Today's Message Index:
----------------------
0. 12:38 AM - If You Got This Email, You Haven't Made A Contribution Yet! :-) (Matt Dralle)
1. 12:59 AM - Runaway trim (DEAN PSIROPOULOS)
2. 08:11 AM - Antennae connector (Ernest Christley)
3. 10:28 AM - Re: LR-3 Controller (dksington)
4. 11:44 AM - Re: Batteries (Kevin Boddicker)
5. 01:28 PM - Re: 496 Audio (Dave Saylor)
6. 01:45 PM - 396/496 Audio Revisited. (emrath@comcast.net)
7. 04:18 PM - Wire Protection - Again (Valovich, Paul)
8. 04:50 PM - Re: Batteries (Robert L. Nuckolls, III)
9. 05:57 PM - Re: Re: LR-3 Controller (Matt Prather)
10. 06:41 PM - Re: Antennae connector (Robert L. Nuckolls, III)
11. 10:17 PM - Re: Antennae connector (Robert L. Nuckolls, III)
Message 0
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| Subject: | If You Got This Email, You Haven't Made A Contribution |
Yet! :-)
Dear Listers,
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Message 1
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Frank is correct:
The folks at the Portland RVators did some testing on the runaway trim issue
and confirmed this. While full up or down trim is difficult to counter-act
when the aircraft is flying at high speed, simply throttling back and
slowing down restores sufficient control authority to the pilot that a safe
landing can be made.
One thing I have not heard mentioned is elevator trim twitchiness in the RV
aircraft. I had heard some folks mention that there is too much (electric)
trim twitchiness at high speed and, trim does not respond fast enough when
the aircraft is flying slow in the pattern. So....I purchased a trim
control module from F-1 Rocket Boy to solve this (perceived) problem. I
have a micro switch that opens when the flaps are down to send a signal to
the trim control module to change the trim motor speed. One of the design
features of this unit is that it has a runaway trim sensing feature built
in. If the trim button is held for more than 5 seconds (ie. a trim wire
shorted to ground), the trim control module assumes a runaway condition and
shuts off the trim motor. Cycling power returns the unit to normal
operating condition.
Does anyone on the list use one of these trim control modules? Is it worth
the time and effort I had to put into wiring it into my system (the price
was reasonable)? And lastly, has it been reliable and does it always work
as advertised? Since the airplane hasn't flown yet I'd like to know what to
expect. Thanks.
Dean
RV-6A N197DM
Functional (electron) checkout in progress.
>__________________________ Original Message________________________________
>
>Subject: RE: AeroElectric-List: TRIM Disconnect Switch
>From: "Hinde, Frank George (Corvallis)" <frank.hinde@hp.com>>
>
>And if you have a fast airplane like an RV or Glassair and the stick
>forces get too high then simply slow down.
>
>I certainly would not bother with another switch.
Message 2
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| Subject: | Antennae connector |
I'm buying a used transponder that does not have the atennae connectory
on the rear. This is the type that locks into the mounting tray with a
clip ring, and the coax exits out the side. Is there a proper name for
this connector? Where could I obtain just one?
Message 3
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| Subject: | Re: LR-3 Controller |
Forgive my ignorance, but why would the LR3-C be incompatible? Does it not merely
send 'switch-on, switch-off' commands to the alternator, and as such as far
as the alternator is concerned it is merely being told to turn on or off? If
this is the case (and I am guessing that there is more to it) then am I not
simply doubling up on alternator control, and with the previously documented problems
with internal regulation am insuring against a reasonably likely future
failure of the internal regulation mechanism?
Are the dimensions of the S701-1 the same as the stock Vans' master contactor (ES
24115) (which I already have attached to my firewall)?
Thank you for your patience with my questions
Derek.
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=144823#144823
Message 4
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Bob,
You should receive the batteries Monday or Tuesday via USPS.
Kevin Boddicker
Tri Q 200 N7868B 78.6 hours
Luana, IA.
On Nov 7, 2007, at 7:08 PM, Robert L. Nuckolls, III wrote:
> <nuckolls.bob@cox.net>
>
> At 09:12 AM 11/7/2007 -0600, you wrote:
>
>> Bob,
>> A few weeks back someone on the list posted a url for some low
>> priced AA and AAA cells.
>> You asked him to send some to you for evaluation, if he made the
>> purchase.
>> I did indeed make that purchase. If the other lister has not send
>> you any cells, I would be happy to. They are from Batteries dot
>> com. 500 cells for $49.99 + $11.98 shipping. Thats 12.3 cents per
>> cell delivered! The cells have a 12 2012 out date. I was
>> concerned that they might be short dated for that price.
>> If you would like to hook them up to your battery runner downer I
>> please let me know, I will send some to you.
>
> Okay. A pair will suffice. I didn't get samples
> from the other gentleman.
>
> On this same topic, Big Lots has a 48-pak of
> AA Maxell alkalines on sale for $9.00 here in
> Wichita. Best price yet at under 20-cents per
> cell.
>
> I'm checking their capacity now. Will add your
> samples to the data base. Thanks for your
> time and interest.
>
> Bob Nuckolls
> 6936 Bainbridge Road
> Wichita, KS 67226-1008
>
>
Message 5
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Thanks, Ken. I'll pass this on to Jacek, who did most of the grunt work.
Dave
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Kenneth
Melvin
Sent: Thursday, November 08, 2007 1:51 PM
Subject: RE: AeroElectric-List: 496 Audio
--> <Melvinke@coho.net>
I congratulate Dave Saylor upon his excellent instructions for connecting up
the audio messages/warnings from the Garmin 496 into the audiopanel. I can
now confirm that his method, described on this list November 1st., delivers
the desired results, loud and clear.
Kenneth Melvin, RV9A,
Hillsboro, Oregon.
Message 6
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| Subject: | 396/496 Audio Revisited. |
Rumen,
Thanks for this posting, it is helpful.
What I would like to do is have the audio warnings input to the audio panel and
to be able to listen to my IPOD. One can turn off the XM radio, if so subscribed,
but the unit needs to be always connected to the panel. So for me, it appears
using the Voice+ input to the audio panel's unswitched input is the way
to go and use the switched audio inputs for the IPOD. Alternatively, 1/8" audio
could be connected in parallel with the IPOD, maybe using 220 ohm resisters,
to the Audio Panel's switched input and thus have both the IPOD and Warnings
muted by radio calls. Someone please correct me if this doesn't seem correct,
given the below informaton
Time: 02:46:14 PM PST US
From: rd2@evenlink.com
Subject: AeroElectric-List: 396/496 Audio revisited
Thanks for all postings on the subject.
I just re-reviewed the manuals and talked to Garmin. Also, I have gone
through 196, 296 and 396.
To summarize on the AUDIO subject:
In aviation mode:
296 has terrain and obstructions, but no VOICE warnings
396 and 496 both have terrain and obstructions, as well as the following
VOICE warnings:
-Terrain
-Obstructions
-500 ft AGL
-Sink Rate
-Traffic (if so equipped)
The available outputs for the above warnings (as well as for XM audio) are:
1) Data cable (voice+ and voice- ; use only voice+ , if not using the
Garmin loudspeaker; do not use voice- ; instead, the ground of the power
cable is used; voice- is meant for loudspeakers with no connection to the
unit.
The Data Cable output is mono, low impedance, amplified (for loudspeaker)
The volume of the output can be controlled.
Music (if XM music is available) is soft-muted during warnings
2) 3.5 mm audio jack - stereo, line volume, higher impedance
Music (if XM music is available) is soft-muted during warnings.
The volume of the output can be controlled.
So, there is no difference between 396 and 496 in terms of available audio
(be it warnings or music) and there is no difference between the audio
available from the data cable (voice+ to loudspeaker) and the audio output
(3.5 mm jack). The only difference here is impedance, signal, and
mono/stereo. Volume is controllable in both cases and XM music is
soft-muted by the audio warnings. Volume controls everything coming out as
audio [Terrain, Obstructions, 500 ft AGL, Sink Rate, Traffic (if so
equipped), XM audio].
In aviation mode, Garmin does not encourage feeding the data+/- to the
panel because it is an amplified low impedance, mono output, intended for
speaker and the signal carries the same info as the 3.5 mm audio jack.
Finally, the audio can be fed to a switched/soft-muted input of the audio
panel or intercom (to be muted by any communication) or to a non-switched
input (to be always audible). Problem is in the latter case, if there is XM
audio, it will be always on during ATC communications.
How to feed the audio from the 396/496 is a matter of personal preference;
there are advantages and disadvantages with any approach; all taken into
consideration, my preference is to use the 3.5 mm line audio and to feed it
to a soft-muted input (e.g. intercom).
Rumen
<html><body>
<DIV>Rumen, </DIV>
<DIV>Thanks for this posting, it is helpful. </DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV>What I would like to do is have the audio warnings input to the audio panel
and to be able to listen to my IPOD. One can turn off the XM radio, if
so subscribed, but the unit needs to be always connected to the panel.
So for me, it appears using the Voice+ input to the audio panel's unswitched input
is the way to go and use the switched audio inputs for the IPOD. Alternatively, 1/8"
audio could be connected in parallel with the IPOD, maybe
using 220 ohm resisters, to the Audio Panel's switched input and thus
have both the IPOD and Warnings muted by radio calls. Someone
please correct me if this doesn't seem correct, given the below informaton</DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV>Time: 02:46:14 PM PST US<BR>From: <A onclick="return doCompose(this);" href="http://mailcenter.comcast.net/wmc/v/wm/473491D20003A8000000136E2205886172089B0E9D030A?cmd=ComposeTo&adr=rd2%40evenlink%2Ecom&sid=c0">rd2@evenlink.com</A><BR>Subject: AeroElectric-List: 396/496 Audio revisited<BR><BR><BR>Thanks for all postings on the subject.<BR><BR>I just re-reviewed the manuals and talked to Garmin. Also, I have gone<BR>through 196, 296 and 396.<BR><BR>To summarize on the AUDIO subject:<BR><BR>In aviation mode:<BR><BR>296 has terrain and obstructions, but no VOICE warnings<BR><BR>396 and 496 both have terrain and obstructions, as well as the following<BR>VOICE warnings:<BR><BR> -Terrain<BR> -Obstructions<BR> -500 ft AGL<BR> -Sink Rate <BR> -Traffic (if so equipped)<BR><BR>The available outputs for the above warnings (as well as for XM audio) are:<BR><BR>1) Data cable (voice+ and voice- ; use only voice+ , if not using the<BR>Garmin loudspeaker; do not use voice-
; inst
ead, the ground of the power<BR>cable is used; voice- is meant for loudspeakers
with no connection to the<BR>unit.<BR><BR>The Data Cable output is mono, low
impedance, amplified (for loudspeaker)<BR><BR>The volume of the output can be
controlled.<BR><BR>Music (if XM music is available) is soft-muted during warnings<BR><BR><BR>2)
3.5 mm audio jack - stereo, line volume, higher impedance<BR><BR>Music
(if XM music is available) is soft-muted during warnings.<BR><BR>The
volume of the output can be controlled.<BR><BR><BR>So, there is no difference
between 396 and 496 in terms of available audio<BR>(be it warnings or music)
and there is no difference between the audio<BR>available from the data cable
(voice+ to loudspeaker) and the audio output<BR>(3.5 mm jack). The only difference
here is impedance, signal, and<BR>mono/stereo. Volume is controllable in
both cases and XM music is<BR>soft-muted by the audio warnings. Volume controls
everything coming out as<BR>audio [Terrain, Obstru
ctions
, 500 ft AGL, Sink Rate, Traffic (if so<BR>equipped), XM audio].<BR><BR>In aviation
mode, Garmin does not encourage feeding the data+/- to the<BR>panel because
it is an amplified low impedance, mono output, intended for<BR>speaker and
the signal carries the same info as the 3.5 mm audio jack. <BR><BR>Finally, the
audio can be fed to a switched/soft-muted input of the audio<BR>panel or intercom
(to be muted by any communication) or to a non-switched<BR>input (to be
always audible). Problem is in the latter case, if there is XM<BR>audio, it will
be always on during ATC communications.<BR><BR>How to feed the audio from the
396/496 is a matter of personal preference;<BR>there are advantages and disadvantages
with any approach; all taken into<BR>consideration, my preference is
to use the 3.5 mm line audio and to feed it<BR>to a soft-muted input (e.g. intercom).
<BR><BR>Rumen<BR><BR></DIV>
<pre><b><font size=2 color="#000000" face="courier new,courier">
</b></font></pre></body></html>
Message 7
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| Subject: | Wire Protection - Again |
I'm using the Z13/8 as the basis of my -8A electrical design. Feeling
pretty smug since no major problems encountered so far with the wiring.
But as always, the devil is in the details.
Just noticed that the 14 AWG wire going from the battery contactor to
the battery bus has a little * next to it that refers to a note that
sez: 6 inches or less.
I'm using fuse blocks mounted in the right forward baggage compartment
as the bus location. Wire length is closer to 18 inches than 6 inches -
although I can rearrange fuse block locations by redrilling. Instead,
how about using 12 AWG wire instead of 14 AWG?
Paul Valovich
N192NM Reserved (again)
Message 8
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At 10:48 AM 11/9/2007 -0600, you wrote:
>Bob,
>You should receive the batteries Monday or Tuesday via USPS.
>Kevin Boddicker
>Tri Q 200 N7868B 78.6 hours
>Luana, IA.
Very good sir. I'll put them on the precision
"battery killer" right away.
Bob . . .
Message 9
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| Subject: | Re: LR-3 Controller |
Wound field alternators are regulated by adjusting the amount of current
going through the field windings - several Amps at high output. The LR3-C
is designed for an alternator like this. Additionally, the LR3-C is a
linear regulator meaning that it's field output is not switched on and off
(in a pulse width modulated method), but instead continuously adjusted so
as to provide the correct field current (and be electrically quiet while
doing it). If the bus voltage sags a little, the field current is
increased a little.
Many/most internally regulated alternators don't take their field current
from the sense line, but from a connection to the B-lead through the
regulator circuit. If the LR3-C were wired "around" the internally
regulated alternator, I predict the output would, at best, be unstable.
As the bus voltage sagged, the LR3-C would increase the field
voltage/current, the internal regulator on the alternator would think the
bus voltage was rising quickly, and reduce the field current - at least
with some bus dynamics.
Additionally, I suspect the LR3-C would be operating at the very edge of
its design curve - the current through the sense line on an internally
regulated alternator may be exceedingly low, which is not what the LR3-C
is likely designed for - it's leakage current through the field output
might be higher than what the sense line will use - if it's driving a FET
for instance.
Also, I suspect that the overvoltage feature of the LR3-C might not work
on an internally regulated alternator as some fail modes on these
alternators don't respond to grounding the sense lead - the alternator
continues be unregulated.
The bottom line is the that the LR3-C is designed to enhance performance
in a certain type of circuit, and this isn't it. If you need the features
like independent over voltage protection you'll be better off adding a
circuit just for that. I'd imagine that you could sell the LR3-C for
nearly what you paid for it. Or, buy a compatible, externally regulated
alternator.
Regards,
Matt-
>
> Forgive my ignorance, but why would the LR3-C be incompatible? Does it
> not merely send 'switch-on, switch-off' commands to the alternator, and as
> such as far as the alternator is concerned it is merely being told to turn
> on or off? If this is the case (and I am guessing that there is more to
> it) then am I not simply doubling up on alternator control, and with the
> previously documented problems with internal regulation am insuring
> against a reasonably likely future failure of the internal regulation
> mechanism?
>
> Are the dimensions of the S701-1 the same as the stock Vans' master
> contactor (ES 24115) (which I already have attached to my firewall)?
>
> Thank you for your patience with my questions
>
> Derek.
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=144823#144823
>
>
Message 10
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| Subject: | Re: Antennae connector |
At 09:19 AM 11/9/2007 -0500, you wrote:
><echristley@nc.rr.com>
>
>I'm buying a used transponder that does not have the atennae connectory on
>the rear. This is the type that locks into the mounting tray with a clip
>ring, and the coax exits out the side. Is there a proper name for this
>connector? Where could I obtain just one?
Sounds like the slip-fit coax connectors
crafted back in the 60's to allow a radio
to be easily removed from the panel for
maintenance leaving the harnesses attached
to the tray. See if this isn't the critter
you're looking for:
http://www.aeroelectric.com/Pictures/Connectors/Coax/TED_9-30-10_A.jpg
No doubt the supplier listed is but one of
many. Do a net-search on "TED" and "9-30-10" and
see what pops up.
P.S. Here's one:
http://tinyurl.com/ynswar
Bob . . .
----------------------------------------
( "Problems are the price of progress. )
( Don't bring me anything but trouble. )
( Good news weakens me." )
( -Charles F. Kettering- )
----------------------------------------
Message 11
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| Subject: | Re: Antennae connector |
At 09:19 AM 11/9/2007 -0500, you wrote:
><echristley@nc.rr.com>
>
>I'm buying a used transponder that does not have the atennae connectory on
>the rear. This is the type that locks into the mounting tray with a clip
>ring, and the coax exits out the side. Is there a proper name for this
>connector? Where could I obtain just one?
Sounds like the slip-fit coax connectors
crafted back in the 60's to allow a radio
to be easily removed from the panel for
maintenance leaving the harnesses attached
to the tray. See if this isn't the critter
you're looking for:
http://www.aeroelectric.com/Pictures/Connectors/Coax/TED_9-30-10_A.jpg
No doubt the supplier listed is but one of
many. Do a net-search on "TED" and "9-30-10" and
see what pops up.
Bob . . .
----------------------------------------
( "Problems are the price of progress. )
( Don't bring me anything but trouble. )
( Good news weakens me." )
( -Charles F. Kettering- )
----------------------------------------
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