Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 01:08 AM - Re: Magneto and VM1000 Dimming (Bruce Gray)
2. 06:11 AM - Matt's Profiteering (not) (Chuck Jensen)
3. 06:57 AM - Re: Re: AeroElectric-List Digest: 12 Msgs - 11/09/07 (Bret Smith)
4. 07:06 AM - Re: Magneto and VM1000 Dimming (Matt Prather)
5. 07:52 AM - Re: Tyco and all its problems (dballin)
6. 08:43 AM - Re: Re: Tyco and all its problems (Gilles Thesee)
7. 09:28 AM - Re: Re: AeroElectric-List Digest: 12 Msgs - 11/09/07 (Walter Fellows)
8. 10:44 AM - Post Mortem - Matronics List Pummeled By Spam... (Matt Dralle)
9. 12:31 PM - Z14 Bat/Alt Master switch circuit questions (rtitsworth)
10. 01:31 PM - RV8 firewall ground block location (sam ray)
11. 03:32 PM - AA battery replacer? What is this thingy called?? (mikef)
12. 05:09 PM - Re: AA battery replacer? What is this thingy called?? (Henador Titzoff)
13. 05:37 PM - Re: AA battery replacer? What is this thingy called?? (mikef)
14. 05:44 PM - Re: AA battery replacer? What is this thingy called?? (mikef)
15. 06:21 PM - Re: Re: AA battery replacer? What is this thingy called?? (Henador Titzoff)
16. 06:53 PM - Re: Belly Com Antenna Shadowing (Todd Heffley)
17. 07:11 PM - Re: TRIM Disconnect Switch (Todd Heffley)
18. 07:13 PM - Satellite antenna ground planes required? (Deems Davis)
19. 08:26 PM - Re: Satellite antenna ground planes required? (paul wilson)
Message 1
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| Subject: | Magneto and VM1000 Dimming |
Yea, I believe the VM1000 only dims from the front panel.
Bruce
www.Glasair.org
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of DEAN
PSIROPOULOS
Sent: Sunday, November 11, 2007 2:48 AM
Subject: AeroElectric-List: Magneto and VM1000 Dimming
--> <dean.psiropoulos@verizon.net>
Functional checkout of my (Nuckolls inspired)electrical system has gone well
so far with no smoked wiring or equipment. I bought an equivalent of an
Odyssey 680 a couple years ago and trickle charged it occasionally hoping it
would at least be good enough to do electrical checkout, first engine start
and maybe a few times around the pattern. But it appears that is not the
case. Voltmeter says there is 12.5 volts at the terminals but it can't
produce enough amps to fire the battery contactor or even make some sparks
when shorted, pretty pathetic. I substituted a Panasonic 4.5 amp hour sealed
lead acid battery that I bought second hand about 6 years ago. It's got
enough oomph for the checkout but I'll need a new 680 for 1st engine start.
I did a test on my magneto P-lead (one mag on left side, electronic on right
side)with an ohm meter. Thinking that when the key switch is in the off
position, the resistance across the p-lead should measure close to dead
short and, it does. By the same logic, I thought that when the mag was
ungrounded the resistance across the pleads (I used a shielded wire with the
shield grounded at the magneto through the key switch as Bob recommends, no
local grounding). But when I measured across the p-leads at the magneto the
resistance only went from 0.2 ohms to 0.4 ohms when I turned the key. Not
an appreciable increase in resistance but it was consistent (happens every
time) and measurable. I thought maybe I had a faulty key switch but not so,
I removed one p-lead from the mag and made the same measurement and the
resistance with the key in that mag's position read infinite. I suspect
that there is some thing about magnetos I don't know and that this is not a
problem but would like to be sure. Anybody ever done this test? Did you get
the same results?
Also checked out the VM-1000 and it seems to work fine except for dimming. I
used one of the B&C dimmers connected to the VM-1000 dimming input but I
don't seem to get any dimming action (backlight works ok). Anyone else
experience this? Have I missed something in the VM manual and it doesn't use
an external dimming input? Any thoughts? Thanks.
Dean
RV-6A N197DM
closer to 1st flight.
Message 2
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| Subject: | Matt's Profiteering (not) |
Robert,
Well said...and quite diplomatically as well. I'm endlessly astounded
by the "baby bird" syndrome suffered by pilots, builders and our
industry as a whole. Pilots think nothing of indulging themselves with
$4.00/gallon gas (if you can find it) to amuse themselves by flying
around or to save the inconvenience of being scrutinized by security and
delayed endlessly by the airlines, yet, when asked for a voluntary
donation for something that we use and enjoy every day, are beside
themselves at the temerity that a net-volunteer should want to recover
some of their cost and, gawd forbid, might even have a nickel of profit
left over. Their immediate response is a flair up of baby-bird
syndrome....cheap, cheap, cheap.
I put my donations where my mouth is--$30 for each of the six lists I
use; and its a raging bargain at that. So yes, Gary, if you are
uncomfortable accepting a free service, then I would think Yahoo is
definitely a good landing spot for you so that you are not put upon once
a year for a voluntary donation. geeezzz.
Chuck
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com]On Behalf Of Robert
McCallum
Sent: Sunday, November 11, 2007 1:06 AM
Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Re: AeroElectric-List Digest: 12 Msgs -
11/09/07
I know I shouldn't reply to issues like this, because my feelings and
emotions on the matter and my way of wording replies sometimes gets me
in trouble, but here goes anyway. Flame suit on. (If necessary)
Gary;
#1 Very kind of you to append the whole of today's digest messages to
your reply. (see Matt's rules of conduct for use of these lists)
#2 How considerate that you think Matt should fork out the mega $$$$$$
it costs to support/run/host these lists without any consideration from
those who benefit from their existence. (You and me. Matt's not the one
gaining here)
#3 I, for one, appreciate the ease of use, and especially the freedom
from clutter/adds that these lists provide. They are FAR easier to use
and follow without all the annoying junk found on Yahoo. (your example
alternate)
#4 I'm not yet building (Falco F8L), but only presently lurking (with
the occasional post) and gathering, what I consider to be, volumes of
valuable knowledge. (and in my opinion some of the most progressive
knowledge going. Between Bob Nuckolls, Stein Bruch, Eric Jones, and even
sometimes gmcjetpilot, to name just a few of the knowledgeable souls on
this list, how can you go wrong???)
#5 The entertainment value alone is worth the token amount Matt requests
of us each year. Heck he doesn't even specify how much, leaves it
entirely up to you what you feel is fair.
#6 When this list provides information or assistance to you which saves
you time , $$, $time$, or damaged components, (more$$$$) maybe you
should consider giving that money to Matt.
#7 Maybe the cost of the electrical course you don't need to take
because of subscribing to this list should be forwarded to Matt????
#8 Maybe the $$$ you save by not having to have someone else sort your
electrical issues should be sent to Matt?????
#9 Or maybe, just maybe, you should consider sending your token
$10-$20-$30-$40-$?? like most others for one of the most valuable,
convenient, informative lists going. Where else can you get Bob N's sage
advice for so little??? Certainly not on Yahoo!
Rant off.
Matt, some of us do appreciate the format. Thank you so very much. The
$$ is well worth it.
Bob McC
do not archive
----- Original Message -----
From: Gary <mailto:gary.chris@comcast.net> Hall
Sent: Saturday, November 10, 2007 8:30 AM
Subject: AeroElectric-List: Re: AeroElectric-List Digest: 12 Msgs -
11/09/07
I appreciate your efforts in trying to provide a service but Yahoo lists
are free and if I have to support you then I'll opt out.
Your choice,
Warm regards,
gary
Message 3
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| Subject: | Re: AeroElectric-List Digest: 12 Msgs - 11/09/07 |
Thank you Charlie,
Isn't it amazing how different people determine value?
Bret Smith
RV-9A N16BL
Blue Ridge, Ga
www.FlightInnovations.com
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Charlie
England
Sent: Sunday, November 11, 2007 12:49 AM
Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Re: AeroElectric-List Digest: 12 Msgs -
11/09/07
--> <ceengland@bellsouth.net>
Gary Hall wrote:
> I appreciate your efforts in trying to provide a service but Yahoo
> lists are free and if I have to support you then I'll opt out.
>
> Your choice,
>
> Warm regards,
>
> gary
>
Matt's lists cost you the sight of a couple of donation-request emails per
year. Contribution is voluntary.
On the other hand, it's pretty hard for me to think of dealing with the
clunkiness of Yahoo as 'free'...
Message 4
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| Subject: | Re: Magneto and VM1000 Dimming |
I went through that too, Dean..
If you measure the resistance between the p-connection on the mag and
the mag case, you are either measuring the resistance through the
primary winding of the coil in the mag, or through the breaker points in
the mag (depending on where mag/engine are positioned - making the
points open or closed). In either case, it's a low resistance value.
Normal behavior.
Regards,
Matt-
DEAN PSIROPOULOS wrote:
>
> Functional checkout of my (Nuckolls inspired)electrical system has gone well
> so far with no smoked wiring or equipment. I bought an equivalent of an
> Odyssey 680 a couple years ago and trickle charged it occasionally hoping it
> would at least be good enough to do electrical checkout, first engine start
> and maybe a few times around the pattern. But it appears that is not the
> case. Voltmeter says there is 12.5 volts at the terminals but it can't
> produce enough amps to fire the battery contactor or even make some sparks
> when shorted, pretty pathetic. I substituted a Panasonic 4.5 amp hour sealed
> lead acid battery that I bought second hand about 6 years ago. It's got
> enough oomph for the checkout but I'll need a new 680 for 1st engine start.
>
> I did a test on my magneto P-lead (one mag on left side, electronic on right
> side)with an ohm meter. Thinking that when the key switch is in the off
> position, the resistance across the p-lead should measure close to dead
> short and, it does. By the same logic, I thought that when the mag was
> ungrounded the resistance across the pleads (I used a shielded wire with the
> shield grounded at the magneto through the key switch as Bob recommends, no
> local grounding). But when I measured across the p-leads at the magneto the
> resistance only went from 0.2 ohms to 0.4 ohms when I turned the key. Not
> an appreciable increase in resistance but it was consistent (happens every
> time) and measurable. I thought maybe I had a faulty key switch but not so,
> I removed one p-lead from the mag and made the same measurement and the
> resistance with the key in that mag's position read infinite. I suspect
> that there is some thing about magnetos I don't know and that this is not a
> problem but would like to be sure. Anybody ever done this test? Did you get
> the same results?
>
> Also checked out the VM-1000 and it seems to work fine except for dimming.
> I used one of the B&C dimmers connected to the VM-1000 dimming input but I
> don't seem to get any dimming action (backlight works ok). Anyone else
> experience this? Have I missed something in the VM manual and it doesn't use
> an external dimming input? Any thoughts? Thanks.
>
> Dean
> RV-6A N197DM
> closer to 1st flight.
>
>
>
>
>
Message 5
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| Subject: | Re: Tyco and all its problems |
Another solution is Gigavac. Their GX11 is basically the same as the Tyco ev200,
but less expensive.
http://www.gigavac.com/products/relays/gigavac/index.htm
I had a very good experience ordering from them. They evidently are a bunch of
ex Tyco people, are very knowledgeable and friendly.
Dan Ballin
Legacy #286
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=145073#145073
Message 6
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| Subject: | Re: Tyco and all its problems |
dballin a crit :
> Another solution is Gigavac. Their GX11 is basically the same as the Tyco ev200,
but less expensive.
>
> http://www.gigavac.com/products/relays/gigavac/index.htm
>
Dan,
It seems the GX11 hold current is about 700 mA, whereas the EV200 is 140
mA....
Or am I missing the obvious ?
Best regards,
--
Gilles
http://contrails.free.fr
Message 7
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| Subject: | Re: AeroElectric-List Digest: 12 Msgs - 11/09/07 |
you get what you pay for one way or another. if one's time is worth
nothing then wasting time reading garbage can seem like good value.
On Nov 10, 2007 9:49 PM, Charlie England <ceengland@bellsouth.net> wrote:
>
> Gary Hall wrote:
> > I appreciate your efforts in trying to provide a service but Yahoo lists
> > are free and if I have to support you then I'll opt out.
> >
> > Your choice,
> >
> > Warm regards,
> >
> > gary
> >
> Matt's lists cost you the sight of a couple of donation-request emails
> per year. Contribution is voluntary.
>
> On the other hand, it's pretty hard for me to think of dealing with the
> clunkiness of Yahoo as 'free'...
>
>
Message 8
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| Subject: | Post Mortem - Matronics List Pummeled By Spam... |
Dear Listers,
Over a 3-day period, Thursday 11/8 though Saturday 11/10, the Matronics Lists were
pummeled with over 450,000 spam emails causing posting delays and a few duplicate
messages. Yeah, I really said nearly half a million spams! The good
news is that I don't believe a single one of them actually made it to the Lists
thanks to the aggressive List filtering code and the Barracuda spam filter.
The bad news was that it caused quite a back log of email messages starting Friday
and continuing until late Saturday when I noticed that delivery seemed a bit
sluggish. By about 11pm on Saturday night, I had managed to get the backlog
cleared out of the spam filter by temporarily adjusting some of the filtering.
A check of the queues this morning, and everything looks like its working great
and there are no incoming filtering delays and spam levels appear to be back
to "normal".
There were a number of people asking what was going on, so I thought that I'd send
out a follow up post mortem on the event...
November is the annual List Fund Raiser. Your contribution directly enables me
to buy systems like the Barracuda spam filter that keep the List free of that
garbage. Please make a contribution to support your Lists!
http://www.matronics.com/contribution
Thank you!
Matt Dralle
Matronics Email List Administrator
Message 9
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| Subject: | Z14 Bat/Alt Master switch circuit questions |
Bob,
I'm building a Z-14 (dual bat, dual alt, split bus) with a 100amp primary
alt, a 20amp aux alt (SD20), and identical Odyssey style, AGM batteries.
Thus, I've biased my heavy/normal loads toward the primary side/bus (heated
prop, heated seats, etc).
I noted the z-14 drawing has s700-2-10 (three way) bat/alt master switches,
which are functionally equivalent to traditional Cessna style split master
switches. I understand this is a useful approach for preventing activation
of an alternator without an associated battery on-line. However, as shown,
it also means that taking a battery off-line dictates that the associated
alternator is off-line.
It seems that it would still be "ok" to leave an alternator on-line, with
it's associated battery off-line, as long as the cross-tie and other battery
were still on-line. However, this is not possible as shown in a std Z-14.
I'm interested in knowing more regarding these potential scenarios and
potential alternative approaches.
1) What typically happens when a battery fails that might cause someone
to want it off-line?
a. Shorts a cell, which causes it to drop approx 2 volts (???)
i. Would
I even know this while the alternator is working???
ii. What
happens if it (and the associated alt) is left on-line???
b. Battery cable becomes disconnected, or contactor fails, etc - which
causes the battery to become off-line
i. What
happens to the alternator that is now working without an associated battery?
ii. How
would I know to turn on the cross-tie (assuming it was "normally" off) to
tie the lone alternator to the remaining good battery?
c. Other Failure scenarios???
2) It seems the wiring alternatives would include:
a. Do nothing (leave z14 as-is) since the potential loss of a battery
is low, and even so I could simply either 1) leave the failed battery and
associated good alt on-line (with the cross connector) and/or 2) complete an
expedited landing with only the aux power system.
b. Include a pullable breaker (or fuse) in series with the battery
contactor side of the s700-2-10 master switch to allow the alternator to be
on-line with the battery off-line (by pulling that breaker/fuse) and leaving
the switch in the both-on position. Of course this essentially overrides
the inherent alternator only prevention and implies the user knows the
cross-tie must therefore also be on.
c. Create a more complex "logic-based" circuit with separate bat and
alt switches that only energizes the alternator switches when a appropriate
battery is also connected (either the associated battery or the other
battery and the cross-tie)
d. Create fully separate bat and alt switches and leave it up to the
pilot to get it right (the simplest, but perhaps not the safest).
e. Other???
Rick
Message 10
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| Subject: | RV8 firewall ground block location |
Where have you guys been mounting the firewall ground
block on your RV8? Seems like there are two possible
locations- one penetrating the baggage compartment,
the other below the baggage compartment floor. One
interferes with baggage, the other possibly with the
rudder pedals. I'd appreciate any insight you all
might have.
Sam Ray
__________________________________________________
Message 11
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| Subject: | AA battery replacer? What is this thingy called?? |
Hi All,
I am trying to find a double A (AA) battery replacement power supply that runs
from a 12v socket. I cannot for the life of me remember what these are called,
thus my Google searches have been fruitless.
If somebody knows where to find such a thing please let me know. I have two Lightspeed
headsets that each take a pair of AA batteries for the noise canceling
function. I want to find some of these AA adapters and make it a more permanent
installation.
Thanks very much,
Mike
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=145215#145215
Message 12
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| Subject: | Re: AA battery replacer? What is this thingy called?? |
Hi Mike,
Check out Thomas Distributing for most of your small battery and charger needs.
I've been buying from these guys for years with no problems whatsoever. Go
to Shop By Category and click on Chargers, then Chargers by Battery Size, then
select one of the four categories for AA batteries. I'll endorse the Maha brand
of chargers, since that's why I have and know. I've had the MH-C204F for
~8 years with no problems whatsoever. It's not listed anymore, but if you select
AA-AAA Chargers, you'll see Mahas listed. If I had to buy a AA charger today,
I would select the Maha MH-C204GT (AC Adaptor) or MH-C204GT-DC (AC and 12V
DC Car Cord Adaptor). You, of course, need the latter for 12V usage.
Also, check out Thomas Distributing's AA NiMH battery selection. I see that they
now have 2850 mAH batteries. Mine are 8 year old GP 1800 and 2000 mAH batteries,
and they do just fine on cross-country trips.
http://www.thomasdistributing.com/
Henador Titzoff
Mig-Weld Fulcrum
----- Original Message ----
From: mikef <mikefapex@gmail.com>
Sent: Sunday, November 11, 2007 6:28:47 PM
Subject: AeroElectric-List: AA battery replacer? What is this thingy called??
Hi All,
I am trying to find a double A (AA) battery replacement power supply
that runs from a 12v socket. I cannot for the life of me remember what
these are called, thus my Google searches have been fruitless.
If somebody knows where to find such a thing please let me know. I have
two Lightspeed headsets that each take a pair of AA batteries for the
noise canceling function. I want to find some of these AA adapters and
make it a more permanent installation.
Thanks very much,
Mike
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=145215#145215
__________________________________________________
Message 13
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| Subject: | Re: AA battery replacer? What is this thingy called?? |
Henador,
THanks for that tip on chargers. It is a good source, but not exactly what I am
looking for.
I want to replace the AA batteries with an adapter that slots into the spot that
the two AA normally go. Then that is wired to a 12v socket plug. That way I
never have to worry about charged batteries. Just plug in and go. I know this
thing is out there, I've seen them. Now I just cannot seem to find them. And I
remember there were models for a 9 volt replacement as well as AA.
Thanks again,
Mike
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=145237#145237
Message 14
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| Subject: | Re: AA battery replacer? What is this thingy called?? |
OK, finally found them. 'battery eliminator'. Kind of like Ahnolad, the Eliminator.
http://www.qcavionix.com/battery_eliminators.php?cat 500
Thanks all.
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=145241#145241
Message 15
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| Subject: | Re: AA battery replacer? What is this thingy called?? |
Thank you, Mike, for turning us on to this remarkable jewel of electronics. I'm
gonna look into it myself! :)
Henador Titzoff
Mig-Weld Fulcrum
----- Original Message ----
From: mikef <mikefapex@gmail.com>
Sent: Sunday, November 11, 2007 8:41:50 PM
Subject: AeroElectric-List: Re: AA battery replacer? What is this thingy called??
OK, finally found them. 'battery eliminator'. Kind of like Ahnolad,
the Eliminator.
http://www.qcavionix.com/battery_eliminators.php?cat 500
Thanks all.
__________________________________________________
Message 16
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| Subject: | Re: Belly Com Antenna Shadowing |
donald
You might consider waiting before you drill another footprint in the
bottom of the airplane.
My experince is that a Lower bent whip, near the middle of the
wing/fuselage is an ideal location.
Is it possible that you are fighting a bad antenna/antenna ground, or
(more likely) a bad coax/coax connector/Rack mount connector....
An interfence with the gear would seem reasonable for a whip mounted
within an INCH of a gear leg.
I am picturing your installation is a foot from each gear leg...???...
Keep lookn', before you start drillin'.
todd
Message 17
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| Subject: | Re: TRIM Disconnect Switch |
Way off topic here..
Any time I hear the "patent" word in the midst of real innovators I cringe.
PLEASE look at
"Case Against Patents" on Don Lancaster's WWW.tinaja.com
Then if you want to know how real innovators make money from ideas,
read "Riskdown" on the same site.
todd
Do not archive
Message 18
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| Subject: | Satellite antenna ground planes required? |
I have 2 (two) satellite antennas mounted to the top of my RV-10 cabin.
On is for a WAAS GPS sensor and the Other is for an XM weather
receiver.The cabin top is entirely made of fiberglass/epoxy composite.
I've looked in vain for information as to whether or not groundplanes
are required for these antennas, and if so what size/dimension. I would
dearly appreciate any guidance and direction the list or it's Sponsor
might provide.
Thanks
Deems Davis # 406
'Its all done....Its just not put together'
http://deemsrv10.com/
Message 19
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| Subject: | Re: Satellite antenna ground planes required? |
Both will work fine looking thru fiberglass Just figure out a mount
under side. Best way to prove it is to do it. That was my method.
Paul
=============
At 07:11 PM 11/11/2007, you wrote:
>
>I have 2 (two) satellite antennas mounted to the top of my RV-10
>cabin. On is for a WAAS GPS sensor and the Other is for an XM
>weather receiver.The cabin top is entirely made of fiberglass/epoxy
>composite. I've looked in vain for information as to whether or not
>groundplanes are required for these antennas, and if so what
>size/dimension. I would dearly appreciate any guidance and direction
>the list or it's Sponsor might provide.
>
>Thanks
>
>Deems Davis # 406
>'Its all done....Its just not put together'
>http://deemsrv10.com/
>
>
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