrote:
><nuckollsr@cox.net>
>
>At 06:52 AM 1/30/2007 -0500, you wrote:
>><rdunhamtn@hotmail.com>
>
> <snip>
>
>
>>Actually, that sounds kinda cool! I love to teach and folks say I'm
>>really good at it. Last summer I held ground school (I'm not a CFI)
>>every Saturday for 10 weeks to help the guys at the flight park
>>study for their Sport Pilot tickets. The trucker that I told my
>>wife wasn't going to make it is the first to complete his check
>>ride and get his ticket! He approached me right after his check
>>ride and, in a humble and appreciative way, thanked me for helping
>>him achieve his dream. It was great!
>>
>>
>>Rodney in Tennessee
>>Unabashed Nuckollhead
>
> Welcome to the community of teachers.
>
>
> Bob . . .
>
> ----------------------------------------
> ( IF one aspires to be "world class", )
> ( what ever you do must be exercised )
> ( EVERY day . . . )
> ( R. L. Nuckolls III )
> ----------------------------------------
>
>
Message 8
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Subject: | Re: Aircraft wiring for smart people |
I can only find mine with one hand!
----- Original Message -----
From: "Tim Andres" <tim2542@sbcglobal.net>
Sent: Tuesday, January 30, 2007 1:00 AM
Subject: RE: AeroElectric-List: Aircraft wiring for smart people
> <tim2542@sbcglobal.net>
>
> This isn't the first time I couldn't find my butt with both hands...Tim
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Robert
> L.
> Nuckolls, III
> Sent: Monday, January 29, 2007 8:44 PM
> To: aeroelectric-list@matronics.com
> Subject: RE: AeroElectric-List: Aircraft wiring for smart people
>
> <nuckollsr@cox.net>
>
> At 07:57 PM 1/29/2007 -0800, you wrote:
> <tim2542@sbcglobal.net>
>>
>>Thanks, Bob....I wanted to have a look at it, I like the idea of having a
>>central hub where most everything terminates. Seems to simplify things a
>>great deal, or at least you can guess where most if not all of your
> troubles
>>reside! BTW I looked for a long while on your site for that article and
>>was
>>not able to find it, thanks for the link.
>>Tim Andres
>
> Hmmmm . . . hey folks, there's a Google Site Search window
> on the front page of the website as well as the What's New
> page. I've used it extensively myself for finding stuff
> on an increasing stack of stuff.
>
> Tim, a site search on "richter" produced 11 hits. Not
> trying to rag you my friend . . . just raise awareness
> of this handy tool.
>
> Bob. . .
>
>
> ----------------------------------------
> ( IF one aspires to be "world class", )
> ( what ever you do must be exercised )
> ( EVERY day . . . )
> ( R. L. Nuckolls III )
> ----------------------------------------
>
>
> --
>
>
> --
>
>
>
Message 9
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Subject: | the fellowship of the list |
While everyone else calls it the junk of life that is collected, I call
it the treasures, and each treasure has its story on how it was found,
scavenged or otherwise taken from its original intended use and put on
the shelf just in case I need it someday!
We should start a 12 step program on this....
Dan
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of
Rodney Dunham
Sent: Tuesday, January 30, 2007 6:53 AM
Subject: AeroElectric-List: the fellowship of the list
<rdunhamtn@hotmail.com>
>Do you suffer from sleepless nights 'cause yer head is busy considering
a
>problem?<
Not really. But I do put myself to sleep building airplanes in my mind!
I
try to work through an upcoming task or problem as far as I can by
visualizing each step as I lay in bed. The next thing I know, the alarm
clock is going off, it's 5:30AM and time to go out to the garage and DO
it!
It's better than Ambien!
>"Would you rather buy a new tool than go to a ball game?<
Oh heck yeah! I've never understood the attraction of sports, so this
one is
a no brainer. My friends marvel at my 'lectric tool kit(s). "You're so
organized!" Well, if I didn't keep the tools all together, I wouldn't be
able to find them when I need them at 5:30AM :o)
>Are the drawers and shelves in your shop stuffed with junque you picked
up
>at garage sales and industrial surplus stores?<
Well, my WIFE calls it junk, but YOU don't have too :o(
>You may be a victim of "the disease"<
Busted!
>...now if some kid in your family or perhaps the neighborhood is really
>lucky, he/she
may "catch the disease" from you. If that happens, you'll find yourself
compelled to take on yet another "project" in an already too-full
schedule.<
Actually, that sounds kinda cool! I love to teach and folks say I'm
really
good at it. Last summer I held ground school (I'm not a CFI) every
Saturday
for 10 weeks to help the guys at the flight park study for their Sport
Pilot
tickets. The trucker that I told my wife wasn't going to make it is the
first to complete his check ride and get his ticket! He approached me
right
after his check ride and, in a humble and appreciative way, thanked me
for
helping him achieve his dream. It was great!
Rodney in Tennessee
Unabashed Nuckollhead
_________________________________________________________________
Turn searches into helpful donations. Make your search count.
Message 10
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Subject: | Re: shielded wires |
At 07:14 AM 1/27/2007 -0600, you wrote:
>have used bobs illustrations and have done a good job making pigtails and
>daisy chaining the shielded wires for my ptt switch. now i notice the 2
>wire shielded cable a little stiff to easily slip into my control stick.
>wouldnt it work to attach the shield to my alum. control stick and then
>use plain 22ga wire inside the stick? wont the stick act as the shield?
> appreciate any input, bob noffs
Bob, sorry for the delay on this. There's been a lot
of conversation on the List recently and your inquiry
moved a long way up the IN box . . .
Sure . . . first, as I mentioned in another posting
earlier, the vast majority of shielding called out in
various drawings probably contributes nothing of electrical
value in the typical small aircraft installation.
This is because there are VERY few noise sources that
propagate chiefly by electrostatic coupling . . . which
is the form of firewall provided by shielding.
I also confessed to using a lot of shielded wire as
a convenience for quick-n-dirty multiple-conductor
signal pathways in a bundle. I've got multi-thousand
foot spools of single, twisted pair and twisted trio
on the rack. If I need a trio for some task, I'm quite
likely to grab a hunk of shielded than to build my own
length of twisted wires.
So, having confessed to all that, know that your suggestion
for not taking the shields up the stick is a sound one but
not for the reason you've guessed. It's not that the shielding
is really useful but that it mostly likely doesn't matter.
-------------
< CAUTION >
-------------
When installing a system wherein the
instructions CALL OUT shielded wire,
don't use this mini-dissertation to
justify dumping shields unless you have
a strong understanding of what those wires
do an what the risks might be for electro-
static noise ingress.
All the LED annunicator fixtures I supply
are wired with shielded wire as a fabrication
convenience. See pages 10 and 11 of:
http://www.aeroelectric.com/articles/lvwarn/LVWarn-ABMM.pdf
As I mentioned above, it's EASY to use
shielded wire whether or not the shield
is necessary . . . but it can be damned
difficult to pull the new shielded wire
in later. I've offered these words as
enlightenment to the realities of shielding,
not as a general recommendation to ignore
the callouts on manufacturer's installation
instructions.
Bob . . .
----------------------------------------
( IF one aspires to be "world class", )
( what ever you do must be exercised )
( EVERY day . . . )
( R. L. Nuckolls III )
----------------------------------------
Message 11
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Subject: | Sharing ship's COMM antenna with the hand-held |
>
>I want to split the signal from my COMM antenna so I can plug
>in a handheld when necessary. Can you tell me what type of
>splitter I need, and possibly where to find one? BandC doesn't
>seem to carry them.
The least expensive and most reliable means by which you
can share the airplane's external antenna with a hand
held is to route the COMM antenna cable through the
cockpit such that a pair of connectors . . .
http://www.aeroelectric.com/Pictures/Connectors/crimpcf.jpg
http://www.aeroelectric.com/Pictures/Connectors/s605cm.jpg
come together within easy reach of the pilot. Coil up
some excess length on the ANTENNA SIDE pigtail and make sure
this piece of coax has the cable male connector on it.
If the panel mounted radio becomes unavailable to you,
open this joint and bring the antenna pigtail up to the hand
held. You'll also find it useful to use TWO right angle
adapters . . .
http://tinyurl.com/2u3qzy
. . . on the end of this pigtail.
The coax can now pass up the back side of your hand
held and make a 180-degree u-turn to mate with the radio's
BNC connector at the top.
Bob . . .
----------------------------------------
( IF one wishes to be "world class" at )
( anything, what ever you do must be )
( exercised EVERY day . . . )
( R. L. Nuckolls III )
----------------------------------------
Message 12
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|
Subject: | Re: The case for an IR&D facility . . . |
Robert L. Nuckolls, III wrote:
>
> Smart managers understand that if you expect your
> creative folks to be really good at their jobs, they
> need to be exceedingly familiar with the ingredients
> that feed into recipes for success. Familiarity can come
> in ANY endeavor.
Don't go chasing windmills, Bob. Today's 'smart managers' (or at least
the ones in control who think they are) believe the smart people
shouldn't be working for the company. They should be off creating
start-ups. The company will buy the start-up once it has produced a
successful product. This avoids that whole messy issue of having to
understand the business you're in or what it is you're making. That
stuff doesn't fit easily on a spreadsheet or in a slide show, you know.
Much better to have expensive lunches wheeling and dealing, where you
talk about people as interchangeable 'resources', whether they be a
seasoned engineer or a Chinese subsistance farmer.
--
,|"|"|, Ernest Christley |
----===<{{(oQo)}}>===---- Dyke Delta Builder |
o| d |o http://ernest.isa-geek.org |
Message 13
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Subject: | Re: 8awg line to forrest of tabs |
Discussions with some customers resulted in the following tales:
1) Battery in the tail of a metal-skinned aircraft. Battery positive is to contactor
and fatwire going forward. Battery negative is to the airframe. Aircraft
structure is riveted double epoxy coated aluminum sheets. Big engine. 200A ground
current. Scares me Bubela. Are the rivets getting hot?
2) Purchased aircraft had ground to metal airframe. New owner installed separate
ground wires, one to ground everything in the left and right wings, one to the
tail loads, one to the panel. Now he has amazing instrument deflections when
various loads are energized.
These tales are illustrations that ground currents are just like any other currents.
I mention this because familiarity with automobile electrics where the steel
chassis carries the ground currents often lead builders to ignore this essential
point.
Furthermore grounds are often grouped together or wired to "common" ground busses
without much regard to the voltage drops caused by large ground currents flowing
through them. Often many loads will attach their ground connections to
a smaller ground bus, often buried in the panel right under sensitive instruments.
This needs rethinking. You wouldn't put a positive high-current conductor
there...!?
I agree with the "forest of tabs" approach and I suggest that the idea of other
"ground busses" etc. needs some careful thinking to take grouped ground currents
into consideration.
"Never be afraid to tell the world who you are."
- Anonymous
--------
Eric M. Jones
www.PerihelionDesign.com
113 Brentwood Drive
Southbridge, MA 01550
(508) 764-2072
emjones@charter.net
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=91589#91589
Message 14
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Subject: | Re: To buy or not to buy, that is the question |
When your goal is to get it done, I always tell my engineers the same thing:
"Don't build what you can buy, and don't buy what you can steal".
It's very rare I can resolve a problem more effeciently than purchasing
someone else's canned, tested and mass produced solution. I tell them
to let other companies concentrate on the support widgets...we'll
concentrate on the REAL problems.
-John
www.ballofshame.com
Chuck Jensen wrote:
>
> Bob wrote...
> Not rambling thoughts but critical design review.
> I don't know how many builders have written or called
> about sources for materials to accomplish some portion
> of their project DIY. I always try to ask, "Are you
> doing this because you WANT to learn how it's done
> and enjoy doing it for the experience . . . or is it
> to save money."
>
> More often than not, the answer is, "to save money".
> I've come to realize that our rudimentary commodity
> of exchange is $time$ . . . and when one considers
> the total cost of acquisition and ownership in terms
> of total $time$, they quite often find that it would
> have been better to spend their $time$ acquiring
> cash at something they're good at than to spend more
> $time$ in an attempt to get something new done right
> the first time.
>
> As usual, Bob has succinctly assessed the problem. If I looks at a
> project or item and decide that "I can't build it for that" then it
> seems far better to expend money than time--unless one undertakes it as
> an educational endeavor and not to save money. If we value our time
> very highly (which we must not or we wouldn't be building airplanes!),
> then with an embarrassingly high frequency, it truly is cheaper to buy
> it then build it.
>
> Chuck
>
>
>
Message 15
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Subject: | Re: the fellowship of the list |
At 08:36 AM 1/30/2007 -0600, you wrote:
>
>May I go one step further, and ask all of you who had a great teacher
>sometime in your past to please go THANK that teacher for what you
>learned. I did that last year with 2 of my best friends in high
>school. We all 3 decided that Mr. Palm had been the greatest teacher in
>our lives and that we needed to find him and thank him.
Point well taken sir . . . and I'm pleased that you were
able to get the job done. I mentioned earlier that my most cherished
teacher died a few months before I relocated him after
a long period of isolation. There were many things
I would have wished to share with him . . . not the least
of which was my appreciation for how he influenced my
life.
I attempted to assuage my guilt for ignoring him so
long by relating my story to his widow. I've not thought
about this for years and it took some digging to find
the file which I'll share with my friends here on the
List.
http://www.aeroelectric.com/articles/comentary/Ed_Fistor.pdf
Please use this posting as a demonstration and strong
suggestion that if you have a story to share with
a cherished teacher, don't put it off lest the only
interested listener become his/her survivors. The
risks of total disconnection grow day by day. Get
it done SOON.
Bob . . .
Message 16
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Subject: | Re: Scuse me - bare Nuckolls |
In a message dated 01/29/2007 11:27:38 PM Central Standard Time,
nuckollsr@cox.net writes:
Bottom line is that we can best honor those who go before
us best by exploiting what we've learned from their
contributions. To be both good students and teachers
so that risks remain acceptably low while our confidence
and numbers continue to grow.
>>>>
Amen.
do not archive
Message 17
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Subject: | Re: AeroElectric-List Digest: 39 Msgs - 01/29/07 |
Bob: You wrote "In a nutshell, Steve tells us that the 5A breaker
illustrated in their wiring diagram at . . .
http://plane-power.com/images/AL12_EI70%20Wiring.pdf . . . does carry field
excitation current. Further, the OV protection module does pull down on this
breaker to "crowbar" it open and bring a misbehaving alternator to heel."
All I can say is halleluiah!!!! Spelling??? ;>)
Regards,
Lee...
Message 18
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Subject: | Re: AeroElectric-List Digest: 39 Msgs - 01/29/07 |
I should also say, THANKS BOB for following up with Plane Power so quickly
and comprehensively. This really is great news for a lot of us!
Regards,
Lee...
Message 19
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Subject: | Fusible link question |
Bob,
Can a fusible link be included in a wire bundle, or is it better practice to
keep it separate from a bundle? I'm wiring up fuse blocks; the fusible
link, as shown in Z-1, is in the wire that connects the main buss terminal
to the master switch.
Thanks for any info.
Bill Steer
Zenith 601HD, Stratus
Message 20
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Subject: | Re: the fellowship of the list |
I had a super math teacher two years in high school. I went back twenty
years later and ran into him. I told him sincerely that he was the best
math teacher I ever had. It was obvious it made his day.
Dave N6030X wrote:
> <N6030X@DaveMorris.com>
>
> May I go one step further, and ask all of you who had a great teacher
> sometime in your past to please go THANK that teacher for what you
> learned. I did that last year with 2 of my best friends in high
> school. We all 3 decided that Mr. Palm had been the greatest teacher
> in our lives and that we needed to find him and thank him.
>
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