---------------------------------------------------------- AeroElectric-List Digest Archive --- Total Messages Posted Sun 12/30/07: 14 ---------------------------------------------------------- Today's Message Index: ---------------------- 1. 02:37 AM - Re: Noisy Microphone. (Chris Byrne) 2. 04:44 AM - lacing tape types (raymondj) 3. 06:28 AM - Re: Another wet compas problem (Rodney Dunham, M.D.) 4. 08:29 AM - Re: Another wet compas problem (Charlie England) 5. 10:34 AM - Re: Another wet compas problem (earl_schroeder@juno.com) 6. 02:39 PM - Re: Tap into antenna coax? (Jeffrey W. Skiba) 7. 05:07 PM - AEC9004 Status? (Jeffrey W. Skiba) 8. 05:57 PM - Re: Powering the Ignition and Fuel Injectors on Egg. Subaru (mikef) 9. 06:39 PM - Help with D-Sub pin (Edward Christian) 10. 07:48 PM - Re: Help with D-Sub pin (Charlie England) 11. 09:45 PM - Re: lacing tape types (Robert L. Nuckolls, III) 12. 10:24 PM - Z-14 (regular) Z-14 Fadec and Z-19 (Jeffrey W. Skiba) 13. 10:24 PM - Re: Low voltage problem in a new plane- New readings (Les Goldner) 14. 11:26 PM - Re: lacing tape types (raymondj) ________________________________ Message 1 _____________________________________ Time: 02:37:01 AM PST US From: "Chris Byrne" Subject: AeroElectric-List: Re: Noisy Microphone. Thanks to everyone who gave advice. Results I switched antenna's, no joy. Checked earths and found a lose earth, no joy Adjusted microphone gain on headset, no joy All the while the transmission on the GNC300XL has been great as has the reception on the SL30. Transmission on the SL30 has been full of background noise and unreadable. Fixed it. The SL30 has its own microphone gain that is easy to adjust. It has a range of 1 to 256 and is preset at 128. To get a good transmission I had to wind it back to 1. Its fine now. Chris Byrne SYDNEY ________________________________ Message 2 _____________________________________ Time: 04:44:03 AM PST US From: "raymondj" Subject: AeroElectric-List: lacing tape types On the page linked below they sell 2 types of lacing tape. Polyester - recommend for spot tying, and nylon - recommended for continuous tying. How do the properties of the two differ and how critical is it to use one type or the other for the different tasks? Do you really need both types? http://www.aircraftspruce.com/pdf/2008Individual/Cat08457.pdf Thanks in advance, Raymond Julian Kettle River, MN "Hope for the best, but prepare for the worst." do not archive ________________________________ Message 3 _____________________________________ Time: 06:28:53 AM PST US From: "Rodney Dunham, M.D." Subject: RE: AeroElectric-List: Another wet compas problem Ed, Someone correct me if I'm wrong but... Any ferrous metal will attract your compass needle. So, unless the metal stuff you're moving with the canopy is nonferrous metal it will cause a deflection of the needle. Even if not magnetized. You might try moving the compass to the midline of the plane and see if competing forces cancel out. Also, you may want to do this experiment outside the hangar and away from any power lines, etc... A good place is the compass rose at your airport. Rodney in Tennessee ________________________________ Message 4 _____________________________________ Time: 08:29:11 AM PST US From: Charlie England Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Another wet compas problem ed clegg wrote: > > Hi All, > > I placed a wet compass in my panel on the upper left side. With the canopy > open-RV8- it reads approx correct. As I close the canopy this compass starts > rotating to the right and when completely clsd the compass is Off 50 > degrees. > It would appear that the canopy frame is magnetized. If this is so how would > one go about the fix for this. > Thanks, > Ed Clegg > Try to find a TV repair technician who will loan you his degaussing tool. It's basically a big coil of wire with an AC cord & switch. It generates a constantly changing magnetic field, due to the AC current flowing through it. You power it up and bring it slowly closer to the object you want to demagnetize. Move it slowly around the object holding it as close as possible. Then slowly move it away, as you continue to move it around the object. Don't turn it off until it's several feet away from anything you want to avoid magnetizing. Charlie ________________________________ Message 5 _____________________________________ Time: 10:34:00 AM PST US From: "earl_schroeder@juno.com" Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Another wet compas problem If memory serves, using the old type gun looking soldering irons used to work also.. Earl -- Charlie England wrote: ed clegg wrote: > > Hi All, > > I placed a wet compass in my panel on the upper left side. With the canopy > open-RV8- it reads approx correct. As I close the canopy this compass starts > rotating to the right and when completely clsd the compass is Off 50 > degrees. > It would appear that the canopy frame is magnetized. If this is so how would > one go about the fix for this. > Thanks, > Ed Clegg > Try to find a TV repair technician who will loan you his degaussing tool. It's basically a big coil of wire with an AC cord & switch. It generates a constantly changing magnetic field, due to the AC current flowing through it. You power it up and bring it slowly closer to the object you want to demagnetize. Move it slowly around the object holding it as close as possible. Then slowly move it away, as you continue to move it around the object. Don't turn it off until it's several feet away from anything you want to avoid magnetizing. Charlie _____________________________________________________________ Orchard Bank MasterCard Get your credit on track with an Orchard Bank MasterCard http://thirdpartyoffers.juno.com/TGL2121/fc/JKFkuJi7EpInP9rnnLhp0IcKeEmZw4zLN7YtmWRa4QXfFPMotTRHol/ ________________________________ Message 6 _____________________________________ Time: 02:39:50 PM PST US From: "Jeffrey W. Skiba" Subject: RE: AeroElectric-List: Tap into antenna coax? I realize this is an old post but the link below: http://aeroelectric.com/articles/commtap/commtap.html returns a page not found, I tried looking manually for the info but seem to not be able to find it. Can anyone advise ? -----Original Message----- From: owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Robert L. Nuckolls, III Sent: Sunday, March 20, 2005 5:15 PM Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Tap into antenna coax? Don't know how long Jim's had his butt-ugly hand held antenna adapter article posted. My own version is at: http://aeroelectric.com/articles/commtap/commtap.html HOWEVER, the top paragraph of my article cites the preferred way of breaking into the feedline for your comm antenna . . . put a male/female junction in the feedline with some excess coiled under a seat or behind a velcro'ed upholstery panel. The coax "T" will not work and puts one or both radio's receivers at risk for damage by the other radio's transmitter. Bob . . . At 10:16 AM 3/20/2005 -0600, you wrote: > > >James E. Clark wrote: > > > > > >Another option ... > > > >King used to make an adapter for their KX99 Handheld that can be used. > >Basically the mini jack/plug arrangement opens the coax from the panel and > >closes the connection to the handheld. It is all done in a neat little box > >and you get a mini->coax pigtail. > > > >Don't know if they still sell them or not. > > > >James > > > >snipped > >You can make one of these for yourself if you're handy with a soldering >iron. Jim Weir actually described construction in an old Kitplanes article. >http://www.rst-engr.com/kitplanes/KP0203/KP0203.htm >The design won't make HAM radio guys or RF engineer types happy, but it >works fine considering the limited use it will get. If you're really >worried, put it in a little aluminum box. > >Charlie > > ________________________________ Message 7 _____________________________________ Time: 05:07:05 PM PST US From: "Jeffrey W. Skiba" Subject: AeroElectric-List: AEC9004 Status? I guess this is more of a question for BOB but I figured the list might have info on it also: I was getting ready to do my Electrical system Final design after many different version - ideas and after re-reading several articles and "the book". I seem to need to know what the current status of the new AEC9004 Alternator controller. My understanding is that this device will be able to control an internally regulated Alternator on-off and also be able to handle the "possibility" of "load dump" triggered by Crow bar Over volt protection in the current z24 diag. Ref article: http://www.aeroelectric.com/articles/Adapting_IR_Alternators_to_Aircraft.pdf If it is not done, time frame? Are there any changes to the doc to do until it is ready? I have an internally regulated alternator, and am planning on getting an SD-20 for emergency mode of main alternator failure. Thanks in advance ________________________________ Message 8 _____________________________________ Time: 05:57:28 PM PST US Subject: AeroElectric-List: Re: Powering the Ignition and Fuel Injectors on Egg. Subaru From: "mikef" Ed, Good suggestion on the relays/contactors. I was recently exploring this option and might experiment it out. I am already using a Perihelion Design Powerlink Jr solid state relay for the Z19 E-bus alternate feed, with max capacity of 35 amps. It is a nice, compact package good for a high-vibration location. Another of these might do the trick in the case of the coils. I don't like increasing part counts but .... I still wish Bob would weigh in on these design issues, as an outgrowth of the Z19 design. I've seen these same questions come up but nobody has really addressed them as a part of that scheme as far as I can tell. Fly safe, Mike Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=155085#155085 ________________________________ Message 9 _____________________________________ Time: 06:39:45 PM PST US From: Edward Christian Subject: AeroElectric-List: Help with D-Sub pin I am redoing a panel. I am trying to use a Dynon D-100 to send altitude encoding info to to a KT76A (bought the Encoder converter) - no problem. I also want to use the D-100 to send encoder info to a Garmin 300XL GPS/COMM - this unit can receive grey code or serial, I elect to go the grey code route and I am looking for a 3 way 9-pin connector - any suggestions? Is it possible to split the D-100 Serial Transmit wire to both the converter (for the transponder) and the Garmin GPS? Also, anyone know standard order parts for 37 pin D-Sub pin male/ female and pins (both) - Mauser or DigiKey? This is to make Avionics ground bus. Thanks, Ed ________________________________ Message 10 ____________________________________ Time: 07:48:51 PM PST US From: Charlie England Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Help with D-Sub pin Edward Christian wrote: > > > I am redoing a panel. I am trying to use a Dynon D-100 to send altitude > encoding info to to a KT76A (bought the Encoder converter) - no problem. > I also want to use the D-100 to send encoder info to a Garmin 300XL > GPS/COMM - this unit can receive grey code or serial, I elect to go the > grey code route and I am looking for a 3 way 9-pin connector - any > suggestions? Is it possible to split the D-100 Serial Transmit wire to > both the converter (for the transponder) and the Garmin GPS? > > Also, anyone know standard order parts for 37 pin D-Sub pin male/female > and pins (both) - Mauser or DigiKey? This is to make Avionics ground bus. > > Thanks, > > Ed If it's a standard d-sub connector with 9 pins, go to ebay & enter 'db-9 splitter'. I got 0 auction hits but several ebay store hits, including http://cgi.ebay.com/RS232-DB-9-Serial-SPLITTER-Cable-1Female-to-2-Male_W0QQitemZ6725976345QQihZ016QQcategoryZ41995QQrdZ1QQssPageNameZWD1VQQcmdZViewItem?_trksid=p1638.m118 for $0.99 buy it now. Charlie ________________________________ Message 11 ____________________________________ Time: 09:45:06 PM PST US From: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: lacing tape types At 06:42 AM 12/30/2007 -0600, you wrote: >On the page linked below they sell 2 types of lacing tape. Polyester - >recommend for spot tying, and nylon - recommended for continuous >tying. How do the properties of the two differ and how critical is it to >use one type or the other for the different tasks? Do you really need both >types? > >http://www.aircraftspruce.com/pdf/2008Individual/Cat08457.pdf No. I can't imagine where this comes from. First, nobody does continuous tying any more . . . and you can continuous tie with binder twine and spot tie with chalk line . . . material has more to do with environmental stresses followed by personal preferences than it does with specific restraining technique. My personal preference is for type II, finish W or H polyester for it's wider temperature range but either style in either color will serve your purposes well. Here's a poop sheet on a major portion of the Mil-T-43435 lacing tapes. http://www.gudebrod.com/Electronic/Braid_Lacing_Tape.htm Bob . . . ----------------------------------------) ( . . . a long habit of not thinking ) ( a thing wrong, gives it a superficial ) ( appearance of being right . . . ) ( ) ( -Thomas Paine 1776- ) ---------------------------------------- ________________________________ Message 12 ____________________________________ Time: 10:24:13 PM PST US From: "Jeffrey W. Skiba" Subject: AeroElectric-List: Z-14 (regular) Z-14 Fadec and Z-19 I have been looking over the differences in the above noted systems. What I am wondering is: If I have a dual battery and dual alternator (main 60 amps) and an sd-20 with a Battery dependant engine ECU, with Dual Fuel pumps. Would you not want to have a cross blend of the above noted systems? Aka:Z-14 Fadec and add the Note 24 dual power feed Diode bridge for the ECU and Both Fuel pumps (total of 3 diode brides, one for each item)? My questions are in Z-14 Fadec diagram where would the power come to feed the diode bridges and would you put switches in to select it on or off. If you do not use switches to supply power to the bridges is that setting up a bad situation having power supplied on both ends of the diode bridges ? I would think that this design would have been laid out already but I must be missing something simple probably :-) Thanks in advance. ________________________________ Message 13 ____________________________________ Time: 10:24:14 PM PST US From: "Les Goldner" Subject: RE: AeroElectric-List: Low voltage problem in a new plane- New readings Bob, I took some added measurements regarding the possible voltage drop problem (see earlier email, below) but the results are not consistent. I setup the Dynon 180 to see buss voltage and current draw. When I started up the engine with a fully charged battery the over/under voltage (o/v) light, which is triggered at 12.5V, did not come on although Dynon was saying the buss was only at 11.8 volts. I flew around for 15-minutes while drawing between 2 and 4 amps from an ICOM portable VHF and the Dynon. Then I put on some current hogs like the 50-watt landing light and the strobes. The Dynon reading dropped to 11.6 volts and the o/v light finally did come on at cruse RPM. I was drawing about 8-amps at the time according to Dynon. I turned off the high-draw stuff and the o/v light went off. After flying around for about 30-minutes I landed. On the ground, even when running up at 4300-RPM (cruse RPM is 5000) the o/v light came on and stayed on even with minimal current draw. I turned off the engine and found the voltage across the battery, measured with a voltmeter, to be 12.8V, which dropped to 12.6V after turning on the Dynon, which was now reading 11.6V. Based upon what you told me plus some speculation I am guessing that the Dynon voltage reading is not correct and should be ignored I also guess that the battery did not discharge in flight and the voltage regulator was pumping juice into it as it should be since the battery was at 12.8V when measured after the flight. I plan to ignore the light and keep flying. Even if the battery discharges the ignition should still work (I think it has its own generator) and both the Dynon and the ICOM radio have internal batteries that will keep going for an hour or more. Is the ultimate solution to just stop displaying the Dynon voltage and to use a much lower intensity, less annoying o/v light? Thanks again for your help, and have a great New Year. Les > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com > [mailto:owner-aeroelectric-list-server@matronics.com] On > Behalf Of Robert L. Nuckolls, III > Sent: Monday, December 24, 2007 10:55 AM > To: aeroelectric-list@matronics.com > Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Low voltage problem in a new plane > > --> > > At 10:00 PM 12/23/2007 -0800, you wrote: > > Robert, > > The low-voltage buss indicator light stays on in my new plane > and I would really appreciate help to understand what to do about it. > > I just finished building a Zenith 701 with a new 100-HP Rotax > 912 using your Aeroelectric's Z16 schematic. B&C did not have > the exact Alternator OV detection system shown in the > schematic and sold me their BC207-1 over and low voltage > control module that has a warning light which stays on for > under and flashes for over-voltage. The B&C web site says > that the low voltage light goes on if the Buss voltage is > under 12.5V. I wired this module exactly as shown in Z16. > > I presume that you tied the OV/LV warning > light into the main bus as shown in Z16 but > wired the module in accordance with instructions > provided with the device. > > > I flew the plane for the first time yesterday starting with a > fully charged battery and all seemed well. On the second > flight that day I noticed that the Alternator under voltage > (UV) light came on with the engine idling when the electric > fuel pump was on. > > The Rotax alternators don't give you much output at > idle or taxi speeds. It's possible if not probable that > the bus voltage was indeed too low to turn out the > LV warning light. > > Since I don't need the pump (fuel is gravity fed and the > engine has a mechanical pump) I just turned it off and may > have advanced the throttle beyond its high 2000-RPM idle. The > UV light went out as I did this. > I was happy and did my first solo flight in the plane for a > half hour without incident. > > Okay. This is pretty much what I would expect. > > Today, assuming the battery was fully charged (I did not > check it), I made some adjustments to the Dynon instrument > for about 30 minutes (drawing about 1 to 2-amps), and started > the engine for a few more go-arounds in the pattern. The > engine stared immediately so I guess the battery was charged > . However, the low-voltage light came on as soon as I > started-up and would not go off, even after a 10-minutes > warm-up, much of it above idle RPM, with almost nothing > electric turned on. When I taxied back to the hanger and shut > down (with the UV light still on) my battery voltage read > 12.3V (this is a new battery). > > Get a voltmeter and put it on the bus while you're > observing the Under-Voltage warning light. So far, the > observations you've reported seem pretty common. PM > alternators on the Rotax engines are, first of all, > small. The BIG guy on the 912 is an 18A machine and > then ONLY at cruise RPM. If you ran accessories on your > battery for a time, then it's going to take some time > to replace that energy . . . and it's not going to happen > fast except AFTER engine RPMs are raised to flight ops > levels. > > There are probably a lot of things I need to check to isolate > the problem and need advice as to how to go about doing this. > What is the most likely cause? What should I check first and > second, third. and how do I check them. > Here are some of my (probably dumb) more specific questions: > > For the moment, I don't see that your system is > performing in an unexpected manner. It's designed > in limitations for alternator output at low engine > RPM would account for what you've observed. > > Is this a definite problem or will the this under voltage > light come on as described above when there are no problems? > There are two fuselinks attached to the Alternator OV/UV > module. If one of these blew or got disconnected would it > cause this problem? Since this is easy to check, I plan to > look into this first. > > Is it possible that the problem is in the voltage regulator? > How do you check this out and determine if the regulator and > not the alternator is the cause? > > I'm not certain how to check the alternator or AC voltage. > First, is this a likely source of the problem? Second, if so > how do I check the alternator output? If the alternator is > bad I probably will have to remove the engine and find a > "real" repairman to fix it, so I hope the problem lies elsewhere. > > Any help would really be appreciated. > > Let us begin with the reasonable assumption that you > don't have a problem. Put a smart battery charger > on the battery and get it topped off. Then go fly > the airplane. Doesn't your Dynon have a voltage display > on it? > > I would expect the Low Volts warning to stay lit > until some time after takeoff. You can tell if the > alternator is working by watching the voltmeter. > At ramp idle and with electro-whizzies turned ON, > bus voltage will be decidedly less than 13.0 volts. > > As soon as you power up for takeoff, the bus voltage > should rise . . . not high enough perhaps to turn > out the light, but if the alternator is working at > all, bus voltage should come up with engine RPM. > > I'm betting the light will go out after a time sufficient > for the alternator to top off the battery. > > Bob . . . > > > > Photoshare, and much much more: > > ________________________________ Message 14 ____________________________________ Time: 11:26:10 PM PST US From: "raymondj" Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: lacing tape types Thanks, Bob. Raymond Julian Kettle River, MN "Hope for the best, but prepare for the worst." do not archive ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Other Matronics Email List Services ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Post A New Message aeroelectric-list@matronics.com UN/SUBSCRIBE http://www.matronics.com/subscription List FAQ http://www.matronics.com/FAQ/AeroElectric-List.htm Web Forum Interface To Lists http://forums.matronics.com Matronics List Wiki http://wiki.matronics.com Full Archive Search Engine http://www.matronics.com/search 7-Day List Browse http://www.matronics.com/browse/aeroelectric-list Browse Digests http://www.matronics.com/digest/aeroelectric-list Browse Other Lists http://www.matronics.com/browse Live Online Chat! http://www.matronics.com/chat Archive Downloading http://www.matronics.com/archives Photo Share http://www.matronics.com/photoshare Other Email Lists http://www.matronics.com/emaillists Contributions http://www.matronics.com/contribution ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- These Email List Services are sponsored solely by Matronics and through the generous Contributions of its members.