---------------------------------------------------------- AeroElectric-List Digest Archive --- Total Messages Posted Wed 11/28/07: 11 ---------------------------------------------------------- Today's Message Index: ---------------------- 0. 12:29 AM - Wow! A Ton of Comments! (Matt Dralle) 1. 04:31 AM - Re-GPS Antenna Coax Length () 2. 05:02 AM - Re: Re: Z-12 and Z-13/20 features questions (Peter Laurence) 3. 07:53 AM - Re: Re: Compass Requirements for FAA Inspection (Robert L. Nuckolls, III) 4. 08:43 AM - Re: Re: Z-12 and Z-13/20 features questions (Robert L. Nuckolls, III) 5. 09:01 AM - Re: Re: Z-12 and Z-13/20 features questions (Robert L. Nuckolls, III) 6. 10:36 AM - Re: Z-12 and Z-13/20 features questions (BuckWynd) 7. 10:49 AM - Fusible Links (Eric M. Jones) 8. 10:52 AM - Re: Compass Requirements for FAA Inspection () 9. 09:55 PM - Re: Re: Compass Requirements for FAA Inspection (Fiveonepw@aol.com) 10. 11:06 PM - Re: Re: Compass Requirements for FAA Inspection (Piper Cherokee) ________________________________ Message 0 _____________________________________ Time: 12:29:43 AM PST US From: Matt Dralle Subject: AeroElectric-List: Wow! A Ton of Comments! Dear Listers, I've been getting a ton of great comments from Listers along with their List Support Contributions lately! I've shared a bunch more below. Please read over some of them and see what your fellow Listers think of the Lists and Forums. There are just a couple more days left before the official end of this year's Fund Raiser. Please make a Contribution today to support the continued upgrade and operation of these services. There are still lots of awesome gifts available, so browse the extensive selection and pickup a nice item along with your qualifying Contribution. http://www.matronics.com/contribution Thank you in advance for your generous support! It is very much appreciated! Best regards, Matt Dralle Matronics Email List Administrator ----------- What Listers Are Saying About The Lists ----------- In the big picture, you are most certainly saving lives. The fact that you do it at a very good level of service, quality, and simplicity is just icing on the cake. We all owe you a debt of gratitude. Bruce M Can't go a single day without reading my lists. Even when I am overseas. Terry W Best list ever. No comparison. Johann J I get the digest for the two lists I subscribe to each morning -- they go great with my coffee! I can't tell you how much I've learned from this great service... Mark S ..great lists, best on the Net! Robert S It is very nice to enjoy a SPAM free list. Ken L You run a great list. Makes a builder feel like there's lots of help out there for the asking, and it's appreciated. Steve T The list is a very valuable resource. Thomas S You run a good list. James G Thanks for a great forum. Jimmy Y Thanks for a well-maintained list(s). Michael M Great job! Worth every penny! Stephen T Helps me learn and think about issues I didn't know I didn't know. Martin H I find the list very useful... Robert F What you do provides me with daily contact with a passion of my life, aviation. Wendell M ..the list it is very valuable information. Dwayne H ..a great service to homebuilders. Andrew H I have learned quite a lot from reading the Forums. I have been reading at the forum pages and I like the way it works. Ron L [The List] makes a builder feel like there's lots of help out there for the asking, and it's appreciated. Steve T The list service many purposes, not the least of which is motivation to join my fellow RVer in completing my project and getting in the air. John S Thanks for running a great site. Its simplicity is its greatness. Don't know how I would have been successful without it. Timothy F ..terrific service to experimental and general aviation. James F You have a well run operation. I am happy to support what you do. Mark S A wonderful service to the GA community. David M Great list - let's keep it ad-free! Ben C They have been of great help, learning and friendship for all the members Worldwide. Great job of yours, a little idea that grew really big and wonderful. Gary G ..a thoroughly enjoyable and informative List. John W A GREAT LEARNING TOOL!! Dwayne Y This is a very well-run list and it is a valuable resource for the Pietenpol enthusiast. Graham H Thanks for running this great site - helps those of us on the east of the pond keep in touch. Malcolm H Thanks for the major contribution to my continuing education program. Oldbob S I'm just getting started in the building process & find Matronics to be the most valuable site. Scott D Without the information and encouragement from the listers my project would have been sitting in the corner of my shop collecting dust long ago. Now it's almost ready for final assemble and covering. Edward G Great List. No Ads, just RV-10 builders. Keep it going. Rick E Wonderful source of info for building & flying... Graham H The Yak-list is a superb single source to get answers to questions on the operation of these aircraft. Craig W This list is valuable to everyone and your hard work is very much appreciated. Jim S ________________________________ Message 1 _____________________________________ Time: 04:31:26 AM PST US From: Subject: AeroElectric-List: Re-GPS Antenna Coax Length 11/28/2007 Hello Wayne, I recently had my Garmin 430 upgraded to a 430W. The Garmin installation manual specifically calls out both the type of cable to be used (RGU 400 or 142) and the required length of that cable for the 430W installation. The specific antenna cable length for the 430W installation is there to provide the desired signal strength between the powered antenna and the box -- not too strong, not too weak. The cable length that is excess to my installation needs is just coiled up. I don't know why the technician that you talked to was either ignorant of or in violation of the installation manual instructions, but if you have his name I would call back and ask him to clarify. Please let us know what you learn. 'OC' Says: "The best investment we can make is the effort to gather and understand knowledge." ------------------------------------ Time: 03:14:06 PM PST US From: "Wayne Sweet" Subject: Avionics-List: Re-GPS Antenna Coax Length When in doubt, go to the front end of the horse. Straight from the "horse's mouth" (Garmin installation tech rep 913-397-8200); there is no requirement for either the GNS430 or GNS530W minimum or maximum coax cable length. Wayne ________________________________ Message 2 _____________________________________ Time: 05:02:17 AM PST US From: " Peter Laurence" Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Re: Z-12 and Z-13/20 features questions Buck, I'll put my three cents in here. Having wired two aiplanes as per Bob's drawings, I 've wonderd whether the E buss concept was necessary. One wiring project was a velocity with a B&c 40 amp alt on the vacuum pad, a 60 main with an E buss. It seems that the only time one will have to use the E buss is 1. failure of the battery contactor (and that's another issue ) or 2. failure of both alternators. For that to happen your engine is probably not running!. If your going to use a dual alternators, split the buses and eliminate the E buss. Or, use a main buss and eliminate the E buss. I'm wiring my RV9A and decided that all devices will go on the main buss. In the event of an alt failure, pull the field breaker and if necessary, turn off the battery contactor. Have a 50 to 60 amp breaker/switch from the battery plus to the main buss. You become the E buss and shut down non essentail devices--It takes about 5 to 10 seconds. Close the breaker and you have an essential buss. It seems to me that at one time or another, all these instruments are "essential" to flight. Peter > > Hi Bob, > > To answer your questions, I'm considering installing an SD20 because, > frankly, a). it's available and b). I'm comfortable with a bit of > "overkill" when it comes to electrical power generation. Cost is simply > not an issue, and weight-saving, while important to me, is secondary to > building a robust electrical system. (As an aside, I'm saving over 30 > pounds from a "stock" RV-8 by using a lightweight composite prop and > lightweight aluminum landing gear. Other improvements will save even more > weight.) > > My airplane will be used for a lot of day VFR, but also some fairly > regular IFR cross-country, and occassional night flying. It wil be > highly-electrical dependent, with dual GRT EFIS displays, a backup Dynon > D-10A, a Garmin 430, a Garmin SL-30, a Garmin 330 transponder, a PMA9000 > audio panel, and a Trutrak Digiflight II VSVG autopilot. Not all of these > items are on the E-bus, of course, but some are. > > My concept of the E-bus (and I do NOT mind calling it an Essential Bus -- > it does not scare me or exude a negative connotation -- it's what every > sophisticated airplane I've flown in 28 years calls it) is to cover the > loads of the aircraft's important avionics and some carefully selected > accessories while I comfortably divert to a suitable airport where > maintenance can be undertaken. I do not necessarily want to continue to my > planned destination -- that goes against my personal ideas of safety. > (That topic is a whole other thread which I do not want to get into > here...) > > So there you have it -- I guess I'm attracted to a 20-amp alternator > because it exists; because installing one would allow me a margin of > "comfortable operability" without utilizing my main battery's capacity one > iota while I'm diverting to a suitable airport; and because cost is not > part of the equation. > > So what remains in the equation are weight, complexity (number of parts, > wires and connectors), and reliability. > > If you need to have a complete list of my E-bus loads, I'll certainly post > them here in a day or so when I return home and consult my notebook... > > Thanks in advance. I truly appreciate all input on this matter. > > Buck > > -------- > Buck Wyndham > RV-8 N18XL (working on fuselage & systems) > Northern Illinois > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=148988#148988 > > > ________________________________ Message 3 _____________________________________ Time: 07:53:42 AM PST US From: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Re: Compass Requirements for FAA Inspection At 11:02 PM 11/27/2007 -0800, you wrote: > >While I agree with a lot of what you say, I must say that I once has a >total electrical failure and my PAI vertical card compass sure came in >handy to fly the reciprocal backs to Carson City from the middle of the >Nevada desert That's why I fly with dual, $100 hand-held GPS receivers that do not depend on power from the ship's electrical system. http://www.aeroelectric.com/Pictures/Misc/Failure_Tolerance.pdf Bob . . . ----------------------------------------) ( . . . a long habit of not thinking ) ( a thing wrong, gives it a superficial ) ( appearance of being right . . . ) ( ) ( -Thomas Paine 1776- ) ---------------------------------------- ________________________________ Message 4 _____________________________________ Time: 08:43:06 AM PST US From: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Re: Z-12 and Z-13/20 features questions At 07:58 AM 11/28/2007 -0500, you wrote: > > >Buck, > >I'll put my three cents in here. > >Having wired two aiplanes as per Bob's drawings, I 've >wonderd whether the E buss concept was necessary. Not if you have design goals that eliminate it . . . The concept of "necessary" is unique to individual percepti > One wiring project was a velocity with a B&c 40 amp alt on the vacuum > pad, a 60 main with an E buss. It seems that the only time one will have > to use the E buss is 1. failure of the battery contactor (and that's > another issue ) or 2. failure of both alternators. For that to happen > your engine is probably not running!. Yup, that's figure Z-12 . . . >If your going to use a dual alternators, split the buses and eliminate the >E buss. Or, use a main buss and eliminate the E buss. >I'm wiring my RV9A and decided that all devices will go on the main buss. >In the event of an alt failure, pull the field breaker . . . Your alternator field power doesn't go through the ship's DC PWR MASTER switch? > and if necessary, turn off the battery contactor. . . . when would it be necesary? What indications does the pilot get and how are they interpreted to drive a decision to open the battery contactor? >Have a 50 to 60 amp breaker/switch from the battery plus to the main buss. ???? >You become the E buss and shut down non essentail devices--It takes about >5 to 10 seconds. >Close the breaker and you have an essential buss. It seems to me that at >one time or another, all these instruments are "essential" to flight. The ENDURANCE-Bus is crafted for minimum power consumption for battery only operations. In no way is it intended or crafted to make any ESSENTIAL device unavailable to the pilot. Further, piling "all these instruments" into the classification of "essential" suggests that everything on the panel should have backups . . . I respectfully suggest that (1) with modern alternators and (2) artfully maintained RG batteries that Z-11 offers DC SYSTEM reliability that far exceeds that which is being flown in tens of thousands of TC aircraft wired like a 1970 C-150. This condition exists irrespective of the suite of devices installed or which ones are deemed "essential". If one does nothing other than to exploit what modern alternators and batteries have to offer, SYSTEM reliability is at least equal to and probably MUCH better than what's flying in most light GA aircraft toay. Exploiting an unused vacuum pump pad by plugging the hole with something other than a cover plate is icing on the cake. An SD-8 alternator offers ENDURANCE load support for a fist- full of goodies for en-route operations while retaining 100% of the well- maintained battery's capacity for approach to landing. An approach where EVERY electro-whizzie in the airplane is available for comfortable termination of flight. Note that all of the above makes no mention of numbers, kinds or "criticality" of any particular piece of equipment. Crafting that list (and deciding which bus to drive it from) is driven by anticipate missions to be flown, panel space and weight issues and the size of one's pocketbook. But in no case, does the artfully crafted, failure tolerant system deprive the pilot of any piece of functional equipment. Once the alternator(s)/battery decisions are are made, then it matters very little what architecture is adopted. This is where design goals should strive to minimize weight, parts count and pilot-duties for perceiving and reacting to RARE failures of DC PWR supply equipment. Bob . . . ________________________________ Message 5 _____________________________________ Time: 09:01:07 AM PST US From: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Re: Z-12 and Z-13/20 features questions > >Hi Bob, > >To answer your questions, I'm considering installing an SD20 because, >frankly, a). it's available and b). I'm comfortable with a bit of >"overkill" when it comes to electrical power generation. Cost is simply >not an issue, and weight-saving, while important to me, is secondary to >building a robust electrical system. (As an aside, I'm saving over 30 >pounds from a "stock" RV-8 by using a lightweight composite prop and >lightweight aluminum landing gear. Other improvements will save even more >weight.) > >My airplane will be used for a lot of day VFR, but also some fairly >regular IFR cross-country, and occassional night flying. It wil be >highly-electrical dependent, with dual GRT EFIS displays, a backup Dynon >D-10A, a Garmin 430, a Garmin SL-30, a Garmin 330 transponder, a PMA9000 >audio panel, and a Trutrak Digiflight II VSVG autopilot. Not all of these >items are on the E-bus, of course, but some are. > >My concept of the E-bus (and I do NOT mind calling it an Essential Bus -- >it does not scare me or exude a negative connotation -- it's what every >sophisticated airplane I've flown in 28 years calls it) is to cover the >loads of the aircraft's important avionics and some carefully selected >accessories while I comfortably divert to a suitable airport where >maintenance can be undertaken. I do not necessarily want to continue to my >planned destination -- that goes against my personal ideas of safety. >(That topic is a whole other thread which I do not want to get into here...) > >So there you have it -- I guess I'm attracted to a 20-amp alternator >because it exists; because installing one would allow me a margin of >"comfortable operability" without utilizing my main battery's capacity one >iota while I'm diverting to a suitable airport; and because cost is not >part of the equation. > >So what remains in the equation are weight, complexity (number of parts, >wires and connectors), and reliability. > >If you need to have a complete list of my E-bus loads, I'll certainly post >them here in a day or so when I return home and consult my notebook... > >Thanks in advance. I truly appreciate all input on this matter. First, I'll suggest that your system should be capable of continued flight to airport of intended destination. Comfortable completion of flight with a failed piece of equipment is dependent upon planing and understanding which leads to comfortable decision making. Yes, taking the family out to McD's with $1,000 cash in hand assuages any concerns about paying for the meal, but if you have to traverse 30 miles of sparsely populated terrain and have no spare tire, then your cash comfort is overshadowed by your inability to deal with an easily anticipated and planned-for failure. I'm only suggesting that your willingness to pile on levels of comfort because you have all this extra weight carrying ability is 'easy' but perhaps not the best we know how to do. I met an RV flyer at an airshow some years ago with Z-14, dual EFIS (can fly IFR from either seat) and the guy said he wasn't instrument rated, didn't fly with instrument rated passengers but thought the system would improve on the resale price of the airplane! I'm only suggesting that the optimum design minimizes weight, parts count, cost of ownership and probability of pilot error for failure management. Take care that the "wad of hundreds in the wallet" don't lull you into a false sense of security while increasing overall cost of ownership for your airplane. Bob . . . ________________________________ Message 6 _____________________________________ Time: 10:36:17 AM PST US Subject: AeroElectric-List: Re: Z-12 and Z-13/20 features questions From: "BuckWynd" Thanks, Bob, for the information. I agree that money does not buy happiness and does not cover for poor design or sloppy implementation. Im back from my trip, and Ive looked up the information on my particular requirements. My enroute E-Bus loads: EFIS/MFD 1 1.5 A EFIS/MFD 2 1.5 A AHRS/Magnetometer 0.25 A EIS (Engine Monitor) 0.5 A Alt Field 1.0 A TruTrak Autopilot head 0.5 A A/P servo Roll 1.0 A A/P servo Pitch 1.0 A Garmin 430 NAV/GPS 1.65 A Garmin 330 1.0 A Flexible map light 0.1 A TOTAL: 10.0 Wow, you say. I see some stuff that could be moved off the bus. Yes, youre right. The total is 10 amps, but I could move one of the EFIS displays and the EIS off the E-bus, for a savings of 2 amps. However, the Garmin 430 draws up to 6 amps (intermittent) when transmitting, so were back up to 14 already. I could consider the transmit feature of the radio to be off-limits until I get on the ground. Airplanes can certainly be flown without transmitting on the radio. I could also delete the autopilot head and servos, and just hand-fly. These modifications would definitely keep me below 8 amps. However, my stated goal is to be able to SAFELY and COMFORTABLY fly the airplane IFR to the nearest suitable place where repairs can be made. Coordinating my divert with ATC and getting vectors and an approach clearance are part of the safety and comfort clause, in my opinion. Therefore, I think that both the transponder and radio should be part of an IFR E-Bus. Similarly, an autopilot is an invaluable tool in an irregular operation such as this -- a partial electrical failure in IFR conditions. By the way, my Dynon D-10A is not listed because it has an internal battery. So lets say I install a backup 7.2 Ah battery for my EFIS displays, the EIS, and the AHRS (something Ive been contemplating doing anyway). Were still at over 12 amps when the comm radio is transmitting. See the issue? If I want my alternator to easily handle the entire E-bus load, not share it with the main battery at all, an 8A alternator appears to be too small to handle my particular IFR panel, at least when transmitting. VFR is a totally different story. I can safely recover a plane VFR (or even IFR but good VMC) with a zero load on my E-Bus. Its when we get into the clouds that an 8A alternator appears to be insufficient for my needs. I dont want to debate what should or should not be on a persons E-bus that discussion could go on for years (and has). People can justify whatever makes them comfortable. Am I wrong in thinking that Id like to save my ENTIRE main battery for the approach and landing phase of my emergency? If so, then I have no problem with an 8A aux alternator. Somebody slap me around if I need to get off that particular train of thought. Finally, Bob, you have recently been talking down the Z-13/20, but mostly without further comment just that it sucks. Since youre the guy who designed it, Ill have to take your word for it. But before I abandon all my cool CAD drawings and start over, it would be helpful to know a bit more about why youve soured on it does the design have some missing functionality, less-than-optimal reliability, or a hidden gotcha that a person should know about? Is it that you disagree with peoples design requirements and that you feel no one should have a need for more than an 8A endurance load? Is the SD20 not living up to peoples expectations somehow? I havent seen any of these things addressed here in this forum. Whatever the answer is, its just fine with me. I have no particular attachment to any one design. I just want to get the job done: a 10+ amp E-bus, provided entirely by a standby alternator. If the Z-12 is the answer, great. But how about a little more information for all of us regarding the Z-13/20? Thanks, as always, for your input! Buck -------- Buck Wyndham RV-8 N18XL (working on fuselage & systems) Northern Illinois Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=149148#149148 ________________________________ Message 7 _____________________________________ Time: 10:49:15 AM PST US Subject: AeroElectric-List: Fusible Links From: "Eric M. Jones" There are occasional questions about fusible links on the Aeroelectric. Fusible links were common long ago, but lately engineers have eschewed them. I have seen a demo online regarding what happens when a fusible link blows--the wire inside vaporizes and the plasma arc blows through the covering. This is not good in a bundle, or when fuel or flammables or conductive surfaces may be present. Usually instructions for making fusible links do include layers of non-flammable silicone and fiber over-covering. The link covering may not be capable of enclosing the rupture arc, especially since the rupture arc may occur (probably will occur) near the ends. So for those who have puzzled about the fusible link issue, here's my advice: Use standard fuses/breakers or whatever instead. That's my plan. "When trouble arises and things look bad, there is always one individual who perceives a solution and is willing to take command. Very often, that individual is crazy. --Dave Barry" -------- Eric M. Jones www.PerihelionDesign.com 113 Brentwood Drive Southbridge, MA 01550 (508) 764-2072 emjones@charter.net Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=149151#149151 ________________________________ Message 8 _____________________________________ Time: 10:52:58 AM PST US From: Subject: AeroElectric-List: Re: Compass Requirements for FAA Inspection Re-post of info per request. Each item has three categories Day VFR, Night VFR, IFR (day or night). The format is still messed up but it should go through MINIMUM INSTRUMENT AND EQUIPMENT REQUIREMENTS FOR POWERED AMATEUR BUILT EXPERIMENTAL AIRCRAFT Introduction: The table below is intended to give the builder of amateur built experimental aircraft a ready reference for the instrument and equipment requirements for his aircraft. The builder should note that some items required by the FAR's are described in the FAR's as needing to be approved, but since there are no certification standards established for amateur built experimental aircraft no formal individual item approval, such as meeting a TSO (Technical Standard Order) or FAR Part 23, is required. However certain items must interface properly with ATC (Air Traffic Control), other aircraft, or other entities external to the aircraft. Transponders, communication radios, exterior lighting and ELT's (Emergency Locator Transmitters) are examples of such equipment. Therefore, the builder can expect that the initial airworthiness inspection of his aircraft will require evidence that this type of equipment in the aircraft is acceptable to the FAA. The Special Airworthiness Certificate issued for each amateur built experimental aircraft includes specific Operating Limitations. Per FAA Order 8130.2F the Operating Limitations state: "After completion of Phase I flight testing, unless appropriately equipped for night and/or instrument flight in accordance with 91.205, this aircraft is to be operated under VFR, day only." The FAR's, FAA Order 8130.2F, and current FAA policy have been used in constructing the below amateur built experimental aircraft configuration requirements table. THIS TABLE DOES NOT PROVIDE RECOMMENDATIONS FOR BEST PRACTICES. INSTALLING ONLY THE MINIMUM REQUIRED ITEMS MAY NOT BE PRUDENT OR SAFE. By Owen C. Baker with appreciation to Richard E. Koehler. MINIMUM INSTRUMENT AND EQUIPMENT REQUIREMENTS FOR POWERED AMATEUR BUILT EXPERIMENTAL AIRCRAFT FAR & ITEM DESCRIPTION (See Notes Below Table) (DAY VFR) (NIGHT VFR) (IFR) 1. 91.205 (b) (1) Airspeed Indicator NR R R 2. 91.205 (b) (2) Altimeter NR R R 3. 91.205 (b) (3) Magnetic Direction Indicator NR R R 4. 91.205 (b) (4) Tachometer for Each Engine NR R R 5. 91.205 (b) (5) Oil Pressure Gauge for Each Engine Using a Pressure System NR R R 6. 91.205 (b) (6) Temperature Gauge for Each Liquid Cooled Engine NR R R 7. 91.205 (b) (7) Oil Temperature Gauge for Each Air Cooled Engine NR R R 8. 91.205 (b) (8) Manifold Pressure Gauge for Each Altitude Engine NR R R 9. 91.205 (b) (9) Fuel Gauge Indicating Quantity of Fuel In Each Tank NR R R 10. 91.205 (b) (10) Landing Gear Position Indicator, If Retractable NR R R 11. 91.205 (b) (11) Anti-Collision Light System - (Small civil airplanes certified after 3/11/96) NR R R 12. 91.205 (b) (13) Approved Safety Belts With Metal to Metal Buckles for Each Occupant (2 yrs or older) NR R R 13. 91.205 (b) (14) Approved Shoulder Harness for Each Front Seat - For Small Civil Airplanes Manufactured After 7/18/78 NR R R 14. 91.205 (b) (15) ELT (If required by Sec. 91.207, i.e. >one seat and >50 miles) AR AR AR 15. 91.205 (b) (16) Approved Shoulder Harness for Each Seat - Airplanes With 9 or Less Seats Manufactured After 12/12/86 NR R R 16. 91.205 (b) (17) Shoulder Harness for Each Seat For Rotorcraft - Manufactured After 9/16/92 NR R R 17. 91.205 (c) (2) Approved Position (navigation) Lights NR R R 18. 91.205 (c) (3) Anti-Collision Light System (Systems installed after 8/11/71- see reference) NR R R 19. 91.205 (c) (5) Adequate Source of Electrical Energy for Installed Equipment NR R R 20. 91.205 (c) (6) One Spare Set of Fuses or Three Fuses of Each Kind Required, Must be Accessible to Pilot In Flight NR R R 21. 91.205 (d) (2) Two-Way Radio Communication System and Navigational Equipment Appropriate to Ground Facilities Used NR NR R 22. 91.205 (d) (3) Gyroscopic Rate of Turn Indicator (Some Exceptions, See Reference) NR NR R 23. 91.205 (d) (4) Slip-Skid Indicator NR NR R 24. 91.205 (d) (5) Sensitive Altimeter Adjustable for Barometric Pressure, (See FAR 91.411, Altimeter System Inspection Required Every 24 Calendar Months) NR NR R 25. 91.205 (d) (6) Clock Displaying Hours, Minutes, and Seconds - Sweep Second Pointer or Digital NR NR R 26. 91.205 (d) (7) Electrical Generator or Alternator of Adequate Capacity NR NR R 27. 91.205 (d) (8) Gyroscopic Bank and Pitch Indicator (Artificial Horizon) NR NR R 28. 91.205 (d) (9) Gyroscopic Direction Indicator (Directional Gyro or Equivalent) NR NR R 29. 91.205 (e) DME Above FL 240 N/A N/A AR 30. 91.215, Transponder in Certain Airspace, (See FAR 91.413, Inspection Required Every 24 Calendar Months) AR AR AR Notes: (1) AR = As Required, NR = Not Required, N/A = Not Applicable, R = Required (2) A fourth flight operation category, Day (only) Instruments, is not included above. ABEA Minimum Inst Requirements 7.doc 11/17/2005 --------------------------------- Get easy, one-click access to your favorites. Make Yahoo! your homepage. ________________________________ Message 9 _____________________________________ Time: 09:55:55 PM PST US From: Fiveonepw@aol.com Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Re: Compass Requirements for FAA Inspection In a message dated 11/28/2007 12:56:46 PM Central Standard Time, gmcjetpilot@yahoo.com writes: Therefore, the builder can expect that the initial airworthiness inspection of his aircraft will require evidence that this type of equipment in the aircraft is acceptable to the FAA. Regurgitating the FARs is most likely deja-vu to most builders. "Evidence" here is just as open to interpretation as the result of what King James did to the "Bible". Still best to find out how your DAR reads chapter&verse. You spent years of your life building the sumbitch, why crash&burn on judgement day? Mark (Ohhhhmmmmm..........) **************************************Check out AOL's list of 2007's hottest products. (http://money.aol.com/special/hot-products-2007?NCID=aoltop00030000000001) ________________________________ Message 10 ____________________________________ Time: 11:06:00 PM PST US From: Piper Cherokee Subject: RE: AeroElectric-List: Re: Compass Requirements for FAA Inspection Hi folks does anyone know how to go about to ***Unsubscribe to this email mailing li st****** Please help, Thanks From: Fiveonepw@aol.comDate: Thu, 29 Nov 2007 00:54:01 -0500Subject: Re: Ae roElectric-List: Re: Compass Requirements for FAA InspectionTo: aeroelectri c-list@matronics.com In a message dated 11/28/2007 12:56:46 PM Central Standard Time, gmcjetpilo t@yahoo.com writes: Therefore, the builder can expect that the initial airworthiness inspection of his aircraft will require evidence that this type of equipment in the a ircraft is acceptable to the FAA. Regurgitating the FARs is most likely deja-vu to most builders. "Evidence" here is just as open to interpretation as the result of what King James di d to the "Bible". Still best to find out how your DAR reads chapter&verse. You spent years of your life building the sumbitch, why crash&burn on judg ement day? Mark (Ohhhhmmmmm..........) Check out AOL Money & Finance's list of the hottest products and top money wasters of 2007. _________________________________________________________________ Put your friends on the big screen with Windows Vista=AE + Windows Live=99. http://www.microsoft.com/windows/shop/specialoffers.mspx?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_C PC_MediaCtr_bigscreen_102007 ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Other Matronics Email List Services ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Post A New Message aeroelectric-list@matronics.com UN/SUBSCRIBE http://www.matronics.com/subscription List FAQ http://www.matronics.com/FAQ/AeroElectric-List.htm Web Forum Interface To Lists http://forums.matronics.com Matronics List Wiki http://wiki.matronics.com Full Archive Search Engine http://www.matronics.com/search 7-Day List Browse http://www.matronics.com/browse/aeroelectric-list Browse Digests http://www.matronics.com/digest/aeroelectric-list Browse Other Lists http://www.matronics.com/browse Live Online Chat! http://www.matronics.com/chat Archive Downloading http://www.matronics.com/archives Photo Share http://www.matronics.com/photoshare Other Email Lists http://www.matronics.com/emaillists Contributions http://www.matronics.com/contribution ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- These Email List Services are sponsored solely by Matronics and through the generous Contributions of its members.